Original subtitles

operator Please hold

while we attempt to connect your call.

speaker: Have a seat right there.

- Durst: Here? - Speaker: Right there.

John Lewin: Give you the, uh,

we'll give you the comfier seat.

I'm, uh, I'm John Lewin.

I am a... I'm a deputy DA.

Do you mind if...

Mr. Durst or Bob? You-You tell me.

- Durst: Um, Bob is fine. - Lewin: Okay. Um, so, Bob, basically,

I'm from Los Angeles County,

and-and I'm here to, to speak to you.

What I do, I do cold murder cases.

Durst: I'm surprised there are that many of those

that you have a full-time job working on them.

There's a certain image,

even as a, as a seasoned prosecutor,

you have of, of a killer.

You can't help yourself. And it's not Bob.

Lewin: Before we, we start,

I wanna let you know that, um,

I feel like I know you. Now, I've never met you.

I feel like I know you very well.

You know, I know it's a, it's probably a very, you know,

uncomfortable day for you right now.

And if there's anything that I ask you

that you, that you don't wanna answer...

- Durst: I won't answer it. - Lewin: Okay.

Many times in Bob's life,

in custody, outta custody,

Bob has an option.

One door is

keep your mouth shut and don't say anything,

and one door is talk.

Bob always goes into the talk door. Always.

Detective Whelan, Mike's gonna advise you

of your Miranda rights, and...

Are... Can we... Are you cold? Can we get you something?

Speaker: It is a little cold in here, yeah.

- Lewin: Do you want us to get you a blanket? - Speaker: Do... Yeah.

Lewin: Here you go. Do you want, do you want anything to drink?

- Some coffee? - Durst: Coffee would be great.

Lewin: Okay, only two rules on the coffee.

One, you can't throw it at either one of us, at any of us.

And you can't throw it on the computer. Fair enough?

- Durst: Very fair. - Lewin: Okay, here you go. Alright.

The reason I like cold cases

is because people think they beat it.

I love being able to swoop in,

and to basically be able to say, "Yeah, no, you didn't beat it.

"You walked around for a long time.

"You got a life to live you didn't deserve.

But eventually, you gotta pay the piper."

♪ Well, you just think that I'm ♪

♪ Some great survivor ♪

♪ And you just build upon ♪

♪ The light to carry you ♪

♪ Well, I don't even talk that way ♪

♪ See, I wanted you to stay ♪

♪ And show you the world's a better place ♪

♪ And as we crawl to find our way ♪

♪ We even take the shape of something else ♪

- ♪ You think that I'm just ♪ - (gunshot)

♪ Some great survivor ♪

♪ You think that I'm just ♪

♪ Some great survivor ♪

♪ I'm afraid that the weight of the world ♪

♪ Is catching up with you ♪

Newscaster: LA County Deputy District Attorney John Lewin

has spent decades prosecuting

complicated circumstantial murder cases.

Lewin: The idea that it's not necessarily typical

for a filmmaker to call me up, going,

"Yeah, we've got evidence,"

it's more than not necessarily typical. It's,

I mean, unheard of.

Again, I've done this a lotta years

with a lot of interesting cases, and that just doesn't happen.

I love circumstantial cold cases,

and my expertise are circumstantial no-body cases.

So I knew all about Bob Durst.

Bob's wife Kathie had disappeared

in Westchester back in 1982.

His best friend Susan Berman had been murdered in 2000.

And finally, his neighbor Morris Black was killed

and dismembered in Texas in 2001.

Well, nothing can be done about Morris Black.

He's already been acquitted.

Westchester has never done anything

on Kathie Durst. There are issues.

I don't think there's anything to go there.

The one to look at is the Susan Berman case.

George Shamlyan: It kinda offended me

as a detective

that this person was able to get away

with three murders

because of all the privilege, money, power he had.

Homicide detectives, we have a saying.

"We work for God."

We try to get justice for the victim

and his or her family.

So, John Lewin and I started working on the case together.

We had a board.

On the board, we had the plan of action

and people to be interviewed.

We ended up interviewing close to maybe 300 people.

Lewin: I'm trying to put this case together,

myself and detectives,

and here's the problem.

If we contact these witnesses and it gets back to Bob,

Bob is gonna take off,

and we're not gonna see him again.

So I knew it was going to be a race

to get as far as we could before "The Jinx" came out.

Charles Bagli: Just before "The Jinx" is unveiled,

Bob is living in Houston.

He's still flitting around the country,

but his permanent address is more or less in Houston.

So he was completely free, right?

- At that point. - Bagli: Absolutely, and I think he would be free today

if he had just kept his trap shut.

Charlie Rose: "The Jinx: The Life and Deaths of Robert Durst"

is a new six-part HBO documentary series.

It details the case of the heir

to a wealthy New York real estate family.

Lewin: When "The Jinx" came out,

it was a six-part miniseries.

And my prediction was,

"This is going to be the biggest thing

to hit my office since OJ."

George Stephanopoulos: The multimillionaire real estate heir Robert Durst,

in a new HBO documentary,

he's answering all the charges for the first time.

What do you think at the end?

- Do you reach a conclusion? - Well, I think that

what the audience will find when they get to the end of this

is that they're not scratching their heads.

When they get to the end of six episodes,

they will know what happened.

Who has been pressing, as you know,

to see the finished episodes.

And he was sorta saying, "We're curious about whether

"you come to the conclusion that he's guilty or he's not guilty.

"But obviously, there's a concern that there could be

"a prosecution as a result of this,

and we are, you know, very keen to see it as soon as possible."

I mean, I said to him, "Well, I know for sure

"they'll let me show you one.

You know, episode one, tomorrow or whatever."

And he said, "Well, then I might as well just wait for Sunday."

newscaster: A teenage boy fishing

in the shallow waters off Galveston, Texas

stumbled on the gruesome remains of a murder.

Bagli: "The Jinx" started airing in February.

As each episode aired,

Bob was watching from his home in Houston,

and he and I spoke after every episode.

Bob got away with murdering Kathie.

Gilberte Najamy : I need to know what happened to Kathie.

These are my notes from this time period.

I'd get his reaction.

"Hey, Charles Bagli. It's Robert Durst."

"The second episode, I don't have anything to say about it."

"We've heard Kathie's family saying,

"'Why won't he tell us what he did with her?'

"On and on,

"as if they actually expect me to say,

'I put her over there near the lamppost.'"

speaker : Beverly Hills Police Department received a letter in the mail.

The envelope was addressed "Beverley Hills Police,"

and the note read, "cadaver."

Andrew Jarecki: Can you think of a reason

why somebody might write a note like that?

I can't imagine.

Bagli: By the third episode,

he was thinking, "I-I'm in pretty good shape.

"He's covered Galveston, Los Angeles, Westchester.

What else can he put in those final episodes?"

producer : So, let me see the letter.

And, I mean, of course I told you this, but...

producer : He showed me a letter from Bob to Susan.

The address written on the front

is exactly like the Cadaver Note,

down to the misspelling of "Beverley."

Bagli: So when Bob saw his letter on the TV,

he got very nervous.

This seems to be proof positive

that he killed Susan. That is evidence!

When I called him after the fifth episode...

there was a change in Bob.

He was clearly now worried.

"No, I'm sorta busy right now.

Let me get back to you, uh, say Wednesday. Bye-bye."

And I thought to myself, "Holy shit. He's gonna run."

newscaster : In this past Sunday's show,

the discovery of a potentially blockbuster piece of evidence.

Susan Berman...

Shamlyan: March 2015,

we got evidence from FBI

that Robert Durst was on the run.

We also got evidence that he was doing

what's called "money structuring."

He was withdrawing $9,000 almost daily.

When you withdraw cash money over $10,000,

banks are required to report to the federal government

as a suspish activity, and he was trying to avoid that.

He was making withdrawals of $9,000.

Why would he want that cash unless he was gonna run?

And if he left the country, went to some country

we didn't have a extradition treaty,

we would have a very difficult time

of bringing him back.

And my captain told me,

"Whatever you do, don't let Bob Durst get away."

Eric Perry: When it came time to track him,

I was brought in to help with the technical side of that,

where we were able to get up on his cell phone.

We got his cell phone records.

LAPD was able to obtain a wiretap,

which allows us to see the numbers

calling into and out of Bob's cell phone.

The last cell tower that I was able to map

put him heading eastbound on Interstate 10,

leaving the area of Houston.

So we realized his phone had been turned off

and then it wasn't active for several hours.

LAPD, the FBI in LA, us in New York,

we were all really pushing. We're like,

"We need to get him in custody right away."

Our greatest concern came true, and that was scary.

Bob has always seemed to have been one step ahead

of everybody for the most part.

And this was just a kinda déjà vu moment.

Shamlyan: So we had to scramble to get a search warrant

for his apartment in Houston.

We went to search the apartment,

and we got the surveillance.

Shamlyan: We sent a team of four detectives

to his apartment,

and we did a search there.

His phone was gone.

He left his checkbooks and credit cards in there.

Clearly, he was not gonna use them

'cause we would have tracked it.

There was some evidence of him taking stuff out,

or somebody else.

But apartment was cleaned. It was cleaned out.

investigator: Okay.

My name is Chris Lovell.

C-H-R-I-S, L-O-V-E-double I.

Dan Rather: In one of the more surprising verdicts

in recent court history, a jury in Galveston, Texas

today found a wealthy man

innocent of murdering another man,

even after he admitted

he cut up the victim's body and disposed of it.

Hon. Susan Criss: Chris Lovell was one of the jurors in the Galveston case

that immediately befriended Bob as soon as the trial was over.

They formed a relationship.

I think he was enamored with Bob

because Bob is incredibly wealthy.

He was hoping that would provide some financial rewards.

With what was presented to me,

absolutely, positively, 100%.

With what was presented to me. Yes, sir.

Criss: I've never seen or heard of a juror forming a relationship

with a defendant after trial.

But then, most defendants

aren't extremely wealthy

with sort of a celebrity status.

I think that Bob trusted Chris.

And I think that Chris Lovell will do whatever Bob says.

I didn't set out to be his... Robert Durst's friend.

It just kind of evolved into that.

I just set out to get some

some questions answered in my mind,

but it has evolved into a friendship, and...

I don't have a problem with him at all.

It is astounding

that 12 years after a murder trial,

one of the jurors is helping Bob

make his getaway.

That apartment was sanitized.

We did not find any critical evidence.

There was a box on top of the bed in the bedroom.

In that box there was mementos.

Susan Berman's photos,

Kathie Durst's photos.

To this day, I think it was staged for him to say that,

"I cared about these people."

But he was sort of playing games.

Perry: I'm sitting there, listening to the wiretap

Saturday before the last episode of "The Jinx" aired

and I hear a phone call come into, um, Bob's cell phone.

Operator : Hello, you've reached the Jitterbug voicemail for...

Durst : Bob.

Perry: And I could hear Bob

trying to log into his voicemail using his PIN number.

So, it's like "beep, beep, beep."

And he was unsuccessful. He was actually getting frustrated.

Durst : Dang. Shit.

No... Fuc...

Perry: So I knew it was Bob.

So I quickly ran the number

that was calling into his voicemail

and it came back to the JW Marriott in New Orleans.

FBI office in New Orleans

responded there to attempt to locate Bob.

Special agent checked with the hotel register.

There was no Bob Durst registered at the hotel.

So he decided to set up surveillance.

Sure enough, about three hours later...

Bob walked in.

It just seemed like everything was colliding.

It was all coming to a head at once.

One of the FBI agents said, "Robert Durst?"

And Bob kinda stopped.

So they started talking to him.

And then a woman is walking by, a guest in the hotel,

and she said, "Oh, is that Bob Durst?"

She had just been watching "The Jinx,"

so she recognized him!

You can't make this stuff up!

But Bob is now famous.

As good as Bob can be or as lucky as Bob is

about evading capture,

you know, he screwed up, and, and we caught him.

Lewin: I was contacted,

and I was told, "Okay, he's been arrested."

The FBI agents asked Bob if he had any ID,

so he took them up to his room.

When they end up going into the room, they find

drugs...

a bunch of money...

a loaded firearm...

and a map of Cuba.

There was also

a very expensive latex mask.

Jarecki: Did you ever have an opinion

about what the mask was gonna be for?

Did he ever express that?

Um, do I have an opinion?

The mask was gonna be used to disguise himself

to flee the country, is what I believe.

It was, it was, it was not Halloween.

The plan was Bob was gonna take off for Cuba

never to return.

And, of course, um

that didn't happen.

We all knew you were gonna flee at some point.

I mean, I assume that you're not denying

that you were in the process of fleeing.

- I'm not denying I was in the process of... - Lewin: Yeah, that's right.

And I think the reason you're not doing it

is you know it's obvious,

so let me go another way. Why are you still here?

How come you're not in Cuba? I don't get it.

Durst: I had made arrangements.

I had considered the possibility.

I had looked here and looked there.

But I had never really said,

"You know what? They're gonna come after me.

I've gotta get far away where they can't get me."

I guess inertia. I just didn't really,

really, really think

that I was gonna end up arrested.

Being a fugitive was, was not something I did well.

Newscaster 1: Authorities arrested Robert Durst

in New Orleans Saturday on a Los Angeles County warrant.

Tonight, Robert Durst is behind bars,

arrested overnight in the lobby of a New Orleans hotel,

accused of killing a female friend

in Los Angeles 15 years ago.

The investigation got a boost thanks to new evidence revealed

in a documentary series

that Durst willingly participated in.

newscaster 2: Last night's arrest

comes just hours before tonight's finale.

Newscaster 3: The director promises tonight's final installment

will answer questions people have been asking for decades.

Bagli: That night after Bob's arrest,

we all went to a screening

for the families of the victims

at your house

for the last episode of "The Jinx."

It was kind of like a meeting of an old club.

You had investigators, prosecutors,

you had witnesses,

and then you had Kathie's family.

Jim McCormack, his wife Sharon, and their daughter,

who was the spitting image of Kathie.

Jim McCormack: You gave us a call

to screen the final episode of "The Jinx," the sixth episode.

I knew that you had something special to show us.

Bagli: Also, there was Jeanine Pirro,

the former DA in Westchester County,

and Cody Cazalas,

the detective who had carried the case in Galveston.

So there's dozens of people riveted

by what's unfolding on the screen

and what the final episode will reveal.

Jeanine Pirro : Oh, God, the "B" is exactly the same.

Son of a bitch.

Jarecki : He actually told me he was in Madrid.

Bagli: And as the episode progresses,

the room got quieter and quieter.

Jarecki : So...

So obviously, I wanna ask you about the Cadaver Note,

the famous Cadaver Note.

Can you read me the spelling of "Beverley Hills..."

Durst: "Beverley Hills Police,

1527 Benedict Canyon, Cadaver."

Jarecki: So you wrote one of these,

but you didn't write the other one.

I wrote this one, but I did not write the Cadaver one.

Jarecki : And can you tell me which one you didn't write?

No.

I am going to go use the restroom,

which is right here...

- Or maybe this is the bathroom? - Jarecki : Yeah, that's...

Durst : You're right. This is the bathroom.

Oh, my God!

- Oh, honey. - Holy shit.

guest 1: Oh, my God.

guest 2: Oh, my God.

McCormack: I heard it, and then it kinda settles in.

You'd hate to use the word "closure"

'cause we still had a long road to travel.

But at least for that point in time, we finally had closure

that he was finally admitting the truth.

Oh, it's definitely a confession. I mean, right, Cody?

- Yeah! Yeah! - They can use that?

Jeanine Pirro: He wasn't in custody.

guest 3: He wasn't in custody. It was not an interrogation.

Bagli: And then, all of a sudden, it seems to be everywhere.

Newscaster 1: Real estate heir Robert Durst

admitting to, quote, "killing them all."

Robert Durst said he "killed them all."

They are the five words everyone is talking about this week.

"Killed them all, of course."

- Killed them all. - Killed them all.

Newscaster 2: "Of course, I killed them all."

Cody Cazalas: For the first time it came out of his mouth,

what I have felt for a long time in my heart.

The revelation was like something

we've been waiting for for 33 years.

Well, they got him.

Durst was arrested on Saturday,

the day before the shocking finale

of that documentary series.

Lewin: You know, I've seen...

I've seen all the interviews that you did with Andrew.

Durst: For the whole long weekend

- when I did the interviews for "The Jinx"... - Lewin: Yeah?

Durst: I was on meth.

The whole time, I was on meth.

And when I looked at the little pieces of it,

I was like...

Should have been obvious.

Surprised my lawyer let me go ahead with it

'cause it just...

I looked like there was something going on.

Lewin: Well, so Bob, 'cause before you go

any further on that,

certain things I know...

And you seem like a straight shooter.

I assume you would prefer that I be a straight shooter

- and not a bullshitter, right? - Durst: Sure.

Lewin: Okay, I'm a straight shooter.

What you just told me is bullshit.

Durst: I'm not trying to say

that my answers were wrong. I'm just trying to say I was

during the thing.

I think that what I said

were the correct answers to-to the questions.

And, you know, there begins this conversation

that sounds almost like a plea bargain.

Lewin: Um, you know, it's-it's like I said before,

- this is all voluntary. It's c... - Durst: No, I hear you,

- and I have no problem with what you're saying. - Lewin: Okay.

Durst: But, what's going through my mind is

if I tell you what I know

that answers your questions,

what can you possibly do for me?

Lewin: Okay, let me... I-I'll... I can tell you, Bob...

Durst: I'm very willing to talk to you.

And as I said, I'm 72...

Lewin: You know what I want, correct?

Durst: Yes. You'd like some details

- from me if I knew... - Lewin: Yes.

Durst: About where Kathie's body is.

Lewin: And about what happened to Susan. Those...

- Durst: And about what happened with Susan. - Lewin: Okay.

And-And you would agree that you're in the position,

if you want, to tell me more than you have so far...

Durst: About that, I'm not about to go that far.

- Lewin: Okay. - Durst: But...

Lewin: Well, but wait a minute.

What you're telling me though,

then I wanna understand when you're saying, "Tell me what..."

Durst: Well, you asked me what I thought you wanted to hear.

I think what you wanted to hear,

to make Ann McCormack happy is,

"What did you do with Kathie?"

Lewin: Right.

Durst: And I think you want me to go through details

- of, of Susan. - Lewin: I do.

Durst: Okay, so now, what would I ask for?

- Lewin: Tell me. - Durst: If I tell you those things,

- I'm plea-ing guilty. - Lewin: Okay.

Durst: And I'm plea-ing guilty.

I'm gonna be going back to Los Angeles,

to California, and doing my time.

Lewin: Well, now, I've got a question.

Is there... So, for instance,

something that, and I, and I,

that I would have to see is,

would it be better doing your time in a different place?

- Are you better doing it... - Durst: Yes! Yes, yes.

- That's just what we're getting to. - Lewin: Okay, tell me.

Durst: What could you do... Well, I don't know

what the question is yet.

And, and I will tell you that after New Orleans,

I was very annoyed

because I felt, at the end of that interview,

that I was 10 minutes away from a confession.

Durst: When we s

sit down to do an agreement,

and I would expect by Monday

I will have chosen a lawyer in Los Angeles...

Lewin: And over time, what I've realized is,

and as a big football fan,

I was down at the five-yard line.

But, I was never going to get that confession.

Durst: You see, I'm not about to-to-to say to you...

- What is your name again? - Lewin: John.

Durst: John. I'm not about to say to you,

"John, this is it," without my lawyer being here.

Lewin: Okay, okay. Well, listen, and that's, and that's your right.

And you realize, "Oh, okay."

"It wasn't that I was so great

"getting down to the five-yard line.

"It's that he really wasn't playing any defense,

and he's not gonna let me get into the end zone."

So, are you willing to talk to me after court today?

- Durst: Sure. - Lewin: Okay, alright. We'll head to court.

And he said he would talk to me. And, of course, um,

that didn't happen.

So now, Bob was in custody in New Orleans.

And who was the first person to fly down to New Orleans

and visit Bob in jail?

Debrah Lee Charatan: Hi.

- Hi. How ya doin'? - Durst: Hi.

Doin' alright. How are you doing?

I'm doing fine.

I'm sorry this is the way they do visitation here.

Debbie served as Bob's wife,

confidante, and advisor.

Durst: You see me in my jumper?

Charatan: No, I can barely.

Durst: Hold on a second. Let me stood up.

Charatan: Okay, I see it.

I see it.

Ai-yai-yai.

- You actually look pretty good. - Durst: Thank you.

Your hair looks very bushy, by the way.

Nah, it's just hair, you know?

You know I have a lotta hair.

Bagli: Bob got from Debbie

a safe harbor, a place that he could always go

where there were no questions asked.

He had absolute trust in her.

Durst: What I would like to do going forward,

to pay my bills

and spending the money on the legal defense,

Sell the apartment complex,

sell the two condos.

Yeah, and I think you should keep your apartment in Houston.

And if you... I think the thing you should sell here

is the apartment building.

Durst: The real estate in the Hamptons,

has that gone up much?

- Is that way up? - Crazy.

Durst: So if we have that today to sell,

what would we ask for it?

Um, I don't know.

It's probably worth 20.

Durst: Interesting.

Bagli: So the second person to visit Bob in New Orleans

might have been Dick DeGuerin,

one of the same lawyers that got him off in Texas.

Dick DeGuerin: Once Bob was arrested,

I got to New Orleans as quickly as I could,

which was about the next day.

And that's when I first saw Bob.

Bob saw my dedication to his defense in Galveston.

Bob Durst is not guilty of murder.

It's hard to argue with success.

Will the defendant please rise?

We, the jury, find the defendant,

Robert Durst, not guilty.

DeGuerin: Bob Durst didn't buy his way to freedom.

It wasn't his money that influenced this-this jury.

It was the facts, or the lack of facts.

I understand that you want Dick DeGuerin on your team.

I don't blame you.

He did wonderful things for you in the past.

Bagli: Bob did have this infinite trust in DeGuerin.

So, he authorized Dick

to assemble a defense team.

Dick DeGuerin reaches out to a friend,

David Chesnoff,

a very prominent figure in Las Vegas.

He is the go-to guy

for any celebrity,

any professional athlete,

any bad guy that gets into trouble.

He is very adept at making problems go away.

Chesnoff's a brilliant lawyer.

Uh, he's a strategically thinking lawyer.

I've always been interested in fighting for the underdog.

In the old days, if you were a celebrated person,

you got breaks.

Now, if you're a celebrated person, it's worse.

The more famous you are, the tougher it is.

It's like a populist thing,

their chance to get even with the rich person.

DeGuerin: I think we had a hell of a team.

We had one goal, and that was to defend Bob Durst.

I met this David Chesner,

and he seems very bright.

I think the team that you have is great.

Bagli: So, there are now prominent lawyers

assembled for Bob's defense team.

Jarecki: Were you also listening to his calls

from prison at that point, from jail?

When Bob got arrested in New Orleans,

he made repeated calls.

I listened to every call there.

When he was in Louisiana,

he was a nonstop talkfest.

Bagli: From the moment Bob was arrested in New Orleans,

he was reaching out to old friends,

looking to see who can he rely on.

He was seeking both emotional support

and to see who would be on his side.

Bagli: The people around Bob

helped him,

whether it was consciously or unconsciously,

go on for so many years

without consequence.

I like to think that if a good friend of mine

is suddenly implicated

in one, two, three murders

that I would recoil from that.

But, who knows until you're tested?

♪ You got to help me ♪

♪ I can't do it all by myself ♪

♪ You got to help me, baby ♪

♪ I can't do it all by myself ♪

♪ You know if you don't help me, darling ♪

♪ I'll have to find myself somebody else ♪

♪ I may have to wash ♪

♪ May have to sew ♪

♪ I may have to cook ♪

♪ I might mop the floor ♪

♪ But, you help me, babe ♪

♪ You know if you don't help me, darling ♪

♪ I'll find myself somebody else ♪

♪ When I walk ♪

♪ You walk with me ♪

♪ And when I talk ♪

♪ You talk to me ♪

♪ Oh, babe ♪

♪ I can't do it all by myself ♪

♪ You know if you don't help me, darling ♪

♪ I'll have to find myself somebody else ♪

♪ Help me, help me, darling ♪

♪ Bring my nightshirt ♪

♪ Put on your morning gown ♪

♪ Darling, I know we sleep bare ♪

♪ But, I don't feel like lying down ♪

♪ Oh yeah... ♪