All language subtitles for Longford.2006.1080p.AMZN.WEB-DL.DDP2.0.H264-alfaHD

Today, people, we are
privileged to have with us,

formerly the cabinet minister
and leader of the
house of lords,

a knight of the garter
and seventh Earl of Longford

who's come to talk to us
about a book he's just written

entitled, "saints."

Frank Packenham,
lord Longford,
welcome to the show.

Thank you very much.

So many questions
to ask you, such a long
and distinguished career,

but I'm gonna
start with the book.
What prompted you to write it?

As a lifelong Christian
and scholar,

I've a
in ideas of sanctity.

But more than that,
I think it was probably

the entirely selfish desire
to spend a little time
with my heroes.

- Your heroes?
- Yes, that's what
the saints are...

My heroes, friends,
intercessors.

Interesting. Right,
the time has just gone 2:15.

The subject is "saints."
We're gonna take some calls.

David, you're through
to lord Longford.

What's your question
about the saints?

Actually, my question
isn't about "the saints."

I want to know how
your esteemed guest

can look himself
in the mirror each morning.

I'm assuming this is
a question about Myra Hindley.

Yes, it is.
How could you rub salt

in the wounds of
the families like that?

A man in your position
fraternizing and campaigning

on behalf of that monster?

I certainly take exception
to that description,

but I made it quite clear
before coming on the program

that I wouldn't be talking
about Myra Hindley today.

Of course.
Next caller is Judy
who's in Sheppey.

You're through
to lord Longford.

My call is also
about Ms. Hindley.

In view of everything
we now know about it,

don't you regret having
supported her all that time?

Once again, madam,
I'm afraid I must decline
to answer questions about her.

It's a simple answer,
lord Longford... yes or no.

Do you regret it?

The Pennine Moorlands,

scene of one of the most
intensive murder hunts
of the century.

Police and hundreds
of volunteers

continue their gruesome
search for the bodies
of murder victims,

working on a scant tip-off
that the bleak Moors

hide the evidence
of a mass murderer.

And late on Saturday afternoon
they found the body

of 10-year-old
Lesley downey,

face down
in a shallow grave.

Five days later,
another body was discovered.

...been identified as
that of John Kilbride,

the 12-year-old boy
who disappeared

from his Manchester home
nearly two years ago.

I'm standing outside
number 16

Wardle Brook Avenue,
Hattersley,

where earlier today police
arrested a man and a woman

after finding the body
of a 17-year-old boy,

Edward Evans.

Police have now released
the names of the suspects.

They are Ian Brady,
a 28-year-old clerk,

and Myra Hindley,
his 23-year-old girlfriend.

Hindley, who said that
she had a sore throat,

gave her evidence
in a low, husky voice.

She said that she
had loved Brady

and still loved him.

When she was cross-examined
about her part in the
nude photographing

session with the child
Lesley Ann downey,

she said, "I offer
no defense for that.

It was indefensible
and cruel."

She said she didn't
know that Brady was
tape-recording the session

and that she was ashamed
when she heard the tape
played later.

Extra police were
called in to keep the peace.

The parents of other
missing Manchester children
were outside the court.

- Hanging's
too good for them.
- This was too quick.

He wants to torture them.

A tooth for a tooth
and a life for a life.

...head sank as she heard
the foreman of the jury

speak the word "guilty"
the first time.

"These were three calculated,
cruel and cold-blooded murders,"

was what Mr. Justice
fenton Atkinson said.

Sentencing them both
to life imprisonment,

the judge said quietly,
"put them down."

From time to time,

people are kind enough
to ask me what I consider

to be my greatest
achievement in life,

and I always answer
the same way.

I say, "it is that
I visit prisoners."

Congratulations, Roy.

And if I were
to die tonight,

it is the very first thing
I would say to St. Peter

if he were remotely
interested.

Morning, Barry.

But some of my greatest
and most-valued friendships

have begun
with prison visits.

And much of what I've learned,
I owe to prison visits.

Dennis here, for example,
has taught me the workings

of the diesel engine.

Priceless information...

Even though I do not drive.

And Michael here
has taught me Gaelic.

And together we have
studied some of Ireland's
finest poetry.

And I thank you
for that, Michael.

And Roy here,

whose release we are
celebrating today,

has taught me that it is
never too late to take
up something new

and to still master it.

Having never so much
as picked up a brush
before the age of 30,

he is this year to be shown
at the royal academy.

In fact, I have
an example of that here,

which has just been
presented to me.

It's a very fine
piece of work.

I think you could've
chosen a rather more
attractive subject, Roy,

and you flatter me
a great deal.

Thank you very much.

Might I have a word?

- Yes, of course.
- In private.

Yes, of course.

Excuse me.

I just had a phone call
from the governor
of Holloway prison.

So what did
Ann tree want?

Oh, the mighty tree.

Apparently there's a prisoner
in Holloway who specifically
asked to see me.

As long as it's not
Myra Hindley.

As a matter of fact,
it is.

You're not going to go?

Of course.

I can't sit on the board
of a prison-visiting charity

and start drawing lines.

Yes, you can.

Frank, that woman's inhuman.

She's... she's a monster.

She murdered innocent
young children.

We don't even
know how many.

But as a prisoner,
she's still perfectly
entitled to be visited.

Yes, but not
necessarily by you.

Look, you know I've always
supported your penal work,

but there are some crimes,
some people that are...

What?
Unforgivable.

Oh, come along, you know
what I feel about that.

No human being is
beyond forgiveness.

Condemn people
from our armchairs
and what have we become?

Frank, stay behind
a moment, will you?

Yes, of course,
prime minister.

I read in the paper
you threw a party
for a murderer

in the house
of lords yesterday.

A released murderer,
prime minister,

who's paid
his debt to society
and is now free.

Still made
the headlines.

Wrong sort
of headlines.

Now I understand your
charitable and philanthropic
work is important to you,

but holding
this government together
is important to me.

You've a habit
of doing this,
haven't you?

Attracting
unfortunate headlines.

I remember you asking

your country to forgive
the Germans after the war.

They were starving,
prime minister.

But so were we.
It was 1947.

There's an endearing
childlike quality
about you, frank.

But no one wants
children in cabinet.

I made you leader of the lords
on the recommendation
of Clem Attlee.

And so far, you've done
little to justify his faith.

But, you have a talent...

Which I will utilize.

And then he came up
with this report...

Well, not a report,
more of an investigation.

He wants me to look
into young people nationwide,

focusing on education,
homelessness, criminality.

But you'd do that wonderfully.
I can't think of anyone better.

Under normal circumstances,
perhaps, but this is clearly
a poisoned chalice.

Half the inquiry would
come under the auspices
of education,

and half under
home office.

Oh, I shouldn't have
come out tonight.

- Don't be silly.
- Love to you.

Look, there's that lady
from "the Sunday times"

who wrote those lovely
things about you.

Oh?

Do you remember
how much you liked her?

Oh, yes.

Hello.
Very nice to see you.

I'd like you to clear
an afternoon for me

in the next couple
of weeks.

- How's the 21st?
- You have a meeting at 4:00
with the home secretary.

- 28th?
- Better.

I can move that one.

Good,
let's go for the 28th.

- What shall I put down?
- Hmm?

Oh, just put "prison visit."

Bernadette Collins?

Susan Davis?

Helen Kroger?

Ethel G.?

Myra Hindley?

Susanna Smit?
Rita Williams?

Ms. Hindley?

I do beg your pardon, madam.

I think it's me
you're looking for.

Myra Hindley?

Got rid of the peroxide
before the trial.

It was blue at the trial
for most of it,

and then red
for the sentencing.

Apparently it
counted against me.

It showed I had
no remorse.

I wasn't aware
of a correlation

between hair color
and contrition.

Nor me.

I'm very pleased
to meet you.

Never met a lord before.
What should I call you?

M'lord?
Your grace?

- You must call me frank.
- All right. Frank.

They put me in this
table in the corner

'cause it helps
protect me from
the lip readers.

So, you specifically
asked to see me.

What can I do for you?

I want to see Ian Brady.

I see.

Although
we weren't married,

we were together
for six years,
which I believe

makes us common-law
husband and wife,

and therefore entitled
to see one another

just like
married prisoners.

Well, if that's
what you desire,

of course I will do
all I can to help you.

But I have to say,
even though I'm not
your solicitor,

I don't think
it's a good idea.

Why not?

Because whatever it is
you wish to achieve
by seeing him,

it will almost
certainly elude you.

If it's private conversation
or intimate contact
you're after,

you won't get it.
You'll be surrounded

by prison officers
and guards at all times.

Then there's the question
of public reaction.

Were the press to get hold
of it,he’d have a field day.

It might have a profoundly
detrimental effect

on any future
chances of parole.

Parole?

Lord Longford, have you
forgotten who I am?

They'll never
give me parole.

Why ever not?

As I recall, the judge
made a distinction

between your case
and Mr. Brady's.

Although he sentenced him
for the rest of his
natural life,

he made it quite clear
that in your case
it could be reviewed.

Now the average
life sentence

is currently 21 years.

Parole can be applied for
after a third of that time.

So you can make your
first application...

Six years from now.

Are you serious?

Perfectly serious.

God.

So my advice would be

that you put some distance
between yourself and Mr. Brady.

I gave that man everything...

My heart, my soul,

my life.

Indeed,
if I may say so,

at some personal cost
to yourself.

You're right.

What a pretty smile
you have.

What?

I said
what a pretty smile.

That's the first kind thing
anyone's said to me in months.

It's true.

As a matter of fact,
your entire appearance

and demeanor
is quite different
to what I expected.

Of course, all I had to go on
was that police photograph.

The Medusa.
That's what I call it.

No one looks their best
at 4:00 in the morning

having been questioned
for nine hours straight,
do they?

Five minutes!

So, is there anything
I can send you

that would make things
more comfortable?

Books, and music.

Anything in particular?

I like jazz.
And the goons.

Ian and I used
to listen to them a lot.

I'll see
what I can do.

In the meantime,
I suggest you get
a family member

to put aside half a pound
a week or so.

- What for?
- When you come out.

You really think
I will one day?

Yes, of course.

When will you come again?

When you ask me.
Prison visitors
never visit prisoners

unless they're invited.

Well, you'll hear
from me soon then.

Good.

Delighted to have
met you, Ms. Hindley.

You too, frank.

Bye-bye.

Anyway, she wasn't at all
how I might've expected.

I've found her charming,
intelligent, attractive even.

Ahem.

A woman that murdered
three children?

A woman who came under
the spell of a man
who murdered three children.

- That's rubbish.
- I spoke to the prison
governor afterward.

She's quite convinced
that Myra Hindley was
corrupted by Ian Brady

and to consider them
as equals is a great mistake.

Dada, except that she
procured those children,

knowing exactly what
would happen to them.

Never would've got into the car
without a woman present.

The judge made a clear
distinction at the trial

that Ian Brady
was the initiator
of these crimes

and the actual killer.

Myra Hindley was
merely a dominated
and corrupted accomplice.

The distinction's irrelevant...
Murderer and accomplice

are equally guilty
in the eyes of the law.

Killers of this kind
almost always have a prior
history of offending.

Myra Hindley had nothing,
not even a blemish.

- And wasn't there a tape?
- What tape?

At the trial.
I seem to remember
there was a tape

where one heard
the dreadful things
they did to the little girl,

and that it was
Myra Hindley's voice
one could hear.

- Not Brady's.
- No. What about a swim?

Yes, please, grandpa.

Please, mommy,
a swim, a swim!

I think
it's clearing up.

"Dear frank,

thanks again for your visit,

for the books you sent me.

I finished the first volume
of your autobiography."

- How old are you then?
- 17.

- "It's an interesting
life you have had."
- You look younger to me.

"So many conversions...

From English to Irish;

from conservative
to socialist;

from protestant
to catholic.

I don't know
if you're aware,

but as a teenager I converted
to the catholic church too."

"Dear Myra,

I had no idea that you had
converted to Catholicism too.

How fascinating.

What a coincidence."

- May I?
- Mmm-hmm.

"As a young man, I wasn't
much interested in god.

Quite the opposite.

This one day was
just overwhelmed

by the sheer pointlessness

of an existence without
the prospect of an afterlife.

That's when I
realized that without
a religious dimension,

there was little
meaning to life."

How's your spiritual
life now?

I don't go to church anymore
if that's what you're asking.

That all stopped when
I started seeing Ian...

Along with everything else
that was good in my life.

It's too powerful...

A magnetlike
personality.

He demolished everything
I believed in.

I was obsessed.

Next time you have a moment,
try going back to church.

You might be
pleasantly surprised.

In my experience,
it's the prisoners
with the strongest faith

that cope best.

Just imagine what Ian
would say to that.

He thinks god is for nutters.

Does he?
Well, I beg to differ.

"Dear frank,

the catholic priest that
visits us here is German...

Father Kahle.

He says mass here
twice a week,

and last week I told him
I might be looking

to find a way back
to the church."

"The report in its entirety,

will cover youth activity..."

"He's given me the divine
office to read every day,

and the penny catechism."

"Ah, the penny catechism.

You might also consider
reading 'the confessions
of St. Augustine,'

which are
particularly good."

"Anyway, father Kahle
thinks I have made progress

and that we are not far away
from the day when I can make
a full confession."

"How wonderful.

Be sure to tell me
what day it is

that I might pray
for you myself."

What's that,
lord Longford?

Uh, this is
the much-anticipated

youth report
which I'm delivering

- to the prime minister today.
- How long have you
been working on it?

I've been working
on it for 18 months.

Any further questions?

Very good.

Bye.

Oh, frank,
yesterday I finished
reading St. Augustine.

The way he rejected
his former life
and sinfulness...

Afterwards, I lay
in my cell unable to sleep,

my head was spinning so.

Every fiber in my body
seems to want to resist this,

yet a part of me cannot deny
it feels so good too.

I just keep hearing
Ian's voice in my head

mocking me for my hypocrisy
and my insincerity.

I wouldn't worry about that.

Lord Longford, the prime
minister will see you now.

Oh, thank you very much.

- Prime minister.
- Sit down, frank.

I'm gonna come
straight to the point.

I want to give
Shackleton a run as leader
of the house of lords.

I see.

I want to thank you
for everything you've
done for us, frank.

You've done
a terrific job
over the years.

But you've
reached an age now.

Shackleton's
a younger man.

It... it's nothing to do
with the report, is it?

What report?

The youth report,
prime minister,

that you
asked me to write.

N-No no no.

Nothing to do with that.

I just want to give
Shackleton a run.

As you know,
we're right up
against it now.

Tories have
gained ground and...

You've gotta keep
moving in politics.

Fresh blood,
new faces.

New ideas.

Everyone's down
having breakfast.

Will you join us?

Nice pieces
in the paper.

Yes.

People are being
very kind.

"The last remaining
example of a politician
with principle."

I'll leave the post.

Not another one
from Myra Hindley
by any chance?

Because I've noticed
she's been writing to you
a lot recently.

Yes.

I've been working
towards her return
to the catholic church.

- Myra Hindley?
- Yes.

Anyway, it's not from Myra,
it's from somebody else.

Lord Longford.

Mr. Brady.

How good of you
not to disappoint.

It's wonderful, isn't it,
when people look

exactly as you imagine?

So this is my competition...

This is who
I'm up against.

Myra's new boyfriend.

She certainly
picks 'em, doesn't she?

I did a little
bit of research
before our meeting.

I'd say there's
greater evidence of...

Mental instability
in your past than mine.

Son and grandson
to military heroes,

you were invalided
out of the army

because of
a mental breakdown.

Was it the full
crack-up, I wonder...

Or were you
just a coward?

What can I do
for you, Mr. Brady?

I'd like to find
my way back to god...

Lord Longford.

Will you help me?

Why, certainly,
if that's what you...

Don't you fuckin' dare.
You start with that
pious mumbo-jumbo,

I will jump across that table
and bite out your tongue.

No. This present visit is
for your benefit, not mine.

I want to tell you
about Myra,

who you no doubt believe
is sincere in her
religious conversion.

Let me tell you,
that woman...

Cares no more about god

than she cares about
the piles in my ass.

What she cares about...

Is getting out.

And she thinks
you'll help her.

But the minute
your back is turned...

She mocks you...

For your silly hair

and... and your clothes

and your "self-important
autobiographies

only published because
his family owns a bloody
publishing house."

What?

She didn't tell you
she was still writing to me?

No.

Oh dear.

She probably
didn't tell you

she was fucking that little
prison officer either...

A nun.

They do it under the bed
in her cell, apparently.

Four times a day.

She has a very high
sex drive, our Myra.

It's the sort of detail
you might want about
your new girlfriend.

She needs it
all the time.

Like a man
in that way.

Like a man
in other ways too.

She's strong.

That came in handy,
as you can imagine...

When they were wriggling
and trying to get away.

Wait, you can't go yet.
I haven't finished with you.

Take my advice,

go back to your
other prisoners...

Nice, uncomplicated ones
with broken noses

and knuckle tattoos.

Stay clear of Myra
because she will
destroy you.

She certainly destroyed me.

And there...
There's a thought
you've not had before:

That Myra
egged me on...

That without her,
none of it would
have happened.

Wait.
You're not yet
dismissed!

Listen to the tape,
that's my advice,

if you want to know
what she's really like.

And when you do listen,

bear this in mind...

It was her that insisted

- they call us...
- "Mommy!"

And "daddy!"
Not me!

Are you
all right, sir?

Yes, all...
All right, yes.

- The body of Christ.
- Amen.

It's too late for church.
You're going straight
to hell!

I'm going to
fucking kill you,
you child-murdering bitch!

You fucking bitch!

Myra?

Bless me, father,
for I have sinned.

It has been many years
since my last confession.

It was so beautiful.

I gave my confession.

I told him everything
that had happened

and how sorry I was.

Then he put his hands on me
and gave me a blessing.

Then we went to mass

and I was given
the Eucharist.

I cried afterwards.

I know it won't
change the past...

Bring back those
poor children,

but at least I know
in the eyes of god
I am forgiven.

Well, if you are
forgiven by god,

who are we to condemn you?

She's done well.

Better than any of us
imagined, frankly.

Father Kahle tells me
their talks are going well.

She's registered to do
an open university degree.

She treats the wardens
and her fellow prisoners

with courtesy.

And you really feel
it's sincere?

It's not some form
of compliance or act?

I visited Ian Brady and he
made certain suggestions.

Ian Brady's a psychopath.
I wouldn't believe
a word he says.

Prison is a relentless,
24-hour experience.

It's impossible to hide.

Who you are,
what you think,

no matter
how hard you try,

it will always come out.
Myra Hindley has,
from the very beginning,

been exposed
to extreme provocation

and bullying.

She's never once
behaved in anything

other than the most
exemplary fashion.

As a matter of fact,
as a sign of my
confidence in her,

there's something
I've done over the years

with the better-behaved,
longer-tariffed prisoners

which has always
had good results.

Come on, boy. Good.

All right?

Stay close to me.

I will.

That's it.-

Myra.

Here we are.

Come on.

Come up here,
on this track here.

I'm tired.

Ideally, of course,
I'd take you to the coast.

Or to mountains.

Somewhere in Scotland.

This isn't bad either.

- He comes on the pitch!
- He tackles...

Now, I want you
to try something for me.

Take off your sunglasses.

Now your headscarf.

See? No one
recognizes you.

At least there's one benefit
of that awful photograph

with the blonde hair.

How does it feel?

Wonderful.

Well, this is how it
will be for you
one day...

Walking on the Heath...

On your way
to work perhaps...

Or to the shops.

Just an ordinary person.

Anonymous.

Free.

Just thought you might
want to see these.

Mmm.

Oh, gracious me.

There's no question
of Myra Hindley

being granted parole.
Among those people
who protested

at her action
in taking Hindley out

for one and a half hours
in a local park

was Mr. Bill palfrey,
former chief constable
of Lancashire.

And to let people out
after eight years,

whether it's
a walk in the park,

I think is
a lot of nonsense.

And somebody's living
in a cuckoo-cuckoo land.

It's not the land I've
lived in for 45 years.

I don't believe
that this woman is fit

to be let loose
on society.

In my opinion,
this was the worst
murder this century.

I'm feeling the space
all around me,

the wind
in my hair...

And being able
to see that far.

And I'm going to have
to feed on those two hours

because god only knows
it's the only time I’m
going to get out of here.

- Now that's not true.
- You've seen the papers.

What politician's going
to Grant me parole now?

Well...

Perhaps that's
where I come in.

What can you do?

I can certainly explain
why you were given

the privilege of the walk
in the first place.

Your good conduct
in prison, your...

Return to the church.

And as a former
cabinet minister,

I imagine I still
have some standing.

Why would you do this?

Because I like to think
that after 40 years
of visiting prisoners

I've developed some sort
of instinct about which ones
are worth fighting for.

You look surprised.
Don't you think
you're worth fighting for?

Yes, of course.

So do I.

Before I start,
there's one question
I'm bound to ask you.

Yeah?

Is there anything
about your case

or your personal
circumstances

you haven't told me?

I don't think so.
Why?

It's just that I intend
to be talking about you
in public a great deal

and it'd be awful
to have any...

UN... unpleasant
surprises.

- No.
- Good.

- Time!
- All right then.

Having serviced that,
I see no reason why
we can't forge ahead.

Are some crimes
so appalling

that their perpetrators
should never walk free again?

Or can anyone,
whatever the crime,

be delivered
from evil?

Lord Longford
confronts lord Hailsham.

If you had had the good
fortunes of spending
a great many hours

in Myra Hindley's company,
you would appreciate
how different she is

to the inflammatory reports
one reads in the
popular press.

You reject the idea
that life should mean life...

It's a totally unchristian
beastly idea.

Wicked really,
I guess.

- Well, yes...
- I'm allowed to have
my opinion about that.

Other people think
I'm wicked for saying
the opposite, so you know...

They don't think
you're wicked, frank.

They sometimes think
you're a little foolish.

In my experience,
very few women

are real criminals
in the sense
that men are.

I think you'll find
this view supported
by sociologists.

Whatever she has done,

she is entitled to be
considered for parole.

Myra Hindley was
an innocent young
18-year-old girl

before she met Ian Brady.

She has now
become herself again.

Lord Longford is talking
about parole for Myra Hindley.

When will I get parole?

I am serving
a life sentence

due to that monster.

When will I get my parole?

If she comes out,
I'll be up for murder

if I get my hands
on that woman.

I said this to lord Longford
once and I'll say it again.

She will be
one dead woman.

I mean, she will
be one dead woman.

- Mrs. West,
for a minute...
- I want justice.

- Ms. Billington!
- Can I borrow you

for two seconds
for a quick photo?

- Sorry.
I'll be right back.
- Thank you.

Lord and lady Longford,
would you like to join
the photograph?

- Oh, no...
- Please, sir.

- Oh, hello!
- Just two seconds
of your time, sir,

- to support your daughter.
- Oh come on, why not?

Lord Longford,
come on!

- Oh, all right,
if you say so.
- Thank you so much.

- Dada.
- Lady Longford.

Hello, mom.

Lord Longford, how does
it feel to be the father
of such a famous author?

Well, not hugely different
from being the husband of one.

Lord Longford,
on "brass tacks,"

you told Anne west
that Myra Hindley's
a reformed character.

- That is correct, yes.
- Would you care to comment
further?

I haven't changed my view,
if that's what you're asking.

The families
of the victims

have been particularly
upset by this.

What do you have
to say to them?

Naturally, I feel
the need for sympathy
for the families,

but I also believe
that those of us

without the necessary
qualifications

or experience
in these matters

should refrain
from passing judgment.

So if it were you,

you'd put Myra Hindley
back on the streets?

No, with all due respect,
that is not what I said.

And if you had taken
the actual time to read

the article in question,

you'd realize that I was
merely suggesting

that Ms. Hindley
be treated fairly

in comparison
with other prisoners.

How could you...

Ruin the evening like that?

I refuse to just
stand there and watch

as you sabotage your own
daughter's achievements

by campaigning
for that...

What?

That woman.
This... preoccupation

with Myra Hindley...

I realize losing your job
was a terrible blow

and you're looking
for something replace it.

But not her.

Couldn't you
find someone else?

Something else...

For all our sakes!

Yes.

Of course.

I've written
to Rachel...

To apologize.

It won't happen again.

I thought I'd go down
to the lords this afternoon.

Unless there's something
you need me to do here?

Elizabeth?

No, I don't think so.

There was a subsection
on quality licensing,

and particularly,
the old paragraph b.

And there's the intention
by the government

to achieve a measure
of quality licensing

and this will be
generally welcome.

That the normal role...

The government never
intended to say this

and is now moving
these two amendments...

Look at this one.

She's got bandages on.

Want a better look?

Dirty sod!

What a pervert!

- Frank, it's harmless.
- I disagree.

Completely harmless.

These things are
read by children
at a vulnerable age.

The boys on the bus
can't have been
more than 12.

And in our day,
it was just the same.

Nothing like so graphic.

Or as available.
Look at it!

Sexual arousal
is proverbial

and if boys grow up thinking
that these kinds of breasts

or... or this kind
of submission is normal,

they'll expect it
in later life.

I'm afraid I'm with
Marilyn Monroe on this.

When asked what she
thought about sex,

she thought
for a moment then said

she felt it was
here to stay.

And if it is,
then so is prostitution

and pornography.

I found this book.

Studies have been
done in America.

You'd be astonished
at the detrimental
effect it has.

If you feel that
strongly about it, fine.

As long as it
isn't Myra Hindley.

"Dear frank...

Where are you?

Another month passes,
and still I haven't
heard from you."

- Good evening, sir.
- Good evening.

- Just looking.
- Help yourself, sir.

Thank you.

"If I don't hear
from you soon,

I shall have to assume

that you no longer
wish to represent me."

I know what these are,
but what's this?

- It's an anal stimulator.
- Oh, thank you.

"Recently, I've seen you
campaign against pornography."

Pornography,
it is my conviction,

has increased,
is increasing,

and ought
to be diminished.

- This is hardcore.
- And very heavily thumbed.

This would become
freely available

to children if our friends
carried the motion.

Is this a show
that is representative

of what one gets
in Denmark,

in Copenhagen
at the moment?

Forget this one.

"I can only assume it is
because you have lost interest

or conviction
in my cause."

Do you think pictures
of naked girls can be
enjoyable, for instance?

You mean at my age? No.

Oh, yes.

- There's no age...
- What age should they
cease to be...

You should have to ask
some of the younger members
of the audience that.

Or the middle-aged ones.

I'm an elderly man
and you'll have to take
that answer from me.

"Well, I wish you good luck.

I shall remember you
always in my prayers.

Yours, Myra."

Moors murderer
Myra Hindley

has been caught
trying to escape jail

with her lady
prison officer lover.

Scotland yard have been
investigating an alleged

escape plot
in Holloway jail,

and already
a prison officer
has been charged

and is due to appear
in court on February 1st.

I understand
that Myra Hindley

may also be brought before
the same magistrates

at the same time in connection
with the same offense.

I can't believe
you're going.

Have a heart.
I'm all she's got.

She has a solicitor,
hasn't she?

You gave me
your word.

That woman just tried
to break out of jail.

Perhaps it had something
to do with the fact that
I stopped visiting her.

Or with the fact that
she's a hardened criminal.

Oh, come along.

You're sounding like
a tabloid editorial.

Maybe in this instance,
they're right. Had you
considered that?

I'll give you
a ring from London.

Hello, reg.
Can we go to
the station, please?

Silly man.

Hello, Myra.

I'm sorry, frank.

I just got so bleak.

I thought you'd
given up on me.

Nonsense.

Suddenly I had a vision
of the fact that

I'm going to be here forever,
without no supporters.

Not at all, not at all.

Patricia had this
idea of Brazil.

There are these slums
outside Sao Paulo

where they're crying
out for help.

What's the sense
in keeping us in here

when I could be
out there doing good?

That's what I want
to do is good.

And instead...

I've just made
everything worse.

Now I've got
to go to court.

The case is going
to get sent down.

We're never
going to see
one another again.

You never know.

Help me, please.

Listen, keep praying, Myra.

That's the most
important thing.
Keep praying.

Oh, for pity's
sake, woman.

We will have silence
in this courtroom.

Quiet!

My view,
as an experienced
prison visitor,

is that Myra Hindley
is a good Christian
woman...

Making a determined
effort to make amends
for her past,

and to do good
in the future.

There are those
that say you're under
Ms. Hindley's thrall.

How would you
respond to that?

Well, it may
or may not be so,

at least the supervising
officer was present
at all times,

to ensure that nothing
untoward took place.

Myra Hindley,

you are
already the subject

of a life sentence.

And properly so.

I am sentencing you

to a further 12 months,

to run concurrently.

I pass it in the hope
that if in future...

And it think it should
be a remote event...

People ever consider
you for parole,

then the activities
of this case

should be recorded
and remembered.

Take them down.

So she's going
to be moved, is she?

- Durham.
- Oh no.

Very predictable,
I'm afraid.

I had hoped for somewhere
more progressive.

Durham... it couldn't
be worse.

Morning, sir.

- Is this everything?
- Yes.

- Good.
- Thanks, thanks a lot.

- Goodbye.
- See you tomorrow.

Well, look who it is.

It's lord porn.

I told you to
leave her alone, frank.

But you didn't,
and now look.

Half the country has you
earmarked as a lackey,

the other as
a gullible fool.

So'm going
to tell you again,

nice and slow

so you don't forget it:

Leave...

Myra Hindley...

Alone.

Or she will do to you
what she did to me.

She will destroy you.

I can see that for a man
in your circumstances,

it must be
comforting to blame it
on someone else.

Are you going
to blame her for your
hunger strike too?

My hunger strike is
a legitimate protest

against the filthy
conditions here.

Then why didn't you
allow me to make
representations

to the home secretary
on your behalf?

'Cause I'm not
completely insane.

If I wanted
to set my cause back
a decade or two,

if I wanted to be
denied all exercise,

if I wanted to have them
piss in my food as well
as spit in it,

then I'd ask a batty
old pornography campaigner

and Myra Hindley's
whipping boy

to make representations
on my behalf.

Thank you.

- Now...
- An hysteric.

Some of the...

That's what she is.

Are you familiar
with the term

in its strict
clinical use?

No.

An hysteric
is someone who

gives to people,

reflects back
to them that which they
believe makes them

most acceptable,

most likeable...

What they think
others want to see.

Myra Hindley
is a classic hysteric.

It explains why to you

she's a virtuous

churchgoing angel,

and to her cool prisoners
and dykes,

a strong woman
with a soft heart.

And to me...

She was a brutal sadist

and a cruel killer

with not an ounce
of remorse.

If s is this girl
to you, why did you

insist on her innocence
in the trial?

Because I loved her.

How could you not love
a girl like that?

Come on, frank.
Don't look like that.

You know exactly
what I'm talking about.

I've spoken to the prison
governor about having you
reassessed as a mental case.

Deny it, frank.
Look me in the eye
and tell me

you weren't a little
sweet on her yourself.

And now you're on
this white charger,

riding in to save
his damsel.

"Save me,
lord Longford.

Save me."

Elizabeth?

Elizabeth?

- Elizabeth?
- In here.

Oh, there you are?
What are you doing?

I've been reading
Myra's letters.

I hope you don't mind.

Well, there's the fire.

Go and burn them.

I don't have the stomach
for this anymore.

Oh.

It's just...

The last time
we disagreed

so passionately
about anything,

was over your joining
the catholic church

and I think we both
agree on that matter...

You were right.

So with regard
to Ms. Hindley,

I thought I'd give you
the benefit of the doubt.

So I came into your study,

and read her letters...

And found them
very interesting.

And was thinking
how much I'd like
to meet her.

Passport and
visiting order, please?

Visiting order?

As a member
of the house of lords,
I don't need a visiting order.

You should
know that by now.

- Sorry, sir.
- Thank you.

Thank you.
Good morning.

Good morning.

- Undo the overcoat, please.
- Yes, of course.

- Arms out, sir.
- Stand over there for me.

- I see.
- Arms up.

Legs slightly apart.

Is it really necessary
for lady Longford to take
her coat off?

- Turn towards me, please.
- Thank you.

Ridiculous.

Hardly likely
to be smuggling
anything.

- Dad, I miss you.
- I really really have.

I don't understand.
I can only see
male prisoners.

That's because they
built the women's prison

into the heart
of the men's.

- Myra Hindley?
- Yes.

There she is.

Oh dear.

Be quiet!

Be quiet!

Where's your humanity?

Silence!

For pity's sake.

Hello, Myra.

Myra?

Myra?

- Myra?
It's okay.
She can hear ya.

It's just the medication.

Myra?

I brought someone
with me.

My wife Elizabeth.

- How do you do?
- How do you do?

I was so enjoying
your book.

That...

One about
queen Victoria.

But they wouldn't
let me bring it here.

They've...

Taken all my books.

I'm not allowed them.

They just came...

One day.

Men with guns...

In a helicopter.

Myra?

What have they
given her?

"The liquid kosh,"
we call it.

It's a mixture of tranqs,
antidepressants
and sleepers.

Most of the new
prisoners go on it

to cope
with the shock
of this place.

She had a particularly
rough welcome.

A lot of the women
in here are mothers,
you can imagine.

People have smeared shit
on the walls of her room.

Pretty much all her food
is tampered with.

The only safe thing
for her to eat is boiled eggs

and sweets in wrappers.

I like sweets.

It's horrific.

I had no idea.

How can we do that
to people?

And you have to get
her off that stuff.

It's inhuman.

How long has she been
in prison now?

14 years.

And the average term
served by a life prisoner?

12 years.

And still,
she's been given no
prospect of parole.

No.

You said the trial judge
made a distinction

between her case
and Ian Brady's.

I quote,
"though I believe

Brady is wicked
beyond belief,

I cannot feel the same
is necessarily true
of Hindley

when she is removed
from his influence."

End of quote.

Really?

...who between the wars,

converted more people
to Catholicism...

How's the queen mother
coming along?

Rather slowly,
I'm afraid.

I've got bogged down
researching something else.

Can you say what?

Myra Hindl.

What? Why?

...what a meddler.

It seemed to me that
for years I have been

merrily attacking your father
for supporting her

without having
the slightest idea of what
I was talking about.

- And there you go.
- And?

And I must say
my eyes have been
opened rather.

How much do you
know about

the nature
of sadomasochistic
relationships?

Mercifully,
very little.

Isn't it an accepted
psychological fact

that daughters seek
in their husbands or lovers

someone who mirrors
their own father?

One of the papers claimed

that Myra Hindley was
abused by her father.

So it makes perfect sense

that she would then
repeat the pattern
with Ian Brady,

who subjected her
to the most appalling cruelty,

beating her,
raping her,

threatening
to take her life.

I see. So it's not
her fault she procured
children for him?

She made repeated attempts
to free herself

of him,
running away to London.

But every time
came back... funny that.

Isn't that the nature
of obsession?

The fear of losing Brady
was greater than
anything else.

And you got all
this from?

The public records' office,

where I read the original
trial transcripts,

and I spoke to Dorothy wing,
her former governor
at Holloway.

But...

Ironically, the thing
that finally persuaded me
to offer her my help

was the very same thing
that had so made me

hate her
in the first place:

The fact that she
is a woman.

Did you know

there have been
half a dozen similar
child murders?

The reason none of us
has heard about them

is because the killers
in each case were men.

And men being sadistic
violent killers

isn't a story.

Incidentally,
in each case

the men have also
been paroled.

Note the reason
Myra Hindley is
still in jail

and has never been
considered for parole

is because she
is a woman.

And for that reason,

she will always have
my understanding,

if not my sympathy.

So when did you
go to the public
records' office?

When I said I was
going to the Bodleian.

And governor wing,
when did you visit her?

When I said
I was having lunch
with my agent.

So now I must add mendacity
to your many virtues.

And you'd have me
continue my campaign?

Yes...

And not rest
until she gets paroled.

Have you spoken
to Willie about it?

Whitelaw?
No, not one to one, no.

Then I suggest you do that.

What a very good idea.

I don't think
I've ever loved you

quite so completely
as I do now.

- A new high?
- Off the charts.

Top of the pops.

Get into bed, woman!

We got to get
my dressing gown off.

I've got to take
my shoes off.

The home secretary
will see you now.

Thank you
so much.

- Frank, good to see you.
- My dear fellow.

- How good of you to see me
at such short notice.
- Not at all.

- Come on in.
- Thank you.

- Sherry?
- You know me too well.

She's served
almost 15 years, Willie.

It's a scandal she hasn't
been considered for parole.

I know. But as
home secretary,

I have to make sure
that public confidence

in the system
is not undermined.

If you wish to protect
the integrity of the system,

I suggest you stop
allowing it to be ruled

- according to
the will of the mob.
- Frank, look...

At least allow her
to be interviewed by
a local parole board.

For me?
What harm could that do?

Couldn't she be
moved somewhere better?
Durham is insufferable.

I'll see what I can do.

If anyone deserves
to be in...

Frank!

You really are
a most tenacious
campaigner, you know?

It's an admirable trait.

And you always pick
the most difficult causes.

Maybe you should take
a back seat for a while.

God knows you
deserve it.

I can't, Willie.
You know what they say:

"Only dead fish swim
with the stream."

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Goodbye.

There's good news.

Willie has agreed
for Myra to be seen
by the local parole board.

And she's going to be
moved from Durham.

Oh, frank,
that's wonderful.

Imagine, if they
find in her favor,

and the national board agrees,
that would put

enormous pressure
on the home secretary.

Then the only thing
that will stand in our way
will be public opinion.

So we must keep a lid on this,
because if the press get

even the merest hint of it,
we'll be scuppered.

Fred Harrison?

Top local reporter.

Come on, man, smile.

This is your lucky day.

You are about to get a story

on the front page
of every paper in the country.

Word has reached me

that Myra Hindley is
being considered for parole.

I wasn't aware of that.

No, friend, that's what
makes it an exclusive.

Turn your tape recorder on,
there's a good lad.

Morning, lord Longford.

Good morning.

You certainly are
in high spirits today.

Yes, we are.
A bit of a break,
so I believe, for Ms. Hindley.

Yeah, don't worry.

Just goes to show,
if you keep persisting

and persisting...

Hello, Myra.
This is the nightie
you wanted.

- I couldn't remember
what color you asked for.
- That's great, thanks.

- Now to business.
- Frank...

- I have a friend
on the local parole board...
- Frank.

...who tells me that
your application will be
considered next month.

If that goes well,
all things being equal,

- the national...
- Frank, enough.

The police have
been to see me.

Brady's talked to the press
about the other bodies.

What do you mean,
what other bodies?

Pauline Reade
and the Bennett boy.

He hasn't given them
any details yet...

But he says he knows
where they're buried.

Before he grabs
the initiative,

I've decided to come
clean and tell them
everything I know.

But you know
nothing about other bodies.
You told me as much yourself.

What are you saying?

I'm saying...

That I'm going to give
a full confession
to all five murders.

Dear god.

I asked you specifically

if there was anything
you hadn't told me.

I've staked
my name on this,
my reputation.

I know.

And I would
understand perfectly

if you never wanted
to see me again.

It's what
my new solicitor's
suggested anyway.

Your new solicitor?

He feels...
And if I'm honest,
I have to agree with him...

The campaign that you've
conducted on my behalf

has hurt me
more than helped me,

and that we should
make this our last meeting.

I see.

If that's what he feels,

and you feel.

Goodbye, frank.

An hour after first light,

a police helicopter
carrying Myra Hindley
and an armed bodyguard,

landed on the a635...

The road used
by Hindley and Brady

when they were carrying
the bodies of their victims
up to the Moors.

A small group including
Myra Hindley

then inspected
the peat slopes.

Myra, we do know
it's been a long time,

but you know,
are we in the right spot?

Myra, we need to know
if this is the spot.

Can you be sure, Myra?

Have a look around.
Where in relation
to the group?

- I recognize
the rocks behind you.
- You certain?

Yes yes, I'm certain.

Hindley led the police
to areas she and Brady

visited more than
20 years ago.

In a pub two miles away:

Pat Kilbride,
whose son John was murdered

21 years ago.

He'd come armed
with a knife but was
stopped at a roadblock.

Just want to say...
This here,

I've come prepared
to kill her.

She has confessed
that she is guilty

of participating
in these crimes

so that she would be
guilty of the crime
of murder, yes.

Throughout the morning,
friends and relatives arrived

- at the Reade family home
to pay their last respects.
- I'm so sorry.

This is all my fault.

If I hadn't read
her letters

and insisted
on meeting her...

Because you'd already
decided to let her go.

As the cortege made its way
through the courtland area
of Manchester,

neighbors stood silently
in memory of Pauline.

Later, her body was interred
at a nearby cemetery.

More than two decades
after her death,

the family were at last able
to lay their daughter to rest.

I'll call the police.
Get rid of the photographers.

At graveside, the mother
of Lesley Ann downey,

yet another child
murdered on the Moors.

For Pauline Reade,
the last chapter

of her tragic life
has been written.

John Draper,
ITN, Manchester.

Forgive me father,
for I have sinned.

It has been some weeks
since my last confession,

during which time
much has changed.

My actions have
hurt my family...

My friends, and not to mention
the families of the victims.

Now I ask god

for his guidance,

his strength,

and above all
his compassion.

For in his perfection,

he forgives all
his creatures.

I beseech you, lord,

forgive me.

And give me strength

to follow your
immaculate example...

So that I might put aside
my personal hurt...

And forgive this woman.

Shh.

Go on, sit.

You're all right.
Shh.

Shh.

What's the matter
with you?

Gonna get
real fucking angry
if you don't hurry up.

What's that look for?

If you don't shush,

I'll have to shut
your mouth for you.

And I'll forget myself,

and I'll hit you
once more.

Will you stop it?

Stop it.
Stop it.

So many questions
to ask you, such a long
and distinguished career,

but I'm gonna start
with the book.

What prompted you
to write it?

As a lifelong Christian
and scholar,

I've always been interested
in ideas of sanctity.

But more than that,
I think it was probably

the entirely selfish desire
to spend a little time
with my heroes.

Do you have a favorite?

- A favorite?
- Hey, what a question.

I commend you for distilling
so succinctly such
a complex subject.

Hey, Myra, I think your
Frankie boy is on the radio.

- Lord porn.
- Dismas
of Calvary,

the thief crucified
next to Jesus.

I've always been drawn
to outcasts

and people on
the fringes of society.

And St. dismas,
having spent most of his life

as a violent criminal,

the miracle of his repentance
at the end on the cross...

Yes, I think he would
have to have my vote.

Interesting.

The time is coming up
to 20 past 2:00.

We're gonna take
some calls.

David, what's your
question about "the saints"?

I want to know how
your esteemed guest

can look himself in
the mirror each morning.

I'm assuming this is
a question about Myra Hindley.

How could you rub salt
in the wounds of the families
like that,

campaigning on behalf
of that monster?

I certainly take exception
to that description,

but I made it quite clear
before coming on this program

that I would not be
answering questions about
Ms. Hindley today.

Of course.
Next caller is Judy
who's in Sheppey.

My call is also
about Ms. Hindley.

In view of everything
we now know about it,

don't you regret having
supported her all that time?

Once again, madam,
I'm afraid I must decline
to answer questions about her.

It's a simple answer
lord Longford... yes, or no.

Do you regret it?

Not at all.

As a matter of fact,

I consider my visiting
Myra Hindley,

and indeed all
the other prisoners

I visited
for over 50 years,

to be one of the great
blessings of my life.

Now perhaps we could
get back to the subject
of "the saints"?

Hasn't she betrayed you?

She's ruined
your good name.

She's taken all of
the hard work you did for her

and thrown it
back in your face.

Um... yes.

Perhaps there's some
truth in that.

Forgiving her
has proven difficult,

very difficult.

Not for what
she's done to me...

That's neither here
nor there...

But for the terrible
crimes themselves.

Forgiveness is the very
cornerstone of my faith.

And the struggle
to deepen my faith

is my life's journey.

In that respect,

she has enriched
my spiritual life
beyond measure,

and for that I will always
be grateful to her.

If people think that
makes me weak or mad,

so be it.

That is the path
I am committed to...

To love the sinner
but hate the sins...

To assume the best in people
and not the worst...

To believe that anyone,
no matter how evil,

can be redeemed,

eventually.

Right. The time is
coming up to 2:20.

Lord Longford is with us
for the next couple of hours.

And our switchboard looks
like it's about to explode.

Next caller,
Lionel in seven oaks.

Look at you!

Which prison were
you at today?

Carlisle.

The train was delayed
coming back, I'm afraid.

Snow on the tracks.

Carlisle.

You must be mad.
You're too old for this.

I'm going to get rid
of all the requests

that aren't
local from now on.

- Oh, look.
- What?

This one's from Myra.

Hello, frank.

Oh, there you are.

Hello.

Goodness.
How well you look.

Rubbish.

My hair is falling out

and I'm dying
of emphysema.

Well, you still look
wonderful to me.

Well, you're blind.

Nearly, yes.

Frank, the reason why I've
asked to see you today...

I made up my mind
that if there was one thing

I was going to do
before it was too late,

it would be to apologize
to you in person.

Those are terrible
things I did to you...

Lying to you like that.

I'm sorry.

I couldn't tell you
everything, frank.

In prison, you never
tell anyone everything.

And your full
confession before god...

Was that a lie too?

I'm trying, frank.

I'm really trying to know
the god that you know.

But if you'd been
there that night

on the Moors
in the moonlight

when we did the first one,

then you'd know that evil

can be a spiritual
experience too.

You know we only missed it
by a few weeks.

- What?
- The death sentence.

They abolished it while
we were still on remand.

Looking back,
don't you think
it would have been

better for everyone
if they'd just hung us?

Certainly not.

Only god has the right
to take human life.

Would he have not wanted to give
the families that comfort?

None of us knows
the true purpose

of our lives on earth.

Besides...

Had you been hanged,
I would never have had

the privilege
of getting to know you.

You really believe that,
don't you?

It must be rather
a nice place to be.

Where?

Inside your head.

Oh, I'm not so sure
about that.

A fine pair we are then.

Yes.