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www.titlovi.com
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Paradoxical.
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- Bold.
- Yeah.
4
00:01:01,671 --> 00:01:03,490
Mysterious.
5
00:01:03,590 --> 00:01:06,960
- Eccentric.
- Eccentric.
6
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- Private.
- She was a very, very private woman.
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I never had any idea
she took pictures.
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She would take photographs.
Many, many photographs.
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She would never have let this happen.
10
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Is there anything that you wish
you had done differently than...
11
00:01:25,111 --> 00:01:28,715
Sure. I wish I would have found
those negatives instead of you.
12
00:01:54,557 --> 00:01:57,002
Ten dollars... Let's go harder.
Ten bucks.
13
00:01:57,102 --> 00:01:59,421
Then I'll have to end in five.
So can I have...
14
00:01:59,521 --> 00:02:01,673
It was winter 2007.
15
00:02:01,773 --> 00:02:04,301
I'll have to go seven, anyone at seven?
Seven and a half. Ten.
16
00:02:04,401 --> 00:02:05,719
And ten, gotta go $10...
17
00:02:05,819 --> 00:02:08,805
The auction house is across
the street from my home.
18
00:02:08,905 --> 00:02:13,268
I found this box that was
loaded with negatives.
19
00:02:13,368 --> 00:02:15,729
$70. 75 there... $80.
20
00:02:15,829 --> 00:02:20,984
I was writing a history book, and I
needed a lot of historic photos.
21
00:02:21,084 --> 00:02:24,529
And so I would, like, you know, take the
negatives and I'd look up into the light,
22
00:02:24,629 --> 00:02:26,281
and I'd look for images of Chicago.
23
00:02:26,381 --> 00:02:28,116
150, 160...
24
00:02:28,216 --> 00:02:31,461
There were several boxes
that went with the set.
25
00:02:32,303 --> 00:02:33,922
I just went for the biggest one.
26
00:02:34,322 --> 00:02:37,125
39 is your buyer, 39 is your buyer.
27
00:02:37,225 --> 00:02:39,677
I won it for, I think it was $380.
28
00:02:40,270 --> 00:02:43,673
The auction house told
me the photographer,
29
00:02:43,773 --> 00:02:45,391
her name was Vivian Maier.
30
00:02:49,279 --> 00:02:51,723
Google searched her...
nothing at all.
31
00:02:51,823 --> 00:02:53,524
I mean, absolutely nothing.
32
00:02:54,701 --> 00:02:57,228
So I just kind of
gave up for a while.
33
00:02:57,328 --> 00:02:59,105
I looked at some of
the stuff that night,
34
00:02:59,205 --> 00:03:01,691
and it was cool, but nothing
worked for the book,
35
00:03:01,791 --> 00:03:04,027
so I just put it in the closet.
36
00:03:04,127 --> 00:03:07,080
I just had to figure out, what am
I going to do with this stuff?
37
00:03:08,048 --> 00:03:11,292
That's what sparked me
to start scanning it.
38
00:03:15,805 --> 00:03:18,750
I have a reflex, where we'll
be driving somewhere,
39
00:03:18,850 --> 00:03:22,379
and I'll just, like, spot
something from down the road
40
00:03:22,479 --> 00:03:25,223
that I know what it is and
I know that it's valuable.
41
00:03:26,066 --> 00:03:29,010
I grew up doing the flea
markets with my brother.
42
00:03:29,110 --> 00:03:32,230
My father did it. His father did it.
43
00:03:32,864 --> 00:03:35,767
I would do storage
auctions with my brother.
44
00:03:35,867 --> 00:03:38,728
And he'd win some,
and we'd clean 'em out.
45
00:03:38,828 --> 00:03:42,315
We threw out tons of negatives.
46
00:03:42,415 --> 00:03:46,494
Cos there's no value in negatives
to most resale people.
47
00:03:48,338 --> 00:03:51,616
And these negatives that
I discovered, what I saw at first,
48
00:03:51,716 --> 00:03:54,035
I didn't know if it was really good.
49
00:03:54,135 --> 00:03:55,996
I knew that I thought it was good.
50
00:03:56,096 --> 00:03:58,873
I contacted a couple of galleries.
51
00:03:58,973 --> 00:04:01,175
I didn't know where to go.
52
00:04:02,519 --> 00:04:06,097
I made a photo blog and I
put about 200 images up.
53
00:04:44,477 --> 00:04:47,096
I put a link on Flickr.
54
00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:56,230
That post, it just went insane.
55
00:05:10,587 --> 00:05:15,416
So I went on this mission to piece
together the rest of her work.
56
00:05:17,427 --> 00:05:19,662
And then, I found the other
people who bought boxes,
57
00:05:19,762 --> 00:05:21,289
and I bought their boxes.
58
00:05:21,389 --> 00:05:25,593
And then I had all these negatives,
like, insane amounts of negatives.
59
00:05:27,228 --> 00:05:31,933
You always want to know
who is behind the work.
60
00:05:33,026 --> 00:05:35,895
I just knew her name
was Vivian Maier.
61
00:05:36,738 --> 00:05:40,108
Was she a journalist?
Professional photographer?
62
00:05:41,826 --> 00:05:45,822
"Let me just Google her name again
to see if there's anything up."
63
00:05:47,707 --> 00:05:53,454
And I found an obituary that was placed
just a few days before that search.
64
00:05:54,631 --> 00:05:58,626
I found an address in her stuff.
65
00:05:59,093 --> 00:06:02,247
And after some, like,
WhitePages searches,
66
00:06:02,347 --> 00:06:04,841
I called, and I said,
67
00:06:06,100 --> 00:06:10,088
"I have the work...
the negatives of Vivian Maier."
68
00:06:10,188 --> 00:06:12,390
And he was like,
"Oh, that was my nanny."
69
00:06:14,651 --> 00:06:16,269
That was his nanny.
70
00:06:18,905 --> 00:06:21,275
Why is a nanny...
71
00:06:22,075 --> 00:06:24,735
taking all these photos?
72
00:06:27,038 --> 00:06:29,482
What they started
to tell me about her
73
00:06:29,582 --> 00:06:32,076
was... was strange.
74
00:06:34,879 --> 00:06:36,739
He said, "She was kind of a loner.
75
00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,117
"She didn't have any
family that we knew of.
76
00:06:39,217 --> 00:06:42,412
"She never had any love life
or children that we knew of.
77
00:06:42,512 --> 00:06:44,255
"But she was like our mother."
78
00:06:47,225 --> 00:06:50,052
So it just caught my curiosity.
79
00:06:50,812 --> 00:06:53,423
So what I said was, "Do you
have any of her stuff?"
80
00:06:53,523 --> 00:06:58,261
And they said, "Well, I've been keeping
up the bills on her storage lockers.
81
00:06:58,361 --> 00:07:01,598
"We wanna throw all the stuff out.
She was a pack rat."
82
00:07:01,698 --> 00:07:02,849
I said, "No, no, no, don't."
83
00:07:02,949 --> 00:07:06,319
He's like, "You don't understand.
She was a pack rat.
84
00:07:07,245 --> 00:07:10,857
"We're gonna get a dumpster.
You're welcome to come and help us.
85
00:07:10,957 --> 00:07:15,328
"If you see anything that you like that
we're gonna throw out, you can have."
86
00:07:15,878 --> 00:07:19,957
I just wanted to go find out
who she was. Just a quick thing.
87
00:07:27,515 --> 00:07:30,710
I found this leather chest.
88
00:07:30,810 --> 00:07:35,340
It was, like, taped shut with just,
like, box tape or something.
89
00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:39,677
And so we cut it and we opened it.
90
00:07:39,777 --> 00:07:45,024
And it was filled to the top
with rolls of undeveloped film.
91
00:07:47,035 --> 00:07:51,364
I took one canister and
I shook it, and it rattled.
92
00:07:52,248 --> 00:07:55,117
So I opened it and there
was teeth inside.
93
00:08:01,382 --> 00:08:07,163
She had stuff wedged and hidden
in everything that she had.
94
00:08:07,263 --> 00:08:12,043
Almost like... it's like a secret little
hiding spot for all of her little things.
95
00:08:12,143 --> 00:08:14,295
A coupon, a note,
96
00:08:14,395 --> 00:08:17,423
a flyer, bus passes, train cards.
97
00:08:17,523 --> 00:08:20,802
Her hats. Shoes.
98
00:08:20,902 --> 00:08:24,597
Her coats, her blouses.
99
00:08:24,697 --> 00:08:27,517
I have uncashed income tax
cheques from the government
100
00:08:27,617 --> 00:08:30,027
amounting to thousands of dollars.
101
00:08:43,966 --> 00:08:45,994
I have around 100,000 negatives.
102
00:08:46,094 --> 00:08:49,372
I have 700 rolls of
undeveloped colour film.
103
00:08:49,472 --> 00:08:53,126
2,000 undeveloped rolls
of black-and-white film.
104
00:08:53,226 --> 00:08:57,805
I realised everything needs to be
organised and scanned and archived.
105
00:08:58,564 --> 00:09:01,718
But it was more than
I could handle myself.
106
00:09:01,818 --> 00:09:05,805
So I thought, "Let's see what
the museums will do to help me.
107
00:09:05,905 --> 00:09:09,317
"Maybe I could get this into MoMA.
Maybe I could get this into Tate Modern."
108
00:09:10,410 --> 00:09:12,603
I sent them... letters.
109
00:09:12,703 --> 00:09:15,114
And here is the reply.
110
00:09:17,166 --> 00:09:19,652
"Dear Mr Maloof,
on behalf of the curators,
111
00:09:19,752 --> 00:09:23,197
"I would like to thank you for thinking of
the Department of Photography at MoMA.
112
00:09:23,297 --> 00:09:25,700
"Unfortunately, the
museum cannot accommodate
113
00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:28,085
"these photographs at this time."
114
00:09:28,845 --> 00:09:31,205
At that point,
115
00:09:31,305 --> 00:09:33,716
I just figured, "I'm on my own.
116
00:09:36,644 --> 00:09:38,671
"I'm gonna try to do an exhibition.
117
00:09:38,771 --> 00:09:41,341
"I'm gonna do a book."
118
00:09:41,441 --> 00:09:43,643
It's an insane amount of work.
119
00:09:44,652 --> 00:09:46,812
I'm kind of compulsive with stuff.
120
00:09:48,448 --> 00:09:51,400
I just wanted people to
see this incredible work.
121
00:09:53,870 --> 00:09:57,698
And I applied for a show at the
Cultural Center in Chicago.
122
00:10:06,632 --> 00:10:12,963
They said this was the biggest turnout
for any artist they had ever had.
123
00:10:14,098 --> 00:10:16,801
And then, the story just took off.
124
00:10:22,148 --> 00:10:24,675
The history of street
photography is being rewritten.
125
00:10:24,775 --> 00:10:26,427
- Vivian Maier.
- Vivian Maier.
126
00:10:26,527 --> 00:10:29,263
- Vivian Maier.
- Saved from obscurity.
127
00:10:29,363 --> 00:10:33,851
In death, she is getting the
fame that she never had in life.
128
00:10:33,951 --> 00:10:37,772
John Maloof is still working his
way through all Maier's negatives.
129
00:10:37,872 --> 00:10:42,118
My mission is to put Vivian
in the history books.
130
00:10:46,214 --> 00:10:48,199
My first impression,
when I saw the work,
131
00:10:48,299 --> 00:10:53,162
was the kind of delight when
a surprise comes your way
132
00:10:53,262 --> 00:10:56,457
and you feel that somebody,
hitherto undiscovered,
133
00:10:56,557 --> 00:11:00,211
suddenly makes their work
available and it looks good.
134
00:11:00,311 --> 00:11:03,673
It looks like there's
an authentic eye
135
00:11:03,773 --> 00:11:06,801
and a real savvy about human nature
136
00:11:06,901 --> 00:11:09,929
and photography, and the street,
137
00:11:10,029 --> 00:11:12,723
and that kind of thing
doesn't happen that often.
138
00:11:12,823 --> 00:11:17,311
I see thousands of pictures. Day after day,
people send me their websites to look at.
139
00:11:17,411 --> 00:11:21,323
And when I flick through them,
I feel most of them are undistinguished.
140
00:11:21,707 --> 00:11:28,072
But Vivian's work instantly had those
qualities of human understanding
141
00:11:28,172 --> 00:11:30,032
and warmth and playfulness,
142
00:11:30,132 --> 00:11:33,669
that I thought,
"This is a genuine shooter."
143
00:11:34,804 --> 00:11:37,089
She had a great eye.
144
00:11:38,724 --> 00:11:41,135
And she... Great sense of framing.
145
00:11:41,602 --> 00:11:45,923
- Here... this is the first one. I can't...
- It's a muddy construction worker's butt.
146
00:11:46,023 --> 00:11:48,142
Oh, my God!
147
00:11:49,527 --> 00:11:51,812
She had a sense of humour.
148
00:11:52,488 --> 00:11:54,899
And a sense of tragedy.
149
00:11:57,743 --> 00:11:59,779
Beautiful.
150
00:12:00,162 --> 00:12:02,615
Those photos of
children are beautiful.
151
00:12:04,333 --> 00:12:07,787
Beautiful sense of light,
environment.
152
00:12:08,296 --> 00:12:09,906
I mean, she had it all.
153
00:12:10,006 --> 00:12:12,750
Was she very prolific?
Did she shoot a lot?
154
00:12:13,259 --> 00:12:16,579
In total, there's probably
about 150,000 negatives.
155
00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:18,664
She shot a lot.
156
00:12:18,764 --> 00:12:21,175
She never showed her work to anybody?
157
00:12:23,311 --> 00:12:26,380
That's what I'm trying to
figure out. So far, no.
158
00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:28,682
I think people would
have loved her work.
159
00:12:29,609 --> 00:12:33,646
I mean, I could even say,
Robert Frank with a square format.
160
00:12:34,905 --> 00:12:37,149
Lisette Model...
161
00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:40,569
Helen Levitt, definitely.
162
00:12:41,537 --> 00:12:43,272
Diane Arbus.
163
00:12:43,372 --> 00:12:45,616
Some of the street portraits.
164
00:12:46,751 --> 00:12:50,162
Had she made herself known, she would
have become a famous photographer.
165
00:12:52,131 --> 00:12:53,866
Something was wrong, something...
166
00:12:53,966 --> 00:12:58,003
There's... there's a piece
of the puzzle missing.
167
00:12:58,888 --> 00:13:01,298
That's beautiful.
168
00:13:03,059 --> 00:13:06,796
I really want to know, why did
Vivian make these images?
169
00:13:06,896 --> 00:13:09,932
What drove her to such compulsion,
170
00:13:10,608 --> 00:13:14,178
to an obsessive degree,
to take so many pictures?
171
00:13:14,278 --> 00:13:16,564
Why were they never shown?
172
00:13:17,698 --> 00:13:21,686
I started to unbox all of her stuff.
173
00:13:21,786 --> 00:13:23,688
I'm finding leads.
174
00:13:23,788 --> 00:13:26,023
You know, receipts
that she had. But...
175
00:13:26,123 --> 00:13:30,570
Her... Her receipts are
from the '70s and '80s.
176
00:13:30,670 --> 00:13:32,613
And in the '70s and '80s in Chicago,
177
00:13:32,713 --> 00:13:34,949
there was no area code.
178
00:13:35,049 --> 00:13:40,079
And I started calling these phone numbers,
attaching every various area code.
179
00:13:40,179 --> 00:13:44,917
773, 312, 708, 847, 630, 815...
180
00:13:45,017 --> 00:13:47,753
Was she ever a nanny for
a San Franciscan family?
181
00:13:47,853 --> 00:13:50,590
- Yes.
- Oh, my gosh.
182
00:13:50,690 --> 00:13:52,933
Yes, she lived right next door.
183
00:14:05,204 --> 00:14:08,198
I know Vivian Maier because
she was my childhood nanny.
184
00:14:08,998 --> 00:14:11,744
For about four years.
Something like that.
185
00:14:14,630 --> 00:14:17,708
Her job was as a
housekeeper and a nanny.
186
00:14:19,301 --> 00:14:21,587
Vivian was my nanny.
187
00:14:22,304 --> 00:14:27,968
Vivian came into our lives when we
needed a caretaker for my mother.
188
00:14:28,686 --> 00:14:31,631
I was just staring at her,
and I had thought,
189
00:14:31,731 --> 00:14:35,768
"Where did my sister find this
lady to baby-sit her kids?"
190
00:14:44,076 --> 00:14:47,647
She was obsessed with just
saving bits of memories,
191
00:14:47,747 --> 00:14:49,690
of moments in time.
192
00:14:49,790 --> 00:14:54,320
The stuff that she collected all helped
me understand her a little better.
193
00:14:54,420 --> 00:14:57,623
I have dozens of audio
tapes that Vivian made.
194
00:15:13,647 --> 00:15:17,893
I have around 150 8mm
and 16mm movies.
195
00:15:29,914 --> 00:15:32,533
I found pictures of Phil Donahue.
196
00:15:33,375 --> 00:15:36,954
Like, in his home,
petting a dog and at dinner.
197
00:15:38,088 --> 00:15:42,118
I was a single parent in Winnetka,
Illinois, with four sons.
198
00:15:42,218 --> 00:15:44,995
Along comes Vivian.
199
00:15:45,095 --> 00:15:47,415
I met her in a diner,
to interview her
200
00:15:47,515 --> 00:15:49,875
for this housekeeper job.
201
00:15:49,975 --> 00:15:52,336
She took my picture.
202
00:15:52,436 --> 00:15:55,005
I was a guy running back
and forth over my shoes.
203
00:15:55,105 --> 00:15:58,426
I had to do a programme
every day, sometimes two.
204
00:15:58,526 --> 00:16:01,137
I didn't want any trouble, I just...
205
00:16:01,237 --> 00:16:03,731
You know, I just wanted clean socks.
206
00:16:04,406 --> 00:16:06,726
She was with us less than a year.
207
00:16:06,826 --> 00:16:09,854
I have a memory of
her taking a picture
208
00:16:09,954 --> 00:16:12,698
inside a garbage can.
209
00:16:15,668 --> 00:16:17,862
I thought, "Well, you know...
210
00:16:17,962 --> 00:16:20,156
"They laughed at Picasso."
211
00:16:20,256 --> 00:16:22,450
I didn't know. I mean,
I didn't give it much thought.
212
00:16:22,550 --> 00:16:24,710
I didn't think she was crazy.
213
00:16:29,056 --> 00:16:31,667
Vivian took self-portraits.
214
00:16:31,767 --> 00:16:35,463
In my mind, I don't know what
image I had of this person,
215
00:16:35,563 --> 00:16:39,349
but it was definitely not
the image that I uncovered.
216
00:16:54,290 --> 00:16:57,318
She came across as unusual.
217
00:16:57,418 --> 00:17:01,155
She wore big... big coats,
with felt hats.
218
00:17:01,255 --> 00:17:06,794
The kind of thing that might
have been popular in 1925.
219
00:17:09,138 --> 00:17:11,582
She was always kind
of hiding her figure.
220
00:17:11,682 --> 00:17:15,544
You know, wearing these heavy clothes.
And these boots.
221
00:17:15,644 --> 00:17:17,513
They used to call her Army Boots.
222
00:17:19,523 --> 00:17:20,883
She was very tall.
223
00:17:20,983 --> 00:17:22,510
Seven feet...
224
00:17:22,610 --> 00:17:25,137
- No! Seven feet!
- She was tall.
225
00:17:25,237 --> 00:17:28,107
- Oh, she must have been about five nine.
- Six foot.
226
00:17:30,701 --> 00:17:33,270
- She liked wearing men's shirts...
- She wore men's shirts.
227
00:17:33,370 --> 00:17:34,988
She said the tailoring was better.
228
00:17:36,165 --> 00:17:39,068
She'd have kind of a...
just a straight blunt cut.
229
00:17:39,168 --> 00:17:42,079
She had hair that stuck straight up!
230
00:17:42,713 --> 00:17:45,241
Now, looking back, I would
say she kind of dressed
231
00:17:45,341 --> 00:17:48,953
like you would expect to
find women factory workers
232
00:17:49,053 --> 00:17:51,672
in the Soviet Union in
the '50s or something.
233
00:17:52,973 --> 00:17:54,633
That's how she walked.
234
00:17:57,770 --> 00:18:00,047
You have to swing your
arms up like this,
235
00:18:00,147 --> 00:18:03,592
and you have to do a...
sort of a Nazi march.
236
00:18:03,692 --> 00:18:07,471
You'd see her on her
little motorised bicycle.
237
00:18:07,571 --> 00:18:09,223
I mean, I remember sometimes thinking
238
00:18:09,323 --> 00:18:13,269
she kind of looked like...
the Wicked Witch of the West.
239
00:18:13,369 --> 00:18:15,696
Always had her camera
around her neck.
240
00:18:16,914 --> 00:18:19,366
Always the camera around her neck.
241
00:18:21,543 --> 00:18:25,948
She had, like, this great camera with...
I remember, it was a square.
242
00:18:26,048 --> 00:18:31,620
Rolleiflex. You flip open the thing and you
look through the viewfinder directly down.
243
00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,206
I lusted after a twin-lens Rolly.
244
00:18:34,306 --> 00:18:35,916
And here, she had one.
245
00:18:36,016 --> 00:18:41,346
And I looked at that camera,
and it looked like it was rather old.
246
00:18:43,899 --> 00:18:49,313
You see, the Rolleiflex is
a great disguise camera.
247
00:18:50,531 --> 00:18:55,102
Because it wasn't up here, where she
had to alert somebody on the street
248
00:18:55,202 --> 00:18:56,645
that she was photographing them.
249
00:18:56,745 --> 00:18:58,906
She could be sort of
secretive down here.
250
00:19:00,791 --> 00:19:03,444
The camera was shooting from below.
251
00:19:03,544 --> 00:19:07,956
And it gave her pictures a
kind of towering magnitude.
252
00:19:09,383 --> 00:19:12,995
There's a picture of a guy.
He's just an ordinary street guy.
253
00:19:13,095 --> 00:19:16,832
But he has a power and dignity.
254
00:19:16,932 --> 00:19:21,170
And he's... he's standing there
and he's looking at her.
255
00:19:21,270 --> 00:19:24,924
If you look at his eyeline,
he's looking right into her face.
256
00:19:25,024 --> 00:19:30,229
And she probably looked down and focused
and then looked right up at him.
257
00:19:31,113 --> 00:19:33,982
And he looked at her and
she fired the shutter.
258
00:19:35,117 --> 00:19:39,021
Street photographers
tend to be gregarious
259
00:19:39,121 --> 00:19:41,273
in the sense that they can
go out on the street,
260
00:19:41,373 --> 00:19:44,735
and they're comfortable
being among people,
261
00:19:44,835 --> 00:19:48,262
but they're also a funny
mixture of solitaries
262
00:19:48,363 --> 00:19:51,033
at the same time as being gregarious.
263
00:19:51,133 --> 00:19:53,577
You observe and you
embrace and you take in,
264
00:19:53,677 --> 00:19:57,130
but you stay back and
you try to stay invisible.
265
00:19:59,099 --> 00:20:01,377
She didn't like to
talk about herself.
266
00:20:01,477 --> 00:20:04,505
Some people I meet
and they're very open.
267
00:20:04,605 --> 00:20:08,141
She was not an open person,
she was a closed person.
268
00:20:08,776 --> 00:20:11,387
She lived on the third
floor in our attic,
269
00:20:11,487 --> 00:20:15,975
and one of the first things she asked
me for was please to put in a lock,
270
00:20:16,075 --> 00:20:19,278
so that she could lock
her area securely.
271
00:20:20,537 --> 00:20:22,781
It was a real serious lock.
272
00:20:23,457 --> 00:20:26,159
She was mysterious.
273
00:20:26,794 --> 00:20:31,290
She said don't ever open
this door, to her room.
274
00:20:33,842 --> 00:20:36,745
I think she made friends with
me because she sized me up,
275
00:20:36,845 --> 00:20:40,374
and thought I was strong enough
to lift a bunch of boxes for her.
276
00:20:40,474 --> 00:20:42,718
I broke the springs of my car.
277
00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,930
I think that gives you an idea
of how much weight I lifted.
278
00:20:47,940 --> 00:20:51,051
She mentioned that she
brought her life with her,
279
00:20:51,151 --> 00:20:53,762
which meant a number of boxes.
280
00:20:53,862 --> 00:20:56,640
We said, "Sure, no problem."
We had a garage.
281
00:20:56,740 --> 00:21:01,520
There was a porch off of the room,
you know, sort of those sleeping porches.
282
00:21:01,620 --> 00:21:04,781
And it was piled high with boxes.
283
00:21:05,207 --> 00:21:09,036
We put them in our garage,
which, fortunately,
284
00:21:11,171 --> 00:21:12,622
was a two-and-a-half car
garage, for two cars.
285
00:21:12,965 --> 00:21:15,534
- And so we had this..
- It became a two-car garage.
286
00:21:15,634 --> 00:21:18,454
It became... it became a
tight two-car garage.
287
00:21:18,554 --> 00:21:22,249
Of course, we'll never know how much
the boxes were her photographs,
288
00:21:22,349 --> 00:21:24,418
- and how much of the boxes were...
- John knows.
289
00:21:24,518 --> 00:21:28,013
Well, but she had so many boxes.
290
00:21:29,648 --> 00:21:34,094
I'd like to know why you would
hoard all of this great art.
291
00:21:34,194 --> 00:21:36,521
Why would...
why wouldn't you share it?
292
00:21:37,239 --> 00:21:40,025
What's the point of taking
it if no one sees it?
293
00:21:40,742 --> 00:21:42,644
So sad, really.
294
00:21:42,744 --> 00:21:44,646
Really sad.
295
00:21:44,746 --> 00:21:46,815
If you could have just
shown her all the pictures
296
00:21:46,915 --> 00:21:49,485
and held her down in a chair
somewhere so she couldn't...
297
00:21:49,585 --> 00:21:52,204
put tape on her mouth so
she couldn't tell you no.
298
00:21:52,796 --> 00:21:56,833
Obviously, the woman was so creative,
and it must have been galling...
299
00:21:57,509 --> 00:22:00,253
to just, you know, be a maid.
300
00:22:01,096 --> 00:22:04,091
Wash the floors,
making some lunch and dinner,
301
00:22:04,850 --> 00:22:07,094
taking care of kids as a nanny.
302
00:22:12,941 --> 00:22:16,144
Some of the early photos
I have are from 1951.
303
00:22:18,530 --> 00:22:23,693
One of them said on the back,
"The Walkers, Southampton."
304
00:22:25,162 --> 00:22:29,699
I was surprised to see the photographs
of my grandparents' house.
305
00:22:31,084 --> 00:22:33,286
We always called it Tides' End.
306
00:22:40,469 --> 00:22:44,339
It's amazing to see it,
so dilapidated.
307
00:22:47,226 --> 00:22:48,627
This was flowers.
308
00:22:48,727 --> 00:22:51,805
We'd have lunches out
here, and tea, and...
309
00:22:52,648 --> 00:22:54,842
It was wonderful.
310
00:22:54,942 --> 00:22:57,845
Vivian probably spent the summer.
311
00:22:57,945 --> 00:23:00,647
She was probably a
nanny out of New York,
312
00:23:01,198 --> 00:23:04,184
tagging along with a family
and with the children.
313
00:23:04,284 --> 00:23:07,229
In those days, your father
worked in New York,
314
00:23:07,329 --> 00:23:09,439
and came out by train on Friday,
315
00:23:09,539 --> 00:23:11,567
and went back on Sunday.
316
00:23:11,667 --> 00:23:14,653
I don't think that's
changed very much.
317
00:23:14,753 --> 00:23:17,114
If you go to the beach club today,
318
00:23:17,214 --> 00:23:19,825
and, go down on the sand,
319
00:23:19,925 --> 00:23:22,210
you'll see the nannies there.
320
00:23:22,970 --> 00:23:25,080
Some of these women
have been lucky enough
321
00:23:25,180 --> 00:23:27,541
to make their way up here
to the United States.
322
00:23:27,641 --> 00:23:31,678
The girl who helps me, this is
her fifth or sixth year here.
323
00:23:32,396 --> 00:23:35,015
- What's her name?
- Olivia.
324
00:23:36,942 --> 00:23:39,769
Delightful. Delightful person.
I love her dearly.
325
00:23:41,697 --> 00:23:45,017
She speaks very little English,
and I speak very little Spanish.
326
00:23:45,117 --> 00:23:47,486
We get along beautifully.
327
00:23:56,336 --> 00:23:59,364
It's been written about
that she had few friends,
328
00:23:59,464 --> 00:24:03,418
and I consider myself
one of those friends.
329
00:24:04,553 --> 00:24:07,797
I liked her a lot.
She was a terrific person.
330
00:24:09,599 --> 00:24:11,843
1962.
331
00:24:12,686 --> 00:24:16,590
I lived in Highland Park, I had a lot
of small children, I was home a lot.
332
00:24:16,690 --> 00:24:21,136
One of my children was friendly with
one of the boys she took care of.
333
00:24:21,236 --> 00:24:24,514
The children, they were always
at each other's houses,
334
00:24:24,614 --> 00:24:26,058
and she would come by.
335
00:24:26,158 --> 00:24:30,812
We had good conversations with kids
swirling around us ail the time.
336
00:24:30,912 --> 00:24:33,907
I had a very freewheeling,
open household.
337
00:24:36,251 --> 00:24:38,620
There weren't a lot of rules.
338
00:24:38,962 --> 00:24:40,830
You know? Don't get
killed in the street.
339
00:24:41,673 --> 00:24:43,951
She loved the children and
the children loved her.
340
00:24:44,051 --> 00:24:46,378
She was wonderful to the children.
341
00:24:49,765 --> 00:24:54,344
I think, probably loved them as much
as she probably loved anybody.
342
00:24:55,729 --> 00:24:57,839
- Knock, knock!
- Who's there?
343
00:24:57,939 --> 00:24:59,091
- Apple.
- Apple who?
344
00:24:59,191 --> 00:25:01,935
- Apple knock knock!
- Who's there?
345
00:25:02,944 --> 00:25:05,355
- Apple.
- Knock, knock!
346
00:25:05,947 --> 00:25:07,557
- Who's there?
- Knock, knock.
347
00:25:07,657 --> 00:25:09,493
Knock, knock who?
348
00:25:14,447 --> 00:25:15,391
Oh, God!
349
00:25:15,791 --> 00:25:17,693
Well, gentlemen...
350
00:25:17,793 --> 00:25:22,080
I think she was quite lively, and a
wonderful person in her younger years.
351
00:25:22,964 --> 00:25:24,574
I mean, she must have been a delight.
352
00:25:24,674 --> 00:25:27,703
I can see how they worshipped her,
353
00:25:27,803 --> 00:25:30,706
because she was doing the adventures
354
00:25:30,806 --> 00:25:34,384
that, normally, a parent
would probably not do.
355
00:25:35,852 --> 00:25:38,722
Life was more adventurous
with her around.
356
00:25:39,523 --> 00:25:43,135
She was very opinionated about how
children should spend their time,
357
00:25:43,235 --> 00:25:46,388
and mainly how they should spend
it was out and about with her.
358
00:25:46,488 --> 00:25:50,976
She would load up the stroller with
the baby and her bag, and both kids,
359
00:25:51,076 --> 00:25:53,353
and off they would go on outings.
360
00:25:53,453 --> 00:25:55,105
And they had their routine.
361
00:25:55,205 --> 00:25:57,941
There was a Marshall Field's
in downtown Evanston,
362
00:25:58,041 --> 00:26:00,193
and it had a candy counter
on the first floor.
363
00:26:00,293 --> 00:26:03,788
Well, that was always the first stop,
because there were always free samples.
364
00:26:04,756 --> 00:26:08,668
She would avail herself very
heartily of the free samples.
365
00:26:09,261 --> 00:26:11,121
Meaning, like, dump...
366
00:26:11,221 --> 00:26:14,124
You know, she'd dump the
whole tray of Frango Mints
367
00:26:14,224 --> 00:26:16,426
into her purse and walk away!
368
00:26:17,561 --> 00:26:19,296
We stopped going
there all of a sudden,
369
00:26:19,396 --> 00:26:23,808
but I believe that she was kicked
out of Marshall Field's, permanently.
370
00:26:24,401 --> 00:26:26,762
A really clear memory
is her setting up
371
00:26:26,862 --> 00:26:29,773
to take photos of all
these naked mannequins.
372
00:26:30,198 --> 00:26:34,144
Some of them were headless,
some of them were toppled over a little bit.
373
00:26:34,244 --> 00:26:36,271
There'll be probably an
amazing photograph.
374
00:26:36,371 --> 00:26:38,231
But as a child,
it was taking forever,
375
00:26:38,331 --> 00:26:40,400
standing there on the
corner of the street,
376
00:26:40,500 --> 00:26:44,654
waiting while this weird lady takes pictures
of these naked, headless mannequins.
377
00:26:44,754 --> 00:26:48,367
Then they would go out and they
would look in the alleys for junk,
378
00:26:48,467 --> 00:26:50,410
because that was
what she liked to do.
379
00:26:50,510 --> 00:26:53,789
She would come home with
pieces of metal, old furniture,
380
00:26:53,889 --> 00:26:55,624
and we would look at it.
381
00:26:55,724 --> 00:26:59,419
"Is this art? Is this not art?
What is this? Oh, this could be useful.
382
00:26:59,519 --> 00:27:01,638
"This could come in handy sometime."
383
00:27:03,231 --> 00:27:06,927
My brother Robbie, he was riding
his bike home from school,
384
00:27:07,027 --> 00:27:08,178
and he got hit by a car.
385
00:27:08,278 --> 00:27:12,140
He was sort of laying in the middle of
the street, and an ambulance was coming,
386
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:14,976
and he... and he says,
and I don't know if this is true,
387
00:27:15,076 --> 00:27:19,114
but he always said that Vivian was taking
pictures of him laying on the ground.
388
00:27:21,666 --> 00:27:23,527
It wasn't, like,
"Oh, Robbie, are you OK?"
389
00:27:23,627 --> 00:27:25,870
It was more just,
"Oh, this is a good photo op!"
390
00:27:32,886 --> 00:27:37,173
My mother drove up and saw
my brother lying in the street.
391
00:27:38,558 --> 00:27:41,428
She said, "Oh! I thought
the dogs got hit."
392
00:27:43,271 --> 00:27:45,465
Vivian was just kind
of above the fray.
393
00:27:45,565 --> 00:27:50,145
And I remember thinking,
"There's Vivian, taking pictures, as usual."
394
00:27:53,532 --> 00:27:58,403
She was aware of what was going on
in politics and society at the time.
395
00:28:00,956 --> 00:28:05,110
She would bring this
cassette recorder...
396
00:28:05,210 --> 00:28:09,664
and she goes to the supermarket,
and she's asking people in line...
397
00:28:10,799 --> 00:28:12,033
- VHi, Carl.
- Hi.
398
00:28:12,133 --> 00:28:13,577
I got you with my machine.
399
00:28:13,677 --> 00:28:17,998
I was wondering if you had anything
to say about all this political scene.
400
00:28:18,098 --> 00:28:20,125
- Well...
- About Nixon and so on.
401
00:28:20,225 --> 00:28:23,378
I think it happened the way it
should for the best of the country.
402
00:28:23,478 --> 00:28:26,173
And maybe it'll be a warning
for future politicians.
403
00:28:26,273 --> 00:28:28,933
That's right. That's right.
404
00:28:29,526 --> 00:28:31,678
But what did you think
of the impeachment?
405
00:28:31,778 --> 00:28:33,263
- Come on!
- Am I on tape?
406
00:28:33,363 --> 00:28:36,099
- Yes, you are. Come on.
- I don't know.
407
00:28:36,199 --> 00:28:38,143
Well, you should have an opinion.
408
00:28:38,243 --> 00:28:41,780
Women are supposed to be
opinionated, I hope. Come on.
409
00:28:42,998 --> 00:28:47,243
There's one movie that she
made that has a note in it.
410
00:28:48,795 --> 00:28:53,366
And it says, "1972,
Chicago murder of mother and baby.
411
00:28:53,466 --> 00:28:56,661
"Market where she found
ad for baby-sitting job
412
00:28:56,761 --> 00:28:59,380
"which had led to
disappearance and death.
413
00:29:09,024 --> 00:29:11,768
Then you see her walking
to the supermarket.
414
00:29:14,112 --> 00:29:17,315
She's walking in the
baby-sitter's footsteps.
415
00:29:21,536 --> 00:29:24,030
You see her walking
to the neighbourhood.
416
00:29:24,664 --> 00:29:28,618
I just wonder if that's
where the crime happened.
417
00:29:34,841 --> 00:29:37,085
She goes to the funeral home.
418
00:29:50,106 --> 00:29:54,010
She's kind of... a journalist
of the era, like a...
419
00:29:54,110 --> 00:29:57,305
But... usually, you do
that to show people.
420
00:29:57,405 --> 00:29:59,349
You know, to show,
"This is what happened."
421
00:29:59,449 --> 00:30:00,733
She just did it.
422
00:30:07,540 --> 00:30:12,078
One day in 1977, I was
driving on Sheridan Road
423
00:30:13,546 --> 00:30:16,116
and someone flagged
me for hitchhiking.
424
00:30:16,216 --> 00:30:18,201
Plenty of people do that.
425
00:30:18,301 --> 00:30:20,545
Turned out to be Vivian Maier.
426
00:30:21,304 --> 00:30:25,041
When I met Vivian, back in 1972,
427
00:30:25,141 --> 00:30:27,544
I was in grad school at Northwestern,
428
00:30:27,644 --> 00:30:29,713
and I worked in the language lab.
429
00:30:29,813 --> 00:30:34,726
And it was not at all unusual for eccentric
people to be coming through the lab.
430
00:30:35,694 --> 00:30:40,223
She was French. She had lost
most of her accent, I would say.
431
00:30:40,323 --> 00:30:46,396
She affected what, at the time, struck
me instantly as a fake French accent.
432
00:30:46,496 --> 00:30:49,065
Some people have said that
she had a fake accent.
433
00:30:49,165 --> 00:30:50,900
No, this is... this is not true.
434
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:54,537
My degree is in linguistics.
I have a PhD in linguistics.
435
00:30:56,589 --> 00:30:59,584
The truth is, it was a fake accent.
436
00:31:01,553 --> 00:31:06,541
I happened to see the film The
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse,
437
00:31:06,641 --> 00:31:09,377
and, probably not for nothing,
they were right...
438
00:31:09,477 --> 00:31:11,087
And I have...
439
00:31:11,187 --> 00:31:14,390
There's the lilting
sound of it, you know?
440
00:31:14,691 --> 00:31:18,178
"Uh, I don't really know what you
want me to do, but you have to do it,
441
00:31:18,278 --> 00:31:20,889
"come over later, and then
everything will be OK."
442
00:31:20,989 --> 00:31:23,558
Her voice, it seemed like
it went up and down,
443
00:31:23,658 --> 00:31:26,102
- you know what I'm saying?
- Oh, yes. Ooh!
444
00:31:26,202 --> 00:31:29,981
Her vowels were longer in
duration than French vowels.
445
00:31:30,081 --> 00:31:32,025
I mean, you know, this is the...
446
00:31:32,125 --> 00:31:37,280
I did... My master's, thesis
was on vowel duration in French.
447
00:31:37,380 --> 00:31:39,040
So I had a little bit of background.
448
00:31:40,675 --> 00:31:43,411
I believe it's someone who had
polished their English accent,
449
00:31:43,511 --> 00:31:46,247
having then lost some
of their French accent.
450
00:31:46,347 --> 00:31:49,751
You don't want to see a copy
of my dissertation, so...
451
00:31:51,311 --> 00:31:54,180
- Well...
- No! You don't, really.
452
00:31:56,775 --> 00:31:58,802
I asked her her name.
453
00:31:58,902 --> 00:32:01,221
She kind of paused. I remember that.
454
00:32:01,321 --> 00:32:03,481
And she said, "Call me Smith."
455
00:32:04,616 --> 00:32:07,402
I mean, it was very clear she
didn't want to tell me her name.
456
00:32:08,453 --> 00:32:10,488
I thought, "This is weird."
457
00:32:14,209 --> 00:32:16,903
She had been a customer of ours.
458
00:32:17,003 --> 00:32:19,539
She was a pain in the neck,
to be truthful.
459
00:32:20,173 --> 00:32:23,743
We held things for her
for as long as a year.
460
00:32:23,843 --> 00:32:26,663
We would say, "What's your name?"
461
00:32:26,763 --> 00:32:28,715
"I'm not going to tell you."
462
00:32:29,933 --> 00:32:32,802
"Well, we can't keep
it without a name."
463
00:32:33,603 --> 00:32:37,098
"All right. Miss V Smith."
464
00:32:40,401 --> 00:32:42,637
You know, "Ha-ha-ha, Miss V Smith."
465
00:32:42,737 --> 00:32:46,641
It was patently obvious that
she was not Miss V Smith.
466
00:32:46,741 --> 00:32:49,018
And we'd say, "OK, phone number."
467
00:32:49,118 --> 00:32:50,937
"I don't have a phone."
468
00:32:51,037 --> 00:32:53,982
"Well, how are we going to get in
touch with you if we need to?"
469
00:32:54,082 --> 00:32:55,408
"Well, you won't."
470
00:32:59,212 --> 00:33:02,123
Why was she giving us a fake name?
471
00:33:04,634 --> 00:33:06,878
We didn't think as much about it...
472
00:33:07,887 --> 00:33:09,964
as you are.
473
00:33:14,352 --> 00:33:16,421
Now, she spelled her
name differently.
474
00:33:16,521 --> 00:33:19,640
There's B as in boy Maier.
475
00:33:20,108 --> 00:33:23,219
Every possible combination of
ways you could spell Maier.
476
00:33:23,319 --> 00:33:27,682
M-E-Y-E-R. M-A-I-E-R. M-A-Y-E-R.
477
00:33:27,782 --> 00:33:29,934
We always called her Miss Maier.
478
00:33:30,034 --> 00:33:31,978
Miss Maiers.
479
00:33:32,078 --> 00:33:34,355
She said, "Call me Viv."
480
00:33:34,455 --> 00:33:37,283
You would never have
called this woman Viv.
481
00:33:37,876 --> 00:33:40,528
- Vivian.
- Nobody called her Viv?
482
00:33:40,628 --> 00:33:42,747
No. Vivian.
483
00:33:44,132 --> 00:33:47,210
Why wouldn't you wanna
tell people your real name?
484
00:33:48,303 --> 00:33:53,208
I asked her what she did, and her answer
was another thing I'll never forget.
485
00:33:53,308 --> 00:33:55,251
"I'm sort of a spy."
486
00:33:55,351 --> 00:33:58,338
That's exactly what she said. I can
still see her and hear her saying it.
487
00:33:58,438 --> 00:33:59,764
It was so odd.
488
00:34:01,107 --> 00:34:06,805
I think the only person who says that is
somebody who's definitely not a spy.
489
00:34:06,905 --> 00:34:09,190
Why would you say that?
490
00:34:22,837 --> 00:34:25,248
Maybe she wanted to be somebody else.
491
00:34:26,090 --> 00:34:28,334
A lot of us do that.
492
00:34:32,555 --> 00:34:36,793
If she did not have this
job as a baby-sitter,
493
00:34:36,893 --> 00:34:40,930
her lifestyle would have
been very understandable.
494
00:34:42,732 --> 00:34:46,394
The real question is, why did
she do this kind of work?
495
00:34:48,529 --> 00:34:52,767
Her intelligence and
her views on things,
496
00:34:52,867 --> 00:34:57,188
there was something very precious
to her about keeping them secret.
497
00:34:57,288 --> 00:35:03,236
Vivian may have looked down,
so to speak, on the employers
498
00:35:03,336 --> 00:35:07,290
who were hiring her for this
low-paying kind of work.
499
00:35:09,384 --> 00:35:12,336
She identified with the poor.
500
00:35:19,310 --> 00:35:21,212
I mean, she said she
doesn't go to a doctor,
501
00:35:21,312 --> 00:35:23,047
she doesn't have any
medical insurance,
502
00:35:23,147 --> 00:35:25,466
and I said, "Are you...
are you worried about that?"
503
00:35:25,566 --> 00:35:29,061
And she said, "The poor
are too poor to die."
504
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,809
She told me that when she
first came to New York,
505
00:35:34,909 --> 00:35:38,646
she went to work in
a sewing sweatshop.
506
00:35:38,746 --> 00:35:41,649
She realised one day that
she wanted to do something
507
00:35:41,749 --> 00:35:45,320
where she could be outside and
in the world, out and about,
508
00:35:45,420 --> 00:35:48,247
and see the sun,
so she took up nannying.
509
00:35:50,049 --> 00:35:54,295
She felt that it gave her a
certain amount of freedom.
510
00:35:55,763 --> 00:35:58,499
Somebody else was providing
the shelter for her.
511
00:35:58,599 --> 00:36:03,379
She wasn't having to work so
hard just to make ends meet,
512
00:36:03,479 --> 00:36:07,892
so she had some free time for
her photographic endeavours.
513
00:36:16,075 --> 00:36:17,644
1959.
514
00:36:17,744 --> 00:36:23,316
Vivian told her employer,
"I'm going to travel the world."
515
00:36:23,416 --> 00:36:25,159
"I'll be back in eight months."
516
00:36:26,753 --> 00:36:30,490
She went to Bangkok,
India, Thailand...
517
00:36:30,590 --> 00:36:32,833
Yemen...
518
00:36:33,718 --> 00:36:36,120
All of South America.
519
00:36:36,220 --> 00:36:38,798
She travelled by herself.
520
00:36:40,683 --> 00:36:43,378
Just her and her camera.
521
00:36:43,478 --> 00:36:46,847
There are thousands of photos
from her world travels.
522
00:37:20,765 --> 00:37:25,211
Do you think Vivian would like the
attention that she's getting?
523
00:37:25,311 --> 00:37:27,839
I think she had a very...
I don't know... I don't think so.
524
00:37:27,939 --> 00:37:30,675
I think she was more of
a very private person.
525
00:37:30,775 --> 00:37:33,469
I don't... I think she...
she might have seen this
526
00:37:33,569 --> 00:37:35,938
as... as kind of an
intrusion, you know?
527
00:37:39,492 --> 00:37:46,232
I can't help but to feel a
little uncomfortable or guilty
528
00:37:46,332 --> 00:37:53,080
exposing the work of a person
who did not want to be exposed.
529
00:37:54,841 --> 00:37:57,126
She was so secretive.
530
00:37:57,468 --> 00:38:00,038
I think that she would like
her artwork to be honoured,
531
00:38:00,138 --> 00:38:03,291
but I don't think she personally would
have liked being in the limelight.
532
00:38:03,391 --> 00:38:05,551
I don't.
533
00:38:05,977 --> 00:38:08,504
She would never have let this happen,
534
00:38:08,604 --> 00:38:10,882
had she known about it.
535
00:38:10,982 --> 00:38:12,383
No, she never would have let it.
536
00:38:12,483 --> 00:38:14,685
She... That was her babies.
537
00:38:15,528 --> 00:38:18,356
She wouldn't have put
her babies on display.
538
00:38:20,199 --> 00:38:22,643
But I don't think she took
all those photographs
539
00:38:22,743 --> 00:38:24,395
for them to just dissolve into dust.
540
00:38:24,495 --> 00:38:27,531
I think she took those
photographs to be seen.
541
00:38:30,585 --> 00:38:36,665
I find the mystery of it more
interesting than her work itself.
542
00:38:38,092 --> 00:38:42,797
I'd love to know more
about this person.
543
00:38:44,599 --> 00:38:47,752
And I don't think you can
do that through her work.
544
00:38:47,852 --> 00:38:49,962
So she didn't tell you anything
545
00:38:50,062 --> 00:38:52,507
about where she came from,
her background?
546
00:38:52,607 --> 00:38:55,301
You didn't know anything?
Nobody pried into that?
547
00:38:55,401 --> 00:38:57,812
No. I... I... Not really.
548
00:38:58,529 --> 00:39:02,058
Did you know anything about Vivian?
549
00:39:02,158 --> 00:39:05,236
- Her family, her past?
- No.
550
00:39:06,370 --> 00:39:10,733
It's amazing, isn't it, that you're friendly
with someone for, like, ten years,
551
00:39:10,833 --> 00:39:16,280
and that you don't know anything
more about them than this much?
552
00:39:16,380 --> 00:39:18,407
We always thought she was French.
553
00:39:18,507 --> 00:39:21,244
Now, she's kind of, what... Austrian?
554
00:39:21,344 --> 00:39:26,298
I mean, she's from Als...
from Alsace-Lorraine or something?
555
00:39:27,475 --> 00:39:28,876
She's from New York.
556
00:39:28,976 --> 00:39:30,878
From New York? What do
you mean, from New York?
557
00:39:30,978 --> 00:39:33,222
- Well, she was born in New York.
- She was?
558
00:39:33,856 --> 00:39:37,218
- She was born in New York.
- No. Really?
559
00:39:37,318 --> 00:39:40,771
Oh, I thought she was born in Europe.
I thought she was French.
560
00:39:41,781 --> 00:39:44,358
How did she acquire that accent?
561
00:39:49,413 --> 00:39:52,483
So, where's Vivian from?
562
00:39:52,583 --> 00:39:56,370
She's from New York City,
born February 1st of 1926.
563
00:39:56,712 --> 00:39:59,407
Speaking from a
professional standpoint,
564
00:39:59,507 --> 00:40:02,160
compared to what
I've done in the past,
565
00:40:02,260 --> 00:40:06,789
this is ranked up real high
on the list of difficulty.
566
00:40:06,889 --> 00:40:09,876
The families usually
have some consistency
567
00:40:09,976 --> 00:40:12,044
as to where they're located,
568
00:40:12,144 --> 00:40:15,715
I at least have them in public record,
where I can find information about them.
569
00:40:15,815 --> 00:40:19,719
Not like this one.
The whole family is a mystery family.
570
00:40:19,819 --> 00:40:22,346
There's a few things that
we know about Vivian Maier.
571
00:40:22,446 --> 00:40:25,600
One, we know that she was
never married. She was a spinster.
572
00:40:25,700 --> 00:40:29,069
She had no husband,
she had no children.
573
00:40:29,870 --> 00:40:31,689
Her parents are both dead.
574
00:40:31,789 --> 00:40:34,066
Vivian did have a brother,
an older brother.
575
00:40:34,166 --> 00:40:36,402
Clearly, he's probably dead.
576
00:40:36,502 --> 00:40:38,654
All of them seemed to be private.
577
00:40:38,754 --> 00:40:42,033
All of them seemed to want nothing
to do with the rest of their families.
578
00:40:42,133 --> 00:40:46,537
All of them seemed to be disconnected
from the remainder of their family.
579
00:40:46,637 --> 00:40:51,083
She had one aunt, who was to leave
everything to a friend in her will.
580
00:40:51,183 --> 00:40:54,545
Not to family, but to a friend.
And this is the reason why.
581
00:40:54,645 --> 00:40:57,840
She says here, and I'm quoting
directly from her will,
582
00:40:57,940 --> 00:41:01,928
"I make no provision for
any of my relatives,
583
00:41:02,028 --> 00:41:05,264
"for reasons best known to me,
584
00:41:05,364 --> 00:41:09,985
"which I have disclosed to a
few of my intimate friends."
585
00:41:10,870 --> 00:41:13,689
At the time of Alma's death in 1965,
586
00:41:13,789 --> 00:41:17,068
Vivian was obviously alive,
her only niece.
587
00:41:17,168 --> 00:41:21,447
Whatever her hangup was,
it went to her grave with her.
588
00:41:21,547 --> 00:41:25,326
Vivian's father was out of
the picture very early on.
589
00:41:25,426 --> 00:41:29,338
So the census records show that
Vivian's living with her mother.
590
00:41:30,973 --> 00:41:33,626
But I did know that she lived
in France for a while,
591
00:41:33,726 --> 00:41:35,836
and that her mother was from France.
592
00:41:35,936 --> 00:41:38,422
So my guess was that there
was family in France.
593
00:41:38,522 --> 00:41:44,428
Because the thing is, the 1949
photos and the 1959 photos
594
00:41:44,528 --> 00:41:46,639
are the same village.
595
00:41:46,739 --> 00:41:49,108
So I know she was returning
to the same place.
596
00:41:49,867 --> 00:41:52,561
So I started looking up all the
stuff that she had from France,
597
00:41:52,661 --> 00:41:55,106
I started looking at the
photographs of France,
598
00:41:55,206 --> 00:41:57,900
looking at the little towns
and the church steeples,
599
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:01,320
and how this church steeple looks and
how that one looks in this little village.
600
00:42:01,420 --> 00:42:04,490
And I would go on the internet and
look up little villages in France,
601
00:42:04,590 --> 00:42:05,908
and try to match the steeples.
602
00:42:06,008 --> 00:42:08,577
It's like matching a fingerprint.
603
00:42:08,677 --> 00:42:11,539
I knew I had at least one of
the villages that she was in.
604
00:42:11,639 --> 00:42:13,882
Found.
605
00:42:16,060 --> 00:42:18,421
Saint-Julien and Saint-Bonnet,
606
00:42:18,521 --> 00:42:23,718
in this remote little sheep-herder
village in the French Alps.
607
00:42:23,818 --> 00:42:25,978
Population 250.
608
00:42:27,113 --> 00:42:30,433
She might have been offended
that you found her little town.
609
00:42:30,533 --> 00:42:32,651
That was none of your business.
610
00:42:33,452 --> 00:42:35,863
She might say, "God, oh, God.
611
00:42:36,747 --> 00:42:38,991
"Why did he do that?"
612
00:42:40,876 --> 00:42:44,822
For some reason,
my curiosity is overwhelming
613
00:42:44,922 --> 00:42:47,249
to find out more about Vivian.
614
00:42:48,509 --> 00:42:50,411
I'm uncovering an artist.
615
00:42:50,511 --> 00:42:54,623
If I'm leaving this
giant boulder unturned,
616
00:42:54,723 --> 00:42:57,635
because I don't go here,
it would be a mistake.
617
00:44:08,506 --> 00:44:10,533
- Vivian took this.
- Are you sure?
618
00:44:10,633 --> 00:44:13,877
Yes. 100 per cent.
I have this same print.
619
00:44:15,429 --> 00:44:17,840
Vivian took this picture.
This is her print.
620
00:44:19,725 --> 00:44:21,969
Oui.
621
00:44:22,645 --> 00:44:24,179
He says, "Aren't you happy?"
622
00:44:25,022 --> 00:44:27,383
Her box camera.
623
00:44:29,276 --> 00:44:31,478
I have... I have a similar one.
624
00:44:32,279 --> 00:44:34,857
- No, that's her mum's camera.
- Vivian's mom?
625
00:44:47,336 --> 00:44:48,495
Oh...
626
00:44:50,130 --> 00:44:51,623
- That's Vivian?
- Yes.
627
00:44:52,466 --> 00:44:54,418
Wow.
628
00:44:57,346 --> 00:45:01,375
Another thing I found in
Vivian's stuff was this letter.
629
00:45:01,475 --> 00:45:06,847
It was written in French, and it's talking
about a photography lab in France.
630
00:45:17,324 --> 00:45:19,685
- And you can do... like this.
- Oui.
631
00:45:19,785 --> 00:45:23,030
The letter starts out,
"Dear Mr Simon..."
632
00:46:12,504 --> 00:46:14,248
D'accord.
633
00:47:00,427 --> 00:47:03,622
Previously, we thought
Vivian had no intentions
634
00:47:03,722 --> 00:47:07,084
of having anybody else print
her work or show her work.
635
00:47:07,184 --> 00:47:10,629
This letter proves that
assumption wrong.
636
00:47:10,729 --> 00:47:12,965
Vivian knew she was a
good photographer,
637
00:47:13,065 --> 00:47:15,551
and she knew that these
photographs were good.
638
00:47:15,651 --> 00:47:17,720
She wanted to show them to people.
639
00:47:17,820 --> 00:47:20,598
She may not have had that
happen while she was alive,
640
00:47:20,698 --> 00:47:23,025
but we're doing it now.
641
00:47:23,909 --> 00:47:27,487
I stopped scanning myself,
because I just couldn't keep up with it.
642
00:47:32,835 --> 00:47:36,196
There's a lab in New York with
technicians scanning her work,
643
00:47:36,296 --> 00:47:38,866
Monday through Friday, nine to five,
644
00:47:38,966 --> 00:47:41,793
at a rate of about a
few thousand a week.
645
00:47:42,678 --> 00:47:44,788
I've been developing the
black and white films,
646
00:47:44,888 --> 00:47:47,424
so I have about a couple of
hundred left to develop.
647
00:47:50,978 --> 00:47:53,422
It's a very complicated
and tricky procedure,
648
00:47:53,522 --> 00:47:55,633
because you have to get
the formula correct,
649
00:47:55,733 --> 00:47:59,061
and there's only one
chance to get it right.
650
00:48:00,362 --> 00:48:02,022
It's... it's magical.
651
00:48:11,999 --> 00:48:14,576
We don't know what she
would have printed,
652
00:48:15,836 --> 00:48:18,246
what she would have chosen or edited.
653
00:48:20,591 --> 00:48:25,253
We're seeing work now for the first
time that Vivian never saw herself.
654
00:48:27,097 --> 00:48:31,835
When you contacted me, I wasn't
sure if I wanted to get involved
655
00:48:31,935 --> 00:48:34,638
in a project with posthumous prints.
656
00:48:35,439 --> 00:48:38,342
I just didn't think it would be
the right fit for the gallery.
657
00:48:38,442 --> 00:48:41,053
This is the room where we
store our photographs.
658
00:48:41,153 --> 00:48:44,181
I think there are about between 25
and 30,000 photographs in here.
659
00:48:44,281 --> 00:48:46,684
I mean, it's more than most museums have.
660
00:48:46,784 --> 00:48:50,771
Vivian Maier, we've had
more interest in this work
661
00:48:50,871 --> 00:48:55,409
than perhaps any other photographer
I've ever worked with.
662
00:49:02,174 --> 00:49:05,585
It's a big problem trying to get
her work into institutions.
663
00:49:06,678 --> 00:49:09,373
The problem is that the
art world establishment
664
00:49:09,473 --> 00:49:11,583
still won't recognise Vivian's work.
665
00:49:11,683 --> 00:49:16,588
Museums usually deal with
the final product, the print,
666
00:49:16,688 --> 00:49:19,558
that was made by the artist
in the artist's life.
667
00:49:20,859 --> 00:49:25,981
They don't want to interpret an
artist's work from where they left off.
668
00:49:26,824 --> 00:49:29,727
That's bogus, because Gary Winogrand
669
00:49:29,827 --> 00:49:33,272
had a desk full of rolls of film
that he never developed.
670
00:49:33,372 --> 00:49:35,107
So they're developing 'em.
671
00:49:35,207 --> 00:49:38,444
Eugene Atget's work was
printed after his death,
672
00:49:38,544 --> 00:49:40,863
and then ended up being
acquired by MoMA.
673
00:49:40,963 --> 00:49:44,750
I mean, it's frustrating,
because it's being done and...
674
00:49:45,467 --> 00:49:47,411
but nobody wants to do
it for Vivian's work.
675
00:49:47,511 --> 00:49:49,872
She did print some of her work,
676
00:49:49,972 --> 00:49:54,543
but it... it was largely not
the best edit of her work.
677
00:49:54,643 --> 00:49:57,588
She was a masterful photographer,
678
00:49:57,688 --> 00:50:00,891
but printing was not her thing.
679
00:50:02,359 --> 00:50:06,013
That's common, though. I mean,
Cartier-Bresson hated printing,
680
00:50:06,113 --> 00:50:08,182
and Robert Frank
wasn't a good printer.
681
00:50:08,282 --> 00:50:09,983
But they hire printers.
682
00:50:10,993 --> 00:50:13,153
They hire somebody to print for them.
683
00:50:13,620 --> 00:50:18,108
Good work is good work, and it's
recognised that this is really great art.
684
00:50:18,208 --> 00:50:21,495
I do think her work needs to be
appreciated by... by the world.
685
00:50:24,673 --> 00:50:26,458
These are the new prints.
686
00:50:26,967 --> 00:50:29,661
Cool. Yeah, these are great.
Thank you for showing me.
687
00:50:29,761 --> 00:50:31,830
They're yours.
688
00:50:31,930 --> 00:50:35,959
The only way this work can move forward
is if there's money that is made.
689
00:50:36,059 --> 00:50:38,678
The sale of prints will
be a part of that.
690
00:50:43,775 --> 00:50:49,223
Of course, I wish that I could
give her money, you know...
691
00:50:49,323 --> 00:50:52,734
She's gone. I mean,
there's nothing I can do.
692
00:50:54,536 --> 00:50:56,772
She always had a money problem.
693
00:50:56,872 --> 00:50:59,233
God knows, she probably
could have used the money.
694
00:50:59,333 --> 00:51:01,618
Too bad she wasn't discovered
ten years earlier.
695
00:51:11,803 --> 00:51:13,105
Marble!
696
00:51:14,848 --> 00:51:17,092
Yeah, you two.
697
00:51:18,518 --> 00:51:22,130
Here's the picture.
Miss Maier's right in the corner.
698
00:51:22,230 --> 00:51:24,475
I won't call her Vivian because...
699
00:51:24,775 --> 00:51:27,302
She'd have your guts for garters
if you called her that.
700
00:51:27,402 --> 00:51:31,690
Not Mrs. Not Vivian.
She was Miss Maiers.
701
00:51:32,449 --> 00:51:35,519
She was my governess from
when I was five years old,
702
00:51:35,619 --> 00:51:37,938
up until I was about 11 years old.
703
00:51:38,038 --> 00:51:40,315
I've got in my baby
book the exact date.
704
00:51:40,415 --> 00:51:45,537
It's like March of '67
until about 1974.
705
00:51:46,630 --> 00:51:52,202
Inger and I were best friends, and so I
would spend a lot of time with Miss Maier.
706
00:51:52,302 --> 00:51:56,373
She would take us down to the city,
and we would just walk.
707
00:51:56,473 --> 00:52:00,210
In the worst parts of town,
she'd walk very quickly,
708
00:52:00,310 --> 00:52:03,213
and so my little legs had
to fly to keep up with her.
709
00:52:03,313 --> 00:52:05,640
She would swing her
arm just like this.
710
00:52:06,566 --> 00:52:09,261
And then her stride was just massive.
711
00:52:09,361 --> 00:52:12,097
Inger used to just beg
her to slow down,
712
00:52:12,197 --> 00:52:14,774
and she would just
drag her alongside.
713
00:52:15,742 --> 00:52:17,227
Poor thing.
714
00:52:17,327 --> 00:52:19,771
She'd take pictures of everything.
715
00:52:19,871 --> 00:52:21,948
She would see a subject.
716
00:52:22,791 --> 00:52:24,860
Something that would interest her.
717
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:27,529
She'd open her camera,
718
00:52:27,629 --> 00:52:29,364
she'd focus it...
719
00:52:29,464 --> 00:52:31,450
These poor, you know, people,
720
00:52:31,550 --> 00:52:34,453
she would literally ask them
to... to, like, pose for her.
721
00:52:34,553 --> 00:52:36,413
She didn't tend to pose people.
722
00:52:36,513 --> 00:52:37,831
She's like, "Stand there, wait."
723
00:52:37,931 --> 00:52:39,583
It was just the way it was.
724
00:52:39,683 --> 00:52:41,752
"Impoverished people. Take picture!"
725
00:52:41,852 --> 00:52:45,180
Or somebody crying, it was just, bam!
726
00:52:46,523 --> 00:52:47,925
They... You know?
727
00:52:48,025 --> 00:52:50,218
Like, "Oh, my God,
what is this woman doing?"
728
00:52:50,318 --> 00:52:53,180
We'd joke about hitting her
over the head with a camera,
729
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:55,015
because she embarrassed us so much.
730
00:52:55,115 --> 00:52:57,726
It was imposing and rude.
731
00:52:57,826 --> 00:53:01,605
They felt, I'm sure, that they
were being mocked in some way.
732
00:53:01,705 --> 00:53:03,323
I'm surprised she didn't get shot.
733
00:53:04,416 --> 00:53:08,954
My mom put her foot down and wouldn't let
Miss Maier take me into the slum areas.
734
00:53:11,256 --> 00:53:14,534
She loved to read the paper, she liked
it that we took the New York Times,
735
00:53:14,634 --> 00:53:16,119
and she read it every day,
736
00:53:16,219 --> 00:53:21,875
and she always had an eye for the
bizarre, the grotesque, the incongruous.
737
00:53:21,975 --> 00:53:24,803
She wasn't interested
in sweetness and light.
738
00:53:29,733 --> 00:53:35,981
She liked headlines that revealed
the folly of individuals.
739
00:53:37,449 --> 00:53:41,019
Stories that would enable her
to basically say, "I told you so."
740
00:53:41,119 --> 00:53:43,438
"I told you so."
741
00:53:43,538 --> 00:53:47,067
Some man murders his wife and
then gets caught in cold blood,
742
00:53:47,167 --> 00:53:48,443
"I told you so."
743
00:53:48,543 --> 00:53:52,539
I mean, these things that
revealed the folly of humanity.
744
00:54:11,817 --> 00:54:17,230
If you look at her art,
she sees the bizarreness of life,
745
00:54:18,031 --> 00:54:22,610
the incongruity of life, and the
unappealingness of human beings.
746
00:54:26,414 --> 00:54:29,359
There were little things,
all the time,
747
00:54:29,459 --> 00:54:32,571
that she was just plain...
748
00:54:32,671 --> 00:54:36,958
in microscopic ways,
just chipping at me.
749
00:54:37,968 --> 00:54:39,627
All the time.
750
00:54:40,428 --> 00:54:43,373
I would go down,
with my allowance money,
751
00:54:43,473 --> 00:54:45,542
to the crafts store,
752
00:54:45,642 --> 00:54:50,873
and buy myself a thousand little tiny,
you know, like rainbows and...
753
00:54:51,273 --> 00:54:53,516
Glass tchotchkes.
754
00:54:54,151 --> 00:54:57,979
Viv would look at my trove
of tchotchkes and hate it.
755
00:54:59,156 --> 00:55:02,225
She would get a big mop bucket
756
00:55:02,325 --> 00:55:06,104
and she would fill it with hot,
soapy water, yes, and ammonia.
757
00:55:06,204 --> 00:55:09,357
And she would have the
ammonia be such a strength
758
00:55:09,457 --> 00:55:11,359
that you couldn't be near the bucket.
759
00:55:11,459 --> 00:55:13,904
Clearly, to need that much ammonia,
760
00:55:14,004 --> 00:55:17,499
you would surely be cleaning
something very, very dirty.
761
00:55:21,136 --> 00:55:23,380
She would take her arm,
762
00:55:24,472 --> 00:55:27,250
and just swipe all the
tchotchkes into the bucket.
763
00:55:27,350 --> 00:55:31,004
They're crashing and grinding
together, and smashing,
764
00:55:31,104 --> 00:55:33,131
and they're all covered in ammonia...
765
00:55:37,152 --> 00:55:41,848
Me, I sort of just quietly tolerated
whatever was happening to me in my life.
766
00:55:41,948 --> 00:55:43,517
My brother acted out,
767
00:55:43,617 --> 00:55:48,313
and I don't think that she had good
ways of coping with his behaviour.
768
00:55:48,413 --> 00:55:51,316
She, sort of ditched us.
769
00:55:51,416 --> 00:55:54,486
We were all taking a walk together,
and she ducked down an alley
770
00:55:54,586 --> 00:55:56,738
and just disappeared.
771
00:55:56,838 --> 00:55:59,040
The police finally found us.
772
00:56:00,675 --> 00:56:03,328
I think she wanted to scare us.
773
00:56:03,428 --> 00:56:07,582
I remember getting lectured by the police.
"You can't leave your baby-sitter."
774
00:56:07,682 --> 00:56:09,709
And me saying, "No, no!
775
00:56:09,809 --> 00:56:11,845
"My baby-sitter left me!"
776
00:56:14,356 --> 00:56:16,883
There were some accidents...
777
00:56:16,983 --> 00:56:21,221
which I knew weren't accidents,
everybody knew weren't really accidents.
778
00:56:21,321 --> 00:56:23,014
All of a sudden,
there's a kid screaming
779
00:56:23,114 --> 00:56:25,475
in the basement with the door
shut and the lights off.
780
00:56:25,575 --> 00:56:27,602
Yeah. That kind of thing.
781
00:56:27,702 --> 00:56:30,063
She was mean. I don't
know how else to say it.
782
00:56:30,163 --> 00:56:32,524
I don't know, she had,
like, a dark side.
783
00:56:32,624 --> 00:56:34,909
I remember one time she said...
784
00:56:36,169 --> 00:56:39,489
"These men, they'll have
you sit on... on their laps.
785
00:56:39,589 --> 00:56:42,500
"And then you'll feel
something poking you."
786
00:56:44,219 --> 00:56:46,496
And I can't remember the
context of when she said that,
787
00:56:46,596 --> 00:56:50,167
but it just was, she had this,
like, anger in her towards men.
788
00:56:50,267 --> 00:56:52,460
And now, I know exactly
what she was talking about,
789
00:56:52,560 --> 00:56:57,098
but as a kid, I really... I knew what she was
saying was dark, and a little not right.
790
00:57:07,367 --> 00:57:11,396
I've seen her more than once jump
back in fear, you know, from a man.
791
00:57:11,496 --> 00:57:14,149
She said several times
over the several years,
792
00:57:14,249 --> 00:57:16,693
men, all they were out
to do is ruin you,
793
00:57:16,793 --> 00:57:19,321
stay away from them,
be careful of them,
794
00:57:19,421 --> 00:57:22,624
you know, that all they want is sex.
795
00:57:23,258 --> 00:57:26,836
She was always afraid
of being touched.
796
00:57:28,346 --> 00:57:30,290
I remember she was
standing up at this dump,
797
00:57:30,390 --> 00:57:33,043
taking a picture of
some sort of incident.
798
00:57:33,143 --> 00:57:35,545
The man apparently
thought she was falling.
799
00:57:35,645 --> 00:57:39,174
He reached up, and all she saw
was a man reaching for her,
800
00:57:39,274 --> 00:57:41,176
and she decked him.
801
00:57:41,276 --> 00:57:43,595
She thought he was attacking her,
802
00:57:43,695 --> 00:57:45,764
and gave him a concussion,
803
00:57:45,864 --> 00:57:48,066
and sent him to the hospital.
804
00:57:49,200 --> 00:57:52,737
I would bet money that she was...
805
00:57:53,538 --> 00:57:56,691
brutalised in some way,
attacked in some...
806
00:57:56,791 --> 00:57:59,945
I mean, or, you know...
molested, whatever.
807
00:58:00,045 --> 00:58:03,698
I hate to say that, but something
happened to her that was awful.
808
00:58:03,798 --> 00:58:06,918
Because nobody would act,
like, the way she did.
809
00:58:07,510 --> 00:58:10,705
I remember some of the more strong
emotional things, I'm afraid.
810
00:58:10,805 --> 00:58:16,010
It takes... It's harder to
remember some of the other...
811
00:58:19,606 --> 00:58:22,467
I don't know if you want to go
into this, but I will. I will.
812
00:58:26,363 --> 00:58:29,983
I mean, there were things that
happened to me that were not good.
813
00:58:31,242 --> 00:58:33,728
Miss Maier was force-feeding me.
814
00:58:35,372 --> 00:58:38,817
Forcing me to eat,
because I wasn't finishing my plate.
815
00:58:38,917 --> 00:58:42,862
My parents found out,
and my dad got angry, but...
816
00:58:42,962 --> 00:58:46,207
My dad found out
exactly how it was...
817
00:58:47,759 --> 00:58:51,371
She would hold me down,
she would shove the food in my throat,
818
00:58:51,471 --> 00:58:54,591
and then she would choke
me until I would swallow it.
819
00:58:55,392 --> 00:58:58,094
And she would do that
over and over again.
820
00:59:02,273 --> 00:59:04,926
There was very much
of a dark side to her
821
00:59:05,026 --> 00:59:07,437
that I have not gone into.
822
00:59:09,948 --> 00:59:12,350
She would lose it sometimes.
823
00:59:12,450 --> 00:59:16,021
The first time she hit me was
when I was five years old,
824
00:59:16,121 --> 00:59:20,450
because I was trying to
learn to tie my shoelaces.
825
00:59:21,251 --> 00:59:22,861
And I wasn't doing it right.
826
00:59:22,961 --> 00:59:24,946
And she got very frustrated with me,
827
00:59:25,046 --> 00:59:28,616
and so she started slamming my
head into the side of this bookcase.
828
00:59:28,716 --> 00:59:32,912
I mean, she wouldn't hit me in the face,
obviously, I didn't have bruises there,
829
00:59:33,012 --> 00:59:35,498
but she'd grab me by the wrists
and swing me around the room
830
00:59:35,598 --> 00:59:38,835
and slam me into things when she
got really upset about something.
831
00:59:38,935 --> 00:59:43,089
And I was eight years old
before I could break her grip.
832
00:59:43,589 --> 00:59:45,425
After that, she didn't do that again.
833
00:59:45,525 --> 00:59:47,435
I was strong enough.
834
00:59:49,404 --> 00:59:52,357
I mean... she was a brilliant person,
835
00:59:53,116 --> 00:59:55,818
and I think she really cared,
and I think she tried.
836
00:59:56,661 --> 00:59:59,856
And I don't know if any of the others
will ever talk about that, if they...
837
00:59:59,956 --> 01:00:01,358
if it ever happened to them.
838
01:00:01,458 --> 01:00:04,452
I don't know, maybe she got
it together. I'm hoping she did.
839
01:00:10,091 --> 01:00:12,118
I really hate saying
these things about her,
840
01:00:12,218 --> 01:00:15,455
because I've always felt guilty
about not keeping Viv for longer.
841
01:00:15,555 --> 01:00:19,876
My husband and I were talking
then about having a foster child.
842
01:00:19,976 --> 01:00:24,089
Viv said "If you want to take care of
somebody, why don't you take care of me?"
843
01:00:24,189 --> 01:00:26,974
And then she kind of laughed,
but she meant it.
844
01:00:27,442 --> 01:00:34,015
I think she really wanted to be brought
in to be a member of our family.
845
01:00:34,115 --> 01:00:40,571
But that... wasn't really
what I had bargained for.
846
01:00:46,085 --> 01:00:48,496
So there it is.
847
01:00:53,468 --> 01:00:55,453
Then this little house...
848
01:00:55,553 --> 01:00:58,248
Miss Maiers lived upstairs.
849
01:00:58,348 --> 01:01:01,876
My father did provide a room
for her above his office.
850
01:01:01,976 --> 01:01:04,963
I only... only had a
chance to see it once.
851
01:01:05,063 --> 01:01:07,882
Back when I...
I snuck up behind her.
852
01:01:07,982 --> 01:01:09,634
Cos she kept a padlock on it.
853
01:01:12,487 --> 01:01:14,689
So, yeah, this is totally different.
854
01:01:17,492 --> 01:01:19,436
This was the forbidden zone.
855
01:01:19,536 --> 01:01:21,980
No one was allowed to see
where Miss Maiers lived.
856
01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:24,115
Huh.
857
01:01:24,874 --> 01:01:28,820
Miss Maier went in there and she left
the door open enough for me to see,
858
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:32,365
and the room was literally filled,
floor to ceiling, with newspapers.
859
01:01:32,465 --> 01:01:34,868
See how the floor is sloped?
860
01:01:34,968 --> 01:01:38,621
I told my dad, and he said,
"That's why the floor is sagging so much."
861
01:01:38,721 --> 01:01:42,292
He ended up having to put
a steel post in his office,
862
01:01:42,392 --> 01:01:44,919
because the floor was sagging
and he didn't know why!
863
01:01:45,019 --> 01:01:46,721
It was just totally full.
864
01:01:52,652 --> 01:01:55,521
This floor was Viv's domain.
865
01:01:56,406 --> 01:02:01,227
It occurred to me that maybe I would need
to go up there when she wasn't home,
866
01:02:01,327 --> 01:02:03,488
so she grudgingly gave me a key.
867
01:02:04,080 --> 01:02:06,616
And... And so I went in.
868
01:02:08,251 --> 01:02:10,570
You could tell where
she had been walking,
869
01:02:10,670 --> 01:02:15,783
and it was just this narrow path that
you could just barely traverse like this.
870
01:02:15,883 --> 01:02:18,244
And where would the bed
have been right here...
871
01:02:18,344 --> 01:02:21,422
stacks of newspapers,
almost to the ceiling.
872
01:02:25,018 --> 01:02:28,638
You may think I'm exaggerating.
No. I am not.
873
01:02:46,914 --> 01:02:51,861
Just stacked. Stacked, stacked,
stacked, stacked, stacked, everywhere.
874
01:02:51,961 --> 01:02:55,490
High, you know, high stacks of paper.
875
01:02:55,590 --> 01:02:58,243
How she even could
get to the paper...
876
01:02:58,343 --> 01:03:01,838
I don't even know how much
she even looked at the paper.
877
01:03:09,604 --> 01:03:13,341
I began to see that she was stacking
newspaper elsewhere in the house.
878
01:03:13,441 --> 01:03:17,554
In the basement, and in the back,
we have a little back entryway,
879
01:03:17,654 --> 01:03:20,098
and she would stack
newspaper out there.
880
01:03:20,198 --> 01:03:24,644
Now, the idea was always that there
were articles she wanted to save,
881
01:03:24,744 --> 01:03:29,323
for the day when she did get around to
cutting out the parts she wanted to keep.
882
01:03:30,124 --> 01:03:36,406
I... It concerned me,
but I thought, "Whatever.
883
01:03:36,506 --> 01:03:38,700
"Whatever."
884
01:03:42,929 --> 01:03:47,292
I gave her a ride to her
place of employment.
885
01:03:47,392 --> 01:03:51,254
I looked at her desk,
and piles of stuff there.
886
01:03:51,354 --> 01:03:57,885
She was certain that her employers
were coming into the room she had,
887
01:03:57,985 --> 01:04:01,347
and going through her items.
888
01:04:01,447 --> 01:04:05,977
She would rig the books
and so forth on her desk,
889
01:04:06,077 --> 01:04:10,273
so that if they were
moved half an inch,
890
01:04:10,373 --> 01:04:12,775
she would know that
when she got back,
891
01:04:12,875 --> 01:04:15,236
or so, that was Vivian's story.
892
01:04:15,336 --> 01:04:20,825
And she was also certain that people
were looking through binoculars
893
01:04:20,925 --> 01:04:24,629
and could see through
the window of her room.
894
01:04:26,806 --> 01:04:29,250
She was progressively getting
more and more reclusive,
895
01:04:29,350 --> 01:04:30,460
more and more of a hoarder.
896
01:04:30,560 --> 01:04:32,378
Everybody was saying, resoundingly,
897
01:04:32,478 --> 01:04:34,881
"Oh, my God, you've got
to get rid of your nanny."
898
01:04:34,981 --> 01:04:38,134
I don't think that Mom
and Dad really realised
899
01:04:38,234 --> 01:04:43,014
the extent to which she was
living with mental illness,
900
01:04:43,114 --> 01:04:44,682
cos she was.
901
01:04:44,782 --> 01:04:47,234
She was. She was. She...
902
01:04:47,994 --> 01:04:50,237
She...
903
01:04:53,249 --> 01:04:55,910
Yeah. It was...
it was a little past eccentric.
904
01:04:56,794 --> 01:04:59,947
My neighbour said, "I'm painting the
bathroom, do you have newspaper?"
905
01:05:00,047 --> 01:05:02,950
I said, "Sure!" There was a huge
stack right by the back door.
906
01:05:03,050 --> 01:05:05,870
I gave him a big chunk like this,
I said, "Sure, go ahead."
907
01:05:05,970 --> 01:05:10,541
Well, when Viv came home, she saw
that that stack of newspaper
908
01:05:10,641 --> 01:05:13,211
was shorter by three feet,
or two feet or whatever,
909
01:05:13,311 --> 01:05:16,422
and she was angry and horrified.
910
01:05:16,522 --> 01:05:19,725
"Who took my papers?
Who took my papers?"
911
01:05:21,152 --> 01:05:24,263
And she just went berserk.
I mean, she went crazy.
912
01:05:24,363 --> 01:05:28,059
She was... I remember an outside
scene with screaming and yelling,
913
01:05:28,159 --> 01:05:31,062
where she's yelling at this guy,
telling him to bring them back,
914
01:05:31,162 --> 01:05:33,606
but some already had paint
on them, or were ripped.
915
01:05:33,706 --> 01:05:37,151
"Now they're all covered with paint!
Now I can't use those papers!
916
01:05:37,251 --> 01:05:41,080
"They're covered with paint now.
How could you give him my papers?"
917
01:05:41,839 --> 01:05:46,077
So I said... I just said, "Viv, those aren't
your papers. Those are my papers.
918
01:05:46,177 --> 01:05:48,746
"And there are too many
papers in this house!"
919
01:05:48,846 --> 01:05:53,459
I remember my parents telling me,
"Viv's not gonna be with us any more.
920
01:05:53,559 --> 01:05:56,178
"She's gotten too crazy."
921
01:05:57,021 --> 01:05:59,215
Like, not that she
wasn't already crazy,
922
01:05:59,315 --> 01:06:03,261
but that the craziness has increased to
a level that we can't tolerate any more.
923
01:06:03,361 --> 01:06:06,397
I remember so clearly having
to say to her, "Viv...
924
01:06:08,241 --> 01:06:10,727
"I think you're going to have
to look for another job."
925
01:06:10,827 --> 01:06:12,812
How hard it was to say that to her.
926
01:06:12,912 --> 01:06:16,774
But you know what? I don't
think she was even surprised.
927
01:06:16,874 --> 01:06:20,278
She looked back at me, and
she said, "Do you?" she said.
928
01:06:20,378 --> 01:06:22,621
"Do you?" she said. "Well...
929
01:06:23,464 --> 01:06:27,452
"then, what I want is
two months' notice,
930
01:06:27,552 --> 01:06:30,663
"and two months' pay,"
or something like that.
931
01:06:30,763 --> 01:06:33,124
She gave me her sort of...
what she wanted,
932
01:06:33,224 --> 01:06:36,627
as if she had it on the tip of her
tongue and she'd figured it out.
933
01:06:36,727 --> 01:06:38,880
And I didn't know whether
that was because
934
01:06:38,980 --> 01:06:41,215
she had been dismissed from
positions often enough
935
01:06:41,315 --> 01:06:44,427
that she knew what to say,
936
01:06:44,527 --> 01:06:47,897
or whether she had,
in a way, anticipated it.
937
01:06:49,240 --> 01:06:52,185
My husband and I and our
children, after she was gone,
938
01:06:52,285 --> 01:06:55,521
do you know, we just jumped in the
car and drove up to Michigan,
939
01:06:55,621 --> 01:06:57,356
which is something
we never used to do,
940
01:06:57,456 --> 01:07:01,368
just because it was a huge emotional
thing, not to have her...
941
01:07:02,086 --> 01:07:05,698
See, I'm still weeping about it,
because I really cared about Viv.
942
01:07:05,798 --> 01:07:09,410
And I think she cared about us,
and it was just one of those things,
943
01:07:09,510 --> 01:07:14,924
where she was a person
who didn't fit in very well.
944
01:07:16,058 --> 01:07:19,253
She just had those
edges that couldn't...
945
01:07:19,353 --> 01:07:22,215
And I think we...
Well, I flatter myself,
946
01:07:22,315 --> 01:07:25,676
I think we were one of
the most sympathetic,
947
01:07:25,776 --> 01:07:29,055
accepting and congenial
families that she worked with.
948
01:07:29,155 --> 01:07:31,724
I don't know that.
I think it may be true.
949
01:07:31,824 --> 01:07:34,902
And we couldn't make it work.
950
01:07:40,291 --> 01:07:46,030
In 1996, we were getting my
mother's house ready for sale,
951
01:07:46,130 --> 01:07:51,244
and when I told Vivian, I said, "You can
stay here for a couple of months.
952
01:07:51,344 --> 01:07:54,622
"I won't put it on the market yet,
you know, we have to get things ready,
953
01:07:54,722 --> 01:07:58,676
"and, you know, I'm not...
I'm not kicking you out, you can stay."
954
01:07:59,518 --> 01:08:02,922
Vivian was to be there,
you know, and to show it,
955
01:08:03,022 --> 01:08:05,633
but she was not at all helpful
with the real estate people.
956
01:08:05,733 --> 01:08:07,760
She just didn't want to let them in.
957
01:08:07,860 --> 01:08:11,964
They were calling me, saying she
won't let them show the house...
958
01:08:12,364 --> 01:08:15,852
You know, "We've gotta...
You've gotta do something, Judy."
959
01:08:15,952 --> 01:08:19,572
So I would call her and say, "Vivian,
you have to let people see the house."
960
01:08:21,290 --> 01:08:24,777
They did manage to get in,
and they did manage to sell.
961
01:08:24,877 --> 01:08:28,205
I think we closed the
last day of the year.
962
01:08:32,051 --> 01:08:35,955
The lawyer called and said, "Judy,
we're just afraid she's not gonna be out."
963
01:08:36,055 --> 01:08:38,757
And I said, "She'll be out.
Don't worry. She will be out."
964
01:09:04,000 --> 01:09:05,735
The last time I saw her,
965
01:09:05,835 --> 01:09:08,370
I'm still unhappy about.
966
01:09:10,047 --> 01:09:13,375
It must have been, like...
probably 2000.
967
01:09:14,218 --> 01:09:17,622
I was in Wilmette, going to the beach
with my daughter and her children
968
01:09:17,722 --> 01:09:19,790
and four other children
of her friends.
969
01:09:19,890 --> 01:09:23,669
It was a hot summer day, like,
August, like, 100-degree day.
970
01:09:23,769 --> 01:09:26,756
And all of a sudden, we see this
woman walking down the street.
971
01:09:26,856 --> 01:09:29,300
And immediately, we were like,
"There's Vivian."
972
01:09:29,400 --> 01:09:31,602
I hadn't seen her in 30 years.
973
01:09:32,611 --> 01:09:35,272
But we recognised each other at once.
974
01:09:37,324 --> 01:09:39,769
And we both... "Oh, hi,
how are you, Vivian?"
975
01:09:39,869 --> 01:09:43,022
and, "How are you, Carole?"
and "It's been so long."
976
01:09:43,122 --> 01:09:45,608
We were like, "We'll, it was great,
you know, to see you,"
977
01:09:45,708 --> 01:09:48,110
and, er, we said, "We have...
we have to get going."
978
01:09:48,210 --> 01:09:49,987
And she was like,
"Please don't leave."
979
01:09:50,087 --> 01:09:52,323
She was like, "Carole!"
That's my mother's name.
980
01:09:52,423 --> 01:09:54,625
"Carole, please don't leave."
981
01:09:55,134 --> 01:09:57,078
And you're with a bunch of kids,
982
01:09:57,178 --> 01:09:59,914
and they're swirling around you,
and they want to go to the beach.
983
01:10:00,014 --> 01:10:02,667
It's a hot summer day, you know.
You're, like, stuck.
984
01:10:02,767 --> 01:10:06,045
And she kept saying "Talk to
me, let's talk, let's talk."
985
01:10:06,145 --> 01:10:09,674
And I kept saying, "I can't do it, Vivian.
I have to go, I have to go."
986
01:10:09,774 --> 01:10:13,102
She kept saying, "But you're
my friend, you're my friend."
987
01:10:14,737 --> 01:10:16,555
And...
988
01:10:16,655 --> 01:10:18,683
I dropped the ball.
989
01:10:18,783 --> 01:10:21,769
That's all I can say.
I feel badly about it.
990
01:10:21,869 --> 01:10:27,116
And the, er... despair in her
voice about seeing a friend...
991
01:10:28,000 --> 01:10:30,744
And I feel that I let her down.
992
01:10:31,587 --> 01:10:33,656
So I proceeded to go to
the beach with the kids.
993
01:10:33,756 --> 01:10:36,367
I said, "Follow us," but she
didn't wanna do that, so...
994
01:10:36,467 --> 01:10:39,128
that was the end of that one.
995
01:10:39,762 --> 01:10:43,624
I do remember once she wouldn't
tell me where we were going.
996
01:10:43,724 --> 01:10:45,801
"I don't want to tell you.
It's a surprise."
997
01:10:46,811 --> 01:10:49,054
She took me to the stock yards.
998
01:10:51,398 --> 01:10:54,635
It didn't come into my
consciousness that,
999
01:10:54,735 --> 01:10:57,604
"Oh, this is where they
go to kill the animals."
1000
01:10:59,573 --> 01:11:02,735
There was a, trailer full of sheep.
1001
01:11:05,329 --> 01:11:08,816
I do remember guys poking
at them with sticks
1002
01:11:08,916 --> 01:11:11,410
to get them out down this long ramp.
1003
01:11:13,170 --> 01:11:15,156
After they were done
offloading the sheep,
1004
01:11:15,256 --> 01:11:17,916
they started throwing
out a dead sheep.
1005
01:11:18,759 --> 01:11:20,794
The one that got trampled.
1006
01:11:22,429 --> 01:11:24,798
That was the first
time I ever saw death.
1007
01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:30,804
Looking back, thinking about it,
it didn't bother me.
1008
01:11:31,605 --> 01:11:34,600
It was just kind of odd,
I couldn't understand it.
1009
01:11:37,361 --> 01:11:41,015
I've always been a critter person,
and these are my guys, the sheep.
1010
01:11:45,828 --> 01:11:49,774
The end of her life was something that
I worried about when she worked for me.
1011
01:11:49,874 --> 01:11:52,902
I thought, "How can
this end for her?"
1012
01:11:53,002 --> 01:11:54,612
I don't think it had a happy ending.
1013
01:11:54,712 --> 01:11:58,199
I was very glad that these men that she
took care of when they were little kids
1014
01:11:58,299 --> 01:12:00,618
kind of came to her rescue.
1015
01:12:00,718 --> 01:12:05,381
They got her an apartment
and paid for her rent.
1016
01:12:13,981 --> 01:12:16,383
- Do you... do you live in the area?
- Yes.
1017
01:12:16,483 --> 01:12:19,720
Do you remember a woman who
used to sit on this bench a lot,
1018
01:12:19,820 --> 01:12:21,680
wearing a big floppy hat?
1019
01:12:21,780 --> 01:12:23,849
Was she the French lady?
1020
01:12:23,949 --> 01:12:25,476
Yeah, I remember her.
1021
01:12:25,576 --> 01:12:30,239
People who still, live around here,
yeah, we remember her.
1022
01:12:30,998 --> 01:12:34,451
She was here a lot,
sitting on the bench.
1023
01:12:35,169 --> 01:12:37,830
But I don't think anybody
really talked to her.
1024
01:12:38,297 --> 01:12:40,908
There's a lot of eccentric
people around here,
1025
01:12:41,008 --> 01:12:43,168
and I just thought
she was one of them.
1026
01:12:44,053 --> 01:12:46,088
You knew that, just leave her alone.
1027
01:12:48,724 --> 01:12:50,835
Sometimes she'd be at the dumpsters.
1028
01:12:50,935 --> 01:12:54,004
You'd ask her, you know, "Do you
need help?" or "Do you need food?"
1029
01:12:54,104 --> 01:12:56,932
And she would just kind
of yell at you in French.
1030
01:12:57,816 --> 01:12:59,260
How'd you know her?
1031
01:12:59,360 --> 01:13:01,178
Just from seeing her
in the neighbourhood.
1032
01:13:01,278 --> 01:13:04,056
- And you'd sit with her?
- Well, I'd always sit on her bench,
1033
01:13:04,156 --> 01:13:08,018
and she'd sit there, and it took weeks
or months before she'd even speak to me.
1034
01:13:08,118 --> 01:13:11,063
I was there in the alley all the time,
going through the garbage,
1035
01:13:11,163 --> 01:13:14,150
so I had a bunch of old clothes, and
I had a wool hat, one time, I gave her.
1036
01:13:14,250 --> 01:13:17,987
And she took it, she said, "Oh, that's great,
I'll wear that when I sleep."
1037
01:13:18,087 --> 01:13:20,114
She was very short with people.
1038
01:13:20,214 --> 01:13:23,367
She was funny, though. Nice lady.
1039
01:13:23,467 --> 01:13:26,495
When I was riding my bike,
sometimes I'd cross her path.
1040
01:13:26,595 --> 01:13:29,874
And she'd yell to me,
"Get a bell! Get a bell!"
1041
01:13:29,974 --> 01:13:32,835
And sometimes, I'd be out
in the alley in the winter,
1042
01:13:32,935 --> 01:13:37,590
and she'd see me without a hat,
and she'd yell, "Get a hat! Get a hat!"
1043
01:13:37,690 --> 01:13:40,176
- She was about that bell on the bike.
- Yes.
1044
01:13:40,276 --> 01:13:43,262
Well, who would have known that
she was actually a great artist,
1045
01:13:43,362 --> 01:13:45,055
and she'd come to dumpster diving?
1046
01:13:45,155 --> 01:13:47,808
- That's the sad...
- I mean, sitting on the park bench,
1047
01:13:47,908 --> 01:13:50,728
literally, she'd go across the street,
she'd get a can of food...
1048
01:13:50,828 --> 01:13:54,231
What did she have one day? It was,
like, corned beef hash or something.
1049
01:13:54,331 --> 01:13:57,693
I remember, right out of the can,
not even warm it up, with a spoon.
1050
01:13:57,793 --> 01:13:59,796
And said it was delicious.
1051
01:14:03,549 --> 01:14:06,335
She was much more
damaged than I thought.
1052
01:14:07,928 --> 01:14:11,798
And I have a lot more
empathy for her...
1053
01:14:17,229 --> 01:14:20,724
I just think...
What a lonely lady.
1054
01:14:22,234 --> 01:14:24,561
You know? Incredibly lonely.
1055
01:14:25,654 --> 01:14:28,482
And misunderstood.
1056
01:14:30,367 --> 01:14:33,395
So... Yeah, I think... I mean,
now, if I were to see her today,
1057
01:14:33,495 --> 01:14:36,615
after this, I wouldn't be
as hard on her, probably.
1058
01:14:41,420 --> 01:14:42,905
Somebody called me and said,
1059
01:14:43,005 --> 01:14:46,158
"The old lady in the park,
she fell, she kind of passed out.
1060
01:14:46,258 --> 01:14:48,494
"The ambulance is out there."
1061
01:14:48,594 --> 01:14:51,622
So I went across the street,
and at that point,
1062
01:14:51,722 --> 01:14:54,375
they were loading her onto
the little cart there.
1063
01:14:54,475 --> 01:14:57,670
And she was telling the people,
the paramedics and such,
1064
01:14:57,770 --> 01:15:00,464
that she did not want to go,
she wanted to go home.
1065
01:15:00,564 --> 01:15:03,092
And they said that
she has to go with.
1066
01:15:03,192 --> 01:15:05,928
And she looked at me as if to say,
"Can you do something?"
1067
01:15:06,028 --> 01:15:07,805
But, nothing I could do about it.
1068
01:15:07,905 --> 01:15:11,400
I asked the paramedics,
they said, "No, she has to go."
1069
01:15:14,995 --> 01:15:16,772
And then, but that was it.
1070
01:15:16,872 --> 01:15:19,449
I mean, they put her in the
ambulance and took her away.
1071
01:15:20,334 --> 01:15:22,903
And after the fact, a lot of
people in the neighbourhood said,
1072
01:15:23,003 --> 01:15:25,956
"Whatever happened to the old
lady?" and nobody ever knew.
1073
01:15:51,323 --> 01:15:56,186
You have to try to draw,
from the evidence you have,
1074
01:15:56,286 --> 01:15:59,072
some understanding of the individual.
1075
01:16:00,541 --> 01:16:04,278
I think her pictures
show a tenderness,
1076
01:16:04,378 --> 01:16:08,198
instant alertness to human tragedies
1077
01:16:08,298 --> 01:16:12,461
and those moments of
generosity and sweetness.
1078
01:16:13,429 --> 01:16:18,592
I see her as an incredibly watchful,
observant, caring person.
1079
01:16:19,435 --> 01:16:24,389
And probably why she was a nanny
was that she had those capacities.
1080
01:16:26,275 --> 01:16:29,853
In 1962, when she took
a lot of the pictures...
1081
01:16:31,280 --> 01:16:33,774
the kids would always
play in the ravines.
1082
01:16:34,992 --> 01:16:37,444
It's the most beautiful
spot in the world.
1083
01:16:41,290 --> 01:16:44,735
You know, instead of this
straight-edged suburban community,
1084
01:16:44,835 --> 01:16:48,906
you always went there cos you wanted
the kids to have a little touch of nature.
1085
01:16:49,006 --> 01:16:51,742
You know, wild nature.
1086
01:16:51,842 --> 01:16:55,587
There was a patch of wild
strawberries somewhere in there.
1087
01:16:59,558 --> 01:17:03,095
And I think she liked it so much,
that's why they buried her there.
1088
01:17:05,564 --> 01:17:08,934
It's a place that they
remembered she was happy.
1089
01:17:11,069 --> 01:17:13,680
Now, you tell me how
you can live forever.
1090
01:17:13,780 --> 01:17:16,183
Come on.
1091
01:17:16,283 --> 01:17:19,728
She might have gotten to the
end of her life and thought,
1092
01:17:19,828 --> 01:17:23,990
"Why didn't I try to get
that work out there?"
1093
01:17:24,750 --> 01:17:27,486
Some people's character prevents them
1094
01:17:27,586 --> 01:17:32,874
from pushing that little bit you
need to push to get the work seen.
1095
01:17:33,592 --> 01:17:36,161
You know, she didn't defend
herself as an artist.
1096
01:17:36,261 --> 01:17:38,547
She just did the work.
1097
01:17:39,264 --> 01:17:41,425
A canon is often established.
1098
01:17:41,850 --> 01:17:43,460
And so, when someone comes in,
1099
01:17:43,560 --> 01:17:46,130
there's always the sense that
they're secondary figures.
1100
01:17:46,230 --> 01:17:49,258
But I don't feel her as secondary.
1101
01:17:49,358 --> 01:17:55,188
When I look at the pictures,
I always feel something primary.
1102
01:17:58,200 --> 01:18:02,938
I think that the work is so good that
it's really winning over a lot of people
1103
01:18:03,038 --> 01:18:06,316
who were...
were dismissive of it previously.
1104
01:18:06,416 --> 01:18:08,535
Where it'll wind up, who knows?
1105
01:18:10,045 --> 01:18:12,364
Much of the art world establishment
1106
01:18:12,464 --> 01:18:14,825
still hasn't accepted
Vivian Maier's work.
1107
01:18:14,925 --> 01:18:19,872
But people don't care. They're not waiting
for that validation from institutions.
1108
01:18:19,972 --> 01:18:23,425
They're claiming Vivian
Maier's work for themselves.
1109
01:18:25,185 --> 01:18:27,387
Her work is now in
galleries in New York.
1110
01:18:32,651 --> 01:18:35,645
It can be seen in LA.
1111
01:18:40,742 --> 01:18:42,853
One in particular that
I bought, which I love,
1112
01:18:42,953 --> 01:18:45,272
there's an abject
poverty in the frame,
1113
01:18:45,372 --> 01:18:48,366
but there's also a happiness
in spite of it all.
1114
01:18:50,794 --> 01:18:52,946
Her work is being seen
around the world.
1115
01:18:53,046 --> 01:18:56,700
London, Germany, Denmark.
1116
01:18:56,800 --> 01:19:00,420
They're embracing it,
and they're embracing Vivian Maier.
1117
01:19:07,811 --> 01:19:09,721
Oui, oui, oui.
1118
01:19:42,346 --> 01:19:44,589
Oui, ca c'est sur.
1119
01:19:47,476 --> 01:19:50,128
Maybe this is the best
way of all for her.
1120
01:19:50,228 --> 01:19:53,757
To have it happen after she's died.
1121
01:19:53,857 --> 01:19:55,759
That would probably
make Viv happiest.
1122
01:19:55,859 --> 01:20:00,438
Cos in her own life, the attention, I think
she would have found overwhelming.
1123
01:20:02,449 --> 01:20:04,434
Viv was supposed to be
downtrodden, right?
1124
01:20:04,534 --> 01:20:06,353
She was, like, a nanny.
1125
01:20:06,453 --> 01:20:10,399
That's not considered to be a pretty
high-ranking position in life.
1126
01:20:10,499 --> 01:20:12,442
Not married.
1127
01:20:12,542 --> 01:20:14,953
Not any social life to speak of.
1128
01:20:15,671 --> 01:20:20,117
She didn't have these
measures of status
1129
01:20:20,217 --> 01:20:22,460
that people aspire to.
1130
01:20:23,261 --> 01:20:25,839
But she didn't have to
compromise one bit.
1131
01:20:27,015 --> 01:20:28,750
She did what she wanted.
1132
01:20:28,850 --> 01:20:33,388
That's what she taught me, is that she
got the life she wanted. She had it.
1133
01:20:38,026 --> 01:20:41,021
I understand a lot more about her.
1134
01:20:44,157 --> 01:20:50,480
But why was this person so private,
1135
01:20:50,580 --> 01:20:55,327
yet so prolific in an artform
that she never shared?
1136
01:20:56,378 --> 01:20:58,405
Who knows?
1137
01:20:58,505 --> 01:21:00,824
She did it so it
wouldn't be forgotten.
1138
01:21:00,924 --> 01:21:03,209
And... and here, it's not forgotten.
1139
01:21:05,095 --> 01:21:06,955
As she was photographing,
1140
01:21:07,055 --> 01:21:11,501
she was seeing just how close you
can come into somebody's space,
1141
01:21:11,601 --> 01:21:13,086
and make a picture of them.
1142
01:21:13,186 --> 01:21:15,589
That tells me a lot about her.
1143
01:21:15,689 --> 01:21:19,593
It tells me that she could go into
a space with a total stranger
1144
01:21:19,693 --> 01:21:23,021
and get them to accommodate
her by being themselves,
1145
01:21:23,530 --> 01:21:27,392
and generate this kind of moment,
1146
01:21:27,492 --> 01:21:32,739
you know, where two presences were
actually kind of vibrating together.
1147
01:21:38,044 --> 01:21:40,413
And then she's gone.
1148
01:21:48,346 --> 01:21:51,083
Well, I suppose nothing
is meant to last forever.
1149
01:21:51,183 --> 01:21:54,044
We have to make room for
other people. It's a wheel.
1150
01:21:54,144 --> 01:21:58,223
You get on, you have to go to the end,
and then somebody else takes your place.
1151
01:21:58,273 --> 01:22:02,102
And now I am going to close and
quickly run next door to do my work.
1152
01:22:05,102 --> 01:22:09,102
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