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Mommy, can I have a waffle?
2
00:00:07,581 --> 00:00:09,341
- For breakfast?
- Yeah.
3
00:00:10,981 --> 00:00:13,781
- Hello?
- Check Twitter out. It's blowing up.
4
00:00:14,781 --> 00:00:16,621
Hold on.
I'm going to look for it.
5
00:00:16,781 --> 00:00:18,381
Everyone's doing MeToo.
6
00:00:19,981 --> 00:00:21,741
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
Hold on a sec, Trey.
7
00:00:21,901 --> 00:00:23,461
Mommy!
8
00:00:23,621 --> 00:00:25,181
Mommy?
9
00:00:28,901 --> 00:00:31,261
You know the Me-Too thing, right?
10
00:00:32,101 --> 00:00:33,621
If this Harvey Weinstein story broke
11
00:00:33,781 --> 00:00:36,381
and I hadn't experienced
what happened in ESP,
12
00:00:36,541 --> 00:00:40,581
I would be as equally not supportive
or not as compassionate, empathetic.
13
00:00:40,741 --> 00:00:43,101
I'd be like, "Why wouldn't
they just leave the room?"
14
00:00:43,261 --> 00:00:47,581
If anybody's ever been in an abusive
relationship, it's no different.
15
00:00:47,741 --> 00:00:49,381
Why would you stay with an abuser?
16
00:00:49,541 --> 00:00:52,621
You spend most of your time
defending yourself.
17
00:00:55,501 --> 00:00:57,021
Oh my God.
18
00:01:01,821 --> 00:01:04,341
Look at the Bill Cosby thing.
Look at the Harvey Weinstein thing.
19
00:01:04,501 --> 00:01:06,341
There isn't a place
in our culture right now
20
00:01:06,501 --> 00:01:08,741
where women who had
these abuses happen to them
21
00:01:08,901 --> 00:01:10,701
can go and get taken seriously.
22
00:01:10,861 --> 00:01:14,301
Unfortunately, you have
to use the media to do that.
23
00:01:23,421 --> 00:01:24,981
"Waking up this morning
24
00:01:25,141 --> 00:01:27,021
to almost every
woman friend of mine with a status
25
00:01:27,181 --> 00:01:29,021
moved me to tears, and then rage.
26
00:01:29,181 --> 00:01:32,941
I used to think that these things
never happened to me, but it has.
27
00:01:33,101 --> 00:01:36,541
In England at a rave,
in Israel in a bathroom,
28
00:01:36,701 --> 00:01:40,421
and most recently in Knox Woods,
Clifton Park, New York.
29
00:01:43,021 --> 00:01:45,861
Naked, pinned down,
mutilated and videotaped.
30
00:01:50,821 --> 00:01:53,061
Me too."
31
00:01:53,221 --> 00:01:56,701
THE VOW
32
00:02:02,701 --> 00:02:04,421
Days we were young
33
00:02:04,581 --> 00:02:09,981
We took photographsOf everything we could see
34
00:02:10,141 --> 00:02:13,261
We have to run from it
35
00:02:13,421 --> 00:02:15,421
Priest and prophetess
36
00:02:15,581 --> 00:02:20,101
We were nothing we would defy
37
00:02:22,781 --> 00:02:27,701
Invisible skinThere is the world within
38
00:02:28,541 --> 00:02:33,461
Invincible skinIt's how we all begin
39
00:02:37,061 --> 00:02:41,061
HONESTY & DISCLOSURE
40
00:02:42,781 --> 00:02:44,301
I just got a notification.
41
00:02:44,461 --> 00:02:46,381
- A notification about what?
- A New York Times notification.
42
00:02:46,541 --> 00:02:47,941
- Really?
- It's been popping up.
43
00:02:48,101 --> 00:02:50,741
- Holy shit! Look.
- You just got it? Let's see it.
44
00:02:50,901 --> 00:02:52,861
"To join the self-help
group's inner circle,
45
00:02:53,021 --> 00:02:55,421
some women provided compromising
material about themselves,
46
00:02:55,581 --> 00:02:58,141
then they were held down
and branded."
47
00:02:58,301 --> 00:03:00,821
- It's happening.
- Wow. This shit's about to explode.
48
00:03:00,981 --> 00:03:03,021
- Its front page of the New York Times!
- That's very good.
49
00:03:03,181 --> 00:03:06,581
This is what we wanted!
Oh my God! Oh my God!
50
00:03:06,741 --> 00:03:09,381
With the Me Too shit,
this is going viral.
51
00:03:10,501 --> 00:03:14,661
Holy fuck. Nip, I'm the front page
of The New York fucking Times.
52
00:03:18,141 --> 00:03:21,421
Oh my God. Oh my God.
53
00:03:23,981 --> 00:03:25,341
Shit, Sarah.
54
00:03:25,501 --> 00:03:27,381
Oh my God,
there's a picture of my brand.
55
00:03:28,621 --> 00:03:31,101
"Albany, last March, five women
gathered in a home near here
56
00:03:31,261 --> 00:03:32,581
to enter a secret sisterhood
57
00:03:32,741 --> 00:03:34,901
they were told was created
to empower women."
58
00:03:35,061 --> 00:03:36,821
"A copy of a text message
59
00:03:36,981 --> 00:03:40,101
Mr. Raniere sent
to a female follower indicates
60
00:03:40,261 --> 00:03:42,341
that he knew women
were being branded
61
00:03:42,501 --> 00:03:46,941
and the symbols designed
incorporated his initials.
62
00:03:47,101 --> 00:03:52,541
'If it were Abraham Lincoln's or Bill
Gates initials, no one would care.'"
63
00:03:52,701 --> 00:03:54,421
That's what he said to somebody?
64
00:03:56,981 --> 00:03:59,301
"Several former members
have asked state authorities
65
00:03:59,461 --> 00:04:01,181
to investigate
the group's activities,
66
00:04:01,341 --> 00:04:03,701
but officials have declined
to pursue action."
67
00:04:03,861 --> 00:04:05,661
- Fuck them.
- Yeah.
68
00:04:05,821 --> 00:04:08,581
Fuck you all, shitheads.
69
00:04:11,901 --> 00:04:13,421
Hold on. Mark's calling.
70
00:04:13,581 --> 00:04:15,221
- Hi.
- Holy fuck.
71
00:04:15,381 --> 00:04:16,741
My phone has just been going.
72
00:04:16,901 --> 00:04:18,741
I'm literally phone callto phone call to phone call.
73
00:04:18,901 --> 00:04:21,261
Oh my God.
Like, "I've got to go. Here's Mark.
74
00:04:21,421 --> 00:04:23,341
Got to go, here's Mom.
Got to go to there's a reporter."
75
00:04:23,501 --> 00:04:26,581
"Here's my chiropractor. I missed
my chiropractic appointment."
76
00:04:26,741 --> 00:04:28,541
In some waysthis is like another beginning now.
77
00:04:28,701 --> 00:04:30,221
Yeah. No.
The fireworks are going to start.
78
00:04:30,381 --> 00:04:32,621
Is there a certain unloadingof emotion going on?
79
00:04:32,781 --> 00:04:36,661
- Yeah. I love you, Bonnie.
- I love you, Sarah.
80
00:04:36,821 --> 00:04:39,181
No, no. Seriously.I really fucking love you.
81
00:04:39,341 --> 00:04:41,141
- You were so brave.
- I love you too.
82
00:04:41,301 --> 00:04:44,541
We're having a moment.
You are the bravest, first one.
83
00:04:45,981 --> 00:04:49,381
That must have been scary as fuckto try to leave when you did.
84
00:04:51,381 --> 00:04:54,021
It's just, this is crazy.
85
00:04:54,181 --> 00:04:55,981
This is going to be
a roller coaster.
86
00:04:56,141 --> 00:04:58,861
It's gonna have inertia going
one way, inertia going the other.
87
00:04:59,021 --> 00:05:04,261
But I think it's a steady climb
towards whatever justice, whatever.
88
00:05:04,421 --> 00:05:06,141
What are they going to do now?
89
00:05:06,301 --> 00:05:08,701
What is the worst-case scenario
that they're going to do?
90
00:05:08,861 --> 00:05:11,421
- Yeah, agree.
- Love you. Bye.
91
00:05:15,461 --> 00:05:18,901
Barry, it's Catherine Oxenberg.
I just finished reading the article
92
00:05:19,061 --> 00:05:22,101
and I want to thank you
from the bottom of my heart.
93
00:05:22,261 --> 00:05:26,541
This is going to help save my daughter.
I'm so incredibly grateful.
94
00:05:30,941 --> 00:05:32,301
- Hi.
- How's it going?
95
00:05:32,461 --> 00:05:34,461
Welcome to the New York Times party.
96
00:05:35,781 --> 00:05:37,901
The party's getting started.
97
00:05:38,061 --> 00:05:39,541
Hi, just to let you know,
you're on speaker.
98
00:05:39,701 --> 00:05:41,381
There's a bunch of ex-ESP-ians
at my house.
99
00:05:41,541 --> 00:05:43,341
We're having a New York Times party.
100
00:05:43,501 --> 00:05:45,101
- Hey, guys.
- Hey.
101
00:05:46,301 --> 00:05:48,461
Everyone's on their phone
texting, tweeting,
102
00:05:48,621 --> 00:05:50,421
sending it to people
who are still in,
103
00:05:50,581 --> 00:05:54,301
making sure the right person sends
it so we don't trigger their pride.
104
00:05:57,261 --> 00:05:59,381
We're a little...
105
00:05:59,541 --> 00:06:04,101
Someone is trying to... Barbara
Bouchey is trying to call me now.
106
00:06:04,261 --> 00:06:06,821
Oh my God. Should I answer that?
107
00:06:08,581 --> 00:06:13,101
Some people say I'm too busy.I can't squeeze anything in.
108
00:06:13,261 --> 00:06:15,261
You're exactly the type of personthat needs a program.
109
00:06:15,421 --> 00:06:18,261
You know why? Your lifeis obviously controlling you.
110
00:06:19,421 --> 00:06:21,501
- Sarah?
- Hi, Barb.
111
00:06:21,661 --> 00:06:27,941
What a big day! Oh my God, I love thatit rode the Harvey Weinstein coattails.
112
00:06:28,101 --> 00:06:31,661
Yeah. I think that was very smart,
and I posted the Me Too.
113
00:06:31,821 --> 00:06:33,701
You should go on my Facebook
and check it out.
114
00:06:33,861 --> 00:06:37,221
Oh my God. Finally,it's getting out there.
115
00:06:38,581 --> 00:06:41,221
- And I'm just really proud.
- Thank you.
116
00:06:41,381 --> 00:06:43,661
- And it's very emotional.
- Yeah.
117
00:06:45,421 --> 00:06:49,741
So, I... You know,I don't feel so alone anymore.
118
00:06:49,901 --> 00:06:51,661
No, you're not alone anymore.
119
00:06:51,821 --> 00:06:54,821
I don't know if you guys know this,
Barbara was my field trainer.
120
00:06:54,981 --> 00:06:57,381
Barb taught me everything.
Everything I know.
121
00:06:57,541 --> 00:06:58,981
- That was her?
- That was her.
122
00:06:59,141 --> 00:07:01,501
You told me that story. I didn't know
it was Barbara Bouchey.
123
00:07:01,661 --> 00:07:03,541
I guess her name was blacklisted
back then.
124
00:07:03,701 --> 00:07:05,381
- Now you're back.
- Now you're back.
125
00:07:05,541 --> 00:07:09,261
You know, Sarah, I want to tell you,you outdid me as a field trainer.
126
00:07:09,421 --> 00:07:12,341
And I just knew you were goingto do amazing things,
127
00:07:12,501 --> 00:07:15,661
and I saw that in youfrom the first moment I met you.
128
00:07:15,821 --> 00:07:18,541
And this is what I'm goingto say to you.
129
00:07:18,701 --> 00:07:22,221
It... Nothing may ever come it.He may not be stopped.
130
00:07:22,381 --> 00:07:25,901
But nothing changes what you did.
131
00:07:26,741 --> 00:07:29,741
I'm hoping perhaps the authorities
will take another look.
132
00:07:29,901 --> 00:07:31,741
Yeah, I hope so too.
133
00:07:32,821 --> 00:07:35,621
THE BAY AREA
134
00:07:39,981 --> 00:07:44,741
This is it.
These are the old VHS.
135
00:07:45,941 --> 00:07:47,581
I haven't seen him in 10 years,
136
00:07:47,741 --> 00:07:50,581
and so we're going to be watching
them for the first time.
137
00:07:52,821 --> 00:07:57,781
April 2009, myself
and eight key women resigned.
138
00:07:58,501 --> 00:08:00,941
We thought that people
would wake up at NXIVM
139
00:08:01,101 --> 00:08:04,701
or we can get the government
involved and hold Keith accountable.
140
00:08:04,861 --> 00:08:07,061
This needs to stop.
141
00:08:07,221 --> 00:08:10,381
It's manipulative and deceptiveand not transparent,
142
00:08:10,541 --> 00:08:11,861
and you don't know that.
143
00:08:15,941 --> 00:08:18,741
Of course, it didn't do anything.
144
00:08:21,341 --> 00:08:23,781
- This is a tape that you made?
- Yes.
145
00:08:23,941 --> 00:08:26,101
And I decided to surprise Keith.
146
00:08:26,261 --> 00:08:29,101
His father gave me some videos
when he was a little kid,
147
00:08:29,261 --> 00:08:31,821
and so I compiled that.
148
00:08:36,621 --> 00:08:39,301
This was his song that he would play
for me all the time
149
00:08:39,461 --> 00:08:41,621
by Led Zeppelin
that says, Thank You.
150
00:08:41,781 --> 00:08:45,861
So, of course, I put it in there
because I'm a romantic.
151
00:08:48,941 --> 00:08:50,581
That's me.
152
00:08:50,741 --> 00:08:54,421
- Why did you make this tape?
- It was his birthday.
153
00:08:54,581 --> 00:08:58,061
And you know, at this point now,
I was in love with him.
154
00:09:02,701 --> 00:09:06,341
So, yeah, so I started the trend
of creating tribute videos.
155
00:09:06,501 --> 00:09:09,021
Did one for Nancy for her birthday.
156
00:09:21,061 --> 00:09:22,861
Okay. Are we ready?
157
00:09:23,021 --> 00:09:24,981
Who was Nancy Salzman to you?
158
00:09:26,061 --> 00:09:29,581
Nancy Salzman,
I met in the late '80s.
159
00:09:29,741 --> 00:09:33,661
Nancy was a therapist and I was
referred to her for stress management.
160
00:09:33,821 --> 00:09:36,341
My mom died when I was eight.
My dad was a severe alcoholic.
161
00:09:36,501 --> 00:09:39,101
And I would get stressed out
about things
162
00:09:39,261 --> 00:09:41,661
because I needed
to control my environment.
163
00:09:41,821 --> 00:09:46,141
So, Nancy, she helped me a lot
and we became friends.
164
00:09:46,301 --> 00:09:49,461
Around the year 1999,
165
00:09:49,621 --> 00:09:53,621
she tried to convince me
to take a workshop.
166
00:09:53,781 --> 00:09:55,581
She and Keith had formed the company
167
00:09:55,741 --> 00:09:58,461
at that time called
Executive Success Programs.
168
00:09:59,861 --> 00:10:01,781
It was the first time in my life
169
00:10:01,941 --> 00:10:06,261
that I visited those wounds
and that childhood trauma.
170
00:10:07,301 --> 00:10:10,421
There's a part of our existencethat is indescribable.
171
00:10:10,581 --> 00:10:12,741
Like, for example,the experience of pain.
172
00:10:12,901 --> 00:10:14,781
You could say, "Well, you have nervesthat fire and go up into your brain."
173
00:10:14,941 --> 00:10:18,501
Those are signals,that's not the experience of pain
174
00:10:18,661 --> 00:10:21,341
because there are certain aspectswhere you really like pain.
175
00:10:21,501 --> 00:10:24,341
You ever have someone hitthe volleyball at you fast,
176
00:10:24,501 --> 00:10:26,661
really hard and you receive it.
177
00:10:26,821 --> 00:10:29,341
Doesn't it feel neatwhen you hit it?
178
00:10:29,501 --> 00:10:31,301
You know, that's pain.
179
00:10:31,461 --> 00:10:33,021
Good pain, though.
180
00:10:34,301 --> 00:10:35,701
Let's go!
181
00:10:35,861 --> 00:10:39,221
Oh, get it, get it, get it, get it!
182
00:10:42,141 --> 00:10:43,461
Good.
183
00:10:45,541 --> 00:10:47,221
Do questions?
184
00:10:50,221 --> 00:10:53,261
I have an assumption that youdon't have any disintegrations.
185
00:10:53,421 --> 00:10:56,661
- Is that correct?- Interesting question.
186
00:10:56,821 --> 00:11:00,381
It gets raised from time to time.Unified or disintegration.
187
00:11:01,741 --> 00:11:03,541
I have some really neat talents
188
00:11:03,701 --> 00:11:06,781
and I havesome even neater fallibilities.
189
00:11:08,941 --> 00:11:10,661
The last thing I needed
was a boyfriend,
190
00:11:10,821 --> 00:11:12,141
and I didn't find him attractive.
191
00:11:12,301 --> 00:11:16,741
But after taking the program, I began
to admire and respect his mind.
192
00:11:18,101 --> 00:11:20,221
If I say, "I'm not unified,"then, of course,
193
00:11:20,381 --> 00:11:23,301
"Oh gosh, he created this,and he's not unified yet?"
194
00:11:25,261 --> 00:11:28,981
The goal is not to be unified.The goal is to have more joy.
195
00:11:29,141 --> 00:11:31,381
Thank you for listening and playing.
196
00:11:35,221 --> 00:11:37,421
I'm going to take my ballsand go home.
197
00:11:39,301 --> 00:11:41,181
I do that all the time.
198
00:11:41,341 --> 00:11:44,221
You take my balls and go home?
199
00:11:44,381 --> 00:11:47,501
Wait a minute now.I mean, that's a nice offer, I guess.
200
00:11:47,661 --> 00:11:50,701
My saying is:I take my toys and I go home.
201
00:11:52,021 --> 00:11:53,421
I take my toys and go home.
202
00:11:53,581 --> 00:11:56,221
Keith began flirting with me
and pursuing me.
203
00:11:56,381 --> 00:12:00,501
Do you want to take my balls?Boom, boom.
204
00:12:00,661 --> 00:12:04,141
But it wasn't until months later
that I actually started dating him.
205
00:12:08,661 --> 00:12:11,021
And he would say,
206
00:12:11,181 --> 00:12:13,941
"You are not like anybody else,"
207
00:12:15,501 --> 00:12:18,621
because I was a business woman
and I was all self-made.
208
00:12:20,261 --> 00:12:24,541
I could match him in a way
that other people couldn't.
209
00:12:24,701 --> 00:12:27,461
Keith told me
that we would work together
210
00:12:27,621 --> 00:12:30,101
to help make a difference
in the world.
211
00:12:30,261 --> 00:12:33,781
Hello, everyone. It's an honorto be on the call this evening.
212
00:12:33,941 --> 00:12:37,461
I was 40-years-old and had a highlysuccessful financial planning firm,
213
00:12:37,621 --> 00:12:39,381
a couple of million dollarsin the bank,
214
00:12:39,541 --> 00:12:41,301
and my business was wortha couple of million.
215
00:12:41,461 --> 00:12:44,781
One could say I had it all,but I didn't.
216
00:12:44,941 --> 00:12:49,141
I gave up making millions
to help build the company.
217
00:12:50,381 --> 00:12:54,981
I was the first board member
on the very first executive board.
218
00:12:55,781 --> 00:12:58,861
I created Vanguard Week.
219
00:13:00,421 --> 00:13:04,581
It brought me great joy to createa space for you to have joy.
220
00:13:05,461 --> 00:13:08,181
They had no sales
and marketing material
221
00:13:08,341 --> 00:13:11,261
and they didn't have
any professional image.
222
00:13:13,181 --> 00:13:15,101
Do you feel like a supermodel yet?
223
00:13:17,661 --> 00:13:20,941
That's my business sense
that I brought to the table.
224
00:13:21,101 --> 00:13:24,981
- She's quite the enroller.- I know she is. She never gives up.
225
00:13:25,141 --> 00:13:29,621
During my time there,
I was personally responsible
226
00:13:29,781 --> 00:13:34,421
for probably enrolling hundreds,
maybe a thousand.
227
00:13:34,581 --> 00:13:37,501
If you could change thingsthat you want to change...
228
00:13:38,621 --> 00:13:40,461
What would that be worth?
229
00:13:45,341 --> 00:13:48,461
So 24 messages
since I last looked at Facebook.
230
00:13:48,621 --> 00:13:50,981
I'm looking at Twitter now.
231
00:13:51,141 --> 00:13:53,581
Generally, the overall is:
"Holy fuck.
232
00:13:53,741 --> 00:13:55,901
I'm so glad you're out.
You're so brave."
233
00:13:56,061 --> 00:13:57,781
Every now and then, I'm getting a
234
00:13:57,941 --> 00:14:00,541
"What the fuck?
How could you let that happen?"
235
00:14:01,461 --> 00:14:03,981
It makes me sound stupid,
but whatever.
236
00:14:06,221 --> 00:14:09,901
This isn't a sideline thing.
You know...
237
00:14:10,061 --> 00:14:12,221
People don't understand that though.
238
00:14:12,381 --> 00:14:13,941
You don't get to be neutral.
239
00:14:14,101 --> 00:14:16,741
You're going to get praised
and punished for it.
240
00:14:18,341 --> 00:14:20,301
"I don't feel sorry for them at all.
241
00:14:20,461 --> 00:14:23,301
These people in the Vancouver
chapter were aggressive, cliquey,
242
00:14:23,461 --> 00:14:26,341
and downright abusive in some of
their recruitment tactics of people
243
00:14:26,501 --> 00:14:29,381
within the Vancouver yoga
and acting communities.
244
00:14:29,541 --> 00:14:30,901
Predators."
245
00:14:31,061 --> 00:14:33,461
- Holy shit.
- Wow.
246
00:14:35,981 --> 00:14:38,341
"Why would any woman
subject herself to a tattoo
247
00:14:38,501 --> 00:14:39,821
after being made to say,
248
00:14:39,981 --> 00:14:42,981
'Master, please brand me.
It would be an honor'?"
249
00:14:44,381 --> 00:14:46,141
Sarah.
250
00:14:46,301 --> 00:14:48,021
Sarah?
251
00:14:49,421 --> 00:14:53,541
"It's so shockingly sad that these
women felt so lost in their lives.
252
00:14:53,701 --> 00:14:55,541
No red flags were flapping?
253
00:14:55,701 --> 00:14:57,901
No one thought,
'Wait a minute, what?'
254
00:14:59,101 --> 00:15:02,181
I know we're not supposed
to blame victims, but c'mon."
255
00:15:13,421 --> 00:15:16,981
It's okay. It's okay. It's okay.
Come here. Come here. Come here.
256
00:15:20,621 --> 00:15:22,821
This is my life in general,
but it's way worse right now.
257
00:15:22,981 --> 00:15:26,181
- I want her to hold me.
- Okay, but she's busy right now.
258
00:15:26,341 --> 00:15:30,101
You've got to give her five minutes
and then she'll come sit with you.
259
00:15:30,261 --> 00:15:31,621
Troy. Troy, look at me.
260
00:15:31,781 --> 00:15:33,621
- Sarah?
- Barb?
261
00:15:33,781 --> 00:15:35,781
The comments on the New York Times,
262
00:15:35,941 --> 00:15:40,021
I'm really recognizing specifically
how the main thing that Barry missed
263
00:15:40,181 --> 00:15:42,421
was the steps into getting involved
264
00:15:42,581 --> 00:15:44,941
and the psychology
behind the coercion.
265
00:15:45,101 --> 00:15:47,781
So, yeah.
266
00:15:47,941 --> 00:15:52,141
I would understand why that would bereally bothersome to you, you know?
267
00:15:52,301 --> 00:15:56,061
And they didn't mention your career,and it was your community.
268
00:15:56,221 --> 00:15:57,661
I felt your pain in that moment
269
00:15:57,821 --> 00:16:01,261
because that's what they've doneto me for the last eight years.
270
00:16:03,381 --> 00:16:05,541
Someone just sent me a link,
"Shocking allegations
271
00:16:05,701 --> 00:16:08,981
about capital region calling group
a cult." Let's play it together.
272
00:16:09,141 --> 00:16:10,461
The report out today says
273
00:16:10,621 --> 00:16:13,581
that some female members have beenbranded with the founder's initials.
274
00:16:13,741 --> 00:16:15,181
What?
275
00:16:15,341 --> 00:16:18,181
News Channel 13's Dan Bazile digs deeperinto the underground world of cults.
276
00:16:18,341 --> 00:16:19,861
Oh my God.
277
00:16:20,021 --> 00:16:21,381
Does that meannobody wants to talk to me?
278
00:16:21,541 --> 00:16:23,021
They shut the door on us.
279
00:16:23,181 --> 00:16:25,101
And she was sayingthey didn't want to say a word
280
00:16:25,261 --> 00:16:27,741
about some serious allegationsin the New York Times.
281
00:16:27,901 --> 00:16:29,781
What is happening essentiallyis that these organizations...
282
00:16:29,941 --> 00:16:32,701
Jesus. These are pictures of me,
by the way.
283
00:16:32,861 --> 00:16:35,181
Your lack of identity,your lack of a self.
284
00:16:37,541 --> 00:16:40,981
The person who joins the cultand the person who invents the cult,
285
00:16:41,141 --> 00:16:43,221
they kind of sufferfrom the same disease,
286
00:16:43,381 --> 00:16:45,941
this kind of fragilityor narcissism.
287
00:16:46,101 --> 00:16:48,061
Oh my God.
288
00:16:54,821 --> 00:16:57,181
So, I'd say best case scenario
289
00:16:57,341 --> 00:16:59,741
is there's enough public outrage
for law enforcement to go,
290
00:16:59,901 --> 00:17:01,341
"Okay, we got it from here."
291
00:17:01,501 --> 00:17:03,101
Yeah.But the New York Times article,
292
00:17:03,261 --> 00:17:05,021
in reading it I thought,"Okay, this is great,"
293
00:17:05,181 --> 00:17:08,021
but like, people stilldon't really get what this is.
294
00:17:08,181 --> 00:17:10,461
Look, the branding and all that
is the headline.
295
00:17:10,621 --> 00:17:14,901
Right, and that's the physical
manifestation of multiple abuses,
296
00:17:15,061 --> 00:17:16,421
primarily in the emotional realm,
297
00:17:16,581 --> 00:17:18,541
which are harder to quantify
and harder to prove.
298
00:17:18,701 --> 00:17:22,141
It's very important that that's
the narrative of what's being told.
299
00:17:22,301 --> 00:17:24,101
I think it might be goodto talk to Brendan.
300
00:17:24,261 --> 00:17:25,701
- The Times Union guy?
- Yeah.
301
00:17:25,861 --> 00:17:27,421
Yeah, I think so too.
302
00:17:28,901 --> 00:17:31,261
The irony is I liveabout 10 minutes from Keith.
303
00:17:31,421 --> 00:17:32,741
Oh, my goodness.
304
00:17:32,901 --> 00:17:35,661
We've done many storiesthrough the years.
305
00:17:37,301 --> 00:17:41,141
What was left on the cutting roomfloor, for you, that you thought...
306
00:17:41,301 --> 00:17:43,941
A lot, a lot.
And you know, they broke the story,
307
00:17:44,101 --> 00:17:47,821
but you can do the rest.
308
00:17:47,981 --> 00:17:51,141
They left out the nuances
of how the recruitment was done.
309
00:17:51,301 --> 00:17:52,621
If they had said,
310
00:17:52,781 --> 00:17:55,701
"Do you want to get Keith's and Allie's
initials branded on your vagina,
311
00:17:55,861 --> 00:17:58,101
I definitely would have said no."
312
00:17:58,261 --> 00:18:01,421
But it was step by step,
by step, by step.
313
00:18:01,581 --> 00:18:05,821
People's boundaries and conscience
are being messed with here.
314
00:18:05,981 --> 00:18:08,661
Keith assumes this moral high ground
that he just doesn't have,
315
00:18:08,821 --> 00:18:13,261
but he's convinced an insular
group of people that it exists.
316
00:18:13,421 --> 00:18:16,901
And then they don't take in any
more information from the real world.
317
00:18:17,061 --> 00:18:20,461
And also, they left out
that with the women at the top,
318
00:18:20,621 --> 00:18:23,541
sex with Keith is
part of the enlightenment.
319
00:18:24,781 --> 00:18:26,261
V-WEEK
320
00:18:26,421 --> 00:18:30,141
There don't seem to have any chairsleft. I don't think they need to.
321
00:18:34,181 --> 00:18:37,781
Around 2006, a lot of people
had bought into the belief
322
00:18:37,941 --> 00:18:40,901
that Keith was really truly
an enlightened being.
323
00:18:41,061 --> 00:18:47,021
And if you have sex with the guru,
it actually moves your evolution.
324
00:18:48,021 --> 00:18:51,021
But did you see a halo
over his head?
325
00:18:51,181 --> 00:18:55,181
Did the bells ring?
No, I didn't have any of that.
326
00:18:55,341 --> 00:18:59,861
But the truth is
I had a lot of intimacy problems.
327
00:19:01,301 --> 00:19:03,661
If you grew up without touch,
328
00:19:03,821 --> 00:19:06,341
without cuddling,
without being hugged...
329
00:19:07,821 --> 00:19:10,461
I don't know...
You can't receive.
330
00:19:11,821 --> 00:19:16,261
Keith was very loving, gentle,
attentive, affectionate,
331
00:19:16,421 --> 00:19:20,621
and he helped me work through
a lot of that,
332
00:19:20,781 --> 00:19:24,821
to accept love, to receive love.
333
00:19:27,341 --> 00:19:30,421
I really felt
that he was my soulmate.
334
00:19:34,581 --> 00:19:36,581
And the women in the inner circle
335
00:19:36,741 --> 00:19:39,381
who lived with him for decades,
said that.
336
00:19:40,781 --> 00:19:42,581
Recorder on ya.
337
00:19:45,221 --> 00:19:48,741
He was living with Karen Unterreiner,
Pam Cafritz.
338
00:19:48,901 --> 00:19:53,661
- What's Odin?- Odin is a Norse god.
339
00:19:53,821 --> 00:19:55,141
And Kristin Keeffe.
340
00:19:55,301 --> 00:19:58,301
Which color do you thinkI should dye my hair?
341
00:19:58,461 --> 00:20:00,301
This is an important question.
342
00:20:02,101 --> 00:20:03,621
This. It has more red.
343
00:20:03,781 --> 00:20:06,781
And you can make it lighter or darkerdepending on how long you treat it?
344
00:20:06,941 --> 00:20:09,421
You can look back
and always see the red flags.
345
00:20:09,581 --> 00:20:12,741
But they presented it
like you know a dormitory.
346
00:20:12,901 --> 00:20:14,901
When I walked into his house,
347
00:20:15,061 --> 00:20:17,421
whoever was in there made room
for me to sit next to him.
348
00:20:17,581 --> 00:20:21,821
So, for all general purposes, what
I could see, I was the girlfriend.
349
00:20:22,941 --> 00:20:24,741
There's something about me
350
00:20:24,901 --> 00:20:30,741
that I can carry on a very odd life,and in some ways...
351
00:20:33,461 --> 00:20:35,381
Yeah, it's odd in a lot of ways.
352
00:20:35,541 --> 00:20:39,261
Again, the number of womenthat have been with me a long time.
353
00:20:39,421 --> 00:20:40,781
You've been with me almost 30 years.
354
00:20:40,941 --> 00:20:43,221
You've been with me almost 20 years.
355
00:20:43,381 --> 00:20:46,981
How does that happen?Why me?
356
00:20:54,581 --> 00:20:56,181
It's like what you are is it.
357
00:20:56,341 --> 00:20:59,781
I don't knowhow to put it into words.
358
00:21:01,181 --> 00:21:06,021
I think you touch people's heart,and you get to their core.
359
00:21:06,181 --> 00:21:08,701
Everyone that's ever receiveda Hallmark card,
360
00:21:08,861 --> 00:21:11,381
someone said something aboutsomeone touching their heart.
361
00:21:11,541 --> 00:21:13,381
It sounds good and it may be true,
362
00:21:13,541 --> 00:21:16,901
but how do you express to an audiencewho doesn't know me at all?
363
00:21:17,061 --> 00:21:19,101
Do you say, "He touches my...If you saw a video
364
00:21:19,261 --> 00:21:22,581
about a bunch of people sayinga guy touches someone's heart,
365
00:21:22,741 --> 00:21:26,421
what do you get from that?Do you really get it?
366
00:21:26,581 --> 00:21:31,621
Why is it that I can have relationshipwith multiple women for a long time?
367
00:21:33,661 --> 00:21:35,741
So, you were aware that he was
having sex with other people?
368
00:21:35,901 --> 00:21:37,421
Not for about a year.
369
00:21:37,581 --> 00:21:40,261
NANCY'S BIRTHDAY 2006
370
00:21:40,421 --> 00:21:42,861
Ladies and gentlemen,put your hands together
371
00:21:43,021 --> 00:21:46,261
and get ready to singa very Happy Birthday one time.
372
00:21:46,421 --> 00:21:48,541
On three everybody! One...
373
00:21:48,701 --> 00:21:51,341
Two, three!
374
00:21:56,101 --> 00:22:01,061
Well, this is a party not even Nancycan't help herself. Sing along.
375
00:22:02,061 --> 00:22:03,421
- How are you doing?- Good.
376
00:22:03,581 --> 00:22:07,381
- You look fit. You been working out?- It actually looks good on you.
377
00:22:07,541 --> 00:22:11,301
- You got anything on under that?- No. I did that for you.
378
00:22:13,461 --> 00:22:15,701
You've got to see...She's got nothing on.
379
00:22:15,861 --> 00:22:18,501
- Did she take you to the light?- She didn't take me to the light.
380
00:22:18,661 --> 00:22:22,101
- To the beam yet? Oh, all right.- She did that to you, but not to me.
381
00:22:22,261 --> 00:22:24,461
I'll see you a little later, right?
382
00:22:24,621 --> 00:22:27,141
- Who was the first woman?
- Barbara Jeske.
383
00:22:29,581 --> 00:22:31,141
Why so small?
384
00:22:37,901 --> 00:22:41,341
Keith said,
"So I have sex with Barbara.
385
00:22:43,541 --> 00:22:45,901
What's the big deal?"
386
00:22:48,861 --> 00:22:51,341
Maybe once, twice a year,
that's all,
387
00:22:51,501 --> 00:22:53,781
he had sex with her
as her guru teacher.
388
00:22:58,021 --> 00:23:02,461
But then I found out about
the next one, Pamela Cafritz,
389
00:23:02,621 --> 00:23:04,701
and I confronted them,
390
00:23:04,861 --> 00:23:08,621
and they didn't hold back, yup.
391
00:23:10,301 --> 00:23:15,981
And then all this other stuff
came up, Karen Unterreiner,
392
00:23:16,141 --> 00:23:17,461
because now I'm suspicious
393
00:23:17,621 --> 00:23:20,141
of everybody's he's living with,
in that house.
394
00:23:20,301 --> 00:23:22,141
Who are you looking for?
395
00:23:22,301 --> 00:23:24,101
I'm looking for someone.
396
00:23:27,501 --> 00:23:29,181
You can bring me to the light.
397
00:23:32,661 --> 00:23:34,021
It's getting hot.
398
00:23:34,181 --> 00:23:38,141
During my nine years there, there
were 12 women he was intimate with.
399
00:23:39,421 --> 00:23:43,661
I was humiliated.
I felt betrayed. I was in shock.
400
00:23:46,741 --> 00:23:50,621
But you don't know things and
you don't know people until you do.
401
00:23:50,781 --> 00:23:53,581
And everybody is a blend
of good and bad.
402
00:23:56,381 --> 00:24:00,221
You can't see the bad if you don't
understand how they use the good.
403
00:24:07,501 --> 00:24:09,741
Oh, thanks babe. Thank you.
404
00:24:09,901 --> 00:24:13,021
Okay, here we go.
First radio interview.
405
00:24:13,861 --> 00:24:15,461
Thank you.
406
00:24:19,301 --> 00:24:23,181
The last 12 hours
have been actually pretty insane.
407
00:24:23,341 --> 00:24:26,701
All of a sudden, it's like,
holy shit, the whole world knows.
408
00:24:27,701 --> 00:24:29,861
It's hard to know
how it reads to people
409
00:24:30,021 --> 00:24:31,781
who don't know about any of this,
410
00:24:31,941 --> 00:24:34,501
because now that I'm out
and I'm looking at the people
411
00:24:34,661 --> 00:24:36,821
who are still in,
they just look crazy.
412
00:24:36,981 --> 00:24:40,501
And so, like the frog
in the pot of boiling water.
413
00:24:40,661 --> 00:24:44,301
What was implanted from
the very beginning, that's caused...
414
00:24:47,621 --> 00:24:49,981
...Such a fracture
in my psychology
415
00:24:50,141 --> 00:24:52,301
that I would even get
to the point where I said,
416
00:24:52,461 --> 00:24:55,781
"Okay, master, it would be
an honor to brand me."
417
00:24:58,861 --> 00:25:00,741
That night,
it was like a horror show.
418
00:25:00,901 --> 00:25:04,021
And then there's Lauren saying,
"You're a Green you need to do this,"
419
00:25:04,181 --> 00:25:06,541
and, "What does it mean, Sarah?"
420
00:25:06,701 --> 00:25:08,461
What does it mean to be afraid?
421
00:25:10,861 --> 00:25:13,621
Like, this is
the kind of mind-fuckery.
422
00:25:13,781 --> 00:25:17,381
It was immediately always
flipped back to you being your issue.
423
00:25:19,101 --> 00:25:23,021
A lot of people are reaching out like,
"Oh my God, what man did this to you?"
424
00:25:23,181 --> 00:25:25,541
And technically, it was the women.
425
00:25:25,701 --> 00:25:27,621
It was the women who pinned me down.
426
00:25:27,781 --> 00:25:30,381
It was the women who scarred me.
427
00:25:30,541 --> 00:25:33,261
It was the women
who did the manipulation.
428
00:25:34,341 --> 00:25:36,261
But it was under direction of a man.
429
00:25:36,421 --> 00:25:38,941
And it was all for, in my opinion,
a man's pleasure.
430
00:25:40,461 --> 00:25:43,381
I didn't really recognize how much
431
00:25:43,541 --> 00:25:48,821
that was a massive assault on me
emotionally and physically.
432
00:25:48,981 --> 00:25:51,541
And I just felt compelled
to share it.
433
00:25:52,741 --> 00:25:56,541
And these women feel
it's a beautiful, noble attempt
434
00:25:56,701 --> 00:25:59,701
to teach women strength
and to teach women empowerment,
435
00:25:59,861 --> 00:26:02,061
to be the type of women
that they could be,
436
00:26:02,221 --> 00:26:04,141
and I'm fucking that up for them.
437
00:26:05,301 --> 00:26:07,741
THE BAY AREA
438
00:26:10,541 --> 00:26:12,261
This was from Keith.
"Happy birthday.
439
00:26:12,421 --> 00:26:15,741
Dance like no one's watching you.
Sing like no one can hear you.
440
00:26:15,901 --> 00:26:18,061
Love like you've
never been hurt before
441
00:26:18,221 --> 00:26:20,341
and live like it's heaven on earth."
442
00:26:20,501 --> 00:26:22,981
And he wrote, "I just think of you
every time I read this.
443
00:26:23,141 --> 00:26:25,341
I love you, Keith."
444
00:26:27,181 --> 00:26:28,581
There's a lot of people think
445
00:26:28,741 --> 00:26:33,061
there's nothing wrong with multiple
consenting sexual relationships.
446
00:26:33,221 --> 00:26:35,661
And these women bought
into that concept,
447
00:26:35,821 --> 00:26:39,421
and also the concept that it was
the way to evolve your soul.
448
00:26:41,341 --> 00:26:43,661
I just had a problem with it all.
449
00:26:44,741 --> 00:26:47,221
We have an amazing show.
450
00:26:47,381 --> 00:26:50,381
So, once I found out
about some of the other women,
451
00:26:50,541 --> 00:26:52,421
Keith stopped talking to me
452
00:26:52,581 --> 00:26:56,501
until the inner circle
all met with me for three days.
453
00:26:57,661 --> 00:27:01,661
You know, "Keith is your soulmate.
What's the big deal?
454
00:27:01,821 --> 00:27:03,821
It makes you really angry and jealous.
455
00:27:03,981 --> 00:27:07,901
Wouldn't you rather not have
those feelings anymore?"
456
00:27:09,061 --> 00:27:13,901
And I did love Keith, and I wanted
to get through my issues.
457
00:27:14,061 --> 00:27:16,181
I didn't like feeling jealous.
458
00:27:16,341 --> 00:27:19,701
I didn't like feeling angry.
I felt out of control.
459
00:27:21,101 --> 00:27:25,701
I gave it the Girl Scout try
to not be so attached to the penis.
460
00:27:26,981 --> 00:27:30,741
But any time Keith and I had
a disagreement or an argument,
461
00:27:30,901 --> 00:27:33,861
he'd hang up,
and then I'd get the phone call
462
00:27:34,021 --> 00:27:38,061
within five minutes
from one of those other women.
463
00:27:38,221 --> 00:27:41,101
"Keith says that you're blaming him.
464
00:27:42,301 --> 00:27:45,621
He's flat out on the couch.
You wiped him out.
465
00:27:46,701 --> 00:27:48,421
Keith is not going to talk to you
466
00:27:48,581 --> 00:27:50,541
until we work
through this issue with you,
467
00:27:50,701 --> 00:27:52,581
and we give you
the green light."
468
00:27:55,181 --> 00:27:57,981
They made me think
that I was just crazy.
469
00:28:00,461 --> 00:28:02,181
That went on for years.
470
00:28:02,341 --> 00:28:09,301
I remember one time they came in 60
days in a row, groups, to mentor me.
471
00:28:09,461 --> 00:28:11,541
So, what is blame?
472
00:28:12,821 --> 00:28:14,541
An excuse.
473
00:28:14,701 --> 00:28:17,501
- A way to be right.- A way to be right.
474
00:28:17,661 --> 00:28:19,661
Not taking responsibility.
475
00:28:21,061 --> 00:28:23,541
- Being a victim.- Being a victim.
476
00:28:28,421 --> 00:28:32,101
NXIVM released a statement sayingthey firmly oppose violence and abuse.
477
00:28:32,261 --> 00:28:34,861
They also saythe allegations are unfounded.
478
00:28:38,981 --> 00:28:40,941
I'm looking at India's Facebook.
479
00:28:41,101 --> 00:28:45,821
Okay, so she posted
the official NXIVM statement.
480
00:28:47,741 --> 00:28:50,021
MIGHT BE A CRIMINAL PRODUCT
OF CRIMINAL MINDS
481
00:28:50,181 --> 00:28:53,421
She says, "For anyone who's read the
recent articles in the New York Times,
482
00:28:53,581 --> 00:28:55,901
this may help answer some questions
and alleviate any confusion."
483
00:28:56,061 --> 00:28:57,741
Which it doesn't,
it doesn't address anything.
484
00:28:57,901 --> 00:29:00,421
It makes us even more confused.
"Thank you for your care and concern,
485
00:29:00,581 --> 00:29:03,581
it's been an incredibly sad situation
and I've anticipated this article.
486
00:29:03,741 --> 00:29:05,661
I'm absolutely fine.
Great, actually.
487
00:29:05,821 --> 00:29:08,421
I would never put myself, or
the people I love into any danger.
488
00:29:08,581 --> 00:29:10,141
These are my friends and colleagues.
489
00:29:10,301 --> 00:29:12,341
I've never seen anything
but good come out of this work.
490
00:29:12,501 --> 00:29:13,821
Please share if you feel compelled
491
00:29:13,981 --> 00:29:16,541
to let people
know what's really going on. India."
492
00:29:18,501 --> 00:29:20,061
- Did she write that?
- I doubt it.
493
00:29:20,221 --> 00:29:23,461
They probably had a work session
where they all wrote it together.
494
00:29:23,621 --> 00:29:26,021
I think she has people pushing her.
495
00:29:26,181 --> 00:29:30,461
I mean... This is so hard.
Oh my God.
496
00:29:32,381 --> 00:29:35,421
So, this woman says, "I don't know you
as a woman and sister,
497
00:29:35,581 --> 00:29:37,421
but I'm compelled to write to you.
498
00:29:37,581 --> 00:29:41,181
We live in intense and confusing
times and we've all a drive to feel
499
00:29:41,341 --> 00:29:45,221
that we play a meaningful part
in this mysterious life.
500
00:29:45,381 --> 00:29:47,061
Being without meaning can be scary,
501
00:29:47,221 --> 00:29:50,021
not knowing how to navigate this life
can be scary.
502
00:29:50,181 --> 00:29:53,381
But maybe ask yourself,
what exactly are you so invested in,
503
00:29:53,541 --> 00:29:56,061
guarding, hiding,
keeping in the shadows?"
504
00:29:57,181 --> 00:29:59,781
THE BAY AREA
505
00:29:59,941 --> 00:30:01,261
Come on...
506
00:30:03,621 --> 00:30:07,021
Before I quit, I broke up with Keith
507
00:30:07,181 --> 00:30:10,301
and then we needed to figure out how
I could work within the organization,
508
00:30:10,461 --> 00:30:12,581
which I still thought
had a lot of good,
509
00:30:12,741 --> 00:30:16,261
where Keith and I had
a platonic relationship.
510
00:30:16,421 --> 00:30:19,341
Well, Keith stopped talking to me.
511
00:30:19,501 --> 00:30:22,301
And you cannot be a high-ranking
person in an organization
512
00:30:22,461 --> 00:30:25,221
where the leader
is not talking to you.
513
00:30:25,381 --> 00:30:29,181
And then Keith and the inner circle,
secretly told people
514
00:30:29,341 --> 00:30:32,661
that the reason they saw me
distressed and emotional
515
00:30:32,821 --> 00:30:36,461
was because my soul
had an ethical breach.
516
00:30:37,581 --> 00:30:40,061
They actually told people
I was going crazy.
517
00:30:40,221 --> 00:30:44,621
And nobody told anybody that
I had had a relationship with Keith.
518
00:30:44,781 --> 00:30:47,341
And that it was all
because I broke up with him.
519
00:30:48,981 --> 00:30:50,501
How dare I?
520
00:30:52,301 --> 00:30:54,781
I was just waiting to talk to youbefore I left.
521
00:30:54,941 --> 00:30:56,821
NEW YEAR'S FORUM
522
00:30:56,981 --> 00:30:59,941
By using sex and intimacy
with women,
523
00:31:00,101 --> 00:31:02,941
it allowed him
to then unduly influence them
524
00:31:03,101 --> 00:31:05,221
and gain more control and power.
525
00:31:06,701 --> 00:31:09,621
Keith's role,
not having an intimate relationship
526
00:31:09,781 --> 00:31:13,741
with someone key in the organization
was the kiss of death for him.
527
00:31:19,381 --> 00:31:22,541
He's losing control of me, fast.
528
00:31:24,501 --> 00:31:27,621
I had about 40 NXIVM coaches
and proctors,
529
00:31:27,781 --> 00:31:30,741
who confided in me issues
with leadership and hierarchy.
530
00:31:30,901 --> 00:31:32,981
And I was gaining momentum
with this.
531
00:31:33,141 --> 00:31:35,581
- What is this?- This is my V meter.
532
00:31:37,221 --> 00:31:40,421
It tells you how close you areto being fulling integrated.
533
00:31:40,581 --> 00:31:43,861
One of them was Susan Dones,
who ran the center in Seattle.
534
00:31:44,021 --> 00:31:48,341
Two 16 days, four level twosand about 500 EM's.
535
00:31:54,101 --> 00:31:56,061
It's like I had one foot in
and one foot out.
536
00:31:56,221 --> 00:31:59,741
What's the difference between100% honesty and 100% disclosure?
537
00:31:59,901 --> 00:32:01,701
What's the difference between those?
538
00:32:01,861 --> 00:32:04,981
For me honesty is truthand disclosure is information.
539
00:32:05,141 --> 00:32:07,901
You can't have 100% disclosurewith 100% honesty,
540
00:32:08,061 --> 00:32:11,701
but you do not have to have100% disclosure to have honesty.
541
00:32:11,861 --> 00:32:15,941
And I spent hardly any time at all
with Keith Raniere,
542
00:32:16,101 --> 00:32:20,981
but I didn't like the whole
guru-y kind of thing with him.
543
00:32:21,141 --> 00:32:23,501
So back to the whole thingabout titles.
544
00:32:23,661 --> 00:32:28,541
So, we all got together, and Vanguardgot the highest number of votes.
545
00:32:28,701 --> 00:32:31,421
And I didn't wantto be called master.
546
00:32:32,461 --> 00:32:36,061
I asked Barbara, I said,
"Why is Keith not talking to you?"
547
00:32:36,221 --> 00:32:40,581
And she said, "I can assure you
that I haven't done anything bad,
548
00:32:40,741 --> 00:32:45,821
but I can't talk to you about
why Keith and I aren't talking."
549
00:32:45,981 --> 00:32:49,421
And so then, I shared with her
that I was thinking of leaving
550
00:32:49,581 --> 00:32:51,341
and she said, "Don't leave yet.
551
00:32:51,501 --> 00:32:53,821
Come back to Albany.
And let's talk."
552
00:32:53,981 --> 00:32:59,461
And I held a forum at my home
to discuss the issues of NXIVM,
553
00:32:59,621 --> 00:33:02,261
with the intent to address
and confront Keith.
554
00:33:02,421 --> 00:33:07,381
And that's when I found out the
board consisted of all the women
555
00:33:07,541 --> 00:33:09,541
Keith had been sleeping with.
556
00:33:12,461 --> 00:33:16,861
And there were nine strong women
who wanted to confront him.
557
00:33:17,021 --> 00:33:19,181
Who wants to start?
558
00:33:20,061 --> 00:33:23,101
I can begin by sharing that
559
00:33:23,261 --> 00:33:27,381
each person here in this roomhas conveyed with me the work
560
00:33:27,541 --> 00:33:30,901
that we do and how essentialit is to their lives.
561
00:33:32,061 --> 00:33:36,581
Okay, so the first issueis the control strategies.
562
00:33:36,741 --> 00:33:41,941
There's a conflict of interestcaused by intimacy and secrecy,
563
00:33:42,101 --> 00:33:44,701
that perpetuatesa circle of people close to you
564
00:33:44,861 --> 00:33:46,781
that do not question your authority.
565
00:33:46,941 --> 00:33:48,381
And I don't knowif you want to address this,
566
00:33:48,541 --> 00:33:50,901
or if you want meto just go ahead...
567
00:33:52,221 --> 00:33:55,661
Not only that, but there'snothing to address per se.
568
00:33:55,821 --> 00:33:59,781
It is true for you. So therefore,it is true to some degree.
569
00:34:00,661 --> 00:34:03,901
Because it's a partof our transparency issue.
570
00:34:04,061 --> 00:34:08,101
Transparency doesn't mean everythingis seen by everyone at all times.
571
00:34:10,581 --> 00:34:14,301
What you present to the communityis very scientific.
572
00:34:14,461 --> 00:34:16,981
However,you have often times told me
573
00:34:17,141 --> 00:34:20,861
that should I haveemotional reactions that's negative,
574
00:34:21,021 --> 00:34:25,261
that I am altering your healthin some form or fashion.
575
00:34:25,421 --> 00:34:28,781
That's a half-truth for me. But...
576
00:34:30,421 --> 00:34:34,621
I will state that I don't necessarilybelieve, or not believe in mysticism.
577
00:34:37,021 --> 00:34:39,541
I think you've given usall the tools.
578
00:34:39,701 --> 00:34:41,381
I believe I have.
579
00:34:41,541 --> 00:34:43,861
But I think the toolsget used against us.
580
00:34:45,701 --> 00:34:48,061
It was like,
"Oh my gosh, I'm in a cult."
581
00:34:49,621 --> 00:34:52,701
The nine of us after 11 hours
with Keith all resigned.
582
00:34:52,861 --> 00:34:56,781
I shut my center down
and I told the people I trusted.
583
00:34:56,941 --> 00:34:59,981
And then we wrote
our resignation letter,
584
00:35:01,581 --> 00:35:04,581
asking for money
that we believed that was owed to us.
585
00:35:04,741 --> 00:35:07,461
Some were commissions,
some were trainer fees.
586
00:35:07,621 --> 00:35:10,541
I asked for the value
of what I believe my center was.
587
00:35:10,701 --> 00:35:15,341
Keith and Nancy
personally owed me $1.6 million.
588
00:35:15,501 --> 00:35:18,101
And so, we wrote,
"If these requests are not met,
589
00:35:18,261 --> 00:35:21,181
we're going to move forward
by contacting the press."
590
00:35:22,421 --> 00:35:25,341
BY CONTACTING THE PRESS
591
00:35:25,501 --> 00:35:28,341
Thank you. Please be seated.
592
00:35:29,581 --> 00:35:32,381
Am I sitting here? Okay.I almost sat on the table.
593
00:35:33,861 --> 00:35:38,181
So, I'm here to give you...It's sort of a mixed thing.
594
00:35:40,981 --> 00:35:42,901
I had a series of meetings.
595
00:35:43,061 --> 00:35:46,461
The meetings were to give mefeedback on myself,
596
00:35:46,621 --> 00:35:49,741
on the organization,on a number of different things.
597
00:35:49,901 --> 00:35:51,741
And all the feedback's validby the way.
598
00:35:51,901 --> 00:35:54,541
Now the long and the short of it is,
599
00:35:54,701 --> 00:35:56,261
I think there are a group of people
600
00:35:56,421 --> 00:35:58,541
who are probablygoing to leave our community.
601
00:35:59,901 --> 00:36:02,301
It is believed in this group,
602
00:36:02,461 --> 00:36:07,141
that I have a group of intimaterelationships, some sexual, some not.
603
00:36:07,301 --> 00:36:10,101
And they saythis intimacy is a control strategy.
604
00:36:10,261 --> 00:36:13,301
Well, clearly is.I have to be able to trust them.
605
00:36:13,461 --> 00:36:15,421
And there are thingsthat are secret.
606
00:36:15,581 --> 00:36:19,021
I believe in strategic secret,especially when I believe
607
00:36:19,181 --> 00:36:21,261
that there arepeople with bad intent.
608
00:36:21,421 --> 00:36:25,461
And I do believethat a very, very small minority
609
00:36:25,621 --> 00:36:28,981
in this groupmay not be well-intentioned.
610
00:36:29,141 --> 00:36:32,501
And in a specific case,
611
00:36:32,661 --> 00:36:35,741
there is a personal issuethat I have with one of them.
612
00:36:35,901 --> 00:36:37,901
And I've worked to try to fix it,worked to try to fix it,
613
00:36:38,061 --> 00:36:41,021
to the best of my ability,and I failed.
614
00:36:41,181 --> 00:36:42,821
Where did it cross the line?
615
00:36:42,981 --> 00:36:46,061
It crossed the line whenthe executive board get a letter.
616
00:36:46,221 --> 00:36:49,861
And essentially the letter says,"We want..."
617
00:36:50,021 --> 00:36:52,861
Works out to over $2 million.
618
00:36:53,021 --> 00:36:56,741
"And if you don't give us,coming up this Thursday,
619
00:36:56,901 --> 00:37:00,901
a certified check for the $2 million,we're going to the press."
620
00:37:01,941 --> 00:37:06,781
This is extortion.So, we are filing criminal charges.
621
00:37:06,941 --> 00:37:09,501
It's already in process.
622
00:37:12,261 --> 00:37:16,261
This is very difficult for me, becausethese are people I care about.
623
00:37:16,421 --> 00:37:18,621
And people I've knowna very long time.
624
00:37:19,661 --> 00:37:22,381
I just wanted to ask, how are you?
625
00:37:26,221 --> 00:37:29,261
In some ways it's a death,in some ways it's a birth,
626
00:37:29,421 --> 00:37:31,701
and in some ways it's a relief.
627
00:37:31,861 --> 00:37:35,461
I hate to say that, but there...A physical relief.
628
00:37:35,621 --> 00:37:39,141
I can divert my attention, my focus,
629
00:37:39,301 --> 00:37:42,181
even my physical beingto some other things now.
630
00:37:45,421 --> 00:37:49,501
I have a beautiful picture in here
of the two of them. Let me find it.
631
00:37:51,221 --> 00:37:53,981
That's Sara and Clare Bronfman.
632
00:37:54,141 --> 00:37:59,621
In 2005, Keith convinced me
to become a financial planner.
633
00:37:59,781 --> 00:38:01,701
I left April 2009.
634
00:38:01,861 --> 00:38:06,021
And then what happened is Clare
Bronfman went to the Saratoga DA,
635
00:38:06,181 --> 00:38:09,261
to tell them that her financial
planner, Barbara Bouchey,
636
00:38:09,421 --> 00:38:13,061
had an ethical violation with her,
and she fired her because of it.
637
00:38:13,221 --> 00:38:16,421
And that Barbara Bouchey,
in revenge and spite,
638
00:38:16,581 --> 00:38:20,301
tried to extort $2 million from her
and blackmail her.
639
00:38:20,461 --> 00:38:23,541
They used the resignation letter.
640
00:38:24,861 --> 00:38:30,101
I had a knock on my door, and
I was being served legal documents
641
00:38:30,261 --> 00:38:33,341
that said that Keith Raniere,
NXIVM and the Bronfman's
642
00:38:33,501 --> 00:38:37,381
were going to bring civil
and criminal charges against me.
643
00:38:40,421 --> 00:38:43,381
How did they take people
who should have known me
644
00:38:43,541 --> 00:38:47,581
and experienced me?
And how did they twist it?
645
00:38:49,461 --> 00:38:51,141
We're winning, right?
646
00:38:51,301 --> 00:38:53,221
- No.- Not yet.
647
00:38:58,421 --> 00:39:01,861
Edgar Bronfman wasa pussy cat compared to you.
648
00:39:02,021 --> 00:39:06,501
I mean he just basically sat backin his Fifth Avenue apartment
649
00:39:06,661 --> 00:39:08,661
and just licked his wounds.
650
00:39:08,821 --> 00:39:11,581
Thank you so much, Rick.
All right. Bye-bye.
651
00:39:13,141 --> 00:39:15,541
- Who is Rick Ross?
- He is a cult expert.
652
00:39:15,701 --> 00:39:18,501
And he knows Keith intimately,
653
00:39:18,661 --> 00:39:22,061
because they kept him in litigation
for about 15 years.
654
00:39:22,221 --> 00:39:24,621
He's been helping me all along.
655
00:39:26,781 --> 00:39:28,301
- Hey Rick.
- Hi.
656
00:39:28,461 --> 00:39:31,221
So, this is Stanley.
This is Rick Ross.
657
00:39:31,381 --> 00:39:34,461
Stanley has been a friend of mine
since I was 18.
658
00:39:34,621 --> 00:39:38,781
And India actually, so she just
texted me for the first time,
659
00:39:38,941 --> 00:39:43,981
since the New York Times article.
So, this is what she says,
660
00:39:44,141 --> 00:39:46,341
"Mom, I love you. But I don't agree
with your approach
661
00:39:46,501 --> 00:39:48,861
publicly shaming me
and people I care for.
662
00:39:50,661 --> 00:39:53,501
That's not very considerate
of our private relationship.
663
00:39:53,661 --> 00:39:56,061
I've been cautious about
our communication and don't think
664
00:39:56,221 --> 00:40:00,021
the people you're working with
have your, or mine best interests."
665
00:40:01,341 --> 00:40:06,421
That kind of verbiage to me
it's like, "It's all your fault.
666
00:40:06,581 --> 00:40:08,541
NXIVM never does anything wrong.
667
00:40:08,701 --> 00:40:11,021
Keith Raniere
never does anything wrong."
668
00:40:11,181 --> 00:40:13,621
They never have anything to address.
669
00:40:13,781 --> 00:40:15,981
Well, this is
what I was going to say.
670
00:40:16,141 --> 00:40:18,301
"You have every right
to be angry with me.
671
00:40:18,461 --> 00:40:20,581
In spite of that,
I hope you can understand
672
00:40:20,741 --> 00:40:23,621
that I am coming from love.
I'm a mother afraid for her daughter."
673
00:40:23,781 --> 00:40:25,421
Is there anything else
I should change?
674
00:40:25,581 --> 00:40:27,101
That's good. And you can say,
675
00:40:27,261 --> 00:40:29,261
"I respect your right
to make choices.
676
00:40:29,421 --> 00:40:32,261
And I hope
that you can do the same for me."
677
00:40:32,421 --> 00:40:36,621
Except that my choice is to out
her publicly. How do I justify that?
678
00:40:36,781 --> 00:40:38,221
I think you have to be careful,
679
00:40:38,381 --> 00:40:40,621
because once you start
to get into an argument,
680
00:40:40,781 --> 00:40:44,821
there is probably somebody
coaching her on her text.
681
00:40:44,981 --> 00:40:46,621
And this is the training.
682
00:40:46,781 --> 00:40:50,341
So, he determines
the parameters of reality
683
00:40:50,501 --> 00:40:55,101
and the women that are the closest
to him who live in the Albany area
684
00:40:55,261 --> 00:40:58,981
are the most controlled people
in the entire group.
685
00:40:59,141 --> 00:41:02,541
We don't want to admit that that
could happen to someone we love,
686
00:41:02,701 --> 00:41:07,461
but the human mind is much more
fragile than we would like to believe.
687
00:41:07,621 --> 00:41:11,221
We are all subject
to influence techniques.
688
00:41:11,381 --> 00:41:14,941
And anybody,
especially a woman that says,
689
00:41:15,101 --> 00:41:18,941
"I'm done with you, Keith Raniere."
He doesn't like that.
690
00:41:19,101 --> 00:41:23,541
And I've seen people
who he's utterly destroyed their life.
691
00:41:27,301 --> 00:41:30,501
A significant cultural eventfor the Capital Region,
692
00:41:30,661 --> 00:41:34,181
the appearance of the iconicspiritual leader, the Dalai Lama.
693
00:41:34,341 --> 00:41:36,861
The Tibetan Buddhist monkwho won a Nobel Peace Prize
694
00:41:37,021 --> 00:41:39,621
and who has admirers all overthe globe, came to Albany today,
695
00:41:39,781 --> 00:41:42,821
as the result of an invitationfrom the World Ethical Foundation,
696
00:41:42,981 --> 00:41:44,701
which is founded by two sisters,
697
00:41:44,861 --> 00:41:47,501
heiresses ofthe Seagram's Liquor Corporation.
698
00:41:47,661 --> 00:41:49,141
Two weeks after I quit,
699
00:41:49,301 --> 00:41:52,261
the Dalai Lama agreed
to tack on Albany
700
00:41:52,421 --> 00:41:55,701
to his already 23 city tour.
701
00:41:55,861 --> 00:41:57,381
DALAI LAMA
PRIVATE RECEPTION
702
00:41:57,541 --> 00:41:59,981
And then they milked it.
I mean, it was all over their website
703
00:42:00,141 --> 00:42:02,501
and articles went out
and, you know, letters.
704
00:42:07,861 --> 00:42:10,021
In the meantime, behind the scenes,
705
00:42:11,021 --> 00:42:13,501
my whole criminal case was going on.
706
00:42:14,341 --> 00:42:18,101
The Bronfman's and Keith
had already networked locally
707
00:42:18,261 --> 00:42:20,221
with many prominent law firms.
708
00:42:20,381 --> 00:42:23,861
The name carried weight,
and I couldn't find an attorney.
709
00:42:26,101 --> 00:42:28,301
Who do you think
wants to represent me?
710
00:42:32,581 --> 00:42:34,421
Well, sometimesthere are some people that come
711
00:42:34,581 --> 00:42:36,981
that seem to have bad intent,
712
00:42:37,141 --> 00:42:41,661
but I never want to believe that.
713
00:42:41,821 --> 00:42:46,301
At what pointdo you take action, definitively?
714
00:42:47,581 --> 00:42:49,501
I mean bad motivation.
715
00:42:50,901 --> 00:42:52,341
Truly.
716
00:42:53,381 --> 00:42:58,421
That sometimes it's necessaryto take appropriate measure.
717
00:42:59,941 --> 00:43:04,301
Without self-centered,sort of egotistic sort of feeling.
718
00:43:04,461 --> 00:43:07,541
I get more sort of the fame,
719
00:43:07,701 --> 00:43:13,381
or I get some more followers,then that is self-centered attitude.
720
00:43:13,541 --> 00:43:17,341
And also,you all have to judge your Guru.
721
00:43:19,461 --> 00:43:23,261
Don't refer to me as a Guru.I'm not a Guru.
722
00:43:24,261 --> 00:43:25,741
Or teacher then.
723
00:43:29,101 --> 00:43:30,421
Good.
724
00:43:38,981 --> 00:43:42,821
And after that
I have the actual NXIVM announcement.
725
00:43:44,101 --> 00:43:48,221
They announced proudly
that they were improving things,
726
00:43:48,381 --> 00:43:50,501
and they're going
to change the board.
727
00:43:52,421 --> 00:43:55,461
He took all the girlfriends off
728
00:43:55,621 --> 00:43:58,901
and then he put Clare Bronfman,
Emiliano Salinas,
729
00:43:59,061 --> 00:44:01,941
and Mark Vicente on the board.
730
00:44:02,101 --> 00:44:03,581
That's what I'm talking about.
731
00:44:03,741 --> 00:44:05,901
They kinda pulled Mark into the fold.
732
00:44:06,061 --> 00:44:08,821
The person who was my field traineroriginally Mark's field trainer
733
00:44:08,981 --> 00:44:10,501
is no longer in the company.
734
00:44:11,901 --> 00:44:13,421
So now in the meantime,
735
00:44:13,581 --> 00:44:16,741
they lost Seattle
because of Susan Dones quitting.
736
00:44:16,901 --> 00:44:18,861
And you had
all those people in Vancouver
737
00:44:19,021 --> 00:44:21,701
that used to sometimes go down
to Seattle for some classes.
738
00:44:21,861 --> 00:44:24,181
And one thing, I was goingto say speaking of EM's...
739
00:44:24,341 --> 00:44:26,141
So, Mark and Sarah, Keith and Nancy,
740
00:44:26,301 --> 00:44:30,101
very strategically took
a stronger interest in them.
741
00:44:33,421 --> 00:44:36,181
We are going downstairs,
742
00:44:36,341 --> 00:44:38,741
the front which has a reception.
743
00:44:38,901 --> 00:44:41,021
This would belike a study hall, whiteboard.
744
00:44:41,181 --> 00:44:44,261
And they got to open
the center in Vancouver.
745
00:44:47,021 --> 00:44:51,981
You could say from image to
financial, they got lots of benefits.
746
00:44:54,261 --> 00:44:56,181
And as this went on,
the Bronfmans started accusing me
747
00:44:56,341 --> 00:44:57,701
of more accusations.
748
00:44:57,861 --> 00:45:00,261
I stole their money,
I misappropriated.
749
00:45:00,421 --> 00:45:02,901
They were bombarding the court.
750
00:45:04,141 --> 00:45:08,021
They said that, you know, I had done
all of these crimes against them.
751
00:45:08,181 --> 00:45:10,301
And so, I had to defend all of those.
752
00:45:13,021 --> 00:45:16,181
I think there was 360 court filings
753
00:45:16,341 --> 00:45:20,781
filed in that 10-month
period of time. 360.
754
00:45:21,781 --> 00:45:23,821
And I couldn't work during that time,
755
00:45:23,981 --> 00:45:26,501
because I had
to constantly write motions
756
00:45:26,661 --> 00:45:29,101
and go to hearings
and that kind of stuff.
757
00:45:29,261 --> 00:45:31,621
SUSAN DONES
BANKRUPTCY DEPOSITION
758
00:45:31,781 --> 00:45:33,821
I'm sorry.
759
00:45:33,981 --> 00:45:38,221
I am a weekend DJ because it fitsinto my lifestyle right now.
760
00:45:38,381 --> 00:45:42,821
The lifestyle of having to learnhow to defend myself against them.
761
00:45:44,621 --> 00:45:49,461
I was broke.
I didn't have $20 in my pocket.
762
00:45:49,621 --> 00:45:54,901
I was shuffling between being able
to buy food, or pay my lawyers.
763
00:45:55,061 --> 00:45:59,581
I think it was like 2011, myself
and a couple other people I know,
764
00:45:59,741 --> 00:46:03,381
talked to the New York State
Attorney General.
765
00:46:03,541 --> 00:46:07,261
And we were asked to turn over
lots of documents to them.
766
00:46:07,421 --> 00:46:09,501
And finally, they said,
"Stop sending us stuff."
767
00:46:09,661 --> 00:46:12,021
And we thought, "Okay,
they have enough information."
768
00:46:12,181 --> 00:46:14,541
Nothing ever happened.
769
00:46:14,701 --> 00:46:17,181
Nothing ever happened.
770
00:46:17,341 --> 00:46:19,941
And the attitude was,
"Well Ms. Bouchey,
771
00:46:20,101 --> 00:46:22,941
aren't you and Keith just bickering
like in a bad divorce?
772
00:46:23,101 --> 00:46:26,661
And really this is
just probably just a big fight
773
00:46:26,821 --> 00:46:29,101
and we've got
bigger fish to fry."
774
00:46:30,301 --> 00:46:34,461
I am terrified every timethe doorbell rings, the phone rings.
775
00:46:34,621 --> 00:46:36,541
Every time I open up my email,
776
00:46:36,701 --> 00:46:40,101
that it is another voluminous filing.
777
00:46:40,261 --> 00:46:46,461
Groups that litigate like this candrag out these lawsuits for years,
778
00:46:46,621 --> 00:46:50,861
hoping to exhaust you and drain you
779
00:46:51,021 --> 00:46:53,821
and ultimately to gag you.
780
00:46:56,341 --> 00:47:00,621
It took me seven years to pay off
the $700,000 in legal debt.
781
00:47:00,781 --> 00:47:04,501
I finally was able to move here
and rebuild my life.
782
00:47:07,821 --> 00:47:12,621
I am totally out.I mean, and I am out in a big way.
783
00:47:12,781 --> 00:47:17,781
In February of 2014,
Kristin Keeffe quit NXIVM and left.
784
00:47:18,981 --> 00:47:21,221
And I was the first person
she called.
785
00:47:23,621 --> 00:47:26,941
Are you safe, though?Are you okay?
786
00:47:28,301 --> 00:47:30,421
Well, I think so.
787
00:47:34,021 --> 00:47:36,181
You weren't scared to call me?
788
00:47:37,221 --> 00:47:39,661
- No.
- Why?
789
00:47:39,821 --> 00:47:42,781
Because I know the truth.
790
00:47:42,941 --> 00:47:45,741
You know Barb,he was undermining you
791
00:47:45,901 --> 00:47:48,301
behind your back the whole time.
792
00:47:48,461 --> 00:47:51,341
He undermined you to all of us.
793
00:47:51,501 --> 00:47:56,581
He lured you in, just seduced you,
794
00:47:56,741 --> 00:47:59,301
to get his company off the ground.
795
00:48:00,461 --> 00:48:02,141
Then he used your business
796
00:48:02,301 --> 00:48:05,061
to get complete financial controlof the Bronfmans.
797
00:48:05,221 --> 00:48:09,461
And then, he blew things upwith you, I think deliberately.
798
00:48:11,181 --> 00:48:16,861
He used them to get youto break yourself psychologically.
799
00:48:17,021 --> 00:48:19,901
And I never saw you do anything
800
00:48:20,061 --> 00:48:23,781
that I ever thought waseven remotely questionable.
801
00:48:33,021 --> 00:48:35,261
He could have been great.
802
00:48:37,821 --> 00:48:39,981
There was so much potential.
803
00:48:40,141 --> 00:48:43,181
And he did do
a lot of great, good things
804
00:48:43,341 --> 00:48:47,621
and did help thousands of people,
including me.
805
00:49:00,261 --> 00:49:05,941
It's unfortunate
that his addictions and flaws
806
00:49:06,101 --> 00:49:09,581
destroyed his own consciousness,
807
00:49:09,741 --> 00:49:12,621
and that, I forgive him.
808
00:49:14,781 --> 00:49:17,501
But I want to say to him,
809
00:49:17,661 --> 00:49:21,381
"You belong in jail
for the rest of your life."
810
00:49:23,301 --> 00:49:28,061
You know, I don't begrudge anybody,
anything, and I don't feel bitter.
811
00:49:29,221 --> 00:49:33,301
I totally get how each one of you
812
00:49:33,461 --> 00:49:37,621
at a young age was influenced.
813
00:49:38,781 --> 00:49:42,661
It's like he's moving out the oldand he's bringing in the new.
814
00:49:46,141 --> 00:49:49,301
Like, a whole new groupof women, young.
815
00:49:55,461 --> 00:49:59,821
We're headed to
a 30 Rock, 30 Rockefeller Plaza
816
00:49:59,981 --> 00:50:02,501
to do the Megyn Kelly Show.
817
00:50:02,661 --> 00:50:04,861
Everything that I'm doing right now
is targeted
818
00:50:05,021 --> 00:50:08,101
to pressure the authorities
to start to the right thing.
819
00:50:09,821 --> 00:50:12,941
My daughter, she said,
I made her look like a lunatic.
820
00:50:13,101 --> 00:50:14,461
How did you feel
when you heard that?
821
00:50:14,621 --> 00:50:18,221
Sad. I mean, because...
I mean, this is the thing
822
00:50:18,381 --> 00:50:20,381
and this I want
to get across on the show.
823
00:50:20,541 --> 00:50:22,541
there are times in one's life
as a parent
824
00:50:22,701 --> 00:50:26,501
where my child's safety comes first.
825
00:50:26,661 --> 00:50:30,621
And her safety is more important
than her liking me right now.
826
00:50:30,781 --> 00:50:34,421
And that's a price I have to pay.
And it's a big price, as a parent.
827
00:50:39,581 --> 00:50:41,781
Several of the women
went to the authorities
828
00:50:41,941 --> 00:50:43,661
and the authorities
dismissed their claims.
829
00:50:43,821 --> 00:50:46,421
They said, if a woman consents
there's nothing they can do.
830
00:50:46,581 --> 00:50:50,181
I'd like to counter that because
to me, brainwashing is not consent.
831
00:50:50,341 --> 00:50:52,421
Blackmail is not consent.
832
00:50:53,821 --> 00:50:55,741
So, what do you do now?
833
00:50:55,901 --> 00:50:59,581
Well, this is my last resort going
to the media to bring awareness,
834
00:50:59,741 --> 00:51:02,141
because without awareness,
there can be no outrage.
835
00:51:02,301 --> 00:51:04,781
And unless there's outrage, the
authorities are not going to step in
836
00:51:04,941 --> 00:51:06,261
and do what they should do,
837
00:51:06,421 --> 00:51:09,341
which is shut this down,
and stop this from happening.
838
00:51:12,221 --> 00:51:14,901
The fact that they had
all the pictures of us,
839
00:51:15,061 --> 00:51:17,941
like that was really hard.
840
00:51:19,901 --> 00:51:21,661
I felt that I failed her.
841
00:51:39,061 --> 00:51:40,381
Hi, Barb.
842
00:51:40,541 --> 00:51:43,301
So, going after them criminallywould be number one.
843
00:51:43,461 --> 00:51:45,061
And I can be in the background,
844
00:51:45,221 --> 00:51:48,701
providing knowledge,information and evidence.
845
00:51:48,861 --> 00:51:51,101
Because I'm not safeuntil he's stopped.
846
00:51:51,261 --> 00:51:54,381
- Okay. Big hugs. Okay.
- Big hugs.
847
00:51:54,541 --> 00:51:56,581
- Love you honey, bye-bye.
- Bye.
848
00:52:01,701 --> 00:52:03,181
What the...
849
00:52:04,181 --> 00:52:08,421
In 2009, when Barbara Bouchey, left
and everybody left, I got a promotion.
850
00:52:10,301 --> 00:52:12,861
I believed the lies about them.
851
00:52:15,501 --> 00:52:17,461
- Are you a victim?
- Yeah.
852
00:52:17,621 --> 00:52:20,221
I mean, I'm a victim
in terms of a victim of a con.
853
00:52:20,381 --> 00:52:22,021
But I definitely had made choices,
854
00:52:22,181 --> 00:52:24,341
I definitely have
a lots of responsibility
855
00:52:24,501 --> 00:52:26,381
in many bad things that happened,
856
00:52:26,541 --> 00:52:30,421
but it's not black and white,
you're not one or the other.
857
00:52:30,581 --> 00:52:33,021
- Let's have a pillow fight.
- You want to have a pillow fight?
858
00:52:33,181 --> 00:52:34,501
- Yeah.
- Okay.
859
00:52:41,381 --> 00:52:45,381
There is a big huge monster coming.
860
00:52:46,421 --> 00:52:48,541
Let me come in with you,
861
00:52:48,701 --> 00:52:51,101
because I'm going to get eaten too.
862
00:52:51,261 --> 00:52:53,421
Get the pillows. Get the pillows.
863
00:52:53,581 --> 00:52:56,221
- Oh no.
- Get the pillows.
864
00:52:56,381 --> 00:52:59,741
I got you, and we're safe in here.
You're safe.
865
00:52:59,901 --> 00:53:06,461
Yay, thank you. This is the wonderfuland amazing goddess, India.
866
00:53:11,221 --> 00:53:13,301
Oh my God,
it's the Attorney General!
867
00:53:13,461 --> 00:53:17,101
Oh my God.
I'm speechless. Holy shit.
868
00:53:17,901 --> 00:53:20,141
One of the parents
of a girl who escaped
869
00:53:20,301 --> 00:53:22,661
has been in touch
with the Chief Investigator
870
00:53:22,821 --> 00:53:27,021
in Eric Schneiderman's office
and he's ready to talk to me.
871
00:53:27,181 --> 00:53:29,741
Oh my God. Oh my God.
872
00:53:30,901 --> 00:53:34,461
Out on the streetsOf Mary Sally old road
873
00:53:34,621 --> 00:53:38,141
Can't get me outUnless you use a shoe horn
874
00:53:38,301 --> 00:53:42,061
Eve of destructionBut you still talking free trade
875
00:53:42,221 --> 00:53:45,181
You give me lemonsAnd I'll make lemonade
876
00:53:45,341 --> 00:53:48,061
So I pray
877
00:53:49,061 --> 00:53:52,141
Though I'm tired
878
00:53:52,301 --> 00:53:56,181
Well this can't wait
879
00:53:56,341 --> 00:53:59,021
So we fight
880
00:54:01,661 --> 00:54:04,981
They say you earn a pennyEach one you save
881
00:54:05,141 --> 00:54:08,861
Easy to save itWhen you don't need a dang thing
882
00:54:09,021 --> 00:54:12,661
Freedom and justiceWell they ain't your play thing
883
00:54:12,821 --> 00:54:16,381
Prop up your puppetsAnd you kill the real kings
884
00:54:16,541 --> 00:54:19,461
So I pray
885
00:54:19,621 --> 00:54:21,621
Though I'm tired
886
00:54:21,781 --> 00:54:23,261
So tired
887
00:54:23,421 --> 00:54:27,181
Well this can't wait
888
00:54:27,341 --> 00:54:30,301
So we fight
889
00:54:31,661 --> 00:54:35,021
We have to fight Fight
890
00:54:35,181 --> 00:54:38,421
We have to fight Fight
78080
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