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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:07,568 - What are they saying about Bush? - Does he deserve reelection? 2 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:11,048 And here are the numbers. Forty-five percent say yes... 3 00:00:11,280 --> 00:00:13,442 49 percent say no. 4 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:15,768 Democrats, 84 percent say no. 5 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:18,201 Eighty-four percent of Republicans say yes. 6 00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:22,166 Independents, 51 percent now say he does not deserve reelection. 7 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:25,045 - That's a red flag. - And what about for John Kerry? 8 00:00:25,240 --> 00:00:27,049 - Is that good news? - It should be. 9 00:00:27,240 --> 00:00:30,005 Look at John Kerry's numbers, Tom. Positive-negative. 10 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:33,488 Positive 38 percent, negative 38 percent. 11 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:35,927 This thing is still a toss-up. 12 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:48,089 Mr. Hibey will see you now. 13 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:50,565 Thank you. 14 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:52,683 Ms. Mapes. 15 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:55,967 I'm Dick Hibey. What can I do for you? 16 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:58,521 Oh, I think you know. 17 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:01,691 - You knit? - You don't expect a woman like me... 18 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:04,611 - ...to knit? - No. But it's good. It's helpful. 19 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:07,724 Yeah. You mean it blunts my radical feminist agenda. 20 00:01:07,960 --> 00:01:11,885 - Do you have a radical feminist agenda? - You meet a lot of radical leaders? 21 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,041 Do you have a substance abuse problem? 22 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:16,804 I'm working on developing one. 23 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:18,923 - I'm serious. - Oh, so am I. 24 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:21,248 You came to me. If you're not up for this... 25 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:24,922 I've been in news for 20 years. Won two Emmys, broke Abu Ghraib... 26 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:29,045 done jail time for not revealing sources. I have neither a feminist agenda... 27 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:32,369 nor a substance abuse problem. Though I'm gonna take a Xanax... 28 00:01:32,560 --> 00:01:34,722 because this is really freaking me out. 29 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:38,169 Got any water? 30 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:50,210 - Thanks. - You have to be ready... 31 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:53,648 - ...for questions like that. - I'm up for this. 32 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:02,681 There's an interesting recurring theme to the stories you cover. 33 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:05,690 - People abusing their power. - I don't like bullies. 34 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:07,851 Tell me about your work. 35 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:11,681 You wanna know if I'm responsible for what happened. 36 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:14,650 - Aren't you? - Look, I did my job. Believe me. 37 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:16,365 I don't have to believe you. 38 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:20,246 What matters is that they believe you. Now, tell me about your work. 39 00:02:23,920 --> 00:02:26,890 I'm the producer. I find the story. 40 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:30,602 I put the team together. I write and cut the piece. 41 00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:32,848 I work at 60 Minutes. 42 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:34,963 And what's that like? 43 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:38,882 Which one of you ordered the duck? 44 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:40,570 - That would be Tom. - Napkin. 45 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:42,882 - Thank you. Thank you. - Fatso. 46 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:46,408 - They're gonna run it this time? - They're gonna run it. 47 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:50,248 - Because you said that last week. - They're gonna run it, Roger. 48 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:52,801 Hey, you want me to paint it out like this? 49 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:57,642 Oh, Jesus, no, it makes his genitals look like they were attacked by mad cubists. 50 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:01,562 Maybe you could just kind of darken the area. 51 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:03,330 Okay. 52 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:04,727 Like that? 53 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:10,084 Okay, now it just looks like there's a black hole there. 54 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:14,087 - From which no light can escape. - They're really gonna run it? 55 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:15,645 Because Sy Hersh has this... 56 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:18,884 and he's gonna write a story about how we've sat on it. 57 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:23,085 Dana, can you tell Roger they're gonna run it, then hit him for me, will you? 58 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,009 I gotta go grab him. 59 00:03:25,640 --> 00:03:26,880 Can you finish it? 60 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:31,485 He was the first journalist to report John F. Kennedy had been shot. 61 00:03:32,920 --> 00:03:37,721 He described the Zapruder film in detail to a nation... 62 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:40,009 that was not allowed to see it. 63 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:43,609 Became White House correspondent at the age of 33... 64 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:46,167 chief London correspondent a year later... 65 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:50,888 and brought the Vietnam War into American living rooms for the first time. 66 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:55,285 He covered the Russians in Afghanistan, the hostages in Iran... 67 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:59,280 and in 1981, became anchor of the CBS Evening News. 68 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:01,926 He's now anchored more nightly news broadcasts... 69 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,203 than anyone else in U.S. history. 70 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:09,167 That's not bad for the son of a ditch-digger from Wharton, Texas. 71 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:12,607 Ladies and gentlemen, I give you my friend... 72 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:17,090 and the reason I have this job, Dan Rather. 73 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:30,084 Long enough to give us a great market share, I'll tell you. 74 00:04:30,280 --> 00:04:33,807 - It's been a real pleasure. Real pleasure. - Hey, Andrew, I need him. 75 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,805 - Well, you're not taking him. - You say that, but here I am. 76 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:39,122 - You got him? - In a hotel two blocks up. 77 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:42,046 - Let's go. - Dan, you can't leave your own party. 78 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:44,846 - I got 50 affiliates and their wives... - I know. 79 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:47,691 - ...waiting to talk with you. Goddamn it. - I know. 80 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:51,771 - You wanna finish this off? I've had three. - Mary. 81 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:54,287 I'll take that for you, Mr. Heyward. 82 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:55,847 You know? 83 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:59,283 General. This is Dan Rather. 84 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:01,882 - General. - Sir. 85 00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:04,242 Thank you for doing this. 86 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:10,530 Let's start from the beginning. 87 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:29,929 Americans did this to an Iraqi prisoner. 88 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:33,249 According to the Army, the man was told to stand on a box... 89 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:36,324 his head covered with wires attached to his hands. 90 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:40,526 He was told that if he fell off the box, he would be electrocuted. 91 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:42,927 It was this picture and dozens of others... 92 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:45,851 that prompted an investigation by the U.S. Army. 93 00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:48,327 Yesterday, we asked General Mark Kimmitt... 94 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:51,285 deputy director of coalition operations in Iraq... 95 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:52,606 what went wrong. 96 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:55,724 Every day we love our soldiers, but frankly... 97 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,764 some days we're not always proud of our soldiers. 98 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:03,287 The military says six American soldiers have been charged so far... 99 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:05,767 and could be court-martialed. Others higher... 100 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,571 in the chain of command will likely be disciplined. 101 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:12,771 I remember when you used to say "courage" at the end of every broadcast. 102 00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:15,964 - You remember that? - I remember. Do you remember? 103 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:17,685 You must be very old. 104 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,451 - Why'd you stop? - They made fun of him, that's why. 105 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:22,170 - No. - No, they did. 106 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:23,925 - Seriously. Imagine? - Oh, yeah. 107 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:26,088 Go on, give us a "courage," Dan. 108 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:28,368 - No, come on. Mary. - Come on, just one. 109 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:30,005 - For me. - I don't think so. 110 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:32,288 - For me, for me. - Come on. 111 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:33,970 Just a little one. 112 00:06:36,280 --> 00:06:37,327 Cour... 113 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,131 - Come on, please. - Come on. 114 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:43,280 - You really want it? - I want it too, yeah. 115 00:06:43,480 --> 00:06:45,084 Courage. 116 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:50,840 - Well, it worked at one time. - It did. It did. 117 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:55,687 Hey. Here's to a great story. 118 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:57,724 Yeah, once they finally ran it. 119 00:06:57,920 --> 00:06:59,001 - Yeah. - F.E.A. 120 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:01,328 F.E.A. 121 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:06,451 We're sitting here with Mommy. Thank you for being here. 122 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:09,411 No. Thank you for having me. 123 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:12,922 Mommy, you were away for a long time again. 124 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:17,441 - What were you doing? - I was in New York working on the news. 125 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:19,644 And what does that entail? 126 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:23,447 I was asking questions. Questions help reporters get to the truth. 127 00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:26,610 Were you with the men with the cameras? 128 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:29,041 Interesting. 129 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:35,285 - Can I have a new camera, please? - We'll have to talk to your dad about that. 130 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,563 I'm trying to get to the truth here, Mommy. 131 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:40,250 Answer the question. 132 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:42,888 I think this interview is over. 133 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:45,287 - Okay. - Nice try. 134 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:49,521 President Bush said today he was disgusted by pictures of Iraqi prisoners... 135 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:51,887 being abused by American soldiers. 136 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:54,048 Caused a bit of a ruckus, didn't you? 137 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:57,807 Who, me? You didn't let Robbie watch it, did you? 138 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:00,646 Yes, because I'm the worst parent of all time. 139 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,047 ...and the damage to U.S. interests... 140 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:05,891 in the rest of the world is hard to calculate, but.... 141 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:09,601 - You wanna take a walk? - Here's Martha Raddatz. 142 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:12,844 No, I think I have to work. 143 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:18,606 Mary, thanks for coming in. Look, no big preamble. 144 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:21,644 We love you. We love what you've done. It's... 145 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:25,083 Let's talk about the new season. What are you thinking? 146 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:28,170 I might have something for the election. 147 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,565 There's this Houston businessman named Bill White... 148 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:35,401 who claims that he has documents that show the bin Laden family... 149 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:37,250 were investors in Arbusto. 150 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:39,841 Arbusto? Bush's oil company? 151 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:44,244 You know, could just be lots of sound and fury, but Vanity Fair is into it too. 152 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:47,525 You know, that whole time period for Bush is funky. 153 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:48,767 Funky how? 154 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:51,128 Well, I did some work on it back in 2000. 155 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:53,567 - You know Ben Barnes? - No. 156 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:55,848 Oh, he's an old Texas pol. 157 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:59,203 Barnes says when he was the speaker of the Texas House... 158 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:01,323 in '68 during Vietnam... 159 00:09:01,560 --> 00:09:04,484 Sid Adger, this big oilman, comes into his office... 160 00:09:04,680 --> 00:09:06,887 and asks for help getting George Bush... 161 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:09,287 into the National Guard as a pilot. 162 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:12,000 And Poppy Bush at this point is a congressman... 163 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:14,567 and Barnes figures he can use the connections. 164 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:19,368 So he says that he called General Rose, who runs the Texas Air National Guard... 165 00:09:19,560 --> 00:09:21,085 and gets Bush his slot. 166 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:23,086 Barnes told you this? 167 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:26,045 Off the record. He's been dining out on the story for years. 168 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:29,005 I call Buck Staudt, Bush's squadron commander... 169 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:33,489 and he starts screaming at me, saying how Barnes is full of shit... 170 00:09:33,680 --> 00:09:38,208 because everybody knows he's the one who got Bush into the Guard, not Barnes. 171 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:43,122 Anyway, while Bush is in the Guard, he meets this guy named James Bath. 172 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:44,924 And they become running buddies. 173 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:48,886 And after they get out, Bath, with no résumé to speak of... 174 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,401 becomes chief financial representative... 175 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:54,126 for the bin Laden family's interests in Texas. 176 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:57,887 Bush starts up Arbusto, Bath writes him a $50,000 check. 177 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:01,801 Which your guy, White, claims is bin Laden money? 178 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:08,131 Okay. Okay, run it down. 179 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:12,166 But if we go with this, we gotta go early. We can't October surprise them. 180 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:16,251 All right. If you're into this, I'd like to bring in some other people to help. 181 00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:17,965 Who? 182 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:19,730 Colonel Roger Charles. 183 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:24,684 Worked Abu Ghraib for us. Naval Academy grad. 184 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:27,531 Two tours at Vietnam, then the Pentagon. 185 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:32,842 When he's not working for us, he's trying to get better armor for troops in Iraq. 186 00:10:33,560 --> 00:10:34,607 Who else? 187 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:38,600 Well, since Dana's on maternity leave, I'd like Lucy Scott to run point. 188 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:42,282 She's a CBS veteran, journalism professor in Dallas. 189 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,881 What about this man, Mike Smith? 190 00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:50,411 Mikey cut his teeth working for Molly Ivins. He was a researcher for us back in 2000. 191 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,206 Last I heard, he was a stringer for People.com... 192 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:56,563 sneaking into parties to find out who's sleeping with who. 193 00:10:56,800 --> 00:11:00,725 Now, when you say "sport-fucking," he was just putting it to her for fun... 194 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:04,288 or he's like actively attempting to compete at it? 195 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:08,642 It is a crack team. 196 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:10,444 Trust me. 197 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:17,607 You really gonna do it this time? 198 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,321 Your evil corporate overlords will let you? 199 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:22,045 Good to see you too, Mikey. 200 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:24,806 CBS is talking about closing foreign bureaus... 201 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:27,651 moving into more of a bullshit infotainment direction. 202 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:31,490 They won't touch the news division, as long as Dan's there. 203 00:11:31,680 --> 00:11:35,287 Dan's not gonna be there forever. They'll find a way to get the old man out. 204 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:40,170 Why did he even get into journalism if he's not gonna do the tough stories? 205 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:43,446 How you doing, Mikey? 206 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:50,408 I'm eating ramen three meals a day... 207 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:53,607 stealing cable. 208 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:56,442 I could use a job. 209 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:01,525 Come in, meet everybody. 210 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:07,370 Well, hell's bells, you brought me a hippy? 211 00:12:07,560 --> 00:12:10,404 This is Mike Smith, we worked on this together in 2000. 212 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,365 - He has no social graces whatsoever. - That's true. 213 00:12:13,560 --> 00:12:16,325 Your Arbusto tip, it's for shit. 214 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:18,522 Bin Laden money never got near Bush. 215 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:20,889 Okay. 216 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:22,286 What am I doing here? 217 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:25,640 What you're looking at is George W. Bush's... 218 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:27,968 entire Texas Air National Guard file. 219 00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:31,562 - You mean what's left of it, right? - That's affirmative. 220 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:33,480 Wait, wait, wait. 221 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:37,680 You guys are doing a paper trail. 222 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,486 Let me show you what we've got. 223 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,046 It starts right here. 224 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:46,520 May, 1968. 225 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:48,722 Bloodiest month of the Vietnam War. 226 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,606 Bush is accepted into the Texas Air National Guard for pilot training. 227 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,043 And if you believe Ben Barnes, he got Bush onto the waiting list. 228 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:59,369 If there ever was a waiting list. Some say yes, some say no. 229 00:12:59,560 --> 00:13:02,643 Bush says he got in quickly because they were looking for pilots... 230 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:05,923 which is bullshit with the pilots rotating back in from Vietnam. 231 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:07,451 And that's another thing. 232 00:13:07,680 --> 00:13:11,162 Training a National Guard pilot from start to finish, that's a huge rarity. 233 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:13,203 - Why? - It's not cost-effective. 234 00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:14,845 Air National Guard jocks... 235 00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:18,169 they're former Air Force pilots who wanna maintain their ratings. 236 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:21,324 Why spend a million bucks training some new pilot... 237 00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:24,410 when you can get some guy the Air Force taught how to fly. 238 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:29,242 Only thing that makes Bush an attractive candidate is who he's connected to. 239 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:31,841 Well, either way, he's in. 240 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:34,686 He signs on for a six-year commitment. 241 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:36,723 He does his pilot training at Moody... 242 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:40,521 then he's assigned to the 111th Fighter Intercept Squadron in Houston. 243 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:43,485 Now, the record shows that he does really well here. 244 00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:47,446 High marks at every rating period, until the spring of 1972... 245 00:13:47,680 --> 00:13:52,322 when he is suspended in writing for missing a routine physical. 246 00:13:52,560 --> 00:13:55,325 How does someone go from being a top-notch pilot... 247 00:13:55,560 --> 00:13:57,085 to not even taking a physical? 248 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,285 Well, not only that, but he requests and he is granted... 249 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:05,730 a reassignment to Alabama where he helps a friend on his senate campaign. 250 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:08,924 Wait, so he disobeys an order and then they let him transfer? 251 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:10,924 Oh, hey, it gets better. 252 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:13,925 From May 1972 to May 1973... 253 00:14:14,160 --> 00:14:18,609 the record shows there are no points registered on Bush's record. 254 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:22,771 Points. They're like hours on a time card in the Guard. 255 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:26,800 What it basically means is that Bush never even showed up. 256 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,924 The Alabama commander, he has no recollection of him. 257 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:32,407 No eyewitness can place him on that base. 258 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:36,247 And there is no paperwork to prove that he was ever there. 259 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:39,489 So you're telling me that the president of the United States... 260 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:43,241 may have gone AWOL from the military for over a year? 261 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:44,811 We have no proof of that. 262 00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:50,203 - What does the White House say? - That Bush served honorably... 263 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:52,687 and military records go missing all the time. 264 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:55,770 Military records do not go missing all the time. 265 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:58,804 They're the military. They are good at shit. 266 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:04,080 Now, the next time Bush appears on the official record is in July of 1973... 267 00:15:04,280 --> 00:15:05,964 when he shows up for drills. 268 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:09,323 And then in September of 1973... 269 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:14,765 he requests and he is granted an early discharge. Why? 270 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:19,284 So that he can attend Harvard Business School. 271 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,205 So he asks to quit nine months early and they just let him. 272 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:25,006 So, what are the questions we're looking to answer? 273 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:28,329 One, did Bush go into the Guard to avoid going to Vietnam? 274 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:32,650 Not to be cynical, but who didn't try to get into the Guard to avoid 'Nam back then? 275 00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:34,524 Me. 276 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,963 Bush's trainer in the 147th said he wanted to go to Vietnam. 277 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:42,649 There's only one document that deals with that in the official record. 278 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:47,368 On the question of desiring overseas transfer... 279 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:48,967 Bush checked no. 280 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:52,050 Bush's trainer said that must have been a mistake. 281 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:56,040 - Because that's a question you get wrong. - Two, why did he skip his physical? 282 00:15:56,240 --> 00:16:00,006 Well, it's not like he had a drug problem. He just liked the way it smelled. 283 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,248 Okay, three. 284 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:06,724 If someone did get him into the Guard, then who? 285 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:10,770 How the hell do we get them to go on the record? 286 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:13,804 Forty-one percent say they want Mr. Bush reelected... 287 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:15,764 while 51 percent don't. 288 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:19,367 Is it that time of year again already... 289 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:25,124 when I have to fend off the advances of a beautiful woman such as yourself? 290 00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:30,850 Governor, you got the president of the United States into the National Guard. 291 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:35,170 I mean, my God, I find that very impressive. 292 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:37,488 It is impressive, isn't it? 293 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:39,404 Come on TV, tell us all about it. 294 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:42,365 Oh, we both know if I ever said that... 295 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:47,208 about Texas' favorite son on camera, I'd be run out of Austin on a rail. 296 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:49,169 No, sorry, Mary. 297 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,688 Johnny's gonna win this thing, anyway. 298 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:56,642 Barnes is still a no. Who's next? 299 00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:00,124 Colonel Jerry Killian. Bush's CO in the 111th. 300 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:02,561 If anyone will know what really went on, he will. 301 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:04,046 Small problem there. 302 00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:06,402 - Which is? - Killian's dead. 303 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:11,211 - That's a pickle. - Who's next? 304 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:12,526 General Buck Staudt. 305 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:16,287 Former CO of Bush's 147th Interceptor Squadron. 306 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:18,767 George was one of the best pilots I ever had. 307 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:22,567 So I'm gonna respectfully invite you to go fuck yourself. 308 00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:24,640 General Bobby Hodges... 309 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:28,606 succeeded Staudt as commander of the 147th, Killian's direct supervisor. 310 00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:31,883 My husband says no strings were pulled for him. 311 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:35,368 Now, please stop calling our house. 312 00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:38,961 Maurice Udell, Bush's flight instructor. 313 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:40,850 No strings were pulled for him. 314 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,243 I thought he'd be a great American and a great fighter pilot. 315 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:47,371 Tom Honeycutt. 316 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:50,086 No strings were pulled. 317 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:52,880 Albert Lloyd. 318 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:56,527 - No strings were pulled. - Motherf... 319 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:00,485 Bill Hollowell. 320 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:04,167 No strings were pulled. And even if they were, it's a nonissue. 321 00:18:04,360 --> 00:18:07,842 Hey! Hey! Move, you son of a bitch! 322 00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:16,246 It was like they were given talking points. 323 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:19,091 He was a great guy, no strings were pulled. 324 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,767 Well, devil's advocate, Mary. What if no strings were pulled? 325 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:25,281 You know who else was in the 147th? 326 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:26,686 Lloyd Bentsen's son... 327 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:29,486 John Connally's son, both of Sid Adger's sons... 328 00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:32,889 H.L. Hunt's grandson, the heirs to the Sakowitz fortune... 329 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:36,050 and half the starting line of the Dallas Cowboys. 330 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:38,208 Yeah, I'm sure it's just a coincidence. 331 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:40,922 So, what's our next move? 332 00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:45,161 I have no idea. 333 00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:48,845 - I served with John Kerry. - I served with John Kerry. 334 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:52,408 Kerry has not been honest about what happened in Vietnam. 335 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:53,761 He is lying about his record. 336 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:57,169 I know John Kerry is lying about his first Purple Heart... 337 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:58,811 because I treated him. 338 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:01,048 John Kerry lied to get his Bronze Star. 339 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:03,681 I know, I was there, I saw what happened. 340 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:07,726 His account of what happened and what actually happened... 341 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:10,526 are the difference between night and day. 342 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:12,290 - Yeah? - Who is that? 343 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:14,289 My secret lover, go back to sleep. 344 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:18,644 Have you ever heard of Linda Starr? 345 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:22,726 She runs this website, it's like a clearing house for anti-Bush stuff. 346 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:27,005 She's hinting documents are gonna be leaked soon. 347 00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:29,091 What kind of documents? 348 00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:32,122 Mary Mapes is on line two. 349 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:33,970 Thank you. 350 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:37,487 - Mary. - Yeah, I think we've got something. 351 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:39,762 Anti-Bush, Internet rabble-rouser. 352 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:44,887 Oh, God, I talked to her for three hours, but she put me in touch with her source. 353 00:19:45,120 --> 00:19:47,327 A colonel who says he may have access... 354 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:50,126 to missing documents in Bush's purged Guard file. 355 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:53,887 - Sounds promising. - I got Mike Smith talking to him right now. 356 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:56,924 - Milk? - Get a look at those documents. 357 00:19:57,120 --> 00:20:00,488 And do some background on the colonel, make sure he isn't nuts. 358 00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:06,401 Thank you. 359 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:08,444 - Enjoy. - Thank you. 360 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:12,449 No. I saw it. 361 00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:16,646 I saw it with my own two eyes. Those parts of Bush's file they didn't like... 362 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:19,571 - ...they tossed in the wastebasket. - Do you have these? 363 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:23,526 Bill tried to talk about this in 2000, someone ran us off the road one night. 364 00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:27,691 - I ain't scared of them. - Well, I am. I am scared. 365 00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:32,603 All right, let's say I have the documents. 366 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:36,931 Why should I show them to you? Why not one of the newspapers? 367 00:20:37,120 --> 00:20:40,761 - Because nobody reads newspapers. - One of the other networks, then. 368 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:43,725 Don't know if you've noticed, there's not too many people... 369 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,042 who actually do what we do anymore. 370 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,244 We're 60 Minutes. We're the gold standard. 371 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:51,329 We can help you. 372 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,482 Look, you come on camera... 373 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:56,648 No. No. No cameras. 374 00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:58,410 Our name stays out of this. 375 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,086 They will destroy us for this, don't you understand? 376 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:05,120 Nicki, listen. I know what it's like to be bullied. 377 00:21:05,360 --> 00:21:08,682 To feel like they're too strong, and you're small and powerless. 378 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:10,530 But you're not. 379 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:12,722 And doing this will show them that. 380 00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:14,326 Now, I promise... 381 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,171 we will protect you. 382 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:53,202 - These are signed by Jerry Killian. - Yes, they are. 383 00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:58,762 The first one says that Bush made no attempt... 384 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,844 to meet his training certification. 385 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:05,283 That is a big difference than just missing his physical. 386 00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:08,927 And the second one refers to his pilot position as critical. 387 00:22:09,120 --> 00:22:13,489 Well, Bush said he stopped flying because they no longer needed pilots. 388 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:16,724 But this document would prove that statement untrue. 389 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:19,651 Can you think of anybody who'd wanna fool you with these... 390 00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:21,882 like a political dirty trick? 391 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:25,811 I can't think of anyone who would hate me that much. 392 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:28,401 And do you have the originals of these? 393 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,285 No. No, I was only given copies. 394 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,607 And don't ask me where I got them, I'm not gonna tell you anything else. 395 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:39,009 You get your own experts if you want to, you have them look at them. 396 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:41,009 - We will. - We will. 397 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:44,729 September 15th, we don't have a show. 398 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:46,849 CBS is running The Billy Graham Crusade. 399 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:51,250 - What about the 22nd? - Preempted again. Dr. Phil special. 400 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:53,886 So our air date is decided by an unholy confluence... 401 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:56,361 between Billy Graham and Dr. Phil McGraw? 402 00:22:56,800 --> 00:22:59,804 - Jesus.. - News doesn't pay the bills. 403 00:23:00,120 --> 00:23:01,565 There is one more option. 404 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:05,129 - The 8th. - As in five days from now? 405 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,682 - If you don't think... - I need interviews. 406 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:13,362 I need to get the whole team to New York and I need... First, I need Dan. 407 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:14,721 Where is he? 408 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:18,891 Hurricane Frances is pounding the Florida coast... 409 00:23:19,120 --> 00:23:22,522 harder than a strongman trying to win a Kewpie doll at a carnival! 410 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:24,768 I'm gonna kill him. 411 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,127 You may not have to. 412 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:35,003 Maybe I can get him on a puddle jumper to Austin for the Strong interview. 413 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:39,603 I got an e-mail from the colonel about the documents saying, "I feel better." 414 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:45,683 - Yeah? - A memorandum for record... 415 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:47,530 is a memo to nobody, right? 416 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:49,529 So why does Killian file them? 417 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:53,571 Well, Killian knows suspending a guy this protected is a big deal. 418 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:57,765 He's trying to do the right thing here, but he needs a paper trail to insulate himself. 419 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:01,806 Which means Bush's protection must've come from higher up than Killian. 420 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:04,411 You're thinking Hodges? 421 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:08,207 He was Killian's direct supervisor. I'll call you back. 422 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:21,769 You have reached the Hodges' residence, please leave a message. 423 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:24,887 General Hodges, Mary Mapes from 60 Minutes. 424 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:27,481 I was wondering if you could give me a call back. 425 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:29,728 Holy shit! 426 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:34,370 You gotta see this. It's a video from a cell phone... 427 00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:37,006 at a Democratic fundraiser. 428 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:39,480 Now... Thank you. Thank you. 429 00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:43,446 Now, let's talk about John Kerry and George Bush..... 430 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,486 - Is that Ben Barnes? - And I'm not name-dropping. 431 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,443 You see, I got a young man named George Bush.... 432 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:55,850 into the Air National Guard when I was lieutenant governor of Texas. 433 00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:58,771 Now, I'm not necessarily proud of that, but.... 434 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:00,689 Holy shit! 435 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:05,568 I didn't know they were taping me. Did you see it? I looked like shit! 436 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:10,084 - I thought you looked wonderful, Ben. - Oh, don't you start. 437 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:13,449 The cat's already out of the bag and your man Kerry's 10 points down. 438 00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:17,486 We're airing this piece in five days. Are you in or not? 439 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:20,925 - We got him! We got Barnes! - Burkett just called. 440 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,164 - He's got more memos to hand off. - We need to find his source. 441 00:25:24,360 --> 00:25:26,203 - Okay. - Be at the airport in the morning. 442 00:25:26,360 --> 00:25:29,489 - I'll fax you when I get there. - Yes! 443 00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,362 "Bush wasn't here during rating and I don't have any feedback... 444 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:43,125 from 187th in Alabama. I will not rate. Austin is not happy either." 445 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,767 "Bush was not here during rating period." 446 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:51,921 They're trying to get Killian to file a rating for Bush while he wasn't even on base. 447 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,724 This is proof he was AWOL. 448 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:02,602 Who do I talk to first? 449 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:06,805 Is there any doubt in your mind that these memos are genuine? 450 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:11,324 Well, they are compatible with the way business was done at that time. 451 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,808 They are compatible with the man that I remember Jerry Killian being. 452 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,810 And what do you think Colonel Killian was trying to do? 453 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,685 I think he was trying to get a duty performed... 454 00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:25,204 and he was trying to protect himself because of the political environment. 455 00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:29,803 So political considerations were a major force in the Guard? 456 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:38,524 It verged on outright corruption, the favors that were done... 457 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:41,121 the power that was traded. 458 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,171 From a moral and ethical standpoint... 459 00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:46,729 it was unconscionable. 460 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:51,242 Let's go to New York. 461 00:27:00,360 --> 00:27:02,761 I didn't get a chance to introduce myself. 462 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:05,122 - Dan Rather. - No shit. 463 00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:08,130 I mean, I'm Mike Smith. I'm familiar... 464 00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:11,529 I mean... I... I... I'm... Hello. 465 00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,721 You know, Mary tells me you're the one that calls me "the old man." 466 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:21,051 Well, I... I really wish she hadn't shared that with you. 467 00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:26,451 Look, I appreciate the hard work you're doing on this. 468 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:29,246 Asking questions, that's important. 469 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:31,807 Some people are gonna say it doesn't matter. 470 00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:34,964 One side or the other's always gonna say you're being partisan. 471 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,482 But you stop asking questions, that's when the American people lose. 472 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,331 Now, that may sound hokey, but I believe it. 473 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,682 So keep it up. 474 00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:48,204 Y... Yeah... Or no. Thank you. 475 00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:50,129 You're welcome. 476 00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:55,482 You know what's crazy? 477 00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:58,407 Many things are crazy. 478 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:02,650 Tell me specifically what you feel is crazy. 479 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,162 The fact that they kept this secret for so long. 480 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:14,680 You do know why Mary didn't get this story done in 2000, don't you? 481 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:21,841 Mary's mother died... 482 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,122 right in the middle of it. 483 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,560 And then the story never got finished and the election happened. 484 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:33,243 An election that was decided by 537 votes. 485 00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:34,967 I think... 486 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,684 that if Mary's mother hadn't died that summer... 487 00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:42,726 there's a real good chance that AI Gore would be president right now. 488 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:48,887 And what about her father? 489 00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:55,084 Mary's father is a drunken piece of shit... 490 00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:58,443 who hated himself so much, he beat his own daughters. 491 00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:04,165 The more outspoken they were, she says, the harder he hit them. 492 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,284 - So how do you think she fared? - She would get beat up... 493 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:10,768 - ...for asking questions? - That's right. 494 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,564 And this is what she does for a living? 495 00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:17,322 People are funny sometimes. 496 00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:22,522 It's part of what's between her and Dan, I think. 497 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:25,291 Why they work so well together. 498 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:28,526 It's why they need each other. 499 00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:35,487 Fathers and daughters. 500 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,169 Tell me about the document examiners. 501 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:57,365 There are four. Marcel Matley is coming from San Francisco to do on-camera. 502 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,080 Linda James in Texas wants to see the originals. 503 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:02,408 - Yeah, we don't have them. - I told her. 504 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,046 Jim Pierce in Los Angeles just started today... 505 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,284 and Emily Will in North Carolina wants you to call her. 506 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:09,606 Right. Got it. 507 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:11,962 I think you have a problem. 508 00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,282 I've been doing Internet research. 509 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:18,326 President was in Alabama when these were written, they can't be true. 510 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,962 Okay. Have you found anything wrong with the documents themselves? 511 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,881 - Well, no, but... - Do they appear forged in any way? 512 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:28,128 - Without the originals... - That's okay. 513 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:30,926 You just let me worry about the investigational side. 514 00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:33,966 I always work the whole thing. 515 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,285 Look, do you know where these originated? 516 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,887 Establishing chain of custody would go a long way... 517 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:42,008 toward determining authenticity. 518 00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:44,441 Yeah, believe me, we're working on it. 519 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:48,440 I give you the memos, you verify them, that was the deal. 520 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,483 You call the Kerry campaign for me yet? 521 00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:52,762 They cannot lie down on this Swift Boat shit. 522 00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:58,490 If you could just confirm where you got the memos from, we would be home free. 523 00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:01,524 - I told you I cannot go on the record. - I know. 524 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:04,121 I know. You wouldn't have to. 525 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,001 You just give me the name. All right? That's all I need. 526 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:12,520 George Conn. 527 00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:15,003 - Buddy of mine in the Guard. - Right. 528 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:18,522 He was there for the scrubbing. But you call him, he will deny it. 529 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,803 - Thank you. - Goodbye. 530 00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:33,567 You have reached the Conn residence. Please leave a message. 531 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,161 Colonel, this is Mary Mapes with 60 Minutes. 532 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,204 Was wondering if you could give me a call at your convenience. 533 00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:43,883 It's regarding a story we're airing on Wednesday night. Thank you. 534 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:45,605 - Matley's here. - Yeah. 535 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,367 I would say, based on our available handwriting evidence... 536 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,961 yes, this is the same person. 537 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:57,365 This signature on the June 24th document shows some conspicuous differences. 538 00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:00,883 But it also shows some inconspicuous... 539 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,481 similarities to Colonel Killian's handwriting. 540 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:06,206 Right, and why might differences like this exist? 541 00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:09,046 The content of the memo is highly stressful... 542 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,524 Killian telling a higher-up that he cannot rate Bush during his absence. 543 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:18,169 This is enough to explain differences in the pen strokes. 544 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:23,561 Would you excuse me a moment? 545 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:29,606 It's like watching paint dry. What am I gonna do? 546 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:32,844 That was in there somewhere. Think you can get the bite? 547 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:36,203 - Did I have lint on my jacket? - Two bottles of whiskey. 548 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:37,731 Okay. 549 00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:46,408 So, sir, are you saying that if I present this to the American public... 550 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:48,807 and say that to the best of our knowledge... 551 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:53,562 these documents are all signed by the same man, am I on solid ground? 552 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:57,486 Yes. 553 00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:01,127 Matley's a yes. Jim Pierce is a yes. Emily Will's still working. 554 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,170 Linda James wants more documents, but she'll defer to Matley. 555 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:07,603 Dates, contents of the Burkett memos mesh with the official record. 556 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,401 And I'm having Graphics mock something up to show it visually. 557 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:12,931 We don't have it yet. 558 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,922 Somebody has got to confirm the content of those memos. 559 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:18,804 Somebody who knew the players. 560 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:20,968 No one in the Guard is gonna step up. 561 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:24,806 Look what happened to Burkett. You talk, you get your head handed to you. 562 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:26,604 Who were Killian's commanders? 563 00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:30,964 There's Buck Staudt, who figuratively and literally told me to go fuck myself... 564 00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:33,970 and Bobby Hodges, who I've left 18 messages for. 565 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,250 Fine, I'll do 19. 566 00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:51,241 You guys feel like pizza? 567 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:56,770 I really feel like we should start thinking about pizza. 568 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:07,644 Hello? 569 00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:11,209 - General Hodges? - Yeah. 570 00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:16,002 This is Mary Mapes with 60 Minutes. 571 00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:19,961 I'd like to speak with you about some old memos... 572 00:34:20,200 --> 00:34:24,888 I've come across from the 187th Fighter Interceptor Squadron. 573 00:34:26,240 --> 00:34:29,164 They appear to be... 574 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:33,365 from the personal files of Jerry Killian. 575 00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:38,960 Well, I'd like to read them to you, if that's okay? 576 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:40,924 All right. 577 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:48,530 Okay. The first one is dated June 24, 1973. 578 00:34:48,720 --> 00:34:53,248 And the subject is Bush, George W., first lieutenant. 579 00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:57,929 "Sir. I got a call from your staff concerning the evaluation... 580 00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,566 of First Lieutenant Bush due this month. 581 00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,969 His rater is Lieutenant Colonel Harris. 582 00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:08,603 Neither Lieutenant Colonel Harris or I feel we can rate First Lieutenant Bush... 583 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:13,283 since he was not training with the 111th FIS since April 1972. 584 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:17,963 His recent activity is outside the rating period. 585 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,921 Advise me how we are supposed to handle this." 586 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:28,091 Okay, the... 587 00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:34,208 This one is August 18, 1973 and the subject titled CYA... 588 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,444 which I believe means "cover your ass"? 589 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:43,691 Okay. "Staudt has obviously pressured Hodges more about Bush. 590 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,884 I'm having trouble running interference and doing my job. 591 00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:51,603 Harris gave me a message today from Group regarding Bush's OETR... 592 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:54,167 and Staudt is pushing to sugarcoat it. 593 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,284 Bush wasn't here during rating period... 594 00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:00,370 and I don't have any feedback from 187th in Alabama. 595 00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:02,562 I will not rate. 596 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:06,247 Austin is not happy today either. 597 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:08,920 Harris took the call from Group today. 598 00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:12,522 I'll backdate but won't rate. 599 00:36:12,720 --> 00:36:15,087 Harris agrees." 600 00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:22,531 Sir, are these memos familiar to you? 601 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:25,363 They are. 602 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:31,127 But using someone's personal notes, that's going overboard. 603 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:35,166 You're trying to make news, create a story here where there isn't one. 604 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:39,206 No, sir, we're not trying to create anything. 605 00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:43,009 Hold on a minute. Hold. 606 00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:45,445 We have it. 607 00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:51,450 Tell me the truth, and the whole truth, about what happened... 608 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:55,042 with George W. Bush and the draft and the National Guard. 609 00:36:56,400 --> 00:37:01,691 Sid Adger, a friend of the Bush family, came to see me... 610 00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:05,282 and he asked me if I would recommend... 611 00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:08,529 George W. Bush for the Air National Guard. 612 00:37:08,720 --> 00:37:10,404 And I did. 613 00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:13,525 I'm concerned about the sheer amount of story we have. 614 00:37:13,720 --> 00:37:17,247 You know, what if we split it? You know, run Barnes tomorrow... 615 00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:19,761 and the documents on the Sunday broadcast. 616 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:23,971 Sunday's show won't give us the real estate. Where are we with the rest of it? 617 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:26,647 Well, I just got an e-mail from Emily Will. 618 00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:29,127 She has some concerns about the superscript thing. 619 00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:31,926 - Superscript? - It's the raised "th" after the 111. 620 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:35,926 She was worried that function wasn't available on military typewriters in the '70s. 621 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:39,010 But I spoke to Matley, he said they were available then... 622 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:41,362 so Emily said she'd defer to him. 623 00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:42,686 Good, all right. 624 00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:46,043 White House will have someone for on-camera in the morning. 625 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:49,489 I can't send Dan because of the storm. 626 00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:52,570 That fucking hurricane hates me. 627 00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:56,606 Well, I don't think that I had the right... 628 00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:59,371 to have the power that I had. 629 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:04,248 To choose who was gonna go to Vietnam and who was not gonna go to Vietnam. 630 00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,961 That's a power in some instances when I look at those names... 631 00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:12,324 of maybe determining life or death, and that's not a power I wanna have. 632 00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:17,242 Too strong or not, to say you're ashamed of it now? 633 00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:22,407 Oh, I think that that would be an appropriate thing. 634 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:26,571 I'm very, very sorry. 635 00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:32,967 What's it running? 636 00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,568 It's 60 minutes, at least three over. 637 00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,809 Some of the document stuffs a little slow, you can trim there. 638 00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,487 How about flipping it, open with Barnes, then do the documents? 639 00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:45,648 Keep it chronological. 640 00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:47,484 You've got three hours. 641 00:38:47,720 --> 00:38:49,688 - Okay. - Right. 642 00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:52,247 Now, this signature, on the June 24th document... 643 00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,602 shows some conspicuous differences. 644 00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:57,371 But it also shows some inconspicuous... 645 00:38:57,600 --> 00:38:59,648 No. Go back. It's still too long. 646 00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:03,162 - Go back to the bit where he's... - You've gotta lose Matley. 647 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:05,687 We're 40 seconds over, and he's a shit interview. 648 00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:07,444 The meshing graphic doesn't work. 649 00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:11,326 It shows where the new documents fall in with the originals. If we lose that... 650 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:14,000 Poorly. Look, we're out of time. 651 00:39:14,240 --> 00:39:16,686 It's your call. What do you wanna do? 652 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:21,930 Cut it. 653 00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:32,044 - We need to output in two minutes. - I know. 654 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:38,129 If we don't start outputting, we're not gonna have a show. 655 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:43,083 - Lock it and start outputting. - If there's a computer hiccup... 656 00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:46,568 - Tom, I worship you, but shut the fuck up. - Okay. All right. 657 00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:51,407 Eighteen new castaways will face their toughest challenge yet. 658 00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:56,208 Survivor: Vanuatu premieres Thursday at 8,7 Central. Only on CBS. 659 00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,801 Somebody's gonna get burned. 660 00:40:03,720 --> 00:40:06,929 The military records of the two men running for president... 661 00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:10,363 have become part of the political arsenal in this campaign. 662 00:40:10,560 --> 00:40:13,131 A tool for building up or blowing up... 663 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:17,962 each candidate's credibility as America's next commander-in-chief. 664 00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:22,165 While Senator Kerry has been targeted for what he did in combat in Vietnam... 665 00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:25,807 President Bush has been criticized for avoiding Vietnam... 666 00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:30,289 by landing a much sought-after spot in the Texas Air National Guard... 667 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:35,925 and then, apparently, failing to meet some of his obligations in the Guard. 668 00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:40,449 Did then Lieutenant Bush fulfill all his military commitments? 669 00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:44,770 And just how did he land that coveted slot in the Guard in the first place? 670 00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:47,082 Tonight, we have new documents... 671 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:50,489 and new information on the president's military service. 672 00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:53,487 And the first interview with the man who says... 673 00:40:53,720 --> 00:40:56,371 he pulled the strings to get young George W. Bush... 674 00:40:56,560 --> 00:40:59,404 into the Texas Air National Guard. 675 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:24,048 The president's time in the National Guard reemerged today. 676 00:42:24,240 --> 00:42:27,483 He enlisted in Texas, transferred to Alabama... 677 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:31,571 - ...and got out early to attend... - This is what our business has become. 678 00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:35,765 Reporting on reporting. I mean, why go to the trouble of breaking news... 679 00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:40,648 when all you have to do is just talk about other people breaking news, huh? 680 00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:44,170 Thirty minutes from now, someone somewhere is gonna be doing... 681 00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:48,649 a story about this guy doing a story about us. 682 00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:51,963 You know what? They're all gonna get Peabodys. 683 00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:53,964 This one mattered. 684 00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:59,205 It was great. Even the kid liked it. 685 00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:00,686 Oh, really? 686 00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:04,282 Yeah. Yeah, you're a hell of a reporter, babe. 687 00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:07,641 All right, well, I'll be home tomorrow. 688 00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:09,285 Okay, fly safe. 689 00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:12,246 - All right, I love you. - Bye. 690 00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:49,406 Hey, Mary? 691 00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:53,564 What's going on? Because these... 692 00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:58,049 These blogs are saying the memos can be re-created exactly in Microsoft Word. 693 00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:02,723 - Who's saying this? - Well, it's a conservative website, but... 694 00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:06,923 "Every one of these memos is in proportionally spaced font. 695 00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:09,322 It's probably Palatino or Times New Roman. 696 00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:12,724 In 1972, typewriters used monospaced fonts. 697 00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:15,366 Proportionally spaced fonts did not come into use... 698 00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:18,404 until the introduction of personal computers. 699 00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:21,126 They were not widespread until the '90s. Before then... 700 00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:25,922 you needed typesetting equipment. That wasn't used for personal memos. 701 00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:28,766 I'm saying these documents are forgeries... 702 00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:32,851 run through a copier for 15 generations... 703 00:44:33,120 --> 00:44:35,646 to make them look old." 704 00:44:38,600 --> 00:44:39,647 Okay. 705 00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:50,489 Mary? 706 00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:53,401 What the hell is going on? 707 00:44:54,080 --> 00:44:57,687 "Spacing is not just similar, it is identical in every respect. 708 00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:01,646 Notice that the date lines up perfectly, the line breaks are in the same places... 709 00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:06,329 all letters line up with the same letters above and below. 710 00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:08,648 And the kerning is exactly the same. 711 00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:12,083 And I did not change a single thing from Word's defaults. 712 00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:18,925 Margins, type size, tab stops, etcetera, are all using the default settings." 713 00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:22,647 What the hell are we gonna do? 714 00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:25,285 Due respect, did you fuck up? 715 00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:30,002 We had four document examiners and not one said the memos weren't real. 716 00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:32,727 Did any of them try typing them into Microsoft Word? 717 00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,087 I don't know, I'm not a document examiner. 718 00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:39,365 But I'm assuming their job is to make sure these things weren't whipped up. 719 00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:43,929 - Just because guys on the Internet... - It's not just the guys on the Internet. 720 00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:45,724 ABC News is going after this. 721 00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:48,241 - Nightline. - You mean they're going after Dan? 722 00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:50,841 - Yes. - Tell them about the superscript. 723 00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:53,725 It's the "th" that pops up after you type a number. 724 00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:56,969 - Like 111th. - Yeah. I know what it is. What about it? 725 00:45:57,160 --> 00:46:00,528 Bloggers are saying it's a big red flag this was done on a computer. 726 00:46:00,720 --> 00:46:03,644 They say it didn't exist on typewriters in the 1970s. 727 00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:05,290 - Well... - One of the examiners... 728 00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:07,602 did raise that concern as well. 729 00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:09,405 Emily Will. 730 00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:12,968 Yeah, but Matley said they did have them, and she deferred to him. 731 00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:15,362 They will kill us on that alone. 732 00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:19,610 - I don't understand, what do they want? - They want us to say we're wrong. 733 00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:21,165 Because if we're wrong... 734 00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:25,251 all the questions we've asked about the president's service go away. 735 00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:27,722 Look. Okay. 736 00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:30,121 We have the document examiners, okay? 737 00:46:30,320 --> 00:46:32,891 Bob Strong, who worked at Guard headquarters... 738 00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:36,482 says the memos are written in the vernacular of the Guard at the time. 739 00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:39,849 And we have Bobby Hodges, Killian's commanding officer... 740 00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:41,684 who confirmed both the content... 741 00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:44,770 and that they reflected Killian's state of mind at the time. 742 00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:46,564 We have this story. 743 00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:48,046 Well, make sure. 744 00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:49,890 Reconfirm with everybody. 745 00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:54,165 And find us another goddamn "th" in the official record. 746 00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:04,004 We need to find that "th." 747 00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:11,486 - Hi. - Yo. 748 00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:17,409 - You heard? - Yeah, yeah. It's bullshit. 749 00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:19,290 Pardon my French. 750 00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:23,241 People have attacked me for 30 years, it's not about to start bothering me now. 751 00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:25,005 Now, are you okay? 752 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:27,968 We're gonna be in a fight here, Dan. 753 00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:32,848 - I still got a few good ones left in me. - Did you get your contract sewn up yet? 754 00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:36,362 I got the head of the news division his job, I'm gonna be fine. 755 00:47:36,720 --> 00:47:38,848 You gonna give me something to hit back with? 756 00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:40,970 Yes, sir. 757 00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:45,844 The blast went off at 10:30 local time at the Australian Embassy in Jakarta... 758 00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:49,010 killing nine people and wounding 180. 759 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,329 Jemaah Islamiah, the Southeast Asian terrorist group... 760 00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:54,727 claimed responsibility for the attack. 761 00:47:54,920 --> 00:47:57,890 ...but several document experts contacted by ABC News... 762 00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:02,244 have raised serious questions about the authenticity of these new documents. 763 00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:06,724 They point to the typeface, spacing and perfectly even imprint of the letters... 764 00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:11,084 that look more like the creation of a computer than a typewriter. 765 00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:14,244 And there's this, the little superscript "th." 766 00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:19,082 That's something very few typewriters could do in 1972. 767 00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:23,569 You have reached the Hodges' residence. Please leave a message. 768 00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:25,047 General Hodges... 769 00:48:25,240 --> 00:48:29,245 this is Mary Mapes. We need to get in touch again. Can you call me? 770 00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:30,965 Thank you. 771 00:48:36,440 --> 00:48:41,002 ...avoid Vietnam has followed him since he ran for governor of Texas... 772 00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:46,001 - ...and Mr. Bush has always denied it. - I enjoyed it and I enjoyed my service... 773 00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:49,650 Nothing. 774 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:54,206 You done with these? 775 00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:55,964 - Never were mine. - Okay. 776 00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:00,443 ...that he was a person who did n... 777 00:49:00,600 --> 00:49:02,728 Staudt was already out of the Guard. 778 00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:05,205 What are you talking about? 779 00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:09,041 The CYA memo, dated August 18, 1973. 780 00:49:09,240 --> 00:49:14,883 "Staudt has obviously pressured Hodges more about Bush." 781 00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:17,680 Staudt left the Guard in 1972. 782 00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,087 So how the fuck can he still be pressuring? 783 00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:24,764 Listen, when a commanding officer... 784 00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:29,249 - No, the bloggers are having a field day. - When a general leaves his posting... 785 00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:32,290 and goes to work for Quantico on the same base... 786 00:49:32,480 --> 00:49:36,565 he still wields an enormous amount of influence. It doesn't matter when he left. 787 00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:38,762 - Back me up, Roger. - She's right. 788 00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:41,926 Yeah. Right, well... 789 00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:46,246 Forgive me if I don't think everyone is gonna see it the same way you do. 790 00:49:56,840 --> 00:49:57,887 This is bad. 791 00:50:00,720 --> 00:50:05,567 No, when they start asking to talk to our source... 792 00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:07,683 then it'll be bad. 793 00:50:08,320 --> 00:50:10,846 They're coming for us, Roger. 794 00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:42,009 I've got one. 795 00:50:42,200 --> 00:50:43,804 What? 796 00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:49,086 I have a superscript "th" here. 797 00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:51,169 Josh! 798 00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:57,125 Call Dan, tell him we just got in the fight. 799 00:50:57,360 --> 00:51:01,410 So can the experts say, George, positively that these weren't typed... 800 00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,080 and couldn't have been made in the early '70s? 801 00:51:04,240 --> 00:51:07,005 They say all the clues indicate that. They're not making... 802 00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:11,444 an absolute 100 percent guarantee, and CBS is still standing by its story. 803 00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:14,729 And in fact, they're also pointing to another source... 804 00:51:14,960 --> 00:51:16,610 a Colonel Robert Hodges... 805 00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:19,411 who was an immediate superior of Mr. Killian. 806 00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:22,524 They say they read these documents to Colonel Hodges. 807 00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:25,923 He said, "Sounds like what Killian was telling me at the time." 808 00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:27,849 Hodges is not speaking to anyone yet. 809 00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:31,447 Because we can't get him on the fucking phone! 810 00:51:32,240 --> 00:51:34,891 Those raising questions about the documents... 811 00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:37,924 have focused on something called superscript. 812 00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:41,727 A key that automatically types a raised "th." 813 00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:47,086 Critics claim typewriters didn't have that ability in the 1970s, but some did. 814 00:51:47,720 --> 00:51:51,645 In fact, other Bush military records released by the White House itself... 815 00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:53,808 show the same superscript. 816 00:51:54,040 --> 00:51:56,964 Here's one from 1968. 817 00:51:57,440 --> 00:51:58,805 Some analysts outside CBS... 818 00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:02,851 say they believe the typeface on these memos is New Times Roman... 819 00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:05,964 which they claim was not available in the 1970s. 820 00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:09,562 But the owner of the company that distributes this typing style... 821 00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:12,525 says it has been available since 1931. 822 00:52:12,720 --> 00:52:15,849 Document and handwriting examiner Marcel Matley... 823 00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:18,611 analyzed the documents for CBS News. 824 00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:20,643 He says he believes they are real... 825 00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:24,367 but is concerned about exactly what is being examined... 826 00:52:24,560 --> 00:52:27,609 by some of the people now questioning the documents. 827 00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:31,441 Because deterioration occurs each time a document is reproduced. 828 00:52:31,640 --> 00:52:35,770 And the documents being analyzed outside of CBS had been photocopied... 829 00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:38,128 faxed, scanned and downloaded... 830 00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:42,086 and are far removed from the documents CBS started with. 831 00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:46,365 Matley did this interview with us prior to Wednesday's broadcast. 832 00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:50,924 We look basically at what's called significant or insignificant features... 833 00:52:51,120 --> 00:52:54,124 to determine whether it's the same person or not. 834 00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:57,244 So I have no problem identifying them. 835 00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:00,768 I would say based on our available handwriting evidence... 836 00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:03,964 yes, this is the same person. 837 00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:08,171 Matley finds the signatures to be some of the most compelling evidence. 838 00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:11,045 We talked to him again today by satellite. 839 00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:16,444 Are you surprised questions come about these? We're not, but are you surprised? 840 00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:21,489 I knew going in this was dynamite, one way or the other. 841 00:53:21,680 --> 00:53:27,050 And I knew that potentially this could do far more damage to me professionally... 842 00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:28,890 than benefit me. 843 00:53:29,080 --> 00:53:31,287 And... And I knew that. 844 00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:35,525 But... But we seek the truth. That's what we do. 845 00:53:35,960 --> 00:53:39,009 You're supposed to put yourself out, seek the truth... 846 00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:41,567 and take what comes from it. 847 00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:44,248 For the CBS Evening News... 848 00:53:44,440 --> 00:53:45,965 Dan Rather reporting. 849 00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:47,645 Good night. 850 00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:50,207 And we're clear. 851 00:53:54,600 --> 00:53:57,729 - I told you I had it in me. - I'm calling Andrew right now. 852 00:53:57,960 --> 00:53:59,849 - F.E.A. - No kidding. 853 00:54:00,040 --> 00:54:02,327 - What'd you think? - I think you parked it. 854 00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:05,607 Bobby Hodges is on the phone. 855 00:54:08,880 --> 00:54:12,930 General Hodges? This is Mary Mapes. I've got Dan Rather on the line with me. 856 00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:16,727 Why is The Washington Post describing me as your trump card in this? 857 00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:19,010 Did you tell them that, Dan? 858 00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:20,725 I did not, sir. 859 00:54:20,920 --> 00:54:25,289 It says a highly placed CBS source referred to me as your trump card. 860 00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:28,689 Well, sir, that was not me and it was not Dan. 861 00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,362 Well, good, because I'm not. I've seen all the coverage. 862 00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:35,769 And I have to say I think these memos are fake. 863 00:54:36,320 --> 00:54:37,685 You...? Excuse me? 864 00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:40,526 I do not believe Jerry Killian wrote those memos. 865 00:54:40,720 --> 00:54:42,404 Sir, when we spoke on... 866 00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:46,843 September 6th... I'm sorry, I'm just going through my notes. 867 00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:50,886 When we spoke, you said the content of the memos was familiar to you. 868 00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:52,610 - Is that correct? - Yes. 869 00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:56,691 And that they reflected Colonel Killian's mind-set at the time. 870 00:54:56,880 --> 00:54:58,370 And they do. 871 00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:01,883 But I hadn't physically seen them. 872 00:55:02,680 --> 00:55:06,605 So, what physically about the memos makes you now doubt their authenticity? 873 00:55:06,800 --> 00:55:09,565 Jerry's family says he didn't write them. 874 00:55:10,880 --> 00:55:13,724 General, the thrust of our story was about what happened... 875 00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:17,601 with the president's Guard service. Now, if as you say... 876 00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:20,246 Colonel Killian really did feel this way... 877 00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:24,240 and the things described in the memos are true... 878 00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:26,289 we'd like to talk to you about that. 879 00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:29,768 I'm just telling you I now believe the memos are forgeries. 880 00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:31,644 Forget the memos, sir. 881 00:55:31,840 --> 00:55:36,767 Ls what we presented about President Bush accurate? 882 00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:42,446 - I don't wanna get in the middle of this. - Get him to go on camera. 883 00:55:43,360 --> 00:55:46,603 Would you be willing if I came to see you to talk to me on camera? 884 00:55:46,800 --> 00:55:47,881 No, Dan, I'm sorry. 885 00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:50,321 Maybe after the election. 886 00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:53,171 - General, if you... - Look, the family says they're fake. 887 00:55:53,360 --> 00:55:57,570 And I'm supporting the family, okay? I'm sorry. 888 00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:01,603 Shit! 889 00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:04,531 All right, what are we doing about Hodges recanting? 890 00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:06,563 We say we respect General Hodges... 891 00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:09,406 and believed him the first time we spoke with him. 892 00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:13,127 ABC is reaching out to two of our examiners. 893 00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:17,211 Emily Will and Linda James. They say they never authenticated the memos. 894 00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:18,966 Of course they didn't. 895 00:56:19,160 --> 00:56:20,730 - Why? - They... 896 00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:22,251 They... They couldn't. 897 00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:28,403 Well, because they're copies. 898 00:56:28,600 --> 00:56:31,888 There's no original ink or paper to, you know, test. 899 00:56:32,080 --> 00:56:35,368 No one can say with 100 percent certainty they're real or forgeries. 900 00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:39,650 - That's why they can attack us. - Except on the Internet, they are certain... 901 00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:43,049 - Those are lousy wannabe analysts. - We get lousy analysts of our own. 902 00:56:43,240 --> 00:56:46,562 Our story was about whether Bush's connections got him into the Guard... 903 00:56:46,720 --> 00:56:49,041 and covered for him when he missed commitments. 904 00:56:49,200 --> 00:56:50,884 Research we found backs that up. 905 00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:54,721 The documents, they were a small part. They were not the point of the story. 906 00:56:54,920 --> 00:56:57,810 It doesn't matter what the point of the story was. We have to... 907 00:56:57,960 --> 00:57:00,008 - They do not get to do this. - Do what? 908 00:57:00,200 --> 00:57:04,603 They do not get to smack us just for asking a fucking question. 909 00:57:14,880 --> 00:57:16,848 Monday morning... 910 00:57:18,160 --> 00:57:20,561 I want analysts backing us up. 911 00:57:21,720 --> 00:57:23,051 Let's go. 912 00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:06,849 - Hey. - Hey. 913 00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:09,206 When did you get in? 914 00:59:09,440 --> 00:59:13,764 I was worried there might be cameras at the airport. Didn't want Robbie to see that. 915 00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:15,804 God, what are you doing in here? 916 00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:19,325 - Working. - Why don't you take a break? 917 00:59:19,520 --> 00:59:21,648 I'll go get dressed, we can take a walk. 918 00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:25,890 No, I don't need to take a fucking walk. I wanna sit here and do this, okay? 919 00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:30,564 This... Okay. 920 00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:50,524 I'm sorry. 921 00:59:51,840 --> 00:59:55,049 - It's okay. - No, it's not. 922 00:59:55,240 --> 00:59:59,484 It's just... No matter what I say, no matter what I do, I'm gonna get hit. 923 01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:04,370 This.... 924 01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:06,729 This is not that. 925 01:00:10,080 --> 01:00:13,687 When my dad would start in on me, I would think: 926 01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:16,524 "I am not gonna cry. 927 01:00:16,720 --> 01:00:18,643 I am not gonna ask him to stop. 928 01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:22,043 I'm not gonna give him the satisfaction of seeing how much it hurts." 929 01:00:22,200 --> 01:00:23,850 And he would just go in harder. 930 01:00:24,040 --> 01:00:28,728 And I would think, "Someday, I am gonna fight you." 931 01:00:29,680 --> 01:00:32,331 And I never did. 932 01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:40,524 Now. 933 01:00:42,760 --> 01:00:44,888 You have to fight now. 934 01:00:47,640 --> 01:00:51,725 Everything that's in those documents that people are saying can't be done... 935 01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:55,362 as you said, 32 years ago, is just totally false. 936 01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:59,201 Not true. Like I said, proportional spacing was available. 937 01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:02,404 Superscripts was available as a custom feature. 938 01:01:02,600 --> 01:01:06,491 Go back to the beginning of the list. I think that's useful, don't you, Roger? 939 01:01:08,200 --> 01:01:10,009 Word's come down from Andrew. 940 01:01:10,200 --> 01:01:11,929 They wanna talk to your source. 941 01:01:12,560 --> 01:01:15,484 Well, what if my source doesn't wanna talk to them? 942 01:01:15,680 --> 01:01:17,125 Then you'll convince him. 943 01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:20,921 You're good at convincing people to do things, aren't you, Mary? 944 01:01:23,840 --> 01:01:26,844 I just want you to know how important your support has been... 945 01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:28,604 throughout this entire process. 946 01:01:28,800 --> 01:01:31,565 Call your fucking source, Mary. 947 01:01:35,400 --> 01:01:37,050 Now... 948 01:01:37,680 --> 01:01:38,920 it's bad. 949 01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:41,202 - You said he wouldn't have to. - I know, just... 950 01:01:41,360 --> 01:01:44,921 You'd verify the documents and he wouldn't have to do anything else. 951 01:01:45,120 --> 01:01:47,930 Well, it didn't work out that way, did it? 952 01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:52,330 Oh, I'm sorry, Nicki. I'm just... I'm ti... I'm just tired. 953 01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:55,004 Bill did nothing wrong. 954 01:01:55,200 --> 01:01:56,611 No one's saying he did. 955 01:01:56,800 --> 01:01:59,485 I just need to get him on the phone with my boss... 956 01:01:59,680 --> 01:02:01,364 and tell him what he told me. 957 01:02:06,240 --> 01:02:08,811 It would mean a lot to Dan. 958 01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:11,888 Would you, please? 959 01:02:15,320 --> 01:02:18,608 Bill, this is Andrew Heyward, I'm the president of CBS News. 960 01:02:18,800 --> 01:02:19,881 Is Dan there? 961 01:02:21,160 --> 01:02:22,730 I'm here, colonel. 962 01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:25,281 Well, I heard Hodges turned tail on you. 963 01:02:25,480 --> 01:02:27,960 All these guys run from it. 964 01:02:28,160 --> 01:02:30,970 You know I got health problems. 965 01:02:31,240 --> 01:02:35,165 I had heard that, which is why I don't wanna take up too much of your time. 966 01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:38,284 I was wondering if you could fill me in on a few things. 967 01:02:38,520 --> 01:02:39,567 Shoot. 968 01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:42,445 Well, how you came to be in possession of the documents. 969 01:02:42,640 --> 01:02:45,246 You told Mary it was from a man named George Conn? 970 01:02:45,440 --> 01:02:49,331 Well, she was bugging me so much about it, I had to tell her something. 971 01:02:51,800 --> 01:02:53,689 So that's not accurate? 972 01:02:53,880 --> 01:02:57,123 - No, sir, it is not. - Fucking.... 973 01:02:57,320 --> 01:03:00,324 Would you mind telling us what really happened? 974 01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:02,363 I got a call in March from a guy... 975 01:03:02,560 --> 01:03:04,847 who said a woman named Lucy Ramirez... 976 01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:06,963 wanted to get in contact with me. 977 01:03:07,160 --> 01:03:10,801 He told me to call the Houston Holiday Inn between 7 and 10... 978 01:03:11,000 --> 01:03:13,241 and ask for a specific room... 979 01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:15,124 so I did. 980 01:03:15,320 --> 01:03:18,369 This woman told me she was supposed to be a go-between... 981 01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:22,047 a person to deliver a package of documents to me. 982 01:03:22,240 --> 01:03:24,846 And I was supposed to copy the documents... 983 01:03:25,040 --> 01:03:29,250 and then burn the originals, which were also copies, and the envelope. 984 01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:31,882 - Bullshit. - Destroy the DNA evidence... 985 01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:34,168 of where they come from, you see? 986 01:03:34,360 --> 01:03:35,771 Yeah, of course. 987 01:03:35,960 --> 01:03:38,486 So she says, "When are you gonna be in Houston next? 988 01:03:38,640 --> 01:03:41,610 I tell her, "We're coming to the livestock show in a few weeks." 989 01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:43,689 We sell Simmental cattle. 990 01:03:43,920 --> 01:03:47,527 The show is an excellent way to advertise our bull semen. 991 01:03:47,880 --> 01:03:51,680 So the first day at the show, a dark-skinned fella comes up... 992 01:03:51,880 --> 01:03:54,451 and hands me an envelope and walks away. 993 01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:56,210 Inside are those memos. 994 01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,487 I burned the rest like he said. 995 01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:00,841 Done and done. 996 01:04:02,680 --> 01:04:06,890 And was this the same man who talked to you on the phone? 997 01:04:07,520 --> 01:04:10,330 No idea. Maybe. 998 01:04:10,520 --> 01:04:14,650 And you didn't tell Mary all this before because.... 999 01:04:14,960 --> 01:04:18,407 Well, I... I said I'd keep it quiet. 1000 01:04:18,600 --> 01:04:22,082 Mary did a good job on this. Don't judge her too harshly. 1001 01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:24,282 Thanks, Bill. 1002 01:04:25,600 --> 01:04:28,126 Well, Bill, this is.... 1003 01:04:29,000 --> 01:04:30,729 This is pretty amazing stuff. 1004 01:04:31,200 --> 01:04:35,922 I wonder if you'd be willing to come down and sit and talk about it for us. 1005 01:04:36,120 --> 01:04:38,805 Help clear the air for everyone. 1006 01:04:39,000 --> 01:04:41,924 I don't know. What do you think, Dan? 1007 01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:46,968 I think they can't hit us any harder than they already are, colonel. 1008 01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:51,280 I'd go on the record and tell the truth. 1009 01:04:51,440 --> 01:04:53,249 Be done with it. 1010 01:04:58,800 --> 01:05:00,131 Okay. 1011 01:05:00,720 --> 01:05:03,769 My office will make the necessary arrangements. 1012 01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:06,480 - Thank you for your time. - Goodbye. 1013 01:05:11,920 --> 01:05:15,402 - We need him on the air soon. Betsy. - Yep. 1014 01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:24,287 Mary, will you hang back a sec? 1015 01:05:32,080 --> 01:05:35,448 With Burkett, there needs to be a line of questioning about his motives. 1016 01:05:35,600 --> 01:05:39,446 His political leanings, his views on the president, why he lied. 1017 01:05:39,640 --> 01:05:42,769 People will cover how we cover this. We need to inoculate ourselves. 1018 01:05:42,920 --> 01:05:45,685 Thou shalt always protect the company. 1019 01:05:47,280 --> 01:05:49,362 I want Dan to survive this. 1020 01:05:51,280 --> 01:05:52,964 Why wouldn't he survive this? 1021 01:05:56,680 --> 01:06:01,368 If Dan feels like this is corporate positioning, he won't do it. 1022 01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:03,523 He won't for me. 1023 01:06:03,960 --> 01:06:05,883 He will for you. 1024 01:06:18,200 --> 01:06:19,770 He's on oxygen, so.... 1025 01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:22,247 - The vultures are here. - Oh, Jesus. 1026 01:06:23,320 --> 01:06:25,004 Dan! Dan! 1027 01:06:25,200 --> 01:06:26,725 - Mary, comment? - Excuse us, folks. 1028 01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:28,001 Over here. Right here. 1029 01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:31,006 - Excuse us. Pardon me, ma'am. - Dan, a comment, please. 1030 01:06:31,200 --> 01:06:32,406 - Excuse me. - Dan! 1031 01:06:32,600 --> 01:06:33,931 - Excuse us. - Dan! 1032 01:06:34,120 --> 01:06:36,930 You broadcasted those fake memos. You feel duped? 1033 01:06:37,320 --> 01:06:40,130 Can you confirm the memos were typed on a word processor? 1034 01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:43,322 How would you feel about betraying the people? 1035 01:06:43,520 --> 01:06:44,726 - Just drive. - Mary! 1036 01:06:44,920 --> 01:06:47,924 Who the fuck are you people? 1037 01:06:49,720 --> 01:06:50,801 You know anybody? 1038 01:06:50,960 --> 01:06:54,851 Yeah, if you could just see if you can stop it, okay? Just get them to pull it. 1039 01:06:55,040 --> 01:06:56,849 - Colonel. - Yeah. All right. Bye. 1040 01:06:57,040 --> 01:07:00,044 - Where are the Burketts? - Upstairs, getting ready. 1041 01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:01,885 Dan? 1042 01:07:02,120 --> 01:07:04,202 We need to ask why he lied to us, okay? 1043 01:07:04,400 --> 01:07:06,528 We need to make sure we get that. 1044 01:07:13,520 --> 01:07:16,364 I just wanted to come say hello before we get things going. 1045 01:07:16,560 --> 01:07:19,086 Oh, thank you, Dan. I appreciate that. 1046 01:07:19,280 --> 01:07:21,203 - How do you do, ma'am? - Hello there. 1047 01:07:21,400 --> 01:07:24,961 Now, look, these things are fairly easy. We're just gonna sit and talk. 1048 01:07:25,160 --> 01:07:26,321 - Okay. - Okay. 1049 01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:30,326 Now, I will ask you about why you misled us. I don't want you to be surprised. 1050 01:07:30,520 --> 01:07:32,602 No, I was expecting that. 1051 01:07:32,800 --> 01:07:35,724 - I'm happy to set the record straight. - Great. 1052 01:07:35,920 --> 01:07:41,211 Now, if you need to stop, need a glass of water or anything, that's just fine. Okay? 1053 01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:44,131 Okay, if you'll excuse me, I'm gonna get my war paint on. 1054 01:07:44,320 --> 01:07:46,721 That's the worst part of this job, makeup. 1055 01:07:47,240 --> 01:07:49,129 The sound's ready when you are. 1056 01:07:49,760 --> 01:07:52,525 It's gonna be fine, Nicki. Okay? 1057 01:07:56,800 --> 01:07:57,801 Yep. 1058 01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:00,970 But you told us a different story. 1059 01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:04,170 To protect the people who gave me the documents. 1060 01:08:04,360 --> 01:08:06,283 Did they ask you to do this? 1061 01:08:06,480 --> 01:08:08,642 They wanted me to burn everything. 1062 01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:13,450 They didn't want people to know that they were the source on this. 1063 01:08:13,640 --> 01:08:15,802 This man and this mystery woman. 1064 01:08:16,000 --> 01:08:19,686 That's right. Can I please have some water? 1065 01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:21,848 Oh, of course. 1066 01:08:23,920 --> 01:08:25,524 We need a better bite on this. 1067 01:08:25,720 --> 01:08:30,169 So maybe instead of, "Did they ask you to do this?" say, "Did they ask you to lie?" 1068 01:08:32,760 --> 01:08:34,125 Yeah. 1069 01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:36,967 Yeah. Okay. 1070 01:08:40,280 --> 01:08:43,124 Now, we're gonna go back for a moment. 1071 01:08:43,320 --> 01:08:44,367 Okay. 1072 01:08:44,800 --> 01:08:50,045 This man and this mystery woman, did they ask you to lie to us? 1073 01:08:50,240 --> 01:08:54,802 They didn't want me to say how I got the documents. 1074 01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:56,650 I see. 1075 01:08:56,840 --> 01:09:00,640 - I see. So that's why you misled us? - Yes. 1076 01:09:00,840 --> 01:09:05,084 Your producer was pushing me to find out where I got the memos from. 1077 01:09:11,040 --> 01:09:12,405 I see. 1078 01:09:12,600 --> 01:09:15,524 So then, that's why you lied to us? 1079 01:09:16,240 --> 01:09:17,605 Yes. 1080 01:09:17,840 --> 01:09:19,649 And I know it caused some... 1081 01:09:19,880 --> 01:09:21,211 Some problems. 1082 01:09:21,400 --> 01:09:22,890 Excuse me. 1083 01:10:02,520 --> 01:10:03,885 - Whenever you're ready. - Yeah. 1084 01:10:04,080 --> 01:10:05,730 Okay. 1085 01:10:07,720 --> 01:10:10,929 You said you knew that these memos would cause a problem? 1086 01:10:11,120 --> 01:10:15,011 I knew it did, but I didn't know it at the time. 1087 01:10:15,200 --> 01:10:18,841 I see. Now, again... 1088 01:10:19,080 --> 01:10:22,880 why didn't you tell us the truth when you gave us those memos? 1089 01:10:23,840 --> 01:10:25,330 To protect people, Dan. 1090 01:10:27,200 --> 01:10:31,285 People who were trying to tell the truth about what really happened back then. 1091 01:10:33,160 --> 01:10:37,051 And do you believe those documents are telling the truth? 1092 01:10:37,200 --> 01:10:38,804 Yes. Yes, I do. 1093 01:10:39,240 --> 01:10:42,881 I see.I see, so... 1094 01:10:47,960 --> 01:10:50,440 - We already have that. - I need to make sure we... 1095 01:10:50,680 --> 01:10:52,967 No, we've got it. I'm moving on. 1096 01:11:05,800 --> 01:11:07,325 He's a good guy, you know. 1097 01:11:07,520 --> 01:11:09,602 You think I enjoyed that? 1098 01:11:10,760 --> 01:11:12,888 We should cut something for the news... 1099 01:11:13,120 --> 01:11:15,566 get it out immediately. Andrew agrees. 1100 01:11:17,720 --> 01:11:19,085 F.E.A. 1101 01:11:20,640 --> 01:11:24,725 You know, you guys and Dan always say that. What the hell does it mean? 1102 01:11:25,520 --> 01:11:26,567 It's open. 1103 01:11:34,560 --> 01:11:36,210 Excuse me. 1104 01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:39,327 How's Bill? 1105 01:11:41,680 --> 01:11:44,729 Oh, don't you dare ask how Bill is. 1106 01:11:44,880 --> 01:11:48,851 Bill is sick. He's a sick man. You don't give a damn about him. 1107 01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:52,609 You just spent two hours trying to destroy him. 1108 01:11:52,800 --> 01:11:55,280 You made him crawl on camera. 1109 01:11:55,480 --> 01:11:58,404 You made him say again and again that he lied. 1110 01:11:58,600 --> 01:12:01,604 And that still wasn't enough for you. You wanted more. 1111 01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:04,491 You wanted to blame him for all the things you did wrong... 1112 01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:06,290 putting this story together. 1113 01:12:06,480 --> 01:12:09,927 You wanna wrap it in a neat package, say "It's Bill Burkett's fault." 1114 01:12:10,120 --> 01:12:12,248 Well, it's not, and you know it. 1115 01:12:12,440 --> 01:12:14,488 You promised when we came here to do this... 1116 01:12:14,720 --> 01:12:18,566 that we would get a fair shake, and we got nothing from you but lies. 1117 01:12:18,760 --> 01:12:21,525 - Nicki... - You may think I am some stupid hick... 1118 01:12:21,720 --> 01:12:23,927 who doesn't know a damn thing... 1119 01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:27,010 and you're so smart and such a big shot. 1120 01:12:27,200 --> 01:12:28,565 But I keep my promises... 1121 01:12:28,760 --> 01:12:31,286 and I don't destroy people to protect myself. 1122 01:12:31,480 --> 01:12:34,962 I don't destroy people and humiliate them... 1123 01:12:35,480 --> 01:12:39,451 and then pretend I give a goddamn about how they are. 1124 01:12:40,440 --> 01:12:44,490 To answer your question, Bill is not good. 1125 01:12:44,640 --> 01:12:46,927 But then, you knew that already. 1126 01:13:18,520 --> 01:13:19,760 We need to talk. 1127 01:13:30,840 --> 01:13:33,571 What are the chances you have something alcoholic in there? 1128 01:13:34,520 --> 01:13:36,409 Better than average. 1129 01:13:42,920 --> 01:13:44,922 How long have we known each other? 1130 01:13:45,120 --> 01:13:47,885 Oh, Jesus, is it that bad? 1131 01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:52,446 They're gonna start an investigation. 1132 01:13:53,160 --> 01:13:56,369 And CBS wants to appoint an independent panel... 1133 01:13:56,560 --> 01:13:59,291 to take a look at how the story was put together. 1134 01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:01,802 And I'm gonna announce it. 1135 01:14:02,480 --> 01:14:03,970 Tomorrow. 1136 01:14:05,920 --> 01:14:10,801 I'm gonna apologize for the story, on air. 1137 01:14:12,200 --> 01:14:13,964 Andrew asked you to apologize? 1138 01:14:16,400 --> 01:14:18,368 He didn't ask. 1139 01:14:20,360 --> 01:14:24,410 - Dan, that's... It's surrender. - Ever since Burkett changed his story... 1140 01:14:24,640 --> 01:14:27,883 Andrew feels that CBS can't afford the risk to its reputation... 1141 01:14:28,080 --> 01:14:29,445 Oh, God. He knew. 1142 01:14:29,600 --> 01:14:32,683 Even before we went down there. Just wanted to get Burkett on tape. 1143 01:14:32,840 --> 01:14:34,683 Mary, you gotta promise me something. 1144 01:14:35,520 --> 01:14:36,931 Stop worrying about me. 1145 01:14:37,160 --> 01:14:38,844 Yeah, well, that's not gonna happen. 1146 01:14:39,040 --> 01:14:41,361 You gotta protect yourself now. 1147 01:14:43,160 --> 01:14:44,764 We all do. 1148 01:14:50,080 --> 01:14:52,162 Thank you for the drink. 1149 01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:06,607 Now, news about CBS News... 1150 01:15:06,800 --> 01:15:10,122 and the questions surrounding documents we aired on this broadcast... 1151 01:15:10,320 --> 01:15:13,688 and on the Wednesday edition of 60 Minutes on September the 8th. 1152 01:15:14,840 --> 01:15:18,003 The documents purported to show George W. Bush received... 1153 01:15:18,240 --> 01:15:22,564 preferential treatment during his years in the Texas Air National Guard. 1154 01:15:22,760 --> 01:15:26,287 At the time, CBS News and this reporter... 1155 01:15:26,480 --> 01:15:29,131 fully believed the documents were genuine. 1156 01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:32,006 Tonight, after further investigation... 1157 01:15:32,200 --> 01:15:35,568 we can no longer vouch for their authenticity. 1158 01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:43,246 I'm sorry this was your first story here. 1159 01:15:45,920 --> 01:15:49,970 Well, I was thinking next week... 1160 01:15:50,600 --> 01:15:53,171 we just have Dan shoot the president. 1161 01:15:53,400 --> 01:15:55,641 Cause a lot less drama. 1162 01:16:00,680 --> 01:16:05,083 Hey... Hey, Mary, USA Today wants to know if you put Burkett in touch... 1163 01:16:05,280 --> 01:16:08,250 with the Kerry campaign in exchange for documents. 1164 01:16:11,240 --> 01:16:14,767 I know what this is about. Josh, do you remember when I told you... 1165 01:16:15,000 --> 01:16:19,050 Burkett wanted to give the Kerry campaign advice on the Swift Boat stuff? 1166 01:16:20,040 --> 01:16:22,168 Remember, I wanted to do a bullshit check... 1167 01:16:22,360 --> 01:16:24,840 after he said he spoke with Howard Dean. 1168 01:16:25,040 --> 01:16:28,681 And you said that I could contact the Kerry people to check. 1169 01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:31,360 Then Burkett wanted me to give him his phone number... 1170 01:16:31,600 --> 01:16:33,762 and you said I could, so.... 1171 01:16:33,960 --> 01:16:36,850 So... So I did. Do you... 1172 01:16:37,000 --> 01:16:38,729 Do you not remember any of this? 1173 01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:42,051 I must not have been clear. 1174 01:16:42,280 --> 01:16:46,080 You must have misunderstood what it was you could do. 1175 01:16:46,280 --> 01:16:48,886 Oh, Jesus Christ, this is.... 1176 01:16:49,440 --> 01:16:52,603 This is unbelievable. I mean, what the fuck else is gonna happen? 1177 01:16:52,800 --> 01:16:54,962 - Be... Betsy... - No. 1178 01:16:55,360 --> 01:16:59,046 You know what, Mary? Maybe it's best if you just went home. 1179 01:17:18,040 --> 01:17:19,849 The failure of CBS News... 1180 01:17:20,040 --> 01:17:23,761 to properly, fully scrutinize the documents and their source... 1181 01:17:23,960 --> 01:17:28,887 led to our airing the documents when we should have not done so. 1182 01:17:29,440 --> 01:17:34,207 It was a mistake. CBS News deeply regrets it. 1183 01:17:34,400 --> 01:17:39,850 Also, I want to say, personally and directly, I am sorry. 1184 01:17:40,520 --> 01:17:44,969 CBS has hired the firm of Kirkpatrick & Lockhart Nicholson Graham... 1185 01:17:45,160 --> 01:17:47,606 to conduct a review panel. 1186 01:17:48,240 --> 01:17:49,924 You paper-trailed them. 1187 01:17:50,840 --> 01:17:51,887 Of course. 1188 01:17:52,080 --> 01:17:56,051 They're a big firm, got about a thousand lawyers headquartered in Seattle. 1189 01:17:56,240 --> 01:17:59,050 They specialize in internal investigations. 1190 01:17:59,240 --> 01:18:03,370 They're the same ones that Bush brought in last year to rip apart WorldCom. 1191 01:18:03,560 --> 01:18:04,971 We're as bad as them? 1192 01:18:05,200 --> 01:18:07,851 - Oh, it gets worse. - The panel... 1193 01:18:08,840 --> 01:18:13,528 will be co-chaired by K & L partner Richard Thornburgh. 1194 01:18:13,720 --> 01:18:17,167 He's the former governor of Pennsylvania, first appointed... 1195 01:18:17,360 --> 01:18:19,567 as a U.S. attorney under Richard Nixon. 1196 01:18:19,760 --> 01:18:23,321 Ran for Congress twice. Defeated both times by Democrats. 1197 01:18:23,520 --> 01:18:26,603 His second campaign was run by Karl Rove. 1198 01:18:26,840 --> 01:18:29,446 - Yup. - But the crown jewel in his resume... 1199 01:18:29,680 --> 01:18:33,366 is the time served as U.S. attorney general from '88 to '91 1200 01:18:33,600 --> 01:18:37,002 under former president George H.W. Bush. 1201 01:18:37,200 --> 01:18:39,009 Jesus. 1202 01:18:40,200 --> 01:18:41,247 Who goes in first? 1203 01:18:41,680 --> 01:18:43,728 First Dan, then me... 1204 01:18:43,920 --> 01:18:48,050 then Lucy, the colonel, then you. 1205 01:18:48,280 --> 01:18:49,520 You're the grand finale. 1206 01:18:49,720 --> 01:18:51,006 And why? Why is that? 1207 01:18:51,240 --> 01:18:53,971 Because they wanna have as much as they can on you... 1208 01:18:54,200 --> 01:18:56,328 when they sit you down in that chair. 1209 01:18:59,240 --> 01:19:01,129 Holy shit. 1210 01:19:04,240 --> 01:19:07,244 Yeah, I'm sorry. She's not speaking to reporters. 1211 01:19:07,840 --> 01:19:10,844 - It's Heyward. - If they put someone else on, hang up. 1212 01:19:11,640 --> 01:19:14,564 They can't fire you if they don't have a witness on the line. 1213 01:19:14,760 --> 01:19:18,207 - Thanks for the pep talk. Andrew. - Mary. 1214 01:19:18,440 --> 01:19:21,728 We've hired a private detective to go back over everything. 1215 01:19:22,080 --> 01:19:25,289 I need you to hand over your notes, your e-mails, everything. 1216 01:19:25,480 --> 01:19:28,245 Listen, I was thinking, if we could find the typewriter... 1217 01:19:28,440 --> 01:19:30,727 Stop working on the story. 1218 01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:40,729 Well, all work on the Bush-Guard story has officially ceased. 1219 01:19:41,800 --> 01:19:43,484 I can't imagine why. 1220 01:19:48,240 --> 01:19:50,242 Hey, what are you looking at, buddy? 1221 01:19:50,440 --> 01:19:52,010 The men with the cameras. 1222 01:19:56,000 --> 01:19:58,321 Are they friends of yours? 1223 01:20:06,520 --> 01:20:07,931 No. 1224 01:20:08,120 --> 01:20:09,281 Take him upstairs. 1225 01:20:12,680 --> 01:20:15,251 In other news, CBS' internal investigation... 1226 01:20:15,440 --> 01:20:19,445 into their story on George W Bush's National Guard service begins today... 1227 01:20:19,640 --> 01:20:22,689 with the review panel convening at Black Rock. 1228 01:20:27,880 --> 01:20:31,123 I left my wallet in a cab. I'm supposed to be in front of the panel. 1229 01:20:31,320 --> 01:20:32,446 You can't be here. 1230 01:20:32,680 --> 01:20:35,604 - Excuse me? - You're not allowed in the building. 1231 01:20:35,800 --> 01:20:38,531 I'm not allowed in the building according to who? 1232 01:20:38,720 --> 01:20:41,769 Management. You have to go, now. 1233 01:20:44,120 --> 01:20:47,090 Okay, do you understand what's happening here? 1234 01:20:47,320 --> 01:20:49,766 I understand you're leaving. 1235 01:20:51,320 --> 01:20:55,006 Our... Your parent company is currently lobbying... 1236 01:20:55,240 --> 01:20:58,722 a Republican-controlled Congress for deregulation and tax breaks... 1237 01:20:58,920 --> 01:21:02,561 that could potentially save them hundreds of millions of dollars. 1238 01:21:02,720 --> 01:21:06,167 And we just aired a report that could cost those same Republicans... 1239 01:21:06,320 --> 01:21:09,210 - ...the presidency. - Security to the 10th floor now. 1240 01:21:09,680 --> 01:21:13,366 You think Viacom might need the administration on their side? 1241 01:21:13,560 --> 01:21:16,689 You think they might be desperate to make it up to him right now? 1242 01:21:16,880 --> 01:21:20,601 Make up for CBS running stories on Abu Ghraib, the president, and Vietnam... 1243 01:21:20,800 --> 01:21:24,327 and all the other shit that isn't part of your scheduled programming? 1244 01:21:24,560 --> 01:21:28,724 Of course everyone wants it to disappear. There's a fucking election at stake! 1245 01:21:29,360 --> 01:21:31,931 You're supposed to question everything. That's your job. 1246 01:21:32,080 --> 01:21:36,130 We are supposed to question everything, and, what, you won't even question this? 1247 01:21:37,120 --> 01:21:39,361 - Are you done? - Am I done? 1248 01:21:39,560 --> 01:21:41,847 Know when the FCC repealed cross-ownership laws... 1249 01:21:42,040 --> 01:21:45,726 a single company could own 45 percent of the national market share? 1250 01:21:46,080 --> 01:21:48,845 Forty-five percent of the national market share. 1251 01:21:49,040 --> 01:21:51,407 People fucking flipped. They lost their shit. 1252 01:21:51,600 --> 01:21:54,410 They actually sat down and wrote their local congressmen. 1253 01:21:54,600 --> 01:21:57,285 So in the 2003 appropriations bill, guess what... 1254 01:21:57,480 --> 01:21:59,562 Congress overturned it. 1255 01:22:00,440 --> 01:22:03,489 Hooray for democracy, right? 1256 01:22:03,680 --> 01:22:06,001 Nope. The president wouldn't sign it. 1257 01:22:06,200 --> 01:22:09,761 Bush threatened to veto the bill unless a compromise was found at 39 percent. 1258 01:22:09,960 --> 01:22:11,007 And why 39 percent? 1259 01:22:11,160 --> 01:22:14,881 That's the exact percent Viacom wouldn't have to sell off any of their stations. 1260 01:22:15,080 --> 01:22:17,845 The president of the United States was ready to take down... 1261 01:22:18,000 --> 01:22:22,642 the entire federal budget so that Viacom wouldn't lose any money! 1262 01:22:29,480 --> 01:22:31,084 You're right. 1263 01:22:31,520 --> 01:22:34,649 Yeah, we're... We're all evil. 1264 01:22:34,960 --> 01:22:37,042 And you're the... You're the... 1265 01:22:37,240 --> 01:22:39,129 plucky, misunderstood hero. 1266 01:22:39,880 --> 01:22:42,963 It's not that you guys fucked up a story. No, no, it's... it's... 1267 01:22:43,120 --> 01:22:45,771 It's a conspiracy, right? 1268 01:22:50,080 --> 01:22:52,401 They're gonna screw you too, you know. 1269 01:23:08,720 --> 01:23:11,485 Hey, I never got to ask you. 1270 01:23:12,000 --> 01:23:13,729 Why did you get into journalism? 1271 01:23:16,320 --> 01:23:18,163 Curiosity. 1272 01:23:20,760 --> 01:23:22,205 That's it? 1273 01:23:23,680 --> 01:23:25,569 That's everything. 1274 01:23:29,000 --> 01:23:30,968 Why'd you get into it? 1275 01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:35,047 You. 1276 01:23:38,040 --> 01:23:41,965 Mr. Rather, the panel is ready for you. 1277 01:23:55,120 --> 01:23:59,125 It's even worse than we thought. They asked if you bullied staff or sources. 1278 01:23:59,280 --> 01:24:02,011 If you physically intimidated people to get what you want. 1279 01:24:02,160 --> 01:24:04,367 I hope you told them I beat the shit out of you. 1280 01:24:04,560 --> 01:24:07,882 Mary, they... it's... This isn't a joke, okay? 1281 01:24:08,080 --> 01:24:10,208 They asked about your politics. 1282 01:24:10,440 --> 01:24:14,445 The deck is stacked, okay? The game's rigged. Between this... 1283 01:24:14,720 --> 01:24:18,281 talk radio and your father, it's a fucking lynching. 1284 01:24:19,000 --> 01:24:20,240 What about my father? 1285 01:24:22,320 --> 01:24:25,210 Nothing. I... Don't... It's... Forget it. 1286 01:24:25,400 --> 01:24:27,368 What about my father, Mike? 1287 01:24:28,040 --> 01:24:30,042 Look, I'm sorry, I thought you knew. 1288 01:24:32,560 --> 01:24:35,245 I'm ashamed of what my daughter has become. 1289 01:24:35,440 --> 01:24:36,441 You are? 1290 01:24:36,800 --> 01:24:38,848 She's a typical liberal. 1291 01:24:39,000 --> 01:24:41,207 She went into journalism with an ax to grind... 1292 01:24:41,360 --> 01:24:44,045 and that was to promote radical feminism. 1293 01:24:44,360 --> 01:24:47,762 So would you say this is a pattern of hers? 1294 01:24:47,920 --> 01:24:49,206 Oh, sure. 1295 01:24:49,360 --> 01:24:51,966 You know, when I heard this was a 60 Minutes story... 1296 01:24:52,120 --> 01:24:55,283 I figured she would be the producer of the show. 1297 01:24:55,480 --> 01:24:57,847 She and that Dan Rather have been working on this... 1298 01:24:58,000 --> 01:25:02,210 ever since Bush was elected. She should really be looking at George... 1299 01:25:13,440 --> 01:25:14,726 Hello? 1300 01:25:14,920 --> 01:25:17,207 You can't talk to the press anymore, Don. 1301 01:25:17,360 --> 01:25:19,522 - Who is this? - You know who this is. 1302 01:25:19,680 --> 01:25:21,523 Just for once in your life, be decent. 1303 01:25:21,720 --> 01:25:23,563 I'm expressing my opinion. 1304 01:25:23,760 --> 01:25:26,286 I thought you reporters were all about that. 1305 01:25:26,440 --> 01:25:29,444 Okay, well, if you don't stop talking to the press... 1306 01:25:29,640 --> 01:25:32,211 I'll fly up there myself and break your fucking arms. 1307 01:25:32,360 --> 01:25:34,010 - How about that? - Is that him? 1308 01:25:34,960 --> 01:25:37,691 - Here, let me talk to him. - Mar. 1309 01:25:37,880 --> 01:25:39,564 - Mark, just give me the phone. - Mar. 1310 01:25:39,720 --> 01:25:41,643 Just give me the phone, Mark. 1311 01:25:43,000 --> 01:25:45,480 - Daddy? - Yes. 1312 01:25:50,440 --> 01:25:52,727 Daddy, please stop. 1313 01:25:54,280 --> 01:25:58,171 Well, since you asked, I will. 1314 01:26:23,160 --> 01:26:25,447 I can't anymore. 1315 01:26:26,800 --> 01:26:29,963 - Yes, you can. - No. I don't want to. 1316 01:26:30,160 --> 01:26:33,369 They can have my career. I don't care. 1317 01:26:33,880 --> 01:26:37,168 God, I never should have asked the question. 1318 01:26:38,200 --> 01:26:41,044 So, what, they're right, you're wrong? 1319 01:26:41,400 --> 01:26:43,402 Guess so. 1320 01:26:47,360 --> 01:26:51,649 And what about Dan? 1321 01:26:52,240 --> 01:26:53,651 That's not fair. 1322 01:26:53,800 --> 01:26:56,246 "It's a shame what that woman did to Dan Rather." 1323 01:26:56,440 --> 01:26:58,044 - That's what they're saying. - Don't. 1324 01:26:58,200 --> 01:27:02,046 "How he's going to go down? Well, it's just a disgrace." 1325 01:27:02,840 --> 01:27:05,571 And Robert'll get to see you quit, that'll be good for him. 1326 01:27:05,720 --> 01:27:07,085 Oh, fuck you. 1327 01:27:07,280 --> 01:27:09,044 Listen to me. Listen. 1328 01:27:09,240 --> 01:27:11,481 You gotta make your case to the panel, honey. 1329 01:27:11,680 --> 01:27:13,330 You have to fight. 1330 01:27:13,480 --> 01:27:15,881 - Even if the system's rigged? - The system is rigged. 1331 01:27:16,080 --> 01:27:18,082 It always has been. You know that. 1332 01:27:18,400 --> 01:27:21,210 You still have to tell them what happened. 1333 01:27:23,520 --> 01:27:25,090 Why? 1334 01:27:28,840 --> 01:27:31,047 Because that's what we do. 1335 01:27:46,440 --> 01:27:50,240 So do you believe me? 1336 01:27:51,720 --> 01:27:54,200 Do you believe I did my job'? 1337 01:27:54,680 --> 01:27:58,127 - I told you it doesn't matter what I believe. - It does to me. 1338 01:27:59,160 --> 01:28:01,208 If you'd like someone else to represent you... 1339 01:28:01,360 --> 01:28:03,647 Why don't you just tell me why I shouldn't? 1340 01:28:05,880 --> 01:28:08,884 - What do you want out of this? - Excuse me? 1341 01:28:09,040 --> 01:28:11,805 Do you wanna get into a debate about journalism with them... 1342 01:28:11,960 --> 01:28:15,282 - ...or do you wanna keep your job? - I can't do both? 1343 01:28:15,480 --> 01:28:17,881 Not at this point, no. 1344 01:28:18,800 --> 01:28:21,041 You're the primary breadwinner, is that correct? 1345 01:28:25,360 --> 01:28:26,805 Yes. 1346 01:28:26,960 --> 01:28:29,406 And your son is 7. 1347 01:28:30,720 --> 01:28:33,963 This isn't a trial, this is a hunt. 1348 01:28:34,160 --> 01:28:36,561 This is about assignation of blame, who is at fault. 1349 01:28:36,720 --> 01:28:38,165 Because somebody has to be. 1350 01:28:38,320 --> 01:28:40,721 Debate that with them, and you're done. 1351 01:28:41,000 --> 01:28:43,207 You have one chance here. 1352 01:28:43,440 --> 01:28:46,364 Among all the conservative lawyers on that panel... 1353 01:28:46,520 --> 01:28:49,091 there is one former journalist co-chairing it. 1354 01:28:49,240 --> 01:28:52,801 Lou Boccardi, the former head of the Associated Press. 1355 01:28:52,960 --> 01:28:56,487 He's the one man who can maybe understand what happened. 1356 01:28:56,680 --> 01:29:01,004 You convince him, maybe he can turn the others. 1357 01:29:01,360 --> 01:29:03,761 But if you antagonize them... 1358 01:29:04,160 --> 01:29:06,561 if you bait them, if you fight them... 1359 01:29:06,720 --> 01:29:08,006 you will lose. 1360 01:29:11,120 --> 01:29:13,248 You're fucking hired. 1361 01:29:18,400 --> 01:29:20,926 You're going to cooperate in every way. 1362 01:29:21,680 --> 01:29:24,650 Follow every request and instruction. 1363 01:29:24,800 --> 01:29:26,404 There is no standard here. 1364 01:29:26,560 --> 01:29:30,804 No books full of journalistic laws, no written codes. 1365 01:29:31,000 --> 01:29:32,923 There is just opinion. 1366 01:29:33,120 --> 01:29:35,726 And we have to sway it. 1367 01:29:53,120 --> 01:29:54,724 That's Thornburgh. 1368 01:29:55,960 --> 01:29:58,611 - Which one's the journalist? - He's just there. 1369 01:30:04,480 --> 01:30:06,608 Ms. Mapes, thanks for coming in. 1370 01:30:06,760 --> 01:30:10,242 I'm Larry Lanpher. I'm lead council along with Mike Missal here. 1371 01:30:10,400 --> 01:30:11,765 Pleasure. 1372 01:30:11,960 --> 01:30:13,849 I notice there's no stenographer. 1373 01:30:14,040 --> 01:30:16,247 Well, this is an internal investigation. 1374 01:30:16,400 --> 01:30:19,244 We're just gonna take some notes as we go along. 1375 01:30:19,760 --> 01:30:21,808 So there'll be no official record? 1376 01:30:22,560 --> 01:30:24,164 It's fine. 1377 01:30:24,560 --> 01:30:27,723 Would you like to take a bathroom break before we begin? 1378 01:30:27,880 --> 01:30:29,803 - I'm fine. - You sure? 1379 01:30:29,960 --> 01:30:31,121 I'm not that delicate. 1380 01:30:33,320 --> 01:30:36,085 - I'd like one. - Okay. 1381 01:30:36,320 --> 01:30:38,129 Start again in two minutes, everyone. 1382 01:30:45,120 --> 01:30:46,963 I want you to stay calm in there. 1383 01:30:47,120 --> 01:30:49,691 - Don't I look calm? - Not even a little. 1384 01:30:50,400 --> 01:30:52,721 Now, they're gonna try to catch you off balance. 1385 01:30:52,920 --> 01:30:55,366 When they ask you a question, answer it. 1386 01:30:55,760 --> 01:30:58,127 Tell them what time it is, not how to build a clock. 1387 01:30:58,280 --> 01:31:00,328 - But... - Don't fight. 1388 01:31:01,320 --> 01:31:02,845 Okay? 1389 01:31:05,200 --> 01:31:06,884 Okay. 1390 01:31:07,360 --> 01:31:08,407 Don't fight. 1391 01:31:20,880 --> 01:31:23,121 I'd like to talk a little bit about language. 1392 01:31:23,600 --> 01:31:25,409 Absolutely. 1393 01:31:25,600 --> 01:31:28,649 This is a printout of e-mails sent back and forth by your group... 1394 01:31:28,800 --> 01:31:30,131 during the investigation. 1395 01:31:30,320 --> 01:31:33,290 In this one to Mike Smith, what did the two of you mean... 1396 01:31:33,440 --> 01:31:37,650 when you referred to a piece of "tasty brisket"? 1397 01:31:39,520 --> 01:31:42,888 That referred to a piece of information Mike uncovered... 1398 01:31:43,040 --> 01:31:46,089 working on a documentary for the Germans. 1399 01:31:46,720 --> 01:31:49,200 A piece of information against the president? 1400 01:31:51,280 --> 01:31:55,205 I think specifically, it referred to Bush losing his nerve while flying. 1401 01:31:55,440 --> 01:31:58,967 Which you did not mention in the report you aired on 60 Minutes. 1402 01:31:59,200 --> 01:32:01,521 I didn't think we had it nailed down. 1403 01:32:01,680 --> 01:32:03,205 Would it be accurate to say... 1404 01:32:03,360 --> 01:32:06,569 you were looking for anything negative about the president? 1405 01:32:06,720 --> 01:32:09,485 I'd say it's accurate we were looking for any information... 1406 01:32:09,640 --> 01:32:12,166 on his time in the Guard that hadn't come to light. 1407 01:32:12,400 --> 01:32:14,402 And that's what made it tasty? 1408 01:32:14,560 --> 01:32:17,530 Not because it reflected poorly on the president? 1409 01:32:17,680 --> 01:32:22,129 It was tasty because it had the potential to be newsworthy. 1410 01:32:22,280 --> 01:32:25,363 Look, Mike and I are friends, so we use shorthand. 1411 01:32:25,560 --> 01:32:27,210 Sarcasm, jokes. You know. 1412 01:32:27,400 --> 01:32:29,482 Is that common in your industry? 1413 01:32:29,840 --> 01:32:30,887 I suppose. 1414 01:32:31,040 --> 01:32:34,840 When dealing with matters as serious as this, it's common to make jokes? 1415 01:32:36,040 --> 01:32:40,045 I can assure you, we take our work very, very seriously. 1416 01:32:41,920 --> 01:32:44,730 I also wanted to ask you about this e-mail... 1417 01:32:44,880 --> 01:32:50,489 from Roger Charles where he says he feels better about the documents... 1418 01:32:50,640 --> 01:32:52,529 because of their formatting. 1419 01:32:52,680 --> 01:32:55,763 Colonel Charles originally thought the documents were fake? 1420 01:32:56,240 --> 01:32:57,605 I don't believe so. 1421 01:32:57,960 --> 01:33:01,567 Then... Then... Then why would he say he feels better? 1422 01:33:02,760 --> 01:33:06,128 Because it seemed that what our source was telling us was true. 1423 01:33:06,280 --> 01:33:11,605 I have to disagree. Even the subject line in the e-mail is "I feel better"... 1424 01:33:11,760 --> 01:33:14,491 with three exclamation points. 1425 01:33:14,640 --> 01:33:17,211 It seems Colonel Charles initially had doubts. 1426 01:33:20,360 --> 01:33:23,125 I think you'd have to ask Colonel Charles. 1427 01:33:27,360 --> 01:33:33,163 But also, I would say that he was coming from the place of not being sure... 1428 01:33:33,320 --> 01:33:37,211 if the memos were real or not, and then becoming confident that they were. 1429 01:33:37,400 --> 01:33:38,970 Really? 1430 01:33:39,680 --> 01:33:43,127 Forgive me for saying, but your testimony so far doesn't bear that out. 1431 01:33:43,280 --> 01:33:44,770 - How so? - Excuse me. 1432 01:33:44,920 --> 01:33:46,843 This isn't testimony, remember? 1433 01:33:47,280 --> 01:33:49,601 If it was impossible to authenticate the memos... 1434 01:33:49,760 --> 01:33:53,446 doesn't it stand to reason that you initially assumed the memos were real... 1435 01:33:53,600 --> 01:33:56,968 - ...rather than the other way around? - I wouldn't say that. 1436 01:33:57,360 --> 01:33:58,805 Well, what would you say? 1437 01:33:59,640 --> 01:34:02,689 It seems you assumed the memos were real from the outset... 1438 01:34:02,880 --> 01:34:06,089 and you looked to make sure that nothing disproved that. 1439 01:34:06,280 --> 01:34:11,411 Essentially, you took the position that the president was guilty until proven innocent. 1440 01:34:12,120 --> 01:34:14,851 We took several steps to vet these memos. 1441 01:34:15,080 --> 01:34:16,320 Such as? 1442 01:34:17,200 --> 01:34:18,406 - Well... - There were only... 1443 01:34:18,600 --> 01:34:20,682 two signatures, only two sets of initials. 1444 01:34:20,880 --> 01:34:23,451 Hardly enough comparison for a handwriting match. 1445 01:34:23,600 --> 01:34:27,047 And you said yourself that no carbon or ink tests could be performed. 1446 01:34:27,240 --> 01:34:30,926 In fact, two of the four analysts you hired said they had strong reservations... 1447 01:34:31,080 --> 01:34:32,650 about the memos' authenticity. 1448 01:34:32,800 --> 01:34:36,805 Much of the formatting and terminology used is consistent with the period... 1449 01:34:37,000 --> 01:34:38,365 - ...as is... - That's debatable. 1450 01:34:38,520 --> 01:34:41,410 ...consistent with the period, as is the content of the memos... 1451 01:34:41,560 --> 01:34:45,201 which was verified by several sources, including those close to Killian. 1452 01:34:45,360 --> 01:34:48,364 Then what about this? 1453 01:34:51,240 --> 01:34:52,810 "OETR"? 1454 01:34:54,240 --> 01:34:57,562 Is this one of the terminologies that's consistent with the period? 1455 01:34:58,200 --> 01:34:59,201 I believe so. 1456 01:34:59,360 --> 01:35:03,285 - What does that stand for? - Officer Effectiveness Training Report. 1457 01:35:03,440 --> 01:35:07,331 Actually, the correct acronym is OER. 1458 01:35:07,480 --> 01:35:11,201 Officer Effectiveness Report. No T. 1459 01:35:12,080 --> 01:35:15,607 Isn't it true that "Officer Effectiveness Training Report" doesn't appear... 1460 01:35:15,760 --> 01:35:19,446 anywhere on any official document, and this is a phrase that you created... 1461 01:35:19,600 --> 01:35:22,968 to explain this incorrect abbreviation in your memos? 1462 01:35:23,120 --> 01:35:25,646 - That is not true. - It isn't? 1463 01:35:25,920 --> 01:35:29,606 - I would not do something like that. - Then prove it. 1464 01:35:49,560 --> 01:35:52,404 Official document, top of the page. 1465 01:35:54,160 --> 01:35:55,400 Tab 21. 1466 01:35:58,920 --> 01:36:01,161 - Mike? - Of course. 1467 01:36:07,720 --> 01:36:09,404 I see that. 1468 01:36:09,560 --> 01:36:11,449 I'm sorry, my mistake. 1469 01:36:23,440 --> 01:36:25,283 Clearly, you did well. 1470 01:36:25,440 --> 01:36:28,808 They're gonna regroup, call you back in next month. 1471 01:36:28,960 --> 01:36:30,291 Next month? 1472 01:36:30,440 --> 01:36:34,411 They've decided to delay announcing the panel's findings till after the election. 1473 01:36:35,960 --> 01:36:38,042 Don't look so glum. Just keep your head down. 1474 01:36:38,200 --> 01:36:39,645 You'll make it out of this. 1475 01:36:44,400 --> 01:36:47,688 I'm looking forward to serving this country for four more years. 1476 01:36:48,040 --> 01:36:50,486 I wanna thank you for your hard work in the campaign. 1477 01:36:50,640 --> 01:36:55,009 I told you that the other day and you probably thought I was seeking votes. 1478 01:36:56,880 --> 01:36:59,690 But now that you voted, I really meant it. 1479 01:36:59,880 --> 01:37:02,008 [appreciate the hard work of the press corps. 1480 01:37:02,160 --> 01:37:05,607 We all put in long hours. You're away from your families for a long period. 1481 01:37:05,760 --> 01:37:08,127 But the country's better off when we have... 1482 01:37:08,280 --> 01:37:10,647 a vigorous and free press covering our elections. 1483 01:37:10,960 --> 01:37:12,405 And thanks for your work. 1484 01:37:12,560 --> 01:37:16,167 Without over-pandering, I'll answer a few questions. 1485 01:37:16,360 --> 01:37:17,691 Hunt? 1486 01:37:17,840 --> 01:37:20,207 Mr. President. Thank you. 1487 01:37:20,360 --> 01:37:24,763 As you look at your second term, how much is the war in Iraq going to cost? 1488 01:37:24,920 --> 01:37:28,845 Do you intend to send more troops or bring troops home? 1489 01:37:29,000 --> 01:37:31,321 And in the Middle East more broadly... 1490 01:37:31,480 --> 01:37:35,201 do you agree with Tony Blair that revitalizing the Middle East... 1491 01:37:35,360 --> 01:37:40,730 peace process is the single most pressing political issue facing the world? 1492 01:37:41,120 --> 01:37:43,088 Now that I've got the will of the people... 1493 01:37:43,240 --> 01:37:47,211 I'm going to start enforcing the one-question rule. 1494 01:37:47,720 --> 01:37:49,006 That was three questions. 1495 01:37:52,560 --> 01:37:54,528 I'll start with Tony Blair's comments. 1496 01:37:54,720 --> 01:37:57,769 I agree with him that the Middle East peace is a very... 1497 01:38:06,560 --> 01:38:07,607 Hello? 1498 01:38:09,880 --> 01:38:13,521 Mary, it's Dan plus three. 1499 01:38:13,680 --> 01:38:17,287 Well, I'm working on a Chardonnay Xanax cocktail... 1500 01:38:17,440 --> 01:38:19,681 if it makes you feel any better. 1501 01:38:19,840 --> 01:38:23,447 Did you know that 60 Minutes was the first news program... 1502 01:38:23,600 --> 01:38:25,523 to ever make money? 1503 01:38:26,240 --> 01:38:29,687 Before that, all news divisions operated at a financial loss. 1504 01:38:32,000 --> 01:38:36,528 You know, when the government gave the networks the airwaves... 1505 01:38:36,760 --> 01:38:39,445 it was with the stipulation that... 1506 01:38:39,640 --> 01:38:43,326 they'd be used in some capacity for the public good. 1507 01:38:43,560 --> 01:38:45,324 And that... That was the news. 1508 01:38:45,520 --> 01:38:48,000 They... They made their money elsewhere on the schedule. 1509 01:38:48,200 --> 01:38:51,443 But reporting the news was a duty. It was... 1510 01:38:51,800 --> 01:38:52,961 It was a trust. 1511 01:38:54,440 --> 01:38:58,001 You know when Don Hewitt started 60 Minutes, it was in 1968... 1512 01:38:58,240 --> 01:39:01,164 it built to enormous ratings. God, it was... 1513 01:39:01,360 --> 01:39:03,328 God, it was wonderful. 1514 01:39:03,480 --> 01:39:08,281 I mean, people were really watching the news. I mean, they cared. 1515 01:39:08,800 --> 01:39:11,485 And, God, we figured out a way to give it to them. 1516 01:39:11,640 --> 01:39:13,563 I was there, Mary. 1517 01:39:14,320 --> 01:39:18,723 I was there the day they figured out that news could make money. 1518 01:39:21,600 --> 01:39:24,410 After a while it dawned on them, "How come the evening news... 1519 01:39:24,600 --> 01:39:26,921 isn't a profit center too? 1520 01:39:27,080 --> 01:39:30,209 Why aren't the morning shows earning more?" 1521 01:39:31,880 --> 01:39:35,441 If you interview Survivor contestants instead of survivors of the genocide... 1522 01:39:35,600 --> 01:39:38,001 your ad rates go up. 1523 01:39:40,880 --> 01:39:45,329 Pretty soon we won't even run down our own stories because it's too expensive. 1524 01:39:45,480 --> 01:39:46,891 We'll just... 1525 01:39:48,280 --> 01:39:53,047 We'll just pay someone else to do it, then we'll read them on the air for show. 1526 01:39:56,320 --> 01:39:59,290 It was a public trust once. 1527 01:40:00,000 --> 01:40:02,287 I swear to you it was. 1528 01:40:04,680 --> 01:40:06,762 How you doing, Dan? 1529 01:40:09,920 --> 01:40:11,729 I'm stepping down as anchor. 1530 01:40:17,000 --> 01:40:18,286 When? 1531 01:40:19,760 --> 01:40:21,683 After inauguration. 1532 01:40:26,560 --> 01:40:28,528 Oh, Dan. 1533 01:40:30,200 --> 01:40:31,565 You didn't cause this, Mary. 1534 01:40:32,040 --> 01:40:35,123 Well, you're a shitty liar, you know that? 1535 01:40:40,080 --> 01:40:41,570 Why didn't you ask me? 1536 01:40:42,040 --> 01:40:45,408 Because God knows everybody else did when the shit hit the fan. 1537 01:40:45,600 --> 01:40:47,523 Why didn't you? 1538 01:40:48,120 --> 01:40:49,724 Ask you what? 1539 01:40:49,960 --> 01:40:53,123 Why didn't you ask me if the documents were real? 1540 01:40:55,240 --> 01:40:57,447 Because I knew I didn't need to. 1541 01:41:00,400 --> 01:41:01,447 Hey. 1542 01:41:01,600 --> 01:41:04,604 When you go back in there, you hold your head up, you understand? 1543 01:41:06,200 --> 01:41:07,850 Yes, Dan. 1544 01:41:08,760 --> 01:41:10,842 Okay. F.E.A. 1545 01:41:14,280 --> 01:41:16,408 F.E.A. 1546 01:41:49,760 --> 01:41:51,603 You're doing great. 1547 01:41:52,480 --> 01:41:54,801 Another half hour, and you're done. 1548 01:41:57,360 --> 01:41:58,566 What does that mean? 1549 01:42:02,440 --> 01:42:06,206 Fuck 'em all. 1550 01:42:11,080 --> 01:42:14,004 Well, I'm glad we have clarification on that. 1551 01:42:14,160 --> 01:42:17,687 - Good. - Well, if there's nothing else... 1552 01:42:17,880 --> 01:42:20,087 Thank you, gentlemen, for the day. 1553 01:42:23,480 --> 01:42:26,927 Aren't you gonna ask me about my politics? 1554 01:42:28,480 --> 01:42:30,130 Excuse me? 1555 01:42:30,320 --> 01:42:34,564 You asked other people what I believe, so aren't you gonna ask me? 1556 01:42:35,480 --> 01:42:36,527 What are you doing? 1557 01:42:37,120 --> 01:42:41,842 Well, wouldn't you say most of the people you work with consider you a liberal? 1558 01:42:44,880 --> 01:42:48,680 Do you mean, "Am I now or have I ever been a liberal?" 1559 01:42:59,200 --> 01:43:02,010 It's a legitimate question. 1560 01:43:02,640 --> 01:43:03,641 Is it? 1561 01:43:03,840 --> 01:43:05,285 Well, you brought it up. 1562 01:43:06,320 --> 01:43:09,290 No, you did, when you asked all of my co-workers. 1563 01:43:09,720 --> 01:43:10,801 So I'll tell you. 1564 01:43:11,000 --> 01:43:14,368 I don't believe in labels. I think most people have a mixture of views... 1565 01:43:14,520 --> 01:43:16,284 That's not what we're talking about. 1566 01:43:16,440 --> 01:43:18,488 Then what are you talking about, Larry? 1567 01:43:18,680 --> 01:43:21,843 We are talking about you bringing your politics into your reporting. 1568 01:43:22,000 --> 01:43:24,765 - I did nothing of the kind. - Nothing? Really? 1569 01:43:24,920 --> 01:43:27,764 Ls that why when Barnes told you he got Bush into the Guard... 1570 01:43:27,920 --> 01:43:29,649 you believed him without question? 1571 01:43:29,800 --> 01:43:33,327 That when Bill Burkett, an outspoken Bush critic and admitted liar... 1572 01:43:33,600 --> 01:43:37,491 brought you memos, you assumed their authenticity and didn't source them? 1573 01:43:37,680 --> 01:43:41,526 That when not one but two of the four document examiners... 1574 01:43:41,720 --> 01:43:43,643 expressed doubts the memos were real... 1575 01:43:43,800 --> 01:43:45,962 you pushed that aside and rushed this on air? 1576 01:43:46,120 --> 01:43:49,044 Or why you personally contacted the John Kerry campaign... 1577 01:43:49,240 --> 01:43:52,210 on behalf of Bill Burkett, a man who has dedicated himself... 1578 01:43:52,360 --> 01:43:54,362 to smearing the president? 1579 01:43:54,560 --> 01:43:55,846 Tell me, Mary. 1580 01:43:56,040 --> 01:43:59,965 Where exactly does politics not enter into this? 1581 01:44:00,560 --> 01:44:03,325 Or are you just that bad at your job? 1582 01:44:04,160 --> 01:44:06,811 Do you know what it would take to fake these memos? 1583 01:44:06,960 --> 01:44:09,247 - Mary... - No, this is important. 1584 01:44:09,400 --> 01:44:12,961 It would require the forger to have an in-depth knowledge... 1585 01:44:13,120 --> 01:44:17,330 of the 1971 Air Force manual, including rules... 1586 01:44:17,520 --> 01:44:19,966 and regulations and abbreviations. 1587 01:44:20,120 --> 01:44:22,771 He'd have to know Bush's official record front to back... 1588 01:44:22,920 --> 01:44:25,366 to make sure none of the memos conflicted with it. 1589 01:44:25,520 --> 01:44:28,683 He'd have to know all the players in the Texas Air National Guard... 1590 01:44:28,840 --> 01:44:32,401 at the time... Not just their names, but their attitudes, their opinions... 1591 01:44:32,560 --> 01:44:34,608 including how they related to one another. 1592 01:44:34,760 --> 01:44:37,809 He'd have to know Colonel Killian kept personal memos like this... 1593 01:44:38,000 --> 01:44:39,809 for himself in the first place. 1594 01:44:40,000 --> 01:44:42,606 He'd have to know how Killian felt at the time... 1595 01:44:42,760 --> 01:44:46,970 particularly about his superiors and then First Lieutenant Bush. 1596 01:44:47,120 --> 01:44:50,761 He would have to know or learn all of this... 1597 01:44:50,920 --> 01:44:54,970 in order to fool us as you assume he did. 1598 01:44:55,120 --> 01:44:56,565 Now... 1599 01:44:57,200 --> 01:44:59,680 do you really think that a man... 1600 01:44:59,840 --> 01:45:02,844 who takes this kind of time and precision... 1601 01:45:03,000 --> 01:45:06,368 then goes and types these up on Microsoft Word? 1602 01:45:13,560 --> 01:45:19,169 Our story was about whether Bush fulfilled his service. 1603 01:45:19,320 --> 01:45:22,244 Nobody wants to talk about that. They wanna talk about fonts... 1604 01:45:22,400 --> 01:45:24,402 and forgeries and conspiracy theories. 1605 01:45:24,560 --> 01:45:28,485 Because that's what people do these days if they don't like a story. 1606 01:45:28,640 --> 01:45:30,369 They point and scream. 1607 01:45:30,520 --> 01:45:33,126 They question your politics, your objectivity. Hell... 1608 01:45:33,280 --> 01:45:34,520 your basic humanity. 1609 01:45:34,760 --> 01:45:38,321 And they hope to God the truth gets lost in the scrum. 1610 01:45:38,560 --> 01:45:40,244 And when it is finally over... 1611 01:45:40,400 --> 01:45:43,483 and they have kicked and shouted so loud... 1612 01:45:43,640 --> 01:45:46,962 we can't even remember what the point was.... 1613 01:45:48,200 --> 01:45:50,771 But you didn't prove it. 1614 01:45:52,840 --> 01:45:57,209 You didn't prove Ben Barnes got the president into the Guard. 1615 01:45:57,480 --> 01:46:00,086 You didn't prove the memos are real. 1616 01:46:00,280 --> 01:46:03,568 The burden of proof is on you. 1617 01:46:03,760 --> 01:46:07,082 By that standard, The Times would never have run the Pentagon Papers. 1618 01:46:07,240 --> 01:46:09,322 The Post wouldn't have listened to Deep Throat... 1619 01:46:09,480 --> 01:46:13,724 - Ben Barnes is hardly Deep Throat. - He's confessed to abusing his power... 1620 01:46:13,880 --> 01:46:16,565 to keep some of the richest, privileged sons of Texas... 1621 01:46:16,760 --> 01:46:19,047 from getting their asses blown off in Vietnam. 1622 01:46:19,200 --> 01:46:20,804 Ms. Mapes. 1623 01:46:21,560 --> 01:46:24,086 Don't you think it's possible, just possible... 1624 01:46:24,800 --> 01:46:26,768 that some of those fine, young... 1625 01:46:26,960 --> 01:46:29,361 "privileged men, as you call them... 1626 01:46:29,600 --> 01:46:35,289 got into the National Guard on their own merit? 1627 01:46:45,320 --> 01:46:48,608 No, sir. No, I do not. 1628 01:47:07,920 --> 01:47:09,490 You had to do it, didn't you? 1629 01:47:10,480 --> 01:47:13,723 In the immortal words of Popeye, "I am what I am." 1630 01:47:14,600 --> 01:47:17,888 Well, I would have gone with "To thine own self be true"... 1631 01:47:18,040 --> 01:47:19,929 but Popeye works. 1632 01:47:20,120 --> 01:47:23,329 They'll have their findings in a few weeks. I'll call you when I hear. 1633 01:47:23,480 --> 01:47:26,723 All right. Thanks. 1634 01:47:29,680 --> 01:47:31,444 Hey, Mary. 1635 01:47:33,040 --> 01:47:34,849 I believe you. 1636 01:47:46,880 --> 01:47:51,408 But I think he needs a helmet. Have you got a helmet? 1637 01:47:52,120 --> 01:47:56,409 - A helmet? - He needs a helmet. 1638 01:47:56,560 --> 01:47:59,291 - Oh, he hasn't got a head. - Dang it. 1639 01:47:59,440 --> 01:48:01,727 Can you find a head? 1640 01:48:03,800 --> 01:48:05,290 No. 1641 01:48:07,080 --> 01:48:11,688 - Unless you want to chop his head... - Chop his head off? Maybe. 1642 01:48:18,560 --> 01:48:20,050 Hello? 1643 01:48:20,200 --> 01:48:23,682 Mary, the report is out and it's very bad. 1644 01:48:24,600 --> 01:48:26,568 I'm putting Jonathan Anschultz on the line. 1645 01:48:26,720 --> 01:48:28,768 - Jonathan, can you hear me? - Yeah. 1646 01:48:29,040 --> 01:48:32,328 Mary, as I said, the report's bad. You're being terminated. 1647 01:48:34,040 --> 01:48:37,761 It's not something I would've chosen to do under the circumstances, but.... 1648 01:50:36,280 --> 01:50:37,645 Hippie scum. 1649 01:50:38,600 --> 01:50:40,682 Jarhead fuck. 1650 01:50:44,400 --> 01:50:45,925 If you ever need a reference... 1651 01:50:46,280 --> 01:50:47,611 What, you can... 1652 01:50:47,760 --> 01:50:50,411 tell them how we destroyed modern journalism together? 1653 01:50:57,720 --> 01:50:59,688 I'll see you around. 1654 01:51:04,480 --> 01:51:09,691 We've shared a lot in the 24 years we've been meeting here each evening. 1655 01:51:10,200 --> 01:51:15,286 And before I say good night, this night, I need to say thank you. 1656 01:51:15,720 --> 01:51:19,691 Thank you to the thousands of wonderful professionals at CBS News... 1657 01:51:19,840 --> 01:51:21,604 past and present... 1658 01:51:21,800 --> 01:51:25,361 with whom it's been my honor to work over these years. 1659 01:51:26,640 --> 01:51:29,610 And a deeply felt thanks to all of you... 1660 01:51:29,760 --> 01:51:33,526 who have let us into your homes night after night. 1661 01:51:33,760 --> 01:51:38,482 It has been a privilege, and one never taken lightly. 1662 01:51:39,160 --> 01:51:44,690 To a nation still nursing a broken heart for what happened here in 2001 1663 01:51:44,880 --> 01:51:47,611 and especially those who found themselves closest... 1664 01:51:47,800 --> 01:51:49,802 to the events of September the 11th. 1665 01:51:51,120 --> 01:51:56,047 To our soldiers, our sailors, our airmen and Marines in dangerous places. 1666 01:51:56,880 --> 01:52:00,009 And to those who have endured the tsunami. 1667 01:52:00,160 --> 01:52:03,004 And to all who have suffered natural disasters... 1668 01:52:03,160 --> 01:52:06,164 and who must find the will to rebuild. 1669 01:52:06,640 --> 01:52:11,009 To the oppressed and to those whose lot it is to struggle... 1670 01:52:11,200 --> 01:52:14,921 in financial hardship or in failing health. 1671 01:52:16,360 --> 01:52:17,885 To my fellow journalists... 1672 01:52:18,320 --> 01:52:22,769 in places where reporting the truth means risking all. 1673 01:52:23,400 --> 01:52:26,290 And to each of you... 1674 01:52:27,240 --> 01:52:28,765 courage. 1675 01:52:29,960 --> 01:52:33,362 For the CBS Evening News, Dan Rather reporting. 1676 01:52:34,880 --> 01:52:36,450 Good night. 1677 01:54:14,040 --> 01:54:16,088 My God. 1678 01:54:19,280 --> 01:54:21,169 You wanna go for a walk? 1679 01:54:21,320 --> 01:54:22,810 Yeah. 140290

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