Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated:
1
00:00:07,333 --> 00:00:10,333
WOMAN: Natalie Wood falls
into the category of an icon.
2
00:00:10,417 --> 00:00:11,917
NATASHA GREGSON WAGNER:
By the age of 25,
3
00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:14,417
my mom had been nominated
for three Oscars.
4
00:00:14,583 --> 00:00:16,583
The focus on how she died
5
00:00:16,667 --> 00:00:18,792
has overshadowed
her life's work.
6
00:00:19,291 --> 00:00:22,834
In a town where women were not
always respected,
7
00:00:22,917 --> 00:00:23,917
she was an exception.
8
00:00:24,166 --> 00:00:26,250
She had a big heart
and that showed up in her work.
9
00:00:26,333 --> 00:00:28,333
NATALIE WOOD: I've enjoyed
the part where you act,
10
00:00:28,417 --> 00:00:31,000
not the stardom that follows it.
11
00:00:31,250 --> 00:00:33,041
♪ (MUSIC OUTRO PLAYS) ♪
12
00:00:41,750 --> 00:00:42,458
WOMAN: Almost overnight,
13
00:00:43,083 --> 00:00:45,750
23 cases were boxed up
and it's like Wayne did that.
14
00:00:46,458 --> 00:00:50,333
Once Atlanta was provided
an out, they took it.
15
00:00:50,417 --> 00:00:52,875
♪ (DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYS) ♪
16
00:00:52,959 --> 00:00:55,166
MAN: There were so many things
that just pointed directly
17
00:00:55,250 --> 00:00:56,458
at Wayne Williams.
18
00:00:56,834 --> 00:00:58,208
It was all fake math.
19
00:00:58,291 --> 00:01:00,500
And they presented it
to the jury as hard fact.
20
00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:03,542
Almost every key witness
against Wayne Williams
21
00:01:03,625 --> 00:01:06,333
committed perjury
or gave misleading testimony.
22
00:01:06,792 --> 00:01:09,875
How do you defend against
what we did not know?
23
00:01:10,166 --> 00:01:14,000
WOMAN 2: Some of these children
should not have been attributed
24
00:01:14,083 --> 00:01:15,250
to Wayne Williams.
25
00:01:15,458 --> 00:01:17,959
MAN: The person identified
to police
26
00:01:18,041 --> 00:01:19,917
had a scar down his face.
27
00:01:20,125 --> 00:01:23,333
WOMAN 3: The investigators think
that there was at least
28
00:01:23,750 --> 00:01:25,125
one other killer.
29
00:01:26,041 --> 00:01:27,417
[TV static drones]
30
00:01:27,500 --> 00:01:29,667
[bright tone]
31
00:01:37,166 --> 00:01:40,125
["Save Me"
by Joan Armatrading playing]
32
00:01:40,208 --> 00:01:41,291
♪ ♪
33
00:01:41,375 --> 00:01:45,083
- ♪ Sinking ♪
34
00:01:45,166 --> 00:01:49,875
♪ Caught up
in a whirling motion ♪
35
00:01:49,959 --> 00:01:53,125
♪ Such a strange sensation ♪
36
00:01:53,208 --> 00:01:56,667
♪ ♪
37
00:01:56,750 --> 00:02:01,291
♪ The currents uncertain ♪
38
00:02:01,375 --> 00:02:05,125
♪ Like sails of a mill,
I spin ♪
39
00:02:07,166 --> 00:02:10,125
♪ Like wheels,
I move in a circle ♪
40
00:02:10,208 --> 00:02:13,125
♪ While you stand ♪
41
00:02:13,208 --> 00:02:16,125
♪ On the bank ♪
42
00:02:16,208 --> 00:02:21,000
♪ Immune or evasive ♪
43
00:02:21,083 --> 00:02:23,000
♪ Throw me a lifeline ♪
44
00:02:23,083 --> 00:02:26,375
♪ Save me ♪
45
00:02:27,542 --> 00:02:34,000
♪ Save me ♪
46
00:02:34,083 --> 00:02:36,917
- Everybody, please stand
and join hands.
47
00:02:38,375 --> 00:02:39,792
- Father God,
48
00:02:39,875 --> 00:02:41,625
oh, I ask that you would bless
49
00:02:41,709 --> 00:02:44,208
each and every one
that is here, Lord.
50
00:02:45,792 --> 00:02:49,834
Bless every parent, Lord,
that lost a child, Lord.
51
00:02:49,917 --> 00:02:52,083
In Jesus' name we pray.
Amen.
52
00:02:52,166 --> 00:02:53,291
all: Amen.
53
00:02:54,542 --> 00:02:56,458
- Yeah.
[laughs]
54
00:02:56,542 --> 00:02:59,959
- I stayed with the mothers
for a long time.
55
00:03:00,041 --> 00:03:01,208
- Oh, we gonna get started,
56
00:03:01,291 --> 00:03:03,792
and y'all gonna have a chance
to tell y'all's story, okay?
57
00:03:03,875 --> 00:03:05,000
- All right.
58
00:03:05,083 --> 00:03:06,500
- Bless you.
- Bless you.
59
00:03:06,583 --> 00:03:08,291
We had a little group
going on
60
00:03:08,375 --> 00:03:10,333
till about '85.
61
00:03:10,417 --> 00:03:12,333
This lady called
Mildred Glover,
62
00:03:12,417 --> 00:03:15,959
we would go to her house
every Saturday.
63
00:03:16,041 --> 00:03:18,667
She helped us
through a whole lot.
64
00:03:18,750 --> 00:03:20,500
[somber music]
65
00:03:20,583 --> 00:03:23,458
- It was very important
that we all stick together
66
00:03:23,542 --> 00:03:24,834
as a group,
67
00:03:24,917 --> 00:03:26,875
the ones that were still alive.
68
00:03:26,959 --> 00:03:28,500
♪ ♪
69
00:03:28,583 --> 00:03:31,125
I came in
with a 35-millimeter camera
70
00:03:31,208 --> 00:03:34,041
and just started
shooting pictures.
71
00:03:34,125 --> 00:03:38,542
♪ ♪
72
00:03:38,625 --> 00:03:41,917
- I remember I was at
Miss Mildred Glover's.
73
00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:44,417
While a handful of parents
and Miss Glover
74
00:03:44,500 --> 00:03:46,709
was talking in the home,
75
00:03:46,792 --> 00:03:48,750
me as a child,
I'm on the porch,
76
00:03:48,834 --> 00:03:50,375
playing around.
77
00:03:50,458 --> 00:03:52,709
This blue car pulls up.
78
00:03:52,792 --> 00:03:56,250
This guy, tall white guy,
79
00:03:56,333 --> 00:03:57,667
took a brick,
80
00:03:57,750 --> 00:03:59,667
and he slung it
through that window,
81
00:03:59,750 --> 00:04:03,375
and I remember
Miss Glover's husband
82
00:04:03,458 --> 00:04:05,083
come running out of the door
83
00:04:05,166 --> 00:04:06,875
and asked me,
"Ron, what'd you do?"
84
00:04:06,959 --> 00:04:08,667
I said, "I ain't do anything,
Mr. Bill.
85
00:04:08,750 --> 00:04:09,875
That man did it."
86
00:04:09,959 --> 00:04:11,917
And he jumps in his car,
87
00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:13,625
and he turns around,
88
00:04:13,709 --> 00:04:17,625
and he did a gesture like that
out of the window.
89
00:04:17,709 --> 00:04:21,208
♪ ♪
90
00:04:21,291 --> 00:04:23,417
That brick had a note on it.
91
00:04:23,500 --> 00:04:26,542
It said, "We gonna kill
all you niggers."
92
00:04:26,625 --> 00:04:28,375
That's what that note said.
93
00:04:28,458 --> 00:04:30,333
"We gonna kill
all you niggers."
94
00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:34,041
I'll never forget that day.
95
00:04:34,125 --> 00:04:36,875
♪ ♪
96
00:04:36,959 --> 00:04:39,750
- All these
strange things happen
97
00:04:39,834 --> 00:04:42,375
related to the case.
98
00:04:42,458 --> 00:04:44,375
Wayne was in jail...
99
00:04:44,458 --> 00:04:47,542
might've been
a couple of years.
100
00:04:47,625 --> 00:04:51,583
And I'd been working
to get the next appeal ready
101
00:04:51,667 --> 00:04:54,417
when something new
come into the mix.
102
00:04:54,500 --> 00:04:56,625
[suspenseful music]
103
00:04:56,709 --> 00:04:59,750
So my offices
was on Ralph McGill.
104
00:04:59,834 --> 00:05:03,875
I remember coming up
on my doorstep,
105
00:05:03,959 --> 00:05:05,625
there was a package
106
00:05:05,709 --> 00:05:08,166
that was left for me.
107
00:05:08,250 --> 00:05:11,917
I don't know who brought it.
108
00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:14,834
Maybe I do know who brought it,
but I can't say.
109
00:05:14,917 --> 00:05:19,166
[laughs]
But man, it was incredible.
110
00:05:19,250 --> 00:05:22,500
♪ ♪
111
00:05:22,583 --> 00:05:25,458
There was page after page.
112
00:05:25,542 --> 00:05:28,834
Some of it
was hand-written longhand.
113
00:05:28,917 --> 00:05:30,792
Some of it was typed up.
114
00:05:30,875 --> 00:05:35,458
Every bit of it was about
an undercover investigation
115
00:05:35,542 --> 00:05:38,375
which took place
in early '81.
116
00:05:38,458 --> 00:05:40,166
♪ ♪
117
00:05:40,250 --> 00:05:42,000
- The Georgia Bureau
of Investigation
118
00:05:42,083 --> 00:05:46,500
had opened up
an entire investigation
119
00:05:46,583 --> 00:05:50,542
focusing on Ku Klux Klan
involvement in the killings.
120
00:05:50,625 --> 00:05:54,166
♪ ♪
121
00:05:54,250 --> 00:05:56,667
It had been kept
completely secret,
122
00:05:56,750 --> 00:05:59,000
and indeed,
separate and apart from
123
00:05:59,083 --> 00:06:01,458
the task force that was
investigating the murders,
124
00:06:01,542 --> 00:06:03,417
separate from
the prosecuting authorities.
125
00:06:03,500 --> 00:06:06,458
That evidence
had never been presented
126
00:06:06,542 --> 00:06:08,500
to the defense
at any time.
127
00:06:08,583 --> 00:06:10,208
- I was excited, man.
128
00:06:10,291 --> 00:06:13,208
I was excited
because I thought these files,
129
00:06:13,291 --> 00:06:14,959
the anonymous package,
130
00:06:15,041 --> 00:06:20,375
was overwhelming violation
of the Brady Law.
131
00:06:20,458 --> 00:06:21,875
- The United States
Supreme Court,
132
00:06:21,959 --> 00:06:24,792
in a case called
Brady versus Maryland,
133
00:06:24,875 --> 00:06:27,583
held that the prosecution
is required
134
00:06:27,667 --> 00:06:29,375
to provide to the defense
135
00:06:29,458 --> 00:06:31,542
any and all evidence
136
00:06:31,625 --> 00:06:36,875
that tends to exonerate
or exculpate a defendant.
137
00:06:36,959 --> 00:06:39,208
Because the prosecution
and the police
138
00:06:39,291 --> 00:06:42,041
tend to have the ability
to collect far more evidence
139
00:06:42,125 --> 00:06:43,542
than the defense does,
140
00:06:43,625 --> 00:06:45,041
they have to disclose it.
141
00:06:45,125 --> 00:06:48,208
In this case,
they didn't do it.
142
00:06:48,291 --> 00:06:51,500
- It was a no-brainer
that this would give Wayne
143
00:06:51,583 --> 00:06:53,375
a new trial.
144
00:06:53,458 --> 00:06:55,542
- Wayne Williams
is being represented
145
00:06:55,625 --> 00:06:57,083
in this hearing
for a new trial
146
00:06:57,166 --> 00:06:59,542
by his former attorney,
Lynn Whatley,
147
00:06:59,625 --> 00:07:02,458
and two of this country's
most prominent attorneys,
148
00:07:02,542 --> 00:07:04,875
Bobby Lee Cook
of Summerville, Georgia,
149
00:07:04,959 --> 00:07:07,583
and William Kunstler
of New York.
150
00:07:07,667 --> 00:07:10,250
- I'm here in my antiquity,
151
00:07:10,333 --> 00:07:12,750
hoping to do some good
in the world.
152
00:07:12,834 --> 00:07:15,458
- I had always admired
William Kunstler,
153
00:07:15,542 --> 00:07:17,959
even as a very young person.
154
00:07:18,041 --> 00:07:20,458
I watched his work
in the Chicago Eight,
155
00:07:20,542 --> 00:07:23,291
which later became
the Chicago Seven trial.
156
00:07:23,375 --> 00:07:24,417
He fought the House
157
00:07:24,500 --> 00:07:26,917
of Un-American Activities
Committee.
158
00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:28,291
He represented Dr. King.
159
00:07:28,375 --> 00:07:30,041
He represented
the Black Panthers,
160
00:07:30,125 --> 00:07:32,417
the anti-war movement,
the American Indian movement,
161
00:07:32,500 --> 00:07:33,709
and it's like, "Wow.
162
00:07:33,792 --> 00:07:36,250
That's who I want to be
when I grow up."
163
00:07:36,333 --> 00:07:38,417
- Civil rights specialist
William Kunstler
164
00:07:38,500 --> 00:07:40,625
and Harvard Law School's
Alan Dershowitz say
165
00:07:40,709 --> 00:07:42,625
they have proof that police
withheld evidence
166
00:07:42,709 --> 00:07:44,667
of a possible Ku Klux Klan
suspect
167
00:07:44,750 --> 00:07:45,792
out of fear.
168
00:07:45,875 --> 00:07:47,125
- We're asking to have
an opportunity
169
00:07:47,208 --> 00:07:48,458
to see all the files.
170
00:07:48,542 --> 00:07:50,166
Let's have a fair fight.
171
00:07:50,250 --> 00:07:52,542
Let's have
a true scientific test,
172
00:07:52,625 --> 00:07:55,166
and let the chips fall
where they may
173
00:07:55,250 --> 00:07:56,959
without any loaded dice.
174
00:07:57,041 --> 00:08:01,792
- And, of course, we had
the amazing Bobby Lee Cook.
175
00:08:01,875 --> 00:08:04,792
He was already
a legendary figure
176
00:08:04,875 --> 00:08:06,834
in Georgia legal circles.
177
00:08:06,917 --> 00:08:11,834
♪ ♪
178
00:08:11,917 --> 00:08:13,792
- There's no other way to talk
about Bobby Lee Cook
179
00:08:13,875 --> 00:08:15,458
other than brilliant.
180
00:08:15,542 --> 00:08:18,000
They say the "Matlock"
television series
181
00:08:18,083 --> 00:08:20,083
was based on Bobby Lee Cook.
182
00:08:20,166 --> 00:08:22,959
- We've heard some
pretty confusing testimony
183
00:08:23,041 --> 00:08:23,959
around here lately.
184
00:08:24,041 --> 00:08:26,166
First, Lucas perjures himself,
185
00:08:26,250 --> 00:08:27,834
and then your wife
perjures herself.
186
00:08:27,917 --> 00:08:29,125
What's going on?
187
00:08:29,208 --> 00:08:30,834
♪ ♪
188
00:08:30,917 --> 00:08:35,000
- So we had
a pretty all-star team.
189
00:08:35,083 --> 00:08:38,375
The hearings were down
in Butts County,
190
00:08:38,458 --> 00:08:41,166
about an hour
outside of Atlanta.
191
00:08:41,250 --> 00:08:44,291
That's where
the electric chair is,
192
00:08:44,375 --> 00:08:45,709
down there,
Butts County.
193
00:08:45,792 --> 00:08:52,750
♪ ♪
194
00:08:52,834 --> 00:08:57,500
The hearings are set
in this old courtroom.
195
00:08:57,583 --> 00:09:00,500
The press was there.
196
00:09:00,583 --> 00:09:02,375
The courtroom was full,
197
00:09:02,458 --> 00:09:06,458
and it played itself out
pretty big.
198
00:09:16,250 --> 00:09:18,583
- You ladies and gentlemen
ready to proceed now?
199
00:09:18,667 --> 00:09:20,792
- Yes, we are.
200
00:09:20,875 --> 00:09:23,041
Judge, we'd like
to begin this proceeding
201
00:09:23,125 --> 00:09:25,542
with a short overview.
202
00:09:25,625 --> 00:09:30,333
We will present a plethora
of undisclosed documents
203
00:09:30,417 --> 00:09:32,208
and evidence
that we have collected
204
00:09:32,291 --> 00:09:35,583
since the trial.
205
00:09:35,667 --> 00:09:39,417
We do expect to show
that Williams, in fact,
206
00:09:39,500 --> 00:09:41,750
was denied
his constitutional rights
207
00:09:41,834 --> 00:09:44,750
in a very abundant fashion.
208
00:09:44,834 --> 00:09:46,959
- The first witness today,
Billy Joe Whitaker,
209
00:09:47,041 --> 00:09:49,291
says he worked
as a police informant
210
00:09:49,375 --> 00:09:51,959
during the missing
and murdered investigation.
211
00:09:52,041 --> 00:09:53,583
- Why did you come
to see me?
212
00:09:53,667 --> 00:09:55,250
I believe you called me,
did you not?
213
00:09:55,333 --> 00:09:58,333
- Yes, sir.
- And why did you do that?
214
00:09:58,417 --> 00:09:59,917
- I figured, "Well,
215
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:01,583
"here's a man
in a penitentiary,
216
00:10:01,667 --> 00:10:03,250
"been there eight or ten years,
217
00:10:03,333 --> 00:10:05,250
"and I know he's not guilty
of what--
218
00:10:05,333 --> 00:10:06,792
the ones
they convicted him of."
219
00:10:06,875 --> 00:10:07,917
He might've killed
the rest of them.
220
00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:09,250
I don't know about that.
221
00:10:09,333 --> 00:10:11,083
But I knew in my own mind,
222
00:10:11,166 --> 00:10:13,291
and the GBI knew it,
that this man didn't--
223
00:10:13,375 --> 00:10:15,917
he didn't kill
those two people.
224
00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:17,291
- That's the reason
you came to me?
225
00:10:17,375 --> 00:10:19,125
- Yes, sir.
226
00:10:19,208 --> 00:10:20,917
- Billy Whitaker
227
00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:23,208
was a confidential informant
228
00:10:23,291 --> 00:10:25,375
who had infiltrated the Klan.
229
00:10:25,458 --> 00:10:26,917
- Hail victory.
230
00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:28,583
all: Hail victory!
231
00:10:28,667 --> 00:10:29,583
- Hail victory.
232
00:10:29,667 --> 00:10:31,000
all: Hail victory!
233
00:10:31,083 --> 00:10:34,667
- The first I heard
of potential Klan involvement
234
00:10:34,750 --> 00:10:37,125
was a detective with Atlanta
235
00:10:37,208 --> 00:10:39,083
named Aubrey Melton.
236
00:10:39,166 --> 00:10:41,750
♪ ♪
237
00:10:41,834 --> 00:10:44,458
Melton came forward
to the GBI
238
00:10:44,542 --> 00:10:46,792
with a confidential informant.
239
00:10:46,875 --> 00:10:49,333
Melton was a good street cop,
240
00:10:49,417 --> 00:10:50,917
but we had the capacity
241
00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:54,000
to bring more resources
to the table.
242
00:10:54,083 --> 00:10:58,333
We took the informant's
information very seriously.
243
00:10:58,417 --> 00:11:00,375
My boss detached me
244
00:11:00,458 --> 00:11:03,792
to head up
the Klan investigation.
245
00:11:03,875 --> 00:11:06,750
[marchers chanting]
246
00:11:06,834 --> 00:11:08,000
The Klan was engaged
247
00:11:08,083 --> 00:11:10,667
in a lot of activity
at the time.
248
00:11:10,750 --> 00:11:12,875
They were marching
on weekends,
249
00:11:12,959 --> 00:11:14,917
and they were
very disruptive.
250
00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:16,458
[marchers chanting]
251
00:11:16,542 --> 00:11:18,709
The Klan clearly had
252
00:11:18,792 --> 00:11:21,041
every right to march
and protest...
253
00:11:21,125 --> 00:11:22,709
- Go home, nigger!
254
00:11:22,792 --> 00:11:25,000
- But when you enter
criminal activity,
255
00:11:25,083 --> 00:11:26,625
they crossed the line
256
00:11:26,709 --> 00:11:28,709
to bring our attention
to them.
257
00:11:28,792 --> 00:11:30,333
♪ ♪
258
00:11:30,417 --> 00:11:34,000
- The GBI investigation
focuses on the Sanders family.
259
00:11:34,083 --> 00:11:35,166
There are six brothers,
260
00:11:35,250 --> 00:11:36,542
and the Sanders brothers
are involved
261
00:11:36,625 --> 00:11:38,291
in an offshoot of the Klan
262
00:11:38,375 --> 00:11:40,166
called the National
States' Rights Party,
263
00:11:40,250 --> 00:11:41,667
or the NSRP.
264
00:11:41,750 --> 00:11:44,542
It was initially founded
by J.B. Stoner.
265
00:11:44,625 --> 00:11:47,333
- Only way Forsyth County
can have law and order
266
00:11:47,417 --> 00:11:48,625
and peace and tranquility...
267
00:11:48,709 --> 00:11:50,208
both: Is keep the niggers out.
268
00:11:50,291 --> 00:11:52,417
- And they basically said
the KKK
269
00:11:52,500 --> 00:11:53,709
were not radical enough.
270
00:11:53,792 --> 00:11:55,583
One of their earliest recruits
271
00:11:55,667 --> 00:11:58,000
was Joseph Paul Franklin,
272
00:11:58,083 --> 00:12:00,792
who was going
around the country
273
00:12:00,875 --> 00:12:04,750
shooting any integrated couple
that he saw.
274
00:12:04,834 --> 00:12:06,750
So that's just--you know,
give you some idea
275
00:12:06,834 --> 00:12:08,375
about the NSRP.
276
00:12:08,458 --> 00:12:10,875
- White power!
all: White power!
277
00:12:10,959 --> 00:12:12,750
- One of their chief officers
278
00:12:12,834 --> 00:12:14,750
was Donald Willard Sanders.
279
00:12:16,041 --> 00:12:17,792
He's a third-ranking officer
280
00:12:17,875 --> 00:12:19,208
under J.B. Stoner
281
00:12:19,291 --> 00:12:21,333
[foreboding music]
282
00:12:21,417 --> 00:12:22,709
He was one
of the six brothers
283
00:12:22,792 --> 00:12:24,083
in the Sanders clan.
284
00:12:24,166 --> 00:12:25,709
♪ ♪
285
00:12:25,792 --> 00:12:27,375
They were notorious
drug addicts.
286
00:12:27,458 --> 00:12:28,750
I mean, they shot
every drug in the book,
287
00:12:28,834 --> 00:12:31,959
and they sold
every drug in the book.
288
00:12:32,041 --> 00:12:34,083
The main suspects
were the older brothers,
289
00:12:34,166 --> 00:12:36,625
Don Sanders,
Jerry Sanders,
290
00:12:36,709 --> 00:12:38,208
and Charles Sanders.
291
00:12:38,291 --> 00:12:39,750
♪ ♪
292
00:12:39,834 --> 00:12:42,792
- How long had you known
Charles T. Sanders?
293
00:12:42,875 --> 00:12:44,834
- Well, at that time,
I'd probably known him
294
00:12:44,917 --> 00:12:46,250
ten years.
295
00:12:46,333 --> 00:12:48,208
Charles said--
296
00:12:48,291 --> 00:12:50,875
he was always trying to get me
to join the Klan, you know,
297
00:12:50,959 --> 00:12:53,250
and...
298
00:12:53,333 --> 00:12:56,542
they said they had
a lot of money behind them,
299
00:12:56,625 --> 00:12:58,083
people I didn't know,
300
00:12:58,166 --> 00:13:01,792
and people even he didn't know,
he said.
301
00:13:01,875 --> 00:13:03,709
Charles took me downstairs
302
00:13:03,792 --> 00:13:05,417
in the garage.
303
00:13:05,500 --> 00:13:07,417
They had bazookas,
they had--
304
00:13:07,500 --> 00:13:08,583
- Bazookas?
305
00:13:08,667 --> 00:13:09,792
- Bazookas, yeah.
306
00:13:09,875 --> 00:13:11,667
They had hand grenades.
307
00:13:11,750 --> 00:13:14,291
They had C-2 and C-4
explosives.
308
00:13:14,375 --> 00:13:16,166
Well, they had
police uniforms,
309
00:13:16,250 --> 00:13:18,458
Atlanta police uniforms.
They had...
310
00:13:18,542 --> 00:13:20,959
- The Sanders brothers had
all these different uniforms.
311
00:13:21,041 --> 00:13:22,542
- Had DeKalb County
uniform.
312
00:13:22,625 --> 00:13:24,792
- Coca-Cola,
Purolator.
313
00:13:24,875 --> 00:13:27,291
- They had
sanitation uniforms.
314
00:13:27,375 --> 00:13:30,125
- So maybe this let them be
in certain places undetected.
315
00:13:30,208 --> 00:13:31,959
[suspenseful music]
316
00:13:32,041 --> 00:13:34,291
- One of the theories
was that the perpetrator
317
00:13:34,375 --> 00:13:35,917
had to be somebody
that was gonna
318
00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:37,500
walk around that neighborhood
319
00:13:37,583 --> 00:13:38,750
almost invisible,
320
00:13:38,834 --> 00:13:39,917
so like a postman
321
00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:41,291
or a police officer.
322
00:13:41,375 --> 00:13:44,000
♪ ♪
323
00:13:44,083 --> 00:13:45,792
- It's possible
that these children
324
00:13:45,875 --> 00:13:48,000
are being captured by the Klan
325
00:13:48,083 --> 00:13:50,625
dressed in law enforcement
uniforms.
326
00:13:50,709 --> 00:13:52,291
- You know, everybody,
everything evolves,
327
00:13:52,375 --> 00:13:53,625
and the Klan had evolved.
328
00:13:53,709 --> 00:13:58,000
They had this idea where we're
going to start a race war.
329
00:13:58,083 --> 00:14:00,667
- We're convinced
that there's a race war
330
00:14:00,750 --> 00:14:03,417
that is inevitable
in this country.
331
00:14:03,500 --> 00:14:06,083
We feel that there will
be so much shooting
332
00:14:06,166 --> 00:14:07,625
and burning and looting
and rioting
333
00:14:07,709 --> 00:14:09,291
that literally, the authorities
334
00:14:09,375 --> 00:14:11,750
will not be able to cope
with it.
335
00:14:11,834 --> 00:14:13,250
- So what will Klansmen do?
336
00:14:13,333 --> 00:14:15,500
- Well, we're gonna defend
ourselves and our property
337
00:14:15,583 --> 00:14:19,333
and help assist other people
in doing the same.
338
00:14:19,417 --> 00:14:22,625
- At the time, there
was a lot of uncertainty
339
00:14:22,709 --> 00:14:25,166
about who was going to control
the political structure,
340
00:14:25,250 --> 00:14:27,834
who was going to control
the economic resources,
341
00:14:27,917 --> 00:14:30,041
and the Klan was empowered.
342
00:14:30,125 --> 00:14:32,667
They were making
their presence felt.
343
00:14:32,750 --> 00:14:34,834
- It was like this was a plan
344
00:14:34,917 --> 00:14:39,583
to diminish Atlanta's
and Maynard Jackson's success.
345
00:14:39,667 --> 00:14:41,375
♪ ♪
346
00:14:41,458 --> 00:14:43,959
- These were not people
who were simply
347
00:14:44,041 --> 00:14:47,208
play-acting at being bad guys.
348
00:14:47,291 --> 00:14:50,875
And so Aubrey Melton persuaded
349
00:14:50,959 --> 00:14:55,417
the GBI to apply
for wiretap warrants,
350
00:14:55,500 --> 00:14:57,917
which can only be made
on the showing
351
00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,917
of probable cause
to believe the people involved
352
00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:02,875
had committed a crime,
353
00:15:02,959 --> 00:15:04,542
in this case,
the child murders.
354
00:15:04,625 --> 00:15:06,542
- They wanted me to wear a bug.
355
00:15:06,625 --> 00:15:08,375
- Did you agree to that?
356
00:15:08,458 --> 00:15:09,917
- I didn't care what they did.
You know, I was trying--
357
00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:11,375
- You agreed to it.
- I was trying to help them
358
00:15:11,458 --> 00:15:12,917
catch the people doing that.
359
00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:15,375
- How did they wire you up?
360
00:15:15,458 --> 00:15:17,667
- They just put it on me
and taped it around me.
361
00:15:17,750 --> 00:15:19,917
- While the wiretap
was in progress,
362
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,291
we also conducted
physical surveillance.
363
00:15:22,375 --> 00:15:24,667
[machine clicking]
364
00:15:25,458 --> 00:15:28,542
- There were,
to the best of your knowledge,
365
00:15:28,625 --> 00:15:30,750
dozens, if not hundreds,
of those tapes.
366
00:15:30,834 --> 00:15:31,917
Isn't that right?
367
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:33,792
- There were several
368
00:15:33,875 --> 00:15:36,417
reel-to-reel tapes made.
369
00:15:36,500 --> 00:15:39,417
When you monitor,
you monitor 24/7,
370
00:15:39,500 --> 00:15:41,542
from when they get up
to when they go to bed,
371
00:15:41,625 --> 00:15:45,875
hours and hours,
days and days of tapes.
372
00:15:45,959 --> 00:15:48,917
- Was there ever
any conversation that you had
373
00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:50,709
that was recorded
374
00:15:50,792 --> 00:15:54,041
with reference to what
Charles Sanders
375
00:15:54,125 --> 00:15:57,917
and his group were doing
with children?
376
00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:00,834
- They was killing niggers.
That's what he said.
377
00:16:00,917 --> 00:16:02,333
He told me,
"We're killing niggers.
378
00:16:02,417 --> 00:16:04,625
We're gonna start
killing females too."
379
00:16:04,709 --> 00:16:07,625
[disquieting music]
380
00:16:07,709 --> 00:16:08,959
♪ ♪
381
00:16:09,041 --> 00:16:11,083
He said, "We killed a lot
of these fucking niggers."
382
00:16:11,166 --> 00:16:18,166
♪ ♪
383
00:16:21,166 --> 00:16:25,125
- When a man is charged
with the killing of 29 people,
384
00:16:25,208 --> 00:16:27,291
and they charge him for two,
385
00:16:27,375 --> 00:16:29,375
there's a lot
of unanswered questions.
386
00:16:30,333 --> 00:16:31,834
- Like what?
387
00:16:31,917 --> 00:16:35,208
- Like what happened
to the other 27?
388
00:16:35,291 --> 00:16:38,125
There was 29.
He was convicted on 2.
389
00:16:38,208 --> 00:16:39,583
- [coughs]
390
00:16:39,667 --> 00:16:40,625
- I'd be interested
to know what happened--
391
00:16:40,709 --> 00:16:42,166
- John, you ain't rolling that,
are you?
392
00:16:42,250 --> 00:16:43,291
- Hmm?
- Yes.
393
00:16:43,375 --> 00:16:44,542
- You're not rolling this,
are you?
394
00:16:44,625 --> 00:16:45,625
- Yes.
- I'm rolling.
395
00:16:46,917 --> 00:16:50,000
- I would think there's a lot
of unanswered questions.
396
00:16:50,083 --> 00:16:51,834
You don't?
I mean...
397
00:16:51,917 --> 00:16:55,417
there's 27 unsolved mysteries
out there.
398
00:17:03,625 --> 00:17:07,709
And your name is surfacing
399
00:17:07,792 --> 00:17:10,667
in connection with...
400
00:17:10,750 --> 00:17:13,750
[paper rustling]
401
00:17:15,750 --> 00:17:18,417
In connection
with this quote that...
402
00:17:20,542 --> 00:17:22,166
"Yeah, we damn sure did.
403
00:17:22,250 --> 00:17:24,458
We killed a lot
of them niggers."
404
00:17:29,458 --> 00:17:30,542
- That's a blatant lie.
405
00:17:30,625 --> 00:17:34,000
That's a blatant lie
from Mr. Bill Whitaker,
406
00:17:34,083 --> 00:17:37,625
and that's a blatant lie
from the defense.
407
00:17:41,083 --> 00:17:43,917
- You reported all of this
to Mr. Melton.
408
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:47,375
- Well, I told him
I knew about--
409
00:17:47,458 --> 00:17:49,041
about one of those kids
getting killed,
410
00:17:49,125 --> 00:17:50,542
who it was that did it,
411
00:17:50,625 --> 00:17:53,375
and he had told me
he was gonna do it,
412
00:17:53,458 --> 00:17:54,959
and it happened.
413
00:17:55,041 --> 00:17:56,750
I read it in the paper,
so I called Melton.
414
00:17:56,834 --> 00:17:58,500
- All right.
What'd you tell Mr. Melton?
415
00:17:58,583 --> 00:18:00,834
- Well, I told him that
I believed Charles Sanders
416
00:18:00,917 --> 00:18:02,500
of the Ku Klux Klan
417
00:18:02,583 --> 00:18:05,166
killed this one kid
named Geter.
418
00:18:05,250 --> 00:18:07,208
This little kid
run into his van.
419
00:18:07,291 --> 00:18:08,250
- What little kid?
420
00:18:08,333 --> 00:18:10,917
- Geter, on a go-cart.
421
00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:12,083
He lost control of it,
422
00:18:12,166 --> 00:18:14,250
and he run into the side
of that van.
423
00:18:14,333 --> 00:18:16,959
- Geter ran into Sanders's car
with the go-cart?
424
00:18:17,041 --> 00:18:19,375
- Yeah, and he said,
"I'm gonna"--
425
00:18:19,458 --> 00:18:21,458
well, I don't want to say that.
- Use the words that he said.
426
00:18:21,542 --> 00:18:24,083
This is a court,
court of law,
427
00:18:24,166 --> 00:18:26,875
and use the words
that he said.
428
00:18:28,166 --> 00:18:29,291
- Well, you got ladies in here.
429
00:18:29,375 --> 00:18:32,083
- That's all right.
You go ahead.
430
00:18:32,166 --> 00:18:33,125
- Well, he said,
"I'm gonna kill
431
00:18:33,208 --> 00:18:34,458
"that little black bastard,
432
00:18:34,542 --> 00:18:36,125
"and I'm gonna choke him
to death with my dick
433
00:18:36,208 --> 00:18:38,041
and put him
on Martin Luther King's grave."
434
00:18:39,667 --> 00:18:41,875
- You reported all of this
to Mr. Melton.
435
00:18:41,959 --> 00:18:43,583
- To Melton, yeah.
436
00:18:43,667 --> 00:18:47,000
- Whitaker was able to link
one of the Sanders
437
00:18:47,083 --> 00:18:49,125
to the case of Lubie Geter,
438
00:18:49,208 --> 00:18:51,458
whose death
was ultimately used
439
00:18:51,542 --> 00:18:53,291
against Wayne Williams
440
00:18:53,375 --> 00:18:56,250
as one of the ten
pattern cases.
441
00:18:57,375 --> 00:19:00,041
That's significant,
because that actually ties
442
00:19:00,125 --> 00:19:01,583
a member of the Klan
443
00:19:01,667 --> 00:19:04,458
directly to one of the children
444
00:19:04,542 --> 00:19:07,291
that Wayne was credited
with murdering.
445
00:19:07,375 --> 00:19:10,333
[somber music]
446
00:19:10,417 --> 00:19:11,625
♪ ♪
447
00:19:11,709 --> 00:19:14,458
- I had known Lubie
probably from the sixth grade.
448
00:19:14,542 --> 00:19:17,333
Lubie and I were friends
and classmates.
449
00:19:17,417 --> 00:19:18,500
He was a good kid.
450
00:19:18,583 --> 00:19:19,834
You know, he got in trouble
like I did in school
451
00:19:19,917 --> 00:19:21,250
a few times,
452
00:19:21,333 --> 00:19:22,375
talking in class,
453
00:19:22,458 --> 00:19:23,792
maybe talking back to teachers
here and there,
454
00:19:23,875 --> 00:19:26,125
but normal, fun, loving kid.
455
00:19:26,208 --> 00:19:28,875
♪ ♪
456
00:19:28,959 --> 00:19:30,834
He was one of the few kids
in our community
457
00:19:30,917 --> 00:19:33,792
that still had both parents
active in his life.
458
00:19:33,875 --> 00:19:35,834
♪ ♪
459
00:19:35,917 --> 00:19:38,166
I remember, like,
before Christmas break,
460
00:19:38,250 --> 00:19:39,333
Lubie was talking to us.
461
00:19:39,417 --> 00:19:41,417
He was telling us about these
car care product
462
00:19:41,500 --> 00:19:43,166
that he was selling.
463
00:19:43,250 --> 00:19:45,166
But close to when school
opened back up again
464
00:19:45,250 --> 00:19:46,667
after the Christmas break,
465
00:19:46,750 --> 00:19:49,542
we saw on the news
that Lubie was missing.
466
00:19:49,625 --> 00:19:51,458
- 14-year-old Lubie Geter
467
00:19:51,542 --> 00:19:53,834
went to a South Side
Atlanta shopping center
468
00:19:53,917 --> 00:19:55,792
on Saturday to sell
air fresheners
469
00:19:55,875 --> 00:19:56,959
for automobiles.
470
00:19:57,041 --> 00:19:58,834
He never came home.
471
00:19:58,917 --> 00:20:01,458
- Police say, so far,
they're stumped.
472
00:20:02,709 --> 00:20:05,709
- A month afterwards
is when they found his body.
473
00:20:05,792 --> 00:20:09,709
♪ ♪
474
00:20:09,792 --> 00:20:11,709
After he was found dead,
475
00:20:11,792 --> 00:20:13,500
there were some nights
I didn't sleep.
476
00:20:13,583 --> 00:20:15,208
♪ ♪
477
00:20:15,291 --> 00:20:18,000
There was always a ringing bell
in the back of my head, like,
478
00:20:18,083 --> 00:20:21,208
normal, you know,
Atlanta teenager.
479
00:20:21,291 --> 00:20:22,875
How could he get caught up
in the middle of this?
480
00:20:22,959 --> 00:20:27,083
♪ ♪
481
00:20:27,166 --> 00:20:29,041
- This Mr. Whitaker says
482
00:20:29,125 --> 00:20:31,375
that he asked Sanders
specifically
483
00:20:31,458 --> 00:20:34,500
about 14-year-old Lubie Geter.
484
00:20:34,583 --> 00:20:36,709
♪ ♪
485
00:20:36,792 --> 00:20:38,875
- Well, I can remember this
very clearly.
486
00:20:38,959 --> 00:20:45,834
Uh, Mr. Whitaker had
brought this to my attention
487
00:20:45,917 --> 00:20:50,000
a couple days
after Lubie Geter was killed.
488
00:20:52,208 --> 00:20:54,709
And he was telling me
489
00:20:54,792 --> 00:20:59,083
that he was gonna kill
that...black boy
490
00:20:59,166 --> 00:21:00,917
because he run into my car.
491
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:02,583
- Well, that's what he's saying
you said.
492
00:21:02,667 --> 00:21:04,750
- True.
493
00:21:04,834 --> 00:21:05,917
He's turning it around.
494
00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:07,667
That's not the way it happened.
495
00:21:09,166 --> 00:21:10,750
- Did there come a point
in time
496
00:21:10,834 --> 00:21:14,291
in which they sent you
to Charles Sanders's house
497
00:21:14,375 --> 00:21:16,250
and wanted you to ask
specific questions
498
00:21:16,333 --> 00:21:17,917
about the Geter boy?
499
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:19,083
- Yeah.
500
00:21:19,166 --> 00:21:21,417
I said, "Well, you killed
that damn Geter kid,
501
00:21:21,500 --> 00:21:22,417
didn't you?"
502
00:21:22,500 --> 00:21:24,417
He said, "Yeah,
I damn sure did.
503
00:21:24,500 --> 00:21:26,834
I killed
the little black bastard."
504
00:21:26,917 --> 00:21:28,458
- Was that recorded?
505
00:21:28,542 --> 00:21:30,250
- I assume it--I don't know
why it wouldn't have--
506
00:21:30,333 --> 00:21:32,041
if they didn't get it, I don't
know why they didn't get it.
507
00:21:32,125 --> 00:21:36,125
- Charles T. Sanders
admitted killing Geter.
508
00:21:36,208 --> 00:21:37,208
- The next witness,
509
00:21:37,291 --> 00:21:39,500
former Atlanta police chief
George Napper
510
00:21:39,583 --> 00:21:41,417
says he does not remember
511
00:21:41,500 --> 00:21:43,041
his officers ever telling him
512
00:21:43,125 --> 00:21:45,417
about possible Klan
involvement.
513
00:21:45,500 --> 00:21:49,375
- He had told them
about the Klan being involved
514
00:21:49,458 --> 00:21:50,917
in the child murders?
515
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:52,458
- No, I don't recall that
at all.
516
00:21:52,542 --> 00:21:54,291
- Well, you say
"I don't recall."
517
00:21:54,375 --> 00:21:56,667
That's your answer to a lot
of questions here today.
518
00:21:56,750 --> 00:21:58,125
Does that mean
you don't recall,
519
00:21:58,208 --> 00:21:59,458
he might have told you,
520
00:21:59,542 --> 00:22:02,291
or you have no memory now,
or it didn't happen?
521
00:22:02,375 --> 00:22:04,458
- I don't know
whether it happened or not.
522
00:22:04,542 --> 00:22:06,333
- You have
a black man testifying.
523
00:22:06,417 --> 00:22:08,083
- I don't think so, no.
524
00:22:08,166 --> 00:22:09,709
- You mean to tell me that
525
00:22:09,792 --> 00:22:11,959
the Klan is involved
526
00:22:12,041 --> 00:22:14,125
in the missing and murdered
children case,
527
00:22:14,208 --> 00:22:16,917
and you don't remember?
528
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:18,458
They knew about it.
529
00:22:18,542 --> 00:22:20,333
- I don't recall that
happening.
530
00:22:20,417 --> 00:22:24,667
- You know, they gave a lot
of disingenuous answers.
531
00:22:24,750 --> 00:22:26,667
- Have you ever seen
that document before?
532
00:22:26,750 --> 00:22:29,333
- Not that I know of.
I don't recall, so.
533
00:22:29,417 --> 00:22:31,875
I don't remember.
I--you know, I'm sure
534
00:22:31,959 --> 00:22:33,208
he said something,
I just don't remember
535
00:22:33,291 --> 00:22:35,834
that the--
that there was anything said
536
00:22:35,917 --> 00:22:38,667
other than that,
if there was information
537
00:22:38,750 --> 00:22:40,667
pertaining
to our investigation,
538
00:22:40,750 --> 00:22:42,834
that they would let us know
what was going on.
539
00:22:42,917 --> 00:22:45,000
- I'm afraid that at this time,
540
00:22:45,083 --> 00:22:48,333
I'm not clear
on exactly what to report.
541
00:22:48,417 --> 00:22:51,000
- Push the mic up a little bit.
There.
542
00:22:51,083 --> 00:22:53,166
- I don't know.
- I do not know.
543
00:22:53,250 --> 00:22:55,792
I don't recall that.
- I don't recall.
544
00:22:55,875 --> 00:22:57,208
- My answer is,
I don't recall.
545
00:22:57,291 --> 00:22:59,208
- I don't recall
that I remember
546
00:22:59,291 --> 00:23:01,208
exactly that it said
Lubie Geter.
547
00:23:01,291 --> 00:23:03,041
- I don't know.
548
00:23:03,125 --> 00:23:04,834
- You ever had
any discussion about that?
549
00:23:04,917 --> 00:23:06,583
- I don't have a recall, sir.
550
00:23:06,667 --> 00:23:08,208
♪ ♪
551
00:23:08,291 --> 00:23:10,792
- But that would be bad,
now, wouldn't it?
552
00:23:14,750 --> 00:23:16,250
- Well, it's getting
to the point.
553
00:23:16,333 --> 00:23:19,166
It's right lunchtime.
All right.
554
00:23:19,250 --> 00:23:20,333
- We're hearing
about some lapses
555
00:23:20,417 --> 00:23:21,583
of memory here.
556
00:23:21,667 --> 00:23:23,041
Do you believe these gentlemen
when they say they don't--
557
00:23:23,125 --> 00:23:24,000
- No, I don't.
558
00:23:24,083 --> 00:23:26,208
These are convenient lapses
of memory.
559
00:23:26,291 --> 00:23:28,417
Can you imagine
the chief of police
560
00:23:28,500 --> 00:23:30,542
can't recall
anything that happened
561
00:23:30,625 --> 00:23:33,542
in the most major investigation
in the history of Atlanta,
562
00:23:33,625 --> 00:23:35,083
if not of Georgia?
563
00:23:35,166 --> 00:23:36,542
And he can't remember anything?
564
00:23:36,625 --> 00:23:38,709
I can't recall this,
I can't recall that.
565
00:23:38,792 --> 00:23:41,083
He can't recall
that someone confessed
566
00:23:41,166 --> 00:23:42,792
to the murder of Lubie Geter?
567
00:23:42,875 --> 00:23:44,750
Impossible.
568
00:23:44,834 --> 00:23:46,917
- Because of the nature
of the case,
569
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:49,125
the sensitivity
of the case,
570
00:23:49,208 --> 00:23:51,250
we went far above
and beyond.
571
00:23:51,333 --> 00:23:54,583
It is very uncommon
that you would run
572
00:23:54,667 --> 00:23:56,917
multiple
electronic surveillances,
573
00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:59,208
multiple
physical surveillances.
574
00:23:59,291 --> 00:24:00,917
[machine clicking]
575
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:05,250
- The GBI looked for anything
associated with the case.
576
00:24:05,333 --> 00:24:07,250
They looked for fiber.
577
00:24:07,333 --> 00:24:09,125
They looked for dogs.
578
00:24:09,208 --> 00:24:12,583
- Trace evidence in the case
included dog hair
579
00:24:12,667 --> 00:24:15,083
that most likely belonged
to a husky
580
00:24:15,166 --> 00:24:16,625
or a malamute.
581
00:24:16,709 --> 00:24:19,333
The Klansmen had a dog.
582
00:24:19,417 --> 00:24:21,250
- Did anyone ask you
583
00:24:21,333 --> 00:24:24,500
to check and see
if Charles Sanders had a dog?
584
00:24:24,583 --> 00:24:25,750
- Yes, sir.
585
00:24:25,834 --> 00:24:28,375
- And what did they
want to know?
586
00:24:28,458 --> 00:24:30,000
- Well, they wanted
some hair off the dog,
587
00:24:30,083 --> 00:24:31,000
and I--
588
00:24:31,083 --> 00:24:32,792
- Hair off of what dog?
589
00:24:32,875 --> 00:24:34,125
- Charles Sanders' dog.
590
00:24:34,208 --> 00:24:36,959
- What kind of dog
did Charles Sanders have?
591
00:24:37,041 --> 00:24:39,208
- Alaskan husky.
592
00:24:40,208 --> 00:24:42,333
- A husky?
- Yes, sir.
593
00:24:43,875 --> 00:24:45,625
- Did you ever own a dog?
594
00:24:45,709 --> 00:24:47,458
- Yes.
595
00:24:47,542 --> 00:24:50,625
- A Alaskan malamute?
596
00:24:50,709 --> 00:24:53,625
- No, I never had a...
597
00:24:53,709 --> 00:24:55,959
- And a Siberian husky.
598
00:24:56,041 --> 00:24:58,291
- Well, my dog Trigger,
599
00:24:58,375 --> 00:25:00,917
sh--she was pretty close
to a Siberian,
600
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:03,959
but it was a German shepherd.
601
00:25:04,041 --> 00:25:05,375
I had a German shepherd.
602
00:25:05,458 --> 00:25:07,834
She was pretty close
to a Siberian.
603
00:25:07,917 --> 00:25:11,291
But had a little
shih tzu puppy,
604
00:25:11,375 --> 00:25:15,125
and I had a German shepherd,
605
00:25:15,208 --> 00:25:17,959
and I also had a pig
by the name of Sausage.
606
00:25:19,959 --> 00:25:22,000
- Did Mr. Melton
and the GBI officer
607
00:25:22,083 --> 00:25:24,000
ask you to get anything else?
608
00:25:24,083 --> 00:25:25,208
- Well, he said,
609
00:25:25,291 --> 00:25:26,834
"Well, will you get me
something out of the house?"
610
00:25:26,917 --> 00:25:28,166
I said, "Yeah, if I can."
611
00:25:28,250 --> 00:25:30,166
He told me just reach down
on the carpet
612
00:25:30,250 --> 00:25:32,083
in the living room
and get a little--
613
00:25:32,166 --> 00:25:33,333
you know, just a speck
or something--
614
00:25:33,417 --> 00:25:35,500
you know, just whatever
I could pull out.
615
00:25:35,583 --> 00:25:37,417
- What kind of carpet was it?
616
00:25:38,041 --> 00:25:41,792
- Uh, this old green
fuzzy carpet.
617
00:25:41,875 --> 00:25:44,667
- So okay, there's
a green fiber here as well.
618
00:25:46,291 --> 00:25:48,166
- And then there's
a conversation
619
00:25:48,250 --> 00:25:50,208
in April that was recorded.
620
00:25:50,291 --> 00:25:52,583
Terry Sanders says,
"Hey, where you going?
621
00:25:52,667 --> 00:25:54,125
Out to get
another little kid?"
622
00:25:56,417 --> 00:25:58,208
And Don Sanders said,
"Well, yeah,
623
00:25:58,291 --> 00:25:59,959
scope out some places."
624
00:26:01,458 --> 00:26:04,166
A few weeks later,
the GBI brought in
625
00:26:04,250 --> 00:26:06,667
Jerry Sanders, Don Sanders,
626
00:26:06,750 --> 00:26:08,250
and Charles Sanders.
627
00:26:09,792 --> 00:26:12,083
- Were you ever picked up?
- Yes, I was.
628
00:26:12,166 --> 00:26:13,750
- Can you tell me
about that?
629
00:26:13,834 --> 00:26:18,041
- Uh, Mr. Joe Jackson,
GBI investigator,
630
00:26:18,125 --> 00:26:20,750
took me to GBI headquarters
631
00:26:20,834 --> 00:26:22,542
and interrogated me.
632
00:26:22,625 --> 00:26:26,417
I was accused
of distributing explosives.
633
00:26:26,500 --> 00:26:28,750
Uh...
634
00:26:28,834 --> 00:26:31,709
I was accused of killing
a young man
635
00:26:31,792 --> 00:26:34,083
by the name of Lubie Geter,
636
00:26:34,166 --> 00:26:36,375
which I don't know
nothing about.
637
00:26:36,458 --> 00:26:39,375
[suspenseful music]
638
00:26:39,458 --> 00:26:43,959
♪ ♪
639
00:26:44,041 --> 00:26:46,625
You know, they questioned me
extensively.
640
00:26:46,709 --> 00:26:48,875
Uh...
641
00:26:48,959 --> 00:26:51,083
and then they took me
back to my house.
642
00:26:51,166 --> 00:26:53,417
♪ ♪
643
00:26:53,500 --> 00:26:55,417
I think Mr. Jackson realized
644
00:26:55,500 --> 00:26:58,542
that I had no knowledge
645
00:26:58,625 --> 00:27:00,709
of his investigation.
646
00:27:00,792 --> 00:27:03,250
♪ ♪
647
00:27:03,333 --> 00:27:06,125
- Anyway, there came
a point in time
648
00:27:06,208 --> 00:27:12,417
in which you ceased working
for the GBI and Mr. Melton.
649
00:27:12,500 --> 00:27:14,750
What blew up
this investigation?
650
00:27:14,834 --> 00:27:16,166
When did it stop?
651
00:27:17,542 --> 00:27:18,667
- Well...
652
00:27:18,750 --> 00:27:20,750
- Must be something
that happened.
653
00:27:22,834 --> 00:27:25,125
- Well, this man's
not gonna like it,
654
00:27:25,208 --> 00:27:26,625
but I'm gonna tell it
like it is.
655
00:27:26,709 --> 00:27:29,291
A agent named Jackson,
a GBI agent.
656
00:27:29,375 --> 00:27:30,792
- Jackson?
- Yeah, which--
657
00:27:30,875 --> 00:27:32,125
when Melton told me
about it,
658
00:27:32,208 --> 00:27:34,083
he said a goddamn idiot
GBI agent
659
00:27:34,166 --> 00:27:35,792
blowed it,
blowed everything.
660
00:27:35,875 --> 00:27:36,875
I said, "Who is it?"
He said,
661
00:27:36,959 --> 00:27:38,750
"That son of a bitch
named Jackson."
662
00:27:40,375 --> 00:27:42,583
[mic scraping]
- State your full name, please.
663
00:27:43,667 --> 00:27:46,458
- Joe Bledsoe Jackson, Jr.
664
00:27:46,542 --> 00:27:50,166
- Did you ask either Terry
or Don Sanders
665
00:27:50,250 --> 00:27:51,625
about a conversation
666
00:27:51,709 --> 00:27:53,417
about scoping out
some children?
667
00:27:55,500 --> 00:27:58,208
- Mr. Cook...
- Finding another kid?
668
00:27:58,291 --> 00:28:00,000
- Judge, I'd like
the opportunity
669
00:28:00,083 --> 00:28:01,709
to discuss this matter
with counsel.
670
00:28:01,792 --> 00:28:04,542
- I'd like for him
to answer the question.
671
00:28:04,625 --> 00:28:06,959
- The question is,
did you ask
672
00:28:07,041 --> 00:28:09,166
either of the Sanders that
during interviews?
673
00:28:09,250 --> 00:28:11,166
- Yes, sir.
- Okay.
674
00:28:11,250 --> 00:28:13,667
Now, Judge, if you don't mind,
675
00:28:13,750 --> 00:28:14,750
could you and I
go into chambers?
676
00:28:14,834 --> 00:28:16,458
- No, no, I'm not
going into chambers.
677
00:28:16,542 --> 00:28:18,000
Mr. Jackson,
let's just simplify this.
678
00:28:18,083 --> 00:28:20,000
Answer his question now.
679
00:28:20,083 --> 00:28:21,625
- Yes, sir.
680
00:28:21,709 --> 00:28:23,750
- [clears throat]
- Well,
681
00:28:23,834 --> 00:28:27,667
what did Terry or Don Sanders
say about that?
682
00:28:27,750 --> 00:28:30,083
- They stated--
- That they were just joking?
683
00:28:31,166 --> 00:28:32,542
- That's correct, sir.
684
00:28:32,625 --> 00:28:35,250
They related to me
that it was a joking
685
00:28:35,333 --> 00:28:36,959
type of conversation.
686
00:28:37,041 --> 00:28:39,250
- Talking about killing
little kids
687
00:28:39,333 --> 00:28:41,208
being a joking conversation.
688
00:28:41,291 --> 00:28:43,583
Did you laugh with them?
689
00:28:43,667 --> 00:28:46,709
- Mr. Cook, the conversation
that you refer to
690
00:28:46,792 --> 00:28:49,208
took place
on April Fools' Day.
691
00:28:49,291 --> 00:28:51,750
- Oh, I see.
That was their explanation,
692
00:28:51,834 --> 00:28:53,792
that the conversation
took place
693
00:28:53,875 --> 00:28:55,667
on April Fools' Day?
694
00:28:55,750 --> 00:28:57,041
- That's correct, sir.
695
00:28:57,125 --> 00:29:00,917
- And you accepted that
as being a good faith reply?
696
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,250
- That, along with the other
surveillance techniques
697
00:29:06,333 --> 00:29:08,959
that we were utilizing
during this time period.
698
00:29:10,291 --> 00:29:14,250
- And then there's
a matter of the tapes.
699
00:29:14,333 --> 00:29:19,417
- This case generated
a number of cassette tapes.
700
00:29:19,500 --> 00:29:21,583
- Yes.
- What became of those?
701
00:29:21,667 --> 00:29:23,542
- The tapes,
to my knowledge,
702
00:29:23,625 --> 00:29:24,750
have been destroyed.
703
00:29:24,834 --> 00:29:27,792
[suspenseful music]
704
00:29:27,875 --> 00:29:29,583
♪ ♪
705
00:29:29,667 --> 00:29:35,583
- Wayne Williams was arrested
on June 3, 1981.
706
00:29:35,667 --> 00:29:39,417
It says "destroyed 7/31/81."
707
00:29:39,500 --> 00:29:42,083
- Yes, sir.
- And whose initial is that?
708
00:29:42,166 --> 00:29:43,917
- Those are my initials.
709
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:46,667
- GBI agent Jackson
710
00:29:46,750 --> 00:29:49,125
destroyed the tapes
711
00:29:49,208 --> 00:29:54,583
while Wayne's original trial
was pending,
712
00:29:54,667 --> 00:29:56,917
which looks very suspicious.
713
00:29:59,166 --> 00:30:02,333
Why would they destroy
the evidence?
714
00:30:02,417 --> 00:30:05,166
- Did you listen to all
of the tape recordings?
715
00:30:05,250 --> 00:30:08,250
- I don't remember listening
to each of them, no, sir.
716
00:30:08,333 --> 00:30:10,792
- Well, wouldn't you have
listened to all of them?
717
00:30:10,875 --> 00:30:12,792
- I don't know
that I heard them all.
718
00:30:12,875 --> 00:30:13,750
I may have.
719
00:30:13,834 --> 00:30:15,291
I don't remember.
720
00:30:15,375 --> 00:30:17,625
- You say you may have
heard all of them?
721
00:30:17,709 --> 00:30:19,000
- That's correct.
722
00:30:19,083 --> 00:30:21,083
- And no record
was made of it.
723
00:30:21,166 --> 00:30:22,792
No transcript.
724
00:30:22,875 --> 00:30:24,250
- I don't think so.
725
00:30:24,333 --> 00:30:25,500
- And you were investigating
726
00:30:25,583 --> 00:30:27,625
the missing
and murdered children.
727
00:30:27,709 --> 00:30:29,333
- What I was investigating
728
00:30:29,417 --> 00:30:31,250
was whether or not
this particular group
729
00:30:31,333 --> 00:30:32,458
had anything to do with it...
730
00:30:32,542 --> 00:30:33,792
- Right.
- And they did not.
731
00:30:33,875 --> 00:30:35,750
- And they did not,
and you concluded that.
732
00:30:35,834 --> 00:30:37,000
- Yes, sir.
- And you don't remember
733
00:30:37,083 --> 00:30:38,166
what was on the tapes
734
00:30:38,250 --> 00:30:39,166
'cause you don't even know
735
00:30:39,250 --> 00:30:40,375
that you listened
to all of them.
736
00:30:40,458 --> 00:30:43,458
- Well, sir, Mr. Cook,
what I do recall for certain
737
00:30:43,542 --> 00:30:46,875
is that there was no mention
738
00:30:46,959 --> 00:30:48,291
in any form or fashion
739
00:30:48,375 --> 00:30:51,500
in which these people
were killing any children.
740
00:30:51,583 --> 00:30:52,750
- Well, how would you know that
741
00:30:52,834 --> 00:30:56,041
if you don't remember
hearing the tapes?
742
00:30:56,125 --> 00:30:59,208
- Uh, it just--that's the way
I recall it.
743
00:30:59,291 --> 00:31:02,625
There's no tie whatsoever
to any murders.
744
00:31:02,709 --> 00:31:05,625
[uneasy music]
745
00:31:05,709 --> 00:31:08,333
♪ ♪
746
00:31:08,417 --> 00:31:12,166
- You know,
these are Klansmen, rednecks,
747
00:31:12,250 --> 00:31:16,208
who spewed racial rhetoric
every day,
748
00:31:16,291 --> 00:31:19,542
just people
running their mouths.
749
00:31:19,625 --> 00:31:22,375
Sanders was brought in
and polygraphed,
750
00:31:22,458 --> 00:31:23,834
which was negative.
751
00:31:23,917 --> 00:31:25,917
As a result
of the searches,
752
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:27,542
examination of the fiber...
753
00:31:27,625 --> 00:31:29,333
There was no indication
754
00:31:29,417 --> 00:31:31,375
that the Sanders family
had killed
755
00:31:31,458 --> 00:31:33,709
any of those children.
756
00:31:33,792 --> 00:31:37,417
The information was determined
to be unfounded.
757
00:31:37,500 --> 00:31:40,917
As a result,
the investigation was closed.
758
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:42,250
- All right,
we'll be in recess,
759
00:31:42,333 --> 00:31:44,250
and if there's nothing else,
until 9:00 in the morning.
760
00:31:45,333 --> 00:31:48,000
- I think Mr. Cook,
761
00:31:48,083 --> 00:31:49,709
Mr. Kunstler,
762
00:31:49,792 --> 00:31:52,208
Mr. Whatley,
763
00:31:52,291 --> 00:31:55,333
should really look
at what they have.
764
00:31:57,125 --> 00:31:59,750
If you have a case
against Charles Sanders
765
00:31:59,834 --> 00:32:01,959
or his family,
766
00:32:02,041 --> 00:32:04,500
put it up, or else shut up.
767
00:32:08,208 --> 00:32:09,750
- You know, other
than him boasting
768
00:32:09,834 --> 00:32:11,625
that he was going to do this,
769
00:32:11,709 --> 00:32:14,542
there was no evidence
he had done it.
770
00:32:14,625 --> 00:32:16,583
- Anything else?
- The end.
771
00:32:16,667 --> 00:32:20,458
[laughing]
772
00:32:20,542 --> 00:32:22,125
- And the evidence
on Lubie Geter,
773
00:32:22,208 --> 00:32:24,750
none of it pointed
to Charles Sanders.
774
00:32:24,834 --> 00:32:26,250
In other words,
there was nothing there
775
00:32:26,333 --> 00:32:29,083
other than a Klansman
bragging, apparently,
776
00:32:29,166 --> 00:32:32,250
to another Klansman
777
00:32:32,333 --> 00:32:35,959
about something that...
778
00:32:36,041 --> 00:32:37,208
didn't happen.
779
00:32:37,291 --> 00:32:39,208
- If had been the Sanders,
780
00:32:39,291 --> 00:32:42,166
I would've been the first
to put the handcuffs on them.
781
00:32:42,250 --> 00:32:44,458
Uh, it wasn't the Sanders,
782
00:32:44,542 --> 00:32:46,458
and we moved on.
783
00:32:46,542 --> 00:32:47,959
♪ ♪
784
00:32:48,041 --> 00:32:51,458
- I was never willing
to go so far as to say
785
00:32:51,542 --> 00:32:53,125
that members
of the Sanders family
786
00:32:53,208 --> 00:32:54,250
were guilty,
787
00:32:54,333 --> 00:32:56,417
but we will never
actually know for sure,
788
00:32:56,500 --> 00:32:59,458
because the tapes
were destroyed.
789
00:32:59,542 --> 00:33:00,834
- [laughs]
790
00:33:00,917 --> 00:33:02,583
- What I do think:
791
00:33:02,667 --> 00:33:07,458
there was at least as much
reliable evidence
792
00:33:07,542 --> 00:33:09,667
against the Sanders family
793
00:33:09,750 --> 00:33:12,250
for one or more
of those killings
794
00:33:12,333 --> 00:33:14,458
than there was
against Wayne Williams,
795
00:33:14,542 --> 00:33:17,458
and I also believe
beyond any possible doubt
796
00:33:17,542 --> 00:33:20,250
that had the jury learned
797
00:33:20,333 --> 00:33:22,583
of the Sanders family
involvement,
798
00:33:22,667 --> 00:33:25,792
of the threats
against Lubie Geter,
799
00:33:25,875 --> 00:33:28,000
Sanders' husky,
800
00:33:28,083 --> 00:33:29,625
I do think the jury
may have come
801
00:33:29,709 --> 00:33:32,041
to a very, very different
conclusion.
802
00:33:32,125 --> 00:33:33,792
- Were these people
simply incompetent,
803
00:33:33,875 --> 00:33:35,542
or was there some--
- Was who incompetent?
804
00:33:35,625 --> 00:33:37,125
- The police investigation.
805
00:33:37,208 --> 00:33:38,667
- Well, I don't--
806
00:33:38,750 --> 00:33:41,000
I don't want
to characterize it as that.
807
00:33:41,083 --> 00:33:43,125
I don't know what they were.
- I think I know what it was.
808
00:33:43,208 --> 00:33:44,417
- You know, I'll let them
speak for themselves.
809
00:33:44,500 --> 00:33:45,375
- All right.
- I'll speak,
810
00:33:45,458 --> 00:33:46,500
not being from Georgia.
811
00:33:46,583 --> 00:33:48,250
This was a device
812
00:33:48,333 --> 00:33:51,041
to a keep a race war
from happening,
813
00:33:51,125 --> 00:33:53,166
and if they indicted
someone from the Klan,
814
00:33:53,250 --> 00:33:55,667
that's what was gonna happen,
in their opinion,
815
00:33:55,750 --> 00:33:58,000
and if they indicted someone
who was black,
816
00:33:58,083 --> 00:33:59,458
it would not happen.
817
00:33:59,542 --> 00:34:01,000
And they made
a calculated choice.
818
00:34:01,083 --> 00:34:03,667
They wanted to sacrifice
Wayne Williams
819
00:34:03,750 --> 00:34:05,542
in order to keep the peace.
820
00:34:05,625 --> 00:34:08,083
[uneasy music]
821
00:34:08,166 --> 00:34:11,458
- After Wayne Williams
became a suspect,
822
00:34:11,542 --> 00:34:13,542
all of these other
investigations
823
00:34:13,625 --> 00:34:15,542
were closed.
824
00:34:15,625 --> 00:34:19,375
Anything that suggested
Wayne could be innocent
825
00:34:19,458 --> 00:34:21,709
was simply cast aside
826
00:34:21,792 --> 00:34:25,792
because Wayne Williams
solved a lot of problems.
827
00:34:27,166 --> 00:34:30,709
- Not saying that Wayne
did it or didn't do it.
828
00:34:30,792 --> 00:34:31,875
I don't know.
829
00:34:31,959 --> 00:34:33,500
But had they pinned this
830
00:34:33,583 --> 00:34:35,750
on somebody white,
831
00:34:35,834 --> 00:34:38,709
especially somebody related
to the Klan,
832
00:34:38,792 --> 00:34:41,417
there would have been riots
all over America.
833
00:34:41,500 --> 00:34:44,583
America would have been
upside down.
834
00:34:44,667 --> 00:34:47,917
The fact that they pinned this
on somebody black
835
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:49,208
shut it down.
836
00:34:49,291 --> 00:34:51,250
♪ ♪
837
00:34:51,333 --> 00:34:53,208
- They are killing
little children in the city!
838
00:34:53,291 --> 00:34:56,458
- They did not want
a second Atlanta burning.
839
00:34:56,542 --> 00:35:00,208
♪ ♪
840
00:35:00,291 --> 00:35:03,250
Maynard Jackson had gotten
the airport,
841
00:35:03,333 --> 00:35:04,625
and he had gotten
all this business.
842
00:35:04,709 --> 00:35:07,750
They did not want it
to be destroyed.
843
00:35:07,834 --> 00:35:09,750
♪ ♪
844
00:35:09,834 --> 00:35:11,083
- All rise.
845
00:35:11,166 --> 00:35:12,583
Court is now in session,
846
00:35:12,667 --> 00:35:14,959
Honorable Judge
Hal Craig presiding.
847
00:35:15,041 --> 00:35:19,417
- The appeals became
a very long process.
848
00:35:19,500 --> 00:35:20,834
- Be seated.
849
00:35:22,375 --> 00:35:24,458
- And I remember thinking
850
00:35:24,542 --> 00:35:26,625
enough time had gone by,
851
00:35:26,709 --> 00:35:29,125
the passions had cooled,
852
00:35:29,208 --> 00:35:32,333
the Klan evidence all came out
in open court,
853
00:35:32,417 --> 00:35:34,667
and there was no race war.
854
00:35:34,750 --> 00:35:36,625
I thought, "Maybe now
855
00:35:36,709 --> 00:35:39,625
we can have
a sensible reckoning."
856
00:35:39,709 --> 00:35:43,625
♪ ♪
857
00:35:43,709 --> 00:35:45,458
- Williams, in fact,
858
00:35:45,542 --> 00:35:46,917
was denied
his constitutional rights.
859
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:49,834
- It was a tremendous effort
on our part
860
00:35:49,917 --> 00:35:52,792
to show the injustice,
861
00:35:52,875 --> 00:35:54,834
and I think we showed it.
862
00:35:54,917 --> 00:35:57,000
- Well, what has happened today
is this.
863
00:35:57,083 --> 00:36:00,250
A Superior Court judge,
Harold Craig,
864
00:36:00,333 --> 00:36:03,792
has denied Wayne Williams'
plea for a new trial.
865
00:36:03,875 --> 00:36:06,000
♪ ♪
866
00:36:06,083 --> 00:36:10,208
- The judge found
for the prosecution.
867
00:36:10,291 --> 00:36:13,041
He upheld the conviction,
868
00:36:13,125 --> 00:36:17,834
said no violation of Brady
had been made
869
00:36:17,917 --> 00:36:20,667
of any significance.
870
00:36:20,750 --> 00:36:23,500
- The judge said
there was nothing here
871
00:36:23,583 --> 00:36:26,375
that could've been useful
in any way to the defense
872
00:36:26,458 --> 00:36:29,500
except the sort of red herring
that you could throw out,
873
00:36:29,583 --> 00:36:30,959
saying
"the Klan was involved,"
874
00:36:31,041 --> 00:36:33,166
which we still hear
about today,
875
00:36:33,250 --> 00:36:34,542
as if they were involved,
876
00:36:34,625 --> 00:36:36,458
and there was no evidence
they were involved.
877
00:36:36,542 --> 00:36:38,500
So the judge
on the habeas corpus said
878
00:36:38,583 --> 00:36:40,500
there's nothing
they could've used.
879
00:36:40,583 --> 00:36:43,333
- Eh...
880
00:36:43,417 --> 00:36:45,792
it's the worst trial
I've ever seen.
881
00:36:45,875 --> 00:36:48,458
It's the worst situation
882
00:36:48,542 --> 00:36:51,750
of unfairness
and the deprivation of fairness
883
00:36:51,834 --> 00:36:54,625
that I've seen in 43 years
of law practice.
884
00:36:55,625 --> 00:36:58,125
You know, it's a damn disgrace.
885
00:36:59,792 --> 00:37:01,750
- When the decision came out,
886
00:37:01,834 --> 00:37:03,875
Bill Kunstler said,
887
00:37:03,959 --> 00:37:06,375
talking about white people,
888
00:37:06,458 --> 00:37:08,667
quote, "They're all
such bullshitters
889
00:37:08,750 --> 00:37:11,000
when it comes
to a black man's life."
890
00:37:11,083 --> 00:37:12,375
Close quote.
891
00:37:12,458 --> 00:37:15,417
[melancholy music]
892
00:37:15,500 --> 00:37:16,542
♪ ♪
893
00:37:16,625 --> 00:37:21,083
It was that
dashed expectation
894
00:37:21,166 --> 00:37:23,875
that sort of gave rise
to my motto
895
00:37:23,959 --> 00:37:25,709
of the ensuing years,
896
00:37:25,792 --> 00:37:27,875
which is,
"I have no expectations.
897
00:37:27,959 --> 00:37:29,667
I only have hopes."
898
00:37:29,750 --> 00:37:32,375
Because disappointment
is a function of expectations,
899
00:37:32,458 --> 00:37:36,458
and mine, now, pretty low
from the legal system.
900
00:37:36,542 --> 00:37:43,542
♪ ♪
901
00:37:50,375 --> 00:37:53,125
- It's this enormous
injustice.
902
00:37:54,792 --> 00:37:56,542
For the Georgia Bureau
of Investigation to say
903
00:37:56,625 --> 00:37:58,375
that they found no evidence
904
00:37:58,458 --> 00:38:01,917
of the Sanders brothers
being involved
905
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:03,208
is hogwash.
906
00:38:03,291 --> 00:38:09,041
♪ ♪
907
00:38:09,125 --> 00:38:10,750
There were a number of cases
where they found
908
00:38:10,834 --> 00:38:13,458
Caucasian pubic hairs
and other hairs on the kids.
909
00:38:14,208 --> 00:38:16,125
They should have known
at that point
910
00:38:16,208 --> 00:38:17,875
that they were looking
for a white man.
911
00:38:18,542 --> 00:38:20,834
When I'm going
through the GBI file,
912
00:38:20,917 --> 00:38:22,667
certain elements struck me
913
00:38:22,750 --> 00:38:24,250
about Don Sanders.
914
00:38:25,250 --> 00:38:26,834
Again, he's secretary
915
00:38:26,917 --> 00:38:29,000
of the National States'
Rights Party,
916
00:38:29,083 --> 00:38:31,792
who's trying to start
a race war.
917
00:38:31,875 --> 00:38:36,000
Now, this is a 1975 mug shot
of Don Sanders.
918
00:38:36,083 --> 00:38:39,000
You will notice a scar
on his cheek
919
00:38:39,083 --> 00:38:41,125
and a long scar
on his neck.
920
00:38:41,208 --> 00:38:43,291
This, of course,
brings me back
921
00:38:43,375 --> 00:38:44,458
to the FBI file
922
00:38:44,542 --> 00:38:47,667
along with the Atlanta
Police Department files.
923
00:38:47,750 --> 00:38:50,458
Then you have
these eyewitness accounts.
924
00:38:50,542 --> 00:38:51,458
For example,
925
00:38:51,542 --> 00:38:53,792
in the Christopher Richardson
case,
926
00:38:53,875 --> 00:38:57,000
you've got a eyewitness
saying they saw this white man
927
00:38:57,083 --> 00:38:59,500
kidnap Richardson,
928
00:38:59,583 --> 00:39:01,834
this witness describing
the scar
929
00:39:01,917 --> 00:39:03,542
like an arrow on his face.
930
00:39:03,625 --> 00:39:05,667
♪ ♪
931
00:39:05,750 --> 00:39:07,834
And then you see Don Sanders.
932
00:39:07,917 --> 00:39:08,875
Right by his mouth,
933
00:39:08,959 --> 00:39:11,125
he has a cut scar
on his left cheek.
934
00:39:11,208 --> 00:39:12,709
♪ ♪
935
00:39:12,792 --> 00:39:14,792
A very noticeable scar.
936
00:39:14,875 --> 00:39:16,333
It fits Don Sanders.
937
00:39:16,417 --> 00:39:19,166
♪ ♪
938
00:39:19,250 --> 00:39:22,000
And I sort of just compare
the GBI file
939
00:39:22,083 --> 00:39:23,500
with the FBI file
940
00:39:23,583 --> 00:39:26,792
to find out
what else could be a match.
941
00:39:26,875 --> 00:39:30,000
Is there another nexus
between those two files?
942
00:39:30,083 --> 00:39:33,500
This is an example
of an FBI file
943
00:39:33,583 --> 00:39:34,792
on the investigation.
944
00:39:34,875 --> 00:39:36,750
As you can see,
they are heavily redacted,
945
00:39:36,834 --> 00:39:40,083
where names, basic descriptions
are taken out.
946
00:39:40,166 --> 00:39:43,500
As compared to these files,
947
00:39:43,583 --> 00:39:45,750
which is from the Georgia
Bureau of Investigation.
948
00:39:45,834 --> 00:39:47,625
There is no redactions.
949
00:39:47,709 --> 00:39:49,750
And you can then
put the two together,
950
00:39:49,834 --> 00:39:52,250
you know, synthesize the data
that you're looking at.
951
00:39:52,333 --> 00:39:55,041
This is from the FBI file.
952
00:39:55,125 --> 00:39:56,875
In February of 1981,
953
00:39:56,959 --> 00:39:59,041
this white male
chases this ten-year-old kid
954
00:39:59,125 --> 00:40:00,542
home from school.
955
00:40:00,625 --> 00:40:02,208
The boy runs under the bed
and locks the door.
956
00:40:02,291 --> 00:40:03,709
The guy breaks the door down,
957
00:40:03,792 --> 00:40:05,041
tries to the find the kid,
958
00:40:05,125 --> 00:40:07,000
but the kid is hiding
under the bed, so he leaves.
959
00:40:07,083 --> 00:40:10,125
A few hours later,
this guy comes back.
960
00:40:10,208 --> 00:40:12,083
The kid and his mother
see this white male
961
00:40:12,166 --> 00:40:13,417
staring through the window.
962
00:40:13,500 --> 00:40:15,125
He's got blue eyes,
963
00:40:15,208 --> 00:40:17,917
and he has a scar.
964
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:21,250
This suspect in question
had no facial hair.
965
00:40:21,333 --> 00:40:23,250
On March 1st,
the same ten-year-old
966
00:40:23,333 --> 00:40:24,750
goes into
the FBI headquarters,
967
00:40:24,834 --> 00:40:26,709
and he's shown a photo lineup,
968
00:40:26,792 --> 00:40:29,166
picks out--he says
this is definitely the man
969
00:40:29,250 --> 00:40:30,917
who chased him
about a month earlier,
970
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:32,959
but in this photograph,
971
00:40:33,041 --> 00:40:34,917
he's wearing a full beard.
972
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:36,917
"When he chased me,
he was clean-shaven."
973
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:40,291
♪ ♪
974
00:40:40,375 --> 00:40:42,125
Now, at the same time,
975
00:40:42,208 --> 00:40:44,625
in February of '81
into early March,
976
00:40:44,709 --> 00:40:46,625
the agent in charge
of the GBI investigation
977
00:40:46,709 --> 00:40:48,542
of the Sanders notices
that he's changed
978
00:40:48,625 --> 00:40:50,417
his appearance completely.
979
00:40:50,500 --> 00:40:52,125
He's cut his hair
a little bit,
980
00:40:52,208 --> 00:40:54,709
and he has
a well-manicured beard now,
981
00:40:54,792 --> 00:40:56,041
whereas he had been
clean-shaven
982
00:40:56,125 --> 00:40:57,917
a few weeks before.
983
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,750
This matches up
with a suspect
984
00:41:00,834 --> 00:41:04,500
here in the FBI document,
whose name is redacted.
985
00:41:04,583 --> 00:41:06,959
Again, he had a full beard
in March,
986
00:41:07,041 --> 00:41:08,792
and so did Don Sanders
987
00:41:08,875 --> 00:41:10,667
in this GBI file.
988
00:41:10,750 --> 00:41:12,792
♪ ♪
989
00:41:12,875 --> 00:41:14,625
The dots are connected.
990
00:41:14,709 --> 00:41:17,333
The beard changing
at the same time
991
00:41:17,417 --> 00:41:21,291
and then the scar--
it all adds up.
992
00:41:21,375 --> 00:41:23,834
I think Don Sanders
has to be the man
993
00:41:23,917 --> 00:41:27,000
whose name is blacked out
in the FBI file.
994
00:41:27,083 --> 00:41:30,667
[suspenseful music]
995
00:41:30,750 --> 00:41:31,959
I said, "Oh, my God,
they've been trying
996
00:41:32,041 --> 00:41:34,333
"to cover this up
for 40 years,
997
00:41:34,417 --> 00:41:35,542
and they slipped up."
998
00:41:37,208 --> 00:41:39,959
- I think the file
shows very clearly
999
00:41:40,041 --> 00:41:42,625
that the Sanders
were involved.
1000
00:41:42,709 --> 00:41:45,000
I'm speculating,
but seems like
1001
00:41:45,083 --> 00:41:48,542
the Atlanta police
investigator Aubrey Melton
1002
00:41:48,625 --> 00:41:51,959
was the origin
of how all those files
1003
00:41:52,041 --> 00:41:53,083
got to me.
1004
00:41:53,166 --> 00:41:55,834
He knew they were sweeping it
up under the rug,
1005
00:41:55,917 --> 00:41:57,792
and he put his career
on the line
1006
00:41:57,875 --> 00:41:59,959
for the truth.
1007
00:42:00,041 --> 00:42:02,250
- Aubrey Melton ought
to be commended for that.
1008
00:42:03,917 --> 00:42:05,250
You know, that's what
Shakespeare said about murder.
1009
00:42:05,333 --> 00:42:07,166
Murder always leaves
a silent witness.
1010
00:42:07,250 --> 00:42:09,709
To me, those documents
are a silent witness
1011
00:42:09,792 --> 00:42:13,041
showing the Sanders brothers
are involved
1012
00:42:13,125 --> 00:42:14,709
in killing those kids.
1013
00:42:14,792 --> 00:42:20,333
♪ ♪
1014
00:42:20,417 --> 00:42:23,000
- Look at the whole record,
1015
00:42:23,083 --> 00:42:26,417
and it seems like
there's several strands
1016
00:42:26,500 --> 00:42:28,375
of killings.
1017
00:42:28,458 --> 00:42:32,250
You have the Sanders
and the Ku Klux Klan.
1018
00:42:32,333 --> 00:42:34,917
You had pedophilia
going on:
1019
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:38,375
Wilcoxen
and Tom Terrell,
1020
00:42:38,458 --> 00:42:41,542
convicted pedophiles.
1021
00:42:41,625 --> 00:42:44,000
You have witnesses
to Jamie Brooks
1022
00:42:44,083 --> 00:42:46,667
with Clifford Jones.
1023
00:42:46,750 --> 00:42:50,625
They didn't follow those leads.
1024
00:42:50,709 --> 00:42:52,417
They chose Wayne.
1025
00:42:52,500 --> 00:42:56,041
♪ ♪
1026
00:42:56,125 --> 00:42:57,709
- You know, I always felt
1027
00:42:57,792 --> 00:42:59,583
that this is one
of those mysteries
1028
00:42:59,667 --> 00:43:00,875
that will remain a mystery
1029
00:43:00,959 --> 00:43:03,375
because we blew it
from the beginning.
1030
00:43:03,458 --> 00:43:05,333
There were just
all these questions,
1031
00:43:05,417 --> 00:43:07,250
and we never got
good answers.
1032
00:43:07,333 --> 00:43:10,583
♪ ♪
1033
00:43:10,667 --> 00:43:13,917
- The questions
kept coming up.
1034
00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,458
The case had been so much
about fiber evidence,
1035
00:43:17,542 --> 00:43:19,792
and just a few years back,
1036
00:43:19,875 --> 00:43:23,041
the Justice Department
sent me a letter.
1037
00:43:23,125 --> 00:43:25,417
They said
there was a problem
1038
00:43:25,500 --> 00:43:27,125
with the whole process
1039
00:43:27,208 --> 00:43:29,375
by the FBI crime lab.
1040
00:43:29,458 --> 00:43:33,417
♪ ♪
1041
00:43:33,500 --> 00:43:35,417
- FBI lab evidence
in some of this country's
1042
00:43:35,500 --> 00:43:37,500
most high-profile
criminal cases
1043
00:43:37,583 --> 00:43:38,959
and a whole lot more
1044
00:43:39,041 --> 00:43:40,625
could be called
into question now,
1045
00:43:40,709 --> 00:43:43,583
this months
after an FBI whistleblower
1046
00:43:43,667 --> 00:43:47,917
accused the FBI crime lab
of shoddy and sloppy work.
1047
00:43:48,917 --> 00:43:53,583
- The FBI laboratory was in
the J. Edgar Hoover Building,
1048
00:43:53,667 --> 00:43:55,792
and that building
was not built
1049
00:43:55,875 --> 00:43:58,834
to hold a laboratory.
1050
00:43:58,917 --> 00:44:01,667
Immediately upon walking
into the laboratory in 1986,
1051
00:44:01,750 --> 00:44:03,625
I saw it was
a filthy environment.
1052
00:44:03,709 --> 00:44:06,667
Some of the equipment
was way outdated.
1053
00:44:06,750 --> 00:44:09,875
A lot of it was rusty--
literally rusty.
1054
00:44:09,959 --> 00:44:12,125
I was working
in a trace analysis unit
1055
00:44:12,208 --> 00:44:13,834
where we were looking for
1056
00:44:13,917 --> 00:44:16,458
tiny, tiny, tiny amounts
of material.
1057
00:44:16,542 --> 00:44:19,333
The air system
that was in the laboratory--
1058
00:44:19,417 --> 00:44:22,583
the air ducts were lined
with fiberglass,
1059
00:44:22,667 --> 00:44:24,333
and fiberglass
started breaking down.
1060
00:44:24,417 --> 00:44:27,208
And when the air system
came back on,
1061
00:44:27,291 --> 00:44:30,000
all this stuff would rain down
on our equipment,
1062
00:44:30,083 --> 00:44:32,125
and we referred to it
as black rain.
1063
00:44:32,208 --> 00:44:33,959
I took Scotch tape,
1064
00:44:34,041 --> 00:44:35,375
and I put it around
on surfaces
1065
00:44:35,458 --> 00:44:36,959
and I put it
under the microscope,
1066
00:44:37,041 --> 00:44:39,333
and it literally took
my breath away.
1067
00:44:39,417 --> 00:44:41,166
I was looking at countless--
1068
00:44:41,250 --> 00:44:42,834
and I'm not talking
about 100 or 1,000.
1069
00:44:42,917 --> 00:44:43,875
I'm talking about--
1070
00:44:43,959 --> 00:44:45,625
if there was such a thing
as a zillion,
1071
00:44:45,709 --> 00:44:49,542
there were just fibers
everywhere,
1072
00:44:49,625 --> 00:44:51,333
and it was coming down
into areas
1073
00:44:51,417 --> 00:44:52,959
that we were doing
fiber analysis,
1074
00:44:53,041 --> 00:44:54,333
and we had no idea
1075
00:44:54,417 --> 00:44:55,834
whether they came
from crime scenes
1076
00:44:55,917 --> 00:44:58,500
or whether they came
from the laboratory itself.
1077
00:44:58,583 --> 00:45:01,500
We're gonna put human beings
in cages and death chambers
1078
00:45:01,583 --> 00:45:04,417
based upon that environment?
No, sir.
1079
00:45:06,083 --> 00:45:07,208
I hadn't been there long
1080
00:45:07,291 --> 00:45:09,333
when I talked
to my training agent.
1081
00:45:09,417 --> 00:45:10,625
I said, "You know,
this is gonna come out
1082
00:45:10,709 --> 00:45:14,000
in court sometime,"
and his response was,
1083
00:45:14,083 --> 00:45:15,709
"Before you embarrass the FBI,
1084
00:45:15,792 --> 00:45:18,709
"you'll commit perjury
in court.
1085
00:45:18,792 --> 00:45:20,417
We all do it."
1086
00:45:20,500 --> 00:45:22,709
Then I go to his boss,
1087
00:45:22,792 --> 00:45:26,542
and I took that go-to-boss
up over about...
1088
00:45:26,625 --> 00:45:30,542
oh, six years, whatever,
1089
00:45:30,625 --> 00:45:32,709
from boss to boss
to boss to boss,
1090
00:45:32,792 --> 00:45:35,709
and about 1995,
the media got hold of it,
1091
00:45:35,792 --> 00:45:38,458
and then it got a life
of its own.
1092
00:45:38,542 --> 00:45:41,375
- For years, the FBI lab
has been world-renowned
1093
00:45:41,458 --> 00:45:44,208
for coming up with clues
that break cases.
1094
00:45:44,291 --> 00:45:47,250
Now a new investigation shows
that for years,
1095
00:45:47,333 --> 00:45:49,583
the lab may have been
turning out mistakes.
1096
00:45:49,667 --> 00:45:53,083
- Scientifically flawed
testimony,
1097
00:45:53,166 --> 00:45:55,458
inaccurate testimony,
1098
00:45:55,542 --> 00:45:56,959
testimony beyond
1099
00:45:57,041 --> 00:45:59,250
the laboratory examiner's
expertise.
1100
00:45:59,333 --> 00:46:02,667
- It just ballooned.
1101
00:46:04,417 --> 00:46:07,000
The FBI and the U.S.
Department of Justice
1102
00:46:07,083 --> 00:46:08,959
reopened thousands of cases.
1103
00:46:09,041 --> 00:46:11,750
♪ ♪
1104
00:46:11,834 --> 00:46:14,417
In April of 2015,
1105
00:46:14,500 --> 00:46:16,625
the FBI announced
1106
00:46:16,709 --> 00:46:20,208
that 26 of 28 hair examiners
1107
00:46:20,291 --> 00:46:22,417
had provided
misleading testimony
1108
00:46:22,500 --> 00:46:24,750
95% percent of the time
1109
00:46:24,834 --> 00:46:26,792
over a 30-year period of time
1110
00:46:26,875 --> 00:46:28,041
in court.
1111
00:46:28,125 --> 00:46:30,750
26 of 28.
1112
00:46:30,834 --> 00:46:32,875
- Whitehurst is now
cataloguing the files
1113
00:46:32,959 --> 00:46:34,458
and offering his opinions
1114
00:46:34,542 --> 00:46:36,125
on mistakes made in cases
1115
00:46:36,208 --> 00:46:38,000
ranging from
the World Trade Center bombing
1116
00:46:38,083 --> 00:46:39,583
to Oklahoma City
1117
00:46:39,667 --> 00:46:42,625
and hundreds of local murders
in between.
1118
00:46:42,709 --> 00:46:45,583
- Wayne Williams' case
was worked on
1119
00:46:45,667 --> 00:46:47,000
by the same group of people
1120
00:46:47,083 --> 00:46:49,291
in the same processing areas
1121
00:46:49,375 --> 00:46:51,208
under the same black rain.
1122
00:46:52,917 --> 00:46:59,875
♪ ♪
1123
00:47:02,375 --> 00:47:05,291
- It wasn't just
the fiber evidence.
1124
00:47:05,375 --> 00:47:07,834
Based on victim type,
1125
00:47:07,917 --> 00:47:09,625
where the bodies
were found,
1126
00:47:09,709 --> 00:47:12,750
and the eyewitnesses
that saw Wayne Williams
1127
00:47:12,834 --> 00:47:14,959
with victims...
1128
00:47:15,041 --> 00:47:16,458
I'm 100% certain
1129
00:47:16,542 --> 00:47:18,333
that Wayne Williams
is the killer.
1130
00:47:18,417 --> 00:47:21,333
[suspenseful music]
1131
00:47:21,417 --> 00:47:22,667
♪ ♪
1132
00:47:22,750 --> 00:47:24,583
Keep in mind, the pattern
1133
00:47:24,667 --> 00:47:27,333
of juvenile
and young adult homicides
1134
00:47:27,417 --> 00:47:30,875
stopped after the arrest
of Wayne Williams.
1135
00:47:30,959 --> 00:47:33,667
- The killings stopped.
He can't do this anymore.
1136
00:47:33,750 --> 00:47:35,041
He's done.
1137
00:47:35,125 --> 00:47:37,375
- No, I don't think
the killings stopped
1138
00:47:37,458 --> 00:47:39,291
because of Wayne Williams
being arrested.
1139
00:47:39,375 --> 00:47:41,500
I think what happened
is that
1140
00:47:41,583 --> 00:47:43,625
the most probable suspects
went to jail
1141
00:47:43,709 --> 00:47:44,834
around the same time
1142
00:47:44,917 --> 00:47:47,166
as Wayne's arrest.
1143
00:47:47,250 --> 00:47:49,083
When the Sanders brothers
were taken into custody,
1144
00:47:49,166 --> 00:47:50,458
they were told point-blank,
1145
00:47:50,542 --> 00:47:52,709
"We have information
that you are connected
1146
00:47:52,792 --> 00:47:55,375
to some of the murders."
1147
00:47:55,458 --> 00:47:57,000
Well, of course then,
they're on notice,
1148
00:47:57,083 --> 00:47:58,333
so they have to stop.
1149
00:47:58,417 --> 00:48:00,667
Now, at the same time,
1150
00:48:00,750 --> 00:48:03,875
the prime
Clifford Jones suspect,
1151
00:48:03,959 --> 00:48:05,166
Tom Terrell,
1152
00:48:05,250 --> 00:48:07,166
David Wilcoxen,
1153
00:48:07,250 --> 00:48:09,542
they were all arrested
and thrown in jail,
1154
00:48:09,625 --> 00:48:11,250
and that's why
the killings stopped.
1155
00:48:11,333 --> 00:48:14,375
- No, these
were outlandish rumors
1156
00:48:14,458 --> 00:48:16,375
with no substance
to back them up.
1157
00:48:16,458 --> 00:48:19,750
There was nobody identified
as a viable suspect
1158
00:48:19,834 --> 00:48:21,834
other than Wayne Williams.
1159
00:48:21,917 --> 00:48:23,375
♪ ♪
1160
00:48:23,458 --> 00:48:26,542
The evidence in this case
is airtight in my opinion,
1161
00:48:26,625 --> 00:48:29,083
and I think, if somebody
looks at it objectively,
1162
00:48:29,166 --> 00:48:30,875
it should prove it to them
1163
00:48:30,959 --> 00:48:33,208
that Wayne Williams is guilty.
1164
00:48:33,291 --> 00:48:35,709
But some of the parents
are still not satisfied
1165
00:48:35,792 --> 00:48:37,291
with the investigation.
1166
00:48:43,333 --> 00:48:46,750
- This is one
of the favorite pictures.
1167
00:48:46,834 --> 00:48:49,500
We had just left church
that Easter.
1168
00:48:52,709 --> 00:48:55,250
Patrick would be married
with kids
1169
00:48:55,333 --> 00:48:56,750
and probably went on
to the service
1170
00:48:56,834 --> 00:48:58,750
like his rest of his brothers.
1171
00:48:58,834 --> 00:49:00,834
[somber music]
1172
00:49:00,917 --> 00:49:03,291
Just broke my heart.
1173
00:49:03,375 --> 00:49:05,583
♪ ♪
1174
00:49:05,667 --> 00:49:07,917
You know, it's--probably
was a time that I said
1175
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:10,083
that, you know, in my heart,
I really do believe
1176
00:49:10,166 --> 00:49:11,583
that Wayne Williams
killed Patrick Balt--
1177
00:49:11,667 --> 00:49:14,667
I remember saying that.
1178
00:49:14,750 --> 00:49:16,250
And then there's a time,
you know,
1179
00:49:16,333 --> 00:49:17,875
I don't believe Wayne Williams
killed nobody.
1180
00:49:17,959 --> 00:49:19,917
And then it was a time,
yeah, maybe he did kill
1181
00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:23,291
Nathaniel Cater
and Jimmy Ray Payne,
1182
00:49:23,375 --> 00:49:26,291
because I have been put
in a situation
1183
00:49:26,375 --> 00:49:30,792
that, you know,
you don't know what to believe,
1184
00:49:30,875 --> 00:49:32,625
so that means
that you just believe
1185
00:49:32,709 --> 00:49:34,625
every damn thing.
1186
00:49:34,709 --> 00:49:36,667
You know, so to hell with that.
1187
00:49:36,750 --> 00:49:38,250
I don't know.
1188
00:49:38,333 --> 00:49:40,458
I wasn't there.
1189
00:49:40,542 --> 00:49:44,125
♪ ♪
1190
00:49:44,208 --> 00:49:47,583
- If you look
at Wayne Williams' case
1191
00:49:47,667 --> 00:49:50,625
and say, "I don't know
what happened,"
1192
00:49:50,709 --> 00:49:53,291
"I don't know"
1193
00:49:53,375 --> 00:49:57,625
connects to "not guilty"
in our system of law.
1194
00:49:57,709 --> 00:49:59,500
That does not mean
he's an innocent man.
1195
00:49:59,583 --> 00:50:06,583
♪ ♪
1196
00:50:11,750 --> 00:50:14,041
- Wayne has grown up
in jail.
1197
00:50:14,125 --> 00:50:16,834
♪ ♪
1198
00:50:16,917 --> 00:50:19,667
If Wayne got out of jail,
where would he go?
1199
00:50:19,750 --> 00:50:22,834
Um, I don't--his mother's dead.
His father's dead.
1200
00:50:22,917 --> 00:50:25,834
I don't know what kind of life
he would have.
1201
00:50:25,917 --> 00:50:30,000
But I think he's entitled
to find out.
1202
00:50:30,083 --> 00:50:32,834
♪ ♪
1203
00:50:32,917 --> 00:50:37,500
- His parents were supportive
of him to the end.
1204
00:50:37,583 --> 00:50:42,000
I just hate
that they had to die
1205
00:50:42,083 --> 00:50:45,583
not knowing what had become
of their son.
1206
00:50:45,667 --> 00:50:47,917
♪ ♪
1207
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:50,375
- I don't think Atlanta
wants him released.
1208
00:50:50,458 --> 00:50:53,834
I don't think they want
the case regurgitated,
1209
00:50:53,917 --> 00:50:55,250
brought back up again,
1210
00:50:55,333 --> 00:50:57,125
and I think Wayne is--
1211
00:50:57,208 --> 00:50:59,041
is gonna be in prison
for the rest of his life.
1212
00:50:59,125 --> 00:51:03,208
♪ ♪
1213
00:51:03,291 --> 00:51:04,291
- Growing up in America,
1214
00:51:04,375 --> 00:51:05,917
I thought it was
the land of opportunity.
1215
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:08,917
I thought that my people,
black people,
1216
00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:11,542
had made our strides
during the Civil Rights era.
1217
00:51:11,625 --> 00:51:13,542
We had made progress.
1218
00:51:13,625 --> 00:51:15,917
But after years
of this nightmare,
1219
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:17,709
I have found out that
1220
00:51:17,792 --> 00:51:19,875
there is no justice
1221
00:51:19,959 --> 00:51:21,834
in the criminal justice system
1222
00:51:21,917 --> 00:51:23,875
in the United States
of America.
1223
00:51:23,959 --> 00:51:27,417
Nobody's concerned
about whether you're innocent
1224
00:51:27,500 --> 00:51:29,125
or whether you're guilty.
1225
00:51:29,208 --> 00:51:33,583
♪ ♪
1226
00:51:33,667 --> 00:51:35,750
- He's truly an evil person
1227
00:51:35,834 --> 00:51:38,417
because he presents himself now
as being so innocent
1228
00:51:38,500 --> 00:51:40,250
and he's victimizing
the families again.
1229
00:51:40,333 --> 00:51:42,875
He killed their kids.
Now he's using them again
1230
00:51:42,959 --> 00:51:44,208
to put himself out there
and say,
1231
00:51:44,291 --> 00:51:45,417
"Hey, I'm innocent.
I didn't do it.
1232
00:51:45,500 --> 00:51:48,792
It's not me."
And, you know, it's just...
1233
00:51:48,875 --> 00:51:51,375
They were throwaways.
1234
00:51:51,458 --> 00:51:53,750
You know, their families
didn't want them
1235
00:51:53,834 --> 00:51:55,750
or they're out on their own.
1236
00:51:55,834 --> 00:51:56,959
It was sad, you know.
1237
00:51:57,041 --> 00:51:59,875
They're just kids,
but they didn't have a chance,
1238
00:51:59,959 --> 00:52:01,792
most of them,
and they fell prey
1239
00:52:01,875 --> 00:52:05,083
to this lunatic.
1240
00:52:05,166 --> 00:52:08,083
[high piano music]
1241
00:52:08,166 --> 00:52:09,417
♪ ♪
1242
00:52:09,500 --> 00:52:12,125
- I don't want
this investigation
1243
00:52:12,208 --> 00:52:13,458
to become
1244
00:52:13,542 --> 00:52:15,875
a "Free Wayne Williams"
campaign.
1245
00:52:15,959 --> 00:52:17,625
To the extent
that there's evidence
1246
00:52:17,709 --> 00:52:21,083
that shows that it was not him,
1247
00:52:21,166 --> 00:52:24,667
I think that justice
will take its course.
1248
00:52:24,750 --> 00:52:28,250
But I really want this
to be about the children
1249
00:52:28,333 --> 00:52:32,667
and the unanswered questions
for many of the families.
1250
00:52:32,750 --> 00:52:35,041
♪ ♪
1251
00:52:35,125 --> 00:52:37,667
- I'm hopeful we find
some evidence.
1252
00:52:37,750 --> 00:52:39,500
You know, it's a long shot.
1253
00:52:39,583 --> 00:52:41,500
This is really about being able
1254
00:52:41,583 --> 00:52:44,458
to look at the families,
the moms, the dads,
1255
00:52:44,542 --> 00:52:47,625
and say, "We have done
everything possible."
1256
00:52:47,709 --> 00:52:50,667
And so we are just
very methodically
1257
00:52:50,750 --> 00:52:52,834
pulling in
the boxes of evidence,
1258
00:52:52,917 --> 00:52:55,375
looking at the cases
chronologically.
1259
00:52:55,458 --> 00:52:58,208
It's gonna take time.
1260
00:52:58,291 --> 00:53:00,959
- 2020, it'll be 40 years.
1261
00:53:01,041 --> 00:53:04,458
They should've did that
40 years ago,
1262
00:53:04,542 --> 00:53:07,000
not 40 years...
1263
00:53:07,083 --> 00:53:09,625
They should've been did it.
1264
00:53:09,709 --> 00:53:11,500
They should've been
done something.
1265
00:53:11,583 --> 00:53:14,667
- Come on.
29 to 30 kids,
1266
00:53:14,750 --> 00:53:16,375
and you mean to tell me
1267
00:53:16,458 --> 00:53:18,834
nobody had an answer
for 30 kids?
1268
00:53:18,917 --> 00:53:21,875
[mournful music]
1269
00:53:21,959 --> 00:53:23,375
We're not worth it,
1270
00:53:23,458 --> 00:53:26,333
is what you're telling me.
1271
00:53:26,417 --> 00:53:28,667
I want my brother, and
I want all the other children,
1272
00:53:28,750 --> 00:53:30,125
to be worth something
1273
00:53:30,208 --> 00:53:32,166
so they can sleep.
1274
00:53:35,125 --> 00:53:36,208
- It's 40 years ago.
1275
00:53:36,291 --> 00:53:38,208
How many people have
handled this over the years?
1276
00:53:38,291 --> 00:53:40,417
I don't think
they're gonna find anything.
1277
00:53:40,500 --> 00:53:43,166
♪ ♪
1278
00:53:43,250 --> 00:53:45,041
- You think that this
is really trying
1279
00:53:45,125 --> 00:53:46,417
to get to the bottom
of all this?
1280
00:53:46,500 --> 00:53:48,250
- N...
1281
00:53:48,333 --> 00:53:50,709
♪ ♪
1282
00:53:50,792 --> 00:53:53,291
No.
1283
00:53:55,625 --> 00:54:00,083
This reinvestigation
is about cleaning up,
1284
00:54:00,166 --> 00:54:02,667
just trying to clean up
1285
00:54:02,750 --> 00:54:05,417
the legacy of Atlanta.
1286
00:54:05,500 --> 00:54:08,709
♪ ♪
1287
00:54:08,792 --> 00:54:10,291
- The man considered
the main suspect
1288
00:54:10,375 --> 00:54:11,709
in the Atlanta child murders
1289
00:54:11,792 --> 00:54:12,875
will stay in prison.
1290
00:54:12,959 --> 00:54:15,083
The state denied
Wayne Williams' appeal
1291
00:54:15,166 --> 00:54:16,250
for parole.
1292
00:54:16,333 --> 00:54:20,000
- His next opportunity
will be in 2027.
1293
00:54:21,667 --> 00:54:24,417
- Atlanta's a city of images.
1294
00:54:24,500 --> 00:54:26,458
It's a PR place.
1295
00:54:26,542 --> 00:54:28,750
It's what looks good
and what we can project
1296
00:54:28,834 --> 00:54:31,250
to the world--
"World's busiest airport."
1297
00:54:31,333 --> 00:54:33,917
♪ ♪
1298
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:35,917
- When this took place,
1299
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,417
Atlanta was on the rise.
1300
00:54:38,500 --> 00:54:43,083
They felt like Atlanta
was being attacked
1301
00:54:43,166 --> 00:54:45,625
by us defending Wayne Williams.
1302
00:54:45,709 --> 00:54:47,875
♪ ♪
1303
00:54:47,959 --> 00:54:50,250
Everything we brought out,
1304
00:54:50,333 --> 00:54:52,458
people thought about it
1305
00:54:52,542 --> 00:54:54,792
as a reflection on Atlanta.
1306
00:54:54,875 --> 00:55:01,917
♪ ♪
1307
00:55:04,709 --> 00:55:07,625
- It's a very different
Atlanta now
1308
00:55:07,709 --> 00:55:09,000
because there was a plan
1309
00:55:09,083 --> 00:55:12,291
of what Atlanta
was gonna be.
1310
00:55:12,375 --> 00:55:18,125
♪ ♪
1311
00:55:18,208 --> 00:55:20,750
- It's kind of crass.
1312
00:55:20,834 --> 00:55:24,458
We want to have
the clout and the class,
1313
00:55:24,542 --> 00:55:26,291
but none
of the public housing projects
1314
00:55:26,375 --> 00:55:27,834
remain at all.
1315
00:55:29,125 --> 00:55:31,959
They've all been torn down,
1316
00:55:32,041 --> 00:55:33,959
black folks pushed out.
1317
00:55:34,041 --> 00:55:35,750
♪ ♪
1318
00:55:35,834 --> 00:55:38,000
And few, if any,
of the people who lived there
1319
00:55:38,083 --> 00:55:39,875
found homes there again.
1320
00:55:39,959 --> 00:55:46,583
♪ ♪
1321
00:55:59,208 --> 00:56:02,333
- After Clifford passed away,
1322
00:56:02,417 --> 00:56:03,792
we moved across town,
1323
00:56:03,875 --> 00:56:06,041
and then we moved
back to Chattanooga.
1324
00:56:07,250 --> 00:56:09,542
I would never move
to Atlanta again.
1325
00:56:12,250 --> 00:56:14,500
I'm mad at Atlanta.
1326
00:56:14,583 --> 00:56:18,166
I'm pissed off at Atlanta,
for real.
1327
00:56:18,250 --> 00:56:20,208
I just feel like they did
our family wrong.
1328
00:56:20,291 --> 00:56:22,500
[somber music]
1329
00:56:22,583 --> 00:56:25,542
When Clifford passed away,
1330
00:56:25,625 --> 00:56:27,417
I almost tried to, like,
block it out
1331
00:56:27,500 --> 00:56:29,083
like it was a bad dream.
1332
00:56:29,166 --> 00:56:31,750
♪ ♪
1333
00:56:31,834 --> 00:56:34,750
I guess I went
into a deep depression.
1334
00:56:34,834 --> 00:56:38,041
♪ ♪
1335
00:56:38,125 --> 00:56:40,917
Clifford was buried
at the National Cemetery
1336
00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:44,041
in Chattanooga, Tennessee.
1337
00:56:44,125 --> 00:56:45,417
I've never been back
over there
1338
00:56:45,500 --> 00:56:47,500
since we buried him.
1339
00:56:48,458 --> 00:56:50,583
I got past it, and...
1340
00:56:50,667 --> 00:56:57,625
♪ ♪
1341
00:57:00,166 --> 00:57:02,375
Just holding onto this,
it was
1342
00:57:02,458 --> 00:57:04,625
mentally tearing me down.
1343
00:57:04,709 --> 00:57:08,542
♪ ♪
1344
00:57:08,625 --> 00:57:10,750
I finally felt
like it was time
1345
00:57:10,834 --> 00:57:12,709
to come and see him.
1346
00:57:12,792 --> 00:57:19,208
♪ ♪
1347
00:57:29,959 --> 00:57:32,750
I just want the world to know
we love Clifford.
1348
00:57:32,834 --> 00:57:39,834
♪ ♪
1349
00:57:48,750 --> 00:57:50,667
- Me, personally, myself,
1350
00:57:50,750 --> 00:57:55,083
nothing would give me
a peace of mind or closure.
1351
00:57:55,166 --> 00:57:58,917
Just want to know
who and why.
1352
00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:06,000
♪ ♪
1353
00:58:07,875 --> 00:58:10,750
- I think that the notion
of closure
1354
00:58:10,834 --> 00:58:14,917
is something that people
who are not directly involved
1355
00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:16,875
make up.
1356
00:58:18,583 --> 00:58:20,500
I don't know
what constitutes closure
1357
00:58:20,583 --> 00:58:22,250
for a murdered child.
1358
00:58:22,333 --> 00:58:29,542
♪ ♪
1359
00:58:30,125 --> 00:58:32,291
- People always talking
about closure
1360
00:58:32,375 --> 00:58:34,875
and...mm-mm.
1361
00:58:34,959 --> 00:58:39,041
I can't get with this thing
about closure.
1362
00:58:39,125 --> 00:58:41,959
I don't think I'll ever have
peace about that,
1363
00:58:42,041 --> 00:58:43,709
about my son.
1364
00:58:43,792 --> 00:58:49,834
♪ ♪
1365
00:58:49,917 --> 00:58:52,875
- It's been an emotional
kind of afternoon
1366
00:58:52,959 --> 00:58:54,834
because a lot of families
are seeing each other
1367
00:58:54,917 --> 00:58:58,875
for the first time
in almost 40 years.
1368
00:58:58,959 --> 00:59:04,333
♪ ♪
1369
00:59:04,417 --> 00:59:06,917
- Good afternoon.
all: Good afternoon.
1370
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:09,542
- My name
is Catherine Leach Bell.
1371
00:59:09,625 --> 00:59:11,625
I'm the mother
of Curtis Walker.
1372
00:59:12,792 --> 00:59:15,959
Curtis was very important.
1373
00:59:16,041 --> 00:59:20,041
He was a black America child.
1374
00:59:20,125 --> 00:59:22,875
And someone took him from me.
1375
00:59:22,959 --> 00:59:26,667
Now, that's a pain that no one
will ever forget.
1376
00:59:26,750 --> 00:59:28,709
[up-tempo music]
1377
00:59:28,792 --> 00:59:30,375
'Cause seemed like
nobody cared
1378
00:59:30,458 --> 00:59:33,417
nothing about what I was
going through, not nobody.
1379
00:59:33,500 --> 00:59:35,917
♪ ♪
1380
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:37,542
But I didn't give up.
1381
00:59:37,625 --> 00:59:39,917
I kept going.
1382
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:42,417
♪ ♪
1383
00:59:42,500 --> 00:59:44,083
- It hurts.
1384
00:59:44,166 --> 00:59:46,166
You're losing a child
and being killed like that,
1385
00:59:46,250 --> 00:59:48,709
and you don't know why
he being killed like that.
1386
00:59:48,792 --> 00:59:49,959
- It hurts.
1387
00:59:50,041 --> 00:59:51,417
- You don't know why
would anybody
1388
00:59:51,500 --> 00:59:53,041
do something to a child
like that.
1389
00:59:53,125 --> 00:59:55,959
That's a sick maniac.
- Come on now, come on.
1390
00:59:56,041 --> 00:59:57,375
- That's right.
- We went through it
1391
00:59:57,458 --> 00:59:59,917
40 long years,
but guess what.
1392
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:01,542
We can go through it
40 more long years.
1393
01:00:01,625 --> 01:00:02,750
- That's right.
1394
01:00:02,834 --> 01:00:04,083
- Until the end.
1395
01:00:04,166 --> 01:00:05,667
- Till the end.
- Till the end.
1396
01:00:05,750 --> 01:00:07,041
Until he be caught.
1397
01:00:07,125 --> 01:00:08,583
- Say it!
1398
01:00:08,667 --> 01:00:09,583
- We can't give up.
1399
01:00:09,667 --> 01:00:11,959
When we die,
we can't do nothing about it.
1400
01:00:12,041 --> 01:00:14,542
But long as breath
is in our body,
1401
01:00:14,625 --> 01:00:17,083
we got our rights to find out
who did this.
1402
01:00:17,166 --> 01:00:20,125
[dramatic music]
1403
01:00:20,208 --> 01:00:27,166
♪ ♪
1404
01:00:33,542 --> 01:00:36,458
[emotional string music]
1405
01:00:36,542 --> 01:00:43,542
♪ ♪
1406
01:01:17,417 --> 01:01:19,417
[bright tone]
94688
Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.