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The following programme
contains scenes
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00:00:02,360 --> 00:00:05,000
which some viewers
may find distressing.
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00:00:44,160 --> 00:00:46,680
Go and have the
time of your life.
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00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:47,999
A newsflash.
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00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:49,000
A newsflash.
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00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:51,880
Plane's gone down.
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00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:00,680
Murray Guthrie. Jim Swire.
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Full disclosure,
I'm a journalist.
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00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:03,999
They say in the press it may
have been Iran, revenge attack.
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00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:04,720
They say in the press it may
have been Iran, revenge attack.
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00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:06,920
Anonymous phone call
made to the US Embassy.
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00:01:06,960 --> 00:01:08,640
Embassy dismissed it as a hoax.
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00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:11,400
Your government
knew. They all knew.
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00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:12,000
I have nightmares.
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00:01:12,001 --> 00:01:13,400
I have nightmares.
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00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:16,960
Was our daughter conscious
as she fell through the sky?
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00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,999
How did a bomb get through airport
security and onto Flight 103?
18
00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:21,056
How did a bomb get through airport
security and onto Flight 103?
19
00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:23,440
Why is there so much
secrecy around this?
20
00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:25,840
Are we ever going to know
what really happened?
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I will never stop. Not until we
know the answer to everything.
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I will never stop. Not until we
know the answer to everything.
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00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:51,440
You've
reached the Swire household.
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00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:52,000
We're not home to take
your call at the moment.
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00:01:52,001 --> 00:01:53,536
We're not home to take
your call at the moment.
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00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:56,640
Please leave a message after the beep
and we'll get back to you.
27
00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:59,200
Oh, hi, Jim. Murray here.
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I hope you're sitting down,
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00:02:00,001 --> 00:02:01,081
I hope you're sitting down,
30
00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:04,360
because I've just heard Thatcher's
ordered an independent inquiry...
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00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:07,999
..into the Strangeways
Prison riot.
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00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:08,160
..into the Strangeways
Prison riot.
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00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:10,560
Sum total of deaths, two.
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00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:13,520
So we now have inquiries into
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00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:15,999
the Clapham Junction
crash, 35 deaths,
36
00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:16,360
the Clapham Junction
crash, 35 deaths,
37
00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:18,720
the King's Cross
fire, 31 deaths,
38
00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:22,280
and the Piper Alpha
disaster, 167 deaths.
39
00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:23,999
But bugger all for Lockerbie.
40
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:24,640
But bugger all for Lockerbie.
41
00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:27,040
Bugger all for 270 dead.
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00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:31,000
I mean...
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00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:32,000
..what is it with these people?
44
00:02:32,001 --> 00:02:33,176
..what is it with these people?
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00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:36,680
What the hell do you have to do to
make them sit up and take notice?
46
00:02:36,720 --> 00:02:39,520
Actually get off their
arses and do something?
47
00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:42,760
What is it they're hiding?
48
00:03:06,920 --> 00:03:08,800
What's going on?
49
00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,040
Security spot checks on luggage.
50
00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:19,999
Am I OK to look inside? Yes.
51
00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:21,080
Am I OK to look inside? Yes.
52
00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,800
Where are you flying to, sir?
53
00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:27,960
Boston, via JFK.
54
00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:43,760
Have you taken the
batteries out, sir?
55
00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:44,000
We have new safety rules.
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00:03:44,001 --> 00:03:45,880
We have new safety rules.
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00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:47,880
Yes. Yeah, I have. Mm-hmm.
58
00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:55,640
Thank you.
59
00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:57,680
Have a safe flight.
60
00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,480
Sorry. Sorry, the
traffic. Hello, darling.
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00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:23,040
Don't worry. How are
you? Good. How are you?
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00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:24,000
Good.
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00:04:24,001 --> 00:04:25,120
Good.
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00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:32,000
Oh, it was a gift.
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00:04:32,001 --> 00:04:33,400
Oh, it was a gift.
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00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:37,120
Flora's boyfriend's father painted
it and sent it over for us.
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00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:39,999
He's really caught
her, don't you think?
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00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:41,560
He's really caught
her, don't you think?
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00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:46,560
You don't think there's
enough reminders?
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00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:55,920
It's not Flora.
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00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:04,000
Dad made it to the
airport alright?
72
00:05:04,001 --> 00:05:05,800
Dad made it to the
airport alright?
73
00:05:05,840 --> 00:05:07,840
Oh-Oh, yeah.
74
00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:09,760
Did you get any
sleep last night?
75
00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:12,000
Hey,
hey. Hey, hey, hey.
76
00:05:12,001 --> 00:05:13,560
Hey,
hey. Hey, hey, hey.
77
00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:16,840
Sit down and put your feet up.
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00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:19,560
I'll take those bags upstairs,
then I'll make us some tea.
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00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:23,600
OK?
80
00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:15,760
You OK?
81
00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:23,760
Mum, please. Will you
go and speak to someone?
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00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:24,000
It's OK. I'm fine.
83
00:06:24,001 --> 00:06:25,320
It's OK. I'm fine.
84
00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:27,360
I'm fine, Cathy. I'm fine.
85
00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:30,680
It's fine.
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00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:31,200
Hello, Jim.
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00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:32,920
It's good to see you.
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00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,999
Everyone's excited to
finally meet you in person.
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00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:36,360
Everyone's excited to
finally meet you in person.
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00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,720
My very own homemade version...
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00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:42,000
..of the bomb
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00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:43,840
which blew up Flight 103.
93
00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:48,960
You brought that
with you on a plane?
94
00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:51,240
Is that Semtex?
95
00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:55,320
A very pliable, odourless
plastic explosive
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00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:58,720
favoured by paramilitary
groups and terrorists.
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00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:04,840
I used marzipan.
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00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:07,999
Jim, I'm sorry. Are
you out of your mind?
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00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:08,480
Jim, I'm sorry. Are
you out of your mind?
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00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,200
How many times have we been told
airport security has improved,
101
00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,040
that a bomb would never get onto
a plane nowadays? Yeah, sure.
102
00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:15,600
But is this the way
to call them out?
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00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:16,000
A security officer at Heathrow
picked it up, looked at it,
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00:08:16,001 --> 00:08:18,096
A security officer at Heathrow
picked it up, looked at it,
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00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:21,000
and wished me a safe onward
journey. I got through three sets
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00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,999
of security checks to get here
via JFK. I wasn't stopped once.
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00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,440
Of security checks to get here
via JFK. I wasn't stopped once.
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00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:30,680
Now, I'm sorry if this
upsets some of you.
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00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:31,999
I wanted it to be impossible
for me to do this, believe me.
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00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:34,320
I wanted it to be impossible
for me to do this, believe me.
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00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:36,840
The fact is, it wasn't.
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00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:39,999
And people need to know.
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00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:41,000
And people need to know.
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00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:50,960
Did you know
about the fake bomb?
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00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,440
Do you agree with what
your father's done?
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00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:58,240
Incredible, audacious,
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00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:00,440
an act of gross stupidity.
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00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,400
Just some of the
reactions to Dr Jim Swire,
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00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:04,000
spokesman for UK
Families Flight 103.
120
00:09:04,001 --> 00:09:06,280
Spokesman for UK
Families Flight 103.
121
00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:09,760
Why? Because he built
a fake bomb in his home
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00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:11,999
and carried it in a suitcase-
Did you know about this?
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00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:12,080
And carried it in a suitcase-
Did you know about this?
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00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:14,360
..on a flight from
London to New York.No.
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00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,360
The same route on which his
daughter, Flora, was killed.
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00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:19,999
If I was a terrorist, another plane
would have been blown out of the sky.
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00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:20,720
If I was a terrorist, another plane
would have been blown out of the sky.
128
00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:23,520
Hundreds more innocent people
would have been murdered.
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00:09:23,560 --> 00:09:27,560
24 hours since touching
down in the US, Dr Swire has-
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00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:28,000
The Midlands doctor, whose daughter
died in the Lockerbie plane bomb-
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00:09:28,001 --> 00:09:30,696
The Midlands doctor, whose daughter
died in the Lockerbie plane bomb-
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00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,680
I cannot stress strongly enough
this government's determination
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00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:35,999
to enforce the highest
standards of aviation security.
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00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:37,936
To enforce the highest
standards of aviation security.
135
00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:42,040
And we will be speaking to Dr
Swire on his return to the UK.
136
00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,080
Finally.
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00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:15,440
Questioned. Given
a verbal warning.
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00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:19,320
"Bad boy, don't do it again."
139
00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:29,200
I'm sorry.
140
00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:32,000
What hurts the most is
being kept in the dark.
141
00:10:32,001 --> 00:10:33,801
What hurts the most is
being kept in the dark.
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00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:37,560
I didn't want to
get you involved.
143
00:10:39,560 --> 00:10:40,000
There were press people
outside, Jim, dozens of them.
144
00:10:40,001 --> 00:10:42,560
There were press people
outside, Jim, dozens of them.
145
00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:44,760
We hadn't a clue
what was going on.
146
00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:46,760
And what if you
had been arrested,
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00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:47,999
here or in America?
Wh-Wh-What would I have done?
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00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:49,920
Here or in America?
Wh-Wh-What would I have done?
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00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:53,000
And the kids.
150
00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:55,040
Did you think about any of us?
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00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,120
Did Murray put you
up to this? No.
152
00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:03,960
No, all my own doing.
153
00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:07,200
Is that why you've been shut
up in your study all this time?
154
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:10,320
You've barely
spoken a word to us.
155
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:11,999
Spineless government
hiding behind secrets,
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00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:12,560
Spineless government
hiding behind secrets,
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00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:14,840
criminal investigation
taking forever.
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00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:17,200
I just wanted to
make some noise.
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00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:19,999
Do something. You
are doing something.
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00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:21,376
Do something. You
are doing something.
161
00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:24,080
You're constantly giving
interviews, writing letters.
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00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:27,680
Howling at the moon. No.
No, Jim. That's not true.
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00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:28,000
This will cause consternation
and tutting for a few days,
164
00:11:28,001 --> 00:11:30,280
This will cause consternation
and tutting for a few days,
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00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:32,120
then it will all go quiet again.
166
00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:40,120
I should have told you.
It was wrong of me.
167
00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:51,999
It's all for her.
168
00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:53,000
It's all for her.
169
00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,840
You haven't stopped
since she died.
170
00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:06,760
What else can I do?
171
00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:14,640
For now...
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00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:16,000
..take a step back.
173
00:12:16,001 --> 00:12:17,600
..take a step back.
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00:12:18,560 --> 00:12:20,840
You have me...
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00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:22,880
you have two other children.
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00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:27,040
Be with us.
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00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:16,440
Good to be back.
178
00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:51,720
Here it goes.
179
00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:52,000
Thanks, darling.
You're going down.
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00:13:52,001 --> 00:13:54,200
Thanks, darling.
You're going down.
181
00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:56,640
Ready? Steady. Go!
182
00:13:56,680 --> 00:13:59,280
What? No!
183
00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:07,640
No, no! No, no!
184
00:14:07,680 --> 00:14:08,000
Get behind me.
185
00:14:08,001 --> 00:14:09,280
Get behind me.
186
00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:23,999
Thanks, Dad.
187
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:25,000
Thanks, Dad.
188
00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:36,080
Now,
three years later,
189
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,840
two suspects have
finally been identified.
190
00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:39,999
Their names announced
earlier today
191
00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:41,056
Their names announced
earlier today
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00:16:41,080 --> 00:16:43,680
by Scotland's Lord
Advocate, Peter Fraser.
193
00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:46,120
And yesterday,
Mr McDougall obtained
194
00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:47,999
from him the grant of warrants
195
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:49,920
from him the grant of warrants
196
00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:53,600
for the arrest of two
Libyan nationals...
197
00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:55,999
Libya? I thought Iran did it?
..on charges of conspiracy,
198
00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:57,216
Libya? I thought Iran did it?
..on charges of conspiracy,
199
00:16:57,240 --> 00:16:59,600
murder and contravention
200
00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:02,800
of the Aviation
Security Act of 1982.
201
00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:06,520
The two accused are...
202
00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:09,840
Abdelbaset Ali
Mohamed al-Megrahi...
203
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:16,720
and Al Amin Khalifa Fhimah.
204
00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:19,999
Both accused are believed-
They did it... to be in Libya.
205
00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:22,096
Both accused are believed-
They did it... to be in Libya.
206
00:17:22,120 --> 00:17:25,120
The warrants will be circulated
to Interpol... They got them.
207
00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,999
But it is considered unlikely
that they will be arrested.
208
00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:30,360
But it is considered unlikely
that they will be arrested.
209
00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,520
So I've gone through the indictment
and set it out in layman's terms,
210
00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:47,999
together with some of the
other information that we have.
211
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:50,240
Together with some of the
other information that we have.
212
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:52,720
As we know, the bomb...
213
00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:55,760
..hand-built presumably,
214
00:20:55,800 --> 00:20:56,000
was hidden inside a Toshiba
BomBeat radio-cassette recorder
215
00:20:56,001 --> 00:20:59,200
was hidden inside a Toshiba
BomBeat radio-cassette recorder
216
00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:02,560
and placed amongst
articles of clothing...
217
00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:04,000
..inside a brown
Samsonite suitcase.
218
00:21:04,001 --> 00:21:06,640
..inside a brown
Samsonite suitcase.
219
00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:09,400
Now, we know this because
blast-charred fragments
220
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:11,999
of clothing and suitcase were
found by search teams in Lockerbie
221
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:12,440
of clothing and suitcase were
found by search teams in Lockerbie
222
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,160
and forensically examined
223
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,480
by the Royal Armament Research
and Development Establishment.
224
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:19,999
Now at the same time, a
baggage record from Frankfurt
225
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:20,320
Now at the same time, a
baggage record from Frankfurt
226
00:21:20,360 --> 00:21:22,320
was turned over to
Scottish police.
227
00:21:22,360 --> 00:21:25,040
It flagged one unattended
piece of luggage,
228
00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:27,999
a suitcase not connected
with anybody on the flight.
229
00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:28,120
A suitcase not connected
with anybody on the flight.
230
00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:31,760
That suitcase was
destined for Pan Am 103.
231
00:21:31,800 --> 00:21:34,000
Via Frankfurt,
232
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:35,999
it had originated... in Malta.
233
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:37,136
It had originated... in Malta.
234
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,760
Forensic experts then looked more
closely at the damaged clothing,
235
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:43,999
finding a pair of
Yorkie trousers,
236
00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:44,120
finding a pair of
Yorkie trousers,
237
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:47,000
which Scottish police traced
to a clothing manufacturer,
238
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,000
also on Malta.
239
00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:51,560
That manufacturer then led
them to one of their buyers.
240
00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:52,000
A shop called Mary's
House, again on Malta.
241
00:21:52,001 --> 00:21:54,560
A shop called Mary's
House, again on Malta.
242
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:57,360
Now, Mary's House is
owned by the Gauci family.
243
00:21:57,400 --> 00:21:59,999
Tony Gauci has positively
identified one of the suspects,
244
00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:00,520
Tony Gauci has positively
identified one of the suspects,
245
00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:02,520
Megrahi, to Scottish police
246
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,960
as the man he sold
the clothing to
247
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:07,999
on December 7th, 1988.
248
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:08,120
On December 7th, 1988.
249
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:11,280
And then, amazingly...
250
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:14,400
..found lodged
inside the remnants
251
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:15,999
of one of the shirts
that Gauci sold...
252
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:17,520
of one of the shirts
that Gauci sold...
253
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:21,920
..was this.
254
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,640
Tiny piece of electronic
circuit board.
255
00:22:28,120 --> 00:22:31,680
This... is absolutely central
256
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:32,000
to the Crown's prosecution case.
257
00:22:32,001 --> 00:22:34,160
To the Crown's prosecution case.
258
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,600
Both British and American
forensic experts agree...
259
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,200
..this is part of the timer...
260
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,720
..attached to the
bomb's detonator.
261
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,760
It was made by a Swiss
firm based in Zurich, MEBO,
262
00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,160
owned by Edwin Bollier
263
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:55,999
and Erwin Meister.
264
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:56,680
And Erwin Meister.
265
00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:59,480
MEBO supplied 20 of the timers
266
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,080
exclusively to Libya.
267
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:04,000
Not only this, but Megrahi
established a front company
268
00:23:04,001 --> 00:23:06,096
Not only this, but Megrahi
established a front company
269
00:23:06,120 --> 00:23:08,160
under the name ABH,
270
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,120
used as a cover for Libyan
intelligence operations.
271
00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:15,040
This business was established
272
00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:17,400
in the same office building
273
00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:19,440
as MEBO.
274
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,000
And here are our suspects.
275
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:31,960
Both men live in Tripoli.
276
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,560
Both are said to be Libyan
intelligence agents...
277
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:36,000
..with Megrahi owning
a second passport
278
00:23:36,001 --> 00:23:38,280
..with Megrahi owning
a second passport
279
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:41,920
given to him by the Libyan
Intelligence Agency, the JSO.
280
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:44,000
Both men worked for
Libyan-Arab airlines,
281
00:23:44,001 --> 00:23:45,720
Both men worked for
Libyan-Arab airlines,
282
00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,760
with Megrahi as Head of
Airline Security until 1986.
283
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,999
Fhimah, as Station Manager
at Malta airport until 1988.
284
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:52,600
Fhimah, as Station Manager
at Malta airport until 1988.
285
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,240
Police believe the bomb was put
onto the plane at Malta airport,
286
00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:59,200
using Fhimah's old security pass
287
00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:00,000
to gain airside access,
using Air Malta baggage tags
288
00:24:00,001 --> 00:24:02,041
to gain airside access,
using Air Malta baggage tags
289
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,240
to allow unaccompanied
baggage on board.
290
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:07,999
That is how Fhimah and Megrahi
291
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:08,720
That is how Fhimah and Megrahi
292
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:10,880
were able to get the
suitcase airside.
293
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,640
That is how they were able to get
the bomb straight through customs,
294
00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:15,999
and bypass airport security.
295
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:17,200
And bypass airport security.
296
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:22,320
That is how these men
killed 270 people.
297
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:43,680
Hello? MURRAY: So let
me get this straight.
298
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:46,440
For almost three
years, we've been told
299
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:47,999
that Flight 103 was a
revenge attack by Iran
300
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,456
that Flight 103 was a
revenge attack by Iran
301
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,840
for the US shooting down its
Airbus, killing 290 people.
302
00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:55,840
They paid a Palestinian
terror group, the PFLP-GC,
303
00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:56,000
who are based in Syria,
304
00:24:56,001 --> 00:24:58,000
who are based in Syria,
305
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,680
to carry out the
bombing. So, we've got...
306
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:03,160
motives, named suspects.
307
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:04,000
But then everything changes.
308
00:25:04,001 --> 00:25:05,280
But then everything changes.
309
00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:07,480
We got it all
wrong. It was Libya.
310
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:09,760
Murray, have you actually
read the indictment?
311
00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:11,999
The evidence against them is pretty
damning. It's a remarkable piece
312
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:12,720
The evidence against them is pretty
damning. It's a remarkable piece
313
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:15,840
of detective work. You know, I heard
an interesting rumour this morning.
314
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,720
President Bush rang Thatcher
three months after Lockerbie
315
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:19,999
and told her, "Lay off Iran."
316
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:20,520
and told her, "Lay off Iran."
317
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:22,680
And then, on top of that,
318
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:24,920
a year later, Iraq
invades Kuwait.
319
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:27,999
So now, we need Syria's help...
320
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:29,240
So now, we need Syria's help...
321
00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:32,920
..to liberate Kuwait, keep
Iran sweet and out of the way.
322
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:34,760
That's how you defeat Saddam.
323
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:35,999
Can you not accept that the
Scottish investigators and the CIA
324
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:37,736
Can you not accept that the
Scottish investigators and the CIA
325
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:40,720
might have got this right? I'm
just asking the question, Jim.
326
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,120
The West kicks the Middle
East around like a football
327
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:44,000
to suit its needs,
always has done.
328
00:25:44,001 --> 00:25:45,256
To suit its needs,
always has done.
329
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,000
I think that's what we're seeing
here. Now it's Libya's turn.
330
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:49,920
Rogue state ruled
by Colonel Gaddafi,
331
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:51,999
a murderous nutjob with a history
of funding terrorism.Exactly.
332
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:52,600
A murderous nutjob with a history
of funding terrorism.Exactly.
333
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:54,560
They have a history
of this kind of thing.
334
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:57,480
And we've been trying to topple
Gaddafi for nearly a decade.
335
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,600
I mean, what better
excuse? Murray, I'm sorry.
336
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:00,000
I don't have time to listen
to your madcap theories.
337
00:26:00,001 --> 00:26:02,016
I don't have time to listen
to your madcap theories.
338
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,320
You mark my words,
Jim. If you think...
339
00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:07,520
Gaddafi is going to let
the West railroad Libya,
340
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:08,000
you've got another thing coming.
341
00:26:08,001 --> 00:26:09,440
You've got another thing coming.
342
00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:11,600
You going to do
anything about Gaddafi?
343
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,160
The United
States carried out the attack
344
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:15,999
in retaliation for what it
said were terrorist acts...
345
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:16,600
in retaliation for what it
said were terrorist acts...
346
00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:18,800
Under the direct
orders of the Libyan regime.
347
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:21,600
A noted 100 Libyans
were killed, 30 in Benghazi-
348
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,999
The defiance of
Libyans in the street was apparent.
349
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:24,560
The defiance of
Libyans in the street was apparent.
350
00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:27,920
Suicide squads will
be sent to attack American targets.
351
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,000
Renewed anti-American
feeling within Libya.
352
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:31,999
Syrian leader President
Assad pledging support for Gaddafi.
353
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:33,296
Syrian leader President
Assad pledging support for Gaddafi.
354
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,480
Almost every
major terrorist incident
355
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,040
has been attributed
to Libya and Gaddafi.
356
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:39,999
Libya implemented
the hijacking of a Pan Am jumbo jet
357
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:40,800
Libya implemented
the hijacking of a Pan Am jumbo jet
358
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:42,920
carried out by
four Palestinians.
359
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,440
The bullet which
killed WPC Yvonne Fletcher
360
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,360
came from Libyans
inside the embassy.
361
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,120
Supported
the Irish Republican Army.
362
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,640
This mad dog of the
Middle East referred to
363
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:55,999
the slaughter in Rome and
Vienna airports as a noble act.
364
00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:57,016
The slaughter in Rome and
Vienna airports as a noble act.
365
00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,720
Iran and Libya are two of
the most dangerous supporters
366
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:01,560
of terrorism in the world.
367
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:03,920
America is a powerful country.
368
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:04,000
Will not intimidate us
369
00:27:04,001 --> 00:27:05,960
Will not intimidate us
370
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:09,000
to accept a responsibility
that is not ours.
371
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:27,999
Oh, my God!
372
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:29,000
Oh, my God!
373
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:33,280
My apologies.
374
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:35,320
I did not mean to frighten you.
375
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:38,720
Who the hell are you?
376
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:43,760
My name is Nabil Nagameldin.
377
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:46,960
I work for the Al-Ahram
newspaper in Cairo.
378
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,040
I have come to tell you that
379
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:56,360
Gaddafi will never release
these two suspects.
380
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:59,160
That isn't possible. Oh,
no, I'm afraid it is.
381
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:00,000
Libya is under immense international
pressure to hand them over.
382
00:28:00,001 --> 00:28:02,680
Libya is under immense international
pressure to hand them over.
383
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,400
Which would make most
countries capitulate.
384
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:07,480
But Libya is not most countries.
385
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:08,000
Libya is ruled by
Muammar Gaddafi,
386
00:28:08,001 --> 00:28:09,800
Libya is ruled by
Muammar Gaddafi,
387
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:13,040
who loves nothing more than
thumbing his nose at the West.
388
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:15,999
He will stall and
obstruct at every turn.
389
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:17,600
He will stall and
obstruct at every turn.
390
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,800
But he's not stupid. He
knows that he has to assuage
391
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,480
the other Middle Eastern
and African countries.
392
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:24,000
So there are rumours...
393
00:28:24,001 --> 00:28:25,080
So there are rumours...
394
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:28,160
..these men will stand trial.
395
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,040
But in Libya.
396
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:32,000
No, they cannot
be tried in Libya.
397
00:28:32,001 --> 00:28:33,361
No, they cannot
be tried in Libya.
398
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,520
It is imperative these men
stand trial in Scotland.
399
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,560
I agree. That is why I have
come here with a request,
400
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:40,000
or, more appropriately,
an offer...
401
00:28:40,001 --> 00:28:41,720
or, more appropriately,
an offer...
402
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,760
..to take you to Libya to
meet with Colonel Gaddafi.
403
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:51,840
I have contacts
in the Libyan government.
404
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:54,040
I will write the
article and you will...
405
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:55,999
you will grant me an
interview after your meeting.
406
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:56,760
You will grant me an
interview after your meeting.
407
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,640
Why on Earth would I
do something like that?
408
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,999
Look, Gaddafi is-is- is
impetuous and impatient.
409
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:04,280
Look, Gaddafi is-is- is
impetuous and impatient.
410
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,000
He has to be approached
with-with certain,
411
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,560
shall we say,
unconventional ways.
412
00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:11,999
An approach like this from you,
413
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:12,120
An approach like this from you,
414
00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:14,240
that is one of those
ways, I'm convinced.
415
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:16,480
Gaddafi doesn't have
the first idea who I am.
416
00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:18,520
You are wrong, Dr Swire.
417
00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:20,000
In the Middle East,
you have standing,
418
00:29:20,001 --> 00:29:22,000
In the Middle East,
you have standing,
419
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,040
you are known.
420
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:26,680
You are admired.
421
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:27,999
People respect you. Truly.
422
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:28,960
People respect you. Truly.
423
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,600
They have seen you stand
up against your government.
424
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,480
Look, next month in New York,
425
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:35,999
the UN Security Council will be
meeting to discuss Resolution 731,
426
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:38,536
the UN Security Council will be
meeting to discuss Resolution 731,
427
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:41,200
compelling Libya to hand
over the two suspects.
428
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:43,999
Gaddafi will not comply.
429
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:44,120
Gaddafi will not comply.
430
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:47,200
Your country and America's next
move will be to impose sanctions.
431
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,000
The moment that happens,
432
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:51,720
Libya will become even
more of a pariah state.
433
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:52,000
Gaddafi's position
will harden...
434
00:29:52,001 --> 00:29:53,760
Gaddafi's position
will harden...
435
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:57,560
..and your-your Lockerbie
trial will be...
436
00:29:58,560 --> 00:29:59,999
..will be dead, finished.
437
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:00,560
..will be dead, finished.
438
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:06,280
Tell me this is a bad joke.
439
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:07,999
Are you sure he's not making it
all up? Oh, no, he seems genuine.
440
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:09,216
Are you sure he's not making it
all up? Oh, no, he seems genuine.
441
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:11,600
He writes for a
newspaper in Cairo.
442
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:13,600
Dad, you're not going.
443
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,999
I didn't want to decide anything
until I'd spoken to all of you.
444
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:17,456
I didn't want to decide anything
until I'd spoken to all of you.
445
00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:19,320
He's right, though.
446
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:21,440
If the UN do impose
sanctions on Libya,
447
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:23,999
those two men will never
stand trial in Scotland.
448
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:25,056
Those two men will never
stand trial in Scotland.
449
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,040
It's crazy, I know-Crazy?
450
00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:30,400
Terry Waite went to Beirut to
negotiate the release of hostages,
451
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:31,999
and they locked him in a
basement for four years.
452
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:32,840
And they locked him in a
basement for four years.
453
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:34,880
Do I have any choice?
454
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:38,840
If there's no trial, we will
never find out the truth.
455
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:39,999
Do you know what
they call Gaddafi?
456
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:40,680
Do you know what
they call Gaddafi?
457
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:44,000
The Mad Dog. He's a dictator.
His regime murders people.
458
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:45,800
I'm completely aware of that.
459
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:47,999
I'm sure he's happy to
sit down with Jim Swire,
460
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:48,440
I'm sure he's happy to
sit down with Jim Swire,
461
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:51,840
a GP from Bromsgrove, and
give him whatever he wants
462
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,360
Mum, are you gonna
say anything? I have.
463
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:55,999
I didn't want it to descend
into this. What did you expect?
464
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:57,056
I didn't want it to descend
into this. What did you expect?
465
00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:58,680
That we're all behind you?
466
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:01,480
No, please... Will,
please come back.
467
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:11,360
Well, Gaddafi's popularity stems
from his nationalist achievements.
468
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:12,000
Demanding higher
prices for Libyan oil,
469
00:31:12,001 --> 00:31:14,000
Demanding higher
prices for Libyan oil,
470
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:16,240
expelling foreign
military bases,
471
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,520
support for Palestine and
other anti-imperialist causes.
472
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:20,000
Gaddafi has also had
dozens of his critics
473
00:31:20,001 --> 00:31:22,680
Gaddafi has also had
dozens of his critics
474
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:25,440
around the world...
assassinated.
475
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:30,920
The moral support you wanted?
476
00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:32,880
I have to do this. I
can't tell you what to do.
477
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:35,000
You would go. Like a shot.
478
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:36,000
But I don't have a family.
479
00:31:36,001 --> 00:31:37,016
But I don't have a family.
480
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,760
I'm not a spokesman for
UK Families Flight 103.
481
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:43,999
Have you told them
about this? Not yet.
482
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:45,056
Have you told them
about this? Not yet.
483
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:47,400
But I'm hoping
they'll be in support.
484
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:51,680
The group...
485
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:52,000
The family's not
exactly happy about it.
486
00:31:52,001 --> 00:31:54,640
The family's not
exactly happy about it.
487
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:58,600
What?
488
00:31:58,640 --> 00:31:59,999
Just make sure they don't
say anything to anyone.
489
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:01,920
Just make sure they don't
say anything to anyone.
490
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,360
Why? Jim, are you kiddin'?
491
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,400
You took a fake bomb
on a passenger plane.
492
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,440
You've pissed off Thatcher's
government God knows how many times.
493
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,720
They'll be watching
your every move. No.
494
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,280
You really think so? They'll
get every fax before you do.
495
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:22,040
Tap every phone call.
496
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:23,999
They've probably been listening
in for years. From now on,
497
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:24,800
They've probably been listening
in for years. From now on,
498
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:26,520
you need to be
careful what you say.
499
00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:28,640
But I promised Jane I'd
phone her every day.
500
00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:34,560
Will they try to
stop me, you think?
501
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:37,880
Libya's been on the
state-sponsored terrorism list
502
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:39,999
since 1979. So yeah,
503
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:40,640
since 1979. So yeah,
504
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,720
they might. You watch yourself.
505
00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,240
You're no good to anyone dead.
506
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:53,120
If I call you and say, "Tell the
family everything's alright,"
507
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,440
that means what it says.
508
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:56,000
I'm safe.
509
00:32:56,001 --> 00:32:57,480
I'm safe.
510
00:32:57,520 --> 00:32:59,680
Bye, darling.
511
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:03,999
If I say, "Tell the family
everything's fine..."
512
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:05,136
If I say, "Tell the family
everything's fine..."
513
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:09,000
That means things are not going as
planned, but they're not critical.
514
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:12,000
If I say, "Tell EVERY-one
everything's alright."
515
00:33:12,001 --> 00:33:14,760
If I say, "Tell EVERY-one
everything's alright."
516
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,200
That means I'm in danger.
517
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:19,999
Phone the Foreign Office
and tell them to get me out.
518
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:20,400
Phone the Foreign Office
and tell them to get me out.
519
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:23,040
And what if you
can't get to a phone?
520
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,280
It's OK. We wait here.
521
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:03,960
Who's this?
522
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:07,480
It's, uh, the 1986 attack,
523
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:08,000
when Reagan ordered
the bombing of Tripoli.
524
00:36:08,001 --> 00:36:10,360
When Reagan ordered
the bombing of Tripoli.
525
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,520
Gaddafi's adoptive daughter,
Hannah, was killed instantly.
526
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:15,999
She was 15 months old.
527
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:16,720
She was 15 months old.
528
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:18,760
He has never forgotten.
529
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:24,000
Please.
530
00:36:24,001 --> 00:36:25,680
Please.
531
00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,040
Um, I will wait for you here.
532
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:32,000
Good luck, Dr Swire.
533
00:36:32,001 --> 00:36:33,080
Good luck, Dr Swire.
534
00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:56,160
Thank you for
meeting with me, sir.
535
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:58,400
You have come to talk with me.
536
00:37:59,880 --> 00:38:00,000
So, talk.
537
00:38:00,001 --> 00:38:01,880
So, talk.
538
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:04,760
We, um, myself...
539
00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:07,999
..and the families and
relatives of those who died,
540
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:08,760
..and the families and
relatives of those who died,
541
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:10,920
our utmost desire is, uh,
542
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:12,760
to see justice done.
543
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,440
So tell me, how will
justice be done?
544
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:16,000
Already the West
has convicted them.
545
00:38:16,001 --> 00:38:17,416
Already the West
has convicted them.
546
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:19,360
They are the Lockerbie bombers.
547
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:21,960
The Libyan mass murderers.
Is that justice?
548
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:24,000
No, sir. It is not.
549
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:29,200
If I may...
550
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:40,000
I brought...
551
00:38:40,001 --> 00:38:41,320
I brought...
552
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:43,160
some photographs...
553
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,880
of my daughter. Flora.
554
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:56,000
I ask only that the two men accused
of this crime be made to stand trial.
555
00:38:56,001 --> 00:39:00,000
I ask only that the two men accused
of this crime be made to stand trial.
556
00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:02,520
I assure you, they
will be treated fairly.
557
00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:03,999
When has Libya ever
been treated fairly?
558
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:05,096
When has Libya ever
been treated fairly?
559
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:08,560
Can you tell me? My country
is being blackmailed
560
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:10,720
and bullied into compliance
by the Americans,
561
00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:11,999
by the UN, and your country.
562
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:13,120
By the UN, and your country.
563
00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:18,880
If you do as they wish-Why should I
agree to a trial here or anywhere?
564
00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:19,999
Did the cowardly American pilot
who dropped the missile on my home
565
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,416
Did the cowardly American pilot
who dropped the missile on my home
566
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,600
ever stand a trial? No.
567
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,360
He was commended
for his bravery.
568
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:28,000
This meeting is over.
569
00:39:28,001 --> 00:39:29,400
This meeting is over.
570
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:42,840
Sir, we both lost daughters.
571
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,160
I'm asking you,
father to father.
572
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:13,040
This is not about revenge.
573
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:19,760
Pan Am 103.
574
00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:22,880
The truth must be known.
575
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:30,200
I only want to know
who killed my daughter.
576
00:40:59,406 --> 00:41:02,840
A British man who lost his
daughter in the Pan Am 103 bombing
577
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:03,999
is being criticized for meeting
with Libyan leader, Muammar Gaddafi.
578
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,656
Is being criticized for meeting
with Libyan leader, Muammar Gaddafi.
579
00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:09,320
I fully understand the repugnance
at anyone shaking the hand
580
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:11,999
of Colonel Gaddafi, a man
who may have known about,
581
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:12,080
of Colonel Gaddafi, a man
who may have known about,
582
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:13,840
or even ordered
the Lockerbie plot.
583
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:15,960
But let them also ask themselves
584
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:18,560
if they want to see these
two men stand trial or not.
585
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:19,999
I'm angry because the British
perception of Jim Swire
586
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:21,696
I'm angry because the British
perception of Jim Swire
587
00:41:21,720 --> 00:41:24,440
is that he speaks for all of us.
588
00:41:26,600 --> 00:41:27,999
Well, Jim's heart
was in the right place,
589
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:28,840
Well, Jim's heart
was in the right place,
590
00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:32,200
but, uh, he left
his brain at home.
591
00:41:32,240 --> 00:41:35,200
The Libyans have won a
propaganda coup with this trip.
592
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:39,920
Jim Swire has been
duped by Gaddafi.
593
00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:42,560
Jim Swire has become
Gaddafi's poodle.
594
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:47,320
We're glad as a group
to have someone like Jim,
595
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:49,840
someone who is as active
596
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:51,999
and committed and dedicated.
597
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:52,120
And committed and dedicated.
598
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:54,840
Although it has, and...
599
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:57,160
it will cost him a great deal.
600
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:31,999
Pierre Salinger, ABC
News. Hello, sir.
601
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:32,760
Pierre Salinger, ABC
News. Hello, sir.
602
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,600
I'm very grateful you've agreed
to speak with me, Mr Megrahi.
603
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:39,560
America is very interested in what
you have to say about these charges.
604
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,600
According to the indictment, you
travelled with a special suitcase
605
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:47,280
from Tripoli to Malta Airport
606
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:48,000
on the 20th of December, 1988.
607
00:42:48,001 --> 00:42:50,080
On the 20th of December, 1988.
608
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:52,440
What you mean special suitcase?
609
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:54,640
A Samsonite suitcase.
610
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:55,999
No, that is wrong. Uh...
611
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:57,240
No, that is wrong. Uh...
612
00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,440
Whenever I go to Malta,
613
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,800
which is a lot, because
of my job, I... I...
614
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:03,999
I carry what I...
what I carry in a...
615
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:05,680
I carry what I...
what I carry in a...
616
00:43:05,720 --> 00:43:07,480
a clothing case.
617
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:09,600
It's a small case, a small case.
618
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:11,760
A small case. Nev...
Never big case.
619
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:15,520
You keep a diary, Mr
Fhimah, do you not?
620
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:18,360
Yes, a personal diary. Hmm.
621
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:19,999
They say you wrote a reminder to
take some Air Malta baggage tags,
622
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:22,576
They say you wrote a reminder to
take some Air Malta baggage tags,
623
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:26,440
the kind that get bags onto planes
unaccompanied from the airport.
624
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:27,999
Now, why would you
have written that?
625
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:28,600
Now, why would you
have written that?
626
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,280
If I could, uh,
look at my diary,
627
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:32,880
I could tell you why.
628
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,760
The indictment also says
that when you went to Malta
629
00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:36,000
on the 20th of December,
630
00:43:36,001 --> 00:43:37,560
on the 20th of December,
631
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:40,720
you did so on a false
passport, using a false name.
632
00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:43,280
If I had written something
important in my diary,
633
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:44,000
I wouldn't have
just left it there.
634
00:43:44,001 --> 00:43:46,000
I wouldn't have
just left it there.
635
00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:48,280
In other words, if you felt
there was something in there
636
00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:51,440
that might implicate you in
some crime? Exactly. Exactly.
637
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:52,000
I'm, uh,
surprised they tell me this.
638
00:43:52,001 --> 00:43:55,000
I'm, uh,
surprised they tell me this.
639
00:43:55,040 --> 00:43:56,840
I'm here in Tripoli.
640
00:43:56,880 --> 00:43:59,760
My family know I was here. I
was here. They know I was here.
641
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:00,000
Well, the indictment
says you were in Malta.
642
00:44:00,001 --> 00:44:02,240
Well, the indictment
says you were in Malta.
643
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:05,080
That you stayed at the Holiday
Inn on the night of the 20th,
644
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:07,640
into the 21st of December,
1988, the day of the bombing.
645
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:08,000
My friend, I tell you, I'm...
I'm not on Malta on the day.
646
00:44:08,001 --> 00:44:10,680
My friend, I tell you, I'm...
I'm not on Malta on the day.
647
00:44:10,720 --> 00:44:12,600
I was here. You were
here, in Tripoli,
648
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:14,920
on the 21st of December? Yes.
649
00:45:27,240 --> 00:45:28,000
Hello? NABIL: Hello, Jim.
650
00:45:28,001 --> 00:45:29,360
Hello? NABIL: Hello, Jim.
651
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:31,360
Nabil. It's exactly
as I feared.
652
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:34,120
The UN Security Council
have passed the resolution.
653
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:35,999
And now Gaddafi is refusing
to release the two suspects,
654
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:36,760
And now Gaddafi is refusing
to release the two suspects,
655
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:39,240
despite the sanctions. No.
656
00:45:39,280 --> 00:45:41,560
We've reached a stalemate, Jim.
657
00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:43,920
A standoff has begun.
658
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:44,000
The international
community will not tolerate
659
00:45:44,001 --> 00:45:46,680
The international
community will not tolerate
660
00:45:46,720 --> 00:45:49,800
such threats to international
peace and security.
661
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:51,999
It is prepared to take
concerted political action
662
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:53,176
It is prepared to take
concerted political action
663
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,200
against the continuing defiance
664
00:45:55,240 --> 00:45:58,400
represented by Libya's
state-supported terrorists.
665
00:45:58,440 --> 00:45:59,999
At a
five-year memorial service,
666
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:00,360
At a
five-year memorial service,
667
00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:02,840
President Clinton had appeared
to throw down the gauntlet
668
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:04,760
for the Pan Am bombing.
669
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:06,960
It was an attack on America.
670
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:08,000
The next logical
punitive step by the United Nations
671
00:46:08,001 --> 00:46:09,976
The next logical
punitive step by the United Nations
672
00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:12,600
would be to order
a naval blockade.
673
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:15,120
Libyan anger over United
Nations' sanction vote
674
00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:16,000
has apparently come to a boil.
675
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:16,600
Has apparently come to a boil.
676
00:46:16,640 --> 00:46:19,320
Demonstrators attacked foreign
embassies in Tripoli today.
677
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:21,320
Took to
the streets to protest-
678
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:23,999
US sanctions
have cost nearly $2.5 billion.
679
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:24,040
US sanctions
have cost nearly $2.5 billion.
680
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:27,280
My clients have advised me
that they cannot get a fair trial
681
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:30,320
in the United States where people
believe they're already guilty.
682
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:31,999
Under no circumstances
will they be extradited
683
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:33,296
Under no circumstances
will they be extradited
684
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:35,080
to face trial in the
West. Sorry, we cannot.
685
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:38,120
It is unacceptable to say
justice in Scotland is not fair.
686
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:39,999
About time all sides stop shouting
at each other from the touchline.
687
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:40,880
About time all sides stop shouting
at each other from the touchline.
688
00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:43,760
I'm not here to talk politics. I'm
here to talk truth and justice.
689
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:46,560
We have the
same interest like Jim Swire.
690
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:47,999
We want the truth to be
revealed and to be found.
691
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:49,920
We want the truth to be
revealed and to be found.
692
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:52,080
Have we done
everything we could do?
693
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:55,080
Well, uh, if that's so,
it hasn't been enough.
694
00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:56,000
Eight years after Pan
Am 103 was blown out of the sky,
695
00:46:56,001 --> 00:46:58,216
Eight years after Pan
Am 103 was blown out of the sky,
696
00:46:58,240 --> 00:47:00,720
the case against the
suspected terrorist bombers
697
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,280
is an international
standoff going nowhere.
698
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:04,000
Libya's leader refuses
to hand the men over.
699
00:47:04,001 --> 00:47:05,880
Libya's leader refuses
to hand the men over.
700
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,960
Resolving the case of Pan
Am 103 in a court of law
701
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:10,920
seems as distant as ever.
702
00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:11,999
My latest proposal
will be my last.
703
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:13,176
My latest proposal
will be my last.
704
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:16,000
If this doesn't work, it
may be the end of the line.
705
00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:18,640
There is a slight chance
it will be accepted,
706
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:19,999
and any chance is
better than no chance.
707
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:21,560
And any chance is
better than no chance.
708
00:47:25,720 --> 00:47:27,999
Thank you for meeting
me, Professor Black.
709
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:28,320
Thank you for meeting
me, Professor Black.
710
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:30,240
Oh, please, Jim.
It's, uh, Robert.
711
00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:32,520
I feel like I already know you.
712
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:34,480
Please.
713
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:35,999
After four long years,
714
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:36,800
After four long years,
715
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:38,560
this is where we stand.
716
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:41,760
We are proposing the trial
be held in a neutral country.
717
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:43,999
The Netherlands? Uh, it's the only
way we'll get the Libyans on board.
718
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:45,016
The Netherlands? Uh, it's the only
way we'll get the Libyans on board.
719
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:47,080
It's the same with the jury.
720
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:50,000
Their lawyers are arguing
that any jury will be biased.
721
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:51,999
So we're proposing a
panel of Scottish judges,
722
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:52,840
So we're proposing a
panel of Scottish judges,
723
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:54,920
which Libya are still...
724
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:57,160
..mulling over.
725
00:47:57,200 --> 00:47:59,320
You've had quite a battle of it.
726
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:00,000
We are making
legal history here.
727
00:48:00,001 --> 00:48:01,440
We are making
legal history here.
728
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:04,920
Nothing like this on this scale
has ever been done before.
729
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:07,999
The only problem is the
US and the UK don't want
730
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:09,016
The only problem is the
US and the UK don't want
731
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:11,240
to be seen making
concessions to Gaddafi.
732
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:14,120
And Gaddafi wants the Arab
world to see him standing up
733
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:15,999
to the imperialistic
dogs of the West.
734
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:17,480
To the imperialistic
dogs of the West.
735
00:48:18,120 --> 00:48:21,480
Behind closed doors, of course,
both sides are desperate to agree.
736
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:23,960
The UK and the US for
the sake of the families,
737
00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:27,720
and Libya because UN sanctions
are slowly killing the country.
738
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:30,480
Right now, it's Gaddafi
that worries me.
739
00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:31,999
I think he's about to walk away,
740
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:32,520
I think he's about to walk away,
741
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:35,160
whether his country collapses
or not. You can't give up.
742
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:38,440
I don't want to. I was born
and raised in Lockerbie, Jim.
743
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:40,000
We will do all we
can. Believe me.
744
00:48:40,001 --> 00:48:42,160
We will do all we
can. Believe me.
745
00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:45,520
But unless we can
get Gaddafi on board,
746
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:47,640
it's game over.
747
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:48,000
I'll help you.
748
00:48:48,001 --> 00:48:49,680
I'll help you.
749
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,840
I have Gaddafi on speed dial.
750
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:01,880
Last traces of my sense
of humour, Robert.
751
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:03,999
Ah.
752
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:05,000
Ah.
753
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:09,960
But I'm serious.
754
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:12,000
We should go and
pay him a visit.
755
00:49:12,001 --> 00:49:14,360
We should go and
pay him a visit.
756
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:57,480
Don't take waiting this
long as a bad sign.
757
00:50:19,240 --> 00:50:21,680
This is
Professor Robert Black,
758
00:50:21,720 --> 00:50:23,999
the legal expert who
first proposed the idea.
759
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:25,336
The legal expert who
first proposed the idea.
760
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:29,360
Have a seat.
761
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:39,999
My patience is being tested.
762
00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:40,080
My patience is being tested.
763
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:42,720
My legal experts has
been in a discussion
764
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:44,800
with yours for many years.
765
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:47,840
We are impatient also,
but we must persevere.
766
00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:52,360
Uh... Uh, the tide
is turning, sir.
767
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:55,680
I note that the Arab League
have signalled their displeasure
768
00:50:55,720 --> 00:50:56,000
at the current sanctions.
769
00:50:56,001 --> 00:50:57,800
At the current sanctions.
770
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:00,040
The whole world wants to
see this trial happen.
771
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:06,520
The one thing they
aren't expecting
772
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:09,360
is for you to take the
lead. Send the suspects.
773
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:11,999
The... The trial will be
fair, your reputation intact.
774
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:12,560
The... The trial will be
fair, your reputation intact.
775
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:15,560
And they will have no choice but
to lift the sanctions. You win.
776
00:51:15,600 --> 00:51:17,360
On every count, sir.
777
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:19,320
A victory for both
you and your country.
778
00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:23,160
The way you lead,
779
00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:25,200
others will follow.
780
00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:27,999
The Libyan
government has finally agreed
781
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:28,960
The Libyan
government has finally agreed
782
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:30,880
to allow the
suspects to be tried
783
00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:33,240
in neutral territory
under Scottish law.
784
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:43,800
The trial masterminded
by Professor Robert Black,
785
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:44,000
will be held at a former
airbase in the Netherlands,
786
00:51:44,001 --> 00:51:46,240
will be held at a former
airbase in the Netherlands,
787
00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:48,520
a first in international
legal history.
788
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:15,720
Some people said
there was never going to be
789
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:16,000
a criminal trial into the
mass murder over Lockerbie.
790
00:52:16,001 --> 00:52:18,440
A criminal trial into the
mass murder over Lockerbie.
791
00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:20,560
There now is going to
be a criminal trial.
792
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:22,720
And best of all, the
relatives will now have
793
00:52:22,760 --> 00:52:23,999
the chance to hear the
evidence that we hold
794
00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:24,720
the chance to hear the
evidence that we hold
795
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:27,160
brought out in a local court.
796
00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:43,400
I know you want to
go to the trial.
797
00:52:45,240 --> 00:52:47,400
But after it's over,
798
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:48,000
I want you to
promise me something.
799
00:52:48,001 --> 00:52:50,000
I want you to
promise me something.
800
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:52,320
What?
801
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:00,800
That that's the end of it.
802
00:53:00,840 --> 00:53:03,120
You stop.
803
00:53:04,600 --> 00:53:07,040
You accept the verdict,
whatever it is.
804
00:53:14,120 --> 00:53:15,800
And we get you back.
805
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:31,040
I promise.
806
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:35,999
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807
00:53:36,000 --> 00:53:38,240
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