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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:01:04,933 --> 00:01:06,501 Block the cars. 2 00:01:07,268 --> 00:01:09,404 Cars, please. 3 00:01:10,104 --> 00:01:13,741 Same as before. Block only Avenue Hoche. 4 00:01:14,208 --> 00:01:15,910 Allow traffic on rue de Courcelles. 5 00:01:16,077 --> 00:01:19,447 Block pedestrians 6 00:01:19,614 --> 00:01:21,049 on Avenue Hoche. 7 00:01:21,683 --> 00:01:23,084 Straight ahead like that. 8 00:01:24,919 --> 00:01:26,921 Yes, like that. Careful! 9 00:01:27,355 --> 00:01:29,524 Too close, buddy! 10 00:01:29,691 --> 00:01:31,859 Come forward a tiny bit. 11 00:01:32,293 --> 00:01:34,195 Come forward... 12 00:01:34,529 --> 00:01:36,264 two inches. 13 00:01:39,300 --> 00:01:41,603 Stop! No, too much! 14 00:01:43,271 --> 00:01:45,940 A little more. Okay, good! Stay there. 15 00:01:46,107 --> 00:01:47,609 Let's do it. 16 00:01:47,775 --> 00:01:49,544 Places, everyone. 17 00:01:51,646 --> 00:01:52,914 Camera! 18 00:01:56,818 --> 00:01:57,685 Action! 19 00:02:09,030 --> 00:02:10,932 Back in position. Let's do it again. 20 00:02:12,266 --> 00:02:14,802 Reposition the car quickly. - That take was shorter. 21 00:02:14,969 --> 00:02:19,240 Philippe, if we linger too long, it drags. 22 00:02:19,407 --> 00:02:23,945 Melville and I had our disaster. We were supposed to do a film five years ago. 23 00:02:24,112 --> 00:02:27,348 We did screen tests, hair and makeup, 24 00:02:27,515 --> 00:02:31,386 but it didn't work out for reasons I'd rather not discuss, 25 00:02:31,552 --> 00:02:34,622 and so we weren't on good terms for five years. 26 00:02:34,789 --> 00:02:41,629 But like all decent people who've had a falling out, 27 00:02:41,796 --> 00:02:43,831 now everything's roses 28 00:02:43,998 --> 00:02:47,735 because we're working together, and we even laugh about it. 29 00:02:47,902 --> 00:02:51,139 “That was the time when I talked ill of you.” 30 00:02:51,305 --> 00:02:55,443 “And I did the same of you.” 31 00:02:55,610 --> 00:02:59,614 Now it's all laughter and friendship. 32 00:02:59,781 --> 00:03:02,717 What I'd like to talk about, 33 00:03:02,884 --> 00:03:06,888 because this is the first time I've worked with him, 34 00:03:07,055 --> 00:03:12,427 is that he amazes me because he's still a craftsman 35 00:03:14,028 --> 00:03:17,699 even in the middle of this “big deal.” 36 00:03:17,865 --> 00:03:22,403 A film set in 1943 with lots of characters - that's a big deal. 37 00:03:22,570 --> 00:03:24,639 And he's still the craftsman. 38 00:03:24,806 --> 00:03:28,509 His studio on rue Jenner burned down, so he's shooting at the Boulogne studios, 39 00:03:28,676 --> 00:03:31,212 which are much more luxurious, 40 00:03:31,379 --> 00:03:35,717 but his way of working remains the same. 41 00:05:40,641 --> 00:05:46,214 Audiences know Jean-Pierre Melville as the director of films like 42 00:05:46,380 --> 00:05:49,750 Le silence de la mer, Le doulos, Le samourai. 43 00:05:50,818 --> 00:05:57,558 Before listening to a little jazz, one of your favorite pastimes, 44 00:05:57,725 --> 00:06:03,798 we saw a piece on your new film, Army of Shadows, 45 00:06:03,965 --> 00:06:05,967 which you are currently editing. 46 00:06:06,133 --> 00:06:11,606 Why make Army of Shadows? And is it just a film for you? 47 00:06:11,772 --> 00:06:16,777 No, it's a nostalgic reverie about the past. 48 00:06:17,845 --> 00:06:19,614 As Courteline said, 49 00:06:19,780 --> 00:06:23,584 “Unhappy memories! Yet I welcome you. You are my long-lost youth.” 50 00:06:23,751 --> 00:06:29,757 As we grow older, we realize that what should be unhappy memories, 51 00:06:29,924 --> 00:06:34,295 the unhappy memories of 1940-1944, 52 00:06:34,462 --> 00:06:43,404 are now a period we relive in our dreams with nostalgia. 53 00:06:44,472 --> 00:06:49,911 Because we think, “I survived. It was a disaster and I was spared.” 54 00:06:50,077 --> 00:06:53,314 People who survive a plane crash don't regret making the trip. 55 00:06:53,481 --> 00:06:55,416 It's not that. 56 00:06:55,583 --> 00:06:57,685 I think if I'd died... 57 00:06:59,387 --> 00:07:04,926 and I had a twin brother who thought the way I did at the time, 58 00:07:05,092 --> 00:07:07,328 he'd wouldn't be sorry either. 59 00:07:07,495 --> 00:07:11,832 It was a fantastic time, one that had to be experienced. 60 00:07:11,999 --> 00:07:15,403 I'm glad I was 22 years old in 1939. 61 00:07:15,569 --> 00:07:18,439 I consider it a blessing. 62 00:07:18,606 --> 00:07:21,943 Were you in Paris the day the Germans paraded on the Champs-Elysées? 63 00:07:22,109 --> 00:07:24,545 No. I was never in Paris during the Occupation. 64 00:07:24,712 --> 00:07:28,316 Your film opens with German troops on parade. 65 00:07:28,482 --> 00:07:32,320 Was that historical footage or a reenactment? 66 00:07:32,486 --> 00:07:34,622 It was a reenactment. 67 00:07:34,789 --> 00:07:38,926 Everyone on the set was anxious about it. 68 00:07:39,093 --> 00:07:41,395 No one thought it'd be possible. 69 00:07:41,562 --> 00:07:46,334 At 4:00 a.m., directing night rehearsals on Avenue d'léna, 70 00:07:46,500 --> 00:07:50,171 even I thought, “lt's okay now. It's dark. No one knows what's going on. 71 00:07:50,338 --> 00:07:55,409 But later, by the Arc de Triomphe, and on the empty Place Charles de Gaulle, 72 00:07:55,576 --> 00:08:00,014 will it be possible?” And it was. 73 00:08:00,181 --> 00:08:02,583 You had the Champs-Elysées and Arc de Triomphe to yourself, 74 00:08:02,750 --> 00:08:05,019 with police protection so you wouldn't be disturbed. 75 00:08:05,186 --> 00:08:08,589 That was quite a luxury. - Yes, it was. 76 00:08:09,457 --> 00:08:14,762 Speaking of luxury, your films up to now haven't cost much, 77 00:08:14,929 --> 00:08:16,998 though producers always think films are too expensive. 78 00:08:17,164 --> 00:08:22,003 But, as Simone Signoret put it so well, 79 00:08:22,169 --> 00:08:26,073 you're a craftsman, even when working on “a big deal.” 80 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:32,480 For the first time, you've got a big budget, around a billion francs. 81 00:08:32,646 --> 00:08:33,914 Yes, 900 million. 82 00:08:34,081 --> 00:08:37,451 Almost enough for a short version of an action film like The Brain! 83 00:08:37,618 --> 00:08:40,988 What was it like having all that money? 84 00:08:41,155 --> 00:08:43,391 I didn't even notice. 85 00:08:43,557 --> 00:08:45,793 It doesn't bother me because I don't realize it. 86 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:49,130 I make films the same way I always have. 87 00:08:49,296 --> 00:08:53,934 It's true that the concept requires a large budget. 88 00:08:54,101 --> 00:08:57,438 I knew that before writing the script 89 00:08:57,605 --> 00:08:59,640 based on Joseph Kessel's book. 90 00:08:59,807 --> 00:09:03,978 But I don't feel constrained because of the film's cost. 91 00:09:04,145 --> 00:09:07,882 I work exactly as if I were in my little studio on rue Jenner, 92 00:09:08,049 --> 00:09:09,984 the same way I made my previous films. 93 00:09:10,151 --> 00:09:15,523 That's something that will always make your enemies green with envy: 94 00:09:15,689 --> 00:09:19,393 You'll always be penniless but still live like a millionaire. 95 00:09:20,327 --> 00:09:21,829 Just about. 96 00:09:22,396 --> 00:09:28,636 This film has a star-studded cast. Can you refresh our memory? 97 00:09:28,803 --> 00:09:30,004 Of course. 98 00:09:30,171 --> 00:09:33,607 Paul Meurisse, Simone Signoret, Lino Ventura, Jean-Pierre Cassel, 99 00:09:33,774 --> 00:09:39,914 Paul Crauchet, Christian Barbier, Claude Mann, Serge Reggiani, etc. 100 00:09:40,081 --> 00:09:44,618 I believe some of them are waiting now. 101 00:09:48,122 --> 00:09:52,526 Gentlemen, you are Jean-Pierre Melville's guests, 102 00:09:52,693 --> 00:09:56,931 but you're still allowed to say what you think of him. 103 00:09:57,098 --> 00:09:59,166 Jean-Pierre Cassel, 104 00:09:59,333 --> 00:10:00,801 Paul Meurisse, 105 00:10:01,402 --> 00:10:03,003 Paul Crauchet. 106 00:10:03,437 --> 00:10:07,808 Paul Meurisse, what do you really think of Jean-Pierre Melville? 107 00:10:08,976 --> 00:10:16,784 It seems silly for me to talk about Jean-Pierre Melville 108 00:10:16,951 --> 00:10:19,720 when he does it so well himself. 109 00:10:21,388 --> 00:10:29,897 It's difficult to talk about someone who's a friend, 110 00:10:30,064 --> 00:10:34,768 because it's a delicate matter. 111 00:10:34,935 --> 00:10:40,608 I'd rather talk about him simply as a director, 112 00:10:40,774 --> 00:10:46,280 and the relationship between an actor and a director, 113 00:10:46,447 --> 00:10:49,550 which can sometimes be difficult. 114 00:10:49,717 --> 00:10:53,521 It isn't because we're friends. 115 00:10:53,687 --> 00:10:57,057 It's simply because he likes actors 116 00:10:57,224 --> 00:11:04,398 with whom the actor-director relationship is a good one. 117 00:11:05,499 --> 00:11:12,273 It's very important for a director to appreciate actors. 118 00:11:13,474 --> 00:11:16,777 He doesn't have to love them - even though Melville does - 119 00:11:16,944 --> 00:11:20,681 but he can't have contempt for them. 120 00:11:20,848 --> 00:11:25,619 I think he's one of the few directors who doesn't treat actors with contempt, 121 00:11:25,786 --> 00:11:30,090 because he doesn't envy them. 122 00:11:30,257 --> 00:11:32,927 That's a nice pat on the back, Paul Meurisse. 123 00:11:33,394 --> 00:11:35,129 It's the simple truth. 124 00:11:35,296 --> 00:11:36,830 Jean-Pierre Cassel? 125 00:11:36,997 --> 00:11:39,233 Paul betrayed us! We had a little plot: 126 00:11:40,201 --> 00:11:43,470 “Melville's not here. Let's say nasty things about him!” 127 00:11:43,637 --> 00:11:48,309 But he was here just before us, 128 00:11:48,475 --> 00:11:51,345 and it doesn't feel right now, even as a joke. 129 00:11:51,512 --> 00:11:55,683 It's true. He's a real pleasure to work with. 130 00:11:55,849 --> 00:11:57,084 Paul Crauchet? 131 00:11:57,251 --> 00:12:01,455 It's difficult to speak after such brilliant colleagues! 132 00:12:02,223 --> 00:12:07,261 I'm touched by things that are difficult to talk about in public, 133 00:12:07,428 --> 00:12:13,100 which have to do with sensibility. 134 00:12:13,267 --> 00:12:19,406 When working with Melville, we work with very sensitive emotions, 135 00:12:19,573 --> 00:12:25,713 something that's increasingly denied to actors of my generation... 136 00:12:27,481 --> 00:12:30,818 who get caught up in - How can I put it? 137 00:12:30,985 --> 00:12:34,288 Overintellectualizing. 138 00:12:37,258 --> 00:12:41,996 Professionally, as well as on a personal level, 139 00:12:42,162 --> 00:12:47,901 I'm deeply touched by how deeply connected he is 140 00:12:48,068 --> 00:12:53,474 to those around him. 141 00:12:53,641 --> 00:12:55,442 Great introduction. 142 00:12:55,609 --> 00:12:58,279 I think Mr. Melville can join us now. 143 00:12:59,179 --> 00:13:02,816 I'd like to reply to Paul Meurisse, who lied as usual. 144 00:13:02,983 --> 00:13:05,252 He said I wasn't envious of actors. 145 00:13:05,419 --> 00:13:09,590 You don't know me very well. I'm extremely envious of you. 146 00:13:09,757 --> 00:13:12,726 My greatest regret is that I wasn't an actor. 147 00:13:12,893 --> 00:13:19,566 What I meant was 148 00:13:19,733 --> 00:13:23,671 that when you're on the set, you're always acting. 149 00:13:23,837 --> 00:13:25,439 That's true. 150 00:13:25,606 --> 00:13:30,444 Everyone's acting. We're acting right now. 151 00:13:30,611 --> 00:13:35,916 I'm playing the role of your guest on this show. 152 00:13:37,251 --> 00:13:41,655 You're playing the host, right? 153 00:13:41,822 --> 00:13:44,491 So everyone's playing a role, 154 00:13:44,658 --> 00:13:46,660 some better than others. 155 00:13:46,827 --> 00:13:53,767 In my opinion, the others aren't as good as me. 156 00:13:57,905 --> 00:14:01,608 We're laughing and smiling. We won't comment on that. 157 00:14:01,775 --> 00:14:04,111 Jean-Pierre Melville, did you hear 158 00:14:04,278 --> 00:14:07,314 what these men said about you? 159 00:14:07,481 --> 00:14:11,352 - Certainly. - Were you touched by their kindness? 160 00:14:11,518 --> 00:14:13,153 Absolutely. 161 00:14:14,188 --> 00:14:18,158 I've very glad Paul Crauchet said what he did, 162 00:14:19,059 --> 00:14:22,129 because it's possible to be curt with people on a set 163 00:14:22,296 --> 00:14:25,466 and have little contact with them. 164 00:14:25,632 --> 00:14:29,770 Actually, on the set of the film I'm shooting now, 165 00:14:29,937 --> 00:14:35,309 I don't have a close relationship with one actor, whom I won't name, 166 00:14:36,176 --> 00:14:38,178 and it's unpleasant. 167 00:14:38,345 --> 00:14:41,949 The end result is still the same, 168 00:14:42,116 --> 00:14:46,120 but it's annoying and pointless. 169 00:14:46,286 --> 00:14:52,359 It's much nicer being friends with Paul Crauchet and Cassel, 170 00:14:52,526 --> 00:14:56,597 and at least trying to be friends with Paul Meurisse. 171 00:14:58,232 --> 00:15:02,803 Do you ever accept actors' suggestions for their performance? 172 00:15:02,970 --> 00:15:05,305 Certainly. 173 00:15:05,472 --> 00:15:09,443 When you're directing actors, you must use their input. 174 00:15:09,610 --> 00:15:16,250 You can't impose a totally subjective vision on an actor, 175 00:15:16,417 --> 00:15:19,987 one that may be wrong for him. 176 00:15:20,154 --> 00:15:25,492 You can't direct an actor if he doesn't meet you halfway. 177 00:15:25,659 --> 00:15:29,430 Some actors - the very bad ones - 178 00:15:29,596 --> 00:15:33,734 need you to do all the work for them. 179 00:15:33,901 --> 00:15:36,403 But those are very bad actors. 180 00:15:36,570 --> 00:15:39,907 Do actors sometimes overact? 181 00:15:40,073 --> 00:15:44,778 Not in my films. It's not something they tend to do. 182 00:15:45,279 --> 00:15:48,182 So Army of Shadows will be good? 183 00:15:48,348 --> 00:15:50,584 I haven't the slightest idea. 184 00:15:51,051 --> 00:15:55,622 I hope so, but I'm not quite sure how it will come out. 185 00:15:55,789 --> 00:15:58,192 There were some difficult scenes. 186 00:15:58,358 --> 00:16:01,462 I remember one night when Cassel, Crauchet and I 187 00:16:01,628 --> 00:16:04,665 were completely exhausted. 188 00:16:04,832 --> 00:16:10,504 I was determined to shoot in a certain location 189 00:16:10,671 --> 00:16:12,840 because it reminded me 190 00:16:13,006 --> 00:16:14,775 of Joseph Kessel. 191 00:16:14,942 --> 00:16:17,578 It was at a bar called Le Cintra in Marseilles, 192 00:16:17,744 --> 00:16:22,349 where I'd seen Joseph Kessel one day, sad and distraught, 193 00:16:22,516 --> 00:16:25,452 just before he left for England. 194 00:16:25,619 --> 00:16:29,556 I wanted to shoot in Le Cintra right where I'd seen Joseph Kessel. 195 00:16:29,723 --> 00:16:37,764 Naturally, one of the first men I wanted to see upon arriving in England 196 00:16:37,931 --> 00:16:40,467 was General de Gaulle. 197 00:16:40,634 --> 00:16:45,906 He received me very warmly. 198 00:16:46,073 --> 00:16:49,142 He asked me what I wanted to do. 199 00:16:49,309 --> 00:16:50,978 I told him... 200 00:16:53,447 --> 00:16:57,217 I'd like to work for one of the various services, 201 00:16:57,384 --> 00:17:02,256 and he raised the objections I mentioned earlier. 202 00:17:02,422 --> 00:17:08,462 He said, “What you should do, since you were involved with the Resistance, 203 00:17:08,629 --> 00:17:15,402 the true strength of the French nation, is write a book about it.” 204 00:17:16,203 --> 00:17:20,374 I left... 205 00:17:24,545 --> 00:17:27,648 quite opposed to the idea, 206 00:17:27,814 --> 00:17:31,518 because writing about people who are fighting 207 00:17:31,685 --> 00:17:34,454 while you yourself are in relative safety 208 00:17:34,621 --> 00:17:40,327 is always, I think, a sensitive matter. 209 00:17:40,494 --> 00:17:46,033 But after a few weeks, 210 00:17:46,199 --> 00:17:48,502 I realized I was completely useless 211 00:17:48,669 --> 00:17:51,138 from a military standpoint. 212 00:17:51,305 --> 00:17:57,044 I'd been placed in the air force at a desk job. 213 00:17:57,210 --> 00:18:00,347 I didn't have much to do. 214 00:18:01,148 --> 00:18:06,520 When I started spending time with the French in London, 215 00:18:06,687 --> 00:18:10,891 especially those involved in the Resistance, 216 00:18:11,058 --> 00:18:14,928 I realized that perhaps the best thing I could do 217 00:18:15,095 --> 00:18:19,066 was to write about what was happening in France. 218 00:18:19,900 --> 00:18:24,004 Honestly, I'd never been so afraid 219 00:18:24,171 --> 00:18:27,240 of starting a book, 220 00:18:28,508 --> 00:18:32,679 precisely because of the feelings 221 00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,083 I just mentioned. 222 00:18:40,120 --> 00:18:43,991 In retrospect, I see no one makes literature out of it, 223 00:18:44,157 --> 00:18:48,929 but I really tried to steer clear of any literary tone. 224 00:18:49,096 --> 00:18:53,166 Resistance movements exist throughout the world, 225 00:18:53,333 --> 00:18:57,337 but the French Resistance was the one I knew. 226 00:18:57,504 --> 00:19:03,510 It was my country, and it seemed sacred to me. 227 00:19:03,677 --> 00:19:07,848 Normally, we're forced to go to war. 228 00:19:08,015 --> 00:19:10,584 Even if we go willingly, 229 00:19:10,751 --> 00:19:14,454 we're supported by an entire country, 230 00:19:14,621 --> 00:19:16,857 by popular enthusiasm, 231 00:19:17,024 --> 00:19:20,761 and the whole framework of an army. 232 00:19:20,927 --> 00:19:26,933 But in this case, all the Resistance fighters had to choose for themselves, 233 00:19:27,100 --> 00:19:29,836 and it was a difficult choice to make. 234 00:19:30,003 --> 00:19:32,706 You had to renounce your personal safety, 235 00:19:32,873 --> 00:19:38,879 and also that of your family, renounce everything in life, 236 00:19:39,046 --> 00:19:41,148 everything that makes life worth living. 237 00:19:44,885 --> 00:19:48,789 In approaching these people to describe them, 238 00:19:48,955 --> 00:19:53,960 I really had qualms about it, which is normal, 239 00:19:54,127 --> 00:19:57,497 but it held me back for a long time. 240 00:19:58,265 --> 00:20:03,070 But then I began meeting people like Colonel Remy. 241 00:20:03,236 --> 00:20:07,074 I saw Emmanuel D'Astier again, when he took the terrible risk 242 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:10,343 of traveling between England and France. 243 00:20:10,510 --> 00:20:12,446 I met Colonel Rémy, 244 00:20:12,612 --> 00:20:15,515 Médéric, and Brossolette. 245 00:20:16,450 --> 00:20:20,854 Gradually, through hearing their stories 246 00:20:21,021 --> 00:20:26,126 and through my access to the documents of the BCRA... 247 00:20:27,728 --> 00:20:33,567 I slowly fell under the spell... 248 00:20:37,204 --> 00:20:44,111 of the secrecy, the networks, the Resistance groups. 249 00:20:44,277 --> 00:20:49,816 From this arose the desire and the urgency, 250 00:20:49,983 --> 00:20:53,620 which I believe is absolutely necessary for a writer 251 00:20:53,787 --> 00:20:57,524 if he wants to write something worthwhile. 252 00:20:59,860 --> 00:21:03,597 In Army of Shadows, there's another character - 253 00:21:03,764 --> 00:21:07,768 I can't say “actor,” although he plays a very special role. 254 00:21:07,934 --> 00:21:11,872 It's Mr. Andre' Dewavrin, 255 00:21:12,038 --> 00:21:15,575 who became famous under the name of “Colonel Passy” 256 00:21:15,742 --> 00:21:19,946 and who had a very important role in the Resistance 257 00:21:20,113 --> 00:21:23,483 on which the book is based. 258 00:21:23,650 --> 00:21:27,554 Jean-Pierre, I believe you're not the only one who is touched 259 00:21:27,721 --> 00:21:31,424 that he accepted to join us tonight. 260 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:34,361 Colonel Passy, Mr. Dewavrin, 261 00:21:34,528 --> 00:21:41,034 you agreed to play yourself in Jean-Pierre Melville's film. 262 00:21:41,201 --> 00:21:44,404 I can easily imagine how it came about, 263 00:21:44,571 --> 00:21:47,941 because I know Jean-Pierre could talk the Eiffel Tower 264 00:21:48,108 --> 00:21:51,044 into standing in for the Arc de Triomphe, 265 00:21:51,211 --> 00:21:53,346 but please tell us how you agreed 266 00:21:53,513 --> 00:21:55,916 to become an actor 267 00:21:56,082 --> 00:21:59,953 for what I assure you is a very good cause. 268 00:22:00,120 --> 00:22:03,590 In reality, I fell right into his trap. 269 00:22:03,757 --> 00:22:08,595 We'd met one day and he'd asked me 270 00:22:08,762 --> 00:22:11,298 to have a look at the set design, 271 00:22:11,464 --> 00:22:17,504 because he wanted my London office to be as authentic as possible. 272 00:22:17,671 --> 00:22:24,177 His assistant called one morning to ask me to come see the set 273 00:22:24,344 --> 00:22:26,446 to make sure it was authentic. 274 00:22:26,613 --> 00:22:30,650 We agreed to meet at 5:00 p.m., and when I arrived at the Boulogne studios, 275 00:22:30,817 --> 00:22:34,855 Mr. Melville showed me the set. 276 00:22:35,021 --> 00:22:38,725 I pointed out some things to correct, and we left the set. 277 00:22:38,892 --> 00:22:43,797 Then he said, “I have a favor to ask. I hope you'll agree. 278 00:22:43,964 --> 00:22:48,802 I'd like you to play yourself in Army of Shadows. ” 279 00:22:48,969 --> 00:22:51,271 First, Jean-Pierre is a friend, 280 00:22:51,438 --> 00:22:57,277 and secondly, I was glad he was making a film of Kessel's book, 281 00:22:57,444 --> 00:23:00,113 a mutual friend of ours, so I agreed. 282 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:04,150 That's how I made my acting debut, which I hope won't be too bad. 283 00:23:04,317 --> 00:23:06,353 Did you change your lines at all? 284 00:23:06,519 --> 00:23:09,422 Yes. When I got the script, 285 00:23:09,589 --> 00:23:12,659 I had dialogue, 286 00:23:12,826 --> 00:23:15,095 or rather, the character I was playing had dialogue 287 00:23:15,262 --> 00:23:19,466 that didn't match what I'd have said in London at that time. 288 00:23:19,633 --> 00:23:24,237 I said I'd like to change the lines. He said, “Do as you like.” 289 00:23:24,404 --> 00:23:29,743 I ended up with lines in French and English quite similar to what I'd have said. 290 00:23:29,910 --> 00:23:33,313 I should mention, Mr. Dewavrin, that you're a tough audience. 291 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:37,717 When Hollywood movies try to recreate France, 292 00:23:37,884 --> 00:23:40,854 we say, “Hey, Gauloises cigarettes didn't cost that much that year.” 293 00:23:41,021 --> 00:23:44,257 It's the same for you. We were talking the other day - 294 00:23:44,424 --> 00:23:47,727 and Jean-Pierre will kill me for bringing this up - 295 00:23:47,894 --> 00:23:53,300 about using cyanide to commit suicide if captured by the Germans. 296 00:23:53,466 --> 00:23:58,571 You said, “No, we didn't use cyanide in 1943,” and you explained why. 297 00:23:58,738 --> 00:24:04,844 We used cyanide in the beginning, until around 1942, 298 00:24:05,011 --> 00:24:07,847 at which point we realized 299 00:24:08,014 --> 00:24:14,120 that people who had to use it suffered terribly. 300 00:24:14,287 --> 00:24:19,225 It was much slower than we thought, and horribly painful. 301 00:24:19,392 --> 00:24:24,197 Plus, if they were treated quickly, it might not even be lethal. 302 00:24:24,364 --> 00:24:28,401 Therefore, the English found a much more virulent poison, 303 00:24:28,568 --> 00:24:32,939 a pill small enough to be hidden in the mounting of a ring. 304 00:24:33,106 --> 00:24:36,743 It killed instantly. You dropped dead in two seconds. 305 00:24:36,910 --> 00:24:40,413 I was able to experience its strength firsthand, 306 00:24:40,580 --> 00:24:46,386 not by taking it but by transporting it in my ring when I came to France. 307 00:24:46,553 --> 00:24:51,691 I just rubbed my eyes after washing my hands, 308 00:24:51,858 --> 00:24:56,062 and my eyes swelled up like a frog's within three minutes. 309 00:24:56,796 --> 00:25:00,400 How long have you known each other? 310 00:25:00,567 --> 00:25:07,173 I met Colonel Passy at the home of our mutual friend Paul Meurisse. 311 00:25:08,208 --> 00:25:11,878 I'll never forget: The colonel sat on the floor. 312 00:25:12,045 --> 00:25:14,047 There were little tables, 313 00:25:14,214 --> 00:25:19,719 and I was sitting with some film people like Verneuil. 314 00:25:19,886 --> 00:25:21,654 And you sat on the floor. 315 00:25:21,821 --> 00:25:24,958 - What year was that? - Five or six years ago. 316 00:25:25,492 --> 00:25:31,731 You went to London in 1943, while Colonel Passy was there. 317 00:25:32,399 --> 00:25:37,303 What did Colonel Passy represent for you before you met him? 318 00:25:37,470 --> 00:25:40,907 In 1942-43, Colonel Passy was already 319 00:25:41,074 --> 00:25:44,110 a living legend in France. 320 00:25:44,277 --> 00:25:47,547 When my companions-in-arms arrived, parachuting into England - 321 00:25:47,714 --> 00:25:53,453 one was named Riblet, and another was Philippe Vallin - 322 00:25:53,620 --> 00:25:57,490 they all asked the same question: “What does Colonel Passy look like?” 323 00:25:57,657 --> 00:25:59,592 There were no pictures of him. 324 00:25:59,759 --> 00:26:02,162 That's not something to leave lying around! 325 00:26:02,328 --> 00:26:05,231 We'd seen pictures of General de Gaulle, but not Colonel Passy. 326 00:26:05,398 --> 00:26:10,637 People said, “He's handsome, young, blond, blue-eyed, etc.” 327 00:26:10,804 --> 00:26:15,341 And that's how we formed an idea of what he was like. 328 00:26:15,508 --> 00:26:20,447 - He was a real person. - But I didn't know him then. 329 00:26:20,613 --> 00:26:25,919 I did know his lieutenant very well, Pierre Brossolette. 330 00:26:26,086 --> 00:26:29,923 He was your liaison. 331 00:26:30,090 --> 00:26:32,158 On August 11, 1943, 332 00:26:32,325 --> 00:26:35,061 I spent the entire day in London with Pierre Brossolette. 333 00:26:35,228 --> 00:26:43,136 We walked from the Duke Street offices of the BCRA 334 00:26:43,303 --> 00:26:45,105 all the way to Victoria Station, 335 00:26:45,271 --> 00:26:48,608 where he took a train to catch the ship to Algiers. 336 00:26:48,775 --> 00:26:50,143 Besides Colonel Passy, 337 00:26:50,310 --> 00:26:53,646 Pierre Brossolette was the only man who knew everything 338 00:26:53,813 --> 00:26:56,149 about the Resistance network. 339 00:26:56,316 --> 00:26:58,084 I'd like to say something about that. 340 00:26:58,251 --> 00:27:03,823 When I met Colonel Passy, I asked, “Don't you think Mission Arquebuse, 341 00:27:03,990 --> 00:27:09,329 which you and Brossolette carried out, was a big risk for the Resistance? 342 00:27:09,496 --> 00:27:15,235 The only two men who knew everything about the Resistance 343 00:27:15,401 --> 00:27:18,605 parachuted into France together and stayed together. 344 00:27:18,771 --> 00:27:21,207 You moved through Paris, 345 00:27:21,374 --> 00:27:26,012 meeting contacts who were dependable, of course. 346 00:27:26,179 --> 00:27:29,682 They weren't traitors, but still, someone might have talked. 347 00:27:29,849 --> 00:27:32,185 What if you'd both been arrested?” 348 00:27:32,352 --> 00:27:37,123 Colonel Passy immediately replied, “Brossolette was arrested. 349 00:27:37,290 --> 00:27:40,326 As far as I know, he didn't talk.” 350 00:27:40,493 --> 00:27:44,564 I realized I didn't have to ask Colonel Passy if he'd have talked, 351 00:27:44,731 --> 00:27:48,034 because it was obvious he wouldn't have. 352 00:27:48,201 --> 00:27:52,071 Pierre Brossolette's memory is, of course, deeply honored, 353 00:27:52,238 --> 00:27:55,542 especially here among us. 354 00:27:55,708 --> 00:27:58,578 I'd like to ask Colonel Passy: 355 00:27:58,745 --> 00:28:02,515 If such a virulent poison existed, why didn't Brossolette use it? 356 00:28:02,682 --> 00:28:06,886 Why did he choose an even more horrible death? 357 00:28:07,053 --> 00:28:10,623 That was a subject Brossolette and I often discussed back then. 358 00:28:10,790 --> 00:28:13,226 Despite what Jean-Pierre said, 359 00:28:13,393 --> 00:28:17,497 I'd never have dared go on a mission in France without loads of poison. 360 00:28:17,664 --> 00:28:22,268 I had poison in my ring, my tie, my pocket, everywhere. 361 00:28:22,435 --> 00:28:27,073 However, Brossolette believed, because he'd been arrested before, 362 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:30,510 that there was always a way out, 363 00:28:30,677 --> 00:28:34,914 and if you had poison at hand, you'd be tempted to use it too soon. 364 00:28:35,081 --> 00:28:38,685 That's why he absolutely refused to carry poison. 365 00:28:38,851 --> 00:28:44,891 When he was arrested, and recognized, quite by accident, 366 00:28:45,058 --> 00:28:48,561 two days later he was forced, probably to avoid talking, 367 00:28:48,728 --> 00:28:50,897 to throw himself out a fifth-story window. 368 00:28:51,064 --> 00:28:55,935 I'd like to know how you manage to lead a normal life 369 00:28:56,102 --> 00:28:58,171 with everything you've experienced - 370 00:28:58,338 --> 00:29:02,942 all the great, tragic, beautiful, and horrible memories. 371 00:29:03,109 --> 00:29:08,381 I've blocked out a lot of those memories, and I try to keep it that way. 372 00:29:08,548 --> 00:29:13,253 I don't like going to war veteran's meetings and things like that. 373 00:29:13,419 --> 00:29:17,523 Usually, I try not to talk about it. It was an extremely dramatic period. 374 00:29:17,690 --> 00:29:21,527 Some of my best friends were killed, Brossolette and many others. 375 00:29:21,694 --> 00:29:26,432 Half of the BCRA's operatives died in combat, 376 00:29:26,599 --> 00:29:30,737 so it's not something I enjoy remembering. 377 00:29:31,304 --> 00:29:35,575 How do I live with that? I try to forget. I discuss it as little as possible. 378 00:29:35,742 --> 00:29:38,344 And when I must discuss it, 379 00:29:38,511 --> 00:29:40,680 I use as much humor as I can, 380 00:29:40,847 --> 00:29:45,051 because after all, without humor, we're lost. 381 00:29:45,218 --> 00:29:47,654 Jean-Pierre Melville, do you feel the same? 382 00:29:47,820 --> 00:29:52,058 After all, during the Occupation, 383 00:29:52,225 --> 00:29:56,029 you had a hard life too, with nothing to be glad about. 384 00:29:56,195 --> 00:29:57,964 I don't agree. 385 00:29:58,131 --> 00:30:02,502 For me, personally, 386 00:30:03,102 --> 00:30:08,441 as I said earlier, my memories of the Occupation aren't only tragic ones. 387 00:30:08,608 --> 00:30:12,512 What mattered during the Occupation 388 00:30:12,679 --> 00:30:16,816 was the way the lives of the French changed. 32738

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