All language subtitles for The.Big.Swindle.S01E06.The.Fake.Love.Rat.1080p.AMZN.WEB-DL.DDP2.0.H.264-BurCyg_track3_[eng]

[Sue Hughes]
For the past 25 years,

my life was not real.

Everything was a lie.

Sue Hughes paid well
in excess of £100,000,

for what she thought was
her man's cancer treatment.

[Sue] He's my best
friend's uncle,

of course I'm gonna help.

[Cusack] Sue was
so far invested

in this quest to save Ste,

that she was completely
blinded by it.

If you've got feelings
for someone,

you would do
anything for them.

[Cusack] All the time,

she didn't confide in anybody
else what she was doing.

This wasn't opportunistic.
It wasn't impulsive.

It was cold,
and it was calculated.

[Charlene Bonner]
I started thinking more about

all these gifts
that were coming,

and then that's when I knew
that something was off.

There was nothing to tell
me what was going on.

She would look
at her bank statements,

and realize the size
of the hole that she was in.

When Sue didn't believe me,

I just thought,
"She's gonna have
to learn on her own."

And she did.

Then, all the lies
started to unravel.

That was the straw that
broke the camel's back.

That's the point at which
Sue goes to the police,

-and that's what she did.
-[sirens wailing]

[Atherton] This was an
extreme example

of a terrible abuse of trust.

My name's Susan Hughes.

I live in Birkenhead.

I'm a 50-year-old woman,
just turned.

First time I met Anna,
was at work,

in a supported living home.

I cooked, she cleaned.

Come to dinnertime,

and she's serving meals.

[Cusack] They had
a lot in common,

and really found that they
shared a sense of humor.

Then they started, like,

working things so they
could do shifts together,

in the care home.

And seeing each
other afterwards

and going for drinks,
and generally having a laugh.

And they became
the best of friends,
and they really hit it off.

Me and Anna, kinda like
two peas in a pod.

We were really, really close.

We did virtually
everything together.

We were both
single at the time.

We'd go out nearly
every weekend,

so I'd go to work,

then I'd party Friday,
Saturday and Sunday.

[Sue] That's the house where

me and Anna lived together.

Her bedroom was at front.

Mine was at the back.

She was all right
to live with, to be fair.

She'd polish, I'd hoover.

Uh, she'd cook,
I'd wash the dishes.

If I was in the shower
and she needed a wee,

she'd just come in
and have a wee.

I'd be the same.

It just felt normal.

Comfortable.

They're happy memories.

We had fun in that house.

We were really, really close.

We did virtually
everything together.

[club music]

RJ's was the happening
club at the time.

It was the kind of place
where people would put
their glad rags on

and go out for the night out
on a Friday, Saturday night.

It'd have bouncers,
it'd play chart music,
it had neon lights.

[Sue] One night,
I'd seen this bouncer,

talking to Anna, I was,
like, "Oh, he's okay."

Anna went,
"That's my uncle, Ste.

Ste Lucas."

"Really?" Oh, I thought
my luck was in.

Sue has an episode
of love at first sight
with the bouncer.

[Sue] When Anna told me
he was her uncle,

I was, like,

"Yeah, I do quite fancy him."

And she's, like,

"Let's see what we can do."

[Cusack] She was
immediately struck by him.

Ste, the baldy-headed,
big bear of a bouncer,

apparently was
very kind to her.

Anna never formally
introduced us.

In RJ's, it was really loud,

like most clubs are.

He was always smiling at me.

He'd say something,
not that I could hear him.

I'd say something,
not that he could hear me.

So this one night, I decided

I was taking my camera out.

I think I took

everybody's photograph
in there.

All the bouncers, the staff.

And yeah, I did take
Ste's photograph as well.

What drew me to Ste?

He did have a cheeky smile.

He did have a nice bum.

There was a lot of flirting
going on between me and him.

We'd never kissed.

We never met outside the club.

When Sue meets Ste,

there's an instant connection
between the two of them,

but in addition to that,

Anna says that
Ste is her uncle.

So from Sue's perspective,

it is a relative
of a close friend,

so there's already an
in-built layer of trust,

of safety,
within that relationship.

[Cusack] Around the time
of the millennium,

RJ's shuts down.

The girls have to find
somewhere else to go
for their nights out.

Poor Sue is more
concerned about

Ste the bouncer
disappearing out of her life.

Sue and Ste would
see each other

every week at this nightclub.

They didn't spend any
time with each other

outside of that context,

but we have to remember that
this was in the late '90s.

People didn't really
have mobile phones.

Social media didn't exist.

So this would have been
quite typical for that time.

There was nothing abnormal
about their interactions.

When the nightclub closes,

from Sue's perspective,
it might be a bit upsetting,

'cause she might've broken
that connection with Ste,

who she's got
romantic interest in.

But having said that,

she knows that
it's Anna's uncle,

so she must've held
onto a sliver of hope,

knowing that there's
still a chance

that she might see him again,

and that this could
potentially even blossom

into something
a bit more romantic.

[Charlene] Sue used
to look after us.

She was funny.
She used to play with us.

She was more of a kid than us.

She used to make us laugh.

I used to call Sue
growing up "Aunty Soup",

because I couldn't
pronounce her name.

Charlene, Anna's
foster daughter,

is her maternal niece.

Charlene has lived with
Anna since she was two.

[producer] How would
you like to refer
to Anna, in this?

I usually call her mom.

-[producer] Okay.
You're happy with that, yeah?
-Yeah.

[Charlene] When
I was growing up,
my mom was lovely.

She would want
to do stuff with me.

She'd be like a typical mom,

might want to go to the park,
want to take me out,

we used to go to
the zoo all the time.

Just spend time
together, really.

When I was younger,

my mom used to get me
lots of birthday presents,
Christmas presents.

She used to spoil us.
We used to get lots
of toys, and gifts.

We did have
lots of good times.

When I was growing up,

my mom's and
Sue's relationship,

they were best friends.

They used to go out
clubbing every weekend,

so Sue would come
round to our house

and get ready with her,

and then they wouldn't
usually roll in 'til the next
morning. [chuckles]

[Sue] I was chief bridesmaid.

She asked me to be
her matron of honor.

My first memory that
I can remember of Sue

is when my mom
had her wedding.

But because I was only a baby,

I was kicking off because
I wanted the balloons.

And my mom wouldn't
let me have them,

but Sue kept giving me
them when she wasn't
looking. [chuckles]

[Sue] Ste didn't go
to her wedding.

He was apparently
busy with work.

Which, to be fair,
didn't seem unusual.

[Sue] As the years went on,

Anna's giving me
updates on Ste.

He moved to America.

He got married, he had kids.

He then got divorced.

Anna would fill me in

on what's he doing
and things like that,

I'd buy him
his Christmas present,
a birthday present,

she'd give it to him.

Um, it was just like...

...he's family.

After RJ's closes down,

and apart from
snippets of information

that she's fed from Anna,

she doesn't see anything,
sight or sound, of Ste,

but she never forgets him.

She still carries a torch
for him, in her heart.

Ste has always been
in the background.

Yes, I don't see him.

But he's always been there.

Anna sent me a couple
of photos of Ste.

I did question it,

because one of the photos,

he's wearing a wedding ring.

But at this point,
Ste's divorced.

I ask Anna, "Why has he
got a wedding ring on?"

"Oh, it's probably
an old photograph

from when he was married."

The photograph I took,

he had a gap in his teeth.

And he had no hair.

In these photos,
he's got no gap,

and he's got
a little bit of hair.

I, uh, said to Anna,
"Where's his gap?"

"He's had his teeth fixed."

It's plausible. You can. Okay.

[Sue] It's 2011.
It's around Christmas.

[phone ringing]

[Sue] It's a male voice
with a little accent.

Tells me, "It's Ste."

I'm in shock.

I've not seen him
for a long time.

He wants to catch up.

He said that
he was in America.

Doing really well for himself.

Said he's part owner,
or full owner,

of businesses out there.

During that phone
call, uh, Ste,

whilst he didn't
express any kind

of romantic intentions
towards her,

he talked about them
two in the future.

[Sue] He then
asks if I'm buying him
a Christmas present.

I always buy him
a Christmas present.

He wanted this

HD camcorder. Okay.

I told Ste I would
think about it.

Went back to work.

I've got butterflies.

I then rings Anna,

We're both shocked
Ste has rang me.

I didn't even think
he had my number.

It was a shock.

It was a nice shock.

Sue gets this phone
call out of the blue,

after many years,
and it's Ste.

So finally,
after feeling that this,

this potential relationship
has gone by the wayside,

she has this little
sliver of hope.

[Sue] When I got
the phone call,

it was more the fact

that Ste had rang me,

not the fact that he had asked
for a camcorder for Christmas.

It was the fact he rang me.

I've always thought of him.

It's no different.

It's nothing much.

It's like a bottle of vodka,

or a pair of socks.

These presents just come from

a bottle of vodka,
to a camcorder.

Although it might seem like
a bit of an odd request,

for somebody to ask for
a camcorder as a present,

Sue had been sending Ste gifts

for years via Anna,

using her as a conduit.

So she obviously
shows her generosity.

So it's not particularly
that unusual

or atypical for Ste to want
something a bit more,

to ask for this camcorder,
on this occasion.

So, yeah. I bought it.

I wrapped it,

I then gave it to Anna,

to give to him
when she gave him

his Christmas
presents from her.

[Das] The phone call from Ste,

I'm sure would have made him
feel like a tangible presence,

after a long absence,

and it also would have made

a potential relationship
feel real once again.

Ste gets cancer.

Struggles with the health
system out there,

without adequate
health insurance,

and comes home to
the UK for treatment.

His cancer goes
into remission.

And he starts
resuming his life,

gets a job as a doorman,

uh, at a nightclub,

uh, in Liverpool,
called Garlands.

Anna tells Sue that not
only is he working there,

but he's looking forward
to meeting up with them,

and do you fancy
coming to the club that
Saturday night?

So Sue's all excited.

She buys a new dress.

She goes with Anna
for the week.

She gets all her glad rags on
and gets her hair done.

When they get there,
he's nowhere to be seen.

And Garlands
is quite a big club,
with different rooms.

So the two women
spend most of the night

meandering around the rooms,
looking for Ste.

But they still
didn't find him.

She goes home heartbroken.

[police sirens]

[Cusack] There was a huge
drug trade at Garlands.

We know drug dealing
has been taking place
in this premises,

so we've executed
a search warrant,

and we will subsequently
be issuing a closure notice.

A lot of people were lifted
and arrested from the club.

[Sue] I was told Ste
was arrested in Garlands,
when it was raided.

Found to have alleged
drugs on him.

He was then charged,

and convicted,
and sent to prison.

[Das] It must have
been a rollercoaster
of emotions for Sue.

Ste has finally
returned from the States,

so he is accessible,
he's nearby,

possibly, they can meet up,

possibly it could lead
to some kind of relationship,

but then, out of the blue,
he's suddenly arrested,

and this must have
been a devastating blow

towards Sue
and her future plans.

Sue is clearly
a generous and kind person,

so when she hears of
this soul-crushing news,

that Ste has been
sent to prison,

of course she wants to help.

When Anna says that
there's an opportunity

to help him out financially,

because of her personality
and her nature,

Sue puts herself
in that position.

Anna, I loved like a sister.

Some decisions I have made

were done for
the right reasons.

Um, this guy
I had feelings for,

if you've got
feelings for someone,

you would do
anything for them.

[Sue] This guy,
who wasn't even 40,

uh, he's looking
at a death sentence.

I was gutted.

[Cusack] Anna breaks
the news that Ste's ill.

And Sue was devastated.

Even though 15, 16,
17 years have gone by,

she's still carrying
the torch for him.

So it must have been love.

So Anna starts talking
about fundraising,

and getting money together,

for Ste to go
for revolutionary, uh,

testicular cancer treatment,
in Maryland, in the US.

Anna said, "I can't
afford it on my own.

Will you help?"

Well, of course
I'm gonna help.

It's a friend.

And if it helps,

and he gets more
life, why not?

Ste, maybe, possibly,
there is a future there.

So, yeah.

I made the decision to help.

[Sue] Anna said,
"He needs more treatment."

It goes from £1,000

to £1,200.

And then it ended up
£1,800 a month,

just for treatment.

The hospital decided that

he was too institutionalized,

and they wanted
to move Ste into a flat

that was connected
to the hospital.

So he would still
get his treatment,

but he'd have his own space.

Which I thought
was a good idea.

So that was gonna cost me

£450 a month.

Okay. We can do this.

And then every six months,

it was £2,400.

And that was just for paying
a machine to clean his bloods.

If it would help him, yeah.

If I missed a payment,

they would charge extra.

If I was late with payments,

they would charge extra.

So the payments
had to be paid on time.

She starts building an
imaginary future

for herself, in her head,
for her and Ste.

He's in hospital.
He's on his own.

So you wanna cheer him up.

He's asked for letters off me.

So I write, three,
four letters a month.

They're not short
letters, either.

It's like, five, six A4 pages.

He started sending
love letters to her.

Lockets. Valentine's cards.

She's sending him
large sums of money,

as well as gifts.

[Sue] All these things
I'm sending and writing,

I give to Anna,

who then takes them
over to America to him.

Anna then leaves
the phone with Ste,

who...

...messages me.

And that I'm a good person.

And that he's really grateful

for me paying,
and helping him get better.

And he would make it up to me.

He can't wait to make
memories with me,

he is kicking himself

for not realizing sooner

that he has feelings for me.

I was shocked.

I was happy.

It's took him a while,
but eventually, he got there.

[Das] From Sue's
perspective, these letters,

these cards that
she's receiving from Ste

re-validate the strength
of their relationship.

It continues the cycle,

because it's
something tangible,

it's something that
she's getting back.

It's feedback
for her generosity.

It might seem
strange to some of us

that Sue would be
communicating to Ste

through somebody else's phone,
through Anna's mobile.

But everything
seemed credible.

[Sue] Nobody knew
that I was paying for

Ste's experimental treatment.

My parents, friends, no one.

I didn't tell anyone...

...because I didn't think

they'd understand
why I was paying it.

Of course I'm gonna help.

From about 14, I think,
I started noticing

Sue would bring
various gifts round

for different occasions,
so, say, Valentine's Day,

she brought, like,
a big gift bag

full of teddies, chocolate,

like, a big card,
and there was, like,

a heart-engraved stone,

it said, "I always love you."

Something along those lines.

My mom used to say,
"Oh, they're for himself."

And I'd be dead confused.

I wasn't quite sure
who they were for.

And I asked my mom,
like, "Why are they here?"

And she said,
"Oh, just don't tell her",

or, when she'd come round,
she'd say "Oh, hide them."

And then that's when I knew
that something was off.

I thought, like, she's lied.

And then it was annoying me

that she was
doing all this to Sue
and Sue didn't know.

[Sue] Charlene
has lived with Anna

since she was two.

I have known Charlene since
the day she was born.

I started thinking more about

all these gifts
that were coming,

so I eventually messaged Sue.

Anna's foster daughter,
Charlene, messages me.

Charlene is telling me
not to trust her mom.

She lies.

At this point, I did not
believe Charlene.

I was horrible to Charlene.

Sue was still
in denial about it.

[Charlene] Sue
didn't believe me.
Asked me to prove it.

So I said to her,
"Sit outside the house,

and you will see that
she doesn't go to work.

She doesn't get off her bum.

And then she blocked me
and told me to go away.

[Das] At first,
when Sue heard what
Charlene was saying,

she didn't believe her.

It feels like
she was in denial.

The thought or
the concept of Anna

having betrayed her
for so long was so painful,

that Sue would
rather reject it.

And in her mind,

it made more logical
sense to her at that time

that perhaps Charlene
wasn't telling the truth,

rather than her best friend
of many years, Anna.

When Sue didn't believe me,

I did feel upset and betrayed,

'cause I had no reason to lie.

But I just thought,

she's gonna have to
learn on her own.

And she did.

[Sue] At this point,

it felt like a relationship.

It maybe could get...

...better, when
he gets better.

[Cusack] Sue was
so far invested

in this quest to save Ste,

that she was completely
blinded by it.

With the amount
of cards and letters,

that were arriving on
Sue's door, from Ste,

she had no qualms
in upping the ante.

Sending more money.
Getting more credit cards.

Taking out loans.
Borrowing money.

All the time,

she didn't confide in anybody
else what she was doing.

It got to the point
where I couldn't do it.

It was...

...too much.

I had had enough.

I was done.

I had a breakdown.

My mental health got worse.

I went suicidal.

I got to the point,
I told my counselor

I was going home
to commit suicide.

[Cusack] In quiet moments,

she would look at her
bank statements,

and realize the size
of the hole that she was in.

She'd race to the door
when the postman

put the letters
through the door,
just on the off chance

that her mom or her dad
might see her bank statements.

She was in over
£100,000 in debt.

Credit cards maxed out.

Personal loans.

And she'd been
to a pay day lender.

So she was really up
to her eyes in debt.

I don't eat.

I don't sleep.

I don't speak.

At this point, I am living
on coffee and fags.

At this point,

Anna is still messaging
me about Ste.

Ste is pinching her phone

and sending me messages.

I'm answering them.

I've now got no job.

I can't.

It's just too hard to get up,
let alone go to work.

[Sue] She rang
where she worked,

who had never heard of Anna.
Did not know her.

This woman had worked there,

or so I thought, for 10 years.

She was, so I thought,

a manager of three wards.

So if she's not worked there,

what else is she lying about?

She's supposed
to be in America.

They're in Skelmersdale.

Funny, that.

Not America, then.

At this point,
it is the wake-up call.

I needed to pull my
head out my arse.

I then continued

to carry on as normal.

While...

...we all dig in,

to find out what
else she lied about.

[Das] Sometimes when people
come to this realization,

that they've been
duped, or lied to,

they want to confront
the perpetrator.

But in some cases, like Sue,

they might take a step back,

and this could be
for a number of reasons.

It could be because they're
actually quite frightened

of the confrontation itself,

or it could be there's still
a degree of denial.

They still don't want to
accept this horrific betrayal.

[Cusack] Anna's husband,
Steven Bonner,

had separated from Anna.

So he knocks on
Sue Hughes' door,

to ask her for the key,

because he knew

that Sue had a key
to Anna's house.

Steven wants to get
into the house,

to get his passport.

Let him in the house,
I goes in with him.

At this point,
Steven has told me

he's got some letters
and cards that he found.

The letters were letters that
I had wrote to Steve Lucas,

cards that I had sent
to Steve Lucas.

Cards that had been
sprayed with Sue's perfume.

Valentine's cards,
and knick-knacks,

they were all being
stored in a box.

It was just a nightmare.

It just somehow
made it all real.

[Das] It then became
apparent to Sue

that she wasn't
being scammed by Ste.

Ste didn't even exist.

This was all a web of lies,

created by her best
friend, Anna.

To me, that suggests that Anna

is potentially a very
dangerous person.

She completely lacks empathy.

She has no moral boundaries.

And there's no low
that she won't stoop to.

[Sue] I was gutted.

As far as I was aware,

she'd never lied to me.

We now know different.

I goes on Births,
Deaths and Marriages.

And Ste Lucas

his birthday,

nobody is born on that day.

With that name.

So this person who
I know as Ste Lucas

does not exist.

I was devastated.

I just couldn't believe it.

Then, all the lies
started to unravel.

When I got the letters,

that was the straw that
broke the camel's back.

[Das] Anna and her husband
Steve are separated,

and Steve knows
that Sue has a key,

so he needs this key
to get into the house,

so he can get
his own passport.

It's at that point

that he tells Sue

that all of these letters
that she'd previously written,

hadn't even been
forwarded on to anybody.

I then gets a text message.

How dare I take
a stranger into her house,

you know, and she's
going to the police,

blah, blah, blah.

[Das] Then, Anna threatens Sue

with legal action for
breaking into her house.

This really indicates that
she's being very defensive,

and at that moment in time,

she feels like her back
is against the wall,

doing almost anything
to get out of this situation.

[Cusack] That's the point
at which Sue goes
to the police,

and that's what she did.

[Sue] I have never spoken
to that woman since that day.

That was June 2020.

I will never
speak to her again.

She lied from day
one of friendship.

Which is why there
were no triggers.

And there was
nothing different.

I had no reason
not to believe her.

Twenty-five years
of friendship, gone.

When we look at it
from Sue's perspective,

this is a huge mental shift.

So I imagine there
must have been a lot
of emotional turmoil.

She must have been
utterly distressed, upset,

she's gone from
potentially being

in a relationship with a man

to not even knowing
if he exists,

within a matter of moments.

She might even have
been questioning other
aspects of her life,

you know, what's going on?
What's real, and what's not?

I'm sure when Anna's first
approached by the police,

she must have realized
that her whole

web of deceit
is about to collapse.

She must have been
quite panicked at the time.

But even then,

even when she's being
backed into a corner,

she still tries to blame Sue.

She says that Sue owes her
money through holidays,

and this is the only way
that she could get it back.

So, to me, this suggests
this sense of desperation.

And we see this quite
typically in some fraudsters.

They like to play the victim.

They will blame
anybody but themselves.

I didn't think that the police

or anybody would believe me,

because of the way
Anna did it.

She used my feelings, for Ste.

She used my good nature.

She manipulated me,
isolated me.

When Sue had told
me what the extent

it had gone to,
I was quite shocked.

I didn't think my mom
could be so cruel.

I was gobsmacked.

I have not come across

a fraud in which
two best friends,

with a longevity
of 20-plus years,

have ultimately
ended in this way,

in this type of fraud.

When you have victims
like Sue going to court,

to see their perpetrator
brought to justice,

it can be quite
a double-edged sword.

On the one hand,
there can be something
quite satisfying,

and cathartic about
seeing justice served,

in front of your eyes.

But on the other hand,
it can be quite upsetting.

You're re-triggering
all those memories

of being violated,
all that betrayal,

that happened over
so many years.

[Atherton] One unusual
aspect of the case

was that Charlene Bonner,
Anna Bonner's daughter,

was willing to give
evidence against her.

And it's unusual
for a family member

to be willing to give evidence

against another family member.

When I decided to help Sue
with the investigation

by giving a statement
to the police,

and telling the police exactly

what I'd seen in
the house, the gifts,

it was upsetting,
because obviously,
it was my mom.

Obviously, I'd realized
how much she'd hurt Sue

and how broken she was.

And I thought, "She can't
do that to anybody else."

Charlene, I got back
in contact with her.

Because I felt I owed
her an apology.

We are now closer than ever.

Every single day
we were in court,

Charlene was there.

I thank God for her every day.

Without her,
I wouldn't be here.

Charlene said she would never
be a witness for her mom.

She would be a witness for me.

[Atherton] The Economic Crime
Team of Merseyside Police

had done a fantastic job
in gathering the evidence.

It was strong.

Charlene Bonner was willing
to give evidence.

And there was no
doubt in my mind.

[Sue] Do I think it's enough?

No. I don't.

I had mixed emotions,
putting Anna away.

It needed to be done.

She needed to be punished
for what she'd done.

[Das] Anna clearly is a mean,
selfish and egocentric woman.

She would go to any lengths,

she knows no boundaries,

to try and defraud
her best friend.

[Sue] The fraud, yeah.
It's taken my money.

It does not account
for the emotional side,

the mental health side,

what it's done
to my physical health.

[Das] Objectively, it might
be easy for some people

to look at this scenario

and put some
of the blame on Sue.

But I think, actually,

this just indicates
her natural personality.

She's altruistic.
She's generous.

She has a huge heart.

She's obviously somebody
that's quite caring.

The blame needs to go on Anna.

This is the person that's been
manipulating her best friend,

that has been betraying
her trust for so many years.

[Sue] A lot of
the cards, and letters,

and gifts that I received,

I burnt.

The locket, I threw
in the Mersey.

I don't want nothing to do
with that part of my life.

I do think about the bouncer

who I thought was Ste Lucas.

I will never know
his proper name.

I will never know if,

you know, he got
married, had kids,

changed his job,
done whatever.

I, I will never know.

[Das] Something that
really stands out to me

about Anna's personality
is her ability to lie.

She's very skillful at it,

she did it almost right
from the beginning
of this scenario,

telling Sue that
Ste was her uncle.

It seems that later on,
throughout this scenario,

there were, there was
reasons for her lies.

It didn't seem to be

what I would consider
pathological lying.

She was lying for a purpose,
which is part of the fraud.

[Cusack] It certainly
is the behavior pattern
of a compulsive liar.

But something a little
bit more sinister than
a compulsive liar.

I think it's the behavior
pattern, uh, of a psychopath.

I think that Anna is an
extremely selfish person,

who has put aside
years of friendship

with somebody she perceives

to be quite naive
and vulnerable,

and she's pulled
at her heartstrings.

She knows how to target
one particular area,

that Sue is quite
sensitive about,

which is her potential
romantic life.

So she really will
go to any depths,

she'll make up any lies,

she'll lie about
family members,

she will create
fake phone calls,

she will write fake messages,

she'll do whatever it
takes to extract money

from her cash cow over
a long period of time.

[Sue] It was a hard,
long journey,

to get to this point.

I'm still in recovery.

She has been punished,

in my opinion, not enough.

I thought she was a friend.

Yeah, no.

Friends like that,
who needs enemies?

Charlene is...

...my niece.

Charlene's always
called me Aunty.

But yeah,
our relationship is great.

We have not argued

since we reconnected.

My relationship with Sue
today is very good.

We are, she is like
the mom I've never had.

And we are very close,

and she loves my children
like they are her own.

Honestly, our
relationship's great.