All language subtitles for Slutever s02e07 Sugar Babies.eg

Karley: Who is this?

This is Donatella.

She was a purchase with
the sugar-daddy money.

I wanted a hairless cat,
and hairless cats aren't cheap.

How much do these cats
generally cost?

Like, $1,500
to $2,000,

and if you're gonna get
a really good one, like, $3,500.

She's bougie
like her mom.

I want one.

♪♪

Karley:
I'm an independent woman or whatever,

but I still like it
when guys buy me stuff.

Duh.

Like, ever since I was
a little girl

watching
"Breakfast at Tiffany's,"

I've wanted a sugar daddy
to bankroll

my superficial existence.

And now, thanks to the Internet,

I'm pretty sure you can order
a sugar daddy on Amazon Prime

because the world is on fire.

As the slutty feminist
that I am,

I can't help but wonder,

"Is being a sugar baby
the world's greatest life hack?"

♪♪

Honestly in this
pre-apocalyptic world

where the average blogger
is 50 grand in college debt,

being sponsored by
a random finance bro

doesn't sound so bad.

How the F does the average slut
make rent these days?

What's the craziest thing that
you have ever done for money?

-Oh, yikes.
-How much money?

You tell me.

I worked a corporate job
for two years.

Probably steal
from people.

Licked the sidewalk
for, like, $10.

-You've done that?
-Yeah.

A library job.

If -- When you were
working at this library,

if an older guy came up
and was like,

"Will you be
my fake girlfriend,

and I'll pay you a couple
thousand dollars a month,"

would you have
done it instead?

Probably.

Karley: Confirmed --
Everybody's desperate.

♪♪

Back in my mid-20s,
I was a sugar baby for a while.

So in the most basic terms,

a sugar baby is usually
a younger woman

who forms a relationship
with an older man

that has some sort
of financial exchange.

These relationships are most
often formed on sugar websites.

The most common of all
is called SeekingArrangement.

Back when I was
on SeekingArrangement,

I knew other girls
that were doing this,

but people were
pretty discrete about it.

It was something that kind of
had a stigma, you know?

Fast-forward a handful of years,
and SeekingArrangement alone

has over 10 million
registered members.

That's literally more people
than live in New York City.

♪♪

With more women on sugar
websites than ever before,

I'm curious
how things have changed

since I was sugaring,
so I'm meeting up

with a sugar baby
who's a sophomore in college

to see what she
gets out of it.

My name's Ava.

I'm a college student,

and I guess you could say
I'm a sugar baby as my "job."

-Side hustle.
-Side hustle.

-Main hustle.
-I mean, it's just kind of

something to do
when I'm not in class.

♪♪

So, this is where I live.

I love men's sneakers,
'cause boys like you better

when you have
men's sneakers.

-Oh, what's that?
-These cost $1,000,

if you don't know what
they are.

These go for, like,
two grand now, but...

Really? I know nothing
about men's fashion,

but these don't look like
they're worth two grand.

They don't, and they're crappy
and fall apart on the bottom,

but I'm about
the Chanel slides these days.

I feel like
you like Gucci.

This is something I'm reading
just from being in your room.

That's my brand
right now.

Yeah, I got the phone case,
the jeans, the shoes,

the sandals, and this is for
when I feel like being a girl

and not wearing snakes.
-This, I like.

-Yeah?
-This, I would get.

If I had a sugar daddy, like,
that's what I would pick out.

This one wasn't
that much money.

What's
"not that much money"?

$1,200.

Like, my bag collection could
probably pay for a semester.

So, you bought all this
with your sugar money?

Yeah.

♪♪

How did you hear
about SeekingArrangement?

Freshman year in college,
my friends were like,

"Oh, my God," like,
"We're all on this site."

I will walk
into a frat party,

and it'll be a topic
of conversation.

And I have
these frat guys,

like, pimping out girls,
being like,

"Oh, let me be your
SeekingArrangement manager."

-That is insane.
-Yeah.

You don't need a pimp
on SeekingArrangement. No.

For me, I made it very clear in
my profile what I'm looking for.

That's completely platonic,
nothing sexual.

If girls and your friends
are sleeping with guys,

can you make
more money that way?

I think so.
I think it would be so easy.

There's all different kinds
of ways of being a sugar baby.

Like, it can be sex work
if you make it sex work.

♪♪

So, I'm just gonna show you
my profile on my phone.

My username -- I just made
"networkseeking."

The heading --
I just put

"Looking to network"
with a little happy face.

They love the little happy faces
for some reason.

It just makes you seem
that much more approachable.

The picture I used --
I just kind of picked one

where I'm just,
like, in a tank top.

-You look like a sex doll.
-You think?

But, like -- But you're
wearing clothes.

Exactly.
But that's just your look maybe.

-Yeah.
-You have, like,

900,000 messages.
-Yeah.

These are all
from the last week.

There's, like, a million.
-Mm-hmm, yeah.

So what do your arrangements
look like?

I make sure I show up
wearing something expensive,

like, super nice,
and, like,

I'll sit down and talk
to them, be like,

"How are you?" like,
"Tell me what you do for work."

Like, that's always what
I like to start off with.

Then I'll be like,
"Well, I'm a PR major.

These are
the internships I want.

These are the business
opportunities I want,"

and I, like, empower them
and make them feel like

they can offer me
so much.

It's like
a mentor boner.

-Yeah.
-I think...

So it's fulfilling them
in a different way

than sexually.
-Yeah.

How do you learn
how to negotiate?

Like, who teaches you
how to be a sugar baby

in a way that's safe?

You could go into it
blind, kind of,

and you start having all
these men message you like,

"$500 pay-per-meet,"
and things like that,

and they're like,
"What? What's this mean?"

like, "What am I doing?"
like, "Am I an escort now?"

like, "Is this okay?"

And it's, like,
kind of just,

I feel like,
learned through experience.

And I'm not saying it would
work out for everyone that way,

and I've gotten extremely lucky
with the people I've met,

but, I mean, it's taken a lot
of sorting through messages

and things like that
to get there.

Here's someone I was talking to.
This man just messaged me.

He's like, "Hi, I love your
profile. Are you still looking?"

and then I explained to him
what I'm looking for.

I said, "Yes, I'm seeking
a mentor of sorts,

a platonic relationship,

mostly seeking out
career advice, friendship,

hoping to meet with someone
interested in this over dinner.

-So you told him right away...
-Right away.

...that you wanted
a platonic relationship,

and he was like...

"Okay, sounds good,
mentor/protege.

I've done that before
and enjoyed it immensely."

Do you think that,
a lot of times,

when guys engage with you
after you say

you want something
platonic...

They think that they can
convince me otherwise.

-They do, right?
-They do.

I feel like they do, and so you
just take it for what it is.

You have your first dinner,
and if you never see them again,

there's other men
out there.

Like, I would use it like
any other student

would use, like,
a job-search site.

It's like I made
SeekingArrangement into, like,

LinkedIn with perks.

♪♪

Karley: While Ava has managed
to make sugaring

more about handing out résumés
than blow jobs,

most sugar relationships
are not platonic.

So, where do girls learn

how to negotiate
their sexual boundaries

while steering clear of
catfish daddies and frat pimps?

Brook:
You want to give him something

but not, like,
the whole shebang.

-This is, like, my lucky outfit.
-Really?

Is it because, like,
it's vagina-like?

I've met a number
of sugar babies, almost 500.

Is this, like,
your full-time job?

♪♪

♪♪

Karley:
I want to know how a sugar baby becomes skilled at negotiating,

so I'm in Beverly Hills

at a SeekingArrangement
sugar-baby boot camp --

one of many
all over the country.

It's like going to trade school
but the slutty version.

-Thank you.
-You're welcome. Have fun.

Cheers.

-Hey, guys.
-Hi.

I'm gonna ask you some nosy
questions, if that's okay.

What are the guys
on the site like?

We have the very normal and
then the very, like, kinky.

You know, they'll just,
like, ask for things

I've never even heard of.
-Like what?

-Golden oral showers.
-I know what that is.

I was like, "Maybe not for me,"
and he was like, "Okay."

Is it, like,
a weird conversation to have,

to be like,
"Okay, cool.

It was so great
hanging out with you," like,

"We have great chemistry,
but, like, now pay me."

It's not
necessarily, like,

a talk you have
to have about money.

It can be,
"I need to move,"

like, "Swipe that card
for my rent

for the next 6 months,"
you know...

-Right, right, right.
-...just whatever.

Being demanding, I think,
is, like, a learned skill

and one that I, like,
haven't learned.

It's not necessarily
demanding.

It's being assertive.

Have to be like,
"I hate my bag so much.

My bag is broken."

"I broke my zipper
and need a new one so bad.

Look, the Gucci store
is right there.

It's still open for an hour!"
-Yeah. [ Gasps ]

♪♪

Brook:
Hi, sugar babies.

Welcome to our Los Angeles
"Let's Talk Sugar" pop-up.

I'm Alexis.
This is Brook.

We are here today to answer
all of your questions

about
SeekingArrangement.com.

How many of you guys have
a SeekingArrangement profile?

-Good, yes.
-Ooh.

I have some notebooks
in your bags.

If you guys want
to take them out,

I want you to think of the top
two questions you have for us

and write them down on
your handy-dandy notebooks.

♪♪

And then I will come around
and collect those questions.

-Yeah, pull the little page out.
-So you can just rip them out.

So a lot of the questions
are about money, of course.

When you're asking
for money,

it's gonna be
based on your need.

Daddies don't want
to just buy you a Prada.

You need to have a spreadsheet
with your expenses

so that you can share that
with a sugar daddy.

You can say,
"Where can you help me?"

Then he should know
that he needs to take the bait

and give you
what you want

because, potentially, you might
have to pick up a second job

because you can't afford
to hang out with him anymore.

Exactly and you just
won't have the time

to spend with him.

Um, is a sugar daddy gonna think
I'm, like, totally crazy

if we give him
an actual spreadsheet?

On the first date,
yes, but...

Do not do that
on the first date.

Yeah, no, once you get
to know someone,

I don't think
it's strange at all.

I think it's really smart
to start an e-mail thread

with your sugar daddy.

A lot of older men
of this variety

use e-mail all day.
-Mm-hmm.

They might not be using
texting all day,

but they'll use e-mail.
-Think about your own dad.

If you ask your own dad
for something...Biological father.

...yes, your biological father,
and you're just like,

"Dad, I want money,"
and he's like, "Okay,"

but if you're like, "Dad,
I need a new tire for my car,"

he's probably
gonna give you

the money for the tire
for your car...

-Been there.
-...probably, yeah.

-Dad always comes through.
-So...

Karley: Okay, so,
the literal dad comparison

is kind of creepy
but maybe good life advice.

So that's the, "You're
handsome. You're smart.

I love when
you call me."

They want to hear you
affirming them in that way.

Also, if he's
wearing a watch,

you can look at his watch
and compliment his watch.

But you need to ask him,
be like,

"I really love your timepiece."
-Call it a timepiece.

Call it a timepiece
because we just like it.

What do I wear
on a first date?

You are only going to
display one body part,

so if you decide you're gonna
show off the legs that day,

I don't want to see
all of this out.

You want to give him something,
reveal something to him,

but not, like,
the whole shebang.

-Don't have all your milk out.
-Don't have all your milk out.

Karley: Milk?[Mooing]

No.

If you don't want to be
sexual, do you have to?

-Um, no.
-Hello?

I would say, "No."

So you want to have
a sexual connection

with someone if you want
to get intimate with them.

If you don't feel that way,
then don't do it.

Please hear these words,
like, from me.

Please hear
these words.

I was wondering, if you're never
willing to have sex,

then what would be in it
for the guy?

Like, why would he do it?

There are
a lot of people

who have successful
platonic arrangements.

-Mm-hmm.
-I don't so much like them.

I think they're, like, a bit
of opportunists personally.

I think
a real relationship,

you shouldn't be opposed
to having sex.

I mean, it's online dating,
so there are guys

who want to have sex,
believe it or not.

-Mm-hmm.
-Oh, my God, I'm shocked!

Like, it's just a dating site
like any other.

Karley: Okay, so you don't
have to have sex,

but you should probably
definitely should. Got it.

[Applause]

Stop.
Stop.

You shouldn't have,
but you should have.

Keep going.

Karley:
Times have definitely changed since I was a sugar baby.

Like, I never understood
that you were supposed

to call a man's watch
a timepiece.

I never have called my tits
my milk before.

[Indistinct conversations]

Karley:
I came here looking for some clarity on sugar negotiation,

but they just made it seem

like sugaring
is a 1950s role-play

where women trick men
into handing over their wallets.

What gives?

Every day,
there's a new trove

of models and actresses
flying into LAX.

I don't know anybody
who's not a sugar baby,

if you really
want to know.

Interesting.

♪♪

♪♪

Karley:
As I'm trying to understand the convoluted world

of the modern sugar baby,
I want to know --

What are the daddies
looking for,

and how do they feel about
opening up their bank accounts?

-I like your house.
-Oh, thank you.

Welcome
to California.

Have you been on the site
for a long time?

Yeah, for more than
five years, actually.

So, how did you initially hear
about the website?

I was married
at the time.

I had discovered that my wife
had a lot of affairs,

and I'd gone online to find out
something similar

for somebody in my age bracket

and came across
the SeekingArrangement site.

Interesting.

I've met a number
of sugar babies on the site.

-How many?
-Um, almost 500.

You've met
almost 500 people?

[ Chuckling ] Is this, like,
your full-time job?

[ Chuckles ] In this world
today, in L.A. and New York,

I don't know anybody
who's not a sugar baby,

if you really
want to know.

So, of course, every day,
it feels that

there's a new trove of models
and actresses flying into LAX

that want to meet
their benefactors.

Karley: So in other words,
a classic Hollywood romance.

Is there an age bracket
that you feel like

is perfect
for a sugar baby?

Oh, in their
early 20s, say.

That's sort of
perverse.

Well, it is.

When you have
a young lady in college

going on a date
with a guy who is 55,

there's some component of it
that isn't quite normal.

It's not "finding the one,"
if you will,

but it's a relationship
nevertheless.

What do you get out
of these relationships?

I find it thrilling
to be a provider,

and the excitement of being
with a young woman

is both very gratifying
and flattering.

You know, there's
a validation as a man. Right.

Karley: So in a perfect world,
both sides get what they need.

However, it's still not
super clear

how sex plays
into these relationships.

So, I'm headed to meet
sexologist and former sex worker

Dr. Carol Queen
for some real talk.

Why is it that sugar-daddy
websites are being so vague

about whether sex is involved
in these relationships?

Because given that money
is often clearly involved,

sex and money
would equal sex work

and would get the website
potentially shut down.

Yeah, because you can't
sell sex legally.

When sex enters
the picture,

it becomes
a different discussion,

and sugar babying
lives somewhere

between sex work
and dating sites.

You know, it's sort of
a Venn-diagram middle space.

Sometimes sex
might not be involved,

but I would argue that this
is a sexualized situation

in most cases.
-Right.

The deniability, I think,
is super key here.

From the website to the sugar
baby to the sugar daddy,

in this situation, everybody
gets some plausible deniability.

It's the kind of thing that you
can imagine telling your mom,

like, "I have a sugar daddy,"
and her being like,

"That sounds okay,"
versus being like,

"I've got a client."
-Yeah.

Sugar babying is just
a step away enough

from acknowledged sex work
for many people

that it seems doable.

It doesn't bring up
the sense of shame

or,
"Oh, I can't do that."

It doesn't step over a line
that many people would be

maybe a little loathe
to step over.

I'm very pro-sex-work for people
who are consensually doing it.

However, I do
sometimes worry

that the marketing
of this website

of, "It's just
a relationship,"

leads to young women
not realizing

that sex
is going to be expected.

I do worry about anybody
stepping into the sex industry

not really sure that
that's where they are.

Sex work is best
when you know you're doing it

and you know how you're
optimizing your situation --

be able to communicate, be able
to negotiate, all that stuff.

And given the fact that there
are millions of women

on this site ostensibly
interested in doing this,

it does seem like it
would be useful to understand

what sex work is,
how to do it safely,

the fact that it comes
in many forms,

and that you can
do it consensually,

and that doesn't
make you a bad person.

Super sensible, and it might
help people feel

more grounded
in what they're doing.

Right.

Karley: Ultimately,
if sex work was legal,

people who wanted to engage
in it would be safer.

But as it stands,
how do people incorporate sex

into their arrangements?

Jessica: It feels
very powerful.

You want me so badly
you are going to pay me

a lot of money
to be around you.

Respect.

♪♪

Karley: Not all sugar
relationships are sexual,

but many are, so I want to know
what it's like

to negotiate the intersection
of romance and money

when sex is involved.

-Hi!
-Hey.

Karley: So I'm meeting Jessica,
a college student

who currently
has two sugar daddies

and is in town
to meet a potential third.

-Glam.
-I know.

I got all
my cute stuff out.

I'm excited.

So, you're in L.A.
for a date, right?

-Yeah, yeah.
-What are you gonna wear?

I usually wear this.

This is, like, my lucky outfit.
-Really?

Is it because, like,
it's vagina-like?

Yeah, no.
This is what...

I mean, I think it has
a lot to do with it.

It used to not be this short,
but it actually shrunk, so...

I feel like, if it's working,
we should just stay with it.

So how long have you been
a sugar baby?

I've been a sugar baby for --
okay, 18, 19, 20, 21 --

four years.

So, you started right
when you were 18, like,

fresh out the gate.
-Yeah.

Can I ask how much money
you make?

The man who I see consistently,
he gives me

a setup of $3,000
a month,

and the man I see
kind of, like, on and off,

it's $2,000 to $3,000,
just kind of depending.

That one's a little different
because we see each other

not really, like,
a set amount, you know?

Do you consider being
a sugar baby sex work?

Yeah, I definitely do.

Even if you're not being,
like, I feel like,

sexually active, you know,
on the off chance you are

in one of
the sugar relationships

where you don't have sex,
you know,

I still feel like it is
just because

it's like
you're spending time

and, like, emotional intimacy
with another person, you know?

I definitely
think it is.

So, why do you do this?

I do this because,
you know, like,

I've always wanted to be, like,
a really educated person.

Like, I've always known, like,
I wanted to go to college.

I always knew I wanted
to get a degree,

and I always knew I wanted
to get a master's.

And that was something
that I was like --

I didn't know how I was
gonna get to that,

and I was just like,
"Dude, I'm spending, like,

50 hours a week at work,
and I'm still barely making it,"

you know, just kind of really,
like, really, like,

broke my heart to think
I wouldn't be able to,

like, reach some of my dreams
just because, like,

I just wasn't in
the financial position.

So, for you, that money
is life-changing.

Yeah, yeah,
definitely.

It's just really opened up
kind of, like,

a world of opportunities
for me

that I had never,
like, seen before.

This isn't something I want to
do forever obviously, you know?

Like, I want to be making
all this money

also, you know,
on my own,

but it was definitely,
like, an amazing,

amazing start to help me
get to where I want to be.

♪♪

So, when you're on your way
to meet someone new,

do you get nervous?

I don't really get
nervous, you know?

Like, I do enough background,
like, checks before.

Like, I do a lot of, like,
safety precautions before,

so I know that I'm safe.

I wouldn't recommend anyone
ever meeting anybody,

like, in
an isolated area.

Have you had negative
experiences on the site?

Yeah, I definitely had a lot of
negative experiences at first.

Very often, you'll be, like,
wasting time after time,

like, you know, spending time
with these guys,

but then they end up just,
like, ghosting you.

They get you
to hang out,

sometimes have
a sexual interaction,

and then they just don't
text you back.

Yeah, yeah, mm-hmm.
Exactly, yeah, and that

happens a lot.

But other than that,
it's fun.

Like, you get
to get dressed up.

You get to go to a nice place,
you know, and it's like --

And most
of the time, like,

I've meet
a lot of really fun men

and a lot of great men
who, you know, like,

even if things didn't
work out with in that way,

they were just
really fun company.

Well, it feels, like,
not feminist to say,

but, like, there is something
that can be super erotic

about being,
like, paid for.

Yeah, yeah,
definitely.

Like, it feels very
powerful, you know?

Like, you want me
so badly.

You are going to pay me,
like, a lot of money just,

you know, for me
to be around you.

Feminism these days
is so interesting

and confusing,
but respect.[Laughter]

Karley:
In a society that tends to stigmatize any form of sex work,

Jessica is living proof that you
can do it in an empowered way.

-Thank you so much!
-No problem.

Karley: Whether you need to pay
for college

or just stupidly
expensive shoes,

sugaring works
for a lot of people

so long as you approach it
consciously and with agency,

just like any job
or any relationship.

And maybe one day in
the Utopian sex-positive future,

our society will permit people
to sugar more openly

and, therefore, more safely.

Because no matter what your
sugar arrangement looks like,

women should be free
to make decisions

about who they bang and why.

My body, my choice, you know?

Sugar on, sluts.

♪♪

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