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Mother Nature gave us something
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that's richer than
our imagination.
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We saw a very peculiar pattern.
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Never seen anything
like this before.
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I remember him saying,
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"Remember this word: CRISPR."
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We've never had
the ability to change
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the fundamental chemical nature
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of who we are, and now we do.
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And what do we do with that?
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David's doctor told
me, "Just hold on.
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There's something coming."
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To change DNA.
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You can actually do it.
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We could engineer a
single gene that could
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potentially make us
all more muscular.
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But should we make
that universally available?
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Should we really be
manipulating the heredity
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of future generations given
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our lack of knowledge
about so many things?
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I don't know where
you draw the line
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between not having albinism
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and deciding your kid
needs to be an extra foot taller
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so they can be a good oarsman
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and go to Yale...
where is that line?
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Who's gonna draw that?
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Anything that will stop
my child from suffering
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I'm for.
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But don't draw it in
front of my disease.
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What does this
mean for this science,
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where we have the
capacity to edit in
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some things that we
think are important?
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Are we playing God?
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You don't realize
it's disruptive
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until you look backward.
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Often you don't realize
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that you're in the
middle of a revolution
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until after the
revolution has occurred.
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Major funding for NOVA
is provided by the following:
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Dr. Bonner, fellow
prophets, and...
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Ladies and gentlemen...
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This summer, I traveled through
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northern Arizona
and southern Utah.
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In this land, the rivers
have carved great gorges,
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and on the sheer
cliffs of these gorges,
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one can read a billion years
of the history of the Earth.
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On that immense scale,
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a foot represents the passage
of perhaps 100,000 years;
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all of man's recorded
history took place
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as an inch was deposited;
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all of organized
science, a millimeter;
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all we know of genetics,
a few tens of microns.
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The dramatic advances
of the past few decades
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have led to the discovery of DNA
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and to the decipherment
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00:04:01,931 --> 00:04:04,520
of the universal
hereditary code,
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the age-old language
of the living cell.
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And with this understanding
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will come the
control of processes
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that have known only
the mindless discipline
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of natural selection
for two billion years.
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And now the impact of
science will strike straight home,
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for the biological
world includes us.
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We will surely come to the time
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when man will have
the power to alter,
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specifically and
consciously, his very genes.
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This will be a new
event in the universe.
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The prospect is, to me,
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awesome in its
potential for deliverance
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or equally for disaster.
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There we go, much better.
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You want to squeeze my hand?
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Relax your shoulders.
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Relax your toes.
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Being in the hospital
isn't scary to me.
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Having a certain new problem
isn't scary to me anymore,
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'cause it's happened
so many times.
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I don't know, my blood just
does not like me very much,
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I guess.
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Your red cells are
supposed to be round
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and have oxygen in them.
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Mine are half-moon-shaped,
sickle-shaped,
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which is why it's
called sickle cell,
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so I don't get the
same amount of oxygen.
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I always say, like, oil change.
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You know, you
drain the dirty out
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and then put a clean in.
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Yeah, so he just needs a tune-up
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every four to six weeks,
yeah, uh-huh, yeah... okay?
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Okay. Put this on.
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Take deep breath and hold.
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Mm.
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Okay.
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You okay, David? Mm-hmm.
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He used to tell me,
"Don't cry, Nonna.
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Why are you crying?"
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I said, you know...
"Love you, baby."
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He goes, "Don't worry about it."
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He says, "If I lose
my life," he goes,
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"You'll see me again."
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And I thought, "This
child has more strength
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and faith than I do."
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It's often called the
first molecular disease.
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It's caused by a single
change in the DNA sequence.
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It's the letter A
changed to a letter T.
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- That's it?
- That's it.
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And that mutation
causes a kink in the protein
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that prevents it
from folding properly.
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If your folding structure
of a protein is disrupted,
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now that protein can't function.
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It causes the red blood
cell to really collapse.
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It becomes very stiff and
it can't squeeze through,
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and you're not able
to get red blood cells
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to the tissues where
they can deliver oxygen,
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and if you block the ability of
oxygen to get to those tissues,
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those tissues won't work
well and they'll get damaged.
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In Africa, the life expectancy
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for somebody with
sickle cell disease
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is on the order of five
to eight years of age.
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In the U.S., it's the
early to mid-40s.
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What do you say to a kid
that their life is gonna be...
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We avoid it... we avoid that...
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It's not a, it's... Really?
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It's not a conversation
we're good at having.
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Makes me very nervous.
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00:09:03,163 --> 00:09:05,027
David can go from
crazy teenager,
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joking, jumping around,
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00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:13,483
to a fetal position
on his knees.
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It's like... pulsing.
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"This hurts!"
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"You're having a
sickle cell crisis!"
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Look, I can have,
like, a little pain crisis
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where it really doesn't count,
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00:09:28,257 --> 00:09:30,086
and then I can have
something really bad,
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but I'm not just gonna
not play basketball.
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00:09:32,779 --> 00:09:34,574
You can't just not
play basketball.
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This is David's
old red blood cells.
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We're gonna save for research.
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How do you sing it?
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โช Rain, rain, go
away, come again... โช
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It's a genetic disorder,
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so in order to cure
a genetic disorder,
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you literally have to
go in and fix the gene.
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00:10:01,531 --> 00:10:03,637
We just didn't have the tools
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00:10:03,741 --> 00:10:07,261
to make that single-letter
change in a precise fashion.
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Even one letter?
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Especially one letter.
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Deoxyribonucleic
acid, or DNA for short,
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is the material
that's the basis of life.
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Each living thing
has its unique DNA
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that determines what
that living thing will be:
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plant or animal, man or muskrat.
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If we understood
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the structure of genes,
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the structure of chromosomes,
and how genes work,
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then we might better
be able to understand
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and treat genetic diseases
which occur in humans.
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The work that Paul Berg did,
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that was probably the beginning.
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This dream of gene therapy
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was born out of those
1970s experiments,
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and we were still
very far away from it,
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but you'll see people talking
about that hope right away.
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The hope is that the
isolation of the gene
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will lead to treatment of people
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with muscular dystrophy.
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Scientists are working
on genetic cures
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for diseases such as
Alzheimer's and Parkinson's.
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A, T, A, G, C...
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The idea behind gene
therapy is really simple:
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add in a copy of
the gene that works.
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Then they'll make
the protein that works,
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and then they won't
be sick anymore.
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But the devil, as is often
the case, is in the details.
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Right now, we have the ability
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to identify the
gene, to isolate it,
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but the ability to put
it where we want it
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is still a long ways away.
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If you put a gene into a cell,
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you cannot tell
exactly where that gene
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is going to enter the
cell's chromosome.
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Conventional gene therapy
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is an essentially
random process.
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So imagine taking this
century-long narrative,
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which is human DNA,
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which is a very, very long text,
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and taking one paragraph
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and just sticking it
somewhere random.
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The change you are creating
is not a controlled one.
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00:12:22,603 --> 00:12:27,194
There was a clinical trial
that was done in France.
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This was for really sick
children... I want to be clear.
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This was for children who
would have died otherwise.
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Four of these children
developed cancer.
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One of them died.
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The gene went
into the wrong place.
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Because it's a random
process, and, by chance,
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it went into the wrong place,
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00:12:47,628 --> 00:12:49,699
and that random
event caused cancer.
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You know, you always think that
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00:12:55,291 --> 00:12:57,569
what you know is
gonna get a little better
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00:12:57,604 --> 00:12:58,881
and a little better
and a little better,
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00:12:58,916 --> 00:13:02,816
and soon be there, and
what we knew how to do
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00:13:02,885 --> 00:13:04,714
wasn't getting a
whole lot better.
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00:13:04,784 --> 00:13:06,233
It was getting
a little bit better.
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00:13:06,268 --> 00:13:09,271
The technology
was just too clumsy
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00:13:09,340 --> 00:13:11,894
to actually use it
with human beings.
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00:13:11,929 --> 00:13:14,621
It became very,
very clear to us that
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00:13:14,690 --> 00:13:17,141
we are at the foot of
a very tall mountain
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00:13:17,244 --> 00:13:19,591
and we may not even have
the right mountaineering gear.
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00:13:23,595 --> 00:13:26,598
I worked at this company
called Sangamo Biosciences.
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00:13:26,667 --> 00:13:30,913
We decided to figure out a way
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00:13:30,982 --> 00:13:33,260
to change human genes
in a precise fashion.
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00:13:33,329 --> 00:13:36,056
You know, this would be like
word processors for your DNA.
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00:13:38,956 --> 00:13:41,303
This will get technical,
but good technical.
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00:13:43,305 --> 00:13:46,480
DNA breaks all the time.
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00:13:46,584 --> 00:13:48,620
You go get a dental X-ray.
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00:13:48,655 --> 00:13:50,553
The technician points
this thing at your face...
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00:13:50,622 --> 00:13:53,625
And the X-rays
actually hit your DNA,
219
00:13:53,660 --> 00:13:55,006
and they physically
create a break,
220
00:13:55,110 --> 00:13:57,112
so the familiar
double helix of DNA
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00:13:57,146 --> 00:13:58,285
physically goes.
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00:13:58,320 --> 00:13:59,493
The good news is,
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00:13:59,562 --> 00:14:01,081
the cell has its own
machine to fixing breaks.
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00:14:03,497 --> 00:14:05,396
Inside our cells,
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00:14:05,465 --> 00:14:07,294
there are two identical
DNA molecules
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00:14:07,329 --> 00:14:09,745
lying side by side,
literally side by side.
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00:14:09,814 --> 00:14:12,955
If one is broken, it
can say to its sister...
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00:14:13,024 --> 00:14:15,509
and that, in fact, is the
technical term, the sister...
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00:14:15,578 --> 00:14:17,477
"Hey, sis, I'm sorry.
I've had a break.
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00:14:17,546 --> 00:14:21,032
I'm wondering if I can copy
the missing genetic information."
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00:14:21,136 --> 00:14:23,000
And the sister goes, "Yeah."
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Done.
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00:14:35,667 --> 00:14:37,980
"Chromosome broken
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00:14:38,049 --> 00:14:41,535
"awaits sounds
of strands pairing,
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00:14:41,639 --> 00:14:45,815
preserving life's thread."
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00:14:45,850 --> 00:14:47,645
There's really,
there is really a haiku
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00:14:47,714 --> 00:14:49,578
about homology-directed repair.
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00:14:51,166 --> 00:14:52,995
Why is that useful?
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00:14:53,064 --> 00:14:54,686
So it's useful because
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00:14:54,755 --> 00:14:58,345
if you can cut a
gene inside a cell,
241
00:14:58,414 --> 00:14:59,933
so if you can create a break
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00:15:00,002 --> 00:15:02,729
at a place of interest,
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00:15:02,832 --> 00:15:04,938
then you can change that gene.
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00:15:05,007 --> 00:15:08,183
You fool the cell,
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00:15:08,217 --> 00:15:14,189
give it a separate piece of
DNA that you have made,
246
00:15:14,223 --> 00:15:16,639
a piece of DNA
which is identical
247
00:15:16,708 --> 00:15:18,848
to the chromosome
that you are cutting
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00:15:18,918 --> 00:15:21,575
except for the change
that you wish to make.
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00:15:25,372 --> 00:15:27,788
And Mother Nature will
not know she's being fooled.
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00:15:27,857 --> 00:15:29,652
She will repair the break
251
00:15:29,721 --> 00:15:32,966
using this piece of DNA
you provided as a template,
252
00:15:33,035 --> 00:15:34,657
and so whatever
change you brought in
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00:15:34,726 --> 00:15:36,866
will then go into
the chromosome.
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00:15:41,699 --> 00:15:43,045
You can think of it
255
00:15:43,114 --> 00:15:45,220
like a cursor in Microsoft Word.
256
00:15:45,254 --> 00:15:47,877
In Word, if you have a
document where you edit,
257
00:15:47,947 --> 00:15:50,397
first you have to
place the cursor there.
258
00:15:53,297 --> 00:15:57,577
In DNA, wherever you make a cut
259
00:15:57,646 --> 00:15:59,234
is the equivalent of a cursor
260
00:15:59,268 --> 00:16:01,167
in this word processor
of the genome.
261
00:16:01,236 --> 00:16:05,274
That's where you can
type in a new word.
262
00:16:09,554 --> 00:16:10,935
So if you wanted
263
00:16:10,970 --> 00:16:16,113
to use that capability to
"engineer the genome,"
264
00:16:16,182 --> 00:16:19,288
the challenge was to
introduce breaks in the DNA
265
00:16:19,357 --> 00:16:21,911
at places where you
wanted to, to alter the code.
266
00:16:21,981 --> 00:16:24,673
How were we gonna do that?
267
00:16:27,917 --> 00:16:30,265
We need something
that cuts only one gene
268
00:16:30,299 --> 00:16:33,061
out of the, you know,
25,000 that we have.
269
00:16:36,478 --> 00:16:41,966
There were just such
serious blocks in the way.
270
00:16:42,035 --> 00:16:44,969
So it looked like it was
gonna be a long road.
271
00:16:45,038 --> 00:16:47,868
And that's what changed.
272
00:16:47,937 --> 00:16:50,043
And that came sort of overnight.
273
00:16:56,946 --> 00:16:58,327
David's doctor told me,
274
00:16:58,396 --> 00:17:01,779
"Just hold on... there's
something coming."
275
00:17:05,127 --> 00:17:06,749
When I first heard about it,
276
00:17:06,818 --> 00:17:08,130
I was at a conference
in New York,
277
00:17:08,199 --> 00:17:10,995
and it was a very strange
conference of, of futurists.
278
00:17:11,064 --> 00:17:12,824
It was put on by a Russian guy
279
00:17:12,893 --> 00:17:14,826
whose ambition is
to download his brain
280
00:17:14,895 --> 00:17:16,138
and become an
android who lives forever.
281
00:17:16,173 --> 00:17:18,865
In this future, people
will be young, beautiful.
282
00:17:18,934 --> 00:17:23,042
They will have multiple
bodies, not only just one.
283
00:17:23,111 --> 00:17:24,422
But they had a lot
of good people there,
284
00:17:24,491 --> 00:17:25,837
including an important
geneticist from Harvard,
285
00:17:25,906 --> 00:17:27,184
George Church.
286
00:17:27,253 --> 00:17:29,979
And I remember him
saying, "Remember this word:
287
00:17:30,049 --> 00:17:34,122
CRISPR," C-R-I-S-P-R.
288
00:17:34,191 --> 00:17:36,365
It's, like, you know, in
"The Graduate," plastics.
289
00:17:36,434 --> 00:17:37,849
Remember the word CRISPR.
290
00:17:37,884 --> 00:17:41,819
This is going to allow
human genome engineering
291
00:17:41,888 --> 00:17:43,683
on a unprecedented scale.
292
00:17:58,456 --> 00:18:00,217
How old is CRISPR?
293
00:18:00,286 --> 00:18:02,184
Oh, in terms of
millions of years?
294
00:18:02,219 --> 00:18:06,188
Yeah. Oh, I mean...
295
00:18:06,257 --> 00:18:09,881
Probably... billions.
296
00:18:25,104 --> 00:18:26,933
When you are a student,
297
00:18:27,036 --> 00:18:29,694
you think everything is known.
298
00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:36,598
But there are places
where no one else looked.
299
00:19:07,491 --> 00:19:09,078
The organism I was working with
300
00:19:09,148 --> 00:19:12,565
is called Haloferax
mediterranei.
301
00:19:14,256 --> 00:19:18,295
This microorganism
is very peculiar.
302
00:19:18,364 --> 00:19:21,056
They only live in environments
303
00:19:21,125 --> 00:19:25,854
where the salinity is about
tenfold that of the seawater.
304
00:19:27,545 --> 00:19:30,307
These tiny organisms are...
305
00:19:30,376 --> 00:19:33,793
I would say, even,
so clever, yeah?
306
00:19:33,827 --> 00:19:35,588
Clever because of
the evolution, of course.
307
00:19:50,982 --> 00:19:54,641
Well, I'll tell you
the story that I know.
308
00:19:54,676 --> 00:19:59,508
Microbial genome sequencing
started sometime in the 1990s.
309
00:19:59,577 --> 00:20:01,993
What does that
mean? See, okay, so,
310
00:20:02,062 --> 00:20:04,996
unraveling the DNA
code of organisms of life
311
00:20:05,065 --> 00:20:07,033
is a relatively
recent part of biology,
312
00:20:07,102 --> 00:20:10,312
and in the late 1990s, people
started to turn their attention
313
00:20:10,347 --> 00:20:12,349
to the sequencing
of microbial genomes.
314
00:20:17,699 --> 00:20:20,495
They're amazingly
highly evolved entities
315
00:20:20,529 --> 00:20:24,602
that just chose a different
way of surviving in the world
316
00:20:24,671 --> 00:20:27,329
than the cells that became us.
317
00:21:01,363 --> 00:21:04,573
We saw a very peculiar pattern.
318
00:21:06,886 --> 00:21:10,579
These very short
fragments of DNA.
319
00:21:12,926 --> 00:21:15,929
They repeated many times.
320
00:21:17,241 --> 00:21:20,348
And they were
regularly interspaced.
321
00:21:28,390 --> 00:21:32,256
Eventually, we realized
these peculiar sequences,
322
00:21:32,291 --> 00:21:36,778
they were present in many
different microorganisms.
323
00:21:40,644 --> 00:21:43,750
But they didn't have
really any name.
324
00:21:43,819 --> 00:21:45,442
CRISPR came to my mind
325
00:21:45,511 --> 00:21:47,582
just thinking about
the, the main features.
326
00:21:47,651 --> 00:21:52,414
Clustered regularly interspaced
327
00:21:52,483 --> 00:21:54,658
short palindromic repeats.
328
00:21:59,801 --> 00:22:02,631
There really wasn't
much precedent
329
00:22:02,700 --> 00:22:05,634
for anything like this in
the DNA of living things,
330
00:22:05,703 --> 00:22:07,602
and when you see
something unusual,
331
00:22:07,671 --> 00:22:08,982
you automatically
assume that it's interesting.
332
00:22:09,086 --> 00:22:10,329
That's just how science works.
333
00:22:13,953 --> 00:22:16,542
CRISPR is actually
clustered regularly interspaced
334
00:22:16,611 --> 00:22:18,785
palindromic repeats, and so,
335
00:22:18,854 --> 00:22:22,133
it's actually named
for the repeats.
336
00:22:22,202 --> 00:22:23,790
But what was really interesting
337
00:22:23,859 --> 00:22:25,792
were these sequences in between
338
00:22:25,861 --> 00:22:29,348
that were completely enigmatic.
339
00:22:29,451 --> 00:22:32,281
Spacers.
340
00:22:32,316 --> 00:22:35,526
And each spacer was different.
341
00:22:39,668 --> 00:22:41,429
Never seen anything
like this before.
342
00:22:43,327 --> 00:22:46,330
Where the hell come
these sequences from?
343
00:22:58,998 --> 00:23:00,344
I have my own way of kind of
344
00:23:00,413 --> 00:23:01,690
telling the story in short form,
345
00:23:01,759 --> 00:23:05,004
is, I show this article
from 2007, right?
346
00:23:05,073 --> 00:23:06,385
Five years before anybody
was talking about CRISPR,
347
00:23:06,488 --> 00:23:07,489
and it's this headline
348
00:23:07,558 --> 00:23:09,836
from a yogurt company saying,
349
00:23:09,905 --> 00:23:11,700
"Holy grail is discovered."
350
00:23:13,909 --> 00:23:18,017
And what was this yogurt
company's holy grail?
351
00:23:18,086 --> 00:23:19,328
It was CRISPR.
352
00:23:19,363 --> 00:23:21,469
It was CRISPR.
353
00:23:23,678 --> 00:23:26,197
When did you get your
CRISPR license plate?
354
00:23:26,266 --> 00:23:30,409
The first one I got back
in the days in Wisconsin,
355
00:23:30,512 --> 00:23:32,411
and when I first moved
to North Carolina...
356
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:34,447
It was one of the
first things I did,
357
00:23:34,516 --> 00:23:36,691
was to make sure I still
had my CRISPR rights
358
00:23:36,725 --> 00:23:37,692
with my CRISPR-mobile.
359
00:23:40,902 --> 00:23:42,869
People were, like, "Have you
heard about this CRISPR thing?"
360
00:23:42,904 --> 00:23:44,112
And I'm, like, "Dude, like,
361
00:23:44,215 --> 00:23:45,251
"I've heard of this
CRISPR thing for ten years.
362
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:46,217
Like, what the hell
are you talking about?"
363
00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:55,744
Danisco is a company
that sells microbes
364
00:23:55,813 --> 00:23:57,470
to people who want to make food.
365
00:23:57,539 --> 00:24:01,612
A lot of foods are produced
using bacteria, and...
366
00:24:01,716 --> 00:24:02,751
Yogurt, for example.
367
00:24:02,820 --> 00:24:07,066
Rodolphe was trying
to work out how to deal
368
00:24:07,100 --> 00:24:09,378
with the problem of
his bacterial cultures
369
00:24:09,448 --> 00:24:13,831
suddenly dying because
of viral infections.
370
00:24:13,900 --> 00:24:15,281
Most people don't wake up
371
00:24:15,384 --> 00:24:16,593
in the morning and think about
372
00:24:16,662 --> 00:24:18,802
how bacteria defend
themselves against viruses.
373
00:24:18,905 --> 00:24:20,148
It's just not on
their, on their,
374
00:24:20,251 --> 00:24:21,736
on the sort of front and
center in people's agenda,
375
00:24:21,805 --> 00:24:22,702
but it should be.
376
00:24:28,536 --> 00:24:31,918
Viruses are very
simple lean machines.
377
00:24:31,953 --> 00:24:35,025
They have one job
to do: look for a host,
378
00:24:35,094 --> 00:24:37,752
take the host over,
and multiply, that's it.
379
00:24:37,821 --> 00:24:42,791
The virus will
attach to the surface,
380
00:24:42,860 --> 00:24:46,415
and then it will inject
its genetic material.
381
00:24:50,109 --> 00:24:53,768
It hijacks the cell
and use the cell
382
00:24:53,837 --> 00:24:55,977
just as a factory
of new viruses.
383
00:25:01,534 --> 00:25:04,261
And then it's over.
384
00:25:04,295 --> 00:25:06,090
It's over for the cell.
385
00:25:10,647 --> 00:25:14,133
This is when people call
companies like Danisco and say,
386
00:25:14,202 --> 00:25:15,962
"You sold us a culture
that's not working.
387
00:25:15,997 --> 00:25:17,446
We want our money back."
388
00:25:22,555 --> 00:25:25,800
But there's a small
subset of the population
389
00:25:25,869 --> 00:25:28,527
that survives the viral attack.
390
00:25:30,701 --> 00:25:32,116
We don't know why they make it,
391
00:25:32,185 --> 00:25:33,808
but they make it.
392
00:25:33,842 --> 00:25:35,534
They become resistant.
393
00:25:37,501 --> 00:25:39,227
At that time, we still don't
know what CRISPR is
394
00:25:39,296 --> 00:25:40,504
and what it does,
395
00:25:40,573 --> 00:25:42,782
so there's no assumption
that CRISPR is involved.
396
00:25:45,682 --> 00:25:49,651
Then what we do is, we
take the survivor that made it,
397
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:51,550
and then we check its DNA.
398
00:25:54,311 --> 00:25:57,417
The DNA sequence had changed.
399
00:26:03,354 --> 00:26:07,117
There are new spacers
400
00:26:07,186 --> 00:26:09,498
that were not present before,
401
00:26:09,568 --> 00:26:13,192
and those spacers are identical
402
00:26:13,261 --> 00:26:17,368
to sequences from the
virus that infect bacteria.
403
00:26:17,437 --> 00:26:20,026
And now it's immune.
404
00:26:20,095 --> 00:26:22,063
So now scientists have a clue,
405
00:26:22,132 --> 00:26:23,582
and, you know, at
this point, of course,
406
00:26:23,685 --> 00:26:25,204
you've sort of put your
Sherlock Holmes hat on,
407
00:26:25,273 --> 00:26:27,206
you take in your
virtual pipe, and you go,
408
00:26:27,275 --> 00:26:28,828
"What are these
clues telling us?"
409
00:26:30,589 --> 00:26:33,730
We do the experiment
five different times.
410
00:26:35,697 --> 00:26:39,874
And consistently, the
bacteria acquired a spacer
411
00:26:39,908 --> 00:26:42,601
that contains a
sequence from the virus
412
00:26:42,704 --> 00:26:45,086
and became resistant.
413
00:26:49,055 --> 00:26:51,748
So what if I take it away?
414
00:26:51,817 --> 00:26:53,784
You lose the resistance.
415
00:26:53,888 --> 00:26:56,580
Without that little
piece of DNA,
416
00:26:56,649 --> 00:27:01,102
the microbial cell, the
bacterial cell, will die,
417
00:27:01,171 --> 00:27:02,655
and if it had it,
it would survive.
418
00:27:02,724 --> 00:27:04,450
Oh, that was,
like, that was, like,
419
00:27:04,553 --> 00:27:05,451
"We got it."
420
00:27:07,384 --> 00:27:10,214
CRISPR is an immune system.
421
00:27:12,596 --> 00:27:14,115
What an idea:
422
00:27:14,184 --> 00:27:16,082
a piece of the genome
of your predator
423
00:27:16,117 --> 00:27:18,567
now stuck in your genome so
you can recognize it in the future.
424
00:27:18,602 --> 00:27:22,468
Bacteria have memory.
425
00:27:22,571 --> 00:27:26,023
They are able to
remember invaders,
426
00:27:26,092 --> 00:27:28,681
recognize them, and kill them.
427
00:27:28,750 --> 00:27:31,650
That was really fantastic.
428
00:27:36,206 --> 00:27:38,726
At the time, you
know, it's useful
429
00:27:38,795 --> 00:27:44,870
in manufacturing cultures
that are resistant to viruses.
430
00:27:44,939 --> 00:27:46,872
It's extremely
valuable to Danisco.
431
00:27:46,941 --> 00:27:49,322
You know, but...
432
00:27:49,391 --> 00:27:52,049
But we don't know
what the future holds.
433
00:27:52,118 --> 00:27:54,293
We have no idea
how useful or not
434
00:27:54,327 --> 00:27:56,019
this technology is gonna
be or pan out in the end.
435
00:28:03,164 --> 00:28:04,890
I think I first heard about it
436
00:28:04,959 --> 00:28:07,478
when I had coffee
with Jill Banfield,
437
00:28:07,547 --> 00:28:08,479
my colleague here at Berkeley,
438
00:28:08,548 --> 00:28:12,138
at the Free Speech
Movement Cafรฉ,
439
00:28:12,173 --> 00:28:14,382
classic Berkeley cafรฉ.
440
00:28:14,485 --> 00:28:16,625
One thing they'll write
on my tombstone was,
441
00:28:16,660 --> 00:28:19,801
"Told Jennifer Doudna
about CRISPR-Cas."
442
00:28:19,836 --> 00:28:22,493
Like, that will be
the sum of my life.
443
00:28:26,981 --> 00:28:28,603
I love things that
not a lot of people
444
00:28:28,672 --> 00:28:31,537
are paying attention to,
which certainly CRISPR was
445
00:28:31,606 --> 00:28:33,988
in its early days, not
anymore, but, but, you know,
446
00:28:34,022 --> 00:28:35,506
in the early days,
it was like that.
447
00:28:35,575 --> 00:28:37,405
But then you
always ask yourself,
448
00:28:37,508 --> 00:28:39,200
"Huh, is everybody else
just a lot smarter than me
449
00:28:39,269 --> 00:28:42,065
"and they've figured out
that this is a, you know,
450
00:28:42,168 --> 00:28:44,446
a dead path and..."
451
00:28:44,515 --> 00:28:47,173
So we've got the
antibody tethered to Cas9.
452
00:28:47,208 --> 00:28:49,348
It's finding the T
cell-specific antigen.
453
00:28:49,417 --> 00:28:53,007
We're biochemists in the lab.
454
00:28:53,076 --> 00:28:58,219
We study the way molecules work.
455
00:28:58,288 --> 00:28:59,945
We try to isolate them from
456
00:29:00,014 --> 00:29:02,326
all of the other pieces
and parts of the cell.
457
00:29:02,361 --> 00:29:05,019
We love to ask,
458
00:29:05,053 --> 00:29:09,540
"Well, what are the essential
parts of this little machine?"
459
00:29:09,575 --> 00:29:12,543
In nature, what CRISPR
systems are doing is,
460
00:29:12,578 --> 00:29:15,029
they're giving bacteria
immunity to viruses,
461
00:29:15,098 --> 00:29:17,203
so they're protecting
them from viruses.
462
00:29:26,385 --> 00:29:28,111
When an invader shows up,
463
00:29:28,214 --> 00:29:32,874
the bacterium has a
way to store a small bit
464
00:29:32,943 --> 00:29:35,704
of the invader's
DNA in its own DNA.
465
00:29:39,294 --> 00:29:42,711
When the invader comes back,
466
00:29:42,781 --> 00:29:45,507
the bacterium makes a copy,
467
00:29:45,576 --> 00:29:49,891
like a little "Most Wanted"
poster of that spacer,
468
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,273
and gives it to the
marvelous machine
469
00:29:52,376 --> 00:29:55,586
at the heart of CRISPR,
470
00:29:55,621 --> 00:29:58,797
this extraordinary
protein that we call Cas9.
471
00:30:01,592 --> 00:30:04,112
Cas9 is truly wondrous.
472
00:30:06,183 --> 00:30:08,530
When Cas9 polices
473
00:30:08,599 --> 00:30:13,294
the intercellular
neighborhood for invasions,
474
00:30:13,363 --> 00:30:14,640
it literally carries a copy
475
00:30:14,743 --> 00:30:16,159
of that "Most
Wanted" poster with it.
476
00:30:18,644 --> 00:30:21,647
Asking everyone that comes in,
477
00:30:21,716 --> 00:30:25,375
"Excuse me, do you
contain an exact match
478
00:30:25,444 --> 00:30:29,586
"to this little 'Most Wanted'
poster that I'm carrying?
479
00:30:29,620 --> 00:30:31,415
Yes? Then I'll cut you."
480
00:30:36,213 --> 00:30:39,803
The thing about Cas9
that struck me at the time
481
00:30:39,872 --> 00:30:41,460
was that, you
know, fundamentally,
482
00:30:41,529 --> 00:30:44,359
this thing was a
programmable protein
483
00:30:44,428 --> 00:30:48,847
that finds and cuts DNA.
484
00:30:51,711 --> 00:30:54,645
As a tool, right, you
could immediately see
485
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:56,889
a lot of uses for
something like that.
486
00:30:56,958 --> 00:30:59,996
I will never forget
487
00:31:00,065 --> 00:31:03,723
reading the last paragraph
of Jennifer Doudna's
488
00:31:03,792 --> 00:31:07,486
and Emmanuelle
Charpentier's deservedly...
489
00:31:07,555 --> 00:31:10,730
"immortal" is a strong word,
so I'm gonna use it carefully...
490
00:31:10,799 --> 00:31:12,491
immortal science paper
491
00:31:12,525 --> 00:31:17,151
in which they describe
that Cas9 can be directed.
492
00:31:25,159 --> 00:31:29,680
Cas9 cuts DNA based on
an instruction that it carries,
493
00:31:29,715 --> 00:31:33,443
and that instruction
is a molecule of RNA
494
00:31:33,512 --> 00:31:36,549
that matches perfectly
the DNA of the invader.
495
00:31:36,618 --> 00:31:41,727
RNA, I think about it as
DNA's chemical cousin.
496
00:31:41,830 --> 00:31:44,903
Like DNA, it has four letters,
497
00:31:44,972 --> 00:31:49,148
and they can form pairs
with matching letters in DNA.
498
00:31:51,737 --> 00:31:53,704
The letters in the RNA
499
00:31:53,773 --> 00:31:56,880
allow Cas9 to find a
unique DNA sequence.
500
00:31:56,949 --> 00:32:01,126
Bacteria were programming
this thing all the time
501
00:32:01,195 --> 00:32:03,783
with different viral
sequences, and then using it
502
00:32:03,852 --> 00:32:06,407
to find and cut and
destroy those viruses.
503
00:32:10,376 --> 00:32:12,723
But because it's using
these little RNA molecules,
504
00:32:12,792 --> 00:32:14,933
those can easily be exchanged.
505
00:32:17,901 --> 00:32:20,490
RNA molecules
are trivial to make
506
00:32:20,559 --> 00:32:24,011
in a molecular biology lab
or order from a company.
507
00:32:27,566 --> 00:32:29,568
And I can cut any DNA I
want just by changing this,
508
00:32:29,637 --> 00:32:31,570
this little piece of RNA.
509
00:32:35,263 --> 00:32:39,302
It was clearly a useful
tool, and I, initially,
510
00:32:39,405 --> 00:32:40,613
I was thinking about
it that way, right?
511
00:32:40,682 --> 00:32:42,167
'Cause, you know, again,
I'm a biochemist, right?
512
00:32:42,236 --> 00:32:44,272
I was thinking
about it as a tool.
513
00:32:44,341 --> 00:32:46,274
I was thinking about
all the cool experiments
514
00:32:46,343 --> 00:32:48,173
you could now do
with this tool, right?
515
00:32:48,242 --> 00:32:49,415
I was thinking about that.
516
00:32:49,450 --> 00:32:51,348
I wasn't thinking about...
517
00:32:51,417 --> 00:32:55,249
Oh, my gosh, I mean,
this is a tool that,
518
00:32:55,283 --> 00:32:57,803
you know, it
fundamentally allows us
519
00:32:57,872 --> 00:33:00,150
to change our
relationship with nature.
520
00:33:00,254 --> 00:33:03,912
It actually allows us to
change human evolution
521
00:33:03,982 --> 00:33:05,431
if we want to.
522
00:33:05,500 --> 00:33:08,158
Right? It's that,
it's that profound.
523
00:33:15,855 --> 00:33:19,204
In my left hand here, I
have purified Cas9 nuclease,
524
00:33:19,273 --> 00:33:22,276
and in my right hand
here, I have a guide RNA,
525
00:33:22,345 --> 00:33:25,451
and so CRISPR essentially
is the combination
526
00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:28,385
of these two ingredients.
527
00:33:28,454 --> 00:33:31,147
It's actually millions
of Cas9 molecules,
528
00:33:31,216 --> 00:33:32,700
and this is millions
of RNA molecules.
529
00:33:36,186 --> 00:33:39,120
I have to say, it didn't
immediately hit me,
530
00:33:39,189 --> 00:33:42,365
until I started seeing the
data, that this could be
531
00:33:42,468 --> 00:33:46,162
an extraordinary transformation.
532
00:33:46,231 --> 00:33:48,888
You know, it was real.
533
00:33:48,992 --> 00:33:54,618
You can actually use CRISPR
in humans to change DNA.
534
00:33:56,310 --> 00:33:57,207
You can actually do it.
535
00:34:00,728 --> 00:34:02,868
Here's a copy of a human gene.
536
00:34:04,904 --> 00:34:09,357
You give it to a Cas9 and
put it inside human cells.
537
00:34:09,426 --> 00:34:10,600
It runs away,
538
00:34:10,669 --> 00:34:12,809
finds that DNA, and cuts it.
539
00:34:15,881 --> 00:34:17,503
Before CRISPR, we were getting
540
00:34:17,538 --> 00:34:18,677
one to two percent correction.
541
00:34:18,746 --> 00:34:22,819
We're now up to 50%
to 80% of the cells.
542
00:34:25,511 --> 00:34:27,375
This could really work.
543
00:34:27,444 --> 00:34:30,516
This could really
cure a patient.
544
00:34:32,518 --> 00:34:35,383
I think it's gonna
help a lot of people,
545
00:34:35,452 --> 00:34:37,592
not just people
with sickle cell,
546
00:34:37,696 --> 00:34:39,732
'cause I know they're
working on it for other things.
547
00:34:42,183 --> 00:34:43,633
And I know so many other people
548
00:34:43,702 --> 00:34:46,084
that have, that
have things like this,
549
00:34:46,187 --> 00:34:49,846
like, like my friend, he...
550
00:34:49,915 --> 00:34:51,882
uh, had leukemia.
551
00:34:51,917 --> 00:34:54,920
He actually didn't make
it out of the hospital.
552
00:34:55,023 --> 00:34:58,268
If he had it just
a little bit later,
553
00:34:58,372 --> 00:35:01,409
of course, he probably
could have been cured of that,
554
00:35:01,478 --> 00:35:03,584
'cause that's what
they're working on.
555
00:35:11,626 --> 00:35:14,905
CRISPR has, really, the ability
556
00:35:14,974 --> 00:35:18,254
to recognize and to
target any piece of DNA
557
00:35:18,323 --> 00:35:20,290
in any type of
cell and organism.
558
00:35:20,394 --> 00:35:23,121
It's really a universal tool.
559
00:35:23,190 --> 00:35:26,124
It's often described as a
kind of Swiss Army knife.
560
00:35:42,105 --> 00:35:43,589
We have thousands of customers
561
00:35:43,658 --> 00:35:45,936
who are working with
CRISPR in a wide variety
562
00:35:46,005 --> 00:35:47,593
of organisms, pretty
much any organism
563
00:35:47,662 --> 00:35:49,595
you can think of,
from butterflies
564
00:35:49,630 --> 00:35:52,288
to dogs to horses
to wheat to corn.
565
00:35:52,357 --> 00:35:55,912
We have a design tool online.
566
00:35:58,501 --> 00:36:01,400
You can specify a gene that
you're looking to knock out.
567
00:36:04,092 --> 00:36:05,439
You can specify
the types of edit
568
00:36:05,508 --> 00:36:06,647
that you're looking to do.
569
00:36:06,716 --> 00:36:07,993
You swipe your credit card,
570
00:36:08,096 --> 00:36:09,028
and a few days later,
571
00:36:09,097 --> 00:36:10,616
a couple of tubes
of all the materials
572
00:36:10,685 --> 00:36:12,100
that you need show
up at your door.
573
00:36:12,170 --> 00:36:13,964
Obviously, we like to validate
574
00:36:14,033 --> 00:36:18,797
the, the researchers'
authenticity and credibility
575
00:36:18,866 --> 00:36:21,075
with regard to
their institution.
576
00:36:21,144 --> 00:36:22,456
Meaning you're not
just shipping it off?
577
00:36:22,490 --> 00:36:24,182
Correct, we don't
ship to just anyone.
578
00:36:24,285 --> 00:36:26,287
That's correct.
579
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,538
The analogy I
like is automobiles.
580
00:36:35,641 --> 00:36:38,334
There were cars before
there were Model Ts,
581
00:36:38,368 --> 00:36:40,267
but they were expensive and
they broke down all the time.
582
00:36:42,648 --> 00:36:45,203
Ford comes out with the
Model T, and, suddenly,
583
00:36:45,306 --> 00:36:46,997
it's cheap and it's reliable.
584
00:36:47,066 --> 00:36:52,486
Pretty soon,
everybody's got a car.
585
00:37:37,220 --> 00:37:41,914
CRISPR gives us the chance to
make precise, targeted changes
586
00:37:41,983 --> 00:37:46,988
in the DNA of any
living organism.
587
00:37:47,057 --> 00:37:48,404
It's a power to
change the biosphere.
588
00:37:48,473 --> 00:37:52,373
That's what makes
CRISPR revolutionary.
589
00:38:35,105 --> 00:38:37,073
Can you just sort of describe
590
00:38:37,142 --> 00:38:39,317
where we are right now?
591
00:38:40,939 --> 00:38:43,148
Oh, here? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
592
00:38:43,251 --> 00:38:45,840
Oh, so here is the, um...
593
00:38:45,909 --> 00:38:47,601
eGenesis garage.
594
00:38:47,670 --> 00:38:50,638
This is our lab space.
595
00:38:50,707 --> 00:38:54,262
It's literally the basement.
596
00:38:54,332 --> 00:38:56,955
I feel it's a
humble start for us
597
00:38:57,024 --> 00:39:00,993
where we embark on
a very exciting journey.
598
00:39:07,690 --> 00:39:09,968
The field is called
xenotransplantation,
599
00:39:10,037 --> 00:39:13,661
transplantation of an organ
from one species to the next.
600
00:39:13,730 --> 00:39:17,182
These things have
actually been tried a lot,
601
00:39:17,285 --> 00:39:19,046
and some of them
are pretty weird.
602
00:39:19,149 --> 00:39:21,497
Like, people were,
were, you know,
603
00:39:21,566 --> 00:39:23,809
in the early 1800s,
that kind of stuff,
604
00:39:23,844 --> 00:39:25,846
they were trying to
transplant monkey testes
605
00:39:25,915 --> 00:39:30,057
into men to make
them more virile.
606
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:31,369
So, so, you know, conceptually,
607
00:39:31,472 --> 00:39:33,509
people have been
trying this for a long time,
608
00:39:33,578 --> 00:39:37,444
but scientifically, this field is
probably about 20 years old.
609
00:39:39,998 --> 00:39:42,345
Whether we like
to believe or not,
610
00:39:42,414 --> 00:39:44,865
we are very similar to the pig.
611
00:39:44,934 --> 00:39:46,522
This pig, this pig, this pig,
612
00:39:46,591 --> 00:39:49,145
all the organs in these
pigs have been modified
613
00:39:49,179 --> 00:39:51,147
very, very slightly.
614
00:39:51,216 --> 00:39:53,252
They tried it 20 years ago.
615
00:39:53,356 --> 00:39:55,393
Novartis had had a
billion-dollar investment in it,
616
00:39:55,496 --> 00:39:58,257
sort of gracefully,
uh, retreated.
617
00:40:00,950 --> 00:40:04,091
They, they just didn't
have the technology.
618
00:40:04,194 --> 00:40:06,473
Without the
CRISPRs... can't do it.
619
00:40:09,683 --> 00:40:12,548
Luhan Yang and her team,
620
00:40:12,617 --> 00:40:15,067
they started as a
ragtag team of scientists
621
00:40:15,171 --> 00:40:16,759
in my academic lab,
622
00:40:16,862 --> 00:40:18,519
and then they went
to a ragtag team
623
00:40:18,554 --> 00:40:22,074
in the basement of,
of a startup incubator.
624
00:40:23,421 --> 00:40:26,078
Nice to meet you... hey.
625
00:40:26,182 --> 00:40:28,115
Happy Halloween.
626
00:40:28,218 --> 00:40:29,841
You know, I dressed
up today, you know?
627
00:40:31,912 --> 00:40:33,534
Can you see anything?
628
00:40:33,569 --> 00:40:35,571
Kind of... something,
not everything.
629
00:40:36,744 --> 00:40:40,058
So this is Yinan,
Yinan is quite creative.
630
00:40:40,092 --> 00:40:42,819
Probably more creative than me.
631
00:40:42,888 --> 00:40:44,407
When I first heard the story,
632
00:40:44,476 --> 00:40:46,271
I thought, it is
sci-fi, you know?
633
00:40:46,340 --> 00:40:48,549
We're going to, we're
going to make a pig
634
00:40:48,618 --> 00:40:49,964
that doesn't speak
human language,
635
00:40:50,068 --> 00:40:52,795
but because they
can donate organs
636
00:40:52,898 --> 00:40:55,729
for the, for the patient
and save the world from,
637
00:40:55,798 --> 00:40:57,006
like, organ shortage.
638
00:40:57,075 --> 00:40:58,973
I mean, it really takes a lot.
639
00:41:04,565 --> 00:41:07,257
As you can imagine,
if you put the organ
640
00:41:07,326 --> 00:41:10,882
from the pig into the
human, there's a rejection.
641
00:41:13,091 --> 00:41:16,819
We can really exercise
the power of CRISPR
642
00:41:16,922 --> 00:41:19,787
to engineer immunocompatibility
by knocking out genes
643
00:41:19,856 --> 00:41:21,168
and knocking in genes.
644
00:41:27,415 --> 00:41:29,141
If you compare the pig genome
645
00:41:29,210 --> 00:41:32,869
to an encyclopedia
of this thick,
646
00:41:32,938 --> 00:41:36,804
so what CRISPR does is,
it can find, like, a specific,
647
00:41:36,873 --> 00:41:39,635
a specific word in
the encyclopedia
648
00:41:39,704 --> 00:41:41,015
and delete that word.
649
00:41:43,604 --> 00:41:46,124
But instead of, like,
deleting a few words,
650
00:41:46,193 --> 00:41:50,300
we have to change
paragraphs after paragraph.
651
00:41:50,369 --> 00:41:52,510
Right now, the
conventional practice
652
00:41:52,613 --> 00:41:54,373
is doing one or two genes.
653
00:41:54,442 --> 00:41:57,480
And the record
before us is five.
654
00:42:00,379 --> 00:42:03,797
We did 62 genes in single step.
655
00:42:04,901 --> 00:42:07,317
We have a revolution going on
656
00:42:07,386 --> 00:42:09,009
that we've never
had a revolution like.
657
00:42:09,078 --> 00:42:11,529
The closest we've come
is, is maybe the internet
658
00:42:11,632 --> 00:42:13,358
and computer revolution.
659
00:42:13,461 --> 00:42:16,464
And that took us
kind of unaware.
660
00:42:16,534 --> 00:42:19,398
We do a lot of iteration
of the pig production.
661
00:42:19,502 --> 00:42:21,400
How are the pigs coming along?
662
00:42:21,469 --> 00:42:23,817
They are coming.
663
00:42:23,886 --> 00:42:26,095
So, uh...
664
00:42:26,164 --> 00:42:29,408
We are expecting some
pigs in, in a few weeks.
665
00:42:30,996 --> 00:42:35,553
We're so excited, we
even named the pig.
666
00:42:35,656 --> 00:42:37,762
The first one is Laika.
667
00:42:37,831 --> 00:42:42,249
It's the name of the Soviet dog
668
00:42:42,318 --> 00:42:43,906
which orbit the Earth first.
669
00:42:49,083 --> 00:42:52,431
We want to symbolize
it as an animal
670
00:42:52,535 --> 00:42:55,503
which can lead us to
a new era of science.
671
00:44:28,113 --> 00:44:29,770
This is Aldous Huxley,
672
00:44:29,839 --> 00:44:32,946
a man haunted by a
vision of hell on Earth.
673
00:44:33,015 --> 00:44:37,536
Mr. Huxley 27 years ago
wrote "Brave New World."
674
00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:41,126
Today, Mr. Huxley says that
his fictional world of horror
675
00:44:41,195 --> 00:44:46,131
is probably just around
the corner for all of us.
676
00:44:53,242 --> 00:44:55,071
I first read "Brave New World"
677
00:44:55,140 --> 00:44:59,282
in a literature
class in high school,
678
00:44:59,351 --> 00:45:01,043
and, yeah, it was startling,
679
00:45:01,146 --> 00:45:02,700
and, yeah, it was provocative.
680
00:45:02,803 --> 00:45:03,804
Um...
681
00:45:03,873 --> 00:45:06,496
But I reread it recently,
682
00:45:06,531 --> 00:45:11,570
and I was startled by
how a book written in 1932
683
00:45:11,639 --> 00:45:16,092
could have the
foresight to predict
684
00:45:16,161 --> 00:45:18,508
in vitro fertilization.
685
00:45:26,102 --> 00:45:28,242
Now, of course,
it went beyond it.
686
00:45:28,311 --> 00:45:30,589
It told a story where
687
00:45:30,658 --> 00:45:32,764
human beings were
literally manufactured
688
00:45:32,833 --> 00:45:34,801
to play specific
roles in society.
689
00:45:38,839 --> 00:45:42,843
It was so sobering to me because
690
00:45:42,912 --> 00:45:46,744
CRISPR makes that original worry
691
00:45:46,847 --> 00:45:51,818
about engineering human
heredity actually feasible.
692
00:46:01,068 --> 00:46:03,208
We mustn't be caught by surprise
693
00:46:03,243 --> 00:46:04,934
by our own advancing technology.
694
00:46:05,038 --> 00:46:07,212
This has happened
again and again in history,
695
00:46:07,281 --> 00:46:08,869
where technology has advanced
696
00:46:08,938 --> 00:46:11,458
and this changes
social conditions,
697
00:46:11,561 --> 00:46:13,874
and suddenly, people
have found themselves
698
00:46:13,909 --> 00:46:15,980
in a situation which
they didn't foresee
699
00:46:16,049 --> 00:46:17,809
and doing all sorts of things
they didn't really want to do.
700
00:46:21,226 --> 00:46:23,470
There is no question
in my mind that
701
00:46:23,539 --> 00:46:25,265
as this field advances,
702
00:46:25,334 --> 00:46:27,405
people will be able to
703
00:46:27,474 --> 00:46:31,409
order a change in
their genetic makeup
704
00:46:31,478 --> 00:46:33,721
to create an outcome
of interest to them:
705
00:46:33,791 --> 00:46:37,415
in their metabolism,
in their appearance;
706
00:46:37,484 --> 00:46:41,143
in principle, potentially,
in who they are as people,
707
00:46:41,246 --> 00:46:44,767
personality changes.
708
00:46:44,836 --> 00:46:46,355
And, again, we
have to be delicate
709
00:46:46,424 --> 00:46:48,253
to not cross into
science fiction territory.
710
00:46:48,322 --> 00:46:53,845
We know that we could
engineer a single gene, myostatin,
711
00:46:53,914 --> 00:46:55,951
in a way that could potentially
712
00:46:56,020 --> 00:46:57,607
make us all more muscular,
713
00:46:57,676 --> 00:47:01,094
but should we make
that universally available?
714
00:47:01,163 --> 00:47:02,509
They discovered
that there are people
715
00:47:02,612 --> 00:47:04,994
who can go by on
four hours of sleep.
716
00:47:05,098 --> 00:47:06,927
What would I give
for that mutation?
717
00:47:06,996 --> 00:47:08,998
One gene, one change,
718
00:47:09,102 --> 00:47:12,174
four hours of sleep, no problem.
719
00:47:12,277 --> 00:47:17,386
So... should this
be, I don't know,
720
00:47:17,455 --> 00:47:19,353
a job requirement for
air traffic controllers?
721
00:47:21,631 --> 00:47:25,118
Do I want the world to go there?
722
00:47:30,399 --> 00:47:31,952
There are people
who feel no pain.
723
00:47:32,021 --> 00:47:35,300
This was discovered by studying
724
00:47:35,369 --> 00:47:38,200
a 14-year-old boy in Pakistan
725
00:47:38,303 --> 00:47:40,133
who felt no pain, and
guess what he did?
726
00:47:40,167 --> 00:47:41,893
He performed street theater.
727
00:47:41,962 --> 00:47:46,139
He died before
his 14th birthday.
728
00:47:46,208 --> 00:47:48,003
He jumped, for
money, off a house roof.
729
00:47:48,072 --> 00:47:50,315
He knew it would be painless.
730
00:47:50,384 --> 00:47:51,730
The study of his DNA revealed
731
00:47:51,799 --> 00:47:53,871
he has a mutation in one gene.
732
00:47:53,974 --> 00:47:57,875
It makes a protein that
transmits the pain signal
733
00:47:57,944 --> 00:48:01,085
from the periphery...
your finger, or your skin...
734
00:48:01,154 --> 00:48:02,983
through the spine to your brain.
735
00:48:03,052 --> 00:48:04,847
You get rid of that gene,
736
00:48:04,882 --> 00:48:07,815
you cannot transmit the
signal, you feel no pain.
737
00:48:07,885 --> 00:48:09,231
Why?
738
00:48:09,334 --> 00:48:10,922
Well, I'll give you
a legitimate reason.
739
00:48:10,991 --> 00:48:13,718
Pain due to cancer is terrible,
740
00:48:13,821 --> 00:48:15,513
especially if it's
terminal cancer
741
00:48:15,547 --> 00:48:16,997
and we know a person
has months to live.
742
00:48:17,066 --> 00:48:19,034
Why not get rid of that gene?
743
00:48:19,103 --> 00:48:22,002
And I'm sure this will
be... I am sure this will be.
744
00:48:22,037 --> 00:48:25,074
We will have gene
editing of that gene
745
00:48:25,178 --> 00:48:27,732
to treat cancer pain.
746
00:48:27,835 --> 00:48:30,597
Now...
747
00:48:30,700 --> 00:48:33,186
Do I want a scenario where
there are parts of the world
748
00:48:33,220 --> 00:48:37,431
where special forces soldiers
are made immune to torture?
749
00:48:43,368 --> 00:48:46,268
I don't think my
job is that different
750
00:48:46,371 --> 00:48:50,065
than what scientists do.
751
00:48:50,134 --> 00:48:51,204
There's a lot of kind
of hunting around,
752
00:48:51,273 --> 00:48:53,309
hunting and pecking, you know,
753
00:48:53,378 --> 00:48:57,727
looking under things,
turning over stones.
754
00:48:57,796 --> 00:48:59,212
And then eventually, you know,
755
00:48:59,246 --> 00:49:00,627
you kind of get on
the scent of something,
756
00:49:00,730 --> 00:49:02,698
and then that's
when the fun starts.
757
00:49:05,597 --> 00:49:07,565
Before science gets published,
758
00:49:07,634 --> 00:49:10,568
it circulates among scientists.
759
00:49:10,602 --> 00:49:12,294
The papers go out for review.
760
00:49:12,397 --> 00:49:13,812
Someone passes
it to somebody else.
761
00:49:13,881 --> 00:49:15,228
Like, they have a
certain circulation,
762
00:49:15,297 --> 00:49:18,231
and so I'd gotten onto
the trail of these papers
763
00:49:18,300 --> 00:49:20,440
coming out of China.
764
00:49:20,509 --> 00:49:23,719
This was the first case where
someone had said about,
765
00:49:23,788 --> 00:49:25,583
you know, "I'm gonna use CRISPR,
766
00:49:25,652 --> 00:49:27,309
and I'm gonna modify
a human embryo."
767
00:49:30,622 --> 00:49:32,935
They had knocked out CCR5.
768
00:49:34,799 --> 00:49:36,766
This is a receptor
that, if you don't have it,
769
00:49:36,835 --> 00:49:39,597
you can't get
infected with H.I.V.
770
00:49:39,666 --> 00:49:41,806
But think about what
they were proposing.
771
00:49:41,875 --> 00:49:43,118
They said, "We're gonna make
someone who's immune to H.I.V."
772
00:49:47,985 --> 00:49:49,365
Once I started digging into it,
773
00:49:49,434 --> 00:49:50,953
I found more examples of people
774
00:49:51,022 --> 00:49:55,682
that were thinking
along these lines.
775
00:49:55,785 --> 00:49:57,787
John Zhang runs the
third- or fourth-biggest
776
00:49:57,856 --> 00:49:59,789
fertility clinic in the country,
777
00:49:59,858 --> 00:50:05,278
and then he started a
company called Darwin Life.
778
00:50:05,347 --> 00:50:07,314
He said that he was
enthusiastic about
779
00:50:07,383 --> 00:50:09,144
the whole idea of
designer babies.
780
00:50:09,213 --> 00:50:10,697
He basically said that,
781
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:12,768
"Of course, that's
the whole point."
782
00:50:14,356 --> 00:50:16,220
There was a company
called OvaScience
783
00:50:16,289 --> 00:50:18,222
that I discovered
a tape recording
784
00:50:18,291 --> 00:50:20,914
that they had put on their own
website of a investor meeting.
785
00:50:20,983 --> 00:50:23,192
We will be able to
correct mutations
786
00:50:23,296 --> 00:50:26,023
before we generate your child.
787
00:50:26,126 --> 00:50:27,472
It may not be 50
years, actually.
788
00:50:27,541 --> 00:50:29,819
It may only be ten, the
way things are going.
789
00:50:35,549 --> 00:50:38,414
I ended up having several dreams
790
00:50:38,483 --> 00:50:40,313
that were very intense
for me at the time,
791
00:50:40,382 --> 00:50:43,488
where I walked into a
room and a colleague said,
792
00:50:43,523 --> 00:50:45,076
"I want to introduce
you to someone,
793
00:50:45,145 --> 00:50:46,871
"and I want you to tell
them... They want to...
794
00:50:46,974 --> 00:50:48,700
They want to know about CRISPR."
795
00:50:48,769 --> 00:50:52,152
And I walked into this
room, and, and it was...
796
00:50:52,187 --> 00:50:53,843
There was a
silhouette of a chair
797
00:50:53,912 --> 00:50:55,880
with someone sitting
with their back to me,
798
00:50:55,949 --> 00:50:59,435
and as they turned
around, I realized with horror
799
00:50:59,504 --> 00:51:02,680
that it was Adolf
Hitler, you know?
800
00:51:02,714 --> 00:51:04,992
And he leaned
over, and he said...
801
00:51:06,787 --> 00:51:10,653
"So tell me all about
how Cas9 works."
802
00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:16,832
I remember waking
up from that dream
803
00:51:16,866 --> 00:51:20,215
and I was shaking.
804
00:51:20,284 --> 00:51:22,320
And I thought, "Oh, my gosh,
I mean, what have I done?"
805
00:51:28,050 --> 00:51:29,707
Five-and-a-half years ago,
806
00:51:29,776 --> 00:51:31,709
it was recognized
that we could take
807
00:51:31,778 --> 00:51:34,367
the CRISPR system
out of bacteria
808
00:51:34,436 --> 00:51:36,438
and move it first
into a test tube
809
00:51:36,541 --> 00:51:38,095
and then into mammalian cells,
810
00:51:38,198 --> 00:51:40,545
and use it as a tool
for genome editing.
811
00:51:40,614 --> 00:51:45,481
The Cas9 protein is gonna
make the cut in the DNA.
812
00:51:45,550 --> 00:51:48,760
We are correcting
the sickle mutation
813
00:51:48,864 --> 00:51:51,418
in blood cells.
814
00:51:51,487 --> 00:51:53,317
So if it's a woman,
815
00:51:53,386 --> 00:51:54,973
their eggs are not corrected.
816
00:51:55,077 --> 00:51:57,286
If it's a man, the
sperm is not corrected.
817
00:51:57,355 --> 00:52:00,462
That change will not get passed
along to future generations.
818
00:52:00,565 --> 00:52:02,498
So they will be cured,
819
00:52:02,567 --> 00:52:05,432
but their children might
get the disease, as well.
820
00:52:05,501 --> 00:52:08,090
Now we need to give the
cell another piece of DNA,
821
00:52:08,159 --> 00:52:11,749
except instead
of having the T...
822
00:52:11,818 --> 00:52:12,922
It has an A.
823
00:52:12,991 --> 00:52:14,890
So why not just do it
824
00:52:14,959 --> 00:52:17,272
so that the diseased gene
825
00:52:17,341 --> 00:52:19,239
never gets passed along
to future generations?
826
00:52:19,308 --> 00:52:21,586
And there are some
people out there who think
827
00:52:21,655 --> 00:52:23,657
that's all we should do.
828
00:52:23,761 --> 00:52:26,764
But we may be creating things
829
00:52:26,833 --> 00:52:28,800
that we can't put
back into the bottle.
830
00:52:31,700 --> 00:52:34,841
When we engineer gene
changes into my blood
831
00:52:34,910 --> 00:52:37,913
or into my skin,
832
00:52:37,982 --> 00:52:40,778
those gene changes die with me,
833
00:52:40,847 --> 00:52:44,506
but the germ cells...
sperm and eggs,
834
00:52:44,609 --> 00:52:49,614
embryos... those
cells are very different.
835
00:52:49,649 --> 00:52:52,617
They're part of what
we call "the germ line."
836
00:52:52,686 --> 00:52:56,449
If we engineer gene
changes into my sperm,
837
00:52:56,518 --> 00:52:59,003
they're passed to my son.
838
00:52:59,072 --> 00:53:02,696
They're passed to
his son and forever.
839
00:53:08,115 --> 00:53:09,462
My colleagues and I wrote
840
00:53:09,531 --> 00:53:14,812
a fairly strongly
worded piece in "Nature"
841
00:53:14,881 --> 00:53:16,641
with the fairly
unequivocal title,
842
00:53:16,710 --> 00:53:18,540
"Do Not Edit the
Human Germ Line."
843
00:53:21,094 --> 00:53:24,408
We proposed that there be
an unconditional moratorium:
844
00:53:24,477 --> 00:53:27,549
Don't edit human embryos,
845
00:53:27,652 --> 00:53:29,482
don't use edited sperm and
eggs to make human embryos...
846
00:53:29,516 --> 00:53:30,690
just nothing.
847
00:53:33,244 --> 00:53:34,832
We must understand that
848
00:53:34,901 --> 00:53:39,181
when we authorize research
on human embryo editing,
849
00:53:39,250 --> 00:53:40,355
we are enabling, ultimately,
850
00:53:40,424 --> 00:53:42,736
human embryo editing
for human enhancement.
851
00:53:42,805 --> 00:53:44,013
That's what we're doing.
852
00:53:44,082 --> 00:53:46,050
We're putting the
recipe out into the world.
853
00:53:46,153 --> 00:53:48,190
The debate that's being had
854
00:53:48,225 --> 00:53:50,606
is whether society
should go in this direction.
855
00:53:50,675 --> 00:53:54,092
Should you be allowed to make
856
00:53:54,161 --> 00:53:55,404
a genetic change into
the next generation
857
00:53:55,508 --> 00:53:58,994
that'll then go on to
other generations?
858
00:53:59,063 --> 00:54:00,858
The gene pool,
859
00:54:00,927 --> 00:54:03,136
like nature itself, is
kind of a common good.
860
00:54:03,205 --> 00:54:05,587
I used to have a T-shirt,
and it had a little...
861
00:54:05,690 --> 00:54:09,211
A guy that was kind
of a DNA spiral, right?
862
00:54:09,280 --> 00:54:11,109
But he was the lifeguard
and he's blowing a whistle,
863
00:54:11,213 --> 00:54:13,698
and he says, "Hey, you,
get out of the gene pool!"
864
00:54:13,767 --> 00:54:17,633
I loved that shirt.
865
00:54:17,702 --> 00:54:19,911
Baby shopping.
866
00:54:19,980 --> 00:54:24,709
Imagine being able to
program the I.Q. of a baby.
867
00:54:26,297 --> 00:54:28,713
Will we be sitting at
computer terminals like this one
868
00:54:28,748 --> 00:54:30,991
punching up the traits we
would like in our children,
869
00:54:31,060 --> 00:54:36,169
like the shape of their faces
or the color of their eyes?
870
00:54:36,238 --> 00:54:38,102
Well, you know, the
fear that everybody
871
00:54:38,171 --> 00:54:40,691
focuses on most is this whole,
this designer baby business.
872
00:54:43,245 --> 00:54:45,730
We're turning
reproduction into production.
873
00:54:45,799 --> 00:54:47,939
We're turning children
into consumer products.
874
00:54:48,008 --> 00:54:51,460
Every time there's
a new technology,
875
00:54:51,564 --> 00:54:53,635
we hear the same concerns.
876
00:54:53,738 --> 00:54:55,430
If there's a market for cloning,
877
00:54:55,499 --> 00:54:57,121
there is no force on Earth
878
00:54:57,224 --> 00:54:59,261
that will keep buyer
and seller apart.
879
00:55:02,091 --> 00:55:04,439
Perhaps Saddam Hussein
would like to give birth to himself.
880
00:55:07,959 --> 00:55:09,892
With CRISPR,
881
00:55:09,927 --> 00:55:12,516
even reputable magazines
882
00:55:12,585 --> 00:55:14,414
could not resist the temptation.
883
00:55:14,483 --> 00:55:17,348
A little thing that says,
884
00:55:17,417 --> 00:55:19,108
"High I.Q."
885
00:55:19,177 --> 00:55:21,490
As if we know
what intelligence is,
886
00:55:21,594 --> 00:55:23,941
let alone how to measure
it, let alone how to design it.
887
00:55:24,010 --> 00:55:25,770
Why do we keep ignoring the fact
888
00:55:25,839 --> 00:55:27,151
that we've seen
the same argument
889
00:55:27,254 --> 00:55:29,843
every decade for
the last five decades?
890
00:55:29,912 --> 00:55:32,294
And these nightmares,
891
00:55:32,363 --> 00:55:34,779
they haven't come to pass.
892
00:55:40,509 --> 00:55:43,961
We are capable
of really evil things,
893
00:55:44,030 --> 00:55:48,310
but we don't need
technology to commit evil acts.
894
00:55:48,379 --> 00:55:52,487
If the goal is genocide,
if the goal is eugenics,
895
00:55:52,556 --> 00:55:54,696
if the goal is discrimination,
896
00:55:54,799 --> 00:55:57,699
there will be another way
to do it and it will be found.
897
00:55:57,802 --> 00:56:00,633
I kind of divide the world
into the bio-optimists
898
00:56:00,702 --> 00:56:02,013
and the bio-pessimists.
899
00:56:04,913 --> 00:56:08,157
Space: the final frontier.
900
00:56:08,192 --> 00:56:11,816
I grew up with the
original "Star Trek,"
901
00:56:11,885 --> 00:56:13,162
and have been a devoted follower
902
00:56:13,231 --> 00:56:15,820
of all of the "Star
Treks" since then.
903
00:56:15,855 --> 00:56:19,479
I've read pretty much
every "Star Trek" novel.
904
00:56:19,548 --> 00:56:20,480
Don't get me started.
905
00:56:20,549 --> 00:56:24,381
It is a vision of progress
906
00:56:24,450 --> 00:56:27,970
and the potential of
science to make life better.
907
00:56:28,005 --> 00:56:29,524
There are other people
908
00:56:29,593 --> 00:56:32,043
who have read
the cautionary tales.
909
00:56:32,112 --> 00:56:35,461
A blade runner's job is
to hunt down replicants,
910
00:56:35,530 --> 00:56:39,292
manufactured humans you
can't tell from the real thing.
911
00:56:39,361 --> 00:56:41,777
But I don't think
the technologies
912
00:56:41,846 --> 00:56:44,193
are inherently good or evil.
913
00:56:44,262 --> 00:56:46,782
The technologies are
tools, they are power.
914
00:56:46,851 --> 00:56:50,303
What you do with the
power determines if the result
915
00:56:50,372 --> 00:56:53,962
is something that we applaud
or something that we deplore.
916
00:56:54,031 --> 00:56:57,552
But it's not the tool that
determines the end point.
917
00:56:57,621 --> 00:57:00,037
It's the user.
918
00:57:00,106 --> 00:57:03,696
Now here are 23 representing
mother's chromosomes,
919
00:57:03,765 --> 00:57:06,733
23 for father's.
920
00:57:06,802 --> 00:57:11,082
Now, we put them together.
921
00:57:12,774 --> 00:57:16,467
Our way of determining
922
00:57:16,536 --> 00:57:19,194
the inheritance of
the next generation
923
00:57:19,263 --> 00:57:21,679
is a lottery.
924
00:57:24,544 --> 00:57:26,615
And it's a perfectly
good argument to say,
925
00:57:26,719 --> 00:57:29,135
"I would rather determine it
926
00:57:29,204 --> 00:57:32,759
than take a lottery."
927
00:57:32,828 --> 00:57:34,727
Well, I think the right
way to say it is that
928
00:57:34,796 --> 00:57:36,832
sex is for recreation
929
00:57:36,901 --> 00:57:39,594
and science is for procreation.
930
00:57:41,319 --> 00:57:43,632
50 years from now,
people may say, like,
931
00:57:43,736 --> 00:57:45,289
"I can't believe
those barbaric people
932
00:57:45,392 --> 00:57:46,911
"in the early 21st century,
933
00:57:46,946 --> 00:57:49,396
"they were having kids this
crazy, old-fashioned way.
934
00:57:49,431 --> 00:57:50,674
"They were just,
like, rolling the dice
935
00:57:50,743 --> 00:57:51,744
with their kids' lives."
936
00:57:56,334 --> 00:57:59,579
We've gone through
in vitro fertilization.
937
00:57:59,614 --> 00:58:02,789
We've harvested the eggs.
938
00:58:02,858 --> 00:58:08,968
It's not uncommon to produce
multiple viable embryos.
939
00:58:09,037 --> 00:58:11,280
Which one do you choose?
940
00:58:13,697 --> 00:58:16,182
One possibility is, "Yeah,
just, we'll just roll the dice.
941
00:58:16,285 --> 00:58:17,148
We'll just... I'll
just point at one."
942
00:58:20,980 --> 00:58:22,878
Another option would be
943
00:58:22,947 --> 00:58:25,467
I run some fancy genetic tests.
944
00:58:28,574 --> 00:58:33,682
Pre-implantation genetic
diagnosis is the process
945
00:58:33,786 --> 00:58:38,169
of doing genetic
tests on an embryo.
946
00:58:38,238 --> 00:58:39,619
When I talk to
most people about it,
947
00:58:39,654 --> 00:58:41,310
they think it's science fiction,
948
00:58:41,379 --> 00:58:43,761
but it was first used
clinically in 1990.
949
00:58:46,730 --> 00:58:48,663
With today's technology,
you've been limited
950
00:58:48,732 --> 00:58:51,666
to looking at only
a handful of traits.
951
00:58:51,735 --> 00:58:54,427
But soon, genome sequencing
952
00:58:54,496 --> 00:58:57,706
will become cheap enough,
easy enough, and accurate enough
953
00:58:57,810 --> 00:58:59,363
that you'll be able
to learn everything
954
00:58:59,466 --> 00:59:00,778
genetics can tell you.
955
00:59:05,749 --> 00:59:09,580
In the future, let's
imagine that CRISPR
956
00:59:09,649 --> 00:59:12,997
gets really, really good.
957
00:59:13,066 --> 00:59:16,483
Maybe you don't need to
produce lots of embryos.
958
00:59:16,553 --> 00:59:17,933
Maybe you just produce one,
959
00:59:18,002 --> 00:59:19,694
but you can make
whatever edits you want to it.
960
00:59:23,421 --> 00:59:25,044
So the carrier screening
961
00:59:25,113 --> 00:59:26,493
that I was talking about earlier
962
00:59:26,563 --> 00:59:28,875
tends to focus on disorders
963
00:59:28,944 --> 00:59:31,188
that show up early.
964
00:59:31,222 --> 00:59:33,362
Everyone wants to have
a healthy, perfect baby.
965
00:59:33,431 --> 00:59:37,090
I think that's a
universal truth.
966
00:59:37,194 --> 00:59:38,609
You know, "How can I make sure
967
00:59:38,678 --> 00:59:40,231
"that my child will be healthy?
968
00:59:40,300 --> 00:59:42,751
"How can I make
sure that, you know,
969
00:59:42,855 --> 00:59:44,511
"they're gonna have some
of these positive traits,
970
00:59:44,581 --> 00:59:45,582
"that they're gonna do well,
971
00:59:45,685 --> 00:59:46,755
they're gonna
learn well, and...?"
972
00:59:46,859 --> 00:59:49,482
Looking at this family
history, certainly, I...
973
00:59:49,551 --> 00:59:52,589
The opinion is that information
is good, and almost everyone
974
00:59:52,692 --> 00:59:54,970
that talks to me wants
more information,
975
00:59:55,039 --> 00:59:56,385
and even wants more...
like, we'll give them
976
00:59:56,454 --> 00:59:58,284
a whole bunch of information,
and they even want more.
977
00:59:58,387 --> 01:00:00,597
- I - know my
grandmother also...
978
01:00:00,666 --> 01:00:02,875
I actually first heard
about genetic counseling
979
01:00:02,909 --> 01:00:04,221
from my mother.
980
01:00:04,290 --> 01:00:08,639
Hemophilia A is the
condition that runs in my family.
981
01:00:08,708 --> 01:00:12,263
It's a genetic
bleeding disorder.
982
01:00:12,332 --> 01:00:14,231
There is a gene on
the X chromosome.
983
01:00:14,300 --> 01:00:16,578
It encodes for a
protein called factor VIII.
984
01:00:16,647 --> 01:00:20,306
When factor VIII isn't working,
985
01:00:20,409 --> 01:00:24,724
you can have a bleed
that will lead to death.
986
01:00:24,793 --> 01:00:28,141
If I decide to have
children naturally,
987
01:00:28,245 --> 01:00:30,350
without reproductive technology,
988
01:00:30,419 --> 01:00:33,284
I am putting that
child at 25% risk
989
01:00:33,353 --> 01:00:35,528
to have a really
severe disorder.
990
01:00:35,597 --> 01:00:40,637
That responsibility
feels like it's on me.
991
01:00:40,706 --> 01:00:43,881
It takes it from the universe's
decision to my decision.
992
01:00:47,367 --> 01:00:50,267
Today, I'm unusual,
because I know that
993
01:00:50,301 --> 01:00:52,269
I'm a carrier of a
genetic condition,
994
01:00:52,338 --> 01:00:54,685
but soon, everyone will know
995
01:00:54,754 --> 01:00:57,446
genetic information
about themselves.
996
01:01:00,760 --> 01:01:03,314
What about the cost of it?
997
01:01:03,383 --> 01:01:06,007
In the short term, there's
a disturbing possibility
998
01:01:06,110 --> 01:01:07,698
that people with means
999
01:01:07,767 --> 01:01:11,460
will be availing themselves
of this technology,
1000
01:01:11,495 --> 01:01:13,083
and people who don't
have those means will not.
1001
01:01:14,601 --> 01:01:16,224
So I kind of hope for a future
1002
01:01:16,293 --> 01:01:20,159
where government
makes it free for everybody.
1003
01:01:20,228 --> 01:01:21,781
You would have a generally
healthier population,
1004
01:01:21,816 --> 01:01:24,957
maybe longer-lived
population on average,
1005
01:01:25,026 --> 01:01:28,754
maybe slightly smarter
population on average.
1006
01:01:31,239 --> 01:01:34,276
So if you have a smaller
fraction of your population
1007
01:01:34,311 --> 01:01:36,244
with Down syndrome,
1008
01:01:36,313 --> 01:01:38,142
the average intelligence
is a little bit higher,
1009
01:01:38,211 --> 01:01:39,661
and, you know,
1010
01:01:39,696 --> 01:01:41,663
society might run a
little bit more efficiently
1011
01:01:41,732 --> 01:01:43,009
if people are a
little bit smarter.
1012
01:01:48,497 --> 01:01:50,741
What is the bearing
of the laws of heredity
1013
01:01:50,810 --> 01:01:52,812
upon human affairs?
1014
01:01:52,881 --> 01:01:56,505
Eugenics provides the
answer, so far as this is known.
1015
01:01:56,574 --> 01:01:59,681
Eugenics seeks to apply
the known laws of heredity
1016
01:01:59,750 --> 01:02:02,339
so as to prevent the
degeneration of the race
1017
01:02:02,408 --> 01:02:04,513
and improve its
inborn qualities.
1018
01:02:04,582 --> 01:02:06,343
Well, the concept
of eugenics, if you,
1019
01:02:06,412 --> 01:02:07,689
if you go way back,
1020
01:02:07,758 --> 01:02:09,691
it really just means good genes.
1021
01:02:09,760 --> 01:02:14,006
The idea is that the human
race could improve itself.
1022
01:02:40,032 --> 01:02:43,207
It was, of course, hijacked,
1023
01:02:43,276 --> 01:02:44,622
and when people today
talk about eugenics,
1024
01:02:44,726 --> 01:02:47,764
they think specifically of
the Nazis, of Nazi Germany,
1025
01:02:47,867 --> 01:02:50,042
of compulsory
sterilization, where, by force,
1026
01:02:50,076 --> 01:02:52,320
people were compelled
to be sterilized or killed
1027
01:02:52,389 --> 01:02:54,494
because the state
didn't like their genes.
1028
01:02:54,563 --> 01:02:57,083
There was shock last
month over the revelation
1029
01:02:57,152 --> 01:03:00,535
that the State of Virginia
sterilized thousands of persons
1030
01:03:00,604 --> 01:03:03,227
between 1922 and '72
1031
01:03:03,296 --> 01:03:06,403
in a program aimed at ridding
the state of so-called misfits.
1032
01:03:06,472 --> 01:03:08,129
What we're talking about here,
1033
01:03:08,232 --> 01:03:11,408
where we're being paid
to do these genetic tests
1034
01:03:11,442 --> 01:03:13,582
by loving parents who
want to have a healthy child,
1035
01:03:13,651 --> 01:03:17,241
to equate that with Nazism is,
1036
01:03:17,310 --> 01:03:21,004
I think, just not, not just
stupid, but actually insane.
1037
01:03:21,073 --> 01:03:22,660
I've taken the
liberty of eradicating
1038
01:03:22,729 --> 01:03:24,283
any potentially
prejudicial conditions:
1039
01:03:24,352 --> 01:03:27,079
alcoholism and
addictive susceptibility,
1040
01:03:27,113 --> 01:03:28,805
propensity for violence,
obesity, et cetera.
1041
01:03:28,908 --> 01:03:32,256
We didn't want... I, I
mean, diseases, yes,
1042
01:03:32,291 --> 01:03:34,258
but, uh... Right, we
were just wondering
1043
01:03:34,293 --> 01:03:37,434
if, if it's good to just leave
a few things to, to chance.
1044
01:03:37,503 --> 01:03:40,161
You want to give your
child the best possible start.
1045
01:03:40,264 --> 01:03:44,303
Now, keep in mind,
this child is still you,
1046
01:03:44,372 --> 01:03:47,202
simply the best of you.
1047
01:03:53,105 --> 01:03:55,210
My greatest fear
in life, honestly,
1048
01:03:55,279 --> 01:03:57,316
I, my two greatest
fears, going back to me
1049
01:03:57,385 --> 01:03:59,456
wanting to be a mom
at the age of five,
1050
01:03:59,490 --> 01:04:00,595
my first-greatest fear is that
1051
01:04:00,664 --> 01:04:02,114
I wouldn't be able
to have a child,
1052
01:04:02,148 --> 01:04:03,563
and my second-greatest fear
1053
01:04:03,632 --> 01:04:05,565
is that something would
be wrong with my child.
1054
01:04:05,634 --> 01:04:08,948
Okay, good job,
not too much water.
1055
01:04:08,983 --> 01:04:10,985
Oh, careful, sweetie.
1056
01:04:11,054 --> 01:04:13,194
With Ruthie, I
started seeing that
1057
01:04:13,297 --> 01:04:14,195
she kind of wasn't tracking.
1058
01:04:17,715 --> 01:04:20,857
When I would feed her, her
eyes would slide back and forth.
1059
01:04:20,960 --> 01:04:25,171
Hi...
1060
01:04:25,240 --> 01:04:26,793
And then one day, I
went to my friend's house,
1061
01:04:26,863 --> 01:04:29,141
and her baby looked
me right in the eyes.
1062
01:04:29,175 --> 01:04:30,142
And I came home
to Ethan and I said,
1063
01:04:30,176 --> 01:04:31,108
"There's something wrong."
1064
01:04:32,661 --> 01:04:36,044
We did genetic testing.
1065
01:04:36,148 --> 01:04:39,806
She inherited one mutated
copy of this OCA2 gene from me
1066
01:04:39,876 --> 01:04:43,362
and one from Palmer.
1067
01:04:43,431 --> 01:04:45,674
I don't think I even
really understood
1068
01:04:45,743 --> 01:04:46,883
that people with albinism
1069
01:04:46,986 --> 01:04:48,712
had such impairment
of their vision.
1070
01:04:48,781 --> 01:04:51,715
It's kind of like wrapping
Saran Wrap over your eyes
1071
01:04:51,818 --> 01:04:53,027
with Vaseline.
1072
01:04:53,096 --> 01:04:55,029
Very, very hard for her to see.
1073
01:04:55,098 --> 01:04:57,031
Hi.
1074
01:04:57,100 --> 01:04:58,860
Now I just, like,
wanted to protect her.
1075
01:04:58,929 --> 01:05:00,689
Like, this isn't true,
this isn't happening.
1076
01:05:00,758 --> 01:05:03,244
It was horrible...
1077
01:05:03,313 --> 01:05:04,728
It was bad.
1078
01:05:07,110 --> 01:05:13,012
One, two, three, four.
1079
01:05:13,081 --> 01:05:14,738
Okay, Ruthie, Ruthie!
1080
01:05:14,841 --> 01:05:17,706
Whoa!
1081
01:05:17,775 --> 01:05:20,847
Hi.
1082
01:05:22,780 --> 01:05:26,508
She was really easy and happy.
1083
01:05:27,958 --> 01:05:29,442
Whoo!
1084
01:05:29,546 --> 01:05:32,549
And early on, I think
we wondered if she was
1085
01:05:32,618 --> 01:05:34,792
sort of, I don't know,
1086
01:05:34,896 --> 01:05:37,140
protected by the fact
that she couldn't see a lot.
1087
01:05:37,209 --> 01:05:39,625
Look, I have a flashlight!
1088
01:05:39,728 --> 01:05:41,938
That the world
wasn't as noisy to her.
1089
01:05:42,041 --> 01:05:44,078
Blue! Light it, light it!
1090
01:05:44,147 --> 01:05:45,803
She was smart and talkative.
1091
01:05:45,872 --> 01:05:47,253
Come here, Yoda.
1092
01:05:47,322 --> 01:05:50,084
Super-curious.
1093
01:05:56,573 --> 01:05:57,608
You don't know
what you don't know.
1094
01:05:57,712 --> 01:05:58,920
You don't know that,
1095
01:05:58,989 --> 01:06:00,749
even though it's
going to be different
1096
01:06:00,818 --> 01:06:03,752
than what you thought,
you don't know, you know,
1097
01:06:03,787 --> 01:06:06,376
maybe how much
better that's going to be.
1098
01:06:25,843 --> 01:06:27,984
I want to be a professional
basketball player,
1099
01:06:28,087 --> 01:06:31,608
but I don't think
that's gonna happen.
1100
01:06:33,092 --> 01:06:35,163
Can I hold him?
1101
01:06:36,544 --> 01:06:39,650
"Mission is simply one..."
1102
01:06:39,719 --> 01:06:41,169
Well, I mean, I've
known about CRISPR
1103
01:06:41,273 --> 01:06:42,791
from the perspective
of being a doctor
1104
01:06:42,860 --> 01:06:45,932
probably since
the first publications
1105
01:06:45,967 --> 01:06:47,934
in whatever it was, 2012.
1106
01:06:47,969 --> 01:06:50,523
Oh, they've come
to teach the Natives...
1107
01:06:50,627 --> 01:06:52,180
It really didn't intersect
1108
01:06:52,284 --> 01:06:53,975
with our own world, with Ruthie,
1109
01:06:54,044 --> 01:06:56,943
until probably about
a year and a half ago,
1110
01:06:57,013 --> 01:06:59,429
when I read
something on Twitter.
1111
01:07:05,987 --> 01:07:09,473
A scientist who I respect
a lot said he thought that
1112
01:07:09,542 --> 01:07:12,545
in one or two generations,
that all children would be born
1113
01:07:12,649 --> 01:07:17,619
with all of these genetic
abnormalities edited out.
1114
01:07:20,415 --> 01:07:22,314
I know people who have children
1115
01:07:22,348 --> 01:07:26,421
who have really
debilitating diseases
1116
01:07:26,490 --> 01:07:28,044
that make their children suffer,
1117
01:07:28,147 --> 01:07:29,700
make their
families suffer a lot,
1118
01:07:29,804 --> 01:07:32,048
so I totally understand
1119
01:07:32,151 --> 01:07:36,431
the desire to change that.
1120
01:07:36,500 --> 01:07:38,226
But the rest of it
scares me to death.
1121
01:07:43,335 --> 01:07:45,509
I don't know where
you draw the line
1122
01:07:45,544 --> 01:07:47,442
between not having albinism
1123
01:07:47,511 --> 01:07:49,548
and deciding your kid
needs to be an extra foot taller
1124
01:07:49,617 --> 01:07:52,861
so they can be a good
oarsman and go to Yale.
1125
01:07:52,930 --> 01:07:55,278
You know, where...
where is that line?
1126
01:07:55,347 --> 01:07:57,935
Who's going to draw that?
1127
01:07:58,039 --> 01:08:01,215
We're maybe a society
who is afraid of things
1128
01:08:01,284 --> 01:08:03,700
that are different or afraid
of people who are different,
1129
01:08:03,769 --> 01:08:06,254
afraid of people who have needs.
1130
01:08:06,358 --> 01:08:09,361
I worry that when we're
1131
01:08:09,430 --> 01:08:14,814
manipulating future generations,
1132
01:08:14,883 --> 01:08:19,785
those opinions are
going to be passed on.
1133
01:08:19,888 --> 01:08:21,752
You know, we as
a society may think
1134
01:08:21,821 --> 01:08:25,342
that doing better on the S.A.Ts.
is better than doing worse.
1135
01:08:27,896 --> 01:08:29,657
Being taller,
1136
01:08:29,726 --> 01:08:33,868
being handsomer,
being more creative,
1137
01:08:33,902 --> 01:08:35,766
being more courageous,
1138
01:08:35,835 --> 01:08:39,736
those are traits that we would
want to potentially select for.
1139
01:08:41,496 --> 01:08:42,739
Should we go there?
1140
01:08:42,773 --> 01:08:45,742
Is there an inevitability
to going there?
1141
01:08:47,916 --> 01:08:50,954
You know, sometimes,
I'm invited to give a talk on,
1142
01:08:51,057 --> 01:08:52,852
like, kind of futuristic
science things,
1143
01:08:52,921 --> 01:08:58,168
and I've had tall, blonde
trophy wives come up to me
1144
01:08:58,237 --> 01:09:01,067
after the talk and say,
"Wow, that was incredible.
1145
01:09:01,102 --> 01:09:02,621
"That was an incredibly
interesting talk,
1146
01:09:02,690 --> 01:09:04,623
"but don't you think there's
a problem with all this?
1147
01:09:04,692 --> 01:09:06,452
"Won't every parent
just select their kids
1148
01:09:06,521 --> 01:09:08,661
to be tall and blonde?"
1149
01:09:08,765 --> 01:09:11,423
The geeks all come up to me
and say, "Isn't this dangerous,
1150
01:09:11,492 --> 01:09:12,941
"'cause all the parents
are gonna select
1151
01:09:13,010 --> 01:09:14,771
for the smartest kid
they can possibly get?"
1152
01:09:14,840 --> 01:09:16,359
'Cause that's what
the geeks think is cool.
1153
01:09:16,428 --> 01:09:18,602
You know, probably if you were
talking to some NFL coaches,
1154
01:09:18,637 --> 01:09:20,294
they'd say, "Oh, what,
everyone's gonna,
1155
01:09:20,363 --> 01:09:22,434
"everyone's gonna
select their kid to be 6'5"
1156
01:09:22,503 --> 01:09:24,470
and run a 4.240," you know?
1157
01:09:24,539 --> 01:09:28,198
So, um, there will
be a wide range
1158
01:09:28,267 --> 01:09:29,613
of what people think
1159
01:09:29,648 --> 01:09:32,789
is the right thing to
select for or engineer for.
1160
01:09:32,823 --> 01:09:34,825
And, actually, there's
nothing wrong with that, right?
1161
01:09:34,929 --> 01:09:38,829
Let a million flowers bloom.
1162
01:09:41,694 --> 01:09:43,662
On this estate 30
miles north of San Diego
1163
01:09:43,731 --> 01:09:46,561
is housed a sperm bank
said to be made up exclusively
1164
01:09:46,630 --> 01:09:49,461
of donations by Nobel
Prize-winning scientists.
1165
01:09:49,530 --> 01:09:51,532
The bank's founder will
consider for fertilization
1166
01:09:51,635 --> 01:09:53,741
only women of high intelligence.
1167
01:09:53,810 --> 01:09:56,606
You don't know about
the Nobel sperm bank?
1168
01:09:58,159 --> 01:09:59,643
Businessman inventor
Robert Graham
1169
01:09:59,678 --> 01:10:01,404
adds liquid nitrogen once a week
1170
01:10:01,473 --> 01:10:03,578
to a lead-shielded
sperm repository
1171
01:10:03,647 --> 01:10:05,994
in an underground concrete
bunker in his backyard.
1172
01:10:06,063 --> 01:10:08,169
The more good genes
in the human gene pool,
1173
01:10:08,238 --> 01:10:11,552
the more good individuals
will come out of it.
1174
01:10:11,655 --> 01:10:14,831
We aren't even thinking
in terms of a super race.
1175
01:10:14,900 --> 01:10:16,833
The so-called genius sperm bank,
1176
01:10:16,902 --> 01:10:20,561
a sperm bank to
provide women, for free,
1177
01:10:20,664 --> 01:10:23,702
with donor semen from men
that they viewed as geniuses.
1178
01:10:23,771 --> 01:10:27,361
We utilize sources such as this:
1179
01:10:27,430 --> 01:10:29,190
"Who's Who of Emerging Leaders."
1180
01:10:29,259 --> 01:10:31,572
Very few women
actually went ahead
1181
01:10:31,675 --> 01:10:33,850
and took advantage of this offer
1182
01:10:33,884 --> 01:10:37,129
to be given superior
sperm for free.
1183
01:10:37,198 --> 01:10:40,512
I did a tour of sperm
banks for the U.S. Congress.
1184
01:10:40,581 --> 01:10:43,204
I think I'm the only
person who's ever gone
1185
01:10:43,273 --> 01:10:45,379
on a congressionally financed
tour of California sperm banks.
1186
01:10:45,448 --> 01:10:49,279
Despite the fact that
the donors are described
1187
01:10:49,348 --> 01:10:54,111
taller, skinnier, you
know, better-looking or not,
1188
01:10:54,215 --> 01:10:56,631
people tended to pick somebody
who looked like their partner,
1189
01:10:56,700 --> 01:10:58,254
no matter how imperfect,
1190
01:10:58,323 --> 01:11:01,843
because the emotional
importance of the connection
1191
01:11:01,878 --> 01:11:04,018
outweighed any notion of
1192
01:11:04,087 --> 01:11:06,192
improvability or perfectibility.
1193
01:11:06,262 --> 01:11:11,232
If I were trying to have
a child and my partner
1194
01:11:11,301 --> 01:11:13,407
was light-skinned,
short, with eczema,
1195
01:11:13,476 --> 01:11:15,443
I would have had
a child with a guy
1196
01:11:15,547 --> 01:11:18,066
who was light-skinned,
short, and prone to eczema.
1197
01:11:18,135 --> 01:11:21,035
But what if you could
take that guy's sperm
1198
01:11:21,104 --> 01:11:22,968
and edit those
specific things out?
1199
01:11:23,037 --> 01:11:24,314
Could I change his sperm
1200
01:11:24,383 --> 01:11:27,041
so it's still him,
but a better him?
1201
01:11:27,110 --> 01:11:30,009
Exactly, yeah. Right?
1202
01:11:30,078 --> 01:11:33,737
Maybe, but every change
does come with risks
1203
01:11:33,806 --> 01:11:36,809
that you'll make
changes you didn't intend,
1204
01:11:36,913 --> 01:11:40,088
so I think it'd be
a long, long time
1205
01:11:40,123 --> 01:11:42,746
before you would take
that risk for anything
1206
01:11:42,781 --> 01:11:46,336
other than something
that was pretty significant.
1207
01:11:46,405 --> 01:11:48,269
But I might want
to take advantage
1208
01:11:48,338 --> 01:11:50,823
of editing something
out that would give my kid
1209
01:11:50,927 --> 01:11:53,412
a very strong chance of
developing a severe cancer,
1210
01:11:53,481 --> 01:11:57,174
even if it's 40
years in the future.
1211
01:11:57,243 --> 01:11:59,349
Yeah.
1212
01:11:59,418 --> 01:12:02,559
So maybe that will happen.
1213
01:12:05,528 --> 01:12:07,806
This committee's gonna
be looking at both somatic
1214
01:12:07,875 --> 01:12:11,257
and germ line
applications of gene editing.
1215
01:12:11,292 --> 01:12:13,018
The committee that I co-chaired
1216
01:12:13,121 --> 01:12:15,261
for the National
Academy of Sciences,
1217
01:12:15,296 --> 01:12:16,953
we were asked to look deeply
1218
01:12:17,022 --> 01:12:19,093
at whether or not
there was something
1219
01:12:19,162 --> 01:12:20,784
intrinsically unethical
1220
01:12:20,853 --> 01:12:25,479
about manipulating genes in a
way that makes them heritable.
1221
01:12:25,548 --> 01:12:28,344
Significant degree
of uncertainty...
1222
01:12:28,447 --> 01:12:30,138
This should be
the goal of society,
1223
01:12:30,207 --> 01:12:32,313
to promote a better life for all
1224
01:12:32,348 --> 01:12:35,281
and to ensure that
everybody can live a life
1225
01:12:35,351 --> 01:12:37,456
in dignity and freedom.
1226
01:12:37,525 --> 01:12:41,391
Can this be achieved by
germ line gene editing?
1227
01:12:41,460 --> 01:12:43,738
My view is no.
1228
01:12:43,807 --> 01:12:46,810
The American
Medical Association,
1229
01:12:46,879 --> 01:12:48,985
a bunch of European
countries, you know,
1230
01:12:49,054 --> 01:12:50,296
any number of organizations
all had positions,
1231
01:12:50,366 --> 01:12:52,575
like, meddling in the
germ line would be wrong.
1232
01:12:52,644 --> 01:12:55,992
It would be unethical.
1233
01:12:56,061 --> 01:12:57,752
But they all said those things
1234
01:12:57,821 --> 01:13:00,168
at a time when it couldn't be
done, so it was easy to say.
1235
01:13:00,237 --> 01:13:02,343
It was a gimme, right?
1236
01:13:02,378 --> 01:13:05,415
And then as soon as it
comes that you can do it,
1237
01:13:05,484 --> 01:13:07,279
then the positions change.
1238
01:13:07,348 --> 01:13:11,248
Huntington's lurks in
our DNA like a time bomb.
1239
01:13:11,352 --> 01:13:13,837
It would really eliminate
a scourge in the world,
1240
01:13:13,872 --> 01:13:15,114
so I would say go for it.
1241
01:13:15,183 --> 01:13:17,841
At the big National
Academy meeting,
1242
01:13:17,876 --> 01:13:20,672
there was not a good
representation of patients,
1243
01:13:20,741 --> 01:13:24,330
but the few who did speak
were definitely in favor.
1244
01:13:24,400 --> 01:13:26,367
I say, yes, it is worth pursuing
1245
01:13:26,436 --> 01:13:27,851
in a safe and rational manner.
1246
01:13:27,920 --> 01:13:28,852
Definitely, let's go.
1247
01:13:28,921 --> 01:13:30,854
Anything that will stop
1248
01:13:30,889 --> 01:13:33,063
my child from suffering,
1249
01:13:33,167 --> 01:13:35,687
I'm for.
1250
01:13:35,756 --> 01:13:36,860
You know, draw this ethical
line wherever you want,
1251
01:13:36,929 --> 01:13:38,621
but don't draw it in
front of my disease.
1252
01:13:38,690 --> 01:13:41,624
He was six days old.
1253
01:13:41,693 --> 01:13:43,211
I remember one woman
told a story about a child
1254
01:13:43,280 --> 01:13:46,318
that she had and died
of an inheritable disease.
1255
01:13:46,387 --> 01:13:49,425
He had seizures every day.
1256
01:13:49,528 --> 01:13:52,704
We donated his
body for research.
1257
01:13:52,738 --> 01:13:53,912
If we have...
1258
01:13:53,981 --> 01:13:57,778
The skills and the knowledge
1259
01:13:57,881 --> 01:14:00,677
to fix these diseases,
then freaking do it.
1260
01:14:04,992 --> 01:14:07,477
The statement of
task demanded that we
1261
01:14:07,546 --> 01:14:10,756
try to follow the evidence
and follow the logic,
1262
01:14:10,825 --> 01:14:12,758
not that we follow the politics.
1263
01:14:12,827 --> 01:14:18,177
We said, "We conclude
it is not intrinsically evil."
1264
01:14:18,246 --> 01:14:20,421
It is what we called
ethically defensible,
1265
01:14:20,490 --> 01:14:24,425
but we understood that this
was now a break from the past
1266
01:14:24,494 --> 01:14:28,049
in the thinking
on this topic, yes.
1267
01:14:28,084 --> 01:14:30,362
In Genesis chapter one,
1268
01:14:30,431 --> 01:14:32,916
we discovered the
concept of the Imago Dei,
1269
01:14:32,985 --> 01:14:37,507
being in the image
and likeness of God.
1270
01:14:38,577 --> 01:14:40,614
What does that
mean for this science
1271
01:14:40,683 --> 01:14:42,305
where we have the capacity
1272
01:14:42,374 --> 01:14:47,483
to edit in some things, perhaps,
that we think are important?
1273
01:14:47,586 --> 01:14:49,105
Are we playing God?
1274
01:15:14,958 --> 01:15:17,409
The balance of nature
is built of a series
1275
01:15:17,478 --> 01:15:20,619
of interrelationships
between living things
1276
01:15:20,688 --> 01:15:24,278
and between living things
and their environment.
1277
01:15:33,701 --> 01:15:36,324
Now, to these
people, apparently,
1278
01:15:36,393 --> 01:15:39,362
the balance of nature
was something that was
1279
01:15:39,431 --> 01:15:42,779
repealed as soon as
man came on the scene.
1280
01:15:56,344 --> 01:15:59,244
This is Laika, this is Nova,
1281
01:15:59,313 --> 01:16:02,523
and this is Joy.
1282
01:16:02,558 --> 01:16:06,320
Our pig is the most advanced
genome-modified animal
1283
01:16:06,354 --> 01:16:07,977
running on the Earth.
1284
01:16:10,117 --> 01:16:12,222
The babies that came out of that
1285
01:16:12,291 --> 01:16:15,501
are now adults, and the adults
are having their own babies,
1286
01:16:15,536 --> 01:16:18,401
so it seems like
making that many edits
1287
01:16:18,504 --> 01:16:21,335
is completely compatible
1288
01:16:21,369 --> 01:16:23,613
with a happy, healthy pig.
1289
01:16:29,274 --> 01:16:31,448
I tell people to be
visually underwhelmed
1290
01:16:31,517 --> 01:16:34,313
by my lab.
1291
01:16:34,382 --> 01:16:35,694
It's just a bunch of small rooms
1292
01:16:35,763 --> 01:16:38,352
with usually very
few people in them.
1293
01:16:41,044 --> 01:16:44,323
But in terms of what I see,
1294
01:16:44,392 --> 01:16:47,533
it's very exciting.
1295
01:16:52,435 --> 01:16:54,886
I've never really felt
the "mad scientist"
1296
01:16:54,920 --> 01:16:57,889
was realistic for
anybody that I knew,
1297
01:16:57,958 --> 01:17:01,582
including myself.
1298
01:17:01,617 --> 01:17:04,136
My lab has been accused
of taking science fiction
1299
01:17:04,240 --> 01:17:05,241
and turning it
into science fact.
1300
01:17:05,275 --> 01:17:07,899
I consider that
very high praise.
1301
01:17:07,933 --> 01:17:13,421
But turning science fiction
into science fact is not mad.
1302
01:17:13,490 --> 01:17:15,665
It actually can be quite useful.
1303
01:17:18,357 --> 01:17:21,567
"Aging reversal" is
the term that I prefer.
1304
01:17:21,637 --> 01:17:23,431
You know, I'm 63 years old.
1305
01:17:23,466 --> 01:17:27,539
I feel like I just barely got
trained to do my job last year,
1306
01:17:27,608 --> 01:17:29,575
and so now you're gonna
pull the plug and recycle me.
1307
01:17:29,645 --> 01:17:32,751
That doesn't make sense.
1308
01:17:36,375 --> 01:17:38,101
We need to be cautious
in that, you know,
1309
01:17:38,170 --> 01:17:40,966
there's a, there's this
whole population problem,
1310
01:17:41,035 --> 01:17:44,004
so we can do that if we have
a place to put all those people.
1311
01:17:50,355 --> 01:17:52,978
Almost everything we do,
1312
01:17:53,047 --> 01:17:55,774
people just think,
"This is goofy,
1313
01:17:55,809 --> 01:17:59,605
this is not feasible,
it's science fiction."
1314
01:18:01,538 --> 01:18:04,058
But I think, originally,
1315
01:18:04,127 --> 01:18:05,957
people thought that
sequencing human genomes
1316
01:18:06,026 --> 01:18:08,511
inexpensively was a pipe dream.
1317
01:18:12,584 --> 01:18:15,621
I can't not ask you
about mammoths
1318
01:18:15,656 --> 01:18:17,485
because there's a
bunch of them behind you.
1319
01:18:17,520 --> 01:18:19,556
Yeah, that should be up
at the top of the list of things
1320
01:18:19,625 --> 01:18:23,699
that seem, uh,
quixotic or misguided.
1321
01:18:26,460 --> 01:18:28,807
So in the Mammoth Project,
1322
01:18:28,876 --> 01:18:31,499
we read the ancient DNA,
1323
01:18:31,534 --> 01:18:34,986
decide which genes
we're going to resurrect,
1324
01:18:35,055 --> 01:18:40,854
put those into the
Asian elephant's cells,
1325
01:18:40,923 --> 01:18:42,372
and then we're
developing technology
1326
01:18:42,441 --> 01:18:45,168
that is not yet working to make,
1327
01:18:45,237 --> 01:18:46,514
take those embryos
all the way to term.
1328
01:18:46,549 --> 01:18:49,103
Then we scale that up to
make a herd of these things,
1329
01:18:49,172 --> 01:18:52,797
maybe 80,000 of them,
to repopulate the tundra.
1330
01:18:55,282 --> 01:18:57,008
Don't you see the danger,
1331
01:18:57,042 --> 01:19:00,011
John, inherent in
what you're doing here?
1332
01:19:00,080 --> 01:19:01,667
Genetic power is the
most awesome force
1333
01:19:01,702 --> 01:19:03,255
the planet's ever
seen, but you wield it
1334
01:19:03,359 --> 01:19:04,843
like a kid that's
found his dad's gun.
1335
01:19:04,912 --> 01:19:07,743
I don't think you're
giving us our due credit.
1336
01:19:07,846 --> 01:19:09,952
Our scientists have done things
1337
01:19:10,021 --> 01:19:11,125
which nobody's ever done before.
1338
01:19:11,194 --> 01:19:12,402
Yeah, yeah, but your scientists
1339
01:19:12,471 --> 01:19:14,059
were so preoccupied with
whether or not they could,
1340
01:19:14,128 --> 01:19:15,716
they didn't stop to
think if they should.
1341
01:19:15,785 --> 01:19:17,442
Well,
1342
01:19:17,545 --> 01:19:20,514
I often try to avoid talking
about "Jurassic Park,"
1343
01:19:20,548 --> 01:19:22,965
but I'll, I'll give you this.
1344
01:19:23,034 --> 01:19:25,899
You know, "Jurassic
Park" was about hubris.
1345
01:19:25,968 --> 01:19:27,555
What species is this?
1346
01:19:27,624 --> 01:19:31,559
Uh, it's a velociraptor.
1347
01:19:31,594 --> 01:19:34,390
It's just the opposite
1348
01:19:34,459 --> 01:19:36,772
of what scientists
like George Church
1349
01:19:36,875 --> 01:19:39,222
and others that we work
with are thinking about.
1350
01:19:39,291 --> 01:19:42,570
When people say,
"Aren't you playing God?"
1351
01:19:42,639 --> 01:19:44,780
My real reaction is,
1352
01:19:44,883 --> 01:19:48,266
nobody is playing in this field.
1353
01:19:48,335 --> 01:19:50,233
Nobody is toying with it
1354
01:19:50,268 --> 01:19:52,926
just to see if it can happen.
1355
01:19:55,721 --> 01:19:57,516
You know, in order
to even fathom
1356
01:19:57,585 --> 01:19:59,760
bringing back an
extinct species,
1357
01:19:59,829 --> 01:20:04,592
there's no end of engineering
that has to happen,
1358
01:20:04,661 --> 01:20:07,285
and it is all novel,
important, new science
1359
01:20:07,354 --> 01:20:10,357
that can be used to
protect any species,
1360
01:20:10,426 --> 01:20:14,050
endangered as well as extinct.
1361
01:20:20,125 --> 01:20:21,609
Once you realize the magnitude
1362
01:20:21,678 --> 01:20:24,681
of humans' impact
on the environment,
1363
01:20:24,750 --> 01:20:27,270
you know, it's
hard for me to say
1364
01:20:27,339 --> 01:20:29,894
that we can't try to correct it.
1365
01:20:37,487 --> 01:20:40,490
We can't have our
head in the sand.
1366
01:20:40,594 --> 01:20:42,216
We have a responsibility
1367
01:20:42,285 --> 01:20:44,184
to use our human ingenuity
1368
01:20:44,287 --> 01:20:47,635
and our human skills
and our wherewithal.
1369
01:20:47,704 --> 01:20:50,638
Sometimes it's
leaving nature alone,
1370
01:20:50,707 --> 01:20:53,124
and sometimes it
might be intervening.
1371
01:20:57,059 --> 01:20:58,888
So the gene we've edited
1372
01:20:58,957 --> 01:21:01,028
controls how the pores
1373
01:21:01,132 --> 01:21:03,962
on the underside of the
leaves open and close.
1374
01:21:04,031 --> 01:21:06,792
In the non-edited plant,
the stomata or pores
1375
01:21:06,862 --> 01:21:09,968
will stay open during
the hot, dry conditions.
1376
01:21:10,003 --> 01:21:13,972
Water is lost, and then
these leaves lose water.
1377
01:21:14,041 --> 01:21:16,078
They wilt, and they roll.
1378
01:21:16,147 --> 01:21:19,253
In the edited plant,
those stomata pores
1379
01:21:19,322 --> 01:21:21,497
close sooner
under dry conditions
1380
01:21:21,531 --> 01:21:24,120
and the water is
retained inside the plant.
1381
01:21:34,751 --> 01:21:38,686
We have been messing with nature
1382
01:21:38,755 --> 01:21:40,826
ever since we came
out of the trees.
1383
01:21:43,588 --> 01:21:47,488
Most of the lifeforms we
eat are things we've made.
1384
01:21:50,008 --> 01:21:52,355
Corn used to be a grass.
1385
01:21:52,424 --> 01:21:53,529
Tomatoes used to be
1386
01:21:53,563 --> 01:21:56,394
tiny little berries
that were bitter.
1387
01:21:56,463 --> 01:21:57,843
Geneticists changed that.
1388
01:21:57,913 --> 01:21:59,500
Now, we didn't call
them geneticists.
1389
01:21:59,535 --> 01:22:00,916
We called them farmers.
1390
01:22:18,312 --> 01:22:21,557
Do you think among these
people there was anyone
1391
01:22:21,591 --> 01:22:24,836
that would be fair
to call a scientist?
1392
01:22:24,905 --> 01:22:28,046
Well, that's a really
interesting question.
1393
01:22:28,081 --> 01:22:30,255
I think there's lots
of different types
1394
01:22:30,324 --> 01:22:31,705
of science that were involved.
1395
01:22:31,774 --> 01:22:33,776
The first people
who invented pottery
1396
01:22:33,879 --> 01:22:39,230
were really chemists,
in a way, um...
1397
01:22:39,299 --> 01:22:44,614
And certainly the people
who were inventing agriculture
1398
01:22:44,683 --> 01:22:47,617
and control, controlling
plants and animals,
1399
01:22:47,686 --> 01:22:51,242
they were biologists, you
know, botanists and biologists,
1400
01:22:51,311 --> 01:22:52,208
in our sense.
1401
01:22:59,491 --> 01:23:02,494
You know, you can see
people trying things out.
1402
01:23:02,563 --> 01:23:03,771
What is the best way
1403
01:23:03,840 --> 01:23:07,016
to grind grain, and how
do you make bread?
1404
01:23:07,085 --> 01:23:09,915
You know, that
was invented here.
1405
01:23:09,985 --> 01:23:12,539
To work that out...
1406
01:23:12,608 --> 01:23:14,575
Is really not, is
not straightforward.
1407
01:23:17,958 --> 01:23:20,616
In this period of time,
something more modern-like
1408
01:23:20,685 --> 01:23:22,273
in terms of our
relationship with nature
1409
01:23:22,342 --> 01:23:24,965
was beginning to emerge.
1410
01:23:32,662 --> 01:23:34,457
As far as we understand it,
1411
01:23:34,492 --> 01:23:36,804
hunter-gatherers
had a relationship
1412
01:23:36,873 --> 01:23:41,568
of equality with nature
and had to look after nature,
1413
01:23:41,637 --> 01:23:43,328
and if you hunted an animal,
1414
01:23:43,397 --> 01:23:45,675
you would have to
give a gift to nature
1415
01:23:45,744 --> 01:23:48,230
to thank it for the animal
that you'd been given.
1416
01:23:48,299 --> 01:23:51,405
And then as people started
1417
01:23:51,474 --> 01:23:53,304
domesticating
plants and animals,
1418
01:23:53,373 --> 01:23:55,306
they started having
a new relationship,
1419
01:23:55,375 --> 01:23:56,824
where they were dominating
1420
01:23:56,859 --> 01:23:59,068
and controlling
the natural world...
1421
01:24:01,381 --> 01:24:05,316
That made it something
that you could transform.
1422
01:24:24,852 --> 01:24:26,785
We definitely see
1423
01:24:26,854 --> 01:24:29,202
great advantages in
genetic engineering,
1424
01:24:29,236 --> 01:24:35,725
as agriculture, you know,
was a great, a great advance.
1425
01:24:35,794 --> 01:24:37,520
Certainly, it's
the building block
1426
01:24:37,555 --> 01:24:40,696
of civilization as
we understand it.
1427
01:24:40,765 --> 01:24:43,664
But it definitely comes
with its negatives.
1428
01:24:47,358 --> 01:24:50,499
You could say that the
long-term consequences
1429
01:24:50,533 --> 01:24:52,984
were pollution
1430
01:24:53,053 --> 01:24:55,228
and environment degradation
and so on and so forth,
1431
01:24:55,297 --> 01:24:57,782
but you would have
had to be very far-seeing,
1432
01:24:57,885 --> 01:25:01,130
you know, 9,000 years
ago to realize that,
1433
01:25:01,199 --> 01:25:03,684
that that was what
was gonna happen.
1434
01:25:09,414 --> 01:25:12,279
These things creep in slowly.
1435
01:25:14,385 --> 01:25:16,973
It's not like everybody
was hunting and gathering,
1436
01:25:17,042 --> 01:25:18,389
and then next year,
somebody said,
1437
01:25:18,458 --> 01:25:20,253
"Oh, let's farm," right?
1438
01:25:20,322 --> 01:25:22,669
It happened slowly,
and so it is disruptive,
1439
01:25:22,738 --> 01:25:24,636
but it creeps up on people.
1440
01:25:24,740 --> 01:25:26,086
You don't realize
it's disruptive
1441
01:25:26,155 --> 01:25:27,432
until you look backward.
1442
01:25:27,501 --> 01:25:29,124
Often you don't realize
1443
01:25:29,193 --> 01:25:31,298
that you're in the middle
of a revolution until
1444
01:25:31,402 --> 01:25:34,129
after the revolution
has occurred.
1445
01:25:34,232 --> 01:25:37,062
Right? So I don't know
where we are right now.
1446
01:25:37,132 --> 01:25:39,099
It'll be interesting to see.
1447
01:25:39,168 --> 01:25:42,275
I hope I live long
enough to see it.
1448
01:25:42,344 --> 01:25:45,761
Do you think you
want to have kids?
1449
01:25:45,830 --> 01:25:48,073
I have too many
siblings for that.
1450
01:25:48,143 --> 01:25:50,145
The answer's
probably gonna change,
1451
01:25:50,248 --> 01:25:53,355
but for now, probably not, no.
1452
01:25:53,424 --> 01:25:54,459
I'm not crazy.
1453
01:25:54,528 --> 01:25:57,117
They're saying maybe
one day with CRISPR,
1454
01:25:57,186 --> 01:25:59,671
they could go in and change
1455
01:25:59,740 --> 01:26:02,847
the gene in the embryo
1456
01:26:02,916 --> 01:26:06,091
so that the kid, when it's born,
1457
01:26:06,161 --> 01:26:08,646
doesn't have sickle cell.
1458
01:26:08,749 --> 01:26:09,819
Hmm.
1459
01:26:15,308 --> 01:26:18,276
I guess that's kind of
cool, that they're thinking
1460
01:26:18,311 --> 01:26:20,451
that it can do
that in the future,
1461
01:26:20,520 --> 01:26:22,004
but I think that would be
1462
01:26:22,107 --> 01:26:26,008
up to the kid later.
1463
01:26:26,111 --> 01:26:27,492
What do you mean?
1464
01:26:27,561 --> 01:26:31,531
There's a lot of things that
I learned having sickle cell
1465
01:26:31,634 --> 01:26:33,326
just because I had it.
1466
01:26:33,395 --> 01:26:36,777
I learned patience
with everyone.
1467
01:26:36,846 --> 01:26:39,228
I learned, uh,
1468
01:26:39,297 --> 01:26:41,057
just to be positive.
1469
01:26:41,126 --> 01:26:44,060
So you don't wish
that you never had it.
1470
01:26:44,129 --> 01:26:46,097
I don't wish that
I never had it, no.
1471
01:26:46,166 --> 01:26:48,824
I don't think I'd be me if
I didn't have sickle cell.
1472
01:26:52,759 --> 01:26:55,175
Sickle cell's a
really interesting,
1473
01:26:55,244 --> 01:26:57,936
unusual genetic disease.
1474
01:26:58,005 --> 01:27:00,007
If you've got two
copies of the sickle gene,
1475
01:27:00,076 --> 01:27:02,147
you're really sick, and
without modern medicine,
1476
01:27:02,217 --> 01:27:03,666
you die young.
1477
01:27:03,701 --> 01:27:06,151
If you've got two copies
of the normal gene,
1478
01:27:06,186 --> 01:27:08,084
you don't get
sickle cell at all.
1479
01:27:08,153 --> 01:27:11,709
It turns out, though,
that if you've got
1480
01:27:11,778 --> 01:27:14,677
one sickle gene and
one nonsickle gene,
1481
01:27:14,712 --> 01:27:19,924
you make cells that
are somewhat sickle?
1482
01:27:19,993 --> 01:27:23,272
You're not sick,
1483
01:27:23,341 --> 01:27:25,205
but the organism
that causes malaria
1484
01:27:25,274 --> 01:27:27,794
doesn't like those
red blood cells.
1485
01:27:27,863 --> 01:27:30,728
Having a sickle gene
is protective against
1486
01:27:30,797 --> 01:27:32,143
getting severe malaria,
1487
01:27:32,212 --> 01:27:35,698
so in the environment
where there's lots of malaria,
1488
01:27:35,733 --> 01:27:37,424
it's better to be
sickle cell trait
1489
01:27:37,528 --> 01:27:39,046
than not to be
sickle cell trait.
1490
01:27:39,115 --> 01:27:42,118
And that's why you
see sickle cell anemia
1491
01:27:42,187 --> 01:27:45,087
in sub-Saharan Africa,
1492
01:27:45,156 --> 01:27:47,952
but you also see it
in the Mediterranean,
1493
01:27:48,021 --> 01:27:51,231
in Greece and in Sardinia.
1494
01:27:51,266 --> 01:27:54,890
It's because they had
mosquitoes and malaria.
1495
01:27:54,959 --> 01:27:56,892
The relationship between
1496
01:27:56,961 --> 01:27:59,412
our genes and our environment
1497
01:27:59,481 --> 01:28:00,413
is incredibly complex.
1498
01:28:00,482 --> 01:28:03,381
"Thanks, little brothers..."
1499
01:28:03,450 --> 01:28:05,038
And we don't understand that.
1500
01:28:14,772 --> 01:28:17,326
I think we have
to have humility.
1501
01:28:17,430 --> 01:28:22,918
Nature is one of the
greatest inventors of all time.
1502
01:28:22,952 --> 01:28:25,265
What we can do
is, is a very, very
1503
01:28:25,334 --> 01:28:28,717
insignificant fraction of
what nature has already done.
1504
01:28:32,237 --> 01:28:34,378
Nature invented CRISPR.
1505
01:28:39,866 --> 01:28:43,110
So now we're mixing
the cells with the CRISPR.
1506
01:28:43,179 --> 01:28:46,182
That's beautiful.
1507
01:28:46,251 --> 01:28:47,598
Once it's into the cell,
1508
01:28:47,667 --> 01:28:49,772
that starts the editing process.
1509
01:28:49,807 --> 01:28:52,257
We can't see that, we
just know it happens.
1510
01:28:54,639 --> 01:28:55,951
I don't know how,
1511
01:28:56,020 --> 01:28:58,091
out of all the genes
that you have,
1512
01:28:58,125 --> 01:28:59,851
that it targets the one
1513
01:28:59,920 --> 01:29:01,232
that's doing sickle cell
1514
01:29:01,301 --> 01:29:03,027
and not the thing that's
making you grow hair.
1515
01:29:03,096 --> 01:29:05,063
Oh...
1516
01:29:05,132 --> 01:29:07,203
But it does, apparently.
1517
01:29:07,272 --> 01:29:10,759
Like, that's cool.
1518
01:29:25,256 --> 01:29:27,810
You have to appreciate
that this is a technology
1519
01:29:27,879 --> 01:29:29,812
that's only about
five years old,
1520
01:29:29,881 --> 01:29:33,678
but it's been deployed
incredibly rapidly.
1521
01:29:33,747 --> 01:29:36,198
We've never had
the ability to change
1522
01:29:36,301 --> 01:29:39,995
the fundamental chemical nature
1523
01:29:40,029 --> 01:29:41,997
of who we are
in this way, right?
1524
01:29:42,031 --> 01:29:44,033
And now we do, and
what do we do with that?
1525
01:29:44,102 --> 01:29:46,415
It does make us really
1526
01:29:46,484 --> 01:29:48,831
think deeply about what
it means to be human.
1527
01:29:48,866 --> 01:29:51,351
What do we value
about human society?
1528
01:29:51,420 --> 01:29:52,904
And I know for myself...
1529
01:29:53,008 --> 01:29:55,182
The things that
make us most human
1530
01:29:55,251 --> 01:29:57,012
are some of the most
genetically complex,
1531
01:29:57,081 --> 01:29:59,324
which is kind of a relief.
1532
01:29:59,359 --> 01:30:02,500
Creativity...
1533
01:30:02,535 --> 01:30:06,021
Emotionality.
1534
01:30:06,090 --> 01:30:08,886
Love.
1535
01:30:08,955 --> 01:30:10,681
Now, I want to be clear:
1536
01:30:10,715 --> 01:30:12,683
they all have a
biological basis.
1537
01:30:12,717 --> 01:30:15,755
They are all written in our DNA.
1538
01:30:18,620 --> 01:30:23,279
But we are a very,
very, very long way away
1539
01:30:23,348 --> 01:30:28,215
from being able
to edit the person.
1540
01:30:28,284 --> 01:30:30,873
Do you think that day will come?
1541
01:30:30,942 --> 01:30:33,531
I do, but I'm hopeful that
1542
01:30:33,566 --> 01:30:35,291
we will mature as a species
1543
01:30:35,395 --> 01:30:37,742
before we get this incredible
technology to play with
1544
01:30:37,811 --> 01:30:39,813
for our own detriment.
1545
01:30:39,882 --> 01:30:43,645
I am hopeful for that, yes.
1546
01:30:43,714 --> 01:30:47,545
Is that hope based in fact?
1547
01:30:47,580 --> 01:30:50,306
We'll see.
1548
01:30:50,375 --> 01:30:52,723
How might we like
to change our genes?
1549
01:30:52,792 --> 01:30:54,276
Perhaps we would like to alter
1550
01:30:54,379 --> 01:30:57,728
the uneasy balance
of our emotions.
1551
01:30:57,762 --> 01:31:00,144
Could we be less warlike,
1552
01:31:00,247 --> 01:31:03,250
more self-confident,
more serene?
1553
01:31:03,319 --> 01:31:04,320
Perhaps.
1554
01:31:10,775 --> 01:31:16,401
Ours is, whether
we like it or not,
1555
01:31:16,436 --> 01:31:20,509
an age of transition.
1556
01:31:20,578 --> 01:31:22,511
After two billion years,
1557
01:31:22,580 --> 01:31:25,756
this is, in a sense, the
end of the beginning.
119467
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