All language subtitles for A.o.L.S01E01.The Talented Miss Finch [eng]

[soft music]

MAN: Everyone is talking
about this right now,

and I literally have not stopped
thinking about it.

MAN 2: This story is so crazy.
MAN: It's just really...

MAN 3: This is where it gets
nuts, though. I'm speechless!

WOMAN: We are going
to talk about Elisabeth Finch,

a television writer on
a medical drama, Grey's Anatomy,

who reigned supreme.
[applause]

And the Golden Globe
goes to...

Grey's Anatomy.

[applause]

I'd like to thank
every single writer

who writes on the show.

[music swells]

KILEY DONOVAN:
As a writer,

Elisabeth Finch knew exactly
what she was doing.

She would just like, break
people open and make them cry.

MATT GRAHAM: She wanted to be
the figure

that a lot of people
looked up to.

The guru
to female TV writers.

People feel seen and heard

and empowered by the story
that she wrote.

ANDY REASER: Her writing was
so highly regarded

because Finch had been
through so much.

Finchie wrote that episode and
deserves all the nominations.

AURORA LEE PASSIN:
She would tell me, like,

maybe I'm suffering this way

so that I can write
this way, too?

ELISABETH FINCH: Honestly,
I don't know anyone

who doesn't feel like
an impostor.

[tense music]

MATT: I remember turning on
my phone,

and the sound of about
20 messages.

Da-ding! Ding! Ding da-ding!
[phone chiming]

And then I looked at my phone.

"Dude, have you heard about
Elisabeth Finch?"

ANDY: I was like,
what kind of monster--

Like what are you even...
this doesn't compute with me

-on any level.
-We start now with a story

that has incredible drama

and could actually be
a plot line on Grey's Anatomy.

In my mind, that was like,
just the ultimate betrayal.

I would want to say to her,
like, what the fuck?

There couldn't possibly be
anything bigger than this!

But it was also that
validating feeling of...

I am not crazy, y'all!

Okay, it's officially on
the record.

The sheer scope,
the magnitude, for decades...

Oh my God, she's brilliant!

I have been taken by a genius!

[music swells]

[pensive music]

ELISABETH:Every time you have
to go write something,

it's a blank piece of paper.

I say what is my instinct
telling me to do?

I have to write like
everyone I know is dead.

[chuckles]

Which I know
sounds really creepy.

But if you're headed into risky
territory, keep going.

MATT: I knew Elisabeth Finch

because I was at film school
with her at USC

in the early 2000s.

ELISABETH: When you're on
the threshold of true success,

work is what you do.

Writing is how I make
my way in the world.

It defines who I am.

MATT: She was one
of these people who was

absolutely confident
in everything she said.

She was going to make it big.

[rhythmic music]

[crowd cheering]

First of all, has anyone
ever been in a giant room

where you seriously
know every single person?

It's really freaky and
amazing

to be surrounded by a room of
people that I love so fiercely

and who love me so fiercely.

[applause]

MATT: When she turned 40,
she had a huge party

celebrating
this huge birthday

with TV writers,
directors, top execs.

Anyone who looked up to her.

CROWD: * Happy birthday
to you **

[cheering]

MATT: But I was under
the impression this person

was running out of time.

Everyone here in this room
is someone that I know and love.

And over these last very...

bizarre seven years,

has been instrumental
in, uh,

helping me get to 40.

MATT: Her story
was extraordinary.

It has everything.

Loyalty, treachery.

And most of all, ambition.

So, thank you all for--
[crowd cheers]

MATT: The truth is,
Hollywood is a factory town.

That's all I know.

It's where story is created.

Essentially, I think
she probably saw her life

like a TV series.

It was gripping.

And for years,
it fooled Hollywood.

It fooled us all.

[gentle music]

PODCAST HOST:
So, Elisabeth, now.

You grew up in Jersey?

At what point did you get
the writing bug?

Uh-huh.

REBECCA: I knew
Beth Finch

in middle school and
high school.

Specifically, Cherry Hill East,
where we went.

People moved out of the city
or moved to Cherry Hill

because you wanted to send
your kid to Cherry Hill East,

which was one of
the best schools.

Theatre was big there.

And she was one of
the theatre kids.

[dramatic music]

But there was always
a darkness around her.

She wrote a play

called Daddy's Home,

all about a girl
who's abused by her father.

I was sitting
next to her parents,

and her mother was in tears
the entire time.

But the play got accolades.

It went on to win state-wide
play competitions,

and the theatre elites
of Cherry Hill East loved her.

[tense music]

ELISABETH: My mother and
father swore

that everything that made me
a pain in the ass as a child,

the strong will,

the determination
to make my own decisions,

was going to make me
an excellent adult.

I'd decided to be a writer.

AURORA: I met Elisabeth Finch
in 1996,

and she was 18,

and she was a freshman
learning about writing.

And we hit it off immediately.

And things went
from friendship to flirty

to "Oh, what are
these weird feelings?"

As a gay kid
in Kansas in the '90s,

somebody that has a lot
in common with you

makes you a whole lot less
weird real fast.

And that's a nice feeling.

That's a wonderful feeling,
actually, and...

we had a relationship,
briefly.

And then we stayed
very close friends. Um...

You just felt like
the spotlight was both on you

and you were the audience
to something just riveting.

[soft music]

ELISABETH: Well I went
to grad school as USC

for playwriting.

But I took a couple
TV classes,

and thought like wow,
this feels home.

And so I switched over
to scripting TV.

[rock music]

AURORA: After she graduated,
she got a gig in LA.

She was pretty darn happy
at True Blood.

ELISABETH: I worked
as an assistant

the first season
for True Blood. And then,

they fired
one of the writers,

uh, for not doing their job.
And...

I got his.

For me. No matter what.

Don't eat anyone.

AURORA: She went on to
Vampire Diaries.

Seemed to be working her way up
the ladder, so to speak.

I became known as
"Vampire Girl."

Everything with like
superpowers

or all these kinds of things.

And then you emerge
24 hours later overnight

as a baby vampire.

AURORA: But she wanted
to move forward.

It's never going to be
the same, Elena.

ELISABETH: I'd been on
a bunch of Vampire Diaries,

and I had a...
I was done with vampires

and wanted to move
into more human drama.

I had interviewed
to be Shonda's assistant

for Grey's Anatomy.

Okay, they're going to find
Teddy. It's gonna be okay.

It's gonna be okay,
it's gonna be okay.

ELISABETH: It was between me
and the other guy,

and the other guy got the job.

And then I walked out
of the office being grumbly

and like, "Oh I'm never
gonna watch it, whatever."

And then it became
my favorite show.

Kiss me.

AURORA: She was like,
"This is really good TV!"

We would watch it every week,
and we'd like scream at it.

ELISABETH: I was super
obsessed with Grey's.

And I had every episode
memorized in my head.

There were two things
it was clear she wanted.

One was being an executive
producer some day,

and the other was,
you know,

getting a gig
on Grey's Anatomy.

She tried more than once,
I think.

She wrote a sample script
and sent it to them,

but she didn't get
that job,

so she was
very disappointed.

[keyboard clacking]

But she was always
a very driven person.

She liked to set a goal

and execute it,
and she gets it done.

And um... Whatever that
"it" is.

[keyboard clacking]

She just didn't want to be
a nobody

from nowhere
with nothing to say.

She wanted to be somebody.

She was a great writer,

but there's so many
good writers.

So in order to get work
in Hollywood,

you have to be
so interesting

that people will just want
to meet you.

[tense music]

AURORA: I was always
in email contact with Finch,

but one day I got this package.

She sent a book called
The Fault in our Stars.

And I thought, "Why?
Why would she do this?"

But Finch had always been
very, very good

at indirect communication.

I remember reading that book and
realizing it was about cancer.

And saying, at the time,
like, she's got cancer!

She's got cancer.

[sombre music]

Then eventually, she confided
in me

that she had this kind
of bone cancer in her spine,

and then she said that
it's terminal.

And terminal means
the funeral is coming sooner

than it would have
otherwise.

Um... That was devastating.

She told me she's gonna be
all on her own

out in Minnesota
at the Mayo Clinic

for this chemo stuff,
and...

I end up offering to come
and be with her

while she's doing
her treatments.

We stayed at
a friend's condo

and she'd go into
the bathroom

and I'd hear her vomiting.

She's sitting
with her head in her hands

just moaning and crying.

She was physically hurting

and there was nothing
I could do

except be with her.

I remember thinking
Finch always said,

"Show up."

That's what's important about
being a friend.

But she didn't make it easy.

I drove her to the clinic.

I was surprised

because she told me
to stay in the car.

Well, the chemo takes a...
Takes a while.

And I just figured
she wasn't thinking clearly,

so I parked, and I got out,

and I sat in the lounge
and I waited.

You know, just texting,
reading.

Just passing the time.

Eventually she showed up

and she was angry with me

for having come inside
the Mayo Clinic,

instead of waiting inside
the car like I was supposed to.

She was very upset.

It was weird,
and I felt really hurt.

But you can forgive
anything

when your friend tells you
they're dying.

[dramatic music]

ELISABETH: I catch fragmented
glimpses

of my bald reflection
in the mirror.

My surgeon told me,

"I've never seen anything
like this,

especially in someone
your age."

Chondrosarcoma.

Bone cancer.

AURORA: Finch was
suffering so much.

She was like, "I'm gonna
turn it into an article

and I'm gonna share
my story."

[music builds]

Finch's story was
all about fighting back.

ELISABETH: My salve came
in the form of

Friday Night Lights.

Coach Taylor's epic speeches
about character

and beating the odds.

State was the victory
that would make

every battle along the way
worth it.

"State" became
the team's battle cry.

And in a very real way,
it became mine, too.

Let's go.
[distant cheering]

[phone buzzing]

ELISABETH: Staring at the dark
bedroom ceiling,

suddenly my phone began
buzzing insistently.

[buzzing continues]

I had two dozen texts,

each with a photo
of a different friend

holding up a sign
bearing one word,

state.

[inspiring music]

AURORA: Even the star
Kyle Chandler joined in.

The response was
incredible.

I'll just call it the Friday
Night Lights campaign.

[uplifting music]

MARK WILDING: I remember
reading the article

and I was very moved by it.

And I'm like, wow,

this woman has really
gone through it.

And the article was really
well written.

[overlapping chatter]

And that got noticed
by Shonda Rhimes.

PHOTOGRAPHER: Shonda,
one right up here, please?

MARK: I think what Shonda
brought to the table

that was new in the world
of television

was that she had these
very strong female characters.

You have to stop thinking
of me as an employee

and start thinking of me
as what I am.

-And what is that?
-The boss.

MARK: But they were flawed.
And at the end of the day,

they would somehow
redeem themselves

through the good
things they did.

He's alive! He's alive.

He's unconscious,
but he's alive.

Take Owen to the OR and
take that bullet out and get...

MARK: And in Grey's Anatomy,
it was, you know,

doctors saving lives
every week.

The absolute best part of
creating shows

and producing shows for me
is really the other writers.

The very dark and twisty
writers' rooms that we have.

MARK: I think Shonda thought

that because of Finch
having cancer

and being in the middle of our,
you know, health system,

she would be a good person
to sort of generate stories

for Grey's Anatomy.

What got you
to Grey's Anatomy?

My agents called me and said,
"Shonda wanted to meet you."

Um... And I thought
we were just meeting to like,

say hey! I was like,
oh I'm sorry,

I didn't know I was here
for a job.

I thought we were just talking.

Um, so I went to Grey's.

AURORA: It was always
Finch's goal.

And so when she did get
the gig there, that was like,

man, eye on the prize,
she-she Babe Ruthed that.

ANDY REASER: Elisabeth Finch
and I started at the same time,

2014.

And we worked together
for seven years.

It felt really awesome.
I mean, Grey's Anatomy,

it was certainly the most

well-known show
I had ever worked on

and still blows my mind.

The writers' room at Grey's
is incredibly intimate.

You're spending
hours upon hours with people

and you're thinking about
very emotional things.

ELISABETH: We stayed in the room
for about 10 hours a day,

eat a lot of snacks that
we shouldn't,

and talk about story.

There's one thing in common
that we have,

which is our passion
and our love for TV.

ANDY: I don't know
of an environment

where people just speak
as candidly as they do

in writers' rooms.

I mean it was
a close-knit group.

But Finch had
a very encyclopedic

knowledge of the show.

Like she could say,
"Oh that's like in season 5

when this happened and
this happened."

ELISABETH: I didn't bother
playing it cool

and figured that
having someone

with the knowledge of
that show

from an audience perspective
might be valuable.

I mean, sometimes people
would say, "That didn't happen"

or "that did happen"
and then there would be like,

okay, let's go to the computers,
and then she'd be proven right,

and then, you know. Stick it
in the other person's face.

KILEY: I was a writer
on Grey's for six seasons.

And it's one of those
things where,

when you're trying to break
in as a writer,

it seems like...
the greatest possible job.

And it is in many ways,
but it's a big learning curve.

The expression read the room
is never more applicable

than when you get to
a writers' room.

No one's telling you,
but like,

you have to learn
when to shut up, and when...

to speak up, and um, who
do you want to be on your side.

It's complicated.

And most people don't even
make it past their first year.

And I remember
hearing this one writer,

Elisabeth Finch,
had been on the chopping block

just based on writing alone.

[pensive music]

MARK: The people who were
running the show at that point

were really not happy with...

her contributions
in the writers' room,

and with the scripts
that Finchie wrote.

They wanted to fire her.

And then there was a call
from leadership above saying,

maybe rethink this one.

They said,
"You can't fire Finchie,

Finchie has cancer.

She has to stay on the show."

[tense music]

ANDY: When I met Finch,

she seemed to me like
someone who was in remission

and everything was
sort of behind her. Um...

But not long after,

she would be going
and getting treatment again.

And we were like, oh, my god,
Finch, I'm so sorry.

Like, it was awful.

ELISABETH: There's a tiny
cluster of cells

still hanging out in my spine
as I like to think about it,

that is managed if I do pretty
regularly intense medication.

She would wear
the head scarf,

and I realized
it was chemo hair loss.

Um, you know, if there was
a deadline approaching

and then something
was going on medically,

my attitude was always
Finch was family,

and, take whatever time
you need.

The work will get done.
We'll figure it out.

ELISABETH: Shonda told me
I was amazing.

Brave. Badass.

And then she sent me home.
I shook my head.

Respectfully. Hell fecking no.

My work was at stake.
My lifeline.

I was determined
not to lose it.

I didn't want to stop.

I couldn't stop.

KILEY: I was just really
impressed by

the fact that she did show up
every day and she had,

you know, a pretty serious
work ethic.

ANDY: But as time went on
she would look more unwell,

uh you know,
with quite a bit of makeup on,

which I figured had to be

'cause she was trying to look
less green from the chemo.

There was a day
in the writers' room

that she was wearing sort of
like a low-cut sweater,

and I noticed for the first time
that I could see

her chemo port on her chest.

And I'd never seen one
on a person.

Finch was taking breaks
to go to the bathroom

and throw up
from the chemo.

And it started
to really feel like,

I'm going to attend
this person's funeral.

But my sense
that I got from her

is that she didn't want
to confide in people

about her cancer.

It was very much like
"I'm soldiering through this,

do not treat me differently.

I don't want sympathy,
it's condescending."

And she was very private
with us.

But it was strange
because

Finch had a really large reach
on social media.

And she would talk about
her own cancer,

and her own experience
with it,

and there would be like,
interactions with celebrities.

And like,
"Finch knows everyone"

would be a thing that
we just started saying.

She says she doesn't want
attention,

and she doesn't want
everybody

catering to her
all the time.

But Finch's social media

was very self-congratulatory.

Truly it did feel
sometimes like,

two different Finches.

ELISABETH: For me it was
very much a process,

and you know, I had kept
some things quiet,

and was ready to let
people in as I saw fit.

There's a difference
between being secretive to me,

or being quiet about it
and private about it,

to being a liar.
And I...

pride myself
in not being the liar.

[tense music]

[keyboard clacking]

ELISABETH:
When I'm watching a story,

whether it's fiction,
whether it's documentary,

I can tell when someone
is speaking a truth.

I know when it's from
a point of view

of a lived human experience.

And I think that
that's what people are craving.

ANDY: She knew so much about
the step by step nuts and bolts

that went into being
in a hospital

and living in a hospital
for a prolonged period of time.

You could bounce things off
with her, or you could say like,

"Did-- When you were in
the hospital, did this happen?"

So she became the cancer expert
in the room.

Elisabeth,
how has the fact

that you are a writer
who has a disability

impacted the Grey's Anatomy
writing room?

I wrote a couple episodes
about a character

who was going through cancer
and ends up living with cancer

because that's my specific
lived experience.

[serious music]

KILEY: I remember
when Finch pitched

that we do the story

of her particular type
of cancer, chondrosarcoma.

And if it's chondrosarcoma?

Chondro is a beast.

KILEY: She pitched it
as a long-term storyline

for Debby Allen's character,
Catherine Fox.

We may be able to cut it out
without, uh...

Making me a quadriplegic
which means,

I'll never operate again.

ANDY: When Finch was writing
that episode, she was like,

"You need to rethink the way
that you think about cancer."

She was like, "Don't say
people beat cancer."

[typing]

MEREDITH GREY:
Battle.

Fight.

Win.

Lose.

These are the words we use
when someone is diagnosed

with an illness
or a disease.

KILEY: Finch's point was like,
cancer isn't somehow a game

that you win or lose.

And she wanted to change
the language.

There were 13 people
in my clinical trial.

Uh, I am the last one
who is alive.

Am I the winner?
Are they losers for dying?

KYLEY: The narrative
she experienced was like,

there are people
who just live with it,

and you're not
on death's door,

but you're also not
cancer free.

I'll have to live with this
cancer the rest of my life.

Cause they had seen me
for years live with cancer

and be in the writers' room
and carry on a full life.

HOST: That's amazing.

ANDY: I read the PDF of it and
I was like, this is fantastic.

You don't have to worry about
turning this in, it's great.

I mean the dialogue
just jumped off the page.

I have survived
racism, sexism,

every "ism" designed to make me
feel small

and make me less.

If I can do all of that,
if I can survive all of that,

then I just might
survive this too.

ANDY: That episode
was really successful.

And it got a lot of press.

Joining me is
Elisabeth Finch.

She is a co-executive producer

and writer for
Grey's Anatomy.

Finch was beloved.
People on set loved her,

the showrunner loved her.

Well, Finchie wrote
that episode

for any Emmy voters

who are watching.
[chuckling]

ANDY: Debby Allen would give her
a ride into work.

KYLEY: At this point
she was co-executive producer,

highly paid writer.

But it felt like...

that wasn't enough.

MATT: You've gotta realize,
in Hollywood,

the pressure
was extraordinary.

She wanted to be the figure
that people looked up to.

The guru
to female TV writers.

A sort of right on,
truth-telling person.

Very aware of current events,

kind of an activist.

Me too, NYC, cause we are
doing this again!

[crowd cheering]

KILEY: The MeToo movement
gave everyone permission

to start talking openly
about things that you sort of

just buried away forever.

[serious music]

All of us were pretty
triggered in like,

in our own ways.

There was this story
from Finch

about what had happened
on a previous show.

ELISABETH: Three minutes
into a rehearsal

on my episode
of The Vampire Diaries,

the director screams,

"If I wanted to talk
to a nagging cunt,

I'd go home to my wife."

I laugh for every damn day
of that shoot.

Laugh through his lewd jokes
about actresses' bodies

and lingering hugs

and clammy hands
on the back of my neck,

giving me massages I never want
but allow anyway.

LISINA STONEBURNER:
I was the acting coach

on The Vampire Diaries.

Finch was there
for three seasons.

I worked with her.
A lot.

And when the Hollywood Reporter
article came out

about the harassment,
I couldn't believe it.

And the very next thing
I did

was call the script supervisor.

And the two of us stayed
on the phone for three hours.

We were going through
the article together

literally line by line
by line.

But it was all very...

surprising.

[sombre music]

[ticking]

At this point, she...

was in like a kind of
a golden position.

KILEY: She was near
to the top but it felt like

she wanted more. She wanted
to be an important voice.

I started to notice that

whenever there was something
being talked about

in the zeitgeist,
or the news,

Finch always seemed to have
a connection to it,

uh, or her own
personal experience or story.

MARK: Abortion being
a big subject in this country,

she weighed in on the issue.

She was saying that at one point
she'd been pregnant,

and she had an abortion

because of the chemotherapy
that she was undergoing.

I am more than
my preexisting conditions,

more than the tumor
in my spine,

more than what my uterus
can or cannot do.

She got a lot of attention
for that piece.

You know, she's this writer,
living with cancer,

and now she also has
the definitive abortion story.

[dramatic music]
And now it felt like

abortion was another subject
that Finch owned,

and if we're gonna do it
on the show

we're going to do
her version.

Those words weren't spoken
but that was always the vibe.

[ticking]

Members of the Tree of Life
synagogue,

conducting a peaceful service

in their place of worship

were brutally murdered
by a gunman

targeting them simply
because of their faith.

ANDY: There was an attack
in Pittsburgh,

and I remember hearing
about it on the news,

and thinking oh my god,
this is terrible.

And then when I got to work,

I learned that Finch
had left.

KILEY: I was there.
She ran to her office,

grabbed all her stuff, and
just left with no explanation,

and then I think like
texted to say like,

"This is what's happening,
I'm getting on a plane right now

to go to Pittsburgh."

ANDY: We found out
that Finch

had gone to that synagogue
in the past

and knew some of the people
who were murdered.

And per Jewish law,

she was going there
to help.

Jewish law generally
forbids autopsies

and generally encourages burial
as quickly as possible,

usually within
about 24 hours.

ANDY: Someone needed to be
with the bodies,

and to help collect remains,

or as much of remains...
are available.

And she felt like she had to

'cause she owed it to them.

I can't imagine what that
would have felt like for her.

To go there and have to be
at the scene of that crime.

And at the place
that would be sacred

and holy and safe
for you,

and then for her to like
know these old women

who had been killed.

It was just, it was awful.

I just felt like how much
can this one person endure.

[typing]

MARK: I remember talking
to Andy Reaser,

and I said, do you understand
how odd that sounds?

The fact that she had
to go in, you know,

scoop up her friend's brains?

I mean, that's pretty
heavy-duty.

Also, the FBI is there!

It's a crime scene!

And he said,
"You know, I'm a Christian,

and I don't necessarily know
all the tenets

of the Jewish faith.
I certainly didn't think

to question her."

I felt like, man,
she cannot catch a break.

Like how is it
that so many awful things

keep happening
to this poor woman

who's like just trying
to survive?

MARK: Somebody did say to her,

"I can't believe you've been
through all this stuff,"

and Finchie's response was
"I can't believe it either."

[pensive music]

KILEY: If you were one
of the people that she liked,

it was sort of like,

when the sun shines on you,
it's warm.

We texted and
had our own inside jokes

and we got pedicures together.

Then we would
close the door and chat

and talk about
each other's lives.

I definitely considered her
a friend.

At some point
we had a drink,

and I shared something
that happened to me.

Kind of something
I was processing,

which was that
my biological father

was my mother's rapist.

And I had not, I had not
processed that trauma,

that information at all,
as like,

this is my origin story.
This is part of my identity.

It was like,
I felt for my mom,

and I knew that she had gone
through something

that she had not processed
in any way.

And, heavy, heavy shit
unraveling all of that.

You might want justice,

and I want you to have
everything you need to do that.

And that was around the time
that Finch started writing

an episode that she called
Silent All These Years,

where the character Jo Wilson
is treating a woman

who had been assaulted

and was going to administer
a rape kit to her.

[tense music]

But then, the second element
of the episode was in the past,

Jo had flashbacks
to meeting her mother

and learning that
she had been conceived...

in rape.

I fought as hard as I could

but he would not take no
for an answer.

So...

Nine months later
I had a baby.

I had you.

And, just even hearing
that story, like,

I have not even told
this story myself,

and I'm a writer. Like,
I haven't even had the chance

to figure out if I want
to tell this story,

and now it's an episode,

and it was really starting
to bug me,

that this is going to be

the high-profile episode
post MeToo.

I asked permission to not
have a writers' room for that,

so I wrote that by myself.

Doctor Karev asked us to all
stand here, do we know why?

Just that a patient needs us.

She needs all of us.

Okay.

ANDY: For the episode
dealing with rape,

every female member
of the crew

was invited, if they wanted to,
to come stand in scrubs,

and be in the show.

[dramatic music]

ELISABETH: And they forced me
into scrubs

and made me hold the gurney
all the way down the hallway.

So I'm like right there.

And then every photo advertising
the episode

had my face on it.

Which, there was a lot,
at the time.

ANDY: And the episode
came together so well,

that's an episode that people
come up to me still and say,

"Oh my god,
I saw that episode,

I was crying the whole time,
I couldn't believe it,

you guys did
such a wonderful job."

And I would say, well that was
Elisabeth Finch.

[pensive music]

KILEY: I tried to not
make a big deal out of it.

And I tried
to tell myself,

this is what it is
being in a writers' room.

You share parts of yourself,
you share your stories,

and then people
internalize them.

But looking back,
it was super painful.

It just felt really,
it felt weird. And wrong.

And uh,

I never confronted Finch
about it because it felt,

A, I was a lower-level
writer,

and she was
a co-executive producer,

and was being heralded
for this amazing script.

And it didn't feel like
I had a leg to stand on,

or that it was appropriate.

[applause]

She wrote the episode,
she's a co-executive producer,

an amazing human being.
Elisabeth Finch.

ANDY: Finch talked on panels,
people had heard of her.

Camilla Luddington.

ANDY: And after
Silent All These Years,

she became very interested
in the character Jo,

played by Camilla Luddington.

The character became
more popular,

so, like when we would do
writers' reads,

Finch would always
want to read Jo.

And I thought,
she does seem kind of

preoccupied
with this character,

but, maybe she has a crush
on the actress?

I mean any time
Jo's story would come up,

it seems like Finch would kind
of yoink it for herself.

ELISABETH: When you're
pitching a story,

you can pitch for
your favorite ones to write.

So they just said,
"Can you take the Jo stuff

for the rest of the season," and
there were fivemore episodes.

So I would write
Jo's stuff

because they knew
I was in her headspace,

if that makes sense?

I know it sounds
a little fruity.

ANDY: So, Finch had
a real stake in...

telling stories with her,
and through her.

Whatever life you had,

tell me it wasn't better
than mine.

Jo had already been
through a lot in the show.

Hey.

KILEY: She had an abusive
ex-husband,

who then came back and like,
basically tried to kill her.

You point fingers
at everyone else around you,

but you're the monster.

And then,
Finch really pushed this...

story of sending Jo
down a really dark path.

ELISABETH: As a story teller,
I often find myself asking,

what is the worst-case scenario?

It's thrilling to imagine
what it takes for a character

to climb out of
her own personal depths.

MATT: What people want
is a good story.

You have to start small,

and get bigger and bigger
and bigger.

I'm not okay.

KILEY: Finch said
the only option

was for Jo to go
into inpatient treatment.

Um, I'm checking in my wife,
Josephine Karev.

You need to drive around,

you say goodbye there,
she goes in on foot.

[gate creaks]

ANDY: Not long after,

Finch was supposed to have been
working on the script,

but called like the day
we were supposed

to get the outline
and said,

"I've had a complete
breakdown

from being at that attack
in Pittsburgh.

I'm going to get treatment
for PTSD."

KILEY: Before she went in
for PTSD treatment,

there was a total embargo
in the writers' room

on any mention of guns,
or gunshots,

or even using the expression
"shooting the idea down."

Finch would get,
like, physically,

visibly upset,

and you could see
that she was traumatized.

It was concerning.

But it was strange
circumstance because...

very soon after we sent
the character Jo Wilson

off to inpatient
PTSD treatment,

Finch was then going away
for the same treatment.

[music builds]

[typing]

ANDY: Finch had checked herself
into a facility

in Arizona.

She checked in under
the name of Jo,

the character on the show
that she was dealing with,

which seemed...

very strange.

Jo, you've had
a depressive episode

caused by intense trauma.

JENN BEYER: I remember like,
seeing Finch,

or at that time I knew her
as Jo, cause she went by Jo,

in a chair
up against the wall,

and just scared of like
all the noise.

Like just, her eyes
darting everywhere

and trying to figure out
what's going on,

not wanting anybody
to walk behind her,

and not wanting anybody
to touch her and like...

I understood that.

I was at a facility,
Sierra Tucson,

for many months
before meeting Jo.

I didn't really talk
to many people there,

I was very scared a lot,
and quiet.

[soft music]

She started walking with me,

and she was just
very kind, like,

"you don't have to talk to me,
I'll just be with you.

You don't have to say anything,
I understand."

She didn't seem to judge me
in any way.

I don't know,
she was just very kind.

Very loving, very nice.

MARGARET FITA: I met Jenn and Jo
in group therapy.

It felt really good that Jenn
could have that person,

because I think that Jenn,

she was the sickest person
there. You know?

Like she was sometimes
hysterical, crying, screaming,

clearly in some sort of
major distress.

And Jo was specifically
very protective over Jenn.

Ancient Egypt.

We haven't seen
any camels yet.

JENN: She would just be silly.

There she goes.

I could be having
the worst time, the worst day.

She could make me laugh.

I hadn't laughed
in a long time.

[laughter]

There's somebody in here
who knows how to survive.

JENN: After a while,

she asked me
about being roommates.

As a rule, you couldn't be
a roommate with somebody

if you were
in their process group.

But she was able
to get it approved.

And she would leave like
silly notes on the bed.

When she said she loved me,
it wasn't like I love you,

like a relationship love.
It was just like,

I really care about you,
I'm not going anywhere.

MARGARET: I knew
that they were close.

But it felt like

Jo became more interested
in being my friend

once I think I was like
kind of talking

and hanging out with Jenn.

JENN: I was very,
very, very touched

that she would take time
to...

talk to me about my life.

Getting to know, like what I was
there for,

and my story.

I had a wall of pictures
of the kids up.

She would always
listen to like--

Whenever I wanted to tell her
about this kid or that kid.

It was hard.

But I told her...

um, what happened.

I have five children.

And I was a nurse
at the hospital.

My name's Brendan Byer.

JENN: And Brendan was
a local political activist.

What democracy looks like!

JENN: We seemed like
the perfect family.

But Brendan abused me
physically and mentally.

Eventually I got
a protection order,

and he wasn't allowed
within 900 feet of me.

But Brendan kept stalking me

and at times
he'd be standing in our yard.

Because of the danger I was in,
I was having a PTSD reaction.

One day,

I had a dissociative
episode

and I didn't know
where I was

and I didn't know
where the children were.

Brendan convinced people
that I was, uh...

psychotic.

And I lost custody
of the children.

And I was afraid I would never
get them back.

And that's why I was
at Sierra Tucson.

MARGARET: Jenn's story
was obviously super intense,

so Jenn would have a lot of
these trauma triggers.

You couldn't move
the chair too loud,

or she would be
really triggered.

And it was obviously very true.
And Jo would...

talk about that as if
she also had all of that.

JENN: We both were struggling
with PTSD.

When you see someone
going through

what you're going through,
you connect with them.

We just grew closer
because of our similarities.

And I felt safe

to talk to her about
Brendan's patterns

and ways of behavior,

and the way he would say things,
and how he acted.

[phone chiming]

AURORA: I got a message
from Finch

for the first time
in a long time.

And she asked me
to come to Arizona.

Eventually I get there
and she says,

"Tell them you're here
for Jo."

She said that she took that name
from the character on Grey's.

-You have a name?
-Jo Wilson.

Oh, nice.

I was just like, well sure,
that seems random as hell,

but, fine.

And then she greets me,

and she wants to take a walk.

And then she tells me

her brother used to beat
the shit out of her.

I was gobsmacked,

I had never heard
a bad thing about Eric.

All I'd ever heard about Eric
was that he was older than her,

kind of pretty funny guy,
she seemed to admire him.

But then she had a realization,

she says, "My brother assaulted
me brutally as a child.

And it turns out that's what
I'm really all upset about."

JENN: She had discovered
physical abuse from her brother

was her real issue,

even more than what happened
at the synagogue.

So I just kept saying like,
I'm so sorry. I did, I did.

I was just,
I was devastated for her.

Devastated.

[sighs]

JENN: Shortly before
my discharge date,

Brendan sent a video.

Think I'm leaving
to get you soon.

Don't be frightened.

[sighs]

I just need you.

That video terrified me.

I was really, really scared,
and really struggling.

I was gonna have to go home
and...

I was...

extremely terrified
that he was gonna kill me.

MARGARET: At that time,

it seemed like Jo
just cared about

finding out everything
about Jenn's story.

And then right around
the same time that Jenn

was getting these threats
from Brendan,

Jo said she was getting threats
from her brother.

JENN: She said that there was
a hand-written letter

from her brother,

along the lines
of she better shut up.

Saying he was coming
to get her.

She was having this
huge emotional scary crisis

going on at the same time
as I am at Sierra Tucson.

And we're both in this room
together

and we're both having
the same kind of symptoms.

MARGARET: Slowly I realized
something about Jo,

that every time
there was something with Jenn,

there was something with her,
that was... weird.

[soft music]

JENN: At Sierra Tucson,
they'll pick a week

that will be their family week.

When it came Jo's time
for family week,

she invited her mom and dad.

And then they come into
your process group,

and then your group sits
around you.

What she said to her parents

is that she had brought
them there

so that she could tell them
about the trauma

between her and her brother.

And her parents
were kind of these,

like a deer in headlights,
listening to her.

And they didn't say a lot.
Like, they were very confused.

They were very confused about
what she was talking about

with her brother. And this is
all a very big shock to them.

[sighs]

And then Jo's cancer came up.

[tense music]

Cancer?

Uh... We didn't know anything
about cancer.

She hadn't mentioned it
before,

but I figured
she was private about it,

so I didn't press
or ask questions.

Though she always wanted
to know everything

that was happening
in my life.

Jo seemed very interested

in my therapy sessions
with Carly, my therapist.

I started this new treatment
called EMDR,

eye movement desensitisation
reprocessing,

which helps you
process trauma.

Carly was a very trusted person
to me.

She would have me talk
about a feeling,

and I had tap-

what they call tappers,
that I would hold on to,

that buzz in each hand,
back and forth.

Jo was constantly asking me
questions.

She wanted to know everything.

And I knew very little
about her life.

MARGARET: Jo was very private.

When I asked her what she did,
you know, what was her job,

and she was just acting
very strange,

not wanting to tell me.

I got the vibe that that it was
like don't ask me any questions.

JENN: One day she said
she needed to leave

'cause she was going on
a work thing.

People didn't usually leave
for work things here

so that was very different.

Right when she was leaving,
she was like,

"Here's a picture of me
so you have, you know,

you have somebody safe
to look at."

She was wearing scrubs
and an OR cap.

You know, obviously I knew
she wasn't a nurse or whatever,

so, um, that's when I learned
that she was a writer

on Grey's Anatomy
and she had, um,

acted in one of the episodes
that she wrote.

And she tells me that her name
is Elisabeth Finch.

[high-pitched ringing]

I was shocked
that she hadn't told me.

But if you're a writer
for something that big,

I guess people really,
really care

if you're at
a mental health facility.

[string music]

ANDY: Finch came back
just seemingly much better,

with a lot of stuff
she learned there

and wanted to write about.

ELISABETH: I was introduced
to EMDR,

which I'd never heard of,

so I was interested
in exploring it on the show.

A couple of people on
the team had that reaction of,

"Really? Is that possible?"

But, it wasn't hard to convince
them.

[typing]

No, no, no. I'm not.
I can't do EMDR today.

I'm not doing it. I know
it's life-changing or whatever,

but I can't- Not today.

It felt like she had found
her way to do great stories.

Make them seem real
and convincing.

It was fantastic.

Hi, I'm Carly,

and my core feeling
today is pride

because my patient asked
for what she needed

for the first time
in 22 days.

HOST: Tell us about the Jo-
that therapist episode,

how did you research that?

Well, what we'd never seen
on Grey's,

because we're primarily
a surgical show,

is inpatient treatment
for trauma.

EMDR is just another way
to get at the root of my trauma.

We did a whole ton of research
to make it as specific

and nuanced as possible,

because we were showing
a different model of therapy.

And now I'm, I'm what,
I'm supposed to

stare at a light bar and all
my troubles are gonna disappear?

JENN: EMDR turned out to not be
the best thing for me at all,

because things were really
escalating,

that felt like it
wasn't going to fix it.

Brendan was saying that he was
coming to get me,

and I felt like everything
was going in reverse

and going backwards again.

What was really fun for me
was...

I wanted her to have
a flip up in her fear

like she's going backwards.

[device beeps]

You get to a certain point
and you feel like

"I'm good now, I'm good now,
I'm good now,"

and then something else
knocks you off your feet

and you think, "I'm
right back where I started."

I was scared I was going
back to square one.

And now I'm,
now I'm back to square one.

It was great. It was a good one,
that was fun.

[dramatic music]

[typing]

Finch is marrying a woman
and moving to Kansas!

Mom was like,
"We're gonna be a family!"

It was all happening
so fast.

[overlapping chatter]

If there's one thing
I'm good at,

it's making robots
out of magnet tiles.

I trusted her completely.

But I started
noticing a pattern.

KILEY: Someone said Finch's
brother's in the hospital,

he's on life support.

We heard that Shonda was crying
the night of the operation.

She felt that Finch might die.

Things are not matching up.

Somebody isn't coming out of
this situation alive.

[laughter]

This is so deep and dark
and cruel, and...

it's terrifying.

[dramatic music]