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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:52,315 --> 00:00:55,149 During the years of triumph, 2 00:00:55,235 --> 00:00:58,445 Germans couldn't see enough of Adolf Hitler - 3 00:00:58,529 --> 00:01:00,654 Germany's saviour. 4 00:01:00,739 --> 00:01:04,033 Germany's greatest statesman. 5 00:01:04,117 --> 00:01:07,869 The greatest general the world had ever seen. 6 00:01:09,039 --> 00:01:14,835 But as the war turned against Germany, Hitler disappeared from public view. 7 00:01:14,919 --> 00:01:19,672 And at the last, the German people knew nothing. 8 00:01:20,424 --> 00:01:25,928 They were told he had died a hero's death, but that was all. 9 00:01:26,013 --> 00:01:31,350 Nazis, and later the Russians, concealed what they knew about his end. 10 00:01:32,685 --> 00:01:35,188 The first Westerner to investigate the affair 11 00:01:35,271 --> 00:01:38,106 was British historian Hugh Trevor-Roper. 12 00:01:38,191 --> 00:01:45,197 The controversy began because Hitler was last heard of in the West 13 00:01:45,280 --> 00:01:53,286 when he made a broadcast on the 22nd, I think, of April 1945, 14 00:01:53,372 --> 00:01:56,289 saying that he would stay in Berlin. 15 00:01:56,374 --> 00:01:58,625 And when the Russians captured Berlin, 16 00:01:58,709 --> 00:02:04,839 no announcement was made about his life or death or anything about him. 17 00:02:04,924 --> 00:02:09,177 The body of Goebbels was found and shown by the Russians. 18 00:02:09,262 --> 00:02:11,637 The body of Hitler was not. 19 00:02:11,721 --> 00:02:16,684 And five months after Hitler's disappearance, 20 00:02:16,768 --> 00:02:20,645 the Russians accused the British authorities in Germany 21 00:02:20,730 --> 00:02:25,899 of concealing Hitler and Eva Braun in the British zone 22 00:02:25,985 --> 00:02:28,820 for ultimate use against the Russians. 23 00:02:28,903 --> 00:02:34,033 This was the last straw which provoked the British authorities in Germany 24 00:02:34,117 --> 00:02:37,244 to decide to settle this matter 25 00:02:37,328 --> 00:02:40,998 and I was appointed to find out the facts. 26 00:02:41,081 --> 00:02:44,500 That's the beginning of the controversy. 27 00:02:44,585 --> 00:02:48,880 And of course I naturally consider that when I had made my report, 28 00:02:48,964 --> 00:02:51,340 on 1 November, 1945, 29 00:02:51,425 --> 00:02:55,344 the controversy should logically have come to an end. 30 00:02:55,429 --> 00:02:59,432 Why it went on, I can't think, 31 00:02:59,516 --> 00:03:04,811 except for the perpetual Russian mystification. 32 00:03:04,896 --> 00:03:08,648 (narrator) Yelena Rzhevskaya was an interpreter with the Red Army unit 33 00:03:08,733 --> 00:03:10,149 which tried to find Hitler. 34 00:03:10,234 --> 00:03:13,278 Dr Faust Shkaravsky headed the autopsy commission 35 00:03:13,361 --> 00:03:16,113 which examined the body the Russians found. 36 00:03:16,198 --> 00:03:19,074 Professor Keith Simpson is a British pathologist 37 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:21,952 who has assessed the Soviet findings. 38 00:03:22,036 --> 00:03:25,330 Dental expert Reidar Sognnaes found important new evidence 39 00:03:25,415 --> 00:03:27,790 in a U nited States archive. 40 00:03:27,917 --> 00:03:33,671 Albert Speer, Nazi armaments minister, saw Hitler often during the war. 41 00:03:33,756 --> 00:03:38,884 Heinz Linge was Hitler's valet and closest personal servant. 42 00:03:38,969 --> 00:03:40,762 Hitler's secretary Traudl Junge 43 00:03:40,845 --> 00:03:44,723 was with him in the underground headquarters, the bunker, until the end. 44 00:03:45,308 --> 00:03:52,897 This situation in the bunker was a fantastic one. 45 00:03:52,981 --> 00:03:57,401 One really can't... An unrealistic one. 46 00:03:57,569 --> 00:04:05,575 One really can't describe how the moods went on and off like waves. 47 00:04:06,285 --> 00:04:09,829 Sometimes they were all exhilarating 48 00:04:09,915 --> 00:04:11,415 and we were thinking, 49 00:04:11,499 --> 00:04:15,334 "Well, now the Western troops 50 00:04:15,420 --> 00:04:17,754 are coming for release of Berlin." 51 00:04:17,879 --> 00:04:20,381 Goebbels was exclaiming 52 00:04:20,465 --> 00:04:26,095 one of the biggest decisions of the war that Hitler made. 53 00:04:26,179 --> 00:04:33,101 "He is now determined to... no more to fight against the West, 54 00:04:33,186 --> 00:04:35,396 only to the East in Berlin, 55 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:41,651 and this will mean that the Western powers will join us 56 00:04:41,735 --> 00:04:43,527 in our fight against Russia." 57 00:04:43,612 --> 00:04:46,739 And such things happened every now and then, 58 00:04:46,823 --> 00:04:53,161 and then a few minutes afterwards everybody was speaking about suicide. 59 00:04:53,288 --> 00:04:55,706 (speaking German) 60 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:00,001 (translator) Since Stalingrad, 61 00:05:00,086 --> 00:05:04,797 Hitler's state of health had been constantly deteriorating. 62 00:05:07,426 --> 00:05:13,514 He dragged one of his legs somewhat and got a shaking in his arm. 63 00:05:18,645 --> 00:05:23,606 During the last days in the bunker, this got much worse. 64 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:35,284 During April, when the report came through that Roosevelt was dead, 65 00:05:35,367 --> 00:05:41,372 and Truman had said that America's area of interest was not in Europe, 66 00:05:41,458 --> 00:05:43,791 but in East Asia, 67 00:05:43,877 --> 00:05:47,085 Hitler drew some hopes from this 68 00:05:47,171 --> 00:05:52,966 and clung to it like a drowning man clutching a last straw. 69 00:05:56,805 --> 00:06:01,643 We spoke about committing suicide 70 00:06:01,726 --> 00:06:07,814 as other people talk about fashions 71 00:06:07,899 --> 00:06:11,359 or about what they have done today. 72 00:06:11,443 --> 00:06:19,449 And so Eva Braun asked for the best and the painless, 73 00:06:19,534 --> 00:06:24,204 the most painless method to commit suicide. 74 00:06:24,288 --> 00:06:27,540 And Hitler said, "That would be cyanide." 75 00:06:27,625 --> 00:06:29,792 "You don't feel anything." 76 00:06:29,878 --> 00:06:33,463 And she said, "Then I would prefer that, because if I shoot myself, 77 00:06:33,546 --> 00:06:37,508 I would make an ugly impression when I am dead." 78 00:06:37,592 --> 00:06:43,972 Hitler himself saw no other solution 79 00:06:44,057 --> 00:06:50,437 and no other way out than to commit suicide himself too. 80 00:06:50,522 --> 00:06:53,398 And so it infected us a little. 81 00:06:53,482 --> 00:07:01,115 It was a most varied theme of our conversations, how to commit suicide. 82 00:07:01,198 --> 00:07:08,577 It was a little macabre. And then he gave us capsules, poison capsules. 83 00:07:08,663 --> 00:07:12,958 It was in a brass, in a brass... like a lipstick. 84 00:07:13,041 --> 00:07:18,672 It looked like a lipstick in brass... outside wrapping. 85 00:07:18,755 --> 00:07:22,842 And he gave it to Mrs Christian and me and said, 86 00:07:22,926 --> 00:07:27,263 "l would like to give you a nice present, 87 00:07:27,346 --> 00:07:33,894 but I think this one will be of much use for you." 88 00:07:34,979 --> 00:07:41,693 And with a regretting smile, he gave us this poison. 89 00:07:41,777 --> 00:07:43,360 (speaking German) 90 00:07:43,446 --> 00:07:49,324 (translator) He himself also did not have the sort of trust he used to have 91 00:07:49,409 --> 00:07:51,493 towards other people, 92 00:07:51,577 --> 00:07:56,038 even, for instance, towards his own doctors. 93 00:07:59,293 --> 00:08:02,962 I had to give him his eye drops in the morning. 94 00:08:04,423 --> 00:08:08,717 He maintained that I had a particularly steady hand. 95 00:08:08,801 --> 00:08:13,597 But I believe that it was more his mistrust of other people. 96 00:08:14,766 --> 00:08:20,019 Also, when the doctor came to take his blood, 97 00:08:20,104 --> 00:08:23,982 I had to be there and keep an eye on it. 98 00:08:26,485 --> 00:08:33,282 It became more and more clear that he mistrusted everybody. 99 00:08:33,408 --> 00:08:39,622 And one day there came one of the men of the press bureau, press office, 100 00:08:39,705 --> 00:08:42,749 and brought the news. 101 00:08:42,832 --> 00:08:49,671 I think he had heard it by radio from Reuters news agency, 102 00:08:49,799 --> 00:08:57,805 that Himmler had had negotiations with Count Bernadotte for capitulation 103 00:08:58,181 --> 00:09:00,474 and Hitler was very upset 104 00:09:00,557 --> 00:09:05,895 because he held Himmler for his most faithful paladin 105 00:09:05,980 --> 00:09:08,940 and the most reliable one, 106 00:09:09,024 --> 00:09:14,695 and now he saw that also he had tried to betray him. 107 00:09:14,779 --> 00:09:21,326 He remembered suddenly that the poison which he had to use for himself 108 00:09:21,411 --> 00:09:25,121 was given to him from one of Himmler's staff 109 00:09:25,206 --> 00:09:28,291 and he mistrusted that it may affect... 110 00:09:28,417 --> 00:09:32,711 Perhaps Himmler tried a dirty trick 111 00:09:32,796 --> 00:09:39,801 and gave him something that would only make him unconscious, 112 00:09:39,886 --> 00:09:45,349 so that he could be transported against his will out of the bunker 113 00:09:45,432 --> 00:09:48,268 and delivered to the enemy. 114 00:09:48,353 --> 00:09:50,728 And to test this, 115 00:09:50,812 --> 00:09:57,776 he ordered a doctor to try to test this poison capsule on the dog. 116 00:09:57,861 --> 00:10:03,116 I think next to Eva Braun, this one was next to him. 117 00:10:03,199 --> 00:10:07,661 So he said farewell and Blondi died very promptly. 118 00:10:07,744 --> 00:10:10,414 (speaking German) 119 00:10:10,497 --> 00:10:13,165 (translator) The telegram came from Goering, 120 00:10:13,291 --> 00:10:15,877 which said, "Mein Führer". 121 00:10:15,961 --> 00:10:19,213 No longer "My beloved Führer", 122 00:10:19,339 --> 00:10:22,133 but just "Mein Führer". 123 00:10:22,216 --> 00:10:26,095 "l know that you are now totally cut off 124 00:10:26,178 --> 00:10:31,725 and are no longer in possession of full freedom to command." 125 00:10:32,727 --> 00:10:38,731 "According to the law of succession, I will now step into your position 126 00:10:38,816 --> 00:10:46,780 and will undertake to represent Germany both in internal and external matters." 127 00:10:46,989 --> 00:10:49,075 "Yours, Goering." 128 00:10:52,494 --> 00:10:55,914 Hitler was so worked up over this. 129 00:10:56,040 --> 00:11:01,377 He sat in his chair and could not grasp it at first. 130 00:11:01,461 --> 00:11:07,799 This was added to by Bormann, who added fuel to the fire somewhat, 131 00:11:07,884 --> 00:11:15,641 so that Hitler then said, "To give me an ultimatum, that really is the end." 132 00:11:21,229 --> 00:11:26,233 It was sad to see how Hitler went down and down. 133 00:11:26,319 --> 00:11:32,530 He walked very stooped and bent, his hand shaking badly, 134 00:11:32,616 --> 00:11:39,203 which he used to put inside his jacket so that people didn't see it so much, 135 00:11:39,288 --> 00:11:42,498 and his dragging leg. 136 00:11:42,583 --> 00:11:47,337 And this whole mood spread over all around him. 137 00:11:47,420 --> 00:11:51,800 Nobody knew what they should do any more. 138 00:11:51,883 --> 00:11:53,759 It came in my mind 139 00:11:53,843 --> 00:12:00,264 that perhaps he always was the first commander of the army 140 00:12:00,350 --> 00:12:05,895 and the chief of all soldiers, 141 00:12:05,980 --> 00:12:12,819 so it would be more stylish and more logical 142 00:12:12,902 --> 00:12:18,030 to fight his last battle, his last fight, 143 00:12:18,116 --> 00:12:22,868 and to die on the honour 144 00:12:22,953 --> 00:12:28,082 and to fall with his soldiers. 145 00:12:29,750 --> 00:12:32,128 But he refused. 146 00:12:32,211 --> 00:12:36,465 "Yes, it would be right, but I cannot do that 147 00:12:36,550 --> 00:12:44,348 because my health state is too low and I am so trembling 148 00:12:44,432 --> 00:12:51,812 that I couldn't hold a pistol and couldn't handle it." 149 00:12:51,897 --> 00:12:56,775 "So.... And I am not sure that any one of my paladins 150 00:12:56,860 --> 00:13:04,866 would be able to give me the last, the death shot if I was only wounded, 151 00:13:05,035 --> 00:13:10,747 and I am not willing to fall in the hands of the enemy, 152 00:13:10,832 --> 00:13:13,749 neither alive nor dead." 153 00:13:14,334 --> 00:13:19,963 (narrator) By April 29, Soviet troops were fighting inside Berlin. 154 00:13:20,048 --> 00:13:23,091 Hitler began putting his affairs in order. 155 00:13:23,176 --> 00:13:28,262 He married his mistress Eva Braun, and then he summoned Traudl Junge 156 00:13:28,347 --> 00:13:31,850 to dictate to her his personal and political testaments. 157 00:13:31,975 --> 00:13:36,353 Then he began, "My last will." 158 00:13:36,438 --> 00:13:40,816 Then he dictated me at first his private will 159 00:13:40,901 --> 00:13:46,738 and afterwards his political testimony. 160 00:13:46,822 --> 00:13:51,743 And I must confess that I was... 161 00:13:51,827 --> 00:13:57,540 I was at first in a very excited mood, 162 00:13:57,625 --> 00:14:01,959 because I expected that I would be 163 00:14:02,046 --> 00:14:07,216 the first and the only one who knows, 164 00:14:07,300 --> 00:14:13,930 who is going to know the explanation and declaration 165 00:14:14,014 --> 00:14:21,938 why the war had come to this end and why Hitler couldn't stop 166 00:14:22,022 --> 00:14:26,024 and why the development and why the catastrophe... 167 00:14:26,110 --> 00:14:32,031 I thought, "Now comes the moment of the truth." 168 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:39,871 And I was heart bumping when I wrote down what Hitler said. 169 00:14:40,915 --> 00:14:43,791 But he used nothing new. 170 00:14:43,875 --> 00:14:49,379 He came out with his old phrases. 171 00:14:49,464 --> 00:14:54,926 He repeated his accusations, 172 00:14:55,011 --> 00:15:01,390 his swearing to the enemy 173 00:15:01,518 --> 00:15:05,227 and to the Jewish capitalistic system. 174 00:15:06,563 --> 00:15:11,942 And then he announced, 175 00:15:12,026 --> 00:15:15,904 in the second part of the political testament, 176 00:15:15,989 --> 00:15:18,532 he announced a new government. 177 00:15:20,325 --> 00:15:21,535 (speaking German) 178 00:15:21,618 --> 00:15:24,787 (translator) The next day, reports came in, 179 00:15:24,913 --> 00:15:31,544 and it was now clear to him that the Russians could break in at any moment. 180 00:15:33,087 --> 00:15:36,339 When Hitler said farewell to me, 181 00:15:36,424 --> 00:15:39,925 l... I went to him against him 182 00:15:40,012 --> 00:15:43,054 and he came toward me 183 00:15:43,139 --> 00:15:48,475 and his face was already dead. It was like a mask. 184 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:52,813 He looked at me, but I had the feeling he looked through me, 185 00:15:52,898 --> 00:15:55,524 and he gave me a shake of the hand 186 00:15:55,609 --> 00:15:58,693 and murmured something, but I didn't understand. 187 00:15:58,778 --> 00:16:04,157 It's... I had not understand what he said at last. 188 00:16:04,242 --> 00:16:07,327 But Eva Braun was beside him 189 00:16:07,410 --> 00:16:12,498 and he... shook hands to all the others. 190 00:16:12,582 --> 00:16:19,963 She embraced me really heartily and looked at me with a little sad smile 191 00:16:20,048 --> 00:16:22,882 and said, "Please try to go out of here." 192 00:16:22,967 --> 00:16:25,593 "Please try to come to Munich again 193 00:16:25,677 --> 00:16:32,933 and give my regards to my beloved Bavaria." 194 00:16:33,019 --> 00:16:36,645 And then he... 195 00:16:36,730 --> 00:16:41,901 she and Hitler shut the door and retired 196 00:16:41,985 --> 00:16:49,492 and I had an absolute need for... for fleeing, and l... l... 197 00:16:51,619 --> 00:16:55,829 I fled these stairs upside on the next level, 198 00:16:55,914 --> 00:16:58,582 and there I found the children of Goebbels. 199 00:16:58,707 --> 00:17:00,834 (speaking German) 200 00:17:00,919 --> 00:17:04,296 (translator) He said farewell to everybody 201 00:17:04,381 --> 00:17:08,050 and I was the last one he came to. 202 00:17:08,133 --> 00:17:14,179 Hitler said to me, "l have given the order to break out." 203 00:17:14,266 --> 00:17:20,270 "You should break out in groups, join one of these groups 204 00:17:20,353 --> 00:17:24,147 and try to get through to the West." 205 00:17:24,233 --> 00:17:31,405 Then I asked Hitler, "For whom should we fight on for now?" 206 00:17:31,489 --> 00:17:35,449 And to that Hitler said in a monotone, 207 00:17:35,534 --> 00:17:37,535 "For the coming man." 208 00:17:38,453 --> 00:17:44,500 I saluted him. He gave me his hand and I disappeared out of the room. 209 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:51,965 I was so upset, and for a moment I didn't know what to do. 210 00:17:52,050 --> 00:17:55,092 I ran over to the bodyguard. 211 00:17:55,177 --> 00:17:58,930 But after a short while, I went back 212 00:17:59,015 --> 00:18:04,227 because I assumed now it must surely have happened. 213 00:18:04,311 --> 00:18:08,438 Suddenly there was a bang. There was a shot. 214 00:18:08,523 --> 00:18:13,235 And it was obviously within the bunker, 215 00:18:13,319 --> 00:18:20,908 because the noises of the outside... shooting, 216 00:18:20,994 --> 00:18:25,037 we know how they sound. 217 00:18:25,122 --> 00:18:30,166 And the little boy of Goebbels, 218 00:18:31,377 --> 00:18:35,589 he noticed and he noticed that there was another sound. 219 00:18:35,672 --> 00:18:41,385 He said, "Oh, that was a bull-eye... that was a bull's-eye." 220 00:18:41,511 --> 00:18:46,265 And I thought, "Yes, you are right, that was really a bull's-eye." 221 00:18:46,391 --> 00:18:48,726 (speaking German) 222 00:18:50,270 --> 00:18:52,730 (translator) I went into Hitler's workroom 223 00:18:52,813 --> 00:18:55,523 with the former Reichsleiter Bormann, 224 00:18:55,608 --> 00:18:59,527 and this picture presented itself to us. 225 00:18:59,612 --> 00:19:03,281 Hitler was sitting on the left of the sofa 226 00:19:03,366 --> 00:19:09,661 with his face bent slightly forward and hanging down to the right. 227 00:19:09,746 --> 00:19:16,543 With the 7.65 he had shot himself in the right temple. 228 00:19:16,627 --> 00:19:20,130 The blood had run down onto the carpet, 229 00:19:20,215 --> 00:19:25,593 and from this pool of blood, a splash had got onto the sofa. 230 00:19:32,559 --> 00:19:37,062 Eva Braun was sitting on his right. 231 00:19:37,146 --> 00:19:42,025 Eva Braun had drawn both her legs up onto the sofa 232 00:19:42,110 --> 00:19:45,529 and was sitting there with cramped lips, 233 00:19:45,613 --> 00:19:51,992 so that it immediately became clear to us that she had taken cyanide. 234 00:19:53,496 --> 00:19:56,288 I took Hitler by his neck. 235 00:19:56,373 --> 00:20:01,126 Behind me were two other officers from the Escort Commando. 236 00:20:03,505 --> 00:20:05,755 And so we took Hitler's body 237 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:09,717 and proceeded with it into the park. 238 00:20:13,180 --> 00:20:18,767 In the park we laid the bodies together, next to each other 239 00:20:18,852 --> 00:20:22,146 and poured the available petrol over them. 240 00:20:24,023 --> 00:20:29,777 In the Reichschancellery Park, there was fire all around it 241 00:20:29,862 --> 00:20:31,738 and there was a draught, 242 00:20:31,822 --> 00:20:36,743 so that we could not set the corpse alight with an ordinary match. 243 00:20:41,039 --> 00:20:46,418 So I twisted a taper out of some paper with notes on it, 244 00:20:46,502 --> 00:20:49,504 and Reichsleiter Bormann, 245 00:20:49,589 --> 00:20:54,634 who meanwhile had also come upstairs with some others, 246 00:20:54,719 --> 00:20:59,763 like Dr Goebbels, Burgdorf and officers, 247 00:20:59,848 --> 00:21:06,020 lit the taper and I threw the taper onto the bodies 248 00:21:06,145 --> 00:21:10,941 and in an instant the corpses were set alight. 249 00:21:16,571 --> 00:21:22,243 As regards the burning of the bodies of Hitler and Eva Braun, 250 00:21:22,327 --> 00:21:27,456 I should like to add that the flames lit them for about half an hour, 251 00:21:30,042 --> 00:21:37,174 that only the woollen blankets and the clothes were affected by this and burnt, 252 00:21:37,257 --> 00:21:40,010 and not the body itself. 253 00:21:48,392 --> 00:21:55,273 It was clear to us afterwards that we should have laid the corpses on them. 254 00:21:55,358 --> 00:21:59,444 Then the bodies would have been totally charred. 255 00:22:06,493 --> 00:22:10,746 But this was in consequence of the whole mood. 256 00:22:10,830 --> 00:22:14,290 We couldn't collect our thoughts any more. 257 00:22:18,421 --> 00:22:24,426 And apart from that, the troops who should make the break-out with us 258 00:22:24,510 --> 00:22:27,971 were quartered in the Reichschancellery. 259 00:22:32,891 --> 00:22:34,851 If the soldiers had seen 260 00:22:34,936 --> 00:22:39,940 that we were burning Hitler's and Eva Braun's bodies - 261 00:22:40,024 --> 00:22:44,152 one can't just say Hitler's body - 262 00:22:44,236 --> 00:22:50,241 they would probably not have been prepared to carry out the break-out. 263 00:22:55,997 --> 00:22:58,331 (narrator) Even before Berlin fell, 264 00:22:58,416 --> 00:23:02,544 a Soviet investigating team had been given the job of finding Hitler 265 00:23:02,628 --> 00:23:04,837 or his corpse. 266 00:23:04,922 --> 00:23:09,883 lncomplete reports and poor photographs of their work were eventually released. 267 00:23:10,928 --> 00:23:12,929 This is supposed to be the very spot 268 00:23:13,013 --> 00:23:16,765 where they found the bodies of Hitler and of Eva Braun. 269 00:23:18,144 --> 00:23:24,982 The Russians never admitted that Hitler was dead until 1950, 270 00:23:25,065 --> 00:23:27,775 when they produced a film. 271 00:23:27,860 --> 00:23:34,823 They then revealed no details, 272 00:23:34,950 --> 00:23:38,745 although we now know that they had all the facts. 273 00:23:38,828 --> 00:23:46,834 The details they have revealed have been revealed in such a form 274 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:51,797 that it doesn't carry a great deal of conviction or not full conviction. 275 00:23:51,924 --> 00:23:54,217 (speaking Russian) 276 00:23:54,301 --> 00:23:56,509 (translator) On 4 May, 277 00:23:56,595 --> 00:24:01,264 I saw them lying in the garden of the lmperial Chancellery 278 00:24:01,350 --> 00:24:03,725 wrapped in a grey blanket. 279 00:24:06,562 --> 00:24:09,814 In fact, on 4 May, 280 00:24:09,899 --> 00:24:13,859 they were discovered in a bomb crater spattered with earth 281 00:24:13,944 --> 00:24:18,322 by Churakov, one of the soldiers in our group. 282 00:24:20,909 --> 00:24:27,289 Their bodies were dragged from there to the garden of the lmperial Chancellery. 283 00:24:28,416 --> 00:24:31,627 (narrator) The bodies were sent to Dr Faust Shkaravsky 284 00:24:31,711 --> 00:24:35,630 to be autopsied by himself and his five-man team. 285 00:24:35,757 --> 00:24:38,508 (speaks Russian) 286 00:24:38,592 --> 00:24:42,552 (translator) One should however say that Hitler's and Eva Braun's bodies 287 00:24:42,638 --> 00:24:44,180 were badly charred, 288 00:24:44,263 --> 00:24:49,226 unrecognisably so, especially that of Eva Braun. 289 00:24:49,310 --> 00:24:52,896 Hitler too was charred, but less so. 290 00:24:52,980 --> 00:24:56,232 From the outside, one couldn't have said who it was. 291 00:24:58,486 --> 00:25:00,403 You see, the extremities, 292 00:25:00,487 --> 00:25:03,615 that is the ends of the hands and lower part of the foot, 293 00:25:03,699 --> 00:25:07,159 were completely gone - they'd been burnt away. 294 00:25:07,244 --> 00:25:11,287 The torso itself was a dark colour, like some sort of coal. 295 00:25:11,373 --> 00:25:14,959 The crown of the head was extremely badly burnt in places, 296 00:25:15,042 --> 00:25:21,338 so much so that a lump of skin, sorry, of bone, had been burnt. 297 00:25:25,010 --> 00:25:26,760 We approached the examination 298 00:25:26,845 --> 00:25:31,055 with the highest degree of care that it was possible to observe. 299 00:25:31,142 --> 00:25:35,644 Everything that was possible to be seen from the autopsy we examined, 300 00:25:35,729 --> 00:25:38,105 and then we took samples of fluids 301 00:25:38,230 --> 00:25:42,109 and despatched it all to the district medical research laboratory, 302 00:25:42,234 --> 00:25:46,905 which was called, as far as I can remember, cellar 291. 303 00:25:52,453 --> 00:25:53,911 They did the examination 304 00:25:53,995 --> 00:25:58,123 and advised me by telegraph either one or two days later - 305 00:25:58,207 --> 00:26:00,833 I don't remember the date too well - 306 00:26:00,918 --> 00:26:06,214 that the traces found were either cyanide or cyanide compounds. 307 00:26:11,552 --> 00:26:15,264 The autopsy for Hitler, for instance, which they have published, 308 00:26:15,348 --> 00:26:18,308 has never been published in the original Russian. 309 00:26:18,393 --> 00:26:22,729 It has only been published in German and English. 310 00:26:22,813 --> 00:26:28,526 It was released in... an unusual way, 311 00:26:28,611 --> 00:26:33,448 in a way which, perhaps unfairly, seems to deprive it of authority. 312 00:26:33,573 --> 00:26:36,200 (narrator) Here, in Russian, 313 00:26:36,325 --> 00:26:39,661 is Shkaravsky's typed copy of the autopsy report. 314 00:26:39,746 --> 00:26:44,625 It states, "On the body, considerably damaged by fire, 315 00:26:44,709 --> 00:26:47,960 no visible signs of severe lethal injuries or illnesses 316 00:26:48,045 --> 00:26:49,545 could be detected." 317 00:26:49,631 --> 00:26:53,966 "The presence in the oral cavity of the remnants of a crushed glass ampoule; 318 00:26:54,051 --> 00:26:57,719 the marked smell of bitter almonds emanating from the bodies 319 00:26:57,805 --> 00:27:00,598 and the forensic chemical test of internal organs, 320 00:27:00,681 --> 00:27:03,683 which established the presence of cyanide compounds, 321 00:27:03,810 --> 00:27:06,645 permit the commission to arrive at the conclusion 322 00:27:06,771 --> 00:27:11,942 that death in this instance was caused by poisoning with cyanide compounds." 323 00:27:12,025 --> 00:27:17,238 The report also says that "Part of the occipital vault is missing." 324 00:27:17,321 --> 00:27:19,280 Since this is part of the skull, 325 00:27:19,366 --> 00:27:24,411 some people say it leaves open the possibility that Hitler was also shot. 326 00:27:25,872 --> 00:27:30,040 I've read the autopsy report. I expect it's mainly directed by Shkaravsky. 327 00:27:30,168 --> 00:27:31,626 But he had assistance, 328 00:27:31,710 --> 00:27:35,129 and I would regard it as a very full and searching autopsy. 329 00:27:35,256 --> 00:27:38,424 The postmortem appears to have been a really searching one 330 00:27:38,508 --> 00:27:41,510 and to have been thorough by ordinary standards. 331 00:27:41,595 --> 00:27:43,761 (narrator) But was this body Hitler's? 332 00:27:43,848 --> 00:27:45,931 The corpse had only one testicle, 333 00:27:46,015 --> 00:27:49,393 and the body was not as tall as Hitler was known to be. 334 00:27:49,518 --> 00:27:51,728 (speaking Russian) 335 00:27:51,812 --> 00:27:54,438 (translator) I repeat, the body was badly charred 336 00:27:54,523 --> 00:27:57,483 and the extremities were even more charred. 337 00:27:57,567 --> 00:28:02,154 And so, to speak of a difference of six, seven or even ten centimetres, 338 00:28:02,239 --> 00:28:05,366 to ascertain it accurately would be beyond our scope. 339 00:28:05,449 --> 00:28:08,953 And this was why we wrote "approximately" in the end. 340 00:28:09,036 --> 00:28:15,667 And even if in life he measured 1.75 and in the autopsy he only measured 1.65, 341 00:28:15,750 --> 00:28:19,421 I don't see this as being anything significant. 342 00:28:19,504 --> 00:28:24,633 A body shrinks when burned and I think the difference is too small to matter. 343 00:28:24,759 --> 00:28:27,636 (speaking Russian) 344 00:28:30,348 --> 00:28:33,392 (translator) There was indeed one genital missing, 345 00:28:33,475 --> 00:28:36,145 which we discovered quite by chance, 346 00:28:36,228 --> 00:28:39,522 but it had nothing to do with the case in hand. 347 00:28:43,611 --> 00:28:47,155 We usually treat this extremely rare occurrence 348 00:28:47,238 --> 00:28:50,032 by looking in the sperm duct itself. 349 00:28:50,116 --> 00:28:52,075 But it wasn't there. 350 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:58,247 Then we looked in the lower intestine regions, but it wasn't there either. 351 00:28:58,333 --> 00:29:02,586 So we came to the conclusion that it was in fact absent. 352 00:29:03,544 --> 00:29:06,047 To find one testicle only, 353 00:29:06,131 --> 00:29:10,509 which I was amused to see in the report was found quite by accident - 354 00:29:10,594 --> 00:29:13,845 it doesn't appear to have been searched for - is not uncommon. 355 00:29:13,931 --> 00:29:17,933 They did search properly, but it's not uncommon to find only one testicle. 356 00:29:18,016 --> 00:29:21,686 I don't think that's a very important point of identification. 357 00:29:21,770 --> 00:29:25,398 And we don't know if Hitler had only one testicle or not. 358 00:29:25,482 --> 00:29:32,279 The ordinary methods of identifying a dead body as a particular person - 359 00:29:32,364 --> 00:29:35,031 their clothing, papers, documents, 360 00:29:36,660 --> 00:29:39,870 credit cards and things in their pockets, 361 00:29:39,954 --> 00:29:42,956 the features, which can be recognised by relatives, 362 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:44,875 colour of the hair and eyes, 363 00:29:44,959 --> 00:29:49,629 and fingerprints, if it comes to detail of that order - 364 00:29:49,755 --> 00:29:53,549 are of course destroyed when the body is subjected to fire. 365 00:29:53,634 --> 00:29:59,846 When it's scorched badly or is charred, 366 00:29:59,972 --> 00:30:03,724 almost all those things disappear, 367 00:30:03,811 --> 00:30:08,605 and you are left with a study of what is sometimes nearly a skeleton. 368 00:30:08,690 --> 00:30:12,733 So you can only identify a person as being male or female, 369 00:30:12,819 --> 00:30:16,778 a certain height and probably somewhere near a certain age. 370 00:30:16,863 --> 00:30:19,489 The fingerprints will have disappeared. 371 00:30:19,573 --> 00:30:26,204 Now you also, because the teeth tend to be preserved from fire inside the mouth, 372 00:30:26,289 --> 00:30:28,582 have one other source of information. 373 00:30:28,666 --> 00:30:35,547 The teeth, especially if they include a lot of detail of conservation, 374 00:30:35,630 --> 00:30:40,884 repair work, of fillings and bridges and other similar things, 375 00:30:40,969 --> 00:30:44,596 can provide a mine of information about identification. 376 00:30:45,222 --> 00:30:47,182 (speaking Russian) 377 00:30:47,266 --> 00:30:49,852 (translator) The teeth were so unusual 378 00:30:49,935 --> 00:30:54,105 that their identification would mean the identification of the corpse. 379 00:30:58,193 --> 00:31:00,736 One should also comment that in the upper jaw 380 00:31:00,820 --> 00:31:04,948 on the left-hand side, I think - I don't remember for certain - 381 00:31:05,034 --> 00:31:09,829 well, high up in the left-hand jaw, there was a smooth file mark. 382 00:31:11,997 --> 00:31:16,292 It was felt that some mistake had been made in the filing of the dentures 383 00:31:16,419 --> 00:31:20,629 and a stomatologist had filed off a piece of the bridge. 384 00:31:24,008 --> 00:31:28,012 Taken all in all, we paid considerable attention to the teeth. 385 00:31:29,263 --> 00:31:32,932 Of course, for those to have any value, like fingerprints, 386 00:31:33,017 --> 00:31:34,726 you must have records. 387 00:31:34,810 --> 00:31:39,064 You must have a dental surgeon who has been careful to keep full records, 388 00:31:39,148 --> 00:31:43,692 and you must have photographs and x-rays. 389 00:31:43,818 --> 00:31:46,486 And it is when you can, 390 00:31:46,571 --> 00:31:50,698 by making careful note of the details in your dead body, 391 00:31:50,785 --> 00:31:52,658 take these to a dental surgeon, 392 00:31:52,743 --> 00:31:56,871 whom you suspect to have looked after that supposed body, 393 00:31:56,955 --> 00:32:03,044 by comparing the two and finding that they do match in detail, 394 00:32:03,170 --> 00:32:07,590 then you can be as certain as you could with fingerprints 395 00:32:07,674 --> 00:32:13,970 that that is the body of this person whose records that dental surgeon has. 396 00:32:14,055 --> 00:32:18,308 (narrator) Hitler did have a personal dentist, Hugo Blaschke. 397 00:32:18,392 --> 00:32:20,060 No one could find him. 398 00:32:20,143 --> 00:32:23,396 So the investigators began the search for his assistant. 399 00:32:23,523 --> 00:32:26,566 (speaking Russian) 400 00:32:29,402 --> 00:32:33,447 (translator) Käthe Hausermann was the assistant of Professor Blaschke, 401 00:32:33,532 --> 00:32:36,283 who was Hitler's personal dentist. 402 00:32:36,367 --> 00:32:38,660 In a medical investigation, 403 00:32:38,744 --> 00:32:43,247 her participation was an extremely important link in the chain 404 00:32:43,332 --> 00:32:47,127 because nobody else could have determined Hitler's teeth, 405 00:32:47,210 --> 00:32:51,004 which were in perfectly good order, to such a degree. 406 00:32:51,131 --> 00:32:52,965 And this being the case, 407 00:32:53,091 --> 00:32:57,427 her place in the investigation was extremely important. 408 00:33:02,267 --> 00:33:05,184 We hardly hoped to find anybody of assistance 409 00:33:05,310 --> 00:33:08,229 in the destruction and fire of Berlin, 410 00:33:08,355 --> 00:33:12,858 the city which had just been witness to the fall of the Third Empire. 411 00:33:12,943 --> 00:33:15,902 It was still enveloped in flames. 412 00:33:15,986 --> 00:33:19,239 This city, whose roads were so wrecked 413 00:33:19,323 --> 00:33:23,618 that our cars couldn't go to and fro across the town. 414 00:33:27,290 --> 00:33:33,419 In Berlin we literally dug in the heaps of rubble to unearth her. 415 00:33:33,503 --> 00:33:38,257 One could say that our efforts have been accompanied by a stroke of luck. 416 00:33:39,509 --> 00:33:42,595 Without her we could hardly have had 417 00:33:42,678 --> 00:33:47,098 such an exhaustively full and complete proof. 418 00:33:49,602 --> 00:33:50,684 (speaking Russian) 419 00:33:50,770 --> 00:33:53,313 (translator) It was I who, both as an expert 420 00:33:53,396 --> 00:33:55,689 and as the chairman of the commission, 421 00:33:55,774 --> 00:33:59,652 had to have a long conversation with Käthe Hausermann. 422 00:33:59,736 --> 00:34:02,821 Her first approach to us was one of trepidation. 423 00:34:02,906 --> 00:34:07,034 She feared that the Soviet doctors would treat her badly. 424 00:34:07,117 --> 00:34:10,703 But then told her that I also was a doctor, just like herself, 425 00:34:10,788 --> 00:34:16,000 interested in purely medical questions and therefore she could feel at ease. 426 00:34:17,460 --> 00:34:21,547 The table at which I was sitting had a flask of water, sweets, 427 00:34:21,631 --> 00:34:24,800 Russian cigarettes and cigars on it. 428 00:34:24,884 --> 00:34:27,135 I asked her if she wanted to smoke 429 00:34:27,220 --> 00:34:31,556 and an atmosphere both businesslike and calm was established. 430 00:34:33,100 --> 00:34:36,644 When I was working during the war, 431 00:34:36,728 --> 00:34:42,066 at the period in question, 1942, '43, '44, '45, 432 00:34:42,150 --> 00:34:46,320 I had several London bombing bodies to - 433 00:34:46,403 --> 00:34:50,908 the victims of London bombing - to identify, and we used dental details. 434 00:34:50,992 --> 00:34:55,870 And I wouldn't have thought of setting out in the mortuary 435 00:34:55,954 --> 00:34:58,413 for identification of a body 436 00:34:58,500 --> 00:35:02,834 without the assistance of a dental surgeon and his records. 437 00:35:02,919 --> 00:35:06,922 I might myself, if we were working under difficulty, 438 00:35:07,006 --> 00:35:13,595 as the Russians may well have been at the 1945 autopsy on Hitler, 439 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:19,308 I would myself, perhaps, have to make a photographic and drawing record 440 00:35:19,393 --> 00:35:21,561 of the teeth as I saw them. 441 00:35:21,645 --> 00:35:23,938 But I would certainly retain those teeth 442 00:35:24,022 --> 00:35:27,607 and see that an expert dental surgeon, used to dental recording, 443 00:35:27,692 --> 00:35:30,236 saw them later to confirm my findings. 444 00:35:30,361 --> 00:35:32,904 (speaking Russian) 445 00:35:33,030 --> 00:35:36,615 (translator) I suggested that she should relate all that she knew, 446 00:35:36,701 --> 00:35:40,870 and in those instances where there was a lack of clarity in what she had said, 447 00:35:40,954 --> 00:35:43,831 I posed her several questions. 448 00:35:43,915 --> 00:35:48,377 When I realised that she really was acquainted with Hitler's dentures, 449 00:35:48,461 --> 00:35:50,755 that to say that this was indeed a person 450 00:35:50,839 --> 00:35:52,922 who had dealings with the dentures, 451 00:35:53,008 --> 00:35:56,092 I asked her additional questions. 452 00:35:56,261 --> 00:36:04,226 The team consisted of some half a dozen army pathologists, 453 00:36:04,310 --> 00:36:11,440 none of whom, even Lt Col Shkaravsky himself, who was in charge, 454 00:36:11,525 --> 00:36:14,359 none of whom had special forensic experience 455 00:36:14,443 --> 00:36:16,529 and none of whom, to my knowledge, 456 00:36:16,612 --> 00:36:20,073 had ever had this exercise to perform before. 457 00:36:20,157 --> 00:36:25,328 They made an autopsy which, from the record, looked thorough enough, 458 00:36:25,412 --> 00:36:29,040 but they failed to include in their autopsy 459 00:36:29,124 --> 00:36:36,130 more than a very poor drawing of the upper and lower teeth 460 00:36:36,214 --> 00:36:41,343 and of bridge work, which were still lying in situ. 461 00:36:41,427 --> 00:36:44,304 It would not be enough for a pathologist, 462 00:36:44,388 --> 00:36:51,435 especially if he were doing routine army pathology, to indulge himself 463 00:36:51,519 --> 00:36:56,148 in what is a special medical legal exercise of identification 464 00:36:56,232 --> 00:36:58,567 in which he knows, if he's had experience, 465 00:36:58,651 --> 00:37:02,321 he must use the services of a skilled dental surgeon, 466 00:37:02,404 --> 00:37:06,240 very often a dental surgeon whose work has become forensic 467 00:37:06,325 --> 00:37:10,537 or who may have turned over to forensic identification work entirely. 468 00:37:10,662 --> 00:37:14,082 (speaking Russian) 469 00:37:14,165 --> 00:37:16,583 (translator) As I talked to Käthe Hausermann, 470 00:37:16,667 --> 00:37:19,086 I sketched the teeth of a human being. 471 00:37:19,170 --> 00:37:21,046 Here's the right-hand side. 472 00:37:21,130 --> 00:37:26,051 Here I sketched the teeth in the upper jaw and here the lower jaw. 473 00:37:26,135 --> 00:37:29,846 And you can clearly see the smooth edge of the teeth. 474 00:37:31,681 --> 00:37:34,475 Then I showed this sketch to Käthe Hausermann 475 00:37:34,559 --> 00:37:38,771 and said that here I'd found the two steel pins. 476 00:37:38,855 --> 00:37:41,732 But she protested, saying there had to be three. 477 00:37:43,150 --> 00:37:47,862 It's incredibly poor. It's a schoolboy diagram. 478 00:37:47,947 --> 00:37:51,282 It shows a nine-tooth gold bridge here. 479 00:37:51,366 --> 00:37:55,995 It even shows in front the little pegs which were hung on the four, 480 00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,832 the left lateral and a right lateral incisor here. 481 00:37:59,916 --> 00:38:03,376 But really the detail is very difficult to pick up. 482 00:38:03,461 --> 00:38:08,006 It's small and it's indeterminate, though I can't say it's inaccurate. 483 00:38:08,633 --> 00:38:10,467 (speaking Russian) 484 00:38:10,551 --> 00:38:13,344 (translator) And when the conversation had ended, 485 00:38:13,428 --> 00:38:17,056 and I was convinced that she really did know these teeth well, 486 00:38:17,140 --> 00:38:20,851 I showed her the dentures which had been extracted from Hitler. 487 00:38:22,855 --> 00:38:26,773 Her first reaction was one of extreme surprise. 488 00:38:26,859 --> 00:38:31,319 She then realised that our conversation had not been an abstract one, 489 00:38:31,404 --> 00:38:34,406 that we really had autopsied Hitler's corpse 490 00:38:34,490 --> 00:38:37,783 and that it had been examined by Soviet specialists 491 00:38:37,869 --> 00:38:41,829 and that she was confronted with Hitler's very dentures. 492 00:38:43,290 --> 00:38:49,627 She then became less distraught and we calmly, dispassionately examined them. 493 00:38:51,965 --> 00:38:55,508 Then she started off showing me these steel pins, 494 00:38:55,593 --> 00:38:58,220 and when we examined the teeth in greater detail, 495 00:38:58,304 --> 00:39:03,974 she turned out to be right - there were indeed three of these pins to be seen. 496 00:39:04,059 --> 00:39:06,560 And here they are pictured on the right. 497 00:39:10,815 --> 00:39:15,194 This convinced the commission, and more so myself, 498 00:39:15,277 --> 00:39:18,780 that we had indeed unearthed Hitler's body. 499 00:39:21,492 --> 00:39:26,829 The evidence that I have been involved with in studying Hitler's remains 500 00:39:26,913 --> 00:39:30,666 is based on three types of observation. 501 00:39:30,750 --> 00:39:35,754 First of all, the Russian autopsy report, published in 1968, 502 00:39:35,838 --> 00:39:38,631 revealed certain types of dental bridge work 503 00:39:38,716 --> 00:39:43,887 which are critical for identification on a body that was destroyed by fire. 504 00:39:45,306 --> 00:39:49,184 N umber two, in the National Archives in Washington DC, 505 00:39:49,267 --> 00:39:51,894 I was able to study in detail 506 00:39:51,978 --> 00:39:55,647 the interrogation report of Hitler's dentist, 507 00:39:55,732 --> 00:39:58,274 Dr Hugo Blaschke, who is now dead. 508 00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:02,153 And he described in great detail the state of his dentition, 509 00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:04,739 his treatment and so forth. 510 00:40:04,822 --> 00:40:08,493 And thirdly, I was very fortunate, after a considerable search, 511 00:40:08,576 --> 00:40:12,163 to locate five x-rays which were known to exist 512 00:40:12,248 --> 00:40:17,751 from the British study of Hitler's last days, but which had not been found. 513 00:40:17,835 --> 00:40:22,381 And I located this in the branch of the National Archives 514 00:40:22,465 --> 00:40:25,217 in the little town of Suitland in Maryland. 515 00:40:25,342 --> 00:40:31,097 And I'm showing two of the five x-rays here taken by the head and neck experts 516 00:40:31,181 --> 00:40:34,475 who treated Hitler after the assassination attempt. 517 00:40:35,811 --> 00:40:39,689 This picture was taken in September and this in October. 518 00:40:39,772 --> 00:40:41,273 I want to point out, 519 00:40:41,357 --> 00:40:44,568 though they were taken at two different times and locations 520 00:40:44,694 --> 00:40:48,070 by two different doctors, they are from the identical persons, 521 00:40:48,155 --> 00:40:52,659 seeing the very typical fingerprints, as it were, of the sinus outlines 522 00:40:52,743 --> 00:40:55,661 and very characteristic bridge work 523 00:40:55,746 --> 00:40:59,540 both in this picture and in that picture. 524 00:40:59,624 --> 00:41:02,710 Lastly, I have prepared a model 525 00:41:02,794 --> 00:41:09,465 which summarises the findings of the dentist's report, 526 00:41:09,550 --> 00:41:12,594 the x-rays and the Russian findings, 527 00:41:12,679 --> 00:41:17,347 and I believe that this represents the true state of affairs of Hitler's teeth, 528 00:41:17,433 --> 00:41:19,934 made up here in gold and porcelain. 529 00:41:20,018 --> 00:41:24,521 Among that, this very discoloured left front tooth here, 530 00:41:24,605 --> 00:41:26,565 which can be seen in some pictures, 531 00:41:26,649 --> 00:41:31,903 although it was camouflaged most of the time by his moustache, 532 00:41:31,988 --> 00:41:35,865 and the very characteristic bridge work in the lower jaw as well 533 00:41:35,949 --> 00:41:39,618 and various types of pathology in his front teeth. 534 00:41:39,745 --> 00:41:43,664 Sognnaes and Ström, when they drew, 535 00:41:43,789 --> 00:41:46,583 of course by now, with the assistance of x-rays, 536 00:41:46,668 --> 00:41:49,085 which had been discovered in Washington, 537 00:41:49,171 --> 00:41:54,634 have absolutely every single piece of detail in a single diagram, 538 00:41:54,717 --> 00:41:56,885 the diagram in their article. 539 00:41:56,969 --> 00:42:01,305 It shows not only the presence of, the number of teeth in, 540 00:42:01,389 --> 00:42:05,351 the exact shape of and attachment of the three bridges, 541 00:42:05,435 --> 00:42:08,395 the nine-tooth in the upper jaw, the two in the lower, 542 00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:12,982 it shows the remarkable shape and attachment of the lingual bar bridge 543 00:42:13,067 --> 00:42:16,069 in the right lower jaw and draws special attention 544 00:42:16,195 --> 00:42:18,237 to the left upper-central incisor, 545 00:42:18,322 --> 00:42:22,909 with its curious Richmond gold crown and this central translucent face. 546 00:42:22,993 --> 00:42:27,246 I cannot conceive of anybody now not being utterly convinced 547 00:42:27,330 --> 00:42:33,210 that these are the teeth of Hitler and that this was Hitler's skull. 548 00:42:33,294 --> 00:42:37,214 There could be, I think, no conceivable objection. 549 00:42:37,298 --> 00:42:39,716 There is not a single point which doesn't fit 550 00:42:39,841 --> 00:42:42,301 and there are very many points which do. 551 00:42:42,428 --> 00:42:48,515 It would be impossible, in my opinion, to recreate this in another individual. 552 00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:50,893 So that I disregard the possibility 553 00:42:50,977 --> 00:42:53,771 of there being a double that the Russians autopsied. 554 00:42:53,854 --> 00:42:58,942 They did in fact find the body and where Trevor-Roper suggested it may be found, 555 00:42:59,026 --> 00:43:03,905 outside a bunker in Berlin, and they autopsied the real Hitler. 556 00:43:04,531 --> 00:43:09,953 The only question which is still debated, in my opinion, 557 00:43:10,036 --> 00:43:12,537 or can legitimately be debated, 558 00:43:12,623 --> 00:43:15,832 is whether Hitler took poison or shot himself. 559 00:43:17,128 --> 00:43:21,964 All the evidence that I had in 1945 was that he shot himself. 560 00:43:22,966 --> 00:43:27,969 The Russians have always maintained that he took cyanide. 561 00:43:30,596 --> 00:43:36,184 I stated in 1945, on the evidence of one of the German authorities, 562 00:43:36,269 --> 00:43:40,105 that it was possible that although he had shot himself, 563 00:43:40,189 --> 00:43:43,900 he had also put a poison capsule in his mouth to make sure. 564 00:43:44,026 --> 00:43:46,569 And that seems to me quite possible. 565 00:43:46,696 --> 00:43:47,696 (speaks Russian) 566 00:43:47,779 --> 00:43:49,947 (translator) A small piece of the skull 567 00:43:50,072 --> 00:43:53,993 of approximately ten by seven centimetres was missing. 568 00:43:54,119 --> 00:43:56,578 The edge of the missing portion was charred, 569 00:43:56,663 --> 00:44:00,916 which meant that this was a result of the burning and not of injury. 570 00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:04,252 I must stress that the brain itself was well preserved 571 00:44:04,336 --> 00:44:07,213 and that there was no damage to the brain. 572 00:44:07,298 --> 00:44:10,549 Neither was there damage to other portions of the skull. 573 00:44:10,634 --> 00:44:15,053 Neither the nasal portion, the cheekbones, etc. 574 00:44:15,138 --> 00:44:16,805 In a word, there is, 575 00:44:16,890 --> 00:44:19,684 there was no damage at all, 576 00:44:19,768 --> 00:44:23,437 so there is no proof of damage by firearms. 577 00:44:24,397 --> 00:44:27,107 The only positive things that emerged from autopsy 578 00:44:27,191 --> 00:44:30,110 are that glass was found in the mouth 579 00:44:30,194 --> 00:44:35,281 and that hydrocyanic acid was detected by analysis afterwards in the body. 580 00:44:35,365 --> 00:44:39,368 I find this a little surprising if there was great heat for some time, 581 00:44:39,453 --> 00:44:42,747 as there was - petrol was poured more than once on the body - 582 00:44:42,830 --> 00:44:48,376 for cyanide evaporates very quickly, and I'm a little surprised at that. 583 00:44:48,461 --> 00:44:50,462 But glass was found in the mouth. 584 00:44:50,545 --> 00:44:54,298 I think death must have due to the crushing of a cyanide capsule, 585 00:44:54,382 --> 00:44:58,719 which we know was common practice among the higher Nazis. 586 00:44:59,597 --> 00:45:01,554 We have to recognise the fact 587 00:45:01,641 --> 00:45:07,895 that all the German witnesses do bear witness about the shooting. 588 00:45:07,978 --> 00:45:13,066 We can't ignore that. They are just as good witnesses as the Russians. 589 00:45:13,150 --> 00:45:20,615 The evidence on the Russian side is the autopsy which they've produced. 590 00:45:20,699 --> 00:45:25,077 But I can't regard it as final, 591 00:45:25,161 --> 00:45:30,707 firstly because they have produced it in so propagandist a form 592 00:45:30,791 --> 00:45:34,336 that it, to some extent, cancels itself out. 593 00:45:34,461 --> 00:45:37,840 Mr Bezymenski, a Russian journalist, 594 00:45:37,923 --> 00:45:43,010 whom the Russians have employed to publish these documents, 595 00:45:43,178 --> 00:45:49,892 makes it quite clear that he regards suicide by poison as the death of a dog 596 00:45:49,976 --> 00:45:51,685 and a cowardly death, 597 00:45:51,811 --> 00:45:55,563 and suicide by shooting as a soldier's death, 598 00:45:55,648 --> 00:45:59,650 and that he is anxious to show that Hitler did not die a soldier's death, 599 00:45:59,735 --> 00:46:01,235 but a dog's death. 600 00:46:01,319 --> 00:46:04,321 That shows a kind of political motivation 601 00:46:04,406 --> 00:46:08,951 which rather detracts from his objectivity. 602 00:46:10,286 --> 00:46:15,374 There is a truly extraordinary passage in Bezymenski's work 603 00:46:15,457 --> 00:46:23,172 in which, having argued throughout that Hitler only took a poison capsule, 604 00:46:23,257 --> 00:46:28,845 he then suddenly produces a theory which has no evidence or probability in it 605 00:46:28,971 --> 00:46:32,764 and is given as a second-hand speculation, 606 00:46:32,850 --> 00:46:40,022 that Heinz Linge afterwards shot Hitler when he was dead. 607 00:46:41,189 --> 00:46:43,983 Well, what is the point of this 608 00:46:44,067 --> 00:46:48,529 unless there was some evidence that Hitler had been shot? 609 00:46:48,615 --> 00:46:51,948 I can't see what is the point of this speculation, 610 00:46:52,034 --> 00:46:54,452 especially since the Russians had Linge 611 00:46:54,535 --> 00:46:57,454 in their possession as a prisoner for nine years. 612 00:46:57,538 --> 00:47:02,083 They could easily have established this fact if it were true 613 00:47:02,168 --> 00:47:07,713 without producing it as a second-hand speculation ascribed to Linge. 614 00:47:07,798 --> 00:47:10,841 So I think that they, even in this matter, 615 00:47:10,927 --> 00:47:13,510 the Russians have created mystification 616 00:47:13,595 --> 00:47:15,721 and I think the balance of evidence, 617 00:47:15,847 --> 00:47:19,892 which is what one has to go on when the evidence conflicts, 618 00:47:19,976 --> 00:47:21,685 that the balance of evidence, 619 00:47:21,769 --> 00:47:27,523 taking account of the fact that the German witnesses had no reason to lie 620 00:47:27,608 --> 00:47:32,654 and were perfectly objective in their accounts to me, 621 00:47:32,737 --> 00:47:36,531 the balance of evidence is that he shot himself. 622 00:47:36,658 --> 00:47:40,535 As regards to the firearm, I find no evidence of this in the report. 623 00:47:40,620 --> 00:47:45,624 Shkaravsky doesn't find a hole in the roof of the mouth or either temple. 624 00:47:45,708 --> 00:47:48,710 Part of the skull was missing, but it commonly is in fire - 625 00:47:48,794 --> 00:47:51,171 it flakes off or is destroyed by fire. 626 00:47:51,254 --> 00:47:55,342 And the brain was in good condition with no bullet track through it. 627 00:47:55,425 --> 00:48:00,054 I don't think Hitler can have been shot. Certainly not through the head. 55913

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