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Nobody joins a cult.
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Nobody joins something
they think is going to hurt them.
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You join a religious organization,
you join a political movement,
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and you join with people
that you really like.
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I think in everything
that I tell you about Jim Jones,
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there is going to be a paradox.
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Having this vision
to change the world,
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but having this
whole undercurrent of dysfunction
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that was underneath that vision.
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Some people see
a great deal of God in my body.
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They see Christ in me, a hope of glory.
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He said, �If you see me as your friend,
I�ll be your friend.
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As you see me as your father,
I�ll be your father.�
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He said, �If you see me as your God,
I�ll be your God.�
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Jim Jones talked about
going to the Promised Land
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and then, pretty soon, we were seeing
film footage of Jonestown.
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Rice, black-eyed peas, Kool-Aid.
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We all wanted to go.
I wanted to go.
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00:02:08,803 --> 00:02:14,237
Peoples Temple truly had the potential
to be something big
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and powerful and great,
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and yet for whatever reason,
Jim took the other road.
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On the night of the 17th,
it was still a vibrant community.
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I would never have imagined that
24 hours later, they would all be dead.
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Die with a degree of dignity!
Don�t lay down with tears and agony!
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It�s nothing to death.
It�s just stepping over into another plane.
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Don�t, don�t be this way.
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I vividly remember the first time
that I met Jim Jones.
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00:03:01,948 --> 00:03:05,346
My sister Carolyn
had invited my parents
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and my younger sister and I
to visit her in Potter Valley.
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We came and there was
this strange man in her house,
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and her husband wasn�t there.
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Annie and I were sent out
to go on a walk.
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When we came back,
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00:03:19,701 --> 00:03:24,061
something had happened.
Something terrible had happened,
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because everyone had red eyes
except for Jim Jones.
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We didn�t really get the story
until we were in the car going home.
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He was carrying on an adulterous
relationship with my sister.
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And because his wife
couldn�t relate to him as a wife...
39
00:03:43,193 --> 00:03:45,442
that Carolyn
had taken over that role.
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Everything was plausible,
except in retrospect,
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00:03:49,270 --> 00:03:52,017
the whole thing seems
absolutely bizarre.
42
00:04:07,390 --> 00:04:10,143
The first time
I visited Peoples Temple,
43
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I drove at the urging of a friend,
a co-worker, to Redwood Valley.
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We all got suited down,
neck-tied and everything.
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You know, and we were sharp.
46
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As soon as I walked into
the San Francisco temple, I was home.
47
00:04:36,761 --> 00:04:40,939
I was one of those kind of guys...
that I used drugs.
48
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I was an alcoholic.
I drunk alcohol and stuff like that.
49
00:04:44,635 --> 00:04:49,526
And... and all these people
that were like my age,
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00:04:49,527 --> 00:04:51,827
they were clean.
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00:04:51,927 --> 00:04:55,167
Before I came here,
I was taking�LSD, marijuana,
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every type of dope
you can imagine.
53
00:04:57,473 --> 00:05:00,501
Without our pastor, Jim Jones,
to teach me the right way,
54
00:05:00,502 --> 00:05:02,528
I would not be in college right now.
55
00:05:02,529 --> 00:05:06,504
And for me, that was like,
�Wow, man.� I liked that.
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00:05:06,588 --> 00:05:08,831
Thank you very much, thank you.
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00:05:09,685 --> 00:05:13,243
There was an interracial group.
The choir was interracial
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and they used to sing this song:
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�Never heard a man
speak like this man before.
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00:05:18,496 --> 00:05:22,069
Never heard a man
speak like this man before.
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00:05:22,111 --> 00:05:26,050
All the days of my life,
ever since I been born,
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00:05:26,123 --> 00:05:30,467
I never heard a man
speak like this man before.�
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00:05:30,732 --> 00:05:35,027
After they sang one or two songs,
the whole place was lit up.
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00:05:48,761 --> 00:05:50,788
The Peoples Temple services,
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they had life, they had soul,
they had power.
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00:05:55,466 --> 00:05:58,258
We were alive in those services.
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00:06:04,426 --> 00:06:08,138
I would be up jumping in the balcony
and clapping my hands.
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00:06:09,103 --> 00:06:12,692
If you came in as a stranger
and didn�t know anything about the politics,
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00:06:12,751 --> 00:06:17,542
you were thinking you were entering
an old-time religion service.
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00:06:22,081 --> 00:06:26,150
By the time Jones did come out
to do his speaking,
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the table had already been set.
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I represent divine principle,
total equality,
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a society where people own
all things in common.
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Where there is no rich or poor.
Where there are no races.
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Wherever there is people struggling
for justice and righteousness,
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there I am.
And there I am involved.
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What he spoke about were
things that were in our hearts.
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The government was not
taking care of the people.
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There were too many poor people
out there. There were poor children.
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00:06:54,141 --> 00:06:56,067
The world is like a human family.
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The little child may not be able to go
and draw a paycheck,
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but the father
guarantees the childcare.
83
00:07:01,118 --> 00:07:03,536
The grandmother
may not be able to work anymore,
84
00:07:03,539 --> 00:07:07,556
but the father and mother
guarantees her the right to live.
85
00:07:08,370 --> 00:07:11,538
Every single person felt
that they had a purpose there
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and that they were
exceptionally special.
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00:07:13,939 --> 00:07:18,126
And that is how he brought
so many young college kids in,
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so many older black women in,
so many people from diverse backgrounds
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who realized that there was
something bigger than themselves
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that they needed to be involved in...
and that Jim Jones offered that.
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I went home, told mom, �You know what,
this is the right church for me.�
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It was the next week that I became
a member of Peoples Temple.
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There�s a little town in Indiana.
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00:08:02,851 --> 00:08:07,085
The moment I think of it
a great deal of pain comes.
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00:08:09,217 --> 00:08:14,558
As a child I was undoubtedly
one of the poor in the community,
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never accepted.
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00:08:16,378 --> 00:08:20,104
Born as it were
on the wrong side of the tracks.
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00:08:23,251 --> 00:08:28,539
I grew up with Jimmy Jones.
We started first grade together.
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My brothers used to
go over to Jimmy�s house
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00:08:34,777 --> 00:08:40,069
and hung around his barn,
which was where he played.
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00:08:42,344 --> 00:08:46,466
From the time I was five years old,
I thought Jimmy was a really weird kid,
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there was something not quite right.
103
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He was obsessed with religion;
he was obsessed with death.
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00:08:55,670 --> 00:08:58,848
My brothers came back
with stories of him
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00:08:58,860 --> 00:09:03,204
conducting funerals
for small animals that had died.
106
00:09:03,205 --> 00:09:07,410
A friend of mine told me that
he saw Jimmy kill a cat with a knife.
107
00:09:08,534 --> 00:09:11,471
Well having a funeral for it
was a little strange,
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00:09:11,548 --> 00:09:14,308
killing the animal was very strange.
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00:09:15,406 --> 00:09:21,237
Jimmy�s father did not work,
did not have a job, and was a drunk.
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00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:26,629
Jim�s mother had to work
in order to support the family.
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00:09:26,690 --> 00:09:28,842
And he was kind of
left to his own devices.
112
00:09:28,948 --> 00:09:32,482
Kind of the kid who ran wild
in the street, you know what I mean?
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Listen, he was in a
dysfunctional family.
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00:09:37,091 --> 00:09:39,884
We got a nice name for it now.
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00:09:40,780 --> 00:09:42,756
But when you live
in a dysfunctional family,
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00:09:42,786 --> 00:09:44,560
you think it�s normal.
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Feeling as an outcast,
I�d early developed a sensitivity
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for the problems of blacks.
119
00:09:58,718 --> 00:10:02,989
I brought the only black
young man in the town home
120
00:10:03,037 --> 00:10:05,946
and my dad said that
he could not come in
121
00:10:05,992 --> 00:10:10,266
and I said, �Then I shan�t,�
and I did not see my dad for many years.
122
00:10:17,708 --> 00:10:22,772
In Lynn, Jim Jones looked for community
and couldn�t find community,
123
00:10:22,873 --> 00:10:27,184
in Lynn as a town... which had a
population of what, a thousand people?
124
00:10:27,713 --> 00:10:31,562
But he did find community
in the Pentecostal Church.
125
00:10:34,875 --> 00:10:38,907
He saw that they were
a surrogate home.
126
00:10:38,955 --> 00:10:44,070
He saw that the preachers were like
father figures to their congregations.
127
00:10:45,218 --> 00:10:51,080
And that role represented power
over the lives of your congregation.
128
00:10:56,580 --> 00:11:00,140
Jim Jones started out
on the revival preaching circuit,
129
00:11:00,141 --> 00:11:03,141
learning the ropes of
being a preacher.
130
00:11:03,204 --> 00:11:05,610
And once he started doing that,
131
00:11:05,611 --> 00:11:08,611
it became clear that
he could get a following.
132
00:11:08,907 --> 00:11:13,281
The first time I met Jim Jones
was Easter 1953.
133
00:11:13,344 --> 00:11:16,530
My mother-in-law, Edith Cordell,
134
00:11:16,531 --> 00:11:19,631
had a monkey and it hung itself
135
00:11:19,671 --> 00:11:21,626
and she wanted to
replace the monkey.
136
00:11:21,627 --> 00:11:23,827
So she looked in the�Indianapolis Star,
137
00:11:23,908 --> 00:11:28,790
and in that�Indianapolis Star
was Jim Jones�s ad
138
00:11:28,828 --> 00:11:31,624
that he had some monkeys to sell.
139
00:11:31,931 --> 00:11:35,106
So it was through that
that she met Jim Jones,
140
00:11:35,159 --> 00:11:37,299
and came back saying that
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00:11:37,454 --> 00:11:41,376
he had invited her to church
this next Sunday.
142
00:11:48,304 --> 00:11:51,446
It didn�t make no difference
what color you were.
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00:11:51,512 --> 00:11:54,438
It was everybody welcome there
in that church
144
00:11:54,439 --> 00:11:56,549
and he made it very plain
from the platform.
145
00:11:56,740 --> 00:11:58,423
We had some people
that disagreed with Jimmy.
146
00:11:58,424 --> 00:12:01,324
They got up in the audience
and they said they disagreed with him.
147
00:12:02,354 --> 00:12:06,134
They did not like this
integration part of the services.
148
00:12:06,218 --> 00:12:10,479
We did ask people to leave the church
one night because of that.
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00:12:13,917 --> 00:12:16,113
I was the first Negro child
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00:12:16,194 --> 00:12:19,092
adopted by a Caucasian family
in the state of Indiana.
151
00:12:19,604 --> 00:12:24,151
Jim and Marceline actually
went to adopt a Caucasian child.
152
00:12:24,282 --> 00:12:27,122
The story goes that
I was crying real loud
153
00:12:27,123 --> 00:12:30,420
and it drew attention
for Marceline to come over,
154
00:12:30,642 --> 00:12:34,938
and once she picked me up,
I stopped crying.
155
00:12:36,454 --> 00:12:40,026
My family was a template
of a rainbow family.
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00:12:40,206 --> 00:12:42,736
We had an African American,
157
00:12:43,137 --> 00:12:46,637
we had two American Asian
158
00:12:46,837 --> 00:12:50,083
and we had his
natural son, homemade.
159
00:12:51,639 --> 00:12:57,141
Jim was breaking new ground
in race relations
160
00:12:57,226 --> 00:13:03,107
at a time when the ground was
still pretty hard against that.
161
00:13:03,778 --> 00:13:08,433
Jim Jones was hated
and despised by some people,
162
00:13:08,504 --> 00:13:11,861
particularly
in the white community.
163
00:13:18,989 --> 00:13:23,094
There had been pressures on him
to leave Indianapolis.
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00:13:23,164 --> 00:13:28,717
He thought that Indianapolis was
too racist of a place for him to be,
165
00:13:28,897 --> 00:13:30,835
and he wanted to
take his people out.
166
00:13:32,542 --> 00:13:36,812
California is perceived to be
a very progressive state.
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00:13:37,890 --> 00:13:43,174
This would be the place to
implement the dream of racial equality.
168
00:13:43,289 --> 00:13:46,320
Not Indianapolis,
which seems hopeless,
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00:13:46,321 --> 00:13:49,844
but California, which
seems to be the Promised Land.
170
00:13:50,042 --> 00:13:52,608
He chose Ukiah
in northern California,
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00:13:52,651 --> 00:13:55,308
about 90 miles north
of San Francisco,
172
00:13:55,316 --> 00:13:58,943
because there was an article
in�Esquire Magazine�that said that
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00:13:58,981 --> 00:14:01,768
Ukiah was one of the nine places
in the world that
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00:14:01,769 --> 00:14:04,269
in the event of
thermonuclear attack,
175
00:14:04,270 --> 00:14:05,970
people would survive.
176
00:14:07,614 --> 00:14:13,361
I told Edith, �If you follow Jimmy
to California, you�re crazy.�
177
00:14:14,938 --> 00:14:17,941
So what did Jimmy do,
but took her to a psychiatrist
178
00:14:17,942 --> 00:14:20,142
and sent me a certified letter
179
00:14:20,251 --> 00:14:23,968
that she is of sound mind,
and she is not crazy.
180
00:14:25,772 --> 00:14:28,386
I was there the afternoon
that Edith drove away.
181
00:14:29,767 --> 00:14:32,053
I didn�t know
I�d never see her again.
182
00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:50,733
The move to California
was really fun.
183
00:14:50,852 --> 00:14:56,408
There were about twelve to fifteen cars
driving across United States
184
00:14:56,637 --> 00:14:58,222
and making that journey
185
00:14:59,303 --> 00:15:02,114
to a place that none of us knew,
186
00:15:02,606 --> 00:15:06,617
you know, none of us
could even imagine.
187
00:15:07,949 --> 00:15:10,998
We were going to California,
our new world.
188
00:15:15,867 --> 00:15:19,110
When I saw Redwood Valley,
I couldn�t believe my eyes
189
00:15:19,186 --> 00:15:23,266
because it was like a paradise.
It was rural. It was green.
190
00:15:23,344 --> 00:15:25,985
There were grape vines everywhere,
191
00:15:26,138 --> 00:15:28,251
and I fell in love.
192
00:15:28,382 --> 00:15:31,645
I said "This is got to be
a perfect way to live."
193
00:15:35,469 --> 00:15:37,724
We started with about
a hundred and forty-one people
194
00:15:37,725 --> 00:15:41,094
and from that, we�ve grown
to a very thriving congregation.
195
00:15:41,095 --> 00:15:45,760
We have about every level of society,
all socio-economic income strata,
196
00:15:45,843 --> 00:15:50,257
professional down to the ordinary
field worker, field laborer.
197
00:15:50,395 --> 00:15:53,938
Really, it�s beautiful to see that
all these divisions have been broken down...
198
00:15:53,939 --> 00:15:57,680
not only race, but any differences
of economic position.
199
00:15:57,681 --> 00:16:02,219
The focus of Jim�s message
was taken from the Bible,
200
00:16:02,873 --> 00:16:06,148
where Jesus in his earliest days
201
00:16:07,266 --> 00:16:11,239
told people to sell all things
and have all things in common.
202
00:16:11,341 --> 00:16:16,552
Jesus Christ had the most revolutionary
teachings to be said, in the sense that
203
00:16:16,553 --> 00:16:18,772
he said to feed the hungry,
clothe the naked,
204
00:16:18,830 --> 00:16:20,459
take in the stranger,
205
00:16:20,460 --> 00:16:23,460
administer to those who are
widows and afflicted in their suffering.
206
00:16:23,531 --> 00:16:26,754
And we feel that no one really
tried Christianity too effectively
207
00:16:26,755 --> 00:16:28,264
in the Judeo-Christian tradition.
208
00:16:28,857 --> 00:16:31,241
The membership
increased substantially
209
00:16:31,334 --> 00:16:36,003
as he procured
more and more Greyhound buses
210
00:16:36,307 --> 00:16:39,141
and fixed them up,
211
00:16:39,142 --> 00:16:43,005
and every summer
he began this cross-country tour.
212
00:16:44,261 --> 00:16:47,942
The purpose of the bus trips
was to spread Jim�s beliefs
213
00:16:47,999 --> 00:16:50,843
about socialism and the world,
214
00:16:50,910 --> 00:16:54,782
and how we can live a better life
and about an integrated lifestyle.
215
00:16:54,998 --> 00:17:00,759
But behind that, I think it was to
gather more members for the Temple.
216
00:17:10,785 --> 00:17:13,172
I decided not to go to Vietnam,
217
00:17:13,226 --> 00:17:17,147
and I was just at the point of
what am I going to do with myself?
218
00:17:17,211 --> 00:17:21,406
I heard Jim Jones was
going to be coming to Philadelphia,
219
00:17:21,546 --> 00:17:24,259
and coming to
Benjamin Franklin High School.
220
00:17:24,847 --> 00:17:26,895
And I went Wednesday night
and I listened to him,
221
00:17:26,896 --> 00:17:30,896
and I was impressed by
how it was such an interracial group
222
00:17:30,897 --> 00:17:32,297
and people were really happy.
223
00:17:32,370 --> 00:17:34,382
You got nothing to lose.
Who else is going to stand
224
00:17:34,383 --> 00:17:36,483
and look you in the face and say,
�Come and I�ll give you a job.
225
00:17:36,552 --> 00:17:38,724
Come and I�ll give you a home.
226
00:17:38,819 --> 00:17:42,430
Come and I�ll give you a bed?�
�But I�ve got nothing but a pension.�
227
00:17:42,496 --> 00:17:46,047
�Go and leave your pension behind,�
who else will tell you that?
228
00:17:46,158 --> 00:17:48,982
Who�ll tell you,
�I�ll put you on that bus tomorrow?�
229
00:17:49,052 --> 00:17:52,663
I heard Jim Jones talking
about equality among races,
230
00:17:52,784 --> 00:17:57,820
what it�s like living in California,
in the Redwood Valley,
231
00:17:57,821 --> 00:18:00,521
the good works that they�re doing.
232
00:18:00,590 --> 00:18:02,897
Things that, like,
I wanted to get involved with,
233
00:18:02,898 --> 00:18:05,198
but didn�t even know
where to make an entr�e.
234
00:18:05,318 --> 00:18:07,907
And all of a sudden,
the answer was there.
235
00:18:07,976 --> 00:18:13,001
Somebody is gonna get on the
freedom train in Philadelphia!
236
00:18:13,614 --> 00:18:17,583
He was there for three evenings,
and the third evening
237
00:18:17,645 --> 00:18:20,483
I went off on the bus
and came to California.
238
00:18:30,004 --> 00:18:34,344
When I joined Peoples Temple
in the spring of 1966,
239
00:18:34,423 --> 00:18:37,630
there were exactly
eighty-one members.
240
00:18:37,695 --> 00:18:42,732
Five years later,
an extended family of eighty people
241
00:18:43,606 --> 00:18:48,176
had become
an organization of thousands.
242
00:18:53,394 --> 00:18:56,559
Peoples Temple
really was a black church.
243
00:18:56,637 --> 00:19:01,650
It was led by a white minister,
but in terms of the worship service,
244
00:19:01,791 --> 00:19:05,734
commitment to the social gospel,
its membership,
245
00:19:05,735 --> 00:19:08,435
it functioned completely
like a black church.
246
00:19:08,510 --> 00:19:11,191
He talked black.
He really understood it.
247
00:19:11,192 --> 00:19:14,592
He understood how it was
to be treated differently.
248
00:19:14,658 --> 00:19:17,327
And that�s from his roots
coming out of Lynn.
249
00:19:17,399 --> 00:19:19,110
When people heard Jim,
250
00:19:19,111 --> 00:19:23,111
they didn�t look upon him
as being a white preacher, you know.
251
00:19:23,112 --> 00:19:26,412
People didn�t look at Jim
as being white. He was not white.
252
00:19:26,413 --> 00:19:28,113
He was just their preacher.
253
00:19:28,189 --> 00:19:30,516
You going to go to Texas with me
when I have that campaign?
254
00:19:30,587 --> 00:19:35,549
I was just wondering whether
I could go or not. I would like to go.
255
00:19:35,581 --> 00:19:38,241
Why of course you�d go,
you went to Mexico with me.
256
00:19:38,293 --> 00:19:42,241
As older people joined,
it took a year or so
257
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:46,462
and he�d convince the people that
he was doing so much in the community
258
00:19:46,527 --> 00:19:50,183
and so why not rather than
just tithe your twenty percent,
259
00:19:50,334 --> 00:19:55,004
why not sell your home,
give the money to the church?
260
00:19:55,083 --> 00:19:57,548
And that is what people began to do.
261
00:19:57,624 --> 00:20:01,229
Now in this church,
what have we done in a short time?
262
00:20:01,329 --> 00:20:06,480
We have four senior citizens� homes
that are the most innovating,
263
00:20:06,528 --> 00:20:08,592
the most beautiful you want to see.
264
00:20:08,658 --> 00:20:12,325
They had their own rooms,
they had every need taken care of,
265
00:20:12,403 --> 00:20:17,122
they had their food provided.
They were well looked after.
266
00:20:17,484 --> 00:20:21,473
Now my home is stone block and
there�s not a piece of new furniture in it.
267
00:20:21,512 --> 00:20:25,177
But our senior citizen homes,
they�re elegant. And that�s beautiful.
268
00:20:25,249 --> 00:20:28,749
They were giving their life�s money
and savings to the church,
269
00:20:28,822 --> 00:20:30,422
but in exchange,
270
00:20:30,423 --> 00:20:33,906
the church was agreeing
to take care of them in the community,
271
00:20:33,962 --> 00:20:36,100
not just in a nursing home.
272
00:20:46,217 --> 00:20:49,643
Well it got to the point where
there were so many duties in the Temple
273
00:20:49,686 --> 00:20:52,909
that some people
had to become full time.
274
00:20:52,981 --> 00:20:55,279
So when you were full-time Temple,
275
00:20:55,331 --> 00:20:57,559
you worked about
twenty hours a day.
276
00:20:57,579 --> 00:21:00,872
My week kind of ran like this,
I�d work my regular job on Mondays,
277
00:21:00,922 --> 00:21:03,279
you know, eight to five.
Then, I�d work on files.
278
00:21:03,318 --> 00:21:05,947
There were people
who ran rest homes.
279
00:21:05,983 --> 00:21:08,521
There were animals to be taken care of.
There were the publications.
280
00:21:08,584 --> 00:21:10,575
Everybody had a job.
281
00:21:10,624 --> 00:21:12,799
Wednesday night we�d have
a meeting in Redwood Valley
282
00:21:12,839 --> 00:21:15,519
and I�d go to the meeting for,
until probably 10 or 10:30.
283
00:21:15,543 --> 00:21:18,285
We turned our paychecks over
every time we got paid.
284
00:21:18,310 --> 00:21:20,952
And then we got an allowance,
five dollars a week.
285
00:21:20,958 --> 00:21:22,995
And Friday, I�d go to work
and I�d get off of work,
286
00:21:23,064 --> 00:21:26,218
and I�d hop on the bus
or drive the bus to San Francisco.
287
00:21:26,261 --> 00:21:27,853
If I had to go to the doctor,
it was taken care of.
288
00:21:27,854 --> 00:21:29,454
If I had to go to the dentist,
it was taken care of.
289
00:21:29,541 --> 00:21:31,503
If I needed clothes,
that was taken care of.
290
00:21:31,572 --> 00:21:33,808
And often on Saturday night,
we�d have planning commission meetings
291
00:21:33,809 --> 00:21:35,209
until 2 or 3 in the morning.
292
00:21:35,225 --> 00:21:37,278
We would always try to let
each other know the next day,
293
00:21:37,279 --> 00:21:38,679
�Well, how long did you sleep?�
294
00:21:38,691 --> 00:21:39,801
�Oh, I slept two hours.�
295
00:21:39,802 --> 00:21:42,202
�You only slept two?
Well, I slept an hour-and-a-half.�
296
00:21:42,228 --> 00:21:44,102
And then Sunday,
we�d have a Sunday morning service
297
00:21:44,132 --> 00:21:47,445
and then around one o�clock
hop on the buses, drive up,
298
00:21:47,504 --> 00:21:50,686
drop people off in San Francisco,
and drive up to Redwood Valley.
299
00:21:50,736 --> 00:21:53,130
The longest I ever stayed awake
was six days,
300
00:21:53,221 --> 00:21:56,028
and that�s with no coffee,
no nothing.
301
00:21:56,081 --> 00:21:57,484
It changed over the years,
302
00:21:57,579 --> 00:22:00,292
but it was always busy.
303
00:22:00,679 --> 00:22:04,469
Being in an environment where you�re
constantly up, you�re constantly busy,
304
00:22:05,153 --> 00:22:10,060
and you�re made to feel guilty if you
take too many luxuries like sleeping...
305
00:22:10,605 --> 00:22:13,260
you tend to
not really think for yourself.
306
00:22:13,665 --> 00:22:16,342
And I did allow Jones
to think for me
307
00:22:16,391 --> 00:22:19,360
because I figured that
he had the better plan.
308
00:22:19,414 --> 00:22:22,111
I gave my rights up to him.
309
00:22:22,165 --> 00:22:24,427
As many others did.
310
00:22:26,775 --> 00:22:28,456
Edie.
311
00:22:30,673 --> 00:22:35,165
Fingers, are your fingers numb
in your right hand?
312
00:22:36,237 --> 00:22:39,387
Reach the fingers out
that are bothering you.
313
00:22:43,647 --> 00:22:45,608
Now, is the pain gone?
314
00:22:52,631 --> 00:22:57,419
There was a senior citizen
and we nicknamed her Power.
315
00:22:58,268 --> 00:23:01,651
He would have her to come up
in the midst of one of his meetings,
316
00:23:01,652 --> 00:23:03,052
and she used to say,
317
00:23:03,266 --> 00:23:07,153
�The man got power.
318
00:23:07,954 --> 00:23:10,354
The man got power, ya�ll.�
319
00:23:10,577 --> 00:23:13,044
And the whole place
would just go wild.
320
00:23:15,988 --> 00:23:19,887
Take your glasses off.
Let�s just dare in our faith.
321
00:23:23,805 --> 00:23:27,927
Now look at my face.
322
00:23:28,528 --> 00:23:32,128
I love you,
the people love you,
323
00:23:32,192 --> 00:23:34,703
most importantly
Christ loves you.
324
00:23:34,718 --> 00:23:36,382
What do you see?
325
00:23:36,441 --> 00:23:38,954
- One finger.
- One finger!
326
00:23:41,515 --> 00:23:44,334
One of the most
incredible healings, to me,
327
00:23:44,758 --> 00:23:48,315
was this little old lady
and she was in a wheelchair.
328
00:23:48,389 --> 00:23:51,221
Jim said, �Darlin�,
you know, today is your day.
329
00:23:51,256 --> 00:23:53,717
We�re going to,
you�re going to get healed today.�
330
00:23:54,915 --> 00:23:57,921
He said, �We�re going to,
we�re going to heal those legs of yours.
331
00:23:57,922 --> 00:23:59,322
You�re going to walk again.�
332
00:23:59,396 --> 00:24:03,678
And the whole auditorium
went totally crazy.
333
00:24:04,829 --> 00:24:06,909
Come forth, my dear.
334
00:24:07,310 --> 00:24:12,110
Stand up. Take that step.
Bless your heart. Take that step.
335
00:24:12,361 --> 00:24:16,411
And she takes this
real slow, shaky step.
336
00:24:17,068 --> 00:24:19,221
She said, �I can feel it.�
337
00:24:19,327 --> 00:24:22,696
He said, �Yes, I know you can feel it.
Now take your other leg and do it.�
338
00:24:22,736 --> 00:24:25,730
And so another real slow, shaky step
339
00:24:25,794 --> 00:24:28,409
and he says, �Now
I want you to walk toward me.�
340
00:24:28,428 --> 00:24:34,178
Move forward. Move forward.
Move forward, darlin�. You can do it.
341
00:24:34,757 --> 00:24:39,242
And she starts taking forward steps.
And pretty soon she is walking.
342
00:24:39,943 --> 00:24:42,843
And she starts walking up
one of the aisles.
343
00:24:46,327 --> 00:24:48,605
And pretty soon she�s running.
344
00:24:49,957 --> 00:24:53,233
Well, by this time the whole congregation�s
running down these aisles with us,
345
00:24:53,516 --> 00:24:57,723
we�re all just running around the aisles,
just hoopin� and hollerin� up a storm.
346
00:25:03,998 --> 00:25:07,490
Later, I found out
that this person
347
00:25:07,691 --> 00:25:11,491
that I had seen healed
and cried with
348
00:25:11,961 --> 00:25:17,361
was really one of the secretaries,
made up to look crippled and blind.
349
00:25:17,362 --> 00:25:22,662
Never shall forget
what He�s done for me.
350
00:25:22,963 --> 00:25:28,663
Oh, what He�s done for me.
351
00:25:28,964 --> 00:25:34,664
Oh, what He�s done for me.
352
00:25:34,965 --> 00:25:39,965
Oh, what He�s done for me.
353
00:25:39,966 --> 00:25:45,266
I never shall forget
what He�s done for me.
354
00:25:45,484 --> 00:25:49,481
For those people that hadn�t
grown up in the apostolic world,
355
00:25:49,530 --> 00:25:52,652
Jim would say, you know,
�I know this is different for you.
356
00:25:52,711 --> 00:25:57,787
But for people to come from
extremely religious backgrounds,
357
00:25:57,872 --> 00:26:00,546
so that I can bring them forward
to the message
358
00:26:00,578 --> 00:26:02,777
that�s so important
for all of us today
359
00:26:02,778 --> 00:26:05,078
and that is activism,
360
00:26:05,190 --> 00:26:08,567
then I need to speak
on each person�s level.�
361
00:26:08,652 --> 00:26:10,764
He said, �A lot of you people,
you Christian people coming in,
362
00:26:10,765 --> 00:26:12,565
you�re so hung-up on this Bible.�
363
00:26:12,634 --> 00:26:14,867
He said, �This black book
has held down black people
364
00:26:14,868 --> 00:26:16,868
for the last two-hundred years.�
365
00:26:16,954 --> 00:26:19,627
He said, �But I�m going to
show you this has no power.�
366
00:26:19,685 --> 00:26:24,007
So he leaned way back
like a football player and he flung it.
367
00:26:24,208 --> 00:26:28,908
And when he flung it and let it go,
the place got dead quiet like.
368
00:26:30,999 --> 00:26:33,011
And he waited
until it hit the floor, POW!
369
00:26:33,013 --> 00:26:37,597
When it hit the floor, he stood
and he looked back and forth.
370
00:26:39,825 --> 00:26:44,399
He said, �Now, did you see any lightning
come from the sky and strike me dead?�
371
00:26:44,483 --> 00:26:46,664
You�re gonna help yourself,
or you�ll get no help!
372
00:26:46,793 --> 00:26:49,758
There�s only one hope of glory�
That�s within you!
373
00:26:49,855 --> 00:26:53,389
Nobody�s gonna come out of the sky!
There�s no heaven up there�
374
00:26:53,470 --> 00:26:55,714
We�ll have to make heaven
down here!
375
00:26:58,243 --> 00:27:02,527
And he said, �What you need to
believe in is what you can see.�
376
00:27:03,077 --> 00:27:06,634
He said, �If you see me as your friend,
I�ll be your friend.
377
00:27:06,725 --> 00:27:09,269
As you see me as your father,
I�ll be your father,
378
00:27:09,270 --> 00:27:11,070
for those of you
that don�t have a father.�
379
00:27:11,157 --> 00:27:14,539
He said, �If you see me as your savior,
I�ll be your savior.�
380
00:27:14,616 --> 00:27:18,922
He said, even so, �If you see me
as your God, I�ll be your God.�
381
00:27:37,374 --> 00:27:42,986
People lifted Jim
to a level of adoration
382
00:27:43,209 --> 00:27:48,191
because many believed that
he had healed them of cancer.
383
00:27:48,312 --> 00:27:49,604
Many believed
384
00:27:49,605 --> 00:27:54,605
that he had saved their son
or daughter from an automobile accident.
385
00:27:56,472 --> 00:28:00,231
There were many reasons
for many people
386
00:28:00,232 --> 00:28:02,732
to admire, love,
387
00:28:02,838 --> 00:28:07,576
excuse, overlook
much of what Jim did.
388
00:28:17,500 --> 00:28:21,074
I had been in the Temple
for just a few months.
389
00:28:21,431 --> 00:28:23,833
I was sent backstage
in Los Angeles to...
390
00:28:24,134 --> 00:28:26,534
to get something for somebody,
I don�t remember what.
391
00:28:26,620 --> 00:28:30,308
And Jones happened to be
coming out of his room and he said,
392
00:28:30,309 --> 00:28:34,309
�Hi Tim, how are you doing? How is it going?
How do you like everything so far?�
393
00:28:34,423 --> 00:28:37,482
And, �Oh, I like it a lot.�
And, �you know, it�s really cool.�
394
00:28:37,500 --> 00:28:39,320
I don�t remember exactly.
395
00:28:39,329 --> 00:28:44,330
And he reached up and kind of patted
the back of my neck, and he said,
396
00:28:44,331 --> 00:28:46,623
�I�ll fuck you in the ass
if you want.�
397
00:28:47,736 --> 00:28:52,836
And I just kind of stammered,
�No.� You know, �No.�
398
00:28:52,837 --> 00:28:56,937
And he said, �Well, you know,
if you ever want that, that�s okay,
399
00:28:57,037 --> 00:28:59,076
just let me know
and we�ll do that.�
400
00:29:00,591 --> 00:29:03,860
Jim said that
all of us were homosexuals,
401
00:29:03,983 --> 00:29:08,517
everyone except... He was the only
heterosexual on the planet.
402
00:29:10,147 --> 00:29:12,941
And that the women were all lesbians
and the guys were all gay.
403
00:29:13,009 --> 00:29:17,150
And so anyone that showed
any interest in sex was just compensating.
404
00:29:17,223 --> 00:29:22,747
What he explained to each of us,
and in sermons, was that
405
00:29:23,748 --> 00:29:28,148
sexual relationships
were very selfish
406
00:29:28,234 --> 00:29:33,622
and they took away
from the focus of the church,
407
00:29:33,623 --> 00:29:36,023
and that was to help others.
408
00:29:36,782 --> 00:29:38,849
Jim was not celibate.
409
00:29:39,150 --> 00:29:43,850
Nobody knew that until perhaps
it was their time to find out.
410
00:29:43,979 --> 00:29:48,685
What he spoke from the pulpit
wasn�t what he did behind the scenes.
411
00:29:50,750 --> 00:29:55,225
I remember one night,
one of the brothers had stood up and said,
412
00:29:55,325 --> 00:30:00,715
�You know, I think everybody
that wants Father to screw them in the butt,
413
00:30:00,816 --> 00:30:04,116
you need to take an enema first.�
414
00:30:05,031 --> 00:30:09,420
I�m telling you the truth man,
I�m telling you the truth.
415
00:30:11,155 --> 00:30:13,615
And then the question went on,
416
00:30:13,816 --> 00:30:17,516
�Well, how many of you in here
have had him to do that?�
417
00:30:18,186 --> 00:30:21,762
And whether they were lying
or just following suit,
418
00:30:21,863 --> 00:30:25,363
hands of the men
just went up around the room.
419
00:30:25,519 --> 00:30:28,244
And I�m sitting there petrified
because I�m like,
420
00:30:28,445 --> 00:30:31,345
�Is this what it�s leading to,
that I�m supposed to get to?�
421
00:30:31,493 --> 00:30:34,921
And I�m thinking, �hmmm.�
But I played it off like,
422
00:30:34,922 --> 00:30:37,522
�Okay, I�m being cool.
Okay, if that�s where they at,
423
00:30:37,622 --> 00:30:39,477
that�s not where I�m at.�
424
00:30:39,512 --> 00:30:43,562
Because I�m thinking, �My wife...
I�m happy with my wife.
425
00:30:43,563 --> 00:30:46,663
With this sleep I�m not getting,
I�m not getting enough anyway.�
426
00:30:49,990 --> 00:30:55,399
One of the powerful things that
Jim used, to keep us to not think,
427
00:30:55,498 --> 00:31:00,014
was that we were never really allowed
to speak with one another.
428
00:31:00,096 --> 00:31:03,852
I�d look around and I�d say,
�Am I the only one that feels this way?�
429
00:31:05,023 --> 00:31:10,763
I learned, eventually,
not to say anything to anyone.
430
00:31:13,351 --> 00:31:15,922
We had a lady
who visited us a week ago here
431
00:31:15,992 --> 00:31:18,982
and was speaking to one at the door,
and she was a member of a prominent church,
432
00:31:19,047 --> 00:31:20,568
a pastor�s wife,
433
00:31:20,645 --> 00:31:23,865
and she said, �I think that the poor
should be made to control
434
00:31:23,949 --> 00:31:26,877
how many children they bring
into the earth.� You remember?
435
00:31:26,972 --> 00:31:30,742
Some leading scientists say,
�We have to have euthanasia.�
436
00:31:30,855 --> 00:31:34,054
Oh, no. Oh, no.
437
00:31:34,174 --> 00:31:37,824
Who�s going to decide who
and when a person�s going to die?
438
00:31:37,926 --> 00:31:41,208
We must never allow that because
this is the kind of thing that ushers in
439
00:31:41,255 --> 00:31:43,815
the terror of a Hitler�s Germany.
440
00:31:43,879 --> 00:31:46,876
We must not allow these kind of things
to enter our consciousness.
441
00:31:50,356 --> 00:31:54,235
My father used to tell me
that people�s lives,
442
00:31:54,317 --> 00:31:58,576
sixty percent of people�s lives,
were made on emotional decisions.
443
00:31:59,433 --> 00:32:00,957
Make your decisions,
444
00:32:00,958 --> 00:32:04,258
sixty percent of your decisions,
based on logic, fact and reason,
445
00:32:04,827 --> 00:32:09,108
and allow emotion
to be the secondary motivator.
446
00:32:09,498 --> 00:32:13,712
And... we were Star Trek fans.
He and I were Star Trek fans,
447
00:32:13,713 --> 00:32:15,313
and he used to always say,
448
00:32:15,347 --> 00:32:18,828
�Just vulcanize yourself.
Just vulcanize yourself.�
449
00:32:24,961 --> 00:32:27,871
We were celebrating New Years Eve.
450
00:32:27,972 --> 00:32:31,172
There were about
a hundred and twenty people.
451
00:32:31,263 --> 00:32:36,540
Jim started talking
about our cause and he said,
452
00:32:37,652 --> 00:32:40,833
�This punch is going to be
passed out to everybody here.�
453
00:32:42,681 --> 00:32:46,625
We all drank our punch
and then he said,
454
00:32:46,999 --> 00:32:49,633
�You just drank poison.
455
00:32:50,342 --> 00:32:55,106
And we will all die, right here
in the church, together as one.�
456
00:32:56,358 --> 00:33:00,281
The women were just screaming,
�Oh no, my baby, my baby�,
457
00:33:00,988 --> 00:33:02,754
and others just sat there.
458
00:33:04,755 --> 00:33:06,755
And all of a sudden, Jim says,
459
00:33:08,310 --> 00:33:10,590
�That wasn�t poison you drank.�
460
00:33:11,738 --> 00:33:14,650
Jim said that
this was a test of loyalty.
461
00:33:14,728 --> 00:33:20,401
He just wanted to see if we were
truly committed to our cause,
462
00:33:20,450 --> 00:33:23,176
and that was
how we would show it.
463
00:33:23,742 --> 00:33:26,096
Well it wasn�t about our loyalty,
464
00:33:26,197 --> 00:33:29,497
because we were
demonstrating loyalty all the time.
465
00:33:29,825 --> 00:33:33,693
Coming there, being there
in the meetings, sitting, listening,
466
00:33:33,994 --> 00:33:35,994
you know, supporting, working.
467
00:33:36,134 --> 00:33:40,994
And I thought it had
a lot more to do with Jim�s sense of
468
00:33:43,496 --> 00:33:44,696
rehearsal.
469
00:33:45,235 --> 00:33:50,279
Did he feel like he was potent
and... and omnipotent enough
470
00:33:50,369 --> 00:33:54,296
to really get people
to kill themselves when he said so?
471
00:33:54,612 --> 00:33:57,311
And that frightened
the hell out of me.
472
00:34:08,009 --> 00:34:11,779
Jim Jones, I think,
realized that
473
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:17,680
ultimately Ukiah
was not the sort of climate
474
00:34:17,681 --> 00:34:20,254
where Peoples Temple would thrive.
475
00:34:20,411 --> 00:34:24,796
He wasn�t going to be gaining
large numbers of members.
476
00:34:24,945 --> 00:34:27,257
He couldn�t declare himself to be
477
00:34:27,382 --> 00:34:32,094
a socialist god openly,
certainly in a city like Ukiah.
478
00:34:40,978 --> 00:34:46,010
In San Francisco, Jones walked in
on a sort of a wild kind of party,
479
00:34:46,089 --> 00:34:49,790
where there was a lot of new faces
and new sources of power.
480
00:34:49,882 --> 00:34:52,644
And there was a sort of feeling
that smaller groups,
481
00:34:52,733 --> 00:34:55,966
neighborhood groups, activist groups
had a bigger chance.
482
00:34:57,720 --> 00:35:01,633
I think the early sixties
had been a time of great optimism;
483
00:35:01,734 --> 00:35:04,113
there was a belief that
we could change the world
484
00:35:04,229 --> 00:35:06,199
through social movements.
485
00:35:06,294 --> 00:35:11,565
With various assassinations, Malcolm X,
Medgar Evers, Martin Luther King,
486
00:35:11,648 --> 00:35:16,312
Robert Kennedy, there was definitely
a feeling of hopelessness.
487
00:35:18,139 --> 00:35:21,914
The message of Peoples Temple was,
�No, the dream is alive.�
488
00:35:28,030 --> 00:35:31,653
If you had a demonstration
in San Francisco
489
00:35:32,389 --> 00:35:34,380
and you wanted
people to show up,
490
00:35:34,616 --> 00:35:39,322
Jim Jones, the Peoples Temple,
could be there in twenty minutes,
491
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:43,219
with hundreds of people.
And we would be enthusiastic.
492
00:35:45,940 --> 00:35:49,661
There was an attitude of,
"We can change the world."
493
00:35:49,961 --> 00:35:53,067
And that�s what we wanted to do.
494
00:35:53,131 --> 00:35:56,702
These people would be on time,
they�d be polite and nice.
495
00:35:56,806 --> 00:35:59,583
They were a span of ages,
a span of races.
496
00:35:59,697 --> 00:36:03,373
They were tailor-made
for a political rally.
497
00:36:03,490 --> 00:36:06,843
To a politician, it was like
a birthday cake times twelve.
498
00:36:08,177 --> 00:36:10,048
You have managed to make
499
00:36:10,649 --> 00:36:13,649
the many persons associated
with Peoples Temple part of a family.
500
00:36:13,714 --> 00:36:16,179
If you are in need of healthcare,
you get healthcare.
501
00:36:16,250 --> 00:36:19,103
If you�re in need of legal assistance
of some sort, you get that.
502
00:36:19,182 --> 00:36:21,177
If you�re in need of
transportation, you get that.
503
00:36:21,271 --> 00:36:24,283
And that�s the kind of religious thing
that I am excited about,
504
00:36:24,284 --> 00:36:25,884
and have some respect for.
505
00:36:26,157 --> 00:36:31,979
When vice presidential candidate,
Walter Mondale, came to San Francisco,
506
00:36:32,067 --> 00:36:36,435
Jim Jones was part of the entourage
that boarded his private jet.
507
00:36:37,047 --> 00:36:41,275
When Rosalyn Carter
came to San Francisco,
508
00:36:41,372 --> 00:36:44,107
she gave Jim Jones
a private audience.
509
00:36:44,948 --> 00:36:49,377
Jim Jones had political power
that few people,
510
00:36:49,378 --> 00:36:52,378
let alone preachers,
could have imagined.
511
00:36:59,633 --> 00:37:01,813
Jim Jones represented
the Peoples Temple
512
00:37:01,877 --> 00:37:05,052
as a progressive movement
that was threatened.
513
00:37:05,112 --> 00:37:09,491
That there were outside forces who
didn�t want us to do what we were doing.
514
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:10,967
And it was the government.
515
00:37:13,365 --> 00:37:16,993
The government was infiltrating
and wiretapping
516
00:37:17,416 --> 00:37:20,258
and trying to kill people
or assassinate people.
517
00:37:20,341 --> 00:37:22,165
That�s what was happening.
518
00:37:24,201 --> 00:37:27,047
He was always paranoid that
someone was going to get in
519
00:37:27,048 --> 00:37:28,248
and try to kill him,
520
00:37:28,371 --> 00:37:31,426
that they had two people
that had dedicated their lives,
521
00:37:31,510 --> 00:37:33,793
that they were going to jump
in front of Jones and take the bullet,
522
00:37:33,794 --> 00:37:36,094
kind of like the secret service
so to speak.
523
00:37:37,236 --> 00:37:40,097
Jim started changing a lot
in the seventies.
524
00:37:40,298 --> 00:37:42,098
He was taking drugs.
525
00:37:42,718 --> 00:37:45,230
I think he said
it was his kidneys at the time.
526
00:37:45,342 --> 00:37:48,166
And he was getting
more and more paranoid.
527
00:37:48,367 --> 00:37:50,367
Incredibly paranoid.
528
00:37:50,927 --> 00:37:52,442
There was always threats.
529
00:37:52,443 --> 00:37:56,743
Always, always, always,
always threats. They were there.
530
00:37:56,832 --> 00:38:00,097
They were just about
to try to destroy us
531
00:38:00,462 --> 00:38:05,173
if we weren�t always viligant
about our movement.
532
00:38:09,981 --> 00:38:12,768
There was a fire
in the San Francisco Temple.
533
00:38:12,861 --> 00:38:16,594
The Temple was burned down
and had to be rebuilt.
534
00:38:17,067 --> 00:38:20,083
The fire proved
they are out to get us.
535
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:22,601
They so don�t want us to do
what we�re doing;
536
00:38:22,683 --> 00:38:23,844
they�ve burned down the Temple.
537
00:38:23,898 --> 00:38:26,457
They�ll do anything to keep us
from doing what we�re doing.
538
00:38:26,517 --> 00:38:28,920
So we have to be even stronger.
539
00:38:28,992 --> 00:38:30,669
What about the fact that
the Ku Klux Klan
540
00:38:30,670 --> 00:38:33,170
has increased one hundred times
in its membership?
541
00:38:33,214 --> 00:38:36,471
Where? Not Mississippi,
I�m talking about New York State.
542
00:38:37,673 --> 00:38:41,926
It�s the church�s duty to have
a place of protection for its people.
543
00:38:45,368 --> 00:38:50,468
December of �75, ninety of us
went by plane, into Guyana,
544
00:38:50,587 --> 00:38:54,107
and saw where we were
building the community there.
545
00:38:54,205 --> 00:38:56,152
See, they�ve made
progress on the road
546
00:38:56,238 --> 00:38:59,017
and leveled it,
clear in to five miles.
547
00:38:59,152 --> 00:39:03,868
And you�re seeing in the distance,
housing complexes, that are being built.
548
00:39:04,758 --> 00:39:09,639
What I saw that creation
as being was building a city
549
00:39:09,725 --> 00:39:15,319
where we could move and raise
our children, outside of the oppression
550
00:39:15,435 --> 00:39:19,220
and the racism of
the United States of America.
551
00:39:22,353 --> 00:39:27,380
When I first went into Jonestown,
it was just a footpath in the rainforest.
552
00:39:30,508 --> 00:39:33,148
We had Indians
in front of us with machetes,
553
00:39:33,149 --> 00:39:35,949
and we had Indians
behind us with machetes.
554
00:39:39,048 --> 00:39:43,196
Three-hundred miles into the jungle,
we literally built a city
555
00:39:43,246 --> 00:39:45,614
in the middle of the jungle,
in the middle of nowhere.
556
00:39:45,686 --> 00:39:49,645
Hello family. It�s been a... it�s
such a joy and great pleasure being here,
557
00:39:49,731 --> 00:39:52,220
because of Father�s love.
We are trying to make,
558
00:39:52,297 --> 00:39:55,421
and we are making
a place of refuge for all of you here.
559
00:39:56,285 --> 00:39:59,528
There is no,
nothing at all that I would...
560
00:40:00,129 --> 00:40:01,629
that I have any holdings here.
561
00:40:01,630 --> 00:40:06,530
I do not want to go back in any way,
shape or form to the States.
562
00:40:06,644 --> 00:40:10,903
I love it here and this is the place
where all of you are going to be.
563
00:40:14,533 --> 00:40:17,203
Pretty soon we were
seeing film footage
564
00:40:17,272 --> 00:40:20,777
of the first crew
that went down there.
565
00:40:22,301 --> 00:40:25,045
We all wanted to go.
I wanted to go.
566
00:40:25,390 --> 00:40:27,948
It looked like...
like freedom.
567
00:40:36,927 --> 00:40:40,945
Now, will each of you
give a very fond embrace,
568
00:40:40,946 --> 00:40:44,446
a salutary kiss of greeting
to your neighbor,
569
00:40:44,639 --> 00:40:47,732
and let�s fill this atmosphere
with warmth and love.
570
00:40:49,430 --> 00:40:54,163
We thought of ourselves as one big
family that did handle our own discipline.
571
00:40:55,176 --> 00:41:01,164
I was in a lot of the meetings where
people were spanked or beaten, and I...
572
00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:05,414
I was slapped once,
also in a public meeting.
573
00:41:05,532 --> 00:41:07,788
People were brought
up front and asked...
574
00:41:08,067 --> 00:41:10,002
had to tell who
they had slept with
575
00:41:10,368 --> 00:41:14,884
and who they had
sneaked off to a restaurant with.
576
00:41:15,017 --> 00:41:18,239
There wasn�t a week that went by
that I wasn�t called up on the floor
577
00:41:18,566 --> 00:41:21,451
because of my behavior,
because of my attitude.
578
00:41:21,452 --> 00:41:25,263
�Stanley Clayton, up, front, center.�
579
00:41:25,734 --> 00:41:27,414
He would ask people,
580
00:41:27,498 --> 00:41:28,882
�What do you think
we ought to do with them?
581
00:41:28,957 --> 00:41:30,732
Do you think they ought to
get a good boxing?�
582
00:41:30,790 --> 00:41:33,888
And then he�d get
a resounding roar, �Yes!�
583
00:41:34,067 --> 00:41:37,077
You might fight
five people in one night.
584
00:41:37,462 --> 00:41:40,416
Well, you know,
you�re very tired!
585
00:41:40,644 --> 00:41:44,363
I�ve seen situations where
they actually knocked the person out
586
00:41:44,492 --> 00:41:47,578
and actually took water
and threw water back on him,
587
00:41:47,579 --> 00:41:49,479
woke him up,
and whooped him some more.
588
00:41:49,695 --> 00:41:53,471
I had welts really bad,
and when I went to work the next day,
589
00:41:53,550 --> 00:41:57,308
one of my employees
noticed the welts when I sat down.
590
00:41:57,456 --> 00:41:59,296
And I just broke down
and told her.
591
00:41:59,385 --> 00:42:01,208
She didn�t even know
I was Peoples Temple.
592
00:42:01,335 --> 00:42:04,674
And she called the manager
of the station up
593
00:42:05,109 --> 00:42:07,771
and they talked to me
about leaving.
594
00:42:07,874 --> 00:42:11,034
I couldn�t say goodbye
to my son or my husband
595
00:42:11,582 --> 00:42:14,199
because at that point,
it was like the Gestapo,
596
00:42:14,303 --> 00:42:16,030
the families were
turning in each other.
597
00:42:16,103 --> 00:42:19,327
If I had said goodbye,
one of them would have reported me.
598
00:42:20,610 --> 00:42:24,418
It�s kind of like when you
get married and you have this ideal.
599
00:42:24,519 --> 00:42:27,531
And you�re, you know,
you�re in love and then,
600
00:42:27,532 --> 00:42:31,332
you know, the honeymoon
wears off and reality sets in.
601
00:42:31,611 --> 00:42:34,096
And most people,
once the going gets rough,
602
00:42:34,172 --> 00:42:36,664
don�t jump out immediately.
603
00:42:39,134 --> 00:42:43,357
In one planning commission meeting,
Jim was getting notes, kind of love notes,
604
00:42:43,419 --> 00:42:45,861
from one of the members
on the planning commission.
605
00:42:45,940 --> 00:42:48,715
Jones is sitting there calmly
and so another lady said,
606
00:42:48,784 --> 00:42:50,209
�Well, I don�t know
why you keep doing that.
607
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:53,223
What makes you think you�ve got
something that he wants anyway?�
608
00:42:53,224 --> 00:42:54,449
And so another woman says,
609
00:42:54,519 --> 00:42:56,322
�Well, you know what?
You ought to just take off your clothes
610
00:42:56,323 --> 00:42:58,823
and show him what you got.
You ain�t got nothing.�
611
00:42:58,935 --> 00:43:02,007
And so, by this time,
they looked back to Jones
612
00:43:02,176 --> 00:43:05,426
and so he looks over his glasses,
and he nods with approval.
613
00:43:05,487 --> 00:43:07,391
�Yeah, that�s a good idea.�
614
00:43:07,472 --> 00:43:13,181
She was to be totally naked and
she was down to nothing but her skin,
615
00:43:13,886 --> 00:43:18,229
not even any shoes on, you know,
no bra, no panties, no nothing.
616
00:43:18,276 --> 00:43:20,927
Then they begin to say
what her breasts looked like,
617
00:43:21,003 --> 00:43:23,125
her stomach, butt,
vagina, you name it.
618
00:43:23,213 --> 00:43:25,536
Everything they could think of,
they were saying.
619
00:43:25,595 --> 00:43:27,738
By this time, her face is red,
620
00:43:27,815 --> 00:43:32,042
her body�s almost red from
embarrassment, and I noticed something.
621
00:43:32,116 --> 00:43:34,723
Jones was sitting,
looking over his sunglasses,
622
00:43:34,823 --> 00:43:37,139
but he had a smile on his face
623
00:43:37,242 --> 00:43:40,911
like he�s really enjoying
this woman being torn down.
624
00:43:41,018 --> 00:43:44,868
I have a conscious memory of
sitting there, thinking to myself,
625
00:43:44,985 --> 00:43:46,880
�This is wrong.�
626
00:43:47,015 --> 00:43:52,196
And I didn�t do a damned thing
to stand up and say, �This is wrong.�
627
00:43:52,289 --> 00:43:55,986
It�s like a child
in a dysfunctional family.
628
00:43:56,230 --> 00:44:00,267
On a certain level,
it�s normal, you know?
629
00:44:02,268 --> 00:44:05,368
I just kind of took
everything in stride.
630
00:44:05,648 --> 00:44:10,692
But then we felt like we had gotten
involved and gotten in so deep that
631
00:44:11,693 --> 00:44:13,393
it was actually no way out.
632
00:44:21,097 --> 00:44:24,460
I had traveled on Bus Seven,
which was Jim�s bus.
633
00:44:26,141 --> 00:44:28,520
And he sat down next to me.
634
00:44:30,621 --> 00:44:32,521
And I was sitting there
and I thought,
635
00:44:32,734 --> 00:44:38,542
�That�s weird, it smells
like alcohol next to me.�
636
00:44:39,474 --> 00:44:43,768
And he leaned over and he said,
�Do you know what you do to me?�
637
00:44:46,163 --> 00:44:49,583
He had informed me that
I was to come in... On Bus Seven,
638
00:44:49,584 --> 00:44:53,584
there was a room
in the back for just him.
639
00:44:53,702 --> 00:44:56,483
He had books.
He had a desk. He had a bed.
640
00:44:58,274 --> 00:45:00,638
When everyone got off the bus
at the rest stop,
641
00:45:01,147 --> 00:45:04,830
I went into his little room
and I sat there and waited for him.
642
00:45:06,846 --> 00:45:12,761
And finally he opened the door,
and without any talk or anything,
643
00:45:12,962 --> 00:45:15,760
he just pulled down his pants and...
644
00:45:17,761 --> 00:45:19,761
and had sex with me.
645
00:45:22,269 --> 00:45:25,164
And as I lay there frightened,
646
00:45:25,373 --> 00:45:31,339
not sure what to do,
and as I shivered, he�d say to me,
647
00:45:31,780 --> 00:45:35,475
�This is for you.
I�m doing this for you, Debbie.�
648
00:45:44,956 --> 00:45:48,168
Well, in 1975 it was
a mayoral election in San Francisco.
649
00:45:48,254 --> 00:45:51,818
A conservative candidate and
a liberal candidate, George Moscone.
650
00:45:54,315 --> 00:45:59,222
Jones had several hundred people
who would go door-to-door Election Day.
651
00:45:59,232 --> 00:46:03,459
Instead of a group that might give you
twenty or thirty of these people,
652
00:46:03,460 --> 00:46:06,460
or a hundred, you had
three or four hundred.
653
00:46:07,682 --> 00:46:10,369
The Moscone election was very close.
654
00:46:10,556 --> 00:46:14,098
The margin of victory was
probably no more than 4,000.
655
00:46:14,204 --> 00:46:19,302
So you had to credit a big chunk of
decisive votes to Peoples Temple.
656
00:46:21,673 --> 00:46:25,341
The reward for the election
of George Moscone
657
00:46:25,486 --> 00:46:30,943
was the appointment of Jim Jones
as Chairman of the City Housing Authority.
658
00:46:33,860 --> 00:46:36,629
What was once a really
boring meeting, all of a sudden,
659
00:46:36,673 --> 00:46:39,699
became like really interesting
when Jim Jones became the head of it
660
00:46:39,749 --> 00:46:41,565
because we all
came down on the buses.
661
00:46:41,606 --> 00:46:44,598
And we were instructed that
when Jim came in, we stood,
662
00:46:44,645 --> 00:46:47,696
and when he left or spoke,
we�d stand and clap.
663
00:46:47,759 --> 00:46:50,814
The sheer staginess,
the controlled atmosphere
664
00:46:50,815 --> 00:46:53,215
that sort of enclosed this guy,
665
00:46:53,311 --> 00:46:56,483
made him so unusual,
so different than the norm,
666
00:46:56,684 --> 00:46:59,384
that it made me very curious.
667
00:47:00,752 --> 00:47:02,124
My biggest problem was
getting somebody
668
00:47:02,183 --> 00:47:06,418
to sort of talk to me about the Church
in kind of conversational terms.
669
00:47:08,217 --> 00:47:12,006
I had become friends with
some of the various defectors,
670
00:47:12,007 --> 00:47:14,507
and one of the defectors told me that
671
00:47:14,553 --> 00:47:17,415
she was going to speak
publicly about Jones.
672
00:47:18,010 --> 00:47:21,111
And I said to her, �Well,
if you�re going to speak publicly,
673
00:47:21,199 --> 00:47:24,914
I�m going to speak with you.
I�m not going to let you do this alone.�
674
00:47:26,007 --> 00:47:30,129
I finally heard from
some ex-members who heard
675
00:47:30,222 --> 00:47:33,887
I was interested in writing a story
about the Temple for�New West�magazine,
676
00:47:33,977 --> 00:47:35,874
and they took a chance.
They called me and some of them said,
677
00:47:35,875 --> 00:47:37,675
you know, �You don�t know
nothing about the Church.
678
00:47:37,731 --> 00:47:40,987
Wait until I tell you
what I went through.�
679
00:47:42,514 --> 00:47:44,175
Before the article was going to break,
680
00:47:44,176 --> 00:47:48,276
Jim convinced the publisher
that she needed to read it to him.
681
00:47:48,514 --> 00:47:52,092
He was on one phone and
I was on taping the other end of it,
682
00:47:52,184 --> 00:47:54,742
while somebody else
listened on another one.
683
00:47:55,153 --> 00:47:59,529
Jim didn�t understand that
there was no way he could talk her down
684
00:47:59,830 --> 00:48:02,930
from whatever this article
was going to say.
685
00:48:03,074 --> 00:48:05,674
And as she continues
to read this article,
686
00:48:05,675 --> 00:48:07,775
he�s looking around the room
at about five of us
687
00:48:07,876 --> 00:48:10,532
and you could tell that he�s becoming
more and more anxious and as...
688
00:48:10,615 --> 00:48:13,851
and you know, his mouth
becomes dryer and dryer.
689
00:48:13,952 --> 00:48:18,252
And he realizes that this article
is going to be hugely damning,
690
00:48:19,614 --> 00:48:23,635
and it was midway through it
he mouths to all of us in the room,
691
00:48:23,636 --> 00:48:25,136
�We�re leaving tonight.�
692
00:48:26,368 --> 00:48:28,420
They flew out to Guyana,
693
00:48:28,421 --> 00:48:31,621
six hours before
that article was going to hit.
694
00:48:51,413 --> 00:48:55,768
When Jim Jones decided that
there was too much pressure,
695
00:48:55,906 --> 00:48:59,450
too much trouble
to stay in San Francisco,
696
00:48:59,625 --> 00:49:02,725
he ordered the move to Jonestown
697
00:49:02,826 --> 00:49:06,630
and it happened almost overnight.
698
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:11,013
People were being taken to airports.
699
00:49:11,517 --> 00:49:16,737
There were people who were packing
their belongings and leaving their homes,
700
00:49:16,840 --> 00:49:21,470
with virtually no explanation
to their family members
701
00:49:21,471 --> 00:49:25,071
as to where they were going
or why they were going.
702
00:49:26,658 --> 00:49:32,231
Fred Lewis came home and found that
his wife had taken their seven children
703
00:49:32,592 --> 00:49:36,942
and gone to Guyana,
along with all their possessions.
704
00:49:39,912 --> 00:49:43,262
My wife had gone over
three months prior.
705
00:49:43,380 --> 00:49:44,641
And I was waiting
on pins and needles,
706
00:49:44,642 --> 00:49:48,542
and I was talking to her probably
twice a week on the hand radio
707
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:51,949
and Leona Collier came up,
708
00:49:51,950 --> 00:49:55,150
�Ok, Eugene it�s your time,
you�re going over.�
709
00:49:58,069 --> 00:50:00,829
Coming into Jonestown,
you see a guard at the front gate
710
00:50:00,902 --> 00:50:03,689
and you�re all excited,
you�re going down this road.
711
00:50:04,197 --> 00:50:06,281
The trailer comes to a stop
712
00:50:06,282 --> 00:50:09,082
and then you can see the wooden
pathway that leads to the pavilion.
713
00:50:09,192 --> 00:50:10,800
And you�re just...
714
00:50:10,801 --> 00:50:13,801
you want to run, but you know,
you just try, �Alright I�m gonna be cool.�
715
00:50:14,763 --> 00:50:16,777
And just as you reach
the edge of the pavilion,
716
00:50:16,778 --> 00:50:18,678
people started rushing you
that you knew, you know.
717
00:50:18,762 --> 00:50:22,302
My wife was there. Haven�t seen
my mother in over a year or so.
718
00:50:22,398 --> 00:50:27,157
And I�m just hugging people
and it�s just... it�s like, I have arrived
719
00:50:27,231 --> 00:50:29,805
and everything is
going to be okay now.
720
00:50:44,313 --> 00:50:48,924
I have never been so totally
happy or fulfilled in my life.
721
00:50:48,949 --> 00:50:50,640
I can�t begin to describe it.
You could sit here
722
00:50:50,724 --> 00:50:53,697
and talk all day long and no words
could describe the peace, the beauty,
723
00:50:53,759 --> 00:50:58,036
the sense of accomplishment and
responsibility and camaraderie that�s here.
724
00:50:58,096 --> 00:51:01,898
It�s overwhelming, it really is.
You can�t describe it.
725
00:51:02,167 --> 00:51:06,577
You know, it�s just such an exciting time.
Everything was new and unique and...
726
00:51:07,083 --> 00:51:11,007
and just fun. You know,
we just had fun with it as it grew.
727
00:51:14,359 --> 00:51:17,438
I just loved that
we created what we ate,
728
00:51:17,486 --> 00:51:19,973
that we did all these jobs.
729
00:51:22,258 --> 00:51:24,856
What you think about your friends
back down in the States?
730
00:51:24,878 --> 00:51:26,692
You think they should be here?
731
00:51:27,079 --> 00:51:30,403
Do you want to share with them
this morning? Speak up!
732
00:51:30,478 --> 00:51:32,751
- I wished I could, share with them,
- Can you do it?
733
00:51:33,353 --> 00:51:37,117
- but they won�t listen to me.
- Would you do it? Won�t listen to you, huh?
734
00:51:38,820 --> 00:51:41,607
When you don�t have anything,
735
00:51:41,635 --> 00:51:43,678
you own Jonestown
you are part of Jonestown.
736
00:51:43,702 --> 00:51:48,282
You were a shareholder of Jonestown
if you were African American.
737
00:51:48,591 --> 00:51:54,378
It gave them the opportunity to...
to really be a part of creating a utopia.
738
00:52:35,344 --> 00:52:37,566
I think that Jim Jones
took his group down there
739
00:52:37,625 --> 00:52:39,623
because he was afraid
to face the publicity
740
00:52:39,624 --> 00:52:42,524
and answer the questions
here in this country.
741
00:52:42,596 --> 00:52:45,067
I don�t think that he feels confident
742
00:52:45,099 --> 00:52:47,734
having people talk to their relatives.
743
00:52:47,804 --> 00:52:50,822
I think the only way he can survive
and sustain what he started
744
00:52:50,866 --> 00:52:55,080
is to isolate all his followers
from this country and from their families.
745
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:58,590
The Concerned Relatives
were the ex-members
746
00:52:58,654 --> 00:53:01,156
who wanted other family members,
still in the church,
747
00:53:01,236 --> 00:53:02,913
to know they could leave.
748
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:06,280
They wanted them to feel
that there was an outside world,
749
00:53:06,322 --> 00:53:08,613
that Jones was wrong about telling people
they could never leave the church,
750
00:53:08,683 --> 00:53:11,975
and that they would be
treated badly in the real world.
751
00:53:12,250 --> 00:53:17,815
The Concerned Relatives prompted
FCC�investigation of Peoples Temple.
752
00:53:17,894 --> 00:53:22,588
They organized letter-writing campaigns
to public officials, to members of Congress.
753
00:53:22,679 --> 00:53:27,631
They were incredibly effective
in mobilizing government
754
00:53:27,729 --> 00:53:30,677
and media interest
in Peoples Temple.
755
00:53:30,738 --> 00:53:33,229
He was talking integration.
He was talking helping people.
756
00:53:33,267 --> 00:53:36,069
He was talking
better this and better that.
757
00:53:36,070 --> 00:53:39,070
What about now?
What�s your impression now?
758
00:53:40,113 --> 00:53:44,103
My impression now,
that those are fronts for him.
759
00:53:44,104 --> 00:53:46,404
I think he�s gone crazy.
760
00:53:53,740 --> 00:53:58,501
When Jim Jones wasn�t there,
things tended to be a little bit lighter.
761
00:53:59,641 --> 00:54:01,847
You know, people would be
dancing or singing.
762
00:54:01,848 --> 00:54:04,848
There would be music
in different cottages.
763
00:54:06,619 --> 00:54:10,627
But when Jones was present,
it was very, very dark.
764
00:54:10,724 --> 00:54:12,847
It was almost like a dark cloud.
765
00:54:16,920 --> 00:54:20,016
In Jonestown,
there was a speaker system
766
00:54:20,017 --> 00:54:22,017
and only Jim spoke on it.
767
00:54:22,083 --> 00:54:26,443
And it went twenty-four hours a day
and he would tape himself.
768
00:54:26,543 --> 00:54:29,144
So, in the middle of the night,
all through the night,
769
00:54:29,145 --> 00:54:31,345
his voice was talking to you.
770
00:54:31,410 --> 00:54:34,889
The United States is calling for
the removal of all Blacks and Indians.
771
00:54:34,890 --> 00:54:36,090
So is England.
772
00:54:36,139 --> 00:54:41,408
They want to have their immigrant Black,
Indian population removed in six months.
773
00:54:41,836 --> 00:54:45,302
We had no other radio or T.V.
or communication with parents
774
00:54:45,385 --> 00:54:51,327
or any kind of, you know, update
that could show us, really,
775
00:54:51,378 --> 00:54:56,407
that there�s a whole other thing going on
besides what Jim was interpreting for us.
776
00:54:56,440 --> 00:54:58,569
I make my stand clear.
777
00:54:58,670 --> 00:55:02,670
Give us our liberty
or give us our death.
778
00:55:03,026 --> 00:55:05,658
No matter where you were,
you could hear.
779
00:55:06,285 --> 00:55:10,246
You could hear it in your...
in your bunk at night.
780
00:55:10,337 --> 00:55:12,809
You could hear it
when you�re in the outhouse.
781
00:55:12,910 --> 00:55:16,610
You could hear it when
you were working in the field.
782
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:20,164
You...
you could hear it all the time.
783
00:55:20,219 --> 00:55:23,171
At least on those terms,
we choose our death
784
00:55:23,269 --> 00:55:25,440
and no one chooses it for us.
785
00:55:25,641 --> 00:55:27,741
Don�t try to take any of our children.
786
00:55:28,226 --> 00:55:33,897
There was this pervasive sense
of being under attack in Jonestown.
787
00:55:34,010 --> 00:55:37,626
He told them that things were
just getting worse in the United States,
788
00:55:37,705 --> 00:55:39,539
they couldn�t go back home.
789
00:55:39,605 --> 00:55:43,425
And not only that, but these
forces were traveling to Guyana
790
00:55:43,465 --> 00:55:45,472
to destroy them there.
791
00:55:45,551 --> 00:55:48,259
You can�t know how much
of a conspiracy there is
792
00:55:48,260 --> 00:55:49,860
in the U.S. these days.
793
00:55:50,037 --> 00:55:52,079
Maybe it�s economics?
Who knows what it is?
794
00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:54,880
I�m not able to say.
But I do know it�s real.
795
00:55:55,025 --> 00:55:58,272
It�s obvious that Martin Luther King
was murdered by conspiracy,
796
00:55:58,273 --> 00:55:59,773
Malcolm X, Senator Kennedy�
797
00:55:59,835 --> 00:56:03,538
Over the summer of 1978,
all of us noticed that
798
00:56:03,602 --> 00:56:05,924
Jim was seemed to be getting sicker.
799
00:56:06,029 --> 00:56:10,302
His harangues over the loudspeaker
were getting more and more frantic,
800
00:56:10,406 --> 00:56:13,703
and really just sounding
more and more insane.
801
00:56:14,251 --> 00:56:19,017
He had gotten to the place that
even his voice was becoming slurred,
802
00:56:19,301 --> 00:56:21,534
and he said it was because
803
00:56:21,565 --> 00:56:25,547
the nurse was giving him
the wrong medications.
804
00:56:25,693 --> 00:56:29,142
But yet still, everyday
it was getting worse and worse.
805
00:56:30,744 --> 00:56:32,594
Every night, at some point,
806
00:56:32,595 --> 00:56:35,595
his voice would come over
the loudspeaker and he�d say,
807
00:56:35,797 --> 00:56:38,078
�I�m sending somebody out tonight,
808
00:56:38,149 --> 00:56:41,056
somebody you know,
somebody you trust
809
00:56:41,152 --> 00:56:44,154
and they�re going to act like
they want to leave.
810
00:56:44,293 --> 00:56:48,577
But this is a loyalty test
and you need to turn them in.�
811
00:56:50,647 --> 00:56:54,203
A father would turn in a son.
A husband would turn in a wife.
812
00:56:54,275 --> 00:56:57,572
A small child would turn in a parent.
813
00:56:59,417 --> 00:57:04,416
There was no freedom to express
to one another what was going on,
814
00:57:04,474 --> 00:57:07,688
because everything was suspect.
815
00:57:08,084 --> 00:57:13,169
The most forbidden thing
to express was to leave.
816
00:57:14,538 --> 00:57:17,853
He had a real issue with separation.
817
00:57:18,854 --> 00:57:21,154
People could not leave him.
818
00:57:22,352 --> 00:57:28,159
He took it as a betrayal
to the cause, and to him personally.
819
00:57:29,553 --> 00:57:34,688
He said, �I really want to get away
from him. By Christmas, I will be gone.�
820
00:57:34,794 --> 00:57:39,255
By Christmas, do you want to be gone?
By Christmas, do you want to be gone?!
821
00:57:39,325 --> 00:57:41,894
By Christmas, do you want to be gone?!!
822
00:57:41,953 --> 00:57:45,279
I would ask you, could I go home
and make a trip to see my people?
823
00:57:45,363 --> 00:57:48,885
I have the power
to send you home by Christmas,
824
00:57:48,979 --> 00:57:51,370
but it�s not on Transworld Airlines.
825
00:57:51,497 --> 00:57:55,508
It�s blasphemy! It�s blasphemy
to talk about going back
826
00:57:55,591 --> 00:57:57,937
when you have not been
given any approval!
827
00:57:57,990 --> 00:58:00,226
Do you want to go home?
828
00:58:00,712 --> 00:58:03,647
- No.
- Well, then be seated and shut your mouth
829
00:58:03,648 --> 00:58:05,805
and don�t be in my face anymore.
830
00:58:11,371 --> 00:58:15,217
Congressman Ryan was unique
in the political sphere.
831
00:58:15,287 --> 00:58:19,225
He had this hands-on
approach to legislating.
832
00:58:19,226 --> 00:58:22,726
He just didn�t take no for an answer.
833
00:58:22,798 --> 00:58:26,814
So when he was in the state assembly,
he went to Folsom State Prison
834
00:58:27,247 --> 00:58:29,236
and spent a week as an inmate
835
00:58:29,322 --> 00:58:33,103
to understand the prison issues
and prison reform.
836
00:58:34,221 --> 00:58:36,607
He became concerned
837
00:58:36,608 --> 00:58:41,808
because a number of residents
in San Mateo County had become
838
00:58:41,868 --> 00:58:43,380
members of the Peoples Temple
839
00:58:43,381 --> 00:58:46,381
and family members
started contacting him,
840
00:58:46,437 --> 00:58:49,373
concerned about
their whereabouts
841
00:58:49,406 --> 00:58:54,537
and concerned about whether or not
they were being held against their will.
842
00:58:55,230 --> 00:58:59,508
The word we were getting was
that there was an armed encampment.
843
00:59:01,019 --> 00:59:04,456
It was enough
for the Congressman to say,
844
00:59:04,511 --> 00:59:07,889
�You know what?
I want to go find out for myself.�
845
00:59:17,458 --> 00:59:21,632
There was a lot of preparation
for Congressman Ryan�s visit.
846
00:59:21,709 --> 00:59:26,144
There was all these different
scenarios that were presented.
847
00:59:26,399 --> 00:59:29,250
He wasn�t going to let him in.
He was going to let him in.
848
00:59:30,025 --> 00:59:31,513
We were going to wait
for them to come in
849
00:59:31,514 --> 00:59:33,914
and we were going to kill 'em all
when they came in.
850
00:59:34,795 --> 00:59:37,122
I was very fearful
about making the trip.
851
00:59:37,512 --> 00:59:39,808
I had a copy of the Congressman�s will
852
00:59:39,809 --> 00:59:44,209
and placed it in a
particular drawer in my desk,
853
00:59:45,608 --> 00:59:47,530
just in case.
854
00:59:54,967 --> 00:59:58,948
We flew in sometime
in the afternoon, about 6pm.
855
00:59:59,747 --> 01:00:04,737
We saw this beautiful sign,
�Welcome to Jonestown.�
856
01:00:06,255 --> 01:00:11,270
As we approached Jonestown,
it was spartan,
857
01:00:11,768 --> 01:00:15,696
but very impressive.
858
01:00:15,879 --> 01:00:18,507
How could you not be impressed that
859
01:00:18,584 --> 01:00:23,171
out of the jungles of Guyana,
they had carved out a community?
860
01:00:23,962 --> 01:00:28,092
They had crops growing.
They had cabins.
861
01:00:28,151 --> 01:00:31,406
They had a little medical clinic,
a little daycare area.
862
01:00:32,263 --> 01:00:36,241
Flour, rice, black-eyed peas,
863
01:00:37,113 --> 01:00:38,713
more peas.
864
01:00:38,714 --> 01:00:40,372
We have different containers
surrounding the place
865
01:00:40,505 --> 01:00:44,270
we couldn�t go through all of the tremendous
inventory they built up. Kool-aid...
866
01:00:54,515 --> 01:00:56,838
When Ryan came,
he came on a Friday night
867
01:00:57,839 --> 01:01:00,839
and we put on a reception for him.
868
01:01:01,707 --> 01:01:05,838
The songs that we sang
that night, it was people saying,
869
01:01:05,910 --> 01:01:08,622
�This is who we are
and this is what we are about.�
870
01:01:23,157 --> 01:01:25,791
It was a vibrant community.
871
01:01:26,192 --> 01:01:29,792
I would never have imagined
that twenty-four hours later,
872
01:01:29,861 --> 01:01:32,089
those people would be dead.
873
01:01:53,242 --> 01:01:57,027
Everything up to that point
was, was... was good.
874
01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:00,691
Everybody was thrilled
that Ryan was thrilled.
875
01:02:00,792 --> 01:02:02,492
He just kind of praised us.
876
01:02:02,561 --> 01:02:05,920
I think that all of you know that
I am here to find out more about...
877
01:02:06,006 --> 01:02:08,057
Questions have been raised
about your operation here.
878
01:02:08,169 --> 01:02:09,525
And I can tell you right now,
879
01:02:09,526 --> 01:02:12,426
that from the few conversations
I�ve had with some of the folks here
880
01:02:12,531 --> 01:02:13,803
already this evening,
881
01:02:13,804 --> 01:02:16,804
that whatever these comments are,
there are some people here who believe
882
01:02:16,892 --> 01:02:20,104
that this is the best thing
they�ve ever had in their whole lives.
883
01:02:28,658 --> 01:02:32,893
That response to him
was spontaneous. It was loud.
884
01:02:33,012 --> 01:02:35,741
It was emotional.
885
01:02:38,643 --> 01:02:44,211
What I was feeling was,
this is an opportunity that I can vocalize
886
01:02:44,351 --> 01:02:47,607
how much I believe
in what we are doing here.
887
01:02:47,841 --> 01:02:49,135
The reporter next to me said,
888
01:02:49,319 --> 01:02:51,266
�I�ve never felt anything
like this before,� and I said,
889
01:02:51,311 --> 01:02:55,050
�Because you haven�t felt
anything like this before.�
890
01:03:02,003 --> 01:03:04,975
I actually felt pretty good overall.
891
01:03:05,313 --> 01:03:09,519
This went probably as well
as it possibly could go, so far.
892
01:03:14,110 --> 01:03:18,331
When Congressman Ryan came,
I wanted to pass him a note
893
01:03:18,418 --> 01:03:21,276
that said, �Help us
get out of Jonestown.�
894
01:03:23,599 --> 01:03:28,532
When one of the reporters was walking
around toward the edge of the pavilion,
895
01:03:28,895 --> 01:03:34,755
I stuck the note in the fold of his arm
and it fell to the ground.
896
01:03:35,449 --> 01:03:38,183
And so I picked up the note and I...
and I gave it back to him.
897
01:03:38,184 --> 01:03:41,684
I said, �You dropped something,�
and this little boy, about nine years old,
898
01:03:41,763 --> 01:03:44,224
started saying,
�He passed a note! He passed a note!�
899
01:03:44,300 --> 01:03:47,582
Don Harris, who was the�NBC�reporter,
900
01:03:48,537 --> 01:03:51,426
came up to me and Congressman Ryan
901
01:03:51,498 --> 01:03:57,222
and handed us these two notes
from people that wanted to leave.
902
01:03:57,657 --> 01:03:59,157
So at that point,
903
01:03:59,958 --> 01:04:04,658
we knew that
something was very, very wrong.
904
01:04:18,488 --> 01:04:24,277
I was like the first to rise up
the following morning.
905
01:04:25,246 --> 01:04:30,644
It was a bright sunny day,
but it was a dark day.
906
01:04:31,342 --> 01:04:33,285
It just didn�t feel right.
907
01:04:33,351 --> 01:04:36,844
We were there, supposed to interview
some of the family members
908
01:04:36,952 --> 01:04:39,257
to ask them why they cannot leave.
909
01:04:39,260 --> 01:04:40,772
Are you happy here?
910
01:04:40,797 --> 01:04:43,654
Oh, I should say I am.
I�ve never been any happier in my life.
911
01:04:43,662 --> 01:04:45,162
Do you want to stay?
912
01:04:45,163 --> 01:04:48,718
Definitely.
I certainly do.
913
01:04:48,798 --> 01:04:52,481
Some people have said
they couldn�t leave if they wanted to.
914
01:04:52,590 --> 01:04:54,310
Do you think you could?
915
01:04:54,389 --> 01:04:57,005
Yeah. If I really wanted to
I�m... I�m free to go,
916
01:04:57,039 --> 01:05:00,383
if I really wanted to.
I would be free to go.
917
01:05:00,573 --> 01:05:04,239
Well, I believe it. I�ve been here
a few days and I have...
918
01:05:04,240 --> 01:05:06,240
I have absolutely
no complaints at all.
919
01:05:06,351 --> 01:05:09,352
It is really nice here.
It is really nice.
920
01:05:09,410 --> 01:05:11,755
And I�ll be leaving in a couple weeks
921
01:05:11,853 --> 01:05:15,060
and they could come with me,
but they said they didn�t want to come.
922
01:05:18,797 --> 01:05:22,537
Literally, out of nowhere,
this storm came blowing in.
923
01:05:22,629 --> 01:05:26,061
The sky turned black.
The wind came up and it just,
924
01:05:26,154 --> 01:05:28,564
torrential rain.
925
01:05:29,431 --> 01:05:35,321
But what I personally felt was
that evil itself blew into Jonestown.
926
01:05:38,909 --> 01:05:41,029
It was about 11:30 in the morning.
927
01:05:41,230 --> 01:05:44,130
Edith Parks walked up to
Jackie Speier and said,
928
01:05:44,190 --> 01:05:47,198
�I�m being held prisoner here,
I want to go home.�
929
01:05:47,315 --> 01:05:49,967
Now do I both
understand you to say that
930
01:05:49,968 --> 01:05:52,968
you both want to leave
Jonestown on this date,
931
01:05:53,072 --> 01:05:55,325
November 18th, 1978?
932
01:05:55,395 --> 01:05:58,182
Immediately,
the whole vibe changed.
933
01:05:58,249 --> 01:06:00,591
I mean this reporter said,
�We got our story.�
934
01:06:00,592 --> 01:06:02,592
You know, �The story�s here.
It�s happening right now.�
935
01:06:02,638 --> 01:06:07,542
Jim Jones came to talk to me
and the first thing he said was,
936
01:06:07,836 --> 01:06:11,750
�Don�t say anything to the reporters.
They�re all liars.�
937
01:06:12,627 --> 01:06:15,123
The last words I heard
from Jim Jones was,
938
01:06:15,124 --> 01:06:18,957
�I just want you to know that
you can come back to Jonestown
939
01:06:19,017 --> 01:06:21,478
and visit your son
any time you want.�
940
01:06:21,590 --> 01:06:25,331
Last night, someone came
and passed me this note.
941
01:06:26,234 --> 01:06:28,489
He�s the one that
I�m just talking about.
942
01:06:29,690 --> 01:06:32,490
This is the man that
wants to leave his son here.
943
01:06:33,884 --> 01:06:37,712
Doesn�t it concern you, though,
that this man, for whatever reason,
944
01:06:37,827 --> 01:06:39,689
one of the people in your group�
945
01:06:39,748 --> 01:06:43,550
People play games, friend.
They lie. They lie.
946
01:06:43,626 --> 01:06:44,950
What can I do about liars?
947
01:06:45,038 --> 01:06:49,295
Are you people going to leave us.
I just beg you, please leave us.
948
01:06:49,412 --> 01:06:51,355
Bill, we will bother nobody.
949
01:06:51,356 --> 01:06:53,456
Anybody wants to
get out of here, can get out of here.
950
01:06:53,574 --> 01:06:55,246
They have no problem
about getting out of here.
951
01:06:55,287 --> 01:06:59,321
They come and go all the time.
I don�t know what kind of games people like.
952
01:06:59,354 --> 01:07:02,721
Who... people like publicity.
Some people do. I don�t.
953
01:07:03,337 --> 01:07:04,535
But some people like publicity.
954
01:07:04,608 --> 01:07:08,189
But if it�s so damned bad,
why is he leaving his son here?
955
01:07:08,640 --> 01:07:10,783
Can you give me
a good reason for that?
956
01:07:10,851 --> 01:07:15,067
When word got out
that people were leaving,
957
01:07:16,585 --> 01:07:18,141
all hell broke out.
958
01:07:18,205 --> 01:07:20,685
You bring those kids back here!
959
01:07:20,870 --> 01:07:23,152
You bring them back!
960
01:07:23,504 --> 01:07:25,703
Don�t you touch my kids!
961
01:07:26,593 --> 01:07:28,512
More people wanted to leave.
962
01:07:28,597 --> 01:07:33,155
And then Jim Jones started
to make pleas to people, saying,
963
01:07:33,246 --> 01:07:36,583
�You can�t leave.
You�re my people.
964
01:07:37,060 --> 01:07:39,163
Why do you want to leave?�
965
01:07:40,659 --> 01:07:44,924
It was an emotional roller coaster
for everyone there.
966
01:07:44,981 --> 01:07:47,381
Don�t you touch my kids!
967
01:07:48,582 --> 01:07:49,682
Mother!
968
01:07:50,183 --> 01:07:52,983
You�re not taking my kids!
No!
969
01:07:54,903 --> 01:07:57,136
Jones was in the pavilion.
970
01:07:58,137 --> 01:07:59,337
At one point, he said,
971
01:07:59,401 --> 01:08:00,987
�Well, of course
you can go if you want.�
972
01:08:01,021 --> 01:08:03,815
But clearly,
that was not the message.
973
01:08:03,851 --> 01:08:06,563
The message was,
�You are betraying me.�
974
01:08:08,684 --> 01:08:12,115
I went and I spoke to
the Congressman in the pavilion.
975
01:08:13,041 --> 01:08:18,844
I told him, �You are in extreme danger.
You need to leave.�
976
01:08:20,343 --> 01:08:23,044
And he said, �You don�t have
anything to worry about.�
977
01:08:23,166 --> 01:08:27,002
He says, �You have the Congressional
shield of protection around you.�
978
01:08:27,684 --> 01:08:32,659
And I just looked at him
like he was totally insane.
979
01:08:33,729 --> 01:08:36,025
Congressman Ryan was
directly across from me,
980
01:08:36,123 --> 01:08:39,731
and I saw this Temple member
walk up behind him
981
01:08:39,820 --> 01:08:42,430
and he was actually
crying and shaking
982
01:08:42,504 --> 01:08:45,818
and all of a sudden,
he pulled out this knife and said,
983
01:08:45,862 --> 01:08:48,070
�All right, motherfucker,
you�re gonna die.�
984
01:08:48,149 --> 01:08:51,521
We all jumped on him,
and there were just screams of horror
985
01:08:51,594 --> 01:08:53,183
everywhere.
986
01:08:53,301 --> 01:08:58,823
We heard this great uproar
in the pavilion and the truck stopped.
987
01:08:59,272 --> 01:09:02,665
Then, shortly thereafter,
Congressman Ryan starts walking out
988
01:09:02,737 --> 01:09:05,084
in this bloodstained shirt.
989
01:09:06,636 --> 01:09:10,616
Those of us in the news media
viewed Congressman Ryan
990
01:09:10,724 --> 01:09:15,312
as a form of protection,
a shield of the United States.
991
01:09:16,433 --> 01:09:19,549
What happened there
in those few moments
992
01:09:19,623 --> 01:09:23,352
made it clear that nobody was safe.
993
01:09:28,323 --> 01:09:31,480
I went back to my cottage.
994
01:09:31,616 --> 01:09:34,899
All I wanted to do was
see my wife and my son.
995
01:09:35,748 --> 01:09:38,026
Gloria and I were laid down
on the cot and we just held each other
996
01:09:38,120 --> 01:09:40,390
and I said, �You know,
I think we may all die.�
997
01:09:40,505 --> 01:09:44,334
And she said, she kind of looked at me
and then she looked down at our son,
998
01:09:44,419 --> 01:09:46,428
who was playing on the floor
with the toys,
999
01:09:46,502 --> 01:09:48,468
and she said,
�You�re scaring him.�
1000
01:09:48,648 --> 01:09:52,435
I had literally opened my mouth
to say we need to leave,
1001
01:09:52,665 --> 01:09:54,390
when there was an
announcement on the loud speaker,
1002
01:09:54,391 --> 01:09:57,591
�Will everybody report to
the pavilion for a meeting.�
1003
01:10:09,319 --> 01:10:12,629
We drove back
to the airstrip, Port Kaituma.
1004
01:10:14,133 --> 01:10:19,815
All of a sudden, we saw a dump truck
from far away arriving to this airstrip.
1005
01:10:20,109 --> 01:10:23,312
We realized these people
catch up from people from Jim Jones,
1006
01:10:23,313 --> 01:10:26,313
they�re very close lieutenant
to Jim Jones.
1007
01:10:29,540 --> 01:10:31,124
These three guys,
1008
01:10:31,125 --> 01:10:33,425
they get off the truck
and walk around this area
1009
01:10:33,622 --> 01:10:35,718
as though they were
looking for somebody.
1010
01:10:35,791 --> 01:10:37,721
They looked in people�s faces.
1011
01:10:37,806 --> 01:10:40,347
They stared at us for a little bit,
but they didn�t say one word.
1012
01:10:40,442 --> 01:10:42,278
They didn�t ask anything.
1013
01:10:42,385 --> 01:10:44,509
Right away,
they walked back to the truck.
1014
01:10:45,622 --> 01:10:50,300
They drove this truck
all the way across the airstrip
1015
01:10:50,442 --> 01:10:53,116
and stop on this side of the plane,
1016
01:10:53,240 --> 01:10:56,550
so literally
they cut us off from the jungle.
1017
01:10:58,567 --> 01:11:02,480
We never know there�s people
hidden inside the dump truck.
1018
01:11:02,573 --> 01:11:05,797
The moment it stopped,
they start shooting right away.
1019
01:11:10,073 --> 01:11:13,735
Everybody ran toward the plane,
on this side of plane.
1020
01:11:13,825 --> 01:11:16,140
They try to hide
underneath the wheels.
1021
01:11:16,195 --> 01:11:20,431
Then the Congressman ran under
the plane, and I sort of followed suit
1022
01:11:20,547 --> 01:11:23,756
and got behind one of the tires.
1023
01:11:26,346 --> 01:11:30,600
All you can hear is the gun
"pop, pop, pop" goes off constantly.
1024
01:11:31,017 --> 01:11:34,267
We lie flat on the tarmac
at that moment.
1025
01:11:34,762 --> 01:11:39,320
But shortly afterwards,
I heard my partner, the cameraman.
1026
01:11:39,428 --> 01:11:42,719
He yelled, �Oh shit.� He said he got...
he got shot. He was sitting up.
1027
01:11:45,207 --> 01:11:48,464
There were people
tumbling and yelling
1028
01:11:48,665 --> 01:11:51,965
and letting out cries
as they were hit.
1029
01:11:53,040 --> 01:11:56,263
I was hit in my arm and wrist.
1030
01:11:56,624 --> 01:12:00,072
I felt a tremendous explosion,
right next to my head.
1031
01:12:00,182 --> 01:12:04,911
I got a tremendous pain
ran through my arm and on my shoulder.
1032
01:12:05,280 --> 01:12:07,927
I was really shaking,
but I didn�t move.
1033
01:12:08,018 --> 01:12:10,857
I took the pain and hold still.
1034
01:12:11,309 --> 01:12:16,136
I was lying on my side,
pretending that I was dead,
1035
01:12:16,266 --> 01:12:18,538
with my head down.
And...
1036
01:12:23,120 --> 01:12:28,204
they came and shot me
at point blank,
1037
01:12:28,505 --> 01:12:30,505
point blank range.
1038
01:12:31,971 --> 01:12:34,968
I remember someone coming to me
1039
01:12:35,037 --> 01:12:37,612
and telling me that
Congressman Ryan was dead.
1040
01:12:37,691 --> 01:12:41,313
But I was at a point where
I didn�t know
1041
01:12:41,413 --> 01:12:44,781
how much more time
I was going to be alive.
1042
01:12:49,362 --> 01:12:52,634
The gun�s dead and all we can hear
this one engine was still running.
1043
01:12:52,729 --> 01:12:56,204
So all you could hear
the engine noise. And that�s it.
1044
01:13:07,563 --> 01:13:10,909
We walked up to the pavilion
together, with everybody else.
1045
01:13:10,986 --> 01:13:14,104
It was very quiet.
It was very somber. It was very sad,
1046
01:13:14,242 --> 01:13:16,945
but it wasn�t a death march.
1047
01:13:17,420 --> 01:13:19,158
The congressman is dead!
1048
01:13:21,791 --> 01:13:24,553
You think they�re going to
allow us to get by with this?
1049
01:13:26,214 --> 01:13:29,927
You must be insane. They�ll torture
some of our children here.
1050
01:13:29,971 --> 01:13:31,952
They�ll torture our people.
They�ll torture our seniors.
1051
01:13:31,953 --> 01:13:33,653
We can not have this!
1052
01:13:34,071 --> 01:13:36,001
He said, �Well, we got to go.
1053
01:13:36,602 --> 01:13:39,502
We got to get out of here.
We got to... we got to go to sleep.
1054
01:13:40,381 --> 01:13:42,635
Get the solution together.�
1055
01:13:42,719 --> 01:13:46,583
If we can�t live in peace,
then let�s die in peace.
1056
01:13:48,988 --> 01:13:51,617
Maria Katsaris walked up to him
and whispered in his ear,
1057
01:13:51,685 --> 01:13:55,000
and he looked at her and said, �Is there
anyway to make it taste less bitter?�
1058
01:13:55,980 --> 01:13:58,022
And she said,
�No, no apparently not.�
1059
01:13:58,117 --> 01:14:00,008
And he said, �Is it quick?�
1060
01:14:00,111 --> 01:14:03,404
And she said,
�Yeah, it�s supposed to be quick.�
1061
01:14:03,531 --> 01:14:07,781
Anyone that has any
dissenting opinion, please speak.
1062
01:14:08,805 --> 01:14:11,667
When we destroy ourselves,
we�re defeated.
1063
01:14:12,045 --> 01:14:14,890
We let them,
the enemies, defeat us.
1064
01:14:15,081 --> 01:14:18,139
On the last day of Jonestown,
Christine Miller stood up and said,
1065
01:14:18,206 --> 01:14:19,585
�I don�t want to die here.
1066
01:14:19,648 --> 01:14:23,210
Why are we going to throw
all this away? We�ve worked too hard.�
1067
01:14:23,305 --> 01:14:26,348
I look at all the babies,
and I think they deserve to live.
1068
01:14:26,446 --> 01:14:30,648
I agree, but also they deserve�
What�s more, they deserve peace.
1069
01:14:32,463 --> 01:14:37,711
We all came here for peace.
Is it too late for Russia?
1070
01:14:38,100 --> 01:14:41,305
She�s calling Jim Jones
on some of the things that
1071
01:14:41,404 --> 01:14:44,386
he has promised them
that they were going to do.
1072
01:14:45,139 --> 01:14:49,235
Jim had promised, as an
alternative to them dying in Jonestown,
1073
01:14:49,322 --> 01:14:51,744
that they could go
to the Soviet Union.
1074
01:14:51,826 --> 01:14:54,126
I�m listening to you.
You asked me about Russia.
1075
01:14:54,199 --> 01:14:56,158
I�m right now
making a call to Russia.
1076
01:14:56,258 --> 01:14:58,417
What more do you suggest?
1077
01:14:58,522 --> 01:15:00,599
Eventually, the rhetoric
ratchets up enough
1078
01:15:00,600 --> 01:15:02,300
that she is shouted down.
1079
01:15:02,410 --> 01:15:05,917
Christine, your life
has been extended to today.
1080
01:15:05,985 --> 01:15:08,597
That you�re standing there
is because of him.
1081
01:15:09,899 --> 01:15:13,022
That�s when I noticed
that there were armed guards
1082
01:15:13,096 --> 01:15:15,572
that had kind of taken positions
up around the pavilion.
1083
01:15:15,773 --> 01:15:16,973
I�m thinking,
1084
01:15:17,076 --> 01:15:19,816
�Where did all of these
fucking guns come from?�
1085
01:15:21,566 --> 01:15:26,045
Jones came down off the podium
1086
01:15:26,146 --> 01:15:29,846
and he said,
�Hey, we got to do this.
1087
01:15:30,460 --> 01:15:32,269
We got to... we got to go,
1088
01:15:32,370 --> 01:15:35,903
that if we don�t go this way,
we going to go like this.�
1089
01:15:37,213 --> 01:15:39,993
They were coming,
taking like newborn babies
1090
01:15:40,194 --> 01:15:41,894
out of their mothers� arms.
1091
01:15:42,044 --> 01:15:44,827
Mother, mother, mother,
mother, mother please.
1092
01:15:45,582 --> 01:15:49,047
Mother, please,
please, please don�t�
1093
01:15:49,048 --> 01:15:51,048
Don�t do this!
Don�t do this!
1094
01:15:52,720 --> 01:15:56,337
Lay down your life with your child.
But don�t do this.
1095
01:15:59,980 --> 01:16:03,638
There was a young kid,
his name was Sunny
1096
01:16:04,139 --> 01:16:06,139
and when he came inside,
1097
01:16:06,440 --> 01:16:09,040
he bumped into me.
1098
01:16:09,250 --> 01:16:11,373
At that same time,
he�s falling to the ground
1099
01:16:11,374 --> 01:16:13,774
and he�s going into convulsion.
1100
01:16:13,862 --> 01:16:16,397
Hurry, hurry, my children, hurry!
1101
01:16:16,398 --> 01:16:19,398
All right, let us not fall
into the hands of the enemy.
1102
01:16:19,447 --> 01:16:22,838
Hurry my children!
Hurry!
1103
01:16:22,898 --> 01:16:26,972
I grabbed the kid
from the shoulders up,
1104
01:16:27,273 --> 01:16:31,473
and in that process of
taking him out of the pavilion,
1105
01:16:31,918 --> 01:16:34,096
this kid died in my arms.
1106
01:16:34,097 --> 01:16:38,097
I mean, I just felt
the life go out of him.
1107
01:16:38,190 --> 01:16:43,152
To me... at that point,
I knew that this shit was real.
1108
01:16:44,546 --> 01:16:47,974
Die with respect,
die with a degree of dignity.
1109
01:16:48,129 --> 01:16:51,149
It�s nothing to death, it�s just
stepping over into another plane.
1110
01:16:51,150 --> 01:16:53,250
Don�t, don�t be this way!
1111
01:16:55,175 --> 01:16:57,268
I ain�t never used
the term �suicide,�
1112
01:16:57,269 --> 01:16:59,969
and I�m not gonna never
use the term �suicide.�
1113
01:17:00,103 --> 01:17:02,835
That man killed... was killing us.
1114
01:17:03,875 --> 01:17:06,893
As I walked up
to the back of the pavilion,
1115
01:17:06,894 --> 01:17:10,594
I saw a woman named Rosie
on the ground crying,
1116
01:17:10,595 --> 01:17:12,595
holding her dead baby.
1117
01:17:12,689 --> 01:17:15,707
There were maybe eight
or nine other people who were dying,
1118
01:17:15,708 --> 01:17:17,808
or in the process of dying.
1119
01:17:17,963 --> 01:17:23,609
Inside, I just wanted things to stop.
Please, just let me catch my breath,
1120
01:17:23,755 --> 01:17:26,689
let me figure out
what�s happening here.
1121
01:17:28,552 --> 01:17:31,872
I looked to my right
and I saw my wife,
1122
01:17:31,876 --> 01:17:34,385
with our son in her arms
1123
01:17:34,786 --> 01:17:38,386
and poison
being injected into his mouth.
1124
01:17:39,783 --> 01:17:42,635
My son was dead and
he was frothing at the mouth.
1125
01:17:42,707 --> 01:17:45,758
You know, cyanide
makes people froth at the mouth.
1126
01:17:46,985 --> 01:17:48,816
My wife died in my arms
1127
01:17:48,931 --> 01:17:51,788
and my dead baby son
was in her arms.
1128
01:17:51,849 --> 01:17:56,307
And I held her and said, �I love you,
I love you,� because it�s all I could say.
1129
01:18:00,407 --> 01:18:02,212
She died in my arms, man.
1130
01:18:02,298 --> 01:18:05,391
Quickly! Quickly!
Quickly! Quickly! Quickly!
1131
01:18:07,373 --> 01:18:09,823
Where is the vat?
The vat, the vat�
1132
01:18:09,948 --> 01:18:12,509
Bring it here,
so the adults can begin.
1133
01:18:14,701 --> 01:18:18,146
My wife came up to me,
she didn�t have no tears in her eyes.
1134
01:18:18,194 --> 01:18:21,113
She just was...
was just in a daze.
1135
01:18:22,161 --> 01:18:26,979
�My mother, my grandmother,
my sister, my brother, they gone."
1136
01:18:27,142 --> 01:18:30,892
You know she said,
�Just take me. Just take me
1137
01:18:31,093 --> 01:18:34,893
and just lay me down
next to my grandmamma.�
1138
01:18:35,349 --> 01:18:38,149
And she went up to that Kool-Aid,
1139
01:18:38,150 --> 01:18:40,050
to that death barrel
1140
01:18:40,550 --> 01:18:43,926
and she just, didn�t hesitate,
just took it and drunk it
1141
01:18:43,993 --> 01:18:47,179
and then told me to hold her,
to take her, and I did.
1142
01:18:47,248 --> 01:18:49,269
And she died in my arms.
1143
01:18:50,470 --> 01:18:52,770
And once I laid her down
1144
01:18:52,819 --> 01:18:56,595
and she told me how she wanted to
lay with her grandmother,
1145
01:18:56,855 --> 01:19:00,096
I... at that point, knew that
1146
01:19:00,397 --> 01:19:03,097
I didn�t have no reason
to be here no more.
1147
01:19:04,568 --> 01:19:07,301
We laid it down, we got tired.
1148
01:19:11,338 --> 01:19:13,063
We didn�t commit suicide.
1149
01:19:13,064 --> 01:19:15,364
We committed an
act of revolutionary suicide
1150
01:19:15,468 --> 01:19:19,724
protesting the conditions
of an inhumane world.
1151
01:19:24,793 --> 01:19:26,793
We were just fucking slaughtered.
1152
01:19:27,994 --> 01:19:30,035
Fucking slaughtered.
1153
01:19:31,036 --> 01:19:33,036
There was nothing dignified about it.
1154
01:19:33,131 --> 01:19:35,041
Had nothing to do
with revolutionary suicide,
1155
01:19:35,124 --> 01:19:36,984
nothing to do about
making a fucking statement,
1156
01:19:37,385 --> 01:19:40,385
it was just senseless waste,
1157
01:19:40,620 --> 01:19:43,289
senseless waste and death.
1158
01:19:46,934 --> 01:19:49,479
�To whomever finds this note.
1159
01:19:50,480 --> 01:19:52,480
Collect all the tapes,
1160
01:19:52,720 --> 01:19:55,904
all the writing, all the history.
1161
01:19:56,618 --> 01:19:58,880
The story of this movement,
1162
01:19:59,002 --> 01:20:03,923
this action, must be
examined over and over.
1163
01:20:04,545 --> 01:20:07,134
We did not want this kind of ending.
1164
01:20:07,635 --> 01:20:10,635
We wanted to live, to shine,
1165
01:20:10,756 --> 01:20:15,947
to bring light to a world
that is dying for a little bit of love.�
1166
01:20:16,785 --> 01:20:19,073
I never believed in
Heaven in my whole life.
1167
01:20:19,074 --> 01:20:21,074
You know, that�s not the way
I operated
1168
01:20:21,130 --> 01:20:23,813
but when I was in Guyana,
and when I�d watch the sun rise,
1169
01:20:23,869 --> 01:20:27,094
I actually thought
there was a heaven on Earth.
1170
01:20:31,603 --> 01:20:34,846
And now, I can�t
believe in heaven anymore.
1171
01:20:35,359 --> 01:20:38,203
�There�s quiet
as we leave this world.
1172
01:20:38,336 --> 01:20:40,200
The sky is gray.
1173
01:20:40,401 --> 01:20:45,201
People file by us slowly
and take the somewhat bitter drink.
1174
01:20:45,706 --> 01:20:48,100
Many more must drink.�
1175
01:20:48,714 --> 01:20:51,591
I�m saddened
because it didn�t work out.
1176
01:20:51,769 --> 01:20:54,514
Because it just seemed so beautiful.
1177
01:20:55,302 --> 01:20:58,140
And I�ll say this
about November 18th,
1178
01:20:58,270 --> 01:21:01,889
I felt I�d lost a family
1179
01:21:02,944 --> 01:21:05,847
and I knew I�d lost my children.
1180
01:21:07,060 --> 01:21:10,857
�A teeny kitten
sits next to me watching.
1181
01:21:11,071 --> 01:21:13,264
A dog barks.
1182
01:21:13,656 --> 01:21:17,105
The birds gather
on the telephone wires.
1183
01:21:17,295 --> 01:21:21,934
Let all the story of this
Peoples Temple be told.�
1184
01:21:23,705 --> 01:21:26,746
We were people that...
We wanted to make a change.
1185
01:21:26,912 --> 01:21:31,202
It�s a shame it didn�t happen.
It might not never happen.
1186
01:21:31,372 --> 01:21:34,276
But one thing I can say,
at least we tried
1187
01:21:34,332 --> 01:21:38,751
and we didn�t sit back and wait
on the laurels for somebody else to try it.
1188
01:21:38,808 --> 01:21:41,740
Yes, we tried it.
Yes, it was a failure.
1189
01:21:41,808 --> 01:21:43,968
Yes, it was very tragic.
1190
01:21:44,070 --> 01:21:47,288
But at least we tried.
1191
01:21:48,586 --> 01:21:52,850
�If nobody understands,
it matters not.
1192
01:21:53,368 --> 01:21:55,719
I am ready to die now.
1193
01:21:56,043 --> 01:21:59,068
Darkness settles over Jonestown
1194
01:21:59,569 --> 01:22:02,569
on its last day on Earth.�
1195
01:22:03,137 --> 01:22:06,004
I never had any dreams of Jonestown
1196
01:22:06,605 --> 01:22:09,005
until this one dream came.
1197
01:22:09,656 --> 01:22:12,383
I could see myself
in Jonestown walking,
1198
01:22:12,481 --> 01:22:16,224
and when I looked to my left,
there was my son.
1199
01:22:17,008 --> 01:22:20,797
He was standing
in the middle of a duffel bag.
1200
01:22:20,943 --> 01:22:24,475
And just right when I got ready
to reach to touch his head,
1201
01:22:24,552 --> 01:22:26,195
he pulled the bag up like this.
1202
01:22:26,424 --> 01:22:30,232
And the bag fell and he was gone.
106572
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