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- Any time you're playing music
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00:00:03,827 --> 00:00:07,517
for the crowd
instead of yourself,
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00:00:07,517 --> 00:00:09,413
you're fucked.
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["I'm Now" by Mudhoney playing]
5
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♪ Well, I still see
that look in her eyes
6
00:00:22,482 --> 00:00:25,206
♪ Passing through
security, waving goodbye
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♪ I had no idea that
would be the last time
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♪ I had no idea about
that look in her eyes
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♪ No
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♪ Aw, that look in her eyes
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♪ That look in her eyes
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♪ Well, the black
light was my baby
13
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♪ And the strobe
light was my mind
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♪ The past made no sense,
the future looks tense
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♪ The past made no sense,
the future looks tense
16
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♪ I'm now
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- [Voiceover] You
turned 21 this year.
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- [Voiceover] It's not a
matter of referencing the past,
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although you can,
and there's certainly
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things you can draw from.
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It's not a matter of
trying to be the future,
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'cause you don't know
what the future is.
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You know, their point
is, we do it now.
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We do it our way, and we
continually do it now,
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day after day after day,
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which is why they've survived.
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♪ I'm now
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["Touch Me I'm
Sick" by Mudhoney]
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♪ I've been bad
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♪ I've been worse
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00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:05,103
♪ I'm a creep
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♪ Yeah, I'm a jerk
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♪ C'mon
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♪ Touch me, I'm sick
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- You know, I'm grateful
this whole thing
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didn't peter out 15 years ago,
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that, you know, people
still give a shit about us
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and that we can go
virtually wherever we want,
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00:02:28,275 --> 00:02:30,206
you know, when we want to,
40
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and people are happy to have us.
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I mean, I feel incredibly
lucky to be able to do that.
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- I mean, we're
pretty much outside of
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00:02:37,137 --> 00:02:40,482
any kind of cultural existence.
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00:02:40,482 --> 00:02:43,655
We exist in the past in a lot
of people's minds, you know?
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00:02:43,655 --> 00:02:46,000
So there's a certain amount
of nostalgia and stuff to it,
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00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:48,862
but I mean, you can't get
away from that, really.
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If it's valuable
to other people,
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if they like it, that's great,
49
00:02:51,413 --> 00:02:54,310
but I think we would do
it regardless. [laughing]
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00:02:54,310 --> 00:02:56,827
We would still play in the
basement sometimes, I think,
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00:02:56,827 --> 00:02:59,137
you know, no matter what, so...
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Ah, can I get a beer?
53
00:03:01,862 --> 00:03:05,379
[crowd cheering]
54
00:03:08,931 --> 00:03:11,137
- People oftentimes believe
55
00:03:11,137 --> 00:03:13,586
that if they have
heard of a band,
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00:03:13,586 --> 00:03:16,448
that the people in that
band are well-to-do
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and that they have a
super glamorous lifestyle
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and life is easy
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00:03:21,758 --> 00:03:26,103
and it's not always
that, especially with
independent bands.
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00:03:27,137 --> 00:03:31,103
So the funny thing is when
we send out our packages,
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00:03:31,103 --> 00:03:33,448
it's actually
listed as Mark Arm,
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00:03:33,448 --> 00:03:37,034
as the person having sent
the package to anybody,
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00:03:37,034 --> 00:03:40,103
so this is to record stores
who receive our records,
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00:03:40,103 --> 00:03:43,896
these are to mail-order
customers who get our stuff.
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00:03:43,896 --> 00:03:47,344
Mark Arm sends all of
our shit to everybody
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00:03:47,344 --> 00:03:49,551
in the world, basically.
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00:03:49,551 --> 00:03:53,000
- It's unbelievable
that a legend
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00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:56,482
have to work a normal
work to live in,
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00:03:56,482 --> 00:04:00,379
they can't live only
doing the rock and roll.
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00:04:00,379 --> 00:04:03,620
Some people think that
making rock and roll
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00:04:03,620 --> 00:04:06,206
as a second work, as a hobby,
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00:04:06,206 --> 00:04:11,103
helps to stay pure
to the spirit.
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00:04:11,103 --> 00:04:13,206
- That's a working
man's aesthetic.
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00:04:13,206 --> 00:04:16,482
I'm gonna certainly make sure
that whatever I'm sending out
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00:04:16,482 --> 00:04:19,862
is gonna go to the
right address on time
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00:04:19,862 --> 00:04:23,310
to the person that
it's addressed to.
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00:04:23,310 --> 00:04:25,827
You know, in a way, that's
what a great rock band does.
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You know, they go in,
they write their songs,
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and they go out and play them
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and they address them to
the people they wanna reach,
81
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and they do it directly, and
they do it with no bullshit.
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- Right, OK, I'm here backstage
at the [mumbling] Theaters
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[laughing] with Mudhoney,
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00:04:41,586 --> 00:04:43,000
and we're just going
over some of the
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00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:44,689
finer parts of
their European tour.
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- So, night after night,
another motel room,
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another backstage,
are you getting tired
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00:04:48,172 --> 00:04:51,862
of the rock and roll life
at all, Mr. Mudhoney People?
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00:04:51,931 --> 00:04:55,482
[rock playing]
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00:04:55,586 --> 00:04:57,448
- Here's a fuckin'
band that got it right.
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00:04:57,448 --> 00:04:58,931
It was like the coolest
thing I've heard
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00:04:58,931 --> 00:05:02,068
since like Fun House, as
far as that kinda rock goes.
93
00:05:02,068 --> 00:05:04,896
I mean, Steve and Mark's
fuzzy guitars together
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00:05:04,896 --> 00:05:06,068
fuckin' sounded awesome.
95
00:05:06,068 --> 00:05:08,655
Their ability to kind
of connect the 60s
96
00:05:08,655 --> 00:05:13,206
to 80s punk rock, and they're
a very 60s-sounding band.
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00:05:13,206 --> 00:05:14,965
They don't get a lot
of credit for that.
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00:05:14,965 --> 00:05:16,448
- There's a certain
amount of chaos happening
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00:05:16,448 --> 00:05:19,482
because Steve's guitar
tone is so distorted,
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00:05:19,482 --> 00:05:22,137
but in a beautiful way,
just the perfect way.
101
00:05:22,137 --> 00:05:24,034
A distorted guitar that
was like a jagged knife
102
00:05:24,034 --> 00:05:26,413
ripping through like
a whale's belly,
103
00:05:26,413 --> 00:05:28,448
and then the guts come out
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with Mark's voice
when he's screaming.
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00:05:30,586 --> 00:05:34,172
[screaming]
106
00:05:34,689 --> 00:05:36,310
- I remember when
they first started,
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00:05:36,310 --> 00:05:38,551
sort of being a little
puzzled and going,
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"Are you sure you want the
guitars to be this dirty?"
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I think was probably
the only comment I made
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at the beginning of
the session, like,
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"Boy, that's pretty
dirty, guys."
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00:05:49,310 --> 00:05:52,275
Of course, the word,
the adjective "grungy"
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00:05:52,275 --> 00:05:55,103
had not occurred to any of
us, I think, at that point.
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00:05:55,103 --> 00:05:56,862
[laughing]
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But it's pretty goddamn grungy.
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00:06:00,275 --> 00:06:02,620
[laughing]
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00:06:04,137 --> 00:06:05,620
- The Seattle scene was theirs.
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00:06:05,620 --> 00:06:07,758
Being with them was
being chauffeured
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through town by the mayors.
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00:06:10,310 --> 00:06:12,137
The parties were all fantastic,
121
00:06:12,137 --> 00:06:14,862
and it was just a
great moment in time.
122
00:06:14,862 --> 00:06:17,517
- The critics said,
"Well, Mudhoney's this"
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00:06:17,517 --> 00:06:18,827
and, "Blah ba dee blah,"
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and, "They're
unsuccessful because
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00:06:20,827 --> 00:06:23,379
"they didn't have the success
of Soundgarden and Pearl Jam,"
126
00:06:23,379 --> 00:06:25,206
and it's like, "Fuck you!"
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That's a fucking amazing band!
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- They were the powder keg.
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00:06:30,551 --> 00:06:32,344
They were the
first great Seattle
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00:06:32,344 --> 00:06:34,068
quote unquote "grunge band."
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[rock music]
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- No pretensions, no big egos,
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00:06:42,379 --> 00:06:46,206
no hassle, just
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00:06:46,206 --> 00:06:48,517
having a good time all the time.
135
00:06:48,517 --> 00:06:51,034
- They are the people who
would be watching them.
136
00:06:51,034 --> 00:06:53,689
That's what makes them an
incredibly honest band.
137
00:06:53,689 --> 00:06:54,862
- They got nice pants.
138
00:06:54,862 --> 00:06:56,034
- Amazing vintage guitars.
139
00:06:56,034 --> 00:06:59,448
- Yeah, good equipment,
good hairdos.
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00:06:59,448 --> 00:07:01,758
- Amazing songs.
141
00:07:01,758 --> 00:07:03,206
And they love to drink.
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00:07:03,206 --> 00:07:06,379
- They would just pour beer
and fill up everybody's glasses
143
00:07:06,379 --> 00:07:09,034
and you'd have the
funnest fucking time
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00:07:09,034 --> 00:07:10,896
you could ever imagine.
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00:07:10,896 --> 00:07:12,172
- Everybody was
welcome, actually,
146
00:07:12,172 --> 00:07:14,172
in the dressing room to party.
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00:07:14,172 --> 00:07:16,068
We had like seven crates of beer
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and four bowls of strong liquor,
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00:07:18,482 --> 00:07:21,896
and it would be gone
before they would go.
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00:07:21,896 --> 00:07:25,724
♪ Revolution
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- [Voiceover] So you feel
that you can communicate
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00:07:32,689 --> 00:07:36,241
to the public regardless
of any language barriers.
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00:07:36,241 --> 00:07:37,827
- Well, I think the
penis is international.
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00:07:37,827 --> 00:07:39,862
- Dealing with those guys,
you always kinda knew
155
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that you would get
them aboard of an idea,
156
00:07:43,172 --> 00:07:44,275
but then they
would take the idea
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00:07:44,275 --> 00:07:45,655
and do it completely
their own way,
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00:07:45,655 --> 00:07:47,793
so there was a cheesy
soundtrack that was coming out.
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It's a scene where
a guy is running
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through a college campus,
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so they wrote a song
called, "Run Shithead Run,"
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and then they sent it
off to the filmmaker.
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♪ Run, run
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♪ Run
165
00:07:59,344 --> 00:08:02,896
♪ Run, shithead, run
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00:08:04,103 --> 00:08:07,137
- So that song is
on the soundtrack
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00:08:07,137 --> 00:08:10,034
and every once in awhile
we get these nice little
168
00:08:10,034 --> 00:08:13,379
50-cent royalty checks for a
song called "Run Shithead Run."
169
00:08:13,379 --> 00:08:15,862
- That was the last
soundtrack we did. [laughing]
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00:08:15,862 --> 00:08:19,620
[rock music]
171
00:08:31,413 --> 00:08:35,793
- They also were
certainly leaders in
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00:08:35,793 --> 00:08:39,275
sort of sculpting Seattle
rock and roll history,
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00:08:39,275 --> 00:08:41,827
from fashion to the music.
174
00:08:41,827 --> 00:08:44,172
- Take away Mudhoney, nothing
would've happened. Nothing.
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00:08:44,172 --> 00:08:46,068
I honestly believe that,
because they got people
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from beyond the Pacific
Northwest interested.
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[rock music]
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00:09:02,103 --> 00:09:06,448
- They were, like, kind of
inspired us to play harder.
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00:09:07,896 --> 00:09:10,068
Going on after them was
so hard all the time
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00:09:10,068 --> 00:09:12,689
because they had so much energy.
181
00:09:12,689 --> 00:09:16,241
- I mean, it was these two
guys with these shitty guitars
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rocking, just rocking out.
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00:09:18,310 --> 00:09:21,517
[rock music]
184
00:09:21,517 --> 00:09:22,793
- [Voiceover] They'd
throw out a trampoline.
185
00:09:22,793 --> 00:09:24,862
The set would start
and they'd jump around
186
00:09:24,862 --> 00:09:26,896
and flail their guitars about.
187
00:09:26,896 --> 00:09:29,551
- I'd see Mark bend
all the way backwards
188
00:09:29,551 --> 00:09:31,724
to where he was on his
knees and all the way back
189
00:09:31,724 --> 00:09:33,103
and then he'd come back up,
190
00:09:33,103 --> 00:09:35,241
and they're flying
around the stage
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00:09:35,241 --> 00:09:37,000
like a bunch of marionettes.
192
00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:38,517
- They reach a
kind of apotheosis
193
00:09:38,517 --> 00:09:41,758
where everybody in the crowd
had like an epiphanic moment
194
00:09:41,758 --> 00:09:45,310
where the future of music was
revealed, just for a moment.
195
00:09:45,310 --> 00:09:49,379
[rock music]
196
00:10:08,586 --> 00:10:10,931
- They really motivated
a lot of musicians
197
00:10:10,931 --> 00:10:13,965
and photographers and producers
198
00:10:13,965 --> 00:10:16,896
and you name it, they were
just a motivational force.
199
00:10:16,896 --> 00:10:20,620
- Even in Seattle, where
you had this gold rush
200
00:10:20,620 --> 00:10:23,413
for two, three, four years,
201
00:10:23,413 --> 00:10:27,689
this intense attention of media,
202
00:10:27,689 --> 00:10:29,551
record companies, business,
203
00:10:29,551 --> 00:10:32,241
the guys in Mudhoney were
kind of seen as stable,
204
00:10:32,241 --> 00:10:35,344
as guys who actually
had their shit together.
205
00:10:35,344 --> 00:10:36,655
- I've worked with a
lot of other bands.
206
00:10:36,655 --> 00:10:37,965
They get together
for sound check.
207
00:10:37,965 --> 00:10:39,689
When it's done, they all
go their separate ways,
208
00:10:39,689 --> 00:10:42,068
and then they come back
together for the show.
209
00:10:42,068 --> 00:10:45,103
The Mudhoney guys, except
for the odd occasion
210
00:10:45,103 --> 00:10:48,103
where someone's got a friend
in town or something like that,
211
00:10:48,103 --> 00:10:49,793
and a reason to go
off on their own,
212
00:10:49,793 --> 00:10:52,275
they all just basically
stick together,
213
00:10:52,275 --> 00:10:54,103
and I think that they're
some of the best of friends.
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00:10:54,103 --> 00:10:56,000
I guess put it that way.
215
00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:58,724
♪ I'm a creep, yeah
216
00:10:58,724 --> 00:11:00,413
♪ And I'm a jerk
217
00:11:00,413 --> 00:11:04,241
♪ C'mon, touch me, I'm sick
218
00:11:05,689 --> 00:11:08,758
♪ I'm diseased
219
00:11:08,758 --> 00:11:11,931
♪ And I don't mind
220
00:11:11,931 --> 00:11:15,482
♪ Gonna make you love me
221
00:11:15,482 --> 00:11:18,206
♪ 'Til the day we die
222
00:11:18,206 --> 00:11:20,517
♪ Oh
223
00:11:20,517 --> 00:11:23,551
♪ Touch me, I'm sick
224
00:11:25,103 --> 00:11:27,655
♪ Come on
225
00:11:27,655 --> 00:11:31,068
♪ Touch me, I'm sick
226
00:11:33,034 --> 00:11:35,931
♪ Come on, baby,
now come with me
227
00:11:35,931 --> 00:11:37,379
♪ If you don't come
228
00:11:37,379 --> 00:11:39,000
♪ If you don't come
229
00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:41,000
♪ If you don't come
230
00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:43,689
♪ You'll die alone
231
00:11:43,689 --> 00:11:47,172
[crowd cheering]
232
00:11:49,482 --> 00:11:50,896
- [Voiceover] Mark Arm,
you just played Pukkelpop.
233
00:11:50,896 --> 00:11:52,241
What next?
234
00:11:52,241 --> 00:11:54,034
- I wanna get high!
235
00:11:54,034 --> 00:11:58,827
[rock music]
236
00:11:59,896 --> 00:12:02,241
I think my voice is
basically genetic.
237
00:12:02,241 --> 00:12:06,034
I moved here when I
was four years old.
238
00:12:06,034 --> 00:12:08,275
Before that, I'd been
living in Germany
239
00:12:08,275 --> 00:12:09,931
on an air force base.
240
00:12:09,931 --> 00:12:13,000
I just, I guess, felt
like kind of an outsider,
241
00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:14,655
a foreigner, strange.
242
00:12:14,655 --> 00:12:15,896
Yeah, music was always around.
243
00:12:15,896 --> 00:12:18,379
My mom was an opera
singer whose career
244
00:12:18,379 --> 00:12:22,448
got kind of cut off because
of the Second World War.
245
00:12:22,448 --> 00:12:25,310
She was in Germany and, you
know, kind of at the time
246
00:12:25,310 --> 00:12:27,068
that her career would've
been taking off,
247
00:12:27,068 --> 00:12:29,793
that's when the war broke out.
248
00:12:29,793 --> 00:12:32,655
You know, I gravitated
towards rock and roll.
249
00:12:32,655 --> 00:12:34,586
It was music that was kind
of forbidden in my household,
250
00:12:34,586 --> 00:12:35,896
so that was like
another kind of thing
251
00:12:35,896 --> 00:12:38,655
that was another
attraction to it,
252
00:12:38,655 --> 00:12:40,413
and my parents had a Volkswagen,
253
00:12:40,413 --> 00:12:44,172
and the great thing about
Volkswagen Bugs in those days
254
00:12:44,172 --> 00:12:45,586
was you could just go into them
255
00:12:45,586 --> 00:12:47,275
and turn on the radio
and it would work,
256
00:12:47,275 --> 00:12:50,068
so I would listen to the top
40 radio station at the time
257
00:12:50,068 --> 00:12:53,275
and hope to hear, you know,
the kind of more rocking songs.
258
00:12:53,275 --> 00:12:54,896
As a kid getting into punk rock,
259
00:12:54,896 --> 00:12:57,586
I kept reading about
and hearing about
260
00:12:57,586 --> 00:12:59,103
this band The Stooges.
261
00:12:59,103 --> 00:13:02,310
The third album, "Raw Power,"
you could find as a cutout.
262
00:13:02,310 --> 00:13:04,275
It was like three dollars
or something like that,
263
00:13:04,275 --> 00:13:07,241
but the first two records
were impossible to find.
264
00:13:07,241 --> 00:13:11,000
I finally found them in a
small record store in Oregon.
265
00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:13,448
I bought the first one,
listened to it a ton,
266
00:13:13,448 --> 00:13:14,862
and then like a
week or two later,
267
00:13:14,862 --> 00:13:17,103
when I had enough money
again, I bought "Fun House,"
268
00:13:17,103 --> 00:13:19,931
and it was like, "Holy crap."
269
00:13:19,931 --> 00:13:22,965
You know, like, "This is it."
270
00:13:25,137 --> 00:13:29,448
Mr. Epp had been kind of an
imaginary band in high school,
271
00:13:29,448 --> 00:13:31,000
named after a math teacher.
272
00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:33,517
The full name of the band was
Mr. Epp and the Calculations.
273
00:13:33,517 --> 00:13:36,310
At some point it kind of
turned into a real band
274
00:13:36,310 --> 00:13:38,896
where we actually
bought instruments.
275
00:13:38,965 --> 00:13:43,344
We would just get feedback and
think we were Jimi Hendrix.
276
00:13:43,344 --> 00:13:46,827
You know, like the part in
live Jimi Hendrix records
277
00:13:46,827 --> 00:13:50,000
between the songs. [laughing]
278
00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:51,517
[rock scream]
279
00:13:51,517 --> 00:13:53,931
To kind of promote Mr. Epp,
280
00:13:53,931 --> 00:13:55,758
I wrote a letter to the editor
281
00:13:55,758 --> 00:13:58,000
from the point of
view of someone
282
00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,724
who had gone to see Mr. Epp
and thought they were crap.
283
00:14:00,724 --> 00:14:02,241
I think I said something like,
284
00:14:02,241 --> 00:14:05,137
"They're pure
shit, pure grunge."
285
00:14:05,137 --> 00:14:06,310
You know, that's
not the first use
286
00:14:06,310 --> 00:14:08,241
of the word "grunge"
to describe music.
287
00:14:08,241 --> 00:14:10,344
In Australia, in the early 80s,
288
00:14:10,344 --> 00:14:13,310
there was like The Scientists
and The Beasts of Bourbon.
289
00:14:13,310 --> 00:14:15,000
Those bands were called grunge
290
00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,103
by the press down there.
291
00:14:17,103 --> 00:14:18,655
Tex Perkins at one point was
292
00:14:18,655 --> 00:14:21,034
called the high
priest of grunge,
293
00:14:21,034 --> 00:14:25,448
which apparently caused Tex
to punch that guy in the face.
294
00:14:25,448 --> 00:14:26,655
- [Voiceover] But what
we've all heard about
295
00:14:26,655 --> 00:14:28,517
is the so-called "grunge
rock" from Seattle.
296
00:14:28,517 --> 00:14:32,206
Grunge is not a term Seattleites
are particularly fond of.
297
00:14:32,206 --> 00:14:33,655
- You know, when all
that shit was going on,
298
00:14:33,655 --> 00:14:34,965
I said, "Yeah, it's your fault,
299
00:14:34,965 --> 00:14:36,827
"you fucking invented grunge."
300
00:14:36,827 --> 00:14:41,206
- You didn't label the genre
by just describing the sound.
301
00:14:41,206 --> 00:14:42,896
From there, so and so,
302
00:14:42,896 --> 00:14:45,482
"Oh, that's the genre
reference we'll use."
303
00:14:45,482 --> 00:14:47,172
At the time, no one accepted it.
304
00:14:47,172 --> 00:14:48,448
Everyone thought, "What?"
305
00:14:48,448 --> 00:14:49,896
- Grunge is stuff that
gets on your dishes
306
00:14:49,896 --> 00:14:51,379
that you try to scrub off.
307
00:14:51,379 --> 00:14:53,310
♪ Losing myself again
308
00:14:53,310 --> 00:14:54,862
- If he coined the
word, God bless him,
309
00:14:54,862 --> 00:14:56,275
he should be getting royalties.
310
00:14:57,620 --> 00:15:00,620
If he didn't, I think he
should consider himself lucky,
311
00:15:00,620 --> 00:15:04,482
because it's a nasty word,
and I think it actually
312
00:15:04,482 --> 00:15:06,000
became kind of an epithet.
313
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:10,758
It was a way to very
briskly, conveniently,
314
00:15:10,758 --> 00:15:12,862
and almost dismissively describe
315
00:15:12,862 --> 00:15:14,655
a style of music
that I think had
316
00:15:14,655 --> 00:15:18,344
much deeper roots in discontent.
317
00:15:18,344 --> 00:15:20,413
- You know, people, when
they think of grunge,
318
00:15:20,413 --> 00:15:23,206
they think of, like, heavy,
319
00:15:23,206 --> 00:15:26,103
like a lot of trees
and a lot of rain, and,
320
00:15:26,103 --> 00:15:29,793
I was gonna say mud. [laughing]
321
00:15:29,793 --> 00:15:31,344
- [Voiceover] I mean, it
was just, essentially,
322
00:15:31,344 --> 00:15:34,241
a different way of saying
"punk rock," I guess.
323
00:15:35,827 --> 00:15:36,965
- Just because you're nerd rock
324
00:15:36,965 --> 00:15:38,827
doesn't mean you're
smarter than us.
325
00:15:38,827 --> 00:15:40,620
- Well, look, see these glasses?
326
00:15:40,620 --> 00:15:44,379
- [Voiceover] Steve invented
kind of being a hip nerd.
327
00:15:44,379 --> 00:15:48,448
Back in the 80s, 90s, it
was not cool to be a nerd,
328
00:15:48,448 --> 00:15:50,620
but Steve was like
an intellectual.
329
00:15:50,620 --> 00:15:52,034
- [Voiceover] Steve
Turner was called
330
00:15:52,034 --> 00:15:54,758
"the Eric Clapton of Grunge"
in Rolling Stone Magazine.
331
00:15:54,758 --> 00:15:57,413
- "The Eric Clapton
of grunge." [laughing]
332
00:15:57,413 --> 00:15:59,034
- The next records,
still to this day,
333
00:15:59,034 --> 00:16:02,379
kind of like goes against the
guitar solo whenever you can.
334
00:16:02,379 --> 00:16:05,206
- A lot of his old
solos were almost like
335
00:16:05,206 --> 00:16:07,448
lampooning the idea
of a guitar solo.
336
00:16:07,448 --> 00:16:09,448
They were anti-solos.
337
00:16:09,448 --> 00:16:13,793
[rock music]
338
00:16:17,793 --> 00:16:19,448
- My brother had
an acoustic guitar
339
00:16:19,448 --> 00:16:21,448
and then he had the
Beatles songbooks
340
00:16:22,551 --> 00:16:24,482
and the Eagles.
341
00:16:24,482 --> 00:16:27,448
Learned how to sing and
play "Rocky Raccoon"
342
00:16:27,448 --> 00:16:30,241
and "Desperado" in eighth grade,
343
00:16:30,241 --> 00:16:31,655
and then I didn't
touch a guitar again
344
00:16:31,655 --> 00:16:34,000
'til a couple years later,
345
00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:36,172
after I'd gotten into
punk rock a little bit.
346
00:16:36,172 --> 00:16:38,586
Black Flag and Devo kind of
showed up at the same time.
347
00:16:38,586 --> 00:16:40,000
That summer, they
came to Seattle
348
00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:42,448
and that was my first rock
concert I got to go see,
349
00:16:42,448 --> 00:16:45,034
and that was huge,
because they used
350
00:16:45,034 --> 00:16:46,827
skaters in their videos.
351
00:16:46,827 --> 00:16:48,758
All the skateboarders
around Seattle went to it,
352
00:16:48,758 --> 00:16:50,344
so it was this huge thing.
353
00:16:50,344 --> 00:16:52,206
That's why my parents figured
they could allow me to go,
354
00:16:52,206 --> 00:16:54,724
because they figured
a group of tin skaters
355
00:16:54,724 --> 00:16:57,517
couldn't possibly get into
any trouble. [laughing]
356
00:16:57,517 --> 00:16:59,241
The punk scene was
just so different
357
00:16:59,241 --> 00:17:02,172
from what I thought it was
gonna be like, you know?
358
00:17:02,172 --> 00:17:03,689
And they seemed so much smarter
359
00:17:03,689 --> 00:17:07,517
and cooler to me than any
other group I'd seen so far
360
00:17:07,517 --> 00:17:10,689
as far as at gatherings,
social gatherings.
361
00:17:10,689 --> 00:17:13,896
- Steve and I early on had
a kind of musical kinship.
362
00:17:13,896 --> 00:17:15,827
He was one of the
few people who,
363
00:17:15,827 --> 00:17:20,275
when he met me, said he actually
liked Mr. Epp. [laughing]
364
00:17:20,275 --> 00:17:23,551
- I joined a band
called Spluii Numa,
365
00:17:23,551 --> 00:17:26,655
and I left that after
just a couple practices
366
00:17:26,655 --> 00:17:29,068
'cause they told me I
had to get all new gear.
367
00:17:29,068 --> 00:17:30,724
The guitar player
was a real tech guy.
368
00:17:30,724 --> 00:17:32,275
He looked at my
amp, said, "Nope,"
369
00:17:32,275 --> 00:17:33,482
looked at my
guitar, said, "Nope,
370
00:17:33,482 --> 00:17:34,896
"none of this is good enough."
371
00:17:34,896 --> 00:17:36,206
So then, right after
that, that summer,
372
00:17:36,206 --> 00:17:38,172
I joined Mr. Epp with Mark.
373
00:17:40,275 --> 00:17:43,586
- The first time I met Mark
Arm, I saw Green River,
374
00:17:43,586 --> 00:17:46,827
and it was a pretty
awesome show.
375
00:17:46,827 --> 00:17:49,068
It was at the Central.
376
00:17:49,068 --> 00:17:51,758
I remember walking
up to him and saying,
377
00:17:51,758 --> 00:17:53,758
"Man, that was a
great show, dude.
378
00:17:53,758 --> 00:17:55,896
"I got some pot, you
wanna go smoke some?"
379
00:17:55,896 --> 00:17:59,551
[rock music]
380
00:18:03,517 --> 00:18:04,931
- At the time, the
Green River Killer
381
00:18:04,931 --> 00:18:07,000
was in all the headlines.
382
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:08,758
I think it was just trying to be
383
00:18:08,758 --> 00:18:10,275
as provocative as we could be,
384
00:18:10,275 --> 00:18:12,586
and it retrospect
it's regrettable.
385
00:18:12,586 --> 00:18:15,827
It's what you do when you're
20 years old and obnoxious.
386
00:18:15,827 --> 00:18:17,448
- I remember the
first time I saw them,
387
00:18:17,448 --> 00:18:20,965
I was like, "Holy cow,
what is Mark doing?"
388
00:18:20,965 --> 00:18:23,793
He really was able to
sort of express himself
389
00:18:23,793 --> 00:18:26,275
and let out his angst.
390
00:18:26,275 --> 00:18:29,793
- They went from being folks
that I had seen around town
391
00:18:29,793 --> 00:18:32,206
and that I'd do shifts with
392
00:18:32,206 --> 00:18:35,517
to being like rock heroes.
393
00:18:35,517 --> 00:18:38,689
There was a lot of
stuff that went in
394
00:18:38,689 --> 00:18:41,586
to what made Green
River who they were.
395
00:18:41,586 --> 00:18:44,413
Some of the components were
396
00:18:44,413 --> 00:18:47,448
this kind of glammy metal.
397
00:18:47,448 --> 00:18:49,862
- He definitely took
that stage persona
398
00:18:49,862 --> 00:18:52,793
through into Mudhoney,
399
00:18:52,793 --> 00:18:56,172
sort of minus the sequin pants.
400
00:18:56,172 --> 00:18:57,448
[laughing]
401
00:18:57,448 --> 00:18:58,724
- I do remember
going to check out
402
00:18:58,724 --> 00:19:00,344
the early Green River shows
403
00:19:00,344 --> 00:19:02,448
and being, really, kind
of blown away by them.
404
00:19:02,448 --> 00:19:04,965
Steve Turner was in
Green River at the time.
405
00:19:04,965 --> 00:19:08,965
- We didn't really know
Jeff Ament that well,
406
00:19:08,965 --> 00:19:10,931
but we'd seen him play
with Deranged Diction,
407
00:19:10,931 --> 00:19:12,379
who we thought were cool,
408
00:19:12,379 --> 00:19:15,103
and he jumped really high and
played through distortion.
409
00:19:15,103 --> 00:19:17,379
Seemed very important
to us at the time,
410
00:19:17,379 --> 00:19:19,103
so Steve kind of
went on this campaign
411
00:19:19,103 --> 00:19:21,413
to get to know Jeff
by getting a job
412
00:19:21,413 --> 00:19:25,482
at the same espresso place
that he worked at. [laughing]
413
00:19:25,482 --> 00:19:29,517
- I could tell that
Mark and Steve were
414
00:19:29,517 --> 00:19:33,586
into music and into kind
of making something happen,
415
00:19:33,586 --> 00:19:35,827
so I went to a couple practices.
416
00:19:35,827 --> 00:19:38,103
- That's how Green
River started.
417
00:19:38,103 --> 00:19:42,137
[rock music]
418
00:19:43,758 --> 00:19:46,344
- The "Rehab Doll"
album by Green River
419
00:19:46,344 --> 00:19:48,379
was the first record
that Jonathan and I
420
00:19:48,379 --> 00:19:53,310
put out on Sub Pop
in spring of '88.
421
00:19:53,310 --> 00:19:58,137
We emptied our coffers
of about, I think, $5000,
422
00:19:58,137 --> 00:20:01,241
which was like
423
00:20:01,241 --> 00:20:04,344
a massive fortune
for us at the time.
424
00:20:04,344 --> 00:20:07,448
♪ Now I wouldn't mind
425
00:20:08,344 --> 00:20:11,137
♪ If you swallowed my pride
426
00:20:11,137 --> 00:20:14,206
- And, unfortunately,
as soon as the band
427
00:20:14,206 --> 00:20:17,689
handed us a master tape, they
told us they were breaking up,
428
00:20:17,689 --> 00:20:22,586
so that was kind of our
grand opening release
429
00:20:22,586 --> 00:20:24,551
and we realized we
were probably gonna
430
00:20:24,551 --> 00:20:26,379
go out of business
within a month.
431
00:20:26,379 --> 00:20:29,724
- [Voiceover] We're down
in L.A., opening up for
432
00:20:29,724 --> 00:20:32,172
Jane's Addiction and Junkyard.
433
00:20:32,172 --> 00:20:34,137
- I remember Stone and I were
up on the side of the stage
434
00:20:34,137 --> 00:20:35,620
watching Jane's Addiction,
just going like,
435
00:20:35,620 --> 00:20:37,620
"Oh my god, this is incredible."
436
00:20:38,586 --> 00:20:42,448
And I remember Mark and Bruce
coming up at different times,
437
00:20:42,448 --> 00:20:45,000
saying how lame
they thought it was,
438
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:47,551
and I remember thinking, "Wow."
439
00:20:47,551 --> 00:20:50,172
I think any hope that I had
440
00:20:50,172 --> 00:20:52,275
that I thought that
Green River could be
441
00:20:52,275 --> 00:20:55,413
as good as Jane's Addiction,
442
00:20:55,413 --> 00:20:58,413
because Mark didn't
like Jane's Addiction,
443
00:20:58,413 --> 00:21:02,517
for me, that felt like
there was a big chasm there.
444
00:21:02,517 --> 00:21:04,655
I remember just
being kind of bummed.
445
00:21:04,655 --> 00:21:08,103
- Whether people say Jane's
Addiction split them up,
446
00:21:08,103 --> 00:21:09,586
it was just a moment in time
447
00:21:09,586 --> 00:21:11,206
where it sort of
became more evident.
448
00:21:11,206 --> 00:21:12,965
- And then when they split into
449
00:21:12,965 --> 00:21:16,034
Mother Love Bone and Mudhoney,
450
00:21:16,034 --> 00:21:20,551
there was no doubt that we were
going to work with Mudhoney.
451
00:21:20,551 --> 00:21:23,413
- The separation that
sort of launched Mudhoney,
452
00:21:23,413 --> 00:21:25,517
which is fantastic from a
marketing point of view,
453
00:21:25,517 --> 00:21:28,758
it's like, you know, the two
sellouts went one direction
454
00:21:28,758 --> 00:21:30,655
and the purists--
[laughing]
455
00:21:30,655 --> 00:21:32,586
the purists went the other,
and we've got the purists,
456
00:21:32,586 --> 00:21:34,896
and they had a fantastic
band, you know,
457
00:21:34,896 --> 00:21:36,413
I mean, Mudhoney was fantastic.
458
00:21:36,413 --> 00:21:38,103
We saluted them as
soon as we saw them.
459
00:21:38,103 --> 00:21:39,827
We were like, "Wow,
that's so much better
460
00:21:39,827 --> 00:21:41,103
"than Green River was."
461
00:21:41,103 --> 00:21:44,310
[rock music]
462
00:21:44,965 --> 00:21:47,965
[rock scream]
463
00:21:53,103 --> 00:21:54,689
- Green River broke
up, I was like,
464
00:21:54,689 --> 00:21:56,310
"What am I gonna do now?"
465
00:21:56,310 --> 00:21:58,413
The first thought
that occurred to me
466
00:21:58,413 --> 00:22:00,586
was, "Maybe I
should call Steve."
467
00:22:00,586 --> 00:22:03,034
He was going to school up
in Bellingham at the time,
468
00:22:03,034 --> 00:22:04,689
and I called him and I was like,
469
00:22:04,689 --> 00:22:06,655
"Hey, Green River broke up.
470
00:22:07,689 --> 00:22:10,586
"Why don't you drop out
of school?" [laughing]
471
00:22:10,586 --> 00:22:15,206
[orchestra playing
"Auld Lang Syne"]
472
00:22:27,413 --> 00:22:31,482
[rock music]
473
00:22:31,827 --> 00:22:35,172
That is the day, New
Year's Day, 1988,
474
00:22:35,172 --> 00:22:37,000
that we mark as the
beginning of the band.
475
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:38,827
That's like the band's birthday.
476
00:22:38,827 --> 00:22:41,241
- The night before,
everybody was
477
00:22:41,241 --> 00:22:43,586
kind of converging on
the Seattle [mumbling]
478
00:22:43,586 --> 00:22:45,482
to go to the Coliseum
to see Motorhead
479
00:22:45,482 --> 00:22:47,034
open up for Alice Cooper.
480
00:22:47,034 --> 00:22:49,310
Matt was coming into town
for that show, so we figured,
481
00:22:49,310 --> 00:22:52,482
"OK, we'll get together
the next day with Matt."
482
00:22:52,482 --> 00:22:54,482
- It was really not a
whole lot of thought.
483
00:22:54,482 --> 00:22:57,000
We weren't, like,
auditioning. [laughing]
484
00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,344
There was very little thought.
485
00:22:59,344 --> 00:23:00,862
It came together really easily.
486
00:23:00,862 --> 00:23:04,068
- I was 20 at this point,
so I couldn't buy beer.
487
00:23:04,068 --> 00:23:05,965
I walk into the store with Matt,
488
00:23:05,965 --> 00:23:07,344
and just kind of meeting him,
489
00:23:07,344 --> 00:23:09,758
and I'm like, "Hey,
wanna buy me some beer?
490
00:23:09,758 --> 00:23:11,172
"I'll give you some money,"
491
00:23:11,172 --> 00:23:12,448
and he was like, "Yeah,"
and I give him some money,
492
00:23:13,724 --> 00:23:15,172
and he grabs himself
a half-case of beer,
493
00:23:15,172 --> 00:23:16,413
he's like, "Well, I got mine,"
494
00:23:16,413 --> 00:23:18,586
and I'm like, "Whoo,
he's got his,"
495
00:23:18,586 --> 00:23:20,586
and it was like a
half-case of beer,
496
00:23:20,586 --> 00:23:22,000
and I'm like, "Well,
can you get me one too?"
497
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,103
- I knew of him, just
from the bands he was in,
498
00:23:24,103 --> 00:23:25,724
but I never really
personally met him
499
00:23:25,724 --> 00:23:28,275
until I was in a car with
him, being taken to practice,
500
00:23:28,275 --> 00:23:30,551
and he steps in the
backseat with me.
501
00:23:30,551 --> 00:23:32,103
"Hey, nice to meet you!"
502
00:23:32,103 --> 00:23:34,620
He was wearing a
beret. [laughing]
503
00:23:34,620 --> 00:23:37,172
That's another thing I
forgot about until just now.
504
00:23:37,172 --> 00:23:38,724
He was wearing a
beret, and I'm like,
505
00:23:38,724 --> 00:23:41,413
"Oh, what's up with this
drummer?" [laughing]
506
00:23:41,413 --> 00:23:44,310
But I fell in love
with him. [laughing]
507
00:23:45,551 --> 00:23:47,965
- [Voiceover] Mudhoney can
influence your very life.
508
00:23:47,965 --> 00:23:51,103
A rewarding experience that
you shall never forget.
509
00:23:51,103 --> 00:23:54,310
- Steve and I were
very into B-movies,
510
00:23:54,310 --> 00:23:55,862
psychotronic movies.
511
00:23:55,862 --> 00:23:58,965
One of those directors that we
really liked was Russ Meyer.
512
00:23:58,965 --> 00:24:01,620
- [Voiceover] Ladies and
gentlemen, welcome to sex.
513
00:24:01,620 --> 00:24:03,413
You have just
witnessed some scenes
514
00:24:03,413 --> 00:24:06,482
from Russ Meyer's sadistically
sensual motion picture
515
00:24:06,482 --> 00:24:09,310
"Mudhoney," a taste of evil.
516
00:24:09,310 --> 00:24:11,793
- I thought, "You know,
that's a pretty cool name,"
517
00:24:11,793 --> 00:24:13,862
and kind of stored it, you know,
518
00:24:13,862 --> 00:24:15,793
like, "If I ever
have another band,
519
00:24:15,793 --> 00:24:18,310
"that might be a really
good name to use."
520
00:24:18,310 --> 00:24:20,448
- You better get your
hands outta there!
521
00:24:20,448 --> 00:24:22,931
You're gonna get in trouble!
522
00:24:22,931 --> 00:24:23,965
[maniacal laughing]
523
00:24:23,965 --> 00:24:25,413
- I haven't seen it for so long.
524
00:24:25,413 --> 00:24:27,344
It's the one with the preacher
talking in black and white
525
00:24:27,344 --> 00:24:29,793
and spouting off all sorts
of Biblical nonsense,
526
00:24:29,793 --> 00:24:34,689
and there's a buxom blonde
white trash kind of lady
527
00:24:34,689 --> 00:24:36,448
running around
the swamps, right?
528
00:24:36,448 --> 00:24:37,551
- There's a preacher.
529
00:24:37,551 --> 00:24:39,517
I don't know, it's boobs.
530
00:24:39,517 --> 00:24:40,758
[laughing]
531
00:24:40,758 --> 00:24:42,620
- [Voiceover] Steeped
with the flavor of evil.
532
00:24:42,620 --> 00:24:45,172
- I don't remember much
of it other than that.
533
00:24:45,172 --> 00:24:47,275
[laughing] Seriously!
534
00:24:47,275 --> 00:24:50,655
- [Voiceover] For a taste
of evil, see Mudhoney.
535
00:24:53,551 --> 00:24:56,103
- I remember Mark saying
that he introduced himself,
536
00:24:56,103 --> 00:24:58,000
I think, to Dan Peters,
537
00:24:58,000 --> 00:24:59,793
and told him he
should join Mudhoney,
538
00:24:59,793 --> 00:25:02,172
while pushing in front of
him at some Seattle Club
539
00:25:02,172 --> 00:25:04,758
in the queue for the
toilet so he could vomit.
540
00:25:04,758 --> 00:25:06,000
It was like, "We're
starting a new band!
541
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:07,551
"It's called
Mudhoney!" [vomiting]
542
00:25:07,551 --> 00:25:08,965
Like that, you know.
543
00:25:11,551 --> 00:25:15,068
- Dan Peters, greatest
fucking drummer in the world.
544
00:25:15,068 --> 00:25:18,620
[rock music]
545
00:25:19,965 --> 00:25:21,551
- Nobody sounds like Dan Peters.
546
00:25:21,551 --> 00:25:23,586
You can hear
drumming on anything,
547
00:25:23,586 --> 00:25:26,310
even if he's like on a Mark
Lanegan record or whatever,
548
00:25:26,310 --> 00:25:28,379
sessions he's done,
you can always tell
549
00:25:28,379 --> 00:25:31,448
in about two seconds, "That's
Dan Peters on the drums.
550
00:25:31,448 --> 00:25:35,172
"I recognize that feel, I
recognize that drum fill,
551
00:25:35,172 --> 00:25:37,793
"I can totally tell by the way
he's hitting the snare drum."
552
00:25:37,793 --> 00:25:40,137
Danny is completely unique.
553
00:25:43,517 --> 00:25:48,068
[rock music]
554
00:25:52,827 --> 00:25:54,931
- My mom was a lounge singer.
555
00:25:54,931 --> 00:25:57,620
She had bands
556
00:25:57,620 --> 00:26:01,620
and sang six, seven
nights a week.
557
00:26:01,620 --> 00:26:05,310
I got my first pair
of drumsticks at a
fairly early age.
558
00:26:05,310 --> 00:26:07,793
I used to sit around
and, you know,
559
00:26:07,793 --> 00:26:10,344
act like I had a drum
set in front of me.
560
00:26:10,344 --> 00:26:11,827
My uncle was in a band,
561
00:26:11,827 --> 00:26:13,827
and the singer of
that band told me
562
00:26:13,827 --> 00:26:15,448
he had an extra drum set.
563
00:26:15,448 --> 00:26:16,931
A band like Gang of
Four really changed
564
00:26:16,931 --> 00:26:20,206
the way I thought of music
and listened to music.
565
00:26:20,206 --> 00:26:22,862
X. Dead Kennedys.
566
00:26:22,862 --> 00:26:25,724
My math teacher knew that I
had listened to punk rock,
567
00:26:25,724 --> 00:26:27,517
so [mumbling] this weird guy.
568
00:26:27,517 --> 00:26:29,448
He asked me to bring
in some punk rock
569
00:26:29,448 --> 00:26:30,758
to play for the class, I'm like,
570
00:26:30,758 --> 00:26:32,448
"Ah, all right, I'll do that,"
571
00:26:32,448 --> 00:26:36,551
and I made a cassette tape
of a Dead Kennedys song.
572
00:26:36,551 --> 00:26:38,896
So the whole class is
sitting down, getting ready,
573
00:26:38,896 --> 00:26:40,689
they're like, "Dan's gonna
play you some punk rock,"
574
00:26:40,689 --> 00:26:42,241
I'm like, "Yeah, this
is gonna be good."
575
00:26:42,241 --> 00:26:44,586
So I press play.
The song starts up.
576
00:26:44,586 --> 00:26:48,137
["Forward to Death"
by Dead Kennedys]
577
00:26:54,482 --> 00:26:57,000
Like the lyrics are like, "I
don't need this fucking world,
578
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:58,379
"I don't need this
fucking world,
579
00:26:58,379 --> 00:27:00,206
"This world gets me down,"
580
00:27:00,206 --> 00:27:02,965
and he's like, "OK,
Dan, stop!" [laughing]
581
00:27:02,965 --> 00:27:05,413
Kinda like, "Ah, well,
you wanted to hear it."
582
00:27:05,413 --> 00:27:07,241
♪ I don't need
this fucking world
583
00:27:07,241 --> 00:27:09,551
♪ This world brings you down
584
00:27:11,689 --> 00:27:14,137
- [Voiceover] One beer down,
and he's fucking gonna snap.
585
00:27:14,137 --> 00:27:16,137
- What?
- [Voiceover] Nothing.
586
00:27:16,137 --> 00:27:19,379
- Look at this, I got
a disease last night.
587
00:27:19,379 --> 00:27:20,655
- [Voiceover] Where'd
you get that at?
588
00:27:20,655 --> 00:27:22,103
- [Voiceover] I don't
know, I had a bunch of
589
00:27:22,103 --> 00:27:23,482
open sores on my hand and I
was rolling around on my floor.
590
00:27:23,482 --> 00:27:25,724
I passed out, and [mumbling]
somebody diseased me!
591
00:27:25,724 --> 00:27:27,931
- [Voiceover] Matt Lukin
was the mud in the honey.
592
00:27:27,931 --> 00:27:31,896
- The guy had a brilliant
and surreal sense of humor.
593
00:27:31,896 --> 00:27:33,413
He was a work of art.
594
00:27:33,413 --> 00:27:35,586
- I woke up at about 11:00
in the morning and came down,
595
00:27:35,586 --> 00:27:38,931
and he was sitting in
front of the TV, smoking,
596
00:27:38,931 --> 00:27:42,379
taking hits out of a bong,
and watching an AC/DC video,
597
00:27:43,517 --> 00:27:46,379
and I thought, "This is
exactly what I would imagine,"
598
00:27:46,379 --> 00:27:49,275
almost too much so,
like he staged it,
599
00:27:49,275 --> 00:27:51,241
but he was serious,
he wasn't joking.
600
00:27:51,241 --> 00:27:53,034
That's what he did.
601
00:27:53,034 --> 00:27:56,103
- His whole family said, "Don't
go into the music business.
602
00:27:56,103 --> 00:28:00,275
"Don't do it. Get a job,
become a carpenter."
603
00:28:00,275 --> 00:28:02,103
So pretty soon he was like,
604
00:28:02,103 --> 00:28:04,344
"Yeah, they didn't want
me to be a musician,
605
00:28:04,344 --> 00:28:08,275
"but I'm the first fucking Lukin
who ever made it to Europe,
606
00:28:08,275 --> 00:28:10,758
"to Japan, to
Australia, whatever."
607
00:28:10,758 --> 00:28:13,000
So he was the first Lukin
going around the world,
608
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:14,241
being a rock star.
609
00:28:14,241 --> 00:28:16,655
This is Matt Lukin,
right there for you.
610
00:28:16,655 --> 00:28:19,241
[laughing] So crazy guy!
611
00:28:19,241 --> 00:28:21,000
Amazing guy.
612
00:28:24,655 --> 00:28:27,517
- As a young kid, I
remember playing singles
613
00:28:27,517 --> 00:28:30,137
of like Black Sabbath
and shit like that,
614
00:28:30,137 --> 00:28:32,896
but it scared me at the
same time. [laughing]
615
00:28:32,896 --> 00:28:34,896
But when I got
older, I was like,
616
00:28:34,896 --> 00:28:37,000
"Yeah, this is the
stuff." [laughing]
617
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:41,034
I didn't really get into guitar
until I was about 13 or 14.
618
00:28:41,034 --> 00:28:43,758
Then I got one and I'd
sit there and pluck away.
619
00:28:43,758 --> 00:28:46,586
We were just friends or
whatever, hanging out.
620
00:28:46,586 --> 00:28:50,965
The guy who played bass was
the cousin of the drummer
621
00:28:50,965 --> 00:28:54,103
but he would rarely show up,
but he had a bass and an amp,
622
00:28:54,103 --> 00:28:56,724
and I'd be there with my
guitar, but it's like,
623
00:28:56,724 --> 00:28:58,137
"Well, there's no one
here to play bass.
624
00:28:58,137 --> 00:28:59,344
"Why don't you play bass?"
625
00:28:59,344 --> 00:29:03,482
[rock song]
626
00:29:19,344 --> 00:29:23,586
Buzz's girlfriend played
bass and she replaced me,
627
00:29:23,586 --> 00:29:25,448
so that was pretty much,
628
00:29:25,448 --> 00:29:28,689
since I didn't have
a pussy [laughing]
629
00:29:28,689 --> 00:29:31,310
I was no longer
needed in the band.
630
00:29:31,310 --> 00:29:34,275
He found a bass player that
had a pussy and would fuck him.
631
00:29:34,275 --> 00:29:35,862
[laughing]
632
00:29:35,862 --> 00:29:38,620
[bass riff]
633
00:29:38,620 --> 00:29:40,413
Then when I joined
Mudhoney, I was like,
634
00:29:40,413 --> 00:29:41,793
"This stuff's fucking great.
635
00:29:41,793 --> 00:29:43,793
"It's just good rock and roll,"
636
00:29:43,793 --> 00:29:46,758
which is all anybody
wants anyway, isn't it?
637
00:29:46,758 --> 00:29:48,724
It's just good rock.
638
00:29:50,344 --> 00:29:51,862
- I was working at a
Japanese restaurant,
639
00:29:51,862 --> 00:29:55,206
and this chef there seemed like
640
00:29:55,206 --> 00:29:56,551
he'd already been
through the punk wars
641
00:29:56,551 --> 00:29:58,827
and, you know, had
gone pop, sort of
642
00:29:58,827 --> 00:30:00,413
and was into kind
of synthpop stuff.
643
00:30:00,413 --> 00:30:01,931
I was talking about
guitar and I was like,
644
00:30:01,931 --> 00:30:04,000
"I just can't really get it to
sound the way I want it to,"
645
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:05,896
and he asked me what
distortion box I was using,
646
00:30:05,896 --> 00:30:07,482
and I didn't know what that was.
647
00:30:07,482 --> 00:30:08,724
I was like, "Huh?"
648
00:30:08,724 --> 00:30:10,137
He just kind of smiled
and the next day,
649
00:30:10,137 --> 00:30:13,172
he handed me a Super Fuzz,
said, "Here, try this."
650
00:30:13,172 --> 00:30:15,931
[rock music]
651
00:30:15,931 --> 00:30:17,379
It was a serious revelation,
652
00:30:17,379 --> 00:30:19,689
because it's not just
a distortion box,
653
00:30:19,689 --> 00:30:21,517
it's fuzz, you know.
654
00:30:21,517 --> 00:30:24,689
It's like really,
really deep, thick fuzz.
655
00:30:24,689 --> 00:30:27,000
And so that just blew my mind.
656
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,758
[rock music]
657
00:30:29,758 --> 00:30:32,413
By the time that
Mudhoney started,
658
00:30:32,413 --> 00:30:34,344
I was playing the Big
Muff because it had
659
00:30:34,344 --> 00:30:35,586
more of that
sustain, kind of like
660
00:30:35,586 --> 00:30:38,172
Blue Cheer, Stooges
kind of thing going.
661
00:30:38,172 --> 00:30:40,310
And so Mark used the Super Fuzz.
662
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:47,000
♪ Sweet young thing
ain't sweet no more
663
00:30:51,517 --> 00:30:56,517
♪ Sweet young thing
ain't sweet no more
664
00:31:01,172 --> 00:31:06,172
♪ Sweet young thing
ain't sweet no more ♪
665
00:31:09,068 --> 00:31:11,068
- [Voiceover] So here's
the original 8-track reel.
666
00:31:13,551 --> 00:31:16,413
Inside is what passes
for a track sheet
667
00:31:16,413 --> 00:31:17,793
at that point in my career.
668
00:31:17,793 --> 00:31:19,344
I think I'd only been
a recording engineer
669
00:31:19,344 --> 00:31:21,310
for maybe a year and a half.
670
00:31:21,310 --> 00:31:23,862
- When we did that
single, we really wanted
671
00:31:23,862 --> 00:31:27,241
to put, like, our
best foot forward.
672
00:31:27,241 --> 00:31:29,482
This is our chance
to make a statement,
673
00:31:29,482 --> 00:31:31,482
and we didn't really know
if we were going to do
674
00:31:31,482 --> 00:31:33,000
anything more than
that first single,
675
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:35,206
so we were like, "We're gonna
put our two best songs on it
676
00:31:35,206 --> 00:31:36,896
"and that'll be it,"
and that could be
677
00:31:36,896 --> 00:31:39,689
the only document that
this band would ever have.
678
00:31:39,689 --> 00:31:42,655
- You know, here's
the initial salvo.
679
00:31:42,655 --> 00:31:45,827
It's kind of the opening salvo
of grunge, in a lot of ways.
680
00:31:45,827 --> 00:31:48,137
I think people would
look at it that way now.
681
00:31:48,931 --> 00:31:50,758
[rock music]
682
00:31:50,758 --> 00:31:52,310
- What you're going
to hear about today
683
00:31:52,310 --> 00:31:54,241
is nothing short of a miracle.
684
00:31:54,241 --> 00:31:56,344
It's dramatically new.
685
00:31:56,344 --> 00:32:00,344
["Touch Me I'm
Sick" by Mudhoney]
686
00:32:05,551 --> 00:32:08,103
♪ I've been bad
687
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,103
♪ And I've been worse
688
00:32:11,103 --> 00:32:12,344
- [Voiceover] That's
the apotheosis
689
00:32:12,344 --> 00:32:14,689
of what rock and roll
should sound like.
690
00:32:14,689 --> 00:32:18,448
♪ Yeah, I'm a jerk
691
00:32:18,448 --> 00:32:19,724
- "Touch me, I'm sick"
692
00:32:19,724 --> 00:32:21,896
is a pretty extraordinary
thing to say.
693
00:32:21,896 --> 00:32:23,862
♪ Touch me, I'm sick
694
00:32:23,862 --> 00:32:26,482
You think, there are
eight million ways to say
695
00:32:26,482 --> 00:32:28,758
"I love you" or "I don't
love you" in rock and roll.
696
00:32:28,758 --> 00:32:32,413
"Touch me, I'm sick," that
was one I hadn't heard before.
697
00:32:32,413 --> 00:32:34,586
- It was exciting and vital.
698
00:32:34,586 --> 00:32:37,517
It sounded really
punk as fuck, too.
699
00:32:38,931 --> 00:32:42,482
♪ Touch me, I'm sick
700
00:32:44,103 --> 00:32:47,620
- That record was so in demand
that they flew out the door.
701
00:32:47,620 --> 00:32:51,172
One of those classic singles
that captured the time.
702
00:32:51,172 --> 00:32:52,724
♪ If you don't come
703
00:32:52,724 --> 00:32:55,965
♪ You'll die alone
704
00:32:55,965 --> 00:33:00,896
- It did not get on radio in
any kind of widespread way.
705
00:33:00,896 --> 00:33:02,862
There was something
that the insiders,
706
00:33:02,862 --> 00:33:04,517
the know-it-alls knew,
707
00:33:04,517 --> 00:33:06,965
but it really had a
strong viral effect
708
00:33:06,965 --> 00:33:11,068
to the point now that it
is in its own way a hit.
709
00:33:11,068 --> 00:33:14,551
[rock music]
710
00:33:16,551 --> 00:33:21,137
♪ Sweet young
ain't sweet no more
711
00:33:26,034 --> 00:33:31,034
♪ Sweet young ain't
sweet no more ♪
712
00:33:35,344 --> 00:33:37,172
- As a label, we really tried
713
00:33:37,172 --> 00:33:39,000
to work the collector's market,
714
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:42,034
doing colored vinyl
editions of all the 45s.
715
00:33:42,034 --> 00:33:45,000
- We worked with Erika
Records for weeks
716
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:49,103
getting samples of
a good shit brown,
717
00:33:49,103 --> 00:33:54,034
and they'd send us kind
of like a veiny purple,
718
00:33:54,034 --> 00:33:56,275
a baby shit brown,
and we were like,
719
00:33:56,275 --> 00:33:58,000
"No, no, no, no,
this has gotta be
720
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:02,000
"a firm, adult, dog shit brown."
721
00:34:03,103 --> 00:34:04,896
They finally got it.
722
00:34:04,896 --> 00:34:07,103
- Here's a little-known fact.
723
00:34:07,103 --> 00:34:10,689
I remember Jonathan and
Steve and I went out to lunch
724
00:34:10,689 --> 00:34:15,413
and the whole idea for the
Sub Pop Singles Club came out
725
00:34:15,413 --> 00:34:17,793
during a conversation
about record collecting
726
00:34:17,793 --> 00:34:19,206
and how we could
sell more records,
727
00:34:19,206 --> 00:34:21,827
and Steve was probably the
deepest record collector
728
00:34:21,827 --> 00:34:23,310
of anybody in the band.
729
00:34:27,310 --> 00:34:30,034
- I mean, I remember the
first record I bought.
730
00:34:30,034 --> 00:34:32,448
When I was in first
or second grade,
731
00:34:32,448 --> 00:34:33,655
I bought an Elvis Presley record
732
00:34:33,655 --> 00:34:35,896
for 25 cents at a garage sale.
733
00:34:35,896 --> 00:34:37,655
I still have that record.
734
00:34:37,655 --> 00:34:39,965
Yeah, the two things that
have kind of remained with me,
735
00:34:39,965 --> 00:34:43,172
it's pretty easy, I love
punk rock, I love folk music.
736
00:34:43,172 --> 00:34:45,758
One of my all-time
heroes, Roky Erickson.
737
00:34:45,758 --> 00:34:47,448
Monochrome set, "He's Frank."
738
00:34:47,448 --> 00:34:50,344
Live version of "Hospital"
by Jonathan Richman.
739
00:34:50,344 --> 00:34:54,000
Tumwater, these are
beer ads from the 70s,
740
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:56,482
like little tiny snippets,
little songs about beer.
741
00:34:56,482 --> 00:34:58,758
[laughing]
742
00:34:58,758 --> 00:35:01,137
First Mudhoney single,
the super limited.
743
00:35:01,137 --> 00:35:03,758
Just a handful of
weird colors made,
744
00:35:05,172 --> 00:35:06,965
because they were
trying to make up
745
00:35:06,965 --> 00:35:08,931
for the fact that
they were so late
746
00:35:08,931 --> 00:35:10,689
and they kept fucking
up all the orders.
747
00:35:10,689 --> 00:35:12,448
The saddest thing about
all these singles?
748
00:35:12,448 --> 00:35:14,896
The sleeve that they put them in
749
00:35:17,068 --> 00:35:19,448
stained them, made
this horrible staining.
750
00:35:19,448 --> 00:35:22,344
I don't know if you
can see that anyway.
751
00:35:22,344 --> 00:35:24,862
It's a crime against
a record, though.
752
00:35:24,862 --> 00:35:28,620
Somehow, like, they
chemically don't mix
753
00:35:28,620 --> 00:35:30,620
with the vinyl, the sleeves.
754
00:35:30,620 --> 00:35:32,068
Very sad.
755
00:35:32,068 --> 00:35:35,000
So they're all
downgraded, unfortunately,
756
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,103
from mint minus to
[mumbling] plus.
757
00:35:38,103 --> 00:35:40,551
[laughing]
758
00:35:43,482 --> 00:35:46,448
- We were just kind
of hobbling along.
759
00:35:46,448 --> 00:35:48,586
We had run out of cash.
760
00:35:48,586 --> 00:35:50,758
That summer, Jonathan
and I went to
761
00:35:50,758 --> 00:35:52,206
the New Music Seminar,
762
00:35:52,206 --> 00:35:54,620
which is a big conference
in New York City.
763
00:35:54,620 --> 00:35:57,517
Spent the last few cents we
had going to that conference.
764
00:35:57,517 --> 00:36:01,931
Amazingly, we met up
with a German promoter.
765
00:36:01,931 --> 00:36:03,344
- And the next thing you know,
766
00:36:03,344 --> 00:36:08,000
Mudhoney, Bruce and
myself were given tickets
767
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,000
to go to Berlin at
the end of October.
768
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:14,620
- [Voiceover] Hey, we're
Mudhoney, we're from Seattle!
769
00:36:14,620 --> 00:36:16,034
- That was really exciting,
770
00:36:16,034 --> 00:36:18,827
'cause, you know, we hadn't
been anywhere, really.
771
00:36:18,827 --> 00:36:23,068
We just got flown in to
play one show to Berlin.
772
00:36:23,068 --> 00:36:25,241
To us it seemed like
a complete joke,
773
00:36:25,241 --> 00:36:29,655
like, "Who's paying for
this and why?" [laughing]
774
00:36:29,655 --> 00:36:31,655
- [Voiceover] Playing
that show was a huge break
775
00:36:31,655 --> 00:36:35,172
for Mudhoney and also a
huge break for Sub Pop.
776
00:36:35,172 --> 00:36:38,724
- It was fucking surreal,
man, on every level.
777
00:36:38,724 --> 00:36:40,344
People got it.
778
00:36:40,344 --> 00:36:43,344
I mean, in many ways,
they got it much more
779
00:36:43,344 --> 00:36:46,068
than people outside
of Seattle did.
780
00:36:46,068 --> 00:36:50,241
[rock music]
781
00:37:27,482 --> 00:37:29,586
- I was driving up to Seattle.
782
00:37:29,586 --> 00:37:31,172
There was a show that night.
783
00:37:31,172 --> 00:37:32,724
A band called
Mudhoney were playing.
784
00:37:32,724 --> 00:37:34,275
I was just minding
my own business.
785
00:37:34,275 --> 00:37:38,620
I was behind this chick
that had a skeleton thing
786
00:37:38,620 --> 00:37:40,103
hanging from her
rear view mirror.
787
00:37:40,103 --> 00:37:43,310
I remember thinking, "Ooh,
an alternative chick.
788
00:37:43,310 --> 00:37:44,862
"Maybe's she's cute."
789
00:37:44,862 --> 00:37:47,137
Pulled up alongside of
her and it was Matt Lukin.
790
00:37:47,137 --> 00:37:48,586
[dramatic music]
791
00:37:48,586 --> 00:37:50,896
- I would say that Bob
Whittaker, their manager,
792
00:37:50,896 --> 00:37:53,931
was kind of like the
fifth member of Mudhoney.
793
00:37:53,931 --> 00:37:57,000
He was an integral part to
the whole Mudhoney vibe.
794
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,137
- We'd be playing shows and
there'd be some kind of ruckus,
795
00:37:59,137 --> 00:38:01,241
you know, like some
drunk guy in the corner
796
00:38:01,241 --> 00:38:03,413
doing something that
he shouldn't be doing.
797
00:38:06,137 --> 00:38:07,413
"Who the hell is that guy?"
798
00:38:07,413 --> 00:38:09,310
"That guy? Well,
that's our manager.
799
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,586
[laughing] "You're gonna
be paying him later."
800
00:38:12,586 --> 00:38:14,758
- Everything Mudhoney
did was kind of casual,
801
00:38:14,758 --> 00:38:18,068
kind of non-industry-oriented.
802
00:38:18,068 --> 00:38:19,413
Bob was their
manager, and I think
803
00:38:19,413 --> 00:38:21,793
that they split everything
evenly with him,
804
00:38:21,793 --> 00:38:23,103
like he was a band member,
805
00:38:23,103 --> 00:38:26,620
which is not your traditional
industry practice.
806
00:38:26,620 --> 00:38:28,827
They kind of bucked the
system, so to speak.
807
00:38:28,827 --> 00:38:30,137
- [Voiceover] French franc.
808
00:38:30,137 --> 00:38:33,931
- 'Ello. Behind me is ze
White Cliffs of Dover.
809
00:38:33,931 --> 00:38:38,344
[rock music]
810
00:38:38,344 --> 00:38:39,793
- They were the
first band I ever met
811
00:38:39,793 --> 00:38:43,103
where the manager's more out
of control than the band.
812
00:38:43,103 --> 00:38:45,689
- Yeah, he would
definitely throw gasoline
813
00:38:45,689 --> 00:38:48,000
on all kinds of fires.
814
00:38:52,034 --> 00:38:53,620
[yelling]
815
00:38:53,620 --> 00:38:56,896
- Bob's crazy, thoroughly crazy.
816
00:38:56,896 --> 00:38:59,206
- [mumbling] fuck
is going on in here?
817
00:38:59,206 --> 00:39:01,068
- Uh, nothing.
818
00:39:02,517 --> 00:39:05,000
- When we went on
our first U.S. tour,
819
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:08,724
we brought him along
kind of as entertainment,
820
00:39:08,724 --> 00:39:11,758
and more often that not,
he would get shit-faced
821
00:39:11,758 --> 00:39:14,068
and heckle us from the crowd.
822
00:39:14,068 --> 00:39:17,517
[rock music]
823
00:39:17,517 --> 00:39:19,413
- [Bob] Matt Lukin's
doing what he does best,
824
00:39:19,413 --> 00:39:21,206
you fucking dick.
825
00:39:21,206 --> 00:39:23,379
- You may not have
even seen him,
826
00:39:23,379 --> 00:39:24,655
even though it's
hard to miss him,
827
00:39:24,655 --> 00:39:27,034
'cause he's kind of like
the punk rock Big Bird.
828
00:39:27,034 --> 00:39:31,137
- [Bob] I was the butt rocker
with bad corkscrew hair.
829
00:39:32,310 --> 00:39:34,758
It was such a great
opportunity for me,
830
00:39:34,758 --> 00:39:37,896
college dropout,
go see the world.
831
00:39:37,896 --> 00:39:41,206
- He was drafted in
to be our roadie.
832
00:39:41,206 --> 00:39:45,275
The joke is if you asked
him to help carry an amp,
833
00:39:45,275 --> 00:39:47,206
he's like, "Carry it
yourself!" [laughing]
834
00:39:47,206 --> 00:39:48,758
"It's not mine!"
835
00:39:48,758 --> 00:39:52,344
- No, no, no, Bob didn't lift
a finger moving anything.
836
00:39:52,344 --> 00:39:53,586
- He'd just look at you and go,
837
00:39:53,586 --> 00:39:56,068
"Fuck you, you got two
legs, you go do it."
838
00:39:56,068 --> 00:39:58,448
Like, "Dude, I need to add
someone to the guest list,"
839
00:39:58,448 --> 00:40:01,241
"Fuck you, go to the front
door and do it yourself."
840
00:40:01,241 --> 00:40:03,551
It's like, "No, man,
you work for us!
841
00:40:03,551 --> 00:40:04,724
"You're supposed to do it!"
842
00:40:04,724 --> 00:40:06,413
"Ah, fuck you, you do it."
843
00:40:06,413 --> 00:40:10,586
But he was really great at
finding a place to stay,
844
00:40:10,586 --> 00:40:12,551
'cause, like, back when
you can't afford hotels,
845
00:40:12,551 --> 00:40:16,034
the best place to stay
is to find college girls
846
00:40:16,034 --> 00:40:18,896
living in a house that
her parents are paying for
847
00:40:18,896 --> 00:40:20,896
that's really nice or whatever.
848
00:40:20,896 --> 00:40:22,689
He was really good at
finding those kind of people
849
00:40:22,689 --> 00:40:24,862
that had a lot of room
and a really nice house,
850
00:40:24,862 --> 00:40:27,862
as opposed to finding
the punk rock house
851
00:40:27,862 --> 00:40:31,206
that's just full of piss
and cockroaches to stay in.
852
00:40:31,206 --> 00:40:33,586
- I think the band
and myself mutually
853
00:40:33,586 --> 00:40:38,103
had contempt for a lot of
the industry standards.
854
00:40:38,103 --> 00:40:40,620
I can remember it on
a flight one time,
855
00:40:40,620 --> 00:40:43,275
I just said, "Hey, you
guys, managers are creepy.
856
00:40:43,275 --> 00:40:45,793
"Let me be your creepy manager."
857
00:40:45,793 --> 00:40:48,413
But I just said, "I think
I can shoulder this load
858
00:40:48,413 --> 00:40:49,965
"without screwing
things up too much.
859
00:40:49,965 --> 00:40:51,482
"I can be your point guy."
860
00:40:51,482 --> 00:40:52,758
- [Steve] You know, he
kind of grew with us
861
00:40:52,758 --> 00:40:56,172
as the machine kind of
grew and slowly took on
862
00:40:56,172 --> 00:40:57,586
more and more responsibilities.
863
00:40:57,586 --> 00:40:59,172
And he took it real
seriously, really.
864
00:40:59,172 --> 00:41:02,275
He was learning as we were
going, too, as we all were.
865
00:41:02,275 --> 00:41:04,586
- I was a good
candidate, 'cause I'm
866
00:41:04,586 --> 00:41:06,379
relatively articulate
and I'm ultimately
867
00:41:06,379 --> 00:41:09,896
very concerned about the
band and their credibility
868
00:41:09,896 --> 00:41:12,724
and not talk them into
something they don't want,
869
00:41:12,724 --> 00:41:15,172
and so it was a pretty
comfortable transition.
870
00:41:16,413 --> 00:41:18,517
- For me, part of what
makes a record great
871
00:41:18,517 --> 00:41:23,310
is how it captures the time
in which it's presented.
872
00:41:24,068 --> 00:41:26,620
- This is our B-side to
our #1 hit in England
873
00:41:26,620 --> 00:41:28,482
called "Superfuzz Bigmuff."
874
00:41:28,482 --> 00:41:30,620
[crowd cheering]
875
00:41:30,620 --> 00:41:34,034
- It almost immediately entered
the indie charts in England,
876
00:41:34,034 --> 00:41:37,137
which was something
that never happened.
877
00:41:37,137 --> 00:41:40,896
American records never made
the indie charts in England.
878
00:41:40,896 --> 00:41:45,000
It was very rare, and it
stayed there for over a year.
879
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:48,448
- It instantly became
the party record.
880
00:41:48,448 --> 00:41:50,965
To this day, I think
it's the greatest EP
881
00:41:50,965 --> 00:41:53,103
that we've ever put out.
882
00:41:53,103 --> 00:41:57,827
- I had been, you know, a
professional recording engineer
883
00:41:57,827 --> 00:42:00,310
for less than two
years at that point.
884
00:42:00,310 --> 00:42:03,241
Now, what it is, you know, 23
years I've been doing this.
885
00:42:03,241 --> 00:42:07,103
I've made like 350-some albums
886
00:42:07,103 --> 00:42:09,068
in 10 countries or whatever,
887
00:42:09,068 --> 00:42:14,068
and this shit keeps
coming back! [laughing]
888
00:42:15,620 --> 00:42:20,206
♪ Give me love laced with lies
889
00:42:22,965 --> 00:42:27,689
♪ There ain't much
I haven't tried
890
00:42:31,241 --> 00:42:36,137
♪ Give me love laced with lies
891
00:42:38,793 --> 00:42:42,793
♪ There ain't much,
baby, I haven't tried ♪
892
00:42:42,793 --> 00:42:45,482
- You see Mark just
hurling towards the camera
893
00:42:45,482 --> 00:42:46,758
with their hair flowing,
894
00:42:46,758 --> 00:42:48,724
and then it looked
like "Mudhoney"
895
00:42:48,724 --> 00:42:50,310
written in amazing Magic Marker
896
00:42:50,310 --> 00:42:52,310
and "Superfuzz Bigmuff"
written underneath.
897
00:42:52,310 --> 00:42:54,172
I challenge anyone to sit down
898
00:42:54,172 --> 00:42:57,000
and make "Superfuzz" a
better record than it is.
899
00:42:57,000 --> 00:42:58,172
The only way you can do it
900
00:42:58,172 --> 00:43:00,241
is to just make
it longer somehow.
901
00:43:01,758 --> 00:43:05,172
♪ Sliding in and out of grace
902
00:43:08,172 --> 00:43:10,758
- You think of some of the
greatest lines in rock and roll,
903
00:43:10,758 --> 00:43:14,344
that line, that fucking "Oh
god, how I love to hate."
904
00:43:15,965 --> 00:43:18,172
Fuck. I wish I wrote that.
905
00:43:18,172 --> 00:43:20,137
That's the coolest fucking line.
906
00:43:20,137 --> 00:43:22,034
"Oh god, how I love to hate."
907
00:43:22,034 --> 00:43:25,793
♪ Oh god, how I love to hate
908
00:43:28,655 --> 00:43:32,517
♪ Sliding in and out of grace
909
00:43:32,517 --> 00:43:34,379
- They were tapping into
these reference points,
910
00:43:34,379 --> 00:43:36,137
B-movies, there's this kind of
911
00:43:36,137 --> 00:43:37,827
kitschy, trashy thing going on.
912
00:43:37,827 --> 00:43:39,275
It's kind of a bit shit.
913
00:43:39,275 --> 00:43:40,620
Those films are a bit shit.
914
00:43:40,620 --> 00:43:42,655
People who act in
them are a bit shit,
915
00:43:42,655 --> 00:43:45,000
because they're the cheapest
actors they could get,
916
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:46,931
but there is this
sort of quality to it,
917
00:43:46,931 --> 00:43:49,379
and I feel like a lot of
what Mudhoney were doing
918
00:43:49,379 --> 00:43:52,551
was tapping into that,
like they weren't shit,
919
00:43:52,551 --> 00:43:54,758
but they were tapping into
these reference points.
920
00:43:54,758 --> 00:43:55,896
- [Voiceover] That's
a Lenny Kravitz song.
921
00:43:55,896 --> 00:43:57,275
- "There's a
Tractor in My Balls"
922
00:43:57,275 --> 00:43:58,965
is Lenny Kravitz's new hit.
923
00:43:58,965 --> 00:44:00,517
- But we know Sonic Youth.
924
00:44:00,517 --> 00:44:02,206
[laughing]
925
00:44:03,827 --> 00:44:05,793
- Has anybody vomited yet?
926
00:44:05,793 --> 00:44:08,000
- [Voiceover] Mark did!
927
00:44:13,620 --> 00:44:15,379
- We asked them to play with us
928
00:44:15,379 --> 00:44:17,655
when we were coming out
to do a West Coast tour,
929
00:44:17,655 --> 00:44:20,172
never having seen them
or really anything.
930
00:44:20,172 --> 00:44:22,827
- You know, with the Sonic
Youth stamp of approval,
931
00:44:22,827 --> 00:44:26,344
at that time, it
was a big thing.
932
00:44:26,344 --> 00:44:28,344
- And they were always happy.
933
00:44:28,344 --> 00:44:30,862
They were always just kind
of like eating and drinking
934
00:44:30,862 --> 00:44:32,931
and smoking cigarettes
and just, like,
935
00:44:32,931 --> 00:44:34,517
rolling up to the sound check
936
00:44:34,517 --> 00:44:36,931
and just spilling out of the van
937
00:44:36,931 --> 00:44:38,620
and wrestling on the pavement.
938
00:44:38,620 --> 00:44:39,827
Their whole thing was like,
939
00:44:39,827 --> 00:44:41,724
"Let's just have a
really good time."
940
00:44:41,724 --> 00:44:43,827
So it was kind of an
interesting pairing,
941
00:44:43,827 --> 00:44:46,172
you know, because we were
kind of a little older,
942
00:44:46,172 --> 00:44:49,482
and we were sort of like
egghead book collectors.
943
00:44:49,482 --> 00:44:50,965
- Yeah, didn't they
make fun of, like,
944
00:44:50,965 --> 00:44:52,655
they said something
once about us
945
00:44:52,655 --> 00:44:55,482
just reading in the van
all the time or something.
946
00:44:55,482 --> 00:44:57,275
- Right.
- "What book are you reading?"
947
00:44:57,275 --> 00:44:58,551
- When they'd come offstage,
948
00:44:58,551 --> 00:45:01,724
we'd be in the dressing
room, all drunk,
949
00:45:01,724 --> 00:45:03,827
entertaining them with whatever,
950
00:45:03,827 --> 00:45:06,034
just being degenerates.
951
00:45:06,034 --> 00:45:08,000
I think they needed to
probably drink a bit more
952
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:11,310
and party a bit more to
make it more fun for them.
953
00:45:11,310 --> 00:45:15,103
They seemed to be into
buying books and stuff.
954
00:45:15,103 --> 00:45:18,206
[laughing] Good people, though.
955
00:45:18,206 --> 00:45:22,275
[rock music]
956
00:45:29,655 --> 00:45:32,206
- One of the most famous
Mudhoney gigs in London
957
00:45:32,206 --> 00:45:35,655
was the gig at the School
of Oriental African Studies.
958
00:45:35,655 --> 00:45:37,000
Mudhoney were headlining,
959
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:38,758
and they were supported
by Soundgarden.
960
00:45:38,758 --> 00:45:42,482
- All of the British
press at that show,
961
00:45:42,482 --> 00:45:45,241
so there were like
at least 200 people,
962
00:45:45,241 --> 00:45:47,206
press people, on the guest list.
963
00:45:47,206 --> 00:45:50,034
- We played first,
played a great set.
964
00:45:50,034 --> 00:45:51,137
I loved the set.
965
00:45:51,137 --> 00:45:52,448
I remember the
songs that we played
966
00:45:52,448 --> 00:45:54,034
and the sequence in
which we played them
967
00:45:54,034 --> 00:45:55,793
and it was really strong.
968
00:45:55,793 --> 00:45:58,034
- There's nowhere
else in our history
969
00:45:58,034 --> 00:46:00,448
that we ever could have had
Soundgarden open for us.
970
00:46:00,448 --> 00:46:02,551
[laughing] That was
like the one day.
971
00:46:02,551 --> 00:46:05,344
[laughing]
972
00:46:05,344 --> 00:46:06,689
Kind of weird.
973
00:46:06,689 --> 00:46:08,862
- We get up there,
and there's just this
974
00:46:08,862 --> 00:46:10,413
weird energy in the air.
975
00:46:10,413 --> 00:46:13,034
You could definitely sense
there's a lot of anticipation.
976
00:46:13,034 --> 00:46:15,034
- Sometimes you need
a collective of people
977
00:46:15,034 --> 00:46:17,103
to be in the same room
together to realize
978
00:46:17,103 --> 00:46:19,206
how they all feel about
it and to be excited
979
00:46:19,206 --> 00:46:20,551
about how they
all feel about it,
980
00:46:20,551 --> 00:46:22,172
because up until then, you know,
981
00:46:22,172 --> 00:46:23,758
people had been hearing
this stuff on the radio,
982
00:46:23,758 --> 00:46:25,137
people had been
buying the records,
983
00:46:25,137 --> 00:46:27,379
but until you actually
saw the band live,
984
00:46:27,379 --> 00:46:30,793
you never really get a sense
of how you'll feel about it
985
00:46:30,793 --> 00:46:33,000
and how exciting and
empowering that can be.
986
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:34,448
[rock music]
987
00:46:34,448 --> 00:46:36,517
- Mark Arm always had these
988
00:46:36,517 --> 00:46:39,655
cynical, wiseass jokes.
989
00:46:39,655 --> 00:46:41,448
He decided to ask, "I would like
990
00:46:41,448 --> 00:46:45,068
"to invite everybody on stage."
991
00:46:45,068 --> 00:46:46,310
They did.
992
00:46:46,310 --> 00:46:50,931
♪ I've been so close
to no way out ♪
993
00:46:50,931 --> 00:46:52,655
- We called it
the friendly riot.
994
00:46:52,655 --> 00:46:55,413
You know, this was the
arrival of grunge mania.
995
00:46:55,413 --> 00:46:57,137
- An out-of-control good time.
996
00:46:57,137 --> 00:47:01,275
[rock music]
997
00:47:06,241 --> 00:47:08,000
- But the next day,
all you heard about
998
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,896
in the press was how
great Mudhoney was.
999
00:47:10,896 --> 00:47:14,068
I was bummed that we were
a footnote in the review.
1000
00:47:14,068 --> 00:47:17,448
- That really established
Sub Pop in Seattle
1001
00:47:17,448 --> 00:47:19,551
and Mudhoney in Europe.
1002
00:47:19,551 --> 00:47:22,517
- That started the whole
thing, especially in England.
1003
00:47:27,310 --> 00:47:29,448
- The basic feeling was
1004
00:47:29,448 --> 00:47:32,344
we were still cruising
under the radar
1005
00:47:32,344 --> 00:47:36,000
and nobody really
knew, except for us,
1006
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:39,172
just how big the
scene had gotten,
1007
00:47:39,172 --> 00:47:42,931
so it was with that
intention that we said,
1008
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:45,724
"We're gonna do a
show in the Moore.
1009
00:47:45,724 --> 00:47:47,655
"And not only are we gonna
do a show in the Moore,
1010
00:47:47,655 --> 00:47:49,275
"we're gonna sell it out."
1011
00:47:49,275 --> 00:47:50,724
- I just thought
they were crazy.
1012
00:47:50,724 --> 00:47:52,827
Nirvana, at that point,
was barely known.
1013
00:47:52,827 --> 00:47:55,896
TAD had something out.
1014
00:47:55,896 --> 00:47:59,931
- The bands had all been
playing these little clubs.
1015
00:47:59,931 --> 00:48:02,172
The Rainbow Tavern, the Central.
1016
00:48:02,172 --> 00:48:05,034
There's a club around the
corner called the Ditto.
1017
00:48:05,034 --> 00:48:08,275
These are all rooms that
held a couple hundred people.
1018
00:48:08,275 --> 00:48:11,689
Playing the Moore at that time,
1019
00:48:11,689 --> 00:48:13,517
not opening for somebody
1020
00:48:13,517 --> 00:48:15,310
but actually headlining
at the Moore,
1021
00:48:15,310 --> 00:48:18,551
that was seen to be a
pretty big accomplishment.
1022
00:48:18,551 --> 00:48:22,000
We knew how popular these
bands had become in town,
1023
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:25,206
and we wanted to strut
our stuff a little bit.
1024
00:48:25,206 --> 00:48:26,862
Wake people up.
1025
00:48:26,862 --> 00:48:31,137
[crowd cheering, rock music]
1026
00:48:38,413 --> 00:48:41,034
- Needless to say,
the venue sold out.
1027
00:48:41,034 --> 00:48:43,034
People went crazy.
1028
00:48:43,034 --> 00:48:45,586
It was total mayhem.
1029
00:48:45,586 --> 00:48:49,000
["No One Has" by Mudhoney]
1030
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:52,448
♪ I've been so close
to no way out ♪
1031
00:48:52,448 --> 00:48:54,448
- Now it was no
longer these people
1032
00:48:54,448 --> 00:48:57,275
in this core group
of musicians and fans
1033
00:48:57,275 --> 00:48:59,344
that was always
the Seattle scene.
1034
00:48:59,344 --> 00:49:02,034
It's now reaching
out to the suburbs.
1035
00:49:04,379 --> 00:49:07,862
♪ I don't lock
the door no more ♪
1036
00:49:12,413 --> 00:49:14,965
- That really got the
attention of the main writers
1037
00:49:14,965 --> 00:49:16,758
for the local papers.
1038
00:49:17,965 --> 00:49:20,344
We couldn't be ignored
after that show.
1039
00:49:20,344 --> 00:49:25,034
[singing]
1040
00:49:26,827 --> 00:49:28,551
- After the show,
word on the street was
1041
00:49:28,551 --> 00:49:32,517
that Seattle was
just blowing up.
1042
00:49:32,517 --> 00:49:36,827
[rock music]
1043
00:49:39,068 --> 00:49:40,931
They had a relentless
release schedule.
1044
00:49:40,931 --> 00:49:43,206
Now, our whole
strategy of attack
1045
00:49:43,206 --> 00:49:46,034
was to just keep
putting something out,
1046
00:49:46,034 --> 00:49:51,000
and it built to the album,
and the album did great.
1047
00:49:51,896 --> 00:49:54,172
- The thing that I
remember the most?
1048
00:49:54,172 --> 00:49:58,344
We work radio right
before records come out.
1049
00:49:58,344 --> 00:50:02,379
It came in as a CMJ
#1 added record,
1050
00:50:02,379 --> 00:50:05,068
and that we had a
#1 record at CMJ
1051
00:50:05,068 --> 00:50:08,413
was a huge, huge fucking deal.
1052
00:50:08,413 --> 00:50:10,931
- That was at the
height of hair metal.
1053
00:50:10,931 --> 00:50:12,862
It was at the height
of so many things
1054
00:50:12,862 --> 00:50:15,275
that were considered to be
1055
00:50:15,275 --> 00:50:18,551
the cultural rule,
1056
00:50:18,551 --> 00:50:20,482
and yet what they
were doing up there
1057
00:50:20,482 --> 00:50:22,379
was like, "Fuck it,
1058
00:50:22,379 --> 00:50:23,827
"whatever you're doing out there
1059
00:50:23,827 --> 00:50:25,724
"has nothing to do with
what we're doing in here."
1060
00:50:27,379 --> 00:50:32,068
- We ramped up our marketing
efforts, did some videos.
1061
00:50:33,344 --> 00:50:36,931
It was, like, a grown-up
1062
00:50:36,931 --> 00:50:41,827
independent rock
record marketing spree.
1063
00:50:41,827 --> 00:50:46,206
["Here Comes
Sickness" by Mudhoney]
1064
00:50:55,586 --> 00:50:57,862
♪ Here comes sickness
1065
00:50:57,862 --> 00:51:00,172
♪ Walking down my street
1066
00:51:00,172 --> 00:51:01,827
- I was quickly kind of
1067
00:51:01,827 --> 00:51:04,793
underwhelmed by it
after it was done.
1068
00:51:04,793 --> 00:51:07,724
- It was kind of more of
the same as "Superfuzz,"
1069
00:51:07,724 --> 00:51:09,172
maybe without the urgency.
1070
00:51:09,172 --> 00:51:11,379
There's some really good
songs on there, I think.
1071
00:51:11,379 --> 00:51:14,000
"Superfuzz," being
a six-song EP,
1072
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:17,310
is really concise
and to the point.
1073
00:51:17,310 --> 00:51:18,620
There's no filler on it.
1074
00:51:18,620 --> 00:51:20,827
You know, we don't
write an album and go,
1075
00:51:20,827 --> 00:51:22,413
"This song is filler,"
but, you know,
1076
00:51:22,413 --> 00:51:23,931
after a while you
kind of can step back
1077
00:51:23,931 --> 00:51:27,034
and go, "Maybe that song isn't
quite as good as this one."
1078
00:51:27,034 --> 00:51:30,793
- OK, well, that was, you
know, the sophomore slump.
1079
00:51:30,793 --> 00:51:32,655
We didn't raise the bar any.
1080
00:51:32,655 --> 00:51:36,137
♪ At you
1081
00:51:45,344 --> 00:51:47,620
- Is it true you
want to break up now?
1082
00:51:47,620 --> 00:51:50,137
Why, I mean, what's
going to be the future
1083
00:51:50,137 --> 00:51:53,413
for grunge rock and things?
1084
00:51:53,413 --> 00:51:56,379
- I don't know, Steve's
going back to school
1085
00:51:56,379 --> 00:51:58,551
and Dan's going to
play drums for Nirvana,
1086
00:51:58,551 --> 00:51:59,862
so me and Mark are just gonna,
1087
00:51:59,862 --> 00:52:01,482
I don't know, something
might come along.
1088
00:52:01,482 --> 00:52:03,965
There'll be other
bands in Seattle still.
1089
00:52:03,965 --> 00:52:05,931
There are still
good bands there.
1090
00:52:05,931 --> 00:52:08,655
- I'm sure I'll play music
of some sort for all my life,
1091
00:52:08,655 --> 00:52:12,482
but I've never wanted
to be like a rock star
1092
00:52:12,482 --> 00:52:15,000
or like a professional
musician, really.
1093
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:18,310
I just always played
in bad punk rock bands,
1094
00:52:18,310 --> 00:52:21,000
and that's what I
intend to keep doing.
1095
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:23,000
We're not really saying
we're breaking up,
1096
00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:24,689
'cause you never know,
1097
00:52:24,689 --> 00:52:27,413
we might be back
together at some point.
1098
00:52:27,413 --> 00:52:29,103
- [Voiceover] You know, at
the time when the band was,
1099
00:52:29,103 --> 00:52:31,103
you know, doing
really, really well,
1100
00:52:31,103 --> 00:52:33,517
Steve decided that he
wanted to go back to school.
1101
00:52:33,517 --> 00:52:36,379
- You know, when the
band started, I mean,
1102
00:52:36,379 --> 00:52:38,206
our initial thing was like,
1103
00:52:38,206 --> 00:52:40,241
"We're gonna be lucky
to get a single out."
1104
00:52:40,241 --> 00:52:41,758
We accomplished that.
1105
00:52:41,758 --> 00:52:43,310
At the time, it
seemed like most bands
1106
00:52:43,310 --> 00:52:45,172
had three good years in them.
1107
00:52:45,172 --> 00:52:47,172
Steve was, more
than anybody else,
1108
00:52:47,172 --> 00:52:49,241
kind of really
married to that idea.
1109
00:52:49,241 --> 00:52:50,896
And so I think he
probably just thought,
1110
00:52:50,896 --> 00:52:52,896
"Well, this is the
thing I'm doing
1111
00:52:52,896 --> 00:52:54,310
"at this point in my life
1112
00:52:54,310 --> 00:52:56,068
"and I'm gonna eventually
go back to school
1113
00:52:56,068 --> 00:52:57,724
"and get that
anthropology degree
1114
00:52:57,724 --> 00:53:00,448
"and go become a professor
somewhere or something."
1115
00:53:00,448 --> 00:53:01,931
I don't know.
1116
00:53:01,931 --> 00:53:06,103
- I still could not imagine
music being, you know, a living.
1117
00:53:06,103 --> 00:53:07,517
I don't think I
wanted it, really,
1118
00:53:07,517 --> 00:53:09,551
and I think I was in denial
that it could have been.
1119
00:53:09,551 --> 00:53:11,241
I know I didn't like
the record very much.
1120
00:53:11,241 --> 00:53:13,103
Just wanted distance ourselves
1121
00:53:13,103 --> 00:53:17,689
from what was becoming known
as the grunge thing in Seattle.
1122
00:53:17,689 --> 00:53:21,827
[rock music]
1123
00:53:23,586 --> 00:53:25,931
- I had run into the girlfriends
1124
00:53:25,931 --> 00:53:28,655
of Kurt and Krist at a show,
1125
00:53:28,655 --> 00:53:32,275
and they had told me Nirvana
was looking for a new drummer.
1126
00:53:32,275 --> 00:53:34,103
Chad wasn't gonna be
in the band anymore.
1127
00:53:34,103 --> 00:53:35,965
I'm like, "Well, you know,
1128
00:53:35,965 --> 00:53:37,517
"I'm not gonna be doing
anything for awhile."
1129
00:53:37,517 --> 00:53:39,413
Let them know that I'd
like to play with them
1130
00:53:39,413 --> 00:53:41,000
if they were interested.
1131
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:43,931
[rock music]
1132
00:53:48,896 --> 00:53:50,827
I had played a show with them
1133
00:53:50,827 --> 00:53:52,827
at the Motorsports
International Garage.
1134
00:53:52,827 --> 00:53:55,310
It was a big show
for them in town.
1135
00:53:55,310 --> 00:53:57,172
There was supposed
to be a photo shoot
1136
00:53:57,172 --> 00:53:59,172
the next day after that show for
1137
00:53:59,172 --> 00:54:00,793
the cover of Sounds Magazine.
1138
00:54:00,793 --> 00:54:02,758
I went to Tacoma and
did the photo shoot,
1139
00:54:02,758 --> 00:54:05,448
and then they took off and
went to talk to labels.
1140
00:54:05,448 --> 00:54:07,551
When they got back from
that, Kurt gave me a call
1141
00:54:07,551 --> 00:54:10,034
and he's like, "Looks like
we're gonna sign to Geffen,"
1142
00:54:10,034 --> 00:54:12,068
and I'm like, "Eh, all right."
1143
00:54:12,068 --> 00:54:15,413
I'm like, "So what's happened
with that English tour?"
1144
00:54:15,413 --> 00:54:18,379
He's like, "Oh, yeah,
that's why I'm calling.
1145
00:54:18,379 --> 00:54:20,724
"We got another drummer."
1146
00:54:20,724 --> 00:54:21,931
I'm like, "Oh."
1147
00:54:21,931 --> 00:54:23,517
Turned out to be,
of course, Dave,
1148
00:54:23,517 --> 00:54:25,172
who was at the
show that I played,
1149
00:54:25,172 --> 00:54:28,689
who was at the photo session
that I did with those guys.
1150
00:54:28,689 --> 00:54:30,655
They all knew full
well at the time
1151
00:54:30,655 --> 00:54:33,379
that I was not gonna
be in the band,
1152
00:54:33,379 --> 00:54:34,655
but didn't say anything.
1153
00:54:34,655 --> 00:54:35,862
The great thing that happened
1154
00:54:35,862 --> 00:54:37,517
after the Nirvana
thing didn't work out
1155
00:54:37,517 --> 00:54:39,379
was I ended up playing drums
for the Screaming Trees
1156
00:54:39,379 --> 00:54:42,275
for almost a year or
half a year or something,
1157
00:54:42,275 --> 00:54:43,793
and that was great.
1158
00:54:43,793 --> 00:54:47,413
- You know, we were still
practicing and writing songs.
1159
00:54:47,413 --> 00:54:49,620
- I'm like, "Steve, what
the fuck's going on?
1160
00:54:49,620 --> 00:54:52,275
"What do you got?
What's, you know...
1161
00:54:52,275 --> 00:54:54,344
"The Trees wanna go
and record a new record
1162
00:54:54,344 --> 00:54:57,137
"and they wanna continue
touring and stuff.
1163
00:54:57,137 --> 00:54:58,413
"What's up?"
1164
00:54:58,413 --> 00:55:01,000
And he was like, "Uhhh,
I think we should tour."
1165
00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:02,758
And I'm like, "All right."
1166
00:55:02,758 --> 00:55:05,034
So, I mean, that was
an easy choice for me
1167
00:55:05,034 --> 00:55:06,551
to go back to Mudhoney.
1168
00:55:06,551 --> 00:55:09,586
The energy and the
vibe and stuff,
1169
00:55:09,586 --> 00:55:10,758
you couldn't beat it.
1170
00:55:10,758 --> 00:55:11,965
I stopped playing
with the Trees,
1171
00:55:11,965 --> 00:55:14,206
and, of course,
they went on to make
1172
00:55:14,206 --> 00:55:17,241
one of their most successful
records of all time as well.
1173
00:55:17,241 --> 00:55:19,275
[laughing]
1174
00:55:19,275 --> 00:55:21,275
Apparently if I join a band
but don't play on their record,
1175
00:55:21,275 --> 00:55:25,586
they're gonna go off and
maybe have some good success.
1176
00:55:28,724 --> 00:55:32,310
- Well, for Sub Pop, 1991 was
1177
00:55:32,310 --> 00:55:34,517
the make or break year,
1178
00:55:34,517 --> 00:55:37,000
and I believe it was
1179
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:40,655
the early summer of '91
1180
00:55:40,655 --> 00:55:45,000
that Jon and I basically
laid off everybody.
1181
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:48,068
We'd come in the office and
pack up a box of records
1182
00:55:48,068 --> 00:55:51,172
to ship to Japan and maybe
get a couple hundred dollars,
1183
00:55:51,172 --> 00:55:53,862
and we were really
on our last legs
1184
00:55:53,862 --> 00:55:57,172
when "Every Good Boy
Deserves Fudge" came out.
1185
00:55:58,517 --> 00:56:01,896
If it wasn't for that release,
1186
00:56:01,896 --> 00:56:03,068
there's a very good chance
1187
00:56:03,068 --> 00:56:05,655
that we would have
folded the company.
1188
00:56:05,655 --> 00:56:09,172
Sub Pop has always been
very grateful to Mudhoney
1189
00:56:09,172 --> 00:56:12,413
for staying with
us like they did.
1190
00:56:12,413 --> 00:56:16,034
♪ Whatever happens
1191
00:56:16,034 --> 00:56:18,379
♪ Never thought for a second
1192
00:56:18,379 --> 00:56:22,275
♪ That I'd let go
1193
00:56:22,275 --> 00:56:25,241
♪ Uh-huh
1194
00:56:25,241 --> 00:56:28,000
- "Every Good Boy
Deserves Fudge," to me,
1195
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:32,344
may be the defining work
that Mudhoney has released,
1196
00:56:32,344 --> 00:56:36,758
and I know I'm not
alone in that thought.
1197
00:56:36,758 --> 00:56:41,586
That record married their
wit, their songwriting skills,
1198
00:56:41,586 --> 00:56:45,931
but there is a level
of sophistication,
1199
00:56:45,931 --> 00:56:49,275
but equal parts sophistication
1200
00:56:49,275 --> 00:56:51,448
and dinge.
1201
00:56:51,448 --> 00:56:53,379
That's another word for grunge.
1202
00:56:53,379 --> 00:56:55,896
And just fucking great jams.
1203
00:56:55,896 --> 00:56:59,172
- At that time,
selling 100,000 albums
1204
00:56:59,172 --> 00:57:02,689
on an indie label, that
didn't happen too often.
1205
00:57:02,689 --> 00:57:04,517
That was like going platinum,
1206
00:57:04,517 --> 00:57:05,793
and we were very
proud of the record
1207
00:57:05,793 --> 00:57:08,000
because it was such
an awesome disc.
1208
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:10,827
♪ They can make it sound so nice
1209
00:57:10,827 --> 00:57:15,172
♪ Everybody's got a price
1210
00:57:17,931 --> 00:57:21,551
♪ Ho, ho, ho, ho
1211
00:57:21,551 --> 00:57:22,931
- I think it's a
really good record,
1212
00:57:22,931 --> 00:57:25,655
and it was a good
change of direction.
1213
00:57:25,655 --> 00:57:28,137
You know, at that time I
was doing a lot more dope,
1214
00:57:28,137 --> 00:57:30,344
and I think Steve definitely
picked up the slack
1215
00:57:30,344 --> 00:57:32,137
and kind of drove that record.
1216
00:57:32,137 --> 00:57:36,275
[rock music]
1217
00:57:39,931 --> 00:57:41,034
- I guess it kind of gets tagged
1218
00:57:41,034 --> 00:57:43,413
more of a garage
punk kind of record.
1219
00:57:43,413 --> 00:57:44,620
We'd stripped things down
1220
00:57:44,620 --> 00:57:46,068
and simplified
things a little bit.
1221
00:57:46,068 --> 00:57:47,758
Also, 'cause it
was a pretty crude
1222
00:57:47,758 --> 00:57:49,344
8-track studio at the time.
1223
00:57:49,344 --> 00:57:52,103
If Mark had the
Farfisa on the song,
1224
00:57:52,103 --> 00:57:54,793
there couldn't be a
second guitar. [laughing]
1225
00:57:55,655 --> 00:57:58,724
♪ Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey
1226
00:57:58,724 --> 00:58:01,482
♪ Who you driving
1227
00:58:01,482 --> 00:58:04,758
♪ Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey
1228
00:58:04,758 --> 00:58:08,827
♪ Who you driving now
1229
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:11,896
♪ Now
1230
00:58:13,379 --> 00:58:15,103
- [Voiceover] But
it wasn't enough
1231
00:58:15,103 --> 00:58:19,586
for the company to
be in the black.
1232
00:58:19,586 --> 00:58:24,068
- They had an enormous
amount of patience with us,
1233
00:58:24,068 --> 00:58:28,862
because even though we
knew what we were doing
1234
00:58:28,862 --> 00:58:30,862
or what we were trying to do,
1235
00:58:30,862 --> 00:58:33,655
those guys didn't sign on
1236
00:58:33,655 --> 00:58:37,137
to uphold that.
1237
00:58:37,137 --> 00:58:39,172
You know, they were our friends
1238
00:58:39,172 --> 00:58:40,931
and they believed in
us and they believed in
1239
00:58:40,931 --> 00:58:44,758
the vision of the label
to a certain degree,
1240
00:58:44,758 --> 00:58:46,965
but, you know, they
had their own interests
1241
00:58:46,965 --> 00:58:48,689
to manage and maintain.
1242
00:58:48,689 --> 00:58:50,758
- You know, leaving
Sub Pop was rough.
1243
00:58:50,758 --> 00:58:53,551
It wasn't something
that I'm proud of
1244
00:58:53,551 --> 00:58:54,931
or happy about doing.
1245
00:58:54,931 --> 00:58:57,448
It just seemed really
unloyal to me to leave.
1246
00:58:57,448 --> 00:58:59,413
- It was getting uncomfortable,
1247
00:58:59,413 --> 00:59:02,379
and we started worrying
that they were going to
1248
00:59:02,379 --> 00:59:05,344
go out of business owing us
75,000 bucks or something,
1249
00:59:05,344 --> 00:59:08,103
and it was really gonna destroy
any kind of friendships.
1250
00:59:08,103 --> 00:59:12,241
I think us leaving kind of
ruined the friendships anyway,
1251
00:59:12,241 --> 00:59:14,517
kind of, but I don't think
there was any way around it.
1252
00:59:14,517 --> 00:59:17,689
[rock music]
1253
00:59:17,689 --> 00:59:19,793
- What ended up happening was,
1254
00:59:19,793 --> 00:59:21,620
it got the company to a point
1255
00:59:21,620 --> 00:59:23,758
where it could survive
just a little bit longer,
1256
00:59:23,758 --> 00:59:25,931
and then "Nevermind" happened,
1257
00:59:25,931 --> 00:59:27,724
and it ended up
being "Nevermind"
1258
00:59:27,724 --> 00:59:29,586
that kind of pushed
the company, really,
1259
00:59:29,586 --> 00:59:32,241
into a better financial place,
1260
00:59:32,241 --> 00:59:33,689
where they could kind of regroup
1261
00:59:33,689 --> 00:59:36,000
and figure out
what the plan was.
1262
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:38,655
- If we had known that
Sub Pop was gonna be
1263
00:59:38,655 --> 00:59:42,103
kept afloat by Nirvana
signing to a major label,
1264
00:59:42,103 --> 00:59:44,413
I don't think we would
have left the label.
1265
00:59:44,413 --> 00:59:46,034
You know, we probably
would have just
1266
00:59:46,034 --> 00:59:47,482
kind of like weathered the storm
1267
00:59:47,482 --> 00:59:49,344
and waited 'til that happened,
1268
00:59:49,344 --> 00:59:52,068
but, of course, we didn't
know that was gonna happen.
1269
00:59:52,068 --> 00:59:56,379
Sub Pop was distributed at
the time by a record label
1270
00:59:56,379 --> 00:59:58,965
in New York called
Caroline Records,
1271
00:59:58,965 --> 01:00:00,172
so we thought, "Well,
1272
01:00:00,172 --> 01:00:01,517
"maybe we'll just cut
out the middleman."
1273
01:00:01,517 --> 01:00:02,827
President of the label came out,
1274
01:00:02,827 --> 01:00:05,137
his name was Keith
something or other.
1275
01:00:05,137 --> 01:00:07,000
I wish I could totally
remember the name,
1276
01:00:07,000 --> 01:00:09,689
just because people like this
need to have their names,
1277
01:00:09,689 --> 01:00:11,689
they need to be
called out, right?
1278
01:00:11,689 --> 01:00:13,310
He took us to a nice lunch,
1279
01:00:13,310 --> 01:00:15,482
started telling us what
we could and could not do
1280
01:00:15,482 --> 01:00:16,793
if we signed to Caroline.
1281
01:00:16,793 --> 01:00:18,241
He said we would have to tour
1282
01:00:18,241 --> 01:00:19,827
for nine months out of the year.
1283
01:00:19,827 --> 01:00:21,586
That's what Smashing
Pumpkins were doing
1284
01:00:21,586 --> 01:00:22,689
and it was really helping them,
1285
01:00:22,689 --> 01:00:24,724
and it's like, "Why are you
1286
01:00:24,724 --> 01:00:27,103
"even comparing us
to Smashing Pumpkins?
1287
01:00:27,103 --> 01:00:28,413
"Come on."
1288
01:00:28,413 --> 01:00:29,793
- Talked about how,
"You need to polish up
1289
01:00:29,793 --> 01:00:31,310
"those guitar stands and stuff."
1290
01:00:31,310 --> 01:00:33,482
- And how, like, we needed
to do a few more records
1291
01:00:33,482 --> 01:00:37,068
before we could become
a major label band.
1292
01:00:37,068 --> 01:00:39,689
We needed to work on
sweetening up our sound
1293
01:00:39,689 --> 01:00:41,517
[laughing] and shit like that.
1294
01:00:41,517 --> 01:00:42,931
- That's all we've got.
1295
01:00:42,931 --> 01:00:44,344
It's our guitar sound, you know?
1296
01:00:44,344 --> 01:00:46,413
You want us to totally
lose, like, our identity?
1297
01:00:46,413 --> 01:00:48,896
♪ You stupid asshole
1298
01:00:48,896 --> 01:00:52,172
So we thought, if this is
what an independent label
1299
01:00:52,172 --> 01:00:56,379
is gonna throw at
us, we might as well
1300
01:00:56,379 --> 01:00:59,310
meet with major labels and
see what they have to say.
1301
01:00:59,310 --> 01:01:02,172
♪ One, two, I'm looking at you
1302
01:01:04,103 --> 01:01:05,655
- Major labels
basically had to admit
1303
01:01:05,655 --> 01:01:08,172
they had no idea what
was gonna be popular
1304
01:01:08,172 --> 01:01:09,931
with the youngsters anymore.
1305
01:01:09,931 --> 01:01:11,551
They had lost complete control.
1306
01:01:11,551 --> 01:01:12,758
When Nirvana hit big, you know,
1307
01:01:12,758 --> 01:01:14,965
that just changed everything.
1308
01:01:14,965 --> 01:01:17,103
Like, they went, "Oh, we don't
know why this is popular.
1309
01:01:17,103 --> 01:01:19,000
"We have no idea
what's going on now."
1310
01:01:19,000 --> 01:01:20,413
- All the majors
said the same thing.
1311
01:01:20,413 --> 01:01:22,206
"Oh, we're gonna come
out with guns blazing.
1312
01:01:22,206 --> 01:01:24,000
"We're gonna have all
these advertisements.
1313
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:25,862
"You're gonna get the most
support," blah blah blah.
1314
01:01:27,586 --> 01:01:30,137
The Mudhoney guys are
all very savvy dudes,
1315
01:01:30,137 --> 01:01:32,344
and they're a very quick
read to personalities.
1316
01:01:32,344 --> 01:01:34,620
- You just kind of
knew immediately, like,
1317
01:01:34,620 --> 01:01:36,000
this is not gonna work.
1318
01:01:36,000 --> 01:01:37,379
[laughing]
1319
01:01:37,379 --> 01:01:39,482
- We're trying to capture
audience's interest
1320
01:01:39,482 --> 01:01:42,172
and soften them up
so that the salesmen
1321
01:01:42,172 --> 01:01:44,793
can sock 'em with a
good old hard sell.
1322
01:01:44,793 --> 01:01:46,724
- We were not looking
to start a bidding war
1323
01:01:46,724 --> 01:01:48,620
because we didn't want to
get into kind of a trap
1324
01:01:48,620 --> 01:01:50,827
where we, like, owed
somebody a shitload of money,
1325
01:01:50,827 --> 01:01:53,482
and we went with David
Katznelson at Reprise
1326
01:01:53,482 --> 01:01:55,793
because both the label
and he seemed like
1327
01:01:55,793 --> 01:01:58,551
the most reasonable people
out there that we'd met with.
1328
01:01:58,551 --> 01:02:01,413
- [Voiceover] Yeah, Dave
just seemed to be cooler
1329
01:02:01,413 --> 01:02:04,413
and outgoing and a fun guy.
1330
01:02:04,413 --> 01:02:06,068
- I was really, really nervous.
1331
01:02:06,068 --> 01:02:08,275
I was still at a period
of time in my career
1332
01:02:08,275 --> 01:02:09,344
where whenever I
would talk to a band
1333
01:02:09,344 --> 01:02:11,000
I was always the younger person.
1334
01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:12,655
I was always the fan,
1335
01:02:12,655 --> 01:02:13,931
and I was always the
person who was like,
1336
01:02:13,931 --> 01:02:15,827
"I really, should
I even be here?
1337
01:02:15,827 --> 01:02:17,896
"Who am I to be
talking to these guys?"
1338
01:02:17,896 --> 01:02:20,172
First person I met
was Bob Whittaker,
1339
01:02:20,172 --> 01:02:23,965
and Bob was a
larger-than-life figure.
1340
01:02:23,965 --> 01:02:26,137
He would take me to his place
1341
01:02:26,137 --> 01:02:29,275
and, you know, sit me in this
huge dentist chair that he had
1342
01:02:29,275 --> 01:02:31,172
and start throwing
all these records
1343
01:02:31,172 --> 01:02:32,655
of what was going
on in the scene
1344
01:02:32,655 --> 01:02:34,310
while plying me with alcohol
1345
01:02:34,310 --> 01:02:36,000
and then, while we
were doing that,
1346
01:02:36,000 --> 01:02:37,620
trying to talk business
with me at the same time,
1347
01:02:37,620 --> 01:02:40,413
and I was doing
everything I could,
1348
01:02:40,413 --> 01:02:43,655
everything I could
possibly do to keep focused
1349
01:02:43,655 --> 01:02:47,586
and keep attempting
to keep on target
1350
01:02:47,586 --> 01:02:49,862
of what I was out
there trying to do.
1351
01:02:49,862 --> 01:02:51,137
- When we met with
Warner Brothers,
1352
01:02:51,137 --> 01:02:52,793
I was really concerned
'cause, you know,
1353
01:02:52,793 --> 01:02:55,896
the Replacements and
Husker Du had both signed
1354
01:02:55,896 --> 01:02:58,000
[mumbling] Warner Brothers,
1355
01:02:58,000 --> 01:03:01,241
and all of a sudden, once
they got onto the major label,
1356
01:03:01,241 --> 01:03:03,379
their records
sounded way slicker.
1357
01:03:03,379 --> 01:03:05,379
- I think the band
itself was really worried
1358
01:03:05,379 --> 01:03:07,241
about having to go
to a major label.
1359
01:03:07,241 --> 01:03:09,344
The typical stuff,
going to a major label,
1360
01:03:09,344 --> 01:03:12,103
being changed, and
these are all things
1361
01:03:12,103 --> 01:03:13,896
that were on their minds
when they were talking to me.
1362
01:03:13,896 --> 01:03:16,379
- I asked Lenny Waronker, who
was the president at the time,
1363
01:03:16,379 --> 01:03:18,931
"Why did you do this
to these bands?"
1364
01:03:18,931 --> 01:03:20,517
and he was like, "We didn't
do anything to these bands.
1365
01:03:20,517 --> 01:03:22,241
"They just did what
they wanted to do."
1366
01:03:22,241 --> 01:03:24,000
And I'm sure the bands
probably thought,
1367
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:26,068
"Well, if we record
a slicker record,
1368
01:03:26,068 --> 01:03:27,931
"then it's more likely
to get radio airplay
1369
01:03:27,931 --> 01:03:29,413
"and stuff like this,"
1370
01:03:29,413 --> 01:03:32,206
so we intentionally went to
the exact same basement studio
1371
01:03:32,206 --> 01:03:33,827
that we did our previous record,
1372
01:03:33,827 --> 01:03:36,379
to kind of prove a
point that, you know,
1373
01:03:36,379 --> 01:03:37,931
just because we're
on a major label
1374
01:03:37,931 --> 01:03:40,620
we're not gonna, like,
compromise our sound.
1375
01:03:40,620 --> 01:03:42,310
- There was so much excitement
1376
01:03:42,310 --> 01:03:44,448
about the movement that
they were a part of
1377
01:03:44,448 --> 01:03:48,000
and them themselves that
it was really unstoppable.
1378
01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:51,758
["Blinding Sun" by Mudhoney]
1379
01:03:54,551 --> 01:03:59,275
♪ We fell asleep on the
riverbank one sunny afternoon
1380
01:04:01,137 --> 01:04:02,862
♪ We fell asleep
on the riverbank ♪
1381
01:04:02,862 --> 01:04:04,068
- Once we were on a major label
1382
01:04:04,068 --> 01:04:05,241
and the contracts were
signed, we realized
1383
01:04:05,241 --> 01:04:07,172
we had these budgets
for every record.
1384
01:04:07,172 --> 01:04:10,482
We found out that
what we didn't use
1385
01:04:10,482 --> 01:04:12,241
of the recording
budget in the studio,
1386
01:04:12,241 --> 01:04:13,551
we actually got to keep.
1387
01:04:13,551 --> 01:04:15,103
- Rather than going
to the Bahamas
1388
01:04:15,103 --> 01:04:16,551
and recording at Compass Point
1389
01:04:16,551 --> 01:04:19,000
or whatever you're supposed
to do with your $200,000,
1390
01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:20,551
their thing was
to keep the money
1391
01:04:20,551 --> 01:04:22,448
and just use some of
it to record with.
1392
01:04:22,448 --> 01:04:25,482
- And then we would spend
20 of it or whatever
1393
01:04:25,482 --> 01:04:26,862
recording the record, you know,
1394
01:04:26,862 --> 01:04:29,931
and then you could pocket
the rest. [laughing]
1395
01:04:29,931 --> 01:04:31,068
[cash register dings]
1396
01:04:31,068 --> 01:04:34,793
- We're punks! We're
rebels! [laughing]
1397
01:04:36,862 --> 01:04:39,689
♪ Everybody loves us
1398
01:04:39,689 --> 01:04:42,758
♪ Everybody loves our town
1399
01:04:42,758 --> 01:04:45,620
♪ That's why I'm thinking lately
1400
01:04:45,620 --> 01:04:49,034
♪ Time for leaving is now
1401
01:04:50,517 --> 01:04:52,827
♪ Hey, hey, hey, hey
1402
01:04:52,827 --> 01:04:55,724
- Mark's ode to the
Seattle scene at the time.
1403
01:04:55,724 --> 01:04:59,689
♪ It's so overblown
1404
01:05:00,448 --> 01:05:02,241
- It was recorded for $62,
1405
01:05:02,241 --> 01:05:04,551
or $162, I can't remember which.
1406
01:05:04,551 --> 01:05:06,827
Our attorney at the time told me
1407
01:05:06,827 --> 01:05:09,275
not to let the label
find out how much we paid
1408
01:05:09,275 --> 01:05:10,931
for the recording of that song
1409
01:05:10,931 --> 01:05:13,793
that was on the platinum
soundtrack for singles.
1410
01:05:13,793 --> 01:05:15,344
"Don't let them find
out that you're paying
1411
01:05:15,344 --> 01:05:18,482
"$162 for that recording,"
because, you know,
1412
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:22,344
we got a check for a lot more.
1413
01:05:22,344 --> 01:05:24,413
- Well, it's always good
to get money. [laughing]
1414
01:05:24,413 --> 01:05:27,931
♪ I'll just sit and grin
1415
01:05:27,931 --> 01:05:31,000
♪ The money will roll right in
1416
01:05:33,344 --> 01:05:37,000
- I'll get money out of my
famous name, one way or another.
1417
01:05:37,862 --> 01:05:39,931
- [Voiceover] You know,
that allowed all of us
1418
01:05:39,931 --> 01:05:42,310
to eventually make down
payments on houses.
1419
01:05:42,310 --> 01:05:44,551
- So that's kind of how we
tried to operate each time.
1420
01:05:44,551 --> 01:05:47,655
- All musicians know what
it's like to struggle.
1421
01:05:47,655 --> 01:05:49,793
They bought roofs
over their heads,
1422
01:05:49,793 --> 01:05:50,827
which actually shows what a good
1423
01:05:50,827 --> 01:05:52,517
survivalist instinct they have.
1424
01:05:52,517 --> 01:05:55,000
- Some of them had stock
and stuff like that.
1425
01:05:57,172 --> 01:06:00,655
♪ It's fun to be a star
1426
01:06:00,655 --> 01:06:03,655
♪ It's nice to have a car
1427
01:06:03,655 --> 01:06:06,862
♪ Yeah, you'll have to admit
1428
01:06:06,862 --> 01:06:10,551
♪ That I'll be rich as shit
1429
01:06:10,551 --> 01:06:14,000
♪ And I'll just sit and grin
1430
01:06:14,000 --> 01:06:16,965
♪ The money will roll right in
1431
01:06:24,206 --> 01:06:27,000
- The title "Piece of Cake"
kind of says it all to me.
1432
01:06:27,000 --> 01:06:30,275
I mean, it's like, things have
come so easy to this band.
1433
01:06:30,275 --> 01:06:32,172
We do one single,
we're going to Europe.
1434
01:06:32,172 --> 01:06:34,103
Oh, we're going out
there with Sonic Youth.
1435
01:06:34,103 --> 01:06:36,724
We're getting
attention straightaway.
1436
01:06:36,724 --> 01:06:38,310
Our whole approach
was kind of like,
1437
01:06:38,310 --> 01:06:39,724
"We can do that.
That's a piece of cake.
1438
01:06:39,724 --> 01:06:40,896
"Yeah, sure."
1439
01:06:40,896 --> 01:06:42,758
Do another record?
"Piece of cake."
1440
01:06:42,758 --> 01:06:44,206
And that kind of
became our attitude,
1441
01:06:44,206 --> 01:06:46,620
and that was the title that
we chose for that record.
1442
01:06:46,620 --> 01:06:48,758
It was like, "Yeah,
it's no big deal.
1443
01:06:48,758 --> 01:06:50,379
"We're doing this. It's easy."
1444
01:06:50,379 --> 01:06:51,965
And it shouldn't be.
1445
01:06:51,965 --> 01:06:54,206
- I felt with those guys,
when they hit the major label,
1446
01:06:54,206 --> 01:06:55,827
they just wanted
to self-sabotage.
1447
01:06:55,827 --> 01:06:57,517
And if you listen
to "Piece of Cake,"
1448
01:06:57,517 --> 01:06:59,517
I mean it starts off with
that little techno blip
1449
01:06:59,517 --> 01:07:01,103
that were just annoying,
1450
01:07:01,103 --> 01:07:02,931
and I think they
deliberately did that
1451
01:07:02,931 --> 01:07:04,724
because it was sort
of like a "Fuck you"
1452
01:07:04,724 --> 01:07:06,482
to being on a major label.
1453
01:07:06,482 --> 01:07:09,344
Even Nirvana, who obviously
were a very good band,
1454
01:07:09,344 --> 01:07:12,758
but they wrote big hooks
and big monsters anthems,
1455
01:07:12,758 --> 01:07:14,310
and Mudhoney never
tried to do that,
1456
01:07:14,310 --> 01:07:16,620
to their own probably
financial detriment.
1457
01:07:16,620 --> 01:07:18,241
- With Mudhoney, they
came out of the box
1458
01:07:18,241 --> 01:07:22,172
and they were the #1
sale-sheeted band of the week,
1459
01:07:22,172 --> 01:07:24,482
and they ended up
selling 150,000 records.
1460
01:07:24,482 --> 01:07:27,379
The label, I think,
was peachy about that.
1461
01:07:27,379 --> 01:07:28,482
- [Voiceover] Do
you like it, Dave?
1462
01:07:28,482 --> 01:07:30,448
- I do. I love it.
1463
01:07:30,448 --> 01:07:32,034
- The deal that we
did with Mudhoney
1464
01:07:32,034 --> 01:07:34,379
was not the biggest of the
offers they got, either.
1465
01:07:34,379 --> 01:07:38,482
It was a deal that was
designed to recoup faster.
1466
01:07:38,482 --> 01:07:41,206
I think the point structure
was a little bit better,
1467
01:07:41,206 --> 01:07:43,482
and their freedoms were
a little bit better,
1468
01:07:43,482 --> 01:07:46,379
so selling 150,000
records right off the bat
1469
01:07:46,379 --> 01:07:47,724
was pretty damn good.
1470
01:07:47,724 --> 01:07:49,793
- My favorite comment
on "Piece of Cake"
1471
01:07:49,793 --> 01:07:51,241
was from Bruce Pavitt.
1472
01:07:51,241 --> 01:07:53,896
His thing was, "You know,
the record's only as good
1473
01:07:55,068 --> 01:07:56,827
"as its best song, basically.
1474
01:07:56,827 --> 01:07:59,068
"If it's got that
one good song on it,
1475
01:07:59,068 --> 01:08:00,413
"then it's a good record."
1476
01:08:00,413 --> 01:08:03,103
♪ Can't breathe 'til I
1477
01:08:03,103 --> 01:08:05,206
♪ Suck you dry
1478
01:08:13,827 --> 01:08:16,172
- I think "Suck You Dry"
was a rousing success,
1479
01:08:16,172 --> 01:08:19,241
and I think some other stuff
on there was really half-baked.
1480
01:08:20,758 --> 01:08:24,000
I think Mark likes
to take the bulk of
1481
01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:27,034
the credit for that.
1482
01:08:27,034 --> 01:08:30,172
- Yeah, I was really
fucked up a lot of times.
1483
01:08:30,172 --> 01:08:32,068
I was really fucked up
a lot in that period.
1484
01:08:32,068 --> 01:08:34,931
I was drinking a lot,
doing a lot of drugs.
1485
01:08:34,931 --> 01:08:37,482
That recording session
more than any other one,
1486
01:08:37,482 --> 01:08:39,000
I was probably showing up, like,
1487
01:08:39,000 --> 01:08:41,827
an hour, two hours
late every day
1488
01:08:41,827 --> 01:08:43,758
because I was
waiting to get drugs
1489
01:08:43,758 --> 01:08:45,413
before I could go over there.
1490
01:08:45,413 --> 01:08:47,931
- I had seven junkies on
my roster at one point,
1491
01:08:47,931 --> 01:08:50,482
which makes life move
very slow for you,
1492
01:08:50,482 --> 01:08:53,000
because when you're talking
to somebody on the phone
1493
01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:56,586
who is doing heroin,
if you have like
1494
01:08:56,586 --> 01:08:58,068
three things that you
wanna talk to them about,
1495
01:08:58,068 --> 01:09:00,896
you might get one of
those things through
1496
01:09:00,896 --> 01:09:03,137
and it'll take seven
hours or five hours
1497
01:09:03,137 --> 01:09:04,344
or whatever it might be.
1498
01:09:04,344 --> 01:09:05,620
I would be on the
phone with Mark a lot
1499
01:09:05,620 --> 01:09:07,827
where he would pretty
much go to sleep on me
1500
01:09:07,827 --> 01:09:09,241
or something like that,
1501
01:09:09,241 --> 01:09:12,448
and it was happening since
before I got involved with him.
1502
01:09:12,448 --> 01:09:14,724
- [Voiceover] Hey, Marty. Here.
1503
01:09:15,310 --> 01:09:16,724
Lookee here.
1504
01:09:16,724 --> 01:09:17,931
- What's that?
1505
01:09:17,931 --> 01:09:20,413
- H.
- H?
1506
01:09:20,413 --> 01:09:21,586
What's H?
1507
01:09:21,586 --> 01:09:23,275
- Shh, not so loud.
1508
01:09:23,275 --> 01:09:25,000
It's heroin.
1509
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:28,482
- I hate the way in
music documentaries,
1510
01:09:28,482 --> 01:09:30,689
like Behind the
Music or something,
1511
01:09:30,689 --> 01:09:33,551
the way people talk about
1512
01:09:33,551 --> 01:09:36,413
their drug use or whatever.
1513
01:09:36,413 --> 01:09:39,275
Like the music gets
all kind of sappy
1514
01:09:39,275 --> 01:09:41,689
and things sort
of slow down, and,
1515
01:09:43,448 --> 01:09:46,517
you know, it's like
this big pivotal point
1516
01:09:46,517 --> 01:09:48,862
in this musician's
career or whatever.
1517
01:09:48,862 --> 01:09:51,586
To me, when bands like
Aerosmith or whatever,
1518
01:09:51,586 --> 01:09:54,310
they'll, like, just talk
about their deep addiction
1519
01:09:54,310 --> 01:09:57,620
and they'll kind of glorify it,
1520
01:09:57,620 --> 01:10:00,310
you know, like their
"Toxic Twins" T-shirts
1521
01:10:00,310 --> 01:10:01,827
with Joe Perry and Steve Tyler,
1522
01:10:01,827 --> 01:10:05,448
and they're all like, "We did
mountains of Peruvian blow
1523
01:10:05,448 --> 01:10:08,758
"and did a lot of heroin
and partied like crazy,"
1524
01:10:08,758 --> 01:10:11,034
and then they go, "But
don't do that, kids.
1525
01:10:11,034 --> 01:10:12,827
"It's really bad."
1526
01:10:12,827 --> 01:10:15,310
To me, it's kind
of embarrassing.
1527
01:10:15,310 --> 01:10:18,379
I was a total cliche.
1528
01:10:18,379 --> 01:10:20,827
I was a rock guy
strung out on heroin,
1529
01:10:20,827 --> 01:10:23,965
and actually, for
awhile in there,
1530
01:10:23,965 --> 01:10:25,827
was going out with a stripper.
1531
01:10:25,827 --> 01:10:27,724
[laughing]
1532
01:10:27,724 --> 01:10:30,034
How did this happen
to me? [laughing]
1533
01:10:30,034 --> 01:10:33,344
Of course, I walked through
all those doors myself.
1534
01:10:33,344 --> 01:10:34,551
- When he started
doing hard drugs,
1535
01:10:34,551 --> 01:10:37,931
a couple of his friends
told me I had to
1536
01:10:37,931 --> 01:10:39,793
do something about
it or talk to him,
1537
01:10:39,793 --> 01:10:43,620
and I was like, "Well, I
don't think that's my place."
1538
01:10:43,620 --> 01:10:45,655
I'm all for personal freedom
1539
01:10:45,655 --> 01:10:48,344
to fuck yourself up if you want.
1540
01:10:48,344 --> 01:10:50,172
He's a smart guy.
1541
01:10:50,172 --> 01:10:51,793
So we never really
talked about it much.
1542
01:10:51,793 --> 01:10:54,241
- I think the first time
1543
01:10:54,241 --> 01:10:58,862
anyone in Mudhoney
caught wind of it
1544
01:10:58,862 --> 01:11:00,827
that I might be doing
it, there was a rumor
1545
01:11:00,827 --> 01:11:03,827
that I went into the
emergency for a drug overdose,
1546
01:11:03,827 --> 01:11:05,137
and I don't know
how that got out,
1547
01:11:05,137 --> 01:11:08,034
but I OD'd several times.
1548
01:11:08,034 --> 01:11:11,172
Went to the
Harborview Emergency.
1549
01:11:11,172 --> 01:11:13,655
Those guys had heard
that and I was just like,
1550
01:11:13,655 --> 01:11:18,000
"What? No way. That's not me."
1551
01:11:18,000 --> 01:11:19,586
[laughing]
1552
01:11:19,586 --> 01:11:21,275
- People do drugs
'cause they're fun.
1553
01:11:22,482 --> 01:11:24,551
It's not always, like,
can be explained away
1554
01:11:24,551 --> 01:11:25,827
like, oh, they're
self-medicating
1555
01:11:25,827 --> 01:11:29,655
or they have some kind
of painful something,
1556
01:11:29,655 --> 01:11:31,000
it's like, well,
it's kind of fun,
1557
01:11:31,000 --> 01:11:35,482
and then the fun
factor gets pushed away
1558
01:11:35,482 --> 01:11:38,206
because it's an addiction too,
1559
01:11:38,206 --> 01:11:40,586
and chemically, you're getting
more and more fucked up.
1560
01:11:40,586 --> 01:11:43,379
- It really got
boring after awhile.
1561
01:11:43,379 --> 01:11:46,586
I was able to go through
this period with heroin
1562
01:11:46,586 --> 01:11:48,827
and come out
relatively unscathed.
1563
01:11:48,827 --> 01:11:52,000
I didn't die, I didn't get AIDS.
1564
01:11:52,000 --> 01:11:54,517
I did get Hepatitis C,
1565
01:11:54,517 --> 01:11:57,482
which I didn't find out
about until many years later.
1566
01:11:57,482 --> 01:11:58,793
That was the only
thing that was like,
1567
01:11:58,793 --> 01:12:01,034
"Wow, this shit actually
bit me on the ass."
1568
01:12:01,034 --> 01:12:02,724
After I stopped doing heroin,
1569
01:12:02,724 --> 01:12:04,827
I was playing in
this band, Bloodloss,
1570
01:12:04,827 --> 01:12:06,068
and one of the
members of the band
1571
01:12:06,068 --> 01:12:09,206
was doing heroin at the time.
1572
01:12:09,206 --> 01:12:10,724
I remember people would ask me,
1573
01:12:10,724 --> 01:12:12,931
"Man, isn't it really hard to
be in a band with this guy,
1574
01:12:12,931 --> 01:12:14,551
"just after what
you've gone through?"
1575
01:12:14,551 --> 01:12:16,586
And it was like,
"No, it's a reminder
1576
01:12:16,586 --> 01:12:19,551
"of what I don't wanna be."
1577
01:12:19,551 --> 01:12:22,000
It wasn't like I saw
him and was like,
1578
01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:23,482
"Man, I'd really like
to be like that."
1579
01:12:23,482 --> 01:12:26,965
It's like, "I am so glad I
am not that way anymore."
1580
01:12:29,448 --> 01:12:32,482
And actually, that was a real
1581
01:12:32,482 --> 01:12:35,137
important part of
the process for me.
1582
01:12:38,551 --> 01:12:40,241
- Hi, I'm Kurt Loder
with an MTV News
1583
01:12:40,241 --> 01:12:42,586
special report on
a very sad day.
1584
01:12:42,586 --> 01:12:44,206
Kurt Cobain, the
leader of one of rock's
1585
01:12:44,206 --> 01:12:47,758
most gifted and promising
bands, Nirvana, is dead.
1586
01:12:47,758 --> 01:12:49,137
- It was a real
kick in the pants
1587
01:12:49,137 --> 01:12:52,103
to the entire grunge
scene, Seattle scene.
1588
01:12:52,103 --> 01:12:55,448
- No one wanted to know anything
more about Seattle and us,
1589
01:12:55,448 --> 01:12:58,000
because it was such a sad tale.
1590
01:12:58,000 --> 01:12:59,482
The only bands from Seattle
1591
01:12:59,482 --> 01:13:02,137
that were doing well that year
was, like, The Presidents.
1592
01:13:02,137 --> 01:13:04,068
♪ Moving to the country
1593
01:13:04,068 --> 01:13:07,000
♪ I'm gonna eat a
lot of peaches ♪
1594
01:13:07,000 --> 01:13:08,586
They wanted happy music now.
1595
01:13:08,586 --> 01:13:12,551
[laughing] They didn't
want more of us.
1596
01:13:12,551 --> 01:13:17,310
["Judgment, Rage, Retribution
and Time" by Mudhoney]
1597
01:13:24,068 --> 01:13:27,344
♪ When I look in the mirror
1598
01:13:27,344 --> 01:13:31,034
- We were back working
with Jack for the record.
1599
01:13:31,034 --> 01:13:34,620
Almost seemed like a restatement
of what our sound was.
1600
01:13:35,724 --> 01:13:37,896
It was grunge, damn it.
1601
01:13:37,896 --> 01:13:42,379
♪ Well, it's 1995, my friend
1602
01:13:44,689 --> 01:13:48,827
♪ Now we're closing
in on the end
1603
01:13:51,310 --> 01:13:55,275
♪ Another year for you and me
1604
01:13:57,827 --> 01:13:58,758
- [Voiceover] There
were health issues
1605
01:13:58,758 --> 01:14:00,310
that had been resolved.
1606
01:14:00,310 --> 01:14:01,965
There was a whole
bunch of new songs
1607
01:14:01,965 --> 01:14:03,931
that were well rehearsed
1608
01:14:03,931 --> 01:14:06,206
and seemed well arranged
and ready to go.
1609
01:14:06,206 --> 01:14:08,689
- And there was
one song on there
1610
01:14:08,689 --> 01:14:12,931
that Courtney Love
thought was about her,
1611
01:14:12,931 --> 01:14:16,793
so she called the
CEO of our company,
1612
01:14:16,793 --> 01:14:20,620
who had worked with Kurt
before and knew Courtney.
1613
01:14:20,620 --> 01:14:22,000
- We did a record at Reprise.
1614
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:23,241
We would go down there.
1615
01:14:23,241 --> 01:14:25,310
There was always kind
of a courtesy meeting
1616
01:14:25,310 --> 01:14:26,620
with the president.
1617
01:14:26,620 --> 01:14:29,517
- The band was in the building,
1618
01:14:29,517 --> 01:14:32,517
was at Warner Brothers
in Burbank on that day,
1619
01:14:32,517 --> 01:14:36,137
and it was Mark Arm's
birthday on that day.
1620
01:14:36,137 --> 01:14:40,241
The cake was being brought to
Mark with the candles on it
1621
01:14:40,241 --> 01:14:41,827
when I get a call from the CEO.
1622
01:14:41,827 --> 01:14:44,551
I pick up the phone, he has no
idea that Mudhoney's in town.
1623
01:14:44,551 --> 01:14:46,517
He's like, "You know
those Mudhoney guys?"
1624
01:14:46,517 --> 01:14:48,896
And I'm like, "Um, yeah."
1625
01:14:48,896 --> 01:14:53,000
And he's like, "I never
wanna see those guys again.
1626
01:14:53,000 --> 01:14:54,482
"I mean, we're putting
the record out,
1627
01:14:54,482 --> 01:14:55,724
"I hope it does great,
1628
01:14:55,724 --> 01:14:56,931
"but I never wanna talk
to those guys again."
1629
01:14:56,931 --> 01:14:58,310
And I'm like, "What
are you talking about?"
1630
01:14:58,310 --> 01:15:00,896
- David was trying to
arrange the meeting with him.
1631
01:15:00,896 --> 01:15:04,103
He heard back that
there was no way in hell
1632
01:15:04,103 --> 01:15:05,344
that he was gonna meet with us,
1633
01:15:05,344 --> 01:15:07,310
because of the song
"Into Yer Shtik."
1634
01:15:07,310 --> 01:15:09,000
- "I never wanna
meet those guys,
1635
01:15:09,000 --> 01:15:10,758
"I never wanna shake their hand,
1636
01:15:10,758 --> 01:15:12,689
"I never wanna have my
picture taken with them."
1637
01:15:12,689 --> 01:15:16,655
And Dave told us
that, and I'm like,
1638
01:15:16,655 --> 01:15:19,310
"Really?" I go, "That
bums me out, man,
1639
01:15:19,310 --> 01:15:21,275
"because that's all
I've ever wanted to do,
1640
01:15:21,275 --> 01:15:22,689
"was have my picture taken
1641
01:15:22,689 --> 01:15:24,344
"with whatever the
fuck his name is."
1642
01:15:24,344 --> 01:15:27,000
Who gives a fuck if you
wanna meet us or not?
1643
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:28,724
Fucking asshole!
1644
01:15:28,724 --> 01:15:30,068
[laughing]
1645
01:15:30,068 --> 01:15:31,344
Thanks for the bottle of wine
1646
01:15:31,344 --> 01:15:33,758
you might've bought me
at a dinner sometime,
1647
01:15:33,758 --> 01:15:36,034
but still, fuck you.
1648
01:15:36,034 --> 01:15:38,172
- And he's basically saying,
1649
01:15:38,172 --> 01:15:39,586
"I got a call from Courtney
1650
01:15:39,586 --> 01:15:41,275
"and she's going
back into therapy
1651
01:15:41,275 --> 01:15:44,344
"because they made a song
about her on this record."
1652
01:15:45,206 --> 01:15:48,517
♪ Why don't you
1653
01:15:48,517 --> 01:15:52,896
♪ Blow your brains out too
1654
01:15:54,241 --> 01:15:55,758
- Many people
think it's directed
1655
01:15:55,758 --> 01:15:57,103
strictly at Courtney Love.
1656
01:15:57,103 --> 01:16:00,344
It's a much broader
shot than that,
1657
01:16:00,344 --> 01:16:02,896
but she definitely fits.
1658
01:16:02,896 --> 01:16:06,758
Of course, this was a year after
Kurt Cobain killed himself.
1659
01:16:06,758 --> 01:16:10,862
I was pretty angry with how
that whole thing went down.
1660
01:16:11,862 --> 01:16:16,137
♪ All of you make
1661
01:16:16,137 --> 01:16:19,448
♪ Me sick
1662
01:16:22,310 --> 01:16:25,000
♪ You're so
1663
01:16:25,000 --> 01:16:27,344
♪ Into yer shtik
1664
01:16:27,344 --> 01:16:30,517
- The line is so much more
1665
01:16:30,517 --> 01:16:33,000
about the industry.
1666
01:16:33,000 --> 01:16:35,827
It's so much more
about all those people
1667
01:16:35,827 --> 01:16:39,413
who take art and try
to push it so hard
1668
01:16:39,413 --> 01:16:43,103
through the financial filter.
1669
01:16:43,103 --> 01:16:45,137
- The thing that kind of
frustrated me the most
1670
01:16:45,137 --> 01:16:46,551
about that whole time period
1671
01:16:46,551 --> 01:16:50,034
was, like, we did this
two-week tour with Nirvana
1672
01:16:50,034 --> 01:16:53,000
and just seeing the way that
they had organized themselves.
1673
01:16:53,000 --> 01:16:55,586
A lot of the people
that they had hired to
1674
01:16:57,448 --> 01:16:59,793
work for the band
were really gross.
1675
01:16:59,793 --> 01:17:01,206
Didn't seem like they had
1676
01:17:01,206 --> 01:17:03,310
anyone in the band's
best interests at heart,
1677
01:17:03,310 --> 01:17:04,965
they just wanted the
band to keep going
1678
01:17:04,965 --> 01:17:06,413
so more money could be made,
1679
01:17:06,413 --> 01:17:09,103
and we had a couple of
shows with Pearl Jam
1680
01:17:09,103 --> 01:17:10,827
booked about a month later,
1681
01:17:10,827 --> 01:17:12,724
and at the time,
the perception was
1682
01:17:12,724 --> 01:17:17,137
Nirvana was the underground
band that came up from Sub Pop
1683
01:17:17,137 --> 01:17:20,344
and Pearl Jam was the major
label band or whatever,
1684
01:17:20,344 --> 01:17:21,620
and we were just like,
1685
01:17:21,620 --> 01:17:23,896
"God, can you imagine
how bad it's gonna be
1686
01:17:23,896 --> 01:17:27,310
"in the Pearl Jam camp if
it's this bad in Nirvana?"
1687
01:17:27,310 --> 01:17:29,413
We went out with Pearl Jam
1688
01:17:29,413 --> 01:17:32,137
and it was just the
fucking exact opposite.
1689
01:17:32,137 --> 01:17:35,551
Every person was super
cool, friendly, helpful.
1690
01:17:35,551 --> 01:17:38,413
There were people
in the Nirvana camp
1691
01:17:38,413 --> 01:17:40,758
who were just, like,
thumping their chests
1692
01:17:40,758 --> 01:17:42,896
at how proud they were to
be working with Nirvana
1693
01:17:42,896 --> 01:17:44,413
and there was nothing like that
1694
01:17:44,413 --> 01:17:46,724
happening over in
Pearl Jam world.
1695
01:17:46,724 --> 01:17:49,241
It was like, oh, you
can be at this level
1696
01:17:49,241 --> 01:17:51,620
and run things in a smart way
1697
01:17:51,620 --> 01:17:54,827
and you don't have to
hire a bunch of dicks.
1698
01:17:54,827 --> 01:17:57,310
- As soon as they were out
playing that first show with us
1699
01:17:57,310 --> 01:17:59,896
and we were interacting, really,
1700
01:17:59,896 --> 01:18:03,172
for the first time in a
few years, in a real way,
1701
01:18:03,172 --> 01:18:05,241
I remember thinking, "Wow,
this is a really good thing."
1702
01:18:05,241 --> 01:18:07,620
And then when Kurt died, I
think it was really important
1703
01:18:07,620 --> 01:18:09,931
that we were all
together at that time.
1704
01:18:09,931 --> 01:18:11,793
I think it was a
wake-up call for us,
1705
01:18:11,793 --> 01:18:13,827
to have Mark and
Steve and those guys
1706
01:18:13,827 --> 01:18:16,517
there at that time,
because it told us
1707
01:18:16,517 --> 01:18:19,896
that we could stop at any
time and take a break.
1708
01:18:19,896 --> 01:18:24,310
[speaking in foreign language]
1709
01:18:32,551 --> 01:18:34,586
- Mr. Steve Turner!
1710
01:18:34,586 --> 01:18:36,965
[crowd cheering]
1711
01:18:36,965 --> 01:18:39,827
And Mr. Mark Arm!
1712
01:18:39,827 --> 01:18:43,206
[crowd cheering]
1713
01:18:43,206 --> 01:18:45,344
- Right now!
1714
01:18:45,344 --> 01:18:48,275
Right now, Sao Paulo!
1715
01:18:48,275 --> 01:18:49,758
[crowd cheering]
1716
01:18:49,758 --> 01:18:51,551
It's time to
1717
01:18:51,551 --> 01:18:55,931
kick out the jams,
motherfuckers!
1718
01:18:55,931 --> 01:18:59,000
["Kick Out the
Jams" by Mudhoney]
1719
01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:00,896
♪ Ah, ah, ah, ah
1720
01:19:00,896 --> 01:19:03,206
♪ I gotta kick 'em out
1721
01:19:07,448 --> 01:19:09,862
♪ Well, I feel pretty good
1722
01:19:09,862 --> 01:19:13,931
♪ And I guess that I could
get crazy now, baby ♪
1723
01:19:14,620 --> 01:19:16,034
♪ 'Cause we all got in tune
1724
01:19:16,034 --> 01:19:20,275
♪ When the dressing
room got hazy now, baby
1725
01:19:21,310 --> 01:19:22,965
♪ I know how you like it, child
1726
01:19:22,965 --> 01:19:24,448
♪ Hot, quick and tight
1727
01:19:24,448 --> 01:19:27,241
♪ The girls can't stand it
when you're doing it right
1728
01:19:27,241 --> 01:19:29,275
♪ Let me up on the stand
1729
01:19:29,275 --> 01:19:31,931
♪ And let me kick out the jams
1730
01:19:31,931 --> 01:19:35,620
♪ Yeah, kick out the jams
1731
01:19:35,620 --> 01:19:38,241
♪ I gotta kick 'em out
1732
01:19:56,620 --> 01:19:58,068
- It was very obvious
it was gonna be
1733
01:19:58,068 --> 01:19:59,689
the last one for
Warner Brothers.
1734
01:19:59,689 --> 01:20:02,482
Everybody at Reprise
was gone, basically.
1735
01:20:02,482 --> 01:20:04,379
One of the new guys at Warner's
1736
01:20:04,379 --> 01:20:06,551
wanted to hear demos
and didn't hear a hit,
1737
01:20:06,551 --> 01:20:07,758
and all that kind of shit,
1738
01:20:07,758 --> 01:20:09,172
which we'd never had
to deal with before.
1739
01:20:09,172 --> 01:20:12,103
We'd always just delivered
the finished product to them
1740
01:20:12,103 --> 01:20:14,034
and they did what
they could with it.
1741
01:20:14,034 --> 01:20:16,344
- He wanted to drop Mudhoney
right when he got there,
1742
01:20:16,344 --> 01:20:18,655
but he was gonna wait
to hear the demos,
1743
01:20:18,655 --> 01:20:21,379
and he was actually impressed
with what they had done.
1744
01:20:21,379 --> 01:20:23,931
I'm like, "Hey, whoop-de-doo
for you, right?"
1745
01:20:23,931 --> 01:20:25,620
- He knew that we weren't
gonna make him any more money.
1746
01:20:25,620 --> 01:20:28,034
And I don't think Reprise
had had a radio hit
1747
01:20:28,034 --> 01:20:29,551
since Alanis Morissette,
1748
01:20:29,551 --> 01:20:31,724
which was three or fours before,
1749
01:20:31,724 --> 01:20:35,551
which in major label
time is forever.
1750
01:20:35,551 --> 01:20:37,310
He was brought in
because he had produced
1751
01:20:37,310 --> 01:20:40,448
the breakthrough
Sugar Ray album.
1752
01:20:40,448 --> 01:20:42,034
They brought him in
because they figured
1753
01:20:42,034 --> 01:20:46,379
since he produced a
crappy breakthrough record
1754
01:20:46,379 --> 01:20:49,586
that he could get
more made. [laughing]
1755
01:20:49,586 --> 01:20:52,172
- I remember there was
one song, "Oblivion,"
1756
01:20:52,172 --> 01:20:54,000
which, you know,
that was the song
1757
01:20:55,482 --> 01:20:58,275
that the boss thought
was the single.
1758
01:20:59,275 --> 01:21:02,896
♪ Oblivion
1759
01:21:05,068 --> 01:21:08,689
He had all these little
detailed mix ideas
1760
01:21:08,689 --> 01:21:10,172
that he had to throw in there.
1761
01:21:10,172 --> 01:21:11,344
- He'd had some other hits,
1762
01:21:11,344 --> 01:21:14,655
so these record people get cocky
1763
01:21:14,655 --> 01:21:16,758
and they think, "I
can hear a hit now.
1764
01:21:16,758 --> 01:21:18,172
"I've got the golden ear."
1765
01:21:18,172 --> 01:21:19,379
- We probably went
into the studio
1766
01:21:19,379 --> 01:21:21,758
to mix "Oblivion" five,
six, seven, eight,
1767
01:21:21,758 --> 01:21:23,206
I don't know how many times.
1768
01:21:23,206 --> 01:21:26,206
- It shows exactly why the
record industry is dying.
1769
01:21:26,206 --> 01:21:27,517
[laughing] 'Cause
they just throw money
1770
01:21:27,517 --> 01:21:29,448
at bullshit for no reason.
1771
01:21:30,758 --> 01:21:33,517
♪ Woke up this morning
1772
01:21:33,517 --> 01:21:36,482
♪ I had a laugh
1773
01:21:36,482 --> 01:21:39,137
Each record you do
for a record label,
1774
01:21:39,137 --> 01:21:40,758
the advance grows,
1775
01:21:40,758 --> 01:21:42,034
and we were selling
less and less records.
1776
01:21:42,034 --> 01:21:43,689
- I think they got
keen to us as well.
1777
01:21:43,689 --> 01:21:46,241
They knew that we
would take our money
1778
01:21:46,241 --> 01:21:48,655
and record cheaply
and pocket the rest.
1779
01:21:48,655 --> 01:21:49,965
- So if we didn't
spend it recording,
1780
01:21:49,965 --> 01:21:51,206
we weren't gonna get it anyway,
1781
01:21:51,206 --> 01:21:53,482
why don't we actually
hire a producer
1782
01:21:53,482 --> 01:21:56,482
and spend some money and
see what that's like?
1783
01:21:56,482 --> 01:21:59,068
Obviously no one's gonna
give us that money again.
1784
01:21:59,068 --> 01:22:00,724
- It was a great record on
so many different levels,
1785
01:22:00,724 --> 01:22:02,965
produced by the
legendary Jim Dickinson.
1786
01:22:02,965 --> 01:22:07,241
["Poisoned Water" by Mudhoney]
1787
01:22:09,931 --> 01:22:14,068
♪ Like stacks and
stacks of rats on rafts
1788
01:22:14,068 --> 01:22:17,413
♪ Clutchin' anything we can
1789
01:22:17,413 --> 01:22:20,586
♪ Stacks and stacks
of rats on rafts
1790
01:22:20,586 --> 01:22:24,103
♪ Weight of the world
crushin' our backs
1791
01:22:24,103 --> 01:22:27,275
♪ Tooth for a tooth
1792
01:22:28,206 --> 01:22:30,896
♪ Eye for an eye
1793
01:22:30,896 --> 01:22:34,448
- You know, released
into major obscurity.
1794
01:22:34,448 --> 01:22:35,655
- It was one of
the first records
1795
01:22:35,655 --> 01:22:37,793
that they put out
at a higher price.
1796
01:22:37,793 --> 01:22:39,379
- Once the record came
out, they just sort of
1797
01:22:41,551 --> 01:22:42,862
did nothing with it.
1798
01:22:42,862 --> 01:22:44,275
They wanted it to disappear.
1799
01:22:44,275 --> 01:22:45,379
- You know, there was that time
1800
01:22:45,379 --> 01:22:46,689
that we had to drop them,
1801
01:22:46,689 --> 01:22:49,620
and the conversation was
almost like, "Who cares?
1802
01:22:49,620 --> 01:22:51,965
"They'll go on and
do their thing."
1803
01:22:51,965 --> 01:22:55,172
Nobody was surprised, and
the relationship ended
1804
01:22:55,172 --> 01:22:57,034
in a really good way,
where it was like,
1805
01:22:57,034 --> 01:22:59,275
I think we all
agreed that even if
1806
01:23:00,724 --> 01:23:02,068
Reprise wanted to keep them on,
1807
01:23:02,068 --> 01:23:03,551
it probably wasn't the
right place for them to be.
1808
01:23:03,551 --> 01:23:05,206
The music industry had
completely changed.
1809
01:23:07,793 --> 01:23:09,000
- It was fairly brutal.
1810
01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:10,896
The shows were
getting really small.
1811
01:23:10,896 --> 01:23:12,517
It was definitely
the lowest point
1812
01:23:12,517 --> 01:23:14,172
as far as playing live shows.
1813
01:23:14,172 --> 01:23:15,482
In the States, it
was like, fuck, man,
1814
01:23:15,482 --> 01:23:18,896
150 people in some
shitty Florida town.
1815
01:23:18,896 --> 01:23:20,689
- It must have been
a pretty discouraging
1816
01:23:20,689 --> 01:23:22,517
situation for them to be in.
1817
01:23:22,517 --> 01:23:24,896
And, of course, subsequently,
Matt Lukin left,
1818
01:23:24,896 --> 01:23:27,793
which was a factor in what was
going on as well, I believe.
1819
01:23:29,620 --> 01:23:31,965
[crowd cheering]
1820
01:23:31,965 --> 01:23:34,758
[imitates machine gun]
1821
01:23:34,758 --> 01:23:38,000
- It seemed like a
pretty good time to quit.
1822
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:40,482
The touring wasn't going to
make us any money anymore.
1823
01:23:40,482 --> 01:23:43,482
- I think he might have even
stuck around as long as he did
1824
01:23:43,482 --> 01:23:44,896
because he thought he was gonna
1825
01:23:44,896 --> 01:23:46,827
let the rest of us
down if he quit,
1826
01:23:46,827 --> 01:23:48,620
and that was a tough blow.
1827
01:23:48,620 --> 01:23:50,103
- The last three or
four years of the band,
1828
01:23:50,103 --> 01:23:52,448
I was hoping that
somebody else would quit
1829
01:23:52,448 --> 01:23:56,689
or somebody else would make
a move so I didn't have to,
1830
01:23:56,689 --> 01:23:58,862
'cause I hate to be
the one quitting.
1831
01:23:58,862 --> 01:24:00,655
I hate to let people down.
1832
01:24:00,655 --> 01:24:02,758
I was just kind of sick of music
1833
01:24:02,758 --> 01:24:07,034
and pop culture in
general, altogether.
1834
01:24:07,034 --> 01:24:09,103
I just hated everything
to do with it
1835
01:24:09,103 --> 01:24:11,724
and anybody who felt
it was important.
1836
01:24:11,724 --> 01:24:14,896
I was working as a carpenter
during my off time.
1837
01:24:14,896 --> 01:24:16,965
It was kind of like going
back to the beginning,
1838
01:24:16,965 --> 01:24:19,034
back when I was
like 18, 19 again.
1839
01:24:19,034 --> 01:24:20,517
I'd work during the
week and go play
1840
01:24:20,517 --> 01:24:23,275
Melvins gigs on the weekend.
1841
01:24:23,275 --> 01:24:25,344
It was kind of like
having to go back to that.
1842
01:24:25,344 --> 01:24:27,275
I didn't wanna do that.
1843
01:24:28,482 --> 01:24:31,000
- [Voiceover] There's some
drinking and smoking to do!
1844
01:24:31,000 --> 01:24:33,206
[crowd cheering]
1845
01:24:35,724 --> 01:24:38,103
- We have always
kind of had this idea
1846
01:24:38,103 --> 01:24:41,827
of Mudhoney being Mark,
Steve, Matt, and Dan,
1847
01:24:41,827 --> 01:24:45,172
and if one of us was
not in the picture
1848
01:24:45,172 --> 01:24:47,000
that we would not be a band.
1849
01:24:47,000 --> 01:24:48,103
I don't know if
that's some kind of
1850
01:24:48,103 --> 01:24:51,172
idealistic Three
Musketeers or whatever.
1851
01:24:51,172 --> 01:24:54,482
I guess there's four. [laughing]
1852
01:24:56,000 --> 01:24:58,482
So when Matt quit,
my whole thing was,
1853
01:24:58,482 --> 01:25:00,448
"Well, the idea of getting
another bass player
1854
01:25:00,448 --> 01:25:03,000
"is not something
that I'm into at all."
1855
01:25:03,000 --> 01:25:05,000
- Dan didn't wanna
do it without Matt.
1856
01:25:05,000 --> 01:25:07,620
They were kind of like the
two partners to me and Mark.
1857
01:25:07,620 --> 01:25:09,689
They roomed together and
all that kind of stuff.
1858
01:25:11,103 --> 01:25:12,862
♪ I've been thinking
1859
01:25:12,862 --> 01:25:14,172
♪ I could find some meaning
1860
01:25:14,172 --> 01:25:15,413
♪ I could start believing
1861
01:25:15,413 --> 01:25:17,310
♪ Instead of killing time
1862
01:25:17,310 --> 01:25:18,862
♪ I've been thinking
1863
01:25:18,862 --> 01:25:20,413
♪ Your love could
give me meaning
1864
01:25:20,413 --> 01:25:21,793
♪ I could start believing
1865
01:25:21,793 --> 01:25:23,862
♪ Instead of killing time
1866
01:25:23,862 --> 01:25:27,172
♪ I think I could love,
if you could show me
1867
01:25:27,172 --> 01:25:29,448
♪ What your lovin' is
1868
01:25:31,482 --> 01:25:33,655
- These guys wanted to start
an Internet record label
1869
01:25:33,655 --> 01:25:35,517
and they hired to me
to produce an album.
1870
01:25:35,517 --> 01:25:37,655
Mudhoney came up
in the conversation
1871
01:25:37,655 --> 01:25:41,379
as being a band that just
gets better as time goes on,
1872
01:25:41,379 --> 01:25:43,206
and so we got a hold of them
1873
01:25:43,206 --> 01:25:45,482
and they said they'd be
interested in talking about it.
1874
01:25:45,482 --> 01:25:48,068
- It's probably been about
a year, so we got together.
1875
01:25:48,068 --> 01:25:49,517
- [Voiceover] Started
working on some things,
1876
01:25:49,517 --> 01:25:50,724
and it felt good.
1877
01:25:50,724 --> 01:25:52,034
There's a chemistry
that we have.
1878
01:25:52,034 --> 01:25:53,931
- So I went up there
and met the guys
1879
01:25:53,931 --> 01:25:56,551
and I made them an offer
they couldn't refuse.
1880
01:25:56,551 --> 01:25:59,551
[rock music]
1881
01:25:59,551 --> 01:26:03,931
Money talks. [laughing]
1882
01:26:03,931 --> 01:26:05,931
♪ Let me in
1883
01:26:06,724 --> 01:26:08,620
♪ Let me in
1884
01:26:08,620 --> 01:26:11,655
♪ It takes an inside job to
make it easy when it's hard ♪
1885
01:26:11,655 --> 01:26:13,103
- And that song ended up
1886
01:26:13,103 --> 01:26:16,724
kind of starting
off our next record.
1887
01:26:16,724 --> 01:26:18,724
That's kind of how we got
that ball rolling again.
1888
01:26:26,172 --> 01:26:28,000
- I am a registered nurse,
1889
01:26:28,000 --> 01:26:30,827
and I work at the
main trauma center
1890
01:26:30,827 --> 01:26:33,206
at Harborview Hospital
here in Seattle.
1891
01:26:33,206 --> 01:26:36,310
The elements of my
job are working on
1892
01:26:36,310 --> 01:26:38,344
specific things in
the emergency room,
1893
01:26:38,344 --> 01:26:40,827
what are called trauma codes,
1894
01:26:40,827 --> 01:26:44,689
where someone has a trauma
injury of some sort,
1895
01:26:44,689 --> 01:26:46,931
gunshot, knife, motor vehicle,
1896
01:26:46,931 --> 01:26:48,310
fell off a cliff, whatever.
1897
01:26:48,310 --> 01:26:51,413
People have some preconceived
and prejudiced ideas
1898
01:26:51,413 --> 01:26:54,206
about what being in a band is.
1899
01:26:54,206 --> 01:26:56,517
You're a philanderer
or a drug addict
1900
01:26:56,517 --> 01:26:59,000
or a person with
low responsibility.
1901
01:26:59,000 --> 01:27:00,586
But it's come out, obviously.
1902
01:27:00,586 --> 01:27:02,931
It's hard to conceal in this
town that you're in Mudhoney,
1903
01:27:02,931 --> 01:27:05,896
'cause you've got pictures in
the press and stuff like that.
1904
01:27:05,896 --> 01:27:09,103
When Mudhoney first started,
1905
01:27:09,103 --> 01:27:10,758
they came to
Australia very early,
1906
01:27:10,758 --> 01:27:14,413
and my band went to America
around the same time, '88, '89,
1907
01:27:14,413 --> 01:27:16,965
and we became friends.
1908
01:27:16,965 --> 01:27:21,068
As a teenager, I'd been
obsessed with punk rock.
1909
01:27:21,068 --> 01:27:24,172
I'd sort of mucked around with
some friends at high school,
1910
01:27:24,172 --> 01:27:27,551
just in the garage or in
the back room or whatever,
1911
01:27:27,551 --> 01:27:29,896
and I actually started
off wanting to be
1912
01:27:29,896 --> 01:27:31,517
the singer of the band,
1913
01:27:31,517 --> 01:27:34,172
but as it turned out we
could not find a bass player,
1914
01:27:34,172 --> 01:27:36,724
and I couldn't play bass
and sing at the same time,
1915
01:27:36,724 --> 01:27:38,000
so I became a bass player,
1916
01:27:38,000 --> 01:27:41,379
but I had a bass guitar
and I was interested in.
1917
01:27:41,379 --> 01:27:44,000
- I had already been playing
with Guy in Bloodloss,
1918
01:27:44,000 --> 01:27:47,758
and I was like, if Matt doesn't
want to do this anymore,
1919
01:27:48,931 --> 01:27:51,862
Guy would be perfect
for the band.
1920
01:27:51,862 --> 01:27:55,862
He's a good friend already
and he's a great bass player.
1921
01:27:55,862 --> 01:27:57,896
He's got lots of really,
really cool ideas.
1922
01:27:57,896 --> 01:28:00,310
- [Guy] It was a
little strange, though,
1923
01:28:00,310 --> 01:28:02,275
because I've been
a fan of the band,
1924
01:28:02,275 --> 01:28:05,655
and so I always
considered the band to be
1925
01:28:05,655 --> 01:28:08,827
the four-piece that
it originally was
with Matt on bass.
1926
01:28:08,827 --> 01:28:12,241
Learning the songs and fitting
in wasn't that difficult.
1927
01:28:12,241 --> 01:28:15,724
I started off just by going
over to Steve's place in Seattle
1928
01:28:15,724 --> 01:28:17,482
and sitting out on his porch
1929
01:28:17,482 --> 01:28:20,586
and just doing my songs
with an acoustic guitar.
1930
01:28:20,586 --> 01:28:23,103
- The first practice
we had with Guy,
1931
01:28:23,103 --> 01:28:24,620
at this point I
was still kind of,
1932
01:28:26,724 --> 01:28:29,137
"OK, getting a new bass player."
1933
01:28:29,137 --> 01:28:31,241
He comes in and starts playing,
1934
01:28:31,241 --> 01:28:34,517
and then and there I knew
this was gonna be cool.
1935
01:28:34,517 --> 01:28:36,103
He was a great bass player.
1936
01:28:36,103 --> 01:28:37,517
- [Steve] That was
really great to get
1937
01:28:37,517 --> 01:28:39,068
a fourth person in the room
1938
01:28:39,068 --> 01:28:42,000
that was fully engaged again,
1939
01:28:42,000 --> 01:28:43,724
like Matt had been
at the beginning.
1940
01:28:43,724 --> 01:28:47,172
- Definitely Guy brought
some new energy to the band.
1941
01:28:50,827 --> 01:28:53,103
Spent a couple months
teaching him our catalog
1942
01:28:53,103 --> 01:28:57,103
and finally started to move
forward and write new songs.
1943
01:28:57,103 --> 01:28:58,724
- He's got a different style,
1944
01:28:58,724 --> 01:29:01,068
but he's a very,
very good player.
1945
01:29:01,068 --> 01:29:04,206
Excellent choice to
play bass in Mudhoney.
1946
01:29:04,206 --> 01:29:05,965
I was actually
thrilled to pieces
1947
01:29:05,965 --> 01:29:08,310
when I found out that he
was gonna join the band.
1948
01:29:08,310 --> 01:29:09,724
- And they're still great
friends with Matt too,
1949
01:29:09,724 --> 01:29:11,137
so it works out.
1950
01:29:11,137 --> 01:29:13,034
I mean, Matt comes to the
occasional Mudhoney show
1951
01:29:13,034 --> 01:29:15,310
and sits out back and
drinks all their beer,
1952
01:29:15,310 --> 01:29:16,827
so it still works out, you know?
1953
01:29:16,827 --> 01:29:18,517
He does the same thing
he was doing before,
1954
01:29:18,517 --> 01:29:20,517
he just doesn't get on
stage, basically, you know?
1955
01:29:20,517 --> 01:29:22,620
[laughing]
1956
01:29:22,620 --> 01:29:27,103
[electronic music]
1957
01:29:28,206 --> 01:29:29,655
- Mudhoney would never
have left Sub Pop
1958
01:29:29,655 --> 01:29:31,068
if it wasn't for the
fact that Sub Pop
1959
01:29:31,068 --> 01:29:32,896
was going through huge,
huge growing pains
1960
01:29:32,896 --> 01:29:34,344
during the time that
Mudhoney was having
1961
01:29:34,344 --> 01:29:37,482
the most success
in the early days.
1962
01:29:37,482 --> 01:29:39,137
I think they would
never have left,
1963
01:29:39,137 --> 01:29:40,965
so it makes sense.
1964
01:29:40,965 --> 01:29:43,655
And as a music fan,
you always love
1965
01:29:43,655 --> 01:29:44,724
seeing that kind of stuff.
1966
01:29:44,724 --> 01:29:45,965
You know, if a record collector,
1967
01:29:45,965 --> 01:29:47,206
you're looking at the
back of the record,
1968
01:29:47,206 --> 01:29:50,413
"Oh, man! In that
era, they went back!
1969
01:29:50,413 --> 01:29:52,068
"Wow, I wanna hear that record!
1970
01:29:52,068 --> 01:29:53,206
"I don't wanna hear
that major label crap!
1971
01:29:53,206 --> 01:29:54,862
"I wanna hear that one!"
1972
01:29:54,862 --> 01:29:57,896
- Seemed like I ran into
Jonathan at some show.
1973
01:29:57,896 --> 01:30:00,000
I walked by him, I'm like,
"Hey, Jonathan, how you doing?"
1974
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:01,448
And he's like, "So
when we gonna get
1975
01:30:01,448 --> 01:30:04,137
"the next Mudhoney record?"
1976
01:30:04,137 --> 01:30:06,206
I was kind of taken aback.
1977
01:30:06,206 --> 01:30:08,827
I'm like, "You wanna put out
another Mudhoney record?"
1978
01:30:08,827 --> 01:30:10,793
He's like, "Of course!"
1979
01:30:10,793 --> 01:30:15,413
And to me, that was just
kind of, "Well, that's cool."
1980
01:30:15,413 --> 01:30:18,448
- There are few joys greater
1981
01:30:18,448 --> 01:30:21,896
than the joy of knowing
that Mudhoney was going to
1982
01:30:21,896 --> 01:30:24,103
come back to Sub Pop
when the time came,
1983
01:30:24,103 --> 01:30:27,344
and it was something that we
all felt really excited about,
1984
01:30:27,344 --> 01:30:30,379
and it was something that
made us feel super proud,
1985
01:30:30,379 --> 01:30:32,896
was kind of for them
just to come home,
1986
01:30:32,896 --> 01:30:36,310
because that's still
the way we saw it.
1987
01:30:36,310 --> 01:30:40,517
It didn't feel even
like the good old days.
1988
01:30:40,517 --> 01:30:42,965
It felt better than that.
1989
01:30:42,965 --> 01:30:44,620
It really felt
like a homecoming.
1990
01:30:44,620 --> 01:30:46,068
- [Voiceover] Sub
Pop was no longer
1991
01:30:46,068 --> 01:30:48,103
the flying by the
seat of its pants,
1992
01:30:48,103 --> 01:30:50,827
making it up as they
were going along.
1993
01:30:50,827 --> 01:30:52,793
We were both learning
at the same time.
1994
01:30:52,793 --> 01:30:54,413
They were learning how
to be a record label,
1995
01:30:54,413 --> 01:30:56,206
and we were learning
how to be a band.
1996
01:30:56,206 --> 01:30:57,620
They learned from
their mistakes,
1997
01:30:57,620 --> 01:31:01,448
and I can't imagine
being on a better label.
1998
01:31:02,586 --> 01:31:05,275
- People who come to
work here, you know,
1999
01:31:05,275 --> 01:31:07,758
the early days are mythical.
2000
01:31:07,758 --> 01:31:11,827
So now, Mark is in the
office all the time,
2001
01:31:11,827 --> 01:31:14,896
and there's a certain
earthbound quality
2002
01:31:14,896 --> 01:31:18,551
which I think, frankly,
suits Mark better.
2003
01:31:18,551 --> 01:31:22,275
I don't think he necessarily
wants to be a rock god,
2004
01:31:22,275 --> 01:31:25,965
but there was this real feeling,
2005
01:31:25,965 --> 01:31:29,793
the prodigal son,
this whole idea of
2006
01:31:29,793 --> 01:31:33,620
the band that built
Sub Pop is coming back.
2007
01:31:33,620 --> 01:31:37,655
[rock music]
2008
01:31:44,586 --> 01:31:47,862
[rock scream, echoing]
2009
01:31:58,517 --> 01:32:02,068
- The whole end of the
90s kind of energized us.
2010
01:32:02,068 --> 01:32:04,620
After we weren't getting
paid for any of it,
2011
01:32:04,620 --> 01:32:06,482
we were playing
a lot more music.
2012
01:32:06,482 --> 01:32:08,448
Collectively and
individually, we were doing
2013
01:32:08,448 --> 01:32:10,482
a crapload more music
than we'd done in years.
2014
01:32:10,482 --> 01:32:12,034
[rock music]
2015
01:32:12,034 --> 01:32:14,482
- [Voiceover] Mudhoney's
style is not mainstream.
2016
01:32:14,482 --> 01:32:16,724
They never wanted
it to be mainstream,
2017
01:32:16,724 --> 01:32:19,310
and I'm very glad they
never made the compromises
2018
01:32:19,310 --> 01:32:21,482
some of the other
bands tried to make.
2019
01:32:21,482 --> 01:32:23,448
- It's a big "Fuck you guys!"
2020
01:32:23,448 --> 01:32:26,965
[rock music]
2021
01:32:26,965 --> 01:32:28,137
- [Voiceover] In a world where
2022
01:32:28,137 --> 01:32:29,551
The White Stripes
and The Dirtbombs
2023
01:32:29,551 --> 01:32:30,965
are getting national attention,
2024
01:32:30,965 --> 01:32:32,827
Mudhoney made a lot more sense.
2025
01:32:32,827 --> 01:32:36,448
[crowd chattering]
2026
01:32:41,551 --> 01:32:44,275
- And for the reason that
Mudhoney became popular again
2027
01:32:44,275 --> 01:32:47,275
was because they were
almost a direct link
2028
01:32:47,275 --> 01:32:48,965
to that time and to that place,
2029
01:32:48,965 --> 01:32:52,379
and to Nirvana, for kids
who'd never seen Nirvana.
2030
01:32:52,379 --> 01:32:54,034
For them, this was like
a living, tangible link
2031
01:32:54,034 --> 01:32:55,931
to that whole scene.
2032
01:32:55,931 --> 01:32:59,206
[rock music]
2033
01:33:06,724 --> 01:33:08,448
- [Voiceover] As great as
those early records are,
2034
01:33:08,448 --> 01:33:10,103
they're better now.
2035
01:33:10,103 --> 01:33:13,965
[rock music]
2036
01:33:13,965 --> 01:33:17,448
- We recorded that and
"Under a Billion Suns"
2037
01:33:17,448 --> 01:33:19,448
kind of in similar manners,
2038
01:33:19,448 --> 01:33:21,896
where we would just
go for a long weekend
2039
01:33:21,896 --> 01:33:24,551
with one engineer and a studio
2040
01:33:26,586 --> 01:33:28,689
and put down three or four songs
2041
01:33:28,689 --> 01:33:32,103
and then mix those and
then do the same thing
2042
01:33:32,103 --> 01:33:33,344
with someone else when we had
2043
01:33:33,344 --> 01:33:34,827
three or four more
songs written.
2044
01:33:34,827 --> 01:33:38,413
To me, both those two records
seem kind of of a pair.
2045
01:33:38,413 --> 01:33:43,068
♪ It's our patriotic duty
2046
01:33:43,068 --> 01:33:47,965
♪ To make sweet love tonight
2047
01:33:50,068 --> 01:33:52,241
♪ Come on, little girl
2048
01:33:52,241 --> 01:33:55,689
♪ I've become a dirty old man
2049
01:33:55,689 --> 01:33:59,724
♪ With a hard on for war
2050
01:34:33,620 --> 01:34:35,551
- Oh, yeah, sure.
2051
01:34:35,551 --> 01:34:39,793
We as Mudhoney would like
to show our appreciation
2052
01:34:39,793 --> 01:34:44,034
for the good people of Japan.
2053
01:34:44,034 --> 01:34:45,482
- Who appreciate us.
2054
01:34:45,482 --> 01:34:46,758
- [Steve] Who appreciate us.
2055
01:34:46,758 --> 01:34:49,206
- And the rest of you
who don't appreciate us?
2056
01:34:52,172 --> 01:34:54,068
[laughing]
2057
01:34:56,724 --> 01:34:58,103
- I really like
the record a lot.
2058
01:34:58,103 --> 01:35:00,275
The songs are more
stripped down and simple
2059
01:35:00,275 --> 01:35:03,000
and easy to understand,
right off the bat.
2060
01:35:03,000 --> 01:35:04,827
I never like all of our songs,
2061
01:35:04,827 --> 01:35:07,000
and I never like all
of our recordings.
2062
01:35:07,000 --> 01:35:08,448
This one came closer.
2063
01:35:08,448 --> 01:35:10,482
- We did it all in one weekend.
2064
01:35:10,482 --> 01:35:14,275
We'd done most of the
tracking by Friday evening,
2065
01:35:14,275 --> 01:35:15,689
and then I started
doing the vocals
2066
01:35:15,689 --> 01:35:16,931
and finished most of the vocals,
2067
01:35:16,931 --> 01:35:18,482
I think, by Saturday evening.
2068
01:35:18,482 --> 01:35:19,758
Basically, I'm now at,
2069
01:35:19,758 --> 01:35:21,620
it was the first completed take.
2070
01:35:21,620 --> 01:35:23,379
I remember coming to
the end of the song
2071
01:35:23,379 --> 01:35:25,689
and I had to kind
of throw up my hands
2072
01:35:25,689 --> 01:35:28,103
so Dan knew that this
was like the end,
2073
01:35:28,103 --> 01:35:29,551
and that was the take.
2074
01:35:29,551 --> 01:35:33,482
It was like, wow, it's not
gonna get any better than that.
2075
01:35:35,448 --> 01:35:40,448
♪ If this is what it
means to be saved ♪
2076
01:35:41,137 --> 01:35:44,379
- [Voiceover] They've been
able to withstand a lot
2077
01:35:44,379 --> 01:35:48,379
because they not
just stuck together,
2078
01:35:48,379 --> 01:35:51,034
but they never lost sight of
2079
01:35:51,034 --> 01:35:53,689
who they were as friends.
2080
01:35:53,689 --> 01:35:56,344
They always say, "Don't go into
business with your friends."
2081
01:35:56,344 --> 01:35:59,620
Well, sometimes your
friends are all you got.
2082
01:36:00,620 --> 01:36:02,137
- They're all total music nerds.
2083
01:36:02,137 --> 01:36:03,827
You could go out,
sit down to dinner,
2084
01:36:03,827 --> 01:36:06,068
and inevitably it turns into,
2085
01:36:06,068 --> 01:36:08,931
"No, that band was not punk
rock, they were post punk rock!"
2086
01:36:10,172 --> 01:36:12,344
- They've always played
by their own rules,
2087
01:36:12,344 --> 01:36:15,620
and they have a very
high level of integrity,
2088
01:36:15,620 --> 01:36:20,275
and they really understand
what it takes to rock.
2089
01:36:21,689 --> 01:36:23,482
- Nowadays, the tours are short,
2090
01:36:23,482 --> 01:36:26,862
around work schedules,
around kids,
2091
01:36:26,862 --> 01:36:29,931
around whatever, around
various different things,
2092
01:36:29,931 --> 01:36:32,379
so typically a block
of time is picked
2093
01:36:32,379 --> 01:36:33,586
and then it's just filled.
2094
01:36:33,586 --> 01:36:34,827
That's what it comes down to.
2095
01:36:34,827 --> 01:36:36,724
- It adds a bit of a
sort of vacation vibe
2096
01:36:36,724 --> 01:36:40,793
to things for us, because we
don't go out all the time,
2097
01:36:40,793 --> 01:36:43,586
and when we do go out
once or twice a year,
2098
01:36:43,586 --> 01:36:45,482
it's kind of special for us.
2099
01:36:45,482 --> 01:36:47,206
We go places we wanna go.
2100
01:36:47,206 --> 01:36:48,448
We get to hang out.
2101
01:36:48,448 --> 01:36:50,137
- I'm grateful that
we get to tour at all.
2102
01:36:51,379 --> 01:36:53,103
I'm grateful that there
are people out there
2103
01:36:53,103 --> 01:36:55,655
who give a shit,
who wanna see us,
2104
01:36:55,655 --> 01:36:58,482
and who will bring
us over to Japan
2105
01:36:58,482 --> 01:36:59,724
or bring us down to Brazil
2106
01:36:59,724 --> 01:37:03,551
or do a show with us
someplace in Europe.
2107
01:37:03,551 --> 01:37:05,482
Unfortunately, we
can't tour the way
2108
01:37:05,482 --> 01:37:07,000
we used to be able to tour,
2109
01:37:07,000 --> 01:37:10,448
'cause everyone works or has
commitments with their family,
2110
01:37:10,448 --> 01:37:13,862
so when we do tour, we
tend to pack a lot of stuff
2111
01:37:13,862 --> 01:37:16,241
into a short period of time,
2112
01:37:16,241 --> 01:37:19,482
which may not be
the smartest way
2113
01:37:19,482 --> 01:37:20,758
to go about doing things,
2114
01:37:20,758 --> 01:37:22,413
but it's the only way we can.
2115
01:37:25,482 --> 01:37:29,310
- It's fun for us. It's low-key.
2116
01:37:29,310 --> 01:37:31,379
We're not trying to sell
records, necessarily.
2117
01:37:31,379 --> 01:37:33,310
There's no pressure
for us to get out there
2118
01:37:33,310 --> 01:37:36,275
and work the record.
2119
01:37:36,275 --> 01:37:38,379
It's a cool space right now.
2120
01:37:40,275 --> 01:37:43,206
- I am glad that we
are not in a position
2121
01:37:43,206 --> 01:37:45,448
where music is our only thing
2122
01:37:45,448 --> 01:37:49,965
and that we have to worry about
catering to a certain crowd.
2123
01:37:49,965 --> 01:37:52,724
I think we're really
lucky that we get to do
2124
01:37:52,724 --> 01:37:55,551
whatever the fuck we
want, despite the crowds.
2125
01:37:55,551 --> 01:37:58,413
There's a lot of
people think of music
2126
01:37:58,413 --> 01:38:00,379
as a way to get something else.
2127
01:38:00,379 --> 01:38:02,000
To me, and I think
the rest of the band,
2128
01:38:02,000 --> 01:38:05,482
music is an end
in and of itself.
2129
01:38:05,482 --> 01:38:10,103
It's not like a way to
get fame and fortune
2130
01:38:10,103 --> 01:38:13,000
and pussy and drugs or whatever.
2131
01:38:13,000 --> 01:38:16,896
Thinking about music like that
just kind of creeps me out.
2132
01:38:16,896 --> 01:38:21,448
And I think that
might be the result of
2133
01:38:21,448 --> 01:38:23,517
kind of the music that
we came up through,
2134
01:38:23,517 --> 01:38:26,000
which if you were a
kid playing hardcore
2135
01:38:26,000 --> 01:38:29,482
in like 1981 and '82,
2136
01:38:29,482 --> 01:38:31,896
the idea that you
were gonna make money
2137
01:38:31,896 --> 01:38:36,137
or have fame or get laid or,
2138
01:38:36,137 --> 01:38:38,000
well, maybe you might get drugs,
2139
01:38:38,000 --> 01:38:39,206
you might get laid,
2140
01:38:39,206 --> 01:38:43,620
but it wasn't like
anybody was clamoring
2141
01:38:43,620 --> 01:38:44,896
to hear this kind
of music except for
2142
01:38:44,896 --> 01:38:48,103
a handful of other
kids your own age.
2143
01:38:48,103 --> 01:38:50,000
There wasn't any idea
that there was like
2144
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:53,655
a pot of gold at the
end of the rainbow.
2145
01:38:56,517 --> 01:38:58,551
We were doing this just
to amuse ourselves,
2146
01:38:58,551 --> 01:39:01,586
and I still am.
2147
01:39:04,482 --> 01:39:08,344
[crowd cheering]
2148
01:39:18,310 --> 01:39:22,517
[rock music]
2149
01:39:22,517 --> 01:39:25,517
- May this be the
official document.
2150
01:39:25,517 --> 01:39:28,103
As long as those guys
wanna make records,
2151
01:39:28,103 --> 01:39:30,517
I'm gonna put 'em out.
2152
01:39:30,517 --> 01:39:31,931
Hopefully they're
not gonna wanna make
2153
01:39:31,931 --> 01:39:34,034
too many of them too quickly,
2154
01:39:34,034 --> 01:39:36,137
or else we'll all end up
2155
01:39:36,137 --> 01:39:39,517
back in the straits that
we were in 20 years ago.
2156
01:39:39,517 --> 01:39:43,379
[rock music]
2157
01:40:07,275 --> 01:40:11,275
[crowd cheering]
2158
01:40:13,068 --> 01:40:16,655
[rock music]
2159
01:40:21,724 --> 01:40:23,620
- I mean, I just think
a lot of it's luck
2160
01:40:25,586 --> 01:40:29,310
and, you know,
just sheer talent.
2161
01:40:29,310 --> 01:40:33,758
Blistering licks and, you
know, hot, hot, hot drum fills.
2162
01:40:33,758 --> 01:40:35,310
[laughing]
2163
01:40:35,310 --> 01:40:37,103
Well, really, that's what it is.
2164
01:40:37,103 --> 01:40:39,896
We're just a fucking
great band, really.
2165
01:40:39,896 --> 01:40:42,344
It's a proven fact, isn't it?
2166
01:40:42,344 --> 01:40:45,724
- It got universal praise
and universal play.
2167
01:40:45,724 --> 01:40:48,413
The only person,
quite ironically,
2168
01:40:48,413 --> 01:40:52,310
who gave it a bad
review, is Grant Alden.
2169
01:40:52,310 --> 01:40:55,068
I'm calling you out
right here, motherfucker.
2170
01:40:55,068 --> 01:40:57,551
- [laughing] White shoes!
2171
01:40:57,551 --> 01:40:59,310
Wearing the big old white shoes.
2172
01:40:59,310 --> 01:41:01,172
There's a lot of
pictures and videos of me
2173
01:41:01,172 --> 01:41:03,034
wearing big old white
shoes, and I'm like,
2174
01:41:03,034 --> 01:41:04,586
"Damn, why didn't I
have a little more
2175
01:41:04,586 --> 01:41:07,827
"fashion sense back then?"
2176
01:41:07,827 --> 01:41:09,931
- It was in the hotel lobby
where we were staying,
2177
01:41:09,931 --> 01:41:11,413
and Lukin was walking
by, and I said,
2178
01:41:11,413 --> 01:41:13,448
"Hey, Matt, say hi
to my girlfriend."
2179
01:41:13,448 --> 01:41:15,206
I handed him the phone.
2180
01:41:15,206 --> 01:41:17,862
He'd never met my girlfriend,
didn't know who she was,
2181
01:41:17,862 --> 01:41:19,620
and I had just kind
of met the band.
2182
01:41:19,620 --> 01:41:21,793
This was the first time
we toured with them.
2183
01:41:21,793 --> 01:41:24,379
"Hey, Matt, say hi
to my girlfriend."
2184
01:41:24,379 --> 01:41:25,965
And so he grabbed
the phone and says,
2185
01:41:25,965 --> 01:41:28,241
"How big's your
pussy?" [laughing]
2186
01:41:28,931 --> 01:41:31,310
First words out of his mouth!
2187
01:41:31,310 --> 01:41:35,586
[rock music]
2188
01:41:44,172 --> 01:41:46,413
♪ I'm now
2189
01:41:47,517 --> 01:41:49,827
♪ Yeah, I'm now
161515
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