All language subtitles for People Magazine Investigates Surviving A Serial Killer - S01E03 - Surviving the Casanova Killer

There are many more murders
making, in my opinion,

Paul John Knowles, the most
heinous mass murderer

in American history.

[Wendy] For five months
in 1974,

Paul John Knowles
terrorized the country

murdering men,
women and children
as young as 7 years old.

[Roy Harris] The victims
were strangled, stabbed, shot.

Apparently just killing
somebody excited Knowles.

And there was
the sexual element.

He was a smooth talker.

He could con you
out of your shoe.

And he became known
as the Casanova Killer.

Knowles may not be
the most well-known,

but he certainly was
one of the most vicious.

He thought killing people
would make him famous.

[Eleanor] It was said
his total was 30
something people.

I mean,
it was just unthinkable.

It's shocking
that the woman who brought
the Casanova Killer to justice

can still detail what happened
during those harrowing days.

[Barbara] It's been 49 years,
and I am telling my story
to the world.

My name is Barbara Mabee Abel

and I survived
one of the most heinous
serial killers ever.

I was born a twin
in Detroit, Michigan,

and my twin sister, Beverly,
was born with cerebral palsy.

Throughout my whole lifetime,
I always called her Bevy

and while we were fraternal,
we both knew each other's
thoughts and inner feelings.

She was the smart,
funny person

and had anything
that had to do with fun stuff.

And I was a serious person.

We lived with Mom and Dad,
and an older sister, Jackie
and my brother Gary.

And then all of a sudden
when I was 6 years old
my dad passed away.

After that, Mom decided that
she needed a new beginning,
and she loved Florida.

So Mom moved
all four of us kids down
West Palm Beach, Florida,

and then she went
and bought this house
where I still live today,

after she got a job
as a saleswoman,

And she was so proud
to buy this in the '50s
and make it her own.

It's a darling little house,
and it was safe.

Barbara really loved
her new life in Florida.

She loved the neighborhood.
She made a lot of friends.

I have known Barbara
for 56 years,

ever since we were
in the seventh grade.

She was just very outgoing,
and we got along real well.

We could talk to each other
about anything.

[Barbara] Eleanor is
my best friend
in the whole world.

We became like sisters
through the years.

She got married,
I got married and
we moved up to Georgia.

And my only son, Dale,
was born in April 1968,

and I was in my early 20s.

When I brought Dale
home from the hospital,
he was the light of my life.

He was so beautiful.

He had red hair, blue eyes,

and I couldn't get over
hugging and kissing and
singing lullabies to him.

I adored my son.

[Wendy] But Barbara's marriage
is short lived,

and she and Dale moved back in
with her mom and
her twin sister, Beverly.

With extra hands
to care for Dale,

Barbara joins the workforce,
and she discovers her calling.

[Barbara] Somebody said,
"Hey, Barbara, why don't you
go to work WIRK here in town?"

[on the radio] 339, WIRK,
West Palm Beach.

I'm Barry Grant.
Got the music.

They had an opening
as a receptionist,

and I wound up learning
how to record commercials.

And then I could do it
and I was hooked.

I wanted to be a copywriter
and start writing commercials
and recording.

[Christine] Barbara was
an author at heart.

She always wanted
to be a writer,

so this worked out
really well for her.

But a few years later,
in May of 1974,
Barbara's mother dies.

Beverly and Barbara
are both so upset.

But they, you know,
make things work

and they develop a new rhythm.

And by November,
things are starting
to look up.

[Barbara] Thursday,
November the 14th, 1974
was like any other day to me.

Got ready for work.

Dale went and got ready
for school.

Beverly got her breakfast
and was happy.

And after I dropped off Dale
at his church school,

I got to work and
started writing commercials.

When it was almost noontime
I tried to call my sister
at home

and she didn't answer,
and she always answered.

Which I thought was
kind of weird.

After work, I drove home
from the nursery school
with Dale

and I got to the door
with my son and
unlocked the door.

We shouted out for Beverly
and there was no answer.

So I said to Dale,
"Go look for Bevy

and I'm gonna go
get some water, honey."

So I went into the kitchen
to go get my glass of water.

All of a sudden
I had this horrible feeling

and I had chills going up
and down my arms.

Maybe it was instinct... fear,
but I turned around,

and I see this man
with a sawed-off shotgun

and I was scared to death.

At that point Dale runs out
and says,

"Bevy is in the bedroom
and she's bleeding."

And I said,
"I want to see my sister.
I want to see Beverly."

So he took me
into the bedroom with Dale,

we went into this bedroom
right here and I saw Bevy.

And I went around the bed
because it was a different way
back then,

and I put my hand on her
and here she was crying.

And she was laying there
with the covers over her.

She was bound and gagged
and she had blood dripping
from her gag in her mouth.

Once we loosened the gag,

I put my hand
on Bevy's shoulder,
bent down and kissed her.

Told her how much I loved her
and that we're gonna be okay

because God's gonna get us
out of this, okay.

And then I pulled back
the bedspread and found out
she was naked.

That... that's when I lost it.

I said,
"Did you rape her? Be...

Because if you raped her,
I'm gonna kill you."

He started laughing and said
he tried to rape my sister,
and I just felt terror.

I asked,
"Why are you doing this?"

Like, "What happened,?"
He said, "My name is John

and I don't want to go back
to jail.

I just need money
and your car."

I said, "I've got money,

and I'll get it for you."

And it was the mortgage money.

And then...

He says,
"I'm gonna take your son."

No way would I let him
take my son.

And I said, "Take me instead,"

and so he did.

At that point, John,
who I later learned
was Paul John Knowles

went and tied my son
Dale up... up to my sister.

It made me feel horrible,.

You know, I mean, my God,
she was naked and he was
only 6 years old.

But I just had to get out
of the house with John

and make sure
that Beverly and Dale
were going to be safe.

And hope and pray
that I would live.

When he tied my son up,

I told Dale to please act
like a big boy.

I said, "We're gonna be okay."

Then he got my keys.
He already had the money.

And we went out
through the front door
to the car.

And we drove off
into the sunset.

He asked me
where the interstate was,

so we got him over on
the northbound A1A

and then we started driving.

[indistinct radio chatter]

And all that time,
he had the radio on

and he was getting mad

and he had me
turn the stations.

And I was wondering,
"Why does he want to
hear the news?"

[man on the radio] Thank you,
Andy, very much.

And this is WINZ Miami.

And then he said,
"I've killed people."

I was terrified.

And it was then, I decided
that I was gonna do

whatever I needed to do
to survive.

And I started talking
about movies,

beautiful songs of the '70s.

I wanted to make him
fall in love with me.

I was trying to save my life
and get back to Beverly
and Dale.

So I said, "Honey,
do you want a cigarette?"

And he said, "Why are you
calling me honey?"

I said, "Why not?
You're not a bad guy."

And that's when I said,
"You remind me
of Robert Redford,

the movie star
and he said, "I do?"

and I said,
"Well, you kinda do.

You know,
you're not bad looking."

After that,
he was very responsive
in the way I was treating him.

He was actually happy
to be talking to me
and talking to somebody

'cause he said
he had silence all day being
in the home with Beverly.

He started talking about
his family a little bit,

how he had a rough childhood
with his father.

"I have brothers and sisters.
I was raised in Jacksonville.

I was raised
with a Christian family."

And then he said,
"I heard from your sister
that you wrote something."

And I said,
"I work at WJNO radio
and I'm a copywriter."

"Well, do you know how
to write books?"

And I said, "Why do you
want to write a book?"

And he told me that
he wanted to be famous.

And I said, "What do you
want to be famous for?"

And he didn't answer.

And I didn't ask after that.

[Wendy] As Barbara and
her captor continue north,

a vehicle has been recovered
in West Palm Beach.

It was stolen from a man
named William Bates
back in September,

and a strangled body
is discovered in Ohio
months later.

[Christine] Inside the vehicle
were credit cards
and insurance cards

that belonged to a guy
named Carswell Carr,

who was also murdered
in a double homicide

along with his 15-year-old
daughter, Amanda, in Georgia

just days before Barbara
was abducted.

[Officer James Josey]
Carswell and Amanda Carr

were found
in their ransacked home.

She had been strangled.

He had been stabbed
approximately 35 times.

Pair of scissors...

It was the most bloody
crime scene I'd ever seen.

Based on the severity,
we figured a lunatic
might have done it

because we had no idea
who we were looking for.

[Christine] Back inside
the stolen vehicle

they also discover a will of
a man named Paul John Knowles.

Little do they know
Paul John Knowles
is a serial killer

zigzagging across the country
on a five month rampage.

Karen Wine is 35,
and her daughter Dawn, 15,

were found dead
on October 16th,

and on this particular day,
Knowles broke into their home

and made them eat dinner
with him.

He tied them up
and then strangled and
sexually assaulted them.

Knowles killed
a 13-year-old girl hitchhiking
near Macon, Georgia,

who was later identified
as Ima Jean Sanders.

He raped her, strangled her
and left her body in the woods
between trees.

[Christine] Doris Hosey was a
53-year-old woman found shot
dead in her home,

and Knowles shot her
with her husband's gun.

[James] Starting in the summer
of '74 and for the next
five months,

old women, children,
it didn't matter to him.

When he had the urge to kill,
whoever was there
happened to be the victim.

The will identified the name
of Knowles' attorney,
Sheldon Yavitz

and so he was called.

In early '74 I became
associated with him

because I was hired
to get him a parole
from Raiford Prison

where he was serving
two sentences,

one for burglary,
the other one
was resisting arrest.

I told the West Palm
Beach Police,

if you check his
criminal record, you're gonna
find out all about him.

So within three hours,
they have Knowles's
fingerprints and his picture.

[James] It was like Christmas.

We actually had a name,
we knew who we were
looking for.

That didn't solve the case,
however,

and we still had to find him.

[Wendy] While the police
are busy searching

the West Palm Beach area
for Paul John Knowles,

what they don't know
is Barbara is trapped beside
him in her Volkswagen

as he drives her out of town.

Meanwhile, her sister Beverly
and son Dale are still tied up
in the family home.

He kept saying,
"I've killed people."

And I realized he was so evil.

I just wish I had the guts
to try to go and push him
out the door, but I couldn't.

I was too tired
and too scared.

And Paul John Knowles
got tired.

He was exhausted.

So he saw this motel.

It's kind of like on a hill.

And he said,
"We're going to stay
over there."

And then that's when
all hell broke loose.

When we pulled up the motel
in Fort Pierce,

he parked the car in front,
at the office,

and I said,
"You can drop me off
and then leave with the car."

And he said, "Nope,
you're coming with me."

He got his sawed-off shotgun

and we went to the
front office to check-in.

I was almost shaking,
but I had to get my
head together

because I knew I had to go and

make him see myself
as being calm,

when inside, my guts
were churning.

At the front desk,
he put his arm around my waist

pretending like
we were a couple.

And he said, "We're Mister
and Mrs. Joe Smith."

I'm thinking, okay,
I put my arm around him

because I wanted her to think
that we were married.

I figured if I said
anything else,

he might go ahead
and kill her and me, too.

And it worked.
She gave him the key
to room 10.

When we got in the room,
he says, "Just get undressed."

I told him
I didn't want to do anything.

And he says, "Nope," he says,
"Just get undressed."

So that's when he decided...

that he had to rape me.

And when he raped me, I, um,

was thinking of Dale
and Beverly and everything
but being raped.

But he couldn't finish.

He tried to rape me
three times, four times.

Then he got furious.

Then he grabbed my thumb
and tried to break my finger.

He grabbed my hair
and I thought he was going to
beat me to death.

And I said,
"What are you doing?"

And he, like, shook his head
and said, "I'm so sorry.
I'm so sorry."

He was Dr. Jekyll
and Mr. Hyde.

I didn't know
from one moment to the next
if I was going to be killed.

Then he takes a sheet
and he rips it apart.

He tied my wrist to the...
to the bedpost, and then he...

went and got my ankles
and tied them.

I was terrified and I...

I was praying to the dear Lord
that I'd get out of this.

I said, "Let me get home
to Beverly and Dale," and...

and all of a sudden
I was dozing off

because I was so exhausted
mentally and physically and...

and then all of a sudden
I saw my mo... [breaks up]

I saw my mother. [sobbing]

My mother came to me
in a dream and...

and she was like an angel and

she was like,
"You're gonna be okay.

You're going to be okay.
God's with you."

When I came to,
he got me untied
and he turned on the TV.

And that's when it flashed
with our pictures
on the screen.

All I remember
on the first news report

was Paul John Knowles
was a killer

who had kidnapped me.

And he was so intense.

I mean, I couldn't say a word
because he'd probably slap me.

So I just kept my mouth shut
and let him listen
to the news.

Watching the broadcast,
Barbara also learns

that her son and sister
are safe.

[Barbara] I thought...
[gasps] "Thank God,"

and I was relieved.

That's when I just started
sobbing inside

because I didn't want to upset
Paul John Knowles.

Apparently, 6-year-old Dale
was able to free himself
and his aunt

before getting help
from the neighbor
to call police.

I remember watching the news
just, you know, a normal day

and all of a sudden
Barbara's picture
flashed on the screen

with a story
that was horrifying

and shocking,
about her being kidnapped.

And I started praying
for Barbara's safety

because you just assume
that that person is not
going to come back home.

[Roy] There was
numerous BOLOs that were
coming out about Knowles,

and they had a description
of the car,

which was a
gold colored Volkswagen,
not a very common car.

[Eleanor] They had
their forces out looking,
trying to track them down.

And of course,
the more information
they have on what he did,

the more frightened we got.

[Christine] Trapped in
a motel room nearly
70 miles north

of her West Palm Beach home,

Barbara sees that Knowles
is fixated on the broadcast

and his infamy.

[Barbara] He was so intense.

And I thought that must be
why he wants me
to write his book.

So I thought,
if he says it again,

I'll tell him I know
how to write a book.

When we went to bed
that first night on Thursday,

he took my ankle
and tied it to his.

Pretty difficult to sleep
on a single bed,
with your ankle tied,

Being tied up in the dark
next to a killer.

I couldn't get rid
of the terror in my...

soul.

[woman] While Barbara tries
to survive the night,

the FBI pay
a visit to Sheldon Yavitz.

They want to know
more about the will
found in the stolen vehicle.

And if he knows
where his client is.

At the time, the authorities
only suspect Knowles

for three murders
and Barbara's kidnapping.

They are still unaware
of the full breadth
of his murder spree.

[Roy] The will said
that Knowles was going
to record his crimes

he was committing on a tape.

Yavitz would then put him
in a safe and keep it until
one of two things happened.

One that he was killed.

Committing his crimes.

Or secondly,
that he gave a written release

for Yavitz
to release the tape.

The tape, naturally,
was what we would consider

to be a goldmine
on what Knowles had done.

[Yavitz] In October 1974
I met Knowles
at a bar in Miami.

And then Knowles said,
"I want you to know
I'm a mass murderer.

I said,
I really don't want to know.

"But I want to tell you
what I've done.

I've got to tell somebody.

They've got to know what
I've done for the future."

I said, "Do you want
to give yourself up?"

"No. But someday I want people
to know that I've
killed all these people."

And then he said,
"Well, I'll put it on tape."

Okay.

That his...
His confessions of his crimes.

The next day
he's got the tape.

I never listened to it,
but I put the tape
in an envelope

and then locked in a safe
in my home,
and then he's gone.

Once it was learned
that the tape existed,

the attorney who possessed it,
refused to turn it over.

[Yavitz] I said,
"This is in accordance

with the lawyer-client
privilege.
So I'm not going to help you."

And he said,
"You are the worst person
we've ever seen.

You're horrible.

We're not going
to deal with you."

I said, "Okay."

[Christine] As for Barbara,
they make it through
the night with little sleep.

And by the time
the sun comes up,

she's been captive
for 18 hours.

[Barbara] The next morning,
he said he was hungry

and wanted
to take me out to eat.

So, he took me down the road
to a restaurant.

It was like a little diner.

We walked in the door
and I smelled
this freshly baked bread.

Oh, I was so hungry.

We get seated in. I thought,
well, maybe I can get loose.

And then I saw the way
that he had
a sawed-off shotgun.

And he goes and gets
it out of his coat,
takes his coat off.

Puts the gun on the seat.

And covers it with the coat.

Then this elderly waitress
comes over and waits on us.

He ordered orange juice,
bacon and eggs,
hash browns, everything.

I was thinking to myself,
"Why isn't
anybody noticing us?

We were on the news
last night."

And I knew at that time
that there was nobody
to help me.

I just couldn't believe
that nobody had seen us on TV.

And that's when I realized
I had to keep on acting.

Because he had the shotgun.

And I would not put
anybody else in danger.

If he was going to kill me,
he was going to kill me.

But not with other
people involved.

After we had breakfast,
we came back to the motel
and he raped me again.

Once again, couldn't perform
and he got mad.

So I had to do reverse
psychology

and make him think
that he was really great.

So he would calm down
and not kill me.

He says,
"I wish I would have met you
before all this happened."

When the news
came on again later,

he wasn't happy
with the reporter
and he wasn't happy with me.

And then he took out the gun

and put it towards my head
and said, "Bang, bang."

And then started
laughing hysterically.

And then he tied me up
once again.

He went out
to make a telephone call.

I was praying on and off
every single moment.

I was praying that I could
be released and go home
to my sister and my son.

And all of a sudden
I looked over
at the nightstand

and the motel key was there.

He comes back and he actually
tries to get in the door.

But the door's locked.

And Barbara realizes
he doesn't have another key.

[knocking on door]

[Barbara] I felt like
a miracle just happened

when he couldn't
get in the room.

[banging on door]

[Barbara]
And after a few minutes...

through the door,
Paul John Knowles said,

"When they pick you up,
don't tell them
that I hurt you.

And I love you."

And then there
was nothingness.

But I didn't want to scream
for help because
what if he was outside?

He'd kill somebody else.

And me, too.

[Wendy] Barbara begins
to wriggle herself free.

First from the bedpost
and then from the sheets
binding her hands and feet.

And by 07:30 in the morning,

Barbara is finally free.

And calls the front desk.

[Barbara] I told her my name.

And I was kidnapped
by a serial killer.

When law enforcement came,
the FBI showed up.

Plus they had
a crimes lab come.
And they had everything.

When I was rescued,
I had to go
to the motel's front office,

because I had a telephone call
waiting for me.

It was Beverly,
and she was crying,

and then she says,
"[gasps] Oh, my God,
you're okay."

And I said, "I'm okay."
I said, "How are you?"
And she says, "I'm okay."

And we both started
sobbing together
and I said, "How's Dale?"

"He's right here.
He's..."
"Mommy, Mommy, Mommy!"

He gets on the phone.
"I love you. I love you.
When are you coming home?"

I said, "I'll be there
in a little bit." And I said,
"I love you to pieces."

He says, "Thank God
he didn't hurt you, Mommy."

I hung up crying and sobbing
for the next 15 minutes.

[Eleanor] We were elated that
she was able to come home.

And I knew that it was going
to be a long, long
process of healing...

after the ordeal
she'd been through.

I had to be there.
And we hugged each other.

It was a miracle.

[Christine]
Barbara is rescued,
but he's in the wind.

And police actually
put out a bolo.

Be on the lookout
for Barbara's car.

[Roy] A Florida state trooper
was patrolling out of Perry,
not far from the Georgia line.

And he apparently
saw the stolen car
and stopped Knowles.

Knowles had a double barrel
sawed-off shotgun
that he liked.

And he was able to get
the jump on the trooper.

Knowles then puts
the trooper in the backseat
of the patrol car,

and drives off.

And so Knowles driving
the patrol car

ends up pulling over
James Meyer,

a businessman
who was just in town
for a few days.

At this point, Knowles
abandoned the patrol car

and took the trooper
and Mr. Meyer hostage,
and they left in Meyer's car.

They were next observed
at a gas station
in Lakeland, Georgia.

You've got a civilian
and you've got a state trooper
in uniform in the back seat

with another individual.

And the attendant thought
something's
not right about this

and reported
it to the authorities.

The kidnapping
of a police officer,

a state trooper
was unheard of.

That was national news.

And there was an urgency
to try to find them
before they were killed.

We're here trying to recover
our missing trooper,

which was kidnapped
in the state of Florida.

Along with another hostage
and brought
into the state of Georgia.

[Roy] The next day
I got a call.

They got Knowles
cornered in Henry County.

I got another one
arriving now.

Deputy sheriff saw the car
and recognized
it was a wanted car.

So the deputy radioed ahead
and had a roadblock set up.

Everybody from metro Atlanta
who had a badge
and a gun was there.

I've never seen so many cops
in my entire life.

[siren blaring]

[tires screech and thuds]

[Roy] Knowles
crashed into the roadblock.

At that point,
Knowles abandoned the car
and left on foot.

Paul John Knowles was running
and had the shotgun.

And exchanged gunfire
with the authorities
that pursued him.

They shot Knowles in the leg
and he took off
and he was bleeding.

And a young man who was out
rabbit hunting saw him.

But Knowles was exhausted
from running, losing blood

and Knowles gave up.

No, not really.

[James] The authorities came,
took Knowles into custody.

And the rest,
they say, is history.

[Barbara]
It was a relief to me
when I saw it on the TV.

And when I got home
and talked to Bevy,
we were both relieved.

[Wendy] When law enforcement
realizes that the trooper
and James Meyer

are not in the car
with Knowles,
they assume the worst.

It's more than likely
that Knowles
killed the two men.

But when he is arrested,
he refuses to say.

In one of his interviews,
he bragged he killed
more than 30 people.

Knowles felt
that of everything
he did in his life,

the only thing that he
had been successful
at was killing people.

He didn't want to be caught,
but he didn't want
to go out at the end.

Nobody knew what he did.

And he thought sharing
his high body count
would make him look good.

From a publicity standpoint.

And he felt if
he was famous,

he'd make money out of it,
which would go to his mother.

This was his good
deed for his mother.

[Roy] He wanted to be famous.

He wanted a book
and a movie made.

And the media was all
over it all day long.

[Barbara] I saw a magazine,
and it had on there

the picture
of Paul John Knowles,
Casanova Killer.

And I'm like...
"You've got to be kidding me."

[Wendy] Several days later,
another deer hunter

discovers the bodies
of Trooper Charles Campbell

and businessman James Meyer
in the Georgia woods.

[James] He handcuffed
both of them to the tree.

Shot both of them in the back
of the head, execution style.

[Wendy] Based
on the caliber of the bullet,

authorities believe
that Knowles used

Trooper Campbell's own gun
to kill them both.

[Roy] Once they were
discovered, essentially,
Knowles was cooked.

And Knowles agreed
to take authorities

to Henry County
and show him where he ditched

the trooper's .357
Magnum pistol.

They loaded Knowles up
in the sheriff's car

and were coming down
I-20 into Atlanta.

When Knowles secreted
a paper clip,

and picked his handcuffs
on his belly chain.

[officer] That man got
a handcuff off
and he went for my gun,

and he got his hands
on my gun.

And you know, you come
to your own conclusion,
but I'm pretty shook up.

I know he would have
taken my life.

I began firing
and continued firing
until I was satisfied

that the danger
had subsided to both
Sheriff Lee and myself.

[Barbara] It was one
of the best days
of Dale, Beverly, and my life

when we found out
that he was killed.

Because he could kill no more.

[Yavitz]
Before Knowles was killed,

they threw me
in jail for contempt.

Because I wouldn't tell them
where the tape was.

But eventually,
I agreed to produce the tape
if it was sealed by the judge,

until the Court of Appeals
determined

whether lawyer-client
privilege existed.

Well, Knowles was killed
in December.

So in January, a judge rules
that the lawyer-client
privileges died.

And then the judge apparently
listened to the tape

and to all the confessions
he had made.

[Roy] Although Knowles
was killed before he could
be prosecuted for his crimes,

the tapes solved
20 of our homicides.

He claimed he killed
a lot more.

There are many more murders
making in my opinion,

Paul John Knowles,
the most heinous

mass murderer
in America history.

[James]
During the investigation

to find out how more bodies

were attributed
to Paul John Knowles,

we discovered that apparently

Knowles was gonna get married
in the summer of '74.

But this lady had been
to a psychic

who told her that there was
a bad man coming into her life

and she needed
to get away from him.

So she broke off
the engagement.

And we feel that that's
what set him off.

Because shortly after that
he started killing.

Knowles said he killed
at least 35.

And authorities are hoping
that the tape would provide

you know, some kind of answer,

as to who these other people
that he killed are.

But it just wasn't to be.

[Gary] We ultimately learned

the tape was destroyed
in a flood
at the federal courthouse

in Macon, Georgia,
and no longer existed.

[Christine]
Unfortunately, because
the tape was destroyed,

no one really knows just
how many people
Knowles killed.

[Wendy] For Barbara,
the death of Paul John Knowles

removes any
fear of his return.

But it doesn't erase
the trauma for her,
Beverly, or Dale.

[Barbara] My son needed help.
He was only six years old.

I knew it affected him.

I could see it in his eyes

and how he wanted to be very
protective of me
after it happened.

And was afraid
when I had to go to work

and drop him off
at the church school.

But we had the pastors
at his church school
talk to all three of us

and pray over us
and everything.

And he's a beautiful,
beautiful family member now.

Has his own business.

And he is a beautiful
Christian, helping others now.

[Eleanor]
There were days that Barbara
was able to somewhat cope.

And there were days
that she couldn't cope at all.

It was very strenuous
on her psyche.

She would call me on the phone
and would be crying and...

And then I'd get off the phone
and I'd be bawling.

[Barbara] I wound up
one Saturday, just losing it.

And screamed bloody murder.

And all I could hear
in the distance

was my son crying out to me,
and I came to.

And that's when I decided
to go to the West Palm Beach
Mental Health Center.

I went to see a beautiful,
beautiful woman.

And when I told her my story,
she said,

"You're not crazy.
That's nothing but stress."

And I knew at that time
I was blessed.

That God let me live.

And gave me the right words
to think and say and do

during that horrible
time in my life.

You really never know until
you put in that situation
just how you would react.

But Barbara did exactly
what she had to do.

Because she knew she had
Dale and Beverly at home

that she had
to take care of them.

Barbara is one
of the strongest women I know.

And I'm blessed
to know Barbara

and have her as a friend
that she is.

Beverly couldn't talk
about the kidnapping
for several years.

And there were several times

when I wanted to move
after being kidnapped.

And then it dawned on me.

This was Mama's house.

And look at all the love.

And there are way
more good memories

in this house
than there are bad.

And so I decided to stay.

And I built a life here
for Beverly and Dale
and myself.

And then I fell in love
with Jim, the love of my life.

Oh, oh. Okay.
[indistinct] Ta-da.

-Did I tell you I love you?
-[laughs slightly]

My name is Jim Abel.

And Barbara and I have been
married for 43 years.

[Barbara] I met Jim in 1973.

But he was going overseas.

We decided to keep in touch.

And he became my friend
and was writing all that time.

You know, I started having
feelings for him really early.

But after everything happened,
and Paul John Knowles
was killed,

I wrote him a letter.

Telling him several months
later about the kidnapping.

[Jim] When I received
Barbara's letter,
it really hit me hard.

I knew that she probably
needed someone

and then the way
I felt about her anyway...

I was hoping that that person
would be me that could
help her through it.

We just had our
43rd anniversary.

So I guess
it's doing pretty good.

I definitely
admire her strength.

I don't know
how she got through
it and everything.

That's just the way
Barbara is. Very strong.

I don't think about
Paul John Knowles
at all anymore.

I don't need to.

I've written a book.
I've gotten everything
off my chest.

And I know
and there's only two choices.

You can choose to be a victim.

Or you can choose
to be a survivor.

I chose to be a survivor.

I am worth being
who I am today.

I am a somebody.

I am a survivor.

He brought me downstairs
and he put me inside the hole.

I was very loud.

They were in pain
and he was laughing.

He ordained himself as a bishop.

Everything began to smell
like death.

I may have lost my mind
in that basement.

I made a choice.

I risked my life
to save these girls.