Original subtitles

[crickets chirping]

Ties to a cult may have led to a fatal shooting

in Monroe County. A woman is now in custody

for shooting her boyfriend in the head.

[Tony] Stephen and Barbara met online

through the Sherry Shriner group.

They look like people,

but they can transform into a reptilian form.

Yeah.

Stephen was angry and wanted to die because

he got kicked out of that cult.

I felt like killing myself over this.

I felt like killing myself because of her.

This went down because Sherry Shriner manipulated

Steve Mineo and my ex-wife, Barbara.

That's what happened.

Five years before Stephen died,

there was another follower of...

Sherry Shriner's that had a tragic death.

Her name was Kelly Pingilley.

Sherry generated over $774,000

over a 10- year period.

♪ [electronic]

♪ [electronic]

[radio static]

We've been hearing a lot about a case that

happened in northeastern Pennsylvania over the weekend.

A 32-year-old...

A 32-year-old man was killed,

shot in the head...

According to the story from The Daily Wire,

after he allegedly made the request to die for the sake of

a bizarre belief in the reptilian nature

of his cult leader.

And so, we thought we would reach out to

the woman who is being called the cult leader,

this is Sherry Shriner with us on WILK.

- Hi, Sherry. - Hi, how you doing?

Doing well.

First of all, before we get into the specific incident...

Are you a cult, or not?

[Sherry] No, I'm not a cult. I'm just a Christian.

I love the lord. I serve the lord.

They want to make all Christians look bad and crazy,

call them a cult.

[Tony] Right after Stephen was killed,

Sherry Shriner was on a bunch of different radio shows.

And, I think that she thought this was her

big chance to really get her word out.

I think that she thought that

when Kelly killed herself as well.

I think that she sees these tragedies

as a way to improve her reach.

And, to prove that she was right all along.

[Host] According to Barbara Rogers,

Stephen thought that

you were actually a reptilian.

[Sherry] I know, I thought that was hilarious.

Interestingly, we called her a reptile,

so she's calling us, me back a reptile.

She is a practicing Wiccan witch, and there's

a lot of other things that gets involved with her.

This isn't her first time she's killed somebody and

that's why I hope the police investigate this.

Sherry was saying, "I know that she's killed four other people,"

you know, on, on the real radio.

Not on her made up little blog thing,

and the, the lady's like, "You can't say that for real.

None of that is true." [laughs]

[Host] You know, that...

You have to be careful when you say stuff like that.

[Sherry] I know. Well, they need to investigate her because

she has a past in Kentucky that's very well hidden.

And the men, two men missing...

anybody that can hold up a gun to some kid's head and

pull the trigger is not new at it.

♪

A Florida woman will face a trial on charges

she murdered her boyfriend last month,

in Monroe County.

42-year-old Barbara Rogers was in court for a

preliminary hearing this afternoon in Tobyhanna.

♪

When you tell somebody that their mother was involved in

a death, there's no easy way to say those things.

You sit down and you say what happened.

And there's a lot of crying, and there's a lot of hugging,

and there's a lot of being there for each other.

And I think that's where we were at.

What's going on with the fire, dude?

We were kind of kept in the dark.

No police ever talked to me.

You know, and I'd see something on YouTube or

something with the arraignment or whatever

and that was it.

That was, you know, local Poconos news.

You know, that's... that's what we had.

Rogers says Mineo asked her to kill him because

he had gotten threats from an online cult.

Rogers faces one count of criminal homicide,

which was sent on to a higher court this morning.

She remains in the Monroe County Prison without bail.

I was in contact with

Detective Bray at the beginning,

and he was asking me about my mother and,

you know, her mental illness and...

I was like, "Is she taking her medication?

Make sure that she's doing that."

And... he was like, "Well, this is..."

you know, "it's just not adding up."

He wasn't very nice about it.

He told me he was, like, you know,

dropped the death sentence phrase.

He was like, "Well, you know,

she might get the death penalty."

[Joel] Alena had to deal with a lot of stuff.

She had to deal with going to the crime scene and

picking up the things from their apartment.

[Alena] When I drove there... [sniffles]

You know, a week after the shooting,

I was just, like, looking around.

And of course, it had been, like,

tossed by the police, you know, looking for evidence.

And I think, I think Steve's family had gone in and

taken some items, you know.

[creaking]

The room smelled like her.

I could just, like, I could just like feel her,

like, lingering, and it was so weird.

Like, this is where she's been?

♪

The life that she had with Stephen...

studio apartment, guns,

violence, conspiracy... uncertainty.

I mean, the things that she, what kind of life is that?

And why is that life

better than the one she could have had with me?

♪

[Host] Have you ever seen a reptilian?

[Sherry] In person, no, no. [Host] Okay.

[Sherry] I've gotten phone calls with the hissing.

[laughing]

[Host] Who's that? I mean, do you have caller ID?

Do you know who they are?

[Sherry] Actually it's just a weird thing of numbers and

they call and they give me death threats and stuff.

When you take on Satan's kingdom,

it's going to come at you full force, and it has.

♪

It is difficult to conceive that

anybody in their right mind

could be a follower of Sherry Shriner where,

she's contending she was in heaven,

that she can tell alien reptiles from humans.

There's no part of it that makes sense.

And yet, it was a driving factor in this whole case.

In July of 2017, I was contacted by Barbara's family

and told about Barbara's situation,

and I was asked to represent Barbara.

Mr. Galloway and I were doing the criminal work together and,

we, we began to represent Barbara.

There's no question that, that there were people

saying that she was a reptile, and there's probably

no question that Stephen pushed back against that.

♪

First thing we did was drive up there and speak to Barbara.

♪

We met with her in the prison there and,

my first impression was how fragile she was.

♪

As I said to Jeff one day,

"She's like a frightened rabbit."

So, it was obvious that she was very, very nervous

and scared and, and rightly so.

She had serious mental health issues,

and I don't think there's...

any doubt about that.

[Jeff] Her involvement was an accident.

She never wanted the gun to go off.

And, the accident started and was precipitated by

Stephen's desire to take his own life.

We both thought that...

that that was a picture of somebody was not guilty and

we were gonna work at proving that.

Ah... period.

It's very unusual that we get that 9-1-1 call where

somebody confesses to a crime that they committed.

The impressions that we got were that Barbara

had actually pulled the trigger on Stephen Mineo.

♪

On surface, this looks like one of those cases

that looks fairly easy.

The fact that we already had a good suspect and

she was there, and our guys had her, was a good thing.

♪

So, when I arrive on scene, the first thing that I noted

was the big hole in the center of his forehead.

It's a, a star-like pattern that was around the hole.

Some of the most rudimentary police trainings,

they teach you that is a sign of a contact wound,

which means that that gun was right up against his forehead.

And it was in a position that is not typical

of a suicide-type shot.

It's more typical of someone else pulling the trigger.

And it gave the appearance that he was sitting there and,

and executed, looking up at the barrel of a gun.

I think they went down that path,

and that was the narrative that they spun,

that she intentionally killed him.

[Tony] I think the police saw it as an open and shut case.

And, I think it may have affected the way

that they proceeded.

The biggest thing that the police missed,

at first, was the...

cartridge was still in the chamber of the gun.

It didn't get expelled.

And so, they get to the crime scene, and...

there's no cartridge and

there's no blood on the shooter.

And so, they're like, "She clearly threw out

the cartridge, washed off the blood,

and then called us."

[Dick] I think it's awfully hard for detectives not to jump

to conclusions and work toward that conclusion.

[John] Now put your hands the other way.

But I think they concluded that she intended it,

and they weren't gonna be satisfied

with anything less than that.

[radio static]

[Sherry] The evidence, itself, speaks for itself.

You know, her first story coming out of Pennsylvania,

right over there, was that he was bullied and harassed

and he wanted her to kill him.

The whole story, "I'm just a frail little girl," and, and...

you know, it just falls apart.

[radio static]

[Host] ...but they said this woman, Barbara Rogers,

she originally was from Florida and somehow,

she came to the Poconos.

Do you know when these two...

two met, and what the nature of their relationship is,

as you understand it?

[Sherry] He met her online.

He didn't know her very long. And he started telling us

that he found the woman of his dreams.

♪

Sherry Shriner launched her Patreon the day that

Barbara's trial started.

It's still up and running.

I joined her Patreon for one month and...

you know, she was gonna provide this

exclusive insight to this...

to this murder.

[Sherry] She had several profiles on Facebook that

she was denying that was hers, that I knew was her.

I even had a crime scene detective, retired,

go through the two different profiles and state,

"This is the same person."

Now, why would you go to that length though, Sherry?

Why would you go to that length to find out who she was?

[Sherry] I love Steve, and I just could tell ya,

it's, it's a mother's instinct,

whatever you want to call it,

that this woman was no good. This girl was no good.

♪

A trial is underway for a Florida woman charged with

murdering her boyfriend in Monroe County.

Opening statements began this morning in the trial of

44-year-old Barbara Rogers.

Rogers says Mineo asked her to kill him because

he had gotten threats from an online cult.

[Tony] Once they started getting this kind of attention,

everything about Barbara's cas was viewed through

this prism of Sherry Shriner's reptile cult.

Even if it's just you're the type of person who believes

this crazy thing, who knows what you're capable of.

You go back to the scene, you have the victim laying

on the ground with a gunshot wound point blank to the

middle of his forehead, so close that there's burns

around the wound, there's the star pattern in his forehead.

Name's Andrew Kroeckel.

I'm an Assistant District Attorney,

here at the Monroe County District Attorney's office.

And in the prosecution of Barbara Rogers,

I was second chair.

I think it was a Saturday morning, I woke up

and there was, I was looking at articles,

and there was an article in The Daily Beast.

And I forwarded that to Mike Mancuso,

our first assistant, he handles all our homicides.

From that, he asked me if I wanted to help him with it.

[Producer] And, for you...

how many homicides had you worked on before this?

This was my first.

The prosecution wanted to show

that Barbara must have done this on purpose.

♪

And, they wanted to make sure that

they put her away for life.

[Andrew] We didn't know how much we wanted to

make the cult part of the case.

We couldn't ignore it, but you don't want to overwhelm

the jury with it or distract them with it.

'Cause again, you know, it's not funny.

Someone's, someone was murdered.

You know, like...

when you put a gun to someone's forehead

in a position like this...

You know, that's, that's murder.

♪

[gun shots]

My name is Emanuel Kapelsohn.

I'm a firearms, ballistics, and use of force expert.

And I worked as an expert witness on behalf of

Barbara Rogers in the homicide trial.

♪

[gunshot & shell clattering onto floor]

♪

In this case, I went to the police department

that was holding the evidence.

I looked at the gun, the magazine...

looked at the autopsy report and photographs.

Looked at the scene photographs,

scene diagrams for the purpose of seeing

whether I could offer an opinion

about whether Barbara Rogers' version

of the events was probable.

So, this simulates Barbara Rogers holding

the pistol with her finger on the trigger,

the deceased putting his hands over hers,

pulling the trigger...

And now I'm gonna take the gun away to show

that firing in this way

leaves the empty shell casing in the chamber,

just as it was in Barbara Rogers' case.

So, I formed an opinion...

that this shot was fired with the muzzle

in contact with the deceased's forehead,

and that if the gun was held at all by Barbara Rogers,

it was held by her with the deceased's own hands

over her hands.

Pushed the muzzle against his own forehead,

put his own finger or fingers over her trigger finger,

and pressed her finger against the trigger.

So, in effect, he fired the gun into his own skull.

And that would account for the contact wound to the forehead,

and possibly the shell casing

still being left in the pistol's chamber.

♪

Although this case was only a few years ago,

it stands out in my memory as one of the more unusual cases...

with cults, with aliens,

with the details of the situation.

Mr. Kapelsohn was our key witness.

I think he confirmed Barbara's version of events.

And even demonstrated Barbara's version of events

to the jury.

Our gun expert from the state police just explained

that gun gets out-of-battery, if it's,

too much pressure's put on it,

and it makes sense that it would be right,

you know, the loose contact or light contact.

As respected as Manny is and

as much as he knows about Glocks,

I don't know that the jury was necessarily

taken with their demonstration.

It's not the way it happened, so...

[Radio Host] Do you believe that there is...

an underworld of reptilians

who are infiltrating high levels of power,

including Hollywood and also politics, right?

[Sherry] Oh, sure. I've been posting

YouTube videos on my sites for years.

You can go to YouTube and type in

"reptilian shapeshifter" or "celebrity shapeshifters,

celebrity vampires".

I mean, it's just all coming out.

They can't hide it anymore.

With the merging of the dimensions,

people are beginning to see these beings exist in people,

they're shapeshifting, they're morphing.

Sherry, to most people who don't really think like this,

this all sounds pretty crazy.

[Sherry] Well, you know, when you learn it as you go,

'cause that's what I've had to do 'cause I didn't

grow up in this kind of stuff, it all makes sense.

You know, I'm calling a spade a spade.

I've been exposing this stuff for 20 years.

So, who's the crazy one?

♪

What about Sherry is worth following?

What about Sherry is worth listening to?

And the answer's nothing!

She is just some crank sitting in her office,

spewing garbage on the internet.

Beginning, middle, and end.

♪

Day two of a trial for a Florida woman charged with

murdering her boyfriend in Monroe County.

44-year-old Barbara Rogers walked into the court room

today for the second day of trial.

The jury was played an interrogation video showing

Rogers speaking to police officers.

What really stands out to me about her condition

during that statement was just the fatigue.

The interrogation went on for over 6 hours...

And she was, obviously, was so fatigued and so sad,

and so confused, which is very consistent

with somebody being through a traumatic event.

[Tony] Barbara was useless as a witness.

The police ask her for her story and,

she tells it, poorly, several times.

I know you went through a traumatic event tonight and

I want to talk to you a little bit about that.

You're not under arrest, okay.

You're in a police station.

The Pocono Regional Police, they're...

you wouldn't necessarily think it 'cause it's kind of rural

up there, it's, you know, there's a lot of trees,

and woods, and all that sort of stuff, but they're...

they're very good. They're a very--

their detectives have always been very good.

I know that you, you had your hands on the gun

when it went off today, right?

[Barbara] I did. He put my hands there, he goes,

"Here, put them here." And then, it's like...

he just goes, "I want you to shoot it."

He's just put my hands on it and said,

"I want you to shoot it at me."

He said, "Point it at me."

He goes, "Here you go, take this into your hands.

I want you to point this at me."

The police thought that Stephen didn't have

his hands on the gun,

he couldn't have had his hands on the gun.

Just the little bit that I saw at the scene,

it doesn't look like his hands were on the gun

when it went off.

So, can you explain that to me again?

The defense case hung almost exclusively on

the testimony of Emanuel Kapelsohn.

What the Glock expert was able to show was that

Stephen's hands were likely on the gun.

I think that if the cops had known...

they may have gone about their interrogation differently.

You told 9-1-1 that you both had your hands on that,

on the gun, and we know that that's not the truth now either,

that you had the gun in your hand all by--

Do you remember what you told 9-1-1?

I listened to it.

That's another reason why I'm having a whole bunch of

problems sitting here swallowing what you're telling us.

[Barbara] Ah, well...

we both had our hands on the gun, you know.

I, I didn't want to hold it.

I was reluctant to even grab it, but...

you know, he put it in my hands.

It's fascinating when the detective finally gets her

to admit that there was no way his hands

could have been on the gun.

Well, he handed it to me.

Okay, so he hands you the gun?

Now you have the gun in your hand?

Yes.

Seeing him push her, and push her, and push her

until she says, "Yeah, his hands weren't on the gun."

He's not touching it anymore, right?

Um... no, his hands were off of it.

Okay, so, the only person whose hands are on the gun

are yours, at this point, right?

Yes.

She changed her story so many times because

they insisted that she do that.

They weren't happy with her story.

He asked me to point it at him.

No, that, we already went over that.

That's, that's not what happened,

'cause you told me, we specifically talked about that.

You said he asked you to point at something.

He asked you to point the gun,

but not at himself.

He could have said, "Point it beside me," or,

"Point it beside my head."

They were just guessing. She was saying nonsense,

and they were guessing at what could have happened,

and sometimes she said yes and sometimes she said no.

And if they guessed the same things a couple times,

she'd say yes to keep them from guessing it anymore.

I think it was pressed against his forehead,

I think you pulled it on purpose.

In fact, I know that you pulled it on purpose.

I don't think that when, like,

you were planning this.

I don't think this is something that you

necessarily planned in doing,

but I think that's exactly what happened, correct?

It might-- Yes, that... that could be right, yeah.

What she told them was not satisfactory to them,

and they just kept going after her,

and going after her, and going after her.

That's nonsense.

There was no coercion at all.

The way Detective Bohrman conducts that interview is...

It was mind blowing for me, of how...

the opposite of what you see on TV he was.

It's not like...

you know, trying to hammer them,

"You tell me the truth right now," it's just,

"Let's have a conversation about what happened."

♪

When you're dealing with a woman who's in these

circumstances with this background, etc.,

and you keep it going 6 and a 1/2 hours because...

accident keeps coming up, and coming up,

and coming up, and coming up,

and you're not happy with that...

you're gonna wear somebody down.

I don't care who it is.

You're not being truthful. You're not.

And so, that bothers me.

I, I, I...

You just killed this guy who you tell us you, you love, right?

You're in love with him? Were you in love with him?

- Yes! I love him! - You just killed him.

You just killed him. You took his life.

And you're, matter of fact, sitting there trying to

come up with a story that makes you look better.

There's no way to make you look better here.

You did what you did. The only thing you can do is

to clear your conscience and be truthful about it.

Oh, god, I would never kill him.

But you did kill him.

She tried to tell them every way from Sunday that this

was an accident, and I asked the jury when they listened,

how many times she would say the word "accident"?

And it was 24. She told them 24 times

that this was an accident, and they...

they simply refused to believe it.

I picked it up and I just squeezed it.

[Bohrman] On purpose. [Barbara] [Sighs]

[Barbara] Yes, it was on purpose.

If the question is, "Is it coerced?"

Of course it is.

When you're Barbara Rogers and you're as fragile

as an eggshell, it's really a disaster.

♪

How does prison impact your Bipolar Disorder?

[birds chirping]

I couldn't ask my mom over the phone,

"Tell me what happened," you know,

the truth, just because...

She could have incriminated herself, you know.

I went to the trial.

I knew that she would need some help and some support

and, I just really wanted to find out what happened.

♪

Find out the truth, you know.

♪

We called some of Barbara's family.

I thought it was important for the jury to know

a little bit more about Barbara.

That was a difficult situation.

I thought I was just going up there to defend her character.

And they specifically asked me,

"Does she know how to fire a 9 mm pistol?"

And I said, "Absolutely not."

They claimed at trial that

she'd never been trained on handguns.

I don't know if that's true or not.

It seems unlikely...

to spend 8 years in the military, they don't

ever teach you anything about handguns.

[whistle blows]

The fact that she had, you know,

she demonstrated that shooting stance,

I know I keep going back to that, but it,

it was important to us 'cause how would she know to do that?

Hand it...

And it's a proper stance, not something she just made up.

So, for her to do that, to know to do that...

it seemed like she had to have had some idea of

what she was doing.

It's just not true. It's absolutely false.

She had fired a rifle because she had to qualify with a rifle.

She had never fired pistols in the service.

She had never fired this pistol.

My secretary has as much ability with

a firearm as Barbara does.

[Sherry] First of all, she used her military issue .45 Glock.

She was in the military,

she retired from the military, I believe.

Or she got out early on a pension.

She had no problem shooting 'em.

She pointed it right to his head and blew his head off.

At one point, Sherry Shriner

told Steve that she was a super soldier

and that she had been trained by the military

to destroy him.

[Joel] A super soldier? She was a supply clerk.

She barely qualified with her weapon at the range.

There was no super soldier in her.

She was Barbara, mother of three, you know.

Her job was to work in the logistics and,

and running the army, and she did well at that,

but for the mental health problems that developed

when she was stationed in Germany.

♪

I knew that she was mentally ill,

and I knew that this was a big problem,

and I knew she needed help.

And at that point, all I could do was pray for her.

We found out that she was discharged from the military

for mental health reasons and that she'd

attempted to kill herself.

Do you take medicine for your bipolar?

Have you taken it regularly?

Are you up to date on your medicine?

I, I think I, sometimes I skip a few days, but yeah...

- [knocking] - Come on in.

[Joel] In the trial, we got to hear the time where

her interrogators left the room.

And we got to hear her talk, a lot.

And that is the one thing that makes me understand

that she's innocent, and that she didn't

maliciously murder Stephen.

We called them "The Whisperings" 'cause

she was just, just whispering to herself,

which you couldn't, you couldn't make out most of it.

It was like she was trying to convince herself that she

didn't do it or that she did it because her wanted her to.

One of the things she said is,

"Please, God, bring him back.

If you bring hm back, I'll quit drinking."

And that just blew my mind.

It's just how out of touch with consequences...

You see the mental health problem she has

when you watch that.

We thought the jury should be entitled to know

that she had bipolar disorder,

which would reduce her culpability in this case.

We confirmed Barbara's diagnosis of bipolar disorder,

and the bipolar disorder was the same disorder that

she was honorably discharged from, from the military.

The judge ruled that we could not put that into evidence

unless we were willing to concede that

she was guilty of at least 3rd degree.

We could not and did not do that.

♪

Has law enforcement contacted you from Pennsylvania yet?

[Sherry] No, nm-nm.

[Host] It's interesting, isn't it?

[Sherry] I haven't talked to anybody. They have the script.

They want to go with the script that Sherry Shriner's

a reptile and she's a cult and we're gonna blame it on her.

They've done this before. This is round two for me.

We didn't know if Sherry would be a witness to

actually testify in trial, but...

decided we probably should talk to Sherry,

try to get as much background on at least the

dispute that people were having with Stephen and

Barbara online, just to get an idea of how much that

might have contributed to him being stressed out or...

any tensions between him and Barbara,

those sorts of things.

'Cause the jury wants to hear motive.

I think we all want to know why things happen.

And that's one of the things we wanted to talk

to Sherry Shriner about.

She might have been able to fill those gaps in.

More information, the better...

usually is the case for us.

Her email address was pretty easy to find

on one of her websites.

I emailed her, expecting to never hear from her.

She emailed, emailed me back I think the same day.

I don't care what she said. I don't care if she said

she was an eye witness to the shooting.

She's eminently attackable.

I mean, she said the killing was proof that

Barbara was in fact an alien reptile.

And honestly, the prison, I think,

would have discovered if she was a reptile.

We set up a meeting to meet her in Youngstown,

which is not terribly far away from where she lived.

And then, she just kind of went silent.

So, filling in the gap of motive was important to us.

There was absolutely no motive.

There was no greed, there was no jealousy,

there was no abuse. There was nothing.

There was nothing in the history of this couple that

had a motive of any way, shape, or form.

It made sense to me that she would end this relationship,

somehow, and then just leave.

She ended up not doing that, but...

not leaving, but she ended the relationship.

What they tried to do during the course of the trial...

was that Barbara was tired of him,

she wanted to discard him, and that simply wasn't true.

There was no evidence of that,

but they wanted the jury to make that leap.

Really, one person woke up that day wanting to kill somebody,

and it was Stephen Mineo wanting to kill himself.

He was a 14-year follower of Sherry Shriner who,

I was shocked to hear, that she had

not 4 followers or 27 followers...

but 5,000 people bought into that crap.

And Stephen Mineo was a huge follower of hers.

And it wasn't just that he suddenly wasn't in the cult.

It was him against 5,000, and that's the reason

he was distraught by the whole thing.

That woman really fucked my head up.

The mental torture she gives people...

Dude, I had suicidal thoughts!

I felt like killing myself because of her.

[News] Prosecution and defense presented

their closing arguments in the case.

A judge is expected to give jurors their final

instructions in the case tomorrow morning.

We were shocked that the judge ruled accident

out of the case.

We're trying to show accident,

they're trying to show it's not accident,

and then the jury doesn't get to pass on that.

To not give the jury the option of an accident was

very disappointing and, unfair, I think, to Barbara.

Well, we begin tonight with a murder sentence

handed down in Monroe County Court.

Today, Barbara Rogers was sentenced to

15 to 40 years behind bars.

She claims the murder was tied to an alien cult.

The verdict of the jury was that Barbara was guilty of,

of 3rd degree murder.

And Barbara received a sentence of 15 to

40 years incarceration.

[News] The defense asked for a more lenient sentence,

as Rogers is a mother of three with no prior

criminal history and military service.

We had hoped that the judge would take that into

consideration and give her a sentence that was closer to

the bottom end of the standard range,

as opposed to the top end.

The sentence is... awfully high.

If we'd have gotten the ruling that we expected on

involuntary manslaughter, the most that could have

happened to Barbara was two and a half to five years.

She's already been in jail three years.

[News] Prosecutors asked for the maximum sentence

of 20 to 40 years.

We would have liked to have seen her get more,

but we understand why the judge did what she did.

What happened to my son is permanent.

Her sentence should have been permanent.

It was totally unfair.

I don't believe anybody's benefiting from Barbara

being incarcerated for the amount of time that

she was sentenced.

She's not a danger to anybody and

does not deserve to be in prison.

[Joel] As far as I'm concerned, the worst she should have gotten

was a manslaughter charge.

But really, what she should have got was

innocent because of insanity.

How I feel about her as a murderer is...

something I can hardly even touch on, you know.

♪

That's insane to me.

♪

Now she's gone!

And it's not... she's gone now.

Now it's over. There isn't any hope.

♪

Do you regret what you did?

I was not in control of the situation that happened.

I was not the dominating party in that situation.

[Tony] Putting Barbara away for 15 to 40 years,

I guess it satisfies our sense that someone

did something and got blamed for it.

But it doesn't begin to address...

the damage that Sherry did.

And that's really unsatisfying.

[Jeff] I think Stephen Mineo is,

is most responsible for his death.

And I think Sherry Shriner had a part in it.

[Dick] If Sherry Shriner had never existed and he had

not gotten into that cult, probably none of this

would have happened.

Can I say that this would have happened without the cult?

No. I don't know.

But I don't think it helped.

[Tony] I think that these are just two lost souls,

frankly, you know.

They were never capable of dealing with adult life,

and they certainly weren't capable of

dealing with Sherry Shriner.

♪

The online world is very different from real life.

Facebook created this echo chamber that allowed Sherry

to grow faster than she might have otherwise expected.

The more people that watch, the more eyeballs on the screen,

the more ads that get consumed,

the more money YouTube makes.

You know, you want to get a sense whether

she really believed what she said.

I feel like if I got to talk to her, I'd at least know.

I feel like somebody has their hands around my throat.

[coughs] Not much time left.