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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:25,108 --> 00:00:28,152 Crouch could very easily be suspect in other cases. 2 00:00:28,153 --> 00:00:30,071 This looks like he slipped through the cracks. 3 00:00:30,072 --> 00:00:32,865 And on a side note, I got a phone call yesterday that 4 00:00:32,866 --> 00:00:35,368 Travis Crouch is getting paroled. 5 00:00:35,369 --> 00:00:37,703 His hearing is today. 6 00:00:37,704 --> 00:00:42,667 We had our next cold case meeting scheduled already. 7 00:00:42,668 --> 00:00:46,212 We find out, going into that meeting, 8 00:00:46,213 --> 00:00:49,590 that Travis is actually set for his parole hearing 9 00:00:49,591 --> 00:00:53,594 the Thursday of that week, his first time eligible for parole. 10 00:00:53,595 --> 00:00:55,012 So, of course, we're following that closely 11 00:00:55,013 --> 00:00:57,932 because he's a strong person of interest 12 00:00:57,933 --> 00:00:59,558 at minimum at this point. 13 00:00:59,559 --> 00:01:04,021 Ideally, we'd like to interview him in custody 14 00:01:04,022 --> 00:01:05,314 where he's not a risk to the public. 15 00:01:05,315 --> 00:01:07,400 And if he's getting out in October, 16 00:01:07,401 --> 00:01:10,695 then that really puts us at a pace we don't want to be at. 17 00:01:10,696 --> 00:01:15,950 We'd like to slow roll and have all the resources in place. 18 00:01:15,951 --> 00:01:17,577 And if I read his documents right, 19 00:01:17,578 --> 00:01:20,037 his parole release date would be in October. 20 00:01:20,038 --> 00:01:24,667 So if he did get granted, we're on a two-month clock. 21 00:01:24,668 --> 00:01:28,713 If he didn't, he did tell me he could reapply in a year. 22 00:01:28,714 --> 00:01:31,716 So we're on a one-year clock if he got denied. 23 00:01:37,806 --> 00:01:42,351 Detective Marion comes in and says 24 00:01:42,352 --> 00:01:44,770 he knows that I've been tasked with 25 00:01:44,771 --> 00:01:46,522 the Travis Crouch side of things. 26 00:01:46,523 --> 00:01:49,400 And he says, received a phone call that Travis's victim 27 00:01:49,401 --> 00:01:51,235 would like to talk to us. 28 00:01:51,236 --> 00:01:52,486 I didn't know... 29 00:01:52,487 --> 00:01:56,866 I mean, I saw Marion tell you about that call. 30 00:01:56,867 --> 00:01:59,535 And so... 31 00:01:59,536 --> 00:02:02,580 I did... I mean, when did she call him? 32 00:02:02,581 --> 00:02:03,873 Yesterday. 33 00:02:03,874 --> 00:02:06,292 And do we know what prompted that? 34 00:02:06,293 --> 00:02:08,794 My assumption would be the parole hearing. 35 00:02:08,795 --> 00:02:10,212 - But no, I don't know. - OK. 36 00:02:10,213 --> 00:02:11,756 He hadn't spoken to her. 37 00:02:11,757 --> 00:02:17,011 And so, for sure, it's the victim of Travis Crouch, 38 00:02:17,012 --> 00:02:19,472 who he's convicted on in Colorado. 39 00:02:19,473 --> 00:02:21,349 That's what I've been led to believe. 40 00:02:21,350 --> 00:02:25,436 Special Agent Allen and I did make a phone call to her. 41 00:02:25,437 --> 00:02:27,229 It's been 26 years. 42 00:02:27,230 --> 00:02:29,857 And she is... she's struggled to talk about it, 43 00:02:29,858 --> 00:02:31,567 and we didn't force it. 44 00:02:31,568 --> 00:02:34,111 We're not going to... we have records we can go back to. 45 00:02:34,112 --> 00:02:37,573 So we don't need to make her relive all that. 46 00:02:37,574 --> 00:02:40,993 She had testified in the parole hearing one way or another, 47 00:02:40,994 --> 00:02:43,871 but that wound had been opened for the first time in... 48 00:02:43,872 --> 00:02:45,539 since that trial was over. 49 00:02:45,540 --> 00:02:48,209 So she had been through a rough couple of days, 50 00:02:48,210 --> 00:02:49,210 to say the least. 51 00:02:49,211 --> 00:02:51,128 But we did speak to her. 52 00:02:51,129 --> 00:02:53,464 Fortunately, she was strong. 53 00:02:53,465 --> 00:02:58,386 His victim fought this parole, and it was denied. 54 00:03:04,059 --> 00:03:06,894 He'll be in Colorado prison for at least another year. 55 00:03:06,895 --> 00:03:11,107 He'll be eligible for another parole hearing in a year, 56 00:03:11,108 --> 00:03:12,733 and we'll see what happens. 57 00:03:12,734 --> 00:03:16,404 But the timing was wild that the day of that meeting, 58 00:03:16,405 --> 00:03:18,906 we found out, he's going to have a parole hearing 59 00:03:18,907 --> 00:03:20,116 two days later. 60 00:03:20,117 --> 00:03:21,826 But we were on a pretty tight clock 61 00:03:21,827 --> 00:03:24,620 if his parole had been released, and worse than that, 62 00:03:24,621 --> 00:03:26,247 he would be back on the streets. 63 00:03:26,248 --> 00:03:28,499 You know, maybe he was reformed in prison, 64 00:03:28,500 --> 00:03:29,834 but we don't know that. 65 00:03:29,835 --> 00:03:32,628 And the data that we do have on him 66 00:03:32,629 --> 00:03:34,463 +is that he was very violent. 67 00:03:34,464 --> 00:03:37,049 And I'm not sitting here saying, 68 00:03:37,050 --> 00:03:38,342 for sure, that he did it. 69 00:03:38,343 --> 00:03:39,677 He's a really good suspect, though. 70 00:03:39,678 --> 00:03:42,096 And our job is to either rule him out 71 00:03:42,097 --> 00:03:45,349 or prove that it was him. 72 00:05:28,787 --> 00:05:30,913 So we know Melissa was hit in the head. 73 00:05:30,914 --> 00:05:34,083 The medical examiner said it was something that was... 74 00:05:34,084 --> 00:05:36,377 could render her unconscious, 75 00:05:36,378 --> 00:05:38,337 but it was not enough of a blow 76 00:05:38,338 --> 00:05:40,381 that could be the cause of death. 77 00:05:40,382 --> 00:05:43,050 So that tells me, about the crime scene, 78 00:05:43,051 --> 00:05:45,594 that she was struck and then, I believe, 79 00:05:45,595 --> 00:05:47,388 carried through the parking lot. 80 00:05:47,389 --> 00:05:50,599 And that's why the blood spots are so spread out. 81 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:53,769 But the longer she was carried to the parking lot, 82 00:05:53,770 --> 00:05:57,189 you get the larger blood spots towards the, uh... 83 00:05:57,190 --> 00:05:59,775 towards the back of the parking lot. 84 00:05:59,776 --> 00:06:01,735 The way the attack happened... this could have been 85 00:06:01,736 --> 00:06:04,613 a random person sitting in the parking lot 86 00:06:04,614 --> 00:06:06,907 that saw her and, you know, acted immediately. 87 00:06:06,908 --> 00:06:10,035 This could have been someone that she knew 88 00:06:10,036 --> 00:06:11,662 and had an argument with. 89 00:06:11,663 --> 00:06:14,582 We know that there was a man and a woman in the parking lot 90 00:06:14,583 --> 00:06:17,710 and a verbal disagreement that caused alarm 91 00:06:17,711 --> 00:06:19,753 to the 11-year-old that went outside. 92 00:06:19,754 --> 00:06:21,922 So if I was to speculate, 93 00:06:21,923 --> 00:06:24,967 I would say that Melissa got into an argument with someone 94 00:06:24,968 --> 00:06:26,468 that she knew. 95 00:06:26,469 --> 00:06:28,971 And she turned to go towards the bowling alley, 96 00:06:28,972 --> 00:06:31,515 and she was hit in the head. 97 00:06:31,516 --> 00:06:32,975 So during the investigation, 98 00:06:32,976 --> 00:06:37,605 detectives go to Missy's home. 99 00:06:37,606 --> 00:06:39,231 And when they're at their home, 100 00:06:39,232 --> 00:06:41,358 they're going to collect items that may help with the case. 101 00:06:41,359 --> 00:06:45,446 One item that detectives did take was a diary. 102 00:06:45,447 --> 00:06:48,490 The last entry was a week or two before 103 00:06:48,491 --> 00:06:50,075 she had actually went missing. 104 00:06:50,076 --> 00:06:53,662 Inside the diary, you know, she laid out just about everything 105 00:06:53,663 --> 00:06:57,916 she... her friends, every activity she had done. 106 00:06:57,917 --> 00:07:01,045 And Melissa seemed like she was a very outgoing person. 107 00:07:01,046 --> 00:07:04,548 There was nothing to indicate any kind of 108 00:07:04,549 --> 00:07:08,218 drug activity or alcohol activity, anything like that. 109 00:07:08,219 --> 00:07:10,429 She just seemed like she was a... 110 00:07:10,430 --> 00:07:12,389 just a very young... 111 00:07:12,390 --> 00:07:16,268 I'd say love-stricken teenager. 112 00:07:16,269 --> 00:07:18,979 Looking at some of the people in the investigation, 113 00:07:18,980 --> 00:07:23,817 such as Charles Ray Vines, Travis Crouch, 114 00:07:23,818 --> 00:07:27,029 their MOs were outliers. 115 00:07:27,030 --> 00:07:28,530 They were different. 116 00:07:28,531 --> 00:07:32,868 You start looking at, who knew Missy? 117 00:07:32,869 --> 00:07:35,913 Statistics show that something like this 118 00:07:35,914 --> 00:07:37,373 is going to be most likely someone 119 00:07:37,374 --> 00:07:39,166 that she was associated with. 120 00:07:49,511 --> 00:07:53,430 Any type of case you work, the victim's statement is 121 00:07:53,431 --> 00:07:55,057 the best thing that you have. 122 00:07:55,058 --> 00:07:57,101 I mean, what they experienced, how they experienced it. 123 00:07:57,102 --> 00:08:00,104 And that was exactly what finding the diary was like. 124 00:08:00,105 --> 00:08:03,357 You have her day-to-day life in her own words. 125 00:08:03,358 --> 00:08:07,403 She references boyfriends, friends, going to parties, 126 00:08:07,404 --> 00:08:10,739 people that have said ill things about her, 127 00:08:10,740 --> 00:08:12,199 people she doesn't like. 128 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:14,326 Melissa was very meticulous in the way 129 00:08:14,327 --> 00:08:17,079 that she wrote things and described things. 130 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,874 I mean, you could almost feel her excitement in her words. 131 00:08:20,875 --> 00:08:24,670 As we're searching all the documents, what was done, 132 00:08:24,671 --> 00:08:26,964 what do we want to do, what do we still need to do. 133 00:08:32,887 --> 00:08:34,930 We know Missy was bleeding 134 00:08:34,931 --> 00:08:36,265 in the parking lot of Bowling World. 135 00:08:36,266 --> 00:08:37,599 We found blood. 136 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:39,518 So we assume that the bleeding will 137 00:08:39,519 --> 00:08:42,646 continue on into the vehicle she was placed in. 138 00:08:42,647 --> 00:08:44,398 As the investigation is ongoing, 139 00:08:44,399 --> 00:08:46,984 you know, multiple vehicles are being searched. 140 00:08:46,985 --> 00:08:48,527 Trying to rule people out. 141 00:08:48,528 --> 00:08:49,862 If you do find blood, then we're going 142 00:08:49,863 --> 00:08:51,613 to want to have it analyzed. 143 00:08:51,614 --> 00:08:56,160 So that's something that we are, you know, hoping to find, 144 00:08:56,161 --> 00:08:58,203 rule out, look at. 145 00:08:58,204 --> 00:09:01,248 As part of the investigation, we look at phone records. 146 00:09:01,249 --> 00:09:04,710 So we pull up the phone records for her house. 147 00:09:04,711 --> 00:09:08,255 We look at the phone number and the date and time, 148 00:09:08,256 --> 00:09:10,632 and then we go and look at the diary. 149 00:09:10,633 --> 00:09:16,388 And surely, you know, right there is a document 150 00:09:16,389 --> 00:09:18,390 in Missy's own words 151 00:09:18,391 --> 00:09:20,142 about what was discussed on the phone call, 152 00:09:20,143 --> 00:09:23,687 how she felt about the phone call, who she spoke with. 153 00:09:23,688 --> 00:09:27,441 So it's basically Missy talking to us. 154 00:09:27,442 --> 00:09:31,779 And, you know, we got the date and time of the phone call, 155 00:09:31,780 --> 00:09:36,366 and then we have how Missy felt about that phone call 156 00:09:36,367 --> 00:09:38,577 and what she wanted to tell us. 157 00:09:38,578 --> 00:09:40,579 So it's real nice to have that, 158 00:09:40,580 --> 00:09:42,623 where we can make that connection. 159 00:09:42,624 --> 00:09:44,833 This is who she spoke to, 160 00:09:44,834 --> 00:09:47,252 and this is how the conversation went. 161 00:09:47,253 --> 00:09:50,172 My goal at that point is to find out as much as I can, 162 00:09:50,173 --> 00:09:53,342 try to interview friends, family, just to build a profile 163 00:09:53,343 --> 00:09:55,385 and see what other people's interactions, 164 00:09:55,386 --> 00:09:57,805 other relationships, what those were like. 165 00:10:24,541 --> 00:10:27,543 Baker, you got some updates on Crouch on CODIS? 166 00:10:27,544 --> 00:10:29,211 Yeah. Yeah. 167 00:10:29,212 --> 00:10:31,338 We'd noticed in his IIIs that there was an entry that said, 168 00:10:31,339 --> 00:10:32,589 no CODIS entry made. 169 00:10:32,590 --> 00:10:33,966 Collect DNA. 170 00:10:33,967 --> 00:10:36,510 So that was a little alarming. 171 00:10:36,511 --> 00:10:38,637 Contacted the Colorado Bureau of Investigation, 172 00:10:38,638 --> 00:10:41,515 and they said, on their end, yes, there is one, 173 00:10:41,516 --> 00:10:43,934 and it's constantly being searched. 174 00:10:43,935 --> 00:10:46,353 I still wasn't real comfortable with that, given the IIIs. 175 00:10:46,354 --> 00:10:48,438 So Arkansas State crime lab... 176 00:10:48,439 --> 00:10:51,275 Miranda Crawford's also checking that. 177 00:10:51,276 --> 00:10:54,403 She said in her findings, the same thing. 178 00:10:54,404 --> 00:10:56,238 She's going to go a little more in depth 179 00:10:56,239 --> 00:10:58,532 into the cigarette butt and the evidence that they're aware of 180 00:10:58,533 --> 00:11:01,326 and the partial off the cigarette butt up there, 181 00:11:01,327 --> 00:11:03,912 and see if... she said there's been no hit on it. 182 00:11:03,913 --> 00:11:05,497 But she's going to make sure it's 183 00:11:05,498 --> 00:11:08,584 being processed in such a way that if it's there, 184 00:11:08,585 --> 00:11:10,711 they'll find it, so... 185 00:11:10,712 --> 00:11:12,963 The family... his family said 186 00:11:12,964 --> 00:11:16,341 he... he was not in the area in this time. 187 00:11:16,342 --> 00:11:19,595 There's a lady named Glenda who lives in that area. 188 00:11:19,596 --> 00:11:22,222 And she came forward and said he absolutely 189 00:11:22,223 --> 00:11:24,057 was in this area at that time. 190 00:11:24,058 --> 00:11:25,767 She remembered, for sure, that it was Travis. 191 00:11:25,768 --> 00:11:28,437 She remembered for sure that Travis was in his mama's car. 192 00:11:28,438 --> 00:11:32,232 And it would have been six to eight weeks after Labor Day, 193 00:11:32,233 --> 00:11:37,029 putting us somewhere in November that Travis 194 00:11:37,030 --> 00:11:39,489 was absolutely in this area. 195 00:11:39,490 --> 00:11:42,951 Miss Glenda is still locked in on that. 196 00:11:42,952 --> 00:11:47,706 She is in a difficult position because she is still very good 197 00:11:47,707 --> 00:11:51,043 friends with Travis's parents. 198 00:11:51,044 --> 00:11:54,129 She said maybe they just misremember the dates. 199 00:11:54,130 --> 00:11:57,466 She doesn't think they're doing it intentionally. 200 00:11:57,467 --> 00:12:00,052 She made an interesting comment to us. 201 00:12:00,053 --> 00:12:01,929 Because as soon as we walked in, she said, 202 00:12:01,930 --> 00:12:03,889 you're here about Melissa and Travis, aren't you? 203 00:12:03,890 --> 00:12:06,141 And we said, yeah. We want to visit with you. 204 00:12:06,142 --> 00:12:08,852 She said, well, I can tell you this. 205 00:12:08,853 --> 00:12:10,437 Travis didn't kill her. 206 00:12:10,438 --> 00:12:11,730 Travis wasn't a killer. 207 00:12:11,731 --> 00:12:13,690 He was only a rapist. 208 00:12:13,691 --> 00:12:15,734 So we just kind of filed that back, 209 00:12:15,735 --> 00:12:18,570 knowing the behavioral patterns of serial rapist 210 00:12:18,571 --> 00:12:21,114 and the affinity for violence. 211 00:12:21,115 --> 00:12:23,867 So we didn't dig into that with Ms. Glenda. 212 00:12:23,868 --> 00:12:26,161 I wasn't trying to run his name into the dirt with her. 213 00:12:26,162 --> 00:12:28,956 I just wanted to corroborate with her 214 00:12:28,957 --> 00:12:32,960 that he was in this area in that general timeframe. 215 00:12:32,961 --> 00:12:34,670 And we were able to. 216 00:12:34,671 --> 00:12:40,300 His ex-wife stated that every time he got out of jail, 217 00:12:40,301 --> 00:12:42,094 he always went back to his dad's. 218 00:12:42,095 --> 00:12:45,263 We know, for sure, New Orleans PD ran him in NCIC 219 00:12:45,264 --> 00:12:46,890 on January 3 of '95. 220 00:12:46,891 --> 00:12:49,643 So we've got a firmly established line. 221 00:12:49,644 --> 00:12:51,269 We've got a north-to-south travel line 222 00:12:51,270 --> 00:12:54,439 from Minneapolis to New Orleans that logically 223 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:57,359 would include our area. 224 00:12:57,360 --> 00:12:59,569 If Travis Crouch is the suspect, 225 00:12:59,570 --> 00:13:02,239 whatever vehicle he used to transport 226 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:04,408 Melissa will have blood in it because 227 00:13:04,409 --> 00:13:06,034 we know it was a bloody scene. 228 00:13:06,035 --> 00:13:07,869 We know that when she got in that car, 229 00:13:07,870 --> 00:13:09,329 she didn't suddenly stop bleeding. 230 00:13:09,330 --> 00:13:13,542 So if we can ever find a vehicle 231 00:13:13,543 --> 00:13:18,714 that has her blood, especially if it's connected to him... 232 00:13:18,715 --> 00:13:21,466 but even if it's one of these other gentlemen... 233 00:13:21,467 --> 00:13:24,678 these other men that we're looking at... 234 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:26,513 then that's rock-solid evidence 235 00:13:26,514 --> 00:13:27,848 that she was in that car. 236 00:13:27,849 --> 00:13:29,433 But I think it's worth our while 237 00:13:29,434 --> 00:13:31,643 to look into the other cars, see if we can find 238 00:13:31,644 --> 00:13:33,186 some other vehicles, belong to the family, 239 00:13:33,187 --> 00:13:37,357 see if we can track them down and perhaps run those as well. 240 00:13:37,358 --> 00:13:41,112 And maybe he was driving something different that day. 241 00:13:43,573 --> 00:13:45,198 You know, you have this 242 00:13:45,199 --> 00:13:47,034 beautiful young woman that 243 00:13:47,035 --> 00:13:50,871 was abducted and murdered, and then her body dumped 244 00:13:50,872 --> 00:13:54,791 out here in the National Forest, 245 00:13:54,792 --> 00:13:58,128 and, you know, stripped nude. 246 00:13:58,129 --> 00:14:02,674 I mean, just... it's not right 247 00:14:02,675 --> 00:14:04,801 not to be able to figure out who did this to her 248 00:14:04,802 --> 00:14:06,386 and bring them to justice. 249 00:14:06,387 --> 00:14:09,181 Even though, like you said, her parents are gone, 250 00:14:09,182 --> 00:14:11,641 I think the community demands that, 251 00:14:11,642 --> 00:14:15,187 and that's what they expect from, you know, 252 00:14:15,188 --> 00:14:16,772 the police department. 253 00:14:16,773 --> 00:14:19,316 It's not about pointing fingers or, you know, 254 00:14:19,317 --> 00:14:23,445 did you do a good job, did you not do a good job. 255 00:14:23,446 --> 00:14:25,864 Trying to find something... something to grasp 256 00:14:25,865 --> 00:14:28,784 and identify who did this. 257 00:14:28,785 --> 00:14:32,079 And even if that person is no longer here, 258 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:35,499 at least we could wrap it up and, you know, 259 00:14:35,500 --> 00:14:41,254 say, without a doubt, this is the person that did it. 260 00:14:41,255 --> 00:14:43,882 I mean, just... to me, you abduct her, 261 00:14:43,883 --> 00:14:45,926 knock her over the head, fight with her, whatever, 262 00:14:45,927 --> 00:14:49,721 in the parking lot, and then drive all the way up... 263 00:14:49,722 --> 00:14:51,348 I mean, we're not even on the logging road yet. 264 00:14:51,349 --> 00:14:52,933 We're not even there. Yeah. 265 00:14:52,934 --> 00:14:54,810 And it happens at night. 266 00:14:54,811 --> 00:14:56,269 It's pitch black out here. 267 00:14:56,270 --> 00:14:57,938 Yeah. 268 00:14:57,939 --> 00:15:00,524 I mean, there's 1,000 places he could have dumped her. 269 00:15:00,525 --> 00:15:02,317 It's just hard to fathom he randomly 270 00:15:02,318 --> 00:15:04,528 ended up on a logging road. 271 00:15:04,529 --> 00:15:07,489 Yeah, because the store and the campground 272 00:15:07,490 --> 00:15:10,659 was on the aerial maps. 273 00:15:10,660 --> 00:15:12,911 We're still here, so... 274 00:15:12,912 --> 00:15:14,454 But then you got the campground, 275 00:15:14,455 --> 00:15:16,039 which puts Travis Crouch in the area, 276 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:17,833 and then you got the cemetery. 277 00:15:17,834 --> 00:15:20,043 And the lady that puts him in the area worked at that store 278 00:15:20,044 --> 00:15:21,461 right there. 279 00:15:21,462 --> 00:15:22,838 That's where she said she saw him. 280 00:15:22,839 --> 00:15:24,714 And she still holds that to this day, 281 00:15:24,715 --> 00:15:26,466 even though she doesn't think he did it. 282 00:15:26,467 --> 00:15:29,010 She's friends with his parents. 283 00:15:29,011 --> 00:15:32,305 She absolutely holds that he was right there, 284 00:15:32,306 --> 00:15:33,890 picking up those puppies... 285 00:15:33,891 --> 00:15:38,645 picking up a puppy in his mama's car 286 00:15:38,646 --> 00:15:41,189 in the time he says he wasn't here. 287 00:15:41,190 --> 00:15:43,024 And then you got Charles Ray Vines 288 00:15:43,025 --> 00:15:46,820 that had a work order for digging the cemetery 289 00:15:46,821 --> 00:15:49,072 even closer to the logging road. 290 00:15:49,073 --> 00:15:50,240 So... 291 00:15:50,241 --> 00:15:52,951 Well, we'll get on up there. 292 00:15:52,952 --> 00:15:54,786 We got a lot to do. 293 00:15:54,787 --> 00:15:57,747 When I think about it, 294 00:15:57,748 --> 00:16:03,670 I mean, we are already quite a distance away from 40. 295 00:16:03,671 --> 00:16:06,214 And the windy roads, coming up here 296 00:16:06,215 --> 00:16:08,800 in the middle of the night, how dark it would be... 297 00:16:08,801 --> 00:16:10,844 like you said, he definitely have to be familiar. 298 00:16:10,845 --> 00:16:13,346 And this is just on the highway. 299 00:16:13,347 --> 00:16:16,558 You know, we're not even on the logging road yet. 300 00:16:16,559 --> 00:16:20,729 So that adds another whole layer of someone 301 00:16:20,730 --> 00:16:22,439 has to be familiar with the area 302 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:24,482 to get all the way up there. 303 00:16:24,483 --> 00:16:25,817 I don't know. 304 00:16:25,818 --> 00:16:28,945 I keep going back to Crouch or... 305 00:16:28,946 --> 00:16:30,238 I don't know. 306 00:16:30,239 --> 00:16:34,534 I just... it's so fucking far out here. 307 00:16:34,535 --> 00:16:37,788 I mean, look at this, going... 308 00:16:53,304 --> 00:16:54,804 Kind of spooky how that big rock 309 00:16:54,805 --> 00:16:57,390 almost looks like a headstone. 310 00:17:21,082 --> 00:17:23,041 So when you're examining a cold case, 311 00:17:23,042 --> 00:17:24,542 and you want to look at the evidence, 312 00:17:24,543 --> 00:17:26,294 you're going to pull all this evidence out 313 00:17:26,295 --> 00:17:28,838 so you can determine what evidence 314 00:17:28,839 --> 00:17:32,425 is best and will give you the best luck of getting 315 00:17:32,426 --> 00:17:34,469 a return on DNA, say. 316 00:17:34,470 --> 00:17:38,181 DNA has made leaps and bounds, advances, 317 00:17:38,182 --> 00:17:40,517 and they can do a lot more now than they could 318 00:17:40,518 --> 00:17:44,063 back in 1995, 2000. 319 00:17:46,315 --> 00:17:50,485 When we're looking at new procedures and the advancement 320 00:17:50,486 --> 00:17:54,489 in technology, we really want to look at possibly submitting 321 00:17:54,490 --> 00:17:57,742 almost everything again, and private labs 322 00:17:57,743 --> 00:18:01,496 as well, who may have a better technology 323 00:18:01,497 --> 00:18:04,833 than your state crime lab. 324 00:18:18,306 --> 00:18:21,308 One of the first questions I had is, 325 00:18:21,309 --> 00:18:23,143 um, the nail clippings. 326 00:18:23,144 --> 00:18:25,145 I know the ME took those, 327 00:18:25,146 --> 00:18:27,981 like, when you did the autopsy. 328 00:18:27,982 --> 00:18:29,607 But I haven't found... 329 00:18:29,608 --> 00:18:31,526 I know you sent me something on the nail clippings, 330 00:18:31,527 --> 00:18:33,570 but it said it was, like, being retained, 331 00:18:33,571 --> 00:18:36,574 that it hasn't been tested. 332 00:18:52,173 --> 00:18:53,340 I got you on speaker. 333 00:18:53,341 --> 00:18:55,008 But no, I was just calling earlier. 334 00:18:55,009 --> 00:18:57,761 We were fixing to go into a meeting with the crime lab. 335 00:18:57,762 --> 00:19:00,597 And we had a list of questions and stuff, 336 00:19:00,598 --> 00:19:02,974 and we wanted to make sure we didn't miss anything. 337 00:19:02,975 --> 00:19:04,934 It's pretty exciting. So... 338 00:19:04,935 --> 00:19:07,020 Yeah. 339 00:19:07,021 --> 00:19:09,981 The... they said, from their end, what they can tell... 340 00:19:09,982 --> 00:19:13,777 the fingernail clippings have never been tested. 341 00:19:13,778 --> 00:19:15,487 Ooh, that is exciting. 342 00:19:15,488 --> 00:19:17,447 So that's pretty awesome. 343 00:19:17,448 --> 00:19:19,115 So... 344 00:19:19,116 --> 00:19:21,034 Yeah. 345 00:19:21,035 --> 00:19:22,869 They've got them there, 346 00:19:22,870 --> 00:19:24,788 so they're fixing to start testing them. 347 00:19:24,789 --> 00:19:27,207 They said it could be anywhere from three to six months, 348 00:19:27,208 --> 00:19:31,753 but just depending on if they can get people 349 00:19:31,754 --> 00:19:34,047 moved to the cold case stuff. 350 00:19:34,048 --> 00:19:35,882 And then, like, the blood droplets... 351 00:19:35,883 --> 00:19:39,219 you know, we talked about, like, did they test each one, 352 00:19:39,220 --> 00:19:40,762 or did it... 353 00:19:40,763 --> 00:19:44,057 you know, they just test one or two spots? 354 00:19:44,058 --> 00:19:46,351 And they said most likely it was the one or two spots, 355 00:19:46,352 --> 00:19:48,311 but they were going to go back, 356 00:19:48,312 --> 00:19:50,939 and they would retest all of them. 357 00:19:50,940 --> 00:19:52,899 OK. 358 00:19:52,900 --> 00:19:54,567 Pretty exciting. So... 359 00:19:54,568 --> 00:19:56,528 Dude, that fingernail thing... that is exciting. 360 00:19:56,529 --> 00:19:58,488 Oh, my gosh. 361 00:19:58,489 --> 00:19:59,656 Hopefully... 362 00:19:59,657 --> 00:20:01,282 You know, that could be... 363 00:20:01,283 --> 00:20:03,201 I mean, that has the potential to be a huge breakthrough. 364 00:20:03,202 --> 00:20:06,204 We'll see. 365 00:20:06,205 --> 00:20:09,124 It seems like that's our best potential right now. 366 00:20:09,125 --> 00:20:11,961 Right. Yeah, I agree. 367 00:20:14,171 --> 00:20:15,880 The whole purpose of the Cold Case group 368 00:20:15,881 --> 00:20:18,383 is to overlook and see what could have been missed 369 00:20:18,384 --> 00:20:19,884 and what can be re-approached. 370 00:20:19,885 --> 00:20:21,678 And now we're doing that, and we're actually 371 00:20:21,679 --> 00:20:26,474 getting solutions and finding key pieces that could have 372 00:20:26,475 --> 00:20:28,101 slipped through the cracks. 373 00:20:28,102 --> 00:20:32,147 I want to push to get this done because, I mean, this is, 374 00:20:32,148 --> 00:20:33,982 like I said, it's one of those things 375 00:20:33,983 --> 00:20:35,733 that you never thought you'd be part of, 376 00:20:35,734 --> 00:20:37,318 and you're doing it. 377 00:20:37,319 --> 00:20:39,821 And to feel like you're making headway and getting close 378 00:20:39,822 --> 00:20:43,992 to something, it's pretty... 379 00:20:43,993 --> 00:20:46,327 I mean, I can't even describe it. 380 00:20:46,328 --> 00:20:49,414 You know, they see, OK, we've got 10 blood spots. 381 00:20:49,415 --> 00:20:50,915 Let's test four of them. 382 00:20:50,916 --> 00:20:52,459 Four of them show to be the victim. 383 00:20:52,460 --> 00:20:54,335 OK, we believe that all to be the victim. 384 00:20:54,336 --> 00:20:56,588 I mean, that's a very good educated guess. 385 00:20:56,589 --> 00:20:59,507 You know, and in that time, in that moment, 386 00:20:59,508 --> 00:21:01,843 maybe that's sufficient enough at the time. 387 00:21:01,844 --> 00:21:03,720 But when you get down to a case such as this, 388 00:21:03,721 --> 00:21:08,516 where it's nitty gritty, like, every blood spot matters. 389 00:21:08,517 --> 00:21:11,978 Every piece of DNA matters because you're 390 00:21:11,979 --> 00:21:16,691 looking for that game-changing piece that could put everything 391 00:21:16,692 --> 00:21:18,359 that we have together. 392 00:21:18,360 --> 00:21:20,361 You know, that's why you have to have these follow up 393 00:21:20,362 --> 00:21:22,113 meetings and explain to the crime lab, hey, 394 00:21:22,114 --> 00:21:23,323 we need to revisit this. 395 00:21:23,324 --> 00:21:24,616 We need to resubmit everything. 396 00:21:24,617 --> 00:21:26,493 We need to figure out what's been tested, 397 00:21:26,494 --> 00:21:29,412 what's not been tested so we can make sure it's all tested. 398 00:21:29,413 --> 00:21:31,289 That way, nothing's missed. 399 00:21:31,290 --> 00:21:35,376 Now, Melissa was found in January. 400 00:21:35,377 --> 00:21:38,171 And five to six months later, 401 00:21:38,172 --> 00:21:39,672 you had the Morgan Nick case come up. 402 00:21:39,673 --> 00:21:44,844 So you've got the insane amount of evidence 403 00:21:44,845 --> 00:21:46,971 being sent from our case. 404 00:21:46,972 --> 00:21:49,349 Then you turn around, and you know, 405 00:21:49,350 --> 00:21:52,894 they're still sending stuff, I'm sure, 406 00:21:52,895 --> 00:21:54,854 on that case and constantly following up with me and check. 407 00:21:54,855 --> 00:21:57,440 There's no telling how many pieces of evidence 408 00:21:57,441 --> 00:21:59,317 they had sent in that case. 409 00:21:59,318 --> 00:22:00,819 I think that's what makes this 410 00:22:00,820 --> 00:22:03,029 a crucial time now is that we are finding out 411 00:22:03,030 --> 00:22:04,614 that some didn't get tested. 412 00:22:04,615 --> 00:22:07,492 Let's test it now and see what it does to open... 413 00:22:07,493 --> 00:22:09,619 open up this case. 414 00:22:09,620 --> 00:22:13,039 Have I told you the story, when Morgan was actually taken, 415 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:17,460 that I was playing the Little League game the night 416 00:22:17,461 --> 00:22:19,295 that she had gotten taken? 417 00:22:25,719 --> 00:22:27,053 I'll never forget. 418 00:22:27,054 --> 00:22:28,346 My mom just like, stand right here. 419 00:22:28,347 --> 00:22:29,931 Do not move. 420 00:22:29,932 --> 00:22:32,809 And I was not to leave her side. 421 00:22:32,810 --> 00:22:35,228 And I remember everybody kind of... 422 00:22:35,229 --> 00:22:36,646 it's hazy. 423 00:22:36,647 --> 00:22:38,523 But I remember, like, people in a panic. 424 00:22:38,524 --> 00:22:40,275 You could just tell that something was wrong. 425 00:22:40,276 --> 00:22:42,569 There wasn't any celebrating after the game. 426 00:22:42,570 --> 00:22:44,654 There was... everybody was getting in their cars 427 00:22:44,655 --> 00:22:46,155 and leaving. 428 00:22:46,156 --> 00:22:47,907 And I remember a lot of police officers being there, 429 00:22:47,908 --> 00:22:49,200 but you didn't really... 430 00:22:49,201 --> 00:22:51,202 it wasn't until probably the next day 431 00:22:51,203 --> 00:22:52,787 that it started hitting home and you 432 00:22:52,788 --> 00:22:55,456 started hearing everything that actually had taken place. 433 00:22:55,457 --> 00:22:57,250 Back then, nobody really had cameras, 434 00:22:57,251 --> 00:22:59,127 and it was just a rare thing. 435 00:22:59,128 --> 00:23:02,463 But my mom had gotten a video camera and had taken it to film 436 00:23:02,464 --> 00:23:03,965 our last game. 437 00:23:03,966 --> 00:23:08,887 And so the tape was turned over to the police and... 438 00:23:18,856 --> 00:23:22,150 That's the last time that Morgan was seen, 439 00:23:22,151 --> 00:23:24,193 in the background of that video. 440 00:23:24,194 --> 00:23:26,821 I guess I didn't realize that your mom's was... 441 00:23:26,822 --> 00:23:29,407 it actually had her in the background. 442 00:23:29,408 --> 00:23:31,326 But it also makes you think... 443 00:23:31,327 --> 00:23:32,869 look at the Witt case... 444 00:23:32,870 --> 00:23:36,497 you know, I said earlier, that can't happen to me. 445 00:23:36,498 --> 00:23:37,832 And that happened. 446 00:23:37,833 --> 00:23:39,375 And now here we are working it. 447 00:23:39,376 --> 00:23:42,837 And I mean, you just got to... 448 00:23:42,838 --> 00:23:46,507 it's wild how everything falls in line. 449 00:23:59,396 --> 00:24:00,855 So Fort Smith PD has worked with... 450 00:24:00,856 --> 00:24:03,107 is working with the state crime lab 451 00:24:03,108 --> 00:24:06,486 to get the fingernail clippings sent to a private lab. 452 00:24:06,487 --> 00:24:08,529 And that's that lab in Florida. 453 00:24:08,530 --> 00:24:13,368 And so the goal is, uh, 454 00:24:13,369 --> 00:24:17,455 to fully test the fingernails for the touch DNA. 455 00:24:17,456 --> 00:24:20,041 So they're going to use that private lab. 456 00:24:20,042 --> 00:24:23,002 And that private lab's... you know, it's got the... 457 00:24:23,003 --> 00:24:27,548 the reputation of handling touch DNA as their forte. 458 00:24:27,549 --> 00:24:32,345 And then the other thing was the culmination 459 00:24:32,346 --> 00:24:36,224 of everyone's work is that three of the blood spots 460 00:24:36,225 --> 00:24:39,102 were confirmed tested, but not all of them. 461 00:24:39,103 --> 00:24:40,520 Gotcha. 462 00:24:40,521 --> 00:24:42,855 And so the state crime lab is going to... 463 00:24:42,856 --> 00:24:44,482 they have the blood samples. 464 00:24:44,483 --> 00:24:46,859 They're going to retest all of them, 465 00:24:46,860 --> 00:24:49,278 the three that have been tested 466 00:24:49,279 --> 00:24:51,823 and the seven or eight that have not been. 467 00:24:51,824 --> 00:24:54,158 Any one of those blood spots... 468 00:24:54,159 --> 00:24:58,538 if she had struggled enough to cause him to bleed any... 469 00:24:58,539 --> 00:25:02,709 that if any of those spots could be our suspect, 470 00:25:02,710 --> 00:25:04,460 then we would... 471 00:25:04,461 --> 00:25:05,962 the only way to know is to have them all tested. 472 00:25:05,963 --> 00:25:07,672 - Right. - So that should be 473 00:25:07,673 --> 00:25:10,466 in the works now, to get all the blood spots tested. 474 00:25:16,724 --> 00:25:18,182 Admittedly, in the back of our minds, 475 00:25:18,183 --> 00:25:19,767 we're going to be waiting for that answer, 476 00:25:19,768 --> 00:25:23,604 waiting for that lab result, and guardedly hopeful 477 00:25:23,605 --> 00:25:26,441 that it gives us something that we can act on. 478 00:25:26,442 --> 00:25:30,153 It's often not like what it appears in TV shows and movies 479 00:25:30,154 --> 00:25:32,238 and things of that nature. 480 00:25:32,239 --> 00:25:33,614 A negative answer is still an answer. 481 00:25:33,615 --> 00:25:36,617 So if, for some reason, we get results back 482 00:25:36,618 --> 00:25:39,203 that say it's not this, well, that just gives me motivation 483 00:25:39,204 --> 00:25:43,124 to keep pushing forward to get some answers 484 00:25:43,125 --> 00:25:44,917 for something to get a positive result. 485 00:25:44,918 --> 00:25:47,712 So I'm hopeful, but at the same time, 486 00:25:47,713 --> 00:25:51,382 I'm realistic and understanding that not every result 487 00:25:51,383 --> 00:25:53,092 is going to be positive. 488 00:25:53,093 --> 00:25:55,386 But that gives me the motivation to keep trying 489 00:25:55,387 --> 00:25:57,388 to look for the right answer. 490 00:25:57,389 --> 00:25:59,599 The hope would be that there's some form 491 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:03,186 of suspect DNA that can be found 492 00:26:03,187 --> 00:26:05,813 with her fingernail clippings. 493 00:26:22,706 --> 00:26:24,207 DNA Labs International. 494 00:26:24,208 --> 00:26:25,583 This is Christine. 495 00:26:25,584 --> 00:26:26,876 This is Detective Marion with the Fort Smith 496 00:26:26,877 --> 00:26:28,294 Police Department. 497 00:26:28,295 --> 00:26:29,587 OK. Let me see if she's in her office. 498 00:26:29,588 --> 00:26:31,047 Hold on one second. 499 00:26:31,048 --> 00:26:34,383 Thank you. 500 00:26:40,432 --> 00:26:43,142 It almost hurts to have to sit and wait 501 00:26:43,143 --> 00:26:46,604 because it's something that, you know, has never been done. 502 00:26:46,605 --> 00:26:49,774 And you just can't... you want the results now. 503 00:26:49,775 --> 00:26:53,111 But once we get it all sent off, 10 to 12 weeks, 504 00:26:53,112 --> 00:26:55,696 I mean, that kind of crushes the excitement 505 00:26:55,697 --> 00:26:57,615 as far as the timeline. 506 00:26:57,616 --> 00:27:00,701 But it's still... it's just because, 507 00:27:00,702 --> 00:27:05,206 you know, you want it now. 508 00:27:05,207 --> 00:27:07,083 In a case like this, I would think 509 00:27:07,084 --> 00:27:10,962 that the fingernail clippings, in a strangulation case, 510 00:27:10,963 --> 00:27:15,424 are going to be crucial evidence because, you know, 511 00:27:15,425 --> 00:27:18,678 we know that Melissa fought at the bowling alley, 512 00:27:18,679 --> 00:27:22,306 and most likely, she fought when she was being strangled. 513 00:27:22,307 --> 00:27:26,769 And, you know, her fingernails could hold potential evidence 514 00:27:26,770 --> 00:27:29,397 of the... of her killer. 515 00:27:29,398 --> 00:27:33,067 I mean, it's... to me, I think that is a vital, 516 00:27:33,068 --> 00:27:36,404 vital piece of evidence that has never been tested. 517 00:27:36,405 --> 00:27:38,614 And, you know, with all the technology today, 518 00:27:38,615 --> 00:27:40,449 hopefully we can find... 519 00:27:40,450 --> 00:27:43,619 find some good answers with it. 520 00:28:10,522 --> 00:28:13,149 Well, there's a lot of weight that 521 00:28:13,150 --> 00:28:14,650 goes into a call like this. 522 00:28:14,651 --> 00:28:17,695 You know, there's hopes, especially with 523 00:28:17,696 --> 00:28:19,530 the community and family members 524 00:28:19,531 --> 00:28:22,283 and the department in general. 525 00:28:22,284 --> 00:28:24,744 We just don't know whether that's 526 00:28:24,745 --> 00:28:27,622 going to be a good phone call or a bad phone call 527 00:28:27,623 --> 00:28:29,123 or inconclusive. 528 00:28:29,124 --> 00:28:31,250 So either way, regardless of the information, 529 00:28:31,251 --> 00:28:34,170 there's still going to be a lot of work to do. 530 00:28:34,171 --> 00:28:37,214 So we're just hoping that we get a good phone call. 531 00:28:41,929 --> 00:28:44,347 Hello. This is Deputy Chief Thompson. 532 00:28:44,348 --> 00:28:45,806 Hi, Deputy Chief Thompson. 533 00:28:45,807 --> 00:28:47,642 This is Rachel from DNA Labs International. 534 00:28:47,643 --> 00:28:49,060 - How are you? - I'm great. 535 00:28:49,061 --> 00:28:50,853 How are you doing this morning? 536 00:28:50,854 --> 00:28:52,271 Good. 537 00:28:52,272 --> 00:28:53,981 I was just calling with some preliminary results 538 00:28:53,982 --> 00:28:55,483 from your case. 539 00:28:55,484 --> 00:28:57,777 So as you know, we had extracts 540 00:28:57,778 --> 00:28:59,236 from the nail clippings, 541 00:28:59,237 --> 00:29:01,155 and then we also tested the nail clippings 542 00:29:01,156 --> 00:29:03,574 using our sponge shell method. 543 00:29:03,575 --> 00:29:07,578 So looking at the extracts, we re-quantified them. 544 00:29:07,579 --> 00:29:09,455 And although there is plenty of DNA 545 00:29:09,456 --> 00:29:12,083 present to move forward with DNA profiling, 546 00:29:12,084 --> 00:29:14,835 there was no male DNA detected. 547 00:29:14,836 --> 00:29:16,671 OK. 548 00:29:16,672 --> 00:29:19,715 So we also retest them, as I said, 549 00:29:19,716 --> 00:29:21,425 using our sponge shell method. 550 00:29:21,426 --> 00:29:23,177 And again, although there's plenty 551 00:29:23,178 --> 00:29:25,888 of DNA to move forward for DNA profiling, 552 00:29:25,889 --> 00:29:29,850 no male DNA was detected. 553 00:29:29,851 --> 00:29:31,394 I have a question for you guys. 554 00:29:31,395 --> 00:29:33,104 So we do have two options. 555 00:29:33,105 --> 00:29:35,606 We could stop testing at this point, 556 00:29:35,607 --> 00:29:38,943 or we could still move forward with DNA profiling. 557 00:29:38,944 --> 00:29:41,570 We don't necessarily know what happened to Melissa. 558 00:29:41,571 --> 00:29:45,116 So it is possible we could still yield a DNA profile that 559 00:29:45,117 --> 00:29:47,618 could have information, or we could also just 560 00:29:47,619 --> 00:29:49,620 pause at this point and move forward 561 00:29:49,621 --> 00:29:52,206 with some of the other items that we talked about. 562 00:29:52,207 --> 00:29:55,126 Do we think that the DNA profile could be hers, 563 00:29:55,127 --> 00:29:59,422 or do we think that it's... is there a way to test that? 564 00:29:59,423 --> 00:30:01,132 It could be just hers. 565 00:30:01,133 --> 00:30:03,843 It could also be her and another female, 566 00:30:03,844 --> 00:30:06,512 or it's also possible that there could be a really 567 00:30:06,513 --> 00:30:08,806 low-level male that's not being picked up 568 00:30:08,807 --> 00:30:10,474 with quantification. 569 00:30:10,475 --> 00:30:12,518 But the only way to be able to detect that 570 00:30:12,519 --> 00:30:15,646 would probably be doing next-generation sequencing, 571 00:30:15,647 --> 00:30:17,189 which is much more sensitive. 572 00:30:17,190 --> 00:30:18,607 OK. 573 00:30:18,608 --> 00:30:20,192 Do you want us to issue a report 574 00:30:20,193 --> 00:30:22,236 at this time on what we've done so far, 575 00:30:22,237 --> 00:30:23,571 or do you want us to hold off? 576 00:30:23,572 --> 00:30:25,114 Yeah, if you could issue a report 577 00:30:25,115 --> 00:30:27,033 and send it to us, that way we can look at that. 578 00:30:27,034 --> 00:30:30,161 And then we can discuss it and go from there. 579 00:30:30,162 --> 00:30:31,787 OK, sounds good. Thank you, gentlemen. 580 00:30:31,788 --> 00:30:33,080 Have a good day. 581 00:30:33,081 --> 00:30:36,167 All right. Thank you. 582 00:30:36,168 --> 00:30:39,003 Yeah, that's definitely disappointing. 583 00:30:39,004 --> 00:30:41,964 Disappointing news. 584 00:30:41,965 --> 00:30:46,260 But I think bring that report and... 585 00:30:46,261 --> 00:30:48,471 you know, to the team and discuss 586 00:30:48,472 --> 00:30:50,097 what we want to do from there. 587 00:30:50,098 --> 00:30:53,100 But we'll just have to look and see how much further 588 00:30:53,101 --> 00:30:54,852 we want to try to go with it. 589 00:30:54,853 --> 00:30:56,354 Yeah. 590 00:30:59,483 --> 00:31:03,152 I don't think he's going to answer, so... 591 00:31:03,153 --> 00:31:05,821 Your call has been forwarded to voicemail. 592 00:31:05,822 --> 00:31:07,948 Yeah, no luck. 593 00:31:07,949 --> 00:31:10,576 Brad's on vacation now. 594 00:31:10,577 --> 00:31:15,623 I have to get in touch with him some other time, it looks like. 595 00:31:26,635 --> 00:31:29,678 I remember interviewing people and people 596 00:31:29,679 --> 00:31:33,307 saying this was such a safe and quiet and friendly community. 597 00:31:33,308 --> 00:31:35,434 This is shocking that something like this 598 00:31:35,435 --> 00:31:37,019 has happened in our town. 599 00:31:37,020 --> 00:31:41,024 And I think that's why the town mobilized like it did. 600 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:46,821 But as far as violent crime or abductions or anything 601 00:31:46,822 --> 00:31:49,073 like that, I mean, that was not going on 602 00:31:49,074 --> 00:31:52,034 when I was there, you know, in the mid '90s. 603 00:31:52,035 --> 00:31:56,330 It wasn't until this abduction occurred with Melissa Witt 604 00:31:56,331 --> 00:31:59,708 that it just, it shook that community to its core. 605 00:31:59,709 --> 00:32:01,252 Because when we walked up here, I saw... 606 00:32:01,253 --> 00:32:02,753 I don't even think there was a, 607 00:32:02,754 --> 00:32:04,797 we've got to find who did this, in the beginning. 608 00:32:04,798 --> 00:32:06,340 It was more like, well, she's got to be somewhere, 609 00:32:06,341 --> 00:32:09,927 and we've got to find her. 610 00:32:13,598 --> 00:32:15,516 I think Melissa's case 611 00:32:15,517 --> 00:32:17,017 is important to the community. 612 00:32:17,018 --> 00:32:21,522 Someone committed this horrible crime. 613 00:32:21,523 --> 00:32:23,732 Someone needs to be brought to justice. 614 00:32:23,733 --> 00:32:26,527 And even if this person who did this to Missy... 615 00:32:26,528 --> 00:32:28,904 if they're deceased, we still want 616 00:32:28,905 --> 00:32:31,782 to be able to identify and make sure that nothing like this 617 00:32:31,783 --> 00:32:33,200 could ever happen again. 618 00:32:33,201 --> 00:32:35,077 So I think that's kind of what drives me 619 00:32:35,078 --> 00:32:38,038 and the fellow detectives is you have this cold case 620 00:32:38,039 --> 00:32:41,000 that hasn't been solved, we have plenty of evidence, 621 00:32:41,001 --> 00:32:43,460 And just going back through all that evidence 622 00:32:43,461 --> 00:32:45,963 and statements that were made... 623 00:32:45,964 --> 00:32:50,426 see if we could find a link or something that wasn't followed 624 00:32:50,427 --> 00:32:53,679 through with all the way and maybe rule out 625 00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:56,682 some of the people that were already investigated, 626 00:32:56,683 --> 00:32:59,935 but kind of left in limbo so we could definitely 627 00:32:59,936 --> 00:33:03,647 cross them off the list. 628 00:33:03,648 --> 00:33:06,233 It's 29 years later, almost 30 years later. 629 00:33:06,234 --> 00:33:08,903 And if there's anything, anything that 630 00:33:08,904 --> 00:33:13,199 covering her story today can do to help bring closure... 631 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:16,702 um, you know, unfortunately, Mary Ann has left us. 632 00:33:16,703 --> 00:33:18,871 She's passed away. 633 00:33:18,872 --> 00:33:21,832 And that breaks my heart to think that she passed 634 00:33:21,833 --> 00:33:24,210 never knowing what happened to her daughter, 635 00:33:24,211 --> 00:33:29,090 and that she lived all those years without knowing. 636 00:33:30,842 --> 00:33:35,471 Even the day that they found Melissa's body 637 00:33:35,472 --> 00:33:38,557 and we went to her home and... 638 00:33:38,558 --> 00:33:40,142 she invited us in. 639 00:33:40,143 --> 00:33:42,269 You know, her friends and family were showing up. 640 00:33:42,270 --> 00:33:43,771 Melissa's friends were there. 641 00:33:43,772 --> 00:33:45,522 She invited us into her home. 642 00:33:45,523 --> 00:33:51,237 And I just said, Mary Ann, take this time for privacy. 643 00:33:51,238 --> 00:33:55,157 We'll report from outside. 644 00:33:55,158 --> 00:33:58,077 You need your... I had so much respect for her 645 00:33:58,078 --> 00:34:00,955 and admiration for her on how she handled 646 00:34:00,956 --> 00:34:03,082 herself through all of this. 647 00:34:03,083 --> 00:34:07,253 And in her memory and honor and Missy's, 648 00:34:07,254 --> 00:34:10,172 if there's anything that we could do to put out there 649 00:34:10,173 --> 00:34:16,387 that could bring either justice or closure to this... 650 00:34:16,388 --> 00:34:18,430 I guess it would make us feel better. 651 00:34:18,431 --> 00:34:19,723 I know she's with Missy now. 652 00:34:19,724 --> 00:34:21,100 You know, I know they're together. 653 00:34:21,101 --> 00:34:23,102 I know she knows what happened now. 654 00:34:23,103 --> 00:34:25,104 And that's the only thing that honestly brings me 655 00:34:25,105 --> 00:34:27,022 consolation is that... 656 00:34:27,023 --> 00:34:28,983 is that I know they're together. 657 00:34:33,488 --> 00:34:36,865 There's so much to be... to review, 658 00:34:36,866 --> 00:34:39,576 so much information to go over, 659 00:34:39,577 --> 00:34:41,412 boxes of materials to go through. 660 00:34:41,413 --> 00:34:44,039 One person is easily overwhelmed by that. 661 00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:47,459 But if you get a group of investigators that 662 00:34:47,460 --> 00:34:49,878 are interested and will spend a little bit of time 663 00:34:49,879 --> 00:34:52,840 individually and take a piece of the investigation, 664 00:34:52,841 --> 00:34:56,760 then it's a force multiplier to enhance the ability 665 00:34:56,761 --> 00:34:59,138 of the group to further the investigation, 666 00:34:59,139 --> 00:35:03,434 to maybe get some clarity, eliminate suspects, 667 00:35:03,435 --> 00:35:08,188 hopefully, theoretically, conclude what happened 668 00:35:08,189 --> 00:35:10,482 and, you know, potentially convict someone 669 00:35:10,483 --> 00:35:13,736 or at least close the case. 670 00:35:13,737 --> 00:35:16,530 I don't know how guys and gals do this job 671 00:35:16,531 --> 00:35:19,199 without faith as a central element to it because you 672 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:23,329 could quickly lose your hope, faith in all things. 673 00:35:23,330 --> 00:35:27,124 But you just... 674 00:35:27,125 --> 00:35:29,376 I've got on the back of my work phone 675 00:35:29,377 --> 00:35:32,004 that from the Gospel of John 676 00:35:32,005 --> 00:35:34,214 just to be a light in the darkness. 677 00:35:34,215 --> 00:35:36,300 Coping with it, it's just a matter of getting in there 678 00:35:36,301 --> 00:35:37,926 and realizing that you've been... 679 00:35:37,927 --> 00:35:43,349 it's truly an honor to get to do what we do, 680 00:35:43,350 --> 00:35:47,436 to shine light on these situations and to help... 681 00:35:47,437 --> 00:35:49,813 maybe help deliver people from them and help them 682 00:35:49,814 --> 00:35:52,441 find their way out. 683 00:35:52,442 --> 00:35:54,610 From the night that she was taken 684 00:35:54,611 --> 00:35:57,488 and seeing how everything played out in the community, 685 00:35:57,489 --> 00:36:00,407 how it affected the family, how it affected 686 00:36:00,408 --> 00:36:01,992 law enforcement, just... 687 00:36:01,993 --> 00:36:06,246 and watching that the entire time you're growing up 688 00:36:06,247 --> 00:36:08,332 and then being part of this cold case group 689 00:36:08,333 --> 00:36:12,961 that is on the other end of it working the case, 690 00:36:12,962 --> 00:36:15,506 and seeing all the work that's gone into it... 691 00:36:15,507 --> 00:36:19,051 I mean, it's very surreal. 692 00:36:19,052 --> 00:36:21,220 But then also too, we got to be mindful of, 693 00:36:21,221 --> 00:36:24,014 you know, however many years left 694 00:36:24,015 --> 00:36:27,768 we have in law enforcement, what we do today is extremely 695 00:36:27,769 --> 00:36:31,939 important because if we're not doing it right now, 696 00:36:31,940 --> 00:36:33,482 the right way... 697 00:36:33,483 --> 00:36:36,360 and say we don't solve the case and it gets passed on 698 00:36:36,361 --> 00:36:38,028 to the next detective, 699 00:36:38,029 --> 00:36:40,489 you know, he's going to look at what we did 700 00:36:40,490 --> 00:36:45,160 and then have to go off of our notes, what we've discovered, 701 00:36:45,161 --> 00:36:49,081 you know, and some day, find a piece that we're missing, 702 00:36:49,082 --> 00:36:52,126 add it to the rest of the case, and solve it. 703 00:36:52,127 --> 00:36:54,086 I mean, everybody plays a part. 704 00:36:54,087 --> 00:36:56,588 So we're hopeful we solve the case 705 00:36:56,589 --> 00:36:58,799 or get a closure on that end. 706 00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,802 But if we don't, we're still laying the foundation 707 00:37:01,803 --> 00:37:03,929 or climbing the ladder to whoever 708 00:37:03,930 --> 00:37:07,015 is able to solve that case. 709 00:37:07,016 --> 00:37:09,101 You know, Melissa Witt's case, where, 710 00:37:09,102 --> 00:37:10,936 you know, her family's deceased, 711 00:37:10,937 --> 00:37:12,771 and a person would say, well, 712 00:37:12,772 --> 00:37:14,398 what closure are you giving to anyone? 713 00:37:14,399 --> 00:37:16,316 Well, it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, 714 00:37:16,317 --> 00:37:19,862 because, you know, it's important 715 00:37:19,863 --> 00:37:22,239 to get justice for people. 716 00:37:22,240 --> 00:37:25,033 It's important for... 717 00:37:25,034 --> 00:37:28,620 it gets to me in a way because I think of... 718 00:37:28,621 --> 00:37:30,289 and maybe it's wrong, but I think of, like, 719 00:37:30,290 --> 00:37:32,291 Melissa Witt as a... 720 00:37:32,292 --> 00:37:37,671 she was a 19-year-old girl who did nothing wrong. 721 00:37:37,672 --> 00:37:40,215 And her last hours on this Earth 722 00:37:40,216 --> 00:37:44,261 were probably the most horrific a person can experience. 723 00:37:44,262 --> 00:37:46,889 And that 19-year-old Melissa Witt 724 00:37:46,890 --> 00:37:50,100 deserves justice and deserves our best effort of justice. 725 00:37:50,101 --> 00:37:53,771 Even if we fail, at least we give it our best effort 726 00:37:53,772 --> 00:37:56,356 and do the best we can to get her justice 727 00:37:56,357 --> 00:37:57,983 because that's what she deserved then. 728 00:37:57,984 --> 00:37:59,610 She deserves it now. 729 00:37:59,611 --> 00:38:02,863 You know, any victim of that kind of crime deserves it. 730 00:38:02,864 --> 00:38:04,823 And if you don't have a heart towards that, 731 00:38:04,824 --> 00:38:07,284 then you have no conscience. 732 00:38:19,798 --> 00:38:22,799 It was December, so you never know. 733 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,219 I mean, she could have fought back, 734 00:38:25,220 --> 00:38:28,555 and the killer could have had a long-sleeve jacket on or shirt 735 00:38:28,556 --> 00:38:31,809 or, you know, something like that where 736 00:38:31,810 --> 00:38:33,936 she just was not able to collect that DNA 737 00:38:33,937 --> 00:38:35,938 under her fingernails. 738 00:38:35,939 --> 00:38:37,815 Melissa was unfortunately out in the elements 739 00:38:37,816 --> 00:38:41,902 for several days and exposed to, 740 00:38:41,903 --> 00:38:46,365 you know, the sun, the snow, the cold weather, 741 00:38:46,366 --> 00:38:48,742 things like that, wildlife. 742 00:38:48,743 --> 00:38:50,327 When you put all that into account, 743 00:38:50,328 --> 00:38:53,497 you know, DNA starts to deteriorate rather quickly. 744 00:38:53,498 --> 00:38:57,125 You know, when we get assigned these cases, even new cases, 745 00:38:57,126 --> 00:38:58,835 we become involved in them. 746 00:38:58,836 --> 00:39:02,381 I mean, you meet with these people, you speak with them. 747 00:39:02,382 --> 00:39:03,799 And just like in this case, you know, 748 00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:05,592 we've talked about Melissa's diary 749 00:39:05,593 --> 00:39:09,263 and how personal it was and how involved 750 00:39:09,264 --> 00:39:11,473 and how real it makes it. 751 00:39:11,474 --> 00:39:13,767 It's almost like you're entering into her world. 752 00:39:13,768 --> 00:39:16,728 We had numerous blood spots located in the bowling alley 753 00:39:16,729 --> 00:39:19,064 that we know all haven't been tested. 754 00:39:19,065 --> 00:39:22,859 So we got to just kind of 755 00:39:22,860 --> 00:39:25,237 move forward and hope for the best 756 00:39:25,238 --> 00:39:27,656 with the evidence that we have and 757 00:39:27,657 --> 00:39:29,783 start looking at the next suspect. 758 00:39:29,784 --> 00:39:32,578 She was walking from her job at Hardee's on Waldron 759 00:39:32,579 --> 00:39:35,622 in Fort Smith when she was approached by a man 760 00:39:35,623 --> 00:39:37,207 who tried to abduct her. 761 00:39:37,208 --> 00:39:40,419 That man was allegedly Dustin Markel. 762 00:39:40,420 --> 00:39:43,213 Within a minute or two, he had grabbed me by my right arm, 763 00:39:43,214 --> 00:39:45,883 and I jerked away. 764 00:39:45,884 --> 00:39:47,467 He had very lengthy criminal history, 765 00:39:47,468 --> 00:39:51,388 including sexual assaults, attempted rapes, rapes. 766 00:39:51,389 --> 00:39:53,682 You know, he had attempted a kidnapping 767 00:39:53,683 --> 00:39:56,727 at Central Mall from a lady that 768 00:39:56,728 --> 00:39:58,645 was luckily able to escape. 769 00:39:58,646 --> 00:40:03,108 And, you know, the day after Melissa was abducted, 770 00:40:03,109 --> 00:40:07,654 this individual left the area and left the state. 771 00:40:07,655 --> 00:40:10,198 You know, there's, like I said, several people 772 00:40:10,199 --> 00:40:12,409 in this case file, and we've just kind of scratched 773 00:40:12,410 --> 00:40:14,161 the surface of it. 774 00:40:14,162 --> 00:40:19,124 So we'll keep pushing until we get the results that we want. 60828

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