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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:14,095 REPORTER: Y'all, we are awaiting Space Shuttle Columbia, 2 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:15,735 as we promised. 3 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:19,215 About ready to land at the Kennedy Space Center in Florida. 4 00:00:19,240 --> 00:00:23,335 It's supposed to happen in about 15 more minutes. 5 00:00:25,240 --> 00:00:28,735 At the runway, there was just a lot of energy in the air, 6 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:32,215 and so, as a kid, you just kind of ride that energy. 7 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,935 But all of the waiting just felt like an eternity. 8 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,175 Here we go! Woo! 9 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:40,455 There's this big countdown clock. 10 00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:44,975 I just remember staring at that clock, 11 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:48,255 watching every second go down. I'm like, "ls it now? ls it now?" 12 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:51,735 I don't know what I expected when I saw that clock. 13 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:55,975 Like, for them to just magically arrive when it reached zero? 14 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:58,415 lain was very excited. 15 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:02,935 Mom's coming home and, you know, he's going to get Mom hugs, 16 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:05,495 erm, great meals... 17 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,615 You know, life will be back to normal. 18 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:10,975 It is now 9am on the East Coast. 19 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,455 Take a look outside. If you hear a "boom-boom", it's the Space Shuttle. 20 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:19,175 Somebody from NASA said, "You'll see the big, kind of, parachute 21 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:20,975 "that pops out of the back." 22 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,815 I think that's probably what I was most excited about, 23 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:26,175 just watching the parachute come out. 24 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:32,735 But then the clock started counting back up. 25 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:35,615 It went zero, negative one, negative two... 26 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:39,095 Where's the double sonic boom? 27 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:41,175 No sonic boom. 28 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,215 I'm kind of looking at all the other families, 29 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:47,695 but no-one was really saying anything. 30 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:53,175 You could kind of feel the air shift a little bit. 31 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:56,215 There's no Space Shuttle. 32 00:01:56,240 --> 00:02:00,455 I just got this incredible pit in my stomach... 33 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:04,095 ...of fear and of anxiety. 34 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:07,735 A rush of adrenaline that you just... 35 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,215 You know something's wrong. Something's wrong. 36 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:24,815 The shuttle is the most complicated space machine ever built. 37 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:33,375 The world's greatest electric flying machine. 38 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:42,455 It has been a bad day for NASA. 39 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:44,975 A sense of tragedy in the space program me, 40 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,455 and as word spreads across the nation... 41 00:02:50,080 --> 00:02:52,655 There are no simple and easy answers. 42 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:54,975 We are doing everything we possibly can 43 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,255 to find out what caused this accident. 44 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:04,495 All the warning signs were there. 45 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:07,935 This didn't have to happen. We let it happen. 46 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:23,135 Houston, UHF comm check. 47 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:25,695 M|LA's not reporting any RF at this time. 48 00:03:32,760 --> 00:03:35,175 When are you expecting tracking? 49 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:39,095 One minute ago, Flight. 50 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:44,935 Flight, GC. No C-band yet. 51 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:48,175 COPY- 52 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:55,815 C-band is a radar that sits on the ground 53 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:58,375 and literally it sends out a signal and it bounces it 54 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:02,455 off of the spacecraft to tell us where it is. 55 00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:07,335 But we were getting nothing. 56 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:14,015 You know, the room was just silent. 57 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:24,295 All right, Miles, back over to you. 58 00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:27,215 Erm, we've got a little problem on the Space Shuttle Columbia. 59 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:30,055 It has been out of communication now for the past 12 minutes. 60 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:33,455 Let's take a look at a live picture of mission control in Houston. 61 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:35,975 I was live on morning TV. 62 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:40,735 I was dialled into NASA on a cellphone I had. 63 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,455 There was a secret phone number you could dial into 64 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:45,655 and hear the mission audio. 65 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:48,575 The people in the control room are going, "Are you hearing this?" 66 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,855 No further communications with the spacecraft about 8am Central Time... 67 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:53,495 Hang on, let's listen in. 68 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:56,895 ...and no further tracking data from the spacecraft that was gained from 69 00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:00,535 C-band tracking radar at the Merritt Island tracking station in Florida. 70 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:03,735 My team was in the control room and they were like, "This is serious. 71 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:05,815 "We need to get Miles off that couch." 72 00:05:05,840 --> 00:05:09,375 Ancl as I was making my way across the newsroom to this other set, 73 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:11,815 I literally started heaving. 74 00:05:13,520 --> 00:05:15,975 The last communications with the Shuttle Columbia 75 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:19,175 during its descent from orbit were at about 8am Central Time... 76 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:22,215 Standing on the side of the runway, 77 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:27,495 realising that my biggest fear is coming true. 78 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:30,535 I just dropped my head and turned around, 79 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:32,975 shaking my head, just walked away. 80 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,215 There wasn't anything else you could do. 81 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:40,495 We are a minute-and-a-half past the scheduled landing time. 82 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,495 The Space Shuttle is not here. This has never happened before. 83 00:05:44,520 --> 00:05:48,375 All of a sudden, the astronaut family escorts, 84 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:52,015 all of their cellphones start simultaneously ringing. 85 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:58,735 We realised something's seriously wrong, and I said, 86 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:02,175 "Let's get the families... Let's get them back to crew quarters." 87 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:06,095 Wow. 88 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:07,935 Oh, my goodness. 89 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:09,495 Oh! 90 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:12,575 It looks like we've got a van, probably full of family members 91 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:15,455 of the astronauts, being driven away. That's not good. 92 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:22,815 I remember grabbing Mom's arm and saying, "Mom, is Daddy OK?" 93 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:26,695 Ancl I was just kind of staring out of the window, 94 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:29,455 trying to figure out what was happening. 95 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:34,215 I can just hear my mom and the driver just kind of whispering 96 00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:36,695 in a hushed tone, like, "What does this mean?" 97 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:41,775 From WFAA TV, Channel 8, The Spirit of Texas. 98 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:44,815 We're going to suspend our normal format right now 99 00:06:44,840 --> 00:06:47,215 because we've got some breaking news. 100 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:50,215 This is videotape of the Space Shuttle Columbia 101 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:53,455 on its way to a scheduled landing this morning. 102 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:55,735 But then we began to see this... 103 00:06:55,760 --> 00:07:00,175 It looks like you can see pieces of the shuttle coming off. 104 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:05,935 There you can see numerous streams leaving some kind of trail 105 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:07,895 over the skies of Texas. 106 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:15,855 The Space Shuttle over Nacogdoches? 107 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:18,015 What is... What is happening? 108 00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:22,175 We had just gone through 9/11 and at first I thought, 109 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:23,655 "Did somebody blow it up?" 110 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,575 It was probably a reasonable thought that a lot of people had, 111 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:28,735 that it could be something terrorist-related, 112 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:30,375 even in this small rural area, 113 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:32,695 because you never know where that might take place. 114 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:41,055 Phones were ringing off the hook. 115 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:43,295 Much more than our dispatch staff could handle. 116 00:07:49,440 --> 00:07:51,255 There was mass confusion. 117 00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:56,455 We can only hope that what we're seeing is not the worst, 118 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:58,575 but we don't have any confirmation. 119 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:01,535 Well, they were reporting what they knew on TV, 120 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:05,055 but here we knew that it was falling all over our county, 121 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,055 and so immediately I picked up my camcorder. 122 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,775 This was something that was going to be big. 123 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:19,455 Oh, my goodness. 124 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:27,535 I wonder what that is. 125 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,295 A large piece of debris right in the middle of their parking lot, 126 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:33,935 behind the bank. 127 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:38,495 You see this? This is parts of it. 128 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:41,095 That's where it hit. That's where it hit and bounced. 129 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:43,575 Well, it's up in a tree over here. 130 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,455 It must have come right through there. Golly! 131 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:48,175 That's pretty big. 132 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:52,495 It was just chaos. 133 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:56,455 Y'all didn't touch it or anything, did you? No, mam. 134 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:04,215 You don't understand. 135 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:07,695 You don't comprehend the massiveness of what's happening. 136 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:18,095 It became pretty obvious that... 137 00:09:18,120 --> 00:09:20,455 ...the worst had happened. 138 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,175 It was just shocking. 139 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,455 People waking up to this horrible news. 140 00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:38,215 Quite frankly, I turned and looked across a big open ploughed field, 141 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:40,975 and there, in fact, is a piece of smoking wreckage. 142 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:44,495 This blackened material, letting out white-hot smoke. 143 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:46,895 There's some rubber burning in our pasture. 144 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:49,535 They're reporting a piece of wreckage came through 145 00:09:49,560 --> 00:09:52,015 an apartment roof and started a fire. 146 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,455 Catastrophe striking the Space Shuttle Columbia. 147 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:56,495 Its crew of seven astronauts... 148 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,495 Right now, NASA will be trying to make sense 149 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:01,855 of what happened in the skies over Texas. 150 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:07,535 GC, Flight. Flight, ac. 151 00:10:07,560 --> 00:10:09,695 Lock the doors. Copy. 152 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:21,695 I was starting to see the beginning of the process for shut down, 153 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:23,495 preserve your data, 154 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:26,255 because it's going to be needed later, for investigation. 155 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:32,495 No... No phone calls off-site outside of this room, 156 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,975 our discussions are on these loops, on the recorded DVIS loops only. 157 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:40,175 No data, no phone calls, no transmissions anywhere, into or out. 158 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:46,455 I remember turning around and seeing Leroy... 159 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:51,175 ...and he had...he had a tear going down his cheek. 160 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:57,175 That was...that was a hard moment. 161 00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:06,895 I glanced up and I saw an engineer, 162 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:09,215 I remember her eyes and cheeks were wet. 163 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:13,375 She was sobbing and crying. And she looked at me and she said, 164 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,495 "There's nothing we could have done." 165 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:20,735 And all my pent-up frustration and anger just came out 166 00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:24,455 and I said, "I've been hearing that damn stuff all week 167 00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:26,735 "and I'm sick and tired of it!" 168 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,135 I think I was more angry than sad, thinking, 169 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:33,455 this didn't have to happen. 170 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:36,935 It didn't have to happen. 171 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:47,975 We were told, "We're going to take you to crew quarters", 172 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:52,735 and so we were just kind of taken to this huge boardroom. 173 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:57,295 It's this big long table, many chairs, and all of these TV screens. 174 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:00,055 Ancl all of the screens were off. Everything was off. 175 00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:05,495 We were all together, waiting in this room, 176 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:09,975 but as a kid, I was just looking around to see if I could, 177 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:12,775 kind of, figure out what was going down. 178 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:20,535 I remember going in the conference room... 179 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:24,055 ...and, erm... 180 00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:28,095 ...it was my job to tell the families. 181 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:36,055 I can't remember exactly how I said it. 182 00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:37,935 That, erm... 183 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,695 That the crew is lost - that they were not coming home. 184 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:49,575 I didn't want them to have any kind of false hope, and... 185 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:52,175 ..| just did it in the most... 186 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:55,935 ...caring, compassionate way that I could. 187 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:06,975 It's almost like, from what I remember, 188 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:08,975 there was, like, a ringing in my ear. 189 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:13,775 Like, I don't know what was being said or what, like... 190 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:23,895 And, you know, I just... You can't even process that. 191 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:30,135 This is not happening. 192 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:33,935 There's no way this is happening. 193 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:38,735 In my mind, I'm thinking, kind of, like, 194 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,695 the spaceship is like a cruise ship. There are lifeboats. 195 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:44,575 Surely they got on a lifeboat, you know? 196 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:47,495 And, you know, somebody has just got to go get them, cos... 197 00:13:47,520 --> 00:13:50,655 I'm thinking of like, you know, all of the science fiction movies 198 00:13:50,680 --> 00:13:53,975 where they get into the little pods and they zoom away from the danger. 199 00:13:56,240 --> 00:14:00,815 Somehow they had survived the crash in the ocean somewhere, 200 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:05,135 and they were all out living on an island. 201 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,935 There was explosive crying. 202 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,935 If you've ever heard an animal scream in agony or... 203 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:21,855 It was... It was primal. 204 00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:24,215 It was... It was horrific. 205 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,735 Everything just fell apart. 206 00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:35,415 The shuttle wasn't coming home. Dad wasn't coming home. 207 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:39,335 Sorry. 208 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:52,215 These were husbands and fathers and wives, gone. 209 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,455 A fair amount of rookies on this particular one. 210 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:04,175 Somehow I just got my act together and I just started talking. 211 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,815 The mission appeared to go well. 212 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:14,215 There was one thing that engineers were looking at at launch. 213 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:16,735 We're going to try to get you some tape of it. 214 00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:19,455 There was a piece of debris which came off the shuttle. 215 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:21,495 I'm going to bring in a model here. 216 00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:26,735 I felt like it was my responsibility to talk about the foam strike, 217 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:29,975 to get it out there in the public, so... 218 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:33,935 ..| talked to the folks in the control room and I said, you know, 219 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,135 "Can you cue-up the launch replays?" 220 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,375 All right, let's take a look at this launch. If we can run that through 221 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:41,535 the telestrator, that would be very helpful. 222 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:44,335 Look what happened a minute after launch. 223 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:47,535 Look at this very, very slow... Look at that piece, right there. 224 00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:49,255 What was that? 225 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:53,975 There was a piece of debris which struck the shuttle as it came off. 226 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,455 Was it a piece of foam? Was it a piece of ice? 227 00:15:56,480 --> 00:15:59,375 The question was, what did it do? 228 00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:03,415 I still didn't know for sure. I still was the armchair analyst. 229 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:07,335 But Challenger was deep in our memory 230 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:10,175 and this was a similar scenario. 231 00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:13,695 In the wake of Challenger, 232 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:16,735 NASA management just tried to shut everything down, 233 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:19,855 and it created a huge amount of bad blood between the media... 234 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:22,095 It made NASA look guilty as hell. 235 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:25,935 How will they respond to this? 236 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:32,095 What is this going to do to the space program me? 237 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:34,495 The second shuttle craft lost. 238 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:37,935 It was my worst nightmare. 239 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:42,695 Painful. 240 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:50,175 Such a searing memory of Challenger and how much it had defined NASA. 241 00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:55,775 This was the very last thing I had thought that I would be reporting 242 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:58,695 to the President on this day or any other day. 243 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,495 I called the White House, told him that we don't know a lot 244 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:08,215 but we have just lost Shuttle Columbia. This was my duty... 245 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:11,135 ...to be responsible for this accident. 246 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:16,095 My fellow Americans... 247 00:17:16,120 --> 00:17:21,455 ...this day has brought terrible news and great sadness to our country. 248 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:25,855 The Columbia is lost. 249 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:28,175 There are no survivors. 250 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,575 All Americans today are thinking as well 251 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:36,415 of the families of these men and women 252 00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:39,295 who have been given this sudden shock and grief. 253 00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:43,975 They gave their lives for us and we want everybody to know 254 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,975 how much we appreciate that, especially their families, 255 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:50,335 because it's the most precious gift they could give. 256 00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:57,695 When we drove up in front of our house... 257 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:00,375 ...our whole street, all of our neighbours, 258 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:03,175 were standing outside of our house to welcome us. 259 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,655 just hugged and cried in the street. 260 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:13,735 We walk into the house that my brother and I had decorated 261 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:18,695 to welcome my clad home, and now we have to take this down. 262 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:20,775 Like, this is.... He's not here. 263 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:25,455 We were home... 264 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:28,255 ...but it wasn't the same. 265 00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:35,255 The solution for the first day was... 266 00:18:35,280 --> 00:18:38,055 ...drink alcohol and talk. 267 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,135 I mean, drinking - a lot. 268 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:45,575 Until I'm just passed out. 269 00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:51,455 Going home, you go through it all over again. 270 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:53,255 You realise... 271 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:57,935 ...she's not going to come back. 272 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:01,695 So it was kind of hopeless. 273 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:05,815 Nothing really matters any more. 274 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:12,095 I mean, honestly, the only goal I had... 275 00:19:12,120 --> 00:19:15,495 ...was simply just to keep him alive. I mean, literally. 276 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:18,975 It's like, I don't want him to get to that despondent stage where 277 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:23,215 he just says, you know, "|'m going to check out and join Mom now." 278 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:33,935 This happened under my watch. 279 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:37,615 But I didn't have the answers. 280 00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:40,495 In every public forum I'm going to have to be in, 281 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,735 how am I going to explain this to anybody? 282 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:52,495 We're going to find out, we hope, in a few minutes, what NASA knows. 283 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:58,335 NASA, as an agency, will have a lot of tough, pointed questions, 284 00:19:58,360 --> 00:20:00,015 asking specifics. 285 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,175 At this time we have no indication that the mishap was caused 286 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,695 by anything or anyone on the ground. 287 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,695 Welcome to the Johnson Space Center. 288 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:10,735 To my left is Ron Dittemore. 289 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:12,775 He's the Space Shuttle Programme Manager. 290 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:15,935 We're devastated... 291 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:20,015 ...because of the events that unfolded this morning. 292 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:25,375 Do you have any idea how much of a damage area may have been left on 293 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:28,495 the left wing and how big that piece of foam was that came off? 294 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:30,815 Tell me who's leading this investigation. 295 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:32,975 We'd heard some reports that during launch 296 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:35,735 there had been some concerns that some debris hit the wing. 297 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:38,135 ls that true and is that any cause of concern that 298 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:40,575 that could have caused today's problems? 299 00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:44,095 It is true. It was judged that that event 300 00:20:44,120 --> 00:20:46,935 did not represent a safety concern. 301 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,975 We have appointed a Mishap Investigation Board, 302 00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:57,215 an external group, people who are independent from NASA, to ascertain 303 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:01,055 the causes and the circumstances under which the tragedy occurred. 304 00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:04,455 My thoughts are on what we missed... 305 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:07,935 ...what I missed... 306 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:11,495 ...to allow this to happen, 307 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,175 but I guarantee you we're going to fix it. 308 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,815 I was playing tennis in McLean, Virginia. 309 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:24,495 I received a phone call... 310 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,695 ...saying that I would be flown immediately 311 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:30,895 to Barksdale Air Force Base. 312 00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:35,295 After Challenger, NASA had a contingency plan 313 00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:37,335 in case there was a shuttle accident. 314 00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:40,655 I never really imagined that it would happen. 315 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:46,175 With Columbia, we had people who had experience 316 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:48,135 with accident investigation 317 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:50,855 from the military, Navy and Air Force, on the team. 318 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:54,935 I came to the investigation 319 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:57,695 as a helicopter pilot who knew something 320 00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:00,215 about doing accident investigations. 321 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:04,175 I did not come to the investigation as a Space Shuttle expert. 322 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:08,815 I literally knew nothing about how the shuttle was put together. 323 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:13,215 We needed NASA's help because, by definition, 324 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:17,975 everybody who came in as an external part of the investigation team 325 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,495 is not a Space Shuttle expert. 326 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,495 There was years of shuttle program me knowledge 327 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:25,895 that we needed to learn very quickly. 328 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:29,935 From what we understand, a piece of foam insulation 329 00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:31,695 came off during lift-off. 330 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:35,415 This piece hit part of the left side of the shuttle 331 00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,335 and they don't know if there was any damage or not. 332 00:22:38,360 --> 00:22:40,335 Very early on, NASA told us that 333 00:22:40,360 --> 00:22:42,975 they knew about a foam...a debris event. 334 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:46,215 But we didn't even know enough about the shuttle 335 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:49,175 to understand that there was foam on the tanks. 336 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,175 The press wants to know what happened, and it's like... 337 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,215 ...yep, so do we. 338 00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,175 REPORTER: The recovery effort is massive, 339 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:01,055 involving dozens of agencies, 340 00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,775 covering many hundreds of square miles. 341 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:08,255 It's the largest recovery effort that has ever been attempted 342 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:10,295 in this country. 343 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:15,375 As an investigator, I wanted as ironclad a case 344 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:19,495 as we could possibly have for the sequence of events 345 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,495 leading to the cause of the crash of Space Shuttle Columbia. 346 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:26,215 But if we were going to do that, 347 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:31,175 we needed to collect all the debris and reconstruct the shuttle. 348 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,575 1,200 sites have been identified. 349 00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,735 All those pieces will be brought to the Kennedy Space Center, 350 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,855 where Columbia will be reassembled, in a manner-of-speaking. 351 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:47,175 Literally thousands of pieces of debris are now pieces to a puzzle. 352 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:51,215 They've already made hundreds of finds, 353 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,415 from tiny scraps of metal to whole panels... 354 00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:58,935 ...and the tragic but inevitable discovery of human remains. 355 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:11,495 A spacecraft breaking up at 190,000 feet. 356 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:15,255 It's something you couldn't, like, get out of your mind. 357 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,735 I mean, I'd been in space before. 358 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,255 This was something I was about to do again. 359 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:27,935 Ancl then this horrific thing happens to my classmates, 360 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:31,175 my co-workers, friends. 361 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:38,175 So I called the constable ancl I said, "Hey, I need a helicopter. 362 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:40,455 "I've got to get to East Texas." 363 00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,815 On the way, you could see there were pieces of Space Shuttle, 364 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:51,935 thousands and thousands of pieces, all over the place. 365 00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:01,295 So, we land on the high school... 366 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,495 ...it was a high school football field, and, erm... 367 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,975 ...a police officer said to me, he says, 368 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:11,215 "Hey, we have a report of one of the crew members' bodies." 369 00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:18,935 I was the first person there from NASA. 370 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:22,775 This was not something I was trained for. 371 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,935 We just try to do the best job we can to handle this 372 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,455 as respectfully as possible. 373 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:38,935 For decades, the American space program me has been a source 374 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:41,575 of great technological innovation. 375 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,975 But that hard-won reputation is looking badly knocked. 376 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:49,495 For many of the thousands who work at the Lyndon Johnson Space Center 377 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,735 in Houston, today was the first day back at work since the disaster. 378 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:57,455 They'd apparently been encouraged not to talk to the press. 379 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:03,975 The investigators rented a building right outside the gate. 380 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:06,495 I felt OK. I felt, "This is a good thing, 381 00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:09,215 "this has to happen, I hope they're thorough." 382 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:12,055 Inside, the internal conflict was building. 383 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:15,495 Getting angry at management, and it was very public arguments. 384 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:18,175 It wasn't just one-on-one. It was out in the hallways. 385 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,455 It was so accusatory. 386 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,055 There was so much anger and frustration. 387 00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:30,975 On the first clay that we went into johns on Space Center, 388 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:34,615 there were people who received us very well. 389 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:39,255 There were people who were not happy that we were here. 390 00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:45,175 I was one of the first people to be... 391 00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:48,015 ...interviewed and interrogated. 392 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:54,655 They had access to everything - all videos, all data, all emails. 393 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:56,695 People had to comply. 394 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,495 In some cases, we're asking for data, and they'd be like, 395 00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:04,655 "I can't give you that information right now. 396 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:06,495 "You're going to have to go up through 397 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:08,975 "a very formal NASA chain of command to be approved." 398 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:11,735 Generally speaking, who were the ones who were less keen 399 00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:14,495 for your help, or less pleased you were there, perhaps? 400 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:19,495 I think the folks that were probably less interested in our help 401 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:23,855 were more at the management level in NASA. 402 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:25,895 I call it the Managers' Club. 403 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:30,855 It's a type of a culture 404 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,335 where there are rules of behaviour and ways of talking. 405 00:27:34,360 --> 00:27:36,975 You don't jump the chain of command. 406 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:40,295 And that's insulting, to go up to someone higher and ask directly. 407 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,655 You're supposed to co-ordinate all your questions, especially harsh 408 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,695 or strong questions to managers. You don't do that directly. 409 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:49,095 You use the intermediaries to do that. 410 00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:53,455 You don't talk bluntly or pose questions like that 411 00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,375 to a NASA manager. 412 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:01,255 Are you going to risk your career in NASA by standing up 413 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,375 and arguing with the chain of command? 414 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:07,975 Because that can be very career limiting 415 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:12,215 and you find yourself shuffled off into a windowless room 416 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,895 and, you know, just going through paperwork. 417 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:22,935 I want the system, I want the NASA manager culture, confronted. 418 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,495 Good afternoon, everybody, 419 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,455 and welcome to the johns on Space Center for today's briefing. 420 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,375 Again joining me is Shuttle Programme Manager Ron Dittemore. 421 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:37,455 Today, I brought with me... 422 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:43,375 ...a piece of foam, and I think we've made some foam available to you, 423 00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:48,935 so that you can get an understanding of the composition of this material. 424 00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,015 It's very lightweight, which is logical. 425 00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:59,735 You would want it to be lightweight because the more weight you put 426 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:03,975 on the tank, the less up-mass you could launch into an orbit. 427 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:09,415 So it's difficult for us to believe as engineers, as management, 428 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:13,815 and as a team, that this particular piece of foam debris 429 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:17,495 shedding from the tank represented a safety-of-flight issue. 430 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:22,695 I caught some segment that Ron got into 431 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,935 in which he said in a declarative voice... 432 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:31,935 Right now, it just does not make sense to us that a piece of debris 433 00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:34,495 would be the root cause... 434 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:37,455 ...for the loss of Columbia and its crew. 435 00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:40,935 There's got to be another reason. 436 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:45,175 How can he say that? Where is he getting that from? 437 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:46,775 What a big denial. 438 00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:49,495 To be certain it was foam is nonsense, right? 439 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:54,175 But to be certain it wasn't foam is equally nonsense, right? 440 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:55,815 Ancl that's what they were saying. 441 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:57,935 It's not foam. Well, how do you know? 442 00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:02,175 I know from the accident investigation team's perspective, 443 00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:06,735 no-one was going to go public and say, "We know what didn't happen." 444 00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:08,735 Can you get that shot right there? 445 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,295 That's a NASA official. He's holding a piece of foam, 446 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,495 which he is now saying could not have had enough impact because 447 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:18,095 it's too light to have damaged those tiles that we've been talking about. 448 00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:23,175 I knew Ron, I had respect for Ron, Ron was Linda Ham's boss, 449 00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,495 and a good manager, 450 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,935 but what's always the first step in...in grief? 451 00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:31,455 Denial. 452 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:40,295 I called Ron and we had a very brief conversation. 453 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:42,735 I said, "Ron, let me just remind you, OK? 454 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,735 "We've got a clear understanding that we are not going to 455 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:50,455 "eliminate ANYTHING until the data has come in 456 00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,615 "to definitively eliminate it." 457 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:57,015 To bring that out and dismiss it, you know, pre-emptively, 458 00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:58,775 I think speaks volumes. 459 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:01,495 At the very least they had to acknowledge it, 460 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,895 but it was acknowledging their own mistakes. 461 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,415 And that's hard to do. 462 00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:22,775 Each week, there was a new trailer-load of debris showed up, 463 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:25,375 came right in this hangar, through those doors, 464 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:29,095 and it would be catalogued and then put out on the floor. 465 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:34,375 I want to know what the debris is telling us, 466 00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:36,855 I want to know what the aerodynamics are telling us, 467 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,295 and I want to know what the sensors are telling us. 468 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,855 You know, follow the debris. What's it telling you? 469 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:50,735 Ancl if you follow the logic, 470 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:54,855 you begin to see pieces that are telling you a story. 471 00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:01,175 As we were progressing through the left-wing reconstruction, 472 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,015 you can see these burned tiles. 473 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:08,135 This reinforced carbon-carbon looks like it's been burned 474 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,655 in a way that's very different than everything else. 475 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:16,895 All of that data pointed to a problem at RCC Panel #8. 476 00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:23,415 Something very different happened in this location on the orbiter 477 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,815 and so let's go see if we can understand what that was. 478 00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:34,015 OK, so as the vehicle is entering the atmosphere, 479 00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:37,495 these black tiles are protecting the structure, 480 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:40,975 the aluminium of the vehicle, in high-heat areas, 481 00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:45,375 and the grey is the wing leading edge reinforced carbon-carbon - 482 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:47,175 RCC panels. 483 00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,975 Those protect the vehicle from the highest level of heat, 484 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:57,455 those 3,000-degree temperatures, so that you don't get metal melting. 485 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:06,335 But we had never had any experience in breaking a panel. 486 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:16,495 What was starting to join up was, you've got video analysis 487 00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:20,695 that says the strike on the orbiter created a hole in the wing. 488 00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:29,855 Ancl you can see that there had been some sort of penetration 489 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:32,455 against the RCC panel. 490 00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,215 Hot gas had entered 491 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,215 and the shuttle had lost aerodynamic control and crashed. 492 00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:44,055 But I think the challenge for a lot of folks at NASA 493 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,695 was believing that foam had clone that. 494 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:53,815 They would say foam can't break reinforced carbon-carbon. 495 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:55,655 There were a lot of people that said 496 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:57,855 there's something else that explains this. 497 00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:01,655 There are dramatic new details tonight from NASA 498 00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:05,815 on what scientists knew and when they knew it about possible trouble 499 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:09,895 that could put the Columbia Shuttle astronauts' lives in danger. 500 00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:13,375 The Observer moves the story forward, saying that there have been 501 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,695 repeated warnings about safety at NASA over the past couple of years. 502 00:34:19,240 --> 00:34:22,775 We decided to ask NASA about the history of foam strikes, 503 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:24,615 which had never been clone. 504 00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:28,735 I was asked by the accident investigation team 505 00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,815 to help find that type of information. 506 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,775 I went through a database... 507 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:38,935 ...and I was shocked to find that there were over 508 00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:40,695 a half a dozen occurrences. 509 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:45,815 We turned that in to the investigation board 510 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:48,535 and I said, "You're not going to believe this. Take a look at this." 511 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:55,335 1983 was the first bipod ramp foam loss. 512 00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:57,735 1990. 513 00:34:57,760 --> 00:34:59,375 1992. 514 00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:01,055 '92 again. 515 00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:02,935 1994. 516 00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:08,215 As well as those bigger pieces, we saw small pieces of foam 517 00:35:08,240 --> 00:35:12,255 fall away all the time - what we call "popcorning". 518 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:16,975 Think of popcorn. When popcorn pops, it pops up and comes out, 519 00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:19,455 and so that's what we called it - "popcorning". 520 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,175 They weren't very big, so you're not talking about 521 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:24,615 much damage to the tiles, 522 00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:27,095 and so it had become the norm at NASA. 523 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:30,535 This mantra, "|t's only foam, it's only foam." 524 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:33,735 "Hey, we see foam loss all the time and it never did any damage 525 00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:37,575 "to the vehicle and we don't have to worry about it. It's only foam". 526 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:49,455 Two missions before Columbia, it happened on STS-112 Atlantis. 527 00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,455 A significant strike hit the skirt of the solid rocket booster 528 00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,455 and actually put a dent in it. 529 00:36:02,720 --> 00:36:05,095 Prior to the launch of Columbia, 530 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,935 in a couple of the meetings, the topic of foam 531 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,255 coming off 112 came up. 532 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:12,935 There's probably, erm... 533 00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:15,495 ..15 to 20 people around the table, 534 00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:18,935 and then there's a lot of other people at NASA in the room. 535 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:25,495 We talked about starting to look into this a little bit more 536 00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:29,895 because we've seen it come off on, you know, more than one flight now. 537 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,455 It could certainly be an issue and we should understand 538 00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:34,455 if there's a way to prevent it. 539 00:36:36,240 --> 00:36:40,935 Late October of 2002, after STS-112 Atlantis, 540 00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:44,455 I went to a meeting about that flight. 541 00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,495 I had put together a report 542 00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:49,735 about the foam loss and the damage to the solid rocket booster, 543 00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:52,375 and I presented the case that said... 544 00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:56,575 ...that amount of foam, that mass, 545 00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:00,935 in one chunk, coming off Shuttle Atlantis... 546 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:06,935 ...this was the vehicle telling us something is wrong, 547 00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:08,855 here's your warning. 548 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:16,455 At risk of being insubordinate, I said to the heads 549 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:19,455 of the Shuttle Programme sitting around the centre table, 550 00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:24,255 I was adamant at that meeting, either fix the problem 551 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:28,935 or don't fly an external tank on the next launch, which is impossible. 552 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:37,655 From that meeting, I never heard any discussion of... 553 00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,495 .."Let's wait and see if we can solve some of this. 554 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:42,975 "Let's get a better understanding of this before 555 00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:46,055 "we schedule the next launch." None of that I ever heard. 556 00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:48,815 In other words, again, they were thinking it was more 557 00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,935 of a turnaround issue, and so it wasn't preventing 558 00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,855 shuttle flights from going forward. 559 00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,935 The pressure on the management team to stay on schedule 560 00:37:59,960 --> 00:38:04,375 and the concept of "it's just foam" 561 00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,215 is leading the charge through all of this. 562 00:38:07,240 --> 00:38:10,655 So it wasn't like they weren't talking about issues at all, 563 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:14,175 but there certainly was a big focus on the schedule. 564 00:38:18,240 --> 00:38:21,855 Here's an email. It's Tuesday, January 21st. 565 00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:26,895 This was sent six clays into the Columbia mission. 566 00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:33,295 This is a private exchange between Linda Ham and Ron Dittemore, 567 00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,175 two of the top managers in the program me. 568 00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:41,455 "The external tank rationale for flight for the STS-112 569 00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,695 "loss of foam was lousy. 570 00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:48,735 "The rationale states we haven't changed anything, 571 00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:52,735 "we haven't experienced any safety flight damage in 112 flights." 572 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:57,695 The concluding sentence, "Rationale was lousy then and still is." 573 00:38:57,720 --> 00:39:02,615 What I take that to mean is that Linda Ham is raising a concern 574 00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:05,535 but they appear to rely on the fact that previous flights 575 00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:08,815 which had suffered this foam loss had returned safely. 576 00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:12,135 In other words, "We've gotten away with this." 577 00:39:14,240 --> 00:39:18,735 This is a failure to learn from past similar events, 578 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:22,655 simply because those flights did not have catastrophic consequences. 579 00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:27,695 The classic... The classic normalisation of deviance. 580 00:39:31,240 --> 00:39:35,215 You have to make sure that every incident 581 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:39,455 is thoroughly investigated and properly assessed. 582 00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:43,335 And that wasn't done for the 112 foam loss. 583 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:47,215 People were saying they were willing to accept the risk. 584 00:39:47,240 --> 00:39:50,455 What they didn't understand is how much risk they were accepting. 585 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:54,735 After the 112 loss, people were starting to say, 586 00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:56,935 "Maybe we're accepting too much risk." 587 00:39:56,960 --> 00:39:59,175 Yeah, I was concerned, you know... 588 00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,455 As I said, the, erm... 589 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:08,935 The sense that the risk was greater than we should be expecting, 590 00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:11,695 was starting to surface. 591 00:40:11,720 --> 00:40:14,095 We were moving in the right direction, 592 00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:15,735 we just didn't get there in time. 593 00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:20,455 We should have never launched Columbia 594 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,135 until we fixed that problem. 595 00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:34,775 Lisa Stark with ABC News. 596 00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:39,735 When you realised that you had this debris that had struck the shuttle 597 00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:42,655 and you started your analysis, what was the discussion about 598 00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:46,135 trying to take a look either through satellites or these large telescopes 599 00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:49,175 that the military has? And why was the decision made not to try that? 600 00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:53,495 We certainly had that discussion. 601 00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:58,295 We believed that taking a picture, looking for tile damage, 602 00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:02,215 it does not show us the depth of tile that may have been shaved off. 603 00:41:02,240 --> 00:41:04,735 We cannot make a determination conclusively 604 00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:07,135 whether that represents a concern or not. 605 00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:10,935 Linda, reading through the transcripts, in hindsight, 606 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:14,735 were you sufficiently open to the idea 607 00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,615 that this was a really serious problem? 608 00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:21,975 You're asking in 20-20 hindsight or what my thought was then? 609 00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:25,015 Well, it sounds like you were just kind of seeking reassurance 610 00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:27,935 that everything was OK, as opposed to digging in 611 00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:30,215 and saying, "How do we know this?" 612 00:41:30,240 --> 00:41:33,375 I didn't have a preconceived notion on the damage or the possible 613 00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:37,055 consequences and I needed to wait for them to complete their work. 614 00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:40,495 The best experts at our disposal concluded 615 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:44,375 that it was a minor problem, not a significant problem. 616 00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:48,295 They had clone the engineering assessment and evaluated it. 617 00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:51,375 They said the worst case on the RCC would be coating damage, 618 00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:53,975 which would not be a flight safety issue. 619 00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:58,495 And when you added all that up, there was no need to take pictures 620 00:41:58,520 --> 00:42:02,215 to document any evidence, because we believed it to be superficial 621 00:42:02,240 --> 00:42:05,255 and it to be a turnaround issue and not a safety issue. 622 00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:07,175 And so we didn't take any pictures. 623 00:42:09,240 --> 00:42:12,815 Had we known that there was a catastrophic situation on orbit, 624 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:15,455 we certainly would have clone everything we could... Absolutely 625 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,495 Did you know that other people at NASA, other departments, 626 00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:27,495 were also requesting images during the mission? 627 00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:30,455 I did not know at the time. I did not know. 628 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:32,135 'n. 629 00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,455 I'm not aware of anybody else during the mission saying that. 630 00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,495 I only learned later that there really were 631 00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:44,455 people outside of our team that were trying to do something about it. 632 00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:52,495 I had no idea what was happening because there was no communication. 633 00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:55,015 I'm not in the loop, I'm not in the know. 634 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,575 Nobody's talking to each other and so nobody knows what's going on. 635 00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:01,455 That's just kind of the way it was. 636 00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:08,615 NASA is a series of fiefdoms. 637 00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:12,775 Ten separate centres, each of them have their own responsibilities. 638 00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:19,255 But there isn't necessarily a lot of exchange of knowledge 639 00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:20,975 across those silos. 640 00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:24,935 Frankly, the system is not designed for good communication. 641 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:28,975 But that's not an excuse 642 00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:31,695 because this foam problem was not a new problem. 643 00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:36,655 It was ignored right up until an opportunity 644 00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:41,975 to intervene presented itself, and then that opportunity 645 00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:46,695 to get a spy satellite to take a look was dismissed. 646 00:43:48,520 --> 00:43:50,935 This sort of stick to your guns of... 647 00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:54,455 ...convincing yourself that it's OK. 648 00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:58,455 That just made matters worse. 649 00:44:03,240 --> 00:44:05,975 Why would you not just get the pictures 650 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,695 that could show the damage and then work the problem? 651 00:44:08,720 --> 00:44:10,455 Erm... 652 00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:16,335 I could only deal with the data that was presented to me. 653 00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:20,495 The whole situation was a case of people doing... 654 00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,095 ...their jobs as they understood them. 655 00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:27,455 But I think everybody was operating with good faith. There was no... 656 00:44:33,240 --> 00:44:36,215 I wouldn't say malfeasance, but negligence... 657 00:44:36,240 --> 00:44:39,375 There may have been... I don't even think there was negligence. 658 00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:43,455 I just think that the actions we took were inadequate 659 00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:45,935 for the problem we were facing. 660 00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:54,455 I think there was a mindset and sort of a hope 661 00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:59,215 that we've seen foam strikes before 662 00:44:59,240 --> 00:45:03,215 and it's never caused a safety flight issue, 663 00:45:03,240 --> 00:45:05,615 so we're assuming that's the case here. 664 00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:07,775 But not a sure thing. 665 00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:16,495 It seemed like by staying ignorant of the degree of damage, 666 00:45:16,520 --> 00:45:19,535 the mission management team perhaps didn't want to know 667 00:45:19,560 --> 00:45:21,095 about the worst-case scenario. 668 00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:35,975 At this point, from our work in the hangar, 669 00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:39,135 I think we have enough information to say 670 00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:43,575 that we've found the physical cause of the shuttle crash. 671 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,135 But there were still people at NASA who didn't believe 672 00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:52,015 that foam could break reinforced carbon-carbon. 673 00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:55,495 At that point, the only question that was really left 674 00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:58,975 to tie the whole chain of events together was, 675 00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:01,935 does foam break reinforced carbon-carbon? 676 00:46:10,240 --> 00:46:14,295 We're here at Southwest Research Institute in San Antonio, Texas, 677 00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:19,055 to conduct a test designed to show whether foam 678 00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:21,895 that fell off the external tank of the Columbia Orbiter 679 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:25,455 could create a hole big enough to destroy the vehicle. 680 00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:31,335 How does NASA move forward if we don't do the foam test? 681 00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:33,015 We need to do this. 682 00:46:36,240 --> 00:46:38,855 Everything came down to whether or not the foam shot 683 00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:40,815 was going to break an RCC panel. 684 00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:45,495 But if our investigative analysis is wrong, 685 00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:47,655 then what? 686 00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:52,735 Five, four, three, two, one. 687 00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:56,175 Whoa! 688 00:47:08,720 --> 00:47:12,615 OK, foam will break reinforced carbon-carbon 689 00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:18,935 I mean, there was no doubt at that point, right? Case closed. 690 00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:21,775 There's no denying it. 691 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:25,455 You know, there was foam falling from clay one. 692 00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:29,815 They should have had that test clone clay two. 693 00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:34,455 This was a known failure. 694 00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:39,895 But I think the failure to imagine being wrong, 695 00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:43,415 the failure to imagine the consequences of failure 696 00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:45,215 were catastrophic. 697 00:47:45,240 --> 00:47:51,855 Ancl I think it's this whole notion of the failure to imagine failure. 698 00:47:56,240 --> 00:47:59,615 NASA's trying to move forward after Tuesday's blistering report, 699 00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:02,975 blaming it for failing to prevent the Shuttle Columbia tragedy. 700 00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:06,815 NASA stands accused of complacency, of a flawed safety culture, 701 00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:09,215 of major management failures. 702 00:48:09,240 --> 00:48:13,135 This stinging report, with its 29 recommendations, is not just about 703 00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:16,255 technical failures, but also about a human failure. 704 00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:20,735 NASA had conflicting goals of cost, schedule and safety. 705 00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:23,735 It's our view that clearly there is still evidence 706 00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:27,695 of a silent safety program me with echoes of Challenger. 707 00:48:28,720 --> 00:48:30,735 They knew about the foam. 708 00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:35,415 They could take pictures and people chose not to. 709 00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:42,095 Pure grief and sadness turned into more of, like, anger and disgust. 710 00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:47,095 NASA was something that I was so proud of 711 00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:49,215 because my clad loved it 712 00:48:49,240 --> 00:48:53,935 and it felt almost like they had betrayed him. 713 00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:58,975 It kind of became this inner struggle in me of... 714 00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:03,935 ...how can I hate this thing that, like, my clad loved so much? 715 00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:05,895 Why? 716 00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,935 Why? Those are the questions that you can't answer. 717 00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:13,375 The only...the only reason... 718 00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:17,695 ...was because of the way they made decisions within that culture. 719 00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:23,215 If there was damage, could it have been detected in space 720 00:49:23,240 --> 00:49:26,175 and some rescue plan conceived? We'll never know. 721 00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:29,495 Astronauts learn of the foam hit. 722 00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:33,535 They are sent this grainy video and an email that dismisses 723 00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:36,855 the foam hit as, quote, "not even worth mentioning". 724 00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:40,855 Knowing that concerns had been downplayed to the crew, 725 00:49:40,880 --> 00:49:42,575 I felt angry. 726 00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,055 I mean, I just was extremely disappointed. 727 00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:49,215 I think that Rick would have wanted to have known 728 00:49:49,240 --> 00:49:52,095 that something was very wrong with the vehicle. 729 00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:56,615 One of the things that I thought was such an indictment 730 00:49:56,640 --> 00:50:00,975 was that the astronauts were expected to successfully fly 731 00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:05,335 this multimillion dollar mission and were given that responsibility, 732 00:50:05,360 --> 00:50:07,175 but they had no authority. 733 00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:15,495 In terms of a hypothetical, and I think other people 734 00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:18,575 in senior levels that probably felt the same way, 735 00:50:18,600 --> 00:50:21,375 if we knew that the crew wasn't going to survive, 736 00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:23,895 why would we tell them? Why wouldn't we let them 737 00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:26,895 just carry out their mission and feel like they were successful? 738 00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:33,975 I regret that I didn't do more, but given what we know now, 739 00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:37,255 it's unlikely anything I could have done would have made a difference. 740 00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:42,775 I feel ashamed. 741 00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,935 So, who's guilty? I'm not just going to say the program me managers are. 742 00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:50,735 We're all guilty. 743 00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:53,375 If you don't speak up for your own system 744 00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:57,335 and you're the victims of this environment, we're guilty, too. 745 00:51:00,240 --> 00:51:04,255 Yes, there were individuals who made very poor decisions. 746 00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:08,975 You need to embrace dissenting opinions, 747 00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:13,975 and if somebody says, "Hey, let's get better data to make a decision", 748 00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:18,175 why is getting better data a problem? 749 00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:23,175 But, I mean, I was in mission control, I was a NASA employee, 750 00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:24,975 I knew about the foam strike. 751 00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:29,215 When there's blame that's laid out, I'm right up there saying, "I knew." 752 00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:33,775 And... And I wish I could have done something differently 753 00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:37,815 but I...| can't undo that, and it... 754 00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:41,375 You can just make it better for those that follow. 755 00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:47,895 I fought, but I share some of the blame 756 00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:50,255 that says maybe I could have fought harder. 757 00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:54,735 But the thing I can't get past is, 758 00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:59,135 if we knew entry was going to cause loss of the vehicle 759 00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:02,295 and loss of the crew, there are things we can do as human beings. 760 00:52:03,520 --> 00:52:07,655 Ancl that is, for the families, the chance to be able to say goodbye. 761 00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:14,535 That wasn't afforded to anyone. 762 00:52:15,960 --> 00:52:17,775 Ancl that's always haunted me. 763 00:52:21,720 --> 00:52:23,255 Sorry. 764 00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:33,095 During the mission, I could have easily clone a story 765 00:52:33,120 --> 00:52:35,055 because I saw the foam come off. 766 00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:39,135 While NASA is saying it's nothing, some engineers believed 767 00:52:39,160 --> 00:52:41,935 there might be some concern. What if I had clone that? 768 00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:46,815 I was the one who could have, you know, should have and could have 769 00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:48,975 owned that story in a way that potentially 770 00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:51,295 even might have changed the course of events. 771 00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:59,935 I didn't stay on that story, in order to go be the person explaining 772 00:52:59,960 --> 00:53:02,855 all the clever ways we were going to kill people in Iraq. 773 00:53:09,520 --> 00:53:11,775 Ancl maybe I was doing what NASA was doing. 774 00:53:11,800 --> 00:53:14,015 I was sweeping it all under the rug. 775 00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:19,975 Ancl so I'm part of the problem, you know? I'm complicit. 776 00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:29,215 If you could say anything to those individuals, the managers, 777 00:53:29,240 --> 00:53:34,175 the engineers, the top bosses at NASA who made those decisions, 778 00:53:34,200 --> 00:53:36,175 what would you say now? 779 00:53:36,200 --> 00:53:38,775 Yeah, erm... 780 00:53:38,800 --> 00:53:42,455 I never really thought about it, but I guess I would want them 781 00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:45,455 to know that I forgive them 782 00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:48,175 and that my family forgives them. 783 00:53:49,520 --> 00:53:54,935 Ancl that I can't imagine what they went through, 784 00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:57,215 having to make those decisions. 785 00:53:57,240 --> 00:54:00,095 Like, that breaks my heart thinking about it. 786 00:54:00,120 --> 00:54:01,535 Erm... 787 00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:06,215 But just that I'm not angry about it any more. 788 00:54:06,240 --> 00:54:09,135 Ancl it happened, but I don't blame them. 789 00:54:09,160 --> 00:54:11,575 I don't think that they're bad people. 790 00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:15,495 In the end, after I go down that journey of what-if'ing 791 00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:18,695 and if someone had done this, if someone had not done that, 792 00:54:18,720 --> 00:54:22,775 in the end, it all comes out the same - that the crew perished, 793 00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:24,735 that everyone died. 794 00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:27,935 And so, for me, I had to very, erm... 795 00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:33,495 ...purposely make a decision that this was not going to be something 796 00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:35,975 that was going to define me for the rest of my life - 797 00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,375 that I was going to be on a mission to fix that 798 00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:41,975 or on a mission to be angry about that or make people pay for it. 799 00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:46,695 I mean, none of that was a path I wanted to go on at all. 800 00:54:46,720 --> 00:54:50,495 And God has been very merciful to help me with that, 801 00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:52,855 just to be able to keep moving forward. 802 00:54:54,320 --> 00:54:59,495 You know, I just prayed and hoped that NASA learned from this. 803 00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:02,215 That the lessons that they learned will carry on 804 00:55:02,240 --> 00:55:05,735 to future space flights, so that they won't forget that people 805 00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:08,175 are on the end of whatever they're doing, 806 00:55:08,200 --> 00:55:10,495 that people's lives are stake. 807 00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:17,375 Rick was an astronaut. 808 00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:20,975 It was something that we always called a calculated risk 809 00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:24,455 but it was a risk that Rick decided to take. 810 00:55:24,480 --> 00:55:26,455 And I'm OK with that. 811 00:55:31,760 --> 00:55:35,455 If she had listened to me, you know, things would have been OK 812 00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:37,855 and she wouldn't have been up there. 813 00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:40,655 I had told her not to go. 814 00:55:42,240 --> 00:55:46,175 I was angry that she chose to take that risk... 815 00:55:48,200 --> 00:55:51,335 ...instead of staying with me. 816 00:55:54,240 --> 00:55:55,975 Daddy, I'm here! 817 00:55:58,600 --> 00:56:00,175 Hi. 818 00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:02,175 Oh, my gosh. 819 00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:06,935 It's crazy over here, right? 820 00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:08,575 LAUREL LAUGHS 821 00:56:08,600 --> 00:56:10,455 You need your sunglasses? 822 00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:13,455 Try them on. 823 00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:17,935 This is Laurel, and she is my daughter. 824 00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:21,455 She has a lot of my mom's spirit. 825 00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:24,935 The same enthusiasm and positivity. 826 00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:31,455 I imagine... 827 00:56:32,960 --> 00:56:34,935 ...it would be harder if... 828 00:56:35,960 --> 00:56:38,095 ...she wasn't such a great kid. 829 00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:41,175 So I got pretty lucky there. 830 00:56:55,240 --> 00:56:58,935 NASA has released video footage taken inside the cockpit 831 00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:00,975 of the Space Shuttle Columbia. 832 00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:03,855 It was recorded in the final moments before the shuttle broke up. 833 00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:08,375 The last part of the tape was burnt-up in the accident. 71175

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