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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:19,620 --> 00:00:20,999 Tonight David Morris 2 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:24,210 is starting four life sentences behind bars. 3 00:00:25,689 --> 00:00:27,619 A police escort led the killer 4 00:00:27,620 --> 00:00:30,274 of Mandy, Katie, Emily, and Doris 5 00:00:30,275 --> 00:00:33,205 away from the court, back to prison. 6 00:00:35,862 --> 00:00:37,412 -My brother's not the real man. 7 00:00:40,241 --> 00:00:41,791 He didn't do these things. 8 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:45,343 And I just hope that that Mandy's family 9 00:00:45,344 --> 00:00:47,454 can see that they've got the wrong man 10 00:00:49,241 --> 00:00:51,101 and the real killers are walking free. 11 00:00:56,758 --> 00:01:00,758 I just thought, "What's gonna happen to us now?" 12 00:01:01,862 --> 00:01:03,382 We didn't know how people were gonna react. 13 00:01:03,383 --> 00:01:06,619 We didn't know if they were gonna be violent towards us. 14 00:01:09,482 --> 00:01:11,172 But we knew we had to fight for him. 15 00:01:15,620 --> 00:01:19,792 We were so convinced we could get him out. 16 00:01:19,793 --> 00:01:21,483 He's innocent, we can get him out. 17 00:01:22,965 --> 00:01:24,965 20 years later, we're still fighting it. 18 00:01:26,862 --> 00:01:28,832 -You don't just go and murder a family 19 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:31,830 unless you've got a reason to do it. 20 00:01:31,831 --> 00:01:33,307 And they had a reason. 21 00:01:37,758 --> 00:01:38,658 They had a reason. 22 00:01:41,482 --> 00:01:42,282 Bastards. 23 00:01:48,310 --> 00:01:49,895 This was, and still is, 24 00:01:49,896 --> 00:01:51,718 the biggest murder inquiry ever seen in South Wales. 25 00:01:52,793 --> 00:01:55,033 After months of often frustrating work, 26 00:01:55,034 --> 00:01:57,792 police have now arrested a 38-year-old man 27 00:01:57,793 --> 00:01:59,103 on suspicion of murder. 28 00:03:07,344 --> 00:03:09,481 Back in court amid mid tight security, 29 00:03:09,482 --> 00:03:13,274 David Morris, the man serving at least 32 years behind bars 30 00:03:13,275 --> 00:03:15,995 for the murders of three generations of the same family. 31 00:03:18,551 --> 00:03:21,102 His family were there to support him. 32 00:03:21,103 --> 00:03:23,481 His two daughters, sister, and father, 33 00:03:23,482 --> 00:03:25,171 who've long protested his innocence 34 00:03:25,172 --> 00:03:26,932 of one of the most horrific crimes 35 00:03:26,933 --> 00:03:28,621 in British criminal history. 36 00:03:30,551 --> 00:03:32,591 Today it was claimed that David Hutchinson 37 00:03:32,592 --> 00:03:34,723 should never have represented Morris 38 00:03:34,724 --> 00:03:37,834 because he'd also acted for policeman Stephen Lewis. 39 00:03:39,586 --> 00:03:41,550 He had agreed with David Hutchinson 40 00:03:41,551 --> 00:03:43,481 that he wouldn't be blamed for the murders 41 00:03:43,482 --> 00:03:46,002 at Morris's trial in 2002. 42 00:03:50,586 --> 00:03:52,412 -I didn't quite understand conflict of interest 43 00:03:52,413 --> 00:03:54,723 at the time, but I just thought it was odd. 44 00:03:54,724 --> 00:03:56,794 I remember going in the office and saying to Hutchinson, 45 00:03:56,795 --> 00:03:58,412 "But how can you represent my brother" 46 00:03:58,413 --> 00:04:00,763 "when you've already worked for the Lewises?" 47 00:04:00,764 --> 00:04:02,895 "You know, you were their lawyer." 48 00:04:02,896 --> 00:04:04,343 My brother asked him the same question, 49 00:04:04,344 --> 00:04:06,619 "Can you actually represent me?" 50 00:04:06,620 --> 00:04:09,171 And he said the same thing to my brother, "Of course I can." 51 00:04:09,172 --> 00:04:10,103 "Of course I can." 52 00:04:10,104 --> 00:04:11,212 "I'm the best man for the job." 53 00:04:13,965 --> 00:04:15,481 Right, David, can I just say 54 00:04:15,482 --> 00:04:17,310 the reason for this interview is 'cause you've been arrested 55 00:04:17,311 --> 00:04:18,792 on suspicion of being involved in the murders 56 00:04:18,793 --> 00:04:21,309 of Doris Violet Dawson- 57 00:04:21,310 --> 00:04:25,240 - A lawyer in these circumstances representing, 58 00:04:25,241 --> 00:04:30,930 at one in the same time, competing suspects 59 00:04:30,931 --> 00:04:33,001 is an impossible situation. 60 00:04:41,275 --> 00:04:42,999 For Mandy Power's sisters and brother 61 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:45,964 it must have been an agonizing journey to the court today. 62 00:04:45,965 --> 00:04:47,999 They believe the man responsible for brutally killing 63 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,000 three generations of their family is behind bars. 64 00:04:52,517 --> 00:04:53,792 But this afternoon they had to listen 65 00:04:53,793 --> 00:04:55,757 to David Morris's barrister explain 66 00:04:55,758 --> 00:04:57,968 why he believed the conviction was unsafe. 67 00:05:00,103 --> 00:05:04,757 -The reason is obvious, that as one of these clients 68 00:05:04,758 --> 00:05:09,067 you're going to be suspecting, "Am I being told everything?" 69 00:05:09,068 --> 00:05:10,518 "Is he keeping stuff back" 70 00:05:10,519 --> 00:05:13,307 "because he's gotta protect these other clients?" 71 00:05:15,793 --> 00:05:19,274 His defense was shackled and one hand 72 00:05:19,275 --> 00:05:23,305 was tied behind the back because you couldn't develop 73 00:05:24,310 --> 00:05:26,720 the case against another suspect. 74 00:05:29,517 --> 00:05:34,517 I mean, you know, if Morris didn't do it, then who did? 75 00:05:36,448 --> 00:05:38,723 But the fact that nobody actually did anything 76 00:05:38,724 --> 00:05:40,792 about the conflict of interest 77 00:05:40,793 --> 00:05:45,447 illustrates the kind of legal claustrophobia 78 00:05:45,448 --> 00:05:49,102 that penetrates South Wales 79 00:05:49,103 --> 00:05:51,623 and has done for a very long time. 80 00:05:52,689 --> 00:05:53,519 -Innocent! 81 00:05:55,310 --> 00:05:56,240 -Fucking innocent, man. 82 00:05:56,241 --> 00:05:57,141 Fucking set up. 83 00:05:58,862 --> 00:06:00,447 I wanted to do the case 84 00:06:00,448 --> 00:06:04,518 because I've done a lot of cases out of South Wales. 85 00:06:06,172 --> 00:06:07,723 The Cardiff Three would spend 86 00:06:07,724 --> 00:06:10,757 four years in jail before being released on appeal. 87 00:06:10,758 --> 00:06:11,586 -M25- 88 00:06:11,587 --> 00:06:12,964 -Fucking justice, man. 89 00:06:12,965 --> 00:06:14,412 Justice. 90 00:06:14,413 --> 00:06:18,757 -The reason why it's so appalling is it demonstrates 91 00:06:18,758 --> 00:06:22,102 a willingness by a large number of police officers 92 00:06:22,103 --> 00:06:25,073 essentially to fit up the wrong people. 93 00:06:27,620 --> 00:06:29,378 Wayne and Paul Darvell, 94 00:06:29,379 --> 00:06:32,033 free men after seven long years in custody 95 00:06:32,034 --> 00:06:34,412 for a murder they didn't commit. 96 00:06:34,413 --> 00:06:36,071 South Wales Police had doctored, 97 00:06:36,072 --> 00:06:37,723 planted, and suppressed evidence, 98 00:06:37,724 --> 00:06:39,622 altering notes of Wayne's confession, 99 00:06:39,623 --> 00:06:41,033 holding back tape recordings 100 00:06:41,034 --> 00:06:43,002 of the men's conversation in custody, 101 00:06:43,003 --> 00:06:44,481 and halting forensic tests 102 00:06:44,482 --> 00:06:47,585 that were inconsistent with the brothers' guilt. 103 00:06:47,586 --> 00:06:48,999 The killing of Cardiff newsagent 104 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:50,826 Philip Saunders was a brutal one. 105 00:06:50,827 --> 00:06:52,688 He was bludgeoned to death on his doorstep 106 00:06:52,689 --> 00:06:54,723 in the Canton area of the city. 107 00:06:54,724 --> 00:06:56,214 The conviction of three teenagers 108 00:06:56,215 --> 00:06:59,171 was based partly on an alleged confession. 109 00:06:59,172 --> 00:07:01,930 -All three defendants received life sentences. 110 00:07:01,931 --> 00:07:05,136 As he was taken down, O'Brien turned to the public gallery 111 00:07:05,137 --> 00:07:07,477 and shouted, "I didn't do it, Dad." 112 00:07:13,172 --> 00:07:14,382 -If I had not gone through 113 00:07:14,383 --> 00:07:16,999 my 11 years and 43 days of imprisonment, 114 00:07:18,275 --> 00:07:19,999 I probably would've been one of those persons 115 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,970 who think the police would do no wrong. 116 00:07:25,206 --> 00:07:27,619 Michael O'Brien finally stepped out of prison 117 00:07:27,620 --> 00:07:29,309 late this afternoon. 118 00:07:29,310 --> 00:07:31,550 He was immediately surrounded by his family, 119 00:07:31,551 --> 00:07:33,791 who'd been waiting 11 years for this day. 120 00:07:36,793 --> 00:07:38,213 -I don't know what champagne tastes like, 121 00:07:38,214 --> 00:07:39,646 but I'm sure gonna find out. 122 00:07:44,275 --> 00:07:46,447 My stepfather died when I was inside 123 00:07:46,448 --> 00:07:48,898 and my daughter died when I was inside. 124 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,412 I should have been with my wife at the time 125 00:07:52,413 --> 00:07:55,861 and with my child, and I wasn't with 'em. 126 00:07:55,862 --> 00:07:57,212 I was taken away from them. 127 00:07:59,068 --> 00:08:02,412 When I was released and I was on the Court of Appeal steps, 128 00:08:02,413 --> 00:08:03,964 you know what I mean, I was quite angry. 129 00:08:03,965 --> 00:08:05,861 I can remember walking up to the microphone saying, 130 00:08:05,862 --> 00:08:08,072 you know, I was gonna be South Wales Police's 131 00:08:08,073 --> 00:08:10,309 worst nightmare for what they did to me. 132 00:08:10,310 --> 00:08:14,343 And I meant every word of it because I had 11 years of hell. 133 00:08:14,344 --> 00:08:16,343 There's no other word for it. 134 00:08:16,344 --> 00:08:18,964 And I would not be able to sleep at night 135 00:08:18,965 --> 00:08:22,240 knowing that an innocent man is in prison 136 00:08:22,241 --> 00:08:24,102 if I didn't get involved and try 137 00:08:24,103 --> 00:08:25,723 and do something to rectify it. 138 00:08:27,758 --> 00:08:29,378 Somebody else could be in the same position 139 00:08:29,379 --> 00:08:32,792 as what I was in, and I am very, very worried 140 00:08:32,793 --> 00:08:34,003 at David Morris's case. 141 00:08:34,004 --> 00:08:35,481 However, I must say- 142 00:08:35,482 --> 00:08:39,067 I was there at the appeal and I met the family, 143 00:08:39,068 --> 00:08:40,447 you know, I met Debra, 144 00:08:40,448 --> 00:08:43,999 and it was clearly something wasn't right here. 145 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,309 There was never no direct link, no DNA evidence 146 00:08:47,310 --> 00:08:49,654 which linked Dai Morris to the crime. 147 00:08:49,655 --> 00:08:51,792 And that's what made me sort of look at it 148 00:08:51,793 --> 00:08:54,343 and think this is a miscarriage of justice. 149 00:08:54,344 --> 00:08:56,314 There's no doubt about it in my mind. 150 00:09:05,172 --> 00:09:06,481 -The Clydach murder case, 151 00:09:06,482 --> 00:09:08,964 which has haunted a Swansea Valley community 152 00:09:08,965 --> 00:09:12,585 for six long years is to be sent for retrial. 153 00:09:12,586 --> 00:09:14,343 Former builder's laborer David Morris 154 00:09:14,344 --> 00:09:16,999 has won his appeal against conviction. 155 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:19,274 -The court decided that the conflict of interest 156 00:09:19,275 --> 00:09:21,240 was the fatal flaw which pervaded 157 00:09:21,241 --> 00:09:23,412 the entire conduct of the defense. 158 00:09:23,413 --> 00:09:25,412 On that basis, the conviction was quashed. 159 00:09:25,413 --> 00:09:27,071 A retrial will now follow. 160 00:09:27,072 --> 00:09:28,897 -Well, we can go live now to Swansea 161 00:09:28,898 --> 00:09:30,757 and our chief reporter, Penny Roberts. 162 00:09:30,758 --> 00:09:31,930 Penny. 163 00:09:31,931 --> 00:09:32,761 -Thanks Jane. 164 00:09:32,762 --> 00:09:34,136 Well you join me at- 165 00:09:34,137 --> 00:09:38,857 At the first trial I was filing from Swansea Crown Court 166 00:09:40,172 --> 00:09:44,447 at lunchtime, in the evening a report, do a live, 167 00:09:44,448 --> 00:09:48,343 you know, for three months virtually every night. 168 00:09:48,344 --> 00:09:51,516 Now, nearly six years after the murders of their loved ones, 169 00:09:51,517 --> 00:09:54,826 Mandy Power's family face the ordeal of another trial. 170 00:09:54,827 --> 00:09:59,827 All this time had passed and we were back to square one. 171 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:08,481 -Mansfield, he did a brilliant job. 172 00:10:08,482 --> 00:10:11,412 You know, he was second to none in the court. 173 00:10:11,413 --> 00:10:12,763 We thought, "This is it." 174 00:10:12,764 --> 00:10:16,826 "This is gonna be when he's coming home." 175 00:10:16,827 --> 00:10:18,897 But then Mansfield couldn't stay with us. 176 00:10:18,898 --> 00:10:20,792 He was in the middle of something else. 177 00:10:20,793 --> 00:10:25,553 And so it was massive blow, massive blow, and we lost him. 178 00:10:30,655 --> 00:10:33,475 -He just, he was taken notice of. 179 00:10:37,275 --> 00:10:39,274 He just seemed to have a really big voice 180 00:10:39,275 --> 00:10:41,240 and a big presence. 181 00:10:41,241 --> 00:10:44,792 And you could see that he would've put things across the way 182 00:10:44,793 --> 00:10:46,173 they should have been put across. 183 00:10:47,551 --> 00:10:48,831 But what happened? 184 00:10:50,655 --> 00:10:52,515 -The second trial started 185 00:10:53,655 --> 00:10:57,375 and things just seemed to fall apart. 186 00:11:02,137 --> 00:11:03,378 The second trial 187 00:11:03,379 --> 00:11:06,309 was really a rerun of the first trial. 188 00:11:06,310 --> 00:11:07,900 -Chief Reporter Penny Roberts 189 00:11:07,901 --> 00:11:10,033 has been in court for the retrial 190 00:11:10,034 --> 00:11:11,171 and has followed the story 191 00:11:11,172 --> 00:11:12,622 from the day the murders were discovered. 192 00:11:12,623 --> 00:11:16,171 -But what was very different was a very key moment 193 00:11:16,172 --> 00:11:17,412 as the trial progressed, 194 00:11:17,413 --> 00:11:19,483 when David Morris was giving evidence. 195 00:11:21,241 --> 00:11:24,521 It was, you know, vintage Patrick Harrington. 196 00:11:28,034 --> 00:11:30,554 -David Morris started giving evidence. 197 00:11:31,724 --> 00:11:33,274 He'd been given every opportunity 198 00:11:33,275 --> 00:11:35,999 to tell the truth, and he didn't. 199 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:39,412 And not only did he lie, he repeated those lies. 200 00:11:39,413 --> 00:11:40,964 He elaborated upon them. 201 00:11:40,965 --> 00:11:43,335 He changed his story time after time. 202 00:11:48,689 --> 00:11:50,999 His account had been that on the Friday 203 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:52,654 he'd gone to Mandy Power's, 204 00:11:52,655 --> 00:11:54,655 had sex, and left his chain there. 205 00:11:57,896 --> 00:12:01,516 But our scrutiny of telephone records had shown 206 00:12:01,517 --> 00:12:05,412 that there were two telephone calls made from his flat 207 00:12:05,413 --> 00:12:09,143 at the time when he says he'd been with Mandy Power. 208 00:12:12,137 --> 00:12:16,136 This new piece of evidence was a devastating point. 209 00:12:16,137 --> 00:12:18,619 We were able to prove by those phone calls 210 00:12:18,620 --> 00:12:21,210 that his account was simply untrue. 211 00:12:22,758 --> 00:12:25,447 He was like a boxer who'd been punched 212 00:12:25,448 --> 00:12:27,930 and fell back on the ropes. 213 00:12:27,931 --> 00:12:29,001 It demolished him. 214 00:12:30,862 --> 00:12:34,067 -The image of David Morris in the witness box, 215 00:12:34,068 --> 00:12:35,999 you know, he put his head in his hands. 216 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:41,895 But, you know, you could see the blood drain from his face. 217 00:12:41,896 --> 00:12:44,205 It was very, very significant. 218 00:12:44,206 --> 00:12:46,546 And I think the trial turned on that. 219 00:12:48,759 --> 00:12:50,309 After seven harrowing years 220 00:12:50,310 --> 00:12:53,067 and a three month long retrial, justice again 221 00:12:53,068 --> 00:12:54,964 for those who lost their loved ones 222 00:12:54,965 --> 00:12:57,792 in a senseless act of brutality. 223 00:12:57,793 --> 00:13:01,240 The public gallery erupted with shouts of "Yes." 224 00:13:01,241 --> 00:13:04,516 Mandy Power's family sobbed and embraced. 225 00:13:04,517 --> 00:13:07,550 In the dock, David Morris showed no emotion, 226 00:13:07,551 --> 00:13:09,826 merely turning towards his father 227 00:13:09,827 --> 00:13:11,237 and shrugging his shoulders. 228 00:13:12,793 --> 00:13:15,757 The judge then called him a savage and sadistic killer. 229 00:13:15,758 --> 00:13:18,792 "In your case," he said, "life in prison 230 00:13:18,793 --> 00:13:22,383 "should mean the whole of your life behind bars." 231 00:13:38,068 --> 00:13:41,447 Has he changed even since the last visit? 232 00:13:41,448 --> 00:13:42,278 -Mm. 233 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:46,140 But you haven't given up hope? 234 00:13:46,141 --> 00:13:47,997 -No, no. 235 00:13:49,310 --> 00:13:50,760 What about you, Adele? 236 00:13:52,413 --> 00:13:54,003 -No, I ain't given up hope. 237 00:13:57,586 --> 00:13:59,585 And how is that, 238 00:13:59,586 --> 00:14:02,136 how do you keep that hope going then? 239 00:14:02,137 --> 00:14:03,897 -I know he didn't do it. 240 00:14:08,724 --> 00:14:11,861 -Just because he's had two trials and been found guilty 241 00:14:11,862 --> 00:14:14,102 still does not make him a guilty man. 242 00:14:15,896 --> 00:14:17,309 Di Morris is in the same prison 243 00:14:17,310 --> 00:14:20,516 where I spent seven years at, 244 00:14:20,517 --> 00:14:22,657 in Long Lartin Prison in Worcestershire. 245 00:14:24,034 --> 00:14:27,654 And I can tell you now you've gotta keep yourself busy. 246 00:14:27,655 --> 00:14:29,405 That's what I did with my time. 247 00:14:30,862 --> 00:14:34,067 I mean, I used to write 70 letters a week, a week. 248 00:14:34,068 --> 00:14:38,585 I wrote to every single member of parliament, 660 MPs. 249 00:14:38,586 --> 00:14:40,447 I wrote to the House of Lords, 250 00:14:40,448 --> 00:14:42,861 members of the European Parliament. 251 00:14:42,862 --> 00:14:44,902 And, you know, I just never stopped. 252 00:14:47,137 --> 00:14:50,102 So you gotta keep hopes alive. 253 00:14:50,103 --> 00:14:52,688 And as long as you keep them hopes alive, 254 00:14:52,689 --> 00:14:54,929 you know, the truth will come out. 255 00:14:59,482 --> 00:15:02,412 -If you find yourself in prison, you can send a letter 256 00:15:02,413 --> 00:15:05,313 to the Criminal Cases Review Commission, and you can say, 257 00:15:05,314 --> 00:15:07,070 "Please investigate my case." 258 00:15:10,413 --> 00:15:14,136 Every year 1,500 people do this. 259 00:15:14,137 --> 00:15:18,517 And every year 99% of those applications are rejected. 260 00:15:20,448 --> 00:15:21,688 Nobody will help them. 261 00:15:23,758 --> 00:15:25,618 And so they come to somebody like me. 262 00:15:30,275 --> 00:15:33,826 12 years ago I got a letter from David Morris 263 00:15:33,827 --> 00:15:34,787 asking for help. 264 00:15:37,448 --> 00:15:38,619 David Morris is probably 265 00:15:38,620 --> 00:15:40,309 the most guilty person you can imagine. 266 00:15:40,310 --> 00:15:43,930 In terms of the legal system, he's as guilty as you can be. 267 00:15:43,931 --> 00:15:46,141 Everybody's looked at this case and everybody says, 268 00:15:46,142 --> 00:15:47,617 "This man is guilty." 269 00:15:52,068 --> 00:15:54,999 And so I was struggling to think, "Where can this go?" 270 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:57,688 "How can he claim that he's innocent?" 271 00:15:57,689 --> 00:16:00,930 And so I kept reading, really so that I wanted 272 00:16:00,931 --> 00:16:03,654 to sort of satisfy myself that when I said to him, 273 00:16:03,655 --> 00:16:04,964 "Look, there's nothing we can do," 274 00:16:04,965 --> 00:16:06,240 that at least I could say to him, 275 00:16:06,241 --> 00:16:07,691 "Well, I've read everything." 276 00:16:09,275 --> 00:16:11,619 But the more I read, the more unsettled, 277 00:16:11,620 --> 00:16:13,170 the more uneasy I became. 278 00:16:14,551 --> 00:16:16,861 And the more you kind of pushed against this evidence, 279 00:16:16,862 --> 00:16:21,452 you thought, "Actually, this is not what it seems to be." 280 00:16:22,758 --> 00:16:24,338 "There is something wrong here." 281 00:16:34,206 --> 00:16:36,930 I'm happiest looking through the box of files, 282 00:16:36,931 --> 00:16:38,999 looking through the evidence 283 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:40,520 with that almost obsessive 284 00:16:40,521 --> 00:16:42,967 sort of searching out for something new. 285 00:16:47,551 --> 00:16:50,001 What I discovered by going through all the files 286 00:16:50,002 --> 00:16:52,410 is that there are effectively two investigations. 287 00:16:55,862 --> 00:16:57,242 The investigation into Morris 288 00:16:57,243 --> 00:16:59,071 is the one that everybody knows about. 289 00:17:03,137 --> 00:17:06,136 It's the one where we know that he has a criminal record. 290 00:17:06,137 --> 00:17:07,826 We know that he lied. 291 00:17:07,827 --> 00:17:08,997 We know about his chain. 292 00:17:11,068 --> 00:17:14,478 But the other investigation, pretty much nobody knows about. 293 00:17:16,758 --> 00:17:17,999 And this is the investigation 294 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:20,100 into the Lewises that came before. 295 00:17:24,137 --> 00:17:25,619 And these two investigations 296 00:17:25,620 --> 00:17:27,380 sit very uncomfortably together. 297 00:17:36,310 --> 00:17:38,102 The main thing that I keep coming back to 298 00:17:38,103 --> 00:17:39,999 is the fact that Stuart, 299 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,205 the identical twin brother of Stephen, 300 00:17:43,206 --> 00:17:45,926 doesn't know where he was for hours. 301 00:17:52,379 --> 00:17:55,069 On a shift where he's a senior officer. 302 00:17:58,827 --> 00:18:02,412 And offers no explanation why he can't remember, 303 00:18:02,413 --> 00:18:05,103 and then lies repeatedly. 304 00:18:06,586 --> 00:18:08,856 This really stinks there's something very wrong here. 305 00:18:12,310 --> 00:18:14,447 But also normally what happens 306 00:18:14,448 --> 00:18:17,723 is the senior officer in charge of a crime scene 307 00:18:17,724 --> 00:18:21,343 is always called to the court case to tell the jury 308 00:18:21,344 --> 00:18:23,033 about what was happening at the time 309 00:18:23,034 --> 00:18:25,214 and what the scene looked like, and so on. 310 00:18:25,215 --> 00:18:26,896 Stuart Lewis was never called. 311 00:18:29,724 --> 00:18:32,930 And all the information about his behavior on the night 312 00:18:32,931 --> 00:18:35,240 and his possible connection to the E-fit 313 00:18:35,241 --> 00:18:36,760 and these sightings of a car 314 00:18:36,761 --> 00:18:38,999 similar to the car that he was driving that night, 315 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,000 none of that was shown to the jury. 316 00:18:45,551 --> 00:18:49,516 But crucial to any involvement by Stuart and Stephen 317 00:18:49,517 --> 00:18:52,274 in this case is the matter of motive. 318 00:18:52,275 --> 00:18:55,378 Did Stephen Lewis know that Alison and Mandy 319 00:18:55,379 --> 00:18:56,719 were having a relationship? 320 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:03,520 People say to me, "He must have known." 321 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:06,930 But I did my best to hide it from him. 322 00:19:08,793 --> 00:19:10,833 And I don't think he did know. 323 00:19:12,931 --> 00:19:15,274 In terms of the court, in terms of the jury, 324 00:19:15,275 --> 00:19:17,825 none of the juries were convinced that he knew. 325 00:19:19,793 --> 00:19:20,620 Well played. 326 00:19:20,621 --> 00:19:21,791 Go for it, Al. 327 00:19:23,448 --> 00:19:26,826 -But the rugby players, the taxi drivers, 328 00:19:26,827 --> 00:19:30,309 neighbors, friends, everybody 329 00:19:30,310 --> 00:19:32,450 was telling the police Stephen knew. 330 00:19:33,931 --> 00:19:35,761 So this is perhaps the most intriguing 331 00:19:35,762 --> 00:19:38,309 piece of evidence of the lot. 332 00:19:38,310 --> 00:19:41,410 This is a document from a police informant. 333 00:19:42,896 --> 00:19:47,067 The informant tells the police that he was in a local pub 334 00:19:47,068 --> 00:19:49,205 and that he overheard a conversation 335 00:19:49,206 --> 00:19:51,999 Mandy was having with two friends. 336 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:56,619 Mandy told these friends that her and her kids 337 00:19:56,620 --> 00:20:00,550 had been threatened by her current lover's husband, 338 00:20:00,551 --> 00:20:01,971 who was a police officer. 339 00:20:03,724 --> 00:20:06,999 What's extraordinary about this is that you can see 340 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:10,274 from the date stamp is that this came in within hours 341 00:20:10,275 --> 00:20:12,240 of the murders actually happening. 342 00:20:12,241 --> 00:20:15,481 And yet this informant never gave evidence 343 00:20:15,482 --> 00:20:16,762 in any of the trials 344 00:20:16,763 --> 00:20:19,378 and was never seen as a significant witness. 345 00:20:22,517 --> 00:20:24,277 We investigated that fully. 346 00:20:25,448 --> 00:20:27,548 Of course, couldn't had any meat on that bone. 347 00:20:28,758 --> 00:20:30,138 And there had been a lot of local gossip 348 00:20:30,139 --> 00:20:31,617 that Stephen must have known. 349 00:20:34,965 --> 00:20:38,136 Mandy would spend time at the Lewis' house. 350 00:20:38,137 --> 00:20:42,547 And equally, Alison would sleep over at Mandy's house. 351 00:20:45,517 --> 00:20:48,207 But why would a police officer go and kill four people? 352 00:20:50,827 --> 00:20:53,205 You might think that if somebody's sleeping 353 00:20:53,206 --> 00:20:55,999 with your wife, that might be a motive. 354 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:59,378 -Does everybody whose wife or husband have an affair 355 00:20:59,379 --> 00:21:00,379 go and murder the family? 356 00:21:00,380 --> 00:21:02,102 Of course they don't. 357 00:21:02,103 --> 00:21:06,826 I mean, I think that's a ludicrous assumption to make. 358 00:21:06,827 --> 00:21:07,861 You don't think that's a motive? 359 00:21:07,862 --> 00:21:08,722 -Not at all. 360 00:21:10,068 --> 00:21:11,588 If you think somebody having a lesbian relationship 361 00:21:11,589 --> 00:21:14,096 and somebody would go out and kill that individual 362 00:21:15,517 --> 00:21:17,997 and then kill four people, where have you seen that ever? 363 00:21:30,482 --> 00:21:31,723 -During the police interviews, 364 00:21:31,724 --> 00:21:33,274 Stephen Lewis starts off at a point saying, 365 00:21:33,275 --> 00:21:34,585 "I was never in the house." 366 00:21:35,931 --> 00:21:37,901 "Never in the house, never touched anything." 367 00:21:40,103 --> 00:21:44,205 Then slowly but surely, incrementally, he says, 368 00:21:44,206 --> 00:21:47,171 "Oh yes, maybe I was in there once or twice." 369 00:21:47,172 --> 00:21:49,240 Then he says, "I was downstairs." 370 00:21:49,241 --> 00:21:50,791 Then he says, "I was upstairs." 371 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,309 To a point where he says he was lighting matches 372 00:21:54,310 --> 00:21:55,999 in the kitchen in order to help Mandy 373 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:57,240 just make a cup of tea. 374 00:22:02,344 --> 00:22:04,004 But the awkward thing for Stephen Lewis 375 00:22:04,005 --> 00:22:06,030 is that it's an electric cooker. 376 00:22:12,034 --> 00:22:13,243 And then he says, yeah, 377 00:22:13,244 --> 00:22:15,171 he may have even gone into Doris' room. 378 00:22:17,413 --> 00:22:18,585 We're now moving 379 00:22:18,586 --> 00:22:20,412 from the blood stain on the landing 380 00:22:20,413 --> 00:22:24,553 into the rear bedroom downstairs, which is mother's bedroom. 381 00:22:27,344 --> 00:22:30,214 -And then the most remarkable moment is where he says 382 00:22:30,215 --> 00:22:33,686 that he might have touched the murder weapon. 383 00:22:35,620 --> 00:22:39,930 The officers interviewing him are almost stunned by this 384 00:22:39,931 --> 00:22:44,205 because they think, "Well, how could that have happened?" 385 00:22:44,206 --> 00:22:48,066 "Well, because I lifted something out to the shed for Mandy." 386 00:22:49,551 --> 00:22:53,071 "May have touched the murder weapon just by accident." 387 00:22:54,241 --> 00:22:56,447 Situated up the rear of the premises 388 00:22:56,448 --> 00:22:58,518 is a wooden garden shed. 389 00:22:59,724 --> 00:23:01,243 -And they're saying, "What?" 390 00:23:01,244 --> 00:23:03,381 And then eventually he comes up with a tumble dryer. 391 00:23:03,382 --> 00:23:06,309 So this is a man who's never been in the house before, 392 00:23:06,310 --> 00:23:08,309 is suddenly carrying a tumble dryer 393 00:23:08,310 --> 00:23:10,999 out to the shed in Mandy's house. 394 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:15,590 I mean, it's utterly amazing and bizarre. 395 00:23:20,206 --> 00:23:22,826 Two juries have found David Morris guilty. 396 00:23:23,896 --> 00:23:26,033 Why are you pushing this? 397 00:23:26,034 --> 00:23:27,654 -I can completely understand why somebody 398 00:23:27,655 --> 00:23:30,447 would think that David Morris is guilty. 399 00:23:30,448 --> 00:23:34,618 But if we have misgivings about a case, 400 00:23:37,586 --> 00:23:39,654 the legal system in this country 401 00:23:39,655 --> 00:23:43,615 should be robust enough to sustain difficult questions. 402 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:46,450 Asking for transparency, 403 00:23:46,451 --> 00:23:48,861 asking for evidence is not an attack. 404 00:23:48,862 --> 00:23:51,070 It's simply asking them to give us confidence 405 00:23:51,071 --> 00:23:52,208 that the system works. 406 00:23:58,586 --> 00:24:02,343 -I think the general public are largely 407 00:24:02,344 --> 00:24:05,934 and justifiably very trusting of the police. 408 00:24:09,172 --> 00:24:14,032 But the suggestion that the police never frame people, 409 00:24:17,655 --> 00:24:19,861 it's really, it's not right. 410 00:24:19,862 --> 00:24:22,692 It happens, it really does happen. 411 00:24:25,827 --> 00:24:30,827 In November 2013, Brian Thornton got in touch. 412 00:24:32,206 --> 00:24:33,930 He said he'd been working on this case for a number of years 413 00:24:33,931 --> 00:24:36,309 and he was kind of dangling the promise 414 00:24:36,310 --> 00:24:37,723 of some positive leads 415 00:24:37,724 --> 00:24:39,974 that kind of as an appealer you get drawn to. 416 00:24:41,103 --> 00:24:42,243 I think there is an element 417 00:24:42,244 --> 00:24:46,274 of sticking your fingers up at authority 418 00:24:46,275 --> 00:24:48,412 and just saying to people at the end of something, 419 00:24:48,413 --> 00:24:50,103 "You know what, you got it wrong." 420 00:24:51,448 --> 00:24:56,067 21 years on from the murders, after two appeals, 421 00:24:56,068 --> 00:25:00,067 two previous CCRC applications, fourth firm of solicitors, 422 00:25:00,068 --> 00:25:03,412 you might think it was a hopeless case. 423 00:25:03,413 --> 00:25:04,483 It's not. 424 00:25:06,275 --> 00:25:11,275 But we have no alternative but to go back to the CCRC. 425 00:25:12,724 --> 00:25:14,074 Only the CCRC can refer a case back to the Court of Appeal. 426 00:25:14,075 --> 00:25:15,619 We've got no choice, 427 00:25:15,620 --> 00:25:17,830 and we've got to get the evidence ourselves. 428 00:25:25,137 --> 00:25:26,688 -It was actually a student of mine 429 00:25:26,689 --> 00:25:29,339 that came up with, sort of, the first big breakthrough. 430 00:25:31,827 --> 00:25:34,343 He was reading about the forensics, 431 00:25:34,344 --> 00:25:38,384 and he said that there's male DNA on this murder weapon. 432 00:25:41,137 --> 00:25:43,137 And after doing a lot of research 433 00:25:44,862 --> 00:25:49,826 we also found that there was male DNA on the sock 434 00:25:49,827 --> 00:25:52,277 that may have been used by the killer as a glove. 435 00:25:55,448 --> 00:25:57,343 Surely, now surely this male DNA 436 00:25:57,344 --> 00:25:59,104 would've been tested and retested. 437 00:26:03,068 --> 00:26:04,408 Turned out they had tested 438 00:26:05,482 --> 00:26:07,832 but couldn't identify who it was. 439 00:26:09,931 --> 00:26:11,171 That's a real problem. 440 00:26:12,965 --> 00:26:14,619 That's a fundamental problem. 441 00:26:14,620 --> 00:26:17,171 And we think that 20 years later 442 00:26:17,172 --> 00:26:19,930 the technology has moved on so much 443 00:26:19,931 --> 00:26:22,067 that a review of that material 444 00:26:22,068 --> 00:26:25,068 will finally establish who that person was. 445 00:26:31,758 --> 00:26:33,309 But the problem with the DNA 446 00:26:33,310 --> 00:26:35,720 is that because it was part of the original case 447 00:26:36,862 --> 00:26:38,662 it can't be considered as fresh evidence. 448 00:26:40,172 --> 00:26:43,102 And the CCRC will only really look at this case again 449 00:26:43,103 --> 00:26:45,173 if we present them with fresh evidence. 450 00:26:47,724 --> 00:26:49,344 So we need to find something new. 451 00:27:00,965 --> 00:27:03,825 -I set up the Facebook group about 11 years ago. 452 00:27:07,517 --> 00:27:10,407 I think we currently have 26,000 members. 453 00:27:17,689 --> 00:27:20,619 I mean, the idea is that the more people 454 00:27:20,620 --> 00:27:21,930 that are aware of Dad's case, 455 00:27:21,931 --> 00:27:24,309 the less likely it is to be forgotten. 456 00:27:24,310 --> 00:27:26,757 You know, we want people to be as outraged 457 00:27:26,758 --> 00:27:28,548 at this case as we are. 458 00:27:32,103 --> 00:27:34,550 -"SWP should hang their heads in shame 459 00:27:34,551 --> 00:27:36,378 "for their handling of this case." 460 00:27:36,379 --> 00:27:39,999 "The work you guys do on here is really commendable." 461 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:41,930 "I hope we get justice for Dai." 462 00:27:46,827 --> 00:27:48,309 Somebody might be sitting at home right now 463 00:27:48,310 --> 00:27:50,999 with new information thinking, "What do I do?" 464 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,380 And if they can see that people are supportive, 465 00:27:53,381 --> 00:27:55,519 they may feel more willing to come forward. 466 00:28:00,689 --> 00:28:03,723 -I completely understand David Morris' family 467 00:28:03,724 --> 00:28:05,454 fighting for justice for him. 468 00:28:07,068 --> 00:28:08,723 Who would want to believe 469 00:28:08,724 --> 00:28:10,934 that someone in their family is capable of that? 470 00:28:10,935 --> 00:28:12,861 And I completely understand it. 471 00:28:12,862 --> 00:28:14,619 I always understood it. 472 00:28:14,620 --> 00:28:17,757 But that never, what I didn't understand 473 00:28:17,758 --> 00:28:21,138 is why it was always put onto us. 474 00:28:23,965 --> 00:28:27,999 We have over 400 social media threats 475 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,900 from his Free Dai Morris site of abuse. 476 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,999 These people aren't interested in the truth. 477 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:40,860 All they want to do is slam South Wales Police, 478 00:28:42,620 --> 00:28:44,792 say it's a conspiracy. 479 00:28:44,793 --> 00:28:47,619 And no one has ever said what evidence there is 480 00:28:47,620 --> 00:28:50,481 against me, Stephen, and Stuart, 481 00:28:50,482 --> 00:28:55,342 except for hearsay, gossip, rumors, and lies. 482 00:29:03,758 --> 00:29:06,338 Not one of them has got one piece of evidence. 483 00:29:20,206 --> 00:29:23,066 I've been feeling guilty for the last 20 years. 484 00:29:30,551 --> 00:29:32,551 But I have to protect my family. 485 00:29:35,034 --> 00:29:36,724 This is why I never come forward. 486 00:29:41,965 --> 00:29:44,102 -The suggestion that this is a case 487 00:29:44,103 --> 00:29:46,343 of police looking after him is ludicrous. 488 00:29:46,344 --> 00:29:48,481 Absolutely ludicrous. 489 00:29:48,482 --> 00:29:50,792 People love these conspiracy stories. 490 00:29:50,793 --> 00:29:52,412 They love to build something around it. 491 00:29:52,413 --> 00:29:55,143 And I think that's what's driving this particular case. 492 00:29:56,551 --> 00:29:58,550 The evidence in this case points to one person, 493 00:29:58,551 --> 00:29:59,413 and one person only. 494 00:29:59,414 --> 00:30:01,412 That's David Morris. 495 00:30:01,413 --> 00:30:02,933 Everything fits perfectly. 496 00:30:17,827 --> 00:30:18,999 -I was up to the mountain 497 00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:20,830 about half past four in the morning. 498 00:30:25,551 --> 00:30:27,792 I always keep to the back roads 499 00:30:27,793 --> 00:30:29,833 because I didn't have a driving license. 500 00:30:33,620 --> 00:30:36,720 That night it was dark, 501 00:30:40,655 --> 00:30:45,025 but I had full beam on and it lit up the whole lane. 502 00:30:50,068 --> 00:30:51,788 And when I come around that corner, 503 00:30:53,827 --> 00:30:55,517 he was in the middle of the road. 504 00:31:06,068 --> 00:31:10,478 The person I saw was by here. 505 00:31:12,793 --> 00:31:16,205 He ran across here like this, 506 00:31:16,206 --> 00:31:18,096 and he looked directly at me. 507 00:31:19,379 --> 00:31:22,205 And I had perfect view of that person. 508 00:31:22,206 --> 00:31:23,136 Perfect view. 509 00:31:25,103 --> 00:31:27,623 And I know for a fact it was that person, 510 00:31:29,724 --> 00:31:30,934 the man in question. 511 00:31:35,551 --> 00:31:37,381 Sergeant Stephen Lewis. 512 00:31:40,206 --> 00:31:43,343 He had a green kitbag under his arm 513 00:31:43,344 --> 00:31:45,864 and he went into the darkness. 514 00:31:51,206 --> 00:31:53,102 Why didn't you come forward 515 00:31:53,103 --> 00:31:54,723 to the police with what you knew? 516 00:31:56,724 --> 00:31:57,653 -Who would've believed me? 517 00:32:01,034 --> 00:32:05,102 I've done wrong in my life, taking cars and stuff like that. 518 00:32:05,103 --> 00:32:06,003 Silly things. 519 00:32:08,137 --> 00:32:11,205 I knew the inspector was his brother. 520 00:32:11,206 --> 00:32:12,999 If I had gone and said, "Oh, by the way", 521 00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,516 "I saw your brother up the mountain road," 522 00:32:15,517 --> 00:32:17,167 my feet wouldn't touch the floor. 523 00:32:18,551 --> 00:32:19,791 I don't trust him at all. 524 00:32:27,379 --> 00:32:31,929 But because the condition I'm in now, then enough's enough. 525 00:32:33,310 --> 00:32:34,380 You know what I mean? 526 00:32:37,758 --> 00:32:42,378 I want justice for Mandy Power's family. 527 00:32:43,586 --> 00:32:45,999 I want justice for the community of Clydach. 528 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,410 And I want justice for Dai Morris' family. 529 00:32:51,793 --> 00:32:53,863 I feel now I've done the right thing. 530 00:32:55,241 --> 00:32:58,412 Least if I do die, I might go to a better place 531 00:32:58,413 --> 00:33:00,723 than where I was planning to go to. 532 00:33:00,724 --> 00:33:01,904 Do you know what I mean? 533 00:33:05,551 --> 00:33:09,792 -John Allen's new testimony is important 534 00:33:09,793 --> 00:33:10,933 and it's significant 535 00:33:12,724 --> 00:33:16,826 because moving away from 9 Kelvin Road, 536 00:33:16,827 --> 00:33:18,964 out of the northern edge of Clydach Village, 537 00:33:18,965 --> 00:33:23,135 up Gellionnen Road, leads to a path. 538 00:33:24,551 --> 00:33:27,343 As the crow flies, it's a straight line 539 00:33:27,344 --> 00:33:29,794 to a village called Pontardawe. 540 00:33:32,413 --> 00:33:36,792 And Stephen Lewis lived at an address 541 00:33:36,793 --> 00:33:38,593 in Pontardawe at that time. 542 00:33:44,241 --> 00:33:47,205 So the sighting by John, the new witness, 543 00:33:47,206 --> 00:33:50,585 supports the original evidence 544 00:33:50,586 --> 00:33:54,516 from the police investigation and from the trial. 545 00:33:56,551 --> 00:33:58,826 That of Nicola Williams. 546 00:33:58,827 --> 00:34:01,477 He was quite tall, dark cropped hair. 547 00:34:02,689 --> 00:34:04,409 I saw him just here under the lamppost, 548 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:07,619 and he was carrying a bundle under his arm, 549 00:34:07,620 --> 00:34:10,654 quite a large kitbag. 550 00:34:10,655 --> 00:34:12,343 -An E-fit was generated, 551 00:34:12,344 --> 00:34:15,794 which is pretty much a picture of Stephen or Stuart Lewis. 552 00:34:17,758 --> 00:34:19,550 Nicola Williams' evidence 553 00:34:19,551 --> 00:34:21,861 was supported in turn by Rosemary Jones, 554 00:34:23,620 --> 00:34:25,585 who lived opposite 9 Kelvin Road, 555 00:34:25,586 --> 00:34:28,516 who heard a distinctive diesel vehicle, 556 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:31,070 saw somebody get out. 557 00:34:33,068 --> 00:34:35,205 Who do you think that person was? 558 00:34:35,206 --> 00:34:39,481 -I really don't know, but whoever came back that time 559 00:34:39,482 --> 00:34:44,482 must have come back to set the house on fire. 560 00:34:47,862 --> 00:34:51,312 -And Stuart Lewis was driving a diesel red Peugeot vehicle. 561 00:34:52,724 --> 00:34:56,481 So all these sightings combined, geographically, 562 00:34:56,482 --> 00:35:01,309 sequentially support the proposition 563 00:35:01,310 --> 00:35:06,310 that Stephen Lewis was at the scene of the murder. 564 00:35:10,241 --> 00:35:13,551 And Stuart Lewis was there very quickly afterwards. 565 00:35:20,551 --> 00:35:25,516 There is not one similar sighting of David Morris, 566 00:35:25,517 --> 00:35:26,997 and there never has been. 567 00:35:45,482 --> 00:35:48,378 South Wales Police have said a forensic review 568 00:35:48,379 --> 00:35:50,309 is to be carried out on the evidence 569 00:35:50,310 --> 00:35:52,481 which helped convict a Swansea Valley man 570 00:35:52,482 --> 00:35:55,762 for the murders of three generations of the same family. 571 00:36:14,241 --> 00:36:16,067 -People have been led to believe 572 00:36:16,068 --> 00:36:18,240 that actually there are questions 573 00:36:18,241 --> 00:36:20,661 in relation to David Morris' conviction. 574 00:36:21,758 --> 00:36:23,447 If we haven't got trust in the community, 575 00:36:23,448 --> 00:36:25,343 then that's really damaging. 576 00:36:25,344 --> 00:36:27,516 So we are willing to listen. 577 00:36:27,517 --> 00:36:29,240 But we needed another force to do this 578 00:36:29,241 --> 00:36:31,829 because it would be like marking our own homework. 579 00:36:31,830 --> 00:36:34,309 You know, let's face it, would the public believe us? 580 00:36:34,310 --> 00:36:35,900 They're questioning us already. 581 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:41,999 -Daddy's been asking for these forensics 582 00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:43,550 to be done for years. 583 00:36:43,551 --> 00:36:46,861 A guilty man doesn't ask for forensics to be done again. 584 00:36:46,862 --> 00:36:52,723 I mean, a guilty man asking for forensics to be done again, 585 00:36:52,724 --> 00:36:53,764 where's the sense in that? 586 00:36:56,310 --> 00:36:57,590 -They can't push it off. 587 00:36:58,655 --> 00:36:59,757 -They can't. -I hope not. 588 00:36:59,758 --> 00:37:01,136 -No, there's... 589 00:37:01,137 --> 00:37:02,274 -I just want him home. 590 00:37:02,275 --> 00:37:03,206 I just want him home. 591 00:37:03,207 --> 00:37:04,481 Do you know what I dream of? 592 00:37:04,482 --> 00:37:05,964 Just walking up to the prison, right? 593 00:37:05,965 --> 00:37:07,067 Then us just... 594 00:37:07,068 --> 00:37:08,654 -Hm. -Mm. 595 00:37:08,655 --> 00:37:11,655 -You know, just being there and he's free, he's a free man. 596 00:37:13,206 --> 00:37:14,756 Just a free man, like. 597 00:37:17,413 --> 00:37:18,523 -I don't trust them. 598 00:37:19,896 --> 00:37:21,412 As simple as that. 599 00:37:21,413 --> 00:37:23,343 I know, babe. 600 00:37:43,862 --> 00:37:45,309 Before we move on, 601 00:37:45,310 --> 00:37:46,830 I have some breaking news for you this evening. 602 00:37:46,831 --> 00:37:50,412 David Morris, the man who was serving four life sentences 603 00:37:50,413 --> 00:37:54,723 for the murders of a Swansea family, has died in prison. 604 00:37:54,724 --> 00:37:55,964 The Ministry of Justice 605 00:37:55,965 --> 00:37:58,205 has not confirmed the cause of his death. 606 00:38:16,344 --> 00:38:19,764 -I still can't believe this is our life. 607 00:38:24,620 --> 00:38:25,999 20 years, 20-odd years, 608 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:29,000 and I still can't believe this is our life. 609 00:38:30,172 --> 00:38:32,342 I'd give anything for it not to be, but it is. 610 00:38:39,413 --> 00:38:43,343 It's just, I can't explain it. 611 00:38:43,344 --> 00:38:44,974 I just feel so angry. 612 00:38:46,241 --> 00:38:47,281 I just feel so angry. 613 00:38:49,103 --> 00:38:50,412 Who'd you feel angry towards? 614 00:38:50,413 --> 00:38:51,243 -The police. 615 00:38:52,379 --> 00:38:55,136 I'm squarely on the police and their actions 616 00:38:55,137 --> 00:38:57,309 and everything they did to get a conviction. 617 00:38:57,310 --> 00:38:58,930 They went to such lengths to get a conviction 618 00:38:58,931 --> 00:39:01,551 and they took my brother's life away 619 00:39:02,965 --> 00:39:05,585 and they changed ours, they changed ours completely. 620 00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:08,450 They took everything away from him, 621 00:39:08,451 --> 00:39:10,338 but they took it away from us as well. 622 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,309 Just because he's gone doesn't mean we've given up on him. 623 00:39:17,310 --> 00:39:18,830 You know, he's my big brother. 624 00:39:25,724 --> 00:39:26,664 -You know, Dad can't be gone 625 00:39:26,665 --> 00:39:30,999 and still be legally a murderer. 626 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,136 There's no way that we could allow that to happen. 627 00:39:35,137 --> 00:39:37,343 If we didn't carry on fighting, 628 00:39:37,344 --> 00:39:40,244 then that's like us walking away from him then. 629 00:39:41,965 --> 00:39:43,144 And I could never do that to him. 630 00:40:05,931 --> 00:40:08,240 -South Wales Police has shown a commitment 631 00:40:08,241 --> 00:40:10,654 to providing evidence-based answers 632 00:40:10,655 --> 00:40:14,102 to the issues which have been raised about this case. 633 00:40:14,103 --> 00:40:15,964 This commitment has now resulted 634 00:40:15,965 --> 00:40:19,171 in a forensic link to the convicted killer. 635 00:40:19,172 --> 00:40:22,516 Operation Dolomite has identified a scientific link 636 00:40:22,517 --> 00:40:26,171 between Morris and a sock which is widely accepted 637 00:40:26,172 --> 00:40:29,002 as being used by the offender during the killings. 638 00:40:30,448 --> 00:40:32,999 -In the opinion of the examining scientist 639 00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:36,033 regarding these results, which were obtained 640 00:40:36,034 --> 00:40:40,314 from samples extracted from two separate areas of the sock 641 00:40:41,724 --> 00:40:44,585 at the time of the original forensic examination, 642 00:40:44,586 --> 00:40:46,930 it is more likely that David Morris 643 00:40:46,931 --> 00:40:50,141 contributed DNA to them than if he did not. 644 00:40:53,758 --> 00:40:56,033 -I hope this now provides closure 645 00:40:56,034 --> 00:40:58,414 for those most affected by the murders, 646 00:40:59,931 --> 00:41:01,792 in particular those who lost 647 00:41:01,793 --> 00:41:03,933 three generations of the same family. 648 00:41:11,862 --> 00:41:13,619 So how strong 649 00:41:13,620 --> 00:41:16,067 is the DNA link to David Morris? 650 00:41:16,068 --> 00:41:18,550 -So the link to David Morris 651 00:41:18,551 --> 00:41:21,001 is as strong as we can possibly get at this time. 652 00:41:21,002 --> 00:41:22,999 But we have to accept it's not gonna be as strong 653 00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:26,861 as something that we got from a murder a week ago, 654 00:41:26,862 --> 00:41:29,136 'cause it's 20 years old. 655 00:41:29,137 --> 00:41:31,861 But on the basis that this evidence 656 00:41:31,862 --> 00:41:35,205 did identify similarities with David Morris, 657 00:41:35,206 --> 00:41:36,481 and all the other evidence 658 00:41:36,482 --> 00:41:39,619 that we've had with a conviction previously, 659 00:41:39,620 --> 00:41:42,309 the two of those things together combined 660 00:41:42,310 --> 00:41:46,447 make this a case where we feel the evidence corroborates 661 00:41:46,448 --> 00:41:48,138 the safe conviction of Dave Morris. 662 00:41:58,448 --> 00:42:02,654 -For them to say, "Right, we have found DNA" 663 00:42:02,655 --> 00:42:06,274 "that would likely match your father's," 664 00:42:06,275 --> 00:42:09,136 and then to expect us to take this lightly 665 00:42:09,137 --> 00:42:10,617 after 20-odd years fighting 666 00:42:11,724 --> 00:42:13,590 and forget all the trust that we had in Dad 667 00:42:13,591 --> 00:42:16,102 and kind of believe they are likely and walk away- 668 00:42:16,103 --> 00:42:17,623 -Yeah, because we're gonna trust them, see, 669 00:42:17,624 --> 00:42:19,412 we're gonna trust them, we're gonna believe them, 670 00:42:19,413 --> 00:42:23,412 police, South Wales Police, I don't think so. 671 00:42:23,413 --> 00:42:25,002 -You know, is it the kind of likely 672 00:42:25,003 --> 00:42:26,274 that would stand up in court 673 00:42:26,275 --> 00:42:27,792 or is it the kind of likely 674 00:42:27,793 --> 00:42:30,274 that wouldn't be able to be used in court as evidence? 675 00:42:30,275 --> 00:42:31,305 We just don't know. 676 00:42:32,413 --> 00:42:35,378 I mean, is there anybody else's DNA there? 677 00:42:35,379 --> 00:42:38,067 We know there's male DNA on the murder weapon. 678 00:42:38,068 --> 00:42:39,619 Whose DNA is that? 679 00:42:39,620 --> 00:42:41,999 Because they haven't said that's likely to be Dad's. 680 00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:44,102 You know, does that mean that that belongs to somebody else, 681 00:42:44,103 --> 00:42:46,243 or does it mean that they haven't tested it? 682 00:42:48,828 --> 00:42:49,998 There's so many questions. 683 00:43:42,068 --> 00:43:44,412 -The police are saying that they have found a link 684 00:43:44,413 --> 00:43:46,213 between the sock and David Morris. 685 00:43:46,214 --> 00:43:50,343 And when we say, "Great, can you show us this evidence?" 686 00:43:50,344 --> 00:43:52,378 "Can we have access to anything?" 687 00:43:52,379 --> 00:43:54,102 And they say, "No." 688 00:43:54,103 --> 00:43:55,830 "No, we're not answering any questions." 689 00:43:55,831 --> 00:43:57,999 "No, we're not gonna release the report." 690 00:43:58,000 --> 00:43:59,964 "Why aren't you gonna release the report?" 691 00:43:59,965 --> 00:44:01,481 "We're not gonna tell you." 692 00:44:01,482 --> 00:44:02,691 But how can we have closure 693 00:44:02,692 --> 00:44:04,688 if we don't know what this evidence is? 694 00:44:04,689 --> 00:44:07,378 Apologies to the police, but we can't take it on trust. 695 00:44:07,379 --> 00:44:09,481 They just haven't earned it. 696 00:44:09,482 --> 00:44:11,274 -We have released the results 697 00:44:11,275 --> 00:44:13,205 from the forensic report into the public. 698 00:44:13,206 --> 00:44:15,654 So there really shouldn't be any question 699 00:44:15,655 --> 00:44:17,619 as to what's been found there. 700 00:44:17,620 --> 00:44:19,516 The physical report itself, 701 00:44:19,517 --> 00:44:22,207 that needs to go to the Criminal Cases Review Commission. 702 00:44:22,208 --> 00:44:23,546 And that's what we've done. 703 00:44:24,965 --> 00:44:26,723 When people talk about the Clydach murders, 704 00:44:26,724 --> 00:44:28,692 other cases from South Wales Police history 705 00:44:28,693 --> 00:44:29,999 keep getting brought up. 706 00:44:31,068 --> 00:44:33,274 A lot of this is about trust, isn't it? 707 00:44:33,275 --> 00:44:35,585 -It's safe to say that we got it wrong on those occasions. 708 00:44:35,586 --> 00:44:36,999 We absolutely got it wrong. 709 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:38,898 I think it was a very different case when you looked 710 00:44:38,899 --> 00:44:40,826 at some of the previous miscarriages of justice 711 00:44:40,827 --> 00:44:43,723 and the reviews demonstrated huge errors 712 00:44:43,724 --> 00:44:46,205 in the way the investigations were conducted. 713 00:44:46,206 --> 00:44:50,067 We haven't found that on this occasion, not at all. 714 00:44:50,068 --> 00:44:52,208 This is not a miscarriage of justice. 715 00:44:58,827 --> 00:45:01,033 -This all could have been stopped 20 years ago 716 00:45:01,034 --> 00:45:03,964 when, if David Morris had said, "I'm sorry", 717 00:45:03,965 --> 00:45:05,475 "I've committed these crimes," 718 00:45:06,689 --> 00:45:08,999 and taken responsibility for what he did. 719 00:45:16,310 --> 00:45:18,309 He was quite happy for the general public 720 00:45:18,310 --> 00:45:20,412 to think that other people might have done this 721 00:45:20,413 --> 00:45:22,861 and he was innocent, he was a victim in this. 722 00:45:22,862 --> 00:45:24,622 David Morris was never a victim. 723 00:45:26,034 --> 00:45:30,554 He brought everybody into this fury of disbelief, 724 00:45:31,689 --> 00:45:33,379 and false facts, and misinformation. 725 00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,102 He could have been honest with his family. 726 00:45:38,103 --> 00:45:39,343 He could have saved their family 727 00:45:39,344 --> 00:45:42,136 all the torment of this last 21 years, 728 00:45:42,137 --> 00:45:43,657 and he's chose not to do that. 729 00:45:47,034 --> 00:45:48,484 That was his biggest betrayal. 730 00:45:58,379 --> 00:46:01,585 -Dad hated the fact that we had to live our lives 731 00:46:01,586 --> 00:46:03,999 doing campaigning, and fighting, 732 00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:06,757 and being so public, and just, 733 00:46:06,758 --> 00:46:08,309 he would never have allowed us 734 00:46:08,310 --> 00:46:11,654 to do what we've done if he was guilty. 735 00:46:11,655 --> 00:46:12,475 There's no way. 736 00:46:13,862 --> 00:46:14,793 Do you think that he might want you 737 00:46:14,794 --> 00:46:16,904 to move on with your life? 738 00:46:18,103 --> 00:46:20,240 -I think my brother would be thinking, 739 00:46:20,241 --> 00:46:21,826 "Just get on with your life now." 740 00:46:21,827 --> 00:46:23,067 "You fought for long enough." 741 00:46:23,068 --> 00:46:24,723 But that's not gonna happen. 742 00:46:24,724 --> 00:46:26,243 It's just not possible. 743 00:46:26,244 --> 00:46:27,792 We're gonna carry on fighting. 744 00:46:27,793 --> 00:46:29,483 I don't really know where we're gonna go from here, 745 00:46:29,484 --> 00:46:31,830 but we need the report, we're gonna fight for the report, 746 00:46:31,831 --> 00:46:33,274 and we're gonna carry on. 747 00:46:33,275 --> 00:46:34,103 We're gonna carry on. 748 00:46:34,104 --> 00:46:35,174 It's as simple as that. 749 00:47:25,724 --> 00:47:26,796 -I thought the world of Doris. 750 00:47:28,206 --> 00:47:29,546 She was a lovely lady. 751 00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:35,930 Whenever I went down to the house, I'd sit on the settee. 752 00:47:35,931 --> 00:47:38,001 Emily always used to come and sit with me. 753 00:47:40,689 --> 00:47:42,929 Katie used to call me Ali baby. 754 00:47:46,827 --> 00:47:50,237 You know, Mandy was always kind, loving, 755 00:47:51,413 --> 00:47:54,003 tried to do her best all the time, 756 00:47:56,137 --> 00:47:59,237 and enjoyed her life, enjoyed her children. 757 00:48:07,827 --> 00:48:10,619 Mandy had so much to give. 758 00:48:10,620 --> 00:48:12,210 She had so much to live for. 759 00:48:16,517 --> 00:48:20,757 And it hasn't been a day that I haven't missed her. 760 00:48:38,793 --> 00:48:40,213 I loved being with her. 761 00:48:47,172 --> 00:48:49,832 Everything about her made me happy. 762 00:48:49,833 --> 00:48:51,833 ---oOo--- 59129

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