Original subtitles

This is... Oh, we've started! This is it!

Oh, hello, faithful viewer. Hello, faithful viewer!

Hiya, you've got the three who rule here.

Yeah! Aukon, Camilla

and the other one. Yeah, the other one. The other one?!

Yes! We haven't done one of these in a while.

We never will again, probably!

No, it's probably the last one you'll ever hear of us.

But now we're on camera these days.

In the old days, we just sort of... Sh! Sorry. This is very good.

Can I just tell the faithful viewers? We're having to watch this

on a laptop, at a distance, perched on a milk crate

because this is how technology has come along.

We're supposed to have ear pieces in. I can't be bothered.

Apparently, this is good, but I'm squinting.

Thank God I remember what happened.

So, look... Neil Patrick Harris. Neil Patrick Harris.

Also, I've watched this episode Unleashed last night, so I'm going

to make... If you say something you also said in Unleashed.

I'm going to set off an alarm. Oh, good!

So, it's all new, juicy content. Unfortunately,

might leave us with nothing to say.

No.

I just want this, really.

Ah, Stooky Bill!

Meine favouriten!

But you will leave the family all alone.

Poor Stooky Sue and the poor Stooky baby.

You would leave them without papa. The little orphans will be crying.

Um, yes. So, here we are.

This is a set which I think is the most amazing set. Beautiful.

And it was built in the studio

and then the exterior is in Bristol.

Yes, but the two...the two chime together very well, don't they?

They do. They definitely do.

A very big visible curtain, I think.

If you're in the know, you go, "That's the...that's the cut!"

Come on, now. Not fooling anyone on a commentary. No! Let's be... No!

Oh, hang on. When he leaves, he goes out the door, you can see...

We don't see him go out the door!

The only thing we're missing is people walking past,

actually, I think. I think originally Stooky Bill

was going to be the villain. Really? Oh! And it was all going to be...

If you think about it, it was going to be about a puppet...

Yeah? ..trying to be a man. Right.

So, he was going to kind of, like, steal the Doctor's...

..regenerate, you know, the Galvanic Beam, cos we can assume people

have seen the end of this. Yes. Oh, yes. Spoilers.

There will be spoilers. I think he would...

The Doctor was split in half. Stooky Bill was stuck in the middle

or something like that. And eventually, after thinking about

this for a couple of months, I thought, "I cannot imagine

"Jemma Redgrave pointing a gun at a little puppet walking around

"saying..." Deep Roy, we could have got him back.

Deep Roy could have come back. Yes.

So, the Toymaker was inserted relatively late?

I mean, not late, but well into the thinking, because then I sat

down and thought, "You can't just have a puppet running

"around threatening the Doctor." Although I think there are

resemblances between Stooky Bill and you.

I mean, he's not unalike, so...

I remember thinking, "Stooky Bill..."

and there was going to be... You were going to be like a great big

puppet version of yourself. That would have been really creepy,

actually. Well, there's a minute of that.

But, no, I mean, like, the face. Your face there. Would have given

you a nose like Stooky Bill... Right. ..which would have been

genuinely scary. Then I thought, "Don't be so stupid."

So then I thought, "What does a puppet have?

"A puppet has a puppet master." Ah. And I got a bit stuck then

cos the Fantastic Four was a puppet master and things like that

and then led to... And was that like a light-bulb moment when you went,

"Oh, my God, it needs to be him!"? Yes.

And I wasn't certain either. I thought, "Does that work?

"Is that an old-fashioned character?"

And then I sat down to write him and those first two pages

we just skipped over, they were magic. I love those.

Yeah. Oh, my God. This is such a good...

Well, it's everything, isn't it?

It's the toy shop... Yeah. ..and the creepy toys... Yeah.

..and, yeah, I mean, it's just brilliant.

How much... Do we tell you what's happening in advance?

Or do you just get a script? How does it work? I knew...

What did I...? How much did I know? No, I think I knew the Toymaker was

coming. Yeah. I think you told me that much. And we talked about

Stooky Bill way back... Right. Yes.

..and John Logie Baird and the...

Yeah, I remember that conversation, but... Did you know you were going

to split? Did we tell you that? Oh, we must have done. No.

Oh, yes, you did. Right. Yes. Cos that's been a sort of

slow-burning idea for a while, hasn't it? Yes. Years.

Well, I remember years ago you were thinking you'd do

that with a regeneration.

Ah, do you like these?

Well, now, listen.

Oh! Listen, this is the first... Is that a no?!

It's not a no. It's beautiful.

I mean, look at those colours. But we...

Now, this is not too much of a spoiler to tell the viewing public,

we filmed a bit to go in the title sequence.

Talk us through it, producers. All right, then.

What happened there? What do you think, Phil?

I think you should speak.

I think, I think I'm the only person that liked it!

Really? We felt... Faithful viewers,

we shot a sequence in the middle of this in the title sequence

where David and Catherine hang out of the TARDIS doors, which then...

Hanging out of the TARDIS... Oh, you shot it... ..with all

the time vortex going past...

Literally, it was like a war of attrition.

Everyone who watched it, hated it. Everyone just... I loved it!

I liked it. Oh! I do like it. Enlighten me! I told you I liked it!

You got worn down. Eventually, it was Moffat who happened to see it.

What's he got to do with anything any more?! I play it

to him, "Look, what a great big title sequence we've got." He went,

"Oh, that's absolutely brilliant. Cut that shot." Literally lethal.

Really? "Cut that shot." I went, "Don't you like that?"

"Cut that shot." "But isn't it...?" "Cut that shot." No debate?

No debate. No debate.

See, I like to think they all kind of get together in, like, a misty

plain somewhere, the three of them, every now and again,

around a campfire. Oh, the show runners?! The show runners.

Like Guardians of...

Yeah, exactly! And they exchange stories.

And I think it was at one of those. Once a month, I think.

But we've made these things called, excuse me, everyone,

Tales Of The TARDIS.

We've made little dramas with Wendy Padbury,

Frazer Hines.

Well, I know because I might have a family member who's

in one. Of course you do! Of course you do!

Yes. Oh, that's so lovely. Yes. Oh, my God.

Steven and Vicky, Peter Purves and Maureen O'Brien, together.

I remember... Giddily exciting! ..I was sitting there watching it,

thinking he was in the original

Doctor Who with the Toymaker... Yes. Right!

Unbelievable, isn't it, to think that?

I thought about putting him in this episode. Did you?

At one point, there was...

..there was a giant cow in UNIT HQ.

One of the creatures like the Vlinx... Oh, yeah?

..there was going to be a big cow sitting at a desk. Rather good.

I know, it would have been really brilliant. It was called

the Ruminant. Did he just sit chewing the cud?

And it turned out... You won't believe...

I've been dreaming...

The Toymaker... And then it turned out to be Steven in disguise.

The things that go through my head. I know, the things you don't

ever see. Wow. He was going to go, "Wham!", like that,

"I'm here to fight the Toymaker." And it would have been much

better than that. But I never did it.

That's a great... I mean, that is... We just talked

all the way through. Great shot.

Yeah. Did you ever think it would look like that when you were

in the back car park? No.

That is just... That, we're in the car park.

In the car park there, a bit of old, you know...

..a bit of old foam on the floor.

It's funny because I think this is everyone's favourite special effect

because it's real, because we know what a tower

in London looks like. Yes, yes. I think if you've got a spaceship,

you go, "Yes, it's a spaceship," like that... Yeah. ..this, you're

like, "Oh, my God, that actually looks like a tower.

Yes, there were just big bits of greenscreen

all the way around the outside of that, weren't there? Yeah, yeah.

Just gives you so much scale to the whole thing.

And look! And we know that Bonnie Langford's back!

Bonnie! Oh! Amazing.

Why? Cos I'm going to need all the statist... Oh, no way.

Oh! That is the best news!

Melanie! Hello!

We'll catch up later. We haven't got time.

How early in the process was Mel part of this?

Very early. Was she post the Ruminant? Yes.

She was alongside the Ruminant. She was there with the Ruminant

and the Vlinx. So scenes exist somewhere with Mel, the Ruminant

and the Vlinx, all chatting?

Well, I think it should be like a madhouse, you know?

I think we can't throw enough in there.

Oh, my goodness. We should have, you know... He's not finished.

You see that coming back to bite.

We should have that thing from The Curse Of The Peladon bubbling

away in a corner. What's that bubbly thing? Arcturus.

Arcturus! Bring that on!

There is lovely, lovely...

We just saw lovely Alexander Devrient there as Ibrahim,

who wasn't originally cast

and then we cast someone else and then he got a part in Casualty.

And so we said, "Right, we'll get..." Best person in the world.

He's brilliant. He's absolutely brilliant. Why should I

care about you? No change there, then.

You're fine. You're completely normal.

And that's because of the...

We call it the Zeedex. An invention of the Vlinx.

Hello, the Vlinx! I'm the Doctor.

I love the Vlinx, I love the Vlinx.

Is the Vlinx a recurring character? You will see the Vlinx

in the future, slightly upgraded from what... Oh!

I like the Vlinx. Well, I think this is the Vlinx when they've just

fished him out of the wreckage... Yes. ..of a spaceship. Sure.

Vlinx is on a journey. He's been polished up. He's kind of chrome

now, which is just a little bit... But he was always meant to be.

It always said chrome and then that just got forgotten.

How much do you love this set?! Oh, I love it.

Well, I don't love it. It's the most expensive set in the world...

How much use are we getting out of it? ..and operate...

It's, like, the bills we get for footage and screen hire...

Oh, my word. I'm sorry.

But it's amazing. I'm joking. We are getting our use out of it.

"Shall we go to UNIT HQ?", they say, at the drop of a hat.

"Shall we do 30 pages in UNIT HQ?"

Literally... It is literally 30 pages a series, please.

Pay for itself. Oh, my gosh.

It was great to have another little play with Jemma.

She's great. She's brilliant, isn't she?

Together in the 50th. We were, yes.

And she's been playing this part a long time. Yes.

It's quite amazing, really.

Which now, of course, faithful viewer,

you can go and see. Today it gets announced.

This is... What date is it? It's 10th October.

You know the entire back catalogue's going on to the iPlayer? Yes!

1st of November. On 1st November? Yes. So, by the time you've seen...

You already know this, faithful viewer.

You cannot be trusted. And you and her, both with red hair,

what is this?

Sounds like a conspiracy.

What are you hiding?

And as for her in that chair,

I've seen you walk.

I've seen you walking!

Don't deny it!

No, you can't stop me. It's about time you heard the truth!

Activate Zeedex.

Anyway, look, Jemma's having a turn.

Yes. Good, that bit. She's clever, that bit.

She's great in that. Yeah. She's always great.

Do you know? I loved writing for her because

I came to it, she was brand-new. "Oh, what have we got here then?"

Just love her. Really think... Yeah, she's proper, isn't she?

I loved her in Bramwell. Yes! Yeah, yeah.

I loved Bramwell. I thought she was amazing.

I watched every episode of that. Yeah, yeah.

Bramwell, for the viewer, was a sort of period drama

about the first female surgeon in London. Yes, yes.

And Jemma played the first female surgeon in London.

Is it strange now watching your last episode, darling?

Well, he's hoping it's not.

Don't say that to any actor! Do you a little part! Yeah.

It is, yes. Well, the whole thing's been odd, coming back

to something that's been so...that was such a huge thing

and you come back and it's so vivid,

but it's for a short time and then you sort of step away again

and it carries on.

And there's people, you know, I've just seen shooting again

in the car park. Yes. It all just carries on.

It does.

And it's... I'm so glad we did it, though.

So glad. They were all saying that last week on

Tales Of The TARDIS.

"He'll be back. 50 years' time, here he is,

"his Zimmer frame."

Oh, gosh.

But it's lovely to have the chance to do this.

It is, isn't it?

And I think a better last line for you now.

Yes. "Never been so happy in my life."

Yes. Yes.

That's... It's funny cos those... It kind of preyed on me,

the regeneration is always done as a tragedy and a sadness

and, you know, life moves on and stuff like that.

I thought, "Oh, let's have a happy one." Yeah.

That's the only option left!

Let's have a happy one.

And my theory is... OK, shall I do my theory?

Yeah, go on. Yeah.

Because there's no better place to say it. I think

what with Peter having been in, and Colin having been in,

I think, down the timeline, they all separate,

they all went like that.

I think all the Doctors came back to life

with their individual TARDISes,

the gift of the Toymaker, and they're all out there travelling

round in what I'm calling a Doctorverse. Wow!

It's the Doctorverse. This is major!

This is... And I want to know... I want to create a future

in which, in which Sylvester McCoy could survive and have an adventure.

Yeah. Because one of the things about The Star Beast is to get

you back and Catherine back, we had to jump through so many hoops...

Yeah, yeah. ..great story, but it's like, why can't you just arrive

and step out of the TARDIS?

So, hopefully, it creates a future in which that happens. Yes.

Because in these things, this may not be that interesting

to people who've already seen them on the iPlayer, but these Tales

Of The TARDIS that you've done, obviously, you're dealing

with some actors who are not the age they once were,

but you're just... You're not addressing that, you're just...

No, there's kind of little lines, "Ooh, the timelines," and things

like that. OK. None of them find it strange.

I think if we ever do another little spin-off, it's

pretty hard to find an adventure to stop in which to say this -

"Oh, yes. By the way, we once...", or, you know,

"I think Peter Davison once was left behind on the surface

"of Androzani and woke up and there was a TARDIS and he carried on..."

Ah! "..having those adventures." It's exactly what a big finish does.

It's exactly what everyone does in their imagination. Yeah, yeah.

Sylvester in his says, doesn't he?

He says, "There are different timelines and I'm from

"a timeline in which I didn't change, I just got old." Right.

And I love that idea. Yes. Actually, science fiction writers...

We come up with a history of kind of linear science fiction

of the '60s, '70s, '80s, the Doctor regenerates.

Now we live in the world of the Spider-Verse.

Yes, quite. Multiverses are the thing and no-one

has a problem following this. Yeah. I think it's time to just kind of

open it up and say, "They're all out there now,"

like the way Colin Baker once turned up

to save Patrick Troughton's life.

Yes. I mean, that doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

But I'm now saying that was a little echo...

It was a future echo. ..of the Doctorverse happening backwards.

Yes. Nice. Is anyone listening to a word we're saying? Not a word.

This is deep. I am. I'm fascinated.

We've gone deep fan on this. Yeah. We have. I think that probably

suits the people who are watching this. I don't want to prejudge

our audience. I think this is on the iPlayer, isn't it?

Nod behind the camera.

You see? This is on the iPlayer.

Hello, iPlayer.

Oh, is it? Of course it is.

Hello, Whoniverse. We're on the Whoniverse.

That's what it's called on the iPlayer now.

Is it?

When you first wrote this, Russell, this was a much bigger sequence,

wasn't it?

Oh, yes, didn't I climb out of the wind tunnel at one point?

You go out onto the helipad, and all these faces followed him...

I wrote this madness. "You've got a budget now.

"You could do whatever you want, Russell." I wrote this magical

sequence where the Doctor was like the Pied Piper,

and all the images of all the televisions of London rose up

and formed a great big... He stood on the edge. Right.

David stood on the outside, facing London,

the whole vast pixelated image of Stooky Bill formed out of all

the televisions of London. And then the budget came in.

They said, "Can you just do it on screen?"

"Can you just, could you just tap a few monitors?"

And that's what happened.

Put a big Stooky Bill on the telly. There you go.

There's never an endless budget.

There definitely isn't. You are magnificent.

It worked. You are amazing.

You are just...

That's what it's all about, darling.

Never mind the special effects.

You stand there and you give us a speech like that.

How does it feel playing him...

Well, I mean, he's a different character now?

Or do you feel like the old one inhabits you?

I mean, he feels darker to me.

Does he? Yeah, he definitely does.

He definitely does. He feels... Yeah.

It feels like he's got more on his shoulders, somehow.

That's interesting. I mean, there's nothing...

I didn't make a conscious decision to do anything, but then it's...

Russell will have written it differently.

No.

But, I mean...

"Still bust it out, same as I did before."

I don't even mean... Excuse me.

All this bother to bring back David Tennant, then make him different?

Well, exactly. It's like, who wants that?

Yes. It's like you...

Let's have a miserable David Tennant.

Can you imagine?

Or vengeful, imagine.

Or untrustworthy.

Or with a funny voice.

Yeah, he's got a high-pitched... "Hello!"

"My face is back, but my voice is very different!"

"He whistles through his teeth now!"

You could have done that!

But I suppose, well, we're older. Yeah.

There will be differences just because...

Well, you never put your foot in the same river twice.

However... Alarm. Unleashed, that's kind of been discussed.

Oh, has it? Let's move on. Oh, all right. Thank you.

Also on the iPlayer, you can look at these episodes Unleashed.

Yes, let's not double our content.

And we're missing the moment where Sabalom Glitz gets mentioned.

Yes, yes.

Did you ever think you'd type that?

Never! Never in a million years.

She had a lot more to remember.

During the regeneration, she talked about Lakertya.

That's been cut, sadly.

It was a little bit too much of Mel's history.

But, yeah, Sabalom Glitz, played by Tony Selby.

Yes. The late Tony Selby. Mid-'80s. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Great person.

A character who was so loved, he came back.

He did. He was in two adventures, wasn't he?

And pivotal. And Mel ended up... Did she marry him?

Was she going to be romantically involved with him,

or did she just... Oh, I never thought it was romantic? Did you?

Nobody was romantic in Doctor Who back in the day.

Well, you don't just get in a spaceship with someone, do you?

I would with Dibber?

Yes, Dibber... Dibber?

Glitz and Dibber.

Glitz had a companion called Dibber.

But Dibber never came back. Dibber was only in the first...

Very oddly for John Nathan-Turner, he wrote Dibber did not come back.

Did you think he would?

But off you go now. You're going to...

Oh, is my phone pinging? I'm so sorry.

There you go.

You're going to Bristol.

Back in time. Yes, we're going to trace...

That was a mad shoot in Bristol, wasn't it? Goodness me.

That's a gorgeous shot, though, isn't it? Look at that.

Amazing.

What we can do now with special effects.

We were down this little lane, and there were...

quite a lot of crowds had turned out

and they were held just behind where the TARDIS is.

So, the TARDIS is literally blocking out quite a lot of people.

And because we had to have this conversation down this lane,

people figured out that Mel was in it.

Oh, cos she mentions Mel? Yes. Yeah, yeah.

Oh, those fans.

Some of them will have been there with, like, little listening...

Like Gene Hackman in The Conversation. Yeah, exactly.

Gosh. We normally think of things like that, don't we?

Changing lines in public. We didn't think of that.

Yes, because I'm busy right now.

You're busy every second of every day.

I mean, look at us now. We haven't stopped.

When you were filming this in Bristol, David, do you remember?

It was Neil Patrick Harris's birthday. That's right, yes.

And Neil Patrick Harris took David, Catherine and myself

to a Doctor Who escape room. in Bristol.

Surely you knew how to escape from a Doctor Who escape room?

I suspect it was once a different escape room that's been repurposed.

There wasn't very much Doctor Who... With a picture of Jodie Whittaker

in a long scarf, I think is what they had.

There was a Cyberman head. We did have fun, though.

Can you imagine us four turning up?

What were the staff like?

That's what I mean. They were open-mouthed when we came in.

But because it's Neil Patrick Harris and he's all Hollywood and posh,

of course. He'd taken it over, so it was just us.

There was no-one else there. It was just us. Oh, right.

Yes. Because he loves...

Loves an escape game, absolutely loves an escape game.

We did two escape rooms, didn't we?

And you survived? You escaped?

We survived!

So, we ended... The second one, we were in two teams.

Catherine and I versus David and Neil,

and they beat us.

How did Catherine even conceive of what an escape room is?

We were howling.

She threw herself right in. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I tell you what, she really did.

Yes, she was very into it.

Howling, we were.

Now, I've got a little bone to pick with the sound team coming up.

Have you? When I watched this, there's a bit where I leap over

the counter in a sec. Do you go, "Argh"?

No. Listen.

Well, when we came to do ADR, additional dialogue recording,

you do it when the pictures are all locked and you go in

and you re-record any bits that haven't quite been recorded.

And sometimes you'll add little bits of sound.

And they said, "When you jump over this, you don't make any noise."

And I'm like, well, that's cos I'm poised like a gazelle!

"I'm an athlete."

And they said, "We just need something. It just doesn't sound..."

I went, "Well, please don't make me sound like a wizened old crone

"huffing and puffing over the desk."

It's coming up. "Huh-urgh!"

"Creak!"

"Creak! Pop!" Oh, no. Put my hip out.

Oh, look, William Hartnell. Oh, William Hartnell!

They were thinking you were him, you see?

That's what it is.

And I said, "Well, please, when you do the mix, please be...

"Only if you really, really need it."

Oh, I'm listening for it now. Listen to it now.

Well, you're talking to the two people who signed-off on the mix.

I'm awfully sorry!

Here we go.

Oh! Oh, my hip!

I find it realistic. I find it very realistic.

I do.

Wasn't this quite a difficult day with all these doors?

I remember this being a bit... It was difficult.

It was difficult because.... Tetchy. Not tetchy. That's the wrong word.

It was a noisy set, so it was difficult to shoot on

because all the lines kept getting creaked over.

And hard to find your way around... Yeah.

And of course, there is only one corridor, so every time we shoot

through a door, it was mounting... It was endlessly re-mounting.

I thought we'd have to ADR the whole thing.

We haven't, though. No.

The sound was... The sound team are amazing at cleaning stuff up.

Yes, it was a tricky day, though, cos to get all the in and out

of doors took most of the day. Yes.

And then there's quite a big scene at the end of it,

which we had to do a bit fast.

I know. It's those bits you write to give you more time in the studio,

a page of dialogue. Yeah. And it's the bits...

Get done in 20 minutes at the end of the day, yeah.

We never learn. You know what we call it?

Ben-Hur in the morning, Benny Hill in the afternoon.

And that's what happens! Every day.

Benylin at night. Benylin at night, yeah. Yeah, exactly.

To save money on the VFX on this sequence,

cos it was meant to be endless corridors whatever way

the camera pointed... Right. ..and, actually, you'll see

there are certain shots where we just put a door there, like that.

Yes. And that saves us vast amounts of money.

The minute you turn the other way, it's an endless corridor

with parallax that moves and traps. Well, it's the same old tricks.

Same old tricks we were doing 20 years ago, really.

It is weird, isn't it? 60 years ago.

Well, yes. 60 years, yeah. Well, exactly.

Oh, there'd have been a whole four-parter on this set!

There was!

It was called a...!

Fair enough. Yes, yes, yes.

Did you go back and watch the surviving episodes when you...?

I really should have, shouldn't I? No, no, no.

I just wondered if that was interesting.

No, I kind of think... I should have.

When I handed in the script... I sent the script to my agent,

like you do automatically, who's not a Doctor Who fan,

and she went, "Oh, Michael Gough was the Toymaker."

Now those things have sunk into people's minds.

You know, we always think it's just fans who know this stuff.

She remembered after all these years.

She must've been about 10 or 12 or something when that was on.

Was there ever a draft where David and Neil Patrick Harris

played the Trilogic Game and David disappeared for an episode?

As we worked out the schedule...

It got a week off! We could do with that now sometimes, let's be honest!

Just whip out a Trilogic Game.

Sorry, viewer.

In the original, William Hartnell had two weeks off,

and so he plays a sort of game of chess with the Toymaker,

and the Toymaker makes him invisible for some reason. Yeah.

Look at you two acting all... Never mind the special effects.

Never mind the sets. This is what we're here for.

Oh, it's the best thing ever. This is why we're here.

You are amazing. Oh, well...

I love working with you, David Tennant. Well, the feeling is

very mutual, Russell. I love working with Catherine, as well.

Look at just them. Just two of them.

Life and death turning around them, and just friendship.

Friendship at the heart of it. It's gorgeous.

It was a lovely scene. But this is the scene we did very quickly.

Yes! In, like, five minutes.

And because it's a lovely scene, you really want, you know,

you want to have lots of goes at it. But of course,

you don't necessarily need them. But you got it.

It's like... Perfect. Yeah, yeah.

What amazes me when you watch this episode...

How many times do we sit through an episode?

I think we're less than 30 minutes into it.

It's packed. Oh, it's mad, isn't it?

I mean, this would normally be the climax. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Head towards the Toymaker, big sequence.

There's a big sequence there that went, wasn't there?

Didn't we do lots of lock, handle, door, door, handle, slam, slam?

Slam, slam, slam, slam. Like a sort of montage.

Maybe... Manic running through. There might have been, yeah.

Did we not shoot that because that day fell behind?

Maybe we didn't. I'm not sure.

I think there was just a lot more slamming. We did bits of it.

You want to get to the puppets, don't you? Yes. Let's be honest.

Yeah, the Stooky babbies.

Here we go. Charlie! Charlie the puppet.

Oh, this is brilliant. This!

This was a fiddle to shoot, wasn't it?

You see, there was nearly an episode where this was all you, David.

Right, yeah. Apparently, we've learnt today!

You'd have been wrapped up in that brown paper hanging up.

No, he was... That was the climax, he was in UNIT HQ.

He was like, "Hello, I'm the Doctor puppet," like this. Oh, I see.

Oh, it would have been great.

It would have been very good. But more papier mache kind of thing.

Oh, I see.

Cos I remember thinking for a long time, "Oh, David's going to be

"so unhappy with all these prosthetics."

We never got there. It never happened.

Not as unhappy as Peter Purves was going to be with his...

The things you never see!

I've got to do it one day.

Look how sinister... It was.

It was a real fiddle lining up Charlie's head.

And he was in a blue jumpsuit, of course. Yeah.

So, Charlie was in a blue jumpsuit, and then we chalked the rest

of his body off. Yes. Yeah, it was a real fiddle.

What's great is, we're in the studio that made His Dark Materials.

So, with this and with Stooky Sue, they have access

to the finest puppeteers... Yes. ..in the industry.

You know, cos that's how they did all the animals

in His Dark Materials. Right.

So, when you just call on them, and there they are,

and they're just world-class. So good at this.

"Could you do us a puppet, David?" "Yeah, yeah, yeah."

"Can you do a Stooky Sue?" "Yeah, yeah, yeah."

Off they go and just...

Look at that shot. That's gorgeous. Brilliant, isn't it?

I mean, that's what it's all about. Look at the sky.

Yeah.

It's good, cos we've kept... You know, David, he says at the end,

"My legions are coming." Yes. They are.

And so, every so often we get a chance to do an episode that's

kind of supernatural, not exactly supernatural,

but where all the rules are suspended. Yes, yes.

That's what's so creepy about this one. Exactly.

So, there's been a couple of episodes where we've just gone,

"Right, now it's this."

So, he's like a pantheon of gods. Right.

And we're going to keep doing it, aren't we? We love it.

How many have we had now?

Three? We're on our third now. Right.

Just every so often. More to come.

It breaks the budget every time! We love them, though.

They just give it a different flavour, don't they?

They allow you to go into different places.

Well, Doctor Who isn't really science fiction.

You know, sometimes you do...

I mean, episode three is hard science fiction.

Really good, hard science fiction.

And then you can swing the other way.

I think we've always been a little bit half-hearted about that.

And the existence of the gods has allowed us to go,

"Right, that's fine. It's the Toymaker. He set the rules.

"There are puppets walking around now trying to kill people."

And it just allows it... It's just another bit of vocabulary.

Yeah. Doctor Who has always done that.

It did this on the Toymaker in the first place.

But it kind of allows it a bit more...

A bit more vocabulary. I can't wait for all these episodes.

I don't know what's coming.

I actually did watch this, the original black-and-white one,

and he does talk, William Hartnell does talk about the fact

that he's lived for thousands of years and in his own dimension. Yes.

It's all right there.

It's amazing, really.

Surely only Donna Noble could do this scene? Isn't it brilliant?

Cos, you know, companions are always suffering,

and it's like, "Let's just have a companion beat the enemy up."

Yeah. Yes, this is quite violent, what she does.

I know it's a puppet. It's a doll!

She smashes her head up! This is my favourite line.

Anything to add?

Babby!

Babbies.

Off they go!

Off into the dark.

And she kicks the head. Yeah.

Oh, I love that.

Oh, there you are. You had a day off then.

One day off. Yeah.

No, I think I was doing something else.

I was on a different set.

I love that bit, where it spins round and we're in a different room.

Oh, it's gorgeous, isn't it?

Oh, this was a big wrangle, getting you in those chairs.

Was it? Oh, it was. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

I love that set.

That was a brilliant studio. That thing really is that size.

Yes. Yes, it really is. It's not a special effect.

It really is that tall.

And even in the studio, you just stand and go, wow.

I visited that day, I remember seeing it and I was like, wow.

We've got a wonderful art department.

And these, I love these.

We can make a range of these. Neil did all this.

Yeah. He did.

It was a lot, doing all this.

Yeah, Neil did the marionettes...

In Unleashed, he has a good old moan. Oh, does he?

Does he? Oh, he makes it clear how busy...

Oh, he's really...

That's the first thing he said to me when he arrived.

He was like, "Oh, you've got me doing everything." Card tricks.

I mean, yeah, singing, dancing, card tricks. He can do it all.

Yeah. That's the thing.

And do you know what I said to him? "That's why we cast you."

It's his own fault. Yeah, it's his own fault for being a polymath.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

And we love him cos he did It's A Sin with me and Phil.

and he's such a true...such a fine...

..such a lovely man to work with.

Oh, he's great. Yeah. Wonderful. Yeah, yeah.

And it is genuinely that thing of going,

he can do marionettes and he can do card tricks

and he can sing. Yeah, yeah. And he reaches the size of the enemy.

Yes. He's a big enemy.

And that's so important, cos this ends your life.

This ends the 14th Doctor's life. This does things to the Doctor

by generating things they've never had before.

Here comes the Flux. Yeah.

I love the Flux! Oh, my God.

Here we go. Oh, the Flux.

Well, and, you know, I think the... People say to me,

"Oh, are you going to mention the Flux? Like, did that happen?"

Of course it did. We watched it.

Chibnall's, you know, great contribution.

I love the Flux. It's like...

And there it gets reduced to five puppet moons.

With faces!

I'm sorry! With faces!

There's a little moment here which makes me think that...

Here there's the moment where the Toymaker says,

"I made a jigsaw out of your history."

Oh, yeah. Which, again, is part of this whole loosening the rules.

The Doctor first - you know, was the Doctor half human

when he was Paul McGann? Mm-hm.

You know, is he a Timeless Child? Is he this...

It just relaxes the rules to say he is whatever you want him to be.

Right. Right. That could be the Toymaker's puzzle. I see.

That could be inferred, or it's all true, and it is all true,

but it just opens the canon a bit, you know? Yeah.

And when he lost,

I sealed him for all eternity inside my gold tooth.

Ah, the teeth! I love the teeth! Yeah.

The Master in the tooth.

No sign of the Master. No sign of the Master yet?

No sign of the Master. Sorry. God knows what happened to that tooth!

Obviously, the cleaning woman picked it up at the end.

The cleaning woman was hovering over London as well!

I know, right? Yeah.

I know.

Gorgeous, though. And again, this is my favourite bit.

It's like the two of you get a chance to talk. Yes. Yeah.

I love that scene. And I love it. They match each other as characters.

You know, you're equally as powerful.

I love that. There's very few scenes...

There's very few scenes in which Donna couldn't have much dialogue.

And this is one of them, so you've just got to go, sometimes... Right.

Did you find yourself trying to insert her a bit?

No, I think... I think because I'm old and experienced,

I've kind of gone past that. When you're young, you think everyone's

got to talk all the time. And as you get older, you think, no, just talk

when you need it. Right. Right. And it would...

She's actually really just watching... Yeah.

Gives you more, doesn't it? ..that sort of plays off.

It's like that marvellous scene in The Unicorn And The Wasp

where she just eats grapes throughout the entire day.

Sort of my favourite thing. You can do that with Catherine.

You can just say, "Have a bowl of grapes,"

and then she's upstaging everything you did.

Yeah, she'll upstage everything. Felicity Kendal, giant wasp?

Here's Donna with a bowl of grapes!

Should've given her some grapes here!

Oh, why didn't I do that?

Oh, you should've done! Oh, why didn't we think?

Can we reshoot? Can we add some in special effects?

You could put some in. She takes grapes to the theatre!

I should have done with Donna, she just does that.

Oh, my God. That would have been brilliant.

They just appear from nowhere. I liked the...

I liked the stage direction there. Wasn't it something like,

"An eight of clubs? It's an OK card."

Yeah, middling. Middling!

Middling. Middling.

But it is. If you turn an eight, you're like, "Oh." Yeah.

When we you do... My family always plays Play Your Cards Right,

you know, Bruce Forsyth? Yeah. We love that, our family.

And in fact... Oh, we do that! We play that. Yeah.

Higher than a six, higher than a six!

And we do the theme tune and everything. Yeah!

I know.

Copyright people behind the cameras have just gone, "Don't sing!"

Oh, sorry. We might need to...

I think you're allowed to do that amount of notes that you just did.

Well, if you... Homage. Yeah.

If it sounds nothing like the original as well!

There is that. I think that was...

If you comment on the quality of the tune, it's fair dealing. Oh, run!

Oh, there we go. This was like five million effect shots that we cut,

and it's ended up very good. It's really good. Mm.

There were a lot more effects here, all collapsing. Oh, they ran through

a lot more. That's lovely! I love that. Isn't it brilliant? Yeah.

That's great. All the dust and everything. I love that.

But of course, this was written long ago, then I watched...

Was it then I watched the Flux? And that happens to Dan's house.

John Bishop's house does that, and I kind of went, "Oh."

And then I thought, "Well, damn, we're good!"

I just thought it becomes nothing.

Oh, look! The Galvanic Beam. Yeah, I love a Galvanic Beam!

Yeah. Yeah.

Cos you remember where you last faced Galvanic radiation,

which is very deadly to you, Mr David Tennant.

Yes, I do remember. On the planet Midnight.

That was Galvanic. Oh, it was Galvanic!

That was Galvanic radiation. Was it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Outside? Yes. Yes. Not inside or they'd be dead.

Yes. No, yes, I'm just... It's just coming back.

Did you discover Galvanic radiation or is that a real bit of science?

Oh, it's completely made up. Good. Good, good. Completely made up.

But in Doctor Who... Look at... Oh, look at that beam!

So where's this Galvanic radiation come from, then?

Obviously, a little piece of galvanised doodah fell to Earth

in the Great Time War and then... In Donna's boot.

Yes. Came back in Donna's Wellington boot. Exactly.

Or that spaceship that crashed on Mount Snowdon long ago.

Look at you standing on the desks!

Yeah. I didn't huff and puff to get up there, either,

I'd like to note! Well, if you listen back, you do, actually.

We put something... We asked for that to be put in there.

Right, and we put creaks in.

One of my favourite things in Doctor Who is how much

the Doctor and Shirley don't like each other.

I love the way you two play this,

and you love each other really. Oh, God, she's great.

You're always... There's just a spikiness. A needle.

You give her a look in a minute that I love.

It's just like, "Don't interrupt me.

And she's like, "Don't talk nonsense," with you,

and I love her. It's just...

It stops everyone being nice and cosy there.

It's just a little edge of like, "We're talking."

Oh, she's about to chip it any minute.

We're all building up to the song, of course.

Here we go.

I watched Ruth the other night in The Long Shadow. Have you seen that?

No, I haven't. Yes. I'm burning up to see it.

She does this incredible scene... Oh, that scene! Oh! Is it?

God, yes. Oh, gosh, I'm dying to see it.

Yes. I will. Yeah, it's just a plug for entirely different show

on an entirely different network. I know!

Oh, this bit. Look at that look you give her!

Your like, "Don't bother me.

"Please listen to what I'm saying."

And I love it.

How many days on set was Spice Up Your Life? Oh...

Did it drive you mad?

Two. Two days, wasn't it?

Did you sing it in your head for a long time?

I did, but it was quite... I didn't mind it.

I think it was. I mean, I just sort of...

Again, I just stand and watch it happen. Yes, you...

With horror. You and Neil got the short straw! Yeah.

That's tough, isn't it, singing and dancing

while the rest of the set doesn't? Mm.

That must be very...

We took him out for dinner after this. Yeah, yeah.

That was a hard day. A properly hard day. Tough day for him.

But brilliant. I mean, look at him. Yeah.

It's like...

That's my favourite one - on the phone. Oh, yeah.

Tough for Chanya. I mean, what a shoot. Yeah.

Oh, I love... I love how...

..horrible it looks for... Yeah.

That thump into that wall.

And what happens to Bonnie now, it's really...

It's violent. You know, it's cloaked in all this, the pop song,

but it's horrible and nasty and alarming.

But is that song somehow, isn't it? There's an edge to that song,

I think. In all great pop music,

there's a savagery to it. Yeah.

That bit, I love! Look at this! Yeah, me too.

Oh! I love that! That's my favourite bit -

reduced to a ball. Oh!

And that bit - they're dead, I'm sorry.

There's no sort of, "It's all right, I'm going to sort it." Yes.

It's getting very bleak now. Gone, gone.

Yeah. It's like in the middle of a song, people are being slaughtered.

It's pure Doctor Who, isn't it? Well, actually, it's...

Even Doctor Who doesn't often do this. No.

It's just nuts. See, it's a mad episode.

It really is a mad episode. But I guess you've got to get,

because of what's all about to happen,

you've got to feel like the stakes are higher than normal. Yes. Yeah.

I'm always using pop music like that.

I just think there's a savagery to it,

a darkness in there somewhere. Yeah. The relentlessness, that's the word.

There's a ruthlessness to pop music. The sound of drums, there was...

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's bang, bang, bang.

Good pop is, like, hard.

How easy was it to get the song? Cos that's always a bit of a wrangle

with, you know... No, it was all good. Yeah, yeah, it was all good.

Yes, yes, yes. There was one point... It took a while, but...

So there's that one line in the lyrics

that could be said to have racial connotations,

and even the Spice Girls think that now.

And when they sing the song, they've changed the lyrics,

but the lyrics haven't changed on the version that is licensed

to be played on television,

so therefore we have to lift the volume...

To cover the line. Yeah, which is wise. Ah.

Oh, my God.

He's got the Galvanic Beam.

Achtung, achtung!

Oh...

Look, here we go. Climax time!

When you watch the Unleashed of this, you are baking.

It was so hot. It was so hot. It's nuts, isn't it?

But it's great. It gives you that...

There's no sense that you're not outside, which is great.

You know, the light is very... I mean, we were, we were

in a car park, but it could have been raining on us.

It could have been a grim, overcast day.

It's absolutely our most successful marriage of exterior

with effects. Right. Yeah. I think partly it's because

of that sunlight. It's astonishing. Yeah.

And it stayed for days, didn't it? It was just on our side.

It was just gorgeous.

Abso... Look at that. I love it.

It's my favourite thing.

I don't understand...

..why you're so small!

You can turn bullets into flowers.

Think of the good you could do.

So tell me why you don't.

You know full well this is merely a face concealing a...

Have to give a big shout-out to Neil's costume, actually, here.

Yes. Pam Downe, our wonderful costume designer -

I mean, every costume he wears is magnificent.

Yeah. This was very last-minute. This was thrown on.

He was meant to be... He was always in his...

..Spice Up Your Life outfit. Oh, right. Right.

And then, bless, Pam right at the last minute went,

"Oh, he could dress up as, like, a World War I pilot in this."

It was like, "All right, fine."

And it's gorgeous, isn't it? Yeah. She was quite right.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's amazing. Yeah.

We're going to fall into silence now cos we love this bit.

We do. Don't do that, it's a commentary! Keep talking!

Everyone's already seen it. We have to remember that. I know.

It's funny, isn't it? It's like...

I love the beam. I love that great big gun.

I don't...

They made us scrap that.

Every so often they'd say, "Do you need this again?"

And I was like, "Hmm, sorry, no."

We built that gun. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yes, it was a big old piece of work, wasn't it? And it moved.

It had hydraulics in it and everything.

I mean, it was... It was a great piece of work.

Oh, it's gorgeous. Absolutely gorgeous.

This world is the ultimate playground.

Here we go, creeping up. We're just getting ready for this ending now.

Yeah. Don't fall into silence. I know. Yeah.

Oh, but I love it. This ending, you always knew this was coming?

This was... You were sort of working backwards from this

to an extent? Yes. Always, even from bringing you back, it was like,

we will bi-generate. It didn't come up in our work

until quite late but, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Well, because your anniversaries are traditionally multi-Doctor...

Yeah. ..which have not madly... Marvellous though the ones you've

done are, I don't ever fancy writing that. Right. And it's weird.

It's like, you know, I'm sure you'd love it, Phil,

if I said, "Oh, let's bring them all back!" I can see the challenge

though, cos you've sort of got to give them. I mean, it's like you've

got to make all these clever people exist in one story. Yes.

Having 12 clever people, they just solve

the problem themselves.

Well, that's what, actually, that's the ending of the 50th.

It's brilliant. Oh, yes.

And I just, I just, I don't quite believe it.

I think you're looking at the actors and not the people.

Right. I think there's something in it makes me go "Hmm,"

"cos I'm such a purist,"

he said, with the Toymaker swinging about a great big gun.

Everything was so real, David. It's so real!

So you had like a corset on, thing, didn't you?

Yeah, but talk about the screen.

Well... They held you up and allowed you to bend, so...

Yes, it was a sort of... Don't try and pretend you can bend like that.

That wasn't me. I did have help.

There was a sort of contraption that held me backwards,

that then got taken out afterwards.

I love the physical law that says "When a laser withdraws through you,

"you get pulled." Yes, yes.

It's like reaching that button.

But it's good, it works. It works.

Now, what's interesting, of course, is knowing,

is what the audience thinks is about to happen, presumably,

because... It's kind of leaked.

So a lot of fans will know about this, but that's just fans.

And my sisters will sit there screaming. We're doing, we're saying

this before it's been transmitted, obviously, and... I love it.

It's so cheeky, I think. Gobsmacked.

This is where Mel had a speech about "I've seen this before."

Do you remember? They kind of waited for her to finish talking.

Yeah. She went, because The Rani dragged us down to...

They went, "Do you mind?" That's right, yes!

Do you mind?

That was quite a nice gag. Funny. It was a good gag.

Oh, here we go. Here we go. Or we don't.

Oh... And then it's all.

Oh... Is it, is it?

It's was a very close set, wasn't it?

It was like...

How strange.

How many regenerations have we done now?

I don't know now. God.

It's on your CV, jumping. horse riding.

And regenerating now, isn't it?

I would think.

Cos there will be an awful lot of people

who don't know what's going to happen. The vast majority.

And it plays with them so much here. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

What's going on?

What a laugh.

What a laugh. Yeah.

We were going to see if we can get this on the news afterwards.

Your last regeneration.

Yeah, that's right. Yeah.

It was, "We're going to try. We'll try our best."

Oh, my God, the fussing over this special effect was...

Was it difficult? Oh, it was really difficult.

Well, this particular shot as well.

And... Well... Here he is. It's quite funny.

It's like a bubble, isn't it? Like an amoeba.

And there were versions where you kind of ripped apart.

It was too violent. Some violence. All right, OK.

It was too liquid sometimes. It was... It was too thin.

It was... Oh! I wanted to put a popping cork on,

but they wouldn't let me. That's the shot.

That's a great... Yeah, it's a great...

Yes, that was a big, old... A big, old camera

on a big, old hand, wasn't it? Yeah. That was a thing.

That's beautifully directed. That's a magical shot.

Here's the man. He should be here, really.

He should be commentating with us.

I mean, how mad for him?

I could put words in his mouth, but what a set to walk onto.

Yeah, he just walked on and started. Yeah.

Because I always think it's like there's been enough

of that "Oh, I've regenerated, I feel a bit ill."

You're in bed for an episode. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Having done that, it's like you can't.

He just runs in and off he goes.

It was so nice, the sort of joy of this, yeah.

The fact that Bonnie's there, I love that.

Yeah. In this bit of Doctor Who history, Mel is standing there.

Yeah. I mean, Donna, yes, obviously.

But to have Mel there is just so nuts.

So, then, so a whole timeline I generated then.

That was it in that moment? Yes.

The Toymaker... Mr McCoy woke up in a drawer in a morgue...

..in San Francisco.

Unfortunately, nobody's got him out yet. He's still in there.

Constantly regenerating, dies over and over again.

And Jon Pertwee woke up on the floor of the laboratory.

Right, yes. Colin Baker got out of...

Got up and sorted The Rani out.

Yes, he did. Did all of that.

They all did.

Oh, interesting. There you go.

Most of the modern Doctors just end up in their own TARDIS.

So Peter Capaldi just woke up in the TARDIS.

You, your tenth version... Oh, yes.

..is also still out there. Yes.

Just woke up in the TARDIS, because they've all been...

Does that mean there's three of me now? Yeah.

No, the last one... His wasn't in the TARDIS,

was it? It was outside.

TARDIS-based.

And here you go, playing a game. I'm the Doctor. I'm the Doctor.

Yeah. The two of you together.

So this is what I wanted... Multi... I was saying multi, special.

Don't believe them. But to have the next one

with the previous one, I've always wanted to do.

I remember you talking to me about wanting to do one

where for a little bit he changes and then changes back

to... Like Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde. Yes.

Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde.

Do that next time? Lovely.

Which would be... Oh, wouldn't it?

Little Jodie pops up. Ooh!

Yeah.

Yeah. Oh, that'd be brilliant.

Yeah. How long did this take, you catching...?

We did some... We did proper rehearsals.

We got in our gym kit, and we all went...

We got taken off and we did various sort of...

We had to come up with novel ways

of catching a ball.

That was...Neil did a proper...

You don't even really get to see, he...

He produced that, the way he balances that little hacky sack

ball on his hand, that is...

Yeah.

There was probably creaks and groans here?

Not a single creak and groan, but they love adding them afterwards.

Oh, yeah! Let's remind the audience

it's 15 years since he last did it. We are terrible to you, though.

You once had an operation on your back,

and I do this to you. It's like it's...

It's cruel. It's kind of fun, though. It's cruel, frankly,

and I love it.

And it looks so gorgeous. It does. To have all of this, I mean...

This was a hefty bill once we edited all this together, the number

of shots of exterior London.

Oh, of course, yes.

Took us not by surprise, but more than we ever thought it would be.

Yes. Because every time there's even a bit of background there,

you're replacing something. It's all...

But we're also replacing a lot of these balls as well.

Oh, yes. Always. The balls aren't real.

Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's very, very, very expensive.

I love it. In the back we catch a glint of the Thames.

It looks so... I think it looks so real, this.

I think it looks absolutely beautiful.

How...? Do you know how many you did?

Is it...? Because in the script they were very... 47 in the script,

I think. We shortened it, it was a little bit... We did.

There was a version as you went, "Oh, right." Right.

"That's enough."

But, yeah. Was that page, wasn't it? That page.

"Catch, catch, catch, catch, catch." Yeah.

I loved writing that.

Oh, no! This is my favourite effect we've ever done.

Is it?! When he goes... The Toymaker?!

When he goes flat.

I just think it's amazing.

Oh, is it really? Oh, I love it, yeah.

I've never seen anything like it in anything before.

I know someone will write in to me and tell me that there's a film

that does it better, but I just love it.

I know. It's great, isn't it?

It's like it's... A little bit...

It's got, like, he's not a pack of cards,

but it's a bit like, yeah, flattening into almost

being a pack. Look at that. Yeah.

Brilliant. I love it.

"Where's the toy box, Mel?"

Here she comes. She knows.

She just knows instinctively, because she's a good companion.

Yes. Yes.

Melanie knows.

And gone, my legions. Back...

Do we see that box again?

No, it's... It's buried. ..carted off.

It's been buried in salt. In the archive.

Doesn't mean... But it's mentioned.

It's mentioned. It is mentioned, yes.

You and the Toymaker in salt gets said by someone in the future.

Is it the Ruminant?

Not the Ruminant. Can you imagine?!

A mad giant cow chasing Doctor Who... Played by Peter Purves!

Cow!

It would have worked. I would have made it work.

Don't give up on it. Oh, my gosh.

And now it's one of those stories that ends

ten minutes before the end, because now it's like we've built

a whole new future... Yeah. ..out of it.

This must have been... You know what's going to happen.

All I'm going to be asked,

"So what does that mean? When's the next story?

"When's the...?" Yes, I think that's starting already.

Let me tell you, you get mentioned once.

Oh, showbiz is harsh! One mention.

Because it's like... I know, because someone said to me

"Why doesn't the Doctor...?"

...call on..?

"Why doesn't the Doctor come sailing in?" Why doesn't he always?

It's like Colin Baker came to rescue Patrick Troughton.

Yeah. They did that. They all came

at the end of The Day Of The Doctor.

Clara's out there somewhere flying around in the TARDIS

with what's her name? River Song.

Jenny, the Doctor's daughter. Doctor's daughter, she's out there.

So you can kind of use that argument for anything.

Yeah. "Why didn't someone else?" But that's not what happens in stories.

It's like A Tale Of Two Cities.

Someone else could have popped in and saved them. Yeah. It's...

Never mind Miss Pross and Madame Defarge,

why didn't a soldier come in and save them?

It just doesn't work that way. It's like you're in the story,

you tell the story.

How did I get to A Tale Of Two Cities from that? I don't know.

It was very good, though. Elegant.

I thank you. Thank you.

And you must... You must have done commentaries in which you say

how much you love your TARDIS, so we'll just skip over this.

Oh, my goodness. It's gorgeous. I've just been there,

because I'm back in Cardiff.

I brought my eldest and showed him the TARDIS.

Oh, you did? Yeah.

Were the lights on? The lights were on.

Oh, brilliant. What did he say?

I think he was... I think he was, yeah,

might have take a couple of little illegal photographs.

They won't go anywhere.

Don't worry. Surely it's his, by the rule of thumb, one day.

This has to be handed down. Yes.

It's just the law, according to your family.

Well, I also brought his uncle, who is my brother-in-law,

who is the same age. Peter's. Oh, right, right.

So it was... There was a lot of... There was a lot of...

Oh, Jodie? Yes. No? ..family history. Joel.

Yes, yes, yes. Joel, yeah.

Yes, Joel. We got him tickets for the concert.

That's right. Yes. Yes, yes, yes.

Happy days. Which was a laugh.

That was. Oh, I bet. Yes.

So I did a big concert last week. It's on on Sunday night.

On on Sunday night to celebrate Doctor Who.

You will hear the 15th Doctor's theme.

You will hear Ruby Sunday's theme.

Actually, it's on BBC Sounds from Friday.

Well, you will have heard it, won't you,

by the time they listen to this. It'll be old news by this time.

Old news. We'll be going back over that.

This is the biggest name-drop of...

Of... Ncuti must be thinking, "Who were these people?

"Mavic Chen?!" Like, "What the hell?"

It's a very big name-drop. Yes.

There's some lovely fan service here, isn't there?

There really is. Well, it's the 60th.

Yes! Quite right, too.

It was interesting to go through the history of Doctor Who.

What were the big ones? And when you look back,

"Oh, wow. The Gods of Ragnarok. That's..."

Yeah. Yes.

Wow! Well, that was a fantasy story.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was a bonkers story. Yeah.

I loved that one. I love those gods.

They should come back this year. They were amazing.

We'll have to have them back. Yeah, yeah.

So, yes, for the 60th.

But also, it's kind of like this is...

Because we are parking you and we are saying,

"That's your therapy, Doctor, go and get better."

And please don't imagine the next Doctor is problem-free,

because that lasts about half an hour.

Yeah, of course. He's deep in it, but...

I think Catherine's so beautiful here. Yeah.

The score here, Murray Gold's score.

I just love this.

This is absolutely beautiful.

And it's tough. It's a big change.

It's a big, big change.

Yeah. Here we go.

Yeah.

Gosh, I wonder.

He's retiring.

Yeah.

Briefly.

Well, he's already... He'll be off to New York with Mel.

Yeah. Well, I've already done that, yeah.

Just having a little curry in a garden in Chiswick.

Oh! Just for a minute. Exactly.

Oh, feet up.

Gorgeous, though.

You see lots more that started...

People say... Who said to me about the TARDIS?

I think it was Janet Fielding.

She said, "Oh, I can't wait to see what's through those portals."

I said, "Well, good luck."

We've spent all our money.

We're going to build more?! Walk through them. That's it.

It is a breathtaking... There was a very big portal, eventually,

that got cancelled because we couldn't afford it. Oh!

And it was like... The bits at the back,

do they become screens ever? Yes.

Finally, after months of nagging, the big blank screen

stops being blank... Right. ..after a while.

Episode...six. OK. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it's lovely when it does. It's waiting.

You build him the biggest set that's ever been built

in Doctor Who history and he says,

"Ooh, what's on that screen over there?"

Can you imagine? It's true. Can you imagine?

Oh, my God, that's true.

You get a prize, honey.

Where is mine?

Oh, I love that!

I love the bell sound.

Yeah, it's such fun.

That was a huge effect sequence, remember, it was...

It was the Doctor...the two Doctors.

Remember, it unfolded?

I said, "It's like when..." You know, when you put your recycling

your rubbish, you know, when you unpack a cardboard box

and it, and does all this and unfolds on you. That's right.

It was meant to do that. That's right.

You and Ncuti were, like, going,

"Pom-pom-pom..." Do it like origami.

Like origami. So it folded into two and then Phil said,

"We won't have money, could you have a big hammer?"

Yeah. I think this is better. Yeah. I do!

I honestly do. I think it's fun. Wouldn't take it off now.

It sort of makes more sense, in a way. It was...

It made sense of the shape of the TARDIS. It was nice.

It was like... It was mad.

Oh, look at the jukebox.

I didn't get a jukebox. Not keen on that. Yeah.

See, I think, if I'm any judge of fandom, people will worry

that that is a new TARDIS and not the old TARDIS,

Ncuti's TARDIS. Right.

And I'm here to say...

..in a story to come,

there is proof that it's still the old TARDIS.

Oh! That's all I'm saying.

That's calmed our nerves. Very good. Thank you. Very good.

So here's his theme.

Yes, just beginning, Ncuti's theme.

I love that colour. We never used that colour on the walls again.

That is gorgeous, isn't it? Oh, off you go.

I was always very sad that Kate wasn't in this scene, that she's

outside the TARDIS watching all this go on.

But I kept on thinking about those men who fell to their death,

and I thought, she can't... She can't be too glib about it.

..swan about with two TARDISes... Right, right, right.

..going, "Wow, look, at all the magic," while people died. So...

And I love Jemma.. I would have loved... I really...

I'm still not sure I'm right. I think I could have put her in there,

but it just felt wrong.

Nice that that costs her. Yeah.

You know, it's like...

She's coming back as well. That's no secret.

Look at you three, two Doctors together.

Aw!

Were you gutted in the 50th when you swanned off

and then Matt Smith got a scene with Tom Baker? Were you?

I've always meant to ask you. And it was all supposed to film

on the same day and then something happened, so I wasn't even there.

Oh! So you didn't even get to watch it? No, I didn't.

I think Steve Moffat's cruel.

You're not removing this from the edit.

It's like... I've always wondered that,

because it's such a glorious thing.

It is a glorious thing.

And you're, like, ten seconds gone from it and it's like...

Gorgeous.

Yes.

And unfortunately, we have no equivalent, I'm awfully sorry.

People are probably waiting for it. Yes.

That's just occurred to me, people will be waiting for the curator

scene, won't they? No! Yes.

It's a very different vibe. OK. It is.

It's curry, and apple crumble,

and look at the family.

And I love this. I love the family.

This was... It's probably worth noting that we didn't quite know

what we might have with Bernard at this point.

That is very true. Beautiful Bernard, who we were so lucky to film.

There was actually...

He actually died during the filming of this, he passed away.

And I actually wrote a version, remember, Phil,

in which you discussed his passing. And you probably never read that.

I never read that. It was immensely sad,

it was beautiful and it was very much a reaction

to what literally just happened because it felt very, very strange.

And so I felt like we had to acknowledge it.

And it was... You could imagine how totally fitting it is

remembering the past and coming to terms

with those we've lost and stuff like that.

And then, Phil, my learned friend Phil Collinson, just went,

"Are you mad? Are you mad?"

And of course, he's alive off camera.

Of course, he's alive forever around the corner.

And I just went, "You're so right. You're so..."

Remember that, Phil? I do. Of course I do. 'Course I do.

That's why you're a very brilliant producer. Aww! You are, though.

Because a lot of people...

We could have signed off on it almost.

And then you just went, "Stop! Stop, stop, stop, stop."

Now Bernard's forever.

Forever shooting moles. Shooting moles over the fence.

But not hurting them. No, exactly.

Oh, bless him.

And Mel's got a family, that's what I like. Yeah.

We still haven't discovered whatever happened to her family

all those years ago.

Was it Cybermen or something?

I can't remember. They never said.

I don't think we ever know.

I think that's part of the myth that it might have been the Cybermen.

Ah, right. That they were turned into something, maybe.

I love that they've got such a beautiful garden.

I wonder who's the gardener in that family?

The TARDIS is just parked in the corner. Yes.

No, I think Shaun does all the way. I think Sylvia points at things.

Yes. Sylvia's got secateurs, I think.

And I definitely think that she's a member of the RHS.

Oh, my God, Sylvia's got a trug.

Yes.

She's Margo Leadbetter. She is!

She just goes around with her secateurs...

With a funny old... Yes, yes, yes.

Where they pick... Do you remember

when she's got to help with the shelling,

picking the harvest, Margo?

Oh, it's the best scene ever filmed in television.

But look! A happy... And congratulations... Hooray!

Oh, I love how well you all look. I know. That's what I love.

And happy.

It's such a happy place to leave them.

Yes. Well done. Yeah.

Mr David Tennant. What a day that was.

The sun was shining. It was a beautiful. Birds and...

Yeah, a lot of lucky weather with this, wasn't there?

Yes. Well, it was a very hot summer. Oh, it really was. Yeah.

Beautiful, absolutely beautiful.

You've never been so happy in your life. Hooray!

Nor us, frankly. Nor us.

Absolute happiness. Oh, I'm sad this is over.

I was enjoying this. Yeah. You're forgotten, though.

There's the future, viewers.

Look at this! Isn't that how it always works?

Yeah, of course it is. Tune in at Christmas.

It will be pretty much next week, won't it?

It's a two-week gap, isn't it? Yeah.

Does it say, "Destination Christmas"? It does.

I think it does. Yeah. Brilliant.

Thank you. Is that the name of the episode, Destination Christmas?

No, it's called The Church On Ruby Road.

Oh! Very good.

Oh, thank you. Hooray!

Thank you. What a privilege.

And now there's long credits, we can talk for a long time.

I know. Like a whole minute's worth of credits.

Thank you for coming back, David.

Oh, my goodness. It was...

Thanks for having me. What a treat.

Such a pleasure. Thank you people for...

And that's a good way to go out, I think. I really do.

Think we've done you proud.

Yes, I do, too, I think.

Yeah. It's just the best episode of Doctor Who ever made, that. Mad.

Yes. Amazing.

It's the one I keep watching.

You know, when you finish these and watch one for pleasure,

I come back to this one. Good. I'm very, very proud of it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I haven't even seen the middle one yet.

No, no. It's not finished!

I'm going to be tearing up Oxford Street at five to seven.

It's like broadcasting... Pop that in!

Jam that in the machine! It is done. Press play!

People are coming to London to have a viewing with you. We are...

Is that happening?

Yes. Faithful viewer -

you're not invited. Bye-bye!