Original subtitles

The computer system Post Office

We're ready to mount and fund

Angela, nice to meet you.

We are hearing from Bob

has been obstructive

But this is about the reputation

You are the Chief Executive,

Blood on their hands now.

I am told that people

of their mediation meetings.

Our lawyers advised

has the power to overturn

You have broken your words

They say there's no remote access

but they're lying.

There was a whole room

doing thousands of corrections

while the postmasters slept.

It may be possible

to fight them in court,

How many would you need?

I can do that.

'Hard to believe it's eight years

Even harder to believe that finally,

555 of us now,

ready to tell our stories

That's all fine and dandy,

how are we gonna pay for it?

Er, well, James is the expert.

Er, there are

who are prepared to take on

If we win, we pay them back

If we lose, please?

Well, then they lose too.

It is high risk.

Win or lose, it costs a fortune.

And there's no guarantee

And I... I want to make it clear

that there are a few other things

is not going to do for us.

I'm sorry, Jo.

Sorry, Noel.

But it's not going to overturn

It's not going to discharge

One day.

It's not going to... to get back

and it's not going to repair

Or bring back those we've lost.

Well, also, er...

I've got to say,

who've not much faith in the law

Believe in British justice,

Well...

I-I've told you all the things

but I want you to think about...

All those things that

Compensation.

Bigger than that.

Justice.

Bigger.

The truth?

CHUCKLES

Exactly.

Yes, compensation.

without the truth,

Going to law will force

so, finally, we'll get to know

The truth.

The whole truth.

All those in favour?

Motion carried.

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

CHEERING INTENSIFIES

Yes, it's true that the Post Office

will now have to give us everything

but it's also true

the side with more money

Unless...

Our whole case

Yes. Yes, it is,

And what's very striking

many... people...

rang that helpline and were told,

I asked to see if that phrase

and the Post Office said,

Yeah, and anyone

knows they parrot a script,

So what happened to the principle of

Well, whatever we ask them

they either say the record

and whatever documents

are often pretty much redacted

Yes, I get the sense

is coming as news to Mr Bates.

Welcome to my world.

JO: The price of everything!

I went looking for a dress,

Yeah, love.

Did your mum tell you

No.

She...

You'd better go and speak to her.

I got a new scarf...

Do you wanna see?

I'm sorry, love.

Don't need what?

I've got cancer, love.

In a place I didn't even know

Pancreas.

Does it hurt?

Well...

JO SOBS

The look on that doctor's face...

It was me offering him the Kleenex.

He wouldn't tell me

INHALES DEEPLY

Not long. Come on.

Don't you worry about me.

Oh, I don't care about any of that!

Promise me, on my life,

Promise me, Jo, you won't rest

till the world sees

I promise.

I promise, Mum.

THEY CRY

ALAN: Sorry for your loss, Jo.

Five days, we had together.

Five more days on this Earth...

You really didn't need

No, I made her a promise.

But she's not even buried yet,

so don't ask me

Well, there could be

they're going to make us

before they even start

And you won't get called

They won't call anyone

Well, I'll still come every day

Bates and Others

I'll be "Others".

I told our lawyers, I said,

"All right, you can put my name

"but that doesn't mean you have

"Choose the best people."

Alan...

you ARE the best people.

PATRICK: 'So, listen to this.

'Three years ago,

Is it possible to access

"We are told it is,"

and Paula then asks her managers,

"I need to say,

" 'and that we are sure of this

"I need the facts."

Wow, OK.

That is an email of Paula's

in a disclosure bundle,

Well, this is...

If we can prove they have

then, I mean, that means all

Look forward to hearing you ask her

Unfortunately, the Post Office

their final list of witnesses

Paula Vennells is not on it.

Ha! Brilliant (!)

What? What's she worried about?

Who are they putting up instead?

Er, the Peoples Services Director...

Angela van den Bogerd, yes.

She's had more job titles

She's like a stick of Blackpool rock

with "Post Office"

And she's a hard-faced cow.

Excellent. Tell us

Ha! Well, who am I?

There is a possibility that Patrick

can still question Angela

Er, where is it? This is

"Sub-postmasters

"for their branch accounts.

"There is no transaction

"without their consent."

Well, that's just not true.

And we know a man who can prove it.

What, you've got a whistleblower?

You'd be right inside,

You could tell if he was busy, you

Remote access?

Not often.

We'd go in using

find the cause of his problems,

He'd never even know.

What, so, it would look like...

Yeah.

Richard, what if

What if you...

I don't know.

I can't remember much detail.

And like I said to Alan,

or stick my neck out

Sure, sure.

No, no, it's not just that Richard

He's got no evidence to give,

Alternatives?

He's still the only Fujitsu insider

I meant ties.

Oh, maroon or maroon. Hm?

SUZANNE CHUCKLES

Oh, I'm not even gonna ask.

One thing I took

is it really helps to use your face.

You know, confused,

THEY CHUCKLE

And that's your masterplan

make faces at the Post Office?

555 sub-postmasters in our group,

and I have to go on first.

I do solemnly and sincerely

that the evidence I shall give

the whole truth,

Good morning, Mr Bates.

Mr Bates, would it be right to say

you are quite a careful man?

Is that fair? You're a details man.

Yes.

At paragraph 15

you refer to being sent

"The subpostmaster

"for all losses or gains incurred

You were aware you would be

however large it was.

At the time

losses weren't a major concern.

The original deficit of £1,182...

that is a staff error, isn't it?

No.

No, that was, er...

that was definitely Horizon,

Without a shadow of a doubt.

You've got it in your mind

and forevermore,

No.

The errors jumped out.

They couldn't have been

I put to you generally

is that these deficits

or wrongdoing in your branch

That is the Post Office case.

Mr Bates, that is being put to you

so that you can tell me

No, My Lord.

No.

No further questions. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr Bates.

"A details man".

Alan did OK, I think.

DISTANT: You're gonna be brilliant.

I took over Barking Post Office

on August 3rd, 1999.

So some 19-odd years ago.

It's fair to say

is probably pretty vague.

Is that fair?

Not particularly stunning events,

like a car crash or something -

If you are talking

then, yes, they are very similar

You are talking

Yes.

Yes, I... I accept that.

Moving, then, forward

following the £18,000-odd deficit

Well, I was staggered

Absolutely staggered.

I was probably as angry and upset

Because, for the last six months,

to help me find the source

in order that I could...

How can I put it?

..that it would stop me

with phone calls, letters.

A lot of people might think,

"Well, I've received this letter.

Let's look at section 19,

and see whether

Well, I couldn't do that.

I had no entry to my post office

from the day

They took the keys away

But my point is,

without really casting your mind

I dispute that completely.

I never used to be an angry person.

And it really works, doesn't it?

Oh, well,

Otherwise, the stress of all this

ALAN CHUCKLES

Well, the Post Office

and we chose three witnesses.

The Post Office has read

Why they chose me?

So, they chose Mohammad Sabir

because he has

So just watch them try to make him

Do you accept from me

that being involved

as an assistant accountant

means that I can consider you

I did not understand your question,

Rephrase it, Mr Wentworth.

As at the time

you were not commercially naive?

My Lord,

You had experience

You weren't...

It's put me on the spot,

At that time,

I was just thinking

make my life better

This was my main ambition.

So if I am clear, honest,

so I don't be afraid of signing

assuming that they are doing

And I had already positive thinking

OK, I think you would agree

that a deficit of £4,878

Do you agree with that?

I told them everything,

Have you read all the documents

I rang the Post Office helpline.

"Please, can somebody ring me

"or come to my office

But they said,

"We have to suspend you."

I never thought

when I will be working

We are supposed to be

We don't expect anyone to behave

Why they do this?

Well, that's

The QC was very clever.

You did everything right, Mohammad.

You told the truth,

Truth is truth.

Well, that was brilliant.

Just a... pile of ash

Well, we've got

in the witness box tomorrow.

You get to ask the questions.

And I've got plenty.

We get to see if we picked

THEY CHUCKLE

Miss Van den Bogerd,

if we could please look

So, this is co-authored by you.

"Horizon Help has, since

"fallen short of delivering

"as part of Horizon roll-out

"and that postmasters and

Yes.

That is an honest and candid

of the situation, isn't it?

There were shortcomings

It's...

It's clunky,

Clunky?

Right. So why don't you mention this

I don't...

I suppose the length

it's so long anyway that...

Was it your understanding

on the length

The witness statement in itself

and so...

Mr Green.

If we could go, please,

It says, "January 30, 2015.

"Mrs Vennells asks,

" 'Is it possible

"I need to say no,

"and that we are sure of this."

So in 2015, it would be wrong

that Post Office couldn't

Post Office can't.

Could you do it through Fujitsu?

Through Fujitsu...

..yes, I can.

CROWD MUTTERS

SOFTLY: Yes.

You're going to have to keep

I'm sorry. Sorry.

I suggest

anything that is damaging

That is not the case.

Do you feel pressure to protect

At this particular moment?

Yes.

Can I just ask one simple question?

What exactly does

It-It... It just means that, erm...

One, it is making sure

how we behave,

And it's...

It's just making sure that,

we are maintaining that.

CROWD MUTTERS

BIG BEN TOLLS,

Made it past midnight.

HE CHUCKLES

All the meetings with MPs,

More ministers

Years and years.

Still, nobody in power

What's brought this on?

New Year's Honours list.

Come on, turn it off, details man.

Paula Vennells has got the CBE.

Services to the Post Office.

SHE GASPS

Always another trick

HE CHUCKLES

I'll see you up there.

The Post Office now admits

but they insist it could

and permission

Well, they're wrong.

But it's 15 years ago. More.

I... can't remember the details.

I can't help you, Alan.

It's not that bad, honestly.

There'll be loads

I wasn't senior, Alan. Not at all.

And my girlfriend really doesn't

You just have to talk to the judge.

You can really help us out here,

and still be home for your tea.

I'll only disappoint you.

You'll be fine.

BOB: 'Jo?'

Bob, what are you doing here?

Oh, I wouldn't miss this

Fujitsu technical support

The guy's quite shy.

A real-life whistleblower.

It's gonna be dynamite, kid.

Mr Roll...

Would you accept

at Fujitsu is hazy?

It is quite hazy.

It could just be my perception

..15, 17 years ago.

So you're not saying that you were

routinely encountering

Bugs? No, no.

You don't recall ever

that definitely caused

I don't... recall discovering one,

I'm going to move on

My suggestion to you

and would never manually change

that a postmaster had keyed in.

No, that is something we did,

But ultimately, the sub-postmaster

what Fujitsu had done, is that true?

Again, my understanding

the data would be indis... erm...

Indistinguishable?

Yes.

Yes, my Lord.

You couldn't tell the difference.

No, you... you couldn't tell

Remote access to the Horizon system

We had the ability to change data

even while the postmaster

Without the postmaster being aware?

Yes, that is my understanding.

Your understanding?

No.

My recollection.

'Thought he was great in the end.'

I wonder if it's enough.

I asked you a question, Bob,

"Bob, where did all the money go?"

£36,000, they took off me.

Now, I think -

I can't prove it, Jo, not yet,

that the money you gave them

hung around in some sort

while they failed to investigate.

And after a couple of years,

..it just showed up

My £36,000 that I didn't steal,

that they actually stole off me

that never existed...

..is in the Post Office profits.

I just...

I mean, are they just incompetent,

Er, well, you know,

Another one?

Definitely.

The Post Office describes itself

as "the nation's

Well, as far as these claimants

this might be thought to be

The Post Office witnesses

that they simply

to consider the possibility

as the consequences of doing so

Angela van den Bogerd did not

She sought to mislead me.

Her judgment also seemed

to paint the Post Office in

regardless of the facts.

Mr Bates seemed to me to offer

"..has proved himself

"and a considerable irritant

He's got you to a T.

CHUCKLES

And the Post Office, too.

Er, "Oppressive, unfair,

and, well, 180,000 other words

GIGGLES

Sorry, we've got to get back

Why?

Hold on, love.

'I just saw this five minutes ago.'

It's an application for me

as being the managing judge

Mr Wentworth,

Post Office asked the judge

on the grounds that he's clearly

Amazing. This is the best day ever.

Proof they're desperate.

I mean, in my world, Alan,

the most, er,

is to make unfounded allegations

I mean, you just... you...

They're idiots.

I bet you it wasn't the lawyers

I bet it came

Oh, well,

Well, we're winning.

Well, yes, but...

Oh, I should have known there

Well, the trial stops now.

It'll be weeks,

on whether we need a new judge.

And it's a delay the Post Office

That's why they're doing this,

Alan... we have run out of money.

No.

No, no, we can't stop now.

No-one's talking about stopping.

But... it is time to start...

..negotiating a settlement.

HE CHUCKLES

I think you're forgetting

I've negotiated

and people have died.

Well, people are still dying.

You know this, all right,

There's millions of people

who don't know about the suicides

God knows how many victims

who are still too scared

Ha! I haven't spent 20 years

to pack up now

to start running amok

Again.

Well...

Well, I-I've said enough.

We have to win.

Alan, we just did.

This is what winning looks like.

You're talking

and it's... it's really not.

This is just what happens

we get around the table.

And if we don't

we lose everything

and the clock sets back to zero.

So... it's about knowing when

So that's it, give up now.

No, no. We... settle.

Same thing.

MAN: Mrs Vennells? Paula Vennells?

Yes?

Would you like to say anything

who've been through

No. I really find this unacceptable.

Would you like to apologise to them?

So, you won't apologise to them?

Well, can I confirm, then,

you're saying you will not apologise

after everything

NEWSREADER:

'during which the Post Office

'to remove the judge,

'on almost every count.

'Their victory

'worth £58 million.'

Well... You took them on,

And I cannot overstate enough

It is more than we could ever have

It is an absolutely

In my professional career,

I have never seen anything

APPLAUSE

Having... Having said that,

I-I do need to make you aware that,

er, there are legal fees

and our obligations to our funders

So...

The amount that will be left

..divide amongst yourselves

will be in the region of,

MUMBLING

Wait, 12 million between 555?

That... That's, what, 20...

On average, yes.

That... That...

That won't touch the sides

Listen, I understand,

is that today's settlement

so that people with convictions

to help with their appeals

MAN: But what about us?

What this also means

who've been too scared

will be able to do so without fear.

Friends... we did talk this

and we knew we might not see

..we decided, we voted to go ahead.

They got paid, right?

ALL TALK OVER EACH OTHER

Excuse me? Excuse me?

Excuse me!

I've been in court every single day,

and I saw us with my own eyes

And that's all down

and their hard work.

So could you just all... stop it?

GROUP MURMURS

It's never gonna end, is it?

I wouldn't mind, but our legal team

and none of them,

took anything like the fees

Well, anyway, it's not about money,

Well, it is, partly.

HE CHUCKLES

You know what I mean.

You won, Alan.

You set out to prove Horizon

You won.

But everyone is still skint.

Alan...

Lee, I want to...

Everyone can see you did your best.

I mean that.

Don't listen to the angry people.

I know. It's all right.

Just remember, we'd be nowhere

HE CHUCKLES

Huh...

There from the beginning...

Never. Not for all those long years.

Just been a tower of strength

Ooh, am I embarrassing you?

Listen, Jo...

All this evidence

all the secrets

well, we got to the truth.

It belongs to us now. Use it.

Go to the Court of Appeal

what a miscarriage of justice

All right, Alan.

But... what are you gonna do?

Oh, er... There's a pint of beer

HE CHUCKLES

HE SIGHS

I think people are bitter.

They're angry. And I get it, I do.

I'm bitter. I'm angry.

And I care about the money,

I care about the home

the life we could have had, and...

But I care about justice, too.

And you, I care about you,

so don't you dare

I don't.

You have absolutely nothing

And that's why I don't blame myself.

Come on, let's get home.

I suppose I've... I've never seen

I-I treat it like a job, you know?

Something I lift off the shelf

Funnily enough,

the "putting it back on the shelf"

More the "seven days a week,

HE LAUGHS

And also, Alan, jobs are things

Yeah, something went a bit wrong

HE CHUCKLES

Not actually giving up at all,

Well...

..there's the small matter

getting their money back.

And then there's the small matter

holding up their hands

For the Vennells?

The British government.

Why? Well, because the government

of the good ship Post Office,

which doesn't have a penny

owing to the fact

All of which means that in the end,

Her Majesty's Government is going

accept responsibility

and pay us the compensation

When people say "the government",

but nobody would begrudge you.

We established the truth

and now I'm focusing on the 555

who need their lives

You don't give up, do you,

Well...

Someone's got to be.

Alan, cast your mind back,

to the summer of 2013.

Er, Bob was doing his review.

And you were fighting me

I was right, though.

And at the same time,

in secret and at the highest level,

were commissioning

This lawyer's report

that the Post Office lied to

You were right.

It also proves that all the time

we were wading through treacle

senior Post Office executives

and failing to disclose

there were unsafe convictions.

Did... Did Paula know?

It's not possible to say

PAULA: 'I want to say

'for those sub-postmasters

'I have read many of their stories,

'They are with me every day.

'I was and remain deeply disturbed

'It is contrary to what I believe

'as CEO of Post Office

'I wish to state for the record

'any personal criminal misconduct.'

WOMAN: Morning, Jo. Good luck.

This judgment concerns

..who were all prosecuted

and convicted

Josephine Hamilton pleaded guilty

There was no examination of the data

There was no proof of an actual loss

as opposed to

Even more alarming,

Post Office Limited's

there was no evidence of theft.

We conclude Mrs Hamilton's

and an affront to justice.

We allow her appeal.

We quash her convictions.

Notwithstanding his guilty plea,

We allow his appeal.

His prosecution was unfair

In the case of Susan Rudkin,

Her conviction is unsafe.

Very sadly,

Julian Wilson, Peter Holmes

have not lived to see the outcome

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

REPORTER: 'Did the Post Office

'No. No, no.

'I've been to jail.

'It doesn't do any good.

'Hit them in their pockets.

'It's the only language

APPLAUSE

You should have gone down

It's not about me.

Where's Jo?

There she is.

REPORTER: 'Jo? What do you think

'Oh, I dunno. Erm...

'We've waited so long for this day,

'People have died, you know,

'and all we ever wanted

'and for someone to listen.'

It didn't have to be like this.

All these good people,

I mean, look at us.

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Bob!

BOB LAUGHS

Congratulations, Jo.

Not just unfair, but look at this!

"An affront to justice."

No, that's 100 times as bad.

Oh, you were like lambs

and they were villains and idiots.

Hey, you.

You make me cry, you're a bad man.

'Josephine Hamilton and others

'Look, Alan!'

'Look what we did!

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Come on! Yes! Yes!

It's jaw-droppingly significant.

The judges have not only ruled

were wrongfully convicted,

that the Post Office decision

that it amounts to an affront

This has to be

in British legal history.

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

I know what you're thinking.

Well, it's not over, is it?

Well, how about we...

OK.

TYPING IN OTHER ROOM

Alan?

Minister of postal affairs.

Re legal costs

Total now due: £46,843,853.

Plus another month's interest at 8%.

Mounts up.

On what planet is the government

They'll have to.

Sole shareholder.

The only one.

The only one awkward enough

making trouble for 20 years.

20 years so far.

Just think of it as a hobby

THEY LAUGH