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He would come to my house on his way
home from shift,
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and he'd have his firefighter
gear on. You could smell the smoke.
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00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:13,560
Everybody loved James Scott.
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00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:15,320
Everybody. He won everybody over.
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00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:20,280
There was this little black book
sitting in
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the branches of the Christmas tree.
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I took it out and opened it up
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and it just said,
"Coleen Scott's wedding diary."
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I said...I said yes.
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I...I couldn't really not say it.
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I didn't feel I could say no.
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My daughters were 13 and 15.
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00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:40,840
My family was complete in my eyes.
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I was like, "Are you sure?
You know, once you do this,
15
00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:47,960
"there's no going back."
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00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:51,760
He is making this life-changing
decision. That's the red flag.
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I went into shock.
I just couldn't...
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..couldn't get my head around it.
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I had this awful fear that he's
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going to think I've cheated on him.
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This was breaking my heart.
My wedding dress is hanging there,
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Everything's ready to go,
and he's sitting there saying,
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"I can't go ahead with it."
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He was crying his eyes out.
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The feeling of...helplessness was
just terrible.
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I'd been single for quite a while,
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I had come out of quite
a long relationship,
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I'd been married for 17 years.
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00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:53,240
I just thought it might be nice
to dip my toe back in
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00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,840
the dating scene
and maybe go for a few dates,
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00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:59,320
have a bit of fun.
A lot of my friends were doing it.
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The apps were getting quite popular,
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00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:03,400
and I thought, "Well,
I've got nothing to lose,
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"it might be fun,"
so I gave it a go.
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I got a message from
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a gentleman who called himself
Firefighter J,
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that was his profile name.
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He didn't have a profile picture on.
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He just said for the nature of
his job,
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00:02:21,320 --> 00:02:23,600
he didn't like to put his picture
out there.
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00:02:23,640 --> 00:02:27,560
And he emailed me loads
of photos straight away.
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00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:33,640
It was exciting cos we did seem to
have a lot in common -
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he had two daughters,
I had two daughters.
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He was divorced, I was divorced.
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I definitely thought, "Yes, seems
like my kind of person."
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I think it's great being a twin.
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It means you have a best friend
that's always got your back.
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00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:54,800
Coleen and I worked together.
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We both worked for student
accommodation
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for Durham University.
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One afternoon at work
I got a message,
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and he'd just been playing
a round of golf
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because he wasn't on shift
that afternoon
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and said he could pop into Durham.
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00:03:07,800 --> 00:03:09,720
I said to her, actually, "Just go,
just go and
56
00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:11,600
"see if there's a spark.
Go and meet him
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"and then you'll know
if it's something that you really,
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"you know, want to pursue or not."
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00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:17,760
So, yeah, I nervously decided that,
yeah,
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I'll go, go meet him for coffee.
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00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,280
His photos were genuine, he was
the spit of his photographs.
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00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:26,680
And he worked
out of Darlington Fire Station,
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part of the White Watch.
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His stories were so interesting
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and all these tales about
the guys he worked with at
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the station, and it was
entertaining.
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And, yeah, I left and thought,
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"Nice guy," you know, "I might see
him again."
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00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:48,760
After we'd only had two or three
dates,
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he would pop in
to work quite regularly.
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He'd bring me croissants or
chocolate bars and flowers.
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They'd be the most beautiful
bouquets coming to work.
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But they'd be coming sometimes on
a daily basis,
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on occasion twice a day.
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00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:06,880
I remember one instance, he sent
flowers three times in one day.
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00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:08,840
The guys at work were always ribbing
and teasing me
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00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:10,640
because it's like,
"He's a bit keen, isn't he?"
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00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:28,040
The thing is, with love-bombing,
it is disguised as love.
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What James does, you know,
he sends flowers,
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he sends chocolates,
nothing that extravagant,
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but romantic.
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He is being very romantic.
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Something that Coleen is
desperate for,
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00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:44,240
that is missing from her life,
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and immediately he is filling
that void.
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00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:50,640
When I first met James,
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I was quite taken by how charismatic
he was, really,
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very gregarious.
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There was no nerves at all about
meeting new family members.
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00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,920
He was very, you know,
larger than life, very boisterous.
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00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:10,560
I'd like to describe it as,
you know, meeting a Jack Russell
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in a house, and he'll run around,
jump on you, try and lick you.
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00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:15,640
You know, that kind of personality.
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00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:17,080
Very excitable.
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To me, family's everything.
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The fact that my girls liked him,
they got on,
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my mum liked him,
my sister, my brother-in-law,
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00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:28,880
all my friends. It was just great.
Perfect.
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What's so interesting about
James at this point is that he's
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00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:37,440
incredibly good at getting other
people to like him.
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00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:41,480
And so I think all those kinds
of danger points that you might
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look for at this point in time
aren't showing.
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KAREN:James was really passionate
about his job.
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00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:53,040
He really sort of came alive when
he was talking about his career
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00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:55,720
and the Fire Service
and all his colleagues.
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He would come to my house on his way
home from shift
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00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:01,360
and he'd have his firefighter
gear on.
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00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:04,960
You could smell the smoke on it.
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00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:07,800
He told us a story about how he
had saved a little boy
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00:06:07,840 --> 00:06:10,320
from a burning building and jumped
out and landed on his back.
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00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:12,200
And that's apparently how he broke
his back.
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He had a card from the little boy,
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and he actually gave me that card.
And I was so proud.
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I used to keep it on my desk at
work.
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He is the hero. He is the saviour.
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And, you know, he is a firefighter.
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So, for the evenings and the
occasions
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he is not around,
Coleen's thinking,
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00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:35,960
"Well, he's off saving someone's
life, I can't be cross with that
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00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:37,720
"because he is making a difference."
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And that's exactly what he wants
her to think.
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SIRENS WAIL
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00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,120
About six months into
our relationship,
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00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,320
I discovered I was pregnant, and
it was a shock.
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00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:57,240
I didn't know what to do for
the best.
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00:06:57,280 --> 00:06:59,280
My daughters were 13 and 15.
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00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:00,840
My family was complete in my eyes.
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00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:03,600
James had his two daughters,
his family was complete.
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00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:05,320
So we had the difficult conversation
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00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:08,200
and decided that the best thing,
you know,
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00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:09,920
was to terminate the pregnancy.
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00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:18,560
Yeah, it was, um... Yeah.
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I'd never had to deal
with anything like that before,
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00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:25,000
and it was a hard decision to make,
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00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,280
and I did find it really,
really tough.
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00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:30,840
I wouldn't say I made
the wrong decision
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but I definitely didn't take
it lightly.
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00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:42,040
I was terrified if it happened once,
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00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:43,840
what's to say it wouldn't
happen again?
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00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:46,680
And from that point I wasn't
comfortable having
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00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,920
a physical relationship,
just out of fear that...
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00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,040
It was almost like a bit of PTSD.
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00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:54,480
I was just so scared that
that could happen again
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00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:56,880
that our relationship halted at
that point
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because I was too frightened.
146
00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:06,800
James suggested having a vasectomy.
147
00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:08,520
He didn't want me worrying,
148
00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:11,520
and obviously he wanted us to have
a relationship together.
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00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:14,720
I was like, "Are you sure?" I said,
"You know, once you do this,
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00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:17,200
"there's no going back."
But he was adamant that it was the
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00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:18,880
right thing to do for our
relationship.
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KAREN:The fact he would
so selflessly decide to have
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00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:24,920
a vasectomy just
for Coleen's peace of mind,
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we just thought was such a nice,
kind, giving act of love, really,
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and we all loved him
a little bit more for that.
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I think the red flag comes around
his willingness
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00:08:41,680 --> 00:08:42,840
to get this vasectomy
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because they hardly know each
other, really.
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He is making this life-changing
decision,
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like this.
SHE SNAPS HER FINGERS
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I didn't go with him for this
procedure, he went privately.
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He was very stoic about it,
he was going to go on his own.
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In due course, he showed me the
documentation to prove he'd got
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00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:07,840
a nil sperm count, and once I'd seen
that, then, yeah,
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00:09:07,880 --> 00:09:12,680
our relationship could, in its
fullness, you know, start again.
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00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:29,320
This is a really significant place
167
00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,640
because this is where I found out
I was pregnant again.
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James had had a vasectomy,
so that couldn't be possible.
169
00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:39,200
But on a night out with
Karen and Ryan and James,
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I just didn't feel right.
I felt a bit out of sorts.
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00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:46,440
A little uneasy, almost like I had
done in my previous pregnancies,
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which I knew was stupid, ridiculous.
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So I took Karen to one side
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00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:53,240
and told her I was feeling that
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00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:54,960
I just felt like
I could be pregnant,
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which she thought was hilarious,
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but I wouldn't let it go,
to the point that she turned
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00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:02,640
to James and said, "For God's sake,
James, will you nip to the chemist,
179
00:10:02,680 --> 00:10:05,960
"get Coleen a pregnancy test, and
then we can all put this to bed."
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00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:09,800
I did the test and up came
a blue line,
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00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:11,800
and I just couldn't believe what
I was looking at.
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00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:13,200
I was in such shock.
183
00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:17,920
I remember thinking,
184
00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,400
"This is absolutely ridiculous, this
isn't right."
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00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:21,840
But, no, she was,
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00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:25,080
she went on to do about six further
tests and she was pregnant.
187
00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,920
We were all flabbergasted,
except for James.
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00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:32,080
The rest of us were devastated,
and he... "Oh, this is good."
189
00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:34,800
And I couldn't understand why he
would go through having
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00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:37,560
a vasectomy to then find out
Coleen was pregnant again
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00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:39,240
and think this was a good thing.
192
00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:41,280
You put his behaviour
193
00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:44,760
and his responses
to certain situations all together
194
00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:46,760
and there is your red flag.
195
00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:50,520
I was horrified
cos I couldn't be pregnant.
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00:10:50,560 --> 00:10:53,120
There was no way, I'd seen
the test results.
197
00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:58,000
James had had the vasectomy.
But it said I was.
198
00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:00,680
All I could think to myself was,
"How has this happened?"
199
00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:04,160
And worse, "James is going to think
I've been unfaithful."
200
00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,680
And I kept telling him,
"I haven't, I wouldn't,
201
00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:08,840
"I could never do that to you."
202
00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:12,240
And he was so, so sweet,
he just said,
203
00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:14,880
never, never would he ever think
that of me.
204
00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:18,440
KAREN:I remember at the time
thinking how understanding
205
00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:21,200
and trusting of him
to believe without a shadow of
206
00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:23,200
a doubt that she hasn't cheated
on him.
207
00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:25,920
Because I think most men in that
situation would have
208
00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:27,440
a few niggling doubts.
209
00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:30,680
There was no way I was having
another termination after how
210
00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:33,440
I felt last time
and the soul-searching
211
00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:36,880
and the upset, and I just knew,
212
00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,160
and James knew that I could never
do that.
213
00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:42,320
It was never up for discussion that
I would be having this baby.
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00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,720
PHONE RINGS
I started to bleed,
215
00:11:57,760 --> 00:11:59,360
and it was scary.
216
00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:01,680
So I tried to get in contact
with James.
217
00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:03,840
He was on shift at the time,
218
00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:06,040
he didn't answer his phone.
I left him loads
219
00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:08,400
of messages, didn't get any
response.
220
00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:12,920
RYAN:Karen and I were there with
her,
221
00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:15,120
supporting her all the way.
222
00:12:15,160 --> 00:12:17,000
None of us could get James on
the phone.
223
00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:23,320
I was very angry with James,
I found it really, really difficult
224
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:26,400
to understand why he wouldn't be
there at that time.
225
00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:29,040
I know I hadn't wanted this baby,
226
00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:32,320
but I wanted this baby now,
I loved this baby.
227
00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:35,440
I was scared to breathe, really.
228
00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,240
I was so scared every movement would
bring my labour on.
229
00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:40,760
At this point there was no sign
of James.
230
00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:43,520
He still hadn't returned any
of my calls.
231
00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:45,200
I was in an awful state.
232
00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:11,640
James turned up, it must have been
maybe three or four hours
233
00:13:11,680 --> 00:13:13,400
after I'd been in the hospital.
234
00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:15,800
He came in wearing his
firefighter gear,
235
00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:17,680
he'd come straight from a shout.
236
00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:20,080
KAREN:It was Bonfire Night.
So it's the busiest night
237
00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:21,720
of the year for the Fire Service.
238
00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,280
And he was just so sorry that he
couldn't be there.
239
00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:26,800
He's saving lives, isn't he,
so what can you do?
240
00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:28,160
You can't be too annoyed.
241
00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:31,560
I think what James is doing very
cleverly is developing
242
00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:34,240
the scaffolding of a story.
243
00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:37,240
And he's fantastic at
this storytelling.
244
00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,560
And from Coleen's point of view,
she's buying into it.
245
00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:51,680
It was just before the Christmas,
246
00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:55,000
so I will have been
six months pregnant.
247
00:13:55,040 --> 00:13:57,800
And I came into the living room
and my girls were there,
248
00:13:57,840 --> 00:13:58,960
and James said,
249
00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:01,960
"Can you see anything different?
What about the Christmas tree?"
250
00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:04,640
And so I got up and waddled over to
the tree
251
00:14:04,680 --> 00:14:07,400
and there was this little black book
sitting in
252
00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,280
the branches of the Christmas tree,
253
00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:11,760
so I took it out and opened it up
254
00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:14,680
and it just said,
"Coleen Scott's wedding diary."
255
00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:18,920
It had these little, like,
mini Post-it notes,
256
00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:21,520
and they were numbered
one to five, or one to six.
257
00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,520
And number one was
"meet the wedding planner",
258
00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:27,680
and the time and the day
and the venue
259
00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:29,000
I was meeting the wedding planner.
260
00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:33,320
Number two, cake tasting and where
we were going to do it and the time.
261
00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:34,960
And then it just went on like that.
262
00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:36,480
You know, wedding dress fitting,
263
00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:39,400
and then even then onto details of
the honeymoon
264
00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:41,120
and the flight numbers
and everything,
265
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:43,800
all chapter-and-verse in this diary.
266
00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:45,680
It was a massive surprise to
Coleen.
267
00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:48,600
She really wasn't expecting
to get proposed to.
268
00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:51,720
But then it wasn't really a
proposal
269
00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:54,400
because it was all done
fait accompli.
270
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,560
I was just flummoxed,
I was just totally shocked.
271
00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:02,160
It was never on my agenda.
272
00:15:02,200 --> 00:15:04,280
I didn't want to get married again.
273
00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,960
What feels like is going on is that
Coleen is now
274
00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:11,920
an object who he's managing,
275
00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:16,240
and he's created this fantasy
wedding around her,
276
00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:18,800
and she just has to take
part in it.
277
00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:22,200
And telling her two daughters,
who are very excited
278
00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:23,800
by this whole wedding,
279
00:15:23,840 --> 00:15:28,440
is all adding to her being squeezed
out of the story, actually,
280
00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:30,960
because it's no longer about
the two of them.
281
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:32,960
It's about what he's doing for her.
282
00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:35,440
And he's got full control at
this point.
283
00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:38,560
I just turned to him and he's down
on one knee with a ring.
284
00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:40,520
You could have knocked me down
with a feather.
285
00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:42,000
I did not see that coming.
286
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,040
I said...I said yes.
287
00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:51,880
I...I couldn't really not say it.
288
00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:53,600
I didn't feel like I could say no.
289
00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:55,880
And I'm not saying I didn't
want to marry him.
290
00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:57,880
I loved him and we were having
a baby.
291
00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:02,920
Just, it had never been anything
that I'd even...considered,
292
00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:04,680
and I didn't think he had either.
293
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:15,800
I was really scared
294
00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:17,560
because I just didn't know what was
happening.
295
00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,640
Um... Yeah, it was terrifying.
296
00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:25,440
KAREN:James was at the
hospital sporadically
297
00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,480
and he was always leaving Coleen
to go and make phone calls.
298
00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:33,680
And it got to the point where Ryan
was getting quite annoyed with him
299
00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:35,880
and saying,
"You need to be by her side."
300
00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:41,680
It looked bleak at this point.
301
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:44,080
I was too ill that I couldn't go
with him.
302
00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:46,160
And, um...
303
00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:49,480
So they brought him in, like,
304
00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:51,280
a trolley that they would put in
the ambulance,
305
00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,080
and wheeled him in to see me.
306
00:16:53,120 --> 00:16:55,680
Um...
307
00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,560
They gave me
a little photograph of him,
308
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:01,000
and I didn't realise at that time
that that was probably
309
00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:03,560
because they thought that would be
the last time I'd see him,
310
00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:06,480
and they took him off
and I was just...
311
00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:11,960
It was the feeling of helplessness
was just terrible.
312
00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:14,880
So all I wanted at that point was
James to go
313
00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:16,480
and his dad to be with him
314
00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,640
so he wasn't alone that night,
in case the worst happened.
315
00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:25,520
He didn't want me,
you know, to go with him.
316
00:17:25,560 --> 00:17:26,880
He was going to, you know,
317
00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:30,480
be at Charlie's bedside.
He didn't need anybody else.
318
00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:33,600
I don't for a second believe he
actually went to be with Charlie.
319
00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:35,840
And Charlie, who could have passed
away that night,
320
00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:37,320
would have been completely on
his own.
321
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:50,200
James suddenly announced to Karen
and I that
322
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:51,800
his mother had approached him,
323
00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:56,160
she wanted to invest in a restaurant
or a wine bar
324
00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:57,480
in the Newcastle area,
325
00:17:57,520 --> 00:17:59,920
and she wanted James
to get involved in this.
326
00:17:59,960 --> 00:18:03,800
Then James opened up more about
his mother's financial situation
327
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:05,520
and that she was really
quite wealthy,
328
00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:07,480
which we had not been aware of.
329
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,600
And since he was only doing
the odd shift at
330
00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:11,120
the Fire Service, then, yeah,
331
00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:12,920
it seemed a perfect idea for him.
332
00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:15,760
This is something that Coleen
333
00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:17,960
and I had always harboured
a dream of owning.
334
00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,560
We'd always talked,
even as children,
335
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:22,200
the fact we would love a coffee shop
or a little restaurant.
336
00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:23,760
I did have some money at that point
337
00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:26,000
because I had an inheritance from
my father.
338
00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,600
And I thought investing in
something like that,
339
00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:31,040
which had always been my dream,
would just be
340
00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:34,720
an ideal way to use it.
I invested, in total, £30,000.
341
00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:38,400
ANJULA:
The story that James has spun
342
00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:40,960
so far gives Karen confidence
343
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,440
this is going to be
a family business.
344
00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:46,640
So, at this point,
if there was a red flag,
345
00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,960
it's turned green
because she feels safer
346
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:52,080
because Mum's part of
the storyline now.
347
00:18:52,120 --> 00:18:54,480
I had no qualms about wanting
to be part of it.
348
00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:56,760
I really wanted to invest in it,
349
00:18:56,800 --> 00:18:59,000
and, you know, it was...
350
00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,880
It looked really like a legit
proposition.
351
00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:04,320
From a policing perspective,
352
00:19:04,360 --> 00:19:05,680
the fact that he is willing
353
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:09,400
to accept money from her sister is
a massive red flag.
354
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,640
If this was a successful business,
355
00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,120
if his mum was putting all this
356
00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:17,000
money into this business on
his behalf,
357
00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:18,840
he wouldn't need her money.
358
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:21,680
And one thing we do know
with fraudsters
359
00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:24,240
is they always purport to
have money.
360
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:25,920
"Oh, yeah, well,
I've already got money,
361
00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:27,440
"so I don't really need yours."
362
00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:31,240
Because then they'll make it look
like your idea to give it them.
363
00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:35,560
This is Pravda,
364
00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:36,960
one of the properties we came
365
00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,920
to view when James was interested in
setting up
366
00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:42,960
the business, restaurant, nightclub,
whatever,
367
00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:45,440
with his mum,
that Karen invested in.
368
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:49,080
It used to be a Russian nightclub.
369
00:19:49,120 --> 00:19:51,200
And, yeah, it was good.
370
00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:53,600
Out of all the places James took us
to view,
371
00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,240
it definitely got everyone's vote.
372
00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:58,880
And you could see
the potential, its quite old,
373
00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:01,560
not been used in quite a while,
bit dusty.
374
00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:03,800
But you could see
the vision that James had,
375
00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:06,720
and he was so excited, and...
376
00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,040
..everybody got swept up in it.
377
00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:13,200
We were going to call it, on James's
suggestion, At Scott's
378
00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:15,520
so it would have the Scott name
379
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:17,760
and it would be a family business.
380
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:21,560
James had an interior designer come
and meet us at the property.
381
00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:24,960
James had so many plans, it was like
a runaway train.
382
00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:32,640
At the time, I told James not to be
so stupid
383
00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:34,440
and I didn't believe him for
a second,
384
00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:37,840
but then he had so much paperwork
and emails to back it up.
385
00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:40,960
REBECCA:We tend to find that
386
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:43,960
fraudsters like to exaggerate
everything.
387
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:46,440
Not only that, there will be
supporting
388
00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,200
documentation coming
out of your eyeballs
389
00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:51,440
because they know they're lying.
390
00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:54,600
Being back here now,
looking at the property,
391
00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:56,560
it's...it's weird,
392
00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:59,720
it just feels like yesterday that we
were here wandering around
393
00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:02,280
with Charlie in his little car seat,
394
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:04,320
and not a lot has really changed.
395
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:11,080
He had businessmen.
He had solicitor's firms.
396
00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:14,160
You know, organisations that,
you know,
397
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:16,960
when you walked in,
he was this fantastic person,
398
00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:19,080
and he would promise you the world.
399
00:21:19,120 --> 00:21:22,120
So it wasn't just Coleen,
it wasn't just the family,
400
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:24,440
it was a lot more people.
401
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:27,400
They always say, you know, you've
got to believe your own lies,
402
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:29,960
and if you do that,
you can convince anyone.
403
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,400
And that's what he did.
Everyone's wanting to invest.
404
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:36,800
They are feeding off his energy
and his drive.
405
00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:45,480
RYAN:James didn't just manipulate
Coleen,
406
00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:47,720
James manipulated the whole family.
407
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:49,640
But James didn't just manipulate
the family,
408
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:51,960
James manipulated everybody around
the family.
409
00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:21,960
James came up with this proposal,
410
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:23,680
"Well, you work in property
already.
411
00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:26,440
"Why don't we just set up
a property business?"
412
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,040
I thought, "Doesn't seem like a bad
thing.
413
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:31,240
"James has got the investment from
his mum.
414
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:33,680
"His mum's got the chops
to make this work.
415
00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:35,080
"So, you know,
what could go wrong?"
416
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,440
The property business we decided was
417
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:41,880
going to be called Gemini Property
418
00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:45,160
because the star sign
Gemini is twins.
419
00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:47,080
Karen I would really be the
420
00:22:47,120 --> 00:22:49,960
figurehead at the front of the
business.
421
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:52,880
In Gemini, I invested
a further £25,000.
422
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:58,520
All of my money at that point,
423
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,120
everything I had was tied up
424
00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:04,000
in investments related to James,
425
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:08,600
but I never felt at that point that
it was worrying
426
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,040
because he was a member
of our family,
427
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,280
he was my...my nephew's father.
428
00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:15,960
He, you know, he was James,
we all loved him.
429
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:18,480
Everything appeared
totally legitimate.
430
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,200
Everything seemed perfect.
431
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:23,680
It was exciting times.
432
00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:38,200
James found a lump on one
of his testicles.
433
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,600
I was there in the waiting room when
they called out James Scott
434
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:43,560
and he went into the room.
435
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:44,960
Um...
436
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:49,280
So, yeah, it was suspected
testicular cancer.
437
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:51,600
The wedding was put on hold.
438
00:23:58,160 --> 00:23:59,720
I just felt sick,
439
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:03,680
I felt just shocked
and horrified and frightened
440
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:05,680
and worried for the future,
441
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:07,760
and just all the emotion you can
442
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,880
imagine when you find out your
loved one's sick.
443
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,320
When I got the news, I was, you
know, concerned for the guy.
444
00:24:15,360 --> 00:24:17,760
You know, we'd become,
you know, reasonably good friends
445
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:18,920
by this point, you know,
446
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:21,040
I was going to be his best man at
the wedding.
447
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:24,360
And, you know, the news
was shocking.
448
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:38,680
It feels at this point very much as
449
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,240
if James is now
future-faking Coleen,
450
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,480
because how do you put the brakes on
a wedding you don't want to happen?
451
00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:47,800
You get cancer.
452
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,200
James went for tests at the
hospital.
453
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,000
It wasn't cancer. It turned out it
was a condition called hydrocele,
454
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:59,240
which causes a fluid build-up that
can be misdiagnosed as cancer.
455
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:01,960
The relief and just...
456
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,160
We were so happy he was going
to be OK.
457
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:07,320
We were just absolutely
shellshocked
458
00:25:07,360 --> 00:25:09,920
because we'd been pretty much told
it was,
459
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:13,200
you know, the diagnosis was
a bad one.
460
00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:14,600
So to suddenly hear this,
461
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:17,800
it was just, like,
the most amazing news ever.
462
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:32,040
I was very surprised at how quickly
463
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,200
the wedding got rearranged.
Looking back on it,
464
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:37,080
I would have thought,
you know, you've dodged a bullet,
465
00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:39,200
just let sleeping dogs lie,
you know,
466
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:43,240
move on with things.
But, no, as James was,
467
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:46,520
everything had to happen now,
and according to James' schedule.
468
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,960
Both his daughters were going to be
bridesmaids as well as my two girls.
469
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:08,080
They were very excited about coming
to the wedding,
470
00:26:08,120 --> 00:26:10,720
his ex had agreed that they
could come,
471
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:12,080
and this was actually going to be
472
00:26:12,120 --> 00:26:14,280
the first time I'd properly met
them.
473
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:16,920
He was sending us pictures from
the hotel he was in,
474
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:20,800
and then it went quiet,
and I rang his phone
475
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:22,480
and it was turned off,
476
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:24,760
so I started to get
a little bit concerned about that,
477
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:26,800
but I just thought,
478
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,160
"He's going to be back
the day after tomorrow, it's fine."
479
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:36,320
I was actually at my mum's house
with Coleen,
480
00:26:36,360 --> 00:26:38,400
and James walked in the house
481
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:41,560
and just slumped on the sofa
with his head in his hands,
482
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:45,240
and then he said that
the wedding was off.
483
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,080
He couldn't bring his daughters
back, his ex-wife wouldn't allow it,
484
00:26:48,120 --> 00:26:50,600
and he couldn't get married without
his daughters being there.
485
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,080
At that point I'm like, "What?!"
486
00:26:53,120 --> 00:26:56,000
And he went,
"No, no, I can't do it."
487
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:58,840
And at this stage
all my family in Ireland
488
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:01,560
have got the hotels booked.
Everyone's got their outfits,
489
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:03,960
the hotels booked,
the flights booked.
490
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,640
Everything's ready to go,
and he's sitting there saying,
491
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:09,680
"I can't go ahead with it, I can't
do it without my girls being there."
492
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:11,400
He was crying his eyes out.
493
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:15,440
I felt incredibly bad
for him that he was so upset,
494
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,400
but I felt more upset for my
sister.
495
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:18,880
This was her second wedding
496
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,240
and now he was cancelling it at
the last moment.
497
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,240
So I felt angry on her behalf.
And I thought,
498
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:25,200
"Yes, it's horrible his daughters
can't come,
499
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,000
"but he can still marry her."
500
00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:29,680
But he was adamant it would have
to be postponed again.
501
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:31,280
This was breaking my heart.
502
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:32,880
My wedding dress is hanging there.
503
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,720
We've got a little boy together.
504
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,760
Look, everybody's bought their
outfits, the girls are excited,
505
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,720
and I just... I was...
506
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,640
To be honest, I was just disgusted
in him.
507
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:47,440
I just thought, "This isn't right.
508
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,560
"There's something not right
here now."
509
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:54,000
And at that point,
the whole relationship shifted
510
00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:57,600
and, yeah, the cracks really started
to appear.
511
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:15,120
I don't know why, but I just had
this feeling that I wanted to go
512
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,160
and inspect one of the properties
513
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:18,960
and check everything was all right.
514
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:26,040
We opened the cabinet, expecting
515
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:29,920
to see this nice new shiny boiler,
and...
516
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:34,200
..no, it wasn't. It was a dusty old,
you know, thing.
517
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,000
And this really piqued my interest.
518
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:42,120
Why was this old boiler in-situ when
Karen had paid for
519
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:43,720
a brand-new one to be replaced?
520
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,440
Ryan actually phoned the
manufacturer of the boiler company
521
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:50,160
and found out that that particular
model hadn't been stocked
522
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:51,600
for about eight years.
523
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:57,720
And I thought, "Something's not
right here."
524
00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:00,000
And, "Why was the wedding
called off?"
525
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,800
I got in touch with the hotel where
the wedding was supposed to be held,
526
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:05,720
asked them if there was a, you know,
527
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,160
a James Scott wedding.
528
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:11,200
The manager assured me there was
nobody by that name -
529
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,560
not in the past, not today,
not in the future.
530
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:17,840
We'd seen links to Wynyard Hall
website and stuff on emails,
531
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:19,400
and none of it was real.
532
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:24,760
That was the moment where
we ripped off the bandage,
533
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:27,800
and the horrible sore that was
underneath was exposed.
534
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,080
PHONE RINGS
535
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,280
So I made a phone call to Coleen,
536
00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:38,760
and she was with James
and Charlie, and I just said,
537
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:40,800
"I need you to excuse yourself.
538
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:42,920
"Don't let James know there's
anything wrong
539
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:44,280
"and just go to the toilet
540
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,840
"and I'll phone you back in
five minutes."
541
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:49,560
She said, "I'm so, so,
so sorry Coleen,
542
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:50,960
"you were never going to get
married."
543
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:53,240
And I said, "What do you mean?"
And she said,
544
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:55,360
"There's never been a wedding
booked."
545
00:29:58,520 --> 00:30:00,720
I just thought, "Well,
that can't be possible,"
546
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:04,040
because I've met the wedding
planner, I've spoken to her,
547
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:06,760
I've had emails off her,
I'd been to the venue.
548
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:11,280
He spent over £1,000 on
a wedding dress for me.
549
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:14,160
I felt like it was some sick joke,
550
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,320
and I didn't know what
the hell was going on.
551
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:18,960
I honestly didn't know which way
to turn or what to think.
552
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:33,680
I stood at the doorway
so he couldn't get away,
553
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,000
because I knew once he
was confronted,
554
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,920
he's going to make an excuse
to get out, and I wanted the truth.
555
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:43,840
He just shut down.
556
00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:45,440
He refused to talk.
557
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:47,920
And I let go with both barrels.
558
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,440
I knew that he had lied.
I knew there was no wedding.
559
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,280
But at this point,
we didn't know how far it went.
560
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,120
I think I knew at that point that
my money was gone,
561
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:00,640
but I wasn't going to admit it
to myself then.
562
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,760
I was still clinging onto
the hope that although he'd lied
563
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:06,200
about the weddings, that was as far
as it went.
564
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:17,000
I knew the name of the solicitors
that he said he was using.
565
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:20,440
And I telephoned, you know,
trying to find the Newcastle office
566
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,800
where he had said he had
had many, many meetings.
567
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:24,600
I couldn't find a number for that,
568
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:26,720
so I phoned the head office
in London.
569
00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:32,760
"We don't have a Newcastle branch."
And I thought, "Hold on a second."
570
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,520
You know, "The lies are starting
to stack up here."
571
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:39,640
Karen, you know,
telephoned Coleen and said,
572
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:41,040
"We're coming to speak to you."
573
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:43,120
At that point, off we went up to
the house,
574
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,520
to Coleen's house, and...
575
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:48,760
..he knew we were coming.
576
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:50,120
He knew the gig was up.
577
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:53,960
He jumped back in the car, said,
578
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,000
"I'll be back in a minute,"
slammed the door, and off he went.
579
00:31:57,040 --> 00:32:00,160
Karen and I were in the car,
driving.
580
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:02,440
By this time, I was fuming.
581
00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,520
There was steam coming
out of my ears. I wanted answers.
582
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,560
When we were just pulling into
their street,
583
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:11,920
James drove past us,
584
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,000
he just gave this little cheery wave
585
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,840
with this very smug little smile on
his face.
586
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:18,840
That, to me...
587
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,800
..it was the equivalent of giving us
the finger.
588
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:24,920
And that's the last time we've
seen him.
589
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:37,160
We soon found out that
James Scott was not James Scott.
590
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:41,400
He was, in fact, Greg Wilson...
591
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:46,080
..who had a wife and three sons.
592
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:51,640
I cried buckets.
593
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,040
My whole world fell apart.
594
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:26,440
It had been bad enough the wedding
not happening,
595
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,920
but now it appeared my whole life
hadn't happened either.
596
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:33,880
The name James Scott was on our
child's birth certificate.
597
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:35,320
I was marrying James Scott.
598
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:39,280
But that wasn't this man's name.
599
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:40,960
This man who was the man I was
600
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:42,800
going to marry was called
Greg Wilson.
601
00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:46,640
At that point, I had...
602
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:50,400
..I suppose what you'd class as
a little mini breakdown.
603
00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:54,720
That night, I ended up staying
with her in her double bed.
604
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:57,440
And I remember just lying there,
605
00:33:57,480 --> 00:33:59,440
and she was sobbing, and thinking,
606
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,360
"Well, I've lost all my money,
I've lost everything,
607
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,560
"but I still wouldn't
want to be in her position."
608
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:07,120
It was just devastating.
609
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,800
This case landed on my desk,
and when I read it,
610
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:21,960
I just thought straight away,
"Wow, that's unusual!"
611
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:25,440
I've been a police officer
for 27 years,
612
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:30,000
and I've never come across any
investigation like this at all.
613
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:31,640
I didn't go and arrest him
straight away.
614
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:33,120
For one, he was on the run,
615
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,360
and we didn't quite know where
he was.
616
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:37,280
But right from the start,
617
00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:40,640
so much had happened over
a long period of time,
618
00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:44,440
I had to get my head around it
and I had to gather the evidence.
619
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:46,320
We wanted him to be brought
to justice.
620
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,920
We wanted him not to do this
to another family,
621
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,440
and we wanted him to pay
for his crimes.
622
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:57,200
The police investigation was
going ahead,
623
00:34:57,240 --> 00:34:58,400
we just needed more answers.
624
00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:02,440
So we managed to track down his mum
and contact her, his stepbrother,
625
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:05,240
and, ultimately, a couple
of weeks further down the line,
626
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:06,480
his wife.
627
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,880
This is when we found that,
you know,
628
00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:11,600
it was a much bigger story than we
had actually believed.
629
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,040
His father had been a firefighter,
630
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:22,800
that's how he had all the knowledge.
631
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:28,480
And he'd bought an ex-firefighter's
outfit off eBay.
632
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:30,040
That's why it smelled of smoke,
633
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:31,800
because it had been
to plenty of fires,
634
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:33,840
just never with him wearing it.
635
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:38,720
There was no nightclub.
636
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:42,840
Gemini Properties was all based
on a farce.
637
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:45,320
There were no properties that they
were actually managing,
638
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,520
apart from the few that Karen owned.
639
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:57,080
When the police actually accessed
Greg's bank account,
640
00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:58,560
there was very little left.
641
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:00,640
So I think he'd been funding
his lifestyle
642
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:04,080
and Coleen's lifestyle on
the money that I'd given him
643
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:05,640
for quite a long period of time.
644
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:14,200
The police investigated.
645
00:36:14,240 --> 00:36:17,480
The doctor didn't exist, the
appointments didn't exist.
646
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,680
Um...
647
00:36:19,720 --> 00:36:24,080
That medical note he showed me,
the police believe was a forgery.
648
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:26,560
I think all the documentation that
he provided
649
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:31,160
to solicitors and real estate agents
was all, again, a fabrication.
650
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:36,040
All the text messages, iMessages,
the Facebook posts,
651
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,800
the Facebook profiles,
everything was fake.
652
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,880
He didn't just con us.
He conned solicitors,
653
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,640
real estate agents, football clubs,
rugby clubs.
654
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:47,680
He fleeced everybody he could
655
00:36:47,720 --> 00:36:49,640
for as much as he could while
he could.
656
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:55,680
It's incredible the lengths that
Greg Wilson must have gone to,
657
00:36:55,720 --> 00:36:59,200
to commence this fraud
and also to keep it going,
658
00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:00,760
day after day after day.
659
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:03,000
Normally, fraudsters,
you can catch them out
660
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:04,400
because they forget the lies,
661
00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:06,320
and it's quite easy to prove.
662
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:08,760
But, actually, Greg covered his
tracks quite well.
663
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:14,080
It was... It was just, "Why?"
664
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:16,520
I just couldn't understand why.
665
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:19,120
And I really missed him
666
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:22,240
because it felt like
a bereavement in a way,
667
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:24,600
because I'd fallen in love
with James Scott...
668
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:28,400
..and suddenly he didn't exist.
It was like he was dead.
669
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:30,840
And I was traumatised.
670
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:35,680
As soon as I found out the truth,
671
00:37:35,720 --> 00:37:37,840
I went to a solicitor
to see what I could do
672
00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:39,080
to get Charlie's name changed,
673
00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:41,800
because Charlie had
a surname that didn't exist
674
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:43,680
because the father on his birth
certificate said,
675
00:37:43,720 --> 00:37:45,000
"James Scott, firefighter."
676
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:46,880
What he did to Charlie
is unforgivable.
677
00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:48,720
He'd been such a big part
of Charlie's life.
678
00:37:48,760 --> 00:37:53,120
And Charlie suffered from extreme
separation anxiety at that point.
679
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:56,320
It got to the stage that I couldn't
leave him for a second.
680
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,000
He would cry and cry and cry till
he was sick.
681
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:01,000
And I felt so sorry for him
682
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,480
because he was the innocent party in
all this.
683
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:05,920
CHARLIE LAUGHS
684
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:20,240
Amazingly, when I got to the house
and arrested him there,
685
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:21,760
he was there with his girlfriend.
686
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:23,640
He was in a relationship
687
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:25,480
and had told a pack of lies,
688
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:28,640
saying that he was purporting
to be somebody that he wasn't
689
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:30,240
and that I think it was another
690
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:32,240
family member had left him
some money
691
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:35,240
and he was going to buy a house.
692
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:37,880
So I think another fraud was
obviously in
693
00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:39,760
the making when he was arrested.
694
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:43,720
When we got him in the car on
the journey up to County Durham,
695
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,400
I think the only time he ever spoke,
he sort of said, "Yes, it was me."
696
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:51,200
And that was what classed as what
was called a significant statement,
697
00:38:51,240 --> 00:38:54,320
which is the only answer he ever
gave in sort of all
698
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:55,800
the interviews that I did with him.
699
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:59,720
That was the only sort of piece
of admission that we got.
700
00:39:07,240 --> 00:39:10,280
Everybody was ready.
We were ready, the CPS was ready,
701
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,640
all the victims, all the witnesses
were ready
702
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:14,440
to come to court to give evidence.
703
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,720
KAREN:It was actually on
the Friday before the trial was due
704
00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:20,040
to start at 9am
the following Monday that I had
705
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:23,560
a call from CPS at about 4.45
in the afternoon
706
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:26,720
to say that at that point he'd
decided
707
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:28,880
to plead guilty to all charges
708
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:30,520
and there would be no trial.
709
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,520
But he'd left it to
the last possible moment,
710
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:35,800
and he'd made us suffer right to
the end.
711
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:42,120
He pleaded guilty
712
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:46,880
and the verdict was that he got
six years in prison
713
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:50,680
for multiple cases of fraud,
which, yeah, we were happy about.
714
00:39:50,720 --> 00:39:55,040
RYAN:And as he was being taken
down, we could hear him sobbing.
715
00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:57,720
And, for me, if I couldn't face him,
716
00:39:57,760 --> 00:39:59,640
just knowing that he was now
717
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:02,680
a broken man, like he had done
to everybody else,
718
00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:05,280
was the only satisfaction I was
going to get.
719
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:10,120
So what the judge said about
Greg's behaviour
720
00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:13,400
was that it was jaw-dropping
cruelty,
721
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:17,520
persistent cruelty,
that he lied, he manipulated,
722
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:20,040
he feigned illness, the cancer.
723
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:23,960
And when confronted, the judge says,
he runs away.
724
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,400
It was sophisticated
and sustained fraud.
725
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:32,320
And what this tells me is that there
were no underlying psychological
726
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:34,600
issues that the judge could pick
up on,
727
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:37,400
that Greg knew exactly what he
was doing,
728
00:40:37,440 --> 00:40:42,680
and he was completely devoid
of empathy for anybody.
729
00:40:42,720 --> 00:40:44,760
CHARLIE LAUGHS
730
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:46,520
Getting justice was
a really happy day.
731
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,920
And I felt like I'd taken some of
the power back,
732
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:51,120
because he'd hurt my family
733
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,560
and we weren't going to get that
money back that Karen lost,
734
00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:57,520
and I wasn't going to get back those
lost years,
735
00:40:57,560 --> 00:41:00,600
but I wasn't going to let him get
away with it,
736
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:02,000
he had to be made accountable.
737
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:05,240
There's no doubt that the motivation
initially was financial.
738
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:09,400
He initially lived off Karen
and Coleen's wealth,
739
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,640
their inheritance.
However, I think, as time went on,
740
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:16,320
it's the control of people, I think,
that took over.
741
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:19,080
And I think he loved every single
minute of it.
742
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:23,800
After what happened with James,
743
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,600
it left me in a situation where
I had no alternative
744
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:28,320
but to file for bankruptcy.
745
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:31,240
And I lost my home
and I lost everything.
746
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:32,880
My career was gone.
747
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:34,920
The worst things he did,
in my opinion,
748
00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:39,320
was he destroyed Karen
and Coleen's lives.
749
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:44,080
They were two fantastic women when
I first met them.
750
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:45,320
And when he left...
751
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:48,520
..they were shells
of their former selves.
752
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:53,640
If you allow this to change the way
you view all of humanity,
753
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,240
then, really, you're always going
to be a victim.
754
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:59,640
And I don't want to be a victim.
Coleen doesn't want to be a victim.
755
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:03,920
I wasn't going to let what happened
to me dictate
756
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:05,400
the rest of my life.
757
00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:14,000
I've got the most lovely husband
now who's adopted Charlie.
758
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:17,240
So he's not a little boy with
the fake name anymore,
759
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:21,160
he's got what he calls
his forever dad now,
760
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:25,320
and I'm now hoping
to help other women
761
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:28,240
who are in the same situation,
because it's not your fault.
762
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:31,640
When something like this happens to
you, you're a victim.
763
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:34,120
I couldn't stop what he did to me,
764
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:37,080
but if I can stop him doing
it to somebody else, I will do.
765
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:41,400
There's no doubt that both Coleen
766
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:43,240
and Karen are survivors.
767
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:45,800
They both have moved on brilliantly,
768
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:47,880
I have nothing but admiration
for them.
769
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:49,800
The police and everyone had said,
you know,
770
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:51,720
"You'll have to write
a book one day about this."
771
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:53,920
Neither me nor my sister are writers
772
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,440
but we thought it would be
a cathartic measure, you know,
773
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:59,240
so that's what we did.
774
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:02,520
And I've had so many people that
have read the book get in contact
775
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,000
and say something similar's happened
to them.
776
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:06,840
Helped so many people.
777
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:10,840
Coleen has been through
the most horrific,
778
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:13,440
unimaginable experience,
779
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:15,760
and she has come
out of it ten times stronger.
780
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:18,200
There is no victim in her.
781
00:43:18,240 --> 00:43:20,360
That woman's a warrior.
782
00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:27,360
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