All language subtitles for On.The.Trail.of.UFOs.S01E08.Longer.Ways.To.Go.1080p.WEB-DL.DDP2.0.H.264-squalor_track3_[eng]

(Slow dramatic music)

(Digital beeping)

(Dramatic music intensifies)

- There's no bringing
back, I forgot it.

So I could use some
astro, I thought maybe.

- Any hits?

- I think there's
some latent type stuff.

You'll have to ask her,
I'm not entirely sure.

- So Carolyn, what
are we looking at here?

- Alright well, usually
when people come in

we make sure they
have a little book

where they can document,

you know, what they see,

that they have a star chart
so they know for every season,

so we make sure that they know

what they're
looking at in the sky.

So they can look at the map,

they can look what's up there

and when they do
see something move,

then we can help them
with the laser pointer

and whatnot to discern if it was

a satellite or not a satellite.

Laser signal,

which puts out a
pretty powerful beam,

it goes 20 miles

and it will light a match
head in five seconds.

- So Carolyn, why
do you come out here

and spend a lot of your
free time gazing at the sky?

- Well, I do think
that our civilization

really needs to
start reaching out.

And that's the only
way it's gonna happen

because we've been waiting
for decades for disclosure

and it's not coming from
our own governments,

so we're gonna just
have to do it ourselves.

And a lot of people have
with some really good results,

including myself.

- What was the closest
you've seen something?

Have you gotten
a little bit nervous

that they've
come in a little bit

too close to you?
- Oh yeah.

Yeah, definitely.

But not nervous in a scared way.

- Right.

- More of an excited way like,

and then they acknowledge you,

they flash a couple more
times, and they're gone.

So it's not a very long
experience anyway.

- How much time do
you think you've been

in the field practicing this?

(Sighs)

- It's going on
seven years, easily.

And off and on before that.

But for about seven years

I've been coming
out mostly by myself.

Here, guys.

- Where at?

- It was right up here.

Well first listen

and see if you can
hear any engines.

It's going in a
straight line but it's not

perfectly straight.
- Oh, whoa.

Whoa, did you
see that over there?

- Which one?

- Nobody saw that?

- What?

- That thing just like
flew across the sky.

Like orange light.
- Well that's what we see

all the time.

- Alex saw something
orange fly cross the sky.

- Where?

- Let's go up here.

- It was orange.

- By the Ridge?

- Yeah it went like right,

it disappeared before the Ridge,

so yeah.

So the hills here,
it was like this.

It went like this.

I can see that with a laser.

It goes here to
there and it just like,

it didn't go over the
Ridge it just kind of

disappeared right at
the Ridge and that was it.

Right to that house.

- Yeah.

(Creepy techno music
with digital sound effects)

(Eerie piano music)

(Digital beeping)

- It's been almost a
year since I started

on this trip in
search of answers.

One year of traveling the U.S.,

meeting investigators
and witnesses

and looking to the
skies for any sign

that what people are
claiming to see actually exists.

(Music intensifies)

I came into this
adventure knowing full well

the odds of seeing
anything for myself were slim.

Despite what the mass
array of paranormal themed

television shows
currently floating around

the bowl of networks
might tell you,

simply going to a location
where someone has

seen something strange
before doesn't come close

to guaranteeing
your own encounter.

This goes doubly for ufos.

A phenomenon so beyond
our reach that it actually

seems to be just
messing with us.

I guess it's the
elusiveness of the target

and the frustration I
feel after failing to see

anything for myself
that makes me wonder

just what it is that keeps
the average enthusiast

or researcher coming back
to the subject day after day.

How do you find the
willpower to continue looking

when logic would
dictate that there are

better ways to spend your time

than chasing shadows in the fog.

- My entire life changed
when I saw that ufo.

Like the entire path of,

that I was on was changed.

I'm now talking about ufos

all the time, every day.

This is a part of my
life and I never saw that.

I never wanted that.

For me, the more stories I heard

the more excited I got
to possibly find answers,

if we ever will,
about what ufos are.

I can't tell you but the journey

almost means more to me.

- While Ryan sprague's
research keeps him

within the confines of
one of the most populated

cities in the country,

butch Witkowski has
been investigating

around the state of
Pennsylvania for years.

Butch has a career in law
enforcement behind him

and utilizes his
previous training

while investigating
strange cases

around the keystone state.

More recently he's
invested thousands of dollars

into making his
research more mobile.

- Had my first sighting in 1989

with seven other
people in my front yard

in Tucson, Arizona.

The bug bit me and that's
where I've been ever since,

so that's been
30-something years now

that I've been involved in this.

I was a member of
mufon in 2007 to 2009,

I left them as a chief
investigator star team member

and state section director

and started my own
group which was

the ufo research
center of Pennsylvania.

- Carolyn larocque
has been researching

the ufo subject
since she was a kid.

Carolyn has a background
in environmental biology

and due to her retirement,

now spends most of her
free time attempting to

have an interaction
with what she believes

to be a metaphysical phenomenon.

- I've been involved in the ufo

subject matter (Digital beeping)

My entire life
because my father was

a dod contractor my entire life.

And so he worked on advanced
technologies for a long time

and he used to go
to meetings over at

hanscom air force base
down in Massachusetts

and we would go
and hang out outside

watching planes land while
he was having meetings

on different technologies.

- Pretty much started
just looking into

the ufo phenomenon,
still got nowhere.

I mean I bought
books, I have papers,

I start accumulating
all kind of information

that took me no place at all.

So I joined mufon,
like I said I became

a state section director,

chief investigator
for the state.

Everybody got
all this information

it went in the cms
files, end of story.

And I just made up my mind

I was going to
start my own group.

Got a bunch of
like-minded guys together

that I knew that had
been doing it a long time

and I said, "let's do this".

- Since your dad
was involved in dod,

does that in form the
way you investigate ufos?

- Initially it did, I was,

'cause my dad is a hardcore
nuts-and-bolts scientist

and it was, two different
key things happened.

In 2016 I had my dog out

and it was well after
ten o'clock sometime

and I kind of felt a buzzing

and I caught a little
bit of movement

out of the corner of my eye.

So I turned around and
then I could kinda get a feel

that there was something
moving very slowly

across the sky
overhead, like a barge.

If you've ever seen a
barge go down a river,

how slow that it moves.

And so that kind
of kick-started me.

And it was super long,

I mean it just kept going
and going and going.

So we ended up moving
from this one house

in sanbornton over to gilford

and right before we
moved in December

I was out with my dog.

This time it was at
three in the morning

and I saw, you know, you
always see a star moving

and I know it's not a satellite.

And so i'm,

I was just kinda to the
point where I was like,

"I've been looking at
you guys for 30 years".

In my mind I'm thinking,

I just wanna know
if you're a ufo,

if you're an extra
terrestrial, what are you?

Because I was just exhausted
of seeing these things

and not knowing and
wanting to know that bad.

So as soon as I thought
that it changed direction,

came in close and did
that classic flashbulb effect,

you know.

That's kind of how I
made the transition from

the nuts-and-bolts looking
at the sky and whatnot

to more of

now I'm very much into

the emotional contact
with what I see in the sky.

(Slow synthesizer music)

- Investigators and
researchers looking into

the ufo subject are often
treated with a certain

level of disdain by
scientists and academics.

After all, most of the
people actively investigating

the subject don't have
training or a background

in the fields that would
correlate with the study of

unknown aerial
phenomena to begin with.

Dating all the way
back to the days

of Kenneth Arnold's sighting,

the field of ufology
has been bolstered by

average people who spend
inordinate amounts of time

looking into something
that in someway

has impacted their
lives to such a degree

that they'll give up free time,

massive amounts
of personal funds

and even their family
lives to chase ufos.

Yet, despite the
occasional exception,

most of those
involved in the search

aren't in it for money or fame.

They're simply seeking answers.

- How does like a typical
investigator go about

looking into a sighting report?

- So when it comes to
investigation, it's tough.

There's no like,
official field manual,

there's no degree
you get in ufology.

My mentor Peter
Robins always says,

"to be a ufologist you just
spin around three times

and touch your nose
and you're a ufologist".

And I guess that's
kind of how we all do it.

We're just stumbling through it.

- Can you walk us through,

like what a typical
investigation

actually entails if
someone calls you

or contacts you and.
- Sure.

- Well contact is
usually one of two ways:

They fly the net on the website,

on one of our websites,

or it comes from
another investigator.

That will automatically,
you know,

if I have the
contact information

I'll call that person,
set up a meeting.

I don't like to do
things over the phone

and I hate to do
things over the Internet.

So I want to see
'em face to face

I want to be where they
were, what they saw,

so I can take readings,
I can take samples,

I can take photographs, I
can take measurements,

I can do everything
I need to do.

See that's the part that
kind of makes me crazy

because people gotta
understand there's a difference

between research
and investigations.

Research is just knowledge,

investigations
is out in the field.

And not many people
do that anymore.

- Can you explain what ce5

is to people that may not know.

- Sure, it's basically
where you, the person,

is initiating contact.

It's not like you got
abducted against your will

or anything like that.

It's like, you were out there,

you asked for
contact and you got it

in some fashion.

Whether it was a sighting

or a message or whatever.

In my case it was
the light bulb flashes

and a profound emotional
connection that, you know.

Like, when we go out
and do sky-watches now,

I've been having a
hard time finding a group

that can settle in and
really work on that level.

Because they're too
chatty and they're not like

letting themselves
get to that level.

So I have found my best
success is when I'm out

either by myself or like
a couple other people.

(Dramatic piano music)
- I often call

myself a collector of stories.

But in my time
collecting those stories

I've come to find that
more often times than not,

I'm also sort of a
therapist or sounding board

for people who've
experienced things

that defy explanation.

Someone will tell me
about something traumatic

or terrifying or simply
bizarre that happened

in their life and in doing
so, a weight is lifted.

For many of these people,

I might be the first
person they've ever told.

The same holds true for
many involved in the ufo subject.

While seeking
answers is important,

many of those who talk to
witnesses and experiencers

come to find that in
offering an ear to listen,

they've also created a
safe place for someone

who might otherwise
never be able

to express something
that has potentially

changed their entire world view.

- I mean, when you
do put yourself out there

in those public platforms

people will constantly
reach out to you.

And it's great, I love it.

I love meeting new people,

I love hearing from
more witnesses.

Every person, to me,
that comes forward

with a ufo case

or experience, it
normalizes the topic.

So immediately I will
respond and just say,

"thank you for sending this".

And a lot of the times
they just want someone to

give it to instead
of just keeping it in.

- My name's Mike Stevens.

We're in stratham,
New Hampshire at

the kri center for
consciousness studies.

And I am the
founder of granite sky

which is a support
group for experiencers

which I run out of here.

- But when you
say support groups,

I mean, how does it function?

- It kinda brings people of

like-minded
experiences together.

The biggest part of it is,

it's letting them know
they're not alone and that,

so they don't feel crazy
or stuck with this thing

they've been told
isn't real their whole life

while they've been having
traumatic experiences.

- What prompted
you to start that?

- I had my own experiences
at a really early age

so when I got to the point of

coming to terms with 'em,

I kinda said well I
can't let anybody else

do this without
making an effort.

- The types of reports
and the types of reporting,

they're all the same.

I mean, you've
got to be diligent,

you've gotta talk to the people,

you've gotta ask
those questions.

You can pretty much tell

when somebody's
giving you a snowball job,

you know what I mean?

- There was a ufo
case that I looked at

about a year ago in
Brooklyn, New York

where a girl had
called me frantically.

She was a co-worker of mine.

She called me at like
two in the morning,

I'd never talked to this
person on the phone before

so I was scared, I was nervous,

I didn't know what was going on.

And she called so she said,

"Ryan, Ryan! You're the
only person I thought of.

There is this huge red
light outside my window

and it's coming closer
and it's getting brighter

and then it's going
back up into the sky

and coming down and pulsating.

And I don't know what to do.

Should I call the police?"

And I'm like,

I immediately jumped
into investigator mode.

I told her just calm down.

Is it hot?

Like is it burning you
or anything like that?

Like making sure she was okay.

And she said, "no, no, no, no,

it's not that close
but it's super scary".

Is it making any noise?

Is anyone else in
your house that can,

you know, verify this?

This, that, this, that.

And I told her
immediately, I said,

"get off the phone with
me and start recording it.

Is it still there?"

And she said,
"yes", and she did.

- Why are people,

I guess why are
people so hesitant

to discuss their
own experiences?

Do you think that that has?

- I think one,

we've been
conditioned to believe

that it's not
true, it's not real.

And the other one is you know,

fear, ridicule of
losing their job,

friends, family.

You know I know people who

have had full blown, you know,

what you'd call
abduction experiences.

Their husband will
sit down and watch

"ancient aliens"
with them but thinks

it couldn't happen to
you so there's a lot of play

with it even within
the field of people

who possibly believe in it.

- And the biggest challenge

when it comes to
investigating ufos is

by the time it's reported
it's already gone.

So there's rarely anything
to ever investigate.

So for me, it comes
down to the witnesses

and a lot of people don't,

don't put a lot of creedance
into witness testimony.

'Cause it is just a story.

Unless a piece of that
craft was left behind

or some sort of trace evidence

there's not much to
ever really investigate.

So it is a,

it's a field of
investigation that I think

is more research
and more journalistic

than it ever truly
was investigating.

- You know the search
for fame and fortune

has pretty much
destroyed ufology

in the search for the truth.

That's what I want.

I don't want the game,

I don't want the embellishment.

I want proof, I want the truth

and let me tell you something,

it's out there.

It is out there.

I know there's
people who go, like,

"bah humbug,
that's a lot of crap".

You know, this,
that and the other.

Yeah well I've seen
things that I can't explain

and from my prior
police experience

I can pretty much
explain anything.

- I mean how many
times have you heard,

"oh it's so cathartic
just to tell someone,

or just to share it with some".

- Absolutely!

Most of them say like,

"oh you have no, like a
weight was lifted off my chest".

And for some
people it's very easy

to talk about
their ufo sightings,

they want to tell you

and they'll tell you
at great lengths.

And there's others who

it's hard to pull
it out of them.

They may not know what they saw

or ever find out what
it was but they might

have some sort of
closure in knowing

that someone is
willing to listen to them.

(New age music)

- Across the United States,

ufos continue to
grow in popularity

with new voices coming
into the field daily.

It's the first time we've
seen anything like it

since the 1970s,

and unlike that
period of history,

the phenomenon is being
taken somewhat more seriously

now by academics
and government officials.

But I can't get past
the idea that amateurs,

experiencers and witnesses

who have been
touched by the subject,

are the ones who will
continue to drive it forward.

Investigators like hyneck,
vallee and Friedman

are the reason there is
even a public awareness

of the subject today.

And to some degree
this fact could end up

lost in a world infatuated

with tick tacks and
conspiracy theories.

But as we move
forward into a new era

in the field of uips,

I'm really left to wonder
what is left to look into.

The phenomenon
remains just out of reach

while the motivating
factor for many of those

acting as mouthpieces
for the subject

tend to be fame or money.

What do you even say to
those who have witnessed

something or just have
a new found interest

that want to seek
answers for themselves?

(Digital beeping)
- I don't know

for a young person
starting out doing this I,

the only thing I would say was

don't let your ego
get in the way, really.

Don't think that you're
the most important thing

or that you're going to,

everybody's gonna
pay attention to you.

If you concentrate on the thing

that makes you the most excited,

that makes you the most happy

and that you really want
to know the answers to,

you'll get attention.

It'll just happen

just as a result of
you're doing good work.

And if you don't do
good work, who cares?

You know? (Chuckles)

At least you can have some fun.

(Digital beeping)
- There's a movement

back towards what
started to happen in the 70s

with people like Dr. J. Allen
hynek and Jacques vallee

where we were trying
to focus investigation

of the subject towards
real scientific methodology

and real scientific legitimacy,

real observation of
phenomena in the field.

And I think there's a move
back towards that coming up.

- I would say, first of all,

read as much as you
possibly can because

there's a wealth of
information that's out there.

(Calming music)
Everyone in their

own generation tends
to think of themselves

as sort of the pioneers,

but in this field in particular

there is decades worth
of raw material out there

that's already been compiled.

And you have to put
yourself in places where

your chances of seeing
something for yourself increase.

That's not to say
that anyone who ever

goes out looking
for a ufo will see one.

You know there's people
like Stan Gordon who have

been in this field
for over 50 years

who have immersed
themselves in the subject

who have never seen a thing.

With that caveat I
think you have to say,

as an investigator you
have to hit the bricks,

you have to talk to people,

you have to learn the art of,

not only asking
the right questions,

but really listening to people

and not guiding their
answers in any way.

But just letting them talk.

(Digital beeping)
- Get out from

behind the keyboard.

You can't really
delve into this field

sitting at your computer.

You can learn a lot, sure,

but a large portion of what's,

you're gonna
find on the Internet

it's gonna be those
political debates,

it's gonna be those
opinions and arguments.

Remember, nobody
ultimately has the answer.

Find some mentors, find
some people you respect,

read, read, read.

And get out and learn some

solid investigative
techniques, you know.

Get your boots on the ground,

be in the field,

talk to the witnesses,

and begin to
understand that there is

a much bigger
question going on here

than any organization is
gonna sit down and solve

with a few pieces of paper.

(Digital beeping)
- I guess the first thing

I'd say to look at,

I'm a little biased but,

I think this is why
I do what I do.

What I'm trying to do is
be very journalistic about it.

Just to write the
facts, share with you

what is substantiated
and what is credible,

so at least in that sense
our attempt is to give you

an unbiased look at
these different situations.

And I think it's a
good place to start

because I think
people should know

what the government has done,

what very credible
researchers have done,

as a good base before
you kind of jump off

and get into some of
the really weird stuff.

And it's a little scary because

there are a lot
of cults out there.

And you have to be careful
of some of these charlatans

that are kind of
selling a world view.

(Digital beeping)
- Don't expect to

make any money.

It's a...

If you have another local
organization that you like,

join it.

Read almost anything
by Jacques vallee,

believe about 1/4th
of what you hear,

2/3rds of what you see

and attend conferences,
ask lots of questions

and anybody that's making
a lot of money off of this

is probably a fool
and a charlatan.

- Do you think we'll have
an answer to the ufo mystery

or do you think
there is a mystery?

- Oh I think we will.

I think the answer's out there

and for me to put
limitation on the universe

is somewhat more than I
think I'm capable of doing.

And to say that
it's this or it's this,

and make it something
that's exclusive would be

a little arrogant, I believe.

So no, I don't do that,
I don't see how I can.

- Yeah what happens
if at the end of your life

you have no more answers
than you did at the start?

- I actually, I did a lot
of thinking about that

recently when the late
Stanton Friedman passed away.

This guy had been
investigating ufos for

50 years of his life
and you think about

all these people
who came before you

that researched this topic

passing away and not finding
any of the answers they sought.

You can only hope they're
finding them now in the afterlife.

I don't know but it's
depressing and sobering to think

we may never find an
answer to what ufos are but

again, that life journey

for me, it's been worth it.

Meeting people, talking to them.

I love it.

I love going places, I
love meeting people,

I love hearing their
stories and I honestly feel

that every ufo story
has some sort of value.

Again, not to find answers

but to possibly tell us
more about ourselves

that in whatever the
ufos actually represent.

(New age music)

- Maybe it's fitting that
my trip would wrap up

in a place so
important to ufology.

Hollywood has done
more to push the ufo subject

into the national consciousness

than most realize.

Though it's probably
worth mentioning

that the end
result usually leave

a lot to be desired.

(Digital beeping)

We came here to get a
final handful of interviews

and to make plans for
what we'll be doing next.

But before we can
look into the future,

we have to analyze
the past and present.

- I think it's easier
for people to come out

and talk about the subject

but I really don't know
if that means that a lot

of people still feel
that it's okay to do so.

Because they're still
in their circle of friends,

and their life and
their serious jobs.

And at the end of the
day it's still up to them,

regardless of what all
the rest of us are doing,

if they want to come
out and talk about it.

But I feel like
that's a big part of it

is to gather more
and more information

and more data
about what's going on.

- What do you feel like
your ultimate goal was

with the trip?

Like with going
around the country and

speaking to so many
witnesses and investigators.

Like what did you come
into this wanting to get

out of it and what
are you leaving with?

- I always come
at things from the

personal side of it,
so the people side of it.

Well Ryan sprague
has told me before.

He's like, "I'm
good, I saw it once,

I know it was
something very strange".

Sean Kim Jason
or someone like that,

they're always looking up there,

always trying to
see something else.

Again, that would probably add

only more questions for them.

That's also something
that we set out to do

is to prove that hopefully
there are still people just

simply gazing up at the sky.

Yeah it's great to
hear about the craft but,

I mean, Greg bishop
really touched on this a lot,

was okay well that's great.

What did the craft do?

How fast did it fly off?

You know, what
angle did you see it?

What was the moon doing?

But what about the
people involved?

You already mentioned
they have their lives changed.

Some of these people
they don't sleep right,

they're obsessed with finding
out more and more and more

and it's something
that some of these folks,

it's all that they do.

Whether or not
they're on a podcast

or doing some of
the things that we do.

- Yeah.

- It's taken over their lives.

(Intense music)

- Now despite what I
thought one year ago,

you can't simply walk
out your front door

and encounter ufos.

People like Stanton
Friedman or Ron regere

have devoted the
better part of their lives

to investigating this subject
of identified flying objects.

And in retrospect,

analyzing it for myself
is something I just can't

put a stop to and declare that

I lean one way or the other.

Uip exist.

From the skies above sedona

to the forests of
brown mountain.

There are objects or lights
which defy explanation

that are being witnessed
by ordinary people.

But I still don't
know what they are.

And despite traveling
thousands of miles

I've barely
scratched the surface

of the decades long
history of the study.

If I've learned one
thing during this journey,

it's that you can't
put an expiration date

on the search for the truth.

This year has been many things:

Eye opening,
exhausting and exciting.

But most of all, this year
was just the beginning.

(Techno music with
digital sound effects)

(Eerie music)