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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:29,780 --> 00:00:31,907 I thought I had found the perfect car. 2 00:00:31,990 --> 00:00:36,119 The VW Diesel Jetta Wagon. The ad sucked me in. 3 00:00:36,662 --> 00:00:39,302 Volkswagen has more diesel cars on the road in the US 4 00:00:39,373 --> 00:00:40,958 than every other brand combined. 5 00:00:41,041 --> 00:00:43,190 Boasting a two-liter TDI turbo-charged 6 00:00:43,191 --> 00:00:46,672 clean diesel engine, not only does it provide excellent fuel economy, 7 00:00:46,755 --> 00:00:48,340 but you'll love the performance, too. 8 00:00:48,423 --> 00:00:50,568 It was the only car that seemed to have it all. 9 00:00:50,592 --> 00:00:51,843 Drove like a sports car... 10 00:00:51,927 --> 00:00:53,887 Can the Green Car of the Year be fast? 11 00:00:56,974 --> 00:00:59,601 Wasn't too expensive, got great mileage, 12 00:00:59,685 --> 00:01:02,396 and unlike diesels of the past, it was clean. 13 00:01:02,479 --> 00:01:04,481 Volkswagen Jetta TDI Clean Diesel. 14 00:01:04,565 --> 00:01:05,649 TDI Clean Diesel. 15 00:01:05,732 --> 00:01:06,858 TDI Clean Diesel. 16 00:01:07,442 --> 00:01:10,571 I was beaming with pride as I drove around the suburbs 17 00:01:10,654 --> 00:01:12,573 or commuted to New York City. 18 00:01:12,656 --> 00:01:16,034 What I didn't know was that I was driving a killing machine. 19 00:01:18,370 --> 00:01:21,039 What has VW been up to? 20 00:01:21,123 --> 00:01:24,293 We may be looking at the largest systematic corporate fraud 21 00:01:24,376 --> 00:01:26,253 in the history of the global corporation. 22 00:01:26,336 --> 00:01:29,256 Volkswagen has admitted that their clean diesel cars 23 00:01:29,339 --> 00:01:30,801 have been systematically, 24 00:01:30,802 --> 00:01:34,845 proactively engineered to deceive emissions testing. 25 00:01:34,928 --> 00:01:38,849 It's called a defeat device. It's designed to defeat the test. 26 00:01:39,766 --> 00:01:41,852 The Volkswagen scandal is widening. 27 00:01:41,935 --> 00:01:43,603 The news just keeps getting worse. 28 00:01:43,687 --> 00:01:46,606 VW share price down 31%. 29 00:01:46,690 --> 00:01:49,484 If you're a VW shareholder or employee today, 30 00:01:49,568 --> 00:01:52,029 the letters stand for Very Worried. 31 00:01:53,697 --> 00:01:58,035 Volkswagen turned over half a million American drivers 32 00:01:58,118 --> 00:02:02,080 into unwitting accomplices in an unprecedented assault 33 00:02:02,164 --> 00:02:04,333 on our country's environment. 34 00:02:04,416 --> 00:02:08,337 Our criminal investigation is active and ongoing. 35 00:03:00,430 --> 00:03:01,932 We can't undo the damage 36 00:03:02,015 --> 00:03:04,768 that Volkswagen caused to our air quality. 37 00:03:04,851 --> 00:03:05,909 But what we can do 38 00:03:05,910 --> 00:03:11,775 is offset that damage by reducing pollution from future sources. 39 00:03:11,858 --> 00:03:14,152 Now, with respect to the agreement, more specifically, 40 00:03:14,236 --> 00:03:17,906 Volkswagen must offer to buy back any car that's on the road. 41 00:03:18,532 --> 00:03:23,120 That's nearly 500,000 two-liter diesel vehicles 42 00:03:23,203 --> 00:03:26,581 that are model years 2009 through 2015. 43 00:03:26,665 --> 00:03:28,250 As part of the buyback, Volkswagen... 44 00:03:28,333 --> 00:03:31,169 When I first heard about the scandal, I was furious. 45 00:03:31,253 --> 00:03:33,004 VW had lied to me. 46 00:03:33,088 --> 00:03:35,132 They had pitched me a vision of my dream car, 47 00:03:35,215 --> 00:03:37,551 but sold me my worst nightmare. 48 00:03:37,634 --> 00:03:40,887 A car that was polluting 50 times more than advertised. 49 00:03:40,971 --> 00:03:43,306 It's not enough for VW to just apologize. 50 00:03:43,390 --> 00:03:46,810 They gotta use their folly to actively make the world better. 51 00:03:46,893 --> 00:03:48,353 Even before that, Kirk suggests... 52 00:03:48,437 --> 00:03:52,274 Weirdly, I was listening to NPR when my own name came up 53 00:03:52,357 --> 00:03:56,778 in an interview with a PR expert, on how VW could make things right. 54 00:03:56,862 --> 00:03:59,197 ... an investigative documentarian group, 55 00:03:59,281 --> 00:04:01,658 like a Frontline or an Alex Gibney, 56 00:04:01,742 --> 00:04:06,371 who can come in with the charge of discovering 57 00:04:06,455 --> 00:04:08,582 what happens in a company 58 00:04:08,665 --> 00:04:14,129 that actually leads to this type of gross infraction. 59 00:04:14,212 --> 00:04:15,760 Kirk went ahead and made a promo 60 00:04:15,761 --> 00:04:18,008 for this imaginary documentary. 61 00:04:18,091 --> 00:04:21,178 A new series from Alex Gibney, the director of 62 00:04:21,261 --> 00:04:26,016 The Smartest Guys in the Room, Coming Clean: Inside Volkswagen. 63 00:04:26,099 --> 00:04:27,726 Fuck Volkswagen. 64 00:04:27,809 --> 00:04:31,480 With unprecedented and unlimited access from Volkswagen... 65 00:04:31,563 --> 00:04:34,191 There was no way VW was gonna give me access 66 00:04:34,274 --> 00:04:38,278 to look at the scandal, but the promo did get me worked up. 67 00:04:38,862 --> 00:04:43,116 Angry as I was, it didn't begin to describe the fury my wife felt. 68 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:45,285 She stopped driving the car entirely. 69 00:04:45,994 --> 00:04:48,997 Though she had pasted "namaste" on our bumper sticker, 70 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:51,833 a yoga term for "bowing to the divine in others," 71 00:04:51,917 --> 00:04:53,251 she had visions of marching in 72 00:04:53,335 --> 00:04:55,879 to the local VW dealership with a chainsaw. 73 00:04:55,962 --> 00:04:57,682 - And the number. - Yes. 74 00:04:57,756 --> 00:04:58,882 These two documents... 75 00:04:58,965 --> 00:05:02,052 - Okay, so I sign right... - Seller signature. 76 00:05:02,135 --> 00:05:06,056 Yep. There we go. We're going to give you back the car. 77 00:05:06,139 --> 00:05:08,934 I feel so badly because I love the car... 78 00:05:09,017 --> 00:05:10,185 Yeah. 79 00:05:10,268 --> 00:05:12,854 Um, but when you feel you've been lied to, 80 00:05:12,938 --> 00:05:16,817 it's really hard to feel okay about the company, in general. 81 00:05:16,900 --> 00:05:18,652 Sort of like, shame on you, Volkswagen. 82 00:05:18,735 --> 00:05:19,736 - Yeah. - Right? 83 00:05:19,820 --> 00:05:20,820 Exactly. 84 00:05:20,821 --> 00:05:22,669 Okay, my wife is way too nice 85 00:05:22,670 --> 00:05:24,991 to think about killing the local dealers. 86 00:05:25,075 --> 00:05:27,327 But she wanted the car out of our lives. 87 00:05:28,328 --> 00:05:30,664 The question she was asking, and I was, too, 88 00:05:31,414 --> 00:05:33,250 was, "How could this have happened? 89 00:05:33,458 --> 00:05:35,382 How could a company have lied to its customers 90 00:05:35,383 --> 00:05:37,295 on such a massive scale?" 91 00:05:37,671 --> 00:05:39,798 I decided to look into the scandal. 92 00:05:39,881 --> 00:05:42,175 What I would discover was much darker 93 00:05:42,259 --> 00:05:45,971 and more vast than anything I had imagined. 94 00:05:49,391 --> 00:05:52,269 I am pleased that at the skilled hands 95 00:05:52,352 --> 00:05:55,313 of a brilliant design engineer and his staff, 96 00:05:55,397 --> 00:06:00,610 preliminary designs for a German Volkswagen have been completed, 97 00:06:00,694 --> 00:06:05,073 and the first models will finally be tested by the middle of the year. 98 00:06:07,075 --> 00:06:08,442 Then you will understand 99 00:06:08,443 --> 00:06:12,289 why I was utterly determined to lay the groundwork 100 00:06:12,372 --> 00:06:19,337 for the invention of the German Volkswagen and its ultimate conclusion, 101 00:06:19,421 --> 00:06:24,009 and by that, dear gentlemen, I mean a successful conclusion! 102 00:06:27,262 --> 00:06:30,640 Okay, it's usually a cheap shot to bring up Hitler, 103 00:06:30,724 --> 00:06:32,100 but when it came to VW, 104 00:06:32,183 --> 00:06:36,271 he's the man that jump-started the company back in the 1930s. 105 00:06:39,858 --> 00:06:41,610 In the 1930s, 106 00:06:41,693 --> 00:06:45,405 cars were still a rarity in Germany, or relatively rare. 107 00:06:45,488 --> 00:06:48,074 It wasn't something that most people had. 108 00:06:48,158 --> 00:06:53,288 And in the United States, a lot of people think Henry Ford invented the car 109 00:06:53,371 --> 00:06:55,332 but he didn't, actually. What he did invent was 110 00:06:55,415 --> 00:06:58,418 how to build cars cheaply that everybody could afford. 111 00:06:58,501 --> 00:06:59,711 So in the United States, 112 00:06:59,794 --> 00:07:04,591 there was far more middle-class people who had automobiles than in Germany. 113 00:07:04,674 --> 00:07:07,802 And that really bothered the Germans and the Nazis, in particular, 114 00:07:07,886 --> 00:07:09,804 because they were supposed to be superior. 115 00:07:12,390 --> 00:07:15,393 So Hitler hooked up with Ferdinand Porsche. 116 00:07:15,977 --> 00:07:18,855 Porsche already had some designs in his drawer. 117 00:07:19,522 --> 00:07:22,137 This idea of a volkswagen, a people's car, 118 00:07:22,138 --> 00:07:24,402 had been kicking around for quite a while. 119 00:07:24,486 --> 00:07:28,156 And then he started developing the car with Nazi money. 120 00:07:31,368 --> 00:07:33,328 Porsche, himself, went to Ford 121 00:07:33,411 --> 00:07:35,956 and looked around on several occasions. 122 00:07:36,039 --> 00:07:39,250 He hired Germans who were working at Ford, �migr�s. 123 00:07:39,334 --> 00:07:43,505 He brought them back to Germany to help build the Volkswagen factory. 124 00:07:43,588 --> 00:07:46,466 And it was very consciously modeled on Ford, 125 00:07:46,549 --> 00:07:48,969 but it was supposed to be even bigger. 126 00:07:49,052 --> 00:07:51,429 They wanted it to be the biggest factory in the world, 127 00:07:51,513 --> 00:07:53,139 which it eventually became. 128 00:07:54,808 --> 00:07:56,608 There was a celebration in Germany, 129 00:07:56,643 --> 00:07:59,980 to mark the one millionth people's car since the war. 130 00:08:00,063 --> 00:08:04,359 Over 150,000 people were present to take part in the jollification. 131 00:08:04,442 --> 00:08:06,236 This included a... 132 00:08:06,319 --> 00:08:07,570 The city of Wolfsburg, 133 00:08:07,654 --> 00:08:10,323 it just doesn't get any more "company town" than that. 134 00:08:10,407 --> 00:08:13,660 There was nothing there until they built the Volkswagen factory. 135 00:08:15,328 --> 00:08:17,414 Everything that you see in Wolfsburg today 136 00:08:17,497 --> 00:08:20,834 has really grown up around that original factory. 137 00:08:25,630 --> 00:08:30,844 Okay, so, here, that's the main street in Wolfsburg. 138 00:08:30,927 --> 00:08:32,387 So there was nothing here? 139 00:08:32,470 --> 00:08:35,140 Wolfsburg, as a city, didn't exist. 140 00:08:35,223 --> 00:08:36,683 It's a massive factory. 141 00:08:36,766 --> 00:08:38,226 It's a massive factory. 142 00:08:38,309 --> 00:08:40,603 Nowadays, they are still employing 60,000 people. 143 00:08:40,687 --> 00:08:43,523 - Really? - And the chimneys you see over there, 144 00:08:43,606 --> 00:08:45,859 - that's actually the paint shop. - Uh-huh. 145 00:08:45,942 --> 00:08:47,902 So, this is all employee housing in here? 146 00:08:47,986 --> 00:08:50,655 Yeah. Basically everyone works, uh, 147 00:08:50,739 --> 00:08:54,159 either directly or at least indirectly for Volkswagen here. 148 00:08:54,909 --> 00:08:58,079 How does it rank in terms of the largest factories in the world? 149 00:08:58,163 --> 00:08:59,622 - It's the largest one. - It is. 150 00:08:59,706 --> 00:09:03,043 There's no other factory, uh... 151 00:09:03,126 --> 00:09:06,629 Right now, they are producing by day, 152 00:09:06,713 --> 00:09:09,549 - round about between 3,000 to 3,500 cars. - Wow. 153 00:09:10,467 --> 00:09:13,178 VW declined to give us a tour of Wolfsburg. 154 00:09:13,845 --> 00:09:16,014 So, I sought out the help of Walter Groth, 155 00:09:16,097 --> 00:09:17,807 a consultant on corporate culture, 156 00:09:17,891 --> 00:09:20,810 who'd worked for 20 years as an executive for Volkswagen. 157 00:09:21,311 --> 00:09:23,146 You'd been at Volkswagen for a long time. 158 00:09:23,229 --> 00:09:24,481 Twenty-four years. 159 00:09:24,564 --> 00:09:27,525 When the news broke about the cheating scandal, 160 00:09:27,609 --> 00:09:29,319 what was your reaction? 161 00:09:29,402 --> 00:09:34,324 My reaction, uh... I was angry, actually. I was angry. 162 00:09:34,407 --> 00:09:36,534 I took that very personal because, uh, 163 00:09:36,618 --> 00:09:39,954 I was thinking about all the people working for the brand 164 00:09:40,038 --> 00:09:42,040 and really doing the hard work. 165 00:09:42,123 --> 00:09:45,752 And when you imagine that this is a company 166 00:09:45,835 --> 00:09:49,172 with more than 600,000 people working for Volkswagen worldwide, 167 00:09:49,255 --> 00:09:53,009 and more than a hundred factories, 168 00:09:53,093 --> 00:09:59,390 and you have to run this operation... And all these people, 169 00:09:59,474 --> 00:10:01,195 when you look at the production lines, 170 00:10:01,196 --> 00:10:03,603 at manufacturing, what they do... 171 00:10:03,686 --> 00:10:06,147 When you look at the people developing a car, 172 00:10:06,231 --> 00:10:08,983 starting with the designers, for example, 173 00:10:09,067 --> 00:10:11,903 they all want to come up with the best product possible. 174 00:10:20,829 --> 00:10:22,997 For VW, the road to global dominance 175 00:10:23,081 --> 00:10:25,291 had always led through America. 176 00:10:25,375 --> 00:10:27,043 In the '60s, sales hit new highs, 177 00:10:27,127 --> 00:10:30,213 when VW flew the freak flag for the counterculture. 178 00:10:30,296 --> 00:10:34,717 The Bug was a real people's car, mechanically simple and down-to-earth. 179 00:10:34,801 --> 00:10:36,261 You could be high on mescaline 180 00:10:36,344 --> 00:10:38,555 and still shift gears or repair the engine. 181 00:10:38,930 --> 00:10:41,808 And the Bus was a crash pad on wheels. 182 00:10:46,938 --> 00:10:49,065 It was an amazing case of rebranding 183 00:10:49,149 --> 00:10:52,443 because this car was basically designed for Hitler. 184 00:10:53,027 --> 00:10:56,489 Then after the war, it becomes the symbol of the counterculture. 185 00:11:05,582 --> 00:11:08,376 But VW didn't keep up with the times. 186 00:11:08,459 --> 00:11:11,588 As the counterculture gave way to the Reagan era, 187 00:11:11,671 --> 00:11:13,747 VW didn't innovate and its sales dropped 188 00:11:13,748 --> 00:11:16,092 as fast as the quality of its cars. 189 00:11:17,010 --> 00:11:21,055 During all these years, sales went down, losses were mounting. 190 00:11:21,139 --> 00:11:23,725 Volkswagen was close to being insolvent. 191 00:11:23,808 --> 00:11:27,353 I was asked to join the newly-formed, uh, North American region 192 00:11:27,437 --> 00:11:31,524 because we needed to do a turnaround of the Volkswagen of America. 193 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:35,053 In 1993, Volkswagen sold roughly 194 00:11:35,054 --> 00:11:38,239 38,000 cars a year in the United States. 195 00:11:38,323 --> 00:11:41,017 That's a market with 16-17 million cars. 196 00:11:41,018 --> 00:11:44,271 So 38,000 is, uh, ridiculous. 197 00:11:44,360 --> 00:11:49,375 When Volkswagen in the United States, 198 00:11:49,459 --> 00:11:52,712 with the Beetle, sold almost half a million cars. 199 00:11:56,299 --> 00:11:59,344 The savior for VW was Ferdinand Piëch. 200 00:12:00,178 --> 00:12:02,055 The grandson of Ferdinand Porsche, 201 00:12:02,138 --> 00:12:04,891 Piëch was professionally and personally productive. 202 00:12:05,391 --> 00:12:08,102 He sired 12 children with four different women. 203 00:12:09,020 --> 00:12:11,689 He also infused VW with a new DNA. 204 00:12:12,690 --> 00:12:17,070 Whenever there is war, fewer remain in the end. 205 00:12:17,946 --> 00:12:20,865 There are always winners and losers. 206 00:12:23,326 --> 00:12:25,453 And I intend... 207 00:12:26,788 --> 00:12:31,668 along with our VW partners around the world... 208 00:12:33,836 --> 00:12:35,546 to emerge victorious. 209 00:12:43,763 --> 00:12:46,975 Yeah, a little faster is more fun. 210 00:12:53,398 --> 00:12:56,484 Piëch, he was the head of Audi before. 211 00:12:58,569 --> 00:13:00,071 He's a brilliant man. 212 00:13:00,154 --> 00:13:05,201 It's brilliant, but it's dangerous, okay? Kind of. 213 00:13:05,785 --> 00:13:09,205 I mean, Piëch was a tough guy and he knew what he was doing. 214 00:13:10,415 --> 00:13:14,919 I don't feel I can't communicate with others. 215 00:13:15,003 --> 00:13:18,464 But there are individuals with whom I don't want to communicate. 216 00:13:18,548 --> 00:13:23,011 And they complain about my lack of communication. 217 00:13:23,094 --> 00:13:24,804 However, that's not unintentional. 218 00:13:27,557 --> 00:13:31,519 When Piëch started, Volkswagen was down and out. 219 00:13:31,602 --> 00:13:35,356 They were just about bankrupt and their quality sucked. 220 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:39,902 It was a disaster. Their value at the time was a disaster. 221 00:13:39,986 --> 00:13:43,322 The average, uh, workshop visit of an average car 222 00:13:43,406 --> 00:13:46,325 was three to four times in the first year. 223 00:13:47,493 --> 00:13:50,455 He had to turn the company around. And it's tough. 224 00:13:51,205 --> 00:13:54,876 Dr. Piëch came just in time to make that happen. 225 00:13:54,959 --> 00:13:58,713 Before him, Volkswagen was rather thinking small, 226 00:13:59,630 --> 00:14:03,509 and with Piëch, the big thinking really started. 227 00:14:03,593 --> 00:14:07,680 Piëch, uh, he's the typical inventor. He has the big product ideas. 228 00:14:07,764 --> 00:14:10,933 He comes up with stuff that's just, uh... Wow. 229 00:14:11,017 --> 00:14:12,310 Where did he get that from? 230 00:14:13,352 --> 00:14:15,938 He has this idea of diesel. 231 00:14:16,022 --> 00:14:20,568 At the time, diesels were something for tractors. 232 00:14:20,651 --> 00:14:23,654 Maybe for, uh, big Mercedes. 233 00:14:24,238 --> 00:14:25,865 And he said, "It's going to be diesel." 234 00:14:25,948 --> 00:14:31,621 He made the diesel smaller, invented TDI. People, they loved it. 235 00:14:40,546 --> 00:14:44,384 The new TDI. It arrived with a hip new ad campaign. 236 00:14:44,467 --> 00:14:48,221 A diesel that was fun to drive, powerful and clean. 237 00:14:57,897 --> 00:15:01,025 Volkswagen had huge success with TDI engines. 238 00:15:01,109 --> 00:15:03,820 In Europe, people started to love the diesel. 239 00:15:04,987 --> 00:15:07,031 But there was always the problem 240 00:15:07,698 --> 00:15:12,370 that what comes out from the exhaust, um... Not really healthy. 241 00:15:17,417 --> 00:15:20,670 The basics of diesel and gas engines are the same. 242 00:15:20,753 --> 00:15:25,174 A series of explosions move the pistons, which turn the drive shaft. 243 00:15:28,261 --> 00:15:30,471 Diesel fuel is much more efficient than gas 244 00:15:30,555 --> 00:15:33,307 and produces much less carbon dioxide. 245 00:15:33,391 --> 00:15:36,436 But diesel fuel exhaust disgorges much nastier stuff. 246 00:15:37,145 --> 00:15:40,398 Particulate matter and nitrogen oxide, called NOx, 247 00:15:40,481 --> 00:15:43,693 that causes air pollution and damages human lungs. 248 00:15:45,653 --> 00:15:47,905 This is personal for me. 249 00:15:47,989 --> 00:15:49,115 When my family was living 250 00:15:49,198 --> 00:15:51,868 in the NOx-filled smog of Southern California, 251 00:15:51,951 --> 00:15:54,579 my daughter developed exercise-induced asthma. 252 00:15:55,329 --> 00:15:57,373 When she was playing soccer in high school, 253 00:15:57,457 --> 00:16:00,084 she collapsed in front of me from lack of oxygen. 254 00:16:02,003 --> 00:16:04,046 NOx is not good. 255 00:16:04,130 --> 00:16:07,717 No. NOx, nitrogen oxide, is very, uh, nasty stuff. 256 00:16:08,885 --> 00:16:12,263 Elements of nitrogen oxides mix with ozone, 257 00:16:12,346 --> 00:16:15,892 and then chemically changes into what we call smog. 258 00:16:16,976 --> 00:16:21,397 It's a factor in acid rain. It's damaging for plant life. 259 00:16:21,481 --> 00:16:27,069 It causes asthma in children, causes cardiac problems, cancer. 260 00:16:27,153 --> 00:16:29,030 People will die prematurely. 261 00:16:35,703 --> 00:16:38,789 To keep the efficiency of diesel, but to cut down on NOx, 262 00:16:38,873 --> 00:16:42,126 manufacturers like VW tried to create NOx traps 263 00:16:42,210 --> 00:16:45,421 that caught and burned the stuff before it left the tailpipe. 264 00:16:45,505 --> 00:16:47,673 But the special parts needed were expensive, 265 00:16:47,757 --> 00:16:50,551 and had to be replaced every few thousand miles. 266 00:16:50,635 --> 00:16:52,136 Yet, they were the only way to meet 267 00:16:52,220 --> 00:16:54,764 the NOx pollution standards set in the US, 268 00:16:54,847 --> 00:16:56,849 which were much more strict than in Europe. 269 00:17:00,728 --> 00:17:02,647 Today, I'm directing the EPA 270 00:17:02,730 --> 00:17:06,108 and the Department of Transportation, Energy and Agriculture 271 00:17:06,192 --> 00:17:09,487 to take the first steps towards regulations 272 00:17:09,570 --> 00:17:13,908 that would cut gasoline consumption and greenhouse gas emissions 273 00:17:13,991 --> 00:17:15,034 for motor vehicles. 274 00:17:15,826 --> 00:17:18,371 We have set in motion a national policy 275 00:17:18,454 --> 00:17:21,776 aimed at both increasing gas mileage 276 00:17:21,777 --> 00:17:25,044 and decreasing greenhouse gas pollution 277 00:17:25,127 --> 00:17:29,215 for all new trucks and cars sold in the United States of America. 278 00:17:31,759 --> 00:17:34,053 Solving that problem in the US was critical 279 00:17:34,136 --> 00:17:35,346 for the strategy of the man 280 00:17:35,347 --> 00:17:37,306 who would eventually be tapped to follow Piëch 281 00:17:37,390 --> 00:17:40,226 as the head of VW, Martin Winterkorn. 282 00:17:40,309 --> 00:17:41,912 Dr. Piëch and I 283 00:17:41,936 --> 00:17:45,314 have been working together for almost 30 years. 284 00:17:45,398 --> 00:17:47,469 And as you know, Dr. Piëch 285 00:17:47,470 --> 00:17:50,069 has always regarded innovation as the top priority. 286 00:17:50,152 --> 00:17:52,382 So, we agreed that he would focus on 287 00:17:52,383 --> 00:17:56,033 innovation and I would safeguard it. 288 00:17:58,744 --> 00:18:00,270 Winterkorn came 289 00:18:00,271 --> 00:18:04,240 and they did this strategy called Strategy 2018. 290 00:18:04,333 --> 00:18:06,669 We wanted to have the most satisfied customers. 291 00:18:06,752 --> 00:18:09,171 We wanted to have the most satisfied employees. 292 00:18:09,255 --> 00:18:13,050 We wanted to achieve good results in order to invest in the future. 293 00:18:13,134 --> 00:18:14,802 And we wanted to make the best cars. 294 00:18:14,885 --> 00:18:19,348 The upshot of which will be that by 2018 we are going to be 295 00:18:19,432 --> 00:18:21,767 the preeminent car manufacturer in the world. 296 00:18:23,019 --> 00:18:25,813 Volkswagen never was great in America. 297 00:18:25,896 --> 00:18:28,232 The Volkswagen Bug was kind of a fluke. 298 00:18:28,316 --> 00:18:30,522 But America's a very important market. 299 00:18:30,523 --> 00:18:33,529 At the time, it was the world's largest. 300 00:18:33,613 --> 00:18:36,949 So, those Americans, they have to buy our diesel cars. 301 00:18:37,617 --> 00:18:40,202 That's what he wanted for the United States, diesel, 302 00:18:40,286 --> 00:18:43,080 which is incredibly hard to do in the United States. 303 00:18:43,164 --> 00:18:44,874 Everyone knew this. 304 00:18:45,833 --> 00:18:48,461 And that's how it all started. 305 00:18:49,879 --> 00:18:53,549 The pressure on everybody 306 00:18:53,633 --> 00:18:57,136 to increase sales became unbearable. 307 00:18:58,512 --> 00:19:01,599 Under pressure and when people feel fear, 308 00:19:01,682 --> 00:19:05,770 they might do things you don't want them actually to do. 309 00:19:15,196 --> 00:19:17,132 Determined to conquer the American market, 310 00:19:17,156 --> 00:19:21,285 VW built a new green factory in Chattanooga, Tennessee. 311 00:19:21,369 --> 00:19:24,205 To comply with American pollution standards, 312 00:19:24,288 --> 00:19:29,293 VW retooled its product line and introduced a new clean diesel, TDI. 313 00:19:31,212 --> 00:19:33,964 Its pitch to Americans was captivating. 314 00:19:34,048 --> 00:19:35,766 Cars that were low-cost, low-pollution, 315 00:19:35,767 --> 00:19:38,469 got good mileage and were fun to drive. 316 00:19:38,552 --> 00:19:39,720 Perfect. 317 00:19:39,804 --> 00:19:42,682 With its new green profile, VW's CEO boasted 318 00:19:42,765 --> 00:19:45,768 about its new-found commitment to social responsibility. 319 00:19:46,394 --> 00:19:50,272 And Chattanooga stands for the Volkswagen way of life. 320 00:19:50,356 --> 00:19:54,026 Sustainable, reliable and successful. 321 00:19:55,903 --> 00:20:00,533 Now, more than ever, Volkswagen has everything it takes 322 00:20:00,616 --> 00:20:04,370 to win the hearts and minds of American customers. 323 00:20:08,457 --> 00:20:11,085 I was one those people who stood up and cheered. 324 00:20:11,168 --> 00:20:15,548 I was proud to own a VW. Auto experts were cheering too. 325 00:20:16,716 --> 00:20:20,344 Somehow, VW seemed to have solved a problem no one else could: 326 00:20:21,262 --> 00:20:25,224 how to clean up dirty diesel engines in small, low-priced cars. 327 00:20:26,350 --> 00:20:29,854 I was completely surprised when I suddenly saw the clean diesel thing 328 00:20:29,937 --> 00:20:31,147 in the United States. 329 00:20:31,230 --> 00:20:33,816 And first thought was, 330 00:20:33,899 --> 00:20:38,112 "Great. That's great. They solved the problem. 331 00:20:38,195 --> 00:20:40,573 Wow. I'm really deeply impressed." 332 00:20:40,656 --> 00:20:43,909 Then I looked at the price of the cars 333 00:20:43,993 --> 00:20:48,998 and, hmm, well, it's actually right in the market. 334 00:20:50,791 --> 00:20:52,918 But I was asking myself, "How did they do it?" 335 00:20:53,002 --> 00:20:56,464 And I'm not an engine developer, I'm not an engineer, so... 336 00:20:56,547 --> 00:21:00,968 There might be a way nobody else has ever seen. Uh, great, they did it. 337 00:21:13,439 --> 00:21:15,524 VW's solution to the diesel problem 338 00:21:15,608 --> 00:21:18,861 caught the attention of a group focused on clean transportation. 339 00:21:19,987 --> 00:21:23,282 They studied VW diesels not to see if they were bad, 340 00:21:23,657 --> 00:21:25,493 but why they were so good. 341 00:21:25,576 --> 00:21:29,455 And whether the US cars could serve as a model for other companies. 342 00:21:29,538 --> 00:21:33,083 The man in charge of the group was an American named John German. 343 00:21:33,959 --> 00:21:37,797 I describe myself as a pragmatic environmentalist. 344 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:41,550 I spent about a decade each with Chrysler, then EPA, then Honda 345 00:21:41,634 --> 00:21:43,552 before I wound up at this non-profit, 346 00:21:43,969 --> 00:21:46,555 International Council on Clean Transportation. 347 00:21:47,389 --> 00:21:49,099 The goal's always the environment. 348 00:21:49,183 --> 00:21:53,896 We focus on working with regulators worldwide, 349 00:21:53,979 --> 00:21:56,398 not with legislatures. 350 00:21:56,482 --> 00:21:59,276 So we're trying to help the regulators do their job better. 351 00:22:01,237 --> 00:22:04,073 The whole VW scandal started in Europe. 352 00:22:04,782 --> 00:22:09,078 In 2011-2012, there's a report from an organization called JRC. 353 00:22:09,161 --> 00:22:11,092 It actually showed some anecdotal evidence 354 00:22:11,093 --> 00:22:14,458 of high diesel emissions in Europe. 355 00:22:16,085 --> 00:22:19,129 But the report was basically ignored. 356 00:22:20,631 --> 00:22:24,677 We had this brainstorm that there was a missing piece of data, 357 00:22:25,344 --> 00:22:27,179 which is what's happening in the US. 358 00:22:34,228 --> 00:22:40,150 And so, in 2013, we decided to test some diesels in the US. 359 00:22:41,694 --> 00:22:45,030 Primarily because we expected them to be clean. 360 00:22:45,698 --> 00:22:48,284 And then we would take that data back to Europe and say, 361 00:22:48,367 --> 00:22:52,621 "Look, they're clean in the US. How come you can't do it in Europe?" 362 00:23:03,215 --> 00:23:04,842 German needed to find someone 363 00:23:04,925 --> 00:23:07,636 to test what was coming out of the tailpipes of the cars, 364 00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:09,805 first in the lab and then on the road. 365 00:23:11,473 --> 00:23:14,935 The contract went to a group at the University of West Virginia. 366 00:23:15,019 --> 00:23:16,270 Car geeks who wanted to see 367 00:23:16,353 --> 00:23:19,398 if clean diesel was for real in any kind of car. 368 00:23:30,534 --> 00:23:32,846 This is a portable emissions measurement system 369 00:23:32,870 --> 00:23:37,249 that we use to measure emissions from vehicles on a real-time basis. 370 00:23:37,333 --> 00:23:40,377 It's a miniaturized version of a laboratory-grade measurement system 371 00:23:40,461 --> 00:23:43,422 where it's kind of in a shoebox-size, uh, equipment, 372 00:23:43,505 --> 00:23:44,945 where you can put it in the vehicle. 373 00:23:46,216 --> 00:23:50,054 This is used for a very specific purpose, which is in-use measurement. 374 00:23:50,137 --> 00:23:53,057 So we tap into the tailpipe and it measures two things. 375 00:23:53,140 --> 00:23:55,809 It measures the exhaust flow rate, how much exhaust is coming out, 376 00:23:55,893 --> 00:23:58,354 and then what the constituents of the exhaust are. 377 00:23:58,437 --> 00:24:02,566 So it's just a simple math, flow rate times the concentration, 378 00:24:02,650 --> 00:24:05,819 which is going to give you the, uh, the amount of, uh, pollutants 379 00:24:05,903 --> 00:24:08,113 that are coming out of the tailpipe. So that's... 380 00:24:08,197 --> 00:24:10,616 Arvind Thiruvengadam was part of the team 381 00:24:10,699 --> 00:24:13,035 that did the diesel pollution test for John German. 382 00:24:13,994 --> 00:24:17,831 They focused on European diesels being sold in the US. 383 00:24:19,166 --> 00:24:21,335 Whenever we do real-world testing, 384 00:24:21,418 --> 00:24:24,880 we do expect certain deviations from the certification number. 385 00:24:24,963 --> 00:24:29,176 Conditions such as ambient temperature, road grade, traffic and such, 386 00:24:29,259 --> 00:24:31,345 which you always cannot expect the manufacturer 387 00:24:31,428 --> 00:24:33,472 to be at the lowest possible emissions. 388 00:24:34,139 --> 00:24:36,433 But there is an acceptable level of deviation. 389 00:24:36,767 --> 00:24:41,647 Usually, five to six times deviation is part of real-world activity. 390 00:24:42,231 --> 00:24:44,817 But the kind of deviations we were observing 391 00:24:44,900 --> 00:24:49,822 from the VW passenger cars were significantly higher. 392 00:24:50,739 --> 00:24:53,742 During the road test, the VW TDI was sending 393 00:24:53,826 --> 00:24:58,706 up to 40 times more NOx into the air than the VW lab test numbers. 394 00:24:59,748 --> 00:25:02,418 West Virginia University, then they came to us. 395 00:25:02,501 --> 00:25:04,253 Once they said, you know, 396 00:25:04,336 --> 00:25:06,880 "We have these high emissions and we can't explain it." 397 00:25:06,964 --> 00:25:10,008 And my first reaction was, 398 00:25:10,092 --> 00:25:12,469 "There must be something wrong with the vehicle." 399 00:25:12,553 --> 00:25:15,723 Literally, a malfunction. It wasn't operating properly. 400 00:25:17,016 --> 00:25:21,186 But we tested these vehicles at the California emission laboratory 401 00:25:21,562 --> 00:25:23,147 and they passed the standards, 402 00:25:24,273 --> 00:25:26,608 which meant there was nothing wrong with the vehicle. 403 00:25:27,276 --> 00:25:31,739 And at that stage, I was pretty darn sure this was a defeat device. 404 00:25:34,742 --> 00:25:38,537 There's a long history of defeat devices 405 00:25:38,620 --> 00:25:42,916 and I worked at EPA during some of these defeat device investigations. 406 00:25:43,625 --> 00:25:47,004 The most recent major one was a 1998 case 407 00:25:47,087 --> 00:25:49,256 for heavy-duty engine manufacturers, 408 00:25:49,339 --> 00:25:52,843 in which almost every manufacturer of heavy-duty engines 409 00:25:52,926 --> 00:25:57,431 was calibrating them to increase emissions when they ran down the highway. 410 00:25:57,514 --> 00:26:02,561 That scandal cost them about $1 billion in total fines and remedies. 411 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,404 And now with the VW case, I knew I was sitting on a time bomb. 412 00:26:13,739 --> 00:26:16,533 But the words "defeat device" never would cross my lips, 413 00:26:16,784 --> 00:26:21,079 'cause you just don't say that about a multi-billion dollar company 414 00:26:21,163 --> 00:26:24,958 when you're a little, uh, NGO with 30 employees. 415 00:26:25,042 --> 00:26:26,210 It was just too dangerous. 416 00:26:26,293 --> 00:26:29,922 We'd have been potentially sued out of existence 417 00:26:31,006 --> 00:26:35,803 if it had even been implied we were accusing VW of having a defeat device. 418 00:26:37,679 --> 00:26:40,349 To avoid retaliation by VW, 419 00:26:40,432 --> 00:26:43,811 German first revealed his findings in 2014 420 00:26:44,103 --> 00:26:46,897 in San Diego, in a small academic conference. 421 00:26:49,107 --> 00:26:52,444 In the audience were a handful of VW executives. 422 00:26:52,528 --> 00:26:54,209 They must've realized for the first time 423 00:26:54,210 --> 00:26:56,532 that investigators were on their trail. 424 00:26:57,282 --> 00:26:59,594 But German was careful not to call out VW 425 00:26:59,595 --> 00:27:01,411 when it came to publishing results. 426 00:27:02,830 --> 00:27:06,166 The compromise that we came up with 427 00:27:06,250 --> 00:27:09,169 is that we did post the report publicly on our website, 428 00:27:09,253 --> 00:27:13,966 but it refers to vehicles A, B and C. We did not identify them. 429 00:27:14,049 --> 00:27:17,302 Now, two days before we put the report online, 430 00:27:17,386 --> 00:27:19,575 I sent a courtesy e-mail to VW, saying, 431 00:27:19,576 --> 00:27:22,474 "This report's coming out. Here it is. 432 00:27:22,558 --> 00:27:25,018 By the way, vehicles A and B are yours." 433 00:27:33,110 --> 00:27:34,403 Raise your hand, sir. 434 00:27:35,654 --> 00:27:36,823 Do you swear or affirm 435 00:27:36,824 --> 00:27:39,241 that the testimony you're going to give in these proceedings 436 00:27:39,324 --> 00:27:42,035 depicts the whole truth under penalty of perjury? 437 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:43,179 - I do. - Thank you. 438 00:27:43,203 --> 00:27:44,722 You are Stuart Johnson? 439 00:27:44,746 --> 00:27:45,914 I am. 440 00:27:45,998 --> 00:27:48,001 Are you currently employed 441 00:27:48,002 --> 00:27:50,669 - at Volkswagen Group of America, Inc.? - Yes, I am. 442 00:27:50,752 --> 00:27:53,046 - How long have you been employed there? - Uh... 443 00:27:53,130 --> 00:27:56,341 All together, I've worked at Volkswagen 33 years. 444 00:27:56,425 --> 00:28:01,471 In this e-mail, uh, it's true isn't it, 445 00:28:01,555 --> 00:28:06,768 that you're talking about the West Virginia University study. True? 446 00:28:06,852 --> 00:28:07,852 Yes. 447 00:28:07,853 --> 00:28:09,771 Second-to-last sentence: 448 00:28:09,855 --> 00:28:14,735 "Some presenters indicated they suspected cheating." You see that? 449 00:28:15,077 --> 00:28:16,135 Yes, I do. 450 00:28:16,236 --> 00:28:18,356 - That's something you wrote, right? - That's correct. 451 00:28:18,405 --> 00:28:23,118 So you were aware, at least as of April 8, 2014, 452 00:28:23,201 --> 00:28:25,245 that cheating was one of the possible explanations 453 00:28:25,329 --> 00:28:27,456 - for what was going on. True? - Yes. 454 00:28:28,415 --> 00:28:30,292 You state, quote, 455 00:28:31,043 --> 00:28:33,921 "We will have to be careful with this going forward." 456 00:28:34,504 --> 00:28:36,715 - That's correct. - Why did you say that? 457 00:28:37,507 --> 00:28:42,137 Because I didn't like hearing that, out in a public forum, 458 00:28:42,221 --> 00:28:45,515 Volkswagen was being accused of cheating. 459 00:28:46,892 --> 00:28:48,656 Well, what was it specifically 460 00:28:48,657 --> 00:28:52,147 that you all would need to be careful about? 461 00:28:52,231 --> 00:28:57,277 I didn't like the fact that there was a... That that would, um, lead to 462 00:28:57,361 --> 00:29:00,614 some kind of suspicion against our company. 463 00:29:00,697 --> 00:29:04,743 But how could you be careful in order to alleviate suspicions? 464 00:29:04,826 --> 00:29:07,913 You have no control over suspicions third parties have, right? 465 00:29:07,926 --> 00:29:08,910 Yes. 466 00:29:08,914 --> 00:29:11,833 So what was it specifically that you needed to be careful about? 467 00:29:11,917 --> 00:29:14,544 My reason for writing that 468 00:29:14,628 --> 00:29:17,714 was that I wanted to try to manage the message 469 00:29:18,882 --> 00:29:23,178 and part of managing that message is engaging with the agencies. 470 00:29:25,264 --> 00:29:27,599 The agencies Johnson tried to manage 471 00:29:27,683 --> 00:29:30,560 were the EPA and California regulators. 472 00:29:31,645 --> 00:29:35,899 Following the San Diego presentation, California did its own tests. 473 00:29:35,983 --> 00:29:38,235 They confirmed the West Virginia results. 474 00:29:38,318 --> 00:29:40,862 Inside the lab, the pollution emitted by the cars 475 00:29:40,946 --> 00:29:42,322 was well within government limits. 476 00:29:43,323 --> 00:29:46,868 But on the road, NOx levels were dangerously high. 477 00:29:48,245 --> 00:29:50,664 That caught the attention of Alberto Ayala 478 00:29:50,747 --> 00:29:54,167 at the California Air Resources Board, known as CARB. 479 00:29:55,335 --> 00:30:00,632 What was different about this is, how far off they were, the magnitude. 480 00:30:00,716 --> 00:30:03,719 We're not talking about just a little bit above the standard. 481 00:30:03,802 --> 00:30:06,013 Forty times the limit was the average. 482 00:30:06,096 --> 00:30:10,183 If you look at some data points that we have, um, 483 00:30:10,267 --> 00:30:13,228 in some cases, it was 80 times the limit. 484 00:30:15,105 --> 00:30:17,274 And now you have two data points. 485 00:30:17,357 --> 00:30:21,862 We have two studies on our hands, saying this just doesn't make sense. 486 00:30:22,612 --> 00:30:25,532 At that point, that's when we went from research 487 00:30:25,615 --> 00:30:28,493 to, "Now we need to turn this into a regulatory action." 488 00:30:29,077 --> 00:30:33,582 What followed was 60 months of intense interaction with the company, 489 00:30:33,665 --> 00:30:36,960 back and forth, because it just escalated. 490 00:30:37,044 --> 00:30:40,172 We would do some testing, generate questions, 491 00:30:40,255 --> 00:30:44,926 send them to the company. They'd be expected to bring us answers. 492 00:30:45,010 --> 00:30:47,262 They would bring answers, we would go back to the lab 493 00:30:47,346 --> 00:30:49,389 and try them and then generate more questions. 494 00:30:51,433 --> 00:30:53,810 CARB was asking tough questions, 495 00:30:53,894 --> 00:30:56,772 and back in Wolfsburg, executives were terrified 496 00:30:56,855 --> 00:31:00,400 that honest answers would reveal a long trail of deceit. 497 00:31:01,401 --> 00:31:04,696 CEO Martin Winterkorn received an urgent e-mail 498 00:31:04,780 --> 00:31:07,824 from VW's head of quality management, Frank Tuch. 499 00:31:08,700 --> 00:31:12,579 "A thorough explanation of the dramatic increase in NOx emissions 500 00:31:12,662 --> 00:31:15,123 cannot be given to the authorities. 501 00:31:15,207 --> 00:31:18,168 It can be assumed that the authorities will then investigate 502 00:31:18,251 --> 00:31:22,339 whether Volkswagen implemented a so-called defeat device." 503 00:31:24,383 --> 00:31:25,574 Rather than come clean, 504 00:31:25,575 --> 00:31:29,388 VW thought its only alternative was to stall for time. 505 00:31:32,015 --> 00:31:33,855 Technological leadership 506 00:31:33,934 --> 00:31:37,729 is not just defined anymore by horsepower and torque. 507 00:31:38,939 --> 00:31:42,734 The joy of economical and emissions-free driving, ladies and gentlemen, 508 00:31:43,318 --> 00:31:47,447 will be the currency in coming years. 509 00:31:51,201 --> 00:31:54,329 The company was, uh, unfortunately, uh, dismissive. 510 00:31:54,333 --> 00:31:55,242 It's like, oh, you know, 511 00:31:55,252 --> 00:31:58,737 "Maybe your instruments are not well calibrated," 512 00:31:58,792 --> 00:32:02,020 or, you know, "Oh, you have academics, 513 00:32:02,021 --> 00:32:03,296 graduate students running around, 514 00:32:03,380 --> 00:32:07,217 maybe they did it wrong and, uh, you guys gotta go check in 515 00:32:07,300 --> 00:32:09,344 because you gotta use experts to make sure that... " 516 00:32:09,428 --> 00:32:11,138 And we would do all of that, right? 517 00:32:11,221 --> 00:32:14,975 'Cause, again, all along, we're thinking, "This is not a defeat device. 518 00:32:15,058 --> 00:32:17,269 This is just a technical problem." 519 00:32:18,145 --> 00:32:22,691 It's true, isn't it, that these various reasons were given 520 00:32:22,774 --> 00:32:27,070 in attempt to mislead the agency into believing 521 00:32:27,154 --> 00:32:30,907 there were technical explanations for the high NOx level 522 00:32:30,991 --> 00:32:34,828 as opposed to an explanation that involved cheating? True? 523 00:32:35,579 --> 00:32:38,498 In retrospect, yes, that's true. 524 00:32:38,582 --> 00:32:42,586 Mr. Johnson, I've handed you what's been marked as Exhibit 25... 525 00:32:42,669 --> 00:32:44,251 The two company representatives 526 00:32:44,252 --> 00:32:45,881 that we interacted with the most 527 00:32:45,964 --> 00:32:49,230 were Stuart Johnson and Oliver Schmidt, 528 00:32:49,231 --> 00:32:52,053 who at the time was actually based here. 529 00:32:52,137 --> 00:32:56,183 So he represented the company when it came to certification issues. 530 00:32:56,266 --> 00:32:57,493 Let's first have a look 531 00:32:57,517 --> 00:32:59,811 at Volkswagen's history of diesel in the US. 532 00:32:59,895 --> 00:33:04,232 With this technology, we won, in 2009, the Green Car of the Year. 533 00:33:04,316 --> 00:33:07,569 Unfortunately, we got new emission regulations in the US. 534 00:33:07,652 --> 00:33:09,028 So, we had to comply with, um, 535 00:33:09,029 --> 00:33:13,283 with Bin 5 or ULEV standard all over the US... 536 00:33:13,366 --> 00:33:16,369 In May of 2014, was Oliver Schmidt your boss? 537 00:33:16,453 --> 00:33:17,787 Yes, he was. 538 00:33:17,871 --> 00:33:20,165 When the West Virginia University report came out, 539 00:33:20,248 --> 00:33:21,750 did Oliver Schmidt express to you 540 00:33:21,833 --> 00:33:24,878 that one of the possibilities for the explanation of this report 541 00:33:24,961 --> 00:33:27,172 - is that we were cheating? - No. 542 00:33:27,255 --> 00:33:30,091 We were able to increase fuel economy by a lot, 543 00:33:30,175 --> 00:33:33,553 and we reduced the NOx raw emission of the engine by 40% 544 00:33:33,637 --> 00:33:36,848 in order to comply with future emission regulations... 545 00:33:36,932 --> 00:33:39,142 Oliver Schmidt was not sharing what he knew 546 00:33:39,226 --> 00:33:42,229 with many of the US team, including Stuart Johnson. 547 00:33:43,355 --> 00:33:45,899 But the cheating and how to handle it was an open secret 548 00:33:45,982 --> 00:33:47,984 among many executives in Germany. 549 00:33:48,818 --> 00:33:52,531 Schmidt wrote an e-mail posing a fundamental question about strategy. 550 00:33:52,614 --> 00:33:55,867 "It should first be decided whether we are honest. 551 00:33:55,951 --> 00:33:59,412 If we are not honest, everything stays as it is." 552 00:33:59,496 --> 00:34:03,083 Translation: Keep cheating and conceal the defeat device 553 00:34:03,166 --> 00:34:05,335 in a storm of obfuscating e-mails, 554 00:34:05,418 --> 00:34:09,464 misleading technical reports and endless diversionary meetings. 555 00:34:09,548 --> 00:34:11,508 For every meeting that Oliver and I had, 556 00:34:11,591 --> 00:34:15,095 our technical teams probably had another five, ten meetings. 557 00:34:15,178 --> 00:34:19,307 There was so much going on and it just got really convoluted. 558 00:34:20,433 --> 00:34:24,104 That was a challenge here. It didn't feel like we were making progress. 559 00:34:26,273 --> 00:34:31,152 We were negotiating, holding meetings with them, talking about... 560 00:34:31,236 --> 00:34:33,154 As CARB turned up the heat on VW, 561 00:34:33,155 --> 00:34:36,074 Stuart Johnson was suddenly promoted 562 00:34:36,157 --> 00:34:39,035 and Oliver Schmidt was quickly transferred back to Germany. 563 00:34:40,203 --> 00:34:42,831 Do you believe that Oliver Schmidt 564 00:34:42,914 --> 00:34:44,749 was transferred back to Germany 565 00:34:44,833 --> 00:34:48,962 and you moved into that position to allow plausible deniability? 566 00:34:49,045 --> 00:34:52,090 No, I don't believe that. 567 00:35:00,515 --> 00:35:02,726 Did you have a reputation at your company for honesty? 568 00:35:02,809 --> 00:35:03,810 Yes. 569 00:35:03,893 --> 00:35:05,520 - Being forthright? - Yes. 570 00:35:05,604 --> 00:35:08,815 Did Oliver Schmidt share that reputation that you had? 571 00:35:11,860 --> 00:35:12,860 No. 572 00:35:19,993 --> 00:35:21,119 Back in Wolfsburg, 573 00:35:21,202 --> 00:35:24,539 Schmidt and the other German execs came up with a plan. 574 00:35:24,623 --> 00:35:28,710 VW would announce a recall and pledge to fix the problem. 575 00:35:28,793 --> 00:35:32,005 For the moment, CARB and the EPA seemed satisfied 576 00:35:32,088 --> 00:35:35,008 that VW was finally ready to do the right thing. 577 00:35:36,009 --> 00:35:38,470 They told us, "Oh, while we do this recall, 578 00:35:38,553 --> 00:35:41,056 we will put a fix to this issue on the NOx." 579 00:35:41,139 --> 00:35:44,309 Right? Uh, in the hope that I would come back 580 00:35:44,392 --> 00:35:45,810 and tell my team, "We're done." 581 00:35:45,894 --> 00:35:49,189 They'd convince you with their data 582 00:35:49,272 --> 00:35:51,274 so you wouldn't bother to keep testing the car. 583 00:35:51,358 --> 00:35:54,319 Correct, and of course that's not how we do business here, right? 584 00:35:55,612 --> 00:35:58,657 They did the recall and we got some test vehicles. 585 00:35:58,740 --> 00:36:00,033 We went back into the lab, 586 00:36:00,116 --> 00:36:01,401 and it wasn't giving us in-use emissions 587 00:36:01,402 --> 00:36:03,662 that match the in-certification test. 588 00:36:04,913 --> 00:36:06,849 Would it be a fair statement that at the time that 589 00:36:06,873 --> 00:36:09,125 Volkswagen Group of America was telling CARB 590 00:36:09,209 --> 00:36:12,545 that it would update its software 591 00:36:12,629 --> 00:36:17,801 to more closely attempt compliance with regulatory limits, 592 00:36:17,884 --> 00:36:22,514 in fact, it was updating the software to further its cheat? 593 00:36:24,140 --> 00:36:26,059 Objection to the form of the question. 594 00:36:26,142 --> 00:36:27,519 True? 595 00:36:27,602 --> 00:36:31,272 I would say, yes, that's true, knowing what I know today. 596 00:36:34,693 --> 00:36:37,779 VW did not fix the problem. Just the opposite. 597 00:36:37,862 --> 00:36:42,742 The company fixed the defeat device to make it even better at cheating. 598 00:36:43,993 --> 00:36:45,370 Through VW's own test, 599 00:36:45,453 --> 00:36:48,289 engineers discovered that sometimes the pollution controls 600 00:36:48,373 --> 00:36:51,209 would actually work as advertised on the road. 601 00:36:51,710 --> 00:36:54,170 But that caused wear and tear on the exhaust system. 602 00:36:54,796 --> 00:36:58,466 So to protect the cars, VW engineers changed the software, 603 00:36:58,550 --> 00:37:01,052 so pollution controls were shut off 604 00:37:01,136 --> 00:37:03,304 as soon as the driver moved the steering wheel. 605 00:37:08,101 --> 00:37:10,729 You strap a vehicle onto a dynamometer 606 00:37:10,812 --> 00:37:12,689 and the front wheels never turn. 607 00:37:12,772 --> 00:37:15,900 So they looked for movement of the front steering wheel 608 00:37:15,984 --> 00:37:18,903 and deactivated emission controls if they found that movement. 609 00:37:19,571 --> 00:37:22,198 How could they possibly believe 610 00:37:22,282 --> 00:37:27,495 that they could go out and just change from one egregious strategy 611 00:37:27,579 --> 00:37:30,123 to a different egregious strategy and get away with it? 612 00:37:30,206 --> 00:37:31,833 I still don't understand that. 613 00:37:31,916 --> 00:37:35,754 That was without doubt the stupidest thing VW did. 614 00:37:36,921 --> 00:37:40,759 The time that we wasted giving them the benefit of the doubt, 615 00:37:40,842 --> 00:37:46,514 that's really what... what, um, what got me, that I was, um... 616 00:37:48,725 --> 00:37:54,939 I was naïve thinking that the company was operating, uh, in good faith 617 00:37:55,023 --> 00:37:58,485 and trying to find a solution, because it was all wasted. 618 00:37:58,568 --> 00:38:01,946 They could've come clean from day one and saved us a lot of trouble. 619 00:38:02,030 --> 00:38:04,532 Very systematically, we were checking... 620 00:38:04,616 --> 00:38:06,743 We thought it's this. It's not, it's not. 621 00:38:06,826 --> 00:38:09,120 You go down and eliminate all other options. 622 00:38:09,621 --> 00:38:12,457 The only thing remaining is it's gotta be a defeat device. 623 00:38:13,500 --> 00:38:15,150 I always thought 624 00:38:15,151 --> 00:38:20,131 that there was a good explanation for what was happening 625 00:38:20,215 --> 00:38:21,674 and that it wasn't cheating. 626 00:38:22,550 --> 00:38:25,553 And the first time that I really... 627 00:38:27,347 --> 00:38:29,243 had the feeling that something was wrong 628 00:38:29,244 --> 00:38:32,477 and cheating was very possibly happening 629 00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:38,358 was when we met with the Air Resources Board on July 8th, 2015. 630 00:38:39,108 --> 00:38:43,196 In my opinion, I would characterize it as, uh, a pretty rough meeting. 631 00:38:43,947 --> 00:38:46,741 Lots of strong talk from the agencies. 632 00:38:47,700 --> 00:38:51,287 They said, "We think you're recognizing the FTP. 633 00:38:52,539 --> 00:38:55,792 We don't know how you're doing it, but we're convinced you're doing it." 634 00:38:55,875 --> 00:38:58,253 Who above you, 635 00:38:58,336 --> 00:39:01,673 as far as management's concerned, did you discuss it with? 636 00:39:03,758 --> 00:39:09,264 Well, I've discussed it a lot with the management in Germany. 637 00:39:09,347 --> 00:39:14,435 Uh, Oliver Schmidt almost called me immediately after the meeting, 638 00:39:14,519 --> 00:39:16,688 within a day or so, saying, 639 00:39:16,771 --> 00:39:19,482 "What went on at the meeting? How did it go?" 640 00:39:19,566 --> 00:39:22,694 I said, "It didn't go very well." He said, "Yes, I heard that." 641 00:39:22,777 --> 00:39:23,862 I'm gonna stop you there. 642 00:39:23,945 --> 00:39:26,739 Did you ask anybody whether or not you were cheating? 643 00:39:28,283 --> 00:39:30,451 - No, I didn't. - Why not? 644 00:39:31,995 --> 00:39:35,540 To me, the people I was in contact with 645 00:39:35,541 --> 00:39:38,877 were the people that were deceiving me. 646 00:39:43,423 --> 00:39:46,509 When it was clear VW's fog machine wasn't working, 647 00:39:46,593 --> 00:39:51,180 VW agreed to a series of meetings with CARB in August 2015. 648 00:39:52,599 --> 00:39:54,726 Oliver Schmidt told me 649 00:39:55,476 --> 00:40:01,107 that he was authorized to come to the US, 650 00:40:02,066 --> 00:40:04,819 he was authorized to meet with Alberto Ayala, 651 00:40:05,361 --> 00:40:08,114 and he was authorized to make an admission. 652 00:40:10,575 --> 00:40:15,663 The reason VW finally came clean is actually fairly simple. 653 00:40:16,581 --> 00:40:20,877 EPA told them that if they didn't come clean, 654 00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:23,769 they would not certify any 2016 vehicles, 655 00:40:23,770 --> 00:40:25,465 including their gasoline vehicles. 656 00:40:25,548 --> 00:40:27,717 That means VW can't sell cars. 657 00:40:28,927 --> 00:40:30,553 No sales of new cars. 658 00:40:31,304 --> 00:40:33,107 There were comments made at the meeting 659 00:40:33,108 --> 00:40:36,059 that this was a financial decision. 660 00:40:36,142 --> 00:40:38,436 There was an intentional premeditated 661 00:40:38,519 --> 00:40:40,271 cost-benefit analysis to cheat. 662 00:40:41,105 --> 00:40:43,650 That's what was stated in the meeting. 663 00:40:44,651 --> 00:40:49,155 So, it sounded like a pretty strong confession to me at the time. 664 00:40:50,406 --> 00:40:54,702 Stuart did approach me and we went aside and had a conversation, 665 00:40:54,786 --> 00:40:58,456 and that's when he admitted to me that it was a defeat device. 666 00:40:58,539 --> 00:40:59,958 That was the first time. 667 00:41:00,041 --> 00:41:01,709 We told Mr. Ayala 668 00:41:03,002 --> 00:41:08,216 the vehicle recognizes the dyno, it recognizes the test cycle 669 00:41:09,008 --> 00:41:13,888 and that this was a software gimmick. 670 00:41:13,972 --> 00:41:16,724 That some software had been developed 671 00:41:16,808 --> 00:41:19,185 by somebody who thought they were smarter than you. 672 00:41:20,812 --> 00:41:25,900 I was very upset. I mean, I was probably very, um... 673 00:41:27,402 --> 00:41:28,444 not very polite, 674 00:41:28,987 --> 00:41:34,575 and I think that Stuart probably took most of the brunt of it 675 00:41:34,659 --> 00:41:37,161 simply because he was the company at the time. 676 00:41:37,245 --> 00:41:38,246 But I was very upset. 677 00:41:38,329 --> 00:41:40,999 Read for me, if you would, into the record, 678 00:41:41,082 --> 00:41:45,169 what the quotes were that you're quoting Dr. Ayala saying 679 00:41:45,253 --> 00:41:47,922 to your conversation, if you would. 680 00:41:48,006 --> 00:41:50,717 So, his quotes are, 681 00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:54,679 "You played us. You tried to put a pillow over our head. 682 00:41:54,762 --> 00:41:56,529 You wasted a lot of our time and money. 683 00:41:56,530 --> 00:41:59,809 We will come after you hard on this. 684 00:41:59,892 --> 00:42:02,979 This has taken too much time and raised expectations. 685 00:42:03,062 --> 00:42:06,858 Now it's just going to confirm what NGOs have been saying all along. 686 00:42:07,692 --> 00:42:09,664 We will write a nasty press release. 687 00:42:09,665 --> 00:42:12,665 I don't believe your company anymore. 688 00:42:12,739 --> 00:42:16,659 This is going to be a lot of money and you better not fight it. 689 00:42:19,162 --> 00:42:21,956 And don't give me any shit on the midterm review 690 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,958 when I ask for more stringency." 691 00:42:27,253 --> 00:42:28,463 Thank you. 692 00:42:29,422 --> 00:42:32,675 There was tremendous pressure that the company was putting on itself 693 00:42:32,759 --> 00:42:36,304 to really get to that point where they wanted to be number one, 694 00:42:36,387 --> 00:42:40,058 and they basically wanted to get there at whatever cost, and... 695 00:42:41,476 --> 00:42:42,852 now, here we are. 696 00:42:45,063 --> 00:42:46,856 Ladies and gentlemen, 697 00:42:46,939 --> 00:42:49,525 please welcome president and CEO 698 00:42:49,609 --> 00:42:52,862 of Volkswagen Group of America, Michael Horn. 699 00:42:59,535 --> 00:43:01,412 So, let's be clear about this. 700 00:43:01,496 --> 00:43:03,600 Our company was dishonest 701 00:43:03,601 --> 00:43:07,710 with the EPA and the California Air Resources Board, 702 00:43:07,794 --> 00:43:09,337 and with all of you. 703 00:43:09,420 --> 00:43:12,548 And in my German words, we've totally screwed up. 704 00:43:12,632 --> 00:43:17,220 The irregularities found in our diesel engines 705 00:43:17,303 --> 00:43:21,057 are the antithesis of everything Volkswagen stands for. 706 00:43:21,140 --> 00:43:26,020 Even I, at this point, don't have answers to all the questions. 707 00:43:26,104 --> 00:43:30,191 But we are working diligently to find out exactly what happened. 708 00:43:30,274 --> 00:43:31,901 Is it conceivable 709 00:43:31,984 --> 00:43:36,393 that Winterkorn didn't know about the cheating devices? 710 00:43:36,394 --> 00:43:37,657 Is that conceivable? 711 00:43:37,740 --> 00:43:41,119 If you believe in the tooth fairy, then it's conceivable. 712 00:43:41,202 --> 00:43:44,455 To our employees, I'd like to say, 713 00:43:44,914 --> 00:43:47,625 I know with how much dedication, 714 00:43:47,708 --> 00:43:52,004 honesty and integrity you pursue your work day after day. 715 00:43:52,922 --> 00:43:58,594 I am well aware that much of it has been thrown into question. 716 00:43:59,637 --> 00:44:03,558 But it would be wrong to cast general suspicion 717 00:44:03,641 --> 00:44:07,562 on the hard and honest work of 600,000 people 718 00:44:07,645 --> 00:44:09,414 because of the terrible mistake made by the few. 719 00:44:09,438 --> 00:44:12,483 Dr. Winterkorn, this happened under your watch. 720 00:44:12,567 --> 00:44:13,818 You own it. 721 00:44:14,694 --> 00:44:19,157 Don't tell me that some engineers at some place did something wrong. 722 00:44:19,240 --> 00:44:20,366 Don't tell me that. 723 00:44:20,449 --> 00:44:22,076 You have my word, 724 00:44:22,702 --> 00:44:24,327 we will do all of this with the greatest 725 00:44:24,328 --> 00:44:27,790 possible openness and transparency. 726 00:44:28,541 --> 00:44:30,293 Winterkorn denied any knowledge 727 00:44:30,376 --> 00:44:32,670 of the defeat device or the cheating scandal, 728 00:44:32,753 --> 00:44:35,923 but he was forced to resign the day after giving the statement. 729 00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:41,721 The US Congress began to investigate, with one question in mind: 730 00:44:41,804 --> 00:44:44,140 how high did the deception go? 731 00:44:44,223 --> 00:44:47,768 Raise your right hand and I'll swear you in. 732 00:44:47,852 --> 00:44:50,897 Michael Horn was the CEO of Volkswagen Group of America. 733 00:44:50,980 --> 00:44:52,583 Do you swear the testimony you're about to give... 734 00:44:52,607 --> 00:44:54,327 One of the company's best salesmen, 735 00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:57,194 he'd worked at VW for 25 years. 736 00:44:57,278 --> 00:44:58,651 I'm told that this was a decision 737 00:44:58,652 --> 00:45:00,781 made in Germany at the corporate level. 738 00:45:00,865 --> 00:45:02,158 Is that correct? 739 00:45:03,034 --> 00:45:05,286 Two answers to this. 740 00:45:05,369 --> 00:45:08,080 Um, first of all, the investigations are ongoing, 741 00:45:08,164 --> 00:45:10,124 but this was not a corporate decision. 742 00:45:10,207 --> 00:45:13,044 From my point of view, to my best knowledge today, 743 00:45:13,127 --> 00:45:14,754 the corporation in no board meeting 744 00:45:14,837 --> 00:45:17,548 or no supervisory board meeting has authorized this. 745 00:45:17,632 --> 00:45:21,010 But Michael Horn knew about the defeat device. 746 00:45:21,093 --> 00:45:23,763 A year and a half before his testimony to Congress, 747 00:45:23,846 --> 00:45:26,599 Horn had received an e-mail from Oliver Schmidt. 748 00:45:27,850 --> 00:45:32,021 Schmidt told Horn about the defeat device and the likely consequences. 749 00:45:32,813 --> 00:45:36,275 "Intentional conduct equals penalties." 750 00:45:37,151 --> 00:45:40,237 In a conversation I had with Michael Horn, 751 00:45:41,447 --> 00:45:43,343 he had mentioned that he had received 752 00:45:43,344 --> 00:45:48,412 a report from Oliver in May of 2014. 753 00:45:48,496 --> 00:45:50,706 Did he tell you what it was about? 754 00:45:50,790 --> 00:45:52,416 Not in detail. No. 755 00:45:52,500 --> 00:45:57,004 - Or did he tell you in summary? - He just said that it, uh... 756 00:45:58,547 --> 00:46:04,929 raised the possibility of cheating at that point in time. 757 00:46:05,012 --> 00:46:09,225 At that point of time, I had no understanding what a defeat device was 758 00:46:09,308 --> 00:46:11,686 and I had no indication whatsoever 759 00:46:11,769 --> 00:46:14,355 that a defeat device could have been in our cars. 760 00:46:14,438 --> 00:46:16,444 This was a couple of software engineers 761 00:46:16,445 --> 00:46:18,943 who put this in for whatever reasons, 762 00:46:19,026 --> 00:46:20,528 and I would also like to find out... 763 00:46:20,611 --> 00:46:24,991 That story of a small group of engineers at Volkswagen 764 00:46:25,074 --> 00:46:29,286 doing something on their own is unbelievable, okay? 765 00:46:29,370 --> 00:46:32,039 It's unbelievable, okay? 766 00:46:32,123 --> 00:46:36,585 At Volkswagen, if you want a pen, you need three signatures. 767 00:46:38,796 --> 00:46:40,464 New York state took up the fight 768 00:46:40,548 --> 00:46:43,801 and launched a civil suit, proclaiming fraud by VW. 769 00:46:43,884 --> 00:46:48,139 Today's suit and the nine-month investigation that led to it 770 00:46:48,222 --> 00:46:51,767 are designed to hold Volkswagen accountable for their actions 771 00:46:51,851 --> 00:46:55,187 and to make sure that no car company again 772 00:46:55,271 --> 00:46:58,482 ever considers this type of widespread deception. 773 00:46:58,566 --> 00:47:00,609 The individuals who purchase cars are victims. 774 00:47:00,693 --> 00:47:03,571 Those who suffer from this extra pollution are victims. 775 00:47:03,654 --> 00:47:06,407 So is every other company that followed the rules 776 00:47:06,490 --> 00:47:09,452 and was trying to produce a car complying with the law 777 00:47:09,535 --> 00:47:10,855 to meet these emission standards. 778 00:47:10,911 --> 00:47:12,210 To have these folks cheating 779 00:47:12,211 --> 00:47:15,166 and programming their cars to commit fraud, 780 00:47:15,249 --> 00:47:17,376 in a way, their competitors are also victims. 781 00:47:17,460 --> 00:47:19,795 We're trying to establish a level playing field, 782 00:47:19,879 --> 00:47:21,630 that everyone has to follow the rules, 783 00:47:21,714 --> 00:47:23,174 no one is above the law 784 00:47:23,257 --> 00:47:26,343 and no level of corporate cover-up can excuse this. 785 00:47:26,427 --> 00:47:29,638 Did you come up with evidence that indicated 786 00:47:29,722 --> 00:47:32,266 that Winterkorn knew what was going on? 787 00:47:32,349 --> 00:47:35,269 Yeah. Going back to, I think, 2006, 788 00:47:35,352 --> 00:47:37,480 it's clear that things at least came to his attention. 789 00:47:39,648 --> 00:47:41,396 We've reviewed millions of pages of documents, 790 00:47:41,397 --> 00:47:42,735 thousands of internal e-mails. 791 00:47:43,944 --> 00:47:48,074 It is clear that there had been a very frantic effort to cover this up. 792 00:47:48,657 --> 00:47:50,618 They had phony recalls, 793 00:47:50,701 --> 00:47:55,122 they looked at other penalties against carmakers and said, 794 00:47:55,206 --> 00:47:57,458 "We can survive this sort of a penalty." 795 00:47:57,958 --> 00:48:01,128 There were signals sent, "We may be putting a document holdout," 796 00:48:01,212 --> 00:48:03,839 which sends a signal, maybe you wanna destroy some documents. 797 00:48:03,923 --> 00:48:08,010 Hundreds of very high-level executives and engineers knew about this. 798 00:48:08,094 --> 00:48:10,387 We didn't find one e-mail from anyone saying, 799 00:48:10,471 --> 00:48:12,598 "We shouldn't do this," or, "This is against the law," 800 00:48:12,681 --> 00:48:14,725 or trying to put the brakes on this system. 801 00:48:14,809 --> 00:48:18,270 So this was a corporate culture permeated by fraud. 802 00:48:18,354 --> 00:48:22,733 Now, all of these cars are out of the legal compliance, clearly. 803 00:48:22,817 --> 00:48:25,694 I had a phone conversation with Michael Horn 804 00:48:25,778 --> 00:48:27,947 after I'd heard from Oliver Schmidt, 805 00:48:28,030 --> 00:48:30,741 that he's authorized to make an admission. 806 00:48:30,825 --> 00:48:35,204 Things were looking bad, you know, dire outcome. 807 00:48:37,039 --> 00:48:38,499 So, um... 808 00:48:39,250 --> 00:48:40,584 Michael Horn called me. 809 00:48:40,668 --> 00:48:42,002 I told Mr. Horn, 810 00:48:43,087 --> 00:48:47,174 "It looks like we've been cheating and we've been caught." 811 00:48:47,925 --> 00:48:52,471 And did Mr. Horn then immediately issue a stop-sale order, 812 00:48:52,555 --> 00:48:57,309 to stop selling these cars that Volkswagen had been cheating to sell? 813 00:48:57,393 --> 00:48:58,644 Not that I'm aware of, no. 814 00:48:59,436 --> 00:49:02,648 Would it be fair to say that Michael Horn's primary focus is 815 00:49:03,816 --> 00:49:05,651 increasing sales? 816 00:49:05,734 --> 00:49:07,486 Objection. Calls for speculation. 817 00:49:07,570 --> 00:49:10,364 In respect to his position at Volkswagen Group of America? 818 00:49:10,447 --> 00:49:11,782 Calls for speculation. 819 00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:14,702 I would say yes. 820 00:49:19,540 --> 00:49:20,666 You know what's really great 821 00:49:20,749 --> 00:49:24,170 about the all-new 2012 Volkswagen Passat TDI Clean Diesel? 822 00:49:24,253 --> 00:49:26,338 Not only does it provide excellent fuel economy, 823 00:49:26,422 --> 00:49:28,424 but you'll love the performance, too. 824 00:49:28,507 --> 00:49:31,552 Delivers turbo-charged performance and great mileage. 825 00:49:31,635 --> 00:49:35,347 Passat TDI Clean Diesel with up to 814 highway miles per tank. 826 00:49:35,431 --> 00:49:36,724 Just one reason Volkswagen 827 00:49:36,807 --> 00:49:39,852 is the number-one selling diesel car brand in America. 828 00:49:39,935 --> 00:49:44,273 If you want a look into the psyche, into the thinking of a company, 829 00:49:45,191 --> 00:49:47,193 you should look at the advertising campaign. 830 00:49:47,943 --> 00:49:50,571 The old wives' tale is funny. 831 00:49:50,654 --> 00:49:52,531 How do you like my new car? 832 00:49:52,615 --> 00:49:53,615 Isn't diesel dirty? 833 00:49:53,657 --> 00:49:55,409 Oh, say it's beautiful, for Christ's sake. 834 00:49:55,492 --> 00:49:58,204 I think it's beautiful, but aren't diesels dirty? 835 00:49:58,287 --> 00:49:59,287 Yeah, that's true. 836 00:50:00,539 --> 00:50:03,417 Oh, that used to be dirty. This is 2015. 837 00:50:03,500 --> 00:50:05,711 No, no, no. Listen to me, Terry. 838 00:50:05,794 --> 00:50:09,465 - Diesel in Latin means dirty. - I'll prove it to ya. 839 00:50:10,216 --> 00:50:13,177 You're gonna ruin your scarf. Oh, look what she's doing. 840 00:50:13,260 --> 00:50:14,929 See how clean it is? 841 00:50:15,012 --> 00:50:17,157 It's not dirty, but you still have a dirty mind. 842 00:50:17,181 --> 00:50:18,419 The audience is like, "It's very funny. 843 00:50:18,420 --> 00:50:22,978 That's the way it is." But it was a lie. 844 00:50:23,062 --> 00:50:24,688 Every time one of those ads ran, 845 00:50:24,772 --> 00:50:27,566 the executives of these companies knew that they were telling a lie, 846 00:50:27,650 --> 00:50:30,159 and they'd sold, uh, ultimately about 847 00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:31,695 11 million of these cars around the world. 848 00:50:31,779 --> 00:50:33,906 That's a lot of cars, a lot of excess pollution. 849 00:50:34,949 --> 00:50:37,243 They seemed to have a culture in the company, 850 00:50:37,326 --> 00:50:39,328 a feeling as though they were above the law. 851 00:50:40,829 --> 00:50:43,040 Between state and federal sanctions, 852 00:50:43,123 --> 00:50:47,127 VW was forced to pay over $25 billion in fines, 853 00:50:47,211 --> 00:50:51,465 and to buy back over 550,000 vehicles from angry owners. 854 00:50:51,548 --> 00:50:55,386 Through lawsuits and investigations by government regulators, 855 00:50:55,469 --> 00:50:57,265 more details would be revealed about 856 00:50:57,266 --> 00:51:00,724 VW's vast cheating campaign in the US. 857 00:51:00,808 --> 00:51:02,184 And across the ocean, 858 00:51:02,268 --> 00:51:04,645 a journalist named Hans Koberstein uncovered 859 00:51:04,728 --> 00:51:07,773 a much more pervasive problem in Europe. 860 00:51:07,856 --> 00:51:11,652 Our main question was is Volkswagen the only one? 861 00:51:11,735 --> 00:51:15,489 What about all the other diesel car manufacturers in Germany? 862 00:51:15,572 --> 00:51:17,095 World leaders in diesel technology. 863 00:51:17,096 --> 00:51:19,994 Do they use illegal defeat devices, too? 864 00:51:24,873 --> 00:51:27,001 My colleagues and I decided to do a test 865 00:51:27,084 --> 00:51:32,381 to measure the emissions on the road of German cars. 866 00:51:32,464 --> 00:51:38,095 BMW, Mercedes and a Volkswagen with a defeat device. 867 00:51:38,178 --> 00:51:41,056 Do they poison the air more than allowed? 868 00:51:41,932 --> 00:51:45,477 When we tried to get the portable emission measurement system 869 00:51:45,561 --> 00:51:46,729 to do the testings, 870 00:51:47,646 --> 00:51:50,149 in this time there were just four companies 871 00:51:50,232 --> 00:51:52,776 that offer this service in Germany. 872 00:51:52,860 --> 00:51:56,196 We called all of them and they all of them told us, 873 00:51:56,280 --> 00:52:00,242 "Mmm. Mmm, we don't want to do it with you." 874 00:52:00,326 --> 00:52:04,079 Or they had no time, or they said, "Oh, you can't do this testing." 875 00:52:04,163 --> 00:52:05,163 "Why not?" 876 00:52:05,831 --> 00:52:07,750 "You can't do this testing." 877 00:52:07,833 --> 00:52:09,585 They just didn't want to do it with us. 878 00:52:10,336 --> 00:52:14,631 Those service agencies that offer the mobile measurements 879 00:52:14,715 --> 00:52:20,095 depend on the car industry, so they didn't want to harm their clients. 880 00:52:20,971 --> 00:52:23,807 And so, we had to go to Switzerland to do this testing. 881 00:52:23,891 --> 00:52:25,300 We did the same test 882 00:52:25,301 --> 00:52:27,770 on the street that we did in the lab. 883 00:52:28,479 --> 00:52:31,648 We compared how is the car acting in the lab 884 00:52:31,732 --> 00:52:35,277 and how is the same car acting on the road. 885 00:52:35,361 --> 00:52:39,490 And it was amazing to see that it is dirty. 886 00:52:39,573 --> 00:52:43,535 Not just a little bit. It is extremely dirty. 887 00:52:44,161 --> 00:52:47,122 The Volkswagen with an illegal defeat device 888 00:52:47,206 --> 00:52:49,917 and the BMW and the Mercedes 889 00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:56,799 emitted up to 400-500% higher than during the laboratory test. 890 00:52:56,882 --> 00:53:02,221 That shows clearly that those cars have a defeat device. 891 00:53:04,223 --> 00:53:06,934 When Hans asked the car companies for comment, 892 00:53:07,017 --> 00:53:08,693 they responded by threatening to sue 893 00:53:08,694 --> 00:53:10,270 for hundreds of millions of dollars 894 00:53:10,354 --> 00:53:12,356 to prevent the broadcast. 895 00:53:12,439 --> 00:53:14,858 But Hans pushed forward and exposed 896 00:53:14,942 --> 00:53:19,488 not only the cheating but the way the German government enabled it. 897 00:53:19,571 --> 00:53:24,868 Every manufacturer in Europe is using calibration strategies 898 00:53:24,952 --> 00:53:28,163 that, in the US, would be considered defeat devices. 899 00:53:28,831 --> 00:53:30,290 Every one of them. 900 00:53:30,791 --> 00:53:32,459 And what's really interesting here 901 00:53:32,543 --> 00:53:35,838 is that if you read the language for what a defeat device is, 902 00:53:35,921 --> 00:53:38,298 in Europe and the US, they're almost identical. 903 00:53:38,382 --> 00:53:41,635 Almost word for word. So, what's going on here? 904 00:53:42,428 --> 00:53:46,932 What it really comes down to is that there are three exceptions 905 00:53:47,015 --> 00:53:50,144 for cases in which calibration changes are allowed. 906 00:53:50,227 --> 00:53:53,605 And one of them is for safety and protection of the engine. 907 00:53:54,231 --> 00:53:57,818 In Europe, the manufacturers just claim, 908 00:53:57,901 --> 00:54:00,863 "Oh, I need this for protection of the engine." 909 00:54:00,946 --> 00:54:03,824 Or, "I need this for protection of the after-treatment system." 910 00:54:03,907 --> 00:54:07,411 And those claims go unchallenged. 911 00:54:08,620 --> 00:54:10,306 The understanding of the German government 912 00:54:10,330 --> 00:54:14,209 is defeat devices are generally allowed 913 00:54:14,751 --> 00:54:18,172 because there's an exemption to protect the engines. 914 00:54:18,255 --> 00:54:19,882 Any engine must be protected, 915 00:54:19,965 --> 00:54:23,427 so all the defeat devices we know in diesel cars are allowed. 916 00:54:23,510 --> 00:54:28,056 That's the interpretation of the German government and it is absurd. 917 00:54:28,140 --> 00:54:30,368 It seems crazy that the German government cares more 918 00:54:30,392 --> 00:54:33,020 about protecting engines than human beings. 919 00:54:33,103 --> 00:54:37,983 - Is it this way throughout Europe? - Well, the primary issue in Europe 920 00:54:38,066 --> 00:54:40,142 isn't so much their requirements which, 921 00:54:40,143 --> 00:54:43,071 for the most part, are world-class. 922 00:54:43,155 --> 00:54:46,283 But Europe does tend to have a problem with enforcement. 923 00:54:46,366 --> 00:54:49,828 The standards are set at the European level for all the countries. 924 00:54:49,912 --> 00:54:54,082 But enforcement is done at the individual country level. 925 00:54:54,166 --> 00:54:56,540 Further, every country agrees 926 00:54:56,541 --> 00:55:00,088 to accept enforcement in every other country. 927 00:55:00,756 --> 00:55:04,176 So this leads to a situation which the manufacturers go shopping. 928 00:55:04,259 --> 00:55:07,221 Which country is going to do the least enforcement? 929 00:55:08,263 --> 00:55:10,516 In Europe, it's a game of musical chairs. 930 00:55:10,599 --> 00:55:12,935 If enforcement is too strict in France or Finland, 931 00:55:13,018 --> 00:55:15,020 try Luxembourg or Malta. 932 00:55:15,103 --> 00:55:17,981 They may need the money or factories that might be built, 933 00:55:18,065 --> 00:55:21,193 so they're willing to look the other way when companies cheat. 934 00:55:31,245 --> 00:55:34,957 Companies often claim they can't improve safety or pollution controls 935 00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:37,084 or they'd go out of business. 936 00:55:37,167 --> 00:55:39,670 For VW, the situation is even more prone to corruption. 937 00:55:39,753 --> 00:55:42,106 The German province of Lower Saxony 938 00:55:42,107 --> 00:55:45,676 actually owns 20% of VW's voting stock. 939 00:55:45,759 --> 00:55:47,219 Given that fact, 940 00:55:47,302 --> 00:55:51,473 is it likely that Lower Saxony will conduct a thorough investigation 941 00:55:51,557 --> 00:55:53,767 of its biggest profit center? 942 00:55:53,850 --> 00:55:57,479 The government covered the car companies. 943 00:55:57,563 --> 00:56:00,148 Why? Because of its jobs. 944 00:56:00,232 --> 00:56:03,694 They're very worried if people are out of a job 945 00:56:03,777 --> 00:56:08,532 because then they're lining up outside of the agencies 946 00:56:08,615 --> 00:56:10,784 and collect money and they vote them out of power. 947 00:56:10,867 --> 00:56:14,288 Any national government in Europe has the problem 948 00:56:14,371 --> 00:56:16,832 if it has a national car industry. 949 00:56:16,915 --> 00:56:19,543 "Oh, how are we going to deal with this problem?" 950 00:56:19,626 --> 00:56:24,006 They all think, "Mmm, better not to harm our national car industry," 951 00:56:24,089 --> 00:56:28,051 because they can only enforce the law for their own car industry, 952 00:56:28,135 --> 00:56:31,597 not for the German or French one, just for the British one. 953 00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:34,891 And so, any national government is thinking, 954 00:56:34,975 --> 00:56:39,896 "Should I harm my national car industry if others won't? 955 00:56:39,980 --> 00:56:43,483 No, I will not do this. I am not stupid." 956 00:56:44,818 --> 00:56:47,988 And they are still selling dirty cars. 957 00:56:49,072 --> 00:56:52,034 To this day, despite the VW scandal, 958 00:56:52,117 --> 00:56:54,027 car manufacturers are selling dirty cars 959 00:56:54,028 --> 00:56:56,079 throughout Europe and the world. 960 00:56:56,455 --> 00:56:59,833 It always sounds good to say, "We need the jobs." 961 00:56:59,917 --> 00:57:02,628 But what if you were offered a job at an assembly line 962 00:57:02,711 --> 00:57:07,215 to make products that killed people? Would you take that job? 963 00:57:10,761 --> 00:57:12,554 What's going on in Europe? 964 00:57:12,638 --> 00:57:16,099 They have these plans for how they're going to reduce air pollution, 965 00:57:16,183 --> 00:57:19,269 and they've had these for 10, 20 years. 966 00:57:20,187 --> 00:57:22,856 They made projections about what's gonna happen in the future. 967 00:57:22,940 --> 00:57:27,027 They have not been meeting their projections for ambient air quality. 968 00:57:27,653 --> 00:57:31,239 The pollutants in the air are higher than they've always projected, 969 00:57:31,865 --> 00:57:33,784 and now we finally know why. 970 00:57:35,869 --> 00:57:39,539 The one thing that the governments in Europe did after the VW scandals, 971 00:57:39,623 --> 00:57:41,291 they did a lot of testing. 972 00:57:41,375 --> 00:57:45,754 So we have in-use tests on over 150 vehicles in Europe now, 973 00:57:45,837 --> 00:57:46,755 and it's clear. 974 00:57:46,838 --> 00:57:50,092 The diesels in Europe are six or seven times dirtier 975 00:57:50,175 --> 00:57:51,468 than the standards allow. 976 00:57:52,552 --> 00:57:56,515 So the ambient air quality in every city in Europe 977 00:57:56,598 --> 00:57:58,684 is worse than it should've been, 978 00:57:58,767 --> 00:58:02,229 and this is having health impacts and premature deaths. 979 00:58:03,480 --> 00:58:08,151 In Germany, it's more than 10,000 premature deaths per year 980 00:58:08,235 --> 00:58:11,196 only due to nitrogen dioxide. 981 00:58:11,989 --> 00:58:14,908 That's much more than we have 982 00:58:14,992 --> 00:58:19,329 in losses and deaths due to traffic accidents. 983 00:58:21,832 --> 00:58:25,752 I am living in Berlin for almost 20 years now, 984 00:58:25,836 --> 00:58:28,338 and I am living in a zone where it's green. 985 00:58:28,422 --> 00:58:33,719 Lot of trees, parks. There's a lake, there's little traffic. 986 00:58:34,594 --> 00:58:37,139 We did measurements on the road where I live 987 00:58:38,348 --> 00:58:44,688 and those measurements showed that the levels of nitrogen dioxide 988 00:58:44,771 --> 00:58:50,193 are much higher than the average annual limit that is legally allowed. 989 00:58:53,071 --> 00:58:55,490 I wouldn't have ever expected that. 990 00:58:55,574 --> 00:58:57,034 That's really a huge problem. 991 00:58:57,117 --> 00:59:01,663 We think we have an air pollution problem wherever we see many cars 992 00:59:01,747 --> 00:59:04,583 and wherever many cars are driving at the moment. 993 00:59:05,333 --> 00:59:07,586 But the problem of nitrogen dioxide is 994 00:59:07,669 --> 00:59:11,506 that's even there where you do not expect it to be in the cities. 995 00:59:11,590 --> 00:59:13,217 We did measurements in a kindergarten 996 00:59:13,218 --> 00:59:15,635 that's very close to where I'm living. 997 00:59:16,762 --> 00:59:21,266 The levels within the kindergarten were above the legal limits. 998 00:59:22,976 --> 00:59:25,729 The German car companies didn't want their customers to know 999 00:59:25,812 --> 00:59:28,190 how harmful were their diesel cars. 1000 00:59:28,815 --> 00:59:31,943 VW, in particular, wanted to fight back. 1001 00:59:32,027 --> 00:59:34,905 To show the benefits of clean diesel cars, 1002 00:59:34,988 --> 00:59:39,659 VW embarked on a plan to do their own tests on human beings. 1003 00:59:42,662 --> 00:59:47,501 Step 1: Establish a phony research company called EUGT, 1004 00:59:47,584 --> 00:59:53,507 funded by VW, Mercedes and BMW, to study the effects of diesel exhaust. 1005 00:59:54,424 --> 00:59:56,510 This secret plan to fool the public 1006 00:59:56,593 --> 01:00:00,097 was uncovered by a lawyer representing angry American consumers. 1007 01:00:01,556 --> 01:00:07,771 So, EUGT, the fake nonprofit, pays approximately $730,000 1008 01:00:07,854 --> 01:00:12,984 to a company called Lovelace Respiratory Research Institute, LRRI, 1009 01:00:13,068 --> 01:00:14,778 to conduct a study. 1010 01:00:14,861 --> 01:00:19,116 The purpose of the study, purportedly, was to attempt to show 1011 01:00:19,199 --> 01:00:21,576 that the new diesel technology represented 1012 01:00:21,660 --> 01:00:25,539 by these Volkswagen TDI Clean Diesel vehicles 1013 01:00:25,622 --> 01:00:29,209 was much more environmentally friendly than the old diesel technology. 1014 01:00:29,292 --> 01:00:31,962 It would not result in the type of health problems 1015 01:00:32,045 --> 01:00:35,340 that diesel exhausts from old diesel technology would create. 1016 01:00:35,966 --> 01:00:37,968 And the person that was in charge of that study 1017 01:00:38,051 --> 01:00:40,470 was a guy by the name of Dr. Jake McDonald, 1018 01:00:40,554 --> 01:00:43,056 whose deposition I just recently took. 1019 01:00:43,140 --> 01:00:45,600 Did you ever have any information that 1020 01:00:45,684 --> 01:00:48,465 any of the monies that you all received 1021 01:00:48,466 --> 01:00:50,564 to do the study came from Volkswagen? 1022 01:00:51,356 --> 01:00:54,943 I presumed that because Volkswagen was a contributing member of EUGT 1023 01:00:55,026 --> 01:00:56,626 that they contributed money to the study. 1024 01:00:56,695 --> 01:00:58,155 But I didn't know... 1025 01:00:58,238 --> 01:01:04,161 I had no details in terms of who contributed what amount. 1026 01:01:04,661 --> 01:01:07,038 All I knew was the contract was with EUGT. 1027 01:01:07,122 --> 01:01:11,543 So, the setup happens in Lovelace's laboratory 1028 01:01:11,626 --> 01:01:12,919 in Albuquerque, New Mexico. 1029 01:01:14,254 --> 01:01:17,465 They procure a dyno to run these cars on. 1030 01:01:17,549 --> 01:01:21,720 That dyno was selected by none other than Stuart Johnson, 1031 01:01:21,803 --> 01:01:25,640 and personally delivered there to the LRRI facilities. 1032 01:01:26,266 --> 01:01:32,522 You had involvement in assisting with this study. 1033 01:01:33,815 --> 01:01:34,858 True? 1034 01:01:35,567 --> 01:01:37,068 Limited involvement. 1035 01:01:37,736 --> 01:01:41,740 Stuart Johnson wasn't the only VW executive involved. 1036 01:01:41,823 --> 01:01:44,201 James Liang, a German engineer 1037 01:01:44,284 --> 01:01:46,745 who helped with the development of the defeat device, 1038 01:01:46,828 --> 01:01:48,997 also helped shape the study. 1039 01:01:49,080 --> 01:01:55,462 James Liang personally delivered a TDI 2013 red Beetle 1040 01:01:55,545 --> 01:01:57,631 for purposes of doing this testing. 1041 01:01:58,340 --> 01:02:01,301 Volkswagen USA insisted 1042 01:02:01,384 --> 01:02:07,307 that James Liang be given real-time access to LRRI's data. 1043 01:02:08,516 --> 01:02:13,521 Is it unusual for a manufacturer to require 1044 01:02:13,605 --> 01:02:17,651 real-time monitoring of what is happening in your study? 1045 01:02:17,734 --> 01:02:19,277 Objection. Vague. 1046 01:02:20,320 --> 01:02:21,655 Calls for speculation. 1047 01:02:24,783 --> 01:02:26,201 Um... 1048 01:02:27,994 --> 01:02:31,414 It's the first time that I've experienced that. 1049 01:02:31,498 --> 01:02:34,376 In your entire career, this has never happened previously? 1050 01:02:34,459 --> 01:02:35,543 Correct. 1051 01:02:35,627 --> 01:02:38,213 That was necessary to ensure 1052 01:02:38,296 --> 01:02:42,425 that these so-called clean diesel vehicles would run in test mode 1053 01:02:42,509 --> 01:02:47,347 and produce the fraudulent emissions for purposes of this fake scientific research. 1054 01:02:48,848 --> 01:02:51,977 What they're doing at the same time is they're attempting to compare 1055 01:02:52,060 --> 01:02:55,563 their so-called new technology with old technology. 1056 01:02:55,647 --> 01:03:01,736 So they are running a 2004 Ford F-250 on the dyno also. 1057 01:03:02,696 --> 01:03:06,199 In the original draft, the original proposal, the study, 1058 01:03:06,283 --> 01:03:10,370 they were actually going to have a human sitting on an exercise bike. 1059 01:03:10,453 --> 01:03:13,498 There's actually a diagram of this in the proposal 1060 01:03:13,581 --> 01:03:16,668 where a human participant would sit riding an exercise bike. 1061 01:03:16,751 --> 01:03:21,756 They would then be exposed to gas directly from the diesel vehicles. 1062 01:03:23,049 --> 01:03:26,886 And then, they would poke and prod that person later to determine, uh, 1063 01:03:26,970 --> 01:03:29,931 what type of health effects 1064 01:03:30,015 --> 01:03:33,935 they would see from this person being gassed. 1065 01:03:34,561 --> 01:03:41,109 Were you involved in discussions about doing this study on humans? 1066 01:03:42,777 --> 01:03:46,614 - Yes. - In retrospect, does that seem... 1067 01:03:47,991 --> 01:03:49,659 ridiculous? 1068 01:03:49,743 --> 01:03:52,829 Objection. Calls for speculation. 1069 01:03:53,663 --> 01:03:56,624 In retrospect, the optics aren't very good. 1070 01:04:01,463 --> 01:04:06,885 Obviously, one cannot help to think back 1071 01:04:06,968 --> 01:04:10,972 throughout history of another series of events 1072 01:04:11,056 --> 01:04:14,434 involving individuals being gassed 1073 01:04:14,517 --> 01:04:19,272 by a person who was actually at the opening 1074 01:04:19,356 --> 01:04:21,399 of the very first Volkswagen factory 1075 01:04:22,067 --> 01:04:26,279 and gave a speech there in connection with that opening. 1076 01:04:30,700 --> 01:04:33,787 Did you recommend against doing this study on humans? 1077 01:04:34,954 --> 01:04:36,664 Um... 1078 01:04:38,333 --> 01:04:39,709 I don't recall. 1079 01:04:39,793 --> 01:04:46,383 I know that, um, David Geanacopoulos was involved in the discussion, 1080 01:04:46,466 --> 01:04:48,301 and he didn't like the idea. 1081 01:04:50,845 --> 01:04:55,100 But VW did not abandon the idea of the experiment. 1082 01:04:55,183 --> 01:04:59,020 Someone suggested that the test be performed on NHPs. 1083 01:04:59,104 --> 01:05:01,564 Non-human primates. 1084 01:05:35,348 --> 01:05:37,183 They set up tubing 1085 01:05:37,267 --> 01:05:41,312 from the back of the tailpipe up through the ceiling. 1086 01:05:44,232 --> 01:05:47,026 The gas would then come down into the chamber. 1087 01:05:52,782 --> 01:05:55,577 These monkeys have been trained to watch TV, 1088 01:05:55,660 --> 01:05:56,911 and so what they would do 1089 01:05:56,995 --> 01:06:00,081 is they would actually play for them cartoons 1090 01:06:00,165 --> 01:06:02,125 and have them watch cartoons. 1091 01:06:10,383 --> 01:06:11,950 After they would've been exposed 1092 01:06:11,951 --> 01:06:14,095 to the TDI Clean Diesel gases, 1093 01:06:14,179 --> 01:06:18,808 they're then subsequently exposing them to the Ford F-250 gases. 1094 01:06:22,812 --> 01:06:26,232 The nitrogen oxide and other particles of exhaust 1095 01:06:26,316 --> 01:06:28,610 that would be coming out of this F-250 1096 01:06:28,693 --> 01:06:32,197 are very, very dirty, and very noxious, very harmful. 1097 01:06:38,286 --> 01:06:40,126 Wake up! Where's everybody going? 1098 01:06:41,873 --> 01:06:44,459 The monkey would be exposed to that gas 1099 01:06:44,542 --> 01:06:46,961 for a three- or four-hour period of time, 1100 01:06:47,045 --> 01:06:50,798 after which time they would take the monkey back to a separate facility 1101 01:06:50,882 --> 01:06:53,468 and test it, taking blood samples. 1102 01:06:54,177 --> 01:06:56,471 They would stick a tube down the monkey's throat, 1103 01:06:56,554 --> 01:07:00,058 in order to scrub samples from inside of the monkey's lungs. 1104 01:07:15,240 --> 01:07:17,134 Do you know what happened to the monkeys 1105 01:07:17,158 --> 01:07:20,036 after the testing was completed? 1106 01:07:20,537 --> 01:07:22,017 We didn't ship them to Volkswagen, 1107 01:07:22,018 --> 01:07:24,415 if that's what you're asking. 1108 01:07:24,499 --> 01:07:26,584 They... We... 1109 01:07:27,377 --> 01:07:29,254 I don't recall. My... We... 1110 01:07:29,337 --> 01:07:34,842 It was a non-terminal study, so the animals were not euthanized 1111 01:07:34,926 --> 01:07:39,639 to be able to look at any sort of more invasive responses. So... 1112 01:07:39,722 --> 01:07:42,433 When Dr. McDonald realized 1113 01:07:42,517 --> 01:07:46,604 that these emissions that he tested were, in fact, fraudulent, 1114 01:07:46,688 --> 01:07:47,774 and that he had been duped 1115 01:07:47,775 --> 01:07:51,314 and set up to be used by Volkswagen as a pawn, 1116 01:07:52,277 --> 01:07:55,363 he said that this report cannot be published. 1117 01:07:58,700 --> 01:08:03,454 You know, there is a concern, obviously, amongst Volkswagen that, 1118 01:08:03,538 --> 01:08:07,709 if a jury were to ever hear about any of this stuff, 1119 01:08:07,792 --> 01:08:11,713 that could really impact the verdict in this case, 1120 01:08:11,796 --> 01:08:15,383 and, in fact, Volkswagen has filed a motion with the court, 1121 01:08:15,466 --> 01:08:19,220 specifically asking the court to exclude any mention of any of this. 1122 01:08:24,225 --> 01:08:26,227 Today, the Department of Justice, 1123 01:08:26,311 --> 01:08:28,229 the Environmental Protection Agency 1124 01:08:28,313 --> 01:08:30,648 and the US Customs and Border Protection 1125 01:08:30,732 --> 01:08:33,735 have reached a global resolution with Volkswagen 1126 01:08:33,818 --> 01:08:37,739 that carries both criminal and civil penalties. 1127 01:08:37,822 --> 01:08:39,918 As part of this resolution, 1128 01:08:39,919 --> 01:08:42,785 Volkswagen is pleading guilty to three felonies. 1129 01:08:42,869 --> 01:08:47,081 Conspiracy to defraud the United States, to commit wire fraud, 1130 01:08:47,165 --> 01:08:50,543 and to violate the Clean Air Act, obstruction of justice, 1131 01:08:50,627 --> 01:08:53,588 and importation of goods by false statements. 1132 01:08:55,673 --> 01:08:59,969 In January 2017, James Liang pled guilty to fraud 1133 01:09:00,053 --> 01:09:02,680 and was sentenced to 40 months in prison. 1134 01:09:02,764 --> 01:09:07,018 Oliver Schmidt was arrested in Miami after a Caribbean vacation, 1135 01:09:07,101 --> 01:09:09,687 just as he was about to board a flight to Germany. 1136 01:09:10,563 --> 01:09:12,690 In August of 2017, 1137 01:09:12,774 --> 01:09:16,110 he pled guilty to conspiracy to defraud the government. 1138 01:09:16,194 --> 01:09:19,572 He was one of six VW executives indicted by the US. 1139 01:09:20,948 --> 01:09:24,452 Did anybody ever instruct you during this timeframe 1140 01:09:24,535 --> 01:09:26,412 to basically keep your mouth shut? 1141 01:09:26,496 --> 01:09:29,374 I don't recall that. 1142 01:09:35,380 --> 01:09:37,215 He said that's not a "no." 1143 01:09:38,299 --> 01:09:39,717 I don't remember. 1144 01:09:39,801 --> 01:09:43,888 You're aware that Oliver Schmidt recently pled guilty 1145 01:09:43,971 --> 01:09:46,349 to a felony in federal court in Michigan, are you not? 1146 01:09:46,432 --> 01:09:47,934 I'm aware of that. 1147 01:09:48,017 --> 01:09:50,478 As of September 2017, 1148 01:09:50,561 --> 01:09:53,314 Stuart Johnson has not been charged with a crime. 1149 01:09:53,398 --> 01:09:56,192 There are indications that he may be a cooperating witness 1150 01:09:56,275 --> 01:09:58,736 for the ongoing federal investigation. 1151 01:09:59,696 --> 01:10:04,200 Michael Horn resigned from VW in 2016 and returned to Germany. 1152 01:10:05,368 --> 01:10:09,080 Martin Winterkorn remains untouched by the criminal investigation. 1153 01:10:10,957 --> 01:10:12,834 Outside of Germany, other carmakers, 1154 01:10:12,917 --> 01:10:14,810 including GM and Fiat Chrysler, 1155 01:10:14,811 --> 01:10:17,839 have been accused of using defeat devices. 1156 01:10:17,922 --> 01:10:22,051 But even after all the fines, the criminal charges and the scandals, 1157 01:10:22,135 --> 01:10:26,514 VW realized its dream of becoming the world's largest carmaker. 1158 01:10:29,934 --> 01:10:33,146 At the same time, with the election of President Trump, 1159 01:10:33,229 --> 01:10:34,456 the federal government declared 1160 01:10:34,480 --> 01:10:36,607 that corporate profits would now be more important 1161 01:10:36,691 --> 01:10:38,609 than protecting the environment. 1162 01:10:39,360 --> 01:10:45,783 In order to fulfill my solemn duty to protect America and its citizens, 1163 01:10:46,868 --> 01:10:49,954 the United States will withdraw 1164 01:10:51,706 --> 01:10:56,210 from the Paris Climate Accord. 1165 01:11:01,507 --> 01:11:02,800 Thank you. 1166 01:11:02,884 --> 01:11:06,179 This announcement made the US, Syria and Nicaragua 1167 01:11:06,262 --> 01:11:07,762 the only three nations on Earth 1168 01:11:07,763 --> 01:11:09,974 to abandon the effort to prevent global warming. 1169 01:11:12,769 --> 01:11:14,455 The Trump administration has also threatened 1170 01:11:14,479 --> 01:11:17,273 to undermine CARB in California, 1171 01:11:17,356 --> 01:11:20,485 because of CARB's strict air-pollution controls. 1172 01:11:20,818 --> 01:11:22,904 When you look at a state like California, 1173 01:11:22,987 --> 01:11:25,531 we have goals for 2030 and 2050. 1174 01:11:25,615 --> 01:11:27,408 You know, long-term goals. 1175 01:11:27,492 --> 01:11:28,951 We need to start thinking now 1176 01:11:29,035 --> 01:11:31,829 and laying out ideas for how we're gonna get there. 1177 01:11:33,748 --> 01:11:36,417 It's hard for people to remember now, New York, 1178 01:11:36,501 --> 01:11:38,061 when the smog problem, caused by NOx... 1179 01:11:38,085 --> 01:11:40,838 It's exactly the stuff that was being emitted from these cars. 1180 01:11:40,922 --> 01:11:43,174 It was really bad back in the '60s and '70s. 1181 01:11:43,257 --> 01:11:45,345 It was a city where people would get sick, 1182 01:11:45,346 --> 01:11:47,303 people would die from the smog. 1183 01:11:48,513 --> 01:11:50,774 So, this is something we spent decades 1184 01:11:50,775 --> 01:11:52,141 in the United States trying to clean up. 1185 01:11:52,225 --> 01:11:53,893 We've had great success. 1186 01:11:53,976 --> 01:11:57,313 The American people don't want to undo the regulations. 1187 01:11:57,396 --> 01:11:59,941 State environmental laws are a very important backstop. 1188 01:12:00,024 --> 01:12:02,026 The federalist system was designed 1189 01:12:02,109 --> 01:12:05,696 so that states can fill in if the federal government does not. 1190 01:12:05,780 --> 01:12:09,575 That's why we're pushing so hard on some of these policies, 1191 01:12:09,659 --> 01:12:14,247 because this is really about impacting on people's lives. 1192 01:12:28,511 --> 01:12:30,930 When my wife turned in our car, 1193 01:12:31,013 --> 01:12:34,433 it was sent to an asphalt graveyard for VW's dirty diesels 1194 01:12:34,517 --> 01:12:37,103 in the shadow of the old Detroit Lions stadium. 1195 01:12:38,771 --> 01:12:40,982 From here, according to the company, 1196 01:12:41,065 --> 01:12:44,193 they will either be fixed, recycled or destroyed. 1197 01:12:47,697 --> 01:12:49,323 Every car in the lot represents 1198 01:12:49,407 --> 01:12:52,535 the sum of an economic calculation made by the company 1199 01:12:52,618 --> 01:12:54,412 between risk and reward. 1200 01:12:54,954 --> 01:12:58,499 In that way, VW is not so different from other companies. 1201 01:12:58,583 --> 01:13:01,252 They see themselves as financial abstractions, 1202 01:13:01,335 --> 01:13:06,173 pressured by competition to build models on profit, loss and market share. 1203 01:13:07,049 --> 01:13:09,886 But when many of us think of the lungs of our children, 1204 01:13:09,969 --> 01:13:13,055 scarred by NOx fumes that could have been contained, 1205 01:13:13,139 --> 01:13:16,350 we wonder if the equation is missing an important variable. 1206 01:13:17,351 --> 01:13:21,689 How to balance the cost of a car with the value of a human life? 1207 01:13:37,998 --> 01:13:42,998 - Synced and corrected by chamallow - - www.addic7ed.com - 102943

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