All language subtitles for 14 - Costume Design

when you talk about costume design

all right let's say the block of

of classical cinema from Hollywood or from England

from Italy whatever

that's custom design

talking about Pira tossy

you're talking about the house of Terrelli in Rome

Viscontes films and you know

extraordinary things uh

but they're all the time and place

in other words

they are depicting

um uh period

and there is an aspect of accuracy

to say the least

and some um

what's the word

a flourish to that accuracy

a touch of the artist

so to speak

beyond that

um you know

in the case of Manelli directing uh

uh Madame Bovrie uh

they changed the

the period costuming

I believe to be around the 1870s or so in Paris

cause they felt they were more interesting

than when the book

than the actual period the book was written about

I believe could be the 1840s

and so these things are you know

once you make that kind of decision

you do have drawings from the 1840s

you do have drawings from the 1870s

you do have pictures from the 19 1920s

one of the key things I found

like an age of innocence

for example

costumes and where it was an upper strata of society

was I always wanted the costumes to feel lived in

um that they should look like costumes

that was the idea

um particularly the people in the street

the extras or what they call now the atmosphere um

in the case of gangs in New York

it's different

uh in the gangs of New York we had

we had license to go as far as we wanted with costumes

got the daybreak boys and swamp angels

they work the river loot and ships

the Frog Hollow

Shanghai sailors down around the bloody angle

sure tails was rough for a while

but they become a bunch of Jackroll and Dandy's

longing around

murders Ali

looking like Chinamen

the gangs did dress differently

gangs dressed differently today each

once they know each other

they could see you

that person's wearing that

I can see the block away

you know all right

be careful there's this

this group coming

and those persons said that

this person wears suspenders

a certain way to call them galaces

the Bowery boys behaved a certain way

they all had their own uniforms

there's a plug ugly surf

from somewhere deep in the old country

got their own language

no one understands what they're saying

they love to fight

the cops and the night walkers

the rat pickers were open

and they work on their backs and kill with their hands

they're so scurvy

I'm gonna plug ugly

so talk to him

but who knows what they're saying

we could take license with that

uh in the case of uh uh

the very few characters in the film

with the upper classes were more

conventional

but everything else you can

you could let

you could let your

your mind go

of course films like Mean Streets or Taxi Driver or

going up to after hours

things like that

it's a different kind of costume design

in other words

it shouldn't be confused I think

with the custom designers and of the classical cinema

it's something else

one has to understand the world around them

and the world that they're depicting

um and so in a way

custom designer has to understand for character

what that character could be wearing um

where the character would shop for clothes

where that character would inherit clothes

certain colors that would look right on the character

certain colors were right on the character

but change because the actor is somewhat different

so you have to rearrange it somehow

or rework it rethink it

and so you need somebody who understands contemporary

expression in costuming

expression in dressing

whether you go from Armani to

I don't know what

to me today

people wear those

down jackets black

and they from far away

looks like those garbage bags that

so the style is gone in a way

so it's more practical

but it's a different statement

it's a very different statement about who you are

and what the world is

and one has to know that

one really has to know that

and so custom designers of a modern film

really comes from

and it always does

whether it's period or modern

but even more so with the modern noun

comes from the character

always from the character

what that character would she or he would wear

and particularly when they would wear it

what's appropriate of that world

and if you want to take it and move

I'm not talking about fantasy films

I'm not talking about period pieces

I'm talking about present day cinema

but go back to main streets

for example

I'll get the costumes

where I got the costumes with Harvey

and with David Provell

and Richard Romanis and everybody

and Amy Robinson

we all work together

and I got costumes

I specifically knew what I wanted

Bob knew kind of what he wanted

but he found that little shirt

I think was a knit shirt

with a little chain that you pull down

a little uh

zipper chain

which was popular for like

uh 20 minutes

I think in uh

1969 or something

and he thought this was good character thing

I said yeah

and then one day I was talking to Madonna

and his lofty had a loft at the time

and he came out of back room

and he had this little hat on

he said I think this hat

I said that's absolutely right

that's the hat

cause he understood

having spent a lot of time in the Lower East Side

when I was growing up

around 16 years old

we kind of knew each other

uh he knew the people

and he knew

uh he knew um

the culture

you know and so uh

the hat made me understand that he

he really understood everything

now I think over the years he said he didn't do that

but I know he did it

I know he put the hat on

okay so uh cause then I said

uh you know

whatever he's gonna suggest

I think he's he's on

he's onto something accurate

and we know it

and he knew the people that

somehow the picture was written about

and that sort of thing

when you go all the way down to um

Taxi Driver

the jacket of the King Kong Company

whatever the uses of Browns

brown plaids and away beiges

all the way through to Raging Bull

the Raging Bulls

interesting

because ultimately

and it was his passion to do Jake Lamada

but ultimately

I watched him sort of over period of a couple of years

between his working out that he would do

especially when he was doing New York New York

he was always working out

for the possibility doing this film which

which included boxing

you know raging ball

and so he would

work in such a way

with photographs of Jake and the people around him

the curling of the hair

the way the hair would

the way the hair would lay

at different times of Jake's life testing

I'd say 20 to 30 different noses um

and it's not exaggeration because the nose has changed

because the fights you know

but what looked like the right nose for that

sort of makeup

prosthetics and that sort of thing

that wouldn't look like a prosthetic

and so ultimately

that all came together when we started playing around

Dick Bruno and all of us

playing around with the costumes

racks were brought in of existing costumes

they call today vintage

basically it's used clothes you know

and period pieces you know

and I remember we here in 58 Street somewhere

and I forget

I was in a um

production office of some kind

there was a rack of clothes

maybe putting on jackets and putting on jackets

it was an exhausting experience

because we were trying so many different things

we knew that ultimately he didn't wear as many suits

as the other people did in the film

and that sort of thing

but what did he lounge around in you know

and he suddenly picked up this jacket and put it on

it was a jacket

a three quarter length of black

and it had a white top to it

and we looked at it

and it was strong enough and off enough

and made a statement

character statement

and he said

we looked at each other and he said

look at this as

yeah that's it

that was it

and that's the basis of that character

that jacket

which he uses in a few scenes in the beginning

especially when he talks to Kathy Moriarty

tells her to come out

join him in the car whatever

but there was something about the boldness of it

and maybe the shoulders

maybe the shoulders

I don't know

but it felt right

king of comedy was really interesting

because king of comedy would try something different

at Paul Zimmerman script

something I didn't want to do again

but he convinced me over the years

because I wasn't aware of the element of celebrity

at the point of which Bob was

he became aware of it

right around the time of the tax drive

because he had done Godfather too

and he became aware of a certain kind of

his relationship to the people around him

started to change

or people would come up to him in the street

in a different way

and this whole strangeness about

the cult of celebrity

and so by the time we did Raging Bull

I began to sense what

what they were talking about

and I was still on the cusp of it in a sense I still

felt in a way

like one of the cultish fans

so to speak

of a Jerry or The Tonight Show

New York television film makers and that sort of thing

but at the same time

you're trying to work as a film maker

so that you're on both sides of it um

and so with Rupert Pumpkin

which is a name I think Paul Zimmerman got from a

taxi driver

I think he took it off

somebody who was in a car and taxi and saw the name

it was really good with Rupert

we just didn't know what he'd wear

we honestly didn't know

Dick Bruno is our great guy

he was our costume designer

and Dick and I and Bob

we were uh upon 59

we knew that we should go to certain places

on 47 Street

on 48 Street

58 Street maybe

I think no not 58

but 53rd Broadway

Seventh Avenue

that was still very much

the Brill Building

was still very much Broadway

all the film making centers were really up

up up at that

in that place

now they roll downtown um in um

a Tribecara Soho

but in uh the

the 60s and 70s

50s 60s and 70s

it was really um

between 47 Street

the Screen Building

the Bell Building and um

the sense of Broadway Danny Rose

the sense of you know

clothing stores that sold to lounge singers

you know this is

they had comics from the Borsch belt

would buy the clothes there

so it's like

really showbiz

but on a real hard working day to day

foot soldier

world and away

and then have all the 8 by 10 stills

in their glossy

signed to the different store owners

thanks for everything

that sort of thing

from Milton Borough

or you know

movie stars

but primarily

New York comics

New York performers

and so we were walking around

I think around uh

Central Park South

or whatever

we had just gone from one store to another

and we weren't quite sure

so what does he wear

ultimately we were just narrowing in

and we had some thoughts

we had some thoughts

it was a little easier with the Jerry Lewis and

and a couple of the others

but with Rupert

what is he you know

as we're walking by

there was a store

I think it may have been on 7th Avenue or Broadway

I'm not quite sure

that was called Lou Magrim

Shirt Maker to the stars

and small storefront

and we always used to see it

you know we always walk by and strip mainly sure

the shirts were

you know interesting looking

they had a kind of a showbiz feel to them a kind of

flourish so to speak

big wide you know bow ties

all kinds of things

fluff ruffled shirts

and we looked in the window and we were stunned

we saw this mannequin

and the mannequin was wearing a searsucker

blue and white stripe suit

three piece I believe

navy blue or dark blue shirt

the white collar

a yellow knit tie

and kind of a white leather slip ons

and not only was the costume right

but the face was right

the hair on the mannequin was right

the mustache was right

in fact the mustache was a fraction of an inch shorter

on one side than the other

and we looked at him

we looked at each other that's him

that's him even the hair is him

that's what we did I'll tell you boy

hi Eliza good seeing you Gerala good seeing you Jerry

don't get up

ah boy I tell you

every time you come back from a tour

I don't know what it is

but there must be something in the air

or the tour really becomes you

it's like you become rejuvenated

I don't know what it is

isn't that so everybody

you have to see

it came out of that part of the world

at that time

in New York

was show business

but it wasn't necessarily the successful show business

it was just show business

because you had no other choice

you you wouldn't get out of it

you always looking for

you know the big break

and it didn't come

maybe you know

and for us it was

it came out of the very

how should I put it

it came out of

the actual environment that the film takes place in

that the story takes place in

so it wasn't something imposed on the environment