Original subtitles

NARRATOR: Previously on D.B. Cooper: Case Closed?...

When he got on a plane in Portland, Oregon, last night,

he was just another passenger

who gave his name as D.A. Cooper.

NARRATOR: It is one of the most audacious crimes

in American history.

CRONKITE: The description on one wire service:

master criminal.

NARRATOR: Thanksgiving Eve, 1971.

A man in a suit and tie and armed with a bomb

skyjacks a 727,

gets $200,000 in ransom,

and parachutes into the night somewhere between Seattle

-and Reno. -JENSEN: This guy was on our radar.

He was part of our lives for five hours.

And we're still talking about him today.

NARRATOR: For over four decades,

there have been thousands of leads and suspects,

but zero arrests.

KAYE: In 40 years,

they've never come up with a body.

Well, he either got away

or else he sure made a big hole in the ground up there.

We, as skydivers, knew that was a very survivable jump.

NARRATOR: Now, two journalists, Tom Colbert and Jim Forbes,

are revealing the details of a theory

Colbert has spent thousands of dollars

of his own money building.

COLBERT: We have now 36 members on a cold case team.

It's like running your own police department.

NARRATOR: Colbert and Forbes believe they found D.B. Cooper,

-Perfect. -and he's alive.

Tom believes to his core that he's got D.B. Cooper.

COLBERT: I'm not wrong. This is him.

I actually took it to the FBI already,

in 2012, when we had 33 pieces of evidence.

But they said they couldn't get involved.

They had other priorities.

NARRATOR: Now the men say they have 93 pieces

of circumstantial evidence, and that they want

to go back to the FBI.

Okay, convince us.

NARRATOR: So History has brought in

former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and crime journalist Billy Jensen

to pressure test their Colbert-Forbes theory.

FUENTES: If you form a theory in an investigation too early,

then you subconsciously

are trying to prove yourself correct.

NARRATOR: On day one of their presentation,

Colbert and Forbes revealed the name of the man

at the center of their theory.

Robert Wesley Rackstraw.

NEWSMAN: Your background suggests that you

could've been D.B. Cooper.

Could've been. Could've been.

NARRATOR: A one-time suspect

in the FBI's investigation of the Cooper case,

Rackstraw had extensive military experience

during the Vietnam War.

RAY: He, uh, went to infantry jump school,

demolition school, Special Forces Ops,

survival skills, Psy Ops.

REPORTER: Some people say it adds up.

Oh, certainly.

Rackstraw was forced to resign his commission

because he had falsified his background.

To us, that was the motive.

In addition to his military records, Don pulled

a photo taken 14 months before the hijacking.

We do not know if these photos were pulled by the FBI

when he was investigated in the '70s.

JENSEN: They have a specific suspect in mind,

and this could be just one giant rabbit hole

that these two gentlemen have gone down.

NARRATOR: Tonight, the rest of the Colbert-Forbes theory

-is revealed... -FORBES: Here's an element.

It is so far-fetched, it-it's crazy,

and it's the biggest leap of faith,

but if we can bring this home, then we've got a hell of a case.

NARRATOR: ...and interrogated.

Are one of those 93 pieces of evidence

money or the parachute?

NARRATOR: Plus, they finally face the man they believe

is D.B. Cooper.

Bob, it's Jim Forbes.

I've got some easy questions.

NARRATOR: Then, a key witness

who hasn't spoken in 45 years

agrees to one final interview.

JENSEN: Have you ever seen this guy's picture?

Or does he look like this could've been

the guy that you were sitting next to?

NARRATOR: And the FBI sits down to talk.

We're about to make a transition--

an official transition-- in the case.

NARRATOR: And the D.B. Cooper case,

the only unsolved skyjacking in American history,

takes a surprising turn.

So, during the course of our investigation, we sit down

with the half-sister of Robert Rackstraw, Linda LoDuca.

We didn't know the extent at the time--

we did know she was ill, but we didn't know how gravely,

and, in fact, she passed away only weeks later.

It's the only interview she ever gave.

She filled in the timeframe of when he got in trouble,

and that was in the late '70s,

when the FBI first approached her.

LODUCA: When the FBI asked me, did I know

where Bob was Thanksgiving Day, 1971?

[chuckles] I said,

"Well, you know, I really don't."

And, you know, "Why?" And he told me,

you know, did I know about D.B. Cooper?

So that was the first reference

to Bob and D.B. Cooper that I had heard.

Does the FBI come back and again question you

about D.B. Cooper?

Um, no, they don't.

Um, not, no.

I-I don't think I ever heard from them

about D.B. Cooper again.

-FORBES: Ever again? Just that one contact? -Yeah.

And did you discuss that with family or friends?

-Oh, yeah. -And what did they think?

They thought it funny. I mean, D.B. Cooper was almost

a, uh, I won't say idol,

but people are, "Hey, he got away with it."

-He's a folk hero. -Yeah, a folk hero, exactly.

"Oh, you think your brother might be him?"

You know, that's when, that's when conversations started,

could Bob be it?

Did anybody think he could be it?

Um...

A lot of my friends didn't know him that well.

They met him, but they didn't know him real well.

But, you know, when I described, you know, his Army background

and his capabilities, hey, yeah.

That's exactly what you need.

She also filled us in on their skydiving uncle,

Ed Cooper, who very well may have been

the inspiration for Dan Cooper.

FORBES: Who is Ed Cooper?

He's our uncle.

He's married to my mom's sister.

He was marr... our uncle by marriage.

FORBES: Did you know anything about him being a parachutist?

LODUCA: Yeah, that's all he talked about. He loved it.

-That's all who talked about? -Uncle Ed.

With who?

The family. Us. As we were sitting there.

-FORBES: Was Bob there? -Oh, yeah.

Uncle Ed, he was a really nice guy.

JENSEN: Okay.

So that's where the last name came from.

Where did the "Dan" come from?

No idea.

COLBERT: No one knows.

She also, at the time, thought is was a lark.

That there was no way in the world

that he could've possibly been D.B. Cooper.

And when she sat down,

uh, her opinion changed dramatically

as to whether he could possibly be D.B. Cooper.

Even though he didn't let on initially

as to why he wasn't in the Army, you did learn he was angry.

Um, I learned from the FBI agent, actually.

He, uh, the one that came to me and told me,

was asking me about, you know, where Bob was.

And he told me he read, um,

a letter Bob had sent to the Army

after he had been discharged, and it was an angry letter.

He was angry in that letter.

Before, he was gung ho Army.

Now he wasn't so gung ho Army anymore.

Military, government.

With that in mind, does it make sense to you

that a bitter Bob Rackstraw, booted from the Army,

five months later, could've hijacked that plane

-and posed as D.B. Cooper? -That would be...

That would be the reason I would've thought he did it.

JENSEN: It's definitely something that fits,

that this guy, with all the training that he was doing,

it seemed like he wanted to be a career soldier,

and they took it away from him like that.

FORBES: In a quick reset, as you recall,

uh, Rackstraw is booted from the Army, June 21, 1971.

We've already established he clearly had the means.

We think he had the motive by being thrown into the street.

So, the next part of our story

is gonna take us to Astoria, Oregon.

Astoria is only 56 miles

from what is believed to be the D.B. Cooper drop zone.

We believe that Robert Rackstraw spent months after his discharge

in the Oregon area.

We believe he was flying a small plane,

scouting the drop zone, and he assumed

a false identity.

So here's an element,

it is so far-fetched, it's crazy.

And it's the biggest leap of faith, but if we can

bring this home, then we got a hell of a case.

So we discovered that in the summer of 1971,

this mysterious man shows up in Astoria.

Supposed Swiss baron by the name of Norman De Winter.

This is less than a month after Bob Rackstraw is booted

from the Army.

COLBERT: Several of the people

that knew Norman De Winter were told

that he had a small plane.

Now, Pete Roscoe, who grew up in town,

had lived there his whole life,

he was 24 on the night of the hijacking.

He always felt this character could be D.B. Cooper.

ROSCOE: You know, I remember

around Thanksgiving of 1971,

after D.B. Cooper had...

done his thing aboard the plane,

I was sitting in a tavern here in Astoria.

And I see the sketch on TV, and I said,

"That's that guy that was here this summer.

That was Norman De Winter."

Why nobody else thought this guy was D.B. Cooper, I have no idea.

It seemed obvious to me.

But I didn't pursue it.

I dismissed it in my mind as,

"You know the FBI's gonna catch him.

They don't need my help."

That never happened,

but I think I know where D.B. Cooper was

before he hijacked the plane,

and that's always been a part of this story

that has sort of been ignored by the press.

FORBES: So, when we heard this theory,

Tom and I said, "We got to go up there and investigate."

And Pete Roscoe introduced us to a few people

who said they absolutely remember Norman De Winter.

ROSCOE: There was a guy in Astoria

-named Norman De Winter. -That's right. That's right.

I was the priest, and he came in and introduced himself to me,

and he said, "I'm from Switzerland.

"And I want to come to Astoria, uh, a rural community,

"and I'd like to live here for a while

and get to know the people."

My recollection is

that, uh, he asked to stay in my apartment.

'Cause he was looking for a place to live.

I think he stayed at several people's places.

-MAN: Yeah, yeah. -It was strange.

SODERBERG: Mostly what I recall is that

we had quite a bit of conversation about flying.

And Norman said he had a private plane.

A number of members of the community

were invited to fly free of charge

on a chartered jet to Switzerland.

SODERBERG: When we started to talk

about his desire to charter an aircraft

to take all of us to Switzerland,

then our friend, who, um, was an airline employee,

offered to check with her company to see

if this could be arranged, and then,

the airline's executives explained

that there wasn't a Baron Norman De Winter

that... and that they could find

in Switzerland.

ROSCOE: Isn't that about the time the guy disappeared?

Yes. He disappeared.

And then Norman disappeared.

He was gone, and all of a sudden, we said,

"We've been took."

And nobody got the free trip to Switzerland.

-JENSEN: Did they confront him? -COLBERT: When they got wind

that he wasn't who he was-- Pete explained it to me--

the word got around town real quick.

And he just disappeared.

COLBERT: They never caught up with him.

So once again, Rackstraw booted in June.

De Winter appears in Astoria in July.

Just about the time Norman De Winter

disappears from Astoria, Rackstraw reappears

at the family home in Valley Springs.

Rackstraw tells his sister Linda

that he wants to take his two eldest children--

through his first wife Pam-- down to Disneyland.

Bob's sister Linda described the Disneyland trip.

But he would disappear for a while, and then he'd pop up.

You know, he'd pop-- when he--

One of the times he'd popped up was when he asked me,

he said he wanted to take his kids to Disneyland.

And that was in October of '71?

LODUCA: I believe it was October.

-Yeah. -When he was discharged

in July of '71,

did you see him right away, do you know?

-Do you have any recollection? -I don't think I did.

I think he disappeared for a while and then popped up again.

FORBES: When he came home to take his children to Disneyland,

was that the first time you recall seeing him?

LODUCA: It is.

Linda gave us over 50 photos,

and two of them were pictures at Disneyland.

That is Bob with his daughters.

Linda went with him.

This is the long hair look.

This is, uh, as we said, late September, early October.

After the Disneyland trip,

Robert Rackstraw disappears again.

Back up north, who reappears?

Norman De Winter.

These kids that Norman De Winter

had been drinking with all summer

went off to college in the fall, unaware that the De Winter fraud

had been discovered.

Norman De Winter joined them in the college town

of Corvallis, Oregon.

COLBERT: Two college students, Gayle Downing and Fred Jaross,

met Norman at a party.

That evening, we'd decided to put on an impromptu

little party, and, knowing that Thanksgiving was coming,

grabbed the guys before they were all, sort of,

sky bursting out of there, and, you know, probably half a dozen

to nine or ten football players came in and the party went on,

and everybody went home.

Got up the next morning,

and there is this fella sleeping on the couch.

And no idea who he was or where he came from,

other than that we figured that he had come in

with the football guys.

I just saw him as sort of an eccentric, odd kind of guy.

But back in the early '70s, I mean,

there was a lot of odd people floating around,

and this guy just sort of fit into the bunch.

And so he spent, you know, the better part

of four or five days with us.

Probably either a Tuesday or a Wednesday morning,

we got up and Norman was gone.

Sort of disappeared like he appeared.

So he didn't make it to Thanksgiving dinner?

No, no, he was, he was gone probably the morning prior.

Which would have been a Wednesday.

So he's saying the Friday before Thanksgiving,

Friday before the eve of Thanksgiving

when the hijacking occurs, that that Friday,

he shows up at the party and then doesn't leave,

and stays on their couch until Monday or Tuesday

or Wednesday the next week.

The question, was he still with you on Thanksgiving,

and he said no, it was, I think, the morning before.

So that's why we have him, we believe, in Corvallis,

Norman, until November the 23rd, the day before Thanksgiving.

We know in the afternoon of Wednesday, November 23rd,

at Portland Airport, two hours drive away,

Dan Cooper boards Flight 305.

FUENTES: Okay, since that's the day of the hijacking,

do they say what he was wearing while he was with them,

or did he have luggage where the black suit and tie

might have come from?

COLBERT: We don't have anything on luggage.

We have nothing about what he brought in.

I mean, he literally came in for a party.

I'd imagine if he had a suitcase they would have noticed that.

But he didn't describe himself as a baron

-or anything like that? -FORBES: No.

In fact, he didn't say he was Swiss or a baron.

But he did say his name was Norman De Winter?

-Yes, they... -COLBERT: No, Norman.

-Norman. -Just Norman.

He just said Norman to everyone.

Gayle's memory of Norman De Winter

is particularly telling,

and she has not forgotten him to this day.

I was invited to the party.

I didn't really want to go, but I came.

JAROSS: I had broken up with Gayle.

DOWNING: When he made the breakup, I was very upset.

But I met Norm, and he spent almost an hour visiting with me.

He was just very charming, very polite, very good listener.

Asked a lot of questions about me.

Didn't talk about himself hardly at all.

You know, people come into your life,

and you'll never forget them.

And it's just how you interact with them

for one minute or one hour.

And, for me, at 21, he really was the most charming,

polite person that I had ever met.

-Including you. -[both laugh]

You're trying to say that this guy's gonna pull off

the caper of a lifetime, and he decides to take on

this flamboyant character of Norman De Winter,

and is the talk of the town?

Why would anybody do that?

COLBERT: He was trained in undercover work

with the Green Berets and in Vietnam.

And being in a character was one thing

they were trained to do.

That's true, but when he's in Vietnam,

he's not trying to be an undercover

Vietnamese rice farmer.

So what he's doing is secret,

and it's undercover in that sense,

but that's not the same as being an undercover operative,

where you're embedded into a town, trying to fit in,

trying to use that as a cover.

FORBES: Want you to see the people

who remember Norman De Winter,

and you should see their reaction when we showed them

pictures and video of Robert Rackstraw.

JENSEN: You're trying to say that this guy's gonna pull off

the caper of a lifetime,

and he decides to take on this flamboyant character

of Norman De Winter, and is the talk of the town?

Why would anybody do that?

I'm saying it's plausible, okay? But don't take our word for it.

NARRATOR: Newsmen Jim Forbes and Tom Colbert

are deep into their presentation of their theory

that onetime D.B. Cooper suspect Robert Rackstraw

may be the infamous skyjacker.

The men want to present their case to the FBI.

But first, they have to convince

former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and crime journalist Billy Jensen.

Among other assertions, they say Rackstraw posed

as a Swiss baron named Norman De Winter

in the days leading up to the Cooper hijacking.

Want you to see the people who remember Norman De Winter,

and you should see their reaction when we showed them

pictures and video of Robert Rackstraw.

FORBES: So what we're looking at:

a picture taken about 18 months prior to the hijacking.

-Right there. -Yeah. Look at that.

FORBES: That feels familiar to you?

MATTINGLY: A little bit, yeah.

SODERBERG: I'm not a hundred percent sure,

but it's a familiar face to me.

My reaction is that's not him.

FORBES: That's October '71.

The last month and a half.

Prior to the hijacking.

-Okay. -Wow.

MATTINGLY: Now, I got excited when I see this picture.

SODERBERG: Oh.

That's more like it.

DOWNING: That does look like him.

JAROSS: Yeah, that would be the guy.

-At least as I remember. -Yep.

I don't know.

INTERVIEWER: Are you willing to state, one way or the other,

whether or not you're D.B. Cooper?

I'm afraid of heights.

His gestures and then his way of talking there

I would say is very much what I remember.

The eyes, the way he would close his eyes and open his eyes,

brought back a memory for me.

The shape of the face is correct.

And look at those eyes. Eyes are the same.

Norm had nice eyes.

-Kind of resonates. -It does.

FORBES: This could have been the guy who spent

-three nights in your apartment? -MATTINGLY: Yes.

PALMBERG: I would be hard put to say

definitely that is the person we knew as Norman De Winter.

That possibly could be the person that was here in Astoria.

That really, really looks like the guy that I remember.

To recap our Norman De Winter, Robert Rackstraw timeline.

Less than a month after Robert Rackstraw

is booted from the Army, this character named Norman De Winter

pops up in Astoria, Oregon.

He's there until late September, when he suddenly disappears,

never seen in that town again.

Suddenly, Rackstraw pops up in Northern California,

picking up his sister and his kids to head to Disneyland.

When the trip's done, he vanishes.

FORBES: And then Norman De Winter

pops up in Corvallis, Oregon.

That's only 95 nautical miles from Portland.

And he's there until the day before the hijacking.

Never seen or heard from anywhere again.

Then a third character pops up.

His name is Dan Cooper.

He's getting on a plane in Portland, heading to Seattle.

Okay, yeah.

I think that the Astoria story, to me,

in the building blocks of this case,

it's an interesting parallel, but...

it doesn't require Rackstraw to be De Winter

for Rackstraw to be D.B. Cooper.

JENSEN: You can see the look on Tom's face, you know.

And I don't want to kill this guy's dream of having

Rackstraw be De Winter be Cooper.

But I just don't buy it. I don't buy it.

I think he was just a con man that was just going through.

We know that after the hijacking,

Rackstraw was living in Northern California.

And we know that, in '73, he starts working

for a flooring company out of San Francisco.

It's a job that takes him everywhere,

and he's working with Pudgy Hunt and Dick Briggs.

FORBES: These are the guys, back in the beginning of our story,

that connected Briggs to the money find.

So you're trying to say that just two years after

he pulls off the crime of the century, bags $200,000,

that two years later, he's breaking his back

laying gym floor?

FORBES: I'll go with that.

Our theory on motive is that it had nothing to do with money.

That the money was... secondary.

In our theory, this is still a "stick it to the man,"

"you did me wrong, and I'm gonna do you right."

-How you doing? Billy Jensen. -Jack Immendorf. How are you?

COLBERT: The next part of my investigation

is where Rackstraw officially becomes a D.B. Cooper suspect.

Jack Immendorf has been a private investigator

for over 40 years.

He is a member of our cold case team,

and he's gonna help tell the rest of the story.

We learn, in 1977, that Rackstraw

has been investigated for check fraud.

Allegedly writing and cashing checks

from his company he had with his stepfather.

Eventually, it totaled $75,000,

from three banks in two counties.

FORBES: Investigators in two counties,

San Joaquin and Calaveras, are starting to look at this,

and by December of 1977,

they go to serve a search warrant at the Rackstraw house.

When police come to arrest him, he's gone.

They come to arrest him for check fraud,

and they find out he has 150 pounds of explosives.

But nobody knows where he is.

So the D.A. adds to the check fraud

a charge of illegal possession of explosives.

Just about this time is when Jack starts honing in

a little more on Rackstraw's whereabouts.

When Bob disappeared, one of the people we talked to

recalled Bob bragging about some type of opportunities

with helicopters in the Middle East,

and it didn't take a scientist to figure out

the only helicopter operations in the Middle East

were in Iran, and it was with Bell Helicopter.

NARRATOR: In the 1970s,

the Shah of Iran was building what would become

the third largest helicopter fleet in the world.

Bell Helicopter was their primary supplier.

They owned and operated a factory

where thousands of American workers

and contractors were employed.

When the Shah was overthrown by the Islamic Revolution

in 1979, the Americans were expelled.

FORBES: The FBI went out and got a felony fugitive warrant

against Rackstraw.

Bell forced Rackstraw out of Tehran,

and his plane had a stopover in Paris,

and when he stops over, two FBI agents

board the plane because there's a warrant for his arrest,

and then, the second they touch down at JFK,

he's arrested by the FBI.

I've never been able to wrap my head around the fact

that the FBI got so involved in bringing him back from Iran

on these petty state charges.

Why would they go to that degree

if they weren't, at the core of it, really interested in him

as possibly being D.B. Cooper?

The way that normally would work is,

if the local authorities bring charges against somebody,

and there's reason to believe that person

has fled the jurisdiction,

then the local authorities go to the FBI

and request an unlawful flight to avoid prosecution warrant,

UFAP warrant.

All of that legal procedure to get him out of Iran

was based on the California state charges,

not in any way connected to Cooper at the time.

FORBES: Right, but aren't those pretty penny-ante charges

for the FBI to be going to that extent?

Putting agents on the plane with him

and flying him from Paris to JFK,

that would indicate that they've already got

a little more serious of an interest in him.

So, yes, I would agree with you,

it does sound like, at this point,

they're going above and beyond the normal call of duty

for checks and explosives.

There must be more to this.

-Yeah. -Right.

FORBES: Back in, uh,

early '78, thanks to Jack Immendorf,

State Department, FBI collaborate,

go to extreme measures, it seems,

to bring back Rackstraw from Iran for what are essentially

penny-ante charges

NARRATOR: Investigative journalists

Tom Colbert and Jim Forbes are presenting

their theory that onetime D.B. Cooper suspect,

Robert Rackstraw, may be the infamous skyjacker.

In the four years since meeting with the FBI,

Colbert says that he and his team have nearly tripled

the amount of circumstantial evidence,

and he's hoping that he will be able to convince

former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and veteran crime reporter Billy Jensen

to bring his new findings back to the FBI.

FORBES: But here's where we're gonna take one of the most

bizarre twists of the entire case.

He's going down to San Joaquin County

to face charges on bank fraud

and illegal explosives.

He's due in court the next day,

so what he does is he goes down to the airport in Stockton,

leases a plane, puts his sister on as next of kin

for in case anything happens...

-Let me stop you right there. -Sure.

He's allowed to lease a plane while he's out on bail?

-COLBERT: Mm-hmm. -FORBES: Yeah, he had a pilot's license.

-Yeah, has a pilot's license. -Hadn't been revoked.

Hasn't been convicted of anything.

Mm-hmm. Okay.

Jack is driving down the coast, and you hear a news report.

We're driving back from San Jose,

listening to the radio, and all of a sudden,

we hear a bulletin regarding a plane on fire,

a mayday,

and the pilot indicating that he may have to ditch.

And then I was absolutely blown away.

The pilot, Robert Wesley Rackstraw.

It's like, "Son of a bitch!

He's gonna disappear again."

-[chuckles] -I couldn't believe it.

Now, did they do any kind of, uh...

uh, research and recovery or anything like that?

There was a massive search in the crash site.

There were five planes, three Coast Guard ships,

12 miles out all the way to dusk.

Nothing-- no body, no wreckage.

FORBES: And absolutely no one,

including Jack, buys it. No one.

Just like that, out of the blue, bang, he's gone again.

We think he ran because the FBI was closing in on him

as a Cooper skyjacking suspect.

COLBERT: I truly feel that the reason he was out

was to set up what happened along the Columbia River.

We have him, about December of '78,

there during his fugitive run.

Now, what was happening right after that?

We have Briggs telling his runners, "I'm D.B. Cooper."

I think he gave him the money.

And then after that, 14 months later,

that money is found on the shore.

JENSEN: So Tom Colbert's theory is that Rackstraw

gave the money to Briggs,

Briggs arranged with Dwayne Ingram

to find the money

so everyone would think that D.B. Cooper was dead,

and thus Rackstraw couldn't be D.B. Cooper.

That's some theory.

So he wasn't gone really that long this time.

It was about three months.

He's found 300 miles to the south in Fullerton, California,

assuming a fake name.

The plane is at a now defunct, privately-run airport

in Huntington Beach called Meadowlark Airport.

Uh, he had repainted it, puts tape over the tail number,

adds a new tail number, and then,

on the I.D. on the dash, does the same thing.

Then he's apprehended,

brought back up north to face trial.

And so now he's facing not only check fraud

and illegal possession of explosives,

but also, oh, he stole a plane.

JENSEN: I'm here to find out who D.B. Cooper is.

I'm not here to find out how bad this guy is.

I don't need to hear about the check frauds

and all this other things; I want to hear more

about the hijacking.

COLBERT: The FBI quietly investigated Rackstraw

for a year, but for the first time, it goes national.

FORBES: And that's when he gives this strange interview.

NEWSMAN: Today at the San Joaquin County Courthouse,

this 35-year-old man, Robert Rackstraw,

made a brief court appearance

on charges of stealing an airplane

and stockpiling explosives.

Rackstraw is being kept in solitary confinement

partly because the FBI still believes

he may be D.B. Cooper,

the skyjacker who parachuted out of a 727 over Oregon

with $200,000 in 1971.

You think it's legit that you could be one of the suspects,

one of the thousand?

Oh, yes. If I was an investigator, definitely so.

I wouldn't discount myself.

I wouldn't, no.

Or a person like myself.

Were you in the Washington area at that time?

I've been in the Washington area a number of times.

The FBI's verified all that.

That's one of the reasons they keep hounding me.

Well, I've been told that they've spent something like

$3.5 million-- that's including this D.B. Cooper business.

Some $160,000 between these two counties

to try and make me a criminal, and they haven't succeeded yet.

He received three years for check fraud.

He plead no contest to the other charges.

He was given, with time served, two years.

He only served one.

He gets out in the summer of 1980.

He gets two years probation.

Once that's over, he hits the books.

He gets a degree from San Francisco University

in business; he gets a law degree at another school.

He winds up being an arbitration expert.

In fact, he starts teaching arbitration

at UC Riverside for ten years.

Two of the years becoming head of the legal department.

I can't find any serious trouble

that this guy's been in from then till now.

FORBES: Somewhere along this time,

and we're not sure exactly why,

the FBI seems to lose interest in Robert Rackstraw

as a Cooper suspect.

FUENTES: Well, the policy, you know,

is in existence-- it's not just an FBI policy,

it's also the U.S. Attorney's office

and the Department of Justice-- on how much of a pending case

is allowed to be revealed to the public.

And many people contact the FBI

and ask for their identity to be protected.

FORBES: From the beginning, we mentioned that

Tom began assembling this great cold case team

back when he started four and a half years ago.

It's very extensive, it's widely varied,

but we wanted to bring a couple of the members here today

to speak with you directly, answer your questions,

and illuminate a little further some of the evidence

that we've uncovered.

So, first is Jack Trimarco, former FBI.

Uh, Jeff Renz, who is

a law professor at the University of Montana.

Most recent member of the cold case team is Dr. Kris Mohandie,

and Kris is a forensic criminal psychologist.

And I think you're gonna find this really illuminating,

some of the information they have to share with us.

We met Bill Mitchell,

who was a key witness for the FBI

in the first three years.

Sat across from Cooper.

We showed him a lineup of six photos,

and one of them was Rackstraw.

A member of our cold case team, John Bocciolatt,

conducted that test.

I'm gonna show you some photographs.

They're gonna just be displayed in

what we call a six-pack window display.

The suspect may or may not be in the package.

If you see the suspect in there, would you point to the suspect?

Well... [chuckles]

That's Richard McCoy.

NARRATOR: The name Richard McCoy

is synonymous with the D.B. Cooper case.

McCoy became a suspect in 1972

when, five months after Cooper, he skyjacked a 727,

then parachuted out with $500,000 in ransom.

McCoy was later caught

and eventually killed in a shootout with the FBI.

But the Bureau was never able to conclusively link him

to the Cooper skyjacking.

MITCHELL: It's just incredibly hard

to remember 44 years ago.

BOCCIOLATT: So let me ask you,

if you pointed to this person

-and it's Richard McCoy... -I did.

...on a scale of one to ten, ten absolutely being

what you remember as Richard McCoy,

and one not being anybody related to Richard McCoy,

what number would you put on that?

MITCHELL: Looks like Richard McCoy,

and so I would probably give that six or seven... six.

You know, none of them strike me as...

D.B. Cooper.

I mean, I... [stammers]

I don't remember.

I-I can't do it.

-Thank you very much. -Sure.

You know, when you lay out six photos,

you make a comparative analysis.

Now, what was interesting about this is he just went boom.

I agree that the fact he went

straight to that photo has significance.

-As an investigative lead? -Yes. Exactly.

-Exactly. -I agree with that.

Not as an evidentiary matter that you can introduce.

An evidentiary issue is a different one. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

FUENTES: The photo array is very questionable at best.

You know, to me, I could see where somebody could make

a misidentification very easy.

In this case, you have Billy Mitchell

paying more attention to the flight attendants

than the old man sitting in the seat.

It's kind of like, yeah, yeah, no, what's with him?

And how good of a view...

Did he ever have a full facial view

of Cooper sitting over there?

MOHANDIE: Rackstraw's Army photo,

compared to the McCoy photos,

they don't look anything alike, in my opinion.

There was so much emotional arousal

associated with what happened

when that initial information was encoded into memory.

And it conjures up a visceral reaction years later.

It's like a key that unlocks a door

that goes to the room

where he houses his prototypes for skyjackers.

So his hijacker prototype is D.B. Cooper.

He confuses it with McCoy, mistakenly,

but really he's pointing out D.B. Cooper.

That's somebody he recognizes.

FUENTES: Now the question is-- like there is with so many other

eyewitness accounts-- would it be accurate?

MOHANDIE: I-I don't think there's a coincidence there.

I think that the psychology of that...

of that response is significant,

and I don't think it was an accident.

JENSEN: Sounds like, hey, there could be something there,

but, uh, listen,

you know, psychologists are always gonna say

there could be something there.

Sometimes a banana's just a banana.

FORBES: At the beginning of this presentation,

we said our D.B. Cooper suspect is still alive.

Now we'd like to show you what happened

when we reached out to our suspect.

NARRATOR: Jim Forbes and Tom Colbert

are in the final hour of their presentation

to former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and veteran crime journalist Billy Jensen.

For the past three days,

they've laid out a theory that they believe shows

that onetime D.B. Cooper suspect

Robert Rackstraw might be the infamous skyjacker.

FORBES: So, in the summer of 2012,

that's when Tom reached out to me,

'cause he wanted me to make the contact with Rackstraw.

Tom wondered if, in fact, he would answer the call,

and I said, "I know he'll answer the call,

"because if he is D.B. Cooper,

"he's gonna want to know what we got,

"and if he's not, he's gonna want to play us

like he played NBC back in 1979."

There was no problem at all.

He immediately got back in touch with me.

We spent, uh, over an hour on the phone.

So when you finally got in touch with him, what did he say?

That I knew that at one time he was a suspect

and quickly exonerated

and I wanted to talk to him about that experience;

I'm sure it was hell on he and his family.

And he said, "Oh, yeah, it was,"

and the conversation rolled on from that point.

And that was the first of several phone calls.

Over time, then, it was clear that,

while he initially agreed to an interview,

he wasn't gonna do one.

I eventually said to Tom, "Look, this story goes nowhere

"until we ask him these questions.

We need to go down and have an encounter with him."

We went down to have a discussion with him

in May of 2013.

COLBERT: Our first approach was me, showing up.

I drove my car right up to his store.

Bob just thinks of me as another client showing up.

I walked up with a big smile, handed him my business card,

and he just... "[Bleep]! It's Tom Colbert!"

You know, he had no idea I was coming.

And I say, "Bob, we know who you are.

"And if you come forward and tell us what you did,

uh, and go on camera, you can tell your story."

He says, "Yeah, I... I... I said I was Cooper,

uh, but I was just pretending."

I said, "You know that Jim Forbes is here, too?"

And he was surprised at that.

And I said, "Jim would love to come by."

And after a little negotiation, Jim showed up.

He'd been out with, uh, a colleague of his,

and they were doing a test run on a boat.

And they pull it into this chain-link fence

on the property.

Bob, it's Jim Forbes.

I've got some easy questions.

FORBES: Time passes, time passes, and eventually,

he just meanders up to the fence,

as though nothing's happening, we're not there,

just ignoring us.

Then I walked up to the fence,

and this is the conversation we had.

Hmm.

FORBES [recorded]: Let me ask you a simple question.

No, you're not gonna ask me any questions.

-Oh, I'm gonna ask you lots of... -I told you.

I'm gonna ask you lots of questions.

-I won't ask any questions... -That's okay.

...and I won't answer any questions.

-That's okay. That's your prerogative. -Attaboy.

Are you the person

-who boarded a flight... -What did I just tell you?

...on November 24, 1971,

identifying yourself as Dan Cooper?

-Maybe I didn't... -Did you hijack a plane

when it was coming out of Seattle toward Reno?

-Did you jump out with... -Maybe I wasn't clear, Jim.

Maybe I wasn't clear.

-Are you that person? -Don't try...

don't try and play you're Dan Rather.

FORBES: Are you D.B. Cooper, yes or no?

I answered your question, Jim.

Bob, we have eyewitnesses that have you in Astoria, Oregon,

from the time of your discharge in 1971

to the time of the hijacking. Were you there?

FUENTES: I think the approach of Rackstraw at the marina,

and the way that was conducted, I just think...

it didn't strike me as being

the best thing to do at that point in time,

uh, to try to do an ambush interview of him.

Now, you see the media sometimes do that.

"No, tell us, what'dou did." You know.

And you see that.

Well, they never get a good answer,

you know, when they do that kind of thing,

but it looks good on the evening news,

that they were all, uh, you know, aggressive

against the subject.

FORBES: Bob, why won't you

just come out and say

that you are not D.B. Cooper?

We'll wait for you.

FORBES: I can't understand

why he would not either

get in my face and say, "Get the hell out of here.

You're crazy, Forbes. I'm not Cooper."

or just say, "You need to leave,"

or "I'm not Cooper," or whatever.

What do you think, Tom?

Well, I think the camera makes all the difference.

I think he's-he's in

a defensive mode to just not let this go anywhere at all.

All right, so what happens next?

So... simple question.

Did you board a Northwest Orient flight

-on November 24, 1971... -What difference does it make?

-...as the name Dan Cooper? -Jim...

Because if you're, if you're D.B. Cooper,

the world would want to know your story, Bob.

Sure they would. So would the FBI,

and the secret indictment in Washington, D.C....

Bob, you're a folk hero.

-Oh, no, no. -You're a folk hero. Nobody cares.

-FORBES: No denial. -Mm-hmm.

"Why not say? You're a folk hero.

Why not let the public know?"

Well, because there's a secret indictment.

That's the first thing he goes to.

NARRATOR: In 1976, five years after the skyjacking,

at the point when the statute of limitations

to prosecute the crime was about to run out,

the FBI secured what is known as a John Doe indictment.

That means that if and when the FBI collars D.B. Cooper,

the U.S. Attorney will be allowed to prosecute

to the full extent of the law.

I think he's trying to, at this point,

just hope you go away

and lose patience and give up and leave.

FUENTES: I think in-in a case where, if you have somebody

that you've been investigating for the number of years

and the amount of effort

that had gone into the Colbert-Forbes investigation,

you wouldn't want to, um, sacrifice it, let's say,

with one attempt at an ambush interview.

What you want to do is give him a reason to talk to you,

not a reason to shout across a fence

that he's not gonna talk to you.

This is our last discussion.

I'll pass. Damn if I...

And I don't remember any of it, you know?

-I'm so old. -FORBES: But that's why

we should sit and talk, Bob.

-Old and feeble. -One last question.

[engine starts]

Did you board that Northwest flight

and hijack it for $200,000?

I've never been on a Northwest flight.

Why are you so evasive

about what should be a simple thing to say no?

Because you guys make such a big deal out of it.

FORBES: It would've been...

Why would you call NBC News when you were in jail?

You know, you asked me that before,

and honest to God, I don't remember any of that.

FORBES: Why did you...

-I got to go. -Why did you steal an airplane

to avoid... facing...

RACKSTRAW: The attorney will be calling you.

FORBES: Thank you.

COLBERT: I get a response six days later,

and this is a very short note from the attorney.

"Here is my client's response to your offer.

"Now we will consider a real offer,

"if they provide virtually every piece of data

"and information that they have acquired

"in the past years, as they claim,

subject to our review of same."

That was his comment.

And that's where we left it.

So that's our case.

JENSEN: Colbert says he has 93 pieces of evidence.

But all this evidence is within the story

that we're hearing right now.

And very little about this story is about D.B. Cooper.

All we're hearing are details

about this specific gentleman named Rackstraw.

FORBES: And this isn't, you know,

tied up in a nice little knot for us.

Yeah, we're digging every day,

we're coming up with new information every day.

COLBERT: We think we're ready,

and we'd like to go back to the FBI,

and we hope you guys can help us do that.

I think Rackstraw's very compelling,

and we certainly have a lot of questions

from our investigation of

all the other suspects that we've looked at.

FUENTES: We don't know why the FBI stopped looking at him.

We know that he was a prime suspect in the '70s,

and we know now that you went back to them

just a few years ago,

but it doesn't tell us why they stopped looking at him

or didn't prosecute him.

Yes, based on this presentation, we will go to the FBI

and ask why they stopped working on Rackstraw.

Now, they may not give that up,

but it would be great to learn that.

-COLBERT: It would. It would. -FORBES: Thank you.

Thank you.

Appreciate it, guys, more than you know.

FUENTES: We'll be in touch soon.

Excellent. Thanks, Tom.

-Appreciate it. -COLBERT: Thank you.

FUENTES: It is a very compelling story.

And if you were personally involved in this investigation

for several years, like they have been,

I could see where they would be completely convinced.

JENSEN: He's a viable suspect,

even though I did have a couple of issues.

There are so many coincidental and circumstantial events

that prove that he could be,

but to go so far as to say, "It's him,"

uh, you know, I'm not ready to make that jump.

FORBES [over phone]:So good luck, have fun and, uh,

we look forward to seeing you in L.A.

-JENSEN: Thank you. -FUENTES: Thanks, guys. -Bye, guys.

[phone beeps]

FORBES: I wish I was going on that trip.

I bet you do.

You know, I truly feel

what would be the best thing to happen for me

is closure for Tina.

NARRATOR: After spending the last three days

presenting a D.B. Cooper theory

that he spent five years working on,

journalist Tom Colbert

and his partner, fellow journalist Jim Forbes,

are still thinking about

the one interview they couldn't get.

So you want to talk to Tina.

I wish we could talk to Tina, but I think she's made it clear

she won't talk if she believes he could be out there.

NARRATOR: "Tina" is Tina Mucklow,

the flight attendant who spent the most time with D.B. Cooper.

I would love to convince her we have identified the man,

he's being watched, tell us your story.

That would be incredible.

And bring her closure.

'Cause... 'cause everybody says it's a victimless crime.

Uh-uh. I think of Tina, I think of the pilots,

I think of everyone else.

But if our telling this story

brings her peace, boy, that would be incredible.

NARRATOR: While Colbert and Forbes stay back in L.A.,

former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and veteran crime journalist Billy Jensen

are headed north to Seattle

where they have set a meeting with Curtis Eng,

the agent in charge of the D.B. Cooper skyjacking case.

JENSEN: The things that I would like to know right now--

I want to know about, you know, this character Rackstraw,

and whether he was eliminated and why he was eliminated.

I want to know about the eight cigarette butts that were

left on the plane by D.B. Cooper.

Those are the questions that I want to know.

NARRATOR: Fuentes and Jensen

will seek answers for Tom Colbert and Jim Forbes,

answers to whether or not the FBI

would reconsider Colbert's and Forbes's theory

that onetime D.B. Cooper suspect Robert W. Rackstraw

may be the infamous skyjacker.

-[line beeps] -Hi, Bob.

This is Billy Jensen. I'm an investigator.

I just heard a pretty interesting story about you.

If you could, give me a call back, uh,

'cause I'd love to talk to you about some things.

Bye-bye.

JENSEN: It'd be great to talk to Rackstraw.

He's a Cooper suspect.

And they left a lot on the table

when they went to talk to him the first time.

I'd love to sit down with him

and listen to what he has to say.

NARRATOR: Robert Rackstraw isn't the only person

featured in the Colbert/Forbes presentation for whom

the two investigators have questions.

JENSEN: Hi, Dwayne. This is Billy Jensen.

I'm an investigator looking into the D.B. Cooper case.

How are you today?

Dwayne Ingram and his eight-year-old son

found some of D.B. Cooper's ransom money

along the Columbia River in 1980,

nine years after the skyjacking.

According to Colbert and Forbes, a man named Dick Briggs

allegedly predicted, days before the find,

that Ingram would discover the cash.

Their assertion is that the money was planted

and that Ingram was in on it.

It's a significant claim and a cornerstone

in the foundation of the Colbert/Forbes theory.

Well, we were just showed an interview

from a guy named Jim Forbes who came down to your house

and gave you a line of questioning.

And... suffice to say

that you looked pretty agitated on that interview.

Is there anything to his allegations?

When's the last time that you were up at Tena Bar?

JENSEN: Would you be willing to come down to the river

at Tena Bar and walk the site with us?

Yeah, we'd love to get your take on everything.

Why'd you pick this place for, for a good place to camp?

INGRAM: I had a dog.

So I loaded him up one day after work

and I come over here and worm my way around,

found a way down in here, you know?

And I would run him on this beach.

Up and down, up and down, up and down.

It's a wonder he didn't find the money.

And then once I got down here, I thought, "Wow.

"This is the place to hang out

when you ain't hanging out somewhere else, you know?"

JENSEN: How do you think the money ended up here?

I don't really know.

And it didn't seem normal to me, though...

-Mm-hmm. -...the way it was.

It didn't seem normal at all.

This weren't scattered.

This was all three touching each other

and just rolled up so gingerly.

How deep was it?

Couldn't have been deep,

because he was eight years old.

The little skinny arms about like mine.

He was simply going like that.

He wasn't using a shovel or anything.

-He was just... -Uh-uh.

That was too simple-- you see what I mean?

-Right. -Yeah.

I was asked, "Where's the other 194,000?"

They were happy that you brought the six, you know, $5,800.

And they immediately thought,

"He's got the rest of the money somewhere."

I felt as though they thought that.

Seems to beg the question: Why would you pocket 194,

knowing you couldn't spend it?

I said, "I don't know where your money is." [chuckles]

I was asked, "Where-where do you think Cooper is?"

"How would I know?

"Maybe he's screwed up to his elbows

"on a mountain over there

"still trying to get his parachute open.

How would I know this, you see?"

'Cause I guess you were their first lead

in a long, long time, so...

But, you know, it's a shame when you try

to do something right

and... and everything starts going wrong.

I'd rather not found it at all.

JENSEN: Was Dwayne Ingram complicit in this crime?

Did he plant this?

Uh, it seems really far-fetched to me.

He certainly seems like a guy

that just found some money and was

unwittingly pulled into this crazy caper.

So this is gonna be exciting.

We go into the belly of the beast.

NARRATOR: Billy Jensen and Tom Fuentes

are back in Seattle for their meeting at the FBI.

The D.B. Cooper case falls

under the jurisdiction of this division.

ENG: This is the first time I've...

I've ever spoken to the media about anything in the FBI.

NARRATOR: Special Agent Curtis Eng

has been the lead agent on the case since 2010.

He met with Tom Colbert in 2012,

back when Colbert had just started his investigation

and had 33 pieces of circumstantial evidence--

less than half of what he claims to have now.

Do you remember meeting Tom Colbert?

Yes, he-he came to the Seattle division

a couple years back.

I normally don't meet with people who have suspects,

but, um, in his situation, I made an exception.

Why'd you make an exception for him?

He was referred by another FBI division,

so I gave it its due diligence.

When individuals have come in to provide their theories to me,

I still cannot confirm or deny anything about the case.

I am taking their information,

but I'm not gonna give them any feedback.

It's-it's a one-way street.

If their information they give me is not useful,

I can't really tell them that.

NARRATOR: According to The Privacy Act of 1974,

the FBI is prohibited from publicly disclosing

details of a pending case,

unless those details are stated in an indictment

or become testimony in a legal proceeding.

JENSEN: And what was your impression

of Colbert and his investigation?

Although his presentation was thorough

and it was detailed, it didn't prove

that his suspect was Dan Cooper.

I can't go on nice presentations.

I have to go by evidence.

And that presentation

didn't give me any additional evidence

that I could use to prosecute the case.

There are times when I've concluded

that it's not the individual based on what I already know

and why they were eliminated years before

by my predecessors.

JENSEN: Colbert's entire investigation

is centered around a guy that the FBI has dismissed.

Now, they won't tell us the reasons why they dismissed him,

but as best they can, they are telling us

that Rackstraw is not the guy.

My job as an agent is not to help somebody

confirm their theories.

My job is to bring prosecutable cases

to the Assistant United States Attorney's office.

It is frustrating,

because the suspects that we already have,

the current evidence doesn't really eliminate them,

but it also doesn't prove that they did it, either.

Obviously, in 1971,

there was no, um, uh, forensic DNA.

But when you hear that the guy was a smoker

and that the guy did leave eight cigarette butts on the plane...

Nowadays, there's a protocol we follow

when we gather evidence.

Back then, they didn't have those protocols,

because DNA testing didn't exist.

So the DNA that we have obtained,

there's multiple donors on there.

It's not a complete profile.

So in court, it'd be useless.

They will not prosecute a case unless there's

ample evidence, and, um, in this situation,

in this case, there isn't ample evidence.

JENSEN: For Colbert and Forbes,

unless they have the parachutes or the money,

the FBI is not gonna answer the phone for them.

NARRATOR: As Fuentes and Jensen wrap up

their meeting with Agent Eng, the guys are summoned

by Public Affairs Specialist Ayn Dietrich-Williams.

[door beeps]

DIETRICH-WILLIAMS: We're preparing for a change

in status of the case,

and so for that reason, I'm going to have you talk

to the head of our office, the special agent in charge,

which is very unusual for us.

It's always easier to talk about a case

with a former FBI employee.

They get all the nuances of working the case

and they speak our language, in a way.

NARRATOR: Frank Montoya is the special agent

in charge of the FBI's Seattle division.

MONTOYA: D.B. Cooper-- as Americans, we have a tendency

to-to kind of lionize him.

It's-it's part of our culture.

But the fact of the matter is

the world has changed so much in 45 years.

And the-the nature of the challenges that we're facing,

the threats that we're facing have evolved as well.

And our resources are, frankly, just better served

in-in these other areas.

And so, we're about to make a transition,

an official transition in the case.

So is this case closed?

MONTOYA: The world has changed so much in 45 years.

And the-the nature of the challenges that we're facing,

the threats that we're facing have evolved as well.

And our resources are, frankly,

just better served in-in these other areas.

NARRATOR: Tom Fuentes's and Billy Jensen's meeting

with the FBI takes an unexpected turn

when Frank Montoya, the special agent

in charge of the Seattle division,

reveals he has a major announcement

about the D.B. Cooper case.

We're about to make a transition,

an official transition in the case,

and we'll be putting out a statement, uh,

on our Web site as well as via social media.

It's just this simple. "Following one of the longest

"and most exhaustive investigations in our history,

"the FBI will be redirecting resources

"allocated to the 45-year-old D.B. Cooper case

in order to focus on other investigative priorities."

JENSEN: After 40 years and all these different theories,

you want to find out who did it.

You want to leave no stone unturned.

But the FBI seems like they're at the end of their rope.

So the evidence will be boxed.

It'll be catalog boxed

and shipped back to our headquarters.

The files will also be moved back to our headquarters.

Um, and then we'll be moving on.

So is this case closed?

Administratively, yes.

It's not that we're turning our back on the investigation.

It's one of those things where if something did come up

that was worthy of our, of our,

of additional pursuit, we would absolutely go after it.

What would you consider a worthy lead?

Bottom line would be the money or-or the parachute.

FUENTES: The way the rules work in the federal

criminal justice system, if the United States Attorney's

office says, "We will not prosecute that case,"

then you are to cease and desist investigation.

So if somebody shows up with anything other

really than the parachute or the money,

they're gonna be shown the door?

They'll be thanked for their interest and we'll move on

to the next case.

On behalf of a grateful FBI,

thank you for giving us more information,

but you're gonna have to look at

whether it's credible and whether

-it can lead to the prosecution. -Absolutely.

JENSEN: Wow, this is historic.

This is one of the most famous

unsolved crimes in American history.

After all the millions of words that have been written,

all the theories, all the books,

they're closing this case.

It's pretty incredible.

NARRATOR: While the FBI is essentially shutting the door

on the Colbert/Forbes theory, Fuentes and Jensen are about

to open one that has been closed for 45 years.

With the help of the FBI, Fuentes and Jensen

have secured a meeting

with the one person who spent the most amount of time

with the infamous skyjacker--

the person who last saw him before he jumped into history

and the one person who Colbert and Forbes believe

is the key to confirming their theory.

Hello. [chuckles]

-Hi. -COLBERT: Hi.

NARRATOR: After a 45-year

self-imposed silence about her experience

with D.B. Cooper, flight attendant Tina Mucklow

has agreed to one last interview.

MUCKLOW: And this character I know.

-[laughter] -Tina.

-Hi, Bill. -Good to see you.

NARRATOR: Sitting side-by-side with Tina is Bill Rataczak.

Rataczak was the co-pilot of Flight 305.

He handled communications from the cockpit during the crime

and spoke for the crew in the immediate aftermath.

We felt he...

was assured that we were honoring his requests,

and therefore, we made no attempt

to impede his, uh... the completion of his, uh,

mission, if you will.

NARRATOR: Although Bill Rataczak has declined to speak

about Cooper for more than a decade,

like Tina, he has agreed to this one final interview

to ensure that there's an accurate record

of what happened that night.

RATACZAK: I ain't gonna give no more interviews

and talk about this thing.

It's not that I'm afraid to, I'm just tired of it.

It's 44 years in the making, and it's time to put it to bed.

JENSEN: The most important thing during an investigation

is to get to a first-person source.

So the fact that the FBI is closing this case

makes it that much more important

for us to be able to go and talk to these people

who interacted with him on the plane,

to get their final thoughts about what happened that night,

to talk to the people that had the most time with this man.

What was he like in general?

MUCKLOW: I think, at first, he was very, um,

cautious and careful with the whole crew.

Um, he...

was not a horrible person.

He didn't yell, he didn't scream.

There wasn't unusual behavior.

Um, he didn't seem to have delusional or paranoid

kind of ideation

He had an agenda,

and-and I kind of conveyed that to the cockpit.

And I think it was at that point that he opened the briefcase

and explained.

There were these red cylinders

and, uh, wires running out, and one was already

connected to the battery terminal,

and the other side was not connected.

He explained that

if he connected them to the battery,

that it would complete the circuit

and detonate the bomb.

What feeling was running through you at the time?

The first thought that came to my mind was, uh,

"Okay, bomb.

"Depressurization.

"Okay, what is gonna happen in the cabin?

"What are the people gonna have to deal with?

What am I gonna have to do to take care of the people?"

And then, all of the sudden,

it dawned on me that I was sitting next to him,

and that if there was an explosion,

I was going to be pulled out with him.

MUCKLOW: The first thought

that came to my mind was, uh,

"Okay, bomb.

"Depressurization.

"Okay, what is gonna happen in the cabin?

What am I gonna have to deal with?"

NARRATOR: After decades of remaining silent,

Northwest 305 flight attendant Tina Mucklow

and co-pilot Bill Rataczak are talking

to former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and crime writer Billy Jensen.

I wanted to run, but on a 727,

there isn't any place to run.

NARRATOR: Prompted by the FBI's decision

to administratively close the 45-year-old case,

Rataczak and Mucklow are giving one last interview

about the night their flight from Portland to Seattle

was hijacked by the man known as D.B. Cooper.

MUCKLOW: At that point,

I really just, uh, prayed for the safety of the passengers

and, um, and for the hijacker as well.

NARRATOR: Tina Mucklow was responsible for 36 passengers

on the flight to Seattle,

and because she kept calm, none of them had any idea

that there was a man onboard threatening their lives.

When the 727 touched down in Portland,

Cooper demanded that Tina serve as the go-between

with the authorities charged with meeting his demands.

Tina made four trips to retrieve the $200,000 in ransom money

and four parachutes.

JENSEN: What was it like getting off the plane

and knowing that you had to go back on the plane?

MUCKLOW: It was my job.

Um, and the one thing I do remember,

and I don't know who it was-- whoever handed me the money, um,

said to me, "Are you okay?"

And I said, "Yes, I'll be okay."

And-and I went back on the airplane.

JENSEN: You give it to him. What happens?

RATACZAK: He wanted $200,000 in a knapsack.

The bank put it into a satchel bag.

MUCKLOW: So when he saw the laundry bag,

he was upset.

RATACZAK: I could hear him over the radio.

"I wanted that in a knapsack!"

And so we thought that maybe that

was gonna be the end of it right there,

if he had a death wish.

JENSEN: After you bring him the money,

uh, do you, is that when they say

that people can get off the plane?

MUCKLOW: I know we asked if the passengers

could get off now, um, and he said yes.

RATACZAK: The scene is this:

three pilots in the cockpit,

one hijacker in the back of the airplane,

Tina moving back and forth the airplane,

and the other two flight attendants right outside

the cockpit door.

So I thought that this was a good time

to tell those other two girls

the next time Tina left the airplane

to tell Tina to stay out and they stay out also.

This is crucial,

because if they had gone out of that airplane with Tina,

and they all three had stayed off,

we could've packed our bag,

opened the door and walked down the same stairway they did,

because the only way he would've seen us

is if he'd have gotten on all four

and put his head under to see us up in first class

coming out of the cockpit.

FUENTES: If there is any possibility of leaving Cooper

all to himself, that goes from a hostage situation.

Then it becomes what's identified

as a barricaded subject situation.

And the approach for that is a whole different situation.

They can introduce tear gas.

They can do any number of things.

JENSEN: We might not even be talking about this

45 years later.

D.B. Cooper would've been Dan Cooper.

He'd be rotting in a jail cell,

just a footnote in the annals of American crime.

Andy was monitoring fueling.

Tina's making the trips up,

but she was making her last trip out,

coming back up when Andy told me,

"Bill, the other two girls are still here."

And we knew that it was Tina's last trip.

The co-pilot said,

"You better get the hell out now."

So I left without Tina.

And that's when he decided... to keep her

because he was getting suspicious at everything.

RATACZAK: Scotty said, "What do you think?

"Should we just get out of the airplane

and leave her back there?"

And I told him, "I can't, in good faith,

leave Tina back there alone."

And he said, "Okay.

Andy, what do you think?"

Andy said, "Well, I'm with Bill.

I want to stay, too."

Scotty said, "That's good enough for me."

So we agreed to stay.

And we took off into the darkness.

NARRATOR: Flight 305 headed out of Seattle

bound for Mexico City.

Per Cooper's demands,

the 727 would fly at a low altitude

with the flaps down.

That meant the plane would burn more fuel,

and therefore require a refueling stop.

Reno was the agreed-upon destination.

RATACZAK: He wanted us to fly at 10,000 feet.

We were really only about 5,000 feet above the ground,

because that's where the mountain ranges

were starting to come up.

FUENTES: So you're 10,000 feet above sea level,

but the ground is rising below you.

RATACZAK: That's exactly right, Tom.

And we were flying in the overcast,

and we were getting ice on our wings,

we were getting ice on the cockpit window.

And that will destroy the lift on an airplane,

and all we could think about is that

we're losing our aerodynamics on that wing.

JENSEN: They had a very good chance

of falling out of the sky.

They were flying so low, just 5,000 feet

above the ground, and the ice,

the fog, everything was piling up.

So who knew if the bomb was real, but this ice was real.

Now it was an entirely empty cabin

with just you and him.

I was gonna stay back there and open the back door.

NARRATOR: According to Cooper's demands,

the crew was to lower the 727's aft stairs midflight.

RATACZAK: But we didn't know whether or not

that door opening was gonna cause this air to escape.

We didn't know whether you would be

-sucked out of the airplane. -[bell dings]

So I got on the line, and I said,

"Tina, here's what I want you to do.

"We have escape ropes that are in the overhead."

So I told her that, "We'll cut a piece

"of that rope off, and then I want you to put

"pillows around your stomach, tie that rope

around your stomach, and tie it to one of the legs."

So I told her that we'll have Andy bring a rope back.

You had that phone, and you squeezed it

-so that we could hear what was going on. -Yes.

"No one's coming back here," he said.

"Okay, in that case, Tina, what I want you to do

"is open up one of the parachutes

"and cut some of those nylon cords

"and wrap them around the chair and make that line

only as long as to you to the door."

MUCKLOW: At that point, he had said to me,

"You can go forward."

And I didn't ask any questions.

I just said "thank you" and "good-bye."

Coming through the cockpit door was just an amazing thing.

That was the crew, and I guess,

whether you're thinking real or you're not thinking real,

there's a sense of, "Okay, now it's okay.

I'm safe." You know.

RATACZAK: She did such a marvelous job of being

the middle cog in the wheel of this,

uh, unfortunate incident.

I mean, when she came through that door...

[crying]: ...it was big-time.

Yeah. [chuckles]

That was a long time ago, Bill.

-[laughs] -I know, but, um...

a long time...

My long-term memory isn't quite as bad

as my short-term memory.

And I remember the job you did, Tina.

It was terrific.

She was the key.

JENSEN: I mean, hearing Tina Mucklow

and Bill Rataczak tell the story,

it turns it from a story

that you tell amongst your friends,

that it's a parlor game-- who did this,

who was D.B. Cooper--

and it turns it into a real crime

with real victims and also real heroes.

FUENTES: You were aware,

in your mind, at least, that there's a possibility

he's going to jump out that back stairway.

RATACZAK: Yes.

Well, pretty soon, I got an indication

on the annunciator panel that the aft door is open.

All of a sudden, he's picked up the interphone and he said,

"They can't get the stairs down."

I said, "Well, stand by, just a minute."

So I contacted Paul Soderlind, who was our

Director of Flight Operations, and he said, "Um, Bill,

slow the airplane down to the marked bug."

That's our final approach speed plus five knots.

So we're about 15 knots above the stall speed.

Remember the ice building up on the center?

I was sitting a little bit closer

to the edge of my seat then,

and I think all of us were, because we weren't sure,

we slow this airplane down, now that-that icy condition

taking away the aerodynamics of that wing,

now we're coming down to meet it.

So, uh, we slowed it down, and so I got back on the P.A.,

and I said "All right, we've slowed the airplane down.

"You should be able to open the door now."

And that's the last we heard of him.

[alarm beeping]

We felt this bump in the cabin causing

increased pressure in our ears, and we also saw the indication

on the engineer's panel.

NARRATOR: Weeks later, Northwest flight operations

would conduct tests that confirm that

when the hijacker jumped, it caused the stairs to rebound,

much like a diving board,

sending a pressure wave through the plane.

RATACZAK: I called the air traffic control,

and I said, "You might want to mark this down.

I think our friend just took leave of us."

Now, we think that he has left the airplane,

but we don't know for certain.

We were told that there were going to be FBI agents,

uh, county deputies, sheriffs, local police,

they were gonna be all over the airport.

MUCKLOW: You know, I was one of the first ones off, and, um,

you know, in training, we had always been taught

if you're ever in an emergency procedure,

you stand a safe distance away from the airplane,

but in a place where people can see you.

So, you know, the obvious thing

is to go to one of the runway lights.

So I remember one of the cars pulled up

and said, "Who are you?"

And I said, "Well, I'm one of the crew."

-[laughter] -And we were laughing,

but after I got in the car is when I broke down.

[sighs] And I just sobbed for a couple minutes.

And I think Bill said, "It's okay. It's over now."

So, you haven't done, uh,

interviews in decades, but in your personal life,

do you think about it often?

MUCKLOW: I couldn't tell you

the number of letters and information and mail

and telephone calls and what have you

that I've gotten.

People have felt that I was trying to escape it,

or that I wasn't able to handle it,

or that I was very fragile.

I think I'm just pretty normal.

FUENTES: Tina came in here and very calmly and coolly

explained what she did that day and what she's done since.

And I found her to be totally believable,

very articulate, very sane, very stable,

and a great witness.

MUCKLOW: I think the thing has been

when I've been pressured or almost felt

stalked sometimes by individuals

who just didn't seem to understand no,

um, I've kind of wanted to say to them,

you know, "Get a life."

[chuckles]: You know?

This is 40-some years ago.

NARRATOR: Once Bill and Tina finished telling

their story of the night of the hijacking,

a story they have not told in decades,

Fuentes and Jensen have one more question--

one that may or may not support Tom Colbert's theory

that one-time suspect Robert Rackstraw

could be D.B. Cooper.

JENSEN: Have you ever seen this guy, this picture?

Or does he look like this could've been

the guy that you were sitting next to?

FUENTES: Hey, guys.

NARRATOR: Former FBI Assistant Director Tom Fuentes

and crime writer Billy Jensen are back in Los Angeles...

-Hi, Tom. -Good seeing you.

-Jim, good to see you. -Tom, good to see you.

-I hope. -NARRATOR: ...to share their news

from the FBI and to tell journalists

Tom Colbert and Jim Forbes

Tina Mucklow's verdict on the picture

of the man they believe is D.B. Cooper.

FUENTES: Well, we're here to, uh,

bring you up to date on some of the latest work that we've done,

uh, in this case and the investigation,

and particularly a couple of things

that we learned, uh, earlier this week

from the FBI in Seattle.

The FBI is transitioning the case right now,

and they were in the process of packing up the boxes

and the evidence to be shipped back to Washington.

So "transition" means kaput?

"Transition" means that the case will be closed.

Which will open the files?

There's a variety of rules that require them

to still protect large portions of the investigation.

However, they gave me,

you know, as they referred to it,

unprecedented access to information

about the investigation, and, um,

basically with the understanding that I would not say

what it specifically was, but enough to tell me, um,

how diligent the case was investigated

going back to day one.

Now, we talked to, uh,

Curtis Eng, the case agent that you met with

when you went up there,

and Curtis remembers the meeting with you very well.

JENSEN: Do you remember meeting Tom Colbert?

ENG: Yes, he came

to the Seattle division a couple years back.

And what was your impression of Colbert and his investigation?

Although his presentation was thorough,

and it was detailed,

it didn't prove that his suspect was Dan Cooper.

I can't go on nice presentations.

I have to go by evidence,

and that presentation didn't give me

any additional evidence

that I could use to prosecute the case.

COLBERT: So, in essence, we have nothing specific

shooting down any of the 93 pieces of evidence.

FUENTES: No, that's-- you know, they're not gonna do that.

They're not gonna go point by point

and tell you where you're right or where you're wrong,

or try this or go that direction.

They already have enough compelling reasons

to indicate why he's no longer a suspect to them.

JENSEN: The meeting with the FBI

wasn't the most compelling thing that we heard.

We were able to sit down

with Bill Rataczak and Tina Mucklow.

Have you ever seen this guy, this picture?

[Mucklow sighs]

I've seen so many pictures.

It would be very hard for me to say,

"Yes, I've seen it, no, I haven't."

JENSEN: Do you remember what his name is?

No.

But, you know, I...

JENSEN: Or does he look like this could've been the guy

that you were sitting next to?

MUCKLOW: No, I don't think so.

I don't think so.

Um... [sighs]

No. Do you know who he is?

-JENSEN: Yeah. -FUENTES: Would you be willing

to look at this short interview

where he's being talked to by the media

and just look at the-the gestures that he uses,

the style of speech, the tone of his voice,

and just see if any of that seems like

maybe, possibly, it could be him?

Sure.

INTERVIEWER [over computer]: Are you willing to state

one way or the other whether or not you're D.B. Cooper?

RACKSTRAW: No, I'm afraid of heights.

INTERVIEWER: You have, uh...

parachute training, and, uh,

as you mentioned yourself, y-your background suggests

that you could've been D.B. Cooper.

RACKSTRAW: Could've been. Could've been.

INTERVIEWER: You don't want to commit yourself

-one way or the other? -RACKSTRAW: No.

I, uh, I can't commit myself on something like that, Warren.

It's, uh, like I say.

Primarily I'm afraid of heights.

MUCKLOW: Hmm.

R [over computer]: You don't want to commit yourself

-one way or the other? -RACKSTRAW: No, I, uh,

I can't commit myself on something like that, Warren.

It's, uh, like I say.

Primarily I'm afraid of heights.

NARRATOR: Flight attendant Tina Mucklow is looking at video

of onetime D.B. Cooper suspect Robert W. Rackstraw--

the man Colbert has spent five years

and thousands of dollars investigating.

And it's primarily up to the, uh, American people

someday how that comes out.

MUCKLOW: Hmm.

I don't think so.

FUENTES: Well, thank you for looking at it, and...

and, uh, refreshing your memory.

[Fuentes and Mucklow laugh]

FUENTES: As you could see, she's very articulate,

had a great memory,

-and she was like, "No." -FORBES: Well, in all candor,

uh, you know, I never, ever expected either of them

to recognize Rackstraw this many years later,

despite the trauma, 'cause of the glasses, just--

but also the fading of memory, uh, not unlike Bill Mitchell.

-Mm-hmm. -JENSEN: Tom?

I'd love to hear from the other potential witness

what she thinks.

Did the FBI ever approach the other

stewardess who saw him with his glasses off?

It was always Tina was the mythical one

that wasn't answering the questions.

-And Tina spent the most time. -Most time.

She spent four to five hours with him, I absolutely agree.

I absolutely agree.

There is no possibility of getting a conviction

when the best witness says, "Not him."

I am convinced Rackstraw is not Cooper.

I... I hear you.

I-I'm weighing what, you know,

four years of work is and-- for myself, five for Tom.

I'm weighing what you guys are saying,

and... my needle just switched.

You know, what-what's key to me is-is,

you know, obviously that's a setback

that she doesn't recognize the video.

I still think it's him.

Uh... you know, she's very adamant, and-and that's tough.

But what else is it gonna take for you to think

this isn't the guy?

I want to hear what happens with my 93 pieces of evidence

with the FBI; that's what I want to hear.

I want them to look at it and tell me that

it's all circumstantial and, uh,

we can't confirm it and it's not worth opening the case.

Are one of those 93 pieces of evidence money or the parachute?

No, Billy, we know that's not in there.

This is circumstantial, but it's-it's... uh, testimony...

They're not gonna... they're not gonna reopen it.

-Well, that's what I understand. -They made it clear.

That's what... well...

JENSEN: Of the 93 pieces

of information, there's nothing in here

that puts him on the plane.

There's nothing in here

that even puts him in Portland that day.

If the FBI is saying, "We're not gonna look at him,"

if the FBI is saying, "We're not gonna look at him

unless you have hard evidence," why keep going?

I got a lot of retired federal guys I trust

who gave me an awful hard time when I said I think I found

a Coop-- I found a Cooper candidate,

didn't believe it, and are believers.

And, uh, that's why I still feel passionate

about all the circumstantial we have.

And until the FBI looks at this and says no,

I'm still a believer.

The thing about that is, though, Tom and Billy were

-on that same edge... -Right.

FORBES: ...but now they have access

to different information and new information

that the investigators don't have and we don't have.

-Yeah, yeah. -So it speaks for itself.

Well, I'd like to know what it is, you know, that's...

So would I.

Odds are, we ain't gonna.

-FORBES: Guys, thanks a million. -[Colbert laughs, mutters]

Appreciate it. You did what we asked

-you to do, you got inside. -Thank you.

FORBES: Tom has...

a lot more riding on this than I do,

because he's so completely invested,

literally and figuratively.

How you doing?

I'm doing fine, I'm doing fine.

You know, that's too bad about Tina, but, uh...

Too bad in what way?

Well-- What way? [chuckles]

We all wish she had recognized him,

but, uh, you know, that's-that's the...

If it was him, though, Tom, if it was him.

JENSEN: I don't know that Tom could ever

solve the D.B. Cooper case because he is so deep

into that rabbit hole with Rackstraw.

I don't consider myself obsessed.

I really don't.

I believe Tina believes what she believes,

just like Billy Mitchell believes what he believes,

but I think they were both very, very honest

on what 40 years does to them.

I hear you.

But I think, most likely, he's not D.B. Cooper.

You truly don't think it's him?

No, no.

There's a time when reality kicks in.

We don't bring them in to investigate

to then ignore what they have to say.

FORBES: It won't be easy for me

to walk away whatsoever.

I think it'll be devastating for Tom to have to walk away.

Hi, Bob. It's Billy Jensen, uh, calling again.

I'd still love to hear your side of the story

about what went down with Colbert and Forbes.

NARRATOR: After several phone and text conversations,

and a protracted negotiation,

Robert Rackstraw declined the opportunity to tell his story,

give his version of events during the confrontation

with Jim Forbes and Tom Colbert,

or to describe his experience in 1979,

when, for a brief time, he was the prime suspect

in the D.B. Cooper investigation.

INTERVIEWER: Are you willing to state, one way or the other,

whether or not you're D.B. Cooper?

Could have been. Could have been.

All right, let's, uh, let's take an inventory of the items

that we're gonna send back to headquarters.

NARRATOR: There have always been two D.B. Cooper cases.

One of them is officially being closed.

First item I have is the 1-B 20,

the currency that was found in 1980.

-[camera clicks] -MAN: Yup, got it, 1-B 20.

NARRATOR: For the past 45 years, one investigation

lived in this secure basement file room

of the Seattle division of the FBI.

It contains the few pieces of physical evidence

collected in the aftermath of the skyjacking

of Northwest Flight 305,

and the thousands of interviews

that the FBI conducted in the months and years that followed.

This is 1-B 7. This is the black necktie

with the attached tie clip.

MONTOYA: During the course of the 45-year,

what we call Norjak investigation,

the FBI exhaustively reviewed all credible leads,

utilized multiple field offices to conduct searches,

collected all available evidence,

interviewed all identified witnesses.

So there's the original ticket.

MONTOYA: Over the years, the FBI has applied numerous

new d innovative investigative techniques,

as well as examined countless items at the FBI laboratory.

Evidence obtained during the course of the investigation

will now be preserved for historical purposes

at FBI headquarters in Washington D.C.

PHOTOGRAPHER: Thank you.

MAN: Green sheet, 1-B five.

The salmon pink chest parachute.

PHOTOGRAPHER: And then if you guys

could hold it up for me, please.

ENG: You know, we-we can't solve all the cases.

We try our best.

We've tried for 45 years.

Do a quick inventory of

the original notes taken by Florence Schaffner

during the actual hijacking.

MAN: So she took these in-flight.

-So she's a flight attendant? -Mm-hmm.

ENG: In this situation,

we can't solve it.

For the FBI,

it's not the conclusion that we wanted,

but it is the conclusion that we're presented with.

For us, as the investigating agency,

it's time to move on.

NARRATOR: The other Cooper case is an American mystery.

One that captivated the imagination of the nation

and will continue to do so for generations to come.

It began when the press misidentified

passenger Dan Cooper as skyjacker D.B. Cooper.

A phantom, he was given a face

when this iconic sketch was released to the nation.

And as the decades have passed, the myth of who he was

and how he got away with it has only grown.

You know, the D.B. Cooper case isn't over.

We're just going to the next chapter.

NARRATOR: New and old suspects

continue to appear and reappear.

CARR: It's such a great mystery, you know, and you--

we-we've got almost the whole book written

except the last chapter.

And I'm just like everybody else, you know.

They get sucked into it,

and I want to know how it ends, you know.

I was hoping that I could write

that last chapter, and maybe we still can.

There's gonna be a wave of information coming in

from people because of-of what they see on their screens.

You know, the guy's probably dead at this point, anyway,

so even if you did solve the case,

would it really get you anywhere?

Except saying you solved the only skyjacking

in U.S. history that's unsolved.

Yeah, we don't have a trophy to hold up on the dock and say,

"Look what we caught. We got D.B. Cooper."

We don't have that.

The FBI doesn't have that.

But I think we've taken it as far as we can take it,

and I'm ready that we should close the case.

But still fascinated by everything,

still ready to reopen it in a heartbeat

if something new comes up.

FORBES: I have no reason to push forward

with Bob Rackstraw right now.

We've all gone down rabbit holes in our careers.

We've all followed leads that don't pan out.

My only disappointment is that the end of this journey

isn't revealing the truth, because it's still unknown.

COLBERT: I'm not gonna do a hypothetical

on five years of work and say,

"What if you got an innocent man here?"

I am not gonna talk about what if I'm wrong,

specifically, how will I handle it.

Look, I did the best I could based on the evidence.

I'm at a place where I truly still feel it could be him.

INTERVIEWER: You don't want to commit yourself

-one way or the other? -No.

I, uh, I can't commit myself on something like that, Warren.

It's, uh, like I say. Primarily I'm afraid of heights.

And, uh, there's a matter there, too.

You-you say, well, with a story like that,

should it be fiction or should it be fact?

And it's primarily up to the, uh, American people,

uh, someday how that comes out.

Good-bye, evidence.

JENSEN: Despite the efforts of the most powerful

investigative agency the world has ever seen,

along with thousands of amateur detectives,

it looks like this case will never be solved.

There's very few crimes that are like that,

and it's amazing.

This guy, for all intents and purposes, got away with it.

We have no idea who he was.

We have no idea if he lived or died.

And it looks like we're never gonna know.