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[Instrumental music]
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♪ Rock of ages ♪
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♪ cleft for me ♪
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♪ let me hide myself in thee ♪
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00:00:17,809 --> 00:00:22,814
♪ let the water and the blood ♪
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♪ from thy wounded
side which flowed ♪
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♪ be of sin the double cure ♪
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00:00:32,907 --> 00:00:38,621
♪ save from wrath
and make me pure ♪
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♪ while I draw
this final breath ♪
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00:00:43,752 --> 00:00:48,715
♪ when mine eyes
shall close in death ♪
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00:00:48,757 --> 00:00:54,012
♪ when I rise to
worlds unknown ♪
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00:00:54,054 --> 00:00:59,642
♪ and behold thee
on thy throne ♪
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00:00:59,684 --> 00:01:05,023
♪ rock of ages cleft for me ♪
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00:01:05,065 --> 00:01:09,569
♪ let me hide myself in thee ♪♪
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[Indistinct chatter on radio]
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[Indistinct chatter]
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(Female #1) He who dwells
in the shelter of the most high
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will abide in the
shadow of the almighty.
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The lord is my
shelter and my fortress
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00:01:24,834 --> 00:01:26,336
and my god in whom I trust.
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00:01:26,377 --> 00:01:28,671
Surely he will save you
from the Fowler's snare
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from the deadly pestilence..
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Detective pitts.
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00:01:36,971 --> 00:01:39,307
Most high will abide in
the shadow of the almighty.
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00:01:39,349 --> 00:01:41,142
The lord is my
shelter and my fortress
26
00:01:41,184 --> 00:01:42,286
and my god, in whom I trust.
27
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Surely, he will save you
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00:01:43,770 --> 00:01:46,064
from the Fowler's snare,
from the deadly pestilence.
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00:01:46,106 --> 00:01:47,816
'He shall cover you
with his feathers'
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and under his wings
you shall shelter.
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00:01:49,526 --> 00:01:51,820
His truth shall be your
shield and your buckler.
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00:01:51,861 --> 00:01:53,947
He who dwells in the
shelter of the most high
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00:01:53,988 --> 00:01:56,074
will abide in the
shadow of the almighty.
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The lord is my shelter..
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00:02:03,373 --> 00:02:04,666
Why are you doing those by hand?
36
00:02:04,707 --> 00:02:07,669
I was just asking myself that.
37
00:02:07,710 --> 00:02:08,795
Is that normal?
38
00:02:08,837 --> 00:02:11,339
Sending out invitations
to a baby's baptism?
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00:02:11,381 --> 00:02:12,799
Is that what presbyterians do?
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00:02:12,841 --> 00:02:15,009
Well, I want close
friends and family there.
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00:02:15,051 --> 00:02:16,529
How will they know,
if we don't tell them?
42
00:02:16,553 --> 00:02:17,887
I'm saying we don't want this
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turning into another wedding.
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Our wedding was perfect.
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Yeah, 30 of our closest friends.
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Simple backyard ceremony.
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Turned into 150 of your mom's
closest friends at the church.
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Oh, that.
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[Cell phone ringing]
50
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If that's work..
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Tell them it's your day of rest.
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[Chuckles]
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This is annabeth.
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[Intense music]
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Blessed are you when men
shall revile you and persecute you
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00:02:50,753 --> 00:02:54,716
and shall say all manner
of evil against you falsely.
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- Hey.
- What's up?
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Sorry to drag you
out on a Sunday.
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00:02:59,220 --> 00:03:00,263
That's okay, detective.
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00:03:00,305 --> 00:03:01,973
Double time on weekends makes up
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for a multitude of sins.
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00:03:03,892 --> 00:03:04,893
What do you got?
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Cindy delacroix,
married no children.
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She's under arrest
for killing her husband.
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He was regional manager of
the croft Miller's grocery chain.
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How'd he die?
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Well, Mr. Delacroix was stabbed
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three times in the back
with a butcher knife.
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00:03:20,992 --> 00:03:24,329
Cindy's bloody palm print
is on the kitchen counter.
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'Her fingerprints
are on the weapon.'
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has she confessed?
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I believe she's about to.
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00:03:30,877 --> 00:03:32,378
She waived her
right to an attorney.
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Not much she can say
to get out of this one.
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Let's see.
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00:03:37,008 --> 00:03:38,635
We're ready.
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Mrs. Delacroix?
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00:03:40,511 --> 00:03:42,156
The deputy prosecuting
attorney is here now.
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00:03:42,180 --> 00:03:44,265
You ready to make
your statement?
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Yes.
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Did you stab your husband?
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00:03:47,936 --> 00:03:48,978
Yes.
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00:03:49,020 --> 00:03:51,064
Did you intend to kill him?
84
00:03:51,105 --> 00:03:52,732
Yes.
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00:03:52,774 --> 00:03:54,442
'Why'd you do it?'
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god told me to.
87
00:04:01,824 --> 00:04:03,910
Blessed are ye when
men shall revile you
88
00:04:03,952 --> 00:04:06,079
'and persecute you and
shall say all manner..'
89
00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:09,123
I think she just found
something to say.
90
00:04:18,299 --> 00:04:20,593
I've had dozens of clients
who wanted to plead insane
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00:04:20,635 --> 00:04:22,363
but I don't think I've
ever actually had anybody
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who is insane plead insane.
93
00:04:23,846 --> 00:04:25,682
I'm telling you,
this lady is so crazy
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00:04:25,723 --> 00:04:27,100
she doesn't want to plead crazy.
95
00:04:27,141 --> 00:04:29,477
Then how can you file
a competency motion?
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00:04:29,519 --> 00:04:31,729
Because she
doesn't know about it.
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(Male #1) 'Case
number 75cr-30756.'
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people vs Cindy delacroix.
99
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First degree murder. Your honor.
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00:04:42,699 --> 00:04:44,742
(Male #2) 'I've read the
public defender's motion'
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00:04:44,784 --> 00:04:46,661
for a pretrial competency exam.
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00:04:46,703 --> 00:04:48,413
Unless the people
have any objection
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00:04:48,454 --> 00:04:51,624
to a psychiatric
evaluation, I will so order.
104
00:04:51,666 --> 00:04:54,419
Requesting a
sidebar, your honor.
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00:04:57,338 --> 00:04:58,965
(Judge p. Teague)
'Yes, counselor?'
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00:04:59,007 --> 00:05:00,901
your honor, this motion
was filed confidentially.
107
00:05:00,925 --> 00:05:02,845
Mrs. Delacroix believes
psychiatry to be the work
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00:05:02,885 --> 00:05:04,571
of the devil and objects
to even the slightest
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00:05:04,595 --> 00:05:06,389
insinuation she might
have mental problems.
110
00:05:06,431 --> 00:05:08,308
Then why is he pursuing
the competency hearing?
111
00:05:08,349 --> 00:05:09,934
Your honor, this is not a ploy.
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00:05:09,976 --> 00:05:11,870
'Cindy delacroix believes
she was divinely directed'
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to commit the acts she's
accused of, and she's not kidding.
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00:05:14,314 --> 00:05:16,458
Well, the state believes she
picked that butcher knife up
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all by herself and
stabbed her husband
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in the back with it three times.
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00:05:19,193 --> 00:05:20,504
Your honor, if I'm
gonna continue to be able
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to represent my client,
I respectfully request
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the court to insist on
a competency exam
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00:05:24,574 --> 00:05:25,992
over my strenuous objections.
121
00:05:26,034 --> 00:05:28,053
As long as we don't establish
the precedent that being
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00:05:28,077 --> 00:05:31,289
deeply religious makes you
mentally incompetent, fine.
123
00:05:31,331 --> 00:05:33,207
Okay. I get it. Step back.
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00:05:34,042 --> 00:05:36,586
The court hereby orders
the defendant to submit
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00:05:36,627 --> 00:05:38,087
'to a psychiatric examination'
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00:05:38,129 --> 00:05:40,381
to determine her
fitness to stand trial.
127
00:05:40,423 --> 00:05:41,382
Objection, your honor!
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00:05:41,424 --> 00:05:42,508
There's nothing to warrant
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00:05:42,550 --> 00:05:43,926
such an examination.
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00:05:43,968 --> 00:05:45,362
My client considers
this examination
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to be an invasion of her
privacy and a direct attempt
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to circumvent her
communication with god.
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(P. Teague) 'Competency
hearing so ordered.'
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00:05:52,060 --> 00:05:55,313
this is wrong. This is wrong.
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00:05:55,355 --> 00:05:57,982
(Maureen) Officer
macklin, what's going on?
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00:05:58,024 --> 00:05:59,442
How are you holding up?
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00:05:59,484 --> 00:06:01,164
I know there was a
lot of fallout after you
138
00:06:01,194 --> 00:06:02,570
testified against margate.
139
00:06:02,612 --> 00:06:03,780
I'm okay.
140
00:06:03,821 --> 00:06:07,075
I just want you to know that not
every cop hates you, Maureen.
141
00:06:07,116 --> 00:06:08,785
You came down here
just to tell me that?
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00:06:08,826 --> 00:06:10,054
That and I was
hoping that you could
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00:06:10,078 --> 00:06:12,413
put this paperwork
on the fast track for me.
144
00:06:12,455 --> 00:06:13,831
It's a justifiable homicide.
145
00:06:13,873 --> 00:06:15,375
Homeowner takes a
gun away from a guy
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00:06:15,416 --> 00:06:17,877
breaking into his house
and shoots him. Kills him.
147
00:06:17,919 --> 00:06:19,480
Burglar had a record
for previous b and es.
148
00:06:19,504 --> 00:06:22,924
Hmm, and officer Keith macklin
has a promotion coming up
149
00:06:22,965 --> 00:06:26,177
and would like another solved
case on his record, hmm?
150
00:06:26,219 --> 00:06:28,513
You know, I called
you some time ago.
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00:06:28,554 --> 00:06:30,264
I didn't return the
message. Sorry.
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00:06:30,306 --> 00:06:32,725
That's okay. You
were probably busy.
153
00:06:34,185 --> 00:06:36,938
- I was wondering if...
- I don't date cops.
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00:06:36,979 --> 00:06:42,276
Oh, so it's, it's the
clothes and not the man?
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00:06:42,318 --> 00:06:44,362
Basically.
156
00:06:44,404 --> 00:06:46,114
Listen, I will do this.
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00:06:46,155 --> 00:06:47,883
Anything to save the
people's time and money.
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00:06:47,907 --> 00:06:50,993
But you need to
send, uh, Dave Simon
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up here to talk to me.
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00:06:54,747 --> 00:06:56,624
I'll bring him myself.
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00:06:59,752 --> 00:07:03,089
(Male #2) 'So tell me, who
is the commander in chief?'
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00:07:03,131 --> 00:07:05,258
George w. Bush.
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00:07:05,299 --> 00:07:07,510
And your parents' names?
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00:07:07,552 --> 00:07:10,972
- Gabe and Nora Templeton.
- How's the baby?
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00:07:11,013 --> 00:07:13,182
Oh, she's so
cute, it's ridiculous.
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00:07:13,224 --> 00:07:15,184
She's getting
baptized next week.
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00:07:15,226 --> 00:07:19,480
Can you tell me why god
told you to kill your husband?
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00:07:19,522 --> 00:07:21,149
I don't trust you.
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00:07:21,190 --> 00:07:22,692
I don't appreciate your tone.
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00:07:22,733 --> 00:07:24,819
And I'm not going to
answer that question.
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00:07:24,861 --> 00:07:26,571
Mrs. Delacroix, I simply asked
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why god told you
to kill your husband.
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00:07:29,699 --> 00:07:32,452
That's between god and me.
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00:07:32,493 --> 00:07:34,078
I spoke to the lord.
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'I sought his guidance.'
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it was his hand
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00:07:38,458 --> 00:07:41,169
that took Barry's
life, not mine.
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00:07:41,210 --> 00:07:42,670
And I am at peace with that.
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00:07:42,712 --> 00:07:46,215
So, if god told you right
now to reach across this table
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00:07:46,257 --> 00:07:49,510
put your hands around my
neck and strangle me to death
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00:07:49,552 --> 00:07:50,511
you'd do it?
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00:07:50,553 --> 00:07:52,180
I know what the
lord guided me to do
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00:07:52,221 --> 00:07:55,933
is against the laws of man,
but I answer to a higher law.
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00:07:55,975 --> 00:07:57,852
Okay, she not only
knows right from wrong
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00:07:57,894 --> 00:08:00,813
she just confessed on the
record again. She's competent.
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00:08:00,855 --> 00:08:03,191
And she also just told
her shrink she hears voices
187
00:08:03,232 --> 00:08:04,942
and believes her
actions are compelled
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00:08:04,984 --> 00:08:07,361
by an overwhelming
undeniable force.
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00:08:07,403 --> 00:08:10,448
In Indiana vs kennesaw,
the court called that crazy.
190
00:08:10,490 --> 00:08:12,283
(Cindy) 'You're
not listening to me.'
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00:08:12,325 --> 00:08:14,744
you think that
everything can be solved
192
00:08:14,785 --> 00:08:17,038
through doctors and therapy.
193
00:08:17,079 --> 00:08:18,247
Well, there's no question
194
00:08:18,289 --> 00:08:21,709
therapy would be a
tremendous benefit.
195
00:08:21,751 --> 00:08:24,045
But there is no doubt whatsoever
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00:08:24,086 --> 00:08:28,174
the defendant is mentally
competent, aware of her actions
197
00:08:28,216 --> 00:08:31,385
and legally fit to stand trial.
198
00:08:31,427 --> 00:08:33,012
So ordered.
199
00:08:33,054 --> 00:08:34,865
Your honor, even though
my client is deemed competent
200
00:08:34,889 --> 00:08:37,767
to face trial, we reserve
the right to plead insanity
201
00:08:37,808 --> 00:08:39,310
and/or temporary insanity.
202
00:08:39,352 --> 00:08:40,520
I told you I'm not insane.
203
00:08:40,561 --> 00:08:42,730
This competency
finding by no means
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00:08:42,772 --> 00:08:46,234
prevents you from mounting
any defense you choose.
205
00:08:46,275 --> 00:08:48,402
'If you think you
can prove your client'
206
00:08:48,444 --> 00:08:51,030
was legally insane at
the time of the crime...
207
00:08:51,072 --> 00:08:53,574
My sister is not insane!
Her husband was insane!
208
00:08:53,616 --> 00:08:55,618
Please refrain from
talking in the gallery.
209
00:08:55,660 --> 00:09:00,081
If I am insane, then
Abraham is insane.
210
00:09:00,122 --> 00:09:02,625
God told him to
kill his beloved son.
211
00:09:02,667 --> 00:09:04,919
You promised me you
wouldn't say I was insane.
212
00:09:04,961 --> 00:09:07,171
Mrs. Delacroix, I
won't warn you again!
213
00:09:07,213 --> 00:09:11,050
God tested Abraham,
god tested Jonah
214
00:09:11,092 --> 00:09:14,095
god tested Sarah,
god tested Mary
215
00:09:14,136 --> 00:09:16,556
and god tested me.
216
00:09:16,597 --> 00:09:19,308
[Gavel bangs] 'Next case.'
217
00:09:19,350 --> 00:09:21,686
(Maureen) So tell
me about the break-in.
218
00:09:21,727 --> 00:09:24,230
The worst part was
this was my weekend
219
00:09:24,272 --> 00:09:27,567
with Laurie, my little girl.
220
00:09:27,608 --> 00:09:30,861
Her mother and
me split up last year.
221
00:09:30,903 --> 00:09:32,238
Since the break-in
222
00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,782
she won't let Laurie
stay with me anymore.
223
00:09:34,824 --> 00:09:36,784
Did Laurie see anything?
224
00:09:36,826 --> 00:09:39,620
No. Thank god.
225
00:09:39,662 --> 00:09:40,830
She didn't wake up.
226
00:09:40,871 --> 00:09:44,709
Like I said, I woke with
a glass breaking sound
227
00:09:44,750 --> 00:09:46,711
like a window being punched out.
228
00:09:46,752 --> 00:09:49,839
So I got up and I
went downstairs.
229
00:09:50,715 --> 00:09:54,260
And I see this guy
rifling through my things.
230
00:09:54,302 --> 00:09:58,389
First, I froze, but
then he spun around.
231
00:09:58,431 --> 00:10:01,601
And I saw the gun
and just, you know
232
00:10:01,642 --> 00:10:04,353
instinctively grabbed it.
233
00:10:04,395 --> 00:10:06,105
And?
234
00:10:06,147 --> 00:10:09,191
Big struggle. He-he
wasn't letting go of that gun.
235
00:10:09,233 --> 00:10:12,945
And it just... Kind of went off.
236
00:10:12,987 --> 00:10:15,364
And he was dead.
237
00:10:16,949 --> 00:10:22,121
Well, this is all very
consistent with your statement.
238
00:10:23,331 --> 00:10:25,207
You're a very lucky
man, Mr. Simon.
239
00:10:25,249 --> 00:10:29,086
Well, I'm lucky everybody's
been so helpful and great.
240
00:10:29,128 --> 00:10:31,631
This has been a
horrible few days.
241
00:10:31,672 --> 00:10:32,882
But seriously, I-I appreciate
242
00:10:32,923 --> 00:10:36,427
everyone not making
any, making it it any worse.
243
00:10:36,469 --> 00:10:38,095
Thank you both.
244
00:10:38,137 --> 00:10:41,057
Thank you. Thank
you for coming in.
245
00:10:41,098 --> 00:10:42,642
Okay.
246
00:10:48,522 --> 00:10:51,317
- So, you good on this?
- Close.
247
00:10:51,359 --> 00:10:53,486
No one gets a pass
until I see the ballistics
248
00:10:53,527 --> 00:10:55,696
and fingerprint reports.
249
00:11:01,869 --> 00:11:06,749
[Chuckles] I guess I.. Guess
I'll let you get back to work.
250
00:11:14,423 --> 00:11:16,342
Ms. Delacroix, you are claiming
251
00:11:16,384 --> 00:11:18,844
that god ordered you
to kill your husband
252
00:11:18,886 --> 00:11:20,554
is that correct?
253
00:11:20,596 --> 00:11:21,764
God is my Shepherd.
254
00:11:21,806 --> 00:11:24,058
He guides my heart and my hand.
255
00:11:24,100 --> 00:11:27,228
And last Sunday, god
put a knife in that hand
256
00:11:27,269 --> 00:11:29,689
'and told you to
stab your husband?'
257
00:11:29,730 --> 00:11:30,773
yes.
258
00:11:30,815 --> 00:11:33,067
I can't believe her lawyer
let her do this interview.
259
00:11:33,109 --> 00:11:34,694
She fired her lawyer.
260
00:11:34,735 --> 00:11:36,904
You're kidding.
She 86'd Jeffrey?
261
00:11:36,946 --> 00:11:39,824
She refused any further
psych exams and she fired him.
262
00:11:39,865 --> 00:11:43,035
Her sister and her church
are handling things for now.
263
00:11:43,077 --> 00:11:45,162
And her church
thinks a confession
264
00:11:45,204 --> 00:11:46,831
'on the local news
is a good plan?'
265
00:11:46,872 --> 00:11:49,166
they're trying to
sway public sentiment.
266
00:11:49,208 --> 00:11:50,793
Taint the jury pool.
267
00:11:50,835 --> 00:11:53,379
Believe me, I almost wish they
would've found her incompetent.
268
00:11:53,421 --> 00:11:56,132
I gotta tell you, boss, having
to go after this woman's
269
00:11:56,173 --> 00:11:59,051
twisted idea of god, that's
not a good day in court.
270
00:11:59,093 --> 00:12:02,179
(Female reporter) 'Why do you
think god wanted your husband dead?'
271
00:12:02,221 --> 00:12:04,181
the devil had taken his soul.
272
00:12:04,223 --> 00:12:05,516
'So you killed him?'
273
00:12:05,558 --> 00:12:08,561
I cut out his sin. I did
as god commanded.
274
00:12:08,602 --> 00:12:10,813
You think a jury's
going to go for this?
275
00:12:10,855 --> 00:12:12,189
Maybe.
276
00:12:12,231 --> 00:12:13,542
With some people,
all you need to do
277
00:12:13,566 --> 00:12:15,776
is invoke god and
they fall in line.
278
00:12:15,818 --> 00:12:18,237
It only takes one
person to deadlock a jury.
279
00:12:18,279 --> 00:12:19,572
No, well, I don't buy it.
280
00:12:19,613 --> 00:12:21,741
God doesn't tell people to kill.
281
00:12:21,782 --> 00:12:23,367
Danny, do me a favor
282
00:12:23,409 --> 00:12:26,537
and work up a brief on
religious based offenses.
283
00:12:26,579 --> 00:12:27,538
Okay.
284
00:12:27,580 --> 00:12:29,373
Don't let the whole
"god told me to do it"
285
00:12:29,415 --> 00:12:31,250
spin throw you off your game.
286
00:12:31,292 --> 00:12:32,501
Steve, don't worry.
287
00:12:32,543 --> 00:12:34,312
I'm going to handle
this just like every other
288
00:12:34,336 --> 00:12:36,297
murder case I've tried.
289
00:12:37,715 --> 00:12:39,967
She's only tried
two murder cases.
290
00:12:40,009 --> 00:12:42,052
Yeah, but she won 'em both.
291
00:12:50,519 --> 00:12:54,023
So she came up from
behind and stabbed him.
292
00:12:54,064 --> 00:12:55,941
Victim fell forward
onto this chair
293
00:12:55,983 --> 00:12:57,067
knocking it on its side.
294
00:12:57,109 --> 00:12:58,819
She stabbed him two more times
295
00:12:58,861 --> 00:13:01,822
leaving the knife
buried to its hilt.
296
00:13:01,864 --> 00:13:04,116
This was not a happy housewife.
297
00:13:04,158 --> 00:13:06,368
Anywho... the blood trail
298
00:13:06,410 --> 00:13:09,038
goes back into the kitchen
where he grabs his keys.
299
00:13:09,079 --> 00:13:10,122
His car keys?
300
00:13:10,164 --> 00:13:11,707
Maybe he thought
he could drive himself
301
00:13:11,749 --> 00:13:12,666
to the hospital.
302
00:13:12,708 --> 00:13:15,336
Staggers outside,
face-plants in the yard.
303
00:13:15,377 --> 00:13:17,797
'Not many signs of chaos
and discord in the house.'
304
00:13:17,838 --> 00:13:19,799
'she said that he was
demon-possessed.'
305
00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:21,258
but there are no signs of drugs
306
00:13:21,300 --> 00:13:23,093
alcohol or porno magazines.
307
00:13:23,135 --> 00:13:24,512
There's still the computer.
308
00:13:24,553 --> 00:13:26,180
We'll get to that
this afternoon.
309
00:13:26,222 --> 00:13:28,974
Let's hope there's a big
fat Internet history file.
310
00:13:29,016 --> 00:13:30,559
Hey, what about
their financials?
311
00:13:30,601 --> 00:13:32,937
Big box of receipts. They
did keep track of their money.
312
00:13:32,978 --> 00:13:36,398
Good. We need a clear motive
based on their life together.
313
00:13:37,775 --> 00:13:40,402
They say women kill
men for three reasons.
314
00:13:40,444 --> 00:13:42,196
Infidelity, abuse
315
00:13:42,238 --> 00:13:43,673
and every once in
a while, for money.
316
00:13:43,697 --> 00:13:45,199
Given that she
stabbed him three times
317
00:13:45,241 --> 00:13:47,076
let's focus on the
cheating and the beating.
318
00:13:47,117 --> 00:13:48,410
'Done.'
319
00:13:49,703 --> 00:13:53,165
Barry and Cindy were the
first couple that I married here
320
00:13:53,207 --> 00:13:55,960
back when this church
met in a storefront.
321
00:13:56,001 --> 00:13:57,378
They were high
school sweethearts.
322
00:13:57,419 --> 00:13:59,713
They had their whole
lives in front of them.
323
00:13:59,755 --> 00:14:01,340
So you knew them well.
324
00:14:01,382 --> 00:14:02,675
Yeah.
325
00:14:02,716 --> 00:14:04,677
This is a shock for all of us.
326
00:14:04,718 --> 00:14:07,888
Cindy's one of the most active
members of our congregation.
327
00:14:07,930 --> 00:14:09,974
What about Barry?
328
00:14:10,015 --> 00:14:13,060
Unfortunately, he
had stopped attending.
329
00:14:13,102 --> 00:14:15,729
He was going through
some difficult times
330
00:14:15,771 --> 00:14:17,606
personally, and..
331
00:14:18,899 --> 00:14:20,359
He couldn't
reconcile his feelings
332
00:14:20,401 --> 00:14:21,986
with the tenets of our religion.
333
00:14:22,027 --> 00:14:24,071
Were they having
marital problems?
334
00:14:25,155 --> 00:14:27,950
They came to me for
counseling about a year ago.
335
00:14:27,992 --> 00:14:29,368
They were at a crossroads.
336
00:14:29,410 --> 00:14:31,495
Barry wanted to go one way
337
00:14:31,537 --> 00:14:33,747
and Cindy wanted to go another.
338
00:14:33,789 --> 00:14:35,374
It came to a point in therapy
339
00:14:35,416 --> 00:14:38,586
where I think Barry wanted
me to counsel them to divorce.
340
00:14:38,627 --> 00:14:41,839
He brought it up several times,
but Cindy was adamantly opposed.
341
00:14:41,881 --> 00:14:43,924
She did not believe in divorce.
342
00:14:43,966 --> 00:14:46,635
Was Barry unfaithful to her?
343
00:14:47,386 --> 00:14:49,096
Okay, this is..
344
00:14:50,848 --> 00:14:52,808
I'm still Cindy's active pastor
345
00:14:52,850 --> 00:14:54,268
and the leader of
this congregation.
346
00:14:54,310 --> 00:14:55,978
I feel like I've said
too much already.
347
00:14:56,020 --> 00:14:59,106
I just need to understand
why this happened.
348
00:15:01,150 --> 00:15:03,235
Was Barry gay?
349
00:15:03,277 --> 00:15:05,696
Again, I don't.. I'm
not comfortable.
350
00:15:05,738 --> 00:15:07,573
You understand that
the clerical privileges
351
00:15:07,615 --> 00:15:10,576
only apply to catholic
priests in the confessional.
352
00:15:10,618 --> 00:15:12,411
I can subpoena your testimony.
353
00:15:12,453 --> 00:15:15,664
You have your
responsibilities and I have mine.
354
00:15:16,916 --> 00:15:17,958
[Sighs]
355
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:20,044
[Instrumental music]
356
00:15:27,718 --> 00:15:30,971
(Annabeth) Well, they found a
dress in Barry delacroix's closet.
357
00:15:31,013 --> 00:15:32,157
The dress had a name tag on it.
358
00:15:32,181 --> 00:15:33,766
"Hi, my name's Marie."
359
00:15:33,807 --> 00:15:35,809
- So who's Marie?
- Exactly.
360
00:15:35,851 --> 00:15:38,854
Was he having an affair
with Marie, or was he Marie?
361
00:15:38,896 --> 00:15:40,814
Well, either way,
you got your motive.
362
00:15:40,856 --> 00:15:42,608
It's promising. How's
it going in here?
363
00:15:42,650 --> 00:15:45,361
Cindy's comparing her acts
to acts committed in the Bible.
364
00:15:45,402 --> 00:15:47,363
But in the Bible, if god
wants somebody dead
365
00:15:47,404 --> 00:15:48,948
he takes care of it himself.
366
00:15:48,989 --> 00:15:50,282
Lot's wife, sodom and gomorrah..
367
00:15:50,324 --> 00:15:53,285
Okay, so god never
tells anyone to kill.
368
00:15:53,327 --> 00:15:55,245
If he does, it's just a test.
369
00:15:55,287 --> 00:15:57,414
And then he stops
the guy from doing it.
370
00:15:57,456 --> 00:16:00,042
I have a feeling this act
has a lot less to do with god
371
00:16:00,084 --> 00:16:01,794
and a lot more to do with Marie.
372
00:16:01,835 --> 00:16:04,380
Alright, I'm on my way to
talk to the victim's brother.
373
00:16:04,421 --> 00:16:05,923
Keep it up.
374
00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:09,468
I'm so sorry for your
loss, but I have to ask..
375
00:16:09,510 --> 00:16:13,806
Did your brother ever talked to
you about someone named Marie?
376
00:16:13,847 --> 00:16:15,516
Marie? No.
377
00:16:15,557 --> 00:16:17,810
Do you know if he
was having an affair?
378
00:16:17,851 --> 00:16:20,854
That's not a simple question.
379
00:16:20,896 --> 00:16:23,357
He and Cindy had known
each other since they were
380
00:16:23,399 --> 00:16:26,151
I don't know, a
couple of dumb kids.
381
00:16:27,152 --> 00:16:28,779
He had grown into
a different person
382
00:16:28,821 --> 00:16:31,907
and she wanted him
to stay the way he was.
383
00:16:31,949 --> 00:16:34,743
- Are we talking about sex?
- Yeah.
384
00:16:34,785 --> 00:16:36,012
He wanted to
try different things
385
00:16:36,036 --> 00:16:38,288
but he didn't want
to upset Cindy.
386
00:16:38,330 --> 00:16:40,082
That's what he
kept saying to me.
387
00:16:40,124 --> 00:16:43,711
He was trying to figure out
how do that without hurting her.
388
00:16:43,752 --> 00:16:47,673
But finally, he realized
he had to leave.
389
00:16:47,715 --> 00:16:49,675
He told you that? When?
390
00:16:50,884 --> 00:16:53,178
A week or so before he died.
391
00:16:53,220 --> 00:16:55,264
- Did Cindy know that?
- Of course!
392
00:16:55,305 --> 00:16:58,142
Oh, Barry was
very honest with her.
393
00:16:58,183 --> 00:17:00,144
He wanted to do this right.
394
00:17:00,185 --> 00:17:02,104
But it just..
395
00:17:02,146 --> 00:17:03,355
All went wrong.
396
00:17:03,397 --> 00:17:05,482
So about a year
ago, the delacroixs
397
00:17:05,524 --> 00:17:07,443
upgraded their computer system
398
00:17:07,484 --> 00:17:11,655
and Barry discovered the
wonders of pornography.
399
00:17:11,697 --> 00:17:12,990
Guy just went bananas.
400
00:17:13,032 --> 00:17:15,325
Two grand a month
on their credit cards.
401
00:17:15,367 --> 00:17:18,245
- He only made $45,000 a year.
- Wait, it gets better.
402
00:17:18,287 --> 00:17:19,887
Look where he's been
spending most of his
403
00:17:19,913 --> 00:17:21,790
Internet time last
couple of months.
404
00:17:21,832 --> 00:17:23,375
"Free living," what is this?
405
00:17:23,417 --> 00:17:25,335
It's like a swingers
organization.
406
00:17:25,377 --> 00:17:28,547
- You mean like wife swapping?
- More like just group sex.
407
00:17:28,589 --> 00:17:30,483
I've been trying to get in
touch with some of these people
408
00:17:30,507 --> 00:17:31,901
but they're kind of
hard to track down.
409
00:17:31,925 --> 00:17:34,178
Sex-addicted swinger
and a religious wife.
410
00:17:34,219 --> 00:17:35,763
That's a recipe for disaster.
411
00:17:35,804 --> 00:17:36,889
And a slam-dunk motive
412
00:17:36,930 --> 00:17:38,366
if we can get somebody
from free living
413
00:17:38,390 --> 00:17:40,642
to testify to Barry's
involvement.
414
00:17:40,684 --> 00:17:42,686
- Keep looking.
- You got it.
415
00:17:42,728 --> 00:17:45,397
Here's the ballistic report
on your b and e case.
416
00:17:46,231 --> 00:17:48,192
Thank you.
417
00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,911
(Maureen) 'Do you understand
you have the right to counsel?'
418
00:17:59,703 --> 00:18:01,080
I've got nothing to hide.
419
00:18:01,121 --> 00:18:03,540
The burglar pulled a
gun and we struggled.
420
00:18:03,582 --> 00:18:05,084
Your fingerprints
are on the bullets.
421
00:18:05,125 --> 00:18:09,630
You lied to me,
Mr. Simon. It was your gun.
422
00:18:09,671 --> 00:18:12,800
That's, that's not possible.
423
00:18:12,841 --> 00:18:15,219
I'm going to give you
exactly one more chance
424
00:18:15,260 --> 00:18:17,012
to tell the truth.
425
00:18:18,222 --> 00:18:21,433
Okay. It was my gun.
426
00:18:21,475 --> 00:18:23,811
But it wasn't my
idea to lie about it.
427
00:18:23,852 --> 00:18:26,105
Whose idea was it then?
428
00:18:26,146 --> 00:18:28,941
The officer.. Macklin.
429
00:18:28,982 --> 00:18:32,069
'Gosh, you know, I don't want
to cause trouble for anybody.'
430
00:18:32,111 --> 00:18:33,487
what did macklin tell you?
431
00:18:33,529 --> 00:18:37,116
Okay, the gun wasn't registered.
432
00:18:37,157 --> 00:18:38,992
So when I told
macklin that, he said
433
00:18:39,034 --> 00:18:41,411
I should say it was
the burglar's gun.
434
00:18:42,955 --> 00:18:44,248
'He said it would save him.'
435
00:18:44,289 --> 00:18:47,251
me, everybody, a
whole lot of trouble.
436
00:18:47,292 --> 00:18:50,379
He'd, he'd just
write it up that way.
437
00:18:52,631 --> 00:18:54,591
His fingerprints
are on the bullets.
438
00:18:54,633 --> 00:18:56,444
Wait a minute, are you
saying that it was his gun?
439
00:18:56,468 --> 00:18:59,012
He says you told
him to lie about it.
440
00:18:59,054 --> 00:19:00,406
You think I filed
the false report?
441
00:19:00,430 --> 00:19:03,142
I'm informing you
of what he said.
442
00:19:03,183 --> 00:19:06,145
You know, a lot of guys
said some pretty nasty things
443
00:19:06,186 --> 00:19:08,814
about you after you testified
against detective margate.
444
00:19:08,856 --> 00:19:10,566
I wasn't one of them.
445
00:19:10,607 --> 00:19:11,942
This is why I don't date cops.
446
00:19:11,984 --> 00:19:14,987
If Dave Simon said I told
him to lie about that gun
447
00:19:15,028 --> 00:19:16,280
then he's making that up
448
00:19:16,321 --> 00:19:18,907
and if he's making that up,
he's making up everything else.
449
00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:21,910
Two things, Cindy
delacroix purchased
450
00:19:21,952 --> 00:19:24,538
a set of kitchen knives
six days before the murder.
451
00:19:24,580 --> 00:19:26,015
I have a credit card
receipt to prove that.
452
00:19:26,039 --> 00:19:28,375
Do we know if the murder
weapon came from those knives?
453
00:19:28,417 --> 00:19:29,626
I'll have forensics check.
454
00:19:29,668 --> 00:19:30,770
Great. What's the second thing?
455
00:19:30,794 --> 00:19:31,795
Cindy got a new lawyer.
456
00:19:31,837 --> 00:19:33,839
Somebody named Marla dodds.
457
00:19:33,881 --> 00:19:36,508
No. Oh, no, no, no.
458
00:19:36,550 --> 00:19:37,801
Well, who is she?
459
00:19:37,843 --> 00:19:39,279
She's a nightmare
of a defense attorney
460
00:19:39,303 --> 00:19:41,346
and an unapologetic media hound.
461
00:19:41,388 --> 00:19:43,015
- That would make sense.
- Why?
462
00:19:43,056 --> 00:19:45,976
'Cause she's outside on the
courthouse steps right now.
463
00:19:46,768 --> 00:19:50,939
Religion is under
attack in this country
464
00:19:50,981 --> 00:19:54,276
in our schools and
in our courthouses.
465
00:19:54,318 --> 00:19:55,819
In this very courthouse
466
00:19:55,861 --> 00:19:59,573
where our sister, Cindy
delacroix, will be tried.
467
00:19:59,615 --> 00:20:01,783
Is this just?
468
00:20:01,825 --> 00:20:03,285
Is it fair?
469
00:20:03,327 --> 00:20:04,703
No. Why?
470
00:20:04,745 --> 00:20:07,915
Because how can
a godless process
471
00:20:07,956 --> 00:20:11,168
ever understand the heart
472
00:20:11,210 --> 00:20:14,046
of a god-fearing woman?
473
00:20:14,087 --> 00:20:16,840
'Let us all bow our heads'
474
00:20:16,882 --> 00:20:19,885
and join in a silent vigil
475
00:20:19,927 --> 00:20:21,720
for our sister Cindy.
476
00:20:21,762 --> 00:20:24,973
And let us pray
that the holy spirit
477
00:20:25,015 --> 00:20:27,893
will touch the heart
of this judge, this jury
478
00:20:27,935 --> 00:20:29,978
this prosecuting attorney
479
00:20:30,020 --> 00:20:32,522
'so that they, too, may one day'
480
00:20:32,564 --> 00:20:36,276
be able to hear
the voice of god.
481
00:20:36,318 --> 00:20:39,404
She's praying the
jury ignores the law?
482
00:20:40,656 --> 00:20:43,200
She's saying religious
people should band together
483
00:20:43,242 --> 00:20:45,244
regardless of the cause.
484
00:20:45,285 --> 00:20:47,120
'She's manipulating emotions.'
485
00:20:47,162 --> 00:20:48,830
she's going for
jury nullification.
486
00:20:48,872 --> 00:20:50,332
So what does that mean for us?
487
00:20:50,374 --> 00:20:53,293
[Sighs] It means I have
the strongest murder case
488
00:20:53,335 --> 00:20:55,963
I could possibly have.
489
00:20:56,004 --> 00:20:58,131
And I could lose.
490
00:21:03,053 --> 00:21:06,682
No luck finding our swingers
or the mysterious Marie?
491
00:21:06,723 --> 00:21:10,978
Nothing so far.
Detective pitts is still on it.
492
00:21:11,019 --> 00:21:13,272
Well..
493
00:21:13,313 --> 00:21:14,982
Show time.
494
00:21:16,817 --> 00:21:18,777
[Indistinct chatter]
495
00:21:22,364 --> 00:21:24,199
Ms. Chase.
496
00:21:24,241 --> 00:21:25,867
It is an honor to do battle
497
00:21:25,909 --> 00:21:28,620
with such a seasoned
star of Indiana's
498
00:21:28,662 --> 00:21:30,539
criminal justice system.
499
00:21:30,580 --> 00:21:32,082
Ms. Dodds.
500
00:21:33,709 --> 00:21:35,752
Can we get you two together?
501
00:21:37,629 --> 00:21:39,756
You know what Jesus
said at the last supper.
502
00:21:39,798 --> 00:21:41,174
"Everybody who
wants in the picture
503
00:21:41,216 --> 00:21:43,593
get on my side of the table."
504
00:21:43,635 --> 00:21:45,220
[Indistinct chatter]
505
00:21:47,472 --> 00:21:49,891
(Maureen) 'What you
told us is not adding up.'
506
00:21:49,933 --> 00:21:53,312
did you know the man
you shot was a loan shark?
507
00:21:54,604 --> 00:21:57,107
Really? No.
508
00:21:57,149 --> 00:21:59,192
I have a sworn statement
from your ex-wife
509
00:21:59,234 --> 00:22:01,695
saying she left you because
of your gambling addiction.
510
00:22:01,737 --> 00:22:05,198
[Chuckles] Well, that's
her side of the story.
511
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:06,533
Mm-hmm.
512
00:22:06,575 --> 00:22:10,996
Ernie hay came to your house
on the evening of September 8th
513
00:22:11,038 --> 00:22:12,414
and you let him in.
514
00:22:12,456 --> 00:22:17,044
And he demanded that you
pay him what you owed him.
515
00:22:18,837 --> 00:22:20,964
This record book
from Ernie's apartment
516
00:22:21,006 --> 00:22:24,509
has you in the red for
150 grand in football bets.
517
00:22:24,551 --> 00:22:26,970
When you told him you couldn't
pay him, he threatened you
518
00:22:27,012 --> 00:22:29,097
so you got your gun
out and shot him.
519
00:22:29,139 --> 00:22:32,184
Come on. You-you know
that's not the way it was.
520
00:22:32,225 --> 00:22:34,770
Then you broke the window
to make it look like a burglary
521
00:22:34,811 --> 00:22:37,981
got his fingerprints on the gun
to make it look like it was his
522
00:22:38,023 --> 00:22:39,733
to make it look
like self-defense.
523
00:22:39,775 --> 00:22:40,942
It was self-defense.
524
00:22:40,984 --> 00:22:44,154
Except there was no break-in
and he never had a gun.
525
00:22:44,196 --> 00:22:47,824
And I never told you to
say that the gun was his.
526
00:22:50,535 --> 00:22:52,621
I want to talk to a lawyer.
527
00:22:52,662 --> 00:22:54,790
[Scoffs]
528
00:22:54,831 --> 00:22:57,376
(Female #2) 'The first stab
wound was directly above'
529
00:22:57,417 --> 00:23:00,712
'the right shoulder blade,
the second stab wound'
530
00:23:00,754 --> 00:23:02,756
punctured the victim's left lung
531
00:23:02,798 --> 00:23:04,299
and the third one went very deep
532
00:23:04,341 --> 00:23:06,510
'causing massive
internal bleeding.'
533
00:23:06,551 --> 00:23:08,178
how would you
categorize such wounds?
534
00:23:08,220 --> 00:23:11,765
These would be
classified as rage wounds.
535
00:23:11,807 --> 00:23:13,809
(Annabeth) 'Thank you.'
536
00:23:16,770 --> 00:23:18,688
no questions, your honor.
537
00:23:20,399 --> 00:23:23,860
Detective Welsh, can you
tell us if any of these knives
538
00:23:23,902 --> 00:23:26,029
were used in the
commission of the crime?
539
00:23:26,071 --> 00:23:27,531
The largest one,
the chef's knife
540
00:23:27,572 --> 00:23:29,324
was found imbedded
in the victim's back.
541
00:23:29,366 --> 00:23:31,594
(Annabeth) 'The one with the
defendant's fingerprints on it?'
542
00:23:31,618 --> 00:23:34,871
- 'that's correct.'
- Nothing further, your honor.
543
00:23:36,248 --> 00:23:38,500
Thank you for your
good work, detective.
544
00:23:38,542 --> 00:23:40,752
No questions, your honor.
545
00:23:42,796 --> 00:23:44,714
(Annabeth) 'Pastor rayburn..'
546
00:23:46,007 --> 00:23:47,175
does god speak to you?
547
00:23:47,217 --> 00:23:49,344
- 'Absolutely.'
- in what way?
548
00:23:49,386 --> 00:23:54,224
I sense him in my
heart, in my soul.
549
00:23:54,266 --> 00:23:55,684
In every way possible.
550
00:23:55,725 --> 00:23:57,936
Does god condone killing?
551
00:23:57,978 --> 00:23:59,896
No. Of course not.
552
00:23:59,938 --> 00:24:01,648
(Annabeth) 'Thank you, pastor.'
553
00:24:01,690 --> 00:24:04,234
no further questions,
your honor.
554
00:24:07,946 --> 00:24:09,656
Pastor..
555
00:24:09,698 --> 00:24:10,991
What does the Bible say
556
00:24:11,032 --> 00:24:13,076
that god did to
sodom and gomorrah
557
00:24:13,118 --> 00:24:14,578
for their sins of the flesh?
558
00:24:14,619 --> 00:24:15,871
He destroyed them.
559
00:24:15,912 --> 00:24:17,789
Objection, your
honor. The reference...
560
00:24:17,831 --> 00:24:19,708
Your honor, Ms. Chase is the one
561
00:24:19,749 --> 00:24:21,394
who opened the door
to this line of questioning
562
00:24:21,418 --> 00:24:24,212
when she asked the witness
if god condoned killing.
563
00:24:24,254 --> 00:24:25,881
Actually, I'm objecting
to the reference
564
00:24:25,922 --> 00:24:27,007
to sodom and gomorrah,
565
00:24:27,048 --> 00:24:29,009
in which god did
not ask an individual
566
00:24:29,050 --> 00:24:31,928
to do the destruction,
he did it himself.
567
00:24:31,970 --> 00:24:34,681
And if the court wishes
to get into biblical debates
568
00:24:34,723 --> 00:24:36,808
we'll be here indefinitely.
569
00:24:36,850 --> 00:24:40,604
Stay on target, Dr. Dodds.
570
00:24:40,645 --> 00:24:43,064
Pastor, the last time that Cindy
571
00:24:43,106 --> 00:24:47,903
came to you for help, what
was going on in her life?
572
00:24:49,571 --> 00:24:52,449
She was struggling
to save her marriage.
573
00:24:52,491 --> 00:24:54,493
Struggling against what?
574
00:24:54,534 --> 00:24:57,287
Her husband's sexual obsessions.
575
00:24:57,329 --> 00:25:00,165
'Mm! Could you
be more specific?'
576
00:25:01,750 --> 00:25:05,670
he, he wanted Cindy to have
sex with multiple partners.
577
00:25:07,255 --> 00:25:11,426
(Dodds) 'And what
did Cindy want?'
578
00:25:11,468 --> 00:25:14,513
(male #3) 'A family.
A normal marriage.'
579
00:25:15,388 --> 00:25:17,933
so, when Cindy asked
for your help, what..
580
00:25:17,974 --> 00:25:20,644
What sort of advice
did you give her?
581
00:25:20,685 --> 00:25:23,688
I said the Bible teaches
us to hold marriage sacred
582
00:25:23,730 --> 00:25:26,608
but in this case, her marriage
may not be a real marriage
583
00:25:26,650 --> 00:25:28,902
anymore, but a..
584
00:25:28,944 --> 00:25:31,947
A perversion of marriage.
585
00:25:31,988 --> 00:25:35,283
Oh, so, did you offer a remedy?
586
00:25:38,161 --> 00:25:39,996
I told her to open her heart.
587
00:25:41,498 --> 00:25:44,543
That god would
tell her what to do.
588
00:25:48,672 --> 00:25:51,174
I think we made a big
mistake not arguing religion.
589
00:25:51,216 --> 00:25:52,133
How'd it go?
590
00:25:52,175 --> 00:25:53,611
She's turned into
St. Cindy in there.
591
00:25:53,635 --> 00:25:55,512
We should call the
pastor again for tomorrow.
592
00:25:55,554 --> 00:25:57,764
Steve, this is how she
does it. This is how she wins.
593
00:25:57,806 --> 00:26:00,267
She puts the focus of the
debate as far away from the crime
594
00:26:00,308 --> 00:26:01,786
as possible, and
gets you to follow her.
595
00:26:01,810 --> 00:26:05,897
Guys, good news. I found
the swingers, they want to talk.
596
00:26:05,939 --> 00:26:08,066
Let's not keep them waiting.
597
00:26:09,693 --> 00:26:13,363
We've just been in a state of
utter confusion, Phil and me.
598
00:26:13,405 --> 00:26:16,866
I mean, we couldn't
believe that Barry was dead.
599
00:26:16,908 --> 00:26:19,077
It's just so awful.
600
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:20,579
When we heard all
the horrible things
601
00:26:20,620 --> 00:26:22,998
they were saying
about Barry on TV
602
00:26:23,039 --> 00:26:25,959
particularly because he
was involved in free living..
603
00:26:26,001 --> 00:26:28,795
We knew we had to speak out.
604
00:26:28,837 --> 00:26:31,673
Well, you did the right thing.
605
00:26:31,715 --> 00:26:34,926
Yes, and we are interested
in anything you have to tell us.
606
00:26:34,968 --> 00:26:40,015
Well, first of all,
Barry was a good man.
607
00:26:40,056 --> 00:26:41,099
A sweetheart.
608
00:26:41,141 --> 00:26:43,310
He did not deserve
to die like that.
609
00:26:43,351 --> 00:26:46,354
And second, that woman,
keeps calling herself Cindy
610
00:26:46,396 --> 00:26:49,524
his wife, she's a hypocrite.
611
00:26:49,566 --> 00:26:51,359
You knew Cindy?
612
00:26:51,401 --> 00:26:53,028
We knew her.
613
00:26:54,779 --> 00:26:56,615
As Marie.
614
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,245
We've been getting the
victim's mail since the murder
615
00:27:02,287 --> 00:27:03,997
and that bill just came in.
616
00:27:04,039 --> 00:27:06,249
Barry reserved a moving truck.
617
00:27:06,291 --> 00:27:07,834
Picking it up the day he died.
618
00:27:07,876 --> 00:27:09,336
Somebody up there likes you.
619
00:27:09,377 --> 00:27:10,479
Defense get a hold of that yet?
620
00:27:10,503 --> 00:27:11,856
Yeah, they just
got it this morning.
621
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:13,482
Well, they're going to
claim Cindy didn't know
622
00:27:13,506 --> 00:27:14,633
anything about it.
623
00:27:14,674 --> 00:27:16,217
Now with Marla as her attorney
624
00:27:16,259 --> 00:27:17,677
I have to get
Cindy on the stand.
625
00:27:17,719 --> 00:27:20,472
Dodds won't let that
happen in a million years.
626
00:27:20,513 --> 00:27:21,598
Cindy's a woman scorned.
627
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,475
I have to find a way
to let the jury see that.
628
00:27:23,516 --> 00:27:24,601
Let the evidence show them.
629
00:27:24,643 --> 00:27:26,019
That's just it, dodds has a way
630
00:27:26,061 --> 00:27:27,771
of making evidence irrelevant.
631
00:27:27,812 --> 00:27:30,023
I have to provoke
Cindy to testify.
632
00:27:34,569 --> 00:27:37,030
Was Barry alone when he came
633
00:27:37,072 --> 00:27:39,866
to the free living sex
parties here in Indianapolis?
634
00:27:39,908 --> 00:27:42,786
First of all, they're
not parties, or orgies
635
00:27:42,827 --> 00:27:45,538
they're sexual
exploration seminars.
636
00:27:45,580 --> 00:27:48,166
The witness will
answer the question.
637
00:27:48,208 --> 00:27:53,088
Did Barry come to these
sexual seminars alone?
638
00:27:53,129 --> 00:27:54,506
No.
639
00:27:54,547 --> 00:27:56,049
Who did he come with?
640
00:27:56,091 --> 00:27:59,094
He came with his
girlfriend, Marie.
641
00:27:59,135 --> 00:28:02,847
- Is Marie here today?
- Yes.
642
00:28:02,889 --> 00:28:05,725
Would you point
her out to us, please?
643
00:28:06,810 --> 00:28:08,436
Oh, she's lying.
644
00:28:08,478 --> 00:28:09,813
Objection, your honor.
645
00:28:09,854 --> 00:28:13,400
This is an
unsubstantiated allegation.
646
00:28:13,441 --> 00:28:15,276
Your honor..
647
00:28:16,403 --> 00:28:18,780
This dress..
648
00:28:18,822 --> 00:28:21,241
With a name tag
that reads in full..
649
00:28:21,282 --> 00:28:25,370
"Free living seminar.
Hi, my name is Marie."
650
00:28:25,412 --> 00:28:26,913
Was found in the
delacroix's bedroom.
651
00:28:26,955 --> 00:28:29,874
In Barry delacroix's
closet, not Cindy's.
652
00:28:29,916 --> 00:28:32,919
Your honor, we are checking
DNA from the dress against DNA
653
00:28:32,961 --> 00:28:34,045
taken from the defendant.
654
00:28:34,087 --> 00:28:36,089
But if need be the
witness can identify
655
00:28:36,131 --> 00:28:40,051
certain birthmarks on
the defendant's body.
656
00:28:43,847 --> 00:28:45,724
Withdrawn.
657
00:28:48,685 --> 00:28:51,563
What happened when
you first met Cindy?
658
00:28:51,604 --> 00:28:54,524
She was real nervous,
so I got her a drink
659
00:28:54,566 --> 00:28:56,151
and we just talked.
660
00:28:56,192 --> 00:28:59,571
She enjoys drinking white
Russians, and so do I.
661
00:28:59,612 --> 00:29:02,115
So I-I told her that they
don't have to be fattening
662
00:29:02,157 --> 00:29:03,825
if you make 'em with skim milk.
663
00:29:03,867 --> 00:29:05,702
(Annabeth) 'And
then what happened?'
664
00:29:05,744 --> 00:29:09,873
she met my husband Phil,
and we danced a little bit
665
00:29:09,914 --> 00:29:13,585
and, eventually, we
hooked up with Barry.
666
00:29:13,626 --> 00:29:15,587
And then with a
couple of other couples
667
00:29:15,628 --> 00:29:19,799
and, you know, had sex.
668
00:29:23,428 --> 00:29:25,430
Who had sex?
669
00:29:25,472 --> 00:29:28,475
We all had sex. Together.
670
00:29:32,312 --> 00:29:34,272
Did you have sexual relations
671
00:29:34,314 --> 00:29:36,941
with Cindy delacroix
at this seminar?
672
00:29:36,983 --> 00:29:39,068
Yes. Two different times.
673
00:29:39,110 --> 00:29:40,820
This is wrong.
674
00:29:41,863 --> 00:29:43,782
Was she a willing participant?
675
00:29:43,823 --> 00:29:47,118
- I would say so.
- Based on..
676
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:48,745
Based on..
677
00:29:50,205 --> 00:29:51,706
She was very giving.
678
00:29:51,748 --> 00:29:57,170
And she certainly
seemed... Satisfied.
679
00:29:57,212 --> 00:29:59,964
She cannot say this about me.
680
00:30:00,006 --> 00:30:01,341
Take your seat, Mrs. Delacroix.
681
00:30:01,382 --> 00:30:03,593
She also came back to
three different seminars.
682
00:30:03,635 --> 00:30:04,594
She is lying!
683
00:30:04,636 --> 00:30:06,179
[Gavel banging]
No, let go of me!
684
00:30:06,221 --> 00:30:09,098
This woman is lying,
and I demand to be heard!
685
00:30:09,140 --> 00:30:10,642
This is my trial.
686
00:30:10,683 --> 00:30:12,894
(Judge p. Teague) 'Order!
The defendant will be silent.'
687
00:30:12,936 --> 00:30:15,730
'counselors, approach
the bench now.'
688
00:30:19,567 --> 00:30:21,378
there is nothing more
fundamental then the right
689
00:30:21,402 --> 00:30:23,279
of the accused to speak
in her own defense.
690
00:30:23,321 --> 00:30:25,532
What about the rights
against self-incrimination?
691
00:30:25,573 --> 00:30:26,717
She's on the record as saying
692
00:30:26,741 --> 00:30:28,868
she wishes to
testify, Dr. Dodds.
693
00:30:28,910 --> 00:30:32,622
'Has she expressed this
wish to your privately as well?'
694
00:30:34,207 --> 00:30:36,125
she has, your honor.
695
00:30:36,167 --> 00:30:38,169
Then that is her right.
696
00:30:43,258 --> 00:30:44,926
(Cindy) 'We've been
married for 12 years'
697
00:30:44,968 --> 00:30:47,971
'and our sex life had
always been normal.'
698
00:30:48,012 --> 00:30:53,268
but then Barry started telling
me how repressed he felt.
699
00:30:53,309 --> 00:30:56,145
That he enjoyed other things.
700
00:30:56,855 --> 00:30:58,439
I know this is difficult, Cindy
701
00:30:58,481 --> 00:31:02,819
but you need to
be more specific.
702
00:31:04,279 --> 00:31:07,365
The lord wanted me
to do whatever it took
703
00:31:07,407 --> 00:31:09,075
to save my marriage.
704
00:31:09,117 --> 00:31:13,079
Even sleeping with other people?
705
00:31:13,121 --> 00:31:15,123
It wasn't easy.
706
00:31:15,164 --> 00:31:17,250
'Or pleasurable.'
707
00:31:17,292 --> 00:31:20,795
I didn't enjoy anything,
like that woman said
708
00:31:20,837 --> 00:31:24,173
but Barry wanted to experiment.
709
00:31:24,215 --> 00:31:26,259
And did you want to experiment?
710
00:31:27,719 --> 00:31:30,680
I didn't want to
lose my husband.
711
00:31:30,722 --> 00:31:34,183
Love, honor and
obey your husband.
712
00:31:34,225 --> 00:31:36,686
Those may be
words to some people
713
00:31:36,728 --> 00:31:39,188
but to me, they're not.
714
00:31:39,230 --> 00:31:41,441
'And I loved him..'
715
00:31:41,482 --> 00:31:44,235
so much, I lowered myself.
716
00:31:46,029 --> 00:31:48,406
It was..
717
00:31:48,448 --> 00:31:50,450
Sickening.
718
00:31:50,491 --> 00:31:52,827
'So, I prayed for guidance.'
719
00:31:52,869 --> 00:31:56,623
I asked the lord to protect me.
720
00:31:56,664 --> 00:31:58,833
And he answered me.
721
00:32:00,501 --> 00:32:02,587
How?
722
00:32:02,629 --> 00:32:05,048
A voice.
723
00:32:05,089 --> 00:32:07,216
God spoke to me.
724
00:32:07,258 --> 00:32:10,094
He said he was with me
725
00:32:10,136 --> 00:32:13,181
but that I needed
to protect myself.
726
00:32:15,141 --> 00:32:18,102
He told me to pick up the knife.
727
00:32:18,144 --> 00:32:20,188
He told me he
would guide my hand.
728
00:32:21,230 --> 00:32:23,483
And that's the last
thing I remember.
729
00:32:28,279 --> 00:32:31,991
So, it's your testimony that
you had sex with Cheryl pierson
730
00:32:32,033 --> 00:32:34,160
but you did not enjoy it?
731
00:32:35,244 --> 00:32:37,121
I did not.
732
00:32:37,163 --> 00:32:39,123
You did not enjoy it twice?
733
00:32:39,165 --> 00:32:41,668
- 'Objection, your honor.'
- 'Withdrawn.'
734
00:32:41,709 --> 00:32:46,089
did Barry force you to
have sex with other people?
735
00:32:46,130 --> 00:32:50,760
Did he hurt you or threaten you?
736
00:32:50,802 --> 00:32:52,428
I knew it was what he wanted.
737
00:32:52,470 --> 00:32:55,181
But did he physically force you?
738
00:32:56,182 --> 00:32:57,016
No.
739
00:32:57,058 --> 00:32:59,227
'Did he threaten
you in any way?'
740
00:33:00,603 --> 00:33:02,522
no.
741
00:33:02,563 --> 00:33:05,108
Did things improve
between you and Barry
742
00:33:05,149 --> 00:33:07,110
after you had sex
with other people?
743
00:33:07,151 --> 00:33:08,695
No, they did not.
744
00:33:08,736 --> 00:33:11,864
In fact, Barry reserved
a rental moving truck
745
00:33:11,906 --> 00:33:13,741
six days before the murder.
746
00:33:13,783 --> 00:33:15,618
Isn't that true?
747
00:33:15,660 --> 00:33:17,495
I'm not sure.
748
00:33:20,498 --> 00:33:23,376
It must have been awful for you
749
00:33:23,418 --> 00:33:26,170
to have lowered
yourself like that.
750
00:33:26,212 --> 00:33:28,923
Sacrificed your standards
751
00:33:28,965 --> 00:33:30,550
your morals, your own body.
752
00:33:30,591 --> 00:33:35,471
I prayed that he would
see the error of his ways.
753
00:33:35,513 --> 00:33:38,474
Because god gives us free will.
754
00:33:38,516 --> 00:33:39,851
That's right.
755
00:33:39,892 --> 00:33:42,311
Did god tell you to
go to those sex parties
756
00:33:42,353 --> 00:33:45,523
or did you choose that
of your own free will?
757
00:33:45,565 --> 00:33:47,483
I did it to save my marriage.
758
00:33:47,525 --> 00:33:51,029
But you chose to
stay in that marriage.
759
00:33:51,070 --> 00:33:53,364
'Barry wanted a
divorce. He wanted out.'
760
00:33:53,406 --> 00:33:57,035
he told you he intended to
have sex with other people
761
00:33:57,076 --> 00:33:58,911
but you chose to stay.
762
00:33:58,953 --> 00:34:00,580
I loved him.
763
00:34:00,621 --> 00:34:03,583
Love is a powerful
thing, Mrs. Delacroix
764
00:34:03,624 --> 00:34:05,877
but so is rage.
765
00:34:05,918 --> 00:34:07,587
So is shame.
766
00:34:07,628 --> 00:34:10,423
Like the shame you felt
when you attended sex party
767
00:34:10,465 --> 00:34:13,885
after sex party, debased
yourself with another woman
768
00:34:13,926 --> 00:34:16,471
'and Barry told you he
was moving out, anyway.'
769
00:34:16,512 --> 00:34:19,390
and the rage you felt when
you picked up that knife
770
00:34:19,432 --> 00:34:22,643
and of your own free will
stabbed him in the back.
771
00:34:22,685 --> 00:34:24,353
- No.
- 'You wanted revenge.'
772
00:34:24,395 --> 00:34:25,748
you wanted him to
pay, you wanted him
773
00:34:25,772 --> 00:34:27,190
to hurt the way
you were hurting.
774
00:34:27,231 --> 00:34:30,651
I just didn't want
him to leave me!
775
00:34:44,290 --> 00:34:45,208
How great was that?
776
00:34:45,249 --> 00:34:46,417
If this were any other trial
777
00:34:46,459 --> 00:34:47,835
I'd say you made your case
778
00:34:47,877 --> 00:34:49,754
but whatever you did,
dodds has succeeded
779
00:34:49,796 --> 00:34:51,464
in making god the defendant.
780
00:34:51,506 --> 00:34:53,859
There are one or two jurors just
lapping up everything she says.
781
00:34:53,883 --> 00:34:55,194
You're gonna have
to get through to them.
782
00:34:55,218 --> 00:34:56,928
It all comes down to
the closing argument.
783
00:34:56,969 --> 00:34:59,847
You're gonna have to make a
better sermon than she does.
784
00:35:03,559 --> 00:35:06,646
God is real
785
00:35:06,687 --> 00:35:11,400
and god speaks to us all.
786
00:35:11,442 --> 00:35:16,114
'But most of us
choose to ignore him'
787
00:35:16,155 --> 00:35:18,574
because most of us don't want..
788
00:35:20,368 --> 00:35:22,328
To hear his word
789
00:35:22,370 --> 00:35:24,205
because if we did..
790
00:35:25,414 --> 00:35:29,377
We might be called upon to act.
791
00:35:30,378 --> 00:35:32,255
To sacrifice.
792
00:35:33,798 --> 00:35:36,050
I'm sure that
793
00:35:36,092 --> 00:35:38,678
that many of you
794
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:42,181
have a personal
relationship with god
795
00:35:42,223 --> 00:35:45,393
'but you are also under attack'
796
00:35:45,434 --> 00:35:47,562
because in this country
797
00:35:47,603 --> 00:35:50,022
if a person says
798
00:35:50,064 --> 00:35:53,776
that god speaks to
them, not in an intellectual
799
00:35:53,818 --> 00:35:57,989
or metaphorical way,
but actually, actually
800
00:35:58,030 --> 00:36:01,784
speaks to them, that person..
801
00:36:03,536 --> 00:36:05,746
Will be vilified.
802
00:36:06,789 --> 00:36:11,210
'Barry delacroix
was a lost man.'
803
00:36:12,962 --> 00:36:15,298
'he lost his faith.'
804
00:36:15,339 --> 00:36:18,968
'he chose to live
a life of perversity'
805
00:36:19,010 --> 00:36:22,930
and depravity, and he wanted
806
00:36:22,972 --> 00:36:25,600
and expected his wife
807
00:36:25,641 --> 00:36:27,185
to do the same.
808
00:36:27,226 --> 00:36:29,312
He wanted his wife
809
00:36:29,353 --> 00:36:32,148
to have homosexual experiences
810
00:36:32,190 --> 00:36:34,984
for his entertainment.
811
00:36:35,026 --> 00:36:38,988
He wanted to offer
her body to other men
812
00:36:39,030 --> 00:36:42,909
for their sexual gratification.
813
00:36:42,950 --> 00:36:45,661
Now, you tell me
814
00:36:45,703 --> 00:36:48,706
who has committed
the crime here?
815
00:36:49,665 --> 00:36:54,378
'This man, or this woman'
816
00:36:54,420 --> 00:36:56,714
who has listened
817
00:36:56,756 --> 00:37:00,551
to the never-changing voice..
818
00:37:02,678 --> 00:37:05,097
Of a moral god?
819
00:37:12,104 --> 00:37:14,941
Does the prosecution
wish to rebut?
820
00:37:20,655 --> 00:37:22,073
I'm not here to debate
821
00:37:22,114 --> 00:37:25,618
whether Cindy delacroix
is a woman of faith.
822
00:37:27,245 --> 00:37:30,623
I don't know if god
has provided her
823
00:37:30,665 --> 00:37:35,169
comfort and guidance
throughout her life.
824
00:37:35,211 --> 00:37:37,129
I hope he has.
825
00:37:37,171 --> 00:37:41,384
I'm here to see
that Cindy delacroix
826
00:37:41,425 --> 00:37:45,721
is held responsible for
the act she committed.
827
00:37:48,641 --> 00:37:50,559
Her husband Barry
828
00:37:50,601 --> 00:37:53,980
had some strange
ideas, I'll give you that.
829
00:37:54,897 --> 00:38:01,320
But he never forced
her to do anything.
830
00:38:01,362 --> 00:38:04,448
He tried to extricate
himself from the marriage
831
00:38:04,490 --> 00:38:06,909
so they could both lead
the lives they wanted
832
00:38:06,951 --> 00:38:10,913
but instead, Cindy chose
833
00:38:10,955 --> 00:38:13,207
to attend numerous
sex parties with him
834
00:38:13,249 --> 00:38:17,461
where she chose to have
sex with other people.
835
00:38:18,629 --> 00:38:22,049
When Barry decided
to leave, anyway
836
00:38:22,091 --> 00:38:26,095
Cindy chose to take
matters into her own hands.
837
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:31,142
She chose a particular knife
838
00:38:31,183 --> 00:38:35,896
and when her husband was
about to walk out the door forever
839
00:38:35,938 --> 00:38:38,566
she chose to Bury that knife
840
00:38:38,607 --> 00:38:41,777
in his back, not once..
841
00:38:42,737 --> 00:38:45,072
Not twice..
842
00:38:46,115 --> 00:38:48,784
Three times.
843
00:38:57,501 --> 00:39:01,297
Cindy delacroix is not a Saint.
844
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:05,134
She is a murderer.
845
00:39:10,848 --> 00:39:13,100
[Dramatic music]
846
00:39:15,353 --> 00:39:18,314
(Judge p. Teague) Will
the defendant please rise.
847
00:39:19,732 --> 00:39:23,319
Members of the jury,
have you reached a verdict?
848
00:39:23,361 --> 00:39:26,238
- We have, your honor.
- 'What say you?'
849
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:29,033
on the sole count of
murder, we the jury
850
00:39:29,075 --> 00:39:31,660
'find the defendant,
Cindy delacroix..'
851
00:39:36,082 --> 00:39:37,249
guilty.
852
00:39:37,291 --> 00:39:39,668
[Indistinct chatter]
853
00:39:39,710 --> 00:39:41,563
(Judge p. Teague) 'Bailiffs,
take charge of the defendant.'
854
00:39:41,587 --> 00:39:44,173
'members of the jury, this
completes your service.'
855
00:39:44,215 --> 00:39:46,467
'you are dismissed with
the thanks of the court.'
856
00:39:46,509 --> 00:39:48,636
'we are adjourned.'
857
00:39:48,677 --> 00:39:50,012
[indistinct chatter]
858
00:39:50,054 --> 00:39:54,558
♪ All things bright
and beautiful ♪
859
00:39:54,600 --> 00:40:00,689
♪ all creatures
great and small ♪
860
00:40:00,731 --> 00:40:05,444
♪ all things wise
and wonderful ♪
861
00:40:05,486 --> 00:40:10,658
♪ the lord god made them all ♪
862
00:40:10,699 --> 00:40:16,163
♪ each little
flower that opens ♪
863
00:40:16,205 --> 00:40:21,502
♪ each little bird that sings ♪
864
00:40:21,544 --> 00:40:26,882
♪ he made their glowing colors ♪
865
00:40:26,924 --> 00:40:32,721
♪ he made their tiny wings ♪
866
00:40:32,763 --> 00:40:37,393
♪ all things bright
and beautiful ♪
867
00:40:37,435 --> 00:40:43,441
♪ all creatures
great and small ♪
868
00:40:43,482 --> 00:40:48,362
♪ all things wise
and wonderful ♪
869
00:40:48,404 --> 00:40:50,364
♪ the lord god ♪
870
00:40:50,406 --> 00:40:54,869
♪ made them all ♪♪
871
00:40:57,830 --> 00:41:01,125
(Annabeth) Stay tuned for
scenes from our next episode.
872
00:41:01,876 --> 00:41:03,961
[Instrumental music]
64827
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