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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:01,710 --> 00:00:04,720 2 00:00:14,990 --> 00:00:17,770 3 00:00:17,820 --> 00:00:20,860 They call it March Madness for a reason. 4 00:00:20,910 --> 00:00:24,040 5 00:00:36,570 --> 00:00:39,270 And every tournament is better with an underdog, right? 6 00:00:41,580 --> 00:00:44,930 7 00:00:44,970 --> 00:00:46,850 The hottest thing in Chicago sports right now 8 00:00:46,890 --> 00:00:49,940 isn't the Cubs, the Sox, the Bulls, or the Blackhawks. 9 00:00:49,980 --> 00:00:51,280 Here comes the player of the year 10 00:00:51,330 --> 00:00:53,680 of the MVC, he rises, oh! 11 00:00:53,720 --> 00:00:55,200 It's the Loyola Ramblers. 12 00:00:55,250 --> 00:00:57,120 And the dream is alive! 13 00:00:58,120 --> 00:00:59,810 14 00:00:59,860 --> 00:01:01,640 But our journey was more important 15 00:01:01,690 --> 00:01:02,900 than the buzzer beaters. 16 00:01:02,950 --> 00:01:05,950 Townes for three, yes! 17 00:01:07,780 --> 00:01:09,910 With every round we advanced, 18 00:01:09,960 --> 00:01:11,910 we were reminded of our past. 19 00:01:11,960 --> 00:01:15,270 20 00:01:15,310 --> 00:01:16,180 Away we go, 21 00:01:16,220 --> 00:01:19,530 Loyola Chicago controls the tip. 22 00:01:19,570 --> 00:01:22,360 Egan, Egan to Harkness, turnaround jumper's good. 23 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,970 Jerry made his first basket, he made it, he might do it. 24 00:01:26,010 --> 00:01:29,280 When you study the early days of basketball, 25 00:01:29,320 --> 00:01:31,240 Loyola Chicago sticks out. 26 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:33,200 The youth of America, they need to know 27 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:34,810 what that generation went through, 28 00:01:34,850 --> 00:01:37,070 and they need to carry the baton. 29 00:01:37,110 --> 00:01:38,590 Jerry Harkness was the captain 30 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:40,730 of that Loyola team and joins us now. 31 00:01:40,770 --> 00:01:43,120 What a pleasure it is to meet you, sir. 32 00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:44,600 It's a pleasure to be here. 33 00:01:45,510 --> 00:01:47,860 Custer looking for help, gets it, Williamson. 34 00:01:47,910 --> 00:01:51,340 35 00:01:51,390 --> 00:01:53,480 My name is Lucas Williamson. 36 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:56,650 I was a freshman in 2018 when the Loyola Ramblers 37 00:01:56,700 --> 00:01:58,740 made it to the Final Four, 38 00:01:58,790 --> 00:02:03,230 for the first time in 55 years. 39 00:02:04,620 --> 00:02:07,750 We were always told how the '63 team made history, 40 00:02:08,620 --> 00:02:10,580 but it was in the forgotten details 41 00:02:10,620 --> 00:02:12,760 that I found a deeper connection. 42 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:15,720 My absolute and unshakeable stance 43 00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:19,290 for segregation of the races at all levels. 44 00:02:19,330 --> 00:02:20,290 Go home, nigger. 45 00:02:20,330 --> 00:02:22,680 This is not 200 years ago. 46 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:24,250 These are our fathers and our grandfathers 47 00:02:24,290 --> 00:02:26,210 that have gone through this. 48 00:02:26,250 --> 00:02:29,170 This was more than a game, this was history. 49 00:02:30,950 --> 00:02:32,390 It's time the rest of the world 50 00:02:32,430 --> 00:02:33,820 hears their whole story, 51 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:36,820 about those who changed the game, 52 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:40,960 by playing it their way. 53 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:43,660 54 00:02:44,830 --> 00:02:48,180 55 00:02:54,970 --> 00:02:56,280 56 00:02:56,320 --> 00:03:00,150 The story of any great team begins with the coach. 57 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:04,070 And in this case, a day he would never forget. 58 00:03:05,550 --> 00:03:09,680 It is very hard for me to think back to that day in 1959. 59 00:03:10,900 --> 00:03:13,430 I was in nursing school at Loyola. 60 00:03:13,470 --> 00:03:15,650 And I came out of class the one day, 61 00:03:15,690 --> 00:03:18,740 and it was just a regular kind of autumn day. 62 00:03:19,870 --> 00:03:21,610 My dad was George Ireland. 63 00:03:21,650 --> 00:03:24,870 He was the Loyola University basketball coach. 64 00:03:25,870 --> 00:03:28,750 There was something different about Dad that day. 65 00:03:28,790 --> 00:03:32,100 I don't know if something happened at practice, at school, 66 00:03:33,050 --> 00:03:35,450 but I walked over towards Dad's office 67 00:03:35,490 --> 00:03:37,150 and I looked up and I thought, 68 00:03:37,190 --> 00:03:38,930 "Well, what on Earth can that be?" 69 00:03:42,110 --> 00:03:46,590 And it was a hanging effigy of my father. 70 00:03:48,460 --> 00:03:51,770 I thought, "How could someone do that to my dad?" 71 00:03:53,950 --> 00:03:57,040 There were chants, "Get rid of Ireland." 72 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:58,780 "We need a new coach." 73 00:04:00,260 --> 00:04:02,390 Those students were totally unhappy. 74 00:04:02,430 --> 00:04:04,040 They wanted him out. 75 00:04:05,300 --> 00:04:09,090 His job was in jeopardy because he was losing. 76 00:04:09,130 --> 00:04:13,440 We played hard, but we didn't have a lot of talent. 77 00:04:13,490 --> 00:04:16,880 He had to start bringing new players in. 78 00:04:18,010 --> 00:04:20,970 George Ireland had to confront all this stuff. 79 00:04:21,020 --> 00:04:24,150 He knew if he kept going the way he was going, 80 00:04:24,190 --> 00:04:25,320 he was done as a coach. 81 00:04:26,460 --> 00:04:29,630 82 00:04:35,290 --> 00:04:36,730 The one thing about basketball 83 00:04:36,770 --> 00:04:40,030 is all you need is that backboard and hoop, and a ball. 84 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:42,860 In cities where there's a big population, 85 00:04:42,910 --> 00:04:46,390 not much space, well, it's the perfect game. 86 00:04:46,430 --> 00:04:49,480 The best players in the country were from Harlem. 87 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:51,830 They were playing a style of basketball 88 00:04:51,870 --> 00:04:54,270 that was up-tempo and fast-paced. 89 00:04:54,310 --> 00:04:55,440 One of the best ways 90 00:04:55,490 --> 00:04:56,920 that I've heard it described 91 00:04:56,960 --> 00:05:00,750 is the old school basketball was played on the floor 92 00:05:00,790 --> 00:05:03,880 and modern basketball was played in the air. 93 00:05:03,930 --> 00:05:07,110 94 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:10,760 It felt like the early style of basketball 95 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:13,370 was like some sort of exercise in calisthenics. 96 00:05:13,420 --> 00:05:14,680 You know, people stretching 97 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:17,680 and there wasn't very much athleticism to it. 98 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:21,470 George Ireland was losing, teams weren't very good. 99 00:05:21,510 --> 00:05:26,430 We're playing staid, feet-in-the-mud-in-concrete basketball. 100 00:05:26,470 --> 00:05:27,950 And it's time to change. 101 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,910 These black players were changing the game 102 00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:34,090 and they were making it so exciting. 103 00:05:34,130 --> 00:05:39,140 This was a time when superstars were heavily recruited. 104 00:05:39,660 --> 00:05:41,660 105 00:05:41,710 --> 00:05:44,490 Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson, 106 00:05:44,530 --> 00:05:46,360 everybody knew who these guys were, 107 00:05:46,410 --> 00:05:48,540 a lot of coaches wanted them. 108 00:05:48,580 --> 00:05:51,850 But for the next tier of players down, 109 00:05:51,890 --> 00:05:55,410 black guys who were merely excellent basketball players, 110 00:05:55,460 --> 00:05:57,590 nobody wanted them. 111 00:05:57,630 --> 00:05:59,850 For the black athlete, the landscape 112 00:05:59,900 --> 00:06:02,250 of these kids playing on university campuses 113 00:06:02,290 --> 00:06:04,680 or in the NBA just wasn't there. 114 00:06:04,730 --> 00:06:07,510 George Ireland was thinking about job security. 115 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:10,300 He just wanted to win and he didn't care who you were. 116 00:06:11,300 --> 00:06:15,300 117 00:06:17,610 --> 00:06:20,870 My father, Jerry Harkness, was born in Harlem, New York. 118 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:25,920 And he lived in very harsh conditions in the projects. 119 00:06:26,970 --> 00:06:29,580 He's ultra competitive, and I've always wondered 120 00:06:29,620 --> 00:06:32,540 where did that competitive drive come from? 121 00:06:32,580 --> 00:06:33,710 The resilience? 122 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:36,800 As a child in the 1940s, 123 00:06:36,850 --> 00:06:38,460 Jerry remembers his own father 124 00:06:38,500 --> 00:06:41,370 returning home from the war a hero. 125 00:06:41,420 --> 00:06:43,640 But the fanfare faded, and soon 126 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:46,470 he was just a young black man trying to build a life. 127 00:06:46,510 --> 00:06:49,950 He did everything to try to get work. 128 00:06:49,990 --> 00:06:52,730 The more Italian and Irish come in, 129 00:06:52,780 --> 00:06:55,040 the less work he would have. 130 00:06:55,080 --> 00:07:00,090 He could not take that pressure and he left us. 131 00:07:01,870 --> 00:07:04,000 My mom was a go-getter, 132 00:07:04,050 --> 00:07:07,660 and she pretty much had to be when my dad left. 133 00:07:07,700 --> 00:07:12,710 And I could see her really trying to keep it all together. 134 00:07:14,450 --> 00:07:17,450 The financial stress was overwhelming. 135 00:07:17,500 --> 00:07:20,500 At one point, his mother had a mental breakdown 136 00:07:20,540 --> 00:07:23,110 and admitted herself into Bellevue Hospital. 137 00:07:24,550 --> 00:07:28,250 When she got out, I looked her in the eyes. 138 00:07:28,290 --> 00:07:31,160 I knew that we were gonna be all right. 139 00:07:31,210 --> 00:07:34,030 She said, "I'm gonna get a job, we're gonna make it. 140 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:38,340 We're not gonna depend on anybody but the three of us." 141 00:07:40,910 --> 00:07:44,310 To see her go through what she went through, 142 00:07:44,350 --> 00:07:49,350 I said, "If she can do things like that, I can make it." 143 00:07:49,660 --> 00:07:51,180 144 00:07:51,230 --> 00:07:53,140 Young Jerry loved playing basketball 145 00:07:53,180 --> 00:07:55,530 on the streets of Harlem, but he never figured 146 00:07:55,580 --> 00:07:58,710 he was good enough to make his high school team. 147 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:00,800 To him, the game was an escape. 148 00:08:02,670 --> 00:08:04,150 And when he'd save up a quarter, 149 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:06,330 he'd go practice alone at the Y. 150 00:08:06,370 --> 00:08:08,850 151 00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:12,940 I could still see myself bouncing back and forth, 152 00:08:12,990 --> 00:08:15,160 and then going up for the shot, 153 00:08:15,210 --> 00:08:17,900 saying "Good, we win." 154 00:08:19,820 --> 00:08:23,000 All of a sudden, a guy hit me on my shoulder, 155 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,220 and he said, "Hey, you're pretty good." 156 00:08:27,700 --> 00:08:30,830 My eyes got wide, my mouth jumped open. 157 00:08:32,010 --> 00:08:36,790 It was my hero, 158 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:38,100 Jackie Robinson. 159 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:44,800 So when a guy like that tells me I'm not that bad, 160 00:08:45,580 --> 00:08:47,590 maybe he's right. 161 00:08:47,630 --> 00:08:50,680 I said, "I'm going out for the team." 162 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:54,640 My coach, he asked me, "Are you set for college?" 163 00:08:54,680 --> 00:08:56,730 I said, "No, I don't have any offer." 164 00:08:56,770 --> 00:08:59,690 He said, "We're gonna work on that." 165 00:08:59,730 --> 00:09:01,910 George Ireland was coming up to Harlem 166 00:09:01,950 --> 00:09:03,560 to watch the ball players. 167 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,780 My coach told him, "There's a guy here 168 00:09:06,820 --> 00:09:08,780 that doesn't have the recognition 169 00:09:08,830 --> 00:09:12,610 the other players have because he only played one year. 170 00:09:12,660 --> 00:09:14,310 Why don't you give him a chance?" 171 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:19,230 So I was trying to impress this guy 172 00:09:20,100 --> 00:09:23,100 like he was the man that had my future, 173 00:09:23,140 --> 00:09:26,320 because this was pretty much my last chance. 174 00:09:27,670 --> 00:09:30,190 If I don't get this, I'm finished. 175 00:09:33,020 --> 00:09:36,110 And that was the beginning of Jerry Harkness. 176 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:37,900 With Jerry joining the Ramblers, 177 00:09:37,940 --> 00:09:41,470 Coach Ireland developed a whole new vision for his team. 178 00:09:41,510 --> 00:09:45,120 Jerry was a speedster. 179 00:09:45,170 --> 00:09:47,430 My father was a great track athlete 180 00:09:47,470 --> 00:09:49,910 prior to becoming a basketball player. 181 00:09:49,950 --> 00:09:52,870 We had to run two miles every day before practice 182 00:09:52,910 --> 00:09:56,700 because of Harkness, because he loved running. 183 00:09:56,740 --> 00:10:00,660 I remember one coach said, "Put the ball on the floor. 184 00:10:00,700 --> 00:10:05,010 Now pick it up. Jerry Harkness just scored a bucket." 185 00:10:05,060 --> 00:10:07,230 Jerry was kind of in command. 186 00:10:07,270 --> 00:10:10,500 You could see the growth that was happening. 187 00:10:10,540 --> 00:10:12,500 And that was the best season he had had 188 00:10:12,540 --> 00:10:15,670 in about five or six years, that saved him. 189 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:18,290 And then we came along. 190 00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:22,940 Ireland took me to a St. Rita's game. 191 00:10:22,990 --> 00:10:24,680 And I'm looking at the game and I said, 192 00:10:24,730 --> 00:10:26,690 "I know why he got me here." 193 00:10:28,210 --> 00:10:31,120 He didn't tell me who he was scouting, 194 00:10:31,170 --> 00:10:33,470 but I was looking at these brothers, 195 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:35,170 the center and the forward. 196 00:10:35,220 --> 00:10:38,920 They were 6-10, they were tough. 197 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:41,220 At the end of the game, he said, 198 00:10:41,270 --> 00:10:43,880 "What did you think of the little guard?" 199 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:45,970 200 00:10:46,010 --> 00:10:48,660 I was from St. Rita's high school, born in Chicago. 201 00:10:48,710 --> 00:10:52,320 I loved basketball because I was good at it. 202 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:56,150 I said to myself, "This guy's not a ball player." 203 00:10:56,190 --> 00:10:58,110 I was wrong about that. 204 00:10:58,150 --> 00:10:59,940 Don't let Jack Egan's size fool you. 205 00:10:59,980 --> 00:11:01,810 He's incredibly athletic. 206 00:11:01,850 --> 00:11:04,510 Jack Egan is no nonsense. 207 00:11:04,550 --> 00:11:08,120 He knows what he wants and he is going to get it. 208 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:09,290 And it's important 209 00:11:09,340 --> 00:11:12,690 that you are not gonna be intimidated. 210 00:11:12,730 --> 00:11:15,730 I needed some physical contact with the other team 211 00:11:15,780 --> 00:11:17,610 even though it was basketball. 212 00:11:17,650 --> 00:11:20,170 I think I was fouled more often than anybody else. 213 00:11:22,650 --> 00:11:24,090 Les Hunter and Vic Rouse 214 00:11:24,130 --> 00:11:26,750 both came from Nashville, Tennessee. 215 00:11:26,790 --> 00:11:30,880 I've heard Vic and Les be referred to as a package deal. 216 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:34,060 Mr. Ireland did not recruit Les Hunter, 217 00:11:34,100 --> 00:11:36,450 he recruited Vic Rouse. 218 00:11:36,490 --> 00:11:40,410 Vic Rouse said to him, "If I come to your school, 219 00:11:40,450 --> 00:11:42,240 can Les come with us?" 220 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:43,760 He said, "Of course." 221 00:11:43,810 --> 00:11:46,500 He didn't realize he had a diamond. 222 00:11:46,550 --> 00:11:47,980 Les Hunter may have been 223 00:11:48,030 --> 00:11:50,680 the most talented player on the team. 224 00:11:50,730 --> 00:11:52,640 Vic and Les were the bigs. 225 00:11:52,680 --> 00:11:56,170 They brought that menacing athletic height. 226 00:11:56,210 --> 00:11:58,600 227 00:11:58,650 --> 00:12:00,650 Ronnie Miller came from New York, 228 00:12:00,690 --> 00:12:03,560 a very similar area that my father came from. 229 00:12:03,610 --> 00:12:05,870 When coach met my mother the first time, 230 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:07,790 he completely ignored me. 231 00:12:07,830 --> 00:12:10,050 He promised that any kid that went to his school 232 00:12:10,090 --> 00:12:12,010 for four years would graduate. 233 00:12:12,050 --> 00:12:15,010 George Ireland gave his sales pitch to the parents, 234 00:12:15,050 --> 00:12:16,360 not to the kid. 235 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:18,280 The kid's looking to play big time basketball, 236 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:21,500 he probably wasn't gonna go to Loyola University. 237 00:12:21,540 --> 00:12:23,370 I was probably the best defensive player 238 00:12:23,410 --> 00:12:25,200 on the team, so I could guard someone 239 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:27,760 that was bigger than me. 240 00:12:29,290 --> 00:12:34,250 You had a group of extremely talented freshmen. 241 00:12:34,860 --> 00:12:36,120 I had never played 242 00:12:36,160 --> 00:12:39,910 with such talented players before in my life. 243 00:12:39,950 --> 00:12:42,780 I knew we had something special. 244 00:12:45,390 --> 00:12:48,130 We lost one game as freshmen. 245 00:12:48,170 --> 00:12:51,700 And the word kinda spread throughout college basketball 246 00:12:51,740 --> 00:12:54,090 that Loyola had this excellent freshmen class. 247 00:12:57,880 --> 00:12:59,620 Well, we move up to the varsity, 248 00:13:00,530 --> 00:13:03,060 the reality of big-time basketball 249 00:13:03,100 --> 00:13:05,320 kinda hit me in the face for the first time. 250 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:08,850 There was an unwritten rule 251 00:13:08,890 --> 00:13:11,200 that racialized who played. 252 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:15,850 How many black players can be played 253 00:13:15,900 --> 00:13:17,810 on the court at one time? 254 00:13:18,900 --> 00:13:22,120 One at home, two when you're away, 255 00:13:22,170 --> 00:13:23,780 and three when you're in a pinch, 256 00:13:23,820 --> 00:13:26,170 you need that little extra oomph. 257 00:13:26,210 --> 00:13:28,870 And it's not written anywhere. 258 00:13:28,910 --> 00:13:31,700 It's just kind of what the coaches knew. 259 00:13:31,740 --> 00:13:33,310 The coaches, if they didn't 260 00:13:33,350 --> 00:13:35,310 wanna put black players on the floor, 261 00:13:35,350 --> 00:13:38,700 they wouldn't have recruited them to begin with. 262 00:13:38,750 --> 00:13:43,750 But American higher education was overwhelmingly segregated. 263 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,450 Your student body is 98% white, 264 00:13:48,500 --> 00:13:51,540 the faculty is 99% white, 265 00:13:51,590 --> 00:13:55,110 the alumni are 99 1/2% white. 266 00:13:55,150 --> 00:13:58,030 How many black guys can you put on the floor 267 00:13:58,070 --> 00:14:01,030 to represent this lily white institution 268 00:14:01,070 --> 00:14:04,990 before you're gonna run into blowback? 269 00:14:05,030 --> 00:14:06,910 How far could they go? 270 00:14:06,950 --> 00:14:09,040 I value my job, I value my reputation, 271 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:12,130 so I'm not going to push the system. 272 00:14:12,170 --> 00:14:13,480 I wonder how many coaches 273 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:16,180 were just simply complying with the status quo. 274 00:14:17,180 --> 00:14:18,830 Coach Ireland was careful. 275 00:14:18,870 --> 00:14:21,140 He'd bend the rule, but never break it. 276 00:14:22,270 --> 00:14:25,490 He consistently played three black starters at a time, 277 00:14:25,530 --> 00:14:29,100 but fearing the reaction of fans and university donors, 278 00:14:29,150 --> 00:14:30,540 he never played a fourth. 279 00:14:31,970 --> 00:14:34,930 How George Ireland played us was when Jerry 280 00:14:34,980 --> 00:14:37,200 or Les Hunter would be in foul trouble, 281 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:39,500 or needed a break, I would go in for one of them. 282 00:14:39,550 --> 00:14:43,030 So I played, but I was not allowed to start. 283 00:14:43,070 --> 00:14:45,470 And he'd follow that the whole year. 284 00:14:45,510 --> 00:14:46,730 These athletes were marginalized 285 00:14:46,770 --> 00:14:47,990 and they didn't have the same privileges 286 00:14:48,030 --> 00:14:49,860 as their white teammates did. 287 00:14:49,910 --> 00:14:51,340 And it was openly practiced. 288 00:14:51,380 --> 00:14:54,520 It was openly practiced, and we didn't have any laws 289 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:57,350 to protect individuals from this kind of behavior. 290 00:14:58,390 --> 00:15:01,740 In the North, Jim Crow segregation was practiced, 291 00:15:01,790 --> 00:15:05,530 it was an unspoken rule, but not the law. 292 00:15:05,570 --> 00:15:07,790 But Jim Crow was the law in the South. 293 00:15:09,530 --> 00:15:13,540 My absolute and unshakeable stance 294 00:15:13,580 --> 00:15:16,840 for segregation of the races at all levels. 295 00:15:16,890 --> 00:15:19,940 296 00:15:19,980 --> 00:15:22,720 Ross Barnett was the governor of Mississippi 297 00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:25,900 at the time, rabid segregationist. 298 00:15:25,940 --> 00:15:27,380 You gotta understand, Mississippi 299 00:15:27,420 --> 00:15:29,340 was incredibly racially volatile. 300 00:15:30,420 --> 00:15:32,560 If you even suggested something 301 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:36,650 that included integration, it could be life-threatening. 302 00:15:36,690 --> 00:15:38,000 It was that bad. 303 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:40,870 In his fight to preserve segregation 304 00:15:40,910 --> 00:15:43,390 in the early 1960s, Governor Barnett 305 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:45,830 made a special target out of state sports, 306 00:15:45,870 --> 00:15:49,970 denouncing any competition between white and black athletes. 307 00:15:50,010 --> 00:15:51,920 One team falling under his rule 308 00:15:51,970 --> 00:15:53,880 were the Mississippi State Bulldogs, 309 00:15:53,930 --> 00:15:55,670 led by Coach Babe McCarthy. 310 00:15:56,580 --> 00:15:58,670 For three of the previous four seasons, 311 00:15:58,710 --> 00:16:01,370 Mississippi State won the SEC Championship, 312 00:16:01,410 --> 00:16:03,630 earning a spot in the NCAA tournament. 313 00:16:04,540 --> 00:16:07,030 And each time, Coach McCarthy did as he was told 314 00:16:07,070 --> 00:16:09,330 by the Governor and turned it down. 315 00:16:10,380 --> 00:16:12,900 We grew up doing what we were told to do. 316 00:16:12,940 --> 00:16:15,030 To not be able to go to the tournament, 317 00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:18,600 the attitude of some of the guys was, why do we even play? 318 00:16:18,650 --> 00:16:20,470 We only wanted to go for one reason, 319 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:23,740 and that was to compete and be the best we could be. 320 00:16:23,780 --> 00:16:25,960 When you think about Mississippi, 321 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:29,090 you have to remember that the world was different. 322 00:16:29,130 --> 00:16:31,010 The country was different. 323 00:16:31,050 --> 00:16:35,450 And we had to deal with things differently. 324 00:16:35,490 --> 00:16:40,540 Racism in sports was not a new thing, 325 00:16:40,580 --> 00:16:44,500 it was a part of the life that we lived. 326 00:16:46,670 --> 00:16:49,680 In 2001, I was a grad student at Loyola 327 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:53,900 as a oral historian, and I started talking to the players, 328 00:16:53,940 --> 00:16:56,730 and I started hearing about their experiences. 329 00:16:56,770 --> 00:16:58,730 And I tied that into the context 330 00:16:58,770 --> 00:17:00,430 of what was happening in Chicago, 331 00:17:00,470 --> 00:17:02,690 because Chicago was then and is now, 332 00:17:02,730 --> 00:17:04,690 quite a segregated city. 333 00:17:04,740 --> 00:17:06,480 What was it like for these guys? 334 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:11,520 One of the most surprising things that I have found out, 335 00:17:11,570 --> 00:17:14,830 is things that were going on in the minds of my teammates 336 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:18,530 that I did not know was going on in their mind then. 337 00:17:18,580 --> 00:17:21,400 In particular, someone who I'm very close to, 338 00:17:21,450 --> 00:17:22,580 Jerry Harkness. 339 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:28,060 When I first met him, he was very standoffish. 340 00:17:29,370 --> 00:17:33,330 For more than a year, we had no relationship 341 00:17:33,370 --> 00:17:35,900 other than on the basketball court. 342 00:17:35,940 --> 00:17:39,120 If he was in the locker room, I wouldn't acknowledge him. 343 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:42,210 Jack Egan actually played my mother's high school 344 00:17:42,250 --> 00:17:44,640 in basketball, which was a black team. 345 00:17:44,690 --> 00:17:49,690 And the kids from St. Rita treated my mom's school terribly. 346 00:17:50,650 --> 00:17:53,960 She told me that St. Rita's was racist 347 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:57,090 and they would throw garbage cans at you. 348 00:17:57,140 --> 00:18:00,490 I just drew a conclusion on him early on. 349 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:05,140 I grew up in a neighborhood that was all white. 350 00:18:05,190 --> 00:18:09,190 It was mostly Irish, Polish and Italian. 351 00:18:09,230 --> 00:18:11,800 Marquette Park was known as the neighborhood 352 00:18:11,850 --> 00:18:16,630 that most vehemently resisted the housing initiatives 353 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:20,160 that Martin Luther King came to Chicago to promote. 354 00:18:21,070 --> 00:18:23,290 It was a place where blacks were not welcome. 355 00:18:23,340 --> 00:18:26,300 You could be chased down and even beaten. 356 00:18:26,340 --> 00:18:28,470 I've been in many demonstrations 357 00:18:28,510 --> 00:18:31,740 all across the South, but I can say 358 00:18:31,780 --> 00:18:33,520 that I have never seen, 359 00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:35,220 even in Mississippi and Alabama, 360 00:18:35,260 --> 00:18:39,130 mobs as hostile and as hate-filled 361 00:18:39,180 --> 00:18:40,830 as I'm seeing in Chicago. 362 00:18:42,490 --> 00:18:45,750 When I would go home from Loyola University 363 00:18:45,790 --> 00:18:48,580 to go back to my neighborhood on the Southside, 364 00:18:48,620 --> 00:18:51,890 a lot of my friends had the same kind of notion 365 00:18:51,930 --> 00:18:56,240 that the black players on the team needed me 366 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:59,550 because I was the brains of the outfit. 367 00:18:59,590 --> 00:19:02,370 You know who is? Les Hunter. 368 00:19:03,460 --> 00:19:06,810 There's always been stereotypes about black athletes 369 00:19:06,860 --> 00:19:11,470 that they are all athlete, very little smarts. 370 00:19:11,510 --> 00:19:13,600 African American players were described 371 00:19:13,650 --> 00:19:18,090 as tremendous athletes, you know, a physical specimen. 372 00:19:18,130 --> 00:19:19,520 Whereas a lot of the white players 373 00:19:19,570 --> 00:19:23,350 were described as crafty, smart. 374 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:26,090 You didn't have to be that aware to know 375 00:19:26,140 --> 00:19:27,970 what they were trying to say. 376 00:19:28,010 --> 00:19:30,880 377 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:33,230 Of all the players at the center of this story, 378 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,100 I never had the chance to meet Les Hunter or Vic Rouse. 379 00:19:37,370 --> 00:19:40,720 Vic died in 1999 and Les passed away 380 00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:42,280 during the making of this film. 381 00:19:43,500 --> 00:19:47,770 In many ways, Les and Vic embodied Loyola at their best. 382 00:19:47,810 --> 00:19:52,030 Les was the team's top player and Vic was their top student. 383 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:55,040 And when Les missed a shot, Vic was there to tip it in. 384 00:19:55,990 --> 00:19:58,740 For me, team chemistry is everything, 385 00:19:58,780 --> 00:20:00,780 but you have to earn that trust. 386 00:20:00,820 --> 00:20:04,350 That was true for Jack and Jerry, but in Les and Vic, 387 00:20:04,390 --> 00:20:06,660 the Ramblers always had an example to follow. 388 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:15,190 The program had been under fire. 389 00:20:15,230 --> 00:20:20,240 I saw an opportunity to be a part of the resurgence. 390 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:23,930 You have Loyola that no one 391 00:20:23,980 --> 00:20:27,460 had ever paid attention to before. 392 00:20:27,500 --> 00:20:30,900 If we're going to compete nationally, 393 00:20:30,940 --> 00:20:34,680 what we have to do is get past race. 394 00:20:36,470 --> 00:20:38,120 We weren't ranked, we weren't a team 395 00:20:38,170 --> 00:20:39,690 that people were looking at. 396 00:20:39,730 --> 00:20:41,040 We were an independent school, 397 00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:45,000 so we weren't the preseason pick for anything. 398 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:48,740 In the 1961, '62 season, 399 00:20:48,790 --> 00:20:52,270 Ireland no longer had to rely on Jerry's speed alone. 400 00:20:52,310 --> 00:20:54,310 Now, his whole team could run. 401 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,790 Almost immediately we developed this style 402 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:02,280 of a rebound, a pass and a basket. 403 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:07,020 Get down and score before the defense 404 00:21:07,060 --> 00:21:09,280 had a chance to set up. 405 00:21:09,330 --> 00:21:10,330 That's all it was. 406 00:21:10,370 --> 00:21:13,550 And that's run-and-gun basketball. 407 00:21:13,590 --> 00:21:15,900 408 00:21:15,940 --> 00:21:20,160 Ireland believed in playing his starters a long time. 409 00:21:20,210 --> 00:21:23,600 In the '61, '62 season, the team consisted 410 00:21:23,650 --> 00:21:26,780 of Egan, and a guy named Mike Gavin, Jerry Harkness, 411 00:21:26,820 --> 00:21:28,520 Les Hunter and Vic Rouse. 412 00:21:29,430 --> 00:21:31,650 Ireland's coaching style with that team 413 00:21:31,700 --> 00:21:35,220 was just standing aside and letting them run. 414 00:21:35,270 --> 00:21:39,440 His genius as a coach was to just let them play their game. 415 00:21:39,490 --> 00:21:42,100 416 00:21:43,930 --> 00:21:46,360 In the pros they call it a motion offense, 417 00:21:46,410 --> 00:21:48,240 where someone is always moving. 418 00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:50,980 If you didn't stay with us, 419 00:21:51,020 --> 00:21:52,540 we would score an easy basket. 420 00:22:09,870 --> 00:22:11,910 The Ramblers had some games in the South 421 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:16,790 and they ran into some of the hard truths 422 00:22:16,830 --> 00:22:19,660 of US race relations. 423 00:22:19,700 --> 00:22:21,790 The famous trip to New Orleans 424 00:22:21,830 --> 00:22:23,880 where George Ireland, at the last minute, 425 00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:25,490 told us that we would not be able 426 00:22:25,530 --> 00:22:27,710 to stay together as a team. 427 00:22:27,750 --> 00:22:31,710 The black ball players stayed in Algiers 428 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:35,460 in private homes, while the white players 429 00:22:35,500 --> 00:22:39,330 stayed in New Orleans in hotels. 430 00:22:39,370 --> 00:22:41,850 And he said he didn't know about it 431 00:22:41,900 --> 00:22:43,200 until the last minute. 432 00:22:44,900 --> 00:22:46,250 And I never believed that. 433 00:22:47,120 --> 00:22:49,690 434 00:22:51,120 --> 00:22:54,040 We land in New Orleans and the black guys, 435 00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:56,220 all of us jump into a cab. 436 00:22:56,260 --> 00:22:58,780 And Ireland gets in the cab with us. 437 00:22:58,830 --> 00:23:01,440 And it was a black driver, and he said, 438 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:03,960 "Sir, you're gonna have to get out of my cab. 439 00:23:04,010 --> 00:23:06,530 It's against the law for a white person 440 00:23:06,580 --> 00:23:09,100 to drive in a cab with black people." 441 00:23:09,140 --> 00:23:11,280 And Ireland said, "Well, I'll pay the fine 442 00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:13,150 if you get stopped." 443 00:23:13,190 --> 00:23:15,670 Driver said, "You don't understand. 444 00:23:15,710 --> 00:23:18,280 It's not the fine, I will go to jail." 445 00:23:19,540 --> 00:23:23,460 That's how bad it was in 1962. 446 00:23:23,510 --> 00:23:26,380 When we played Loyola of New Orleans, 447 00:23:26,420 --> 00:23:28,120 the shock hit us. 448 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:32,080 They had a roped-off section for coloreds. 449 00:23:32,120 --> 00:23:33,950 You couldn't talk back, you couldn't fight back, 450 00:23:33,990 --> 00:23:36,470 there was nothing you could do about it. 451 00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:39,260 But you could express that anger 452 00:23:39,300 --> 00:23:44,220 by taking it out on the other squad. 453 00:23:44,260 --> 00:23:46,830 454 00:23:54,270 --> 00:23:57,540 The court was an equalizer. 455 00:23:57,580 --> 00:24:01,150 After the game, the black players went off to Algiers. 456 00:24:01,190 --> 00:24:04,590 And I can honestly say, that was by far 457 00:24:04,630 --> 00:24:07,240 the best trip that we had. 458 00:24:07,290 --> 00:24:09,550 We had no curfew, parties at night, 459 00:24:09,590 --> 00:24:12,380 and the people in the community were so proud of us, 460 00:24:12,420 --> 00:24:13,990 they treated us like kings. 461 00:24:14,900 --> 00:24:18,080 They sent us two brand new Pontiacs to drive. 462 00:24:18,120 --> 00:24:22,520 We had a great time, and we felt so sorry 463 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:24,130 for the white guys. 464 00:24:24,170 --> 00:24:25,390 But in contrast, 465 00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:28,050 what it took us to get to that point. 466 00:24:28,090 --> 00:24:31,790 I felt offended by some of the things that occurred. 467 00:24:34,580 --> 00:24:37,100 After the game, Ireland made headlines 468 00:24:37,140 --> 00:24:39,450 denouncing New Orleans' segregation laws, 469 00:24:39,490 --> 00:24:41,710 vowing that the team would never return. 470 00:24:42,580 --> 00:24:45,760 But just a day later, the truth came out. 471 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,850 Prior to Loyola's trip, another school in New Orleans, 472 00:24:48,890 --> 00:24:52,160 Xavier University, offered to house the entire team. 473 00:24:53,420 --> 00:24:56,080 This rare break from the Jim Crow laws governing the city 474 00:24:56,120 --> 00:24:58,640 would have allowed all the white and black players 475 00:24:58,690 --> 00:25:00,210 to stay together as usual. 476 00:25:01,210 --> 00:25:03,470 But for reasons that were never made clear, 477 00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,040 Ireland declined, and chose instead 478 00:25:06,090 --> 00:25:07,570 to keep the team segregated. 479 00:25:09,180 --> 00:25:11,440 When I heard this story from the players, 480 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:12,570 I couldn't believe it. 481 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:15,790 It's crazy to me that any coach would choose 482 00:25:15,830 --> 00:25:18,750 to separate their team anywhere for any reason. 483 00:25:19,660 --> 00:25:23,060 It's not just unsafe, it's bad strategy. 484 00:25:23,100 --> 00:25:24,580 Your team is your family. 485 00:25:26,190 --> 00:25:30,200 We had to deal not only with the racism 486 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,550 of the South when we would travel down there, 487 00:25:33,590 --> 00:25:35,070 we also had to deal with it 488 00:25:35,110 --> 00:25:38,730 to some degree right here at our home court. 489 00:25:38,770 --> 00:25:41,380 490 00:25:42,730 --> 00:25:45,560 When you think about the Loyola story, 491 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:50,570 you inevitably come to a very complex topic. 492 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,440 We all kinda knew our place. 493 00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:58,360 It doesn't sound right when you say that, 494 00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:00,660 it sounds terrible when you say that. 495 00:26:00,710 --> 00:26:04,060 I just mean that as people, we kinda knew 496 00:26:04,100 --> 00:26:06,150 what we had to do to survive. 497 00:26:07,190 --> 00:26:12,150 They wanted us to be available as tokens. 498 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,420 For example, if they had a party on campus, 499 00:26:16,460 --> 00:26:19,030 they wanted us to stand on the walls, 500 00:26:19,070 --> 00:26:20,770 you know, and be there. 501 00:26:20,810 --> 00:26:23,210 But we weren't supposed to dance with the girls, 502 00:26:23,250 --> 00:26:25,510 we weren't supposed to talk with the girls. 503 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:29,260 And if they come to us and ask us to dance, 504 00:26:29,300 --> 00:26:31,520 we even had Jesuit priests who said, 505 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,350 "No, you don't do that." 506 00:26:33,390 --> 00:26:35,740 507 00:26:35,780 --> 00:26:39,090 The priests had a job and part of their job 508 00:26:39,140 --> 00:26:42,660 was making sure the students were safe. 509 00:26:42,700 --> 00:26:46,450 And unfortunately the black male body 510 00:26:46,490 --> 00:26:50,540 has often been considered, just by existing, unsafe. 511 00:26:53,450 --> 00:26:54,930 I guess I expected to hear 512 00:26:54,980 --> 00:26:57,890 the '63 guys faced discrimination when traveling south, 513 00:26:57,940 --> 00:27:00,330 or maybe even on the court by opponents, 514 00:27:00,370 --> 00:27:02,810 but to know that they were also disrespected at home 515 00:27:02,850 --> 00:27:04,600 makes me furious. 516 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:06,510 And on a call between our two teams, 517 00:27:06,550 --> 00:27:08,690 we got an opportunity to talk about it. 518 00:27:08,730 --> 00:27:12,170 Then I remember, and the other guys will remember this, 519 00:27:12,210 --> 00:27:15,690 we could not go to the barber shop 520 00:27:15,740 --> 00:27:18,390 right across Sheridan Road. 521 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:21,440 They would not cut black guys' hair. 522 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:23,310 You couldn't get a haircut on campus? 523 00:27:23,350 --> 00:27:26,400 Like, you had to go somewhere else to get a haircut? 524 00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:29,970 I guess again, I was blind to what they were experiencing. 525 00:27:30,010 --> 00:27:32,360 Just assumed everything was great. 526 00:27:32,410 --> 00:27:37,110 In the '60s, we didn't express ourselves. 527 00:27:37,150 --> 00:27:40,110 'Cause I really don't think we knew how to talk about it. 528 00:27:40,150 --> 00:27:42,850 You know, the average person might look at it and say, 529 00:27:42,890 --> 00:27:45,200 "That's not, that's not racism." 530 00:27:46,250 --> 00:27:47,070 But it is. 531 00:27:48,550 --> 00:27:50,860 They're going to have to swallow their discontent. 532 00:27:50,900 --> 00:27:52,690 They're going to have to swallow their hurts. 533 00:27:52,730 --> 00:27:55,340 Because the moment they start making waves, 534 00:27:55,390 --> 00:27:57,470 the moment they start asking for things 535 00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:01,090 that they know they should have, they're no longer 536 00:28:01,130 --> 00:28:03,960 just these wonderfully respectable young men 537 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:07,050 that we would be so happy to have amongst us. 538 00:28:07,090 --> 00:28:10,010 There was a mold that they needed to fit. 539 00:28:10,050 --> 00:28:12,750 Not the angry team, not the frustrated, 540 00:28:12,790 --> 00:28:16,930 they were classy, and oh look, how acceptable they are. 541 00:28:18,540 --> 00:28:22,410 That might be why they're not loud and they're not vocal. 542 00:28:24,370 --> 00:28:27,980 It makes you feel completely isolated. 543 00:28:28,030 --> 00:28:32,680 It is a very hard thing to face. 544 00:28:32,730 --> 00:28:35,690 What you say is nothing, what you think is nothing. 545 00:28:36,950 --> 00:28:40,650 That's what it feels like to be discriminated against. 546 00:28:40,690 --> 00:28:43,740 You're invisible, you don't exist. 547 00:28:45,870 --> 00:28:47,000 You don't exist. 548 00:28:51,620 --> 00:28:53,230 Toward the end of the season, 549 00:28:53,270 --> 00:28:54,790 Ron Miller began playing 550 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,010 a more prominent role on the team. 551 00:28:57,060 --> 00:28:59,540 He was scoring a lot, and at one point, 552 00:28:59,580 --> 00:29:01,840 Ireland pulled him aside to tell him 553 00:29:01,890 --> 00:29:03,410 why he wasn't starting. 554 00:29:03,450 --> 00:29:05,460 And he didn't really tell him, he said, 555 00:29:05,500 --> 00:29:08,280 "But you know, you understand what it is." 556 00:29:08,330 --> 00:29:09,940 And Miller did understand. 557 00:29:10,850 --> 00:29:14,460 Ireland didn't wanna have the fourth black guy on the court. 558 00:29:14,510 --> 00:29:17,030 It was so obvious to everyone around the team 559 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:18,600 and everyone at Loyola, 560 00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:22,560 that we should have had four blacks starting. 561 00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,000 You keep in mind, I'm coming off the bench 562 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:26,910 and I was averaging double figures. 563 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:31,830 So that tells you that maybe, I should have been starting. 564 00:29:31,870 --> 00:29:33,960 The one white boy that he was starting 565 00:29:34,010 --> 00:29:38,620 over Ron Miller had no business starting. 566 00:29:38,660 --> 00:29:41,800 And he knew it and every boy knew it. 567 00:29:42,970 --> 00:29:46,190 In 1962, Loyola went 21 and 3, 568 00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:48,670 earning a bid to the National Invitation Tournament 569 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:50,670 at Madison Square Garden in New York. 570 00:29:51,810 --> 00:29:54,070 With two Harlem natives on his team, 571 00:29:54,110 --> 00:29:55,510 Ireland saw an opportunity 572 00:29:55,550 --> 00:29:58,730 to lure the next generation of local recruits. 573 00:29:58,770 --> 00:30:01,820 We had advanced to the semis playing Dayton. 574 00:30:02,730 --> 00:30:04,860 And what really surprised me 575 00:30:04,910 --> 00:30:08,650 was that Coach Ireland changed the lineup. 576 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:11,520 He wanted to start me 577 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:14,870 because he was recruiting heavy out of New York City. 578 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:16,350 Local papers made a big deal 579 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,920 that I was coming back to Madison Square Garden. 580 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,530 Two New York kids, me and Jerry Harkness. 581 00:30:22,580 --> 00:30:24,450 So he has to play Miller 582 00:30:24,490 --> 00:30:28,150 and he has to play me because we're in New York. 583 00:30:28,190 --> 00:30:33,280 So he takes out 6-8, 6-9 Hunter. 584 00:30:33,330 --> 00:30:35,720 He brought Miller in for Les Hunter. 585 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:37,900 Best ball player on the team. 586 00:30:37,940 --> 00:30:40,030 Dayton was a hell of a team. 587 00:30:40,070 --> 00:30:42,250 And we were getting beat up pretty bad. 588 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:47,340 Take out Les Hunter and we're smaller, much smaller. 589 00:30:47,380 --> 00:30:50,170 It just put us in a bad situation. 590 00:30:51,820 --> 00:30:53,780 Ron Miller was the Ramblers' high scorer 591 00:30:53,820 --> 00:30:56,960 in the game, but without Hunter in the lineup, 592 00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,310 Loyola was just outmatched. 593 00:30:59,350 --> 00:31:01,750 So we lost to them. 594 00:31:01,790 --> 00:31:04,230 We had to play another game after that, 595 00:31:04,270 --> 00:31:06,100 which was a consolation game. 596 00:31:06,140 --> 00:31:07,930 And we played Duquesne University, 597 00:31:07,970 --> 00:31:11,620 which was a very good basketball school in those days. 598 00:31:11,670 --> 00:31:12,890 And you have to remember 599 00:31:12,930 --> 00:31:15,930 that Mr. Ireland was in difficulty. 600 00:31:16,980 --> 00:31:19,590 He could not afford to lose. 601 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,900 Ireland was not trying to be an activist. 602 00:31:23,940 --> 00:31:26,940 George Ireland was thinking about winning ball games. 603 00:31:26,990 --> 00:31:30,430 And that was the game where Ireland chose 604 00:31:30,470 --> 00:31:33,340 not to play the senior, Mike Gavin, 605 00:31:33,390 --> 00:31:37,040 and inserted Ron Miller as the other guard. 606 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,350 He put the best team on the court. 607 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:45,750 He broke the code. 608 00:31:45,790 --> 00:31:48,010 609 00:31:48,050 --> 00:31:52,840 When we won the consolation game, from there on, 610 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:54,710 he played four black guys. 611 00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,540 On that historic night, the Iron Five were born. 612 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:02,890 For the Loyola Ramblers, 613 00:32:02,940 --> 00:32:05,160 there would be no turning back. 614 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:06,200 Let me ask you this, 615 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,640 do you ever get crank phone calls? 616 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:13,640 Well, they criticize who he's got on his team. 617 00:32:13,690 --> 00:32:16,600 As you know he has a Negro ball club. 618 00:32:16,650 --> 00:32:19,780 And we get letters on that. 619 00:32:19,820 --> 00:32:20,960 Well, that's terrible. 620 00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,350 The rest of the world could take a cue 621 00:32:23,390 --> 00:32:25,740 from on integration is how well these kids get along 622 00:32:25,790 --> 00:32:27,000 together on the basketball court. 623 00:32:27,050 --> 00:32:28,270 That's right. 624 00:32:29,570 --> 00:32:31,140 With his new starting five set 625 00:32:31,180 --> 00:32:34,840 for the 1962, '63 season, there was plenty of fallout 626 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:36,880 for George Ireland and his family. 627 00:32:36,930 --> 00:32:38,930 But with his eyes on a national title, 628 00:32:38,970 --> 00:32:41,020 the coach had come too far to turn back. 629 00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:45,330 Meanwhile, there was another team down south 630 00:32:45,370 --> 00:32:46,810 with their eyes on the title. 631 00:32:48,460 --> 00:32:51,250 I was always fascinated about the psychology 632 00:32:51,290 --> 00:32:53,860 of the Mississippi State basketball team. 633 00:32:53,900 --> 00:32:55,470 You're feeling a lot of pressure 634 00:32:55,510 --> 00:32:58,470 if your programs aren't performing well, if you're losing. 635 00:32:58,510 --> 00:33:01,130 The irony is that Mississippi State was winning. 636 00:33:01,170 --> 00:33:04,560 And the more they won, the more pressure they faced. 637 00:33:04,610 --> 00:33:07,000 Our governor in particular just didn't think 638 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,530 we ought to be playing against black players. 639 00:33:09,570 --> 00:33:12,140 We never imagined that we would get to go 640 00:33:12,180 --> 00:33:15,100 to the NCAA tournament in '63. 641 00:33:15,140 --> 00:33:17,010 Young people are often a product 642 00:33:17,050 --> 00:33:20,800 of a dysfunctional situation, taught things 643 00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:22,670 that they shouldn't be taught. 644 00:33:22,710 --> 00:33:25,890 And it's not until they actually experience 645 00:33:25,930 --> 00:33:28,460 a different set of circumstances 646 00:33:28,500 --> 00:33:31,330 that they can appreciate what should be. 647 00:33:32,370 --> 00:33:34,940 In Mississippi, if you opposed Governor Barnett 648 00:33:34,990 --> 00:33:36,990 and the racism of Jim Crow laws, 649 00:33:37,030 --> 00:33:39,990 you were all but guaranteed a prison sentence. 650 00:33:40,030 --> 00:33:41,300 Or maybe even worse, 651 00:33:41,340 --> 00:33:43,300 with the state's long history of lynchings. 652 00:33:45,820 --> 00:33:48,090 But despite those very real threats, 653 00:33:48,130 --> 00:33:51,090 just 100 miles from the Mississippi State campus, 654 00:33:51,130 --> 00:33:54,660 there was someone still brave enough to fight back. 655 00:33:54,700 --> 00:33:56,310 The enrollment of James Meredith, 656 00:33:56,350 --> 00:33:58,270 the first African American to attend 657 00:33:58,310 --> 00:34:00,970 on the campus of Ole Miss. 658 00:34:01,010 --> 00:34:04,320 That night a riot broke out, hundreds were injured. 659 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:05,540 Two people died 660 00:34:05,580 --> 00:34:08,190 as protesters tried to stop a black man 661 00:34:08,240 --> 00:34:11,370 from attending a tax-supported state school. 662 00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:14,940 James Meredith, who was a Mississippi native 663 00:34:14,980 --> 00:34:17,550 and a veteran, applied to enter 664 00:34:17,590 --> 00:34:19,990 the University of Mississippi, Ole Miss. 665 00:34:20,030 --> 00:34:21,510 Ross Barnett said 666 00:34:21,550 --> 00:34:25,560 that Meredith would enter Ole Miss over his dead body. 667 00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:29,520 His admission caused a riot of such magnitude, 668 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:32,520 the president called out National Guard troops 669 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:34,260 to come put the riot down. 670 00:34:35,180 --> 00:34:37,130 Immediately following the mass panic, 671 00:34:37,180 --> 00:34:39,440 the college infirmary was besieged 672 00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,100 with injured persons, officers and students. 673 00:34:43,140 --> 00:34:44,580 People died. 674 00:34:44,620 --> 00:34:46,710 It's hard to believe that ever happened, 675 00:34:46,750 --> 00:34:49,020 but it damn sure did. 676 00:34:50,540 --> 00:34:52,630 As the dust settled after the riots, 677 00:34:52,670 --> 00:34:55,850 James Meredith successfully enrolled at Ole Miss. 678 00:34:55,890 --> 00:34:57,680 Another small piece of progress 679 00:34:57,720 --> 00:34:59,460 in the Civil Rights Movement. 680 00:34:59,500 --> 00:35:01,640 And while figures like Babe McCarthy were left 681 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:04,210 to grapple with what it meant on his campus, 682 00:35:04,250 --> 00:35:07,430 back in Chicago, they were listening too. 683 00:35:07,470 --> 00:35:09,080 Things were starting to change, 684 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:10,950 but not rapidly enough. 685 00:35:12,470 --> 00:35:17,260 We would sit up in my room around this radio, 686 00:35:17,310 --> 00:35:20,790 listening and cheering for people 687 00:35:20,830 --> 00:35:24,140 who were doing things to make a difference. 688 00:35:24,180 --> 00:35:25,360 We were in the middle 689 00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:28,320 of the Civil Rights Movement and Dr. King. 690 00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:30,930 The emphasis was put on them, 691 00:35:30,970 --> 00:35:34,840 but we in the background were making changes too. 692 00:35:34,890 --> 00:35:36,240 693 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:38,670 We really started the season with, 694 00:35:38,720 --> 00:35:40,550 not just a good team, but a great team. 695 00:35:40,590 --> 00:35:44,770 We had seven guys who legitimately could start. 696 00:35:44,810 --> 00:35:46,160 They were the highest scoring team 697 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:47,380 in the country that year. 698 00:35:47,420 --> 00:35:49,210 They knew exactly what the next step 699 00:35:49,250 --> 00:35:51,430 of the other was going to be. 700 00:35:51,470 --> 00:35:54,260 There was something electric that happened to us. 701 00:35:54,300 --> 00:35:58,610 We just knew that we were going to be very good. 702 00:35:58,650 --> 00:36:00,520 They were bulldozing teams. 703 00:36:00,570 --> 00:36:02,220 No one could stop them. 704 00:36:02,260 --> 00:36:05,530 In retaliation to all of this resistance, 705 00:36:05,570 --> 00:36:07,140 they ran up the scores. 706 00:36:07,180 --> 00:36:11,360 Send a message, "We're good and we're good at what we do." 707 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:12,840 Is this the best team you've had 708 00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,230 in your 12 years as Loyola coach? 709 00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:17,930 Well, Mike, I think this is my best team. 710 00:36:17,970 --> 00:36:19,190 Well, there's no question about it, 711 00:36:19,240 --> 00:36:21,020 you certainly do have an excellent team. 712 00:36:21,060 --> 00:36:23,810 In fact, you must be ranked second in the nation. 713 00:36:23,850 --> 00:36:25,370 George Ireland, how do you think 714 00:36:25,420 --> 00:36:28,250 that your Loyola club would make out against Cincinnati? 715 00:36:28,290 --> 00:36:29,990 Well, that's a hard question. 716 00:36:30,030 --> 00:36:33,340 We are an offensive team and Cincinnati 717 00:36:33,380 --> 00:36:34,900 are a defensive team. 718 00:36:34,950 --> 00:36:36,650 I would like to play Cincinnati 719 00:36:36,690 --> 00:36:38,910 and possibly sometime we will. 720 00:36:38,950 --> 00:36:41,650 For such a long period of time we knew 721 00:36:41,690 --> 00:36:44,390 that, somewhere along the way, we were going 722 00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:47,960 to go up against Cincinnati. 723 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,880 They were the big dogs, we were the underdogs. 724 00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,920 Cincinnati had become a machine, a real machine, 725 00:36:54,970 --> 00:36:57,060 under the leadership of Ed Jucker. 726 00:36:57,100 --> 00:37:00,020 727 00:37:00,060 --> 00:37:02,580 Cincinnati was the complete opposite of Loyola. 728 00:37:02,630 --> 00:37:05,330 Cincinnati had won two championships 729 00:37:05,370 --> 00:37:08,810 with a very deliberate, slow-down pace. 730 00:37:08,850 --> 00:37:10,330 When you talk about a team 731 00:37:10,370 --> 00:37:12,940 that wanted to make four passes before they took a shot, 732 00:37:12,990 --> 00:37:16,080 Cincinnati probably wanted to make six passes. 733 00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:18,470 Something that was not in our DNA at all. 734 00:37:19,380 --> 00:37:20,990 While Loyola was the fastest team 735 00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,300 in college basketball, no one matched 736 00:37:23,340 --> 00:37:26,260 the slow, tactical pace of Cincinnati. 737 00:37:28,350 --> 00:37:30,660 At a time when more and more teams experimented 738 00:37:30,700 --> 00:37:33,700 with running the ball, Ed Jucker found success 739 00:37:33,750 --> 00:37:35,360 by doing just the opposite. 740 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:37,450 Don't shoot unless you have a good shot. 741 00:37:37,490 --> 00:37:39,360 Hold the ball if you need to once in a while, 742 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:41,580 that was before the days of shot clock. 743 00:37:41,620 --> 00:37:43,100 Everyone thought he was crazy 744 00:37:43,150 --> 00:37:46,580 until he won his first NCAA Championship. 745 00:37:46,630 --> 00:37:49,980 They thought he was lucky until he won his second. 746 00:37:50,020 --> 00:37:53,200 747 00:37:54,900 --> 00:37:57,860 When they got ahead of you by 10 points, 748 00:37:57,900 --> 00:37:59,990 you were probably toast. 749 00:38:00,030 --> 00:38:02,300 Combined with the talents of Tom Thacker, 750 00:38:02,340 --> 00:38:04,690 Ron Bonham and George Wilson, 751 00:38:04,730 --> 00:38:07,340 Cincinnati was set to be the first-ever team 752 00:38:07,390 --> 00:38:09,480 to win three consecutive titles. 753 00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:10,830 We had the best record. 754 00:38:10,870 --> 00:38:12,220 I don't know what Loyola was, 755 00:38:12,260 --> 00:38:14,700 but they didn't win as many games as we did. 756 00:38:14,740 --> 00:38:17,050 I mean, Cincinnati was the monster. 757 00:38:17,090 --> 00:38:18,570 Why would you think that this small, 758 00:38:18,620 --> 00:38:20,790 Catholic school could beat Cincinnati? 759 00:38:24,750 --> 00:38:27,060 Out of everything I learned about this story, 760 00:38:27,100 --> 00:38:29,150 I was most surprised by Cincinnati. 761 00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:32,370 Because for all the praise given to Ireland 762 00:38:32,410 --> 00:38:34,370 for breaking that unwritten rule, 763 00:38:34,420 --> 00:38:37,070 I didn't know that Ed Jucker broke it first, 764 00:38:37,110 --> 00:38:39,810 months before Ireland, winning a national championship 765 00:38:39,860 --> 00:38:42,600 with four black starters in 1962. 766 00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:45,250 767 00:38:47,990 --> 00:38:50,130 You might say it was easier for Cincinnati 768 00:38:50,170 --> 00:38:52,650 since they were already defending national champs. 769 00:38:53,910 --> 00:38:56,740 But I think it's more likely that four black starters 770 00:38:56,790 --> 00:39:00,090 with a slow, controlled game were less threatening 771 00:39:00,140 --> 00:39:02,660 than Loyola's aggressive, fast-break players. 772 00:39:04,710 --> 00:39:06,580 Whatever the explanation is, 773 00:39:06,620 --> 00:39:08,710 these two trailblazing teams seemed to be 774 00:39:08,750 --> 00:39:11,670 on a clear path to the championship. 775 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,150 But the season was far from over, 776 00:39:15,190 --> 00:39:17,680 and Loyola's future was suddenly uncertain. 777 00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:22,900 Midway through the season, 778 00:39:22,940 --> 00:39:25,990 Loyola lost three players. 779 00:39:26,030 --> 00:39:29,080 One of them left for financial reasons. 780 00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:31,990 The other two were New York playground guys. 781 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:35,000 They didn't make grades, and would have gotten 782 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:38,740 a lot of playing time had they stayed on the team. 783 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:42,180 Everyone was understandably shocked 784 00:39:42,220 --> 00:39:43,790 when all that happened at once. 785 00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:47,230 We had nine players, that was it. 786 00:39:47,270 --> 00:39:51,100 It was so awkward just to have scrimmages 787 00:39:51,140 --> 00:39:53,230 and you have nine people. 788 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,450 Their absence is one of the reasons 789 00:39:55,500 --> 00:39:59,460 that the five starters were playing virtually every minute. 790 00:40:00,630 --> 00:40:03,420 The Iron Five were used to playing nonstop. 791 00:40:03,460 --> 00:40:06,380 But now, even when Loyola took big leads, 792 00:40:06,420 --> 00:40:09,210 Ireland refused to give any of them a break. 793 00:40:09,250 --> 00:40:10,860 Some of the games were complete blowouts. 794 00:40:10,900 --> 00:40:12,640 We would still be playing, I mean, 795 00:40:12,690 --> 00:40:16,170 we'd be up by 15, 20 points, 796 00:40:16,210 --> 00:40:18,480 and he would still have all of us in the game. 797 00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:20,650 We had a 30-point lead at halftime. 798 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,440 Man, I'm gonna be playing. 799 00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:26,180 Never got in. 800 00:40:26,220 --> 00:40:28,880 801 00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,710 That starting five, I think he was nervous 802 00:40:31,750 --> 00:40:34,970 when any one of them was off of the floor. 803 00:40:35,010 --> 00:40:39,580 And it wasn't that we were incapable of contributing. 804 00:40:39,630 --> 00:40:42,800 People don't realize how good we were 805 00:40:42,850 --> 00:40:44,850 because they never saw us. 806 00:40:44,890 --> 00:40:49,850 We'd be up 35, 40 points, let's give the first team a break. 807 00:40:51,030 --> 00:40:54,420 I was feeling badly because we had guys on the bench 808 00:40:54,470 --> 00:40:56,210 that weren't getting in. 809 00:40:56,250 --> 00:40:58,910 I said, "Coach, take me out, I'm tired." 810 00:40:58,950 --> 00:40:59,910 He said, "Stay in." 811 00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:04,170 Trust me, I can tell you, 812 00:41:04,220 --> 00:41:07,920 being on the court 40 minutes straight is no joke. 813 00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:11,440 To play that fast-paced style every game without a sub? 814 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,440 That can break you. 815 00:41:17,580 --> 00:41:20,670 And that season, as the exhaustion built on the court, 816 00:41:20,710 --> 00:41:22,450 the pressure got to everyone. 817 00:41:23,410 --> 00:41:25,760 We were in New York playing St. John's, 818 00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:28,410 Jerry Lyne came out and says, "George is on the table. 819 00:41:28,460 --> 00:41:30,110 He's coughing up blood." 820 00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:31,850 You know, he had a bleeding ulcer. 821 00:41:32,720 --> 00:41:33,990 You know, there were times 822 00:41:34,030 --> 00:41:37,420 when guys out there on that floor were hurting. 823 00:41:37,470 --> 00:41:39,030 They had been injured. 824 00:41:39,080 --> 00:41:41,860 Vic Rouse had had a shoulder separation, 825 00:41:41,910 --> 00:41:43,820 and they would have to put it back in 826 00:41:43,870 --> 00:41:44,950 and tape it up. 827 00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:50,000 When you run a team for 30 games, 828 00:41:50,050 --> 00:41:51,830 you know, iron wears out. 829 00:41:53,220 --> 00:41:57,660 We tried to figure out why certain things happened. 830 00:41:57,710 --> 00:42:00,060 Why certain things didn't happen. 831 00:42:01,010 --> 00:42:03,360 But, we loved each other. 832 00:42:03,410 --> 00:42:06,890 Five guys were going to play, 833 00:42:06,930 --> 00:42:09,500 and the other four 834 00:42:09,540 --> 00:42:11,890 were going to be supportive of them. 835 00:42:14,240 --> 00:42:15,940 Worn down, Loyola suffered 836 00:42:15,980 --> 00:42:19,030 their only two defeats of the season late in the schedule. 837 00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:23,170 The struggle for the Iron Five was increasing. 838 00:42:24,210 --> 00:42:26,430 But the worst was yet to come. 839 00:42:28,210 --> 00:42:31,570 840 00:42:37,830 --> 00:42:40,440 The game was in Houston, Texas. 841 00:42:40,490 --> 00:42:42,920 To me, we were just going down to play another team. 842 00:42:42,970 --> 00:42:46,540 That's how naive and ignorant I was back then. 843 00:42:47,930 --> 00:42:50,630 It was a pretty small, confined gym. 844 00:42:50,670 --> 00:42:52,240 It didn't take long to realize 845 00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:54,760 that it was gonna be more than a basketball game. 846 00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:59,420 Things started to unravel. 847 00:42:59,460 --> 00:43:02,900 I believe everybody in the stadium was against us. 848 00:43:02,940 --> 00:43:05,290 The fans were out of control. 849 00:43:06,470 --> 00:43:08,860 Go back home, get out of here. 850 00:43:08,910 --> 00:43:10,470 We're gonna get you. 851 00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:12,780 They used the N-word constantly. 852 00:43:12,820 --> 00:43:15,650 Threw ice, threw things at us on the court. 853 00:43:16,570 --> 00:43:18,740 The students throwing stuff, 854 00:43:18,790 --> 00:43:21,140 I mean, they look like me. 855 00:43:22,050 --> 00:43:25,970 Never having experienced that side of racism, 856 00:43:26,010 --> 00:43:27,970 literally, they're spitting on us. 857 00:43:28,010 --> 00:43:30,750 This is what you guys go through on a daily basis? 858 00:43:32,060 --> 00:43:35,850 I looked to the side, I didn't see police. 859 00:43:35,890 --> 00:43:37,200 And I started to worry. 860 00:43:39,020 --> 00:43:41,420 There were times during that game 861 00:43:41,460 --> 00:43:46,470 that we feared for our lives, it was that bad. 862 00:43:47,730 --> 00:43:50,910 All of the sudden, we heard a loud bang. 863 00:43:50,950 --> 00:43:52,380 864 00:43:52,430 --> 00:43:55,520 I swear to God, I thought they were shooting at us. 865 00:43:55,560 --> 00:43:59,650 Somebody took a popcorn bag and popped it. 866 00:44:00,780 --> 00:44:03,870 That was one of the worst experiences on the court 867 00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,090 that we experienced as a team. 868 00:44:06,140 --> 00:44:08,530 This is when we talk about Coach George Ireland. 869 00:44:08,570 --> 00:44:09,970 To me, he should have known that, 870 00:44:10,010 --> 00:44:12,710 he should not have put us in those situations. 871 00:44:12,750 --> 00:44:16,500 If he cared, he would not have put us in those situations. 872 00:44:17,370 --> 00:44:21,110 Coach Ireland had a lot of power. 873 00:44:21,150 --> 00:44:23,760 And I'm not just talking about the power 874 00:44:23,810 --> 00:44:27,510 to play the starters the entire game. 875 00:44:27,550 --> 00:44:31,250 He had the power to say, "This is a segregated city, 876 00:44:31,290 --> 00:44:34,300 and things might be a little scary for you, 877 00:44:34,340 --> 00:44:36,080 but you're gonna play anyway." 878 00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:39,740 And maybe they would have chosen to play anyway, 879 00:44:39,780 --> 00:44:43,000 but we don't know that, because they didn't have a choice. 880 00:44:44,350 --> 00:44:46,610 Through all the highs and lows of that season, 881 00:44:46,660 --> 00:44:47,920 the game at Houston 882 00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,140 left the most lasting impression on the team. 883 00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:54,490 But they won the game, and for the first time ever 884 00:44:54,530 --> 00:44:57,890 Loyola accepted their invitation to the NCAA tournament. 885 00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:02,850 The Iron Five were about to face 886 00:45:02,890 --> 00:45:05,410 a whole new level of public scrutiny 887 00:45:05,460 --> 00:45:08,030 and there was nowhere to hide from what was coming. 888 00:45:10,250 --> 00:45:12,940 889 00:45:12,990 --> 00:45:14,160 We get the mail. 890 00:45:15,730 --> 00:45:17,690 On the outside it was KKK. 891 00:45:19,210 --> 00:45:24,170 "You don't belong on the same floor as white players. 892 00:45:25,090 --> 00:45:26,960 We're gonna kill you." 893 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,310 And I'ma tell you, I was scared to death. 894 00:45:29,350 --> 00:45:31,050 They know where I live. 895 00:45:31,090 --> 00:45:33,400 They're gonna come to the dorm and get me. 896 00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:36,530 I called Ireland, I said, 897 00:45:36,580 --> 00:45:38,800 "Ireland, you gotta get over here." 898 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:42,100 And he went to the front desk of the dorm. 899 00:45:42,150 --> 00:45:47,150 "Any mail that comes in for the ballplayers, give it to me." 900 00:45:48,240 --> 00:45:50,550 My dad would keep the mail from them. 901 00:45:50,590 --> 00:45:52,770 He did not want them to read 902 00:45:52,810 --> 00:45:55,550 some of the things that were sent. 903 00:45:55,590 --> 00:45:57,160 Dad would show it to us at home. 904 00:45:57,210 --> 00:46:00,340 I just could not believe any human beings 905 00:46:00,380 --> 00:46:04,730 would send stuff like this to 19, 20-year-old kids. 906 00:46:05,740 --> 00:46:09,000 I've heard stories of the letters that he received. 907 00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:10,870 But I personally never seen any of the letters. 908 00:46:10,910 --> 00:46:13,660 I believe that he did receive letters. 909 00:46:13,700 --> 00:46:16,090 I was never able to get to the letters. 910 00:46:16,140 --> 00:46:18,750 In my mind, I had to put the letters out of my book 911 00:46:18,790 --> 00:46:22,800 because I couldn't prove them. 912 00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:27,980 There's three like this that are all closed up. 913 00:46:29,150 --> 00:46:34,110 And up in the corner it says, "Loyola HM," for hate mail. 914 00:46:35,420 --> 00:46:36,770 The way they were signed, 915 00:46:36,810 --> 00:46:40,510 "Uncle Tom," and "KKK," the N-word. 916 00:46:40,550 --> 00:46:42,990 He said he wanted me to have it 917 00:46:43,030 --> 00:46:45,250 because he knew I would protect it. 918 00:46:46,730 --> 00:46:51,650 And he said, "Someday, this history will be alive again. 919 00:46:52,610 --> 00:46:56,530 And maybe then you can show it." 920 00:46:56,570 --> 00:46:59,090 921 00:47:17,240 --> 00:47:19,550 He knew it was the wrong thing to do, 922 00:47:19,590 --> 00:47:24,120 but he could not let this keep coming to his ball players. 923 00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:26,250 I thought, "If I can just protect them, 924 00:47:26,290 --> 00:47:29,040 who needs to know about this stuff?" 925 00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:32,170 It happened, it's here and I promised Dad 926 00:47:32,210 --> 00:47:33,650 that I would protect it. 927 00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:37,390 It's tempting to hide 928 00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:41,920 the worst parts of our histories, to lock them away, 929 00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:43,490 pretend they don't exist. 930 00:47:46,010 --> 00:47:48,230 Maybe for Ireland, these letters were seen 931 00:47:48,270 --> 00:47:50,880 as a burden on the players, a distraction 932 00:47:50,930 --> 00:47:52,410 at the height of their season. 933 00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:56,670 Maybe it was easiest to just move past them. 934 00:47:58,110 --> 00:48:01,330 But the problem is, Ireland didn't. 935 00:48:02,460 --> 00:48:04,900 Among those letters were threats so severe, 936 00:48:04,940 --> 00:48:06,900 he hired security for his daughters, 937 00:48:07,810 --> 00:48:10,210 a protection he never offered his players. 938 00:48:12,300 --> 00:48:15,390 I don't think he thought at all 939 00:48:15,430 --> 00:48:17,480 about race relations. 940 00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:21,960 I don't think he was interested in race relations. 941 00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:25,350 I think George Ireland was thinking about himself, 942 00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:30,050 his family, and winning basketball games. 943 00:48:31,230 --> 00:48:36,060 I always accepted that as a part of the times. 944 00:48:36,100 --> 00:48:38,710 I never held that part against him. 945 00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:42,410 It was important to him that he was successful. 946 00:48:42,460 --> 00:48:47,160 And by being good to us, it made him successful. 947 00:48:49,460 --> 00:48:51,250 Even through the death threats, 948 00:48:51,290 --> 00:48:53,950 the Loyola players found a way to stay focused. 949 00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,210 The NCAA tournament was fast approaching 950 00:48:59,260 --> 00:49:01,740 and Cincinnati was still expected to win it all. 951 00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:06,700 Though it looked like the bracket 952 00:49:06,740 --> 00:49:08,740 would have one glaring omission. 953 00:49:08,790 --> 00:49:10,830 954 00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:13,360 Mississippi State defeated Ole Miss 955 00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,750 to clinch the Southeastern Conference Championship, 956 00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:21,240 which gave them the automatic bid to the NCAA tournament. 957 00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:24,850 The next day, Governor Barnett issued a statement 958 00:49:24,890 --> 00:49:27,630 that Mississippi State will not be playing 959 00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:29,070 in the NCAA tournament. 960 00:49:30,980 --> 00:49:34,680 Personally, I feel it is not for the best interest 961 00:49:34,730 --> 00:49:39,730 of Mississippi State University, or either of the races. 962 00:49:41,820 --> 00:49:45,000 The governor had issued an injunction. 963 00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:48,520 We will do all we can, to the point of arresting you, 964 00:49:48,570 --> 00:49:51,270 when you get ready to leave the state of Mississippi. 965 00:49:52,180 --> 00:49:55,360 The NCAA had no idea where to put State in their seeding 966 00:49:55,400 --> 00:49:56,790 'cause they didn't know if State was gonna be able 967 00:49:56,840 --> 00:49:59,530 to make it, even though they had verbally committed. 968 00:49:59,580 --> 00:50:02,930 Mississippi State was given a first-round bye. 969 00:50:02,970 --> 00:50:05,110 Their first opponent would be the winner 970 00:50:05,150 --> 00:50:07,190 of Loyola versus Tennessee Tech. 971 00:50:09,670 --> 00:50:12,760 People don't realize the amount of pressure 972 00:50:12,810 --> 00:50:14,460 that we were under. 973 00:50:14,510 --> 00:50:17,680 Not only from the KKK and the White Knights, 974 00:50:17,730 --> 00:50:19,420 but from our own people. 975 00:50:20,820 --> 00:50:23,080 Blacks across the country, 976 00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:27,080 who were putting their hopes on us. 977 00:50:27,130 --> 00:50:32,090 That we had to win because the black community 978 00:50:32,610 --> 00:50:34,480 was counting on us. 979 00:50:36,090 --> 00:50:39,010 Jerry said that he had black people calling him saying, 980 00:50:39,050 --> 00:50:41,620 "Hey, you better not lose to those white boys." 981 00:50:41,660 --> 00:50:43,970 Come on, you guys, we're rooting for you, 982 00:50:44,010 --> 00:50:45,360 we're rooting for you. 983 00:50:46,450 --> 00:50:51,410 We got so roused up that you're gonna be hard to beat. 984 00:50:51,850 --> 00:50:54,330 You're gonna be very hard to beat. 985 00:50:55,810 --> 00:50:59,460 The first game was against Tennessee Tech, 986 00:50:59,510 --> 00:51:01,420 an all-white team. 987 00:51:01,470 --> 00:51:04,640 988 00:51:06,380 --> 00:51:08,560 And that poor team. 989 00:51:08,600 --> 00:51:12,430 We went up 30, 40, we beat 'em, 990 00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:15,350 and it's still a record, 69 points. 991 00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:19,700 The final score of that game 992 00:51:19,740 --> 00:51:23,140 is still the greatest disparity in NCAA history. 993 00:51:23,180 --> 00:51:27,750 I mean, it's just amazing the advantage you have 994 00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:30,020 once you're motivated and roused up. 995 00:51:32,190 --> 00:51:35,150 The Ramblers were eager for their next match-up. 996 00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,200 But with no word from Mississippi State, 997 00:51:38,200 --> 00:51:40,550 Loyola had no idea if they'd show up. 998 00:51:42,990 --> 00:51:44,250 Their coaches said we're going, 999 00:51:44,290 --> 00:51:45,860 their president says they're going, 1000 00:51:45,900 --> 00:51:47,690 but everybody else in power in the state says, 1001 00:51:47,730 --> 00:51:50,170 "No, you can't." 1002 00:51:50,210 --> 00:51:53,520 These are guys who were raised to honor authority, 1003 00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:55,870 to obey their elders. 1004 00:51:55,910 --> 00:51:58,090 You know, we faced jail time 1005 00:51:58,130 --> 00:52:00,920 if we failed to obey the injunction. 1006 00:52:02,050 --> 00:52:03,090 The night before the trip, 1007 00:52:03,140 --> 00:52:05,270 Coach McCarthy did have a team meeting. 1008 00:52:05,310 --> 00:52:07,660 We talked, he'd said, 1009 00:52:07,710 --> 00:52:09,140 "Here's what we're gonna do." 1010 00:52:11,230 --> 00:52:14,230 1011 00:52:19,150 --> 00:52:20,330 We aimed to leave early the next morning, 1012 00:52:20,370 --> 00:52:23,550 as early as we could and we headed out. 1013 00:52:25,420 --> 00:52:27,900 The team was gonna split into two teams. 1014 00:52:27,940 --> 00:52:30,510 One was the decoy team. 1015 00:52:30,550 --> 00:52:32,990 They sent our trainer and six of our players 1016 00:52:33,040 --> 00:52:36,520 that didn't play a whole lot out to the airport. 1017 00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:39,040 They keep the five starters and the sixth man 1018 00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:40,350 back at the dorm room. 1019 00:52:40,390 --> 00:52:42,260 There're two airports in Starkville. 1020 00:52:42,310 --> 00:52:45,270 As a decoy, one group was going to Bryan Field. 1021 00:52:45,310 --> 00:52:46,740 They went out there to see 1022 00:52:46,790 --> 00:52:50,440 if there was gonna be an officer to serve the injunction. 1023 00:52:50,490 --> 00:52:54,670 In that case, the trainer with the decoys 1024 00:52:54,710 --> 00:52:58,190 was gonna phone back to campus, tell the starting team, 1025 00:52:58,230 --> 00:53:00,150 "Don't come to the airport." 1026 00:53:00,190 --> 00:53:02,020 They had another plane waiting for them 1027 00:53:02,060 --> 00:53:05,550 at another airport that they were gonna take if they had to. 1028 00:53:06,630 --> 00:53:08,640 And should six be arrested, 1029 00:53:08,680 --> 00:53:11,160 six will end up in East Lansing, Michigan. 1030 00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:14,160 It was like "Mission Impossible," man. 1031 00:53:15,900 --> 00:53:17,650 We were kinda the guinea pigs, okay? 1032 00:53:17,690 --> 00:53:21,340 I was literally scared to death, but we were gonna go. 1033 00:53:23,130 --> 00:53:25,610 The reserves made it through to the airport. 1034 00:53:25,650 --> 00:53:28,350 A call was made, and they said, "Coast is clear." 1035 00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:32,010 And the starters, Joe Dan and Red Straud 1036 00:53:32,050 --> 00:53:33,750 and Doug Hutton, they went. 1037 00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:37,930 And they all flew together. 1038 00:53:37,970 --> 00:53:39,800 1039 00:53:39,840 --> 00:53:42,630 And as soon as the plane left the ground, 1040 00:53:42,670 --> 00:53:44,500 you could hear the guys all together 1041 00:53:44,540 --> 00:53:46,890 started clapping and cheering. 1042 00:53:46,940 --> 00:53:48,940 We're off, we're on our way. 1043 00:53:54,160 --> 00:53:56,250 I didn't think they were gonna come. 1044 00:53:56,290 --> 00:53:59,820 And when we got to Michigan, they said 1045 00:53:59,860 --> 00:54:02,860 Mississippi State is gonna play you. 1046 00:54:04,950 --> 00:54:06,690 To know that cops are chasing them 1047 00:54:06,740 --> 00:54:09,570 and that what they're doing is gonna create a stir. 1048 00:54:09,610 --> 00:54:12,220 And then just even getting psychologically ready 1049 00:54:12,270 --> 00:54:13,700 for an NCAA tournament game, 1050 00:54:13,740 --> 00:54:16,310 which they had never done before. 1051 00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:18,270 I'm sure they were probably tapped out. 1052 00:54:19,400 --> 00:54:22,710 How many people are gonna support us being there? 1053 00:54:22,750 --> 00:54:23,620 We don't know. 1054 00:54:24,890 --> 00:54:27,060 Everything was very quiet. 1055 00:54:27,110 --> 00:54:28,460 We're all sitting there, you know, 1056 00:54:28,500 --> 00:54:30,020 about halfway wanting to cry. 1057 00:54:31,240 --> 00:54:34,330 1058 00:54:34,370 --> 00:54:36,160 And when we got on the floor that night, 1059 00:54:36,200 --> 00:54:40,420 and all of a sudden, the MSU fight song was played. 1060 00:54:40,470 --> 00:54:42,600 1061 00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:45,820 1062 00:54:51,960 --> 00:54:54,610 Here we are, a bunch of white kids in opposition 1063 00:54:54,660 --> 00:54:57,750 to a movement against black athletes, 1064 00:54:57,790 --> 00:55:01,970 to play something as easy or simple as a basketball game? 1065 00:55:02,010 --> 00:55:05,620 To walk into a gym of 15, 18,000 people. 1066 00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:09,190 Wow. 1067 00:55:12,370 --> 00:55:14,330 Could it really be happening? That, um. 1068 00:55:16,550 --> 00:55:19,160 1069 00:55:21,860 --> 00:55:22,990 They had no clue 1070 00:55:23,030 --> 00:55:24,640 that they would be that welcomed. 1071 00:55:25,770 --> 00:55:28,040 Joe Dan Gold was our captain 1072 00:55:28,080 --> 00:55:31,080 and he went out to shake hands before the tip-off. 1073 00:55:32,820 --> 00:55:34,350 There was no cheering. 1074 00:55:34,390 --> 00:55:36,350 The place was quiet. 1075 00:55:36,390 --> 00:55:39,870 Everybody was watching us, you could feel it. 1076 00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:44,010 I didn't hear anything the referees were saying. 1077 00:55:44,050 --> 00:55:48,100 I was looking at Joe Dan and he was looking at me. 1078 00:55:48,140 --> 00:55:52,580 We both went to shake hands and the place lit up. 1079 00:55:52,630 --> 00:55:53,800 Pop, pop, pow! 1080 00:55:56,500 --> 00:55:58,370 The cameras just went crazy. 1081 00:55:59,460 --> 00:56:00,940 Almost turned into daylight. 1082 00:56:00,980 --> 00:56:03,330 I mean everyone understood 1083 00:56:03,380 --> 00:56:06,550 how important that moment was. 1084 00:56:06,600 --> 00:56:08,340 It was captured for the ages. 1085 00:56:09,510 --> 00:56:12,340 I said, "This is more than a game. 1086 00:56:12,390 --> 00:56:13,950 This is history." 1087 00:56:17,390 --> 00:56:19,610 For our two captains to shake hands 1088 00:56:19,650 --> 00:56:23,700 and acknowledge the fact that, "Hey, we're here." 1089 00:56:23,740 --> 00:56:26,360 1090 00:56:32,100 --> 00:56:34,230 The night would forever be known 1091 00:56:34,280 --> 00:56:35,710 as the Game of Change. 1092 00:56:45,770 --> 00:56:47,460 When the final buzzer sounded, 1093 00:56:47,510 --> 00:56:51,340 Loyola had earned the win, sending them to the Elite Eight. 1094 00:56:51,380 --> 00:56:54,640 While Mississippi State faced the reality of returning home, 1095 00:56:54,690 --> 00:56:57,470 and the consequences that would be waiting. 1096 00:56:57,520 --> 00:56:59,340 I don't know, we could have played a whole lot of games 1097 00:56:59,390 --> 00:57:00,910 and probably never beaten them. 1098 00:57:02,570 --> 00:57:05,090 Coach came in, and his first thing he says 1099 00:57:05,130 --> 00:57:06,310 when he popped in that door, 1100 00:57:06,350 --> 00:57:08,700 is "Boys, you get your head up." 1101 00:57:08,750 --> 00:57:10,090 He said, "Y'all have done something 1102 00:57:10,140 --> 00:57:12,450 that nobody in Mississippi's ever done, you know. 1103 00:57:12,490 --> 00:57:14,320 Y'all have nothing to be ashamed of." 1104 00:57:17,540 --> 00:57:18,760 Well, obviously our flight home 1105 00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:20,410 was a disappointing flight home. 1106 00:57:21,320 --> 00:57:23,890 Yet, it wasn't disappointing 1107 00:57:23,930 --> 00:57:26,720 because we had accomplished what we set out to do. 1108 00:57:28,110 --> 00:57:30,330 The Mississippi State team didn't know 1109 00:57:30,380 --> 00:57:33,160 what they would find when they got home. 1110 00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:34,550 That was the danger. 1111 00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:36,080 That was the element that they were dealing with, 1112 00:57:36,120 --> 00:57:38,510 it had to be in the back of their minds the whole time. 1113 00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:41,520 1114 00:57:42,870 --> 00:57:44,430 They get back to Mississippi 1115 00:57:46,130 --> 00:57:48,960 and there's a crowd treating them like heroes. 1116 00:57:49,000 --> 00:57:52,180 1117 00:57:58,230 --> 00:58:00,190 You know, the best thing is to win. 1118 00:58:00,230 --> 00:58:02,020 The second best thing is to lose. 1119 00:58:02,060 --> 00:58:04,410 That means you got a chance to compete. 1120 00:58:04,450 --> 00:58:07,940 Without the ability to compete, you got nothing. 1121 00:58:09,280 --> 00:58:11,420 Differences of opinion that we have 1122 00:58:11,460 --> 00:58:13,680 and ill feelings that we have, 1123 00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:17,070 but basketball and sports can do an awful lot 1124 00:58:17,120 --> 00:58:18,420 to bring people together. 1125 00:58:20,770 --> 00:58:23,170 As the NCAA tournament continued, 1126 00:58:23,210 --> 00:58:25,300 Loyola defeated Illinois and Duke 1127 00:58:25,340 --> 00:58:27,390 to advance to the championship game 1128 00:58:27,430 --> 00:58:30,170 for the first time in school history. 1129 00:58:30,220 --> 00:58:32,870 The most anticipated contest of the season, 1130 00:58:32,920 --> 00:58:35,960 Loyola versus Cincinnati, was set. 1131 00:58:36,010 --> 00:58:39,790 The night we beat Duke, what I remember most vividly 1132 00:58:39,840 --> 00:58:42,930 is Vic Rouse jumping on the bed 1133 00:58:42,970 --> 00:58:44,930 at four o'clock in the morning 1134 00:58:44,970 --> 00:58:49,370 saying he's gonna be looking at his NCAA watch. 1135 00:58:49,410 --> 00:58:52,150 I remember that vividly. 1136 00:58:52,200 --> 00:58:53,980 'Cause they didn't give out rings at that time. 1137 00:58:54,020 --> 00:58:55,550 They gave out watches. 1138 00:58:55,590 --> 00:58:57,990 I don't think any of the guys got to bed 1139 00:58:58,030 --> 00:58:59,120 til at least 4:00 in the morning. 1140 00:58:59,160 --> 00:59:01,160 And that might have been, 1141 00:59:01,210 --> 00:59:03,900 the guys might have been dragging a little bit. 1142 00:59:03,950 --> 00:59:05,780 NCAA Championship ball game. 1143 00:59:05,820 --> 00:59:07,820 It's a ding-dong-dilly of a battle tonight 1144 00:59:07,860 --> 00:59:10,210 at Louisville as we will have the Bearcats, 1145 00:59:10,260 --> 00:59:12,910 coached by Ed Jucker, against the Ramblers, 1146 00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:17,130 coached by George Ireland of Loyola of Chicago. 1147 00:59:17,180 --> 00:59:19,620 For the first time in NCAA history, 1148 00:59:19,660 --> 00:59:23,450 seven black starters across both teams took the floor. 1149 00:59:23,490 --> 00:59:25,670 And in a nationally televised game, 1150 00:59:25,710 --> 00:59:27,360 the entire country was watching. 1151 00:59:29,230 --> 00:59:32,890 On Chicago local radio, Loyola's very own announcer, 1152 00:59:32,930 --> 00:59:35,020 Red Rush was calling the game, 1153 00:59:35,890 --> 00:59:38,590 a voice no one would forget by the end of the night. 1154 00:59:38,630 --> 00:59:40,940 We are hungry for a championship, 1155 00:59:40,980 --> 00:59:43,640 so please bring one home to us, won't you? 1156 00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:45,290 It was bringing chills to me 1157 00:59:45,340 --> 00:59:46,950 to be honest with you, watching that. 1158 00:59:46,990 --> 00:59:49,080 We had 150 young nuns there, 1159 00:59:49,120 --> 00:59:51,130 looking at this little black-and-white TV 1160 00:59:51,170 --> 00:59:53,040 so we could watch that game. 1161 00:59:55,560 --> 01:00:00,570 Probably the audience at the time was pro-Cincinnati. 1162 01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:04,230 Nobody had won three titles in a row. 1163 01:00:05,660 --> 01:00:07,230 I guess the excitement starts 1164 01:00:07,270 --> 01:00:11,280 when you're running out through the crowded area. 1165 01:00:12,190 --> 01:00:15,670 I could not see anybody that I knew there, 1166 01:00:15,720 --> 01:00:17,370 but I knew they were there. 1167 01:00:17,410 --> 01:00:19,630 Okay, there was that many people. 1168 01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:21,980 1169 01:00:22,030 --> 01:00:23,240 It felt as though 1170 01:00:23,290 --> 01:00:24,990 I'd been looking forward to this all my life. 1171 01:00:26,640 --> 01:00:28,950 I would say more excited, 1172 01:00:28,990 --> 01:00:32,170 somewhat nervous, but more excited. 1173 01:00:34,730 --> 01:00:36,910 I just said, "We gotta get to a good start." 1174 01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:40,870 At tip-off, I had this little habit 1175 01:00:40,910 --> 01:00:43,610 where I always reached down and touched my sock. 1176 01:00:43,660 --> 01:00:46,790 And that night, I didn't touch my sock, 1177 01:00:46,830 --> 01:00:49,530 which said to me I must have been nervous. 1178 01:00:50,400 --> 01:00:51,620 The ball's in the air 1179 01:00:51,660 --> 01:00:53,970 and controlled by Cincinnati's Tony Yates. 1180 01:00:54,010 --> 01:00:56,150 So the Bearcats have got the ball on the move. 1181 01:00:56,190 --> 01:00:58,450 He brings the ball over the 10-second timeline. 1182 01:00:58,500 --> 01:01:00,020 The Bearcats control down here to Bonham, 1183 01:01:00,060 --> 01:01:01,850 fires from the baseline, jumps, shoots, off, 1184 01:01:01,890 --> 01:01:04,550 no good, and Wilson stuffs it through. 1185 01:01:04,590 --> 01:01:08,330 George Wilson went high in the sky and stuffed it through. 1186 01:01:08,380 --> 01:01:10,640 We were the best team, without a doubt. 1187 01:01:10,680 --> 01:01:12,900 Deliberate game, set picks, 1188 01:01:12,950 --> 01:01:14,560 take our time with the ball. 1189 01:01:15,950 --> 01:01:17,040 Right at tip-off, 1190 01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:19,430 Cincinnati had momentum on their side. 1191 01:01:19,470 --> 01:01:21,430 Both teams studied their opponent, 1192 01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:25,000 their styles, tactics, and their biggest threat. 1193 01:01:25,050 --> 01:01:26,180 Harkness out to Ron Miller, 1194 01:01:26,220 --> 01:01:27,740 they're going to try to set the pattern, 1195 01:01:27,790 --> 01:01:29,960 they're not going in that full-court-press incidentally. 1196 01:01:30,010 --> 01:01:32,710 Tom Thacker, the best defensive player 1197 01:01:32,750 --> 01:01:34,970 in college basketball at the time. 1198 01:01:35,010 --> 01:01:38,280 At the beginning of the game I said, "I'ma get in his head." 1199 01:01:40,540 --> 01:01:41,580 He was going in 1200 01:01:41,630 --> 01:01:44,150 for what he thought was an easy layup. 1201 01:01:44,190 --> 01:01:47,200 He thought he had Tom Thacker beat. 1202 01:01:47,240 --> 01:01:48,850 Instead of going left, 1203 01:01:48,900 --> 01:01:50,850 where I know they had scouted me 1204 01:01:50,900 --> 01:01:54,160 and I go left 90% of the time, 1205 01:01:54,200 --> 01:01:56,600 I said, "I'ma go right on him." 1206 01:01:56,640 --> 01:01:58,080 They're going to try to set the pattern. 1207 01:01:58,120 --> 01:01:59,600 There goes Harkness driving the baseline, 1208 01:01:59,640 --> 01:02:00,820 and the ball knocked out of bounds 1209 01:02:00,860 --> 01:02:03,740 by Tom Thacker who is on Harkness. 1210 01:02:03,780 --> 01:02:05,350 He slapped the ball away. 1211 01:02:05,390 --> 01:02:09,480 I could not believe what he had just done. 1212 01:02:09,520 --> 01:02:13,350 Nobody would think of it as being awesome except me. 1213 01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:15,750 He knocked me out of my game. 1214 01:02:15,790 --> 01:02:19,100 From that moment on, he was afraid of Thacker. 1215 01:02:19,140 --> 01:02:20,840 Thacker was in his head. 1216 01:02:20,880 --> 01:02:22,760 Being guarded by Thacker, Harkness goes up 1217 01:02:22,800 --> 01:02:25,060 off the left side, jumps, an 8-footer, off, no good, 1218 01:02:25,110 --> 01:02:27,800 and Wilson clears the backboard backing up underneath. 1219 01:02:28,980 --> 01:02:32,460 When I got around him, there's George Wilson. 1220 01:02:32,500 --> 01:02:35,510 They had a double where they had me boxed in. 1221 01:02:35,550 --> 01:02:36,330 Down to Harkness. 1222 01:02:36,380 --> 01:02:37,420 Harkness has yet to score, 1223 01:02:37,470 --> 01:02:38,990 we're going to see what happens. 1224 01:02:39,030 --> 01:02:40,340 He backs up, he always shoots when he does, let's wait. 1225 01:02:40,380 --> 01:02:42,340 He turns around, jumps, shoots, off, no good, 1226 01:02:42,380 --> 01:02:44,650 and the ball knocked into the hands of Wilson. 1227 01:02:44,690 --> 01:02:47,170 They had all of the things to stop me. 1228 01:02:47,210 --> 01:02:49,390 They just scouted us very, very well. 1229 01:02:49,430 --> 01:02:51,170 Off to Miller to the right-hand side, 1230 01:02:51,220 --> 01:02:54,000 goes to the baseline, jumps, an 8-footer, off, no good. 1231 01:02:54,050 --> 01:02:56,180 So Ron Miller has got a foul. 1232 01:02:56,220 --> 01:02:58,700 We'd had slow starts before. 1233 01:02:58,750 --> 01:03:03,360 But this night, something is wrong. 1234 01:03:03,400 --> 01:03:05,360 1235 01:03:05,410 --> 01:03:08,240 With the threat of Jerry Harkness neutralized, 1236 01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:09,670 Ed Jucker turned his attack 1237 01:03:09,710 --> 01:03:14,240 on what Loyola relied on most, their speed. 1238 01:03:14,280 --> 01:03:16,030 Passing over to Bonham behind the free-throw line, 1239 01:03:16,070 --> 01:03:17,110 it is off the iron, no good 1240 01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:18,990 and Miller controls it off of there. 1241 01:03:19,030 --> 01:03:20,330 They slow down that fast break. 1242 01:03:20,380 --> 01:03:22,640 9:56 left to go in the first half. 1243 01:03:22,680 --> 01:03:25,600 They took away our fast breaks. 1244 01:03:25,640 --> 01:03:27,950 We wanted to cut loose all the time. 1245 01:03:27,990 --> 01:03:29,390 We wanted to get the ball and go, 1246 01:03:29,430 --> 01:03:31,000 and get the ball and go. 1247 01:03:31,040 --> 01:03:34,870 They didn't take enough shots for us to get going. 1248 01:03:34,910 --> 01:03:37,830 They were never in a hurry to take a shot. 1249 01:03:37,870 --> 01:03:40,960 Thacker way over, hands it back to Larry Shingleton. 1250 01:03:41,010 --> 01:03:42,270 They have a seven point lead 1251 01:03:42,310 --> 01:03:43,710 and when Cincinnati's got that kind of a lead, 1252 01:03:43,750 --> 01:03:44,840 it's pretty tough. 1253 01:03:44,880 --> 01:03:46,450 So they didn't miss a lot of shots. 1254 01:03:46,490 --> 01:03:50,020 So there was not an opportunity for us to get rebounds. 1255 01:03:50,060 --> 01:03:53,630 And for some reason, we could not ever adjust to that style. 1256 01:03:53,670 --> 01:03:57,150 I don't remember having a fast-break in the first half. 1257 01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,070 We just never could get started. 1258 01:03:59,110 --> 01:04:00,420 And we weren't shooting well. 1259 01:04:00,460 --> 01:04:02,120 Shooting percentage was terrible. 1260 01:04:02,160 --> 01:04:04,730 The Ramblers with a 13-footer, up, off, no good. 1261 01:04:04,770 --> 01:04:06,420 Over to Miller, jumping from behind the free-throw lane, 1262 01:04:06,470 --> 01:04:09,250 it is up, and short, no good, and Thacker clears it. 1263 01:04:09,300 --> 01:04:11,340 How could we miss that many shots? 1264 01:04:11,390 --> 01:04:13,870 I mean they were easy shots, they were wide open shots, 1265 01:04:13,910 --> 01:04:15,220 and we were missing shots. 1266 01:04:15,260 --> 01:04:17,700 I knew that we were much better 1267 01:04:17,740 --> 01:04:19,180 than we were playing. 1268 01:04:19,220 --> 01:04:21,920 A lot of people were probably watching at home. 1269 01:04:21,960 --> 01:04:24,050 And we come there and flop. 1270 01:04:25,360 --> 01:04:27,790 Everyone on that team was nervous. 1271 01:04:28,840 --> 01:04:33,150 We were out of sync, largely because our leader 1272 01:04:33,190 --> 01:04:36,580 was not having a good half. 1273 01:04:36,630 --> 01:04:38,890 Jerry did not feel confident. 1274 01:04:38,930 --> 01:04:41,420 If Jerry was not confident, the rest of the team 1275 01:04:41,460 --> 01:04:44,070 had to wonder, "What's to become of us?" 1276 01:04:44,110 --> 01:04:45,720 Miller over to Harkness. 1277 01:04:45,770 --> 01:04:47,120 He goes down near the baseline. 1278 01:04:47,160 --> 01:04:48,860 Bonham's on him, dribbles under, fakes, shoots, 1279 01:04:48,900 --> 01:04:50,550 and he is knocked down. 1280 01:04:50,600 --> 01:04:51,860 But getting the ball. 1281 01:04:51,900 --> 01:04:55,170 Egan sets, he shoots, it is rolling off, no good. 1282 01:04:55,210 --> 01:04:57,520 Over to Ron Miller, he jumps, he shoots, a 6-footer, 1283 01:04:57,560 --> 01:04:59,740 rolls off, no good, and the ball is knocked out of bounds, 1284 01:04:59,780 --> 01:05:01,700 last touched by Vic Rouse. 1285 01:05:01,740 --> 01:05:06,480 At halftime the score is 29 to 21. 1286 01:05:06,530 --> 01:05:08,530 The assumption by everybody is that this is a gimme. 1287 01:05:08,570 --> 01:05:10,440 Cincinnati's got it, it's in the bag. 1288 01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:15,450 1289 01:05:15,490 --> 01:05:17,710 The first half of the championship game 1290 01:05:18,840 --> 01:05:20,190 is kind of a blur. 1291 01:05:21,720 --> 01:05:23,810 I remember Jerry had a very bad game, 1292 01:05:25,240 --> 01:05:26,720 but so did everyone else. 1293 01:05:28,070 --> 01:05:29,940 We played the worst game of the year. 1294 01:05:32,160 --> 01:05:34,900 Of the four years that I was around Ireland, 1295 01:05:34,950 --> 01:05:36,380 I've often thought 1296 01:05:36,430 --> 01:05:40,780 that George Ireland's greatest achievement as a coach 1297 01:05:40,820 --> 01:05:43,260 was what he said at halftime. 1298 01:05:44,570 --> 01:05:49,530 He walks into the locker room and said to us, 1299 01:05:49,570 --> 01:05:53,840 "You know, you just played the worst half of basketball 1300 01:05:53,880 --> 01:05:55,920 I think we've played all year." 1301 01:05:55,970 --> 01:05:58,190 And he says, "I'm not worried about it. 1302 01:05:59,360 --> 01:06:01,360 We're gonna go out there the second half, 1303 01:06:01,410 --> 01:06:04,280 and you're gonna play better, and we'll win the game." 1304 01:06:05,760 --> 01:06:08,420 There were other times when we would be winning 1305 01:06:08,460 --> 01:06:10,720 by 10, 12, 15 points, 1306 01:06:10,770 --> 01:06:12,460 and he would come into the locker room 1307 01:06:12,510 --> 01:06:14,680 and he would start throwing things around, 1308 01:06:14,730 --> 01:06:17,550 telling us how lousy we were playing. 1309 01:06:17,600 --> 01:06:20,340 But at this moment, that night, 1310 01:06:20,380 --> 01:06:23,730 he was the complete opposite of all of those. 1311 01:06:25,080 --> 01:06:27,390 He said, "We're better than that. 1312 01:06:27,430 --> 01:06:29,350 You're better than that." 1313 01:06:29,390 --> 01:06:31,440 He said, "We'll get 'em the second half." 1314 01:06:33,740 --> 01:06:36,570 I've often felt that was his finest hour. 1315 01:06:36,620 --> 01:06:40,660 1316 01:06:40,710 --> 01:06:43,890 1317 01:06:46,760 --> 01:06:48,370 The ball is up and controlled 1318 01:06:48,410 --> 01:06:50,850 by Jerry Harkness over near the sideline. 1319 01:06:50,890 --> 01:06:52,590 Back to Miller the ball goes. 1320 01:06:52,630 --> 01:06:54,290 Back down to Harkness on the right side, 1321 01:06:54,330 --> 01:06:56,290 going inside the free-throw lane, shoots up, 1322 01:06:56,330 --> 01:06:57,860 and it goes off to Rouse, 1323 01:06:57,900 --> 01:07:00,640 he scores as he controls the board. 1324 01:07:00,680 --> 01:07:04,950 I never heard anyone say they had lost their hope. 1325 01:07:04,990 --> 01:07:07,080 But if you're watching that game, 1326 01:07:07,130 --> 01:07:09,650 you had to think, "Things are not going our way 1327 01:07:09,690 --> 01:07:12,520 and I don't see how they're gonna change." 1328 01:07:12,570 --> 01:07:14,520 Bolstered by their coach's confidence, 1329 01:07:14,570 --> 01:07:17,050 Loyola came out of the half ready to fight, 1330 01:07:17,090 --> 01:07:20,230 but Cincinnati looked just as strong as they started. 1331 01:07:20,270 --> 01:07:22,010 With Jerry still held at bay, 1332 01:07:22,050 --> 01:07:23,970 the Bearcats kept the pace slow, 1333 01:07:24,010 --> 01:07:25,620 making it even harder to catch up. 1334 01:07:25,670 --> 01:07:27,190 Yates has got it over the far side 1335 01:07:27,230 --> 01:07:28,190 to Larry Shingleton. 1336 01:07:28,230 --> 01:07:29,580 Larry down the corner to Bonham, 1337 01:07:29,630 --> 01:07:31,760 he jumps, an 18-footer is up and good. 1338 01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:35,420 45 to 30, Cincinnati leading by 15 points, 1339 01:07:35,460 --> 01:07:37,900 you wouldn't believe it unless you were here. 1340 01:07:37,940 --> 01:07:39,330 I'm thinking to myself, 1341 01:07:39,380 --> 01:07:40,940 "How do we make this comeback? 1342 01:07:40,990 --> 01:07:42,550 How do we do it?" 1343 01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:44,990 Cincinnati was about the best defensive team 1344 01:07:45,030 --> 01:07:46,510 in the United States, 1345 01:07:46,560 --> 01:07:48,730 so how do you overcome that deficit? 1346 01:07:48,780 --> 01:07:51,910 It's a long, hard hill to climb. 1347 01:07:51,950 --> 01:07:54,300 But maybe there's some life in them yet. 1348 01:07:54,350 --> 01:07:56,700 Rouse clears the backboard for Loyola. 1349 01:07:58,050 --> 01:07:59,400 Take the deep breath 1350 01:07:59,440 --> 01:08:02,620 and you wait for your time to hit. 1351 01:08:02,660 --> 01:08:05,010 47-34, 13 point lead. 1352 01:08:05,050 --> 01:08:07,190 Here's Ron Miller going down to the baseline. 1353 01:08:07,230 --> 01:08:09,410 Jumps, shoots, scores. 1354 01:08:09,450 --> 01:08:10,580 Going in the lane, and back, and pass, 1355 01:08:10,620 --> 01:08:12,230 it goes to Harkness, the baseline, 1356 01:08:12,280 --> 01:08:13,410 jumps, off, no good, 1357 01:08:13,450 --> 01:08:15,720 he can't get it, Rouse gets the rebound. 1358 01:08:15,760 --> 01:08:18,760 It was about five minutes to go in the game. 1359 01:08:18,810 --> 01:08:20,370 I hadn't scored a basket. 1360 01:08:20,420 --> 01:08:21,590 Shoots, up, off, no good. 1361 01:08:21,640 --> 01:08:22,980 And Leslie Hunter clears it. 1362 01:08:23,030 --> 01:08:25,550 There they go, Harkness, and the ball is stolen, 1363 01:08:25,600 --> 01:08:29,030 as Harkness passes, it's stolen by Larry Shingleton. 1364 01:08:29,080 --> 01:08:30,820 Beautiful interception by Larry. 1365 01:08:32,430 --> 01:08:34,870 Loyola was battling every possession. 1366 01:08:34,910 --> 01:08:37,300 But still down seven, every miss 1367 01:08:37,350 --> 01:08:39,260 made it painfully clear, 1368 01:08:39,310 --> 01:08:44,220 if Jerry Harkness couldn't score, Loyola was finished. 1369 01:08:47,270 --> 01:08:50,140 Jerry had a big dream, had big ideas 1370 01:08:50,190 --> 01:08:53,620 about his friends at home watching him on TV. 1371 01:08:53,670 --> 01:08:56,760 How this was gonna be triumph of the poor, 1372 01:08:56,800 --> 01:08:59,760 be triumphant back in New York. 1373 01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:02,590 And he saw all that slipping away. 1374 01:09:02,630 --> 01:09:05,640 I would not have been able to face myself, 1375 01:09:05,680 --> 01:09:09,340 in life, because I played so bad. 1376 01:09:10,600 --> 01:09:14,340 I would have felt bad for the rest of my life. 1377 01:09:17,080 --> 01:09:20,740 But God has always put me in a situation, 1378 01:09:22,130 --> 01:09:25,790 going on welfare, nothing to eat. 1379 01:09:27,140 --> 01:09:30,050 And I think of my mom getting us through, 1380 01:09:31,360 --> 01:09:35,190 coming out of the hospital, and telling us, 1381 01:09:36,100 --> 01:09:37,800 "We're going to make it." 1382 01:09:39,060 --> 01:09:43,020 I realized that all of that drive and determination 1383 01:09:45,070 --> 01:09:46,290 came from my mom. 1384 01:09:48,110 --> 01:09:50,810 Ireland put in a different play 1385 01:09:50,850 --> 01:09:53,680 that Cincinnati had not seen. 1386 01:09:53,730 --> 01:09:56,560 I felt finally, maybe this is it for me. 1387 01:09:59,950 --> 01:10:03,390 Egan, Egan to Harkness, turn around, jumper's good. 1388 01:10:03,430 --> 01:10:05,090 Jerry made his first basket. 1389 01:10:05,130 --> 01:10:10,220 He made it, he might do it, 48 to 43, 48 to 43. 1390 01:10:10,270 --> 01:10:11,440 We can win this game. 1391 01:10:11,480 --> 01:10:13,960 At that point, we can win. 1392 01:10:14,010 --> 01:10:15,790 Here's Thacker with that ball. 1393 01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:17,660 Passing down, intercepted by Harkness. 1394 01:10:17,710 --> 01:10:20,540 Here goes Jerry, lays it up, and he scores. 1395 01:10:20,580 --> 01:10:24,670 Harkness scores, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. 1396 01:10:26,460 --> 01:10:29,020 48-45, 4:16 left to go. 1397 01:10:29,070 --> 01:10:31,330 Oh, is this a ball game now. 1398 01:10:31,370 --> 01:10:33,720 Out to Harkness on the left side, he's driving down, 1399 01:10:33,770 --> 01:10:38,770 he's under, lays it up, and scores, he scores, he scores. 1400 01:10:39,210 --> 01:10:41,860 Jerry was the primary reason 1401 01:10:41,910 --> 01:10:46,260 that we were able to come back and get into the game. 1402 01:10:46,300 --> 01:10:51,220 Once he heated up, the rest of the team followed suit. 1403 01:10:53,000 --> 01:10:57,010 We just started playing harder, much harder. 1404 01:10:57,050 --> 01:10:58,400 Look at Hunter get that ball. 1405 01:10:58,440 --> 01:10:59,920 Miller on the right side, 1406 01:10:59,970 --> 01:11:01,750 a bounce pass into Hunter, turn around, layup, and oh! 1407 01:11:01,800 --> 01:11:04,410 Goal tending, goal tending, they finally called it. 1408 01:11:04,450 --> 01:11:06,410 It's 51 to 50. 1409 01:11:06,450 --> 01:11:09,110 The crowd started to come around, 1410 01:11:09,150 --> 01:11:11,020 'cause we started to close the gap. 1411 01:11:11,070 --> 01:11:13,150 Here comes Harkness, he lays it up 1412 01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:17,510 and it is tipped in by Hunter, 19 seconds, 15 seconds, 16. 1413 01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:20,730 Shingleton's got it, and a foul. 1414 01:11:20,770 --> 01:11:22,770 Harkness fouled him purposefully, he had to do it. 1415 01:11:23,690 --> 01:11:25,040 12 seconds to play 1416 01:11:25,080 --> 01:11:27,520 and it's bedlam here in Louisville, Kentucky. 1417 01:11:28,820 --> 01:11:32,780 53 to 52, Cincinnati by one single point. 1418 01:11:32,830 --> 01:11:35,390 And going to the line will be Larry Shingleton. 1419 01:11:35,440 --> 01:11:37,570 Larry Shingleton was one of 1420 01:11:37,610 --> 01:11:41,790 the best free-throw shooters in the nation. 1421 01:11:41,840 --> 01:11:46,800 So, you know, when he stepped to the line, my heart sank. 1422 01:11:47,190 --> 01:11:48,840 With 12 seconds to go, 1423 01:11:48,890 --> 01:11:50,410 Shingleton will go to the line. 1424 01:11:50,450 --> 01:11:53,500 If he should miss, they would have time of course 1425 01:11:53,540 --> 01:11:56,420 to go down the court and perhaps take that one shot. 1426 01:11:56,460 --> 01:11:58,630 And Tom, anything can happen at this point. 1427 01:12:00,030 --> 01:12:02,460 I am out there praying. 1428 01:12:02,510 --> 01:12:05,340 'Cause if he hits both, over. 1429 01:12:05,380 --> 01:12:07,730 No doubt about it, the game is over. 1430 01:12:07,770 --> 01:12:11,340 1431 01:12:11,390 --> 01:12:12,690 1432 01:12:12,740 --> 01:12:16,130 Well, there's one of them, 54 to 52. 1433 01:12:16,170 --> 01:12:21,180 I said, "Dear Lord, please, please just give us a chance." 1434 01:12:22,050 --> 01:12:23,220 Larry Shingleton 1435 01:12:23,270 --> 01:12:25,440 with only his second point of the night. 1436 01:12:25,490 --> 01:12:28,490 And now, perhaps he can ice the ball game for them. 1437 01:12:30,190 --> 01:12:33,580 1438 01:12:35,320 --> 01:12:39,240 It's short, and it comes off to Loyola. 1439 01:12:39,280 --> 01:12:41,850 Les gets the rebound, perfect position. 1440 01:12:42,810 --> 01:12:44,250 And there's a guy from Cincinnati 1441 01:12:44,290 --> 01:12:48,210 who swipes at the ball as Les passes the ball to me. 1442 01:12:48,250 --> 01:12:51,120 And as I catch the ball, I take one dribble 1443 01:12:51,170 --> 01:12:54,600 and I see Jerry streaking toward the basket. 1444 01:12:54,650 --> 01:12:57,870 I saw him break, I knew he could get his shot, 1445 01:12:57,910 --> 01:12:59,610 because that's his spot. 1446 01:12:59,650 --> 01:13:01,780 Jerry did what he does best. 1447 01:13:01,830 --> 01:13:05,440 He cocked that left hand behind his head. 1448 01:13:05,480 --> 01:13:06,880 I didn't feel anything. 1449 01:13:08,140 --> 01:13:10,880 I didn't feel the ball leave my hand. 1450 01:13:10,920 --> 01:13:13,450 If I would have had an air ball, 1451 01:13:13,490 --> 01:13:15,100 I wouldn't have been surprised. 1452 01:13:16,100 --> 01:13:17,630 I just let it go. 1453 01:13:17,670 --> 01:13:19,630 No good, and Leslie Hunter has got it. 1454 01:13:19,670 --> 01:13:21,460 To Ron Miller, they've got a fast break. 1455 01:13:21,500 --> 01:13:24,070 Down to Harkness, he jumps, he shoots, he scores. 1456 01:13:25,850 --> 01:13:28,810 He scores, he scores, he scores! 1457 01:13:28,860 --> 01:13:31,470 Perfect fast break within seconds. 1458 01:13:31,510 --> 01:13:33,640 And that, to me, was who Loyola was. 1459 01:13:33,690 --> 01:13:36,470 That's how we played, just like that. 1460 01:13:36,520 --> 01:13:37,690 One second to go, 1461 01:13:37,730 --> 01:13:39,260 and we're going into overtime. 1462 01:13:40,820 --> 01:13:43,830 And the score is all tied, 54 to 54. 1463 01:13:46,310 --> 01:13:47,960 1464 01:13:48,000 --> 01:13:49,620 The clock is running with nine seconds, 1465 01:13:49,660 --> 01:13:51,230 Harkness takes it, he makes it. 1466 01:13:51,270 --> 01:13:53,270 It's all tied up. 1467 01:13:53,310 --> 01:13:56,490 1468 01:13:56,540 --> 01:13:57,840 There was some controversy 1469 01:13:57,880 --> 01:14:01,100 that Ronnie Miller might have gotten away 1470 01:14:01,150 --> 01:14:02,670 with a traveling call. 1471 01:14:03,760 --> 01:14:06,680 That's true, I gotta say it. 1472 01:14:08,940 --> 01:14:12,770 There's the Ronnie, he did an extra step. 1473 01:14:12,810 --> 01:14:15,860 They know what they did, they know what happened. 1474 01:14:15,900 --> 01:14:19,860 It was so close that nobody in their mind 1475 01:14:19,910 --> 01:14:22,740 as a referee is gonna call that. 1476 01:14:22,780 --> 01:14:25,260 There was no question in my mind, he walked. 1477 01:14:25,300 --> 01:14:27,440 Did he get away with something? 1478 01:14:27,480 --> 01:14:30,390 Yeah, they didn't blow a whistle. 1479 01:14:32,220 --> 01:14:34,660 I didn't travel because the ref didn't call it. 1480 01:14:35,920 --> 01:14:39,190 And the basket's made. We're into overtime. 1481 01:14:39,230 --> 01:14:43,280 1482 01:14:43,320 --> 01:14:45,370 It is absolutely a madhouse here. 1483 01:14:45,410 --> 01:14:47,850 And it's all tied, 54-54. 1484 01:14:47,890 --> 01:14:50,020 Loyola getting 33 points in the second half, 1485 01:14:50,070 --> 01:14:51,110 Cincinnati getting 25. 1486 01:14:51,150 --> 01:14:53,810 And Jerry Harkness, who had had 1487 01:14:53,850 --> 01:14:57,250 perhaps his most miserable night in his college career, 1488 01:14:57,290 --> 01:14:58,550 came back to become the hero 1489 01:14:58,600 --> 01:15:00,860 to tie it up with three seconds to go. 1490 01:15:00,900 --> 01:15:03,340 But when David comes up against Goliath, 1491 01:15:03,380 --> 01:15:04,730 what can you do? 1492 01:15:04,780 --> 01:15:05,870 There it goes down to Harkness, he's underneath, 1493 01:15:05,910 --> 01:15:07,690 he lays it up, he scores, he scores. 1494 01:15:08,870 --> 01:15:10,780 56 to 54, it's a dilly! 1495 01:15:12,390 --> 01:15:13,960 As the Ramblers are out in front 1496 01:15:14,000 --> 01:15:17,050 for the first time in this ball game. 1497 01:15:17,090 --> 01:15:18,620 What I remember most about the last five minutes 1498 01:15:18,660 --> 01:15:20,230 was that desperation. 1499 01:15:20,270 --> 01:15:22,270 Keep clawing until the bitter end 1500 01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:23,970 and something good will happen. 1501 01:15:25,320 --> 01:15:26,360 Thacker trying to get one inside, 1502 01:15:26,410 --> 01:15:30,240 he goes to Wilson, and Wilson scores. 1503 01:15:30,280 --> 01:15:33,460 Imagine playing an entire game 1504 01:15:33,500 --> 01:15:37,240 without any break, and an overtime. 1505 01:15:37,290 --> 01:15:39,510 Those guys had no time to rest. 1506 01:15:39,550 --> 01:15:43,640 They were constantly going. All five. 1507 01:15:43,690 --> 01:15:45,170 They have gone all the way 1508 01:15:45,210 --> 01:15:46,990 without a substitute. 1509 01:15:47,040 --> 01:15:50,740 And I'm wondering, Tom Hamlin, if this isn't beginning 1510 01:15:50,780 --> 01:15:52,780 to wear on Loyola a little bit. 1511 01:15:52,830 --> 01:15:55,740 As you get tired, you lose your legs, 1512 01:15:55,780 --> 01:15:59,270 you lose your shot, a lot of things go south. 1513 01:15:59,310 --> 01:16:00,440 Les Hunter takes his shot, 1514 01:16:00,480 --> 01:16:01,700 it rolls around and goes off. 1515 01:16:01,750 --> 01:16:04,180 And George Wilson grabs it for the Bearcats. 1516 01:16:06,670 --> 01:16:08,410 At one time, one of the guys came out and says, 1517 01:16:08,450 --> 01:16:10,840 "Chuck, I'm gassed." 1518 01:16:10,890 --> 01:16:14,150 Well, coach said go out there, keep playing. 1519 01:16:14,190 --> 01:16:16,280 Somebody maybe needs a sub, 1520 01:16:16,330 --> 01:16:18,980 but you don't wanna tinker with that moment. 1521 01:16:19,030 --> 01:16:21,330 No substitutions, that's what it's gonna be. 1522 01:16:21,380 --> 01:16:23,380 The lead pass intercepted by Ron Miller. 1523 01:16:23,420 --> 01:16:24,510 Ron Miller intercepted the pass 1524 01:16:24,550 --> 01:16:26,210 and now the Ramblers have got it. 1525 01:16:26,250 --> 01:16:28,160 Action? You better believe it. 1526 01:16:28,210 --> 01:16:30,340 Miller shoots a 20-footer, good. 1527 01:16:30,380 --> 01:16:32,040 Good by Ron Miller. 1528 01:16:32,080 --> 01:16:33,780 The final minutes of overtime 1529 01:16:33,820 --> 01:16:35,650 felt like a tug-of-war. 1530 01:16:35,690 --> 01:16:37,650 Two teams desperate to win, 1531 01:16:37,700 --> 01:16:40,390 both on the verge of collapse. 1532 01:16:40,440 --> 01:16:42,350 They'd do anything to score. 1533 01:16:42,400 --> 01:16:45,140 Even if it meant taking a play from the other side. 1534 01:16:45,180 --> 01:16:47,580 To Cincinnati, a long pass to Shingleton, 1535 01:16:47,620 --> 01:16:49,530 he's in the clear. 1536 01:16:49,580 --> 01:16:51,580 He ties it up, 58 to 58. 1537 01:16:52,620 --> 01:16:55,240 1538 01:16:55,280 --> 01:16:56,580 A minute and a half to go. 1539 01:17:00,540 --> 01:17:01,980 Egan almost loses it. 1540 01:17:02,020 --> 01:17:03,420 They'll have to jump for it. 1541 01:17:04,370 --> 01:17:07,330 Egan and Shingleton, the two smallest men on the court, 1542 01:17:07,380 --> 01:17:08,900 will jump for it. 1543 01:17:08,940 --> 01:17:12,030 Jack has no quit in him. 1544 01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:15,390 The fact that Shingleton was a little taller 1545 01:17:15,430 --> 01:17:17,210 didn't make a difference. 1546 01:17:17,260 --> 01:17:20,000 Shingleton is 5-10 and Egan is 5-9, 1547 01:17:20,040 --> 01:17:23,050 so Cincinnati with a slight height advantage. 1548 01:17:24,220 --> 01:17:26,050 Because believe me, this is a very important jump. 1549 01:17:26,090 --> 01:17:27,920 Jack would fight anybody. 1550 01:17:27,960 --> 01:17:31,310 I mean, he didn't care who you were. 1551 01:17:31,360 --> 01:17:33,490 If you had the ball, he was gonna fight you 1552 01:17:33,530 --> 01:17:35,100 to take the ball. 1553 01:17:35,140 --> 01:17:39,110 I don't care if the guy was 6-8, that's the way Jack is. 1554 01:17:39,150 --> 01:17:41,850 Ball is up and tipped back to Ron Miller. 1555 01:17:41,890 --> 01:17:44,590 He's got it, over to Jerry Harkness. 1556 01:17:44,630 --> 01:17:47,550 I think it was a misfiring on Shingleton's part 1557 01:17:47,590 --> 01:17:50,900 because he was up too soon before the ball was, 1558 01:17:50,940 --> 01:17:52,250 could be reached. 1559 01:17:52,290 --> 01:17:55,640 And Jack timed it perfectly, luck of the Irish. 1560 01:17:56,510 --> 01:17:58,250 Back to Egan, 1:15. 1561 01:17:58,300 --> 01:18:00,520 What would you do? 58-58. 1562 01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:02,690 Would you go for the one? 1563 01:18:02,740 --> 01:18:06,480 I think everyone knew that the idea was 1564 01:18:06,520 --> 01:18:10,440 to get the ball to Jerry Harkness for the last shot. 1565 01:18:11,490 --> 01:18:13,920 So we're gonna try to get the ball to Jerry. 1566 01:18:13,970 --> 01:18:15,530 And he should be taking his shot 1567 01:18:15,580 --> 01:18:17,710 with three, four seconds left, 1568 01:18:17,750 --> 01:18:20,840 so there's a chance for a tip in, a rebound, 1569 01:18:20,890 --> 01:18:22,540 but not an opportunity for them 1570 01:18:22,580 --> 01:18:25,330 to get a rebound and go all the way down the court. 1571 01:18:25,370 --> 01:18:26,980 How do we do it? 1572 01:18:27,020 --> 01:18:28,280 They're gonna go for one, 1573 01:18:28,330 --> 01:18:29,980 I don't think there's any question about it. 1574 01:18:30,030 --> 01:18:32,330 50 seconds, 49, 48. 1575 01:18:32,380 --> 01:18:34,330 Harkness backing in, he may go, 1576 01:18:34,380 --> 01:18:35,860 now he goes back out to Egan. 1577 01:18:35,900 --> 01:18:39,120 Egan has got the ball, looking around, over to Harkness, 1578 01:18:39,170 --> 01:18:41,820 back to Egan, 38 seconds left to go. 1579 01:18:41,860 --> 01:18:44,610 To Rouse, back to Miller, they're gonna go for the one shot. 1580 01:18:44,650 --> 01:18:47,430 58-58. And this is a twist. 1581 01:18:47,480 --> 01:18:50,000 Cincinnati, the team that always holds the ball, 1582 01:18:50,050 --> 01:18:52,090 they're seeing what it feels like now. 1583 01:18:53,350 --> 01:18:57,100 The team that normally held the ball 1584 01:18:57,140 --> 01:18:59,930 did not know what to do 1585 01:18:59,970 --> 01:19:02,800 when someone held the ball against them. 1586 01:19:02,840 --> 01:19:04,710 Egan over To Harkness. 1587 01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:06,240 Harkness going inside the lane, 1588 01:19:06,280 --> 01:19:08,370 now he goes back out to Miller. 1589 01:19:08,410 --> 01:19:10,280 15 seconds, out to Egan. 1590 01:19:10,330 --> 01:19:11,500 I guarantee you one thing, 1591 01:19:11,550 --> 01:19:13,420 they'll give it Harkness when it's time. 1592 01:19:13,460 --> 01:19:16,680 Everybody pretty much thought it would come to me. 1593 01:19:16,720 --> 01:19:18,600 Miller's got it, out to Rouse. 1594 01:19:18,640 --> 01:19:21,210 Nine, eight, Harkness has got it, here he goes. 1595 01:19:21,250 --> 01:19:22,900 And I got the ball. 1596 01:19:22,950 --> 01:19:26,650 And he knew I was going left, and I knew it. 1597 01:19:27,780 --> 01:19:29,080 But I didn't feel it. 1598 01:19:29,960 --> 01:19:34,220 In the corner of my eye, I saw Hunter open. 1599 01:19:34,260 --> 01:19:36,310 And he can hit that shot. 1600 01:19:36,350 --> 01:19:37,700 Threw it to Les. 1601 01:19:37,750 --> 01:19:40,180 Now we're talking probably three or four seconds. 1602 01:19:40,230 --> 01:19:41,400 I got nervous. 1603 01:19:41,440 --> 01:19:44,140 Not because Les isn't a great shot, 1604 01:19:44,190 --> 01:19:49,320 but I heard the ball scratch as he took that shot. 1605 01:19:49,370 --> 01:19:51,980 He scratched it with his fingernails. 1606 01:19:52,020 --> 01:19:53,890 It was a good shot to take. 1607 01:19:53,940 --> 01:19:55,760 It went off the side of the rim 1608 01:19:55,810 --> 01:19:59,330 and then one of the second best, 1609 01:19:59,380 --> 01:20:01,860 third best moment of my life was seeing Vic 1610 01:20:01,900 --> 01:20:04,030 push that ball back through the basket. 1611 01:20:04,080 --> 01:20:05,290 Off the rim, Rouse gets it, 1612 01:20:05,340 --> 01:20:08,340 scores, it's over, it's over! 1613 01:20:08,380 --> 01:20:11,870 We won, we won, we won the ballgame! 1614 01:20:11,910 --> 01:20:13,830 We won the ballgame! 1615 01:20:13,870 --> 01:20:16,130 Oh, we won, Loyola won the ballgame! 1616 01:20:16,180 --> 01:20:20,050 Oh, we won it, we won, 1617 01:20:20,090 --> 01:20:21,960 60 to 58, 60 to 58. 1618 01:20:25,620 --> 01:20:29,010 Rouse gets it, scores, it's over, it's over! 1619 01:20:29,060 --> 01:20:32,320 We won, we won, we won, we won the ballgame! 1620 01:20:32,370 --> 01:20:33,800 We won, we won. 1621 01:20:36,200 --> 01:20:39,070 And all of a sudden, we heard these voices, 1622 01:20:39,110 --> 01:20:41,550 marched out on Sheridan Road yelling, 1623 01:20:41,590 --> 01:20:43,680 "We won, we won, we won!" 1624 01:20:43,720 --> 01:20:45,730 I think they went all the way to Evanston, 1625 01:20:45,770 --> 01:20:49,730 like at midnight, oh, so joyous and so joyful. 1626 01:20:49,770 --> 01:20:51,860 1627 01:20:51,910 --> 01:20:53,690 You just have no idea the pride 1628 01:20:53,730 --> 01:20:55,340 that I have for those guys. 1629 01:20:57,040 --> 01:21:00,050 It was unbelievable. 1630 01:21:00,090 --> 01:21:03,610 It was good to see the starting five 1631 01:21:03,660 --> 01:21:07,790 get the reward reward that they had earned. 1632 01:21:09,620 --> 01:21:10,880 George, how does it feel 1633 01:21:10,930 --> 01:21:13,230 to be a national champion of the NCAA? 1634 01:21:13,280 --> 01:21:14,580 It's the first time we brought a team 1635 01:21:14,620 --> 01:21:16,150 to the tournament and we just said, 1636 01:21:16,190 --> 01:21:18,060 "Look, we're having a poor first half. 1637 01:21:18,110 --> 01:21:20,800 I know you can beat 'em, let's go out and give it to 'em." 1638 01:21:20,850 --> 01:21:23,500 And that is the championship for 1963 1639 01:21:23,550 --> 01:21:26,550 and one of the most unbelievable comebacks of all time. 1640 01:21:26,590 --> 01:21:30,810 America was sitting witness to this evolution of the game 1641 01:21:30,860 --> 01:21:34,730 by seven out of 10 African Americans starting in that game. 1642 01:21:36,300 --> 01:21:38,610 Loyola did what they set out to do. 1643 01:21:38,650 --> 01:21:40,910 But their win represented so much more. 1644 01:21:42,520 --> 01:21:43,610 The end of the tournament 1645 01:21:43,650 --> 01:21:45,830 marked the beginning of their legacy, 1646 01:21:45,870 --> 01:21:47,570 one that shaped the sport 1647 01:21:47,610 --> 01:21:51,440 and their lives for years to come. 1648 01:21:53,010 --> 01:21:55,620 1649 01:21:57,540 --> 01:22:00,710 1650 01:22:01,630 --> 01:22:04,410 โ™ช We're Loyola, we're number one โ™ช 1651 01:22:04,460 --> 01:22:08,500 โ™ช We're Loyola, we're number one โ™ช 1652 01:22:10,160 --> 01:22:11,860 The Ramblers returned home to Chicago 1653 01:22:11,900 --> 01:22:14,640 as champions that March of 1963, 1654 01:22:14,680 --> 01:22:16,510 the first school in the state of Illinois 1655 01:22:16,560 --> 01:22:19,170 to ever win a division one national title. 1656 01:22:19,210 --> 01:22:21,080 How do you feel after your four years at Loyola? 1657 01:22:21,130 --> 01:22:22,690 Well, I feel tremendous. 1658 01:22:22,740 --> 01:22:23,820 This is a great thing. 1659 01:22:23,870 --> 01:22:26,650 We won the championship in basketball 1660 01:22:26,700 --> 01:22:29,000 and that's exactly what I wanted. 1661 01:22:29,050 --> 01:22:32,220 1662 01:22:33,830 --> 01:22:36,360 The win was celebrated not just by Loyola, 1663 01:22:36,400 --> 01:22:39,060 but the entire city of Chicago. 1664 01:22:39,100 --> 01:22:42,020 So Ireland proudly paraded their trophy around town, 1665 01:22:42,060 --> 01:22:44,240 including a barber shop across from campus 1666 01:22:44,280 --> 01:22:47,070 where four of the Iron Five weren't even allowed inside. 1667 01:22:50,590 --> 01:22:53,200 As for Jerry Harkness, after graduating, 1668 01:22:53,250 --> 01:22:55,730 he had a short-lived pro career in the ABA 1669 01:22:55,770 --> 01:22:57,290 before returning to Chicago 1670 01:22:57,340 --> 01:22:59,690 and finding work as a salesman on the Northside, 1671 01:22:59,730 --> 01:23:00,950 close to campus. 1672 01:23:02,560 --> 01:23:06,040 Now, he was just a young black man trying to build a life. 1673 01:23:06,080 --> 01:23:10,000 1674 01:23:10,040 --> 01:23:13,440 I could see all of those people out there 1675 01:23:13,480 --> 01:23:16,830 cheering as we won the national title. 1676 01:23:16,880 --> 01:23:20,050 Then when it got time to just move, 1677 01:23:20,100 --> 01:23:23,490 I could not get a place to stay. 1678 01:23:23,540 --> 01:23:26,320 And they came up with all kind of excuses. 1679 01:23:27,320 --> 01:23:28,720 I was being discriminated against, 1680 01:23:28,760 --> 01:23:30,670 there was no doubt about it. 1681 01:23:32,410 --> 01:23:35,290 The story of the '63 Ramblers made me wonder, 1682 01:23:36,200 --> 01:23:38,640 "What was really different now? 1683 01:23:38,680 --> 01:23:41,820 Did their accomplishments change anything?" 1684 01:23:41,860 --> 01:23:44,510 The answer is complicated, 1685 01:23:44,560 --> 01:23:47,730 but their lasting effect on basketball is clear. 1686 01:23:48,950 --> 01:23:53,310 The '63 team changed the game, 1687 01:23:53,350 --> 01:23:56,440 made it faster, more interesting, 1688 01:23:56,480 --> 01:24:01,490 a lot more fun to watch, almost like a ballet. 1689 01:24:02,620 --> 01:24:06,620 1690 01:24:08,320 --> 01:24:10,930 It was the beginning of modern basketball. 1691 01:24:11,800 --> 01:24:14,890 That changed the landscape of college sports. 1692 01:24:14,940 --> 01:24:17,070 We were able to work together 1693 01:24:17,110 --> 01:24:20,070 with all this diversity and come out a winner. 1694 01:24:20,110 --> 01:24:22,250 And then common sense would tell us, 1695 01:24:22,290 --> 01:24:24,510 "Well, can't we do that in society as well?" 1696 01:24:24,550 --> 01:24:27,600 1697 01:24:27,640 --> 01:24:32,610 1698 01:24:35,520 --> 01:24:39,530 One part of America was making changes. 1699 01:24:39,570 --> 01:24:40,960 Texas Western takes 1700 01:24:41,000 --> 01:24:43,660 the first major sports title the school has ever won. 1701 01:24:43,700 --> 01:24:45,750 And the other part was not. 1702 01:24:48,450 --> 01:24:53,190 I got involved in the Civil Rights Movement after school. 1703 01:24:53,230 --> 01:24:56,320 We had an obligation to do something, 1704 01:24:56,370 --> 01:25:00,240 say something about how the situation was. 1705 01:25:03,330 --> 01:25:05,770 Sports has a way of tearing down barriers 1706 01:25:05,810 --> 01:25:07,600 faster than the rest of society. 1707 01:25:08,820 --> 01:25:12,470 And when athletes use their platform to demand justice, 1708 01:25:12,510 --> 01:25:14,170 they can often turn their victories 1709 01:25:14,210 --> 01:25:15,560 into something much bigger. 1710 01:25:17,870 --> 01:25:19,260 But they can't do it alone. 1711 01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:25,440 1712 01:25:25,480 --> 01:25:28,100 1713 01:25:29,400 --> 01:25:31,100 The world of college basketball 1714 01:25:31,140 --> 01:25:32,750 has lost a pioneer. 1715 01:25:34,100 --> 01:25:35,580 Jerry Harkness was best known 1716 01:25:35,620 --> 01:25:38,150 for the history he made as a Loyola Rambler. 1717 01:25:39,020 --> 01:25:40,410 Harkness would go on to work 1718 01:25:40,460 --> 01:25:42,630 for the United Way of Central Indiana. 1719 01:25:42,680 --> 01:25:44,980 He helped start the Indiana Black Expo 1720 01:25:45,030 --> 01:25:47,200 and he was the first black sportscaster 1721 01:25:47,250 --> 01:25:49,030 on Indianapolis television. 1722 01:25:49,940 --> 01:25:52,290 Jerry Harkness was 81 years old. 1723 01:25:53,380 --> 01:25:55,990 1724 01:25:57,520 --> 01:25:59,390 During the 1963 season, 1725 01:25:59,430 --> 01:26:02,000 we see numerous stories being told. 1726 01:26:02,040 --> 01:26:05,000 And the obvious one is a story about a team, 1727 01:26:05,050 --> 01:26:07,310 a team with four black players. 1728 01:26:07,350 --> 01:26:10,400 And they play well and they win. 1729 01:26:11,310 --> 01:26:14,920 And the story doesn't stop. 1730 01:26:14,970 --> 01:26:17,710 Because the story's not just about basketball. 1731 01:26:17,750 --> 01:26:20,800 This story is about the worth of an athlete, 1732 01:26:20,840 --> 01:26:22,630 the worth of a black man, 1733 01:26:22,670 --> 01:26:25,370 their place in society and what they can demand. 1734 01:26:26,410 --> 01:26:27,720 It's just a tremendous honor 1735 01:26:27,760 --> 01:26:32,160 for all the team members to be recognized. 1736 01:26:32,200 --> 01:26:36,470 It's a chance to see the effect that you've had 1737 01:26:36,510 --> 01:26:38,300 on some of the people that played, 1738 01:26:38,340 --> 01:26:41,860 some of the black players that we opened some doors for. 1739 01:26:41,910 --> 01:26:45,390 We are extremely proud of you. 1740 01:26:45,430 --> 01:26:49,130 You represent the university 1741 01:26:49,180 --> 01:26:51,790 and yourselves extremely well. 1742 01:26:51,830 --> 01:26:55,050 We try to do our best to just imitate you guys 1743 01:26:55,100 --> 01:26:57,710 and like what you guys have done. 1744 01:26:57,750 --> 01:27:01,750 The best we can do is say this is to be continued. 1745 01:27:01,800 --> 01:27:03,970 It is a work in progress. 1746 01:27:04,020 --> 01:27:07,060 It is a project that's not yet ended. 1747 01:27:07,110 --> 01:27:08,460 To make our country one 1748 01:27:08,500 --> 01:27:10,760 that's worthy of what these men went through. 1749 01:27:11,760 --> 01:27:12,770 The most important thing 1750 01:27:12,810 --> 01:27:14,460 is that we keep telling the story. 1751 01:27:14,510 --> 01:27:16,250 Looking back you have a better understanding 1752 01:27:16,290 --> 01:27:18,860 of why we are in the situation that we are in today. 1753 01:27:23,690 --> 01:27:26,260 1754 01:27:28,220 --> 01:27:30,650 One day, hopefully long from now, 1755 01:27:30,700 --> 01:27:33,260 my time playing basketball will come to an end. 1756 01:27:34,310 --> 01:27:36,350 But there will always be more work to do, 1757 01:27:36,400 --> 01:27:38,620 more unwritten rules to break, 1758 01:27:38,660 --> 01:27:40,180 more ways to make the world better 1759 01:27:40,230 --> 01:27:41,530 for the next generation. 1760 01:27:42,400 --> 01:27:44,540 To me, that's the inspiration I think 1761 01:27:44,580 --> 01:27:46,800 we can all carry forward. 1762 01:27:46,840 --> 01:27:49,280 That's the legacy of the '63 Ramblers. 1763 01:27:51,060 --> 01:27:53,630 1764 01:27:57,420 --> 01:28:00,600 1765 01:28:30,500 --> 01:28:34,500 1766 01:29:00,570 --> 01:29:04,570 1767 01:29:30,420 --> 01:29:34,390 1768 01:30:00,320 --> 01:30:04,330 135778

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