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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:13,680 [classical music] 2 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:21,760 [indistinct chatter] 3 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:30,200 It was Frieze Week in London, which is, I suppose, the week in 4 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:33,440 the London calendar when everyone in the art world is in town. 5 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:37,720 And the contemporary evening auctions are the biggest in London, 6 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:39,400 and this was Sotheby's. 7 00:00:48,880 --> 00:00:51,560 It was a huge sale. 60-odd lots. 8 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:54,560 And this Banksy was positioned right at the end, 9 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:56,360 the last lot of the evening. 10 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:00,400 [upbeat music] 11 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,400 I was bidding for the Banksy, the "Girl with Balloon", 12 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:08,040 and it was the one that, you know, everyone connects Banksy to. 13 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:10,720 The year before, so I think in 2017, 14 00:01:10,720 --> 00:01:14,480 it was rated as the UK's most favourite art piece. 15 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:16,360 [upbeat music] 16 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:22,840 For me, from a collector's point of view and a dealer's point of view, 17 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,440 uh, it's the holy grail. 18 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:28,760 Banksy, "Girl with Balloon", ladies and gentlemen. 19 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:31,840 I'm going to start bidding at 100, 150, 200 thousand. 20 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:34,840 300 thousand. 350. 400 thousand. 21 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:36,760 450 thousand. 500 thousand. 22 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:40,920 The estimate being quite low, that encouraged the bidding. 23 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:43,040 And there was a lot of energy. It was a big sale. 24 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:45,640 Does anybody...? 700 thousand. 25 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:48,280 We went up to £650,000. Stopped there. 26 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:53,280 Towards the end, I think there was maybe about two or three bidders left. 27 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:56,040 800 thousand. Thank you. 28 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:58,200 No pressure. Last chance. 29 00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:02,040 At £850,000. 30 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:03,280 860! 31 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:04,440 [crowd muttering] 32 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:05,960 Last... Yeah, are we bidding? 33 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:07,600 And selling for 860 thousand! 34 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:09,760 -Thank you very much. -[cheering and applause] 35 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:12,440 When the hammer comes down that's always very loud 36 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:16,000 because it clearly demarcates the fact that a work is sold. 37 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:19,640 [cheering and applause] 38 00:02:19,640 --> 00:02:22,440 Thank you very much indeed. And, ladies and gentlemen... 39 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:24,840 [beeping] 40 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:29,120 [woman shouts] 41 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:32,440 [audience clamouring, beeping continues] 42 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:35,440 It all happened in sort of like a split second. 43 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:38,800 The gavel came down, the alarm started beeping. 44 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:42,800 Everyone's attention and everyone turning round and all the mobile phones going up. 45 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:45,280 [auctioneer speaking indistinctly, beeping continues] 46 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:48,280 What's happening? Is that like a fire alarm? Did someone steal a painting? 47 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:51,680 Ladies and gentlemen, we have to move on here. Sorry, can I have your attention? 48 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:54,560 It stopped halfway 49 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:57,360 and two technicians were sort of ushered out to take it away, 50 00:02:57,360 --> 00:03:00,440 and usually they'd have white gloves on and they didn't, 51 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:03,480 so there was kind of an indication that this wasn't expected. 52 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:09,120 Was this a prank by Banksy? Is this a real Banksy? 53 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:11,000 Was this pure genius or...? 54 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:13,920 It wasn't that the painting fell out because the frame was broken. 55 00:03:13,920 --> 00:03:15,600 It was choreographed. 56 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,120 Knowing that Banksy's a great provocateur, 57 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:23,400 immediately the question was, "Was Banksy in the saleroom himself?" 58 00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:27,680 And it seems that he was. 59 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:30,680 But, again, unproven, so this is what keeps you guessing. 60 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:33,160 Who is he? Where is he? Is he here? Is he, you know... 61 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:37,440 - He wasn't in the room, but I... -[interviewer] How do you know? 62 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:40,320 I... Well, I don't know. 63 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:44,480 But I saw the person who activated the alarm. 64 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:50,120 He had a briefcase with some mechanical machines in there. 65 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,160 There was a man with some sort of, not disguise, 66 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:56,120 but, you know, dark glasses and a hat, or a sort of... 67 00:03:56,120 --> 00:04:01,640 He was wearing sunglasses, yes, and he was wearing a hat, I think. Um... 68 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:03,720 So it's like a comedy! 69 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:07,320 It's like a pastiche, it's like a caricature. 70 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:11,200 Was this a prank? Was this a stunt? 71 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:14,000 Or is this art? 72 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:19,840 It was a major art statement. 73 00:04:19,840 --> 00:04:23,200 Is it the price that makes art worthwhile? 74 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,240 Or is it because you look at it and think, "This is brilliant?" 75 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:31,440 And the art world is very snobby. To most people it's impenetrable 76 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:33,800 and Banksy punches through that wall. 77 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:38,360 It's like a massive "fuck you" to the art world. 78 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:39,680 It is. 79 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:41,840 Oh, no, sorry. I am allowed to say "fuck"? 80 00:04:41,840 --> 00:04:44,200 [men shouting] 81 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:47,160 [upbeat music] 82 00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:49,280 His work supported the underdog 83 00:04:49,280 --> 00:04:52,000 who was fighting against neo-liberalism and capitalism. 84 00:04:56,520 --> 00:05:00,200 He created a new way of selling, marketing, talking. 85 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:03,720 He alerted a generation to the ills of society. 86 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:14,400 [in French] Right now, Banksy is one of the ten most highly rated artists 87 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:16,040 in the contemporary art market. 88 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:19,760 [auctioneer] And selling for £8,500,000. 89 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:20,840 -Congratulations. -[gavel bangs] 90 00:05:23,280 --> 00:05:27,600 Nobody has been that famous and yet invisible. 91 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:29,960 The NYPD would like to arrest him. 92 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,320 But just take a look at how ordinary New Yorkers are responding. 93 00:05:34,840 --> 00:05:37,160 [siren wailing] 94 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:39,520 Everyone's trying to own a bit of Banksy. 95 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:44,640 [woman] Hey! Hey! 96 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:45,360 Fuck off! 97 00:05:46,280 --> 00:05:50,800 It's a sad day, people. The Banksy has been removed from the wall of the Taibach. 98 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:52,560 -[people chanting] We want Banksy! -[man] What do we want? 99 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:54,240 -Banksy back! -When do we want it? 100 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:55,360 Now! 101 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:58,120 It's just a massive old circus. 102 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:30,040 99.9% of the world's population have no idea who Banksy is at all, 103 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:31,720 what he looks he. 104 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:35,200 [suspenseful music] 105 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:41,760 People think the anonymity was like a smart marketing trick by Banksy, 106 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:43,760 a move of pure genius. 107 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:46,440 And it was but it wasn't done deliberately. 108 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:49,760 It was more self-preservation than self-promotion. 109 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,960 How urgently he was wanted by the police, I don't know, 110 00:06:56,960 --> 00:07:00,920 but he was certainly painting on walls and that's a crime. 111 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:05,480 Originally, anonymity was completely essential for him. 112 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:21,000 [in French] We all have an identity, 113 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:22,600 we're all given a name when we're born. 114 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:24,880 That's the way society has been built. 115 00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:27,680 So, refusing to reveal one's identity is in fact 116 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:30,560 refusing to play by society's rules. 117 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:41,440 [people cheering] 118 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,600 Banksy showed that if you do want to be anonymous, you can. 119 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:51,040 [hip-hop playing] 120 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:54,120 He is probably, in the Kardashian age, 121 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:56,800 the only person that doesn't want to be famous. 122 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:05,240 Banksy's is almost a kind of unofficial spokesperson for people. 123 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:08,160 I mean, we all would like our politicians to speak our language, 124 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:10,400 but they don't, on the whole. 125 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:14,960 Deep down people feel like he's an everyday person 126 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:16,920 and people can relate to that. 127 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:18,720 He's one of us, you know. 128 00:08:18,720 --> 00:08:22,040 Keep the mask as it is then that's fine. We can project. 129 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,400 [pulsating music] 130 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:36,480 [in French] Today, Banksy 131 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:39,680 has twice as many followers on Instagram as the Louvre. 132 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:47,760 Banksy doesn't speak to the 1%, like most contemporary artists, 133 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:49,760 he speaks to 100% of the population. 134 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:03,480 [in French] From the very start, Banksy has a signature style. 135 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:08,000 There's a very ironic quality to his work 136 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:10,520 which makes it immediately recognisable. 137 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:16,040 It's a sort of sarcasm, a British sense of humour. 138 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,320 It's an easy, simplistic message that you can get 139 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:29,360 when you're going past on a bus, going past on a train or waking down the street. 140 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,720 They're bold enough to be see from the moon. 141 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:44,320 Between the humour, politics and the simplicity of the message, 142 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:46,520 he managed to capture everybody, 143 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,840 from small children to grandparents. 144 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:52,760 It's like, it sucked in everybody. 145 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:02,600 [in French] "The Flower Thrower", 146 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:05,000 which he initially created in Jerusalem in 2003, 147 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:06,760 is an image everyone has appropriated 148 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:09,880 as a way of protesting against the violence of war. 149 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:12,600 Even if you're not aware of its original context, 150 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:15,720 the image still works, because it reflects 151 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:19,040 adolescent, student rebellion, and the anger young people feel. 152 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:33,600 Banksy's the voice shouting out, 153 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,360 screaming against what was happening in society. 154 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:39,600 There were more and more arrests, stop and search. 155 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,520 There were more and more security cameras. You were being monitored. 156 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:44,160 You were being monitored through your phone, 157 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:45,960 you were being monitored on the street. 158 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:50,520 It was him, a single voice, bringing all these other voices together. 159 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:00,120 [crowd clamouring] 160 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:24,880 So, welcome along, everyone, 161 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,720 to the Bristol Street Art and Graffiti Art Guided Walking Tour, 162 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:31,200 where this morning you will be discovering why Bristol 163 00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:34,160 is the street art and graffiti capital of the UK. 164 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:36,960 Possibly of Europe, too. 165 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:40,320 Plus there's insights into the life and work of Banksy. 166 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:44,440 Not "Bansky", it's Banksy, 167 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:48,880 which is based upon his original artist name, which was Robin Banks, 168 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,760 which is far too long, so he shortened his name down to Banksy 169 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:56,000 and the artist we've all heard of was born from that very moment. 170 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:07,400 [in French] We don't know if Banksy was really born in Bristol 171 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:09,440 but we know he's from Bristol in the sense that 172 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:12,480 that's where his first tags began to appear in the '90s. 173 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,920 He chose the city as the playground for his work. 174 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:29,600 [in French] Graffiti represents the vandalistic essence of things, 175 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:31,800 meaning an intervention without authorisation, 176 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:34,120 where you leave behind what's known as your tag. 177 00:12:34,120 --> 00:12:36,880 So he starts off with this vandalistic energy. 178 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:47,760 Graffiti isn't a way of communicating for the people. 179 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:50,160 Graffiti is a way of talking to your peers. 180 00:12:53,680 --> 00:12:58,840 There comes a point when he starts using the stencil technique, 181 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,320 which is a lot more mainstream, a lot more popular, 182 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:04,360 in order to communicate things to as many people as possible. 183 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:24,800 [in French] Banksy moves to the capital, to London, 184 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:27,880 where a greater number of people see his work. 185 00:13:27,880 --> 00:13:30,200 The media is also much more powerful there. 186 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:31,480 And so when he gets to London, 187 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:35,200 there's actually a much bigger impact on the whole country. 188 00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:44,920 This young guy from Bristol spread his message throughout London 189 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:47,360 and it was those very early stencils in London 190 00:13:47,360 --> 00:13:50,320 that just hadn't been seen before. 191 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:53,720 So it was like a new voice in a bigger city. 192 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:56,640 It started really in 2002. 193 00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:07,360 I was sat in my photography gallery and an art dealer who I knew came in 194 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:10,200 and he had roll, the size of this, 195 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:13,920 of Banksy prints and they were all "Rude Coppers". 196 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:16,480 He peeled one off, put it down on my desk, 197 00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:18,360 and said, "Do you want to buy these?" 198 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:21,840 It was a picture of a copper holding his finger up like this, 199 00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:24,080 called "Ruder Copper", and I didn't get it. 200 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:30,040 Within two weeks, I realised my mistake. 201 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:34,080 And that, suddenly, these works were taking off. 202 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:38,200 Kids were going in to these pop-up shows that Banksy was doing, 203 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,880 buying these prints, going straight back to their digs, 204 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:44,800 getting on their computer, getting on to eBay and flipping them for profit, 205 00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:50,160 and created this crazy market that took off at such an exponential speed 206 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:51,800 it was quite shocking to watch. 207 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:54,880 [in French] He's irreverent, 208 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:56,840 and that speaks to younger people, 209 00:14:56,840 --> 00:14:59,040 because he's one of them, he's a part of that group. 210 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,800 And I kick myself to this day that I wasn't in early enough 211 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,680 to understand it, because I'd be a lot wealthier now! 212 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:21,400 The trajectory of his career is aligned to that of the internet. 213 00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:24,480 Because, for the first time ever, suddenly there was a tool. 214 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:28,600 That these artists couldn't get representation by the galleries, 215 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,880 they were being accepted by the museums. 216 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:33,600 Suddenly, their careers flew cos they could get their work out. 217 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:36,000 What museum or gallery in the world 218 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:38,080 can bring you that kind of audience? 219 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:49,440 [reporter] Painting walls isn't enough for Banksy any more. 220 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:53,040 A graffitied elephant the star of this American show. 221 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:55,840 [in French] Very quickly, he decides that walls aren't enough for him 222 00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:58,840 and that he needs to break through the art market. 223 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:01,000 [Krishnan Guru-Murthy] A step away from street art, 224 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:03,760 this is Banksy's graffiti rendered into 3D. 225 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:07,000 Banksy says this is a different kind of family day out. 226 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:10,160 [all] Welcome to Dismaland. 227 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:11,880 End-joy. 228 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:17,240 [in French] He invents a horror version of Disneyland. 229 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:19,280 It's the absolute opposite of actual Disneyland. 230 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:24,200 In his Disneyland there are only really dark images of people dying, 231 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:26,960 of migrants drowning. 232 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:29,720 In another section, it's the media being hauled over hot coals. 233 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,280 And in another section it's all about broken dreams. 234 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:34,920 Banksy's saying, "Don't you get it? 235 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:38,680 This is what's behind Mickey Mouse, behind Sleeping Beauty's castle. 236 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:40,160 This is reality." 237 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:44,640 [in French] What makes him stand out are his scathing remarks. 238 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:54,080 He's someone who hits where it hurts, 239 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:55,760 who lights fires, 240 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:58,440 and after all, isn't that what being an artist is about? 241 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:24,200 He is the most famous artist in any point of art history. 242 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:29,120 You might have Leonardo da Vinci and a couple of others might come close. 243 00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:35,040 But in terms of the most recognisable artist today, worldwide, is Banksy. 244 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:40,000 [speaking Japanese] 245 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,480 [in French] Today we can say he's definitely an artist who's here to stay. 246 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:48,280 He is the Picasso of the 21st century. 247 00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:51,200 The Andy Warhol. That's not up for debate anymore. 248 00:17:59,360 --> 00:18:01,160 [upbeat music] 249 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,520 [reporter] UK graffiti artist Banksy has moved here for a month 250 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:11,160 and he's promised to surprise the city every day with a new piece of work. 251 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:12,640 [car horns blowing] 252 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:14,640 [siren wailing] 253 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:20,360 [reporter] His canvasses are cars and city walls. 254 00:18:20,360 --> 00:18:22,840 His fans and New York detectives alike 255 00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:25,320 combing the city in a hunt for the murals. 256 00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:30,440 He basically did a gallery exhibit on the streets of New York 257 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:32,000 and nothing was for sale. 258 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:34,640 That did get the city kind of Banksy crazy. 259 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:38,440 A Banksy would appear and everybody would turn up taking pictures in front of it. 260 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:41,320 Head down a bit, head down a bit. 261 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:47,200 Every morning, there was like a new Banksy, 262 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,280 which is pretty cool. 263 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:54,960 [in French] And actually, he plays with our adrenaline levels, 264 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:57,000 he plays with the excitement he instils in the public, 265 00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,200 who wakes up thinking, "Where has Banksy struck now? 266 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:03,560 I want to find it first. I want to be the first to report it. 267 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:04,760 I want to be the first to see it. 268 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:09,240 I'm hoping we can spot it here. 269 00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:12,320 OK, here it is. 270 00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:14,200 [man] I've been looking all around for him. 271 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:16,760 Just driving around earlier today, found this one, so awesome. 272 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:18,200 Layla! 273 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:19,320 [laughter] 274 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,080 [in French] Back then in 2013, there were a few of us who followed him. 275 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,280 But what was so incredible was that every day, 276 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:29,800 more and more people started following him on social media. 277 00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:32,920 [reporter] Banksy has taken the Big Apple by storm. 278 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:34,680 I remember, 8 or maybe 10 days later, 279 00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:36,840 it was on the news on every TV channel all over the world. 280 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:39,000 [woman reporter speaks foreign language] Banksy... 281 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,920 [in French] Huge murals created under cover of darkness... 282 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:43,160 You see crowds gathering. 283 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,720 You see people getting really excited about this treasure hunt. 284 00:19:47,360 --> 00:19:48,920 [siren wailing] 285 00:20:03,360 --> 00:20:05,600 "Where's Banksy? Where's Banksy?" 286 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:08,600 That's the only thing that New York City was talking about. 287 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:14,920 I haven't seen that kind of excitement in the city about something going on 288 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,280 and, you know, I've lived here my entire life. 289 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:25,000 My wife's cousin called me around nine, nine thirty, in the morning and said... 290 00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:29,440 you know, "You have a Banksy." 291 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:32,320 And I said, "Oh, shit! Really?" 292 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:35,480 And they said, "Yeah." I said, "That's pretty cool. Let me go and see." 293 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:37,720 So I walked over here and I looked, 294 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,120 and all of a sudden I see the Banksy. 295 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:59,640 And there's hundreds of people and I see there's news teams starting to show up. 296 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:04,960 So we took my building engineer and we got a big piece of plexiglass, 297 00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:08,480 and we came over here, and then people started yelling and screaming, 298 00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:12,280 "What are you doing? You're defacing the Banksy." 299 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,360 And I'm like, "No, no, no. I'm the general manager of Zabars. 300 00:21:15,360 --> 00:21:19,920 Zabars owns this building. We want to protect it." 301 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:23,520 -And then we got a standing ovation. -[interviewer laughs] Really? 302 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:26,400 It was like everything changed in a second. 303 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:33,320 I think it's a miracle because he never got caught 304 00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:36,480 and he's been doing it his whole career. 305 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:40,520 He's under the radar. He's like Superman. You just can't catch him. 306 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:49,000 You running up to somebody's property or public property 307 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:52,040 and defacing it is not my definition of art. 308 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:57,640 Graffiti does ruin people's property 309 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:01,760 and is a sign of decay and loss of control. 310 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,200 So the mayor may be contemptuous. 311 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:08,480 The NYPD would like to arrest him. 312 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,600 [siren wailing] 313 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:14,880 [in French] I remember the mayor calling a press conference 314 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:16,760 out of the blue and suddenly, the police were trying to find him, 315 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:21,960 because what he's doing really is insulting the establishment 316 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:26,360 by painting on public walls, private walls, each day. 317 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,560 [tannoy] The New York City Police Department would like to remind you, 318 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:37,880 if you see something suspicious in the station... 319 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,200 There was a "Catch Me If You Can" element to it. 320 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,480 And it's weird, with all this surveillance and everything else, 321 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:46,400 you never saw like surveillance footage of him actually 322 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:48,320 doing his work. 323 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:56,600 [in French] The public were searching for Banksy. 324 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:58,360 The authorities were searching for Banksy. 325 00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:00,080 The press were searching for Banksy. 326 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,400 The paparazzi were hounding him. 327 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:04,520 It was worse than the British royal family. 328 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,600 [in French] I think that he's become so well-known that 329 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,400 his anonymity is now something people want to get to the bottom of 330 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:17,800 just for the sake of revealing his identity. 331 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:22,680 I can't even imagine what it must feel like to be Banksy. 332 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:24,920 To wake up every morning knowing 333 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:28,560 that the very tenet of your existence, 334 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:32,480 the core of what you are, is at threat every day. 335 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:36,280 Every day you pick up a newspaper, every day you turn a radio or television on, 336 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,320 it could be game over. 337 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,200 [in French] Is the Banksy mystery over? 338 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,480 No one ever knew who he is. 339 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,440 A blogger claims to have found out who he is. 340 00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:50,960 [heavy beat] 341 00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:59,840 As a journalism student, I had to come up with ideas 342 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,600 and articles that would attract attention online. 343 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:08,840 Me being stupid, me being young, me being a bit of an idiot, 344 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:13,720 I was like, fuck it, why don't I go after the biggest story in the world? 345 00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:18,160 Not like who killed JFK, but something everybody can connect to. 346 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,080 Something everybody is interested in - who is Banksy? 347 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:31,320 If anyone is going to find out who Banksy is, 348 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:36,560 why can't it be some guy in his pants on a Sunday in his house, a student, 349 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:38,400 typing up like a hacker? 350 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:40,320 I felt like I was a hacker. 351 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,520 I'm kind of like the overweight guy eating McDonald's, you know? 352 00:24:48,120 --> 00:24:53,840 This all started on January 28th, 2016. 353 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:55,920 I went to see Massive Attack in Glasgow. 354 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:01,880 The show was amazing, although I was very drunk. 355 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:03,800 And I thought to myself, "Holy shit! 356 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,440 Massive Attack are from Bristol. Banksy's from Bristol." 357 00:25:09,120 --> 00:25:13,280 It was a general consensus that they operate in the same world 358 00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,040 and I was like, "OK, let me see if I can find something." 359 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,360 One of the first places I looked at was Los Angeles, 2006. 360 00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:32,600 Cos that was something that really stood out to me, when Banksy 361 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,840 went into Disneyland and he left 362 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:41,200 a kind of human crash doll dressed up as a Guantanamo Bay detainee. 363 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:43,600 [camera shutter clicks] 364 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:49,640 I was like, "OK, here I have a specific more or less date about Banksy. 365 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:55,120 So did Massive Attack play a concert there?" Bingo! 366 00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:57,280 Massive Attack played two concerts, 367 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:01,360 one in Anaheim and one in California, in Los Angeles. 368 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,000 [in French] Massive Attack were on tour in America, 369 00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,920 and were doing a gig at the Hollywood Bowl, 370 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:15,240 in September 2006. 371 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:20,000 So, yes, it does coincide exactly with Banksy's presence 372 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:21,200 in Los Angeles. 373 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,200 That for me was a good starting point. 374 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,880 And then, in 2010, Massive Attack went on concert. 375 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,880 They played in San Francisco, they played in Boston. 376 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:37,280 I looked at newspaper reports from these cities. 377 00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:42,360 I realised that Banksy had been there almost one day before or one day after. 378 00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,160 OK, man, this is definitely a connection being made here. 379 00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:52,080 It makes sense. Massive Attack comes as a one-night gig in New York 380 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,440 and, like, for the next 30 days, the city is plastered 381 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,160 with these crazy Banksy pieces. 382 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,360 These kind of like snippets of information and connections 383 00:27:05,360 --> 00:27:07,520 just keep on being fed into me. 384 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:22,880 In 2008, Banksy left 14 stencils around New Orleans. 385 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,640 But in New Orleans, Massive Attack hadn't played a show. 386 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:30,360 If Massive Attack weren't playing a concert why was Banksy there? 387 00:27:30,360 --> 00:27:31,400 Bang! 388 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,400 2008, Robert Del Naja, the singer's history, 389 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:39,560 Went to New Orleans to give the premiere of a documentary film about 390 00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:41,080 Hurricane Katrina. 391 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,040 [in French] Robert Del Naja has composed music for a documentary 392 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,480 on the mistakes made 393 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:52,600 during the crisis management of Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans. 394 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:54,160 And at the same time, 395 00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:57,480 Banksy's street art started popping up in New Orleans, 396 00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:01,560 and one of his works depicted police pillaging a shop. 397 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,120 Both artists were criticising the same thing at the same time. 398 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,080 [in French] There are very shocking similarities between the two. 399 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,760 For example, Robert Del Naja had no qualms about 400 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:20,280 showing images of migrants on huge screens during one of his concerts. 401 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:22,400 Banksy has also often shown his support for the migrant cause. 402 00:28:26,120 --> 00:28:28,840 Robert Del Naja is clearly against the political situation in Israel. 403 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:29,760 So is Banksy. 404 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:33,480 So if they're not the same person, 405 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,520 then they at least have very similar political views. 406 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:45,440 There was an anti-Iraq war when Tony Blair was in power here. 407 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:49,160 It was one of the biggest political rallies in history in the UK. 408 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:54,080 And Banksy did a whole set of placards for that called "Wrong War". 409 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:55,560 -[man] Tony! -[crowd] Blair! 410 00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:57,200 -Tony! -Out! 411 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,200 -Tony! Tony! Tony! -Out, out, out! 412 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,560 [in French] We know that Robert Del Naja protested against the war in Iraq 413 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:05,600 against Tony Blair in 2003. 414 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,760 You really feel that at different moments in history 415 00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:12,960 these two people have some very strong political views in common. 416 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:17,840 I also never realised how Robert Del Naja was part of 417 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:19,600 a graffiti movement. 418 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:25,440 He, kind of, kick started the movement not only in Bristol but even in the UK. 419 00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:27,800 He was one of the real original graffiti artists, 420 00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,200 under his old moniker of Delge or 3D. 421 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,160 Banksy said, "3D was a big influence on me." 422 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,360 Robert Del Naja said, "Oh, Banksy was a big influence on me." 423 00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,440 People always assumed that they were friends. 424 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,160 No one suggested they're just talking about themselves. 425 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:48,000 He's just talking about himself to throw people off the chase. 426 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,160 The turning point or the point where I said to myself, 427 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,440 "I've got him!" as if I had like a net. 428 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,200 I'm running behind Banksy and I'm like, "I caught him", 429 00:29:57,200 --> 00:29:58,760 was in Naples. 430 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:05,160 In August 2004, Banksy left a stencil called "Madonna con la Pistola". 431 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:12,280 Robert Del Naja - funny name, Italian name. 432 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,080 His dad is from Naples. 433 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:19,200 And he is a crazy Napoli football fan. 434 00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:21,680 And the first time that he attended the stadium 435 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:26,160 was almost the exact same time when Banksy left the stencil there. 436 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:28,240 And that's when I said to myself, 437 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,960 "You've fucking done it, son!" You know, I was like... 438 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:32,360 "It's him! 439 00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,560 It is him! 440 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:36,960 Robert Del Naja is Banksy." 441 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:44,200 [reporter] The world may have finally discovered the secret identity 442 00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,400 of he renowned guerilla street artist known as Banksy. 443 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:52,200 A British student named Craig Williams proposed the theory in a blog post 444 00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:57,040 back in January that Robert Del Naja of the electronic hip-hip trio Massive Attack 445 00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,520 is behind the international works of art. 446 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,440 [Craig] Before I even finished my journalism course, 447 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,480 I'd already done the biggest thing that I'll ever do in my life as a journalist. 448 00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:10,760 So it was pretty fucked up, but cool by another. 449 00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,160 [in French] Banksy and Robert Del Naja have the same political views 450 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,120 but if I wanted to make a joke, I could say that I share those views, 451 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:33,600 which doesn't make me Banksy. 452 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:35,320 You can look for everything they have in common, 453 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:37,880 but I don't think that's proof. 454 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:45,880 I don't think that that makes Robert and Banksy the same guy. I mean... 455 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,880 I would love for somebody to go deeper and say, 456 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,480 when was a Banksy done in a certain city 457 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,680 and Massive Attack was completely somewhere else? 458 00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:56,520 There are definitely inconsistencies when you match the dates up. 459 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,200 [in French] On 20th October 2014, a new stencil appeared in Bristol: 460 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:05,960 "The Girl with Pierced Eardrum". 461 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,600 And the night before Massive Attack had been playing in San Francisco. 462 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,160 So he couldn't actually have played the night before in San Francisco 463 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:16,600 and then add a stencil on the street of Bristol. 464 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:27,680 You would never be able now to know who Banksy is. 465 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,120 At least 50% to 60% of my time 466 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,840 -was spent trying to keep him anonymous. -[interviewer] How? 467 00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:40,280 Oh, all sorts of things. We'd do fake news stories. 468 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,000 You know, we were well ahead of Donald Trump on the fake news. 469 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,800 You know, part of it was putting out news stories. 470 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:50,120 I put... The websites and everything were in my name. 471 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:53,360 You know, lots of things we did I'm not going to tell you about. 472 00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,800 My years with Banksy were the best years of my life. 473 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,440 We lived like kings but without any rules. 474 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:11,040 I've picked out some of my favourites over the years. 475 00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,840 This is my favourite portrait that I've done. 476 00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:18,840 I think we went from there to the city farm and did something really weird. 477 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,600 So... This was great. This was in West London. 478 00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:26,160 And this is a good example of him, like, working, middle of the day. 479 00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:29,840 That's not a quick stencil. That's not a five minutes and done. 480 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:34,120 That's probably an hour of him, on the street, doing a piece 481 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,520 with no one saying shit. 482 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:49,760 There was another time when closed off a street, 483 00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:52,320 with cones with guys with hi-vis jackets, 484 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:56,760 pretending that a road was closed so he could do a big piece underneath a bridge. 485 00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:58,840 All sorts of, various techniques. 486 00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:05,480 I've never ever known him do anything at night. 487 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:07,680 It's like an invisibility cloak. 488 00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,200 You put on a boiler suit 489 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:12,160 and a hi-vis jacket, 490 00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:15,720 and you look like you're supposed to be where you are... 491 00:34:15,720 --> 00:34:18,160 most people just walk past. 492 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:26,120 [typing] 493 00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:34,280 Institutions are very careful about 494 00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:38,160 making sure no one steals their paintings. However, 495 00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:42,480 they never had any interest in people going in there to put up a painting. 496 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:44,680 So he sort of shuffled along, 497 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:48,760 dressed in a sort of beard and mac and everything, 498 00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:50,920 and put in a painting on the wall. 499 00:34:52,720 --> 00:34:56,280 [suspenseful music] 500 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:11,320 And, of course, it was Banksy who put it up 501 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:13,640 but already there was a bit of a team with him. 502 00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:17,560 I went with him so we did a dry run the day before. 503 00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:20,080 Then we went back the next day to do it for real. 504 00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:23,640 So I had a little camcorder, so I was filming us as we went up the steps. 505 00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:25,760 I go to get into the Tate, 506 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:29,160 the security guard stops me, says, "You're not allowed to film." 507 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,240 -I'm like, "Shit!" -[interviewer laughs] 508 00:35:31,240 --> 00:35:35,120 It's like, if we don't film it, then it's all for nothing. 509 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,600 I end up flicking the lens cap off the camcorder 510 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,720 and film it all with the camera down by my hip, 511 00:35:41,720 --> 00:35:46,080 just hoping that there was some footage, which there was in the end. 512 00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,800 Everything was kind of planned out with meticulous precision. 513 00:35:56,800 --> 00:35:58,920 Nothing was really left to chance. 514 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:01,200 There wasn't many things that happened that weren't, 515 00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:03,720 like, thought through and planned. 516 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,920 I mean, it's almost part of his kind of modus operandi 517 00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:23,040 to choose remote areas. 518 00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,840 They seem random but obviously they aren't. They're quite premeditated. 519 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:46,560 [in French] Banksy is a genius of situations. 520 00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:48,840 He says the right thing 521 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:50,480 in the right place 522 00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:51,600 at the right time. 523 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:00,520 This little cat appeared amongst within ruins 524 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:04,320 of the city of Gaza after a series of bombings some years ago 525 00:37:04,320 --> 00:37:07,320 and everyone was asking: "What's that kitten doing there?" 526 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:10,120 And that's when he said: 527 00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:13,560 "The thing that's most searched for and looked at globally on the internet 528 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,640 are cats and kittens. 529 00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:17,360 I've put a cat there because I want you all to take an interest 530 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:19,040 in what's happening over there. 531 00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,040 Rub your noses in it, look at what's happening over there." 532 00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:32,120 The work he's done in Palestine has drawn so much world attention 533 00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:35,240 for the young people, who would never have engaged 534 00:37:35,240 --> 00:37:37,440 with what Palestine is, what Israel is. 535 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:43,600 Are suddenly aware of this and I think his crusade to make that visible 536 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:47,800 and to highlight the injustice that's happening there, I think's admirable. 537 00:37:51,240 --> 00:37:55,080 Banksy has set up the hotel in Bethlehem. 538 00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:58,560 As a political statement, it's the big attraction 539 00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:00,600 to Western holidaymakers. 540 00:38:02,720 --> 00:38:05,280 The hotel is very special because 541 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,200 it is the hotel with the worst view in the whole world. 542 00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:16,880 So it attracts these people and whilst they're staying there they get to hear 543 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,960 about the exact political situation of the Palestinian people, 544 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:24,240 which isn't normally reflected on the television news particularly well 545 00:38:24,240 --> 00:38:27,720 or in a balanced fashion against the other side of the story. 546 00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:34,280 [in French] Most people might have a moment of genius once in their lives, 547 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:36,080 but he has them all the time. 548 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,520 He put up this installation in Venice, 549 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:42,240 showing massive cruise ships coming into port, 550 00:38:42,240 --> 00:38:46,000 even though Venice is in danger of being totally destroyed. 551 00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:49,360 He set up his installation in St Mark's Square. 552 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:54,240 One week later, two cruise ships crashed into each other. 553 00:38:54,240 --> 00:38:55,240 Everyone went crazy. 554 00:38:55,240 --> 00:38:56,960 I mean, he couldn't have guessed that would happen. 555 00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:04,720 It's insane, 556 00:39:04,720 --> 00:39:06,240 but each time, he gets it exactly right. 557 00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,080 We had this idea of raising money for 558 00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:18,600 a project to provide fresh water for one village in Chiapas. 559 00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:20,640 The Zapatistas are an armed social movement 560 00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:24,920 who rose up against the Mexican state, against 500 years of oppression. 561 00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:28,280 And I think Banksy felt an affinity for the Zapatista cause, as we all did. 562 00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,720 Banksy painted some murals in those communities. 563 00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:39,120 Did his research before he went out there. 564 00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:42,320 So he looked at artistic tradition that there is out there. 565 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,440 This was the first time he'd gone abroad and done painting abroad, 566 00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:54,120 and tried to shine a spotlight on a struggle in a different part of the world. 567 00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:58,200 Of course, after that, he went to various other places around the world. 568 00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,400 [upbeat music] 569 00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:14,760 [reporter] " Season's greetings" was the only comment from Banksy 570 00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:18,760 as he posted this video online, confirming he was behind this gift 571 00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:20,640 to the people of Port Talbot. 572 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:22,840 At first glance, the boy is playing in the snow, 573 00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:27,560 but the work expands to reveal a burning skip and the ash it emits. 574 00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,600 It's the kind of political messaging that's often in his work 575 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:34,360 and references the impact of Port Talbot's industrial skyline. 576 00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:42,200 [in French] Banksy created a piece criticising climate change 577 00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:46,000 and which criticised pollution levels coming from industries at Port Talbot, 578 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,040 which is a very polluted area. 579 00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:50,800 And everyone thought: "What is this place? 580 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:52,040 Why Port Talbot?" 581 00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,280 People started looking on a map, they started searching informations. 582 00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:56,800 And that's how Banksy uses his notoriety, 583 00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,800 and it's actually a very powerful weapon. 584 00:41:07,240 --> 00:41:10,680 I imagine that's part of the excitement from his point of view. 585 00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,560 I don't know how much exploration he does, but to find areas, 586 00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:16,840 knowing there will be publicity and excitement. 587 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:21,000 It almost forces the media then to travel to these places and explore 588 00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:25,120 little pockets of the UK, so it's quite a clever concept really, 589 00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:30,840 to actually enforce people to be part of his plan. 590 00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,320 What did you guys think when you saw it for the first time? 591 00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:36,840 Well, I thought perhaps anybody could do that. 592 00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:40,200 -[laughter] -Shows I don't know anything about art. 593 00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,640 But, yeah, the more I've looked at it... 594 00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:45,320 I've come to appreciate it now and, uh... 595 00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:46,600 [laughs] 596 00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:50,160 -Do you think Banksy's here today? -Is he?! 597 00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:52,000 No. Well, I'm asking you. Do you think he's here? 598 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,680 -Well, we don't know. Nobody knows. -[man] You could be interviewing him! 599 00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:56,840 [laughter] 600 00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,880 -There's a lot of intrigue around that. -Yeah. 601 00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:31,280 So, you know, Banksy puts them up on walls 602 00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:34,280 -in places that you think are safe. -Yeah. 603 00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:37,680 -And I come along and take them away. -[they laugh] 604 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,840 And that's what gives you great pleasure? 605 00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:42,960 It gives me... As I say, I own about 20 originals. 606 00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:46,960 And the trouble is, a lot of his artwork has got tagged or damaged 607 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:50,360 by other artists so now it's a case of moving it here into town, 608 00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:54,760 and then it will be permanently on display where people can just see it all the time. 609 00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:56,320 Bullshit! 610 00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:59,840 You know, if someone walks into a warehouse 611 00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:02,920 and find a Banksy sprayed on a gas cannister, 612 00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:07,160 fair enough, yeah, but if you're going round ripping it off a public wall 613 00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:11,760 and taking it out the side of somewhere, you're making the city a poorer place. 614 00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:18,760 It's just a very 21st-century, self-centred, narcissistic thing to do. 615 00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,280 And they should be punished. 616 00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:24,040 Corporally. Death. 617 00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:35,120 [Welsh woman] And there we are. We have Banksy going to his new home. 618 00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:39,840 But it doesn't matter because if we turn around by here, 619 00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:43,040 we have Banksy on my wall. 620 00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,160 They're now moving it and putting it inside a building. 621 00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:52,120 That's not street art, it's building art. 622 00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:54,640 It's not the same. It's got no meaning downtown. 623 00:43:55,640 --> 00:43:59,400 It was done here to cover the steelworks. It's got a meaning. 624 00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:02,040 It should be left out on the street for everybody to enjoy. 625 00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:04,360 That's what he's done it for. 626 00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,400 Banksy doesn't do it to sell them. 627 00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:10,880 You know, he proved that with his painting that he shredded. 628 00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:14,440 Um, no, all they want to do is make money from it. 629 00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:17,680 I will miss him now. 630 00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:20,800 I'll be opening my gate and what have I got? [laughs] 631 00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,000 A big hole in the wall! 632 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,320 Yes. That's not good. 633 00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:29,360 That's not good. 634 00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:36,600 Banksy is so careful about where pieces should be placed 635 00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:41,560 and he doesn't particularly mind if they stay there only for a time, 636 00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:43,880 but they shouldn't be taken out of that place 637 00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:45,840 for gosh knows how much money. 638 00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:53,360 [cheering and applause] 639 00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:57,120 [in French] I don't know what he's doing. 640 00:44:59,960 --> 00:45:02,040 Is he taking it down? 641 00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,480 [reporter in French] Artwork attributed to British artist Banksy 642 00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,080 was stolen at some point on Saturday night in Paris. 643 00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:11,720 [US reporter] Exclusive video of guys who decided to scale a building, 644 00:45:11,720 --> 00:45:14,120 cut down the latest Banksy work and... 645 00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:17,360 [in French] Right now, Banksy is one of the ten most highly rated artists 646 00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:18,960 in the contemporary art market. 647 00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,480 As soon as one of Banksy's pieces is taken down from a wall, 648 00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:23,640 someone sells it at auction. 649 00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:27,400 [in French] I think his work is more wanted than he is. 650 00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:30,840 [reporter in French] The thieves tore off the entire door. 651 00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,120 This stencil piece using white paint 652 00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:35,760 was drawn on one of the back doors of Bataclan 653 00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:38,000 in memory of the victims killed at the music venue 654 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,680 on 13th November 2015 by a group of terrorists. 655 00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:43,840 Having a Banksy that's taken off a wall and being sold, 656 00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:47,520 I just think is morally and ethically really wrong. 657 00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:56,880 For a decade, I was making money out of Banksy street works 658 00:45:56,880 --> 00:46:00,960 and I saw absolutely nothing wrong with what I was doing. 659 00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:10,000 I recall sitting in my delicatessen down in Kent, 660 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:13,400 and I got a call from a colleague saying, "Have you seen the new Banksy?" 661 00:46:13,400 --> 00:46:16,120 And I was like, "Really? Another Banksy?" 662 00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:19,360 And by this point, I was sort of, not famous for it, but I was known, 663 00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,960 notorious for the guy who goes and takes Banksy's away and upsets everyone. 664 00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,080 And I said, "Send me a picture." And he sent me a picture of this 665 00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:27,040 really ugly mural on a wall. 666 00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:30,720 But I saw its potential to make considerable money. 667 00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:37,440 "Art Buff" is an elderly lady. 668 00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:39,880 She's got one of those headsets on 669 00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:43,880 that you go to a gallery and somebody's telling what the artwork means, 670 00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:46,120 and in the front there is a plinth. 671 00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:48,560 And the plinth is empty. 672 00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:55,480 My intention was to make as much money as I possibly could. 673 00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:59,400 I had good contacts at the Miami Art Fair. I'd been there a number of times. 674 00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:01,880 I had the credentials necessary, 675 00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:05,800 and I agreed that we would attempt to remove the piece 676 00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:09,640 with a team of guys who can pretty much move anything on the planet. 677 00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,440 [seagulls crying] 678 00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:25,160 I should have perhaps realised what they were going to do because 679 00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:29,880 they come in and start covering the area with scaffold 680 00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:32,160 and chopping the Banksy out of the wall. 681 00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:37,320 [drilling] 682 00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:41,040 We started about eight o'clock in the morning. 683 00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:44,480 As the noise echoed across Folkestone, 684 00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:46,880 suddenly more and more people started appearing. 685 00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:50,080 And it was clear that they were carrying protest placards. 686 00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:54,040 They were vehemently against what was going on. 687 00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:57,200 It felt like we were being robbed of Folkestone's Banksy. 688 00:47:57,200 --> 00:47:59,280 You know, we believed it belonged to our town. 689 00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:01,800 You know, we wanted to benefit from it 690 00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:03,640 and to see it every day. 691 00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:09,800 We could be quite smug. "We've got a Banksy. Have you got a Banksy?" 692 00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:11,400 It was a bit like that. 693 00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:18,720 I mean, these were relatively middle-class, working-class, 694 00:48:18,720 --> 00:48:23,680 small-town folk who suddenly turned into these sort of harridans and monsters 695 00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:26,080 screaming abuse at us and my construction guys. 696 00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:28,880 I mean, it wasn't just verbal abuse, it was physical abuse. 697 00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:32,720 It was just, "No, why are you taking it? How can it be taken away?" 698 00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:36,960 And I think the fact that everyone felt it was being taken away for money 699 00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,440 was even more frustrating. 700 00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:44,080 Everybody ran up there. They're trying to stop it happening. 701 00:48:44,080 --> 00:48:47,800 And then Robin Barton, "Bankrobber" as he's know, a gallerist, 702 00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:50,200 he is there, walking around, winding everybody up 703 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:52,400 and telling them that he had total rights to take it. 704 00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,040 Cos the more upset you are, the more noise there is. 705 00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:57,760 The more noise there is, the more media there is. 706 00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:59,760 The more media there is, the more value there is. 707 00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:09,320 It was a long, long day. I mean, it was 14 hours of drilling and cutting. 708 00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:14,520 And we finally pulled the last piece of the wall out around about sunset. 709 00:49:14,520 --> 00:49:17,640 And off it flew out to Miami. 710 00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:19,880 [jet roars] 711 00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:22,600 By putting it in Miami, 712 00:49:22,600 --> 00:49:25,160 the contrast would be so great from where it originally came from. 713 00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:29,120 A broken down, Third World town of Folkestone 714 00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:31,640 and then you've got the glitz and glamour of Miami. 715 00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:35,120 And having all the Americans staring at it was quite appealing to me. 716 00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:40,560 As you came into Art Miami, there it was, boomph, right in the middle, 717 00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:43,680 with a price tag of half a million dollars on it. 718 00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:50,000 There's of course a certain irony about selling an artwork 719 00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:53,920 for a huge amount of money to a collector about the vacuousness 720 00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:58,640 of the collecting of artwork and how value is put on art and so on. 721 00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:03,160 But it was painted to go on that wall. It was painted to be in an urban setting. 722 00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:07,320 And we'd actively got involved in trying to bring it back. 723 00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:17,000 Because it's an illegal act and put out there in the street, 724 00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:19,200 covertly without permissions, 725 00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:21,960 there is no copyright issue whatsoever. 726 00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:26,200 The person who owns that wall, that door, that window, that floor 727 00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:29,520 is the owner of that artwork and it gives me the right, 728 00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:33,160 on behalf of those freeholders, to sell the works. 729 00:50:33,160 --> 00:50:36,840 -[interviewer] So it's legal? -It's completely legal as long as, 730 00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:40,240 and this is the critical mass, as long as the freeholder 731 00:50:40,240 --> 00:50:43,120 can prove without question they are the freeholder. 732 00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:45,760 But that doesn't tell you who emotional owns it. 733 00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:48,640 It's emotionally owned by the people of the town going, 734 00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:51,000 "This is Folkestone's Banksy. 735 00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:54,000 I'm from Folkestone. It's my Banksy." 736 00:51:05,080 --> 00:51:09,320 Whilst I was sunning myself in Miami and drinking I know not what, 737 00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:12,400 I got a lawyer's letter saying we have discovered 738 00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:15,640 there is a greater freeholder and that the Godden family 739 00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:18,360 were indeed not the freeholders of the building. 740 00:51:18,360 --> 00:51:21,560 At this point, it was game over. 741 00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:29,280 I was forced to dip my hands in my pocket 742 00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,800 and pay for it to be returned to Folkestone. 743 00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,240 It's good that we've got one, it's good that we've kept it. 744 00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:40,840 No one can touch it now. It's our Banksy. 745 00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:42,720 Owned by Folkestone. 746 00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,080 Hands off. 747 00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:07,520 So you can see that the whole piece looks amazing, 748 00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:10,840 but if you get slightly closer up, you can see there's this chop here, 749 00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:14,840 that the paint is cracked and it's where the saw came 750 00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:17,000 and just cut this out of the wall. 751 00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:18,920 And that's, um, you know... 752 00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:22,040 The thing about Banksy is the story is as much of the artwork. 753 00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:24,640 It's never just the painting. It's what happens afterwards. 754 00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:28,000 How people talk about it. People demonstrating on the streets. 755 00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,600 People saying, "That's ours and you can't take it!" 756 00:52:30,600 --> 00:52:34,240 So I don't mind these cuts, cos I think people will be able to 757 00:52:34,240 --> 00:52:38,360 understand the story better with these little marks that are going through it. 758 00:52:42,520 --> 00:52:44,960 Don't mess with Folkestone, that's the moral of the story, 759 00:52:44,960 --> 00:52:47,440 cos we love art in this community. 760 00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:50,600 I don't feel guilty about anything I did in Folkestone. 761 00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:56,320 And whereas Banksy clearly set his stall up as being Robin Hood of the art world, 762 00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,360 I suddenly realised, there I was, the Sheriff of Nottingham. 763 00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,680 I was the bad guy, he was the good guy. 764 00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:05,080 Now, I watch movies. Who do I want to be? The bad guy. 765 00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:09,840 Banksy, I suppose, is up here just looking down at this little 766 00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:14,000 thing he made. It's just a massive old circus. 767 00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:24,280 -What do we want? -Banksy back! 768 00:53:24,280 --> 00:53:26,160 -When do we want it? -Now! 769 00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:27,560 Save our Banksy! 770 00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:35,520 Society has embraced him to such a point 771 00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:39,520 where he has become part of the establishment. 772 00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:42,120 Possibly something he'd kick against if he could, 773 00:53:42,120 --> 00:53:46,440 but I'm not sure that creating a prank at Sotheby's with "Girl with Balloon" 774 00:53:46,440 --> 00:53:52,720 is a good way of distancing yourself from all the things that he dislikes. 775 00:53:52,720 --> 00:53:55,200 [Australian reporter] A stunt like no other. 776 00:53:55,200 --> 00:54:00,200 The iconic image known as "Girl with the Balloon" self-destructs. 777 00:54:00,200 --> 00:54:03,880 A Banksy painting sells at auction for $1.4 million. 778 00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:07,400 I'm frustrated that it didn't shred completely because I think 779 00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:11,760 a wholly shredded picture with just bits and pieces 780 00:54:11,760 --> 00:54:15,400 lying on the floor is not worth much money. 781 00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:18,880 I mean, if the buyer got these bits and pieces, what she supposed to do? 782 00:54:18,880 --> 00:54:20,960 Stick them together? 783 00:54:23,360 --> 00:54:26,520 It wasn't a destructive process. It was a change. 784 00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:29,760 And, of course, in the end, he gave the painting a new name, 785 00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:31,720 a new date and now it's a different work. 786 00:54:31,720 --> 00:54:35,960 So, you criticise the market but you give it what it wants at the same time. 787 00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:38,560 So, yes, I think I found that was a bit... 788 00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:40,120 a bit lame really. 789 00:54:41,240 --> 00:54:42,920 [in French] Since Sotheby's, 790 00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:46,160 there's been a change in the public's perception of him. 791 00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:49,800 Because, yes, he's great, yes, he's got things to say, 792 00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:51,520 but his criticism of the market, 793 00:54:51,520 --> 00:54:55,280 which is what makes him popular and gives his artwork value, 794 00:54:56,200 --> 00:54:58,200 is beginning to make people wonder. 795 00:54:58,200 --> 00:55:00,200 They are starting to doubt his sincerity. 796 00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:06,800 After the event, we had probably around fifty to sixty 797 00:55:06,800 --> 00:55:10,160 enquiries on Banksy "Girl with Balloon" print. 798 00:55:10,160 --> 00:55:14,600 So, yes, the demand went sky high, 799 00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:17,760 um, especially with "Girl with Balloon", um... 800 00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:20,520 [interviewer] Does he make money from that? 801 00:55:20,520 --> 00:55:22,960 Indirectly, I'm sure he does. 802 00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:25,440 -How? -Um... 803 00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:27,840 -I can't say. -You can't? 804 00:55:27,840 --> 00:55:30,440 No, because I'm very good friends with my collectors 805 00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:33,080 -and they can't see me saying that, sorry. -OK. 806 00:55:33,080 --> 00:55:35,440 He's become a capitalist, like... 807 00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:38,080 like his good friend Robin Barton. 808 00:55:42,760 --> 00:55:46,320 There was so much money being made by Banksy and by his entourage, 809 00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:48,760 and by his colleagues, friends, 810 00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:51,240 that it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. 811 00:55:51,240 --> 00:55:55,680 That you become the very person that you didn't like when you started out. 812 00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:58,880 You become the person sitting in an ivory tower. 813 00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:00,880 Can you have a relevant voice 814 00:56:00,880 --> 00:56:05,080 when you're so removed from the very thing you started talking about? 815 00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:13,400 He still has an agent. He has a manager. 816 00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:18,040 There's definitely a lot of people working really hard to protect him. 817 00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:22,720 Banksy is not the guy with the spray can any more. 818 00:56:22,720 --> 00:56:24,680 He's a lot bigger than that. 819 00:56:30,800 --> 00:56:35,680 Banksy is so famous now and he keeps putting himself in situations 820 00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:40,880 and doing really big things that we deserve to know who he is. 821 00:56:42,840 --> 00:56:47,640 And I think the journalist who one day will reveal him will be... 822 00:56:47,640 --> 00:56:50,760 will go down in the history books for being the guy or the girl who 823 00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:53,080 revealed who Banksy was. 824 00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:03,400 My source, um, 825 00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:05,760 decided that he wants to stay anonymous. 826 00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:10,280 He's a forensic expert. 827 00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:12,040 Due diligence. 828 00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:15,040 Looks through companies and the owners of companies 829 00:57:15,040 --> 00:57:16,960 to see the trails there. 830 00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:26,080 [disguised male voice] I'd like to remain anonymous 831 00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:30,800 because I just don't want any kind of exposure. 832 00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:34,400 It's just an itch I needed to scratch and I was just intrigued by the whole thing. 833 00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:38,200 I don't need any kind of hate mail for exposing Banksy, 834 00:57:38,200 --> 00:57:41,600 cos there would probably be a bunch of people who were very angry 835 00:57:41,600 --> 00:57:44,760 if it turned out I was right. 836 00:57:57,640 --> 00:58:01,840 Banksy has just released a documentary, 837 00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:03,920 "Exit Through The Gift Shop". 838 00:58:03,920 --> 00:58:07,400 And it got a bit of noise at that time 839 00:58:07,400 --> 00:58:09,680 and then it got nominated for an Academy Award, 840 00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:14,080 and he was still trying to claim that he was 841 00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:16,400 some sort of anonymity, 842 00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:20,160 which is impossible if you're making any film like that. 843 00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:22,840 As soon as business is involved, 844 00:58:22,840 --> 00:58:25,520 and you want to make some money out of that, 845 00:58:25,520 --> 00:58:29,360 you have to register companies and the money has to go somewhere. 846 00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:31,440 And then there is a paper trail. 847 00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:35,480 So I looked up what the production company was. 848 00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:38,520 It was a company called Paranoid Pictures. 849 00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:41,560 [gunfire] 850 00:58:41,560 --> 00:58:45,000 And if you look through this company document 851 00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:46,880 and the annual return, 852 00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:49,360 you'll find that it's actually owned by another company 853 00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:52,280 called Pest Control Office Ltd. 854 00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:57,880 This is a company that is solely there to verify Banksy 855 00:58:57,880 --> 00:58:59,920 works of art to make sure that they're not fakes 856 00:58:59,920 --> 00:59:03,200 and they've really actually been made by Banksy himself. 857 00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:07,680 So this company is the owner of Paranoid Pictures. 858 00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:11,000 But if you look through the annual return here... 859 00:59:11,000 --> 00:59:15,760 this in itself is owned by a company called Picturesonwalls Ltd. 860 00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:21,120 So if you go to Picturesonwalls Ltd and looking through this annual return... 861 00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:23,360 at the time of my investigation, 862 00:59:23,360 --> 00:59:27,760 you can see that the sole owner is Jamie Hewlett. 863 00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:34,520 Jamie Hewlett, the founder of Gorillaz. 864 00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:39,320 It makes sense. 865 00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:42,160 Gorillaz, Banksy. He's in their music video. 866 00:59:42,160 --> 00:59:44,560 He is... Yeah. 867 00:59:44,560 --> 00:59:46,680 I... I just thought, "This is him." 868 00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:48,160 [camera shutter clicks] 869 00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:51,520 [camera shutter clicks] 870 00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:53,640 Gorillaz is a fake band. 871 00:59:53,640 --> 00:59:58,160 They're not actually humans. They're meant to be these characters, 872 00:59:58,160 --> 01:00:01,440 which is very close to what Banksy's doing as well. 873 01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:08,400 [camera shutter clicks] 874 01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:11,280 The other guy in Gorillaz, Damon Albarn, 875 01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:13,440 has another band called Blur 876 01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:16,920 and Banksy made the front cover for their album. 877 01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:19,360 [disguised male voice] This Blur album cover 878 01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:21,440 is designed by Banksy himself. 879 01:00:21,440 --> 01:00:25,880 If you look at this still here from one of the Gorillaz's music videos, 880 01:00:25,880 --> 01:00:29,520 that is a Banksy in the actual music video itself. 881 01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:30,920 [camera shutter clicks] 882 01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:38,840 And it was surprising to see that everything just kind of added up. 883 01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:41,920 [disguised voice] Another thing... I may be clutching at straws here, 884 01:00:41,920 --> 01:00:46,200 but a few years ago when Banksy opened up his hotel, 885 01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:52,560 some tourist hosted video footage of who he or she believed 886 01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:55,320 may have been Banksy spotted. 887 01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:59,560 This person had been uncovered doing these graffiti stencils 888 01:00:59,560 --> 01:01:01,560 around the corner from the hotel. 889 01:01:01,560 --> 01:01:06,480 He actually looks like Jamie Hewlett from certain kind of facial similarities. 890 01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:11,480 Wow! I'm gonna reveal who Banksy is. 891 01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:14,920 It was too good, the information was too good not to publish. 892 01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:25,320 [disguise male voice] Since I made a bit of a noise, 893 01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:29,200 the very next annual return, in 2017. 894 01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:30,840 If you look here, 895 01:01:30,840 --> 01:01:33,960 Jamie Hewlett has transferred all his shares 896 01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:36,440 to someone called Marcus Samuel Chambers. 897 01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:40,920 So if I was suspicious, which of course I am, 898 01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:44,000 there has been a reaction to my action. 899 01:01:48,680 --> 01:01:53,920 It's a very kind of fun idea, like using A.I. to see where people are 900 01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:57,960 based in the world at any one point but this is a pretty black and white theory 901 01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,120 which you can't deny. 902 01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:03,800 [siren wailing] 903 01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:16,680 Joanna Brooks emailed me... She's Banksy's publicist. 904 01:02:16,680 --> 01:02:19,320 ...saying Jamie Hewlett is not Banksy. 905 01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:25,560 But she made a mistake and she spelt Hewlett with an "i" not an "e". 906 01:02:28,120 --> 01:02:30,720 Which is wrong. 907 01:02:30,720 --> 01:02:33,640 So I thought, "Is this a sneaky way of not lying?" 908 01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:37,720 So if we do reveal him now and we said, "But you lied!" 909 01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:40,240 She will say, "No, cos I didn't spell it the right way." 910 01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:46,560 If it's not Jamie Hewlett, I don't think I believe the other theories more. 911 01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:05,800 I went through every single story that had been written on Banksy to get clues. 912 01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:08,880 Where he had been, who his friends were. 913 01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:18,200 There was one picture that supposedly was Banksy in Jamaica 914 01:03:18,200 --> 01:03:20,200 and it had been published in the Evening Standard, 915 01:03:20,200 --> 01:03:22,720 and then it sort of mysteriously disappeared 916 01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:25,600 and nobody knew who owed the copyright any more. 917 01:03:25,600 --> 01:03:27,720 It was part of the mystery around Banksy. 918 01:03:37,480 --> 01:03:40,840 Finally, I found someone who knew who he was. 919 01:03:40,840 --> 01:03:44,120 Someone that had interviewed Banksy, 920 01:03:44,120 --> 01:03:46,960 that knew Banksy, that knew who Banksy was 921 01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:49,760 and told me that he was called Robin Gunningham. 922 01:03:54,840 --> 01:03:59,320 First of all, I found out everything about Robin Gunningham I could. 923 01:03:59,320 --> 01:04:02,320 His birth certificate, his parents' names. 924 01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:06,560 I did his full family tree with his sisters and cousins and relatives. 925 01:04:07,560 --> 01:04:09,840 And then I looked on the Electoral Roll. 926 01:04:09,840 --> 01:04:14,600 And all the places he'd lived seemed to be places where Banksy had lived. 927 01:04:19,760 --> 01:04:23,840 So I was fairly confident when I went down to Bristol 928 01:04:23,840 --> 01:04:28,000 with a team of people that I worked very well with to prove it. 929 01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:32,360 I wanted to do it quickly because I didn't want another journalist to get the story. 930 01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:39,360 We spoke to someone called Luke Egan, 931 01:04:39,360 --> 01:04:42,440 who denied knowing Robin Gunningham, but he'd lived with him. 932 01:04:45,680 --> 01:04:51,200 We spoke to a woman who had moved into a flat after Robin Gunningham had left, 933 01:04:51,200 --> 01:04:54,880 and she had discovered some old discarded Banksy drawings. 934 01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:04,000 I think the final piece in the jigsaw 935 01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:07,280 was the fact that one of the neighbours of where Robin grew up 936 01:05:07,280 --> 01:05:12,440 identified that initial photograph from Jamaica as Robin Gunningham. 937 01:05:13,920 --> 01:05:16,720 And I interviewed someone who went to school with him 938 01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:18,960 and he had a photograph of him at school 939 01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:23,160 and it looked similar to the picture that was taken in Jamaica. 940 01:05:27,560 --> 01:05:31,000 And when I spoke to Mr Gunningham, 941 01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:35,720 he was laughing and smiling and saying, "I can't comment." 942 01:05:35,720 --> 01:05:40,600 And I said, "Well, look, if your son is a teacher in Birmingham, 943 01:05:40,600 --> 01:05:44,760 you must tell me because I'm going to put in the paper on Sunday that he's Banksy." 944 01:05:44,760 --> 01:05:47,680 And he just said, "I can't possibly say anything." 945 01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:50,880 Nobody, apart from Banksy's father, 946 01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:53,800 would have played games with me the way he did. 947 01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:56,120 If you are familiar with the artist known as Banksy, 948 01:05:56,120 --> 01:05:58,240 he's never publicly shown his face. 949 01:05:58,240 --> 01:06:01,480 Now though, Banksy may have actually been unmasked. 950 01:06:01,480 --> 01:06:03,240 [in French] Who is Banksy? 951 01:06:03,240 --> 01:06:07,360 Banksy's name could be Robin Gunningham, a native of Bristol. 952 01:06:07,360 --> 01:06:10,520 [reporter] The article claims Robin Gunningham, who's now 35, 953 01:06:10,520 --> 01:06:12,240 was great at art at school. 954 01:06:12,240 --> 01:06:14,920 Banksy had a background that was posh and privileged 955 01:06:14,920 --> 01:06:16,680 if this article is to be believed. 956 01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:19,840 He went to school here, the Bristol Cathedral School. 957 01:06:19,840 --> 01:06:22,320 It's hardly the background of someone who's made his name 958 01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:24,920 from being "hip" and "street". 959 01:06:42,560 --> 01:06:46,480 Geographic profiling is a criminal investigative methodology. 960 01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:48,960 It was designed to help prioritise suspects 961 01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:52,920 and manage information in a large-scale serial crime case. 962 01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:58,800 So if we have a serial murder, there's a pattern to where they hunt 963 01:06:58,800 --> 01:07:01,960 and the locations where the offender is most likely based. 964 01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:05,880 I was a member of the Vancouver Police Department 965 01:07:05,880 --> 01:07:08,440 and because I had a background in mathematics, 966 01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:12,200 I wondered about what you might be able to extract, in terms of information, 967 01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:15,040 from a pattern of crime locations. 968 01:07:21,160 --> 01:07:25,240 What I'm showing right now is the top five per cent of the area 969 01:07:25,240 --> 01:07:28,920 for the art that Banksy did while he was in New York City. 970 01:07:28,920 --> 01:07:33,400 I was able to find information on 31 of his graffiti artworks. 971 01:07:33,400 --> 01:07:36,760 So I put it into the Rigel System, which I have open here. 972 01:07:38,200 --> 01:07:41,960 And you can see here Manhattan. 973 01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:46,880 And the dark orange shows the most probable area for Banksy's base. 974 01:07:46,880 --> 01:07:50,040 This could be where he was staying in a hotel, 975 01:07:50,040 --> 01:07:54,400 or if he was crashing at a friend's apartment or condo, 976 01:07:54,400 --> 01:07:57,840 between Union Square Park, Washington Square Park 977 01:07:57,840 --> 01:08:02,040 and it's roughly northern Greenwich Village. 978 01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:06,920 Well, it doesn't tell us anything about Gunningham or about other suspects, 979 01:08:06,920 --> 01:08:10,680 but it would be, um, if he were still in New York, 980 01:08:10,680 --> 01:08:14,600 where you would probably want to focus your search efforts for him. 981 01:08:14,600 --> 01:08:18,040 Now, if no one tried to find out who Banksy was, 982 01:08:18,040 --> 01:08:20,160 well, it would all be rather boring, wouldn't it? 983 01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:26,720 This map here shows you, through the red dots, 984 01:08:26,720 --> 01:08:30,080 locations associated with Banksy's artwork. 985 01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,840 Blue dots, locations associated with Robin Gunningham, 986 01:08:33,840 --> 01:08:36,400 such as, where did he live? Where did he go to school? 987 01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:40,000 Where did he work? Anything that you could associate with him. 988 01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:42,720 If we had multiple Banksy suspects, 989 01:08:42,720 --> 01:08:45,440 we could see which ones came out best but we don't. 990 01:08:45,440 --> 01:08:49,080 So the idea is that you look at this and you see, well, that compared quite well. 991 01:08:54,960 --> 01:08:58,320 So that elevated the probability 992 01:08:58,320 --> 01:09:02,520 of him being the correct suspect to a certain degree. 993 01:09:02,520 --> 01:09:04,680 We're not proving anything here. 994 01:09:04,680 --> 01:09:08,560 All we're doing is saying, here's some evidence that either supports 995 01:09:08,560 --> 01:09:12,040 the Gunningham theory or doesn't support it. 996 01:09:12,040 --> 01:09:14,680 In the end, it supported it quite well. 997 01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:19,000 Yeah, this is a science used to find criminals, 998 01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:22,160 instead used to catch an artist, 999 01:09:22,160 --> 01:09:25,240 the person behind this - Banksy. 1000 01:09:25,240 --> 01:09:29,760 And scientists say they're 90% sure they have their man. 1001 01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:31,880 The spatial evidence of the artworks 1002 01:09:31,880 --> 01:09:35,080 supports the theory that he is the suspect, that he is Banksy. 1003 01:09:35,080 --> 01:09:38,120 Mystery solved? Don't bank on it. 1004 01:09:38,120 --> 01:09:40,760 Robin Gunningham, this "public schoolboy". 1005 01:09:40,760 --> 01:09:43,360 I don't think that this person ever existed. 1006 01:09:43,360 --> 01:09:47,520 I have a feeling that's another one of our fake news things maybe. 1007 01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:50,440 Maybe it's not. 1008 01:09:50,440 --> 01:09:51,960 [interviewer laughs] 1009 01:09:51,960 --> 01:09:55,040 [in French] There is regular speculation about his identity, 1010 01:09:55,040 --> 01:09:57,200 probably in order to blur the lines. 1011 01:09:57,200 --> 01:09:59,640 I think he's probably got something to do with that. 1012 01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:14,320 Everyone likes to have another theory about Banksy. 1013 01:10:14,320 --> 01:10:16,360 There's nothing saying... 1014 01:10:16,360 --> 01:10:19,000 we can guarantee this is a man. 1015 01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:23,360 The weird thing is, like, the Banksy pieces, anybody could do it. 1016 01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:26,240 If Banksy gave me the stencil and I bought some spray paint, 1017 01:10:26,240 --> 01:10:28,640 I could go out and do it. 1018 01:10:29,560 --> 01:10:32,200 Banksy might have operatives all over the world. 1019 01:10:32,200 --> 01:10:34,840 Maybe he's got like sleeper cells in every city. 1020 01:10:36,520 --> 01:10:38,840 [in French] He's almost definitely hiding somewhere amongst it all. 1021 01:10:38,840 --> 01:10:40,280 Maybe there isn't even one Banksy. 1022 01:10:40,280 --> 01:10:42,720 Maybe the mastermind is actually 1023 01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:44,360 a whole group of, I don't know, 10, 15 or 20 people. 1024 01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:47,160 Yeah, there's a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes 1025 01:10:47,160 --> 01:10:49,640 regarding Banksy. 1026 01:10:49,640 --> 01:10:53,240 Who is he? Actually, I don't really care. Not that bothered. 1027 01:10:53,240 --> 01:10:55,280 So, I'm not giving the game away. 1028 01:10:55,280 --> 01:10:59,200 It would be like telling a small child that Santa Claus didn't exist. 1029 01:10:59,200 --> 01:11:01,760 And plus, I think, the general public made him. 1030 01:11:01,760 --> 01:11:04,360 Like, they made this folk hero. 1031 01:11:04,360 --> 01:11:09,440 Yeah? And the last thing they want is for someone to blow that myth. 1032 01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:19,200 It has been a very curious experience 1033 01:11:19,200 --> 01:11:21,600 because there seems to be 1034 01:11:21,600 --> 01:11:24,760 a sort of conspiracy to suggest that I'm wrong. 1035 01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:30,200 People are like, "You're a fucking idiot. You've ruined Banksy for me, 1036 01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:32,400 because now I know what he looks like." 1037 01:11:32,400 --> 01:11:35,000 My retort is to them is, like, 1038 01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:37,640 "Do you know fucking Picasso?" "Yes." 1039 01:11:37,640 --> 01:11:40,280 "Do you like Picasso?" "Yes." 1040 01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:43,080 "Do you know what fucking Picasso looks like?" 1041 01:11:43,080 --> 01:11:44,160 "Yes." 1042 01:11:44,160 --> 01:11:45,960 "What fucking difference does it make?" 1043 01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:49,080 I think the fact people are upset about it 1044 01:11:49,080 --> 01:11:51,480 is because there's like a strong political message. 1045 01:11:51,480 --> 01:11:53,680 They don't want to see the face that tells them it. 1046 01:11:53,680 --> 01:11:57,840 They want just to be told it by someone they don't know. 1047 01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:05,120 Everybody wins with him not being known. 1048 01:12:06,120 --> 01:12:09,640 Would Banksy have the same impact if we knew his name? 1049 01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:11,720 Well, probably not. 1050 01:12:11,720 --> 01:12:13,240 It's just like Jack the Ripper. 1051 01:12:13,240 --> 01:12:17,200 Jack the Ripper's one of the most infamous serial killers in history. 1052 01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:19,240 Maybe people call him the first serial killer, 1053 01:12:19,240 --> 01:12:21,960 but that's not true, not by a long shot. 1054 01:12:21,960 --> 01:12:23,920 But he is perhaps the most famous, 1055 01:12:23,920 --> 01:12:27,720 and one of the reasons he's the most famous is he was never caught. 1056 01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:38,160 I suppose at those kind of low times people reach for the fictional world 1057 01:12:38,160 --> 01:12:39,800 and the fantasy, 1058 01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:42,800 and they like to feel that there's some kind of 1059 01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:47,160 rescue just around the corner and there's hope somehow. 1060 01:12:47,160 --> 01:12:51,560 Even now that he has a huge possibility of generating money, 1061 01:12:51,560 --> 01:12:54,760 he's stayed very true to the roots 1062 01:12:54,760 --> 01:12:58,000 that he would have grown up around in Bristol. 1063 01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:01,200 Which is a large community of people who are... 1064 01:13:01,200 --> 01:13:04,880 helping each other in a social and cultural way, 1065 01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:08,440 and the fact that he is now finding ways to 1066 01:13:08,440 --> 01:13:12,160 benefit hundreds of people from this incredible achievement that's he's made, 1067 01:13:12,160 --> 01:13:14,080 I think is just a fantastic story. 1068 01:13:14,080 --> 01:13:18,120 The renowned and illusive artist Banksy is weighing in 1069 01:13:18,120 --> 01:13:20,920 to help a cash-struck boys' club in Bristol. 1070 01:13:20,920 --> 01:13:25,320 This youth club was another way where he said, "Right, I'm going to help them." 1071 01:13:30,120 --> 01:13:32,400 It was Sunday, April the 13th. 1072 01:13:32,400 --> 01:13:34,680 It was around one o'clock in the afternoon 1073 01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:37,680 and I parked just outside the boys' club gates. 1074 01:13:37,680 --> 01:13:42,920 And I noticed immediately in a doorway this rather amazing stencil. 1075 01:13:51,920 --> 01:13:55,160 As I was sat there waiting, I couldn't really take my eyes off it 1076 01:13:55,160 --> 01:13:58,960 and I said to my wife, I'm like, "That looks like a Banksy." 1077 01:14:09,720 --> 01:14:12,080 My son came past. 1078 01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:14,000 He rang me. He said, "Dad, you're not going to believe this. 1079 01:14:14,000 --> 01:14:16,400 I think we've got a Banksy outside the club." 1080 01:14:16,400 --> 01:14:18,880 I said, "Oh, don't be so stupid. Don't be so foolish." 1081 01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:22,920 I wasn't 100% sure. I said, "If it's what I think it is, 1082 01:14:22,920 --> 01:14:26,120 then you need to get that protected." You know? 1083 01:14:26,120 --> 01:14:28,800 And when I got there, I thought, 1084 01:14:28,800 --> 01:14:32,920 "Oh, it looks good. It might be a Banksy, but, I mean, I don't much about Banksy's." 1085 01:14:32,920 --> 01:14:35,240 All I could see was this young couple. 1086 01:14:35,240 --> 01:14:37,360 They both have their mobile phones. They were both, in effect, 1087 01:14:37,360 --> 01:14:39,720 supposed to be looking into each other's loving eyes. 1088 01:14:39,720 --> 01:14:42,000 And, in fact, they weren't, they were looked at each other's phones. 1089 01:14:48,400 --> 01:14:52,520 It really was quite a poignant statement about young people today, 1090 01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:56,920 that the mobile phone can be a little bit more important than the human being. 1091 01:14:59,600 --> 01:15:03,520 Somebody would've had to done it, so I thought I'd go and check my CCTV. 1092 01:15:09,240 --> 01:15:13,200 A white van pulled up and parked just by 1093 01:15:13,200 --> 01:15:16,720 what would be the place where the "Mobile Lovers" was put. 1094 01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:22,080 Two men got out the van. I couldn't see their faces. 1095 01:15:22,080 --> 01:15:24,080 They had hi-vis jackets on and they had helmets on. 1096 01:15:24,080 --> 01:15:26,560 They just looked like any work team. 1097 01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:30,720 A gentleman took a picture, drove off. 1098 01:15:30,720 --> 01:15:33,080 And then at 12 o'clock on the 15th, 1099 01:15:33,080 --> 01:15:36,400 is when it became known to the public and the world, basically, 1100 01:15:36,400 --> 01:15:38,120 that there was a new Banksy for people to see. 1101 01:15:38,120 --> 01:15:41,080 And that's when my story began. 1102 01:15:41,080 --> 01:15:43,600 [reporter] In April, a picture appeared here overnight, 1103 01:15:43,600 --> 01:15:46,800 created by the secretive street artist Banksy. 1104 01:15:46,800 --> 01:15:51,360 With a steady stream of visitors coming to see the latest Banksy creation... 1105 01:15:54,280 --> 01:15:58,360 There had been a period of time where no new Banksy artworks had appeared 1106 01:15:58,360 --> 01:16:00,640 in Bristol for a while, 1107 01:16:00,640 --> 01:16:03,280 and so I was very keen to see the new artwork. 1108 01:16:03,280 --> 01:16:05,880 I actually thought a murder had been committed outside, 1109 01:16:05,880 --> 01:16:08,640 because I'd never seen so many people with cameras 1110 01:16:08,640 --> 01:16:11,080 taking pictures of "Mobile Lovers". 1111 01:16:11,080 --> 01:16:15,240 And I'm looking at it and I'm thinking, "Whoa! This really is a Banksy." 1112 01:16:15,240 --> 01:16:17,400 And we've left it there for two or three days. 1113 01:16:17,400 --> 01:16:18,920 I mean, are we mad? 1114 01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:24,120 James, back the other way! 1115 01:16:24,120 --> 01:16:27,760 Don't forget your arms. Keep 'em moving! Come on, you can! 1116 01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:29,840 Well done! Keep going! 1117 01:16:29,840 --> 01:16:32,520 As soon as he realised it was a Banksy, 1118 01:16:32,520 --> 01:16:35,440 he knew that he was sat on something that could save the club. 1119 01:16:35,440 --> 01:16:38,000 So, you're gonna take it out nice and slowly. 1120 01:16:38,000 --> 01:16:41,520 The problem with the clubs were that government at the time 1121 01:16:41,520 --> 01:16:45,800 and local council were cutting funding to youth projects. 1122 01:16:45,800 --> 01:16:49,880 Boxing really is a fantastic sport. 1123 01:16:49,880 --> 01:16:54,840 It's something that is always done in a boxing club, OK? 1124 01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:58,160 We use sport as a platform to engage young people. 1125 01:16:58,160 --> 01:17:00,560 To give them something to hang their coat on. 1126 01:17:00,560 --> 01:17:05,040 This is their place to just grow, nurture and develop at their pace, 1127 01:17:05,040 --> 01:17:09,000 doing what they would like to do where they know they'll be looked after. 1128 01:17:14,040 --> 01:17:15,680 So I thought, "Do you know what? 1129 01:17:15,680 --> 01:17:18,480 We need to take 'Mobile Lovers' off the wall and we're going to sell it, 1130 01:17:18,480 --> 01:17:20,520 so that we can save the club." 1131 01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:21,840 [siren wailing] 1132 01:17:24,600 --> 01:17:29,760 And then we had all of the negative press and people writing on the Facebook page, 1133 01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:32,440 "What kind of example are you setting for others?" 1134 01:17:32,440 --> 01:17:33,880 "You should be ashamed." 1135 01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:38,160 People have taken to Twitter as soon as they heard this news today. 1136 01:17:38,160 --> 01:17:40,960 Some people are calling Dennis Stinchcombe a vulture. 1137 01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:43,400 I guess, street art, they do it on the streets 1138 01:17:43,400 --> 01:17:46,440 so that people will have more access to it, so it's like a bit of a shame. 1139 01:17:46,440 --> 01:17:50,760 It's gone already before anyone's got a chance to look at it, so it's wrong. 1140 01:17:55,160 --> 01:17:56,480 Go left! 1141 01:17:58,200 --> 01:18:00,320 I started getting death threats. 1142 01:18:00,320 --> 01:18:02,720 What gave me that right? And it went on and on and on. 1143 01:18:02,720 --> 01:18:06,600 And this is against a man that's all he's ever done for 30 years is give 1144 01:18:06,600 --> 01:18:10,720 to the people of Bristol and you've got people saying he should be killed. 1145 01:18:10,720 --> 01:18:12,960 And that was the hard thing, for me. 1146 01:18:15,000 --> 01:18:17,800 And finally, the most important thing that happened, 1147 01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:19,520 with all the months of arguments 1148 01:18:19,520 --> 01:18:21,840 and discussions and dialogues and everything else, 1149 01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:25,000 was the day that this letter came through the door. 1150 01:18:25,000 --> 01:18:27,400 I got a phone call from Dad and he's like, 1151 01:18:27,400 --> 01:18:30,960 "Sean, you're never going to believe it. I've only got a letter from Banksy." 1152 01:18:30,960 --> 01:18:32,960 It was like, wow! This is it or it's not it. 1153 01:18:32,960 --> 01:18:34,960 It could be ours, it might not. 1154 01:18:34,960 --> 01:18:37,400 And it's almost like I wanted to read it but I didn't want to read it. 1155 01:18:37,400 --> 01:18:40,520 But there it is now in front of me and it's like, "Oh, my God!" 1156 01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:43,680 "Private and confidential. 1157 01:18:43,680 --> 01:18:47,120 Dear Dennis, I hope this finds you well. 1158 01:18:47,120 --> 01:18:51,240 As you know, I recently painted on a doorway near the club. 1159 01:18:51,240 --> 01:18:54,160 This was meant to be a small visual gift for the area. 1160 01:18:54,160 --> 01:18:58,160 But, apparently, a financial one would have been much more useful. 1161 01:18:59,280 --> 01:19:02,080 I don't normally admit to committing criminal damage, 1162 01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:06,560 but seeing as it looks like charges won't be brought any time soon, 1163 01:19:06,560 --> 01:19:10,080 you have my blessing to do what you feel is right with this piece. 1164 01:19:11,400 --> 01:19:13,880 I'm a great admirer of the work done at the club 1165 01:19:13,880 --> 01:19:16,920 and will be chuffed if this can help in some way. 1166 01:19:16,920 --> 01:19:21,520 Your tenacity in the past few weeks has made for an entertaining spectator sport. 1167 01:19:21,520 --> 01:19:25,440 I assume you're familiar with the quote attributed to Abraham Lincoln. 1168 01:19:25,440 --> 01:19:27,600 'Things may come to those who wait 1169 01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:30,360 but only the things left behind by those who hustle.' 1170 01:19:31,480 --> 01:19:35,920 Best wishes, Banksy." And, of course, he signed it at the bottom. 1171 01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:40,280 This letter was incredibly important and on that day I read it... 1172 01:19:40,280 --> 01:19:42,320 Wow! It was like... 1173 01:19:57,920 --> 01:20:00,400 I was so happy for him. 1174 01:20:00,400 --> 01:20:03,200 Because no one deserves to be ridiculed on social media 1175 01:20:03,200 --> 01:20:07,320 because of a picture, because he's seen an opportunity to save 1176 01:20:07,320 --> 01:20:12,560 a club that he loves with every part of his body. 1177 01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:14,720 He'll never be away from that place. 1178 01:20:14,720 --> 01:20:17,240 That's where his soul's going to be. That's where his heart is now 1179 01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:18,880 and that's where his heart and soul's gonna die. 1180 01:20:25,600 --> 01:20:28,760 [reporter] This piece of graffiti sprayed on a boarded-up doorway 1181 01:20:28,760 --> 01:20:32,880 is now officially worth £403,000. 1182 01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:36,760 The money itself won't just benefit one club here in Bristol. 1183 01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:39,080 It will benefit up to six, seven or eight of them. 1184 01:20:39,080 --> 01:20:42,480 It will go far and wide and it will touch an awful lot of people. 1185 01:20:42,480 --> 01:20:46,360 It is a very good news story in this city. 1186 01:20:48,280 --> 01:20:54,320 This was the most direct way that he had used the value of his art 1187 01:20:54,320 --> 01:20:56,160 for a social purpose. 1188 01:20:56,160 --> 01:21:00,200 I think we'd lose some of the magic if somebody 1189 01:21:00,200 --> 01:21:02,440 reveals who he is. 1190 01:21:21,600 --> 01:21:25,440 [electronic music] 1191 01:21:28,920 --> 01:21:32,520 I know exactly who he is cos he was a member of my club when he was a lad. 1192 01:21:32,520 --> 01:21:34,600 -And I'm not telling you that. -Why? 1193 01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:35,640 I can't. 1194 01:21:42,600 --> 01:21:45,200 Everybody I meet goes, "I know somebody who knows Banksy." 1195 01:21:45,200 --> 01:21:47,680 Then there's a few people who go, "I know Banksy." 1196 01:21:47,680 --> 01:21:50,480 But they can't tell you. Really, I mean, you know, so... 1197 01:22:11,840 --> 01:22:13,320 I mean, Donald Trump would love it. 1198 01:22:13,320 --> 01:22:16,000 Right, he's always on about leakers. Banksy has no leakers. 1199 01:22:16,000 --> 01:22:19,520 How does it do that? The White House is loaded with leakers! 1200 01:22:19,520 --> 01:22:20,920 Banksy, no leakers! 1201 01:22:28,920 --> 01:22:32,760 Even if he wanted to come out and become Banksy, 1202 01:22:32,760 --> 01:22:34,320 no one's going to believe it. 101456

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