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[classical music]
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[indistinct chatter]
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It was Frieze Week in London,
which is, I suppose, the week in
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the London calendar when everyone
in the art world is in town.
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And the contemporary evening
auctions are the biggest in London,
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and this was Sotheby's.
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It was a huge sale. 60-odd lots.
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And this Banksy was positioned
right at the end,
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the last lot of the evening.
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[upbeat music]
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I was bidding for the Banksy,
the "Girl with Balloon",
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and it was the one that, you know,
everyone connects Banksy to.
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The year before, so I think in 2017,
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it was rated as the UK's
most favourite art piece.
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[upbeat music]
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For me, from a collector's point of
view and a dealer's point of view,
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uh, it's the holy grail.
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Banksy, "Girl with Balloon",
ladies and gentlemen.
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I'm going to start bidding
at 100, 150, 200 thousand.
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300 thousand. 350. 400 thousand.
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450 thousand. 500 thousand.
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The estimate being quite low,
that encouraged the bidding.
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And there was a lot of energy.
It was a big sale.
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Does anybody...? 700 thousand.
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We went up to £650,000. Stopped
there.
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Towards the end, I think there was
maybe about two or three bidders
left.
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800 thousand. Thank you.
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No pressure. Last chance.
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At £850,000.
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860!
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[crowd muttering]
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Last... Yeah, are we bidding?
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And selling for 860 thousand!
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-Thank you very much.
-[cheering and applause]
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When the hammer comes down
that's always very loud
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because it clearly demarcates
the fact that a work is sold.
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[cheering and applause]
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Thank you very much indeed.
And, ladies and gentlemen...
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[beeping]
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[woman shouts]
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[audience clamouring, beeping
continues]
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It all happened in sort of like
a split second.
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The gavel came down,
the alarm started beeping.
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Everyone's attention and everyone
turning round and all the mobile
phones going up.
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[auctioneer speaking indistinctly,
beeping continues]
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What's happening? Is that like a
fire alarm? Did someone steal a
painting?
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Ladies and gentlemen, we have to
move on here. Sorry, can I have your
attention?
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It stopped halfway
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and two technicians were sort of
ushered out to take it away,
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and usually they'd have
white gloves on and they didn't,
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so there was kind of an indication
that this wasn't expected.
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Was this a prank by Banksy?
Is this a real Banksy?
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Was this pure genius or...?
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It wasn't that the painting fell out
because the frame was broken.
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It was choreographed.
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Knowing that Banksy's a great
provocateur,
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immediately the question was,
"Was Banksy in the saleroom
himself?"
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And it seems that he was.
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But, again, unproven,
so this is what keeps you guessing.
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Who is he? Where is he?
Is he here? Is he, you know...
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- He wasn't in the room, but I...
-[interviewer] How do you know?
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I... Well, I don't know.
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But I saw the person
who activated the alarm.
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He had a briefcase with some
mechanical machines in there.
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There was a man with some
sort of, not disguise,
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but, you know, dark glasses and a
hat, or a sort of...
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He was wearing sunglasses, yes,
and he was wearing a hat, I think.
Um...
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So it's like a comedy!
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It's like a pastiche,
it's like a caricature.
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Was this a prank? Was this a stunt?
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Or is this art?
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It was a major art statement.
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Is it the price that makes
art worthwhile?
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Or is it because you look at it
and think, "This is brilliant?"
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And the art world is very snobby.
To most people it's impenetrable
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and Banksy punches through that
wall.
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It's like a massive "fuck you"
to the art world.
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It is.
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Oh, no, sorry. I am allowed to say
"fuck"?
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[men shouting]
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[upbeat music]
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His work supported the underdog
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who was fighting against
neo-liberalism and capitalism.
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He created a new way
of selling, marketing, talking.
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He alerted a generation
to the ills of society.
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[in French] Right now, Banksy is one
of the ten most highly rated artists
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in the contemporary art market.
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[auctioneer]
And selling for £8,500,000.
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-Congratulations.
-[gavel bangs]
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Nobody has been that famous
and yet invisible.
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The NYPD would like to arrest him.
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But just take a look at how ordinary
New Yorkers are responding.
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[siren wailing]
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Everyone's trying to own a bit of
Banksy.
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[woman] Hey! Hey!
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Fuck off!
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It's a sad day, people. The Banksy
has been removed from the wall of
the Taibach.
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-[people chanting] We want Banksy!
-[man] What do we want?
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-Banksy back!
-When do we want it?
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Now!
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It's just a massive old circus.
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99.9% of the world's population
have no idea who Banksy is at all,
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what he looks he.
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[suspenseful music]
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People think the anonymity was like
a smart marketing trick by Banksy,
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a move of pure genius.
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And it was but it wasn't
done deliberately.
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It was more self-preservation
than self-promotion.
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How urgently he was wanted
by the police, I don't know,
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but he was certainly painting on
walls and that's a crime.
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Originally, anonymity was
completely essential for him.
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[in French]
We all have an identity,
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we're all given a name
when we're born.
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That's the way society has been
built.
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So, refusing to reveal
one's identity is in fact
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refusing to play by society's rules.
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[people cheering]
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Banksy showed that if you do
want to be anonymous, you can.
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[hip-hop playing]
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He is probably, in the Kardashian
age,
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the only person that
doesn't want to be famous.
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Banksy's is almost a kind of
unofficial spokesperson for people.
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I mean, we all would like our
politicians to speak our language,
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but they don't, on the whole.
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Deep down people feel like
he's an everyday person
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and people can relate to that.
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He's one of us, you know.
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Keep the mask as it is then that's
fine. We can project.
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[pulsating music]
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[in French] Today, Banksy
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has twice as many followers
on Instagram as the Louvre.
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Banksy doesn't speak to the 1%,
like most contemporary artists,
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he speaks to 100% of the population.
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[in French] From the very start,
Banksy has a signature style.
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There's a very ironic
quality to his work
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which makes it
immediately recognisable.
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It's a sort of sarcasm,
a British sense of humour.
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It's an easy, simplistic message
that you can get
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when you're going past on a bus,
going past on a train or waking down
the street.
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They're bold enough to be see
from the moon.
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Between the humour, politics
and the simplicity of the message,
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he managed to capture everybody,
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from small children to grandparents.
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It's like, it sucked in everybody.
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[in French]
"The Flower Thrower",
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which he initially created
in Jerusalem in 2003,
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is an image everyone has
appropriated
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as a way of protesting
against the violence of war.
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Even if you're not aware
of its original context,
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the image still works,
because it reflects
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adolescent, student rebellion,
and the anger young people feel.
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Banksy's the voice shouting out,
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screaming against what
was happening in society.
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There were more and more arrests,
stop and search.
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There were more and more security
cameras. You were being monitored.
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You were being monitored
through your phone,
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you were being monitored on the
street.
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It was him, a single voice, bringing
all these other voices together.
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[crowd clamouring]
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So, welcome along, everyone,
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to the Bristol Street Art and
Graffiti Art Guided Walking Tour,
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where this morning you will be
discovering why Bristol
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is the street art and graffiti
capital of the UK.
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Possibly of Europe, too.
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Plus there's insights into
the life and work of Banksy.
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Not "Bansky", it's Banksy,
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which is based upon his original
artist name, which was Robin Banks,
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which is far too long, so he
shortened his name down to Banksy
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and the artist we've all heard of
was born from that very moment.
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[in French] We don't know if Banksy
was really born in Bristol
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but we know he's from Bristol
in the sense that
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that's where his first tags began
to appear in the '90s.
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He chose the city as
the playground for his work.
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[in French] Graffiti represents
the vandalistic essence of things,
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meaning an intervention
without authorisation,
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where you leave behind
what's known as your tag.
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So he starts off
with this vandalistic energy.
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Graffiti isn't a way of
communicating for the people.
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Graffiti is a way
of talking to your peers.
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There comes a point when
he starts using the stencil
technique,
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which is a lot more mainstream,
a lot more popular,
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in order to communicate things to
as many people as possible.
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[in French] Banksy moves to
the capital, to London,
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where a greater number of
people see his work.
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The media is also
much more powerful there.
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And so when he gets to London,
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there's actually a much
bigger impact on the whole country.
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This young guy from Bristol spread
his message throughout London
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and it was those very
early stencils in London
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that just hadn't been seen before.
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So it was like a new voice
in a bigger city.
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It started really in 2002.
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I was sat in my photography gallery
and an art dealer who I knew came in
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and he had roll, the size of this,
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of Banksy prints and they
were all "Rude Coppers".
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He peeled one off,
put it down on my desk,
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and said, "Do you want to buy
these?"
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It was a picture of a copper
holding his finger up like this,
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called "Ruder Copper",
and I didn't get it.
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Within two weeks,
I realised my mistake.
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And that, suddenly,
these works were taking off.
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Kids were going in to these pop-up
shows that Banksy was doing,
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buying these prints,
going straight back to their digs,
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getting on their computer, getting
on to eBay and flipping them for
profit,
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and created this crazy market that
took off at such an exponential
speed
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it was quite shocking to watch.
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[in French] He's irreverent,
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00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:56,840
and that speaks to younger people,
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because he's one of them,
he's a part of that group.
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00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,800
And I kick myself to this day
that I wasn't in early enough
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to understand it, because
I'd be a lot wealthier now!
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The trajectory of his career
is aligned to that of the internet.
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Because, for the first time ever,
suddenly there was a tool.
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00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:28,600
That these artists couldn't get
representation by the galleries,
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00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,880
they were being accepted
by the museums.
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Suddenly, their careers flew
cos they could get their work out.
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What museum or gallery in the world
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can bring you that kind of audience?
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[reporter] Painting walls isn't
enough for Banksy any more.
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A graffitied elephant the star
of this American show.
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[in French] Very quickly, he decides
that walls aren't enough for him
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and that he needs
to break through the art market.
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[Krishnan Guru-Murthy]
A step away from street art,
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this is Banksy's graffiti
rendered into 3D.
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00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:07,000
Banksy says this is a different kind
of family day out.
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[all] Welcome to Dismaland.
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End-joy.
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[in French] He invents
a horror version of Disneyland.
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00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:19,280
It's the absolute opposite
of actual Disneyland.
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In his Disneyland there are only
really dark images of people dying,
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00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:26,960
of migrants drowning.
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00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:29,720
In another section, it's the media
being hauled over hot coals.
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00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,280
And in another section
it's all about broken dreams.
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00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:34,920
Banksy's saying, "Don't you get it?
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This is what's behind Mickey Mouse,
behind Sleeping Beauty's castle.
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This is reality."
237
00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:44,640
[in French] What makes him stand out
are his scathing remarks.
238
00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:54,080
He's someone who hits where it
hurts,
239
00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:55,760
who lights fires,
240
00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:58,440
and after all, isn't that
what being an artist is about?
241
00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:24,200
He is the most famous artist
in any point of art history.
242
00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:29,120
You might have Leonardo da Vinci
and a couple of others might come
close.
243
00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:35,040
But in terms of the most
recognisable artist today,
worldwide, is Banksy.
244
00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:40,000
[speaking Japanese]
245
00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,480
[in French] Today we can say he's
definitely an artist who's here to
stay.
246
00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:48,280
He is the Picasso of the 21st
century.
247
00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:51,200
The Andy Warhol.
That's not up for debate anymore.
248
00:17:59,360 --> 00:18:01,160
[upbeat music]
249
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,520
[reporter] UK graffiti artist Banksy
has moved here for a month
250
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:11,160
and he's promised to surprise the
city every day with a new piece of
work.
251
00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:12,640
[car horns blowing]
252
00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:14,640
[siren wailing]
253
00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:20,360
[reporter] His canvasses are cars
and city walls.
254
00:18:20,360 --> 00:18:22,840
His fans and New York detectives
alike
255
00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:25,320
combing the city
in a hunt for the murals.
256
00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:30,440
He basically did a gallery exhibit
on the streets of New York
257
00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:32,000
and nothing was for sale.
258
00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:34,640
That did get the city
kind of Banksy crazy.
259
00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:38,440
A Banksy would appear and everybody
would turn up taking pictures in
front of it.
260
00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:41,320
Head down a bit, head down a bit.
261
00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:47,200
Every morning,
there was like a new Banksy,
262
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,280
which is pretty cool.
263
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:54,960
[in French] And actually, he plays
with our adrenaline levels,
264
00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:57,000
he plays with the excitement
he instils in the public,
265
00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,200
who wakes up thinking,
"Where has Banksy struck now?
266
00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:03,560
I want to find it first.
I want to be the first to report it.
267
00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:04,760
I want to be the first to see it.
268
00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:09,240
I'm hoping we can spot it here.
269
00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:12,320
OK, here it is.
270
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:14,200
[man] I've been looking
all around for him.
271
00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:16,760
Just driving around earlier today,
found this one, so awesome.
272
00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:18,200
Layla!
273
00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:19,320
[laughter]
274
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,080
[in French] Back then in 2013,
there were a few of us who followed
him.
275
00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,280
But what was so incredible
was that every day,
276
00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:29,800
more and more people
started following him on social
media.
277
00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:32,920
[reporter] Banksy has taken
the Big Apple by storm.
278
00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:34,680
I remember, 8 or maybe 10 days
later,
279
00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:36,840
it was on the news on every
TV channel all over the world.
280
00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:39,000
[woman reporter speaks foreign
language] Banksy...
281
00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,920
[in French] Huge murals created
under cover of darkness...
282
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:43,160
You see crowds gathering.
283
00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,720
You see people getting really
excited about this treasure hunt.
284
00:19:47,360 --> 00:19:48,920
[siren wailing]
285
00:20:03,360 --> 00:20:05,600
"Where's Banksy? Where's Banksy?"
286
00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:08,600
That's the only thing that
New York City was talking about.
287
00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:14,920
I haven't seen that kind of
excitement in the city about
something going on
288
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,280
and, you know,
I've lived here my entire life.
289
00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:25,000
My wife's cousin called me around
nine, nine thirty, in the morning
and said...
290
00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:29,440
you know, "You have a Banksy."
291
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:32,320
And I said, "Oh, shit! Really?"
292
00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:35,480
And they said, "Yeah." I said,
"That's pretty cool. Let me go and
see."
293
00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:37,720
So I walked over here and I looked,
294
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,120
and all of a sudden I see the
Banksy.
295
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:59,640
And there's hundreds of people and I
see there's news teams starting to
show up.
296
00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:04,960
So we took my building engineer
and we got a big piece of
plexiglass,
297
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:08,480
and we came over here, and then
people started yelling and
screaming,
298
00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:12,280
"What are you doing?
You're defacing the Banksy."
299
00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,360
And I'm like, "No, no, no.
I'm the general manager of Zabars.
300
00:21:15,360 --> 00:21:19,920
Zabars owns this building.
We want to protect it."
301
00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:23,520
-And then we got a standing ovation.
-[interviewer laughs] Really?
302
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:26,400
It was like everything
changed in a second.
303
00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:33,320
I think it's a miracle
because he never got caught
304
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:36,480
and he's been doing it his whole
career.
305
00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:40,520
He's under the radar. He's like
Superman. You just can't catch him.
306
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:49,000
You running up to somebody's
property or public property
307
00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:52,040
and defacing it
is not my definition of art.
308
00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:57,640
Graffiti does ruin people's property
309
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:01,760
and is a sign of decay
and loss of control.
310
00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,200
So the mayor may be contemptuous.
311
00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:08,480
The NYPD would like to arrest him.
312
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,600
[siren wailing]
313
00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:14,880
[in French] I remember the mayor
calling a press conference
314
00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:16,760
out of the blue and suddenly,
the police were trying to find him,
315
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:21,960
because what he's doing
really is insulting the
establishment
316
00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:26,360
by painting on public walls,
private walls, each day.
317
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,560
[tannoy] The New York City Police
Department would like to remind you,
318
00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:37,880
if you see something suspicious
in the station...
319
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,200
There was a "Catch Me If You Can"
element to it.
320
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,480
And it's weird, with all this
surveillance and everything else,
321
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:46,400
you never saw like surveillance
footage of him actually
322
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:48,320
doing his work.
323
00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:56,600
[in French]
The public were searching for
Banksy.
324
00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:58,360
The authorities were
searching for Banksy.
325
00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:00,080
The press were searching for Banksy.
326
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,400
The paparazzi were hounding him.
327
00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:04,520
It was worse than
the British royal family.
328
00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,600
[in French] I think that he's
become so well-known that
329
00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,400
his anonymity is now something
people want to get to the bottom of
330
00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:17,800
just for the sake of
revealing his identity.
331
00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:22,680
I can't even imagine what
it must feel like to be Banksy.
332
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:24,920
To wake up every morning knowing
333
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:28,560
that the very tenet of your
existence,
334
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:32,480
the core of what you are,
is at threat every day.
335
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:36,280
Every day you pick up a newspaper,
every day you turn a radio or
television on,
336
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,320
it could be game over.
337
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,200
[in French] Is the Banksy mystery
over?
338
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,480
No one ever knew who he is.
339
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,440
A blogger claims to have
found out who he is.
340
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:50,960
[heavy beat]
341
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:59,840
As a journalism student,
I had to come up with ideas
342
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,600
and articles that would
attract attention online.
343
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:08,840
Me being stupid, me being young,
me being a bit of an idiot,
344
00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:13,720
I was like, fuck it, why don't I go
after the biggest story in the
world?
345
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:18,160
Not like who killed JFK,
but something everybody can connect
to.
346
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,080
Something everybody is interested in
- who is Banksy?
347
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:31,320
If anyone is going to find out
who Banksy is,
348
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:36,560
why can't it be some guy in his
pants on a Sunday in his house, a
student,
349
00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:38,400
typing up like a hacker?
350
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:40,320
I felt like I was a hacker.
351
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,520
I'm kind of like the overweight guy
eating McDonald's, you know?
352
00:24:48,120 --> 00:24:53,840
This all started on January 28th,
2016.
353
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:55,920
I went to see Massive Attack in
Glasgow.
354
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:01,880
The show was amazing,
although I was very drunk.
355
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:03,800
And I thought to myself, "Holy shit!
356
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,440
Massive Attack are from Bristol.
Banksy's from Bristol."
357
00:25:09,120 --> 00:25:13,280
It was a general consensus that
they operate in the same world
358
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,040
and I was like, "OK, let me see
if I can find something."
359
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,360
One of the first places I looked at
was Los Angeles, 2006.
360
00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:32,600
Cos that was something that really
stood out to me, when Banksy
361
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,840
went into Disneyland and he left
362
00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:41,200
a kind of human crash doll dressed
up as a Guantanamo Bay detainee.
363
00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:43,600
[camera shutter clicks]
364
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:49,640
I was like, "OK, here I have a
specific more or less date about
Banksy.
365
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:55,120
So did Massive Attack play
a concert there?" Bingo!
366
00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:57,280
Massive Attack played two concerts,
367
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:01,360
one in Anaheim and one in
California, in Los Angeles.
368
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,000
[in French] Massive Attack
were on tour in America,
369
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,920
and were doing a gig
at the Hollywood Bowl,
370
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:15,240
in September 2006.
371
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:20,000
So, yes, it does coincide exactly
with Banksy's presence
372
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:21,200
in Los Angeles.
373
00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,200
That for me was a good starting
point.
374
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,880
And then, in 2010, Massive Attack
went on concert.
375
00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,880
They played in San Francisco,
they played in Boston.
376
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:37,280
I looked at newspaper reports
from these cities.
377
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:42,360
I realised that Banksy had been
there almost one day before or one
day after.
378
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,160
OK, man, this is definitely
a connection being made here.
379
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:52,080
It makes sense. Massive Attack comes
as a one-night gig in New York
380
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,440
and, like, for the next 30 days,
the city is plastered
381
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,160
with these crazy Banksy pieces.
382
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,360
These kind of like snippets
of information and connections
383
00:27:05,360 --> 00:27:07,520
just keep on being fed into me.
384
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:22,880
In 2008, Banksy left 14 stencils
around New Orleans.
385
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,640
But in New Orleans, Massive Attack
hadn't played a show.
386
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:30,360
If Massive Attack weren't playing
a concert why was Banksy there?
387
00:27:30,360 --> 00:27:31,400
Bang!
388
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,400
2008, Robert Del Naja,
the singer's history,
389
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:39,560
Went to New Orleans to give the
premiere of a documentary film about
390
00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:41,080
Hurricane Katrina.
391
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,040
[in French] Robert Del Naja has
composed music for a documentary
392
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,480
on the mistakes made
393
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:52,600
during the crisis management of
Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.
394
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:54,160
And at the same time,
395
00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:57,480
Banksy's street art started
popping up in New Orleans,
396
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:01,560
and one of his works
depicted police pillaging a shop.
397
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,120
Both artists were criticising
the same thing at the same time.
398
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,080
[in French] There are very shocking
similarities between the two.
399
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,760
For example, Robert Del Naja
had no qualms about
400
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:20,280
showing images of migrants on huge
screens during one of his concerts.
401
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:22,400
Banksy has also often shown
his support for the migrant cause.
402
00:28:26,120 --> 00:28:28,840
Robert Del Naja is clearly against
the political situation in Israel.
403
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:29,760
So is Banksy.
404
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:33,480
So if they're not the same person,
405
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,520
then they at least have
very similar political views.
406
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:45,440
There was an anti-Iraq war
when Tony Blair was in power here.
407
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:49,160
It was one of the biggest political
rallies in history in the UK.
408
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:54,080
And Banksy did a whole set of
placards for that called "Wrong
War".
409
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:55,560
-[man] Tony!
-[crowd] Blair!
410
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:57,200
-Tony!
-Out!
411
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,200
-Tony! Tony! Tony!
-Out, out, out!
412
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,560
[in French] We know that Robert Del
Naja protested against the war in
Iraq
413
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:05,600
against Tony Blair in 2003.
414
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,760
You really feel that
at different moments in history
415
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:12,960
these two people have some
very strong political views in
common.
416
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:17,840
I also never realised how
Robert Del Naja was part of
417
00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:19,600
a graffiti movement.
418
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:25,440
He, kind of, kick started the
movement not only in Bristol but
even in the UK.
419
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:27,800
He was one of the real
original graffiti artists,
420
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,200
under his old moniker of Delge or
3D.
421
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,160
Banksy said,
"3D was a big influence on me."
422
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,360
Robert Del Naja said, "Oh,
Banksy was a big influence on me."
423
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,440
People always assumed
that they were friends.
424
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,160
No one suggested they're just
talking about themselves.
425
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:48,000
He's just talking about himself
to throw people off the chase.
426
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,160
The turning point or the point
where I said to myself,
427
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,440
"I've got him!" as if I had like a
net.
428
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,200
I'm running behind Banksy
and I'm like, "I caught him",
429
00:29:57,200 --> 00:29:58,760
was in Naples.
430
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:05,160
In August 2004, Banksy left a
stencil called "Madonna con la
Pistola".
431
00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:12,280
Robert Del Naja -
funny name, Italian name.
432
00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,080
His dad is from Naples.
433
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:19,200
And he is a crazy Napoli football
fan.
434
00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:21,680
And the first time that
he attended the stadium
435
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:26,160
was almost the exact same time
when Banksy left the stencil there.
436
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:28,240
And that's when I said to myself,
437
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,960
"You've fucking done it, son!"
You know, I was like...
438
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:32,360
"It's him!
439
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,560
It is him!
440
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:36,960
Robert Del Naja is Banksy."
441
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:44,200
[reporter] The world may have
finally discovered the secret
identity
442
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,400
of he renowned guerilla street
artist known as Banksy.
443
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:52,200
A British student named Craig
Williams proposed the theory in a
blog post
444
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:57,040
back in January that Robert Del Naja
of the electronic hip-hip trio
Massive Attack
445
00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,520
is behind the international works of
art.
446
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,440
[Craig] Before I even finished
my journalism course,
447
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,480
I'd already done the biggest thing
that I'll ever do in my life as a
journalist.
448
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:10,760
So it was pretty fucked up,
but cool by another.
449
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,160
[in French] Banksy and Robert Del
Naja have the same political views
450
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,120
but if I wanted to make a joke,
I could say that I share those
views,
451
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:33,600
which doesn't make me Banksy.
452
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:35,320
You can look for everything
they have in common,
453
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:37,880
but I don't think that's proof.
454
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:45,880
I don't think that that makes Robert
and Banksy the same guy. I mean...
455
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,880
I would love for somebody
to go deeper and say,
456
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,480
when was a Banksy done in a certain
city
457
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,680
and Massive Attack was
completely somewhere else?
458
00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:56,520
There are definitely inconsistencies
when you match the dates up.
459
00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,200
[in French] On 20th October 2014,
a new stencil appeared in Bristol:
460
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:05,960
"The Girl with Pierced Eardrum".
461
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,600
And the night before Massive Attack
had been playing in San Francisco.
462
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,160
So he couldn't actually have played
the night before in San Francisco
463
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:16,600
and then add a stencil
on the street of Bristol.
464
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:27,680
You would never be able now
to know who Banksy is.
465
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,120
At least 50% to 60% of my time
466
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,840
-was spent trying to keep him
anonymous. -[interviewer] How?
467
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:40,280
Oh, all sorts of things.
We'd do fake news stories.
468
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,000
You know, we were well ahead
of Donald Trump on the fake news.
469
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,800
You know, part of it was
putting out news stories.
470
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:50,120
I put... The websites and everything
were in my name.
471
00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:53,360
You know, lots of things we did
I'm not going to tell you about.
472
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,800
My years with Banksy
were the best years of my life.
473
00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,440
We lived like kings
but without any rules.
474
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:11,040
I've picked out some of my
favourites over the years.
475
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,840
This is my favourite portrait
that I've done.
476
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:18,840
I think we went from there to the
city farm and did something really
weird.
477
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,600
So... This was great.
This was in West London.
478
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:26,160
And this is a good example of him,
like, working, middle of the day.
479
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:29,840
That's not a quick stencil.
That's not a five minutes and done.
480
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:34,120
That's probably an hour of him,
on the street, doing a piece
481
00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,520
with no one saying shit.
482
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:49,760
There was another time
when closed off a street,
483
00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:52,320
with cones with guys with hi-vis
jackets,
484
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:56,760
pretending that a road was closed so
he could do a big piece underneath a
bridge.
485
00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:58,840
All sorts of, various techniques.
486
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:05,480
I've never ever known him
do anything at night.
487
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:07,680
It's like an invisibility cloak.
488
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,200
You put on a boiler suit
489
00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:12,160
and a hi-vis jacket,
490
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:15,720
and you look like you're
supposed to be where you are...
491
00:34:15,720 --> 00:34:18,160
most people just walk past.
492
00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:26,120
[typing]
493
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:34,280
Institutions are very careful about
494
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:38,160
making sure no one steals
their paintings. However,
495
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:42,480
they never had any interest in
people going in there to put up a
painting.
496
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:44,680
So he sort of shuffled along,
497
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:48,760
dressed in a sort of beard and mac
and everything,
498
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:50,920
and put in a painting on the wall.
499
00:34:52,720 --> 00:34:56,280
[suspenseful music]
500
00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:11,320
And, of course,
it was Banksy who put it up
501
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:13,640
but already there was
a bit of a team with him.
502
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:17,560
I went with him so we did
a dry run the day before.
503
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:20,080
Then we went back the next day
to do it for real.
504
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:23,640
So I had a little camcorder, so I
was filming us as we went up the
steps.
505
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:25,760
I go to get into the Tate,
506
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:29,160
the security guard stops me,
says, "You're not allowed to film."
507
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,240
-I'm like, "Shit!"
-[interviewer laughs]
508
00:35:31,240 --> 00:35:35,120
It's like, if we don't film it,
then it's all for nothing.
509
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,600
I end up flicking the lens cap
off the camcorder
510
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,720
and film it all with the camera
down by my hip,
511
00:35:41,720 --> 00:35:46,080
just hoping that there was some
footage, which there was in the end.
512
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,800
Everything was kind of planned out
with meticulous precision.
513
00:35:56,800 --> 00:35:58,920
Nothing was really left to chance.
514
00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:01,200
There wasn't many things
that happened that weren't,
515
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:03,720
like, thought through and planned.
516
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,920
I mean, it's almost part of his
kind of modus operandi
517
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:23,040
to choose remote areas.
518
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,840
They seem random but obviously
they aren't. They're quite
premeditated.
519
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:46,560
[in French]
Banksy is a genius of situations.
520
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:48,840
He says the right thing
521
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:50,480
in the right place
522
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:51,600
at the right time.
523
00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:00,520
This little cat appeared
amongst within ruins
524
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:04,320
of the city of Gaza after a series
of bombings some years ago
525
00:37:04,320 --> 00:37:07,320
and everyone was asking:
"What's that kitten doing there?"
526
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:10,120
And that's when he said:
527
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:13,560
"The thing that's most searched for
and looked at globally on the
internet
528
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,640
are cats and kittens.
529
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:17,360
I've put a cat there because
I want you all to take an interest
530
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:19,040
in what's happening over there.
531
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,040
Rub your noses in it,
look at what's happening over
there."
532
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:32,120
The work he's done in Palestine
has drawn so much world attention
533
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:35,240
for the young people,
who would never have engaged
534
00:37:35,240 --> 00:37:37,440
with what Palestine is, what Israel
is.
535
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:43,600
Are suddenly aware of this and I
think his crusade to make that
visible
536
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:47,800
and to highlight the injustice
that's happening there, I think's
admirable.
537
00:37:51,240 --> 00:37:55,080
Banksy has set up the hotel
in Bethlehem.
538
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:58,560
As a political statement,
it's the big attraction
539
00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:00,600
to Western holidaymakers.
540
00:38:02,720 --> 00:38:05,280
The hotel is very special because
541
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,200
it is the hotel with the worst view
in the whole world.
542
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:16,880
So it attracts these people and
whilst they're staying there they
get to hear
543
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,960
about the exact political situation
of the Palestinian people,
544
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:24,240
which isn't normally reflected on
the television news particularly
well
545
00:38:24,240 --> 00:38:27,720
or in a balanced fashion against
the other side of the story.
546
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:34,280
[in French] Most people might have
a moment of genius once in their
lives,
547
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:36,080
but he has them all the time.
548
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,520
He put up this installation in
Venice,
549
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:42,240
showing massive cruise ships
coming into port,
550
00:38:42,240 --> 00:38:46,000
even though Venice is in danger
of being totally destroyed.
551
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:49,360
He set up his installation
in St Mark's Square.
552
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:54,240
One week later, two cruise ships
crashed into each other.
553
00:38:54,240 --> 00:38:55,240
Everyone went crazy.
554
00:38:55,240 --> 00:38:56,960
I mean, he couldn't have
guessed that would happen.
555
00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:04,720
It's insane,
556
00:39:04,720 --> 00:39:06,240
but each time,
he gets it exactly right.
557
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,080
We had this idea of raising money
for
558
00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:18,600
a project to provide fresh water
for one village in Chiapas.
559
00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:20,640
The Zapatistas are
an armed social movement
560
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:24,920
who rose up against the Mexican
state, against 500 years of
oppression.
561
00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:28,280
And I think Banksy felt an affinity
for the Zapatista cause, as we all
did.
562
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,720
Banksy painted some murals
in those communities.
563
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:39,120
Did his research before he went out
there.
564
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:42,320
So he looked at artistic tradition
that there is out there.
565
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,440
This was the first time he'd gone
abroad and done painting abroad,
566
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:54,120
and tried to shine a spotlight on a
struggle in a different part of the
world.
567
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:58,200
Of course, after that, he went to
various other places around the
world.
568
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,400
[upbeat music]
569
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:14,760
[reporter] " Season's greetings" was
the only comment from Banksy
570
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:18,760
as he posted this video online,
confirming he was behind this gift
571
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:20,640
to the people of Port Talbot.
572
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:22,840
At first glance,
the boy is playing in the snow,
573
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:27,560
but the work expands to reveal
a burning skip and the ash it emits.
574
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,600
It's the kind of political messaging
that's often in his work
575
00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:34,360
and references the impact of
Port Talbot's industrial skyline.
576
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:42,200
[in French] Banksy created a piece
criticising climate change
577
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:46,000
and which criticised pollution
levels coming from industries at
Port Talbot,
578
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,040
which is a very polluted area.
579
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:50,800
And everyone thought:
"What is this place?
580
00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:52,040
Why Port Talbot?"
581
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,280
People started looking on a map,
they started searching informations.
582
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:56,800
And that's how Banksy
uses his notoriety,
583
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,800
and it's actually
a very powerful weapon.
584
00:41:07,240 --> 00:41:10,680
I imagine that's part of the
excitement from his point of view.
585
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,560
I don't know how much exploration
he does, but to find areas,
586
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:16,840
knowing there will be
publicity and excitement.
587
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:21,000
It almost forces the media then
to travel to these places and
explore
588
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:25,120
little pockets of the UK, so it's
quite a clever concept really,
589
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:30,840
to actually enforce people
to be part of his plan.
590
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,320
What did you guys think when
you saw it for the first time?
591
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:36,840
Well, I thought perhaps
anybody could do that.
592
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:40,200
-[laughter]
-Shows I don't know anything about
art.
593
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,640
But, yeah, the more I've looked at
it...
594
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:45,320
I've come to appreciate it now and,
uh...
595
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:46,600
[laughs]
596
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:50,160
-Do you think Banksy's here today?
-Is he?!
597
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:52,000
No. Well, I'm asking you.
Do you think he's here?
598
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,680
-Well, we don't know. Nobody knows.
-[man] You could be interviewing
him!
599
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:56,840
[laughter]
600
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,880
-There's a lot of intrigue around
that. -Yeah.
601
00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:31,280
So, you know, Banksy puts them up on
walls
602
00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:34,280
-in places that you think are safe.
-Yeah.
603
00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:37,680
-And I come along and take them
away. -[they laugh]
604
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,840
And that's what gives you great
pleasure?
605
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:42,960
It gives me... As I say,
I own about 20 originals.
606
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:46,960
And the trouble is, a lot of his
artwork has got tagged or damaged
607
00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:50,360
by other artists so now it's a case
of moving it here into town,
608
00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:54,760
and then it will be permanently on
display where people can just see it
all the time.
609
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:56,320
Bullshit!
610
00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:59,840
You know, if someone
walks into a warehouse
611
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:02,920
and find a Banksy sprayed
on a gas cannister,
612
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:07,160
fair enough, yeah, but if you're
going round ripping it off a public
wall
613
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:11,760
and taking it out the side of
somewhere, you're making the city a
poorer place.
614
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:18,760
It's just a very 21st-century,
self-centred, narcissistic thing to
do.
615
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,280
And they should be punished.
616
00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:24,040
Corporally. Death.
617
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:35,120
[Welsh woman] And there we are.
We have Banksy going to his new
home.
618
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:39,840
But it doesn't matter because
if we turn around by here,
619
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:43,040
we have Banksy on my wall.
620
00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,160
They're now moving it
and putting it inside a building.
621
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:52,120
That's not street art, it's building
art.
622
00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:54,640
It's not the same.
It's got no meaning downtown.
623
00:43:55,640 --> 00:43:59,400
It was done here to cover the
steelworks. It's got a meaning.
624
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:02,040
It should be left out on the street
for everybody to enjoy.
625
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:04,360
That's what he's done it for.
626
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,400
Banksy doesn't do it to sell them.
627
00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:10,880
You know, he proved that with
his painting that he shredded.
628
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:14,440
Um, no, all they want to do
is make money from it.
629
00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:17,680
I will miss him now.
630
00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:20,800
I'll be opening my gate
and what have I got? [laughs]
631
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,000
A big hole in the wall!
632
00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,320
Yes. That's not good.
633
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:29,360
That's not good.
634
00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:36,600
Banksy is so careful about
where pieces should be placed
635
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:41,560
and he doesn't particularly mind
if they stay there only for a time,
636
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:43,880
but they shouldn't be taken
out of that place
637
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:45,840
for gosh knows how much money.
638
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:53,360
[cheering and applause]
639
00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:57,120
[in French]
I don't know what he's doing.
640
00:44:59,960 --> 00:45:02,040
Is he taking it down?
641
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,480
[reporter in French] Artwork
attributed to British artist Banksy
642
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,080
was stolen at some point
on Saturday night in Paris.
643
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:11,720
[US reporter] Exclusive video of
guys who decided to scale a
building,
644
00:45:11,720 --> 00:45:14,120
cut down the latest Banksy work
and...
645
00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:17,360
[in French] Right now, Banksy is one
of the ten most highly rated artists
646
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:18,960
in the contemporary art market.
647
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,480
As soon as one of Banksy's pieces
is taken down from a wall,
648
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:23,640
someone sells it at auction.
649
00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:27,400
[in French] I think his work
is more wanted than he is.
650
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:30,840
[reporter in French]
The thieves tore off the entire
door.
651
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,120
This stencil piece using white paint
652
00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:35,760
was drawn on one of
the back doors of Bataclan
653
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:38,000
in memory of the victims
killed at the music venue
654
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,680
on 13th November 2015
by a group of terrorists.
655
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:43,840
Having a Banksy that's taken
off a wall and being sold,
656
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:47,520
I just think is morally
and ethically really wrong.
657
00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:56,880
For a decade, I was making money
out of Banksy street works
658
00:45:56,880 --> 00:46:00,960
and I saw absolutely nothing wrong
with what I was doing.
659
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:10,000
I recall sitting in my delicatessen
down in Kent,
660
00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:13,400
and I got a call from a colleague
saying, "Have you seen the new
Banksy?"
661
00:46:13,400 --> 00:46:16,120
And I was like, "Really? Another
Banksy?"
662
00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:19,360
And by this point, I was sort of,
not famous for it, but I was known,
663
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,960
notorious for the guy who goes and
takes Banksy's away and upsets
everyone.
664
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,080
And I said, "Send me a picture."
And he sent me a picture of this
665
00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:27,040
really ugly mural on a wall.
666
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:30,720
But I saw its potential
to make considerable money.
667
00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:37,440
"Art Buff" is an elderly lady.
668
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:39,880
She's got one of those headsets on
669
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:43,880
that you go to a gallery and
somebody's telling what the artwork
means,
670
00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:46,120
and in the front there is a plinth.
671
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:48,560
And the plinth is empty.
672
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:55,480
My intention was to make as much
money as I possibly could.
673
00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:59,400
I had good contacts at the Miami Art
Fair. I'd been there a number of
times.
674
00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:01,880
I had the credentials necessary,
675
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:05,800
and I agreed that we would attempt
to remove the piece
676
00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:09,640
with a team of guys who can pretty
much move anything on the planet.
677
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,440
[seagulls crying]
678
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:25,160
I should have perhaps realised what
they were going to do because
679
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:29,880
they come in and start
covering the area with scaffold
680
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:32,160
and chopping the Banksy out of the
wall.
681
00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:37,320
[drilling]
682
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:41,040
We started about eight o'clock
in the morning.
683
00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:44,480
As the noise echoed across
Folkestone,
684
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:46,880
suddenly more and more people
started appearing.
685
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:50,080
And it was clear that they were
carrying protest placards.
686
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:54,040
They were vehemently against
what was going on.
687
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:57,200
It felt like we were being robbed
of Folkestone's Banksy.
688
00:47:57,200 --> 00:47:59,280
You know, we believed
it belonged to our town.
689
00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:01,800
You know, we wanted to benefit from
it
690
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:03,640
and to see it every day.
691
00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:09,800
We could be quite smug. "We've got
a Banksy. Have you got a Banksy?"
692
00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:11,400
It was a bit like that.
693
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:18,720
I mean, these were relatively
middle-class, working-class,
694
00:48:18,720 --> 00:48:23,680
small-town folk who suddenly turned
into these sort of harridans and
monsters
695
00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:26,080
screaming abuse at us
and my construction guys.
696
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:28,880
I mean, it wasn't just verbal abuse,
it was physical abuse.
697
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:32,720
It was just, "No, why are you taking
it? How can it be taken away?"
698
00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:36,960
And I think the fact that everyone
felt it was being taken away for
money
699
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,440
was even more frustrating.
700
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:44,080
Everybody ran up there.
They're trying to stop it happening.
701
00:48:44,080 --> 00:48:47,800
And then Robin Barton,
"Bankrobber" as he's know, a
gallerist,
702
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:50,200
he is there, walking around,
winding everybody up
703
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:52,400
and telling them that he had
total rights to take it.
704
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,040
Cos the more upset you are,
the more noise there is.
705
00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:57,760
The more noise there is,
the more media there is.
706
00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:59,760
The more media there is,
the more value there is.
707
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:09,320
It was a long, long day. I mean,
it was 14 hours of drilling and
cutting.
708
00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:14,520
And we finally pulled the last piece
of the wall out around about sunset.
709
00:49:14,520 --> 00:49:17,640
And off it flew out to Miami.
710
00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:19,880
[jet roars]
711
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:22,600
By putting it in Miami,
712
00:49:22,600 --> 00:49:25,160
the contrast would be so great
from where it originally came from.
713
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:29,120
A broken down,
Third World town of Folkestone
714
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:31,640
and then you've got
the glitz and glamour of Miami.
715
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:35,120
And having all the Americans staring
at it was quite appealing to me.
716
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:40,560
As you came into Art Miami, there it
was, boomph, right in the middle,
717
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:43,680
with a price tag of
half a million dollars on it.
718
00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:50,000
There's of course a certain irony
about selling an artwork
719
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:53,920
for a huge amount of money
to a collector about the vacuousness
720
00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:58,640
of the collecting of artwork and
how value is put on art and so on.
721
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:03,160
But it was painted to go on that
wall. It was painted to be in an
urban setting.
722
00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:07,320
And we'd actively got involved
in trying to bring it back.
723
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:17,000
Because it's an illegal act
and put out there in the street,
724
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:19,200
covertly without permissions,
725
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:21,960
there is no copyright issue
whatsoever.
726
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:26,200
The person who owns that wall,
that door, that window, that floor
727
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:29,520
is the owner of that artwork
and it gives me the right,
728
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:33,160
on behalf of those freeholders,
to sell the works.
729
00:50:33,160 --> 00:50:36,840
-[interviewer] So it's legal?
-It's completely legal as long as,
730
00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:40,240
and this is the critical mass,
as long as the freeholder
731
00:50:40,240 --> 00:50:43,120
can prove without question
they are the freeholder.
732
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:45,760
But that doesn't tell you
who emotional owns it.
733
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:48,640
It's emotionally owned by
the people of the town going,
734
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:51,000
"This is Folkestone's Banksy.
735
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:54,000
I'm from Folkestone. It's my
Banksy."
736
00:51:05,080 --> 00:51:09,320
Whilst I was sunning myself in Miami
and drinking I know not what,
737
00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:12,400
I got a lawyer's letter
saying we have discovered
738
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:15,640
there is a greater freeholder
and that the Godden family
739
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:18,360
were indeed not the freeholders
of the building.
740
00:51:18,360 --> 00:51:21,560
At this point, it was game over.
741
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:29,280
I was forced to dip my hands in my
pocket
742
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,800
and pay for it to be
returned to Folkestone.
743
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,240
It's good that we've got one,
it's good that we've kept it.
744
00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:40,840
No one can touch it now.
It's our Banksy.
745
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:42,720
Owned by Folkestone.
746
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,080
Hands off.
747
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:07,520
So you can see that
the whole piece looks amazing,
748
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:10,840
but if you get slightly closer up,
you can see there's this chop here,
749
00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:14,840
that the paint is cracked
and it's where the saw came
750
00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:17,000
and just cut this out of the wall.
751
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:18,920
And that's, um, you know...
752
00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:22,040
The thing about Banksy is the story
is as much of the artwork.
753
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:24,640
It's never just the painting.
It's what happens afterwards.
754
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:28,000
How people talk about it.
People demonstrating on the streets.
755
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,600
People saying, "That's ours
and you can't take it!"
756
00:52:30,600 --> 00:52:34,240
So I don't mind these cuts,
cos I think people will be able to
757
00:52:34,240 --> 00:52:38,360
understand the story better with
these little marks that are going
through it.
758
00:52:42,520 --> 00:52:44,960
Don't mess with Folkestone,
that's the moral of the story,
759
00:52:44,960 --> 00:52:47,440
cos we love art in this community.
760
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:50,600
I don't feel guilty about
anything I did in Folkestone.
761
00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:56,320
And whereas Banksy clearly set his
stall up as being Robin Hood of the
art world,
762
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,360
I suddenly realised, there I was,
the Sheriff of Nottingham.
763
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,680
I was the bad guy, he was the good
guy.
764
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:05,080
Now, I watch movies.
Who do I want to be? The bad guy.
765
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:09,840
Banksy, I suppose, is up here
just looking down at this little
766
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:14,000
thing he made.
It's just a massive old circus.
767
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:24,280
-What do we want?
-Banksy back!
768
00:53:24,280 --> 00:53:26,160
-When do we want it?
-Now!
769
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:27,560
Save our Banksy!
770
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:35,520
Society has embraced him
to such a point
771
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:39,520
where he has become
part of the establishment.
772
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:42,120
Possibly something he'd
kick against if he could,
773
00:53:42,120 --> 00:53:46,440
but I'm not sure that creating a
prank at Sotheby's with "Girl with
Balloon"
774
00:53:46,440 --> 00:53:52,720
is a good way of distancing yourself
from all the things that he
dislikes.
775
00:53:52,720 --> 00:53:55,200
[Australian reporter]
A stunt like no other.
776
00:53:55,200 --> 00:54:00,200
The iconic image known as
"Girl with the Balloon"
self-destructs.
777
00:54:00,200 --> 00:54:03,880
A Banksy painting sells at auction
for $1.4 million.
778
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:07,400
I'm frustrated that it didn't shred
completely because I think
779
00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:11,760
a wholly shredded picture
with just bits and pieces
780
00:54:11,760 --> 00:54:15,400
lying on the floor is
not worth much money.
781
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:18,880
I mean, if the buyer got these bits
and pieces, what she supposed to do?
782
00:54:18,880 --> 00:54:20,960
Stick them together?
783
00:54:23,360 --> 00:54:26,520
It wasn't a destructive process.
It was a change.
784
00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:29,760
And, of course, in the end,
he gave the painting a new name,
785
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:31,720
a new date and now
it's a different work.
786
00:54:31,720 --> 00:54:35,960
So, you criticise the market but you
give it what it wants at the same
time.
787
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:38,560
So, yes, I think I found that was a
bit...
788
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:40,120
a bit lame really.
789
00:54:41,240 --> 00:54:42,920
[in French] Since Sotheby's,
790
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:46,160
there's been a change in
the public's perception of him.
791
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:49,800
Because, yes, he's great,
yes, he's got things to say,
792
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:51,520
but his criticism of the market,
793
00:54:51,520 --> 00:54:55,280
which is what makes him popular
and gives his artwork value,
794
00:54:56,200 --> 00:54:58,200
is beginning to make people wonder.
795
00:54:58,200 --> 00:55:00,200
They are starting
to doubt his sincerity.
796
00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:06,800
After the event, we had
probably around fifty to sixty
797
00:55:06,800 --> 00:55:10,160
enquiries on Banksy
"Girl with Balloon" print.
798
00:55:10,160 --> 00:55:14,600
So, yes, the demand went sky high,
799
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:17,760
um, especially with
"Girl with Balloon", um...
800
00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:20,520
[interviewer] Does he
make money from that?
801
00:55:20,520 --> 00:55:22,960
Indirectly, I'm sure he does.
802
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:25,440
-How?
-Um...
803
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:27,840
-I can't say.
-You can't?
804
00:55:27,840 --> 00:55:30,440
No, because I'm very good friends
with my collectors
805
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:33,080
-and they can't see me saying that,
sorry. -OK.
806
00:55:33,080 --> 00:55:35,440
He's become a capitalist, like...
807
00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:38,080
like his good friend Robin Barton.
808
00:55:42,760 --> 00:55:46,320
There was so much money being made
by Banksy and by his entourage,
809
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:48,760
and by his colleagues, friends,
810
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:51,240
that it becomes
a self-fulfilling prophecy.
811
00:55:51,240 --> 00:55:55,680
That you become the very person that
you didn't like when you started
out.
812
00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:58,880
You become the person
sitting in an ivory tower.
813
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:00,880
Can you have a relevant voice
814
00:56:00,880 --> 00:56:05,080
when you're so removed from the very
thing you started talking about?
815
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:13,400
He still has an agent. He has a
manager.
816
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:18,040
There's definitely a lot of people
working really hard to protect him.
817
00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:22,720
Banksy is not the guy
with the spray can any more.
818
00:56:22,720 --> 00:56:24,680
He's a lot bigger than that.
819
00:56:30,800 --> 00:56:35,680
Banksy is so famous now and he
keeps putting himself in situations
820
00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:40,880
and doing really big things that
we deserve to know who he is.
821
00:56:42,840 --> 00:56:47,640
And I think the journalist who one
day will reveal him will be...
822
00:56:47,640 --> 00:56:50,760
will go down in the history books
for being the guy or the girl who
823
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:53,080
revealed who Banksy was.
824
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:03,400
My source, um,
825
00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:05,760
decided that he wants
to stay anonymous.
826
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:10,280
He's a forensic expert.
827
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:12,040
Due diligence.
828
00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:15,040
Looks through companies
and the owners of companies
829
00:57:15,040 --> 00:57:16,960
to see the trails there.
830
00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:26,080
[disguised male voice]
I'd like to remain anonymous
831
00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:30,800
because I just don't want
any kind of exposure.
832
00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:34,400
It's just an itch I needed to
scratch and I was just intrigued by
the whole thing.
833
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:38,200
I don't need any kind of hate mail
for exposing Banksy,
834
00:57:38,200 --> 00:57:41,600
cos there would probably be a bunch
of people who were very angry
835
00:57:41,600 --> 00:57:44,760
if it turned out I was right.
836
00:57:57,640 --> 00:58:01,840
Banksy has just released a
documentary,
837
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:03,920
"Exit Through The Gift Shop".
838
00:58:03,920 --> 00:58:07,400
And it got a bit of noise at that
time
839
00:58:07,400 --> 00:58:09,680
and then it got nominated
for an Academy Award,
840
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:14,080
and he was still trying
to claim that he was
841
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:16,400
some sort of anonymity,
842
00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:20,160
which is impossible if you're
making any film like that.
843
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:22,840
As soon as business is involved,
844
00:58:22,840 --> 00:58:25,520
and you want to make
some money out of that,
845
00:58:25,520 --> 00:58:29,360
you have to register companies
and the money has to go somewhere.
846
00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:31,440
And then there is a paper trail.
847
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:35,480
So I looked up what
the production company was.
848
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:38,520
It was a company called
Paranoid Pictures.
849
00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:41,560
[gunfire]
850
00:58:41,560 --> 00:58:45,000
And if you look through
this company document
851
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:46,880
and the annual return,
852
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:49,360
you'll find that it's actually owned
by another company
853
00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:52,280
called Pest Control Office Ltd.
854
00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:57,880
This is a company that is
solely there to verify Banksy
855
00:58:57,880 --> 00:58:59,920
works of art to make sure
that they're not fakes
856
00:58:59,920 --> 00:59:03,200
and they've really actually
been made by Banksy himself.
857
00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:07,680
So this company is the owner
of Paranoid Pictures.
858
00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:11,000
But if you look through
the annual return here...
859
00:59:11,000 --> 00:59:15,760
this in itself is owned by a company
called Picturesonwalls Ltd.
860
00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:21,120
So if you go to Picturesonwalls Ltd
and looking through this annual
return...
861
00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:23,360
at the time of my investigation,
862
00:59:23,360 --> 00:59:27,760
you can see that the sole owner
is Jamie Hewlett.
863
00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:34,520
Jamie Hewlett, the founder of
Gorillaz.
864
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:39,320
It makes sense.
865
00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:42,160
Gorillaz, Banksy.
He's in their music video.
866
00:59:42,160 --> 00:59:44,560
He is... Yeah.
867
00:59:44,560 --> 00:59:46,680
I... I just thought, "This is him."
868
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:48,160
[camera shutter clicks]
869
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:51,520
[camera shutter clicks]
870
00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:53,640
Gorillaz is a fake band.
871
00:59:53,640 --> 00:59:58,160
They're not actually humans.
They're meant to be these
characters,
872
00:59:58,160 --> 01:00:01,440
which is very close to what
Banksy's doing as well.
873
01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:08,400
[camera shutter clicks]
874
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:11,280
The other guy in Gorillaz, Damon
Albarn,
875
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:13,440
has another band called Blur
876
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:16,920
and Banksy made the front cover
for their album.
877
01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:19,360
[disguised male voice]
This Blur album cover
878
01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:21,440
is designed by Banksy himself.
879
01:00:21,440 --> 01:00:25,880
If you look at this still here from
one of the Gorillaz's music videos,
880
01:00:25,880 --> 01:00:29,520
that is a Banksy in the actual
music video itself.
881
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:30,920
[camera shutter clicks]
882
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:38,840
And it was surprising to see that
everything just kind of added up.
883
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:41,920
[disguised voice] Another thing...
I may be clutching at straws here,
884
01:00:41,920 --> 01:00:46,200
but a few years ago when
Banksy opened up his hotel,
885
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:52,560
some tourist hosted video footage
of who he or she believed
886
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:55,320
may have been Banksy spotted.
887
01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:59,560
This person had been uncovered
doing these graffiti stencils
888
01:00:59,560 --> 01:01:01,560
around the corner from the hotel.
889
01:01:01,560 --> 01:01:06,480
He actually looks like Jamie Hewlett
from certain kind of facial
similarities.
890
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:11,480
Wow! I'm gonna reveal who Banksy is.
891
01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:14,920
It was too good, the information
was too good not to publish.
892
01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:25,320
[disguise male voice]
Since I made a bit of a noise,
893
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:29,200
the very next annual return, in
2017.
894
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:30,840
If you look here,
895
01:01:30,840 --> 01:01:33,960
Jamie Hewlett has
transferred all his shares
896
01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:36,440
to someone called Marcus Samuel
Chambers.
897
01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:40,920
So if I was suspicious,
which of course I am,
898
01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:44,000
there has been a reaction to my
action.
899
01:01:48,680 --> 01:01:53,920
It's a very kind of fun idea,
like using A.I. to see where people
are
900
01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:57,960
based in the world at any one point
but this is a pretty black and white
theory
901
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,120
which you can't deny.
902
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:03,800
[siren wailing]
903
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:16,680
Joanna Brooks emailed me...
She's Banksy's publicist.
904
01:02:16,680 --> 01:02:19,320
...saying Jamie Hewlett is not
Banksy.
905
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:25,560
But she made a mistake and she
spelt Hewlett with an "i" not an
"e".
906
01:02:28,120 --> 01:02:30,720
Which is wrong.
907
01:02:30,720 --> 01:02:33,640
So I thought, "Is this
a sneaky way of not lying?"
908
01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:37,720
So if we do reveal him now
and we said, "But you lied!"
909
01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:40,240
She will say, "No,
cos I didn't spell it the right
way."
910
01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:46,560
If it's not Jamie Hewlett, I don't
think I believe the other theories
more.
911
01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:05,800
I went through every single story
that had been written on Banksy to
get clues.
912
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:08,880
Where he had been, who his friends
were.
913
01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:18,200
There was one picture that
supposedly was Banksy in Jamaica
914
01:03:18,200 --> 01:03:20,200
and it had been published
in the Evening Standard,
915
01:03:20,200 --> 01:03:22,720
and then it sort of
mysteriously disappeared
916
01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:25,600
and nobody knew who owed
the copyright any more.
917
01:03:25,600 --> 01:03:27,720
It was part of the mystery around
Banksy.
918
01:03:37,480 --> 01:03:40,840
Finally, I found someone
who knew who he was.
919
01:03:40,840 --> 01:03:44,120
Someone that had interviewed Banksy,
920
01:03:44,120 --> 01:03:46,960
that knew Banksy,
that knew who Banksy was
921
01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:49,760
and told me that he was called
Robin Gunningham.
922
01:03:54,840 --> 01:03:59,320
First of all, I found out everything
about Robin Gunningham I could.
923
01:03:59,320 --> 01:04:02,320
His birth certificate, his parents'
names.
924
01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:06,560
I did his full family tree with his
sisters and cousins and relatives.
925
01:04:07,560 --> 01:04:09,840
And then I looked on the Electoral
Roll.
926
01:04:09,840 --> 01:04:14,600
And all the places he'd lived seemed
to be places where Banksy had lived.
927
01:04:19,760 --> 01:04:23,840
So I was fairly confident
when I went down to Bristol
928
01:04:23,840 --> 01:04:28,000
with a team of people that
I worked very well with to prove it.
929
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:32,360
I wanted to do it quickly because I
didn't want another journalist to
get the story.
930
01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:39,360
We spoke to someone called Luke
Egan,
931
01:04:39,360 --> 01:04:42,440
who denied knowing Robin Gunningham,
but he'd lived with him.
932
01:04:45,680 --> 01:04:51,200
We spoke to a woman who had moved
into a flat after Robin Gunningham
had left,
933
01:04:51,200 --> 01:04:54,880
and she had discovered some
old discarded Banksy drawings.
934
01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:04,000
I think the final piece in the
jigsaw
935
01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:07,280
was the fact that one of the
neighbours of where Robin grew up
936
01:05:07,280 --> 01:05:12,440
identified that initial photograph
from Jamaica as Robin Gunningham.
937
01:05:13,920 --> 01:05:16,720
And I interviewed someone
who went to school with him
938
01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:18,960
and he had a photograph of him at
school
939
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:23,160
and it looked similar to the picture
that was taken in Jamaica.
940
01:05:27,560 --> 01:05:31,000
And when I spoke to Mr Gunningham,
941
01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:35,720
he was laughing and smiling
and saying, "I can't comment."
942
01:05:35,720 --> 01:05:40,600
And I said, "Well, look, if your son
is a teacher in Birmingham,
943
01:05:40,600 --> 01:05:44,760
you must tell me because I'm going
to put in the paper on Sunday that
he's Banksy."
944
01:05:44,760 --> 01:05:47,680
And he just said,
"I can't possibly say anything."
945
01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:50,880
Nobody, apart from Banksy's father,
946
01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:53,800
would have played games with me
the way he did.
947
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:56,120
If you are familiar with
the artist known as Banksy,
948
01:05:56,120 --> 01:05:58,240
he's never publicly shown his face.
949
01:05:58,240 --> 01:06:01,480
Now though, Banksy may have
actually been unmasked.
950
01:06:01,480 --> 01:06:03,240
[in French] Who is Banksy?
951
01:06:03,240 --> 01:06:07,360
Banksy's name could be
Robin Gunningham, a native of
Bristol.
952
01:06:07,360 --> 01:06:10,520
[reporter] The article claims
Robin Gunningham, who's now 35,
953
01:06:10,520 --> 01:06:12,240
was great at art at school.
954
01:06:12,240 --> 01:06:14,920
Banksy had a background
that was posh and privileged
955
01:06:14,920 --> 01:06:16,680
if this article is to be believed.
956
01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:19,840
He went to school here,
the Bristol Cathedral School.
957
01:06:19,840 --> 01:06:22,320
It's hardly the background
of someone who's made his name
958
01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:24,920
from being "hip" and "street".
959
01:06:42,560 --> 01:06:46,480
Geographic profiling is a criminal
investigative methodology.
960
01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:48,960
It was designed to help
prioritise suspects
961
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:52,920
and manage information
in a large-scale serial crime case.
962
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:58,800
So if we have a serial murder,
there's a pattern to where they hunt
963
01:06:58,800 --> 01:07:01,960
and the locations where the offender
is most likely based.
964
01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:05,880
I was a member of
the Vancouver Police Department
965
01:07:05,880 --> 01:07:08,440
and because I had
a background in mathematics,
966
01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:12,200
I wondered about what you might be
able to extract, in terms of
information,
967
01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:15,040
from a pattern of crime locations.
968
01:07:21,160 --> 01:07:25,240
What I'm showing right now
is the top five per cent of the area
969
01:07:25,240 --> 01:07:28,920
for the art that Banksy did
while he was in New York City.
970
01:07:28,920 --> 01:07:33,400
I was able to find information
on 31 of his graffiti artworks.
971
01:07:33,400 --> 01:07:36,760
So I put it into the Rigel System,
which I have open here.
972
01:07:38,200 --> 01:07:41,960
And you can see here Manhattan.
973
01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:46,880
And the dark orange shows the most
probable area for Banksy's base.
974
01:07:46,880 --> 01:07:50,040
This could be where
he was staying in a hotel,
975
01:07:50,040 --> 01:07:54,400
or if he was crashing at
a friend's apartment or condo,
976
01:07:54,400 --> 01:07:57,840
between Union Square Park,
Washington Square Park
977
01:07:57,840 --> 01:08:02,040
and it's roughly northern
Greenwich Village.
978
01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:06,920
Well, it doesn't tell us anything
about Gunningham or about other
suspects,
979
01:08:06,920 --> 01:08:10,680
but it would be, um,
if he were still in New York,
980
01:08:10,680 --> 01:08:14,600
where you would probably want
to focus your search efforts for
him.
981
01:08:14,600 --> 01:08:18,040
Now, if no one tried to
find out who Banksy was,
982
01:08:18,040 --> 01:08:20,160
well, it would all be
rather boring, wouldn't it?
983
01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:26,720
This map here shows you,
through the red dots,
984
01:08:26,720 --> 01:08:30,080
locations associated
with Banksy's artwork.
985
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,840
Blue dots, locations associated
with Robin Gunningham,
986
01:08:33,840 --> 01:08:36,400
such as, where did he live?
Where did he go to school?
987
01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:40,000
Where did he work? Anything
that you could associate with him.
988
01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:42,720
If we had multiple Banksy suspects,
989
01:08:42,720 --> 01:08:45,440
we could see which ones
came out best but we don't.
990
01:08:45,440 --> 01:08:49,080
So the idea is that you look at this
and you see, well, that compared
quite well.
991
01:08:54,960 --> 01:08:58,320
So that elevated the probability
992
01:08:58,320 --> 01:09:02,520
of him being the correct suspect
to a certain degree.
993
01:09:02,520 --> 01:09:04,680
We're not proving anything here.
994
01:09:04,680 --> 01:09:08,560
All we're doing is saying, here's
some evidence that either supports
995
01:09:08,560 --> 01:09:12,040
the Gunningham theory
or doesn't support it.
996
01:09:12,040 --> 01:09:14,680
In the end, it supported it quite
well.
997
01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:19,000
Yeah, this is a science
used to find criminals,
998
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:22,160
instead used to catch an artist,
999
01:09:22,160 --> 01:09:25,240
the person behind this - Banksy.
1000
01:09:25,240 --> 01:09:29,760
And scientists say they're 90% sure
they have their man.
1001
01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:31,880
The spatial evidence of the artworks
1002
01:09:31,880 --> 01:09:35,080
supports the theory that he
is the suspect, that he is Banksy.
1003
01:09:35,080 --> 01:09:38,120
Mystery solved? Don't bank on it.
1004
01:09:38,120 --> 01:09:40,760
Robin Gunningham, this "public
schoolboy".
1005
01:09:40,760 --> 01:09:43,360
I don't think that this person
ever existed.
1006
01:09:43,360 --> 01:09:47,520
I have a feeling that's another one
of our fake news things maybe.
1007
01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:50,440
Maybe it's not.
1008
01:09:50,440 --> 01:09:51,960
[interviewer laughs]
1009
01:09:51,960 --> 01:09:55,040
[in French] There is regular
speculation about his identity,
1010
01:09:55,040 --> 01:09:57,200
probably in order to blur the lines.
1011
01:09:57,200 --> 01:09:59,640
I think he's probably got
something to do with that.
1012
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:14,320
Everyone likes to have another
theory about Banksy.
1013
01:10:14,320 --> 01:10:16,360
There's nothing saying...
1014
01:10:16,360 --> 01:10:19,000
we can guarantee this is a man.
1015
01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:23,360
The weird thing is, like, the Banksy
pieces, anybody could do it.
1016
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:26,240
If Banksy gave me the stencil
and I bought some spray paint,
1017
01:10:26,240 --> 01:10:28,640
I could go out and do it.
1018
01:10:29,560 --> 01:10:32,200
Banksy might have operatives
all over the world.
1019
01:10:32,200 --> 01:10:34,840
Maybe he's got like sleeper cells
in every city.
1020
01:10:36,520 --> 01:10:38,840
[in French] He's almost definitely
hiding somewhere amongst it all.
1021
01:10:38,840 --> 01:10:40,280
Maybe there isn't even one Banksy.
1022
01:10:40,280 --> 01:10:42,720
Maybe the mastermind is actually
1023
01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:44,360
a whole group of, I don't know,
10, 15 or 20 people.
1024
01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:47,160
Yeah, there's a lot of stuff
going on behind the scenes
1025
01:10:47,160 --> 01:10:49,640
regarding Banksy.
1026
01:10:49,640 --> 01:10:53,240
Who is he? Actually, I don't really
care. Not that bothered.
1027
01:10:53,240 --> 01:10:55,280
So, I'm not giving the game away.
1028
01:10:55,280 --> 01:10:59,200
It would be like telling a small
child that Santa Claus didn't exist.
1029
01:10:59,200 --> 01:11:01,760
And plus, I think,
the general public made him.
1030
01:11:01,760 --> 01:11:04,360
Like, they made this folk hero.
1031
01:11:04,360 --> 01:11:09,440
Yeah? And the last thing they want
is for someone to blow that myth.
1032
01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:19,200
It has been a very curious
experience
1033
01:11:19,200 --> 01:11:21,600
because there seems to be
1034
01:11:21,600 --> 01:11:24,760
a sort of conspiracy
to suggest that I'm wrong.
1035
01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:30,200
People are like, "You're a fucking
idiot. You've ruined Banksy for me,
1036
01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:32,400
because now I know what he looks
like."
1037
01:11:32,400 --> 01:11:35,000
My retort is to them is, like,
1038
01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:37,640
"Do you know fucking Picasso?"
"Yes."
1039
01:11:37,640 --> 01:11:40,280
"Do you like Picasso?"
"Yes."
1040
01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:43,080
"Do you know what
fucking Picasso looks like?"
1041
01:11:43,080 --> 01:11:44,160
"Yes."
1042
01:11:44,160 --> 01:11:45,960
"What fucking difference does it
make?"
1043
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:49,080
I think the fact people
are upset about it
1044
01:11:49,080 --> 01:11:51,480
is because there's like
a strong political message.
1045
01:11:51,480 --> 01:11:53,680
They don't want to see
the face that tells them it.
1046
01:11:53,680 --> 01:11:57,840
They want just to be told it
by someone they don't know.
1047
01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:05,120
Everybody wins with him not being
known.
1048
01:12:06,120 --> 01:12:09,640
Would Banksy have the same impact
if we knew his name?
1049
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:11,720
Well, probably not.
1050
01:12:11,720 --> 01:12:13,240
It's just like Jack the Ripper.
1051
01:12:13,240 --> 01:12:17,200
Jack the Ripper's one of the most
infamous serial killers in history.
1052
01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:19,240
Maybe people call him
the first serial killer,
1053
01:12:19,240 --> 01:12:21,960
but that's not true,
not by a long shot.
1054
01:12:21,960 --> 01:12:23,920
But he is perhaps the most famous,
1055
01:12:23,920 --> 01:12:27,720
and one of the reasons he's the most
famous is he was never caught.
1056
01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:38,160
I suppose at those kind of low times
people reach for the fictional world
1057
01:12:38,160 --> 01:12:39,800
and the fantasy,
1058
01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:42,800
and they like to feel
that there's some kind of
1059
01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:47,160
rescue just around the corner
and there's hope somehow.
1060
01:12:47,160 --> 01:12:51,560
Even now that he has a huge
possibility of generating money,
1061
01:12:51,560 --> 01:12:54,760
he's stayed very true to the roots
1062
01:12:54,760 --> 01:12:58,000
that he would have
grown up around in Bristol.
1063
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:01,200
Which is a large community
of people who are...
1064
01:13:01,200 --> 01:13:04,880
helping each other
in a social and cultural way,
1065
01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:08,440
and the fact that he
is now finding ways to
1066
01:13:08,440 --> 01:13:12,160
benefit hundreds of people from this
incredible achievement that's he's
made,
1067
01:13:12,160 --> 01:13:14,080
I think is just a fantastic story.
1068
01:13:14,080 --> 01:13:18,120
The renowned and illusive artist
Banksy is weighing in
1069
01:13:18,120 --> 01:13:20,920
to help a cash-struck
boys' club in Bristol.
1070
01:13:20,920 --> 01:13:25,320
This youth club was another way
where he said, "Right, I'm going to
help them."
1071
01:13:30,120 --> 01:13:32,400
It was Sunday, April the 13th.
1072
01:13:32,400 --> 01:13:34,680
It was around one o'clock
in the afternoon
1073
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:37,680
and I parked just outside
the boys' club gates.
1074
01:13:37,680 --> 01:13:42,920
And I noticed immediately in a
doorway this rather amazing stencil.
1075
01:13:51,920 --> 01:13:55,160
As I was sat there waiting,
I couldn't really take my eyes off
it
1076
01:13:55,160 --> 01:13:58,960
and I said to my wife, I'm like,
"That looks like a Banksy."
1077
01:14:09,720 --> 01:14:12,080
My son came past.
1078
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:14,000
He rang me. He said, "Dad,
you're not going to believe this.
1079
01:14:14,000 --> 01:14:16,400
I think we've got a Banksy
outside the club."
1080
01:14:16,400 --> 01:14:18,880
I said, "Oh, don't be so stupid.
Don't be so foolish."
1081
01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:22,920
I wasn't 100% sure.
I said, "If it's what I think it is,
1082
01:14:22,920 --> 01:14:26,120
then you need to get that
protected." You know?
1083
01:14:26,120 --> 01:14:28,800
And when I got there, I thought,
1084
01:14:28,800 --> 01:14:32,920
"Oh, it looks good. It might be a
Banksy, but, I mean, I don't much
about Banksy's."
1085
01:14:32,920 --> 01:14:35,240
All I could see was this young
couple.
1086
01:14:35,240 --> 01:14:37,360
They both have their mobile phones.
They were both, in effect,
1087
01:14:37,360 --> 01:14:39,720
supposed to be looking
into each other's loving eyes.
1088
01:14:39,720 --> 01:14:42,000
And, in fact, they weren't, they
were looked at each other's phones.
1089
01:14:48,400 --> 01:14:52,520
It really was quite a poignant
statement about young people today,
1090
01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:56,920
that the mobile phone can be a
little bit more important than the
human being.
1091
01:14:59,600 --> 01:15:03,520
Somebody would've had to done it,
so I thought I'd go and check my
CCTV.
1092
01:15:09,240 --> 01:15:13,200
A white van pulled up
and parked just by
1093
01:15:13,200 --> 01:15:16,720
what would be the place where
the "Mobile Lovers" was put.
1094
01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:22,080
Two men got out the van.
I couldn't see their faces.
1095
01:15:22,080 --> 01:15:24,080
They had hi-vis jackets on
and they had helmets on.
1096
01:15:24,080 --> 01:15:26,560
They just looked like any work team.
1097
01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:30,720
A gentleman took a picture, drove
off.
1098
01:15:30,720 --> 01:15:33,080
And then at 12 o'clock on the 15th,
1099
01:15:33,080 --> 01:15:36,400
is when it became known
to the public and the world,
basically,
1100
01:15:36,400 --> 01:15:38,120
that there was a new Banksy
for people to see.
1101
01:15:38,120 --> 01:15:41,080
And that's when my story began.
1102
01:15:41,080 --> 01:15:43,600
[reporter] In April, a picture
appeared here overnight,
1103
01:15:43,600 --> 01:15:46,800
created by the secretive
street artist Banksy.
1104
01:15:46,800 --> 01:15:51,360
With a steady stream of visitors
coming to see the latest Banksy
creation...
1105
01:15:54,280 --> 01:15:58,360
There had been a period of time
where no new Banksy artworks had
appeared
1106
01:15:58,360 --> 01:16:00,640
in Bristol for a while,
1107
01:16:00,640 --> 01:16:03,280
and so I was very keen
to see the new artwork.
1108
01:16:03,280 --> 01:16:05,880
I actually thought a murder
had been committed outside,
1109
01:16:05,880 --> 01:16:08,640
because I'd never seen
so many people with cameras
1110
01:16:08,640 --> 01:16:11,080
taking pictures of "Mobile Lovers".
1111
01:16:11,080 --> 01:16:15,240
And I'm looking at it and I'm
thinking, "Whoa! This really is a
Banksy."
1112
01:16:15,240 --> 01:16:17,400
And we've left it there
for two or three days.
1113
01:16:17,400 --> 01:16:18,920
I mean, are we mad?
1114
01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:24,120
James, back the other way!
1115
01:16:24,120 --> 01:16:27,760
Don't forget your arms. Keep 'em
moving! Come on, you can!
1116
01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:29,840
Well done! Keep going!
1117
01:16:29,840 --> 01:16:32,520
As soon as he realised it was a
Banksy,
1118
01:16:32,520 --> 01:16:35,440
he knew that he was sat on something
that could save the club.
1119
01:16:35,440 --> 01:16:38,000
So, you're gonna take it out
nice and slowly.
1120
01:16:38,000 --> 01:16:41,520
The problem with the clubs
were that government at the time
1121
01:16:41,520 --> 01:16:45,800
and local council were cutting
funding to youth projects.
1122
01:16:45,800 --> 01:16:49,880
Boxing really is a fantastic sport.
1123
01:16:49,880 --> 01:16:54,840
It's something that is always done
in a boxing club, OK?
1124
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:58,160
We use sport as a platform
to engage young people.
1125
01:16:58,160 --> 01:17:00,560
To give them something
to hang their coat on.
1126
01:17:00,560 --> 01:17:05,040
This is their place to just grow,
nurture and develop at their pace,
1127
01:17:05,040 --> 01:17:09,000
doing what they would like to do
where they know they'll be looked
after.
1128
01:17:14,040 --> 01:17:15,680
So I thought, "Do you know what?
1129
01:17:15,680 --> 01:17:18,480
We need to take 'Mobile Lovers'
off the wall and we're going to sell
it,
1130
01:17:18,480 --> 01:17:20,520
so that we can save the club."
1131
01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:21,840
[siren wailing]
1132
01:17:24,600 --> 01:17:29,760
And then we had all of the negative
press and people writing on the
Facebook page,
1133
01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:32,440
"What kind of example
are you setting for others?"
1134
01:17:32,440 --> 01:17:33,880
"You should be ashamed."
1135
01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:38,160
People have taken to Twitter as soon
as they heard this news today.
1136
01:17:38,160 --> 01:17:40,960
Some people are calling
Dennis Stinchcombe a vulture.
1137
01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:43,400
I guess, street art,
they do it on the streets
1138
01:17:43,400 --> 01:17:46,440
so that people will have more access
to it, so it's like a bit of a
shame.
1139
01:17:46,440 --> 01:17:50,760
It's gone already before anyone's
got a chance to look at it, so it's
wrong.
1140
01:17:55,160 --> 01:17:56,480
Go left!
1141
01:17:58,200 --> 01:18:00,320
I started getting death threats.
1142
01:18:00,320 --> 01:18:02,720
What gave me that right?
And it went on and on and on.
1143
01:18:02,720 --> 01:18:06,600
And this is against a man that's all
he's ever done for 30 years is give
1144
01:18:06,600 --> 01:18:10,720
to the people of Bristol and you've
got people saying he should be
killed.
1145
01:18:10,720 --> 01:18:12,960
And that was the hard thing, for me.
1146
01:18:15,000 --> 01:18:17,800
And finally, the most important
thing that happened,
1147
01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:19,520
with all the months of arguments
1148
01:18:19,520 --> 01:18:21,840
and discussions and dialogues
and everything else,
1149
01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:25,000
was the day that this letter
came through the door.
1150
01:18:25,000 --> 01:18:27,400
I got a phone call from Dad
and he's like,
1151
01:18:27,400 --> 01:18:30,960
"Sean, you're never going to believe
it. I've only got a letter from
Banksy."
1152
01:18:30,960 --> 01:18:32,960
It was like, wow!
This is it or it's not it.
1153
01:18:32,960 --> 01:18:34,960
It could be ours, it might not.
1154
01:18:34,960 --> 01:18:37,400
And it's almost like I wanted to
read it but I didn't want to read
it.
1155
01:18:37,400 --> 01:18:40,520
But there it is now in front of me
and it's like, "Oh, my God!"
1156
01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:43,680
"Private and confidential.
1157
01:18:43,680 --> 01:18:47,120
Dear Dennis, I hope this finds you
well.
1158
01:18:47,120 --> 01:18:51,240
As you know, I recently painted
on a doorway near the club.
1159
01:18:51,240 --> 01:18:54,160
This was meant to be
a small visual gift for the area.
1160
01:18:54,160 --> 01:18:58,160
But, apparently, a financial one
would have been much more useful.
1161
01:18:59,280 --> 01:19:02,080
I don't normally admit
to committing criminal damage,
1162
01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:06,560
but seeing as it looks like charges
won't be brought any time soon,
1163
01:19:06,560 --> 01:19:10,080
you have my blessing to do what
you feel is right with this piece.
1164
01:19:11,400 --> 01:19:13,880
I'm a great admirer of the work
done at the club
1165
01:19:13,880 --> 01:19:16,920
and will be chuffed if this
can help in some way.
1166
01:19:16,920 --> 01:19:21,520
Your tenacity in the past few weeks
has made for an entertaining
spectator sport.
1167
01:19:21,520 --> 01:19:25,440
I assume you're familiar with the
quote attributed to Abraham Lincoln.
1168
01:19:25,440 --> 01:19:27,600
'Things may come to those who wait
1169
01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:30,360
but only the things left behind
by those who hustle.'
1170
01:19:31,480 --> 01:19:35,920
Best wishes, Banksy." And, of
course, he signed it at the bottom.
1171
01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:40,280
This letter was incredibly important
and on that day I read it...
1172
01:19:40,280 --> 01:19:42,320
Wow! It was like...
1173
01:19:57,920 --> 01:20:00,400
I was so happy for him.
1174
01:20:00,400 --> 01:20:03,200
Because no one deserves
to be ridiculed on social media
1175
01:20:03,200 --> 01:20:07,320
because of a picture, because
he's seen an opportunity to save
1176
01:20:07,320 --> 01:20:12,560
a club that he loves
with every part of his body.
1177
01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:14,720
He'll never be away from that place.
1178
01:20:14,720 --> 01:20:17,240
That's where his soul's going to be.
That's where his heart is now
1179
01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:18,880
and that's where his heart
and soul's gonna die.
1180
01:20:25,600 --> 01:20:28,760
[reporter] This piece of graffiti
sprayed on a boarded-up doorway
1181
01:20:28,760 --> 01:20:32,880
is now officially worth £403,000.
1182
01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:36,760
The money itself won't
just benefit one club here in
Bristol.
1183
01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:39,080
It will benefit up to six,
seven or eight of them.
1184
01:20:39,080 --> 01:20:42,480
It will go far and wide and it will
touch an awful lot of people.
1185
01:20:42,480 --> 01:20:46,360
It is a very good news story
in this city.
1186
01:20:48,280 --> 01:20:54,320
This was the most direct way that
he had used the value of his art
1187
01:20:54,320 --> 01:20:56,160
for a social purpose.
1188
01:20:56,160 --> 01:21:00,200
I think we'd lose some
of the magic if somebody
1189
01:21:00,200 --> 01:21:02,440
reveals who he is.
1190
01:21:21,600 --> 01:21:25,440
[electronic music]
1191
01:21:28,920 --> 01:21:32,520
I know exactly who he is cos he was
a member of my club when he was a
lad.
1192
01:21:32,520 --> 01:21:34,600
-And I'm not telling you that.
-Why?
1193
01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:35,640
I can't.
1194
01:21:42,600 --> 01:21:45,200
Everybody I meet goes,
"I know somebody who knows Banksy."
1195
01:21:45,200 --> 01:21:47,680
Then there's a few people
who go, "I know Banksy."
1196
01:21:47,680 --> 01:21:50,480
But they can't tell you.
Really, I mean, you know, so...
1197
01:22:11,840 --> 01:22:13,320
I mean, Donald Trump would love it.
1198
01:22:13,320 --> 01:22:16,000
Right, he's always on about leakers.
Banksy has no leakers.
1199
01:22:16,000 --> 01:22:19,520
How does it do that?
The White House is loaded with
leakers!
1200
01:22:19,520 --> 01:22:20,920
Banksy, no leakers!
1201
01:22:28,920 --> 01:22:32,760
Even if he wanted to come out
and become Banksy,
1202
01:22:32,760 --> 01:22:34,320
no one's going to believe it.
101456
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