All language subtitles for [English (auto-generated)] Interview With An Evil Child (AND WHERE SHE IS TODAY!) [DownSub.com]

are people afraid of you beth

beth thomas was just six years old when

her deep blue eyes shocked american

society after this documentary about her

life was broadcasted on television

undaunted and bored beth recounted how

she tried to murder her younger brother

when she was going to kill her parents

and why she had stolen knives from the

family kitchen

despite her short life she had suffered

brutal abuse from her biological father

the girl had been diagnosed with

reactive attachment disorder rad a

condition in which young children failed

to establish healthy bonds with their

parents or caregivers due to extreme

abuse

her signs of psychopathy had been

developed as a form of self-defense

against the outside world beth thomas

was adopted at 19 months old along with

their 7th month old brother jonathan by

tim and julie a conservative american

couple who had been married for 12 years

but were unable to have children of

their own

although tim mentioned not needing

children to make their lives complete

they decided to venture into adoption as

a means of sharing and transmitting the

completeness

julie seemed more excited about the idea

of adoption and mentioned that it was a

dream shared by both

finally in 1984 they were notified of

the availability of adoption of beth and

jonathan

they were surprised by the speed of the

process and they were told that they

were normal and healthy as if they were

children without a past like two blank

books

later they obtained information

regarding the living conditions that

both children had before their adoption

and discovered that the children lived

in a despicable environment

both showed signs of having been

mistreated and abandoned and their food

and hygiene conditions were precarious

beth showed signs of having been

sexually abused by her father and could

spend a whole day alone with a box of

cereal to eat

jonathan lived reclining in a crib

surrounded by urine and dirty diapers

and his head was misshapen from having

spent so much time in the same pose

while his back was completely flat his

forehead had bumps

the boy was seven months old and the

lack of stimulation had affected his

abilities he could not raise his head or

turn around

after a short time they noticed that

beth began to show aggressive and sexual

behaviors that were gradually increasing

mainly directed towards her brother but

also towards her adoptive parents and

domestic animals through hitting kicking

the use of pins to prick them pinching

her brother's genitals self-injurious

genital masturbation in public places

and confessions about wanting to kill

jonathan tim and julie

when they were overwhelmed by the

situation they decided to take beth to

dr ken maggot a clinical psychologist

specializing in abused children who

conducted this interview with beth

presented in the video when she was six

and a half years old

who's afraid of you ben

john

your brother

and what is your brother why is your

brother afraid of you

because i hurt him so much

okay

and

what

at night time what do your parents do to

your door

get shot

why do they lock it shut

because they don't want me to

hurt john

right and they're kind of afraid

of

of hurting john are you hurting john

okay

are they afraid that you might hurt them

yep

during the session with the therapist

beth was distant and jaded

she seemed destined to be a murderer and

lacking any ounce of empathy

would you bet

when would you do it

right

okay

why would you do night time

because i don't like don't say i make a

way

but they can kill me

and what would you do to him beth

okay what would you start with a knife

dearest pins and people

who

my brother

okay do you do it a little bit or

a lot

a lot

okay

and what are you trying to do to your

brother

why do you want your brother to die

because i was hurt so bad and i don't

want to be around people

okay

who else would you like to stick pins

into

mommy and daddy what would you like to

have happen to them

[Music]

jesus could have lived to save israel

yet chose to die to save the world tim

is the minister of a small methodist

church in the south

he and his wife julie have been married

for 12 years

unable to have children of their own

they decided to adopt

in february of 1984 they received a call

from the department of social services

telling them they had two children

available for adoption

they were told that beth 19 months old

and her brother jonathan seven months

old were normal and healthy

we did not need children to make our

lives complete

we felt secure in ourselves and securing

our relationship

but we wanted to share that with

somebody else and we felt like we had a

lot to pass on to a child and that was

what we really wanted to do

and when the phone call came it was like

at last it's here

it seemed like a miracle it happened so

quick

we'd heard of couples having to wait

five ten years on a child and here we

had two young children

um it was like the answer to our dream

their dream became a nightmare when they

realized that beth and jonathan had

severe emotional problems

beth and her brother eric were children

of a dysfunctional family

his father was an alcoholic and his

mother neglected early child rearing

also passing away a year and a half

after eric's birth

they had an older sister but she was

hardly home since she worked in a strip

club

her father sexually abused beth from

birth to three years at which point

social services took care of the

children

we had the kids with us

beth and her younger brother john for

uh probably a couple of months until we

begin to learn something about their

background and their past

and when we learned it

some things seem to fall in place about

her behavior and john's behavior

from several sources we discovered that

that they didn't have enough food to eat

that perhaps even

beth went all day maybe with just a box

of kick cereal

john himself

was found in a bassinet with

little patches of urine all over it and

a dirty diaper and a couple of bottles

at his feet that had curdled milk and

the back of his head was completely flat

the front of his head had bulged out and

at the seven months he couldn't raise

his head couldn't roll over

he was

just had no stimulation

and

we think perhaps that happened to beth

and it wasn't very long until

she began showing some signs of perhaps

even some abuse

there was a nightmare

that she had

and the nightmare was about

a man who was falling on her

and

hurting her with a part of himself

tell me about your birth father what was

that nightmare like

when he touched not the tennis

okay and talk lad

hearted a lot until it lagged

and um

wouldn't be me a lot

he'd hit on me

wouldn't be very nice to me how old were

you

one and

in your nightmare what happens

i get real scared

where are you in the nightmare what

happens in the dream

i'm in the house upstairs

and then what happens then

when he comes upstairs and um

how do you feel when you talk about this

scared

where's your birth where's your birth

father what's he doing

he's right there and there's his hand

his hands right there

where

right there you can't hardly see it

because it's green what's it touching

my vagina

and what is your birth father doing

hot nut

your face looks uh sad can you tell me

about that

[Music]

that's crying because there's

thoughts of the tears

when referring to the nightmares in

which a man fell on her and hurt her

beth implies that she was sexually

assaulted by her father

the repercussions of the abuse she had

suffered as a child had led to

uncontrollable anger

[Music]

beth had endured severe neglect and

abuse as a child

her birth mother died when she was one

because of these early childhood

experiences beth never developed a sense

of conscience love or trust for anyone

the early sexual abuse by her birth

father would cause her to exhibit

inappropriate sexual behavior especially

toward her brother

does your brother have private parts

um

yeah yeah what are what is his private

parts penis

and butts

and what do you do with your brother

with his private parts ben

i heard it

tell me about it what do you do

well

a pinch it

um

squeeze it

kick it

when you do things to your brother's

private parts what does he say stop

okay tell me that

well he says stop but i don't stop

do you hurt him

a lot

okay

and

would you like to do that to other boys

when i caught her with jonathan one

morning she was molesting him

he was crying and his pants were down

and i said beth what's happening

and she said i pulled his penis and

put my finger up his anus

and i said didn't he say to stop and she

said yeah i did

and i said did you and she said no

beth and her brother jonathan had lived

alongside their biological father in a

state of total abandonment

also as a result of her pain

beth sexually harassed her brother

have you ever rubbed your private parts

do you do it a lot a lot

how much do you do that

not every single day and let's see

i did it every single day until it got

well bad and messed up and i had to go

to the doctor and i did not like it

what what do you mean by real bad

well it looked real raw

got all kinds of boobies on it

charms

a lot of stuff from my hand and it bled

she started to masturbate at

inappropriate times

um

i remember one typically

when we were at the hospital waiting for

tim to come out he was there visiting

and beth and john were in the back seat

and i turned around and she had her legs

spread and was masturbating in a

public parking lot

and i had tried to explain to her

numerous times before that that that's

private area you don't do it in public

places

and

gone over that with her and

and it never seemed to face her

and um julie how often would your

daughter masturbate

daily

constantly do you have animals beth

four of them

can you tell me their names

cloudy shooky

darcy and annie and daddy said um a day

ago

that um there was a stray cat he did not

have a home so daddy is was taking care

of it

and took it to the vet when he started

there when he had a flight to go

and what do you do to the animals beth

they come with pants

do you stick them a little bit or a lot

a lot

what are you trying to do the animals

path kill them

what do they do when you stick them with

the pins

well annie cries

she's a dog

she got baby birds down out of the nest

and we thought maybe she was just

curious

so we explained that she could hurt them

um

put them back

and went through a hole sitting down and

talking to her about

the problem of it

and the next day we went out to check

the baby birds and they were on the

ground dead with her their necks broken

let's talk about what happened once when

you were smaller when you when you found

some baby birds in a tree what what did

you do then

i took them out

and what did mom say to you

um that the mother will not come back if

somebody touches her babies

are the baby birds kind of small can you

describe them for me

well they don't have their eyes open but

they can hear

hear me

and they look up

are they kind of helpless

little baby birds

can they fly well

can they run away

yes they can

are they easy to catch or hard to catch

yeah well it's hard to remember

with the baby birds what did you do

took them out of the food

and what did you do with them

right around too rough

also when at the end i picked it up and

i thought it was better and i came to

say

mommy

is this bird dead and she said

um

she called daddy and said

tim

and um

and then he came and um

i think i'll remember that they said yes

and so

so the little baby birds die

i don't know

you don't remember

i just remember

that i think i remember what mommy and

daddy saying the last bird boy got was

dead

do you know what mom said to me she said

that all of them were dead

did you squeeze him did baby best

squeeze him

you're doing a good job honey go ahead

and tell me what happened

i squished them

and what happened

i died

beth also wanted to kill her parents

with a knife and although she had never

killed a human being she tortured family

pets and even killed birds

the way she says it means she is

oblivious of the pain she inflicts on

others

but this kind of aggression and our

animals and even

our brother jonathan was beginning to

to grow to such an excess that our life

was miserable at home

we had

john would cry

uh in the mornings and say his stomach

hurt

we for the longest time we thought maybe

this child has

uh has some

problem with his intestinal area or

maybe has allergies and so we're trying

to get all that checked out

come to find out beth was coming out of

her room and hitting him in the stomach

and so as a last resort just to protect

him we had to tie our door shut so i

guess for what the last

three or four months now we've had to

tie her in at night

sort of barricade her

other times the girl waited until her

parents did not see her to hit her

younger brother hard in the stomach

in addition she was sticking pins into

him

the situation was unmanageable for the

parents who could not control the girl

to protect the brother they placed the

latch on beth's room and locked her in

at night to prevent her from continuing

to do harm

the repercussions of beth's tragic

childhood led to uncontrollable rage

despite the love and nurturing of her

adoptive parents she took this rage out

on herself

on her brother and on them her acts of

violence became more and more cruel and

frightening

well i noticed several

uh like pairing knives in the kitchen

missing

and my first thought was beth

and i felt a little guilty about it at

first i thought no

but um

i really didn't even mention it to her

they had been gone several weeks she was

sitting at the table drawing

and mentioned to me

what do those knives look like that are

gone mom

and i said what knives fifth

and

she said weren't they kind of silver and

about this big

and um

i knew then and then this little smile

that's not not a sweet smile but a

malicious

type of smile

and i knew then i thought she's got them

tell me about the knives where did you

get them

from the drawer

and where else

do you remember

tell me about it

i got them from the dishwasher

what kind of knives

um

and what do you want to do with those

knives

kill john and mommy with them and daddy

beth frankly admits that she wishes to

kill both her adoptive parents

her acts of violence were increasingly

cruel and chilling to the point where

she now had the weapons to accomplish

the killing

and when mommy asks you about

where the knives are what do you say

i don't know what they are

what did you think she might do with the

knives

my first thought was jonathan

and the reason we thought that was that

she had by this time she had tried to

kill john on several occasions and

openly admitted that

in the basement she was hitting his head

against a

cement floor

i heard his screams and ran down and had

to

literally pull her hands off and she

looked wild-eyed

did you get real mad at him

did you hit his head real hard

tell me about it

how many times did you do it a lot

what was the floor like

clean up

and what happened to your brother tell

me about it

his head hurt real bad

but his chin he had to have stitches in

it

could you stop

use your words back

okay

what was your brother doing when you

were doing this

what

what the toys okay

was he asking you to stop when you when

you were doing it

what was he saying

he said

stop

and what did you do

that didn't stop

i just kept on

hurting them

what were you thinking when you were

doing that

thinking of killing them

how did you stop

what made you stop

when i heard peter walking across

the kitchen

it made me stop because i thought mommy

and daddy would come

okay did mommy come

what did she do

she sent me to my mom

okay

um

and what if mom didn't stop you what

would you have done

kept on doing it

beth's outbursts of violence were

directed especially against jonathan who

on one occasion had to be hospitalized

after the girl repeatedly hit his head

on a concrete floor in an attempt to

take his life

if not for her parents this would

certainly have happened it was clear now

that beth had a psychological problem

and what about after evaluating the

extent of that psychological problems dr

mcgidd felt that for the well-being of

the family beth needed to be temporarily

separated from them

in april of 1989

her parents brought her to a special

home of the expert at raising children

with early attachment disorders

especially children who are dangerous to

themselves and others i have children

that have killed numerous times

cold-blooded family members neighbor

children

kill them

and they can do it makes my blood run

cold you think about nine years old

people don't think a nine-year-old is

capable of cold-blooded murder but they

are that attachment break

does severe damage to the heart the

ability to care and the ability to love

they don't care and they don't love

they're capable of anything

we're very strict

very strict about everything everything

is completely monitored we take complete

control because a child who's unattached

does not trust

and because they don't trust they don't

allow anybody to be boss of them

so we take complete control they are not

boss of anything they have to ask to get

a drink of water they have to ask to go

to the bathroom they have to ask to

leave our site part of that is because

we cannot trust them because of the

damage that they've done before

worried about the situation her adoptive

parents tried to help her in different

ways and took her to countless

specialists

the aggressions were incessant to the

point that it was impossible to continue

a healthy life

everything changed when they met the

therapist ken maggot a clinical

psychologist specializing in abused

children and victims of serious abuse

so traumatized during the first years of

life that they do not establish

emotional ties with other people

the doctor worked with children who

could not accept love who had no

conscience and who could hurt and even

kill without remorse

the proposal was an intensive behavior

modification therapy and part of the

sessions with beth were recorded and

formed part of the documentary

after assessing the extent of beth's

psychological problems the specialist

decided that it was best to separate her

from the rest of the family

in april 1989 the girl was taken to a

specialized residence for children with

attachment disorders that are danger to

themselves and others

there beth lived with minors who had

murdered in cold blood

the therapy consisted of imposing

extreme restrictions

beth had to ask permission for

everything including drinking water and

going to the bathroom

part of the goal was to rebuild beth's

self-esteem so that she perceived

herself as a person of value

beth would you like to say grace please

generally father thank you for this good

day

and everybody doing good

in jesus name

amen

believe that they're evil they believe

they're from the devil they believe that

they are not a person of value and we

have to change that and we have to build

that from a child who's nothing who's a

bad kid in their own mind to a child

who's valuable and loving and they see

themselves as that

[Music]

you don't have to bite this

when they do it you're well we can say

you did a good job you're a good worker

and then it just builds that self-esteem

little by little so that they change the

way that they see themselves

several months into treatment in this

controlled environment

beth had made progress and her therapist

decided to loosen some of the controls

[Music]

that continued to show signs of

improvement

she began to develop a sense of right

and wrong

she seemed to respond to affection

it was more outgoing

she went to public school

made friends at the local church

and even sang in the choir

and you're going to go into sunday

school again

yeah get stickers

maybe you could put one on your nose

[Music]

yeah it's a beard she's beard

here's his nose [ __ ]

yeah see his beard is kind of flowing in

the wind and everything

well that's that's where that's elisha

that's the

other prophet that took elijah's place

and he was left and there's elijah you

know

and he learned about sheep and the lord

is my shepherd

march 3rd you just got that yesterday

huh

[Music]

in the beginning we couldn't trust her

with anything she was locked up at night

we had alarms on the door at night so

she wasn't sneaking around doing things

with the other children

we don't worry about that anymore

there's no alarm on her door at night

now

she sleeps in the same room with my own

daughter and i trust her that much

she brushes the dogs and i trust her

that much

because she has earned that trust she's

learned it she's she has a heart and she

has a love inside and she feels bad when

she does something now

in the past because she didn't have a

conscience she didn't feel anything when

she did something bad there was just no

feeling there

and now she does feel bad and it shows

in her face

i believe that beth can make it

she's got a really bright mind she's got

a good heart now

which has done a lot of healing she's

got a really super set of parents

they're powerful they're knowledgeable

they're motivated

she's done a lot of good work with

you in therapy with canal and with

myself she wants to heal and that's the

number one key

and she wants to heal because she has a

family that really cares about her and

she wants to be with her

animal therapy also helped her empathize

in the controlled environment beth was

showing signs of improvement was even

beginning to develop a differentiation

between good and bad

at home she also had to feed various

farm animals and seemed to respond to

affection

she laughed and interacted with other

living beings and even hugged her

therapist

gradually beth began to have more

contact with other children was sent to

school became friends at church and

began participating in a choir

with less than a year of therapy beth's

attitude changed radically

do you know where that anger came from

that's when my birthday um

hurt me

i had it all inside and i remembered it

and i started doing it

and what did what did that do

when it was inside

it made me

want to hurt people really bad

and who did you hurt my brother

my mom and dad

and animals

and animals where did it hurt the most

my brother

me

why don't you tell me that

it hurt

it hurt me

the most how did it hurt you the most

because when i hurt

other people um

it had only been a couple of months

since beth had admitted that her wish

was to murder her brother and her

parents but the change was resounding

the girl expressed regret for how she

had treated her brother she no longer

harmed herself and lamented for having

hurt people after passing through the

residence beth began to feel empathy and

regretted having herded our loved ones

i'm burning my

dead itself

how you feel right now

it's kind of tough to talk about isn't

it

[Music]

beth gave her last interview from this

film in december of 1989

although she had made progress

she would still need extensive therapy

not all abused children are as deeply

scarred as beth

but all abused children suffer a

profound hurt for the rest of their

lives

the road to recovery is long and hard

for the abused child

there are more than one million new

victims of child abuse in america every

year

[Music]

over the years we can see beth as a

person with the capacity to empathize

and to be aware of the consequences of

her actions

obviously her apparent evil had its

genesis in the continued abuse of which

she was a victim as a baby and her case

serves to illustrate the dire

consequences of physical and

psychological abuse at a young age

currently beth leads a normal life and

works as a nurse

her professional merits have earned her

several awards

this case leads us to the following

conclusions the importance of good

parenting especially in critical periods

of the child

but it also tells us about the

effectiveness at least in this case of

psychological therapy even in cases of

extreme gravity and that may seem

irreconcilable

this total psychological recovery of

small beth could be achieved by raising

awareness to the child about their

actions to mend their self-esteem and

build the habits and social behavior

functional for example getting to accept

certain standards and to manage channel

and understand the reason for their

anger

you