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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:01:28,774 --> 00:01:33,210 As we began to contemplate evacuation, 2 00:01:33,211 --> 00:01:36,580 the question, the burning question was, 3 00:01:36,581 --> 00:01:38,381 "Who goes, 4 00:01:38,382 --> 00:01:40,861 and who gets left behind?" 5 00:01:53,861 --> 00:01:56,764 I borrowed a truck 6 00:01:56,765 --> 00:01:59,899 and I basically sent the signal to my folks, 7 00:01:59,900 --> 00:02:02,969 and this meant a group of South Vietnamese majors, 8 00:02:02,970 --> 00:02:06,139 lieutenant colonels, colonels and their families 9 00:02:06,140 --> 00:02:10,107 to muster at an address in downtown Saigon. 10 00:02:10,108 --> 00:02:14,211 I drove down there, they loaded up onto the truck, 11 00:02:14,212 --> 00:02:19,183 and I drove them to the airbase. 12 00:02:19,184 --> 00:02:21,384 And I had told them, "When you hear three thumps, 13 00:02:21,385 --> 00:02:23,954 "that means hold the babies' mouths. 14 00:02:23,955 --> 00:02:27,624 "Don't breathe, don't talk, don't make any noise 15 00:02:27,625 --> 00:02:30,059 because we're going through the gatepost." 16 00:02:30,060 --> 00:02:32,294 I saluted in uniform 17 00:02:32,295 --> 00:02:35,964 as a captain of the United States Army. 18 00:02:35,965 --> 00:02:37,698 The guard waved me through, 19 00:02:37,699 --> 00:02:40,033 and I drove straight out to the flight line 20 00:02:40,034 --> 00:02:43,904 to an aircraft that was awaiting. 21 00:02:43,905 --> 00:02:48,208 One Vietnamese colonel that was putting his family on the plane, 22 00:02:48,209 --> 00:02:53,245 he had wanted to stay in Vietnam to defend the country. 23 00:02:53,246 --> 00:02:57,448 And this full colonel had, like, eight kids and a wife. 24 00:02:57,449 --> 00:03:00,590 And he was in tears, the family... 25 00:03:05,590 --> 00:03:08,125 The family were in tears, 26 00:03:08,126 --> 00:03:11,028 and I said to him, "Get on the plane. 27 00:03:12,028 --> 00:03:14,763 "Just... go. 28 00:03:14,764 --> 00:03:15,764 Go." 29 00:03:18,633 --> 00:03:23,572 It was a terrible, terrible, terrible moral dilemma 30 00:03:23,573 --> 00:03:25,816 for everybody. 31 00:03:35,816 --> 00:03:40,519 We today have concluded an agreement to end the war 32 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:42,576 and bring peace with honor in Vietnam. 33 00:03:50,062 --> 00:03:53,964 We have adopted a plan for the complete withdrawal 34 00:03:53,965 --> 00:03:57,667 of all U.S. combat ground forces. 35 00:03:57,668 --> 00:04:01,573 We are finally bringing American men home. 36 00:04:03,573 --> 00:04:08,043 We who made the agreement 37 00:04:08,044 --> 00:04:10,478 thought that it would be the beginning 38 00:04:10,479 --> 00:04:12,479 not of peace in the American sense, 39 00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:15,716 but the beginning of a period of coexistence 40 00:04:15,717 --> 00:04:21,954 which might evolve as it did in Korea into two states. 41 00:04:21,955 --> 00:04:25,725 Reconciliation between North and South Vietnam 42 00:04:25,726 --> 00:04:28,594 we knew would be extremely difficult. 43 00:04:28,595 --> 00:04:32,767 But I was hopeful. 44 00:04:34,767 --> 00:04:37,268 Because of the Paris Agreement, 45 00:04:37,269 --> 00:04:40,406 American soldiers were going home. 46 00:04:41,406 --> 00:04:44,579 But I was on my way back to Vietnam. 47 00:04:48,579 --> 00:04:50,112 I was assigned to Saigon 48 00:04:50,113 --> 00:04:53,082 in the first week of August 1973, 49 00:04:53,083 --> 00:04:55,692 so about six months after the ceasefire. 50 00:05:05,494 --> 00:05:08,328 I would say that between the State Department people 51 00:05:08,329 --> 00:05:10,463 and CIA people, 52 00:05:10,464 --> 00:05:13,332 the contractors who were there to maintain infrastructure, 53 00:05:13,333 --> 00:05:14,600 maintain aircraft, 54 00:05:14,601 --> 00:05:17,335 as well as people like me, 55 00:05:17,336 --> 00:05:21,875 we had 5,000 to 7,000 Americans in country. 56 00:05:23,875 --> 00:05:28,112 A lot of the guys had Vietnamese girlfriends and wives, 57 00:05:28,113 --> 00:05:31,849 in many cases with children. 58 00:05:31,850 --> 00:05:36,451 In general, things were eerily calm 59 00:05:36,452 --> 00:05:41,256 and in many ways normal in Saigon. 60 00:05:41,257 --> 00:05:43,758 My sense was that we were gonna be there, 61 00:05:43,759 --> 00:05:46,896 you know, pretty much for a long time to come. 62 00:05:48,896 --> 00:05:53,200 I was assigned to the American embassy in Saigon. 63 00:05:53,201 --> 00:05:55,002 I was in charge 64 00:05:56,002 --> 00:06:00,405 of the 84 Marine security guards that were there, 65 00:06:00,406 --> 00:06:02,141 making sure that they kept up 66 00:06:02,142 --> 00:06:04,142 with their physical fitness training. 67 00:06:05,345 --> 00:06:09,114 We were there to protect American lives 68 00:06:09,115 --> 00:06:11,582 as well as American property. 69 00:06:11,583 --> 00:06:13,454 It was just a day-to-day job. 70 00:06:15,454 --> 00:06:21,026 The Ambassador there was a guy named Graham Martin, 71 00:06:22,026 --> 00:06:24,559 a North Carolinian, just as I was. 72 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:27,362 He spoke with a slow Southern drawl. 73 00:06:27,363 --> 00:06:28,963 He was a great gentleman. 74 00:06:28,964 --> 00:06:32,566 He was a cold warrior in the old stripe. 75 00:06:32,567 --> 00:06:36,970 He'd lost an adopted son in Vietnam to combat. 76 00:06:36,971 --> 00:06:41,040 And he was not gonna give up South Vietnam to the Communists. 77 00:06:41,041 --> 00:06:45,044 He was determined to keep U.S. aid 78 00:06:45,045 --> 00:06:46,783 flowing into Saigon. 79 00:06:49,783 --> 00:06:53,083 When the ceasefire occurred in 1973, 80 00:06:53,084 --> 00:06:56,153 everybody toasted it with Bloody Marys 81 00:06:56,154 --> 00:06:57,922 in the U.S. embassy. 82 00:06:57,923 --> 00:07:00,124 It was a grand party. 83 00:07:00,125 --> 00:07:03,494 We thought peace was at hand. 84 00:07:03,495 --> 00:07:08,435 But the Paris Peace Accord was a masterpiece of ambiguity. 85 00:07:11,746 --> 00:07:14,802 In order to get President Thieu and the South Vietnamese 86 00:07:14,803 --> 00:07:16,804 to go along with the Paris Agreement, 87 00:07:16,805 --> 00:07:19,141 President Nixon pulled out all the stops, 88 00:07:19,142 --> 00:07:21,708 and in a letter to President Thieu, 89 00:07:21,709 --> 00:07:24,378 he promised that if the North Vietnamese 90 00:07:24,379 --> 00:07:26,414 were to substantially violate 91 00:07:26,415 --> 00:07:28,448 the terms of the Paris Agreement, 92 00:07:28,449 --> 00:07:31,061 the United States would respond with full force. 93 00:07:32,019 --> 00:07:36,388 In other words, reenter the war. 94 00:07:36,389 --> 00:07:41,092 The North Vietnamese viewed Nixon as a madman. 95 00:07:41,093 --> 00:07:44,996 They were terrified of him. 96 00:07:44,997 --> 00:07:48,700 They believed that Nixon, if necessary, 97 00:07:48,701 --> 00:07:50,766 would bring back American air power. 98 00:07:50,767 --> 00:07:56,905 But in August 1974, he was gone. 99 00:07:56,906 --> 00:08:01,210 Nixon resigned because of Watergate. 100 00:08:01,211 --> 00:08:04,546 And overnight, everything changed. 101 00:08:04,547 --> 00:08:11,386 Hanoi suddenly saw the road to Saigon as being open. 102 00:08:40,678 --> 00:08:43,213 The South Vietnamese population 103 00:08:43,214 --> 00:08:47,116 had ample reason to fear the Vietnamese Communists. 104 00:08:47,117 --> 00:08:50,818 The Communist conduct throughout the course of the war 105 00:08:50,819 --> 00:08:54,254 had been violent and unforgiving. 106 00:08:54,255 --> 00:08:56,224 For example, when the city of Hue 107 00:08:56,225 --> 00:08:58,493 was taken over by the North Vietnamese, 108 00:08:58,494 --> 00:09:01,260 several thousand people on a long blacklist 109 00:09:01,261 --> 00:09:02,595 were rounded up... 110 00:09:02,596 --> 00:09:04,965 Schoolteachers, government civil servants, 111 00:09:04,966 --> 00:09:07,133 people who were known anti-Communists... 112 00:09:07,134 --> 00:09:09,969 And they were executed, 113 00:09:09,970 --> 00:09:11,971 in some cases even buried alive. 114 00:09:16,509 --> 00:09:19,847 So panic was but a millimeter away. 115 00:09:23,847 --> 00:09:27,451 Hundreds of thousands of refugees 116 00:09:27,452 --> 00:09:29,619 are in a blind rush to flee even further 117 00:09:29,620 --> 00:09:31,754 from the rapidly advancing Communists. 118 00:09:31,755 --> 00:09:33,089 Bruce Dunning reports. 119 00:09:33,090 --> 00:09:37,426 President Thieu broadcast a strong appeal 120 00:09:37,427 --> 00:09:39,695 to the soldiers and the people of Da Nang, 121 00:09:39,696 --> 00:09:42,745 urging them to stay and fight. 122 00:09:59,124 --> 00:10:01,513 As the enemy approaches, the panic has swept 123 00:10:01,514 --> 00:10:03,749 from the coastal city's crowded backstreets and pagodas 124 00:10:03,750 --> 00:10:05,483 onto runways at the airport. 125 00:10:05,484 --> 00:10:07,451 Our plane is surrounded here. 126 00:10:07,452 --> 00:10:10,421 I don't know how the hell we're gonna get out. 127 00:10:10,422 --> 00:10:11,955 We're racing down the runway, 128 00:10:11,956 --> 00:10:14,626 leaving behind hundreds and thousands of people. 129 00:10:16,626 --> 00:10:18,795 Another dozen of them running along, 130 00:10:18,796 --> 00:10:20,896 grabbing at the air stair. 131 00:10:20,897 --> 00:10:24,066 We're pulling them on as fast as we can. 132 00:10:24,067 --> 00:10:26,600 There's a sea of humanity jamming on. 133 00:10:26,601 --> 00:10:29,671 Impossible to stop the crowd. 134 00:10:29,672 --> 00:10:31,306 We're pulling away. 135 00:10:31,307 --> 00:10:32,574 We're leaving them behind. 136 00:10:32,575 --> 00:10:33,806 We're pulling up with the... 137 00:10:33,807 --> 00:10:35,908 People are falling off the air stairs! 138 00:10:35,909 --> 00:10:38,479 The plane is taking off. 139 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:42,114 It was every man for himself. 140 00:10:42,115 --> 00:10:45,084 So you saw the World Airways flight 141 00:10:45,085 --> 00:10:49,687 being mobbed by South Vietnamese soldiers. 142 00:10:49,688 --> 00:10:54,459 You saw ships with thousands of refugees, 143 00:10:54,460 --> 00:10:56,860 including lots of soldiers. 144 00:10:56,861 --> 00:10:58,865 You saw out-of-control panic. 145 00:11:00,865 --> 00:11:03,600 Basically any boats, trucks, airplanes, 146 00:11:03,601 --> 00:11:06,970 or anything going south 147 00:11:06,971 --> 00:11:10,643 were besieged by people wanting to get onboard. 148 00:11:13,643 --> 00:11:17,979 The Americans were gone, 149 00:11:17,980 --> 00:11:21,219 and as a result, the house of cards began to collapse. 150 00:11:25,219 --> 00:11:29,024 The North Vietnamese decided to escalate, 151 00:11:30,024 --> 00:11:32,957 escalate, escalate, escalate at every turn 152 00:11:32,958 --> 00:11:35,698 to see if the United States would react. 153 00:11:40,698 --> 00:11:45,034 In April of '75, I was with President Gerald Ford, 154 00:11:45,035 --> 00:11:48,604 and we were flying across the country on Air Force One 155 00:11:48,605 --> 00:11:51,374 when one of the airplane's crew 156 00:11:51,375 --> 00:11:53,609 comes and hands me a note, 157 00:11:53,610 --> 00:11:55,978 and it says, "Da Nang has fallen." 158 00:11:55,979 --> 00:12:00,148 Ford was bombarded by questions from the press 159 00:12:00,149 --> 00:12:03,552 after he got off Air Force One. 160 00:12:03,553 --> 00:12:06,321 Around 150,000 to 175,000 161 00:12:06,322 --> 00:12:10,957 well-trained North Vietnamese regular forces 162 00:12:10,958 --> 00:12:12,960 in violation of the Paris Peace Accords 163 00:12:12,961 --> 00:12:15,494 moved into South Vietnam. 164 00:12:15,495 --> 00:12:19,199 We have objected to that violation. 165 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:25,204 It's a tragedy unbelievable in its ramifications. 166 00:12:25,205 --> 00:12:30,508 We are now in a crisis. 167 00:12:30,509 --> 00:12:32,476 We had a wave of humanity: 168 00:12:32,477 --> 00:12:40,082 500,000 refugees rolling, rolling south towards Saigon, 169 00:12:40,083 --> 00:12:46,392 and 160,000 North Vietnamese troops moving right behind them. 170 00:12:50,392 --> 00:12:54,128 I had become so concerned, 171 00:12:54,129 --> 00:12:56,797 I decided to pull our best Vietnamese agents in 172 00:12:56,798 --> 00:12:58,465 out of the woodwork 173 00:12:58,466 --> 00:13:01,100 to try to see what they could tell us 174 00:13:01,101 --> 00:13:04,936 about Communist planning, which obviously was rapidly evolving. 175 00:13:04,937 --> 00:13:08,941 On the 8th of April, 176 00:13:08,942 --> 00:13:11,010 I met with one of our best agents, 177 00:13:12,010 --> 00:13:15,513 who said, "The Communists are gonna drive on Saigon. 178 00:13:15,514 --> 00:13:17,981 They're gonna be in there by Ho Chi Minh's birthday," 179 00:13:17,982 --> 00:13:22,119 which was May 19th, literally a month away. 180 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,388 Communist forces in South Vietnam, 181 00:13:24,389 --> 00:13:27,190 already solidly in control of 11 provinces, 182 00:13:27,191 --> 00:13:30,628 began working on yet another one today: Binh Dinh. 183 00:14:14,765 --> 00:14:16,831 I kept a map every day 184 00:14:16,832 --> 00:14:19,835 on the progress of the North Vietnamese onslaught. 185 00:14:19,836 --> 00:14:21,870 By the 5th of April, 186 00:14:21,871 --> 00:14:25,639 the North Vietnamese had 15, even 16 divisions 187 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:27,676 heading in the direction of Saigon. 188 00:14:27,677 --> 00:14:29,843 They were bringing SA-2 missiles down 189 00:14:29,844 --> 00:14:34,748 to provide anti-aircraft cover for their forces. 190 00:14:34,749 --> 00:14:36,249 There were people who were saying, 191 00:14:36,250 --> 00:14:38,850 "Look, we've gotta do some heavy, heavy planning here 192 00:14:38,851 --> 00:14:40,519 "because depending on how this goes, 193 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:43,955 and it doesn't look good now, we may all have to evacuate." 194 00:14:43,956 --> 00:14:46,490 And Ambassador Martin 195 00:14:46,491 --> 00:14:48,826 wouldn't tolerate or countenance such thought. 196 00:14:48,827 --> 00:14:50,262 That was defeatism. 197 00:14:50,263 --> 00:14:52,263 That was poisonous to the prospects 198 00:14:52,264 --> 00:14:55,832 of the people we're here to help. 199 00:14:55,833 --> 00:15:01,204 But people could see what was going on 200 00:15:01,205 --> 00:15:06,441 and they started leaving, especially the Americans. 201 00:15:06,442 --> 00:15:07,743 I'm leaving Vietnam. 202 00:15:07,744 --> 00:15:08,811 Why? 203 00:15:08,812 --> 00:15:10,512 I'm kind of scared, to be honest with you. 204 00:15:10,513 --> 00:15:12,379 To be perfectly honest with you, I'm really scared. 205 00:15:12,380 --> 00:15:15,653 I think the situation's a lot worse than we know about. 206 00:15:17,653 --> 00:15:22,288 There was always a standing evacuation plan in the embassy. 207 00:15:22,289 --> 00:15:24,691 It held that in an emergency, 208 00:15:24,692 --> 00:15:27,158 all Americans still in the country, 209 00:15:27,159 --> 00:15:31,730 about 6,000 people, would be evacuated 210 00:15:31,731 --> 00:15:38,572 and that no South Vietnamese would be evacuated with them. 211 00:15:40,572 --> 00:15:42,906 I was a student. 212 00:15:42,907 --> 00:15:44,642 The school's not closing, 213 00:15:44,643 --> 00:15:46,877 but it seemed like nobody's interested in school anymore. 214 00:15:46,878 --> 00:15:50,113 You can't stay here. 215 00:15:50,114 --> 00:15:51,815 You can't live with the Communists, 216 00:15:52,015 --> 00:15:56,317 especially if you have a connection with the Americans. 217 00:15:56,318 --> 00:15:59,625 Then you really gotta get out. 218 00:16:03,625 --> 00:16:07,961 If we really made up a list of endangered South Vietnamese, 219 00:16:07,962 --> 00:16:13,600 the ones who really worked closely with us during the war, 220 00:16:13,601 --> 00:16:16,734 this number could be 150,000, 200,000. 221 00:16:16,735 --> 00:16:21,273 Including their families, many more than that. 222 00:16:21,274 --> 00:16:23,608 But the idea of talking about an evacuation 223 00:16:23,609 --> 00:16:27,478 and of planning for an evacuation of Americans, 224 00:16:27,479 --> 00:16:30,248 let alone an evacuation of Vietnamese, 225 00:16:30,249 --> 00:16:34,417 was still anathema in the embassy. 226 00:16:34,418 --> 00:16:36,787 If you mean, "Is South Vietnam 227 00:16:36,788 --> 00:16:40,221 on the imminent verge of collapse?" 228 00:16:40,222 --> 00:16:43,325 I think the answer is quite definitely no. 229 00:16:43,326 --> 00:16:47,595 We were dealing with an ambassador 230 00:16:47,596 --> 00:16:51,566 who was just convinced that somehow, 231 00:16:51,567 --> 00:16:54,500 he was going to be able to pull this out 232 00:16:54,501 --> 00:16:57,271 and that there wouldn't have to be an evacuation 233 00:16:57,272 --> 00:16:59,338 and therefore, there wouldn't have to be a concern 234 00:16:59,339 --> 00:17:01,510 about evacuating South Vietnamese. 235 00:17:04,510 --> 00:17:09,980 The situation in South Vietnam has reached a critical phase 236 00:17:09,981 --> 00:17:14,451 requiring immediate and positive decisions by this government. 237 00:17:14,452 --> 00:17:18,288 There are tens of thousands 238 00:17:18,289 --> 00:17:22,392 of South Vietnamese employees of the United States government, 239 00:17:22,393 --> 00:17:24,028 of news agencies, 240 00:17:25,028 --> 00:17:29,098 of contractors and businesses for many years 241 00:17:29,099 --> 00:17:33,802 whose lives, with their dependents, 242 00:17:33,803 --> 00:17:38,472 are in very grave peril. 243 00:17:38,473 --> 00:17:42,508 I'm therefore asking the Congress 244 00:17:42,509 --> 00:17:46,145 to appropriate without delay $722 million 245 00:17:46,146 --> 00:17:50,716 for emergency military assistance for South Vietnam. 246 00:17:50,717 --> 00:17:54,452 If the very worst were to happen, 247 00:17:54,453 --> 00:18:00,491 at least allow the orderly evacuation of Americans 248 00:18:00,492 --> 00:18:06,497 and endangered South Vietnamese to places of safety. 249 00:18:06,498 --> 00:18:09,298 There was no way in 1975 250 00:18:09,299 --> 00:18:11,400 that the Congress was going to vote any money 251 00:18:11,401 --> 00:18:14,470 to go to the aid of South Vietnam. 252 00:18:14,471 --> 00:18:17,440 We had pulled out our troops in 1973 253 00:18:17,441 --> 00:18:21,343 and public opinion at that point shifted. 254 00:18:21,344 --> 00:18:25,412 The people of the United States, having seen Watergate, 255 00:18:25,413 --> 00:18:28,516 having seen the deception of the generals, 256 00:18:28,517 --> 00:18:33,118 weren't about to give any help in Southeast Asia. 257 00:18:33,119 --> 00:18:36,623 And you know, Kissinger knew this. 258 00:18:36,624 --> 00:18:40,358 We knew we were not going to get the $722 million. 259 00:18:40,359 --> 00:18:44,429 By that time it made no big difference, 260 00:18:44,430 --> 00:18:47,832 but President Ford said 261 00:18:47,833 --> 00:18:50,768 he owed it to Vietnam to make a request. 262 00:18:50,769 --> 00:18:54,738 We've sent, so to speak, battleship after battleship 263 00:18:54,739 --> 00:18:58,708 and bomber after bomber and 500,000 and more men 264 00:18:58,709 --> 00:19:02,377 and billions and billions of dollars. 265 00:19:02,378 --> 00:19:05,247 If billions and billions didn't do 266 00:19:05,248 --> 00:19:07,981 at a time when we had all our men there, 267 00:19:07,982 --> 00:19:11,155 how can $722 million save the day? 268 00:19:14,155 --> 00:19:17,990 This is the way my map looked in mid-April. 269 00:19:17,991 --> 00:19:21,028 The North Vietnamese just rolled down the coast. 270 00:19:22,028 --> 00:19:25,765 Saigon was clearly threatened. 271 00:19:25,766 --> 00:19:28,601 The situation was urgent. 272 00:19:28,602 --> 00:19:29,825 Urgent understates it. 273 00:19:32,070 --> 00:19:37,141 At this time, Ambassador Martin had been back in Washington 274 00:19:37,142 --> 00:19:39,910 trying to persuade Congress to vote additional aid. 275 00:19:39,911 --> 00:19:43,047 Do you have anything to say on your arrival? 276 00:19:43,048 --> 00:19:45,248 He has no statement to make. 277 00:19:45,249 --> 00:19:48,817 He came back to Saigon, 278 00:19:48,818 --> 00:19:50,952 and my boss, the CIA station chief, said, 279 00:19:50,953 --> 00:19:53,422 "Go down and tell the old man what's happening." 280 00:19:53,423 --> 00:19:55,757 I went and I said, "Mr. Ambassador, 281 00:19:55,758 --> 00:19:59,861 "half of the South Vietnamese Army has disintegrated. 282 00:19:59,862 --> 00:20:01,196 "We're in grave trouble. 283 00:20:02,029 --> 00:20:04,699 "Please, sir, plan for an evacuation. 284 00:20:04,700 --> 00:20:07,499 "At least allow us to begin putting together 285 00:20:07,500 --> 00:20:10,202 lists of South Vietnamese we should rescue." 286 00:20:10,203 --> 00:20:14,772 And he said, "No, Frank. 287 00:20:14,773 --> 00:20:17,242 "It's not so bleak. 288 00:20:17,243 --> 00:20:22,113 And I won't have this negative talk." 289 00:20:22,114 --> 00:20:25,216 Young officers in the embassy 290 00:20:25,217 --> 00:20:29,385 began to mobilize a black operation, 291 00:20:29,386 --> 00:20:35,324 meaning a makeshift underground railway evacuation 292 00:20:35,325 --> 00:20:38,326 using outgoing cargo aircraft 293 00:20:38,327 --> 00:20:43,530 that would be totally below the radar of the Ambassador. 294 00:20:43,531 --> 00:20:45,666 People like myself and others 295 00:20:45,667 --> 00:20:49,803 took the bull by the horns and organized an evacuation. 296 00:20:49,804 --> 00:20:52,672 In my case, that meant friends of mine 297 00:20:52,673 --> 00:20:56,742 who were senior officers in the South Vietnamese military. 298 00:20:56,743 --> 00:21:01,847 As the North Vietnamese came closer and closer to Saigon, 299 00:21:01,848 --> 00:21:04,086 these people were dead men walking. 300 00:21:08,086 --> 00:21:09,854 I had arranged a signal 301 00:21:09,855 --> 00:21:11,721 with my intelligence community friends 302 00:21:11,722 --> 00:21:13,924 that if I said, "I'm having a barbecue," 303 00:21:13,925 --> 00:21:16,593 that meant come to a certain pre-designated place 304 00:21:16,594 --> 00:21:18,829 and bring your families and only bring one suitcase 305 00:21:19,029 --> 00:21:21,197 because we're going to have a party. 306 00:21:21,198 --> 00:21:23,232 But it was understood the party meant 307 00:21:23,233 --> 00:21:24,971 I was going to get them out. 308 00:21:27,971 --> 00:21:31,739 Black Ops were essentially violating the rules... 309 00:21:31,740 --> 00:21:33,607 In this case meaning, 310 00:21:33,608 --> 00:21:36,810 you're not allowed to bring out Vietnamese military people 311 00:21:36,811 --> 00:21:41,147 who were under obligation to stand and fight. 312 00:21:41,148 --> 00:21:44,351 We were fully expecting if we got caught doing this 313 00:21:44,352 --> 00:21:46,052 that we would be run out of country. 314 00:21:46,053 --> 00:21:48,120 End of career, do not pass go. 315 00:21:48,121 --> 00:21:53,490 But sometimes there's an issue not of legal and illegal, 316 00:21:53,491 --> 00:21:55,163 but right or wrong. 317 00:21:57,163 --> 00:22:01,464 The deputy defense attaché moved out Vietnamese personnel 318 00:22:01,465 --> 00:22:06,368 and their families to Clark Air Base in the Philippines 319 00:22:06,369 --> 00:22:08,037 without any approval whatsoever, 320 00:22:08,038 --> 00:22:09,807 without any immigration papers, anything... 321 00:22:10,007 --> 00:22:12,575 Passports, you name it. 322 00:22:12,576 --> 00:22:15,344 And when they began showing up in the Philippines, 323 00:22:15,345 --> 00:22:17,746 Martin hit the roof and fired him! 324 00:22:17,747 --> 00:22:22,482 But that didn't stop other State Department people 325 00:22:22,483 --> 00:22:27,188 who had Vietnamese friends and family members. 326 00:22:27,189 --> 00:22:30,067 They continued to organize these makeshift airlifts. 327 00:22:42,067 --> 00:22:44,835 TERRY McNAMARA: That April, I was in Can Tho, 328 00:22:44,836 --> 00:22:48,038 which was about 100 miles from Saigon. 329 00:22:48,039 --> 00:22:49,739 And we were getting reports 330 00:22:49,740 --> 00:22:53,343 of this town falling and that province falling and so on. 331 00:22:53,344 --> 00:22:57,278 And then we were attacked. 332 00:22:57,279 --> 00:23:02,451 Sergeant Hasty came by to give me a report on the damage. 333 00:23:02,452 --> 00:23:06,453 Can Tho came under pretty intense artillery bombardment. 334 00:23:06,454 --> 00:23:09,324 The North Vietnamese had overrun 335 00:23:09,325 --> 00:23:13,794 some South Vietnamese artillery batteries 336 00:23:13,795 --> 00:23:21,701 and managed to turn those around and shell the center of Can Tho. 337 00:23:21,702 --> 00:23:25,005 We knew that the situation was bad. 338 00:23:26,005 --> 00:23:31,742 We could see that the South Vietnamese Army was eroding. 339 00:23:31,743 --> 00:23:34,210 Supplies had been cut off 340 00:23:34,211 --> 00:23:37,551 and you could see the armaments dwindling. 341 00:23:41,551 --> 00:23:45,422 McNAMARA: We were, under the terms of the Paris Agreement, 342 00:23:45,423 --> 00:23:49,391 committed to resupplying the South Vietnamese. 343 00:23:49,392 --> 00:23:52,294 They lacked simple things, like barbed wire 344 00:23:52,295 --> 00:23:54,563 and bags for sand bags. 345 00:23:56,832 --> 00:24:00,433 They were rationing their artillery shells 346 00:24:00,434 --> 00:24:03,069 because they were running out. 347 00:24:03,070 --> 00:24:05,337 The military support, the material support, 348 00:24:05,338 --> 00:24:07,374 was not coming. 349 00:24:07,375 --> 00:24:12,377 When President Ford went before the Congress, 350 00:24:12,378 --> 00:24:17,548 he had two major concerns. 351 00:24:17,549 --> 00:24:24,454 The first was to save as many people as we could. 352 00:24:24,455 --> 00:24:27,056 He cared for the human beings involved; 353 00:24:27,057 --> 00:24:29,124 they were not just pawns 354 00:24:29,125 --> 00:24:33,030 that once they had lost their military power were abandoned. 355 00:24:34,030 --> 00:24:39,166 The second was the honor of America, 356 00:24:39,167 --> 00:24:45,639 that we would not be seen at the final agony of South Vietnam 357 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,747 as having stabbed it in the back. 358 00:24:53,747 --> 00:24:56,883 Congress wouldn't pass it. 359 00:24:56,884 --> 00:24:59,317 They said, "No more. 360 00:24:59,318 --> 00:25:04,456 No more troops, no more money, no more aid to the Vietnamese." 361 00:25:04,457 --> 00:25:12,328 Well, I had to go into President Ford's office to tell him. 362 00:25:12,329 --> 00:25:15,565 I had never heard Ford use a curse word 363 00:25:15,566 --> 00:25:17,467 in all the time I'd known him. 364 00:25:17,468 --> 00:25:21,970 But when I showed him this story, he said, 365 00:25:21,971 --> 00:25:23,454 "Those sons of bitches." 366 00:25:40,654 --> 00:25:43,623 I think there were a total of 50 ships that were there. 367 00:25:43,624 --> 00:25:45,624 I mean, it wasn't just us; it was a whole bunch of ships. 368 00:25:45,625 --> 00:25:51,299 We were standing by for the evacuation of Americans. 369 00:25:54,299 --> 00:25:56,633 I was a terrible letter writer. 370 00:25:56,634 --> 00:25:59,236 I would write one letter for my wife's ten letters, 371 00:25:59,237 --> 00:26:00,938 and she didn't like that, so she said, 372 00:26:00,939 --> 00:26:02,872 "We're going to exchange tapes." 373 00:26:02,873 --> 00:26:04,941 So I would run into my stateroom, 374 00:26:04,942 --> 00:26:07,043 turn the tape recorder on for a couple of minutes 375 00:26:07,044 --> 00:26:08,411 and tell her what's happening. 376 00:26:08,412 --> 00:26:10,679 I really don't know where to start. 377 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:14,516 It's been such an unusual couple days for us. 378 00:26:14,517 --> 00:26:19,452 We went with the rest of this huge task force of ours 379 00:26:19,453 --> 00:26:23,757 up into about, oh, 20 miles off the coast, 380 00:26:23,758 --> 00:26:25,529 basically east of Saigon. 381 00:26:29,529 --> 00:26:34,400 As most Navy operations are, it was very carefully planned. 382 00:26:34,401 --> 00:26:36,636 We planned it to death. 383 00:26:38,636 --> 00:26:42,105 The chain of command, as I understood it 384 00:26:42,106 --> 00:26:44,541 as a captain of the United States Marine Corps, 385 00:26:44,542 --> 00:26:47,443 and I think I got it right, 386 00:26:47,444 --> 00:26:49,813 is that for any evacuation, 387 00:26:49,814 --> 00:26:52,315 that decision is the Ambassador's decision. 388 00:26:52,316 --> 00:26:58,187 Graham Martin is the responsible guy. 389 00:26:58,188 --> 00:26:59,854 But the military is responsible 390 00:26:59,855 --> 00:27:01,489 for giving him all kinds of plans. 391 00:27:01,490 --> 00:27:05,460 And this is how we got into the four options. 392 00:27:05,461 --> 00:27:08,461 The first option was 393 00:27:08,462 --> 00:27:11,632 you would take commercial ships right up the Saigon River 394 00:27:11,633 --> 00:27:14,066 to a couple blocks from the embassy. 395 00:27:14,067 --> 00:27:15,567 You would load whoever you wanted 396 00:27:15,568 --> 00:27:21,772 to bring out on these ships and you'd be done with it. 397 00:27:21,773 --> 00:27:23,508 The second option was, you know, 398 00:27:23,509 --> 00:27:27,612 United and Continental and Flying Tiger Airlines 399 00:27:27,613 --> 00:27:30,347 were still using Tan Son Nhut Air Force Base at the time, 400 00:27:30,348 --> 00:27:32,650 and you could've brought anybody you wanted out 401 00:27:32,651 --> 00:27:36,518 by commercial aviation. 402 00:27:36,519 --> 00:27:39,355 The third option was military fixed-wing aviation... 403 00:27:39,356 --> 00:27:42,924 The C5As, the C-141s, which carry a lot of people. 404 00:27:42,925 --> 00:27:45,925 You could've brought them out of Tan Son Nhut on those. 405 00:27:48,832 --> 00:27:51,566 The very last option, the very last option, 406 00:27:51,567 --> 00:27:53,401 was helicopters off the carriers 407 00:27:53,402 --> 00:27:55,603 in the Tan Son Nhut Air Force Base. 408 00:27:55,604 --> 00:27:59,239 We had 75 Marine Corps helicopters out there. 409 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:00,641 The helicopter option, 410 00:28:00,642 --> 00:28:02,508 that was absolutely the last resort. 411 00:28:02,509 --> 00:28:04,043 You know, they don't go very fast, 412 00:28:04,044 --> 00:28:05,978 they don't carry that many people. 413 00:28:05,979 --> 00:28:07,868 That was if everything else failed. 414 00:28:18,656 --> 00:28:24,094 I got into Vietnam late on the 24th of April, 1975. 415 00:28:24,095 --> 00:28:29,632 Saigon was full of rumor, of false stories, 416 00:28:29,633 --> 00:28:32,200 whether we were going to have a last attempt 417 00:28:32,201 --> 00:28:35,136 to draw a line across the country, 418 00:28:35,137 --> 00:28:37,972 that Saigon and the south would remain a free republic, 419 00:28:37,973 --> 00:28:39,206 all of these things, 420 00:28:39,207 --> 00:28:40,740 and it was all churning all around. 421 00:28:40,741 --> 00:28:44,679 The fighting was close to Saigon 422 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:49,214 but hadn't shown up in the streets of Saigon. 423 00:28:49,215 --> 00:28:51,418 I served as a naval officer 424 00:28:51,419 --> 00:28:53,951 in three and a half tours in Vietnam, 425 00:28:53,952 --> 00:28:56,422 two of those years as a Special Forces advisor 426 00:28:56,423 --> 00:29:00,991 with a 20-boat River Division, all Vietnamese. 427 00:29:00,992 --> 00:29:04,729 I could tell jokes and hear jokes in Vietnamese. 428 00:29:04,730 --> 00:29:06,596 And once you start off like that, 429 00:29:06,597 --> 00:29:11,735 you eventually end up being able to dream in Vietnamese. 430 00:29:11,736 --> 00:29:16,639 In 1975, my mission was to remove or destroy 431 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:18,941 as many ships, swift boats, 432 00:29:18,942 --> 00:29:23,077 anything that I considered to be a benefit to the enemy. 433 00:29:23,078 --> 00:29:25,979 I met with Captain Do Kiem, 434 00:29:25,980 --> 00:29:29,499 who was the operations officer of the Vietnamese Navy. 435 00:29:46,499 --> 00:29:48,933 The plan was to sail 436 00:29:48,934 --> 00:29:52,036 all the large ships of the South Vietnamese Navy 437 00:29:52,037 --> 00:29:55,306 down the Saigon River to the sea 438 00:29:55,307 --> 00:29:59,409 and rendezvous at Con Son Island. 439 00:29:59,410 --> 00:30:02,444 We had to keep this secret. 440 00:30:02,445 --> 00:30:05,015 If word got out, it would have had an effect 441 00:30:06,015 --> 00:30:08,293 on the morale of the people in the street. 442 00:30:13,855 --> 00:30:17,825 JOE McBRIDE: We knew that there were roughly 5,000 Americans 443 00:30:17,826 --> 00:30:20,727 still in the country. 444 00:30:20,728 --> 00:30:24,031 Many of them had Vietnamese wives, mistresses, whatever. 445 00:30:25,031 --> 00:30:28,334 Just hadn't left. 446 00:30:28,335 --> 00:30:30,469 And they were basically letting us know, 447 00:30:30,470 --> 00:30:33,137 "We're not leaving without our families." 448 00:30:33,138 --> 00:30:37,842 Finally, we were given authority by the Ambassador 449 00:30:37,843 --> 00:30:41,511 to bypass the immigration laws 450 00:30:41,512 --> 00:30:44,984 and send these Vietnamese out of the country. 451 00:30:46,984 --> 00:30:48,918 So then we started an operation 452 00:30:48,919 --> 00:30:52,889 basically to get out the Americans 453 00:30:52,890 --> 00:30:54,761 and their Vietnamese dependents. 454 00:30:59,628 --> 00:31:01,462 It was not an official evacuation. 455 00:31:01,463 --> 00:31:05,000 We still had no organized plan 456 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:10,303 for evacuating high-risk South Vietnamese 457 00:31:10,304 --> 00:31:11,837 because we had an ambassador 458 00:31:11,838 --> 00:31:13,706 who was making up his mind on the wing. 459 00:31:13,707 --> 00:31:15,973 The President also asked Congress 460 00:31:15,974 --> 00:31:17,910 for authorization to use American troops here 461 00:31:17,911 --> 00:31:19,243 to evacuate Americans 462 00:31:19,244 --> 00:31:20,845 and Vietnamese who worked for Americans. 463 00:31:20,846 --> 00:31:22,381 If it were necessary. 464 00:31:22,382 --> 00:31:23,948 Do you have plans for that? 465 00:31:23,949 --> 00:31:26,784 Well, of course, every embassy in the world has plans for it. 466 00:31:26,785 --> 00:31:28,518 Do you think it will be necessary? 467 00:31:28,519 --> 00:31:31,787 That again, you see, is a judgment 468 00:31:31,788 --> 00:31:36,692 that I can't possibly make at this time. 469 00:31:36,693 --> 00:31:39,761 We have been reducing the population here 470 00:31:39,762 --> 00:31:41,896 as measure of prudency 471 00:31:41,897 --> 00:31:43,966 and will take measures to reduce it further 472 00:31:43,967 --> 00:31:47,168 as a question of prudence. 473 00:31:47,169 --> 00:31:50,505 The Ambassador was extremely skittish, 474 00:31:50,506 --> 00:31:54,475 and I guess understandably so, about talking about evacuation, 475 00:31:54,476 --> 00:31:56,777 about sending signals that an evacuation 476 00:31:56,778 --> 00:31:59,778 was being planned or even executed. 477 00:31:59,779 --> 00:32:03,286 He feared it would trigger a panic. 478 00:32:07,286 --> 00:32:09,754 It time to get out. 479 00:32:09,755 --> 00:32:14,858 And in Saigon at that time, it was like, "Who do you know?" 480 00:32:14,859 --> 00:32:16,971 The the key word would be "connection." 481 00:32:18,864 --> 00:32:22,731 There's a lot of people, they try to get their money 482 00:32:22,732 --> 00:32:25,168 because if the people have money, 483 00:32:25,169 --> 00:32:29,238 maybe they will find a connection to get out. 484 00:32:29,239 --> 00:32:31,874 You know, and so, "You want to go? 485 00:32:31,875 --> 00:32:33,808 Give me this kind of money." 486 00:32:33,809 --> 00:32:36,710 One guy said to me, 487 00:32:36,711 --> 00:32:39,046 "Your family, tell them to come to the boat dock. 488 00:32:39,047 --> 00:32:41,181 I'll be waiting for them." 489 00:32:41,182 --> 00:32:45,256 Of course they took the money, but they never got us. 490 00:32:48,256 --> 00:32:52,423 There was chaos in Saigon at that time. 491 00:32:52,424 --> 00:32:58,296 Everybody was looking for ways to get out as soon as possible. 492 00:32:58,297 --> 00:33:01,833 Of course, the Americans we worked with 493 00:33:01,834 --> 00:33:04,500 had a plan in place for us. 494 00:33:04,501 --> 00:33:09,839 They told us to get to the meeting place, 495 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:17,212 which was a safe house near the American embassy, 496 00:33:17,213 --> 00:33:21,357 and to wait for buses to come to pick us up. 497 00:33:30,180 --> 00:33:31,958 If we were gonna get people out, 498 00:33:31,959 --> 00:33:33,625 we were gonna have to make it happen 499 00:33:33,626 --> 00:33:36,595 and deliver the Vietnamese to the big airplanes 500 00:33:36,596 --> 00:33:40,431 in some form or fashion. 501 00:33:40,432 --> 00:33:42,267 And the only way we could do that 502 00:33:42,268 --> 00:33:45,984 was keeping the airport open as long as we could. 503 00:34:01,984 --> 00:34:05,021 Ambassador Martin still hoped that somehow, 504 00:34:06,021 --> 00:34:09,923 this thing would not end with the North Vietnamese 505 00:34:09,924 --> 00:34:15,194 humiliating the United States by attacking Saigon. 506 00:34:15,195 --> 00:34:20,971 But it seemed like the North Vietnamese had other ideas. 507 00:34:42,586 --> 00:34:45,754 What may be the final battle of Saigon has begun. 508 00:34:45,755 --> 00:34:48,591 Communist ground forces have started moving in 509 00:34:48,592 --> 00:34:50,792 on Saigon's Tan Son Nhut Airport. 510 00:34:50,793 --> 00:34:53,428 Rockets exploded all over the base, 511 00:34:53,429 --> 00:34:56,932 touching off three major fires. 512 00:34:57,766 --> 00:35:00,433 The air base was under continuous artillery fire. 513 00:35:00,434 --> 00:35:02,435 I felt the rounds. 514 00:35:02,436 --> 00:35:05,071 They were so close, 515 00:35:05,072 --> 00:35:08,575 the shrapnel was plinking against the fence behind us. 516 00:35:08,576 --> 00:35:14,318 It was abundantly clear that it was a whole new ball game. 517 00:35:20,318 --> 00:35:23,321 We never expected any trouble out there. 518 00:35:23,322 --> 00:35:27,658 And then, of course, fear a little bit set in 519 00:35:27,659 --> 00:35:30,861 because now we knew that it really meant business, you know? 520 00:35:30,862 --> 00:35:34,596 Were they gonna continue shelling Tan Son Nhut? 521 00:35:34,597 --> 00:35:38,567 They had given us a warning, you know? 522 00:35:38,568 --> 00:35:40,005 "Get out." 523 00:35:43,005 --> 00:35:46,908 As the sun came up, General Smith, 524 00:35:46,909 --> 00:35:49,977 who was our defense attaché out at Tan Son Nhut, 525 00:35:49,978 --> 00:35:52,111 contacted the Ambassador and said, 526 00:35:52,112 --> 00:35:53,781 "The plan to use the fixed-wing 527 00:35:53,782 --> 00:35:55,381 "to get a few thousand people out today 528 00:35:55,382 --> 00:35:57,616 "isn't gonna work. 529 00:35:57,617 --> 00:36:01,421 "And we need to consider that this is it. 530 00:36:01,422 --> 00:36:02,754 "Option 4: 531 00:36:02,755 --> 00:36:06,390 a heavy-lift helicopter evacuation." 532 00:36:06,391 --> 00:36:11,162 And Ambassador Martin wouldn't hear of it. 533 00:36:11,163 --> 00:36:12,763 He said, "I want to come out there. 534 00:36:12,764 --> 00:36:14,698 I want to see it," and which he did. 535 00:36:14,699 --> 00:36:16,598 He got in a sedan. 536 00:36:16,599 --> 00:36:18,334 He didn't lack for guts. 537 00:36:18,335 --> 00:36:22,038 There were still rounds coming in... 538 00:36:22,039 --> 00:36:24,484 Sporadic, but there was still artillery fire. 539 00:36:27,143 --> 00:36:30,210 And he could see that the main runway 540 00:36:30,211 --> 00:36:34,214 was full of craters from North Vietnamese artillery. 541 00:36:34,215 --> 00:36:37,084 And it was understood that General Smith 542 00:36:37,085 --> 00:36:41,791 was not being premature with the recommendation for Option 4. 543 00:36:44,791 --> 00:36:48,828 McBRIDE: Ambassador Martin's concern very clearly up to now 544 00:36:48,829 --> 00:36:52,464 was that once we started an official evacuation, 545 00:36:52,465 --> 00:36:57,968 it's pretty obvious that the game is over. 546 00:36:57,969 --> 00:37:00,136 You've got to remember, this is an ambassador 547 00:37:00,137 --> 00:37:05,475 who had lost his only son in combat in Vietnam. 548 00:37:05,476 --> 00:37:09,779 One becomes pretty invested in that country. 549 00:37:09,780 --> 00:37:12,614 He had been holding out hope 550 00:37:12,615 --> 00:37:17,319 that some kind of third-party solution could be worked out 551 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,654 so that South Vietnam could continue 552 00:37:20,655 --> 00:37:25,259 with some form of independence or autonomy. 553 00:37:25,260 --> 00:37:27,660 And he was being encouraged 554 00:37:27,661 --> 00:37:31,263 to think that this might be possible. 555 00:37:31,264 --> 00:37:33,933 But the morning of the 29th, 556 00:37:33,934 --> 00:37:38,641 he came to accept the fact that that wasn't going to happen. 557 00:37:42,641 --> 00:37:44,776 And I picked up the phone 558 00:37:44,777 --> 00:37:49,513 and told Secretary Kissinger to inform the President 559 00:37:49,514 --> 00:37:52,452 that I had decided we would have to go to Option 4. 560 00:37:55,452 --> 00:37:59,754 When I tell President Ford the airport is being shelled 561 00:37:59,755 --> 00:38:03,857 and that it's now time to pull the plug, 562 00:38:03,858 --> 00:38:06,028 he keeps coming back time and again, 563 00:38:07,028 --> 00:38:09,932 "You really think we have to do it?" 564 00:38:11,932 --> 00:38:15,535 That's how heartbreaking it was for him. 565 00:38:15,536 --> 00:38:21,009 He finally reluctantly gave the go-ahead 566 00:38:22,009 --> 00:38:24,612 for the final evacuation. 567 00:38:27,612 --> 00:38:31,016 This is the American Forces Vietnam Network. 568 00:38:32,016 --> 00:38:35,021 The prearranged signal for the evacuation 569 00:38:36,021 --> 00:38:39,522 was broadcast on American radio in Saigon. 570 00:38:39,523 --> 00:38:41,491 The message was, 571 00:38:41,492 --> 00:38:44,861 "The temperature is 105 and rising," 572 00:38:44,862 --> 00:38:49,531 and then Bing Crosby's "White Christmas." 573 00:38:49,532 --> 00:38:52,001 And sure enough, about 10:00 in the morning, 574 00:38:53,001 --> 00:38:55,636 I believe, on the 29th, 575 00:38:55,637 --> 00:39:00,573 there was Bing Crosby on the airwaves. 576 00:39:00,574 --> 00:39:09,915 ♪ I'm dreaming of a white Christmas ♪ 577 00:39:09,916 --> 00:39:20,158 ♪ Just like the ones I used to know ♪ 578 00:39:20,159 --> 00:39:30,899 ♪ Where the treetops glisten and children listen ♪ 579 00:39:30,900 --> 00:39:38,305 ♪ To hear sleigh bells in the snow... ♪ 580 00:39:38,306 --> 00:39:40,542 That morning, Ambassador Martin 581 00:39:40,543 --> 00:39:44,111 received a message that said within 24 hours, 582 00:39:44,112 --> 00:39:47,281 the U.S. presence in Vietnam had to be closed out, 583 00:39:47,282 --> 00:39:50,415 meaning we had to be gone. 584 00:39:50,416 --> 00:39:53,021 It was obvious that there was the need 585 00:39:54,021 --> 00:39:57,890 for a hasty plan to be developed 586 00:39:57,891 --> 00:40:01,027 for a helicopter airlift out of the embassy to the fleet. 587 00:40:02,027 --> 00:40:06,062 And we had less than 24 hours to pull it off. 588 00:40:06,063 --> 00:40:09,600 McBRIDE: That morning, there must have been, I would guess, 589 00:40:09,601 --> 00:40:14,604 at least 10,000 people literally ringing the embassy. 590 00:40:14,605 --> 00:40:18,941 The embassy compound was the size of a city block. 591 00:40:18,942 --> 00:40:20,509 It was big. 592 00:40:20,510 --> 00:40:25,913 And all sides of it were filled 200, 300 feet back. 593 00:40:25,914 --> 00:40:29,850 Fortunately, people were by and large very controlled. 594 00:40:29,851 --> 00:40:33,319 They were very patient. 595 00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:37,491 They were just hoping desperately to get in. 596 00:40:37,492 --> 00:40:40,926 It's like the whole of Saigon 597 00:40:40,927 --> 00:40:44,763 want to get inside the American embassy. 598 00:40:44,764 --> 00:40:47,799 So you have to know somebody, you know? 599 00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:51,937 If you're like me, I find my friend 600 00:40:51,938 --> 00:40:56,607 and got a little paper to ensure us to get in. 601 00:40:56,608 --> 00:40:59,410 So several of us went to the embassy. 602 00:40:59,411 --> 00:41:01,611 Then my friend, he showed the paper to the guard, 603 00:41:01,612 --> 00:41:04,781 and he's just kind of pointing at each one of us, 604 00:41:04,782 --> 00:41:08,350 and we, one by one, could go inside of the embassy. 605 00:41:08,351 --> 00:41:12,821 When I first got in, I feel so good. 606 00:41:12,822 --> 00:41:16,790 "I'm in America... I'm almost there." 607 00:41:16,791 --> 00:41:19,926 They have a courtyard and a swimming pool, 608 00:41:19,927 --> 00:41:23,495 and we mostly gather around the swimming pool. 609 00:41:23,496 --> 00:41:28,204 And 1,000 people there, and they just keep coming in. 610 00:41:32,204 --> 00:41:36,908 That morning, CIA choppers began picking up evacuees 611 00:41:36,909 --> 00:41:39,710 off the roofs of buildings around the city 612 00:41:39,711 --> 00:41:42,215 and bringing them to the embassy. 613 00:41:45,215 --> 00:41:49,720 There was an old pilot named O.B. Harnage. 614 00:41:49,721 --> 00:41:53,888 He was blind in one eye and lame in one leg. 615 00:41:53,889 --> 00:41:59,127 And I said, "Harnage, we got people at 6 Gia Long. 616 00:41:59,128 --> 00:42:02,897 You gotta go pick them up." 617 00:42:02,898 --> 00:42:09,502 It was the deputy CIA station chief's apartment building. 618 00:42:09,503 --> 00:42:13,339 There were a number of very high-risk Vietnamese, 619 00:42:13,340 --> 00:42:16,542 including the defense minister of South Vietnam, 620 00:42:16,543 --> 00:42:19,812 all waiting to be rescued. 621 00:42:19,813 --> 00:42:23,848 As they climbed up the ladder to the roof, 622 00:42:23,849 --> 00:42:27,584 a photographer took that famous photograph. 623 00:42:27,585 --> 00:42:30,788 Many people thought that was the U.S. embassy. 624 00:42:30,789 --> 00:42:32,422 It wasn't. 625 00:42:32,423 --> 00:42:36,359 But it indicated to what extent chaos had descended 626 00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:38,601 on this entire operation. 627 00:42:44,601 --> 00:42:46,267 Inside the embassy, 628 00:42:46,268 --> 00:42:50,104 everywhere we looked was teeming with Vietnamese. 629 00:42:50,105 --> 00:42:52,739 We counted them, and the total number 630 00:42:52,740 --> 00:42:56,209 was about 2,800. 631 00:42:56,210 --> 00:42:58,155 There was no hiding it that somehow, 632 00:42:58,658 --> 00:43:01,547 people had to have let these people into the embassy. 633 00:43:01,548 --> 00:43:03,649 Was it, you know, 634 00:43:03,650 --> 00:43:06,718 Marine security guards who kind of looked the other way? 635 00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:09,488 Was it American employees in the embassy 636 00:43:09,489 --> 00:43:12,189 who were doing kind of what we did with black ops 637 00:43:12,190 --> 00:43:14,993 and taking care of their own? 638 00:43:14,994 --> 00:43:17,393 We never got to the bottom of that 639 00:43:17,394 --> 00:43:21,497 and frankly, we never pursued it. 640 00:43:21,498 --> 00:43:23,033 One of the Marines said to me, 641 00:43:23,034 --> 00:43:24,500 "You know, we should take out the tailor." 642 00:43:24,501 --> 00:43:29,439 There was a tailor who made all our civilian clothes. 643 00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:31,306 So I said, 644 00:43:31,307 --> 00:43:33,241 "Why don't we take out the cook too?" 645 00:43:33,242 --> 00:43:35,176 He said, "Well, you should take out the cook too, 646 00:43:35,177 --> 00:43:36,511 "and all the other cooks. 647 00:43:36,512 --> 00:43:38,080 "They should get out. 648 00:43:38,081 --> 00:43:40,281 They had business with Americans." 649 00:43:40,282 --> 00:43:42,283 So they took the bread truck 650 00:43:42,284 --> 00:43:45,752 and they rounded up the tailor, the cooks and the dishwashers, 651 00:43:45,753 --> 00:43:47,854 a few others and their families, 652 00:43:47,855 --> 00:43:51,695 and drove them into the embassy compound. 653 00:43:56,695 --> 00:43:59,665 There was in the parking lot of the embassy 654 00:43:59,666 --> 00:44:02,265 a great tamarind tree, 655 00:44:02,266 --> 00:44:05,236 which the Ambassador had often referred to 656 00:44:05,237 --> 00:44:10,640 as "steadfast as the American commitment in Vietnam." 657 00:44:10,641 --> 00:44:12,810 The CIA station chief that last morning said, 658 00:44:13,010 --> 00:44:15,622 "Mr. Ambassador, we have to cut this tree down." 659 00:44:18,181 --> 00:44:22,183 You could not land any large helicopters on the parking lot 660 00:44:22,184 --> 00:44:26,721 unless the tree and all the shrubbery was all gone. 661 00:44:26,722 --> 00:44:31,191 The Ambassador had resisted us cutting that tree 662 00:44:31,192 --> 00:44:35,495 because he did not want anybody to be alerted 663 00:44:35,496 --> 00:44:38,064 that we were doing any sort of evacuation 664 00:44:38,065 --> 00:44:40,399 or were going to do any sort of evacuation. 665 00:44:43,302 --> 00:44:45,005 He was upset. 666 00:44:46,005 --> 00:44:50,207 But finally he succumbed, you know, to just common sense 667 00:44:50,208 --> 00:44:52,076 and gave up his, uh... 668 00:44:52,077 --> 00:44:53,944 I guess you could call it a dream. 669 00:44:53,945 --> 00:44:56,114 And we cut it down. 670 00:45:01,318 --> 00:45:03,986 He had also, for the past few days, 671 00:45:03,987 --> 00:45:07,189 prevented us from burning classified documents 672 00:45:07,190 --> 00:45:10,491 for fear that it would panic the South Vietnamese. 673 00:45:10,492 --> 00:45:13,426 So that morning of the 29th, 674 00:45:13,427 --> 00:45:17,531 we had thousands of pages of classified documents 675 00:45:17,532 --> 00:45:22,234 we had failed to destroy beforehand. 676 00:45:22,235 --> 00:45:25,437 Our next job was just looking at that classified document idea 677 00:45:25,438 --> 00:45:27,038 and getting rid of that. 678 00:45:27,039 --> 00:45:29,642 So we went to every office 679 00:45:29,643 --> 00:45:32,143 and told them to start pulling stuff, 680 00:45:32,144 --> 00:45:35,812 and piles and piles of paper began coming out. 681 00:45:35,813 --> 00:45:38,088 And we began shredding. 682 00:45:44,088 --> 00:45:48,890 There was a small building where we handled the pay 683 00:45:48,891 --> 00:45:52,962 for the Vietnamese who worked for the embassy. 684 00:45:52,963 --> 00:45:54,763 And in this building, 685 00:45:54,764 --> 00:45:57,631 there was over $1 million in U.S. currency. 686 00:45:57,632 --> 00:46:02,303 So we had to send a message to the Navy, 687 00:46:02,304 --> 00:46:03,937 who sent it to the Treasury Department, 688 00:46:03,938 --> 00:46:05,573 who came back and said, "Destroy it." 689 00:46:05,574 --> 00:46:11,109 So I assigned a few Marines to get rid of the money. 690 00:46:11,110 --> 00:46:14,279 And I said, "Oh, by the way, we're gonna lock you in there." 691 00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:17,058 It took them eight hours to burn a million dollars. 692 00:46:19,052 --> 00:46:21,520 That morning, 693 00:46:21,521 --> 00:46:25,522 fear and desperation were the order of the day. 694 00:46:25,523 --> 00:46:27,058 But I had a job to do, 695 00:46:27,059 --> 00:46:29,359 and it was an important job to do, I thought, 696 00:46:29,360 --> 00:46:32,385 to deny the enemy the South Vietnamese Naval ships. 697 00:46:59,385 --> 00:47:01,453 We had expected, frankly, 698 00:47:01,454 --> 00:47:03,288 a longer time period to get ready. 699 00:47:04,023 --> 00:47:07,091 We had been told by people in our intelligence community 700 00:47:07,092 --> 00:47:09,127 that we might have as long as the 4th of May, 701 00:47:09,128 --> 00:47:13,596 but the North Vietnamese were closing in quite tightly, 702 00:47:13,597 --> 00:47:16,431 and clearly it was time to send the signal to leave. 703 00:47:42,255 --> 00:47:45,058 I knew this, 704 00:47:45,059 --> 00:47:47,192 but I didn't know how many civilians 705 00:47:47,193 --> 00:47:48,727 were gonna be on board. 706 00:47:48,728 --> 00:47:50,632 I had no idea. 707 00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:36,003 I was the first one into the embassy. 708 00:48:37,003 --> 00:48:39,437 And my only mission at this time, 709 00:48:39,438 --> 00:48:41,573 this is early in the afternoon, was to bring the Ambassador out. 710 00:48:41,574 --> 00:48:45,642 It was actually a mission that was called "Embassy Snatch." 711 00:48:45,643 --> 00:48:48,779 I was just supposed to get the Ambassador. 712 00:48:48,780 --> 00:48:50,948 I land and I said to the people, 713 00:48:50,949 --> 00:48:54,417 I said, "I'm here to get the Ambassador." 714 00:48:54,418 --> 00:48:56,618 Well, not quite. 715 00:48:56,619 --> 00:49:01,422 The Ambassador refused to leave until he could get 716 00:49:01,423 --> 00:49:06,261 as many Vietnamese on as many choppers as possible. 717 00:49:06,262 --> 00:49:10,564 The evacuation of Vietnamese happened 718 00:49:10,565 --> 00:49:14,643 because Graham Martin wanted it to happen. 719 00:49:24,643 --> 00:49:29,381 So they loaded some Vietnamese onto my helicopter 720 00:49:29,382 --> 00:49:31,216 and because I'm supposed to have the Ambassador on board, 721 00:49:31,217 --> 00:49:34,051 we go right to the command ship, the USS Blue Ridge. 722 00:49:36,121 --> 00:49:39,723 We land on the Blue Ridge, General Carey comes out, 723 00:49:39,724 --> 00:49:41,558 wants to know where the Ambassador is. 724 00:49:41,559 --> 00:49:43,359 I said, "Well, he didn't get on." 725 00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:45,227 I mean, I don't know who I'm supposed to tell, 726 00:49:45,228 --> 00:49:47,129 but I told everybody I was supposed to get the Ambassador 727 00:49:47,130 --> 00:49:48,497 but the Ambassador didn't get on. 728 00:49:48,498 --> 00:49:50,902 So that starts the lift. 729 00:49:52,902 --> 00:49:57,437 Like I say, we had 75 Marine Corps helicopters. 730 00:49:57,438 --> 00:50:00,306 You and your wingman would fly into the embassy, 731 00:50:00,307 --> 00:50:03,310 get your passengers loaded, 732 00:50:03,311 --> 00:50:06,686 and fly back out to the ships. 733 00:50:14,686 --> 00:50:17,235 It was a little over an hour back and forth. 734 00:50:32,235 --> 00:50:34,904 On the USS Kirk, our mission was 735 00:50:34,905 --> 00:50:36,738 to protect the helicopters moving 736 00:50:36,739 --> 00:50:38,908 from the embassy out to the aircraft carriers 737 00:50:38,909 --> 00:50:40,942 and back and forth. 738 00:50:40,943 --> 00:50:42,721 We were very close to the action. 739 00:50:46,014 --> 00:50:48,415 You could stand there on the deck 740 00:50:48,416 --> 00:50:51,484 and you could watch it all happening. 741 00:50:51,485 --> 00:50:54,153 We thought that the USS Kirk was just going to be 742 00:50:54,154 --> 00:50:57,457 an observer to this whole thing 743 00:50:57,458 --> 00:50:58,758 and when all of a sudden 744 00:50:58,759 --> 00:51:01,292 on radar we started seeing these little blips 745 00:51:01,293 --> 00:51:03,727 coming out from the shore. 746 00:51:03,728 --> 00:51:05,997 I really don't know where to start. 747 00:51:05,998 --> 00:51:08,265 We looked up at the horizon and all you could see 748 00:51:08,266 --> 00:51:12,035 were helicopters all heading toward us. 749 00:51:12,036 --> 00:51:14,370 These were not Marine Corps helicopters. 750 00:51:14,371 --> 00:51:17,372 They were small helicopters, the little Hueys, 751 00:51:17,373 --> 00:51:21,143 which were never part of the evacuation plan. 752 00:51:21,144 --> 00:51:23,645 But they were flying over top of us. 753 00:51:23,646 --> 00:51:24,680 We were watching them fly 754 00:51:24,681 --> 00:51:27,585 over top over and over and over again. 755 00:51:30,585 --> 00:51:34,824 We viewed them as enemy until we could verify who it was. 756 00:51:36,824 --> 00:51:39,158 Then we realized that these 757 00:51:39,159 --> 00:51:43,330 were South Vietnamese trying to escape. 758 00:51:43,331 --> 00:51:44,763 I figured if we could save one, 759 00:51:44,764 --> 00:51:47,866 at least we'd save 15, 20 people. 760 00:51:47,867 --> 00:51:52,736 They were packed in there like sardines. 761 00:51:52,737 --> 00:51:54,872 So I made the decision. 762 00:51:54,873 --> 00:51:58,109 Land the helicopter. 763 00:51:58,110 --> 00:52:00,910 One of our sailors could speak rudimentary Vietnamese. 764 00:52:00,911 --> 00:52:04,046 So we put him on the radio and he started broadcasting. 765 00:52:04,047 --> 00:52:05,814 "This is ship 1087. 766 00:52:05,815 --> 00:52:09,618 Land here." 767 00:52:09,619 --> 00:52:12,288 So, we got his attention. 768 00:52:12,289 --> 00:52:15,890 He came flying over and landed on our flight deck. 769 00:52:15,891 --> 00:52:18,893 And it turned out that the pilot, he was the pilot 770 00:52:18,894 --> 00:52:22,529 for the deputy chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. 771 00:52:22,530 --> 00:52:24,698 Real high up. 772 00:52:24,699 --> 00:52:27,801 And he had the general with him, who was a two-star general, 773 00:52:28,001 --> 00:52:31,638 and the two-star general's nephew, three women, 774 00:52:31,639 --> 00:52:34,038 and about four children. 775 00:52:34,039 --> 00:52:37,308 It was a big deal for us. 776 00:52:37,309 --> 00:52:39,343 When it landed, we got everything off. 777 00:52:39,344 --> 00:52:41,279 And I looked up because there were five, six, 778 00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:44,848 seven stacked up ready to land. 779 00:52:44,849 --> 00:52:48,084 Turned out all throughout the southern part of Vietnam 780 00:52:48,085 --> 00:52:52,388 there were South Vietnamese Army and Air Force installations 781 00:52:52,389 --> 00:52:54,624 with one or two or three or four helicopters. 782 00:52:54,625 --> 00:52:57,526 And those helicopters were flyable. 783 00:52:57,527 --> 00:52:59,662 Their pilots were there. 784 00:52:59,663 --> 00:53:02,696 And when they realized that the evacuation was happening 785 00:53:02,697 --> 00:53:04,966 and they weren't going to be part of it, they said, 786 00:53:04,967 --> 00:53:07,602 "Oh yeah, we are." 787 00:53:07,603 --> 00:53:11,071 These young Vietnamese pilots would go to their homes, 788 00:53:11,072 --> 00:53:14,508 land right in their front yards, pick up their families 789 00:53:14,509 --> 00:53:16,810 and anybody else, and head out to sea, 790 00:53:16,811 --> 00:53:18,611 hoping they can rendezvous with a ship. 791 00:53:18,612 --> 00:53:22,751 Well, we're one of the first ships they saw. 792 00:53:25,751 --> 00:53:27,752 Our flight deck will only take 793 00:53:27,753 --> 00:53:29,721 one helicopter at a time landing. 794 00:53:29,722 --> 00:53:31,187 There are no wheels on them. 795 00:53:31,188 --> 00:53:32,689 They just have skids. 796 00:53:32,690 --> 00:53:34,959 We couldn't think of what else to do and these other planes 797 00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:36,694 were looking for a place to land 798 00:53:36,695 --> 00:53:39,995 so we just physically pushed them. 799 00:53:39,996 --> 00:53:42,332 Of course, this was a big old helicopter, thousands of pounds, 800 00:53:42,333 --> 00:53:44,801 so we had to figure out how to get it 15 feet over 801 00:53:45,001 --> 00:53:46,806 to the edge of the flight deck. 802 00:53:50,006 --> 00:53:52,406 You don't have time to think about what you did, 803 00:53:52,407 --> 00:53:53,675 you just had to do it. 804 00:53:54,675 --> 00:53:57,620 So, we open up our flight deck and they begin to land, 805 00:53:58,012 --> 00:54:01,513 one right after the other. 806 00:54:01,514 --> 00:54:04,621 Some of them were shot at, holes in them. 807 00:54:07,621 --> 00:54:10,622 Most of the Vietnamese who came out, I'm talking 808 00:54:10,623 --> 00:54:14,158 about the flight crews, they were heavily armed, 809 00:54:14,159 --> 00:54:16,727 all with side arms, some with M-16 rifles. 810 00:54:16,728 --> 00:54:20,163 They had no idea what was going to happen so they came out 811 00:54:20,164 --> 00:54:22,001 ready for anything, really. 812 00:54:23,001 --> 00:54:25,407 So we had to disarm them. 813 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:32,540 None of them had ever landed on a ship before. 814 00:54:32,541 --> 00:54:33,810 They were Vietnamese Air Force. 815 00:54:34,010 --> 00:54:36,845 Everybody had a gun and we took all the guns away from them. 816 00:54:36,846 --> 00:54:39,214 Then about five minutes later another one came in and landed. 817 00:54:39,215 --> 00:54:42,186 And we pushed his airplane over the side. 818 00:54:45,186 --> 00:54:47,520 That was the second one. 819 00:54:47,521 --> 00:54:50,288 I helped push that one over, too. 820 00:54:50,289 --> 00:54:51,857 Then the third plane came in. 821 00:54:51,858 --> 00:54:53,158 It landed also. 822 00:54:53,159 --> 00:54:54,660 We pushed it over the side. 823 00:54:54,661 --> 00:54:57,928 So meanwhile, we've thrown three helicopters in the water so far. 824 00:54:57,929 --> 00:54:59,296 This is incredible. 825 00:54:59,297 --> 00:55:01,899 I know you probably don't believe any of this, 826 00:55:01,900 --> 00:55:03,914 but it's all true. 827 00:55:16,914 --> 00:55:18,846 By late afternoon, 828 00:55:18,847 --> 00:55:21,403 the chopper flow at the embassy really started. 829 00:55:25,176 --> 00:55:26,788 And each time a bird came in, 830 00:55:26,789 --> 00:55:28,890 here would go another 40, 50 people. 831 00:55:28,891 --> 00:55:33,429 But did the right mix of people get out? 832 00:55:35,418 --> 00:55:37,863 You know, who says that these were the people 833 00:55:37,864 --> 00:55:40,232 who either deserved or should have gone out? 834 00:55:40,233 --> 00:55:44,102 At the embassy a lot of the people who got out 835 00:55:44,103 --> 00:55:47,407 happened to be good wall jumpers. 836 00:55:49,407 --> 00:55:52,609 The choppers started coming in at ten-minute intervals. 837 00:55:52,610 --> 00:55:53,944 One would land on the roof 838 00:55:53,945 --> 00:55:57,381 and one would land on the parking lot. 839 00:55:57,382 --> 00:55:59,771 They would put all the Vietnamese in groups, 840 00:55:59,971 --> 00:56:02,218 they would search them, and if they had any weapons 841 00:56:02,219 --> 00:56:05,687 all those weapons were thrown into the swimming pool. 842 00:56:05,688 --> 00:56:09,290 And as soon as the chopper would land they would be brought 843 00:56:09,291 --> 00:56:13,895 into the restricted area where a couple of the Marines 844 00:56:13,896 --> 00:56:16,634 would escort them into the aircraft. 845 00:56:19,634 --> 00:56:24,543 Then they would raise the ramp up and take off. 846 00:56:29,543 --> 00:56:31,776 I remember I talked to my friend 847 00:56:31,777 --> 00:56:33,812 and he said, "Oh, it's our turn now. 848 00:56:33,813 --> 00:56:34,946 We're almost there." 849 00:56:34,947 --> 00:56:36,670 You know, so we're all excited. 850 00:56:37,784 --> 00:56:40,451 And I remember very distinctively that every time 851 00:56:40,452 --> 00:56:42,587 the helicopter coming down it just blew us away. 852 00:56:42,588 --> 00:56:44,053 We have to kind of duck down 853 00:56:44,054 --> 00:56:46,262 to fight with the wind of the chopper. 854 00:56:53,262 --> 00:56:56,431 Three of the choppers that came in each landed a platoon 855 00:56:56,432 --> 00:56:58,266 of 40 Marines from the task force. 856 00:56:58,812 --> 00:57:02,035 And they had to be brought in because we didn't have enough 857 00:57:02,036 --> 00:57:06,378 Marines in the embassy security guard to secure the walls. 858 00:57:11,378 --> 00:57:15,150 I went with my wife to the embassy. 859 00:57:17,150 --> 00:57:23,355 A lot of people, they clenched to the top of the wall, 860 00:57:23,356 --> 00:57:24,745 but they couldn't get in. 861 00:57:34,231 --> 00:57:38,767 Each gate was besieged like that, 862 00:57:38,768 --> 00:57:43,337 although the side gate was the principal place where they came. 863 00:57:43,338 --> 00:57:46,207 People holding letters saying, 864 00:57:46,208 --> 00:57:47,776 you know, "I worked for the Americans. 865 00:57:47,777 --> 00:57:48,780 Please let me in." 866 00:57:52,780 --> 00:57:56,783 Journalists were arriving and counting on being recognized 867 00:57:56,784 --> 00:57:58,362 to be let in by the Marines. 868 00:58:09,362 --> 00:58:12,196 There was a sea of people 869 00:58:12,197 --> 00:58:16,600 wanting to get out by helicopters. 870 00:58:16,601 --> 00:58:23,040 But, well, they looked up at the helicopters leaving 871 00:58:23,041 --> 00:58:27,042 and I could see their eyes. 872 00:58:27,043 --> 00:58:28,155 Desperate eyes. 873 00:58:40,155 --> 00:58:42,122 My dad flew a Chinook helicopter 874 00:58:42,123 --> 00:58:45,491 in the South Vietnamese Air Force. 875 00:58:45,492 --> 00:58:49,395 He had been waiting for orders but his captain had, 876 00:58:49,396 --> 00:58:52,198 you know, basically just left. 877 00:58:52,199 --> 00:58:55,033 So he and some other pilots 878 00:58:55,034 --> 00:58:58,574 picked out the best Chinooks and took off. 879 00:59:03,574 --> 00:59:06,179 He said it was the Wild West at this point. 880 00:59:09,179 --> 00:59:12,582 Just you and your horse and you just do what you had to do 881 00:59:12,583 --> 00:59:15,183 to survive and take care of your family. 882 00:59:15,184 --> 00:59:18,319 He had given my mom a heads-up 883 00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:23,424 that if she did hear a Chinook coming, to get ready. 884 00:59:23,425 --> 00:59:26,393 I was six and a half years old. 885 00:59:26,394 --> 00:59:28,261 I can still hear the rumbling, 886 00:59:28,262 --> 00:59:32,466 a very, you know, familiar rumbling of a Chinook. 887 00:59:32,467 --> 00:59:34,500 When you hear the Chinook coming, you know it's coming. 888 00:59:34,501 --> 00:59:35,890 I knew my dad was coming. 889 00:59:39,373 --> 00:59:41,741 In Saigon, during my childhood, 890 00:59:41,742 --> 00:59:46,611 it was like, say, living in the middle of busy L.A. 891 00:59:46,612 --> 00:59:51,348 So, there's really not a big area to land the Chinook. 892 00:59:51,349 --> 00:59:57,886 So he came in and landed in a play field. 893 00:59:57,887 --> 01:00:01,723 Caused a lot of wind, caused a lot of commotion. 894 01:00:01,724 --> 01:00:04,792 My mom grabbed my little sister, 895 01:00:04,793 --> 01:00:07,062 who was about six months at that time, 896 01:00:07,063 --> 01:00:08,964 and I have a little brother who was 897 01:00:08,965 --> 01:00:11,832 about three or four years old, and myself. 898 01:00:11,833 --> 01:00:18,305 We quickly ran into the Chinook and we all flew off 899 01:00:18,306 --> 01:00:22,210 out into the Pacific Ocean. 900 01:00:24,210 --> 01:00:27,712 My dad was afraid for not having enough fuel, 901 01:00:27,713 --> 01:00:29,366 afraid for a lot of things. 902 01:00:30,916 --> 01:00:33,283 He was just flying blind. 903 01:00:33,284 --> 01:00:36,423 And then he saw a ship out there. 904 01:00:38,423 --> 01:00:41,424 In the middle of the day, after we had taken 905 01:00:41,425 --> 01:00:43,893 those first helicopters aboard, 906 01:00:43,894 --> 01:00:47,129 this huge helicopter called a Chinook, 907 01:00:47,130 --> 01:00:49,931 it came out and tried to land on the ship. 908 01:00:49,932 --> 01:00:52,701 And oh, we almost... the thing almost crashed onboard our ship. 909 01:00:52,702 --> 01:00:54,703 This big Chinook showed up. 910 01:00:54,704 --> 01:00:58,473 There's no way he could land 911 01:00:58,474 --> 01:01:00,107 on Kirk without impacting the ship. 912 01:01:00,108 --> 01:01:04,143 He would have killed everybody on this helicopter plus my crew. 913 01:01:04,144 --> 01:01:07,413 It was way too big to land. 914 01:01:07,414 --> 01:01:11,116 We thought that the helicopter would just fly away. 915 01:01:11,117 --> 01:01:14,553 But as the ship was moving forward probably four, five, 916 01:01:14,554 --> 01:01:17,388 six knots, something like that, the pilot communicated 917 01:01:17,389 --> 01:01:19,857 that he was running low on fuel. 918 01:01:19,858 --> 01:01:23,727 He opened up the port side of the helicopter and he hovered 919 01:01:23,728 --> 01:01:25,962 across the stern of the Kirk. 920 01:01:25,963 --> 01:01:29,469 Then, all of a sudden, here comes a human. 921 01:01:31,469 --> 01:01:34,203 One by one, we jump out. 922 01:01:34,204 --> 01:01:36,205 I jumped out, my brother jumped out. 923 01:01:36,206 --> 01:01:42,845 My mom was holding my sister, obviously very scared. 924 01:01:42,846 --> 01:01:48,348 And she just, you know, just trustingly, just with one hand, 925 01:01:48,349 --> 01:01:52,084 with her right hand, holding on with her left to brace herself, 926 01:01:52,085 --> 01:01:56,589 you know, just dropped my baby sister. 927 01:01:56,590 --> 01:01:59,725 One fella is standing there and he said he looked up 928 01:01:59,726 --> 01:02:02,194 and he saw this big bundle of stuff come flying out 929 01:02:02,195 --> 01:02:03,729 and it was a baby. 930 01:02:03,730 --> 01:02:05,342 It was the one-year-old baby. 931 01:02:07,967 --> 01:02:12,303 And then the mother jumped out and he caught her, too. 932 01:02:12,304 --> 01:02:17,441 Then the pilot flew out on our starboard, right side. 933 01:02:17,442 --> 01:02:22,578 He hovered with his wheels in and out of the water. 934 01:02:22,579 --> 01:02:24,647 He hovered there for like ten minutes and we couldn't 935 01:02:24,648 --> 01:02:26,348 figure out what he was doing and it turned out 936 01:02:26,349 --> 01:02:28,517 what he was doing was taking his flight suit off. 937 01:02:28,518 --> 01:02:32,888 Here's a man flying a twin rotor helicopter by himself, 938 01:02:32,889 --> 01:02:36,556 and at the same time he's taking off a flight suit. 939 01:02:36,557 --> 01:02:38,658 How you do it, I've talked to helicopter pilots 940 01:02:38,659 --> 01:02:41,227 and they can't figure out how he did that, you know, how... 941 01:02:41,228 --> 01:02:43,363 like a Houdini, trying to get out of this thing. 942 01:02:43,364 --> 01:02:46,433 And finally, he made the helicopter roll to the right 943 01:02:46,434 --> 01:02:51,237 as he stepped out the door on the left. 944 01:02:55,007 --> 01:02:58,109 Just thunderous loud noise. 945 01:02:58,110 --> 01:03:03,879 The shrapnel is just blowing up. 946 01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:05,585 And suddenly just quiet. 947 01:03:08,585 --> 01:03:09,852 And he pops up. 948 01:03:09,853 --> 01:03:11,188 And he's alive. 949 01:03:14,157 --> 01:03:16,625 And he swam away. 950 01:03:16,626 --> 01:03:18,326 And the helicopter was only about 20 feet from him 951 01:03:18,327 --> 01:03:20,383 when it hit the water; it was amazing. 952 01:03:22,531 --> 01:03:24,198 We went out and picked him up. 953 01:03:24,199 --> 01:03:25,832 He was none, no worse for the wear. 954 01:03:25,833 --> 01:03:27,834 He was a little bit wet. 955 01:03:27,835 --> 01:03:31,104 Only one unfortunate thing is he had some small bars of gold, 956 01:03:31,105 --> 01:03:32,805 which was all his worldly possessions, 957 01:03:33,005 --> 01:03:36,475 that were in his shirt pocket and it sank. 958 01:03:36,476 --> 01:03:37,843 So he lost everything. 959 01:03:37,844 --> 01:03:39,511 He didn't own a thing but his underwear 960 01:03:39,512 --> 01:03:42,314 when he finally came aboard the ship. 961 01:03:42,315 --> 01:03:46,283 He was a tremendous pilot. 962 01:03:46,284 --> 01:03:49,986 The guy was just so cool and calm. 963 01:03:49,987 --> 01:03:55,191 We've so far taken a total of 17 helicopters. 964 01:03:55,192 --> 01:03:58,735 We ended up with 157 people aboard this ship. 965 01:04:05,735 --> 01:04:08,069 And that crew was very special. 966 01:04:08,070 --> 01:04:11,071 They went, they took their money, went to the Navy exchange 967 01:04:11,072 --> 01:04:14,508 and commissary, bought all the clothes and food they could get, 968 01:04:14,509 --> 01:04:17,643 took it up and gave it to the refugees they had befriended. 969 01:04:17,644 --> 01:04:20,648 They were unbelievable. 970 01:04:22,648 --> 01:04:26,151 We laid mats and all kinds of blankets and stuff out 971 01:04:26,152 --> 01:04:27,685 on the deck for the babies. 972 01:04:27,686 --> 01:04:29,587 And there were all kinds of... there were infants 973 01:04:29,588 --> 01:04:31,788 and children and women, 974 01:04:31,789 --> 01:04:34,461 and oh, it was a scene I'll never forget. 975 01:04:37,461 --> 01:04:38,928 We were happy. 976 01:04:38,929 --> 01:04:42,098 My mom was just, you know, wow. 977 01:04:42,099 --> 01:04:44,433 Symbolically, it was like, you know, the first step 978 01:04:44,434 --> 01:04:48,947 onto not American soil, but American freedom. 979 01:05:37,647 --> 01:05:39,314 When we started the evacuation 980 01:05:39,315 --> 01:05:41,816 we were very, very excited about it. 981 01:05:41,817 --> 01:05:44,585 Then your next emotion probably was 982 01:05:44,586 --> 01:05:47,975 just determined to get this job done and get these people out. 983 01:05:50,757 --> 01:05:53,660 And then, later as it went on you became fatigued 984 01:05:53,661 --> 01:05:56,861 and frustrated that you could never make a dent in the amount 985 01:05:56,862 --> 01:06:00,969 of people that were coming out of the embassy. 986 01:06:02,169 --> 01:06:05,035 You'd ask questions like, was the crowd getting any smaller? 987 01:06:05,036 --> 01:06:07,238 "When are we going to finish this?" you know. 988 01:06:07,239 --> 01:06:08,705 And they'd say, 989 01:06:08,706 --> 01:06:10,573 "You know, we're under orders from the Ambassador. 990 01:06:10,574 --> 01:06:13,377 We're doing the best we can." 991 01:06:13,378 --> 01:06:14,745 Carrier pilots were saying, 992 01:06:14,746 --> 01:06:18,614 look, it's an uncontrollable sea of people 993 01:06:18,615 --> 01:06:21,884 and Ambassador Martin has lost his objectivity, 994 01:06:21,885 --> 01:06:23,986 that Ambassador Martin is trying to evacuate 995 01:06:23,987 --> 01:06:26,690 all of Saigon through the U.S. embassy. 996 01:06:28,690 --> 01:06:32,063 But he was doing his best under terrible circumstances. 997 01:06:35,263 --> 01:06:37,832 JOSEPH McBRIDE: Ambassador Martin was dragging out the evacuation 998 01:06:38,032 --> 01:06:39,698 as long as he could 999 01:06:39,699 --> 01:06:43,470 to get as many South Vietnamese out as possible. 1000 01:06:43,471 --> 01:06:47,807 Each helicopter took about 40 people. 1001 01:06:48,807 --> 01:06:51,085 He knew that once the Americans were gone, 1002 01:06:52,010 --> 01:06:54,148 the evacuation would be over. 1003 01:06:57,148 --> 01:07:02,693 So they just put one or two Americans on each one. 1004 01:07:09,693 --> 01:07:13,060 You're very tired and you're not seeing an end to this thing. 1005 01:07:13,061 --> 01:07:14,796 So I got the word out, 1006 01:07:14,797 --> 01:07:18,633 "You know, we could use some help out here. 1007 01:07:18,634 --> 01:07:20,401 We only have 75 helicopters." 1008 01:07:20,402 --> 01:07:23,837 And the word comes back, "No. 1009 01:07:23,838 --> 01:07:26,012 No, Marine pilots don't get tired." 1010 01:07:33,012 --> 01:07:36,348 Back at the embassy under the Ambassador's direction, 1011 01:07:36,349 --> 01:07:39,551 we, of course, were taking advantage 1012 01:07:39,552 --> 01:07:43,757 of the presence of the aircraft to evacuate threatened folks. 1013 01:07:46,757 --> 01:07:50,130 But there were other independent efforts to get people out. 1014 01:07:53,130 --> 01:07:57,466 McBRIDE: Several of us at the embassy agreed that we would drive vans 1015 01:07:57,467 --> 01:08:01,871 down to the docks on the Saigon River. 1016 01:08:03,871 --> 01:08:08,241 I had an assigned assembly point in the middle of Saigon, 1017 01:08:08,242 --> 01:08:12,546 and I crammed about 15 people into a nine-person van 1018 01:08:12,547 --> 01:08:15,716 and then drove through the streets of Saigon 1019 01:08:15,717 --> 01:08:22,923 through various checkpoints down to the docks. 1020 01:08:24,923 --> 01:08:26,725 People would get out 1021 01:08:26,726 --> 01:08:30,963 and go running for these commercial boats and get on. 1022 01:08:31,963 --> 01:08:35,866 I made a number of runs and there'd just be more 1023 01:08:35,867 --> 01:08:38,577 and more and more people. 1024 01:08:47,577 --> 01:08:49,711 Finally, as the sun was going down, 1025 01:08:49,712 --> 01:08:51,912 we were running out of light. 1026 01:08:51,913 --> 01:08:56,617 Man came up to me. 1027 01:08:56,618 --> 01:09:01,587 I turned to him and said, "This is my last load. 1028 01:09:01,588 --> 01:09:03,523 I, you know, I can't take anymore." 1029 01:09:03,524 --> 01:09:04,824 I said, "Well, get your family." 1030 01:09:05,024 --> 01:09:06,259 And he said, "Can't do it. 1031 01:09:06,260 --> 01:09:07,693 "My family's too big. 1032 01:09:07,694 --> 01:09:10,765 My family's too big." 1033 01:09:13,765 --> 01:09:18,903 And he just shook my hand and said, "Thanks for trying," 1034 01:09:18,904 --> 01:09:20,270 and walked away. 1035 01:09:20,271 --> 01:09:26,609 So I came back to the embassy and parked the van. 1036 01:09:26,610 --> 01:09:30,478 It was already getting well into twilight. 1037 01:09:30,479 --> 01:09:32,281 Got my way through the crowd. 1038 01:09:32,282 --> 01:09:33,338 It was a big crowd. 1039 01:09:38,287 --> 01:09:40,455 I had nothing more I could do. 1040 01:09:40,456 --> 01:09:44,157 So I went to get on the helicopter 1041 01:09:44,158 --> 01:09:47,728 and Ambassador Martin pulled me out of line and he said, 1042 01:09:47,729 --> 01:09:49,528 "I know what you've been doing. 1043 01:09:49,529 --> 01:09:50,929 "I know you've been out there. 1044 01:09:50,930 --> 01:09:52,197 "We've been talking. 1045 01:09:52,198 --> 01:09:54,200 I want to thank you." 1046 01:09:54,201 --> 01:09:57,439 I thought that was a kind gesture. 1047 01:10:00,429 --> 01:10:02,374 By that time it was definitely dark. 1048 01:10:02,375 --> 01:10:06,710 The lights of the... of the helicopter inside 1049 01:10:06,711 --> 01:10:09,647 radiated very clearly. 1050 01:10:09,648 --> 01:10:12,047 I sat down, looked around. 1051 01:10:12,048 --> 01:10:15,518 I was one of maybe two or three Americans. 1052 01:10:15,519 --> 01:10:18,886 The rest were all Vietnamese. 1053 01:10:18,887 --> 01:10:21,359 And we flew out. 1054 01:10:24,359 --> 01:10:26,794 It was very dark. 1055 01:10:26,795 --> 01:10:28,161 I remember that. 1056 01:10:28,162 --> 01:10:30,497 And people started to elbow each other and try to get 1057 01:10:30,498 --> 01:10:33,300 in the front line. 1058 01:10:33,301 --> 01:10:35,801 And that's when the Captain Herrington started 1059 01:10:35,802 --> 01:10:38,104 speaking to us in Vietnamese. 1060 01:10:40,006 --> 01:10:42,242 "Nobody is going to be left behind." 1061 01:10:45,578 --> 01:10:49,947 And then he said, "When you are in American embassy, 1062 01:10:49,948 --> 01:10:51,393 "you are in American soil. 1063 01:10:52,016 --> 01:10:55,051 "I promise, me and my soldier will be the last one 1064 01:10:55,052 --> 01:10:56,620 leave the embassy." 1065 01:10:56,621 --> 01:11:00,424 So after that announcement everybody feel relaxed. 1066 01:11:00,425 --> 01:11:02,390 Literally, we totally relaxed. 1067 01:11:02,391 --> 01:11:03,859 We have nothing to worry about. 1068 01:11:03,860 --> 01:11:05,130 Yeah. 1069 01:11:08,130 --> 01:11:09,864 We were told 1070 01:11:09,865 --> 01:11:14,269 that the North Vietnamese tanks were coming very close. 1071 01:11:14,270 --> 01:11:16,737 So we asked, we in the White House, asked 1072 01:11:16,738 --> 01:11:22,442 the Defense Department how many South Vietnamese were left. 1073 01:11:22,443 --> 01:11:26,379 "Left" meant inside the embassy compound. 1074 01:11:26,380 --> 01:11:28,848 And then we calculated how many helicopters 1075 01:11:28,849 --> 01:11:32,984 it would take to get them out. 1076 01:11:32,985 --> 01:11:39,590 We told Martin that he had to be on the last helicopter. 1077 01:11:39,591 --> 01:11:41,858 All I know is that in Washington 1078 01:11:41,859 --> 01:11:44,693 there was confusion about the numbers on the ground. 1079 01:11:46,530 --> 01:11:51,500 At 1:00 a.m. there were 1,100 people left to evacuate. 1080 01:11:51,501 --> 01:11:53,202 After we'd had a flurry of choppers 1081 01:11:53,203 --> 01:11:55,403 and cleaned out more than half of them 1082 01:11:55,404 --> 01:11:57,938 and there were 420 people left, 1083 01:11:57,939 --> 01:12:00,742 we received an order from Washington 1084 01:12:00,743 --> 01:12:02,710 that the lift was over 1085 01:12:02,711 --> 01:12:05,614 other than the extraction of the remaining Americans. 1086 01:12:07,614 --> 01:12:09,483 About 4:00 in the morning, 4:30, 1087 01:12:09,484 --> 01:12:11,952 I land on the USS Blue Ridge again. 1088 01:12:11,953 --> 01:12:16,288 So, General Carey comes out, gives me an apple 1089 01:12:16,289 --> 01:12:18,357 and a cup of coffee or something and says, 1090 01:12:18,358 --> 01:12:19,957 "We're under orders from the President. 1091 01:12:19,958 --> 01:12:22,493 You got to get the Ambassador out." 1092 01:12:22,494 --> 01:12:24,362 So we fly in. 1093 01:12:24,363 --> 01:12:28,299 I land on the roof exactly at 4:50 in the morning and I said, 1094 01:12:28,300 --> 01:12:33,836 "I'm not leaving until the Ambassador's onboard." 1095 01:12:33,837 --> 01:12:36,906 One of the Marines lowered the flag, folded it up 1096 01:12:36,907 --> 01:12:39,975 and escorted the Ambassador up to the landing zone 1097 01:12:39,976 --> 01:12:41,343 up on top of the embassy 1098 01:12:41,344 --> 01:12:44,313 and he gave him the flag 1099 01:12:44,314 --> 01:12:46,984 and, uh, that was it. 1100 01:12:49,808 --> 01:12:52,586 Major Kean came to Colonel Madison, said, "No more. 1101 01:12:52,587 --> 01:12:54,589 Only Americans from this point on." 1102 01:12:54,590 --> 01:12:57,691 And Madison said, "The hell you say. 1103 01:12:57,692 --> 01:12:59,658 We've got these people over here." 1104 01:12:59,659 --> 01:13:03,661 And Kean said, "Sir, not going to happen. 1105 01:13:03,662 --> 01:13:06,331 It's a presidential order." 1106 01:13:06,332 --> 01:13:08,666 And Madison said, "I'll take this up with the Ambassador." 1107 01:13:08,667 --> 01:13:10,468 He was very hot under the collar. 1108 01:13:10,469 --> 01:13:15,305 And Kean said, "You can't, that's him," 1109 01:13:15,306 --> 01:13:19,981 and pointed to the CH-46 that was just flying away. 1110 01:13:24,981 --> 01:13:29,085 So the Ambassador's on board. 1111 01:13:29,086 --> 01:13:30,457 And out we go. 1112 01:13:35,457 --> 01:13:38,325 We land on the Blue Ridge. 1113 01:13:38,326 --> 01:13:42,696 15 or 20, maybe 25 people get off with the Ambassador 1114 01:13:42,697 --> 01:13:44,667 and that was the end of it. 1115 01:13:46,667 --> 01:13:49,368 I flew 18.3 hours straight through. 1116 01:13:49,369 --> 01:13:53,705 Graham Martin looked very tired, extremely haggard. 1117 01:13:53,706 --> 01:13:56,942 I mean, he looked like... I'm sure the pressure was immense. 1118 01:13:56,943 --> 01:13:59,809 And at what time were you to cease evacuation? 1119 01:13:59,810 --> 01:14:02,045 Cease evacuation? 1120 01:14:02,046 --> 01:14:04,948 We could still be flying if we hadn't gotten the Ambassador out 1121 01:14:04,949 --> 01:14:10,252 because he refused to stop the lift. 1122 01:14:10,253 --> 01:14:11,286 I think about 3:00. 1123 01:14:11,287 --> 01:14:12,554 3:00 in the morning? 1124 01:14:12,555 --> 01:14:13,555 No, 3:45. 1125 01:14:19,496 --> 01:14:23,997 Colonel Madison says to me, "We're screwed. 1126 01:14:23,998 --> 01:14:26,634 "Stu, you stay down here in the parking lot 1127 01:14:26,635 --> 01:14:29,568 and keep these 420 people warm"... 1128 01:14:29,569 --> 01:14:32,236 Meaning if they see us all leave at the same time 1129 01:14:33,006 --> 01:14:37,076 they'll panic... "and then make your way to the roof. 1130 01:14:37,077 --> 01:14:38,943 We gotta go." 1131 01:14:38,944 --> 01:14:43,214 And he was very angry and very disappointed. 1132 01:14:43,215 --> 01:14:47,318 So they disappeared into the embassy. 1133 01:14:47,319 --> 01:14:49,054 And I went to where the remaining Vietnamese 1134 01:14:49,055 --> 01:14:51,555 who were waiting and told them... 1135 01:14:55,527 --> 01:15:03,331 "Big helicopters about to come," and waited a few minutes. 1136 01:15:03,332 --> 01:15:06,902 Then I saw a chopper take off and I thought, 1137 01:15:06,903 --> 01:15:10,505 "Shit, was I supposed to be on that one?" 1138 01:15:10,506 --> 01:15:13,041 So, I looked at the Vietnamese and I said... 1139 01:15:14,542 --> 01:15:17,243 "I got to take a leak." 1140 01:15:17,244 --> 01:15:20,679 And I left into the shadows. 1141 01:15:20,680 --> 01:15:23,483 I made my way around in a circuitous route 1142 01:15:23,484 --> 01:15:25,554 and went into the embassy. 1143 01:15:27,554 --> 01:15:33,993 I thought about how this really, really was wrong. 1144 01:15:34,993 --> 01:15:37,995 I thought maybe I should just say, "I'm not leaving 1145 01:15:37,996 --> 01:15:41,598 till they go, because I promised them." 1146 01:15:41,599 --> 01:15:44,033 And then I said, "Don't be a fool. 1147 01:15:44,034 --> 01:15:45,568 "Maybe they've started shooting down helicopters 1148 01:15:45,569 --> 01:15:46,736 "for all you know. 1149 01:15:46,737 --> 01:15:49,871 "You're not going to get anybody else out. 1150 01:15:49,872 --> 01:15:52,508 "It's a presidential order. 1151 01:15:52,509 --> 01:15:55,510 This decision has been made." 1152 01:15:55,511 --> 01:16:00,913 So, I got to the roof and a CH-46 alighted on the rooftop, 1153 01:16:00,914 --> 01:16:06,957 put its ramp down and we got on board. 1154 01:16:09,957 --> 01:16:13,059 As it took off, the door was open. 1155 01:16:13,060 --> 01:16:14,894 And down in the parking lot 1156 01:16:14,895 --> 01:16:16,961 I could see the group of 420 of them. 1157 01:16:16,962 --> 01:16:18,964 They were right were we had left them marshaled 1158 01:16:18,965 --> 01:16:22,465 on this little patch of grass. 1159 01:16:22,466 --> 01:16:25,536 I felt absolutely awful. 1160 01:16:25,537 --> 01:16:31,487 It was just so... serious and deep a betrayal. 1161 01:16:45,487 --> 01:16:48,421 Later that night I was quite surprised that I got 1162 01:16:48,422 --> 01:16:49,991 a call to "Come alongside the flagship. 1163 01:16:49,992 --> 01:16:52,925 The Admiral wants to speak to you." 1164 01:16:52,926 --> 01:16:57,496 My first reaction, as any CO, is, "What did we do?" 1165 01:16:57,497 --> 01:17:02,934 not realizing we had been picked for a special mission. 1166 01:17:02,935 --> 01:17:05,737 We were supposed to pick up this person. 1167 01:17:05,738 --> 01:17:08,973 He was 30 years old, came aboard, civilian clothes. 1168 01:17:08,974 --> 01:17:11,276 And the Captain was just told 1169 01:17:11,277 --> 01:17:16,313 to take his direction from this guy. 1170 01:17:16,314 --> 01:17:20,249 I went aboard the Kirk and met with Captain Paul Jacobs. 1171 01:17:20,250 --> 01:17:22,684 And the first thing he said to me is, 1172 01:17:22,685 --> 01:17:25,720 "Young man, I'm not accustomed 1173 01:17:25,721 --> 01:17:28,189 "to strange civilians coming aboard my ship armed 1174 01:17:28,190 --> 01:17:29,791 in the middle of the night." 1175 01:17:29,792 --> 01:17:32,093 And I said, "Captain, I assure you, neither am I." 1176 01:17:32,094 --> 01:17:35,662 He smelled like a Naval officer, you know. 1177 01:17:35,663 --> 01:17:37,363 You know, one officer can smell another one. 1178 01:17:37,364 --> 01:17:39,265 So, I looked him up in the blue book. 1179 01:17:39,266 --> 01:17:41,901 He's a graduate of the Naval Academy. 1180 01:17:41,902 --> 01:17:43,702 So from that point on we were fine. 1181 01:17:43,703 --> 01:17:44,970 "What do you want to do?" 1182 01:17:44,971 --> 01:17:47,043 And we worked together as a team. 1183 01:17:51,043 --> 01:17:54,513 We steamed down to Con Son Island and we could see 1184 01:17:54,514 --> 01:17:58,648 on the radar display that there were a lot of blips. 1185 01:17:58,649 --> 01:18:01,318 And I remember dawn breaking and the sun coming up, 1186 01:18:01,319 --> 01:18:05,490 and seeing what I had seen as a radar display in person. 1187 01:18:07,490 --> 01:18:10,893 There were dozens of ships. 1188 01:18:10,894 --> 01:18:15,764 And not just Vietnamese naval ships, 1189 01:18:15,765 --> 01:18:18,966 but also civilian ships. 1190 01:18:18,967 --> 01:18:22,407 And they were all totally crammed with people. 1191 01:18:26,407 --> 01:18:30,109 There are no words to describe 1192 01:18:30,110 --> 01:18:33,179 what a ship looks like that holds 200 1193 01:18:33,180 --> 01:18:35,581 and it's got 2,000 on it. 1194 01:18:35,582 --> 01:18:41,252 I don't think anybody really understood the magnitude of it 1195 01:18:41,253 --> 01:18:44,056 until we looked at what we got in front of us. 1196 01:18:46,056 --> 01:18:48,295 It looked like something out of Exodus. 1197 01:18:50,295 --> 01:18:55,697 Our mission was to help the ships into international waters. 1198 01:18:55,698 --> 01:19:00,035 But now they had all these people. 1199 01:19:00,036 --> 01:19:03,208 My reaction is, "How the hell are we going to do this?" 1200 01:19:06,208 --> 01:19:09,577 Most of the Vietnamese Navy ships were dead in the water, 1201 01:19:09,578 --> 01:19:14,015 some were anchored, some were just adrift. 1202 01:19:14,394 --> 01:19:17,117 So, we sent over our engineering, technical people 1203 01:19:17,118 --> 01:19:23,054 to see what we could do to help them and get them underway. 1204 01:19:23,055 --> 01:19:29,460 We had worked a plan out to sail the ships to the Philippines. 1205 01:19:29,461 --> 01:19:34,499 And the Kirk was going to escort them. 1206 01:19:34,500 --> 01:19:36,566 But the fact that they're going to be crammed 1207 01:19:36,567 --> 01:19:38,535 with an unknown number of civilians 1208 01:19:38,536 --> 01:19:41,203 was somewhat problematic. 1209 01:19:41,204 --> 01:19:43,939 The U.S. government already had a refugee problem 1210 01:19:43,940 --> 01:19:45,974 with the U.S. Naval ships. 1211 01:19:45,975 --> 01:19:49,376 This was another 30,000 or more people to deal with. 1212 01:19:49,377 --> 01:19:53,047 We were up all night talking about it. 1213 01:19:53,048 --> 01:19:55,617 And I'm convinced that if we sent them back or took them back 1214 01:19:55,618 --> 01:19:56,849 they would have killed them all. 1215 01:19:56,850 --> 01:20:02,156 And Armitage decided to bring them. 1216 01:20:02,157 --> 01:20:06,125 And he didn't get permission from Washington to do that. 1217 01:20:06,126 --> 01:20:09,895 I thought it was a lot easier to beg forgiveness 1218 01:20:09,896 --> 01:20:11,865 than to get permission. 1219 01:20:13,865 --> 01:20:16,401 So the decision was made. 1220 01:20:16,402 --> 01:20:18,894 And they all went with us. 1221 01:20:45,894 --> 01:20:49,295 We had finally got out the last of the refugees 1222 01:20:49,296 --> 01:20:51,098 that we could get out. 1223 01:20:51,099 --> 01:20:54,569 Now we had to evacuate the Marines. 1224 01:20:56,569 --> 01:21:01,406 They were all inside the embassy building except for us. 1225 01:21:01,407 --> 01:21:05,109 I was still on the embassy grounds with two of my sergeants 1226 01:21:05,110 --> 01:21:07,112 and I said, "You two stay right with me. 1227 01:21:07,113 --> 01:21:08,511 Don't leave my side." 1228 01:21:08,512 --> 01:21:12,349 We slowly walked backwards to the embassy door 1229 01:21:12,350 --> 01:21:15,251 and a couple of Vietnamese came towards me. 1230 01:21:15,252 --> 01:21:17,185 I said, "We have no more helicopters. 1231 01:21:17,186 --> 01:21:18,187 "That's it. 1232 01:21:18,188 --> 01:21:19,522 "I'm sorry. 1233 01:21:19,523 --> 01:21:21,823 We cannot take you." 1234 01:21:21,824 --> 01:21:23,524 And they began to argue with me. 1235 01:21:23,525 --> 01:21:25,292 They spoke good English, too. 1236 01:21:25,293 --> 01:21:27,062 "We can ride in your helicopter." 1237 01:21:27,063 --> 01:21:31,232 I said, "I'm sorry, no more." 1238 01:21:31,233 --> 01:21:34,568 So we spun around and slammed these huge doors, 1239 01:21:34,569 --> 01:21:38,109 and we locked it from behind. 1240 01:21:44,109 --> 01:21:46,178 I kind of fall asleep off and on, 1241 01:21:46,179 --> 01:21:49,380 but what gets me woke up is the noise. 1242 01:21:49,381 --> 01:21:51,114 It's a different noise. 1243 01:21:51,115 --> 01:21:53,785 So I kind of look up. 1244 01:21:53,786 --> 01:21:56,487 And the first thing in my sight was 1245 01:21:56,488 --> 01:22:02,692 I didn't see that soldier there anymore on that wall. 1246 01:22:02,693 --> 01:22:06,528 There were people throwing blankets or jackets 1247 01:22:06,529 --> 01:22:08,130 and materials over the barbed wire 1248 01:22:08,131 --> 01:22:11,001 so they can climb over the wire to come in. 1249 01:22:12,001 --> 01:22:15,469 It was like, "Where are the soldiers?" 1250 01:22:15,470 --> 01:22:19,105 We were going up the stairs. 1251 01:22:19,106 --> 01:22:22,509 Below me I could hear feet running on the stairway. 1252 01:22:22,510 --> 01:22:26,045 When we got to the roof, Master Sergeant Valdez was there. 1253 01:22:26,046 --> 01:22:27,947 He says, "We got everybody?" 1254 01:22:27,948 --> 01:22:29,448 "Yeah." 1255 01:22:29,449 --> 01:22:33,251 I said, "Man, there's somebody chasing me up those stairs." 1256 01:22:33,252 --> 01:22:37,121 There were wall lockers up on the roof 1257 01:22:37,122 --> 01:22:40,925 and those big fire extinguishers with wheels so we tilted 1258 01:22:40,926 --> 01:22:43,394 all those wall lockers and the fire extinguishers, 1259 01:22:43,395 --> 01:22:46,529 put them against the door. 1260 01:22:46,530 --> 01:22:49,364 There was a little window there that we could see them in there, 1261 01:22:49,365 --> 01:22:54,571 al the Vietnamese trying to get to the roof. 1262 01:22:54,572 --> 01:22:59,273 The Marines started going out as choppers came in. 1263 01:22:59,274 --> 01:23:04,444 Then all of a sudden choppers all cease. 1264 01:23:04,445 --> 01:23:06,819 There was 11 of us still left there. 1265 01:23:12,819 --> 01:23:16,455 The briefing was delayed until the evacuation was completed 1266 01:23:16,456 --> 01:23:18,791 and the last helicopters are now in the air. 1267 01:23:18,792 --> 01:23:22,394 The President commends the personnel of the armed forces 1268 01:23:22,395 --> 01:23:25,729 who accomplished it, as well as Ambassador Graham Martin 1269 01:23:25,730 --> 01:23:28,633 and the staff of his mission who served so well 1270 01:23:28,634 --> 01:23:31,401 under difficult conditions. 1271 01:23:31,402 --> 01:23:34,670 We were told that Martin had left on the last helicopter 1272 01:23:34,671 --> 01:23:37,608 and that the evacuation had ended. 1273 01:23:37,609 --> 01:23:42,711 I'm confident that every American who wanted to come out 1274 01:23:42,712 --> 01:23:44,412 is out. 1275 01:23:44,413 --> 01:23:47,381 So we held a briefing. 1276 01:23:47,382 --> 01:23:49,483 Well, turned out not to be the last helicopter 1277 01:23:49,484 --> 01:23:53,520 because there was another horrendous screw-up. 1278 01:23:53,521 --> 01:23:57,724 There were no helicopters. 1279 01:23:57,725 --> 01:24:00,448 You know, we were just kind of sitting down around 1280 01:24:01,028 --> 01:24:02,728 looking at each other, 1281 01:24:02,729 --> 01:24:05,165 wondering, you know, what's going to happen here, 1282 01:24:05,166 --> 01:24:08,733 you know, whether they truly had forgotten about us. 1283 01:24:08,734 --> 01:24:14,572 So I got on my radio and I began saying, "U.S. Navy, U.S. Navy, 1284 01:24:14,573 --> 01:24:18,175 American embassy, request extraction immediate." 1285 01:24:18,176 --> 01:24:20,044 And I repeated this over and over and over. 1286 01:24:20,045 --> 01:24:24,015 The only option we had was sit on the stupid roof 1287 01:24:25,015 --> 01:24:26,849 like a sitting duck. 1288 01:24:26,850 --> 01:24:29,795 And I kept thinking, "Where are the North Vietnamese?" 1289 01:24:32,622 --> 01:24:35,523 About 7:45 in the morning you could start seeing 1290 01:24:35,524 --> 01:24:39,661 North Vietnamese coming down the road. 1291 01:24:39,662 --> 01:24:41,929 My thoughts were, "What's to keep them from bombing 1292 01:24:41,930 --> 01:24:45,097 the top of the embassy roof and blowing us off," you know? 1293 01:24:46,833 --> 01:24:49,234 A tank is going to take one shot. 1294 01:24:49,235 --> 01:24:51,875 If it hits the building, you're gone. 1295 01:24:54,875 --> 01:24:57,341 So I didn't like the idea of being up there, 1296 01:24:57,342 --> 01:25:01,912 but where else are you going to go? 1297 01:25:01,913 --> 01:25:06,716 Finally I looked out and I saw a black dot. 1298 01:25:06,717 --> 01:25:08,919 When that chopper landed, I told the Marines, 1299 01:25:08,920 --> 01:25:12,287 "Go. Get in." 1300 01:25:12,288 --> 01:25:16,326 I was the last one out. 1301 01:25:16,327 --> 01:25:20,528 And as I was putting my foot on the ramp, I fell down, 1302 01:25:20,529 --> 01:25:24,398 and I'm just hanging on and the ramp's going up. 1303 01:25:24,399 --> 01:25:25,866 The ramp is closing 1304 01:25:25,867 --> 01:25:29,303 and I did what I was trained in my first tour... count. 1305 01:25:29,304 --> 01:25:32,538 So I went, "One, two, three, four, five, six... ten. 1306 01:25:32,539 --> 01:25:33,773 "Ten? 1307 01:25:33,774 --> 01:25:35,942 "One, two, three, four, five, six... ten. 1308 01:25:35,943 --> 01:25:37,344 Ten." 1309 01:25:37,345 --> 01:25:41,179 And I looked at the crew chief and I said, "Put it down." 1310 01:25:41,180 --> 01:25:43,047 I knew I was missing one man. 1311 01:25:43,048 --> 01:25:45,084 I remember looking at the ramp 1312 01:25:45,085 --> 01:25:47,586 and two hands were over the top of it. 1313 01:25:48,565 --> 01:25:50,621 So the Marines just kind of grabbed me 1314 01:25:50,622 --> 01:25:52,659 and then just pulled me in. 1315 01:25:55,659 --> 01:26:01,496 We left, by my watch, at 7:58 Saigon time. 1316 01:26:01,497 --> 01:26:04,171 And we were the last 11. 1317 01:26:10,171 --> 01:26:14,645 My cameraman, Neil Davis, and I decided to stay. 1318 01:26:17,645 --> 01:26:20,948 We saw the last helicopter leave from the roof. 1319 01:26:21,948 --> 01:26:25,151 We then tried to scramble into the embassy ourselves. 1320 01:26:25,152 --> 01:26:26,618 Neil got to the roof. 1321 01:26:26,619 --> 01:26:28,353 I did not. 1322 01:26:28,354 --> 01:26:30,288 And he saw dozens of Vietnamese 1323 01:26:30,289 --> 01:26:34,393 just sitting on the helicopter pad on the roof of the embassy, 1324 01:26:34,394 --> 01:26:37,827 waiting, wanting to get out. 1325 01:26:37,828 --> 01:26:40,717 And of course no more helicopters were going to come. 1326 01:26:44,467 --> 01:26:46,435 I didn't join them. 1327 01:26:46,436 --> 01:26:50,273 I actually... scared. 1328 01:26:50,274 --> 01:26:52,009 If the Communists come in, 1329 01:26:52,843 --> 01:26:54,843 the last thing we want them to see us 1330 01:26:54,844 --> 01:26:56,844 is in the American embassy. 1331 01:26:56,845 --> 01:26:57,845 So we get out. 1332 01:27:01,750 --> 01:27:04,818 People were coming in and out of the buildings. 1333 01:27:04,819 --> 01:27:08,688 Literally, anything that could not be fastened down 1334 01:27:08,689 --> 01:27:12,425 or was not fastened down was being taken away. 1335 01:27:12,426 --> 01:27:14,926 Any souvenirs from the Ambassador's office 1336 01:27:14,927 --> 01:27:16,429 were taken away. 1337 01:27:16,430 --> 01:27:19,496 Almost brick by brick the embassy was being dismantled. 1338 01:27:19,497 --> 01:27:21,832 It was ordinary looting. 1339 01:27:21,833 --> 01:27:26,370 But more than that, I think it was just frustration and anger 1340 01:27:26,371 --> 01:27:30,674 and an opportunity to get back, perhaps, at the Americans 1341 01:27:30,675 --> 01:27:33,443 because in the view of many in that crowd that day, 1342 01:27:33,444 --> 01:27:36,685 we had deserted them. 1343 01:27:43,685 --> 01:27:46,220 NBC news correspondent Jim Laurie 1344 01:27:46,221 --> 01:27:49,322 is one of the few Americans still left in Saigon, 1345 01:27:49,323 --> 01:27:52,859 in the city when President Duong Van Minh went on the radio 1346 01:27:52,860 --> 01:27:55,060 and told the Viet Cong 1347 01:27:55,061 --> 01:27:57,197 that his country would surrender unconditionally 1348 01:27:57,198 --> 01:28:00,934 and that he had told its army to lay down its arms. 1349 01:28:00,935 --> 01:28:02,568 Here from Saigon radio hookup 1350 01:28:02,569 --> 01:28:04,769 is Laurie's report on the surrender. 1351 01:28:04,770 --> 01:28:08,840 In the words of General Minh, "We are here to hand over 1352 01:28:08,841 --> 01:28:13,011 the power of government to you in order to avoid bloodshed." 1353 01:28:14,011 --> 01:28:17,947 It is a unilateral ceasefire and an unconditional surrender. 1354 01:28:17,948 --> 01:28:21,439 The 30-year war in South Vietnam is at last over. 1355 01:28:46,439 --> 01:28:50,041 The first thing I did was to destroy my documents, 1356 01:28:50,042 --> 01:28:55,647 my badges, just keeping the civilian ID. 1357 01:28:55,648 --> 01:29:00,180 And then I went around Saigon to see what happened. 1358 01:29:33,180 --> 01:29:40,618 I saw a lot of South Vietnamese soldiers in underwear. 1359 01:29:40,619 --> 01:29:46,724 They took off all their military clothes, boots, 1360 01:29:46,725 --> 01:29:49,067 and they threw them away. 1361 01:29:57,067 --> 01:30:01,774 And I thought, well, what would happen to them? 1362 01:30:04,774 --> 01:30:07,041 And to me, to myself. 1363 01:30:07,042 --> 01:30:08,346 Right. 1364 01:30:12,346 --> 01:30:18,684 I thought of my friends who were killed in action and I thought, 1365 01:30:18,685 --> 01:30:22,257 "Well, is this what we fought for?" 1366 01:30:25,257 --> 01:30:29,631 "Is this what the Americans came for?" 1367 01:30:33,631 --> 01:30:36,907 And I didn't have the answer. 1368 01:30:42,907 --> 01:30:48,376 I have wrestled with this ever since. 1369 01:30:48,377 --> 01:30:52,648 I realized that I had become 1370 01:30:52,649 --> 01:30:55,849 the quintessential American in Vietnam. 1371 01:30:55,850 --> 01:30:59,853 I had all these causes, all these big things I was doing. 1372 01:30:59,854 --> 01:31:01,921 I was trying to get the truth back to Washington. 1373 01:31:01,922 --> 01:31:05,626 I was talking to agents, trying to persuade the Ambassador, 1374 01:31:05,627 --> 01:31:10,568 and I forgot that what was at stake were human lives. 1375 01:31:15,568 --> 01:31:20,538 For years after that, I hear that sound in my head, 1376 01:31:20,539 --> 01:31:23,573 that sound like, "Tchk-tchk-tchk-tchk-tchk." 1377 01:31:23,574 --> 01:31:25,675 In the middle of the night I just jump up. 1378 01:31:25,676 --> 01:31:27,899 I thought the helicopter come pick me up. 1379 01:31:30,046 --> 01:31:32,552 I called it "dream in the wind." 1380 01:31:35,552 --> 01:31:39,121 Later we found out the big fleet is out there. 1381 01:31:39,122 --> 01:31:41,122 You can just take a boat and go there. 1382 01:31:41,123 --> 01:31:43,025 They take everybody. 1383 01:31:44,025 --> 01:31:46,303 If you can get out there, you're on board. 1384 01:31:50,297 --> 01:31:52,831 And I just didn't know that. 1385 01:31:52,832 --> 01:31:55,947 You know, so... 1386 01:32:07,769 --> 01:32:10,547 As we approached the Philippines with our refugees, 1387 01:32:10,548 --> 01:32:13,050 there was a big problem. 1388 01:32:13,051 --> 01:32:14,850 They wouldn't let us in. 1389 01:32:14,851 --> 01:32:17,787 And the reason they wouldn't let us in is 1390 01:32:17,788 --> 01:32:19,388 because the government there had recognized 1391 01:32:19,389 --> 01:32:21,590 the new regime in Vietnam 1392 01:32:21,591 --> 01:32:24,460 and these Navy ships we were escorting, 1393 01:32:24,461 --> 01:32:28,563 they were all flying South Vietnamese flags. 1394 01:32:28,564 --> 01:32:32,701 And the solution was to reflag all these ships 1395 01:32:32,702 --> 01:32:36,237 as American ships. 1396 01:33:28,515 --> 01:33:32,952 They lowered their Vietnamese flag, people crying. 1397 01:33:32,953 --> 01:33:35,254 It was very emotional for them to lose their country, 1398 01:33:35,255 --> 01:33:36,721 their flag, their ship. 1399 01:33:36,722 --> 01:33:40,658 Everything was gone. 1400 01:33:40,659 --> 01:33:42,460 And then we raised the American flag. 1401 01:33:42,461 --> 01:33:45,350 We tried to do that with as much dignity as we could. 1402 01:33:56,818 --> 01:33:59,374 There were thousands and thousands of Americans 1403 01:33:59,375 --> 01:34:04,312 who served in Vietnam who were sitting at home heartbroken 1404 01:34:04,313 --> 01:34:08,554 at watching this whole thing come to naught. 1405 01:34:12,554 --> 01:34:16,956 The end of April of 1975 was... 1406 01:34:16,957 --> 01:34:20,893 the whole Vietnam involvement in microcosm... 1407 01:34:20,894 --> 01:34:23,828 Promises made in good faith, promises broken; 1408 01:34:23,829 --> 01:34:29,002 people being hurt because we didn't get our act together. 1409 01:34:29,578 --> 01:34:31,301 You know, the whole Vietnam War 1410 01:34:31,302 --> 01:34:34,837 is a story that kind of sounds like that. 1411 01:34:34,838 --> 01:34:39,443 But on the other hand, sometimes there are moments 1412 01:34:39,444 --> 01:34:42,644 when good people have to rise to the occasion 1413 01:34:42,645 --> 01:34:45,214 and do the things that need to be done. 1414 01:34:45,215 --> 01:34:49,000 And in Saigon, there was no shortage of people like that. 113135

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