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- Why were the Stones so out there?
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That really focused on
this guy Brian Jones.
3
00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:36,062
- You think of the
Rolling Stones in the mid-60's
4
00:02:36,062 --> 00:02:37,970
and you think of Brian Jones.
5
00:02:37,970 --> 00:02:39,550
You don't think of Mick Jagger,
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you certainly don't
think of Keith Richards.
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00:02:41,460 --> 00:02:44,610
Brian Jones is the
perfect British rock star.
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He's the first English rock star
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with perhaps the best
look there's ever been
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00:02:49,780 --> 00:02:51,730
of any British rock star.
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- He was the one
who was introducing them
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00:02:53,510 --> 00:02:56,950
to these Moroccan sounds, to world music,
13
00:02:56,950 --> 00:02:59,170
he was the one who was
the friend of John Lennon,
14
00:02:59,170 --> 00:03:00,820
the friend of Jimi Hendrix.
15
00:03:00,820 --> 00:03:02,790
- Although there
were five individuals
16
00:03:02,790 --> 00:03:05,760
you sort of knew that he was the governor.
17
00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:07,966
- He was a major
player in the 1960's
18
00:03:07,966 --> 00:03:11,057
in charting new regions
which had been thought
19
00:03:11,057 --> 00:03:13,810
otherwise impossible for young white men
20
00:03:13,810 --> 00:03:15,090
to even think about.
21
00:03:15,090 --> 00:03:16,670
Musically,
22
00:03:16,670 --> 00:03:18,190
fashion wise,
23
00:03:18,190 --> 00:03:20,084
attitude wise.
24
00:03:20,084 --> 00:03:22,130
He was a trailblazer.
25
00:03:22,130 --> 00:03:23,600
Hedonism, excess,
26
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:26,333
he embodied all of those in his 27 years.
27
00:03:57,886 --> 00:04:00,750
- Brian's peripatetic
wanderings around London,
28
00:04:00,750 --> 00:04:04,500
a hunted man, obviously called
for a sense of relocation
29
00:04:04,500 --> 00:04:06,590
and his advisors came
up with Cotchford Farm
30
00:04:06,590 --> 00:04:09,798
down in East Sussex in the
little village of Hartfield.
31
00:04:09,798 --> 00:04:14,750
So he found a great sense
of peace and identity
32
00:04:14,750 --> 00:04:15,842
at Cotchford Farm.
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00:04:16,675 --> 00:04:17,780
With the village of Hartfield
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00:04:17,780 --> 00:04:21,571
and the locals here adopted him.
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00:04:21,571 --> 00:04:23,356
They're very protective
36
00:04:23,356 --> 00:04:26,300
and so for the short
while that he was here
37
00:04:26,300 --> 00:04:30,706
during 68 and into 69 he
found a sense of community
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00:04:30,706 --> 00:04:33,360
which didn't exist in London.
39
00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:36,110
- Brian has found his dream home,
40
00:04:36,110 --> 00:04:39,600
previously owned by AA Milne,
the author of Winnie the Pooh,
41
00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:41,838
and it has a swimming pool
which is ideal for him.
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00:04:41,838 --> 00:04:46,210
He kind of seems to be
largely, as far as I know,
43
00:04:46,210 --> 00:04:49,053
off drugs at that point
although he's drinking a lot.
44
00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:54,166
- He was indulged in by the doctors
45
00:04:54,166 --> 00:04:59,166
who went on prescribing
right till when he died.
46
00:04:59,590 --> 00:05:02,480
When people say oh, he
wasn't taking drugs anymore.
47
00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:06,180
He wasn't smoking hash and taking cocaine
48
00:05:06,180 --> 00:05:09,900
or taking anything else of that type
49
00:05:09,900 --> 00:05:13,400
but he was taking a whole bunch
of dreadful type of things.
50
00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:14,923
And he was drinking heavily!
51
00:05:15,990 --> 00:05:19,620
That's why his health so badly declined
52
00:05:19,620 --> 00:05:21,570
in the following year.
53
00:05:21,570 --> 00:05:24,571
Brian was very much a broken man
54
00:05:24,571 --> 00:05:29,020
and was never functioning
at the same level of genius
55
00:05:29,020 --> 00:05:32,640
that he had before because he was relying
56
00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:34,910
on these prescription pills.
57
00:05:34,910 --> 00:05:38,540
The doctors overprescribed constantly
58
00:05:38,540 --> 00:05:41,792
which is why little by little
59
00:05:41,792 --> 00:05:46,600
this problem developed
in the group, I think,
60
00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:51,020
where because everybody was
preoccupied with their own thing
61
00:05:51,020 --> 00:05:53,830
but Brian was the absent one.
62
00:05:53,830 --> 00:05:56,460
As time went by, he came to,
63
00:05:56,460 --> 00:05:59,702
he knew I was seeing a
lot of Mick and Keith
64
00:05:59,702 --> 00:06:03,410
and he would ask me, what
are the Stones doing?
65
00:06:03,410 --> 00:06:06,840
He would use these words,
what are the Stones doing,
66
00:06:06,840 --> 00:06:08,640
what are they up to and so forth
67
00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:12,062
as if he wasn't part of it anymore.
68
00:06:12,062 --> 00:06:14,162
- Well Brian by the time rock n' roll
69
00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,610
had become marginalized as
far as the group was concerned
70
00:06:18,610 --> 00:06:21,140
simply because they couldn't rely on him,
71
00:06:21,140 --> 00:06:23,420
they wouldn't know whether
he was gonna turn up
72
00:06:23,420 --> 00:06:27,030
to the recording sessions
or turn up too late
73
00:06:27,030 --> 00:06:30,113
or turn up in a condition in
which he couldn't contribute.
74
00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:33,550
- Cotchford Farm needed some renovations
75
00:06:33,550 --> 00:06:35,600
and from all available
reports of the builders
76
00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:38,830
they were on a jolly as we say over here
77
00:06:38,830 --> 00:06:41,360
and they weren't gonna get much done.
78
00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:43,910
This existed for a period of time
79
00:06:43,910 --> 00:06:47,370
before even Brian decided
that enough was enough.
80
00:06:47,370 --> 00:06:48,930
The building work was shoddy
81
00:06:48,930 --> 00:06:50,400
and they were generally taking over,
82
00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:52,210
in particular the main
builder Frank Thorogood
83
00:06:52,210 --> 00:06:54,047
even moved into the property.
84
00:06:54,047 --> 00:06:58,322
- Frank Thorogood was
brought into the movie
85
00:06:58,322 --> 00:07:02,840
by Tom Keylock so the pair
of 'em were in cohorts
86
00:07:02,840 --> 00:07:04,450
at some level or another.
87
00:07:04,450 --> 00:07:07,310
- Tom Keylock was a minder.
88
00:07:07,310 --> 00:07:09,782
He was one of those people
that occupy positions,
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00:07:09,782 --> 00:07:14,782
roadie, chauffer, tour
manager, stroke minder.
90
00:07:15,470 --> 00:07:18,500
- Tom Keylock was much older
than the Rolling Stones.
91
00:07:18,500 --> 00:07:23,500
He had connections with all
tiers of officialdom police
92
00:07:23,830 --> 00:07:25,470
and also the underworld as well.
93
00:07:25,470 --> 00:07:28,060
So he was a shady character, world wise.
94
00:07:28,060 --> 00:07:31,430
- Frank and Tom Keylock were
95
00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:38,010
really living the life in Brian's house.
96
00:07:38,010 --> 00:07:40,510
- Brian was not around.
97
00:07:40,510 --> 00:07:42,660
He was always in the country
98
00:07:42,660 --> 00:07:44,780
and he wasn't going to,
99
00:07:44,780 --> 00:07:48,090
I think a lot of times
he just didn't go even
100
00:07:48,090 --> 00:07:50,642
to the recording sessions and so on.
101
00:07:50,642 --> 00:07:52,630
- Yeah, I saw Brian in the studio,
102
00:07:52,630 --> 00:07:54,880
he's sitting in the corner.
103
00:08:17,019 --> 00:08:19,032
- He had no discipline whatsoever.
104
00:08:19,032 --> 00:08:23,330
And I think that was his undoing
105
00:08:23,330 --> 00:08:27,974
because they thought
if we can't rely on him
106
00:08:27,974 --> 00:08:29,921
we'll get on without him.
107
00:08:29,921 --> 00:08:31,830
And that's what eventually happened.
108
00:08:41,977 --> 00:08:44,820
- He was a difficult guy to love, Brian.
109
00:08:44,820 --> 00:08:48,020
I can imagine Brian really getting up
110
00:08:48,020 --> 00:08:49,710
in Mick and Keith's nose in the end
111
00:08:49,710 --> 00:08:50,994
because of his demands
112
00:08:50,994 --> 00:08:55,994
and his moaning and
dissatisfaction with his lot.
113
00:08:56,060 --> 00:09:01,060
- But the idea that Brian was pushed out
114
00:09:01,313 --> 00:09:03,160
I think is ridiculous.
115
00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:08,160
Brian created a situation
where they had to push him out
116
00:09:08,660 --> 00:09:11,080
otherwise he could've
brought the band down.
117
00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:13,087
- He was talking
about leaving anyway
118
00:09:13,087 --> 00:09:15,700
so I wasn't surprised.
119
00:09:15,700 --> 00:09:17,380
I didn't really feel
particularly bad about it
120
00:09:17,380 --> 00:09:20,280
because he was potentially brilliant
121
00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:23,509
and a very, very intelligent person
122
00:09:23,509 --> 00:09:27,763
but he just seemed to be
set on destroying himself.
123
00:09:38,540 --> 00:09:42,100
- Cheltenham, people
sort of said at the time
124
00:09:42,100 --> 00:09:46,867
or people have said since that
it was a sort of stayed place
125
00:09:46,867 --> 00:09:48,820
but it never was.
126
00:09:48,820 --> 00:09:53,820
There was plenty to do and
there was the typical rock scene
127
00:09:54,250 --> 00:09:57,480
that there'd been with the
Teddy Boys and rock n' roll
128
00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:01,070
and the sort of coffee shop era.
129
00:10:01,070 --> 00:10:04,230
There were plenty of coffee
shops and little cafes
130
00:10:04,230 --> 00:10:06,324
and plenty going on.
131
00:10:10,556 --> 00:10:13,990
- Brian came from a very well to do
132
00:10:13,990 --> 00:10:15,300
middle class family
133
00:10:15,300 --> 00:10:20,300
and he proved to be
something of a character.
134
00:10:22,010 --> 00:10:25,130
- I think the significant clue to Brian
135
00:10:25,130 --> 00:10:30,120
is in his early childhood
which is when he's four
136
00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:32,090
and his two year old sister dies.
137
00:10:32,090 --> 00:10:34,850
His parents soon have another daughter
138
00:10:34,850 --> 00:10:37,000
but the mother who'd been heartbroken
139
00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:38,500
at the loss of the first child
140
00:10:38,500 --> 00:10:41,400
transfers all her love and affection
141
00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:43,180
onto this new daughter,
142
00:10:43,180 --> 00:10:46,430
withdrawing it, it seems, from Brian.
143
00:10:46,430 --> 00:10:51,110
And Brian at that point
starts to develop asthma.
144
00:10:51,110 --> 00:10:55,240
- Also, he told me things
about his sister Pamela
145
00:10:55,240 --> 00:11:00,240
who had died and when he was
a naughty boy, as it were,
146
00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:03,523
his father or mother would threaten him
147
00:11:03,523 --> 00:11:05,903
with the same result.
148
00:11:11,661 --> 00:11:13,230
- He wasn't interested in going to college
149
00:11:13,230 --> 00:11:16,136
although he went to a very good college
150
00:11:16,136 --> 00:11:18,843
called Dean Close in Cheltenham.
151
00:11:20,352 --> 00:11:22,410
- He could've gone to university,
152
00:11:22,410 --> 00:11:24,420
he was very bright, Brian.
153
00:11:24,420 --> 00:11:27,490
Had a very high Mensa intelligence rating
154
00:11:27,490 --> 00:11:31,240
but he also had the
emotional rating of a child.
155
00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:33,710
And that was his problem.
156
00:11:33,710 --> 00:11:36,240
- His parents wanted him
to be a classical musician
157
00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:40,210
so when he discovers
jazz at the age of 14,
158
00:11:40,210 --> 00:11:42,350
starts playing saxophone.
159
00:11:42,350 --> 00:11:45,400
- Cannonball Adderley was
Brian's real favorite.
160
00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:49,600
- Which became an
absolute religion with him.
161
00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:51,460
He played the piano quite nicely,
162
00:11:51,460 --> 00:11:54,520
he'd had quite legitimate
lessons from a very good teacher
163
00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:59,190
but all the time his
fanaticism for jazz music
164
00:11:59,190 --> 00:12:00,690
was coming to the fore
165
00:12:01,610 --> 00:12:04,030
it was a great disappointment to us
166
00:12:04,030 --> 00:12:06,200
and source of considerable anxiety
167
00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:11,200
when he became so wrapped
up in his love of jazz music
168
00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:17,280
that in spite of everything
we could do or say
169
00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:19,513
he went off and did it.
170
00:12:25,820 --> 00:12:28,300
- I used to learn piano and clarinet.
171
00:12:28,300 --> 00:12:30,368
I used to play clarinet.
172
00:12:31,450 --> 00:12:32,337
Thank you.
173
00:12:32,337 --> 00:12:34,330
And I lost interest in the clarinet
174
00:12:34,330 --> 00:12:38,500
because I became very
involved in musical studies
175
00:12:38,500 --> 00:12:40,810
and I lost a lot of interest
176
00:12:40,810 --> 00:12:42,813
because I think I was getting in a rut,
177
00:12:42,813 --> 00:12:44,320
I was getting too involved.
178
00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:47,880
- His parents threw him
out one Christmas time
179
00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:50,800
and a little before Christmas
180
00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:54,440
Left a suitcase on the doorstep.
181
00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:57,140
That was the first thing he
told me about his parents.
182
00:12:58,040 --> 00:12:59,870
- He wasn't
interested in settling down
183
00:12:59,870 --> 00:13:01,070
to do any work.
184
00:13:01,070 --> 00:13:04,222
He didn't mind working, he got some jobs.
185
00:13:04,222 --> 00:13:09,222
He had a job which I mentioned
earlier in Gloucestershire
186
00:13:09,420 --> 00:13:11,700
and he had no parents to help him.
187
00:13:11,700 --> 00:13:13,750
- He didn't want to settle down.
188
00:13:13,750 --> 00:13:16,780
He just wanted to party, party, party
189
00:13:16,780 --> 00:13:19,380
and make love to as many
girls as he possibly could.
190
00:13:20,708 --> 00:13:24,267
He was a naughty boy, he really was.
191
00:13:31,552 --> 00:13:32,760
When he told me about Valerie
192
00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:35,210
he also told me about an earlier one.
193
00:13:35,210 --> 00:13:40,210
At the time he was going out
with Pat and she was pregnant.
194
00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:44,110
- By the time Brian was 19
195
00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:46,750
he had three illegitimate children.
196
00:13:48,544 --> 00:13:50,443
How do you cope with that?
197
00:13:51,472 --> 00:13:54,170
His reputation wasn't very good.
198
00:13:54,170 --> 00:13:58,720
I was surprised by it because
I'd never been friends
199
00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:03,323
with somebody who suddenly
was persona non grata.
200
00:14:06,510 --> 00:14:09,456
Being beaten up by an
umbrella in the street
201
00:14:09,456 --> 00:14:11,433
and such a thing.
202
00:14:20,452 --> 00:14:22,810
- We were both interested
in jazz and blues
203
00:14:22,810 --> 00:14:26,900
but blues came on much
stronger after that.
204
00:14:26,900 --> 00:14:29,180
To start with it was jazz.
205
00:14:29,180 --> 00:14:30,680
He was getting into the blues
206
00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:33,020
because he heard the old stuff
207
00:14:33,020 --> 00:14:36,290
like Lead Belly and I had a
record with Elmore James on it
208
00:14:36,290 --> 00:14:39,230
which is something that really grabbed him
209
00:14:39,230 --> 00:14:40,350
the first time he heard it.
210
00:14:40,350 --> 00:14:41,870
- And I started to play the guitar
211
00:14:41,870 --> 00:14:46,870
and it gave me a new feel musically
212
00:14:47,490 --> 00:14:50,869
and I became interested in jazz
213
00:14:50,869 --> 00:14:52,896
and rhythm and blues eventually.
214
00:14:52,896 --> 00:14:54,720
- Elmore Jones.
215
00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:56,300
- Gradually worked around to playing
216
00:14:56,300 --> 00:14:57,637
with the Rolling Stones, shut up.
217
00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:01,600
- One of the people we used to go and see
218
00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:04,440
in the early days was Alexis Korner.
219
00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:07,052
He was often called the
father of rhythm and blues
220
00:15:07,052 --> 00:15:10,080
in England at that time.
221
00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:11,944
- After the
performance in Cheltenham,
222
00:15:11,944 --> 00:15:15,032
Brian came up to me together
with a friend of his.
223
00:15:15,032 --> 00:15:18,571
I gave him my address and
phone number and everything
224
00:15:18,571 --> 00:15:21,460
and he used to appear
and sleep on our floor
225
00:15:21,460 --> 00:15:25,050
and come around the odd clubs
if I was playing anywhere.
226
00:15:25,050 --> 00:15:29,312
- He was really in the
forefront of British blues
227
00:15:29,312 --> 00:15:33,000
and he also played with
a guy called Cyril Davies
228
00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:35,150
who had Cyril Davies All-Stars
229
00:15:35,150 --> 00:15:39,280
and these were real
pioneers of British blues
230
00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:43,340
and it was when Alexis
Korner starts a club
231
00:15:43,340 --> 00:15:47,360
in Ealing in West London in April 1962.
232
00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:51,790
- Brian sat in, he played
with Alexis at the Ealing Club
233
00:15:51,790 --> 00:15:53,280
on several occasions.
234
00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:55,780
- He's billed himself as Elmo Lewis
235
00:15:55,780 --> 00:15:57,760
who has learned to play slide guitar.
236
00:15:57,760 --> 00:15:59,470
He's found a piece of metal
237
00:15:59,470 --> 00:16:01,210
that he can put on his finger
238
00:16:01,210 --> 00:16:03,420
and he can therefore emulate the sounds
239
00:16:03,420 --> 00:16:05,610
of Elmore James and others.
240
00:16:05,610 --> 00:16:07,052
- Alexis talked to Brian
241
00:16:07,052 --> 00:16:08,260
and right from the beginning he thought
242
00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:12,770
he was a very accomplished guitarist.
243
00:16:12,770 --> 00:16:15,160
He was very influential on Brian
244
00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:19,700
because he became a
father figure, I thought,
245
00:16:19,700 --> 00:16:23,683
and he started to make real
plans then for going to London.
246
00:16:38,222 --> 00:16:39,055
- Well from my point of view
247
00:16:39,055 --> 00:16:40,503
the group started with Brian, really
248
00:16:40,503 --> 00:16:44,320
in that he was the first one I met.
249
00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:45,920
- There would not have
been a Rolling Stones
250
00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:47,030
without Brian Jones.
251
00:16:47,030 --> 00:16:50,160
Brian Jones was the
man who caused the band
252
00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:51,676
to come into effect.
253
00:16:51,676 --> 00:16:55,532
He was the one who placed
an advert in Jazz News
254
00:16:55,532 --> 00:16:58,140
looking for other members
who were interested
255
00:16:58,140 --> 00:16:59,930
in a blues band.
256
00:16:59,930 --> 00:17:01,610
The first person I think to respond to it
257
00:17:01,610 --> 00:17:03,380
was Ian Stewart, the keyboard player,
258
00:17:03,380 --> 00:17:05,410
who was particularly close friend of mine.
259
00:17:05,410 --> 00:17:08,850
- Mick, Keith and myself
went down to the Ealing Club
260
00:17:08,850 --> 00:17:13,470
and I think it may be the second
or third week we went there
261
00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:18,600
we saw Brian Jones play
on stage with Paul Jones,
262
00:17:18,600 --> 00:17:19,440
I think it was.
263
00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:22,070
I think he played either with Paul Jones
264
00:17:22,070 --> 00:17:24,670
or Long John Bal-dree or both
265
00:17:24,670 --> 00:17:27,750
and we were just knocked
out with his playing.
266
00:17:27,750 --> 00:17:30,700
The thing with Brian is he
played amazing slide guitar
267
00:17:30,700 --> 00:17:34,800
and we heard people like
Elmore James on record
268
00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:37,332
and here was a guy actually doing it
269
00:17:37,332 --> 00:17:42,140
for real, for live, in
Ealing which was amazing
270
00:17:42,140 --> 00:17:45,552
and so we went and talked to him
271
00:17:45,552 --> 00:17:50,110
and Brian invited Mick to
go and sing with his band
272
00:17:50,110 --> 00:17:53,320
at which point he asked
me if I could play bass
273
00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:54,970
which I'd never done.
274
00:17:54,970 --> 00:17:58,736
That was it really, the
Rolling Stones were born.
275
00:17:58,736 --> 00:18:01,720
People always seem to
ask about Edith Grove,
276
00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:06,430
which was absolutely where
Mick, Keith and Brian lived
277
00:18:06,430 --> 00:18:10,140
and I remember going
there and going oh my God,
278
00:18:10,140 --> 00:18:11,892
do people really live like this.
279
00:18:11,892 --> 00:18:14,575
- Oh my God, what a place that was.
280
00:18:14,575 --> 00:18:16,992
That was a hellhole on Earth.
281
00:18:18,190 --> 00:18:20,516
- Before hippie squats
it was a hippie squat.
282
00:18:20,516 --> 00:18:23,563
- I think squat is too good a word.
283
00:18:26,260 --> 00:18:28,493
- It was summer of 1962, I guess,
284
00:18:28,493 --> 00:18:31,260
and we were having a good time.
285
00:18:31,260 --> 00:18:33,637
We'd go there every week, rehearse,
286
00:18:33,637 --> 00:18:35,690
have a lot of laughs.
287
00:18:35,690 --> 00:18:38,440
One thing which I think people don't know
288
00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:40,283
so much about Brian,
289
00:18:40,283 --> 00:18:43,020
he actually had a
brilliant sense of humor.
290
00:18:43,020 --> 00:18:45,490
I don't know, he used to
pull the most ridiculous,
291
00:18:45,490 --> 00:18:47,573
gruesome faces.
292
00:18:47,573 --> 00:18:51,309
At that point we had
become the Rolling Stones.
293
00:18:51,309 --> 00:18:56,309
At that point all the gigs were
coming through Brian really.
294
00:18:56,497 --> 00:18:59,813
Our very first gig was the Marquee club
295
00:18:59,813 --> 00:19:03,880
which was pretty terrifying
because at that point
296
00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:08,083
it was like one of the most
prestigious clubs in London.
297
00:19:09,270 --> 00:19:12,697
- I'd been to a gig at the Flamingo
298
00:19:12,697 --> 00:19:14,693
and there were about,
299
00:19:14,693 --> 00:19:17,620
probably more people on the stage
300
00:19:17,620 --> 00:19:19,880
than there were in the audience.
301
00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,580
- He was a rat bastard
'cause he knew I had money
302
00:19:22,580 --> 00:19:25,300
from the Army and he used to make me go
303
00:19:25,300 --> 00:19:30,300
to the nearest wimpy
bar and he'd say to me,
304
00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,240
you stay here, you can't come in with us.
305
00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:35,314
Give us some money so we can have the food
306
00:19:35,314 --> 00:19:37,000
but you stay out here
307
00:19:38,460 --> 00:19:42,370
in this really unbelievably cold winter
308
00:19:42,370 --> 00:19:44,300
'cause he had a cold streak
309
00:19:44,300 --> 00:19:47,660
and Brian desperately wanted a new guitar.
310
00:19:47,660 --> 00:19:49,372
We went around the guitar shops
311
00:19:49,372 --> 00:19:53,200
and eventually I bought
him a Harmony Stratocaster.
312
00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:56,240
- I think there was always
a bone of contention
313
00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:58,740
between Brian and Mick and Keith
314
00:19:58,740 --> 00:20:03,080
as to who's band it
was, who was the leader,
315
00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:07,073
because Brian because of
starting his other band
316
00:20:07,073 --> 00:20:10,970
sort of thought well, it was his band,
317
00:20:10,970 --> 00:20:14,920
whereas really what it
was a kind of amalgam
318
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,769
of Brian Jones, Brian's band
319
00:20:17,769 --> 00:20:21,760
and with Mick, Keith and myself
320
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:26,200
from what we had called Little
Boy Blue and the Blue Boys.
321
00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:27,870
I, after a while of doing this,
322
00:20:27,870 --> 00:20:30,750
decided that I didn't
want to play bass anymore,
323
00:20:30,750 --> 00:20:34,283
I wanted to play guitar and so I left.
324
00:20:40,150 --> 00:20:41,936
- Brian is kind of
running the gig initially
325
00:20:41,936 --> 00:20:45,800
and the management team
who came to see them
326
00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:48,680
play in Richmond and signed them up
327
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:51,380
is this young hustler
called Andrew Loog Oldham
328
00:20:51,380 --> 00:20:54,853
and Eric Easton who was
much more a traditional
329
00:20:54,853 --> 00:20:57,160
English showbiz kind of guy.
330
00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:00,581
- He was working with the
Beatles on their publicity
331
00:21:00,581 --> 00:21:04,510
and he was looking for
something more of his own,
332
00:21:04,510 --> 00:21:07,283
something he could move on
from just being a publicist.
333
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:15,221
- I think the reason Andrew
didn't want him in the band
334
00:21:15,221 --> 00:21:17,817
was because he didn't feel that his look
335
00:21:17,817 --> 00:21:21,490
was quite right to the image.
336
00:21:21,490 --> 00:21:25,650
- He initially saw that the
route for the Stones to take
337
00:21:25,650 --> 00:21:27,909
was a similar kind of
route the Beatles took
338
00:21:27,909 --> 00:21:31,629
where Brian had Epstein
knocked off the rough edges
339
00:21:31,629 --> 00:21:35,070
and promoted them as a more acceptable,
340
00:21:35,070 --> 00:21:38,240
good, clean living lads
and all around entertainers
341
00:21:39,410 --> 00:21:42,205
and Andrew started in
that direction with them.
342
00:21:42,205 --> 00:21:43,840
They had suits that he bought for them
343
00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:48,420
which they swiftly lost or
mislaid, didn't wear 'em.
344
00:21:48,420 --> 00:21:49,790
- And I realized,
345
00:21:49,790 --> 00:21:51,880
'cause I didn't realize
when I first met them
346
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:53,630
that it was Brian's group
347
00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:57,570
and everything revolved around him.
348
00:21:57,570 --> 00:21:59,840
He was a top class musician, Brian,
349
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:01,370
really a great player.
350
00:22:01,370 --> 00:22:03,620
The whole group was good but you just knew
351
00:22:03,620 --> 00:22:06,150
that he was the leader somehow or another.
352
00:22:06,150 --> 00:22:09,110
He even got paid more
money than anybody else,
353
00:22:09,110 --> 00:22:10,660
unbeknownst to the other Stones
354
00:22:11,517 --> 00:22:14,829
and I remember when they found
out they weren't pleased.
355
00:22:14,829 --> 00:22:19,829
- During the tour in 1963, the end of 1963
356
00:22:20,185 --> 00:22:21,770
when they're supporting
the Everly Brothers,
357
00:22:21,770 --> 00:22:23,930
it emerges during that time
358
00:22:23,930 --> 00:22:27,100
that he's getting this
additional five pounds a week
359
00:22:27,100 --> 00:22:31,060
to everyone else and
Keith Richards later said
360
00:22:31,060 --> 00:22:32,020
when we found that out,
361
00:22:32,020 --> 00:22:34,220
that was the beginning
of the end for Brian.
362
00:22:45,145 --> 00:22:46,760
- I think it would've been Mick
363
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:50,730
rang me and said that they
were doing some recordings
364
00:22:50,730 --> 00:22:54,521
and could I go along and
do a number with them
365
00:22:54,521 --> 00:22:58,620
and then Andrew obviously was there
366
00:22:58,620 --> 00:23:02,110
and in fact Phil Spector
was also in the studio
367
00:23:02,110 --> 00:23:04,560
at the same time 'cause
Andrew was a great fan
368
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,240
of Phil Spector's.
369
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:08,090
On that record that I did with them
370
00:23:08,090 --> 00:23:09,840
you can hear the influence,
371
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,650
that big sort of wall of sound.
372
00:23:12,650 --> 00:23:15,860
- I thought he was really
important in the studio.
373
00:23:15,860 --> 00:23:19,630
He wasn't a producer in the
technical sense, I don't believe
374
00:23:19,630 --> 00:23:23,303
but he was a producer
in an emotional sense.
375
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:26,560
- We used to laugh and talk about
376
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:29,470
can you imagine Mick
doing this when he's 40.
377
00:23:29,470 --> 00:23:32,660
It was unheard of and
we used to talk about
378
00:23:32,660 --> 00:23:35,380
what are we gonna do
when all this was over
379
00:23:35,380 --> 00:23:37,440
'cause we were all convinced
this was gonna last
380
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:40,610
one or two years and we'd
have to get a proper job.
381
00:23:40,610 --> 00:23:42,930
We just had no idea it was gonna last
382
00:23:42,930 --> 00:23:47,203
or had no idea it was gonna
rock the world like it did.
383
00:24:01,224 --> 00:24:03,020
- I didn't really see too much of Brian
384
00:24:03,020 --> 00:24:05,900
until myself and the Pretty Things
385
00:24:05,900 --> 00:24:10,240
which by then we were doing pretty well.
386
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:14,300
We got a house in Belgravia
387
00:24:14,300 --> 00:24:18,837
which is a very posh part of
London which we were renting
388
00:24:18,837 --> 00:24:23,200
and the guy who had the flat downstairs
389
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:26,441
was letting Brian who wasn't
very fond of paying rent,
390
00:24:26,441 --> 00:24:29,260
he was staying in the basement
391
00:24:29,260 --> 00:24:34,260
so then we basically saw a
lot more of one another again.
392
00:24:34,420 --> 00:24:36,060
- We were both gigging
393
00:24:36,060 --> 00:24:37,838
so we got home about an hour before
394
00:24:37,838 --> 00:24:40,650
and we're all getting stoned
395
00:24:40,650 --> 00:24:43,500
and that happened to be the day
396
00:24:43,500 --> 00:24:46,001
that Five by Five EP came out
397
00:24:46,001 --> 00:24:50,720
so we put it on, we're listening
to it, completely stoned,
398
00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:52,627
having a laugh like you do
399
00:24:52,627 --> 00:24:55,880
and Brian came in and he saw us
400
00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:57,770
sitting around the record player
401
00:24:57,770 --> 00:25:00,070
and laughing with this record on.
402
00:25:00,070 --> 00:25:02,210
So he came rushing back with a ukulele
403
00:25:02,210 --> 00:25:06,730
and smashed it over
Viv's head, good friends.
404
00:25:06,730 --> 00:25:09,993
So Viv is sitting there
wearing this ukulele like,
405
00:25:10,913 --> 00:25:12,837
I wasn't wearing this before.
406
00:25:12,837 --> 00:25:16,100
And Brian was convinced
we were taking the piss
407
00:25:16,100 --> 00:25:18,777
out of the record and when
went away a week later
408
00:25:18,777 --> 00:25:23,021
he got all our singles and
he melted them with a lighter
409
00:25:23,021 --> 00:25:26,350
and stuck them on the wall of the bathroom
410
00:25:26,350 --> 00:25:30,220
and wrote in shaving
foam, you fucking cunts,
411
00:25:30,220 --> 00:25:34,950
you fucking wankers
because he really thought,
412
00:25:34,950 --> 00:25:38,829
and we hadn't, we were
really enjoying the record.
413
00:25:38,829 --> 00:25:41,240
That's paranoia for you.
414
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,750
- Brian was maybe less
of a happy character
415
00:25:43,750 --> 00:25:46,660
than when I used to know him, I must say,
416
00:25:46,660 --> 00:25:49,105
even though the Stones were by that time
417
00:25:49,105 --> 00:25:51,390
very, very successful.
418
00:25:51,390 --> 00:25:52,700
- No one in the British public
419
00:25:52,700 --> 00:25:55,410
really knows about the tensions
that have begun to appear
420
00:25:55,410 --> 00:25:57,420
with in this band but Brian is seen
421
00:25:57,420 --> 00:25:59,900
as the personification
of the Rolling Stones.
422
00:25:59,900 --> 00:26:01,310
- I think the most important thing to us
423
00:26:01,310 --> 00:26:02,300
is when we go on stage
424
00:26:02,300 --> 00:26:04,710
is that we succeed in
communicating to an audience
425
00:26:04,710 --> 00:26:06,620
and the only way we can
do this is to produce
426
00:26:06,620 --> 00:26:09,700
an exciting atmosphere
therefore if the kids scream
427
00:26:09,700 --> 00:26:13,113
we love it, we react to their reaction.
428
00:26:18,865 --> 00:26:19,973
- Bill was the only one
429
00:26:19,973 --> 00:26:22,437
who was coming to the house and stayed.
430
00:26:22,437 --> 00:26:25,917
Very often, you know, sleep there
431
00:26:25,917 --> 00:26:30,917
and I knew that Bill was
really, he really liked Brian.
432
00:26:33,850 --> 00:26:37,120
But the others I knew, I knew I could feel
433
00:26:37,120 --> 00:26:41,577
that there was a sort of
bad feeling about him.
434
00:26:41,577 --> 00:26:45,414
But Brian was really a nice boy.
435
00:26:45,414 --> 00:26:48,325
He was crying almost every night.
436
00:26:48,325 --> 00:26:52,860
He was telling me about the
film he wanted to do with me
437
00:26:52,860 --> 00:26:56,577
and he was telling me
how vulgar were the songs
438
00:26:56,577 --> 00:26:58,405
of Keith and Mick.
439
00:26:58,405 --> 00:27:02,010
Oh yeah, he was really
pissed off with them already
440
00:27:02,889 --> 00:27:06,410
because he thought that
it was not the music
441
00:27:06,410 --> 00:27:11,367
that he really loved and that
the old group was his group
442
00:27:11,367 --> 00:27:13,940
and suddenly he was feeling that the group
443
00:27:13,940 --> 00:27:15,720
was escaping from him.
444
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:17,620
- He still felt he was leader of the group
445
00:27:17,620 --> 00:27:19,610
for the couple years after it started
446
00:27:19,610 --> 00:27:21,840
and he used to be a bit
bitter under the surface
447
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:23,507
that Mick was the leader
of the group, not him,
448
00:27:23,507 --> 00:27:25,837
and the fact that they were recording
449
00:27:25,837 --> 00:27:27,743
all Mick and Keith's songs.
450
00:27:27,743 --> 00:27:30,720
Brian was incapable of writing music
451
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:32,263
and so I'm not really sure
what else he wanted them to do.
452
00:27:33,785 --> 00:27:36,357
- Keith and Mick realized it early on
453
00:27:36,357 --> 00:27:40,460
and Andrew realized early on
that the money was to be made
454
00:27:40,460 --> 00:27:45,460
both working and composing
and doing your own songs.
455
00:27:46,120 --> 00:27:49,297
A matter of necessity would change
456
00:27:49,297 --> 00:27:51,700
the direction of the band.
457
00:27:51,700 --> 00:27:53,330
- No, we're sort of developing
458
00:27:53,330 --> 00:27:55,810
in lots of different
directions musically, I think.
459
00:27:55,810 --> 00:27:59,000
- Brian's big complaint to me was he got
460
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:04,000
a bigger mailbag as Mick
and he wanted to sing a song
461
00:28:04,140 --> 00:28:06,997
and I said fuck off, Mick's
462
00:28:08,977 --> 00:28:10,913
sing a song, you can't,
he probably could sing.
463
00:28:10,913 --> 00:28:13,493
I said why are you rocking the boat?
464
00:28:13,493 --> 00:28:15,880
Get on with it.
465
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:17,507
He said, "Yeah but you know,
466
00:28:17,507 --> 00:28:19,790
"I got as many a fans as Mick."
467
00:28:19,790 --> 00:28:23,070
So that was his big beef.
468
00:28:23,070 --> 00:28:25,830
- By the time of the third American tour
469
00:28:25,830 --> 00:28:30,510
Brian is starting to get into
what we see as his demise.
470
00:28:30,510 --> 00:28:32,660
He's very into uppers,
he's also drinking a lot,
471
00:28:32,660 --> 00:28:33,930
Brian also drank a lot
472
00:28:33,930 --> 00:28:38,180
and later you would see
this puffiness on his face.
473
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,380
- Satisfaction changed
everything not only in terms
474
00:28:56,380 --> 00:28:58,269
of the commercial success of the band,
475
00:28:58,269 --> 00:29:01,930
the broadness of the audience,
the success in America,
476
00:29:01,930 --> 00:29:04,460
all of those things but it also changed
477
00:29:04,460 --> 00:29:06,761
the dynamic of the band
because Mick and Keith
478
00:29:06,761 --> 00:29:09,650
were suddenly established
as the songwriters.
479
00:29:09,650 --> 00:29:11,670
Suddenly the band was going to be doing
480
00:29:11,670 --> 00:29:14,530
their original material and that changed
481
00:29:14,530 --> 00:29:16,580
the dynamic of the band.
482
00:29:16,580 --> 00:29:17,970
- Once that was established,
483
00:29:17,970 --> 00:29:20,425
the focus or the tension in the band
484
00:29:20,425 --> 00:29:24,770
changed to the lead singer
and the lead guitarist
485
00:29:24,770 --> 00:29:26,120
who were writing the songs.
486
00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:27,730
Brian got sidelined
487
00:29:27,730 --> 00:29:29,557
and Brian couldn't take
that kind of thing.
488
00:29:29,557 --> 00:29:32,258
It was a massive blow to his self esteem.
489
00:29:32,258 --> 00:29:35,245
- That's why he started to drink more,
490
00:29:35,245 --> 00:29:38,040
take more pills every day
491
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:40,530
and there was always nice people to bring
492
00:29:40,530 --> 00:29:45,210
huge quantities of pills for Brian.
493
00:29:45,210 --> 00:29:48,800
- He was unequipped for
fame, he was fragile
494
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,641
and he was quite comfortable
while he was emulating
495
00:29:51,641 --> 00:29:55,970
the inspiration or aspects of these heroes
496
00:29:55,970 --> 00:29:59,665
like Muddy Waters or
Bo Diddley or whoever.
497
00:29:59,665 --> 00:30:02,545
He was comfortable in his own world.
498
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:20,190
Soon as they try to move him out of that
499
00:30:20,190 --> 00:30:23,120
and get him to write his own
songs he was uncomfortable.
500
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,343
- Pop songwriting was not something
501
00:30:26,343 --> 00:30:28,470
that he could easily knock off
502
00:30:28,470 --> 00:30:32,317
and Brian was extremely instrumental,
503
00:30:33,750 --> 00:30:37,165
fundamentally instrumental
in making every one
504
00:30:37,165 --> 00:30:42,165
of those hit songs immortal
by his contributions.
505
00:30:43,890 --> 00:30:45,713
- Yes, I think he was highly thought of.
506
00:30:45,713 --> 00:30:50,713
He was clearly extremely
adept as a musician.
507
00:30:51,020 --> 00:30:53,787
He was able to play almost any instrument.
508
00:30:53,787 --> 00:30:57,600
- Things like Under My Thumb
where he played marimba
509
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:01,380
and then he played sitar of
course on Paint It Black.
510
00:31:01,380 --> 00:31:03,890
He could pick up an instrument
whether it be an oboe
511
00:31:03,890 --> 00:31:08,890
or Mellotron and he could
change the aspect of the song
512
00:31:09,009 --> 00:31:11,229
so that it became a hit.
513
00:31:11,229 --> 00:31:13,563
He made hit records.
514
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:29,681
- Acid is an extraordinary tool to explore
515
00:31:29,681 --> 00:31:34,540
magical dimensions that
exist within oneself.
516
00:31:34,540 --> 00:31:39,540
When Brian felt comfortable
and saw the wealth
517
00:31:41,860 --> 00:31:45,250
and the benefit of these things,
518
00:31:45,250 --> 00:31:48,360
being ultrasensitive as an individual,
519
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:52,560
he would easily fall prey to undue fears.
520
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,885
- Brian was definitely
the most experimental
521
00:31:55,885 --> 00:32:00,885
in terms of drug use
at that point in time.
522
00:32:01,300 --> 00:32:04,001
He was a tortured soul.
523
00:32:04,001 --> 00:32:06,100
He was out of balance.
524
00:32:06,100 --> 00:32:09,039
He had psychological issues.
525
00:32:09,039 --> 00:32:12,810
Looking back, I think probably he was
526
00:32:12,810 --> 00:32:17,810
an undiagnosed bipolar,
unmedicated bipolar.
527
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:20,760
We were all too young
and too inexperienced
528
00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:24,000
to know how to deal with that.
529
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:27,167
I mean, yes, he was a cracked person,
530
00:34:05,810 --> 00:34:10,440
- Anita was an extraordinary personality,
531
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:13,750
was so vibrant and so intelligent
532
00:34:13,750 --> 00:34:18,750
and so inspiring and so
avant guard in her sexuality
533
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:24,240
and everything else that obviously Brian
534
00:34:24,240 --> 00:34:27,020
would be hopelessly in love with her
535
00:34:27,020 --> 00:34:28,840
and remain hopelessly in love with her
536
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:31,173
despite all the other girls.
537
00:34:51,060 --> 00:34:53,134
- She scared me a bit, I found her scary.
538
00:34:53,134 --> 00:34:56,374
I think she was very intelligent
539
00:34:56,374 --> 00:35:00,180
but she got into some weird areas.
540
00:35:00,180 --> 00:35:02,620
- When she came and joined Brian
541
00:35:02,620 --> 00:35:05,990
at a break in the tour in Miami
542
00:35:05,990 --> 00:35:08,380
they certainly did a lot of acid
543
00:35:08,380 --> 00:35:10,340
over a couple days that she stayed
544
00:35:11,180 --> 00:35:13,489
and I think everybody knew that.
545
00:35:13,489 --> 00:35:16,660
I don't recall anybody else doing acid
546
00:35:16,660 --> 00:35:18,820
at that particular moment in time.
547
00:35:18,820 --> 00:35:22,740
- Keith Richards was with
this girl called Linda Keith
548
00:35:22,740 --> 00:35:27,130
who left him and he was
very cut up about it
549
00:35:27,130 --> 00:35:30,580
so he took refuge with Brian and Anita.
550
00:35:30,580 --> 00:35:33,610
- Kind of reignited Brian and Keith,
551
00:35:33,610 --> 00:35:35,920
the friendship that
they had when the lived
552
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:40,320
together in Fuller but there's
a lot of drugs going on.
553
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:44,670
- They always blame Anita
for everything that happened
554
00:35:44,670 --> 00:35:47,300
but it's totally unfair because Brian
555
00:35:47,300 --> 00:35:52,300
was not by any stretch of the
imagination a faithful guy.
556
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:58,520
- Brian was a very touching character.
557
00:35:58,570 --> 00:36:03,570
You could not help being intrigued by him.
558
00:36:03,605 --> 00:36:07,666
There was something very
vulnerable about him,
559
00:36:07,666 --> 00:36:12,666
very sensitive, he had an
incredible insight into people
560
00:36:14,030 --> 00:36:17,370
an almost devilish insight.
561
00:36:17,370 --> 00:36:20,370
Now that was the mean side of him
562
00:36:20,370 --> 00:36:23,570
that if he saw through people
563
00:36:23,570 --> 00:36:28,570
and then used what he felt
was their weakness somehow
564
00:36:28,630 --> 00:36:30,880
to torture them.
565
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,380
- He invited me around to his apartment
566
00:36:33,380 --> 00:36:36,139
with his girlfriend,
we had dinner together
567
00:36:36,139 --> 00:36:41,139
and I sold him a German
uniform he bought from me
568
00:36:41,539 --> 00:36:44,329
'cause I was so military
at the time as well.
569
00:36:44,329 --> 00:36:49,329
- And he had this need
to challenge people,
570
00:36:50,770 --> 00:36:55,761
challenge the public by
showing up in a Nazi uniform
571
00:36:55,761 --> 00:37:00,761
which you could do that maybe in London
572
00:37:01,261 --> 00:37:06,261
but in Munich it was not funny.
573
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:09,560
- Towards the end of that summer,
574
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:13,410
Brian and Anita go to Morocco
575
00:37:13,410 --> 00:37:17,420
where Brian and Anita have a huge row
576
00:37:17,420 --> 00:37:21,010
and Brian tries to punch
her, maybe does punch her
577
00:37:21,010 --> 00:37:23,880
but certainly punches the
wall and breaks his hand.
578
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,220
- He did break his
wrist one time in Africa
579
00:37:27,220 --> 00:37:31,290
and from then on he just
didn't wanna play guitar.
580
00:37:31,290 --> 00:37:34,790
He played soprano sax on a Beatles B-side.
581
00:37:49,790 --> 00:37:54,200
- One day on the set,
Anita came to see me.
582
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:59,200
Brian had left and she
said Brian is asking
583
00:37:59,620 --> 00:38:02,023
whether he could do the
music for the movie.
584
00:38:03,070 --> 00:38:04,944
I was speechless.
585
00:38:04,944 --> 00:38:08,102
You don't turn down the offer of a Stone
586
00:38:08,102 --> 00:38:12,410
to do your music in 1967.
587
00:38:12,410 --> 00:38:17,410
Allen Klein just had taken over
the management of the Stones
588
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:22,876
and Brian said you got to
come with me to see him
589
00:38:22,876 --> 00:38:25,998
and he was as scared of
him, I think, as I was
590
00:38:25,998 --> 00:38:30,640
and convince him that he let me do this.
591
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:35,180
And a couple of months
later during which time
592
00:38:35,180 --> 00:38:38,391
he was supposed to compose the music
593
00:38:38,391 --> 00:38:41,041
he was in very bad shape.
594
00:38:41,041 --> 00:38:45,100
He was not always in the
state that he could work
595
00:38:45,100 --> 00:38:47,331
or focus or concentrate
596
00:38:47,331 --> 00:38:50,670
or even show up before one at night or so.
597
00:38:50,670 --> 00:38:53,030
He asked for a lot of musicians,
598
00:38:53,030 --> 00:38:56,747
a wonderful pianist,
Nicky Hopkins, to come in.
599
00:38:56,747 --> 00:39:00,320
Keith Richards fortunately showed up
600
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:03,593
who saved the recording session.
601
00:39:04,610 --> 00:39:07,420
- Jimmy Page plays on that for example
602
00:39:07,420 --> 00:39:11,780
and the soundtrack never came out as an LP
603
00:39:11,780 --> 00:39:15,040
but it's sensational, in fact.
604
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:20,040
- I was in the recording studio
when it became vividly clear
605
00:39:22,650 --> 00:39:27,650
that the band were going in
a direction without Andrew.
606
00:39:28,010 --> 00:39:31,630
They were recording Satanic,
the tension was really
607
00:39:31,630 --> 00:39:34,810
increasingly unpleasant,
particularly Mick and Keith
608
00:39:34,810 --> 00:39:37,680
were coming to the
sessions later and later.
609
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:40,940
- In 67 when I stayed with him
610
00:39:40,940 --> 00:39:44,103
we started working on stuff together
611
00:39:44,103 --> 00:39:47,419
which was very avant guard
612
00:39:47,419 --> 00:39:50,620
because he was always ahead of the curve
613
00:39:50,620 --> 00:39:53,980
and he wanted to do some proto rap things
614
00:39:53,980 --> 00:39:57,587
with my using words that
I was coming up with
615
00:39:57,587 --> 00:40:02,587
and saying oh can we use this
but not on a separate project,
616
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:04,590
on a Rolling Stones project,
617
00:40:04,590 --> 00:40:07,123
so he was convinced that
this would somehow fit.
618
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:19,430
- Sergeant Norman Pilcher
was an opportunist career cop
619
00:40:19,430 --> 00:40:22,563
based in the London drug
squadron in the 1960's.
620
00:40:22,563 --> 00:40:26,530
He made a name for
himself during the decade
621
00:40:26,530 --> 00:40:28,350
for busting high profile pop stars.
622
00:40:28,350 --> 00:40:31,294
- Sergeant Pilcher was
known as the groupie cop.
623
00:40:31,294 --> 00:40:35,855
He busted John Lennon and Yoko Ono,
624
00:40:35,855 --> 00:40:40,855
George Harrison and it's
always very dubious.
625
00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:43,700
- Pilcher's first strike
on the music industry
626
00:40:43,700 --> 00:40:46,500
occurred in 1966 where
he went for Donovan.
627
00:40:46,500 --> 00:40:50,180
This dovetailed with the
News of the World article
628
00:40:50,180 --> 00:40:52,560
Pop Stars and Drugs, so it
was obvious from that point
629
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:56,433
that the press were working
hand in hand with the police.
630
00:40:56,433 --> 00:41:00,840
Brian Jones, he had the
misfortune to meet two reporters
631
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:02,930
undercover from News of the World
632
00:41:02,930 --> 00:41:06,380
and who managed to talk him into revealing
633
00:41:06,380 --> 00:41:09,680
all sorts of detail about his drug use.
634
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:11,940
When Brian would continually
reference his leader
635
00:41:11,940 --> 00:41:13,260
of the Rolling Stones status
636
00:41:13,260 --> 00:41:15,140
they scurried back to their offices
637
00:41:15,140 --> 00:41:17,135
to say we've got Mick Jagger
talking about drug use.
638
00:41:17,135 --> 00:41:20,160
This in turn went into the second feature
639
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,325
of Pop Stars and Drugs
saying that Mick Jagger
640
00:41:22,325 --> 00:41:26,410
had been in a club in London
talking about his drug use.
641
00:41:26,410 --> 00:41:27,810
When this was disseminated
642
00:41:27,810 --> 00:41:29,360
at the Rolling Stones organization
643
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:31,620
Mick Jagger who was in Italy at the time
644
00:41:31,620 --> 00:41:34,279
slapped liable suit on
the News of the World.
645
00:41:34,279 --> 00:41:37,550
So the News of the
World were in a quandary
646
00:41:37,550 --> 00:41:40,590
and the only way they could
embarrass the liable suit
647
00:41:40,590 --> 00:41:43,030
was to find Mick Jagger
in possession of drugs.
648
00:41:43,030 --> 00:41:45,610
Now, within the next few days
649
00:41:45,610 --> 00:41:47,525
a furious amount of activity went on
650
00:41:47,525 --> 00:41:50,750
to penetrate the Rolling
Stones organization,
651
00:41:50,750 --> 00:41:54,100
penetrate Mick and Keith's movements
652
00:41:54,100 --> 00:41:55,650
and as luck would have it for them
653
00:41:55,650 --> 00:41:58,980
that a party was being
held at Redlands in Sussex
654
00:41:58,980 --> 00:41:59,930
which was gonna be attended
655
00:41:59,930 --> 00:42:01,370
by Mick Jagger and Keith Richards.
656
00:42:01,370 --> 00:42:05,130
- The Redlands bust, which is February 67,
657
00:42:05,130 --> 00:42:06,690
Brian isn't there.
658
00:42:06,690 --> 00:42:08,810
In fact, he's not there
because he's been working
659
00:42:08,810 --> 00:42:11,190
on the soundtrack of A Degree of Murder
660
00:42:11,190 --> 00:42:13,267
and he and Anita are
supposed to go down there.
661
00:42:13,267 --> 00:42:15,890
- The party took place
and the News of the World
662
00:42:15,890 --> 00:42:17,130
tipped off the local police
663
00:42:17,130 --> 00:42:19,470
who mounted a raid on the property.
664
00:42:19,470 --> 00:42:21,630
They found a few roaches,
665
00:42:21,630 --> 00:42:23,140
they found in a coat of Mick Jagger's
666
00:42:23,140 --> 00:42:24,870
four amphetamine pills
which would have been
667
00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:27,050
legally acquired in Italy.
668
00:42:27,050 --> 00:42:28,550
More damning for one of their party,
669
00:42:28,550 --> 00:42:31,340
Robert Fraser they found
20 plus heroin tablets
670
00:42:31,340 --> 00:42:32,840
in his jacket pocket.
671
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:34,450
But as far as News of
the World was concerned
672
00:42:34,450 --> 00:42:36,650
it meant they'd embarrassed
the liable suit.
673
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,570
- They decide to go to Morocco
674
00:42:47,570 --> 00:42:50,270
and then they drive down to through France
675
00:42:50,270 --> 00:42:53,150
and on the first day Brian is
sitting in the back of the car
676
00:42:53,150 --> 00:42:55,220
just rolling immense joints
677
00:42:55,220 --> 00:42:59,090
and eventually he basically collapses,
678
00:42:59,090 --> 00:43:00,950
he kind of has an asthmatic attack
679
00:43:00,950 --> 00:43:02,630
and they leave him in hospital
680
00:43:02,630 --> 00:43:04,660
and they continue on their way.
681
00:43:04,660 --> 00:43:07,662
He's gonna join them when
he gets out of hospital.
682
00:43:07,662 --> 00:43:12,662
- Anita didn't callously
abandon Brian for Keith.
683
00:43:13,930 --> 00:43:18,420
This affair started but she
was torn between two lovers
684
00:43:18,420 --> 00:43:20,720
and she wrote, what people don't know
685
00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:24,420
is that she wrote every day to Brian
686
00:43:24,420 --> 00:43:26,320
and Brian every day to her.
687
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:30,800
Indeed, Brian made me
read Anita's letters.
688
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:34,530
In this case he pushed the wrong buttons
689
00:43:34,530 --> 00:43:36,360
and got the wrong effects
690
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:40,470
and he could've, when he
got more physical with her
691
00:43:40,470 --> 00:43:43,330
to put it mildly there was a problem,
692
00:43:43,330 --> 00:43:46,700
what would they do and they decided
693
00:43:46,700 --> 00:43:48,800
that to avoid a worse problem
694
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:51,050
the best thing to do was to leave.
695
00:43:51,050 --> 00:43:53,010
- They split to Tangiers
696
00:43:53,010 --> 00:43:55,880
and they leave Brian with the bill.
697
00:43:55,880 --> 00:44:00,130
There was kind of a lot of
nastiness towards Brian.
698
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:24,260
- The problem is that Brian felt abandoned
699
00:44:24,260 --> 00:44:26,540
and being paranoid he felt,
700
00:44:26,540 --> 00:44:28,760
oh, they've left me behind sort of thing.
701
00:44:28,760 --> 00:44:32,600
He was devastated by being left behind
702
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:35,210
but after the fact he told me
703
00:44:35,210 --> 00:44:38,290
that he was himself to blame.
704
00:44:38,290 --> 00:44:42,350
- During the sessions
when we recorded in London
705
00:44:42,350 --> 00:44:46,340
everything was more or less
fine with Anita and Brian
706
00:44:46,340 --> 00:44:49,400
even though she was very
upset that he didn't
707
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,370
make more of this opportunity
708
00:44:52,370 --> 00:44:56,560
and the fact that Keith
stepped in to help out
709
00:44:56,560 --> 00:45:00,130
and to get the thing done
should've been a hint
710
00:45:00,130 --> 00:45:01,753
but I was unaware of it.
711
00:45:03,260 --> 00:45:05,590
Two months later the film premiered
712
00:45:05,590 --> 00:45:07,438
at the Cannes Film Festival.
713
00:45:07,438 --> 00:45:10,840
Anita showed up with Brian, of course,
714
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:13,093
and we were on the red carpet and all that
715
00:45:13,093 --> 00:45:17,730
and it was a great event
but Keith was there as well.
716
00:45:17,730 --> 00:45:21,100
- Brian was determined to get Anita back.
717
00:45:21,100 --> 00:45:24,450
These arrangements were made
and much to Brian's relief
718
00:45:24,450 --> 00:45:27,300
I went with him to
Cannes with the intention
719
00:45:27,300 --> 00:45:32,300
of seeing whether we could
engineer a reconciliation
720
00:45:32,530 --> 00:45:36,290
between Brian and Anita.
721
00:45:36,290 --> 00:45:41,290
It was a very joyous night
and it was full of affection
722
00:45:41,720 --> 00:45:46,720
and good times but it became
very clear to all of us
723
00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:51,270
that she would not go back to Brian.
724
00:45:51,270 --> 00:45:55,470
I told Brian, look, the best thing to do
725
00:45:55,470 --> 00:45:57,674
is let's fly in Suki.
726
00:45:57,674 --> 00:46:01,960
I thought she'd be a good substitute
727
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:05,620
and indeed she was for a
while a very good substitute
728
00:46:05,620 --> 00:46:08,440
and she took it but she wasn't Anita.
729
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:12,460
She had the looks but she
didn't have the character,
730
00:46:12,460 --> 00:46:16,850
she didn't have this amazing Anita vibe.
731
00:46:16,850 --> 00:46:19,710
- What I firmly
believe was the turning point
732
00:46:19,710 --> 00:46:23,820
in Brian's life was when
he lost the only girl
733
00:46:23,820 --> 00:46:25,922
he ever really loved.
734
00:46:25,922 --> 00:46:29,384
I think this was a very
severe blow to him.
735
00:46:29,384 --> 00:46:34,100
He changed suddenly and alarmingly
736
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:37,874
from a bright, enthusiastic young man
737
00:46:37,874 --> 00:46:42,874
to a quiet and morose and
inward-looking young man.
738
00:46:45,900 --> 00:46:48,710
- Very interestingly on
the day Mick and Keith
739
00:46:48,710 --> 00:46:51,370
were formally charged
with possession of drugs
740
00:46:51,370 --> 00:46:53,270
following the Redlands raid,
741
00:46:53,270 --> 00:46:56,830
Pilcher's squad mounted
a raid on Brian's flat
742
00:46:56,830 --> 00:46:59,560
in South Kensington on Courtfield Road
743
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:01,013
where Brian was present.
744
00:47:04,740 --> 00:47:09,590
- We arrived fairly late in the evening
745
00:47:09,590 --> 00:47:12,620
and went to bed at Courtfield Road
746
00:47:13,909 --> 00:47:18,460
and in the morning the phone
was ringing off the hook
747
00:47:18,460 --> 00:47:21,570
and they were all calling
us because everybody
748
00:47:21,570 --> 00:47:25,003
seems to have been tipped
off that we would be busted.
749
00:47:26,122 --> 00:47:28,760
And they all said, have you been busted
750
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:30,970
and we said what are you talking about?
751
00:47:30,970 --> 00:47:33,430
We talked to Robert Fraser who said
752
00:47:33,430 --> 00:47:36,830
let me send Mohammad, my servant,
753
00:47:36,830 --> 00:47:39,875
to clean up Courtfield Road.
754
00:47:39,875 --> 00:47:41,957
And there was likelihood that
drugs were secluded somewhere
755
00:47:41,957 --> 00:47:45,320
and with a team of Pilcher's
squad raiding the place
756
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,240
they would probably find drugs
757
00:47:47,240 --> 00:47:50,030
but also which has later come to light
758
00:47:50,030 --> 00:47:51,760
it probably didn't matter
'cause Pilcher's squad
759
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:53,830
would probably bring
their own just in case.
760
00:47:53,830 --> 00:47:56,932
- When I went to the door to open the door
761
00:47:56,932 --> 00:47:59,410
for whom I took to be Mohammad
762
00:48:00,730 --> 00:48:03,560
there was this rush of people that again,
763
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:05,500
I took to be reporters.
764
00:48:05,500 --> 00:48:09,240
I tried to close the door but
they were faster than I was
765
00:48:09,240 --> 00:48:14,240
and they knocked me backwards
and then they rushed forward
766
00:48:14,460 --> 00:48:17,170
and steadied me before I hit the wall
767
00:48:17,170 --> 00:48:21,377
and said, "So sorry, sir,
but here we have a warrant
768
00:48:21,377 --> 00:48:24,124
"to search these premises for drugs."
769
00:48:24,124 --> 00:48:28,870
- The raid took place under
the glare of the press corps
770
00:48:28,870 --> 00:48:31,160
who were camped out outside the flat.
771
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:35,451
- They marched straight over
to where Brian had his bed
772
00:48:35,451 --> 00:48:38,770
on the floor, they flipped his mattress
773
00:48:38,770 --> 00:48:43,770
and very conveniently a kind
of cheap-o leather wallet
774
00:48:44,240 --> 00:48:48,230
came out and this cop with
a big smile on his face
775
00:48:48,230 --> 00:48:51,163
looked at it and it
was full of this grass.
776
00:48:52,354 --> 00:48:56,210
Then they found this empty vial
777
00:48:57,200 --> 00:48:59,537
and this cop said to us,
778
00:48:59,537 --> 00:49:03,542
"Ooh, I would like to know
what's been in there."
779
00:49:03,542 --> 00:49:05,550
And we said, "What?"
780
00:49:05,550 --> 00:49:09,787
I remember Brian, it was
like this stupid act, what!
781
00:49:09,787 --> 00:49:13,340
And he looked and he said, "Cocaine."
782
00:49:13,340 --> 00:49:14,760
And we went, "Oh no!"
783
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:19,760
You know, like this, and
he went yeah, but you know,
784
00:49:19,780 --> 00:49:23,060
what could be, I'm not
gonna charge you for that,
785
00:49:23,060 --> 00:49:26,400
am I, he said, what could be in there?
786
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,090
One thousandth, those are the exact words,
787
00:49:29,090 --> 00:49:33,410
I'll never forget them,
one thousandth of a grain?
788
00:49:33,410 --> 00:49:36,214
We were taken down to
Chelsea police station
789
00:49:36,214 --> 00:49:40,270
and it was a media frenzy.
790
00:49:40,270 --> 00:49:41,993
There were hundreds of reporters
791
00:49:41,993 --> 00:49:45,070
and suddenly someone from the office came
792
00:49:45,070 --> 00:49:47,737
and posted bail for both of us
793
00:49:47,737 --> 00:49:51,533
and so we were told
that we were free to go
794
00:49:51,533 --> 00:49:54,750
until the next day when
we had to go to court
795
00:49:54,750 --> 00:49:59,490
but meanwhile Brian was caving in slowly
796
00:49:59,490 --> 00:50:02,170
because his defense
said you better not see
797
00:50:02,170 --> 00:50:04,390
any of the other Rolling Stones,
798
00:50:04,390 --> 00:50:07,329
don't hang out with Stash too much.
799
00:50:07,329 --> 00:50:11,157
You gotta stay away because if
they bust you again together
800
00:50:11,157 --> 00:50:13,521
it could make your case worse
801
00:50:13,521 --> 00:50:17,501
so Brian got a bit isolated and then
802
00:50:17,501 --> 00:50:22,501
I was absolutely astounded
and both Brian and I
803
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:26,760
looked at each other in horror
because that's when we heard
804
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:31,645
the police lie and call
us naive if you will
805
00:50:31,645 --> 00:50:35,350
but we never expected Scotland Yard,
806
00:50:35,350 --> 00:50:36,620
we thought we can lie
807
00:50:36,620 --> 00:50:39,860
but they're not allowed to lie.
808
00:50:39,860 --> 00:50:43,070
But they did because
their account of the bust
809
00:50:43,070 --> 00:50:47,780
and what we said and so
on was so completely wrong
810
00:50:47,780 --> 00:50:52,780
and inaccurate that we
were absolutely horrified
811
00:50:53,070 --> 00:50:58,070
and so again we were remanded
to be tried by jury later on
812
00:50:59,005 --> 00:51:04,005
and during that time after
our second court appearance
813
00:51:05,060 --> 00:51:07,973
that's when Brian started to fall apart.
814
00:51:25,700 --> 00:51:29,600
Brian was somebody that
everybody looked up to.
815
00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:34,170
When he was on top of his
game nobody could beat him
816
00:51:34,170 --> 00:51:38,060
and certainly nobody
disrespected him in those days.
817
00:51:38,060 --> 00:51:42,660
Everybody deferred to him,
in the studio and everything.
818
00:51:42,660 --> 00:51:44,440
His word was king.
819
00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:49,440
He only lost that edge
when after we were busted
820
00:51:49,478 --> 00:51:54,200
and he was unfortunately
introduced to Mandrax
821
00:51:54,200 --> 00:51:58,670
and he took like a doctor order
to these prescription pills
822
00:51:58,670 --> 00:52:00,830
and started to overindulge in them
823
00:52:00,830 --> 00:52:03,840
and then he became absolutely useless.
824
00:52:03,840 --> 00:52:08,078
- Brian again being of
a rather weak nature
825
00:52:08,078 --> 00:52:12,626
would succumb to almost any temptation.
826
00:52:12,626 --> 00:52:16,000
He could resist anything but temptation.
827
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:19,630
- I remember seeing him at
Olympic being propped up
828
00:52:19,630 --> 00:52:24,300
in the booth and basically
given the instrument
829
00:52:24,300 --> 00:52:26,970
and he did play and he managed to play
830
00:52:26,970 --> 00:52:29,720
but he was almost falling over.
831
00:52:29,720 --> 00:52:33,943
So yes, it was very
difficult and it was tragic.
832
00:52:37,200 --> 00:52:39,940
- Earlier Jones admitted
that he'd allowed his flat
833
00:52:39,940 --> 00:52:42,250
in Courtfield Road in West Kensington
834
00:52:42,250 --> 00:52:44,570
to be used for drug taking.
835
00:52:44,570 --> 00:52:48,020
The prosecution said a
total of 35 and a quarter
836
00:52:48,020 --> 00:52:49,060
grains of cannabis,
837
00:52:49,060 --> 00:52:52,090
that's enough to make about
seven to 10 cigarettes
838
00:52:52,090 --> 00:52:53,496
were found in his flat.
839
00:52:53,496 --> 00:52:57,407
Jones is said to have told
police, "Yes, it is hash.
840
00:52:57,407 --> 00:53:00,347
"I do smoke it, but not cocaine, man.
841
00:53:00,347 --> 00:53:02,300
"That's not my scene."
842
00:53:02,300 --> 00:53:04,478
- None of us spoke like that.
843
00:53:04,478 --> 00:53:09,478
They just made it up to
make it sound plausible.
844
00:53:09,970 --> 00:53:12,937
So the whole thing was
completely trumped up.
845
00:53:12,937 --> 00:53:16,710
- Jones in evidence said he
had taken drugs in the past
846
00:53:16,710 --> 00:53:19,330
to a slight extent but
he'd now decided to have
847
00:53:19,330 --> 00:53:21,430
absolutely nothing to do with them.
848
00:53:21,430 --> 00:53:23,558
He was never really dependent on them
849
00:53:23,558 --> 00:53:26,580
but was only an occasional smoker.
850
00:53:26,580 --> 00:53:28,600
- He didn't listen to me, sadly.
851
00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:33,600
I went to the gallery, he did
the stupidest move of his life
852
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:36,420
which would prove fatal to him.
853
00:53:36,420 --> 00:53:37,794
He pled guilty.
854
00:53:37,794 --> 00:53:40,958
- When sentence was passed, Jones winced
855
00:53:40,958 --> 00:53:44,250
and a number of teenage
girls in the public gallery
856
00:53:44,250 --> 00:53:46,346
stood up and burst into tears.
857
00:53:52,330 --> 00:53:55,150
Passing sentence, Mr.
Reginald Seton, the chairman,
858
00:53:55,150 --> 00:53:58,030
told Jones you occupy a position
859
00:53:58,030 --> 00:54:00,640
by which you have a
large following of youth
860
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:04,010
and therefore it behooves
you to set an example.
861
00:54:04,010 --> 00:54:07,310
- So I think it's likely
that given the evidence
862
00:54:07,310 --> 00:54:10,760
was conclusive on Brian
that he had no other option
863
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:13,130
than to declare himself guilty.
864
00:54:13,130 --> 00:54:16,492
- He totally let down the side
865
00:54:16,492 --> 00:54:19,520
and it was a huge tactical miss,
866
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:23,166
a heartbreaking, huge tactical mistake.
867
00:54:23,166 --> 00:54:28,166
And a tragic mistake
because he was sentenced
868
00:54:28,656 --> 00:54:32,860
to jail time and there
was this manifestation
869
00:54:32,860 --> 00:54:37,100
and yes, he did spend the
night, then they released,
870
00:54:37,100 --> 00:54:41,092
had this nervous breakdown
almost and so on and so forth
871
00:54:41,092 --> 00:54:46,092
but it escalated where in October of 67
872
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:50,820
he had about a year and a half
to live, not quite two years.
873
00:54:50,820 --> 00:54:53,120
- His drug taking was obvious.
874
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:57,650
He was a victim and
easy prey for the police
875
00:54:57,650 --> 00:55:01,040
and the establishment so
they were picking on him.
876
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:04,500
Mick and Keith were much
stronger, they were resilient,
877
00:55:04,500 --> 00:55:06,490
they were able to cope
with it much better.
878
00:55:06,490 --> 00:55:11,010
They were able to even
exploit it in a positive way
879
00:55:11,010 --> 00:55:14,713
if that's possible but Brian
was just going downhill.
880
00:55:23,230 --> 00:55:26,060
- It was a plot to get
rid of the Rolling Stones
881
00:55:26,060 --> 00:55:31,060
once and for all and Brian
was seen as the anchor
882
00:55:31,210 --> 00:55:35,110
or the person who was the
best musician and so on
883
00:55:35,110 --> 00:55:38,310
and decapitating the Rolling Stones,
884
00:55:38,310 --> 00:55:40,210
you already had Mick and Keith,
885
00:55:40,210 --> 00:55:41,970
those guys were going to jail.
886
00:55:41,970 --> 00:55:46,021
If you jailed Brian that
was the end of the band
887
00:55:46,021 --> 00:55:48,260
and it was finished,
888
00:55:48,260 --> 00:55:50,760
there would be no Rolling Stones anymore
889
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:52,830
and this terrible influence
890
00:55:52,830 --> 00:55:57,320
that the Rolling Stones
would have on the youth
891
00:55:57,320 --> 00:56:01,730
was this menace, was being averted
892
00:56:01,730 --> 00:56:06,640
by this fucking
bowler-hatted establishment.
893
00:56:06,640 --> 00:56:08,490
- It's interesting because
where Mick and Keith
894
00:56:08,490 --> 00:56:10,720
in the Redlands raid were under advice
895
00:56:10,720 --> 00:56:14,284
to swear not guilty of the charges,
896
00:56:14,284 --> 00:56:18,892
Brian was advised to plead guilty.
897
00:56:18,892 --> 00:56:21,120
The circumstances of the Redlands raid
898
00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:23,856
were the evidence was flimsy.
899
00:56:23,856 --> 00:56:26,640
Brian's was perhaps more damning.
900
00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:31,470
- Brian just wasn't
equipped to cope with that
901
00:56:31,470 --> 00:56:33,840
and there was nobody to help.
902
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:38,088
We didn't know how to support him
903
00:56:38,088 --> 00:56:41,100
and he was a manipulative person
904
00:56:41,100 --> 00:56:46,083
and he was a person who would
push you to the very limits.
905
00:57:04,516 --> 00:57:06,520
- When I seen Brian just
a few months earlier,
906
00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:08,344
in January he came in the studio
907
00:57:08,344 --> 00:57:11,090
when I was working as a tape op
908
00:57:11,090 --> 00:57:14,220
for All Along the
Watchtower, Jimi Hendrix,
909
00:57:14,220 --> 00:57:16,744
and he came down hanging
out with his girlfriend.
910
00:57:16,744 --> 00:57:20,940
And he seemed really sharp and on the case
911
00:57:20,940 --> 00:57:24,139
and he didn't look overweight or anything,
912
00:57:24,139 --> 00:57:25,836
he looked pretty healthy
913
00:57:25,836 --> 00:57:30,064
and then to see him three
or four months later
914
00:57:30,064 --> 00:57:32,640
where he'd kind of put on a lot of weight,
915
00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:35,540
he was very puffy, that thing
you get when you drink a lot
916
00:57:35,540 --> 00:57:37,960
or you're taking drink and pills.
917
00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:40,530
It was something had been going on.
918
00:57:40,530 --> 00:57:42,690
He wasn't like unconscious,
919
00:57:42,690 --> 00:57:44,900
people have said so many
things about this guy.
920
00:57:44,900 --> 00:57:47,797
He could still function but
he obviously wasn't well.
921
00:57:47,797 --> 00:57:49,850
No one really bothered to talk to him,
922
00:57:49,850 --> 00:57:51,156
he was put in a booth.
923
00:57:51,156 --> 00:57:53,110
He's in the same room as everyone
924
00:57:53,110 --> 00:57:54,370
but they had screens all around him
925
00:57:54,370 --> 00:57:56,392
because he mainly was playing acoustic.
926
00:57:56,392 --> 00:57:59,870
He got treated pretty bad by that point
927
00:57:59,870 --> 00:58:01,610
but I think one of the highlights
928
00:58:01,610 --> 00:58:03,304
or the magic that you
were talking about earlier
929
00:58:03,304 --> 00:58:07,470
was the No Expectations and the solo
930
00:58:07,470 --> 00:58:09,406
that Brian played on that.
931
00:58:09,406 --> 00:58:13,840
If you think of the kind
of state he was in in a way
932
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:17,180
or perhaps they're not
getting as much from him
933
00:58:17,180 --> 00:58:19,830
as other members of the
band, let's put it that way,
934
00:58:19,830 --> 00:58:23,070
I disagree when people
have said that his mic
935
00:58:23,070 --> 00:58:24,730
wasn't even plugged in,
936
00:58:24,730 --> 00:58:27,345
that's just another kind
of let's get at Brian.
937
00:58:27,345 --> 00:58:29,660
If it was good it would've been used.
938
00:58:29,660 --> 00:58:32,150
If it wasn't it could be
replaced, we had eight tracks.
939
00:58:32,150 --> 00:58:35,160
But that night when he
played the solo on that
940
00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:37,013
it was just stunning.
941
00:58:44,487 --> 00:58:46,940
- We could call it
persecution if you like,
942
00:58:46,940 --> 00:58:50,880
we could call it some personal misconduct
943
00:58:50,880 --> 00:58:53,400
and the consequences thereof.
944
00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:55,610
However you approach it
945
00:58:55,610 --> 00:58:58,290
and however it's
acceptable to other people.
946
00:58:58,290 --> 00:59:02,120
- After that bust at Courtfield
Road he was on the run.
947
00:59:02,120 --> 00:59:04,920
He was paranoid, he
couldn't feel safe anywhere.
948
00:59:04,920 --> 00:59:06,980
He'd moved within Chelsea
949
00:59:06,980 --> 00:59:09,020
and yet then a second raid occurred.
950
00:59:09,020 --> 00:59:11,400
To me, this is far more obvious
that the drugs were planted
951
00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:13,440
because the marijuana that was found
952
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:15,480
was secreted in a ball of wool
953
00:59:15,480 --> 00:59:19,320
and what Brian Jones would
be doing with a ball of wool,
954
00:59:19,320 --> 00:59:20,470
certainly not knitting.
955
00:59:24,241 --> 00:59:27,689
- Thankfully for him he met
a fairly receptive magistrate
956
00:59:27,689 --> 00:59:30,765
and offered him a
lifeline but this lifeline
957
00:59:30,765 --> 00:59:34,498
was also dependent on
heavy psychological reports
958
00:59:34,498 --> 00:59:37,100
and if one actually sees
them you could see the state
959
00:59:37,100 --> 00:59:39,950
of Jones' shattered vizard at this point,
960
00:59:39,950 --> 00:59:41,200
he was absolutely broken.
961
00:59:49,274 --> 00:59:51,660
- Brian Jones had various
trips out to Morocco.
962
00:59:51,660 --> 00:59:53,420
He was enchanted with
the sights and the sounds
963
00:59:53,420 --> 00:59:56,570
and the aromas and when
he first heard these
964
00:59:56,570 --> 00:59:58,993
Pan Pipe players of
Joujouka from the tribes
965
00:59:58,993 --> 01:00:01,649
of the inter-lands of Morocco
966
01:00:01,649 --> 01:00:03,840
introduced to him by the artist,
967
01:00:03,840 --> 01:00:06,120
the left field artist Brion Gysin,
968
01:00:06,120 --> 01:00:09,370
and to him it validated
a lot of the sounds
969
01:00:09,370 --> 01:00:12,290
that were in his head and he
became enchanted with them.
970
01:00:12,290 --> 01:00:14,157
- A significant point about this is that
971
01:00:14,157 --> 01:00:16,730
Brian was like the first person really
972
01:00:16,730 --> 01:00:21,409
as a British popular music
to examine world music.
973
01:00:37,205 --> 01:00:40,080
- I think he was relieved
to have left the Stones.
974
01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:43,550
He was very determined
to, I think they call it,
975
01:00:43,550 --> 01:00:46,200
turn over the page, yes, he was.
976
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:48,630
Which is one of the reasons
he bought the house,
977
01:00:48,630 --> 01:00:50,550
I think, in the country,
978
01:00:50,550 --> 01:00:55,070
to be away from the nightlife
and everything rock n' roll.
979
01:00:55,070 --> 01:00:57,109
I think it's rock n'
roll, it wasn't the blues,
980
01:00:57,109 --> 01:00:58,410
it's the rock n' roll life.
981
01:00:58,410 --> 01:01:02,705
- He got over that and
was really planning ahead.
982
01:01:02,705 --> 01:01:06,900
He was wanting to form a new band
983
01:01:06,900 --> 01:01:09,420
and he was very excited
because of all the musicians
984
01:01:09,420 --> 01:01:11,370
that he'd heard in Morocco
985
01:01:11,370 --> 01:01:16,370
and it was what we now
would call world music.
986
01:01:17,110 --> 01:01:20,020
Brian actually asked me
if I would sing with them.
987
01:01:20,020 --> 01:01:21,610
- I think he was happy there.
988
01:01:21,610 --> 01:01:23,929
Sometimes he was lonely
but it was his decision
989
01:01:23,929 --> 01:01:28,929
to live in the country and be alone.
990
01:01:29,480 --> 01:01:32,029
He had many friends, people
that would come and see him
991
01:01:32,029 --> 01:01:35,597
but very often the
wrong people in my book.
992
01:01:35,597 --> 01:01:39,290
- When Brian left the Stones
his finances were reevaluated
993
01:01:39,290 --> 01:01:41,860
and even though he was
in for a large payment
994
01:01:41,860 --> 01:01:46,620
and a large retainer there
was no real ready cash.
995
01:01:46,620 --> 01:01:49,549
He didn't write songs,
he was not going to tour
996
01:01:49,549 --> 01:01:51,710
so he was only getting
mechanical royalties
997
01:01:51,710 --> 01:01:53,330
which, this was in 1969,
998
01:01:53,330 --> 01:01:55,330
so if we think of the
rest of the Rolling Stones
999
01:01:55,330 --> 01:01:57,210
who were fairly broke at that point
1000
01:01:57,210 --> 01:01:59,740
and soon would have to go into exile,
1001
01:01:59,740 --> 01:02:04,113
Brian's finances were going
to be even more challenged.
1002
01:02:04,113 --> 01:02:06,780
So it really all came to a head.
1003
01:02:56,470 --> 01:02:59,890
- The night of Brian's
death I was in the studio
1004
01:02:59,890 --> 01:03:04,150
with the Rolling Stones round
the corner here at Olympic
1005
01:03:04,150 --> 01:03:09,150
and around about 12 o'clock,
might've been a bit later,
1006
01:03:10,420 --> 01:03:14,446
Tom Keylock came into the Olympic Studios
1007
01:03:14,446 --> 01:03:19,150
and gathered Mick and a couple
of the other Stones around
1008
01:03:19,150 --> 01:03:23,210
and outside the control
room where I was sitting
1009
01:03:23,210 --> 01:03:26,250
with Marianne, finally Marianne went out,
1010
01:03:26,250 --> 01:03:28,960
was called out there
and went into a huddle
1011
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:31,390
and I think Tom put his arm around her
1012
01:03:31,390 --> 01:03:33,800
and she came back in, she was in tears
1013
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:37,000
and she told me that Brian had drowned
1014
01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:38,550
in his swimming pool that night
1015
01:03:40,460 --> 01:03:43,900
and they thought that
he got into difficulties
1016
01:03:43,900 --> 01:03:45,173
because of his asthma.
1017
01:03:46,180 --> 01:03:49,840
- July 3rd, 1969, I was
in the Stones office,
1018
01:03:49,840 --> 01:03:52,570
the news had come
through of Brian's death.
1019
01:03:52,570 --> 01:03:57,460
Everybody was genuinely shocked and upset
1020
01:03:57,460 --> 01:04:00,645
from the musicians to all
the people, of course.
1021
01:04:00,645 --> 01:04:04,670
- And I only knew that he died
1022
01:04:04,670 --> 01:04:08,505
because the police called
me the following morning
1023
01:04:08,505 --> 01:04:11,170
because they'd gone through his phone
1024
01:04:11,170 --> 01:04:15,363
and I was the last person
he called, so they said.
1025
01:04:16,540 --> 01:04:19,833
- The response to Brian's death was
1026
01:04:19,833 --> 01:04:22,243
it was an accident waiting to happen.
1027
01:04:24,100 --> 01:04:26,450
- We were stunned when he died
1028
01:04:26,450 --> 01:04:30,230
and stunned that he was drowned
1029
01:04:30,230 --> 01:04:31,973
because he was a strong swimmer.
1030
01:04:32,900 --> 01:04:36,092
- The combination of prescription pills,
1031
01:04:36,092 --> 01:04:40,577
downers and the like and alcohol
1032
01:04:40,577 --> 01:04:44,461
damaged his liver and his heart
1033
01:04:44,461 --> 01:04:47,650
and it was very depressing, all that.
1034
01:04:47,650 --> 01:04:52,533
- I was disappointed that
the verdict was what it was
1035
01:04:52,533 --> 01:04:56,490
and basically gave the
newspapers the ability to say
1036
01:04:56,490 --> 01:04:58,125
it was drugs and alcohol
1037
01:04:58,125 --> 01:05:01,410
but the only drugs he had that I could see
1038
01:05:01,410 --> 01:05:02,853
were prescription drugs.
1039
01:05:03,740 --> 01:05:06,243
- And the amount of alcohol
in his body was minor.
1040
01:05:07,120 --> 01:05:09,490
In my day when I was 27, 28,
1041
01:05:09,490 --> 01:05:10,741
I'd have to drink a hell of a lot
1042
01:05:10,741 --> 01:05:12,820
to do anything as stupid
1043
01:05:12,820 --> 01:05:16,190
as be unconscious in a swimming pool.
1044
01:05:16,190 --> 01:05:18,421
So none of it added up.
1045
01:05:18,421 --> 01:05:21,165
- I thought it was all a bit odd
1046
01:05:21,165 --> 01:05:24,877
and I questioned Mick
a little bit about it
1047
01:05:24,877 --> 01:05:26,370
and I said, well what happens now,
1048
01:05:26,370 --> 01:05:27,721
what are you gonna do.
1049
01:05:27,721 --> 01:05:31,367
And he said, "It goes on, it goes on."
1050
01:05:32,891 --> 01:05:34,478
I said, "What goes on?"
1051
01:05:34,478 --> 01:05:35,647
He said, "Everything."
1052
01:05:38,620 --> 01:05:40,909
And everything did go on.
1053
01:05:40,909 --> 01:05:43,300
Of course they got Mick Taylor involved
1054
01:05:43,300 --> 01:05:45,993
and did the Hyde Park concert.
1055
01:05:45,993 --> 01:05:49,220
- Peace, peace, he is not dead,
1056
01:05:49,220 --> 01:05:51,330
he does not sleep,
1057
01:05:51,330 --> 01:05:53,563
he has awakened from the dreams of life.
1058
01:05:53,563 --> 01:05:58,563
- When Mick read that
appalling Shelley poem,
1059
01:05:58,637 --> 01:06:01,890
it was stamped on some dead butterflies
1060
01:06:01,890 --> 01:06:05,176
and that was supposedly that.
1061
01:06:05,176 --> 01:06:08,297
- Invulnerable nothings.
1062
01:06:08,297 --> 01:06:11,569
We decay like corpses.
1063
01:06:21,670 --> 01:06:23,620
- I was extremely upset when Brian died
1064
01:06:24,649 --> 01:06:29,649
and the streets of Cheltenham
were absolutely packed.
1065
01:06:30,993 --> 01:06:32,620
And I mean packed.
1066
01:06:32,620 --> 01:06:34,930
- We weren't welcome at the funeral
1067
01:06:34,930 --> 01:06:38,356
because they didn't want
that kind of press attention,
1068
01:06:38,356 --> 01:06:43,356
especially since it was strongly
suspected when Brian died,
1069
01:06:44,446 --> 01:06:49,120
we all thought that it
was an OD of some sort.
1070
01:06:49,120 --> 01:06:54,120
- I just felt very
sorry, very sad for him.
1071
01:06:57,180 --> 01:07:00,490
Of course, it wasn't until years later
1072
01:07:00,490 --> 01:07:02,720
that people started
making conspiracy theories
1073
01:07:02,720 --> 01:07:03,653
about his death.
1074
01:07:03,653 --> 01:07:06,380
- Can't dismiss what the coroner
1075
01:07:06,380 --> 01:07:09,810
actually came up with that night.
1076
01:07:09,810 --> 01:07:12,740
Although again, we have to also remember
1077
01:07:12,740 --> 01:07:14,410
that Frank Thorogood, the main builder,
1078
01:07:14,410 --> 01:07:16,670
the character who was
in the pool with Brian
1079
01:07:16,670 --> 01:07:18,410
was actually taken away that night,
1080
01:07:18,410 --> 01:07:20,050
he was actually arrested.
1081
01:07:20,050 --> 01:07:21,500
I could look at it in one sense
1082
01:07:21,500 --> 01:07:23,677
and say hay, the builders are sacked,
1083
01:07:23,677 --> 01:07:27,610
he's dead a few hours later
1084
01:07:27,610 --> 01:07:29,317
which could easily lead you to believe
1085
01:07:29,317 --> 01:07:32,360
that there was some revenge.
1086
01:07:32,360 --> 01:07:36,390
- And he rang me the
evening sadly that he died
1087
01:07:36,390 --> 01:07:38,490
and he seemed to me absolutely fine
1088
01:07:38,490 --> 01:07:41,030
but we'd been several times before,
1089
01:07:41,030 --> 01:07:43,920
I can't remember, the boys
remember more than I do,
1090
01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:47,520
and they were explicitly
told do not touch.
1091
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:50,220
And I think it was an
inhaler but I could be wrong,
1092
01:07:50,220 --> 01:07:52,260
his medicine, it was called his medicine.
1093
01:07:52,260 --> 01:07:55,260
It was always by the
side of the pool in case
1094
01:07:55,260 --> 01:07:58,940
and I was asked if there
had been a party going on.
1095
01:07:58,940 --> 01:08:01,780
As far as I know there
was no party going on.
1096
01:08:01,780 --> 01:08:03,620
Yes, there were people in the background
1097
01:08:03,620 --> 01:08:05,500
and people at the house,
throughout the house
1098
01:08:05,500 --> 01:08:08,960
but it wasn't a party, I would've heard.
1099
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:11,870
- But I think that there was
definitely partying happening
1100
01:08:11,870 --> 01:08:14,250
and definitely cars leaving
1101
01:08:14,250 --> 01:08:16,080
and the builders getting out of there
1102
01:08:16,080 --> 01:08:19,650
but it would've been an impromptu
party at Brian's expense
1103
01:08:19,650 --> 01:08:23,520
rather than a Brian Jones
party that he had held himself.
1104
01:08:23,520 --> 01:08:28,230
I suspect it would be
another example of those guys
1105
01:08:28,230 --> 01:08:29,293
exploiting him.
1106
01:08:36,770 --> 01:08:41,600
- I found out later snippets
from various people.
1107
01:08:41,600 --> 01:08:46,010
The builder who was involved
in this, Frank Thorogood,
1108
01:08:46,010 --> 01:08:48,740
who was in the pool with
Brian at some stage.
1109
01:08:48,740 --> 01:08:51,080
- He's had a lot of building work done
1110
01:08:51,080 --> 01:08:53,446
but it's not been that very satisfactory.
1111
01:08:53,446 --> 01:08:56,595
He fires the builders.
1112
01:08:56,595 --> 01:08:58,610
The builders hang around, however.
1113
01:08:58,610 --> 01:09:01,820
And there's a party that night.
1114
01:09:01,820 --> 01:09:03,040
- The Nicholas Fitzgerald book
1115
01:09:03,040 --> 01:09:05,830
was dismissed by everybody at the time
1116
01:09:05,830 --> 01:09:09,650
but I think that probably got right.
1117
01:09:09,650 --> 01:09:11,680
I think what Nicholas did,
1118
01:09:11,680 --> 01:09:14,080
he turned up to go and see Brian,
1119
01:09:14,080 --> 01:09:17,030
one of those guys that
Brian had befriended again
1120
01:09:17,030 --> 01:09:18,770
probably thought he was
a good friend of Brian's
1121
01:09:18,770 --> 01:09:21,540
but probably wouldn't
have lasted very long.
1122
01:09:21,540 --> 01:09:23,222
Turn up with the maid,
1123
01:09:23,222 --> 01:09:26,640
went, came down the lane to see Brian,
1124
01:09:26,640 --> 01:09:29,090
saw through the trees that
there was all this activity
1125
01:09:29,090 --> 01:09:32,310
going on in the pool, not liking it,
1126
01:09:32,310 --> 01:09:35,023
someone pops up, almost
certainly Tom Keylock,
1127
01:09:36,070 --> 01:09:37,323
and threatens him.
1128
01:09:39,200 --> 01:09:43,020
People claim they saw a lot of horseplay
1129
01:09:43,020 --> 01:09:44,669
going on in the swimming pool
1130
01:09:44,669 --> 01:09:46,940
'cause of course the
official cause of death
1131
01:09:46,940 --> 01:09:48,593
is death by drowning.
1132
01:09:49,810 --> 01:09:53,080
- Brian was provoking him in some way
1133
01:09:53,080 --> 01:09:56,520
with a little bit of banter
if you wanna call it that
1134
01:09:57,610 --> 01:09:59,680
and the banter got a bit nasty
1135
01:09:59,680 --> 01:10:03,760
and there was a bit of
horseplay in the pool.
1136
01:10:03,760 --> 01:10:05,805
And Thorogood left him in a state
1137
01:10:05,805 --> 01:10:09,880
either after a ducking
or a push or whatever
1138
01:10:09,880 --> 01:10:12,930
and walked away and left him
1139
01:10:12,930 --> 01:10:16,913
not really knowing or caring
what condition he was in.
1140
01:10:20,940 --> 01:10:24,129
- Brian died during some kind of party
1141
01:10:24,129 --> 01:10:28,040
in an accident that went wrong,
1142
01:10:28,040 --> 01:10:32,080
I would say that's pretty
much kind of what happened
1143
01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:36,429
but if there were other
witnesses to his death
1144
01:10:36,429 --> 01:10:39,269
I think one of them would've
come forward by now.
1145
01:10:39,269 --> 01:10:41,828
- The relationship with the builder
1146
01:10:41,828 --> 01:10:45,420
was a horrible, awful relationship.
1147
01:10:45,420 --> 01:10:48,360
It was a sick relationship,
that's quite clear.
1148
01:10:48,360 --> 01:10:50,510
And the builder was sick fucker
1149
01:10:50,510 --> 01:10:52,350
and Brian was a sick fucker
1150
01:10:52,350 --> 01:10:55,420
but I don't think that guy murdered him.
1151
01:10:55,420 --> 01:10:58,677
I think the guy might've
contributed to his death,
1152
01:10:58,677 --> 01:11:02,110
certainly, they might've
been fooling around
1153
01:11:02,110 --> 01:11:06,780
but I don't think that he murdered Brian.
1154
01:11:06,780 --> 01:11:10,840
- This nasty incident led
to Brian not being murdered
1155
01:11:10,840 --> 01:11:14,963
but being, the technicality
is manslaughter.
1156
01:11:26,920 --> 01:11:28,670
- The first officer on the scene
1157
01:11:28,670 --> 01:11:30,957
was a young PC Albert Evans
1158
01:11:30,957 --> 01:11:33,870
and he spoke to about
20 people in the garden.
1159
01:11:33,870 --> 01:11:35,230
He put it all in his notebook,
1160
01:11:35,230 --> 01:11:37,101
they all near enough said the same thing.
1161
01:11:37,101 --> 01:11:38,910
There had been a fight
between Frank Thorogood
1162
01:11:38,910 --> 01:11:42,281
and Brian Jones that led to
the death of Brian Jones.
1163
01:11:42,281 --> 01:11:46,200
When Bob Marshall, the CID
officer who led the investigation
1164
01:11:46,200 --> 01:11:48,071
turned up about four hours later.
1165
01:11:48,071 --> 01:11:50,910
The first person he
spoke to was Albert Evans
1166
01:11:50,910 --> 01:11:53,110
and he led him away from Cotchford Farm,
1167
01:11:53,110 --> 01:11:55,020
walked him out the lane and
he said what have you heard,
1168
01:11:55,020 --> 01:11:56,300
what do you think?
1169
01:11:56,300 --> 01:11:59,501
And young PC Evans said
everyone's saying the same thing,
1170
01:11:59,501 --> 01:12:02,100
there's been a fight between
Frank Thorogood and Brian Jones
1171
01:12:02,100 --> 01:12:04,093
which has led to the death of Brian Jones.
1172
01:12:04,093 --> 01:12:08,173
At that point, Marshall put
his arm around PC Evans,
1173
01:12:08,173 --> 01:12:10,833
said that'll be the last we hear of that
1174
01:12:10,833 --> 01:12:12,710
and led him back to the house.
1175
01:12:12,710 --> 01:12:16,601
And from that point onwards
the real police investigation
1176
01:12:16,601 --> 01:12:19,410
into the death of Brian Jones ended
1177
01:12:19,410 --> 01:12:21,620
and what they found as a result of that
1178
01:12:21,620 --> 01:12:23,738
was a constructed story.
1179
01:12:36,450 --> 01:12:39,660
We know from the two drug
squad officers who arrived
1180
01:12:39,660 --> 01:12:41,740
at the scene at Cotchford Farm
1181
01:12:41,740 --> 01:12:43,613
about one o'clock in the morning
1182
01:12:43,613 --> 01:12:46,973
that Frank Thorogood
wasn't at Cotchford Farm
1183
01:12:46,973 --> 01:12:50,570
at that poin, he'd been
taken down to the hospital
1184
01:12:50,570 --> 01:12:51,900
and he'd been taken down to the hospital
1185
01:12:51,900 --> 01:12:55,640
because of treatment that
was required to his hand.
1186
01:12:55,640 --> 01:12:59,360
I can only assume from what
scene has been described
1187
01:12:59,360 --> 01:13:02,770
at Cotchford Farm that Frank
would've injured his hand
1188
01:13:02,770 --> 01:13:05,110
in that fight with Brian.
1189
01:13:05,110 --> 01:13:08,490
- The builders had been
fired that same day
1190
01:13:08,490 --> 01:13:11,135
and they were very upset with Brian,
1191
01:13:11,135 --> 01:13:15,017
they believed that they
had money owed to them.
1192
01:13:22,387 --> 01:13:25,360
- Anna Wohlin was probably
the youngest person there
1193
01:13:25,360 --> 01:13:28,760
in the garden on the night
of Brian Jones' death.
1194
01:13:28,760 --> 01:13:30,940
She was undoubtedly, she says it herself,
1195
01:13:30,940 --> 01:13:32,747
she was high, she'd been taking drugs
1196
01:13:32,747 --> 01:13:35,630
and she freaked out when Brian Jones died.
1197
01:13:35,630 --> 01:13:37,710
She was still like that days later
1198
01:13:37,710 --> 01:13:40,220
and she was angry about it as well.
1199
01:13:40,220 --> 01:13:43,460
She was confused, she was
starting to speak out about it.
1200
01:13:43,460 --> 01:13:45,410
Everybody who turned up at Cotchford Farm
1201
01:13:45,410 --> 01:13:49,270
would hear Anna saying he didn't die
1202
01:13:49,270 --> 01:13:50,250
through drink and drugs.
1203
01:13:50,250 --> 01:13:52,920
It was a fight that had led to the death
1204
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:55,580
so the decision was taken to remove Anna
1205
01:13:55,580 --> 01:13:58,520
from Cotchford Farm and
bring her up to London
1206
01:13:58,520 --> 01:14:01,590
to stay with Bill Wyman
and his girlfriend Astrid.
1207
01:14:01,590 --> 01:14:05,690
Up here in London, Anna carried
on talking about the truth,
1208
01:14:05,690 --> 01:14:08,730
she kept on saying that Brian
Jones had died in a fight
1209
01:14:08,730 --> 01:14:10,610
and people needed to know this
1210
01:14:10,610 --> 01:14:12,840
and she arranged through a friend to speak
1211
01:14:12,840 --> 01:14:16,312
to the Times newspaper
and to tell them the truth
1212
01:14:16,312 --> 01:14:20,591
and at that point she was
sharing all of this with Astrid
1213
01:14:20,591 --> 01:14:23,120
and within hours she'd been put in a car
1214
01:14:23,120 --> 01:14:25,910
and she'd been driven across
London to Allen Klein's house.
1215
01:14:25,910 --> 01:14:28,310
She had to stay in the
UK because of the inquest
1216
01:14:28,310 --> 01:14:31,480
that took place four
days after Brian's death
1217
01:14:31,480 --> 01:14:33,490
but she was driven from the inquest
1218
01:14:33,490 --> 01:14:36,020
by Rolling Stones management,
taken to Heathrow,
1219
01:14:36,020 --> 01:14:39,470
thrown on a plane and
told never to come back.
1220
01:14:39,470 --> 01:14:41,973
- When we found Anna she
said one of the reasons
1221
01:14:41,973 --> 01:14:45,527
she did not come forward was
that she was scared of Tom
1222
01:14:45,527 --> 01:14:50,527
and that she had been
warned after the inquest.
1223
01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:54,150
- I would've been much more frightened
1224
01:14:54,150 --> 01:14:58,120
to have been threatened by Tom
Keylock than by Allen Klein.
1225
01:14:58,120 --> 01:14:59,795
Keylock was a funny guy.
1226
01:14:59,795 --> 01:15:04,200
- Janet also was having an
affair with Tom at the time
1227
01:15:04,200 --> 01:15:08,000
and it seemed that the reason
she was also frightened
1228
01:15:08,000 --> 01:15:10,099
of talking about the whole thing
1229
01:15:10,099 --> 01:15:13,620
and she almost got into hiding
was because of Tom Keylock.
1230
01:15:13,620 --> 01:15:15,970
Tom held the key to this thing
1231
01:15:15,970 --> 01:15:19,310
and he openly said that he believed
1232
01:15:19,310 --> 01:15:20,700
that his colleague at the time
1233
01:15:20,700 --> 01:15:23,310
who is of course deceased when
we were looking into this,
1234
01:15:23,310 --> 01:15:25,603
Frank, had murdered Brian.
1235
01:15:32,571 --> 01:15:35,300
- So Keylock, that worked for Keith,
1236
01:15:35,300 --> 01:15:38,991
was down there at the farm,
he had gotten down there
1237
01:15:38,991 --> 01:15:43,991
and the various tidbits
that I gleaned and learned
1238
01:15:44,840 --> 01:15:48,500
over the next couple of days
have always disturbed me
1239
01:15:48,500 --> 01:15:50,060
since those days,
1240
01:15:50,060 --> 01:15:54,750
one of which was that he
was burning stuff there,
1241
01:15:54,750 --> 01:15:58,160
so none of us could really
understand what that was.
1242
01:15:58,160 --> 01:16:00,400
What was he burning?
1243
01:16:00,400 --> 01:16:03,970
What he was burning, because
none of it ever showed up,
1244
01:16:03,970 --> 01:16:08,135
was a lot of receipts
that were to do, I think,
1245
01:16:08,135 --> 01:16:09,830
with the building work.
1246
01:16:09,830 --> 01:16:12,677
The building work that had
been going on at the farm
1247
01:16:12,677 --> 01:16:17,330
was very expensive and there
was a whole bunch of people
1248
01:16:17,330 --> 01:16:18,920
living on Brian's tab.
1249
01:16:18,920 --> 01:16:22,680
- My conclusion in the
end was that he was being
1250
01:16:22,680 --> 01:16:27,160
royally exploited by Tom Keylock primarily
1251
01:16:27,160 --> 01:16:29,960
who even in his death was exploiting him.
1252
01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:33,780
He had taken his Rolls Royce,
he had taken his clothes,
1253
01:16:33,780 --> 01:16:36,180
he had taken his possessions,
1254
01:16:36,180 --> 01:16:39,530
he somehow managed to
inveigle a lot of money
1255
01:16:39,530 --> 01:16:44,260
out of the Rolling Stones and
again nobody quite knows why.
1256
01:16:44,260 --> 01:16:46,999
- Tom Keylock was having
an affair with this girl
1257
01:16:46,999 --> 01:16:49,990
who announced that she was pregnant
1258
01:16:49,990 --> 01:16:52,251
so Tom Keylock, instead of being,
1259
01:16:52,251 --> 01:16:54,800
officially he was somewhere else
1260
01:16:54,800 --> 01:16:58,840
but actually he was at Cotchford
when this thing happened.
1261
01:16:58,840 --> 01:17:02,239
When Brian died he called Frank,
1262
01:17:02,239 --> 01:17:05,920
Frank Keylock, his brother,
1263
01:17:05,920 --> 01:17:08,567
who was very high up in the CID
1264
01:17:09,530 --> 01:17:14,120
and he got the whole thing supposedly
1265
01:17:14,120 --> 01:17:16,430
on behalf of the Stones,
1266
01:17:16,430 --> 01:17:20,480
they kind of manipulated this thing,
1267
01:17:20,480 --> 01:17:23,430
that's where people get really confused
1268
01:17:23,430 --> 01:17:26,130
but Keylock was acting on his own
1269
01:17:26,130 --> 01:17:28,759
without any mandate from anybody else
1270
01:17:28,759 --> 01:17:33,280
to cover his own ass about his own affair.
1271
01:17:33,280 --> 01:17:36,470
- Frank Keylock probably
would've helped his brother
1272
01:17:36,470 --> 01:17:38,700
back in return but he
wouldn't have been able
1273
01:17:38,700 --> 01:17:41,810
to offer as much support, as much help,
1274
01:17:41,810 --> 01:17:45,490
as the chief constable who'd
supersede the police officers
1275
01:17:45,490 --> 01:17:48,510
who were across the details
of Brian's death within hours
1276
01:17:48,510 --> 01:17:51,930
and they were endorsing the
police activity on the ground
1277
01:17:51,930 --> 01:17:53,580
that was covering up the death.
1278
01:17:53,580 --> 01:17:57,450
I've heard that the fighting
was going on in the gardens
1279
01:17:57,450 --> 01:18:00,617
rather than in the pool
itself earlier in the day
1280
01:18:00,617 --> 01:18:04,170
and it's interesting, there's
a trough in the garden
1281
01:18:04,170 --> 01:18:06,690
and that trough contained water
1282
01:18:06,690 --> 01:18:08,760
that would've been fresh water.
1283
01:18:08,760 --> 01:18:11,230
It could easily have been the case
1284
01:18:11,230 --> 01:18:13,740
that Brian had actually died
outside of the swimming pool
1285
01:18:13,740 --> 01:18:18,740
and that trough of fresh
water played a part in it.
1286
01:18:19,340 --> 01:18:23,470
- I ran a fan club for Brian
Jones when I was a teenager,
1287
01:18:23,470 --> 01:18:25,420
bit of a teenage obsession.
1288
01:18:25,420 --> 01:18:28,971
I went to the house, went to
Cotchford Farm, met the owner
1289
01:18:28,971 --> 01:18:31,290
and I became friends with Mary Hallett
1290
01:18:31,290 --> 01:18:34,927
who was Mrs. Hallett, who was Brian's maid
1291
01:18:37,413 --> 01:18:39,663
and her husband Les Hallett.
1292
01:18:39,663 --> 01:18:43,810
Then she passed away and
I'd still go to the house
1293
01:18:43,810 --> 01:18:46,595
from time to time and the
last time I saw Les Hallett
1294
01:18:46,595 --> 01:18:48,690
it was just hello, how are you
1295
01:18:48,690 --> 01:18:51,410
and then as I was leaving the area,
1296
01:18:51,410 --> 01:18:55,115
leaving the property of Cotchford
and going down the drive
1297
01:18:55,115 --> 01:18:58,240
he was running after my car saying
1298
01:18:58,240 --> 01:18:59,930
they drowned him in the trough,
1299
01:18:59,930 --> 01:19:02,555
they drowned him in the
trough and I didn't know,
1300
01:19:02,555 --> 01:19:04,830
what's a trough, right?
1301
01:19:04,830 --> 01:19:07,230
So I guess it's a barrel of some sort
1302
01:19:07,230 --> 01:19:08,807
but he said they drowned him the trough
1303
01:19:08,807 --> 01:19:11,130
and they threw him in the pool.
1304
01:19:11,130 --> 01:19:13,320
- That was the water that
was inside his lungs,
1305
01:19:13,320 --> 01:19:14,480
it wasn't chlorinated water,
1306
01:19:14,480 --> 01:19:17,103
there were no chemicals inside the lungs.
1307
01:19:17,103 --> 01:19:19,920
I've had the medical reports analyzed
1308
01:19:19,920 --> 01:19:23,716
by senior pathologists and they have said
1309
01:19:23,716 --> 01:19:26,730
that the stress on the
tissues around the heart show
1310
01:19:26,730 --> 01:19:30,360
that Brian Jones would've been
aware he was being murdered.
1311
01:19:30,360 --> 01:19:32,850
Apparently the body
responded a certain way
1312
01:19:33,790 --> 01:19:35,933
and they can tell it,
those experts can tell
1313
01:19:35,933 --> 01:19:38,770
through the tissue damage
what level of stress
1314
01:19:38,770 --> 01:19:39,883
the body was under.
1315
01:19:47,430 --> 01:19:49,030
- You can look at a contract
1316
01:19:49,030 --> 01:19:50,740
that's written about in many books
1317
01:19:50,740 --> 01:19:53,257
where Brian was due to
be paid a block of money,
1318
01:19:53,257 --> 01:19:56,192
100,000 pounds as a one off payment
1319
01:19:56,192 --> 01:19:58,550
for his departure from the Rolling Stones
1320
01:19:58,550 --> 01:20:01,460
that happened four weeks before he died.
1321
01:20:01,460 --> 01:20:04,488
He was then due to get
20,000 pounds a year
1322
01:20:04,488 --> 01:20:07,300
every year that the band stayed together.
1323
01:20:07,300 --> 01:20:09,510
So you're talking about
an awful lot of money.
1324
01:20:09,510 --> 01:20:11,690
Now when you look at Brian Jones' will
1325
01:20:11,690 --> 01:20:13,499
you can see that he died basically
1326
01:20:13,499 --> 01:20:15,330
without much money at all
1327
01:20:15,330 --> 01:20:17,527
so that money that Allen
Klein was due to pay him,
1328
01:20:17,527 --> 01:20:22,368
about 100,000 pounds one
off, the 20,000 pounds a year
1329
01:20:22,368 --> 01:20:24,110
didn't come.
1330
01:20:24,110 --> 01:20:28,036
- Allen Klein, you can't
involve Allen Klein in this,
1331
01:20:28,036 --> 01:20:33,036
Allen Klein had much more
important things to deal with
1332
01:20:35,100 --> 01:20:36,810
with the Beatles and so on.
1333
01:20:36,810 --> 01:20:39,450
- Allen Klein's making
millions of dollars anyway,
1334
01:20:39,450 --> 01:20:43,960
100,000 pounds to Allen Klein
is neither here nor there
1335
01:20:43,960 --> 01:20:46,640
when you think that he's
personally responsible
1336
01:20:46,640 --> 01:20:49,407
for the revenue of the Beatles
and the Rolling Stones.
1337
01:20:49,407 --> 01:20:52,620
He was a heavy man, no question about that
1338
01:20:52,620 --> 01:20:54,970
but he was a Jewish accountant.
1339
01:20:54,970 --> 01:20:57,250
Jewish accountants count the money,
1340
01:20:57,250 --> 01:20:59,320
they don't have people killed.
1341
01:20:59,320 --> 01:21:01,574
The idea that Allen Klein
had somebody killed,
1342
01:21:01,574 --> 01:21:05,010
frankly, I think it's an
insult to the man's memory.
1343
01:21:05,010 --> 01:21:06,840
He was a tough son of a bitch
1344
01:21:06,840 --> 01:21:08,600
but I don't think he was that hard.
1345
01:21:08,600 --> 01:21:12,152
- He was always tardy
in coughing up the money
1346
01:21:12,152 --> 01:21:13,950
that was their own money
1347
01:21:13,950 --> 01:21:16,232
because he was always
playing around with it
1348
01:21:16,232 --> 01:21:21,232
and it might've indirectly
caused Brian his life,
1349
01:21:22,410 --> 01:21:25,370
this thing that the money wasn't arriving,
1350
01:21:25,370 --> 01:21:28,460
that conveniently it was delayed.
1351
01:21:28,460 --> 01:21:31,410
- Allen Klein decided to send
his own person down there
1352
01:21:31,410 --> 01:21:34,430
and investigate look
into Brian Jones' death.
1353
01:21:34,430 --> 01:21:36,570
A report was put together, Sam Cutler,
1354
01:21:36,570 --> 01:21:38,180
one of the Stones' tour managers said
1355
01:21:38,180 --> 01:21:40,030
that a report was put together
1356
01:21:40,030 --> 01:21:41,420
that went back to Maddox Street,
1357
01:21:41,420 --> 01:21:43,257
the Rolling Stones' head office.
1358
01:21:43,257 --> 01:21:46,703
- He was highly suspicious of the builder.
1359
01:21:47,890 --> 01:21:50,330
- Months after Brian Jones' death
1360
01:21:50,330 --> 01:21:53,210
the Stones flew to America on what became
1361
01:21:53,210 --> 01:21:56,292
their most lucrative tour
of all time at that point.
1362
01:21:56,292 --> 01:22:00,708
If the Rolling Stones
had had to stay in the UK
1363
01:22:00,708 --> 01:22:03,460
because of the death into Brian Jones'
1364
01:22:03,460 --> 01:22:05,190
police investigations, et cetera,
1365
01:22:05,190 --> 01:22:07,110
it would've just been an investigation
1366
01:22:07,110 --> 01:22:09,430
that would get bigger
and bigger and bigger
1367
01:22:09,430 --> 01:22:11,790
so Allen Klein had a real investment
1368
01:22:11,790 --> 01:22:15,262
in making sure that tour
went ahead as planned.
1369
01:22:15,262 --> 01:22:17,670
- And this was something
right which makes me annoyed
1370
01:22:17,670 --> 01:22:19,570
'cause sometimes people say oh,
1371
01:22:19,570 --> 01:22:21,594
Mick and Keith had
something to do with it.
1372
01:22:21,594 --> 01:22:23,990
- The band, that's ridiculous,
1373
01:22:23,990 --> 01:22:28,990
Brian Jones was worth a lot
more to people alive than dead.
1374
01:22:45,270 --> 01:22:47,980
- After Brian's death, Joan
Fitzsimmons was really,
1375
01:22:47,980 --> 01:22:50,360
violently attacked.
1376
01:22:50,360 --> 01:22:53,250
Her body was found
effectively left for dead
1377
01:22:53,250 --> 01:22:55,910
on the side of the beach, she was blinded,
1378
01:22:55,910 --> 01:22:58,980
her skull was fractured
and she had teeth missing.
1379
01:22:58,980 --> 01:23:01,200
Shed been really badly beaten up
1380
01:23:01,200 --> 01:23:04,420
and if you wind things
back earlier on to that day
1381
01:23:04,420 --> 01:23:06,470
Frank Thorogood had
been at the family home,
1382
01:23:06,470 --> 01:23:07,650
he'd been banging on the door,
1383
01:23:07,650 --> 01:23:10,480
he'd been demanding to
know where Joan was.
1384
01:23:10,480 --> 01:23:13,610
He was saying she knows too
much about the Rolling Stones,
1385
01:23:13,610 --> 01:23:16,050
she knows too much about Brian's death
1386
01:23:16,050 --> 01:23:19,120
and within hours Joan was attacked.
1387
01:23:19,120 --> 01:23:21,210
We now know that Joan Fitzsimmons
1388
01:23:21,210 --> 01:23:23,900
was definitely at Brian's
house on the night he died.
1389
01:23:23,900 --> 01:23:27,330
She drove his girlfriend or
his ex-girlfriend Sue Potier
1390
01:23:27,330 --> 01:23:30,514
away from the house about
30 minutes before Brian died
1391
01:23:30,514 --> 01:23:34,000
and then days later Joan was in the pubs
1392
01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:35,510
in and around Chichester
1393
01:23:35,510 --> 01:23:37,670
saying it's not true what's in the papers
1394
01:23:37,670 --> 01:23:40,370
about Brian Jones, the
drink and drugs headlines,
1395
01:23:40,370 --> 01:23:42,850
they're not true, he was
attacked, there was fighting,
1396
01:23:42,850 --> 01:23:44,810
he was attacked and he died.
1397
01:23:44,810 --> 01:23:47,150
Frank Thorogood obviously
got wind of that,
1398
01:23:47,150 --> 01:23:50,186
he heard of that, brought
himself back down to Sussex
1399
01:23:50,186 --> 01:23:52,890
and within hours Joan was attacked
1400
01:23:52,890 --> 01:23:54,370
and her body was found left for dead.
1401
01:23:54,370 --> 01:23:57,090
There was a newspaper report locally
1402
01:23:57,090 --> 01:24:00,060
down in Chichester that
led to national newspapers
1403
01:24:00,060 --> 01:24:02,780
reporting that said there
was a woman in a coma
1404
01:24:02,780 --> 01:24:05,742
in hospital in Southampton
which is where she was taken to
1405
01:24:05,742 --> 01:24:08,620
that they said, everyone
said there were connections
1406
01:24:08,620 --> 01:24:09,710
to Brian Jones' death.
1407
01:24:09,710 --> 01:24:12,350
This woman in the coma
was linked to the death.
1408
01:24:12,350 --> 01:24:13,690
The police then shut that down
1409
01:24:13,690 --> 01:24:15,500
and said there were no links at all
1410
01:24:15,500 --> 01:24:17,800
but the police files
that have now come out
1411
01:24:17,800 --> 01:24:20,890
show that the police knew
the attack on Brian Jones,
1412
01:24:20,890 --> 01:24:24,960
the death of Brian Jones
instantly led within days
1413
01:24:24,960 --> 01:24:27,230
to the attack on Joan Fitzsimmons
1414
01:24:27,230 --> 01:24:30,320
and that the same people,
the same names were involved.
1415
01:24:30,320 --> 01:24:33,000
If you look at the pictures
of the before and after
1416
01:24:33,000 --> 01:24:35,742
you could see the level of
the violence that took place
1417
01:24:35,742 --> 01:24:37,360
at Cotchford Farm that night,
1418
01:24:37,360 --> 01:24:39,150
it was the same people involved.
1419
01:24:39,150 --> 01:24:41,743
It was the same police
force that then came in
1420
01:24:41,743 --> 01:24:43,080
to look at it.
1421
01:24:43,080 --> 01:24:45,430
They knew they had a dead
man in the swimming pool.
1422
01:24:45,430 --> 01:24:47,670
They knew they had a body left for dead
1423
01:24:47,670 --> 01:24:49,760
on the side of the beach
1424
01:24:49,760 --> 01:24:52,490
and they knew the same person was named
1425
01:24:52,490 --> 01:24:54,626
time and time again by witnesses,
1426
01:24:54,626 --> 01:24:58,970
yet they did nothing to try
and bring that man to justice.
1427
01:24:58,970 --> 01:25:01,650
They did everything to create headlines
1428
01:25:01,650 --> 01:25:03,523
that said drink and drugs are bad.
1429
01:25:16,490 --> 01:25:19,910
If you look back at the
social and political times
1430
01:25:19,910 --> 01:25:23,980
in 68, 69, to work out why did the police
1431
01:25:23,980 --> 01:25:26,770
or why did the home office
or why did the government
1432
01:25:26,770 --> 01:25:28,710
want to spin the death of Brian Jones,
1433
01:25:28,710 --> 01:25:33,210
you have to look at the
growth of the counterculture,
1434
01:25:33,210 --> 01:25:36,460
the growth of drugs for the
first time as a social problem
1435
01:25:36,460 --> 01:25:38,960
and you have to look
at what the home office
1436
01:25:38,960 --> 01:25:40,650
were advising the government,
1437
01:25:40,650 --> 01:25:43,610
they were basically saying
get rid of the pop stars
1438
01:25:43,610 --> 01:25:45,710
and you get rid of the drug problem.
1439
01:25:45,710 --> 01:25:48,110
If you then look at the
busts that were carried out
1440
01:25:48,110 --> 01:25:52,920
on Brian, on Mick in
particular, on Brian especially,
1441
01:25:52,920 --> 01:25:56,100
all of those drug busts, 90%
of them involved the police
1442
01:25:56,100 --> 01:26:00,140
actually trying to plant drugs
inside the Stones properties.
1443
01:26:00,140 --> 01:26:01,670
The politics at the time was to say
1444
01:26:01,670 --> 01:26:03,030
we've got to destroy these bands,
1445
01:26:03,030 --> 01:26:05,938
we've got to destroy this
counterculture that's emerging
1446
01:26:05,938 --> 01:26:08,910
and people like Brian
Jones represented it more
1447
01:26:08,910 --> 01:26:10,400
than anybody else.
1448
01:26:10,400 --> 01:26:13,661
Again, if you go back to
the Stones in 67, 68, 69,
1449
01:26:13,661 --> 01:26:18,030
Mick and Keith were not
quite as rebellious as Brian,
1450
01:26:18,030 --> 01:26:20,270
they certainly weren't as connected
1451
01:26:20,270 --> 01:26:22,120
to drink and drugs as Brian.
1452
01:26:22,120 --> 01:26:25,210
They didn't look as
counterculture as Brian.
1453
01:26:25,210 --> 01:26:26,266
He was the one,
1454
01:26:26,266 --> 01:26:30,630
he was the DNA of the
band's rebellious nature
1455
01:26:30,630 --> 01:26:33,980
and when he died he became a poster boy.
1456
01:26:33,980 --> 01:26:37,040
The government could
literally hold him up and say
1457
01:26:37,040 --> 01:26:39,972
this is what happens to
you kids if you take drugs
1458
01:26:39,972 --> 01:26:43,300
and it was a total, total misuse
1459
01:26:43,300 --> 01:26:44,650
of actually what had happened.
1460
01:26:44,650 --> 01:26:48,180
The man had been killed but
rather than get to the truth
1461
01:26:48,180 --> 01:26:50,250
they would rather spin out a lie
1462
01:26:50,250 --> 01:26:52,520
to suit their own political agenda
1463
01:26:52,520 --> 01:26:56,040
about what was going wrong
in their minds with society
1464
01:26:56,040 --> 01:26:58,240
and the emerging
counterculture at the time
1465
01:26:58,240 --> 01:27:00,943
'cause the truth is
Brian Jones was killed.
1466
01:27:00,943 --> 01:27:04,318
The truth is Brian Jones
didn't die of drink and drugs.
1467
01:27:04,318 --> 01:27:07,220
- They wanted to make an
example of him, didn't they?
1468
01:27:07,220 --> 01:27:08,530
They wanted to show the kids,
1469
01:27:08,530 --> 01:27:12,030
oh, if you behave like this
this is what's gonna happen.
1470
01:27:12,030 --> 01:27:13,310
Look what happened to him,
1471
01:27:13,310 --> 01:27:15,670
don't do drugs, don't enjoy yourself,
1472
01:27:15,670 --> 01:27:17,890
keep your nose clean, go and work hard.
1473
01:27:17,890 --> 01:27:21,580
- It piled up and all due to the fact
1474
01:27:21,580 --> 01:27:25,690
that the establishment wanting to do away
1475
01:27:25,690 --> 01:27:26,973
with the Rolling Stones.
1476
01:27:26,973 --> 01:27:29,393
It's very, very tragic.
1477
01:27:30,850 --> 01:27:35,510
That's how Brian Jones was
killed, not by any conspiracy.
1478
01:27:35,510 --> 01:27:38,970
- And this all came
together and I said my God,
1479
01:27:38,970 --> 01:27:42,887
he didn't just die, he was murdered
1480
01:27:42,887 --> 01:27:46,738
and the Sussex police completely bungled,
1481
01:27:46,738 --> 01:27:49,130
completely bungled the investigation.
1482
01:27:49,130 --> 01:27:52,394
All they did was just put
this in a nice little package,
1483
01:27:52,394 --> 01:27:55,560
then they sealed it up and
they put it in the ground
1484
01:27:55,560 --> 01:27:57,080
because that's the
message that they wanted
1485
01:27:57,080 --> 01:27:58,670
to get across to people.
1486
01:27:58,670 --> 01:28:00,313
They wanted to take
down the Rolling Stones,
1487
01:28:00,313 --> 01:28:03,215
they wanted to take down Brian Jones.
1488
01:28:03,215 --> 01:28:05,950
Drink and drugs, died in his pool,
1489
01:28:05,950 --> 01:28:08,313
nice, neat, that's it.
1490
01:28:22,387 --> 01:28:26,150
- I think the police in 2010
just continued the cover up
1491
01:28:26,150 --> 01:28:29,520
that was originally put in place in 1969.
1492
01:28:29,520 --> 01:28:33,210
That investigation in 1969
could've easily resulted
1493
01:28:33,210 --> 01:28:35,810
in the truth coming out,
they had all the evidence.
1494
01:28:35,810 --> 01:28:38,560
It was a very deliberate
decision at a senior level
1495
01:28:38,560 --> 01:28:40,760
to make sure that the
truth didn't come out.
1496
01:28:48,025 --> 01:28:49,370
There has never been a reason given
1497
01:28:49,370 --> 01:28:54,110
for why it was a 75 year rule
put onto the Brian Jones files
1498
01:28:54,110 --> 01:28:57,130
but what is absolutely
clear is that when you look
1499
01:28:57,130 --> 01:28:59,840
at the Brian Jones police investigation
1500
01:28:59,840 --> 01:29:01,490
that it was was a cover up
1501
01:29:01,490 --> 01:29:04,520
and the you look at the
Joan Fitzsimmons attack
1502
01:29:04,520 --> 01:29:06,600
that happened two weeks later.
1503
01:29:06,600 --> 01:29:09,350
If they didn't have that 75 year rule
1504
01:29:09,350 --> 01:29:12,520
put on that file it would be very clear
1505
01:29:12,520 --> 01:29:14,801
that there had been that double cover up.
1506
01:29:14,801 --> 01:29:19,801
It's wrong that a man's
death could be ignored
1507
01:29:19,945 --> 01:29:24,380
and the truth be hidden
so the establishment
1508
01:29:24,380 --> 01:29:26,730
could play politics with drug culture
1509
01:29:26,730 --> 01:29:29,030
on the back of that man's
death, that's wrong.
1510
01:29:36,060 --> 01:29:37,453
- Keith Richards once said about him
1511
01:29:37,453 --> 01:29:39,641
that he was a hard man to like.
1512
01:29:39,641 --> 01:29:41,681
I didn't find that.
1513
01:29:41,681 --> 01:29:44,109
I actually found him very easy to like.
1514
01:29:44,109 --> 01:29:46,569
I think he was a hard man to like
1515
01:29:46,569 --> 01:29:48,941
if you had to live with him,
1516
01:29:48,941 --> 01:29:50,630
if you had to work with him
1517
01:29:50,630 --> 01:29:53,650
or if you had to be with
him for long periods of time
1518
01:29:53,650 --> 01:29:58,170
because he had very little in
the way of moral sensibility,
1519
01:29:58,170 --> 01:30:01,601
he was amoral and unreliable.
1520
01:30:01,601 --> 01:30:04,989
- I find him a very nice,
charming, charming guy
1521
01:30:04,989 --> 01:30:09,989
and somewhat of an original in that band.
1522
01:30:11,930 --> 01:30:13,690
- I just thought he was wonderful.
1523
01:30:13,690 --> 01:30:18,210
Softly spoken and quite shy in a way.
1524
01:30:18,210 --> 01:30:20,900
- He was a very friendly,
normal guy really
1525
01:30:20,900 --> 01:30:23,800
and I was just impressed as
I've always been with him,
1526
01:30:23,800 --> 01:30:27,550
just how many instruments
the guy could play.
1527
01:30:51,010 --> 01:30:53,610
Much maligned I think after that people
1528
01:30:53,610 --> 01:30:56,680
only want to read about sex and drugs
1529
01:30:56,680 --> 01:30:58,220
and how many women he had,
1530
01:30:58,220 --> 01:31:00,280
how many children, if
he got five children,
1531
01:31:00,280 --> 01:31:01,210
I have no idea
1532
01:31:02,300 --> 01:31:06,537
and does anyone talk about the music?
1533
01:31:06,537 --> 01:31:07,913
I have no idea.
1534
01:31:09,090 --> 01:31:11,310
- He was a musical genius.
1535
01:31:11,310 --> 01:31:13,860
The Rolling Stones would not
have existed without him.
1536
01:31:13,860 --> 01:31:16,490
I think they should give
him the kind of respect
1537
01:31:16,490 --> 01:31:18,040
that he really deserves.
1538
01:31:18,040 --> 01:31:20,187
And also, the other thing about Brian is
1539
01:31:20,187 --> 01:31:22,230
that Brian's lifestyle,
1540
01:31:22,230 --> 01:31:27,230
his very evident aura of hedonism
1541
01:31:30,010 --> 01:31:35,010
was probably the first example
of any British rock star
1542
01:31:35,651 --> 01:31:39,027
living the rock n' roll lifestyle
1543
01:31:39,027 --> 01:31:42,660
and maybe it's also that's
a salutary warning as well.
124624
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