Original subtitles

Put it this way, some of these

I do not want to be seen by other people.

‐[WOMAN LAUGHS] ‐Um... [CHUCKLES]

You didn't get those, did you? Those last ones?

I'm serious. You got some of those,

‐I'm gonna kill you. ‐[WOMAN LAUGHING]

Some of these are really too smutty for you, Vester.

Look at, um, yeah. See, seriously.

[LAUGHS] This is embarrassing.

‐WOMAN: Why is it embarrassing? ‐I read smut.

It's my guilty pleasure. I don't drink. I don't smoke.

I don't use drugs. I read smut.

AIMEE GARCIA: [NARRATING] M. J. grasped her wrist

and pinned them above her head,

pushing her hard against the wall

before she could finish her thought.

His lips claimed hers in a hard, possessive kiss.

ALLISON TOLMAN: [NARRATING] He kissed my neck

while running his hands down my thigh.

‐[SIGHS] ‐His breath drew in deeply.

Then out in a whisper across my skin.

AISHA TYLER: [NARRATING] His eyes are on fire and he's panting.

You need to understand, Megan.

Once I make love to you, you're mine.

TOLMAN: [NARRATING] His lips opened hers

and their tongues tangled.

His fierce and urgent.

She shut her eyes against the blinding yellow red of the setting sun

streaking the sky behind him.

GARCIA: [NARRATING] A small gasp escaped my lips

as his warm hand palmed my breast through soft fabric.

TOLMAN: [NARRATING] His fingers never stopped caressing

and rubbing her inside,

‐and she felt herself coming. ‐[WOMAN MOANS]

GARCIA: [NARRATING] Every glance at her triggered the memory

of her quivering beneath him.

TYLER: [NARRATING] He moves up behind me with a blue Tiffany box.

"I will give you the moon."

TOLMAN: [NARRATING] She'd remember this moment for the rest of her life.

She'd think of this night, and feel these feelings

that are much stronger than she'd ever have.

TYLER: [NARRATING] He opens the box

and cradled in the velvet is diamond...

‐TOLMAN: [NARRATING] She wanted his affection, needed it... ‐[VOICE FADES]

The book and the phenomenon that everybody's talking about.

Fifty Shades Of Grey or as one happy husband called it,

"Fifty shades of yay."

ALTER: It was an unbelievable blockbuster.

I went on to sell more than 100 million copies worldwide.

I think when Fifty Shades came out,

it really demonstrated

this immense appetite for erotic fiction that I think

traditional publishers maybe weren't aware of.

And self‐published authors were in a position

to immediately emulate that.

Essentially, it's as simple as uploading your manuscript

from your home computer to various sites.

I mean, Amazon is the massive one.

Pretty quickly, it can be formatted and sold,

and you set the price.

Suddenly you saw just an explosion

of that type of fiction.

Previously, self‐published books other than one or two

really didn't sell that many copies.

These women, who were all of a sudden

finding the Internet to publish on,

just decided they were going to do it that way

and sell their books that way directly.

And then everything exploded.

REBECCA: A lot of people were really, had no money

prior to self‐publishing,

and, you know, it was hard to make ends meet,

hard to feed their kids, all of that.

So I really love this movement

because I think it's made a huge difference financially

in tons of people's lives.

They were making seven figures left and right.

I don't know if everybody realizes

the amount of success that I had.

And I like that.

I like to be the...

You know, the millionaire that nobody knows is really a millionaire.

My husband stayed up, checking our bank,

and he's like, (GASPS) "Holy crap,

"It just hit. It's real.

"It's real. You really made this."

I went to an event called Rock on the Range,

and I was like "Man, there is 100,000 people."

It's hard to fathom that this times two

has read my books.

[SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

[WOMEN SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

KRISTEN: I loved your books.

‐Thank you. ‐WOMAN 1: They are amazing.

‐I'm glad you liked them. ‐[INDISTINCT]

‐Can you sign this? ‐I would love to.

I'm known as the girl that writes the dirty books.

I guess that in some ways

it is kind of taboo what I write.

But they just found out that I've sold a million books.

This is the fantastic fucking CJ Roberts.

‐[MAN LAUGHING] ‐If you don't know who she is,

then you really need to pick up her books.

CJ: My whole life I've just been afraid

that people are not going to accept me.

And it's because I wasn't accepting of myself.

And I grew up Catholic,

and Hispanic and then

the culture is very patriarchal.

Like sexuality for a woman is very, like, taboo.

Like, "What? Women get turned on too? [GASPS]

"What will Jesus say?"

So... [LAUGHS] I'm like, I don't know.

I know six of them. You can ask.

‐WOMAN 2: Thank you so much. ‐Thank you.

WOMAN 1: Oh, my God, you are awesome.

I know.

WOMAN: Okay. Okay.

KELLI: I wanna do something, I do it and I get it done.

I started writing about five or six years ago

while I was working full‐time.

I started out in the young adult world

and I'm still in that world, um, publishing,

but I decided to try something different last year

and write, um, an adult erotic romance.

And, you know, you look through the paper,

you look online, you hear, you know,

it's all these self‐publishers are getting all these big deals.

And it's like, "Oh." That's kind of where I said,

"Well, you know, this is going on.

"I don't want to miss this."

WOMAN 1: All right.

‐ALL: Whoa. ‐WOMAN 2: Oh, yeah, sugar.

Set them up in your lane.

‐Each one? ‐Yes.

[INDISTINCT]

‐WOMAN: Oh, it's coming in. All right. ‐[CHEERING]

Ready? Go.

[WOMEN SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY AND HOOTING]

WOMAN 1: They just like, take you on a whirlwind, you know.

And you're staying up forever to read.

I'd rather be reading smut than doing housework.

I'd rather be reading smut than work full‐time.

I went from reading about two to three books a year, and since July 2012

till July 2013, I have read 88 books.

I would never be standing here in front of you two years ago and say,

"Hey, I think I want to handcuff my husband

"and bang the shit out of him."

I mean, you would never hear that before

as to where now, it's okay.

What good girl doesn't want a bad man?

I mean, what good girl you know don't want a bad man.

We want the strong man who has a soft heart.

You know, we want the caveman,

who would throw us over his shoulder and just take us

and just have his way with us. That's what we want.

Romance is not new. The romance genre isn't new.

We're not all of the sudden having this great like,

"Oh, we just found the romance genre."

I think what you're seeing right now,

is not that the genre is becoming new.

It's that the community is bridging together

and really embracing each other in a way

that empowers them even more

and says, "Oh, my story is okay to tell.

"Then how about this one?"

It's weird fads the way the culture works

and it will be...

it's gonna be interesting to see how it all plays out.

Awesome. Oh, my gosh.

It was like...

I kept telling Emily and Michelle, I'm like,

you guys, believe this, like,

after all these years, we did this.

It's like, oh, my God. So...

[WOMAN LAUGHING]

♪ This ain't no prohibition

♪ Runnin' out of ammunition

♪ Get a girl, get a girl, get a girl a drink

♪ Whoa‐oh‐oh, can't think when my glass is empty

♪ Good times roll on quick I know, babe

♪ Get a girl, get a girl, get a girl a drink

♪ We stumbled through the door

♪ Hands all over up against the wall

♪ The girls hit the floor

♪ You talk naughty, but I need some more

♪ 'Cause my thirst won't quench

♪ Pump the brakes so we can hit the fridge

♪ For ol' Johnny Black

♪ And then the three of us... ♪

WOMAN 1: What are you getting today?

WOMAN 1: Musical notes.

Nice.

[KRISTEN SPEAKING]

[WHIRRING]

[KELLI SPEAKING]

WOMAN 2: Congratulations on that. That's amazing.

Thank you.

[SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

[WOMAN SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

[GIRL LAUGHING]

‐Here. ‐GIRL 1: Thank you, Mama.

Can you see CJ right there?

Must have been, what, 14, maybe.

This is CJ's father and brother, Scott.

And this is one of the few last pictures they had together

before he passed on.

CJ: I grew up in North Hollywood.

I'm the eldest of seven kids.

I have four brothers and two sisters,

and I was raised by a single mom.

At one point we were like, 13 people

in a two bedroom apartment.

Like college wasn't a thing that we could afford.

And, um...

I knew that if I just stuck around the neighborhood,

I was gonna end up hooking up with some guy

who was gonna, like, make me pregnant,

and just suck the life out of me.

I was like, I'm gonna join the military,

and I'm gonna go and go to college and see the world.

And the first time I rode on an airplane

was on my way to basic training.

I'm sure it made some people nervous.

I was like, "We're gonna die."

INTERVIEWER: You were on your way to basic training

for the Air Force?

Yeah. Yep.

CJ: For the Air Force. I know.

And I was scared to be on the plane. [LAUGHS]

But I constantly do things that terrify me.

And then in 2008,

I got out of the military

and I had my college degree.

I graduated with a 4.0,

and, like, I was like, I'm gonna go out there, I'm gonna get a job.

It's gonna be amazing.

And I couldn't get a job answering phones.

I always wrote a lot. I always kept a journal.

I always told little stories about things.

I just like to write for me and I was exploring things.

I was exploring my sexuality,

my sensuality, my relationship with my mother and my history.

And people always ask me like,

which character you identify with.

And I really identify with both of my characters equally.

For me, Livi is side of me that is more vulnerable,

softer, more curious.

And Caleb, I feel, is my more, like, I'm on top of my stuff

because within me there is that person,

the goal setter, the person who's like

this will be mine by any means necessary.

So I explored that through my male character,

who was not afraid of his sexuality,

who was not embarrassed, um, by what he wanted

or his body or his goals.

Then my husband was like,

"Why don't you publish this story?"

And I was like, "You're stupid."

Um, [LAUGHS] I was like, who wants to read this crap?

First of all, if they read it, they'll be like,

"You're the weirdest person that I've ever encountered."

So I researched that whole process,

and I did my query letters and I sent it out,

and very promptly received like 25 to 30 rejection letters.

And he was like, "It... it's good."

He's like, "It's good, you should, you should put it out there."

So as a last resort,

because at that point it was considered vanity publishing to be an independent.

And vanity publishing was like, if you have to pay

for people to read your work,

then you're not a real writer.

And I put it out there

and my book ended up being on that short list

of books to read after you'd read Fifty Shades of Grey.

The one thing I did always warn people about

when they were getting ready to read my stuff,

I was like, if you read Fifty Shades

and you thought Christian Grey was taking it too far,

I'm not for you. [LAUGHS]

You know, like if you were like, "Christian!"

Like, no.

You should not touch my stuff.

I think I started telling people I was going to publish

maybe a month before I actually did,

and...

it was so funny because I would say to someone,

"I'm gonna publish a book" and they would say,

[GASPS] "Who's publishing your book?"

And I said, Well, I'm publishing my book and then it's like,

"Oh, like you poor thing,

"you are self‐publishing."

Um, that means nobody else will buy it.

Before I published,

um, I lived a very simple, middle‐class life.

You know, I worked in a 40‐hour week job.

Um, paycheck to paycheck.

I started reading my Mom's Harlequins

when I was in high school.

My first novel, I wrote when I was 22,

and joined Romance Writers of America and got involved.

I started querying agents and publishers

and nothing came of it. And then, you know,

got married and life takes over.

I have a cousin who writes horror,

and in early 2012,

he had talked on social media about self‐publishing.

And he just explained it to me.

And I said, well, writing and publishing a book

has just been something on my bucket list.

If I can just publish this book,

I can just mark that off my list

and say, I did that.

I published a book.

I figured, if 100 people buy the book, I'll be happy.

Honestly, it sold about 1200 copies in the first weekend.

Roughly seven months later, I had a deal with Pocket books

through Simon & Schuster.

That was my validation, that said...

This is what you should be doing.

Not living paycheck to paycheck anymore.

[LAUGHS] And, um...

I quit my hospital job in January of this year.

JAMIE: Come on.

[WHIMPERING]

JAMIE: Come on.

Come on.

I write young adult books under Jamie Blair, my real name.

And then under a pen name, Kelli Maine,

I write erotic romance books.

In my personal life, I'm not a romantic, I'm a realist.

You know, I don't expect cards and flowers and stuff.

If I, if I get them, well, it's nice.

You know, but the flowers are gonna die,

and I'm gonna throw the card away.

I was a command center strategist

for a telemarketing company.

So I got up and went to work and my kids went to school

or, you know, to camp during summer and...

you know, day camp and my husband to his job,

and I came home and...

Did it again the next day.

A lot of times, you know,

a lot of other authors, I've read interviews and stuff with them and...

"I always wanted to be an author ever since I was a little kid."

I never thought of it.

I don't know, I just kind of started,

you know, I'll go ahead and say this

because it's kinda embarrassing, but... [CHUCKLES]

After I read Twilight, I'm like,

"Well, if she can do it, [LAUGHS] I'm gonna try it."

My young adult deal kept getting pushed back.

I'm trying to start a career,

but because, contractually, I can't publish under my name

until six months after my book comes out

and it keeps getting pushed back.

I am, you know, well...

How am I supposed to do this?

I decided to try something different last year

and write, um, an adult erotic romance

just for fun to see what would happen

for something different that I had complete control over

because I self‐published it

instead of going the traditional route

through an agent, an editor and a publishing house.

I made a pen name. I made a blog.

I put the cover on good reads.

And it just kind of took off.

I don't know how, I don't...

It was funny 'cause I had a coworker at the time

and he kept looking

and, you know, he'd look on their stuff,

and I think maybe he brought it to my attention.

He was like, it's number one on there.

I'm like, "Are you kidding me?" and he's like, "No, look, look."

And I'm like, "Oh, my God."

'Cause it was me and then all three of E. L. James books.

I'm like, "No. This cannot be happening."

‐[LAUGHS] ‐Something's really wrong.

GLORYA: Bend over.

[WOMEN LAUGHING]

‐[CHUCKLES] That was good. ‐WOMAN 1: Oh.

[WOMEN LAUGHING]

Oh, my God. It was a good one.

‐GLORYA: You want one too? ‐WOMAN 2: No, I'm good.

‐GLORYA: Really? It doesn't hurt. ‐No, thanks.

‐GLORYA: Another one? ‐I'll take another.

[LAUGHS]

My name is Glorya Hidalgo.

And I own the Bookfriends book blog.

Ow. That was a nice sting.

‐Another one? ‐Motherfucker no.

[ALL LAUGHING]

‐I love that series. ‐WOMAN 2: I love it too.

I love that series.

But have you guys read Aurora Belle's Raw?

‐No, not yet. But I know it... ‐Okay.

‐I know it's a... ‐Well, when you do...

I don't know the unconventionality

I guess, if that's the word...

That's what I love.

But I also love a nice alpha story.

‐Anytime. ‐Oh, God, yes.

Isn't it every girl's fantasy that you can break...

‐ALL: Yeah. Yeah. ‐...them and change them.

‐WOMAN 3: I think it... ‐Is it realistic?

ALL: No.

My parents didn't talk about sex.

My mother never had that conversation with me.

When I married my husband, my husband said I was a prude.

So I think now...

I've read so much, I'm like,

"Oh, these women in the books enjoy it."

‐WOMAN 4: Yeah. ‐These women are experimenting with that.

That sounds like something I would like to try.

Before, it would be too taboo.

Like, there's no way I would even try that.

Now I... after I've read it I'm like, huh...

I wouldn't mind trying that.

‐I could see that. You know. ‐WOMAN 4: Mmm‐hmm.

You know, friends that I grew up with,

or went to high school with,

that are just, you know, blast you on Facebook about,

"How dare you go and see something like this or read trash.

"Don't you know what true literature is?"

And I'm like...

It's definitely not something I talk with my other friends,

'cause they're like, "What the hell are you reading?

"Are you reading just porn." I'm just like, "It's not porn."

You hear the term that it's like, you know soccer mom,

um, or mommy porn or whatever that term is?

It's not for me, about the sex at all.

It's just the emotions

that it makes the readers feel and I think that

um, the readers are also misunderstood

because, yeah, they like these books.

They like the erotica, but they also like, you know,

the other contemporary romances

that may not even have sex in them.

So the other genres

that most people like, only read

are mystery, science fiction and comics.

Those genres are overwhelmingly read by men.

And the women readers in those genres

have frequently talked about

the sexism that they face as readers of a genre

that they are not supposed to enjoy.

Like, whatever that means.

And, sex is not a big part of most mysteries.

‐I mean... ‐I don't think that's true.

Sometimes, but not...

I disagree. I think sex is a part of every book

‐we are all reading. ‐But not like romance.

Like, I don't know.

I've read some of those books that Dad claims are like

somehow better than our romance.

There is nothing, no. If there's sex,

they're just as twisted, there's dark themes.

I mean, our father was reading J. D. Robb for years,

whose other name is Nora Roberts.

He had no idea.

I'm very open about, you know, the fact that,

I'm, you know, I'm a sexual person,

and reading these types of books,

yeah, there is an outlet in there,

and a really good sex scene, oh, my God, yeah.

Me and my girlfriends talk about that.

Why even, you know...

You know, try to lie about it. It's, you know, it's porn.

I don't consider what I write porn.

Um, it is explicit,

but it's part of a story,

and it's different to me.

It's as...

much porn as, as...

you know, looking at artistic naked pictures, I think. I think it's...

[SIGHS] But on the other hand, it is a little porn.

I guess, really, my response is "And what's wrong with that?"

Straight white guy walks in off the street.

"You have a whole bookstore for romance?"

And they always couch in some sort of, like, business thing.

Like, does that really seem viable to you?

It's the second part.

That we don't know our own business

well enough to have done the research to know

that this would exist and survive and thrive.

The thing is that most men cannot conceive of a space that's not for them.

This is not for you.

DR. TANIA: Yes, they're all about a man and a woman getting together,

and falling in love and presumably living happily ever after.

But there are undercurrents of anger and dissatisfaction

that are being expressed through the novels.

Well, it's certainly fantasy.

I mean, 100%. The sex is fantastic.

The men are beautiful. In our everyday lives,

women take care of everybody.

And so to read about a man that takes care of his girl is sexy.

TYLER: [NARRATING] "Open your eyes.

"I gaze up into his perfect blue eyes,

"gazing at me with passion and hunger.

"My breath catches and I run my fingertips down his cheek.

"'You are so sexy, Natalie. I just can't seem to stop touching you.'

"'I love you touching me.'

"'You do?'

"He caresses my face, pushing errant strands of hair off my cheek.

"'Yes', I whisper.

"'Your skin is so soft', he murmurs, his fingers still on my cheek.

"'I love your curvy body.'

"My eyes widen.

"'Don't frown.'

"He kisses me between my eyebrows

"as if he's smoothing the frown from my face.

"'I'm not so sure about my curvy body.'

"It's a whispered admission that I have never made before, and frankly,

"I've never felt this vulnerable.

"His blue gaze meets mine again, and each word is a staccato.

"'You are beautiful.'

"I close my eyes,

"but he tips my chin, forcing me to look at him again.

"'Thank you.'

"His lips find mine.

"Gently now, lingering and pressing my mouth

"as if we have all the time in the world.

"I shift my hips and grind myself against his thigh,

"and he groans low in his throat.

"My blood is on fire.

"I've never wanted a man like I want Luke.

"I want to consume him.

"I want him fast and hard and I want him to take all day.

"I love how tender he is with me."

PHOTOGRAPHER: Nice one.

Oh, perfect hold.

[CAMERA SHUTTER CLICKS]

And again.

Hold that.

DR. KATIE: There is some sort of

really retrograde yearning

for this traditional man

who's acting in a traditional role,

even if we don't want that in a million ways

in our rational minds.

And I think that that's a sign of the fact that

we are not entirely comfortable or inhabiting our own power with ease.

We still aren't allowed

as women to be fully sexual creatures.

It's still the bad thing.

It's still the women's responsibility to be virtuous more than the man.

And when we have these books

where the male is dominating the woman into it,

it's like, I didn't have a choice.

[CHEERING]

He made me feel that way, but I didn't choose to feel that way.

I didn't seek it, so it takes the ownership

of the slutty label that we're going to get off of us.

And we can enjoy it without being worried about that stigma.

We are a society awash in gender inequality,

racial inequality, economic inequality,

you name it, every form of inequality.

And I think, well, instead of fighting it,

we've kind of sexualized that inequality,

specifically, the gender inequality.

And we said, "Well, it's... this is the best it gets.

"This is it. So let's make it fun."

We could talk about why the books are feminists

‐till we're blue in the face. ‐Yeah.

But, they're...

written, produced, marketed and sold by women for women.

So it's very hard for me to understand the argument

that they somehow are not feminist.

Oh, yeah.

WOMAN 1: Readers right now are ravenous.

They would be thrilled if I would release a book a month.

Romance, I think more than any other genre,

has the highest number of books consumed and bought

per month, per year.

There's something about the e‐book that made it

incredibly easy to just binge read.

You could read the first book and then read the next six,

and it's that Amazon one‐click feature.

You could see it all over Facebook, you know,

just one click five books. Just, you know what I mean.

And it's because they're 99 cents, they're $1.99, they're $2.99.

Four, five years ago, it wasn't as easy just to pick up a book,

get through it really fast.

Um, you had to go to a bookstore and you know,

I think it's just the convenience of it.

Like, I read on my phone. I can download a book and have it in two seconds,

and it's just made it a lot more accessible than sometimes even TV.

I think it's wonderful that people are able to do this,

and being able to bypass the publishers to get their stuff out there.

Um, however, it's having an effect on, on, you know, authors.

I've been publishing every two to four months.

This market is so saturated right now,

that readers forget you.

It's a double‐edged sword for writers because...

...it's great that they have readers who are clamoring for their work.

On the other hand, it's really hard to write ten books a year.

K.P. SIMMON: Because the market is changing,

we saw this huge explosion,

and now we're seeing such a saturation.

And, uh, sustainability is an extremely hard thing to do.

[LAUGHING]

There is no Plan B. This just better work.

My last novel and novella that came out in May and June,

the novella in June,

um, hasn't gone so well.

You know, what do you do now? Do you, do you, you know...

[STUTTERS] And I have no idea.

My books have just fallen through the cracks.

The pressure to crank out a new book

every four to six months has become immense.

All these medical bills from when, uh, [SIGHS]

Rich got in his motorcycle accident.

His shoulder still hurts. He started riding way too early.

But, whatever.

He's stubborn. You're not gonna stop him from doing what he wants to do, so.

I've been waiting to like, write a of full‐length novel since 2013.

I put one out. That was the last full‐length novel that I did.

And since then, people have been waiting for me

‐to come out with something. ‐[MOTORBIKE ENGINE STARTS]

‐Rich? ‐GIRL 1: Hopefully.

Rich, will you take this scooter out?

‐RICH: Whee! ‐CJ: All right.[SIGHS]

Turn sharp to the left and back up.

Turn it hard left, hard left.

Hard left, so you can get it out, you know.

You're gonna let her drive that?

I was gonna ride behind her.

I'm gonna sit with her. I'm gonna sit here...

‐That's a terrible idea. ‐Right here.

‐BOY: Let her try. ‐All right, yeah, let her try.

[MOTORBIKE ENGINE REVVING]

Okay.

Watch out for your sister.

[LAUGHS]

It's been hard to go from writing for fun

to writing to pay my rent.

I've been given such a tremendous opportunity

to do something like this.

Um, and to, you know, to make a living doing something that you love,

and I feel like I'm squandering it

by not taking the opportunities

that could make me a better writer.

[DOG BARKING]

Nobody in my family can read the Taken series.

No.

Because it would be weird.

I have not read them.

‐I told them you have no interest in reading that. ‐I gave her my word,

I would not read them.

Nope. I'm curious. But nope.

I haven't, actually, I'm not, I'm not into, um,

even the young adult... don't really, but I read it, and it was good.

But, um, basically, I just read historical romance, so, yeah.

No, haven't looked at it. [LAUGHS] They're on my bookshelves.

Yup.

And I had her, she signed them for me and everything, so.

PRODUCER: Were you allowed to read the inscription?

‐Mmm‐hmm. ‐Yes. It said, "You're not allowed to read this book."

[BOTH LAUGHING]

I know she's, she can write better books than that.

I shouldn't say that.

She's a better writer than that.

But, um...

I think at the time, that was really the trend.

I don't how it is now,

but, you know, I'm kind of proud that she jumped on board when she did.

You know, kind of helped her along a little bit there.

KELLI: You know, my grandma,

she's like, "What do you think I've never read a dirty book before?"

Like, well, you're not reading my dirty book.

They're looking forward to my young adult book coming out.

So it'll be neat to have something that's considered normal.

Where did you autograph it?

You should show the picture of her.

It doesn't look anything like me.

‐Oh, no. ‐[LAUGHS]

‐KELLI: I don't know. ‐Oh, it doesn't really.

‐Isn't it exciting? ‐Yes.

So proud.

[SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

KELLI: I'm disappointed that I sold my rights to something

that didn't perform better than I think I could have done myself.

As an author, you sell the rights to a publisher

because you want your books to reach readers.

And when it's not you, it makes you think, well,

you know, I could have priced the e‐book

a lot lower than $10 and sold more

than what they've sold.

There's transition,

and some can handle the transition, and some realize

"I don't think that's for me," something they always dreamt of.

Then they realize, "Yeah, that's not for me."

You have so much more control when you self‐publish.

You have control over timing,

you have control over what exactly is in the book.

Um, there's just, you know, you have all of your hands in the pot.

BEA: We love Kristen so much that her name is on our tote bag.

LEAH: Mmm‐hmm.

It's there for a reason.

Mostly 'cause of her own self‐publishing prowess,

and, and what she kind of represents in the industry,

which is something very unique and special.

She was putting out the books she wanted to put out.

She was... they were looking the way that she wanted them to look,

and people really respect that kind of control.

I think it's been an interesting sort of power dynamic shift.

So in the past, when a publisher would come to an author and say,

"We want to pay you this amount of money to buy your book."

You know, it was very rare for people to say no,

even if it wasn't enough money.

But now, because people have the ability to make the money on their own,

the offer has to be something that they really want.

Generally speaking, if you self‐publish,

your book is almost certainly digital.

Um, you can produce physical books,

but it's hard to get them into stores.

I mean, it's virtually impossible.

KRISTEN: This book is backed by Simon & Schuster.

So it's the first traditionally published book

that is out there from me.

It was difficult to give up control on things,

and to have my editor say, "Nope, I don't like your hero.

"We're going to change it." And I was like, "No.

"No, no, no, we're not changing it."

Um, but it's not technically my book.

They bought it from me, so I had to. [LAUGHS]

DIRECTOR: So it is first thing in the morning,

and we're pulling up to Kristen's house.

Um, she has released Loving Cara today,

and we're going to bring her wine for breakfast.

Every trusty assistant should have a key to get in.

Good morning. Happy release day.

‐Good morning. Thank you. ‐You're supposed to be naked.

You told me. You told me you'd be naked.

‐I am so not naked. ‐She's a liar. She lies, people.

‐There you go, my dear. ‐Oh, my goodness.

See, if she...

...plans to get drunk before 8:00,

she's got about three minutes.

Just gonna... why need a glass? I mean...

Drink it right out of the bottle.

‐That's right. Thank you. ‐You're welcome.

‐Are you excited? ‐Yes.

What are we doing today?

We're doing a Facebook party right now.

And then?

And then we're gonna go find the book in the store.

‐Yay. ‐Yay.

KRISTEN: So the new series is called Love Under the Big Sky.

It's a trilogy that takes place in Montana.

The books will be mass market, so they'll be in grocery stores and WalMart and Target.

So hopefully, readers will pick it up and then say,

"Well, what else has she written?"

I'm glad you're having a party for this 'cause it's a big deal.

It is a big deal. Yeah.

It doesn't really feel real yet. Even though I saw it in the store.

‐Will you ever feel like it happened? ‐Probably not.

Although, I will say, it was quite impressive

to stand in Barnes & Noble and see my name right above Nora Roberts' name.

‐[SIGHS] ‐That was, I think the moment

that I might have got a little teary,

‐'cause that's it, right? ‐ASSISTANT: Yeah.

‐Right. ‐That's the dream right here, yeah.

ASSISTANT: Oh, yeah.

The religious pressure that we're all under,

‐I think is fascinating that... ‐Yeah.

...that you find that because we're not, we're not all harlots,

‐and... ‐WOMAN 4: We are not?

Speak for yourself. I'm kidding.

‐I mean... ‐Even though we write about it,

we're not all these... well, we have moral values,

‐and traditions and... ‐WOMAN 4: Well, let's be clear, sex isn't bad.

‐Right, I know. An entire book of the Bible that's just dedicated to sex.

‐Oh, I've read that one. ‐The Old Testament.

Song of Solomon?

The Old Testament is...

[OVERLAPPING CONVERSATION]

[ALL LAUGHING]

We can write a great, a great re‐telling of David and...

I mean just a great... [INDISTINCT]

But, but, right, 'cause we're not.

But we get this judgment and I'm finding that's more and more common with.

‐Oh, yeah. ‐Other authors feeling that pressure.

Yeah, that's why there's a lot of pen names and...

The biggest industry, the biggest genre that has sold in the industry

was, was romance. And then the next closest genre

or category, was thrillers.

‐WOMAN 2: I was gonna say, was it thrillers? ‐It was thrillers.

‐James Patterson for the... ‐Right. Grisham. You know, those sort of novels.

If romance is selling eight million,

and then the next is thriller,

then why in the heck is Dan Brown and James Patterson,

the one getting on Good Morning America and the Today show,

and my romance authors are not getting on there

when they're the ones selling the most books.

[ALL LAUGHS]

All right, let's go party.

‐WOMAN 1: Look at everybody wonder who she is. ‐WOMAN 2: Like, what's going on?

Who is she? Look at her.

Hi, everybody.

Um, no, thank you all so much for coming. I'm super excited.

Chat and, um, drink and eat and hang out.

And drink. And, um, I will come around to everybody

and chat and I'm gonna sign books for you.

♪ It's half the fun 'Cause here it comes

♪ Oh here it comes We know

♪ Oh, we'll make it!

♪ Oh

♪ The sky is our limit now

♪ We'll take this dance...

And so I can knock it over there.

I think your book was on the same bookshelf as Nora Roberts.

‐I know. ‐That's like the coolest thing ever.

‐Tell me you took a picture. ‐I did take a picture. You wanna see it?

[BOTH LAUGH]

♪ We'll make it! ♪

DIRECTOR: So, Kelli, you don't think your second book sold as well?

KELLI: No, it didn't.

One of my faults is trying to bring the more plot

over onto this side.

And it's... I don't think it's working out for me so well. [CHUCKLES]

Nobody wants a whole lot of plot with their sex.

Just, you know, that's what I'm finding out. [LAUGHS]

We don't need all that.

Twist, turns, yeah, you know, maybe one or two,

but nothing real difficult to follow. It's just...

I've got all my books in boxes over here.

I should probably make them a little prettier, I know.

This is the magnet boards. They're like dry erase boards.

So I've got all my Taken and Given and...

stuff just, uh, in boxes.

I know, right? I think I've sent one out now, but...

You know, I think that I just I do better when I have freedom

to be creative and come up with new things.

And I don't like doing the same thing over and over and over and over again.

DIRECTOR: What is the formula?

Well, there's the friends to lovers.

There's the you know, the billionaire,

there's the rock star, there's the biker this,

but it's always saving the girl. You know, sometimes

he's tortured, the tortured hero too, and they save each other.

But somebody's always in need of saving and tortured,

and, you know, emotionally crazy.

And, you know, the magic sex happens, and then everybody's happy,

and nobody needs to see a psychologist.

Or, you know, it's all... just the magic orgasm.

Magic, magic, healing power of the billionaire's orgasm.

[LAUGHS] That's what it is.

DIRECTOR: What do you say to people say that

people read this as a fantasy. It's an escape.

And they do, and I know that it's an escape,

but it's you know, they, they live that real life.

So they just want that happiness that, you know,

that's not who I am though, you know.

So I have a hard time, um, connecting with that

because that's, to me, it's cheesy.

TOLMAN: [NARRATING]

"The club is packed. Bodies grind together on the dance floor.

"There's barely room to move.

"You catch my eye.

"You're alone.

"Bass pounds through my body, rushes from my head to my toes,

"takes the same path your eyes follow.

"Your dark eyed stares flutter soft on my skin.

"It raises goose bumps.

"Makes me flush.

"My vodka and cranberry soaked blood runs hot with need.

"You smile.

"Dimples pierce your cheeks.

"Your eyes flash. I can't resist.

"'Rach.' Shannon grabs my arm.

"She's sweaty from dancing and pulls her blonde hair up off her shoulders.

"'I'm going.'

"She tilts her head towards Sean or Shane or Seth, I'm not sure.

"The guy she met two hours ago.

"'How am I supposed to get home?' She drove.

"Shannon shoves her car keys in my hand.

"'See you in the morning.'

"She winks and pushes back through the crowd

"toward the guy whose name starts with an S.

"When I turned from watching Shannon go,

"you're standing right in front of me.

"'Hi', you say.

"Familiarity strikes.

"But I don't think I'd ever forget meeting you.

"'Hi.'

"I fall into your dark eyes and can't get out.

"They're serious and focused on mine.

"Looking away would be a crime.

"You ran a hand through your wavy black‐brown hair.

"Are you nervous? I can't tell.

'"What were you drinking?'

"You tap my glass. Empty except for melting ice.

'"Vodka and cranberry.'

"I take in a thick damp breath.

"Dancing bodies fog up the air, make it heavy to breathe.

"You shake your beer bottle, indicating its emptiness.

"'I'm headed to the bar. Would you like another?'

"I have to drive Shannon's car home.

"But I don't want to stop talking to you.

"I nod. 'Please.

"'I'll drink slowly.

"'I'll drive even slower.'

"I follow behind you,

"taking in the view of your incredible backside and jeans.

"A black long sleeve shirt shifts with your strong, wide shoulders,

"and hugs your narrow waist.

"You work out. A lot.

"The body I'm staring at didn't come from luck and a good gene pool.

"You glance back to make sure I'm following.

"When a group of people push between us,

"you reach out and take my hand.

"My fingers curl around yours like they're possessed."

Oh, it's in here someplace.

Ah, there it is.

I think the problem obviously, is that I don't write romance, I don't read romance.

I don't know what these women like.

Um, do you write

what you just really want to write?

And possibly have it...

die on the vine and go nowhere?

Um, or do you keep trying to just pump out

the very commercial romance fest stuff?

It's if you have a competitive personality,

it's like, you know, okay, I'm not gonna let this beat me.

I'm not gonna let this beat me. Even though, you're absolutely miserable.

Like I've spent the last couple years just absolutely miserable

because I'm not having fun writing anymore.

Annie, you wanna go outside?

You know, I'm trying to figure out what's, what do people want to read.

And how do I reach these people and where'd they go,

and how do I get it back?

And you know, and it's just been a constant source of, you know, anxiety.

MAN 1: Mine goes rolling over. Come on over here.

MAN 2: Good catch, good catch.

Oh, careful.

MAN 1: Here, give me your plate, Lou.

[SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

‐MAN 3: Where is he? ‐MAN 2: His name is Juan. And he is funnier.

[SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

Here's four plates.

[PEOPLE SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

[LAUGHTER]

CJ: I live out in the middle of nowhere.

So, since I got out of the military, I've just been,

you know, living there with my husband and my kids,

and doing the whole domestic thing,

which I never really imagined myself doing.

Think there's probably a good reason we're not gonna be able to find your art supplies

'cause I bet you, they're in the closet.

I wouldn't record my closet.

‐[LAUGHS] ‐It's very, very, very dirty...

...in here.

Oh, my God, Booba.

GIRL: I know.

‐I need to clean it. ‐What is this?

Mod Pogde.

CJ: Oh, my God, Nina.

I'm sorry, okay.

CJ: God, every picture you see of me when I was a baby,

I'm like wearing, like, lace.

And I hated it 'cause it was itchy.

So when I had my daughter, I was like no baby dolls.

Anybody who gets me anything pink will be murdered.

There will be no kitchen sets at my house.

And, and then, the opposite happened,

where I have the girliest,

princess, sugar cane child that I could possibly have.

You know, I'm like, Don't you want this truck?"

She's like, "No, but what do you have in glitter?" [LAUGHS]

HOST: [OVER VIDEO] Our little Miss West River

is contestant number nine, Nina Roberts.

[WHISTLING AND CHEERING]

CJ: And then I realized that I had to let her be that.

My mom wanted me to be glitter, and I wasn't.

But my daughter is. And I have to let her be that.

Like I know with my first pageant, I'm like...

CJ: Writing can be really lonely.

You spend a lot of time by yourself in a room

talking to yourself.

Because I see people having just cranking stuff out,

and I'm like, I, I just can't.

You know, things come to me when they come to me,

and they come to me organically and I can't help that.

When I was writing The Dark Duet,

I slept it, like, breathed it.

It obsessed me. My hands hurt like...

It's something that won't leave you alone

until you're done, until you're done.

So once, I just want to get that going.

Is this the one of the story you're talking about the other night about

‐being in the room? ‐CJ: Oh, yeah. No.

‐That's just another story that I was thinking about. ‐Oh.

‐I could tie it into this one, I suppose. ‐Right.

Um, but, okay, so if I were gonna do that, what would I do?

Okay, so somebody finds a note.

Well, it works because of the‐‐ You were talking about it being like,

that person wakes up in a room and there's a camera, and they're being told.

Oh, this is like, they, you find a note, they're somewhere

they're not supposed to be. They're snooping around.

And they have an hour to meet somebody at an address.

Who snoops around?

‐Detectives snoop around. ‐Detectives.

New. The new...

‐Okay. ‐Hmm.

‐Rich? ‐Yes.

People that snoop around.

Thoughts?

‐RICH: People that snoop around? ‐Yeah.

RICH: You gotta be a little more specific than that.

What would you, like, like,

we've got private investigators,

and busy body housewives, people that snoop around.

RICH: Um...

‐Can I get you to braid my hair, please? ‐CJ: Yeah.

All right, people snoop around.

‐I like the neighbor's idea. ‐BRANDON: Yeah.

Maybe somebody moves in next door,

and like, is really weird for whatever reason.

I haven't thought of that yet.

And...

maybe you put cameras in your house

because you were concerned that at some point they're going to come over there.

And then maybe they do. But why do they?

Ooh. Maybe you're hiding something.

I kind of like that because you would be paranoid,

you'd have cameras in your house,

and if somebody did move in next door,

and was paying a particular amount of attention to you,

‐you would certainly be concerned about that. ‐BRANDON: Yeah.

Maybe like that.

What's the point of this conversation?

I have to write a 15,000 word story by July.

Oh, yeah.

It doesn't sound like fun.

Unless, that's what you do.

‐[LAUGHS] ‐RICH: I suppose.

I have a lot of friends that do have the husbands that are not supportive.

And I have some friends that their husbands are supportive,

and some of them have been able to make it work, and some of them have not,

'cause just some men can't, can't take that flip.

It was a bit of a transition because...

I went from...

I manage movie theaters and Blockbuster stores and everything

to being at home.

Um, and she worked at home,

and then she became, you know, she's successful.

So I had to, um...

be supportive but realize that my ego

has to be in check because I think...

I think it's hard for a lot of guys

to like, think of their wives as being the breadwinners,

and not themselves. So...

‐[INDISTINCT CONVERSATION] ‐[FOLK MUSIC PLAYING]

TOM: In our present financial arrangement,

we don't really need my income.

I mean, I went through bouts of depression,

and just, just trying to...

to come to understand the new relationship in the way, the way everything is working.

KRISTEN: People talk about

how they usually fight mostly about financial things,

and that's a huge stressor in most relationships.

We were no different. So I thought, when the success started happening,

that would be pretty much taken care of and things will be great.

And then, um,

the books started to sell, and we, and I became pretty successful,

and he could not deal.

To the point where it wasn't just him being quiet about it.

It was, now we're just gonna demean it,

and embarrass you in front of fans,

and be a jerk pretty much.

You know, you hear all the time, somebody will say,

"Well, he didn't hit me."

"Well, no, but called you a fucking whore,"

like, is that worse or better... I don't know. [LAUGHS]

I don't want either of those things to happen to me.

So...

I think we forget that, um,

just because you're not hurting physically that you're not hurting.

One day I just said, "You're not allowed to talk to me like this anymore."

And I've not seen him since that day.

I grabbed my computer and my purse and I left.

Checked into a hotel. I had no clothes. I had no stuff.

I just packed my car and went to Montana.

[TRAIN HORN HONKING]

I think I probably expected

to live a very similar life to my parents

as far as being working class. And...

Uh, I figured I would be married and have children, and...

um...

I think, I don't know.

I mean, I think most kids that come from...

...small towns probably all think the same.

I didn't expect to move away, ever.

I didn't expect to, um...

choose a career that, that it makes me well known

to people, and...

um...

It's definitely different than I expected.

I just thought I'd be a regular... probably a mom.

I was able to get out of that situation,

because I, um,

I was successful with the publishing.

Uh, a few years prior, I would not have been able to leave.

Um, it's just too expensive.

Sorry. What a person wants...

[SIGHS] Hold on.

[SNIFFLES]

Um...

[SNIFFLES]

Give me five.

‐CJ: What's going on? ‐NINA: [ON PHONE] I just got home from school,

and Britney just bailed out on Daddy.

‐So, and Daddy is sick. ‐CJ: Oh.

And I'm not supposed to be telling you this

because he can hear me through the air vent.

CJ: What happened?

I didn't do anything wrong, and he just told me to do all my chores.

But, but, I shouldn't be telling...

WOMAN 2: He's back there?

‐NINA: I have to go. ‐Where you going, love bug?

I'm going with Daddy to pick up Ella.

‐This son of a bitch. ‐We need to bring my baby.

‐Yeah. ‐I can be there tomorrow.

CJ: Yeah, dude, I need you to get my baby.

‐Is he working? ‐What the hell is he talking about?

Now he's trying to yell at me. We're about to have a fight.

‐Don't. ‐He just texted me,

[IMITATING MAN'S VOICE] "It'd be nice if you answer my fucking phone calls,"

and I'm like, "Uh, first of all, I have no missed calls on my phone."

‐I didn't hear it ring. ‐I didn't hear it ring.

I just called him and he didn't answer the phone.

So when he got tired of working that job that he didn't like,

I said, "Quit." I said, "I'm in a position right now

"where you know, I can take care of things."

And so he quit, and then he did not get off the ground

the things he wanted to get off the ground. And it was like,

the more successful I got and the less successful he got,

the more he just resented me.

You know, little by little, he's just not at home.

And then all of a sudden, it's like I'm doing everything.

‐I'm... ‐You're super mom.

I'm super mom and I'm still trying to have my career.

I'm still trying to have my life,

and, and I couldn't do it.

I couldn't do it.

And he just took whatever he could from me, you know.

Now I don't have, I haven't written a book

in like, you know, two years.

My money is spent.

KRISTEN: Release days are still hard for me to get excited

because he made it so horrible.

There it is.

Right there.

DIRECTOR: You know, a big reason for going with a traditional publisher

was that you get access to readers. New readers.

Mmm‐hmm.

Have you gotten a sense that goal has been achieved?

Um...

Some. Not as many as I expected.

I think I brought more readers with me

to the new series than the other way around.

Um...

So... I didn't see that for myself.

I think that other authors do.

But... it wasn't my experience that I gained a lot of new fans.

Introducing a new series is really tricky,

because they already trust you with what you've already done.

And I've had some success with the Seattle stuff,

and now I'm begging people to read something again.

It just makes my release day a little more stressful.

Truly, the Big Sky releases have been more stressful

than the Seattle books.

But also a Seattle, those are me.

If they don't do well, it's all on me and it would suck.

But, you know...

I am representing Simon & Schuster and Pocket books

with The Big Sky series.

And so, for that reason too, I want them to do very well.

And, um, I worry that they won't.

[TYPING]

‐[CELL PHONE RINGING] ‐Oh, here's K. P.

K.P. SIMMON: [ON PHONE] So Amazon, 118,

and Barnes & Noble is still 26.

KRISTEN: So we're not doing bad.

‐No. ‐I'd really like to get into the top 100 today.

KRISTEN: If you get into the top 100,

more people are gonna see your book.

The more people that see it, the more people that are gonna buy it,

and click on it. And that will keep it up there.

So, it will just keep perpetuating sales.

And if you fall below that,

you're really sort of in the swamp with everybody else,

where you're sort of invisible.

‐Hello? ‐Hey, how are you?

Hi. Hi.

Hi, little doggie.

‐Hi, sweetie. Hi. Thanks. ‐Come on in.

‐You want some wine? ‐Yes, please.

KELLI: I've been told that the readers are going more dark.

You know, darker, dirtier.

That's what they want now.

So, um, I'm like, okay, I can do that, you know?

So are you excited about, um, Lilith?

Yeah, um, you know, it's Monday,

so that'll be exciting. Um...

A little nervous. It's different from anything I've done before.

It's darker and dirtier and so.

‐Psychopathic. ‐We'll see.

‐Yes, she's right. She edited. ‐Psychopathic?

Carol edited it for me.

‐Okay. ‐Yeah. I mean...

...you know, there's, there's fear that,

um, you know,

my kids in Catholic school will have some repercussions if people

read this book, 'cause it's not a romance.

‐It's... ‐Right.

‐You know, it's bad stuff. ‐Mmm‐hmm.

It's about a guy,

who's in a motorcycle club who kidnaps women,

and trains them to be sold into the sex trade.

‐Ah! ‐In, uh, Mexican cartels.

‐[SIGHS] ‐[ALL LAUGHS]

I'm saying that with a smile.

So pushing... published will be interesting.

‐It'll be like... ‐CAROL: See what happens.

‐Yeah, we'll see. ‐Yeah, yeah.

That's so exciting.

Yeah, it's...

Yeah, that's interesting. It's, you know, different, so.

What do you like to write?

I like writing... I don't know.

We know that you've got to cut your losses at some point.

‐Mmm‐hmm. ‐Here it's not time to cut yours.

So forget that.

‐Oh, we will see. ‐No.

I agree with her that you need to get out there.

But here's the thing,

you're looking at profits and losses, you know what I mean?

If I'm spending all this time travelling

‐and this money travelling... ‐Yeah, that's a good point.

‐...I've gotta make up for it. ‐It's like an age‐old adage.

‐You've got to... ‐What you put in, you're gonna get out.

‐Yeah, yeah. ‐I know, but what if you don't get it out?

WOMAN 1: You're already in a rut.

CAROL: You've got to spend money to make money.

I've done that. It's not happening.

This one needs to happen. You have to keep being Kelli Maine,

keep making money, keep having readers,

and then... every six months,

put out something in young adult,

'cause that's what makes you happiest.

You can't just write and put books out,

you've gotta get it into the promotion,

you've gotta get it into the social media,

you've gotta get it in with the bloggers,

you've gotta... there's just...

it's overwhelming.

[DIRECTOR SPEAKING]

Sometimes I regret it because, I mean, I can't regret it.

I have this house because I went down there.

I have my car because I went down there.

I mean, I've been able to do things

because, um, you know, I got one... I got lucky,

I got one big payday out of it.

Basically, I'm at the point where

I need to decide, just decide for myself

where to go from here, which path I wanna take,

and who... what writer I wanna be

and what I wanna write.

I think if I stop now,

it's like admitting that I failed at this.

[KEYBOARD CLACKING]

[CHUCKLES]

[DIRECTOR SPEAKING]

Oh... good, nervous,

anxious, you know.

I think it's the same every time,

I don't think it gets any... any different,

you know, it's just, uh...

it's exciting,

but a little nerve‐wracking. [LAUGHS]

[PEOPLE SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY]

[GIGGLES]

WOMAN 1: I'll ask you, what do you recommend?

GLORYA: So, if you're looking to like a dark erotic romance...

‐I read it all. ‐...CJ Roberts is your girl.

Her mind is fucking... twisted.

Like, you know, dark erotica, dark romance,

‐the girl gets kidnapped. ‐WOMAN 1: Oh, okay.

[LAUGHING]

‐Who should I make it out to, hon? ‐Christina.

All right, Christina...

Okay, I have an author for you.

CJ, tell her about your books.

She likes reading true crime. She's not a romance...

‐but tell her about Captive. ‐Oh, okay.

So, uh, kidnapping,

blood, guts, lots of sex, and revenge!

‐[ALL LAUGHING] ‐Awesome.

CJ: I'm attracted to power dynamics.

Like, probably because...

I have felt weak in a lot of situations.

And, like, they said, like, all rape fantasies anyway,

it's not about sex. It's about power.

Growing up Catholic, I feel like shame

and arousal are like right in my pockets.

GARCIA: [NARRATING] "He kissed down my chest

"holding my knees apart.

"Stop! Stop...

"The first objection was real.

"The second one... I wasn't sure.

"His mouth latched onto my nipple,

"to the fabric of his shirt.

"Somehow more excruciating

"because he couldn't quite get to me.

"He sucked harder,

"making my nipple hard,

"wet and hot.

"I have sighed and groaned, unable to resist

"tilting my head back against the carpet,

"eyes closed,

"falling into sensations I had never felt before.

"You don't hate me at all.

"I think you like me just fine.

"I was crying.

"But it wasn't for the right reasons.

"I think I know something else you might like.

"His hands and his mouth trailed down my body.

"And though I knew I should...

"I couldn't bring myself to say anything against it.

"He was gonna do what he wanted,

"whether I protested or not.

"Would it be so horrible if I did nothing?

"Could I be held to blame?

"My eyes shot open and I sat up...

"as soon as his hot mouth covered my sex.

"He looked up and grabbed the collar around my neck,

"kissing me with fury before pushing me back down.

"Shocked...

"I twisted from side to side...

"crying and grunting."

DIRECTOR: Is there a sense

when you're reading these darker things,

like, oh, I shouldn't be enjoying this, but I am?

Yeah, it's...

There is. Because it's, like, you know,

when a character gets raped,

um, or there is any type of abuse,

physical or anything...

For me, yeah, I do get extremely emotional,

and think, you know,

how can I even continue reading this?

And why am I enjoying the story?

We know that the hero loves the woman all along,

we the readers. Even if the heroine is confused.

And that's absolutely crucial.

Um, so that any kind of aggression

that he, uh, exhibits towards her

or meanness, any kind of pain that he inflicts,

is always in the service of love.

So I think the business of rape fantasy,

it has to be seen as fantasy,

as something that is not, like,

what you wish would happen directly to you.

There is this perception

that romance readers are not able

‐to separate their worlds. ‐No. No.

We do not understand the difference between a book and real life.

‐Well, our tiny, tiny brains can't do it. ‐Can't handle it.

I think what happens is that, if you buy into that fantasy,

it puts you at risk

of being a victim of a perpetrator.

If this is what you think romance looks like...

Because we don't have two brains,

one marked "fantasy," one marked "reality,"

you know, we process information with the same brain

that's fantasy, that's reality, that's imaginary,

and it all gets, sort of, mushed up into experience.

This is an ideology, this is patriarchy.

We need... We can do better than this.

You know what? We can do a hell of a lot better

than what patriarchy hands us.

To kinda try to view sex as something that we can...

We can take away... apart

from power, aggression, submission,

all of those questions, I just, I... I think it's both,

um, kind of, ridiculously utopian

and also, sort of, awful.

For me, it was like,

to overcome that repressed sexuality

where, yeah, someone will just barge into your life,

um, and, give you

what you didn't even know you needed.

Um, which is, I think, for women, a big fantasy.

Not... not the rape, not the nonconsensual,

not really the real life elements of these things,

but the undertone of these things

which is...

I want... I want to be explosive about my sexuality,

but I don't wanna have to own it.

It is a way for us to take hold of our sexuality,

to be able to read these books,

and have these dark things happen.

And a lot of what we see in our violent culture of rape,

and being cat called and hollered and objectified...

imprints on us and is actually what we like to see

acted out in our fantasies where we have control of it,

and we have control of what happens to us,

and we can change it and make it not scary in our book.

But women that were survivors of sexual abuse email me a lot

and they go, "You know what? I read your stuff, and I really loved it.

"And I just wanted to say, like, I had this experience.

"And I have all of these fantasies

"that I don't know what to do with

"because it's so taboo,

"because people are gonna shame you."

I felt like something that was a part of me

was finally talked about.

When I started writing this story,

I wrote it... I wrote it for myself,

because I...

I felt, maybe, like, a lot of people in this room,

like, there are some things about me

that I can never share with anyone.

And the blank page...

is my diary, it's my canvas,

it's my friend.

And I wrote that story for myself.

Um, there's a piece of my heart in it

and a piece of my soul.

Though, what I love about it the most is that...

you've accepted the piece of me

I thought I couldn't share with anybody.

[SNIFFLING] And you have loved me for it.

And when you guys thank me for writing,

I just say, you know what?

I don't give a shit about that.

Thanks for reading it

and just thanks for taking me as I am and as I come.

So, that's it. I'm very proud. Thank you.

[AUDIENCE CHEERING, APPLAUDING]

DIRECTOR: Ready for take one.

So, just walk us through what happened.

Um... Amazon said, "Uh, we're not gonna put this up.

"This goes against our content guidelines."

Um... which is actually a kind of a relief,

because I don't really wanna put it out anyway.

I don't know. You know, I'm kind of...

at the point now where, maybe, this is a good place

to just kind of...

[LAUGHING]

...ride off into the sunsets.

It's not fun, it's awful.

So, yeah, this would probably be

a good place to just decide...

to not do this anymore. [CHUCKLES]

I'm just done.

[CAMERA SHUTTER CLICKS]

KRISTEN: Last night, it was like...

nine‐hundred and something.

And I was kind of disappointed in that.

INTERVIEWER: What's the Amazon ranking?

Um, let's take a look.

We're in the top‐200.

Come Away with Me peaked at about

50, 60‐ish.

I've... I think the highest I've been is three.

That's not gonna happen with this book.

[CELL PHONE VIBRATING]

[GASPS] Number 99 on Amazon!

We broke the top‐100.

That's right. Yes!

And number 25 on Barnes & Noble.

Very nice.

My day is complete.

I can now rest easy.

I've an announcement to make, people.

There's nothing over here. Sorry.

‐Oh, it's real clogged up. ‐Um...

So, we already know I'm number 84 on Amazon.

‐Right. ‐And number 21 on Barnes & Noble.

But my author rank moved up

from 43 to 40 on Amazon.

‐Yeah! ‐Yes!

[BOTH LAUGHING]

I'm gonna hold the... I'm gonna hold this.

I was a little on edge all day

and then I saw it hit number 99,

and I took a very visible breath.

It was like... [SIGHING] Okay.

Everything's gonna be okay.

I remember the first time even reading your book.

And we were sitting on a couch, remember it was at your house.

And you had handed it to me, it was on your Kindle.

And you were like... "Don't read past this amount of pages."

‐[ALL LAUGHING] ‐"Don't go far."

At that time, I was like, "I'm fine. I can read it."

"Are you sure? I don't want you to read this,

"and then you look at me funny. Just... Just read a few pages."

And then by the time she went to go put the laundry down,

and then she came back up, I was already on chapter two.

And then she was like, "I told you not to read that much.

"Don't go that far." Then she goes, "Lemme see. What do you think?"

‐"What do you think?" ‐[ALL LAUGHING]

They're like, "Oh, my gosh, she's so famous."

Like, who the hell is famous? That's not her.

‐[ALL LAUGHING] ‐Who you talking to?

I think that shit every time I'm cleaning the cat box at home,

‐like, I'm so famous. I'm so famous! ‐[ALL LAUGHING]

They're like, "Your sister is famous, dude. She writes books."

I'm like, "So what? Shit... She wrote a book.

"She's not famous. She don't have a Hollywood story."

There's so much stories within her mind

that she just hasn't put 'em in the right direction yet.

But when she finds it...

um, I know it's gonna be another hit.

Like, I always tell her, I wish I could be you when I grow up.

Because in a way,

um, I mean, we grew up together, both of us.

I was very young when I had her, I was only 17‐years‐old when I became a mother.

‐WOMAN 1: [WHISPERING] 16. ‐Well, 16, and the next month I became 17.

That even with the one book, even if she doesn't write another book,

even though... she's already left a mark,

and that's how I feel, and I'm proud as hell, and I'll always be.

Because she left a mark.

Every time I do something or I'm gonna, like, come up,

some shit comes along to, like, chop my legs out from under me.

‐But I'll... ‐JULIE: Yeah, I see that.

‐...I'll get there. ‐JULIE: I see that. And I... And I hope that, uh,

it gets out there soon. I think it's time.

I mean, shit, me too, man. Me too. Damn it!

ALTER: I think after Fifty Shades,

mainstream publishing looks at romance

and romance readers very differently.

I think beyond even just the publishing industry,

the effect of those books was to show

the... the range of, of taste that

mainstream audiences have.

It was much more extreme and edgy

than anyone anticipated.

Nobody thought women would go to bookstores and buy

a book about S&M,

you know, and, um, and celebrate it.

I think because Fifty Shades...

because of the books

that were associated with it, including mine,

I think women were like, "Yeah, that turns me on. I like it."

MODLESKI: Love has always had to be there,

um, in the novels,

to legitimate

all the sex that... that goes on,

um, however much there happens to be

in any... in any given novel.

Um, so I think the next step would be

and God knows when it's gonna come,

is when women just enjoy the sex

and forget about the love.

Maybe when my children are grown up,

the books will be able to have more women‐dominant

and maybe that will be more accepted

and... and be the next phase of things.

It's also just a function of society,

devaluing things that women like.

People always wanted to be more complicated than that,

and it's really not,

where, especially when we to try to explain, like,

it's just sexist.

It's not that much more complicated.

It's just sexist.

They're like, oh, there must be some other reason.

Mmm, not really.

DIRECTOR: What do you think your life would look like now

if you had never written Come Away with Me?

[SIGHING] Oh, that makes me sad.

Like, the thought of that.

We can't go there right now. [LAUGHS]

KRISTEN: I've hit New York Times now,

which was the big goal.

But I'd love to hit that number one slot.

I'd love to be invited to sign books with Nora Roberts.

It's been a wild‐ride,

but amazing. I wouldn't change it.

Even the bad stuff, I wouldn't have changed it.

I can't believe it's my life most of the time.

‐I'm following you. Let's go this way. ‐All right.

KELLI: Nothing against the authors that write this stuff.

They're writing things that readers wanna read.

I'm the one that can't write what readers wanna read in the genre.

It's a dark place when you realize

that it's you that's holding yourself back.

I guess lottery winners win one time in their life, right?

[LAUGHING] So, that's where I'm at:

post lottery.

Well, you get to the level of your own fucking self‐loathing and exhaustion

and then you're like, that's it.

Get up and do something before I hate you forever.

So, I'm getting up, and I'm moving

before I hate myself forever.

CJ: When I put this book out,

I didn't want anyone to know that it was me.

I just wanted to put it out there.

Because it was the first time that an entire...

group of people had been like... "I see you."

♪ I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way

♪ You're breaking my heart

♪ Yeah, that's just what I need

♪ I got a new start

♪ Yeah, that's just what I need

♪ I'm rising above

♪ The flood under my feet

♪ I'm moving on

♪ Yeah, that's just what I need

♪ Yeah, that's just what I need

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ Shine a light in the dark

♪ Yeah, that's just what you need

♪ Throw open your doors

♪ Yeah, that's just what you need

♪ Maybe you broke me in two

♪ These legs still carry me

♪ I broke out of my chains

♪ The truth gonna set me free

♪ The truth gonna set me free

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

[VOCALIZING]

♪ Yeah, I'm on my way!

♪ I'm on my way I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way

♪ Yeah, I'm on my way!

♪ I'm on my way

♪ I'm on my way, yeah!

♪ I'm layin' it down I'm layin' it down ♪