Original subtitles

♪

A palindrome is a word, phrase, or sentence

that reads backward and forward the same.

Just seems like such a magic little puzzle.

People underestimate how hard

a hard a good short palindrome is

in part because the easy ones have all been done.

If you say to someone, "Do you know what a palindrome is?"

if they say yes, they usually can quote something like

"Madam, I'’m Adam," or, "Was it a rat I saw?"

My favorite palindrome that I'’ve written is:

There'’s something exquisite

about a beautifully crafted palindrome.

I think that'’s worthy of support and worthy of celebration.

♪

Next year is the second World Palindrome Championship.

We will invite top palindromists

from all across the country and around the world,

and they will have 90 minutes or so

to craft original palindromes

and the audience will vote on the winners.

♪

[indistinct conversations]

♪

All the way from Portland, Oregon,

he'’s performed all over the U.S.

You may have seen him on eHarmony or Match.com.

Mark Saltveit.

[applause]

You know what I'’m most famous for in the world

is writing palindromes.

And this just confuses people,

especially when I use it to try to impress women.

So I explain, you know, palindromes,

words that are the same backwards and forwards,

and she'’s like, "Huh?"

And I'’m like, "Yeah, exactly!"

It took me 12 years as a standup comic

to figure out how to explain palindromes

to a crowd of people who are not reading,

they'’re just listening to you.

So I start pouring it on,

I start throwing down original palindromes that I wrote,

like, "An igloo? Cool, Gina."

[laughing]

She just looks right back and says,

"Oh no, Don Ho."

[cheering]

Like a lot of kids in the third, fourth, fifth grade,

I learned about palindromes in school

and got really excited, and my brothers and I

tried to write our own palindromes,

and we could never come up with a good one.

The best we ever came up with was,

"Radar kayak radar."

And then, one day we thought we had hit the jackpot

and were like gonna be the most famous nine-year-old kids

in history '’cause we wrote a dirty palindrome,

which was, "Eat poop tea."

And we were like so proud of ourselves,

and then one of us looked at it and it doesn'’t actually work.

It'’s A, E, T, T, E, A.

So it'’d be, "Aet poop tea,"

or, "Eat poop tae."

And so, basically, gave up on it.

Twenty years after the "poop tea" incident,

I was insomniac one night.

I just thought, "Oh, palindromes are fun.

Let me try my hand with that."

And I just, like, grabbed a dictionary

and ended up writing a really long palindrome.

It'’s vastly easier than it was when I was a little kid

and it was called The Brag of the Vain Lawyer, and it was:

I was like, "That didn'’t even seem that hard."

So, I got obsessed, started writing a bunch of palindromes.

And at the time, I was very active in the zine scene,

you know, when people do little handmade magazines,

before the internet, mind you.

Palindromes were the obvious subject.

Almost everyone was doing there about their personal obsessions.

It was kind of a no-brainer.

So I started writing this magazine, The Palindromist.

Part of my goal with creating the zine

was just to encourage people to write their own palindromes,

'’cause part of my thing is that a lot more people

could write palindromes than do.

Very early on, I met Jon Agee just interviewing him

for the magazine '’cause he's the obvious choice.

He'’s the only person who's ever made money off palindromes.

♪

That was, I think the Subaru Durabus.

You know, the drawing for that would be something like this.

You know...

[mumbling]

♪

Do you ever make noises when you draw?

If you draw, that'’s what I do.

I make noises, when I'’m trying to make something

that looks tough, like, "Argh!"

My face goes into a tough "Argh."

put a little bit of a tank.

Yes, there we go.

Lots of rivets, lots of rivets.

That helps.

[laughing]

There.

Yes.

The Eddie Bauer edition, okay.

♪

This is the book Go Hang A Salami! I'’m a Lasagna Hog!

from 1991.

First book, yeah, first book of palindromes.

But this, this was a good one.

This is a friend of mine,

Dan Fagelson came up with this one.

Last egg gets Al.

It'’s a great palindrome but this is an example

of a palindrome which really needs a picture.

Last egg gets Al.

So you see a guy who'’s standing here,

somebody'’s been trying to throw eggs at him

and finally, they got him.

I'’m always thinking of like, "What'’s the picture here?"

♪

My mom is an artist and my twin sister, she'’s an artist.

So yeah, been drawing and illustrating

since I was a kid.

♪

Went to art school and lugged all my drawings

to publishers, cartoons and stuff,

thinking that they'’d just publish 'em,

and they'’d say, "Who are you?"

And I realized, "Oh, you have to kind of get your stuff

in magazines before people are ready to do that."

And then sort of by accident, I ended up illustrating

and writing my own picture books for kids.

In the middle of all that,

I was at dinner with some friends

and a friend of mine was talking about palindromes

and I handed him my little sketchbook and I said,

"Here, draw--

show me some of your palindromes."

Well, it was interesting, he didn'’t just write

the palindromes, he drew a picture,

because his palindromes were so weird

that they needed a picture.

And I think that was the hook for me.

It was like, "Oh, I create palindromes,

but I'’ll draw pictures for them!"

Whenever I'’d show them to people,

they would find them amusing.

They'’d say, "That's funny, oh,

and the thing backwards and forwards."

The palindromes by themselves

would create these funny scenarios,

like star rats.

I would actually really enjoy creating them.

[typewriter keys clicking]

Some say that the first words ever spoken

were a palindrome when Adam introduced himself to Eve

in the Garden of Eden by saying,

"Madam, I'’m Adam."

In truth, the oldest written palindrome that we know

was God'’s words to Moses from the burning bush.

"Ahyh ashr ahyh,"

which translates to English as,"I am who I am."

This is a word unit palindrome

where the words reverse, not the letters.

Like the famous Three Musketeers slogan,

"One for all and all for one."

When alphabets and writing first emerged,

everyone felt the mystical power of these strange symbols.

The cleverest scribes noticed that some words and phrases

worked in either direction.

These must be the words of gods and the curses of devils.

These mysterious symmetrical invocations

soon decorated amulets and papyrus magical spells,

often surrounded by the Ouroboros,

the snake that swallows its own tail.

The most famous palindromic spell was the Sator Square.

Sator, arepo, tenet,

opera, rotas.

Palindromic in four directions.

No one knows where the Sator Square originated,

but has been found everywhere from the ruins of Pompeii

to Hungary, England,

Syria, Portugal,

Sweden, and Ethiopia.

But the most powerful of all was "ablanathanalba."

It was a spell to call down a mighty god

to do your evil bidding.

Over the centuries, "ablanathanalba" transformed

into the most famous magic word of all,

"abracadabra."

It'’s clear that palindromes have always had

a grip on our collective imaginations,

from the earliest days of history.

♪

♪

Will Shortz just loves competitions.

He'’s been doing palindrome competitions since 1991

when he was editor at Games Magazine,

though most of them have been on print

or on his NPR radio program.

And we talked about doing a live competition.

This is a chancefor the best palindrome writers

to come and show their skills,

and to discover who'’s the best palindromist.

Will came up with three prompts,

and you had to write a palindrome that fit

one of the three prompts.

The category that I won with had to have

an X and a Z in the palindrome.

I started off looking through my dictionary, as I do,

of things I'’ve accumulated over the years,

and with Z, I had a great start,

which is the word-- or the phrase,

"trapeze part."

♪

So, I look in my dictionary and I have another one, which is,

"fixes" reverses to "sex if."

So, "fixes trapeze part."

That makes sense, right?

Somebody had to repair something

due to a bedroom disaster.

"Fixes trapeze part,

sex if."

You need a subject here.

I find the name Kay, which reverse to "yak."

So now we'’re, now we're close.

So you can tell this is a classic in the making,

but the seconds are ticking down.

Everyone else is furiously scribbling.

And finally, I know that "sex if yak,"

I need a verb here.

So, I go, "What are the verbs, what are the verbs?"

And I came up with "lived"

and then "devil Kay."

She'’s already involved in some incident

involving sex with a yak that got injured,

so clearly, "devil" is a pretty good word for her.

And that'’s what I finished with.

"Devil Kay fixes trapeze part,

sex if yak lived."

I don'’t even wanna try to fully imagine

what this phrase is describing.

♪

[evil laughter]

♪

Yoohoo!

♪

[evil laughter]

[yak groaning]

♪

Yeah, I won, it was an audience vote.

Sex yak.

[imitating crowd cheering]

Everybody'’s--obviously, that was the one to go with.

Well, the last time was just a hoot.

We had those fantastic signs.

"Wow!" for the palindromes that were good,

and "Huh?" for the ones that weren'’t.

Mark Saltveit is the king of palindromes.

He is, you know, the guy to beat.

[waves crashing]

So this is my workbook.

I'’ve had a few of these at various times.

This is what palindroming looks like.

Just reams of things where I'’ve tried to,

you know, write bits and pieces.

So there'’s one that I like,

"Won'’t I use jam if I'’m a Jesuit now?"

And I'’m always worried when I'’m traveling on planes

that this looks like some sort of

terrorist manifesto or something like that.

People will look at it and say, "What do these words mean?

It'’s all in code!"

The Australian Women'’s Weekly, which my mother used to get,

had a back page for kids,

and one of them was a big page of palindromes.

I can still remember, I can picture the typeface

where it said, "Was it a rat I saw?"

And I thought that was absolutely brilliant.

That was the first time I recall looking at them

and then after that, I started looking for them.

Sort of collected examples of them for a while

and then, um, after about 20 years of doing that,

it suddenly occurred to me to try and write one.

Yeah, and then I sort of just got into that

and sort of was writing them for quite a few years

before I discovered anybody else was doing it too.

♪

The first time I sat down to write,

I took the seed word of my name, Martin, and I wrote:

And I was very pleased with that

and I still find it quite an interesting palindrome.

I just remember that set when I got enough to say to myself,

"You know, this is an infinite world.

I can go on and just keep writing these things," you know?

♪

It is a bit solitary.

There'’s not many people who do it.

You know, I would show other people my palindromes

but I don'’t think I ever met a single person

who had even attempted to write a palindrome.

♪

It'’s quite new for me for this, you know, activity that you did.

But when you told me about palindromes,

it just like took me a while until, "Okay,

there are people interestedin that kind of thing as well."

-Yeah. -Yeah.

I think it'’s important to do what you like.

So, I don'’t like being limited

by what other people find enjoyable.

I'’ve felt that about a lot of things.

If ever people think, "Oh, that'’s silly,"

or something like that, who cares?

They'’re not doing it, it's me.

We normally just like, you know, just spend time outside,

went to the park, walked the dog.

Apart from when I ask you about like, you know,

"What did you do about palindromes"?

and you told me about it, apart from that,

I didn'’t see you just, like, you know,

concentrating, writing one.

-It'’s my solitary activity. -Yeah.

-She'’s very proud of it though. -Yeah, kind of.

She always tells her friends about it.

But I had a hard time explaining it to them.

I just have to start with, like, something easy,

like pop, mom, kayak or something,

and they'’re just rolling their eyes

and it'’s like, "How did he do it?"

And just like--I think what they try to tell me,

just like how weird your boyfriend is.

[laughing]

You know, I have my interest in palindromes.

Other people have other interests in other things

and I encourage them to enjoy those,

even if they'’re not things that fascinate me.

To me, it'’s the differences between us

that sometimes make us interesting.

I'’m kind of--you know, I know the ones who I email

and who are in that sort of little group.

Lori Wike is a new one

that we'’ve sort of recently contacted.

She'’s the lead bassoonist, I think,

in the Utah State Orchestra.

♪

[birds chirping]

So this is one of my palindromes.

It'’s one of my favorite palindromes that I'’ve written.

I first became aware of palindromes

when I was probably eight or nine years old.

It'’s kind of ironicsince I ended up living in Utah,

but the first palindrome I think I probably ever saw was,

"Hat Utah," with a very cute little drawing

in the Martin Gardner book.

Happened to discover Mark Saltveit'’s

Palindromist magazine online and I said, oh, you know

this is for people who read and write palindromes.

I was like, "I should try to write palindromes.

I wonder if I can."

And I wrote a palindrome.

I believe it was...

I think that'’s it.

Is that a palindrome?

Yes, it is.

It kind of just took off from there

and I just kept writing palindromes.

♪

As a bassoon player, we have to make our own reeds.

So I make mini, mini bassoon reeds.

It'’s a very individualized art.

It'’s just very satisfying.

I enjoy lots of puzzles.

I love logic puzzles, I love jigsaw puzzles,

but palindromes are without question,

my favorite form of word play.

The palindromist is playing with the language

and playing with this kind of art of letter reversal

and then coming up with something that is both new

and yet was always already there.

It'’s this dual operation of both finding

and creating at the same time.

I think it'’s mostly a hobby,

although it can make it a little difficult to read at times

if you'’re constantly looking at words backwards.

If it'’s an addiction, it'’s a very positive addiction.

[blowing]

[reed whistling]

[typewriter keys clicking]

In World War II even,

palindromes played a part in the war effort.

The British, when they were trying to crack

the Nazi'’s secret codes, recruited all of the best

crossword puzzle as well as math people

and they set up an operation at a mansion,

an estate outside of London called Bletchley Park.

One night, John Henry Whitehead,

the head mathematician on the team,

challenged everyone to a palindrome contest.

The idea was to come up with something more compelling

than the old chestnut, "Step on no pets!"

Peter Hilton quickly invented the classic,

"Sex at noon taxes."

But Whitehead was still not satisfied.

He challenged Hilton to write a longer one.

Later that night, Hilton simply laid down on his bed,

closed his eyes, and without the use of pen or paper,

he took on Whitehead'’s challenge,

and by the morning, he had assembled

what some consider the greatest palindrome of all time.

The code breakers were under extremely strict secrecy

at Bletchley Park, so none of the code breakers

ever reported their palindromes.

However, soon after the war ended,

there was a rather peculiar event.

An itinerant engineer named Leigh Mercer,

who lived just a few miles from Bletchley Park,

just so happened to send in exactly 100 palindromes

to a popular literary magazine.

When asked about them, he admitted

that he hadn'’t written most of them.

These 100 palindromes were about as many

English language palindromes as had been written

in all of history put together,

and his post-war bounty included

such unpublished classics as,

"Poor Dan is in a droop,"

and, "Won'’t lovers revolt now?"

Not to mention Mercer'’s own classic,

"A man, a plan, a canal.

Panama."

♪

♪

My name is Danica McKellar and I love palindromes.

Writing palindromes is a challenge.

It'’s a fun challenge that I highly recommend to everyone,

and what you need to do-- '’cause first you think,

"Oh, I wouldn'’t know where to start."

Pick someone'’s name and then do a palindrome from that name,

and you might think it'’s impossible.

Like, Danica, how would you write a palindrome from Danica?

I believe it'’s, "Danica in a Niacin ad."

I had never even thought about writing my own palindromes

until I was a new mother, actually.

I was sitting in my glider rocking chair

breastfeeding my newborn child, thinking about his name,

Draco, D, R, A, C, O,

and just, I thought,

"Hey, if you spell it backwards,

Draco card.

Draco card, that'’s a palindrome!"

So then on Twitter, I tweeted out the challenge to everyone

where the answer was "Draco card,"

and a bunch of people came up with the answer

and it was so much fun interacting with my fans

that way that the next night, I gave another challenge.

I believe the second one I did was, " I prefer Pi."

And for a while, for years actually--

I think for about two years--

I did a new palindrome contest every single night,

and so I stopped for a little while.

I think I stopped for a few months

and people kept asking me about it.

I thought, "You know what,

I bet I could do it once a week."

Do it once a week and I'’ve been doing it ever since.

Every Thursday on my Twitter account,

I put out a challenge, a clue

and the answer is always a palindrome.

-Oh! -Yeah, so I have--

-do you wanna play? -I would like to try.

-I would like to try to do it. -So, in 2014,

I was on Dancing With the Stars at the time,

and The Tonight Show had me on as a guest

to talk about Dancing With the Stars,

to talk about my math books,

and also palindromes.

I was delighted to hear that they were interested

in me talking about that on the show, and they said,

"We want you to give Jimmy Fallon a challenge,

like give him one of your clues."

If martians landed and we found their used--

If they landed?

Duh, they already have, um...

If we found their used tissues on board

and we discover lots of, quote, lots of "alien boogers."

But I had a feeling he wasn'’t gonna get the palindrome,

I mean, it didn'’t seem very realistic

because you don'’t have a lot of time to sit there and think

when you'’re in the middle of a show.

Lots of alien boogers, reword that.

-Snot rockets? -Close.

-Snot... -Tons of UFO snot!

That'’s a palindrome.

So, it was a great moment, I love that guy.

♪

I live in Washington D.C.

It'’s a great place for photography.

It'’s a very interesting place.

It has its own unique character in a lot of ways.

There was a Wolf Trap Road in Northern Virginia

and I just happened to notice

it was Dr. Part Flow.

D, R, Part Flow backwards,

Wolf Trap Rd.

And I started researching

what people had done with palindromes.

I subscribed to The Palindromist newsletter.

I started trying to put poems together

and I realized that maybe I could do things

that hadn'’t quite been done yet.

I wrote a book where palindromes were the heart of it.

I wanted to go for poems that I could show to people,

but they wouldn'’t notice that it was a palindrome

or they wouldn'’t suspect it was some form of word play.

♪

If you wanna become a palindromist,

just simply start looking at words backwards.

The major difficulty is getting started.

I think once people get over that,

it really isn'’t that difficult.

You start in the middle and you build out from there.

You have the word in the middle and then you add another word,

but you have extra letters on one side and not the other side.

So then you have to add those letters in reverse over here

and you can make a word from that,

but now you'’ve expanded it this way

and you'’ve got a few more letters on that end

that now have to go on this end.

So it'’s like an accordion.

There'’s technicalities to words

that make them good for palindromes or not.

Any word that alternates a vowel and a consonant

all the way through is often easy to turn backwards.

And then sometimes you go, "That wasn'’t a good word

to click on there but I think there'’s an other word

that I can click on instead

and see how that one works over there."

And then you'’re like, "Wait, is this good though?"

Sometimes you scrap the whole thing.

Hi, my name is Douglas Fink.

I am a palindromist.

I have been so

for quite a long time, at least 20 years.

In fact, if I do the math, at least 25,

at least 27 years.

Let'’s say 30 years.

Hi, my name is Douglas Fink.

I have been a palindromist for about 30 years.

There was a TV show on when I was a kid

called The Electric Company.

And they would have these big fuzzy letters in the air

floating around and when I'’m moving letters around,

I see it kind of like that.

I see those big fuzzy white letters

and I move '’em around in my head,

and somehow,

palindromes is kind of related to it,

because it'’s just a simple mirroring of it.

You'’re not mixing them up in a complex way.

You'’re just reversing them.

So, "slip up" is "pupils,"

"drawer" is "reward."

These are things that

I guess from an early time,

I kind of knew.

"Gateman" is "nametag."

These are some of the early longer words

that you become familiar with, reversals of each other

that are good in the palindrome world.

This is the letter I got when I won

Games Magazine'’s Palindromes With Personality contest

back in 1992.

Mine was:

I'’ve not been in contact with Lisa Bonet,

who, by the way, is a vegetarian.

There'’s probably a very good chance

that she does eat basil.

The amusing ones tend to be the ones that grab people the most,

because they make them laugh and they'’re like,

"Wow, I just laughed at this thing

and it'’s also this really crazy,

constrained form of writing at the same time,

but it'’s also hilariously funny."

Because you'’re forced to come up with

crazy word combinations often, that becomes comedic.

I think the funny ones are probably the most impressive,

because it'’s hard to be funny

and it'’s really hard to write a palindrome,

but to write a funny palindrome, that'’s pretty amazing.

I guess my claim to fame in the palindrome world

is the song I wrote called Bob.

It was on my Poodle Hat album which came out in 2003.

I was hoping the album would come out in 2002,

because 2002 was a palindrome year

and I thought that would be kind of cool

to have it come out then.

And I was just really fascinated with palindromes

and I thought, wouldn'’t it be cool

to make a song comprised entirely out of palindromes?

So it was just sort of like a little exercise that I did

and I was very happy with the result, and I think

a lot of people in the palindrome community

seemed to appreciate it.

♪ God, a red nugget

♪ A fat egg under a dog

♪ Go hang a salami, I'’m a lasagna hog ♪

Jon Agee, more than anybody else,

was the inspiration for my song Bob.

I think I was probably flipping through

one of his books in a bookstore and I thought,

"Well, this would make a good song."

I wish I could take credit for the palindromes in the song.

I don'’t think I wrote a single one of those.

Those were all very famous palindromes.

"Oozy rat in a sanitary zoo."

I thought that was a nice image to conjure up.

"O Geronimo, no minor ego."

I mean, there are a lot of fun ones.

Once I started coming up with rhyme schemes

and putting it together, it was sounding to me

sort of like a Bob Dylan song,

because the palindromes all sort of made sense.

They seemed sort of like they could be profound

in a certain context, and I tried to sing them

in sort of a Bob Dylan kind of nasal twang,

and I thought, "Yeah, this is like a Bob Dylan song."

And then I thought, "Oh, even the name Bob is a palindrome,

so yeah, this is meant to be."

I'’m a big fan of Weird Al Yankovic

and I went to one of his shows at the Oakdale Theater.

And one of the songs that he did there was Bob.

♪ No lemons, no melon

♪ Too bad I hid a boot

♪ Lisa Bonet ate no basil

So it was really quite exciting hearing my palindrome

and saying, "Wait a minute, that'’s mine!"

I got to hear my palindrome there

in this giant sea of people,

and it was kind of amazing.

Palindromists or pa-lin-dromists,

or palindromistas.

I would say palindromist,

but I would not look at you askance

if you said pa-lin-dromist.

Pa-lin-dromist flows, it sounds very elegant.

Oh, it'’s definitely palindromist.

Pa-lin-dromist doesn'’t even sound like a real word.

All the dictionaries says pa-lin-dromist.

I think that sounds preposterous.

It sounds British, hoity-toity.

I prefer palindromist, that sounds American.

Pa-lin-dromist sounds like more snooty or something.

"I'’m a pa-lin-dromist."

No you'’re not.

You like palindromes, right?

Okay, just checking.

♪

[laughing]

♪

As I inflict on the neighbors on regular intervals.

I'’m kind of known in the palindroming community

for writing very immature palindromes.

I write a lot of rude ones, for instance.

I think comedy writers do something similar

to what palindrome writers do.

They work on two levels at the same time.

So when you--in a palindrome,

you'’re working on one level which is a mechanical one.

You'’re reversing words into other words,

but you'’re also trying to write a meaningful sentence

and you'’ve gotta obey those two masters at the same time.

A comedy writer will write something

that has a certain meaning

but then there'’s an underlying meaning as well

that people are aware of.

The very fact that when you reverse words,

you get something that you weren'’t intending

provides this wonderful random element

that throws up weird phrases and things like that.

I think absurdity has always fascinated me

and I think palindromes

are definitely in that realm.

There'’s something nonsensical about them,

but there'’s something beautiful about doing a drawing

that can bring sense to them and that'’s the best part.

♪

I have to say, I didn'’t think I'd be doing

another palindrome book

after I finished Palindromania! 13 years ago.

I thought that was it, and then I started concocting

some palindromes with wonton in them.

And I suddenly had like this conversation with this guy

who'’s made wonton soup and nobody wants to have it,

and he realizes that he'’s stuck in this thing

where every time he offers wonton, it'’s, "Not now."

And I sent the idea for the dialogue

to my editor at Penguin,

and Lori is one of those rare people

who also loves palindromes,

and she was all for it.

♪

So this is an idea for the beginning of the book.

It would start with him looking at a Chinese cookbook

and he zeroes in on wonton soup and he sees,

like the picture of the soup, and he turns to his wife

who'’s on the computer in the kitchen and says, "Hey, Ava.

You know, how about I make some wonton soup," right?

And then she'’s looking at her computer and she says,

"Wonton? Not now."

And then you turn the page and it'’s like,

"Hey, that'’s a palindrome."

"A what?" "A palindrome.

Forwards and backwards it says the same thing."

"Oh."

So that'’s what I'm currently at work on.

Struggling with, but turned out to be more,

more of a challenge than I originally thought.

Made mostly because I want it to be very entertaining

for everybody, you know,

and so that'’s the challenge.

-Hello, Amanda, come on in. -Hi, thanks.

So this is my student, Amanda Moreton.

Amanda, so at the beginning of Beethoven'’s 4th symphony,

the last movement, we have a passage

in the two bassoons, which is quite tricky.

It goes like this.

[rapid notes playing]

Um, so why don'’t you play this backwards?

-Okay. -Slowly, slowly.

-Okay. -Slowly once.

Starting there.

[notes playing]

Good, how about a little faster?

[fast-paced notes playing]

And then play forwards.

-Wanna try it together? -Sure.

One, two, one.

[rapid notes playing]

-Excellent. -Yeah.

So even before I was writing palindromes,

I was having my students do this

because if you'’re practicing something that'’s very difficult,

you can'’t keep playing it over and over exactly the same.

It'’s like beating your head against a brick wall

is what I like to say.

You have to add variations,

and sometimes if something is extremely difficult,

playing it backwards is kind of the one thing

that will really get it into your head.

I was like, "I just can'’t get this, I practiced it so much,"

and Lori'’s like, "Play it backwards."

And I was like, "What?"

Changed my life, just--

-Palindrome power. -Palindrome power.

Okay, so let'’s try this Bach crab canon.

One, two, one, two.

Sorry.

-I'’ll give two full bars. -Okay.

One, two, one.

[classical music]

♪

This Bach'’s crab canon from The Musical Offering,

and it'’s a musical palindrome, the two voices together.

And he wrote it as a puzzle.

He only wrote one part of it, and then at the end of it,

he wrote a backwards clef sign

with the indication to the performers

that it was meant to be a canon in two voices.

That was the clue and then the performers

had to come up with the solution

in order to be able to play this canon,

and just that backwards clef sign at the very end

of the music was what pointed the direction of the solution.

It'’s really very, very fascinating

how this was written.

But there are lots of musical palindromes

and this is one of the most famous ones.

♪

The first World Palindrome Championship,

that was a great experience.

It was actually--

meeting all of the palindromists for the first time.

Mark, Martin, Nick from Boston,

and Doug Fink was there,

and we were all very different people.

That was fun.

I was happy for Mark, Mark won,

because I think Mark has been such a supporter

and a spokesperson for the art of writing a palindrome.

I was a little sad for Martin.

Martin, all the way from Australia.

Martin has a way of writing a palindrome,

longish and relatively coherent.

But they went over the heads of people because they'’re--

once they start getting too long, you know,

and so he didn'’t win and I felt bad for that,

'’cause he's unique, you know.

Now he'’s had one chance at this

and he kind of knows what the audience is,

he'’s gonna get his act together and he'’s gonna do well.

Lori has chops.

She definitely has chops.

And she also has I think a more accessible

sense of humor maybe than some of the others.

There'’s a little pressure

since I'’m the published palindrome writer,

but, but I think I'’ll be okay.

It does become kind of a sickness though, you know?

At a certain point, like, I couldn'’t read a sign on a bus

without reading it backwards first.

You know, you can miss your stop

if you forget to read it forwards also.

Here'’s The Dalles on the sign again.

How can anybody read "The Dalles"

and not see, "Sell ad, eh?"

Uh, but I wanna introduce a gentleman here in a moment

who'’s gonna help us celebrate kind of the wild cousin

of tongue twisters, palindromes.

His name is Mark Saltveit, he'’s from Portland.

[applause]

Thank you very much.

Now, Kirby, as we know, works for a newspaper

and they'’re dependent on selling ads.

So, this palindrome tells me, Kirby, that you should maybe try

to sell your ads down the road a little bit.

This is what it says:

[laughing]

[applause]

Thank you!

I think Mark, his knowledge of palindromes is unmatched.

As far as I think of Mark, he'’s the palindromic ambassador.

[typewriter keys clicking]

One of the reasons we even have a palindrome scene today

is '’cause of a man named Howards Bergerson.

After work, he would go home and write late into the night

on a Smith Corona Manual typewriter,

positioned in the center of his living room

which was the only spot where

the shingle mill worker'’s roof didn'’t leak.

Howard spent years gathering the known palindromes

and corresponding with the greatest palindromists

of the day, J.A. Lindon and Leigh Mercer,

among many others, and compiled a book

which many refer to as the Palindrome Bible.

It was titled Palindromes and Anagrams,

but at the time he was finishing his book

there was a strike.

And with a family to feed, he was in a tight spot.

So he wound up accepting an offer to sell

all of the rights to his book for a flat $1,000.

To this day, 45 years later, it'’s still in print

and it still stands as the definitive book on palindromes.

♪

Gonna visit Merla,

Howard Bergerson'’s daughter here.

She'’s cleaning out his old boxes of papers.

He passed on a few years ago.

I think there might be some gold in there.

[doorbell ringing]

Hey, Merla, how ya doing?

-Good to see you! -Good to see you, hey!

♪

This is one of my favorite photos.

-Oh, that'’s a great photo. -My Aunt Dottie took that.

-Here'’s an army picture of Dad. -Oh, that'’s great.

-That'’s serious. -He did not go into action.

He was in the typing pool.

The word play that my dad did was pretty esoteric.

I mean, there'’s just not a huge body of people

who are out there doing that.

This is a letter from James A. Lindon

-from England. -From J .A. Lindon!

You know he'’s one of the three great palindromists

-of the 20th century. -And he signs--he always

-signed his letters JAL. -JAL.

So, I mean here'’s word squares.

-Right, right. -This is interesting.

-Oven, menu. -Yeah.

They'’re not palindromic though,

but they are word squares that work different ways.

"I know you could go into great detail concerning word-squares,

but so far as I could see do not mention word-cubes."

Oh my God, a word cube in three dimensions?

This is interesting about palindromes.

"I agree that the ideal is a sentence, yes,

but I feel that language, however used,

should come alive by referring whatever is said

to a wider context, either to the real world

or to the world of the imagination.

And if it doesn'’t,

then even your perfectly constructed sentence is dead

and cold and might as well be left in the abstract."

I agree 100%.

So here he'’s saying that palindromes like,

"A man, a plan, a canal--Panama!"

or, "Able was I ere I saw Elba,"

or, "Red now, Asia is a wonder,"

pass because they refer to the real world.

"More fun are the absurd ones that conjure up

a surrealistic world of the imagination."

This is one of my favorites, I know this is your dad'’s.

I love that one so much.

So this must be the list he put together for his book.

Do you remember him working on the book?

Oh yeah.

His book, Palindromes and Anagrams, is still in print

but I think Edna Waterfall was his palindromic opus.

♪

It was in the Guinness Book of World Records

as the longest palindromic poem,

and then, you know, other people said,

"Wait a minute, palindromic poem?

I can write a bunch of palindromic words in order,"

and then, you know, it was just nonsense.

-Yeah. -But Edna Waterfall,

it had story to it, it had characters,

and it made sense if you were a thoughtful reader

and a careful reader.

But in terms of like, fame and notoriety,

I don'’t think that Dad got a whole lot.

You know, and if you'’re looking for fame...

palindromes is probably...

[laughing]

♪

I love Salt Lake, I love living in Utah

and I keep discovering the most amazing hikes

and trails and just things

that just blow my mind constantly.

♪

Spiral Jetty is one of my favorite places

to take people when they come to visit Utah,

and part of that is because it'’s constantly changing.

Every time I go,

it'’s a completely different experience.

The first time I went to Spiral Jetty,

the water was a turquoise color and I'’ve always wanted

to see it when the water is red as it was originally

when Smithson built the Spiral Jetty.

This is the color of the waterthat attracted Robert Smithson,

so that was part of the reason he chose that particular area

in which to build Spiral Jetty.

♪

Oh, the water is red.

Oh, that'’s so cool, look at that!

[waves crashing]

♪

It'’s pink, it's totally pink!

It'’s amazing.

On another visit to the Spiral Jetty,

I brought my little notebook with me and I said,

"I'’m gonna write a palindrome when I'’m at Spiral Jetty,"

and that'’s what I came up with.

It'’s just such a...

vast landscape.

I mean, "vast" is the only word that kinda comes to mind for me.

And then this idea of the void, you know, it'’s just nothingness.

It'’s, it's salt.

It'’s a good palindrome for this place.

If you'’re not at this place, it'’s not such a good palindrome.

♪

[traffic whirring]

This is, um--

well, it used to be a wonton, now it'’s Otto.

I just couldn'’t have this story about a guy

who'’s trying to sell wontons, you know?

I mean, it became annoying.

This whole, this whole desperate odyssey of this guy

trying to get somebody to have his wonton soup.

Whereas Otto, it'’s cool.

I mean, he'’s this kid who interacts with people.

This would be Otto.

He has his binoculars.

You turn the page.

His parents are sleeping next to him,

and he looks out to the ocean and he sees this sailboat

with an emu in it, sailing it,

and then eventually, this is where it kind of

takes off when he sees this rat walking by.

And the rat stops, looks both ways,

then walks down the beach.

And Otto turns to his dad, "Huh?"

And then one of the oldest palindromes of all,

"Was it a rat I saw?"

And the father says, "No, son."

Kid thinks for a second, "Hm."

So he follows the rat

and that'’s really where the journey starts.

But in that journey, everything that'’s spoken

will be in a palindrome

'’cause I'm trying to make it accessible.

So at the end of the book you'’ll realize,

"Oh, that was fun, that was a fun read.

And it was all in palindromes, oh my God!"

Yeah, so, that'’s--yeah, that'’s what I'm hoping.

Another thing about palindromes that'’s funny

is that people think that you'’re really--

they'’ll think you're a genius.

And then there are other people who just think you'’re weird.

You know, it'’s like, "Oh, okay."

I would say it'’s probably a fairly small community.

That'’s my sense of it.

[laughing]

I'’ve never met any of them.

I'’ve had some online interactions, that'’s all.

Mark'’s a good online friend,

so now it'’s like...

well over 15 years apart,

we'’ve emailed just about palindromes,

we'’ve never met in person.

It'’s a particular community of people

I enjoy an awful lot,

which doesn'’t mean I'’m not gonna kick their ass

at the 2nd World Palindrome Championship.

This is Think Out Loud on OPB and KLCC.

I'’m Dave Miller.

We turn now to a reigning world champion

who'’s getting ready to defend his title.

Mark Saltveit is a palindromist.

He writes those symmetrical phrases

that read the same forward as backward.

In 2012, he won the first ever World Palindrome Championship,

which was of course organized by the Puzzle Master himself,

Will Shortz.

This weekend, he'’s heading back into the fray

to defend his title.

Before he does,

he joins me in the studio.

How are you feeling right now,

going into the championship?

I mean, is there a target on your head?

There is, of course-- I'’m the champ!

Everybody'’s gunnin' for me.

But, you know, I'’ve done my work.

I also work out,

and that kind of freaked out

the other palindromists last time,

so I'’m continuing that.

What is your physical regimen to prepare for

-this mental game? -Right now, I'’m running a lot.

I ran 10 miles yesterday,

and last time, I was doing a lot more weights.

But you'’re trying to just psych them out.

Yeah, of course.

I-I-I'’ve already offered to buy alcohol for everybody,

like, "What are you drinkin'’? Drinks on me!"

♪

I think of myself as a pretty relaxed person,

but I guess I'’m actually pretty competitive.

It'’s when I finally find something

that I'’m totally engaged with

and I lock into it,

I will dig in for years or even decades.

You don'’t put in the work to get to this level

without wanting to be the best,

and that'’s great.

That'’s what makes a good palindromist.

I think the most memorable palindromes

are the ones, that, um, uh... make sense, you know?

For a palindrome to be a good palindrome,

it should reflect life, it should make sense.

If it can have a bit of humor,

all the better.

[dog whimpers]

I don'’t know what you want in here.

You'’re just dumping everything out.

But it'’s off-camera.

The most important skill in being a palindrome person,

aside from knowing a lot of words--

and maybe you don'’t even need to know that many--

is patience.

Because most of what you try isn'’t going to work.

You flip it around, it doesn'’t work;

you flip it around,

you try to throw stuff in the middle,

it doesn'’t work.

There'’s a lot of failure involved in the process.

And then, you get something that'’s decent,

if you'’re lucky,

and then you look and you say,

"But can I make it good instead of just decent?

Can I make it great?"

So, I do think about strategy that I'’m going to do

for this competition,

and one of them is,

that you see a lot in sports,

is psyching people out.

Is this a strategy that I want to use?

I'’m not nervous at all,

because I have nothing to lose.

I'’m actually very excited to get together

with a whole group of people

who are all into this palindrome thing.

Because I really don'’t tend to meet people like that.

These people are gonna be my friends.

These are people who I can talk about this stuff

that everybody else says,

"My God, what are you talking about?

You'’re so boring.

Why are you into this weird, obscure thing?"

And here are people who just naturally

know the lifestyle,

know what it feels like,

know the drama, the--the nervousness,

the...the boredom, the-- well, let'’s call it

the artist'’s process.

These people all get it.

I hope it'’ll be interesting.

♪

I'’ve tried to think of everything I possibly can.

I mean, who knows what Will Shortz

is gonna throw at us?

It'’s tricky, because I don'’t really know

exactly how to prepare for this.

I'’ve taken so many auditions as a musician.

I know how to prepare for those,

and this feels like an audition, but, like,

"Ooh, what do I do, exactly?"

I'’ve never had to write palindromes

under pressure before, so...

I don'’t know what'’s gonna happen

Friday night.

So I'’m excited to meet my people,

who have a similar obsession with writing things backwards.

[she chuckles]

This is the nerdiest thing I'’ve ever done.

[laughing]

Yeah, I love to travel, always have.

I like these sorts of things where I get to meet

the other palindromists,

'’cause I'm a bit more isolated than the rest of them.

I don'’t know anyone in Australia who writes palindromes.

But it'’s kind of opened a different world to me,

you know, that other people were actually interested

in something that I was doing

and said I was good at it, too.

I'’m competing in a world championship, you know?

How many people get to say that?

♪

I wrote a lot of poems over the winter

in preparation of this,

and I haven'’t shown them to anyone.

I think my chances are better than the average,

but, you know, there'’s voting,

so anything can happen.

Realistically, everyone probably thinks

their chances are better than they actually are.

On the train,

I went through all of my extra letters,

and I wrote out some of my favorites

from each set of extra letters,

like my favorite extra As,

but I'’m guessing he won't do a specific letter again.

I brought No-End Neon,

which is a chapbook I made on my printer,

my 12-year-old printer,

and it'’s all the poems I wrote in preparation of this.

There are things in here that no one'’s seen

that I really want to use.

Depending on what prompts we'’re given,

I'’m hoping to work some of the things

I'’ve discovered in the last few months

into them.

This was a lot more fun to do than, like, practicing anyway.

I'’m not very good at studying.

I'’ve got, uh, my notebook.

I'’ll buy some tape,

because my extra Js fell out on the train today.

Tomorrow is when it all begins, tomorrow night.

Friday night, I think we are given one hour

to write our palindromes,

based on whatever constraint or constraints were given,

and then I know that at the end of Friday night,

we'’ll be given the constraints for Saturday,

and we'’ll have a full day to work on the palindromes

for Saturday'’s.

I mean, these are the best of the best,

so I'’m honored to be among them, and...

yeah, it'’s mostly a male community,

for the most part.

I hope I won'’t be letting down half of the world'’s population

if I lose, but, you know.

No pressure.

Oh, 1 to 10, it'’s like 10, 11.

Turn it to 11, Spinal Tap! I don'’t know.

I'’m havin' a great time.

Everybody else'’s style is kinda different from mine.

Everybody--each one of us has his own style, really.

So, hopefully, that'’ll work out.

Ultimately, there'’s a creative process

in palindroming,

and I'’ll be, you know, world champion

if I'’m the best at that creative process,

and I think whoever is world champion, if it isn'’t me,

is going to be world champion because they are the best

at that creative process.

I think Mark has an excellent chance to repeat.

I think Jon Agee is good because he writes

very simple, direct palindromes,

which wins these sorts of competitions.

I'’m interested in this guy Anthony Etherin too.

His poems, I thought, were brilliant.

If he'’s able to produce that sort of material

in a 75-minute span,

than he could well walk away with it.

♪

We'’ve just got in,

and we'’re going to scale some tall buildings,

um, visit some galleries.

Probably gonna get very drunk, at some point.

Afterwards, we'’re going to Stamford

for the World Palindrome Championship,

the most important event of the year.

♪

My mind is racing, for sure.

This will be the first time I'’ve met

any of these palindromists in person,

so I'’m looking forward to it.

♪

-Good luck to everybody. -Thank you.

This is gonna be interesting.

The last time, it was just one night;

now it'’s a bigger event.

I'’m feeling pretty good, I think!

[indistinct chatter]

♪

[laughter, chatter]

♪

Well, welcome, everybody.

[applause]

We'’ll start with the 2nd World Palindrome Championship,

and I'’m gonna introduce the contestants.

Then they will go

to a private room for an hour

to create original palindromes.

When the hour is up,

someone will check to make sure

that none of the entries appear online,

so that they are new entries,

new palindromes,

and these results will count

toward a third of the entire championship.

So, are you guys ready?

-Yeah! -Here you go.

These are your choice of constraints.

First, start or end with a French or Spanish word.

[laughter]

Number two.

Your palindrome must contain a Q not followed by a U.

-Phew! -[murmuring]

Three, your palindrome must start and end

with words that rhyme with each other.

[indistinct chatter]

Or four,

your palindrome must contain the names

of two or more magazines.

So there you go.

[Will chuckles]

Okay.

Good luck, you guys.

[applause]

How exciting.

This is great.

I love it!

♪

I'’m ready to go.

Okay!

♪

Then comes the writing part.

♪

Gosh, it was intense, it just--you know,

I'’m used to sitting in my chair and doing them,

where speed is not an issue.

♪

Will is being so tough with the constraints

that they were really hard to use

in that very short amount of time.

Fourteen minutes.

I have many fun middles to play with

that may help.

Doug Fink talks a lot out loud

and nobody else does.

He actually made some crack about psyching me out

by sitting across from me,

so you have to suspect it'’s gamesmanship.

♪

I'’m just glad that I, you know, didn'’t forget

how to write palindromes!

Under pressure.

♪

-I have to bring these to you? -If you don'’t mind.

-Nah. -Thanks.

Okay, both of those work.

That works.

♪

-This one works. -Okay.

I like that.

♪

They'’re about through their hour of solitude,

so I guess it'’s the moment

either of truth or frustration

that things are coming together

or things are not going to plan, but, um...

really quite nervous for them all, to be honest.

♪

[buzzer sounds]

The situation affected me more than I thought it would.

It was quite tense for a while,

and there was a sort of panic of,

"Am I working quickly enough?"

Today'’s our wedding anniversary!

We'’ve hardly had a chance to accept that

because there'’s been so much going on.

[indistinct chatter]

So there have been two entries I think so far

that are very similar to others.

Of course, they were discovered independently.

There are two entries that have similarity on the net

to something.

-Mm-hm. -So, uh,

we'’ve never really had any kind of scandal

in the palindrome world before.

This--this might be the closest to it.

We shall see.

Well, someone here probably knows that palindrome

really well.

That'’s Jon Agee's invention.

"Go hang a salami, I'’m a lasagna hog."

[laughter]

I don'’t know how close they are.

It'’s not mine, mine'’s good.

But, uh, we'’ll see what happens.

...once did a puzzle in which...

Okay, we'’re almost ready.

There was only one palindrome

that was thrown out of the competition

by being too similar to one that had been created before.

So, we are starting with Doug Fink.

Doug?

[laughter, applause]

Uh, the television advertisement for a late-night talk show

during the Vietnamese New Year.

[applause, bell rings]

The first is from a James Bond film.

[applause, bell rings]

[applause, bell rings]

Using the Q constraint; it'’s also a haiku.

[laughter]

For those who don'’t know,

an umiaq is an Inuit rowboat.

[laughter]

Okay?

[applause, bell rings]

Hello, everyone.

Um, I did it about Yoko Ono.

It is...

[applause, bell rings]

The first one I did is using the Q-without-a-U constraint.

[laughter, applause, bell rings]

That'’s about Christmas dinner,

in case you...

So, first of all,

big hand for our palindromists.

[applause]

That is amazing,

to do that in an hour.

[indistinct chatter]

♪

I was nervous because of the time restraints

and so forth.

They disqualified one of his because it had been

published before in Word Ways.

It was mine.

They found it on the internet, it was mine.

I had no idea-- I had forgotten that I had--

I-I know now that I published it.

Yeah, the system worked,

but I screwed it up, so...

So I'’ll have to come back tomorrow, we'’ll see,

I don'’t know.

-That'’s why it's a contest! -Yep.

I'’m proud of him.

And I'’m proud of his whole body of work

that he'’s done over time.

I am!

If women could just know what a great hobby this was,

they would talk all their husbands

into being a palindromist,

because, first of all,

it costs absolutely no money.

You get a pen, you get a piece of paper,

you got a hobby.

He'’s always there when I need him to do

some, you know, big macho thing

like open a jar of pickles or whatever?

There he is.

I loved the 007 one.

I thought that was a very good palindrome.

It'’s a thing with palindromes that,

because of the nature of them,

the end is given away by the start, so that the--

so if you can have something clever at the end,

you know, it works, yeah.

The "Q was 700" sort of thing,

it wasn'’t immediately obvious that that was coming,

so I thought it was very clever.

There'’s so many good ones.

I mean, there'’s a lot of really good work here.

There'’s a lot of really natural language.

So, competition'’s really tough this year.

I-I got like all "huhs."

I did not do well on the sign votes,

so I don'’t think I did too well tonight.

We'’ll see.

You guys finish those.

And you can do the totaling?

-I'’ll do the numbers. -That'’s brilliant,

that'’s brilliant.

I thought they were great,

and I thought everybody did a great job.

-Guess what? -What?

They'’re gettin' ready to announce the awards.

-Are they? -I think we gotta go.

We'’re gonna find out what the crowd likes

and doesn'’t like. That'’s almost more important.

It'’s the same people who are gonna be here tomorrow, so...

it'’d be important to take notes

on what worked and what didn'’t.

Okay, Olga is going to announce the results.

Okay. Hi, everybody.

Martin Clear came in number three, with:

[applause]

[bell rings]

Position number two was Jon Agee, for:

[applause, bell rings]

And in first place was Martin Clear, with:

First place.

[applause, bell rings]

♪

Okay, before you go,

there are five constraints

that the palindromists can choose for tomorrow,

and they have until 8:00 tomorrow night.

Number one.

[animated chatter]

And for the person who wrote a haiku tonight,

it has to be a new one.

[laughter]

Number two.

[collective "Ooh!"]

[laughter, chatter]

[laughter]

Or five:

[laughter, chatter]

So, good luck, it'’s been a great night,

and we'’ll see you all tomorrow morning.

♪

The palindromists are like entertainment.

And these are hardcore word people here,

and I think people enjoy it.

Probably gonna write a little tonight

and see if I can sleep, and if not,

I'’ll keep writing!

Or if I can sleep, I'’ll get some sleep

and keep working on them tomorrow.

Interesting constraints for the new five.

It was interesting that we anticipated

several of them.

I'’ve never written a movie-plot palindrome.

I'’ll--maybe I'll look through some movies,

movie titles, and try to work on in.

Tomorrow is the big day, as far as points.

That'’s two thirds of it, they say, so...

We'’ll see what happens, yeah.

It'’s good to be clubhouse leader

after round one,

but that doesn'’t mean you'’re the champion.

♪

♪

I stayed up till about 1:00 last night

and I think I made some progress.

Spend the rest of the afternoon

just trying to refine what I'’ve got

and see if I can improve on them, and make some--

maybe find a new one, but, uh,

they'’re pretty challenging--

pretty challenging prompts!

I think I had the fewest points

of all the competitors last night, yeah.

Now I'’m just trying to do the best I can

and have fun.

I hope people like the ones I do tonight,

and I'’ll be able to-- I'’ll be listening.

[chuckles]

Looking for the signs!

♪

I came back to my room and just started working,

because I knew I couldn'’t sleep

unless I had written at least, you know,

a few semi-decent palindromes.

I'’m so exhausted! I just wanna sleep.

I mean, it'’s exciting, you know.

It does push you,

but it'’s a very strange experience,

because I'’m just used to writing palindromes

in a very relaxed kind of fashion,

and I don'’t know that I'’m super-pleased yet with...

you know, I mean, I'’m still writing.

We'’ll see what I come up with and actually submit tonight.

♪

I think I'’m in fairly good standing

as of the first round in terms of points,

but, I mean, you know, who knows?

It'’s so hard to--to know what other people

are going to like in a palindrome.

I felt--I felt pretty good about the three palindromes

I wrote last night.

I mean, I felt, okay, that'’s a respectable--

respectable showing.

I-I didn'’t forget how to write palindromes on the spot,

so, yay!

So, uh, I think my strongest one so far,

and I think it'’s probably the easiest prompt,

is simply to write a palindrome that deals with Trump

or the Trump administration in some fashion.

The word "Trump" is nearly impossible

to use in a palindrome without abbreviations.

But "Don," of course, is extremely easy.

♪

Woke up and I thought, "I'’d better get to this soon,"

'’cause, I don't know, it'’s not gonna be easy.

Creating palindrome is such a random thing.

Sometimes, it just sort of picks up

and you find something,

"oh, let me twist it around here."

But very rarely do you get anything that'’s great,

you know?

It'’s like every, you know, year it'’s like,

maybe four or five really good--

really good ones that I remember.

It'’s not the perfect way for me to come up with

my palindromes,

but I think that'’s true for probably everybody here.

Except for maybe Martin, who just is a natural.

And maybe Anthony, too.

And Mike. And Lori.

And Win.

[laughing]

And Doug, yeah!

I think, yeah, I think this is where the outlier,

I'’m really out.

The oddest thing is that I do feel

somewhat intimidated, yeah.

I can'’t wait for this to be over.

I mean, it'’s been-- last night was fun,

'’cause it was short, you know, it was finite.

I thought today would be a little easier, but...

it'’s like just so many things you could do,

and then there'’s this pressure of coming up with something.

But we have...

What time we have to turn these in?

Oh, I have five and a half hours.

Maybe I'’ll get one good one.

That'’s all I'm hoping for.

♪

I didn'’t do too well last night,

I'’m pretty low in the standings.

So...I'’m gonna throw some Hail Marys

and hope for a miraculous comeback.

I think I got the most "huhs,"

so I didn'’t get the least points,

but I got the most people saying, "Huh?"

And I'’m adapting towards the audience more.

I'’m trying to be funny, I'’m trying to be shorter,

uh, and I'’m trying to surprise them.

I think everyone will do at least

one or two Trump palindromes,

and probably some people will do all three,

because those will be really popular.

And I'’m no different, I'’m going for that,

and we'’ll see, you know, who comes out on top with those.

And who knows?

I still have a shot, I think.

♪

I have a very promising center.

"Stacy'’s saga: gassy cats."

Which is already funny, I think.

But you wanna finish it off.

I feel good about it because Google didn'’t have

any palindromic hits,

but it immediately came up with "cat farts"

and "cat flatulence," a whole bunch of websites!

Got my haiku right here.

It'’s kinda cute,

and it makes sense, I think,

people will understand what it'’s about.

It'’s about olives.

[chuckling]

Well, I tried something with the movies,

Rosemary'’s Baby.

Devil and, you know, a devil tot.

Possibly "tot" in the middle.

A devil! A tot!

Alive!

We'’ll work on that one. We'’ll see.

I looked at Top Gun, which you can, you know--

"snug," "pot," you can somehow fit that in.

But, you know "snug pot," that didn'’t mean anything to me

so I abandoned that.

But, uh, I ended up going with a different movie.

With palindromes,

there'’s two conflicting factors that come into play.

One, you want to include everything that you can

that matches the theme, but, two,

you want to remove everything that doesn'’t.

And sometimes, people get so obsessed with that first one,

putting everything in,

that there'’s a whole bunch of words

that don'’t relate to it,

and it'’s messy.

You know, you sort of think, "Yeah, okay, I can see

you put that in in order to make that reverse to that,"

and that'’s what you want to avoid.

But if you can do it really well,

if you can get a movie, cover a plot,

and get sort of like a punchline at the end,

that might win.

♪

It'’ll be interesting tonight,

because Will is gonna read the palindromes with, you know,

and so, you won'’t see anybody'’s names.

So it'’ll be interesting to see if you can--

it people can identify palindromes

based on the different people in the room,

you know, who are there.

I think I'’ll be trying to guess

who writes which ones,

and probably I'’ll be successful in some

but probably not all.

This is when you realize that people do this stuff

and know this stuff inside-out and are experts,

and you can'’t accidentally fall into,

"Well, maybe I'’ll win this year."

Ah! Here it is.

"Putin rubles made.

Tarts rife rule rare lure.

First-rate damsel, burn it up."

That is Trump, that is a haiku.

♪

Anthony is really passionate and really talented.

He does constraints that no one else does.

He'’s written some palindromes that follow

the numerical digits of pi

in a different way that how I'’ve written them,

so it'’s a different kind of style

of writing pi palindromes,

and so, that was really interesting to me.

And just talking to someone who gets super excited

about adding on crazy, crazy constraints to palindromes,

that was really fun to-- to talk with him.

The last championship,

Mark won with an amusing short one.

And that'’s not the kind of thing I write.

Today, I thought I'’d write a longer one,

since we have this extra time.

So I wrote a short poem,

it'’s an eight-line rhyming palindrome.

And then, after that, I just wrote a shorter one,

a haiku.

I'’ve probably written about 200 palindromic haiku,

most of them in the last year.

I feel a kinship with him '’cause he's so poetry-oriented.

He and Clara do really nice work as publishers.

I love his stuff.

I'’m having fun, I'’m meeting interesting people.

I'’ve submitted these palindromes now, so...

the work is over.

And, yeah, looking forward to tonight.

Today counts a lot, so I still have a shot.

Everyone'’s gonna have a surprise, I think.

And that'’s the benefit of having time.

And we'’ve never seen how this plays out before.

We'’re gonna find out tonight.

-I'’ll take one. -Okay.

Is this for the palindrome thing?

Yes, it is, you get to vote.

They'’re all too good.

Can'’t wait to see what they come up with.

[indistinct chatter]

Okay. After we hear all the palindromes,

we would like you to write 1, 2, and 3

next to your three favorites,

number 1 being your very favorite,

2, your second favorite,

and 3, your third favorite.

At the end of the evening,

we will announce a new World Palindrome Champion.

Okay. And here are the entries.

That was the movie of Jaws, okay.

[chatter, bell rings]

A sea of blue.

[laughter]

There was more blue than I expected.

I don'’t know how they even interpreted "Huh?"

because I always think of "Huh?" as meaning,

"I don'’t understand your palindrome."

So to see "Huh?", I'’m like, "You didn'’t understand that?

I mean, it was pretty straightforward."

Star Wars.

-What'’s that? -Isn'’t "Annikin" misspelled?

-I don'’t know. -It is.

Okay.

I misspelled "Annikin."

I looked at it and I said...

You throw a K-I-N and you get "Anikin."

Well, you don'’t throw that.

It'’s really...

Next is one on the Titanic,

and it actually includes it in the start.

"Rose lures Leo: '’Draw me.'"

It got, like, an "ooh"and an "ahh" from the audience,

so that was a nice moment,

that made it all worthwhile.

[laughter, applause]

Is that 140 characters?

[laughter]

It'’s interesting to judge,

'’cause a lot of the ones that scored highly

were all the Trump ones,

and I suspect people are displaying their politics

rather than their analysis of palindromy.

We may see that they won'’t figure

when people come to write down their best three.

That'’s one long palindrome.

[indistinct chatter]

Note that it is"constrain" rhymes with "plane,"

"trap with lap,"

"renown" and "drown,"

and "saw" and "draw."

[Will and audience laugh]

This is about Trump, and, it'’s--and, uh...

[laughter]

Don'’t even have to look for the name.

[laughter]

[laughter]

You got to hear Will Shortz both say "pussy-grab"

and say, "'’S up?"

And I think that'’s something

that I at least wanted to see.

Bear in mind that the winner might appear

in other publications.

[laughter, cheers]

Shawshank Redemption.

[whooshing, bell rings]

Movie.

Rosemary'’s Baby.

Oh, Rosemary'’s Baby.

It was short and sharp and people understood it,

just got a straight sea of "wows."

This is the last one.

It'’s about the championship.

Whew!

Okay! Let'’s have a big hand for our eight contestants.

[applause]

Now, we'’ll have the results at the end of the evening.

♪

Now we just do the waiting!

[chuckles]

Mood reviled.

Three numbers 1s.

Uh...okay.

Three number 2s.

Okie-dokie.

-One number 3. -Okay.

Based on what we'’ve seen,

it'’s a crapshoot.

I mean, I personally think Martin--

what I think is Martin'’s--

is like Babe Ruth,

it'’s like a-- it'’s a grand slam.

-But...you know. -We could be wrong.

-Maybe he'’s not the author. -Yeah.

That'’s true! I don't know.

Might not be Martin, but I think it is.

It went great.

It was fun,

I'’m very happy with the reactions

I got from the crowd.

They really liked the Titanic one,

so I'’m super happy about that.

I think with the sign voting,

there was another Trump one

that almost got unanimous "wows,"

so that might be in the lead.

But it will also be interesting,

there were so many Trump ones,

to see if they cancel out.

-Wary abyss. -So, wary abyss.

-Three number 1s. -Five.

-One number 2. -Seven.

One number 3.

There was one that was really expressive about Trump,

which I thought was good, you know.

I think-- I think he wrote it.

Mark, did you write the one about Trump and the ass and...

I did no Trump.

I can'’t believe--

I can'’t believe he didn'’t do any Trump!

Did you have a good time doing this?

Yeah, yeah!

-Oh. -The competition was so tough.

-Oh my God. -But this is what you want,

right?

I was miserable all day.

Miserable.

I don'’t know.

I was saying to Audrey, "I'’ll never do this again."

-Mark... -No, don'’t say that!

I was hor-- I had no fun.

I think you'’re right in it.

I think you could pull this off.

Then you'’re gonna retire like, "I'’m done! I'm out!"

No, never, never, never.

You'’ll be like Apollo Creed in the first Rocky.

"No! No rematch, no rematch!"

[laughing]

Well, this was a great night.

I'’m so thankful for these judges.

There were a few that were the sea of red,

which was good,

and a few that were a sea of blue

that was bad.

My ask.com one got a sea of blue.

Oh you did--I liked that,

-that was really cute. -I thought so too!

I thought it would be catchy, but, you know,

-I can'’t figure this crow out. -Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Clearly.

It was just fun trying to think of them.

It was much harder, I think, than I had anticipated

it was gonna be.

When you put a severe restraint on what you have to write about,

it makes it harder, so,

and that'’s where the challenge it.

That'’s why it's a contest.

Otherwise, it'’s not a contest, it's just--

it'’s something else.

It'’s something else fun, but it'’s not a contest.

We'’ll see what happens.

I think I got a fair chance of winning this thing

and walking out of here with $1,001 dollars,

for the palindrome.

It'’s very close, it'’s very exciting.

We'’re gonna find out in a few minutes.

They'’re tabulating now,

and as soon as they have the votes,

we'’re gonna go in and present the results.

-What? -You can'’t get any closer.

You can'’t get much closer.

You'’re gonna have to proof his math later.

So I'’d better get it right.

How is this happening?

Amazing!

-Thank you so much. -Amazing!

This is the grand totals of the last two nights,

and it was very, very, very close.

-Real close. -It'’ll be exciting.

Crazy close.

♪

So here we go for tonight.

By your vote,

the third most popular palindrome tonight was...

all right, I'’m not gonna read the whole thing.

[laughter]

It was "Rail at Obama" from Martin Clear.

[applause, cheers]

♪

By your vote,

the second most popular palindrome tonight

was "Tides reverse."

[applause]

And the number one palindrome by your vote tonight

is from Lori Wike.

[cheers, applause]

Lori, come up and take a bow.

♪

♪

Okay, now the points have been totaled for last night,

which counted one third of the score,

and tonight, which was two thirds of the score.

It was extremely close between 1 and 2.

Second place was .3 points behind the winner.

-Wow! -That'’s how close it was.

In fifth place

was Jon Agee, with 113.3. points.

[applause]

Fourth place,

with 136.3 points,

is Mike Maguire.

Yeah! Come up, come up!

Thank you. Thanks.

In third place with 138 points

is Doug Fink.

[applause]

Okay, there was only .3 points

separating first and second place.

In second place is Lori Wike

with 193.7.

-Wow! -Wow!

[applause]

And our champion palindromist,

with 194 points,

winner of the 2nd World Palindrome Championship,

from Australia, Martin Clear.

[cheers, applause]

♪

Martin wins a check for $1,001.

[cheers, applause]

Thank you!

Here is a trophy

that will not be easy to take in his luggage

back home.

[audience gasps, applauds]

I can'’t believe the palindromes that you created

under pressure like that.

It was great fun.

[applause]

Wow! Wow! Wow!

Ta-da!

It'’s a pretty piece of work,

considering it'’s only made of cardboard, isn'’t it?

It'’s just a buzz,

it sort of just feels like I'’m waiting for someone

to come and tap me on the shoulder and say,

"Oh, we calculated it wrong; you didn'’t get it."

You know, something like that.

He was deserving.

-He was deserving. -He'’s terrific.

He'’s good.

Wow. .3 points.

-[Martin laughs] -That'’s crazy.

I was shocked at how close it was.

And my palindrome won the final round

and I came in second by...

.3 tenths of a point

to the amazing Martin Clear,

which I could not be happier about.

He did amazing in this whole competition.

I told my friends, my family.

I'’ve already been texting away.

Kind of amazing, it'’s a little surreal.

I jumped to fourth place.

It was almost third place.

So I had a good night, I can'’t complain.

I am happy,

but I'’m ready to compete again

for the next one.

So you guys are all coming to Sydney

in five years'’ time, yeah?

Yeah, that'’s right.

That'’s the plan.

I'’ll probably try again.

I got five years to get better, maybe.

I have to practice more.

I would like to see someday

the crossword puzzle be the side event

to the palindrome tournament.

I wanna see, like, hundreds of people show up

for the palindrome tournament.

As much as it was a struggle today for me,

and as much as I really didn'’t enjoy it...

It was--it was good.

I mean, as it all turned out, it was great.

In fact, I'’m...

second thoughts about...

I could--I could imagine coming back

and doing this again.

I could see that happening.

There'’s a real validation in being the world champion

of absolutely anything,

that sort of thing.

If you get to be world champion of something that there are

only three people doing,

there'’s a sense of fun in that.

My favorite part was definitely meeting the other palindromists,

for sure-- and meeting Will Shortz,

because I kinda went a little bit fangirl

when I met him.

We'’re this really small community.

But I think what'’s wonderful about it

is that even though we don'’t have a lot in common,

we connect, in a way.

It'’s that camaraderie, I guess,

being with a bunch of people who share that same interest.

Just things like when we were sitting in the bar there before,

just bouncing ideas off of each other, you know?

Looking at Jon'’s new book,

he'’s got a new palindrome book coming out.

Just talking about the ideas that people have

and stuff like that.

So it'’s great to come here.

Cheers!

[glasses clinking]

It'’s been good.

[chuckling]

Good writing should be something you play with,

and it should be fun to read

because there'’s a sense of joy in the writing.

And I think palindromes are a way to remind people of that.

I love writing palindromes, it'’s awesome.

We'’re really living in the golden age of palindromes.

-Here'’s to the palindrome. -Yeah!

Anyone can sit down,

look at a few words,

reverse '’em, and see what happens.

And, you know, you may come up with something brilliant,

you know?

Keeping an open mind,

seeing things in a new way.

Palindromes are good for your soul.

I think if anything can save our civilization,

palindromes can.

♪

♪