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NOW WHAT I'M GOING TO DO IS STRAP DOWN YOUR ARMS

TO AVOID ANY EXCESSIVE MOVEMENT ON YOUR PART

DURING THE EXPERIMENT.

- IS THAT TOO TIGHT? - IT'S ALL RIGHT.

THIS ELECTRODE IS CONNECTED

TO THE SHOCK GENERATOR IN THE NEXT ROOM.

AND THIS ELECTROPASTE IS TO PROVIDE A GOOD CONTACT

TO AVOID ANY BLISTER OR BURN.

- ( continuous buzzing ) - NOW HE'LL GET A SHOCK OF 75 VOLTS.

HE KIND OF DID SOME YELLING IN THERE.

- 75 VOLTS, JIM. - ( man yells )

( chuckles ) HE YELLED OUT.

- Dr. Milgram: PLEASE CONTINUE. - THIS WILL BE AT 330.

JUST HOW FAR CAN YOU GO ON THIS THING?

Dr. Milgram: AS FAR AS IS NECESSARY.

Man: I CAN'T STAND THE PAIN! HELP ME OUT OF HERE!

HE CAN'T STAND IT. I'M NOT GONNA KILL THAT MAN IN THERE.

- YOU HEAR HIM HOLLERING IN THERE? - Dr. Milgram: AS I SAID BEFORE,

- THE SHOCKS MAY BE PAINFUL, BUT THEY'RE NOT DANGEROUS. - YEAH, BUT HE'S HOLLERING.

HE CAN'T STAND IT. WHAT IF SOMETHING HAPPENS TO HIM?

THE EXPERIMENT REQUIRES THAT YOU CONTINUE TEACHING.

YEAH, BUT, UH... ( chuckles )

I'M NOT GONNA GET THAT MAN SICK IN THERE.

I MEAN, HE'S HOLLERING IN THERE.

WHO'S GONNA TAKE THE RESPONSIBILITY IF ANYTHING HAPPENS TO THAT GENTLEMAN?

I'M RESPONSIBLE FOR ANYTHING THAT HAPPENS HERE.

- CONTINUE, PLEASE. - 285 VOLTS.

CONTINUE, PLEASE.

Man: THAT PLACE TURNED ME INTO A MONSTER.

I WAS VERY ANGRY.

JUST BEING IN ABU GHRAIB WILL CHANGE YOUR WHOLE MIND FRAME.

YOU KNOW, YOU CAN GO FROM BEING A DOCILE,

YOU KNOW, JOLLY GUY--

AND YOU GO TO ABU GHRAIB FOR A FEW--

YOU KNOW, JUST BEING IN IRAQ FOR A WHILE,

YOU BECOME, YOU KNOW, A ROBOT.

Man #2: IT WAS A DOOR THAT I WAS AFRAID TO WALK THROUGH.

YOU KNOW, IF YOU WALK THROUGH IT,

AT WHICH POINT DO YOU SAY IT'S ENOUGH?

YOU KNOW, WHAT'S CRUEL ENOUGH? WHAT'S-- WHAT'S--

HOW DO YOU GO BACK FROM THAT?

AND I WAS AFRAID THAT--

I-I JUST WANTED TO COME BACK--

THAT I WOULD JUST GET LOST.

Woman: SOMETHING IN YOUR BRAIN CLICKS,

THAT EVERYTHING YOU SEE IS-- IS NORMAL.

I MEAN, YOU'LL GO CRAZY

IF YOU DON'T ADAPT TO WHAT YOU'RE SEEING.

YOU GOTTA BLOCK IT OUT.

YOU GOTTA DO SOMETHING TO MAKE YOUR DAY GO BY

WITHOUT GOING CRAZY.

President Bush: These acts of mass murder were intended

to frighten our nation into chaos and retreat.

But they have failed.

Our country is strong.

A great people has been moved

to defend a great nation.

America and our friends and allies

join with all those who want peace and security in the world.

And we stand together to win the war against terrorism.

Israel Rivera: I WAS IN ALGEBRA II CLASS.

AND IT WAS JUST A REGULAR DAY.

WE WERE SITTING DOWN WAITING FOR CLASS.

AND THEN THERE WAS AN ANNOUNCEMENT.

IT WAS BROUGHT INTO REAL RETROSPECT

WHEN MY FRIEND CHRIS,

HE LEANED OVER AND HE'S LIKE,

"HEY, AREN'T YOU IN THE RESERVES?"

I THOUGHT, "YES. YES, I AM. I AM IN THE RESERVES.

HOW IS THIS GOING TO AFFECT ME?"

Megan Ambuhl: THE ULTIMATE REASON I JOINED WAS

TO BE A PART OF THE EFFORT TO MAKE THE COUNTRY A SAFER PLACE.

I WANTED TO HELP PROTECT OUR COUNTRY

SO THAT THESE PEOPLE

THAT WANTED TO COME IN AND ATTACK US

WOULDN'T HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY AGAIN.

Javal Davis: AND IT MADE ME FEEL LIKE WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING.

IT MADE ME FEEL LIKE, YOU KNOW, SOMEONE HAS TO PAY.

IT'S LIKE, WE CAN'T LET TWO BUILDINGS GET BLOWN UP

AND NOT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

President Bush: On my orders,

the United State military has begun strikes

against Al Qaeda terrorist training camps

and military installations of the Taliban regime

in Afghanistan.

And we will do whatever it takes to smoke 'em out

and get 'em runnin'. And we will get 'em.

John Yoo: THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS QUESTION

DOESN'T REALLY COME UP UNTIL THE WAR IN AFGHANISTAN STARTS

AND PEOPLE START TO COME

INTO THE CUSTODY OF OUR FORCES THERE.

AND SO THE DEFENSE DEPARTMENT WANTS TO KNOW,

"WHAT IS THE STATUS OF THE PEOPLE WE'RE CATCHING--

AL QAEDA AND TALIBAN FIGHTERS?"

Alberto Mora: THE FOUR CURRENT GENEVA CONVENTIONS

WERE ADOPTED IN 1949

AND THEY REPRESENT THE STANDARDS

AGAINST WHICH ALL NATIONS AND ALL COMBATING FORCES

ARE GONNA BE-- WILL BE JUDGED.

THEY'RE BINDING INTERNATIONAL LAW

AND THEY REPRESENT

A HUMANITARIAN HUMAN-RIGHTS STANDARD FOR THE WORLD.

THEY'RE IMPORTANT BECAUSE THE U.S. MILITARY

HAS BEEN FREQUENTLY ENGAGED IN COMBAT.

AMERICAN FORCES ARE ALWAYS AT RISK OF BEING CAPTURED

AND THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS PROTECT AMERICAN SOLDIERS

FROM ILL-TREATMENT IN THE EVENT OF CAPTURE.

AFTER THE AMERICAN CIVIL WAR

AND UP UNTIL THE SECOND WORLD WAR,

THE UNITED STATES WAS CONSISTENTLY KNOWN

FOR OBSERVING STANDARDS THAT WERE IN FACT HIGHER

THAN THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS STANDARDS

AND CONSISTENTLY ADVOCATING THAT ALL COUNTRIES SHOULD OPERATE

TO A LEVEL ABOVE THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS STANDARDS.

Yoo: AT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT,

WE DID NOT THINK THAT THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS APPLIED

IN THE WAR AGAINST AL QAEDA

BECAUSE THEY DID NOT SIGN THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS

AND THEY DON'T FOLLOW ANY OF THE RULES OF WARFARE.

AL QAEDA-- IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENED IN 9/11--

HAS NO INTEREST IN FOLLOWING ANY OF THOSE RULES.

THEY DELIBERATELY KILL CIVILIANS.

THEY DELIBERATELY TARGET CIVILIANS.

THEY DISGUISE THEMSELVES AS CIVILIANS.

THEY DON'T TAKE PRISONERS, AS FAR AS WE CAN TELL.L.

INSTEAD, THEY TRY TO KIDNAP PEOPLE

AND EXECUTE THEM ON THE WEB OR ON TELEVISION.

Mark Danner: OFFICIALS IN THE WHITE HOUSE,

AND PARTICULARLY IN THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE,

SAID THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS SHOULDN'T HOLD SWAY.

AND THAT POINT OF VIEW FINALLY TRIUMPHED.

THE PRESIDENT MADE THE DECISION EARLY IN 2002

THAT THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS WOULD NOT HOLD.

AND THIS WAS UNPRECEDENTED IN AMERICAN HISTORY.

IT NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE.

THE WAR IS A TERRIBLE THING

AND IT'S ALWAYS RIGHT ON THE EDGE OF FALLING APART,

OF AWFUL THINGS HAPPENING.

AND THE ONLY WAY-- SORT OF IRONICALLY--

THE ONLY TO CONDUCT A WAR IN A CIVILIZED MANNER

IS TO ENSURE THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS WHAT THE RULES ARE

TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT POSSIBLE.

AND WHEN YOU START MESSING AROUND WITH THOSE RULES,

WHEN YOU SAY THEY DON'T APPLY--

"THEY'RE ALL TERRORISTS, SO DIFFERENT RULES APPLY"--

NOW YOU'RE IN UNLIMITED WARFARE.

Donald Rumsfeld: They'll be handled not as prisoners of wars--

because they're not-- but as unlawful combatants.

Uh, they-- as I understand it,

technically, unlawful combatants do not have any rights

under the Geneva Convention.

THIS WAR WAS A WAR THAT WAS GOING TO DEPEND

FIRST AND FOREMOST ON INTELLIGENCE--

THAT IS, ON INFORMATION

DERIVED FROM PRISONERS OF WAR.

THEREFORE, RULES REGARDING INTERROGATION--

WHAT YOU COULD AND COULDN'T DO TO PRISONERS--

WERE ABSOLUTELY CENTRAL TO FIGHTING THIS NEW WAR.

Danner: THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE BUILT A THEORY

THAT ESSENTIALLY WOULD RENDER MOOT,

RENDER POWERLESS, THE VARIOUS UNDERTAKINGS

THAT THE UNITED STATES HAD SIGNED ON TO

THAT PROHIBITED TORTURE--

THE MOST OBVIOUS ONE IS THE CONVENTION AGAINST TORTURE.

Yoo: THE STATUTE DOES NOT DEFINE MANY OF THE TERMS THAT IT USES.

IT DOESN'T SAY WHAT "SEVERE" MEANS, FOR EXAMPLE.

IT DOESN'T REALLY CONTAIN ANY DEFINITION OF "PHYSICAL PAIN OR SUFFERING."

SO OUR JOB WAS TO TRY TO FIGURE OUT--

WHAT DID THAT STATUTE ACTUALLY MEAN?

BECAUSE THE WORDS ARE AMBIGUOUS, VAGUE,

AND HAD NOT BEEN INTERPRETED BEFORE.

OUR OFFICE EVENTUALLY ISSUED A MEMO IN AUGUST OF 2002

TO THE WHITE HOUSE.

"PHYSICAL PAIN AMOUNTING TO TORTURE

MUST BE EQUIVALENT IN INTENSITY TO THE PAIN

ACCOMPANYING SERIOUS PHYSICAL INJURY

SUCH AS ORGAN FAILURE,

IMPAIRMENT OF BODILY FUNCTION,

OR EVEN DEATH."

THE HEART OF THIS ARGUMENT IS TO REDEFINE TORTURE

SO IT'S SO NARROWLY CONCEIVED,

IT ESSENTIALLY ALLOWS VERY VERY SEVERE INTERROGATION

THAT CANNOT BE CONSTRUED TO BE TORTURE.

WHAT THIS MEMO ARTICULATES IS THE VIEW

THAT TORTURE IS PROHIBITED AND TORTURE--

BUT TORTURE IS DEFINED VERY VERY NARROWLY

TO CONSIST ALMOST OF IMMINENT DEATH

OR LOSS OF BODILY ORGAN OR FUNCTION--

UM, A--

A DEFINITION OF TORTURE THAT WAS LATER CRITICIZED BY ANOTHER OBSERVER

AS THE KIND OF DEFINITION THAT PROBABLY WOULD HAVE JUSTIFIED

MOST OF WHAT SADDAM HUSSEIN WAS DOING IN HIS PRISONS AS NOT BEING TORTURE.

I CAN REMEMBER SITTING IN MY OFFICE

AND READING SOME OF THESE MEMOS.

IT WAS STUNNING. IT TOOK-- IT LITERALLY TOOK MY BREATH AWAY.

I-I COULDN'T BELIEVE THAT I WAS READING THIS

AND THAT IT HADN'T BEEN SHREDDED

AND BURNED AND BURIED

AS THE WILD IMAGINATIONS

OF SOME...

LOWLY LAWYER IN THE BOWELS OF JUSTICE

THAT SHOULD NEVER SEE THE LIGHT OF DAY.

BUT NOW SUDDENLY IT'S BECOME U.S. POLICY. ( chuckles )

President Bush: Iraq continues to flaunt its hostility

toward America and to support terror.

The terrorist threat to America and the world

will be diminished the moment

that Saddam Hussein is disarmed.

And we believe he has in fact reconstituted nuclear weapons.

There's no doubt in my mind

that he has weapons-- chemical, biological weapons--

and has been working on nuclear weapons.

Javal Davis: WHEN WE FIRST GOT TO IRAQ, WE SAW, YOU KNOW,

ALL THE BLOWN-UP TANKS THAT WERE BOMBED FROM THE SKY,

YOU KNOW, BULLET HOLES EVERYWHERE.

IT WAS LIKE GOING TO A "MAD MAX" MOVIE--

LIKE "MAD MAX, RETURN TO THUNDERDOME."

- ( grunts ) - Javal Davis: LIKE, "WOW, I'M AT WAR."

LIKE, "WOW!" YOU KNOW, IT WAS JUST LIKE--

PART OF YOU WAS LIKE, "THIS IS COOL."

AND THEN ANOTHER PART OF YOU WAS LIKE, "DAMN! WELL, WE GOTTA DO THIS,

- BUT SOMEBODY'S GOTTA PAY." - ( machine-gun fire )

Ken Davis: I REMEMBER, AS WE LEFT KUWAIT,

I VOLUNTEERED TO BE A GUNNER.

IT WAS A 12-HOUR RIDE. I SAID, "I'LL GUN.

I'M NEW HERE. JUST TELL ME WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR

AND I'LL GUN ALL DAY ON THIS WHOLE CONVOY."

AND I SAID, "BUT THE ONLY THING I NEED TO KNOW

IS THE RULES OF ENGAGEMENT."

AND THEY ALL KIND OF LOOKED AT ME.

I'M LIKE, "I NEED OUR RULES OF ENGAGEMENT.

I'VE NEVER BEEN IN A COMBAT ZONE BEFORE." AND THEY SAID,

"WELL, IF IT LOOKS LIKE THE ENEMY,

SHOOT IT."

I'M LIKE, "NO NO, I'M 'IOUS.

I NEED RULES OF ENGAGEMENT--

WHAT CONSTITUTES THE ENEMY, WHATEVER."

"WE JUST TOLD YOU, SERGEANT.

IF IT LOOKS LIKE THE ENEMY, SHOOT IT."

AND I LOOKED AT HIM, I SAID, "YOU KNOW,

I'VE REALLY NEVER BEEN OUTSIDE THE UNITED STATES.

EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE THE ENEMY TO ME OUT HERE."

Man: ARE WE LEAVING THE OTHER ONES? JUST TAKE THEM...

Tony Lagouranis: UNITS IN IRAQ ARE PICKING UP PEOPLE

ON HUNCHES AND SUSPICIONS.

FOR INSTANCE, YOU'LL GET AN INTELLIGENCE REPORT

THAT SOMEONE DRIVING A BLACK OPEL--

WHICH IS A MODEL OF CAR OVER THERE--

WAS INVOLVED IN AN I.E.D. ATTACK.

SO THEY'LL JUST ROUND UP PEOPLE WITH BLACK OPELS

AND BRING THEM IN FOR INTERROGATION.

ANY-- ANY KIND OF HUNCH THAT-- THAT THESE UNITS HAD,

THEY WOULD ACT ON IT AND ARREST PEOPLE.

THEY JUST ARRESTED EVERYONE.

Roman Krol: I HEARD THAT OVER 30,000 PEOPLE

WERE EXECUTED OVER THERE DURING SADDAM'S REGIME...

THAT THEY WERE BURIED RIGHT THERE--

MOST OF THEM WERE.

AND JUST VERY HORRIBLE STORIES...

ABOUT PRISONER TORTURE.

OF COURSE, THERE WERE PICTURES OF SADDAM

ALL OVER THE PRISON.

THE PLACE WAS HORRIBLE.

THERE WERE WILD DOGS RUNNING AROUND,

DIGGING OUT HUMAN BODIES.

Javal Davis: THERE WAS A PLACE INSIDE THE PRISON--

LIKE, "THE DEATH CHAMBER" THAT WE CALLED IT--

WHERE THERE WERE TWO HOLES IN THE FLOOR

AND HANGING HOOKS, YOU KNOW.

THEY SAID THEY HUNG PEOPLE EVERY DAY.

THEY'D HANG, LIKE, 80-100 PEOPLE A DAY OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

WHERE WE LIVED AT, IN OUR BARRACKS,

THERE WAS TWO OVENS IN THERE

THAT WE--

WHAT YOU'D CALL AN INCINERATOR FOR BODIES.

THAT WAS KIND OF LIKE, "OKAY, WHOA. ( chuckles )

WHERE ARE WE LIVING AT? YOU KNOW HOW MANY LOST SOULS,

OR DISPLACED SOULS, ARE WALKING AROUND HERE?"

Rivera: IT WAS VERY VERY HOT.

THE HEAT INDEX IN DIRECT SUNLIGHT WAS 130.

AND THE ODOR WAS, UM--

I WILL NEVER FORGET THE SMELL OF ABU GHRAIB--

THE SMELL OF SWEAT AND TRASH

AND FECES AND URINE WAFTING THROUGH THE AIR.

IT'S JUST-- I WILL NEVER FORGET THE SMELL OF ABU GHRAIB.

JUST "A DESERT BOWL OF MISERY"

IS THE ONLY WAY TO DESCRIBE IT.

Sam Provance: AND THE PLACE WAS JUST SO DARK.

YOU KNOW, AND-- AND YOU KNEW THE HISTORY.

AND, I MEAN, LIKE-- IT FELT LIKE IT WAS A HAUNTED PLACE.

YOU KNOW, LIKE AT NIGHTTIME

THERE WERE CERTAIN HALLWAYS YOU WOULDN'T WANNA GO DOWN BY YOURSELF

BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, YOU WERE AFRAID

THERE MIGHT BE A GHOST OR SOMETHING.

AND YOU KNEW IF SOMETHING WAS THERE, IT WAS REALLY PISSED OFF.

IT WAS JUST THE MOST SURREAL PLACE,

YOU KNOW, YOU CAN IMAGINE.

IT'S LIKE A COMBINATION OF "APOCALYPSE NOW" MEETS "THE SHINING,"

EXCEPT THAT THIS IS REAL

AND YOU'RE IN THE MIDDLE OF IT.

MAJOR COMBAT OPERATIONS IN IRAQ HAVE ENDED.

IN THE BATTLE OF IRAQ,

THE UNITED STATES AND OUR ALLIES

HAVE PREVAILED.

Man: WE'VE GOT

FUCKING AT LEAST THREE MISSILES HERE.

Janis Karpinski: WE REQUESTED RESOURCES AND ASSISTANCE

MANY TIMES, ALMOST ON A DAILY BASIS,

AT SOME POINTS PRACTICALLY PLEADING FOR RESOURCES,

NOT ONLY FOR ABU GHRAIB, BUT FOR ALL OF THE OTHER PRISON FACILITIES

WE WERE TRYING TO RESTORE AND REOPEN.

SOMEBODY HAD THIS CRAZY IDEA

THAT THEY COULD RESTORE ALL OF THE PRISON SYSTEMS

AND GET THE NEW IRAQI GUARDS RETRAINED IN THE RIGHT WAY

TO DO AN APPROPRIATE PRISON OPERATION

IN 90 DAYS OR LESS.

THERE WAS NO-- THERE WAS NO PLAN FOR ANYTHING.

Javal Davis: WE GET THERE AND WE'RE TOLD,

"OKAY, PUT YOUR WEAPONS AWAY. PUT YOUR TRUCKS AWAY AND PARK THEM.

YOU'RE NOT GONNA NEED THEM ANY LONGER." LIKE, "WHAT YOU TALKING ABOUT?"

WELL, THESE PEOPLE THAT WERE THERE SAID,

"OKAY, NO, YOU'RE GOING TO BE PRISON GUARDS.

YOU'RE GONNA AUGMENT THE GUARD FORCE INSIDE."

SO OUR COMMANDER WAS LIKE, "HEY, WHAT ARE WE DOING?

WE'RE NOT CORRECTIONS."

HE WAS LIKE, "OUR GUYS HAVE NEVER BEEN TRAINED TO DO ANYTHING LIKE THAT."

SO, HENCE WE PUT OUR WEAPONS AWAY,

OUR TONS OF AMMUNITION AWAY,

AND WE BECAME PRISON GUARDS

WITH NO TRAINING WHATSOEVER.

AND WE ALL LOOK AT EACH OTHER-- "WHAT?

WE-- THE 72nd M.P. COMPANY IS LEAVING

AND WE ARE GONNA TAKE THEIR PLACE."

IF THERE WAS EVER A TURN IN MORALE, IT WAS RIGHT THERE--

THAT I COULD SEE.

EVERYTHING JUST HIT ROCK BOTTOM.

Javal Davis: ABU GHRAIB TURNED OUT TO BE

THE MOST ATTACKED

U.S. POSITION IN IRAQ.

I MEAN, THEY GOT SHELLED EVERY DAY,

SHOT AT EVERY DAY,

EVERY SINGLE DAY, ALL DAY, EVERY DAY.

AND THERE WAS HOLES

IN ONE OF THE WALLS FROM SHRAPNEL

THAT A MORTAR HAD JUST HIT.

I THINK IT WAS MAYBE A WEEK BEFORE WE CAME

OR A COUPLE OF DAYS BEFORE WE CAME.

AND HE WAS TELLING US HOW THE GUY WAS PRAYING

AND A MORTAR HIT AND KILLED A BUNCH OF PRISONERS.

SO THAT MADE IT--

YOU DEFINITELY DIDN'T FEEL SAFE BEING THERE.

Javal Davis: THE ROAD OUTSIDE THE PRISON

IS THE MOST DANGEROUS ROAD ON THE PLANET EARTH.

YOU HAVE MORE FATALITIES ON THAT ROAD,

MORE I.E.D.s ON THAT ROAD,

MORE SHOTS FIRED ON THAT ROAD THAN ON ANY ROAD IN THE WORLD.

YOU COULD BE WALKING-- WALKING TO YOUR BARRACKS--

( mimics hissing ) BOOM!

OH, MAN. "INCOMING! INCOMING!"

I WOULDN'T WISH IT ON MY WORST ENEMY.

YEAH.

- THAT'S RIGHT, ABU GHETTO. - GHETTO ABU.

OH, YOU DON'T WANNA SAY IT?! YOU DON'T WANNA SAY IT?!

- ( men laughing ) - FUCKING BITCH!

- FUCKING BITCH! - ( laughing continues )

( man laughing ) YEAH.

Karpinski: IN JULY AND AUGUST,

THE PRISON POPULATION WAS FAIRLY STABLE.

AND I WOULD SAY, AT THE HIGHEST NUMBERS,

IT WAS STILL LESS THAN 1000.

BY THE END OF SEPTEMBER,

IT WENT TO OVER 6,000!

WE HAD JUST SHORT OF 300

MILITARY POLICE PERSONNEL AT ABU GHRAIB

TO GUARD THOUSANDS OF PRISONERS.

Provance: YOU HAD THE GENERAL POPULATION PRISONERS

WHICH WERE, BASICALLY,

A HUGE MASS OF HUMANITY

YOU KNOW, THROWN INTO A MUD PIT

SURROUNDED BY CONCERTINA WIRE.

AND THEN YOU HAD THE HARD SITES,

WHICH IS WHERE THE INTEL HOLDS WERE AT,

WELL, THE INSANE OR THE CRIMINAL.

AND THEN THERE WAS AN EVEN MORE-- THE MOST SECURE SECTION WAS

WHERE THEY HAD THE WOMEN AND THE CHILDREN.

Javal Davis: THE FEW ONES THAT WE HAD WERE,

YOU KNOW, THE SPOUSES OR SISTERS OR COUSINS

OF HIGH-VALUE DETAINEES THAT WERE BEING USED AS,

"OKAY, WELL, WE HAVE YOUR SISTER, WE HAVE YOUR WIFE.

YOU NEED TO TURN YOURSELF IN."

SAME THING WITH THE LITTLE CHILDREN.

I MEAN, WE HAD, LIKE, NINE-YEAR-OLDS IN THERE. I'M LIKE,

"WHY DO I HAVE A NINE-YEAR-OLD IN A PRISON? THAT'S CRAZY."

BUT YEAH, THAT'S WHAT WAS THERE.

I WAS CHOSEN TO WORK AT THE HARD SITE 'CAUSE I'M A FEMALE

AND THEY NEEDED FEMALES WORKING 1B.

AND THAT'S MAINLY WHERE THEY STUCK ME

WHEN MEGAN AMBUHL WASN'T WORKING.

Ambuhl: IN THE HARD SITE

THERE WAS PROBABLY SIX OR SEVEN GUARDS

GUARDING, I WOULD SAY,

AT LEAST 1000 DETAINEES, IF NOT MORE.

AND YOU HAD ALL THOSE--

IF ALL THOSE PRISONERS

GOT TO COORDINATE AT ONE TIME,

YOU KNOW, THE GUARDS THAT WERE INSIDE OF THE COMPOUND

WOULD'VE BEEN-- THEY WOULD'VE BEEN DEAD.

IT WAS-- IT WAS

SUCH A SCARY SITUATION TO LIVE UNDER.

Javal Davis: THE PRISONERS IN THE HARD SITE

WERE LIKE THE LOWEST SCUM OF THE EARTH--

THE AL QAEDAS, THE TALIBAN,

SADDAM HUSSEIN, FEDAYEEN, WAHHABIS--

JUST ALL TERRORIST BAD GUYS.

AND THEY WERE AMERICAN-KILLERS.

WE WERE TOLD THAT THESE DETAINEES

WERE THE WORST OF THE WORST

AND THIS INFORMATION THAT WE NEEDED TO GET

WAS GONNA SAVE LIVES. IT WAS GONNA HAVE--

SOMEBODY SAID AT ONE POINT

IT WAS GONNA HAVE GLOBAL IMPLICATIONS.

Karpinski: I THINK THE MILITARY INTELLIGENCE PERSONNEL,

WERE CAUGHT PRETTY MUCH BY SURPRISE

AT THIS NUMBER OF PRISONERS BEING BROUGHT IN

THAT HAD TO UNDERGO AN INTERVIEW AT LEAST,

OR INTERROGATIONS.

THEIR ASSESSMENT WITHIN THE FIRST COUPLE OF WEEKS WAS--

"YOU KNOW, MA'AM, MOST OF THEM ARE JUST GUILTY OF BEING

IN THE WRONG PLACE AT THE WRONG TIME. THEY DON'T HAVE ANY INFORMATION."

WELL, ACCORDING TO THEM AT THAT TIME, IT WAS--

ABOUT 75% TO 80% OF THE PEOPL

REALLY DIDN'T HAVE ANY INFORMATION OF VALUE

OR ANY INFORMATION AT ALL ABOUT TERRORISM.

THE INTERROGATORS THAT I WORKED WITH AT ABU GHRAIB

WERE ALL EXTREMELY FRUSTRATED BY THE LACK OF INTELLIGENCE

THEY WERE GETTING DURING INTERROGATIONS.

AND MOST OF THEM ATTRIBUTED THAT TO THE FACT

THAT THEY HAD PRISONERS WHO DIDN'T HAVE INTELLIGENCE TO GIVE THEM.

THE INTERROGATORS WHO WERE IN MY UNIT SPENT ALL YEAR THERE

AND THEY WERE TELLING ME THAT THEY GOT NOTHING.

Danner: IN THE SUMMER OF 2003

THE INSURGENCY GREW AT A VERY RAPID RATE.

YOU HAD THE BOMBING OF THE U.N. HEADQUARTERS IN AUGUST,

THE BOMBING OF THE JORDANIAN EMBASSY,

THE BOMBING OF THE TURKISH EMBASSY,

AND THEN AT THE END OF OCTOBER

THE ATTACK ON THE RASHID HOTEL

WHERE MOST AMERICAN WORKERS IN THE GREEN ZONE WERE HOUSED.

President Bush: Thanks to the United States of America,

50 million people

once lived under tyranny

and today they live in freedom.

Danner: THE AMERICAN MILITARY HAD NO IDEA WHO THESE PEOPLE WERE.

HOW DO WE FIGHT AN ENEMY WE CANNOT SEE?

THE ONLY WAY TO DO THAT IS TO INTERROGATE ENOUGH PEOPLE

THAT WE WILL GET USABLE INTELLIGENCE THAT WILL ALLOW US

TO NIP THE INSURGENCY IN THE BUD.

- ( clamoring ) - AND I THINK THERE WAS A DEGREE OF PANIC

ABOUT THE LACK OF INTELLIGENCE AND THE LACK OF KNOWLEDGE

ABOUT THE INSURGENCY.

RUMSFELD WAS OPENLY IRRITATED ABOUT IT.

AND THEN WE COME TO ACCOUNTS

IN THE SUMMER OF 2003

OF AN INTELLIGENCE BRIEFING

THAT OCCURRED AT THE PENTAGON

INVOLVING RUMSFELD, CAMBONE,

A HANDFUL OF OTHER SENIOR OFFICERS,

AND HE'S DESCRIBED AS BEING OPENLY ANGRY,

POUNDING HIS FIST ON THE TABLE

AND ASKING IN A TAUNTING WAY,

"WHY IS IT THAT GUANTANAMO

GOOD INTEL-- GETS@ JUST WHAT I WANT--

AND I DON'T GET THIS OUT OF IRAQ?

I'VE HAD IT WITH THIS.

I WANT YOU TO GET MILLER OUT TO IRAQ

AND 'GITMO-IZE' THE SITUATION, AND DO IT FAST."

Danner: AND MILLER BY ALL ACCOUNTS IS A MAN

WHO IS IN A WAY RUMSFELD'S KIND OF OFFICER,

WHICH IS TO SAY HE DOESN'T CARE ABOUT PAST PRACTICE,

HE DOESN'T CARE ABOUT TRADITION NECESSARILY.

WHAT HE CARES ABOUT IS GETTING RESULTS.

AND HE ESTABLISHED A SYSTEM IN GUANTANAMO

THAT WAS BASED ENTIRELY

AROUND GETTING INFORMATION FROM THESE DETAINEES,

WHICH IS TO SAY,

USING HARSHER INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES.

I am telling you what I believe

in every inch of my body to be the truth.

And I have spent a lot of time on secure video

with the people down there.

I have talked to people that have been down there and come back

and I haven't found a single scrap

of any kind of information

that suggests that anyone has been treated

anything other than humanely,

notwithstanding everything we have read and heard.

AT THE TIME THERE WERE RUMORS COMING OUT OF GUANTANAMO

THAT PRISONERS WERE BEING ABUSED.

CERTAINLY, CERTAIN OF THE HUMAN-RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS

HAD DETECTED THOSE KINDS OF RUMORS AND WRITTEN LETTERS TO THE ADMINISTRATION

URGING THE ADMINISTRATION NOT TO ENGAGE IN THIS KIND OF PRACTICE.

SO I THINK WORD WAS STARTING TO LEAK OUT

AS TO SOMETHING OCCURRING IN GUANTANAMO.

GENERAL MILLER AT GUANTANAMO TURNED GUANTANAMO

FROM A CONVENTIONAL U.S. MILITARY PRISON

THAT WOULD ABIDE BY THE LAWS OF WAR

INTO A KIND OF AD HOC BEHAVIORAL LABORATORY

FOR THE INTRODUCTION OF THE USE OF EXTREME TECHNIQUES.

Danner: A LOT OF WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT WHAT WENT ON IN THE CELLS

DURING INTERROGATIONS AT GUANTANAMO

WE KNOW FROM FBI OFFICERS WHO WENT DOWN

AND WERE WORKING AT GUANTANAMO

AN IN ESSENCE OBSERVING WHAT THE ARMY INTERROGATORS WERE DOING.

WE HAVE A NUMBER OF EMAILS AND REPORTS THAT HAVE BEEN DECLASSIFIED

BY THESE FBI PEOPLE-- COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICIALS

WHO REPORTED ON WHAT THEY SAW.

"ON A COUPLE OF OCCASIONS," HE WRITES, "I ENTERED INTERVIEW ROOMS

TO FIND A DETAINEE CHAINED HAND AND FOOT

IN A FETAL POSITION ON THE FLOOR

WITH NO CHAIR, FOOD, OR WATER.

MOST TIMES THEY HAD URINATED OR DEFECATED ON THEMSELVES

AND HAD BEEN LEFT THERE

FOR 18, 24 HOURS OR MORE."

THESE PRACTICES, WHEN YOU SEE THEM ON BUREAUCRATIC DOCUMENTS,

SEEM ABSOLUTELY INOFFENSIVE, ALMOST BENIGN.

AND THIS REPORT IS ONE OF MANY MANY WE HAVE FROM GUANTANAMO

SIMPLY REPORTING

ON THE FLESH-AND-BLOOD REALITY

OF WHAT THOSE BUREAUCRATIC-SOUNDING NAMES MEAN.

McCoy: DONALD RUMSFELD APPROVED A MEMO

IN RESPONSE TO PRESSURES FROM INTERROGATORS

IN DECEMBER OF 2002,

IN WHICH HE APPROVED ALL SORTS OF ENHANCED INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES.

WHAT HE ALLOWS IS SOLITARY CONFINEMENT,

NOISE, LIGHT, DARK--

IN OTHER WORDS, ENHANCED OR EXTREME SENSORY DISORIENTATION.

Horton: THEY INCLUDE STRESS POSITIONS,

AND THEY INCLUDE A SERIES OF TECHNIQUES

DESIGNED TO UNDERMINE THE SELF-CONFIDENCE OF THE DETAINEE.

AND SUBSEQUENTLY WE LEARN THAT THIS INCLUDES

SEXUAL HUMILIATION TECHNIQUES AND FORCED NUDITY.

WHAT IS MOST SIGNIFICANT IS THAT IN IT,

SECRETARY OF DEFENSE DONALD RUMSFELD, IN HIS OWN NAME,

APPROVES THE HARSHEST INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES

THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED IN THE HISTORY OF OUR COUNTRY.

ON THE FINAL COPY OF THIS SO-CALLED "ACTION MEMO"

YOU SEE, AFTER RUMSFELD APPROVES CERTAIN OF THESE PRACTICES,

INCLUDING FORCED STANDING,

HE SAYS-- HE WRITES AT THE BOTTOM,

"HOWEVER, I STAND FOR 8-10 HOURS A DAY.

WHY IS STANDING LIMITED TO FOUR HOURS?

D.R."-- DONALD RUMSFELD.

Mora: THIS HANDWRITTEN COMMENT BY SECRETARY RUMSFELD

COULD BE CONSIDERED LIKE A WINK AND A NOD TO THE INTERROGATORS,

SUGGESTING THAT-- "NEVER MIND THE ACTUAL LIMITATIONS

CONTAINED IN THE MEMORANDUM.

DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO TO GET THE INFORMATION REQUESTED."

Karpinski: GENERAL MILLER IS SENT TO IRAQ

TO HELP THEM GET MORE ACTIONABLE INTELLIGENCE

FROM THESE THOUSANDS OF SECURITY DETAINEES.

AND GENERAL MILLER WITHOUT HESITATION SAID,

"LOOK, IT'S MY OPINION

YOU ARE TREATING THE PRISONERS TOO WELL.

THEY DON'T KNOW WHO'S IN CHARGE.

AND IF YOU DON'T TREAT THE PRISONERS LIKE DOGS,

YOU HAVE EFFECTIVELY LOST CONTROL OF THE INTERROGATION."

AT THE CLOSE OF GENERAL MILLER'S VISIT,

LIEUTENANT GENERAL RICARDO SANCHEZ,

OVERALL COMMANDER OF U.S. FORCES FOR IRAQ,

ISSUED A MEMORANDUM FOR EXTREME TECHNIQUES--

TECHNIQUES THAT CAN BE-- SEEM TO BE IN VIOLATION

OF BOTH U.S. AND INTERNATIONAL LAW.

I BELIEVE THEY THOUGHT THEY WERE INTERPRETING

THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS AND APPLYING THEM.

I DON'T THINK THEY THOUGHT, "WELL, THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS DON'T APPLY."

AND SO I THINK WHAT THEY THOUGHT THEY WERE DOING

WAS FOLLOWING THOSE STANDARDS

AND TRYING TO CREATE INTERROGATION METHODS BASED ON THEM.

Krol: THERE WERE SO MANY CHANGES IN POLICIES--

WHAT KIND OF STRESS POSITIONS YOU CAN USE FOR HOW LONG

AND, UM, STUFF OF THAT NATURE

THAT WAS-- IT WAS KIND OF CONFUSING.

IT WAS NEVER CLEAR TO ME WHAT WAS ALLOWED AND WHAT WASN'T ALLOWED IN IRAQ.

NO ONE EVER COULD MAKE ANYTHING CLEAR TO ME.

WHEN THE QUESTIONS WERE ASKED, IT WAS LIKE,

"HEY, I DON'T KNOW."

YOU KNOW, JUST-- NO ONE COULD ANSWER QUESTIONS FOR US.

Harman: ALL I REMEMBER IS THE FIRST DAY I WORKED

AT THE HARD SITE. AND THAT WAS--

( chuckles ) IT WAS OCTOBER 18, I BELIEVE,

'CAUSE I WROTE A LETTER HOME.

AND, UH...

ALL I KNEW WAS THERE WAS AN INTERROGATION GOING ON

AND THERE WAS A PRISONER NICKNAMED "TAXICAB DRIVER"

WHO WAS HANDCUFFED TO A WINDOW

BACKWARDS, NAKED,

IN ONE OF THE CELLS

AND THERE WAS AN INTERROGATOR THERE.

I JUST LEFT IT ALONE. I WROTE BACK HOME SAYING I DIDN'T AGREE WITH IT

AND I WENT TO WORK THE NEXT DAY.

"WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE NAKEDNESS?"

IT'S LIKE, "WHY ARE ALL THESE PEOPLE NAKED?"

I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THAT BEFORE IN MY LIFE--

YOU KNOW, NAKED PRISONERS

WITH PANTIES ON THEIR HEADS

AND IN COMPROMISING POSITIONS, YOU KNOW-- LOCKED UP.

I SAID, "WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THAT?"

I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT.

I GOT IN THERE AND THERE'S THIS NAKED KID

WHO'S OLD ENOUGH TO BE MY YOUNGER SIBLING,

YOU KNOW, JUST-- JUST NAKED,

JUST HIDING HIS SHAME WITH HIS HAND,

TRYING TO ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.

AND NO, WE-- NO ONE RAISED

ANY OBJECTION OR ANY CONCERN.

IT WAS JUST-- IT WAS JUST BUSINESS.

AND OUR BUSINESS WAS SOMETIMES CONDUCTED NAKED.

THE NUDITY AND THE SHACKLING OF THE PRISONERS WAS EVERY DAY--

EVERYDAY OCCURRENCE.

THE PRISONERS THAT CAME IN

HAD TO BE STRIP-SEARCHED

NO MATTER WHAT, JUST AS A SECURITY.

USUALLY THEY CAME IN WITH A SANDBAG ON THEIR HEAD

BECAUSE THEIR HANDLER

DIDN'T WANT ANYBODY TO KNOW THEY WERE THERE

OR DIDN'T WANT THEM

TO SEE ANYBODY ELSE WHO WAS THERE.

SO THEY STOOD AROUND NAKED

WITH A SANDBAG ON THEIR HEAD,

STANDING ON A BOX OR HOLDING SOMETHING,

NOT KNOWING WHERE THEY WERE OR WHAT WAS GOING ON.

WE KNOW THAT AFTER GENERAL MILLER'S VISIT

TO ABU GHRAIB PRISON AND TO IRAQ

IN AUGUST, SEPTEMBER 2003,

THAT THE M.P.s WERE REMOVED FROM THE CONTROL

OF GENERAL JANIS KARPINSKI

WHO WAS THE COMMANDER OF MILITARY POLICE FOR IRAQ,

AND PLACED UNDER THE CONTROL OF MILITARY INTELLIGENCE.

THE M.P.s WERE THEN NO LONGER PART OF,

IF YOU WILL, THE KIND OF INCARCERATION STAFF.

THEY WERE MOVED TO BE A PART OF THE INTERROGATION STAFF.

SO THE M.P.s HAVE THE JOB OF SOFTENING UP,

CREATING THE CONDITIONS FOR EFFECTIVE INTERROGATION

BY THE MILITARY INTERROGATORS.

Ken Davis: WHAT HAPPENED WHEN WE GOT TO ABU GHRAIB WAS,

MILITARY INTELLIGENCE WAS PLACED IN CHARGE OF US.

M.I. AND O.G.A., WHO IS C.I.A.,

AND ALL THESE OTHER CORPORATIONS, THESE CIVILIAN CONTRACTORS

THAT DIDN'T ANSWER TO ANYONE-- LIKE US--

WOULD COME IN AND TELL OUR M.P.s,

"THIS GUY NEEDS TO HAVE A BAD NIGHT."

"WHAT KIND OF BAD NIGHT?" "USE YOUR IMAGINATION.

YOU CAN DO THIS, THIS, THIS, THIS,

STRESS POSITIONS, LOUD MUSIC.

DO WHATEVER YOU WANNA DO TO HIM.

JUST MAKE SURE THEY DON'T SLEEP. WE NEED THAT INFORMATION."

THE M.I. PEOPLE, THE SPECIFIC HANDLERS

WOULD HAVE ME GIVE THE GUY--

GIVE WHICHEVER DETAINEE LOTS OF SHOWERS DURING THE DAY.

LIKE, THEY WOULD SAY, "THIS GUY IS REALLY DIRTY.

WE WANT YOU TO GIVE HIM LOTS OF SHOWERS.

WE WANT YOU TO STAND IN THERE AND POINT AND LAUGH AT HIM"

AND...

YOU KNOW, JUST BE THERE WHILE HE-- SO HE'S DEFINITELY AWARE

THAT I'M STANDING THERE

WHILE HE'S FULLY NUDE.

LIKE, "HEY HEY, SERGEANT DAVIS. TAKE THESE NUMBERS DOWN--

PRISONER NUMBER 111777," OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

"HE NEEDS TO BE UP AT 4:00 IN THE MORNING,

GO TO BED AT 4:30, BE UP AT 5:15,

GO TO BED AT 7:00," YOU KNOW?

"THIS PRISONER NUMBER BLAH-BLAH-BLAH, DO THIS, DO THAT.

TAKE THE RADIO AND PUT THE MEGAPHONE UP

SO WE KEEP HIM UP ALL NIGHT LONG.

BANG THE GARBAGE CAN, SLAM THE DOORS.

IF THEY GO TO SLEEP, THROW WATER ON THEM."

LIKE THAT, YOU KNOW? "KEEP HIM AWAKE.

MAKE SURE THEIR LIFE IS HELL TONIGHT."

IT'S FAR MORE DIFFICULT

TO CURE THE VICTIMS OF PSYCHOLOGICAL TORTURE

THAN IT IS TO CURE THOSE WHO SUFFERED PHYSICAL TORTURE.

WE CALL PSYCHOLOGICAL TORTURE IN THIS COUNTRY "TORTURE LIGHT," OKAY?

IT'S NOT "TORTURE LIGHT." IT'S THE MOST DAMAGING, THE MOST DESTRUCTIVE.

Karpinski: SERGEANT GRANER, HE WAS SENT FOR

SPECIFICALLY TO WORK THE NIGHT SHIFT

BECAUSE-- AS HE WAS TOLD--

BECAUSE OF HIS "CIVILIAN PRISONS" EXPERIENCE.

AND THEY NEEDED SOMEBODY WITH THAT KIND OF EXPERIENCE.

Ambuhl: TIER 1 HAD JUST MYSELF

AND GRANER AT THE TIME.

THERE WAS ONLY TWO OF US,

AS FAR AS MILITARY POLICE, THAT WERE ASSIGNED TO THE TIER

ON A 12-HOUR SHIFT.

Ken Davis: EARLY ON IN OCTOBER,

GRANER WAS HOARSE. HE HAD A REAL RASPY VOICE.

AND I SAID, "WHAT'S THE MATTER? GRANER, ARE YOU SICK?"

HE GOES, "NO." HE SAYS, "I'M HAVING TO YELL AT THE DETAINEES."

AND I SAID, "OH, REALLY?" HE GOES, "I HAVE A QUESTION FOR YOU."

HE SAID, "M.I. AND O.G.A. ARE MAKING ME DO THINGS

I FEEL ARE MORALLY AND ETHICALLY WRONG.

WHAT SHOULD I DO?"

AND I LOOKED AT HIM AND I SAID,

"DON'T DO IT."

HE GOES, "I DON'T HAVE A CHOICE."

GET A LITTLE BIT OF POWER--

"OH, YOU KNOW WHAT? THIS FEELS PRETTY GOOD, ACTUALLY."

YOU GET A LITTLE BIT MORE POWER-- "WAIT A MINUTE, I NEED MORE.

I'M ADDICTED TO THIS POWER." AND IT JUST STARTS BUILDING AND BUILDING.

AND I BELIEVE THAT'S WHAT GRANER HAD.

HE GOT FREE REINS FROM PEOPLE AND GOT ALL THIS POWER,

AND YOU'RE NOT GONNA TURN THE REINS BACK OVER.

IT BECOMES WHO YOU ARE. IT BECOMES WHAT YOU'RE KNOWN FOR.

I DON'T FEEL LIKE IT WAS MY PLACE TO QUESTION ANYTHING

AS--

I'D JUST GOT OUT OF BASIC AND THAT WASN'T-- ( chuckles )

IT WAS LIKE, IF YOU QUESTION YOUR ORDERS,

YOU AND YOUR BATTLE BUDDY ARE GONNA DIE.

WE WERE AT WAR. IT WAS NOT PRETTY. IT WAS NOT NICE.

THESE GUYS KILLED PEOPLE-- OH, WELL.

AFTER A WHILE YOU BECOME NUMB.

YOU JUST ZONE IT OUT. EVERYONE DID.

YOU STARTED TO FORGET WHAT YOU SAW THE DAY BEFORE,

'CAUSE THE NEXT DAY WOULD ALWAYS USUALLY BE WORSE.

SO YOU KIND OF WENT NUMB THE DAY BEFORE

AND THEN IT JUST KEPT GOING. IT WAS LIKE A CYCLE.

IT JUST BECAME SOMETHING THAT YOU HAD--

YOU HAD TO GEAR YOURSELF UP TO DO THAT.

I GUESS I'VE ALWAYS--

IF SOMETHING I HAD TO DO--

IF I DIDN'T LIKE TO DO IT, I ALWAYS--

LIKE GOING TO THE DENTIST, I DIDN'T CARE ABOUT IT

BUT I ALWAYS WENT AND DID IT

EVEN THOUGH IT WAS UNCOMFORTABLE.

IT JUST BLEW MY MIND HOW IT WAS NORMAL,

YOU KNOW, THAT IT WAS JUST NO BIG DEAL.

IT WAS JUST LIKE A DAY AT WORK

TO SAY, "OKAY WE'RE GONNA DO THIS TO THIS GUY. WE'RE GONNA DO THAT TO THAT GUY."

AND I'M SITTING THERE SAYING TO MYSELF, "MY GOD!

WHAT IS HAPPENING TO THIS PLACE?

McCoy: THE PART OF THIS THAT WE DON'T UNDERSTAND

IS THE POWERFUL APPEAL,

AN ENORMOUS DESTRUCTIVENESS OF TORTURE--

WHY, WHEN YOU GIVE AN ORDER

AND YOU GIVE A SIGNAL FOR A LITTLE BIT OF TORTURE,

WHY IT SPREADS LIKE WILDFIRE.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A LITTLE BIT OF TORTURE.

Javal Davis: WHEN WE HAD THAT RIOT,

THAT JUST SET EVERYBODY OFF,

YOU KNOW, INCLUDING MYSELF.

WE WERE JUST LIKE, "THAT'S IT. IT'S THE LAST STRAW."

THEY GATHERED UP THE RIOTERS.

SO WE GOT THEM DOWN TO 1A/B.

THE SOLDIER THREW HIS PERSON ON THE FLOOR.

THEN ANOTHER SOLDIER THREW THEIR PERSON ON THE FLOOR.

THEN I THREW MY PERSON I WAS ESCORTING ON THE FLOOR.

I WAS ANGRY AND UPSET.

I WAS, UM--

I WONDERED LIKE, "WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO ATTACK US?

I KNOW YOU'RE UPSET. WE'RE UPSET TOO."

SO I TOOK MY AGGRESSION OUT

'CAUSE, HEY, IT'S BEEN OKAY THIS WHOLE TIME.

Harman: I WROTE THE WORD "RAPIST" ON ONE OF THEM

BECAUSE HIS FACE SHEET SAID HE WAS A RAPIST--

WHICH WAS COMMON PRACTICE, TO WRITE ON PRISONERS,

JUST WRITING ON THEM. I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHY,

BUT I JUST WROTE IT ON HIM.

Ambuhl: I SAW THE ONE DETAINEE

IN THE STANDING--

THE SIMULATED FELLATIO.

AT THAT POINT FREDERICK TOOK THE SANDBAG

OFF THE HEAD OF THE ONE

AND POINTED AT US TO SHOW THEM

THAT THERE WAS FEMALES WATCHING.

Javal Davis: TO MY KNOWLEDGE THOSE GUYS WERE GOING TO BE INTERROGATED

TO GET INFORMATION ABOUT THE RIOT STARTING,

ABOUT WHAT WAS GOING ON, WHAT WAS GOING NEXT.

SO THAT LED ME TO BE LIKE,

"OKAY, THESE GUYS ARE GONNA GET INTERROGATED,

SO I CAN HELP NOW."

I STEPPED ON THE TOE OF ONE OF THE DETAINEES.

THEN I STEPPED ON THE HAND OF ONE OF THE DETAINEES

AND I YELLED AT HIM.

THEN I LEANED ON THEM WITH MY BODY WEIGHT.

LIKE, I FELL ON THE PILE. WHEN I FELL ON THE PILE, I WAS YELLING AT THEM.

Harman: THEY WERE STRIPPED ONE BY ONE

AND THEN STUCK INTO A PYRAMID.

IF I SAW SOMETHING, I TOOK A PHOTO OF IT.

THE FIRST THING I THINK OF IS TAKE PHOTOS.

THAT PROBABLY SOUNDS REALLY SICK

BUT I'M ALWAYS TAKING PHOTOS.

I MEAN, THAT'S JUST ME.

I'VE ALWAYS TAKEN PHOTOS.

I WAS TAKING A PHOTO FROM BEHIND

AND SERGEANT FREDERICK SAID, "HEY, GET IN THE PHOTO"

OR "LET'S TAKE A PHOTO" OR SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT.

GRANER WAS BEHIND ME AND I JUST...

GAVE A THUMBS-UP AND SMILED.

I REALIZE IT WAS A PRETTY STUPID THING TO DO RIGHT AWAY,

BUT IT HAPPENED.

Danner: I DON'T THINK IT'S NECESSARILY TRUE THAT SOMEONE SAID,

"PUT THOSE PEOPLE IN A PYRAMID-- A NAKED PYRAMID."

BUT THEY'RE PART OF A LARGER UNIVERSE OF OTHER ACTS.

BECAUSE THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT SADISM.

THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT INDISCIPLINE.

THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT ABUSE.

THE PROBLEM IS, ALL OF IT TOOK PLACE

BECAUSE OF AN OVERWHELMING OR AN OVERARCHING

DOCTRINAL PERMISSIVE ENVIRONMENT

THAT ALLOWED YOU TO ALSO BEAT PEOPLE UP

AND ALSO KEEP THEM AWAKE AND ALSO SUBJECT THEM TO STRESS POSITIONS

THAT HAD BEEN APPROVED, IN EFFECT, BY THE SECRETARY OF DEFENSE

AND BY THE THEATER COMMANDER,

LIEUTENANT GENERAL RICARDO SANCHEZ.

Rivera: THERE WAS A SOLDIER

WITH A SORT OF SPEAKER BOX.

AND HE WAS SHOUTING THINGS INTO THIS ROOM.

"HEY, WHAT ARE YOU GUYS DOING IN THERE?

ARE YOU GUYS FUCKING IN THERE? WHAT ARE YOU, FAGGOTS?"

OUT COME THESE THREE

NAKED PETRIFIED IRAQI MEN.

Ken Davis: I GO AHEAD AND GO IN

AND GRANER TELLS ME THEY'RE INTERROGATING THESE GUYS OR WHATEVER.

THEN THEY HANDCUFFED THEM TOGETHER.

AND THE ENTIRE TIME THEY'RE YELLING, "CONFESS!

YOU KNOW YOU DID IT. CONFESS!"

I'M THINKING, "OKAY, WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?"

THEY WERE ASKED TO GET DOWN ON THEIR STOMACHS.

AND REMEMBER, THEY'RE COMPLETELY NAKED.

THEY'RE ASKED TO GET DOWN ON THEIR STOMACHS AND TO CRAWL ON THE FLOOR.

SPECIALIST GRANER WAS SHOUTING, "THAT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

GO DOWN FAR ENOUGH

TO WHERE YOUR GENITALS ARE SCRAPING ON THE FLOOR."

AND THEY WERE MADE TO CRAWL

ON THEIR STOMACHS FROM THAT DOOR

TO THE END OF THE HALL AND BACK.

AT THAT TIME I CAN'T SAY THAT I WAS SYMPATHETIC

TO THE DETAINEES

BECAUSE OF WHAT THEY'D DONE.

I WAS ALSO OUTRAGED.

I WAS EXTREMELY PISSED OFF AT THEM

FOR WHAT THEY'D DONE.

BUT AT FIRST I STOOD TO THE SIDE.

AND THERE WAS SPECIALIST KROL, I REMEMBER THAT,

WITH THE WATER. HE HAD A CUP OF WATER

AND HE WAS MOTIONING WITH HIS FINGER TO ROLL

AND HE WAS POURING WATER ONTO A DETAINEE.

THEN SOMEHOW A FOOTBALL,

A NERF TOY, CAME OUT.

I DON'T KNOW, I THINK ONE OF THE M.P.s BROUGHT IT OUT.

SO THIS FOOTBALL WAS THROWN AROUND

FROM AN M.P. TO AN M.I.

AND I ALSO THREW IT

AND I HIT A DETAINEE IN THE LEG WITH A NERF BALL.

Rivera: THEY ARRANGED THE DETAINEES

INTO A POSITION TO WHERE THEY WERE MIMICKING HAVING SEX.

THEY WERE SHOUTING. THEY WERE CRYING.

THERE WAS JUST A LOT OF "PLEASE," A LOT OF "ALLAHS."

AND "PLEASE, MISTER. PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE."

THE PRESSURE WAS CONSTANTLY BUILDING UP.

AND WHEN I SAW THESE DETAINEES

AND LEARNED WHAT THEY'D DONE,

I JUST KIND OF SNAPPED.

THERE'S NO WAY THAT I CAN JUST SIT HERE

AND CONDONE WHAT'S GOING ON.

SO THEN THE NEXT DAY WE GET UP EARLY, WE RUN MISSIONS,

I COME BACK AND I REPORT IT TO MY LIEUTENANT

THE FOLLOWING DAY-- THAT DAY.

AND JUST TOLD HIM, "HEY, MILITARY INTELLIGENCE

IS OVER AT THE HARD SITE DOING SOME PRETTY WEIRD THINGS WITH NAKED DETAINEES."

HE GOES, "WHAT?"

I SAID, "THEY'RE INTERROGATING NAKED DETAINEES."

AND HE GOES, "YOU'RE NOT EVEN SUPPOSED TO BE OVER THERE."

AND I'M THINKING, "WHAT?"

YOU KNOW, IT'S ALL THESE MELTDOWN THINGS

THAT GO THROUGH YOUR BRAIN LIKE,

"NO, YOU'RE NOT GETTING WHAT I'M SAYING HERE."

HE GOES, "THAT'S NOT EVEN YOUR JOB OVER THERE.

YOU NEED TO STAY AWAY FROM THE HARD SITE."

NOT TOO LONG-- ABOUT TWO-THREE WEEKS AFTER THAT

IS WHEN GRANER GOT A STATEMENT.

Ambuhl: "CORPORAL GRANER, YOU ARE DOING A FINE JOB IN TIER 1.

AS THE N.C.O.I.C. OF THE 'M.I. HOLD' AREA

YOU HAVE RECEIVED MANY ACCOLADES FROM M.I. UNITS HERE

AND SPECIFICALLY FROM LIEUTENANT COLONEL JORDAN.

CONTINUE TO PERFORM AT THIS LEVEL

AND IT WILL HELP US SUCCEED AT OUT OVERALL MISSION."

THERE'S YOUR VERIFICATION...

THAT, UH...

YOU KNOW, AS ODD AND UNCOMFORTABLE

AS A SITUATION MAY BE, IT'S WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING.

THIS COMMENDATION HAPPENED AFTER MOST OF THE THINGS

PICTURED IN THE PHOTOGRAPHS THAT HAVE BECOME SO NOTORIOUS

HAD ALREADY HAPPENED.

AND IT SIMPLY BEGGARS BELIEF

THAT MILITARY INTELLIGENCE, WORKING VERY CLOSELY

WITH THESE PEOPLE EVERY DAY,

SIMPLY WAS COMPLETELY IGNORANT ABOUT WHAT WAS GOING ON

ON THIS TIER, WHICH AFTER ALL, HELD

ALL OF THEIR VALUABLE PRISONERS.

WHEN I'D PICK UP DETAINEES TO GO TO JAIL

THEY WOULD MOTION TOWARDS THE SIDE

WHERE THERE WAS A CEDAR BUILDING.

IT WAS LIKE THE INTERROGATION BOOTHS.

AND THEY'D LOOK AT IT AND SAY, "NO, MISTER,"

AND POINT OVER THERE. AND THEY'D ACT LIKE THEY WERE SORE.

AND I'M LIKE, "NO, I DON'T TAKE YOU OVER THERE.

WE'RE GOING TO COURT TO SEE THE JUDGE."

"THANK YOU, MISTER. I HURT, I HURT."

SO IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS WHERE, "WHAT ARE THEY DOING TO THESE GUYS?"

WE HAVE ONE CLEAR CASE OF SOMEONE

WHO APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN TORTURED TO DEATH

AT ABU GHRAIB WHO WAS DELIVERED,

WHO WAS KEPT IN ICE, WHO WAS OFF THE RECORDS--

HE WAS A GHOST DET

INVESTIGATION CONDUCTED ABOUT THIS

TYING THIS DEATH TO, AS I RECALL, NAVY SEALS

AND ALSO C.I.A. PERSONNEL.

AT C.I.A., THERE SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN A POLICY DECISION

NOT TO PROSECUTE HOMICIDES

THAT RESULTED FROM THIS HIGHLY ABUSIVE CONDUCT.

Harman: WE CAME TO THE PRISON AND WE WERE TOLD

THAT A PRISONER HAD JUST DIED;

HE'D DIED OF A HEART ATTACK; HE WAS IN THE SHOWER;

AND THAT WAS IT--

THEY WEREN'T GONNA COME PICK HIM UP RIGHT AWAY

BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY MEANS; AND THAT HE WAS IN A BODY BAG.

SO, OF COURSE,

SERGEANT FREDERICK AND ME WERE LIKE,

"OKAY, IT'S JUST A DEAD BODY, RIGHT?

HE DIED OF A HEART ATTACK." SO WE WENT IN

AND I BELIEVE CORPORAL GRANER

TOOK A PHOTO OF ME. IT WAS JUST A DEAD GUY.

IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE JUST A DEAD GUY.

WE DIDN'T REALIZE UNTIL AFTER THESE PHOTOS

THAT HE WAS BLEEDING IN PLACES

THAT YOU WOULDN'T BLEED FROM

GETTING A HEART ATTACK.

THE THUMBS UP-- I GOT THAT FROM THE LITTLE KIDS.

THE SMILE-- I ALWAYS SMILE FOR CAMERAS.

IT'S JUST THE NATURAL THING YOU DO WHEN YOU'RE IN FRONT OF A CAMERA.

IT REALLY WASN'T ANYTHING NEGATIVE TOWARDS THIS GUY.

I DIDN'T KNOW HE WAS JUST MURDERED.

I JUST THOUGHT IT WAS JUST-- IT'S WAR.

IT'S ANOTHER DEAD GUY. NO BIG DEAL.

Ken Davis: C.I.A. PUT HIM ON ICE

AND THEY WERE GONNA TRY TO GET HIM OUT ON A STRETCHER WITH I.V.s(Y

TO COVER UP A MURDER.

BUT HAS ANYBODY BEEN BROUGHT TO TRIAL FOR THAT?

NO, BUT GRANER AND SABRINA WERE CHARGED

WITH THOSE PICTURES.

THAT TO ME IS RIDICULOUS.

WE WON'T CHARGE THE MURDERER EVEN THOUGH IT'S RULED A HOMICIDE,

BUT WE'LL CHARGE YOU FOR TAKING PICTURES

AND EXPOSING THAT A MURDER HAPPENED HERE.

I DON'T UNDERSTAND.

THERE IS A HOLE IN THIS WHOLE INVESTIGATION.

IT'S A BLACK, DARK HOLE

THAT SAYS COVER-UP.

SO I WANTED TO TAKE HOME PICTURES OF HILLA

BECAUSE WE HAD BEEN IN SOME VERY ASTOUNDING PLACES.

WE'D SEEN THE TOWER OF BABEL, THE CITY OF BABYLON.

AND WE HAD BEEN THROUGH A LOT OF HISTORY,

STUFF THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU READ ABOUT IN THE BIBLE

AND IN THE HISTORY BOOKS, COMING THROUGH IRAQ.

SO I WANTED THAT. I WANTED PICTURES OF THAT.

I WANTED PICTURES OF THINGS WE'D EXPERIENCED.

AND SO I WAS ASKING EVERYBODY, "HEY, DID YOU GET ANY PICTURES

OF THIS, DID YOU GET ANY PICTURES OF THAT?"

AND WHEN I TALKED TO GRANER THAT NIGHT,

I SAID, "HEY, MAN, I KNOW YOU'RE ALWAYS TAKING PICTURES.

I WANT TO GET SOME PICTURES OFF OF YOU."

HE TAKES OUT TWO CDs AND SAYS, "HERE, JUST GIVE THEM BACK TO ME WHEN YOU GET A CHANCE."

PROBABLY TWO DAYS LATER I WAS LOOKING AT THE PICTURES,

AND THE FIRST CD, IT WAS ALL HILLA.

YOU KNOW, BABYLON PALACE, EVERYTHING.

YOU KNOW, CAMP VICTORY, THE PALACES WE'D SEEN AND EVERYTHING.

THERE WAS SOME GOOD PICTURES.

THE SECOND CD WAS EVERYTHING DEALING WITH THE ABUSE.

I WAS LIKE, "OH MY GOD, THESE ARE PRISONERS."

AND THEN, YOU KNOW, "WHAT DO I DO NOW?"

I HEARD AMBUHL'S VOICE. I HEARD ENGLAND'S VOICE.

I HEARD GRANER'S VOICE.

I DIDN'T HEAR FREDERICK. I HEARD-- YEAH, I DID HEAR FREDERICK'S VOICE.

AND I HEARD SIVITS' VOICE.

ALL FIVE OF THEM WERE OUTSIDE OF THE ROOM I WAS IN.

I HEARD ALL THEIR VOICES.

I'M LIKE, "OH MY GOD!"

CHIEF ARTHUR COMES IN AND GOES, "YOU'RE STILL HERE!"

I SAID, "YEAH, I'M STILL HERE."

"WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO? I'VE GOT THEM OUT HERE, HE'S IN HERE.

HE CAN'T GET OUT THE DOOR."

AND FINALLY THEY WENT AROUND

AND ROUNDED UP AS MANY BLANKETS AS THEY COULD.

AND THEY HAD ALL FIVE PEOPLE STAND UP

AND TURN AROUND AND FACE THE OTHER WALL,

PUT BLANKETS ALL OVER ME-- I MEAN, HEAD TO TOE COVERED IN BLANKETS.

YOU COULDN'T SEE ANYTHING. I COULDN'T SEE ANYTHING.

THEY WERE LEADING ME. AND THEY RUSHED ME OUT PAST THEM,

OUT THE BACK DOOR AND THEN PULLED THE BLANKETS OFF

AND SAID, "GET OUT OF HERE."

AND THAT'S THE LAST TIME I TALKED TO C.I.D. ABOUT ANYTHING.

IN THE COURSE OF THIS INVESTIGATION

WHEN IT FIRST GOT STARTED UP IN IRAQ

THEY SET UP AMNESTY LOCATIONS.

AND THEY TOLD EVERYBODY ASSIGNED TO ABU GHRAIB,

"IF YOU HAVE ANY DISKS, IF YOU HAVE ANY PHOTOGRAPHS,

IF YOU HAVE ANY CONTRABAND,

YOU NEED TO PUT IT IN THE AMNESTY BOXES NOW

AND IT WILL ALL BE FORGOTTEN.

DON'T WORRY ABOUT PRIVATE PHOTOS.

DON'T WORRY ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE THAT MIGHT BE ON THE DISK,

BUT EVERYTHING WILL BE FORGOTTEN.

Javal Davis: "OKAY, WELL, IF ANYONE HAS ANY PICTURES OF ANYTHING

DESTROY THEM NOW." THERE WAS A WHOLE BUNCH OF PEOPLE

ERASING THEIR HARD DRIVES,

YOU KNOW, LIKE, DESTROYING DISKS AND CDs,

THINGS LIKE THAT, JUST LIKE IN FEAR OF, LIKE,

"MAN, MAYBE IF I TOOK A PICTURE OF SOMETHING,

COULD I GET IN TROUBLE FOR WHAT I TOOK A PICTURE OF?"

Announcer: This is a picture of an Iraqi prisoner of war.

And according to the U.S. Army, Americans did this to him.

Torture outrage. Arab TV networks plastering photos

all over the airwaves today of U.S. troops apparently

abusing Iraqi prisoners.

The images are sickening and the outrage they are causing

worldwide continues to grow.

ABOUT SIX MONTHS AFTER I CAME BACK TO THE STATES

I WALKED INTO A BEST BUY OR SOMETHING--

AN ELECTRONICS STORE.

I'M LOOKING AT TVs

AND I SEE MY PICTURE

AND PICTURES OF OTHER M.P.s

NEAR NAKED DETAINEES.

I WAS SHOCKED, OF COURSE.

THERE WAS MORTIFICATION. I'M ON THE NEWS.

YOU KNOW, THERE'S-- LIFE'S GONNA BE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT FROM NOW ON.

IT WAS DURING THE INVESTIGATION THAT I SAW THEM.

I DIDN'T KNOW

THAT THEY EXISTED. I'M LIKE, "WHAT IS THAT?"

THEY'RE LIKE, "DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THIS?" I'M LIKE, "NO."

"DID YOU TAKE ANY OF THESE PICTURES?" I'M LIKE, "NO."

THE PHOTOGRAPHS...

CAME OUT WHILE I WAS AT BALAD AIRBASE.

THE FIRST TIME ANY OF US KNEW THAT MY NAME WAS OUT THERE

WAS WHEN SECRETARY OF DEFENSE RUMSFELD

ON NATIONAL TV THANKED ME.

AND I'M SUPPOSED TO BE ANONYMOUS.

FIRST SPECIALIST JOSEPH DARBY

ALERTED THE APPROPRIATE AUTHORITIES THAT ABUSES WERE OCCURRING.

I WAS SCARED TO DEATH.

I WAS ACTUALLY ABOUT 10 FEET FROM THE TV

IN THE CHOW HALL WITH FOUR OR FIVE OTHER SOLDIERS

THAT-- THEY ALL KNEW.

THESE WERE THE GUYS THAT I TRUSTED.

AND ONE OF THEM LOOKED AT ME AND HE GOES, "DARB, WE NEED TO LEAVE,

AND LEAVE NOW."

Seven soldiers, all members of the Military Police,

are facing charges of abusing Iraqis

at the Abu Ghraib prison.

From the very beginning the military establishment

has said this is the work of a few bad soldiers.

I share a deep disgust...

that those prisoners were treated the way they were treated.

Those acts ought not to be allowed to define us.

The terrible actions of a few

don't change that.

Those soldiers let us down.

They simply let us down.

Yoo: THE DEFENSE DEPARTMENT HAS DONE NUMEROUS INVESTIGATIONS

AND THEY FOUND WHAT HAPPENED AT ABU GHRAIB WAS NOT AUTHORIZED,

THAT THE PEOPLE WHO CONDUCTED IT WERE NOT AWARE

OF WHATEVER OTHER

THINKING WAS BEING DONE WITH THE LAW,

AND THAT THIS WAS ESSENTIALLY THE ACTIVITY OF PEOPLE ON THE NIGHT SHIFT

THAT WASN'T EVEN IN THE CONTEXT OF INTERROGATIONS.

EVERY INVESTIGATION THAT'S BEEN CONDUCTED SO FAR

HAS NOT FOUND ANY KIND OF LINK.

SIR, WE DID NOT FIND ANY EVIDENCE OF A POLICY

OR A DIRECT ORDER GIVEN TO THESE SOLDIERS

TO CONDUCT WHAT THEY DID.

THERE WAS SADISM ON THE NIGHT SHIFT

AT ABU GHRAIB,

SADISM THAT WAS CERTAINLY NOT AUTHORIZED.

IT WAS A KIND OF "ANIMAL HOUSE"

ON THE NIGHT SHIFT.

EVEN SUGGESTING THAT THIS WAS "'ANIMAL HOUSE'

ON THE NIGHT SHIFT" WAS CONSCIOUS DISINFORMATION.

IS THERE ANY CHANCE THAT THESE PEOPLE WERE SELF-ACTUATED,

THAT THEY JUST CAME UP WITH THIS AS THEIR OWN IDEA?

NO, THERE'S NO CHANCE OF THAT WHATSOEVER,

ZERO CHANCE. WHAT THEY'RE DOING ARE

VERY PRECISELY DESCRIBED TECHNIQUES

THAT WERE DEVELOPED FOR USE ON ARAB MEN

IN THE GLOBAL WAR ON TERROR,

WERE IMPLEMENTED AT GUANTANAMO

AND WERE THEN BROUGHT TO AND USED IN ABU GHRAIB.

WHEN YOU ACTUALLY THINK ABOUT

THE "ANIMAL HOUSE"- ON-THE-NIGHT-SHIFT THEORY

YOU HAVE A COUPLE OF PROBLEMS.

THE BIG PROBLEM IS THAT THIS ACTUALLY IS A PRACTICE

THAT'S WELL-KNOWN TO INTERROGATORS.

IT'S CALLED "THE VIETNAM."

IT WAS DEVELOPED IN BRAZIL.

IT COMBINES STRESS POSITIONS,

WHICH IS TO SAY STANDING ON--

BALANCING ON A BOX--

WITH ELECTROCUTION,

OR IN THIS CASE THE THREAT OF ELECTROCUTION

AND SENSORY DEPRIVATION-- THE HOOD.

SO THIS PRACTICE IS QUITE WELL KNOWN.

HOW EXACTLY ARE SOME UNEDUCATED PRISON GUARDS--

HOW EXACTLY DID THEY KNOW TO USE THIS TECHNIQUE

WHICH WAS DEVELOPED BY THE BRAZILIAN MILITARY?

John McCain: I'd like to know: what agencies or private contractors

were in charge of interrogations;

did they have authority over the guards;

and what were their instructions to the guards?

First, with respect to the--

- ( General Smith speaking ) - Oh my.

It was all prepared.

I'll walk through the chain of command and--

McCain: No, I-- let's-- you can submit

the chain of command, please.

Secretary Rumsfeld, in all due respect,

you've got to answer this question

and it could be satisfied with a phone call.

This is a pretty simple straightforward question.

ABU GHRAIB IS A GREAT EXAMPLE

OF BUREAUCRATIC VIRTUOSITY

IN HANDLING A SCANDAL.

NONE OF THESE REPORTS LOOKED AT THE WHOLE CHAIN OF COMMAND.

THERE IS THIS LONG CHAIN

THAT LEADS FROM WHAT WAS DONE TO PRISONERS IN THE CELLS,

UP THROUGH MILITARY POLICE,

TO THE MILITARY INTELLIGENCE WHO ORDERED IT ON SOME OCCASIONS,

BACK TO THE PENTAGON, BACK TO THE WHITE HOUSE EVENTUALLY.

YOU HAVE THIS LONG CHAIN,

AND UNTIL THAT WHOLE CHAIN IS LOOKED AT

IN AN AUTHORITATIVE WAY BY SOMEONE

WHO IS EMPOWERED TO ASK QUESTIONS OF ANYONE,

WE WON'T AT THE END OF THE DAY KNOW

ACTUALLY WHAT HAPPENENED AT ABU GHRAIB.

THE ADMINISTRATION WILL SAY, "WE'VE CONDUCTED

HUNDREDS OF INVESTIGATIONS INTO THESE THINGS,"

AND INDEED THEY HAVE.

WE DON'T HAVE TOO FEW INVESTIGATIONS,

WE'VE GOT TOO MANY INVESTIGATIONS.

WHAT WE NEED IS ONE INVESTIGATION

THAT IS CONDUCTED BY INDIVIDUALS

THAT ARE ABSOLUTELY BULLETPROOF,

WHO HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE AUTHORITY

TO GO WHEREVER THEY NEED TO GO.

IF IT LEADS THEM TO THE E-RING OF THE PENTAGON

SO BE IT.

IF IT LEADS THEM TO THE OVAL OFFICE, SO BE IT.

GRANER AND THE 372nd M.P. COMPANY

EMBARRASSED THE ARMY

WITH PICTURES.

AND THE ARMY GOT THEM BACK.

NOTHING WOULD HAVE HAPPENED TO ANYBODY IF THE PHOTOGRAPHS WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN OUT.

IF THERE WERE NO PHOTOGRAPHS, THERE WOULD BE NO ABU GHRAIB.

THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN NO INVESTIGATION.

IT WOULD HAVE BEEN, "OH, OKAY, WHATEVER. EVERYBODY GO HOME."

Horton: THESE PHOTOGRAPHS FROM ABU GHRAIB

HAVE COME TO DEFINE THE UNITED STATES.

THE U.S., WHICH WAS VIEWED AS

CERTAINLY ONE OF THE PRINCIPAL ADVOCATES OF HUMAN RIGHTS

AND THE VIEW OF THE DIGNITY

OF HUMAN BEINGS IN THE WORLD,

SUDDENLY IS VIEWED AS

A PRINCIPAL EXPOSITOR OF TORTURE.

Mora: THE UNITED STATES USED TO BE THE MODEL,

BUT IT IS NO LONGER.

IF YOU ADOPT CRUEL TREATMENT,

AS SOME MAY WANT US TO ADOPT,

IF WE EMBRACE TORTURE AS SOMETHING THAT IS

EXPEDIENT AND NECESSARY IN THE INSTANCE,

WE SACRIFICE A LONG-TERM INTEREST.

WE SACRIFICE OUR BELIEF IN HUMAN RIGHTS.

WE SACRIFICE OUR BELIEF IN THE RULE OF LAW

AND WHAT LAW SHOULD GOVERN AND WHAT LAW SHOULD PROHIBIT.

AND WE BLUR THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN OURSELVES

AND THE TERRORISTS. AND I'M CONVINCED

IT WOULD BE COUNTERPRODUCTIVE IN THE WAR ON TERROR.

Javal Davis: AT THAT MOMENT I WAS A DIFFERENT PERSON.

AT THAT MOMENT I WAS NOT THE PERSON YOU'RE SITTING HERE TALKING TO RIGHT NOW.

AT THAT MOMENT I WAS SOMEBODY ELSE.

I'M TRYING TO FORGET THIS,

NOT...

TO BRING BACK BAD MEMORIES.

THAT HE REMINDED ME OF GOLDING'S "LORD OF THE FLIES".

THAT ANIMALISTIC, THAT DARK ELEMENT IN EACH OF US

IS JUST BROUGHT OUT.

IT'S JUST A MATTER OF, ARE THE ELEMENTS RIGHT ?

NOW, YEAH, MAYBE I HAVE SOME REGRETS

ABOUT WHAT WENT ON THERE.

EVEN THOUGH IT WASN'T NECESSARILY

A COMFORTABLE THING TO DO...

I DID IT.

THE RESULTS, AS I OBSERVED THEM IN THE LABORATORY,

ARE DISTURBING.

THEY RAISED THE POSSIBILITY THAT HUMAN NATURE CANNOT BE COUNTED

ON TO INSULATE MEN FROM BRUTALITY AND INHUMANE TREATMENT

AT THE DIRECTION OF MALEVOLENT AUTHORITY.

A SUBSTANTIAL PORTION OF PEOPLE DO WHAT THEY ARE TOLD TO DO

IRRESPECTIVE OF THE CONTENT OF THE ACT

AND WITHOUT LIMITATIONS OF CONSCIENCE.

SO LONG THAT THEY PERCEIVE THAT THE COMMAND

COMES FROM A LEGITIMATE AUTHORITY.

IN THIS STUDY, AN ANONYMOUS EXPERIMENTER COULD SUCCESSFULLY

COMMAND ADULTS TO SUBDUE A 50-YEAR-OLD MAN

AND FORCE HIM PAINFUL ELECTRIC SHOCKS AGAINST HIS PROTESTS.

ONE COULD ONLY WONDER WHAT GOVERNMENT

WITH ITS VASTLY GREATER AUTHORITY AND PRESTIGE

CAN COMMAND AMIDST SUBJECTS.