Original subtitles

match tonight a 2020 investigation

the amazing story that could be the next

making a murderer

he was like they're trying to pin this

on me i was like dad what are you

talking about

they're talking about this nature loving

girl found murdered on a riverbank

there's a car that's run off an

embankment and there's a body land

now the man found fishing nearby

sentenced to life

for killing her a man many think is

innocent

and what you see tonight could set him

free

did the evidence of a brutal strangling

put him away

it was knotted very tightly around her

neck or was it a hell-bent detective

honing in on an easy a car

you target heard a car you never touched

the car low behold guess whose dna is

inside a dead girl's car

tonight one woman's crusade to prove his

innocence

people just lost track of who was doing

what lost track in a high-profile murder

case

we're showing you the crime scene at the

water's edge fishing

there's no way i could even lean out and

see that there's anything going on

tapes the jury never saw even the judge

now rethinking the case what do you

think after watching that

videotape it does make me question

whether or not

mark carver did it did they catch a

murderer

or make one if mark carver didn't kill

iri yamalenka

then who did

hello i'm elizabeth vargas and i'm david

muir as we come on the air here tonight

a man sits in a north carolina prison

nearly six years

into a life sentence for killing this

young woman right here behind us tonight

but just like that hit documentary

series making a murderer questions are

now being raised

is an innocent man behind bars just

yesterday mark carver's lawyer filed a

motion to have his conviction overturned

to start fresh with a new trial i've now

spent hours with that man at the center

who refused a plea deal

saying he wouldn't confess to something

he didn't do

after tonight will you think he did it

drive west from charlotte north carolina

on interstate 85

and you'll cross the catawba river wide

and placid it's a big draw for

recreational boaters and sportsmen

in close but separate locations on the

river's wooded banks

two people arrive here on the morning of

may 5th 2008

they could not be more different

[Music]

one is a 20 year old student from nearby

unc

charlotte ira yarmolenko a musician

a photographer a poet we

as women as children an outdoorsy type

who loves nature really

enjoyed the beauty of nature she tried

to find it everywhere

pavel is era's brother why do you think

your sister drove to the river that day

i think that she was looking for a

pretty spot to take pictures at

ira is originally from the ukraine

immigrating here with her family when

she was just seven years old

the other person on the river that day

39 year old mark carver

he's from just down the road in nearby

gastonia

a dirt road which bears his family name

lined with modest dwellings which house

his relatives

carver was a very simple person

his family lived out in the country

didn't have much education

could not read very well cannot write

very well

unlike era mark has never been to

college in fact he's never gone to high

school

after years of working in the local

cotton mills he now spends his day here

at this fishing hole on the catawba

where he casts away his troubles

often with this man his cousin neil

cassida robin carver is mark's

sister-in-law

oh they were together all the time when

they were fishing and stuff

what happened on that river that bright

may day is as perplexing as it was

violent but this much we can tell you

for sure

today ira yarmolenko is in a north

carolina cemetery

and mark carver is in this north

carolina prison

serving a life sentence for her murder

i recently went behind the barbed wire

and concrete walls

to hear his story hi mark hi i'm

elizabeth

nice to meet you why don't you have a

seat okay

how long have you been in this prison

mark five years

there is no question that what happened

to era that day was

terrible and tragic but attorney chris

mumma who's devoted her career to

exonerating the wrongfully convicted

says carver is also a victim we think

mark is innocent

and if mark is innocent the family has

not received justice and the true

perpetrator is still out on the streets

mumma took me out on the river to the

spot where carver and cassidy were

fishing that morning

mark would back his truck up to this

down this road

so he didn't walk the road he drove down

he drove down

and literally parked with the back of

the truck right here he would sit on the

back the tailgate and fish

cassette left around 12 30 that

afternoon leaving carver alone

half an hour later two jet skiers out

for a ride on the catawba

come upon a gruesome scene

i'm a boater on the catawba river

something blue and metallic catches the

eye of one of the jet skiers

there's a car that's run off an

embankment and there's a body land

laying there i don't know if there are

or not and as they

motor up closer they see the body of a

young girl lying in the grass beside the

car

it is ira yarmolenko her body her car

found 100 yards up river from carver's

fishing hole

the police found ear's body right beside

the driver's side of the cart

elizabeth leland has written extensively

about the case for the charlotte

observer

she says the bizarre crime scene posed

far more questions

than answers she wasn't raped she wasn't

robbed

there were lots of things that just

didn't make sense about this case

among them the odd manner of death these

three ligatures around her neck it was

the drawstring

that had been taken out of her hoodie

and wrapped around tight

and knotted in several places there was

a bungee cord that had been tied around

and lastly a very dainty little blue

ribbon

the disturbing discovery in the catawba

river a body as the media descends

police begin canvassing the area for

witnesses

they talked to those two jet skiers and

to construction workers who were in the

area where era's body was found

we went see if anything could be done

but it was it was too late there was no

movement

and of course they find that fisherman

calmly

casting for carp just downstream mark

carver

and what did they tell you was happening

they didn't tell me nothing

they just said they need to get my name

and address and my fishing license i

give them to them

and then he gave him back i shook his

hand they went up through there

carver is cooperative but not very

helpful he says he neither saw nor

heard anything so police have nothing

but bad news to deliver when they notify

ira's family police officer came to the

door what did he say

he slowly walked in and and told us

that unfortunately they have found my

sister's body and that they're very

certain

that it's her i can't fathom getting

news like that

i think all of us simply collapsed where

we were and

that was that was it days pass with no

arrest

the mystery now as deep as the sorrow

i hope that when you go home tonight you

will tell

everybody that you love them you will

tell everyone that you know that you

love them

pavel eulogizes his sister at a memorial

service on campus

in the coming days she is laid to rest

while detectives speak to those who last

saw her

piecing together her final steps this

video is to represent

the timeline for miss irena yarmolenko

detectives record this

timeline video era spent the morning

running errands she

went to the credit union and she went to

the goodwill a security camera catches

her donating several bags of clothing

and then she went to jackson's java

which was a coffee shop where she worked

takes approximately 5 minutes and 50

seconds to drive to

jackson's jabba from goodwill and from

there to the catawba river

is about a 19-minute drive this is the

last documented moment of era's life

a grainy video of her car driving

through the parking lot of a ymca

about half a mile from the embankment

where her car was found

police study it searching for any sign

of another person with her but the video

is so

unclear police can't tell so they

pursued the theory that era must have

met her killer

out on the river if someone approached

her that she didn't know would she

had her defenses up unfortunately for

her i think she was much more of an

outgoing type of person the kind of

person who would trust

people she didn't know i think so yeah

with the search for the killer dragging

on for weeks

and then months public pressure on the

police to solve the crime

mounts we were tormented by the search

we thought of it more or less constantly

so police bring mark carver back in and

start to do some

fishing of their own do you know what

dna is

are they about to find a murderer or

make one

everybody was just in shock we just

couldn't believe it was happening

stay with us

2020 continues

thank you i'll need you to pound these

gloves

before going through the evidence on the

ground floor of the gaston county

courthouse

we find this cardboard box

inside the evidence from the ira

yarmolenko crime scene

the three ligatures that were wrapped

around her neck

a small floral bag from which one of

those ligatures

a blue ribbon had been torn look at how

tight that knot

is crime scene photos of her car on the

banks of the river

all pieces of a rubik's cube of a case

investigators spend six months working

every possible lead

and interviewing cooperative witnesses

like mark carver

repeatedly did you see that little girl

i told him i didn't know what happened

girl or i went up there and helped her

carver and his cousin neil cassida both

volunteered dna samples

meanwhile era's family works the media

keeping images of the smiling student

the carefree spirit that was era alive

in the public's mind we simply did the

only thing we could do

contact local media and get information

out there so that possible witnesses

would submit information

pavel a brother who won't quit at one

point appeals directly to the killer

i have no doubt that once you truly

realize how deeply you've hurt us all

you'll have no choice but to surrender

it is not until

seven months after the murder that

investigators finally catch a break

they have a dna match traces

of mark carver's dna in one spot on the

outside of the car

above the rear driver's side door neil

cassida's dna is in two spots

on the inside of the right passenger

window and

on an armrest what kind of dna are we

talking about

it's dna where skin cells have been shed

and typically it's called touch

dna it is not blood dna or semen

but police think it's enough even though

the two cousins had no

obvious motive for murder the question

that the dna never answered and the

police never could

was why these men would kill ira

yamalenko

groping for answers police come up with

a theory

that era had somehow seen carver and

cassida

doing something so outrageous they had

to kill her to keep their secret

their theory was that era was down there

to photograph

and caught the men doing something that

they didn't want anybody to know about

and so that the men violently strangled

her

and pushed the car down the embankment

and that's why their dna was found on it

so now mark carver finds himself on the

hot seat

do you know what dna is i found your dna

inside a car

you said you didn't see a car you never

heard a car you never touched the car

low guess who's dna

inside a dead girl's car over and over

again

you keep telling the police we didn't

touch the car

i told them and told them that they

didn't believe nothing we told them

in fact during that hour-long

interrogation carver denies

seeing era or touching her car more than

times when the interview finally wraps

up

police allowed carver and his cousin

neil cassida to go home

but neil's daughter amy says the writing

was on the wall

he walked in and he was like they're

trying to pin this on me

did he tell you what they said to him

well they were saying that

that they knew he did it he just needed

to confess it

two days later before sunrise police

show up to arrest the men

they haul them back in and give them one

last chance to

things to confess real quick this is

neil casada y'all barking around

if i swear my mom was very if i didn't

have a time to do it

no confession no matter police charged

mark carver and neil casada

with her murder the two men are charged

with first-degree murder even though

neil cassida had already passed a

polygraph

the men appear stunned and confused at

their arraignment the following day

like everybody was just in shock we just

couldn't like we just couldn't believe

it was happening

we do not want to go to trial until we

have all the evidence

the man leading the charge against

carver and cassida is gaston county

district attorney lock bell

but it is a slow charge even after the

men make bail

neil casta's family greeted him inside

the gaston county jail tonight

no comment please police continue to

test

and eliminate eight other suspects

two years pass before prosecutors bring

the case to trial

then on the eve of the opening arguments

in neil cassidy's case

a shocking development it was sunday

morning

the trial started on monday he was in

the kitchen and

he told my mom i'm having a little

trouble breathing and he just fell over

neil cassida never gets his day in court

new quesada died in his mount holly holm

sunday morning

those two years it was very hard on him

he was so worried

that he was going to prison for

something he didn't do even with one of

the defendants dead

the state pushes forward with the

prosecution of the other

mark carver who at the time hires local

defense attorney brent

ratchford before the trial carver has

offered the deal of a lifetime

plead guilty to second-degree murder and

spend just

four to eight years in prison ratchford

thought the deal was a strong statement

about the state's weak

case i've never gotten such a low offer

he turned it down without batting an eye

i'm not going to plead guilty for

something i didn't do

you'd rather spend the rest of your life

in prison

mark carver walked calmly into court in

march

2011 carver's legal reckoning finally

arrives he's upbeat and feeling good

he's innocent so we're ready for our day

at trial

prosecutors build their case on three

key pieces of evidence

the first carver's proximity to the

crime scene

if he were less than a hundred yards

from where era was killed

prosecutors argue his claim that he

heard nothing that day

can't be true detectives testify about

an experiment they conducted on the

river

one detective stood where carver was

fishing another where era was

according to testimony they spoke in

normal voices

and could hear each other we had a lot

of issue with that

it was allowed to come in anyway the

second piece of evidence is that

touch dna found on era's car that

matched mark carver

prosecutors say it proves he touched the

car

and therefore must have been at the

crime scene and to drive that point home

the state has an ace in the hole a

moment from that interrogation where

carver

police testify gave himself away i

believe the words he used was a little

a little thing detective william terry

was also in the room during that

interrogation

he said that she

came up to him about right here the

gotcha moment was when the police

detective

was recounting the interrogation and

said that mark carver

knew that era was little that moment

is crucial carver had always said he had

never

seen era so prosecutors asked how could

he know how tall she was

unless he was lying the very first thing

i thought of was

they got you judge timothy kinkade

presided over carver's murder trial

that's what did it for you that was the

turning point of that trial for me

and with that the prosecution rested its

case

everyone was then sort of on the edge of

their chairs waiting for the defense

to present a case but to the shock of

carver's family

ratchford decides the state's case is so

weak

he will present no witnesses or evidence

for the defense

that could not explain how the crime

occurred

based on that the jury is not going to

be convinced beyond a reasonable doubt

they told us no way that they were going

to be convicted

they're wrong it takes the jury just a

few hours to return with a verdict

guilty of first degree murder when i

heard that verdict come down

i couldn't breathe i was like oh my god

they got it wrong judge kincaid

sentences carver to life in prison

but while his cell door slams shut

another investigation is just beginning

so let's

send you over to where era was

how much of the state's case really

holds water

tell her to yell stay with us

chris mumma gets people out of prison

her organization the north carolina

center on actual innocence

has had a hand in overturning 19

convictions

the point at which i really thought

maybe there was something to this case

was finding out that chris mumma

was involved and i thank you so much

muma takes on only two percent of the

clients who approach her

in 2013 she agreed to make mark carver's

fight

her own you rarely take these

you picked mark's case why the bottom

line is

is there a valid question mark and is

there

a way to get the answer mark's case met

all the criteria for us

and if anyone ever needed a sharp legal

mind in his corner it is mark carver

mumma argues he was easily manipulated

by police because of his limited

education is it hard for you to read and

write

yeah i can read a little bit but i can't

write

i'm literate you really have to go all

the way up the hill one of the first

problems mumma noticed in the case was

that the killers were she believes

physically incapable of killing there's

all kinds of things that don't fit

together

it doesn't fit together that two men who

are so limited in their physical ability

could do this to

a young vibrant strong girl

neal had a terrible heart condition his

family said he couldn't walk

20 feet without becoming winded mark

carver has

carpal tunnel in his hands he says he

can't even hold a plate for long without

dropping it

those years working in a cotton mill had

left carver disabled

he showed us the scars on his arms from

multiple surgeries

so how does that affect what you can do

and what you can't i can't grab nothing

hold it for a long time

can you button your your cuff back up

yeah just take me a minute

i'll get it a minute just have to give

me time okay

could these hands throttle someone to

death

and even if carver had killed era for

reasons

unknown why on earth would he stay at

the scene

it doesn't make sense who's going to

kill someone and then go right back to

fishing

mumma also points to this man who asked

us not to reveal his identity

he was on the catawba river that day and

even spoke to mark carver around

2pm in that crucial period after

eero was killed and before police

questioned mark carver

we talked about fishing and talked about

his family

we had a good conversation for about 30

35 minutes

but most importantly this man says he

didn't notice anything about carver that

suggested he had just been through a

homicidal struggle mr carver wasn't

muddy he wasn't wet

he had no scratches on him he was just

as normal as anybody could be normal

just sitting on the back of his suv

fishing mumma thinks this man's

testimony could have been important at

carver's trial

but he was never called to testify

instead the jury heard from that

detective

who described the sound experiment

police conducted on the river

trying to disprove carver's claim that

he heard nothing

we recreated that experiment for

ourselves

so let's send you okay over to where era

was

okay i'm gonna stay here where mark was

okay and we're gonna have you talk

remember on the stand the detective said

he spoke in a

normal voice and could still be heard

from the fishing hole

can you hear me can you hear me

i don't hear anything can you hear me

did they do it yet

elizabeth can you hear me tell her to

yell can you hear me

now i hear her can you hear me

i can hear you you cannot hear each

other talking at a normal voice you

can't

hear each other talking when you raise

your voice several levels and that's

what i did with you

you shouted as loud as you could i did

shot as loud as i could

of course the jurors never saw an

experiment like this

they just heard the detective's

testimony about it

and this isn't the only time mumma

thinks that the detective's testimony

may have misled the jury he said that

she was i believe the words he used was

a little

a little thing remember that bombshell

moment

when he described how carver seemed to

know era's height

even though he claimed never to have

seen her he said that she

came up to him about right here mumma

says you need to look at the actual

video which was never played in court

and understand that police were

interrogating a man with an iq

of 61 and had no idea what he was up

against

if you look at the full interrogation a

detective was asking mark

to tell him about era in fact it is the

detective

interrogating mark who calls ira little

and then

encourages him to describe her even

though he's already said

over and over he's never seen her

it is the detective who is telling mark

the detective stands up and says she

would have come about here on you right

and mark says yeah i guess and he said

well stand up and show me

y'all standing up look at each other but

she do look at you and knives yeah about

how i thought she was on youtube

and mark basically mimics what the

detective did

probably about about right there

was he being manipulated i think it was

manipulative

to present that at trial without

clarification

and i think it was error for the defense

to not

challenge that again jurors in the case

never

saw this video they just heard the

detective describe it

judge timothy kinkade who presided over

the case also found the detective's

trial testimony persuasive

but he'd never seen the tape either

this is the actual interrogation

what do you think after watching that

videotape of the interrogation

i think it was quite leading the

detective was using the language first

in other words

he was do you think that mark carver was

being led by the detectives and is

simple enough

that he would just echo whatever this

man was saying

i can't answer that i think it does put

a new light

on the whole thing what kind of light it

does make me

question whether or not mark carver

did it certainly i think that could have

created reasonable doubt

but what about that final and most

damning piece of evidence

the touch dna that seemed to place

carver

at the crime scene will you hear the

words dna match

that sounds like as close to a sure

thing as you can get

mumma says not so fast whatever you

think you know about the infallibility

of dna

think again is there another explanation

for how that dna got there

stay with us

now 2020 continues once again

elizabeth vargas

emergency found a body floating in

catawba river

in the hours after ira yarmolenko's body

was found

local news crews recorded this footage

of police processing the scene

it looks like they're all over it but

attorney chris mumma says

looks can be deceiving it was actually

two months later before the vehicle was

swabbed

why did the police wait two months

before swabbing that car for dna

it seems from the records that people

just lost track of who was doing what

lost track in a high profile murder case

i can't think of any reason why you

wouldn't swab a vehicle

immediately getting dna from a bodily

fluid like blood is nothing new

but in 2008 the ability to lift dna

from an object that had been merely

touched was cutting edge forensic

science

it was that technology that gave

detectives here the break they needed

those traces of mark carver's touch dna

on era's car

mark's dna was not found on anything

else

it was not found on the steering wheel

the key the ligatures around ms

yarmolenko's neck

her clothing the gear shift a seat

a front door was not found on any of

those and they were tested

what about under era's fingernails was

there any dna there

there were two profiles there was hers

which you would expect to find there and

but there also was another profile that

was unidentified

to this date police have not been able

to identify to whom that mystery dna

belongs

or explain why so little of mark

carver's or neil cassida's dna

was found at the crime scene wouldn't

his dna have been

all over era we're talking about a life

and death struggle here a death match

i would expect to see more of his dna on

her body

or on her clothing dr lawrence

kobalinski is a dna expert who has

testified in nearly 50 trials

he says most of all he would expect to

see carvers touch

dna on those ligatures around ira's neck

you would expect sufficient numbers of

cells

to be left behind the simplest

explanation

is that he did not touch those ligatures

and if it's possible that carver didn't

touch the ligatures

is it also possible he didn't actually

touch the car

most people think of dna only being able

to be in a place

if they specifically touch it and they

don't consider the fact

that someone else may have had contact

with them and then touch the car

there are two ways that dna can be

deposited on

an item of evidence one way is a direct

transfer investment i touch that did i

touch something and i

leave behind dna from my hands

the second possibility is an indirect

or secondary transfer where i

shake your hand and now i touch a

vehicle

and i transfer your dna onto that

vehicle

so how could carver's dna have been

transferred

remember he spoke to police that day on

the banks of the river

the officer who came over and took

mark's driver's license so he's holding

an item that has mark's dna on it and he

shook

mark's hand and look again at the crime

scene photos and video

mumma says it's clear some of the

officers were not wearing gloves

even while they were touching the car

they're touching the inside of the car

they're touching the outside of the car

they're touching the doors the handles

so it's

it's contaminated this officer even

appears to lean on the car door

and something else is startling while

reviewing the video shot at the crime

scene that day we came across

this footage it appears to show an

officer

rubbing the exact area of ira

yarmolenko's car

where mark carver's touched dna was

found

and as you can see he's not wearing

gloves

were any of the officers who were

touching that car did any of them have

their dna tested

there's no record of any dna being taken

from any officer who was at the scene

at carver's trial secondary transfer of

his touch dna was dismissed as highly

unlikely

but it has happened before in 2012

a millionaire from california was

murdered in his home

forensic experts found dna on his

fingernails

that they were able to link to 26 year

old lucas anderson

there was only one problem anderson had

an airtight alibi

at the time of the murder he was in the

hospital being treated for severe

intoxication

it turns out the same two paramedics

that scooped up anderson who was living

on the streets

were at the murder scene a short time

later once

prosecutors realized anderson's dna had

been transferred to the crime scene by

paramedics

he was finally cleared if you're not

careful

you're going to end up putting somebody

at a crime scene who was never there

so why didn't carver's original defense

attorney call a dna expert

to explain how that might have happened

here sometimes you're open in pandora's

box do you think you're putting in a lot

of good evidence

but the kids are around about you then

the dna expert is not going to help you

ratchford's decisions continue to haunt

mark's family

robin have you spoken to mark in prison

we speak to him twice a week and

go and visit when we can he just wants

to come home

just imagine living every day in there

knowing you didn't do it

but if mark carver didn't kill ira

yarmolenko

who did did she travel from charlotte by

herself

or someone else in the car an inmate

wrote a letter said that he had killed

erie yamalenko

the hunt for other suspects next

ever since the day 20 year old ira

yarmolenko's bright life

was cut short mark carver's answers have

been the same

mark did you kill era no

did you strangle that young woman no

i didn't even see her there's some

saying about uh how eli has a short life

but the truth

lives on forever he's never wavered what

does that tell you

tells me he's telling the truth and if

mark carver is telling the truth

that means a killer is still on the

loose

someone who can solve the puzzle of that

crime scene on the catawba river

why for example were there three

ligatures around

ira's neck it's definitely overkill the

hoodie string

was probably enough to cut off the air

supply in her neck

that alone would have killed her i think

that alone would have killed her the

other two

to me almost seemed uh decorative

the blue ribbon almost like a bow

perhaps it was a crime of passion at one

point

investigators entertained the theory

that era knew her keller

could it have been a fellow student who

may have been stalking her

or a customer from that coffee house

where she worked

who some said might have been obsessed

with her or someone who coerced era to

let them

into her car that day the question was

presented to me

did she travel from charlotte by herself

was there someone else in that car

remember investigators were never able

to enhance these surveillance images

enough to confirm if era was alone or

not

the footage was not good enough quality

where someone could tell whether there

was a person another person in the car

even in the front seat

backseat even if era was alone there was

no shortage of other suspects in the

area who might have committed a crime of

opportunity there were a lot of

construction workers

there's a lot of traffic a lot of people

traffic ample opportunity for some her

to come in contact with someone that was

totally unknown to her last but perhaps

most bizarre a confession that came

early in the case an

inmate in the mecklenburg county jail

the case of a murdered unc

charlotte student wrote a letter to one

of our local news anchors and said that

he had killed erie yarmolenko

police talked to the self-proclaimed

killer even tested his dna

but determined his confession was just a

strange way to meet a local celebrity

and they believe that he was infatuated

with the news anchor and saw this as a

way

of getting a chance to talk with her was

there any sign

that he chris mumma says the only way to

resolve the questions surrounding mark

carver's guilt

is for the district attorney to release

the dna evidence to be re-examined

the district attorney in this case has

opposed you

every step of the way yes

he has and and i've asked to sit down

with him i've asked to meet

i asked her why should i help you to get

somebody off

that i firmly believe is guilty

prosecutors in this case declined to

talk to us on camera but they have

steadfastly defended the touch dna

evidence

after all even if carver's was

inadvertently transferred to the car

his cousin neil cassidus was found there

too what are the odds of

two dna transfers happening there's

another way to look at this

if we do believe in secondary transfer

we have to start thinking about

secondary transfer of both

but carver is adamant his only crime is

being a gullible fisherman

in the wrong place at the wrong time why

do you think

police were so focused

on you because they just wanted when

somebody to take the route for it

and they didn't care who done it i think

they thought they were easy targets

because they were uneducated

they wasn't highly sophisticated they

were real so pretty poor

yeah pretty poor as of tonight there is

another

powerful voice suggesting carver's case

should get another look

someone that might surprise you the

trial judge

timothy kincaid part of a district

attorney's oath is to

do justice and if that's what justice

requires that's what you got to do

when we come back what happened just

yesterday that could set

mark carver free and what era's family

has to say about it

stay with us

[Music]

it's been nearly six years since mark

carver was convicted of ira yarmolenko's

murder

his original defense attorney stands by

his handling of the case

but has been haunted by it ever since

this is the one trial

in 20 years that i have lost sleepover

mark carver is innocent i would love to

get a second chance

a second chance for mark carver that's

what chris mumma hopes she can deliver

just yesterday she filed a motion

demanding mark carver receive

a new trial we will certainly be saying

that we thought that he had ineffective

assistance a council

that he should have had a forensic

expert of his own

testifying that they should have put the

videotape in what are the chances that

you're going to be successful

we've been around this block enough to

know it's not good to bet on it

so we're going to fight for him and

we're going to hope that the district

attorney will work with

us

it's a long process but i do believe the

truth will come out

and