All language subtitles for Making A Murderer - S01e01 Eighteen Years Lost-eng

af Afrikaans
sq Albanian
am Amharic
ar Arabic
hy Armenian
az Azerbaijani
eu Basque
be Belarusian
bn Bengali
bs Bosnian
bg Bulgarian
ca Catalan
ceb Cebuano
ny Chichewa
zh-CN Chinese (Simplified)
zh-TW Chinese (Traditional)
co Corsican
hr Croatian
cs Czech
da Danish
nl Dutch Download
en English
eo Esperanto
et Estonian
tl Filipino
fi Finnish
fr French
fy Frisian
gl Galician
ka Georgian
de German
el Greek
gu Gujarati
ht Haitian Creole
ha Hausa
haw Hawaiian
iw Hebrew
hi Hindi
hmn Hmong
hu Hungarian
is Icelandic
ig Igbo
id Indonesian
ga Irish
it Italian
ja Japanese
jw Javanese
kn Kannada
kk Kazakh
km Khmer
ko Korean
ku Kurdish (Kurmanji)
ky Kyrgyz
lo Lao
la Latin
lv Latvian
lt Lithuanian
lb Luxembourgish
mk Macedonian
mg Malagasy
ms Malay
ml Malayalam
mt Maltese
mi Maori
mr Marathi
mn Mongolian
my Myanmar (Burmese)
ne Nepali
no Norwegian
ps Pashto
fa Persian
pl Polish
pt Portuguese
pa Punjabi
ro Romanian
ru Russian
sm Samoan
gd Scots Gaelic
sr Serbian
st Sesotho
sn Shona
sd Sindhi
si Sinhala
sk Slovak
sl Slovenian
so Somali
es Spanish
su Sundanese
sw Swahili
sv Swedish
tg Tajik
ta Tamil
te Telugu
th Thai
tr Turkish
uk Ukrainian
ur Urdu
uz Uzbek
vi Vietnamese
cy Welsh
xh Xhosa
yi Yiddish
yo Yoruba
zu Zulu
or Odia (Oriya)
rw Kinyarwanda
tk Turkmen
tt Tatar
ug Uyghur
Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:09,434 --> 00:00:10,734 Here they come. 2 00:00:12,234 --> 00:00:15,200 Up the road. 3 00:00:15,267 --> 00:00:17,200 After 18 years. 4 00:00:22,100 --> 00:00:23,667 - How you doing? - Oh, hello. 5 00:00:23,734 --> 00:00:25,133 - How are you? - I'm pretty good. 6 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:28,000 - How's it feel? - It feels wonderful. 7 00:00:32,234 --> 00:00:35,234 Oh, God! Stevie, you're home! 8 00:00:35,801 --> 00:00:37,667 I was happy when I got out. 9 00:00:38,634 --> 00:00:41,133 I probably was the happiest man on the earth. 10 00:00:41,801 --> 00:00:44,400 We knew he was innocent. We knew he was innocent. 11 00:00:52,801 --> 00:00:56,334 Law enforcement despised Steven Avery. 12 00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,200 Steven Avery was a shining example 13 00:00:59,267 --> 00:01:03,634 of their inadequacies, their misconduct. 14 00:01:04,667 --> 00:01:08,100 No one ever intended to do anybody any harm by this. 15 00:01:08,167 --> 00:01:11,167 We firmly believed that we had the guilty party at the time. 16 00:01:11,934 --> 00:01:14,000 Welcome home! 17 00:01:14,601 --> 00:01:18,067 This was one of the biggest miscarriages of justice I ever saw 18 00:01:18,133 --> 00:01:22,300 in 20 years in criminal defense work and thousands of cases. 19 00:01:25,567 --> 00:01:27,667 It was like the same old Steve was back. 20 00:01:27,734 --> 00:01:29,601 I missed you. 21 00:01:29,667 --> 00:01:32,200 He was happy. He was smiling. 22 00:01:32,267 --> 00:01:33,934 But I did tell him, "Be careful." 23 00:01:36,234 --> 00:01:38,133 There was just something I felt. 24 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:40,734 I said, "Manitowoc County's not done with you. 25 00:01:41,968 --> 00:01:45,234 They are not even close to being finished with you." 26 00:02:53,813 --> 00:02:58,813 Sync and corrections by explosiveskull www.addic7ed.com 27 00:03:10,701 --> 00:03:12,767 We filed Steven Avery's lawsuit 28 00:03:12,834 --> 00:03:16,534 about a year after the DNA had come through, 29 00:03:16,601 --> 00:03:20,234 indicating that he had not committed the crime. 30 00:03:20,300 --> 00:03:22,701 - Good morning. - You got a new hairdo. 31 00:03:22,767 --> 00:03:25,434 - A little bit. - I didn't recognize you. 32 00:03:25,501 --> 00:03:28,334 The defendants are Manitowoc County, 33 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:33,300 Thomas Kocourek, who was the sheriff at the time in 1985, 34 00:03:33,367 --> 00:03:36,701 and Denis Vogel, the district attorney of Manitowoc County, 35 00:03:36,767 --> 00:03:40,367 again at the time in 1985. 36 00:03:40,434 --> 00:03:43,334 There is a distinction in the law between simple mistakes 37 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,100 for which officers like that are immune, 38 00:03:46,167 --> 00:03:49,033 and purposeful conduct that violates constitutional rights, 39 00:03:49,100 --> 00:03:50,300 for which they're not immune. 40 00:03:50,367 --> 00:03:52,367 Just a little bit more waiting. 41 00:03:53,300 --> 00:03:57,200 I waited long enough. A little bit more ain't gonna bother me. 42 00:03:57,267 --> 00:04:02,000 We're seeking compensation for the loss of his freedom 43 00:04:02,067 --> 00:04:06,868 and punitive damages for the reckless or indifferent behavior of the defendants. 44 00:04:16,534 --> 00:04:19,601 That there's some justice around yet. 45 00:04:24,234 --> 00:04:27,601 Even though there's no guarantee that Steven Avery will win this case, 46 00:04:27,667 --> 00:04:31,033 he says it's still worth going through the trial, 47 00:04:31,100 --> 00:04:34,534 just to hold somebody accountable for taking 18 years of his life. 48 00:04:36,367 --> 00:04:39,267 They had the evidence back then that I didn't do it... 49 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:43,501 but nobody said anything. 50 00:04:45,901 --> 00:04:48,734 I don't see what I really did wrong to the sheriff 51 00:04:48,801 --> 00:04:51,067 for him to pick on me like that. 52 00:04:52,601 --> 00:04:56,400 The only thing I can think of is I ran my cousin off the road. 53 00:05:01,701 --> 00:05:04,834 We're on the record in the matter of Avery v. Manitowoc County. 54 00:05:04,901 --> 00:05:07,834 Would you raise your right hand, please, to be sworn in? 55 00:05:07,901 --> 00:05:10,934 Do you solemnly swear the testimony you're about to give will be the truth, 56 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:13,534 the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God? 57 00:05:14,133 --> 00:05:15,267 Yes. 58 00:05:18,701 --> 00:05:25,400 Ma'am, I'm gonna show you a report about Steven Avery, indecent exposure. 59 00:05:25,467 --> 00:05:29,567 It indicates that there was a complaint received 60 00:05:29,634 --> 00:05:32,501 September 20th, 1984. 61 00:05:33,234 --> 00:05:38,167 It says that "he has been known to masturbate on the hood of the car 62 00:05:38,234 --> 00:05:41,467 as she's driving past." Do you see that? 63 00:05:41,534 --> 00:05:44,567 - Yes. - Did you tell that to the police? 64 00:05:44,634 --> 00:05:46,801 Um... 65 00:05:46,868 --> 00:05:49,567 I didn't put it in that many words. I didn't... 66 00:05:49,834 --> 00:05:51,968 He didn't masturbate on the hood of my car, 67 00:05:52,033 --> 00:05:56,534 but he did come out in front of my car and he was... 68 00:05:58,100 --> 00:05:59,634 doing his thing. 69 00:05:59,701 --> 00:06:03,067 This is why you're driving 40 miles an hour by his house? 70 00:06:03,133 --> 00:06:07,167 He did... He did run out towards the road. 71 00:06:07,234 --> 00:06:09,501 He was prepared. He had it all ready. 72 00:06:10,868 --> 00:06:14,767 OK. It then says "he has had sexual relations 73 00:06:14,834 --> 00:06:18,133 - with his wife out on the lawn..." - That, I have nothing... 74 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,367 Let me just finish the question. 75 00:06:20,434 --> 00:06:25,667 "...while all the neighbors are home in the daytime and able to watch." 76 00:06:25,734 --> 00:06:27,901 - That, I didn't say at all. - OK. 77 00:06:27,968 --> 00:06:31,067 Do you have any explanation for why whoever is writing this 78 00:06:31,133 --> 00:06:33,133 might say that you said that? 79 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:35,534 - I don't know. - OK. 80 00:06:37,968 --> 00:06:42,934 Was there a period where you were spending time in a nearby tavern 81 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:46,267 - and talking about Steven Avery? - I might've. 82 00:06:48,367 --> 00:06:50,567 - I might've went to several taverns. - All right... 83 00:06:52,367 --> 00:06:57,868 In 1985, were you personally friendly with Steven Avery? 84 00:06:57,934 --> 00:06:59,234 No. 85 00:06:59,300 --> 00:07:02,300 In fact, you actively disliked him. 86 00:07:02,367 --> 00:07:05,901 - Is that right? At that time. - Yes. 87 00:07:05,968 --> 00:07:10,234 OK. And you weren't quiet about it. 88 00:07:28,167 --> 00:07:32,033 The people that were close to Steve knew he was harmless. 89 00:07:32,100 --> 00:07:35,501 He was always happy, happy, happy. Always laughing. 90 00:07:35,567 --> 00:07:37,934 Always wanted to make other people laugh. 91 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:43,634 I think the people in the outside community viewed him as an Avery. 92 00:07:43,701 --> 00:07:46,767 You know, viewed him as troublemaker. 93 00:07:46,834 --> 00:07:49,467 You know, "There goes another Avery. They're all trouble." 94 00:08:00,701 --> 00:08:05,834 Manitowoc County is working-class farmers. 95 00:08:05,901 --> 00:08:10,667 And the Avery family, they weren't that. They dealt in junk. 96 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,501 They had a salvage yard. They lived on Avery Road. 97 00:08:15,567 --> 00:08:17,934 I mean, they had their own road and stuff. 98 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:19,767 They didn't dress like everybody else, 99 00:08:19,834 --> 00:08:22,167 they didn't have education like other people, 100 00:08:22,234 --> 00:08:24,868 they weren't involved in all the community activities. 101 00:08:25,634 --> 00:08:27,834 I don't think it ever crossed their mind 102 00:08:27,901 --> 00:08:30,467 that they should try to fit into the community. 103 00:08:30,534 --> 00:08:34,400 They fit into the community they had built, and that was enough. 104 00:08:41,234 --> 00:08:44,467 Growing up with all them cars, you know, it was pretty fun. 105 00:08:45,467 --> 00:08:50,300 Tearing them apart, fixing them... running around in the trails, 106 00:08:50,367 --> 00:08:52,367 in the rows of the cars. 107 00:08:53,834 --> 00:08:58,934 Once, we had a car up there in the back with the motor out and everything else 108 00:08:59,067 --> 00:09:01,801 and we had a bed back there 109 00:09:01,868 --> 00:09:04,767 and then we had a battery in it, so we could listen to the radio, 110 00:09:04,834 --> 00:09:06,667 talk, goof around. 111 00:09:08,534 --> 00:09:10,634 You know, I had a nice childhood. 112 00:09:13,868 --> 00:09:16,367 The family sticks together. 113 00:09:16,434 --> 00:09:18,667 They have a very strong sense of family. 114 00:09:18,734 --> 00:09:21,267 They support each other. Um... 115 00:09:21,334 --> 00:09:24,167 They do a number of things that are quite admirable. 116 00:09:24,234 --> 00:09:27,234 But they have also been in trouble from time to time. 117 00:09:27,300 --> 00:09:30,100 Nothing like the problems that Steven's been in. 118 00:09:32,267 --> 00:09:34,834 I really ain't got much on my record. 119 00:09:35,834 --> 00:09:38,300 Two burglaries with my friends. 120 00:09:39,267 --> 00:09:42,667 We just rode around, get something to do. 121 00:09:42,734 --> 00:09:45,934 And we decided to rob a tavern and that... 122 00:09:48,367 --> 00:09:52,634 was the first time that I got busted with them friends. 123 00:09:57,367 --> 00:09:59,167 Another mistake I did... 124 00:09:59,234 --> 00:10:00,901 I had a bunch of friends over, 125 00:10:00,968 --> 00:10:03,400 and we were fooling around with the cat... 126 00:10:04,334 --> 00:10:07,367 and, I don't know, they were kind of negging it on and... 127 00:10:07,634 --> 00:10:12,133 I tossed him over the fire... and he lit up. 128 00:10:13,367 --> 00:10:15,734 You know, it was the family cat. 129 00:10:18,501 --> 00:10:21,801 I was young and stupid 130 00:10:21,868 --> 00:10:24,901 and hanging around with the wrong people. 131 00:10:26,634 --> 00:10:30,000 Stevie did do a lot of stupid things. 132 00:10:30,067 --> 00:10:32,667 But he always, always owned up to everything he did wrong. 133 00:10:32,734 --> 00:10:35,033 He never said, "No it wasn't me." 134 00:10:35,100 --> 00:10:38,467 He said, "Yeah, it was me. I did it." And paid his fine, sat in jail, 135 00:10:38,534 --> 00:10:40,133 whatever it was and it was no big deal. 136 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:42,767 He... Let's get on with life then. 137 00:10:48,767 --> 00:10:52,701 She was pretty, beautiful, that's what I thought. 138 00:10:52,767 --> 00:10:54,934 She had a good head on her shoulders. 139 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,234 She was making it on her own. 140 00:10:57,300 --> 00:11:00,968 And she had Jason. Jason was just a baby. 141 00:11:01,033 --> 00:11:04,467 And she told me that his father didn't want nothing to do with him. 142 00:11:04,534 --> 00:11:07,434 So, I says, "I'll take over, then." 143 00:11:08,601 --> 00:11:10,567 Family's partway made. 144 00:11:10,634 --> 00:11:14,133 So I'm like, "Well, I might as well give it a shot." 145 00:11:15,167 --> 00:11:19,234 July 24, 1982, a judge married us. 146 00:11:19,300 --> 00:11:24,968 Then after that, her ma and dad threw a little wedding party there in the garage. 147 00:11:27,534 --> 00:11:29,567 From there, the kids. 148 00:11:29,634 --> 00:11:32,634 Rachel was born. I didn't see her born 149 00:11:32,701 --> 00:11:36,033 because I was locked up for that cat incident. 150 00:11:36,100 --> 00:11:38,100 It kinda sucked. 151 00:11:38,167 --> 00:11:41,033 You know, you're supposed to be bringing your kid into the world... 152 00:11:42,133 --> 00:11:44,033 and then you gotta miss it. 153 00:11:46,067 --> 00:11:48,601 And then Jenny, I seen Jenny born. 154 00:11:51,534 --> 00:11:54,334 I think I had a... a good life. 155 00:11:55,801 --> 00:11:58,167 Till all the trouble started. 156 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,467 Sandy Morris and Bill Morris, 157 00:12:03,534 --> 00:12:09,100 they were always picking on Stevie, more or less, you know. 158 00:12:09,167 --> 00:12:14,968 Saying stuff about Steve that... that wasn't true. 159 00:12:15,033 --> 00:12:17,701 And Steve didn't like that, you know. 160 00:12:19,033 --> 00:12:21,801 But I told Steven, "Leave it alone." 161 00:12:21,868 --> 00:12:26,701 In 1985, do you remember the morning in January 162 00:12:26,767 --> 00:12:29,067 when you were forced off the road by Steven? 163 00:12:29,133 --> 00:12:30,801 Yes. 164 00:12:32,567 --> 00:12:36,834 The interview is being conducted January 3, 1985, 165 00:12:36,901 --> 00:12:40,634 by Detective Larry Conrad of the Manitowoc County Sheriff's Department. 166 00:12:40,701 --> 00:12:44,334 Steve, I'd like to ask you if you would explain in your own words 167 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:46,434 exactly what happened. 168 00:12:46,501 --> 00:12:51,534 It was 4:30, quarter to 5, and I let the dog out 169 00:12:51,601 --> 00:12:53,801 and started up the cars to warm them up and... 170 00:12:53,868 --> 00:12:56,100 I seen her come by and then I went down the road 171 00:12:56,167 --> 00:12:58,667 and I just pulled alongside of her. 172 00:12:58,734 --> 00:13:01,968 And then we hit and she went into a little skid. 173 00:13:02,033 --> 00:13:04,067 Did she ever go down into the ditch? 174 00:13:04,133 --> 00:13:05,701 No. 175 00:13:05,767 --> 00:13:09,767 OK, once she stopped her car, what was the next thing you did? 176 00:13:09,834 --> 00:13:15,200 I got out, and I grabbed a gun and she asked me what I was doing. 177 00:13:15,267 --> 00:13:18,467 - Was your gun loaded? - No, it was empty. 178 00:13:18,534 --> 00:13:20,200 The shells were at home. 179 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:24,534 And you know Sandy Morris personally? Is she a relative of yours? 180 00:13:24,601 --> 00:13:25,667 Yeah. 181 00:13:26,667 --> 00:13:29,033 Steve, can you tell me in your own words 182 00:13:29,100 --> 00:13:35,267 why you ran Sandy off the road and pointed a gun at her? 183 00:13:35,334 --> 00:13:38,601 Because she was spreading rumors that I was on the front lawn 184 00:13:38,667 --> 00:13:40,467 and on the road, bare ass, 185 00:13:40,534 --> 00:13:44,234 and she was telling everybody about it and it wasn't true. 186 00:13:44,300 --> 00:13:46,667 - Was this bothering you? - Yeah. 187 00:13:46,734 --> 00:13:51,601 Did you feel by taking the type of action you did earlier today 188 00:13:51,667 --> 00:13:54,133 that this would stop the problem? 189 00:13:56,601 --> 00:13:58,234 I was hoping, yeah. 190 00:14:00,567 --> 00:14:02,934 Steven's actions didn't get what he was hoping. 191 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:06,501 Sandy Morris happened to be married to a Manitowoc County sheriff's deputy. 192 00:14:06,567 --> 00:14:10,701 And she immediately went to the Sheriff's Department and filed a complaint... 193 00:14:11,601 --> 00:14:15,634 that minimized her involvement in provoking the incident 194 00:14:15,701 --> 00:14:17,868 and maximized the alleged danger. 195 00:14:22,334 --> 00:14:25,067 I got his old records. It was usually my practice 196 00:14:25,133 --> 00:14:27,400 to get all the information I could on the client. 197 00:14:27,467 --> 00:14:32,133 Steven's school records showed that he had barely functioned in school. 198 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:35,801 And one of the things I remember was that his IQ was 70. 199 00:14:35,868 --> 00:14:41,667 Which gave me an idea of his coping skills and why that action made sense to him. 200 00:14:45,601 --> 00:14:49,033 I didn't know what to do, how to handle it. 201 00:14:49,901 --> 00:14:53,033 You know, 'cause it was putting too much pressure on me. 202 00:14:53,100 --> 00:14:56,400 People would come up to me and say, "You're doin' that? You're doin' that?" 203 00:14:56,467 --> 00:15:00,100 No. Not in the middle of winter. In the middle of the road? 204 00:15:00,968 --> 00:15:02,868 It made me look like a... 205 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:05,968 like I was a no good person. 206 00:15:08,934 --> 00:15:12,501 Why did she start that? I have no idea. 207 00:15:12,567 --> 00:15:15,634 But I don't think it was very nice of her. 208 00:15:15,701 --> 00:15:18,767 Just 'cause you're married to law enforcement 209 00:15:18,834 --> 00:15:22,801 doesn't give you the right to... to take somebody's name down like that. 210 00:15:22,868 --> 00:15:24,100 That was just wrong. 211 00:15:25,567 --> 00:15:27,334 The Sheriff's Department responded 212 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:31,467 by really going after this case heavily. 213 00:15:31,534 --> 00:15:35,133 More heavily than I think they would've if it was somebody else. 214 00:15:36,067 --> 00:15:40,367 I think Steven was a representative in that case of the entire Avery family 215 00:15:40,434 --> 00:15:45,534 and how the Sheriff's Department saw them as kind of a problem 216 00:15:45,601 --> 00:15:49,367 and definitely, uh, undesirable members of the community, 217 00:15:49,434 --> 00:15:50,801 for lack of a better term. 218 00:15:50,868 --> 00:15:55,734 And the Morris case gave them a chance to claim a violent felony 219 00:15:55,801 --> 00:15:57,734 had been committed by one of the Averys. 220 00:15:57,801 --> 00:16:02,100 And of course... the Sheriff's Department and the DA took it and ran. 221 00:16:13,634 --> 00:16:15,467 I don't want to be a criminal. 222 00:16:16,734 --> 00:16:23,300 I want to be normal. 223 00:16:39,868 --> 00:16:43,567 After Lori had the twins, he came over to my parents' house 224 00:16:43,634 --> 00:16:45,934 instead of taking poor Lori home. 225 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:48,467 You know, with them twin boys and the girls. 226 00:16:48,534 --> 00:16:50,934 He had to come over to my parents' and show us, you know, 227 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:52,968 his happy, healthy baby boys. 228 00:16:53,033 --> 00:16:55,968 Grin on his face from ear to ear, I think, forever. 229 00:16:56,033 --> 00:16:59,501 He probably still has a grin when you talk about the boys. 230 00:17:01,434 --> 00:17:05,567 He was over the moon. He was just so proud. 231 00:17:05,634 --> 00:17:06,868 And he was proud of Lori. 232 00:17:06,934 --> 00:17:09,601 He was proud that she wanted him 233 00:17:09,667 --> 00:17:11,634 and married him and all those kinds of things. 234 00:17:11,701 --> 00:17:15,067 He just thought his life was set. Really, he did. 235 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:18,534 And that makes what happened all the worse. 236 00:17:30,834 --> 00:17:33,467 July 29th, 1985. 237 00:17:33,534 --> 00:17:35,501 It was a warm, sunny day, 238 00:17:35,567 --> 00:17:39,934 and Penny Beerntsen and her husband went to the beach on Lake Michigan. 239 00:17:41,667 --> 00:17:43,501 About 3:00 that afternoon, 240 00:17:43,567 --> 00:17:46,667 Penny started jogging north along Lake Michigan. 241 00:17:49,067 --> 00:17:54,367 She passed a person who was wearing a black leather jacket. 242 00:17:54,434 --> 00:17:57,667 Now, it was summer and it was 85 degrees probably. 243 00:17:57,734 --> 00:17:59,067 So it was an odd thing. 244 00:17:59,133 --> 00:18:03,968 And he said something to the effect of, "It's a nice day for a jog, isn't it?" 245 00:18:05,734 --> 00:18:10,033 Penny was on her way back, and she could see ahead of her 246 00:18:10,100 --> 00:18:14,000 that same man that she had passed earlier. 247 00:18:14,067 --> 00:18:17,901 And he was directly in her path. 248 00:18:19,367 --> 00:18:23,267 To get away from him, she ran into the water. 249 00:18:23,334 --> 00:18:27,133 But he grabbed her and dragged her off into the woods. 250 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:32,067 He knocked her down. 251 00:18:32,133 --> 00:18:35,701 She was clawing at him, and he attempted to rape her, 252 00:18:35,767 --> 00:18:38,834 but he didn't succeed in penetrating her. 253 00:18:40,033 --> 00:18:43,868 He ripped her clothes off, he sexually assaulted her, 254 00:18:43,934 --> 00:18:46,701 he beat her up and basically left her for dead. 255 00:18:49,934 --> 00:18:51,567 It was just real horrific. 256 00:18:51,634 --> 00:18:54,601 The kind of injuries she had to her upper body 257 00:18:54,667 --> 00:18:57,367 could only be done if someone's basically in your face. 258 00:18:57,434 --> 00:18:58,801 So it was very personal. 259 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:10,968 After Mrs. Beerntsen was taken to the hospital, 260 00:19:11,067 --> 00:19:15,267 it turned out that Sandra Morris' friend, Judy Dvorak, 261 00:19:15,334 --> 00:19:18,968 was the deputy sheriff who was assigned to go to the hospital, 262 00:19:19,033 --> 00:19:23,133 and this is where the Sandra Morris matter makes a difference, 263 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,901 because when Penny Beerntsen describes her assailant, 264 00:19:26,968 --> 00:19:31,000 Judy Dvorak says, "That sounds like Steven Avery." 265 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,767 Judy Dvorak lived across the road from him at that time. 266 00:19:41,834 --> 00:19:46,901 And she definitely did not like Steven. She had no use for him at all. 267 00:19:46,968 --> 00:19:51,934 And I think that boils down to the fact that her and Sandy Morris were close, 268 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:53,567 very close friends. 269 00:19:58,601 --> 00:20:01,501 You're the one who prepared the incident report 270 00:20:01,567 --> 00:20:04,234 and asked Mrs. Beerntsen to read it and sign it. 271 00:20:04,300 --> 00:20:06,000 - Yes, sir. - All right. 272 00:20:06,067 --> 00:20:09,267 "Beerntsen told Deputy Dvorak and the sheriff 273 00:20:09,334 --> 00:20:14,000 that she was unable to read the statement because of her blurred vision. 274 00:20:14,067 --> 00:20:17,634 Beerntsen was told to sign the document anyhow." 275 00:20:17,701 --> 00:20:21,534 Did you tell Mrs. Beerntsen to sign the document anyhow? 276 00:20:21,601 --> 00:20:23,767 I do not remember ever saying that. 277 00:20:23,834 --> 00:20:28,200 Did Sheriff Kocourek tell Mrs. Beerntsen to sign the document anyhow? 278 00:20:29,901 --> 00:20:33,601 I have no recollection of ever hearing that. 279 00:20:35,534 --> 00:20:38,200 I was told by other detectives that, at that point, 280 00:20:38,267 --> 00:20:43,067 they've got a photograph of Stevie from the old jail records. 281 00:20:43,133 --> 00:20:46,167 They brought it down, and the chief deputy, 282 00:20:46,234 --> 00:20:50,734 Eugene Kusche that time, made a composite drawing of that photograph, 283 00:20:50,801 --> 00:20:53,868 rather than doing it from her memory. 284 00:20:53,934 --> 00:20:56,033 And then they showed that to Mrs. Beerntsen... 285 00:20:57,067 --> 00:20:58,968 who said, "Yeah, that's him." 286 00:20:59,100 --> 00:21:03,467 Then they took that jail photograph and did a photo lineup. 287 00:21:03,534 --> 00:21:07,000 And Mrs. Beerntsen picked out that photograph. 288 00:21:08,501 --> 00:21:11,567 I mean, if you look at Penny Beerntsen's original description, 289 00:21:11,634 --> 00:21:15,801 as far as height, weight, eye color, all kinds of stuff, 290 00:21:15,868 --> 00:21:17,534 Steven did not fit that description. 291 00:21:17,601 --> 00:21:19,834 Steven's hair didn't fit, the build, everything. 292 00:21:19,901 --> 00:21:24,467 He didn't fit that description. But Judy Dvorak said he did. I mean, wow. 293 00:21:24,534 --> 00:21:27,601 So they show Penny Beerntsen Steven's picture, 294 00:21:27,667 --> 00:21:29,968 and then she sees a lineup later 295 00:21:30,033 --> 00:21:32,400 and Steven is the only person she's seen before. 296 00:21:32,467 --> 00:21:36,100 Plus, she had the sheriff's deputy saying, "Gee, I think it sounds like this guy." 297 00:21:36,167 --> 00:21:38,400 That's pretty suggestive. 298 00:21:42,834 --> 00:21:48,901 Mr. Kusche, I have one large framed composite drawing, 299 00:21:48,968 --> 00:21:52,868 if we could bring that up on the table and put it in camera range. 300 00:21:52,934 --> 00:21:53,934 Yes, sir. 301 00:21:54,801 --> 00:21:57,734 - Did you cause this to be framed? - Yes, sir. 302 00:21:57,801 --> 00:22:00,334 OK. Why'd you do that? 303 00:22:00,601 --> 00:22:03,400 It was my first composite. 304 00:22:03,467 --> 00:22:08,734 It was the only one I ever did that was used in a court case. 305 00:22:08,801 --> 00:22:11,901 And I thought it'd make a interesting, uh... 306 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:15,300 display in my office. 307 00:22:16,267 --> 00:22:19,801 Would you agree with me that it's pretty remarkably coincidental 308 00:22:19,868 --> 00:22:24,067 that that would depict Steven Avery's January 1985 mug photo, 309 00:22:24,133 --> 00:22:26,167 which was available to you that evening? 310 00:22:27,133 --> 00:22:29,667 One, the photo wasn't available to me. 311 00:22:30,601 --> 00:22:32,100 - No? - No. 312 00:22:33,033 --> 00:22:34,133 It wasn't in the array? 313 00:22:35,968 --> 00:22:39,634 - After I drew the sketch, I saw it. - OK, so it was available to you. 314 00:22:39,701 --> 00:22:41,734 - No. - It was around that evening, 315 00:22:41,801 --> 00:22:45,267 it had been brought over from the jail to the hospital, right? 316 00:22:45,334 --> 00:22:47,567 - I don't know when it arrived. - You're just saying... 317 00:22:47,634 --> 00:22:50,033 You're telling us under oath you didn't look at it. 318 00:22:50,100 --> 00:22:52,601 I'm telling you I didn't see it 319 00:22:52,667 --> 00:22:55,701 and I didn't know if it was there before I started the sketch either. 320 00:22:56,067 --> 00:23:00,300 My sketch is what the victim had me draw... 321 00:23:00,367 --> 00:23:02,067 - Right. - ...as what she saw. 322 00:23:02,133 --> 00:23:04,934 We were able to present embarrassingly, 323 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:09,133 the difference between an older photograph and what we then had, 324 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:14,467 which was the photograph from that night as to how Steven Avery actually looked. 325 00:23:14,534 --> 00:23:18,501 That opened the door to us being able to argue 326 00:23:18,567 --> 00:23:22,100 that Kusche drew the composite 327 00:23:22,167 --> 00:23:26,000 from the photograph of Steven Avery 328 00:23:26,067 --> 00:23:29,200 that was already in their files. 329 00:23:33,434 --> 00:23:35,200 And to argue that... 330 00:23:35,267 --> 00:23:39,934 that never would've happened without the sheriff's participation as well. 331 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:46,100 In other words, they made the case against Steven Avery that night themselves. 332 00:23:57,167 --> 00:24:01,200 The sheriff told me "I got you now" when I got to jail. 333 00:24:02,634 --> 00:24:04,667 And the other cops couldn't do nothing. 334 00:24:04,734 --> 00:24:06,133 Nobody could do nothing. 335 00:24:07,267 --> 00:24:09,234 He had all the power. 336 00:24:17,100 --> 00:24:19,467 The public defender's office got a list every day 337 00:24:19,534 --> 00:24:22,033 of who had been arrested the night before. 338 00:24:22,100 --> 00:24:25,667 And that was so the public defender could go in and make sure they had an attorney 339 00:24:25,734 --> 00:24:27,901 for their first appearance. 340 00:24:27,968 --> 00:24:30,968 But Steven's name wasn't on the list. 341 00:24:31,033 --> 00:24:33,200 And the only reason I knew he was in jail... 342 00:24:33,267 --> 00:24:37,734 and they knew I was his lawyer, because Manitowoc was a small town... 343 00:24:37,801 --> 00:24:42,234 Lori called me and told me he was in jail. So I went over and asked to see him. 344 00:24:42,300 --> 00:24:45,934 And the deputy told me that the sheriff had ordered that Steven's name 345 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:49,667 not be on the jail list, that he not be allowed any access to the phone, 346 00:24:49,734 --> 00:24:53,067 which is illegal, that he not be allowed any visitors, 347 00:24:53,133 --> 00:24:55,167 and that he be held in a cell block all by himself 348 00:24:55,234 --> 00:24:57,501 so he could have no contact with anybody. 349 00:24:57,567 --> 00:25:02,133 The sheriff didn't want him to be able to talk to anybody, including a lawyer. 350 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:06,133 And I never ever saw that before or since. 351 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,033 I mean, he had a right to have a phone call, he had a right to have an attorney. 352 00:25:09,100 --> 00:25:11,434 He had a right to be treated just like anybody else. 353 00:25:14,667 --> 00:25:18,033 That Penny Beerntsen case was just treated so differently from day one, 354 00:25:18,100 --> 00:25:21,934 and it had already started with the whole Morris case. 355 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,934 Morning news. A Maribel area man remains 356 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,701 in the Manitowoc County jail without bail today 357 00:25:29,767 --> 00:25:32,033 in connection with the brutal beating and the sexual assault 358 00:25:32,100 --> 00:25:35,133 of a Manitowoc woman yesterday afternoon. 359 00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:37,501 23-year-old Steven Avery was denied bail 360 00:25:37,567 --> 00:25:40,667 on a motion of Manitowoc County District Attorney Denis Vogel, 361 00:25:40,734 --> 00:25:42,534 who cited Avery's past record. 362 00:25:46,667 --> 00:25:49,467 This is not only a violent sexual assault, 363 00:25:49,534 --> 00:25:54,601 it's a violent sexual assault of someone who is a leader of the community. 364 00:25:54,667 --> 00:26:00,067 I mean, a shining example of what Manitowoc would like its citizens to be. 365 00:26:00,133 --> 00:26:04,200 The Beerntsens owned commercial enterprises that were popular 366 00:26:04,267 --> 00:26:08,601 and occupied a central place in the town. 367 00:26:08,667 --> 00:26:11,467 Tom Beerntsen was described as being one of the best things 368 00:26:11,534 --> 00:26:14,501 to happen to Manitowoc in the last decade. 369 00:26:14,567 --> 00:26:18,968 The Beerntsens were clearly people of substance in that community. 370 00:26:19,033 --> 00:26:23,200 When this happened, I think the sheriff just wanted to get quick results 371 00:26:23,267 --> 00:26:25,868 and get a suspect behind bars. 372 00:26:25,934 --> 00:26:29,901 It was the only time in 20 years of criminal defense practice 373 00:26:29,968 --> 00:26:34,467 that I ever saw a sheriff that involved in a case from day one. 374 00:26:36,167 --> 00:26:38,567 I was absolutely devastated. 375 00:26:38,634 --> 00:26:42,267 It's like, why would they arrest Steve for that? 376 00:26:42,334 --> 00:26:44,534 That was so out of his character. 377 00:26:44,601 --> 00:26:48,167 People believed he did it, though, because he was an Avery. 378 00:27:08,033 --> 00:27:10,701 Whatever I learned about the case, 379 00:27:10,767 --> 00:27:16,267 any of the notions that I had personally, uh... 380 00:27:16,334 --> 00:27:18,601 came from the police and the courts. 381 00:27:19,667 --> 00:27:23,133 Each morning you see if there's anything going on in the Sheriff's Department. 382 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,868 I knew Tom Kocourek well. 383 00:27:25,934 --> 00:27:29,734 I knew District Attorney Denis Vogel quite well because we visited with him 384 00:27:29,801 --> 00:27:33,734 on cases all the time. He was kind of a part of our newsbeat. 385 00:27:33,801 --> 00:27:37,634 So Steven Avery was on that beat. 386 00:27:37,701 --> 00:27:41,801 We get acquainted with all the regular names and he was one of them. 387 00:27:42,968 --> 00:27:46,968 When his name came up as the guy that they were holding, it was... 388 00:27:47,033 --> 00:27:50,934 Oh, that would be within, you know, that's in character. 389 00:27:52,367 --> 00:27:57,567 The event involving the deputy sheriff's wife was still pending. 390 00:27:57,634 --> 00:28:00,901 And I think that was on everybody's mind. 391 00:28:02,167 --> 00:28:07,100 The case really turned on the fact that violence was a real, recurring, 392 00:28:07,167 --> 00:28:11,534 regular part of his life, that women seemed to be the victims. 393 00:28:19,334 --> 00:28:23,234 There isn't one iota of physical evidence in this case 394 00:28:23,300 --> 00:28:25,434 that connects Steven Avery to it. 395 00:28:25,501 --> 00:28:27,934 The sheriff was told by the police, 396 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:29,634 "You have the wrong guy. 397 00:28:29,701 --> 00:28:32,167 You need to be aware about this Gregory Allen." 398 00:28:34,968 --> 00:28:41,033 Gregory Allen, who had a long criminal history for sexual crimes, 399 00:28:41,100 --> 00:28:46,801 for the use of violence, was operating on an escalating basis 400 00:28:46,868 --> 00:28:48,767 in the Manitowoc area. 401 00:28:48,834 --> 00:28:52,834 So much so that the city of Manitowoc Police Department 402 00:28:52,901 --> 00:28:57,968 was actually surveilling Gregory Allen on a daily continuing basis. 403 00:28:58,033 --> 00:29:01,200 However, as fate would have it, 404 00:29:01,267 --> 00:29:04,400 on the afternoon of July 29th, 405 00:29:04,467 --> 00:29:06,734 the officers assigned to do the surveillance 406 00:29:06,801 --> 00:29:10,467 were called to investigate other crimes. 407 00:29:10,534 --> 00:29:13,767 So at the very time that Mrs. Beerntsen was assaulted, 408 00:29:13,834 --> 00:29:16,567 Gregory Allen was not under surveillance. 409 00:29:16,634 --> 00:29:22,167 Needless to say, when the story surfaced amongst the police communities, 410 00:29:22,234 --> 00:29:26,701 detective Thomas Bergner from the Manitowoc City Police Department 411 00:29:26,767 --> 00:29:30,701 went to see the sheriff and disclosed to him 412 00:29:30,767 --> 00:29:34,200 this information respecting Gregory Allen. 413 00:29:34,267 --> 00:29:38,501 Essentially, the sheriff told him not to bother, 414 00:29:38,567 --> 00:29:41,300 that they had their man, Steven Avery. 415 00:29:45,467 --> 00:29:50,167 Now, in our opinion, that fact alone is bad enough. 416 00:29:50,234 --> 00:29:51,901 But more than that fact alone, 417 00:29:51,968 --> 00:29:55,467 three women in the district attorney's office, 418 00:29:55,534 --> 00:29:57,834 based on their knowledge of Gregory Allen, 419 00:29:57,901 --> 00:30:00,968 they thought that the police had the wrong person, 420 00:30:01,033 --> 00:30:05,300 and they told their boss, District Attorney Denis Vogel, 421 00:30:05,367 --> 00:30:10,634 "You've got the wrong guy. It's not Steven Avery, it's Gregory Allen." 422 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,801 Tom Kocourek told Stevie, 423 00:30:17,868 --> 00:30:21,167 "I don't care if you did this or if you didn't do it. 424 00:30:21,234 --> 00:30:22,834 I'm gonna get you for it." 425 00:30:22,901 --> 00:30:26,267 Now, is that anything to say to anybody? 426 00:30:26,334 --> 00:30:28,367 And what did he do? 427 00:30:28,434 --> 00:30:31,133 That goddamn Denis Vogel, 428 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,167 and that son of a bitchin' Hazlewood, the judge... 429 00:30:34,234 --> 00:30:37,300 Steve had 22 witnesses at least. 430 00:30:37,367 --> 00:30:39,300 And there was one of them right there. 431 00:30:39,367 --> 00:30:42,534 And every one of us were called fabricators, liars. 432 00:30:44,901 --> 00:30:46,868 If the alibi witnesses were believed, 433 00:30:46,934 --> 00:30:49,801 there would be no way to find him guilty. 434 00:30:49,868 --> 00:30:52,734 Steve Avery was accounted for every minute, 435 00:30:52,801 --> 00:30:58,601 from about 1:30 that afternoon until, um... 436 00:30:58,667 --> 00:31:00,801 you know, at least 5:00. 437 00:31:02,434 --> 00:31:06,367 The victim was sexually assaulted at approximately 3:50. 438 00:31:07,467 --> 00:31:11,534 All of these alibi witnesses testified that on the day of the assault, 439 00:31:11,601 --> 00:31:14,467 Steve Avery was helping his parents and other family members 440 00:31:14,534 --> 00:31:17,601 pour concrete at the salvage yard. 441 00:31:17,667 --> 00:31:21,000 The cement truck arrived sometime between 1:00 and 2:00. 442 00:31:21,067 --> 00:31:24,501 Witnesses testified either that they were out working with him, 443 00:31:24,567 --> 00:31:26,601 pouring the concrete, or they were in the house 444 00:31:26,667 --> 00:31:29,434 watching Divorce Court from 3:00 to 3:30 445 00:31:29,501 --> 00:31:32,634 and saw Steve Avery immediately afterwards. 446 00:31:34,133 --> 00:31:38,000 Steve Avery then took his sister in his four-by-four car 447 00:31:38,067 --> 00:31:40,501 out to a local gravel pit. 448 00:31:40,567 --> 00:31:42,300 They got stuck out there, they had to dig it out. 449 00:31:42,367 --> 00:31:45,267 They got back right around 4:00. 450 00:31:45,334 --> 00:31:49,334 At that point, Steve Avery picked up his wife and his children. 451 00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:52,767 He had two very young babies that had just been born a few days earlier. 452 00:31:52,834 --> 00:31:54,534 And then they went to Green Bay. 453 00:31:54,601 --> 00:31:56,567 It was about a 35 minute drive to Green Bay. 454 00:31:56,634 --> 00:32:00,634 They washed the car, they got something to eat, they went to the Shopko store. 455 00:32:00,701 --> 00:32:05,067 Evidence was presented of a receipt giving the time at 5:13, 456 00:32:05,133 --> 00:32:07,701 and when he came back from Green Bay with his wife, 457 00:32:07,767 --> 00:32:10,701 he called his brother Earl to have him come over 458 00:32:10,767 --> 00:32:13,100 and help do some drywall in his house. 459 00:32:13,167 --> 00:32:15,467 And that they did that in the evening, 460 00:32:15,534 --> 00:32:17,501 finally going to bed, 461 00:32:17,567 --> 00:32:20,300 which is about the time that the police then arrive. 462 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:34,567 When I kicked him, he said, 463 00:32:34,634 --> 00:32:37,067 "Now you're gonna die, now I'm gonna kill you." 464 00:32:39,467 --> 00:32:40,968 And what did he do then? 465 00:32:41,033 --> 00:32:46,067 Then he put his hands on my neck, and he started choking me very hard. 466 00:32:46,934 --> 00:32:49,801 Penny Beerntsen was everything that Steven wasn't. 467 00:32:50,868 --> 00:32:54,300 Smart, educated, well-to-do, church-going lady, 468 00:32:54,367 --> 00:32:58,667 a business owner, involved in community affairs. 469 00:32:58,734 --> 00:33:01,868 So just think of the two of them, side by side. 470 00:33:03,667 --> 00:33:06,567 Mrs. Beerntsen, she's a very good witness. 471 00:33:06,634 --> 00:33:08,033 She was very positive. 472 00:33:08,100 --> 00:33:12,367 She stated that she'd made a point when the crime was being committed 473 00:33:12,434 --> 00:33:15,868 of remembering who it was who was doing this to her. 474 00:33:15,934 --> 00:33:20,067 And, uh, that... that carried the day. 475 00:33:22,934 --> 00:33:26,501 Were you able to pick out anyone in that live line-up? 476 00:33:26,567 --> 00:33:27,567 Yes, I was. 477 00:33:27,634 --> 00:33:30,534 And do you have an opinion as to whether or not the person you picked out 478 00:33:30,601 --> 00:33:33,901 in the live line-up is the same as the person you picked out today? 479 00:33:33,968 --> 00:33:36,734 - Yes, it is the same person. - And are you positive of that? 480 00:33:36,801 --> 00:33:38,968 I am absolutely positive. 481 00:33:42,834 --> 00:33:45,100 The whole thing was a nightmare. 482 00:33:46,634 --> 00:33:48,701 How do you think a man feels? 483 00:33:48,767 --> 00:33:52,601 You see your son sitting right there, 484 00:33:52,667 --> 00:33:57,033 and he's... and he's saying, the tears are coming out of his eyes... 485 00:33:59,701 --> 00:34:02,067 "I didn't do it." He said... 486 00:34:05,934 --> 00:34:08,901 "I'm innocent. I didn't do it." 487 00:34:10,934 --> 00:34:14,434 And you know he didn't do it. You were with him, you know. 488 00:34:19,467 --> 00:34:21,334 It's hard to take. 489 00:34:51,634 --> 00:34:53,934 In Wisconsin, the way the parole system was set up 490 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,300 is if you didn't admit your guilt, you did not get paroled. 491 00:34:57,367 --> 00:35:00,367 And of course Steven didn't admit his guilt because he wasn't guilty. 492 00:35:00,434 --> 00:35:03,400 So that meant he wasn't gonna get paroled. 493 00:35:04,834 --> 00:35:09,767 He watched people who actually had murdered somebody walk out. 494 00:35:10,968 --> 00:35:12,667 And he sat there. 495 00:35:13,968 --> 00:35:16,267 If I did it, I'll admit right away. 496 00:35:16,334 --> 00:35:18,801 I'll take the punishment, I'll do the time. 497 00:35:18,868 --> 00:35:22,667 But I don't break for something I didn't do. 498 00:35:22,734 --> 00:35:24,701 I'll stay strong. 499 00:35:26,801 --> 00:35:28,667 I'll never fail. 500 00:35:45,534 --> 00:35:50,868 Dolores would take the kids to see Stevie about sometimes two or three times a week. 501 00:35:51,701 --> 00:35:54,667 To Green Bay and that, you know, to see Steve. 502 00:35:54,734 --> 00:35:59,534 A lot of times I was by myself, but I'd still go. 503 00:35:59,601 --> 00:36:01,467 Just to go see him. 504 00:36:04,367 --> 00:36:07,167 It was Fox Lake, 505 00:36:07,234 --> 00:36:09,667 Green Bay, 506 00:36:09,734 --> 00:36:13,400 - Tennessee and Stanley. - At the end there... 507 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,334 I used to go to all of them, even if it was icy. 508 00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:20,567 I drove on clear ice. 509 00:36:22,834 --> 00:36:26,767 With Lori, I suppose it was hard for her to watch the kids. 510 00:36:26,834 --> 00:36:30,133 That was a bunch of kids to watch. 511 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:31,934 And she was alone. 512 00:36:34,167 --> 00:36:37,734 I don't know if she thought he would ever get out or not. 513 00:36:39,634 --> 00:36:43,234 With me and my wife, it was tough. 514 00:36:44,667 --> 00:36:46,267 We was fighting. 515 00:36:48,734 --> 00:36:50,667 She'd tell me she can't take it no more. 516 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,467 And she started with she was gonna kill the kids, 517 00:36:54,534 --> 00:36:58,467 then commit suicide and everything else. 518 00:36:58,534 --> 00:37:03,467 A lot of back and forth, a lot of hate and... 519 00:37:03,534 --> 00:37:05,667 I wrote some bad letters. 520 00:37:07,667 --> 00:37:12,000 It lasted about three years... and then I told her to go for the divorce. 521 00:37:13,334 --> 00:37:15,801 You know, we just got where... 522 00:37:16,667 --> 00:37:19,667 we didn't care about each other or nothing. 523 00:37:24,100 --> 00:37:28,601 He loved Lori and he loved the kids. But he ended up with nothing. 524 00:37:37,467 --> 00:37:42,467 When she took the kids away from me then... I tried to stay busy, 525 00:37:42,534 --> 00:37:45,567 I kept my mind occupied. 526 00:37:45,634 --> 00:37:48,868 Like when I was in Green Bay, I did auto body for nine years. 527 00:37:49,934 --> 00:37:55,367 All day, I got my mind working on cars and paint and everything else. 528 00:37:57,100 --> 00:37:58,801 But then when that's all done, 529 00:37:58,868 --> 00:38:02,501 come back and take a shower and then you sit in a room 530 00:38:02,567 --> 00:38:04,400 and listen to the bars. 531 00:38:08,667 --> 00:38:12,167 His mother and dad stuck by him the most. 532 00:38:12,234 --> 00:38:16,167 Mainly his mother. Mainly his mother. 533 00:38:16,234 --> 00:38:20,167 She stuck by him all those years he was in prison. 534 00:38:20,234 --> 00:38:24,067 So did my brother. All the money they had, it went towards getting him out of prison, 535 00:38:24,133 --> 00:38:26,133 saying he was innocent. 536 00:38:36,501 --> 00:38:42,767 Steven and his parents came to us, I think at the stage that, 537 00:38:42,834 --> 00:38:46,634 you know, they decided this was kind of their one last gasp. 538 00:38:53,267 --> 00:38:57,734 The problem was that virtually all the issues that would arise 539 00:38:57,801 --> 00:39:00,901 from the conviction itself had already been litigated 540 00:39:00,968 --> 00:39:05,133 and had already been decided adversely to Steven. 541 00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:07,868 It essentially came down to a requirement 542 00:39:07,934 --> 00:39:09,968 that we come up with some newly discovered evidence. 543 00:39:11,467 --> 00:39:17,000 Rob Henak had to root around in the Manitowoc courthouse, 544 00:39:17,067 --> 00:39:20,267 eventually having the clerks help find boxes. 545 00:39:21,434 --> 00:39:25,400 And then going through the boxes and finding samples of things. 546 00:39:25,467 --> 00:39:29,400 We noted that the sex crimes kit had been completed 547 00:39:29,467 --> 00:39:32,934 and that there were the fingernail scrapings 548 00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:35,501 that had been collected at the time. 549 00:39:35,567 --> 00:39:38,901 The science of DNA at that stage hadn't developed sufficiently. 550 00:39:38,968 --> 00:39:42,067 So nobody had really ever done anything with them. 551 00:39:42,133 --> 00:39:46,567 We had the fingernail scrapings tested by Lab Corporation of America, 552 00:39:46,634 --> 00:39:51,267 and in 1995, with the testing they're able to do, 553 00:39:51,334 --> 00:39:54,601 they're able to limit all the population of the world 554 00:39:54,667 --> 00:39:58,868 into particular groups, based on what are called alleles. 555 00:39:58,934 --> 00:40:00,100 Each of us has two alleles. 556 00:40:01,801 --> 00:40:06,300 Steve Avery and the victim have the same alleles. 557 00:40:06,367 --> 00:40:11,367 However, they found three alleles in the fingernail scrapings. 558 00:40:11,434 --> 00:40:14,934 Two of them that matched Steve Avery's and the victim's, 559 00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:16,901 and one that didn't match either of them. 560 00:40:16,968 --> 00:40:22,067 Meaning there had to be DNA from a person not Steve Avery under her fingernails. 561 00:40:24,701 --> 00:40:27,868 Our argument was that a jury could look at this evidence 562 00:40:27,934 --> 00:40:30,868 and decide that it was most likely the perpetrator. 563 00:40:30,934 --> 00:40:33,434 And when you look at all the other evidence tied together, 564 00:40:33,501 --> 00:40:38,300 the alibi evidence, the fact that the victim was wrong about the eye color, 565 00:40:38,367 --> 00:40:42,634 the fact that the victim identified the perpetrator as wearing white underwear 566 00:40:42,701 --> 00:40:44,901 when Steve Avery didn't even own underwear, 567 00:40:44,968 --> 00:40:46,667 that those kind of things would create 568 00:40:46,734 --> 00:40:48,501 a reasonable probability of a different result. 569 00:40:52,300 --> 00:40:55,901 In this instance, the DNA evidence... 570 00:40:57,767 --> 00:41:00,300 requires that the court speculate. 571 00:41:00,367 --> 00:41:04,033 Regardless of which side I look at and which argument I hear. 572 00:41:04,300 --> 00:41:07,434 The court accepted the state's argument 573 00:41:07,501 --> 00:41:10,968 that since we couldn't prove whose DNA it was, 574 00:41:11,033 --> 00:41:15,434 we couldn't discount the fact that this could've been her husband's DNA, 575 00:41:15,501 --> 00:41:18,901 one of the medical personnel's DNA, 576 00:41:18,968 --> 00:41:22,701 the couple that found Penny Beerntsen on the beach 577 00:41:22,767 --> 00:41:24,968 and comforted her and clothed her 578 00:41:25,033 --> 00:41:30,267 while they were waiting for, uh, medical assistance. Um... 579 00:41:30,334 --> 00:41:33,868 And, I mean, in my mind, and certainly in Rob's mind, 580 00:41:33,934 --> 00:41:37,467 all of that was preposterous because Penny Beerntsen had never said 581 00:41:37,534 --> 00:41:42,467 that she scraped any of those people or had any reason to claw at them. 582 00:41:42,534 --> 00:41:45,734 Nonetheless, the court ruled against us. 583 00:41:45,801 --> 00:41:48,334 The court of appeals ruled against us. 584 00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:51,334 The Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled against us. 585 00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:54,834 And if you ever want to read an opinion, by the way, 586 00:41:54,901 --> 00:42:00,033 that will show you how strongly this system is designed 587 00:42:00,100 --> 00:42:02,601 to perpetuate a conviction, 588 00:42:02,667 --> 00:42:07,400 as opposed to examine whether or not somebody could in fact be innocent, 589 00:42:07,467 --> 00:42:10,934 read the court of appeals decision in Steven Avery's case. 590 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:13,334 You would think that this was the guiltiest person 591 00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:16,300 that had ever been uncovered in a criminal case in Wisconsin. 592 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:23,601 It's now '96 or '97. 593 00:42:23,667 --> 00:42:28,767 You have exhausted every legal proceeding that is... 594 00:42:28,834 --> 00:42:30,501 remotely available to you. 595 00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,601 You've now been in this system for 12 years. 596 00:42:34,667 --> 00:42:38,801 You are a son who cares deeply about his parents. 597 00:42:38,868 --> 00:42:43,567 And his parents are getting older and older while he's sitting in this joint, 598 00:42:43,634 --> 00:42:46,834 who cares about his kids who are getting older and older. 599 00:42:46,901 --> 00:42:51,367 The pressure of that on a person to... 600 00:42:52,334 --> 00:42:54,801 wrongfully confess, if you will, 601 00:42:54,868 --> 00:42:58,601 and to say, "OK, look, um... 602 00:42:58,667 --> 00:43:03,334 I've... I've fought the good fight, I've gone through all my appellate stuff, 603 00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:06,834 I'm not getting anywhere with it, it's time to level with you guys. 604 00:43:06,901 --> 00:43:08,400 I really did this crime." 605 00:43:08,467 --> 00:43:14,567 I mean, those pressures have gotta be more intense than we can imagine. 606 00:43:15,367 --> 00:43:18,467 They always told me, "If you admit to it, we'll let you out. 607 00:43:18,534 --> 00:43:22,767 Otherwise, you'll be here until your MR." You know? 608 00:43:23,667 --> 00:43:27,400 So I guess I'll be in here 'til my MR, 'cause I ain't gonna admit to it. 609 00:43:27,467 --> 00:43:28,868 I'm not gonna lie. 610 00:43:46,300 --> 00:43:48,834 Here's the court of appeals. 611 00:43:54,033 --> 00:43:56,033 Sentencing papers. 612 00:44:00,801 --> 00:44:06,667 This one must've been in... '98. I sent transcripts out. 613 00:44:06,734 --> 00:44:10,334 A whole bunch of them. I made ten copies. 614 00:44:10,400 --> 00:44:15,467 Sit in the living room and done it on the copy machine. 615 00:44:15,534 --> 00:44:20,300 Then I put the pieces, each on the table to make ten, you know, ten of them. 616 00:44:21,667 --> 00:44:23,968 It was nerve-racking. 617 00:44:24,667 --> 00:44:27,000 I think there's about a thousand pages in 'em. 618 00:44:33,868 --> 00:44:35,901 This one went to New York. 619 00:44:38,367 --> 00:44:39,934 They went all over. 620 00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:44,300 Wherever 60 Minutes is or 20/20 or... 621 00:44:44,367 --> 00:44:46,934 I can't remember the other ones all. 622 00:44:47,934 --> 00:44:50,367 All them things that's on TV always. 623 00:44:50,434 --> 00:44:55,734 I thought they'd help Steven to get out if they read all this here script stuff. 624 00:44:55,801 --> 00:44:59,501 Then all of a sudden we got a lot of 'em back, though. 625 00:45:00,501 --> 00:45:04,400 They couldn't do it, they said, or something like that. 626 00:45:08,701 --> 00:45:11,868 Yeah, I put a lot of hours in these boxes. 627 00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:23,901 You learn to take patience, because everything... 628 00:45:23,968 --> 00:45:25,467 it takes time. 629 00:45:26,868 --> 00:45:28,501 In prison, you gotta wait. 630 00:45:29,434 --> 00:45:31,434 Nothing happens just like that. 631 00:45:33,667 --> 00:45:36,834 Anyway, they couldn't take away my love for my family and that. 632 00:45:40,901 --> 00:45:44,634 I never had bad hopes. It was always good hopes. 633 00:46:01,033 --> 00:46:03,267 Both his trial lawyer and his appellate lawyer said, 634 00:46:03,334 --> 00:46:06,501 "Could you look at this guy's case, at Steven Avery's case? 635 00:46:06,567 --> 00:46:09,167 We've been losing sleep over this case for 15 years." 636 00:46:09,234 --> 00:46:13,467 We knew the technology had advanced, so we asked for the testing again. 637 00:46:13,534 --> 00:46:15,701 The material was sent down to the crime laboratory again, 638 00:46:15,767 --> 00:46:18,234 and what they found was that there were 13 pubic hairs 639 00:46:18,300 --> 00:46:22,133 that had been collected during the pubic hair combings of the victim. 640 00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:25,200 Eleven of those hairs had no root. 641 00:46:25,267 --> 00:46:27,267 So they were down to two pubic hairs. 642 00:46:27,334 --> 00:46:32,067 One of those hairs was from a female, probably Penny Beerntsen's own hair. 643 00:46:32,133 --> 00:46:36,534 The truth in this matter came down to that one remaining pubic hair. 644 00:46:40,133 --> 00:46:44,767 They got a full profile. That profile conclusively excluded Steven Avery. 645 00:46:44,834 --> 00:46:48,200 It could not have come from him. Now we know that with certainty. 646 00:46:48,267 --> 00:46:52,400 Whether that alone would've been enough to grant him a new trial, I don't know. 647 00:46:52,467 --> 00:46:56,701 But even more dramatically, they took that profile from that pubic hair 648 00:46:56,767 --> 00:46:59,601 and they ran it through the state crime laboratory data bank 649 00:46:59,667 --> 00:47:01,167 and they got a cold hit. 650 00:47:01,234 --> 00:47:04,100 That is to say, they matched it to somebody in the data bank 651 00:47:04,167 --> 00:47:08,067 who they didn't know was in there. And that somebody was Gregory Allen. 652 00:47:27,234 --> 00:47:29,834 I feel free. 653 00:47:39,767 --> 00:47:42,167 When I left the prison, the anger left. 654 00:47:43,133 --> 00:47:44,267 It was gone. 655 00:47:45,167 --> 00:47:47,200 It stayed there, behind them gates. 656 00:47:47,934 --> 00:47:49,868 It didn't come out with me. 657 00:47:52,934 --> 00:47:54,868 I was happy when I got out. 658 00:47:55,367 --> 00:47:57,601 I probably was the happiest man on the Earth. 659 00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:10,968 - How you doing? - Oh, hello. 660 00:48:11,033 --> 00:48:12,133 - How are you? - I'm pretty good. 661 00:48:12,200 --> 00:48:14,434 - How's it feel? - It feels wonderful. 662 00:48:15,167 --> 00:48:17,734 Oh, God! Oh, Stevie! 663 00:48:20,367 --> 00:48:23,601 Let's get rid of this thing. 664 00:48:30,334 --> 00:48:32,834 I'm just glad they got the guy who did it. 665 00:48:33,334 --> 00:48:35,734 Do you forgive the victim? 666 00:48:35,801 --> 00:48:38,033 It ain't at all her fault, you know. 667 00:48:38,100 --> 00:48:40,000 Honest mistake, you know. 668 00:48:40,701 --> 00:48:45,300 I mean, most the time, I think the cops put it in her head more. 669 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:51,734 Who's this? 670 00:48:52,334 --> 00:48:56,067 I don't know. 671 00:49:02,734 --> 00:49:08,267 The revelation hit the DA's office and the sheriff's office like a bomb. 672 00:49:09,267 --> 00:49:12,801 And as it began to unfold what had happened, 673 00:49:12,868 --> 00:49:16,400 there was then a huge set of repercussions 674 00:49:16,467 --> 00:49:20,534 on a whole series of people in those offices. 675 00:49:20,601 --> 00:49:23,868 The day of or the day after Steven's release, 676 00:49:23,934 --> 00:49:26,334 law enforcement officers in Manitowoc 677 00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,767 are writing memos to describe activity 678 00:49:29,834 --> 00:49:32,367 that had occurred almost ten years earlier. 679 00:49:35,033 --> 00:49:37,467 They don't do that unless they feel threatened. 680 00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:51,234 When I called Denis Vogel to tell him the news 681 00:49:51,300 --> 00:49:54,767 that Steven Avery wasn't guilty of assaulting Penny Beerntsen, 682 00:49:54,834 --> 00:49:59,868 I was expecting to hear some shock or some surprise, like, 683 00:49:59,934 --> 00:50:05,601 "Oh, my goodness. How did this happen?" or "I feel terrible about it" or... 684 00:50:05,667 --> 00:50:08,701 "Thank goodness the DNA proved it." 685 00:50:08,767 --> 00:50:11,501 But I didn't hear any of that from Mr. Vogel. 686 00:50:11,567 --> 00:50:13,334 What I heard instead was a question, 687 00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:18,901 whether or not there was anything on Gregory Allen in his file. 688 00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:24,200 I couldn't believe it. I mean, it showed me two things. 689 00:50:24,267 --> 00:50:29,501 It showed me that he suspected that Gregory Allen was the assailant. 690 00:50:29,567 --> 00:50:32,467 But it also showed me... I didn't know how else to take it, 691 00:50:32,534 --> 00:50:36,234 other than that he was worried about his exposure. 692 00:50:36,300 --> 00:50:39,601 That something about Gregory Allen was in his file. 693 00:50:39,667 --> 00:50:44,033 I started leafing through Denis Vogel's file on Avery and I come across 694 00:50:44,100 --> 00:50:45,400 a criminal complaint. 695 00:50:45,467 --> 00:50:49,400 "State of Wisconsin v. Gregory Allen" in the Avery file, 696 00:50:49,467 --> 00:50:51,534 which didn't make a lot of sense. 697 00:50:51,601 --> 00:50:54,501 It was a charge of lewd and lascivious behavior. 698 00:50:54,567 --> 00:50:59,067 He had dropped his shorts, he exposed himself and he lunged at this woman. 699 00:50:59,133 --> 00:51:03,534 And it was the same basic section of the beach 700 00:51:03,601 --> 00:51:08,167 where Penny Beerntsen was assaulted two... two years later. 701 00:51:08,234 --> 00:51:12,801 Um, and I looked at which prosecutor had prosecuted Gregory Allen earlier, 702 00:51:12,868 --> 00:51:14,534 and it was Denis Vogel. 703 00:51:17,100 --> 00:51:21,534 That was evidence that at least made it possible 704 00:51:21,601 --> 00:51:25,067 that the DA and the sheriff 705 00:51:25,133 --> 00:51:28,501 either knew or should have known 706 00:51:28,567 --> 00:51:31,367 that Steven Avery was not the assailant. 707 00:51:31,434 --> 00:51:33,801 And not only that, 708 00:51:33,868 --> 00:51:39,067 we believe there was the potential that they knew, in fact, 709 00:51:39,133 --> 00:51:43,334 who the assailant was, but continued with the prosecution. 710 00:51:45,501 --> 00:51:48,000 We needed for somebody else to look at it 711 00:51:48,067 --> 00:51:52,033 and the logical office would be the Attorney General's office. 712 00:51:53,567 --> 00:51:55,868 It's extraordinarily significant 713 00:51:55,934 --> 00:51:59,501 that a prosecutor asks the Attorney General, 714 00:51:59,567 --> 00:52:05,133 the chief prosecutor of the state, to investigate his own department 715 00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:09,267 and law enforcement in that community. That doesn't happen. 716 00:52:15,801 --> 00:52:18,400 Would you tell us what your occupation is, please? 717 00:52:18,467 --> 00:52:22,634 I am a special agent with the Wisconsin Department of Justice 718 00:52:22,701 --> 00:52:25,133 Division of Criminal Investigation. 719 00:52:25,767 --> 00:52:29,167 What are your duties as a special agent? 720 00:52:29,234 --> 00:52:35,200 To investigate crimes relating to misconduct in office. 721 00:52:35,267 --> 00:52:38,267 And you were one of two DCI agents 722 00:52:38,334 --> 00:52:43,601 to work on an investigation involving the prosecution in 1985 723 00:52:43,667 --> 00:52:46,267 - of Steven Avery, is that right? - Yes. 724 00:52:46,334 --> 00:52:51,434 We wanted to interview everybody we could identify as being involved 725 00:52:51,501 --> 00:52:55,634 in the investigation or in the prosecution. 726 00:52:55,701 --> 00:52:59,701 Understand, this is all happening in public view. 727 00:52:59,767 --> 00:53:04,634 The public knew an Attorney General's investigation was underway. 728 00:53:04,701 --> 00:53:07,901 And there was a sense 729 00:53:07,968 --> 00:53:10,901 that law enforcement may be vulnerable here, 730 00:53:10,968 --> 00:53:13,567 and probably feeling it, uh... 731 00:53:13,634 --> 00:53:19,501 because God knows there were numerous editorials, articles, 732 00:53:19,567 --> 00:53:23,434 all of which had the theme of "How could this happen?" 733 00:53:27,734 --> 00:53:31,300 The stories of mine that broke some new ground were the ones that documented 734 00:53:31,367 --> 00:53:33,968 how quickly Steven Avery was a suspect 735 00:53:34,033 --> 00:53:37,601 and then how Gregory Allen was not considered. 736 00:53:37,667 --> 00:53:41,567 I went through a lot of police records about Gregory Allen 737 00:53:41,634 --> 00:53:47,000 and kind of built a chronology of his contacts with law enforcement. 738 00:54:01,767 --> 00:54:06,667 Police in Manitowoc had followed him for 13 straight days 739 00:54:06,734 --> 00:54:09,734 where they were making multiple checks on him, as many as 14 times a day, 740 00:54:09,801 --> 00:54:14,601 because he had been implicated in several sex-related crimes. 741 00:54:20,367 --> 00:54:25,467 After Steven Avery was already arrested, had already been identified twice, 742 00:54:25,534 --> 00:54:28,467 the police department contacted Penny Beerntsen. 743 00:54:28,534 --> 00:54:34,501 She was shocked and confused and contacted the Sheriff's Department herself to ask, 744 00:54:34,567 --> 00:54:36,033 "What about this Gregory Allen?" 745 00:54:52,801 --> 00:54:56,968 This isn't just about an innocent guy being locked up. 746 00:54:57,033 --> 00:55:01,901 It's about a dangerous rapist being out on the streets doing what he wanted to do. 747 00:55:08,400 --> 00:55:12,601 It was a hot end-of-June day in 1995, 748 00:55:12,667 --> 00:55:17,501 and I was laying on the couch after I put my daughter to bed 749 00:55:17,567 --> 00:55:20,133 and had fallen asleep. 750 00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:26,234 It was roughly 4:00 in the morning. Gregory Allen broke into my home. 751 00:55:26,300 --> 00:55:31,100 He had taken the towel, apparently, I guess, off the clothesline, 752 00:55:31,167 --> 00:55:33,033 threw it over my head 753 00:55:33,100 --> 00:55:36,167 and then dragged me from the living room to the bedroom. 754 00:55:36,234 --> 00:55:41,400 He pretty much forced himself as far as oral sex. 755 00:55:42,834 --> 00:55:46,767 It felt like an eternity at the moment. 756 00:55:46,834 --> 00:55:51,634 I was afraid my daughter, the next morning, would find me in a pool of blood. 757 00:55:56,167 --> 00:55:59,701 But... thank God it didn't... 758 00:55:59,767 --> 00:56:02,200 It... We're OK. 759 00:56:04,100 --> 00:56:07,367 The judge that I had during sentencing said, 760 00:56:07,434 --> 00:56:09,667 "If I could put you away for life, I would, 761 00:56:09,734 --> 00:56:14,167 but unfortunately I can only give you the maximum," which was 60 years. 762 00:56:14,234 --> 00:56:20,300 And he was around 47 at the time that this happened, so... 763 00:56:21,367 --> 00:56:27,200 I don't think he'll... be able to harm anyone ever again. 764 00:56:31,367 --> 00:56:35,367 Bergner went and talked to Kocourek about Gregory Allen, right? 765 00:56:35,434 --> 00:56:36,567 Correct. 766 00:56:36,634 --> 00:56:40,868 No report was prepared by Kocourek about the information 767 00:56:40,934 --> 00:56:42,868 that was brought to him by Bergner, is that right? 768 00:56:42,934 --> 00:56:43,634 That's correct. 769 00:56:43,701 --> 00:56:47,667 Kocourek tells you that he did not think 770 00:56:47,734 --> 00:56:51,601 that the Sheriff's Department knew who Gregory Allen was in 1985. 771 00:56:51,667 --> 00:56:52,434 Correct. 772 00:56:53,601 --> 00:56:57,767 That was inconsistent with Allen having been booked into the jail 773 00:56:57,834 --> 00:57:02,000 - and photographed in 1984. - Correct. 774 00:57:02,067 --> 00:57:07,367 So if the sheriff had wanted to see a photo of Allen in 1985, 775 00:57:07,434 --> 00:57:10,334 all he had to do was go to his own jail and find it? 776 00:57:12,300 --> 00:57:13,667 Correct. 777 00:57:20,200 --> 00:57:25,300 You and Deb tell the lawyers that it appears 778 00:57:25,367 --> 00:57:29,934 that there was "no real investigation done" by the Sheriff's Department, 779 00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:34,033 and "they had a suspect and they were gonna make it work." 780 00:57:34,100 --> 00:57:38,567 And that what's a little troubling to you is the lack of paperwork that's done 781 00:57:38,634 --> 00:57:41,033 - and so forth. - Deb would've wrote that. 782 00:57:41,100 --> 00:57:43,467 OK, but she's speaking for the two of you. 783 00:57:45,067 --> 00:57:47,467 Yes, I believe she was speaking for the two of us. 784 00:57:47,534 --> 00:57:50,200 And was that your opinion at the time? 785 00:57:54,434 --> 00:57:56,968 Yeah, I think that was our opinion at the time. 786 00:57:57,033 --> 00:58:00,934 In fact, it turned out from all of your investigation 787 00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:02,868 that this one was handled differently. 788 00:58:05,100 --> 00:58:06,467 It appeared from this investigation 789 00:58:06,534 --> 00:58:10,968 that the sheriff was really involved in this one, which wasn't the norm. 790 00:58:11,033 --> 00:58:13,434 "The sheriff told the DA not to screw this case up 791 00:58:13,501 --> 00:58:17,434 because the sheriff wanted Avery convicted of this crime." 792 00:58:33,334 --> 00:58:36,200 The tables were turning entirely, 793 00:58:36,267 --> 00:58:39,968 and the changes were all in Steven's favor. 794 00:58:40,934 --> 00:58:43,934 We thought what had happened to Steven Avery 795 00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:47,334 would have justified the Attorney General's Office 796 00:58:47,400 --> 00:58:51,200 into... uh, frankly, into bringing criminal charges, 797 00:58:51,267 --> 00:58:55,567 but certainly warranted a pretty strong condemnation. 798 00:59:12,567 --> 00:59:14,634 State Attorney General Peg Lautenschlager 799 00:59:14,701 --> 00:59:17,534 says her department conducted an exhaustive review 800 00:59:17,601 --> 00:59:19,467 of police and trial records 801 00:59:19,534 --> 00:59:23,534 and had interviews with the victim, police, prosecutors, and defenders. 802 00:59:23,601 --> 00:59:24,601 Her conclusion? 803 00:59:24,667 --> 00:59:27,868 We don't see that there are any criminal actions 804 00:59:27,934 --> 00:59:30,033 against somebody or criminal missteps. 805 00:59:30,100 --> 00:59:32,501 There don't seem to be any ethical violations. 806 00:59:36,367 --> 00:59:38,667 They said there was no wrongdoing with them. 807 00:59:38,734 --> 00:59:41,801 Then I wouldn't have did 18 years if they didn't do nothing wrong. 808 00:59:41,868 --> 00:59:43,667 They did everything wrong. 809 00:59:44,534 --> 00:59:47,834 The state's 15-page review concludes that, at worst, 810 00:59:47,901 --> 00:59:50,701 the Sheriff's Department failed to investigate Allen, 811 00:59:50,767 --> 00:59:54,067 all little consolation to Avery. 812 00:59:54,133 --> 00:59:56,534 I was hoping they were gonna do something to Manitowoc County... 813 00:59:57,501 --> 01:00:00,300 and set them straight so they don't do it again. 814 01:00:00,367 --> 01:00:03,067 When I saw the Justice Department report, it was like, 815 01:00:03,133 --> 01:00:06,801 they kind of said, "Well, yeah, they did these things that were wrong. 816 01:00:06,868 --> 01:00:09,300 Oh, you know, but they kind of had good intentions," 817 01:00:09,367 --> 01:00:11,801 or some crap like that. "So we don't really think 818 01:00:11,868 --> 01:00:15,767 anything further is justified." It's like, what a crock of shit. 819 01:00:17,234 --> 01:00:22,534 People did a lot of wrong things, and a man's life suffered. 820 01:00:23,501 --> 01:00:28,467 How can that not be... worth anything? 821 01:00:30,067 --> 01:00:34,167 I don't think Steven had any alternative but to bring the lawsuit. 822 01:00:34,234 --> 01:00:38,501 There was never going to be law enforcement recognition 823 01:00:38,567 --> 01:00:40,234 and acceptance of responsibility. 824 01:00:40,300 --> 01:00:44,467 There was never going to be law enforcement held accountable. 825 01:00:44,534 --> 01:00:46,234 I just didn't think that was going to happen, 826 01:00:46,300 --> 01:00:50,100 and it sure as hell wasn't gonna happen after the AG's report. 827 01:00:50,167 --> 01:00:55,267 I mean, I'm... I'm amazed that sitting in Milwaukee 828 01:00:55,334 --> 01:00:58,567 we couldn't hear the sigh of relief coming out of Manitowoc 829 01:00:58,634 --> 01:01:01,067 as soon as that AG's report came out. 830 01:01:01,133 --> 01:01:05,234 Sometimes it just makes me sick, just hearing about it and what they all did. 831 01:01:09,601 --> 01:01:13,434 Everything they did wrong should come back at 'em. 832 01:01:17,901 --> 01:01:21,434 They weren't just gonna let Stevie out. 833 01:01:21,501 --> 01:01:27,767 They weren't gonna hand that man $36 million. 834 01:01:27,834 --> 01:01:30,868 They weren't gonna be made a laughingstock, that's for sure. 835 01:01:30,934 --> 01:01:33,701 They just weren't gonna do all that. 836 01:01:33,767 --> 01:01:36,033 And something in my gut said they're not done with him. 837 01:01:36,100 --> 01:01:37,534 Something's gonna happen. 838 01:01:37,601 --> 01:01:41,100 They're not handing that kind of money over to Steve Avery. 839 01:01:42,400 --> 01:01:45,467 We told him he could expect people would say 840 01:01:45,534 --> 01:01:48,501 that this was just a get-rich effort. 841 01:01:48,567 --> 01:01:52,300 That family private matters would now be public, 842 01:01:52,367 --> 01:01:55,000 and, you know, don't be too surprised 843 01:01:55,067 --> 01:01:58,467 if people say some things about you that you've never even heard before, 844 01:01:58,534 --> 01:01:59,601 that are just plain false. 845 01:02:02,501 --> 01:02:07,167 The one thing we didn't tell him is that you have to be careful 846 01:02:07,234 --> 01:02:11,234 when you bring a lawsuit against a Sheriff's Department 847 01:02:11,300 --> 01:02:13,534 in a community where you still live, 848 01:02:13,601 --> 01:02:17,634 because you could end up getting charged with murder. 849 01:02:26,167 --> 01:02:28,167 Do we have a body or anything yet? 850 01:02:28,234 --> 01:02:30,667 I don't believe so. 851 01:02:30,734 --> 01:02:34,167 Do we have Steven Avery in custody though? 852 01:02:37,268 --> 01:02:42,268 Sync and corrections by explosiveskull www.addic7ed.com 74958

Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.