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Produced by april filmlab
in co-production with Reflexion Films
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PERM-36. REFLEXION
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A film by
Sergei Kachkin
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Follow the guard's instruction
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Ministry of the Interior USSR
FACILITY ВС389/36
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NCO Memorial Centre for the History
of Political Repression "PERM-36"
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MEMORIAL MUSEUM "PERM-36"
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We are now on the territory
of a very special museum.
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It is unique - the only Stalin-era Gulag
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preserved in the entire
post-Soviet territory.
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Not just a single,
freestanding building
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but one with the whole
infrastructure intact.
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The museum began to emerge slowly
and finally opened in 1994.
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Until then, this was a working prison camp.
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The camp was opened in 1946
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and we can divide its
history into three parts.
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00:04:58,740 --> 00:05:03,179
After it was opened in '46,
people sentenced for
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00:05:03,180 --> 00:05:06,860
so-called ‘domestic' crimes
or petty theft were sent here.
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But time passes and with the death
of the greatest leader of all time
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Comrade Stalin, in 1953,
the situation in the country changed
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as did the situation in the camp.
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As fate would have it, none other than
Beria's henchmen would be transferred here
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i.e. the very people
who had carried out the illegal repression.
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00:05:26,140 --> 00:05:31,459
Then, on July 13 1972 on
conditions of utmost secrecy
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00:05:31,460 --> 00:05:35,179
the first group of a
hundred political prisoners
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00:05:35,180 --> 00:05:38,660
from the Mordovian camps arrived
at the Chusovskaya station.
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And two prison colonies were opened:
Perm-35 and Perm-36.
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Four years later the Perm-37
compound was also opened.
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In this way the notorious Perm Triangle
of political prison camps was formed.
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That is the history of
this camp where we now are.
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The last prisoner here was
released on December 27, 1987.
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00:06:02,620 --> 00:06:05,259
Fifteen years after,
the camp had been converted
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00:06:05,260 --> 00:06:08,500
into a high-security compound
for political prisoners.
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The first time I came here
to the Museum of Political Repression
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was entirely by chance ten years ago.
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At that time I accompanied a Scot
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who was studying the Russian
language and culture.
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It so happened that I would later
come back here again and again
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with friends from Russia and from abroad.
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And each time I discovered something new…
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for example, that in the 1970s
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people were imprisoned here for disagreeing
with the official position of the State
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00:06:54,820 --> 00:06:58,899
while in the 1980s they were imprisoned
for collecting certain literature
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which you can now find in any bookstore.
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The camp was active
during the years I was a schoolchild
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so I had no conscious
perception of its existence.
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The camp, now a museum,
is located 80 km from Perm,
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the city where I was born and grew up.
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And so, over time,
I wanted to meet
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with someone who was imprisoned here.
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I'm sure I was not the only one
and probably because of this
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the Museum Administration invited
some former political prisoners.
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That time, a worker from an electrical
engineering plant from the city of Sverdlovsk
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(now Yekaterinburg) turned up.
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We are now situated in one of the four
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sleeping-quarters of the prison barracks.
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This is how the sleeping-quarters
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of the Perm-36 camp looked like
in the early period of its existence,
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00:08:37,540 --> 00:08:42,980
that is in Autumn 1946
when the camp was opened.
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There were bunk beds,
the four-bed wooden plank bunks.
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Basically this is all the décor there was.
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00:08:52,060 --> 00:08:57,260
Now you can get a first-hand
account of how it was.
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With us today is a former prisoner from
the final period of this camp's existence.
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00:09:04,420 --> 00:09:07,059
I'm sure that you all have questions
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about how people lived here.
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Let me introduce myself.
I am Victor Pestov,
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born in 1946.
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I served a five year sentence here
for anti-Soviet agitation and propaganda,
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00:09:22,860 --> 00:09:25,020
(Article 70),
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subversion and organizing
activity Intended to overthrow
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the Soviet System (Article 72).
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A category of particularly
dangerous state prisoners.
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I discovered this
when I was taken to the KGB headquarters
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of Sverdlovsk Region and
given the Penal Code to read.
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We were involved in organizing
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an underground anti-Communist organization.
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We named it "Free Russia",
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it comprised of myself, my brother,
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Kolya Shaburov,
Volodya Bersenyov and Vladik Uzlov.
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00:10:11,020 --> 00:10:13,539
Vladik Uzlov was a student
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00:10:13,540 --> 00:10:17,939
The rest of us worked
in plants and factories.
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We started organizing in 1968.
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And insofar as my mother worked for the KGB
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I managed to quiz her
and find out certain things.
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I told the lads that we should buy carbon
and paper for future,
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use at different places and that
typewriters needed to be bought second-hand
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because my mother told me that they were
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all registered,
so that if you bought them in a shop
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00:10:51,620 --> 00:10:54,620
then the typeface specimens
were sent on to the KGB.
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00:10:54,940 --> 00:10:57,819
We went to craftsmen
and they sold us
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a 1933 ‘ReinMetall'
typewriter for 40 roubles.
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00:11:03,580 --> 00:11:06,099
We also came to an agreement
that they would
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resolder the fonts,
which they were happy to do.
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00:11:08,900 --> 00:11:13,260
We issued five different leaflets.
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We distributed them on November 7th 1969
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00:11:19,020 --> 00:11:27,299
and then on April 25th i.e. Easter 1970,
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the last leaflets issued were
on May 1st ‘70 in the city of Sverdlovsk.
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00:11:33,860 --> 00:11:39,260
Kolya Shaburov went to the Latvian
city of Liepāja (near Leningrad).
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He travelled and contacted a friend
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with whom he had studied
at a training college.
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But his friend denounced him.
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00:11:48,380 --> 00:11:51,100
Then we were sent to Mordovia [camp].
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00:11:51,580 --> 00:11:54,179
We served some of our sentence in Mordovia
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but since information was leaking out
to western radio stations
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they decided to transfer the main
group of prisoners to the Perm region.
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So my brother and I ended up here.
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00:12:09,140 --> 00:12:14,220
He took the bottom bunk here
and I the top one.
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00:12:16,620 --> 00:12:22,339
Then in 1975 I was released
and from ‘76 to ‘91
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we again organized underground.
We paid dues,
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00:12:28,420 --> 00:12:32,699
and had typewriters
and photographic labs.
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00:12:32,700 --> 00:12:35,619
We continued to have
the same organization as before
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00:12:35,620 --> 00:12:40,620
but our circle mainly consisted
of former political prisoners.
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00:12:40,900 --> 00:12:46,099
You said that your mother was in the
KGB, |what happened to her career?
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00:12:46,100 --> 00:12:50,339
Yes, yes… She was relieved of
her duties at her own request.
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00:12:50,340 --> 00:12:53,419
So after that for about a year
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00:12:53,420 --> 00:12:56,940
she could find no work anywhere,
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00:12:57,220 --> 00:13:02,220
she got a job as a cleaner even though
she had been a Colonel in the KGB.
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00:13:02,300 --> 00:13:07,579
It was rather awkward
when I was released but I came out
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00:13:07,580 --> 00:13:13,260
and told her "I am guilty of
what happened in your life."
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00:13:13,500 --> 00:13:17,499
She told me to forget about it
and that I shouldn't worry about it.
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Everything very ‘Russian-style'.
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00:13:20,220 --> 00:13:24,579
Things weren't so easy with my father.
They had divorced.
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00:13:24,580 --> 00:13:28,340
He filed for divorce
when we were imprisoned.
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00:13:33,940 --> 00:13:37,260
At that time of year there are
only a few visitors to the museum.
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00:13:37,660 --> 00:13:42,660
Whereas in the summer
there can be thousands in one weekend.
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00:13:43,980 --> 00:13:47,379
And this is large part due to
the fact that the administration
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00:13:47,380 --> 00:13:50,260
of the museum organizes an
International Civic Forum.
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00:13:50,740 --> 00:13:53,339
It is entitled Pilorama (sawmill)
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00:13:53,340 --> 00:13:55,420
where the prisoners used to work.
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00:13:57,900 --> 00:14:00,260
All that has remained of this place today
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00:14:00,500 --> 00:14:02,740
is the skeleton and the platform.
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00:14:10,180 --> 00:14:11,780
How quiet…
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00:14:13,780 --> 00:14:15,540
not a sound.
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00:14:17,620 --> 00:14:21,740
The smoldering of the final embers of coal
seems almost audible …
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00:14:23,100 --> 00:14:24,540
now just slag.
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00:14:25,820 --> 00:14:29,660
The stoker brought it here on a cart
and dumped it in a pile.
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00:14:33,420 --> 00:14:38,820
The literary scholar Mikhail Meylakh worked
in this very boiler room
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00:14:39,140 --> 00:14:41,300
when he was imprisoned here.
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00:14:42,540 --> 00:14:46,620
And from the words of Meylakh himself
this work had one advantage -
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00:14:47,420 --> 00:14:50,980
it allowed one at least some relief
from the routine of the camp.
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00:14:59,740 --> 00:15:02,140
We are now located in the room with
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a small-scale model of the
Kolyma prison barracks.
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The geographical aspect is not so important
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as there was little variety
in the interiors of the camps.
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00:15:15,060 --> 00:15:20,500
Prisoners had no thermometers and could
only measure the temperature in this way:
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00:15:20,620 --> 00:15:23,459
if it was misty behind the
windows then it was -40 °C,
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00:15:23,460 --> 00:15:27,059
if it was difficult to
breathe then it was -50 °C
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00:15:27,060 --> 00:15:29,299
and if spittle freezes in the air,
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00:15:29,300 --> 00:15:32,660
(that's no metaphor) then it's -60 °C.
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00:15:38,860 --> 00:15:42,339
The prisoners didn't always stay
inside in these temperatures,
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they were sent out to do common labour:
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they mined gold,
tin, uranium ore and coal.
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00:15:48,660 --> 00:15:51,379
They literally extracted
it with their bare hands.
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00:15:51,380 --> 00:15:55,260
The only tools they had were crowbars,
wheelbarrows and spades.
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00:15:57,340 --> 00:16:01,780
Obviously in such conditions
and at such temperatures
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00:16:02,460 --> 00:16:04,980
people didn't survive for long.
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00:16:07,580 --> 00:16:12,700
On average a prisoner sent to
Kolyma would survive 5-6 months
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00:16:16,500 --> 00:16:20,300
The whole country was full of
these yellow circles on the map
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industrialisation sites.
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00:16:24,660 --> 00:16:27,739
The first Five-Year Plan was
a plan for industrialisation.
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00:16:27,740 --> 00:16:31,460
From an agrarian country Russia
should become an industrial one.
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00:16:33,260 --> 00:16:37,139
That was all very fine in theory –
here is the "UralMash" plant,
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00:16:37,140 --> 00:16:39,779
here is the "Chelyabinsk Tractors", here...
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00:16:39,780 --> 00:16:42,100
is the "Dnepro HydroElectric
Power Station".
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00:16:42,500 --> 00:16:45,099
This is all good but near every circle,
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00:16:45,100 --> 00:16:48,540
in each of the squares on the map
there were up to 200 prison camps.
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00:16:49,340 --> 00:16:54,259
Look at Magadan -
it is 7,000 km from the centre by land
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00:16:54,260 --> 00:16:56,379
and 3,000 km by sea.
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00:16:56,380 --> 00:16:58,779
Who would ever go there voluntarily?
Nobody!
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00:16:58,780 --> 00:17:01,660
The whole of Kolyma rests
on the bones of prisoners.
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00:17:04,780 --> 00:17:10,099
As far as women were concerned
this is a separate story to be told.
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00:17:10,100 --> 00:17:12,219
In 1937 a secret order was made
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to arrest women whose husbands
had already been arrested.
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00:17:16,820 --> 00:17:20,219
Simply for not having
denounced their husbands,
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00:17:20,220 --> 00:17:23,219
women and children were repressed.
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00:17:23,220 --> 00:17:27,660
And one of the most terrible
female camps was the "Alzhir" Camp.
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00:17:28,020 --> 00:17:32,860
The abbreviation stood for The ‘Akmolonsky
Camp for Wives of Motherland Traitors'.
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00:17:33,900 --> 00:17:38,300
As we said the camps were
called ‘reform-labour camps'
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00:17:38,620 --> 00:17:41,259
but, of course,
they reformed no one.
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00:17:41,260 --> 00:17:44,099
The people, with their bitter
sense of irony gave them
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00:17:44,100 --> 00:17:47,220
a more accurate description:
deform-labour camps.
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00:18:19,780 --> 00:18:27,260
Creep out, you bourgeois!
We will put you on trial.
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00:18:27,620 --> 00:18:34,140
You will pay for your treason.
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00:18:34,180 --> 00:18:36,859
Communist Party of the
Russian Federation (CPRF)
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00:18:36,860 --> 00:18:40,779
Birds sing and mosquitoes drone,
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00:18:40,780 --> 00:18:44,780
And a dead bourgeois exudes such a stench!
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A-frame sign: We'll struggle
together until victory!
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00:19:07,900 --> 00:19:13,180
CPRF Sergei Andriyanov
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00:19:23,500 --> 00:19:24,940
Komarovo
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00:19:26,020 --> 00:19:29,500
A village of summer houses on
the coast of the Gulf of Finland.
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00:19:32,020 --> 00:19:33,780
Mikhail Meylakh
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00:19:34,100 --> 00:19:36,980
nowadays a Professor at the
University of Strasburg,
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00:19:38,060 --> 00:19:41,140
came here immediately after
being released from the camp.
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00:19:43,180 --> 00:19:45,340
Here in seclusion
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00:19:45,820 --> 00:19:49,500
he could recover from the experience
of several years of camp life.
196
00:19:52,540 --> 00:19:54,300
Today too, Mikhail Borisovich,
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00:19:54,620 --> 00:19:57,580
while living between
Strasbourg and Saint Petersburg
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00:19:57,700 --> 00:20:01,420
often comes here during the
winter and summer holidays.
199
00:20:06,260 --> 00:20:09,340
I feel a little uncomfortable
talking about myself but...
200
00:20:10,500 --> 00:20:13,020
in some way I always
went against the trend.
201
00:20:17,140 --> 00:20:22,380
Even at primary school my teacher said:
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00:20:23,140 --> 00:20:26,899
all kids are kids (deti)
but he's a ‘myslete'.
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00:20:26,900 --> 00:20:31,340
Rather witty as ‘myslete' is also the name
of the letter M in Old Church Slavonic
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00:20:31,900 --> 00:20:35,019
and both my name and
surname begin with the letter M.
205
00:20:35,020 --> 00:20:37,180
Of course...
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00:20:40,220 --> 00:20:43,059
one of the circumstances
leading to my imprisonment
207
00:20:43,060 --> 00:20:45,819
was that I went to visit Brodsky
when he was in exile
208
00:20:45,820 --> 00:20:48,020
and that was well known.
209
00:20:48,460 --> 00:20:51,100
That was sufficient.
210
00:20:53,260 --> 00:20:58,980
But the direct cause of my imprisonment
was that for years I collected
211
00:20:59,980 --> 00:21:03,660
books in Russian published abroad.
212
00:21:05,340 --> 00:21:07,620
So-called ‘tamizdat'.
213
00:21:08,660 --> 00:21:13,540
All these books were kept
in the house of an old lady.
214
00:21:14,860 --> 00:21:19,540
It's extraordinary that after her death
215
00:21:20,700 --> 00:21:26,140
it became known that in the years
of the Stalinist Terrors she was a snitch
216
00:21:26,500 --> 00:21:29,700
and she had been planted on Akhmatova.
217
00:21:29,900 --> 00:21:32,539
Well in any case,
they lay there and I decided
218
00:21:32,540 --> 00:21:36,259
to use these books,
as did my closest friends.
219
00:21:36,260 --> 00:21:39,539
Everything was fine.
Then she had cancer...
220
00:21:39,540 --> 00:21:43,579
She lived on her own
and so we needed to move these books.
221
00:21:43,580 --> 00:21:47,459
I gave them to one person
who was very careless
222
00:21:47,460 --> 00:21:50,580
with them and eventually he was caught.
223
00:21:51,700 --> 00:21:55,300
But when they arrested him
224
00:21:56,340 --> 00:22:01,220
then I, being very naïve in this,
225
00:22:02,860 --> 00:22:07,139
decided simply to leave for Moscow.
226
00:22:07,140 --> 00:22:09,980
This was possible during Stalin's Terror,
227
00:22:10,380 --> 00:22:15,980
to leave for another city,
that had a different security service team.
228
00:22:17,180 --> 00:22:20,939
Generally a person could hide
229
00:22:20,940 --> 00:22:24,059
at least until he attracted
further attention.
230
00:22:24,060 --> 00:22:28,139
This is how Lidia Chukovskaya behaved back
231
00:22:28,140 --> 00:22:30,859
when they arrested her
husband and it was clear
232
00:22:30,860 --> 00:22:33,259
that she would be the next victim.
233
00:22:33,260 --> 00:22:35,259
So she simply left for Moscow.
234
00:22:35,260 --> 00:22:37,179
There were many such cases.
235
00:22:37,180 --> 00:22:39,940
But now times had changed.
236
00:22:40,980 --> 00:22:43,860
When they eventually arrested me
237
00:22:47,900 --> 00:22:52,500
I understood from their
telephone conversations
238
00:22:52,860 --> 00:22:56,500
that they needed to dismantle checkpoints,
and something else...
239
00:22:56,540 --> 00:23:00,499
then I understood that they had been
chasing me around Moscow for two weeks.
240
00:23:00,500 --> 00:23:02,820
And I was traveling in Moscow by car.
241
00:23:03,460 --> 00:23:05,619
Just imagine how badly they worked?
242
00:23:05,620 --> 00:23:09,620
There's a myth that people
in the KGB were clever,
243
00:23:11,740 --> 00:23:16,780
that at least they 'knew their trade',
244
00:23:17,300 --> 00:23:19,620
if one can express oneself in that way.
245
00:23:20,500 --> 00:23:25,900
In reality they botched things up
just like everyone else at that time.
246
00:23:27,100 --> 00:23:29,980
They simply had impunity.
247
00:23:30,620 --> 00:23:35,260
They could use means unavailable to others.
248
00:23:35,820 --> 00:23:41,699
Because they were lazy they mainly
listened in to telephone conversations.
249
00:23:41,700 --> 00:23:47,780
I knew about that and I never
called anyone in Moscow by phone.
250
00:23:49,180 --> 00:23:51,700
Well when I left the city
251
00:23:53,860 --> 00:23:56,460
to visit a female friend
252
00:23:57,100 --> 00:24:01,780
they located me by my car plates.
253
00:24:02,300 --> 00:24:06,580
There were a number of cases in my life
254
00:24:07,340 --> 00:24:12,860
when in a split second
you discover or see something
255
00:24:14,180 --> 00:24:18,539
that completely changes your life
256
00:24:18,540 --> 00:24:22,100
and you know it will
never be the same again.
257
00:24:22,460 --> 00:24:25,940
So when they showed me their KGB ID card,
258
00:24:26,380 --> 00:24:28,980
I understood that everything was over.
259
00:25:10,780 --> 00:25:14,260
Here at least there is a special climate …
260
00:25:16,820 --> 00:25:21,260
a short while ago,
the gusty wind shook the branches
261
00:25:21,660 --> 00:25:23,820
and the cotton-like snow swirled around.
262
00:25:25,540 --> 00:25:28,300
But already by midday
it disappeared somewhere
263
00:25:29,180 --> 00:25:31,100
and then things became very quiet.
264
00:25:31,900 --> 00:25:33,620
But for how long?
265
00:25:42,380 --> 00:25:47,300
Mikhail Borisovich was freed
as a result of a humiliating pardon
266
00:25:48,380 --> 00:25:52,220
which he could only accept
after acknowledging his guilt.
267
00:25:54,420 --> 00:25:57,900
His need to return home was spurred on
by his father's illness,
268
00:25:58,580 --> 00:26:02,260
who died half a year
after his son returned.
269
00:26:08,940 --> 00:26:14,700
Joseph Brodsky first met
Anna Akhmatova here at Komarovo.
270
00:26:16,260 --> 00:26:22,220
He claimed that he owed
all his best human qualities to her.
271
00:26:25,700 --> 00:26:27,660
After Anna Andreevna's death,
272
00:26:28,060 --> 00:26:30,580
Brodsky had to organise her burial.
273
00:26:32,180 --> 00:26:35,820
But the authorities didn't want
to permit her burial in a place
274
00:26:36,380 --> 00:26:39,300
where people could freely visit her grave.
275
00:26:47,420 --> 00:26:50,660
This is Akhmatova's grave,
rather a strange one.
276
00:26:51,500 --> 00:26:57,300
That wall is made from Izborsk stone,
from near Pskov.
277
00:26:57,980 --> 00:27:00,619
The cross was made by
Old Believers from Pskov
278
00:27:00,620 --> 00:27:03,500
even though of course
she was no Old Believer.
279
00:27:04,580 --> 00:27:11,220
A profile of Modigliani
has been attached to this wall.
280
00:27:12,100 --> 00:27:15,100
The funeral was in 1966.
281
00:27:15,860 --> 00:27:18,900
There was a huge crowd of people here.
282
00:27:22,700 --> 00:27:27,219
Her own grave is not here,
not under the cross.
283
00:27:27,220 --> 00:27:29,340
It's somewhere here.
284
00:27:30,900 --> 00:27:35,380
Later all this was moved because
of this architectural ensemble
285
00:27:35,620 --> 00:27:40,820
which Lev Gumilev (her son) had thought up.
286
00:27:43,580 --> 00:27:45,980
This is our family vault.
287
00:27:47,780 --> 00:27:52,380
Here is my father,
mother and little son.
288
00:27:54,060 --> 00:27:56,820
For some reason nearly all
289
00:27:58,260 --> 00:28:01,380
the elements of the monument are oriental.
290
00:28:01,820 --> 00:28:06,140
This monument is a copy
of an architectural detail
291
00:28:07,540 --> 00:28:12,660
of a cathedral in Svetitskhoveli, Georgia.
292
00:28:13,820 --> 00:28:16,180
This is a very early cathedral,
293
00:28:17,580 --> 00:28:21,580
apparently the 6th or 7th century.
294
00:28:22,060 --> 00:28:24,859
And this is an Armenian lion.
295
00:28:24,860 --> 00:28:27,259
My son was called Leo
296
00:28:27,260 --> 00:28:29,540
and I also found this
297
00:28:32,460 --> 00:28:36,980
ancient Armenian image of a lion.
298
00:28:41,140 --> 00:28:43,660
There is a kind of poetry in cemeteries,
299
00:28:44,180 --> 00:28:48,379
they were especially loved
in the epoch of Sentimentalism.
300
00:28:48,380 --> 00:28:51,459
Thomas Gray has a famous poem
301
00:28:51,460 --> 00:28:54,539
"Elegy written in a country churchyard".
302
00:28:54,540 --> 00:28:58,539
Well cemeteries are as old as man.
303
00:28:58,540 --> 00:29:01,900
And archaeology makes use of this fact.
304
00:29:03,180 --> 00:29:07,539
In ancient times people were
buried with many objects
305
00:29:07,540 --> 00:29:10,260
they would need in the afterlife.
306
00:29:10,900 --> 00:29:14,420
I always say that one's
heirs should be buried
307
00:29:15,220 --> 00:29:19,379
if they have author's rights
along with the deceased
308
00:29:19,380 --> 00:29:23,499
just as they buried leaders
with their wives or with their horse
309
00:29:23,500 --> 00:29:27,940
because all the serious
trouble begins with the heirs.
310
00:29:39,540 --> 00:29:42,340
On the first day it felt
rather amused being in jail.
311
00:29:42,620 --> 00:29:46,299
And then I began to reflect upon this
312
00:29:46,300 --> 00:29:52,259
and decided that I was
one of many millions,
313
00:29:52,260 --> 00:29:57,419
maybe 40 million, maybe 60 million.
No one knows exactly
314
00:29:57,420 --> 00:30:01,580
So there was no real reason
to make a 'big deal' over it.
315
00:30:03,340 --> 00:30:07,100
I had one principle:
not to name anybody.
316
00:30:07,700 --> 00:30:12,179
I was already there, they would do
what they want with me anyway.
317
00:30:12,180 --> 00:30:18,940
But I should not name a single name
and I kept strictly to this principle.
318
00:30:19,300 --> 00:30:24,179
I even taunted them to entertain myself.
319
00:30:24,180 --> 00:30:26,820
My sense of humour didn't abandon me.
320
00:30:27,180 --> 00:30:30,219
It's amazing that when
I got to know about my case,
321
00:30:30,220 --> 00:30:35,379
then it was prescribed by law,
I had to read the whole case
322
00:30:35,380 --> 00:30:38,180
and the case ran to six volumes.
323
00:30:39,460 --> 00:30:44,339
Such a fuss about the possession and
324
00:30:44,340 --> 00:30:47,420
circulation of Solzhenitsyn
and Mandelshtam.
325
00:30:49,220 --> 00:30:55,780
It was in that first period when they were
hoping that I would collaborate with them.
326
00:30:56,180 --> 00:31:00,339
I demanded that they give me
a manuscript of my book in the cell
327
00:31:00,340 --> 00:31:02,619
which they had taken in the search.
328
00:31:02,620 --> 00:31:05,900
When they did the search
hey didn't really understand things,
329
00:31:06,140 --> 00:31:09,540
just taking what they could.
They had taken a manuscript of a book
330
00:31:11,020 --> 00:31:15,020
already ready for publication,
which was later published in the ‘90s.
331
00:31:16,140 --> 00:31:22,140
This was my translation of the life
histories of troubadours in literature.
332
00:31:22,460 --> 00:31:24,939
It seemed such a reputable volume.
333
00:31:24,940 --> 00:31:29,059
There was already the "Confirmed
for Publication" stamp
334
00:31:29,060 --> 00:31:33,740
so they had to give me the manuscript.
335
00:31:33,860 --> 00:31:38,499
With the aim of forging a relationship
with me they gave it to me in my cell.
336
00:31:38,500 --> 00:31:40,739
And I was busy at it for a month.
337
00:31:40,740 --> 00:31:43,220
And then when relations worsened
338
00:31:44,540 --> 00:31:49,219
they told me that they
would take it away from me.
339
00:31:49,220 --> 00:31:51,020
What to do with it?
340
00:31:51,980 --> 00:31:55,779
In fact they asked me.
I told them to give it to my co-author,
341
00:31:55,780 --> 00:31:58,419
the now deceased Nadezhda Rykova
342
00:31:58,420 --> 00:32:02,660
with whom I'd worked
together on a part of the book.
343
00:32:03,940 --> 00:32:08,059
She was a member of the Writers' Union
and also a respected person
344
00:32:08,060 --> 00:32:10,500
even though she too had been to jail
in her time.
345
00:32:11,020 --> 00:32:13,139
They agreed.
346
00:32:13,140 --> 00:32:19,980
On the last day I decided that I couldn't
let the book get away 'naked' so to say.
347
00:32:20,380 --> 00:32:22,459
So I did the following:
348
00:32:22,460 --> 00:32:27,860
I wrote a letter in Latin.
349
00:32:29,260 --> 00:32:32,179
and I outdid them,
writing them notes stating
350
00:32:32,180 --> 00:32:36,940
that I didn't have a Latin dictionary
and so I couldn't translate that text.
351
00:32:37,500 --> 00:32:40,059
Please translate it yourselves.
352
00:32:40,060 --> 00:32:42,900
And they had to swallow that too.
353
00:32:43,220 --> 00:32:47,699
So they themselves released a letter to
the outside world - simply nothing worse
354
00:32:47,700 --> 00:32:51,260
could happen to them.
It is called a leak of information.
355
00:32:51,780 --> 00:32:57,380
What information?
None of it was worth a damn thing.
356
00:32:58,380 --> 00:33:01,539
And in the letter there was a sentence
357
00:33:01,540 --> 00:33:05,580
which really offended them saying
358
00:33:06,460 --> 00:33:11,059
that speaking with them was like
teaching a crocodile vegetarianism.
359
00:33:11,060 --> 00:33:14,739
They asked "so we're the crocodiles?"
360
00:33:14,740 --> 00:33:18,379
Hilarious.
Of course they are crocodiles.
361
00:33:18,380 --> 00:33:22,459
I told them that
what wonderful power they had
362
00:33:22,460 --> 00:33:27,580
if it could be subverted
by a few odd books.
363
00:33:28,020 --> 00:33:33,739
So they found
that they had really messed things up,
364
00:33:33,740 --> 00:33:37,780
that they had delivered a letter to
the outside world with their own hands.
365
00:33:38,580 --> 00:33:42,819
I heard that the chief of
this investigation department
366
00:33:42,820 --> 00:33:47,140
apparently had a heart
attack because of this.
367
00:34:15,580 --> 00:34:20,019
At school I was straight sent into
the second year because I already knew
368
00:34:20,020 --> 00:34:25,659
how to read and write and even knew English
which I was taught from the age of 3.
369
00:34:25,660 --> 00:34:29,579
And so from that almost ivory
tower-like home environment
370
00:34:29,580 --> 00:34:34,180
in a family of professors I found myself
suddenly thrown into a madhouse.
371
00:34:34,420 --> 00:34:37,300
On my first day I went
to the school doctor,
372
00:34:37,780 --> 00:34:41,019
I thought that just one
illness was not enough
373
00:34:41,020 --> 00:34:45,139
and said "let me go home,
my stomach and throat hurts".
374
00:34:45,140 --> 00:34:48,419
And then the torment began.
375
00:34:48,420 --> 00:34:53,419
One day we were asked to bring
some scrap metal to class.
376
00:34:53,420 --> 00:34:56,499
I looked around me on
my way home from school
377
00:34:56,500 --> 00:34:59,260
and couldn't find any anywhere.
378
00:34:59,700 --> 00:35:03,539
Then I went for a stroll along
the Field of Mars where we lived.
379
00:35:03,540 --> 00:35:05,900
I live there now too.
380
00:35:07,860 --> 00:35:12,980
And then on the mass grave
of the victims of revolution
381
00:35:13,420 --> 00:35:16,220
although its victims
were quite the others -
382
00:35:19,220 --> 00:35:23,820
I saw some rusty wreaths,
completely of no use to anyone,
383
00:35:25,300 --> 00:35:28,180
powdered with snow,
as it was winter.
384
00:35:28,380 --> 00:35:31,980
I decided that I had found
some scrap metal. Great!
385
00:35:32,340 --> 00:35:36,540
I took those wreaths
and dragged them to school.
386
00:35:37,300 --> 00:35:39,180
There was a terrible scandal.
387
00:35:40,940 --> 00:35:43,340
From there it only got worse.
388
00:35:44,140 --> 00:35:48,220
About a year after the death of Stalin
389
00:35:49,620 --> 00:35:54,940
a fleet of British warships
390
00:35:55,460 --> 00:35:57,660
docked at the Neva [River].
391
00:35:58,140 --> 00:36:00,299
Everyone went to look at them.
392
00:36:00,300 --> 00:36:02,499
We were strictly warned
393
00:36:02,500 --> 00:36:08,339
that we mustn't talk
to the British sailors
394
00:36:08,340 --> 00:36:11,979
who left the ships and
walked through Leningrad.
395
00:36:11,980 --> 00:36:23,260
One dark evening I ran into some British
soldiers in Palace Square returning from school.
396
00:36:24,220 --> 00:36:30,580
Since I already spoke fluent English
the temptation was just too great.
397
00:36:31,060 --> 00:36:35,180
So we started talking.
398
00:36:35,500 --> 00:36:40,940
They were astonished
that a little boy was speaking English and,
399
00:36:41,380 --> 00:36:44,739
to make things worse,
they invited me on to the ship.
400
00:36:44,740 --> 00:36:47,820
Well, how could a little boy resist that?
401
00:36:49,220 --> 00:36:53,180
They waited for a boat near the Hermitage
402
00:36:54,180 --> 00:36:57,459
and they took me on to the ship,
403
00:36:57,460 --> 00:37:01,419
showed me around,
we spoke about Shakespeare
404
00:37:01,420 --> 00:37:05,820
who I had already read in the
retelling by Charles and Mary Lamb.
405
00:37:07,500 --> 00:37:11,819
They gave me some English tea to
drink and brought me back to shore.
406
00:37:11,820 --> 00:37:13,939
As soon as they sailed off
407
00:37:13,940 --> 00:37:17,659
some men were already waiting for me
408
00:37:17,660 --> 00:37:21,499
and grabbed me by my arm,
taking me to the police
409
00:37:21,500 --> 00:37:23,780
where they had summoned my father.
410
00:37:24,620 --> 00:37:27,620
Well that was the second terrible scandal.
411
00:37:30,060 --> 00:37:32,180
Things continued like that
412
00:37:34,460 --> 00:37:39,020
Worse and worse.
I was fated to go to jail.
413
00:37:45,700 --> 00:37:51,539
As far as the trial went I didn't
stay silent like Lev Timofeyev
414
00:37:51,540 --> 00:37:54,099
but attempted to play games with them.
415
00:37:54,100 --> 00:37:58,419
They managed to dig things
out from the witnesses.
416
00:37:58,420 --> 00:38:03,299
My misfortune was to be arrested
with a notebook on me.
417
00:38:03,300 --> 00:38:09,259
For them this was a tasty morsel they could
use to torment people for a whole year.
418
00:38:09,260 --> 00:38:12,659
The majority of witnesses said that
they didn't know anything
419
00:38:12,660 --> 00:38:15,099
but all the same they
named something or other.
420
00:38:15,100 --> 00:38:19,420
The fact that I had given them something
to read was very useful for them.
421
00:38:20,060 --> 00:38:23,300
They managed to collect a
certain amount of evidence.
422
00:38:28,660 --> 00:38:33,259
At that time there were two articles in the law
about anti-Soviet agitation and propaganda.
423
00:38:33,260 --> 00:38:37,859
One article (170) was simply for
anti-Soviet agitation and propaganda.
424
00:38:37,860 --> 00:38:41,660
For this they gave 3 years in a usual camp
with a customary regime.
425
00:38:42,860 --> 00:38:47,699
Then there was article 70:
anti-Soviet agitation and propaganda
426
00:38:47,700 --> 00:38:50,460
with the aim of subverting Soviet power.
427
00:38:50,540 --> 00:38:56,659
How to define this – it was hard to
define who had aim and who didn't.
428
00:38:56,660 --> 00:38:59,620
Anyway they stitched me
up with this aim clause.
429
00:39:00,140 --> 00:39:05,339
In short, this article had a punishment
of up to 7 years of prison camp
430
00:39:05,340 --> 00:39:08,299
and then 5 years of internal
banishment after that:
431
00:39:08,300 --> 00:39:11,620
this is the sentence
that I faced: 7 plus 5.
432
00:39:11,940 --> 00:39:15,619
Then when I saw the
television in the court room
433
00:39:15,620 --> 00:39:19,380
then I got really angry
434
00:39:19,780 --> 00:39:22,259
and abandoned all my testimony,
435
00:39:22,260 --> 00:39:25,179
although I hadn't given them
any particular evidence.
436
00:39:25,180 --> 00:39:28,539
I declared that I didn't consider
myself guilty in any way
437
00:39:28,540 --> 00:39:31,499
and that let them rant on with their
438
00:39:31,500 --> 00:39:37,180
‘subverting', ‘possession'
and ‘distribution'.
439
00:39:39,060 --> 00:39:41,700
After that...
440
00:39:42,140 --> 00:39:44,900
the procurator and the judge...
441
00:39:48,740 --> 00:39:54,020
did what they wanted,
simply to continue with the trial
442
00:39:55,340 --> 00:39:58,299
and so they gave me
the maximum sentence.
443
00:39:58,300 --> 00:40:01,259
Also because of my behaviour
during the investigation:
444
00:40:01,260 --> 00:40:04,820
for the letter, for my jokes
and for everything.
445
00:40:10,300 --> 00:40:12,739
There were some very difficult moments,
446
00:40:12,740 --> 00:40:17,140
I had an illness from
which I almost died.
447
00:40:19,100 --> 00:40:22,540
I asked the doctor
whether I would recover
448
00:40:23,420 --> 00:40:25,740
and he said ‘fifty-fifty'.
449
00:40:27,060 --> 00:40:32,179
And I understood that if I gave
into the course of the illness
450
00:40:32,180 --> 00:40:34,979
and there had already
been intestinal paralysis
451
00:40:34,980 --> 00:40:37,740
and a complete stop to
all my bodily functions…
452
00:40:38,620 --> 00:40:41,499
I understood that if I
stopped fighting this illness
453
00:40:41,500 --> 00:40:44,339
then one could say that
I could calmly slip into death.
454
00:40:44,340 --> 00:40:46,539
And I must say I even
wanted this to happen.
455
00:40:46,540 --> 00:40:48,820
Because then it was considered,
456
00:40:49,380 --> 00:40:53,660
or, rather, seemed
(it was indeed the case at that time)
457
00:40:53,860 --> 00:40:55,939
that I would never get out of that place.
458
00:40:55,940 --> 00:40:59,219
By not admitting my guilt then according
459
00:40:59,220 --> 00:41:03,699
to a Soviet perspective
I was guilty for life.
460
00:41:03,700 --> 00:41:05,819
And the procurator told me
461
00:41:05,820 --> 00:41:09,260
"you'll never see Leningrad
or your parents again".
462
00:41:09,860 --> 00:41:15,540
In those cases one sentence ended and
you're sent down again for some triviality.
463
00:41:16,700 --> 00:41:18,860
So one way or another...
464
00:41:20,100 --> 00:41:24,019
like in Vvedensky's
‘Christmas at the Ivanov's'...
465
00:41:24,020 --> 00:41:26,660
as the boy says
"How I want to die".
466
00:41:27,980 --> 00:41:29,780
But...
467
00:41:30,260 --> 00:41:33,619
I felt pity for my dear ones,
468
00:41:33,620 --> 00:41:36,779
my parents, above all.
469
00:41:36,780 --> 00:41:41,980
And I began to struggle for life
and somehow pulled through.
470
00:41:43,180 --> 00:41:48,300
For my parents I'm sure it was
a worse ordeal than for me.
471
00:41:49,260 --> 00:41:52,580
It wasn't such a pleasant life there.
472
00:41:53,140 --> 00:41:55,980
But there were some
special moments as,
473
00:41:56,940 --> 00:42:01,060
for example, when I worked
as a stoker at different shifts.
474
00:42:01,860 --> 00:42:05,860
That was a great advantage in that you
could somehow ‘drop out' of the routine.
475
00:42:06,900 --> 00:42:09,340
Although, it was very heavy work.
476
00:42:09,660 --> 00:42:11,859
But when everything was already done:
477
00:42:11,860 --> 00:42:14,539
first you have to break
the coal into pieces,
478
00:42:14,540 --> 00:42:17,099
then it is taken to the cart,
throw into the stove
479
00:42:17,100 --> 00:42:19,939
and the stove is cleaned
and the smell of the cart with
480
00:42:19,940 --> 00:42:24,739
all its smoky slag hits you...
481
00:42:24,740 --> 00:42:29,260
and when all this is done and
you go out into the Urals night
482
00:42:30,340 --> 00:42:34,459
and look at the stars as big as my fist,
483
00:42:34,460 --> 00:42:38,020
this is, indeed, real happiness.
484
00:42:41,820 --> 00:42:45,180
As smoke over dampened flame
485
00:42:45,740 --> 00:42:48,700
the news stalks forth, and the word
486
00:42:48,900 --> 00:42:51,939
comes blended with the name
487
00:42:51,940 --> 00:42:54,140
in the accusatory case.
488
00:42:54,700 --> 00:42:57,020
At first inarticulate, as if
489
00:42:57,220 --> 00:42:59,420
some acoustic vessel
490
00:42:59,820 --> 00:43:02,539
was sailing out of the nether realm
491
00:43:02,540 --> 00:43:05,380
of Babylonian distant chaos,
492
00:43:05,660 --> 00:43:09,019
then, massing into a single sound scale,
493
00:43:09,020 --> 00:43:11,819
fricatives, affricates,
sibilants burst forth
494
00:43:11,820 --> 00:43:15,099
making a rustling grove,
495
00:43:15,100 --> 00:43:18,219
a phonetic orchard
496
00:43:18,220 --> 00:43:21,779
blossom in backstreets, along the porches,
497
00:43:21,780 --> 00:43:24,619
along the corners of shabby flats,
498
00:43:24,620 --> 00:43:27,619
coming with the stealthy radio waves
499
00:43:27,620 --> 00:43:30,539
that plough the glacial clouds,
500
00:43:30,540 --> 00:43:34,299
and this passive voice fills
501
00:43:34,300 --> 00:43:37,499
the hoarse air of the two capitals
502
00:43:37,500 --> 00:43:40,899
with a foul fiery dance
503
00:43:40,900 --> 00:43:44,259
of prancing she-demons,
504
00:43:44,260 --> 00:43:47,619
making their dominion
505
00:43:47,620 --> 00:43:50,659
ripple in quavering darkness,
506
00:43:50,660 --> 00:43:53,939
so that the commands from Pluto's realm
507
00:43:53,940 --> 00:43:56,820
might resound in hell as they do in jail.
508
00:43:57,140 --> 00:44:01,019
…The sound draws nearer.
In the vaults of the cell
509
00:44:01,020 --> 00:44:04,060
the lost sound roams astray,
510
00:44:04,580 --> 00:44:07,380
shuddering,
then freezing up as a white butterfly
511
00:44:07,820 --> 00:44:10,860
not grazing the hand outstretched.
512
00:44:31,700 --> 00:44:33,540
Kama...
513
00:44:33,780 --> 00:44:36,100
is a deep, full-flowing river.
514
00:44:38,780 --> 00:44:42,140
Here, on one of its flood banks,
515
00:44:42,780 --> 00:44:45,060
a hundred kilometers from the city of Perm,
516
00:44:45,220 --> 00:44:47,860
is located the leisure resort «Pershino».
517
00:44:55,620 --> 00:44:57,179
I came here
518
00:44:57,180 --> 00:45:00,780
in order to meet and
spend a few May days
519
00:45:01,220 --> 00:45:03,900
with the bio-physicist
and human rights activist,
520
00:45:04,500 --> 00:45:06,660
Sergei Adamovich Kovalev.
521
00:45:12,180 --> 00:45:15,500
Our activity,
our protests arose,
522
00:45:15,900 --> 00:45:18,980
if you like, out of shame.
523
00:45:19,340 --> 00:45:23,219
It was shameful to live
in those circumstances,
524
00:45:23,220 --> 00:45:28,660
shameful to write
these ‘socialist obligations' on demand.
525
00:45:28,980 --> 00:45:31,020
You know what that is like.
526
00:45:31,380 --> 00:45:36,140
It's a completely pointless
piece of paper that
527
00:45:36,460 --> 00:45:41,660
no one would read and you'd forget
about 3 minutes after you've written it.
528
00:45:43,340 --> 00:45:45,979
And you pronounce these
pathetic phrases that
529
00:45:45,980 --> 00:45:49,020
we're going to work even harder,
and all that blah blah blah …
530
00:45:49,220 --> 00:45:51,139
and, "We can look forward to..."
531
00:45:51,140 --> 00:45:53,179
There's nothing we can look forward to!
532
00:45:53,180 --> 00:45:55,619
We looked forward
to getting them off our back.
533
00:45:55,620 --> 00:45:58,579
Take this bloody paper
and stick it up your arse...
534
00:45:58,580 --> 00:46:02,060
well put it in the cupboard and back off.
535
00:46:03,100 --> 00:46:07,179
So shame induced these protests
536
00:46:07,180 --> 00:46:10,020
and this shame intensified when
537
00:46:10,420 --> 00:46:14,179
you spoke up for,
or tried to speak up for
538
00:46:14,180 --> 00:46:16,939
someone in jail, damn it,
539
00:46:16,940 --> 00:46:19,299
it's not that he was
subject to verbal abuse,
540
00:46:19,300 --> 00:46:25,299
he wasn't forced to write
socialist obligations like you.
541
00:46:25,300 --> 00:46:28,220
He was sent to jail
and he is suffering in jail.
542
00:46:29,300 --> 00:46:32,299
Well if someone starts to say,
well they were people,
543
00:46:32,300 --> 00:46:34,059
there's a tendency to do this,
544
00:46:34,060 --> 00:46:37,019
they were people
who thought about their country
545
00:46:37,020 --> 00:46:39,859
and fought so that people
would have it easier,
546
00:46:39,860 --> 00:46:43,339
so that life for people in this
country would start to get better...
547
00:46:43,340 --> 00:46:45,420
this is all lies!
548
00:46:46,020 --> 00:46:49,539
I'm telling you like it is,
I and not only I,
549
00:46:49,540 --> 00:46:52,099
didn't even think about this,
550
00:46:52,100 --> 00:46:56,739
I acted purely out of egoistic concerns,
551
00:46:56,740 --> 00:47:00,699
I wanted to acquire a moral right
552
00:47:00,700 --> 00:47:03,780
to self-respect, damn it!
553
00:47:04,860 --> 00:47:09,179
And in general I want to pursue science
and to continue to do so.
554
00:47:09,180 --> 00:47:13,259
I thought they'll hardly
555
00:47:13,260 --> 00:47:16,020
just go and jail me
for some kind of protest.
556
00:47:17,100 --> 00:47:19,219
But after a very short period of time
557
00:47:19,220 --> 00:47:21,660
I clearly understood
that they'll jail me.
558
00:47:22,020 --> 00:47:24,819
And so then the question arises -
559
00:47:24,820 --> 00:47:27,940
so you want to have the
right to self-respect?
560
00:47:28,780 --> 00:47:31,300
Then you'll have to pay for this!
561
00:47:32,860 --> 00:47:37,699
As it turned out
there were a considerable number of people
562
00:47:37,700 --> 00:47:41,339
ready to pay for this
right with a jail sentence.
563
00:47:41,340 --> 00:47:43,540
That's pretty much how it was.
564
00:47:44,580 --> 00:47:47,179
I want to underline once again that
565
00:47:47,180 --> 00:47:50,940
this was the birth of political idealism.
566
00:47:51,300 --> 00:47:54,419
One must live not according to the rules
567
00:47:54,420 --> 00:47:56,740
but according to one's conscience.
568
00:47:57,180 --> 00:47:59,300
And this is the...
569
00:48:00,340 --> 00:48:02,660
the main global issue today.
570
00:48:03,620 --> 00:48:07,099
That's a long conversation
that we'll have later.
571
00:48:07,100 --> 00:48:09,500
Now I'll go and
get myself a beer.
572
00:48:45,180 --> 00:48:47,220
They're going to hit each other,
573
00:48:47,620 --> 00:48:50,380
they often collide.
574
00:48:55,180 --> 00:48:56,620
Wow, oh boy!
575
00:48:59,620 --> 00:49:01,700
Serious guys!
576
00:49:05,540 --> 00:49:09,740
- That one on the right just came really close to us.
- Yes, yes-yes…
577
00:49:10,100 --> 00:49:13,340
Then it went that way,
a young one, it seems.
578
00:49:13,980 --> 00:49:18,740
Yes, those two there,
walking along the edge.
579
00:49:20,980 --> 00:49:25,100
- It's clear that they're not very strong.
- They're afraid, yes.
580
00:49:31,380 --> 00:49:35,819
- I don't see the females.
- They've gone off somewhere.
581
00:49:35,820 --> 00:49:40,940
- No, here she is.
- Look, they've gone all quiet.
582
00:49:41,540 --> 00:49:45,060
There one of them is standing amongst them,
a large one…
583
00:49:45,500 --> 00:49:47,700
you're such a fine one!
584
00:50:21,740 --> 00:50:25,260
Look it's writhing about…
585
00:50:33,980 --> 00:50:37,140
Where is he?
Over there.
586
00:51:13,980 --> 00:51:16,100
Oh, the sun's just risen.
587
00:51:16,180 --> 00:51:18,140
Look, a beaut!
588
00:51:19,140 --> 00:51:20,900
Oh what a beaut!
589
00:51:21,140 --> 00:51:24,420
Bluish black.
Eyebrows!
590
00:51:27,180 --> 00:51:28,860
A pity, so good looking.
591
00:51:36,100 --> 00:51:39,900
Sergei Adamovich a passionate hunter
since his youth
592
00:51:40,700 --> 00:51:44,460
has a reserve of yarns and tales.
593
00:51:47,260 --> 00:51:50,340
So I asked him
to tell the first yarn
594
00:51:50,660 --> 00:51:52,420
that came to mind.
595
00:52:03,340 --> 00:52:06,379
I'm not going
to tell any preface.
596
00:52:06,380 --> 00:52:08,900
That it was an Indian writer,
597
00:52:09,180 --> 00:52:11,779
and that I don't know his name,
598
00:52:11,780 --> 00:52:14,100
and that he's written a good novel...
599
00:52:14,340 --> 00:52:16,700
and this novel has a parable.
600
00:52:17,260 --> 00:52:20,179
The parable involves a story
in which an Indian prince
601
00:52:20,180 --> 00:52:24,220
travelled with his retinue
who prepared for him
602
00:52:24,620 --> 00:52:27,219
a marquee tent
for his princely repose,
603
00:52:27,220 --> 00:52:30,099
and he had almost fallen asleep
604
00:52:30,100 --> 00:52:34,380
when into the tent flew a dove
and in pursuit was a falcon.
605
00:52:34,700 --> 00:52:37,219
And the dove tried to hide
in some kind of corner,
606
00:52:37,220 --> 00:52:39,899
and the prince stretched out his regal arms
607
00:52:39,900 --> 00:52:41,939
obstructing the falcon's path.
608
00:52:41,940 --> 00:52:44,900
The falcon sat somewhere in the tent
609
00:52:45,220 --> 00:52:48,379
and suddenly addressed
the prince in a human voice
610
00:52:48,380 --> 00:52:51,860
saying "why do you
prevent me from hunting?"
611
00:52:52,300 --> 00:52:53,899
"Because," said the prince
612
00:52:53,900 --> 00:52:57,739
I don't want an innocent
creature to perish.
613
00:52:57,740 --> 00:52:59,899
But the falcon said to him
614
00:52:59,900 --> 00:53:02,619
"nature is built like
that, you understand,"
615
00:53:02,620 --> 00:53:06,580
"I can't feed myself on herbs and grain"
616
00:53:07,340 --> 00:53:10,540
"so how am I guiltier
than that damn dove?"
617
00:53:10,860 --> 00:53:13,859
"Yes, but you will kill it
and I want to..."
618
00:53:13,860 --> 00:53:18,020
"to prevent this cruel killing,"
the prince replied.
619
00:53:18,420 --> 00:53:23,219
"And consequently you want my young to
die of starvation?" says the falcon.
620
00:53:23,220 --> 00:53:26,699
"But can't you hunt somewhere else,"
said the prince.
621
00:53:26,700 --> 00:53:29,979
"So, that's it you want
to save this unfortunate dove"
622
00:53:29,980 --> 00:53:32,260
"at the expense of my poor young ones,"
623
00:53:32,500 --> 00:53:34,700
"please feed them with your own flesh."
624
00:53:37,060 --> 00:53:38,979
So, in short,
625
00:53:38,980 --> 00:53:42,899
they place on one of the balance
scales the weight of this dove.
626
00:53:42,900 --> 00:53:47,100
"Well", says the falcon,
"give of your flesh as much"
627
00:53:47,700 --> 00:53:49,660
"as this bird weighs."
628
00:53:49,900 --> 00:53:51,739
"Fine", said the prince,
629
00:53:51,740 --> 00:53:54,659
and he cut off a large
piece of flesh from his leg,
630
00:53:54,660 --> 00:53:58,979
threw it onto the scales but the arrow
indicating the weight did not even budge.
631
00:53:58,980 --> 00:54:02,139
The dove was much heavier than this meat.
632
00:54:02,140 --> 00:54:04,299
And the prince,
bleeding profusely,
633
00:54:04,300 --> 00:54:07,259
cut piece after piece of flesh
without anything moving.
634
00:54:07,260 --> 00:54:10,259
The prince's servants
were starting to panic,
635
00:54:10,260 --> 00:54:12,539
they addressed the falcon telling him,
636
00:54:12,540 --> 00:54:15,699
"what are you doing foolish bird?"
637
00:54:15,700 --> 00:54:18,219
And the falcon replies
"Well then, do you want
638
00:54:18,220 --> 00:54:21,660
to prevent your prince from
becoming an honest man?"
639
00:54:22,060 --> 00:54:25,900
It continued in this dangerous way
640
00:54:26,180 --> 00:54:28,739
until suddenly,
the weight balanced.
641
00:54:28,740 --> 00:54:31,260
Then the falcon
turned into a god
642
00:54:31,620 --> 00:54:34,179
and sang high praises for the prince
643
00:54:34,180 --> 00:54:36,379
saying, "you are a man of merit!"
644
00:54:36,380 --> 00:54:39,219
"You did a great deed"
645
00:54:39,220 --> 00:54:44,700
"with your own force,
not on someone else's account."
646
00:55:15,620 --> 00:55:19,419
I was arrested on the
27th of December, 1974,
647
00:55:19,420 --> 00:55:20,940
uhhmm the 27th...
648
00:55:21,660 --> 00:55:25,500
well I could have got this one day out.
649
00:55:26,220 --> 00:55:33,220
Then I was brought to the train station
and sent to the camp with my things.
650
00:55:33,540 --> 00:55:36,940
So they led me to the
doors of the "Stolypin car"
651
00:55:37,940 --> 00:55:40,219
and a lieutenant
who had brought me there,
652
00:55:40,220 --> 00:55:42,619
he accompanied me and said
653
00:55:42,620 --> 00:55:44,779
"That one to the "troinik".
654
00:55:44,780 --> 00:55:49,420
A "troinik" -
is a small room meant for three people.
655
00:55:51,940 --> 00:55:54,620
I was transported alone
without cellmates.
656
00:55:56,940 --> 00:55:59,900
At first we went through, mmm…
657
00:56:00,340 --> 00:56:03,499
how could this happen?
I think they brought me
658
00:56:03,500 --> 00:56:06,580
first through Nizhny Novgorod,
then through Yaroslavl'.
659
00:56:06,860 --> 00:56:09,099
I don't remember
what the route was like.
660
00:56:09,100 --> 00:56:10,940
Anyway it's not important.
661
00:56:11,780 --> 00:56:14,499
Well when you travel
through various cities…
662
00:56:14,500 --> 00:56:17,539
and we passed through Kirov…
So where are they taking you?
663
00:56:17,540 --> 00:56:19,980
To Perm!
Where else?!
664
00:56:33,820 --> 00:56:35,460
You see...
665
00:56:36,460 --> 00:56:42,419
we, my generation,
we became active citizens,
666
00:56:42,420 --> 00:56:45,179
in the sixties, in the eighties,
667
00:56:45,180 --> 00:56:50,580
if you want, it's directly
linked to the Khrushchev thaw.
668
00:56:51,540 --> 00:56:55,420
Then society had sort of woken up
669
00:56:55,780 --> 00:57:00,260
because after Khrushchev's
denunciation of Stalin at the XX congress,
670
00:57:00,580 --> 00:57:03,939
it turned out that it was possible to say
671
00:57:03,940 --> 00:57:07,219
deeply critical things
about Soviet power.
672
00:57:07,220 --> 00:57:11,419
This was apparent in this period
673
00:57:11,420 --> 00:57:15,339
when it suddenly became
possible to criticize Stalin.
674
00:57:15,340 --> 00:57:18,380
It was a remarkable lesson.
675
00:57:18,940 --> 00:57:22,659
And then we, those like me,
676
00:57:22,660 --> 00:57:27,379
seized any information
from outside the iron curtain.
677
00:57:27,380 --> 00:57:31,779
We had an avid interest! How did
people live in the rest of the world?
678
00:57:31,780 --> 00:57:33,820
What happened in the outside world?
679
00:57:34,340 --> 00:57:37,539
And so we fell into the trap
680
00:57:37,540 --> 00:57:41,180
of yet another innocent mistake.
681
00:57:41,780 --> 00:57:43,939
We live god knows where,
682
00:57:43,940 --> 00:57:46,139
everything about us
is rather inhuman,
683
00:57:46,140 --> 00:57:49,780
look how the rest of the world lives.
684
00:57:51,100 --> 00:57:53,220
Everything was about ‘realpolitik',
685
00:57:53,660 --> 00:57:57,180
we didn't really recognize this,
we believed that
686
00:57:57,460 --> 00:58:00,939
in the West life was built in accordance
687
00:58:00,940 --> 00:58:05,099
with what was called ‘universal values'.
688
00:58:05,100 --> 00:58:07,460
This was not ‘realpolitik'
689
00:58:07,980 --> 00:58:11,580
but a politics of values
and not interests.
690
00:58:12,100 --> 00:58:14,859
Then it later became clear that
691
00:58:14,860 --> 00:58:17,739
everyone lives in
more-or-less the same way,
692
00:58:17,740 --> 00:58:22,739
and that ideal world exists
only in people's ideals.
693
00:58:22,740 --> 00:58:25,420
And doesn't exist
in any reality anywhere.
694
00:58:27,300 --> 00:58:30,779
This has become clear nowadays
695
00:58:30,780 --> 00:58:33,939
but then like fools we considered
696
00:58:33,940 --> 00:58:37,299
"We stand for noble ideas,
697
00:58:37,300 --> 00:58:44,860
which are there, just there in the West,
they are triumphant!"
698
00:58:45,420 --> 00:58:49,899
Of course, one can't compare
the policy in existence there
699
00:58:49,900 --> 00:58:52,380
which Western countries undertake
700
00:58:53,100 --> 00:58:56,180
with the hideous things which
are happening over here.
701
00:58:56,820 --> 00:59:02,140
But, nonetheless, I'd say
that these are things of the same nature,
702
00:59:02,620 --> 00:59:06,579
so when we become indignant about
703
00:59:06,580 --> 00:59:09,140
that which is happening all around us…
704
00:59:09,700 --> 00:59:11,819
we mustn't forget
705
00:59:11,820 --> 00:59:15,739
that this crisis…
706
00:59:15,740 --> 00:59:19,579
a moral, historic and legal
707
00:59:19,580 --> 00:59:22,059
crisis is a global one!
708
00:59:22,060 --> 00:59:25,059
It shakes the whole world
709
00:59:25,060 --> 00:59:30,180
and in fact we taking
our cue from Andrei Sakharov,
710
00:59:30,660 --> 00:59:34,059
we must think about global politics
711
00:59:34,060 --> 00:59:36,660
and not only about Russian politics.
712
00:59:44,420 --> 00:59:47,700
It rained all day
on the eve of our farewell.
713
00:59:49,660 --> 00:59:51,220
It was cold.
714
00:59:51,340 --> 00:59:54,620
And it felt that this weather
would linger on for a long time.
715
00:59:57,980 --> 01:00:00,820
But time passed by imperceptibly
716
01:00:01,420 --> 01:00:04,100
leaving behind a mass
of unasked questions.
717
01:00:06,220 --> 01:00:09,180
Therefore we decided to meet again
718
01:00:10,100 --> 01:00:12,380
during the "Pilorama" Forum.
719
01:00:29,340 --> 01:00:31,420
A scorching July day.
720
01:00:33,140 --> 01:00:37,260
A ferocious heat but the sun barely
appears from the low, thundery clouds.
721
01:00:41,060 --> 01:00:45,460
The organizers hastily conclude
their preparations to open the forum
722
01:00:45,980 --> 01:00:48,660
which already opens tomorrow (on Saturday).
723
01:00:50,900 --> 01:00:54,740
But the majority of the guests will
arrive today, on the Friday evening
724
01:00:55,340 --> 01:00:57,579
and will be housed in the tented camp
725
01:00:57,580 --> 01:01:00,500
set up in the field opposite the museum.
726
01:01:08,900 --> 01:01:10,420
The morning.
727
01:01:11,540 --> 01:01:15,100
The camp reluctantly
awakes after a rainy night.
728
01:01:17,660 --> 01:01:23,500
The organizers chose the last
weekend of July precisely
729
01:01:24,820 --> 01:01:30,420
because statistically, during this period,
the weather is usually warm and dry.
730
01:01:32,700 --> 01:01:35,339
But for several years now
731
01:01:35,340 --> 01:01:37,380
it has only been dry once
732
01:01:37,940 --> 01:01:40,740
and that year there was a sweltering heat.
733
01:01:42,620 --> 01:01:46,820
The remaining times it has
been rather cold and wet.
734
01:01:49,500 --> 01:01:53,940
Fortunately, visitors to the Forum are not
frightened off by the capricious weather.
735
01:01:54,500 --> 01:01:58,340
And, in spite of the foul weather,
another third of the guests
736
01:01:58,500 --> 01:02:01,580
will come at midday
for the opening ceremony.
737
01:02:15,700 --> 01:02:20,460
Dear friends, we are once again
gathered here at «Pilorama».
738
01:02:20,900 --> 01:02:23,700
It is taking place this year
for the eighth time.
739
01:02:24,300 --> 01:02:26,540
It was founded in 2005
740
01:02:27,580 --> 01:02:30,740
as a folk song gathering
to mark the Museum's anniversary,
741
01:02:31,100 --> 01:02:35,300
but since 2007 it has become a civil forum
742
01:02:36,820 --> 01:02:40,260
drawing a large audience.
743
01:02:40,620 --> 01:02:43,300
Our "Pilorama" is a rather accurate
744
01:02:44,140 --> 01:02:49,420
replica of Russian society.
745
01:02:50,420 --> 01:02:53,419
Beyond the Boyarka river,
coming here, you can see
746
01:02:53,420 --> 01:02:57,100
the largest tent, the highest flags -
747
01:02:57,300 --> 01:02:59,500
they are those of the Communists,
748
01:03:00,100 --> 01:03:03,380
those of ‘Sut' Vremeni'
[the Essence of Time].
749
01:03:03,740 --> 01:03:06,739
Here there are the liberals,
very different groups.
750
01:03:06,740 --> 01:03:11,379
Amidst us now are former
political prisoners of this camp:
751
01:03:11,380 --> 01:03:15,380
Victor Pestov,
our neighbour from Yekaterinburg,
752
01:03:15,980 --> 01:03:17,620
Mikhail Meylakh…
753
01:03:18,420 --> 01:03:19,740
Mikhail Borisovich...
754
01:03:19,820 --> 01:03:23,819
well, it's hard even to pinpoint
755
01:03:23,820 --> 01:03:27,500
how Mikhail Borisovich
found himself in this camp.
756
01:03:27,740 --> 01:03:30,139
He wasn't an active dissident but
757
01:03:30,140 --> 01:03:34,380
he managed to build an independent
life under Soviet power
758
01:03:34,620 --> 01:03:38,619
and do what he most loved.
759
01:03:38,620 --> 01:03:41,619
At the same time he collected
a huge samizdat library,
760
01:03:41,620 --> 01:03:44,620
for which Soviet power sent him to prison.
761
01:03:46,780 --> 01:03:49,139
Sergei Kovalev
762
01:03:49,140 --> 01:03:51,580
visits us each year
763
01:03:51,980 --> 01:03:54,700
so obviously there is little
need to introduce him.
764
01:03:55,900 --> 01:03:58,059
Few people know that...
765
01:03:58,060 --> 01:04:05,420
in the 1980s there were three people
from the Kovalev family in jail.
766
01:04:05,580 --> 01:04:11,020
Sergei Adamovich spent time in this prison
camp and was sent to exile to Kolyma.
767
01:04:11,340 --> 01:04:13,780
Ivan Kovalev was jailed
in camp Perm-36
768
01:04:13,900 --> 01:04:16,499
and Ivan's wife Tanya
Osipova was imprisoned
769
01:04:16,500 --> 01:04:19,500
in a camp in Mordovia
for female political prisoners.
770
01:04:20,020 --> 01:04:22,579
There are also political prisoners
771
01:04:22,580 --> 01:04:25,819
who served their sentences in other camps:
772
01:04:25,820 --> 01:04:29,100
Vyacheslav Bakhmin and
Arseny Roginsky.
773
01:04:31,020 --> 01:04:33,979
I won't name all the
international participants,
774
01:04:33,980 --> 01:04:37,899
those people, those
guests who you will see,
775
01:04:37,900 --> 01:04:40,420
listen to and talk with.
776
01:04:41,220 --> 01:04:43,780
Friends, I declare "Pilorama" is open.
Thank you!
777
01:04:53,180 --> 01:04:56,620
At «Pilorama», one instantly submerges
into a whole train of events:
778
01:04:58,220 --> 01:05:01,980
exhibitions, concerts,
shows, film screenings.
779
01:05:05,060 --> 01:05:07,820
One of the main goals
of the Forum organizers
780
01:05:08,300 --> 01:05:10,580
is to enlighten the public.
781
01:05:18,980 --> 01:05:21,020
I greet my mum!
782
01:05:23,300 --> 01:05:27,780
It seems that both the politician
and the artist feels at home here.
783
01:05:32,380 --> 01:05:35,980
Also at the Forum discussions
on serious subjects are held.
784
01:05:36,980 --> 01:05:38,540
For example like this one:
785
01:05:39,300 --> 01:05:43,740
entitled "20 Years After
The USSR, Gains and Losses".
786
01:05:48,180 --> 01:05:50,419
I wish to give the floor to a person
787
01:05:50,420 --> 01:05:53,259
who it would take a
long time to introduce
788
01:05:53,260 --> 01:05:56,979
and anyway needs little
introduction to people here.
789
01:05:56,980 --> 01:05:59,540
That is Sergei Adamovich Kovalev.
790
01:05:59,860 --> 01:06:01,780
I claim that
791
01:06:02,060 --> 01:06:06,380
the breakdown of the
Soviet Union was inevitable,
792
01:06:07,060 --> 01:06:08,820
historically inevitable.
793
01:06:09,180 --> 01:06:12,780
And now what happened in our country.
794
01:06:13,340 --> 01:06:18,300
We couldn't even imagine
a conversation of this kind back then.
795
01:06:18,580 --> 01:06:22,139
I don't know how many would
have been sent to camps,
796
01:06:22,140 --> 01:06:24,339
how many would have
become informers
797
01:06:24,340 --> 01:06:27,580
but I'm certain of one thing.
798
01:06:29,100 --> 01:06:33,700
Little good would have
come to this audience.
799
01:06:34,100 --> 01:06:36,259
And it would be terrible to imagine what
800
01:06:36,260 --> 01:06:39,180
would have happened to Shmyrov
(the director of Perm-36).
801
01:06:40,860 --> 01:06:43,739
But you should know
that our new authorities
802
01:06:43,740 --> 01:06:46,859
are more sophisticated
in the art of imitation
803
01:06:46,860 --> 01:06:51,300
than in the Soviet Union.
804
01:06:51,780 --> 01:06:55,659
And so what! So how many people
have gathered here? About 100.
805
01:06:55,660 --> 01:06:58,419
So 100 people have
gathered, let them speak
806
01:06:58,420 --> 01:07:00,580
or debate amongst themselves.
807
01:07:00,820 --> 01:07:03,820
Let them let off some steam,
808
01:07:04,140 --> 01:07:06,180
let the young in their...
809
01:07:06,700 --> 01:07:11,220
patriotic T-shirts speak
810
01:07:12,180 --> 01:07:14,739
and row with their elders.
811
01:07:14,740 --> 01:07:17,379
Is this frightening for anyone?
812
01:07:17,380 --> 01:07:19,700
Is the state afraid of this? No!
813
01:07:20,020 --> 01:07:21,899
As Mandelshtam wrote:
814
01:07:21,900 --> 01:07:24,740
"…We live, not sensing
our own country beneath us,
815
01:07:25,260 --> 01:07:29,140
ten steps away they
evaporate, our speeches…".
816
01:07:29,820 --> 01:07:34,179
And time and again
you meet a young man
817
01:07:34,180 --> 01:07:38,499
who has the words USSR
on his gaudy T-shirt
818
01:07:38,500 --> 01:07:41,539
and something else written
819
01:07:41,540 --> 01:07:45,060
and you find that he is
a passionate follower of Stalin.
820
01:07:45,460 --> 01:07:48,540
He has never seen
and never heard this Stalin
821
01:07:48,780 --> 01:07:51,500
and he never heard
or seen the USSR
822
01:07:51,740 --> 01:07:53,860
having been born
after its breakup.
823
01:07:54,700 --> 01:07:56,579
Thank you, Sergei Adamovich.
824
01:07:56,580 --> 01:08:01,259
- You can ask any questions later.
- When exactly? How much time remains?
825
01:08:01,260 --> 01:08:04,460
- You haven't understood me?
- I'm asking you.
826
01:08:05,100 --> 01:08:07,700
I told you that I'll answer you
827
01:08:08,020 --> 01:08:12,100
after Mikhail Meylakh has spoken.
Over to you.
828
01:08:12,780 --> 01:08:15,460
The breakup of the Soviet Union.
829
01:08:16,260 --> 01:08:19,339
Well of course it was inevitable.
830
01:08:19,340 --> 01:08:22,019
The fact that the Soviet Union
831
01:08:22,020 --> 01:08:25,259
had inherited the worst
aspects of the empire,
832
01:08:25,260 --> 01:08:27,780
this is also completely evident.
833
01:08:28,460 --> 01:08:30,860
The medieval consciousness
834
01:08:31,700 --> 01:08:34,659
which had been inherited
from the time of the tsars
835
01:08:34,660 --> 01:08:37,539
and then in the Soviet Empire
has also been preserved
836
01:08:37,540 --> 01:08:44,180
to a large extent too in our society.
837
01:08:44,580 --> 01:08:49,059
I'll give you an example
from my own prison experience.
838
01:08:49,060 --> 01:08:52,380
When I was still in
the pretrial detention cell,
839
01:08:52,940 --> 01:08:55,659
we were only given a copy
of the newspaper Pravda.
840
01:08:55,660 --> 01:08:57,979
And so one day
the cell window opens
841
01:08:57,980 --> 01:09:00,579
and we are given Pravda
with the following words:
842
01:09:00,580 --> 01:09:03,899
"If you start to get excited you'll
be sent to the punishment cell".
843
01:09:03,900 --> 01:09:06,219
What wasn't it possible
to get excited about?
844
01:09:06,220 --> 01:09:08,779
It turned out to be
the death of the most
845
01:09:08,780 --> 01:09:11,900
insignificant of all the rulers, Chernenko.
846
01:09:14,220 --> 01:09:15,460
Thank you.
847
01:09:15,900 --> 01:09:17,860
Thank you, Mikhail Borisovich.
848
01:09:18,740 --> 01:09:22,340
Now … sit down, young man,
sit down, hold your horses,
849
01:09:23,180 --> 01:09:26,939
those ladies and gentlemen in red,
850
01:09:26,940 --> 01:09:29,979
those resting on
each other's shoulders
851
01:09:29,980 --> 01:09:33,539
impatient to express themselves,
852
01:09:33,540 --> 01:09:36,699
and people of other colours, clothes
853
01:09:36,700 --> 01:09:39,379
and persuasions
also can have your say.
854
01:09:39,380 --> 01:09:41,579
When I used to work on month-long shifts…
855
01:09:41,580 --> 01:09:44,339
Wait, wait a moment.
You've already asked a question,
856
01:09:44,340 --> 01:09:47,019
now one has begun to speak,
please sit down
857
01:09:47,020 --> 01:09:49,619
and take it in turns.
Carry on, young man.
858
01:09:49,620 --> 01:09:52,899
I have a question about something
relevant to the discussion.
859
01:09:52,900 --> 01:09:55,859
The title is 20 Years After The USSR:
Gains and Losses.
860
01:09:55,860 --> 01:10:00,140
As far as I know you were
dissidents during the Soviet Union.
861
01:10:00,860 --> 01:10:04,579
From your words I have heard
about a single gain
862
01:10:04,580 --> 01:10:08,540
since the breakup of the Soviet Union.
863
01:10:09,340 --> 01:10:11,699
We are only speaking about the losses.
864
01:10:11,700 --> 01:10:15,459
- Our gains are too obvious.
- For example?
865
01:10:15,460 --> 01:10:19,339
A lot has been stated. There is
freedom, above all freedom…
866
01:10:19,340 --> 01:10:22,179
- Freedom of what?
- There are many freedoms.
867
01:10:22,180 --> 01:10:27,860
Freedom of travel. Before practically
no one could travel abroad.
868
01:10:28,260 --> 01:10:31,059
Even though the
registration system remains,
869
01:10:31,060 --> 01:10:35,740
but the severe Soviet registration system
(apart from Moscow) has ended.
870
01:10:36,140 --> 01:10:39,299
Free enterprise.
Yes, a million freedoms
871
01:10:39,300 --> 01:10:41,540
that people didn't dream of before.
872
01:10:42,060 --> 01:10:45,739
Let's take it in turns.
You have asked your question.
873
01:10:45,740 --> 01:10:48,740
This lady here.
Please, you've already asked a question?!
874
01:10:49,180 --> 01:10:51,979
For 20 years I've dealt
with human mentality
875
01:10:51,980 --> 01:10:54,379
working with very different people.
876
01:10:54,380 --> 01:10:57,259
My impression is that just
as they used to believe that
877
01:10:57,260 --> 01:11:00,579
things were better in
the USSR so do they now.
878
01:11:00,580 --> 01:11:04,139
Just as they wanted the USSR,
so do they want it now.
879
01:11:04,140 --> 01:11:08,220
Just as they used to work in the
USSR so they continue to work.
880
01:11:09,060 --> 01:11:13,219
So there is a paradox that if one
were to behave democratically
881
01:11:13,220 --> 01:11:17,659
then it means one needs
to create a new USSR,
882
01:11:17,660 --> 01:11:19,900
if that's what the people want.
883
01:11:25,340 --> 01:11:30,660
Yes, there is a fairly
large number of people,
884
01:11:31,140 --> 01:11:33,940
I don't know
what the percentage is.
885
01:11:34,660 --> 01:11:37,059
Maybe even half...
886
01:11:37,060 --> 01:11:43,220
who would want to return
to that historic period.
887
01:11:43,620 --> 01:11:47,059
It's possible that our
much suffering nation
888
01:11:47,060 --> 01:11:50,900
will choose the
wrong path again.
889
01:11:52,220 --> 01:11:55,019
I don't know whether you'll be
happy about such a thing…
890
01:11:55,020 --> 01:11:57,539
I'd be sad about it.
891
01:11:57,540 --> 01:12:01,939
Those who say that the
people want Soviet order.
892
01:12:01,940 --> 01:12:10,779
But excuse me, democracy is not
above all the power of the majority.
893
01:12:10,780 --> 01:12:13,859
Democracy is the rights
of the minority.
894
01:12:13,860 --> 01:12:20,219
- You lie. It's called an oligarchy.
- If you continue to speak in that tone
895
01:12:20,220 --> 01:12:23,059
and with those expression
896
01:12:23,060 --> 01:12:25,819
then I'm afraid things
will turn out badly for you.
897
01:12:25,820 --> 01:12:30,540
- A true liberal.
- For a start, they'll kick you out, got it?
898
01:12:34,940 --> 01:12:39,059
- So, never mind.
- You attacked me 3 years ago when I spoke to you.
899
01:12:39,060 --> 01:12:41,499
There's no need to be rude.
Can you get out of here?!
900
01:12:41,500 --> 01:12:44,020
Yeah sure I attacked.
901
01:12:44,660 --> 01:12:47,179
Let's stand near
each other and look at
902
01:12:47,180 --> 01:12:51,700
who could have attacked whom.
903
01:12:52,420 --> 01:12:55,540
You in a whole group attacked one person.
904
01:12:56,100 --> 01:13:00,419
You have the right
to your position,
905
01:13:00,420 --> 01:13:04,140
your point of view and
I won't impinge on that right.
906
01:13:04,540 --> 01:13:07,259
But neither should
you impinge on my rights.
907
01:13:07,260 --> 01:13:10,059
The death of many soldiers
is on your conscience.
908
01:13:10,060 --> 01:13:14,019
Listen, shut it, otherwise
you're going to fly out of here!
909
01:13:14,020 --> 01:13:17,619
- I don't want to sit here, let him leave.
- Leave, quickly!
910
01:13:17,620 --> 01:13:20,379
- You leave!
- Calm down, sit down.
911
01:13:20,380 --> 01:13:22,980
- Go on, you leave!!
- Calm down, sit down.
912
01:13:25,740 --> 01:13:28,380
Listen let...
913
01:13:30,980 --> 01:13:33,860
let me answer you Madam.
914
01:13:35,540 --> 01:13:38,140
Some silence please.
915
01:13:48,540 --> 01:13:52,619
Listen, those lads in the red T-shirts
916
01:13:52,620 --> 01:13:56,340
have come here specially
to scuttle the proceedings.
917
01:13:58,140 --> 01:14:01,540
Let's try to continue now.
918
01:14:04,660 --> 01:14:10,260
This girl there has had her hand up for
such long time, it's almost dropping off!
919
01:14:17,580 --> 01:14:20,700
After midday,
I set off to the tented camp
920
01:14:21,100 --> 01:14:23,780
and there I run into
some lads with red T-shirts.
921
01:14:26,740 --> 01:14:29,660
I asked them to introduce
themselves and tell me
922
01:14:30,660 --> 01:14:33,020
why they came to Pilorama.
923
01:14:41,260 --> 01:14:43,460
My name is Sergei Andriyanov,
924
01:14:43,500 --> 01:14:46,299
I'm the First Secretary of
the Perm Lenin Committee
925
01:14:46,300 --> 01:14:48,980
of the Communist Union of Youth.
926
01:14:49,740 --> 01:14:52,060
The aim of the visit.
Well, Pilorama
927
01:14:52,460 --> 01:14:55,859
has been designated by the
organizers as a territory of freedom,
928
01:14:55,860 --> 01:14:59,619
as a space where people can come,
discuss, express their opinions.
929
01:14:59,620 --> 01:15:03,939
We came here with our
position on our history,
930
01:15:03,940 --> 01:15:07,579
about our view on the contemporary set up,
we take part in discussions…
931
01:15:07,580 --> 01:15:10,859
Of course, now the situation
is rather different.
932
01:15:10,860 --> 01:15:14,499
If in previous years
we came here as opponents
933
01:15:14,500 --> 01:15:17,460
then this time there are
points of convergence.
934
01:15:17,820 --> 01:15:22,980
I understand that to some extent
you have some competitors?
935
01:15:23,340 --> 01:15:26,419
By competitors do you mean
the second camp with red flags?
936
01:15:26,420 --> 01:15:28,579
Well, they already came here last year.
937
01:15:28,580 --> 01:15:31,620
Now you see Putin wished to remain in power
938
01:15:32,420 --> 01:15:35,739
and it was widely stated
that those against him
939
01:15:35,740 --> 01:15:38,060
were western spies.
940
01:15:38,180 --> 01:15:42,940
So to fight against these western spies they
created the organization "Sut' Vremeni",
941
01:15:43,420 --> 01:15:46,860
which acts like a parasite
on Soviet symbols.
942
01:15:47,460 --> 01:15:52,620
So you want to say that you haven't
yet found points of convergence.
943
01:15:52,860 --> 01:15:56,259
What points? They are an openly
antagonistic organization.
944
01:15:56,260 --> 01:15:58,499
They're in favour of Putin!
945
01:15:58,500 --> 01:16:01,699
Yes, many of their activists
say that they're against Putin
946
01:16:01,700 --> 01:16:04,859
but they are playing for his team.
947
01:16:04,860 --> 01:16:09,459
They try to tell citizens that
948
01:16:09,460 --> 01:16:13,460
all opponents are spies, in favour
of the Orange Revolutions and so on.
949
01:16:13,900 --> 01:16:17,139
Therefore they defend
Putin even if not directly
950
01:16:17,140 --> 01:16:19,419
and because they are our enemies.
951
01:16:19,420 --> 01:16:21,179
We just need to explain to people
952
01:16:21,180 --> 01:16:24,140
what kind of organization
it is and what its goals are.
953
01:16:24,180 --> 01:16:27,739
There are many people who are
the against present-day authorities
954
01:16:27,740 --> 01:16:29,939
but are positive about the Soviet past.
955
01:16:29,940 --> 01:16:33,179
They persuaded many of these
people to support their side.
956
01:16:33,180 --> 01:16:35,579
If we were together we would be stronger
957
01:16:35,580 --> 01:16:38,980
but they convinced people
with their talk about foreign spies.
958
01:16:39,340 --> 01:16:43,699
Tell me, why do you insist on those
two figureheads: Lenin and Stalin?
959
01:16:43,700 --> 01:16:48,419
Let's take Stalin. Why do you use
his name and images of him?
960
01:16:48,420 --> 01:16:52,580
Both Lenin and Stalin
created the Soviet Union.
961
01:16:52,940 --> 01:16:56,900
Without this country, without those
reforms that they carried out
962
01:16:57,300 --> 01:17:00,660
then Russia would never have
survived the Second World War.
963
01:17:01,020 --> 01:17:04,459
Consider that the country was agrarian and
964
01:17:04,460 --> 01:17:07,179
to undertake industrialisation,
to make that leap,
965
01:17:07,180 --> 01:17:09,219
we could only do so with that
966
01:17:09,220 --> 01:17:12,820
hard work which these
two leaders implemented.
967
01:17:13,220 --> 01:17:15,859
Therefore, naturally,
we honour their memory and
968
01:17:15,860 --> 01:17:19,499
we come out very strongly against
any attempts to brainwash people,
969
01:17:19,500 --> 01:17:23,059
when people try to dirty the
reputations of these two great people.
970
01:17:23,060 --> 01:17:26,459
It is unjust. As though any other
path for Russia were possible.
971
01:17:26,460 --> 01:17:29,299
There was another path:
to remain an agrarian country
972
01:17:29,300 --> 01:17:32,059
and become some other country's colony.
That was all,
973
01:17:32,060 --> 01:17:34,380
the choice was very narrow in reality.
974
01:17:34,860 --> 01:17:38,579
I understand, but the price of
human lives doesn't put you off?
975
01:17:38,580 --> 01:17:40,900
And what would the price have been,
976
01:17:42,220 --> 01:17:45,059
if Germany had occupied Russia?
977
01:17:45,060 --> 01:17:50,020
The fact is that Stalinist repression
began well before the WWII.
978
01:17:50,220 --> 01:17:52,339
Everyone talks about 1937,
979
01:17:52,340 --> 01:17:55,619
but contemporaries of the time,
the simple inhabitants,
980
01:17:55,620 --> 01:17:59,620
didn't notice that anything
was happening to the country.
981
01:17:59,820 --> 01:18:01,939
They use numbers, which ones?!
982
01:18:01,940 --> 01:18:04,739
That 800 thousand people
were repressed, shot, right?
983
01:18:04,740 --> 01:18:07,659
That's more or less realistic,
of course there are those
984
01:18:07,660 --> 01:18:09,780
who say 20 million,
some say that.
985
01:18:10,020 --> 01:18:13,420
Look 800,000 in a country with
a population of almost 300 million,
986
01:18:13,660 --> 01:18:18,620
you know more people die nowadays.
About a million die each year.
987
01:18:18,740 --> 01:18:22,619
They believe that in capitalism
it's a matter of course,
988
01:18:22,620 --> 01:18:25,219
that from drugs,
criminality and other things.
989
01:18:25,220 --> 01:18:28,619
And yet there someone was guilty,
an evil man who killed everyone.
990
01:18:28,620 --> 01:18:32,699
But all this is not quite true.
And there's another thing.
991
01:18:32,700 --> 01:18:37,699
I'm acquainted with someone who
told me how they repressed his father.
992
01:18:37,700 --> 01:18:40,819
In a spurious way.
It turned out he was accused
993
01:18:40,820 --> 01:18:46,099
by a militia man who
had been a white guard
994
01:18:46,100 --> 01:18:48,939
and who had stolen
someone else's papers.
995
01:18:48,940 --> 01:18:51,180
So there were cases of sabotage.
996
01:18:51,620 --> 01:18:54,659
And that's not the only case,
there were many.
997
01:18:54,660 --> 01:18:56,939
And his father said
that he was in Kolyma
998
01:18:56,940 --> 01:18:59,739
and there many enemies
really were imprisoned,
999
01:18:59,740 --> 01:19:03,139
those who simply wished to get
their own back on the country
1000
01:19:03,140 --> 01:19:06,179
and dreamed of revenge
for some wrongs done to them.
1001
01:19:06,180 --> 01:19:09,620
Those whose personal ambitions
were greater than their country.
1002
01:19:11,660 --> 01:19:15,700
Tell me have you been in conflict
with Kovalev for a long time?
1003
01:19:16,060 --> 01:19:20,140
Well in 2008 when I first came here
1004
01:19:20,940 --> 01:19:23,380
when I met Kovalev
1005
01:19:23,660 --> 01:19:26,019
I asked him whether he dreamt
1006
01:19:26,020 --> 01:19:29,060
about the lads who had
perished in Chechnya.
1007
01:19:29,340 --> 01:19:32,499
So what had caused this question?
1008
01:19:32,500 --> 01:19:35,299
A soldier had heard
on the army transmitter
1009
01:19:35,300 --> 01:19:38,019
how he had called on them to surrender,
1010
01:19:38,020 --> 01:19:40,939
and in fact those who
surrendered never returned home.
1011
01:19:40,940 --> 01:19:43,099
Well I asked him the question
1012
01:19:43,100 --> 01:19:46,939
and he became very nervous
and the director of the Museum
1013
01:19:46,940 --> 01:19:50,739
Shmyrnov and his son jumped on me
as though I were some kind of hooligan
1014
01:19:50,740 --> 01:19:53,179
and grabbed my arms.
So a fight developed.
1015
01:19:53,180 --> 01:19:56,819
They called the police and
the plice saw that there was
1016
01:19:56,820 --> 01:20:00,539
no criminal action on our part,
we didn't throw our fists at them.
1017
01:20:00,540 --> 01:20:02,900
Well, that's the kind of conflict.
1018
01:20:03,220 --> 01:20:05,459
And did this conflict continue or not?
1019
01:20:05,460 --> 01:20:08,579
And in our discussion people
asked him the same questions
1020
01:20:08,580 --> 01:20:12,979
and met with the same reaction,
he gets nervous, the women around him
1021
01:20:12,980 --> 01:20:15,099
come running up
and start to get crazy.
1022
01:20:15,100 --> 01:20:18,859
One can see his intolerance, he talks
about freedom of conscience
1023
01:20:18,860 --> 01:20:22,340
and human thought. Yet he
is extremely intolerant himself.
1024
01:20:23,700 --> 01:20:27,139
Can I ask your colleagues
to introduce themselves
1025
01:20:27,140 --> 01:20:29,300
or would you like to introduce them?
1026
01:20:31,020 --> 01:20:35,899
Yevgeni Yermolaev – the press secretary
of the Leninist Communist Union of Youth.
1027
01:20:35,900 --> 01:20:40,620
And Vassily Malginov – assistant secretary for
propaganda and agitation of the Komsomol.
1028
01:20:45,340 --> 01:20:49,780
This 2012 year, the Culture
Ministry of Perm Region,
1029
01:20:50,460 --> 01:20:52,780
slashed the budget for Pilorama.
1030
01:20:55,580 --> 01:20:59,420
Voices were heard that this
would be the last Pilorama
1031
01:20:59,780 --> 01:21:02,460
and that next year
there would be no event.
1032
01:21:04,900 --> 01:21:09,380
Perhaps it was for this reason that the
organisers decided to conduct an auction
1033
01:21:10,220 --> 01:21:12,500
during the closing
ceremony of the Forum.
1034
01:21:17,060 --> 01:21:20,819
- What shall we start with?
- Well listen, we'll go about it like this:
1035
01:21:20,820 --> 01:21:24,339
we'll start with the minimal and…
1036
01:21:24,340 --> 01:21:28,459
- Don't be greedy!
- And we'll take it step by step,
1037
01:21:28,460 --> 01:21:33,259
yes, each step will be
an increase of 50 roubles.
1038
01:21:33,260 --> 01:21:36,419
We'll start with that.
50 roubles for all that.
1039
01:21:36,420 --> 01:21:39,700
Step one – 50 roubles,
one step – a raised hand. OK?
1040
01:21:40,460 --> 01:21:43,419
Let's start then.
I already see – 100, yes?
1041
01:21:43,420 --> 01:21:45,099
100!
Excellent.
1042
01:21:45,100 --> 01:21:49,580
100 roubles for one large lot
entitled Big Pilorama.
1043
01:21:50,140 --> 01:21:52,299
150.
Excellent.
1044
01:21:52,300 --> 01:21:54,260
200 roubles.
1045
01:21:55,180 --> 01:21:58,980
250.
I see 300. 350.
1046
01:22:00,300 --> 01:22:04,419
400. So, 500.
550. 600.
1047
01:22:04,420 --> 01:22:07,460
2 000!
4 000!
1048
01:22:07,980 --> 01:22:10,099
8 000.
9 000!
1049
01:22:10,100 --> 01:22:12,979
18 000!
20 000! W-e-l-l!
1050
01:22:12,980 --> 01:22:17,419
28 000. Great.
Well, just a little more. 29 000.
1051
01:22:17,420 --> 01:22:19,899
29 000?
30 000 roubles!
1052
01:22:19,900 --> 01:22:24,020
And what's your name?
Olga, Olga, I'm proud of you.
1053
01:22:24,460 --> 01:22:28,179
Well then dear friends!
A very large Pilorama,
1054
01:22:28,180 --> 01:22:32,259
a large and generous and not
the last Pilorama, is at stake here.
1055
01:22:32,260 --> 01:22:34,260
30 000 going once.
1056
01:22:35,100 --> 01:22:39,459
- 30 000 going twice.
- 30 000 three times.
1057
01:22:39,460 --> 01:22:41,820
Hurrah!
1058
01:22:43,540 --> 01:22:47,299
Viktor Smyrov, please come up
to the stage and receive
1059
01:22:47,300 --> 01:22:51,219
the honest money
collected by your followers.
1060
01:22:51,220 --> 01:22:53,340
A round of applause!
1061
01:22:55,140 --> 01:22:57,420
Dear friends,
1062
01:22:57,700 --> 01:23:00,139
Thank you all for this auction.
1063
01:23:00,140 --> 01:23:03,619
I think that we will
continue with this fund-raising.
1064
01:23:03,620 --> 01:23:07,260
Because as some bureaucrat once said:
1065
01:23:07,740 --> 01:23:11,420
if the forum is a civil forum
let the citizens collect money.
1066
01:23:11,740 --> 01:23:16,340
So, that is what the citizens
are doing, the process has begun.
1067
01:23:16,980 --> 01:23:19,700
And let it continue.
Thank you, thank you.
1068
01:23:20,340 --> 01:23:26,060
Rumours about the early death of
Pilorama are wildly exaggerated.
1069
01:23:26,740 --> 01:23:29,139
Moreover Pilorama will grow.
1070
01:23:29,140 --> 01:23:34,099
Thank you friends that you
have been here yesterday and today.
1071
01:23:34,100 --> 01:23:37,179
I promised you that the weather
will be Pilorama weather
1072
01:23:37,180 --> 01:23:39,580
and I fulfilled my promise.
1073
01:23:40,740 --> 01:23:46,380
So let's make an appointment
here for next years.
1074
01:23:46,740 --> 01:23:49,779
Pilorama has ended,
alas, this year
1075
01:23:49,780 --> 01:23:52,579
and now we have a gala concert.
1076
01:23:52,580 --> 01:23:54,620
Thank you and see you.
1077
01:24:03,060 --> 01:24:05,460
Day two of the Forum
was coming to a close.
1078
01:24:07,660 --> 01:24:10,980
The skies darkened as
though indignant at the guests
1079
01:24:11,220 --> 01:24:13,580
who didn't wish
to leave for home.
1080
01:24:15,940 --> 01:24:20,460
I, too, felt the tired after
these two days rich with events.
1081
01:24:24,340 --> 01:24:26,019
But before leaving
1082
01:24:26,020 --> 01:24:28,940
I noticed a group of people
in period costumes and
1083
01:24:29,380 --> 01:24:33,340
I decided to remain and
pose them a few questions:
1084
01:24:34,780 --> 01:24:37,620
why and with what goal
did they come here?
1085
01:24:38,100 --> 01:24:39,819
What are their jobs
1086
01:24:39,820 --> 01:24:43,540
and why are they wearing the uniform
of the NKVD (Stalin's secret police)?
1087
01:24:50,660 --> 01:24:52,940
They introduced themselves as
1088
01:24:53,980 --> 01:24:55,220
Irina,
1089
01:24:55,940 --> 01:24:57,220
Elena
1090
01:24:58,900 --> 01:25:00,180
and Mark.
1091
01:25:09,740 --> 01:25:11,780
Mark, can you give me an axe?
1092
01:25:17,820 --> 01:25:20,580
We are located now in Pilorama 2012.
1093
01:25:20,940 --> 01:25:22,940
We came here to rest.
1094
01:25:23,740 --> 01:25:26,899
In our normal life we
have a tourist business
1095
01:25:26,900 --> 01:25:30,580
Rafting down the rivers of the Urals.
1096
01:25:31,980 --> 01:25:34,539
We are wearing this
uniform for the second year
1097
01:25:34,540 --> 01:25:38,060
and there are a number of reasons for this.
1098
01:25:38,860 --> 01:25:43,179
On the one hand, there is this
drive to impose the opinion that...
1099
01:25:43,180 --> 01:25:46,339
everything was bad
in the Soviet Union and that
1100
01:25:46,340 --> 01:25:51,299
it is necessary to break radically with
this, and to build some new capitalist…
1101
01:25:51,300 --> 01:25:54,459
to live according
to new rules, in short,
1102
01:25:54,460 --> 01:25:57,059
I believe that this is completely wrong.
1103
01:25:57,060 --> 01:26:01,099
One should have taken everything
that was good in our great country.
1104
01:26:01,100 --> 01:26:05,259
So in essence because of this we are
wearing this uniform on the one hand.
1105
01:26:05,260 --> 01:26:09,499
One side is widely
represented here at Pilorama
1106
01:26:09,500 --> 01:26:13,019
you have probably
been to the museum and
1107
01:26:13,020 --> 01:26:17,459
seen where the prisoners
lived how they ate,
1108
01:26:17,460 --> 01:26:21,220
all this is well represented
1109
01:26:21,900 --> 01:26:26,499
But the uniform of the NKVD
is also an inseparable part
1110
01:26:26,500 --> 01:26:30,539
of this place, of this museum
1111
01:26:30,540 --> 01:26:34,299
and so from this side there
is very little information,
1112
01:26:34,300 --> 01:26:36,339
nothing about it.
1113
01:26:36,340 --> 01:26:42,179
So wearing this uniform
here is to show
1114
01:26:42,180 --> 01:26:47,500
that they were an inseparable part of
this place. And that this is not forgotten.
1115
01:26:53,060 --> 01:26:55,620
I looked at these
people and wondered:
1116
01:26:56,340 --> 01:26:59,980
did they ever get to read
Solzhenitsyn or Shalamov?
1117
01:27:01,180 --> 01:27:02,620
Hardly…
1118
01:27:06,420 --> 01:27:09,580
We agreed to meet again
at next year's Pilorama.
1119
01:27:11,580 --> 01:27:16,660
But a year later I only found Tatiana
Kursina, the Museum director
1120
01:27:17,340 --> 01:27:20,580
accompanied by journalists
and some public figures.
1121
01:27:27,700 --> 01:27:30,340
We are now in a prison camp.
1122
01:27:30,940 --> 01:27:37,219
This is all one exhibit, this building has
been preserved as it was in GULAG period,
1123
01:27:37,220 --> 01:27:41,139
in its natural greatness and
with all its particular features.
1124
01:27:41,140 --> 01:27:44,500
Let's walk further on.
1125
01:27:48,940 --> 01:27:51,900
So, I want to tell you,
1126
01:27:52,740 --> 01:27:54,859
lately, particularly in the past year,
1127
01:27:54,860 --> 01:27:59,020
Sut' Vremeni has been
zealously attacking us.
1128
01:28:00,180 --> 01:28:04,740
The organisation which
is led by Mr Kurginian.
1129
01:28:05,900 --> 01:28:09,859
Last year they began a whole
campaign against Perm-36,
1130
01:28:09,860 --> 01:28:12,900
accusing us of falsifying history
1131
01:28:13,780 --> 01:28:16,579
and telling us that money
from the public purse
1132
01:28:16,580 --> 01:28:19,579
intended for Perm-36
went to commemorating
1133
01:28:19,580 --> 01:28:24,420
not the victims of political repression,
not the victims of the GULAG
1134
01:28:24,820 --> 01:28:30,180
but to commemorating criminal
elements and those who aided fascism.
1135
01:28:31,700 --> 01:28:36,019
In reality more than 40% of those imprisoned
in this camp were political prisoners,
1136
01:28:36,020 --> 01:28:40,580
and Andropov specially created
3 political camps: 35, 36, 37.
1137
01:28:41,420 --> 01:28:46,019
So these 3 camps were created by
Andropov as political camps
1138
01:28:46,020 --> 01:28:50,340
but I repeat that they
were never purely political.
1139
01:28:50,500 --> 01:28:53,420
A portion of criminal prisoners
was always present.
1140
01:28:54,940 --> 01:28:59,700
Many offensive things
have been written by
1141
01:29:00,620 --> 01:29:04,980
Sut' Vremeni, recently,
And by other red-brown groups,
1142
01:29:05,300 --> 01:29:11,780
and this has influenced
contemporary politicians.
1143
01:29:13,180 --> 01:29:15,739
You can imagine how "easy"
it is for us to survive,
1144
01:29:15,740 --> 01:29:19,499
if you take into account that for
the entire first 6 months of this year
1145
01:29:19,500 --> 01:29:22,859
we were investigated by the
Control and Audit Commission.
1146
01:29:22,860 --> 01:29:25,939
After we organized the Pilorama,
1147
01:29:25,940 --> 01:29:29,539
OBEP (the Department for Economic
Crimes) came to investigate us.
1148
01:29:29,540 --> 01:29:32,179
After that, since August and
1149
01:29:32,180 --> 01:29:36,019
throughout the autumn and winter
the Procurator's Office visited.
1150
01:29:36,020 --> 01:29:37,740
The reason...
1151
01:29:38,940 --> 01:29:41,779
was that the Perm Communists,
the Sut' Vremeni
1152
01:29:41,780 --> 01:29:45,659
wrote a letter to the President and
the General Procurator about Perm-36.
1153
01:29:45,660 --> 01:29:49,780
They investigated us and only by
New Year did things calm down.
1154
01:29:50,300 --> 01:29:53,419
Now once again letters to the President,
1155
01:29:53,420 --> 01:29:57,059
to the General Procurators Office
have been written about Perm-36
1156
01:29:57,060 --> 01:29:59,979
and so it is impossible
to find any time to work.
1157
01:29:59,980 --> 01:30:05,060
Because we are continually
accompanying the investigators.
1158
01:30:17,740 --> 01:30:19,620
Ladies and gentlemen,
1159
01:30:20,100 --> 01:30:22,539
we are situated near the site
1160
01:30:22,540 --> 01:30:24,980
which is the camp's sawmill (pilorama).
1161
01:30:25,180 --> 01:30:27,579
This is already a legendary place,
1162
01:30:27,580 --> 01:30:32,380
it has given its name to
the international civic festival
1163
01:30:32,900 --> 01:30:35,820
which has taken place here since 2005.
1164
01:30:36,860 --> 01:30:41,580
A festival which gathers
not only locals, local citizens,
1165
01:30:42,100 --> 01:30:45,460
but citizens from throughout
Russia and the world.
1166
01:30:46,740 --> 01:30:50,099
Unfortunately, this year Pilorama
1167
01:30:50,100 --> 01:30:53,660
has been called off for the first
time for a number of reasons.
1168
01:30:54,420 --> 01:30:57,779
Two weeks before the Forum
1169
01:30:57,780 --> 01:31:00,060
we were informed that
1170
01:31:00,380 --> 01:31:02,979
the budget was cut in half.
1171
01:31:02,980 --> 01:31:05,579
Therefore the Public
Council took the decision
1172
01:31:05,580 --> 01:31:08,619
to cancel Pilorama
in view of funding cuts.
1173
01:31:08,620 --> 01:31:11,219
And what motives do
the regional authorities
1174
01:31:11,220 --> 01:31:14,300
have in taking away these two
and a half million roubles?
1175
01:31:14,940 --> 01:31:17,659
I believe that as a result of
1176
01:31:17,660 --> 01:31:20,700
the increasing civil activity
of citizens in Russia,
1177
01:31:20,980 --> 01:31:24,059
the regional leaders felt
that this was probably
1178
01:31:24,060 --> 01:31:26,420
a dangerous event for them.
1179
01:31:26,940 --> 01:31:29,779
There are ‘new faces' in power,
and with rare exceptions
1180
01:31:29,780 --> 01:31:32,060
they are from another region.
1181
01:31:32,100 --> 01:31:34,899
The previous governor knew
this Pilorama very well.
1182
01:31:34,900 --> 01:31:39,219
He was standing with his son and watched
Shevchuk's concert under a downpour.
1183
01:31:39,220 --> 01:31:41,859
He knew very well that
here there was no trouble
1184
01:31:41,860 --> 01:31:43,939
unless Sut Vremeni turned up,
1185
01:31:43,940 --> 01:31:46,739
that here people are
having important discussions,
1186
01:31:46,740 --> 01:31:49,219
that no one is intending
to set up barricades.
1187
01:31:49,220 --> 01:31:52,179
The new regional leadership
has probably got some
1188
01:31:52,180 --> 01:31:55,180
rather cowardly or
incompetent people in it.
1189
01:31:55,860 --> 01:31:59,419
If there weren't Pilorama Forums
the leadership of this area
1190
01:31:59,420 --> 01:32:01,700
would have had to invent them!
1191
01:32:01,780 --> 01:32:04,739
Here they come without
five-star generals
1192
01:32:04,740 --> 01:32:06,979
without high-ranking uniforms
1193
01:32:06,980 --> 01:32:10,579
and meet with
citizens from this region.
1194
01:32:10,580 --> 01:32:13,820
This is how I think about it
1195
01:32:15,900 --> 01:32:18,219
and if I feel any guilt
then it is because
1196
01:32:18,220 --> 01:32:21,780
I couldn't explain how this
has been a very useful experience.
1197
01:32:22,620 --> 01:32:26,019
Tatiana Gergievna you spoke
about Sut' Vremeni,
1198
01:32:26,020 --> 01:32:29,699
can you tell us whether they played
a role in the fact that Pilorama
1199
01:32:29,700 --> 01:32:33,500
this year didn't happen in
the form that we are used to?
1200
01:32:34,060 --> 01:32:36,819
They blame us for not
having dialogue with them.
1201
01:32:36,820 --> 01:32:40,299
But this is only because they
have no arguments of their own.
1202
01:32:40,300 --> 01:32:44,099
They have emotions and the desire
not to keep this museum.
1203
01:32:44,100 --> 01:32:47,460
These people that gather
here falsify everything.
1204
01:32:47,740 --> 01:32:49,940
How does this all influence
1205
01:32:50,620 --> 01:32:53,180
the regional authorities?!
I can't say.
1206
01:32:53,420 --> 01:32:55,739
I respect the regional
leadership too much
1207
01:32:55,740 --> 01:33:00,100
to suspect that
such shallow people
1208
01:33:01,860 --> 01:33:04,540
who don't know history
and don't wish to know it
1209
01:33:04,820 --> 01:33:06,140
that they are...
1210
01:33:09,260 --> 01:33:11,139
that they are being listened to.
1211
01:33:11,140 --> 01:33:13,100
That would be completely pathetic.
1212
01:33:14,500 --> 01:33:18,500
Well welcome to Pilorama 2014.
1213
01:33:18,700 --> 01:33:20,020
Thank you.
1214
01:33:27,420 --> 01:33:30,020
But Pilorama didn't
take place the next year.
1215
01:33:30,580 --> 01:33:32,819
A year later the Perm Ministry of Culture,
1216
01:33:32,820 --> 01:33:35,020
using its administrative resources,
1217
01:33:35,260 --> 01:33:38,340
transformed the public museum
into a state institution,
1218
01:33:38,580 --> 01:33:41,340
sacking Tatiana Kursina
from her post as director.
1219
01:33:42,740 --> 01:33:46,979
A media campaign to discredit
her activities had been organised
1220
01:33:46,980 --> 01:33:49,900
and there had even begun
a legal campaign against her.
1221
01:33:52,340 --> 01:33:54,779
In the meantime
the new museum directors
1222
01:33:54,780 --> 01:33:57,060
changed the exhibitions,
1223
01:33:57,420 --> 01:34:02,180
presenting facts about the GULAG and
about political repressions in a dry manner
1224
01:34:02,620 --> 01:34:09,940
in an attempt to whitewash or even justify
that tragic period in Russian history.
1225
01:34:31,500 --> 01:34:33,980
Dear Comrades!
1226
01:34:35,380 --> 01:34:38,420
It's a great pleasure
that fellow thinkers
1227
01:34:39,060 --> 01:34:42,739
have come here today
to remember Joseph Stalin.
1228
01:34:42,740 --> 01:34:46,139
People from both the younger
and the older generation have come.
1229
01:34:46,140 --> 01:34:49,419
Naturally stalwart
komsomol members have come
1230
01:34:49,420 --> 01:34:53,780
who are now our backbone.
1231
01:34:54,860 --> 01:34:57,100
And I want to say
1232
01:34:57,700 --> 01:35:02,980
that everything depends on us
and that our future is in our hands.
1233
01:35:03,100 --> 01:35:07,819
Look at how things progressed,
in the nick of time,
1234
01:35:07,820 --> 01:35:11,900
when Josef Stalin was
the head of our state,
1235
01:35:12,460 --> 01:35:16,059
how youth rose to
the challenges of labour
1236
01:35:16,060 --> 01:35:18,219
and the challenges of war.
1237
01:35:18,220 --> 01:35:20,500
How is it that now youth
1238
01:35:20,860 --> 01:35:24,499
only sees achievement in
how much beer it puts away,
1239
01:35:24,500 --> 01:35:26,700
in how to grab more money
1240
01:35:27,300 --> 01:35:29,260
buy a fancier foreign car
1241
01:35:29,620 --> 01:35:32,179
and marry some
oligarch's daughter.
1242
01:35:32,180 --> 01:35:34,379
What kind of dignity is in that?
1243
01:35:34,380 --> 01:35:36,740
And what about the future?
Is this progress?
1244
01:35:37,460 --> 01:35:40,179
Instead things will turn out
like in Gorky's poem:
1245
01:35:40,180 --> 01:35:43,460
"… And you will live on earth,
Like the blind worms live,
1246
01:35:44,060 --> 01:35:48,059
No legends will be told of you,
No songs about you sung!"
1247
01:35:48,060 --> 01:35:52,539
Is this really the case,
dear comrades, dear friends,
1248
01:35:52,540 --> 01:35:54,819
especially those who are young.
1249
01:35:54,820 --> 01:35:57,139
Must we really become worms?
1250
01:35:57,140 --> 01:36:00,140
We have brains, we have hands,
1251
01:36:00,260 --> 01:36:03,139
there is a great country
beneath our feet.
1252
01:36:03,140 --> 01:36:06,300
Which we, after
20 years of tyranny
1253
01:36:06,460 --> 01:36:09,299
need to reconstruct, to revive!
1254
01:36:09,300 --> 01:36:12,259
So that she is great once again.
1255
01:36:12,260 --> 01:36:15,779
So that the whole
world envies us.
1256
01:36:15,780 --> 01:36:18,219
So that our rockets
fly into the cosmos again,
1257
01:36:18,220 --> 01:36:20,539
so that our factories work again,
1258
01:36:20,540 --> 01:36:24,459
and homes are built and
are given to the people.
1259
01:36:24,460 --> 01:36:26,619
So that people live, gave birth,
1260
01:36:26,620 --> 01:36:30,859
look forward to the future and
discover new things and conquer,
1261
01:36:30,860 --> 01:36:34,819
conquer not the daughter
of an oligarch but new spaces!
1262
01:36:34,820 --> 01:36:39,220
So that science works for us and
flourishes, everything is in our hands!
1263
01:38:12,580 --> 01:38:17,620
This film was completed with the support of
the patron, whose name has been left unknown.
1264
01:38:20,460 --> 01:38:23,420
Scriptwriter and director Sergei Kachkin
1265
01:38:24,340 --> 01:38:27,660
Producer Sergei Kachkin Konstantin Nafikov
1266
01:38:28,740 --> 01:38:31,540
Cameraman
Sergei Kachkin
1267
01:38:32,820 --> 01:38:35,620
Composer
Mike Kirin
1268
01:38:36,820 --> 01:38:39,820
Editor
Kolia Votinov
1269
01:38:40,820 --> 01:38:43,740
Sound engineer
Nelli Ivanova
1270
01:38:44,940 --> 01:38:47,860
Sound mixer
Vladimir Ermakov
1271
01:38:48,860 --> 01:38:51,900
Sound mixer assistant
Elena Seregina
102897
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