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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:06,058 --> 00:00:08,183 [bright tone] 2 00:00:18,850 --> 00:00:21,725 [melodic strumming] 3 00:00:21,725 --> 00:00:23,725 - Right now I'd like to dedicate this song 4 00:00:23,725 --> 00:00:26,933 to everybody here with hearts, any kind of hearts and ears. 5 00:00:26,933 --> 00:00:28,309 Goes something like this here... 6 00:00:28,309 --> 00:00:32,475 ♪ ♪ 7 00:00:32,475 --> 00:00:34,559 Yeah. 8 00:00:34,559 --> 00:00:35,766 Yeah! 9 00:00:35,766 --> 00:00:42,808 ♪ ♪ 10 00:00:54,434 --> 00:00:57,766 ♪ Once upon a time, you dressed so fine ♪ 11 00:00:57,766 --> 00:01:01,850 ♪ Threw the bums a dime in your prime ♪ 12 00:01:01,850 --> 00:01:04,267 ♪ Didn't you? ♪ 13 00:01:04,267 --> 00:01:06,933 ♪ ♪ 14 00:01:06,933 --> 00:01:09,600 ♪ People called, said, "Beware, doll" ♪ 15 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:11,309 ♪ You're bound to fall ♪ 16 00:01:11,309 --> 00:01:16,142 ♪ You thought they all were kidding you ♪ 17 00:01:16,142 --> 00:01:19,808 ♪ ♪ 18 00:01:19,808 --> 00:01:22,975 ♪ You used to ♪ [chuckles] 19 00:01:22,975 --> 00:01:24,309 ♪ Laugh about ♪ 20 00:01:24,309 --> 00:01:26,641 - Volume one, number one. 21 00:01:26,641 --> 00:01:29,267 A letter from the editor. 22 00:01:29,267 --> 00:01:31,559 You're probably wondering what we're trying to do. 23 00:01:31,559 --> 00:01:35,309 - ♪ Look at you, but now you don't talk so loud ♪ 24 00:01:35,309 --> 00:01:37,933 - It's hard to say. 25 00:01:37,933 --> 00:01:41,183 - ♪ But now you don't, baby, seem so proud ♪ 26 00:01:41,183 --> 00:01:43,225 - We hope that we have something here, 27 00:01:43,225 --> 00:01:46,100 sort of a magazine, sort of a newspaper. 28 00:01:46,100 --> 00:01:47,683 - ♪ Yeah ♪ 29 00:01:47,683 --> 00:01:50,850 - The name of it comes from an old saying. 30 00:01:50,850 --> 00:01:53,975 Muddy Waters used the name for a song he wrote. 31 00:01:53,975 --> 00:01:56,350 - ♪ How does it feel? ♪ 32 00:01:56,350 --> 00:01:59,183 - The Stones took their name from Muddy's song. 33 00:01:59,183 --> 00:02:01,225 - ♪ Oh, how does it feel, baby ♪ 34 00:02:01,225 --> 00:02:03,017 - It was the title of Bob Dylan's 35 00:02:03,017 --> 00:02:05,434 first rock and roll record. 36 00:02:05,434 --> 00:02:06,850 - ♪ To be on your own? ♪ 37 00:02:06,850 --> 00:02:08,517 - It's not just about the music, 38 00:02:08,517 --> 00:02:10,350 but also the things and attitudes 39 00:02:10,350 --> 00:02:12,017 that the music embraces. 40 00:02:12,017 --> 00:02:13,850 - ♪ No direction home ♪ 41 00:02:13,850 --> 00:02:16,058 - We've been working quite hard on it. 42 00:02:16,058 --> 00:02:17,350 We hope you can dig it. 43 00:02:17,350 --> 00:02:19,142 - ♪ A complete unknown ♪ 44 00:02:19,142 --> 00:02:21,183 - To describe it any further would be difficult 45 00:02:21,183 --> 00:02:22,766 without sounding like bullshit. 46 00:02:22,766 --> 00:02:25,100 - ♪ Like a rolling stone ♪ 47 00:02:25,100 --> 00:02:32,225 ♪ ♪ 48 00:02:34,975 --> 00:02:37,058 [crowd cheering] 49 00:02:47,641 --> 00:02:51,058 - Jann, in recent years, sophisticated publications 50 00:02:51,058 --> 00:02:53,559 such as yours and FM radio, 51 00:02:53,559 --> 00:02:56,267 rock and roll is reaching a different age group. 52 00:02:56,267 --> 00:02:58,808 Now, what's the difference between rock and roll now 53 00:02:58,808 --> 00:03:00,933 and the rock and roll of the Elvis Presley, 54 00:03:00,933 --> 00:03:02,392 Everly Brothers era? 55 00:03:02,392 --> 00:03:03,891 - Well, rock and roll is, you know, 56 00:03:03,891 --> 00:03:06,183 is a--is a-- is a particular form 57 00:03:06,183 --> 00:03:08,434 that's changed tremendously and keeps changing 58 00:03:08,434 --> 00:03:11,183 and vastly changing, making a tremendous amount of changes, 59 00:03:11,183 --> 00:03:14,641 and, uh, there was no publication around 60 00:03:14,641 --> 00:03:16,475 that covered it the way it should be covered, 61 00:03:16,475 --> 00:03:18,267 you know, that had treated it 62 00:03:18,267 --> 00:03:19,891 the way it deserved to be treated, 63 00:03:19,891 --> 00:03:22,933 that, you know, understood it, really. 64 00:03:22,933 --> 00:03:24,891 ♪ ♪ 65 00:03:24,891 --> 00:03:26,725 - Oh, yeah! 66 00:03:26,725 --> 00:03:28,600 ♪ ♪ 67 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:31,850 - Jann, is there such thing as a San Francisco sound? 68 00:03:31,850 --> 00:03:34,766 Or is it just that this happened to be the place 69 00:03:34,766 --> 00:03:37,891 where acid rock, or whatever it's called, started? 70 00:03:37,891 --> 00:03:39,600 - The important thing about San Francisco 71 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:41,100 is that it's a scene. 72 00:03:41,100 --> 00:03:43,100 It's a warm, supportive, friendly city 73 00:03:43,100 --> 00:03:45,017 that's historically, you know, had the Bohemians, 74 00:03:45,017 --> 00:03:48,475 the Beats, that supported the arts, poetry, jazz, 75 00:03:48,475 --> 00:03:50,975 and similarly today it supports rock and roll. 76 00:03:50,975 --> 00:03:53,683 - [laughing] 77 00:03:53,683 --> 00:03:56,309 - San Francisco is home to all kinds of artists, 78 00:03:56,309 --> 00:03:58,850 and I loved the excitement of it. 79 00:03:58,850 --> 00:04:02,142 I had tried to do music when I was in college, 80 00:04:02,142 --> 00:04:05,559 but I was not good at it particularly. 81 00:04:05,559 --> 00:04:07,891 I mean, I was not a great guitar player, you know. 82 00:04:07,891 --> 00:04:09,933 I mean, I knew the music, and I loved it. 83 00:04:09,933 --> 00:04:12,850 I could feel it, but that-- 84 00:04:12,850 --> 00:04:15,641 that life was not for me. 85 00:04:15,641 --> 00:04:18,641 But what I had as a skill and a natural ability 86 00:04:18,641 --> 00:04:20,267 was journalism. 87 00:04:20,267 --> 00:04:23,142 - ♪ Ooh, ooh, yeah ♪ 88 00:04:23,142 --> 00:04:26,142 ♪ Ooh, ooh, yeah ♪ 89 00:04:26,142 --> 00:04:27,850 ♪ Ooh, ooh ♪ 90 00:04:27,850 --> 00:04:30,766 - ♪ Everybody's dying, everybody is trying ♪ 91 00:04:30,766 --> 00:04:33,350 ♪ To feel more, feel more, feel more, yeah ♪ 92 00:04:33,350 --> 00:04:35,309 - ♪ Ooh, ooh, yeah ♪ 93 00:04:35,309 --> 00:04:37,559 - In the '60s, rock and roll was becoming more than ever 94 00:04:37,559 --> 00:04:40,683 the medium of communication among young people. 95 00:04:40,683 --> 00:04:43,850 - ♪ Even though you never, then it doesn't mean you never ♪ 96 00:04:43,850 --> 00:04:46,517 ♪ So you feel more, you feel more, you feel more ♪ 97 00:04:46,517 --> 00:04:50,267 - It was freeing yourself from this gray vision of life 98 00:04:50,267 --> 00:04:52,683 in America that was parentally shaped 99 00:04:52,683 --> 00:04:56,225 and socially shaped by the Eisenhower years. 100 00:04:56,225 --> 00:04:58,392 - ♪ Whoa ♪ 101 00:04:58,392 --> 00:05:00,309 ♪ Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa ♪ 102 00:05:00,309 --> 00:05:03,017 [indistinct screaming] 103 00:05:03,017 --> 00:05:05,225 all: ♪ Whoa ♪ 104 00:05:05,225 --> 00:05:07,017 ♪ Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa ♪ 105 00:05:07,017 --> 00:05:09,350 - ♪ Whoa, yeah ♪ - ♪ Yeah, baby ♪ 106 00:05:09,350 --> 00:05:11,058 all: ♪ Whoa ♪ 107 00:05:11,058 --> 00:05:13,058 - Music and the kind of cultural revolution 108 00:05:13,058 --> 00:05:14,559 that was attached to it, 109 00:05:14,559 --> 00:05:16,350 that was the big uncovered story. 110 00:05:16,350 --> 00:05:18,933 [crowd cheering] 111 00:05:21,350 --> 00:05:23,309 At that time, I was living with the woman 112 00:05:23,309 --> 00:05:25,392 I was gonna marry, Jane, 113 00:05:25,392 --> 00:05:27,725 and she had that same enthusiasm 114 00:05:27,725 --> 00:05:31,142 for the sheer joy of the music. 115 00:05:31,142 --> 00:05:34,392 Together, we saw it as really important, 116 00:05:34,392 --> 00:05:37,683 spiritually and culturally, you know? 117 00:05:37,683 --> 00:05:40,725 - We really understood that music 118 00:05:40,725 --> 00:05:44,225 was effecting a change in America. 119 00:05:44,225 --> 00:05:46,641 You could see it and hear it. 120 00:05:46,641 --> 00:05:49,725 ["Paint It Black" begins] 121 00:05:49,725 --> 00:05:52,267 ♪ ♪ 122 00:05:52,267 --> 00:05:56,808 In '67, Jann was going down to cover Monterey Pop. 123 00:05:56,808 --> 00:06:00,600 This was before we started "Rolling Stone." 124 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,475 He was there one day, and then he called me, and he said, 125 00:06:03,475 --> 00:06:05,434 "Jane, you've got to come down here. 126 00:06:05,434 --> 00:06:08,850 You will not believe what's happening." 127 00:06:08,850 --> 00:06:12,183 ♪ ♪ 128 00:06:12,183 --> 00:06:18,309 - ♪ I see a red door, and I want to paint it black ♪ 129 00:06:18,309 --> 00:06:20,392 ♪ No colors in my life ♪ 130 00:06:20,392 --> 00:06:24,100 ♪ You know they're turning black ♪ 131 00:06:24,100 --> 00:06:26,975 ♪ I see people walking by ♪ 132 00:06:26,975 --> 00:06:30,350 ♪ Dressed in their colorful clothes ♪ 133 00:06:30,350 --> 00:06:33,017 ♪ I see them strolling by ♪ 134 00:06:33,017 --> 00:06:34,850 ♪ My happiness just flows ♪ 135 00:06:34,850 --> 00:06:38,600 - We were so lucky to have that music 136 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:40,309 at that time. 137 00:06:40,309 --> 00:06:42,475 I mean, Monterey was incredible. 138 00:06:42,475 --> 00:06:44,683 - ♪ Turn it black, oh, yeah ♪ 139 00:06:44,683 --> 00:06:51,808 ♪ ♪ 140 00:07:08,142 --> 00:07:09,933 Thank you. 141 00:07:13,517 --> 00:07:15,434 - I had been writing a column 142 00:07:15,434 --> 00:07:18,350 for "The Daily Californian," the student newspaper, 143 00:07:18,350 --> 00:07:21,183 and I wrote it under a pseudonym, Mr. Jones, 144 00:07:21,183 --> 00:07:23,309 called "Something Is Happening by Mr. Jones," 145 00:07:23,309 --> 00:07:24,975 after the Dylan song. 146 00:07:24,975 --> 00:07:26,725 And it was very much in the mold 147 00:07:26,725 --> 00:07:28,891 of a column that Ralph Gleason was writing 148 00:07:28,891 --> 00:07:31,017 for the "San Francisco Chronicle." 149 00:07:31,017 --> 00:07:33,225 [smooth jazz music] 150 00:07:33,225 --> 00:07:35,891 - This is "Jazz Casual," and I'm Ralph Gleason. 151 00:07:35,891 --> 00:07:38,808 John Coltrane, like many of the modern jazz musicians, 152 00:07:38,808 --> 00:07:42,683 feels that the music itself speaks far more fluently 153 00:07:42,683 --> 00:07:44,517 than any human ever could. 154 00:07:44,517 --> 00:07:46,392 I agree with that thoroughly, 155 00:07:46,392 --> 00:07:48,725 and I also endorse the position 156 00:07:48,725 --> 00:07:51,267 that Miles Davis' albums shouldn't have liner notes, 157 00:07:51,267 --> 00:07:52,933 even when I write them. 158 00:07:52,933 --> 00:07:54,600 - He was a jazz critic, 159 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:56,309 but he also would write about popular music 160 00:07:56,309 --> 00:07:59,683 and The Beatles or Dylan and Baez. 161 00:07:59,683 --> 00:08:01,891 - ♪ I don't really wanna stop the show ♪ 162 00:08:01,891 --> 00:08:03,975 ♪ But I thought you might like to know ♪ 163 00:08:03,975 --> 00:08:05,850 - His column was the place you could read 164 00:08:05,850 --> 00:08:07,559 about all these things in your own life, 165 00:08:07,559 --> 00:08:10,142 which were not in the local press. 166 00:08:10,142 --> 00:08:12,100 - ♪ So let me introduce to you ♪ 167 00:08:12,100 --> 00:08:14,683 ♪ The one and only Billy Shears ♪ 168 00:08:14,683 --> 00:08:18,183 ♪ And Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band ♪ 169 00:08:18,183 --> 00:08:19,891 - They used to say about Ralph 170 00:08:19,891 --> 00:08:21,641 that he couldn't decide whether he was 171 00:08:21,641 --> 00:08:24,017 four 12-year-olds or three 16-year-olds. 172 00:08:24,017 --> 00:08:25,559 And he loved young people, 173 00:08:25,559 --> 00:08:27,975 and he loved the excitement of it. 174 00:08:27,975 --> 00:08:30,309 People trying to get a place in the rock and roll scene 175 00:08:30,309 --> 00:08:32,933 would come over to him and seek advice. 176 00:08:32,933 --> 00:08:34,933 [crowd cheering] 177 00:08:34,933 --> 00:08:37,142 So I introduced myself to him. 178 00:08:37,142 --> 00:08:38,600 He said, "Oh, I know exactly who you are. 179 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:40,475 I read your column." 180 00:08:40,475 --> 00:08:42,434 And that was just the beginning of it right there. 181 00:08:42,434 --> 00:08:45,808 - ♪ What would you think if I sang out of tune? ♪ 182 00:08:45,808 --> 00:08:49,933 ♪ Would you stand up and walk out on me? ♪ 183 00:08:49,933 --> 00:08:52,808 - He alone among the critical establishment 184 00:08:52,808 --> 00:08:54,600 was receptive to rock and roll 185 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:56,392 and saw how good a music it was, 186 00:08:56,392 --> 00:08:58,517 how good songwriters these were. 187 00:08:58,517 --> 00:09:02,434 - ♪ Oh, I get by with a little help from my friends ♪ 188 00:09:02,434 --> 00:09:04,100 ♪ Mm, I get high... ♪ 189 00:09:04,100 --> 00:09:05,808 - We knew that Ralph was the best person 190 00:09:05,808 --> 00:09:07,933 to be starting "Rolling Stone" with. 191 00:09:07,933 --> 00:09:12,933 - ♪ Mm, gonna try with a little help from my friends ♪ 192 00:09:12,933 --> 00:09:14,434 - Jann came over one day and said, 193 00:09:14,434 --> 00:09:15,975 "How about a magazine?" 194 00:09:15,975 --> 00:09:19,225 Like the "Melody Maker" or "New Musical Express" 195 00:09:19,225 --> 00:09:21,517 but an American one that would be different and better, 196 00:09:21,517 --> 00:09:24,975 that would cover not just, uh, not just the records 197 00:09:24,975 --> 00:09:29,475 and the music but would cover the whole culture. 198 00:09:29,475 --> 00:09:32,475 I find it regrettable and sad 199 00:09:32,475 --> 00:09:36,309 that some of my friends do not share my enjoyment 200 00:09:36,309 --> 00:09:39,350 for the contemporary musicians, 201 00:09:39,350 --> 00:09:41,183 much less regard them 202 00:09:41,183 --> 00:09:42,933 with the respect with which I regard them 203 00:09:42,933 --> 00:09:46,225 or see them as important as I see them. 204 00:09:46,225 --> 00:09:48,641 The only way to stay alive is to stay open. 205 00:09:48,641 --> 00:09:50,392 The minute you shut yourself off 206 00:09:50,392 --> 00:09:52,683 and shut yourself up, you start to rot. 207 00:09:52,683 --> 00:09:55,600 You die of dry rot. 208 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,975 "Rolling Stone" started with the assumption 209 00:09:57,975 --> 00:10:01,517 that music was of infinitely greater importance 210 00:10:01,517 --> 00:10:04,475 to an upcoming generation of Americans 211 00:10:04,475 --> 00:10:06,725 than anyone had ever thought it was before, 212 00:10:06,725 --> 00:10:08,392 and we were right. 213 00:10:08,392 --> 00:10:11,100 [Bob Dylan's "Like a Rolling Stone" plays] 214 00:10:11,100 --> 00:10:13,267 ♪ ♪ 215 00:10:13,267 --> 00:10:16,808 - ♪ Once upon a time, you dressed so fine ♪ 216 00:10:16,808 --> 00:10:21,058 ♪ Threw the bums a dime in your prime ♪ 217 00:10:21,058 --> 00:10:22,891 ♪ Didn't you? ♪ 218 00:10:22,891 --> 00:10:25,058 - We were in a printer's building in San Francisco, 219 00:10:25,058 --> 00:10:26,725 south of Market, 220 00:10:26,725 --> 00:10:30,183 which then was really just kind of warehouses. 221 00:10:30,183 --> 00:10:32,475 Rent was free 'cause we got 222 00:10:32,475 --> 00:10:34,350 the printer to give us some free space. 223 00:10:34,350 --> 00:10:38,100 We rented some typewriters and rented some tables. 224 00:10:38,100 --> 00:10:41,100 - We were looking for $7,500. 225 00:10:41,100 --> 00:10:44,725 So I asked my mother for $2,000. 226 00:10:44,725 --> 00:10:48,600 Jann raised some, and we started "Rolling Stone." 227 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:53,017 And I'll say "we," because we did. 228 00:10:59,641 --> 00:11:02,017 - Well, we felt a great, uh-- 229 00:11:02,017 --> 00:11:04,891 a great historic responsibility 230 00:11:04,891 --> 00:11:06,975 on behalf of the American public. 231 00:11:06,975 --> 00:11:09,725 Well, you know, no, jeez-- [laughs] 232 00:11:09,725 --> 00:11:12,725 That isn't what happened. 233 00:11:12,725 --> 00:11:15,058 - It was really Ralph and myself and Jane. 234 00:11:15,058 --> 00:11:18,891 We'd meet and, uh, discuss this thing and what to do. 235 00:11:18,891 --> 00:11:21,225 ♪ ♪ 236 00:11:21,225 --> 00:11:23,641 The first issue, we had John Lennon on the cover 237 00:11:23,641 --> 00:11:25,434 and an interview with Donovan 238 00:11:25,434 --> 00:11:27,017 and then a big two-page spread 239 00:11:27,017 --> 00:11:28,683 on the Grateful Dead getting busted, 240 00:11:28,683 --> 00:11:31,808 which was a little story that I wrote. 241 00:11:31,808 --> 00:11:34,017 We went over and took these pictures of the Dead 242 00:11:34,017 --> 00:11:38,183 standing on the stoop of their house over in Haight-Ashbury. 243 00:11:38,183 --> 00:11:40,725 All, you know, at the top of the stairs, 244 00:11:40,725 --> 00:11:42,600 you know, with their fists up, raised, 245 00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:44,683 and I think it was Pigpen that had some pistols, 246 00:11:44,683 --> 00:11:47,267 and Phil Lesh was carrying a rifle and all that stuff. 247 00:11:47,267 --> 00:11:51,267 And defiant, "We will not be moved," you know? 248 00:11:51,267 --> 00:11:53,933 We nearly went bankrupt shipping out that issue. 249 00:11:53,933 --> 00:11:56,058 And all of a sudden, all the bills came in, 250 00:11:56,058 --> 00:11:57,933 and we had to-- "Oh, God, we don't have 251 00:11:57,933 --> 00:11:59,808 enough money for that." 252 00:11:59,808 --> 00:12:02,725 ♪ ♪ 253 00:12:02,725 --> 00:12:04,475 - I bought the first issue. 254 00:12:04,475 --> 00:12:06,267 I had no idea that the magazine 255 00:12:06,267 --> 00:12:08,142 consisted of about three people. 256 00:12:08,142 --> 00:12:09,975 It looked like a very professional operation. 257 00:12:09,975 --> 00:12:11,641 I volunteered to be a proofreader. 258 00:12:11,641 --> 00:12:13,309 I told them I was a proofreader. 259 00:12:13,309 --> 00:12:15,058 I had never read proof in my life. 260 00:12:15,058 --> 00:12:18,641 And so I was the first unpaid employee. 261 00:12:18,641 --> 00:12:20,267 I tell you, my qualifications 262 00:12:20,267 --> 00:12:22,267 were a degree in Near Eastern languages, 263 00:12:22,267 --> 00:12:24,808 three years' experience as an animal caretaker, 264 00:12:24,808 --> 00:12:26,475 and I was willing to work for free. 265 00:12:26,475 --> 00:12:29,017 ♪ ♪ 266 00:12:29,017 --> 00:12:31,142 - Now, Charlie was a volunteer, 267 00:12:31,142 --> 00:12:32,641 but he had a paying job, 268 00:12:32,641 --> 00:12:34,309 which was to be an assistant zookeeper 269 00:12:34,309 --> 00:12:35,850 at the San Francisco Zoo. 270 00:12:35,850 --> 00:12:38,225 And he said, "I can't do both." 271 00:12:38,225 --> 00:12:40,808 We agreed that he would get $25 a week. 272 00:12:40,808 --> 00:12:43,641 And he was the first actual, real true employee 273 00:12:43,641 --> 00:12:45,142 of "Rolling Stone." 274 00:12:45,142 --> 00:12:46,891 - I was known at one time 275 00:12:46,891 --> 00:12:49,309 for excessive consumption of marijuana. 276 00:12:49,309 --> 00:12:50,683 When I went to "Rolling Stone," 277 00:12:50,683 --> 00:12:52,017 I found I couldn't use drugs. 278 00:12:52,017 --> 00:12:53,600 I wanted to write, 279 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,392 and I could write reams when I was stoned, 280 00:12:55,392 --> 00:12:57,808 but none of it made any sense. 281 00:12:57,808 --> 00:12:59,850 In those days, we were not well known 282 00:12:59,850 --> 00:13:01,309 outside San Francisco. 283 00:13:01,309 --> 00:13:03,017 "Rolling Stone" was thought of 284 00:13:03,017 --> 00:13:05,559 as particularly a magazine for musicians. 285 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:08,559 And we had to struggle with our distributor 286 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:12,142 to get us put on newsstands near recording studios. 287 00:13:12,142 --> 00:13:13,808 For many years, we had a musician's 288 00:13:13,808 --> 00:13:15,766 free classified column for bands 289 00:13:15,766 --> 00:13:18,017 that were looking for a drummer. 290 00:13:18,017 --> 00:13:20,850 But Jann always had a vision of it as being more 291 00:13:20,850 --> 00:13:23,683 than just about rock and roll itself. 292 00:13:23,683 --> 00:13:26,475 He had an idea that there was a rock culture, 293 00:13:26,475 --> 00:13:28,309 all sorts of generational things 294 00:13:28,309 --> 00:13:30,808 that would be of interest. 295 00:13:30,808 --> 00:13:35,725 ♪ ♪ 296 00:13:38,891 --> 00:13:40,350 - I think there's various things. 297 00:13:40,350 --> 00:13:42,225 I think the basic thing is that-- 298 00:13:42,225 --> 00:13:44,058 is what people have always found fascinating about youth, 299 00:13:44,058 --> 00:13:46,475 you know, and young-- young things 300 00:13:46,475 --> 00:13:48,683 and young people and new ideas 301 00:13:48,683 --> 00:13:51,725 and, you know, that period of life 302 00:13:51,725 --> 00:13:53,434 which is associated with being most alive 303 00:13:53,434 --> 00:13:55,808 and most experimental and the most, you know, 304 00:13:55,808 --> 00:13:57,100 sort of carefree. 305 00:13:57,100 --> 00:13:59,058 ♪ ♪ 306 00:13:59,058 --> 00:14:01,808 It was important that "Rolling Stone" have a sense 307 00:14:01,808 --> 00:14:05,975 of style and sex appeal of the youth culture. 308 00:14:05,975 --> 00:14:07,641 [The Rolling Stones' "Stray Cat Blues" plays] 309 00:14:07,641 --> 00:14:09,766 I met a guy named Baron Wolman, 310 00:14:09,766 --> 00:14:13,559 and Baron had training as kind of a portrait photographer. 311 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:15,183 Baron came up with the idea 312 00:14:15,183 --> 00:14:17,392 to do a special issue on the groupies. 313 00:14:17,392 --> 00:14:21,683 - ♪ There'll be a feast if you just come upstairs, but... ♪ 314 00:14:21,683 --> 00:14:24,267 - I would go backstage and hang out with the bands, 315 00:14:24,267 --> 00:14:26,392 and I saw these women back there 316 00:14:26,392 --> 00:14:29,225 with style and with self-assurance. 317 00:14:29,225 --> 00:14:31,475 You know, nobody was going to tell them what to do. 318 00:14:31,475 --> 00:14:35,808 - ♪ I can see that you're 15 years old ♪ 319 00:14:35,808 --> 00:14:38,600 ♪ No, I don't want your ID ♪ 320 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,267 - Within a certain subculture in San Francisco, 321 00:14:41,267 --> 00:14:43,350 rock is the basic art form. 322 00:14:43,350 --> 00:14:45,766 The musicians are the high priests of the community, 323 00:14:45,766 --> 00:14:48,225 and all activities revolve around the bands. 324 00:14:48,225 --> 00:14:50,891 Now, sex is no big deal within the community. 325 00:14:50,891 --> 00:14:53,683 It's just part of the whole sharing process. 326 00:14:53,683 --> 00:14:57,392 They share food, houses, drugs, money, and sex. 327 00:14:57,392 --> 00:14:59,600 - ♪ You're a stray, stray cat, I bet ♪ 328 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:04,350 ♪ Bet your mama don't know you scream like that ♪ 329 00:15:04,350 --> 00:15:09,808 ♪ I bet your mama don't know you can spread like that ♪ 330 00:15:09,808 --> 00:15:11,475 - You get to fuck the prettiest boys. 331 00:15:11,475 --> 00:15:13,309 You get to smoke the best dope. 332 00:15:13,309 --> 00:15:16,891 You, um--you get to meet all the most far-out people. 333 00:15:16,891 --> 00:15:18,641 - They dress the way I want all guys to dress. 334 00:15:18,641 --> 00:15:19,933 They have long hair. 335 00:15:19,933 --> 00:15:21,600 They talk with a British accent. 336 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:23,600 - "There are two kinds of groupies," 337 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,309 notes veteran trouper, guitarist Jimmy Page. 338 00:15:26,309 --> 00:15:29,434 "Those who are like friends, like San Francisco girls, 339 00:15:29,434 --> 00:15:31,434 "and those Los Angeles and New York girls, 340 00:15:31,434 --> 00:15:33,142 "who are making a religion 341 00:15:33,142 --> 00:15:34,975 "out of how many pop stars they can fuck. 342 00:15:34,975 --> 00:15:37,225 "Groupies are a better ball, by and large. 343 00:15:37,225 --> 00:15:38,975 "They've had more experience, 344 00:15:38,975 --> 00:15:40,350 and they're willing to try more things." 345 00:16:00,891 --> 00:16:04,434 - ♪ White bird ♪ 346 00:16:04,434 --> 00:16:08,225 ♪ In a golden cage ♪ 347 00:16:08,225 --> 00:16:10,309 - Sally Mann lives with Jefferson Airplane 348 00:16:10,309 --> 00:16:13,559 at their spacious, Victorian San Francisco mansion. 349 00:16:13,559 --> 00:16:15,850 She serves as housemother, preparing meals, 350 00:16:15,850 --> 00:16:18,267 washing the dishes, screening unwanted visitors, 351 00:16:18,267 --> 00:16:21,350 and a host of other chores for which she is paid nothing 352 00:16:21,350 --> 00:16:23,766 except the gratitude of the Airplane. 353 00:16:23,766 --> 00:16:27,975 - Jack, show me your cock again, please. 354 00:16:27,975 --> 00:16:30,600 Please, one more time. Come on! 355 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,058 - No. - Jack, one-- 356 00:16:33,058 --> 00:16:34,641 You had to be there. 357 00:16:34,641 --> 00:16:36,641 I don't mean that to understand it, 358 00:16:36,641 --> 00:16:38,559 you had to be there. 359 00:16:38,559 --> 00:16:42,350 I'm saying if you felt it, you had to be where it was. 360 00:16:42,350 --> 00:16:44,183 Oh, look. 361 00:16:44,183 --> 00:16:46,350 Look--look, you can see him in action. 362 00:16:46,350 --> 00:16:48,392 This is how he looks when he's playing. 363 00:16:48,392 --> 00:16:50,225 Oh, isn't it far out? 364 00:16:50,225 --> 00:16:52,641 There was no way on the planet 365 00:16:52,641 --> 00:16:54,641 I could have stayed in Houston, Texas, 366 00:16:54,641 --> 00:16:57,725 when the music was being made out in California. 367 00:16:57,725 --> 00:16:59,183 I had to be there. 368 00:16:59,183 --> 00:17:00,434 Pull the pubes out of the way, 369 00:17:00,434 --> 00:17:01,975 and let's light you a joint up. 370 00:17:01,975 --> 00:17:03,600 You could be crazy about Elvis, 371 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:05,392 but you weren't walking up and down 372 00:17:05,392 --> 00:17:08,058 the streets of Memphis in a movement of people 373 00:17:08,058 --> 00:17:10,183 who all felt the same way. 374 00:17:10,183 --> 00:17:12,850 [laughter] - Need it, need it. 375 00:17:12,850 --> 00:17:14,933 - Groupies are hardly a new phenomenon, 376 00:17:14,933 --> 00:17:17,434 and they are not new to the rock and roll scene either. 377 00:17:17,434 --> 00:17:20,933 But as the scene changes, so do the girls. 378 00:17:20,933 --> 00:17:26,808 ♪ ♪ 379 00:17:26,808 --> 00:17:29,891 Cynthia, age 21, and Diane, age 17, 380 00:17:29,891 --> 00:17:31,766 took a cab to the Chicago Opera House 381 00:17:31,766 --> 00:17:33,559 where they waited 382 00:17:33,559 --> 00:17:35,559 for one of the rock and roll attractions to appear. 383 00:17:35,559 --> 00:17:38,100 If he was agreeable, they would all go to his room, 384 00:17:38,100 --> 00:17:40,142 and this popular lead guitarist 385 00:17:40,142 --> 00:17:44,766 would become Number 00004 in the Plaster Casters' diary. 386 00:17:44,766 --> 00:17:47,933 - In art class, we started doing plaster casting. 387 00:17:47,933 --> 00:17:50,434 One day the teacher said you could plaster cast 388 00:17:50,434 --> 00:17:52,683 almost anything that's solid. 389 00:17:52,683 --> 00:17:55,641 In fact, bring in any old object from home, 390 00:17:55,641 --> 00:17:57,309 tomorrow we'll make a cast of it. 391 00:17:57,309 --> 00:17:59,808 And I thought... [laughs] 392 00:17:59,808 --> 00:18:02,600 - ♪ Having hard times ♪ 393 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:04,766 ♪ In this crazy town ♪ 394 00:18:04,766 --> 00:18:06,309 ♪ Having hard times ♪ 395 00:18:06,309 --> 00:18:07,766 - In the Plaster Casters' diary, 396 00:18:07,766 --> 00:18:09,808 a penis is called a "rig," 397 00:18:09,808 --> 00:18:11,808 fellatio is called "plating," 398 00:18:11,808 --> 00:18:14,475 and a fellator is called a "plater." 399 00:18:14,475 --> 00:18:16,683 Masturbation is called "banking" 400 00:18:16,683 --> 00:18:20,808 and a masturbator is called a "Barclay's Banker." 401 00:18:20,808 --> 00:18:22,766 - ♪ Having hard times ♪ 402 00:18:22,766 --> 00:18:25,808 - Cynthia asked me, you know, if--at that time, 403 00:18:25,808 --> 00:18:28,017 if I'd like to be a plaster caster. 404 00:18:28,017 --> 00:18:29,975 I became her plater. 405 00:18:29,975 --> 00:18:33,350 She called me the head plaster caster because I gave the head. 406 00:18:33,350 --> 00:18:35,309 And she was the master plaster caster 407 00:18:35,309 --> 00:18:37,850 because she's the originator of the idea. 408 00:18:37,850 --> 00:18:39,434 - While you're lying there, 409 00:18:39,434 --> 00:18:42,017 I'd like you to close your eyes. 410 00:18:42,017 --> 00:18:45,350 And I'd like you to think that this is a sexual experience. 411 00:18:45,350 --> 00:18:49,100 Just relax and use your imagination. 412 00:18:49,100 --> 00:18:51,225 Don't necessarily think of the reality of what's happening, 413 00:18:51,225 --> 00:18:54,933 but think of what you'd like to be happening. 414 00:18:54,933 --> 00:18:59,017 We'll get along fine. 415 00:18:59,017 --> 00:19:00,808 - ♪ And I'm sick and tired ♪ 416 00:19:00,808 --> 00:19:04,808 ♪ Of having so many hard, hard times baby ♪ 417 00:19:04,808 --> 00:19:07,058 ♪ And from my party house... ♪ 418 00:19:07,058 --> 00:19:09,891 - We had an ad for the groupie issue that said, 419 00:19:09,891 --> 00:19:11,225 "When we tell you about a groupie, 420 00:19:11,225 --> 00:19:13,058 will you really understand?" 421 00:19:13,058 --> 00:19:14,891 And we were saying, "Hey, we got the goods. 422 00:19:14,891 --> 00:19:16,475 "You want to know what's really happening? 423 00:19:16,475 --> 00:19:18,267 Listen to us." 424 00:19:18,267 --> 00:19:22,100 - This was just complete shock to everybody, you know? 425 00:19:22,100 --> 00:19:23,683 The fact that rock and roll 426 00:19:23,683 --> 00:19:25,058 and the culture of rock and roll 427 00:19:25,058 --> 00:19:28,267 had this world underneath it. 428 00:19:28,267 --> 00:19:32,058 It was the generation gap starting to be writ large. 429 00:19:33,933 --> 00:19:35,683 - Jann had a particular view 430 00:19:35,683 --> 00:19:38,517 of what he wanted "Rolling Stone" to be. 431 00:19:38,517 --> 00:19:41,183 He was always thinking way down the road, 432 00:19:41,183 --> 00:19:42,975 ahead of himself, and maybe ahead 433 00:19:42,975 --> 00:19:45,600 of the generation, to a certain extent. 434 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,392 At "Rolling Stone" we were pretty much around the clock, 435 00:19:48,392 --> 00:19:50,600 living, breathing, writing rock and roll. 436 00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:51,891 - And did you like it? 437 00:19:51,891 --> 00:19:53,683 - Nah, hated it. Hated it. 438 00:19:53,683 --> 00:19:56,850 [James Brown's "Get on the Good Foot" plays] 439 00:19:56,850 --> 00:19:58,517 ♪ ♪ 440 00:19:58,517 --> 00:20:01,225 When Jann hired me, he probably saw me 441 00:20:01,225 --> 00:20:04,267 as a fairly straight person. 442 00:20:04,267 --> 00:20:06,766 Having come out of college for about a year 443 00:20:06,766 --> 00:20:09,891 and having some journalism experience 444 00:20:09,891 --> 00:20:12,100 as well as having a pretty decent knowledge 445 00:20:12,100 --> 00:20:14,600 of the pop music scene in general 446 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,350 and wanting to apply journalism to it. 447 00:20:17,350 --> 00:20:19,267 - ♪ Get on the good foot ♪ 448 00:20:19,267 --> 00:20:21,434 ♪ ♪ 449 00:20:21,434 --> 00:20:24,517 - So he saw a person who came in not just off the street, 450 00:20:24,517 --> 00:20:26,975 being a rock and roll fan, being a longhaired hippie, 451 00:20:26,975 --> 00:20:29,641 but a guy who could bring a modicum 452 00:20:29,641 --> 00:20:31,808 of professional journalism background 453 00:20:31,808 --> 00:20:33,891 to what he was trying to do. 454 00:20:33,891 --> 00:20:36,475 ♪ ♪ 455 00:20:36,475 --> 00:20:39,975 We would sit at our typewriters and get stoned. 456 00:20:39,975 --> 00:20:42,808 No, we would sit at our typewriters and just think, 457 00:20:42,808 --> 00:20:44,766 "Let's see, oh, that could be fun," 458 00:20:44,766 --> 00:20:47,225 and then just start something. 459 00:20:47,225 --> 00:20:51,225 It could be a description of a guy sifting cocaine. 460 00:20:51,225 --> 00:20:56,309 It could be you heading to interview the Jackson Five. 461 00:20:56,309 --> 00:20:58,100 It could be a description 462 00:20:58,100 --> 00:21:01,475 of a living room as with Ike and Tina Turner. 463 00:21:01,475 --> 00:21:03,267 That becomes the lead. 464 00:21:03,267 --> 00:21:05,058 - Walk into what, from the outside, 465 00:21:05,058 --> 00:21:06,975 looks to be another well-paid, 466 00:21:06,975 --> 00:21:09,517 well-kept home in suburban Inglewood, California, 467 00:21:09,517 --> 00:21:11,475 and you're hit... 468 00:21:11,475 --> 00:21:14,517 a huge imperial oil painting of Ike and Tina Turner 469 00:21:14,517 --> 00:21:18,683 dressed as if for a simple, private wedding circa 1960. 470 00:21:18,683 --> 00:21:21,100 Also in the foyer, under the portrait, 471 00:21:21,100 --> 00:21:23,517 a small white bust of John F. Kennedy. 472 00:21:23,517 --> 00:21:26,350 Next to him, the Bible. 473 00:21:26,350 --> 00:21:27,933 Over in the family room, 474 00:21:27,933 --> 00:21:30,142 splashing programmed, is a waterfall. 475 00:21:30,142 --> 00:21:33,225 There's a red velvet sofa designed around a coffee table 476 00:21:33,225 --> 00:21:35,766 in the shape of a bass guitar. 477 00:21:35,766 --> 00:21:39,183 Tina's not back, half an hour late. 478 00:21:42,517 --> 00:21:44,891 - Tina being late showing up, 479 00:21:44,891 --> 00:21:46,434 that was nothing, no big deal. 480 00:21:46,434 --> 00:21:48,517 You're often kept waiting, 481 00:21:48,517 --> 00:21:51,683 except that it wasn't like there was a publicist 482 00:21:51,683 --> 00:21:54,891 or a manager or an agent or somebody. 483 00:21:54,891 --> 00:21:58,183 I think there were a couple housekeepers maybe around 484 00:21:58,183 --> 00:22:01,183 and her family. 485 00:22:01,183 --> 00:22:02,891 I just sat there, 486 00:22:02,891 --> 00:22:04,725 and oftentimes you take those challenges 487 00:22:04,725 --> 00:22:06,517 and just do what you can with them. 488 00:22:06,517 --> 00:22:09,058 You just worked with what you've got. 489 00:22:09,058 --> 00:22:12,309 ♪ ♪ 490 00:22:12,309 --> 00:22:14,392 - The world's greatest heartbreaker drives up 491 00:22:14,392 --> 00:22:16,559 in her Mercedes sedan and strides in, 492 00:22:16,559 --> 00:22:20,641 all fresh and breezy in a red knit hot pants outfit, 493 00:22:20,641 --> 00:22:22,600 third button unbuttoned, 494 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:27,225 supple legs still very trim at age 32, charging on to 33. 495 00:22:27,225 --> 00:22:30,350 ["River Deep, Mountain High" begins] 496 00:22:30,350 --> 00:22:31,891 ♪ ♪ 497 00:22:31,891 --> 00:22:34,434 - ♪ When I was a little girl ♪ 498 00:22:34,434 --> 00:22:37,267 ♪ I had a rag doll ♪ 499 00:22:37,267 --> 00:22:40,100 ♪ Only doll I've ever owned ♪ 500 00:22:40,100 --> 00:22:42,517 ♪ ♪ 501 00:22:42,517 --> 00:22:45,517 - In the mid '60s, around 1966, 502 00:22:45,517 --> 00:22:49,183 I saw Ike and Tina in North Beach 503 00:22:49,183 --> 00:22:52,891 and was just knocked out. 504 00:22:52,891 --> 00:22:55,434 - ♪ And it gets stronger ♪ 505 00:22:55,434 --> 00:22:58,142 ♪ In every way ♪ 506 00:22:58,142 --> 00:23:00,933 ♪ And it gets deeper ♪ 507 00:23:00,933 --> 00:23:03,683 ♪ Let me say ♪ 508 00:23:03,683 --> 00:23:06,766 ♪ And it gets higher ♪ 509 00:23:06,766 --> 00:23:09,017 ♪ Day by day ♪ 510 00:23:09,017 --> 00:23:11,975 - I'd always been an R&B fan, but this was beyond R&B. 511 00:23:11,975 --> 00:23:15,309 This was showmanship. This was rock and roll. 512 00:23:15,309 --> 00:23:19,100 - ♪ Yeah, river deep, mountain high ♪ 513 00:23:19,100 --> 00:23:21,475 ♪ Yeah, yeah, yeah ♪ 514 00:23:21,475 --> 00:23:24,434 - And so it was just in my head, and I volunteered, 515 00:23:24,434 --> 00:23:26,933 "Yeah, I've seen them, I love them, and let's go." 516 00:23:26,933 --> 00:23:29,267 - ♪ Oh, how I love you, baby ♪ 517 00:23:29,267 --> 00:23:32,933 ♪ Baby, baby, baby ♪ 518 00:23:32,933 --> 00:23:39,058 ♪ ♪ 519 00:23:39,058 --> 00:23:41,100 ♪ I love you, baby ♪ 520 00:23:41,100 --> 00:23:44,267 ♪ Like a flower loves the spring ♪ 521 00:23:44,267 --> 00:23:46,350 ♪ And I love you, baby ♪ 522 00:23:46,350 --> 00:23:49,933 ♪ Like a robin loves to sing ♪ 523 00:23:49,933 --> 00:23:52,058 ♪ And I love you, baby ♪ 524 00:23:52,058 --> 00:23:55,808 ♪ Like a schoolboy loves his pet ♪ 525 00:23:55,808 --> 00:23:57,517 ♪ And I love you, baby ♪ 526 00:23:57,517 --> 00:24:01,350 ♪ River deep and mountain high ♪ 527 00:24:01,350 --> 00:24:03,975 - "River Deep, Mountain High"-- 528 00:24:03,975 --> 00:24:07,517 to hear that song for the first time in 1967, 529 00:24:07,517 --> 00:24:10,100 the first year of acid rock and Memphis soul, 530 00:24:10,100 --> 00:24:12,641 to hear that wall falling toward you, 531 00:24:12,641 --> 00:24:14,517 with Tina teasing it along, 532 00:24:14,517 --> 00:24:18,225 was to understand all the power of rock and roll. 533 00:24:18,225 --> 00:24:20,017 - ♪ Do I love you ♪ 534 00:24:20,017 --> 00:24:22,975 ♪ My, oh, my ♪ 535 00:24:22,975 --> 00:24:26,559 ♪ Yeah, river deep, mountain high ♪ 536 00:24:26,559 --> 00:24:28,142 ♪ Yeah, yeah, yeah ♪ 537 00:24:28,142 --> 00:24:30,183 - But after "River Deep" bombed, 538 00:24:30,183 --> 00:24:32,350 Ike Turner said the Spector production didn't get airplay 539 00:24:32,350 --> 00:24:34,808 because the soul stations said "too pop," 540 00:24:34,808 --> 00:24:37,933 and the white stations said "too R&B." 541 00:24:37,933 --> 00:24:39,891 "See, what's wrong with America 542 00:24:39,891 --> 00:24:42,017 "is that rather than accept something for its value, 543 00:24:42,017 --> 00:24:45,100 America mixes race in it." 544 00:24:46,517 --> 00:24:48,766 What finally carried Ike and Tina through 545 00:24:48,766 --> 00:24:51,850 was the 1969 Rolling Stones tour. 546 00:24:51,850 --> 00:24:55,309 Someone once called Tina "The female Mick Jagger." 547 00:24:55,309 --> 00:24:57,017 To be more accurate, 548 00:24:57,017 --> 00:25:01,392 one should call Mick "The Male Tina Turner." 549 00:25:01,392 --> 00:25:03,725 - All right, can you tell me, just real quickly, 550 00:25:03,725 --> 00:25:06,350 what was your first connection with the Stones? 551 00:25:06,350 --> 00:25:08,434 - So I think with the influence 552 00:25:08,434 --> 00:25:10,392 that "River Deep, Mountain High" had on Mick, 553 00:25:10,392 --> 00:25:12,225 and then when he came to see our show, 554 00:25:12,225 --> 00:25:14,100 he wanted, you know, us to be on his show 555 00:25:14,100 --> 00:25:16,058 because he felt that it would be different. 556 00:25:16,058 --> 00:25:18,350 - Right. This is a weird question, but did you have 557 00:25:18,350 --> 00:25:20,517 any kind of a rush of excitement when you discovered 558 00:25:20,517 --> 00:25:23,225 there was a whole new kind of a culture 559 00:25:23,225 --> 00:25:25,392 that was a ready audience for you? 560 00:25:25,392 --> 00:25:27,434 - Hippies came, and they changed the world. 561 00:25:27,434 --> 00:25:30,058 They changed the minds because they said, "Well, why? 562 00:25:30,058 --> 00:25:31,850 "Why is it that you can say that Tina Turner 563 00:25:31,850 --> 00:25:33,517 isn't as good as The Supremes?" 564 00:25:33,517 --> 00:25:35,392 And everybody else said, "Yeah, why?" 565 00:25:35,392 --> 00:25:37,309 This girl and their act is just as good 566 00:25:37,309 --> 00:25:40,475 as these other people that you figure is class. 567 00:25:40,475 --> 00:25:43,641 And she's just as much class as they are. 568 00:25:43,641 --> 00:25:45,058 [cheers and applause] 569 00:25:45,058 --> 00:25:47,766 ♪ Shoo ♪ 570 00:25:47,766 --> 00:25:50,600 ♪ Shoo ♪ 571 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,600 ♪ Shoo ♪ 572 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:56,766 ♪ Shoo ♪ 573 00:25:56,766 --> 00:25:58,850 ♪ Here come old flat-top ♪ 574 00:25:58,850 --> 00:26:01,850 ♪ He comes grooving up slowly ♪ 575 00:26:01,850 --> 00:26:04,683 ♪ He's got ju-ju eyeballs ♪ 576 00:26:04,683 --> 00:26:07,600 ♪ He one holy roller ♪ 577 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:13,683 ♪ He's got hair down to his knees ♪ 578 00:26:13,683 --> 00:26:19,808 ♪ Got to be a joker, he just do what he please ♪ 579 00:26:19,808 --> 00:26:20,975 ♪ Shoo ♪ 580 00:26:20,975 --> 00:26:22,808 - The move to interpreting 581 00:26:22,808 --> 00:26:25,434 white rock and roll, she says, was quite natural. 582 00:26:25,434 --> 00:26:28,309 "My mother, her radio was usually blues, 583 00:26:28,309 --> 00:26:29,808 "B.B. King and all. 584 00:26:29,808 --> 00:26:31,392 "But rock and roll was more me. 585 00:26:31,392 --> 00:26:33,350 "When that sort of music came on, 586 00:26:33,350 --> 00:26:35,058 "I never could sit down. 587 00:26:35,058 --> 00:26:37,142 I always wanted to move." 588 00:26:37,142 --> 00:26:39,309 - ♪ He's got monkey fingers ♪ 589 00:26:39,309 --> 00:26:42,058 ♪ He shoots Coca-Cola ♪ 590 00:26:42,058 --> 00:26:45,641 ♪ He says I know you ♪ 591 00:26:45,641 --> 00:26:48,309 ♪ You know me ♪ 592 00:26:48,309 --> 00:26:53,183 ♪ One thing I can tell you is you've got to be free ♪ 593 00:26:53,183 --> 00:26:55,975 all: ♪ Come together ♪ 594 00:26:55,975 --> 00:26:58,850 ♪ Right now ♪ 595 00:26:58,850 --> 00:27:01,142 ♪ Over me ♪ 596 00:27:01,142 --> 00:27:02,683 ♪ Shoo ♪ 597 00:27:02,683 --> 00:27:04,891 - On stage, there may be reason to compare 598 00:27:04,891 --> 00:27:06,975 Tina Turner to Mick Jagger. 599 00:27:06,975 --> 00:27:10,683 Tina, in fact, is more aggressive, more animalistic. 600 00:27:10,683 --> 00:27:13,017 But it is, indeed, a stage. 601 00:27:13,017 --> 00:27:14,975 "My whole thing," she once said, 602 00:27:14,975 --> 00:27:16,891 "Is the fact I am to Ike-- 603 00:27:16,891 --> 00:27:19,017 "I'm going to use the term 'doll'-- 604 00:27:19,017 --> 00:27:21,017 that you sort of mold." 605 00:27:21,017 --> 00:27:24,309 - Do it. - Do it, go, three, four. 606 00:27:24,309 --> 00:27:28,225 - ♪ Handful of gimme ♪ 607 00:27:28,225 --> 00:27:31,808 ♪ Mouthful of much obliged ♪ 608 00:27:31,808 --> 00:27:33,975 - ♪ Handful of gimme ♪ 609 00:27:33,975 --> 00:27:36,808 both: ♪ Mouthful of much obliged ♪ 610 00:27:36,808 --> 00:27:38,225 - Much obliged. 611 00:27:38,225 --> 00:27:40,058 - ♪ Much obliged ♪ - Right on. 612 00:27:40,058 --> 00:27:43,267 ♪ ♪ 613 00:27:43,267 --> 00:27:46,475 - Tina is giving me a tour of Ike's new main studios. 614 00:27:46,475 --> 00:27:48,891 There's a double-door air closet at the entrance 615 00:27:48,891 --> 00:27:51,434 to Ike's private quarters. 616 00:27:51,434 --> 00:27:53,058 Tina turns to Ike and says, 617 00:27:53,058 --> 00:27:55,725 "Can I tell 'em what we call this room? 618 00:27:55,725 --> 00:27:57,559 We call it the whorehouse." 619 00:27:57,559 --> 00:28:00,392 - Let me hear it. - ♪ Oh, never you ♪ 620 00:28:00,392 --> 00:28:03,683 I asked an ex-Ikette about Ike Turner and sex. 621 00:28:03,683 --> 00:28:07,517 "Sex, oh, my God, that's another volume," she said. 622 00:28:07,517 --> 00:28:09,766 "I'll have to get a cigarette on that one." 623 00:28:09,766 --> 00:28:11,975 - One, two, three, and... 624 00:28:11,975 --> 00:28:15,058 ["I Smell Trouble" begins] 625 00:28:15,058 --> 00:28:17,850 ♪ ♪ 626 00:28:17,850 --> 00:28:20,350 - Last winter Tina was sick with bronchial pneumonia, 627 00:28:20,350 --> 00:28:22,142 in the hospital with her body ice-packed 628 00:28:22,142 --> 00:28:23,891 to bring the temperature down. 629 00:28:23,891 --> 00:28:25,891 And Ike was visiting, and he was going, 630 00:28:25,891 --> 00:28:30,142 "You get out and sing, or you get out of the house!" 631 00:28:38,183 --> 00:28:42,267 ♪ Lord knows I've tried ♪ 632 00:28:42,267 --> 00:28:45,600 ♪ I've tried to do what's right ♪ 633 00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,975 ♪ ♪ 634 00:28:47,975 --> 00:28:52,309 ♪ Five whole long years I stayed home ♪ 635 00:28:52,309 --> 00:28:56,142 ♪ Both day and night ♪ 636 00:28:56,142 --> 00:28:57,309 ♪ ♪ 637 00:28:57,309 --> 00:28:59,600 ♪ And now I smell ♪ 638 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,683 ♪ A whole lot of trouble ♪ 639 00:29:02,683 --> 00:29:05,225 ♪ ♪ 640 00:29:05,225 --> 00:29:08,267 ♪ Lord, I smell trouble ♪ 641 00:29:08,267 --> 00:29:10,517 ♪ Ahead of me ♪ 642 00:29:10,517 --> 00:29:13,142 - Ike and Tina, when they do an interview together, 643 00:29:13,142 --> 00:29:17,600 invariably they disagree and chide each other. 644 00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:21,434 - ♪ Ohh ♪ 645 00:29:21,434 --> 00:29:24,350 ♪ Worries and trouble ♪ 646 00:29:24,350 --> 00:29:26,641 ♪ ♪ 647 00:29:26,641 --> 00:29:29,434 ♪ I declare they just won't... ♪ 648 00:29:29,434 --> 00:29:32,933 - Posing for a photo, Ike is asked to embrace Tina. 649 00:29:32,933 --> 00:29:36,058 He does and warns, "Better catch this quick. 650 00:29:36,058 --> 00:29:38,017 I don't do this often." 651 00:29:38,017 --> 00:29:45,142 ♪ ♪ 652 00:29:48,850 --> 00:29:52,683 - Oh, this is a great, great story, great sitting. 653 00:29:52,683 --> 00:29:54,517 - Mm-hmm. 654 00:29:54,517 --> 00:29:56,434 Ike and Tina, was he crazy at the time? 655 00:29:56,434 --> 00:29:58,267 - Yes, yes, yes. - And what did he-- 656 00:29:58,267 --> 00:30:00,350 Did he make your life difficult in doing that picture? 657 00:30:00,350 --> 00:30:02,683 Because he threatened Ben 658 00:30:02,683 --> 00:30:04,350 at the end of that story with something. 659 00:30:04,350 --> 00:30:06,850 - Ike didn't seem to mind me being around, 660 00:30:06,850 --> 00:30:09,183 and I was taking a lot of, you know, photographs, 661 00:30:09,183 --> 00:30:12,017 and I was, you know, around. 662 00:30:12,017 --> 00:30:14,891 And I told, uh, Ben about it. 663 00:30:14,891 --> 00:30:16,725 I told him what I saw. 664 00:30:16,725 --> 00:30:19,350 You know, like, there would be jugs full of white powder 665 00:30:19,350 --> 00:30:20,891 and things like that. 666 00:30:20,891 --> 00:30:23,058 Cameras in the bedrooms. 667 00:30:23,058 --> 00:30:25,017 And Ben wrote about it, 668 00:30:25,017 --> 00:30:28,600 and, uh--and then I got a call from Ike, saying, 669 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,142 "I trusted you. What did-- 670 00:30:30,142 --> 00:30:32,683 Annie, this is Ike," you know like-- 671 00:30:32,683 --> 00:30:34,225 And, you know, like, "I trusted you. 672 00:30:34,225 --> 00:30:35,975 How could you have done this?" 673 00:30:35,975 --> 00:30:38,058 And, you know, "I have ways to take care of this." 674 00:30:38,058 --> 00:30:43,766 ♪ ♪ 675 00:30:43,766 --> 00:30:46,766 Those years at "Rolling Stone" formed me completely 676 00:30:46,766 --> 00:30:50,309 as a journalist and a photographer. 677 00:30:50,309 --> 00:30:52,142 That's what this work is here. 678 00:30:52,142 --> 00:30:54,641 It really is looking at sort of growing up 679 00:30:54,641 --> 00:30:57,933 a young-- a young girl photographer. 680 00:30:57,933 --> 00:31:00,100 ♪ ♪ 681 00:31:00,100 --> 00:31:03,058 This is my second assignment, which is pretty incredible. 682 00:31:03,058 --> 00:31:04,392 - Mm-hmm. 683 00:31:04,392 --> 00:31:06,142 - Grace Slick and Paul Kantner. 684 00:31:06,142 --> 00:31:08,183 - They were super popular at the time. I mean, huge. 685 00:31:08,183 --> 00:31:11,808 It's incredible how intimate in their lives you got, 686 00:31:11,808 --> 00:31:13,392 or they let you get. 687 00:31:13,392 --> 00:31:15,100 - But--but everyone was that way. 688 00:31:15,100 --> 00:31:16,434 I mean, no one got dressed up. 689 00:31:16,434 --> 00:31:17,933 No one, like, you know-- 690 00:31:17,933 --> 00:31:20,267 Everyone was, like, very relaxed. 691 00:31:20,267 --> 00:31:23,017 - It's just the intimacy level that they gave you. 692 00:31:23,017 --> 00:31:25,309 - You know, we're all sitting on some waterbed or something. 693 00:31:25,309 --> 00:31:27,600 I don't know. - Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh. 694 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:32,100 All the drug paraphernalia laying around. 695 00:31:32,100 --> 00:31:34,225 - When I went in for John and Yoko, I said, 696 00:31:34,225 --> 00:31:35,933 "Oh, my gosh, I'm photographing 697 00:31:35,933 --> 00:31:38,725 this extraordinarily famous person." 698 00:31:38,725 --> 00:31:40,100 But they couldn't have been nicer. 699 00:31:40,100 --> 00:31:41,975 They were incredible. - Mm-hmm. 700 00:31:41,975 --> 00:31:44,309 - And then Yoko Ono finally told me years later 701 00:31:44,309 --> 00:31:46,975 that they were so impressed that you took 702 00:31:46,975 --> 00:31:48,933 a photographer that wasn't known, 703 00:31:48,933 --> 00:31:53,017 and a girl, and let her come and take these pictures. 704 00:31:53,017 --> 00:31:54,641 And that's why they were-- 705 00:31:54,641 --> 00:31:56,559 I think that's why they were so accommodating, 706 00:31:56,559 --> 00:31:58,808 is they just-- they thought it was really 707 00:31:58,808 --> 00:32:01,600 kind of charming and sweet that you took a sort of-- 708 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,559 this unknown photographer and let her take those pictures. 709 00:32:04,559 --> 00:32:06,559 And you know the story about this picture. 710 00:32:06,559 --> 00:32:08,100 - Mm-hmm. 711 00:32:08,100 --> 00:32:10,142 - You saw this picture on a contact sheet. 712 00:32:10,142 --> 00:32:12,309 - I said, "That's the cover." - You did, you did say that. 713 00:32:12,309 --> 00:32:13,891 - Yeah, I picked that out immediately. 714 00:32:13,891 --> 00:32:16,475 Look at the power of that expression. 715 00:32:16,475 --> 00:32:17,891 [John Lennon's "Look at Me" begins] 716 00:32:17,891 --> 00:32:20,850 ♪ Look at me ♪ 717 00:32:20,850 --> 00:32:24,350 ♪ ♪ 718 00:32:24,350 --> 00:32:27,683 ♪ Who am I supposed to be? ♪ 719 00:32:27,683 --> 00:32:29,683 ♪ Who am I supposed to be? ♪ 720 00:32:29,683 --> 00:32:32,517 - Our first real contact with John and Yoko 721 00:32:32,517 --> 00:32:35,725 was about nine or ten months into starting "Rolling Stone." 722 00:32:35,725 --> 00:32:38,434 We heard about the "Two Virgins" record, 723 00:32:38,434 --> 00:32:41,183 that first solo record by John and Yoko together. 724 00:32:41,183 --> 00:32:42,683 Kind of experimental music. 725 00:32:42,683 --> 00:32:45,683 [jangly piano music] 726 00:32:45,683 --> 00:32:51,641 ♪ ♪ 727 00:32:51,641 --> 00:32:54,350 The cover and the back cover of that record 728 00:32:54,350 --> 00:32:58,267 was a photograph of the two of them naked. 729 00:32:58,267 --> 00:33:01,559 Well, this was banned in quite a lot of places, 730 00:33:01,559 --> 00:33:03,392 including the United States. 731 00:33:03,392 --> 00:33:07,267 - The naked album cover, we felt like two virgins-- 732 00:33:07,267 --> 00:33:08,891 that's what the album was called-- 733 00:33:08,891 --> 00:33:10,517 because we were in love, 734 00:33:10,517 --> 00:33:13,933 just met, and we were trying to make something. 735 00:33:13,933 --> 00:33:16,933 And we thought to show everything. 736 00:33:16,933 --> 00:33:18,850 People are always looking at people like me, 737 00:33:18,850 --> 00:33:20,683 trying to see some secret or, 738 00:33:20,683 --> 00:33:22,559 "What do they do? What do they do?" 739 00:33:22,559 --> 00:33:24,309 You know, "Do they go to the bathroom? 740 00:33:24,309 --> 00:33:25,641 Do they eat?" 741 00:33:25,641 --> 00:33:28,183 We just said, "Here." You know? 742 00:33:28,183 --> 00:33:30,600 - We decided to write them 743 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:32,309 and tell them we'll publish it. 744 00:33:32,309 --> 00:33:35,475 It created quite a stir. 745 00:33:35,475 --> 00:33:38,850 Really the first time we had gotten any kind of attention. 746 00:33:38,850 --> 00:33:41,267 The "San Francisco Chronicle" ran an article, 747 00:33:41,267 --> 00:33:46,475 which was headlined, "Naked Beatle Perils S.F." 748 00:33:46,475 --> 00:33:48,517 And I concluded from all this, 749 00:33:48,517 --> 00:33:50,225 if you print a famous foreskin, 750 00:33:50,225 --> 00:33:52,808 the world will beat a path to your door. 751 00:33:52,808 --> 00:33:55,766 - One, two. One, two, three, four. 752 00:33:55,766 --> 00:33:58,850 ["Give Peace a Chance" begins] 753 00:33:58,850 --> 00:34:01,058 ♪ ♪ 754 00:34:01,058 --> 00:34:04,933 - ♪ Everybody's talking about Bagism, Shagism, Dragism ♪ 755 00:34:04,933 --> 00:34:06,933 ♪ Madism, Ragism, Tagism ♪ 756 00:34:06,933 --> 00:34:09,600 ♪ This-ism, that-ism, ism, ism, ism ♪ 757 00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:11,267 ♪ ♪ 758 00:34:11,267 --> 00:34:17,100 ♪ All we are saying ♪ 759 00:34:17,100 --> 00:34:19,267 ♪ Is give peace a chance ♪ 760 00:34:19,267 --> 00:34:21,100 That's all we're saying! 761 00:34:21,100 --> 00:34:23,475 - Because of that cover, 762 00:34:23,475 --> 00:34:27,309 we became friends with John and Yoko. 763 00:34:27,309 --> 00:34:29,309 You know, I would speak to him on the phone. 764 00:34:29,309 --> 00:34:30,933 He'd give us little interviews, 765 00:34:30,933 --> 00:34:32,517 and we'd run all these articles. 766 00:34:32,517 --> 00:34:34,475 We covered their peace crusade, 767 00:34:34,475 --> 00:34:36,392 the bed-in, and all the various things 768 00:34:36,392 --> 00:34:38,559 that they were doing as John was finding his way 769 00:34:38,559 --> 00:34:40,309 into political protests 770 00:34:40,309 --> 00:34:42,017 and starting to come away from the Beatles, 771 00:34:42,017 --> 00:34:44,475 and we kind of became the mouthpiece 772 00:34:44,475 --> 00:34:46,850 for John and Yoko. 773 00:34:46,850 --> 00:34:49,309 At the same time, people thought he was just crazy 774 00:34:49,309 --> 00:34:51,475 for doing that kind of stuff. 775 00:34:51,475 --> 00:34:53,434 The media of the world, they didn't want to see 776 00:34:53,434 --> 00:34:56,641 anything other than the level mop-top Beatle. 777 00:34:56,641 --> 00:34:59,058 - What do you know about a protest movement anyway? 778 00:34:59,058 --> 00:35:01,350 - I know a lot about it-- - It consists of a lot more 779 00:35:01,350 --> 00:35:03,600 than sending your chauffeur and your car 780 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:04,933 back to Buckingham Palace. 781 00:35:04,933 --> 00:35:06,475 - You're just a snob about it. 782 00:35:06,475 --> 00:35:07,850 The only way to make-- - You're a fake. 783 00:35:07,850 --> 00:35:09,975 - ♪ Give peace a chance ♪ 784 00:35:09,975 --> 00:35:11,517 - If I'm gonna get on the front page, 785 00:35:11,517 --> 00:35:12,766 I might as well get on the front page 786 00:35:12,766 --> 00:35:14,183 with the word "peace." 787 00:35:14,183 --> 00:35:15,975 - But you've made yourself ridiculous. 788 00:35:15,975 --> 00:35:17,475 - To some people. I don't care if-- 789 00:35:17,475 --> 00:35:19,183 -You're too good for what you're doing. 790 00:35:19,183 --> 00:35:21,850 - If it saves lives-- - You don't think you-- 791 00:35:21,850 --> 00:35:24,725 Oh, my dear boy, you're living in a Never Never Land. 792 00:35:24,725 --> 00:35:28,183 - ♪ Is give peace a chance ♪ 793 00:35:28,183 --> 00:35:30,683 - ♪ Everybody's talking about revolution, evolution... ♪ 794 00:35:30,683 --> 00:35:32,850 - I'm someone who admired you very much. 795 00:35:32,850 --> 00:35:34,725 - Well, I'm sorry you liked the old mop tops, dear, 796 00:35:34,725 --> 00:35:38,017 and you thought it was very satirical and witty, 797 00:35:38,017 --> 00:35:39,850 and you liked "Hard Day's Night," love, 798 00:35:39,850 --> 00:35:41,600 but I've grown up, but you obviously haven't. 799 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:43,559 - Have you? - Yes, folks. 800 00:35:43,559 --> 00:35:46,225 - What have you grown up to? - Oh, 29. 801 00:35:46,225 --> 00:35:47,559 - Yes, yeah. 802 00:35:47,559 --> 00:35:49,058 - You were saying that in America, 803 00:35:49,058 --> 00:35:51,017 they're so serious about the protest movement. 804 00:35:51,017 --> 00:35:52,725 - Yes, they are. - But they were so flippant 805 00:35:52,725 --> 00:35:54,517 that they were singing a happy-go-lucky song, 806 00:35:54,517 --> 00:35:56,225 which happens to be one I wrote, 807 00:35:56,225 --> 00:35:57,933 and I'm glad they sang it. 808 00:35:57,933 --> 00:36:01,766 And that was a message from me to America or to anywhere. 809 00:36:01,766 --> 00:36:04,225 - Thank you, good-bye. 810 00:36:04,225 --> 00:36:06,434 - But the last point was a good point, 811 00:36:06,434 --> 00:36:08,475 and she didn't want to respond to that. 812 00:36:08,475 --> 00:36:09,808 - She didn't hear anything. 813 00:36:09,808 --> 00:36:15,225 - ♪ All we are saying ♪ 814 00:36:15,225 --> 00:36:19,350 ♪ Is give peace a chance ♪ 815 00:36:19,350 --> 00:36:21,725 - Okay, beautiful. Yeah. 816 00:36:21,725 --> 00:36:24,392 [cheers and applause] 817 00:36:27,808 --> 00:36:29,600 - Would you take it all back? 818 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:31,350 - What? - Being a Beatle? 819 00:36:31,350 --> 00:36:33,600 - If I could be a fucking fisherman, I would. 820 00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:35,434 You know, if I had the capabilities 821 00:36:35,434 --> 00:36:37,475 of being something other than I am, I would. 822 00:36:37,475 --> 00:36:40,600 It's no fun being an artist. It's torture. 823 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,183 I resent being an artist. 824 00:36:43,183 --> 00:36:47,309 I resent performing for fucking idiots. 825 00:36:47,309 --> 00:36:48,600 They can't feel. 826 00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:49,933 I'm the one that's feeling 827 00:36:49,933 --> 00:36:51,434 'cause I'm the one expressing 828 00:36:51,434 --> 00:36:53,434 what they are trying to-- 829 00:36:53,434 --> 00:36:57,808 They--they live vicariously through me and other artists. 830 00:36:57,808 --> 00:37:03,058 I'm interested in more things with a worldwide-- 831 00:37:03,058 --> 00:37:05,434 something that means something for everyone, 832 00:37:05,434 --> 00:37:09,142 not just for a few kids listening to wallpaper. 833 00:37:09,142 --> 00:37:13,600 You know, I'm in the game of concept and philosophy 834 00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:15,267 and ways of life 835 00:37:15,267 --> 00:37:17,891 and whole movements in history. 836 00:37:17,891 --> 00:37:21,725 I'm not interested in good guitarists. 837 00:37:21,725 --> 00:37:23,350 - You don't really believe that we're headed 838 00:37:23,350 --> 00:37:25,142 for a violent revolution, do you? 839 00:37:25,142 --> 00:37:28,100 - Eventually it'll happen. 840 00:37:28,100 --> 00:37:29,725 It has to happen, you know? 841 00:37:29,725 --> 00:37:31,267 What else can happen? 842 00:37:31,267 --> 00:37:33,100 - The problem is a violent revolution now 843 00:37:33,100 --> 00:37:34,975 would really just be the end of the world. 844 00:37:34,975 --> 00:37:36,933 - Not necessarily. They say that every time. 845 00:37:36,933 --> 00:37:40,434 I don't really believe it. And if it is, okay. 846 00:37:40,434 --> 00:37:43,142 I mean, I'm back to where I was when I was 17, you know? 847 00:37:43,142 --> 00:37:44,808 I mean, at 17, I used to think, 848 00:37:44,808 --> 00:37:46,808 "Well, what have you got to lose?" 849 00:37:46,808 --> 00:37:50,683 And now I've got nothing to lose. 850 00:37:50,683 --> 00:37:53,766 ♪ I don't believe in Buddha ♪ 851 00:37:53,766 --> 00:37:55,309 - I knew Beatles fans around the world 852 00:37:55,309 --> 00:37:57,350 had never heard this before. 853 00:37:57,350 --> 00:38:01,058 Imagine a guy who so urgently wants to be himself 854 00:38:01,058 --> 00:38:05,641 and he's being constrained in the Fab Four soapbox package 855 00:38:05,641 --> 00:38:07,600 for so long. 856 00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:09,225 This is what this interview is. 857 00:38:09,225 --> 00:38:10,725 It's that box exploding. 858 00:38:10,725 --> 00:38:12,017 He's blown it to smithereens. 859 00:38:12,017 --> 00:38:16,017 That box is in tatters. 860 00:38:16,017 --> 00:38:20,183 - ♪ I don't believe in kings ♪ 861 00:38:20,183 --> 00:38:22,350 ♪ ♪ 862 00:38:22,350 --> 00:38:26,100 ♪ I don't believe in Elvis ♪ 863 00:38:26,100 --> 00:38:27,683 ♪ ♪ 864 00:38:27,683 --> 00:38:32,225 ♪ I don't believe in Zimmerman ♪ 865 00:38:32,225 --> 00:38:34,017 ♪ ♪ 866 00:38:34,017 --> 00:38:38,392 ♪ I don't believe in Beatles ♪ 867 00:38:39,475 --> 00:38:42,725 - You say now, "I don't believe in the Beatles." 868 00:38:42,725 --> 00:38:45,434 - Yeah, I don't believe in the Beatles, that's all. 869 00:38:45,434 --> 00:38:49,058 I don't believe in the Beatles myth. 870 00:38:49,058 --> 00:38:52,350 You know, I don't believe-- 871 00:38:52,350 --> 00:38:54,100 I don't believe in the Beatles. 872 00:38:54,100 --> 00:38:55,891 Yeah, there's no other way of saying it. 873 00:38:55,891 --> 00:38:57,850 Is there? I don't believe in them. 874 00:38:57,850 --> 00:38:59,725 It was a dream. 875 00:38:59,725 --> 00:39:03,559 I don't believe in the dream anymore. 876 00:39:03,559 --> 00:39:06,725 ♪ I just believe in me ♪ 877 00:39:06,725 --> 00:39:10,225 ♪ ♪ 878 00:39:10,225 --> 00:39:12,225 ♪ Yoko and me ♪ 879 00:39:12,225 --> 00:39:16,225 ♪ ♪ 880 00:39:16,225 --> 00:39:17,933 ♪ That's reality ♪ 881 00:39:17,933 --> 00:39:20,058 ♪ ♪ 882 00:39:20,058 --> 00:39:22,434 ♪ The dream is over ♪ 883 00:39:22,434 --> 00:39:26,392 ♪ ♪ 884 00:39:26,392 --> 00:39:29,600 ♪ What can I say? ♪ 885 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:31,392 ♪ ♪ 886 00:39:31,392 --> 00:39:33,309 - The first "Rolling Stone" that I bought 887 00:39:33,309 --> 00:39:36,641 was Jann's John Lennon interview, part one. 888 00:39:36,641 --> 00:39:41,350 And I couldn't believe the candor of John Lennon. 889 00:39:41,350 --> 00:39:44,142 I couldn't believe that Jann would ask him this stuff. 890 00:39:44,142 --> 00:39:46,142 I couldn't believe the honesty 891 00:39:46,142 --> 00:39:48,392 that John Lennon answered with. 892 00:39:48,392 --> 00:39:52,517 I couldn't believe his ease in the photos with Annie. 893 00:39:52,517 --> 00:39:55,142 I couldn't believe he said "fuck" so much. 894 00:39:55,142 --> 00:39:58,100 I mean, this was, like, fun to read. 895 00:39:58,100 --> 00:40:01,933 - ♪ I was the Walrus ♪ 896 00:40:01,933 --> 00:40:04,808 - There was this head shop next to this bus stop, 897 00:40:04,808 --> 00:40:06,600 my school bus stop, 898 00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:08,641 and they had "Rolling Stone" in a glass case that said, 899 00:40:08,641 --> 00:40:11,225 "Must be 18 to buy this." 900 00:40:11,225 --> 00:40:12,766 But it was like one of those places, 901 00:40:12,766 --> 00:40:15,017 it was like "Ye Olde Head Shoppe" 902 00:40:15,017 --> 00:40:16,766 S-H-O-P-P-E. 903 00:40:16,766 --> 00:40:18,559 And I would--I would go in there and, like, 904 00:40:18,559 --> 00:40:20,017 see the new "Rolling Stone," 905 00:40:20,017 --> 00:40:21,766 and eventually they let me buy it. 906 00:40:21,766 --> 00:40:23,225 And that was how I first 907 00:40:23,225 --> 00:40:24,475 started to read "Rolling Stone." 908 00:40:24,475 --> 00:40:26,183 - And how old were you then? 909 00:40:26,183 --> 00:40:28,517 - 14. - Right. 910 00:40:28,517 --> 00:40:30,142 - A lucky 14. 911 00:40:30,142 --> 00:40:32,683 [laughter] 912 00:40:32,683 --> 00:40:36,891 My mom, a teacher, who did not believe in rock, 913 00:40:36,891 --> 00:40:39,142 didn't believe it should even be in the house, 914 00:40:39,142 --> 00:40:40,808 would never have believed 915 00:40:40,808 --> 00:40:43,267 the kind of emotional and intellectual commitment 916 00:40:43,267 --> 00:40:46,725 that these people had towards putting out this magazine. 917 00:40:46,725 --> 00:40:49,766 [mellow rock music] 918 00:40:49,766 --> 00:40:56,017 ♪ ♪ 919 00:40:56,017 --> 00:40:59,017 "Rolling Stone" had these amazing writers. 920 00:40:59,017 --> 00:41:01,850 They were so serious about this thing 921 00:41:01,850 --> 00:41:07,309 that was supposed to be disposable--rock music. 922 00:41:07,309 --> 00:41:11,017 And so I was trying to, like, make it in my own little way, 923 00:41:11,017 --> 00:41:13,350 writing for this local underground paper-- 924 00:41:13,350 --> 00:41:17,058 the "San Diego Door." 925 00:41:17,058 --> 00:41:21,434 I had started to get copies of my reviews that I would send 926 00:41:21,434 --> 00:41:23,808 to Ben Fong-Torres at "Rolling Stone." 927 00:41:23,808 --> 00:41:26,975 [The Rolling Stones's "Brown Sugar" plays] 928 00:41:26,975 --> 00:41:31,891 ♪ ♪ 929 00:41:31,891 --> 00:41:33,725 At one point, I got tickets 930 00:41:33,725 --> 00:41:36,683 to a 1973 Rolling Stones benefit 931 00:41:36,683 --> 00:41:38,392 that they did at the Forum. 932 00:41:38,392 --> 00:41:40,100 And there was a publicist that said to me, 933 00:41:40,100 --> 00:41:43,017 "Do you want to meet Ben Fong-Torres?" 934 00:41:43,017 --> 00:41:44,434 I said, "Yeah, let's do it." 935 00:41:44,434 --> 00:41:47,058 She was like, "Let's be quick." 936 00:41:47,058 --> 00:41:49,058 - ♪ Yeah, a Gold Coast slave ship ♪ 937 00:41:49,058 --> 00:41:50,808 ♪ Bound for cotton fields ♪ 938 00:41:50,808 --> 00:41:53,725 ♪ Sold in the market down in New Orleans ♪ 939 00:41:53,725 --> 00:41:56,058 - She takes me down to these great seats 940 00:41:56,058 --> 00:41:58,392 where Ben Fong-Torres was and says, 941 00:41:58,392 --> 00:42:01,058 "Ben, Ben, I want you to meet this young writer 942 00:42:01,058 --> 00:42:02,683 from San Diego." 943 00:42:02,683 --> 00:42:04,267 And he said, "Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I think I-- 944 00:42:04,267 --> 00:42:06,142 I think I know your stuff." 945 00:42:06,142 --> 00:42:07,933 And it was dark and he couldn't see how old I was, 946 00:42:07,933 --> 00:42:09,766 and he was like, "Yeah, great, congratulations. 947 00:42:09,766 --> 00:42:12,142 It's great to meet you. Enjoy the show. Bye." 948 00:42:12,142 --> 00:42:16,225 But I had met Ben Fong-Torres, and that was the beginning. 949 00:42:16,225 --> 00:42:22,434 ♪ ♪ 950 00:42:22,434 --> 00:42:25,808 - ♪ Drums beating cold, English blood runs hot ♪ 951 00:42:25,808 --> 00:42:29,267 ♪ Lady of the house wondering when it's gonna stop ♪ 952 00:42:29,267 --> 00:42:32,808 ♪ Houseboy knows that he's doing all right ♪ 953 00:42:32,808 --> 00:42:36,891 ♪ You should have heard him just around midnight ♪ 954 00:42:36,891 --> 00:42:38,683 ♪ ♪ 955 00:42:38,683 --> 00:42:42,017 ♪ Brown Sugar, how come you dance so good? ♪ 956 00:42:42,017 --> 00:42:44,559 - Ben gave me a couple assignments-- 957 00:42:44,559 --> 00:42:48,142 Kris Kristofferson, the Eagles. 958 00:42:48,142 --> 00:42:50,808 Poco was my first byline piece. 959 00:42:50,808 --> 00:42:53,017 ♪ ♪ 960 00:42:53,017 --> 00:42:54,808 - Cameron was a high-school student, 961 00:42:54,808 --> 00:42:56,475 you know, in San Diego. 962 00:42:56,475 --> 00:42:58,683 To get him to go do pieces for us, 963 00:42:58,683 --> 00:43:01,309 we had to write notes to the school 964 00:43:01,309 --> 00:43:04,475 getting him out of classes. 965 00:43:04,475 --> 00:43:07,475 Here comes Cameron, this fresh-faced kid, 966 00:43:07,475 --> 00:43:10,641 super interested in music, and "aw shucks." 967 00:43:10,641 --> 00:43:13,309 And I think everybody loved him for that. 968 00:43:13,309 --> 00:43:15,267 - Is Nixon still on their minds? 969 00:43:15,267 --> 00:43:17,975 I was just happy to be there. 970 00:43:17,975 --> 00:43:19,891 I felt like I was a fan, 971 00:43:19,891 --> 00:43:22,475 who, along with his front-row seat, 972 00:43:22,475 --> 00:43:24,891 got an opportunity to ask the questions 973 00:43:24,891 --> 00:43:27,933 that I really wanted to know the answers to. 974 00:43:27,933 --> 00:43:31,058 - ♪ Just like a young boy should ♪ 975 00:43:31,058 --> 00:43:32,683 - One of my first pieces for them 976 00:43:32,683 --> 00:43:34,641 was a review of Joe Walsh. 977 00:43:34,641 --> 00:43:38,100 Jann sent me a note that said, 978 00:43:38,100 --> 00:43:40,600 "Nice job. Your stuff's getting better. 979 00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:42,017 Jann." 980 00:43:42,017 --> 00:43:43,891 Which I thought, "That's amazing. 981 00:43:43,891 --> 00:43:46,850 He's reading my Joe Walsh review." 982 00:43:46,850 --> 00:43:49,600 - In that period, I was the hands-on editor 983 00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,350 of the magazine of all these writers. 984 00:43:51,350 --> 00:43:54,183 And we had a real great stable of them. 985 00:43:54,183 --> 00:43:56,100 My job is knowing what somebody's good at, 986 00:43:56,100 --> 00:43:57,725 getting them to do what they're good at, 987 00:43:57,725 --> 00:43:59,641 or matching them with a good idea. 988 00:43:59,641 --> 00:44:01,517 You know, sometimes great writers just don't know 989 00:44:01,517 --> 00:44:03,225 what they should write about. 990 00:44:03,225 --> 00:44:05,225 And fairly quickly "Rolling Stone" became 991 00:44:05,225 --> 00:44:07,392 more than a music magazine. 992 00:44:07,392 --> 00:44:09,142 We had really taken over from "Esquire" 993 00:44:09,142 --> 00:44:10,891 as the home of the new journalism. 994 00:44:10,891 --> 00:44:15,434 I mean, by '73, I had recruited Tom Wolfe. 995 00:44:15,434 --> 00:44:17,225 - "Rolling Stone" has been, um, 996 00:44:17,225 --> 00:44:20,641 extremely flexible and willing to take chances 997 00:44:20,641 --> 00:44:22,350 and not frightened. 998 00:44:22,350 --> 00:44:24,017 "Rolling Stone" broke all the rules. 999 00:44:24,017 --> 00:44:25,975 In an era in which young people 1000 00:44:25,975 --> 00:44:29,142 were supposed to have the shortest attention spans, 1001 00:44:29,142 --> 00:44:30,850 started running articles that were endless. 1002 00:44:30,850 --> 00:44:32,434 I wrote some of them myself. 1003 00:44:32,434 --> 00:44:35,766 - With "Rolling Stone," I was given the room 1004 00:44:35,766 --> 00:44:39,725 and the range to really kick ass, you know, 1005 00:44:39,725 --> 00:44:43,641 to stomp on the terra, as Lord Buckley said. 1006 00:44:43,641 --> 00:44:47,766 And very few places, uh, will give you that. 1007 00:44:47,766 --> 00:44:53,183 ♪ ♪ 1008 00:44:53,183 --> 00:44:55,725 - My guest, he's the roving correspondent, 1009 00:44:55,725 --> 00:44:57,933 you might say, for "Rolling Stone." 1010 00:44:57,933 --> 00:44:59,725 One of the most remarkable journalists 1011 00:44:59,725 --> 00:45:02,766 in the country today, Hunter S. Thompson, DGS, 1012 00:45:02,766 --> 00:45:05,517 Doctor of Gonzo Journalism. 1013 00:45:05,517 --> 00:45:06,600 - No. 1014 00:45:12,933 --> 00:45:14,933 - What is gonzo journalism? 1015 00:45:14,933 --> 00:45:17,267 - Subjectivity, total subjectivity. 1016 00:45:17,267 --> 00:45:20,808 Uh, out-front bias, participation. 1017 00:45:20,808 --> 00:45:23,017 You are a part of the story. 1018 00:45:23,017 --> 00:45:24,725 ♪ ♪ 1019 00:45:24,725 --> 00:45:26,183 - Who first came up with the idea 1020 00:45:26,183 --> 00:45:28,434 of Hunter covering a campaign? 1021 00:45:28,434 --> 00:45:30,975 - I did. 1022 00:45:30,975 --> 00:45:32,850 At first, I came up with the idea 1023 00:45:32,850 --> 00:45:35,891 that he should go to Vietnam and cover the war there. 1024 00:45:35,891 --> 00:45:37,309 - Nice. 1025 00:45:37,309 --> 00:45:39,100 - As we were getting ready to do it, 1026 00:45:39,100 --> 00:45:42,309 I kind of, like, was having second thoughts about it. 1027 00:45:42,309 --> 00:45:44,434 - [sniffs] 1028 00:45:44,434 --> 00:45:46,350 - Let's re-mark him. 1029 00:45:46,350 --> 00:45:48,808 - 961. 1030 00:45:48,808 --> 00:45:51,350 - You know, I don't know-- I was getting cold feet on it 1031 00:45:51,350 --> 00:45:53,475 for some reason or another. 1032 00:45:53,475 --> 00:45:56,641 - But I'd like to ask you why you use drugs. 1033 00:45:56,641 --> 00:46:00,766 - It's been demonstratively proven 1034 00:46:00,766 --> 00:46:04,641 that temper tantrums are not the best way to do interviews, 1035 00:46:04,641 --> 00:46:07,058 and probably my life will be easier and yours, too, 1036 00:46:07,058 --> 00:46:09,683 if I smoke a joint. 1037 00:46:09,683 --> 00:46:13,017 If I were to sit here in a fit of anger 1038 00:46:13,017 --> 00:46:14,808 and you saw me eating acid, 1039 00:46:14,808 --> 00:46:17,975 if I were you, I'd leave with all the equipment. 1040 00:46:17,975 --> 00:46:20,891 - We set out on the campaign as partners 1041 00:46:20,891 --> 00:46:24,183 in an effort to influence the election, 1042 00:46:24,183 --> 00:46:26,142 see what we could do with the "Rolling Stone" audience's 1043 00:46:26,142 --> 00:46:28,017 so-called youth vote. 1044 00:46:28,017 --> 00:46:29,850 Nearly all of our audience could all of a sudden vote 1045 00:46:29,850 --> 00:46:31,641 for the first time in American history. 1046 00:46:31,641 --> 00:46:33,683 How do you make politics appealing to an audience 1047 00:46:33,683 --> 00:46:35,517 that didn't like politics? 1048 00:46:35,517 --> 00:46:37,850 I mean, take the guy who wrote "Hell's Angels" 1049 00:46:37,850 --> 00:46:40,392 and send him out to cover this cast of thugs 1050 00:46:40,392 --> 00:46:42,933 and power mad freaks, and, you know, 1051 00:46:42,933 --> 00:46:46,975 all these people running around, you know, and Nixon. 1052 00:46:46,975 --> 00:46:48,891 - Would you have any other place 1053 00:46:48,891 --> 00:46:51,600 to publish your stuff if it wasn't for "Rolling Stone"? 1054 00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:53,392 - Oh, yeah. 1055 00:46:53,392 --> 00:46:56,600 But there's not too many places that would pay for it. 1056 00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:58,475 We've come to the point where every four years, 1057 00:46:58,475 --> 00:47:00,600 this national fever rises up. 1058 00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:02,309 This hunger for the Savior, 1059 00:47:02,309 --> 00:47:05,309 the White Knight, the Man on Horseback, 1060 00:47:05,309 --> 00:47:08,058 and whoever wins becomes so immensely powerful, 1061 00:47:08,058 --> 00:47:10,309 like Nixon is now, 1062 00:47:10,309 --> 00:47:12,475 that when you vote for President today 1063 00:47:12,475 --> 00:47:14,392 you're talking about giving a man 1064 00:47:14,392 --> 00:47:16,225 dictatorial power for four years. 1065 00:47:16,225 --> 00:47:17,933 You almost have to be a rock star 1066 00:47:17,933 --> 00:47:19,683 to generate the kind of fever 1067 00:47:19,683 --> 00:47:22,434 you need to survive in American politics. 1068 00:47:22,434 --> 00:47:25,766 ["Jumpin' Jack Flash" plays] 1069 00:47:25,766 --> 00:47:27,600 - ♪ I was born ♪ 1070 00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:30,808 ♪ In a crossfire hurricane ♪ 1071 00:47:30,808 --> 00:47:32,683 - In a letter released today, 1072 00:47:32,683 --> 00:47:34,933 President Nixon announced that he will run for re-election. 1073 00:47:34,933 --> 00:47:38,517 - ♪ At my ma in the driving rain ♪ 1074 00:47:38,517 --> 00:47:40,600 [cheering] 1075 00:47:40,600 --> 00:47:44,267 ♪ But it's all right, yeah, it's all right ♪ 1076 00:47:44,267 --> 00:47:46,641 - There's no lack of Democratic candidates. 1077 00:47:46,641 --> 00:47:49,434 Maine Senator Edmund Muskie is an early favorite. 1078 00:47:49,434 --> 00:47:52,933 Also in the race, South Dakota Senator George McGovern, 1079 00:47:52,933 --> 00:47:56,975 dark-horse choice of the youth vote. 1080 00:47:56,975 --> 00:48:00,559 - ♪ Whoo ♪ 1081 00:48:00,559 --> 00:48:02,641 - When you go to Washington... - Yeah. 1082 00:48:02,641 --> 00:48:06,766 - You must make applications for press credentials. 1083 00:48:06,766 --> 00:48:08,808 - I don't think they'd even consider ignoring 1084 00:48:08,808 --> 00:48:11,225 or turning down "Rolling Stone" anyway. 1085 00:48:11,225 --> 00:48:13,058 Unless there was somebody that had something 1086 00:48:13,058 --> 00:48:15,100 really personal against me. 1087 00:48:15,100 --> 00:48:17,225 But, uh, I can't think of anybody, 1088 00:48:17,225 --> 00:48:19,309 except some of Nixon's people might. 1089 00:48:19,309 --> 00:48:20,475 - Yeah, yeah. 1090 00:48:20,475 --> 00:48:22,142 - ♪ But it's all right ♪ 1091 00:48:22,142 --> 00:48:23,808 - The only way a reporter 1092 00:48:23,808 --> 00:48:25,975 should look at a politician is down. 1093 00:48:25,975 --> 00:48:28,017 When I went to Washington, 1094 00:48:28,017 --> 00:48:30,559 I was determined to avoid the clubby, personal relationships 1095 00:48:30,559 --> 00:48:32,975 that develop between politicians and journalists. 1096 00:48:32,975 --> 00:48:34,891 But there are serious problems 1097 00:48:34,891 --> 00:48:37,475 with that kind of merciless, ball-busting approach. 1098 00:48:37,475 --> 00:48:39,808 The most obvious had to do with my natural, 1099 00:48:39,808 --> 00:48:43,183 out-front bias for the McGovern candidacy. 1100 00:48:43,183 --> 00:48:46,225 - We ought to have on our hearts the young men 1101 00:48:46,225 --> 00:48:49,475 who are still tied down in the bitter fighting. 1102 00:48:49,475 --> 00:48:52,933 I want the war in Vietnam ended, 1103 00:48:52,933 --> 00:48:55,142 and I want it ended without delay. 1104 00:48:55,142 --> 00:48:58,225 - He is probably the most honest big-time politician 1105 00:48:58,225 --> 00:49:00,559 in America, which is not quite the same thing 1106 00:49:00,559 --> 00:49:02,434 as being the best candidate. 1107 00:49:02,434 --> 00:49:04,600 For that, McGovern would need at least one dark, 1108 00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:06,600 kinky streak of Mick Jagger in his soul. 1109 00:49:06,600 --> 00:49:08,850 - ♪ I was drowned ♪ 1110 00:49:08,850 --> 00:49:11,766 ♪ I was washed up and left for dead ♪ 1111 00:49:11,766 --> 00:49:13,641 - So much for objective journalism. 1112 00:49:13,641 --> 00:49:15,850 Don't bother to look for it here, 1113 00:49:15,850 --> 00:49:17,267 not under any byline of mine 1114 00:49:17,267 --> 00:49:18,891 or anyone else I can think of. 1115 00:49:18,891 --> 00:49:20,183 With the possible exception 1116 00:49:20,183 --> 00:49:21,975 of things like box scores, 1117 00:49:21,975 --> 00:49:24,142 race results, and stock market tabulations, 1118 00:49:24,142 --> 00:49:27,267 there is no such thing as objective journalism. 1119 00:49:27,267 --> 00:49:30,559 The phrase itself is a pompous contradiction in terms. 1120 00:49:30,559 --> 00:49:33,183 It's the built-in blind spots of the objective rules 1121 00:49:33,183 --> 00:49:35,517 and dogma that allowed Nixon to slither 1122 00:49:35,517 --> 00:49:38,267 into the White House in the first place. 1123 00:49:38,267 --> 00:49:40,017 - Let us be strong. 1124 00:49:40,017 --> 00:49:42,683 Let us be for peace, but let us be for peace 1125 00:49:42,683 --> 00:49:45,142 through strength and not peace through weakness. 1126 00:49:45,142 --> 00:49:46,725 That is what we stand for. 1127 00:49:46,725 --> 00:49:49,017 - Richard Nixon represents the dark side 1128 00:49:49,017 --> 00:49:50,725 of the American Dream. 1129 00:49:50,725 --> 00:49:52,475 Richard Nixon stands, to me, for everything 1130 00:49:52,475 --> 00:49:54,891 that I not only have contempt for but dislike 1131 00:49:54,891 --> 00:49:56,891 and think should be stomped out... 1132 00:49:56,891 --> 00:50:00,225 greed, treachery, stupidity, cupidity, 1133 00:50:00,225 --> 00:50:01,975 positive power of lying, 1134 00:50:01,975 --> 00:50:04,142 total contempt for, uh, any sort 1135 00:50:04,142 --> 00:50:07,267 of human constructive political instinct. 1136 00:50:07,267 --> 00:50:10,517 Nixon represents everything that's wrong with this country. 1137 00:50:10,517 --> 00:50:11,975 - Hi. 1138 00:50:11,975 --> 00:50:13,392 - There are only two ways to make it 1139 00:50:13,392 --> 00:50:15,058 in big-time politics today. 1140 00:50:15,058 --> 00:50:17,058 One is to come on like a mean dinosaur 1141 00:50:17,058 --> 00:50:19,017 with a high-powered machine that scares the shit 1142 00:50:19,017 --> 00:50:21,975 out of your entrenched opposition, like Nixon. 1143 00:50:21,975 --> 00:50:25,475 And the other is to tap the massive frustrated energies 1144 00:50:25,475 --> 00:50:27,975 of a mainly young, disillusioned electorate 1145 00:50:27,975 --> 00:50:30,850 that has long since abandoned the idea 1146 00:50:30,850 --> 00:50:33,017 that you have a duty to vote. 1147 00:50:33,017 --> 00:50:35,600 - Thank you. - Whoo! 1148 00:50:37,267 --> 00:50:39,100 - There were five people or six people 1149 00:50:39,100 --> 00:50:40,850 covering the McGovern campaign, 1150 00:50:40,850 --> 00:50:42,891 of whom two were from "Rolling Stone"-- 1151 00:50:42,891 --> 00:50:45,517 Hunter and Tim Crouse, who was one of our junior stars, 1152 00:50:45,517 --> 00:50:47,267 and he wanted to be up there and cover the campaign. 1153 00:50:47,267 --> 00:50:48,975 I said, "Sure, go right ahead, 1154 00:50:48,975 --> 00:50:51,600 and you can help Hunter while you're at it." 1155 00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:55,683 - The whole idea of a revolution 1156 00:50:55,683 --> 00:50:58,142 that would bring about freedom from repression, 1157 00:50:58,142 --> 00:51:02,058 freedom from convention, that would repudiate war, 1158 00:51:02,058 --> 00:51:05,850 Hunter was very romantic about those things. 1159 00:51:05,850 --> 00:51:08,267 Hunter thought that politics 1160 00:51:08,267 --> 00:51:10,559 could be the vehicle for making the world safe 1161 00:51:10,559 --> 00:51:14,641 for the counterculture and for its ideals. 1162 00:51:14,641 --> 00:51:17,517 Essentially, he was a man 1163 00:51:17,517 --> 00:51:19,766 in search of an honest politician, 1164 00:51:19,766 --> 00:51:22,142 and the only candidate in sight 1165 00:51:22,142 --> 00:51:25,933 who even vaguely qualified was George McGovern, 1166 00:51:25,933 --> 00:51:30,309 and at the same time, Hunter had it in for Muskie, 1167 00:51:30,309 --> 00:51:33,975 the man who McGovern was in competition with, 1168 00:51:33,975 --> 00:51:35,725 like you couldn't believe. 1169 00:51:35,725 --> 00:51:39,309 Hunter just could not lay off of Muskie. 1170 00:51:39,309 --> 00:51:42,559 - What did you do to Ed Muskie? 1171 00:51:42,559 --> 00:51:45,641 - Nothing, unless he did it to himself. 1172 00:51:45,641 --> 00:51:48,017 I just helped him along. 1173 00:51:48,017 --> 00:51:50,517 Toward the end of the Wisconsin primary race, 1174 00:51:50,517 --> 00:51:52,392 about a week before the vote, 1175 00:51:52,392 --> 00:51:54,891 word leaked out that some of Muskie's top advisors 1176 00:51:54,891 --> 00:51:56,891 had called in a Brazilian doctor 1177 00:51:56,891 --> 00:51:58,559 who was said to be treating the candidate 1178 00:51:58,559 --> 00:52:00,517 with some kind of strange drug 1179 00:52:00,517 --> 00:52:03,933 that nobody in the press corps had ever heard of. 1180 00:52:03,933 --> 00:52:05,933 I immediately recognized the ibogaine effect 1181 00:52:05,933 --> 00:52:08,183 from Muskie's tearful breakdown on the flatbed truck 1182 00:52:08,183 --> 00:52:09,766 in New Hampshire, 1183 00:52:09,766 --> 00:52:11,517 the delusions and altered thinking 1184 00:52:11,517 --> 00:52:13,559 that characterized his campaign in Florida, 1185 00:52:13,559 --> 00:52:16,309 and finally the condition of total rage 1186 00:52:16,309 --> 00:52:17,975 that gripped him in Wisconsin. 1187 00:52:17,975 --> 00:52:19,600 It is entirely conceivable, 1188 00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:21,392 given the known effects of ibogaine, 1189 00:52:21,392 --> 00:52:23,267 that Muskie's brain was almost paralyzed 1190 00:52:23,267 --> 00:52:24,975 by hallucinations at the time, 1191 00:52:24,975 --> 00:52:26,766 that he looked out at the crowd 1192 00:52:26,766 --> 00:52:28,725 and saw Gila monsters instead of people. 1193 00:52:28,725 --> 00:52:30,392 We can only speculate on this, 1194 00:52:30,392 --> 00:52:32,350 because those in a position to know 1195 00:52:32,350 --> 00:52:34,891 have flatly refused to comment on rumors concerning 1196 00:52:34,891 --> 00:52:39,017 the senator's disastrous experiments with ibogaine. 1197 00:52:39,017 --> 00:52:41,392 - The rumor began to spread everywhere 1198 00:52:41,392 --> 00:52:43,517 among all the people who were covering the campaign 1199 00:52:43,517 --> 00:52:46,058 that Muskie was, in fact, on this bizarre drug. 1200 00:52:46,058 --> 00:52:48,434 You finally said, well, you made it all up. 1201 00:52:48,434 --> 00:52:50,142 - I had to. 1202 00:52:50,142 --> 00:52:52,225 I couldn't believe people took this stuff seriously. 1203 00:52:52,225 --> 00:52:55,142 People really believed that Muskie was eating ibogaine. 1204 00:52:55,142 --> 00:52:56,808 I never said he was. 1205 00:52:56,808 --> 00:52:58,891 I said there was a rumor in Milwaukee that he was, 1206 00:52:58,891 --> 00:53:00,350 which was true. 1207 00:53:00,350 --> 00:53:02,267 And I started the rumor in Milwaukee. 1208 00:53:02,267 --> 00:53:04,225 [laughter] And, uh... 1209 00:53:04,225 --> 00:53:06,683 Yeah, if you read it carefully, I'm a very accurate journalist. 1210 00:53:06,683 --> 00:53:09,766 [man scatting, vocalizing] 1211 00:53:09,766 --> 00:53:11,766 ♪ ♪ 1212 00:53:11,766 --> 00:53:14,434 [upbeat rock music] 1213 00:53:14,434 --> 00:53:16,267 - The Miami Democratic Convention 1214 00:53:16,267 --> 00:53:18,434 was shaping up very fast as one of the most brutal 1215 00:53:18,434 --> 00:53:21,600 and degrading animal acts of our time. 1216 00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:23,350 Jerry Rubin is making frequent appearances 1217 00:53:23,350 --> 00:53:24,850 on local TV to warn that... 1218 00:53:24,850 --> 00:53:26,600 - There will be ten thousand Yippies 1219 00:53:26,600 --> 00:53:28,517 marching naked down this street. 1220 00:53:28,517 --> 00:53:30,600 There's gonna be marijuana smoked everywhere, 1221 00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:32,267 including from the delegates. 1222 00:53:32,267 --> 00:53:35,559 - ♪ High, high, you too can be happy ♪ 1223 00:53:35,559 --> 00:53:36,766 ♪ La-dee-da ♪ 1224 00:53:36,766 --> 00:53:40,600 [indistinct chatter, chanting] 1225 00:53:40,600 --> 00:53:44,183 - Will the 36th annual convention 1226 00:53:44,183 --> 00:53:48,017 of the Democratic Party please come to order? 1227 00:53:48,017 --> 00:53:50,017 - After four hours of listening 1228 00:53:50,017 --> 00:53:52,850 to a seemingly endless parade of shameless dingbats, 1229 00:53:52,850 --> 00:53:54,475 about half the delegates in the hall 1230 00:53:54,475 --> 00:53:56,267 were beginning to lose control. 1231 00:53:56,267 --> 00:53:57,891 All over the floor, I saw people 1232 00:53:57,891 --> 00:53:59,975 giving in to the lure of booze, 1233 00:53:59,975 --> 00:54:01,725 and in the crowded aisle 1234 00:54:01,725 --> 00:54:04,058 between the California and Wisconsin delegations, 1235 00:54:04,058 --> 00:54:06,808 a smiling freak with a bottle of liquid THC 1236 00:54:06,808 --> 00:54:08,517 was giving free hits to anyone 1237 00:54:08,517 --> 00:54:10,641 who still had the strength to stand. 1238 00:54:10,641 --> 00:54:12,392 - It's very good. 1239 00:54:12,392 --> 00:54:14,309 - Okay. - Before it's too late. 1240 00:54:14,309 --> 00:54:16,517 Takes about an hour. [both laughing] 1241 00:54:18,683 --> 00:54:20,808 - McGovern had put together 1242 00:54:20,808 --> 00:54:22,808 a really mind-bending coalition... 1243 00:54:22,808 --> 00:54:25,309 a weird mix of peace freaks and hard hats, 1244 00:54:25,309 --> 00:54:26,808 farmers and film stars, 1245 00:54:26,808 --> 00:54:29,183 along with urban blacks, rural Chicanos, 1246 00:54:29,183 --> 00:54:30,891 the youth vote-- 1247 00:54:30,891 --> 00:54:33,766 a coalition that could elect almost anybody. 1248 00:54:33,766 --> 00:54:36,017 - You're a director as well as an actor. 1249 00:54:36,017 --> 00:54:38,891 Do you feel that this change really gets to the young people 1250 00:54:38,891 --> 00:54:40,683 who in a way are your constituency, 1251 00:54:40,683 --> 00:54:42,142 your special followers? 1252 00:54:42,142 --> 00:54:43,933 - The fact that they are involved, 1253 00:54:43,933 --> 00:54:45,850 that they are interested and they realize that there is 1254 00:54:45,850 --> 00:54:49,267 a process with which they can govern their own society. 1255 00:54:49,267 --> 00:54:52,183 I think that they feel included. 1256 00:54:52,183 --> 00:54:53,683 - By midnight on Monday, 1257 00:54:53,683 --> 00:54:55,808 McGovern would get the nomination. 1258 00:54:55,808 --> 00:54:58,517 - From military spending so wasteful 1259 00:54:58,517 --> 00:55:03,017 that it weakens our nation, come home, America. 1260 00:55:03,017 --> 00:55:07,725 Come home to the belief that we can seek a newer world. 1261 00:55:07,725 --> 00:55:10,850 [wild cheering] 1262 00:55:17,850 --> 00:55:22,225 - ♪ Glory, glory, hallelujah ♪ 1263 00:55:22,225 --> 00:55:26,725 ♪ Glory, glory, hallelujah ♪ 1264 00:55:26,725 --> 00:55:30,559 ♪ Glory, glory, hallelujah ♪ 1265 00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:35,434 ♪ His truth is marching on ♪ 1266 00:55:35,434 --> 00:55:39,058 - Compared to the Democratic Convention five weeks earlier, 1267 00:55:39,058 --> 00:55:40,891 the Nixon celebration was an ugly, 1268 00:55:40,891 --> 00:55:42,475 low-level trip that hovered somewhere 1269 00:55:42,475 --> 00:55:44,517 in that grim indefinable limbo 1270 00:55:44,517 --> 00:55:46,559 between dullness and obscenity, 1271 00:55:46,559 --> 00:55:48,808 like a bad pornographic film that you want to walk out on, 1272 00:55:48,808 --> 00:55:51,058 but sit through anyway and then leave the theater 1273 00:55:51,058 --> 00:55:54,058 feeling depressed and vaguely embarrassed. 1274 00:55:54,058 --> 00:55:55,808 There may not be much difference 1275 00:55:55,808 --> 00:55:57,850 between Democrats and Republicans. 1276 00:55:57,850 --> 00:55:59,808 I've made that argument myself, 1277 00:55:59,808 --> 00:56:02,475 but only a blind geek could miss the difference 1278 00:56:02,475 --> 00:56:05,641 between McGovern and Richard Nixon. 1279 00:56:05,641 --> 00:56:08,766 [crowd cheering] 1280 00:56:12,766 --> 00:56:14,850 I'm not an easy person to deal with 1281 00:56:14,850 --> 00:56:16,808 in terms of deadlines, 1282 00:56:16,808 --> 00:56:19,017 and when I didn't show up for three or four days, 1283 00:56:19,017 --> 00:56:20,933 they decided to do the only logical thing. 1284 00:56:20,933 --> 00:56:22,517 - Thanks. 1285 00:56:22,517 --> 00:56:24,559 - One afternoon, they showed up at my door 1286 00:56:24,559 --> 00:56:26,850 with no warning and loaded about 40 pounds of supplies 1287 00:56:26,850 --> 00:56:29,434 into the room-- two cases of Mexican beer, 1288 00:56:29,434 --> 00:56:32,559 four quarts of gin, a dozen grapefruits, and enough speed 1289 00:56:32,559 --> 00:56:36,267 to alter the outcome of about six Super Bowls. 1290 00:56:36,267 --> 00:56:38,142 Also a big Selectric typewriter, 1291 00:56:38,142 --> 00:56:40,559 two reams of paper, and three tape-recorders... 1292 00:56:40,559 --> 00:56:42,641 Everything stops, comes to a grinding halt. 1293 00:56:42,641 --> 00:56:44,683 Just in case the situation got so desperate 1294 00:56:44,683 --> 00:56:48,641 that I might finally have to resort to verbal composition. 1295 00:56:48,641 --> 00:56:51,683 ["Who'll Stop the Rain" plays] 1296 00:56:51,683 --> 00:56:58,808 ♪ ♪ 1297 00:57:00,309 --> 00:57:03,850 - ♪ Long as I remember ♪ 1298 00:57:03,850 --> 00:57:07,933 ♪ The rain's been coming down ♪ 1299 00:57:07,933 --> 00:57:10,267 ♪ Clouds of mystery pouring ♪ 1300 00:57:10,267 --> 00:57:12,683 - If the current polls are reliable, 1301 00:57:12,683 --> 00:57:15,641 Nixon will be re-elected by a huge majority of Americans 1302 00:57:15,641 --> 00:57:17,600 who feel he is not only more honest 1303 00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:19,475 and more trustworthy, 1304 00:57:19,475 --> 00:57:22,683 but also more likely to end the war in Vietnam. 1305 00:57:22,683 --> 00:57:26,808 - ♪ And I wonder, still I wonder ♪ 1306 00:57:26,808 --> 00:57:30,183 ♪ Who'll stop the rain ♪ 1307 00:57:30,183 --> 00:57:33,309 - This may be the year when we finally come face-to-face 1308 00:57:33,309 --> 00:57:36,225 with ourselves, that we are really just a nation 1309 00:57:36,225 --> 00:57:38,683 of 220 million used-car salesmen 1310 00:57:38,683 --> 00:57:41,350 with all the money we need to buy guns 1311 00:57:41,350 --> 00:57:44,017 and no qualms about killing anybody else 1312 00:57:44,017 --> 00:57:45,891 that tries to make us uncomfortable. 1313 00:57:45,891 --> 00:57:48,183 - ♪ I watched the tower grow ♪ 1314 00:57:48,183 --> 00:57:51,058 - So far, no states projected for Senator McGovern. 1315 00:57:51,058 --> 00:57:53,641 - This is a considerable sweep 1316 00:57:53,641 --> 00:57:56,517 for President Nixon, the definition of a landslide. 1317 00:57:56,517 --> 00:57:59,975 - ♪ And I wonder, still I wonder ♪ 1318 00:57:59,975 --> 00:58:03,017 ♪ Who'll stop the rain ♪ 1319 00:58:03,017 --> 00:58:05,475 - Jesus, where will it end? 1320 00:58:05,475 --> 00:58:08,559 How low do you have to stoop in this country 1321 00:58:08,559 --> 00:58:10,267 to be president? 1322 00:58:10,267 --> 00:58:12,225 ♪ ♪ 1323 00:58:50,183 --> 00:58:54,100 [gentle music] 1324 00:58:54,100 --> 00:58:58,058 It is Nixon himself who represents that dark, 1325 00:58:58,058 --> 00:59:00,434 venal, and incurably violent side 1326 00:59:00,434 --> 00:59:02,225 of the American character. 1327 00:59:02,225 --> 00:59:05,225 He speaks for the werewolf in us, the bully, 1328 00:59:05,225 --> 00:59:06,808 the predatory shyster 1329 00:59:06,808 --> 00:59:09,058 who turns into something unspeakable, 1330 00:59:09,058 --> 00:59:11,683 full of claws and bleeding string warts 1331 00:59:11,683 --> 00:59:15,850 on nights when the moon comes too close. 1332 00:59:15,850 --> 00:59:18,309 - There was something going on with Hunter Thompson 1333 00:59:18,309 --> 00:59:21,267 that was going to sort of like, you know-- 1334 00:59:21,267 --> 00:59:23,808 that was explosive and charismatic, 1335 00:59:23,808 --> 00:59:25,725 and he really wanted to be a lone wolf. 1336 00:59:25,725 --> 00:59:29,434 He would push me away from him to go out and do my own story. 1337 00:59:29,434 --> 00:59:32,475 So, you know, on some level, um, 1338 00:59:32,475 --> 00:59:34,683 you know, the writer and the photographer 1339 00:59:34,683 --> 00:59:37,434 really were pushed into separate directions, you know. 1340 00:59:37,434 --> 00:59:39,475 And--and the photographs did not have to mirror 1341 00:59:39,475 --> 00:59:41,142 what was in the story, but they could-- 1342 00:59:41,142 --> 00:59:42,975 they would always complement the story, 1343 00:59:42,975 --> 00:59:45,475 and they could always add to what, you know, 1344 00:59:45,475 --> 00:59:48,600 what the story was about. 1345 00:59:48,600 --> 00:59:52,058 Um, San Clemente, 1346 00:59:52,058 --> 00:59:55,350 pictures from San Clemente. 1347 00:59:55,350 --> 00:59:57,766 White House press bus, the restless wind. 1348 00:59:57,766 --> 00:59:59,309 - [chuckles] 1349 00:59:59,309 --> 01:00:02,600 - These are the pictures from leaving. 1350 01:00:02,600 --> 01:00:04,142 - When he resigned, 1351 01:00:04,142 --> 01:00:06,017 we were kind of stuck with nothing when Hunter 1352 01:00:06,017 --> 01:00:08,225 didn't write anything, and you had this portfolio. 1353 01:00:08,225 --> 01:00:12,100 So our contribution to the coverage of his resignation-- 1354 01:00:12,100 --> 01:00:13,559 - You were on deadline. 1355 01:00:13,559 --> 01:00:15,142 You were leaving all those pages for Hunter, 1356 01:00:15,142 --> 01:00:17,683 and you filled it up with these pictures, 1357 01:00:17,683 --> 01:00:20,683 which was unbelievable to take these pictures that-- 1358 01:00:20,683 --> 01:00:23,933 that needed space, that needed to go big, 1359 01:00:23,933 --> 01:00:27,142 and you created a classic photo spread. 1360 01:00:27,142 --> 01:00:28,392 - Mm-hmm. 1361 01:00:28,392 --> 01:00:30,559 Who will ever forget that image? 1362 01:00:30,559 --> 01:00:32,683 Unbelievable. 1363 01:00:39,350 --> 01:00:41,058 - It was timely, because we could do this-- 1364 01:00:41,058 --> 01:00:42,808 we could-- one, I didn't think-- 1365 01:00:42,808 --> 01:00:44,517 one, I didn't think we had a cover picture. 1366 01:00:44,517 --> 01:00:46,517 We had an old hero picture, right? 1367 01:00:46,517 --> 01:00:48,475 I'm not keen on these. 1368 01:00:48,475 --> 01:00:50,100 - So we are choosing it on photos rather than story? 1369 01:00:50,100 --> 01:00:52,100 - No, I happen to think that the cover idea 1370 01:00:52,100 --> 01:00:53,766 that we've evolved now, you now, 1371 01:00:53,766 --> 01:00:56,683 which is shooting against an all-white seamless, 1372 01:00:56,683 --> 01:00:58,309 is fantastic, and we're gon-- 1373 01:00:58,309 --> 01:00:59,933 I love it. It looks beautiful. 1374 01:00:59,933 --> 01:01:01,766 - You don't necessarily have to always shoot 1375 01:01:01,766 --> 01:01:04,641 on white, because as long as it's a consistent style-- 1376 01:01:04,641 --> 01:01:06,350 - Not a matter of subject matter 1377 01:01:06,350 --> 01:01:08,142 or whether you use white backgrounds on the cover, 1378 01:01:08,142 --> 01:01:09,891 black backgrounds or red borders or whatever, 1379 01:01:09,891 --> 01:01:11,725 there are only X number of rock and roll covers 1380 01:01:11,725 --> 01:01:13,641 you can do anymore, and it's getting less and less-- 1381 01:01:13,641 --> 01:01:15,017 and it's not the nature of us. 1382 01:01:15,017 --> 01:01:16,559 It's the nature of the industry, 1383 01:01:16,559 --> 01:01:18,225 and it's going to continue that way. 1384 01:01:18,225 --> 01:01:20,891 - Uh, yeah. Okay, next. 1385 01:01:20,891 --> 01:01:24,058 [James Brown's "Papa Don't Take No Mess"] 1386 01:01:24,058 --> 01:01:26,559 ♪ ♪ 1387 01:01:26,559 --> 01:01:28,183 - Over yellow. 1388 01:01:28,183 --> 01:01:30,100 - "Rolling Stone" had already evolved 1389 01:01:30,100 --> 01:01:33,725 its own culture, and I wasn't a joiner. 1390 01:01:33,725 --> 01:01:37,434 - ♪ Oh, papa don't take no mess ♪ 1391 01:01:37,434 --> 01:01:41,142 ♪ Papa don't take no mess ♪ 1392 01:01:41,142 --> 01:01:43,683 - I had other plans for myself. 1393 01:01:43,683 --> 01:01:48,975 So I ran my own page in the record reviews. 1394 01:01:48,975 --> 01:01:51,600 Getting a good review in "Rolling Stone" 1395 01:01:51,600 --> 01:01:55,434 became something to strive for. 1396 01:01:55,434 --> 01:01:57,142 ♪ ♪ 1397 01:01:57,142 --> 01:02:00,517 What I liked most and what I wrote about most 1398 01:02:00,517 --> 01:02:03,058 was black music. 1399 01:02:03,058 --> 01:02:07,600 My early articles were about B.B. King, 1400 01:02:07,600 --> 01:02:10,475 Aretha Franklin, Sam & Dave, 1401 01:02:10,475 --> 01:02:14,017 Otis Redding, Wilson Pickett. 1402 01:02:14,017 --> 01:02:17,975 At first some of my things smelled a little too much 1403 01:02:17,975 --> 01:02:21,475 like college term papers. 1404 01:02:21,475 --> 01:02:24,309 I was told by Jann, "You got to loosen up here." 1405 01:02:24,309 --> 01:02:27,392 - ♪ Papa don't, papa don't, papa don't, papa don't ♪ 1406 01:02:27,392 --> 01:02:29,434 ♪ Papa don't, papa don't ♪ 1407 01:02:29,434 --> 01:02:32,891 ♪ Papa don't take no mess ♪ 1408 01:02:32,891 --> 01:02:35,808 ♪ Papa don't take no mess ♪ 1409 01:02:35,808 --> 01:02:38,683 - Rock is far more popular than ever before, 1410 01:02:38,683 --> 01:02:41,891 but it appears to have much less social impact. 1411 01:02:41,891 --> 01:02:44,392 It is broader than it was ten years ago, 1412 01:02:44,392 --> 01:02:46,017 making unprecedented use 1413 01:02:46,017 --> 01:02:48,350 of country, jazz, and straight pop. 1414 01:02:48,350 --> 01:02:51,766 And yet to my ears, it sounds ever more homogeneous. 1415 01:02:51,766 --> 01:02:53,975 Rock's single biggest lack today 1416 01:02:53,975 --> 01:02:56,434 is a failure of imagination. 1417 01:02:56,434 --> 01:02:59,850 - ♪ We're an American band ♪ 1418 01:02:59,850 --> 01:03:02,267 ♪ We're an American band ♪ 1419 01:03:02,267 --> 01:03:03,725 ♪ Whoo ♪ 1420 01:03:03,725 --> 01:03:06,183 ♪ We're an American band ♪ 1421 01:03:06,183 --> 01:03:07,683 ♪ Whoo ♪ 1422 01:03:07,683 --> 01:03:10,350 ♪ ♪ 1423 01:03:10,350 --> 01:03:12,100 - Tonight there's someone I can write of 1424 01:03:12,100 --> 01:03:13,641 the way I used to write, 1425 01:03:13,641 --> 01:03:15,975 without reservation of any kind. 1426 01:03:15,975 --> 01:03:18,350 Last Thursday at the Harvard Square Theater, 1427 01:03:18,350 --> 01:03:22,017 I saw my rock and roll past flash before my eyes. 1428 01:03:22,017 --> 01:03:24,058 - One, two, three, go! 1429 01:03:24,058 --> 01:03:27,183 ["Tenth Avenue Freeze-Out" begins] 1430 01:03:27,183 --> 01:03:30,850 ♪ ♪ 1431 01:03:30,850 --> 01:03:32,392 Break it down! 1432 01:03:32,392 --> 01:03:34,225 - And I saw something else. 1433 01:03:34,225 --> 01:03:36,392 I saw rock and roll future. 1434 01:03:36,392 --> 01:03:39,434 And its name is Bruce Springsteen. 1435 01:03:39,434 --> 01:03:41,225 - ♪ Teardrops on the city ♪ 1436 01:03:41,225 --> 01:03:45,058 ♪ Bad Scooter searching for his groove ♪ 1437 01:03:45,058 --> 01:03:46,683 ♪ ♪ 1438 01:03:46,683 --> 01:03:48,933 ♪ Seem like the whole world's walking pretty ♪ 1439 01:03:48,933 --> 01:03:52,475 ♪ And you can't find the room to move ♪ 1440 01:03:52,475 --> 01:03:54,641 Clarence! 1441 01:03:54,641 --> 01:03:58,225 ♪ Well, everybody better move over, that's all ♪ 1442 01:03:58,225 --> 01:04:00,183 ♪ 'Cause I'm running on the bad side ♪ 1443 01:04:00,183 --> 01:04:03,392 ♪ And I got my back to the wall, man ♪ 1444 01:04:03,392 --> 01:04:06,392 - ♪ Tenth Avenue freeze-out ♪ 1445 01:04:06,392 --> 01:04:10,183 - Hit it! - ♪ Tenth Avenue freeze-out ♪ 1446 01:04:10,183 --> 01:04:12,559 - ♪ I was stranded out in the jungle ♪ 1447 01:04:12,559 --> 01:04:15,559 ♪ Taking all the heat that was given ♪ 1448 01:04:15,559 --> 01:04:17,725 ♪ ♪ 1449 01:04:17,725 --> 01:04:20,225 ♪ Yeah, the night is dark, and the sidewalk's bright ♪ 1450 01:04:20,225 --> 01:04:23,100 ♪ And lined with the light of the living ♪ 1451 01:04:23,100 --> 01:04:25,267 ♪ ♪ 1452 01:04:25,267 --> 01:04:28,933 ♪ From a tenement window, a transistor blasts ♪ 1453 01:04:28,933 --> 01:04:30,725 ♪ Turn around the corner ♪ 1454 01:04:30,725 --> 01:04:32,891 ♪ Things got real quiet real fast ♪ 1455 01:04:32,891 --> 01:04:35,183 ♪ I walked into a... ♪ - ♪ Tenth Avenue freeze-out ♪ 1456 01:04:35,183 --> 01:04:36,933 - Springsteen does it all. 1457 01:04:36,933 --> 01:04:39,392 He's a rock and roll punk, Latin street poet, 1458 01:04:39,392 --> 01:04:43,183 a ballet dancer, an actor, a joker, bar bandleader, 1459 01:04:43,183 --> 01:04:46,475 hot-shit rhythm guitar player, extraordinary singer, 1460 01:04:46,475 --> 01:04:49,434 and a truly great rock and roll composer. 1461 01:04:49,434 --> 01:04:51,434 He leads a band like he's been doing it forever. 1462 01:04:51,434 --> 01:04:53,350 - ♪ I'm talking about a Tenth ♪ 1463 01:04:53,350 --> 01:04:55,517 - I racked my brains but simply can't think 1464 01:04:55,517 --> 01:04:59,475 of a white artist who does so many things so superbly. 1465 01:04:59,475 --> 01:05:01,475 - ♪ I'm talking about a Tenth ♪ 1466 01:05:01,475 --> 01:05:04,475 - ♪ Tenth Avenue freeze-out ♪ - ♪ Freeze-out, whoo ♪ 1467 01:05:04,475 --> 01:05:11,517 ♪ ♪ 1468 01:05:17,309 --> 01:05:19,392 Yeah! 1469 01:05:19,392 --> 01:05:21,850 "Rolling Stone" I was very tuned into 1470 01:05:21,850 --> 01:05:23,641 from probably the first issue, 1471 01:05:23,641 --> 01:05:26,434 because that would have come out when I was 17. 1472 01:05:26,434 --> 01:05:29,975 It was like, "Oh, my God, there's other weirdos like me 1473 01:05:29,975 --> 01:05:32,808 "out there that are really taking this stuff 1474 01:05:32,808 --> 01:05:35,309 very seriously." 1475 01:05:35,309 --> 01:05:37,309 ♪ A Tenth ♪ 1476 01:05:37,309 --> 01:05:39,683 ♪ ♪ 1477 01:05:39,683 --> 01:05:41,017 [cheers and applause] 1478 01:05:41,017 --> 01:05:44,183 In '74, we were two records in. 1479 01:05:44,183 --> 01:05:46,350 I had a three-record deal. 1480 01:05:46,350 --> 01:05:48,434 Two records hadn't done well. 1481 01:05:48,434 --> 01:05:51,434 Everybody who had hired me had moved on, 1482 01:05:51,434 --> 01:05:53,225 out of the record company. 1483 01:05:53,225 --> 01:05:55,683 One, two, three, four... 1484 01:05:55,683 --> 01:05:57,600 ["Jungleland" begins] 1485 01:05:57,600 --> 01:06:00,683 Our production team was failing at that moment. 1486 01:06:00,683 --> 01:06:03,100 We couldn't record what I knew were good songs. 1487 01:06:03,100 --> 01:06:04,850 We'd already been playing them live. 1488 01:06:04,850 --> 01:06:06,559 "Jungleland," we already had. 1489 01:06:06,559 --> 01:06:08,766 I think we had "Thunder Road," versions of it. 1490 01:06:08,766 --> 01:06:12,183 But we were failing to be able to get these down on record. 1491 01:06:12,183 --> 01:06:14,309 So I went back to a night in Boston 1492 01:06:14,309 --> 01:06:17,683 when I read one of Jon's reviews. 1493 01:06:17,683 --> 01:06:20,434 I said, "Okay, there's information here 1494 01:06:20,434 --> 01:06:23,517 "that I'm not getting from the people around me. 1495 01:06:23,517 --> 01:06:26,350 "This seems smart. 1496 01:06:26,350 --> 01:06:28,392 I need to be closer to this guy." 1497 01:06:28,392 --> 01:06:31,058 And we started up a friendship. 1498 01:06:31,058 --> 01:06:34,808 - Bruce was just one of those great connections 1499 01:06:34,808 --> 01:06:37,766 you make in life that there's nothing like it. 1500 01:06:37,766 --> 01:06:40,766 - ♪ The Rangers had a homecoming ♪ 1501 01:06:40,766 --> 01:06:42,808 One evening, I brought him into the studio, 1502 01:06:42,808 --> 01:06:45,392 and he just observed what we were doing. 1503 01:06:45,392 --> 01:06:48,850 At the end of the night, we went and had a bite somewhere, 1504 01:06:48,850 --> 01:06:52,058 and he said, "Well, you know, if there's anything 1505 01:06:52,058 --> 01:06:54,392 that you think I can do, let me know." 1506 01:06:54,392 --> 01:06:56,058 ♪ Sitting on the hood of a Dodge ♪ 1507 01:06:56,058 --> 01:06:58,142 - My strength was in music 1508 01:06:58,142 --> 01:07:03,434 and some natural ability to edit and arrange. 1509 01:07:03,434 --> 01:07:06,683 I think a lot of what I did at "Rolling Stone" prepared me 1510 01:07:06,683 --> 01:07:11,933 in odd ways for the work that I wound up doing with Bruce. 1511 01:07:11,933 --> 01:07:13,933 ["Thunder Road" begins] 1512 01:07:13,933 --> 01:07:17,058 - ♪ Screen door slams ♪ 1513 01:07:17,058 --> 01:07:20,933 ♪ Mary's dress waves ♪ 1514 01:07:20,933 --> 01:07:24,850 ♪ Like a vision, she dances across the porch ♪ 1515 01:07:24,850 --> 01:07:28,600 ♪ As the radio plays ♪ 1516 01:07:28,600 --> 01:07:32,267 ♪ Roy Orbison singing for the lonely ♪ 1517 01:07:32,267 --> 01:07:36,267 ♪ Hey, that's me, and I want you only ♪ 1518 01:07:36,267 --> 01:07:38,517 ♪ Don't turn me home again ♪ 1519 01:07:38,517 --> 01:07:43,517 ♪ I just can't face myself alone again ♪ 1520 01:07:43,517 --> 01:07:47,017 The earliest versions of the material on "Born to Run," 1521 01:07:47,017 --> 01:07:48,766 the arrangement was longer, 1522 01:07:48,766 --> 01:07:51,475 and it went through some rhythm changes 1523 01:07:51,475 --> 01:07:54,017 and different musical changes. 1524 01:07:54,017 --> 01:07:57,559 ♪ There were ghosts in the eyes ♪ 1525 01:07:57,559 --> 01:08:01,641 ♪ Of all the boys you sent away ♪ 1526 01:08:01,641 --> 01:08:04,267 ♪ They haunt this dusty beach road ♪ 1527 01:08:04,267 --> 01:08:09,600 ♪ In the skeleton frames of burned-out Chevrolets ♪ 1528 01:08:09,600 --> 01:08:12,975 ♪ They scream your name at night in the street ♪ 1529 01:08:12,975 --> 01:08:17,142 ♪ Your graduation gown lies in rags at their feet ♪ 1530 01:08:17,142 --> 01:08:18,975 One of the things that Jon did 1531 01:08:18,975 --> 01:08:20,808 was he was an editor. 1532 01:08:20,808 --> 01:08:24,850 And we were looking for a more streamlined sound 1533 01:08:24,850 --> 01:08:27,725 that felt like a direct punch to the gut, 1534 01:08:27,725 --> 01:08:29,392 to take what I was doing 1535 01:08:29,392 --> 01:08:33,392 and melt it down into this powerful engine. 1536 01:08:33,392 --> 01:08:36,183 ♪ Climb in ♪ 1537 01:08:36,183 --> 01:08:38,183 ♪ It's a town full of losers ♪ 1538 01:08:38,183 --> 01:08:41,850 ♪ I'm pulling out of here to win ♪ 1539 01:08:41,850 --> 01:08:48,891 ♪ ♪ 1540 01:08:56,975 --> 01:09:00,100 - I got the job producing 1541 01:09:00,100 --> 01:09:03,475 what became Bruce's breakthrough album, 1542 01:09:03,475 --> 01:09:06,350 "Born to Run." 1543 01:09:06,350 --> 01:09:10,725 And I realized that that's what I wanted to be now, 1544 01:09:10,725 --> 01:09:12,891 a record producer. 1545 01:09:12,891 --> 01:09:16,559 It was time to let go of the magazine. 1546 01:09:16,559 --> 01:09:23,350 ♪ ♪ 1547 01:09:23,350 --> 01:09:27,850 - There was a generation that started the magazine 1548 01:09:27,850 --> 01:09:31,725 but had grown a little bit away 1549 01:09:31,725 --> 01:09:34,975 from what it had become-- what rock had become. 1550 01:09:34,975 --> 01:09:38,142 [Deep Purple's "Smoke on the Water"] 1551 01:09:38,142 --> 01:09:45,225 ♪ ♪ 1552 01:09:50,933 --> 01:09:53,975 - By the mid '70s, there were all these other bands. 1553 01:09:53,975 --> 01:09:57,517 You know, who wants to write about Deep Purple? 1554 01:09:57,517 --> 01:09:58,933 And I would be like, 1555 01:09:58,933 --> 01:10:00,766 "I will write about Deep Purple. 1556 01:10:00,766 --> 01:10:05,100 "In fact, I will spend weeks writing about Deep Purple. 1557 01:10:05,100 --> 01:10:08,225 I will--I will be your Deep Purple man." 1558 01:10:08,225 --> 01:10:13,267 - ♪ Smoke on the water ♪ 1559 01:10:13,267 --> 01:10:16,933 ♪ Fire in the sky ♪ 1560 01:10:16,933 --> 01:10:18,725 ♪ Smoke on the water ♪ 1561 01:10:18,725 --> 01:10:20,475 - I was the guy that they liked to say 1562 01:10:20,475 --> 01:10:22,100 took out the garbage. 1563 01:10:22,100 --> 01:10:23,850 To them, it was the garbage, you know. 1564 01:10:23,850 --> 01:10:25,434 For me, it was heaven. 1565 01:10:25,434 --> 01:10:28,600 [Jethro Tull's "Song for Jeffrey"] 1566 01:10:28,600 --> 01:10:34,641 ♪ ♪ 1567 01:10:34,641 --> 01:10:36,850 To ask Jethro Tull about the flute 1568 01:10:36,850 --> 01:10:39,808 and Ritchie Blackmore about his guitar sound... 1569 01:10:39,808 --> 01:10:42,350 ♪ ♪ 1570 01:10:42,350 --> 01:10:46,350 That was me, and I was so happy to do that. 1571 01:10:46,350 --> 01:10:48,975 - ♪ Gonna lose my way tomorrow ♪ 1572 01:10:48,975 --> 01:10:51,434 ♪ Gonna give away my car ♪ 1573 01:10:51,434 --> 01:10:53,975 ♪ I'd take you along with me ♪ 1574 01:10:53,975 --> 01:10:56,475 ♪ But you would not go so far ♪ 1575 01:10:56,475 --> 01:10:59,267 ♪ Don't see what I do not want to see ♪ 1576 01:10:59,267 --> 01:11:01,850 ♪ You don't hear what I don't say ♪ 1577 01:11:01,850 --> 01:11:03,683 ♪ Won't be what I don't want to be ♪ 1578 01:11:03,683 --> 01:11:07,267 - I always felt, because I was a freelancer, 1579 01:11:07,267 --> 01:11:09,142 bands that had a problem with "Rolling Stone" 1580 01:11:09,142 --> 01:11:12,017 for one reason or another, I could always say, 1581 01:11:12,017 --> 01:11:17,017 "Well, I work for them, but I'm not the magazine." 1582 01:11:17,017 --> 01:11:19,850 One of the bands that really had a problem 1583 01:11:19,850 --> 01:11:21,808 with "Rolling Stone" was Led Zeppelin. 1584 01:11:21,808 --> 01:11:26,808 - ♪ Oh, I ♪ 1585 01:11:26,808 --> 01:11:30,225 ♪ I can't quit you ♪ 1586 01:11:30,225 --> 01:11:32,850 ♪ Baby ♪ 1587 01:11:32,850 --> 01:11:35,392 ♪ ♪ 1588 01:11:35,392 --> 01:11:40,808 ♪ And I think I'm gonna put you down ♪ 1589 01:11:40,808 --> 01:11:43,808 ♪ For a little while ♪ 1590 01:11:43,808 --> 01:11:48,392 - Their first album was trashed. 1591 01:11:48,392 --> 01:11:51,434 - ♪ I can't quit you, baby ♪ 1592 01:11:51,434 --> 01:11:53,850 - As they started to become huge, 1593 01:11:53,850 --> 01:11:57,475 they did not want to give "Rolling Stone" coverage. 1594 01:11:57,475 --> 01:12:02,725 So my job was to talk them into "Rolling Stone." 1595 01:12:02,725 --> 01:12:04,891 It took three weeks. 1596 01:12:04,891 --> 01:12:06,725 ♪ ♪ 1597 01:12:06,725 --> 01:12:08,517 - Although Led Zeppelin has managed 1598 01:12:08,517 --> 01:12:10,434 to sell more than a million units apiece 1599 01:12:10,434 --> 01:12:13,017 on all five of its albums and is currently working 1600 01:12:13,017 --> 01:12:14,808 a U.S. tour expected to be 1601 01:12:14,808 --> 01:12:17,975 the largest-grossing undertaking in rock history, 1602 01:12:17,975 --> 01:12:20,559 the band has been continually kicked, 1603 01:12:20,559 --> 01:12:23,683 shoved, pummeled, and kneed in the groin 1604 01:12:23,683 --> 01:12:25,725 by critics of all stripes. 1605 01:12:25,725 --> 01:12:28,808 - I really put my heart into this piece 1606 01:12:28,808 --> 01:12:30,975 on Led Zeppelin. 1607 01:12:30,975 --> 01:12:34,641 And I sent it in, and I was expecting the call, 1608 01:12:34,641 --> 01:12:36,725 "Way to go!" [chuckles] 1609 01:12:36,725 --> 01:12:39,267 [phone rings] 1610 01:12:39,267 --> 01:12:41,725 The call I got was from Ben Fong-Torres, 1611 01:12:41,725 --> 01:12:43,725 saying, "Jann wants to see you." 1612 01:12:43,725 --> 01:12:45,517 And I was like, "Well, this is great!" 1613 01:12:45,517 --> 01:12:47,641 And he's like, "Come up to San Francisco. 1614 01:12:47,641 --> 01:12:50,183 "I'll pick you up and take you to the 'Rolling Stone' office. 1615 01:12:50,183 --> 01:12:54,058 And you should know this is a very bad day." 1616 01:12:54,058 --> 01:12:57,100 [somber music] 1617 01:12:57,100 --> 01:13:01,933 ♪ ♪ 1618 01:13:01,933 --> 01:13:06,475 "Ralph J. Gleason, Jann's mentor, died, 1619 01:13:06,475 --> 01:13:08,183 and he's very upset." 1620 01:13:08,183 --> 01:13:11,434 ♪ ♪ 1621 01:13:11,434 --> 01:13:13,267 I go in there, and they say, 1622 01:13:13,267 --> 01:13:16,225 "Jann, the kid from the Led Zeppelin story is here." 1623 01:13:16,225 --> 01:13:19,017 And he says, "Bring him in." 1624 01:13:19,017 --> 01:13:23,058 - That was a very tough, moving day for me. 1625 01:13:23,058 --> 01:13:27,017 And into all that walked young Cameron. 1626 01:13:27,017 --> 01:13:29,850 - There in the corner is Jann 1627 01:13:29,850 --> 01:13:32,600 with a half-finished bottle of vodka 1628 01:13:32,600 --> 01:13:36,766 sitting in front of him, and he's been crying. 1629 01:13:36,766 --> 01:13:38,850 And he said, "I want to tell you 1630 01:13:38,850 --> 01:13:40,475 about your Led Zeppelin story." 1631 01:13:40,475 --> 01:13:42,225 He goes, "Thank you. 1632 01:13:42,225 --> 01:13:46,475 We're gonna run it, but you failed." 1633 01:13:46,475 --> 01:13:48,850 And I said, 1634 01:13:48,850 --> 01:13:50,475 "How did I fail?" 1635 01:13:50,475 --> 01:13:52,309 - You know, for a 16-year-old kid, 1636 01:13:52,309 --> 01:13:54,600 it was a great story, but for a professional journalist, 1637 01:13:54,600 --> 01:13:56,475 he was way soft on the characters 1638 01:13:56,475 --> 01:13:57,933 he was writing about, 1639 01:13:57,933 --> 01:13:59,350 the people he was writing about. 1640 01:13:59,350 --> 01:14:00,975 Not that we wanted to be harsh, 1641 01:14:00,975 --> 01:14:02,891 but you had to have a little more 1642 01:14:02,891 --> 01:14:06,766 of a worldly view of it than just a fan's view of it. 1643 01:14:06,766 --> 01:14:08,600 - And he said, 1644 01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:11,517 "You wrote what they wanted you to write. 1645 01:14:11,517 --> 01:14:13,850 "There's nothing in that story 1646 01:14:13,850 --> 01:14:16,641 "that was you getting to the heart 1647 01:14:16,641 --> 01:14:20,058 "of what the real scene was, what it felt like, 1648 01:14:20,058 --> 01:14:25,434 "what it smelled like, what they meant at this time 1649 01:14:25,434 --> 01:14:29,100 "in history for people to read years from now. 1650 01:14:29,100 --> 01:14:31,058 "You don't have that. 1651 01:14:31,058 --> 01:14:33,683 "You have them talking about themselves. 1652 01:14:33,683 --> 01:14:37,850 Nice stuff, but it's not the stuff." 1653 01:14:37,850 --> 01:14:39,891 And then he said, "Wait right here." 1654 01:14:39,891 --> 01:14:44,434 And he went to the back room and came out with this-- 1655 01:14:44,434 --> 01:14:47,225 Joan Didion's "Slouching Towards Bethlehem." 1656 01:14:47,225 --> 01:14:51,058 He said, "If you're really serious about this 1657 01:14:51,058 --> 01:14:54,309 "and you want to be a writer, not a reviewer, 1658 01:14:54,309 --> 01:14:57,017 "not a critic, not a guy who loves music 1659 01:14:57,017 --> 01:14:59,725 "and is writing about how much he loves music, 1660 01:14:59,725 --> 01:15:01,475 "you will study Joan Didion. 1661 01:15:01,475 --> 01:15:03,891 "You will study her profile of Jim Morrison. 1662 01:15:03,891 --> 01:15:06,058 This is my copy. Take it." 1663 01:15:06,058 --> 01:15:10,267 And that was my experience with Jann Wenner. 1664 01:15:10,267 --> 01:15:11,933 Never forgot it. 1665 01:15:11,933 --> 01:15:14,225 Jann could have easily said, 1666 01:15:14,225 --> 01:15:17,808 "Run the fucking story. Who gives a shit?" 1667 01:15:17,808 --> 01:15:19,808 But he didn't. 1668 01:15:19,808 --> 01:15:23,267 He was like, "Bring him in." 1669 01:15:24,309 --> 01:15:28,017 That's a real editor and a publisher. 1670 01:15:28,017 --> 01:15:31,100 [mellow rock music] 1671 01:15:31,100 --> 01:15:38,142 ♪ ♪ 1672 01:15:52,600 --> 01:15:57,017 - I had read that your family was affluent but eccentric. 1673 01:15:57,017 --> 01:15:58,683 Would you describe them that way? 1674 01:15:58,683 --> 01:16:00,766 - My father was a businessman, you know, 1675 01:16:00,766 --> 01:16:03,434 entrepreneur, started his own business with my mother. 1676 01:16:03,434 --> 01:16:05,183 My mother left that business. 1677 01:16:05,183 --> 01:16:07,183 She became a writer, and she wrote several books. 1678 01:16:07,183 --> 01:16:09,559 I suppose you could call that sort of eccentric at the time. 1679 01:16:09,559 --> 01:16:11,475 But, you know, not terribly. 1680 01:16:11,475 --> 01:16:13,850 - Do you remember having heroes as a child? 1681 01:16:13,850 --> 01:16:15,559 - My parents were heavily involved 1682 01:16:15,559 --> 01:16:18,309 in Democratic politics, and soon thereafter my heroes 1683 01:16:18,309 --> 01:16:19,933 were people like Adlai Stevenson 1684 01:16:19,933 --> 01:16:21,309 and Estes Kefauver. 1685 01:16:21,309 --> 01:16:22,933 - That's where you got your political-- 1686 01:16:22,933 --> 01:16:24,350 - Yeah, from my parents. 1687 01:16:24,350 --> 01:16:26,309 - What did you get from each parent? 1688 01:16:26,309 --> 01:16:27,975 - I guess I got my-- 1689 01:16:27,975 --> 01:16:30,975 some of my business ability from my father. 1690 01:16:30,975 --> 01:16:33,641 And my mother taught me actually how to edit 1691 01:16:33,641 --> 01:16:35,350 when I was young, you know, 1692 01:16:35,350 --> 01:16:39,975 what to look for in writing and, um, you know, 1693 01:16:39,975 --> 01:16:42,641 some taste and some style and that kind of thing. 1694 01:16:43,975 --> 01:16:46,517 My mom actually got me my first job 1695 01:16:46,517 --> 01:16:48,725 at the local NBC radio station, 1696 01:16:48,725 --> 01:16:50,350 writing traffic reports. 1697 01:16:50,350 --> 01:16:52,766 I would sit in a little isolated room, 1698 01:16:52,766 --> 01:16:54,683 listening to police radios 1699 01:16:54,683 --> 01:16:57,017 about car accidents and freeway tie-ups 1700 01:16:57,017 --> 01:16:58,725 and write it up in a little summary 1701 01:16:58,725 --> 01:17:00,725 and run and hand it to the disc jockey. 1702 01:17:00,725 --> 01:17:03,517 That evolved into kind of a stringer position 1703 01:17:03,517 --> 01:17:05,475 at University of California at Berkeley campus, 1704 01:17:05,475 --> 01:17:07,267 when I was in college. 1705 01:17:07,267 --> 01:17:09,517 [Mose Allison's "I Don't Worry About a Thing" plays] 1706 01:17:09,517 --> 01:17:13,683 - ♪ You know this world's just one big trouble spot ♪ 1707 01:17:13,683 --> 01:17:17,975 ♪ 'Cause some have plenty and some have not ♪ 1708 01:17:17,975 --> 01:17:20,267 ♪ You know, I used to be trouble ♪ 1709 01:17:20,267 --> 01:17:23,183 ♪ But I finally saw the light ♪ 1710 01:17:23,183 --> 01:17:26,392 ♪ ♪ 1711 01:17:26,392 --> 01:17:28,641 ♪ Now I don't worry about a thing ♪ 1712 01:17:28,641 --> 01:17:33,725 ♪ 'Cause I know nothing's going to be all right ♪ 1713 01:17:33,725 --> 01:17:36,641 - I came to Berkeley in '63, 1714 01:17:36,641 --> 01:17:39,058 in the fall of '63, 1715 01:17:39,058 --> 01:17:43,891 and met Jann early in '64. 1716 01:17:43,891 --> 01:17:47,517 I went up to Jann's apartment in the hills, 1717 01:17:47,517 --> 01:17:50,766 and, you know, this was a real experience for me. 1718 01:17:50,766 --> 01:17:52,850 I hadn't met anybody who had 1719 01:17:52,850 --> 01:17:55,183 their own apartment as a freshman. 1720 01:17:55,183 --> 01:17:58,392 That was very unusual. 1721 01:17:58,392 --> 01:18:02,183 And he had a Mose Allison record playing, 1722 01:18:02,183 --> 01:18:04,559 which was, you know, super hip, 1723 01:18:04,559 --> 01:18:07,434 and he had the "Chronicle" 1724 01:18:07,434 --> 01:18:10,975 double-page spread of all the debutantes. 1725 01:18:10,975 --> 01:18:12,808 ♪ ♪ 1726 01:18:12,808 --> 01:18:14,933 I had also never encountered anybody 1727 01:18:14,933 --> 01:18:17,142 who was in part of that world, 1728 01:18:17,142 --> 01:18:19,183 and I was a little taken aback 1729 01:18:19,183 --> 01:18:22,600 by the combination of the hipster 1730 01:18:22,600 --> 01:18:25,559 and the society wannabe. 1731 01:18:25,559 --> 01:18:27,350 But I liked him. 1732 01:18:27,350 --> 01:18:29,641 I mean, he was just full of personality. 1733 01:18:29,641 --> 01:18:31,267 - ♪ Things will get worse ♪ 1734 01:18:31,267 --> 01:18:33,267 ♪ Before they get any better ♪ 1735 01:18:33,267 --> 01:18:35,600 - The free speech movement was my sophomore year 1736 01:18:35,600 --> 01:18:37,559 and Jann's sophomore year. 1737 01:18:37,559 --> 01:18:39,600 - I've got the light of freedom! 1738 01:18:39,600 --> 01:18:43,017 - I had been a part of campus radical community. 1739 01:18:43,017 --> 01:18:45,350 I mean, I had joined an organization 1740 01:18:45,350 --> 01:18:47,766 which sponsored campus demonstrations. 1741 01:18:47,766 --> 01:18:49,100 [cheering] 1742 01:18:49,100 --> 01:18:53,600 - We're asking that there be no-- 1743 01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:56,475 no restrictions on the content of speech, 1744 01:18:56,475 --> 01:18:59,641 save those provided by the courts, 1745 01:18:59,641 --> 01:19:02,808 and that's--that's an enormous amount of freedom. 1746 01:19:02,808 --> 01:19:04,392 [cheering] 1747 01:19:04,392 --> 01:19:07,725 - The university banned advocacy on campus, 1748 01:19:07,725 --> 01:19:10,975 and immediately as that was happening, 1749 01:19:10,975 --> 01:19:13,309 a student strike was being organized 1750 01:19:13,309 --> 01:19:14,975 to shut the campus down. 1751 01:19:14,975 --> 01:19:16,766 And the campus was shut down. 1752 01:19:16,766 --> 01:19:19,183 There essentially were no classes taking place, 1753 01:19:19,183 --> 01:19:23,058 and many professors were refusing to teach. 1754 01:19:23,058 --> 01:19:25,933 The university, it just floundered. 1755 01:19:25,933 --> 01:19:28,725 They didn't know what the hell to do. 1756 01:19:28,725 --> 01:19:31,017 - The departmental chairmen believe that the acts 1757 01:19:31,017 --> 01:19:33,225 of civil disobedience on December 2nd and 3rd 1758 01:19:33,225 --> 01:19:36,350 were unwarranted and that they obstruct rational 1759 01:19:36,350 --> 01:19:38,683 and fair consideration. 1760 01:19:38,683 --> 01:19:42,517 [cheers and applause] 1761 01:19:42,517 --> 01:19:44,725 - Mario Savio was standing at the side 1762 01:19:44,725 --> 01:19:48,267 of the stage with some papers in his hand. 1763 01:19:48,267 --> 01:19:51,517 And suddenly, you know, snapped out of it. 1764 01:19:51,517 --> 01:19:54,392 I think, "Oh, my God. What's he doing there?" 1765 01:19:54,392 --> 01:19:57,641 And so he walks very deliberately 1766 01:19:57,641 --> 01:19:59,309 toward the podium, 1767 01:19:59,309 --> 01:20:01,850 and he puts his papers down. 1768 01:20:01,850 --> 01:20:05,517 And suddenly a sheriff comes running up behind him 1769 01:20:05,517 --> 01:20:07,600 and grabs him around the neck. 1770 01:20:07,600 --> 01:20:11,267 - When the operation of the machine becomes so odious, 1771 01:20:11,267 --> 01:20:13,641 you've got to put your bodies upon the gears 1772 01:20:13,641 --> 01:20:16,517 and upon the wheels, and you've got to make it stop. 1773 01:20:16,517 --> 01:20:18,017 [crowd screaming] 1774 01:20:18,017 --> 01:20:19,766 - The shout that went up from the crowd, 1775 01:20:19,766 --> 01:20:21,891 and the shock of that moment 1776 01:20:21,891 --> 01:20:24,808 is one of the formative experiences 1777 01:20:24,808 --> 01:20:28,183 of my life and I'm sure Jann's. 1778 01:20:28,183 --> 01:20:31,225 But he's also a reporter at that event. 1779 01:20:31,225 --> 01:20:33,017 He's got to file a story, 1780 01:20:33,017 --> 01:20:37,641 and lo and behold, there's a great story. 1781 01:20:37,641 --> 01:20:39,808 - When this free speech movement starts, 1782 01:20:39,808 --> 01:20:42,309 all of a sudden, I found myself kind of 1783 01:20:42,309 --> 01:20:44,641 really dealing both sides of it, you know. 1784 01:20:44,641 --> 01:20:47,766 I'm carrying information to the protest leaders, 1785 01:20:47,766 --> 01:20:50,309 then running outside and doing the coverage. 1786 01:20:50,309 --> 01:20:51,975 - Please listen! 1787 01:20:51,975 --> 01:20:54,142 - We saw no contradiction in that era 1788 01:20:54,142 --> 01:20:56,517 to be a journalist and an activist. 1789 01:20:56,517 --> 01:20:59,559 All the leading campuses saw a transformation 1790 01:20:59,559 --> 01:21:02,933 of the student body into large groups of activists. 1791 01:21:02,933 --> 01:21:05,891 And around the edges of our protests, 1792 01:21:05,891 --> 01:21:07,766 violence started breaking out. 1793 01:21:07,766 --> 01:21:11,183 These were smaller groups of extreme activists 1794 01:21:11,183 --> 01:21:15,058 who wanted to foment violence by throwing bottles, 1795 01:21:15,058 --> 01:21:19,183 breaking windows, getting the police agitated 1796 01:21:19,183 --> 01:21:22,142 so they would beat up the protesters. 1797 01:21:22,142 --> 01:21:24,600 [crowd shouting] 1798 01:21:24,600 --> 01:21:26,434 And the Civil Rights Movement 1799 01:21:26,434 --> 01:21:29,475 had morphed into the Black Power Movement, 1800 01:21:29,475 --> 01:21:31,475 and you had the Black Panthers. 1801 01:21:31,475 --> 01:21:33,891 Here was a group that stood up to the cops, 1802 01:21:33,891 --> 01:21:36,808 carried guns, monitored traffic stops. 1803 01:21:36,808 --> 01:21:39,766 This inspired my generation 1804 01:21:39,766 --> 01:21:42,641 that was becoming increasingly revolutionary in nature. 1805 01:21:42,641 --> 01:21:44,225 men: Off the pigs! 1806 01:21:44,225 --> 01:21:45,808 women: ♪ Revolution has come ♪ 1807 01:21:45,808 --> 01:21:47,142 men: Freedom now! 1808 01:21:47,142 --> 01:21:48,975 - So you had all these forces 1809 01:21:48,975 --> 01:21:51,225 sort of coursing through society. 1810 01:21:51,225 --> 01:21:55,559 You had factions breaking off this way and that way. 1811 01:21:55,559 --> 01:21:58,142 And the organizations that were holding together 1812 01:21:58,142 --> 01:22:01,641 the protest movements started to fall apart. 1813 01:22:01,641 --> 01:22:04,017 And by the time you got to 1974 1814 01:22:04,017 --> 01:22:06,183 when Patty Hearst was kidnapped, 1815 01:22:06,183 --> 01:22:08,641 a great paranoia set in. 1816 01:22:11,475 --> 01:22:13,600 - Patty Hearst and Steve Weed were home 1817 01:22:13,600 --> 01:22:15,725 in their Berkeley apartment on the foggy night 1818 01:22:15,725 --> 01:22:18,641 of February 4, 1974. 1819 01:22:18,641 --> 01:22:20,641 The young couple lived together in something 1820 01:22:20,641 --> 01:22:22,183 that used to be called "sin" 1821 01:22:22,183 --> 01:22:24,641 and smoked an occasional joint. 1822 01:22:24,641 --> 01:22:27,725 Donald DeFreeze, Willie Wolf, and Nancy Ling Perry 1823 01:22:27,725 --> 01:22:30,808 moved silently to apartment number four. 1824 01:22:30,808 --> 01:22:34,017 They burst in, brandishing guns, grabbed Patty, 1825 01:22:34,017 --> 01:22:38,683 and carried her kicking and screaming to the waiting car. 1826 01:22:38,683 --> 01:22:41,475 They shoved her into the trunk. 1827 01:22:41,475 --> 01:22:43,517 Patty was scared and half naked, 1828 01:22:43,517 --> 01:22:47,142 but she stared hard-eyed at her kidnappers. 1829 01:22:47,142 --> 01:22:50,559 - Greetings, fellow comrades, brothers, and sisters. 1830 01:22:50,559 --> 01:22:52,350 My name is Cinque. 1831 01:22:52,350 --> 01:22:53,891 I am a black man 1832 01:22:53,891 --> 01:22:56,683 and a representative of black people. 1833 01:22:56,683 --> 01:22:59,017 - To some, Cinque was an unimpressive thug 1834 01:22:59,017 --> 01:23:01,725 who had once robbed a prostitute of $10. 1835 01:23:01,725 --> 01:23:04,600 - I hold the rank of General Field Marshal 1836 01:23:04,600 --> 01:23:06,641 in the United Federated Forces 1837 01:23:06,641 --> 01:23:08,891 of the Symbionese Liberation Army. 1838 01:23:08,891 --> 01:23:12,350 Our unified purpose is to liberate the oppressed peoples 1839 01:23:12,350 --> 01:23:14,267 of this nation. 1840 01:23:14,267 --> 01:23:18,434 Let the voice of their guns express the words of freedom. 1841 01:23:18,434 --> 01:23:20,891 - To the nascent Symbionese Liberation Army 1842 01:23:20,891 --> 01:23:23,725 of four white men and five white women, 1843 01:23:23,725 --> 01:23:27,058 Cinque was a charismatic prophet whose talk of killing 1844 01:23:27,058 --> 01:23:29,683 and kidnapping somehow made sense. 1845 01:23:29,683 --> 01:23:32,975 - I am ordered to convey the following message 1846 01:23:32,975 --> 01:23:34,933 in behalf of the SLA 1847 01:23:34,933 --> 01:23:38,683 that Patricia Campbell Hearst is alive and safe. 1848 01:23:38,683 --> 01:23:40,350 - Patty was kept blindfolded 1849 01:23:40,350 --> 01:23:42,142 in a stuffy closet-sized room 1850 01:23:42,142 --> 01:23:44,683 with a bare lightbulb and a portable cot. 1851 01:23:44,683 --> 01:23:46,933 There were no windows, and it was hot. 1852 01:23:46,933 --> 01:23:50,600 She lost track of time and didn't feel like eating. 1853 01:23:50,600 --> 01:23:53,142 Cinque kept up a constant intimidation. 1854 01:23:53,142 --> 01:23:54,850 He berated her and her family 1855 01:23:54,850 --> 01:23:56,683 for being part of the ruling class 1856 01:23:56,683 --> 01:23:59,017 that was sucking blood from the common people. 1857 01:23:59,017 --> 01:24:02,309 Patty was shown a long list of the Hearst family holdings: 1858 01:24:02,309 --> 01:24:04,933 nine newspapers, thirteen magazines, 1859 01:24:04,933 --> 01:24:06,850 four TV and radio stations, 1860 01:24:06,850 --> 01:24:10,683 a silver mine, a paper mill, and prime real estate. 1861 01:24:10,683 --> 01:24:12,309 - At that time, 1862 01:24:12,309 --> 01:24:15,100 the Hearst name was well known to everybody 1863 01:24:15,100 --> 01:24:18,017 because the family had a lot of money. 1864 01:24:18,017 --> 01:24:22,267 Patty Hearst's grandparent, William Randolph Hearst, 1865 01:24:22,267 --> 01:24:24,891 had started a newspaper empire. 1866 01:24:24,891 --> 01:24:27,100 Books had been written about him. 1867 01:24:27,100 --> 01:24:29,017 There's a movie based on him. 1868 01:24:29,017 --> 01:24:32,517 It's one of the most famous movies ever. 1869 01:24:32,517 --> 01:24:36,808 - I made no campaign promises, 1870 01:24:36,808 --> 01:24:39,683 because until a few weeks ago, 1871 01:24:39,683 --> 01:24:41,725 I had no hope of being elected. 1872 01:24:41,725 --> 01:24:43,225 [laughter and applause] 1873 01:24:43,225 --> 01:24:46,142 - So, when the SLA kidnapped Patty, 1874 01:24:46,142 --> 01:24:49,309 the newspaper heiress, they could not have found 1875 01:24:49,309 --> 01:24:52,309 a more dramatic person to kidnap 1876 01:24:52,309 --> 01:24:55,309 unless you kidnapped the President's daughter. 1877 01:24:55,309 --> 01:24:58,392 [indistinct chatter] 1878 01:24:58,392 --> 01:25:02,725 - Mom, Dad, I'm okay. 1879 01:25:02,725 --> 01:25:07,058 I'm with a combat unit 1880 01:25:07,058 --> 01:25:11,475 that's armed with automatic weapons. 1881 01:25:11,475 --> 01:25:14,017 They're perfectly willing to die 1882 01:25:14,017 --> 01:25:17,100 for what they are doing, 1883 01:25:17,100 --> 01:25:19,309 and... [sighs] 1884 01:25:19,309 --> 01:25:23,100 I just hope that you'll do what they say, Dad, 1885 01:25:23,100 --> 01:25:25,933 and just do it quickly. 1886 01:25:25,933 --> 01:25:31,142 I'm not being forced to say any of this. 1887 01:25:31,142 --> 01:25:32,891 - We love you, Patty. 1888 01:25:32,891 --> 01:25:37,017 I'm sorry I'm crying, but I'm happy you're safe. 1889 01:25:37,017 --> 01:25:38,725 And be strong. 1890 01:25:38,725 --> 01:25:41,017 I know God will bring you back. 1891 01:25:41,017 --> 01:25:42,891 - I believe she's safe. 1892 01:25:42,891 --> 01:25:47,058 I believe that they are taking good care of her. 1893 01:25:47,058 --> 01:25:49,600 And I believe these people are sincere. 1894 01:25:49,600 --> 01:25:51,058 [dramatic music] 1895 01:25:51,058 --> 01:25:53,017 - Patty feared Cinque. 1896 01:25:53,017 --> 01:25:55,183 He told her she'd be killed if her parents did not meet 1897 01:25:55,183 --> 01:25:57,766 the SLA's demands, and she believed him. 1898 01:25:57,766 --> 01:25:59,434 So Patty grew impatient 1899 01:25:59,434 --> 01:26:01,933 as the ransom negotiations bogged down. 1900 01:26:01,933 --> 01:26:04,975 "I felt my parents were debating how much I was worth. 1901 01:26:04,975 --> 01:26:06,891 "Like they figured I was worth 2 million 1902 01:26:06,891 --> 01:26:08,600 "but I wasn't worth 10 million. 1903 01:26:08,600 --> 01:26:10,559 "It was a horrible feeling that my parents 1904 01:26:10,559 --> 01:26:13,017 "could think of me in terms of dollars and cents. 1905 01:26:13,017 --> 01:26:16,100 I felt sick all over." 1906 01:26:16,100 --> 01:26:18,267 By degrees, her disillusionment 1907 01:26:18,267 --> 01:26:21,891 with her parents turned into sympathy for the SLA. 1908 01:26:21,891 --> 01:26:25,225 Cinque wanted her to become a comrade in arms. 1909 01:26:25,225 --> 01:26:26,808 Patty was urged to attend 1910 01:26:26,808 --> 01:26:29,225 SLA's daily political study sessions. 1911 01:26:29,225 --> 01:26:32,600 She was invited to listen to the SLA national anthem, 1912 01:26:32,600 --> 01:26:34,434 an eerie jazz composition 1913 01:26:34,434 --> 01:26:36,933 of wind and string that Cinque had selected. 1914 01:26:36,933 --> 01:26:39,933 [jazz music] 1915 01:26:39,933 --> 01:26:41,434 ♪ ♪ 1916 01:26:41,434 --> 01:26:43,350 They hugged her, called her "sister," 1917 01:26:43,350 --> 01:26:45,267 and ended her loneliness. 1918 01:26:45,267 --> 01:26:48,725 Patty's conversion was as much emotional as political. 1919 01:26:48,725 --> 01:26:50,850 Seven weeks after she was kidnapped, 1920 01:26:50,850 --> 01:26:54,058 Patty changed into Tania, an SLA soldier. 1921 01:26:55,350 --> 01:26:58,434 [suspenseful music] 1922 01:26:58,434 --> 01:27:03,017 ♪ ♪ 1923 01:27:03,017 --> 01:27:05,475 - Greetings to the people. 1924 01:27:05,475 --> 01:27:07,017 This is Tania. 1925 01:27:07,017 --> 01:27:10,267 On April 15th, my comrades and I 1926 01:27:10,267 --> 01:27:15,142 expropriated $10,660.02 1927 01:27:15,142 --> 01:27:18,183 from the Sunset branch of the Hibernia Bank. 1928 01:27:18,183 --> 01:27:20,891 Casualties could have been avoided 1929 01:27:20,891 --> 01:27:22,392 had the persons involved 1930 01:27:22,392 --> 01:27:24,267 cooperated with the people's forces 1931 01:27:24,267 --> 01:27:28,142 and kept out of the way until after our departure. 1932 01:27:28,142 --> 01:27:30,559 - The story was so widely covered. 1933 01:27:30,559 --> 01:27:32,225 It was like a circus. 1934 01:27:32,225 --> 01:27:35,142 It was O.J. Simpson before O.J. Simpson. 1935 01:27:35,142 --> 01:27:37,309 But the mainstream media never had 1936 01:27:37,309 --> 01:27:40,309 her side of the story until "Rolling Stone" 1937 01:27:40,309 --> 01:27:43,600 found a source, someone named Jack Scott. 1938 01:27:43,600 --> 01:27:46,142 - Jack was a writer, and he wanted to write 1939 01:27:46,142 --> 01:27:50,183 a book about the SLA, so he came to Berkeley 1940 01:27:50,183 --> 01:27:53,808 to talk to friends who were sympathetic to the SLA, 1941 01:27:53,808 --> 01:27:56,725 and he didn't realize quite how sympathetic they were. 1942 01:27:56,725 --> 01:27:59,891 [Bob Dylan's "Ballad of a Thin Man" plays] 1943 01:27:59,891 --> 01:28:01,225 ♪ ♪ 1944 01:28:01,225 --> 01:28:03,017 - At 2:00 the next afternoon, 1945 01:28:03,017 --> 01:28:05,475 at the corner of Telegraph and Dwight Way, 1946 01:28:05,475 --> 01:28:07,350 the door opened, and Jack walked 1947 01:28:07,350 --> 01:28:10,850 into an apartment prepared for a police invasion. 1948 01:28:10,850 --> 01:28:13,600 - ♪ You walk into the room ♪ 1949 01:28:13,600 --> 01:28:15,766 ♪ With your pencil in your hand ♪ 1950 01:28:15,766 --> 01:28:19,017 - Automatic machine guns were lined up next to the windows. 1951 01:28:19,017 --> 01:28:21,891 Grenades were stacked in strategic corners. 1952 01:28:21,891 --> 01:28:25,641 One gun was cradled by a short, unsmiling woman. 1953 01:28:25,641 --> 01:28:29,183 - ♪ But you don't understand ♪ 1954 01:28:29,183 --> 01:28:33,933 ♪ Just what you will say when you get home ♪ 1955 01:28:33,933 --> 01:28:37,058 - She was Tania, Patricia Campbell Hearst. 1956 01:28:37,058 --> 01:28:38,933 - ♪ Because something is happening here ♪ 1957 01:28:38,933 --> 01:28:42,641 ♪ But you don't know what it is ♪ 1958 01:28:42,641 --> 01:28:45,017 - "You said you were interested in the SLA. 1959 01:28:45,017 --> 01:28:47,058 "That's why we invited you here. 1960 01:28:47,058 --> 01:28:48,559 "The most important thing, 1961 01:28:48,559 --> 01:28:51,350 at this time is to help us." 1962 01:28:51,350 --> 01:28:54,475 Jack nodded. He had over $40,000. 1963 01:28:54,475 --> 01:28:57,559 The fugitives were welcome to some of that money. 1964 01:28:57,559 --> 01:28:59,100 They could not leave Berkeley 1965 01:28:59,100 --> 01:29:01,559 without the kind of money Jack had. 1966 01:29:01,559 --> 01:29:05,309 ♪ ♪ 1967 01:29:05,309 --> 01:29:07,850 Too many wanted posters had been circulated 1968 01:29:07,850 --> 01:29:09,766 to risk planes or trains. 1969 01:29:09,766 --> 01:29:12,434 They would have to split up, travel by car. 1970 01:29:12,434 --> 01:29:14,559 Jack would have to chauffeur Patty. 1971 01:29:14,559 --> 01:29:17,434 None of the other friends were willing to drive 3,000 miles 1972 01:29:17,434 --> 01:29:19,933 with the most famous fugitive in the country 1973 01:29:19,933 --> 01:29:22,933 to a wooden two-story house that stood unpretentiously 1974 01:29:22,933 --> 01:29:24,891 by a dirt road in Pennsylvania, 1975 01:29:24,891 --> 01:29:28,225 three hours west of New York City. 1976 01:29:28,225 --> 01:29:31,600 Jack and Patty made it without mishap. 1977 01:29:31,600 --> 01:29:33,766 The farmhouse, from the outside, 1978 01:29:33,766 --> 01:29:35,808 loomed tall and weathered. 1979 01:29:35,808 --> 01:29:39,017 Patty spent long hours on a grassy hammock. 1980 01:29:39,017 --> 01:29:40,933 The Pennsylvania summer seemed to relax 1981 01:29:40,933 --> 01:29:43,142 and rejuvenate the fugitives. 1982 01:29:43,142 --> 01:29:44,766 They picked wild blackberries 1983 01:29:44,766 --> 01:29:47,058 from bushes growing across the road. 1984 01:29:47,058 --> 01:29:49,225 For two months, the SLA fugitives 1985 01:29:49,225 --> 01:29:53,017 depended solely on the Schotts. 1986 01:29:53,017 --> 01:29:55,475 Both sides agreed that the fugitives should leave 1987 01:29:55,475 --> 01:29:57,641 the farmhouse by September 1st. 1988 01:29:57,641 --> 01:29:59,808 Their friends back in Berkeley might be willing 1989 01:29:59,808 --> 01:30:01,975 to risk helping them. 1990 01:30:01,975 --> 01:30:03,975 A series of calls followed. 1991 01:30:03,975 --> 01:30:07,559 Reluctantly, they explained the hitch--Patty Hearst. 1992 01:30:07,559 --> 01:30:09,641 The new team did not want the "Newsweek" cover girl 1993 01:30:09,641 --> 01:30:11,142 to be in the car when they entered 1994 01:30:11,142 --> 01:30:13,100 a cross-country automobile trip. 1995 01:30:13,100 --> 01:30:15,225 If Patty were to leave the farm, 1996 01:30:15,225 --> 01:30:18,475 it seemed Jack would have to drive the getaway car. 1997 01:30:18,475 --> 01:30:20,975 [suspenseful music] 1998 01:30:20,975 --> 01:30:23,350 Three days later, they reached Las Vegas. 1999 01:30:23,350 --> 01:30:25,808 Jack dropped Patty at a prearranged motel, 2000 01:30:25,808 --> 01:30:28,225 hugging her hard, and said good-bye. 2001 01:30:28,225 --> 01:30:31,808 The date was September 27, 1974. 2002 01:30:34,475 --> 01:30:37,559 - Patty Hearst was underground for a long time, 2003 01:30:37,559 --> 01:30:39,434 about 19 months. 2004 01:30:39,434 --> 01:30:41,434 During that time, David and I were-- 2005 01:30:41,434 --> 01:30:43,017 we were writing the story, 2006 01:30:43,017 --> 01:30:44,683 and we could not reveal that Jack Scott 2007 01:30:44,683 --> 01:30:46,933 was a primary source. 2008 01:30:46,933 --> 01:30:50,309 It's hard to describe how dangerous this was. 2009 01:30:52,017 --> 01:30:55,225 Finally, I talked to Jann, and I said, 2010 01:30:55,225 --> 01:30:57,641 "I think this is gonna blow your mind, but"... 2011 01:30:57,641 --> 01:30:59,100 [laughs] 2012 01:30:59,100 --> 01:31:01,058 "Are you willing to print a story 2013 01:31:01,058 --> 01:31:04,350 if you don't know where the information comes from?" 2014 01:31:04,350 --> 01:31:06,183 And he said, "Yes." 2015 01:31:06,183 --> 01:31:09,017 He knew we had a scoop. We all knew we had a scoop. 2016 01:31:09,017 --> 01:31:12,183 - So we got the article all ready to go. 2017 01:31:12,183 --> 01:31:15,183 - But then all of a sudden, Patty was found and arrested. 2018 01:31:15,183 --> 01:31:17,309 [indistinct shouting, cheering] 2019 01:31:17,309 --> 01:31:20,350 [gentle music] 2020 01:31:20,350 --> 01:31:22,475 ♪ ♪ 2021 01:31:22,475 --> 01:31:24,725 - She was arrested on a Friday, 2022 01:31:24,725 --> 01:31:27,309 and we held an impromptu press conference. 2023 01:31:27,309 --> 01:31:29,975 So it was me in a flannel shirt 2024 01:31:29,975 --> 01:31:32,891 basically validating our story. 2025 01:31:32,891 --> 01:31:35,225 The political content of their arguments 2026 01:31:35,225 --> 01:31:36,975 about the inequitable distribution of wealth 2027 01:31:36,975 --> 01:31:39,058 in this country and a lot of things that a lot of us 2028 01:31:39,058 --> 01:31:42,559 would agree with did make an impact on Patty Hearst... 2029 01:31:42,559 --> 01:31:44,225 - It was the Patty Hearst stories 2030 01:31:44,225 --> 01:31:46,225 that put the magazine over the top, 2031 01:31:46,225 --> 01:31:48,017 and after that, "Rolling Stone" 2032 01:31:48,017 --> 01:31:50,517 increasingly got publicity for its articles. 2033 01:31:50,517 --> 01:31:52,559 - A long investigation, involving... 2034 01:31:52,559 --> 01:31:54,225 - "Rolling Stone," you say? 2035 01:31:54,225 --> 01:31:56,142 Well, maybe everybody doesn't know. 2036 01:31:56,142 --> 01:31:59,058 "Rolling Stone" started out as the counterculture, 2037 01:31:59,058 --> 01:32:01,058 underground sort of newspaper. 2038 01:32:01,058 --> 01:32:02,975 [Earth, Wind & Fire's "Shining Star" plays] 2039 01:32:02,975 --> 01:32:05,517 Colonel McCormick must be turning over to find 2040 01:32:05,517 --> 01:32:07,309 that his dear "Chicago Tribune" 2041 01:32:07,309 --> 01:32:09,683 is carrying a story originally broken 2042 01:32:09,683 --> 01:32:10,933 in "Rolling Stone." 2043 01:32:10,933 --> 01:32:12,142 - How did you get the story? 2044 01:32:12,142 --> 01:32:13,641 Who were your sources? 2045 01:32:13,641 --> 01:32:14,975 - How do you feel about the ethics 2046 01:32:14,975 --> 01:32:16,850 of giving the SLA publicity? 2047 01:32:16,850 --> 01:32:19,725 - What exactly makes the article so controversial? 2048 01:32:19,725 --> 01:32:21,641 - ♪ You're a shining star ♪ 2049 01:32:21,641 --> 01:32:23,975 ♪ No matter who you are ♪ 2050 01:32:23,975 --> 01:32:25,975 ♪ Shining bright to see ♪ 2051 01:32:25,975 --> 01:32:29,309 ♪ What you could truly be, what you could truly be ♪ 2052 01:32:29,309 --> 01:32:31,267 - Just recently "Rolling Stone" magazine 2053 01:32:31,267 --> 01:32:34,309 put out a two-edition article. 2054 01:32:34,309 --> 01:32:36,017 - Howard Kohn, thank you very much for being with us. 2055 01:32:36,017 --> 01:32:38,434 - And would you please welcome David Weir. 2056 01:32:38,434 --> 01:32:42,142 ♪ ♪ 2057 01:32:42,142 --> 01:32:44,434 - Two years ago, the SLA announced itself 2058 01:32:44,434 --> 01:32:46,267 as a revolutionary vanguard. 2059 01:32:46,267 --> 01:32:49,267 It attempted to scare the rich and powerful, 2060 01:32:49,267 --> 01:32:53,559 but managed instead to scare the American people. 2061 01:32:53,559 --> 01:32:55,641 And history has no record of a people 2062 01:32:55,641 --> 01:32:59,475 who have been frightened into making a revolution. 2063 01:33:00,517 --> 01:33:04,100 - The SLA was, in a way, the last gasp of the '60s, 2064 01:33:04,100 --> 01:33:05,600 even though it was a weird gasp. 2065 01:33:05,600 --> 01:33:07,350 And I feel like in a way, 2066 01:33:07,350 --> 01:33:09,434 I'm a stand-in for a whole generation of people 2067 01:33:09,434 --> 01:33:13,058 who moved slowly away from the protest things. 2068 01:33:13,058 --> 01:33:14,475 We got married. 2069 01:33:14,475 --> 01:33:16,392 We had kids. We got jobs. 2070 01:33:16,392 --> 01:33:18,766 We became professionals on some level. 2071 01:33:18,766 --> 01:33:22,475 And the idealism of the generation 2072 01:33:22,475 --> 01:33:25,225 kind of melted away. 2073 01:33:25,225 --> 01:33:28,641 [car horns honking] 2074 01:33:29,766 --> 01:33:33,017 - Living in San Francisco, you had the SLA, 2075 01:33:33,017 --> 01:33:35,350 you had the Zebra Killers, 2076 01:33:35,350 --> 01:33:39,017 you had the Zodiac Killers. 2077 01:33:39,017 --> 01:33:42,850 At some point, San Francisco started to scare me. 2078 01:33:42,850 --> 01:33:44,850 I just was anxious to get back East. 2079 01:33:44,850 --> 01:33:47,517 I thought New York was where publishing was, 2080 01:33:47,517 --> 01:33:51,058 and it seemed the right time to move. 2081 01:33:51,058 --> 01:33:52,891 - When we started "Rolling Stone," 2082 01:33:52,891 --> 01:33:54,933 San Francisco was a really extremely exciting, 2083 01:33:54,933 --> 01:33:56,683 alive town. 2084 01:33:56,683 --> 01:33:59,933 Everybody now still--the same people still live here, 2085 01:33:59,933 --> 01:34:02,517 but they've grown up, you know. 2086 01:34:02,517 --> 01:34:05,058 Jerry Garcia of the Grateful Dead 2087 01:34:05,058 --> 01:34:06,600 or the Airplane or these people-- 2088 01:34:06,600 --> 01:34:09,766 they're no longer 25-year-old youngst-- 2089 01:34:09,766 --> 01:34:10,975 [laughs] How do you char-- 2090 01:34:10,975 --> 01:34:12,641 Youngsters. - Right. 2091 01:34:12,641 --> 01:34:14,683 - They're 35-year-old men, and they've got families. 2092 01:34:14,683 --> 01:34:16,309 So everybody's settled down, don't have the time 2093 01:34:16,309 --> 01:34:18,058 to run around anymore and, you know, 2094 01:34:18,058 --> 01:34:19,517 create all those scenes-- it's not like that. 2095 01:34:19,517 --> 01:34:21,225 And so it's nothing--it was-- 2096 01:34:21,225 --> 01:34:22,891 it was a natural thing to have happened, you know. 2097 01:34:22,891 --> 01:34:25,725 [Harry Nilsson's "Gotta Get Up" plays] 2098 01:34:25,725 --> 01:34:29,225 By 1977, we were expanding, 2099 01:34:29,225 --> 01:34:31,975 and New York was the only place we could do it, 2100 01:34:31,975 --> 01:34:34,641 and we were ready to go. 2101 01:34:34,641 --> 01:34:36,891 - ♪ Gotta get up, gotta get out ♪ 2102 01:34:36,891 --> 01:34:39,933 ♪ Gotta get home before the morning comes ♪ 2103 01:34:39,933 --> 01:34:42,058 ♪ What if I'm late? Got a big date ♪ 2104 01:34:42,058 --> 01:34:45,641 ♪ Gotta get home before the sun comes up ♪ 2105 01:34:45,641 --> 01:34:47,891 ♪ Up and away, got a big day ♪ 2106 01:34:47,891 --> 01:34:51,183 ♪ Sorry can't stay, I gotta run, run, yeah ♪ 2107 01:34:51,183 --> 01:34:53,017 - When I went to New York, it changed a lot. 2108 01:34:53,017 --> 01:34:54,766 A lot of the original people didn't go. 2109 01:34:54,766 --> 01:34:56,517 And it was a whole new staff, 2110 01:34:56,517 --> 01:35:00,100 and they didn't have the élan and the esprit 2111 01:35:00,100 --> 01:35:01,933 we had in San Francisco. 2112 01:35:01,933 --> 01:35:03,933 - ♪ There was a time when we could dance ♪ 2113 01:35:03,933 --> 01:35:05,766 ♪ Until a quarter to 10:00 ♪ 2114 01:35:05,766 --> 01:35:09,100 - "Rolling Stone" should be, by its existence, 2115 01:35:09,100 --> 01:35:12,309 somehow threatening to the establishment. 2116 01:35:12,309 --> 01:35:16,475 Instead, it's become the establishment in a way. 2117 01:35:16,475 --> 01:35:19,267 - ♪ We never thought we'd get older ♪ 2118 01:35:19,267 --> 01:35:23,183 ♪ We never thought we'd grow cold, but now... ♪ 2119 01:35:23,183 --> 01:35:27,017 - Jann's fundamental conundrum is that, uh, 2120 01:35:27,017 --> 01:35:30,475 his whole gestalt was based on music and the power of music, 2121 01:35:30,475 --> 01:35:33,475 that rock and roll will set you free. 2122 01:35:33,475 --> 01:35:35,517 Well, rock and roll no longer sets you free. 2123 01:35:35,517 --> 01:35:37,350 It's Muzak now. 2124 01:35:37,350 --> 01:35:39,725 Um, and it's no longer threatening. 2125 01:35:39,725 --> 01:35:41,309 It's no longer revolutionary. 2126 01:35:41,309 --> 01:35:43,225 It's just a big billion-dollar industry. 2127 01:35:43,225 --> 01:35:44,933 So, if you've attached your whole life 2128 01:35:44,933 --> 01:35:46,766 and your editorial genius to that concept 2129 01:35:46,766 --> 01:35:49,225 and all of a sudden it changes, what do you do? 2130 01:35:49,225 --> 01:35:51,725 - ♪ Hey, ho, let's go ♪ 2131 01:35:51,725 --> 01:35:54,183 ♪ Hey, ho, let's go ♪ 2132 01:35:54,183 --> 01:35:56,766 ♪ They're forming in a straight line ♪ 2133 01:35:56,766 --> 01:35:59,517 ♪ They're going through a tight wind ♪ 2134 01:35:59,517 --> 01:36:01,641 ♪ The kids are losing their minds ♪ 2135 01:36:01,641 --> 01:36:03,475 ♪ Blitzkrieg bop ♪ 2136 01:36:03,475 --> 01:36:06,392 - Hippie rock had really dominated things for so long. 2137 01:36:06,392 --> 01:36:08,392 The idea of sitting around and smoking dope 2138 01:36:08,392 --> 01:36:12,100 and nodding off just was not really appealing 2139 01:36:12,100 --> 01:36:15,559 to people who were like, you know, 15. 2140 01:36:15,559 --> 01:36:18,142 They don't want to do that. "My dad does that." 2141 01:36:18,142 --> 01:36:20,058 You just were yearning for something 2142 01:36:20,058 --> 01:36:23,600 to come along and blow that away, and punk rock did. 2143 01:36:23,600 --> 01:36:25,725 - ♪ Hey, ho, let's go ♪ 2144 01:36:25,725 --> 01:36:28,517 ♪ Hey, ho, let's go ♪ 2145 01:36:28,517 --> 01:36:30,100 - You could trace it back 2146 01:36:30,100 --> 01:36:31,975 to Iggy and the Stooges in Detroit. 2147 01:36:31,975 --> 01:36:34,225 You could trace it back to Elvis Presley. 2148 01:36:34,225 --> 01:36:36,517 You could trace it back as far as you want, uh, 2149 01:36:36,517 --> 01:36:38,517 but, you know, the clothing 2150 01:36:38,517 --> 01:36:42,225 and the loud, fast guitars-- that started in New York. 2151 01:36:42,225 --> 01:36:44,058 And it started at CBGB. 2152 01:36:44,058 --> 01:36:47,100 [punk rock music] 2153 01:36:47,100 --> 01:36:48,559 ♪ ♪ 2154 01:36:48,559 --> 01:36:50,183 - First time I saw the Ramones 2155 01:36:50,183 --> 01:36:53,392 was in the summer of 1975. 2156 01:36:53,392 --> 01:36:56,891 It was like nothing I'd--I'd heard. 2157 01:36:56,891 --> 01:37:00,058 Everything you heard on the radio was either disco 2158 01:37:00,058 --> 01:37:03,891 or Linda Ronstadt, Eagles, soft rock axis, 2159 01:37:03,891 --> 01:37:07,309 that after a while just got to be boring. 2160 01:37:07,309 --> 01:37:10,683 And the Ramones went out there, and they blew me away. 2161 01:37:10,683 --> 01:37:12,850 And I stayed around for two sets 2162 01:37:12,850 --> 01:37:14,808 until about 3:00 in the morning with this girl 2163 01:37:14,808 --> 01:37:16,891 who didn't want to stick around for any of it at all, 2164 01:37:16,891 --> 01:37:19,225 but she was afraid to go home alone, 2165 01:37:19,225 --> 01:37:21,725 so we stayed for the whole thing. 2166 01:37:21,725 --> 01:37:24,017 ♪ ♪ 2167 01:37:24,017 --> 01:37:26,017 - I met Chuck when we moved to New York. 2168 01:37:26,017 --> 01:37:29,434 He never was part of the West Coast operation. 2169 01:37:29,434 --> 01:37:32,017 And I don't know. We just hit it off. 2170 01:37:32,017 --> 01:37:33,891 He was ten years younger than me, 2171 01:37:33,891 --> 01:37:38,017 and he just had his finger on what was happening. 2172 01:37:38,017 --> 01:37:40,766 He introduced me to CBGB's and punk music. 2173 01:37:40,766 --> 01:37:42,850 - Okay, what we've got-- okay, there's two pages 2174 01:37:42,850 --> 01:37:45,267 scheduled for--it's gonna be about 4,000 words. 2175 01:37:45,267 --> 01:37:48,475 - One time we were having an editorial meeting. 2176 01:37:48,475 --> 01:37:50,766 We were talking about serious stuff 2177 01:37:50,766 --> 01:37:54,225 and, you know, editorial shit. 2178 01:37:54,225 --> 01:37:56,267 All of a sudden, the door breaks open, 2179 01:37:56,267 --> 01:37:59,600 and it's Chuck, but he came out with this weird hair, 2180 01:37:59,600 --> 01:38:01,475 and he looked entirely different, 2181 01:38:01,475 --> 01:38:03,350 and he had a boom box, 2182 01:38:03,350 --> 01:38:07,434 which he put down and he just started miming this song. 2183 01:38:07,434 --> 01:38:10,766 - ♪ I got no reason, it's all too much ♪ 2184 01:38:10,766 --> 01:38:13,017 ♪ You'll always find us ♪ 2185 01:38:13,017 --> 01:38:15,392 - It was the first time I heard the Sex Pistols. 2186 01:38:15,392 --> 01:38:17,600 - ♪ Out to lunch ♪ 2187 01:38:17,600 --> 01:38:19,350 ♪ ♪ 2188 01:38:19,350 --> 01:38:23,975 ♪ Oh, we're so pretty, oh, so pretty ♪ 2189 01:38:23,975 --> 01:38:26,434 ♪ We're vacant, oh, we're so pretty ♪ 2190 01:38:26,434 --> 01:38:28,600 - It wasn't just the fact that Chuck was young 2191 01:38:28,600 --> 01:38:32,517 and outrageous and disruptive and the music was, too. 2192 01:38:32,517 --> 01:38:36,517 He saw that this was valid musically. 2193 01:38:36,517 --> 01:38:38,725 - Chuck Young's cover story on the Sex Pistols 2194 01:38:38,725 --> 01:38:41,975 I think, was an experiment that Jann sort of 2195 01:38:41,975 --> 01:38:43,683 allowed to go forward. 2196 01:38:43,683 --> 01:38:46,808 I don't think he saw much future in this. 2197 01:38:46,808 --> 01:38:48,600 [indistinct chatter] 2198 01:38:48,600 --> 01:38:50,309 - A little before midnight, 2199 01:38:50,309 --> 01:38:54,100 my taxi arrives at a club called the Vortex. 2200 01:38:54,100 --> 01:38:57,434 - ♪ Is this the MPLA? ♪ 2201 01:38:57,434 --> 01:39:01,100 ♪ Or is this the UDA? ♪ 2202 01:39:01,100 --> 01:39:04,808 ♪ Or is this the IRA? ♪ 2203 01:39:04,808 --> 01:39:08,683 ♪ I thought it was the U.K. ♪ 2204 01:39:08,683 --> 01:39:10,559 - The dense crowd inside consists 2205 01:39:10,559 --> 01:39:14,267 of cadaverous teenagers dressed in black or gray. 2206 01:39:14,267 --> 01:39:16,933 Johnny Rotten, blessed with a demented anger 2207 01:39:16,933 --> 01:39:19,392 unseen outside a war zone, declared himself 2208 01:39:19,392 --> 01:39:22,725 an Antichrist who wanted to destroy everything. 2209 01:39:22,725 --> 01:39:24,267 The BBC was not amused 2210 01:39:24,267 --> 01:39:26,891 and gave the Sex Pistols no airplay. 2211 01:39:26,891 --> 01:39:28,683 - ♪ I want to be ♪ 2212 01:39:28,683 --> 01:39:31,808 ♪ Anarchy ♪ 2213 01:39:51,350 --> 01:39:53,142 ♪ Anarchy ♪ 2214 01:39:53,142 --> 01:39:59,350 ♪ 'Cause I want to be ♪ 2215 01:39:59,350 --> 01:40:02,058 ♪ Anarchy ♪ 2216 01:40:02,058 --> 01:40:04,933 - When you stood up and started singing 2217 01:40:04,933 --> 01:40:08,183 for the first time, what happened? 2218 01:40:08,183 --> 01:40:10,559 - Go on, John. Go on. - It was wonderful. 2219 01:40:10,559 --> 01:40:12,017 - No, come on. 2220 01:40:12,017 --> 01:40:14,559 - People loved me. They threw flowers. 2221 01:40:14,559 --> 01:40:16,559 - What do you think about bands like the Stones? 2222 01:40:16,559 --> 01:40:20,058 - I don't. - [chuckles] 2223 01:40:20,058 --> 01:40:21,725 - I don't even consider them a band. 2224 01:40:21,725 --> 01:40:23,600 They're more like a business. 2225 01:40:23,600 --> 01:40:26,183 - Do you think they're relevant to the kids, 16, 17? 2226 01:40:26,183 --> 01:40:28,641 - Of course they're not. 2227 01:40:28,641 --> 01:40:31,933 Relevant to their mums and dads, but that's about all. 2228 01:40:31,933 --> 01:40:34,100 - What about bands like Rod Stewart? 2229 01:40:34,100 --> 01:40:35,975 - What about him? - Mums and dads. 2230 01:40:35,975 --> 01:40:38,475 - He's all-around, isn't he? All-around entertainment. 2231 01:40:38,475 --> 01:40:39,850 - He's an old [bleep]. 2232 01:40:39,850 --> 01:40:41,641 - ♪ Hear me ♪ 2233 01:40:41,641 --> 01:40:45,434 - ♪ Through the dark night ♪ 2234 01:40:45,434 --> 01:40:48,766 ♪ Far away ♪ 2235 01:40:48,766 --> 01:40:51,766 - The Sex Pistols chose not the politics of boredom, 2236 01:40:51,766 --> 01:40:53,559 but the politics of division. 2237 01:40:53,559 --> 01:40:56,017 Amputate the wanking '60s liberals 2238 01:40:56,017 --> 01:40:58,100 from their working-class support. 2239 01:40:58,100 --> 01:41:00,309 "The kids needed a sense of adventure, 2240 01:41:00,309 --> 01:41:02,142 "and rock and roll needs to find a way 2241 01:41:02,142 --> 01:41:04,267 to give it to them," says Malcolm McLaren, 2242 01:41:04,267 --> 01:41:06,891 the manager of the Sex Pistols. 2243 01:41:06,891 --> 01:41:11,017 - It didn't take much to set something up 2244 01:41:11,017 --> 01:41:14,183 opposite everything the industry 2245 01:41:14,183 --> 01:41:16,183 had recognized as good, 2246 01:41:16,183 --> 01:41:20,600 which meant all this incredible corporate thinking, 2247 01:41:20,600 --> 01:41:24,183 all this legacy of pop music 2248 01:41:24,183 --> 01:41:27,392 was suddenly having a huge stake 2249 01:41:27,392 --> 01:41:30,183 driven through its heart by the Sex Pistols, 2250 01:41:30,183 --> 01:41:34,058 and they had legions of followers wanting more. 2251 01:41:34,058 --> 01:41:41,142 ♪ ♪ 2252 01:41:47,350 --> 01:41:49,933 See, this group was put together 2253 01:41:49,933 --> 01:41:52,808 not because they were friends. 2254 01:41:52,808 --> 01:41:56,850 They didn't really, genuinely have anything in common 2255 01:41:56,850 --> 01:42:01,225 other than the fact that they hated everything else. 2256 01:42:01,225 --> 01:42:02,850 [cheers and applause] 2257 01:42:02,850 --> 01:42:04,434 - We aren't nice boys. 2258 01:42:04,434 --> 01:42:07,392 We were fucking nasty little bastards. 2259 01:42:09,350 --> 01:42:11,559 And we still are. 2260 01:42:11,559 --> 01:42:14,142 - Sid Vicious is about as close as rock and roll 2261 01:42:14,142 --> 01:42:15,766 is going to come to Huckleberry Finn 2262 01:42:15,766 --> 01:42:17,559 in this decade. 2263 01:42:17,559 --> 01:42:20,142 His voice has a tone of goofy absurdity. 2264 01:42:20,142 --> 01:42:21,850 - Here, want one of these? 2265 01:42:21,850 --> 01:42:23,350 - Something like Ringo Starr's, 2266 01:42:23,350 --> 01:42:24,600 though he'd hate that analogy. 2267 01:42:24,600 --> 01:42:26,183 - Who else wants something? 2268 01:42:26,183 --> 01:42:28,808 Come on if you want something, you cunts. 2269 01:42:28,808 --> 01:42:32,475 - His teeth appear not to have been brushed in several years, 2270 01:42:32,475 --> 01:42:34,225 his hair is about two inches long 2271 01:42:34,225 --> 01:42:36,225 and sticks straight out at odd angles. 2272 01:42:36,225 --> 01:42:40,058 Several bright red scars highlight his solar plexus. 2273 01:42:40,058 --> 01:42:41,725 - All I did was cash in on the fact 2274 01:42:41,725 --> 01:42:44,309 that I'm good-looking and I have a good figure 2275 01:42:44,309 --> 01:42:46,183 and girls like me. 2276 01:42:46,183 --> 01:42:50,183 If they want a fucking angel in flairs and an anorak-- 2277 01:42:50,183 --> 01:42:52,267 'cause if they want that, 2278 01:42:52,267 --> 01:42:55,766 that ain't me, baby. 2279 01:42:55,766 --> 01:42:58,142 - This summer the Pistols have been careening 2280 01:42:58,142 --> 01:43:00,559 in overexposure in their homeland. 2281 01:43:00,559 --> 01:43:02,808 The four major music weeklies have mentioned them 2282 01:43:02,808 --> 01:43:05,392 on the cover of almost every issue for months. 2283 01:43:05,392 --> 01:43:07,891 Taking punk lyrics at their literal word, 2284 01:43:07,891 --> 01:43:09,850 the dailies regularly proclaim 2285 01:43:09,850 --> 01:43:13,100 the movement as the end of Western civilization. 2286 01:43:13,100 --> 01:43:14,933 - And, okay, you want to get your music across, 2287 01:43:14,933 --> 01:43:17,517 but do you feel maybe the fact that you can't do 2288 01:43:17,517 --> 01:43:19,850 that commercially is because of the way that you behave? 2289 01:43:19,850 --> 01:43:21,517 - [belches] 2290 01:43:21,517 --> 01:43:23,267 - Since they are banned everywhere, 2291 01:43:23,267 --> 01:43:25,600 they will be playing under assumed names. 2292 01:43:25,600 --> 01:43:27,850 Tonight they're going to be The SPOTS, 2293 01:43:27,850 --> 01:43:32,142 an acronym for the Sex Pistols on Tour Secretly. 2294 01:43:32,142 --> 01:43:33,725 The club is in the middle of a tough, 2295 01:43:33,725 --> 01:43:35,350 working-class neighborhood. 2296 01:43:35,350 --> 01:43:37,434 Inside it is already packed with people 2297 01:43:37,434 --> 01:43:39,850 in their late teens and early 20s. 2298 01:43:39,850 --> 01:43:41,808 - [yells] 2299 01:43:41,808 --> 01:43:44,933 [aggressive punk music playing] 2300 01:43:44,933 --> 01:43:51,850 ♪ ♪ 2301 01:43:51,850 --> 01:43:54,600 [singing indistinctly] 2302 01:43:54,600 --> 01:43:59,058 ♪ ♪ 2303 01:43:59,058 --> 01:44:00,933 - The crush around the foot-high stage 2304 01:44:00,933 --> 01:44:02,808 is literally unbelievable, and skirmishes 2305 01:44:02,808 --> 01:44:05,142 with the security men immediately erupt. 2306 01:44:05,142 --> 01:44:07,808 Some kid has put his fist through one of the speakers 2307 01:44:07,808 --> 01:44:09,600 and a few more stomp on wires 2308 01:44:09,600 --> 01:44:11,600 and knock over electronic equipment. 2309 01:44:11,600 --> 01:44:13,766 The ten-foot stacks of PA speakers are rocking 2310 01:44:13,766 --> 01:44:15,600 back and forth and are dangerously close 2311 01:44:15,600 --> 01:44:17,100 to toppling over. 2312 01:44:17,100 --> 01:44:19,434 - [yelling] [microphone feedback whines] 2313 01:44:19,434 --> 01:44:21,142 - I don't like it. 2314 01:44:21,142 --> 01:44:22,600 I didn't like it then, 2315 01:44:22,600 --> 01:44:24,475 and I don't particularly care for it now. 2316 01:44:24,475 --> 01:44:26,891 So, you know, I took a little persuading. 2317 01:44:26,891 --> 01:44:28,517 If there's something you don't like, 2318 01:44:28,517 --> 01:44:30,392 you still have to be open to it, 2319 01:44:30,392 --> 01:44:32,725 and you wait till a constituency 2320 01:44:32,725 --> 01:44:34,891 within the office kind of builds towards it, 2321 01:44:34,891 --> 01:44:36,766 and all of a sudden, you got three or four people 2322 01:44:36,766 --> 01:44:39,434 you respect, like Chuck, saying, "We got to do it." 2323 01:44:39,434 --> 01:44:43,350 You know, and so you say, "Do it." 2324 01:44:43,350 --> 01:44:45,142 - This is a great story about Chuck Young, 2325 01:44:45,142 --> 01:44:47,058 who's just a silly, crazy guy. 2326 01:44:47,058 --> 01:44:49,100 We were going to do the Sex Pistols. 2327 01:44:49,100 --> 01:44:52,517 They were playing in Texas, and we got to the airport, 2328 01:44:52,517 --> 01:44:54,808 and our plane wasn't gonna fly. 2329 01:44:54,808 --> 01:44:57,183 So Chuck said, "Let's drive." 2330 01:44:57,183 --> 01:45:00,017 So we drove to Texas. 2331 01:45:00,017 --> 01:45:02,392 - From New York? - From New York. 2332 01:45:02,392 --> 01:45:03,975 - Oh, my God. Wow! 2333 01:45:03,975 --> 01:45:06,183 - And we got there just-- And we're the crazy-- 2334 01:45:06,183 --> 01:45:07,891 We got there just in time. 2335 01:45:07,891 --> 01:45:10,559 They were putting the-- You know, we drove all night. 2336 01:45:10,559 --> 01:45:13,100 And this--you know, they're just putting the sign up 2337 01:45:13,100 --> 01:45:16,183 on this really-- this dive, you know, 2338 01:45:16,183 --> 01:45:18,766 where the Sex Pistols played. 2339 01:45:18,766 --> 01:45:21,183 That's a real "Rolling Stone" story. 2340 01:45:21,183 --> 01:45:23,891 Chuck Young, "Okay, let's just--let's just drive." 2341 01:45:23,891 --> 01:45:26,850 [laughing] So... 2342 01:45:26,850 --> 01:45:29,600 Anyway... 2343 01:45:29,600 --> 01:45:30,891 Jann... 2344 01:45:30,891 --> 01:45:32,517 uh, you know that you 2345 01:45:32,517 --> 01:45:35,017 took that photograph and ran it 2346 01:45:35,017 --> 01:45:36,766 on the cover with no type. 2347 01:45:36,766 --> 01:45:40,683 I mean, it, um-- it said it all. 2348 01:45:40,683 --> 01:45:45,766 You know, you--you-- you--you just-- 2349 01:45:45,766 --> 01:45:48,309 You know... 2350 01:45:48,309 --> 01:45:51,808 - Two, three, four. 2351 01:45:51,808 --> 01:45:56,225 For the other half of the sky. 2352 01:45:56,225 --> 01:45:58,725 ♪ Woman ♪ 2353 01:45:58,725 --> 01:46:02,766 ♪ I can hardly express ♪ 2354 01:46:02,766 --> 01:46:04,766 ♪ My mixed emotions ♪ 2355 01:46:04,766 --> 01:46:08,766 ♪ At my thoughtlessness ♪ 2356 01:46:08,766 --> 01:46:14,100 ♪ After all, I'm forever in your debt ♪ 2357 01:46:14,100 --> 01:46:15,933 ♪ And, woman ♪ 2358 01:46:15,933 --> 01:46:18,725 - They had just finished their "Double Fantasy" album. 2359 01:46:18,725 --> 01:46:20,350 I remember seeing the cover 2360 01:46:20,350 --> 01:46:23,766 and being very, uh, moved by it... 2361 01:46:23,766 --> 01:46:25,517 because this was 1980. 2362 01:46:25,517 --> 01:46:27,933 Romance was not exactly number one on-- 2363 01:46:27,933 --> 01:46:29,683 [chuckles] On anyone's list. 2364 01:46:29,683 --> 01:46:33,267 And--and I was very moved by seeing them kiss on that-- 2365 01:46:33,267 --> 01:46:35,142 on their album cover, and I thought, 2366 01:46:35,142 --> 01:46:38,975 "How simple, you know, how beautiful, you know." 2367 01:46:38,975 --> 01:46:43,475 And I wanted to try something of them, um, 2368 01:46:43,475 --> 01:46:45,600 of John and Yoko embracing. 2369 01:46:45,600 --> 01:46:48,641 - [vocalizing] 2370 01:46:48,641 --> 01:46:54,641 ♪ ♪ 2371 01:46:54,641 --> 01:46:56,933 ♪ Well, well ♪ 2372 01:46:56,933 --> 01:47:01,309 [vocalizing] 2373 01:47:01,309 --> 01:47:03,142 ♪ Woman ♪ 2374 01:47:03,142 --> 01:47:05,350 - I remember arriving at the apartment that morning, 2375 01:47:05,350 --> 01:47:08,267 and John taking me aside and saying, 2376 01:47:08,267 --> 01:47:10,434 "Listen, you know, I know they want to run me 2377 01:47:10,434 --> 01:47:13,058 "by myself on the cover, you know, but I don't want-- 2378 01:47:13,058 --> 01:47:15,559 "I mean, I really want Yoko to be on the cover with me. 2379 01:47:15,559 --> 01:47:17,434 It's really important." 2380 01:47:17,434 --> 01:47:19,309 I said, "Well, we'll just have to do something 2381 01:47:19,309 --> 01:47:21,600 very, very strong." 2382 01:47:21,600 --> 01:47:24,850 And Yoko, you know, at the last minute did not want 2383 01:47:24,850 --> 01:47:27,017 to take her clothes off. 2384 01:47:27,017 --> 01:47:29,725 So, of course, when they lay down together and John was-- 2385 01:47:29,725 --> 01:47:34,434 John was nude, curled up, you know, against her clothed, 2386 01:47:34,434 --> 01:47:36,725 I mean, he looked much more vulnerable. 2387 01:47:36,725 --> 01:47:39,100 - ♪ Well, well ♪ 2388 01:47:39,100 --> 01:47:41,891 [vocalizing] 2389 01:47:41,891 --> 01:47:44,100 - I remember peeling the Polaroid 2390 01:47:44,100 --> 01:47:46,183 and him looking at it and saying, 2391 01:47:46,183 --> 01:47:48,350 "This is it. This is our relationship." 2392 01:47:48,350 --> 01:47:51,517 - ♪ Now and forever ♪ 2393 01:47:51,517 --> 01:47:54,891 ♪ I love ♪ 2394 01:47:54,891 --> 01:47:56,350 ♪ You ♪ 2395 01:47:56,350 --> 01:47:58,683 - I'm in love with you. [giggles] 2396 01:47:58,683 --> 01:48:02,350 - Unfortunately, I'm in love with you, too. 2397 01:48:02,350 --> 01:48:06,350 - But in the end, I think we'll agree. 2398 01:48:06,350 --> 01:48:08,850 - Fortunately, we don't know. 2399 01:48:08,850 --> 01:48:11,058 But in the end, we'll find out. 2400 01:48:12,808 --> 01:48:15,058 - That was the last picture of him. 2401 01:48:15,058 --> 01:48:19,225 Several hours later, John was murdered. 2402 01:48:19,225 --> 01:48:21,559 December 8, 1980. 2403 01:48:21,559 --> 01:48:23,683 [sirens wailing] 2404 01:48:24,891 --> 01:48:27,683 - "Man shot, 1 West 72nd," 2405 01:48:27,683 --> 01:48:32,017 was the call on the police radio just before 11:00 p.m. 2406 01:48:32,017 --> 01:48:33,725 Officers Jim Moran and Bill Gamble 2407 01:48:33,725 --> 01:48:35,267 were in the third blue-and-white 2408 01:48:35,267 --> 01:48:36,891 that screamed to a halt 2409 01:48:36,891 --> 01:48:39,475 outside the Dakota apartment building. 2410 01:48:39,475 --> 01:48:41,100 The man who had been shot 2411 01:48:41,100 --> 01:48:43,267 couldn't wait for an ambulance. 2412 01:48:43,267 --> 01:48:45,475 They stretched him out on the back seat of their car 2413 01:48:45,475 --> 01:48:47,392 and raced to Roosevelt Hospital 2414 01:48:47,392 --> 01:48:50,017 at the corner of 59th Street and 9th Avenue. 2415 01:48:50,017 --> 01:48:52,267 They lifted the bloody body onto a gurney 2416 01:48:52,267 --> 01:48:54,600 and wheeled it into the emergency room. 2417 01:48:54,600 --> 01:48:56,891 There was nothing the doctors could do. 2418 01:48:56,891 --> 01:49:01,766 They pronounced John Lennon dead at 11:07 p.m. 2419 01:49:01,766 --> 01:49:05,641 - ♪ We're afraid to be alone ♪ 2420 01:49:05,641 --> 01:49:10,100 - It's a tragedy for Yoko and her little kid. 2421 01:49:10,100 --> 01:49:11,975 What did it say about our times? 2422 01:49:11,975 --> 01:49:14,183 What did it say about music itself? 2423 01:49:14,183 --> 01:49:17,891 Was all this violence hidden within it? 2424 01:49:17,891 --> 01:49:22,267 - ♪ Just a boy and a little girl ♪ 2425 01:49:22,267 --> 01:49:26,058 ♪ Trying to change the whole wide world ♪ 2426 01:49:26,058 --> 01:49:29,225 ♪ I... ♪ 2427 01:49:29,225 --> 01:49:32,142 ♪ ..solation ♪ 2428 01:49:32,142 --> 01:49:35,475 - You know, is this-- did it have some seeds of evil? 2429 01:49:35,475 --> 01:49:39,808 Who could do such a thing? I mean, it's just a musician. 2430 01:49:39,808 --> 01:49:41,559 - You knew him personally. 2431 01:49:41,559 --> 01:49:44,392 - Yep. - What was he like? 2432 01:49:44,392 --> 01:49:46,559 - Oh, he was warm, and he was very witty, 2433 01:49:46,559 --> 01:49:50,725 very funny and very intense. 2434 01:49:50,725 --> 01:49:52,975 John and the Beatles are a part of everybody's lives, 2435 01:49:52,975 --> 01:49:55,183 and they die, and something in you dies, 2436 01:49:55,183 --> 01:49:58,142 and something about all your friends dies, 2437 01:49:58,142 --> 01:50:00,142 and something about your life is-- 2438 01:50:00,142 --> 01:50:02,392 you know, you feel gone and concerned about it, 2439 01:50:02,392 --> 01:50:05,559 and it's the gathering together of a great family. 2440 01:50:05,559 --> 01:50:08,559 - How big is that family? - Very big, very big. 2441 01:50:08,559 --> 01:50:10,517 You know, it's the biggest family. 2442 01:50:10,517 --> 01:50:12,808 It's the whole--you know, it's really the whole world. 2443 01:50:12,808 --> 01:50:14,850 [The Beatles's "A Day in the Life" plays] 2444 01:50:14,850 --> 01:50:18,933 - ♪ I read the news day, oh, boy ♪ 2445 01:50:18,933 --> 01:50:20,683 ♪ ♪ 2446 01:50:20,683 --> 01:50:25,225 ♪ About a lucky man who made the grade ♪ 2447 01:50:25,225 --> 01:50:27,267 ♪ ♪ 2448 01:50:27,267 --> 01:50:30,850 ♪ And though the news was rather sad ♪ 2449 01:50:30,850 --> 01:50:33,350 ♪ ♪ 2450 01:50:33,350 --> 01:50:37,017 ♪ Well, I just had to laugh ♪ 2451 01:50:37,017 --> 01:50:39,600 ♪ ♪ 2452 01:50:39,600 --> 01:50:43,683 ♪ I saw the photograph ♪ 2453 01:50:43,683 --> 01:50:45,766 ♪ ♪ 2454 01:50:45,766 --> 01:50:48,600 - To hear John Lennon had been murdered by a fan, 2455 01:50:48,600 --> 01:50:51,559 that he had been killed for who and what he was, 2456 01:50:51,559 --> 01:50:54,891 was like watching someone you love being hit by a car. 2457 01:50:56,434 --> 01:50:59,808 I have my own reasons for caring about John Lennon-- 2458 01:50:59,808 --> 01:51:02,100 a song or a moment in "Help!"-- 2459 01:51:02,100 --> 01:51:05,058 that may never have affected you, 2460 01:51:05,058 --> 01:51:08,600 but you have reasons that are fundamentally the same. 2461 01:51:08,600 --> 01:51:10,683 And that's why it was other people's reaction 2462 01:51:10,683 --> 01:51:12,891 to John Lennon's murder that produced in me 2463 01:51:12,891 --> 01:51:15,600 the most overwhelming despair. 2464 01:51:15,600 --> 01:51:18,559 Rock and roll works as common experience 2465 01:51:18,559 --> 01:51:20,183 and private obsession. 2466 01:51:20,183 --> 01:51:22,559 The two can't really be separated. 2467 01:51:22,559 --> 01:51:25,891 Indeed, one fuels the other. 2468 01:51:27,808 --> 01:51:31,225 - I came in, and they were mocking up covers 2469 01:51:31,225 --> 01:51:32,808 just with John. 2470 01:51:32,808 --> 01:51:34,434 You know, I had done some close-ups 2471 01:51:34,434 --> 01:51:36,392 of John's face and his head. 2472 01:51:36,392 --> 01:51:39,267 And, um, you know, I went in to see Jann, 2473 01:51:39,267 --> 01:51:42,600 and I said, "Jann, you know, I promised John 2474 01:51:42,600 --> 01:51:46,933 that the cover would be, um, him and Yoko." 2475 01:51:51,434 --> 01:51:53,559 And Jann backed me up. 2476 01:51:55,683 --> 01:52:00,100 He, you know--I said it was the last promise... 2477 01:52:00,100 --> 01:52:02,891 [softly] You know, so... 2478 01:52:04,559 --> 01:52:07,766 [John Lennon's "Grow Old With Me" plays] 2479 01:52:07,766 --> 01:52:14,850 ♪ ♪ 2480 01:52:16,100 --> 01:52:21,142 - ♪ Grow old along with me ♪ 2481 01:52:21,142 --> 01:52:22,517 ♪ ♪ 2482 01:52:22,517 --> 01:52:27,309 ♪ Our best is yet to be ♪ 2483 01:52:27,309 --> 01:52:29,808 ♪ ♪ 2484 01:52:29,808 --> 01:52:33,683 ♪ When our time has come ♪ 2485 01:52:33,683 --> 01:52:35,850 ♪ ♪ 2486 01:52:35,850 --> 01:52:39,559 ♪ We will be as one ♪ 2487 01:52:39,559 --> 01:52:41,933 ♪ ♪ 2488 01:52:41,933 --> 01:52:45,309 ♪ God bless our love ♪ 2489 01:52:45,309 --> 01:52:48,100 ♪ ♪ 2490 01:52:48,100 --> 01:52:51,183 ♪ God bless our love ♪ 2491 01:52:51,183 --> 01:52:58,350 ♪ ♪ 2492 01:53:01,517 --> 01:53:07,641 ♪ Grow old along with me ♪ 2493 01:53:07,641 --> 01:53:12,850 ♪ Two branches of one tree ♪ 2494 01:53:12,850 --> 01:53:15,142 ♪ ♪ 2495 01:53:15,142 --> 01:53:20,683 ♪ Face the setting sun ♪ 2496 01:53:20,683 --> 01:53:24,725 ♪ When the day is done ♪ 2497 01:53:24,725 --> 01:53:26,850 ♪ ♪ 2498 01:53:26,850 --> 01:53:30,517 ♪ God bless our love ♪ 2499 01:53:30,517 --> 01:53:32,891 ♪ ♪ 2500 01:53:32,891 --> 01:53:36,891 ♪ God bless our love ♪ 2501 01:53:36,891 --> 01:53:44,017 ♪ ♪ 2502 01:53:51,058 --> 01:53:55,766 ♪ Spending our lives together ♪ 2503 01:53:55,766 --> 01:53:57,434 ♪ ♪ 2504 01:53:57,434 --> 01:54:01,559 ♪ Man and wife together ♪ 2505 01:54:01,559 --> 01:54:04,517 ♪ World without end ♪ 2506 01:54:04,517 --> 01:54:07,559 ♪ World without end ♪ 2507 01:54:07,559 --> 01:54:14,683 ♪ ♪ 2508 01:54:18,475 --> 01:54:24,683 ♪ Grow old along with me ♪ 2509 01:54:24,683 --> 01:54:29,517 ♪ Whatever fate decrees ♪ 2510 01:54:29,517 --> 01:54:32,100 ♪ ♪ 2511 01:54:32,100 --> 01:54:36,267 ♪ We will see it through ♪ 2512 01:54:36,267 --> 01:54:37,933 ♪ ♪ 2513 01:54:37,933 --> 01:54:43,683 ♪ For our love is true ♪ 2514 01:54:43,683 --> 01:54:47,142 [song fading] ♪ God bless our love ♪ 2515 01:55:02,434 --> 01:55:04,517 [bright tone] 181521

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