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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,369 --> 00:00:04,070 Something is going on in nerve center. 2 00:00:04,170 --> 00:00:07,138 In the most extreme cases, heart attack. 3 00:00:07,239 --> 00:00:09,041 Is it true that they can't find his head? 4 00:00:18,918 --> 00:00:21,119 Since I was a young boy, 5 00:00:21,220 --> 00:00:23,488 I've been collecting haunted artifacts, 6 00:00:23,589 --> 00:00:27,293 drawn to the dark and mysterious energy they carry. 7 00:00:27,393 --> 00:00:29,262 The Manson murders will go down as one of 8 00:00:29,362 --> 00:00:31,531 the most heinous crimes of all time. 9 00:00:31,631 --> 00:00:34,900 Through my career as a paranormal investigator, 10 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:37,303 I've been able to build my collection. 11 00:00:37,403 --> 00:00:39,672 Now, I'm building a museum. 12 00:00:39,772 --> 00:00:41,807 The Conjure Chest is one of the deadliest 13 00:00:41,908 --> 00:00:43,409 haunted artifacts in existence. 14 00:00:43,509 --> 00:00:45,678 Robert the Doll has affected thousands of people. 15 00:00:45,778 --> 00:00:48,614 And providing a place for people to bring 16 00:00:48,715 --> 00:00:51,651 their haunted items and hear their stories. 17 00:00:51,751 --> 00:00:54,187 We aid people into coming into the world. 18 00:00:54,287 --> 00:00:56,388 Why can't we aid them in exiting it? 19 00:00:57,656 --> 00:01:01,061 These are my deadly possessions. 20 00:01:06,566 --> 00:01:08,401 My name's Jayne Harris from Stourbridge, England. 21 00:01:12,839 --> 00:01:15,341 I'm currently the owner of a doll named Peggy. 22 00:01:17,978 --> 00:01:20,979 It all started when I posted a photo of her online 23 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:23,950 and received hundreds of responses from people 24 00:01:24,050 --> 00:01:27,119 all over the world who were experiencing 25 00:01:27,220 --> 00:01:30,256 serious, potentially fatal health issues 26 00:01:30,356 --> 00:01:31,991 as a result of seeing her. 27 00:01:34,161 --> 00:01:36,697 At this point, we're really not sure what to do next. 28 00:01:38,564 --> 00:01:40,532 And I would welcome Zak's help. 29 00:01:46,238 --> 00:01:49,375 Why does the doll have a sack on its head? 30 00:01:50,910 --> 00:01:52,777 Honestly, she... 31 00:01:52,878 --> 00:01:54,881 hasn't been around many people, 32 00:01:54,981 --> 00:01:56,783 and when she has, 33 00:01:56,883 --> 00:01:58,952 things have happened, 34 00:01:59,052 --> 00:02:01,020 so... 35 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:04,023 In the most extreme cases, heart attack. 36 00:02:10,997 --> 00:02:13,199 So... people, when they look at the doll, 37 00:02:13,299 --> 00:02:14,734 they've had a heart attack. 38 00:02:14,735 --> 00:02:16,169 Had heart attacks, yeah. 39 00:02:22,708 --> 00:02:24,193 That's interesting, um... 40 00:02:24,194 --> 00:02:25,678 It's interesting, 41 00:02:25,778 --> 00:02:29,082 because when I initially showed a picture online of the doll, 42 00:02:29,182 --> 00:02:32,317 we had about 30 messages overnight. 43 00:02:32,418 --> 00:02:34,854 These people are experiencing these things 44 00:02:34,954 --> 00:02:37,923 just by looking at a picture of her? 45 00:02:38,023 --> 00:02:41,861 We have a folder of statements from people. 46 00:02:41,961 --> 00:02:44,330 - I know for sure... - ...Still have tingling... 47 00:02:44,430 --> 00:02:45,965 ...Had a sharp pain in my chest. 48 00:02:46,065 --> 00:02:50,002 Over the past year, um, 49 00:02:50,102 --> 00:02:53,572 about 200 I would say, I guess. 50 00:02:53,672 --> 00:02:55,007 I got the feeling I couldn't breathe. 51 00:02:55,108 --> 00:02:56,909 I got a pain in my right eye. 52 00:02:57,009 --> 00:02:58,643 - Lights turned off-- couldn't see. - I had to lie down. 53 00:02:58,744 --> 00:03:00,513 I have felt like someone is in my home. 54 00:03:00,613 --> 00:03:03,316 And it was incredible, because we weren't sharing-- 55 00:03:03,416 --> 00:03:05,384 we weren't making it public 56 00:03:05,484 --> 00:03:07,286 that anything was going on for anyone. 57 00:03:07,387 --> 00:03:10,389 Who do you believe the doll is possessed by, 58 00:03:10,489 --> 00:03:13,225 and why was the doll given the name Peggy? 59 00:03:13,325 --> 00:03:15,695 Back in February, a psychic medium gave us 60 00:03:15,795 --> 00:03:19,298 the name of a lady he was connecting with called Peggy. 61 00:03:19,398 --> 00:03:22,835 How do you think that this doll has the power 62 00:03:22,935 --> 00:03:25,204 to infect those 63 00:03:25,304 --> 00:03:27,906 just by looking at a picture of it on Facebook or online? 64 00:03:28,006 --> 00:03:30,577 - I've never seen this before. - We don't understand that, I mean, 65 00:03:30,677 --> 00:03:33,512 whether it's-- whether it's a case that the spirits 66 00:03:33,612 --> 00:03:35,781 are aware when someone takes an interest in them. 67 00:03:35,882 --> 00:03:38,451 While there isn't a lot of documentation 68 00:03:38,551 --> 00:03:42,021 about Peggy's history, we do know she was made in England 69 00:03:42,121 --> 00:03:44,090 in the late 1960s. 70 00:03:44,190 --> 00:03:46,226 The original owner bought the doll, 71 00:03:46,326 --> 00:03:49,328 um, just at a sale, and pretty much straightaway, 72 00:03:49,428 --> 00:03:51,197 things started happening in her home. 73 00:03:51,297 --> 00:03:53,433 She would hear footsteps. 74 00:03:53,533 --> 00:03:56,268 She would wake up at 3 a.m. and feel that there was someone 75 00:03:56,369 --> 00:03:58,771 in the room, and she became more and more fearful. 76 00:03:58,871 --> 00:04:00,572 She lost weight, she couldn't eat. 77 00:04:00,672 --> 00:04:02,575 She had nausea, migraines. 78 00:04:02,675 --> 00:04:06,445 The original owner was overwhelmed by Peggy's power, 79 00:04:06,545 --> 00:04:10,283 so she sought out someone to take the doll off her hands. 80 00:04:10,383 --> 00:04:13,052 She contacted me, because she'd been online 81 00:04:13,152 --> 00:04:16,087 googling haunted objects, came across-- 82 00:04:16,188 --> 00:04:18,289 it's what we do, I've been studying this kind of thing 83 00:04:18,390 --> 00:04:20,426 for about 17 years... experienced a touch... 84 00:04:20,427 --> 00:04:22,461 So you specialize in this. 85 00:04:22,561 --> 00:04:25,798 - I've had some experiences, yeah, nothing like this. - Okay. 86 00:04:25,898 --> 00:04:28,434 Um... this has kind of thrown out 87 00:04:28,534 --> 00:04:32,037 - all my theories and ideas on what the spirit world's about - 88 00:04:32,137 --> 00:04:33,672 to be honest. 89 00:04:35,441 --> 00:04:37,542 Is it something dark that's with the doll? 90 00:04:37,644 --> 00:04:39,378 All of a sudden, I'm being plagued by flies. 91 00:04:39,478 --> 00:04:42,455 I've never seen flies in here. 92 00:04:45,218 --> 00:04:46,653 So, yeah. 93 00:04:46,654 --> 00:04:48,087 Flies, infestation of flies. 94 00:04:49,722 --> 00:04:52,358 Does Peggy-- does Peggy bring flies with her? 95 00:04:52,458 --> 00:04:55,194 As we're talking about demonic stuff. 96 00:04:55,294 --> 00:04:57,296 I don't-- I don't know. 97 00:04:57,396 --> 00:04:59,298 There's so much about her that we don't know, 98 00:04:59,398 --> 00:05:01,033 and as I said, the longer she's with me, 99 00:05:01,133 --> 00:05:03,335 the more questions I've got-- I just don't... 100 00:05:03,436 --> 00:05:06,037 it's what's fascinating, but it's also what's terrifying, as well, 101 00:05:06,139 --> 00:05:08,441 which is the paranormal, I guess. 102 00:05:08,541 --> 00:05:10,393 That's weird. 103 00:05:10,394 --> 00:05:12,244 Do you see all of them? 104 00:05:12,345 --> 00:05:14,213 - Yeah, I see them flyin' around you. - They're like... 105 00:05:14,313 --> 00:05:17,182 there's flies all around me-- I've never seen flies in here, 106 00:05:17,282 --> 00:05:19,284 and they're all just flying around me, 107 00:05:19,384 --> 00:05:21,821 and there's a bunch of them. 108 00:05:21,921 --> 00:05:24,723 Isn't that, there. 109 00:05:24,823 --> 00:05:26,525 There it is, yeah. 110 00:05:26,626 --> 00:05:28,960 It keeps buzzing around me, and-- and I think 111 00:05:29,061 --> 00:05:31,931 we all know the manifestation of flies 112 00:05:32,031 --> 00:05:34,700 in demonic presences. 113 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:38,403 Um... I'm not concluding anything, however, it is very interesting. 114 00:05:38,504 --> 00:05:41,774 - And you're asking me questions, and maybe it's... - Yeah. 115 00:05:46,311 --> 00:05:48,212 So I'm a little nervous. 116 00:05:48,313 --> 00:05:51,150 Dolls is one of my phobia. 117 00:05:55,420 --> 00:05:58,191 But just having a doll over there with a sack over its face 118 00:05:58,291 --> 00:06:01,027 is probably one of the more unnerving things that I've seen. 119 00:06:01,127 --> 00:06:02,595 Um... 120 00:06:02,596 --> 00:06:04,063 It could get more unnerving. 121 00:06:04,163 --> 00:06:07,367 If you choose to have a look at her. 122 00:06:11,069 --> 00:06:13,205 Sounds like a challenge. 123 00:06:13,305 --> 00:06:15,474 Could be. 124 00:06:15,574 --> 00:06:17,844 Before I see Peggy for myself, 125 00:06:17,944 --> 00:06:20,079 I need to know the risks involved. 126 00:06:22,982 --> 00:06:25,017 Katrin Reedik is here to tell me 127 00:06:25,117 --> 00:06:27,453 about the heart attack that almost took her life. 128 00:06:29,555 --> 00:06:31,657 She traveled all the way to Las Vegas, 129 00:06:31,757 --> 00:06:35,160 hoping I can provide some help to give her closure. 130 00:06:35,260 --> 00:06:38,796 Can you tell me, exactly what happened 131 00:06:38,897 --> 00:06:42,200 with-- with you and this Peggy? 132 00:06:44,003 --> 00:06:46,906 My heart was racing like a running racing horse, 133 00:06:47,006 --> 00:06:50,208 and I didn't feel good. 134 00:06:51,911 --> 00:06:54,346 How close in proximity 135 00:06:54,446 --> 00:06:58,283 to when you saw this video of Peggy 136 00:06:58,383 --> 00:07:01,385 did you have the heart attack? 137 00:07:01,486 --> 00:07:03,789 Just minutes. 138 00:07:03,889 --> 00:07:05,524 - Just minutes. - Within minutes? 139 00:07:05,624 --> 00:07:07,092 Yeah, within minutes. 140 00:07:07,192 --> 00:07:09,895 It was so strange. 141 00:07:09,995 --> 00:07:12,732 I went to hospital, and they confirmed 142 00:07:12,832 --> 00:07:16,534 that there was changes in my heart. 143 00:07:16,635 --> 00:07:18,871 Before the Peggy video, 144 00:07:18,971 --> 00:07:21,240 I didn't have any health issues. 145 00:07:23,376 --> 00:07:26,145 And then my GP confirmed it was heart attack, 146 00:07:26,245 --> 00:07:29,181 and I'm still shaking. 147 00:07:29,282 --> 00:07:32,984 Every time I'm speaking about this, I'm shaking, 148 00:07:33,085 --> 00:07:35,688 and I don't feel good. 149 00:07:35,788 --> 00:07:38,590 I can't see any pictures 150 00:07:38,690 --> 00:07:41,360 about Peggy or any videos, 151 00:07:41,460 --> 00:07:45,130 because I feel I'm going mad after this. 152 00:07:45,230 --> 00:07:48,134 I have two children that I need to raise, 153 00:07:48,234 --> 00:07:50,469 and they have nobody. 154 00:07:50,569 --> 00:07:53,072 Sorry. 155 00:07:53,172 --> 00:07:55,208 It's all right. 156 00:07:57,643 --> 00:07:59,512 It's okay. 157 00:08:05,985 --> 00:08:07,920 This has been hard? 158 00:08:09,755 --> 00:08:12,525 It's hard, really hard. 159 00:08:15,328 --> 00:08:17,695 It's hard to explain to my children 160 00:08:17,796 --> 00:08:19,965 what's happening to their mom. 161 00:08:20,065 --> 00:08:23,735 Why she's in the hospital, or what she's really feeling right now. 162 00:08:23,835 --> 00:08:25,086 It's hard. 163 00:08:25,087 --> 00:08:26,337 Mmhm. 164 00:08:26,438 --> 00:08:29,274 They don't understand-- they're too young for this, 165 00:08:29,374 --> 00:08:32,745 but they know that something is happening to their mom. 166 00:08:35,813 --> 00:08:37,399 Sorry. 167 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:38,985 It's okay. 168 00:08:42,787 --> 00:08:45,658 But... are you gonna be okay? 169 00:08:45,758 --> 00:08:48,260 Yeah. 170 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:50,963 I hope. 171 00:08:51,063 --> 00:08:53,532 Do you think that... 172 00:08:53,632 --> 00:08:56,101 that this doll had something to do with it? 173 00:08:56,201 --> 00:08:58,471 I don't think the doll, 174 00:08:58,571 --> 00:09:00,406 but what's inside it. 175 00:09:03,275 --> 00:09:05,478 You know, at the beginning, 176 00:09:05,578 --> 00:09:08,214 I was going to ask you 177 00:09:08,314 --> 00:09:11,016 to bring Peggy and all that, but... 178 00:09:13,018 --> 00:09:14,653 - No, no. - No, I'm not going to. 179 00:09:14,754 --> 00:09:16,622 - No. - I'm not going to, okay? 180 00:09:18,624 --> 00:09:20,626 - Why don't you get up and take... - Zak. 181 00:09:20,726 --> 00:09:22,728 Okay, something is going on in nerve center. 182 00:09:34,306 --> 00:09:37,343 I am talking to Jayne Harris, owner of Peggy the Doll, 183 00:09:37,443 --> 00:09:39,611 who is allegedly responsible for causing 184 00:09:39,712 --> 00:09:42,848 serious health problems all over the world. 185 00:09:42,948 --> 00:09:46,050 So since so many people online 186 00:09:46,151 --> 00:09:49,354 have had these getting sick 187 00:09:49,455 --> 00:09:52,391 and whatnot, I feel like I have a liability, 188 00:09:52,491 --> 00:09:55,327 like I need to issue a liability to the camera. 189 00:09:55,427 --> 00:09:59,198 What would happen if we take the sack off of Peggy's head 190 00:09:59,298 --> 00:10:02,868 and show her face to our audience 191 00:10:02,968 --> 00:10:05,370 through the video cameras? Is that... 192 00:10:05,470 --> 00:10:06,922 Why are you shaking your head for? 193 00:10:06,923 --> 00:10:08,374 It could be interesting. 194 00:10:08,474 --> 00:10:09,875 It could be really interesting. 195 00:10:09,876 --> 00:10:11,276 It would be interesting. 196 00:10:11,376 --> 00:10:14,847 Okay, but... I don't want my viewers to get sick or anything. 197 00:10:14,947 --> 00:10:16,949 I don't know what to do right now. 198 00:10:17,049 --> 00:10:19,617 I think, with anything paranormal, 199 00:10:19,718 --> 00:10:22,688 you... if you don't take the plunge, you don't get 200 00:10:22,788 --> 00:10:25,057 the answers that maybe you want. 201 00:10:25,157 --> 00:10:27,226 Well, she's already been listening to me, you know, 202 00:10:27,326 --> 00:10:29,661 so let's... let's do it. 203 00:10:29,761 --> 00:10:31,312 Why don't you get up and take... 204 00:10:31,313 --> 00:10:32,863 Zak... Zak. 205 00:10:32,964 --> 00:10:35,567 Okay, we have a red light blinking up here right now. 206 00:10:35,667 --> 00:10:38,403 That means that something is going on in nerve center. 207 00:10:38,503 --> 00:10:40,406 - Will you hold on, please? - Yes, yeah. 208 00:11:00,992 --> 00:11:02,560 - Are you serious? - Yeah. 209 00:11:05,531 --> 00:11:07,565 So... 210 00:11:07,666 --> 00:11:09,701 There are cameras running throughout the museum 211 00:11:09,801 --> 00:11:13,372 at all times, and whenever I'm conducting an interview, 212 00:11:13,472 --> 00:11:15,707 Billy is here in the control room, 213 00:11:15,807 --> 00:11:18,177 monitoring these feeds. 214 00:11:18,277 --> 00:11:20,779 When Jayne and I are discussing removing the sack 215 00:11:20,879 --> 00:11:22,381 from Peggy's head... 216 00:11:22,481 --> 00:11:25,283 I think, with anything paranormal, 217 00:11:25,384 --> 00:11:27,085 if you don't take the plunge, you don't get 218 00:11:27,185 --> 00:11:29,220 the answers that maybe you want. 219 00:11:29,321 --> 00:11:32,557 ...the feed from the camera in the ballroom cuts out suddenly 220 00:11:32,657 --> 00:11:35,928 when all the other cameras continue working perfectly. 221 00:11:36,028 --> 00:11:39,998 I have to wonder if Peggy does not want us to see her face. 222 00:11:40,098 --> 00:11:42,367 Is this a warning? 223 00:11:42,468 --> 00:11:46,104 If it is, I cannot change my mind now. 224 00:11:47,606 --> 00:11:50,342 I need to know what is under this sack. 225 00:11:51,744 --> 00:11:55,080 Everyone that's watching this right now, um, 226 00:11:55,180 --> 00:11:57,915 Peggy's face is about to be revealed. 227 00:11:58,016 --> 00:12:00,519 We will film her face, 228 00:12:00,619 --> 00:12:03,055 so you will see it. 229 00:12:03,155 --> 00:12:05,925 Warning to all our viewers, Peggy the Doll's face 230 00:12:06,025 --> 00:12:08,961 is about to be revealed-- by viewing, 231 00:12:09,061 --> 00:12:11,396 you understand the risks involved. 232 00:12:11,497 --> 00:12:13,332 Go ahead. 233 00:12:22,107 --> 00:12:24,175 Why don't we flip Peggy around 234 00:12:24,276 --> 00:12:26,777 so everyone can look at her at home. 235 00:12:26,878 --> 00:12:28,163 You see her, Jay? 236 00:12:28,164 --> 00:12:29,448 Yeah. 237 00:12:29,548 --> 00:12:30,883 - You zoomed in on her? - Yeah. 238 00:12:30,983 --> 00:12:32,435 She lookin' right at ya? 239 00:12:32,436 --> 00:12:33,886 Straight at me. 240 00:12:33,986 --> 00:12:36,688 So everyone at home... 241 00:12:36,788 --> 00:12:39,291 what are you feeling right now? 242 00:12:42,994 --> 00:12:46,065 Are you feeling anything at all through your television screen? 243 00:12:46,165 --> 00:12:49,668 Any anxiety? 244 00:12:49,768 --> 00:12:53,506 This is really interactive. 245 00:12:53,606 --> 00:12:56,575 We've never really had the viewers 246 00:12:56,675 --> 00:12:59,243 take part as much. 247 00:12:59,344 --> 00:13:01,947 At this moment, I can feel something 248 00:13:02,047 --> 00:13:04,115 that wasn't there before. 249 00:13:04,215 --> 00:13:06,885 I don't want to be anywhere near Peggy. 250 00:13:06,985 --> 00:13:10,655 The environment definitely shifted 251 00:13:10,755 --> 00:13:13,525 when that came off of her face, so... so why don't you go ahead 252 00:13:13,625 --> 00:13:15,527 - and take Peggy. - Okay. 253 00:13:15,627 --> 00:13:17,997 - And I'll see you in a little bit, okay? - Okay. 254 00:13:25,037 --> 00:13:27,540 Thank you. 255 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:30,275 I don't want to be in this room anymore. 256 00:13:30,375 --> 00:13:33,078 I feel anxious and tense. 257 00:13:35,814 --> 00:13:39,318 Crazy-- very, very cool, very, very awesome, you know? 258 00:13:39,418 --> 00:13:41,487 But, just gotta be real cautious. 259 00:13:43,622 --> 00:13:46,058 While most of the crew takes a break, 260 00:13:46,158 --> 00:13:48,761 Aaron notices that something isn't right. 261 00:14:17,323 --> 00:14:19,358 I almost put my hand through this window. 262 00:15:24,844 --> 00:15:27,047 Just wanted to start punching everything. 263 00:15:27,147 --> 00:15:29,482 You know? It's weird. 264 00:15:30,783 --> 00:15:33,085 I mean, think about it, if you were the doll, 265 00:15:33,186 --> 00:15:35,387 and you just got flown over and you have a bag over your head 266 00:15:35,488 --> 00:15:37,557 and it came out, you'd be confused, frustrated, 267 00:15:37,657 --> 00:15:40,060 a little pissed, and curious. 268 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:43,194 You probably-- you probably did feel some sort of emotion 269 00:15:43,296 --> 00:15:44,397 of the doll, I mean... 270 00:15:44,398 --> 00:15:45,498 I felt it enter my body. 271 00:15:45,598 --> 00:15:47,283 You, in a way, made that happen. 272 00:15:47,284 --> 00:15:48,968 I felt it enter my body. 273 00:15:49,068 --> 00:15:50,970 - Enter your body? - Mmhm. 274 00:15:51,070 --> 00:15:53,573 - You're the one who made the call and made it happen. - Think about it, think about it. 275 00:15:53,673 --> 00:15:56,810 - The swarm of flies that are just around me. - That was weird. 276 00:15:56,910 --> 00:15:58,411 That was weird. 277 00:15:58,511 --> 00:16:01,313 Then the feed to the camera goes out, 278 00:16:01,413 --> 00:16:02,949 only in that room where she is. 279 00:16:02,950 --> 00:16:04,484 Yeah. 280 00:16:04,584 --> 00:16:07,954 - Then the anxiety, and I go **** bat-**** crazy. - Yeah. 281 00:16:08,054 --> 00:16:10,991 All of a sudden, I come out here, and I feel better. 282 00:16:14,193 --> 00:16:16,396 After this personal experience, 283 00:16:16,496 --> 00:16:18,631 I'm even more worried about Katrin. 284 00:16:18,731 --> 00:16:21,266 Although it will be hard, I believe it is necessary 285 00:16:21,367 --> 00:16:23,803 for her to confront Peggy one last time, 286 00:16:23,903 --> 00:16:27,439 so I decide to enlist the help of psychic, Patti Negri, 287 00:16:27,540 --> 00:16:29,975 who has assisted the "Ghost Adventures" crew 288 00:16:30,076 --> 00:16:32,211 on two previous investigations. 289 00:16:36,483 --> 00:16:39,018 He is taunting you. 290 00:16:39,117 --> 00:16:41,253 Are you okay, Patti? 291 00:16:43,089 --> 00:16:46,025 Something entered that's malicious. 292 00:16:46,126 --> 00:16:49,127 I... interviewed 293 00:16:49,228 --> 00:16:51,531 a couple women from, 294 00:16:51,631 --> 00:16:52,666 the United Kingdom, 295 00:16:52,667 --> 00:16:53,700 Yeah. 296 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:56,803 and one of the ladies 297 00:16:56,903 --> 00:16:59,506 has a doll, okay. 298 00:16:59,606 --> 00:17:02,741 And I know that you do a lot with dolls. 299 00:17:02,841 --> 00:17:04,877 - Yes. - That's why I wanted to call you, 300 00:17:04,977 --> 00:17:07,247 because I need your help. 301 00:17:09,582 --> 00:17:11,918 I'm not gonna tell you a whole lot about this. 302 00:17:15,054 --> 00:17:17,457 Another lady that is here 303 00:17:17,557 --> 00:17:20,893 was severely affected by 304 00:17:20,993 --> 00:17:23,396 just looking at the doll. 305 00:17:28,234 --> 00:17:30,903 She's never... been in 306 00:17:31,004 --> 00:17:33,106 the presence of the doll, okay? 307 00:17:33,206 --> 00:17:35,407 I need you to try and help, 308 00:17:35,507 --> 00:17:38,511 because she needs closure. 309 00:17:40,679 --> 00:17:43,115 Theo, can you send Katrin in? 310 00:17:44,150 --> 00:17:47,387 I've also invited Jay Wasley, an investigator of mine 311 00:17:47,487 --> 00:17:50,456 on "Ghost Adventures," to participate in this séance 312 00:17:50,556 --> 00:17:52,959 as a third party eyewitness. 313 00:17:53,059 --> 00:17:54,511 Hi. 314 00:17:54,512 --> 00:17:55,962 Hi, Katrin. 315 00:17:56,062 --> 00:17:57,831 Do you want to have a seat? 316 00:18:01,301 --> 00:18:03,269 Breathe. 317 00:18:03,369 --> 00:18:05,504 Slow, deep breaths. 318 00:18:19,318 --> 00:18:21,421 If at any time you want to leave, leave, okay? 319 00:18:21,521 --> 00:18:23,189 I'm serious. 320 00:18:23,190 --> 00:18:24,857 No, I want to do it for myself. 321 00:18:24,957 --> 00:18:26,676 Okay. 322 00:18:26,677 --> 00:18:28,394 Because... I know she's controlling me, 323 00:18:28,495 --> 00:18:29,996 but she can't do it anymore. 324 00:18:29,997 --> 00:18:31,496 Okay. 325 00:18:31,597 --> 00:18:33,966 Okay, if everybody wouldn't mind just taking hands. 326 00:18:34,066 --> 00:18:36,603 Um, left palm up, right palm down. 327 00:18:36,703 --> 00:18:38,405 Yeah. 328 00:18:42,474 --> 00:18:45,744 I just want to call a circle of protection within this space, 329 00:18:45,844 --> 00:18:49,014 a center of light within this space 330 00:18:49,114 --> 00:18:53,452 as we slowly raise the veil between the worlds. 331 00:18:53,552 --> 00:18:56,455 Can Peggy manifest physically? 332 00:18:58,757 --> 00:19:00,593 She says she is. 333 00:19:00,693 --> 00:19:02,761 Does anyone notice that the candles, every now and then, 334 00:19:02,861 --> 00:19:04,763 they just go crazy as if they're about to go out. 335 00:19:04,863 --> 00:19:06,831 - That one, that tall one. - Mmhm, yeah. 336 00:19:06,932 --> 00:19:09,535 - Look at it-- it goes from one to the other. - It's like a hand over the top. 337 00:19:09,635 --> 00:19:11,170 There's no breezes in here. 338 00:19:11,270 --> 00:19:13,572 - What's weird, though, is if you look at these, - Mmhm. 339 00:19:13,672 --> 00:19:17,209 - they don't do that, and they're the same candles. - Yeah. 340 00:19:17,309 --> 00:19:18,611 But over there, next to her, 341 00:19:18,612 --> 00:19:19,912 By her. 342 00:19:20,012 --> 00:19:23,581 they dance from one to the other. 343 00:19:23,683 --> 00:19:25,217 See that? 344 00:19:25,317 --> 00:19:28,720 This entity is a bit of a trickster. 345 00:19:28,820 --> 00:19:31,023 Is that the typewriter I keep hearing? 346 00:19:31,123 --> 00:19:32,725 It's the typewriter I keep hearing, yeah. 347 00:19:32,825 --> 00:19:34,477 It's like, it's typewriter sounds. 348 00:19:34,478 --> 00:19:36,128 Yeah, what is it... 349 00:19:36,228 --> 00:19:37,696 You hear like a 350 00:19:39,264 --> 00:19:41,567 From the moment I first ask the spirit 351 00:19:41,667 --> 00:19:43,702 within Peggy to reach out to us... 352 00:19:43,802 --> 00:19:45,602 Can Peggy manifest physically? 353 00:19:45,637 --> 00:19:47,840 ...there has been a flurry of activity, 354 00:19:47,940 --> 00:19:49,608 from the candles... 355 00:19:49,708 --> 00:19:51,210 Look at it, it goes from one to the other. 356 00:19:51,310 --> 00:19:53,078 ...to audible anomalies. 357 00:19:53,178 --> 00:19:55,247 This entity... 358 00:19:55,347 --> 00:19:57,683 This entity... 359 00:19:57,783 --> 00:20:01,254 Some kind of intelligent being is definitely here with us. 360 00:20:04,323 --> 00:20:06,459 Are you-- are you okay? 361 00:20:08,060 --> 00:20:11,330 It's okay-- a lot of energy flying around. 362 00:20:11,430 --> 00:20:14,334 It makes people react in lots of different ways, lots of different ways. 363 00:20:14,434 --> 00:20:16,769 Sorry. 364 00:20:16,869 --> 00:20:18,070 It's okay. 365 00:20:18,170 --> 00:20:21,273 It's obvious that the energy in the room is having 366 00:20:21,373 --> 00:20:23,409 an effect on Katrin. 367 00:20:23,509 --> 00:20:25,577 If she is ever going to break away from the hold 368 00:20:25,678 --> 00:20:29,201 that Peggy has on her life, now is the time. 369 00:20:29,236 --> 00:20:32,409 She needs to confront her fear alone. 370 00:20:32,444 --> 00:20:34,597 - Can we try something? - Yeah. 371 00:20:36,026 --> 00:20:38,000 What would you feel 372 00:20:38,224 --> 00:20:42,422 if we all got up and left you here with her? 373 00:20:48,801 --> 00:20:51,905 Can you come please? I feel the same stabbing here. 374 00:21:00,902 --> 00:21:03,038 What would you feel 375 00:21:03,138 --> 00:21:05,473 if we all got up and left you here 376 00:21:05,574 --> 00:21:07,176 with her? 377 00:21:10,712 --> 00:21:12,881 It's, I mean, it's up to you. 378 00:21:12,981 --> 00:21:15,750 I was just only gonna say if-- if we all left, 379 00:21:15,850 --> 00:21:18,286 then you can just... 380 00:21:20,889 --> 00:21:23,725 spend some time alone. 381 00:21:23,826 --> 00:21:25,127 Do you want to try it? 382 00:21:25,128 --> 00:21:26,428 Mmhm. 383 00:21:26,528 --> 00:21:28,430 Let's get up and see. 384 00:21:32,534 --> 00:21:34,369 You're okay. 385 00:21:53,254 --> 00:21:55,023 Crying? Or what? 386 00:22:02,330 --> 00:22:05,600 - Do you think it's... the spirits are there in there? - Yes. 387 00:22:05,700 --> 00:22:07,202 Is that a bad thing? 388 00:22:18,313 --> 00:22:21,216 Katrin's fear has only made Peggy more powerful. 389 00:22:23,318 --> 00:22:25,954 Whatever the horrible connection between them is, 390 00:22:26,054 --> 00:22:28,490 we need to destroy it. 391 00:22:31,026 --> 00:22:32,761 You good? 392 00:22:32,861 --> 00:22:34,462 - Okay, okay. - Can you come, please? 393 00:22:34,562 --> 00:22:36,197 Okay, you did really good. 394 00:22:36,297 --> 00:22:39,201 'Cause I feel the same stabbing here. 395 00:22:39,301 --> 00:22:41,836 Yeah, but you're-- we're gonna let go of that, okay. 396 00:22:41,936 --> 00:22:44,072 It grabbed onto you so we can cut it. 397 00:22:44,172 --> 00:22:46,141 Can you see that? There you go. 398 00:22:48,610 --> 00:22:51,413 Only time will tell if Katrin has truly escaped 399 00:22:51,513 --> 00:22:53,982 from Peggy's darkness. 400 00:23:09,764 --> 00:23:12,367 As I recover from my encounter with Peggy, 401 00:23:12,467 --> 00:23:16,604 my mom and Aaron talk to customers at the museum shop. 402 00:23:16,704 --> 00:23:19,139 This makes me think you take pictures, 403 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:22,210 and you save 'em, and then they're just gonna end up 404 00:23:22,310 --> 00:23:24,846 at some antique shop, and then, after that, it's gonna... you know? 405 00:23:24,946 --> 00:23:26,981 Like this one, you're right. 406 00:23:27,081 --> 00:23:28,166 Hi, Nancy. 407 00:23:28,167 --> 00:23:29,250 Hey, David! 408 00:23:29,350 --> 00:23:32,153 - I told Zak about this when you guys were down buying stuff, - You finally found it. 409 00:23:32,253 --> 00:23:34,355 and I brought you in to let you see it. 410 00:23:34,455 --> 00:23:36,323 - My God! - My God, that is so crazy! 411 00:23:36,424 --> 00:23:37,709 You know, ooh, okay. 412 00:23:37,710 --> 00:23:38,994 Is that real? 413 00:23:39,094 --> 00:23:40,795 - This one's real. - If you just wanna lay something on it. 414 00:23:40,895 --> 00:23:42,497 This is crazy. 415 00:23:42,597 --> 00:23:44,799 Wait, is that a bone that you put bones on? 416 00:23:44,899 --> 00:23:46,533 Yeah, that's a human jawbone. 417 00:23:46,634 --> 00:23:47,802 Really, my... 418 00:23:47,803 --> 00:23:48,970 What the ****? 419 00:23:49,070 --> 00:23:51,273 This is amazing-- where did you get it? 420 00:23:51,373 --> 00:23:55,077 A friend of mine had it in his coin shop for years, 421 00:23:55,177 --> 00:23:57,745 and it sat up on a shelf that said "Former Shoplifter." 422 00:23:57,846 --> 00:24:00,215 That was great, that was great. 423 00:24:00,315 --> 00:24:02,617 - Probably was. - And when he moved, he sold it to me. 424 00:24:02,717 --> 00:24:05,453 - What age is he, do we know? - He's old-- he's got minerals growing in his teeth. 425 00:24:05,553 --> 00:24:07,189 My God. 426 00:24:07,289 --> 00:24:08,956 You're right. 427 00:24:09,057 --> 00:24:10,892 This-- he's an old skull. 428 00:24:10,992 --> 00:24:12,761 He's been preserved so well. 429 00:24:12,861 --> 00:24:15,030 God, you can hear how the bone... 430 00:24:15,130 --> 00:24:17,199 We look like that, actually. 431 00:24:17,299 --> 00:24:19,334 I mean, you kinda look like that right now, but... 432 00:24:19,434 --> 00:24:21,235 My God. 433 00:24:21,335 --> 00:24:24,506 But the last two owners after they sold it didn't live a year. 434 00:24:26,841 --> 00:24:28,776 So whoever owns it dies? 435 00:24:28,877 --> 00:24:31,146 Well, if you get rid of it, apparently. 436 00:24:31,246 --> 00:24:34,182 So I figure this one's probably going to the grave with me. 437 00:24:34,282 --> 00:24:38,419 Well, we'd sure like to display it. 438 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:39,872 We could probably do that. 439 00:24:39,873 --> 00:24:41,223 Yeah? 440 00:24:41,323 --> 00:24:42,858 - You think? - Well, because, I mean, if you don't want to sell, 441 00:24:42,958 --> 00:24:44,358 we'll make sure you can come back. 442 00:24:44,458 --> 00:24:46,595 You can come in and take it whenever, it's one of those deals, 443 00:24:46,695 --> 00:24:48,763 - 'cause we'd love to have it. - I don't even want to touch it, though. 444 00:24:48,863 --> 00:24:50,732 Touch it, it's okay. 445 00:24:50,832 --> 00:24:52,934 It's okay-- no, it's okay. 446 00:25:00,007 --> 00:25:01,909 Eight weeks after this was filmed, 447 00:25:02,010 --> 00:25:04,613 David Steinke, who was a friend of my mom's, 448 00:25:04,713 --> 00:25:06,047 passed away. 449 00:25:06,147 --> 00:25:09,251 The whereabouts of the skull is unknown. 450 00:25:28,570 --> 00:25:30,606 I'm Mary Skinner from the Tennessee State Museum 451 00:25:30,706 --> 00:25:34,208 in Nashville, Tennessee, home of a very gruesome item 452 00:25:34,309 --> 00:25:37,846 I'm bringing to Zak Bagans. 453 00:25:37,946 --> 00:25:41,583 This is not so much an exhibit as it is a part of a human being, 454 00:25:41,684 --> 00:25:44,586 a human being that was the leader 455 00:25:45,755 --> 00:25:46,822 of hundreds of men 456 00:25:46,922 --> 00:25:50,759 that terrorized the Natchez Trace in the Mississippi. 457 00:25:50,859 --> 00:25:52,628 This item has reportedly 458 00:25:52,728 --> 00:25:54,863 made some people sick in the museum, 459 00:25:54,963 --> 00:25:57,599 scared many children, 460 00:25:57,699 --> 00:26:00,402 and I want to bring it to Zak's attention. 461 00:26:00,502 --> 00:26:03,639 Hopefully, he can fill in some answers about this mysterious outlaw. 462 00:26:09,712 --> 00:26:11,413 - Hello. - Hello. 463 00:26:11,513 --> 00:26:13,881 Welcome, come on in. 464 00:26:13,983 --> 00:26:15,450 Whatever you have in your hand, 465 00:26:15,550 --> 00:26:17,286 please place it on the podium there. 466 00:26:19,454 --> 00:26:21,156 Wow. 467 00:26:21,756 --> 00:26:23,624 Good things come in small packages? 468 00:26:23,724 --> 00:26:25,159 You could say that. 469 00:26:25,260 --> 00:26:26,912 Is it inside this little coffin? 470 00:26:26,913 --> 00:26:28,563 Yes it is, yes. 471 00:26:28,663 --> 00:26:32,233 - I like surprises. - Now if you touch it, you have to wear gloves. 472 00:26:32,334 --> 00:26:34,735 Ooh, I have to wear gloves to touch it? 473 00:26:42,877 --> 00:26:44,446 Is that a... 474 00:26:44,546 --> 00:26:46,248 what am I looking at? 475 00:26:48,116 --> 00:26:51,819 This is a thumb that belonged to once... 476 00:26:51,919 --> 00:26:52,971 It's a thumb. 477 00:26:52,972 --> 00:26:54,022 It's a thumb. 478 00:26:54,122 --> 00:26:57,558 This is a real human thumb? 479 00:26:57,658 --> 00:26:59,561 Yes. 480 00:26:59,661 --> 00:27:03,198 When he felt like they were no longer of any use to him, 481 00:27:03,298 --> 00:27:04,766 then he murdered them. 482 00:27:17,545 --> 00:27:19,030 What in the heck? 483 00:27:19,031 --> 00:27:20,515 This is a thumb-- 484 00:27:20,615 --> 00:27:23,951 This is a real... human thumb? 485 00:27:24,551 --> 00:27:27,588 Yes, from a notorious outlaw, 486 00:27:27,688 --> 00:27:29,557 John Murrell. 487 00:27:32,059 --> 00:27:34,628 I believe Mark Twain was, actually a fan of him. 488 00:27:34,728 --> 00:27:37,699 - He wrote about him in Life on the Mississippi. - Exactly. 489 00:27:39,733 --> 00:27:42,736 He terrorized people along the Mississippi. 490 00:27:45,139 --> 00:27:47,541 And there's people that still believe that his treasure 491 00:27:47,641 --> 00:27:50,010 is buried in caves somewhere on the Mississippi. 492 00:27:50,110 --> 00:27:52,012 Even today, people still search 493 00:27:52,112 --> 00:27:55,383 for the treasures in the caves, but Mark Twain wrote about that. 494 00:27:55,483 --> 00:27:57,685 What are Jesse James 495 00:27:57,785 --> 00:28:00,521 and his half dozen vulgar rascals 496 00:28:00,621 --> 00:28:04,191 compared with this stately old-time criminal John Murrell 497 00:28:04,291 --> 00:28:07,227 with his sermons and his majestic following 498 00:28:07,328 --> 00:28:10,764 of ten hundred men sworn to do evil. 499 00:28:10,864 --> 00:28:14,268 We did an investigation in Natchez, Mississippi, once. 500 00:28:16,637 --> 00:28:18,773 And I know that that was his stomping grounds, 501 00:28:18,873 --> 00:28:20,942 the Natchez Trace, the Devil's Punchbowl. 502 00:28:23,244 --> 00:28:26,347 And I know there's a lot of good stories associated with him in that area. 503 00:28:26,447 --> 00:28:28,416 He was the son of a Methodist minister, 504 00:28:28,516 --> 00:28:31,152 and that's how he got the idea 505 00:28:31,252 --> 00:28:34,053 to pull off these, um, 506 00:28:34,154 --> 00:28:36,691 robberies that he was so famous for. 507 00:28:39,626 --> 00:28:42,497 He would go around to communities 508 00:28:42,597 --> 00:28:44,764 up and down the Mississippi River and the Natchez Trace 509 00:28:44,865 --> 00:28:48,402 and pretend to be a traveling minister. 510 00:28:48,502 --> 00:28:51,639 While he was giving the sermon, 511 00:28:51,739 --> 00:28:55,075 his band of outlaws were out stealing everybody's horses. 512 00:28:57,577 --> 00:29:01,181 I've always believed that John Murrell, 513 00:29:01,282 --> 00:29:04,283 pardon the pun, has gotten buried in history. 514 00:29:04,384 --> 00:29:06,787 He's not as notorious as Billy the Kid 515 00:29:06,887 --> 00:29:08,522 or Jesse James 516 00:29:08,622 --> 00:29:12,159 Many newspaper articles wrote about his crimes. 517 00:29:12,259 --> 00:29:14,394 He was a horse thief, a bandit, 518 00:29:14,494 --> 00:29:16,496 um, he was accused of stealing slaves, 519 00:29:16,597 --> 00:29:19,567 and he was arrested for stealing a slave. 520 00:29:19,667 --> 00:29:23,470 Some people believe he would capture slaves, 521 00:29:23,570 --> 00:29:25,606 and he would sell them and resell them, 522 00:29:25,706 --> 00:29:28,476 and then, when he felt like they were no longer 523 00:29:28,576 --> 00:29:31,012 of any use to him, then he murdered them. 524 00:29:38,118 --> 00:29:41,388 After only a brief encounter with John Murrell's thumb, 525 00:29:41,488 --> 00:29:44,692 Sara Harvey was overcome with physical symptoms 526 00:29:44,792 --> 00:29:47,293 that lingered long after exposure, 527 00:29:47,394 --> 00:29:49,463 leaving her feeling sick and drained. 528 00:29:49,563 --> 00:29:52,700 Um, and I assume you know what that is? 529 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,635 Yes. 530 00:29:54,636 --> 00:29:55,551 You do. 531 00:29:56,070 --> 00:29:57,972 Um, does it make you uncomfortable 532 00:29:58,072 --> 00:30:00,007 - sitting next to it? - Yes. 533 00:30:00,108 --> 00:30:01,609 It does? 534 00:30:01,709 --> 00:30:04,412 It definitely left a mark. 535 00:30:04,512 --> 00:30:05,797 It was quite memorable. 536 00:30:05,798 --> 00:30:07,081 Tell me exactly what happened. 537 00:30:07,181 --> 00:30:09,683 I could tell where it was pretty much without anybody 538 00:30:09,783 --> 00:30:11,718 having to tell me, I was just following 539 00:30:11,819 --> 00:30:14,389 the sense of dread as it got larger. 540 00:30:14,489 --> 00:30:17,158 What did you start feeling? 541 00:30:17,258 --> 00:30:18,593 What was this dread? 542 00:30:18,594 --> 00:30:19,927 That creepy... 543 00:30:20,027 --> 00:30:21,479 vibe and aura coming off of it, 544 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:22,930 Right. 545 00:30:23,030 --> 00:30:24,198 that you could almost follow. 546 00:30:24,199 --> 00:30:25,366 Mmhm. 547 00:30:25,466 --> 00:30:27,702 And it was very tingling, 548 00:30:27,802 --> 00:30:29,870 a little disorienting. 549 00:30:29,971 --> 00:30:31,839 Were you getting, like, headaches and stuff? 550 00:30:31,939 --> 00:30:34,942 Kind of a migraine-y, low hum, 551 00:30:35,042 --> 00:30:38,279 vertigo feeling, um, 552 00:30:38,379 --> 00:30:41,415 a feeling of not quite-- not quite knowing 553 00:30:41,515 --> 00:30:43,218 where all your extremities are. 554 00:30:43,318 --> 00:30:45,186 Your feet feel kinda fuzzy and far away, 555 00:30:45,286 --> 00:30:48,089 and your fingertips, little pins and needles. 556 00:30:48,189 --> 00:30:51,526 Is he getting gratification still in the afterlife 557 00:30:51,626 --> 00:30:55,363 by his thumb giving people like you these reactions? 558 00:30:55,463 --> 00:30:57,966 - The heebie-jeebies? - Scaring people, making them in fear? 559 00:30:58,066 --> 00:31:00,501 Is he thriving off of this? 560 00:31:00,601 --> 00:31:03,237 Probably-- he is not a nice person. 561 00:31:03,337 --> 00:31:07,242 He was not a-- um, a good-hearted person in life. 562 00:31:07,342 --> 00:31:10,110 One of the theories that John Murrell's spirit 563 00:31:10,211 --> 00:31:13,381 is attached to his thumb is because pieces of him 564 00:31:13,481 --> 00:31:17,251 are literally scattered about, but this is not the only piece. 565 00:31:17,351 --> 00:31:20,522 Is it true that John Murrell was also said 566 00:31:20,622 --> 00:31:23,924 to have been decapitated, and they can't find his head? 567 00:31:24,024 --> 00:31:26,226 That's one of the stories. 568 00:31:26,327 --> 00:31:28,462 He died of a lung disease, didn't he, or something? 569 00:31:28,563 --> 00:31:29,931 - Tuberculosis. - Tuberculosis. 570 00:31:30,031 --> 00:31:32,533 And because he was such a notorious person at the time, 571 00:31:32,633 --> 00:31:36,504 - his body was sent to the Nashville Medical College, - Mmhm. 572 00:31:36,604 --> 00:31:39,741 and they mummified the body and put it on display 573 00:31:39,841 --> 00:31:43,011 with his arm extended 574 00:31:43,111 --> 00:31:45,480 as he was going to shake people's hand. 575 00:31:45,580 --> 00:31:47,880 His body was sent 576 00:31:47,982 --> 00:31:49,000 to the medical college? 577 00:31:49,001 --> 00:31:50,017 Yes. 578 00:31:50,117 --> 00:31:52,887 - At that point, did he still have his thumb and head? - Yes. 579 00:31:52,987 --> 00:31:54,422 He did. 580 00:31:54,423 --> 00:31:55,857 But the thumb was severed 581 00:31:55,957 --> 00:31:59,327 and sent to the Historical Society. 582 00:31:59,427 --> 00:32:02,964 - So you have documentation that the thumb was severed. - Yes. 583 00:32:03,064 --> 00:32:04,833 - We have a letter - A letter. 584 00:32:04,933 --> 00:32:07,234 from somebody that states that in the letter, our files. 585 00:32:07,335 --> 00:32:09,637 But this thumb has been in your possession, 586 00:32:09,738 --> 00:32:11,772 Tennessee Historical Society, for how long? 587 00:32:11,872 --> 00:32:15,009 Um, since the early 1800s. 588 00:32:15,109 --> 00:32:17,345 So that's his thumb! 589 00:32:19,380 --> 00:32:22,884 I am familiar with some of John Murrell's ghost stories, 590 00:32:22,984 --> 00:32:26,754 and there are reports that many people have seen his ghost, 591 00:32:26,854 --> 00:32:29,056 his full apparition, in the Devil's Punchbowl 592 00:32:29,156 --> 00:32:31,692 in the Natchez Trace area, 593 00:32:31,792 --> 00:32:34,562 and being as John Murrell was, 594 00:32:34,662 --> 00:32:36,865 in his life, an evil man, 595 00:32:39,266 --> 00:32:42,770 if it's true that his head is also missing from his body, 596 00:32:42,870 --> 00:32:45,406 I imagine that, in the afterlife, 597 00:32:45,506 --> 00:32:48,376 he would be even more vicious that his body parts 598 00:32:48,476 --> 00:32:51,312 are all over the place. 599 00:32:51,412 --> 00:32:53,547 Do I get to touch it? 600 00:32:53,648 --> 00:32:56,049 John, if this is your thumb, 601 00:32:56,150 --> 00:32:59,387 I'm gettin' ready to pick it up. 602 00:33:03,457 --> 00:33:05,026 - Do you approve? - Yes. 603 00:33:05,126 --> 00:33:06,795 Okay. 604 00:33:13,801 --> 00:33:16,003 I gotta be careful not to drop it, right? 605 00:33:16,103 --> 00:33:19,072 So is it, like... my gosh. 606 00:33:21,275 --> 00:33:23,477 Gosh, so this is mummified, right? 607 00:33:23,577 --> 00:33:25,213 Yes. 608 00:33:25,214 --> 00:33:26,848 My gosh. 609 00:33:26,947 --> 00:33:29,049 I'm like... 610 00:33:29,150 --> 00:33:31,585 a little nervous right now. 611 00:33:31,685 --> 00:33:34,087 Not gonna lie. 612 00:33:34,188 --> 00:33:37,725 As I hold a piece of this famous outlaw, 613 00:33:37,824 --> 00:33:40,227 I wonder if his spirit is watching over me 614 00:33:40,328 --> 00:33:43,331 or if my direct contact to his DNA 615 00:33:43,431 --> 00:33:47,001 will welcome a new attachment to the Zak Bagans ghost family. 616 00:33:48,835 --> 00:33:50,937 Wow, that's incredible. 617 00:33:51,038 --> 00:33:54,175 Just to touch this. 618 00:33:54,275 --> 00:33:56,711 You imagine... 619 00:33:56,811 --> 00:34:00,381 how many times he held a gun with this thumb 620 00:34:00,481 --> 00:34:03,251 or how many times he killed someone with his gun 621 00:34:03,351 --> 00:34:05,119 or... 622 00:34:07,555 --> 00:34:11,392 John Murrell and his gang left a trail of bodies in their wake. 623 00:34:11,492 --> 00:34:14,161 Now his descendent, 624 00:34:14,261 --> 00:34:16,998 Jamie Pistel, is here to tell us 625 00:34:17,098 --> 00:34:20,433 about her struggles with her family's bloody legacy. 626 00:34:20,534 --> 00:34:23,571 Growing up, my father always told me that I had some-- 627 00:34:23,671 --> 00:34:26,640 lots of really good ancestors, and then lots of ancestors 628 00:34:26,741 --> 00:34:30,177 that were not so good on this particular one side of the family. 629 00:34:30,277 --> 00:34:34,248 Do you feel anything in that respect? 630 00:34:34,348 --> 00:34:37,884 Do you feel dark energy around it or anything like that? 631 00:34:37,985 --> 00:34:41,356 Um... it's really, um, amazing 632 00:34:41,456 --> 00:34:44,458 that I do feel-- I mean, like, I'm tearing up now. 633 00:34:44,558 --> 00:34:46,927 It's overwhelming to me, really. 634 00:34:47,027 --> 00:34:49,096 Why are you getting emotional? 635 00:34:49,196 --> 00:34:51,866 I don't know-- I don't know, I don't have a lot of experience 636 00:34:51,966 --> 00:34:54,402 with this type of thing-- it's probably the energy, 637 00:34:54,502 --> 00:34:56,436 and just, um, the fact 638 00:34:56,537 --> 00:34:58,839 that, um, he did a lot of things 639 00:34:58,940 --> 00:35:01,175 that, you know-- I know you can't-- 640 00:35:01,275 --> 00:35:03,311 I can't control what happened in the past, 641 00:35:03,411 --> 00:35:06,180 but things that I'm not, you know, proud of. 642 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:10,117 'Cause the museum, actually, where his thumb is housed 643 00:35:10,217 --> 00:35:13,087 is walking distance from where I work, 644 00:35:13,187 --> 00:35:15,589 I spend the majority of my time, 645 00:35:15,689 --> 00:35:17,692 um, and to just know 646 00:35:17,792 --> 00:35:20,728 that there's something that is on display, um, 647 00:35:20,828 --> 00:35:23,331 is... is hard. 648 00:35:23,431 --> 00:35:26,167 So... 649 00:35:26,267 --> 00:35:29,270 Do you just not-- do you not like being around this? 650 00:35:29,370 --> 00:35:31,538 Can you-- can you feel 651 00:35:31,639 --> 00:35:32,740 things around it? 652 00:35:32,741 --> 00:35:33,841 Yeah, it's real-- 653 00:35:33,941 --> 00:35:35,509 I'm just uncomfortable. 654 00:35:35,609 --> 00:35:39,547 I mean, I'm okay-- I mean, I'm okay, but it's just heaviness. 655 00:35:39,647 --> 00:35:41,515 Mmhm. 656 00:35:41,615 --> 00:35:43,683 If you were to come into contact 657 00:35:43,784 --> 00:35:46,821 with the spirit of your ancestor, John Murrell, 658 00:35:46,921 --> 00:35:50,256 and you could talk to him and he could talk back, 659 00:35:50,357 --> 00:35:52,326 what would you ask him? 660 00:35:52,426 --> 00:35:54,361 Why? 661 00:35:54,461 --> 00:35:55,928 Why he did what he did, 662 00:35:56,029 --> 00:35:58,465 and what was so, um, 663 00:35:58,565 --> 00:36:02,136 appealing or enticing that you felt that you had 664 00:36:02,236 --> 00:36:05,306 to, you know, do the things that you did. 665 00:36:05,406 --> 00:36:08,942 We were planning on doing some work around the thumb, 666 00:36:09,043 --> 00:36:12,113 - just to see what happens, we don't know, - Yeah, yeah. 667 00:36:12,213 --> 00:36:14,348 but, you know, maybe his spirit will come through, 668 00:36:14,449 --> 00:36:17,151 maybe he won't, but if he does come through, 669 00:36:17,251 --> 00:36:19,787 I thought maybe that would be a good opportunity 670 00:36:19,887 --> 00:36:21,822 for you to have some closure. 671 00:36:21,922 --> 00:36:23,958 - Would you like to do that? - Yes. 672 00:36:24,765 --> 00:36:27,500 Jamie agrees to join us as we attempt to communicate 673 00:36:27,601 --> 00:36:31,195 with the spirit of her ancestor, John Murrell. 674 00:36:31,230 --> 00:36:32,821 Hi, Jamie. 675 00:36:32,856 --> 00:36:33,965 - Hi. - How you doing? 676 00:36:34,107 --> 00:36:34,963 Good, thank you. 677 00:36:34,998 --> 00:36:36,069 Why don't you have a seat? 678 00:36:36,410 --> 00:36:37,555 - Hi. - Hey. 679 00:36:38,511 --> 00:36:41,381 We are using this blood relative, 680 00:36:41,481 --> 00:36:43,617 along with Murrell's own thumb, 681 00:36:43,717 --> 00:36:46,520 as trigger objects to provoke a response. 682 00:36:49,089 --> 00:36:52,125 During this, I want you to ask questions. 683 00:36:52,226 --> 00:36:53,811 You are his ancestor, 684 00:36:53,812 --> 00:36:55,395 Mmhm. 685 00:36:55,495 --> 00:36:59,433 - and there was a lot of emotion, and I think that we can use that - Mmhm. 686 00:36:59,533 --> 00:37:02,235 to help try to communicate. 687 00:37:02,335 --> 00:37:04,404 For this session, we are using a device 688 00:37:04,504 --> 00:37:07,806 known as the Paranormal Puck, which translates 689 00:37:07,907 --> 00:37:10,843 electromagnetic energy fields into words, 690 00:37:10,944 --> 00:37:13,779 allowing spirits like this murderous outlaw 691 00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,349 to reach out to us from the past. 692 00:37:16,449 --> 00:37:19,586 So I typed a question in, it reads the energy around 693 00:37:19,686 --> 00:37:21,788 and selects a word. 694 00:37:21,888 --> 00:37:24,357 Before we can even begin the session, 695 00:37:24,457 --> 00:37:27,794 while Billy is still testing out the equipment, 696 00:37:27,894 --> 00:37:30,230 he receives what appears to be a response 697 00:37:30,330 --> 00:37:33,165 from the spirit attached to this human thumb. 698 00:37:33,266 --> 00:37:35,168 Whoa. 699 00:37:35,768 --> 00:37:38,304 Do you have a message for Jamie? That's what I typed. 700 00:37:38,404 --> 00:37:41,106 It says cut. 701 00:37:41,206 --> 00:37:42,842 I'm gonna have you switch. 702 00:37:42,942 --> 00:37:44,643 I want you to see this as he's doing it, 703 00:37:44,743 --> 00:37:47,045 'cause we're starting to get-- that's-- 704 00:37:47,146 --> 00:37:48,715 It's connected to you. 705 00:37:48,716 --> 00:37:50,283 Cut. 706 00:37:50,383 --> 00:37:52,818 Could that possibly mean cut thumb? 707 00:37:52,918 --> 00:37:54,654 I don't know. 708 00:37:54,754 --> 00:37:57,489 - Ask another question, watch him type. - Yeah, I'll type it. 709 00:37:57,590 --> 00:38:00,760 Um, you said "cut" -- what does that mean? 710 00:38:05,197 --> 00:38:07,632 Cave. 711 00:38:07,732 --> 00:38:10,969 There's people that still believe that his treasure 712 00:38:11,069 --> 00:38:13,505 is buried in caves somewhere on the Mississippi. 713 00:38:13,605 --> 00:38:15,541 What is hidden in the cave? 714 00:38:15,641 --> 00:38:17,843 Is there something hidden in the cave? 715 00:38:20,145 --> 00:38:22,375 - Swim. - Swim? 716 00:38:24,251 --> 00:38:27,187 At this moment, I don't yet understand the significance 717 00:38:27,287 --> 00:38:29,456 of this response. 718 00:38:29,556 --> 00:38:31,591 Did you commit murder? 719 00:38:31,691 --> 00:38:34,494 Did you commit murder? 720 00:38:34,594 --> 00:38:36,095 Drowned. 721 00:38:36,195 --> 00:38:37,230 It said swim earlier. 722 00:38:37,231 --> 00:38:38,265 Yeah. 723 00:38:38,365 --> 00:38:40,233 We were unsure what this meant, 724 00:38:40,333 --> 00:38:42,535 so I send a crew to visit the region 725 00:38:42,635 --> 00:38:44,571 where Murrell and his gang 726 00:38:44,671 --> 00:38:47,507 buried bodies in unmarked graves. 727 00:38:47,607 --> 00:38:50,277 A man offers up a story 728 00:38:50,377 --> 00:38:52,879 with astonishing connections to this evidence. 729 00:38:52,979 --> 00:38:55,482 I was coming back from a conference 730 00:38:55,582 --> 00:38:57,917 in South Mississippi with a friend of mine, 731 00:38:58,017 --> 00:39:00,987 and we looked down here at the water, 732 00:39:01,087 --> 00:39:02,689 and we could see a guy standing on the edge 733 00:39:02,789 --> 00:39:04,490 of the riverbank down there, 734 00:39:04,591 --> 00:39:06,625 and there was a couple more guys in the water 735 00:39:06,727 --> 00:39:08,895 that had a body in between them. 736 00:39:08,995 --> 00:39:10,929 It was kinda foggy that morning, 737 00:39:11,030 --> 00:39:13,366 and it was kinda rolling in and out across the water, 738 00:39:13,466 --> 00:39:16,703 and we didn't know if they were fishing a dead body out, 739 00:39:16,803 --> 00:39:19,239 you know, a floater, they'd found a floater in the water, or what. 740 00:39:20,740 --> 00:39:23,443 And, we kinda hollered, you know, "What are you guys doin'?" 741 00:39:23,543 --> 00:39:25,711 We hollered a few more times, but they acted like 742 00:39:25,811 --> 00:39:27,514 we just didn't even exist. 743 00:39:28,982 --> 00:39:30,817 And the fog came rolling back in on the water 744 00:39:30,917 --> 00:39:33,520 and just kinda covered them up, and they just disappeared into the fog. 745 00:39:36,556 --> 00:39:38,358 I kinda looked at my friend, and I said, "What the hell?" 746 00:39:38,458 --> 00:39:41,695 And, behind us, we heard somebody go, 747 00:39:41,795 --> 00:39:43,930 "Not hell." 748 00:39:44,030 --> 00:39:45,498 And of course, we spun around, it startled us, 749 00:39:45,599 --> 00:39:47,167 all these dead leaves and sticks and stuff, 750 00:39:47,267 --> 00:39:48,869 we didn't think anybody could sneak up on us, 751 00:39:48,969 --> 00:39:51,838 but... then there was nobody there-- there wasn't a soul there at all. 752 00:40:01,281 --> 00:40:03,250 Did you commit murder? 753 00:40:03,350 --> 00:40:05,051 Drowned. 754 00:40:05,151 --> 00:40:06,353 It said swim earlier. 755 00:40:06,354 --> 00:40:07,554 Yeah. 756 00:40:07,654 --> 00:40:08,739 Swim. 757 00:40:08,740 --> 00:40:09,823 Swim? 758 00:40:09,923 --> 00:40:11,992 Swim, drowned, 759 00:40:12,092 --> 00:40:15,528 and now these figures appear on the riverbank. 760 00:40:15,629 --> 00:40:19,699 I can't help but make the obvious connection 761 00:40:19,799 --> 00:40:22,435 between this eyewitness's testimony 762 00:40:22,535 --> 00:40:25,939 in John Murrell's old stomping grounds, the Devil's Punchbowl, 763 00:40:26,039 --> 00:40:28,007 and our own evidence, 764 00:40:28,107 --> 00:40:30,009 which seems to confirm that there is 765 00:40:30,110 --> 00:40:32,612 some kind of intelligent entity 766 00:40:32,712 --> 00:40:34,948 connected to John Murrell's thumb. 57385

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