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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,180 --> 00:00:09,140 This programme contains some strong language. 2 00:00:20,660 --> 00:00:24,580 Three figures, phallic necks. 3 00:00:26,180 --> 00:00:28,740 There's one with a sort of paw on what looks like 4 00:00:28,740 --> 00:00:30,380 a huge scrubbing brush, 5 00:00:30,380 --> 00:00:32,060 which is snarling. 6 00:00:32,060 --> 00:00:38,740 And they're baying their anger, their pain, their distrust of life. 7 00:00:41,220 --> 00:00:44,180 To the people who walked into the Lefevre Gallery that day... 8 00:00:45,380 --> 00:00:48,100 ..that was a shock. I mean, they had never really seen anything like it. 9 00:00:53,620 --> 00:00:56,820 It was just after the war and people didn't want to be disturbed. 10 00:00:56,820 --> 00:00:58,940 They'd been deeply disturbed already. 11 00:01:01,060 --> 00:01:03,300 Something breaks in that painting, 12 00:01:03,300 --> 00:01:04,660 in English culture. 13 00:01:04,660 --> 00:01:06,780 It was as if art had become feral. 14 00:01:08,900 --> 00:01:13,100 Those things are all in the background, they all inform the work. 15 00:01:13,100 --> 00:01:16,940 But you make a mistake if you explain the paintings 16 00:01:16,940 --> 00:01:20,140 through the war. What Bacon did was something different. 17 00:01:25,860 --> 00:01:28,340 So many people of my generation, 18 00:01:28,340 --> 00:01:32,380 that's where they first saw an image by Francis Bacon. 19 00:01:32,380 --> 00:01:35,180 But nobody knew who Francis Bacon was. 20 00:01:38,700 --> 00:01:43,140 Just after the war, my mother had a house in South Kensington, 21 00:01:43,140 --> 00:01:46,820 and I was always watching what was going on outside. 22 00:01:46,820 --> 00:01:52,260 And I remember seeing somebody who was carrying a very large canvas. 23 00:01:52,260 --> 00:01:54,260 And I don't know why I felt it - 24 00:01:54,260 --> 00:01:56,700 "This guy has to be Francis Bacon." 25 00:01:58,300 --> 00:02:01,420 And he went into a house opposite my mother's house, 26 00:02:01,420 --> 00:02:03,620 I was totally fascinated by him. 27 00:02:03,620 --> 00:02:05,300 And we became friends. 28 00:02:06,500 --> 00:02:08,500 He was like no-one else in the world. 29 00:02:10,540 --> 00:02:13,420 He lived in a very grand studio. 30 00:02:13,420 --> 00:02:19,060 Everything was torn, everything was dirty, everything was wonderful. 31 00:02:21,300 --> 00:02:25,100 A lot of incredibly strong cocktails, 32 00:02:25,100 --> 00:02:27,420 so you got plastered pretty quick. 33 00:02:27,420 --> 00:02:31,460 And then Nanny would appear from time to time and say, 34 00:02:31,460 --> 00:02:36,380 "Would anybody like something to, you know, something to smoke?" 35 00:02:36,380 --> 00:02:39,180 And this didn't mean, you know, Player's cigarettes. 36 00:02:39,180 --> 00:02:41,380 MATCH STRIKES AND FLARES 37 00:02:41,380 --> 00:02:43,260 She was his childhood nanny. 38 00:02:43,260 --> 00:02:45,220 I think he adored her. 39 00:02:45,220 --> 00:02:47,940 She was like a mother to him. 40 00:02:47,940 --> 00:02:52,060 Of course, the whole story is... It's so comical, really. 41 00:02:52,060 --> 00:02:54,300 She slept on the kitchen table. 42 00:02:54,300 --> 00:02:55,660 She was totally blind. 43 00:02:56,780 --> 00:03:00,500 How on earth she cooked and how she knew what she was doing, I don't know. 44 00:03:00,500 --> 00:03:04,020 She organised the gambling parties that he gave, 45 00:03:04,020 --> 00:03:06,540 that's one of the ways he made money. 46 00:03:15,340 --> 00:03:19,420 After the war, the entire sort of bohemian London 47 00:03:19,420 --> 00:03:22,740 began to coalesce around the Gargoyle and then, 48 00:03:22,740 --> 00:03:27,380 of course, with the opening of The Colony Room by Muriel Belcher, 49 00:03:27,380 --> 00:03:32,620 that became the epicentre of the lives of most of the painters and, 50 00:03:32,620 --> 00:03:34,860 of course, Francis Bacon was part of that. 51 00:03:34,860 --> 00:03:39,460 I have no earthly idea when I first encountered Francis. 52 00:03:41,820 --> 00:03:44,820 I most remember him in The Colony, 53 00:03:44,820 --> 00:03:47,660 and Muriel said that I was the only person 54 00:03:47,660 --> 00:03:50,540 who was allowed in from the age of 12. 55 00:03:50,540 --> 00:03:55,900 Francis had an extraordinary capacity to take advantage of any situation 56 00:03:55,900 --> 00:03:57,620 in which he found himself 57 00:03:57,620 --> 00:04:00,580 and to turn it into something wonderful 58 00:04:00,580 --> 00:04:01,980 and magical. 59 00:04:01,980 --> 00:04:03,900 And so you were immediately... 60 00:04:04,940 --> 00:04:07,140 ..enchanted by his presence. 61 00:04:09,780 --> 00:04:13,260 He was like a piece of electricity coming into the room. 62 00:04:13,260 --> 00:04:17,620 I mean, charisma poured out of him, you couldn't take your eyes off him, 63 00:04:17,620 --> 00:04:21,780 you know, he darted around like a bird, and these extraordinary eyes. 64 00:04:23,020 --> 00:04:27,900 Muriel offered him a £10 retainer, a week to bring in his friends, 65 00:04:27,900 --> 00:04:29,700 which he proceeded to do. 66 00:04:31,540 --> 00:04:34,140 TRANSLATION FROM FRENCH: 67 00:05:04,660 --> 00:05:07,100 Yes, this was the age of existentialism, 68 00:05:07,100 --> 00:05:11,380 this is the age when everybody thought that this could be the last, 69 00:05:11,380 --> 00:05:16,420 their last moments, so they were living in a very edgy kind of atmosphere. 70 00:05:16,420 --> 00:05:20,100 We do with our life what we can and then we die. 71 00:05:20,100 --> 00:05:22,300 What else can you... What else is there? 72 00:05:22,300 --> 00:05:26,020 And if somebody is very aware of that, perhaps... 73 00:05:27,180 --> 00:05:29,900 Perhaps it comes out in their work. 74 00:05:29,900 --> 00:05:32,660 I think he saw life as a risk. 75 00:05:32,660 --> 00:05:34,500 It also amused him, I think, 76 00:05:34,500 --> 00:05:39,380 the idea that chance played such a big role in everything. 77 00:05:39,380 --> 00:05:42,980 And he certainly applied that to painting. 78 00:05:44,700 --> 00:05:47,500 If anything ever does work, in my case... 79 00:05:49,140 --> 00:05:53,140 ..well, chance and what I call accident takes over. 80 00:05:57,060 --> 00:05:59,860 Certainly, in his painting, I mean, he would... 81 00:06:01,060 --> 00:06:04,060 ..gamble everything on the next brush stroke. 82 00:06:04,060 --> 00:06:06,940 That's always, always going to be exciting, to see somebody in that 83 00:06:06,940 --> 00:06:08,620 situation and, you know, 84 00:06:08,620 --> 00:06:12,300 it's like watching somebody walking the tightrope to see if they succeed or fail. 85 00:06:12,300 --> 00:06:15,860 For instance, that painting in the Museum of Modern Art, 86 00:06:15,860 --> 00:06:19,140 I first tried to do a gorilla in a cornfield. 87 00:06:19,140 --> 00:06:22,060 Then I tried to do a bird alighting. 88 00:06:22,060 --> 00:06:25,660 And then, gradually, all the marks I'd made suggested this other image, 89 00:06:25,660 --> 00:06:28,540 which is a totally accidental image. 90 00:06:28,540 --> 00:06:32,020 I'd never thought of doing an image like that ever in my life. 91 00:06:32,020 --> 00:06:35,220 I can remember, you know, really studying for a long time, 92 00:06:35,220 --> 00:06:38,540 the umbrella in the sides of beef. 93 00:06:38,540 --> 00:06:41,100 And I remember thinking, how's he made that umbrella so terrifying? 94 00:06:41,100 --> 00:06:42,940 It's just such an everyday object. 95 00:06:42,940 --> 00:06:45,900 You know, you get guttural feelings from paintings 96 00:06:45,900 --> 00:06:47,740 and emotional paintings, and it's just paint. 97 00:06:47,740 --> 00:06:51,620 But it's like it doesn't feel like paint, it feels much more violent. 98 00:06:52,740 --> 00:06:56,740 You know, it taps into something in your unconscious, which is dark and, 99 00:06:56,740 --> 00:06:58,020 you know, exciting. 100 00:06:59,580 --> 00:07:05,220 When I met him, I could not equate just the general sort of drunken foolery 101 00:07:05,220 --> 00:07:08,940 that went on, which I found hugely entertaining, 102 00:07:08,940 --> 00:07:11,140 with these twisted horrors. 103 00:07:13,380 --> 00:07:17,060 This is the great central enigma about Bacon. 104 00:07:18,500 --> 00:07:20,940 Where did the darkness come from? 105 00:07:23,380 --> 00:07:28,460 You see, I was born in Ireland, and I was brought up a rabid Protestant... 106 00:07:32,100 --> 00:07:33,580 ..with no beliefs, of course! 107 00:07:38,980 --> 00:07:42,420 Neither my mother or father were Irish 108 00:07:42,420 --> 00:07:45,300 but, nevertheless, I was brought up in Kildare. 109 00:07:46,740 --> 00:07:48,940 My father was a trainer of race horses. 110 00:07:51,020 --> 00:07:53,500 In the last interview that Bacon ever did, 111 00:07:53,500 --> 00:07:55,500 he spoke of his childhood and 112 00:07:55,500 --> 00:08:01,180 said it was like something cold and something hard, like a block of ice. 113 00:08:01,180 --> 00:08:05,460 And he attributed that to his shyness, which came from being asthmatic, 114 00:08:05,460 --> 00:08:09,660 that he could not interact in the world in the same way that ordinary boys could. 115 00:08:11,740 --> 00:08:16,380 Imagine growing up in a particularly horsey outdoorsy world, 116 00:08:16,380 --> 00:08:21,060 and imagine that you have fragile lungs that are pulverised by any sort of dust 117 00:08:21,060 --> 00:08:24,140 and you basically had to gasp your way through life. 118 00:08:24,140 --> 00:08:27,500 This had an enormous influence on Bacon. 119 00:08:29,700 --> 00:08:32,660 In the paintings, I believe it does come across. 120 00:08:32,660 --> 00:08:38,700 It's as though the air has been pumped out, has been sucked out of the space, 121 00:08:38,700 --> 00:08:42,220 and the figures are there, up against the glass, 122 00:08:42,220 --> 00:08:44,220 almost grasping for breath. 123 00:08:45,860 --> 00:08:49,100 He was growing up in Ireland. By the age of 12, 124 00:08:49,100 --> 00:08:52,540 what do you do when you've begun to have homosexual instincts? 125 00:08:54,980 --> 00:08:57,860 It was a deep-seated, deep-rooted problem with his father. 126 00:08:59,860 --> 00:09:03,620 Bacon's father, Eddie, was a very difficult character. 127 00:09:05,740 --> 00:09:08,660 Francis Bacon disappointed him in a major way. 128 00:09:10,820 --> 00:09:12,820 It was a fairly traumatic childhood. 129 00:09:15,100 --> 00:09:18,660 His father got his stable boys to whip him, 130 00:09:18,660 --> 00:09:22,140 and I think that started one or two things off. 131 00:09:22,140 --> 00:09:25,420 He sometimes talked about it and he said, he said it to me privately... 132 00:09:26,460 --> 00:09:27,860 ..that one of his... 133 00:09:30,340 --> 00:09:35,580 ..difficult dynamics in his life was that he really rather hated his father 134 00:09:35,580 --> 00:09:37,860 but he found his father sexually attractive. 135 00:09:37,860 --> 00:09:40,900 Francis was a born masochist. 136 00:09:40,900 --> 00:09:44,700 It wasn't something that he took up later for kicks. 137 00:09:44,700 --> 00:09:47,980 Francis was through and through a masochist. 138 00:09:51,460 --> 00:09:56,140 More interesting, of course, is that he then went into the stables and 139 00:09:56,140 --> 00:09:59,340 had sexual relations with the grooms. 140 00:10:03,780 --> 00:10:08,500 And I think the buggering in the barn was a sort of important aspect 141 00:10:08,500 --> 00:10:09,740 of his background. 142 00:10:11,740 --> 00:10:14,820 It was a very odd sort of situation. 143 00:10:14,820 --> 00:10:16,900 And the father couldn't deal with it. 144 00:10:16,900 --> 00:10:19,460 So he wanted him out of the house... 145 00:10:19,460 --> 00:10:21,660 and try and get him straightened out. 146 00:10:23,100 --> 00:10:24,180 He went to... 147 00:10:25,380 --> 00:10:32,300 ..an older man whom his family, I think, thought would be a good companion for him 148 00:10:32,300 --> 00:10:34,780 but who turned out to be bisexual. 149 00:10:34,780 --> 00:10:39,140 TRANSLATION FROM FRENCH: 150 00:11:01,980 --> 00:11:07,900 He told it without any sense of hurt but, in fact, I think he'd been deeply, 151 00:11:07,900 --> 00:11:10,220 deeply wounded by this, 152 00:11:10,220 --> 00:11:11,460 by this rejection. 153 00:11:14,940 --> 00:11:17,580 Berlin was huge to him, 154 00:11:17,580 --> 00:11:24,660 as it became to a whole generation of homosexuals around his age. 155 00:11:24,660 --> 00:11:30,020 He liked the fascination, the freedom, the absolute lack of... 156 00:11:31,180 --> 00:11:35,060 ..authority, in a way, which was hugely influential on him. 157 00:11:35,060 --> 00:11:40,460 Francis experienced Berlin whilst at its most famously debauched... 158 00:11:41,980 --> 00:11:47,020 ..where there were these crazy bars and sadism was the flavour of the period. 159 00:11:49,100 --> 00:11:55,340 People have attempted to explain Francis Bacon as a revenge motif against his father. 160 00:11:58,620 --> 00:12:01,820 Once he left Berlin, where was his natural proclivity? 161 00:12:01,820 --> 00:12:03,820 It was France. 162 00:12:03,820 --> 00:12:09,580 He saw this as the Olympus of the art world, and Francis Bacon fell in 163 00:12:09,580 --> 00:12:14,300 love with Paris and Parisian art from his first trip there in 1928. 164 00:12:14,300 --> 00:12:16,660 And that was a constant throughout his entire life. 165 00:12:20,020 --> 00:12:23,820 I stayed for a short time in Paris and it was about that time, 166 00:12:23,820 --> 00:12:28,620 at Rosenberg's, I saw an exhibition of Picasso. 167 00:12:28,620 --> 00:12:32,060 And I think, at that moment, I thought, "Well, I will try and paint, too." 168 00:12:34,820 --> 00:12:38,580 Francis Bacon's first career is a bit obscured because what he did in 169 00:12:38,580 --> 00:12:43,500 Paris in his famous trip, once he left Berlin, has been a subject of much mystery. 170 00:12:45,540 --> 00:12:50,180 He did have some connections into the design world of Paris, 171 00:12:50,180 --> 00:12:51,940 we know for sure. 172 00:12:51,940 --> 00:12:56,940 By the time he came to London, a little-known fact that we've discovered, 173 00:12:56,940 --> 00:13:00,620 he established himself in deepest Chelsea and was, for three or four years, 174 00:13:00,620 --> 00:13:05,460 part of a very important design and interior-decorating world. 175 00:13:05,460 --> 00:13:08,940 He kept quiet about all that, he never mentioned it. 176 00:13:10,740 --> 00:13:15,500 Decoration was one of the foulest words in his vocabulary after that. 177 00:13:15,500 --> 00:13:17,900 Something that was decorative, you know, particularly in art, 178 00:13:17,900 --> 00:13:19,780 was like non-existent. 179 00:13:20,980 --> 00:13:25,980 He sensed, quite early on, that he wanted more than that. 180 00:13:25,980 --> 00:13:28,180 Obviously, he had to make his way, you know? 181 00:13:28,180 --> 00:13:31,460 And of course, he made nothing from the painting but the painting soon 182 00:13:31,460 --> 00:13:33,340 became the obsessive thing. 183 00:13:34,460 --> 00:13:38,420 You know, he's almost, like, egging himself on to be confident enough to paint. 184 00:13:38,420 --> 00:13:40,580 And I love those early years' paintings. 185 00:13:41,820 --> 00:13:46,660 I have the 1933 early Crucifixion, the one like the Picasso Bathers. 186 00:13:48,820 --> 00:13:51,100 You know, I can't believe that I own it now. 187 00:13:52,980 --> 00:13:57,060 The first 15, 20 years of his life and career, 188 00:13:57,060 --> 00:13:58,460 so little of it survives. 189 00:13:58,460 --> 00:14:01,140 I mean, the ratio's about one per year. 190 00:14:01,140 --> 00:14:04,340 Between 1936 and 1944, there's an eight-year gap, 191 00:14:04,340 --> 00:14:06,100 we have no works at all. 192 00:14:06,100 --> 00:14:08,020 Now, he wasn't not painting. 193 00:14:08,020 --> 00:14:11,940 But Roy De Maistre, an artist who was extremely fond of Bacon, 194 00:14:11,940 --> 00:14:15,740 he painted a corner of Bacon's painting studio and you see paintings 195 00:14:15,740 --> 00:14:18,700 stacked up in the corner...the corners of the room, 196 00:14:18,700 --> 00:14:19,940 with their faces showing. 197 00:14:19,940 --> 00:14:22,020 We can see what he was painting. 198 00:14:22,020 --> 00:14:23,220 They were all destroyed, 199 00:14:23,220 --> 00:14:27,140 all these things, we have these tantalising glimpses of in another artist's work. 200 00:14:27,140 --> 00:14:32,700 There's the legend that grew up around this, that Bacon himself fostered, 201 00:14:32,700 --> 00:14:35,420 was that he then just walked away from the easel 202 00:14:35,420 --> 00:14:40,260 and only to re-emerge, of course, in the mid-40s with his great Three Studies. 203 00:14:40,260 --> 00:14:43,380 Um, this is not true. 204 00:14:43,380 --> 00:14:47,820 One thing I feel certain about is that he really, really was painting all the time. 205 00:14:47,820 --> 00:14:51,660 He desperately wanted to be, by then, a great artist. 206 00:14:51,660 --> 00:14:53,420 He didn't want to be mediocre. 207 00:14:53,420 --> 00:14:56,580 There are many strains in his earlier painting 208 00:14:56,580 --> 00:14:57,900 that you can trace 209 00:14:57,900 --> 00:15:02,020 in the development and evolution of the look that appeared 210 00:15:02,020 --> 00:15:03,220 in Three Studies. 211 00:15:04,900 --> 00:15:11,380 About 1943-44, it was then that I really started to paint. 212 00:15:11,380 --> 00:15:15,340 When at Lefevre we had that first exhibition 213 00:15:15,340 --> 00:15:17,500 with Henry Moore, Graham Sutherland, 214 00:15:17,500 --> 00:15:20,340 and it was then that I showed those 215 00:15:20,340 --> 00:15:24,980 Three Studies For Figures At The Base Of A Crucifixion, 216 00:15:24,980 --> 00:15:29,980 which... People were very, very violently against those things. 217 00:15:29,980 --> 00:15:34,140 One of the usual bitchy critics, to me, said, 218 00:15:34,140 --> 00:15:38,980 "Why bother to do things like that when it's already been done by Picasso?" 219 00:15:38,980 --> 00:15:44,140 It was Graham Sutherland, I think, who recommended him to Erica Brausen, 220 00:15:44,140 --> 00:15:48,180 who was one of the brightest contemporary art dealers of the time, 221 00:15:48,180 --> 00:15:52,380 and when she saw his work she saw the point of it right away. 222 00:15:52,380 --> 00:15:57,100 She sold his painting 1946 to MoMA 223 00:15:57,100 --> 00:16:01,900 and that really was a very, very signal moment for Francis. 224 00:16:01,900 --> 00:16:06,220 He was always needing money to waste, you know, to gamble away. 225 00:16:06,220 --> 00:16:09,060 He was nothing but trouble to her. 226 00:16:09,060 --> 00:16:12,540 She just tolerated it and helped him as best she could. 227 00:16:12,540 --> 00:16:15,900 She was nurturing, she was devoted to him. 228 00:16:15,900 --> 00:16:18,820 She was a woman who really looked after him. 229 00:16:20,020 --> 00:16:21,700 And he went to Monaco, 230 00:16:21,700 --> 00:16:24,340 and it was the place where English people of his kind went 231 00:16:24,340 --> 00:16:28,180 and, if you wanted to gamble, it was the most glamorous place to go, still, to gamble. 232 00:16:28,180 --> 00:16:30,900 You could gamble in London, for goodness' sake, to some extent. 233 00:16:30,900 --> 00:16:33,820 But this was much more glamorous and much more congenial, 234 00:16:33,820 --> 00:16:35,420 in many other ways. 235 00:16:36,700 --> 00:16:39,180 I mean, it wasn't just Bacon who went to Monaco, 236 00:16:39,180 --> 00:16:42,180 there was this bizarre, probably ghastly, old nanny, 237 00:16:42,180 --> 00:16:44,020 but the one who he really loved. 238 00:16:45,860 --> 00:16:47,420 TRANSLATED FROM FRENCH: 239 00:17:06,660 --> 00:17:09,620 He was terrible about getting paintings in on time. 240 00:17:09,620 --> 00:17:12,780 Brausen was always writing Bacon and saying, you know, 241 00:17:12,780 --> 00:17:14,100 "Francis, please... 242 00:17:16,820 --> 00:17:19,740 "We have a show planned for next December. How's it going?" 243 00:17:19,740 --> 00:17:22,020 And three months later, nothing. 244 00:17:22,020 --> 00:17:24,940 And his typical pattern was that he would destroy all his work 245 00:17:24,940 --> 00:17:28,220 until pretty near to a show when he would have to 246 00:17:28,220 --> 00:17:30,540 produce some paintings, finally. 247 00:17:30,540 --> 00:17:35,780 He was there most of the time between 1946-49, even into early 1950, 248 00:17:35,780 --> 00:17:38,980 and produced almost nothing. 249 00:17:38,980 --> 00:17:41,860 He'd been rethinking what he must do in his art. 250 00:17:41,860 --> 00:17:43,820 He knew he must say something. 251 00:17:43,820 --> 00:17:46,380 It was no use being derivative of Picasso. 252 00:17:46,380 --> 00:17:50,620 And he knew, in fact, his subject must be the human body 253 00:17:50,620 --> 00:17:54,020 and that it must come from his own life and his own experience. 254 00:17:56,900 --> 00:18:00,500 Part of what he had to express needed a new way of painting. 255 00:18:03,620 --> 00:18:06,300 The heads are astonishing. 256 00:18:08,060 --> 00:18:10,180 They're so close to the animal. 257 00:18:10,180 --> 00:18:11,460 The animal in the man. 258 00:18:12,820 --> 00:18:14,820 In those images that Bacon did, 259 00:18:14,820 --> 00:18:18,220 it's as if you can feel the breath of 260 00:18:18,220 --> 00:18:20,300 the animal on your neck. 261 00:18:20,300 --> 00:18:22,540 Or as if you're going into some dark cave 262 00:18:22,540 --> 00:18:25,340 and you smell the animal before you see it. 263 00:18:25,340 --> 00:18:27,780 I mean, it's so visceral. 264 00:18:27,780 --> 00:18:30,220 The animal is so close. 265 00:18:35,740 --> 00:18:38,580 The fact that Francis Bacon had no formal training 266 00:18:38,580 --> 00:18:43,380 probably freed him in a way that other people were not as free. 267 00:18:43,380 --> 00:18:45,900 He was not part of any movement. 268 00:18:45,900 --> 00:18:48,940 Francis Bacon was an outlier in a most interesting way. 269 00:18:48,940 --> 00:18:52,980 I think he probably did go to one or two classes and things like that. 270 00:18:52,980 --> 00:18:55,860 He certainly never mentioned that afterwards, 271 00:18:55,860 --> 00:18:58,900 and he picked up quite a lot from painter friends. 272 00:19:01,340 --> 00:19:04,700 Denis and Francis Bacon came from a similar background. 273 00:19:04,700 --> 00:19:07,420 Both were untrained as artists. 274 00:19:07,420 --> 00:19:10,340 So this was a link, both were self-taught. 275 00:19:10,340 --> 00:19:12,940 Francis Bacon was inevitably 276 00:19:12,940 --> 00:19:15,500 the main event in Denis's life. 277 00:19:17,620 --> 00:19:21,220 Dickie and Denis were the main event in each other's lives. 278 00:19:21,220 --> 00:19:25,500 Richard Chopping, known as Dickie, was his partner. 279 00:19:25,500 --> 00:19:28,820 Bacon could have actually been a hell of a lot of trouble 280 00:19:28,820 --> 00:19:31,180 to the relationship but he wasn't, 281 00:19:31,180 --> 00:19:34,420 and Denis would put up with anything. 282 00:19:34,420 --> 00:19:37,780 Francis would equally put up with anything that Denis threw at him. 283 00:19:37,780 --> 00:19:41,180 And between them, this relationship went like that for many, many years. 284 00:19:41,180 --> 00:19:43,420 When they were partying and drinking together in Soho, 285 00:19:43,420 --> 00:19:44,980 they would come and drag me out, 286 00:19:44,980 --> 00:19:47,660 with them usually six bottles of champagne ahead of me. 287 00:19:47,660 --> 00:19:50,020 And it would end up with punching in the face, 288 00:19:50,020 --> 00:19:52,340 noses being broken in galleries, 289 00:19:52,340 --> 00:19:54,660 there were plates broken on people's heads. 290 00:19:54,660 --> 00:19:58,220 Turned out, banned from places, the stories just go on and on and on. 291 00:19:58,220 --> 00:20:01,460 Do you know, I don't care if I fuck up the whole of the film, 292 00:20:01,460 --> 00:20:04,140 but you can never say things as clearly in French, 293 00:20:04,140 --> 00:20:07,100 as you say it in English. Yes, of course he can. Of course you can't. 294 00:20:07,100 --> 00:20:11,180 Go away, darling. Avec Rembrandt, avec Michel-Ange. 295 00:20:23,180 --> 00:20:25,780 You know, you're going to be cheapened. 296 00:20:25,780 --> 00:20:27,900 OK. Very. I'll be cheapened. Very. 297 00:20:30,300 --> 00:20:33,300 There were a lot of things that they were using 298 00:20:33,300 --> 00:20:35,100 as common subject matter. 299 00:20:35,100 --> 00:20:37,180 They both had boxing magazines. 300 00:20:37,180 --> 00:20:38,780 They had magazines of runners. 301 00:20:38,780 --> 00:20:41,020 They used Eadweard Muybridge's work. 302 00:20:42,500 --> 00:20:47,180 Denis did introduce Francis to Muybridge, arguably the most, with Picasso, 303 00:20:47,180 --> 00:20:49,980 the most important influence on his work. 304 00:20:51,380 --> 00:20:53,460 It's a very interesting work. 305 00:20:53,460 --> 00:20:59,500 And the images were tremendously suggestive to me of ways I could use the human body. 306 00:21:01,980 --> 00:21:05,620 Francis drew badly and was very conscious of it. 307 00:21:05,620 --> 00:21:09,500 And I think facing up to the fact that he had never been taught drawing... 308 00:21:09,500 --> 00:21:15,260 And he used Muybridge's amazing photographs of athletes in weird positions 309 00:21:15,260 --> 00:21:17,820 again and again, 310 00:21:17,820 --> 00:21:21,820 because there the limbs were dead accurate and he could use them, 311 00:21:21,820 --> 00:21:27,180 as it were, as sketches for a whole series of paintings... 312 00:21:27,180 --> 00:21:31,820 though, above all, the painting known as The Buggers. 313 00:21:31,820 --> 00:21:36,780 I used to go and visit Lucien Freud and Caroline Blackwood in their house. 314 00:21:36,780 --> 00:21:41,500 They had the painting which they always called The Buggers, 315 00:21:41,500 --> 00:21:45,860 which was, is, I think, officially called The Wrestlers. 316 00:21:45,860 --> 00:21:49,100 I just simply thought it was a wonderful painting. 317 00:21:49,100 --> 00:21:54,300 I think, that when you're very young, you don't have preconceived 318 00:21:54,300 --> 00:21:57,580 notions of what is shocking. 319 00:22:00,460 --> 00:22:04,100 You just look at things to see if they are beautiful. 320 00:22:05,740 --> 00:22:08,900 There is no doubt that this is Bacon 321 00:22:08,900 --> 00:22:12,220 and the most important lover in his life. 322 00:22:14,260 --> 00:22:16,020 This is their coupling. 323 00:22:16,020 --> 00:22:18,980 This is their moment of greatest intensity. 324 00:22:18,980 --> 00:22:23,260 And this is the trigger, really, of Bacon's greatest images. 325 00:22:23,260 --> 00:22:26,060 It's where everything comes together. 326 00:22:34,220 --> 00:22:39,860 Francis's first major lover was Peter Lacy. 327 00:22:41,100 --> 00:22:43,940 He had been a Spitfire pilot. 328 00:22:43,940 --> 00:22:48,460 Francis was wildly in love. 329 00:22:52,020 --> 00:22:54,300 Bacon found him very charming. 330 00:22:54,300 --> 00:22:57,380 He said he was... He was amusing. 331 00:22:57,380 --> 00:22:59,180 And he played the piano. 332 00:22:59,180 --> 00:23:00,620 He sang. 333 00:23:00,620 --> 00:23:05,740 And Bacon saw him as somebody quite extraordinary. 334 00:23:08,940 --> 00:23:15,020 Other people didn't have this very enamoured view of Peter Lacy. 335 00:23:15,020 --> 00:23:17,700 I remember going to a gay bar, 336 00:23:17,700 --> 00:23:20,700 one evening, and Peter Lacy was there. 337 00:23:20,700 --> 00:23:27,420 He was very, sort of, soberly dressed, very straightforward. 338 00:23:27,420 --> 00:23:34,780 But he turned out to be, in fact, one of the most sadistic people... 339 00:23:36,140 --> 00:23:37,980 ..I've ever come across. 340 00:23:40,460 --> 00:23:45,420 During the war, his nervous system was...was, basically, shot 341 00:23:45,420 --> 00:23:48,500 and he could become very violent. 342 00:23:48,500 --> 00:23:51,500 Francis was landed with a... 343 00:23:52,620 --> 00:23:54,100 ..sadist 344 00:23:54,100 --> 00:23:57,700 who was going to thrash him to bits 345 00:23:57,700 --> 00:24:00,260 and he hadn't got Nanny to fall back on. 346 00:24:01,540 --> 00:24:06,940 When Nanny died - was it 1951? - he was heartbroken. 347 00:24:06,940 --> 00:24:10,500 She was his adviser, she ran his life 348 00:24:10,500 --> 00:24:14,380 and he had to depend on himself. 349 00:24:38,060 --> 00:24:40,780 They had a turbulent relationship. 350 00:24:40,780 --> 00:24:43,620 Lacy regularly beat Bacon up 351 00:24:43,620 --> 00:24:47,660 and that was something that Bacon actively encouraged and enjoyed. 352 00:24:53,100 --> 00:24:57,580 Peter had a house in the country and Francis went there one weekend. 353 00:25:00,100 --> 00:25:05,140 God knows what he'd done to him already but Peter Lacy simply threw him 354 00:25:05,140 --> 00:25:08,500 through a plate-glass window 355 00:25:08,500 --> 00:25:13,340 on the second floor, onto the garden at the back of the house. 356 00:25:13,340 --> 00:25:18,620 And Francis had terrible damage to one eye and to his face and so on. 357 00:25:18,620 --> 00:25:22,380 But this made him love Peter Lacy more, I think. 358 00:25:24,020 --> 00:25:30,460 And he turned these horrible, terrible things into magic, 359 00:25:30,460 --> 00:25:32,820 into great paintings. 360 00:25:35,380 --> 00:25:40,020 Peter himself was very often the subject of any male figure 361 00:25:40,020 --> 00:25:42,900 in the painting. He's always there. 362 00:25:42,900 --> 00:25:48,100 And I think he stirred the very depths of Bacon's being. 363 00:25:48,100 --> 00:25:53,460 He managed to create these very strange, eerie images, 364 00:25:53,460 --> 00:25:56,740 against a dark blue background. 365 00:25:56,740 --> 00:25:58,180 Very ghostly. 366 00:26:02,380 --> 00:26:03,780 Peter Lacy's... 367 00:26:05,180 --> 00:26:09,700 ..power over Francis, sadistic power over Francis... 368 00:26:11,140 --> 00:26:15,020 And I hope it won't shock people - it was a very positive one. 369 00:26:17,940 --> 00:26:21,980 It was regarded as a rather dirty habit, 370 00:26:21,980 --> 00:26:24,060 to go and look at the paintings of Bacon, 371 00:26:24,060 --> 00:26:27,700 because the whole fashion was abstract expressionism 372 00:26:27,700 --> 00:26:29,740 and everything American. 373 00:26:29,740 --> 00:26:33,700 Here was this man actually painting the human figure... 374 00:26:35,020 --> 00:26:39,140 ..in this quite shocking way, at that time. 375 00:26:40,500 --> 00:26:44,260 Bacon had a slowly growing reputation, 376 00:26:44,260 --> 00:26:48,100 but he was an extremely difficult artist. 377 00:26:48,100 --> 00:26:51,340 So it took a great deal of time 378 00:26:51,340 --> 00:26:54,620 for Bacon's imagery to become popular. 379 00:26:54,620 --> 00:26:58,100 But bit by bit, exhibition by exhibition, 380 00:26:58,100 --> 00:27:00,260 collector by collector, 381 00:27:00,260 --> 00:27:02,700 Bacon's reputation was being made. 382 00:27:05,180 --> 00:27:09,860 Peter Lacy said at this particular point, "You can come and live with me." 383 00:27:09,860 --> 00:27:14,100 And Bacon said, "Well, what does living with you mean?" 384 00:27:14,100 --> 00:27:18,620 And Lacy said, "Well, I could chain you to the wall." 385 00:27:18,620 --> 00:27:23,620 And Bacon said, "Well, the thing is, I did terribly want to paint." 386 00:27:26,220 --> 00:27:29,940 And so because of that, Lacy started visiting Tangier. 387 00:27:33,820 --> 00:27:36,620 By that time, the relationship had broken down. 388 00:27:38,260 --> 00:27:41,500 Bacon felt he needed to go to another stage. 389 00:27:41,500 --> 00:27:44,220 He wanted to go to the very top. 390 00:27:44,220 --> 00:27:48,540 And there was a powerful and relatively new gallery 391 00:27:48,540 --> 00:27:50,660 called Marlborough Fine Art. 392 00:27:52,100 --> 00:27:56,180 Bacon had been considering leaving Erica and the Hanover Gallery for some time. 393 00:27:56,180 --> 00:27:58,420 Because he was quite overwhelmed by debts. 394 00:27:58,420 --> 00:28:01,380 The Marlborough Gallery, for example, had deeper pockets, 395 00:28:01,380 --> 00:28:03,140 could pay a kind of salary. 396 00:28:03,140 --> 00:28:06,100 They were like a cash flow for him. 397 00:28:06,100 --> 00:28:09,180 I remember going in with him to pick up a wad of cash 398 00:28:09,180 --> 00:28:12,220 so that he could go on, sort of, inviting everybody in sight 399 00:28:12,220 --> 00:28:16,700 to champagne and dinner afterwards and then go and play the tables. 400 00:28:18,020 --> 00:28:21,660 And the great attraction of the time for the Marlborough was what? 401 00:28:21,660 --> 00:28:23,580 Well, they've got, 402 00:28:23,580 --> 00:28:25,620 as they have galleries all over the world, 403 00:28:25,620 --> 00:28:28,100 perhaps they thought they could do something with me. 404 00:28:30,420 --> 00:28:34,660 Frank Lloyd, the owner, partner of Marlborough... 405 00:28:34,660 --> 00:28:38,900 realised that, I think, that Francis was going to be the golden goose, 406 00:28:38,900 --> 00:28:40,580 if they... 407 00:28:41,660 --> 00:28:42,860 ..marketed properly. 408 00:28:42,860 --> 00:28:45,220 He did need a lot of managing. 409 00:28:45,220 --> 00:28:50,340 And the only release for the paintings came through Valerie. 410 00:28:50,340 --> 00:28:52,500 She was my direct boss. 411 00:28:52,500 --> 00:28:56,500 Francis Bacon's life at Marlborough revolved to a huge extent 412 00:28:56,500 --> 00:28:59,020 around Valerie Beston, or as he called her, 413 00:28:59,020 --> 00:29:00,500 Valerie from the Gallery. 414 00:29:00,500 --> 00:29:02,700 She was always there for him. 415 00:29:02,700 --> 00:29:05,860 It was as if Bacon was the love of her life. 416 00:29:05,860 --> 00:29:09,580 And she was, you know, completely 100% devoted, 417 00:29:09,580 --> 00:29:13,540 in the same way that Erica Brausen had been initially in his career. 418 00:29:13,540 --> 00:29:15,180 I mean, they were saying to Bacon, 419 00:29:15,180 --> 00:29:17,740 we will give you exhibitions at the Tate, 420 00:29:17,740 --> 00:29:20,380 and they absolutely delivered on their promises. 421 00:29:20,380 --> 00:29:24,100 You know, within three years he'd got the first Tate retrospective. 422 00:29:30,980 --> 00:29:34,620 There were many critics who still did not like Bacon's work. 423 00:29:34,620 --> 00:29:39,860 The Tate retrospective in 1962, I think was very important for him. 424 00:29:39,860 --> 00:29:43,220 At that stage Peter Lacy was in Morocco. 425 00:29:43,220 --> 00:29:45,460 A lot of people of that time were saying that 426 00:29:45,460 --> 00:29:48,900 he was just, like, this very sad figure playing away at the piano, 427 00:29:48,900 --> 00:29:51,940 almost like paying off his alcoholic debts. 428 00:29:51,940 --> 00:29:53,900 Francis writes to Denis, saying, 429 00:29:53,900 --> 00:29:55,860 "I've heard that he's falling to pieces. 430 00:29:55,860 --> 00:29:57,220 "Can you find out for me? 431 00:29:57,220 --> 00:29:59,420 "I really need to know, I can't concentrate on anything." 432 00:30:01,220 --> 00:30:02,900 Bacon is 433 00:30:02,900 --> 00:30:06,060 feeling pity for Peter. 434 00:30:06,060 --> 00:30:08,900 "I'm totally upset over Peter. 435 00:30:08,900 --> 00:30:11,220 "I can't bear to see anyone suffer because of me." 436 00:30:12,580 --> 00:30:18,340 I think Bacon created best when he was himself most disturbed, 437 00:30:18,340 --> 00:30:20,380 most at sea. 438 00:30:23,820 --> 00:30:27,460 Francis used to say, "I've used everybody in my life." 439 00:30:30,340 --> 00:30:32,540 He does go into a kind of crisis. 440 00:30:32,540 --> 00:30:36,180 That may have been what was happening with Bacon at that time. 441 00:30:36,180 --> 00:30:40,860 I think that was to do with his inner need to renew his art, 442 00:30:40,860 --> 00:30:44,340 to not repeat himself, to stretch. 443 00:30:48,380 --> 00:30:51,900 He did a painting right before the 1962 Tate exhibition called, 444 00:30:51,900 --> 00:30:56,140 I believe it was called Three Studies for a Crucifixion. 445 00:30:56,140 --> 00:30:59,420 It's an indication of where he wants to go. 446 00:31:01,100 --> 00:31:03,900 It's a blood-red and black triptych. 447 00:31:05,260 --> 00:31:10,180 In the left-hand panel there is a paternal figure, 448 00:31:10,180 --> 00:31:16,220 more or less telling a smaller figure to go. 449 00:31:17,460 --> 00:31:20,980 I've always thought of that as Bacon being thrown out of the house. 450 00:31:22,380 --> 00:31:24,980 In the middle there is a scene, 451 00:31:24,980 --> 00:31:28,340 a really bloody mangled scene on a bed. 452 00:31:29,420 --> 00:31:33,220 It's the most extreme expression of the horror he felt about his life, 453 00:31:33,220 --> 00:31:34,780 I think, and what it felt to be... 454 00:31:35,860 --> 00:31:39,020 ..Francis Bacon and all the horrors he'd witnessed. 455 00:31:39,020 --> 00:31:42,020 And he did describe the central panel 456 00:31:42,020 --> 00:31:44,900 as someone shot to pieces on a bed. 457 00:31:44,900 --> 00:31:47,420 And that's not normal language, not just from him, 458 00:31:47,420 --> 00:31:48,620 but for a Bacon painting. 459 00:31:48,620 --> 00:31:53,020 And in this case, well, it does look like someone shot to pieces on a bed. 460 00:31:53,020 --> 00:31:55,420 It looks like a murder has taken place. 461 00:31:57,060 --> 00:32:01,780 He would almost empty himself of his darkest, 462 00:32:01,780 --> 00:32:06,180 bitterest thoughts on canvas and be purified. 463 00:32:07,580 --> 00:32:10,500 But of course he was Jekyll and Hyde 464 00:32:10,500 --> 00:32:14,340 and so the two sides were there in the man. 465 00:32:17,580 --> 00:32:20,900 I remember going to the big '62 retrospective at the Tate... 466 00:32:22,820 --> 00:32:25,100 ..and I had a very nice girlfriend 467 00:32:25,100 --> 00:32:28,180 who was vegetarian, though she converted, 468 00:32:28,180 --> 00:32:32,020 under my tutelage, to meat, but she didn't convert to Bacon. 469 00:32:33,420 --> 00:32:37,060 I think that was when he really came out as a superstar, 470 00:32:37,060 --> 00:32:38,700 in Britain anyway. 471 00:32:38,700 --> 00:32:42,980 And I think he saw, this was a perfect moment for him to shine and, 472 00:32:42,980 --> 00:32:44,380 my God, shine he did. 473 00:32:49,300 --> 00:32:53,100 But amongst the telegrams of congratulation, 474 00:32:53,100 --> 00:32:55,820 he got one from Tangier saying 475 00:32:55,820 --> 00:32:59,420 that his great love, Peter Lacy, had just died. 476 00:33:02,060 --> 00:33:04,500 Bacon was convinced it was a suicide. 477 00:33:04,500 --> 00:33:06,500 He talked about it as a suicide. 478 00:33:07,740 --> 00:33:12,860 And that Peter almost deliberately aimed for it to happen 479 00:33:12,860 --> 00:33:16,060 on the day his show opened. 480 00:33:18,820 --> 00:33:24,460 The painting of where Peter Lacy is buried was an enormously... 481 00:33:24,460 --> 00:33:29,940 enormously powerful painting, full of, you can't call it love exactly, 482 00:33:29,940 --> 00:33:31,500 but full of... 483 00:33:32,660 --> 00:33:35,780 ..sort of, dark sexual obsession. 484 00:33:42,300 --> 00:33:47,140 The violence in Bacon's pictures calls forth equally violent reactions. 485 00:33:49,220 --> 00:33:51,740 David Sylvester was one of the first critics 486 00:33:51,740 --> 00:33:54,140 to recognise Bacon as an important artist. 487 00:33:54,140 --> 00:33:56,100 Actually in your work, as a whole, 488 00:33:56,100 --> 00:33:58,260 there are relatively few paintings that 489 00:33:58,260 --> 00:34:01,140 have ostensible subjects which might be called horrific. 490 00:34:02,420 --> 00:34:05,500 And most of them are fairly straight subjects, 491 00:34:05,500 --> 00:34:07,260 figures seated in rooms and so on. 492 00:34:07,260 --> 00:34:11,340 And yet, people have a sense that your work as a whole is horrific. 493 00:34:11,340 --> 00:34:14,980 David Sylvester was enormously important 494 00:34:14,980 --> 00:34:18,100 in that he was the PR man for Francis. 495 00:34:18,100 --> 00:34:20,500 And he did a damned good job. 496 00:34:20,500 --> 00:34:22,300 Because he was widely listened to. 497 00:34:22,300 --> 00:34:24,540 He was never off the BBC, where he could, 498 00:34:24,540 --> 00:34:27,380 he could hear the sound of his own voice. 499 00:34:27,380 --> 00:34:29,020 And he was... 500 00:34:30,180 --> 00:34:32,020 ..perfect for Francis. 501 00:34:32,020 --> 00:34:34,100 I must have another drink. 502 00:34:35,700 --> 00:34:37,940 We might rest for a minute. 503 00:34:37,940 --> 00:34:40,980 Can we rest for a moment, or not, or must it go on? 504 00:34:44,540 --> 00:34:48,780 Bacon and Sylvester together created a manifesto 505 00:34:48,780 --> 00:34:51,420 of his inner life as an artist. 506 00:34:52,580 --> 00:34:54,580 Those interviews had a very big impact on many, 507 00:34:54,580 --> 00:34:56,660 especially young artists. 508 00:34:58,580 --> 00:35:01,540 When I was a student I completely devoured the David Sylvester interviews. 509 00:35:01,540 --> 00:35:04,380 It's like I read that constantly, over and over and over again. 510 00:35:04,380 --> 00:35:06,940 I think that was one of the greatest things about Bacon, 511 00:35:06,940 --> 00:35:08,620 was those interviews. Because he... 512 00:35:08,620 --> 00:35:10,460 It was just a new way of being interviewed, 513 00:35:10,460 --> 00:35:13,460 and it was kind of so fresh and exciting and it was like, 514 00:35:13,460 --> 00:35:15,100 you know, playful. 515 00:35:15,100 --> 00:35:16,340 It was like, you know, in denial. 516 00:35:16,340 --> 00:35:18,580 It just made you think differently about the paintings. 517 00:35:18,580 --> 00:35:22,700 He was nothing if not totally controlling 518 00:35:22,700 --> 00:35:25,820 of the people around him and the 519 00:35:25,820 --> 00:35:28,900 way his work was perceived. 520 00:35:28,900 --> 00:35:33,020 But I think Bacon the public persona 521 00:35:33,020 --> 00:35:38,900 was, to some extent, a way of shielding his images. 522 00:35:38,900 --> 00:35:41,660 He was just, you know, finding a way to sort of avoid the questions, 523 00:35:41,660 --> 00:35:44,420 to keep the painting fresh, to keep you looking at the painting, 524 00:35:44,420 --> 00:35:45,980 to never give you answers. 525 00:35:45,980 --> 00:35:48,540 Francis attracted a certain amount of awe. 526 00:35:48,540 --> 00:35:52,220 He was quite a frightening fellow, or had been in his prime. 527 00:35:52,220 --> 00:35:55,100 And also a certain amount of oiling up to. 528 00:35:55,100 --> 00:35:59,380 So I think the cult, or the fame, was built up in the '60s. 529 00:36:05,540 --> 00:36:07,620 He's got his new studio in Reece Mews, 530 00:36:07,620 --> 00:36:10,140 I think it was very important to him. 531 00:36:10,140 --> 00:36:11,940 He felt he'd got his own space, 532 00:36:11,940 --> 00:36:15,780 he could really get to work and do what he wanted to say powerfully. 533 00:36:17,500 --> 00:36:21,140 We are in a wonderful little secret mews 534 00:36:21,140 --> 00:36:25,020 just off of South Ken, called Reece Mews. 535 00:36:25,020 --> 00:36:27,940 I first came to know it when I met Lionel Bart. 536 00:36:27,940 --> 00:36:33,740 His neighbour turned out to be Francis Bacon. 537 00:36:33,740 --> 00:36:35,380 He was very funny. 538 00:36:35,380 --> 00:36:38,420 He was very witty. He was very clever. 539 00:36:38,420 --> 00:36:42,940 But there was a kind of an underlying kind of melancholy about him. 540 00:36:42,940 --> 00:36:46,940 But Lionel Bart told me that in his kitchen there were loads of 541 00:36:46,940 --> 00:36:52,380 photographs, and he'd noticed there were rather a lot of me, you know. 542 00:36:52,380 --> 00:36:54,460 And Lionel said to him, 543 00:36:54,460 --> 00:36:58,900 "Oh, you think... You know, you like Terence?" 544 00:36:58,900 --> 00:37:02,180 And Francis said, 545 00:37:02,180 --> 00:37:06,420 "God, the two most handsomest men in the world 546 00:37:06,420 --> 00:37:10,260 "are Terence Stamp and Colonel Gaddafi!" 547 00:37:10,260 --> 00:37:13,700 I thought, "Yeah, Colonel Gaddafi would give him a good hiding," you know? 548 00:37:13,700 --> 00:37:15,780 HE LAUGHS 549 00:37:15,780 --> 00:37:21,060 I'd just knock on his door if I was passing and if he would open the door, 550 00:37:21,060 --> 00:37:24,100 sometimes he'd invite me in, sometimes he wouldn't. 551 00:37:24,100 --> 00:37:28,580 And sometimes when he invited me in I realised he was the middle of something. 552 00:37:28,580 --> 00:37:33,060 It struck me that it was a very private thing that was happening. 553 00:37:33,060 --> 00:37:37,620 And...he had to devote himself completely to it. 554 00:37:42,780 --> 00:37:47,580 As an artist, Bacon was always trying to do it a bit better, you know? 555 00:37:47,580 --> 00:37:49,500 You know, you've never arrived, 556 00:37:49,500 --> 00:37:51,900 there wouldn't be much point if you'd arrived. 557 00:37:51,900 --> 00:37:54,780 You know, he would have stopped painting in 1962, 558 00:37:54,780 --> 00:37:57,260 or something, if he was satisfied. 559 00:37:57,260 --> 00:38:01,420 How are you going to trap reality? 560 00:38:01,420 --> 00:38:03,100 How are you going to trap appearance 561 00:38:03,100 --> 00:38:05,540 without making an illustration of it? 562 00:38:05,540 --> 00:38:09,340 And that is one of the great fights and one of the great excitements 563 00:38:09,340 --> 00:38:12,260 of being, of being a figurative artist today. 564 00:38:13,860 --> 00:38:18,140 It was a moment that he was beginning to look to 565 00:38:18,140 --> 00:38:21,380 the people that he was friends with, 566 00:38:21,380 --> 00:38:24,380 beginning to think about painting the people 567 00:38:24,380 --> 00:38:26,340 he felt he knew inside out. 568 00:38:26,340 --> 00:38:29,300 I mean, he had a great love of people. 569 00:38:30,780 --> 00:38:32,980 And a vulnerability to them. 570 00:38:32,980 --> 00:38:35,620 The artist doesn't choose the subject, 571 00:38:35,620 --> 00:38:38,180 the subject chooses the artist. 572 00:38:38,180 --> 00:38:40,900 But there was his subject. 573 00:38:40,900 --> 00:38:46,300 I only am able to paint people or portraits of people that I know very well 574 00:38:46,300 --> 00:38:48,620 and I've looked at a great deal. 575 00:38:48,620 --> 00:38:54,620 And that I have analysed, and know the structure of their face. 576 00:38:54,620 --> 00:38:58,180 I find that the person there inhibits me. 577 00:38:58,180 --> 00:39:01,700 And then I use... I look at photographs. 578 00:39:01,700 --> 00:39:04,140 So the photographs and everything get trodden on, 579 00:39:04,140 --> 00:39:06,780 they get even changed into other things. 580 00:39:06,780 --> 00:39:11,620 And those often are in themselves extremely interesting. 581 00:39:13,340 --> 00:39:16,260 The presence of the person in a portrait 582 00:39:16,260 --> 00:39:19,780 is so fully there because he managed to empty himself 583 00:39:19,780 --> 00:39:22,700 of everything, so that that person could come 584 00:39:22,700 --> 00:39:25,340 through him and onto the canvas. 585 00:39:25,340 --> 00:39:29,620 Of course men were a great subject for him, and the male body. 586 00:39:29,620 --> 00:39:32,900 Women were also extremely important to Bacon, 587 00:39:32,900 --> 00:39:36,100 both personally and in terms of his art. 588 00:39:36,100 --> 00:39:41,220 He had a need for family and he sort of put a lot of women into that role. 589 00:39:41,220 --> 00:39:43,620 And he had a number of those throughout his life. 590 00:39:46,260 --> 00:39:49,900 IN FRENCH: 591 00:40:11,100 --> 00:40:13,740 You look at the women he chose to paint, 592 00:40:13,740 --> 00:40:18,580 they have very strong characteristics in common. 593 00:40:18,580 --> 00:40:20,860 Muriel had a very strong visage 594 00:40:20,860 --> 00:40:23,020 that was almost imperial, 595 00:40:23,020 --> 00:40:25,260 and it was easy for him, in a sense, 596 00:40:25,260 --> 00:40:26,860 to convey exactly that 597 00:40:26,860 --> 00:40:29,740 strength of character that she had. 598 00:40:29,740 --> 00:40:33,460 Isabel Rawsthrone was another, 599 00:40:33,460 --> 00:40:37,300 a woman of almost staggering physical presence. 600 00:40:37,300 --> 00:40:40,940 And Henrietta Moraes, who was curvaceous, 601 00:40:40,940 --> 00:40:43,780 but she was also very, very strong. 602 00:40:43,780 --> 00:40:50,660 I first met Henrietta Moraes across a big lunch table 603 00:40:50,660 --> 00:40:55,380 and it was like being opposite a Bacon painting. 604 00:40:55,380 --> 00:40:59,020 I mean, it was almost as if she wasn't real 605 00:40:59,020 --> 00:41:02,260 because of his portraits of Henrietta. 606 00:41:06,660 --> 00:41:10,980 Henrietta is one of the most interesting of the Soho characters. 607 00:41:10,980 --> 00:41:12,620 She, like many others, 608 00:41:12,620 --> 00:41:14,900 could not wait to get away from her convent past 609 00:41:14,900 --> 00:41:17,260 and get into the life of Soho. 610 00:41:17,260 --> 00:41:20,220 Hen? She was amazing, 611 00:41:20,220 --> 00:41:23,540 she was one of the most wonderful people I've ever known. 612 00:41:25,820 --> 00:41:29,820 No wonder Francis adored her, you know? 613 00:41:29,820 --> 00:41:32,300 And Francis understood, you know. 614 00:41:32,300 --> 00:41:37,220 He was Irish, he understood how hard it is 615 00:41:37,220 --> 00:41:43,100 if you've been through that terrible sort of Catholicism thing. 616 00:41:43,100 --> 00:41:48,740 How dreadfully hard it is to break out of it and get free. 617 00:41:48,740 --> 00:41:52,460 He was never burdened by that, was he? He was never burdened by that guilt? 618 00:41:52,460 --> 00:41:55,700 Well, if he was, it was... I think he was a bit. 619 00:41:55,700 --> 00:41:58,460 Actually, I'm sorry, but I think he was. 620 00:42:00,180 --> 00:42:02,860 Henrietta always said to me, 621 00:42:02,860 --> 00:42:06,100 "Ah, yes, perhaps he doth protest too much." 622 00:42:07,460 --> 00:42:10,140 I think he painted Henrietta 15 times. 623 00:42:10,140 --> 00:42:14,980 I mean, his work can be seen as a search for God. 624 00:42:14,980 --> 00:42:19,060 Although he would probably certainly deny it. 625 00:42:19,060 --> 00:42:25,340 His sort of frustration, if you like, with not finding God. 626 00:42:25,340 --> 00:42:27,980 'When you paint anything, you ask the same...' 627 00:42:27,980 --> 00:42:31,180 You are also painting not only the subject, 628 00:42:31,180 --> 00:42:33,660 but you are painting yourself 629 00:42:33,660 --> 00:42:37,860 as well as, as the object that you're trying to record. 630 00:42:45,620 --> 00:42:47,900 One time she didn't like, 631 00:42:47,900 --> 00:42:53,380 was there was one of the pictures where he had a hypodermic in her arm. 632 00:42:53,380 --> 00:42:56,580 It was a hypodermic syringe. BACON: It was a hypodermic syringe. 633 00:42:58,260 --> 00:43:03,100 But I wanted something to nail the image, the figure, as it were, 634 00:43:03,100 --> 00:43:04,940 to the...to the bed. 635 00:43:04,940 --> 00:43:10,100 And it looked more logical with a hypodermic syringe. 636 00:43:10,100 --> 00:43:12,540 I couldn't put a nail through their arm, 637 00:43:12,540 --> 00:43:15,340 so it was much easier to put a hypodermic syringe. 638 00:43:15,340 --> 00:43:18,340 But it wasn't an attempt suggest that the person was a drug addict? 639 00:43:21,420 --> 00:43:24,860 I can see what Francis was getting at, 640 00:43:24,860 --> 00:43:28,900 but I can also see that Henrietta didn't want that. 641 00:43:30,780 --> 00:43:36,140 Henrietta herself later, looking back at it said, you know, in effect, 642 00:43:36,140 --> 00:43:39,700 "Oh, my God, who could have known? This is prescience, 643 00:43:39,700 --> 00:43:43,260 "and it's foreshadowing what was going to happen to my life that was to come," 644 00:43:43,260 --> 00:43:46,380 which was indeed much more druggy than, you know, 645 00:43:46,380 --> 00:43:51,060 Francis Bacon could have anticipated at the time he'd painted it. 646 00:43:51,060 --> 00:43:54,260 You know, we weren't really in the same crowd. 647 00:43:54,260 --> 00:43:57,580 I was much younger. 648 00:43:57,580 --> 00:44:05,060 And I was smoking hash and taking LSD and Francis was a drinker. 649 00:44:05,060 --> 00:44:12,580 But then, once I had left Mick and my life kind of fell apart, really, 650 00:44:12,580 --> 00:44:20,020 and I was living on a wall in St Anne's Court, on heroin. 651 00:44:20,020 --> 00:44:23,380 So I didn't feel the cold. 652 00:44:23,380 --> 00:44:27,940 And I also had, but I didn't know it, anorexia. 653 00:44:27,940 --> 00:44:33,540 And I must have been on Francis's route from the French 654 00:44:33,540 --> 00:44:36,980 to Wheeler's or something like that. 655 00:44:36,980 --> 00:44:40,660 And not all the time, but every now and again 656 00:44:40,660 --> 00:44:45,100 Francis would go past my wall and sort of pick me up 657 00:44:45,100 --> 00:44:48,340 and take me to Wheeler's and feed me. 658 00:44:48,340 --> 00:44:55,460 And the most wonderful thing about it, apart from the food, of course, 659 00:44:55,460 --> 00:44:59,900 was that he never commented or judged 660 00:44:59,900 --> 00:45:05,420 or said anything about my strange life, you know? 661 00:45:05,420 --> 00:45:10,500 Me, at 22, living on a wall in Soho, 662 00:45:10,500 --> 00:45:15,060 with the meths drinkers and all that, you know? 663 00:45:15,060 --> 00:45:19,100 He never made any judgment or said a word. 664 00:45:19,100 --> 00:45:23,500 We had a wonderful time, we talked about absolutely everything. 665 00:45:23,500 --> 00:45:28,340 And that's when I told him about my great-great-uncle Leopold, 666 00:45:28,340 --> 00:45:31,820 which, of course, he knew all about, 667 00:45:31,820 --> 00:45:36,660 and we discussed de Sade and masochism 668 00:45:36,660 --> 00:45:39,940 and lots of very interesting things 669 00:45:39,940 --> 00:45:43,300 that I didn't realise till much later 670 00:45:43,300 --> 00:45:47,860 how interesting they were to Francis, of course. 671 00:45:49,140 --> 00:45:51,500 But I guessed something was up. 672 00:45:56,580 --> 00:45:58,460 He was obsessed by sex. 673 00:46:00,460 --> 00:46:04,900 He was plugged into all sorts of different things 674 00:46:04,900 --> 00:46:08,380 that most people aren't aware of. 675 00:46:10,820 --> 00:46:13,860 When we were out, at certain moments he'd sort of almost 676 00:46:13,860 --> 00:46:17,300 walk through a wall into a different world. 677 00:46:17,300 --> 00:46:19,420 And disappear. 678 00:46:19,420 --> 00:46:21,780 And what happened then, I don't know. 679 00:46:39,860 --> 00:46:43,540 The next day he'd reappear in a damaged state, you know, 680 00:46:43,540 --> 00:46:46,580 barely able to walk or turn his head. 681 00:46:46,580 --> 00:46:51,340 And there was no point in sort of saying, "Well, what happened, Francis?" 682 00:46:51,340 --> 00:46:55,780 Because he'd, at best, he'd just, you know, 683 00:46:55,780 --> 00:47:00,580 he'd just fix you with a sort of basilisk stare and say, "What do you mean?" 684 00:47:07,380 --> 00:47:13,180 I was fast asleep one night when the phone went and Valerie Beston said, 685 00:47:13,180 --> 00:47:16,180 "Paul, quickly, quickly, you've got to come to Reece Mews." 686 00:47:16,180 --> 00:47:18,820 I've got there and he had 687 00:47:18,820 --> 00:47:22,540 a huge injury, right the way across 688 00:47:22,540 --> 00:47:26,020 from his left eye right the way across, 689 00:47:26,020 --> 00:47:27,700 right round the right eye. 690 00:47:27,700 --> 00:47:32,060 All the skin had been broken and he was in a terrible mess. 691 00:47:32,060 --> 00:47:35,340 And I said, "Francis, you need a plastic surgeon." 692 00:47:35,340 --> 00:47:38,340 "No," he said, "you sew me up now." 693 00:47:38,340 --> 00:47:40,700 I said, "I'll put some local anaesthetic in." 694 00:47:40,700 --> 00:47:43,540 He said, "No, I don't want any local anaesthetic." 695 00:47:43,540 --> 00:47:49,340 That's the only time I realised that he quite enjoyed being hurt. 696 00:47:49,340 --> 00:47:53,140 Francis liked the criminal side of London, you know? 697 00:47:53,140 --> 00:47:56,020 He liked the kind of... 698 00:47:56,020 --> 00:47:58,180 sordidness of London, 699 00:47:58,180 --> 00:48:02,140 all that kind of East End dross 700 00:48:02,140 --> 00:48:04,900 and knowing all those kind of people. 701 00:48:06,620 --> 00:48:08,980 Or wanting to know all those kind of people. 702 00:48:13,100 --> 00:48:16,940 George Dyer came on the scene as this 703 00:48:16,940 --> 00:48:23,100 tough, well-built muscular boxer-like East End thug. 704 00:48:23,100 --> 00:48:26,180 And I think through George he, you know, was able... 705 00:48:26,180 --> 00:48:29,340 George and George's family, through all that, 706 00:48:29,340 --> 00:48:32,980 he got to know, you know, quite a lot of bad boys, 707 00:48:32,980 --> 00:48:34,620 including the Krays. 708 00:48:34,620 --> 00:48:38,220 Who did come knocking on his door. Cos they wanted a painting. 709 00:48:39,460 --> 00:48:42,940 I like painting good-looking people. 710 00:48:42,940 --> 00:48:44,620 Because I like their bone structure. 711 00:48:44,620 --> 00:48:46,180 I loathe my own. 712 00:48:48,660 --> 00:48:51,220 But little by little it became apparent 713 00:48:51,220 --> 00:48:53,020 that however sort of virile 714 00:48:53,020 --> 00:48:59,420 and thug-like he looked, he was actually a very nice, lost young man. 715 00:49:01,260 --> 00:49:04,860 George was obviously rather reticent with the whip. 716 00:49:04,860 --> 00:49:06,740 So, little by little, 717 00:49:06,740 --> 00:49:13,620 Francis became disabused because George had been, in that sense, a disappointment. 718 00:49:13,620 --> 00:49:16,060 He was a kind of very feeble East End thug, 719 00:49:16,060 --> 00:49:18,900 and he liked children and animals and cuddling. 720 00:49:18,900 --> 00:49:22,540 Bacon said, "Oh, I hate the billing and cooing of sex. I just like the sex." 721 00:49:22,540 --> 00:49:25,620 And he wanted George to rape him and George wanted to cuddle. 722 00:49:28,220 --> 00:49:32,700 Francis confided just about everything to do with his relationship with George. 723 00:49:32,700 --> 00:49:37,380 And it seemed that the sexual relationship had a real downturn. 724 00:49:38,860 --> 00:49:41,820 George was suffering from erectile dysfunction. 725 00:49:43,900 --> 00:49:47,660 It seems to me that Francis had emasculated George, 726 00:49:47,660 --> 00:49:53,620 he found what he saw as the typical rough East Ender that he longed 727 00:49:53,620 --> 00:49:57,300 to find, and then he did that job of emasculating him. 728 00:49:58,740 --> 00:50:01,460 Francis did his best to make George Dyer 729 00:50:01,460 --> 00:50:05,220 into something. And I think he did that on canvas. 730 00:50:08,060 --> 00:50:12,020 Bacon was violent in the way he painted, 731 00:50:12,020 --> 00:50:15,980 he was sadistic in the way he took apart George 732 00:50:15,980 --> 00:50:18,420 with missing ears and missing jaws 733 00:50:18,420 --> 00:50:21,220 and missing eyes, missing everything, really. 734 00:50:23,140 --> 00:50:26,340 George was a bit appalled by the whole thing. 735 00:50:26,340 --> 00:50:29,780 He saw all of these rich people standing around sort of, you know, 736 00:50:29,780 --> 00:50:33,660 in this smart gallery. 737 00:50:33,660 --> 00:50:37,060 He said to me, you know, "I think they're 'orrible. 738 00:50:37,060 --> 00:50:39,540 "They're really 'orrible." 739 00:50:39,540 --> 00:50:42,060 He said, "And he thinks I look like that!" 740 00:50:44,660 --> 00:50:47,180 George knew all the prices for the pictures. 741 00:50:47,180 --> 00:50:53,540 And he said, "And these people go and pay fucking thousands of pounds for 'em." 742 00:50:55,700 --> 00:50:58,020 I mean, he portrays him as a kind of idiot. 743 00:50:58,020 --> 00:50:59,900 He has things with what looks almost like 744 00:50:59,900 --> 00:51:02,900 a nappy on his head or something. 745 00:51:02,900 --> 00:51:04,940 And dressed as a baby. 746 00:51:04,940 --> 00:51:06,100 I mean, need I say more? 747 00:51:13,900 --> 00:51:20,500 There were certainly moments when things were firing up between them. 748 00:51:20,500 --> 00:51:23,060 They had lovers' tiffs. 749 00:51:23,060 --> 00:51:27,460 The one time when Francis phoned me and said, "You have to come round, 750 00:51:27,460 --> 00:51:30,580 "you have to come round right away because George has gone berserk 751 00:51:30,580 --> 00:51:33,940 "and all my suits are in the bath and he's poured paint all over them 752 00:51:33,940 --> 00:51:35,460 "and he's trampling up and down." 753 00:51:35,460 --> 00:51:37,420 And I went round. 754 00:51:37,420 --> 00:51:42,500 And I couldn't get in because the front door was barred. 755 00:51:42,500 --> 00:51:45,180 So I had to back the vehicle up, 756 00:51:45,180 --> 00:51:49,540 get up onto the roof and go through the window where I was nearly 757 00:51:49,540 --> 00:51:53,060 throttled by George until he realised who it was. 758 00:51:53,060 --> 00:51:54,780 And he had, in fact, 759 00:51:54,780 --> 00:51:58,500 thrown two thirds of the furniture down the staircase. 760 00:52:00,340 --> 00:52:03,900 Dyer is fighting, in a way... 761 00:52:03,900 --> 00:52:06,220 He's just going downhill, downhill, downhill, 762 00:52:06,220 --> 00:52:07,900 it must have been terrible to watch. 763 00:52:07,900 --> 00:52:10,980 So it's almost like a desperate attempt to get back in with Bacon 764 00:52:10,980 --> 00:52:13,780 and show Bacon that he is still a man. 765 00:52:13,780 --> 00:52:17,420 Francis was painting fewer pictures of George. 766 00:52:17,420 --> 00:52:18,860 He was weary of him, I think. 767 00:52:18,860 --> 00:52:23,140 Weary of his problems, of his drinking, of his carousing, 768 00:52:23,140 --> 00:52:25,780 of his unhappiness, perhaps. 769 00:52:25,780 --> 00:52:28,500 His better judgment told him that he needed to be shot of Dyer. 770 00:52:28,500 --> 00:52:31,020 Bacon began moving away from George. 771 00:52:34,140 --> 00:52:37,980 He looked more to Paris, at a time when other British artists were 772 00:52:37,980 --> 00:52:40,380 resolutely not looking to Paris. 773 00:52:41,700 --> 00:52:47,620 I think Bacon's interest in France goes all the way back to 1928, 774 00:52:47,620 --> 00:52:49,740 on his first trip there. 775 00:52:50,820 --> 00:52:53,900 IN FRENCH: 776 00:53:18,700 --> 00:53:21,460 In 1971, getting a show at the Grand Palais 777 00:53:21,460 --> 00:53:24,540 was the great moment of his life. 778 00:53:24,540 --> 00:53:26,340 It was the turning point. 779 00:53:26,340 --> 00:53:30,420 Huge. The first English artist to be offered the Grand Palais. 780 00:53:30,420 --> 00:53:33,420 So, really, really big time. 781 00:53:33,420 --> 00:53:35,260 It was very important this went well. 782 00:53:35,260 --> 00:53:39,340 I understand that the British embassy were very worried in case 783 00:53:39,340 --> 00:53:41,740 a typical Bacon scene erupted and it was, you know, 784 00:53:41,740 --> 00:53:43,980 something terrible happened there. 785 00:53:43,980 --> 00:53:47,660 George, Francis, myself, Miss Beston, 786 00:53:47,660 --> 00:53:51,300 all had rooms in this particular hotel. 787 00:53:51,300 --> 00:53:55,620 Everybody else was saying, "Don't bring George, he'll ruin everything." 788 00:53:55,620 --> 00:53:59,860 Dicky and Denis and some others with Francis had gone out and they saw the venue. 789 00:53:59,860 --> 00:54:05,060 And there was a big red carpet and there were the soldiers standing there. 790 00:54:05,060 --> 00:54:08,380 They all described to me these leather boots up to the knees 791 00:54:08,380 --> 00:54:11,100 and the red stripe up the soldiers' tight trousers. 792 00:54:11,100 --> 00:54:13,140 And they were fairly taken by this. 793 00:54:13,140 --> 00:54:14,660 They said Francis was... 794 00:54:14,660 --> 00:54:17,380 You could see him sort of swell with pride at this. 795 00:54:17,380 --> 00:54:21,140 And they went back to the hotel thinking this was going to be a good evening. 796 00:54:21,140 --> 00:54:23,380 And Francis went up to his room. 797 00:54:23,380 --> 00:54:28,100 There was a stink of drugs, unwashed bodies, dirty sex, and the rent boy, 798 00:54:28,100 --> 00:54:30,860 the very dirty rent boy, who was in there with George. 799 00:54:30,860 --> 00:54:33,580 And Francis was furious. 800 00:54:33,580 --> 00:54:38,940 Dicky, Denis and Francis, they went drinking, they went gambling. 801 00:54:38,940 --> 00:54:42,100 They had a four, five, six-course meal. 802 00:54:42,100 --> 00:54:46,380 They hardly hurried home, knowing that George was in such a bad state. 803 00:54:46,380 --> 00:54:51,820 I can't remember, exactly, the time, but it must have been sort of two o'clock in the morning. 804 00:54:51,820 --> 00:54:55,100 There was a knock at my door and it was Francis. 805 00:54:55,100 --> 00:55:00,180 And he said, could he come and spend the night in my room 806 00:55:00,180 --> 00:55:03,220 cos I had double... You know, two beds. 807 00:55:03,220 --> 00:55:08,140 Because George had brought home an Arab with smelly feet. 808 00:55:09,220 --> 00:55:12,340 And it was so disgusting he couldn't stand it any longer. 809 00:55:16,500 --> 00:55:19,780 And in the morning he said, 810 00:55:19,780 --> 00:55:25,580 "Just go and see if George has got rid of the Arab." 811 00:55:25,580 --> 00:55:29,500 There was no evidence of George being around, you know, 812 00:55:29,500 --> 00:55:33,660 the bed was in a real state of disarray. 813 00:55:35,300 --> 00:55:40,580 And I then checked with Miss Beston around the room, 814 00:55:40,580 --> 00:55:43,620 and looked in the bathroom. 815 00:55:43,620 --> 00:55:46,900 And George was on the toilet. 816 00:55:46,900 --> 00:55:50,100 Apparently Miss Beston pushed him out of the way, went in there, 817 00:55:50,100 --> 00:55:53,540 and did pulses and things like this and said, "No, he's dead." 818 00:55:55,860 --> 00:55:58,940 I never even thought about it being a suicide attempt. 819 00:56:00,140 --> 00:56:01,700 It could well have been. 820 00:56:04,140 --> 00:56:09,020 We thought brought about by him being so drunk 821 00:56:09,020 --> 00:56:12,500 and taking the wrong tablets. 822 00:56:12,500 --> 00:56:14,860 And so she said, "Right, I'll take care of this." 823 00:56:14,860 --> 00:56:16,980 And Terry was pushed out of the way. 824 00:56:16,980 --> 00:56:18,580 And down she went. 825 00:56:18,580 --> 00:56:23,100 And Valerie did the fixing to then make sure that 826 00:56:23,100 --> 00:56:26,100 the death was found two days later. 827 00:56:26,100 --> 00:56:29,500 I think it was a joint decision between Francis, 828 00:56:29,500 --> 00:56:34,180 Valerie and the hotel manager. 829 00:56:34,180 --> 00:56:37,060 Why was that decision made? 830 00:56:37,060 --> 00:56:39,420 It might have put the opening in jeopardy. 831 00:56:41,060 --> 00:56:43,420 It had to be sorted for Francis. 832 00:56:46,020 --> 00:56:49,060 It was bizarre to think that, you know, 833 00:56:49,060 --> 00:56:52,660 this body was going to be left in a hotel room overnight. 834 00:56:57,780 --> 00:57:02,340 You know, it's a hell of a thing to decide not to report a dead body. 835 00:57:02,340 --> 00:57:06,580 Whether that was Bacon's idea, you can't be sure. 836 00:57:06,580 --> 00:57:09,140 You know? I mean, 837 00:57:09,140 --> 00:57:11,220 it looks like maybe that's what happened, 838 00:57:11,220 --> 00:57:12,860 but it's still a hell of a thing. 839 00:57:12,860 --> 00:57:14,700 I mean, that's a crime. 840 00:57:24,860 --> 00:57:29,660 Once the Grand Palais retrospective had opened, 841 00:57:29,660 --> 00:57:32,540 the news began to sort of filter out, 842 00:57:32,540 --> 00:57:36,180 and of course it got round with all the speed of bad news. 843 00:57:36,180 --> 00:57:40,580 During the dinner, the whole room knew that George had committed suicide, 844 00:57:40,580 --> 00:57:43,460 but up until then nobody had heard. 845 00:57:43,460 --> 00:57:46,020 Francis himself was in the Grand Palais. 846 00:57:46,020 --> 00:57:48,980 I think, it was as though he wasn't really there. 847 00:57:48,980 --> 00:57:52,420 He seemed totally abstracted. He was pale, 848 00:57:52,420 --> 00:57:56,020 but he went through with the dinner because he felt that it was better 849 00:57:56,020 --> 00:57:58,700 to go through with it than to cancel. 850 00:57:58,700 --> 00:58:03,180 So, the stories about Francis being told at the opening of his show and 851 00:58:03,180 --> 00:58:06,300 him being so brave and going ahead with the show, 852 00:58:06,300 --> 00:58:09,500 despite having been given this dramatic news, are absolute tosh. 853 00:58:09,500 --> 00:58:12,540 He knew that two days before. Someone may well have gone up to him 854 00:58:12,540 --> 00:58:15,180 and told him the story, but that was a bit of playacting. 855 00:58:15,180 --> 00:58:18,820 There was a picture that the French had bought, a big triptych, 856 00:58:18,820 --> 00:58:24,060 which actually has George sitting on a sort of beautifully painted 857 00:58:24,060 --> 00:58:25,700 creamy white toilet. 858 00:58:25,700 --> 00:58:29,500 And because the French state had just bought it, 859 00:58:29,500 --> 00:58:33,860 President Pompidou paused for a long time in front of that image. 860 00:58:33,860 --> 00:58:38,420 He had to stand there and talk about this image, 861 00:58:38,420 --> 00:58:44,140 knowing that George had recently died in exactly that position. 862 00:58:46,620 --> 00:58:49,540 IN FRENCH: 863 00:59:11,380 --> 00:59:14,020 And it was all... 864 00:59:18,460 --> 00:59:21,500 ..awful and sad. 865 00:59:23,620 --> 00:59:27,420 This tragic event... 866 00:59:29,340 --> 00:59:35,300 ..at the same time, gave him perhaps the deepest 867 00:59:35,300 --> 00:59:38,980 subject he was ever to have in his life. 868 00:59:38,980 --> 00:59:40,500 It seems a bit mad, 869 00:59:40,500 --> 00:59:43,780 painting portraits of dead people. 870 00:59:43,780 --> 00:59:47,580 After all, if their flesh has rotted away... 871 00:59:49,340 --> 00:59:52,060 ..once they're dead, 872 00:59:52,060 --> 00:59:55,140 you have your memory of them, but... 873 00:59:57,900 --> 00:59:59,380 ..you haven't got them. 874 01:00:04,460 --> 01:00:09,380 He actually went back to Paris to absorb the memories, 875 01:00:09,380 --> 01:00:11,860 to relive the events. 876 01:00:11,860 --> 01:00:15,140 And actually stayed in the same hotel 877 01:00:15,140 --> 01:00:17,940 where George had killed himself. 878 01:00:19,780 --> 01:00:26,700 And from this sort of well of guilt and grief he dredged up 879 01:00:26,700 --> 01:00:31,060 these extraordinarily haunting images that are some of, I think, 880 01:00:31,060 --> 01:00:34,940 the most profound images in painting. 881 01:00:39,980 --> 01:00:41,620 When it came into the gallery... 882 01:00:43,020 --> 01:00:45,180 ..and I saw it for the first time... 883 01:00:47,100 --> 01:00:51,380 ..if Francis showed any emotion to the death, 884 01:00:51,380 --> 01:00:53,060 the emotion was in that painting. 885 01:00:55,020 --> 01:00:57,660 Everything that he felt 886 01:00:57,660 --> 01:01:00,380 about George was in those paintings. 887 01:01:02,940 --> 01:01:06,820 Maybe it was just about getting it out of his system. 888 01:01:06,820 --> 01:01:10,620 So, paint them, get them out the studio, 889 01:01:10,620 --> 01:01:12,460 and then maybe I'll feel better. 890 01:01:15,980 --> 01:01:19,980 It got him recognition far beyond anything he'd ever had before. 891 01:01:19,980 --> 01:01:23,060 It was the turning point in sales 892 01:01:23,060 --> 01:01:25,700 and sort of international reputation. 893 01:01:31,420 --> 01:01:33,260 HE YELLS 894 01:01:45,020 --> 01:01:49,300 He was very much collected by very important film directors. 895 01:01:49,300 --> 01:01:52,500 And influenced, of course, in the actual films, 896 01:01:52,500 --> 01:01:54,940 Pasolini and Bertolucci. 897 01:01:56,180 --> 01:01:59,620 He was au courant, you know? 898 01:01:59,620 --> 01:02:02,580 And the power of his paintings fitted the period. 899 01:02:04,620 --> 01:02:07,300 And he's a great inspiration. 900 01:02:16,940 --> 01:02:19,820 'When I made Theorem with Pasolini,' 901 01:02:19,820 --> 01:02:22,980 one day, he just showed up with this book. 902 01:02:22,980 --> 01:02:25,820 And it was a book of Francis's paintings. 903 01:02:25,820 --> 01:02:28,620 And he said, you know, "When you're talking to the son, 904 01:02:28,620 --> 01:02:31,020 "you can kind of be flicking through this." 905 01:02:31,020 --> 01:02:33,580 And I realised, "Oh, he knows about Francis." 906 01:02:33,580 --> 01:02:36,300 It becomes self-perpetuating. 907 01:02:36,300 --> 01:02:41,020 Francis Bacon, who already at that time, late '70s, was famous. 908 01:02:41,020 --> 01:02:42,460 I was right next door. 909 01:02:42,460 --> 01:02:45,220 And people would approach me 910 01:02:45,220 --> 01:02:49,420 to try and get a painting on the cheap 911 01:02:49,420 --> 01:02:51,820 without going through his gallery at Marlborough. 912 01:02:51,820 --> 01:02:54,060 Or to be painted by him. 913 01:02:54,060 --> 01:02:56,300 And I would fix little things for him, 914 01:02:56,300 --> 01:02:59,100 like a leaky pipe, electricity problem. 915 01:02:59,100 --> 01:03:00,980 Or I'd drive him somewhere. 916 01:03:00,980 --> 01:03:04,820 We sort of fairly quickly got over the homosexual vibes, 917 01:03:04,820 --> 01:03:06,460 if I put it that way. 918 01:03:06,460 --> 01:03:10,900 We got into that and I said, I just do not fancy men. 919 01:03:10,900 --> 01:03:16,340 BACON, IN FRENCH: 920 01:03:28,380 --> 01:03:31,620 Bacon became a quite lonely man. 921 01:03:31,620 --> 01:03:37,580 The ageing process is particularly hard on homosexuals. 922 01:03:37,580 --> 01:03:44,460 So, he was in a position of diminished physical beauty, as it were. 923 01:03:44,460 --> 01:03:48,380 I went a few times with Francis to the West End gay clubs. 924 01:03:48,380 --> 01:03:51,140 Sometimes John Edwards was there, sometimes not. 925 01:03:51,140 --> 01:03:53,900 John was like a son he never had. 926 01:03:53,900 --> 01:03:55,180 A friend. 927 01:03:55,180 --> 01:03:58,020 He really, really cared for John. 928 01:03:58,020 --> 01:04:01,700 John Edwards came into his life in a curious fashion. 929 01:04:01,700 --> 01:04:05,340 He ran, or helped to run, a pub in the East End. 930 01:04:05,340 --> 01:04:09,660 And Bacon had been there and said he'd come back with some friends. 931 01:04:09,660 --> 01:04:13,460 And asked John to stock in some champagne. 932 01:04:13,460 --> 01:04:16,660 And then Bacon didn't turn up. John was mightily pissed off. 933 01:04:16,660 --> 01:04:19,900 And at some point, in The Colony Room, told him. 934 01:04:19,900 --> 01:04:21,980 And this amused Bacon. 935 01:04:21,980 --> 01:04:27,060 Within a short space of time, they became inseparable. 936 01:04:27,060 --> 01:04:28,620 They were... 937 01:04:28,620 --> 01:04:30,900 They were a team, like Laurel and Hardy. 938 01:04:30,900 --> 01:04:32,700 They belonged together. 939 01:04:32,700 --> 01:04:37,620 They just became a very unusual loving relationship. But no sex. 940 01:04:37,620 --> 01:04:41,140 The important thing about the Edwards relationship was that it was 941 01:04:41,140 --> 01:04:45,740 paternal, but it's not always clear who is the father and who is the son. 942 01:04:46,980 --> 01:04:48,340 Oh, come in, John. 943 01:04:49,820 --> 01:04:53,100 I'm glad you came down. 944 01:04:53,100 --> 01:04:57,820 John, David is just asking me the most difficult question. 945 01:04:57,820 --> 01:05:00,340 The pictures of Edwards are often 946 01:05:00,340 --> 01:05:03,660 quite eroticised and quite gentle, you know. 947 01:05:03,660 --> 01:05:06,460 Yes, he has pieces of him that disappear, 948 01:05:06,460 --> 01:05:08,500 yes, he might be leaking, his form 949 01:05:08,500 --> 01:05:10,340 might be leaking onto the ground, 950 01:05:10,340 --> 01:05:12,820 but not with the kind of violence or 951 01:05:12,820 --> 01:05:16,820 brutality that you see in Bacon's earlier paintings. 952 01:05:22,580 --> 01:05:25,180 I often think of the Tempest in Shakespeare, 953 01:05:25,180 --> 01:05:32,220 that there's a sort of, almost an eerie calm in Bacon's later work. 954 01:05:32,220 --> 01:05:35,500 There's something rather beautiful and simplified. 955 01:05:39,420 --> 01:05:44,260 A new period, a third period of Bacon's work, the late landscapes. 956 01:05:44,260 --> 01:05:48,140 Bacon only did about ten of them before he died, 957 01:05:48,140 --> 01:05:53,660 but that's a discreet body of late work which is absolutely great, 958 01:05:53,660 --> 01:05:56,260 and some of his greatest work. 959 01:05:56,260 --> 01:05:58,940 He desperately wanted to be a great artist. 960 01:05:58,940 --> 01:06:01,780 He destroyed, right up to the end of his life, 961 01:06:01,780 --> 01:06:03,780 and by then every time he took a knife to a painting, 962 01:06:03,780 --> 01:06:06,660 he'd just thrown away £1 million, 963 01:06:06,660 --> 01:06:09,180 which is really admirable, I think. 964 01:06:10,980 --> 01:06:16,180 By 1982, he was very famous and he couldn't just... 965 01:06:16,180 --> 01:06:19,940 crumple up the canvas and put it in the dustbin outside 7 Reece Mews, 966 01:06:19,940 --> 01:06:22,860 because people were constantly going through his dustbin, 967 01:06:22,860 --> 01:06:25,340 looking for Bacon scraps, OK? 968 01:06:25,340 --> 01:06:28,140 So he wanted them absolutely destroyed. 969 01:06:28,140 --> 01:06:30,380 So he would phone me up and I would 970 01:06:30,380 --> 01:06:32,860 go over right away and I would do it. 971 01:06:32,860 --> 01:06:35,140 And the only way to destroy them was with a Stanley knife, 972 01:06:35,140 --> 01:06:37,260 so you cut into it, cut strips. 973 01:06:37,260 --> 01:06:38,980 Cut all the strips 974 01:06:38,980 --> 01:06:42,820 and then put it in a rubbish bag 975 01:06:42,820 --> 01:06:46,380 and then they were taken over to the Chelsea dump. 976 01:06:46,380 --> 01:06:50,060 And if you gave the man a fiver, who ran the fire, 977 01:06:50,060 --> 01:06:55,060 he would take the bag right in front of your eyes and things would be burnt there, OK? 978 01:06:55,060 --> 01:06:58,100 And then I'd report back to Francis that I did this. 979 01:06:58,100 --> 01:07:00,860 What did it feel like, to destroy? Terrible. 980 01:07:04,140 --> 01:07:09,580 It's... Heart-wrenching, gutting, terrible to destroy a Francis Bacon painting. 981 01:07:09,580 --> 01:07:12,540 And some of them, I obviously looked at them, I thought, "Pretty good. 982 01:07:12,540 --> 01:07:13,820 "I would like to have one." 983 01:07:15,620 --> 01:07:18,980 I didn't, though. No. 984 01:07:18,980 --> 01:07:20,500 Stupid! 985 01:07:21,780 --> 01:07:24,180 IN FRENCH: 986 01:07:30,700 --> 01:07:32,940 What's vultures in French? 987 01:07:49,620 --> 01:07:52,860 Francis trusted John. He would trust John with everything, 988 01:07:52,860 --> 01:07:56,340 from the early point. I remember John coming home and saying, 989 01:07:56,340 --> 01:08:00,300 "Francis told me where he keeps his money, where he keeps this, where he keeps that." 990 01:08:00,300 --> 01:08:03,220 It's quite understandable that the circle would 991 01:08:03,220 --> 01:08:06,620 look like this and say, "Who is he? What's he want? 992 01:08:06,620 --> 01:08:09,900 "Is he trying to take advantage?" 993 01:08:09,900 --> 01:08:13,180 So, yes, there was definitely suspicion. 994 01:08:13,180 --> 01:08:17,820 I must have first met John Edwards with Francis, 995 01:08:17,820 --> 01:08:20,500 presumably in Muriel's. 996 01:08:20,500 --> 01:08:25,260 He thought it was very funny to handcuff me to the bar. 997 01:08:26,820 --> 01:08:29,580 And he said he was going to place a bet. 998 01:08:29,580 --> 01:08:33,220 And I didn't have any appointment or anything I was doing that day, 999 01:08:33,220 --> 01:08:35,580 it was a free day, 1000 01:08:35,580 --> 01:08:38,540 so, I wasn't worried. 1001 01:08:38,540 --> 01:08:41,740 But it took him an hour and a half or a little more 1002 01:08:41,740 --> 01:08:46,700 to place his bet, and so, he eventually 1003 01:08:46,700 --> 01:08:49,100 did reappear, just when I was wondering 1004 01:08:49,100 --> 01:08:52,380 what I would do if I was going to be there for the night. 1005 01:08:52,380 --> 01:08:55,740 It was only one arm, so my drinking arm was free, 1006 01:08:55,740 --> 01:08:58,300 and I was sitting drinking anyhow. 1007 01:08:58,300 --> 01:09:02,300 The most important thing for Francis was that John had enough money to 1008 01:09:02,300 --> 01:09:04,380 last his life. He changed his will. 1009 01:09:04,380 --> 01:09:08,420 When you think of Francis and how complicated his life was, 1010 01:09:08,420 --> 01:09:10,700 this will was one page long, just one page. 1011 01:09:10,700 --> 01:09:15,540 And everything went to John Edwards if he succeeded Francis by three months. 1012 01:09:15,540 --> 01:09:19,780 Francis always made John aware that he would inherit a lot of money. 1013 01:09:23,260 --> 01:09:28,020 Well, Bacon said he thought about death every day of his life. 1014 01:09:28,020 --> 01:09:35,660 And as he aged, it must have become more and more present to him, death, 1015 01:09:35,660 --> 01:09:38,060 and as his friends died, others died... 1016 01:09:38,060 --> 01:09:42,900 The death of Muriel... I think the fading of The Colony 1017 01:09:42,900 --> 01:09:45,980 must have been difficult for Bacon. 1018 01:09:45,980 --> 01:09:49,860 In the '80s, Soho really had ended. 1019 01:09:49,860 --> 01:09:54,140 It was pretty much running on fumes and I think that that had, you know, 1020 01:09:54,140 --> 01:09:59,620 a very depressing influence on Bacon on top of everything else. 1021 01:09:59,620 --> 01:10:03,060 You know, it's - what is it? - 40 years on or something, 1022 01:10:03,060 --> 01:10:08,540 and he would have been reminded greatly about the passing of time. 1023 01:10:08,540 --> 01:10:12,300 Well, I'd seen Bacon around a lot, but I'd never spoken to him 1024 01:10:12,300 --> 01:10:17,060 cos, I guess a kind of hero or something and I was quite young, 1025 01:10:17,060 --> 01:10:20,020 but I used to see him in cafes in Soho. 1026 01:10:20,020 --> 01:10:22,900 And if I'd been out late, I'd end up going early morning into 1027 01:10:22,900 --> 01:10:25,300 a cafe, and sometimes he'd be having breakfast. 1028 01:10:25,300 --> 01:10:28,660 So it was kind of odd to be in the same room as him and not speak to him 1029 01:10:28,660 --> 01:10:32,140 but then, I just thought, what the hell would I say or whatever? 1030 01:10:32,140 --> 01:10:36,100 In his last years, he looked very old and very tired 1031 01:10:36,100 --> 01:10:39,020 and he must have felt very pained 1032 01:10:39,020 --> 01:10:43,020 at that moment, you know, to see the world flashing before his eyes. 1033 01:10:43,020 --> 01:10:45,740 John wasn't always there for him. 1034 01:10:45,740 --> 01:10:49,580 John was there to support him, but he wasn't there 24/7. 1035 01:10:49,580 --> 01:10:52,420 From day one, John had his partner, Philip. 1036 01:10:52,420 --> 01:10:57,900 They'd been together five or six years before Francis came on the scene. 1037 01:10:57,900 --> 01:10:59,340 And that was a no-go area. 1038 01:10:59,340 --> 01:11:01,420 That was John's life, 1039 01:11:01,420 --> 01:11:02,900 Francis was totally aware of that. 1040 01:11:02,900 --> 01:11:06,260 John Edwards was travelling a lot, he didn't live in London, and again, 1041 01:11:06,260 --> 01:11:11,300 I was living 20 metres away from him, so it deepened his trust in me. 1042 01:11:11,300 --> 01:11:16,020 The opportunity came up to arrange a supper party at my place for Francis Bacon. 1043 01:11:16,020 --> 01:11:18,460 So Frederick Ashton had already committed to come, 1044 01:11:18,460 --> 01:11:21,500 who was the great choreographer of the time. 1045 01:11:21,500 --> 01:11:25,540 I was left with an empty seat and I thought, "Who can I invite?" 1046 01:11:25,540 --> 01:11:30,940 Jose Capelo was someone I used to see at first at the Royal Opera House. 1047 01:11:30,940 --> 01:11:32,740 He was interested in art. 1048 01:11:32,740 --> 01:11:35,820 And I phoned Jose and he leapt at the chance. 1049 01:11:35,820 --> 01:11:40,540 And Ashton and Francis took an immediate liking to him. 1050 01:11:40,540 --> 01:11:42,620 And Francis was rather famous, of course, 1051 01:11:42,620 --> 01:11:47,300 for liking a certain amount of roughish trade. 1052 01:11:47,300 --> 01:11:52,540 There was an element of relief with Jose, because Jose was firmly 1053 01:11:52,540 --> 01:11:55,900 well-educated, professional middle class, 1054 01:11:55,900 --> 01:11:58,980 and so was much easier to talk to. 1055 01:11:58,980 --> 01:12:01,700 I think John would have been happy for Francis. 1056 01:12:01,700 --> 01:12:03,700 There was no jealousy there between them. 1057 01:12:03,700 --> 01:12:06,540 Nothing for John to worry about. 1058 01:12:06,540 --> 01:12:09,220 John had all the keys to all the boxes. 1059 01:12:09,220 --> 01:12:14,220 Francis Bacon and Jose Capelo shared a safety deposit box at Harrods. 1060 01:12:14,220 --> 01:12:16,060 They both had keys. 1061 01:12:16,060 --> 01:12:20,780 John wanted the key from Jose. 1062 01:12:20,780 --> 01:12:25,060 Jose was very difficult to read, as far as what really drove him. 1063 01:12:25,060 --> 01:12:28,180 And I never went further. He would clam up. 1064 01:12:28,180 --> 01:12:32,140 They were travelling together. They would go to Venice, Madrid. 1065 01:12:32,140 --> 01:12:34,420 Francis would come back with a big smile on his face. 1066 01:12:34,420 --> 01:12:37,060 He was a happy man. He was in love 1067 01:12:37,060 --> 01:12:41,020 and for Francis, that obviously meant sexually it was going well. 1068 01:12:44,900 --> 01:12:48,340 Yes, in 1988, he's inspired. 1069 01:12:48,340 --> 01:12:51,020 He re-works, re-studies. 1070 01:12:51,020 --> 01:12:53,580 It is not brutish any longer. 1071 01:12:53,580 --> 01:12:58,980 It's as if the monsters have been turned into silk, 1072 01:12:58,980 --> 01:13:02,420 and they no longer are going to jump out of the frame and bite you. 1073 01:13:02,420 --> 01:13:04,660 There is something distant. 1074 01:13:04,660 --> 01:13:06,780 But that is kind of fascinating too, you know? 1075 01:13:06,780 --> 01:13:12,780 I mean, to look at your earlier work, and your earlier 1076 01:13:12,780 --> 01:13:18,540 juicy brutality, and then make it more designed, 1077 01:13:18,540 --> 01:13:23,340 distant, behind glass - it's another feeling. 1078 01:13:23,340 --> 01:13:26,180 HIRST: The Figure At The Base Of A Crucifixion, 1079 01:13:26,180 --> 01:13:28,420 that's just an unbelievable painting. 1080 01:13:29,860 --> 01:13:33,860 I mean, I made a couple of pieces which were directly, you know, 1081 01:13:33,860 --> 01:13:36,180 taken from Bacon paintings. 1082 01:13:36,180 --> 01:13:40,140 Like I made a three-dimensional triptych. 1083 01:13:40,140 --> 01:13:43,980 I saw these kind of terrifying social spaces that Bacon was painting. 1084 01:13:43,980 --> 01:13:46,900 I remember thinking, "I wonder if I could actually make these spaces?" 1085 01:13:46,900 --> 01:13:49,820 I got a phone call from the Saatchi Gallery and they said, 1086 01:13:49,820 --> 01:13:53,100 "Bacon was in today and he was stood in front of your sculpture for an hour." 1087 01:13:53,100 --> 01:13:55,260 I was like, "An hour? No, can't be an hour." 1088 01:13:55,260 --> 01:13:59,060 Around September 1990, we went up to Saatchi's - 1089 01:13:59,060 --> 01:14:01,980 the first time he saw Damien Hirst. 1090 01:14:01,980 --> 01:14:05,700 He liked one piece of Damien Hirst and we came back and we were having drinks. 1091 01:14:05,700 --> 01:14:07,460 After you've drunk a bottle of wine 1092 01:14:07,460 --> 01:14:09,460 you come to things that really matter, 1093 01:14:09,460 --> 01:14:13,100 and it's not looking at Damien Hirst, it's your love affair. 1094 01:14:13,100 --> 01:14:17,300 Jose had framed it like "Francis, I want to stay your friend." 1095 01:14:17,300 --> 01:14:20,300 That means no more sexual relationship. 1096 01:14:20,300 --> 01:14:23,660 And for Francis Bacon, he knew exactly what it meant, and he was devastated. 1097 01:14:23,660 --> 01:14:25,700 So Francis, in his cups... 1098 01:14:27,620 --> 01:14:31,220 ..told me about the relationship and those two years with Jose, 1099 01:14:31,220 --> 01:14:36,060 and the fact that he'd given Jose four million US. 1100 01:14:36,060 --> 01:14:37,940 and two of his paintings. 1101 01:14:39,300 --> 01:14:42,940 I could read his pain, how gutted he was, his anguish. 1102 01:14:42,940 --> 01:14:49,300 Well, I would say he slowly, slowly deteriorated from 1990, 1103 01:14:49,300 --> 01:14:51,900 over the following two years, 1104 01:14:51,900 --> 01:14:55,140 and I took him to one specialist after another 1105 01:14:55,140 --> 01:14:58,220 and none of them could help him. 1106 01:14:58,220 --> 01:15:02,940 He kept saying to me, "I've got to go to Madrid cos I want to see Jose". 1107 01:15:02,940 --> 01:15:05,300 IN FRENCH: 1108 01:15:54,060 --> 01:15:57,100 Finally, Francis Bacon, one of the most highly acclaimed 1109 01:15:57,100 --> 01:15:59,220 British painters this century has died. 1110 01:15:59,220 --> 01:16:02,820 The painter Francis Bacon has died at the age of 82. 1111 01:16:02,820 --> 01:16:04,820 He collapsed while on holiday in Spain. 1112 01:16:04,820 --> 01:16:06,940 It's thought he had a heart attack. 1113 01:16:06,940 --> 01:16:09,500 He kept saying to me, "I've got to see Jose." 1114 01:16:09,500 --> 01:16:13,580 I said, "Francis, whatever you do, don't go to Madrid, 1115 01:16:13,580 --> 01:16:16,220 "because you're not going to survive if you do." 1116 01:16:18,220 --> 01:16:21,460 I was really destroyed when I heard he had died. 1117 01:16:21,460 --> 01:16:24,180 It was really very, very sad. 1118 01:16:24,180 --> 01:16:26,660 But it was inevitable. 1119 01:16:26,660 --> 01:16:31,660 He was reckless about his own life and other people's lives, I think. 1120 01:16:33,060 --> 01:16:35,660 What caused the heart attack? 1121 01:16:35,660 --> 01:16:37,980 Was it... Did Jose and Francis have a huge row? 1122 01:16:39,300 --> 01:16:43,860 And Francis had the heart attack and was whisked off to hospital. 1123 01:16:43,860 --> 01:16:48,820 Francis was in a Catholic hospital being attended by Catholic nuns 1124 01:16:48,820 --> 01:16:50,900 and Jose was not there. 1125 01:16:50,900 --> 01:16:53,180 It's despicable. 1126 01:16:53,180 --> 01:16:55,500 I think that if Bacon is consistent, 1127 01:16:55,500 --> 01:16:58,380 he has to be prepared to die at any time, 1128 01:16:58,380 --> 01:17:01,100 to be taken advantage of at any time, 1129 01:17:01,100 --> 01:17:03,940 for things not to work out at any time, 1130 01:17:03,940 --> 01:17:06,380 and I think he was. He was a gambler. 1131 01:17:06,380 --> 01:17:09,020 He understood that gamblers usually lose. 1132 01:17:11,660 --> 01:17:12,740 The Study Of A Bull, 1133 01:17:12,740 --> 01:17:14,820 the last painting Bacon completed, 1134 01:17:14,820 --> 01:17:16,140 is mostly raw canvas. 1135 01:17:16,140 --> 01:17:17,940 I don't think that's a question of it 1136 01:17:17,940 --> 01:17:19,300 being unfinished in any sense. 1137 01:17:19,300 --> 01:17:24,100 He said what he wanted to say in that top left corner of the painting. 1138 01:17:24,100 --> 01:17:27,500 The bull seems to be shifting between two spaces. 1139 01:17:27,500 --> 01:17:29,140 That seems like life and death. 1140 01:17:29,140 --> 01:17:31,580 And the fact that he used dust as a medium, 1141 01:17:31,580 --> 01:17:34,100 this is the dust to which he will return, 1142 01:17:34,100 --> 01:17:36,900 as indeed he did in Madrid only a few months later. 1143 01:17:50,060 --> 01:17:54,420 Whatever it is, 50 years, 75 years later, 1144 01:17:54,420 --> 01:17:59,980 they seem even more important, more... 1145 01:17:59,980 --> 01:18:02,420 monumental in their effect. 1146 01:18:04,180 --> 01:18:06,900 He seems to have been perceived now 1147 01:18:06,900 --> 01:18:11,020 almost as a kind of religious painter, 1148 01:18:11,020 --> 01:18:14,860 as somebody who emanates out of 1149 01:18:14,860 --> 01:18:17,660 sort of 16th-century Italian painting, 1150 01:18:17,660 --> 01:18:24,580 because it has that degree of passion, martyrdom and torture, 1151 01:18:24,580 --> 01:18:29,740 which is what's so wonderful about Francis's painting, to my mind. 1152 01:18:29,740 --> 01:18:32,060 There's a sort of sacred quality to them. 99440

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