Original subtitles

>> Oprah: NEARLY TWO BILLION PEOPLE AROUND THE GLOBE WATCHED

THEIR WEDDING.

FROM THE OUTSIDE, IT LOOKED LIKE SOMETHING OUT OF A FAIRY TALE

AND APPEARED TO SIGNAL A NEW DAY FOR THE MODERN BRITISH MONARCHY.

>> THIS COUPLE REPRESENTS EVERYTHING PEOPLE CAN CELEBRATE.

>> IT'S A WONDERFUL FAIRY TALE, IT'S...

>> Oprah: THEY BECAME ONE OF THE MOST TALKED ABOUT COUPLES IN THE

MEDIA.

THEN, IN JANUARY 2020...

>> THERE'S BEEN AN ALMOST SHOCKINGLY QUICK TURNAROUND.

>> Oprah: ...HARRY AND MEGHAN STUNNED THE WORLD WHEN THEY

DECIDED TO STEP BACK AS SENIOR MEMBERS OF THE ROYAL FAMILY.

>> MEGHAN SEEMS TO HAVE MOVED FROM THE NATION'S HEROINE TO THE

NATION'S VILLAIN.

>> Oprah: TONIGHT, FOR THE FIRST TIME, THEY TELL THEIR STORY.

I'M SITTING DOWN WITH MEGHAN.

I THINK WHAT WE REALLY HAVE GOT TO CLEAR UP HERE IS THAT YOU,

MEGHAN, ARE THE ONE WHO MANIPULATED, CALCULATED THIS

"MEGXIT."

AND LATER, HARRY JOINS US.

WHAT WAS THE TIPPING POINT?

DID YOU BLINDSIDE THE QUEEN?

>> HI, GIRLS.

>> Oprah: I ALSO VISIT THEM AT HOME, WHERE THEY'RE BEGINNING

THEIR NEW LIFE IN AMERICA.

WHOA!

>> Meghan: I KNOW!

>> Oprah: YOU REALLY ARE HAVING A BABY!

>> Meghan: WE'RE HAVING A BABY!

>> Oprah: THAT'S MORE THAN A BUMP.

>> Meghan: I KNOW.

>> Oprah: WOW.

>> Meghan: YEAH, I KNOW!

HI.

>> Oprah: HUGS, HUGS.

VIRTUAL HUG.

>> Meghan: I KNOW.

>> Oprah: YEAH, DISTANCE HUG.

SO, YOU KNOW, WE'RE-- WE CAN'T HUG BECAUSE WE'RE PRACTICING--

>> Meghan: ALL THE THINGS.

>> Oprah: DOING ALL THE THINGS.

WE'VE BEEN SO STRICT.

EVERYBODY AROUND HERE LITERALLY IS DOUBLE-MASKED AND HAS FACE

SHIELDS.

BUT YOU LOOK LOVELY.

>> Meghan: THANK YOU.

SO DO YOU.

>> Oprah: PREGNANT AND LOVELY.

>> Meghan: THANK YOU, YES.

>> Oprah: DO YOU KNOW IF YOU'RE HAVING A BOY OR GIRL?

>> Meghan: WE DO, THIS TIME.

I WILL WAIT FOR MY HUSBAND TO JOIN US, AND WE CAN SHARE THAT

WITH YOU.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

THAT WOULD BE REALLY GREAT.

I CAN'T WAIT TO HEAR.

SO, BEFORE WE GET INTO IT.

>> Meghan: ( LAUGHS ) YEAH.

>> Oprah: I JUST WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR TO EVERYBODY THAT EVEN

THOUGH WE'RE NEIGHBORS DOWN THE-- I'M DOWN THE ROAD, YOU'RE

UP THE ROAD...

>> Meghan: YEAH.

THIS ISN'T MY HOUSE.

THIS ISN'T YOUR HOUSE.

>> Oprah: THIS ISN'T MY HOUSE.

WE'RE USING A FRIEND'S HOUSE BECAUSE THEY HAD A VERY NICE

PERGOLA.

>> Meghan: BEAUTIFUL.

>> Oprah: THAT THERE HAS NOT BEEN AN AGREEMENT.

YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M GOING TO ASK.

>> Meghan: NO.

>> Oprah: AND THERE IS NO SUBJECT THAT'S OFF LIMITS.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: AND YOU ARE NOT GETTING PAID FOR THIS INTERVIEW.

>> Meghan: ALL OF THAT'S CORRECT.

>> Oprah: ALL OF THAT IS CORRECT.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU READY?

>> Meghan: I AM.

I THOUGHT THAT WAS IT.

I THOUGHT WE WERE DONE NOW...

>> Oprah: ( LAUGHS ) >> Meghan: ...WHEN YOU ASKED

ABOUT BABY, AND WE'RE GOOD TO GO.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

BUT I REMEMBER SITTING IN THE CHAPEL AND-- THANKS FOR INVITING

ME, BY THE WAY.

>> Meghan: YOU'RE WELCOME.

>> Oprah: SO, I WAS THERE ON THAT WEDDING DAY, AND I SO

RECALL THIS SENSE OF MAGIC.

I MEAN, I-- I'VE NEVER EXPERIENCED ANYTHING LIKE IT.

AND WHEN YOU CAME THROUGH THAT DOOR, IT SEEMED LIKE YOU WERE,

LIKE, FLOATING DOWN THE AISLE.

WERE YOU EVEN INSIDE YOUR BODY AT THAT TIME?

>> Meghan: I THOUGHT ABOUT THIS A LOT, BECAUSE IT WAS LIKE

HAVING AN OUT-OF-BODY EXPERIENCE THAT I WAS VERY PRESENT FOR.

AND THAT'S THE ONLY WAY I CAN DESCRIBE IT BECAUSE THE NIGHT

BEFORE, I SLEPT THROUGH THE NIGHT ENTIRELY-- WHICH, IN AND

OF ITSELF, IS A BIT OF A MIRACLE-- AND THEN WOKE UP AND

STARTED LISTENING TO THAT SONG, "GOING TO THE CHAPEL..."

>> Oprah: AH.

>> Meghan: ...AND JUST TRIED TO MAKE IT FUN AND LIGHT AND REMIND

OURSELVES THAT THIS WAS OUR DAY.

BUT I THINK WE WERE BOTH REALLY AWARE, EVEN IN ADVANCE OF THAT,

THIS-- THIS WASN'T OUR DAY.

THIS WAS THE DAY THAT WAS PLANNED FOR THE WORLD.

>> Oprah: EVERYBODY WHO GETS MARRIED KNOWS THAT YOU ARE

REALLY MARRYING THE FAMILY, TOO.

>> Meghan: MM.

>> Oprah: BUT YOU WEREN'T JUST MARRYING A FAMILY.

YOU WERE MARRYING A 1,200-YEAR-OLD INSTITUTION.

YOU WERE MARRYING THE MONARCHY.

WHAT DID YOU THINK IT WAS GOING TO BE LIKE?

>> Meghan: I WILL SAY, I WENT INTO IT NAIVELY...

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: ...BECAUSE I DIDN'T GROW UP KNOWING MUCH ABOUT THE

ROYAL FAMILY.

IT WASN'T SOMETHING THAT WAS PART OF CONVERSATION AT HOME.

IT WASN'T SOMETHING THAT WE FOLLOWED.

MY MOM EVEN SAID TO ME A COUPLE MONTHS AGO, SHE SAID, "DID-- DID

DIANA EVER DO AN INTERVIEW?" NOW, NOW, I CAN SAY, "YES, A

VERY FAMOUS ONE."

BUT MY MOM DOESN'T EVEN KNOW THAT, RIGHT?

>> Oprah: BUT YOU WERE CERTAINLY AWARE OF THE ROYALS.

>> Meghan: YEAH, OF COURSE.

>> Oprah: AND IF YOU'RE GOING TO MARRY A ROYAL, THEN YOU WOULD DO

RESEARCH ABOUT WHAT THAT WOULD MEAN.

>> Meghan: WELL, I DIDN'T DO ANY RESEARCH ABOUT WHAT THAT WOULD

MEAN.

>> Oprah: YOU DIDN'T DO ANY RESEARCH.

>> Meghan: NO.

I'VE NEVER LOOKED UP MY HUSBAND ONLINE.

I JUST DIDN'T FEEL A NEED TO BECAUSE EVERYTHING THAT I NEEDED

TO KNOW HE WAS SHARING WITH ME, RIGHT?

OR EVERYTHING WE THOUGHT I NEEDED TO KNOW HE WAS TELLING

ME.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU DIDN'T HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH YOURSELF OR

TALKING TO YOUR FRIENDS OR THINKING ABOUT WHAT IT'S LIKE,

WHAT IT WOULD BE LIKE TO MARRY A PRINCE, WHO IS HARRY-- WHO YOU

HAD FALLEN IN LOVE WITH-- AND WHAT IT WOULD MEAN TO BE A PART

OF THAT FAMILY?

YOU DIDN'T GIVE IT A LOT OF THOUGHT?

>> Meghan: NO.

WE THOUGHT ABOUT WHAT WE THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

WHICH IS?

THAT'S WHAT-- THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET.

>> Meghan: YEAH, I DIDN'T FULLY UNDERSTAND WHAT THE JOB WAS,

RIGHT?

WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO BE A WORKING ROYAL?

WHAT DO YOU DO?

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

I KNEW THAT HE AND I WERE VERY ALIGNED ON ALL OF OUR

CAUSE-DRIVEN WORK.

THAT WAS PART OF OUR INITIAL CONNECTION AND WHAT WE TALKED

ABOUT IN OUR-- THE BEGINNING OF OUR COURTSHIP.

BUT I THINK THERE WAS NO WAY TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THE DAY-TO-DAY

WAS GOING TO BE LIKE.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: AND IT'S SO DIFFERENT, BECAUSE I DIDN'T

ROMANTICIZE ANY ELEMENT OF IT.

BUT I THINK AS AMERICANS, ESPECIALLY, WHAT DO YOU KNOW

ABOUT THE ROYALS?

IT'S WHAT YOU READ IN FAIRY TALES.

>> Oprah: RIGHT.

>> Meghan: YOU THINK IT'S WHAT YOU KNOW ABOUT THE ROYALS,

RIGHT?

>> Oprah: RIGHT.

>> Meghan: SO, IT'S EASY TO HAVE AN IMAGE OF IT THAT IS SO FAR

FROM-- FROM REALITY.

AND THAT'S WHAT WAS REALLY TRICKY OVER THOSE PAST FEW

YEARS, IS WHEN THE PERCEPTION AND THE REALITY ARE TWO VERY

DIFFERENT THINGS, AND YOU'RE BEING JUDGED ON THE PERCEPTION

BUT YOU'RE LIVING THE REALITY OF IT.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: THERE'S A COMPLETE MISALIGNMENT, AND THERE'S NO WAY

TO EXPLAIN THAT TO PEOPLE.

>> Oprah: WELL, YOU KNOW, IN EVERY FAMILY, I THINK THINGS GET

SERIOUS WHEN YOU ARE BROUGHT IN TO MEET THE MOTHER OR THE

GRANDMOTHER.

>> Meghan: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: AND IN EVERYBODY'S FAMILY WHO'S WATCHING RIGHT

NOW...

>> Meghan: YES.

>> Oprah: ...THE GRANDMOTHER IS THE MATRIARCH AND KNOWN IN MANY

FAMILIES AS "THE QUEEN."

>> Meghan: YEAH.

AND SHE WAS ONE OF THE FIRST PEOPLE I MET.

>> Oprah: IN YOUR SITUATION, IT'S THE QUEEN.

>> Meghan: THE REAL QUEEN, YEAH.

>> Oprah: THE REAL QUEEN THAT YOU'RE-- YOU'RE MEETING.

AND WHAT WAS THAT LIKE?

WERE YOU WORRIED ABOUT MAKING THE RIGHT IMPRESSION?

>> Meghan: THERE WASN'T ACTUALLY A HUGE FORMALITY THE FIRST TIME

I MET HER MAJESTY, THE QUEEN.

I-- WE WERE GOING TO LUNCH AT ROYAL LODGE, WHICH IS WHERE SOME

OTHER MEMBERS OF THE FAMILY LIVE.

SPECIFICALLY, ANDREW AND FERGIE AND EUGENIE AND BEATRICE WOULD

SPEND A LOT OF TIME THERE.

AND EUGENIE AND I HAD KNOWN EACH OTHER BEFORE I HAD KNOWN HARRY,

SO THAT WAS COMFORTABLE, AND WE WERE FRIENDS WITH THEM AS A

COUPLE.

AND THEN, IT TURNED OUT THE QUEEN WAS FINISHING A CHURCH

SERVICE THERE IN WINDSOR, AND SO SHE WAS GOING TO BE AT THE

HOUSE.

AND I REMEMBER HARRY AND I ARE IN THE CAR, AND HE SAYS, "OKAY,

WELL, MY-- MY GRANDMOTHER'S THERE, SO YOU'RE GOING TO MEET

HER."

I GO, "OH, GREAT.

I LOVE GRAND-- I LOVED MY GRANDMOTHER.

I USED TO TAKE CARE OF MY GRANDMOTHER.

THIS IS GREAT."

HE GOES, "RIGHT, DO YOU KNOW HOW TO CURTSY?"

"WHAT?" HE SAID, "DO YOU KNOW HOW TO

CURTSY?" NOW, I THOUGHT GENUINELY THAT

THAT WAS WHAT HAPPENS OUTSIDE.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: I THOUGHT THAT WAS PART OF THE FANFARE OR--

>> Oprah: UH-HUH.

>> Meghan: I DIDN'T THINK THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS INSIDE.

AND I SAID, "BUT IT'S YOUR GRANDMOTHER."

HE GOES, "IT'S THE QUEEN."

>> Oprah: WOW.

>> Meghan: AND THAT WAS REALLY THE FIRST MOMENT THAT THE PENNY

DROPPED, THAT THIS WASN'T-- IT WAS EASY FOR ME UP UNTIL THEN

TO GO-- >> Oprah: SO, DID YOU GOOGLE HOW

TO CURTSY?

>> Meghan: NO, WE WERE IN THE CAR.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

( LAUGHTER ) >> Meghan: WE WERE IN THE CAR.

WE'RE FIVE MINUTES FROM ARRIVING.

>> Oprah: HOW DOES ONE CURTSY?

YES.

>> Meghan: DEEPLY, TO SHOW RESPECT.

AND I LEARNED IT VERY QUICKLY, RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE HOUSE.

WE JUST PRACTICED AND THEN WALKED IN AND--

>> Oprah: YOU AND HARRY PRACTICED.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

AND FERGIE RAN OUT, AND SHE SAID, "ARE YOU READY?

DO YOU KNOW HOW TO CURTSY?" I SAID, "OH, MY GOODNESS, YOU

GUYS."

AND SO, I PRACTICED REALLY QUICKLY, AND WE WENT IN, AND I

MET HER.

AND, APPARENTLY, I-- I DID A VERY DEEP CURTSY...

>> Oprah: ( LAUGHS ) >> Meghan: ...AND I DON'T

REMEMBER IT.

AND THEN, WE JUST SAT THERE, AND WE CHATTED.

AND-- AND IT WAS LOVELY AND EASY AND-- AND I THINK, THANK GOD I

HADN'T KNOWN A LOT ABOUT THE FAMILY.

THANK GOD I HADN'T RESEARCHED.

I WOULD HAVE BEEN SO IN MY HEAD ABOUT ALL OF IT.

I WOULD HAVE HAD A-- >> Oprah: SO, YOU'RE-- YOU'RE--

BASICALLY, WHAT YOU'RE SHARING WITH US IS THAT YOU-- YOU WERE

NO MORE NERVOUS THAN THE REGULAR PERSON WHO GOES TO MEET

SOMEBODY'S GRANDMOTHER.

YOU WEREN'T THAT INTIMIDATED BECAUSE IT WAS THE QUEEN.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

I THINK IT'S-- I THINK IT'S TWO THINGS.

IT'S-- I HAD CONFUSED THE IDEA OF, WELL, I GREW UP IN L.A.

YOU SEE CELEBRITIES ALL THE TIME.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: THIS IS NOT THE SAME, RIGHT?

BUT IT'S VERY EASY, I THINK, ESPECIALLY AS AN AMERICAN, TO

GO, "OH, THESE ARE FAMOUS PEOPLE."

IT'S LIKE, "NO, THIS IS-- THIS IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT

BALLGAME."

>> Oprah: YEAH.

WERE YOU SILENT?

OR WERE YOU SILENCED?

HERE?

WHAT'S THE WORD?

>> Meghan: PEACE.

>> Oprah: PEACE.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: THE DAY AFTER OUR INTERVIEW, I STOPPED OVER TO

HARRY AND MEGHAN'S NEW HOME.

>> Meghan: HI, GUY.

>> Oprah: HI, GUY.

>> Meghan: YEAH, GUY'S BEEN-- GUY'S BEEN THROUGH EVERYTHING

WITH ME.

I MEAN-- >> Oprah: YEAH, HE-- FROM THE

BEGINNING.

FROM THE VERY FIRST DATE, YEAH.

>> Meghan: IF GUY-- I MEAN, I HAD HIM IN CANADA.

I GOT HIM FROM A KILL SHELTER IN KENTUCKY.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: HI, GIRLS!

>> Oprah: WE PUT ON OUR WELLIES TO FEED THE HENS MEGHAN AND

HARRY RECENTLY RESCUED FROM A FACTORY FARM.

I LOVE YOUR LITTLE DESIGNER HOUSE HERE.

"ARCHIE'S CHICK INN."

OH, HOW CUTE IS THAT?

>> Prince Harry: SHE'S ALWAYS WANTED CHICKENS.

>> Meghan: WELL, YOU KNOW, I JUST LOVE RESCUING.

>> Oprah: SO, THIS IS A PART OF YOUR NEW LIFE.

WHAT ARE YOU MOST EXCITED ABOUT?

>> Meghan: WHOOP!

YOU'RE OKAY.

>> Oprah: WHAT ARE YOU MOST EXCITED ABOUT IN THE NEW LIFE?

WHAT ARE YOU MOST EXCITED ABOUT?

HERE, CHICK, CHICK, CHICK, CHICK.

>> Meghan: I THINK JUST BEING ABLE TO LIVE AUTHENTICALLY.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: RIGHT?

LIKE THIS KIND OF STUFF.

IT'S SO-- IT'S SO BASIC, BUT IT'S REALLY FULFILLING, AND JUST

GETTING BACK DOWN TO BASICS.

I MEAN, I WAS THINKING ABOUT IT.

EVEN AT OUR WEDDING, YOU KNOW, THREE DAYS BEFORE OUR WEDDING,

WE GOT MARRIED.

>> Oprah: AH!

>> Meghan: NO ONE KNOWS THAT.

BUT WE CALLED THE ARCHBISHOP, AND WE JUST SAID, "LOOK, THIS

THING, THIS SPECTACLE IS FOR THE WORLD, BUT WE WANT OUR UNION

BETWEEN US."

SO, LIKE, THE VOWS THAT WE HAVE FRAMED IN OUR ROOM ARE JUST THE

TWO OF US IN OUR BACKYARD WITH THE ARCHBISHOP OF CANTERBURY,

AND THAT WAS THE PIECE THAT-- >> Prince Harry: JUST THE THREE

OF US.

>> Oprah: REALLY.

>> Prince Harry: JUST THE THREE OF US.

>> Meghan: JUST THE THREE OF US.

>> Oprah: YOU KNOW, THE WEDDING WAS THE MOST PERFECT PICTURE,

YOU KNOW, ANYBODY'S EVER SEEN.

BUT THROUGH THAT PICTURE THAT WE WERE ALL SEEING, BEHIND THE

SCENES, OBVIOUSLY, THERE WAS A LOT OF DRAMA GOING ON.

AND SOON AFTER YOUR MARRIAGE, THE TABLOIDS STARTED OFFERING

STORIES THAT PAINTED A NOT-SO- FLATTERING PICTURE OF YOU IN

YOUR NEW WORLD.

THERE WERE RUMORS ABOUT YOU BEING "HURRICANE MEGHAN."

>> Meghan: I HADN'T HEARD THAT.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Oprah: SO, THERE WERE RUMORS ABOUT YOU BEING "HURRICANE

MEGHAN" FOR THE DEPARTURE OF SEVERAL HIGH-PROFILE PALACE

STAFF MEMBERS.

AND THERE WAS ALSO A STORY-- DID YOU HEAR THIS ONE-- ABOUT YOU

MAKING KATE MIDDLETON CRY?

>> Meghan: THIS I HEARD ABOUT.

>> Oprah: YOU HEARD ABOUT THAT.

OKAY.

>> Meghan: THIS WAS-- THAT WAS A-- THAT WAS A TURNING POINT.

>> Oprah: THAT WAS A TURNING POINT.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: SIX MONTHS AFTER HARRY AND MEGHAN'S WEDDING, HEADLINES

BEGAN TO SWIRL ABOUT A RIFT BETWEEN MEGHAN AND HER

SISTER-IN-LAW, THE DUCHESS OF CAMBRIDGE, KATE MIDDLETON.

IT WAS REPORTED THAT MEGHAN HAD LEFT KATE "IN TEARS" OVER THE

BRIDE-TO-BE'S "STRICT DEMANDS" OVER FLOWER GIRL DRESSES.

>> Meghan: THE NARRATIVE WITH-- WITH KATE-- WHICH DIDN'T

HAPPEN-- WAS REALLY, REALLY DIFFICULT AND SOMETHING THAT-- I

THINK THAT'S WHEN EVERYTHING CHANGED, REALLY.

>> Oprah: YOU SAY THE NARRATIVE WITH KATE, IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

SO, SPECIFICALLY, DID YOU MAKE KATE CRY?

>> Meghan: NO.

>> Oprah: SO, WHERE DID THAT COME FROM?

>> Meghan: ( SIGHS ) >> Oprah: WAS THERE A SITUATION

WHERE SHE MIGHT HAVE CRIED?

OR SHE COULD HAVE CRIED?

>> Meghan: NO, NO.

THE REVERSE HAPPENED.

AND I DON'T SAY THAT TO BE DISPARAGING TO ANYONE, BECAUSE

IT WAS A REALLY HARD WEEK OF THE WEDDING.

AND SHE WAS UPSET ABOUT SOMETHING, BUT SHE OWNED IT,

AND SHE APOLOGIZED.

AND SHE BROUGHT ME FLOWERS AND A NOTE, APOLOGIZING.

AND SHE DID WHAT I WOULD DO IF I KNEW THAT I HURT SOMEONE,

RIGHT, TO JUST TAKE ACCOUNTABILITY FOR IT.

WHAT WAS SHOCKING WAS-- WHAT WAS THAT, SIX, SEVEN MONTHS AFTER

OUR WEDDING?

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: THAT THE REVERSE OF THAT WOULD BE OUT IN THE WORLD?

>> Oprah: THE STORY CAME OUT SIX, SEVEN MONTHS AFTER IT

ACTUALLY HAPPENED.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: SO, WHEN YOU SAY-- >> Meghan: I WOULD HAVE NEVER

WANTED THAT TO COME OUT ABOUT HER EVER, EVEN THOUGH IT HAD

HAPPENED.

I PROTECTED THAT FROM EVER BEING OUT IN THE WORLD.

>> Oprah: SO, WHEN YOU SAY THE REVERSE HAPPENED, EXPLAIN TO US

WHAT YOU MEAN BY THAT.

>> Meghan: A FEW DAYS BEFORE THE WEDDING, SHE WAS UPSET ABOUT

SOMETHING PERTAINING-- YES, THE ISSUE WAS CORRECT-- ABOUT FLOWER

GIRL DRESSES, AND IT MADE ME CRY, AND IT REALLY HURT MY

FEELINGS.

AND I THOUGHT, IN THE CONTEXT OF EVERYTHING ELSE THAT WAS GOING

ON IN THOSE DAYS LEADING TO THE WEDDING, THAT IT DIDN'T MAKE

SENSE TO NOT BE JUST DOING WHATEVER-- WHAT EVERYONE ELSE

WAS DOING, WHICH WAS TRYING TO BE SUPPORTIVE, KNOWING WHAT

WAS GOING ON WITH MY DAD AND WHATNOT.

>> Oprah: THIS WAS A REALLY BIG STORY AT THE TIME, THAT YOU MADE

KATE CRY.

NOW YOU'RE SAYING YOU DIDN'T MAKE KATE CRY.

KATE MADE YOU CRY.

SO, WE ALL WANT TO KNOW, WHAT WOULD MAKE YOU CRY?

WHAT-- WHA-- WHAT WERE YOU GOING THROUGH-- YOU WERE GOING

THROUGH ALL OF THE ANXIETY THAT BRIDES GO THROUGH PUTTING THEIR

WEDDING TOGETHER AND GOING THROUGH ALL OF THE ISSUES WITH

YOUR FATHER: WAS HE COMING?

WAS HE NOT COMING?

>> Meghan: MM.

>> Oprah: AND THERE WAS A CONFRONTATION OVER THE-- THE

DRESSES.

>> Meghan: IT WASN'T A CONFRONTATION, AND I ACTUALLY

THINK IT'S-- I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR TO HER TO GET INTO THE

DETAILS OF THAT, BECAUSE SHE APOLOGIZED.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Meghan: AND I'VE FORGIVEN HER, RIGHT?

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: WHAT WAS HARD TO GET OVER WAS BEING BLAMED FOR

SOMETHING THAT NOT ONLY I DIDN'T DO BUT THAT HAPPENED TO ME.

AND-- AND THE PEOPLE WHO WERE PART OF OUR WEDDING GOING TO

OUR COMS TEAM AND SAYING, "I KNOW THIS DIDN'T HAPPEN.

I DON'T HAVE TO TELL THEM WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED"--

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Meghan: --"BUT I CAN AT LEAST GO ON THE RECORD AND SAY SHE

DIDN'T MAKE HER CRY."

AND THEY WERE ALL TOLD THE SAME--

>> Oprah: SO, ALL THE TIME THE STORIES WERE OUT THAT YOU HAD

MADE KATE CRY, YOU KNEW ALL ALONG, AND PEOPLE AROUND YOU

KNEW THAT THAT WASN'T TRUE.

>> Meghan: EVERYONE IN THE INSTITUTION KNEW IT WASN'T TRUE.

>> Oprah: SO, WHY DIDN'T SOMEBODY JUST SAY THAT?

>> Meghan: THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

>> Oprah: HMM.

>> Meghan: I'M NOT SHARING THAT PIECE ABOUT KATE IN ANY WAY TO

BE DISPARAGING TO HER.

I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND THE

TRUTH.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: BUT ALSO I THINK A LOT OF IT THAT WAS FED INTO BY

THE MEDIA.

AND, LOOK, I-- I WOULD HOPE THAT SHE WOULD HAVE WANTED THAT

CORRECTED, AND MAYBE IN THE SAME WAY THAT THE PALACE WOULDN'T LET

ANYBODY ELSE-- >> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: --NEGATE IT, THEY WOULDN'T LET HER, BECAUSE SHE'S

A GOOD PERSON.

AND I THINK SO MUCH OF WHAT I HAVE SEEN PLAY OUT IS THIS IDEA

OF POLARITY, WHERE IF YOU LOVE ME, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HATE HER.

AND IF YOU LOVE HER, YOU DON'T NEED TO HATE ME.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

YOU KNOW, THERE WERE SEVERAL STORIES THAT COMPARED HEADLINES

WRITTEN ABOUT YOU TO THOSE WRITTEN ABOUT KATE.

>> Meghan: MM.

>> Oprah: SINCE YOU DON'T READ THINGS, LET ME JUST TELL YOU

WHAT WAS SAID.

>> Meghan: OKAY.

>> Oprah: THERE WERE STORIES WHERE KATE WAS BEING PRAISED FOR

HOLDING HER BABY BUMP.

>> Meghan: OH, GOSH, HAVE I DONE IT SINCE WE'VE BEEN SITTING

DOWN?

>> Oprah: YES, YOU-- YOU'VE BEEN DOING IT THE WHOLE TIME.

>> Meghan: PROBABLY.

OKAY.

>> Oprah: KATE WAS PRAISED FOR CRADLING HER BABY BUMP, AND THE

HEADLINE ABOUT YOU DOING THE SAME THING SAID, "MEGHAN CAN'T

KEEP HANDS OFF HER BABY BUMP FOR PRIDE OR VANITY."

>> Meghan: WHAT DOES IT HAVE TO DO WITH PRIDE OR VANITY?

>> Oprah: WELL, I'M JUST-- I'M JUST TELLING YOU ABOUT THE

STORIES, OKAY?

>> Meghan: OKAY, I HEAR YOU.

>> Oprah: THEN, THERE WAS A WHOLE ONLINE PIECE ABOUT THIS:

KATE EATING AVOCADOS TO HELP WITH MORNING SICKNESS.

>> Meghan: ( LAUGHS ) I HEARD-- OKAY, I HEARD ABOUT

THE AVOCADO ONE.

>> Oprah: BUT YOU WERE EATING AVOCADOS--

>> Meghan: AND FUELING MURDER, APPARENTLY.

>> Oprah: --WOLFING DOWN A FRUIT LINKED TO WATER SHORTAGES,

ILLEGAL DEFORESTATION, AND ENVIRONMENTAL DEVASTATION.

THERE WAS-- SEEMS-- THERE SEEMS TO BE-- THERE WAS A--

>> Meghan: THAT'S A REALLY LOADED PIECE OF TOAST.

( LAUGHTER ) I MEAN, CAN YOU EVEN-- YOU HAVE

TO LAUGH AT A CERTAIN POINT, BECAUSE IT'S JUST RIDICULOUS.

>> Oprah: THAT'S GOOD, "THAT'S A LOADED PIECE OF TOAST."

IT'S ABOUT DEFORESTATION AND-- >> Meghan: OH, MAN!

>> Oprah: OH, WOW.

SO, DO YOU THINK THERE WAS A STANDARD FOR KATE IN GENERAL AND

A SEPARATE ONE FOR YOU?

AND IF SO, WHY?

>> Meghan: I DON'T KNOW WHY.

I CAN SEE NOW WHAT LAYERS WERE AT PLAY THERE.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: AND, AGAIN, THEY REALLY SEEMED TO WANT A

NARRATIVE OF A HERO AND A VILLAIN.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

YOU CAME IN AS THE FIRST MIXED- RACE PERSON TO MARRY INTO THE

FAMILY, AND DID THAT CONCERN YOU IN BEING ABLE TO FIT IN?

AMERICAN.

YOU CAME IN AS AN ACTRESS.

YOU CAME IN AS A DIVORCEE.

YOU CAME IN AS AN INDEPENDENT WOMAN.

YOU CAME IN AS THE FIRST MIXED- RACE PERSON TO MARRY INTO THE

FAMILY.

AND YOURS WAS A DIFFERENT STORY.

>> Meghan: MM.

>> Oprah: AND DID THAT CONCERN YOU IN-- IN BEING ABLE TO FIT

IN?

DID-- DID YOU THINK ABOUT THAT AT ALL?

>> Meghan: WELL, I THOUGHT ABOUT IT BECAUSE THEY MADE ME THINK

ABOUT IT.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: RIGHT?

BUT I THINK, AT THE SAME TIME NOW, UPON REFLECTION, THANK GOD

ALL OF THOSE THINGS WERE TRUE.

THANK GOD I HAD THAT LIFE EXPERIENCE.

THANK GOD I HAD KNOWN THE VALUE OF WORKING.

MY FIRST JOB WAS WHEN I WAS 13, AT A FROZEN YOGURT SHOP CALLED

HUMPHREY YOGART.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: I'VE ALWAYS WORKED.

I'VE ALWAYS VALUED INDEPENDENCE.

I'VE ALWAYS BEEN OUTSPOKEN, ESPECIALLY ABOUT WOMEN'S RIGHTS.

I MEAN, THAT'S THE SAD IRONY OF THE LAST FOUR YEARS IS I'VE

ADVOCATED FOR SO LONG FOR WOMEN TO USE THEIR VOICE, AND THEN I

WAS SILENT.

>> Oprah: WERE YOU SILENT?

OR WERE YOU SILENCED?

>> Meghan: THE LATTER.

>> Oprah: SO, HOW DOES THAT WORK?

WERE YOU TOLD BY THE COMS PEOPLE OR THE-- I DON'T KNOW-- THE

INSTITUTION, THE-- WERE-- WERE YOU TOLD TO KEEP SILENT?

HOW WERE YOU TOLD TO HANDLE TABLOIDS OR GOSSIP?

WERE YOU-- WERE YOU TOLD TO SAY NOTHING?

>> Meghan: EVERYONE FROM-- EVERYONE IN MY WORLD WAS GIVEN

VERY CLEAR DIRECTIVE FROM THE MOMENT THE WORLD KNEW HARRY AND

I WERE DATING TO ALWAYS SAY "NO COMMENT."

THAT'S MY FRIENDS, MY MOM AND DAD.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: AND WE DID.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: I DID ANYTHING THEY TOLD ME TO DO.

OF COURSE I DID, BECAUSE IT WAS ALSO THROUGH THE LENS OF "AND

WE'LL PROTECT YOU."

SO, EVEN AS THINGS STARTED TO ROLL OUT IN THE MEDIA THAT I

DIDN'T SEE BUT MY FRIENDS WOULD CALL ME AND SAY, "MEG, THIS IS

REALLY BAD," BECAUSE I DIDN'T SEE IT, I'D GO, "DON'T WORRY.

I'M BEING PROTECTED."

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: I BELIEVED THAT.

AND-- AND I THINK THAT WAS-- THAT WAS REALLY HARD TO

RECONCILE BECAUSE IT WAS ONLY-- IT WAS ONLY ONCE WE WERE MARRIED

AND EVERYTHING STARTED TO REALLY WORSEN THAT I CAME TO UNDERSTAND

THAT NOT ONLY WAS I NOT BEING PROTECTED BUT THAT THEY WERE

WILLING TO LIE TO PROTECT OTHER MEMBERS OF THE FAMILY, BUT THEY

WEREN'T WILLING TO TELL THE TRUTH TO PROTECT ME AND MY

HUSBAND.

>> Oprah: SO, ARE YOU SAYING YOU DID NOT FEEL SUPPORTED BY THE

POWERS THAT BE, BE THAT THE FIRM, THE MONARCHY, ALL OF THEM?

>> Meghan: IT'S HARD FOR PEOPLE TO DISTINGUISH THE TWO BECAUSE

THERE'S-- IT'S A FAMILY BUSINESS, RIGHT?

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: SO, THERE'S THE FAMILY, AND THEN THERE'S THE

PEOPLE THAT ARE RUNNING THE INSTITUTION.

THOSE ARE TWO SEPARATE THINGS.

AND IT'S IMPORTANT TO BE ABLE TO COMPARTMENTALIZE THAT, BECAUSE

THE QUEEN, FOR EXAMPLE, HAS ALWAYS BEEN WONDERFUL TO ME.

I MEAN, WE HAD ONE OF OUR FIRST JOINT ENGAGEMENTS TOGETHER.

SHE ASKED ME TO JOIN HER, AND I REM--

>> Oprah: WAS THIS ON THE TRAIN?

>> Meghan: YEAH, ON THE TRAIN.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: AND WE HAD BREAKFAST TOGETHER THAT MORNING, AND SHE'D

GIVEN ME A BEAUTIFUL GIFT, AND I JUST REALLY LOVED BEING IN HER

COMPANY.

AND I REMEMBER WE WERE IN THE CAR--

>> Oprah: CAN YOU SHARE WHAT THE GIFT WAS, OR--

>> Meghan: YES.

SHE GAVE ME SOME BEAUTIFUL PEARL EARRINGS AND A MATCHING

NECKLACE.

AND WE WERE IN THE CAR GOING BETWEEN ENGAGEMENTS, AND SHE HAS

A BLANKET THAT SITS ACROSS HER-- HER KNEES FOR WARMTH.

AND IT WAS CHILLY, AND SHE WAS LIKE, "MEGHAN, COME ON," AND PUT

IT OVER MY KNEES, AS WELL.

>> Oprah: OH, NICE!

>> Meghan: RIGHT?

JUST MOMENTS OF-- AND IT MADE ME THINK OF MY GRANDMOTHER WHERE

SHE'S ALWAYS BEEN WARM AND INVITING AND-- AND REALLY

WELCOMING.

>> Oprah: SO, OKAY, SO SHE MADE YOU FEEL WELCOMED.

>> Meghan: YES.

>> Oprah: DID YOU FEEL WELCOMED BY EVERYONE?

IT SEEMED LIKE YOU AND KATE AT THE WIMBLEDON-- WIMBLEDON GAME

WHERE YOU WERE GOING TO WATCH A FRIEND PLAY TENNIS...

>> Meghan: ( LAUGHS ) >> Oprah: ...WAS IT WHAT IT

LOOKED LIKE?

YOU ARE TWO SISTERS-IN-LAW OUT THERE IN THE WORLD, GETTING TO

KNOW EACH OTHER.

WAS SHE HELPING YOU, EMBRACING YOU INTO THE FAMILY, HELPING YOU

ADJUST?

>> Meghan: I THINK EVERYONE WELCOMED ME.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: AND-- AND, YEAH, AND MO-- WHEN YOU SAY "WAS IT WHAT

IT LOOKED LIKE?" MY UNDERSTANDING AND MY EXPERIENCE

OF THE PAST FOUR YEARS IS IT'S NOTHING LIKE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE.

IT'S NOTHING LIKE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE.

AND I-- AND I REMEMBER SO OFTEN PEOPLE WITHIN THE FIRM WOULD

SAY, "WELL, YOU CAN'T DO THIS BECAUSE IT'LL LOOK LIKE THAT.

YOU CAN'T"-- SO, EVEN, "CAN I GO AND HAVE

LUNCH WITH MY FRIENDS?" "NO, NO, NO.

YOU'RE OVERSATURATED.

YOU'RE EVERYWHERE.

IT WOULD BE BEST FOR YOU TO NOT GO OUT TO LUNCH WITH YOUR

FRIENDS."

I GO, "WELL, I HAVEN'T-- I HAVEN'T LEFT THE HOUSE IN

MONTHS."

I MEAN, THERE WAS A DAY THAT ONE OF THE MEMBERS OF THE FAMILY,

SHE CAME OVER, AND SHE SAID, "WHY DON'T YOU JUST LAY LOW FOR

A LITTLE WHILE, BECAUSE YOU ARE EVERYWHERE RIGHT NOW."

AND I SAID, "I'VE LEFT THE HOUSE TWICE IN FOUR MONTHS.

I'M EVERYWHERE, BUT I AM NOWHERE."

AND FROM THAT STANDPOINT, I CONTINUED TO SAY TO PEOPLE, "I

KNOW THERE'S AN OBSESSION WITH HOW THINGS LOOK, BUT HAS ANYONE

TALKED ABOUT HOW IT FEELS?

BECAUSE RIGHT NOW, I COULD NOT FEEL LONELIER."

>> Oprah: HMM.

YOU WERE FEELING LONELY, EVEN THOUGH YOUR-- YOUR PRINCE,

YOU'RE IN LOVE, YOU'RE WITH HIM.

>> Meghan: I'M NOT LONELY-- I WASN'T LONELY WITH HIM.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: THERE WERE MOMENTS THAT HE HAD TO WORK OR HE HAD TO

GO AWAY.

THERE'S-- THERE'S MOMENTS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT.

AND SO, THERE WAS VERY LITTLE THAT I WAS ALLOWED TO DO.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: AND SO, YEAH, OF COURSE THAT BREEDS LONELINESS

WHEN YOU'VE COME FROM SUCH A FULL LIFE OR WHEN YOU'VE COME

FROM FREEDOM.

I-- I THINK THE EASIEST WAY THAT NOW PEOPLE CAN UNDERSTAND IT IS

WHAT WE'VE ALL GONE THROUGH IN LOCKDOWN.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

WELL, EVERYBODY CAN CERTAINLY RELATE NOW.

>> Meghan: IN THOSE MONTHS WHEN I WAS PREGNANT, ALL AROUND THIS

SAME TIME, SO WE HAVE IN TANDEM THE CONVERSATION OF "HE WON'T BE

GIVEN SECURITY.

HE'S NOT GOING TO BE GIVEN A TITLE," AND ALSO CONCERNS AND

CONVERSATIONS ABOUT HOW DARK HIS SKIN MIGHT BE WHEN HE'S BORN.

>> Oprah: WHAT?

ASKED IF I'M OKAY, BUT IT'S A VERY REAL THING TO BE GOING

THROUGH BEHIND THE SCENES.

>> AND THE ANSWER IS, WOULD IT BE FAIR TO SAY, "NOT REALLY

OKAY," AS IN IT'S REALLY BEEN A STRUGGLE?

>> Meghan: YES.

>> Oprah: WELL, I WOULD HAVE TO SAY, IN SOUTH AFRICA, WHEN THE

REPORTER STOPPED AND ASKED "ARE YOU OKAY..."

>> Meghan: MM.

>> Oprah: AND, WHOO, WE ALL FELT THAT.

WHY DID THAT QUESTION STRIKE SUCH A NERVE?

WHAT WAS GOING ON WITH YOU INTERNALLY AT THAT TIME?

>> Meghan: THAT WAS THE LAST DAY OF THE TOUR.

YOU KNOW, THOSE TOURS ARE-- I'M SURE THEY HAVE BEAUTIFUL

PICTURES AND IT LOOKS VIBRANT, AND ALL OF THAT IS TRUE.

IT'S ALSO REALLY EXHAUSTING.

SO, I WAS FRIED, AND I THINK IT JUST HIT ME SO HARD BECAUSE WE

WERE MAKING IT LOOK LIKE EVERYTHING WAS FINE.

I CAN UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE WERE REALLY SURPRISED TO SEE THAT

THERE WAS PAIN THERE...

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: ...BECAUSE WE WERE DOING OUR JOB.

OUR JOB WAS TO BE ON AND TO SMILE.

AND SO, WHEN HE ASKED ME THAT, I GUESS I HAD FELT THAT IT HAD

NEVER OCCURRED TO ANYONE THAT I-- THAT I WASN'T OKAY AND THAT

I HAD REALLY BEEN SUFFERING.

AND I HAD KNOWN FOR A LONG TIME AND HAD BEEN ASKING THE

INSTITUTION FOR HELP FOR QUITE A LONG TIME.

>> Oprah: HELP FOR WHAT?

>> Meghan: AFTER WE HAD GOTTEN BACK FROM OUR AUSTRALIA TOUR--

WHICH WAS ABOUT A YEAR BEFORE THAT-- AND WE TALKED ABOUT WHEN

THINGS REALLY STARTED TO TURN, WHEN I KNEW WE WEREN'T BEING

PROTECTED.

AND IT WAS DURING THAT PART OF MY PREGNANCY, ESPECIALLY, THAT I

STARTED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT OUR CONTINUED REALITY WAS GOING TO

LOOK LIKE.

>> Oprah: WHAT KIND OF PROTECTION DID YOU WANT THAT YOU

FEEL YOU DIDN'T RECEIVE?

>> Meghan: I MEAN, THEY WOULD GO ON THE RECORD AND NEGATE THE

MOST RIDICULOUS STORY FOR ANYONE, RIGHT?

I'M TALKING ABOUT THINGS THAT ARE SUPER ARTIFICIAL AND

INCONSEQUENTIAL.

BUT THE NARRATIVE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, MAKING KATE CRY I THINK

WAS THE BEGINNING OF A REAL CHARACTER ASSASSINATION.

AND THEY KNEW IT WASN'T TRUE.

AND I THOUGHT, WELL, IF THEY'RE NOT GOING TO KILL THINGS LIKE

THAT, THEN WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO?

SEPARATE FROM THAT, AND WHAT WAS HAPPENING BEHIND CLOSED DOORS

WAS, YOU KNOW, WE KNEW I WAS PREGNANT.

WE NOW KNOW IT'S ARCHIE, AND IT WAS A BOY.

WE DIDN'T KNOW ANY OF THAT AT THE TIME.

WE CAN JUST TALK ABOUT IT AS ARCHIE NOW.

AND THAT WAS WHEN THEY WERE SAYING THEY DIDN'T WANT HIM TO

BE A PRINCE OR A PRINCESS-- NOT KNOWING WHAT THE GENDER WOULD

BE, WHICH WOULD BE DIFFERENT FROM PROTOCOL-- AND THAT HE

WASN'T GOING TO RECEIVE SECURITY.

>> Oprah: WHAT?

>> Meghan: IT WAS REALLY HARD.

>> Oprah: WHAT DO YOU MEAN?

>> Meghan: HE WASN'T GOING TO RECEIVE SECURITY.

THIS WENT ON FOR THE LAST FEW MONTHS OF OUR PREGNANCY WHERE

I'M GOING, "HOLD ON A SECOND."

>> Oprah: THAT YOUR SON AND HARRY-- PRINCE HARRY'S SON WAS

NOT GOING TO RECEIVE SECURITY?

>> Meghan: THAT'S RIGHT.

I KNOW.

>> Oprah: HOW-- BUT HOW DOES THAT WORK?

>> Meghan: HOW DOES THAT WORK?

IT'S LIKE, "NO, NO, NO, LOOK-- BECAUSE IF HE'S NOT GOING TO BE

A PRINCE," IT'S LIKE, OKAY, WELL, HE NEEDS TO BE SAFE, SO

WE'RE NOT SAYING "DON'T MAKE HIM A PRINCE OR A PRINCESS"--

WHATEVER IT'S GOING TO BE.

BUT IF YOU'RE SAYING THE TITLE IS WHAT'S GOING TO AFFECT THEIR

PROTECTION, WE HAVEN'T CREATED THIS MONSTER MACHINE AROUND US

IN TERMS OF CLICKBAIT AND TABLOID FODDER.

YOU'VE ALLOWED THAT TO HAPPEN, WHICH MEANS OUR SON NEEDS TO BE

SAFE.

OUR-- >> Oprah: SO, HOW DO THEY

EXPLAIN TO YOU THAT YOUR SON, THE GRANDSON, THE GREAT-GRANDSON

OF THE QUEEN-- >> Meghan: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: --IS NOT GOING TO HAVE-- HE WASN'T GOING TO BE A

PRINCE?

HOW DID THEY TELL YOU THAT?

AND WHAT REASONS DID THEY GIVE?

AND THEN SAY, "AND SO, THEREFORE, YOU'RE NOT-- YOU

DON'T NEED PROTECTION"?

>> Meghan: THERE'S-- THERE'S NO EXPLANATION.

>> Oprah: HMM.

>> Meghan: THERE'S NO VERSION-- I MEAN, THAT'S THE OTHER PIECE

OF THAT.

>> Oprah: WHO TELLS YOU THAT?

>> Meghan: I HEARD A LOT OF IT THROUGH HARRY AND THEN OTHER

PARTS OF IT THROUGH CONVERSATIONS WITH--

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: --FAMILY MEMBERS.

AND IT WAS A DECISION THAT THEY FELT WAS APPROPRIATE.

AND I THOUGHT, WELL-- >> Oprah: WAS THE TITLE-- WAS

HIM BEING CALLED A PRINCE, ARCHIE BEING CALLED A PRINCE,

WAS THAT IMPORTANT TO YOU?

>> Meghan: IF IT MEANT HE WAS GOING TO BE SAFE, THEN, OF

COURSE.

ALL THE GRANDEUR SURROUNDING THIS STUFF IS AN ATTACHMENT THAT

I DON'T PERSONALLY HAVE, RIGHT?

I'VE BEEN A WAITRESS, AN ACTRESS, A PRINCESS, A DUCHESS.

I'VE ALWAYS JUST STILL BEEN MEGHAN, RIGHT?

SO, FOR ME, I'M CLEAR ON WHO I AM, INDEPENDENT OF ALL THAT

STUFF.

AND THE MOST IMPORTANT TITLE I WILL EVER HAVE IS "MOM."

I KNOW THAT.

BUT THE IDEA OF OUR SON NOT BEING SAFE, AND ALSO THE IDEA OF

THE FIRST MEMBER OF COLOR IN THIS FAMILY NOT BEING TITLED IN

THE SAME WAY THAT OTHER GRANDCHILDREN WOULD BE.

YOU KNOW, THE OTHER PIECE OF THAT CONVERSATION IS, THERE'S A

CONVENTION-- I FORGET IF IT WAS GEORGE V OR GEORGE VI

CONVENTION-- THAT WHEN YOU'RE THE GRANDCHILD OF THE MONARCH--

SO WHEN HARRY'S DAD BECOMES KING-- AUTOMATICALLY ARCHIE AND

OUR NEXT BABY WOULD BECOME PRINCE OR PRINCESS, OR WHATEVER

THEY WERE GOING TO BE.

>> Oprah: SO, FOR YOU, IT'S ABOUT PROTECTION AND SAFETY, NOT

SO MUCH AS WHAT THE-- WHAT THE TITLE MEANS TO THE WORLD.

>> Meghan: THAT'S A HUGE PIECE OF IT, BUT, I MEAN, BUT--

>> Oprah: AND THAT HAVING THE TITLE GIVES YOU THE SAFETY AND

PROTECTION.

>> Meghan: YEAH, BUT ALSO IT'S NOT THEIR RIGHT TO TAKE IT AWAY.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: RIGHT?

AND SO, I THINK EVEN WITH THAT CONVENTION I'M TALKING ABOUT,

WHILE I WAS PREGNANT, THEY SAID THEY WANT TO CHANGE THE

CONVENTION FOR ARCHIE.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: WELL, WHY?

>> Oprah: DID YOU GET AN ANSWER?

>> Meghan: NO.

>> Oprah: YOU STILL DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER?

>> Meghan: NO.

>> Oprah: YOU KNOW, WE HAD HEARD-- THE WORLD, THOSE OF US

OUT HERE READING THE THINGS OR HEARING THE THINGS-- THAT IT WAS

YOU AND HARRY WHO DIDN'T WANT ARCHIE TO HAVE A PRINCE TITLE.

SO, YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT IS NOT TRUE?

>> Meghan: NO, AND IT'S NOT OUR DECISION TO MAKE, RIGHT?

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: I-- EVEN THOUGH I HAVE A LOT OF CLARITY ON WHAT

COMES WITH THE TITLES, GOOD AND BAD-- AND, FROM MY EXPERIENCE, A

LOT OF PAIN-- >> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: --I, AGAIN, WOULDN'T WISH PAIN ON MY CHILD, BUT THAT

IS THEIR BIRTHRIGHT TO THEN MAKE A CHOICE ABOUT.

>> Oprah: OKAY, SO IT FEELS TO ME LIKE THINGS STARTED TO CHANGE

WHEN YOU AND HARRY DECIDED THAT YOU WERE NOT GOING TO TAKE THE

PICTURE THAT HAD BEEN A PART OF THE TRADITION FOR YEARS AND--

>> Meghan: WE WEREN'T ASKED TO TAKE A PICTURE.

THAT'S ALSO PART OF THE SPIN THAT WAS REALLY DAMAGING.

I THOUGHT, CAN YOU JUST TELL THEM THE TRUTH?

CAN YOU SAY TO THE WORLD YOU'RE NOT GIVING HIM A TITLE, AND WE

WANT TO KEEP HIM SAFE, AND THAT IF HE'S NOT A PRINCE, THEN IT'S

NOT PART OF THE TRADITION?

JUST TELL PEOPLE, AND THEN THEY'LL UNDERSTAND.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: BUT THEY WOULDN'T DO THAT.

>> Oprah: BUT YOU WERE-- YOU BOTH, OBVIOUSLY, WERE AWARE THAT

THAT HAD BEEN A PART OF THE TRADITION.

AND THERE WAS A-- WAS THERE A SPECIFIC REASON WHY YOU DIDN'T

WANT TO BE A PART OF THAT TRADITION?

I THINK MANY PEOPLE INTERPRETED THAT AS YOU WERE BOTH SAYING,

"WE'RE GOING TO DO THINGS OUR WAY.

WE'RE GOING TO DO THINGS IN A DIFFERENT WAY."

>> Meghan: THAT'S NOT IT AT ALL.

I MEAN, I THINK WHAT WAS REALLY HARD-- SO, PICTURE, NOW THAT YOU

KNOW WHAT WAS GOING ON BEHIND THE SCENES, RIGHT?

THERE WAS A LOT OF FEAR SURROUNDING IT.

I WAS VERY SCARED OF HAVING TO OFFER UP OUR BABY, KNOWING THAT

THEY WEREN'T GOING TO BE KEPT SAFE.

>> Oprah: MM.

YOU CERTAINLY MUST HAVE HAD SOME CONVERSATIONS WITH HARRY ABOUT

IT AND HAVE YOUR OWN SUSPICIONS AS TO WHY THEY DIDN'T WANT TO

MAKE ARCHIE A PRINCE.

WHAT ARE-- WHAT ARE THOSE THOUGHTS?

WHY DO YOU THINK THAT IS?

DO YOU THINK IT'S BECAUSE OF HIS RACE?

>> Meghan: ( SIGHS ) >> Oprah: AND I KNOW THAT'S A

LOADED QUESTION, BUT...

>> Meghan: BUT I CAN GIVE YOU AN HONEST ANSWER.

IN THOSE MONTHS WHEN I WAS PREGNANT, ALL AROUND THIS SAME

TIME-- SO WE HAVE IN TANDEM THE CONVERSATION OF "HE WON'T BE

GIVEN SECURITY, HE'S NOT GOING TO BE GIVEN A TITLE," AND ALSO

CONCERNS AND CONVERSATIONS ABOUT HOW DARK HIS SKIN MIGHT BE WHEN

HE'S BORN.

>> Oprah: WHAT?

>> Meghan: AND-- >> Oprah: WHO-- WHO IS HAVING

THAT CONVERSATION WITH YOU?

WHAT?

>> Meghan: SO-- >> Oprah: THERE IS A

CONVERSATION-- HOLD ON.

HOLD UP.

HOLD UP.

STOP RIGHT NOW.

>> Meghan: THERE WERE-- THERE WERE SEVERAL CONVERSATIONS

ABOUT IT.

>> Oprah: THERE'S A CONVERSATION WITH YOU--

>> Meghan: WITH HARRY.

>> Oprah: --ABOUT HOW DARK YOUR BABY IS GOING TO BE?

>> Meghan: POTENTIALLY, AND WHAT THAT WOULD MEAN OR LOOK LIKE.

>> Oprah: WHOO.

AND YOU'RE NOT GOING TO TELL ME WHO HAD THE CONVERSATION?

>> Meghan: I THINK THAT WOULD BE VERY DAMAGING TO THEM.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

SO, HOW-- HOW DOES ONE HAVE THAT MEETING?

( CHUCKLES ) >> Meghan: THAT WAS RELAYED TO

ME FROM HARRY.

THOSE WERE CONVERSATIONS THAT FAMILY HAD WITH HIM.

AND I THINK-- >> Oprah: WHOA.

>> Meghan: --IT WAS REALLY HARD TO BE ABLE TO SEE THOSE AS

COMPARTMENTALIZED CONVERSATIONS.

>> Oprah: BECAUSE THEY WERE CONCERNED THAT IF HE WERE TOO

BROWN, THAT THAT WOULD BE A PROBLEM?

ARE YOU SAYING THAT?

>> Meghan: I WASN'T ABLE TO FOLLOW UP WITH WHY, BUT THAT--

IF THAT'S THE ASSUMPTION YOU'RE MAKING, I THINK THAT FEELS LIKE

A PRETTY SAFE ONE, WHICH WAS REALLY HARD TO UNDERSTAND,

RIGHT?

ESPECIALLY WHEN-- LOOK, I-- THE COMMONWEALTH IS A HUGE PART OF

THE MONARCHY, AND I LIVED IN CANADA, WHICH IS A COMMONWEALTH

COUNTRY, FOR SEVEN YEARS.

BUT IT WASN'T UNTIL HARRY AND I WERE TOGETHER THAT WE STARTED TO

TRAVEL THROUGH THE COMMONWEALTH, I WOULD SAY 60%, 70% OF WHICH IS

PEOPLE OF COLOR, RIGHT?

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: AND GROWING UP AS A WOMAN OF COLOR, AS A LITTLE GIRL

OF COLOR, I KNOW HOW IMPORTANT REPRESENTATION IS.

I KNOW HOW YOU WANT TO SEE SOMEONE WHO LOOKS LIKE YOU IN

CERTAIN POSITIONS.

>> Oprah: OBVIOUSLY.

>> Meghan: EVEN-- EVEN ARCHIE.

LIKE, WE READ THESE BOOKS, AND NOW HE'S BEEN-- THERE'S ONE LINE

IN ONE THAT GOES, "IF YOU CAN SEE IT, YOU CAN BE IT."

AND HE GOES, "YOU CAN BE IT!" AND I THINK ABOUT THAT SO OFTEN,

ESPECIALLY IN THE CONTEXT OF THESE YOUNG GIRLS, BUT EVEN

GROWN WOMEN AND MEN WHO WHEN I WOULD MEET THEM IN OUR TIME IN

THE COMMONWEALTH, HOW MUCH IT MEANT TO THEM TO BE ABLE TO SEE

SOMEONE WHO LOOKS LIKE THEM...

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: ...IN THIS POSITION.

AND I COULD NEVER UNDERSTAND HOW IT WOULDN'T BE SEEN AS AN ADDED

BENEFIT...

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: ...AND A REFLECTION OF THE WORLD TODAY.

AT ALL TIMES, BUT ESPECIALLY RIGHT NOW, TO GO-- HOW INCLUSIVE

IS THAT, THAT YOU CAN SEE SOMEONE WHO LOOKS LIKE YOU IN

THIS FAMILY, MUCH LESS ONE WHO'S BORN INTO IT?

>> Oprah: WHAT WAS ACTUALLY GOING ON?

"ALMOST UNSURVIVABLE" SOUNDS LIKE THERE WAS A BREAKING POINT.

>> Meghan: I JUST DIDN'T SEE A SOLUTION.

ROYAL FAMILY IN 2018, SHE BECAME THE TARGET OF UNRELENTING,

PERVASIVE ATTACKS.

>> RACIST ABUSE ONLINE AIMED AT MEGHAN MARKLE.

>> THERE WERE UNDENIABLE RACIST OVERTONES.

THIS STANDS APART FROM THE KIND OF COVERAGE WE'VE SEEN OF ANY

OTHER ROYAL.

>> Oprah: THERE WAS CONSTANT CRITICISM, BLATANT SEXIST AND

RACIST REMARKS BY BRITISH TABLOIDS AND INTERNET TROLLS.

>> WE HAVE SEEN THE RACISM TOWARDS HER PLAY OUT IN REAL

TIME.

>> REFERRING TO HER AS "STRAIGHT OUTTA COMPTON."

>> Oprah: THE DAILY ONSLAUGHT OF VITRIOL AND CONDEMNATION FROM

THE U.K. PRESS BECAME OVERWHELMING AND, IN MEGHAN'S

WORDS, "ALMOST UNSURVIVABLE."

YOU'D SAID IN A PODCAST THAT IT BECAME "ALMOST UNSURVIVABLE,"

AND THAT STRUCK ME, BECAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU WERE IN SOME

KIND OF MENTAL TROUBLE.

WHAT WAS ACTUALLY GOING ON?

"ALMOST UNSURVIVABLE" SOUNDS LIKE THERE WAS A BREAKING POINT.

>> Meghan: YEAH, THERE WAS.

I JUST DIDN'T SEE A SOLUTION.

I WOULD SIT UP AT NIGHT, AND I WAS JUST, LIKE, I DON'T

UNDERSTAND HOW ALL OF THIS IS BEING CHURNED OUT.

AND, AGAIN, I WASN'T SEEING IT, BUT IT'S ALMOST WORSE WHEN YOU

FEEL IT THROUGH THE EXPRESSION OF MY MOM OR MY FRIENDS, OR THEM

CALLING ME CRYING, JUST, LIKE, "MEG, THEY'RE NOT PROTECTING

YOU."

AND I REALIZED THAT IT WAS ALL HAPPENING JUST BECAUSE I WAS

BREATHING.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: AND, LOOK, I WAS REALLY ASHAMED TO SAY IT AT THE

TIME AND ASHAMED TO HAVE TO ADMIT IT TO HARRY, ESPECIALLY,

BECAUSE I KNOW HOW MUCH LOSS HE'S SUFFERED.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: BUT I KNEW THAT IF I DIDN'T SAY IT, THAT I WOULD

DO IT.

AND I-- I JUST DIDN'T-- I JUST DIDN'T WANT TO BE ALIVE ANYMORE.

AND THAT WAS A VERY CLEAR AND REAL AND FRIGHTENING CONSTANT

THOUGHT.

AND I REMEMBER-- I REMEMBER HOW HE JUST CRADLED ME.

AND I WAS-- I WENT TO THE INSTITUTION, AND I SAID THAT I

NEEDED TO GO SOMEWHERE TO GET HELP.

I SAID THAT "I'VE NEVER FELT THIS WAY BEFORE, AND I NEED TO

GO SOMEWHERE."

AND I WAS TOLD THAT I COULDN'T, THAT IT WOULDN'T BE GOOD FOR THE

INSTITUTION.

AND I CALLED-- >> Oprah: SO, THE INSTITUTION IS

NEVER A PERSON.

OR IS IT A SERIES OF PEOPLE?

>> Meghan: NO, IT'S A PERSON.

>> Oprah: IT'S A PERSON.

>> Meghan: IT'S SEVERAL PEOPLE.

BUT I WENT TO ONE OF THE MOST SENIOR PEOPLE JUST TO-- TO GET

HELP.

AND THAT-- YOU KNOW, I-- I SHARE THIS, BECAUSE THERE'S SO MANY

PEOPLE WHO ARE AFRAID TO VOICE THAT THEY NEED HELP.

AND I KNOW, PERSONALLY, HOW HARD IT IS TO NOT JUST VOICE IT, BUT

WHEN YOU VOICE IT, TO BE TOLD NO.

>> Oprah: WHOO.

>> Meghan: AND SO, I WENT TO HUMAN RESOURCES, AND I SAID,

"I JUST REALLY-- I NEED HELP."

BECAUSE IN MY OLD JOB, THERE WAS A UNION, AND THEY WOULD PROTECT

ME.

AND I REMEMBER THIS CONVERSATION LIKE IT WAS YESTERDAY, BECAUSE

THEY SAID, "MY HEART GOES OUT TO YOU, BECAUSE I SEE HOW BAD IT

IS, BUT THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO TO PROTECT YOU, BECAUSE

YOU'RE NOT A PAID EMPLOYEE OF THE INSTITUTION."

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: THIS WASN'T A CHOICE.

THIS WAS EMAILS AND BEGGING FOR HELP, SAYING VERY SPECIFICALLY,

"I AM CONCERNED FOR MY MENTAL WELFARE."

AND PEOPLE GOING, "OH, YES, YES, IT'S DISPROPORTIONATELY TERRIBLE

WHAT WE SEE OUT THERE TO ANYONE ELSE."

BUT NOTHING WAS EVER DONE, SO WE HAD TO FIND A SOLUTION.

>> Oprah: WOW!

"I DON'T WANT TO BE ALIVE ANYMORE," THAT'S-- THAT'S--

>> Meghan: I THOUGHT IT WOULD HAVE SOLVED EVERYTHING FOR

EVERYONE, RIGHT?

>> Oprah: SO, WERE YOU THINKING OF HARMING YOURSELF?

WERE YOU HAVING SUICIDAL THOUGHTS?

>> Meghan: YES.

THIS WAS VERY, VERY CLEAR.

>> Oprah: WOW.

>> Meghan: VERY CLEAR AND VERY SCARY.

AND, YOU KNOW, I DIDN'T KNOW WHO TO EVEN TURN TO IN THAT.

AND ONE OF THE PEOPLE THAT I REACHED OUT TO, WHO'S CONTINUED

TO BE A FRIEND AND CONFIDANT, WAS ONE OF MY HUSBAND'S MOM'S

BEST FRIENDS, ONE OF DIANA'S BEST FRIENDS.

BECAUSE IT'S, LIKE, WHO ELSE COULD UNDERSTAND WHAT'S-- WHAT

IT'S ACTUALLY LIKE ON THE INSIDE?

>> Oprah: DID YOU EVER THINK ABOUT GOING TO A HOSPITAL?

OR IS THAT POSSIBLE, THAT YOU CAN CHECK YOURSELF IN SOMEPLACE?

>> Meghan: NO, THAT'S WHAT I WAS ASKING TO DO.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: YOU CAN'T JUST DO THAT.

I COULDN'T, YOU KNOW, CALL AN UBER TO THE PALACE.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: YOU COULDN'T JUST GO.

YOU COULDN'T.

I MEAN, YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND, AS WELL, WHEN I JOINED THAT

FAMILY, THAT WAS THE LAST TIME, UNTIL WE CAME HERE, THAT I SAW

MY PASSPORT, MY DRIVER'S LICENSE, MY KEYS.

ALL THAT GETS TURNED OVER.

I DIDN'T SEE ANY OF THAT ANYMORE.

>> Oprah: WELL, THE WAY YOU'RE DESCRIBING THIS, IT-- IT'S LIKE

YOU WERE TRAPPED AND COULDN'T GET HELP, EVEN THOUGH YOU'RE ON

THE VERGE OF SUICIDE.

THAT'S WHAT YOU ARE DESCRIBING.

THAT'S WHAT I'M HEARING.

>> Meghan: YES.

>> Oprah: AND THAT WOULD BE AN ACCURATE INTERPRETATION, YES?

>> Meghan: THAT'S THE TRUTH.

>> Oprah: THAT'S THE TRUTH.

>> Meghan: YOU KNOW, AND IF YOU THINK ABOUT-- IT WAS ONE OF THE

THINGS THAT-- IT STILLS HAUNTS ME IS THIS PHOTOGRAPH THAT

SOMEONE HAD SENT ME.

WE HAD TO GO TO AN OFFICIAL EVENT.

WE HAD TO GO TO THIS EVENT AT THE ROYAL ALBERT HALL, AND

A FRIEND SAID, "I KNOW YOU DON'T LOOK AT PICTURES, BUT, OH, MY

GOD, YOU GUYS LOOK SO GREAT..."

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: ...AND SENT IT TO ME.

AND I ZOOMED IN, AND WHAT I SAW WAS THE TRUTH OF WHAT THAT

MOMENT WAS, BECAUSE RIGHT BEFORE WE HAD TO LEAVE FOR THAT, I HAD

JUST HAD THAT CONVERSATION WITH HARRY THAT MORNING, AND IT WAS

THE NEXT DAY THAT I TALKED TO THE INSTITUTION.

>> Oprah: YOU HAD THE CONVERSATION "I DON'T WANT TO BE

ALIVE ANYMORE"?

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: WHOO.

>> Meghan: NO, AND IT WAS-- IT WASN'T EVEN "I DON'T WANT TO."

>> Oprah: AND THEN, YOU-- >> Meghan: IT WAS LIKE, "THESE

ARE THE THOUGHTS THAT I'M HAVING IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT THAT

ARE VERY CLEAR..."

>> Oprah: YES, CLARIFICATION.

>> Meghan: "...AND I'M SCARED, BECAUSE THIS IS VERY REAL.

THIS ISN'T SOME ABSTRACT IDEA.

THIS IS METHODICAL, AND THIS IS NOT WHO I AM."

BUT WE HAD TO GO TO THIS EVENT, AND I REMEMBER HIM SAYING, "I

DON'T THINK YOU CAN GO."

AND I SAID, "I CAN'T BE LEFT ALONE."

>> Oprah: BECAUSE YOU WERE AFRAID OF WHAT YOU MIGHT DO TO

YOURSELF?

>> Meghan: AND WE WENT, AND THAT--

>> Oprah: I'M SO SORRY TO HEAR THAT.

>> Meghan: AND THAT PICTURE, IF YOU ZOOM IN, WHAT I SEE IS HOW

TIGHTLY HIS KNUCKLES ARE GRIPPED AROUND MINE.

YOU CAN SEE THE WHITES OF OUR KNUCKLES, BECAUSE WE ARE SMILING

AND DOING OUR JOB, BUT WE'RE BOTH JUST TRYING TO HOLD ON.

AND EVERY TIME THAT THOSE LIGHTS WENT DOWN IN THAT ROYAL BOX, I

WAS JUST WEEPING, AND HE WAS GRIPPING MY HAND.

>> Oprah: WOW.

>> Meghan: AND THEN, IT WAS, "OKAY, INTERMISSION'S COMING,

THE LIGHTS ARE ABOUT TO COME ON, EVERYONE'S LOOKING AT US AGAIN,"

AND YOU HAVE TO JUST BE ON AGAIN.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: AND THAT'S, I THINK, SO IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE TO

REMEMBER IS YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT'S GOING ON FOR SOMEONE

BEHIND CLOSED DOORS.

YOU HAVE NO IDEA.

EVEN THE PEOPLE THAT SMILE THE BIGGEST SMILES AND SHINE THE

BRIGHTEST LIGHTS, IT SEEMS, TO HAVE COMPASSION FOR WHAT'S

ACTUALLY POTENTIALLY GOING ON.

>> Oprah: I KNOW.

THE PUBLIC IS LOOKING AT YOU.

AND TO THINK THAT YOU, EARLIER IN THE DAY, HAD SAID TO HARRY

THAT YOU DIDN'T WANT TO BE ALIVE ANYMORE.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

AND JUST HOURS BEFORE, JUST SITTING ON THE-- THE STEPS IN

OUR COTTAGE...

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: ...JUST SITTING THERE AND-- AND THEN GOING, OKAY,

WELL, GO UPSTAIRS AND PUT YOUR MAKEUP BAG IN YOUR SINK AND TRY

TO PULL YOURSELF TOGETHER.

>> Oprah: NOBODY SHOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH THAT.

AND, YOU KNOW, HARRY AND I ARE WORKING ON THIS MENTAL HEALTH

SERIES FOR APPLE, AND WE-- YES, SO, WE-- WE-- WE HEAR A LOT OF

THESE STORIES.

NOBODY SHOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH THAT.

>> Meghan: IT TAKES SO MUCH COURAGE TO ADMIT THAT YOU NEED

HELP.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: IT TAKES SO MUCH COURAGE TO VOICE THAT.

AND AS I SAID, I WAS ASHAMED.

I'M SUPPOSED TO BE STRONGER THAN THAT.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: I DON'T WANT TO PUT MORE ON MY HUSBAND'S SHOULDERS.

HE'S CARRYING THE WEIGHT OF THE WORLD.

I DON'T WANT TO BRING THAT TO HIM.

I BRING SOLUTIONS.

TO ADMIT THAT YOU NEED HELP, TO ADMIT HOW DARK OF A PLACE YOU'RE

IN.

>> Oprah: MM.

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE PALACE HEARING YOU SPEAK YOUR TRUTH

TODAY?

ARE YOU AFRAID OF-- OF A BACKLASH OR THEIR REACTION?

>> Oprah: YOU'VE SAID SOME PRETTY SHOCKING THINGS HERE,

REVEALING-- >> Meghan: I WASN'T PLANNING TO

SAY ANYTHING SHOCKING.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Meghan: I'M JUST TELLING YOU WHAT'S HAPPENED.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Meghan: I'M SORRY IF IT'S SHOCKED YOU!

IT'S BEEN A LOT!

>> Oprah: I'M A LITTLE SHOCKED.

>> Meghan: IT'S BEEN A LOT.

>> Oprah: HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE PALACE HEARING YOU SPEAK

YOUR TRUTH TODAY?

ARE YOU AFRAID OF-- OF A BACKLASH OR-- OR THEIR REACTION?

>> Meghan: I MEAN, I THINK I'M NOT GOING TO LIVE MY LIFE IN

FEAR.

YOU KNOW, I THINK SO MUCH OF IT IS SAID WITH AN UNDERSTANDING OF

JUST TRUTH.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: BUT I THINK, TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, I DON'T

KNOW HOW THEY COULD EXPECT THAT AFTER ALL OF THIS TIME, WE WOULD

STILL JUST BE SILENT IF THERE IS AN ACTIVE ROLE THAT THE FIRM IS

PLAYING IN PERPETUATING FALSEHOODS ABOUT US.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: THAT AT A CERTAIN POINT, YOU'RE GOING TO GO, "BUT,

YOU GUYS, SOMEONE JUST TELL THE TRUTH."

AND IF THAT COMES WITH RISK OF LOSING THINGS, I MEAN, I'VE--

I'VE LOST-- THERE'S A LOT THAT'S BEEN LOST ALREADY.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: AND I GRIEVE A LOT.

I MEAN, I'VE LOST MY FATHER.

I LOST A BABY.

I NEARLY LOST MY NAME.

I MEAN, THERE'S THE LOSS OF IDENTITY.

BUT I'M STILL STANDING, AND MY HOPE FOR PEOPLE IN THE TAKEAWAY

FROM THIS IS TO KNOW THAT THERE'S ANOTHER SIDE.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: TO KNOW THAT LIFE IS WORTH LIVING.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

I'M SO GLAD YOU SEE THAT NOW.

WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A BREAK, Y'ALL, AND HARRY'S GOING TO

JOIN US.

>> Meghan: ( LAUGHTER ) >> Oprah: WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK

WITH HARRY.

SO, WHEN I ASK THE QUESTION, "WHY DID YOU LEAVE?" THE

SIMPLEST ANSWER IS?

DID YOU BLINDSIDE THE QUEEN?

>> Oprah: SO, HI.

>> Prince Harry: HELLO.

>> Oprah: THANKS FOR JOINING US.

>> Prince Harry: THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Oprah: YOU'VE BEEN WATCHING ON THE SIDE?

YEAH?

>> Prince Harry: SOME OF IT.

>> Oprah: YES.

I WANT TO SAY, FIRST OF ALL, LET'S SAY CONGRATULATIONS...

>> Prince Harry: THANK YOU.

>> Oprah: ...FOR THE NEW ADDITION TO YOUR FAMILY.

MEGHAN SAID SHE WANTED TO WAIT UNTIL YOU WERE HERE TO TELL US,

IS IT A BOY OR IS IT A GIRL?

>> Meghan: YOU CAN TELL HER.

>> Prince Harry: NO, GO FOR IT.

>> Meghan: NO, NO.

>> Prince Harry: IT'S A GIRL.

>> Oprah: ( SQUEALS ) >> Meghan: IT'S A GIRL.

>> Prince Harry: YES!

>> Oprah: YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A DAUGHTER.

WOW.

>> Meghan: IT'S A GIRL.

>> Oprah: WHEN YOU REALIZED THAT AND SAW IT ON THE ULTRASOUND,

WHAT-- WHAT-- WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST THOUGHT?

>> Prince Harry: AMAZING.

JUST GRATEFUL, LIKE ANY-- TO HAVE ANY CHILD, ANY ONE OR ANY

TWO WOULD HAVE BEEN AMAZING.

BUT TO HAVE A BOY AND THEN A GIRL, YOU KNOW, WHAT MORE CAN

YOU ASK FOR?

BUT NOW, YOU KNOW, NOW WE-- WE'VE GOT OUR FAMILY.

WE'VE GOT, YOU KNOW, THE FOUR OF US AND OUR TWO DOGS, AND IT'S

GREAT.

>> Oprah: DONE.

DONE?

TWO IS IT?

>> Prince Harry: DONE.

>> Meghan: TWO IS IT.

>> Oprah: TWO IS IT.

>> Meghan: TWO IS IT.

>> Oprah: AND WHEN'S THE BABY DUE?

>> Meghan: IN SUMMERTIME.

>> Oprah: THIS SUMMERTIME?

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU ALL HAVE BEEN LIVING IN SUNNY CALIFORNIA NOW

FOR-- >> Meghan: SINCE MARCH.

>> Oprah: SINCE MARCH, OKAY.

IN LATE 2019, PRINCE HARRY AND MEGHAN LEFT THE U.K. AND MOVED

TO CANADA.

THE COUPLE SAYS THEY CHOSE CANADA, A COMMONWEALTH OF

BRITAIN, WITH THE INTENTION OF CONTINUING TO SERVE THE QUEEN.

AFTER THEIR MOVE, HARRY AND MEGHAN SAY SECURITY NORMALLY

PROVIDED BY THE ROYAL FAMILY WAS CUT OFF.

BY MARCH 2020, JUST DAYS BEFORE THE COVID LOCKDOWN BEGAN,

MEGHAN, HARRY, AND ARCHIE RELOCATED TO LOS ANGELES WHERE

MEDIA MOGUL TYLER PERRY OFFERED THEM HIS HOME AS A TEMPORARY

REFUGE.

HE ALSO PROVIDED SECURITY.

THREE MONTHS LATER, THEY BOUGHT THEIR OWN HOME AND SETTLED IN

THE SANTA BARBARA AREA.

LAST SPRING, THE DUKE AND DUCHESS OF SUSSEX CREATED THEIR

OWN FOUNDATION AND MEDIA CONTENT COMPANY CALLED ARCHEWELL.

AND SO, YOU STAYED AT TYLER PERRY'S HOUSE FOR SEVERAL

MONTHS.

>> Prince Harry: THREE MONTHS, I BELIEVE.

>> Meghan: YEAH, BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE A PLAN.

WE NEEDED-- WE NEEDED A HOUSE, AND HE OFFERED SECURITY, AS

WELL, SO IT GAVE US BREATHING ROOM TO TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT

WE ARE GOING TO DO.

>> Prince Harry: THE BIGGEST CONCERN WAS THAT WHILE WE WERE

IN CANADA, IN SOMEONE ELSE'S HOUSE, I THEN GOT TOLD SHORT

NOTICE THAT SECURITY WAS GOING TO BE REMOVED.

BY THIS POINT, COURTESY OF "THE DAILY MAIL," THE WORLD KNEW

EXACT-- OUR EXACT LOCATION.

SO, SUDDENLY, IT DAWNED ON ME, HANG ON A SECOND.

THE BORDERS COULD BE CLOSED.

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE OUR SECURITY REMOVED.

WHO KNOWS HOW LONG LOCKDOWN'S GOING TO BE?

THE WORLD KNOWS WHERE WE ARE.

IT'S NOT SAFE.

IT'S NOT SECURE.

>> Meghan: WELL, AND ALSO-- >> Prince Harry: WE PROBABLY

NEED TO GET OUT OF HERE.

>> Oprah: SO, WHAT SECURITY DID YOU HAVE AT THE TIME THAT WAS

GOING TO BE REMOVED?

>> Prince Harry: WE HAD OUR U.K.

SECURITY.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU GOT WORD FROM OVERSEAS--

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Oprah: --THAT "WE'RE TAKING AWAY YOUR SECURITY."

WHY WERE THEY DOING THAT?

>> Prince Harry: THEIR JUSTIFICATION IS A CHANGE IN

STATUS, OF WHICH I PUSHED BACK AND SAID, "WELL, IS THERE A

CHANGE OF THREAT OR RISK?" AND AFTER MANY WEEKS OF WAITING,

EVENTUALLY, I GOT THE CONFIRMATION THAT, NO, THE RISK

AND THREAT HASN'T CHANGED, BUT DUE TO OUR CHANGE OF STATUS,

WHICH WE WOULD NO LONGER BE AN OFFICIAL WORKING MEMBERS OF THE

ROYAL FAMILY, THEY'RE OBVIOUSLY-- WHAT WE PROPOSED WAS

SORT OF PART-TIME, OR AT LEAST AS MUCH AS WE COULD DO WITHOUT

BEING FULLY CONSUMED BECAUSE OF, I THINK, WHAT MOST OF YOU GUYS

HAVE COVERED ALREADY.

>> Meghan: WE ACTUALLY DIDN'T TALK ABOUT THAT.

IT'S BEEN SO SPUN IN THE WRONG DIRECTION, AS THOUGH WE QUIT, WE

WALKED AWAY, WE-- ALL THE CONVERSATIONS OF THE TWO YEARS

BEFORE WE FINALLY ANNOUNCED IT.

>> Oprah: IN JANUARY 2020, PRINCE HARRY AND MEGHAN

ANNOUNCED THEY WOULD STEP BACK AS SENIOR MEMBERS OF THE ROYAL

FAMILY.

>> THE SWIFTNESS WITH WHICH THEY'VE TAKEN THIS DECISION,

ONLY 18 MONTHS AFTER THEY GOT MARRIED, HAS TAKEN EVERYONE BY

SURPRISE, FROM THE QUEEN ALL THE WAY DOWN.

>> Oprah: THE BOMBSHELL NEWS SPARKED A WORLDWIDE MEDIA FRENZY

DUBBED "MEGXIT" BY THE BRITISH PRESS.

MANY REPORTERS AND VIRAL POSTS BLAMED MEGHAN FOR THE DECISION.

>> MEGHAN KNEW WHAT SHE WAS SIGNING UP FOR.

>> SHE'S BEING EVISCERATED.

>> HARRY, HOW ARE THE DISCUSSIONS GOING ON YOUR

FUTURE?

>> Oprah: IN AN OFFICIAL STATEMENT, QUEEN ELIZABETH SAID,

"ALTHOUGH WE WOULD HAVE PREFERRED THEM TO REMAIN

FULL-TIME WORKING MEMBERS OF THE ROYAL FAMILY, WE RESPECT AND

UNDERSTAND THEIR WISH TO LIVE A MORE INDEPENDENT LIFE AS A

FAMILY WHILE REMAINING A VALUED PART OF MY FAMILY."

OKAY, LET ME ASK THE QUESTION.

>> Meghan: YEAH?

>> Oprah: SO, OVER A YEAR AGO, YOU SHOCKED THE WORLD.

YOU ANNOUNCED THAT YOU WERE STEPPING BACK AS SENIOR MEMBERS

OF THE ROYAL FAMILY.

AND THEN THE MEDIA REPORTED THAT YOU HAD "BLINDSIDED" THE

QUEEN, YOUR GRANDMOTHER.

SO, HERE'S A TIME TO SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT.

WHAT WAS THE TIPPING POINT THAT MADE YOU DECIDE YOU HAD TO

LEAVE?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, IT WAS DESPERATE.

I WENT TO ALL THE PLACES WHICH I THOUGHT I SHOULD GO TO, TO ASK

FOR HELP.

WE BOTH DID...

>> Meghan: MM-HMM.

>> Prince Harry: ...SEPARATELY AND TOGETHER.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU LEFT BECAUSE YOU WERE ASKING FOR HELP AND

COULDN'T GET IT?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, BASICALLY.

BUT WE NEVER LEFT.

>> Meghan: WE NEVER LEFT THE FAMILY, AND WE ONLY WANTED TO

HAVE THE SAME TYPE OF ROLE THAT EXISTS, RIGHT?

THERE'S SENIOR MEMBERS OF THE FAMILY, AND THEN THERE ARE

NON-SENIOR MEMBERS.

AND WE SAID, SPECIFICALLY, "WE'RE STEPPING BACK FROM SENIOR

ROLES TO BE JUST LIKE SEVERAL"-- I MEAN, I CAN THINK OF SO MANY

RIGHT NOW WHO ARE ALL-- THEY'RE ROYAL HIGHNESSES, PRINCE OR

PRINCESS, DUKE OR DUCHESS-- WHO EARN A LIVING, LIVE ON PALACE

GROUNDS, CAN SUPPORT THE QUEEN IF AND WHEN CALLED UPON.

SO, WE WEREN'T REINVENTING THE WHEEL HERE.

WE WERE SAYING, "OKAY, IF THIS ISN'T WORKING FOR EVERYONE,

WE'RE IN A LOT OF PAIN, YOU CAN'T PROVIDE US WITH THE HELP

THAT WE NEED, WE CAN JUST TAKE A STEP BACK.

WE CAN DO IT IN A COMMONWEALTH COUNTRY."

WE SUGGESTED NEW ZEALAND, SOUTH AFRICA.

>> Prince Harry: TAKE A BREATH.

>> Meghan: CANADA.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

AND YOU WANTED TO TAKE A BREATH FROM WHAT, SPECIFICALLY?

LET'S BE CLEAR.

>> Prince Harry: FROM THIS-- THIS CONSTANT BARRAGE.

MY BIGGEST CONCERN WAS HISTORY REPEATING ITSELF, AND I'VE SAID

THAT BEFORE ON NUMEROUS OCCASIONS, VERY PUBLICLY.

AND WHAT I WAS SEEING WAS HISTORY REPEATING ITSELF, BUT

MORE, PERHAPS-- OR DEFINITELY FAR MORE DANGEROUS, BECAUSE THEN

YOU ADD RACE IN AND YOU ADD SOCIAL MEDIA IN.

AND WHEN I'M TALKING ABOUT HISTORY REPEATING ITSELF, I'M

TALKING ABOUT MY-- MY MOTHER.

WHEN YOU CAN SEE SOMETHING HAPPENING IN THE SAME KIND OF

WAY, ANYBODY WOULD ASK FOR HELP, ASK THE SYSTEM OF WHICH YOU ARE

A PART OF-- ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU KNOW THERE'S A RELATIONSHIP

THERE-- THAT THEY COULD HELP AND SHARE SOME TRUTH OR CALL-- CALL

THE DOGS OFF, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT.

SO, TO RECEIVE NO HELP AT ALL AND TO BE TOLD CONTINUOUSLY,

"THIS IS HOW IT IS.

THIS IS JUST HOW IT IS.

WE'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH IT."

AND I THINK THE BIGGEST TURNING POINT FOR ME WAS THE-- AND IT

DIDN'T TAKE VERY LONG.

IT WAS ACTUALLY RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING-- WAS, OKAY, THIS

UNION-- US, ME-- BEING-- HAVING A GIRLFRIEND WAS GOING TO BE A

THING.

OF COURSE IT WAS.

BUT I-- I NEVER EXPECTED, OR I NEVER THOUGHT--

>> Oprah: BECAUSE SHE WAS A MIXED RACE?

>> Prince Harry: NO, JUST-- JUST THE TWO OF US TO START WITH.

I HADN'T REALLY THOUGHT ABOUT THE MIXED RACE PIECE, BECAUSE I

THOUGHT, WELL, WELL, FIRSTLY, YOU KNOW, I'VE SPENT MANY YEARS

DOING THE WORK AND DOING MY OWN LEARNING.

BUT MY UPBRINGING IN THE SYSTEM, OF WHICH I WAS BROUGHT UP IN AND

WHAT I'VE BEEN EXPOSED TO, IT WASN'T-- I WASN'T AWARE OF IT,

TO START WITH.

BUT, MY GOD, IT DOESN'T TAKE VERY LONG TO SUDDENLY BECOME

AWARE OF IT.

>> Oprah: YEAH, BECAUSE YOU SAID YOU REALLY WEREN'T AWARE OF

UNCONSCIOUS BIAS AND ALL THAT THAT REPRESENTS...

>> Prince Harry: NO.

>> Oprah: ...UNTIL YOU MET MEGHAN.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

YOU KNOW, AS SAD AS IT IS TO SAY, IT TAKES LIVING IN HER

SHOES-- IN THIS INSTANCE, FOR A DAY OR THOSE FIRST EIGHT DAYS--

TO SEE WHERE IT WAS GOING TO GO AND HOW FAR THEY WERE GOING TO

TAKE IT.

>> Oprah: AND GET AWAY WITH IT.

>> Prince Harry: AND GET AWAY WITH IT AND BE SO BLATANT ABOUT

IT.

THAT'S THE BIT THAT SHOCKED ME.

THIS IS-- WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE U.K. PRESS HERE, RIGHT?

AND THIS-- THE U.K. IS MY HOME.

THAT IS-- THAT IS WHERE I WAS BROUGHT UP.

SO, YES, I'VE GOT MY OWN RELATIONSHIP THAT GOES BACK A

LONG WAY WITH THE MEDIA.

I-- I ASKED FOR CALM FROM THE BRITISH TABLOIDS ONCE AS A

BOYFRIEND, ONCE AS A HUSBAND, AND ONCE AS A FATHER.

>> Oprah: SO, WHEN I ASK THE QUESTION "WHY DID YOU LEAVE?"

THE SIMPLEST ANSWER IS?

>> Prince Harry: LACK OF SUPPORT AND LACK OF UNDERSTANDING.

>> Oprah: SO, I WANT CLARITY.

WAS THE MOVE ABOUT GETTING AWAY FROM THE U.K. PRESS?

BECAUSE THE PRESS, AS YOU KNOW, IS EVERYWHERE.

OR WAS THE MOVE BECAUSE YOU WEREN'T GETTING ENOUGH SUPPORT

FROM THE FIRM?

>> Prince Harry: IT WAS BOTH.

>> Oprah: BOTH.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Oprah: DID YOU BLINDSIDE THE QUEEN?

>> Prince Harry: NO.

I'VE NEVER BLINDSIDED MY GRANDMOTHER.

I HAVE TOO MUCH RESPECT FOR HER.

>> Oprah: SO, WHERE DID THAT STORY COME FROM?

>> Prince Harry: I HAZARD A GUESS THAT IT PROBABLY COULD

HAVE COME FROM WITHIN THE INSTITUTION.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: SO, I REMEMBER WHEN YOU TALKED TO HER SEVERAL TIMES

ABOUT THIS OVER-- >> Prince Harry: TWO YEARS.

>> Meghan: --TWO YEARS.

BUT EVEN THE NIGHT BEFORE, DAYS BEFORE, WITH THE STATEMENT

COMING OUT, I REMEMBER THAT CONVERSATION.

>> Oprah: SO, AND HOW DO YOU KNOW SHE WASN'T BLINDSIDED?

BECAUSE OF THE WAY IT WAS PRESENTED THROUGH THE PRESS IS

THAT SUDDENLY YOU MADE THIS ANNOUNCEMENT.

SHE DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS COMING.

>> Prince Harry: NO, I-- WHEN WE WERE IN CANADA, I HAD THREE

CONVERSATIONS WITH MY GRANDMOTHER AND TWO

CONVERSATIONS WITH MY FATHER AND-- BEFORE HE STOPPED TAKING

MY CALLS-- AND THEN SAID, "CAN YOU PUT THIS ALL IN WRITING WHAT

YOUR PLAN IS?" >> Oprah: YOUR FATHER ASKED YOU

TO PUT IT IN WRITING.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

HE ASKED ME TO PUT IT IN WRITING, AND I PUT ALL THE

SPECIFICS IN THERE, EVEN THE FACT THAT WE WERE PLANNING ON

PUTTING THE ANNOUNCEMENT OUT ON THE 7th OF JANUARY.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU JUST SAID THAT YOUR DAD STOPPED TAKING YOUR

CALLS.

WHY DID HE STOP TAKING YOUR CALLS?

>> Prince Harry: BECAUSE...

I TOOK MATTERS IN-- BY THAT POINT, I TOOK MATTERS INTO MY

OWN HANDS.

IT WAS LIKE I NEED TO DO THIS FOR MY FAMILY.

THIS IS NOT A SURPRISE TO ANYBODY.

IT'S REALLY SAD THAT IT'S GOTTEN TO THIS POINT, BUT I'VE GOT TO

DO SOMETHING FOR MY OWN MENTAL HEALTH, MY WIFE'S, AND FOR

ARCHIE'S, AS WELL, BECAUSE I COULD SEE WHERE THIS WAS HEADED.

>> Oprah: I THINK WHAT WE REALLY HAVE GOT TO CLEAR UP HERE IS

THAT YOU, MEGHAN, ARE THE ONE WHO MANIPULATED, CALCULATED THIS

MEGXIT.

>> Meghan: TO HAVE SAT BACK AND NOT SAID THAT FOR SO LONG, IT

JUST FEELS REALLY-- >> Oprah: TO HAVE BEEN SILENCED

ALL THIS TIME.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: BEEN THREE AND A HALF, FOUR YEARS-- OR LONGER,

ACTUALLY.

>> Meghan: WE WERE SAYING-- GOSH, IT MUST HAVE BEEN YEARS

AGO WE WERE SITTING IN NOTTINGHAM-- I WAS SITTING IN

NOTTINGHAM COTTAGE, AND "THE LITTLE MERMAID" CAME ON.

NOW, WHO WATCHES-- WHO AS AN ADULT REALLY WATCHES "THE LITTLE

MERMAID"?

BUT IT CAME ON, AND I WAS LIKE, "WELL, I'M JUST HERE ALL THE

TIME, SO I MAY AS WELL WATCH THIS."

AND I WENT, "OH, MY GOD!

SHE FALLS IN LOVE WITH THE PRINCE, AND BECAUSE OF THAT,

SHE HAS TO LOSE HER VOICE."

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Meghan: BUT BY THE END, SHE GETS HER VOICE BACK.

>> Oprah: GETS HER VOICE BACK.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: AND THIS IS WHAT HAPPENED HERE.

YOU FEEL LIKE YOU GOT YOUR VOICE BACK.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: SO, YOU-- YOU'RE STEPPING BACK OUT OF

FRUSTRATION, AND YOU JUST NEED TO GET OUT.

AND, YOU KNOW, YOU HEARD MEGHAN SHARE WITH US ALL...

>> Prince Harry: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: ...THE MOMENT THAT SHE CAME TO YOU, HAD THE COURAGE

ENOUGH TO SAY OUT LOUD...

>> Prince Harry: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: ..."I DON'T WANT TO LIVE ANYMORE."

>> Prince Harry: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: AND YOU DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO DO.

>> Prince Harry: I HAD NO IDEA WHAT TO DO.

I WASN'T-- I WASN'T PREPARED FOR THAT.

I WENT-- I WENT TO A VERY DARK PLACE, AS WELL.

BUT I-- I WANTED TO BE THERE FOR HER AND...

>> Meghan: ALSO, WE DIDN'T LEAVE RIGHT THAT MINUTE, RIGHT?

>> Prince Harry: ...I WAS TERRIFIED.

>> Meghan: WE STILL-- THAT'S ALMOST A YEAR AFTER.

>> Oprah: SO, THEN, DID YOU TELL OTHER PEOPLE IN THE FAMILY, "I

HAVE TO GET HELP FOR HER?

WE NEED HELP FOR HER"?

>> Prince Harry: NO.

THAT'S JUST NOT A CONVERSATION THAT WOULD BE HAD.

>> Oprah: WHY?

>> Prince Harry: I GUESS I WAS ASHAMED OF ADMITTING IT TO THEM.

>> Oprah: OH.

>> Prince Harry: AND I DON'T KNOW WHETHER-- I DON'T KNOW

WHETHER THEY'VE HAD THE SAME-- WHETHER THEY'VE HAD THE SAME

FEELINGS OR THOUGHTS.

I HAVE NO IDEA.

AND IT'S A VERY TRAPPING ENVIRONMENT THAT A LOT OF THEM

ARE STUCK IN.

>> Oprah: YOU WERE ASHAMED OF ADMITTING THAT MEGHAN NEEDED

HELP.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Prince Harry: I DIDN'T HAVE ANYONE TO TURN TO.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Prince Harry: YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT SOME VERY CLOSE FRIENDS

THAT-- THAT HAVE BEEN WITH US THROUGH THIS WHOLE PROCESS, BUT

FOR THE FAMILY, THEY VERY MUCH HAVE THIS MENTALITY OF "THIS IS

JUST HOW IT IS.

THIS IS HOW IT'S MEANT TO BE.

YOU CAN'T CHANGE IT.

WE'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH IT."

>> Oprah: "WE'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH THE PRESSURE.

WE'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH BEING EXPLOITED."

>> Prince Harry: YES.

BUT WHAT WAS DIFFERENT FOR ME WAS THE RACE ELEMENT, BECAUSE

NOW IT WASN'T JUST ABOUT HER, BUT IT IS ABOUT WHAT SHE

REPRESENTS.

AND, THEREFORE, IT WASN'T JUST AFFECTING MY WIFE.

IT WAS AFFECTING SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE, AS WELL.

AND THAT'S-- THAT WAS THE TRIGGER FOR ME TO REALLY ENGAGE

IN THOSE CONVERSATIONS WITH PALACE-- SENIOR PALACE STAFF AND

WITH MY FAMILY TO SAY, "GUYS, THIS IS NOT GOING TO END WELL."

>> Oprah: AND WHEN YOU SAY "END WELL," WHAT DID YOU MEAN?

>> Prince Harry: FOR ANYONE IT'S NOT GOING TO END WELL, BECAUSE

THE WAY THAT I SAW IT WAS THERE WAS A WAY OF DOING THINGS, BUT

FOR US, FOR THIS UNION AND THE SPECIFICS AROUND HER RACE, THERE

WAS AN OPPORTUNITY, MANY OPPORTUNITIES, FOR MY FAMILY TO

SHOW SOME PUBLIC SUPPORT.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Prince Harry: AND I GUESS ONE OF THE MOST TELLING PARTS AND

THE SADDEST PARTS, I GUESS, WAS OVER 70 MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT,

FEMALE MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT-- BOTH CONSERVATIVE AND LABOR--

CAME OUT AND CALLED OUT THE-- THE COLONIAL UNDERTONES OF

ARTICLES AND HEADLINES WRITTEN ABOUT MEGHAN.

YET NO ONE FROM MY FAMILY EVER SAID ANYTHING OVER THOSE THREE

YEARS.

AND THAT-- THAT HURTS.

BUT I ALSO AM ACUTELY AWARE OF WHERE MY FAMILY STAND AND HOW

SCARED THEY ARE OF THE TABLOIDS TURNING ON THEM.

>> Oprah: TURNING ON THEM FOR WHAT?

THEY'RE THE ROYAL FAMILY.

>> Prince Harry: YES, BUT IT'S-- THERE IS THIS INVISIBLE--

WHAT'S-- WHAT'S TERMED OR REFERRED TO AS THE "INVISIBLE

CONTRACT" BEHIND CLOSED DOORS BETWEEN THE INSTITUTION AND THE

TABLOIDS, THE U.K. TABLOIDS.

>> Oprah: HOW SO?

>> Prince Harry: WELL, IT IS-- TO SIMPLIFY IT, IT'S A CASE OF

IF YOU-- IF YOU AS A FAMILY MEMBER ARE WILLING TO WINE,

DINE, AND GIVE FULL ACCESS TO THESE REPORTERS, THEN YOU WILL

GET BETTER PRESS.

>> Oprah: WHAT DO YOU CARE ABOUT BETTER PRESS IF YOU'RE ROYAL?

>> Prince Harry: I THINK EVERYONE NEEDS TO HAVE SOME

COMPASSION FOR-- FOR THEM IN THAT SITUATION, RIGHT?

THERE IS A LEVEL OF CONTROL BY FEAR THAT HAS EXISTED FOR

GENERATIONS-- I MEAN, GENERATIONS.

>> Oprah: BUT WHO'S CONTROLLING WHOM?

IT'S THE INSTITUTION.

FROM OUR POINT OF VIEW, JUST THE PUBLIC, IT'S--

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, BUT THE INSTITUTION SURVIVES BASED ON

THAT, ON THAT PERCEPTION.

SO, ACTUALLY, IF YOU DON'T-- >> Oprah: SO, YOU'RE SAYING

THERE'S THIS RELATIONSHIP THAT MEGHAN WAS SPEAKING OF, IT'S

LIKE SYMBIOTIC.

ONE LIVES OR THRIVES BECAUSE THE OTHER EXISTS.

>> Meghan: MM.

>> Oprah: THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

>> Prince Harry: THAT'S THE-- THAT'S THE IDEA, YEAH.

>> Meghan: WELL, SEE, I THINK THERE'S A REASON THAT THESE

TABLOIDS HAVE HOLIDAY PARTIES AT THE PALACE.

THEY'RE HOSTED BY THE PALACE, THE TABLOIDS ARE.

YOU KNOW, THERE IS A CONSTRUCT THAT'S AT PLAY THERE.

AND BECAUSE, FROM THE BEGINNING OF OUR RELATIONSHIP,

THEY WERE SO ATTACKING AND INCITING SO MUCH RACISM, REALLY,

IT CHANGED OUR-- THE RISK LEVEL, BECAUSE IT WENT-- IT WASN'T JUST

CATTY GOSSIP.

IT WAS BRINGING OUT A PART OF PEOPLE THAT WAS RACIST IN HOW IT

WAS CHARGED.

AND THAT CHANGED THE THREAT.

THAT CHANGED THE LEVEL OF DEATH THREATS.

THAT CHANGED EVERYTHING.

>> Oprah: SO, TELL ME THIS: YOU SAID A MOMENT AGO, IT HURTS THAT

YOUR FAMILY HAS NEVER ACKNOWLEDGED THE ROLE THAT

RACISM PLAYED IN HERE.

DID YOU THINK SHE WAS WELL RECEIVED IN THE BEGINNING?

>> Prince Harry: YES.

FAR BETTER THAN I EXPECTED.

( LAUGHTER ) BUT, YOU KNOW, MY-- MY

GRANDMOTHER HAS BEEN AMAZING THROUGHOUT.

YOU KNOW, MY FATHER, MY BROTHER, KATE AND-- AND ALL THE REST OF

THE FAMILY, THEY WERE.

THEY WERE REALLY WELCOMING.

BUT IT REALLY CHANGED AFTER THE AUSTRALIA TOUR, AFTER OUR SOUTH

PACIFIC TOUR.

>> Meghan: THAT'S WHEN WE ANNOUNCED WE WERE PREGNANT WITH

ARCHIE.

THAT WAS OUR FIRST TOUR.

>> Prince Harry: BUT IT WAS ALSO-- IT WAS ALSO THE FIRST

TIME THAT THE FAMILY GOT TO SEE HOW INCREDIBLE SHE IS AT THE

JOB.

AND THAT BROUGHT BACK MEMORIES.

>> Oprah: I'M THINKING, BECAUSE I WATCH "THE CROWN," OKAY?

I WATCH "THE CROWN."

DO YOU ALL WATCH "THE CROWN"?

>> Meghan: ( LAUGHS ) >> Prince Harry: I'VE WATCHED

SOME OF IT.

YOU'VE WATCHED SOME OF IT?

>> Meghan: I'VE WATCHED SOME OF IT.

>> Oprah: BUT THERE'S THIS-- I THINK IT WAS THE FOURTH SEASON,

ACTUALLY, WHERE THERE IS AN AUSTRALIAN TOUR.

SO, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT?

IT BROUGHT BACK MEMORIES OF THAT?

THE AUSTRALIAN TOUR...

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Oprah: ...WHERE YOUR FATHER AND YOUR MOTHER WENT THERE, AND

YOUR MOTHER WAS BEDAZZLING?

SO, ARE YOU SAYING THAT THERE WERE HINTS OF JEALOUSY?

>> Prince Harry: LOOK, I-- I JUST WISH THAT WE WOULD ALL

LEARN FROM THE PAST.

BUT TO SEE THE-- TO SEE HOW EFFORTLESS IT WAS FOR MEGHAN TO

COME INTO THE FAMILY SO QUICKLY IN AUSTRALIA AND ACROSS NEW

ZEALAND, FIJI, AND TONGA, AND JUST BE ABLE TO CONNECT WITH

PEOPLE IN SUCH A-- >> Oprah: BUT--

>> Prince Harry: I KNOW, I KNOW, I KNOW, I KNOW.

BUT IT'S-- >> Oprah: WHY-- I MEAN, WHY

WOULDN'T EVERYBODY LOVE THAT?

ISN'T THAT WHAT YOU WANT?

YOU WANT HER TO COME INTO THE FAMILY AND TO, AS THE QUEEN SAID

AT ONE POINT, THE WAY THAT MEGHAN HAD BASICALLY-- NOT HER

WORDS-- BUT ASSIMILATED INTO THE FAMILY.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, I THINK, YOU KNOW, AS WE TALKED ABOUT,

SHE WAS VERY MUCH WELCOMED INTO THE FAMILY, NOT JUST BY THE

FAMILY, BUT BY THE WORLD.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: CERTAINLY BY THE COMMONWEALTH.

I MEAN, HERE YOU HAVE ONE OF THE GREATEST ASSETS TO THE

COMMONWEALTH THAT THE FAMILY COULD HAVE EVER WISHED FOR.

>> Oprah: I JUST CAN'T-- I'M KIND OF GOING BACK TO THIS.

SO, THEN, YOU'RE IN CANADA BECAUSE YOU HAD STEPPED BACK.

YOUR FIRM SAYS YOU'RE NO LONGER GOING TO HAVE PROTECTION.

SO, DID YOU ASK FOR THAT?

BECAUSE DID YOU WANT-- WERE YOU TRYING TO HAVE IT BOTH WAYS?

YOU WANTED TO STEP BACK BUT ALSO KEEP YOUR FOOT IN ROYAL

BUSINESS, IT SEEMS.

>> Prince Harry: IT'S INTERESTING THAT YOU TALK ABOUT

IT BEING, YOU KNOW, "HAVE IT BOTH WAYS" ON THE-- ON THE

SECURITY ELEMENT.

I NEVER THOUGHT THAT I WOULD HAVE MY SECURITY REMOVED,

BECAUSE I WAS BORN INTO THIS POSITION.

I INHERITED THE RISK.

SO, THAT WAS A SHOCK TO ME.

THAT WAS WHAT COMPLETELY CHANGED THE WHOLE PLAN.

>> Oprah: SO, THAT YOU AS PRINCE HARRY ARE GOING TO HAVE YOUR

SECURITY REMOVED.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

AND I EVEN-- AND I EVEN WROTE LETTERS TO HIS FAMILY SAYING,

"PLEASE, IT'S VERY CLEAR THE PROTECTION OF ME OR ARCHIE IS

NOT A PRIORITY.

I ACCEPT THAT.

THAT IS FINE.

PLEASE KEEP MY HUSBAND SAFE.

I SEE THE DEATH THREATS.

I SEE THE RACIST PROPAGANDA.

PLEASE KEEP HIM SAFE.

PLEASE DON'T PULL HIS SECURITY AND ANNOUNCE TO THE WORLD WHEN

HE AND WE ARE MOST VULNERABLE."

AND THEY SAID IT'S JUST NOT POSSIBLE.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

I THINK WHAT WE REALLY HAVE GOT TO CLEAR UP HERE IS BECAUSE ONE

OF THE STORIES THAT CONTINUES TO LIVE, EITHER THROUGH RUMORS OR

SOCIAL MEDIA, OUT IN THE WORLD, IS THAT YOU, MEGHAN, ARE THE ONE

WHO MANIPULATED, CALCULATED, AND ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS MEGXIT.

>> Meghan: OH, MY GOSH.

IT'S AMAZING HOW THEY CAN USE MEG FOR EVERYTHING.

>> Oprah: YES.

THERE ARE EVEN STORIES THAT YOU KNEW ALL ALONG THAT THIS WAS

GOING TO HAPPEN.

YOU WENT THROUGH THE WHOLE PROCESS, AND IT WAS ALL

INTENTIONAL TO BUILD YOUR BRAND.

>> Meghan: CAN YOU IMAGINE HOW LITTLE SENSE THAT MAKES?

I LEFT MY CAREER, MY LIFE.

I LEFT EVERYTHING BECAUSE I LOVE HIM, RIGHT?

AND OUR PLAN WAS TO DO THIS FOREVER.

>> Prince Harry: YES.

>> Meghan: OUR PLAN-- FOR ME, I MEAN, I WROTE LETTERS TO HIS

FAMILY WHEN I GOT THERE, SAYING, "I AM DEDICATED TO THIS.

I'M HERE FOR YOU.

USE ME AS YOU'D LIKE."

THERE WAS NO GUIDANCE, AS WELL, RIGHT?

THERE WERE CERTAIN THINGS THAT YOU COULDN'T DO.

BUT, YOU KNOW, UNLIKE WHAT YOU SEE IN THE MOVIES, THERE'S NO

CLASS ON HOW TO-- HOW TO SPEAK, HOW TO CROSS YOUR LEGS, HOW TO

BE ROYAL.

THERE'S NONE OF THAT TRAINING.

THAT MIGHT EXIST FOR OTHER MEMBERS OF THE FAMILY.

THAT WAS NOT SOMETHING THAT WAS OFFERED TO ME.

>> Oprah: SO, NOBODY TELLS YOU ANYTHING?

>> Meghan: NO.

>> Oprah: NOBODY PREPARES YOU.

>> Meghan: NOBODY EVEN-- >> Prince Harry: THERE'S--

>> Meghan: SORRY, BUT EVEN DOWN TO, LIKE, THE NATIONAL ANTHEM.

NO ONE THOUGHT TO SAY, "OH, YOU'RE AMERICAN.

YOU'RE NOT GOING TO KNOW THAT."

THAT'S ME LATE AT NIGHT, GOOGLING HOW-- WHAT'S THE

NATIONAL-- I'VE GOT TO LEARN THIS.

I DON'T WANT TO EMBARRASS THEM.

I NEED TO LEARN THESE 30 HYMNS FOR CHURCH.

ALL OF THIS IS TELEVISED.

WE WERE DOING THE TRAINING BEHIND THE SCENES, BECAUSE I

JUST WANTED TO MAKE THEM PROUD.

>> Oprah: OKAY, BUT HERE'S THE QUESTION: DO YOU THINK YOU WOULD

HAVE LEFT OR EVER STEPPED BACK WERE IT NOT FOR MEGHAN?

>> Meghan: HM.

>> Prince Harry: NO.

THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION IS NO.

>> Oprah: YOU WOULD NOT HAVE.

>> Prince Harry: I WOULDN'T HAVE-- I WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN ABLE

TO, BECAUSE I MYSELF WAS TRAPPED, AS WELL.

I DIDN'T SEE A WAY OUT.

>> Oprah: SHE FELT TRAPPED, YOU WERE TRAPPED?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, I DIDN'T SEE A WAY OUT.

>> Oprah: BUT YOU'D THIS LIFE, YOUR WHOLE LIFE.

THIS HAS BEEN YOUR LIFE YOUR WHOLE LIFE.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, BUT, YOU KNOW, I WAS TRAPPED, BUT I

DIDN'T KNOW I WAS TRAPPED.

>> Oprah: MM.

>> Prince Harry: BUT THE MOMENT THAT I MET MEG, AND THEN OUR

WORLDS SORT OF COLLIDED IN THE MOST AMAZING OF WAYS, AND THEN

TO SEE HOW-- >> Oprah: PLEASE EXPLAIN HOW

YOU, PRINCE HARRY, RAISED IN A PALACE AND A LIFE OF PRIVILEGE--

LITERALLY, A PRINCE-- HOW YOU WERE TRAPPED.

>> Prince Harry: TRAPPED WITHIN THE SYSTEM, LIKE THE REST OF MY

FAMILY ARE.

MY FATHER AND MY BROTHER, THEY ARE TRAPPED.

THEY DON'T GET TO LEAVE.

AND I HAVE HUGE COMPASSION FOR THAT.

>> Oprah: WELL, OKAY, SO THE IMPRESSION OF THE WORLD-- MAYBE

IT'S A FALSE IMPRESSION-- IS THAT, FOR ALL THESE YEARS BEFORE

MEGHAN, YOU WERE LIVING YOUR LIFE AS A ROYAL, PRINCE HARRY--

THE BELOVED PRINCE HARRY-- AND THAT YOU WERE ENJOYING THAT

LIFE.

WE DIDN'T GET THE IMPRESSION THAT YOU WERE FEELING TRAPPED

IN THAT LIFE.

>> Prince Harry: ENJOYING THE LIFE BECAUSE THERE WERE

PHOTOGRAPHS OF ME SMILING WHILE I WAS SHAKING HANDS AND MEETING

PEOPLE?

LIKE, I'M SURE YOU GUYS HAVE COVERED SOME OF THAT.

THAT'S-- THAT'S A PART OF THE JOB.

THAT'S A PART OF THE ROLE.

THAT'S WHAT'S EXPECTED.

NO MATTER WHO YOU ARE IN THE FAMILY, NO MATTER WHAT'S GOING

ON IN YOUR PERSONAL LIFE, NO MATTER WHAT'S JUST HAPPENED, IF

THE BIKES ROLL UP AND THE CAR ROLLS UP, YOU GOT TO GET

DRESSED, YOU GOT TO GET IN THERE.

YOU WIPE YOUR TEARS AWAY, SHAKE OFF WHATEVER YOU'RE THINKING

ABOUT, AND YOU GOT TO BE ON YOUR "A" GAME.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

WHAT WOULD YOU THINK YOUR MOM WOULD SAY ABOUT THIS STEPPING

BACK, THIS DECISION TO STEP BACK FROM THE ROYAL FAMILY?

HOW WOULD SHE FEEL ABOUT THIS MOMENT?

>> Prince Harry: I THINK SHE WOULD FEEL VERY ANGRY WITH HOW

THIS HAS PANNED OUT, AND VERY SAD.

BUT, ULTIMATELY, SHE'D-- ALL SHE'D EV-- ALL SHE'D EVER WANT

IS FOR US TO BE HAPPY.

>> Oprah: MEGHAN SHARED WITH US THAT THERE WAS A CONVERSATION

WITH YOU ABOUT ARCHIE'S SKIN TONE.

>> Prince Harry: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: WHAT WAS THAT CONVERSATION?

>> Oprah: YOU WANTED FREEDOM FROM-- FROM THAT LIFE.

YOU WANTED FREEDOM TO MAKE YOUR OWN MONEY.

YOU WANTED FREEDOM TO MAKE DEALS WITH NETFLIX AND SPOTIFY.

BUT YOU ALSO WANTED TO SERVE THE QUEEN.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, WE DIDN'T WANT TO-- WE DIDN'T WANT TO GIVE

UP, OR WE DIDN'T WANT TO TURN OUR BACKS ON THE ASSOCIATIONS

AND THE PEOPLE THAT WE-- THAT WE'VE BEEN SUPPORTING.

>> Meghan: BUT ALSO, OPRAH, IT EXISTS.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, IT EXISTS.

BUT, ALSO, THE NETFLIX AND THE SPOTIFY, THEY'RE ALL-- THAT WAS

NEVER PART OF THE PLAN.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T HAVE A PLAN.

>> Meghan: WE DIDN'T HAVE A PLAN.

>> Prince Harry: WE DIDN'T HAVE A PLAN.

THAT WAS SUGGESTED BY SOMEBODY ELSE BY THE POINT OF WHERE MY

FAMILY LITERALLY CUT ME OFF FINANCIALLY, AND I HAD TO

AFFORD-- AFFORD SECURITY FOR-- FOR US.

>> Oprah: WAIT.

HOLD-- HOLD UP.

WAIT A MINUTE.

YOUR FAMILY CUT YOU OFF?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, IN THE FIRST HALF, THE FIRST QUARTER OF

2020.

BUT I'VE GOT WHAT MY MUM LEFT ME, AND, WITHOUT THAT, WE WOULD

NOT HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO THIS.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Prince Harry: SO, YOU KNOW, TOUCHING BACK ON WHAT YOU ASKED

ME, WHAT MY MUM WOULD THINK OF THIS, I THINK SHE SAW IT COMING.

AND I CERTAINLY FELT HER PRESENCE THROUGHOUT THIS WHOLE

PROCESS.

AND, YOU KNOW, FOR ME, I'M-- I'M JUST REALLY RELIEVED AND HAPPY

TO BE SITTING HERE TALKING TO YOU WITH MY WIFE BY MY SIDE.

BECAUSE I CAN'T BEGIN TO IMAGINE WHAT IT MUST HAVE BEEN LIKE FOR

HER GOING THROUGH THIS PROCESS BY HERSELF ALL THOSE YEARS AGO,

BECAUSE IT'S BEEN UNBELIEVABLY TOUGH FOR THE TWO OF US, BUT AT

LEAST WE HAD EACH OTHER.

>> Oprah: WHAT'S YOUR RELATIONSHIP LIKE NOW WITH YOUR

FAMILY?

>> Prince Harry: I'VE SPOKEN MOR-- MORE TO MY GRANDMOTHER IN

THE LAST YEAR THAN I HAVE DONE FOR MANY, MANY YEARS.

>> Oprah: DO YOU ALL HAVE ZOOM CALLS?

>> Prince Harry: WE DID A COUPLE OF ZOOM CALLS WITH ARCHIE.

>> Meghan: SOMETIMES, YES, SO THEY CAN SEE ARCHIE.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: MY GRANDMOTHER AND I HAVE A REALLY GOOD

RELATIONSHIP...

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Prince Harry: ...AND AN UNDERSTANDING.

AND I HAVE A DEEP RESPECT FOR HER.

SHE'S MY COLONEL IN CHIEF, RIGHT?

SHE ALWAYS WILL BE.

>> Oprah: YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR FATHER?

IS HE TAKING YOUR CALLS NOW?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

YEAH, HE IS.

THERE'S A LOT TO WORK THROUGH THERE, YOU KNOW?

I-- I FEEL REALLY LET DOWN, BECAUSE HE'S BEEN THROUGH

SOMETHING SIMILAR.

HE KNOWS WHAT PAIN FEELS LIKE, AND THIS IS-- AND ARCHIE'S HIS

GRANDSON.

AND-- BUT, AT THE SAME TIME, YOU KNOW, I-- OF COURSE I WILL

ALWAYS-- I WILL ALWAYS LOVE HIM, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF HURT THAT'S

HAPPENED.

AND-- AND I WILL CONTINUE TO-- TO MAKE IT ONE OF MY PRIORITIES

TO TRY AND HEAL THAT RELATIONSHIP.

AND-- BUT THEY ONLY KNOW WHAT THEY KNOW, AND THAT'S THE THING.

I'VE TRIED TO-- >> Meghan: OR WHAT THEY'RE TOLD.

>> Prince Harry: OR WHAT THEY'RE TOLD.

AND I'VE TRIED TO EDUCATE THEM THROUGH THE PROCESS THAT I HAVE

BEEN EDUCATED.

>> Oprah: BECAUSE IS IT LIKE BEING IN A BIG ROYAL BUBBLE?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

AND YOUR BROTHER?

RELATIONSHIP?

MUCH HAS BEEN SAID ABOUT THAT.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, AND MUCH WILL CONTINUE TO BE SAID ABOUT

THAT.

YOU KNOW, AS I'VE SAID BEFORE, I LOVE WILLIAM TO BITS.

HE'S MY BROTHER.

WE'VE BEEN THROUGH HELL TOGETHER.

I MEAN, WE HAVE A SHARED EXPERIENCE.

BUT WE-- YOU KNOW, WE'RE ON-- WE'RE ON DIFFERENT PATHS.

>> Oprah: WELL, WHAT IS PARTICULARLY STRIKING IS WHAT

MEGHAN SHARED WITH US EARLIER, IS THAT NO ONE WANTS TO ADMIT

THAT THERE'S ANYTHING ABOUT RACE OR THAT RACE HAS PLAYED A ROLE

IN THE TROLLING AND THE VITRIOL, AND YET MEGHAN SHARED WITH US

THAT THERE WAS A CONVERSATION WITH YOU ABOUT ARCHIE'S SKIN

TONE.

>> Prince Harry: MM-HMM.

>> Oprah: WHAT WAS THAT CONVERSATION?

>> Prince Harry: THAT CONVERSATION I'M NEVER GOING TO

SHARE, BUT AT THE TIME-- AT THE TIME, IT WAS AWKWARD.

I WAS A BIT SHOCKED.

>> Oprah: CAN YOU-- CAN YOU TELL US WHAT THE QUESTION WAS?

>> Prince Harry: NO.

I DON'T-- I'M NOT COMFORTABLE WITH SHARING THAT.

>> Oprah: OKAY.

>> Prince Harry: BUT THAT WAS-- THAT WAS RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING,

RIGHT?

>> Oprah: LIKE, WHAT WILL THE BABY LOOK LIKE?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, WHAT WILL THE KIDS LOOK LIKE?

>> Oprah: WHAT WILL THE KIDS LOOK LIKE?

>> Prince Harry: BUT THAT WAS RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING, WHEN SHE

WASN'T GOING TO GET SECURITY, WHEN MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY WERE

SUGGESTING THAT SHE CARRIES ON ACTING, BECAUSE THERE WAS NOT

ENOUGH MONEY TO PAY FOR HER, AND ALL THIS SORT OF STUFF.

LIKE, THERE WAS SOME REAL OBVIOUS SIGNS BEFORE WE EVEN GOT

MARRIED THAT THIS WAS GOING TO BE REALLY HARD.

>> Oprah: SO, IN CONCLUSION, IF YOU'D HAD THE SUPPORT, YOU'D

STILL BE THERE?

>> Prince Harry: WITHOUT QUESTION.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: I'M SAD THAT-- THAT WHAT'S HAPPENED HAS

HAPPENED, BUT I KNOW, AND I'M COMFORTABLE IN KNOWING THAT WE

DID EVERYTHING THAT WE COULD TO MAKE IT WORK.

AND WE DID EVERYTHING ON THE EXIT PROCESS THE WAY THAT-- THE

WAY THAT IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE.

>> Meghan: WITH AS MUCH RESPECT.

>> Prince Harry: WITH AS MUCH RESPECT.

>> Meghan: AND, OH, MY GOD, WE JUST DID EVERYTHING WE COULD

TO-- TO PROTECT THEM.

>> Oprah: SO, WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THE PEOPLE WHO SAY THAT YOU CAME

HERE, YOU MADE THESE MULTIMILLION-DOLLAR DEALS, AND

THAT YOU'RE JUST MONEY-GRABBING ROYALS?

>> Prince Harry: FIRST OFF, THIS WAS NEVER THE INTENTION.

>> Oprah: MM-HMM.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: AND WE'RE CERTAINLY NOT COMPLAINING.

WE-- OUR LIFE IS GREAT NOW.

WE'VE GOT A BEAUTIFUL HOUSE.

WE'VE GOT A BEAUTIFUL-- I'VE GOT A BEAUTIFUL FAMILY.

AND THE DOGS-- THE DOGS ARE REALLY HAPPY.

BUT, AT THE TIME, DURING COVID, THE SUGGESTION BY A FRIEND WAS

WHAT ABOUT STREAMERS?

>> Meghan: YEAH, WE GENUINELY HADN'T THOUGHT ABOUT THAT

BEFORE.

>> Prince Harry: WE HADN'T THOUGHT ABOUT IT.

SO, THERE WERE ALL SORTS OF DIFFERENT OPTIONS.

AND, LOOK, FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, ALL I NEEDED WAS ENOUGH MONEY TO

BE ABLE TO PAY FOR SECURITY TO KEEP MY FAMILY SAFE.

>> Oprah: MM.

HOW WILL YOU USE ARCHEWELL AS A MEANS OF SPEAKING TO THINGS THAT

ARE IMPORTANT TO YOU IN THE WORLD?

>> Meghan: I THINK IN CREATING-- I MEAN, LIFE IS ABOUT

STORYTELLING, RIGHT?

ABOUT THE STORIES WE TELL OURSELVES, THE STORIES WE'RE

TOLD, WHAT WE BUY INTO.

AND-- AND FOR US TO BE ABLE TO HAVE STORYTELLING THROUGH A

TRUTHFUL LENS, THAT HOPEFULLY IS UPLIFTING, IS GOING TO BE GREAT

KNOWING HOW MANY PEOPLE THAT THAT CAN LAND WITH, AND BEING

ABLE TO GIVE A VOICE TO A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE UNDERREPRESENTED

AND AREN'T REALLY HEARD.

>> Oprah: ANY REGRETS?

>> Meghan: THIS MORNING, I WOKE UP EARLIER THAN H. AND SAW A

NOTE FROM SOMEONE ON OUR TEAM IN THE U.K. SAYING THAT THE DUKE OF

EDINBURGH HAD GONE TO THE HOSPITAL.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Meghan: BUT I JUST PICKED UP THE PHONE, AND I-- I CALLED THE

QUEEN JUST TO CHECK IN...

>> Oprah: YOU CHECK IN.

>> Meghan: JUST LIKE, I WOULD, YOU KNOW-- THAT'S WHAT WE DO.

IT'S LIKE BEING ABLE TO DEFAULT TO NOT HAVING TO EVERY MOMENT

GO, IS THAT APPROPRIATE?

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: FOR SO MANY IN MY FAMILY, WHAT THEY DO IS,

THERE'S A LEVEL OF CONTROL IN IT, RIGHT?

BECAUSE THEY'RE FEARFUL OF WHAT THE PAPERS ARE GOING TO SAY

ABOUT THEM.

>> Oprah: YEAH.

>> Prince Harry: WHEREAS, WITH US, IT WAS JUST LIKE, JUST BE--

JUST BE YOURSELF.

JUST BE GENUINE.

JUST BE AUTHENTIC.

JUST GO AND DO WHAT IT IS.

IF YOU GET IT WRONG, YOU GET IT WRONG.

IF YOU GET IT RIGHT, YOU GET IT RIGHT.

>> Oprah: ON FEBRUARY 19, 2021, BUCKINGHAM PALACE RELEASED A

STATEMENT ANNOUNCING IT WAS AGREED THAT PRINCE HARRY AND

MEGHAN WOULD NOT RETURN AS WORKING MEMBERS OF THE ROYAL

FAMILY.

HARRY AND MEGHAN'S ROYAL PATRONAGES AND PRINCE HARRY'S

HONORARY MILITARY TITLES WOULD BE RETURNED TO THE QUEEN.

THE QUEEN'S STATEMENT WAS RELEASED AFTER OUR INTERVIEW

TOOK PLACE.

YOUR EXIT AGREEMENT WITH THE ROYAL FAMILY, IT'S-- THAT IS

COMING UP AT THE END OF THIS MONTH.

>> Prince Harry: THE DECISION IS, I THINK.

YEAH, I MEAN, THE DECISION-- WHAT, AS OF LAST WEEK, OR

WHATEVER IT WAS-- IS THAT THEY WILL BE REMOVING EVERYTHING.

>> Oprah: ARE YOU HURT BY THAT DECISION?

>> Prince Harry: I AM HURT.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I COMPLETELY RESPECT MY

GRANDMOTHER'S DECISION.

I WOULD STILL LOVE FOR US TO BE ABLE TO CONTINUE TO SUPPORT

THOSE ASSOCIATIONS, ALBEIT WITHOUT THE TITLE OR THE ROLE.

>> Oprah: COULD YOU BE AS SATISFIED NOW, DOING THIS

THROUGH YOUR OWN ORGANIZATION, ARCHEWELL?

>> Meghan: WELL, WE-- THIS IS WHAT WE'RE DOING, RIGHT?

WE'RE STILL DOING IT.

WE'RE STILL GOING TO ALWAYS DO THE WORK.

BUT I ALSO THINK IT'S IMPORTANT FOR YOU OR EVERYONE TO KNOW THIS

DECISION THAT WAS MADE ABOUT PATRONAGES AND ALL OF THAT WAS

BEFORE ANYONE KNEW THAT WE WERE SITTING DOWN WITH YOU.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Meghan: I THINK THAT IT'S-- I CAN ONLY IMAGINE--

>> Oprah: I HEARD A STORY THAT YOU'RE GETTING PUNISHED NOW.

THOSE WERE BEING TAKEN AWAY BECAUSE YOU DID SIT DOWN

WITH ME.

>> Meghan: YEAH, BUT THAT WAS-- THOSE LETTERS, THOSE

CONVERSATIONS, THAT WAS-- THAT WAS FINALIZED BEFORE ANYONE EVEN

KNEW THAT WE WERE GOING TO SIT DOWN.

SO, THAT'S JUST NOT TRUE.

>> Oprah: ALL RIGHT, TELL ME THIS, HARRY: WHAT DELIGHTS YOU

NOW IN YOUR EVERYDAY EXPERIENCE AND THE THINGS THAT YOU ACTUALLY

CHERISH IN YOUR LIFE HERE WITH ARCHIE AND MEGHAN?

>> Prince Harry: THIS YEAR HAS BEEN CRAZY FOR EVERYBODY, BUT

TO HAVE OUTDOOR SPACE WHERE I CAN GO FOR WALKS WITH ARCHIE,

AND WE CAN GO FOR WALKS AS A FAMILY AND WITH THE DOGS, AND WE

CAN GO ON HIKES-- WE'LL GO DOWN TO THE BEACH, WHICH IS SO

CLOSE-- ALL OF THESE THINGS ARE JUST-- I GUESS, THE HIGHLIGHT

FOR ME IS STICKING HIM ON THE BACK OF THE BICYCLE IN HIS

LITTLE BABY SEAT AND TAKE HIM ON THESE BIKE RIDES, WHICH IS

SOMETHING I WAS NEVER ABLE TO DO WHEN I WAS YOUNG.

I CAN SEE HIM ON THE BACK, AND HE'S GOT HIS ARMS OUT.

AND HE'S LIKE "WHOO," CHATTING, CHATTING, CHATTING; GOING, "PALM

TREE, HOUSE," AND ALL THIS SORT OF STUFF.

AND I DO-- I THINK TO MYSELF-- >> Oprah: WHAT'S HIS NEW

FAVORITE WORD?

WHAT'S HIS FAVORITE WORD NOW?

>> Meghan: OH, MY GOSH.

HE'S ON A ROLL.

IN THE PAST COUPLE WEEKS, IT HAS BEEN "HYDRATE," WHICH IS JUST

HYSTERICAL.

>> Prince Harry: BUT, ALSO, WHENEVER EVERYONE LEAVES THE

HOUSE, HE'S LIKE, "DRIVE SAFE."

>> Meghan: "DRIVE SAFE."

>> Oprah: ( LAUGHS ) >> Prince Harry: WHICH IS

REALLY...

>> Meghan: HE'S NOT EVEN TWO YET!

>> Oprah: YOU SAID THAT YOUR BROTHER WAS TRAPPED.

YOU SAID THAT YOU LOVE YOUR BROTHER AND ALWAYS WILL LOVE

YOUR BROTHER.

YOU DIDN'T TELL ME WHAT THE RELATIONSHIP IS NOW, THOUGH.

>> Prince Harry: THE RELATIONSHIP IS SPACE, AT THE

MOMENT.

AND, YOU KNOW, TIME HEALS ALL THINGS, HOPEFULLY.

>> Oprah: ANY REGRETS?

>> Prince Harry: NO.

I MEAN, NO, I THINK WE'VE DONE-- I'M REALLY PROUD OF US, YOU

KNOW?

I'M SO PROUD OF-- I'M SO PROUD OF MY WIFE.

LIKE, SHE SAFELY DELIVERED ARCHIE DURING A PERIOD OF TIME

WHICH WAS SO CRUEL AND SO MEAN.

AND EVERY SINGLE DAY I WAS COMING BACK FROM WORK, FROM

LONDON, I WAS COMING BACK TO MY WIFE CRYING WHILE BREASTFEEDING

ARCHIE.

THAT'S COMING FROM SOMEONE WHO WASN'T READING ANYTHING.

AND AS SHE TOUCHED ON EARLIER, IF SHE HAD READ ANYTHING, SHE

WOULDN'T BE HERE NOW.

SO, WE DID WHAT WE HAD TO DO, AND NOW WE'VE GOT ANOTHER LITTLE

ONE ON THE WAY.

>> Meghan: I HAVE ONE.

MY REGRET IS BELIEVING THEM WHEN THEY SAID I WOULD BE PROTECTED.

I BELIEVED THAT.

AND I REGRET BELIEVING THAT BECAUSE I THINK, HAD I REALLY

SEEN THAT THAT WASN'T HAPPENING, I WOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO

MORE.

BUT I THINK I WASN'T SUPPOSED TO SEE IT.

I WASN'T SUPPOSED TO KNOW.

AND-- AND NOW, BECAUSE WE'RE ACTUALLY ON THE OTHER SIDE,

WE'VE ACTUALLY NOT JUST SURVIVED BUT ARE THRIVING.

YOU KNOW, THIS-- I MEAN, THIS IS MIRACLES.

I-- YEAH, I THINK THAT ALL OF THOSE THINGS THAT I WAS HOPING

FOR HAVE HAPPENED, AND THIS IS IN SOME WAYS JUST THE BEGINNING

FOR US.

YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN THROUGH A LOT.

IT'S FELT LIKE A LIFETIME.

( LAUGHS ) A LIFETIME.

>> Oprah: SO, YOUR STORY WITH THE PRINCE DOES HAVE A HAPPY

ENDING.

>> Meghan: IT DOES.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

( LAUGHS ) IT REALLY DID.

>> Oprah: IT HAS A HAPPY ENDING BECAUSE YOU MADE IT SO.

>> Meghan: YEAH, GREATER THAN ANY FAIRY TALE YOU'VE EVER READ.

>> Oprah: GREATER THAN ANY FAIRY TALE.

>> Meghan: YEAH, YEAH.

>> Oprah: WHAT YOU'VE DESCRIBED HERE TODAY, BEING TRAPPED AND

NOT EVEN BEING AWARE OF IT AND ALL THE THINGS THAT HAD

TRANSPIRED, AND THEN SHE COMES INTO YOUR LIFE AND THEN YOU'RE

DOING THERAPY, DO YOU THINK IN SOME WAY SHE SAVED YOU?

>> Prince Harry: YEAH.

WITH-- WITHOUT QUESTION.

THERE WAS-- THERE WAS A BIGGER PURPOSE.

THERE WAS OTHER FORCES AT PLAY, I THINK, THROUGHOUT THIS WHOLE

PROCESS.

I'M THE LAST PERSON TO THINK, OOH, YOU KNOW?

BUT IT'S UNDENIABLE WHEN THESE THINGS HAVE HAPPENED, WHERE THE

OVERLAP IS.

SO, YEAH, SHE DID, WITHOUT-- WITHOUT QUESTION SHE SAVED ME.

>> Meghan: AND I WOULD-- I WOULD, I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S

LOVELY.

I WOULD DISAGREE.

I THINK HE SAVED ALL OF US, RIGHT?

HE ULTIMATELY CALLED IT AND WAS LIKE, "WE'VE GOT TO FIND A WAY

FOR US, FOR ARCHIE."

AND YOU MADE A DECISION THAT SAVED-- CERTAINLY SAVED MY LIFE

AND SAVED ALL OF US.

BUT, YOU KNOW, YOU NEED TO WANT TO BE SAVED.

>> Oprah: WELL, THANK YOU FOR SHARING YOUR LOVE STORY.

WE CAN'T WAIT FOR THE BIG DAY SOMETIME THIS SUMMER.

>> Meghan: YES, INDEED.

>> Oprah: SOMETIME THIS SUMMER.

>> Meghan: YEAH.

>> Oprah: THANK YOU BOTH FOR TRUSTING ME TO SHARE YOUR STORY.

>> Meghan: THANK YOU FOR GIVING US THE SPACE TO DO IT.

>> Prince Harry: YEAH, THANK YOU.

>> Oprah: THIS CONVERSATION DOESN'T END HERE.

THERE WAS SO MUCH MORE THAT WE COULDN'T FIT INTO THIS SPECIAL.

JOIN ME TOMORROW AS I SHARE MORE EXCLUSIVE MOMENTS AND DISCUSS

REACTION AROUND THE WORLD WITH GAYLE, ANTHONY AND TONY ON "CBS

THIS MORNING."

SEE YOU THEN.