Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated:
1
00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:12,074
Advertise your product or brand here
contact www.OpenSubtitles.org today
2
00:00:14,305 --> 00:00:16,850
[wind blowing softly]
3
00:00:33,867 --> 00:00:36,453
[soft, indistinct chatter]
4
00:00:58,391 --> 00:01:00,161
[man 1] Ms. Kaiser,
you seem to have traveled a long way
5
00:01:00,185 --> 00:01:02,896
from an idealistic intern
in Barack Obama's campaign
6
00:01:02,979 --> 00:01:06,483
to working for an organization
that keeps pretty unsavory company.
7
00:01:09,611 --> 00:01:11,291
Didn't that make you uncomfortable at all?
8
00:01:17,911 --> 00:01:20,789
[man 2] You referred to having two sets
of business cards.
9
00:01:21,873 --> 00:01:23,083
Who did you work for?
10
00:01:30,298 --> 00:01:33,218
[explosions booming]
11
00:01:40,225 --> 00:01:41,745
[man 1] Don't take this the wrong way.
12
00:01:42,936 --> 00:01:44,646
In your life, have you ever worked for
13
00:01:45,897 --> 00:01:49,567
or provided information
to any country's intelligence agency?
14
00:02:03,790 --> 00:02:05,458
[man] Hi. A small coffee, please?
15
00:02:05,959 --> 00:02:07,418
- Uh, $2.25.
- Great.
16
00:02:13,716 --> 00:02:14,717
All right.
17
00:02:17,554 --> 00:02:21,224
- [phone chimes]
- [man] Who has seen an advertisement
18
00:02:21,808 --> 00:02:23,476
that has convinced you
19
00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:27,480
that your microphone is listening
to your conversations?
20
00:02:29,274 --> 00:02:31,317
[class laughing]
21
00:02:32,110 --> 00:02:34,654
[man] It's hard for us to imagine
how else it could work,
22
00:02:35,113 --> 00:02:38,950
but what's happening
is that your behavior
23
00:02:39,033 --> 00:02:41,119
is being accurately predicted.
24
00:02:41,452 --> 00:02:45,957
So, the ads that seem uncannily accurate,
25
00:02:46,457 --> 00:02:48,668
that have to be eavesdropping on us,
26
00:02:49,377 --> 00:02:51,796
are more likely to be evidence
27
00:02:52,005 --> 00:02:53,756
that the targeting works,
28
00:02:53,923 --> 00:02:55,967
and that it predicts our behavior.
29
00:02:56,801 --> 00:03:00,930
Maybe it's because I grew up
with the Internet as a reality.
30
00:03:01,014 --> 00:03:04,267
The ads don't bother me all that much.
31
00:03:04,517 --> 00:03:06,895
When does it turn sour?
32
00:03:18,656 --> 00:03:20,992
[electronic chiming]
33
00:03:21,534 --> 00:03:22,911
[phone chimes, vibrates]
34
00:03:23,203 --> 00:03:26,581
[female voice over PA]
This is a Brooklyn-bound Q express train.
35
00:03:26,998 --> 00:03:30,043
- The next stop is Canal Street.
- [phone vibrates]
36
00:03:30,126 --> 00:03:31,127
[phone vibrates]
37
00:03:33,588 --> 00:03:35,924
[Carroll] It began with the dream
of a connected world.
38
00:03:38,468 --> 00:03:41,930
A space where everyone could share
each other's experiences
39
00:03:42,347 --> 00:03:43,973
and feel less alone.
40
00:03:46,142 --> 00:03:49,604
It wasn't long before this world
became our matchmaker,
41
00:03:51,981 --> 00:03:55,068
instant fact-checker,
personal entertainer,
42
00:03:55,318 --> 00:03:58,863
guardian of our memories,
even our therapist.
43
00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:01,783
[speaks indistinctly to students]
44
00:04:01,866 --> 00:04:04,827
[Carroll] I was teaching digital media
and developing apps.
45
00:04:05,495 --> 00:04:08,831
So, I knew that the data
from our online activity
46
00:04:08,915 --> 00:04:10,333
wasn't just evaporating.
47
00:04:12,877 --> 00:04:15,546
And as I dug deeper, I realized...
48
00:04:18,258 --> 00:04:20,843
these digital traces of ourselves
49
00:04:21,302 --> 00:04:25,556
are being mined
into a trillion-dollar-a-year industry.
50
00:04:29,519 --> 00:04:31,646
We are now the commodity.
51
00:04:33,523 --> 00:04:35,191
But we were so in love
52
00:04:35,525 --> 00:04:38,111
with the gift of this free connectivity...
53
00:04:39,153 --> 00:04:42,490
that no one bothered to read
the terms and conditions.
54
00:04:49,247 --> 00:04:52,500
- [overlapping voices]
- [digital noise]
55
00:04:57,297 --> 00:04:59,215
[Carroll] All of my interactions,
56
00:04:59,757 --> 00:05:03,052
my credit card swipes, web searches,
57
00:05:03,219 --> 00:05:05,763
locations, my likes,
58
00:05:08,266 --> 00:05:12,687
they're all collected in real time
and attached to my identity,
59
00:05:13,229 --> 00:05:17,817
giving any buyer direct access
to my emotional pulse.
60
00:05:21,779 --> 00:05:25,950
Armed with this knowledge,
they compete for my attention,
61
00:05:27,285 --> 00:05:33,624
feeding me a steady stream of content
built for and seen only by me.
62
00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:41,132
And this is true
for each and every one of us.
63
00:05:43,801 --> 00:05:44,886
What I like,
64
00:05:46,637 --> 00:05:47,764
what I fear,
65
00:05:48,723 --> 00:05:50,224
what gets my attention,
66
00:05:51,476 --> 00:05:55,813
what my boundaries are,
and what it takes to cross them.
67
00:05:58,232 --> 00:05:59,859
[overlapping voices]
68
00:05:59,942 --> 00:06:01,527
[woman 1] Go back to Washington.
69
00:06:01,778 --> 00:06:03,946
[woman 2]
Crooked Hillary tells lots of lies.
70
00:06:04,030 --> 00:06:06,699
The stock market's gonna crash.
I mean, this'll cause a civil war.
71
00:06:08,117 --> 00:06:11,204
[Carroll] We saw the fallout
of our filtered realities
72
00:06:11,287 --> 00:06:12,497
in the 2016 election.
73
00:06:12,580 --> 00:06:14,980
[woman 3] ...you were not offended
when Donald Trump said it!
74
00:06:15,666 --> 00:06:18,419
[overlapping shouts and jeers]
75
00:06:19,837 --> 00:06:22,423
- [man 1] Get the fuck out!
- [angry shouts overlapping]
76
00:06:22,507 --> 00:06:26,386
[Carroll] The real world became
a deeply divided wreckage site.
77
00:06:26,469 --> 00:06:30,515
- [protesters chanting indistinctly]
- [overlapping shouts]
78
00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,518
[man 2]
Fuck those dirty beaners! Build the wall!
79
00:06:34,060 --> 00:06:35,060
[man 3] Whoo!
80
00:06:35,395 --> 00:06:38,106
[men shouting] Fight!
81
00:06:38,523 --> 00:06:42,610
[Carroll] How did the dream
of the connected world tear us apart?
82
00:06:48,449 --> 00:06:50,076
[static crackles]
83
00:07:03,673 --> 00:07:06,801
[Carroll]
My daughter is eight, and my son is four.
84
00:07:07,885 --> 00:07:13,683
Uh, every app is carefully scrutinized
before ins... being installed, and...
85
00:07:14,100 --> 00:07:17,895
And, like, now, I'm the dad
who reads the privacy policy and says,
86
00:07:19,188 --> 00:07:22,275
"No, you see here?
They read your messages.
87
00:07:22,817 --> 00:07:25,027
Are you okay with that?" [chuckles]
88
00:07:27,613 --> 00:07:31,242
That's, like, the new way
I'm gonna be an annoying parent.
89
00:07:33,578 --> 00:07:35,788
- Hey.
- [kids chattering]
90
00:07:36,456 --> 00:07:38,499
[Carroll]
I've been concerned for a long time
91
00:07:38,583 --> 00:07:42,545
about how the misuse
of our data and information
92
00:07:42,628 --> 00:07:44,589
could affect my children's future.
93
00:07:46,757 --> 00:07:50,386
But it wasn't until
after the 2016 election that I realized
94
00:07:50,678 --> 00:07:52,805
it had already happened on our watch.
95
00:07:55,725 --> 00:07:57,643
It was really, like, a feeling of, like...
96
00:07:57,727 --> 00:07:58,727
[takes a deep breath]
97
00:07:58,728 --> 00:08:01,314
...the worst-case scenario has happened
with technology.
98
00:08:03,941 --> 00:08:05,109
Hmm.
99
00:08:05,359 --> 00:08:07,653
I became obsessed with finding answers.
100
00:08:09,739 --> 00:08:11,782
And the question I kept asking myself was:
101
00:08:13,117 --> 00:08:14,785
Who was feeding us fear?
102
00:08:15,328 --> 00:08:16,412
And how?
103
00:08:21,417 --> 00:08:25,671
This was our Project Alamo,
where the digital arm
104
00:08:25,755 --> 00:08:28,007
of the Trump campaign operation was held.
105
00:08:29,383 --> 00:08:32,011
When Project Alamo was at its peak,
106
00:08:33,012 --> 00:08:35,681
they were spending
one million dollars a day
107
00:08:36,390 --> 00:08:38,184
on Facebook ads.
108
00:08:39,352 --> 00:08:42,188
We had the Facebook,
and YouTube, and Google people.
109
00:08:42,271 --> 00:08:44,065
They would kind of congregate here.
110
00:08:44,315 --> 00:08:47,235
I mean, they were basically
our hands-on partners
111
00:08:47,318 --> 00:08:50,279
as far as, you know,
being able to utilize the platform
112
00:08:50,363 --> 00:08:52,073
as effectively as possible.
113
00:08:52,365 --> 00:08:53,783
But what we also learned
114
00:08:53,866 --> 00:08:56,244
is that a company
called Cambridge Analytica...
115
00:08:59,330 --> 00:09:02,708
was also working on Project Alamo.
116
00:09:04,168 --> 00:09:06,045
Cambridge Analytica was here.
117
00:09:06,254 --> 00:09:09,840
And this is kind of the brain of... of,
you know, the data.
118
00:09:09,924 --> 00:09:12,677
- [over video] This was the data center.
- [man] Right.
119
00:09:13,219 --> 00:09:15,405
"We gotta target this state.
We gotta target that state."
120
00:09:15,429 --> 00:09:17,491
- So, within that...
- [man] How would they know that?
121
00:09:17,515 --> 00:09:20,195
- How would they know that...
- That's... That's their secret sauce.
122
00:09:27,066 --> 00:09:28,734
- [computer chimes]
- [mouse clicks]
123
00:09:28,943 --> 00:09:31,445
- [Carroll] Paul-Olivier?
- [Paul-Olivier] I'm there.
124
00:09:31,904 --> 00:09:34,740
Okay. Let me just, uh, set up my screen.
125
00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:39,787
[Carroll] I connected with a mathematician
based out of Switzerland
126
00:09:39,870 --> 00:09:41,539
named Paul-Olivier Dehaye.
127
00:09:42,123 --> 00:09:45,334
[Dehaye] I've been looking
at Cambridge Analytica for over a year
128
00:09:45,626 --> 00:09:48,087
and I think there's more to be found.
129
00:09:49,589 --> 00:09:51,591
[Carroll] Both Paul and I understood that
130
00:09:51,674 --> 00:09:54,510
in order to send people
personalized messages,
131
00:09:54,594 --> 00:09:55,886
you need people's data.
132
00:09:57,763 --> 00:10:02,143
And Cambridge Analytica
claimed to have 5,000 data points
133
00:10:02,226 --> 00:10:04,186
on every American voter.
134
00:10:07,815 --> 00:10:08,983
But it was invisible.
135
00:10:10,943 --> 00:10:15,239
And so the question is,
how do you make the invisible visible?
136
00:10:19,827 --> 00:10:21,746
[sighs] That's the hardest part. Um...
137
00:10:25,333 --> 00:10:27,710
- [marker squeaks]
- [Carroll] Paul-Olivier Dehaye had
138
00:10:27,793 --> 00:10:28,919
a hypothesis,
139
00:10:29,170 --> 00:10:32,882
and the hypothesis was that US voter data
140
00:10:33,007 --> 00:10:36,218
was processed
by Cambridge Analytica's parent company
141
00:10:36,302 --> 00:10:37,553
in Great Britain.
142
00:10:43,768 --> 00:10:45,436
And if it was true,
143
00:10:45,519 --> 00:10:49,273
I could use a British lawyer
to force Cambridge Analytica
144
00:10:49,357 --> 00:10:50,650
to give me my data.
145
00:10:54,445 --> 00:10:57,657
[man] I think the beauty of David's case
is it encapsulates
146
00:10:57,990 --> 00:11:02,828
why data rights should be considered
just fundamental rights, simple rights.
147
00:11:02,912 --> 00:11:04,705
Because all he wants to know
148
00:11:05,122 --> 00:11:06,540
is what did you do?
149
00:11:08,042 --> 00:11:12,213
And if David finds out
the data beneath his profile,
150
00:11:13,130 --> 00:11:15,883
you'll start to be able
to connect the dots in various ways
151
00:11:16,509 --> 00:11:20,054
with Facebook and Cambridge Analytica
and Trump and Brexit
152
00:11:20,137 --> 00:11:23,891
and all these loosely-connected entities.
153
00:11:24,517 --> 00:11:26,519
Because you get to see inside the beast,
154
00:11:26,852 --> 00:11:28,604
you get to see inside the system.
155
00:11:39,573 --> 00:11:42,576
[man] I used to be the COO and CFO
156
00:11:42,660 --> 00:11:45,496
of the Cambridge Analytica, or SCL, Group.
157
00:11:46,831 --> 00:11:50,167
If you spoke to most people
that worked at Cambridge Analytica,
158
00:11:50,626 --> 00:11:52,128
they would say the same thing.
159
00:11:52,211 --> 00:11:55,715
It was, uh...
an environment of great innovation.
160
00:11:57,675 --> 00:11:59,927
Hello, my name is Alexander Nix.
161
00:12:00,010 --> 00:12:01,804
I'm CEO of Cambridge Analytica,
162
00:12:02,096 --> 00:12:05,182
the world's leading
data-driven communications company.
163
00:12:05,599 --> 00:12:08,394
From Mad Men of old to Math Men of today,
164
00:12:08,477 --> 00:12:10,479
expert data scientists whose insight
165
00:12:10,563 --> 00:12:13,399
can tell you far more about audiences
that you want to reach
166
00:12:13,482 --> 00:12:14,900
and how to reach them.
167
00:12:18,654 --> 00:12:23,033
[Wheatland] Alexander Nix was very focused
on building a strong elections business.
168
00:12:23,868 --> 00:12:28,247
And then the Obama campaign
very successfully used data
169
00:12:28,622 --> 00:12:31,000
and digital communications,
170
00:12:31,250 --> 00:12:34,587
which created a market opportunity
to provide a service
171
00:12:34,670 --> 00:12:36,756
to Republican politics in the US.
172
00:12:36,839 --> 00:12:39,383
[crowd cheering]
173
00:12:39,467 --> 00:12:42,762
[Cruz] God bless the great state of Iowa.
174
00:12:42,845 --> 00:12:44,472
[crowd cheering]
175
00:12:44,555 --> 00:12:47,641
[Wheatland] Ted Cruz went
from the lowest rated candidate
176
00:12:47,725 --> 00:12:48,934
in the primaries
177
00:12:49,059 --> 00:12:54,064
to being the last man standing
before Trump got the nomination.
178
00:12:54,148 --> 00:12:55,441
[crowd members cheer]
179
00:12:55,524 --> 00:12:57,234
Let me first of all say...
180
00:12:58,861 --> 00:13:01,864
- to God be the glory.
- [crowd cheering]
181
00:13:06,285 --> 00:13:08,513
[reporter] Everyone said Ted Cruz had
this amazing ground game,
182
00:13:08,537 --> 00:13:10,790
and now we know
who came up with all of it.
183
00:13:10,873 --> 00:13:14,126
Joining me now, Alexander Nix,
CEO of Cambridge Analytica,
184
00:13:14,210 --> 00:13:15,419
the company behind it all.
185
00:13:15,503 --> 00:13:18,464
It's fascinating, Alexander,
to look at all of the work
186
00:13:18,547 --> 00:13:20,007
that goes into the ground game.
187
00:13:20,090 --> 00:13:22,051
Have any of the other candidates
called you?
188
00:13:22,635 --> 00:13:23,969
Well, um...
189
00:13:31,185 --> 00:13:34,188
[audience applauding]
190
00:13:35,731 --> 00:13:37,942
It's my privilege to speak to you today
191
00:13:38,025 --> 00:13:41,737
about the power of big data
and psychographics.
192
00:13:42,530 --> 00:13:45,950
When Cambridge Analytica
joined the Trump campaign,
193
00:13:46,033 --> 00:13:48,118
we were an attractive proposition.
194
00:13:48,744 --> 00:13:52,331
We'd just spent 14 months
working on the Ted Cruz campaign,
195
00:13:52,414 --> 00:13:56,669
and had collected a huge amount
of voter data and research,
196
00:13:56,752 --> 00:13:59,338
which we were able to hand over
to the Trump team.
197
00:14:01,382 --> 00:14:04,510
By having hundreds and hundreds
of thousands of Americans
198
00:14:04,593 --> 00:14:05,593
undertake this survey,
199
00:14:07,179 --> 00:14:09,515
we were able to form a model,
200
00:14:09,598 --> 00:14:12,977
where we have somewhere close
to four or five thousand data points
201
00:14:13,060 --> 00:14:16,981
we can use to predict the personality
of every adult in the United States.
202
00:14:17,565 --> 00:14:20,192
Because it's personality
that drives behavior,
203
00:14:20,276 --> 00:14:23,362
and behavior that obviously influences
how you vote.
204
00:14:24,613 --> 00:14:26,615
We could then start to target people
205
00:14:26,699 --> 00:14:29,451
with highly-targeted
digital video content.
206
00:14:30,244 --> 00:14:33,539
[man 1] Secretary Clinton said there was
nothing marked classified on her emails
207
00:14:33,622 --> 00:14:35,541
either sent or received. Was that true?
208
00:14:36,959 --> 00:14:39,837
[Trump] Our movement is about replacing
209
00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:44,049
a failed
and corrupt political establishment.
210
00:14:44,133 --> 00:14:46,886
Why aren't I 50 points ahead,
you might ask?
211
00:14:46,969 --> 00:14:49,513
[man 2] Do you really need to ask?
212
00:14:49,597 --> 00:14:53,309
[Clinton coughing]
213
00:14:57,730 --> 00:15:01,734
- [crowd cheering]
- [rousing orchestral theme plays]
214
00:15:02,735 --> 00:15:04,445
A night that will go down in history,
215
00:15:04,528 --> 00:15:07,698
a stunning upset as Donald Trump
triumphs over Hillary Clinton,
216
00:15:07,781 --> 00:15:11,368
defying the polls, the pundits,
and the political class once again,
217
00:15:11,452 --> 00:15:14,163
this time elected president
of the United States.
218
00:15:16,624 --> 00:15:18,626
[orchestral theme continues]
219
00:15:24,590 --> 00:15:28,802
[crowd cheering]
220
00:15:31,889 --> 00:15:34,308
[crowd chanting] USA! USA!
221
00:15:34,391 --> 00:15:36,435
- Thank you.
- [chanting continues]
222
00:15:36,518 --> 00:15:38,437
[Trump]
Thank you very much, everybody.
223
00:15:46,528 --> 00:15:50,032
[Nix] If there's one singular takeaway
from this event,
224
00:15:50,115 --> 00:15:52,952
that is that these sorts
of technologies
225
00:15:53,035 --> 00:15:54,662
can make a huge difference
226
00:15:54,745 --> 00:15:58,248
and will continue to do so
for many years to come.
227
00:15:58,958 --> 00:16:00,084
Thank you.
228
00:16:00,167 --> 00:16:02,711
[audience applauding]
229
00:16:07,466 --> 00:16:10,302
[Wheatland] After the election,
it was really exciting.
230
00:16:10,386 --> 00:16:11,386
[cheering]
231
00:16:12,638 --> 00:16:15,516
[Wheatland] We could see the path
to being a billion-dollar company.
232
00:16:16,517 --> 00:16:19,937
We were on top of the world.
Or at least we thought we were.
233
00:16:37,788 --> 00:16:39,707
[Cadwalladr] This is the exciting box.
234
00:16:45,045 --> 00:16:47,548
I've been investigating
Cambridge Analytica
235
00:16:48,632 --> 00:16:54,888
and how that ties to the Brexit campaign
to leave the European Union.
236
00:16:57,391 --> 00:17:01,103
And this has been my full-time,
12-hours-a-day,
237
00:17:01,186 --> 00:17:05,649
seven-days-a-week kind of obsession,
I would say, since then.
238
00:17:06,567 --> 00:17:07,901
It's been all-consuming.
239
00:17:08,610 --> 00:17:09,778
[sighs]
240
00:17:12,281 --> 00:17:15,492
When I first started looking
into this whole web of links
241
00:17:15,576 --> 00:17:18,954
between Cambridge Analytica and Brexit...
242
00:17:20,122 --> 00:17:22,416
I emailed Andy Wigmore,
243
00:17:22,708 --> 00:17:26,754
who is an associate of Nigel Farage.
244
00:17:27,087 --> 00:17:32,634
And Nigel Farage is a very central figure
in the Brexit campaign.
245
00:17:34,470 --> 00:17:36,680
I sort of said,
"Oh, can we go for a coffee?
246
00:17:37,306 --> 00:17:40,851
I'm really interested in technology
and campaigning."
247
00:17:41,977 --> 00:17:45,272
And then he just sort of like,
he just like laid it all out.
248
00:17:45,355 --> 00:17:47,357
[upbeat jazz playing]
249
00:17:51,236 --> 00:17:53,280
[Cadwalladr]
It was just after the Inauguration.
250
00:17:53,697 --> 00:17:57,034
So, Andy, he was just like sort of, like,
showing me all the photos on his phone.
251
00:17:57,117 --> 00:17:58,869
"This is the inauguration."
252
00:18:00,913 --> 00:18:02,414
Then, "Oh, it's such a laugh!
253
00:18:02,664 --> 00:18:04,583
We had such a good time. Oh, Donald..."
254
00:18:06,543 --> 00:18:09,588
And I was like, "How did the introduction
to Cambridge Analytica come out?"
255
00:18:10,923 --> 00:18:14,301
He was like, "You know, it's 'cause Nigel.
Nigel's friends with Steve Bannon."
256
00:18:14,593 --> 00:18:17,805
- Ladies and gentlemen, Steve Bannon!
- [audience cheers]
257
00:18:18,263 --> 00:18:22,101
[Cadwalladr] Steve Bannon headed
the campaign for Trump.
258
00:18:23,102 --> 00:18:26,772
He's also the Vice President
of Cambridge Analytica.
259
00:18:27,940 --> 00:18:31,068
So he's like, "Yeah, there's this bunch
of billionaires in the States.
260
00:18:31,360 --> 00:18:33,445
We've all got the same aims,
261
00:18:33,946 --> 00:18:38,283
and Brexit was the petri dish for Trump."
262
00:18:38,367 --> 00:18:41,411
For most of my life,
America is the leader.
263
00:18:41,703 --> 00:18:44,998
Now, I would like to think,
in my own little way,
264
00:18:45,499 --> 00:18:47,292
that what we did with Brexit
265
00:18:47,751 --> 00:18:51,380
was the beginning
of what is gonna turn out to be
266
00:18:51,463 --> 00:18:53,674
a global revolution
267
00:18:53,757 --> 00:18:56,176
and that Trump's victory
is a part of that.
268
00:18:56,260 --> 00:18:58,137
[people cheering, applauding]
269
00:19:01,557 --> 00:19:05,644
[scoffs] Anyway, and then he told me
all sorts of other stuff
270
00:19:05,727 --> 00:19:08,605
about, you know, how they used
artificial intelligence,
271
00:19:08,689 --> 00:19:12,651
you know,
how they were mining details from Facebook
272
00:19:12,734 --> 00:19:14,278
and, um...
273
00:19:14,361 --> 00:19:18,115
And he was like... And he was like,
"It's creepy, Carole!" He said,
274
00:19:18,198 --> 00:19:20,450
"The amount of information
you can get on people...
275
00:19:20,534 --> 00:19:22,369
People just give it to you!"
276
00:19:22,452 --> 00:19:24,132
And he sort of said,
"It's just so creepy!"
277
00:19:26,039 --> 00:19:28,041
So, I just kind of kept going.
278
00:19:29,751 --> 00:19:31,044
The Brexit work.
279
00:19:32,462 --> 00:19:37,134
I'd started tracking down all these
Cambridge Analytica ex-employees.
280
00:19:40,470 --> 00:19:44,892
And, eventually, I got one guy
who was prepared to talk to me.
281
00:19:46,476 --> 00:19:47,519
Chris Wylie.
282
00:19:51,190 --> 00:19:54,735
We had this first telephone call,
which was insane.
283
00:19:54,818 --> 00:19:57,654
It was about eight hours long. And...
284
00:19:58,655 --> 00:20:00,324
[mimics explosion sound]
285
00:20:05,704 --> 00:20:08,373
My name is Christopher Wylie,
I'm a data scientist
286
00:20:08,457 --> 00:20:10,500
and I helped set up Cambridge Analytica.
287
00:20:12,044 --> 00:20:15,297
It's incorrect to call Cambridge Analytica
288
00:20:15,380 --> 00:20:19,551
a purely sort of data science company
or an algorithm, you know, company.
289
00:20:19,676 --> 00:20:22,930
You know, it is a full-service
propaganda machine.
290
00:20:26,516 --> 00:20:29,561
[interviewer] You were an investor
in Cambridge Analytica.
291
00:20:29,645 --> 00:20:32,624
- I helped put the company together.
- [interviewer] And... Yes, you did. And...
292
00:20:32,648 --> 00:20:34,733
And gave it...
And gave it that amazing name.
293
00:20:35,192 --> 00:20:38,111
[Wylie]
Steve Bannon was the editor of Breitbart.
294
00:20:39,613 --> 00:20:42,366
He follows this idea
of the Breitbart doctrine,
295
00:20:42,449 --> 00:20:46,370
which is that, if you want
to fundamentally change society,
296
00:20:46,495 --> 00:20:48,121
you first have to break it.
297
00:20:48,455 --> 00:20:49,915
And it's only when you break it
298
00:20:49,998 --> 00:20:54,711
is when you can remold the pieces
into your vision of a new society.
299
00:20:58,257 --> 00:20:59,925
This was the weapon
300
00:21:00,008 --> 00:21:03,178
that Steve Bannon wanted to build
to fight his culture war.
301
00:21:04,179 --> 00:21:05,847
And we could build them for him.
302
00:21:06,431 --> 00:21:09,393
But I needed to figure out a way
of getting data,
303
00:21:09,476 --> 00:21:12,938
and so I went
to these Cambridge University profs
304
00:21:13,021 --> 00:21:14,606
and asked, "What do you think?"
305
00:21:28,328 --> 00:21:33,750
Kogan offered us apps on Facebook
that were given special permission
306
00:21:33,959 --> 00:21:39,756
to harvest data not from just the person
who used the app or joined the app,
307
00:21:41,049 --> 00:21:45,053
but also it would then go
into their entire friend network
308
00:21:45,637 --> 00:21:48,724
and pull out
all of the friends' data as well.
309
00:21:50,475 --> 00:21:53,061
If you were a friend of somebody
who used the app,
310
00:21:53,145 --> 00:21:56,148
you would have no idea
that I just pulled all of your data.
311
00:22:00,777 --> 00:22:03,780
We took things like status updates, likes,
312
00:22:03,864 --> 00:22:06,116
in some cases, private messages.
313
00:22:08,660 --> 00:22:10,954
We wouldn't just be targeting you
as a voter,
314
00:22:11,038 --> 00:22:14,333
we'd be targeting you as a personality.
315
00:22:16,460 --> 00:22:20,672
We would only need to touch
a couple hundred thousand people
316
00:22:20,756 --> 00:22:23,342
to build a psychological profile
317
00:22:23,425 --> 00:22:28,013
of each voter in all of the United States.
318
00:22:31,975 --> 00:22:33,244
[Cadwalladr] And people had no idea
319
00:22:33,268 --> 00:22:35,354
that their data was being taken
in this way?
320
00:22:36,313 --> 00:22:37,314
[Wylie] No.
321
00:22:42,486 --> 00:22:44,363
[Cadwalladr]
You didn't ever stop and think,
322
00:22:44,446 --> 00:22:47,866
"Actually, this is people's
personal information,
323
00:22:47,949 --> 00:22:52,579
and we're taking it, and we're using it
in ways that they don't understand"?
324
00:22:53,288 --> 00:22:54,288
[Wylie] No.
325
00:22:56,375 --> 00:23:00,670
Throughout history, you have examples
of grossly unethical experiments.
326
00:23:01,129 --> 00:23:02,631
[Cadwalladr] Is that what this was?
327
00:23:03,382 --> 00:23:07,636
[Wylie] I think that, yes,
it was a grossly unethical experiment.
328
00:23:08,970 --> 00:23:12,182
You are playing with the psychology
of an entire country
329
00:23:12,265 --> 00:23:14,434
without their consent or awareness.
330
00:23:15,769 --> 00:23:17,729
And not only are you, like,
331
00:23:17,813 --> 00:23:20,190
playing with the psychology
of an entire nation,
332
00:23:20,273 --> 00:23:22,377
you're playing with the psychology
of an entire nation
333
00:23:22,401 --> 00:23:24,111
in the context of the democratic process.
334
00:23:24,194 --> 00:23:27,280
[news anchor speaks indistinctly nearby]
335
00:23:31,034 --> 00:23:33,578
[Carroll]
The revelations have started to spill out.
336
00:23:34,663 --> 00:23:40,460
We're now not just threatening
to do things, but we're actually doing it.
337
00:23:42,671 --> 00:23:45,590
- [anchor] Okay, we're ready, guys.
- [man] One, two, three...
338
00:23:45,966 --> 00:23:48,093
We turn now to the burgeoning scandal
339
00:23:48,176 --> 00:23:51,054
around voter-profiling company
Cambridge Analytica.
340
00:23:51,388 --> 00:23:54,724
David Carroll filed a legal challenge
in Britain
341
00:23:54,808 --> 00:23:57,352
asking the court
to force Cambridge Analytica
342
00:23:57,436 --> 00:24:00,564
to turn over all the data it harvested
on him.
343
00:24:00,814 --> 00:24:02,816
Explain what you are demanding.
344
00:24:03,275 --> 00:24:05,402
Uh, full disclosure, so...
345
00:24:06,945 --> 00:24:08,780
where did they get our data,
346
00:24:08,864 --> 00:24:12,284
how did they process it,
who did they share it with,
347
00:24:12,576 --> 00:24:14,828
and do we have a right to opt out?
348
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:18,331
[man] Cambridge Analytica says
349
00:24:18,415 --> 00:24:19,541
it's got 5,000 data points
350
00:24:19,624 --> 00:24:21,668
on many, many millions
of people out there.
351
00:24:21,751 --> 00:24:22,836
[Carroll] That's right.
352
00:24:22,919 --> 00:24:26,298
When people can actually see
the extent of the surveillance,
353
00:24:26,381 --> 00:24:28,633
I think they're going to be shocked.
354
00:24:30,218 --> 00:24:33,430
We don't work with Facebook data.
We don't have Facebook data.
355
00:24:33,513 --> 00:24:36,766
Uh, we do use Facebook
as a platform, uh, to advertise.
356
00:24:37,184 --> 00:24:38,351
Mr. Nix, Channel 4 News.
357
00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,687
Did you mislead Parliament
over the Facebook issue?
358
00:24:40,770 --> 00:24:43,315
- Absolutely not.
- [reporter continues indistinctly]
359
00:24:44,149 --> 00:24:47,736
[Carroll] It's crazy that I have to mount
a year-long,
360
00:24:47,819 --> 00:24:51,865
super risky legal challenge
in another country
361
00:24:51,990 --> 00:24:54,159
to get my voter profile.
362
00:24:54,326 --> 00:24:57,537
David, don't stop, don't relent.
363
00:24:57,621 --> 00:24:58,872
[Carroll chuckles]
364
00:24:58,955 --> 00:25:00,957
- Keep going. Good.
- I'm gonna do it, don't worry.
365
00:25:01,041 --> 00:25:02,876
- [woman] Don't sleep!
- [Carroll laughs]
366
00:25:05,670 --> 00:25:08,423
Facebook's down 6.35%.
367
00:25:08,715 --> 00:25:10,717
That's 120 billion dollars.
368
00:25:11,092 --> 00:25:12,219
This is huge.
369
00:25:14,387 --> 00:25:17,265
[reporter 1] Officers working
for the UK Information Commissioner
370
00:25:17,349 --> 00:25:20,727
are searching the headquarters
of Cambridge Analytica, in London.
371
00:25:20,810 --> 00:25:22,872
[reporter 2] They're inside,
they're looking at computers,
372
00:25:22,896 --> 00:25:24,523
they're looking for documents.
373
00:25:25,524 --> 00:25:29,486
[reporter 3] Facebook knew about
that data collection over two years ago
374
00:25:29,569 --> 00:25:32,572
but did not go public
until three days ago.
375
00:25:33,365 --> 00:25:34,407
Really, Facebook?
376
00:25:34,491 --> 00:25:36,326
You forgot to mention
that 50 million people
377
00:25:36,409 --> 00:25:37,595
had their private data breached,
378
00:25:37,619 --> 00:25:40,455
but every time it's my uncle's friend's
sister's dog's birthday,
379
00:25:40,539 --> 00:25:41,873
I get a notification?
380
00:25:41,957 --> 00:25:44,167
[audience laughs]
381
00:25:48,129 --> 00:25:50,298
[reporter 4] You are taking on a giant,
382
00:25:50,382 --> 00:25:52,425
a Goliath of big data marketing.
383
00:25:53,343 --> 00:25:55,262
How hopeful are you of succeeding?
384
00:25:55,720 --> 00:26:00,850
- [woman makes indistinct introduction]
- [audience applauds]
385
00:26:02,018 --> 00:26:04,688
[Carroll] People don't want to admit
that propaganda works.
386
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:09,859
Because to admit it means confronting
our own susceptibilities,
387
00:26:10,193 --> 00:26:12,320
horrific lack of privacy,
388
00:26:12,612 --> 00:26:14,281
and hopeless dependency
389
00:26:14,364 --> 00:26:17,742
on tech platforms ruining our democracies
390
00:26:17,826 --> 00:26:19,619
on various attack surfaces.
391
00:26:20,370 --> 00:26:23,248
Join the struggle
to help get our data back.
392
00:26:23,999 --> 00:26:26,585
[applause, cheering]
393
00:26:37,345 --> 00:26:41,891
Welcome to our inquiry
into disinformation and fake news.
394
00:26:41,975 --> 00:26:45,520
I'd like to welcome Christopher Wylie
and Paul-Olivier Dehaye,
395
00:26:45,604 --> 00:26:48,231
uh, to the committee
to give evidence this morning.
396
00:26:49,190 --> 00:26:51,276
[O'Hara] Have you or anybody else made
any assessment
397
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,296
of actually whether any of this
made much difference
398
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:56,364
to the final outcome of the EU Referendum?
399
00:26:59,618 --> 00:27:03,580
When... When you're caught
in the Olympics doping, right,
400
00:27:03,788 --> 00:27:08,668
there's not a debate about how much
illegal drug you took. Right?
401
00:27:08,752 --> 00:27:10,045
Or, "Well,
402
00:27:10,128 --> 00:27:11,808
he probably would've come in first
anyway,"
403
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:14,758
or, you know,
"He only took half of the amount," or...
404
00:27:14,841 --> 00:27:17,719
Doesn't matter. If you're caught cheating,
you lose your medal. Right?
405
00:27:17,802 --> 00:27:18,928
Because...
406
00:27:19,304 --> 00:27:23,308
[stammers]...if we allow cheating
in our democratic process,
407
00:27:23,683 --> 00:27:24,600
what about next time?
408
00:27:24,601 --> 00:27:28,146
What about the time after that?
Right? You shouldn't win by cheating.
409
00:27:29,648 --> 00:27:33,026
A lot of people will say,
and I'll say, um,
410
00:27:33,735 --> 00:27:36,464
that given that you're someone
who worked very closely with these people,
411
00:27:36,488 --> 00:27:37,656
uh, for a period of time,
412
00:27:37,739 --> 00:27:40,325
why have you decided to speak out
against it
413
00:27:40,408 --> 00:27:42,928
and give evidence against people
who used to be your colleagues?
414
00:27:43,286 --> 00:27:46,623
It's a process of coming to terms
with what you've created
415
00:27:46,706 --> 00:27:49,751
and the impact
that that... that... that has had.
416
00:27:49,834 --> 00:27:53,963
Um, I am incredibly remorseful
for my... my role in setting it up.
417
00:27:54,214 --> 00:27:59,094
But there's been a lot of attention on me
because I'm sort of... I've become the...
418
00:27:59,427 --> 00:28:02,347
uh, you know, the face of it,
because I'm the one that's...
419
00:28:02,514 --> 00:28:04,557
come forward and put my name to it.
420
00:28:04,683 --> 00:28:06,363
But someone else
that you should be calling
421
00:28:06,434 --> 00:28:07,894
to the committee is Brittany Kaiser.
422
00:28:08,478 --> 00:28:09,813
Who's Brittany Kaiser?
423
00:28:27,789 --> 00:28:32,085
I'm not that interested in standing up
for powerful white men anymore
424
00:28:32,168 --> 00:28:35,505
who obviously don't have
everybody's best interests at heart.
425
00:28:39,384 --> 00:28:41,469
[reporter 1] Brittany Kaiser,
once a key player
426
00:28:41,553 --> 00:28:43,513
inside Cambridge Analytica,
427
00:28:43,596 --> 00:28:45,765
casting herself as a whistle-blower.
428
00:28:46,433 --> 00:28:49,269
[reporter 2] Until three weeks ago,
Brittany Kaiser, a top exec there,
429
00:28:49,352 --> 00:28:52,981
she had a key to Steve Bannon's townhouse
in Washington.
430
00:28:53,064 --> 00:28:56,151
She spoke at CPAC in 2016,
along with Kellyanne Conway,
431
00:28:56,234 --> 00:28:58,653
spent election night
at the Trump victory party
432
00:28:58,737 --> 00:29:01,364
with mega-donor Rebekah Mercer.
433
00:29:02,532 --> 00:29:04,743
[reporter 1]
Miss Kaiser was also closely involved
434
00:29:04,826 --> 00:29:07,537
with millionaire Brexit supporter
Arron Banks
435
00:29:07,620 --> 00:29:09,706
and his Leave. EU campaign.
436
00:29:18,173 --> 00:29:20,067
[reporter 3]
She's raising some interesting things.
437
00:29:20,091 --> 00:29:21,444
Why is she talking now, do you think?
438
00:29:21,468 --> 00:29:23,470
[man] Well, she only gave us
part of the picture.
439
00:29:23,553 --> 00:29:27,056
She's talking to investigators,
and so we'll know the full picture
440
00:29:27,140 --> 00:29:28,475
at some point later...
441
00:29:37,942 --> 00:29:39,944
[soft jazz playing]
442
00:29:51,456 --> 00:29:53,666
[Kaiser] I have evidence
443
00:29:53,750 --> 00:29:58,171
that the Brexit campaigns
and the Trump campaign
444
00:29:58,254 --> 00:30:00,423
could've been conducted illegally.
445
00:30:03,343 --> 00:30:07,514
And so, for my own safety,
I don't need geolocation of where this is.
446
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,474
Just me sitting here...
447
00:30:11,434 --> 00:30:13,937
the person trying to overthrow
two administrations
448
00:30:14,020 --> 00:30:16,856
and all of the most powerful companies
in the world,
449
00:30:16,940 --> 00:30:18,858
all at once.
450
00:30:18,942 --> 00:30:20,527
[chuckles]
451
00:30:20,610 --> 00:30:25,240
With one disjointed
but hopefully-soon-seamless narrative.
452
00:30:25,323 --> 00:30:26,366
[chuckles]
453
00:30:27,784 --> 00:30:31,204
The wealthiest companies
are technology companies.
454
00:30:31,913 --> 00:30:34,999
Google, Facebook, Amazon, Tesla.
455
00:30:35,500 --> 00:30:37,710
And the reason why these companies
456
00:30:37,794 --> 00:30:40,547
are the most powerful companies
in the world
457
00:30:40,630 --> 00:30:45,343
is because, last year, data surpassed oil
in its value.
458
00:30:45,802 --> 00:30:48,388
Data is the most valuable asset on Earth.
459
00:30:49,430 --> 00:30:52,517
And these companies are valuable
460
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,271
because they have been exploiting
people's assets.
461
00:30:57,939 --> 00:31:00,817
It wasn't until one of my friends
reached out to me
462
00:31:00,900 --> 00:31:03,945
to ask was I going to be all right
463
00:31:04,028 --> 00:31:07,740
with the way that my story would be seen
in history.
464
00:31:08,867 --> 00:31:11,452
And I thought, "No.
465
00:31:12,537 --> 00:31:14,414
I'm not okay, actually." [chuckles]
466
00:31:14,497 --> 00:31:18,042
And there's probably a lot of information
that I could give
467
00:31:18,126 --> 00:31:22,171
that would be helpful
to making things okay, possibly.
468
00:31:42,859 --> 00:31:44,611
[Hilder] I'm a political technologist
469
00:31:44,694 --> 00:31:47,989
who tries to shine a big light
470
00:31:48,072 --> 00:31:50,408
on how data's been used and abused.
471
00:31:52,535 --> 00:31:55,038
It's a moment where people have
that visceral sense.
472
00:31:55,121 --> 00:31:56,748
There is, you know,
473
00:31:57,332 --> 00:31:59,918
that there's something wrong here,
uh, that we need to fix.
474
00:32:00,919 --> 00:32:05,506
And so, I've dropped
pretty much everything I was doing
475
00:32:05,590 --> 00:32:07,967
to work on this with Brittany Kaiser.
476
00:32:10,345 --> 00:32:13,306
I went and found her and met her,
477
00:32:13,389 --> 00:32:15,642
and she was very forthcoming
478
00:32:16,267 --> 00:32:20,063
in a way which made me think,
[chuckles] "There's a lot here."
479
00:32:20,563 --> 00:32:24,025
[applause, scattered cheers]
480
00:32:26,861 --> 00:32:30,657
What we really need to be understanding
is people's levers of persuasion.
481
00:32:30,740 --> 00:32:34,118
How are we actually going to message
voters so that they can under...
482
00:32:34,202 --> 00:32:37,497
[man] Tina and I met with Brittany Kaiser.
483
00:32:37,580 --> 00:32:40,249
[Kaiser] We look very unlike
any other political
484
00:32:40,333 --> 00:32:42,001
and communications firm, so...
485
00:32:42,085 --> 00:32:44,045
[woman]
Do you work both sides of the aisle?
486
00:32:44,128 --> 00:32:46,523
Uh, no, we only work for the Republicans
in the United States.
487
00:32:46,547 --> 00:32:47,547
[woman] Okay.
488
00:32:48,341 --> 00:32:49,676
And in Britain?
489
00:32:49,842 --> 00:32:53,304
[Kaiser] Well, actually, right now
we're working on the Brexit campaign.
490
00:32:54,555 --> 00:32:57,767
At Leave. EU, we're going
to be running a large-scale research
491
00:32:57,850 --> 00:33:00,103
throughout the nation to really understand
492
00:33:00,186 --> 00:33:03,481
why people are interested in staying in
or out of the EU.
493
00:33:03,564 --> 00:33:07,652
And the answers to that will help inform
our policy and our communications,
494
00:33:07,735 --> 00:33:10,321
to make sure that we turn out
more first-time voters,
495
00:33:10,405 --> 00:33:14,200
more unregistered voters,
more apathetic voters than ever before.
496
00:33:31,009 --> 00:33:33,928
[Hilder] I think we now have
the foundations laid for...
497
00:33:34,554 --> 00:33:38,057
her to share what is
some reasonably explosive materials
498
00:33:38,224 --> 00:33:39,642
that we've been finding.
499
00:33:40,226 --> 00:33:46,024
Uh, and, uh...
her inbox and her hard drive,
500
00:33:46,733 --> 00:33:50,945
uh, really are a treasure trove
of... uh, sketchy information.
501
00:33:53,906 --> 00:33:56,075
And we're still
just scratching the surface.
502
00:33:59,454 --> 00:34:02,540
[dance music playing]
503
00:34:21,768 --> 00:34:24,520
[Hilder] Tell us about the first meeting
you had in Trump Tower.
504
00:34:24,812 --> 00:34:27,065
In November 2015,
505
00:34:27,148 --> 00:34:32,153
I went with Alexander Nix
to go see Corey Lewandowski,
506
00:34:32,236 --> 00:34:34,238
who was the campaign manager at the time.
507
00:34:34,489 --> 00:34:38,951
And I asked Corey, why could this place
possibly look so familiar?
508
00:34:39,118 --> 00:34:42,413
And he said,
"This is the set of The Apprentice.
509
00:34:42,789 --> 00:34:45,041
That's probably why you recognize it."
And...
510
00:34:45,541 --> 00:34:47,376
I was kind of shocked, you know?
511
00:34:48,127 --> 00:34:52,048
The Trump campaign HQ is a reality TV set.
512
00:34:52,131 --> 00:34:53,883
[Hilder] Yes. It is.
513
00:34:57,762 --> 00:35:00,765
And the idea of a company...
514
00:35:01,099 --> 00:35:04,143
conducting large-scale analysis
of a population...
515
00:35:04,227 --> 00:35:05,227
Mm-hmm.
516
00:35:05,269 --> 00:35:08,564
...and then identifying the triggers
that people have
517
00:35:08,648 --> 00:35:12,068
in terms of what's gonna move them
from one state to another state,
518
00:35:12,151 --> 00:35:15,113
that feels very challenging
519
00:35:15,196 --> 00:35:18,324
to the individual's sense of autonomy
and freedom...
520
00:35:18,407 --> 00:35:19,492
- Mm-hmm.
- ...uh...
521
00:35:19,575 --> 00:35:22,203
and to the idea of democracy.
522
00:35:22,662 --> 00:35:23,704
Doesn't it?
523
00:35:24,455 --> 00:35:28,000
I don't know. Um...
I would challenge that.
524
00:35:28,668 --> 00:35:31,420
What this strategy is mostly meant to do
525
00:35:31,504 --> 00:35:34,590
is to identify people
who are still considering
526
00:35:34,674 --> 00:35:36,384
- many different options...
- Yes.
527
00:35:36,467 --> 00:35:41,264
...and educate them
on some of the options that are out there,
528
00:35:41,347 --> 00:35:42,765
and if they're on the fence,
529
00:35:42,849 --> 00:35:45,893
then they can be persuaded
to go one way or the other.
530
00:35:45,977 --> 00:35:48,855
- Yes, they can.
- Uh, again, that is their own choice.
531
00:35:48,938 --> 00:35:50,398
- But a lot of the times...
- Is it?
532
00:35:50,481 --> 00:35:53,201
- ...these are individuals that...
- [Hilder] Is it their own choice?
533
00:35:54,569 --> 00:35:56,689
In the end, they're the ones
that go to the ballot box
534
00:35:56,737 --> 00:35:58,990
- and make their ch... decision.
- [Hilder] Yeah.
535
00:35:59,365 --> 00:36:02,368
I mean, I'm asking you these questions
as Brittany Kaiser.
536
00:36:02,451 --> 00:36:03,536
- [Kaiser] I know.
- Right?
537
00:36:03,619 --> 00:36:07,248
I'm not asking you these questions
as Cambridge Analytica or SCL,
538
00:36:07,331 --> 00:36:10,334
because that's not
who you are anymore. Right?
539
00:36:10,626 --> 00:36:12,545
I get it. I get it. But...
540
00:36:12,628 --> 00:36:14,748
[Hilder stammers]
And do you think Cambridge Analytica
541
00:36:14,797 --> 00:36:17,925
was ever involved in the contravention
of people's human rights?
542
00:36:18,009 --> 00:36:19,010
[Kaiser] No.
543
00:36:20,636 --> 00:36:25,766
But, [chuckles] again, I start to question
a lot of things the more I hear.
544
00:36:25,850 --> 00:36:26,800
[Hilder] Yeah.
545
00:36:26,809 --> 00:36:29,770
[Kaiser] I mean,
I had spent my entire career before that
546
00:36:29,854 --> 00:36:31,939
working for human rights.
547
00:36:33,900 --> 00:36:34,900
[Hilder] Okay.
548
00:36:35,318 --> 00:36:37,111
Let's go back to that. [chuckles]
549
00:36:38,196 --> 00:36:41,407
It wasn't that long ago. Just a decade.
550
00:36:43,159 --> 00:36:45,077
- [Hilder] It wasn't that long ago.
- Yeah.
551
00:36:50,541 --> 00:36:54,170
[Kaiser] I had worked in elections
since I was 14 or 15.
552
00:36:55,922 --> 00:36:59,842
I told my cousin I applied
to intern on the Obama campaign.
553
00:37:00,092 --> 00:37:01,302
She was like, "Oh, my God.
554
00:37:01,385 --> 00:37:03,721
You better get that internship,
or I'll die."
555
00:37:05,014 --> 00:37:07,767
I was part of the team
running Obama's Facebook.
556
00:37:09,310 --> 00:37:14,065
We invented the way social media is used
to communicate with voters.
557
00:37:19,820 --> 00:37:22,990
I then spent several years
working on human rights
558
00:37:23,074 --> 00:37:24,742
and international relations,
559
00:37:25,576 --> 00:37:27,328
first for Amnesty International,
560
00:37:27,411 --> 00:37:31,123
then lobbying at the United Nations
and European Parliament.
561
00:37:34,710 --> 00:37:38,214
And I used to always say
I love human rights campaigning,
562
00:37:38,923 --> 00:37:41,968
but sometimes I feel like
I'm banging my head against a brick wall
563
00:37:42,051 --> 00:37:44,387
because I can't see the results
of what I'm doing.
564
00:37:44,470 --> 00:37:46,889
I don't know
if I'm literally just wasting my time.
565
00:37:49,433 --> 00:37:52,144
And that's where I was
when I met Alexander Nix.
566
00:37:53,896 --> 00:37:56,524
- [low chatter]
- [cutlery clinking]
567
00:37:56,607 --> 00:37:59,487
[Kaiser] Friends of ours thought
it would be a good joke to introduce us.
568
00:38:00,486 --> 00:38:04,240
He was very interested in learning more
about my experience with the Democrats.
569
00:38:04,573 --> 00:38:06,367
He gave me his card and said,
570
00:38:06,450 --> 00:38:09,161
"Let me get you drunk
and steal your secrets."
571
00:38:12,248 --> 00:38:16,294
And in December 2014,
he offered me a job.
572
00:38:21,215 --> 00:38:24,927
Coming across a company
where you could actually see your impact
573
00:38:25,011 --> 00:38:27,346
was really exciting for me.
574
00:38:33,894 --> 00:38:36,564
I got a little more conservative or posh
575
00:38:36,647 --> 00:38:41,110
in terms of the way that I dressed
and the way that I spoke,
576
00:38:41,944 --> 00:38:46,532
and doing things
like going on shooting at the weekends
577
00:38:46,615 --> 00:38:47,992
and stuff like that.
578
00:38:48,409 --> 00:38:52,538
It's just very different to what
I would normally spend my time doing.
579
00:38:59,962 --> 00:39:01,881
[Hilder]
Must've been a hell of an adventure.
580
00:39:02,214 --> 00:39:05,343
It was really interesting.
I strapped on my cowboy boots,
581
00:39:05,426 --> 00:39:08,554
got into character,
got my NRA membership.
582
00:39:08,721 --> 00:39:11,140
- Yeah, you joined the NRA, right?
- I did, yeah.
583
00:39:11,223 --> 00:39:13,059
Just to understand
how these people think,
584
00:39:13,142 --> 00:39:14,142
- like...
- Uh-huh.
585
00:39:14,268 --> 00:39:15,686
I don't want to use guns.
586
00:39:15,770 --> 00:39:18,356
- I'm not really interested in guns at all.
- Yeah.
587
00:39:18,439 --> 00:39:20,316
I felt like I was getting to know...
588
00:39:21,233 --> 00:39:24,236
people that I used to disagree with a lot,
589
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:27,281
like my grandparents, my aunts,
uncles, cousins.
590
00:39:28,532 --> 00:39:32,620
[Hilder] So this wasn't just an outfit
that you put on, and it felt important?
591
00:39:32,870 --> 00:39:35,498
It was important. It is important.
592
00:39:35,581 --> 00:39:37,833
- [Hilder] Yeah.
- I feel like the main problem
593
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:39,210
in US politics
594
00:39:39,293 --> 00:39:43,130
is that people are so polarized
that they can't understand each other,
595
00:39:43,214 --> 00:39:46,092
and therefore they can't work together,
and therefore nothing gets done.
596
00:39:47,468 --> 00:39:51,138
- [PA chimes]
- [woman speaking indistinctly on PA]
597
00:39:59,647 --> 00:40:03,651
I am about to draft some questions
for a senator
598
00:40:03,734 --> 00:40:07,029
who will be able to ask them
to Mark Zuckerberg
599
00:40:07,113 --> 00:40:10,950
in the Senate Judiciary hearing
on Tuesday.
600
00:40:11,283 --> 00:40:14,829
"How much of Facebook's revenue
601
00:40:15,996 --> 00:40:19,375
comes directly from the monetization
602
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:23,045
of users' personal data?"
603
00:40:24,713 --> 00:40:26,590
[chortles] All of it!
604
00:40:27,967 --> 00:40:29,552
Exactly.
605
00:40:30,386 --> 00:40:33,013
The reality is that Facebook knows more
about this
606
00:40:33,097 --> 00:40:34,974
than pretty much anyone in the world
607
00:40:35,057 --> 00:40:39,937
because Facebook is the best platform
on which to run experiments.
608
00:40:40,020 --> 00:40:41,939
- Yeah, it is. Um, it...
- [laughing]
609
00:40:42,022 --> 00:40:44,525
And it actually always gets you
the best engagement rates.
610
00:40:44,608 --> 00:40:46,735
We always spend the majority
amount of money
611
00:40:46,819 --> 00:40:49,613
on any commercial
or political campaign in Facebook.
612
00:40:50,156 --> 00:40:51,866
Always gets the majority of the ad budget.
613
00:40:51,949 --> 00:40:53,617
- It does, it does.
- Yep.
614
00:40:55,411 --> 00:40:58,956
[Hilder] There is at least the possibility
that the American public
615
00:40:59,039 --> 00:41:01,876
and publics in other countries
have been experimented on.
616
00:41:07,423 --> 00:41:09,484
[Kaiser] Remember those Facebook quizzes
that we used
617
00:41:09,508 --> 00:41:12,678
to form personality models
for all voters in the US?
618
00:41:15,556 --> 00:41:19,351
The truth is, we didn't target
every American voter equally.
619
00:41:20,519 --> 00:41:22,396
The bulk of our resources
620
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:26,108
went into targeting those
whose minds we thought we could change.
621
00:41:26,901 --> 00:41:29,028
We called them "the persuadables."
622
00:41:31,238 --> 00:41:32,907
They're everywhere in the country,
623
00:41:32,990 --> 00:41:36,619
but the persuadables that mattered
were the ones in swing states
624
00:41:36,702 --> 00:41:40,873
like Michigan, Wisconsin,
Pennsylvania, and Florida.
625
00:41:44,001 --> 00:41:47,922
Now, each of these states were broken down
by precinct.
626
00:41:49,215 --> 00:41:53,093
So, you can say
there are 22,000 persuadable voters
627
00:41:53,302 --> 00:41:54,845
in this precinct,
628
00:41:55,971 --> 00:41:59,725
and if we target enough persuadable people
in the right precincts,
629
00:41:59,850 --> 00:42:03,479
then those states would turn red
instead of blue.
630
00:42:04,980 --> 00:42:07,942
Our creative team designed
personalized content
631
00:42:08,025 --> 00:42:09,693
to trigger those individuals.
632
00:42:09,777 --> 00:42:12,029
Terrorists love porous borders.
633
00:42:12,112 --> 00:42:15,324
Widespread gaps
in border security allow terrorists...
634
00:42:15,407 --> 00:42:19,745
[Kaiser] We bombarded them through blogs,
websites, articles, videos, ads,
635
00:42:19,828 --> 00:42:21,664
every platform you can imagine.
636
00:42:22,122 --> 00:42:24,959
Until they saw the world
the way we wanted them to.
637
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:29,088
[emoji growls]
638
00:42:29,296 --> 00:42:31,590
[Kaiser] Until they voted
for our candidate.
639
00:42:33,384 --> 00:42:35,010
It's like a boomerang.
640
00:42:35,553 --> 00:42:37,137
You send your data out,
641
00:42:38,138 --> 00:42:39,807
it gets analyzed,
642
00:42:40,224 --> 00:42:43,727
and it comes back at you
as targeted messaging
643
00:42:44,311 --> 00:42:46,146
to change your behavior.
644
00:42:53,070 --> 00:42:55,072
[indistinct chatter]
645
00:43:00,744 --> 00:43:02,371
[indistinct announcement over PA]
646
00:43:02,454 --> 00:43:05,374
DCMS Committee announced
the future witnesses
647
00:43:05,457 --> 00:43:07,209
- for a fake news inquiry.
- Yes.
648
00:43:07,668 --> 00:43:09,712
- There you are. You're...
- Me.
649
00:43:09,795 --> 00:43:13,090
- [Hilder] You're the day before Alexander.
- [Kaiser] The former CEO.
650
00:43:13,966 --> 00:43:15,634
He's going the day after me.
651
00:43:16,844 --> 00:43:19,847
Yes. Is it... Is it all feeling a bit real?
652
00:43:19,930 --> 00:43:21,557
[chuckling] It's really intense.
653
00:43:22,266 --> 00:43:23,642
- [sniffles]
- [Hilder] It's real.
654
00:43:23,976 --> 00:43:26,437
- And it's big.
- [Kaiser sighs]
655
00:43:39,533 --> 00:43:42,578
[Cadwalladr] The first time
I wrote about Cambridge Analytica,
656
00:43:43,037 --> 00:43:45,497
it was December 2016.
657
00:43:47,291 --> 00:43:49,501
I said that they'd worked
for the Trump campaign
658
00:43:49,585 --> 00:43:51,587
and for the Brexit campaign.
659
00:43:54,465 --> 00:43:56,305
And I started getting letters
from them saying,
660
00:43:56,383 --> 00:43:58,218
"We never worked for the Leave campaign."
661
00:44:02,097 --> 00:44:04,725
And this was baffling
because on Leave. EU's website,
662
00:44:04,808 --> 00:44:07,019
it said, "We hired Cambridge Analytica."
663
00:44:08,896 --> 00:44:11,482
There were statements from Alexander Nix
about how they worked
664
00:44:11,565 --> 00:44:12,650
for the Leave campaign.
665
00:44:13,484 --> 00:44:17,112
Yeah, I'm afraid we don't talk
about that campaign. At all.
666
00:44:17,571 --> 00:44:19,365
[laughs]
667
00:44:19,448 --> 00:44:21,075
[woman] You didn't? Or you did?
668
00:44:21,158 --> 00:44:22,451
No, no, we don't discuss it.
669
00:44:22,534 --> 00:44:24,134
- [woman] Okay. Not at all.
- [Nix] Yeah.
670
00:44:24,703 --> 00:44:27,831
[Cadwalladr]
And that was when I discovered this video
671
00:44:27,915 --> 00:44:30,125
of Leave. EU's press launch.
672
00:44:32,628 --> 00:44:35,798
And I was like, well, there, look,
it's Brittany Kaiser!
673
00:44:35,881 --> 00:44:38,425
She works for Cambridge Analytica.
674
00:44:38,509 --> 00:44:40,552
She's at the press launch
675
00:44:40,636 --> 00:44:43,389
talking about all the clever things
676
00:44:43,472 --> 00:44:46,350
that they're going to do with data
for the Leave Campaign.
677
00:44:48,102 --> 00:44:50,979
Like, what the fuck?
678
00:44:51,063 --> 00:44:54,817
How can you carry on denying it?
This is nuts!
679
00:44:54,900 --> 00:44:57,945
[Russian national anthem playing]
680
00:44:58,779 --> 00:45:00,539
[Cadwalladr] And it was exactly
the same time
681
00:45:00,614 --> 00:45:02,408
that Leave. EU started posting
682
00:45:02,491 --> 00:45:04,243
the horrible videos of me.
683
00:45:04,326 --> 00:45:05,929
[woman panting]
I've gotta get out of here!
684
00:45:05,953 --> 00:45:08,747
[Cadwalladr] There was a spoof video
of a scene from Airplane!
685
00:45:08,831 --> 00:45:11,434
- [stewardess] Get a hold of yourself!
- [man] Please, let me handle this.
686
00:45:11,458 --> 00:45:14,604
[Cadwalladr] There was like a whole stream
of people going, "Don't be so hysterical!"
687
00:45:14,628 --> 00:45:15,628
And, like, hitting her.
688
00:45:15,671 --> 00:45:17,589
Go back to your seat!
I'll take care of this.
689
00:45:17,673 --> 00:45:19,717
[Cadwalladr]
It was like, "Calm down! Calm down!"
690
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,278
[makes slapping sound]
And, you know, so a whole line of people,
691
00:45:22,302 --> 00:45:24,638
and then the last person's carrying a gun.
692
00:45:26,390 --> 00:45:27,975
And the whole thing they had,
693
00:45:28,058 --> 00:45:30,936
it was set to the music
from the Russian national anthem.
694
00:45:31,019 --> 00:45:33,564
[anthem continues playing]
695
00:45:35,065 --> 00:45:36,400
Ugh.
696
00:45:38,110 --> 00:45:41,488
The day
after that Leave. EU video was put out,
697
00:45:41,572 --> 00:45:45,701
the editor of another news organization
that I was going to do a report for
698
00:45:46,201 --> 00:45:47,536
took me for lunch and said,
699
00:45:47,619 --> 00:45:50,579
"Actually, we think it's too much
of a risk having you present the report."
700
00:45:53,792 --> 00:45:58,046
It is this sort of visceral thing
of living with this disinformation
701
00:45:58,130 --> 00:46:00,924
and this propaganda every single day.
702
00:46:01,216 --> 00:46:04,887
And feeling the effects of it
and knowing that it does work,
703
00:46:04,970 --> 00:46:07,973
it does have an impact in real life,
whether people believe that or not.
704
00:46:13,437 --> 00:46:15,439
You know,
I'm used to just writing stories.
705
00:46:15,522 --> 00:46:18,025
You write it, and then you go on
to the next subject.
706
00:46:18,108 --> 00:46:21,445
I'm a feature writer, that's what I did.
But I was just like, "They've lied."
707
00:46:21,528 --> 00:46:24,168
And they're lying about something
which is actually really massive.
708
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:26,533
'Cause it's, you know, the...
709
00:46:27,075 --> 00:46:29,953
rest of the future of our country.
710
00:46:30,662 --> 00:46:33,749
- [reporter 1] What do you think, Nigel?
- [reporters murmuring indistinctly]
711
00:46:35,584 --> 00:46:39,755
[Cadwalladr] In the referendum,
most people had very fixed views.
712
00:46:40,672 --> 00:46:44,218
But there was a tiny sliver of people
who didn't.
713
00:46:44,301 --> 00:46:46,345
These were "the persuadables."
714
00:46:46,678 --> 00:46:50,057
It was all about finding
these very few people
715
00:46:50,140 --> 00:46:52,810
and then bombarding them with ads.
716
00:46:55,020 --> 00:46:58,649
This is the thing
which was invisible to all of us.
717
00:47:00,442 --> 00:47:06,448
Let June the 23rd go down in our history
as our independence day!
718
00:47:06,532 --> 00:47:08,867
[loud cheering]
719
00:47:10,494 --> 00:47:13,705
[man 1] The British people have spoken,
and the answer is, "We're out."
720
00:47:13,789 --> 00:47:15,082
[woman 1] For good or for ill,
721
00:47:15,165 --> 00:47:18,043
this decision will define our politics
for years to come.
722
00:47:18,126 --> 00:47:22,256
[woman 2] This great country
has made a terrible mistake.
723
00:47:22,339 --> 00:47:24,174
[man 2]
It's an earthquake that has happened.
724
00:47:24,258 --> 00:47:27,553
And what happens after earthquakes?
We wait to see.
725
00:47:27,886 --> 00:47:30,013
[woman 3] People weren't agreed
on what Leave meant.
726
00:47:30,097 --> 00:47:32,992
- [man 3] It's simple: leave. Full stop.
- [woman 3] Was no manifesto for Leave.
727
00:47:33,016 --> 00:47:34,643
But there is no "leave, full stop..."
728
00:47:34,726 --> 00:47:37,604
[crowd chanting] Brexit! Brexit! Brexit!
729
00:47:38,730 --> 00:47:40,232
[PA chimes]
730
00:47:40,315 --> 00:47:41,995
[woman over PA] In the interest of safety,
731
00:47:42,067 --> 00:47:45,487
parents are advised not to carry children
on baggage trolleys
732
00:47:45,571 --> 00:47:47,573
or allow them to play on the escalators.
733
00:47:47,656 --> 00:47:49,575
- [Kaiser] Hi, Mama!
- [mother on phone] Hey!
734
00:47:50,784 --> 00:47:52,744
I'm through, I'm through,
I'm through, yeah.
735
00:47:52,828 --> 00:47:56,748
So, I managed to get
into the United Kingdom with no issues,
736
00:47:56,832 --> 00:47:59,251
which is really fantastic.
737
00:47:59,585 --> 00:48:02,379
[mother] Well, I just want you
to mentally be okay with this,
738
00:48:02,462 --> 00:48:06,091
'cause what you're doing
is a monumental undertaking.
739
00:48:06,174 --> 00:48:07,133
I know.
740
00:48:07,134 --> 00:48:08,719
And I still fear for your life.
741
00:48:08,802 --> 00:48:09,803
Yeah.
742
00:48:09,887 --> 00:48:12,097
With the powerful people
that are involved...
743
00:48:12,639 --> 00:48:13,807
[Kaiser] Yeah, I know.
744
00:48:13,891 --> 00:48:15,976
You just have to be careful all the time.
745
00:48:16,059 --> 00:48:17,853
[Kaiser] I know, but I can't keep quiet
746
00:48:17,936 --> 00:48:20,147
just because it'll make
powerful people mad.
747
00:48:20,230 --> 00:48:23,066
I know. I know, I know, I know. I know.
748
00:48:23,734 --> 00:48:26,111
I totally get that, you know.
749
00:48:26,862 --> 00:48:30,908
Somebody's always got to bring down
these jerks.
750
00:48:31,074 --> 00:48:32,200
Exactly.
751
00:48:32,284 --> 00:48:34,953
So, you know, anyway.
752
00:48:35,203 --> 00:48:37,039
When I have time off next month,
753
00:48:37,122 --> 00:48:40,667
I've gotta go and put deposits down
on electric and gas.
754
00:48:41,126 --> 00:48:44,379
I don't have $1,000 right now,
so I'll have to wait.
755
00:48:44,463 --> 00:48:47,382
[Kaiser] Well, I could...
I could pay for it. That means...
756
00:48:47,466 --> 00:48:49,885
Oh, don't worry,
I don't need it right now.
757
00:48:51,720 --> 00:48:53,472
All right, honey, you stay healthy.
758
00:48:53,555 --> 00:48:54,472
[Kaiser] Love you.
759
00:48:54,473 --> 00:48:55,599
Be safe, honey. I love you.
760
00:48:55,682 --> 00:48:56,599
[Kaiser] I love you. Bye-bye.
761
00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:57,809
Bye-bye, baby.
762
00:48:59,603 --> 00:49:00,604
[Kaiser sighs]
763
00:49:07,945 --> 00:49:09,821
[Kaiser] I'm really happy to be back,
764
00:49:09,905 --> 00:49:14,368
but I don't think I can really do much
going out in public while I'm here.
765
00:49:17,162 --> 00:49:18,664
Last time I left,
766
00:49:18,747 --> 00:49:23,627
I was in a very difficult situation
with a lot of my friends.
767
00:49:24,294 --> 00:49:25,934
- [Kaiser] So fire door number one?
- Yes.
768
00:49:26,004 --> 00:49:27,673
- [man murmurs indistinctly]
- What?
769
00:49:29,883 --> 00:49:33,345
[Kaiser] So many people were so angry
that I was working on the Brexit campaign,
770
00:49:33,428 --> 00:49:36,682
so angry I continued to work for a company
771
00:49:36,765 --> 00:49:39,601
that supported people
like Ted Cruz and Donald Trump.
772
00:49:42,312 --> 00:49:45,649
And there's still this whole group
of people that are wondering,
773
00:49:45,732 --> 00:49:49,361
am I taking the high road,
or am I doing something to protect myself?
774
00:49:56,368 --> 00:49:58,137
[reporter 1]
More news on Facebook over the weekend,
775
00:49:58,161 --> 00:50:00,580
as Mark Zuckerberg prepares to testify
before Congress
776
00:50:00,664 --> 00:50:01,957
tomorrow and Wednesday.
777
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:03,851
Earlier this morning,
he announced some new measures
778
00:50:03,875 --> 00:50:06,670
in the company's efforts
to prevent interference in elections...
779
00:50:11,049 --> 00:50:13,051
[low chatter]
780
00:50:18,056 --> 00:50:20,684
[Kaiser gasps] It's today's FT.
781
00:50:20,767 --> 00:50:23,729
My name's at the top of the front page
of the FT.
782
00:50:23,812 --> 00:50:24,855
Oh, shit.
783
00:50:25,856 --> 00:50:27,566
[chuckles] There it is.
784
00:50:29,234 --> 00:50:31,111
"Zuckerberg braced for Congress grilling.
785
00:50:31,194 --> 00:50:34,573
Facebook chief will admit
that the social network did not do enough
786
00:50:34,656 --> 00:50:37,117
to stop its tools being used for harm."
787
00:50:37,826 --> 00:50:41,538
[Carroll] "Facebook should pay its
two billion users for their personal data.
788
00:50:41,788 --> 00:50:45,834
The big tech companies are evolving
into digital kleptocracies.
789
00:50:46,084 --> 00:50:47,294
Yesterday."
790
00:50:49,171 --> 00:50:50,797
[clicks tongue] Um...
791
00:50:51,590 --> 00:50:54,301
I sort of missed the paragraph of, like,
792
00:50:55,343 --> 00:50:57,554
"I helped build this monster
793
00:50:58,472 --> 00:50:59,472
that...
794
00:51:01,767 --> 00:51:05,395
wreaked havoc upon the world
and will take decades to recover from,
795
00:51:06,396 --> 00:51:10,025
and I feel really bad about that."
I don't see that here.
796
00:51:12,194 --> 00:51:14,071
[Kaiser] The data wars have begun.
797
00:51:15,572 --> 00:51:17,365
[camera shutters clicking]
798
00:51:24,498 --> 00:51:28,627
[Carroll] I mean, this is a company
that is a superstate,
799
00:51:28,919 --> 00:51:33,131
and the only nation
that has jurisdiction over it is ours.
800
00:51:33,215 --> 00:51:36,384
[gavel slams on video feed]
801
00:51:40,347 --> 00:51:44,810
[Grassley] The Committees on the Judiciary
and Commerce, Science and Transportation
802
00:51:44,893 --> 00:51:46,228
will come to order.
803
00:51:48,271 --> 00:51:51,024
[Zuckerberg] Chairman Grassley
and members of the committee:
804
00:51:52,192 --> 00:51:57,364
My top priority has always been
our social mission of connecting people,
805
00:51:57,447 --> 00:52:00,158
building community,
and bringing the world closer together.
806
00:52:01,243 --> 00:52:04,538
But it's clear now that we didn't
do enough to prevent these tools
807
00:52:04,621 --> 00:52:06,206
from being used for harm as well.
808
00:52:06,706 --> 00:52:09,417
Before I talk about the steps
we're taking to address them,
809
00:52:09,501 --> 00:52:10,981
I want to talk about how we got here.
810
00:52:11,545 --> 00:52:14,172
When we first contacted
Cambridge Analytica,
811
00:52:14,256 --> 00:52:16,466
they told us
that they had deleted the data.
812
00:52:16,842 --> 00:52:17,842
About a month ago,
813
00:52:17,884 --> 00:52:20,303
we heard new reports
that suggested that wasn't true.
814
00:52:21,054 --> 00:52:25,225
So, we're getting to the bottom
of exactly what Cambridge Analytica did.
815
00:52:25,767 --> 00:52:28,019
[Kaiser] Blame it on me, Mark. Go for it.
816
00:52:28,103 --> 00:52:30,689
...to address this and to prevent it
from happening again.
817
00:52:31,481 --> 00:52:35,318
Thank you for having me here today,
and I'm ready to take your questions.
818
00:52:36,444 --> 00:52:40,907
Well, Mr. Zuckerberg,
during the 2016 campaign,
819
00:52:41,032 --> 00:52:44,286
Cambridge Analytica worked
with the Trump campaign
820
00:52:44,369 --> 00:52:47,789
to refine tactics under Project Alamo.
821
00:52:47,873 --> 00:52:50,292
Were Facebook employees involved in that?
822
00:52:51,585 --> 00:52:54,480
Senator, I don't know that our employees
were involved with Cambridge Analytica.
823
00:52:54,504 --> 00:52:56,464
- Yes, they were.
- Whoa!
824
00:52:56,548 --> 00:52:57,591
[man] Oh, my God.
825
00:52:57,674 --> 00:53:00,468
The Republican team in DC was. I met them.
826
00:53:00,677 --> 00:53:03,680
...although I know that we did help out
the Trump campaign overall
827
00:53:03,763 --> 00:53:06,600
in sales support in the same way
that we do with other campaigns.
828
00:53:06,683 --> 00:53:08,560
So, they may have been involved
829
00:53:08,643 --> 00:53:11,271
and all working together
during that time period?
830
00:53:11,354 --> 00:53:14,107
Maybe that's something
your investigation will find out.
831
00:53:14,191 --> 00:53:16,818
Senator, I can certainly
have my team get back to you
832
00:53:16,902 --> 00:53:19,946
on any specifics there
that I don't know sitting here today.
833
00:53:20,030 --> 00:53:22,782
Oh, my God. This is the whole point
of the hearing, you...
834
00:53:22,866 --> 00:53:25,493
- [Cantwell] Know what I'm talking about?
- No, I do not.
835
00:53:25,577 --> 00:53:26,577
[Cantwell] Okay.
836
00:53:27,996 --> 00:53:29,122
[man] It can go to you.
837
00:53:29,789 --> 00:53:33,585
Do you think the 87 million users,
do you consider them victims?
838
00:53:34,628 --> 00:53:36,463
Uh, Senator, I think...
839
00:53:36,796 --> 00:53:38,048
Uh...
840
00:53:38,215 --> 00:53:42,010
Yes. I mean, they... they did not want
their information to be
841
00:53:42,219 --> 00:53:46,014
sold to Cambridge Analytica
by a developer. And... And...
842
00:53:46,348 --> 00:53:47,515
that happened.
843
00:53:47,682 --> 00:53:49,309
And it happened on our watch.
844
00:53:49,434 --> 00:53:50,936
So even though we didn't do it,
845
00:53:51,019 --> 00:53:53,563
I think we have a responsibility
to be able to prevent that
846
00:53:53,647 --> 00:53:55,190
and be able to take action sooner.
847
00:53:55,690 --> 00:53:57,734
One of the steps that we need to take now
848
00:53:57,817 --> 00:54:00,946
is go do a full audit
of all of Cambridge Analytica's systems
849
00:54:01,029 --> 00:54:04,449
to understand what they're doing,
whether they still have any data...
850
00:54:04,532 --> 00:54:08,411
[man 1] Obviously, Facebook has been done
considerable reputational damage
851
00:54:08,495 --> 00:54:10,956
by its association
with Cambridge Analytica.
852
00:54:11,039 --> 00:54:13,541
[woman 1]
...process by which Cambridge Analytica...
853
00:54:13,625 --> 00:54:15,228
[woman 2]
...relates to Cambridge Analytica...
854
00:54:15,252 --> 00:54:18,255
[man 2] The recent stories
about Cambridge Analytica
855
00:54:18,338 --> 00:54:19,941
- and data mining...
- [hearing continues indistinctly]
856
00:54:19,965 --> 00:54:23,176
[man] Look at how many people
are posting Zuckerberg...
857
00:54:23,260 --> 00:54:25,321
- [Kaiser] Everyone's watching this.
- [man] Oh, my God.
858
00:54:25,345 --> 00:54:27,281
- [Kaiser] And the whole thing just says...
- [man] Wow.
859
00:54:27,305 --> 00:54:29,307
[Kaiser]...Cambridge, Cambridge,
Cambridge.
860
00:54:29,391 --> 00:54:31,059
[no audible dialogue]
861
00:54:31,851 --> 00:54:33,687
[Kaiser] I never thought
everyone in the world
862
00:54:33,770 --> 00:54:36,064
would know who Cambridge Analytica was.
863
00:54:36,147 --> 00:54:38,942
[Zuckerberg hearing
continues indistinctly]
864
00:54:46,741 --> 00:54:49,536
[Wheatland]
I learnt many things from that period.
865
00:54:50,161 --> 00:54:53,707
I learnt, for example,
that when you're in a PR crisis,
866
00:54:53,790 --> 00:54:56,835
the one thing that you can't hire
is a PR crisis company.
867
00:54:57,168 --> 00:54:59,337
We spoke to...
868
00:55:00,630 --> 00:55:05,010
[sighs]...tens of PR crisis companies
that listened intently,
869
00:55:05,093 --> 00:55:07,220
went away to think about it,
and came back and said,
870
00:55:07,304 --> 00:55:10,557
"Sorry, we can't associate ourselves
with your brand." [chuckles]
871
00:55:10,640 --> 00:55:15,395
Um... And actually, I thought
that's what they were there, um, for.
872
00:55:15,770 --> 00:55:19,858
And so it became impossible to, um...
to get a voice.
873
00:55:26,072 --> 00:55:29,075
The reason that we've called
this news conference today
874
00:55:29,159 --> 00:55:33,913
is to begin to counter
some of the unfounded allegations
875
00:55:33,997 --> 00:55:38,168
and, frankly, the torrent of ill-informed
and inaccurate speculation.
876
00:55:47,135 --> 00:55:49,929
Do you think what was done was illegal?
877
00:55:50,013 --> 00:55:51,765
We think it is probably illegal
878
00:55:51,848 --> 00:55:54,517
according to UK law,
and that's what we're challenging.
879
00:55:54,601 --> 00:55:56,936
We do have a statement
from Cambridge Analytica.
880
00:55:57,020 --> 00:55:58,438
Cambridge said,
881
00:55:58,521 --> 00:56:01,775
"David Carroll has no more right
to submit this request
882
00:56:01,858 --> 00:56:05,737
than a member of the Taliban
sitting in a cave in Afghanistan."
883
00:56:08,615 --> 00:56:10,867
[Wheatland] And it came like a tsunami.
884
00:56:11,743 --> 00:56:16,331
There were 35,000 media stories per day.
885
00:56:19,459 --> 00:56:22,087
They wanted to discredit Trump,
886
00:56:22,420 --> 00:56:24,839
they wanted to discredit Brexit,
887
00:56:24,923 --> 00:56:26,841
and we were the vehicle for doing it.
888
00:56:27,634 --> 00:56:31,012
Do you feel
that you have skewed democracy?
889
00:56:31,388 --> 00:56:36,351
By providing campaign services
to a candidate who'd been fairly nominated
890
00:56:36,434 --> 00:56:39,646
as the Republican representative
of the United States?
891
00:56:40,105 --> 00:56:41,523
How is that possible?
892
00:56:43,191 --> 00:56:46,027
[Wheatland]
Cambridge Analytica became responsible
893
00:56:46,111 --> 00:56:49,864
for pretty much everything
that was wrong in the world.
894
00:56:55,078 --> 00:56:57,622
Are you saying
that Cambridge Analytica lies?
895
00:56:57,705 --> 00:57:00,417
They knowingly misrepresent the truth.
896
00:57:00,583 --> 00:57:02,168
What's your proof of that?
897
00:57:02,836 --> 00:57:04,087
I was there.
898
00:57:05,547 --> 00:57:08,133
[Wheatland]
Chris Wylie spoke with great authority
899
00:57:08,216 --> 00:57:11,094
about what had gone on
in Cambridge Analytica and SCL
900
00:57:11,177 --> 00:57:14,222
during 2015 and 2016,
901
00:57:14,305 --> 00:57:17,517
at a time when he was never there.
902
00:57:18,560 --> 00:57:22,939
He had worked for the company
for nine months, left in 2014.
903
00:57:23,231 --> 00:57:28,153
He then went out and pitched
the Trump campaign,
904
00:57:28,778 --> 00:57:31,281
and lost to us.
905
00:57:34,242 --> 00:57:37,328
Chris Wylie set out to kill the company.
906
00:57:39,998 --> 00:57:41,332
[man] And what about Brittany?
907
00:57:46,963 --> 00:57:48,965
I don't know what Brittany was doing.
908
00:57:54,387 --> 00:57:56,264
Brittany was someone that...
909
00:57:57,015 --> 00:58:00,185
I thought was a friend,
I know Alexander thought was a friend.
910
00:58:01,436 --> 00:58:02,562
But, you know,
911
00:58:04,105 --> 00:58:06,441
when the world gets turned upside down,
912
00:58:07,901 --> 00:58:11,738
people behave in different ways.
913
00:58:12,864 --> 00:58:15,450
Maybe even they don't understand
914
00:58:16,284 --> 00:58:18,495
why they're doing what they're doing
at the time.
915
00:58:24,959 --> 00:58:28,713
[Hilder] I would strongly recommend
that we start doing testimony prep.
916
00:58:30,131 --> 00:58:32,300
Uh, go through the emails together,
917
00:58:32,383 --> 00:58:35,720
maybe go through other stuff
and hash out what's there.
918
00:58:37,430 --> 00:58:39,557
[Kaiser]
Oh, my God. I have my entire calendar.
919
00:58:41,226 --> 00:58:43,144
[whispers] Shit. Shit.
920
00:58:43,228 --> 00:58:45,989
- [Hilder] You have your entire calendar?
- I have my entire calendar.
921
00:58:46,022 --> 00:58:47,273
Oh, my God.
922
00:58:47,524 --> 00:58:48,650
[Hilder] Downloaded?
923
00:58:48,733 --> 00:58:52,195
[Kaiser] I didn't think that
that was going to still link. [gasps]
924
00:58:52,278 --> 00:58:53,363
That's amazing.
925
00:58:53,446 --> 00:58:56,050
I can actually do an entire timeline
of everything, if that's the case.
926
00:58:56,074 --> 00:58:57,234
[Hilder] A timeline is great.
927
00:58:57,700 --> 00:58:59,160
[whispers] Fuck, look at this.
928
00:58:59,744 --> 00:59:02,580
[chuckles] September 2015.
929
00:59:04,749 --> 00:59:06,626
US Chamber of Commerce...
930
00:59:07,126 --> 00:59:08,211
Meeting at...
931
00:59:11,172 --> 00:59:13,883
Leave.EU. That was fun. Run-through.
932
00:59:13,967 --> 00:59:15,009
[Hilder] It's all here.
933
00:59:15,093 --> 00:59:17,762
I know exactly when everything happened.
934
00:59:17,845 --> 00:59:19,472
Always. Forever.
935
00:59:23,393 --> 00:59:25,186
[Kaiser] I didn't realize how much I had.
936
00:59:25,687 --> 00:59:27,021
I've got much more than that,
937
00:59:27,105 --> 00:59:30,108
it's just those are the things I forwarded
that I think are worthwhile.
938
00:59:33,444 --> 00:59:34,444
[elevator bell dings]
939
00:59:36,197 --> 00:59:38,783
[Kaiser] Did you get the chance
to look through all of that?
940
00:59:38,866 --> 00:59:41,666
[Hilder] I went through most of it.
I'll look through more of it today.
941
00:59:44,664 --> 00:59:47,417
[Kaiser] Let me get out
one of the pitches. Um...
942
00:59:47,667 --> 00:59:49,919
- [keyboard clacking]
- "CA Political."
943
00:59:52,171 --> 00:59:53,339
What is this?
944
00:59:54,257 --> 00:59:55,592
This looks mental.
945
00:59:57,343 --> 01:00:02,849
This is a list of, like,
the main sources of data.
946
01:00:04,017 --> 01:00:08,104
And look, it's got that fucking Facebook
data set of 30 million individuals.
947
01:00:08,187 --> 01:00:09,856
It just says it in there! [exclaims]
948
01:00:09,939 --> 01:00:11,608
What the fuck!
949
01:00:12,108 --> 01:00:13,401
[whispers] Oh, my God.
950
01:00:14,068 --> 01:00:16,738
- [Hilder] February...
- [Kaiser] Created February 4th, 2016!
951
01:00:16,821 --> 01:00:19,866
That was after we said to Facebook
that we deleted that shit!
952
01:00:20,992 --> 01:00:23,036
This is the 30 million individuals
953
01:00:23,119 --> 01:00:26,205
that we got their data
through Professor Kogan.
954
01:00:26,289 --> 01:00:27,498
That's that.
955
01:00:28,041 --> 01:00:31,794
And it admits to it right here,
"Our data makes us different,"
956
01:00:32,712 --> 01:00:36,174
because we're scraping people's profiles,
and other people are not.
957
01:00:37,967 --> 01:00:38,967
Fuck.
958
01:00:45,475 --> 01:00:47,977
[chuckles]
I forgot about this stuff, you know?
959
01:00:48,853 --> 01:00:50,772
There's just so much stuff.
960
01:01:02,241 --> 01:01:04,243
[Nix] ...we seek to do as a firm.
961
01:01:04,327 --> 01:01:06,788
We are a behavior change agency.
962
01:01:08,039 --> 01:01:11,125
The holy grail of communications is
963
01:01:11,209 --> 01:01:13,294
when you can start to change behavior.
964
01:01:15,171 --> 01:01:18,633
Uh, Trinidad. This is a great,
interesting case history
965
01:01:18,716 --> 01:01:20,218
of how we look at problems.
966
01:01:21,094 --> 01:01:23,346
[folk music playing]
967
01:01:23,680 --> 01:01:25,682
[Nix]
There are two main political parties,
968
01:01:25,890 --> 01:01:27,642
one for the blacks
and one for the Indians.
969
01:01:28,059 --> 01:01:29,727
And you know, they screw each other.
970
01:01:30,228 --> 01:01:33,064
So, we were working for the Indians.
971
01:01:34,399 --> 01:01:37,985
We went to the client and we said,
"We want to target the youth."
972
01:01:38,152 --> 01:01:42,365
And we try and increase apathy.
973
01:01:44,075 --> 01:01:45,910
The campaign had to be non-political,
974
01:01:45,993 --> 01:01:47,704
because the kids
don't care about politics.
975
01:01:47,787 --> 01:01:50,748
It had to be reactive,
because they're lazy.
976
01:01:51,582 --> 01:01:54,961
So we came up with this campaign,
which was all about:
977
01:01:55,044 --> 01:01:57,171
Be part of the gang. Do something cool.
978
01:01:57,255 --> 01:01:58,423
Be part of a movement.
979
01:01:58,715 --> 01:02:00,967
And it was called the "Do So!" campaign.
980
01:02:01,384 --> 01:02:03,024
[Kaiser]
It means "I'm not going to vote."
981
01:02:03,219 --> 01:02:04,887
[Nix] "Do so! Don't vote."
982
01:02:04,971 --> 01:02:06,973
[crowd cheering]
983
01:02:07,974 --> 01:02:09,726
[man] The salute of resistance
984
01:02:09,851 --> 01:02:12,729
that is known to all
across Trinidad and Tobago.
985
01:02:13,396 --> 01:02:15,481
Do So! Do So!
986
01:02:16,399 --> 01:02:18,484
- Do So!
- [crowd continues cheering]
987
01:02:18,776 --> 01:02:21,988
[Nix] It's a sign of resistance against,
not the government,
988
01:02:22,071 --> 01:02:24,574
against politics and voting.
989
01:02:24,949 --> 01:02:27,034
- d Run with it, run with it d
- d Run, run d
990
01:02:27,118 --> 01:02:28,762
- d Run with it, run with it d
- d Run, run d
991
01:02:28,786 --> 01:02:31,164
[Nix]
They're making their own YouTube videos.
992
01:02:31,247 --> 01:02:34,667
This is the prime minister's house
that's being graffitied.
993
01:02:34,751 --> 01:02:36,502
It was carnage.
994
01:02:38,296 --> 01:02:41,048
[Nix]
We knew that when it came to voting,
995
01:02:41,215 --> 01:02:44,177
all the Afro-Caribbean kids wouldn't vote,
996
01:02:44,260 --> 01:02:45,261
because they Do So!
997
01:02:45,344 --> 01:02:48,973
But all the Indian kids would do
what their parents told them to do,
998
01:02:49,223 --> 01:02:50,808
which is go out and vote.
999
01:02:51,434 --> 01:02:53,269
They had a lot of fun doing this,
1000
01:02:53,352 --> 01:02:56,397
but they're not gonna go
against their parents' will.
1001
01:02:56,939 --> 01:02:58,024
[fireworks crackling]
1002
01:02:58,107 --> 01:03:00,526
[overlapping shouts]
1003
01:03:00,610 --> 01:03:05,072
Thank God for the guidance
that has brought us here to this victory.
1004
01:03:05,156 --> 01:03:07,492
Thank you. Thank you, God.
1005
01:03:07,575 --> 01:03:12,663
[Nix] And the difference in
18-to 35-year-old turnout was like 40%.
1006
01:03:13,372 --> 01:03:16,209
And that swung the election about 6%,
1007
01:03:16,292 --> 01:03:19,253
which was all we needed
in an election that's very close.
1008
01:03:22,256 --> 01:03:28,179
We now undertake ten national campaigns
for prime minister or president each year.
1009
01:03:28,805 --> 01:03:30,389
Malaysia, we're working in.
1010
01:03:30,473 --> 01:03:34,602
[Kaiser] We did Lithuania, Romania,
Kenya, Ghana.
1011
01:03:35,186 --> 01:03:37,266
- [Nix] So quite a few this year.
- [Kaiser] Nigeria.
1012
01:03:37,563 --> 01:03:40,650
- [man] The Brexit campaign?
- [Nix] Oh, and the Brexit campaign, yeah.
1013
01:03:41,067 --> 01:03:42,902
But we don't talk about that.
1014
01:03:42,985 --> 01:03:44,278
[Kaiser] Oops, we won!
1015
01:03:44,362 --> 01:03:45,738
[laughter]
1016
01:03:50,243 --> 01:03:52,912
[man] Do you worry at all
that she might let you down?
1017
01:03:54,539 --> 01:03:55,873
[sighs]
1018
01:03:56,541 --> 01:03:58,251
Look, um...
1019
01:04:01,254 --> 01:04:02,463
[sighs]
1020
01:04:06,843 --> 01:04:08,135
That is a good question.
1021
01:04:10,429 --> 01:04:15,184
I know already that she is
a complicated person, uh,
1022
01:04:15,268 --> 01:04:16,435
who has...
1023
01:04:18,521 --> 01:04:20,773
you know, done some complicated things.
1024
01:04:21,524 --> 01:04:22,608
Uh...
1025
01:04:23,734 --> 01:04:26,571
I believe in redemption.
1026
01:04:26,946 --> 01:04:28,239
[chuckles]
1027
01:04:28,948 --> 01:04:35,371
Uh, individual redemption
and collective... uh, social redemption.
1028
01:04:35,454 --> 01:04:39,041
Uh, I'm an idealist.
I think we can fix stuff that's broken,
1029
01:04:39,333 --> 01:04:42,962
uh, and, at the same time,
1030
01:04:43,045 --> 01:04:46,591
I am a realist about the fact
that you can't fix everything. Um...
1031
01:04:46,716 --> 01:04:49,176
You know, some things get broken
and stay broken.
1032
01:04:54,682 --> 01:04:57,018
Good morning,
welcome to this further session
1033
01:04:57,101 --> 01:05:00,104
of the Digital, Culture,
Media and Sport Select Committee.
1034
01:05:00,187 --> 01:05:02,773
Very pleased to welcome Brittany Kaiser
to give evidence to
1035
01:05:02,857 --> 01:05:04,442
the committee this morning.
1036
01:05:05,276 --> 01:05:09,739
Now, there was a contact between Facebook
and Cambridge Analytica
1037
01:05:09,822 --> 01:05:14,994
about the use of data in,
I think it was 2015, from memory.
1038
01:05:15,202 --> 01:05:18,205
Did you know about that at the time?
1039
01:05:18,414 --> 01:05:21,876
Uh, so Facebook had announced
to all of their clients
1040
01:05:21,959 --> 01:05:25,296
that they were going to close
their clients' access to this data,
1041
01:05:25,963 --> 01:05:27,673
so we agreed to delete it,
1042
01:05:27,757 --> 01:05:31,010
but in March 2016,
1043
01:05:31,093 --> 01:05:33,304
you know, six or eight weeks after
1044
01:05:33,387 --> 01:05:37,141
our chief data officer said
that those data sets were deleted,
1045
01:05:37,224 --> 01:05:40,227
I have an email from one
of our senior data scientists
1046
01:05:40,311 --> 01:05:44,941
that said that we were actually using
Facebook Like data in our modeling.
1047
01:05:45,024 --> 01:05:46,525
Ooh.
1048
01:05:46,609 --> 01:05:48,903
- [Kaiser] So that seems strange to me.
- Uh-oh.
1049
01:05:48,986 --> 01:05:51,131
[Kaiser] If we had deleted
all of the Facebook data sets,
1050
01:05:51,155 --> 01:05:53,491
how we were still using that
for modeling in March.
1051
01:05:54,700 --> 01:05:57,596
Ms. Kaiser, you seem to have traveled
a long way from an idealistic intern
1052
01:05:57,620 --> 01:05:59,288
in Barack Obama's campaign,
1053
01:05:59,372 --> 01:06:03,376
uh, to working for a company
that keeps pretty unsavory company,
1054
01:06:03,459 --> 01:06:07,213
uh, in wishing to make pitches
to far-right political parties.
1055
01:06:07,296 --> 01:06:09,799
- Mm-hmm.
- [man] Didn't that make you uncomfortable?
1056
01:06:09,966 --> 01:06:10,966
Uh, yes.
1057
01:06:11,717 --> 01:06:15,846
I would say questioning the ethics of it
is correct, definitely.
1058
01:06:15,930 --> 01:06:19,892
But I have been offered introductions
to clients
1059
01:06:19,976 --> 01:06:21,686
that I refused to meet with before,
1060
01:06:21,769 --> 01:06:25,940
um, such as the Alternative for Germany
and Marine Le Pen's campaign.
1061
01:06:26,023 --> 01:06:29,235
I refused to even get on a phone call
with them.
1062
01:06:30,361 --> 01:06:31,696
But not UKIP?
1063
01:06:31,988 --> 01:06:33,572
Not UKIP, no.
1064
01:06:35,116 --> 01:06:38,869
Um, did you appear and give a presentation
to the launch of Leave. EU?
1065
01:06:38,953 --> 01:06:40,121
Yes, I did.
1066
01:06:40,204 --> 01:06:42,999
[Matheson] Um, you must've been a bit, um,
disappointed then
1067
01:06:43,082 --> 01:06:45,501
when you subsequently
didn't do any work for them.
1068
01:06:45,793 --> 01:06:48,838
And we didn't do any further work for them
after that day, yes.
1069
01:06:48,921 --> 01:06:50,273
[Matheson] So you had done some work.
1070
01:06:50,297 --> 01:06:52,633
What was the nature of the work
that you had done so far?
1071
01:06:52,717 --> 01:06:53,968
We had taken receipt
1072
01:06:54,051 --> 01:06:57,388
of UK Independence Party data
and the survey data.
1073
01:06:57,471 --> 01:07:03,352
She's, like, contradicting Nix a lot,
what he said previously.
1074
01:07:03,436 --> 01:07:05,956
So, I think you've been quite clear,
as far as you're concerned,
1075
01:07:06,022 --> 01:07:10,026
you were working on the campaign,
but just not being paid for it?
1076
01:07:10,109 --> 01:07:12,069
- Mm-hmm.
- [Collins] You're pretty clear on that.
1077
01:07:12,862 --> 01:07:14,739
Just to clarify, for our benefit,
1078
01:07:14,822 --> 01:07:16,615
to be effective in this space,
1079
01:07:16,699 --> 01:07:18,951
how big a kind of working set do you need
1080
01:07:19,035 --> 01:07:22,163
to be able to then
use that to create the basis
1081
01:07:22,246 --> 01:07:24,790
for targeting the whole country
in terms of voting?
1082
01:07:25,082 --> 01:07:27,185
I'm not a data scientist,
so I wouldn't be able to say
1083
01:07:27,209 --> 01:07:29,712
the minimum number
of data points that you would require,
1084
01:07:29,795 --> 01:07:32,673
uh, but I do know
that their targeting tool
1085
01:07:32,757 --> 01:07:36,594
used to be export-controlled
by the British government,
1086
01:07:36,677 --> 01:07:39,930
so that would mean that
the methodology was considered a weapon.
1087
01:07:40,598 --> 01:07:43,267
Um, weapons-grade communications tactics.
1088
01:07:43,350 --> 01:07:46,896
What you're saying is that the proposal
was for Leave. EU to use what you call
1089
01:07:46,979 --> 01:07:50,858
weapons-grade communications techniques
against the UK population?
1090
01:07:51,942 --> 01:07:53,903
- [Kaiser] Yes, sir.
- It's crazy.
1091
01:07:54,236 --> 01:07:56,989
[O'Hara] Uh, I just want to get
your perspective as well.
1092
01:07:57,073 --> 01:07:59,158
What do you actually think
the legislators should do
1093
01:07:59,241 --> 01:08:01,368
in order to better protect people's data?
1094
01:08:01,911 --> 01:08:05,956
[Kaiser] Well, I'm very glad that
you asked that. Think about it right now.
1095
01:08:06,040 --> 01:08:08,459
The sole worth of Google and Facebook
1096
01:08:08,542 --> 01:08:12,046
is the fact that they own, and possess,
and hold, and use
1097
01:08:12,129 --> 01:08:14,249
the personal data
of people from all around the world.
1098
01:08:14,965 --> 01:08:17,218
So I think that the best way
to move forward
1099
01:08:17,301 --> 01:08:21,180
are for people to really possess
their data like their property.
1100
01:08:21,847 --> 01:08:23,825
- [O'Hara] Thank you, Chair.
- [Collins] Thank you.
1101
01:08:23,849 --> 01:08:26,602
Um, I think that concludes the questions
from us today.
1102
01:08:26,685 --> 01:08:28,005
Just before we close the session,
1103
01:08:28,062 --> 01:08:30,981
I just have to make a short announcement
about Alexander Nix.
1104
01:08:31,065 --> 01:08:34,193
He's now not able to give evidence
to the Committee tomorrow
1105
01:08:34,276 --> 01:08:37,321
as a consequence of him having been served
with an information notice
1106
01:08:37,404 --> 01:08:39,244
and being subject
to the criminal investigation
1107
01:08:39,323 --> 01:08:41,367
by the Information Commissioner's Office.
1108
01:08:41,450 --> 01:08:44,036
And I hope we'll be able to update people
1109
01:08:44,120 --> 01:08:46,413
about that early next week.
Thank you very much.
1110
01:08:47,081 --> 01:08:48,081
Thank you.
1111
01:08:48,749 --> 01:08:49,750
[Carroll] Shit!
1112
01:08:51,001 --> 01:08:53,045
[woman] The proceeding has ended.
1113
01:08:53,129 --> 01:08:54,129
Yes, it has!
1114
01:08:56,090 --> 01:08:57,091
[laughs]
1115
01:09:04,807 --> 01:09:06,809
[indistinct chatter]
1116
01:09:08,477 --> 01:09:10,479
[upbeat music playing over speakers]
1117
01:09:11,772 --> 01:09:13,732
I just got a text from Alexander.
1118
01:09:15,860 --> 01:09:17,486
[chuckles] Alexander Nix.
1119
01:09:20,447 --> 01:09:21,615
[man] What did he say?
1120
01:09:22,283 --> 01:09:25,619
"Well done, Britt.
Looked quite tough, and you did okay."
1121
01:09:26,453 --> 01:09:29,540
With a winky face little emoji.
1122
01:09:31,167 --> 01:09:33,794
It makes me kind of sad.
You know what I mean?
1123
01:09:33,878 --> 01:09:36,088
Like, it's not like he spent
three and a half years
1124
01:09:36,172 --> 01:09:37,923
being an asshole to me. He didn't.
1125
01:09:38,174 --> 01:09:40,443
[Hilder] He spent three and a half years
being nice to you
1126
01:09:40,467 --> 01:09:42,261
to get you to do what he wanted you to do.
1127
01:09:42,344 --> 01:09:46,473
Yeah. But he is rather fun. [laughs]
1128
01:09:46,557 --> 01:09:48,243
- [phone vibrates]
- [Hilder] I know, I know.
1129
01:09:48,267 --> 01:09:49,310
[Carroll] Hey, Justin.
1130
01:09:49,810 --> 01:09:52,146
[Justin over phone]
Hey, what's up? What did you think?
1131
01:09:52,646 --> 01:09:55,441
I'm processing it.
There were a lot of revelations.
1132
01:09:57,484 --> 01:10:00,988
SCL has to file its defense
at the end of the month,
1133
01:10:01,614 --> 01:10:04,200
so, it'll be really interesting
to see, like,
1134
01:10:04,283 --> 01:10:07,328
what they think they can do,
especially after this.
1135
01:10:07,995 --> 01:10:09,205
[Justin] That's right.
1136
01:10:10,206 --> 01:10:11,290
[Carroll] I mean, shit.
1137
01:10:11,373 --> 01:10:15,753
She said that basically psychographics
should be classified as a weapon.
1138
01:10:20,216 --> 01:10:23,719
It seems like Kaiser has
some moral compass in her.
1139
01:10:26,805 --> 01:10:30,392
But, so many times,
she knew that she was
1140
01:10:30,476 --> 01:10:32,061
in a dark world
1141
01:10:32,353 --> 01:10:33,896
and didn't step away.
1142
01:10:33,979 --> 01:10:37,191
And they... they got... got her on that
a couple of times.
1143
01:10:37,274 --> 01:10:38,274
Yeah.
1144
01:10:42,154 --> 01:10:45,157
[interviewer] You did work for a man who,
upon meeting you,
1145
01:10:45,241 --> 01:10:46,927
said to you, you know,
"Let me get you drunk
1146
01:10:46,951 --> 01:10:48,452
and steal your secrets."
1147
01:10:48,869 --> 01:10:51,789
You knew the kind of company
that you were working for.
1148
01:10:51,997 --> 01:10:54,208
I don't know. I guess I trusted him.
1149
01:10:54,500 --> 01:10:56,377
I worked for him
for three and a half years.
1150
01:10:56,460 --> 01:10:59,171
He was a friend and mentor. I mean...
1151
01:10:59,463 --> 01:11:01,465
He actually just sent me a text,
1152
01:11:01,548 --> 01:11:05,135
although I haven't spoken to him in,
I don't know, at least over a month.
1153
01:11:05,219 --> 01:11:06,696
[interviewer] So, he was watching you.
1154
01:11:06,720 --> 01:11:08,720
- He watched, yes.
- [interviewer] What did he say?
1155
01:11:09,056 --> 01:11:12,393
He said that it looked pretty tough
but that I did a good job.
1156
01:11:12,476 --> 01:11:14,520
- [interviewer] Did you reply?
- No.
1157
01:11:14,728 --> 01:11:15,854
[interviewer] Will you?
1158
01:11:15,938 --> 01:11:18,482
No, I don't think that's appropriate
at this time.
1159
01:11:18,565 --> 01:11:21,110
[interviewer]
So, there's no friendship there?
1160
01:11:21,777 --> 01:11:27,658
Well, I now question, you know,
how much of a friendship it actually was.
1161
01:11:49,722 --> 01:11:52,141
[Cadwalladr] The thing which
I give Brittany credit for...
1162
01:11:52,433 --> 01:11:56,520
it's really amazed me how many people
are just keeping their mouths shut.
1163
01:12:01,066 --> 01:12:03,485
I mean, it was a jaw-dropping moment
1164
01:12:03,569 --> 01:12:08,866
when Brittany said these are classified
as weapons-grade technology.
1165
01:12:09,199 --> 01:12:11,994
And it was actually illegal to use those
1166
01:12:12,077 --> 01:12:14,455
without the permission
of the British government.
1167
01:12:18,125 --> 01:12:19,710
It's psyops.
1168
01:12:20,961 --> 01:12:24,214
Psyops is psychological operations.
1169
01:12:24,298 --> 01:12:27,801
And it's a...
it's a term that the military uses
1170
01:12:27,885 --> 01:12:32,348
to describe what you do in warfare
which isn't warfare.
1171
01:12:32,431 --> 01:12:34,350
So, essentially, you know,
1172
01:12:34,433 --> 01:12:36,602
in a place like Afghanistan,
you've got a choice.
1173
01:12:36,685 --> 01:12:38,562
You either bomb the shit out of a village
1174
01:12:38,854 --> 01:12:41,398
or you try and use other techniques
1175
01:12:41,482 --> 01:12:44,943
to persuade them that actually,
"The Taliban's not very good,
1176
01:12:45,027 --> 01:12:46,862
and you'd be much better off
without them."
1177
01:12:51,033 --> 01:12:54,203
SCL started out as a military contractor.
1178
01:12:54,286 --> 01:12:55,454
SCL Defense.
1179
01:12:57,498 --> 01:13:00,417
[Nix] We have a fairly substantial
defense business.
1180
01:13:01,627 --> 01:13:03,837
We actually train the British Army,
the British Navy,
1181
01:13:03,921 --> 01:13:05,464
the U.S. Army, U.S. Special Forces.
1182
01:13:05,547 --> 01:13:09,009
We train NATO, the CIA,
State Department, Pentagon.
1183
01:13:09,718 --> 01:13:15,099
It's using research to influence behavior
of hostile audiences.
1184
01:13:15,766 --> 01:13:20,646
You know, how do you persuade
14-to 30-year-old Muslim boys
1185
01:13:20,729 --> 01:13:22,356
not to join Al-Qaeda?
1186
01:13:23,440 --> 01:13:24,942
Essentially communication warfare.
1187
01:13:25,025 --> 01:13:26,985
- [man] Allahu Akbar!
- [all] Allahu Akbar!
1188
01:13:27,486 --> 01:13:30,948
[Cadwalladr] They'd worked
in Afghanistan, they'd worked in Iraq,
1189
01:13:31,031 --> 01:13:34,576
they'd worked in various places
in Eastern Europe.
1190
01:13:34,993 --> 01:13:37,663
But the real game changer
1191
01:13:37,746 --> 01:13:42,918
was they started using information warfare
in elections.
1192
01:13:44,044 --> 01:13:47,714
[Nix] There's a lot of overlap,
because it's all the same methodology.
1193
01:13:50,843 --> 01:13:55,139
[Cadwalladr] All of the campaigns
which Cambridge Analytica/SCL did
1194
01:13:55,222 --> 01:13:57,599
for the developing world,
1195
01:13:57,808 --> 01:14:02,020
it was all about practicing
some new technology or trick.
1196
01:14:02,354 --> 01:14:04,106
How to persuade people,
1197
01:14:04,189 --> 01:14:07,943
how to suppress turnout,
or how to increase turnout.
1198
01:14:10,654 --> 01:14:11,654
And then it's like,
1199
01:14:11,697 --> 01:14:15,075
"Okay, now we've got the hang of it,
let's use it in Britain and America."
1200
01:14:24,751 --> 01:14:25,752
[Nix]
1201
01:14:37,014 --> 01:14:38,557
[overlapping restaurant chatter]
1202
01:14:42,269 --> 01:14:43,269
[man] Yes.
1203
01:15:19,306 --> 01:15:22,643
...and expands, but with no branding,
1204
01:15:22,893 --> 01:15:25,646
so it's unattributable, untrackable.
1205
01:15:26,396 --> 01:15:28,565
- [applause]
- And my view...
1206
01:15:29,441 --> 01:15:32,569
is that if you can't run your own house,
1207
01:15:32,778 --> 01:15:35,447
- you certainly can't run the White House.
- [crowd cheering]
1208
01:15:35,531 --> 01:15:36,990
- Can't do it.
- [cheering]
1209
01:15:38,158 --> 01:15:41,620
[Trump] Crooked Hillary, right? Crooked.
She's crooked as you can be.
1210
01:15:41,703 --> 01:15:43,413
[crowd chanting]
Lock her up! Lock her up!
1211
01:15:43,497 --> 01:15:45,415
[man] Yep, that's right, lock her up!
1212
01:15:45,499 --> 01:15:47,251
Lock her up! Lock her up!
1213
01:15:47,584 --> 01:15:49,920
Lock her up! Lock her up!
1214
01:15:50,003 --> 01:15:51,838
[crowd continues shouting]
1215
01:15:51,922 --> 01:15:54,424
Let's defeat her in November.
1216
01:16:08,105 --> 01:16:10,482
[man] What was it like for you to watch
1217
01:16:10,566 --> 01:16:12,526
the Channel 4 undercover video?
1218
01:16:14,069 --> 01:16:15,612
Nobody recognized it.
1219
01:16:18,407 --> 01:16:20,701
When we watched that video...
1220
01:16:21,118 --> 01:16:25,872
I watched it in the New York office
with, um, all the staff there.
1221
01:16:25,956 --> 01:16:27,791
And we knew it was coming out.
1222
01:16:28,000 --> 01:16:30,377
And I think everybody was...
1223
01:16:31,962 --> 01:16:33,255
in a state of shock.
1224
01:16:35,424 --> 01:16:40,095
Everybody walked away from the screen
in silence back to their desks.
1225
01:16:47,978 --> 01:16:51,398
[reporter 1] Tonight, an undercover
interview by Channel 4 News in London
1226
01:16:51,481 --> 01:16:52,983
shows Cambridge executives,
1227
01:16:53,066 --> 01:16:55,485
including CEO Alexander Nix,
1228
01:16:55,569 --> 01:16:58,030
boasting about the company's role
in Trump's win.
1229
01:16:58,488 --> 01:17:01,533
This series of undercover interviews
by Channel 4 News
1230
01:17:01,617 --> 01:17:03,076
also caught Nix on tape
1231
01:17:03,160 --> 01:17:06,038
talking about potential bribery
and entrapment.
1232
01:17:08,832 --> 01:17:10,334
[man] I don't understand.
1233
01:17:14,588 --> 01:17:16,798
[reporter 1] Mr. Nix, can I ask you
what your message is
1234
01:17:16,882 --> 01:17:19,217
to Cambridge Analytica employees today?
1235
01:17:22,220 --> 01:17:24,780
[reporter 2] We've just got a statement
from Cambridge Analytica.
1236
01:17:25,932 --> 01:17:29,686
Alexander Nix has been suspended
with immediate effect.
1237
01:17:29,770 --> 01:17:34,066
The company accused of harvesting the data
of more than 87 million Facebook users
1238
01:17:34,149 --> 01:17:35,484
says it is shutting down.
1239
01:17:35,817 --> 01:17:40,489
The company says it intends to file
for bankruptcy in the US and the UK.
1240
01:17:42,324 --> 01:17:44,576
[reporter]
Critics believe Cambridge Analytica
1241
01:17:44,660 --> 01:17:47,496
and SCL Elections
may be shutting operations
1242
01:17:47,579 --> 01:17:51,583
to limit or restrict the ability
of the authority's investigations
1243
01:17:51,667 --> 01:17:53,794
and also to get rid of evidence.
1244
01:18:02,678 --> 01:18:04,364
[Wheatland]
The Cambridge Analytica scandal,
1245
01:18:04,388 --> 01:18:05,972
is it now the Facebook scandal?
1246
01:18:08,100 --> 01:18:10,185
I mean, this is not about one company.
1247
01:18:11,436 --> 01:18:16,608
This technology is going on unabated
and will continue to go on.
1248
01:18:17,943 --> 01:18:19,653
But Cambridge Analytica's gone.
1249
01:18:20,696 --> 01:18:23,532
In some senses, I feel that, um...
1250
01:18:25,867 --> 01:18:30,038
that because of the way
that this technology is moving so fast,
1251
01:18:30,414 --> 01:18:34,710
and because people
don't really understand it,
1252
01:18:34,793 --> 01:18:37,170
and because there's a lot of concerns
about it,
1253
01:18:37,254 --> 01:18:40,215
there was always going to be
a Cambridge Analytica.
1254
01:18:40,632 --> 01:18:43,218
It just sucks for me
it was Cambridge Analytica.
1255
01:18:55,814 --> 01:18:57,733
[Cadwalladr]
After we dealt with the threats
1256
01:18:57,816 --> 01:19:00,527
from Cambridge Analytica
over the course of a year,
1257
01:19:01,027 --> 01:19:03,363
then the thing which made
our heads explode
1258
01:19:03,447 --> 01:19:06,283
was the day before publication,
when we got a letter from Facebook.
1259
01:19:06,992 --> 01:19:10,245
Yeah, it felt like an attempt
to... to cow us into submission.
1260
01:19:10,328 --> 01:19:11,747
It didn't feel like a sort of...
1261
01:19:11,830 --> 01:19:14,499
To me, it didn't feel like
a legitimate response...
1262
01:19:14,583 --> 01:19:18,462
And you sort of go, you know,
why is a great, big organization like you
1263
01:19:18,545 --> 01:19:20,130
using UK lawyers?
1264
01:19:20,213 --> 01:19:22,382
And again, a very aggressive threat
1265
01:19:22,466 --> 01:19:24,318
for which, actually, they then...
Didn't they apologize?
1266
01:19:24,342 --> 01:19:26,178
Yes,
they said it was not their finest hour.
1267
01:19:26,261 --> 01:19:27,888
- [all laugh]
- [Cadwalladr] Yeah.
1268
01:19:27,971 --> 01:19:29,473
And up until that point,
1269
01:19:29,556 --> 01:19:31,808
it was like the tech giants were still,
like,
1270
01:19:31,892 --> 01:19:33,727
the nice guys who wear hoodies,
1271
01:19:33,810 --> 01:19:35,562
- who connected the world.
- [Phillips] Yep.
1272
01:19:35,645 --> 01:19:37,898
And there was a shift away
1273
01:19:37,981 --> 01:19:39,983
from big tech being good
1274
01:19:40,066 --> 01:19:43,945
to saying well, actually,
we do need to start asking questions
1275
01:19:44,029 --> 01:19:46,364
about this and what it is.
1276
01:19:50,243 --> 01:19:52,245
[Cadwalladr] Cambridge Analytica is gone,
1277
01:19:52,829 --> 01:19:58,502
but it's really important to understand
that the Cambridge Analytica story
1278
01:19:58,668 --> 01:20:02,923
actually points to this much bigger,
more worrying story
1279
01:20:03,757 --> 01:20:08,637
which is that our personal data
is out there and being used against us
1280
01:20:08,720 --> 01:20:10,931
in ways we don't understand.
1281
01:20:14,643 --> 01:20:16,520
And if David gets his data back,
1282
01:20:16,812 --> 01:20:19,856
we can hopefully start
getting some answers.
1283
01:20:22,734 --> 01:20:26,780
[Carroll] The deadline is today for SCL
to comply with the law
1284
01:20:26,863 --> 01:20:28,615
and give me my data.
1285
01:20:30,659 --> 01:20:35,497
We're at the precipice of evasion
or accountability.
1286
01:20:38,583 --> 01:20:40,210
Carole tweeted,
1287
01:20:40,293 --> 01:20:43,421
"Prof. Carroll also giving evidence
to European Parliament today
1288
01:20:43,505 --> 01:20:47,634
on day of deadline for Cambridge Analytica
to turn over his data to him.
1289
01:20:47,717 --> 01:20:51,388
If it fails to do so, it becomes
a matter for criminal proceedings."
1290
01:20:55,934 --> 01:20:58,728
[Carroll]
"Hey Ravi, have you heard anything?"
1291
01:21:00,272 --> 01:21:01,356
"Not yet."
1292
01:21:07,445 --> 01:21:11,783
I've been waiting to hear from my lawyer,
and we have heard nothing.
1293
01:21:11,867 --> 01:21:14,244
And so they have not respected
the regulator.
1294
01:21:14,327 --> 01:21:16,788
They are not respecting the law.
1295
01:21:17,372 --> 01:21:19,666
So now that this is becoming
a criminal matter,
1296
01:21:19,749 --> 01:21:21,626
we are now in uncharted waters.
1297
01:21:22,711 --> 01:21:26,298
And I will continue to pursue it
1298
01:21:26,381 --> 01:21:30,051
because their model has the potential
to affect a population
1299
01:21:30,135 --> 01:21:32,596
even if it's just a tiny slice
of the population,
1300
01:21:32,679 --> 01:21:34,264
because in the United States,
1301
01:21:34,347 --> 01:21:39,436
only about 70,000 voters in three states
decided the election.
1302
01:21:42,188 --> 01:21:45,275
Thank you very much,
um, Professor Carroll. Um...
1303
01:21:45,609 --> 01:21:46,818
Mr. Batten.
1304
01:21:47,277 --> 01:21:51,281
[Batten] My question is
for Carole Cadwalladr from The Guardian.
1305
01:21:51,364 --> 01:21:56,077
Is The Guardian's stand
on this a purely politically partisan one
1306
01:21:56,161 --> 01:22:00,040
in its own intention to assist
in any way that it can
1307
01:22:00,123 --> 01:22:03,251
to reverse and overturn
the result of the referendum?
1308
01:22:05,420 --> 01:22:10,258
This is not a partisan issue,
I cannot say that more strongly.
1309
01:22:10,342 --> 01:22:14,304
This is about the integrity
of our democracy.
1310
01:22:14,387 --> 01:22:17,057
It's about our national sovereignty.
1311
01:22:17,599 --> 01:22:21,061
And I would think that you would have
an interest in that also.
1312
01:22:21,144 --> 01:22:23,146
[pounding applause]
1313
01:22:24,147 --> 01:22:28,234
I think that we desperately need
more information,
1314
01:22:28,652 --> 01:22:31,154
because we don't how people were targeted
1315
01:22:31,237 --> 01:22:33,782
and we don't know what data
that was based upon.
1316
01:22:34,157 --> 01:22:40,956
One thing we do know is that Facebook
has been obstructive in its efforts
1317
01:22:41,039 --> 01:22:43,708
to help the British Parliament
investigate this matter.
1318
01:22:44,084 --> 01:22:48,755
Uh, really, really, really,
you've got to, like, look higher
1319
01:22:48,838 --> 01:22:50,966
and really see the bigger issue here
1320
01:22:51,049 --> 01:22:53,635
and the bigger picture
and the bigger risks to us all.
1321
01:22:55,637 --> 01:22:57,973
[applause]
1322
01:23:04,771 --> 01:23:07,983
[reporter] Roger, even if, uh, Facebook
hasn't broken any laws,
1323
01:23:08,066 --> 01:23:12,320
have they broken a sort of moral trust
that they have with their consumers?
1324
01:23:12,404 --> 01:23:14,197
Well, I... They have with me.
1325
01:23:14,280 --> 01:23:18,743
I mean, I spent three months,
starting in October 2016, trying to say,
1326
01:23:18,827 --> 01:23:22,455
"Guys, I think you're killing democracy,
and you're gonna kill your business."
1327
01:23:22,539 --> 01:23:24,833
- Hi, how are you? I'm Roger.
- Hi, how are you?
1328
01:23:24,916 --> 01:23:26,811
- [McNamee] Pleasure to meet you.
- Pleasure to meet you.
1329
01:23:26,835 --> 01:23:31,131
Facebook is designed
to monopolize attention.
1330
01:23:31,589 --> 01:23:34,509
Just taking all of the basic tricks
of propaganda,
1331
01:23:34,592 --> 01:23:37,053
marrying them to the tricks
of casino gambling.
1332
01:23:37,137 --> 01:23:39,014
You know, slot machines and the like.
1333
01:23:39,264 --> 01:23:43,977
And basically playing on instincts,
1334
01:23:44,394 --> 01:23:47,772
and fear and anger are the two
most dependable ways of doing that.
1335
01:23:47,897 --> 01:23:50,483
And so, they created a set of tools
1336
01:23:50,567 --> 01:23:56,197
to allow advertisers to exploit
that emotional audience
1337
01:23:57,073 --> 01:24:00,368
with individual-level targeting, right?
1338
01:24:00,452 --> 01:24:05,623
There's 2.1 billion people,
each with their own reality.
1339
01:24:05,915 --> 01:24:08,251
And once everybody has their own reality,
1340
01:24:08,334 --> 01:24:11,463
- it's relatively easy to manipulate them.
- Mmm. Yeah.
1341
01:24:11,546 --> 01:24:16,926
And the other thing about this is,
they know that it's killing me...
1342
01:24:17,218 --> 01:24:18,678
- [Kaiser] Yeah.
- ...to be critical
1343
01:24:18,762 --> 01:24:20,597
of what I've viewed as my baby.
1344
01:24:20,680 --> 01:24:24,809
It is a lot easier to just sort of say,
"I'm not gonna think about it."
1345
01:24:24,893 --> 01:24:25,893
[Hilder] Yes.
1346
01:24:25,977 --> 01:24:27,645
- But...
- [Kaiser] Yeah.
1347
01:24:28,229 --> 01:24:31,191
...you get tested in your life
a few times, right? And...
1348
01:24:31,483 --> 01:24:33,151
for me, this was one of those moments.
1349
01:24:33,234 --> 01:24:35,004
I was either gonna stand up
and do something about this,
1350
01:24:35,028 --> 01:24:37,781
or I wasn't gonna stand up
and do anything about anything. Right?
1351
01:24:37,864 --> 01:24:40,533
Because my fingerprints are on this thing.
1352
01:24:41,034 --> 01:24:43,495
- [Kaiser] I know.
- I mean, I felt really guilty.
1353
01:24:44,621 --> 01:24:47,332
And I just want to be able to...
1354
01:24:48,458 --> 01:24:49,876
sleep at night.
1355
01:25:09,354 --> 01:25:12,774
[Hilder] One of the things
that I was really struck by was...
1356
01:25:13,066 --> 01:25:15,318
what happened with you
1357
01:25:15,401 --> 01:25:17,487
and the Obama people
and the Hillary people.
1358
01:25:18,863 --> 01:25:22,325
[Kaiser] Uh, none of them ever wanted
to offer to pay me.
1359
01:25:23,493 --> 01:25:27,497
And, um,
when your family loses all their money
1360
01:25:27,580 --> 01:25:30,375
and loses their family home
1361
01:25:30,458 --> 01:25:33,002
and your father,
who's the main breadwinner,
1362
01:25:33,086 --> 01:25:35,588
has brain surgery
and can never work again,
1363
01:25:36,214 --> 01:25:38,925
you have to work for people that pay you.
1364
01:25:40,718 --> 01:25:42,220
[thunder rumbles]
1365
01:25:42,303 --> 01:25:45,265
[Hilder]
Your family lost their money in 2008?
1366
01:25:45,682 --> 01:25:49,519
Um, yeah, but it took a while
for it all to really fall apart.
1367
01:25:49,602 --> 01:25:50,854
- [man] Yeah.
- Um...
1368
01:25:52,147 --> 01:25:57,026
We lost our family home in 2014,
when I started working for Cambridge.
1369
01:26:09,497 --> 01:26:12,375
[reporter 1] Alexander Nix appears
before Parliament's Media Committee
1370
01:26:12,458 --> 01:26:14,460
after previously refusing to testify
1371
01:26:14,544 --> 01:26:17,338
due to law enforcement investigations
into the firm.
1372
01:26:19,924 --> 01:26:22,260
[overlapping questions]
1373
01:26:22,343 --> 01:26:23,887
- Hi, Jo, how are you?
- Hello.
1374
01:26:27,223 --> 01:26:29,058
[Carroll] The last time I was in London,
1375
01:26:29,142 --> 01:26:33,188
I remember considering challenging SCL
1376
01:26:34,522 --> 01:26:38,651
and running through my head, like,
how scary it was.
1377
01:26:40,195 --> 01:26:42,572
The Committee's very grateful, uh,
to Alexander Nix
1378
01:26:42,655 --> 01:26:45,408
for agreeing to come back
in front of the committee today
1379
01:26:45,491 --> 01:26:47,243
to answer our questions...
1380
01:26:47,327 --> 01:26:49,120
[Carroll] Now, to be back here and, uh...
1381
01:26:49,204 --> 01:26:52,457
these guys are down for the count and...
1382
01:26:52,540 --> 01:26:54,876
the villain is up against the wall.
1383
01:26:56,336 --> 01:26:59,505
[chuckles] You know,
does he have any allies left in the world
1384
01:27:00,298 --> 01:27:02,634
or has everybody turned against him?
1385
01:27:04,385 --> 01:27:05,720
[sighs] Right.
1386
01:27:06,763 --> 01:27:09,849
I'd like to make
a few short clarifications.
1387
01:27:09,933 --> 01:27:12,560
Um, these will only take a few minutes,
1388
01:27:12,644 --> 01:27:17,273
uh, but it is important
to be able to frame, uh, my answers.
1389
01:27:17,357 --> 01:27:18,358
He's so nervous.
1390
01:27:18,441 --> 01:27:20,461
Mr. Nix, I'd be grateful if you'd start
with the committee's questions
1391
01:27:20,485 --> 01:27:22,087
and then see how we go
through the hearing.
1392
01:27:22,111 --> 01:27:26,449
Ordinarily, uh, I would respect that,
but these aren't ordinary circumstances,
1393
01:27:26,532 --> 01:27:30,203
and so, if I may, I'd like to start
with a very brief statement
1394
01:27:30,286 --> 01:27:31,663
just to set out my position.
1395
01:27:31,746 --> 01:27:34,332
I would rather take this
on a question by question basis
1396
01:27:34,415 --> 01:27:37,126
rather than being dealt with
as a statement at the beginning.
1397
01:27:37,377 --> 01:27:39,587
Mr. Collins,
you'll have plenty of opportunity,
1398
01:27:39,671 --> 01:27:43,174
as will all the Committee,
to ask me as many questions as you want,
1399
01:27:43,258 --> 01:27:45,134
but I have to insist on...
1400
01:27:45,218 --> 01:27:48,614
- How could you possibly start like that...
- [Collins] It's not your place to insist.
1401
01:27:48,638 --> 01:27:51,724
"I accept that some of my answers
could have been clearer..."
1402
01:27:51,808 --> 01:27:54,560
[Collins] So, instead,
you're just reading out the statement.
1403
01:27:54,644 --> 01:27:58,189
- Can you answer the first question...
- Why is he doing that?
1404
01:27:59,816 --> 01:28:02,456
- Could you repeat your first question?
- [Collins] Yes, thank you.
1405
01:28:02,527 --> 01:28:05,238
You did pitch to work on the Referendum,
1406
01:28:05,321 --> 01:28:09,284
and I don't want to dwell on Leave. EU
because you've made your position clear.
1407
01:28:09,534 --> 01:28:12,912
We're really scratching around here,
Mr. Farrelly. Um...
1408
01:28:13,329 --> 01:28:17,417
We've been working, or I've been working
with this company for 15 years. Um...
1409
01:28:17,500 --> 01:28:20,086
We've never undertaken an election
in the UK.
1410
01:28:20,253 --> 01:28:21,462
[Collins] Well, I was...
1411
01:28:21,546 --> 01:28:23,732
- I hope I wasn't scratching around.
- That is not true.
1412
01:28:23,756 --> 01:28:26,759
[Collins] I was comparing what you told us
with the evidence
1413
01:28:26,843 --> 01:28:28,344
that's subsequently emerged,
1414
01:28:28,428 --> 01:28:30,468
- and you clearly felt...
- [phone chimes, vibrates]
1415
01:28:30,513 --> 01:28:33,641
...that the work that you've done, uh...
[stammers, continues indistinctly]
1416
01:28:33,725 --> 01:28:37,186
[Kaiser] So, I got an email from Carole.
1417
01:28:37,270 --> 01:28:40,315
She knows that I met Julian Assange
in February.
1418
01:28:40,398 --> 01:28:42,025
[chuckles] Um...
1419
01:28:42,108 --> 01:28:47,155
And she knows that I donated to WikiLeaks
at some point in Bitcoin.
1420
01:28:49,073 --> 01:28:52,076
If she prints something about it today,
it's going to make...
1421
01:28:53,202 --> 01:28:56,372
my conversations with my own government
really difficult.
1422
01:28:56,914 --> 01:28:59,059
[Collins] Um, it came up
in Brittany Kaiser's evidence,
1423
01:28:59,083 --> 01:29:02,628
because you spoke to us about, uh,
Julian Assange the last time you came,
1424
01:29:02,712 --> 01:29:06,049
saying that you made an attempt
to gain access to the emails
1425
01:29:06,132 --> 01:29:08,092
that Julian Assange had, um,
1426
01:29:08,176 --> 01:29:11,554
the Hillary Clinton emails,
in order to benefit your client,
1427
01:29:11,637 --> 01:29:12,554
the Trump campaign.
1428
01:29:12,555 --> 01:29:15,099
Well, these were very contentious emails,
potentially...
1429
01:29:15,183 --> 01:29:17,602
- [Collins] Yeah.
- ...and we wanted to understand...
1430
01:29:17,685 --> 01:29:19,812
as did every journalist
1431
01:29:19,896 --> 01:29:22,565
and, I would say,
most political consultants
1432
01:29:22,648 --> 01:29:25,109
on both sides of the aisle
in the United States,
1433
01:29:25,193 --> 01:29:26,778
um, what was contained in them.
1434
01:29:26,861 --> 01:29:32,492
[stammers] I don't think that curiosity
is indicative of anything nefarious.
1435
01:29:32,575 --> 01:29:36,245
- [hearing continues indistinctly]
- Oh, my God. Carole published the article.
1436
01:29:38,122 --> 01:29:40,666
I didn't discuss the US election!
1437
01:29:40,750 --> 01:29:43,086
- Oh, my God, this is insane!
- [phone ringing]
1438
01:29:43,169 --> 01:29:44,337
Paul!
1439
01:29:44,420 --> 01:29:46,964
- [Paul] Hello, how are you!
- Paul!
1440
01:29:47,507 --> 01:29:50,051
I have said to you, it's all coming out,
1441
01:29:50,134 --> 01:29:51,469
and the question is how.
1442
01:29:51,552 --> 01:29:54,347
I didn't conspire
to leak Hillary's emails,
1443
01:29:54,430 --> 01:29:58,184
and I have nothing... [clears throat]
...to do with Russia, so...
1444
01:29:58,267 --> 01:29:59,267
[Paul] Yes.
1445
01:29:59,435 --> 01:30:01,020
The fact is...
1446
01:30:01,104 --> 01:30:02,104
[clears throat]
1447
01:30:02,522 --> 01:30:05,233
- ...it looks like I did both.
- Does it look like you did both?
1448
01:30:05,316 --> 01:30:08,694
If I wasn't me, I would say yes,
that's what it looks like!
1449
01:30:08,778 --> 01:30:10,446
- [chuckles nervously]
- [Paul laughs]
1450
01:30:11,155 --> 01:30:12,698
That's why I'm freaking out.
1451
01:30:12,782 --> 01:30:15,535
There's gonna be so many people
that literally never believe me.
1452
01:30:15,952 --> 01:30:18,496
I will die
with people still not believing me.
1453
01:30:18,579 --> 01:30:21,374
- Uh, that is possible.
- [chuckles]
1454
01:30:21,624 --> 01:30:24,043
- That is definitely possible. [laughs]
- I know!
1455
01:30:24,794 --> 01:30:26,170
Agh! [slams table]
1456
01:30:27,380 --> 01:30:28,423
All right...
1457
01:30:29,006 --> 01:30:31,446
[Kaiser sniffles] I think I need
to get the fuck out of here.
1458
01:30:34,887 --> 01:30:37,807
[O'Hara] From where I'm sitting,
since you've come here today,
1459
01:30:37,890 --> 01:30:41,686
you have attempted to paint yourself
as the victim here,
1460
01:30:41,769 --> 01:30:46,566
though, by no stretch of the imagination
can you be seen as a victim.
1461
01:30:46,858 --> 01:30:50,194
Surely you can see that
you are not the victim here.
1462
01:30:51,028 --> 01:30:52,864
[Nix] What if I was the victim?
1463
01:30:52,947 --> 01:30:56,868
What happens if, as some
of these investigations are concluded,
1464
01:30:56,951 --> 01:30:59,787
people realize
that actually we were simply...
1465
01:31:00,371 --> 01:31:04,917
the guys who were, uh,
perceived to have contributed
1466
01:31:05,001 --> 01:31:06,711
to the Trump campaign
1467
01:31:06,794 --> 01:31:10,923
and were wrongly accredited
with being the architects of Brexit
1468
01:31:11,340 --> 01:31:15,636
and as a result of the polarizing nature
of those two political campaigns,
1469
01:31:15,720 --> 01:31:18,723
the global liberal media took umbrage
1470
01:31:18,806 --> 01:31:21,684
and decided to put us in their crosshairs
1471
01:31:21,767 --> 01:31:26,147
and launch a coordinated attack on us
as a company
1472
01:31:26,230 --> 01:31:29,317
in order to destroy our reputations
and our business,
1473
01:31:29,400 --> 01:31:34,405
and all of this was underpinned
by a stream of allegations,
1474
01:31:34,489 --> 01:31:37,867
unfounded, groundless allegations
that came from Mr. Wylie,
1475
01:31:37,950 --> 01:31:41,287
who gave the media
the ammunition that they needed...
1476
01:31:41,662 --> 01:31:43,164
that they wanted,
1477
01:31:43,247 --> 01:31:46,417
to be able to attack us for something
that, in the case of Brexit,
1478
01:31:46,501 --> 01:31:47,502
we simply didn't do.
1479
01:31:47,585 --> 01:31:49,504
[O'Hara]
So you are the victim in all of this.
1480
01:31:50,796 --> 01:31:54,717
Well, if you're sitting where I am
right now, you'd probably feel...
1481
01:31:54,800 --> 01:31:56,177
uh... [stammers]
1482
01:31:56,260 --> 01:31:57,470
...quite victimized.
1483
01:31:57,845 --> 01:31:59,514
Where the fuck is my passport?
1484
01:32:00,348 --> 01:32:01,348
[exhales]
1485
01:32:01,766 --> 01:32:03,809
Not having a good day right now.
1486
01:32:04,352 --> 01:32:05,645
Did I put it somewhere else?
1487
01:32:08,731 --> 01:32:09,857
[sighs] Oh, my God.
1488
01:32:10,149 --> 01:32:12,568
I've never put it there before in my life.
1489
01:32:13,110 --> 01:32:15,613
Not that I'm thinking straight today,
so...
1490
01:32:17,615 --> 01:32:18,741
[sighs]
1491
01:32:19,992 --> 01:32:22,662
I'm flustered. Sorry, guys.
1492
01:32:27,416 --> 01:32:29,460
Coco Mademoiselle makes me feel better.
1493
01:32:30,503 --> 01:32:32,171
At least I smell good.
1494
01:32:38,678 --> 01:32:41,639
I have no idea what's gonna happen
in the next coming days.
1495
01:32:43,015 --> 01:32:46,352
I literally came back here
because I wanted to be cooperative,
1496
01:32:47,562 --> 01:32:48,938
I want to help.
1497
01:32:49,438 --> 01:32:51,440
[low, indistinct radio chatter]
1498
01:33:15,047 --> 01:33:17,192
[reporter] Today, The Guardian newspaper
in Britain reports
1499
01:33:17,216 --> 01:33:19,468
that a senior executive
at Cambridge Analytica
1500
01:33:19,552 --> 01:33:22,305
met with Julian Assange from WikiLeaks,
1501
01:33:22,555 --> 01:33:25,933
which is the entity that distributed
the documents that Russia had stolen.
1502
01:33:27,935 --> 01:33:31,022
She says they discussed the US election.
1503
01:33:49,498 --> 01:33:52,585
[Kaiser] The Mueller investigation called
when I booked my flight
1504
01:33:52,668 --> 01:33:55,087
and they decided to issue a subpoena.
1505
01:33:56,380 --> 01:34:00,635
We were talking to them
in a very, like, friendly, cooperative way
1506
01:34:00,718 --> 01:34:05,097
and then Carole's article completely
changed the way that they see me.
1507
01:34:06,557 --> 01:34:09,518
And, yeah, I...
1508
01:34:10,144 --> 01:34:12,438
worked at Cambridge Analytica
1509
01:34:12,521 --> 01:34:15,399
while they had Facebook data sets.
1510
01:34:16,400 --> 01:34:18,110
And, you know, I...
1511
01:34:19,612 --> 01:34:23,074
went to Russia one time
while I worked for Cambridge.
1512
01:34:23,157 --> 01:34:25,743
I visited Julian Assange
while I worked for Cambridge.
1513
01:34:25,951 --> 01:34:27,787
I once donated to WikiLeaks.
1514
01:34:27,870 --> 01:34:32,416
I pitched the Trump campaign
and wrote the first contract.
1515
01:34:33,167 --> 01:34:36,170
Like, all of these things
make it look like I am...
1516
01:34:36,504 --> 01:34:40,049
at the center of some big, crazy thing.
1517
01:34:41,258 --> 01:34:44,178
And I see that,
and I can't argue with that.
1518
01:34:46,055 --> 01:34:49,392
I might need to rethink the way
that I've been doing things
1519
01:34:49,475 --> 01:34:50,810
for the past few years.
1520
01:35:05,032 --> 01:35:08,661
[Cadwalladr] This is a story
which we haven't published yet
1521
01:35:08,744 --> 01:35:11,288
talking about all the investigations
1522
01:35:11,372 --> 01:35:14,333
which have been kicked off
in Britain and the US
1523
01:35:14,417 --> 01:35:16,168
since the story came out.
1524
01:35:16,252 --> 01:35:19,630
So, there's an investigation by the FBI,
1525
01:35:19,714 --> 01:35:22,675
by the US, the SEC,
1526
01:35:22,758 --> 01:35:24,260
by the Department of Justice,
1527
01:35:24,343 --> 01:35:25,928
by Robert Mueller,
1528
01:35:26,011 --> 01:35:28,556
and by the Senate Intelligence Committee,
1529
01:35:28,639 --> 01:35:31,016
the Judiciary Committee,
the House Intelligence Committee.
1530
01:35:31,100 --> 01:35:33,060
And then these are all the ones
which are going on
1531
01:35:33,102 --> 01:35:34,770
which are connected in Britain.
1532
01:35:38,274 --> 01:35:41,277
Parliament spent 18 months investigating.
1533
01:35:42,403 --> 01:35:44,572
They called in all these witnesses.
1534
01:35:48,284 --> 01:35:52,037
And at the end of it,
their report says very clearly,
1535
01:35:52,121 --> 01:35:54,623
"Our electoral laws are not fit
for purpose."
1536
01:35:56,417 --> 01:36:00,421
We literally cannot have
a free and fair election in this country.
1537
01:36:01,881 --> 01:36:04,759
And we can't have it because of Facebook,
1538
01:36:04,925 --> 01:36:08,846
because of the tech giants
who are still completely unaccountable.
1539
01:36:13,058 --> 01:36:15,478
It sounds, like, quite apocalyptic.
1540
01:36:15,644 --> 01:36:19,815
But it does feel like we are entering
into a whole new era.
1541
01:36:20,858 --> 01:36:24,945
We can see that authoritarian governments
are on the rise.
1542
01:36:25,362 --> 01:36:31,243
And they're all using these politics
of hate and fear on Facebook.
1543
01:36:33,370 --> 01:36:34,765
- Look at Brazil.
- [crowd cheering]
1544
01:36:34,789 --> 01:36:38,501
[Cadwalladr]
There's this right-wing extremist
1545
01:36:38,584 --> 01:36:39,919
who's been elected.
1546
01:36:40,002 --> 01:36:44,048
And we know that WhatsApp,
which is a part of Facebook,
1547
01:36:44,131 --> 01:36:49,929
was really clearly implicated
in the dissemination of fake news there.
1548
01:36:51,263 --> 01:36:53,474
And look at what happened in Myanmar.
1549
01:36:54,350 --> 01:36:56,727
There is evidence that Facebook was used
1550
01:36:56,811 --> 01:36:58,604
to incite racial hatred
1551
01:36:58,687 --> 01:37:00,731
which caused a genocide.
1552
01:37:07,488 --> 01:37:13,327
We also know that the Russian government
was using Facebook's tools in the US.
1553
01:37:17,081 --> 01:37:24,046
There's evidence that Russian intelligence
created fake Black Lives Matter memes.
1554
01:37:24,755 --> 01:37:28,509
And when people clicked on them,
they were taken to pages
1555
01:37:28,592 --> 01:37:32,388
where they were actually invited
to protests
1556
01:37:32,471 --> 01:37:35,724
that were organized
by the Russian government.
1557
01:37:35,808 --> 01:37:37,911
- [crowd chants] Justice! Now!
- [man] When do we want it?
1558
01:37:37,935 --> 01:37:40,080
[Cadwalladr] At the same time,
they were setting up pages
1559
01:37:40,104 --> 01:37:44,191
targeting adversary groups,
like Blue Lives Matter.
1560
01:37:45,818 --> 01:37:48,696
It's about stoking fear and hate
1561
01:37:48,779 --> 01:37:51,657
to turn the country against itself.
1562
01:37:52,700 --> 01:37:54,493
Divide and conquer.
1563
01:37:54,910 --> 01:37:57,246
[overlapping shouts]
1564
01:37:57,329 --> 01:37:58,998
White power!
1565
01:37:59,456 --> 01:38:01,333
Fascist and proud!
1566
01:38:01,417 --> 01:38:04,378
[overlapping protests]
1567
01:38:04,461 --> 01:38:07,965
[chanting]
Fuck Donald Trump! Fuck Donald Trump!
1568
01:38:08,883 --> 01:38:12,136
[Cadwalladr] These platforms
which were created to connect us
1569
01:38:12,553 --> 01:38:14,847
have now been weaponized.
1570
01:38:16,765 --> 01:38:20,227
And it's impossible to know what is what
1571
01:38:20,311 --> 01:38:24,315
because it's happening
on exactly the same platforms
1572
01:38:24,398 --> 01:38:27,985
that we chat to our friends
or share baby photos.
1573
01:38:30,404 --> 01:38:32,489
Nothing is what it seems.
1574
01:38:45,127 --> 01:38:47,567
- [Kaiser] Hi, how are you?
- [man] Doing wonderful, yourself?
1575
01:38:47,671 --> 01:38:48,923
I'm all right.
1576
01:38:49,006 --> 01:38:55,012
Um, I stayed here last week
and I checked in a suitcase and two bags.
1577
01:38:55,095 --> 01:38:58,474
And I had to go to the airport and just,
like, left.
1578
01:38:58,557 --> 01:39:00,434
So my bags have been here for a week.
1579
01:39:06,941 --> 01:39:08,984
[reporter] My guest, Carole Cadwalladr,
1580
01:39:09,068 --> 01:39:12,363
writes for the British newspapers
The Observer and The Guardian.
1581
01:39:12,863 --> 01:39:15,282
Can you just say a little bit more
about the Facebook data?
1582
01:39:15,824 --> 01:39:20,871
[Cadwalladr] This thing of the data,
so how Americans were targeted,
1583
01:39:20,955 --> 01:39:22,998
and what they were targeted with,
1584
01:39:23,290 --> 01:39:27,544
is a sort of key part
of Mueller's investigation.
1585
01:39:30,839 --> 01:39:34,718
[Kaiser] I am headed to Washington, DC,
1586
01:39:34,969 --> 01:39:38,430
for my testimony
for the Mueller investigation.
1587
01:39:38,514 --> 01:39:40,516
[indistinct radio chatter]
1588
01:39:41,767 --> 01:39:45,270
[Kaiser] I definitely didn't think
that while we're sitting there
1589
01:39:45,354 --> 01:39:47,898
counting votes on our data screen
1590
01:39:47,982 --> 01:39:50,401
that some of those votes
1591
01:39:50,484 --> 01:39:56,281
were made by people
who had seen fake news stories
1592
01:39:56,365 --> 01:39:59,451
paid for by Russia on their Facebook page.
1593
01:40:01,120 --> 01:40:02,413
Maybe I wanted to believe
1594
01:40:02,496 --> 01:40:05,749
that Cambridge Analytica
was just the best.
1595
01:40:07,376 --> 01:40:09,586
It's a convenient story to believe.
1596
01:40:21,515 --> 01:40:23,517
[indistinct announcement over PA]
1597
01:40:25,060 --> 01:40:28,731
...service down to our nation's capital,
Washington Reagan DC airport.
1598
01:40:35,195 --> 01:40:37,656
[Kaiser] I don't think it's possible
to shed any of this.
1599
01:40:40,075 --> 01:40:42,911
You can't really
put something like this behind you.
1600
01:40:58,510 --> 01:41:01,805
"Youth engagement, persuasion...
1601
01:41:03,140 --> 01:41:04,516
apathy."
1602
01:41:04,600 --> 01:41:05,920
[Nix] Malaysia, we're working in.
1603
01:41:05,976 --> 01:41:10,105
[Kaiser] We did Lithuania, Romania,
Kenya, Ghana.
1604
01:41:10,689 --> 01:41:12,816
[Nix] Oh, and the Brexit campaign, yeah.
1605
01:41:12,900 --> 01:41:14,693
But we don't talk about that.
1606
01:41:14,777 --> 01:41:17,821
- [Kaiser] Oops, we won!
- [laughter on recording]
1607
01:41:18,655 --> 01:41:20,949
Listening to this now,
it just sounds like...
1608
01:41:21,784 --> 01:41:25,913
a criminal admitting to everything
he�s done wrong around the world.
1609
01:41:27,498 --> 01:41:28,540
You know?
1610
01:41:29,291 --> 01:41:32,002
I'm just there,
nervously laughing along with him,
1611
01:41:32,086 --> 01:41:33,170
letting it happen.
1612
01:41:34,630 --> 01:41:35,631
[chuckles]
1613
01:41:41,386 --> 01:41:46,058
As I said, it's the opposite of what
I've worked my whole life to do.
1614
01:41:47,601 --> 01:41:48,727
So...
1615
01:41:51,814 --> 01:41:55,192
it makes me angry at myself that
I could sit through a meeting like that...
1616
01:41:55,943 --> 01:41:58,153
and not quit directly afterwards,
1617
01:41:59,321 --> 01:42:00,572
basically.
1618
01:42:04,243 --> 01:42:05,619
What was I doing?
1619
01:42:06,411 --> 01:42:08,664
[reporter] What investigators
have you been talking to?
1620
01:42:09,623 --> 01:42:13,710
I'm currently working
to be as helpful as possible
1621
01:42:13,794 --> 01:42:17,422
to any government investigations
where I can provide assistance,
1622
01:42:17,506 --> 01:42:20,092
but I can't comment on that right now
while they're ongoing.
1623
01:42:28,725 --> 01:42:31,270
[woman over PA] At this time,
you may use your cellular service.
1624
01:42:31,353 --> 01:42:35,023
However, larger electronic devices
must remain stowed.
1625
01:42:35,232 --> 01:42:37,109
[Hilder] Brittany made mistakes.
1626
01:42:38,819 --> 01:42:41,155
But I think it was very brave of her
1627
01:42:41,238 --> 01:42:44,199
to come out and then to keep cooperating
1628
01:42:44,283 --> 01:42:45,826
and not to walk away.
1629
01:42:48,620 --> 01:42:51,665
She is one of two people
1630
01:42:51,748 --> 01:42:56,378
who has blown the whistle
in any serious way on Cambridge Analytica.
1631
01:43:00,465 --> 01:43:01,967
We're all responsible.
1632
01:43:04,928 --> 01:43:07,806
So the question is,
what do we do with that responsibility?
1633
01:43:08,348 --> 01:43:09,683
Can we embrace it?
1634
01:43:12,394 --> 01:43:14,521
[Kaiser] Happy that it's finally happening
1635
01:43:14,605 --> 01:43:18,275
so that I can just tell people
what happened and get everything...
1636
01:43:19,943 --> 01:43:20,944
on record
1637
01:43:22,154 --> 01:43:25,199
for this government, my government.
[chuckles]
1638
01:43:47,095 --> 01:43:49,181
[reporter] You remember, though,
Cambridge Analytica.
1639
01:43:49,431 --> 01:43:51,391
Its big claim in 2016
1640
01:43:51,475 --> 01:43:53,477
was that it had access to voter data
1641
01:43:53,685 --> 01:43:56,688
on all of the people voting
in the US election.
1642
01:43:58,273 --> 01:44:02,402
Well, just one of the 157 million people
who voted in that election,
1643
01:44:02,486 --> 01:44:06,365
a man called David Carroll,
asked them a very simple question:
1644
01:44:06,990 --> 01:44:09,826
"Can I see the data you have on me?"
1645
01:44:10,661 --> 01:44:12,621
And they refused to give it to him.
1646
01:44:14,248 --> 01:44:18,335
But crucially, today,
Cambridge Analytica pled guilty
1647
01:44:18,418 --> 01:44:22,422
at Hendon Magistrates' Court
for failing to comply with the ICO notice.
1648
01:44:40,482 --> 01:44:43,277
[Carroll] The Cambridge Analytica case
is behind me now.
1649
01:44:43,860 --> 01:44:46,738
They pleaded guilty
for not giving me my data,
1650
01:44:47,739 --> 01:44:50,242
and I'll probably never get it back.
1651
01:44:53,120 --> 01:44:55,330
By the time my daughter is 18,
1652
01:44:55,414 --> 01:44:58,750
she'll have 70,000 data points
defining her,
1653
01:44:58,917 --> 01:45:01,295
and currently she has no rights,
1654
01:45:01,628 --> 01:45:03,839
no control over that at all.
1655
01:45:06,216 --> 01:45:07,551
But the battle continues.
1656
01:45:08,176 --> 01:45:10,887
[applause]
1657
01:45:13,432 --> 01:45:15,100
I don't have to tell you
1658
01:45:15,183 --> 01:45:17,102
that there is this dark undertow
1659
01:45:17,185 --> 01:45:19,563
which is connecting us all globally.
1660
01:45:19,646 --> 01:45:23,567
And it is flowing
via the technology platforms.
1661
01:45:24,026 --> 01:45:26,236
And that is why I am here
1662
01:45:26,320 --> 01:45:31,450
to address you directly,
the Gods of Silicon Valley.
1663
01:45:31,533 --> 01:45:33,535
[audience cheers and applauds]
1664
01:45:35,245 --> 01:45:36,997
Mark Zuckerberg,
1665
01:45:38,206 --> 01:45:40,000
and Sheryl Sandberg,
1666
01:45:40,083 --> 01:45:43,170
and Larry Page, and Sergey Brin,
1667
01:45:43,253 --> 01:45:44,671
and Jack Dorsey.
1668
01:45:46,381 --> 01:45:49,301
Because you set out to connect people
1669
01:45:49,801 --> 01:45:51,803
and you are refusing to acknowledge
1670
01:45:51,887 --> 01:45:55,682
that this same technology
is now driving us apart.
1671
01:45:56,767 --> 01:45:59,478
And what you don't seem to understand
1672
01:45:59,561 --> 01:46:03,357
is that this is bigger than you,
and it's bigger than any of us.
1673
01:46:03,440 --> 01:46:08,779
And it is not about left or right,
or leave or remain, or Trump or not.
1674
01:46:09,363 --> 01:46:11,281
It's about whether it's actually possible
1675
01:46:11,365 --> 01:46:13,742
to have a free and fair election
ever again.
1676
01:46:14,368 --> 01:46:18,038
And so my question to you is:
Is this what you want?
1677
01:46:19,247 --> 01:46:22,209
Is this how you want history
to remember you?
1678
01:46:23,293 --> 01:46:26,922
As the handmaidens to authoritarianism?
1679
01:46:27,464 --> 01:46:31,510
And my question to everybody else is,
is this what we want?
1680
01:46:31,968 --> 01:46:36,181
To sit back and play with our phones
as this darkness falls?
1681
01:46:41,770 --> 01:46:44,272
Who is logged into Facebook right now?
1682
01:46:46,274 --> 01:46:47,359
Almost everybody.
1683
01:46:49,069 --> 01:46:50,779
So, as individuals,
1684
01:46:50,862 --> 01:46:55,534
we can limit the flood of data
that we're leaking all over the place.
1685
01:46:55,617 --> 01:46:59,496
But there's no silver bullet.
There's no way to go off the grid.
1686
01:46:59,579 --> 01:47:02,207
So, you have to understand
1687
01:47:02,874 --> 01:47:05,877
how your data is affecting your life.
1688
01:47:07,087 --> 01:47:10,841
Our dignity as humans is at stake.
1689
01:47:11,091 --> 01:47:13,844
[overlapping shouts of protest]
1690
01:47:20,434 --> 01:47:22,314
[Carroll]
But the hardest part in all of this...
1691
01:47:22,394 --> 01:47:25,355
[Trump] Got a lot of rough people
in those caravans. They are not a...
1692
01:47:25,439 --> 01:47:27,899
[Carroll]
...is that these wreckage sites...
1693
01:47:27,983 --> 01:47:31,069
- [people screaming]
- ...and crippling divisions...
1694
01:47:33,989 --> 01:47:37,742
begin with the manipulation
of one individual.
1695
01:47:39,369 --> 01:47:40,537
Then another.
1696
01:47:42,164 --> 01:47:43,248
And another.
1697
01:47:47,794 --> 01:47:50,213
So, I can't help but ask myself:
1698
01:47:52,132 --> 01:47:53,758
Can I be manipulated?
1699
01:47:57,387 --> 01:47:58,388
Can you?
1700
01:47:59,305 --> 01:48:05,340
Support us and become VIP member
to remove all ads from OpenSubtitles.org
145992
Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.