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hello you cultured gentlemen ladies i

don't care what gender you are you're

all cultured welcome to the trash table

every gender every gender we're from

every journey as long as you're cultured

we welcome every that is our gender

there are three genders

i'm joey and i'm with the boys as usual

and we have a special guest introduce

yourself hello my name is uh shindo el

and i

do a manga

what kind of manga what kind of manga

yeah there we go

there we go

is that how you introduce yourself uh to

you know

some fellows of the public who might not

be so familiar with your work i used to

i just used to say ero mangaka and then

people started saying you don't have to

say the arrow part

manga called smile that's fine

what do you say when they ask oh what

kind of series do you draw oh i i

haven't heard of you uh

oh then i go yeah

okay okay

they normally just stop there they're

like i kind of get it i'm not going to

push too much on this some people do

some people yeah

yeah yeah it's like the same it's like

you know like porn directors who are

just like i'm a porn director you could

have just said i mean

yeah you could have just sent you in

movies that's fine

yeah i think uh it's fair to say i know

the least

about you and your work i think these

two know the most yeah but i'm sure

there are many viewers who also are in

the same position as me where they saw

your name in the title and they're like

i don't really know what it is that you

do so is there some series that maybe

the viewers might know and if not i

guess you'll they'll get an insight into

uh the life of an aero mangaker today

well when you when i got invited to uh

talk on trash taste i did some homework

oh and i saw the episode where you guys

read my uh engine yeah yes and i know

kano doesn't

think too highly of it

this man got caught in 4k

i didn't know we'd be reviewing stuff

that the authors and makers would come

in

[Laughter]

i have no words okay i guess we'll jump

right into it okay you created

metamorphosis right very very popular in

the communities

definitely the most infamous united

states one of the most infamous dogen of

all time i would say especially in the

western community

i've said something about it that i do

actually i do regret saying really now

you're wonderful

so too faced

my opinions on it haven't changed

there's one thing that i think i did

just get massively wrong

i i in the episode i think i said

something along the lines of like um it

seemed unrealistic that the mum would

blame the daughter for the dad oh yeah

right

i think and then i found out it's

totally not unrealistic and that it's

happened a bunch and that i lost a lot

of faith in humanity when i thought yeah

yeah i thought i [ __ ]

who would have thought i feel like this

is just my child innocent afraid i'm

like no a mother would never blame them

yeah so okay

so so i guess we should

this is this is like a trash taste first

never before has a guest come on and

said heard you were talking [ __ ]

get the bell out

she will just smack the [ __ ] out of me

i guess there's a lot of things

so yeah should we explain i guess what

we're going to demonetize immediately

now uh what metamorphosis is

kind of very lightly and we'll talk in

depth more a little later

so like so how would you yeah if someone

asks you like oh you know i've heard

this metamorphosis thing henshin thing

like but i've never read it could you

like sell it to me like what what is it

about

god it's like

that cream for dream but like manga

that's probably that's probably the best

way to explain it that is honestly how i

would explain it as well yeah i believe

i said something very similar on like

the podcast episode where we described

it where i was like yeah it kind of

reminds me of red queen for a dream

where

it's just really depressing but also

there's a lot of sex in it yeah it's

like right

it's wrinkly for a dream but it was only

that scene

that's probably the best way to explain

it honestly i literally the last time i

read it was that episodes i'm trying to

remember what happens it's like a high

school girl meets a guy on the street

and then they hook up and have sex in a

yeah and like in a karaoke

yeah yeah i feel like why am i trying to

explain

and it just keeps escalating and

escalating yeah yeah yeah so like

very adult by the way okay i guess i

guess we're jumping right into it yeah

okay like how did you come up with that

i just got i just got asked what what

like what were your inspirations in

writing that it's a trope right like the

first of all it's the makeover trope

yeah the girl takes off the glasses and

she's hot right yeah yeah

and then there's the uh the garuka like

turning into a yeah

yeah

and that's like i've never done that

before so i'm like let's try it out

and it worked out pretty well that's how

it turned out yeah

damn did you know how like the story was

going to develop before you started

working on it or was it just something

because it's it's like pretty it's a

pretty long story in terms of like a lot

of

a lot of aero manga compared to you know

some one shorts or you know one or two

chapters but this one was typical volume

yeah as a full volume like did you have

everything planned out from the get-go

or did it kind of develop

everything planned out but i

think i said in the afterward that i had

the ending out

before i started right

i think i just

and i was talking to my editors about it

and they asked you know so how does it

end i'm like well i just want her to die

at the end and they're like oh

yeah i feel i feel like her

unfortunately dying was like one of the

high points because

like her suffering had ended by that

yeah

right and that's like did you did you

always know you wanted it to be that

depressing or like i mean like i wanted

i wanted it to be more depressing but my

editor was like you want to speak you

have to put like a little bit of levity

in it i'm like

wait hold on what what what did you have

to cut that would have made it more

depressing like

well i couldn't put as many like drug

scenes as i wanted to right right

because like in the magazine because it

gets published in an uh monthly magazine

right right right

and in the magazine they had to cover up

all the uh drug bits oh so like a

syringe had to be like had a like a blue

on it oh okay

i had the whole like you know like

cooking up the

cooking up the drugs yeah yeah and

they're like you can't do that

oh damn because like the cops are

already kind of

tough on manga yeah yeah yeah yeah and

they don't want like

you know more pressure right

all right because it's it was certainly

rare to see

like drug use in just like even error

mango like manga in general and it was

such a heavy theme which i think is like

super super rare to see you know in in

any kind of media that comes out from

japan right i think insane and manga you

see some drug use

or something yeah

but in hentai it's mostly like

i don't know what it is it's right now

it's like uh it's like aphrodisiac

aphrodisiac

um hypnosis apps and stuff yeah

do you have a smartphone yeah

again i didn't know anything uh about

you the the only work i'd read was it

was metamorphosis and i i guess i didn't

know when they were like oh shinuel's

coming on i'm like oh does shouldn't

well speak english

i didn't even know right i didn't know

anything dude i guess when you made

metamorphosis do you find that your

experience is from like uh because you

were raised in the u.s right yeah does

that have a lot of effect on how you

write manga or is it still very like

japanese i don't know i think

because i i've been told that it's not

japanese it's right like my storytelling

but like

i tried to make it japanese yeah yeah

and um i don't know if my

experiences in new york really helped me

yeah

like i'm sure you've seen a lot of

[ __ ] up stuff

i've seen a lot of [ __ ] up [ __ ] but

like

you know i try not to like

directly put that into my storytelling

yeah yeah it would kind of be like

alien to most japanese readers i'm just

projecting all the florida man stuff

i've seen

a florida thing right that's got to be

in one of them i mean i'm sure that's

also the case considering that i think

like for a lot of japanese people new

york is kind of like seen in this like

glory light type of like you know like

new york wow you know like

like gritsy new york or like 80s new

york where it's like yeah like you know

everyone gives a [ __ ] yeah yeah exactly

oh my god just metamorphosis man

did you expect it to be as like big i

didn't expect it to be like so memey

yeah yeah i i knew of the image of her

whereas the glasses yeah yeah as an

anime fan there's some images that are

like almost iconic yeah yeah and one of

them is the girl with the glasses yeah

yeah oh if you know you know yeah yeah

yeah

yeah oh my god yeah did you like when

you released it was it something that

immediately got like picked up by the

community or was it something that you

know you released and you know you had

the usual reaction and then over time it

just blew up in popularity and it was an

overtime thing because like when it was

in the magazines it was because the

editors didn't want to put it up front

because it's kind of like shady yeah

yeah yeah yeah so it was always at the

back

damn

trying to push it under the rock yeah

it was kind of low-key for a while until

like like people um i think online just

picked it up

yeah and started memeing on it yeah

because i remember when i when i

interviewed you like three or four years

ago uh i asked like if you know like the

memes and you were like oh yeah i'm very

upset

because it's just like i don't know like

do you write do you think like the memes

like kind of

i don't know take away from like the

the message that you were like trying to

portray in metamorphosis or do you think

just like kind of just like no i enjoy

the memes it's whatever that means is

fine i don't really

like i don't think about

putting out a message when i make a

story right right you know just like you

want to talk about all that yeah i mean

like

i just wanted to make it entertaining

first and foremost yeah

but i think a lot of i felt entertained

or something yeah well you know

yeah

but i think i think though like you know

regardless i think like a lot of people

read metamorphosis and was like

there's some there's some hidden message

here there's like some kind of like

deeper meaning like to this like story

because it's just so different to the

standard dozens you would read right

like yeah you know the normal dosing is

just like boy meets girl boy fox girl

yeah that's kind of it you know i mean i

would say like out of every you know um

error edition i've seen or era manga

like i was probably like the most

invested in any like story as i was in i

wasn't as invested in any other story as

it was in metamorphosis in terms of just

seeing the characters develop in

in the development that you gave them

and just you know

every like a lot of things outside of

just

the hentai scenes and the sex scenes and

everything

i was probably invested in in the

characters and the ending and that also

also made me even more invested in the

aero scenes as well i thought that was

like fantastic you know i don't know how

much of it was planned on your ends but

it was it was absolutely incredible well

as long as there's like a seal of a

story in there i think people pick up on

it yeah yeah yeah yeah cause like you

know a lot of hentai i think especially

since maybe

early 2000s

they've been streamlining it to make it

more like like i don't know fappable

yeah you know like like they just jump

straight into the [ __ ] and i'm just

like come on come on guys like there are

some dozens i've read where i'm like i

feel like i've skipped like five pages

yeah yeah because this is no build up

yeah when i when i open a dozen it's

like page two or like even

page one come on guys yeah page one and

they're already [ __ ] like whoa whoa

chill out

goddamn like i'll take that over the

hentai that start with like three

minutes of text explaining that

who thought that was a good idea no like

some people are super into that right

it's like

yeah they are like what this it's just

like it's like star wars text on this

yeah some movies just start out with

commanders yeah yeah it's happening

it's the same people who enjoy you know

the interview sections at the start of

porn right like

they want to like get into the story

beforehand it's like i want to feel

invested in this yeah i i have noticed

another trend that's i've seen a lot of

um error manga recently or just not even

recently it's just like it's like you

know like where they say the most

important part of a youtube uh video is

the first 14 seconds yeah so like

there's some error manga that start off

with just like the [ __ ] for like the

first three pages and then it goes to

the story like you gotta hook the

viewers yeah it's like it's always like

page one they're [ __ ] and then it's

like this is how it happened

there's like an omega algorithm yeah

i'm

very interested to know how to so you

lived in new york right right how do you

then go from living in new york to being

like i'm going to start drawing arrow

manga in japan like how does that how is

that the transition that happens well

i've always been drawing right right so

like

and you know when you're a kid you want

like i want to go up and i just want to

draw right yeah

and after college i'm like okay how do i

do that

right right i'm like i could i could

start in the u.s but then you know

there's the comics industry and it's

kind of like it's it's

kind of uh

what i'm like but it's it's never you

know what i'm saying yeah

you have to do this sort of work yeah

right and if you want to like vent off

it's like really minor it's like super

underground yeah yeah yeah like you know

just like a very porn section but it's

like

that's how you make money right

exactly you want to be friends they're

loaded dude sprouts deviantal

japan is like this huge and like back

then like

uh mid 2000s

there was hardly any download like manga

yeah

there's like dl site maybe and that's

about it

so i'm like

it's like that's a little boy to

just upload stuff and like you know

solid like [ __ ] yeah

yeah yeah it's great i mean i guess it

was like the closest to having like an

independent scene where you could just

easily upload and just you know kind of

get your work out there instead of like

having to go through like so many

publishers and getting picked up and

stuff like that

and i guess like a good way to like grow

organically as well right because like

those kinds of works are just spread by

word of mouth yeah so you're always able

to speak japanese is it oh i had to work

on it i'm not okay okay i spoke it yeah

but i couldn't like really write too

well

you know and if you ever saw those like

i don't know if you read like a bad

translation you know i'm talking about

yeah yeah you know it's like bad

translation

i have to so i you know spent a lot of

time like just playing uh video games

and like reading novels and stuff

research just research

you helped me out you know yeah so you

were doing it

have you always been self-published or

did you come to japan self-published

teams in japan self-published and then

like a publisher like picked up on it

mm-hmm okay it's like hey you want to go

on a magazine sure why not yeah

awesome so like

why did you choose to be like on the

aero side of things then well i've

always been interested in the ill side

like how did you get into the era yeah

yeah yeah cause i feel like every like

error manga artist always like kind of

the the beginnings are always different

oh yeah right

well my beginnings were like i think my

first

um

dojin was a

planet of the apes

[Music]

dr zaius

i want to read that now oh my god

wait wait is that like how did that idea

come about you were just like watching

planet of the ace one day and you're

like i want to see i can make this

harder

i remember seeing a porno

that was like a plan with the apes

like back when i was like uh like a

teenager right i'm like it just stuck in

my head

yeah bad

i was like what the [ __ ] was that and

like it's still it was like just eating

away at me and it's like i have to draw

this and like i just put that out oh my

god planet of the gates

that's probably what it was called

an accuracy did it do well did people

like i did not do well

i mean i'm surprised there's an audience

if you ask me handful i think would buy

one of these 70 more people than i

thought it was gonna be

jesus christ i printed like a thousand

copies

like jesus i was gonna like print a

hundred

but then it's like if you're gonna print

a hundred it only costs like so much

more to print a thousand yeah

so what happened to these copies where

are they um

i started like they stuck with me for a

while like every time i go to a comic

con i just like put a little bit out

oh okay okay so after like you know 10

12 years like i finally got rid of all

my

background

that sounds incredible it's like it's

like a bonus item man again now so how

old were you when you drew this planet

of the apes oh my god like 20 something

no

no

she's such a bizarre

that's the most bizarre origin story

i've ever heard

the planet

that sounds like a meme

tell me how you got it

tell me how you got into hentai well

planet of the year so there's this movie

called planet of the apes right

so after planet of the april what came

next yeah i mean after that it's pretty

standard um

there's a dragon quest

yep okay oh yeah yeah i've seen that one

it's favorite very popular yeah

and that's when my uh my first editor

came to me and like hey this is pretty

nice right

yeah like i gotta ask like as um as an

error artist how do you choose which you

know aside from your original work how

do you decide to choose which works to

draw

porn about i guess like

did you do you go with like the

algorithm to be like okay there's like a

bunch of this is like this is hot right

now hot commodity right now or do you

just go with whatever you're a fan of i

think

my uh

primary motivation

is like

drawing stuff that i want to read yeah

yeah

isn't available

oh no okay okay like if someone drew it

i wouldn't draw at all yeah yeah yeah

it's literally the [ __ ] i'll do it

myself

that's awesome you found like the 70

people that wanted a plan yeah yeah yeah

and yeah with the dragon quest like you

know there wasn't anything that i found

like satisfying enough yeah yeah i'm

like do it myself

like how do you

how i guess how do you develop the

skills to draw h manga and error manga

specifically because did you have to do

a lot of practice or a lot of research a

lot of research

research wink like did you go to like

art school and stuff like that i did uh

major in art in um college okay right so

does that but it doesn't really help

right right i mean like i you know you

learn anatomy and like how to how to

paint how of like i mean i'd argue

anatomy is quite important in aero manga

but you know

you don't really need it

yeah but i'm like you know you know what

i'm saying is like you don't really see

arrow manga in the style of like bucky

yeah you know it's like

it's usually like usually more more so

than anything you know like you read the

kama sutra and you're like okay i think

i kind of figured out like basic anatomy

and like basic like you know uh

positions and stuff like that the beagle

is more important than anatomy

damn that's wise lawyers are there put

that i want to put that put that on a

t-shirt put that on

because you know you see some artists

and you know

hips don't go that wide or like you know

boobs don't go that big that's true

that's true but it doesn't matter

because you know that's what he's into

yeah yeah yeah like how how much do you

like to stay i guess

true to

what am i trying to say here like a

human physique are you true to the human

physique oh like i have my own

preferences but like i try to you know

expand them whenever i can yeah i'd say

your style is definitely more rooted in

reality than a lot of artists i've seen

yeah

yeah i mean you know there's a

it's a wide variety yeah like there is a

very wide range about how

artists see the human anatomy especially

in dogen

oh my god

like some artists i'm just like have you

ever seen a human in your life

like that is not that is not what humans

look like

that's what they want that's what they

want though

that's what they want man that's what

they want oh my god yeah i think the you

know obviously that metamorphosis uh you

know is one of your biggest uh series

but like uh you've had like a couple of

other like long form yeah ones as well

right like um tsf i think

yeah tsf one of atari is a big one um

there's also the dragon ball one over

out of yours oh you've had the broly one

yeah

yeah

the personality's there but the fur is

gone

[Laughter]

yeah it's really wholesome it's just

like broly being like oh there's this

thing called sex

and i need some help with it because he

sucks literally a 40 year old virgin

right yeah yeah exactly he's literally

like the 40 year old version of dragon

ball universe

he [ __ ] everyone yeah

because like in the in the dojin he like

discovers what a boner is for the first

time and he's like what is this i don't

know what this is i'm scared

what do i do it hurts what gives him a

boner initially i think it was uh the

chili she remembered

the green skin girl yeah i think

she was masturbating and like

they were like

what is she doing

something's happening

oh my god

he literally had he literally had that

reaction of like when you discover porn

for the first time it's like oh what

what's going on what's going on what the

hell yeah

yeah what is this in my pants yeah oh my

god so excited yeah i got asked how do

you what's your creative process around

coming up with like the different

concepts of you know your different

works and everything like that do you

have one or is it just whatever

sometimes sometimes an idea just comes

and you just start drawing

well sometimes i

you know

see a work of art and i'm like like a

movie or a novel or something that i'm

reading and i'm like

if there are only more sex scenes

[Laughter]

the best thing i've ever heard yeah i

guess that's how like metamorphosis

happened right like you're probably

watching like recording for a dream

something similar you were like this is

way too enjoyable

i need more more of this please

[Laughter]

no one wants to see getting

see your arm getting chopped off and now

his mother you know going insane we want

the ass to ask the ass more else the

hearts

which now that you know that i think

about it is basically just was the

storyline of the main heroine right yeah

holy [ __ ] i'm just like

i've just connected that together how

many pages was metamorphosis again like

250 something i think right it's quite

long right yeah how long would something

like that

take because i mean like it's obviously

reading it it's like i can do this kind

of fast i do like um pretty long

chapters like 40 50 page chapters so

like i mean that was released monthly

right yeah yeah yeah so how many months

was that like a year maybe like six

months of uh storyline damn wow which is

crazy and like i don't i didn't do every

month i did like one every other month

oh yeah right right because each each uh

chapter takes maybe like a few hundred

hours of work geez right damn hello lads

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episode onto the show so like what

what's what's like a day in the life of

you know an error

it depends how much work you have right

you're doing a like a civilized manga

then you wake up you draw you go to

sleep right

and you do that for like maybe like a

month

oh wow do you have like assistance and

stuff like that um when i did um

metamorphosis i had two assistants oh

like most of the tone work right right

right yeah is your office at your home

or do you have like a dedicated office

where are you going i would draw it was

at my home so my living room was like

like desks like

yeah and you had to make room for two

other assistants on top of that oh wow

they're just like on the floor

it's like just cutting tones out

that's just like my image of like you

know these kinds of like small like

manga studios and stuff like that like

the assistants are on the floor you've

seen them before yeah yeah you know

exactly exactly how often do you like

get to work on serialized work because i

imagine you just said it takes a lot of

work so like whenever i want to whenever

you want to yeah you know after my first

um

like volume a volume yeah

[Music]

yeah first uh

book whatever book yeah yeah after my

first book came out you know and it

sells pretty well then people start

giving you like asking you to do work so

and after you you know

gain a little bit of notion then you

know you don't really

have any trouble finding work yeah as

long as you want to work you can oh okay

so that i've been looking in that sense

so you just go on your own schedule

awesome i'm sure you got quite a bit of

notoriety as well like after

metamorphosis all right actually like i

think my first two

like gave me like the most

yeah um yeah

was it name value oh is that including

the plan of the apes no no my first two

like um oh books books oh okay i was

about to say i was like

and uh

you're right right right like my first

two like um published books

i've always been curious because

obviously metamorphosis has been very

like memed up in the western um anime

community

what's like what's the japanese side of

things like how's how's your japanese

audience reacted to your work and

i think

japanese audience finds my work kind of

like

weird

like my stuff is uh a bit different than

like the main

mainstream like yeah yeah it definitely

is yeah in in a good way i i mean yes

it's more story driven i think yeah yeah

definitely so like you know

people and but i just keep trying to put

like a lot of like penta in there too

yeah you know make it work

so i mean like

i think my

in the japanese market my most

best seller is still my first one right

well that's because it's been out long

yeah yeah

so the reaction from the western

japanese audience of metamorphosis was

like really different yeah it's not in

day basically

okay that's interesting how did you how

do you balance like the amount of story

you put in a work versus the amount of

sex scene you put in

yeah um was i supposed to factor

metamorphosis

like genuine question

because i was reading it and i'm like i

don't

when would i

maybe like the first three chapters yes

i felt like

the karaoke scene probably was like the

best optimal point yeah

that one but that one was very confusing

i was like i'm like this is more story

or more

porn i couldn't really was it just like

or do you not see it as that it's just

like it is a story that has porn in it

you can do what you want i think that's

the most optimal way of having a story

with sex in it because like some if you

have a hentai and it's like the story

there's a story part for the first five

pages and then like this next 20 pages

i don't know why i don't know why google

thought we said google but

so like if there's like a story part for

five pages and like 20 pages of sex

then you could skip

the story part can't you

just read the story and read the section

you'll be like

and you're done yeah yeah yeah right

right so is it more that you

you can't

in japan you can't draw stories that

have a lot of sex in them without it

being labeled as like an arrow manga

like are you would you say you're trying

to draw more stories than trying to draw

something to fap too in a way um i think

it's

it's a little bit of both but i think

it's

sexier if there's a

story right sorry i agree with that yeah

okay okay so so like your biggest

challenge is not putting story

in uh in your work but it's

incorporating it in a way that sex

should be an integral part of the story

i think okay thank you thank you

someone someone who gets it thank you

that's why you're the legend

so it's the goat yeah

because like you reach some hentai manga

and you you there is a very like clear

distinction between here's the story

part and here's the second part yeah

metamorphosis didn't feel like a like a

porn thing for me yeah it felt like a

really dark story and very adult yeah um

i think that's why it drew so many

people in though right because like

they're probably going into it expecting

it to be like five pages of story 20

pages 16 and then you're like hold on a

second but yeah i'm just wondering now

because it made me think like oh does

japan have like a if it has x amount of

sex in it would they just automatically

put it in the oh it's porn even if the

story is very fleshed out and very i

think there's no like

there's no like clear-cut line between

like porn and like a story with sex in

it because you see a lot of singing

manga with a decent amount of sex in it

yeah yeah true i think it depends on

like just how much you're showing right

probably i guess so yeah there's like a

lot of like sane in manga and like sex

scenes and stuff like that it's usually

like you know you only see like the top

half or you know like it's like moaning

faces yeah or just like a moaning

yeah it's like oh it's like completely

whited out or whatever whereas like you

know a lot of doujins yeah it's white it

out but it's like very minimally whited

out yeah you know do you have like a

unconscious page count that you need to

reach in terms of like i need to show

sex for this amount of patience because

i do notice that with a lot of manga

where it just feels like okay okay you

have a typical manga it's like 20 odd

pages that's like five pages of story

and dialogue maybe and then 15 pages of

session i think if you have an editor

they try to give you like a set limit

yeah like don't like chill my dick can

only get so hard

so like you know if you're making if

you're making a 30 page manga yeah your

editor would say at least 20 pages

should be sex what wow

so if you're working under those

restrictions

it's hard to make a good story yeah yeah

yeah because you only have 10 pages of

story yeah you have 10 pages of story

that's why if you put like if you um

incorporate the story into the sex then

you have you know all those pages to

work with yeah yeah and i feel like that

just made makes the work

better in general if if you find a way

to incorporate it somehow but like i

guess

like

i guess it's hard because one so few

other

mangakas do it um

and two i i guess you really need to

think about what kind of scenarios

really work in terms of just here is a

scenario that is just not you know a

baseline scenario of just like oh sorry

big brother i got like stuck in like a

washing machine or something you know

what is that how does that work

are there any tropes that you really

hate seeing

oh i mean like

i don't hate anything really yeah it's

really execution yeah okay

so it's not so much the device more yeah

it's used

that makes sense

would are like some of your least

favorite tropes you've seen in hentai

manga than or in in in your field oh

well they may be like a trope you

wouldn't never personally use yeah oh

i don't know like

walking into like a girl bathing

sleeping and then like oh

catching yourself by the boobies

so basically every scene into lover

the entirety of twelve that goes beyond

just like hentai manga that's just like

yeah

in general right yeah

it does get old very fast but it's a

classic though it's a classic but it's

like there are i feel there are

especially some like uh you know h manga

that it's just like

every chance they can get it's like so

we have this new girl character yeah how

do we introduce her to the audience

they better be stinky because they're

going in the bath right now

yeah

how much research you have to do for

when you work on something you just have

to say research because it is a research

man

it's it's the only guy i could talk to

and ask if it's actually research

because it is research yeah like the

more you do the better because like

there

there's so much work out there that

there's always some kind of new way of

showing like a scene like a new angle or

a

a new device of like you know showing uh

whatever yeah yeah yeah that you know

you could always incorporate into your

work so like you know you should always

read other people's stuff um i mean yeah

porn makes like marvel's output look

like nothing yeah there's so much out

there it seems it's insane especially

every time yeah why are there so many

transformer ones

i don't know

transformer which i don't know i have

noticed that actually

every time i've gone to the stores

there's like 15 optimus prime getting

boned people yeah i find transformers

sexy i don't know i mean

bumblebee does pee on something yeah

i guess that's maybe fuel

yeah i've noticed transfo there's a lot

of transformers and sailor moon like

sailor moon makes sense

sailor moon makes more sense yeah but

you find people doing sailor moon these

days though i don't know i still find a

lot of like i don't know if they knew

necessarily the most popular ones now

like ones to make doughnuts well there's

always the you know people who do the

newest thing

yeah uh

fate is always popular

um one that's any of the idols idol idol

master yeah one that's big right now is

like blue archive stuff oh yeah that one

there's a lot of that can you explain to

me

how the dojin like rules or laws work in

japan because okay everyone knows that

japanese copyright laws are like

non-existent they don't

you literally you know there's no fair

use or anything like that but it seems

to be like doujins have been like all

right we'll let you we'll let you slide

like what's there's an honor code

basically okay okay where if the um

original copyright holder says no

doujins you shouldn't do any indulgence

okay i don't say anything it's [ __ ] if

they don't say anything it's fair game

okay oh wow so they kind of just like

turn the blind eye or something or yeah

basically i mean like

um

recently you know there's been um

yeah yeah yeah and they said no doujins

people really don't do it oh wow okay

almost feels like you're a waste not too

though yeah you think that's like the

one series as well yeah like that's like

waifu's galore right for a lot of the

fans so you'd think there'd be like a

massive market well you know it's based

on like real life voices oh yeah you

know it's kind of like you know you

don't want it i guess like weird

politics coming like that right

my baby i don't want to see my baby kind

of like yeah

better stick to apes right yeah

horses overrated

absolute attack that's the real [ __ ]

right there

i can't get over that i really want to

read that

yeah so like how much of your work goes

into preparing for basically comiket

because like like and how much is it

just in general trying to appeal to like

you know just the mass audience and you

know putting your work online nowadays

well

back when you know there was comiket

um

you know twice a year

that's like the main bread and butter of

like your doujin work right

so you know two of these and then

that was pretty much like a few years

ago moderately successful dojin artist

then come here twice a year you could

live off of it right damn okay wow you

know

so people usually do that and then like

other dodging events on the side or

like magazine work on the side yeah

how hard is it to get like a booth or a

table a comic yeah like what's the

process of that comic by the way it's

like japanese comic-con it's massive

comic market very complicated

very huge it's like what like 300 400

000 people or something that's insane

it's the biggest convention right by far

it's i think it's one of the biggest

conventions in the world yeah

and it's all the ocean yeah it's it's

all dogs

it's old ocean yeah it's it's not like

it's not all like hentai it's like every

kind of

okay because dojin just means like you

know self-publishing self-published

stuff yeah yeah so like a lot of like i

learned that from trash takes as well

yeah cause so there's like there's like

entire sections of comic-con where it's

just like the non-errors yeah it's like

just like novels or like

music or whatever

that that can attract that many people

yeah yeah i feel like there's a

convention like that in the us or the uk

i don't think it would be nearly as big

well because like it's anime is just a

lot less accessible over there you know

like you know if they want the same kind

of anime convention experience here in

japan you just go to akihabara yeah

right it's it's a lot so i can

understand why

there is this market for this here um

but

it seems like you know like like you

said a lot of livelihoods depend on

the two main comikets right um so like

how hard is it to get a booth there or

to like to be a part of that event like

if you're

established then you get a cup i think

you get priority seating right now if

you've been to comic-con before and

you've been consistently like putting

stuff out yeah they'll look favorably on

you and give you a space mutually mm-hmm

but if you're new then it's it's like a

nice throw basically sometimes you have

to know someone or no i mean

it really is pretty random oh okay wow

yeah it's gotcha it's got like

it's like ticketed events in japan just

lottery right yeah yeah so it's like

it's completely luck which sucks because

it's like well i was here first can i

have a ticket please yeah you'd think

it's like first come first serve right

but yeah yeah because how did you get

your first booth in comic yet i just

applied you just supplied yeah

and then he rolled

and he wrote the ssr or the ssr

so if you're like not established at all

and you go to communicate right how are

you getting people to come stop by the

booth or check it out

people walk by and you're like hey take

a look at my stuff and then that's how

you have to do it but there's i think

there's also like a lot of comic goers

who are just there to purely consume all

the new [ __ ] yeah and they're kind of

like there to like as like scouts almost

to be like you know how many tables are

we talking how many sellers have no idea

thousands

oh my god yes it feels like if you're if

you haven't made a name for yourself how

on earth would you stand out if there's

thousands of people i mean if you're

seeing like a picture of comiket it's

like you get

it's like a sea of like you know yeah

you get drowned out easily so it's just

like you have to you know hope someone

walks by and you know takes a look at

your stuff it's literally like busking

on the street right it's just like you

just have to hope

that you're drawing enough that you just

have to hope you're drawing enough

attention where someone will stop to

like listen well nowadays you know

there's twitter and other like right now

you can have an online presence before

you do comic-con yeah yeah how important

is that as an aero

artist

old school so like it doesn't matter

yeah yeah yeah cause i i started before

twitter right so yeah i guess you were

already established before the social

media thing right yeah nowadays if

you're studying it's it's definitely

important to have like some kind of

online presence and i feel that like

just you know i think in especially on

twitter like that community as well as

like really supportive of other artists

like i see like dojo and artists i

follow on twitter retweeting other dojin

yeah all the time

i don't retweet any of it mind you i

only like it

it just appears on your timeline that's

all yeah i think i think i follow like

two doujin artists or something yeah um

like at the start and then like just by

following one or two my entire timeline

was filled yeah with hentai because they

they're constantly retweeting each

other's stuff

must know as well when you scroll and

stop for a moment i feel like it knows

because it starts oh yeah keep pushing

it like you want more of this right i

spent more than two seconds on this yeah

you stop scrolling for five seconds

you know here twitter is like a cesspool

but like you don't really see it if

you're doing doujin yeah well that's why

half the people are following twitter

are just dojin artists

because i don't want to see that other

[ __ ] horrid cesspool on twitter yeah

it's like the pornhub comments section

right which is like the most wholesome

comment section you will find on the

internet it's like yes king thank you

for your input appreciate it w plus i

can

everyone's got too much postmark clarity

to look yeah yeah exactly

truly focused truly enlightened

i can't plus i asked

yeah like i guess have you um

have you ever thought about having like

putting more effort into having like a

more like bigger online presence and

maybe like growing your audience there

and getting like an audience that will

you know support a patreon or like

i have a patreon but i'm really bad at

updating it yeah yeah yeah yeah cause

i'm just too i'm i'm lazy first of all

but like when i get into like drawing

something like if i start working on a

project then i'm too focused on it to do

anything else yeah yeah yeah so like

updating a weekly thing is like oh god i

have to spend hours like doing that yeah

yeah yeah yeah what about like stuff

like uh like do you have like a skip or

anything like no not at the moment

obviously

but then it's like more stuff i have to

say oh yeah that's true yeah that's true

do you want to explain what scab is skep

is basically like it's it's like fiverr

where you can like commission artists to

draw whatever it is you want and like i

think in like recent times skep has like

really gotten massive overseas just

because like a lot of like independent v

tubers you know especially like higher

japanese artists because you know it's

like

i'm an anime you know i'm a virtual

anime girl who am i going to get to draw

a virtual enemy girl probably an anime

artist with an anime style right so

that's like really blown up recently and

like i know like a lot of like

independent artists and like dogen

artists like live purely off of skip

commissions right like some some artists

make like bank off skip yeah

yeah i mean and there's a lot of porn

yeah on scab like a lot of porn

there is it's like an insane amount of

pawn on screen it's a lot of porn while

the pawn that could be commissioned by

very very talented artists exactly like

the

the disparity between the work you see

on fiverr and the workers that you're

skipped is like night and day

not even a comparison yeah that's crazy

how good yeah if you want to go

commission good arts uh good artists uh

go on skep and like skep has like a

feature now where like even if you write

the commission in english it auto

translates to japanese oh it does that

yeah yeah so like a lot of japanese

artists now like you don't have to write

in like broken japanese like the the

order translation yeah you don't have to

be like konichiwa commission please you

know like you don't have to be like that

now so like yeah because like i know a

lot of like my english speaking friends

who don't know a word of japanese so

yeah just commission a bunch of japanese

artists and they get exactly what they

want oh cool yeah yeah so it's really

cool they really like optimize that yeah

like in in like the hentai world do you

normally find you find like

that there is like ever certain trends

or like a meta that gets popular between

like different artists oh

i i'm i'm so curious what the world is

like basically oh yeah i mean like

sometimes there's um

i think i can't think of a good example

like uh oh like recently not too

recently a couple of years ago there was

a meta that was going around that was

like a fixed camera and so like for a

few panels it's like for a few pages

it's the same oh

i remember there's like a time lapse

yeah yeah

holy [ __ ] it's like 11 a.m they're in

missionary and then it's like 2 am

they're in doggy

and it was the same angle

they took a water break

[Laughter]

oh my god that is

it reminds me of like that fight scene

in old boy where it's just like one

static together but then you just you

just extrapolate that with sex and

that's just that was just that mess oh

my god that's so weird like i never knew

that there was like notice it now yeah i

know now that you said it i noticed it i

remember it's like there's like montages

in like 80s films where it's like it's

like time-lapsing

except sex

oh my god yeah now that you say that

i've read so many dozens that use that

yeah recently oh my god i never thought

about that that's crazy yeah because

like i don't know like do you know how

how often do you try to like break out

of the trend or like do something

original or do you

sometimes read some works and you're

like damn that's that's awesome i gotta

incorporate in my own work as well

well

when well i don't know if i'm

if i'm weird or not but like it has to

interest me yes i'm not going to have

fun drawing it if i'm not going to have

fun drawing it yeah and i don't do it

yeah yeah of course of course yeah you

got to put your passion into you know

some people you know are really

professional and they just like i i draw

what i'm asked you know but like you

draw what's hot you know yeah right yeah

yeah but i can't really bring myself to

do any of that so like if it doesn't

really like you know

[ __ ] twisting you spock joy yeah yeah

then i can't do it

if i'm not drawing it i don't have a big

smile on my face

then it ain't

it so like i respect that you know if

if i wanted to do like a

straight-up like boy meets girl yeah

kind of story then i have to put my own

twist on it yeah otherwise it's not

interesting to me yeah

what would the what would the shindo

well twist be in an instance like that i

remember

doing one like basically straightforward

story

which is just like one guy and one girl

just said having sex yeah

and like

i think i made to go like a quad like a

quadruple amputee

i mean like

why not right

so like to explain like late she had no

arms nowhere no arms okay

that's like that's like

i feel like that's like as something did

you read a lot of vasanagi during that

time i mean

but

it was a really wholesome story though

yeah

it was like

just looking at connor and carlos is

like discriminate against four amputees

uh yeah

well that's the end of that scene

i shouldn't and i won't

they deserve sex too yeah exactly

just imagining how you draw the panel

was it like we only have x amount of

budget left get rid of the limbs

we don't have enough time to draw the

limbs

it's coming out tomorrow

i think i'm afraid to ask for how'd you

go about researching how to draw the sex

scenes for that well i i knew like a

purple egg so i i talked to that person

for a bit and like

asked them like how do you you know is

it awkward having to ask them those

questions okay how i didn't ask like how

do you have sex

how do you [ __ ]

how do you like you know go about doing

your daily yeah yeah what do you find

hard to do what do you find like how do

you cope with like you know not not

being able to do this or that

yeah so that that that's really

interesting here so you actually have to

like interview your friend right just to

give yourself a frame of reference

to to draw that right if you didn't know

someone and you wanted to kind of ask

them how would you do you have any way

of doing that like if you wanted to meet

someone who is in a certain condition

you know i don't know you'd have to like

go on to school

any paraplegics here

you want to tell me how you [ __ ]

how often do you have to do this kind of

research where you have to like talk to

someone to see what they're experiencing

i mean it's really just it's just for me

basically because yeah yeah i mean i

don't i i figure you could do it without

doing the research or without asking i'm

sure obviously you're not doing that

definitely do not do that yeah

but like you know if

for me it like adds a little bit of like

i could add one thing yeah that speaks

through to someone who's experienced it

maybe yeah it's like oh yeah i know how

that feels yeah and if you had that one

thing then like it makes the story a lot

more interesting yeah because i remember

when we did the interview and i and i

asked you about metamorphosis and like

how i think you said and correct me if

i'm wrong but like you the big reason

why you kind of came up with like

sucky's characters because like you've

heard of like you people like who had

like similar experiences right and like

in high school who like you know got

into drugs right but like

it's not based it's not like based on

who are you right

but i'm sure it's like a lot of it was

like kind of inspired or like you know

kind of taken from that experience right

well like you know like

you know someone who's been through a

lot of [ __ ] and like

and sucky's into like all the [ __ ] right

yeah

yeah it's like oh she has she had like a

comedically bad life right yeah but like

if you take one aspect of it it could

speak true to someone um

like you know yes that part is i

recognize that part as being real right

right so that makes the story more

engaging have you ever had like anyone

come up to you at like events or

whatever and being like you know i

really like related to like sucky's

character i relate it's like this

particular character that spoke through

today i i get that a lot from like

um yeah sucky oh yeah

damn

i feel bad now yeah

right

i am curious because you said that you

had to

sense yourself

for metamorphosis uh because you were

you're drawing it in a magazine i'm i'm

curious now will you ever

release like

a director's cut i guess the snyder card

like 500 pages

because

i i guess even if you couldn't you know

even if you couldn't release it in a

magazine your audience worldwide now is

vast enough to be able to you know sell

that to you because i'd willingly pay

money to see your [ __ ] director of

whatever you had planned originally now

i know i know a lot of people have been

saying like oh shinuel should make like

the happy end right for like

metamorphosis where she doesn't die yeah

[Applause]

i think yeah i think it's me when i was

reading i was like i think the one thing

that i was like oh my god is it it's so

fast right

in one sitting yeah yeah yeah yeah boom

boom boom boom your life's ruined your

life

your life is over yeah

there's no down time yeah yeah there's

literally no break at all and it's just

like you're depressed

and you'll miss a rule and you're never

recovering and it's like oh okay

all right i guess i'm sad now maybe

that's something you can do on your

patreon right maybe i mean like the

thing about working like in a magazine

or just even doing a doujin is that you

have a certain amount of pages and you

have to have some action in there right

right right so like you know you can't

like spend like like 100 pages like you

know showing someone's life right god

forbid

oh my god i'm actually not [ __ ] in

that time

i'll get bored have you ever thought

about just doing just just doing like

you know a non-h manga or non-era manga

i mean

i thought about it but then like

i just come back to what it can be a

hentai

so every story can be improved by sex i

mean like

if you

if you work it the right way

so it's all in the execution tool yes

yes conor yeah yeah

i think you forgot planet of the apes

this is the man that did it when i

watched play with the apes i didn't

think man i want to see caesar just

[ __ ] go at it

so you see that's the challenge right

that's that's that's how you make

excuses yeah how do you do that you know

that's that's the

mental stimulation right

[Laughter]

my god

i admire it i admire this the

determination to be like i want to have

sex in this

i want to try and find every scenario

and turn that into somehow having sex

yeah like after like doing hentai then

like

i don't know i at first i thought like

maybe i'll

use it as a stepping stone to do other

stuff

but the more i got into it the more like

the deeper the world got right like the

hentai world yeah like i realized how

much more i could do

in hentai than

once i realized that it's like you don't

have to like step out of hentai yeah and

do everything you want in hindi what do

you want to do in the entire world oh my

god everything like

a sci-fi epic maybe i could do that

i think that sounds incredible oh man

okay

noelle looks up at the nice guy and he's

like they could be [ __ ] up there

legends with the galactic heroes

[Laughter]

there's not enough [ __ ] in space as

far as i'm concerned

like there's never been like a good zero

g like sex scene so far in hand yeah

oh do you have to like would you

probably have to research that though

right it's like what kind of different

stimuli would a person be able to get

while in zero g's

there are contraptions that people have

developed to extract each other together

right

right but it's never been tested like in

real life in real life oh wow like

people have been thinking about this yet

and i've been like watching them think

about it

it's like yes i agree

this is a great idea

oh my god

is it hard to go

is it like a normal thing that maybe

someone will do error manga and then

just go back to doing manga is that like

common in japan or is it kind of like

there are people who do ero manga

then go on to do like nano manga oh okay

some people come back right like the

author

the author for security was originally

uh uh

manga uh personal thing or dojima or

like uh um

i think that guy clearly wanted to do

porn yeah of course

also oh i didn't know that

oh wow so it's actually more common than

that it's very common do you get to hang

out with many

other aero manga authors yeah i mean

like

like you know years ago like before you

know kovid yeah i used to go out

drinking a lot like i used to go out

drinking with us and say yeah

you know fly on the wall yeah right yeah

yeah yeah and we just talk about like

you know how next shit's going and like

you know like what what do you want to

do next comic what do you want yeah yeah

yeah

that like the workers must be quite

confused over hearing your conversation

what

they're talking about like strapping

each themselves to each other in zero

g's

or how big is the scene right like um i

have no idea like if you

take everybody into account there's like

thousands of people right yeah

but if you uh take one publisher for

example

like sometimes they'll throw a party and

people get together all the authors

would just you know introduce themselves

to each other yeah you know build

rapport

and after that you know sometimes we'll

just hang out

so you know

it's cool yeah yeah

because like i've interacted with us

on twitter before and it's so weird he

is legitimately one of the most

wholesome dudes i've ever interacted

with on twitter and i'm like

the the dichotomy between how wholesome

he acts on twitter versus the [ __ ] he

draws

it's just like nuts right it's done or

do anything with aero stuff generally

quite chill yeah again i mean you must

have some level of clarity yeah yeah

yeah is that listening to yourself

you're like i like this yeah i think i

think i think what makes a lot of them

so cool is just the fact that it's like

they have nothing to hide

it's like i make [ __ ] like this you

either love it or you hate it yeah yeah

if not then i

[Laughter]

yeah i think um and like hentai authors

er manga go really good at like

separating the fantasy and their reality

so like you know you might be into like

lowly but like in in your life of course

you're not yeah right right yeah that's

that's good to hear i mean

it's like yeah thank

much of an industry you know

you mentioned there's thousands of uh

dogen artists

like what percentage of that are able to

do it for like a living

oh like a fraction oh yeah five percent

maybe like ten five percent yeah damn

yeah how do you see people like trying

to stand out now or like

oh my god like people

are so much better now

so much better now than it was like 20

years ago yeah

like this like it keeps going up and

there's a skill inflation that's i can't

keep up with skill inflation skill

inflation

it is insane you see well drawing stuff

on trains here and even then they're

like like 10 years old and they're

drawing anything better than i'll ever

accumulate throughout my life yeah the

the posts i hate the most on twitter is

like when like a devotion artist or like

an artist it's like just a one-hour

sketch and it's like a [ __ ]

masterpiece of the thing i'm like i

hate you i your art is amazing but i

goddamn hate you

but i wish i could say that no it's it's

the thing i say well like the only thing

that shows up my timeline is like when

artists do like oh a quick one-hour

sketch yeah then they go like complete

the sketch or something and it's just

like a tenth of the interactions i'm

like

how does this work

that's like their only post-working

process like pics now because the only

ones that get any interaction if you

want to be a successful artist on

twitter now don't ever finish your work

yeah just only post the sketches

i know a couple of guys who are just

like so much better than me

but they've never gotten like the no no

they deserve

right they can't you know make a living

on like like just drawing and so they

have to work like second jobs to their

jobs

it's really depressing that's really sad

like how

what is the main way artists make a

living or hentai artists make a living

nowadays is is it still comical or has

there been like a big increase in like

say online patreon oh yeah other i mean

like

online

work has just blown up in the past few

years yeah

so i think the mainstay now is just

download like um you know fans are and

the l site yeah

i think it's like maybe like

more than half the market definitely

right right right yeah because i've

definitely seen especially in the last

few years

uh in you know in the western twitter or

western um

industry i guess it's like there's been

a huge explosion of like

patreons and like

especially like even animators like

hentai animators and especially like 3d

artists

people that make overwatch porn are like

the best animators in the world yeah

like pixar yeah i think i wish they

could animate yeah

somehow they all just decided overwatch

will be like i didn't know you could

animate 200 frames a second like that's

that's it's right there it's as smooth

as hell it's like

like they're like

obviously i i've seen like western

side of it but like on the japanese side

it's like a if you are like one of the

top artists is there a potential to make

a lot of money from it or is it still

quite limited on what what you could oh

my i think if you're one of the top like

artists i think

nowadays in the next

past few years of course

i think

having the online presence is a lot more

important than right

so you know people have like you know

half a million like followers on twitter

or something yeah

and you know i think yeah they can

easily make as much money as they want i

think yeah yeah why not right yeah i

have no idea i mean there's probably

there's probably also a lot of like dojo

artists who have like you know found

success

because of their social media presence

by like doing stuff that's not

necessarily like dojin stuff because i

think like i think asaki sensei has like

started like illustrating like a like a

regular manga series or like a line

novel series or whatever it was like it

was like illustrations for novels yeah

yeah yeah yeah so it's like you know

there's like a lot of light novels i

know that like where the illustrations

are done by like doujin artists right

like a lot of people know them from you

know stuff like that right like you know

like pochi for example yeah yeah yeah

yeah yeah yeah yeah like

was just like so massive for him exactly

but even though for her sorry for her

but uh you know but

even though

she did that she still does dogen [ __ ]

yeah you know she's a youtuber now yeah

yeah yeah yeah yeah

like that that's the next step every

dozen artists is going to be a visual

yeah they always come back

let's come back literally become the

plot of error manga sensei now where

they're just they just live stream their

work exactly

exactly

i i gotta ask because i've been curious

maybe you can explain it right right

what is up with those pesky black lines

everywhere i look everywhere oh i see

all i see is the pesky black now it's

just like a white splat or like the

white splotch or sometimes if there's

keep changing

um

i think it's

well i know it's you know

some

a very uh

complicated dance with

okay okay because um they'll come in to

a publisher especially and say

too much

right right right

so yeah so you guys put as little as

possible to not like anger the people

who make up the rules eh the uh well you

know people

the publishers keep trying to push the

limits but then there's always push back

yeah

and like when um

tokyo olympics were happening

like the build up to that was just more

and more censorship right really yeah

right i mean they got rid of porn

magazines from combines right because of

that they did yeah that was one of the

things that the tokyo government decided

to they were like we're gonna have a lot

of people coming to japan and we don't

want people coming here for the first

time to walk into a [ __ ] family mud

and be like there's a lot of porn mags

here

next to like all the manga that's uh i

don't even looked at them but i thought

they were still there but i think it

must be like lewd stuff then

yeah there's a lot of like graveyard

stuff right but yeah but like the actual

like porn magazines like there was like

you know usually there's like a curtain

you know separating you know those kinds

of like stuff right like in any way but

in combinies it was just there

in the open usually right usually right

next to the toilet yeah you know

it's like it's it's one of those things

where like you go to the toilet and you

take a quick little peek before you go

to the toilet they were like sellotaped

shop

yeah yeah

they're like roped up right

no you all buy it

yeah so they're like that was one of the

things where they were just like we're

just going to eradicate porn max yeah i

didn't realize

you hear from different industries how

kind of like they were on like a blitz

before the olympics to just try and

clean things up yeah sanitize everything

yeah

i mean they like killed airbnb they uh

yeah

and i think they did a few other things

as well i can't remember they did quite

a lot of things they did so many things

they brought a lot of things like

science

just like foreign up

like desanitize

like the whole entire industry um

really didn't really end up happening

yeah yeah yeah yeah but it has happened

in like because everything's more online

now everything has to sort of conform

to uh west tourists

so you can't have like there used to be

a lot more bestiary but we can't have

that anymore

it needs to be a lot more lonely you

can't have that anymore it's be sure

that i can't have that anymore yeah so

like is there any like is it's so

with regards to the censorship is there

any like rules that have been like put

down on paper like let let's say you

know you you have like a penis or a

vagina is there like a rule to like what

part

like like

of what needs to be blocked out like 10

20 or whatever i think like

it depends on like what you're talking

about because like

usually like if someone's putting a book

out in comiket yeah

the people who run comiket will come by

in the morning check your book out make

sure everything's censored to the

standards of whatever the hentai

industry is doing it at the moment right

so now

things have to be pretty like blacked

out right well like you know 10 years

ago it used to be

you have to have a boy like over the tip

you have to have a bar over like the

little flange

[Laughter]

that's the scientific term

and you have to have a ball like

somewhere on the shaft right right like

anywhere on the shelf like somewhere

anywhere on this side i've seen it just

like in the most random places yeah like

that is doing nothing it's like the

middle of the shot and it's like i know

what's behind that

yeah i've always noticed it's always

like the tip and the flange yeah but

then there are some instances where it's

just like

[ __ ] like like just seven lines over

the entire shop

it's like a zebra [ __ ] and it's like

so now it's more like minecraft looking

yeah completely blocked out yeah it's

like it's it's like mosaic but it's not

like fully mosaics it makes sense you'll

still make it out like i've seen like a

trend recently which is like the glowy

dick

it's like you can make like a faint

outline of the car somewhere around

here it's it's so weird whenever you get

that scene whenever like yeah whenever

the girl takes off the trousers and it's

just like a glowing dick

and it's just the most surreal thing i

don't know who started this trend or how

this trend started um

make a scene where like the light source

is coming from that dick

so it works with the censorship

it's like it's no sense yeah my dick

just claws have you ever had to come up

with any creative ways to come around to

get past the censorship well you know

the easiest way is like you know just

work the angles so you don't have to

show as much right right

i feel i feel like also like depending

on like what angles you choose it like

some are even better if you don't like

just completely oh yes absolutely

sometimes it's just like better if you

don't see anything yeah yeah it's it's

paradoxical but like sometimes like you

know

yeah

not seeing the faces sometimes it's like

students seeing the face yeah

yeah actually that's that's that's

interesting like how did you how did you

i guess how do you direct your own sex

scenes you know like how do you know

what looks hot or was it just

kind of like you look at other

references and you're like that looks

kind of good or that there's a tempo to

it like you know you can't have like

money shot money shot money shot because

like you know it just blends all

together yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so you

need like you know like downtime

downtime money shot you know right right

right although i've read a lot of dozens

where it's just like seven page motor of

money shots

it's like bro like how is this man's

balls not exploded at this point it's

like that's a lot

so

you mentioned obviously uh centering

from the government but is it ever hard

when you're trying to you know dealing

with almost

self-censorship like you have like ah is

this too much i don't know [ __ ]

well you know personally i try to like

push boundaries right right like

whatever makes me feel uncomfortable

like sometimes i try to delve into that

just like you know get a feeling for it

right yeah yeah myself basically

yeah do you feel like that uncomfortable

feeling enhances your story is is that

what you would say it makes it more

interesting

but you're not doing it like purely for

like shock factor it's not shock factor

it's just like

to catch my own interest and like right

it's not for any like deeper meaning

really but like

i mean

i think it makes the work more like

unique unique and spicy it's a little

spicy yeah i'm surprised that you said

that the

white i guess overseas norms affect

the

japanese senses because normally

people are under the impression that

japan doesn't give a [ __ ] what the

outside world thinks i mean the standard

anime industry definitely is the case

right yeah it's strange if the anime

industry doesn't care but then i guess

if to hear the arrow stuff kind of maybe

is more affected by what other countries

think and what i think maybe it's

because like the dojin industry actually

cares for the like international

community even like the normal anime

stuff like um they're remaking they're

remaking

right yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and like

the foot one of the first scenes is like

a booby shot yeah yeah yeah it's like

what's gonna happen you don't know are

we gonna conform to like you know global

standards or you're just gonna go with

the a's

you know right yeah like complete remake

yeah yeah i guess like

when you

make your work do you have to keep this

keep this into account or was it trying

not to yeah like

i don't know it's it's fantasy right so

like yeah

like

oh this conversation i've had this one

like before more than once right yeah

yeah yeah

like um

do you go about like making something

and like

make it like

because you know it's not socially

acceptable yeah yeah i think

when it's art right it has to be done

tastefully or appropriately right yeah

to be like okay you know you need to

have stories about stuff like this

because it happens you know like i don't

necessarily personally agree with it but

yeah i am okay with it

you don't your characters aren't you

right yeah they're there to represent

something and to push a a storyline and

it's just because you write about a

story i think anyone i i i don't really

agree with people like you can't write

about x topics it's like no i mean if

this stuff happens in real life it it

happens in real life yeah yeah why shy

away from it horrible stuff happens all

the time you should be able to write a

story about it

obviously there are some people who do

it not tastefully at all yeah the

argument i hear a lot is that it

normalizes the uh the act right yeah i i

disagree with that no i disagree i

disagree too but like you know i hear it

a lot yeah yeah yeah hey guys i was

wondering if you have a favorite fruit

uh i like strawberries oranges for me

why are you asking this all of a sudden

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your first order back to the show so uh

legitimate question okay

dick girls yeah

you know

because you know it's a thing indulgence

a lot there's a lot of it yes and you

have a serious tsf that has dick girls

in it right isn't it yes i've always

been curious

how do dojonatas

get into that

like are you not into it i'm like half

off right into it i'm not like crazy

about it what's the name of the tank

again dick girl was it a dick

yeah yeah

yeah

yeah

right because it's like it's when you

think of like you know stereotypical

like dojin tags right like futa is

usually the first one people think of

right because i feel it's a very much

like uh i think there was a there was a

poll that faku did right yeah the most

popular um search tags or post state

first date yeah futo was like all over

the years i think it was like

yeah i think i remember seeing that it

was like out of like out of like the 50

states i think it was like 41 states the

most viewed tag was futa yeah so it's

like it's just i don't know it's just

this really interesting thing that like

i think it's just so synonymous with the

dojian world especially yeah and a lot

of people are so like again it's like

another one of those things like loli

and shutter where it's like a very clear

divide right but and yet it's like

weirdly embraced yes for some reason

right so it's like but like you're not

like personally into it right no

personally i'm not like it doesn't mean

you do anything for me yeah yeah yeah

but i understand like intellectually

how it works like right why it's gonna

describe it intellectually

intellectually

so i try to put it into the work cause

like you know i want to explore

that aspect of so what so what made you

want to explore that side of things well

you know like i've never done it before

i'm like let's give it a try

and like you know the more i try work it

then the more i understand why it works

yeah yeah you know so it's like your

mission i guess is to like go through

every single tag to be like i'm going to

try and explore every single one of

these

that's a good glorious thing

that'd be cool what's like that what's

putting putting your own twists on like

every tag yeah that's a really good goal

is that like a tag you've seen where

you're just like

whoa

what what is that i'll i'll

tell you when i find it

eye penetration i can't i've done it

here's the appeal of that

like it's uh

breaking the laws of physics

like there's penalties in the taboo of

the law of physics like this eye

penetration is ear penetration there's

like belly button penetration and it's

all it all links to like sorry yeah that

made my like stomach like

quiver it's basically all like what you

call leona

which is like uh torture basically right

what a twitch point right yeah yeah

that's that's that's like a really

common tag

yeah there's a lot of any of this is

completely all new to me yeah yeah i

don't read you an innocent child

don't read anything

it is a vast world alberta i'm just

thinking like how would you even

i would how would you do this physically

the orbital socket is like this deep so

you can find like maybe a way to do it i

mean i mean i think the point is you

can't do it physically

that's the appeal of it that's the

appeal yeah it's like i i don't want to

see it in real life i don't want to try

it in real life mrs incredible maybe you

could

i mean

that's one way to do it right well

that's that's not like you you've just

discovered a situation in order to like

achieve that i don't know how much

incredibles porn you think there is out

there

there's a lot yeah yeah yeah yeah

i mean

made of rubber

to make that work realistically

yeah it's like that's like one thing

i've always wanted to ask like a dozen

artists is like when you find those

kinds of like you know

non-vanilla tags and stuff like that

what is it about like those non-vanilla

tags that makes you want to like draw

about it or like you know write about it

or you know like kind of well they try

to get into it if someone

who is really

talented

before and it's like you don't fall in

love with the

act or the tag itself but you fall in

love with the artwork right

so like um i don't know if you know who

godzilla sensei is

i know the name he does like uh manga

um that's about reptiles

okay oh yeah i think i think i'm saying

he does like he does fanboys on his free

time right right and like i've never

been into fanboys right but like just

reading his stuff it's like oh

what's so good like this fanboy is hot

yeah that's that's my exact experience

with asanagi because like a lot of like

his topics in his dojins i'm not

crazy about to be honest like a lot of

it's just like whoa okay but the art is

just so good right yeah yeah they're

like i can't stop reading it it's like

it's i just look at it as like damn he

can [ __ ] draw people and situations

like action scenes like really [ __ ]

well yeah yeah and like i think i just

appreciate him on that aspect and i

think it's like i appreciate a lot of

doji nadas just for that aspect just the

fact that like a lot of them are just

like really [ __ ] talented artists

right right and it's like if i could

draw like that i would absolutely

[ __ ] draw that [ __ ] you know i was

like why wouldn't you it's just cool i

don't know

i i say this because i can't draw good

draw porn is that what you're saying

if i could if i had the talent to draw

porn okay why would you not

i mean especially what they were doing

yes you know and the the churches that's

what they had

right all it's like if i had the talent

to be able to draw like a really hot sex

scene i would absolutely draw my own

sexy yeah because that's just like a

power it's like i don't even have to

look for point anymore i'll just [ __ ]

make it i'll make it i will make the

pawn myself thanos like i'll decline

i'll do it myself yeah exactly

i mean like that's that's why you do it

that's why i do it yeah because it's

like you know you you you look around

and you're like

nothing there that like just clicks for

me yeah so i'll just do exactly what i

want to see and you know what i think is

cool right so it's like yeah if i had

the ability to do that i [ __ ] do that

in a heartbeat absolutely so like what

are some of your favorite tags out of

curiosity um i think

some of my most well-known favorite tags

are like pregnant one right sometimes

birth sometimes like um what is both

birthing birthing like birthing a baby

making a baby

in in the show

the things like well i mean minimal

officers had one right well did it kind

of not merely not really but

[Music]

this one chapter is all just birthing

because i wanted to i'm just giving

birth just giving birth okay

i'm trying to protest

i can hear like the uh

just like

okay i just love i was just looking at

connor when he said okay and just the

eyes darting you like around like okay

i wouldn't ask questions but i'm scared

to know the answer

you might have an opportunity so just

ask just ask so yeah the pregnant thing

i can

all right i can understand that that

could be attractive right yeah but what

about the birth aspect is attractive

well why not go a step further when you

go to if you're into the pregnancy then

why not go a step further

this is water that's the attractive part

well you you know just well

okay okay okay i was making sure i

understand that

you can be like i mean you could like

theoretically do anal while you're doing

it but like you know

doesn't have to i guess you could

that is indeed a fact

the laws of physics

requires

phil i'll fill a pattern which is just

like well you theoretically could do

this

so i think what i'm learning is that

it's it's asking the questions that men

never asked

that's [ __ ] it let's do it yeah yeah

yeah

let's give it a go

i admire the exploration yeah yeah

okay carry on what are the tags what are

those tags um

ishikan which is a cross species

you know usually mixed in with pregnancy

and birthing right right

okay

how many

like sauces like a chef right just like

the ingredients

okay okay and uh well you know the

normal stuff like you know gangbang

whatever you know so yeah it's like

vanilla can you just not do vanilla

anymore

why

go back not the classics right like the

bloney one was vanilla

what was it wasn't it

i wouldn't there's two people and

they're just doing a thing i mean i mean

there's

vanilla like nautical no no

no there is no it's not vanilla because

there was a birth scene

[Laughter]

there was how is birth not vanilla

though

this man's like living on a different

like level of reality he's like i think

i think your version of vanilla and mine

is like so far gone like i'm like

missionary go to bed at 9pm watch a tv

show you know that's vanilla

natural

outcome

no no nothing quote-unquote are natural

right there's a standard human

experience okay that makes sense no but

i get that it's just the fact that

you're like what's not vanilla about

birth it's just like

it's like third eye open it's like oh my

god you're right

this man's like another plane of reality

brain expansion

just like couples getting together

vanilla

it's like an attractive thing to see

just a baby born

i mean like because there's um

the mother has to go through all these

stages right yeah oh and that's the

attractive part of yeah okay okay i

think i understand

i think i feel like you need to like

read some of it to like figure it out

yeah what are the tags i'm interested oh

species okay species um that won't make

sense to me that seems hot yeah well i

mean yeah ish's looking reviewers was

[ __ ] massive right because they're

hot why not yeah exactly exactly i mean

technically like you know the broly one

yeah yeah

yeah yeah yeah exactly but no normally

normally we're talking about like

non-human right yeah yeah yeah

um what else well you know the normal

stuff like you know

uh transgender yeah

one that i've been doing a lot

um what else have been doing doing well

you know i do you're not too the torture

stuff right right once in a while

um

i recently did a collaboration with

asuna sensei and he did his uh

compilation of like various artists

doing like girls who've been who've had

their limbs cut off right yeah i feel

sorry for the fbi agent

your search

i have to go through all this [ __ ] later

yeah yeah um i haven't done too much

scat

right

except like vomiting vomiting i do a lot

why

i mean like

i'm

genuinely curious genuinely i don't know

it's like

it's i'm not trying to be like

derogatory one of the moments where you

where you feel like

at your lowest

when you're when you're throwing up okay

so so there's kind of an attraction to

seeing people

at a very low point at a very vulnerable

point yeah yeah okay okay i mean yes i

guess on the same level in terms of

vulnerability it's simply like

metamorphosis right very vulnerable just

in different ways yeah yeah yeah exactly

it's the same emotion i guess just in a

different kind of scenario i just love

them

just if you just took that conversation

out of context it's like i do vomiting

quite a bit and you're just going why

that must be so weird out of context you

know

i i i'm

this one episode has been like a gold

mine i'm just getting out of context

clips

you know because i i i like to think

that the podcast is is something where

even if we disagree like i said earlier

it's something where we can come to

understand and kind of talk and share

even if i completely be like that is

[ __ ] up yeah yeah yeah yeah i still

think that you should be able to tell me

about it yeah yeah talk to me and be

like this is what it is and i'll be like

oh god

go ahead king go on i just want you to i

just want you to keep going purely just

to see connor's reaction

this entire podcast just been golden

just like every so often you'll say

something con is just like

what every time you say something that i

know is [ __ ] i immediately look at

connor there's a lot of people who you

know

would kill to be in this chair and talk

to you about this so i don't want to you

know i don't want to squander that

opportunity like no i don't want to know

anything about it i want to learn about

it so i can like live vicariously yeah

yeah yeah and if you don't know anything

maybe you can

do my reaction to this episode

i am living vicariously right now yeah

yeah because i'm just like at least i

know connor's gonna have a more [ __ ]

up like reaction than me right

you know i'm i'm sitting on this side of

the table and i'm like sometimes i feel

like i should be over there

i love i love hentai right hentai is

great you know me and samuel jackson

have a lot in common yeah

you know and i almost feel like hentai

is so goddamn vanilla from what's going

on in the dojinski world

i'm watching it i watch a lot of the

hentai and i feel like what is happening

over there like i feel like

we're in like the villa and you guys are

like fighting down on the street

what's going on down there one thing i

can definitely say after after talking

to you is that i think i have vanilla

taste yeah yeah yeah

i never thought i would say that

i used to say like vanilla that's lame

as [ __ ] but now i think i'm vanilla

your colleagues presumably don't

all draw or cover the same stuff as you

are they ever like bro chill like oh no

daddy chill

no

it's always

what i don't know okay okay i mean it's

always fun to see what other people are

doing right right yeah yeah oh you're

doing that cool you know it's like yeah

yeah i can actually be like yes king

yeah yes you [ __ ] buff that kid

penetrate

here's here's the next dojo episode

we're going to ask you to recommend us

some notions yeah and uh we'll read it

and talk about it actually yeah that'll

be pretty [ __ ]

i'm gonna hate my life

if you're going through my category then

i suggest doing a

shindo l's cultural anthropology okay

because i had the most fun writing that

one okay okay so that's you just

explaining

all the

genres i guess it's like me playing

around with a lot of genres okay okay

just like short stories like sure i know

it's one continuous like it's episodic

oh right oh okay i said amount of set

characters doing like different things

for every chapter okay okay

see a lot of these stuff really

confusing for me because i'm like am i

supposed to jack off i don't know when

maybe you're not supposed to yeah am i

supposed to be like genuinely i don't

know i think i think it's just a matter

of like if you think the time is right

yeah you know how you write it you're

like if you if you want to just read

this and experience it do it or are you

writing it for like all right yeah you

can

do it i mean like

some things i've been thinking about for

a while and like you know okay

i kind of let it like percolate yeah

and then i put it on paper but other

things it's you know on a whim yeah

that makes sense i think yeah because

you know like i don't jack off to every

dojo i read yeah you know sometimes i

just like like reading it because i like

reading it yeah i just watched porn yeah

watch it yeah there's storylines no

but that's the weird thing right i'm not

like that with like porn or hinter

so like what is it i don't know it's

there's there's something about dojins

where it's like it can literally just be

like a pick up and read thing sometimes

yeah i see people on the train today

swiping through dojins yeah yeah yeah

i'm just like

this is a strong world to me

but i just find that really fascinating

that like doujins can do that yeah where

it's like even though you look at the

contents of it and you're like yeah i

can definitely see someone like jacking

off to that that the fact that you can

just sometimes be like

yeah you know what i want to read it but

i don't really want to jack off to it i

just kind of want to read it i want to

read the plan in the april

just curious right yeah exactly i think

it's you know why it's just going to be

so simple i think it's because dungeons

aren't a hands-free experience

right right like like if you choose to

jack off to adoption it is it is effort

because you are you are holding

something yeah

whether it's like you're like juggling a

lot of things yeah exactly like like

hentai you know you can put that on the

tv

now you can put it on the screen you

know back in the day you had to like

find a way to put that hold the book

out

like even if you put on the screen go

like

turn the page

[Applause]

it's not a complete hands-free

experience

i've always been curious like can you

view like porn in the same way or do you

just view it now as completely you know

just research or something that you can

incorporate into your own world oh no i

could still you know

okay okay

yeah yeah yeah

yeah it's all good

that's when you know it's good right

[Laughter]

you're like finally some good [ __ ]

is food more you more prefer to read or

watch

i'd rather read

oh that's interesting for me it's like

the complete yeah

like i'm a manga person rather than an

anime person

right right right right so

it's more about like visualizing it and

kind of like it always works better in

my mind when i'm reading it i guess it's

like i'll do it it's like reading a

novel like watching a movie because you

can like fill in the blanks in your own

way right yeah so it's like you can make

it a lot more like sexy or like more for

your taste than perhaps the author

intended

whereas with like hentai it's like you

get the full package and you can't

really change that you know yeah so i

get it i guess is there anything else

you guys want to ask about hentai

specifically

i think we need like a kind of chill

down section

what up it's your boy joey here to let

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this episode onto the show yeah so like

you were talking about elder ring

earlier oh and yeah being a massive

souls fan

so uh yeah like what are what are some

games or some anime or something

it's been like a intense two-hour

conversation about porn so far

so i want to chill out

well what are some like games and anime

that you like

or looking forward to or like or just

like in general yeah whatever your other

interests uh

everything

i like rpgs in general yeah like um

strategy games like um

if you played uh valkyrie chronicles oh

yes yes

yes yes just getting into valkyrie

chronicles right now yeah it's a great

series yeah um i mean you're obviously

into like dragon quest and stuff yeah um

yeah this is a new dragon quest 3 remake

coming

oh yeah

yeah i want to play that as well

um what else is coming out oh there's a

was it made in the best action rpg

coming out

is there actually yeah yeah

yeah it's action rpg

and it's it's really that said for like

adults only

oh i want to play that i'm just curious

you know

but i'm always scared of like anime

games because they haven't had the best

probably gonna be like [ __ ] to play but

like yeah you know i'm interested yeah

sure like what can they possibly do do

you like g oh so you like made in the

best thing i do

you know what now now that you see it it

makes so much sense right

because

because i'm just like damn that

definitely explores some topics that i

don't normally get to see right like

he's like made in the business like some

do you know in it right like there's a

lot of torture scenes in there oh god

that definitely makes me feel

uncomfortable yeah definitely

jesus

a lot of sense holy [ __ ] oh yeah what

are like some like standard manga that

you would like recommend all like you

really really like well you know now spy

family's big of course and

i'm more of a manga spy phone guy um um

what else is new

[Music]

so it's just like the most wholesome

thing

that did surprise me

i don't know why there's a part of me

that was like spider family to vanilla

tornadoes expected to be like yeah so

berserk you know oh yes

it's just hilarious to like imagine you

reading spy phone and being like hell

yeah

oh that's so cute

yeah

so so like what's kind of like some of

your favorites of all time then oh my

favorites of all time

like anime of manga or video games

um anything drawn by

about the takahi

yeah yeah yeah

like his recent work with like one punch

man especially it's just yeah [ __ ]

incredible and obviously i shield as

well i don't i don't know how that man

keeps improving yeah it's crazy i

thought he peaked at i shield 21.

and then one punch man was like i could

do better

crazy yeah

that's definitely like another one where

i can definitely see like it kind of

like makes sense because like he also

has like a really like you know darkish

style and like you know especially like

some scenes in death note like

back in the day it was like whoa that's

uh this is it this isn't shown in jump

yeah yeah it's like holy [ __ ] you know

like i definitely remember reading death

note the first time and i just

i i didn't even know it was shonen jump

yeah you know like i knew at that time

what kind of manga was kind of in shonen

jump you know you had like you know you

know dragon balls your

shows you know all that kind of thing

and then you go to death note and you're

like this comes from the same magazine

yeah it looks it looks like a seinen and

it feels like a saiyan in mind yeah so

it's like yeah i remember like walls of

text right yeah yeah

like a novel huh i just can't imagine

reading it and not having like the

[ __ ] elves theme playing

well that's that's that's how people

experience it before the anime yeah yeah

i know but like now i can't think about

death note without having that song in

my head i know yeah it's so iconic yeah

the anime is so good yeah because like i

remember when i first saw that being

adapted because that was one of the few

mangas i read before watching the anime

and i was just like there's no way this

is going to work in anime form there is

like too much dialogue there's people

too stylized yeah just eating potato

chips

[Laughter]

so it like blew my mind that i was just

the anime was just that engrossing where

i just thought there was no way you'd be

able to translate

all of this text going on into an

interesting

into an interesting anime form but they

did it but they did it [ __ ] whoever

directed that was like five head dude

like they clearly knew how to like take

text based and just like very still

visuals and make it visually exciting

yeah yeah you also mentioned you put

many hours into elden ring uh yeah but

almost 200 i think jesus christ

yeah i got like 70 hours in it it's so

good yeah boys haven't played yet for

some reason i don't know why

but it's because i'm trying to find time

to do it because i know i know i've

played enough like like [ __ ] from

software games where i'm like i know i'm

gonna love this game yeah but i also

have commitments

as well yeah and i need to like block

out a week from my schedule at least

there's something is something so

amazing about when that health bar pops

up on the screen

i don't know what it is that gets me so

excited every time like every single

time yeah of course

it's so hard

what a game dude yeah

yeah

what about some video games aside from

eldon ring

i mean i suppose you've been playing

never played uh fps games or anything

like that well yeah i've been i played

apex like when it first came out

i love apex

i think last battlefield where i played

was three though

oh oh battle oh battlefield three i mean

it's been buggy mess ever since yeah

three was kind of he was like like

borderline you know it's like i could

accept this bad company yeah bad company

two was really good

battlefield game god you got okay so

you're a gamer good yeah good he's a

gamer yeah he's a gamer he is a gamer in

the game yeah how much time do you have

to like

pursue like your other hobbies outside

of your work because you hear some

horror stories about manga artists just

like having zero time if you're working

like if you're doing a monthly or weekly

then you have no time

but i guess you do like bi-monthly right

i do buy monthly but now i'm just like

taking long hiatuses let's see like

because i i bought my i bought a house

i'm like fixing it up and guarding

gardening and doing other retiree things

right

but you know i

want to spend more time drawing

spend more time drawing eye penetration

[Laughter]

do you ever get inspiration from you

know works outside you know just from

like normal manga that you like find

elements that you can incorporate into

like your work yeah i mean like if you

look at a

sex scene it's basically an action scene

so if you read like battle manga you can

there's a lot of like angles and like

movements i agree okay i can never tell

what the [ __ ] is going on

and both i'm like

yeah so

when okay

can you expand like like whoa whoa whoa

whoa whoa whoa whoa i get it i get it

yeah yeah you're you're basically just

um depicting movement right um

so like

how do you get that across like on a

still image right oh okay so you know

you know you do like in and out in and

out yeah yeah yeah that's like one way

to do it and right if you read battle

manga you could like you know we could

incorporate in and out in one picture

[Laughter]

what about like the pacing and tempo of

a battle like does that play into factor

i i've yeah i've never i've never

thought i never thought of

i'm glad you said that because i

actually always thought that like really

yeah yeah i just thought that sex scenes

were just battle scenes

you just think that because bucky said

so

maybe yeah

i'd argue the greatest fight scene in

bucky is the sex scene because the

tension of a fight feels the same as the

tension of a sex scene

that's true in a lot of ways yeah a good

a good the tension in a good fight scene

and the attention of the good sex scene

is like

yeah

it's exactly the same i guess

[Laughter]

yeah like

i guess i guess i'm so curious to to

like hear what like what does that break

down into are you talking about like

just movement or just like the tempo or

the pacing

and movement like

let's say um

you're having a sex scene right right

and you'll notice there's like a large

panel yeah something happening and

there's there'll be a small panel of

like some guy flipping his wrist right

and then the next scene you'll see how

he's using that as his hand yeah in a

different way right and it's the same

thing in the battle manga you know

you're right

one guy's fighting but then he does a

small movement and you'll see a small

panel yeah where they show that and then

that gets incorporated into the next

scene it's a team okay that's so

interesting so

like it's like kind of creating like a

flow right of movement so do you like

when you when you're when you're drawing

this do you have like a kind of like a

rough storyboard in your mind about how

the paneling is going to be

um

like sketching out i sketched it out

beforehand right but you know there are

different you know

you have different templates in your

mind yeah yeah yeah and like

you go by those templates and then once

in a while you want to change it up yeah

make it interesting right right right

right so i'm i think

the more experience you have the more

templates you have in your mind right so

it doesn't become like monotonous okay

that's so yeah because i've never

thought of it like that but now that

you've said it out loud it just it makes

so much sense everyone everyone saw the

moment where it just like clicked and

gone he's like you know like you can see

the light bulb just like oh

god's gonna be watching like demonstrate

getting bricked up

like damn that floor of movement though

oh so you're telling me so you're

telling me if you affordable animate sex

scenes it's just gonna be the greatest

get the greatest greatest

the greatest fight yeah back in the 90s

you had like top animators doing hentai

yeah yeah i know i know not so much

these days but like you know back in the

day it was like we have big names you

know yeah unfortunately we have queen

bee nowadays

[Music]

but yeah like i do know that like hentai

back in the day had some like in terms

of like animation studio and animators

work on it it was like some big big

names

yeah yeah yeah soccer guy

that was the thing that was just fun

i'm a child dude the sakura and 90s

hentai is like insane

it is it's crazy yeah and now it's like

very much you know

the same kind of glossy look the same

kind of template there's less now we're

back to drawing like a frame and then

just moving it on camera like this yeah

yeah yeah i mean it's not all like that

but there's definitely

less

like

experimentation right but now you have

amateurs who are doing amazing like

like um animation work

just on their own yeah yeah yeah like uh

the one in the italian senate yeah

yeah yeah the t

some of foreign some of the most

impressive hence i work so i think we're

going like full circle we have a lot of

talent working in like just doing sex

scenes now yeah yeah yeah

you know hopefully it'll keep going that

way yeah because like i like so like

some of the most talented artists and

talented animators i've seen

um

in the porn world has been independent

and i'm just like damn what if i saw

like because normally you only get to

see like a minute or two of animation

which is of course as much as you're to

be able to see from one person right man

what if he had like an actual 30 minute

episode that like actually looks like

this that would be like insane

you know that man some money yeah yeah

right right give this man a studio right

now

give him a production

that'll be amazing yeah anyway i i don't

have anything more to ask you me neither

man i think i've been i'm i'm full i'm

full i am i'm there was so much good

food i am like enlightened i am

fulfilled right now oh one last question

okay

is hentai art yeah

okay there we go

i thought we knew this

now no one can argue on twitter

confirmed right here yeah what are they

uh where can they find you and also what

should they be looking out for

um

you can find me on twitter

you can see go to thehoots.com i have a

website there

and uh my next project aside from what

work i do for a mobile game

called time running rpg

okay

[Laughter]

i'll also be um i'm still working on a

project for comic unreal which is going

to be a fantasy

epic

wow

hell yeah

yeah well the links all those are in the

description below as always and you said

you had a patreon as well yeah

him on patreon yeah yeah what's what's

the uh

url for that patreon or username i guess

uh schindler i think yeah

yeah so links in the description hey

speaking of patreon look at our patrons

yeah

look at all these cultured individuals

right now

but yeah uh if you would like to support

the show and also uh watch the

uncensored version of this episode

because god knows we're gonna get

yeah monetization mean you know either

way if you like support the show then go

over to patreon patreon.com also follow

us on twitter send us some means on the

subreddit and if you're header face

listen to us on spotify and of course go

check out genocide stuff links in the

description yeah thanks for coming thank

you

the enlightenment was unreal

we are going to leave this office

different men

after this episode

i do feel like all the same way

[Laughter]

thank you so much

thank you for coming thank you guys

incredible episode and thank you guys

for watching yeah see you guys next time

[Music]

you