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This programme contains scenes which
some viewers may find upsetting,
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some strong language
and deals with sexual abuse.
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I really wanted to live in LA.
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I wanted to find an agency
to start modelling.
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This is the building
where the Ford agency is.
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I think it was the eighth floor.
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It's almost like I can see myself,
like, outside of my body.
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I've noticed I do that, though.
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Like, if there's, like,
some sort of trauma involved,
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I really do, like, just detach.
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APPLAUSE AND CHEERING
Jared Leto.
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He was standing...
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..to the left of those double doors.
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My mom noticed him
as we were going up the stairs.
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I kind of saw him look over.
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He hung up the phone and just, like,
walked right in behind us.
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He brought up
that he had won a major award.
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Does anybody want to try it out
for size?
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You can, if anybody wants to fondle.
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SCATTERED LAUGHTER
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Yeah, here.
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He was like, "Oh, yeah,
you're going to get signed.
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"Definitely. You're so beautiful."
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And he asked for my email
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so he can invite me and my mom
to his, like, Oscar party.
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I bet this is a first -
the first person to ever...
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..give their Oscar away for...
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..an orgy in the press room.
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SCATTERED LAUGHTER
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I was 16 at the time
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and he was 42.
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He did email me
and then, very quickly,
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it turns into this whole,
like, sexual thing on the phone,
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saying all these, like, things
that you shouldn't say to a child.
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Thank you very much
and congratulations.
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CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
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00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:05,040
I was... I was 17.
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00:02:05,040 --> 00:02:06,480
17.
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00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:08,160
As a 14-year-old girl
with a little...
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00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:09,480
..with a little crush on him.
41
00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:11,600
I was very excited
to see Jared Leto.
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00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:13,840
I think that was the first time
I ever met a celebrity.
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"Oh, my God. Do you know
who that is?! That's Jared Leto!"
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PAPARAZZI CLAMOUR
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He had invited me to his house.
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Asked me to come meet him
in his hotel.
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"Jared Leto cordially invites you
to a celebration."
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00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:30,920
Sending an invite out
to a lot of models.
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00:02:30,920 --> 00:02:34,680
I ran to the autograph table.
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00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,880
You know, most young girls saw him
very much as a heart-throb.
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00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:44,960
Wait, but...
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00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:46,480
..this is problematic.
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00:02:46,480 --> 00:02:50,080
There's a whole population
who don't know who he truly is.
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You really just chose to take
your power and abuse it.
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Alarms started going off in my head.
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"This is not what I came here for."
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"By the time I get back, I would
like your clothes to be off."
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00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:02,560
"It doesn't matter
what your age is.
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00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:04,080
"It doesn't matter
if you're underage."
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00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:06,240
And that's when I realised
he was in his early 30s.
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00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:07,960
He was 34.
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00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:09,760
He was 42 at the time.
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00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:11,280
And then he just goes,
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00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:13,440
"If you're going to sleep here,
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00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:15,640
"you're going to wake up
with a dick in your ass."
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00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:33,640
People are like, "What did you hope
to accomplish with your book?"
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00:03:33,640 --> 00:03:36,960
Two things. I want to be proud of it
and I want to not get sued.
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00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:39,000
Yeah. Touch and go there
for a little while.
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00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:42,000
OK.
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Mm-hm.
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00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:46,680
So, Jared Leto is an actor
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00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:49,000
at the very highest realms
of the industry.
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PAPARAZZI CLAMOUR
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He won an Oscar for his role
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in Dallas Buyers Club,
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00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:03,680
in which he played a trans woman.
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00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:06,320
And the Oscar
goes to...
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00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:10,520
..Jared Leto,
Dallas Buyers Club.
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00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:12,200
CHEERING
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00:04:12,200 --> 00:04:14,560
That sealed his status
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00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:16,760
as a household name
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00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:19,600
and one of the power players
in Hollywood.
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He started out
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00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:26,200
as a very well-known TV actor
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00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:28,680
in My So-Called Life.
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00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:32,080
His role, Jordan Catalano, was...
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00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,080
..the school dreamboat.
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00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,480
A generation of women -
and, I think, some men -
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00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,040
were mesmerised by those blue eyes.
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00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:46,200
He's unique, in that he's not only
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a high-profile actor,
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00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:50,080
he's also an entrepreneur.
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00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:51,800
And he's an investor.
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00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:54,760
Uber, Airbnb, Spotify, Reddit...
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I've always been entrepreneurial
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ever since I sold dope as a kid.
INTERVIEWER CHUCKLES
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Whoo!
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00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:03,160
He's associated with fashion houses,
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00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:05,600
and, also, he's a really
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00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:07,600
successful rock star,
101
00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,640
with his band
Thirty Seconds To Mars.
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# Take no more
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00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:18,560
# Take no more... #
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CHEERING
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00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:44,120
I think the first time
I ever came across Jared Leto
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00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:46,200
was watching Requiem For A Dream
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00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,160
when I was a teenager.
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I always thought you were
the most beautiful girl I ever seen.
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Really?
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00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:55,520
I thought he was incredible.
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00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:58,000
It was a film
that definitely stayed with me.
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00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:05,200
Air Mail is a digital weekly
based in New York.
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00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:09,080
It does a bit of everything.
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00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:10,520
True crime,
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00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:12,000
arts and culture.
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00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:14,560
I've also done investigative work.
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00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:22,640
I follow this DJ called Allie Teilz,
on Instagram.
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00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:27,120
In April 2025,
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00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:29,040
she posted, on her Instagram,
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00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:31,560
a screenshot of a Facebook status
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00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:33,640
she'd posted originally in 2012.
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00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:46,160
She went on to say
that she was underage,
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00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:47,600
she was 17 at the time,
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00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:49,200
and that he was aware of her age.
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She has a big following.
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00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:53,200
She has over 100,000 followers.
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00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:58,080
She started getting
a lot of responses
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00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:02,920
from women who'd had allegedly
similar experiences with Jared,
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00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,040
which she was then posting.
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00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:29,400
I was refreshing her story
every few hours,
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00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:32,960
and I was quite stunned by the
wealth of responses that she got.
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The experiences ranged
from inappropriate behaviour
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to assault.
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00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:43,680
It captured my attention and
I started looking into the story.
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00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:54,800
My name is Jessica Sartenaer.
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00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:58,280
I'm a documentary producer
and journalist.
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00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:01,800
I've been making documentaries
for nearly ten years...
138
00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:05,080
..often looking into
high-profile people.
139
00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:11,000
We saw Allie's post
and the reaction.
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00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:15,200
This is NOT something you see
every day.
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00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:18,200
If all of this was true,
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00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,040
these were allegations
on a massive scale,
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00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:24,160
about a very big player
in Hollywood.
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00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:26,600
So, we immediately
started investigating.
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00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:31,680
I spoke to some of the women
who wrote in to Allie.
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I managed to track them down.
147
00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:35,920
I was putting down the phone
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and I felt a little bit
sick to my stomach.
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00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:42,960
Among the allegations,
there was one woman,
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00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:44,360
she was 18 at the time.
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00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:47,760
She went over to his house
and he got naked
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00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:51,000
and grabbed her hand
and put it on his penis and said,
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00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:52,360
"I want you to spit on it."
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I gathered all my research,
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00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:58,280
put together the story.
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00:08:59,880 --> 00:09:01,840
Ultimately, nine women contributed.
157
00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:05,720
A lot of them were very scared,
158
00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:09,320
which is why most of them requested
anonymity.
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00:09:09,320 --> 00:09:12,440
We did send a right to reply
to Leto and his team,
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and they responded,
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expressly denying every allegation.
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The article went live.
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It was pretty much picked up
worldwide.
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The Guardian,
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00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:30,120
Italian national newspaper
Il Corriere della Sera.
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Actor and musician Jared Leto
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has been accused of sexual
misconduct and predatory behaviour.
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Allegedly...
Allegedly likes very young girls,
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teenage girls.
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00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:45,200
I saw it was reported that
Disney was holding crisis talks.
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Um, he was meant to be playing
the lead in Tron: Ares.
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I would like you to meet Ares,
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the ultimate soldier.
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00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,720
I think the crisis talks were
surrounding the marketing campaign.
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It was a big deal.
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And I really thought, you know,
"This is going to...
177
00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:04,960
"This is going to have
some real-life repercussions for...
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00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:06,600
"..for Jared."
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00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:10,800
When the Air Mail article came out,
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this was the first time
that women had gone on the record,
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alleging that they had
been sexually abused by Leto.
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We watched and waited to see
what the consequences might be.
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00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:23,720
So, as the days went on...
184
00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,360
..I was typing in
"Jared Leto allegations"
185
00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:28,960
or just googling "Jared Leto".
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00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:33,120
I started seeing other news
about him that was unrelated...
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00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:37,400
And I saw the articles
surrounding the allegations
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start to trickle off.
189
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I thought, "Oh, wow."
Like, "That's it."
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I was... I guess I was disappointed.
191
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I was disappointed
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00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:51,880
the world didn't take
my victims' allegations seriously.
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Within weeks, Leto started doing
publicity for Tron: Ares...
194
00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:04,360
We're in London
and we're super excited.
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00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:06,200
It's been a great night so far.
196
00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,560
..culminating in an appearance
on top of the Piccadilly Lights
197
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as a promotional stunt for the film.
198
00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:17,360
A really uncomfortable truth
about Hollywood is that
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there's now calculations being made
200
00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:23,320
that this is not a career-ender.
201
00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:26,240
I think that calculation got made
with Jared Leto.
202
00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:31,960
"We can quash it, we can ride it
out, we can deflect it
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00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:35,360
"and, six months from now, or,
you know, six minutes from now,
204
00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:37,440
"another story will come
down the pike
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00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:39,440
"and suck up all the oxygen
in the room."
206
00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:44,480
We were still working on our
investigation in the background.
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00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:48,880
40 women had written into Allie.
208
00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,800
Nine women had gone on the record
with Air Mail.
209
00:11:53,680 --> 00:11:55,960
So we were really asking ourselves,
210
00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:58,240
how widespread was this...
211
00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:01,640
..and how long has it
been going on for?
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00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:07,000
We started digging deeper...
213
00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:10,800
..and that's when we found Etta.
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00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:21,840
The first email,
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he just sent an image
of the invitation.
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00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:29,480
"Jared Leto cordially invites you
to a celebration."
217
00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:34,880
I said, "I thank you for the invite,
but I couldn't make it,
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00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:37,080
"even though I'm sure
it would have been fun."
219
00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:40,320
And he responded, "Text me,"
220
00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:41,880
and gave me his number.
221
00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:45,440
I didn't even consider
how weird it was
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00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:49,080
to be invited by a 42-year-old man,
at 16, to a party.
223
00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:55,760
I know, for sure, if not then,
224
00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:58,760
I did tell him a couple days
later when we were texting.
225
00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,320
We texted for a couple days
and then...
226
00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:06,040
Then, he would start mostly calling.
227
00:13:06,040 --> 00:13:07,680
PHONE VIBRATES
228
00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:13,400
He never would call me
without making it a private number.
229
00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:17,600
I think he did his best
to make sure there was no proof.
230
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Like, at first, it was, like,
you know,
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"Who did you sign with?
232
00:13:22,880 --> 00:13:24,280
"Oh, how did it go?"
233
00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:27,600
But it quickly moved into, um...
234
00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:31,720
"Oh, well, you're a virgin.
Do you have any kinks?
235
00:13:31,720 --> 00:13:33,360
"Like, what are you interested in?
236
00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,640
"Oh, can you squirt?"
237
00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:38,320
Like, he seemed very interested
in squirting.
238
00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:44,960
He did, at least once, mention
him and I having sex at some point.
239
00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,360
Um, I remember feeling,
like, nervous.
240
00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:54,000
A little anxious,
241
00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:55,640
a little uncomfortable,
242
00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:58,920
but, like, at the time,
I remember I had a really hard time,
243
00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:02,400
like, saying "no" to things
or, like, putting boundaries up.
244
00:14:06,680 --> 00:14:10,320
He asked me if he could give
my number to a friend of his.
245
00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,360
I just remember him, you know,
246
00:14:12,360 --> 00:14:15,480
telling me that
it was, like, a business thing.
247
00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:19,720
And I was like, "Yeah, sure.
Whatever. That's fine."
248
00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:24,000
This guy, he told me
his name was Christian,
249
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:25,600
he would call me a lot.
250
00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:30,680
He wanted to...
251
00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:32,840
..hire me to shoot porn.
252
00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:35,800
And he was like, "You know, it
doesn't matter if you're underage.
253
00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:37,080
"We'll work it out.
254
00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:40,000
"Like, you know, we'll get
a really nice house in the hills.
255
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:43,680
"You know, we'll have,
like, six guys in the shower,
256
00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:46,160
"and have them, like,
come all over you."
257
00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:52,080
And because he would also call me
from a private number,
258
00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:55,720
I wouldn't know, sometimes,
if it was going to be Jared or him.
259
00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:04,960
They both were really obsessed
260
00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:08,200
with mentioning the possibility
of squirting.
261
00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:11,360
Both of them, yeah.
262
00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:22,240
I think
it would not be that surprising
263
00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:24,720
if that ended up being the truth,
you know?
264
00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,000
And how old are you? You.
265
00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:57,280
17. Come here.
266
00:15:58,360 --> 00:15:59,560
Come here.
267
00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:01,960
Give me a hug, first of all.
268
00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,400
CHEERING
269
00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:09,280
LAUGHTER
270
00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:11,440
OK, you can let go now.
271
00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:15,080
What's your name? Kate.
272
00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:16,720
Kate. Where are you from?
273
00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:18,720
LA. You're from LA?
274
00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:21,520
"That's what I like
about high school girls."
275
00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:22,960
LAUGHTER
276
00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:25,880
"I keep getting older,
they just stay the same age.
277
00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:28,440
"All right, all right, all right.
278
00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:30,600
"All right, all right, all right."
279
00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:37,240
There have been allegations
swirling around Leto for decades.
280
00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:39,040
All the way back in 2005,
281
00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:41,240
there was an article
in the New York Post
282
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:44,240
alleging that Leto was approaching
283
00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:48,400
teen and underage girls
at a hotel in New York,
284
00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,440
and texting them.
285
00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:53,440
But what we were really surprised by
286
00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:56,440
was just how many allegations
actually exist online.
287
00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:01,560
I counted around 120 allegations
288
00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:04,120
relating to highly concerning
behaviour
289
00:17:04,120 --> 00:17:05,920
women said they had witnessed,
290
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:08,880
heard about
or experienced themselves,
291
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:13,160
and some of these allegations dated
right back to the early 2000s.
292
00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:30,200
OK, well, down memory lane, right?
293
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:31,680
I have a few photos here of...
294
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,160
..back in that day,
when I was a little bit younger.
295
00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:42,160
Oh, my gosh.
You guys remember pictures?!
296
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:43,680
Everything's digital now.
297
00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:45,640
There's no such thing.
298
00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:47,200
OK. This is definitely high school.
299
00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,640
I recognise my high school
that I used to go to.
300
00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:57,000
Oh, my gosh.
This is probably right around...
301
00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:59,400
Like, right around the time
when I met him.
302
00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:02,840
I look like such a baby.
303
00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:05,080
Looking back on these pictures,
it's...
304
00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:06,720
..it's so crazy to...
305
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:08,880
I mean, I look...
Yeah, I look so young.
306
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:20,080
I've always been this, like,
free spirit type of person.
307
00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:22,760
And I still, actually,
to this day, one of those
308
00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:25,480
"act first, think second", you know?
309
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:28,360
Just try things and then,
if it works out, great,
310
00:18:28,360 --> 00:18:30,200
and if it doesn't,
then now you know.
311
00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:38,560
In 2002, when I was 17,
312
00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:40,400
I had this job at Planet Hollywood
313
00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:42,040
in Las Vegas.
314
00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:43,920
I worked in the mall.
315
00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:45,840
A group of guys came in.
316
00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:47,760
One of them looked familiar.
317
00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:49,800
So, I said, "Oh, you look familiar.
318
00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:53,000
And he was like, "Well,
what high school did you go to?"
319
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:56,120
And I said, "Oh, I went to..."
You know, this high school.
320
00:18:56,120 --> 00:18:58,480
And he was like,
"Oh, no way. Me too."
321
00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,520
His friends started laughing
322
00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:02,920
and they were like,
"He didn't go to your high school."
323
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:04,520
They were like, "He's famous.
324
00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:06,680
"This is Jared Leto."
325
00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:08,320
They're coughing.
326
00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:10,680
"He has this movie coming out
called Panic Room..."
327
00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:12,560
Nobody's going to die, man!
328
00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:15,920
Will you please have the balls
to follow through with something?
329
00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:18,680
"..and we're in Vegas cos
we actually just started this band,
330
00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:20,600
"called Thirty Seconds To Mars."
331
00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:22,640
"Oh, cool." Like, "That's awesome.
332
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:24,080
"You know, you're famous."
333
00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:25,960
I still didn't know who he was,
right?
334
00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:28,040
So you were saying,
all last night, you missed it.
335
00:19:28,040 --> 00:19:30,000
So I was just showing them around
336
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:31,720
and taking them through the store,
337
00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:33,440
and it was just, you know, like a...
338
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:36,440
..you know, like a fun, casual vibe.
That's when Jared Leto was like,
339
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:38,000
"Hey, like, you seem really cool."
340
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:39,600
You know,
"Can I get your phone number?"
341
00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:41,240
Like,
"Would you like to hang out later?"
342
00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:43,160
"Yeah." You know, I'm like,
"Oh, cool."
343
00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,080
Like, he's a celebrity, right?
I'm 17.
344
00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:46,520
This is a happy fucking day.
345
00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:48,720
I think that was the first time
I ever met a celebrity.
346
00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:55,440
And so I was going to meet up
with him after work,
347
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,000
and he asked me to come meet him
in his hotel.
348
00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:01,440
It was really close to my work
349
00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:04,680
and I pulled in,
and it was this dingy motel.
350
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:08,560
I didn't think much of it.
351
00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:10,560
I just was like,
"Oh, he's still getting ready
352
00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:11,880
"and we're going to meet up there
353
00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:13,960
"and then we're going to go out
afterwards."
354
00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:17,960
So I knocked on the door, went in...
355
00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,840
..I sat on the bed and he was like,
356
00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:24,800
"Hey, yeah, I'm just going to hop
in the shower real quick.
357
00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:27,160
"Do you mind waiting?"
358
00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:30,360
And I was like, "No, of course not."
Like, "Go finish getting ready."
359
00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:41,600
Um...
360
00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:43,320
Sorry. This is where it gets hard.
361
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:49,120
Oh, sorry. I've got to, like,
get myself together.
362
00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:57,840
I was sitting on the bed waiting
for him to get ready and...
363
00:20:57,840 --> 00:20:59,320
..and he called me
364
00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:01,600
and he was like,
"Hey, like, come in here
365
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,520
"so we can talk
while I'm, you know, in the shower."
366
00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:09,240
And so I went into the bathroom.
367
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:15,000
I don't think
there was many words exchanged.
368
00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:19,800
And when he opened
the shower curtain...
369
00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:21,760
..he started kissing me.
370
00:21:23,120 --> 00:21:25,000
Uh, and then he grabbed my hand.
371
00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:28,360
I don't even know
how to say this part,
372
00:21:28,360 --> 00:21:29,960
but he grabbed my hand and he...
373
00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:33,160
..I guess, started, like,
touching himself with my hand -
374
00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:37,280
like, using my hand to, I guess,
masturbate himself with my hand.
375
00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:38,680
Um...
376
00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:41,560
..and, um...
377
00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:45,760
..alarms started going off
in my head, like,
378
00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:47,160
"What are you doing here?"
379
00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,120
Like, "This is not
what you came here for."
380
00:21:50,120 --> 00:21:51,800
And in that moment, I...
381
00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:56,640
..I definitely realised
that I was not in a great situation.
382
00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,800
You know,
I'm alone in this room and...
383
00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:04,320
Like, I didn't know
what was going to happen, right?
384
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,600
I pulled away and I was like,
"OK, I'm going to go."
385
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:11,880
He got out, put a towel on.
386
00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,520
There's a weird thing
that I-I always remembered.
387
00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,240
He looked... He went outside
and I remember he, like,
388
00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:22,280
specifically, like, looked
to the left and looked...
389
00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:25,120
Almost, like, seeing
if there was anybody around...
390
00:22:25,120 --> 00:22:27,480
..before he let me out of the room.
391
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:44,840
We didn't... We didn't have internet
in our hands, right?
392
00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:46,320
And I was at work.
393
00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:48,080
I got off work.
394
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:49,600
I met up with him.
395
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,360
And so I didn't know anything
about him till
396
00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:54,520
after everything, when I went home,
397
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:58,000
and then I looked him up on...
like, a computer, you know?
398
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,760
And that's when I realised
he was in his early 30s.
399
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:04,160
You know, I'm in my 40s now...
400
00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:06,480
..and...
401
00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:09,080
..my whole life...
402
00:23:10,360 --> 00:23:13,520
..I had viewed this event as...
403
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:16,120
..I was a stupid girl...
404
00:23:17,120 --> 00:23:20,120
..that did something stupid,
did something dumb...
405
00:23:20,120 --> 00:23:22,920
..and so this bad thing happened.
406
00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:26,520
But of course it did, because...
407
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:29,800
..I did something dumb and so...
408
00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:32,160
..it's on me.
409
00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:37,800
I don't think
I ever, till recently, ever...
410
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:41,720
..blamed him.
411
00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:43,360
I always blamed me.
412
00:23:56,360 --> 00:23:59,680
In 2005, Thirty Seconds To Mars
release an album
413
00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:01,560
called A Beautiful Lie,
414
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,680
and on that album was a song called
415
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:05,280
The Kill,
416
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,680
which was incredibly popular...
417
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:14,600
# Come break me down
418
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:16,760
# Bury me, bury me
419
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,440
# I am finished with...
420
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:25,360
# You... #
421
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:29,760
# Look in my eyes
422
00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:32,480
# You're...
Killin' me, killin' me
423
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:40,000
# I am finished with you! #
424
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,440
..and it really saw
their entry into the mainstream.
425
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,440
How are you doing, New York City?
426
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:48,200
CHEERING
427
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,840
Suddenly, Leto had access
to this huge, devoted fan base,
428
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,600
many of whom were
young teenage girls.
429
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:13,520
As a teenager, I was very much so
a punk, Goth kid.
430
00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,800
I had coloured hair,
I wore fishnets,
431
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:21,280
I wore black lipstick,
I wore black nail polish.
432
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,960
The scene was so supportive.
433
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,640
It was just a sense of...
like a community.
434
00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:33,160
The first time I ever heard
Thirty Seconds To Mars
435
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,960
was on the radio,
and I was instantly hooked.
436
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:40,080
I was literally listening
to The Kill on repeat.
437
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:47,840
I saw Thirty Seconds To Mars
at the 99X X-Mas Ball.
438
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:49,920
My mom got me tickets.
439
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:53,960
The concert was absolutely amazing.
440
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:58,800
Oh, I was in heaven
when I saw Jared Leto onstage.
441
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:00,640
As a 14-year-old girl
with a little...
442
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:02,000
..with a little crush on him.
443
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,040
So, Thirty Seconds To Mars
gets offstage.
444
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,200
CHEERING
445
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:15,040
They were allowing people
to get autographs and meet them.
446
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:19,040
I walked up to Jared Leto,
447
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,040
told him, "I'm a huge fan,"
448
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,720
and I held my shirt out
for him to sign,
449
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,880
hopefully on an arm
or maybe on the belly
450
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:32,000
and, instead, he chose to sign
my shirt across my breasts.
451
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,600
And he told me,
"You have a nice rack."
452
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:38,880
And in that timeframe,
453
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,600
he asked his bodyguard to go ahead
and take me backstage.
454
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:45,400
He didn't even ask me
if I wanted to go backstage.
455
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:47,440
He literally looked at his security
guard and said,
456
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:48,800
"Take her...take her back."
457
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:52,320
I was very short.
458
00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:55,840
I had braces.
459
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,280
It was very obvious
that I was a teenager.
460
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:03,320
My mother,
who was standing next to me,
461
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:05,280
was like, "That's my daughter.
462
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:07,080
"She's fucking 14."
463
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:10,320
And he looked at her and said,
464
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:11,960
"It's still a nice rack."
465
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:19,680
We didn't get to stay and finish
the concert.
466
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:21,320
My mom took me home.
467
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:26,520
This was not a pleasant experience
468
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:28,280
to have to go through.
469
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:31,760
You should not be touching my
breasts in any way, shape or form.
470
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:36,640
I was 14,
471
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:39,200
and that was supposed to be
a sense of community for me.
472
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,720
Things like that aren't supposed
to happen at metal shows.
473
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:43,120
I'm going to cry.
474
00:27:43,120 --> 00:27:46,240
Things like that aren't supposed
to happen when you...
475
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:49,400
..are supposed to be enjoying
yourself.
476
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:11,440
Thank you.
477
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:20,800
It really altered my life
in a real way.
478
00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:24,600
I stopped going to concerts
altogether.
479
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,880
I stopped listening
to that kind of music.
480
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:32,400
I really felt like I had been
taken advantage of.
481
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:37,480
What turns me on?
482
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,360
I would like to answer that
by asking a question.
483
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:42,000
What doesn't turn me on?
484
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:50,320
We wanted to speak to insiders
from the mid-2000s.
485
00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:52,720
So, people who had spent time
with Leto,
486
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,520
who had worked with him
in the context of his band.
487
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,800
So, we contacted
hundreds of people -
488
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:05,000
producers, crew members,
tour staff, even bandmates...
489
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:10,760
..and it was really, really hard
getting people to talk to us.
490
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:12,960
A lot of them were scared
to speak out.
491
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:14,560
Many had signed NDAs.
492
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,040
But then, eventually,
we found Simon.
493
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:22,040
I think that's him.
494
00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:26,680
Hi, Simon. Hi.
495
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,600
Jessica. Thank you so much
for coming all this way.
496
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:35,320
OK, let me introduce you to...
the lurkers over here.
497
00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:40,400
Speaking to me anonymously -
498
00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:42,800
is that for fear of repercussions?
499
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,280
I don't want to be notable in this
at all, but...
500
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:49,080
..I do want to do my part.
501
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,040
Would I want to tell my daughter...
502
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,600
..that I didn't stand up
for what was right
503
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,280
when I got an opportunity
to say something?
504
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,640
Let's talk about
Thirty Seconds To Mars.
505
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:06,360
I worked with the band
for about a decade.
506
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:10,960
Jared was generally very focused
507
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,720
and hard-working. Very demanding.
508
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,080
He had a clear vision
of what he wanted.
509
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:19,880
During one period of time,
510
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,520
they'd set up their recording
equipment in a spare room
511
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,280
in the house, with just a desk
512
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:27,280
and a few chairs,
513
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:29,080
a microphone,
514
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:31,080
a couple of packing blankets.
515
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:37,160
He would be texting with girls.
516
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:40,360
There would probably,
typically on a given day,
517
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:43,000
be about two girls
that might stop by.
518
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:48,600
It wasn't uncommon
that he would go let them in,
519
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:52,560
sort of point to a chair
for them to sit down,
520
00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:55,840
and possibly ignore them
for about 10, 15 minutes.
521
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,440
He might make a sort of rude remark.
522
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,920
Maybe it might be,
"You're a dirty girl, aren't you?"
523
00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:07,120
The feeling...
524
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:09,920
..was he was
trying to assert control,
525
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:11,960
trying to assert a sense of power.
526
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:17,600
There was one particular instance
that I clearly remember,
527
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,800
where a girl had to be dropped off
by her parents.
528
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,680
This particular girl
was very young-looking, and...
529
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:31,040
..Jared would have been
in his early 30s.
530
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,520
They took off to the bedroom.
531
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,440
When they returned,
and she wanted a photo with him
532
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,120
and she tried to give him
a kiss on the cheek,
533
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:44,640
he stopped her...
534
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:49,360
..and wanted to make sure
that the photo looked like
535
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:52,880
a sort of spontaneous
platonic meeting.
536
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:57,880
At that point, she had to contact
her parents to come pick her up.
537
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,080
Probably only an hour had gone by.
538
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:05,120
She just kind of sat there.
539
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:06,920
The feeling in the air,
540
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,040
it felt like shame
and embarrassment.
541
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:13,640
I just remember being really moved
by it.
542
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:19,680
So what did you think
543
00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:23,560
when the allegations started
to surface last year?
544
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,160
I remember reading the articles
545
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,480
and then coming across a video
546
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:35,320
that a young woman had made,
speaking of her time with Jared.
547
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:41,520
I remember her reciting some of
the things Jared would say to her.
548
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,400
There was no question about it,
549
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:46,760
she wasn't making it up.
550
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:48,640
This is his language.
551
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,680
Could you show me the video
you're talking about?
552
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:57,040
ON VIDEO: I first met him when I had
553
00:32:57,040 --> 00:33:00,160
just turned 17 and he was 33.
554
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:04,240
I met him after
a Thirty Seconds To Mars concert.
555
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:08,520
He had started to move
from just, like, flirting,
556
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:11,960
to saying things
of a more sexual nature.
557
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,440
He literally started calling me
Lolita,
558
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,040
telling me he was old enough
to be my father.
559
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:18,840
He knew I was 17.
560
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:23,560
He...did various things,
like kiss my neck,
561
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:27,680
touch my chest, take my hand,
put it on top of his pants.
562
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:29,400
One time I was backstage with him,
563
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:32,520
he grabbed my face
and made me promise
564
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:34,560
that I wasn't going to tell anyone.
565
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:43,800
Did those behaviours that she's
describing feel familiar to you?
566
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:49,480
It's uncanny, the things she says
about how he would behave with her.
567
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,240
It's upsetting. It's disturbing.
568
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:59,560
It completely brings back memories
of what I witnessed.
569
00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:14,240
His band was having a concert.
570
00:34:14,240 --> 00:34:16,360
I was with another girl.
571
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:18,920
And we were backstage.
572
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,040
I was 17.
573
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:25,160
It wasn't actually Jared Leto
who approached me.
574
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:28,760
He had sent an acquaintance of his,
probably in his 40s.
575
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,880
He was a comedian.
And he told me, you know,
576
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:34,640
"Jared's seen you
from where he is over there,
577
00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:37,320
"and he was interested
in getting your number."
578
00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:40,480
I didn't actually meet him
at that venue at that time.
579
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:41,800
That would come later.
580
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:47,000
You know, most young girls saw him
very much as a heart-throb.
581
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:49,640
You know, very handsome,
great features.
582
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:53,440
Professionally, very good at what
he did as an actor, as a singer.
583
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:55,920
He was a very magnetic person.
584
00:34:55,920 --> 00:34:59,880
At that age,
I had just been coming out of
585
00:34:59,880 --> 00:35:02,920
a really awkward time
in adolescence.
586
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:06,640
I had always been very, very shy.
Painfully shy.
587
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:09,840
I'd blush a lot,
I'd trip over my words.
588
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:11,640
It was very validating
589
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:14,480
that someone like him would be
interested in me at all.
590
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,880
So, sometime after that concert,
591
00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,400
there had been some text exchanges.
592
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:27,560
He had invited me to meet him at
a place called the Chateau Marmont,
593
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:30,480
which is right there
in the main area of Hollywood.
594
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:32,800
I had a friend with me at the time,
so he said,
595
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:34,600
"Go ahead and bring her."
596
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:38,640
It's a very kind of secluded,
upscale place where they cater to
597
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:40,840
a lot of A-list celebrities,
598
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:44,160
so it was intimidating at first
going in there.
599
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:48,880
He was at a table with friends.
600
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:52,280
He kind of waved us over,
we sat down, my friend and I,
601
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:56,680
and just having some general banter
about things.
602
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,280
We had kind of drifted
into the realm to talk about
603
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:02,880
the age of consent.
604
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,760
I had mentioned to him
that my dad was in law enforcement,
605
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:10,640
that I knew with certainty
that, here in California,
606
00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:12,680
the age of consent is 18.
607
00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:16,480
He just kind of shrugged it off like
it wasn't a huge concern for him.
608
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:20,640
And he knew at that point
that you were 17?
609
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:22,880
Oh, yes. He did know. Yeah.
610
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,280
So, after that, he had told me
611
00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:40,600
that they were
about to head back to his house.
612
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:44,480
So, we'd walked in the door
613
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:47,720
and I remember immediately,
off to the side,
614
00:36:47,720 --> 00:36:52,520
there were these two really distinct
statues from the Clockwork Orange.
615
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:54,920
And he had them...
They were two females,
616
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:58,360
and he had them arranged
in, like, a very sexual position.
617
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:02,400
He had shown us
where his bedroom was.
618
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:05,560
We had gone in,
we were sitting on the bed with him.
619
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:10,040
And so, he suggested to my friend,
620
00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:13,120
"You can wait in the computer room
while her and I hang out."
621
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:18,240
That is when things had turned
sexual,
622
00:37:18,240 --> 00:37:20,840
when my friend was
in the other room.
623
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:51,920
So there was probably, I would say,
624
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:55,320
about three or four times
that I had been to his residence.
625
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,520
There was one time in particular
where I had gone over,
626
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:01,320
I let him know that I was there.
627
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:03,480
He opened the door
and he had told me
628
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:05,880
that he was in the middle
of some sort of interview.
629
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:07,680
So he let me in the house...
630
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,680
..I went down the hallway
into his bedroom
631
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:15,880
and he had made a comment of,
632
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:18,880
"By the time I get back, I would
like your clothes to be off."
633
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:22,360
So, he had gone out,
finished the interview.
634
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:24,440
He'd come back in the room
and he said,
635
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:26,400
when he noticed
that I was undressed,
636
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,680
something to the effect
of, "Brave little girl."
637
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,920
It was this theme that he kind of
638
00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:36,880
stuck with, wanting to see me
as a younger girl.
639
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:40,840
He told me,
"I would like you to call me Daddy,"
640
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:45,240
and it was either, "and pretend to
be A little girl or MY little girl."
641
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:05,400
I had so little exposure
to anything sexual, really,
642
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:07,880
at that time as a teenager.
643
00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:10,920
Was this what, you know, is expected
644
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:13,440
when you're intimate
with somebody older?
645
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:15,760
Is this what they say,
is this what they do?
646
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,360
Just wondering if it was normal.
647
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:23,880
As time went on,
I realised more and more
648
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,120
how scary that really was,
649
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:30,800
being that age and being
so naive and vulnerable.
650
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,560
There is no well-adjusted man
in his 30s...
651
00:39:37,720 --> 00:39:41,080
..who's going to look at a teenager
and think,
652
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:44,040
you know,
"Wow, she would be a great partner."
653
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:49,880
The only reason to approach somebody
like that
654
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,280
is because of how easily manipulated
they are.
655
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,600
Let's talk about the lyrics.
656
00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:58,240
You can probably guess
which lyrics I'm going
657
00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:00,200
to pick out of Up In The Air.
I'll be...
658
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,520
Oh, I don't know. Surprise me.
659
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:05,240
"I'll wrap my hands around your neck
so tight
660
00:40:05,240 --> 00:40:06,880
"with love, love, love."
661
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:11,160
Yeah. Quite erotic. Is it?
662
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:12,800
Um, tell us a little bit more...
663
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:14,760
It's funny that you would take it
that way.
664
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:17,800
Well, tell us what the song's about,
if that's not what it is.
665
00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:20,200
Well, I think -
what is it they say? -
666
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:22,960
um, everything is about sex
667
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:24,480
except for sex.
668
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:26,280
Sex is about power.
669
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:33,640
In the late 2000s,
Jared actually took a break
670
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:37,440
from acting to focus on his band,
Thirty Seconds To Mars.
671
00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:43,200
They were really gaining
a massive fanbase across Europe.
672
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:48,360
It's from this period that
we noticed a lot of videos online
673
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:52,840
of Leto inviting young girls
up onstage.
674
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:54,960
Oh, shit, that's so crazy.
675
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:56,600
# And the story goes... #
676
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:58,320
AUDIENCE SINGS
677
00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:13,200
ON PHONE: Hello?
Oh, hi, Brad.
678
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,760
It's Jessica from the BBC.
How are you doing?
679
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:18,120
I'm good. How are you? I'm good.
680
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:23,680
Brad toured with Thirty Seconds
To Mars around this time,
681
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:25,360
and he agreed to speak with me
682
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,240
about his experience
of working with Leto.
683
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:33,080
At the time I was working for them,
684
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,800
they were a very big band, you know,
685
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:41,120
uh, headlining arenas in lots
of different countries.
686
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:44,240
What was the atmosphere like
on tour?
687
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,080
Very tense.
688
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:49,840
I've been on the road
since I was a teenager
689
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:52,960
and Jared is one of the worst people
690
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:56,760
I've ever worked for,
in any way, shape or form.
691
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:00,200
Nice to see you.
692
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:02,320
Give me a hug.
It's been a long time.
693
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:04,560
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
694
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:12,920
Good to see your face.
695
00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:14,200
We've met before.
696
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:18,680
Yeah, I remember, of course.
How could I forget?
697
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:21,160
CROWD SCREAMS
698
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:23,280
How could I ever forget?
699
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:24,720
No. I'm joking, I'm joking.
700
00:42:24,720 --> 00:42:26,360
Of course I remember you.
You're beautiful.
701
00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:32,040
Did anyone on the crew feel
uncomfortable about
702
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:35,520
the way Jared was interacting
with female fans?
703
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:42,480
No-one enjoyed watching that
or being involved in that,
704
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,240
if he ever asked anyone to get
705
00:42:44,240 --> 00:42:46,560
a phone number
or anything like that.
706
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:50,960
I think everyone thought
that the age gap was way too big.
707
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:54,200
And what sort of age range
were these girls, do you think?
708
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:55,600
Teens.
709
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,600
Yeah, you with the pink hair.
Come over here. With the pink hair.
710
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:02,000
Pink hair, pink hair,
pink hair, pink hair.
711
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,720
Pink. Pink. Pink hair.
712
00:43:04,720 --> 00:43:08,560
# Do-do-do, I
713
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:12,360
# Fell apart
714
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:16,040
# But got back up again, yeah... #
715
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:18,240
INAUDIBLE
716
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:26,360
Would he ever ask for any
of the fans to be brought backstage?
717
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:31,280
I remember
at least one or two incidents
718
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:34,240
of girls coming onstage
for the final song
719
00:43:34,240 --> 00:43:38,160
and...crew members being
instructed to,
720
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:40,040
you know, grab those girls
721
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:42,640
and invite them to come backstage
after the show.
722
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:45,920
And he would talk to them
in his dressing room
723
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:49,560
and...I couldn't tell you
what happened from there.
724
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:53,880
Was there anything else
725
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:57,000
crew members were asked to do
that made them feel uncomfortable?
726
00:43:57,000 --> 00:43:58,840
Uh, whenever they would play cities
727
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:02,760
that had a lot of modelling
agencies, like Milan
728
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:05,760
or Berlin, Paris etc,
729
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:09,360
crew members were instructed
to call up the modelling agencies
730
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:12,360
and offer free tickets
for the female models.
731
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,600
They would give all of the models
732
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:18,600
VIP passes and they would have
a room backstage for them.
733
00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:20,720
I know that people involved in that
734
00:44:20,720 --> 00:44:23,400
did not particularly enjoy
having to do that,
735
00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:26,040
because it was all...
Well, I mean,
736
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:28,880
calling up a modelling agency
and saying, "We only want
737
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:33,160
"your female models," is
a little bit uncomfortable.
738
00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:35,200
And who requested this?
739
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:38,240
That was direct from Jared.
740
00:44:43,600 --> 00:44:47,280
I moved to London in 2013.
741
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:50,560
I went to Elite Models.
742
00:44:57,320 --> 00:45:00,120
There was a manager from my agency
743
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:03,840
who told me that
Thirty Seconds To Mars had put out
744
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:06,960
an invitation that we could go
and see the show
745
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:10,720
and then there was also
a VIP meet-up afterwards
746
00:45:10,720 --> 00:45:12,400
that we could go to.
747
00:45:13,720 --> 00:45:16,120
The concert was at the O2.
748
00:45:17,240 --> 00:45:19,000
It was a good concert, I remember.
749
00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:27,560
Somehow the assistant got to me
and asked if I wanted to go
750
00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:29,760
to an afterparty
at Shoreditch House.
751
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:34,480
And I remember thinking to myself,
"I've never been there.
752
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:36,600
"I want to go.
I want to see what it is."
753
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:42,080
So we were eight people,
mostly just women, and then Jared.
754
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:49,840
I remember going to the bathroom
and when I came out,
755
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:51,920
he was standing, like,
in the corridor.
756
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:58,280
He says something and it gets me
to say, "Do you know how old I am?"
757
00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:03,560
And then he...says, "No,"
758
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:06,400
and then I lie and I say, "I'm 17."
759
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:07,960
At the time, I'm 19.
760
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:12,320
I just remember
that I felt the need to say
761
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:14,240
that I'm younger than I am.
762
00:46:14,240 --> 00:46:17,320
He said, "Age is just a number
763
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:19,960
"and, anyway, we're in Europe."
764
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:30,920
I remember speaking to the
assistant, who was saying
765
00:46:30,920 --> 00:46:34,200
that there was the next place
to go to.
766
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:37,360
It was in a hotel.
767
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:43,760
I was a bit drunk
and my phone was dying.
768
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:46,680
So I was saying,
"But I don't know where it is.
769
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:48,480
"How am I going to get there?"
770
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:53,160
She kept, like, pushing and saying,
"It's really easy.
771
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:54,680
"It's right over there."
772
00:46:56,040 --> 00:47:01,480
The assistant is a woman,
so I trusted her.
773
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:08,560
I get into the hotel room.
774
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:11,680
It's really dark.
775
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:16,040
And then I see that it's just him.
776
00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:18,240
"Weren't there supposed to be
other people?"
777
00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:21,640
And I think he just says,
"No, it's just you and I."
778
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:27,080
Then I'm sat there and saying,
"OK, well, my phone is dying,
779
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:30,560
"so I can't really get home
from here."
780
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:33,160
So I ask him
if he has a phone charger.
781
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:36,000
"No, I don't."
782
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:39,400
"OK.
I also don't have any cash left.
783
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:43,720
"Could I get some cash
to get a cab home?"
784
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:46,640
"No, I don't have any cash."
785
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:51,760
I was sat on a chaise longue
kind of thing.
786
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:55,880
So I was kind of like, thinking to
myself, "Could I just sleep here?"
787
00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:00,440
I ask him,
"Can I just sleep here, then?"
788
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:02,880
And then he just goes,
789
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,680
"If you're going to sleep here,
790
00:48:05,680 --> 00:48:08,240
"you're going to wake up
with a dick in your ass."
791
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:12,560
And I think I ask him, like,
"What did you say?"
792
00:48:12,560 --> 00:48:15,640
And he says this a few times.
"If you're going to sleep here,
793
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:18,080
"you're going to wake up
with a dick in your ass."
794
00:48:23,160 --> 00:48:26,760
At that point, I was like,
"I'm not safe here.
795
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:30,640
"OK, I need to get out."
796
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:34,760
I went to the bathroom first,
797
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:38,600
and then, from there,
I was closer to the door.
798
00:48:44,640 --> 00:48:49,960
When I got out of the hotel,
I remember being really angry.
799
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,280
I was angry at myself
for going into the hotel room.
800
00:48:59,880 --> 00:49:04,680
I came home at, I think,
six in the morning.
801
00:49:04,680 --> 00:49:06,960
I texted my then best friend.
802
00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:11,280
And she was saying,
"He was threatening sexual assault.
803
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:13,440
"You should report him."
804
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:16,920
And in my head, I was like, "Nah.
805
00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:19,240
"I put myself in that situation.
806
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:23,400
"He didn't touch me.
It was probably a misunderstanding.
807
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:25,160
"I was probably the only one."
808
00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:28,480
But I'm probably not the only one.
809
00:49:28,480 --> 00:49:31,800
And it's probably been a lot worse.
Yeah.
810
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:39,680
Do you feel like you were tricked
into going to that hotel?
811
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:43,440
Throughout this whole night,
812
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:46,640
I told the assistant all the reasons
813
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:49,960
why I shouldn't go
to the next place.
814
00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:54,160
And every time that I had an excuse
for not going,
815
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:58,480
I was getting nudged to go further.
816
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:05,520
The assistant knew what to say
to lure me into his hotel room.
817
00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:09,240
It seemed that it was planned out.
818
00:50:09,240 --> 00:50:12,280
"Never have I ever hooked up
with a fan on tour."
819
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:15,200
Oh! Really? Yeah. Yeah.
820
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:17,800
CHEERING
821
00:50:26,280 --> 00:50:28,000
How did staff feel about having
822
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:30,920
to procure women for Jared
in this way?
823
00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:35,720
BRAD: I don't think anyone
liked being involved,
824
00:50:35,720 --> 00:50:38,800
but it's also the kind of camp
where I think everyone
825
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:41,120
is slightly fearful for their job
826
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,080
and you don't want to say no
to anything.
827
00:50:46,560 --> 00:50:48,760
He's not really someone
you want to fuck with.
828
00:50:53,200 --> 00:50:55,000
SIMON: He had a lot of people around
829
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:59,120
that just were constantly jumping
through hoops
830
00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:01,960
for him and doing anything
he demanded.
831
00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:06,480
There's sort of a secret rule
832
00:51:06,480 --> 00:51:11,000
that you don't talk about what the
creative talent does in Hollywood.
833
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:16,560
There's a general sense
of just turning a blind eye.
834
00:51:20,160 --> 00:51:22,440
Not a single person spoke up.
835
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:27,880
There were not only just men
of his age, but also women.
836
00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:31,360
These dozens of people
837
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:34,960
who were travelling with him,
touring with him.
838
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:39,840
Not a single one said anything
839
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:44,760
to myself about looking out for him
or being concerned
840
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:47,320
about how young I looked
hanging around him.
841
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:48,960
Nobody said anything.
842
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:52,480
An enormous part of everything
843
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:56,320
that we're talking about is money.
844
00:51:56,320 --> 00:51:58,200
In Hollywood, in music,
845
00:51:58,200 --> 00:52:00,120
there's a superstructure.
846
00:52:00,120 --> 00:52:02,920
There's layers
and layers of people around
847
00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:07,800
the individual who are incentivised
to say and do nothing -
848
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:11,920
assistants, manager, lawyer...
849
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:18,560
..and an unfortunate reality
with these kinds of stories is
850
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:25,120
that it is not uncommon
for sources to be silenced.
851
00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:29,360
Everyone has a vested interest
in all of this going away.
852
00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:39,800
Um, it's about two years
after I met him,
853
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:42,040
I got a call from Jared.
854
00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:43,400
From what I recall,
855
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:48,840
he said his lawyer was concerned
about his relationships with women.
856
00:52:48,840 --> 00:52:51,040
Uh, he kind of, like, chuckled,
857
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:54,760
laughed at that part
and said that he...
858
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:58,800
..uh, that his lawyer wants to have
all the women in his life sign NDAs.
859
00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:04,400
I mean, I didn't feel comfortable
with it, like, right away,
860
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:06,320
but I was willing to, like,
look at it.
861
00:53:08,080 --> 00:53:12,200
It didn't just cover, like,
present and future.
862
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:15,920
It covered things that I would have
said in the past.
863
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:19,680
"Commencing on the date on which
my association with you began,
864
00:53:19,680 --> 00:53:23,280
"I hereby acknowledge and agree
that a confidential
865
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:25,920
"relationship exists
between you and me."
866
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:31,280
It didn't seem right being able
to be held liable
867
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:33,680
for something that I had done
previously,
868
00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:37,840
before I even knew
I wasn't allowed to speak about him.
869
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:41,720
It seemed like a really great way
to get sued.
870
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:44,720
I never signed it.
871
00:53:44,720 --> 00:53:47,760
I made an excuse the first time, and
then just didn't respond after that.
872
00:53:55,480 --> 00:53:58,400
How has it gotten this far
873
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:01,600
without this becoming
a larger scandal?
874
00:54:02,720 --> 00:54:07,200
People knew about it in Los Angeles
and in Hollywood.
875
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:12,200
Is it people just not wanting
876
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:14,680
to believe the allegations
about him?
877
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:18,440
Is it because they believe
what he's accused of isn't that bad?
878
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:20,520
Is it just because they've met him
879
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:24,080
and think he's charming
and fun and cool?
880
00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:27,840
Frankly, honestly, I don't get it.
881
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:33,360
Three women, after they spoke to me
for my article,
882
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:35,480
asked me to retract their testimony
883
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:38,560
because they were pursuing
legal action against him.
884
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:41,240
I'm not sure what came
of the legal action.
885
00:54:41,240 --> 00:54:45,240
I know that there's been no kind of
case in the public domain thus far.
886
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:50,560
It's been a year since
the Air Mail article was published,
887
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:54,080
and since then,
Leto has been in two major movies.
888
00:54:56,720 --> 00:55:00,240
Most recently, he played Skeletor
in Masters Of The Universe.
889
00:55:01,600 --> 00:55:04,160
Thirty Seconds To Mars
have announced
890
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:06,520
that they're going on tour in 2027.
891
00:55:08,080 --> 00:55:11,440
So we have no idea what the impact
of our investigation
892
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:14,920
is going to be because, honestly,
it seems Leto's career
893
00:55:14,920 --> 00:55:17,760
has been unaffected
by previous allegations.
894
00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:22,080
Seeing him continue
to do whatever he wants to do
895
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:25,160
and get accolades for it
is pretty infuriating,
896
00:55:25,160 --> 00:55:27,360
because he's left a trail
897
00:55:27,360 --> 00:55:30,360
of emotional destruction
for a lot of young women.
898
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:35,560
It makes me lose faith because,
like,
899
00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,360
why...why are you supporting a man
like that?
900
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:41,600
How can you support a man like that?
901
00:55:43,120 --> 00:55:46,080
So do you think he thought
that he'd get away with it?
902
00:55:47,560 --> 00:55:51,400
Well, he has. Right?
He HAS gotten away with it.
903
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:54,600
This was 25 years ago.
904
00:55:54,600 --> 00:55:57,840
Um...apparently he's been doing it.
905
00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:00,200
Apparently people know about it.
906
00:56:01,840 --> 00:56:04,560
So, by all means,
I think he has gotten away with it.
112096
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