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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:00,490 --> 00:00:05,590 On September 11th, 2001, the United States was attacked in New York City and 2 00:00:05,590 --> 00:00:06,590 Washington, D .C. 3 00:00:08,370 --> 00:00:10,190 The entire world was shocked. 4 00:00:11,510 --> 00:00:16,750 Al -Qaeda, a terrorist group in Afghanistan led by a certain bin Laden, 5 00:00:16,750 --> 00:00:18,210 responsibility for the attack. 6 00:00:18,970 --> 00:00:23,950 Just two days earlier, on September 9th, he had his only opponent assassinated. 7 00:00:24,590 --> 00:00:28,850 A local hero in the Afghan resistance, Commander Ahmad Shah Massoud. 8 00:00:29,750 --> 00:00:33,290 I remember Massoud saying, there's someone here who's very dangerous to 9 00:00:33,710 --> 00:00:34,710 It's bin Laden. 10 00:00:36,630 --> 00:00:40,570 Five months before the September 11th attacks, while on a visit to France, 11 00:00:40,650 --> 00:00:43,110 Commander Massoud had warned the rest of the world. 12 00:00:44,070 --> 00:00:49,650 He told us he only had one message for us, and it was that Osama bin Laden was 13 00:00:49,650 --> 00:00:52,430 preparing a huge strike against the United States. 14 00:00:52,970 --> 00:00:54,210 something extremely dangerous. 15 00:01:12,210 --> 00:01:15,470 Massoud's message was loud and clear, so why did no one listen? 16 00:01:17,030 --> 00:01:21,710 Was it the trade agreements or the arms sales to Pakistan that made the USA and 17 00:01:21,710 --> 00:01:23,630 other Western countries look the other way? 18 00:01:24,910 --> 00:01:29,330 Why did they refuse to help this man, the last line of defense against the 19 00:01:29,330 --> 00:01:30,610 Taliban and the terrorists? 20 00:02:15,910 --> 00:02:20,510 After ten years of war, to gain control of Afghanistan, the Soviets finally gave 21 00:02:20,510 --> 00:02:21,870 up and left in 1989. 22 00:02:24,550 --> 00:02:29,030 When Kabul's communist regime crumbled three years later, the country found 23 00:02:29,030 --> 00:02:32,370 itself in a civil war between rebels from various ethnic groups. 24 00:02:32,870 --> 00:02:35,950 Tajiks, Uzbeks, Hazaras, and Pashtuns. 25 00:02:37,210 --> 00:02:39,570 Afghanistan spiraled into total chaos. 26 00:02:40,790 --> 00:02:44,810 This ethnic civil war gave rise to a new movement, the Taliban. 27 00:02:49,100 --> 00:02:53,420 In Pashtun language, Taleb literally means a theology student. 28 00:02:53,920 --> 00:02:58,040 The Taliban are Islamic fundamentalists who study religion. 29 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:04,980 Their supreme leader was Mullah Mohammed Omar, a hardcore fundamentalist who 30 00:03:04,980 --> 00:03:09,780 welcomed into his ranks terrorists from Saudi Arabia and Yemen, al -Qaeda 31 00:03:09,780 --> 00:03:12,260 jihadists, and their leader, Osama bin Laden. 32 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:18,320 In September 1996, the Taliban seized Kabul and most of the country. 33 00:03:18,970 --> 00:03:22,290 imposing a tyrannical Islamic regime and Sharia law. 34 00:03:24,750 --> 00:03:30,770 Only one man dared resist, a Tajik from the Panjshir Valley, Commander Ahmad 35 00:03:30,770 --> 00:03:34,670 Shah Massoud, who was famous for having defeated the Red Army during the Soviet 36 00:03:34,670 --> 00:03:35,670 occupation. 37 00:03:36,390 --> 00:03:40,890 Isolated in these mountains, he led a northern alliance that struggled to 38 00:03:40,890 --> 00:03:41,890 the Taliban. 39 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:49,020 I was pretty good in school, and I went to the Sansevier Military Academy. 40 00:03:50,180 --> 00:03:55,120 I spent three great years in France's finest school, receiving a military 41 00:03:55,120 --> 00:04:00,680 education, but also learning engineering, history, and geography, the 42 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:02,980 needed to understand the modern world. 43 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:10,280 That's how I started my career as a military officer in the French Army. 44 00:04:12,180 --> 00:04:17,180 But after several disappointments, I decided to resign in 1999 and became a 45 00:04:17,180 --> 00:04:18,180 civilian again. 46 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:24,420 I thought the fight in Afghanistan with Massoud fighting the Taliban and Al 47 00:04:24,420 --> 00:04:26,100 -Qaeda was a noble cause. 48 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:29,200 So I went to Afghanistan to join the adventure. 49 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:38,020 I introduced myself to Massoud as a former French officer. 50 00:04:38,730 --> 00:04:44,330 and told him about the time I had been on a diving mission where we planted 51 00:04:44,330 --> 00:04:46,990 mines under boats and sabotaged propellers. 52 00:04:47,670 --> 00:04:50,570 And he made a joke about how the Taliban didn't have any boats. 53 00:04:50,810 --> 00:04:54,770 And then I said something that finally caught his attention, which was that I 54 00:04:54,770 --> 00:04:56,550 was a certified French commando instructor. 55 00:04:58,930 --> 00:05:02,130 It turns out that Massoud had a team of commandos. 56 00:05:02,650 --> 00:05:05,990 a group that was a mix of both young and experienced people. 57 00:05:06,310 --> 00:05:10,010 He gathered them for me at a training camp and said, You're a commando 58 00:05:10,010 --> 00:05:14,870 instructor. Here you go. Do your thing and teach them whatever you want. You 59 00:05:14,870 --> 00:05:15,870 have carte blanche. 60 00:05:17,609 --> 00:05:21,790 At that time, I think we had about 15 ,000 fighters on the various fronts. 61 00:05:22,810 --> 00:05:29,770 We were up against 10 times as many men, but we resisted. The Taliban were well 62 00:05:29,770 --> 00:05:34,250 equipped and had a lot of support from Pakistan who wanted them to take over 63 00:05:34,250 --> 00:05:35,250 country. 64 00:05:39,530 --> 00:05:44,210 Armed by Pakistan and supported by al -Qaeda fighters, the Taliban quickly 65 00:05:44,210 --> 00:05:47,050 gained control of 90 % of Afghan territory. 66 00:05:49,900 --> 00:05:54,400 In the heart of their oppressive regime, a single French representative remained 67 00:05:54,400 --> 00:05:58,760 in office in Kabul, the chargé d 'affaires Jean -Yves Berthaud. 68 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:05,600 I had a position with the United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan, or 69 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:10,360 UNSMA, which was there to try to establish peace in a country that was 70 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:12,260 completely ripped apart back then. 71 00:06:17,059 --> 00:06:22,180 I continued to do my job in Afghanistan, but I also became the sarge d 72 00:06:22,180 --> 00:06:26,580 'affaires, which roughly coincided with the Taliban unfortunately taking control 73 00:06:26,580 --> 00:06:27,580 of the country. 74 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:35,880 We were the last European country to have an embassy in Kabul. 75 00:06:38,180 --> 00:06:43,660 I will never forget one of the first diplomatic telegrams I received when I 76 00:06:43,660 --> 00:06:44,660 arrived at the ministry. 77 00:06:45,230 --> 00:06:50,130 which was the report from the newly appointed French chargé d 'affaires, 78 00:06:50,130 --> 00:06:51,570 -Yves Berthaud, in Kabul. 79 00:06:53,270 --> 00:06:57,550 It said, I arrived in Kabul this morning, and as I approached the city 80 00:06:57,710 --> 00:07:00,090 I noticed a garland hanging over the road. 81 00:07:00,470 --> 00:07:04,290 As I got closer, I saw the garland was made of hands. 82 00:07:05,090 --> 00:07:10,350 He went on to explain that punishment for theft was the loss of a hand, and 83 00:07:10,350 --> 00:07:13,550 those severed hands were hung up on display by the regime's thugs. 84 00:07:17,380 --> 00:07:21,400 Many Westerners had a false understanding of diplomacy in the 85 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:26,880 years, thinking through some sort of Western triumphalism that we only talk 86 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:27,880 people who shared our values. 87 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:29,520 And that's absurd. 88 00:07:30,340 --> 00:07:32,680 Diplomacy exists for exactly the opposite reason. 89 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:36,340 It's designed as an alternative to war for addressing conflicts. 90 00:07:36,880 --> 00:07:40,200 It's based on being open to dialogue with anyone and everyone to understand 91 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:41,200 their position. 92 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:46,020 Then you adjust the level of talks, their symbolism, the image they convey. 93 00:07:46,660 --> 00:07:50,040 But once we understood the level of control the Taliban had in Afghanistan, 94 00:07:50,300 --> 00:07:54,640 there was no way we could get involved, even if we thought we should be helping 95 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:57,360 Massoud without being in contact with the Taliban. 96 00:07:59,570 --> 00:08:04,930 The moment they arrived in Kabul in 1996, the Taliban publicly hanged ex 97 00:08:04,930 --> 00:08:09,250 -president Najibullah and his brother. It was an introduction to their barbaric 98 00:08:09,250 --> 00:08:10,410 interpretation of the Quran. 99 00:08:10,830 --> 00:08:15,090 While the religious students virtuously claim to be bringing back peace, this 100 00:08:15,090 --> 00:08:18,650 comes at a huge cost to the 17 million Afghans in the country. 101 00:08:19,210 --> 00:08:23,290 The mullah professes to be fighting vice with virtue and does so by imposing the 102 00:08:23,290 --> 00:08:26,630 most obscurantist and inhumane Islamic system on the planet. 103 00:08:28,530 --> 00:08:34,330 My name is Marui Kalmudin, and I'm currently the leader of the 104 00:08:34,330 --> 00:08:36,450 Islamic movement in Afghanistan. 105 00:08:37,510 --> 00:08:44,070 I was the Taliban's minister for the propagation of virtue and the prevention 106 00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:49,550 vice. My goal was to heavily promote virtue until all vices disappeared 107 00:08:49,550 --> 00:08:50,550 naturally. 108 00:08:51,380 --> 00:08:54,840 We never wanted to directly or brutally intervene. 109 00:08:55,140 --> 00:08:57,960 That's why we trained people, young people. 110 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:04,500 They went to the mosques in small groups to raise awareness and warn against all 111 00:09:04,500 --> 00:09:05,800 types of temptations. 112 00:09:06,580 --> 00:09:11,800 This was necessary to get uneducated people to follow Islamic precepts. 113 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:16,440 We needed to teach them to abandon their vices. 114 00:09:16,890 --> 00:09:19,190 and renounce everything that Islam prohibits. 115 00:09:21,750 --> 00:09:28,170 The Taliban delegation that we invited to Islamabad for peace 116 00:09:28,170 --> 00:09:33,350 negotiations stayed in a small guesthouse next to our offices. 117 00:09:37,130 --> 00:09:43,930 It so happened that the UN mission leader's secretary was staying 118 00:09:43,930 --> 00:09:44,970 in the same guesthouse. 119 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:53,900 She came in the next morning looking very tired because the Taliban in the 120 00:09:53,900 --> 00:09:59,420 room had been watching porn until four in the morning, and this poor lady had 121 00:09:59,420 --> 00:10:00,420 been unable to sleep. 122 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:05,240 That helped us understand that at the end of the day, the Taliban were still 123 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:10,480 human beings made of flesh and blood, and that their piety, despite what they 124 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:14,840 claimed, was not above a certain number of temptations. 125 00:10:16,140 --> 00:10:19,060 The Taliban are terrorists. 126 00:10:20,500 --> 00:10:21,680 They don't believe in peace. 127 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:25,360 Their philosophy is to create eternal war. 128 00:10:27,180 --> 00:10:32,880 They view jihad as a religious principle, an Islamic obligation that 129 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:34,160 Taliban to fight constantly. 130 00:10:35,560 --> 00:10:37,540 Otherwise, they believe they'll be lost to sin. 131 00:10:39,020 --> 00:10:44,580 They believe that jihad guarantees them entry to heaven and that God will grant 132 00:10:44,580 --> 00:10:45,580 them mercy. 133 00:10:47,949 --> 00:10:52,210 The Taliban have absolutely nothing in common with the Afghan people or Afghan 134 00:10:52,210 --> 00:10:53,210 society. 135 00:10:56,250 --> 00:11:01,710 Pakistan, backed by Western nations and an ally of the U .S., wanted to control 136 00:11:01,710 --> 00:11:07,150 Afghanistan. It was in Pakistan's Quranic schools that the Taliban were 137 00:11:07,150 --> 00:11:08,150 trained. 138 00:11:09,250 --> 00:11:11,890 Pakistan was the Taliban's major supporter. 139 00:11:15,820 --> 00:11:19,740 The Pakistanis thought it would be good to have a regime that they controlled in 140 00:11:19,740 --> 00:11:20,740 Kabul. 141 00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:26,860 But they quickly realized they didn't really control it at all. 142 00:11:28,780 --> 00:11:30,920 Sometimes their puppets were out of control. 143 00:11:32,100 --> 00:11:36,640 And in our meetings with the Pakistanis, we asked them to rein in the Taliban, 144 00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:40,540 and they said it wasn't that easy, because of course they were 145 00:11:43,190 --> 00:11:48,210 Pakistan, the historic enemy of neighboring India, had always feared 146 00:11:48,210 --> 00:11:50,130 trapped between two hostile countries. 147 00:11:50,650 --> 00:11:55,930 Trained in the US or the UK, the Pakistani officials and military leaders 148 00:11:55,930 --> 00:11:57,630 at reigning supreme over the region. 149 00:11:58,460 --> 00:12:02,020 This meant that they needed to be heavily armed, which is how they became 150 00:12:02,020 --> 00:12:03,440 preferred client of the US. 151 00:12:03,660 --> 00:12:07,900 The Americans didn't really have a counterpart in Afghanistan. 152 00:12:09,300 --> 00:12:13,240 They knew they couldn't really recognize the Taliban regime. 153 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:18,500 They couldn't be associated with it. 154 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:27,100 The American vision of Afghanistan was what was seen through Pakistani eyes. 155 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:32,880 Pakistan was an ally of the United States and told them that the Taliban 156 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:37,760 simply part of traditional Afghan culture and that they needed to accept 157 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:38,760 fact. 158 00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:43,720 Massoud was simply a panchiri, a Tajik, a group that didn't mean much and that 159 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:44,940 had never ruled Afghanistan. 160 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:48,540 They weren't a proper solution to lead the country. 161 00:12:51,460 --> 00:12:54,460 The Pakistanis didn't have a good relationship with Commander Massoud. 162 00:12:55,680 --> 00:12:59,700 They knew that Ahmed Shah Massoud would never recognize a Pakistani puppet 163 00:12:59,700 --> 00:13:00,700 government. 164 00:13:01,460 --> 00:13:05,940 The Pakistanis saw that as resistance and as direct opposition to them. It's 165 00:13:05,940 --> 00:13:10,340 true because my brother would never have accepted a pro -Pakistan government in 166 00:13:10,340 --> 00:13:14,220 Kabul, and that's the real reason why the United States never helped him, 167 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:16,220 regardless of what they claimed. 168 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:26,580 That was the context in which Europe tried to make some progress by setting 169 00:13:26,580 --> 00:13:30,340 visit with European deputies from France and Belgium. 170 00:13:31,020 --> 00:13:34,300 I remember when the parliamentary representatives visited Panjshir. 171 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:43,800 In June 2000, a European parliamentary delegation travelled to Panjshir to meet 172 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:48,340 Commander Massoud, leading the charge with General Philippe Morillon. 173 00:13:48,890 --> 00:13:53,410 who had previously served as commander of UN forces in the former Yugoslavia 174 00:13:53,410 --> 00:13:55,630 was a well -established peace advocate. 175 00:13:56,070 --> 00:13:59,990 The man who instigated the visit was a longtime friend of Commander Massoud, 176 00:14:00,170 --> 00:14:04,430 Bertrand Gallet, who sought to raise political awareness about the Afghan 177 00:14:04,430 --> 00:14:05,430 conflict. 178 00:14:24,650 --> 00:14:31,310 I think that Pakistan, I'm convinced that Pakistan's goal is 179 00:14:31,310 --> 00:14:34,510 a lot more religious in nature than it is geographical. 180 00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:42,900 whose much talked about in Afghanistan these days, was trained by the Americans 181 00:14:42,900 --> 00:14:43,900 back in the day. 182 00:14:44,300 --> 00:14:45,720 They can't deny it. 183 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:52,440 It's in that context that he took control of all the big madrasas, 184 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:53,440 Quranic schools. 185 00:14:53,900 --> 00:14:57,160 The resistance is much bigger than that. 186 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:03,420 It encompasses everyone who is Tajik, Pashtun, Hazara, and anyone else who 187 00:15:03,420 --> 00:15:04,560 understands the threat. 188 00:15:05,610 --> 00:15:06,730 They all oppose it. 189 00:15:07,530 --> 00:15:11,370 From this moment forward, all ethnicities need to unite against the 190 00:15:11,370 --> 00:15:16,470 invasion. We're living in the 21st century, and globalization is bringing 191 00:15:16,470 --> 00:15:17,470 closer together. 192 00:15:17,910 --> 00:15:22,410 No one could continue to exist in isolation without any contact from the 193 00:15:22,410 --> 00:15:24,930 outside. It's a natural phenomenon. 194 00:15:25,190 --> 00:15:29,730 With a tolerant and moderate Islam, our people can live in peace both internally 195 00:15:29,730 --> 00:15:31,690 and within the international community. 196 00:15:34,670 --> 00:15:36,430 I wore a pacol, like a local. 197 00:15:36,690 --> 00:15:40,390 I speak the language, and since I didn't use French in front of them, they 198 00:15:40,390 --> 00:15:42,710 thought I was Afghan, which suited me just fine. 199 00:15:43,330 --> 00:15:45,230 I attended a number of those meetings. 200 00:15:46,030 --> 00:15:49,710 Massoud wasn't a fool, he was sharp. What he needed, above all else, was 201 00:15:49,710 --> 00:15:50,710 military support. 202 00:15:50,910 --> 00:15:54,670 If an intellectual or a politician rallied behind him for their own 203 00:15:54,670 --> 00:15:57,130 interests, so be it. What mattered... 204 00:15:57,770 --> 00:16:03,990 was that they showed up and brought back a vision that counteracted what many 205 00:16:03,990 --> 00:16:05,790 others in Paris were thinking. 206 00:16:08,270 --> 00:16:12,590 But in the Western world, in the U .S., in Europe alike, arms dealer lobbyists 207 00:16:12,590 --> 00:16:17,070 were numerous and powerful, and Pakistan was quite the client. In that regard, 208 00:16:17,250 --> 00:16:18,250 Massoud was a problem. 209 00:16:19,740 --> 00:16:21,780 Massoud was very good. He convinced them easily. 210 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:27,100 We'll see where that leads in political terms, but I think we're slowly moving 211 00:16:27,100 --> 00:16:28,100 forward. 212 00:16:28,580 --> 00:16:32,180 A country like Afghanistan is so far removed from the current concerns of 213 00:16:32,180 --> 00:16:36,960 European parliamentary representatives, but this is how we'll get things to 214 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:38,960 evolve, through trips like this one. 215 00:16:41,140 --> 00:16:43,700 They're tedious to put together, but they're productive. 216 00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:47,620 Safe travels home. 217 00:16:48,340 --> 00:16:50,080 My heart is here with you. 218 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:53,900 So we'll be back. 219 00:16:57,560 --> 00:16:59,480 We'll be back to bring you to Paris. 220 00:17:02,540 --> 00:17:03,540 And to Washington. 221 00:17:06,060 --> 00:17:11,140 Then when Morion got back to Strasbourg, he convinced Nicole Fontaine, the 222 00:17:11,140 --> 00:17:15,160 president of the parliament, to officially invite Massoud, which had 223 00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:16,300 done by anyone anywhere. 224 00:17:17,710 --> 00:17:22,430 I think France's hands were a little tied by the relationship and economic 225 00:17:22,430 --> 00:17:25,990 connections with Pakistan, which was valuable back then. 226 00:17:27,109 --> 00:17:31,630 Of course, French intelligence services were in contact with Massoud the same 227 00:17:31,630 --> 00:17:33,030 way they were in contact with the Taliban. 228 00:17:33,290 --> 00:17:39,330 They met him regularly to ask questions about the situation, to understand how 229 00:17:39,330 --> 00:17:42,850 he saw things, and also to ask questions about al -Qaeda. 230 00:17:43,810 --> 00:17:47,350 That was the major point of interest of the French intelligence services. 231 00:17:47,910 --> 00:17:52,850 Given how Massoud had a significant network of informants in the country, he 232 00:17:52,850 --> 00:17:55,650 might learn things about bin Laden or al -Qaeda. 233 00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:58,520 and share that information with the French. 234 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:06,060 I shared military insights about the Somali plain front with French 235 00:18:06,060 --> 00:18:08,520 services with Massoud's permission. 236 00:18:08,980 --> 00:18:09,980 I was a messenger. 237 00:18:12,740 --> 00:18:18,580 The messages transmitted by Western secret services, including the CIA, were 238 00:18:18,580 --> 00:18:19,580 eventually heard. 239 00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:25,140 Still sparing Pakistan. 240 00:18:26,060 --> 00:18:29,820 The Americans decided to put pressure on the United Nations Security Council in 241 00:18:29,820 --> 00:18:30,820 New York City. 242 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:34,960 The UN voted to put sanctions in place against the Kabul regime. 243 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:36,600 The United 244 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:46,240 States 245 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:48,360 was in what I call their hyper -power phase. 246 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,640 which meant that basically any other power almost anywhere in the world had 247 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:53,900 take U .S. policies into account. 248 00:18:55,900 --> 00:18:58,260 That didn't mean they needed to agree with those policies. 249 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:02,860 In fact, the French government's position with regard to the United 250 00:19:02,860 --> 00:19:08,640 that time was to be a friend, an ally, but not necessarily aligned with them. 251 00:19:10,220 --> 00:19:12,020 The Americans found that unacceptable. 252 00:19:13,350 --> 00:19:16,930 Because they thought, if you're an ally, you have to be allied with them. 253 00:19:17,630 --> 00:19:19,050 Otherwise, you're useless. 254 00:19:19,990 --> 00:19:26,930 The moment international sanctions were put into place, I knew they 255 00:19:26,930 --> 00:19:28,850 would become even more radicalized. 256 00:19:29,970 --> 00:19:34,450 And that the moderate, who were in favor of keeping open the communication 257 00:19:34,450 --> 00:19:39,150 channels with the Western world, would essentially no longer have it their way. 258 00:19:39,870 --> 00:19:44,490 As a result, it would be the radicals who would seize power. I tried to tell 259 00:19:44,490 --> 00:19:44,989 them that. 260 00:19:44,990 --> 00:19:46,210 I tried repeatedly. 261 00:19:48,890 --> 00:19:54,030 The radicalization of the Taliban had brutal, inhumane consequences for women. 262 00:19:54,590 --> 00:19:56,450 Their rights regressed even further. 263 00:19:57,230 --> 00:20:01,610 Women were reduced to nothing, and any suspicion against a woman could lead to 264 00:20:01,610 --> 00:20:04,390 her imprisonment, beating, or even stoning. 265 00:20:06,710 --> 00:20:11,090 Thousands have come to the stadium to see a woman die, a woman whose face 266 00:20:11,090 --> 00:20:11,829 never see. 267 00:20:11,830 --> 00:20:13,850 We only know her as Zarmina. 268 00:20:14,850 --> 00:20:17,350 That's her in the middle, between the two female guards. 269 00:20:17,730 --> 00:20:20,850 The Taliban leader sentences her to death for adultery. 270 00:20:26,050 --> 00:20:28,970 Zarmina's seven children watched her execution from the stands. 271 00:20:29,230 --> 00:20:31,410 Their uncle was the one who pulled the trigger. 272 00:20:36,650 --> 00:20:39,530 Of course, the Taliban tried to provoke me. 273 00:20:41,750 --> 00:20:45,030 They couldn't resist the idea of luring me to their side. 274 00:20:47,250 --> 00:20:53,890 For example, one time they sent me a beautiful written invitation asking me 275 00:20:53,890 --> 00:20:56,030 honor them by attending a public execution. 276 00:20:57,110 --> 00:20:58,350 at Kabul Stadium. 277 00:21:00,010 --> 00:21:05,090 That really made my blood boil, and I went in person to return the invitation 278 00:21:05,090 --> 00:21:09,390 the protocol service of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, which at that point had 279 00:21:09,390 --> 00:21:11,070 been reduced to its simplest form. 280 00:21:11,970 --> 00:21:15,950 I said, take this back, I don't want to keep such an invitation, and I never 281 00:21:15,950 --> 00:21:17,930 want to receive another one like it in the future. 282 00:21:21,370 --> 00:21:22,530 Freedom for women? 283 00:21:23,110 --> 00:21:25,590 It's false to say that they had no freedom. 284 00:21:27,100 --> 00:21:28,100 They were not prisoners. 285 00:21:29,180 --> 00:21:34,980 Granted, they did not have Western freedoms, but they had Islamic, Quranic 286 00:21:34,980 --> 00:21:35,980 freedoms. 287 00:21:36,580 --> 00:21:42,160 And in our country, it's true that stoning as prescribed by Islam is 288 00:21:44,700 --> 00:21:49,160 Women are like ghosts, all shrouded in the same covering, the chedri. 289 00:21:50,030 --> 00:21:52,310 These furtive silhouettes were filmed in secret. 290 00:21:52,570 --> 00:21:55,690 In Afghanistan, one can't even look at them from behind. 291 00:21:56,010 --> 00:21:58,410 And here, even their underwear is a man's business. 292 00:22:01,110 --> 00:22:02,290 Women selling clothes? 293 00:22:02,610 --> 00:22:03,549 No way. 294 00:22:03,550 --> 00:22:04,890 Islam wouldn't allow it. 295 00:22:06,270 --> 00:22:10,630 Because of this interpretation of the Koran, in Afghanistan, women's fashion 296 00:22:10,630 --> 00:22:14,630 entirely decided by men, from the cut of the pattern to the actual models. 297 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:26,280 You know, when you own a rare pearl, you don't just leave it lying around. 298 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:29,800 You keep it safe in a beautiful box. 299 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:37,060 You find a very beautiful box and you keep it inside because it's very 300 00:22:37,820 --> 00:22:40,860 Women in Islam are like pearls. 301 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:46,800 They are valuable, much more so than they are in the Western world. 302 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:50,420 A man must serve his wife. 303 00:22:51,260 --> 00:22:53,580 I myself am a servant. 304 00:22:54,220 --> 00:22:58,880 My wife is at home along with my daughter and I serve them. 305 00:22:59,860 --> 00:23:02,740 Thanks to us, women do not have to work. 306 00:23:03,940 --> 00:23:06,460 Women's rights are protected by Islam. 307 00:23:07,620 --> 00:23:10,040 The Shadri also protects them. 308 00:23:14,700 --> 00:23:19,000 Before the Taliban arrived in Kabul, women played a major role in Afghan 309 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:20,000 society. 310 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:25,260 They held 80 % of administrative positions and a third of medical jobs. 311 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:30,480 Massoud encouraged equality and advocated women's return to public life. 312 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:37,560 Massoud believed Islam's fundamental values that give women a space and the 313 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:38,620 right to have an education. 314 00:23:40,220 --> 00:23:43,440 They fully belong in the organization of political life. 315 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:47,220 And I think Massoud pushed for those ideas. 316 00:23:48,940 --> 00:23:53,500 Women's groups came to him asking him to sign a charter for women's rights, 317 00:23:53,580 --> 00:23:54,880 which he did. 318 00:23:56,620 --> 00:24:01,500 He was fully aligned with everything they brought up. He agreed with all of 319 00:24:01,780 --> 00:24:06,260 Yet he still added a line about how these clauses had to respect Afghan 320 00:24:10,190 --> 00:24:14,510 Another indication of the Taliban's radicalization was their desire to 321 00:24:14,510 --> 00:24:16,250 all non -Islamic symbols. 322 00:24:17,730 --> 00:24:21,910 After forbidding children to play with kites, to listen to music, and to take 323 00:24:21,910 --> 00:24:25,850 photos of themselves, they now opposed looking at any work of art. 324 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:37,800 The Afghan government, with help from France and a protocol signed in 1921, 325 00:24:38,340 --> 00:24:40,740 had promoted national archaeology. 326 00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:47,920 By destroying Afghan archaeology, the Taliban wanted to prove that Afghanistan 327 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:53,080 had no culture other than that instilled by the Pakistani seminaries. 328 00:24:55,590 --> 00:25:00,030 To access these beautiful works carved in the rock, one must take tunnels that 329 00:25:00,030 --> 00:25:04,370 lead to an opening above them, where one discovers beautiful frescoes that have 330 00:25:04,370 --> 00:25:08,450 already been vandalized with a view to the country's organized art trafficking. 331 00:25:09,530 --> 00:25:14,010 This past Sunday, authorities in Kabul tried to reassure a Western diplomatic 332 00:25:14,010 --> 00:25:17,630 team who had come to investigate the destruction of artworks. 333 00:25:20,650 --> 00:25:24,810 Just two hours after our last meeting, Mullah Omar announced the decision to 334 00:25:24,810 --> 00:25:28,250 systematically destroy all anti -Islamic works. Why? 335 00:25:29,010 --> 00:25:32,270 Of course, there were obvious ideological and religious reasons. 336 00:25:33,090 --> 00:25:37,030 To them, these statues represent idols and must hence be destroyed. That's also 337 00:25:37,030 --> 00:25:38,930 a clear sign of radicalization. 338 00:25:40,550 --> 00:25:47,510 I contacted the Minister of Foreign Affairs and I told him, that if 339 00:25:47,510 --> 00:25:52,090 they did this, they needed to understand that their image would forever be 340 00:25:52,090 --> 00:25:53,090 destroyed. 341 00:25:55,950 --> 00:26:01,210 Stoning women was hard enough to swallow, but here you had something that 342 00:26:01,210 --> 00:26:04,430 been around since the fifth century and which wasn't bothering anybody. 343 00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:07,560 I said, 344 00:26:09,300 --> 00:26:12,420 look, if you're really afraid that people will come and worship these 345 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:16,660 I'm sure I can find you a company somewhere that would be willing to 346 00:26:16,660 --> 00:26:21,880 and donate curtains. You can cover the statues and just open the curtains when 347 00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:25,540 people come to observe their splendor, as opposed to worshipping them. 348 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,380 He said, what a great idea. 349 00:26:33,950 --> 00:26:35,970 and that he would relay it to Mullah Omar. 350 00:26:37,610 --> 00:26:40,190 He promised me that those Buddhas wouldn't be destroyed. 351 00:26:43,830 --> 00:26:45,330 He gave me his word. 352 00:26:52,590 --> 00:26:57,430 When you play the diplomatic game, you're faced with two types of fanatics. 353 00:26:58,550 --> 00:27:02,870 There's the one who doesn't really believe, so you can negotiate with him. 354 00:27:03,629 --> 00:27:05,610 Then there's the fanatic who really believes. 355 00:27:06,690 --> 00:27:08,250 How can you negotiate with that? 356 00:27:08,830 --> 00:27:11,570 And how can you tell one from the other? And which one would you prefer? 357 00:27:14,950 --> 00:27:19,890 I only found out what happened months later, after September 11th, from an 358 00:27:19,890 --> 00:27:20,890 Afghan friend. 359 00:27:22,360 --> 00:27:27,780 He told me the day we left Mutawakil's office, the Minister of Foreign Affairs, 360 00:27:27,980 --> 00:27:32,280 he immediately picked up the phone and called Mullah Omar in Kandahar, the 361 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:36,900 Supreme Leader of the Islamic Emirate, and told him he had given us his word, 362 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:38,040 and so on. 363 00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:48,400 It turns out that Osama bin Laden was in Mullah Omar's office 364 00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:50,540 at the time, and he said, 365 00:27:51,300 --> 00:27:53,500 Don't you think that would be an embarrassment? 366 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:58,880 These foreigners are willing to spend millions to install curtains or build a 367 00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,200 wall around the Buddhas, while our people are dying of starvation, and they 368 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:05,000 won't even lift a finger to help them. 369 00:28:06,260 --> 00:28:07,260 That's shameful. 370 00:28:09,900 --> 00:28:14,040 We need to destroy all that crap, those pieces of stone. 371 00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:19,800 And that's what happened. All of our appeals were unfortunately totally 372 00:28:21,660 --> 00:28:27,540 The Taliban's relentless destruction of the Bamiyan Buddha statues in March 2001 373 00:28:27,540 --> 00:28:33,620 was a huge shock because it revealed an extremely deep -seated way of thinking, 374 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:36,520 which is why the world reacted. 375 00:28:37,740 --> 00:28:42,440 It represented a resurgence of a way of thinking 376 00:28:43,260 --> 00:28:45,700 that we thought we were done with in our world. 377 00:28:49,460 --> 00:28:55,000 This thought that monuments and works of art from civilizations that are not our 378 00:28:55,000 --> 00:29:02,000 own carry ideological messages and pose religious dangers, which 379 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,280 is why they must be completely eradicated. 380 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:13,650 In favor of a moderate Islam, Then French Minister 381 00:29:13,650 --> 00:29:18,750 Alain Madelin took a keen interest in Afghanistan very early on and visited 382 00:29:18,750 --> 00:29:20,050 country on numerous occasions. 383 00:29:23,250 --> 00:29:28,990 I went to Panjshir to explicitly meet Massoud and spend time with him. 384 00:29:31,390 --> 00:29:34,270 He was a true force of nature, an extraordinary man. 385 00:29:36,140 --> 00:29:40,320 While I was in there, Massoud gave me a clear message, warning of the dangers 386 00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:45,420 Afghanistan presented to the world, and saying that the Afghan people needed to 387 00:29:45,420 --> 00:29:47,480 be freed from this tyrannical regime. 388 00:29:49,180 --> 00:29:51,820 I told him that he needed to come to France. 389 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,120 The Ministry of Foreign Affairs was afraid for many reasons, but the main 390 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:01,620 reason, according to one of the senior officials at the Ministry, was weapons 391 00:30:01,620 --> 00:30:03,000 negotiations with Pakistan. 392 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:05,440 We couldn't upset Pakistan. 393 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:13,620 The Ministry of Foreign Affairs didn't want him to come, which was strange 394 00:30:13,620 --> 00:30:19,180 because in reality, and for a bunch of reasons, the French military had people 395 00:30:19,180 --> 00:30:20,940 on the ground there who knew the country. 396 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:26,580 And they had a completely different opinion. 397 00:30:28,220 --> 00:30:33,620 They knew we needed to help Massoud, but their voices were snuffed out as they 398 00:30:33,620 --> 00:30:36,880 passed through military, diplomatic and government channels. 399 00:30:40,810 --> 00:30:43,990 I talked to people and offered them solutions. 400 00:30:44,830 --> 00:30:50,210 The Taliban were losing popular support, and there were Taliban commanders that 401 00:30:50,210 --> 00:30:51,710 we could have paid off. 402 00:30:53,630 --> 00:30:59,350 To these 50 commanders or so, we could have offered $40 ,000 each. 403 00:31:00,140 --> 00:31:05,140 It would have cost $2 million. If someone had just lent us $2 million, we 404 00:31:05,140 --> 00:31:11,120 have taken down an entire front, or multiple fronts, and taken back big 405 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,980 like Herat, Madari Sharif, or Jalalabad. 406 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,180 It would have been possible, but it never happened. 407 00:31:22,180 --> 00:31:27,860 In March, the French Minister for Foreign Affairs invited a Taliban 408 00:31:29,910 --> 00:31:32,430 I offered to greet them because I was curious. 409 00:31:33,610 --> 00:31:38,110 I wanted to see what they were like after having read so many horrible 410 00:31:38,110 --> 00:31:39,110 about them. 411 00:31:39,350 --> 00:31:43,630 I remember they were completely closed off. They never looked at me in the eye. 412 00:31:43,850 --> 00:31:47,470 Even when we were two feet from one another, they didn't say anything. 413 00:31:48,150 --> 00:31:52,450 But it was done, and it probably had to be done because we didn't know what was 414 00:31:52,450 --> 00:31:53,450 next. 415 00:31:55,310 --> 00:32:00,470 This March 2001 visit took place in great secrecy without any cameras or 416 00:32:00,470 --> 00:32:01,470 present. 417 00:32:01,910 --> 00:32:05,910 Diplomacy required keeping both parties happy in order to see the weapons deal 418 00:32:05,910 --> 00:32:06,950 with Pakistan through. 419 00:32:07,770 --> 00:32:12,330 Invited by the European Parliament and not France itself, Massoud made his 420 00:32:12,330 --> 00:32:13,330 stop in Paris. 421 00:32:18,090 --> 00:32:21,990 Once again, our friends at the Ministry for Foreign Affairs were quite sneaky. 422 00:32:22,770 --> 00:32:26,810 They said Jospin was busy, Chirac was busy, but the Ministry of Foreign 423 00:32:26,810 --> 00:32:29,190 could probably give him just a bit of his time. 424 00:32:31,010 --> 00:32:34,890 Simultaneously, they had the nerve to issue a press release announcing that 425 00:32:34,890 --> 00:32:38,770 Ministry of Foreign Affairs was acting as a bridge between all parties which 426 00:32:38,770 --> 00:32:40,630 naturally included the Taliban. 427 00:32:41,909 --> 00:32:46,610 We had a good discussion with Mr. Badrin, even though the meeting was 428 00:32:46,610 --> 00:32:51,910 hurried. It began over breakfast, which was followed by discussions that led to 429 00:32:51,910 --> 00:32:52,970 profound debates. 430 00:32:53,430 --> 00:32:59,950 And that was when they realized they were debating with a real leader 431 00:32:59,950 --> 00:33:02,110 who was on the same level as they were. 432 00:33:02,610 --> 00:33:08,490 I had many other meetings with Mr. Badrin after that, every time. 433 00:33:09,180 --> 00:33:12,540 He mentioned that first interview with Commander Massoud. 434 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:19,020 Before that meeting, it was obvious that they didn't trust us. 435 00:33:22,020 --> 00:33:26,860 He was ecstatic about coming to Paris and very happy to be received by the 436 00:33:26,860 --> 00:33:29,980 minister. There's a certain prestige and status attached to that. 437 00:33:30,180 --> 00:33:33,640 Then he asked if the DGSE could help more by providing weapons. 438 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:36,520 Let's be clear. 439 00:33:39,460 --> 00:33:44,360 He was trying to rally the international community to his side of the fight and 440 00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:46,320 prove that his fight was just. 441 00:33:47,020 --> 00:33:51,260 And his enemy was a serious threat, not just to him, but to everyone. 442 00:33:52,700 --> 00:33:55,000 He didn't get much out of that besides talk. 443 00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:58,780 He told me France didn't even give him a Kalashnikov cartridge. 444 00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:01,600 He made his pinky and said it in Dari. 445 00:34:06,540 --> 00:34:11,139 Five months before September 11th, Massoud came to Europe to deliver a 446 00:34:36,460 --> 00:34:40,639 Of course I saw Massoud when he came to Paris, and we had a meal together. 447 00:34:41,199 --> 00:34:44,820 Of course we talked about all these problems, and I was able to share my 448 00:34:44,820 --> 00:34:47,840 and how disappointed I was with my compatriots. 449 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:56,239 Of course I told him all about my trials and tribulations at the various NGO 450 00:34:56,239 --> 00:35:02,140 conventions in Washington, where everyone had gone out of their way to 451 00:35:02,140 --> 00:35:03,140 organizations. 452 00:35:03,420 --> 00:35:06,600 to recognize the Taliban government and cooperate with them. 453 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:14,580 I'll never forget when this official from the U .S. State Department came to 454 00:35:14,580 --> 00:35:21,540 in spring 2000 and said, listen, at the end of the day, we know that 455 00:35:21,540 --> 00:35:25,660 the Saudis are also violating human rights that we consider fundamental, but 456 00:35:25,660 --> 00:35:26,660 need to be realistic. 457 00:35:26,900 --> 00:35:30,100 We collaborate with them, so why wouldn't we recognize the Taliban? 458 00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:36,380 People met with Massoud and they listened to him. 459 00:35:37,140 --> 00:35:38,800 He spoke in France and in Europe. 460 00:35:39,500 --> 00:35:42,960 And of course there were some people who really advocated that he should be 461 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:43,960 helped. 462 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:49,160 But what you need to understand is that there were just as many people, maybe 463 00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:51,940 more influential, who believed the opposite. 464 00:35:53,420 --> 00:35:55,500 They branded Massoud as a... 465 00:35:56,260 --> 00:35:57,660 fundamentalist, like all the others. 466 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:02,740 Someone who would never have a political future in Afghanistan, and a horse it 467 00:36:02,740 --> 00:36:04,760 would be stupid to bet on. 468 00:36:22,980 --> 00:36:26,440 Welcome to the European Parliament. I'm so happy to have you here. 469 00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:31,740 His message would finally be heard and listened to. 470 00:36:36,980 --> 00:36:41,260 You all know that for a long time now, the European Parliament has been very 471 00:36:41,260 --> 00:36:45,320 concerned with the situation in Afghanistan, the serious and repeated 472 00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:50,120 infringements of fundamental rights and human dignity, the appalling situation 473 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:51,220 facing women, 474 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:56,260 the famine that threatens the country, as well as refugees. 475 00:36:57,860 --> 00:37:04,520 I would venture to say that the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddha statue 476 00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:06,320 straw that broke the camel's back, 477 00:37:07,140 --> 00:37:13,560 which confirmed beyond any doubt that the Taliban simply have no respect for 478 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:14,560 anything. 479 00:37:15,300 --> 00:37:20,400 The invitation I extended is first and foremost the political acknowledgement 480 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:22,100 what Commander Massoud represents. 481 00:37:22,300 --> 00:37:27,120 But I must also tell you that the Pakistani ambassador wrote me a letter. 482 00:37:27,580 --> 00:37:33,060 When his government had invited Khomeini, that letter 483 00:37:33,060 --> 00:37:39,600 gives me the opportunity to give a strict warning to the Pakistani 484 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:40,600 authorities. 485 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:48,080 The support that they give the Taliban is a threat to the entire region. 486 00:37:49,310 --> 00:37:56,170 And in my response to this letter, I will formally ask Pakistan to 487 00:37:56,170 --> 00:38:02,770 cease supporting a regime which, through its fanaticism and obscurantism, has 488 00:38:02,770 --> 00:38:04,690 ostracized itself from the world. 489 00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:24,580 The groups that accompany them, like Osama bin Laden and the Taliban, 490 00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:28,040 have similar ideas. 491 00:38:28,580 --> 00:38:35,560 I want to say this way that the goal of these groups is not 492 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:41,840 Afghanistan, but the first step of Afghanistan and then the exit of 493 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:42,920 And unfortunately, 494 00:38:43,860 --> 00:38:45,960 I must remind you that... 495 00:38:58,970 --> 00:39:01,070 Masoud's visit to Europe was a very good thing. 496 00:39:01,810 --> 00:39:06,110 But it was also the worst possible thing he could have done for himself. 497 00:39:06,750 --> 00:39:12,890 Because I'm pretty convinced that's what gave the enemy the idea that Masoud 498 00:39:12,890 --> 00:39:15,310 himself had to be physically eliminated. 499 00:39:16,460 --> 00:39:20,580 That idea came out of the sick minds of al -Qaeda leaders. 500 00:39:21,740 --> 00:39:26,200 To put it simply, Massoud's assassination was bin Laden's gift to 501 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:33,520 I had noticed the fanatic radicalization of the Taliban. 502 00:39:35,980 --> 00:39:41,300 But I didn't really understand how much influence bin Laden had at the time. Bin 503 00:39:41,300 --> 00:39:48,180 Laden had married one of his own sons to one of 504 00:39:48,180 --> 00:39:49,320 Mullah Omar's daughters. 505 00:39:52,740 --> 00:39:59,560 That meant their relationship had become familial and dynastic, which 506 00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:00,640 posed a lot of problems. 507 00:40:02,460 --> 00:40:06,440 It was a gift to Mullah Omar in the sense that it gave him the last little 508 00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:07,760 of Afghanistan he was missing. 509 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:13,500 Assassinating Massoud meant he could launch a massive operation to conquer 510 00:40:13,500 --> 00:40:17,780 Panjshir and the entire northeast, ruling over the entire country. 511 00:40:20,420 --> 00:40:24,480 All of this without bin Laden having to share what he was planning in the US. 512 00:40:28,090 --> 00:40:34,070 Al -Qaeda thought that one of Massoud's weaknesses was 513 00:40:34,070 --> 00:40:40,370 his willingness to accept visits from journalists and politicians. 514 00:40:40,750 --> 00:40:46,370 So they decided to use that as a way to get close to him. They can go in 515 00:40:46,370 --> 00:40:50,410 pretending to be journalists with a camera or batteries that were filled 516 00:40:50,410 --> 00:40:51,410 explosives. 517 00:41:08,590 --> 00:41:14,050 On September 9th, 2001, two al -Qaeda kamikazes met with Commander Massoud. 518 00:41:14,770 --> 00:41:19,770 The two terrorists pretended to be journalists working for Arab media 519 00:41:32,110 --> 00:41:36,880 Fahim Dashti, one of Massoud's loyal lieutenants, is one of the only two 520 00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:38,300 witnesses still alive today. 521 00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:49,240 It's always hard for me to talk about what happened on September 9th, 2001. 522 00:41:50,940 --> 00:41:54,860 It always brings back terrible memories, the worst of my life. 523 00:41:58,100 --> 00:42:03,980 It was around 8 or 8 .30 in the morning when I came out of my room. 524 00:42:04,430 --> 00:42:06,810 I asked where those Arab journalists had gone. 525 00:42:09,390 --> 00:42:14,030 Someone told me they had already gone to the commander's headquarters to 526 00:42:14,030 --> 00:42:15,030 interview him. 527 00:42:17,790 --> 00:42:21,430 Part of our work back then as a Mujahideen was to record videos. 528 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,820 So I grabbed my camera and headed to the commander's headquarters. 529 00:42:26,540 --> 00:42:29,880 Before they started the interview, the commander asked them to share what 530 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:31,300 questions they were planning to ask. 531 00:42:32,760 --> 00:42:37,200 The Arab sitting next to the commander listed a dozen or so questions, mostly 532 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:42,000 about al -Qaeda, the Taliban, bin Laden, Pakistan, the war. 533 00:42:44,580 --> 00:42:46,540 It was always the same questions back then. 534 00:42:49,580 --> 00:42:54,480 When I sensed the interview was about to begin, I sat in a chair beside them and 535 00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:55,960 prepared my camera to film. 536 00:42:59,060 --> 00:43:02,260 I was suddenly blinded by a very strong yellow light. 537 00:43:04,020 --> 00:43:09,860 My eyes closed instinctively, and then I realized that I was burned and wounded. 538 00:43:12,170 --> 00:43:16,630 Since I had been setting up my camera, the first thing I thought was there had 539 00:43:16,630 --> 00:43:19,630 to have been a short circuit and that it had exploded in my face. 540 00:43:23,090 --> 00:43:27,830 I managed to open my eyes and I saw there was dust and smoke everywhere and 541 00:43:27,830 --> 00:43:29,230 the windows had been blown out. 542 00:43:30,930 --> 00:43:34,770 Two people carried the commander from the room with his pachol covering his 543 00:43:34,770 --> 00:43:35,770 face. 544 00:43:37,830 --> 00:43:41,790 He had injuries to his head and legs, but most seriously to his chest. 545 00:43:44,630 --> 00:43:51,530 When Commander Massoud was killed, for the first time in my life, I realized 546 00:43:51,530 --> 00:43:55,770 what a great responsibility that man had been carrying up until that point. 547 00:43:57,870 --> 00:43:59,250 Everything depended on him. 548 00:44:01,150 --> 00:44:05,470 Millions of us felt it, and we weren't strong enough to carry the weight of 549 00:44:05,470 --> 00:44:06,470 responsibility. 550 00:44:10,290 --> 00:44:15,630 I once read a sentence in a book that said, Woe betide a nation in need of 551 00:44:15,630 --> 00:44:20,100 heroes. And back when the commander was still alive, I thought that that author 552 00:44:20,100 --> 00:44:21,100 was stupid. 553 00:44:21,140 --> 00:44:23,800 He didn't understand that it was great to have a hero. 554 00:44:24,420 --> 00:44:25,640 One should be so lucky. 555 00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:30,840 But when Massoud died, I finally understood what the author was trying to 556 00:44:31,980 --> 00:44:37,260 What he meant was that it's so sad when people need a hero, because when that 557 00:44:37,260 --> 00:44:39,620 hero disappears, all is lost. 558 00:44:52,720 --> 00:44:58,840 Two days after Massoud's assassination, on Tuesday, September 11, 2001, at 8 .45 559 00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:03,600 a .m., an airliner crashed into the North Tower of the World Trade Center in 560 00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:09,160 York. Just 18 minutes later, a second plane hit the South Tower. Then a third 561 00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:13,280 crashed into the Pentagon in Washington, D .C., and a fourth in Pennsylvania. 562 00:45:13,980 --> 00:45:16,740 It was the worst terrorist attack in human history. 563 00:45:20,660 --> 00:45:22,640 The two events are closely connected. 564 00:45:23,020 --> 00:45:27,880 Before the attacks on September 11th, al -Qaeda wanted to eradicate the leader 565 00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:32,160 of the resistance so there would be no more opposition to the Taliban in 566 00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:33,160 Afghanistan. 567 00:45:34,660 --> 00:45:38,560 Yes, bin Laden understood that Massoud was his enemy for sure. 568 00:45:41,810 --> 00:45:45,350 Perhaps he had thought that after the attack on the Twin Towers, there would 569 00:45:45,350 --> 00:45:46,710 a crackdown on Afghanistan. 570 00:45:48,790 --> 00:45:53,630 And if such retaliations occurred, he needed to ensure Massoud was gone, 571 00:45:53,630 --> 00:45:56,030 he represented the main danger against him. 572 00:45:58,370 --> 00:46:01,850 The rest would work itself out, but the connection between the two events is 573 00:46:01,850 --> 00:46:02,990 absolutely obvious. 574 00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:13,060 After September 11th, the United States went after public enemy number one, 575 00:46:13,180 --> 00:46:14,180 Osama bin Laden. 576 00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:16,860 They took military action in Afghanistan. 577 00:46:18,620 --> 00:46:22,340 Helped by the Americans, the troops of the late Commander Massoud liberated 578 00:46:22,340 --> 00:46:24,300 Kabul in November 2001. 579 00:46:25,980 --> 00:46:29,400 The Taliban's departure was a relief to the local population. 580 00:46:30,420 --> 00:46:32,940 I shaved, says the man. There's no more Taliban. 581 00:46:35,940 --> 00:46:40,280 This al -Qaeda command center shows clear signs of its occupants' hurried 582 00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:44,060 departure. But the most surprising thing of all was found in the basement. 583 00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:50,120 A dozen brand -new Milan -type anti -tank missiles, weapons manufactured in 584 00:46:50,120 --> 00:46:54,120 France and abundantly sold to the United Arab Emirates and Pakistan. 585 00:46:55,340 --> 00:47:02,280 In the Western world, the discovery of this arsenal almost 586 00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:03,280 went unnoticed. 587 00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:08,180 Only one person was surprised and dared raise the issue of certain dealings with 588 00:47:08,180 --> 00:47:12,180 Pakistan. I yield the floor to Mr. Alan Madland, the first speaker. 589 00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:18,120 Today, Kabul has been liberated. The Taliban have been chased out, and I'm 590 00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:22,060 first to rejoice because for a very long time, I've had the feeling that very 591 00:47:22,060 --> 00:47:26,340 few of us were ready to denounce the blind eye that France and the world's 592 00:47:26,340 --> 00:47:30,180 democracies turned towards the oppression of the Afghan people under 593 00:47:30,180 --> 00:47:31,400 criminal Taliban regime. 594 00:47:35,399 --> 00:47:41,600 Mr. Prime Minister, perhaps you can enlighten us as to the origin of the 595 00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:48,440 Milan missiles that were just found in the Taliban's deserted arsenals in 596 00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:49,440 Kabul. 597 00:47:50,980 --> 00:47:56,040 By answering you would at least partially explain the French 598 00:47:56,040 --> 00:48:00,240 ambiguous position, because never once, Mr. 599 00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:01,440 Prime Minister, 600 00:48:02,650 --> 00:48:07,150 Did you say that Afghanistan should be free of the Taliban regime? 601 00:48:07,950 --> 00:48:11,270 Taliban? You've never even said the word a single time. 602 00:48:12,610 --> 00:48:17,050 I wanted him to explain where those French military Milan missiles were 603 00:48:17,050 --> 00:48:21,570 from, the wire -guided Milan missiles that had been found in the Taliban's 604 00:48:21,570 --> 00:48:22,570 arsenals in Kabul. 605 00:48:26,150 --> 00:48:27,990 He never answered. 606 00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:34,580 Anyway, I'm not saying France delivered Milan missiles directly to the Taliban. 607 00:48:34,980 --> 00:48:36,260 That's highly unlikely. 608 00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:42,480 That said, it might have been via a country like Pakistan or some other 609 00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:46,080 that somehow these missiles ended up in the Taliban's arsenal. 610 00:48:53,660 --> 00:48:57,580 Massoud remains a living legend to its multi -ethnic and multicultural 611 00:48:57,580 --> 00:48:58,580 population. 612 00:48:59,620 --> 00:49:04,520 But Afghanistan is still threatened by terrorists that coexist with the 613 00:49:05,020 --> 00:49:08,020 And the Taliban continue to be supported by Pakistan. 614 00:49:08,720 --> 00:49:14,140 In this context, Massoud's heritage is a source of inspiration and hope, a hope 615 00:49:14,140 --> 00:49:18,100 that lives on through the political arrival of the commander's only son, 616 00:49:18,380 --> 00:49:20,680 who is following the footsteps of his father. 617 00:49:21,240 --> 00:49:25,080 and embody the new front against the Taliban and international terrorism. 618 00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:31,540 Well, before the collapse of the New York Towers, the oppressed people of 619 00:49:31,540 --> 00:49:34,940 Afghanistan were the first victims of terrorism and its brutality. 620 00:49:37,660 --> 00:49:41,840 If we consider how much of the world's attention we have now, 621 00:49:42,580 --> 00:49:49,180 if even 1 % of that attention had existed in my father's days, the enemy 622 00:49:49,180 --> 00:49:51,720 have been chased out of Afghanistan in a week or two. 623 00:49:55,020 --> 00:49:56,020 No more terrorism. 624 00:49:57,100 --> 00:50:02,720 As long as Pakistan still wants to control Afghanistan, there will never be 625 00:50:02,720 --> 00:50:05,340 peace in the region and the war will continue. 626 00:50:05,800 --> 00:50:10,840 Only when Pakistan ceases to support terrorism, when the leaders of Pakistan 627 00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:15,420 change their policies with regard to Afghanistan, will the region stabilize 628 00:50:15,420 --> 00:50:17,460 find its way on the road to peace. 629 00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:21,200 Pakistan could then develop and so could Afghanistan. 630 00:50:32,080 --> 00:50:35,040 My biggest regret is my own personal failure. 631 00:50:38,500 --> 00:50:43,160 I think that Massoud, I think he counted on me at least a little bit. He counted 632 00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:44,620 on me to relay his message. 633 00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:48,960 Yes, it didn't work. 634 00:50:50,040 --> 00:50:52,680 So it's a personal failure on my part. 635 00:50:54,500 --> 00:50:58,800 That said, the collective failure is even more consequential than my personal 636 00:50:58,800 --> 00:50:59,800 failure. 637 00:51:01,140 --> 00:51:03,300 Massoud's image remains untarnished. 638 00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:09,320 It's an image that isn't exactly what his supporters in Paris thought, but he 639 00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:12,640 was still a strong figure, even if he was a warlord. 640 00:51:14,220 --> 00:51:16,520 I guess he never got a chance to disappoint us. 641 00:51:18,420 --> 00:51:19,760 He died too soon for that. 642 00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:25,620 It all happened like a great tragedy. 643 00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:30,760 Total disaster for Afghanistan. 644 00:51:33,580 --> 00:51:36,360 We let the chips fall where they may. 645 00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:43,460 And no matter how much of a fight we put up, things took 646 00:51:43,460 --> 00:51:44,560 a turn for the worse. 647 00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:47,120 And that's still the case. 58173

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