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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:05,680 This programme contains some strong language. 2 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:11,800 # Something happened on the day he died 3 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:15,640 # Spirit rose a metre and stepped aside 4 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:18,760 # Somebody else took his place 5 00:00:18,760 --> 00:00:21,200 # And bravely cried... # 6 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:24,840 Always remember that the reason that you initially started working 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:28,080 was that there was something inside yourself that you felt 8 00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:30,320 that if you could manifest it in some way, 9 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:33,040 you would understand more about yourself 10 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:35,920 and how you coexist with the rest of society. 11 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:40,400 # How many times does an angel fall? 12 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,800 # How many people lie instead of talking tall?... # 13 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:49,520 People have either really accepted what I do or they absolutely 14 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:53,600 sort of push it away from them. I guess that's what I am, you know? 15 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:55,880 But I would love to feel that what I did 16 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,280 actually changed the fabric of music. 17 00:01:09,320 --> 00:01:12,560 Even though I seem to superficially change such a lot, 18 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:14,720 a style does come through. 19 00:01:17,960 --> 00:01:21,000 By virtue of the fact that I'm getting older, 20 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:24,000 it's given me quite a scope on what I can draw from 21 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:26,160 within my own catalogue of albums. 22 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:40,400 # Look up here 23 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:41,800 # I'm in heaven 24 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:46,920 # I've got scars that can't be seen... # 25 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,160 Hello, hello, hello! 26 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,960 # It's your lucky day!... # 27 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:11,440 # Where are we now? Where are we now?... # 28 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:15,320 I think that David's music is totally autobiographical. 29 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:19,280 He's telling you everything if you just know what to look for. 30 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:25,240 # The moment you know You know, you know... # 31 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:27,880 He was a kind of provocateur. 32 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,360 # Where in the fuck did Monday go? # 33 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:34,440 He offered an alternative to people. 34 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:38,080 And that, to me, is a great artist, you know, 35 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:42,280 someone who can offer that for generations to come. 36 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:48,240 This is one human being who has single-handedly changed 37 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,200 basically the course of my life. 38 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:52,920 And you can't say that about most people. 39 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,240 # Loving the alien... # 40 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:06,760 # Watch that man 41 00:03:07,920 --> 00:03:10,920 # Oh, honey, watch that man... # 42 00:03:10,920 --> 00:03:14,320 # Blue, blue, electric blue That's the colour of my room... # 43 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,920 # I'm looking for a vehicle I'm looking for a ride 44 00:03:17,920 --> 00:03:21,640 # I'm looking for a party I'm looking for a side... # 45 00:03:21,640 --> 00:03:24,440 # We can be heroes 46 00:03:25,640 --> 00:03:27,800 # Just for one day. # 47 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:33,560 CHEERING 48 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,400 I had this poetic, romantic, kind of juvenile idea 49 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:46,240 that I would be dead by 30. 50 00:03:46,240 --> 00:03:50,840 Suddenly you're 30 and you're 40, then you're 50 and 57 and all that, 51 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:54,280 and it's a new land, you know, I pioneer. 52 00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:56,560 # You've got your mother in a whirl 53 00:03:57,800 --> 00:04:00,800 # She's not sure if you're a boy or girl 54 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:05,000 # Hey, baby, your hair's all right 55 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:08,160 # Hey, baby, let's stay out tonight... # 56 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:11,200 - It's a big tour you're starting, isn't it? - Yes, it's going to go on 57 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:13,560 for months and months, but I think we're up for it. 58 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:15,520 How do you feel right now? 59 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:17,520 Pretty relaxed, you know. 60 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:22,360 I enjoy the songs a lot, so I'm going to have a good time. 61 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:29,560 I'm going to be honest with you, 62 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:31,600 the happiest I've ever seen that man 63 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,480 in 42 years that I've spent 64 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:35,920 on and off with him, was that tour. 65 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:38,320 I'd never seen him like that before. 66 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:40,640 - You! - # Rebel, rebel 67 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:42,320 # You've torn your dress 68 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:45,920 - # Rebel, rebel - Your face is a mess 69 00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:50,160 - # Rebel, rebel - How could they know? 70 00:04:51,280 --> 00:04:54,920 - # Hot tramp, I love you so... # - You bet! 71 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:58,880 At a certain time in your life, you get to a point where 72 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:00,800 you do feel freer and you don't 73 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:02,760 really care what people think 74 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:04,160 and you can be yourself 75 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:05,600 and you can laugh at things 76 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:08,320 and you can not take things maybe so seriously. 77 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:12,680 # Hey, baby, let's stay out tonight... # 78 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:15,080 When it came to the Reality tour 79 00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:18,160 I think he had decided that he was going to take down 80 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:22,480 that kind of screen, if you like, and be David Bowie. 81 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:24,280 Not in a cheesy way, 82 00:05:24,280 --> 00:05:27,920 but he allowed more access to himself. 83 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:32,120 On guitar, from Dublin, fair city, Gerry Leonard. 84 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:34,400 CHEERING 85 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,200 Actually, he's from Tunbridge Wells, 86 00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:40,040 but it always gets a good applause when I say that. 87 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:43,920 I'm not really very keen to put on much of a theatrical show, you know, 88 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:47,800 in terms of big sets and elephants and fireworks and things like that. 89 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:50,680 But of course, it doesn't mean that I won't go back on my word 90 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:53,600 because that's part and parcel of what I do for you. 91 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:57,280 It's part of my entertaining factor, is lying to you. 92 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,320 His sense of humour was on. 93 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:05,120 He always had one anyway, 94 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,640 but publicly he didn't show it as much, you know what I mean? 95 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:13,160 There was that serious artist thing going on, you know, 96 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:15,080 during some of the tours. 97 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:17,880 The Reality tour wasn't like that because there were some nights 98 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:19,960 I was falling down laughing at some of the shit 99 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:21,800 that he would say or do or that happened. 100 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:24,560 These must be albums that nobody ever bought, 101 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:27,520 - so they're going real cheap. - Did you see the guy last night? 102 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:29,600 They've got Lodger and Tin Machine... That figures. 103 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,240 We're that some truck stop up in Montana 104 00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:34,560 and I'm at...you know those machines 105 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:37,320 that you never win at, or you put in the quarter 106 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:40,600 and then the claw comes down and picks up the stuffed animal? 107 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:43,920 THEY CHEER 108 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:46,720 I do it and I actually get the thing out. 109 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:48,440 And it's the two of us, 110 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,760 it's this competition of who's going to get the stuffed animal. 111 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:55,680 I think it's a kind of a 50-50 thing. So I'll take that one. 112 00:06:55,680 --> 00:07:00,200 That's just not the David that I had known in earlier years. 113 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:02,720 That's brilliant. 114 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:04,880 Some of the fun and games that were going on, 115 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:07,920 I think that really was who he was, you know. 116 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:09,160 There you go. 117 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:11,960 The real David was the one that you saw 118 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,320 at the time of the Reality tour. 119 00:07:14,320 --> 00:07:17,360 He was always funny, he always had a funny sense of humour. 120 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:20,440 He was always joking about things. 121 00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:24,440 De-de-de-de-de! 122 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:28,480 LAUGHTER 123 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:30,800 There was a sense that David looked 124 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:34,040 as young and as youthful as ever on that tour. 125 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:39,440 It did seem like he had the gift from the gods, you know, 126 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:42,160 that he was never going to get old. 127 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:48,280 # Never ever gonna get old. # 128 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:56,160 It's a lie, but it's only a little lie. 129 00:07:56,160 --> 00:08:01,080 He looked so good and youthful at the same time. 130 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:03,360 And one night I said, 131 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:05,600 "You look really good in that suit." 132 00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:08,040 And for some reason, the way I said it, 133 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:10,400 he said, "I'm happily married." 134 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:16,960 So I didn't realise how I was saying that, but, yeah, 135 00:08:16,960 --> 00:08:19,040 he just looked great... 136 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:20,640 all the time. 137 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:26,160 # Billy rapped all night about his suicide 138 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:29,400 # How he'd kick it in the head when he was 25 139 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:32,440 # Just speed jive 140 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:35,160 # Don't want to stay alive when you're 25... # 141 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:39,200 Playing All The Young Dudes, that's just such an anthem, really, 142 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:41,840 in a way, it was almost like church, you know, 143 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:45,920 when you really do feel like you have this congregation of people 144 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:49,600 and everyone's singing and the whole place is swinging. 145 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:51,240 # All the young dudes... # 146 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:52,720 Yeah, you at the back. 147 00:08:52,720 --> 00:08:55,000 # Carry the news... # 148 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:57,720 In the St George T-shirt. 149 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:01,120 # Carry the news... # 150 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:08,600 It was just an incredible connection to the audience, I think, 151 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:11,560 for that show, for pretty much the whole show. 152 00:09:12,680 --> 00:09:15,440 # Carry the news... # 153 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:20,480 He just got into tunnel vision, 154 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:23,160 like he was going to make this not just successful, 155 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:25,000 but just be prepared to play it 156 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:27,600 because there was a lot of music every night. 157 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:31,880 We were doing two-and-a-half-hour sets. 158 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:37,120 And, you know, you have to really be physically capable to handle that. 159 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:47,680 Going on tour excited him very much, 160 00:09:47,680 --> 00:09:51,240 but he said to me, flat out, "I'm tired." 161 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:55,920 So I think he fulfilled all his wishes and dreams 162 00:09:55,920 --> 00:10:00,160 and maybe he got a little oversaturated in touring. 163 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:12,280 We got to Prague, and then during the show, 164 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:16,200 David was sweating profusely 165 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:18,600 and unable to sing. 166 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:21,280 And then he started to hunch over. 167 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,000 He looked over, and I looked over at him, 168 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:26,760 and I went, "There's something really wrong." 169 00:10:26,760 --> 00:10:29,520 And I signalled to his floor manager 170 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:31,320 and I went, "Boy, you're not OK." 171 00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:34,880 The security person ran out and took him off the stage, 172 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:36,360 just took him away. 173 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:39,240 It was a little mysterious to everybody as to what it might be 174 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:41,560 because it really did come out of the blue. 175 00:10:41,560 --> 00:10:43,920 I was just thinking, OK, he's seen the doctor, 176 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:46,320 maybe they've given him a shot or whatever. 177 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:49,520 Then we got ready to go to the Hurricane Festival. 178 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:55,040 We leave this one for you, for me, for my band, for all our families. 179 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:56,560 Thanks very much. 180 00:10:56,560 --> 00:11:00,000 We played the entire set and it seemed, you know, normal, 181 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,840 not quite as energetic, 182 00:11:02,840 --> 00:11:06,720 and as charged as the performances before. 183 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,280 # But I'll drink all the time 184 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:18,000 # Cos we're lovers 185 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:22,200 # That is a fact 186 00:11:24,680 --> 00:11:26,880 # Yes, we're lovers... # 187 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:28,400 We finished the show... 188 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,560 ..and then it seemed like David was in a lot of pain, 189 00:11:32,560 --> 00:11:34,800 and obviously something was wrong. 190 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:38,040 They sent an ambulance and took him away. 191 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,440 We went back in the vans with the band 192 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:43,200 and he went off in an ambulance that night. 193 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:47,680 I think we were told that he'd had a mild heart attack 194 00:11:47,680 --> 00:11:50,120 and that his life wasn't in danger, 195 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:52,360 but that was it, we were going home. 196 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,400 He said he wasn't going to work for a while 197 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:13,400 and he wasn't sure if you'd ever record again or tour again. 198 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:15,560 He just wanted to take time off. 199 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,360 CAR HORNS BLARE 200 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:27,440 I think any kind of unexpected thing like a heart attack, 201 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:32,800 it makes you re-evaluate things, but I never thought he'd stop working. 202 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,960 We would exchange e-mails about things that were interesting 203 00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:43,720 to each or relevant, but it wasn't a lot of contact. 204 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:49,160 It's hard to figure out David, you know, 205 00:12:49,160 --> 00:12:51,760 and I stopped trying to figure him out. 206 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:56,000 Just hoped the phone would ring or get an e-mail from him. 207 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:57,600 And I did. 208 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,000 BAND REHEARSE 209 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:35,880 Having not heard from him for a while, I suddenly got an e-mail 210 00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:38,960 to see if I was available to come and play on the album. 211 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:43,560 I received then an e-mail from the management about the fact 212 00:13:43,560 --> 00:13:47,680 that IF I was going to do this, it would have to be secret. 213 00:13:47,680 --> 00:13:53,760 And if I said anything about it, I would be in big trouble...legally. 214 00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:59,680 I got an e-mail really out of the blue from David. 215 00:13:59,680 --> 00:14:04,720 Do you want to come and work on some new songs for a week? 216 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,200 PS, keep shtoom. 217 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:12,280 Once we got to the studio, 218 00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:13,880 one of the first things he did 219 00:14:13,880 --> 00:14:15,720 was hand out NDAs to everybody, 220 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:17,040 these papers to sign. 221 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:18,440 It was the first time 222 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:21,040 I'd ever been asked to do something like that for him. 223 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:25,240 The hours were very short compared to normal. 224 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:27,240 By six o'clock that was it, no matter what. 225 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:29,520 And some days even earlier than that. 226 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:33,640 That was not the David Bowie that I ever worked with before, 227 00:14:33,640 --> 00:14:35,480 ever, I'd never seen that. 228 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:40,720 He would go in there and stay there until he was spent or done. 229 00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:46,040 But this was like, "I'm leaving, six o'clock. See ya." 230 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,440 He really wanted no pressure on him to release an album. 231 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:56,600 There was no press release saying expect a Bowie album on this date. 232 00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:00,600 This way, he could finish every song to perfection. 233 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:13,400 I'm much more interested in the process of life 234 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:17,360 and what is it that we're uncovering with our every move. 235 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:21,000 The celebrity side of it, I couldn't give a sausage. 236 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:38,840 # The stars are never sleeping 237 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:43,440 # Ooh-hoo-ooh-hoo, ooh-hoo-ooh-hoo 238 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:46,160 # Dead ones and the living 239 00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:50,200 # We live closer to the Earth 240 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:53,560 # Never to the heavens 241 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,840 # The stars are never far away 242 00:15:56,840 --> 00:15:59,720 # Stars are out tonight... # 243 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:00,880 - WOMANS VOICE: - David. 244 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:04,360 David, give me a wave. 245 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:08,120 The Stars (Are Out Tonight), the song, 246 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:11,120 is about David's attitude towards celebrities. 247 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,000 He's had a good dose of other people's celebrity, 248 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:15,640 which he found distasteful. 249 00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:21,800 He had different things on his mind he'd been ruminating over 250 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:23,640 and it was all coming out now, 251 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:28,440 it was like he was birthing this stuff. 252 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:29,880 He was trying a lot of things, 253 00:16:29,880 --> 00:16:32,160 he had to flex his muscles to get back in shape, 254 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:35,240 like a runner or an athlete, that's what he had to do. 255 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:39,040 You know, we just would throw these songs at the musicians, 256 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:40,560 they'd never heard them before. 257 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,800 So we have David Torn on this track. 258 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:46,840 For instance, the intro, if I play David Torn... 259 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:49,200 MUSIC TRACK ALTERNATES WITH GUITAR 260 00:16:57,640 --> 00:16:59,640 That's his role in this, you know. 261 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:02,400 I had this loop, something like this, going. 262 00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:03,840 Which sounded like this. 263 00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:10,240 And I was moving it in and out while the line was happening. 264 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:15,800 And I remember also that he was changing his vocal 265 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:18,120 over the chords to create different sections, 266 00:17:18,120 --> 00:17:22,920 so we kind of have the idea to put some little different guitar riffs 267 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:25,840 to kind of signify the changes over there. 268 00:17:32,120 --> 00:17:35,840 I put Torn and Leonard together. Torn and Leonard. 269 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:41,240 Very complementary. 270 00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:43,760 OK. 271 00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:51,600 It's almost a Motown kind of thing. 272 00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:54,480 - I don't know where that kind of comes from. - Very Motown-y, yeah. 273 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:00,120 # Sugar pie, honey bunch... # 274 00:18:00,120 --> 00:18:02,360 But he never said anything about doing that. 275 00:18:02,360 --> 00:18:04,240 - That's right. - We kind of assumed. 276 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,680 If you've got a smile, you're going in the right direction. 277 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:08,680 If you get that kind of like... 278 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:12,040 he's like, "No, I wasn't thinking that at all." 279 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:15,920 And it made me think of another song which is a David song, 280 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:18,640 which was China Girl. 281 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:26,840 David would come to the studio with pages full of lyrics 282 00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:28,720 and start scratching them out. 283 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,920 Up until the last minute, he would keep revising. 284 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:35,760 And sometimes he would come in and just re-sing one line. 285 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:53,080 Stars (Are Out Tonight), 286 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:55,960 I think that's one of my favourite songs on the record, actually. 287 00:18:55,960 --> 00:19:00,080 I think that song was, for lack of a better word, a good piss take... 288 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:01,560 in a way... 289 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:07,640 on what fame has become, which is this out-of-control machine. 290 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:12,480 You know, David had great, grand ideas. 291 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:17,720 To become well-known, famous, was for him, initially, 292 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:21,960 was to have the resources to realise what his ideas were. 293 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:24,280 He really does come from that spirit. 294 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:27,480 He just didn't want to be famous per se. 295 00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:40,000 I just wanted to make a really big name for myself. 296 00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:42,200 I wanted to make a mark. 297 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:44,440 # Just look through your window 298 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:48,120 # Look who sits outside... # 299 00:19:48,120 --> 00:19:53,680 David had quite an edgy personality. He was intrigued by edgy stuff. 300 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:56,040 He wanted to do many things, 301 00:19:56,040 --> 00:20:00,040 he loved the idea of theatre, he loved the idea of acting, 302 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,400 he loved the idea of working with actors. 303 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:07,280 # Oh, beautiful baby and my heart's aflame 304 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:09,240 # I'll love you till Tuesday 305 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:13,120 # My head's in a whirl and I'll love you till Tuesday... # 306 00:20:13,120 --> 00:20:16,040 He loved the idea of working with musicians. 307 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:20,880 Being one himself, he always was looking right and left 308 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:24,800 or over his shoulder at what might be 309 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:26,840 or, "What could I do next?" 310 00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:32,400 It took me all the '60s to try everything I could think of 311 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:35,800 to find out exactly what it was I wanted to do anyway. 312 00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:39,640 But just about the end of the '60s, it just started to come together. 313 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,520 # Strange games they would play then 314 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:48,440 # No death for the perfect men 315 00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:54,200 # Life rolls into one for them 316 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:58,240 # So softly, a super god 317 00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:03,600 # Cries... # 318 00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:05,080 Through circumstances, 319 00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:08,640 I'd run into a drummer, called John Cambridge, and Tony Visconti 320 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:12,200 and Mick Ronson, and we put together a band called Hype. 321 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:14,720 It was probably my first costume band. 322 00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:18,840 As far as I'm aware, that was the very first so-called glam rock gig. 323 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:20,880 # ..No flesh, no power to... # 324 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:24,720 Hype was very important to David's development. 325 00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:27,320 This was the only way he could see, at that time, 326 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:33,600 that he could be famous, become famous and become well-known. 327 00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:36,520 And it wasn't quite the right incarnation 328 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,600 because he was not yet dyeing his hair orange 329 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,680 and he hadn't taken on the Ziggy persona yet. 330 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:46,200 # And he was all right 331 00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:50,320 # The band was all together 332 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:54,160 # Yes, he was all right 333 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:57,600 # The song went on for ever 334 00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:01,360 # And he was awful nice 335 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,560 # Really quite out of sight 336 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:09,240 # And he sang all night 337 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,320 # All night long 338 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:17,000 # Oh, how I sighed 339 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:20,800 # When they asked if I knew his name... # 340 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:28,000 The real characterisation really didn't kick in till the Ziggy. 341 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,480 I mean, I was always quite a shy kid. 342 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:33,680 And I didn't come alive on stage, I just got even shier. 343 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:37,280 But I found I didn't get so shy if I adopted a character. 344 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,080 So it was a convenience, 345 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,000 as well as a very bright theatrical idea. 346 00:22:43,120 --> 00:22:47,960 # Didn't know what time it was The lights were low 347 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:52,400 # I leaned back on my radio 348 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:57,680 # Some cat was laying down some get-it-on rock and roll, he said 349 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:04,000 # Then the loud sound did seem to fade 350 00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:08,800 # It came back like a slow voice on a wave of phase 351 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:13,680 # That was no DJ That was hazy cosmic jive 352 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:20,120 # There's a starman 353 00:23:20,120 --> 00:23:22,760 # Waiting in the sky 354 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:24,960 # He'd like to come and meet us 355 00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:27,520 # But he thinks he'd blow our minds 356 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:29,880 # There's a starman 357 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:32,280 # Waiting in the sky 358 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,440 # He told us not to blow it 359 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:36,800 # Cos he knows it's all worthwhile 360 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,520 # He told me Let the children use it 361 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:42,000 # Let the children lose it 362 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,480 # Let all the children boogie... # 363 00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:47,560 - Have you always wanted to be a star? - Yeah. 364 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,560 It's more than being a star. 365 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:54,480 What it is really is that I want to be productive. 366 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:59,440 I'm not content to be just a rock and roll star all my life. 367 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:02,280 I am trying to be one at the moment 368 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,760 because I need it for a particular reason 369 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,120 so that I can get off and do other things. 370 00:24:07,120 --> 00:24:10,000 # There's a starman 371 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:11,880 # Waiting in the sky 372 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:14,360 # He told us not to blow it 373 00:24:14,360 --> 00:24:16,600 # Cos he knows it's all worthwhile 374 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:19,920 # He told me Let the children use it 375 00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:22,440 # Let the children lose it 376 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,520 # Let all the children boogie... # 377 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:30,720 You could feel that David wanted to be the greatest artist 378 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,200 and the next Elvis Presley. 379 00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,360 You could feel it from every pore of his body. 380 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:41,960 He would bring me up to his suite 381 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,040 and we would watch 382 00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:47,000 Elvis Presley videos and Frank Sinatra 383 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:49,600 and we'd have discussions about it 384 00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:52,760 and he would do certain moves and "Does this seem right and natural?" 385 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:56,320 I mean, he was interested to look at those people 386 00:24:56,320 --> 00:24:59,200 and set such icons as his goals. 387 00:25:00,360 --> 00:25:05,040 Oh, yes, David wanted to be famous, David wanted to be an icon, 388 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:08,040 like he is now. He was saying things to me like, 389 00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:10,720 "You have to be someone that 390 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,960 "thousands and millions of people 391 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,160 "want to listen to and believe in." 392 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:23,720 But he once said, too, 393 00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:27,680 that being super-successful was like living in a goldfish bowl. 394 00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:31,520 And it was for him because people became totally obsessed with him. 395 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:36,080 # Fame makes a man take things over... # 396 00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:39,920 You know that feeling you get in a car when someone's accelerating 397 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:42,760 very fast and you're not driving and you get that thing in your chest 398 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:44,880 when you're being forced backwards and think, oh, 399 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:46,840 and you're not sure whether you like it or not. 400 00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:50,080 It's that kind of feeling. That's what success was like. 401 00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:54,080 The first thrust of being totally unknown 402 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:57,280 to being what seemed to be very quickly known. 403 00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,600 It was very frightening for me. 404 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:03,800 # Fame puts you there where things are hollow... # 405 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:09,200 I'm not sure if he can handle it consistently 406 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,160 because it is a demanding mistress 407 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:14,560 that doesn't take no for an answer 408 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:16,240 and is on call 24 hours. 409 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:20,640 So it makes you a bit more paranoid than you used to, doesn't it? 410 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:25,880 And now we are being looked upon as we have to deliver something. 411 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:29,160 The minute you go outside - let me look a certain way, I'm famous now. 412 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:30,880 # Fame 413 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,800 # What you need is in the limo 414 00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:39,120 - # Fame - What you get is no tomorrow 415 00:26:39,120 --> 00:26:40,880 # Fame 416 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:44,000 # What you need you have to borrow 417 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:47,080 - # Fame - Fame 418 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:51,560 - # Fame - "Mine, it's mine!" 419 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:54,400 # It's just his line to bind you to trying 420 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:56,360 # Crime... # 421 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:00,800 This rock star thing, 422 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:03,400 you once described it as being a dreadful existence. 423 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,840 In a sort of very luxuriant mental hospital... 424 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,840 ..where you're sort of put in a padded room... 425 00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:13,480 ..and meals are brought to you 426 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,560 and the only time you're let out on your lead is when you're supposed to 427 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:20,200 go and earn money for just about everybody else except yourself. 428 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:23,280 # Is it any wonder I reject you first? 429 00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:28,080 # Fame, fame, fame, fame, fame 430 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:33,920 # Is it any wonder You're far too cool to fool? 431 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:36,720 # Fame... # 432 00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,600 Did David enjoyed being a star? I would say what he said to me. 433 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:44,840 It's great when you want to get tickets for a concert, 434 00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,920 when you want to get backstage and see your friends 435 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,280 or if you want a good table at a restaurant. 436 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:52,840 But the rest of the time it's a pain in the ass. 437 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:56,160 And I think that's pretty much a verbatim quote. 438 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:59,960 I watched him deal with it too many times. 439 00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:03,000 That was his view on it. 440 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:06,600 - I think we did... - I find this an incredible intrusion. 441 00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:09,120 Fuck off! 442 00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:14,440 - You know that's the only bit we're going to use, don't you? - Yeah. 443 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,560 THEY LAUGH I know when to pick me lines. 444 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:21,920 Yeah, that's better. 445 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:28,800 Once he experienced the fame, and all that comes with that, 446 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:32,320 I think he was done with it. 447 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:34,960 He was done with it. 448 00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:38,360 And I think he realised he'd made a deal with the devil 449 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:42,720 and it would be the rest of his life trying to undo that. 450 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:44,520 Happy hump today, Phil. 451 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:47,280 - I didn't get humped. You? - Yeah. 452 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,720 Some people, huh? They just get lost. 453 00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:55,600 Well, it's more exciting than anything we've got around here. 454 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:57,720 I wouldn't say that. 455 00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:59,720 We have a nice life. 456 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:02,560 We have a nice life. 457 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:06,040 The idea that he had for The Stars (Are Out Tonight) video 458 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:08,440 was that there were celebrities 459 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:12,880 that were stalking normal people to study them. 460 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:16,920 And then he whipped out the photograph of Tilda Swinton. 461 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:18,840 And I was like, OK, that's fantastic, 462 00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:21,760 you know, him and Tilda were to play "the normal couple". 463 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,960 David really wanted to play up the androgyny card because, 464 00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:33,520 you know, he is the androgynous being that we've grown up with. 465 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:39,640 So I cast boys in the girls' parts and girls in the boys' parts. 466 00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:45,000 At that stage, I think he was able to definitely sit back 467 00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:48,000 and reflect on what fame meant. 468 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,880 And I think that song, in a way, is kind of like 469 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,720 stars are never sleeping, you can't escape it. 470 00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:57,880 # They know just what we do 471 00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:01,800 # That we toss and turn at night 472 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,680 # They're waiting to make their moves 473 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,280 # For the stars are out tonight 474 00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:10,480 # Tonight. # 475 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:15,000 Eventually, the celebrities, they are in their home. 476 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:19,880 And when they come into the home, there's a transfer that happens. 477 00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:27,400 And now, the normal people are dressed like celebrities, 478 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:33,200 and the celebrities have succeeded in becoming the normal people. 479 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,480 You know, as an artist, you collect things, 480 00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:38,040 and he's had years of not having to put things out, 481 00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:39,440 so he's collecting things. 482 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,880 He wants to, sort of, hold up a mirror and say, 483 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,720 "Hey, look at this over here, look at this over here." 484 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,400 You know, "Comment on it, but make it, you know... In an artistic way." 485 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,400 # The stars are out tonight, yeah. # 486 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:05,400 - 'Do you ever look back'? - 'Er... 487 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,400 'Only with fond amusement, you know, 488 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,200 'cos I've done such a lot of work in 40 years. 489 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,120 'It's only recently that maybe I've started to write 490 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:15,680 'in a kind of autobiographical way, 491 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:17,960 'and this may be something to do with age, 492 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:19,800 'and the way that one matures.' 493 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,160 HE PLAYS INTRO 494 00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:31,280 And then... 495 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:32,400 HE PLAYS A CHORD 496 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,440 'I don't recall David on the sessions 497 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:36,840 'really talking a lot about being old.' 498 00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,600 I think maybe he would joke that he would wear his slippers, you know? 499 00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:43,640 He had his slippers brought down, and he'd pop his slippers... 500 00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:46,240 You know, when he got to the studio, he'd pop his slippers on. 501 00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,000 We'd made a few jokes about that. 502 00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:53,680 # Where are we now? Where are we now?... # 503 00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:58,880 So, David came in with a piano demo. 504 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:00,680 PIANO MUSIC PLAYS 505 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,120 This is the DB piano - David Bowie piano. 506 00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:10,200 It's got a combination of piano and strings on the patch. 507 00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,040 I couldn't take the strings off, 508 00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:15,320 so those strings are him playing at home. 509 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,240 We found this kind of atmosphere in the demo. 510 00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:20,800 The next time we played that 511 00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:23,840 was when we went in the studio, and Zach was there. 512 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:26,360 I should add the drums in here. 513 00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:29,560 DRUMBEAT STARTS 514 00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:32,880 David's instruction, I remember specifically, was... 515 00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:35,480 - IN TIME WITH RHYTHM: - "One." 516 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:36,760 Yeah. 517 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:37,800 "One." 518 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:39,800 He just said, "Emphasise the 'one'." 519 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:40,840 So... 520 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:43,880 HE PLAYS SONG RHYTHM 521 00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:53,000 If I add David, it's practically it. 522 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,120 PIANO PLAYS 523 00:32:57,480 --> 00:32:59,160 It's... 524 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:04,480 # Where are we now? Where are we now? 525 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:16,480 # The moment you know You know, you know... # 526 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,240 Out of the blue, he called me up, 527 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,160 and said he'd like to talk to me about something. 528 00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:24,160 He explained the situation, 529 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,320 that he had been secretly working on this track, 530 00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:29,880 And I was, like, "Oh, that's fantastic," you know? 531 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:31,240 "What do I have to do with it?" 532 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:34,160 And he goes, "Well, I'd like you to make the video for that." 533 00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:37,440 "Oh, that's quite a task." 534 00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:41,240 You know, and I was thinking, this big-budget video, you know, 535 00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:43,960 and I was thinking, "I have to do this justice, you know, 536 00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:47,160 "it has to be this momentous video that's going to break 537 00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:50,800 "the silence of all these years," you know? 538 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:51,920 And David said, 539 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,880 "No, I want to do it, like, in your studio, 540 00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:58,800 "it'll be these figures - very simple, rough." 541 00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:10,520 These figures were something I was making fairly exclusively, 542 00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:13,400 and did a number of exhibitions of them, 543 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,920 and David, of course, loved these figures, you know? 544 00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:20,280 # Just walking the dead... # 545 00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:22,680 I did a rough sketch, and I was like, 546 00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:24,480 "This is what you have in mind, right? 547 00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:29,680 "This rough-hewn, stretched face, you know? It's not very flattering." 548 00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:32,200 But that's exactly what he wanted - 549 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:37,760 to look, actually, beyond what the years had done to him. 550 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,160 It's a strange, you know... Through the... 551 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:41,800 Here he is leaving. 552 00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:43,080 He's had enough! 553 00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:45,880 HE LAUGHS 554 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,640 He's like, "Stop going on about my face!" 555 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:52,240 # Where are we now?... # 556 00:34:52,240 --> 00:34:59,040 So, the idea was that he wanted all this stuff in the studio situation, 557 00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,080 and we kind of arranged things around, 558 00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:05,880 and we talked about transparency and reflection, 559 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:10,040 and as this was coming together, I said to him, "You know... 560 00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,720 "..people can read into every part of this." 561 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:45,160 This one is perhaps the most deliberately nostalgic 562 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:47,960 look into his past, and... 563 00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,720 - ..you know, he's talking about all the old places... - Yeah. 564 00:35:51,720 --> 00:35:55,080 ..he frequented in Berlin, and it's deliberately sad. 565 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:59,400 He's in the latter part of his life. Those days are gone, you know? 566 00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,240 Berlin was the first freedom I'd had 567 00:36:08,240 --> 00:36:12,480 from all the so-called trappings of celebrity, and, er... 568 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:14,120 And my own problems. 569 00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:17,640 Really, I'm quite fond of that freedom that it gave me. 570 00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:23,200 I put myself in a very anonymous situation, 571 00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:26,840 in a quite working-class part of Berlin, Turkish area, 572 00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:28,880 and started to live a different life, 573 00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:33,080 and I tried to distance myself from the very drug-oriented lifestyle 574 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:34,240 that I'd been leading. 575 00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:36,680 # Had to get the train 576 00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:40,960 # From Potsdamer Platz... # 577 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:44,200 It was just a tremendous place to be. 578 00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,320 And the music was some of the most rewarding 579 00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:47,960 for me as an artist in my life. 580 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:50,880 # I 581 00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:55,200 # I will be king 582 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,320 # And you 583 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,960 # You will be queen 584 00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:07,880 # Though nothing 585 00:37:09,720 --> 00:37:12,360 # Will drive them away 586 00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:16,680 # We can beat them 587 00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:20,720 # For ever and ever 588 00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:24,640 # We can be heroes 589 00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:29,680 # Just for one day 590 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:34,320 # I 591 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:38,040 # I can remember 592 00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:40,040 # I remember 593 00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:42,720 # Standing 594 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:46,440 # By the wall... # 595 00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:48,680 But you can't read Where Are We Now? 596 00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:53,480 as just a nostalgic story about Berlin, at all, you know? 597 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:54,680 But, I mean, really, 598 00:37:54,680 --> 00:38:01,000 it's much more how memories affect the way we move forward, or not. 599 00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:07,640 The Song of Norway T-shirt - I said, 600 00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:10,680 "That's very cheeky," and he goes, "I know," or something like that, 601 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:13,960 and he never explained why he wore it. 602 00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:21,160 'Her name is Hermione Farthingale, and I absolutely adored her, 603 00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:23,800 'I mean, she was the real first love in my life. 604 00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:27,720 'And she was a ballet dancer, and a very good little singer, 605 00:38:27,720 --> 00:38:31,120 'and she played a little bit of bed-sitting room guitar, 606 00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:32,720 'you know, that kind of folk guitar 607 00:38:32,720 --> 00:38:35,680 'that every girl that looked beautiful could play in those days. 608 00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:37,640 'I don't know why, but all the beautiful girls 609 00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:40,040 'could play a little bit of acoustic guitar. 610 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:45,120 'She was doing a film called Song of Norway.' HE CHUCKLES 611 00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,560 'And she fell in love with one of the actors on it, 612 00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:49,240 'and she left me for him. 613 00:38:49,240 --> 00:38:52,920 'God, I didn't get over that for such a long time. 614 00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:54,280 'It really broke me up.' 615 00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:59,560 I did see David when he'd just separated from her, 616 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:01,320 and he was very, very upset. 617 00:39:02,720 --> 00:39:06,440 I think it was also, he was working with her, so it was a double thing, 618 00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:12,000 that he'd lost his girlfriend, and he'd lost someone in his band. 619 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,600 I don't know which one was the worst, to be honest, but... 620 00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:16,680 Yeah, it did hit him pretty hard. 621 00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,480 I think he wanted to release something that would cause 622 00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:26,840 a lot of ripples and question marks all around, 623 00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:30,120 and he was able to get that with this. 624 00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:38,840 # As long as there's sun 625 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:50,360 # As long as there's rain 626 00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:55,920 # As long as there's fire 627 00:39:58,720 --> 00:40:01,200 # As long as there's fire... # 628 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:02,560 I knew this was about Berlin, 629 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:06,600 and I thought it was really, really sweet, and quite nostalgic. 630 00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:07,960 But, er... 631 00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,880 The thing that really made me teary-eyed 632 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:13,520 was when I saw the video for it. 633 00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:16,040 Oh, my gosh, you know? I thought... 634 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:18,240 I'd never expect him to look back, you know? 635 00:40:18,240 --> 00:40:20,080 This is a new thing for him. 636 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,040 CAR HORN BLARES 637 00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:38,360 SIREN WAILS 638 00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:41,600 'I think because of my orientation towards the apocalyptic, 639 00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:45,800 'I think it rather hones that low-level anxiety. 640 00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:50,160 'Especially with, you know, the advent of a new child. 641 00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:55,080 'My daughter really sort of focused my fears and apprehensions. 642 00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:57,720 'I mean, what a disappointing 21st century 643 00:40:57,720 --> 00:40:59,840 'this has been so far, you know?' 644 00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:19,200 I have to say, this track has swagger. 645 00:41:19,200 --> 00:41:21,840 All this loose playing, it's all on purpose. 646 00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:25,360 But we didn't want it to get too fancy, and it had to sound 647 00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:29,000 like a bunch of high school kids playing their instruments. 648 00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:38,680 Very, very cheesy-sounding, but perfect for this song, 649 00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:40,920 because of the lyrical content of the song, 650 00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:45,800 about this, you know, person called Valentine, who is a mass-murderer. 651 00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:50,920 'I mean, Valentine's Day,' 652 00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:52,560 from a musical point of view, 653 00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:55,480 that is way old, that's like old-school, 654 00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:58,040 all those chord changes, and the whole thing. 655 00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:01,440 But if you listen to the lyrics, there's subject matter there. 656 00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:06,600 # Valentine told me who's to go 657 00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:17,200 # Feelings he's treasured most of all... # 658 00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:20,760 There had been a number of incidents prior to creating this song 659 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:22,800 that had moved him. 660 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:25,280 I think he was really troubled by this trend 661 00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:27,800 of people going and shooting kids. 662 00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:31,400 # The teachers and the football stars 663 00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:36,480 # It's in his tiny face 664 00:42:38,720 --> 00:42:41,320 # It's in his scrawny hand 665 00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,600 # Valentine told me so 666 00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:49,480 # He's got something to say 667 00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,640 # It's Valentine's day... # 668 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:55,720 He really wanted to bring the audience 669 00:42:55,720 --> 00:42:57,280 into the mind of that killer, 670 00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:01,960 and that transition from the David that we know 671 00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:06,360 to this other character that he was inhabiting in this song 672 00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:08,720 was very shocking, really. 673 00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:14,280 # Valentine told me how he feels 674 00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:24,720 # If all the world were under his heels... # 675 00:43:24,720 --> 00:43:26,280 Being right there in front of him, 676 00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:30,160 and seeing him pull this out of himself - it was, er... 677 00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:33,280 It was quite terrifying just to watch. 678 00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:34,920 # It's in his tiny face 679 00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:39,640 # It's in his scrawny hand... # 680 00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:42,640 I really wanted to introduce a weapon into the video, 681 00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:44,440 and David was really against it. 682 00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:47,640 He didn't want any guns, he didn't want any blood. 683 00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:51,840 But he was very much aware of making a statement about gun control 684 00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:54,440 and the importance of that, in his own style. 685 00:43:55,400 --> 00:44:00,360 To defeat the divisive forces that would take freedom away... 686 00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,440 I want to say those fighting words... 687 00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:06,240 "From my cold, dead hands!" 688 00:44:06,240 --> 00:44:07,280 CHEERING 689 00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:09,160 # Valentine, Valentine 690 00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:11,440 # It's in his scrawny hand 691 00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:13,960 # It's in his icy heart 692 00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,320 # It's happening today 693 00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:19,320 # Valentine, Valentine... # 694 00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:24,160 He was very interested in society, you know, what makes people operate, 695 00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:26,080 what makes societies operate, 696 00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:30,480 and that was one of his less cryptic and more straight-up lyrics 697 00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:32,040 that he's ever written. 698 00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:36,960 'I'm not an original thinker. 699 00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:40,440 'What I'm best at doing is synthesising those things 700 00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:44,080 'in society or culture, refracting those things, 701 00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:46,640 'and producing some kind of glob 702 00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:50,760 'of how it is that we live at this particular time.' 703 00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:55,720 # Pushing through the market square 704 00:44:58,720 --> 00:45:01,000 # So many mothers crying 705 00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:06,880 # News had just come over 706 00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:13,560 # We had five years left to sigh in 707 00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:19,680 # News guy wept when he told us 708 00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:25,240 # Earth was really dying 709 00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:32,640 # Cried so much that his face was wet 710 00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:36,760 # Then I knew he was not lying... # 711 00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:40,600 He let you know, something's not right here, 712 00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:41,880 so that's the best I knew. 713 00:45:41,880 --> 00:45:43,560 He didn't come up with the solutions, 714 00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:48,040 but at least he could express, and others could resonate with that. 715 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:53,480 # A girl my age went off her head 716 00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:58,920 # Hit some tiny children 717 00:46:03,720 --> 00:46:06,440 # If the black hadn't 'a pulled her off 718 00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:11,880 # I think she would have killed them... # 719 00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:13,880 'I'm not a Dylan, and I'm not a... 720 00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:16,080 'I'm not somebody who can sit down 721 00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:20,160 'and stoically write a clear picture of what's happening, you know? 722 00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:23,320 'But I can leave a very strong impression of how I feel about it.' 723 00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:26,000 - # Five years - # Five years 724 00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:28,760 # Mmm-doo-doo, yeah 725 00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,160 # Five years 726 00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:34,360 # Doo-doo-doo, yeah 727 00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:37,640 # Five years 728 00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:40,240 # Doo-hee, yeah 729 00:46:40,240 --> 00:46:43,200 - # Five years - # Five years 730 00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:45,760 # That's all we've got. # 731 00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:51,960 CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 732 00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:02,400 APPLAUSE BECOMES RHYTHMIC 733 00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,320 ELECTRO INTRO PLAYS 734 00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:08,920 'It's very hard to not continue 735 00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:11,160 'to readdress the same subject matter endlessly. 736 00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:14,280 'I mean, I just have a certain niche that I work in. 737 00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:16,040 'A lot of it, until recently, 738 00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:19,880 'tends to be about alienation, and being on the outside of things.' 739 00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:22,040 # It's the darkest hour 740 00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:24,120 # You're 22 741 00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:27,000 # The voice of youth 742 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,160 # The hour of dread... # 743 00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:32,640 'That tends to be where I feel more comfortable as a writer, 744 00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:34,920 'but I think one keeps readdressing that situation, 745 00:47:34,920 --> 00:47:37,040 'and trying to express it in a different way. 746 00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:38,760 'I guess that's what I do.' 747 00:47:39,720 --> 00:47:41,520 # Love is lost 748 00:47:41,520 --> 00:47:43,600 # Lost is love 749 00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:59,320 When I spoke to David on the phone, it was definitely, 750 00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:00,840 "Don't say a word about this," 751 00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:03,000 In fact, we even had a code word for it, 752 00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:05,840 so if anybody intercepted the phone calls, 753 00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:09,360 they wouldn't know we were talking about the album. 754 00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:13,120 So, the album was actually codenamed The Table. 755 00:48:13,120 --> 00:48:15,320 HE LAUGHS 756 00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:19,320 There was a lot of discussion 757 00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:21,400 about what the album would be called at the time. 758 00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:23,880 It was quite gratifying to know that not even David Bowie 759 00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:26,280 has everything planned out. 760 00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:28,720 So, it was possibly going to be called Love Is Lost... 761 00:48:30,600 --> 00:48:33,000 ..possibly going to be called The Next Day... 762 00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,080 possibly going to be called Where Are We Now? 763 00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:41,720 The thing that started the concept for the design was this photograph. 764 00:48:41,720 --> 00:48:44,520 It's from the '70s, and he said, 765 00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:47,600 "I want to do something with this photo for the cover." 766 00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:49,520 Which I found quite puzzling. 767 00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:53,000 He was looking back on his life, even looking at that image. 768 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:55,480 I really struggled with using the image, 769 00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:58,320 and then it took Bowie to say, "Jonathan... 770 00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:01,720 "Why don't you just turn the image upside down?" 771 00:49:01,720 --> 00:49:05,840 And within that moment, he subverted his whole history. 772 00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:11,000 So, the process was to go through every record cover, 773 00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:14,600 every printed image of him, and see how we could subvert it. 774 00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:24,880 The cover of "Heroes" really had that youthful image of Bowie 775 00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:29,080 looking forward to the future, and the square obliterates it. 776 00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:34,000 It's existentially talking about someone who's coming closer 777 00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:38,080 to the end of their life, and looking back on the past. 778 00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,320 I really wasn't sure about it at the time, 779 00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:45,400 to the point that in fact, the night before it was sent off 780 00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:48,120 to the record company, I wrote to him and said, "Are you sure?" 781 00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:49,480 And he actually said to me, 782 00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:54,360 "No, have faith, Jonathan, this is a good idea, it's an original idea." 783 00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:57,120 # I'd rather be high... # 784 00:49:57,120 --> 00:49:59,520 I think he was subverting people's expectation 785 00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:04,480 because of the years away, so he could play with his image. 786 00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:09,040 He wasn't a young man desperate to be original. 787 00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:12,000 He was someone who'd lived life, 788 00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:16,360 and was not up for playing the game of being in the media all the time. 789 00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:23,080 Bowie was incredibly happy 790 00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:27,160 that we'd managed to keep this thing secret all this time. 791 00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:29,440 We had accomplished something unique 792 00:50:29,440 --> 00:50:32,840 in a time when everybody knows everything. 793 00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:38,440 He was quite attracted to all the furore 794 00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:43,480 around an album being released, but he wanted to play the right way. 795 00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:47,240 # Then we saw... # 796 00:50:47,240 --> 00:50:49,880 - REPORTER: - Hello. David Bowie is back in sound and vision 797 00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:52,040 with his first new album in a decade. 798 00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:54,280 - REPORTER: - He hasn't performed since 2006, 799 00:50:54,280 --> 00:50:58,000 and has rarely been seen in public since then, but now he's back. 800 00:50:58,000 --> 00:50:59,800 - REPORTER: - But after a bout of ill-health, 801 00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:01,400 it was thought he had retired. Wrong. 802 00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:03,640 - REPORTER: - His new album, his first in ten years, 803 00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:05,680 shot to the number one spot last weekend. 804 00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:08,400 In fact, it's the fastest-selling of the year so far, 805 00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:12,320 having shifted over 100,000 copies in less than two weeks. 806 00:51:12,320 --> 00:51:15,680 # The night was always falling 807 00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:20,160 # The peacock in the snow 808 00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:24,280 # And I tell myself 809 00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:29,000 # I don't know who I am... # 810 00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:36,760 He just stopped giving interviews many years ago, and, erm... 811 00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:40,480 this is something that he needed to do, I think, for himself. 812 00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:43,280 He couldn't have his life examined any longer, 813 00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:45,920 he didn't want any speculation about his life. 814 00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:07,120 I think it's terribly dangerous for an artist 815 00:52:07,120 --> 00:52:09,560 to fulfil other people's expectations. 816 00:52:09,560 --> 00:52:12,440 If you feel safe in the area that you're working in, 817 00:52:12,440 --> 00:52:14,480 you're not working in the right area. 818 00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:18,480 Always go further in the water than you feel you're capable of being in. 819 00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:20,200 Go a little bit out of your depth, 820 00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:23,320 and when you don't feel that your feet are quite touching the bottom, 821 00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:26,400 you're just about in the right place to do something exciting. 822 00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:32,360 The way David works, he just keeps evolving, evolving, evolving. 823 00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:36,120 David's always looking for that new element, and unique musicians, 824 00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:38,880 to be the carriage for his new ideas. 825 00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,840 Maria Schneider is an amazing jazz composer, 826 00:52:45,840 --> 00:52:48,400 and how she could have been off my radar, I don't know, 827 00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:53,480 because she suddenly appeared in my life through David, 828 00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:55,360 and when I heard her compositions, 829 00:52:55,360 --> 00:52:58,800 it was everything David and I loved about big band music, 830 00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:03,360 that it was discordant and strange and ethereal. 831 00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:14,040 Out of the blue, David called. 832 00:53:14,040 --> 00:53:15,520 - "Hello?" - SHE CHUCKLES 833 00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:20,200 And then I proceeded to start to talk to him about the idea 834 00:53:20,200 --> 00:53:23,040 that he had to collaborate on a song. 835 00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:32,080 David brought a little demo of Sue, so, I listened to it, 836 00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:34,160 and immediately heard this. 837 00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:37,480 DISCORDANT CHORDS 838 00:53:37,480 --> 00:53:40,640 I said, "Where do you want this to go?" 839 00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:43,880 So, it's... It's pretty bright-sounding, you know, 840 00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:46,160 and he said, "Oh, I want it to be really dark," 841 00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:47,920 so, then I started playing around 842 00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:51,160 with ways in which I could make that... 843 00:53:52,120 --> 00:53:55,240 ..that melody dark, and I just fooled around over here, 844 00:53:55,240 --> 00:53:58,600 and then I looked at him, and I said, "OK, let's try this." 845 00:53:58,600 --> 00:53:59,640 CAR HORN BLARES 846 00:54:00,600 --> 00:54:02,520 Maria Schneider said, 847 00:54:02,520 --> 00:54:05,040 "You have to listen to this guy, Donny McCaslin." 848 00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:07,200 Donny had a band. 849 00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:12,520 This band were trained jazz musicians, 850 00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:15,560 so we had more colours to the palette. 851 00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:20,480 Then I just worked on it on my own a little bit, 852 00:54:20,480 --> 00:54:22,160 and then David came over, 853 00:54:22,160 --> 00:54:25,360 and then I presented him with all these sketches of ideas, 854 00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:28,880 and said, "OK, let me play you lots of different things," 855 00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:31,120 and he would either say, 856 00:54:31,120 --> 00:54:33,360 "Yeah, yeah," or, "Oh, I really like that!" 857 00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:37,000 You know, and if it's got a real reaction from him, then I said, 858 00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:39,040 "OK, maybe that's the direction." 859 00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:41,360 So, I just kind of tried to feel him out. 860 00:54:55,040 --> 00:54:56,400 It was adventure. 861 00:54:56,400 --> 00:54:59,280 Adventure, adventure, "Let's try this, let's try that, 862 00:54:59,280 --> 00:55:01,400 "let's make it as far-out as possible. 863 00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:04,000 "Let's go somewhere no-one's ever gone before," you know? 864 00:55:07,040 --> 00:55:09,880 And when we recorded it, it was like, six hours or something. 865 00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:15,920 - Yeah. - So, he comes out, then he lays down the vocal for the whole song - 866 00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:17,640 seven, eight minutes. 867 00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:20,800 - So, he's been in the studio all day long... - Just sitting there! 868 00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:23,520 Just sitting there, listening, you know, taking this all in, 869 00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:26,640 goes out, a little "one-two-three" on the mic, and then, boom. 870 00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:28,280 # Sue 871 00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:34,360 # I got the job 872 00:55:37,320 --> 00:55:43,200 # We'll buy the house 873 00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:45,840 # You'll need to rest 874 00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:51,680 # But now we'll make it... # 875 00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:54,880 So, I remember doing this interview with Tony Visconti. 876 00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:56,560 The interviewer asked us both, 877 00:55:56,560 --> 00:56:00,120 what was David's relationship to jazz music? Something like that, 878 00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:04,200 and Tony's response was that he thought that that influence 879 00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:06,520 had always been there in David's music, 880 00:56:06,520 --> 00:56:08,840 but it was just sort of underneath the surface, 881 00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:11,760 and that now, it was just, you know, out there. 882 00:56:13,160 --> 00:56:19,680 # Sue, I pushed you down beneath the weeds 883 00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:25,040 # Endless faith in hopeless deeds... # 884 00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:26,880 Of course, when this thing was released, 885 00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:28,520 there were all sorts of comments. 886 00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:31,480 Some people were just absolutely hating it, 887 00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:33,040 and some people were loving it, 888 00:56:33,040 --> 00:56:34,960 and some people didn't know what to think. 889 00:56:37,040 --> 00:56:41,440 # Goodbye. # 890 00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:46,320 This is David Bowie. He's not going to pigeonhole even himself. 891 00:56:46,320 --> 00:56:48,720 Imagine how ridiculous he would have looked, you know, 892 00:56:48,720 --> 00:56:52,520 if he'd kept dying his hair orange when he was 65 years old? 893 00:56:52,520 --> 00:56:56,600 Orange hair and platform shoes, you know? He's smart. 894 00:57:05,800 --> 00:57:08,760 The radical shift between Sue and The Next Day 895 00:57:08,760 --> 00:57:13,000 is like when he did the ambient music of Low and "Heroes" 896 00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:14,160 with Brian Eno. 897 00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:18,360 # Dun-dun-dun-dun... # 898 00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:19,560 HE CHUCKLES 899 00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:21,480 Oh, I'm going to play that again! 900 00:57:21,480 --> 00:57:23,400 # Dun-dun-dun-dun... # 901 00:57:23,400 --> 00:57:26,040 Oh, wow! I'm feeling Low. 902 00:57:27,760 --> 00:57:30,680 Brian Eno's methodology is a little bit different 903 00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:33,400 than any methodology I've ever encountered. 904 00:57:33,400 --> 00:57:35,600 That's not rock and roll. 905 00:57:35,600 --> 00:57:36,680 Rock and roll is, 906 00:57:36,680 --> 00:57:39,600 "Hey, man, I've got this great riff, listen to this, waaah!" 907 00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:40,840 You know? 908 00:57:40,840 --> 00:57:43,880 But when you start experimenting with soundscapes, 909 00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:49,320 which is what they were doing, it makes other things come to light. 910 00:57:50,440 --> 00:57:54,240 David was listening to a few German bands back then 911 00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:57,720 that were at the epicentre of electronic music, 912 00:57:57,720 --> 00:58:01,800 and I think that the electronical part was too much. 913 00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:06,560 That's why he had an R&B, a black rhythm section, being, 914 00:58:06,560 --> 00:58:09,400 "You want a machine? Let me give you a funk band..." 915 00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:12,960 INTRO TO "SOUND AND VISION" PLAYS 916 00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:16,160 "..but I'll add all the electronic stuff on top of that." 917 00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:19,280 Otherwise, he might take the chance 918 00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:24,480 of sounding like European electronic music, 919 00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:27,000 which he did not want to reproduce. 920 00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:32,920 I'd gotten into the idea of real experimentation in music 921 00:58:32,920 --> 00:58:34,840 with the new sounds of Europe, 922 00:58:34,840 --> 00:58:38,440 and it was this kind of hybrid thing that appealed to me so much. 923 00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:40,360 The idea of mixtures 924 00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:44,320 has always been something that I've found absolutely fascinating. 925 00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:46,720 # Blue, blue, electric blue 926 00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:48,960 # That's the colour of my room 927 00:58:48,960 --> 00:58:51,000 # Where I will live 928 00:58:52,880 --> 00:58:54,400 # Blue, blue 929 00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:00,200 # Pale blinds drawn all day 930 00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:02,640 # Nothing to do, nothing to say 931 00:59:06,440 --> 00:59:08,120 # Blue, blue 932 00:59:11,440 --> 00:59:13,760 # I will sit right down 933 00:59:13,760 --> 00:59:16,840 # Waiting for the gift of sound and vision... # 934 00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:20,600 I was just amazed that David was the kind of person that he was, 935 00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:22,200 because I wasn't expecting that. 936 00:59:22,200 --> 00:59:24,720 I was expecting something, sort of... 937 00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:27,600 superhuman, strange, walking in... 938 00:59:27,600 --> 00:59:28,800 SHE CHUCKLES 939 00:59:28,800 --> 00:59:30,680 ..and he presented himself so normal. 940 00:59:30,680 --> 00:59:34,600 As a matter of fact, the doorman from downstairs called me and said, 941 00:59:34,600 --> 00:59:38,520 "There's a... What's your name? Oh, David, here to see you." 942 00:59:38,520 --> 00:59:40,360 And I thought, "Oh, dear!" 943 00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:49,680 Can I just stop for a second? Did I just say he was normal? 944 00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:53,280 - There was really nothing normal about David Bowie! - SHE CHUCKLES 945 00:59:53,280 --> 00:59:54,600 But anyway... 946 01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:20,360 When I was around 17, 18, what I wanted to do more than anything else 947 01:00:20,360 --> 01:00:22,480 was write something for Broadway. 948 01:00:22,480 --> 01:00:26,360 I wanted to write a musical, had no idea of how you did it, 949 01:00:26,360 --> 01:00:31,080 or how musicals were constructed, but the idea of writing something 950 01:00:31,080 --> 01:00:34,560 that was rock-based for Broadway really intrigued me. 951 01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:37,440 I thought that would be a wonderful thing to do. 952 01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:41,160 When we first talked, 953 01:00:41,160 --> 01:00:45,880 quite quickly, he said, "I want to do a musical," 954 01:00:45,880 --> 01:00:49,280 and I said, "Great," and he said, 955 01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:51,760 "all I know is that it's called Lazarus, 956 01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:55,680 "it's going to be called Lazarus, and it's based on the character 957 01:00:55,680 --> 01:00:58,800 "I played in The Man Who Fell To Earth, in the movie, 958 01:00:58,800 --> 01:01:00,200 "Thomas Jerome Newton." 959 01:01:04,200 --> 01:01:06,880 Thomas Newton is an alien. 960 01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:10,440 He can't get home, he's relegated to this Earth. 961 01:01:10,440 --> 01:01:11,880 He is... 962 01:01:11,880 --> 01:01:14,200 in the world, but not of it. 963 01:01:15,920 --> 01:01:18,760 Outsiders, marginalised people, 964 01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:20,840 people that don't belong, that are... 965 01:01:20,840 --> 01:01:24,280 That feel displaced, not at home, 966 01:01:24,280 --> 01:01:26,320 even when they have a house, like Newton, 967 01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:29,840 rich, you know, on Earth, but lost on Earth. 968 01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:31,400 It resonated with him. 969 01:01:34,880 --> 01:01:37,120 My initial reaction was, 970 01:01:37,120 --> 01:01:41,400 "I've got the chance to do a musical with David, which is wonderful. 971 01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:44,360 "But it sure ain't going to buy me a yacht!" 972 01:01:44,360 --> 01:01:46,640 # Oh, say can you see... # 973 01:01:46,640 --> 01:01:50,080 That was my amused comment to myself. 974 01:01:50,080 --> 01:01:53,600 But he said, "I want to see this. I want this on." 975 01:01:53,600 --> 01:01:55,040 OK... 976 01:01:55,040 --> 01:01:58,240 So, erm... Thank you very much... 977 01:01:58,240 --> 01:02:04,240 But just before we were due to start a small workshop, 978 01:02:04,240 --> 01:02:09,320 I was asked to go to David's office in New York at a specific time, 979 01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:14,200 and when I walked in the room, David was on Skype. 980 01:02:15,240 --> 01:02:16,720 And then he said, 981 01:02:16,720 --> 01:02:18,560 "I need to explain something to you, 982 01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:23,160 "because I'm not going to be able to be around a lot 983 01:02:23,160 --> 01:02:24,800 "during this workshop... 984 01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:30,440 "..which doesn't that I'm not going to be totally involved in it, 985 01:02:30,440 --> 01:02:33,760 "it just means that I can't be there sometimes, 986 01:02:33,760 --> 01:02:39,640 "because I'm having treatment, because I have a cancer." 987 01:02:42,440 --> 01:02:44,040 I was shocked. 988 01:02:44,040 --> 01:02:47,440 But his attitude was that he was going to be OK, 989 01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:50,720 and that was kind of the end of the conversation. 990 01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:52,600 I'm here to get you out of this apartment, 991 01:02:52,600 --> 01:02:55,200 get you home to your planet. 992 01:02:55,200 --> 01:02:57,080 I think we should build a rocket! 993 01:02:59,680 --> 01:03:03,960 But, of course, once we started rehearsal, he was there a lot. 994 01:03:03,960 --> 01:03:06,600 He was sort of in and out and in and out, you know? 995 01:03:08,400 --> 01:03:13,240 So, he would go, "Oh, let's remove that scene, and can I write a song? 996 01:03:13,240 --> 01:03:15,080 "I feel as if I should write a song here." 997 01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:16,840 And he was really excited about that. 998 01:03:18,640 --> 01:03:22,320 He was ill, and he said that writing the musical 999 01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:26,560 was on his bucket list, you know, finally writing a musical, 1000 01:03:26,560 --> 01:03:29,840 and all that, so, that's the only time he got a little bit, 1001 01:03:29,840 --> 01:03:33,440 you know, sentimental, maybe, like, "I've got to do these things." 1002 01:03:33,440 --> 01:03:39,800 - Stupid creature! - Why don't you tell me what's going on? - Because I can't. 1003 01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,360 I think that David intended it to be a play 1004 01:03:44,360 --> 01:03:47,720 that's supported by music, rather than a musical 1005 01:03:47,720 --> 01:03:50,320 that's supported by dialogue. 1006 01:03:50,320 --> 01:03:53,680 # But the film is a saddening bore... # 1007 01:03:53,680 --> 01:03:57,000 It's about as far from a typical West End or Broadway show 1008 01:03:57,000 --> 01:03:59,840 as you could get. He wanted this to be an art piece. 1009 01:04:01,440 --> 01:04:04,040 # As I ask you to focus on 1010 01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:08,240 # Sailors fighting in the dance hall 1011 01:04:08,240 --> 01:04:14,040 # Oh, man Look at those cavemen go 1012 01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:16,760 # It's the freakiest show... # 1013 01:04:16,760 --> 01:04:19,200 I'd heard that he'd wanted to do musicals since, 1014 01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:21,480 someone said the mid-'70s, or something or other, 1015 01:04:21,480 --> 01:04:24,320 and I thought, "Oh, God, we're beginning something 1016 01:04:24,320 --> 01:04:27,440 "that feels very, very close to his heart and his head 1017 01:04:27,440 --> 01:04:28,760 "and where he's at." 1018 01:04:40,040 --> 01:04:44,320 'I really had it in my mind to do a musical of Nineteen Eighty-Four.' 1019 01:04:44,320 --> 01:04:46,960 'It was a book that I'd loved all through my youth. 1020 01:04:46,960 --> 01:04:51,240 'But of course, I didn't really take into account the second Mrs Orwell, 1021 01:04:51,240 --> 01:04:53,920 'who, when she got wind of what we were doing, 1022 01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:55,680 'absolutely put her foot down, and said, 1023 01:04:55,680 --> 01:04:57,640 '"I'm not having rock and roll people 1024 01:04:57,640 --> 01:05:00,200 '"work on my late husband's great piece of work." 1025 01:05:00,200 --> 01:05:03,000 'And I thought, "Well, sod it, I'll do my own version, then!"' 1026 01:05:03,960 --> 01:05:05,440 That's a nought. 1027 01:05:05,440 --> 01:05:08,600 This is the beginning of a film called Diamond Dogs, 1028 01:05:08,600 --> 01:05:11,960 and I've put nought in because I don't know what year it says. 1029 01:05:13,200 --> 01:05:17,000 Wanting to do something like write a musical for Nineteen Eighty-Four, 1030 01:05:17,000 --> 01:05:21,480 and then not being able to do it, via the album Diamond Dogs, 1031 01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:25,640 kind of gelled into this thing that we later toured in America. 1032 01:05:25,640 --> 01:05:28,000 # A small Jean Genie snuck off to the city... # 1033 01:05:28,000 --> 01:05:31,480 David had the idea of using dance 1034 01:05:31,480 --> 01:05:36,320 and mime with two vocalists, 1035 01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:38,320 myself being one... 1036 01:05:41,160 --> 01:05:44,880 ..and Gui Andrisano, who had been a child star. 1037 01:05:47,760 --> 01:05:50,800 # Jean Genie, let yourself go... # 1038 01:05:58,040 --> 01:06:02,120 It kind of worked with the input we had from Toni Basil 1039 01:06:02,120 --> 01:06:04,040 in terms of choreography. 1040 01:06:05,760 --> 01:06:11,800 Well, when I met him, the first day, in his hotel suite, 1041 01:06:11,800 --> 01:06:14,080 the set was there. 1042 01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:17,040 The set was already a little mock-up set. 1043 01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:20,040 # We feel that we are paper 1044 01:06:20,040 --> 01:06:22,920 # Choking on you nightly 1045 01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:26,360 # They tell me Son, we want you 1046 01:06:26,360 --> 01:06:29,680 # Be elusive but don't walk far... # 1047 01:06:30,640 --> 01:06:34,440 He had the cityscape and a set list. 1048 01:06:34,440 --> 01:06:40,560 So, for me, the set list was my thread 1049 01:06:40,560 --> 01:06:46,960 of what ideas I could come up with in collaboration with him 1050 01:06:46,960 --> 01:06:50,040 to make this theatrical piece happen. 1051 01:06:50,040 --> 01:06:53,600 # But I love you in your fuck-me pumps 1052 01:06:53,600 --> 01:06:56,720 # And your nimble dress that trails 1053 01:06:56,720 --> 01:06:58,240 # Oh, dress yourself... # 1054 01:06:58,240 --> 01:07:03,400 At that time, there was not really a lot of rock stars 1055 01:07:03,400 --> 01:07:06,400 that focused on theatricality. 1056 01:07:06,400 --> 01:07:10,200 A lot of them thought it was corny, or they were afraid to approach it. 1057 01:07:10,200 --> 01:07:15,840 So, I knew he was a great performer, extremely theatrical, 1058 01:07:15,840 --> 01:07:19,320 that would just always be outside the box, 1059 01:07:19,320 --> 01:07:21,160 always be walking on the edge. 1060 01:07:28,720 --> 01:07:32,200 # In the year of the scavenger The season of the bitch 1061 01:07:32,200 --> 01:07:35,800 # Sashay on the boardwalk Scurry to the ditch 1062 01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:39,680 # Just another future song Lonely little kitsch... # 1063 01:07:39,680 --> 01:07:43,480 Diamond Dogs was probably the most difficult one to choreograph, 1064 01:07:43,480 --> 01:07:46,840 because we were on long pieces of rope, 1065 01:07:46,840 --> 01:07:52,840 and the idea was to tie him down, without fully disabling him, and... 1066 01:07:52,840 --> 01:07:55,160 - HE CHUCKLES - And, er...tripping him up. 1067 01:07:57,600 --> 01:08:00,000 - # Hey, you dogs - Whoo 1068 01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:02,280 # Call them the Diamond Dogs... # 1069 01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:04,800 'It was hideously pressurised for me, 1070 01:08:04,800 --> 01:08:06,880 'these awful tensions and stresses, 1071 01:08:06,880 --> 01:08:09,400 'but the physicality of performing a show like that 1072 01:08:09,400 --> 01:08:11,480 'was alarmingly strenuous.' 1073 01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:14,040 # Oh, honey 1074 01:08:14,040 --> 01:08:15,720 # You're so bad... # 1075 01:08:15,720 --> 01:08:21,560 Diamond Dogs is a series of vignettes of what could happen 1076 01:08:21,560 --> 01:08:25,120 when society breaks down, so it was more sketchy, 1077 01:08:25,120 --> 01:08:27,680 rather than a story from beginning to end. 1078 01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:34,240 'I started getting into the idea of writing... 1079 01:08:34,240 --> 01:08:38,400 'a kind of non-narrative, that just had situations within it, 1080 01:08:38,400 --> 01:08:41,240 'and the audience kind of joins up the dots their own way, 1081 01:08:41,240 --> 01:08:42,760 'in the way they want to make it. 1082 01:08:42,760 --> 01:08:45,680 'They remake the material they're offered.' 1083 01:08:45,680 --> 01:08:48,440 # Just for a day 1084 01:08:49,920 --> 01:08:51,440 # Oh, honey 1085 01:08:51,440 --> 01:08:53,360 # You're so bad... # 1086 01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:05,440 He brought me another song to work on. 1087 01:09:05,440 --> 01:09:06,880 And I said to him, 1088 01:09:06,880 --> 01:09:08,720 "I would love to do this, but I just... 1089 01:09:08,720 --> 01:09:12,840 "I can't, David, I'm recording an album with my own band!" 1090 01:09:17,240 --> 01:09:19,080 And then, I said to him, 1091 01:09:19,080 --> 01:09:22,120 "I think you should do a record with Donny's group." 1092 01:09:22,120 --> 01:09:25,960 He said, "Really, you think so? You think they'd want to do that?" 1093 01:09:25,960 --> 01:09:28,040 And I said, "Are you kidding me?" 1094 01:09:28,040 --> 01:09:30,640 And I said, "I think it would be amazing." 1095 01:09:32,600 --> 01:09:35,000 I got an e-mail from him, and... 1096 01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:38,520 Basically saying that he would really like to record 1097 01:09:38,520 --> 01:09:39,760 a few tunes with us. 1098 01:09:39,760 --> 01:09:42,520 There was a sentence that he said, something like, you know, 1099 01:09:42,520 --> 01:09:45,440 "It would be my dream to record a few songs 1100 01:09:45,440 --> 01:09:48,680 "with the Donny McCaslin Group," I think that... 1101 01:09:48,680 --> 01:09:52,600 That sentence was kind of, like, "Wow!" 1102 01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:03,360 Whatever he was going through health-wise at the time, 1103 01:10:03,360 --> 01:10:08,640 one thing that was really inspiring was how, from the first day, 1104 01:10:08,640 --> 01:10:12,680 the first note, he was just totally in it. 1105 01:10:12,680 --> 01:10:15,200 By the time I joined you guys, I was not aware of anything, 1106 01:10:15,200 --> 01:10:16,600 and I was actually... 1107 01:10:16,600 --> 01:10:18,640 Even being ignorant of all this, 1108 01:10:18,640 --> 01:10:21,200 I was struck by how healthy and energetic 1109 01:10:21,200 --> 01:10:22,560 and in great spirits he was. 1110 01:10:29,840 --> 01:10:33,240 So, David had a lot of vocal ideas that needed to be done. 1111 01:10:33,240 --> 01:10:35,200 You have him singing this. 1112 01:10:35,200 --> 01:10:37,920 BOWIE'S VOICE DOUBLE-TRACKED: # In the villa of Ormen 1113 01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:41,240 # In the villa of Ormen 1114 01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:44,960 # Stands a solitary candle 1115 01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:48,760 # Ah-ah 1116 01:10:48,760 --> 01:10:52,200 # Ah-ah 1117 01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:55,040 # In the centre of it all 1118 01:10:56,040 --> 01:11:00,400 # In the centre of it all 1119 01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:03,960 # Your eyes... # 1120 01:11:03,960 --> 01:11:06,400 Now, the reason it sounds so good is, 1121 01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:08,240 that's just one David Bowie singing, 1122 01:11:08,240 --> 01:11:11,560 but with his voice put up a fifth interval. 1123 01:11:12,520 --> 01:11:14,960 # On the day of execution 1124 01:11:16,200 --> 01:11:18,600 # On the day of execution 1125 01:11:19,680 --> 01:11:22,480 # Only women kneel and smile 1126 01:11:22,480 --> 01:11:26,040 # Ah-ah 1127 01:11:26,040 --> 01:11:29,280 # Ah-ah 1128 01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:32,640 # At the centre of it all 1129 01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:36,760 # At the centre of it all 1130 01:11:37,720 --> 01:11:41,200 # Your eyes 1131 01:11:44,840 --> 01:11:47,560 # Your eyes... # 1132 01:11:47,560 --> 01:11:49,560 He asked me if I would be interested 1133 01:11:49,560 --> 01:11:52,120 in perhaps putting some images to this song, 1134 01:11:52,120 --> 01:11:53,960 and then began, you know, 1135 01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:57,600 a couple of months of a very interesting collaborative process. 1136 01:11:57,600 --> 01:12:02,000 He would send me drawings, that he would literally say, 1137 01:12:02,000 --> 01:12:04,600 "Do what you want with these drawings," you know? 1138 01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:08,200 He would have this character that he drew, 1139 01:12:08,200 --> 01:12:11,800 the man with sort of gauze, you know, across his face, 1140 01:12:11,800 --> 01:12:16,800 with two buttons for eyes, and we named him Button Eyes. 1141 01:12:20,920 --> 01:12:25,760 And he also sent me an image of a spaceman with a skeleton inside. 1142 01:12:26,720 --> 01:12:32,280 # Ah-ah-ah... # 1143 01:12:32,280 --> 01:12:35,200 To me, it was 100% Major Tom, you know? 1144 01:12:35,200 --> 01:12:39,320 A character that he had, you know, revisited and used over his career. 1145 01:12:40,480 --> 01:12:44,440 Major Tom for him was like some sort of talisman or something. 1146 01:12:44,440 --> 01:12:46,440 He was really along for the ride with David, 1147 01:12:46,440 --> 01:12:50,600 and the idea of space, I think represented... 1148 01:12:50,600 --> 01:12:52,440 Maybe it represented freedom. 1149 01:12:56,280 --> 01:12:58,440 Major Tom still means a lot to me. 1150 01:12:58,440 --> 01:13:01,240 It was the first time I'd been able to create a character 1151 01:13:01,240 --> 01:13:03,200 that was very credible - 1152 01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:05,920 I think for any writer, that's a high point. 1153 01:13:05,920 --> 01:13:07,320 He preceded all the others, 1154 01:13:07,320 --> 01:13:09,800 and I suppose one has a special place for him. 1155 01:13:09,800 --> 01:13:10,880 I do. 1156 01:13:10,880 --> 01:13:13,960 # Ground Control to Major Tom 1157 01:13:17,880 --> 01:13:21,440 # Ground Control to Major Tom 1158 01:13:25,160 --> 01:13:30,200 # Take your protein pills and put your helmet on... # 1159 01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:33,320 - INTERVIEWER: - What is it with spaceships? 1160 01:13:33,320 --> 01:13:37,320 Well, it's an interior dialogue that you manifest physically. 1161 01:13:40,720 --> 01:13:44,480 It's my little inner space, isn't it? Writ large. 1162 01:13:44,480 --> 01:13:46,680 I wouldn't dream of getting on a spaceship. 1163 01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:48,040 It'd scare the shit out of me! 1164 01:13:48,040 --> 01:13:49,760 HE LAUGHS 1165 01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:52,520 I have absolutely no interest or ambition 1166 01:13:52,520 --> 01:13:54,560 to go into space whatsoever. 1167 01:13:54,560 --> 01:13:56,720 I'm scared going down the end of the garden! 1168 01:13:58,040 --> 01:14:02,760 # Though I'm past 100,000 miles 1169 01:14:02,760 --> 01:14:06,120 # I'm feeling very still 1170 01:14:07,200 --> 01:14:12,880 # And I think my spaceship knows which way to go 1171 01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:20,640 # Tell my wife I love her very much She knows 1172 01:14:22,360 --> 01:14:25,400 # Ground Control to Major Tom 1173 01:14:25,400 --> 01:14:28,840 # Your circuit's dead There's something wrong 1174 01:14:28,840 --> 01:14:31,920 # Can you hear me, Major Tom? 1175 01:14:31,920 --> 01:14:35,600 # Can you hear me, Major Tom? 1176 01:14:35,600 --> 01:14:38,520 # Can you hear me, Major Tom? # 1177 01:14:39,480 --> 01:14:44,360 Major Tom was a really great device to keep returning to. 1178 01:14:44,360 --> 01:14:46,120 Maybe there was some little, you know, 1179 01:14:46,120 --> 01:14:48,840 obviously a bit of maybe sentimental attachment to it, 1180 01:14:48,840 --> 01:14:52,560 because it represented a lot in terms of how he became known to us 1181 01:14:52,560 --> 01:14:54,600 and became famous. 1182 01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:57,160 # The shrieking of nothing is killing 1183 01:14:57,160 --> 01:15:01,040 # Just pictures of Jap girls in synthesis 1184 01:15:01,040 --> 01:15:05,960 # And I ain't got no money and I ain't got no hair 1185 01:15:10,160 --> 01:15:14,400 # But I'm hoping to kick But the planet is glowing 1186 01:15:17,680 --> 01:15:21,320 # Ashes to ashes Funk to funky 1187 01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:25,320 # We know Major Tom's a junkie 1188 01:15:25,320 --> 01:15:28,600 # Strung out in heaven's high 1189 01:15:28,600 --> 01:15:32,480 # Hitting an all-time low... # 1190 01:15:34,240 --> 01:15:37,680 He just would take these bits of the past, 1191 01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:39,800 and fashion the future out of them, 1192 01:15:39,800 --> 01:15:42,720 and Major Tom was a big part of that. 1193 01:15:44,600 --> 01:15:47,440 And he's been looking for a home for, you know, how long, 1194 01:15:47,440 --> 01:15:49,240 50 years or something, you know? 1195 01:15:49,240 --> 01:15:53,200 A long time, Major Tom's been trying to find peace and rest, 1196 01:15:53,200 --> 01:15:54,960 and he found it in Blackstar. 1197 01:15:54,960 --> 01:15:57,160 Major Tom is home, finally. 1198 01:15:57,160 --> 01:16:02,040 # Ooh-ooh-ooh... # 1199 01:16:02,040 --> 01:16:05,880 Blackstar, you know, it's really wildly open to interpretation, 1200 01:16:05,880 --> 01:16:09,200 and I think he enjoyed this very much, like any artist. 1201 01:16:09,200 --> 01:16:12,760 Any great artist wants you to stand back and look at the work 1202 01:16:12,760 --> 01:16:16,560 and analyse it and feel things from it. 1203 01:16:16,560 --> 01:16:19,440 And you might not feel the same things. 1204 01:16:19,440 --> 01:16:23,000 The idea of art is to stimulate your own imagination. 1205 01:16:24,640 --> 01:16:28,920 # Ooh-ooh-ooh... # 1206 01:16:28,920 --> 01:16:32,880 You know, after a week or two of us having these chats 1207 01:16:32,880 --> 01:16:36,200 about Button Eyes and the spaceman, 1208 01:16:36,200 --> 01:16:38,160 I get a text message from him, it said, 1209 01:16:38,160 --> 01:16:39,920 "I need to Skype with you, can you Skype?" 1210 01:16:39,920 --> 01:16:42,360 And he's saying, "There's something I have to tell you." 1211 01:16:42,360 --> 01:16:44,040 And I said, "Yeah, sure." 1212 01:16:44,040 --> 01:16:46,920 And then he says, "I have to tell you that I'm very ill, 1213 01:16:46,920 --> 01:16:49,440 "and that I'm probably going to die." You know? 1214 01:16:49,440 --> 01:16:53,000 You know, utterly out of the blue, you know, just like that. 1215 01:16:54,640 --> 01:16:59,400 # Ooh-ooh-ooh... # 1216 01:16:59,400 --> 01:17:01,840 Let this be only coming from me, 1217 01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:04,280 but I think part of the way I reacted, also, 1218 01:17:04,280 --> 01:17:06,920 I felt that when he was saying that, 1219 01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:10,760 I thought for a brief second that he looked scared, actually. 1220 01:17:13,680 --> 01:17:16,760 And then, a second later, he would joke about it, you know? 1221 01:17:19,040 --> 01:17:20,920 Over the next six or eight months, 1222 01:17:20,920 --> 01:17:23,240 the disease or illness was never mentioned, 1223 01:17:23,240 --> 01:17:28,640 and he was in no way, in my mind, you know, affected by his illness. 1224 01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:32,560 # Something happened on the day he died 1225 01:17:33,600 --> 01:17:38,000 # Spirit rose a metre and stepped aside 1226 01:17:38,000 --> 01:17:43,000 # Somebody else took his place And bravely cried 1227 01:17:43,000 --> 01:17:45,400 BOWIE'S VOICE DOUBLE-TRACKED: # I'm a blackstar 1228 01:17:45,400 --> 01:17:48,600 # I'm a blackstar... # 1229 01:17:48,600 --> 01:17:52,520 This is a tradition that David and I always had, like, 1230 01:17:52,520 --> 01:17:56,680 how can we mangle the voice, you know, how can we change it? 1231 01:17:56,680 --> 01:17:59,760 And make one person sound like many people, 1232 01:17:59,760 --> 01:18:03,920 and in many different contexts, and in many different spatial areas. 1233 01:18:03,920 --> 01:18:08,840 # I'm a blackstar, way up, on money I've got game 1234 01:18:08,840 --> 01:18:13,400 # I see right, so wide So open-hearted pain 1235 01:18:13,400 --> 01:18:18,000 # I want eagles in my daydreams Diamonds in my eyes 1236 01:18:18,000 --> 01:18:19,960 # I'm a blackstar 1237 01:18:19,960 --> 01:18:22,680 # I'm a blackstar... # 1238 01:18:22,680 --> 01:18:26,920 David is like some bizarre, skeletal choir, doing, 1239 01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:30,280 "I'm a blackstar, I'm a blackstar," this weird thing. 1240 01:18:30,280 --> 01:18:32,680 It makes this whole section very supernatural. 1241 01:18:32,680 --> 01:18:37,320 # Somebody else took his place and bravely cried 1242 01:18:37,320 --> 01:18:39,720 # I'm a blackstar 1243 01:18:39,720 --> 01:18:41,960 # I'm a star star 1244 01:18:41,960 --> 01:18:44,400 # I'm a blackstar 1245 01:18:44,400 --> 01:18:46,040 # I'm a blackstar... # 1246 01:18:46,040 --> 01:18:48,880 I imagine it must have been cathartic for him. 1247 01:18:48,880 --> 01:18:50,840 He was working tirelessly, 1248 01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:57,280 both on Blackstar, and on Lazarus at the same time. 1249 01:18:57,280 --> 01:18:59,080 Perhaps the catharsis... 1250 01:19:01,200 --> 01:19:05,280 ..surrounding Lazarus was unique, inasmuch as its execution 1251 01:19:05,280 --> 01:19:10,080 required him to relinquish control, and allow so many other people 1252 01:19:10,080 --> 01:19:12,560 to take it and make it happen. 1253 01:19:13,840 --> 01:19:16,280 Countryside disappears beneath my feet. 1254 01:19:16,280 --> 01:19:17,720 You know, I mean, I must say, 1255 01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:20,880 there were times when David and me would be reading scenes together... 1256 01:19:20,880 --> 01:19:23,280 You could feel him...more in there. 1257 01:19:23,280 --> 01:19:25,280 MUSIC PLAYS ON PIANO 1258 01:19:25,280 --> 01:19:27,000 This isn't happening. 1259 01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:29,160 I'm still inside my head. 1260 01:19:29,160 --> 01:19:32,120 You know, you forget, you forget that, actually he's... 1261 01:19:32,120 --> 01:19:34,240 Of course, we forgot that he was dying. 1262 01:19:34,240 --> 01:19:36,640 I'm done with this life! 1263 01:19:36,640 --> 01:19:40,160 The cast, of course, never knew. Only me, Ivo and Robert. 1264 01:19:40,160 --> 01:19:43,360 And so, a new universe I'll dream, 1265 01:19:43,360 --> 01:19:44,960 big, up there. 1266 01:19:47,040 --> 01:19:50,840 And although always stuck inside my breaking mind... 1267 01:19:52,520 --> 01:19:55,480 ..I've stepped off the Earth, and into a better place. 1268 01:19:55,480 --> 01:19:58,920 David didn't want "Heroes" in Lazarus, 1269 01:19:58,920 --> 01:20:02,840 because "Heroes" had become like an anthem. 1270 01:20:02,840 --> 01:20:05,880 He wanted a song that would have sent everyone out 1271 01:20:05,880 --> 01:20:07,160 slitting their wrists. 1272 01:20:09,360 --> 01:20:16,080 Ivo and Enda persuaded him that if "Heroes" was treated musically 1273 01:20:16,080 --> 01:20:21,920 in a different way, it would work for the ending of Lazarus. 1274 01:20:25,240 --> 01:20:26,280 # I 1275 01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:31,000 # I will be king 1276 01:20:34,240 --> 01:20:36,680 # And you 1277 01:20:38,320 --> 01:20:40,320 # You will be queen... # 1278 01:20:41,400 --> 01:20:44,160 It's a reflective, it's a beautiful moment. 1279 01:20:44,160 --> 01:20:47,160 Here is this melancholy, instead of triumphant. 1280 01:20:50,000 --> 01:20:52,120 'Through his relationship with this girl, 1281 01:20:52,120 --> 01:20:56,280 'and her re-awakening him to his vitality, 1282 01:20:56,280 --> 01:20:59,280 'Newton is brought back to life,' 1283 01:20:59,280 --> 01:21:02,400 that he may ready himself to die. 1284 01:21:02,400 --> 01:21:04,240 Perhaps. 1285 01:21:04,240 --> 01:21:05,320 Or not. 1286 01:21:05,320 --> 01:21:06,360 HE LAUGHS 1287 01:21:06,360 --> 01:21:09,040 # But we could be safer 1288 01:21:10,920 --> 01:21:15,320 # Just for one day. # 1289 01:21:15,320 --> 01:21:18,360 There is a catharsis moment at the end, with "Heroes", you know, 1290 01:21:18,360 --> 01:21:20,200 when things clear up. 1291 01:21:20,200 --> 01:21:21,720 He cuts loose everything 1292 01:21:21,720 --> 01:21:25,200 which in a normal life of a normal human being is important... 1293 01:21:25,200 --> 01:21:27,640 - BOTH: - # We can be heroes... # 1294 01:21:27,640 --> 01:21:31,240 .. and then he has to let go every hope, just accepting... 1295 01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:34,960 ..well, his own death, at the end. 1296 01:21:34,960 --> 01:21:38,760 - BOTH: - # We can be heroes 1297 01:21:44,120 --> 01:21:47,240 - BOTH: - # We can be heroes... # 1298 01:21:47,240 --> 01:21:49,000 So, the last thing that you see is, 1299 01:21:49,000 --> 01:21:51,680 Michael C Hall is still on stage, alive, 1300 01:21:51,680 --> 01:21:56,680 but in his mind, he is flying away into the stars. 1301 01:21:56,680 --> 01:21:59,120 That's the last image. 1302 01:21:59,120 --> 01:22:05,440 # Just for one day. # 1303 01:22:15,200 --> 01:22:17,640 APPLAUSE 1304 01:22:18,640 --> 01:22:21,400 I didn't expect David to be there on our opening night. 1305 01:22:21,400 --> 01:22:25,120 We had heard that he was getting weak, but he so wanted to be there. 1306 01:22:25,120 --> 01:22:26,440 And er... 1307 01:22:26,440 --> 01:22:28,840 And he turned up, and he watched it, and then afterwards, 1308 01:22:28,840 --> 01:22:31,000 he took the bows with us, it was very, very sweet. 1309 01:22:32,480 --> 01:22:35,680 You know, he got through the night, but I really am convinced 1310 01:22:35,680 --> 01:22:40,640 that he was fighting death, and he wanted to continue and to continue. 1311 01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:44,080 And then afterwards, we were sitting a little bit, 1312 01:22:44,080 --> 01:22:46,920 talking behind the stage, and he said, 1313 01:22:46,920 --> 01:22:51,120 "Let's start the second one now, the sequel to Lazarus!" 1314 01:22:52,840 --> 01:22:55,600 The last thing I remember David saying to me, 1315 01:22:55,600 --> 01:22:58,440 after, you know, the hugs and the smiles, 1316 01:22:58,440 --> 01:23:01,720 and after that opening night performance was, 1317 01:23:01,720 --> 01:23:04,520 "I think it went well tonight, don't you?" 1318 01:23:04,520 --> 01:23:06,520 That's the last thing I remember him saying. 1319 01:23:06,520 --> 01:23:08,360 And I said, "Yeah, I think it did." 1320 01:23:14,960 --> 01:23:18,600 After the musical opened, I got a call saying, 1321 01:23:18,600 --> 01:23:22,960 "David would love to see you," and so I went over to see him, 1322 01:23:22,960 --> 01:23:26,680 and he was in his bedroom, and we chatted. 1323 01:23:26,680 --> 01:23:31,240 And it was all very lovely, peaceful. 1324 01:23:31,240 --> 01:23:37,920 And so, then we walked to the elevator, and he said, 1325 01:23:37,920 --> 01:23:42,920 "You're a genius," to me, and I said, "No, no, no, I'm not a genius. 1326 01:23:42,920 --> 01:23:46,600 "I'm just the producer. YOU'RE the fucking genius." 1327 01:23:46,600 --> 01:23:48,040 And, erm... 1328 01:23:49,040 --> 01:23:52,880 We had a hug, I got in the elevator, and that was it. 1329 01:23:52,880 --> 01:23:54,400 Last time I saw him. 1330 01:24:18,440 --> 01:24:22,520 David said, "I just want to make a simple performance video." 1331 01:24:22,520 --> 01:24:24,760 I immediately said, 1332 01:24:24,760 --> 01:24:27,680 "The song is called Lazarus. He should be in the bed." 1333 01:24:29,160 --> 01:24:32,600 To me, it had to do with the biblical aspect of it, you know? 1334 01:24:32,600 --> 01:24:34,720 The man who would rise again. 1335 01:24:34,720 --> 01:24:37,920 And it had nothing to do with him being ill. 1336 01:24:37,920 --> 01:24:40,960 That was only because I liked the imagery of it, you know? 1337 01:24:42,880 --> 01:24:46,360 I found out later that the week we were shooting 1338 01:24:46,360 --> 01:24:48,560 was when he found out that this is... 1339 01:24:48,560 --> 01:24:49,920 It's over, you know? 1340 01:24:49,920 --> 01:24:53,360 We'll end treatments, you know, in whatever capacity, 1341 01:24:53,360 --> 01:24:56,320 that means that his illness has won. 1342 01:24:58,680 --> 01:25:00,720 # Look up here 1343 01:25:00,720 --> 01:25:02,640 # I'm in heaven 1344 01:25:06,360 --> 01:25:10,280 # I've got scars that can't be seen 1345 01:25:13,480 --> 01:25:17,400 # I've got drama Can't be stolen 1346 01:25:20,840 --> 01:25:24,440 # Everybody knows me now... # 1347 01:25:27,640 --> 01:25:31,720 I've watched him record, and he's in that song, in that feeling, 1348 01:25:31,720 --> 01:25:32,760 in that moment. 1349 01:25:32,760 --> 01:25:34,280 He would stand in front of the mic, 1350 01:25:34,280 --> 01:25:36,480 and for the four or five minutes he was singing, 1351 01:25:36,480 --> 01:25:38,600 he would pour his heart out. 1352 01:25:39,640 --> 01:25:42,960 The audio picked up his breathing in between those lines. 1353 01:25:42,960 --> 01:25:47,240 # Look up here, man I'm in danger... # 1354 01:25:47,240 --> 01:25:50,440 HE BREATHES 1355 01:25:50,440 --> 01:25:54,200 # I've got nothing left to lose... # 1356 01:25:54,200 --> 01:25:57,000 HE BREATHES 1357 01:25:57,000 --> 01:26:01,920 # I'm so high it makes my brain whirl... # 1358 01:26:01,920 --> 01:26:04,680 HE BREATHES 1359 01:26:04,680 --> 01:26:09,000 # Dropped my cellphone down below... # 1360 01:26:12,520 --> 01:26:14,640 It wasn't that he was out of breath - he was... 1361 01:26:14,640 --> 01:26:17,480 like, hyperventilating, in a way, like, 1362 01:26:17,480 --> 01:26:21,560 getting his energy up to sing this, to deliver this song. 1363 01:26:21,560 --> 01:26:23,560 # You know, I'll be free... # 1364 01:26:23,560 --> 01:26:25,440 He was quite stoked. 1365 01:26:25,440 --> 01:26:29,080 I like to say, in the zone, and I could see him through the window, 1366 01:26:29,080 --> 01:26:31,280 that he was really feeling it. 1367 01:26:35,880 --> 01:26:39,240 # Oh, I'll be free... # 1368 01:26:39,240 --> 01:26:41,360 HE BREATHES 1369 01:26:43,200 --> 01:26:48,640 # Ain't that just like me? # 1370 01:26:50,800 --> 01:26:52,880 A man on top of his game. 1371 01:26:52,880 --> 01:26:54,880 It's brilliant, absolutely brilliant. 1372 01:26:54,880 --> 01:26:57,760 And the saddest lyrics to hear them now. 1373 01:26:58,840 --> 01:26:59,880 HE SIGHS 1374 01:27:19,680 --> 01:27:21,680 - REPORTER: - It's 7:09. 1375 01:27:21,680 --> 01:27:25,440 Well, the shock news has only just been officially confirmed. 1376 01:27:25,440 --> 01:27:27,000 David Bowie is dead. 1377 01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:30,800 David Bowie, rock and roll rebel, actor and cultural icon, 1378 01:27:30,800 --> 01:27:32,920 has died at age 69. 1379 01:27:32,920 --> 01:27:35,840 We lost David Bowie this morning. 1380 01:27:37,320 --> 01:27:39,680 Erm... And it's a big deal. 1381 01:27:40,960 --> 01:27:42,200 There have been news crews, 1382 01:27:42,200 --> 01:27:44,760 and fans from all around the world leaving floral tributes... 1383 01:27:44,760 --> 01:27:47,080 ..in downtown Manhattan, and you can see behind me... 1384 01:27:47,080 --> 01:27:49,360 David Bowie, il est mort... 1385 01:27:49,360 --> 01:27:51,600 Fans laying flowers... 1386 01:27:51,600 --> 01:27:54,200 Even the Archbishop of Canterbury was a fan. 1387 01:27:55,280 --> 01:27:57,080 # Heaven loves ya 1388 01:27:59,040 --> 01:28:01,040 # The clouds part for ya 1389 01:28:02,160 --> 01:28:05,040 # Nothing stands in your way 1390 01:28:05,040 --> 01:28:06,640 # When you're a boy 1391 01:28:11,040 --> 01:28:13,040 # Clothes always fit ya 1392 01:28:14,000 --> 01:28:16,840 # Life is a pop of the cherry 1393 01:28:16,840 --> 01:28:18,840 # When you're a boy... # 1394 01:28:18,840 --> 01:28:22,440 'It's been an incredibly full life, and, er...' 1395 01:28:22,440 --> 01:28:25,520 Apart from the drugs in the '70s, I think little of it has been wasted 1396 01:28:25,520 --> 01:28:29,400 in terms of, I've been able to, sort of, harness every moment, in a way. 1397 01:28:29,400 --> 01:28:31,520 I'm... I'm a really lucky chap. 1398 01:28:33,040 --> 01:28:37,160 - INTERVIEWER: - And legacy - how would you like your legacy written? 1399 01:28:37,160 --> 01:28:40,480 'I'd love people to believe that I really had great haircuts.' 1400 01:28:40,480 --> 01:28:41,520 HE LAUGHS 1401 01:28:41,520 --> 01:28:42,560 # Boys 1402 01:28:45,400 --> 01:28:47,200 # Boys keep swinging 1403 01:28:47,200 --> 01:28:49,840 # Boys always work it out... # 1404 01:28:58,600 --> 01:29:00,560 OK, so, at the beginning of this track, 1405 01:29:00,560 --> 01:29:03,360 I noticed there's some waveforms. I said, "What's all this?" 1406 01:29:03,360 --> 01:29:06,160 So, here's Space Oddity. 1407 01:29:07,560 --> 01:29:09,280 'Little mouse fart.' 1408 01:29:09,280 --> 01:29:10,840 Little mouse part. 1409 01:29:10,840 --> 01:29:12,600 'The mouse... A part for the mouse?' 1410 01:29:12,600 --> 01:29:14,760 - Oh... - 'Little mouse FART.' 1411 01:29:14,760 --> 01:29:17,080 - 'Oh, little mouse FART!' - 'Yeah.' 1412 01:29:17,080 --> 01:29:18,400 'Little mouse fart.' 1413 01:29:18,400 --> 01:29:19,440 Ah! 1414 01:29:20,480 --> 01:29:21,560 Oh, he farted! 1415 01:29:21,560 --> 01:29:23,280 HE LAUGHS 1416 01:29:26,720 --> 01:29:29,120 He... David Bowie doesn't fart! 1417 01:29:30,200 --> 01:29:32,440 No, we don't... We'll never hear David Bowie fart. 107692

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