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(acoustic guitar strums "LA Freeway")

(car doors slam)

(engine starts and rumbles)

♪ Pack up all your dishes ♪

♪ Make note of all good wishes ♪

♪ Say goodbye to the landlord for me ♪

♪ That son of a bitch has always bored me ♪

♪ Throw out them L.A. papers ♪

♪ And that moldy box of Vanilla Wafers ♪

♪ Adios to all this concrete ♪

♪ Gonna get me some dirt road back streets ♪

♪ If I can just get off of this L.A. freeway ♪

♪ Without gettin' killed or caught ♪

(engine roars)

♪ Down that road in a cloud of smoke ♪

♪ To some land I ain't bought, bought, bought ♪

♪ And it's, here's to you old Skinny Dennis ♪

♪ The only one I think I will miss ♪

♪ I can hear that old bass singin' ♪

♪ Sweet and low like a gift you're bringin' ♪

♪ Oh, Susanna, don't you cry, babe ♪

♪ Love's a gift that surely handmade ♪

♪ We got somethin' to believe in ♪

♪ Don't you think it's time we're leavin'? ♪

♪ If I can just get off of this L.A. freeway ♪

♪ Without gettin' killed or caught ♪

♪ Down that road in a cloud of smoke ♪

♪ To some land I ain't bought ♪

(car engine rumbles)

(acoustic guitar strums "LA Freeway")

(car engine rumbles)

(car engine stops)

(car headlights switch clicks)

(audience cheers and applauds)

- I'm proud to present the ASCAP Lifetime Achievement Award

to Guy Clark for his outstanding accomplishments

as a songwriter, recording artist, and musical mentor

in the field of country music.

(audience cheers and applauds)

- Thank you.

Thank you very much.

This is (exhales loudly) breathtaking.

Susanna, my wife, Susanna, and I

moved here 27 years ago.

I figure, another 10 or 15, I'll probably break even.

(audience laughs)

(Guy laughs)

Without wonderful friends like these,

Rodney, and Lyle, and Vince,

a thousand others, too numerous to mention,

this wouldn't be possible,

and especially without Susanna.

Thank you very much.

(audience cheers and applauds)

- Guy was madly in love with Susanna,

because she challenged him all the time.

You know, he couldn't get anything over on her,

and he was confident enough to just eat it up.

- From my point of view,

he was the smartest guy in the room,

and when Townes came in,

you know, it was a toss up

between who was the smartest guy in the room then.

Susanna would tell ya

she was the smartest person in the room.

- I would suspect, Guy Clark came out of the womb

knowing exactly who he was.

You know, he just had that aura about him that was,

it was commanding. (upbeat instrumental "Rita Ballou")

♪ Hill country honky-tonkin' Rita Ballou ♪

♪ Every beer joint in town ♪

♪ Has played the fool for you ♪

♪ Backslidin' barrel ridin' Rita Ballou ♪

♪ There ain't a cowboy in Texas ♪

♪ Would not ride a bull for you ♪

♪ All right ♪

- Another thing about Guys is,

he's a real good driver.

We play a lot together,

and we rent cars, and he has yet to let me drive.

He will not let me drive,

and I'm an expert driver, you know?

(tape recorder whirs and clicks)

- [Susanna] Okay, TR.

I'm Susanna Clark.

I grew up an Okie debutante from a high society,

artistic, and very religious family.

I have eight siblings, and we're all close.

I even shared an apartment with my sister, Bunny,

while we worked at our family's art center.

But now, I live in Nashville with my husband Guy,

and our best friend, Townes Van Zandt.

Guy and I paint,

and all three of us write songs.

We're starving artists, (Susanna laughs)

but we have each other.

(guitar strums an upbeat "South Coast of Texas")

Guy and Townes became best friends down in Texas

back in the mid-'60s.

Houston was like the Greenwich Village of Texas.

- [Guy] Jerry Jeff was around,

and Townes was around, and pretty crazy.

When I first met Townes, it was mid-'60s, I guess,

and we were all playing at the coffee house

called Sand Mountain Coffee House,

which just served coffee,

and there was also a place called the Jester,

which was a bar, bar.

Singers, and songwriters, and folk singers

could get on stage behind a microphone,

and play for the folks, you know?

That was the goal, to get an audience,

express yourself to them.

When I met Townes, I think he'd written two or three songs.

He was the first guy I ran across who was doing this,

who had a real grasp of the English language.

He was a storyteller, you know?

Anyway, I'd never really run across anyone quite like that.

And we became friends,

'cause we kinda had the same sense of humor.

I think he liked my song writing, as I did his.

(guitar strums an upbeat "South Coast of Texas")

- [Susanna] Guy had a day job at a TV station,

and he built and fixed guitars,

but all he really wanted to do was write songs.

Around this time, Guy met Susan Spaw.

She was a folk singer.

Guy was 24, Susan was 18.

They got married in June of 1966.

They had to get married,

because Susan was expecting Guy's baby,

and, of course, Guy was gonna do the right thing.

Six months later, their son, Travis Carroll Clark, was born.

- [Guy] That was about the time I got a job

as the assistant art director at Channel 13 in Houston

- [Susanna] In 1969, I was living in Oklahoma City

with my sister.

- [Guy] Hmm.

I had gone to Oklahoma City to see her sister, Bunny,

and I had met her at a club.

Townes and I were playing in a place in Oklahoma City

called the Sword and Stone.

Townes and I made a deal to come hang out on Sunday,

just go over to her apartment and visit.

Well, we went over there, and she said,

"My sister's coming by",

and her sister was Susanna.

That was the first time I had met her.

- [Susanna] I walked into my living room

where Guy and Townes sat on my couch.

They looked exhausted and skinny.

I asked them if they wanted vitamins.

- [Guy] She came in, and we started talking about painting.

- [Susanna] I was painting a prairie.

I got stuck, and said half out loud,

"I can't make the foreground come forward in this painting".

Guy got up, and he walked over to me, and said,

"You can do this, and that,

and you can mix this color with that color".

- [Guy] I told her,

I thought she oughta put an elephant going over the hill,

just his butt, you know?

But she could paint, that was the thing.

- [Susanna] I liked Guy.

He knew somethin' about art, and that impressed me.

He was also tall and handsome, (Susanna chuckles)

Guy and Bunny tried to keep up a long-distance relationship.

He came to visit Bunny.

He wrote to her.

He sent her small gifts.

But back in Houston, Guy's life had fallen apart,

and Susan took Travis, and left him.

- [Guy] Man, I was lost,

looking for something.

And I had a friend who lives, Minor Wilson,

who had a guitar shop in San Francisco.

I just kinda moved in with him.

You know, I slept in the shop on the vacant end of it,

and just kinda worked with him

building guitars for almost a year livin' there.

At that time in '69, you know,

there was a lot of drugs, and a lot of Hells Angels.

I mean, it was too much for a country boy like me,

(Guy chuckles) you know?

(acoustic guitar strums "She Ain't Going Nowhere")

I kinda needed to go back, to take care of my

wife and child.

But anyway, I was trying to be responsible,

go back to Houston.

- [Susanna] Bunny had problems of her own.

She was pregnant, and miserable,

and terrified to break the news to our mother.

So when Guy asked Bunny to join him

on the road trip back to Texas,

she jumped at the chance to get away.

- [Guy] What we decided to do,

was to get a drive away car,

and we drove across the

Southwestern United States in that car.

And at some point, we were...

It was Arizona.

There was a little Curio shop.

I saw this ring.

It just knocked me over, the design of it.

Man, it just fit, like, perfect.

- [Susanna] Bunny and Guy bought a turquoise ring

that Guy would wear forever.

It wasn't long after that trip

that my beautiful sister, Bunny, killed herself.

(guitar strums "She Ain't Goin' Nowhere)"

♪ She ain't goin' nowhere, she's just leavin' ♪

♪ She ain't goin' nowhere she can't breathe in ♪

♪ And she ain't goin' home, and that's for sure ♪

- [Susanna] Guy wrote "She Ain't Goin' Nowhere" for Bunny.

♪ And she ain't goin' home, and that's for sure ♪

- [Susanna] It's his favorite song he ever wrote.

I called Guy,

and asked him to come to Oklahoma for the funeral.

- [Guy] And that was very, very growing up.

I'm not the only person that's gone through it,

but it was serious.

And it was, you know...

I mean, it was very sad,

you know, to have your sister blow her brains out, you know?

That stuff happens.

It's just part of being alive, you know,

and going through this veil of tears.

(somber acoustic guitar "She Ain't Going Nowhere")

Susanna and I kinda migrated to one another

during all of these

goings on around Bunny's funeral.

Susanna, for some reason, felt guilty about it.

She thought it was her fault, you know?

- [Susanna] We were heartbroken over Bunny's suicide,

and Guy and I clung to each other.

I was desperate to hold on to my sister,

and Guy was the closest thing.

In our grief over Bunny, we fell in love.

- [Guy] I was just overjoyed to run into a woman,

like Susanna, who was smart,

was gifted, you know, and did something about it.

It was just true love, I guess, you know?

- [Susanna] After Bunny died, everything changed.

There were so many reminders of my sister in Oklahoma City.

I just wanted to start over.

- [Guy] I was more than willing to move to Oklahoma City.

All I wanted to do was be with her,

and I don't care where it is, you know?

So we just packed all her stuff in her car and my car,

and moved to Houston.

- [Susanna] When I moved to Houston,

I did not know what I was getting myself into.

Our house was a gathering place

for stoners to drop in and get high.

I painted while Guy went to work

at the TV station every day.

It was a terribly lonesome time for me.

Guy is a stoic West Texas hard-ass,

but he'd been close to Bunny, and that was our bond.

Townes came over one day,

wrapped me in a bear hug, and said,

"If Guy loves you, then so do I".

While Guy was distant and distracted, I leaned on Townes.

He was sweet and attentive.

- [Guy] And I'd been the art director

for the CBS affiliate in Houston.

You know, I was playing at night,

and tryin' to write songs,

and I finally just snapped, you know,

and said, "I can't do this".

"I'm gonna go be a songwriter."

I'm 30 years old, and if I don't do this,

I will regret it for the rest of my life,

or probably kill myself, you know?

And I had met a couple of guys from Los Angeles

who were traveling around, and looking for talent.

So with just that much encouragement,

Susanna and I packed up,

and drove the VW bus all the way to LA.

- [Susanna] We found a little guest house

to rent in Long Beach.

I painted and wrote songs.

Guy painted and wrote songs too,

and tried to get a publishing deal.

He wanted to make his living as a songwriter.

- [Guy] I mean, when I first went to LA

to try to get in the music business, I had no tapes.

I would go to people's office

and play my guitar for 'em, you know?

And they were just like, wow, that's different.

- [Susanna] After Townes followed us to Los Angeles

to record an album,

his girlfriend was murdered while hitchhiking around LA.

Townes was grief-stricken,

and it reminded me of Bunny.

We sat together on the beach for days,

and consoled each other.

Guy finally landed a big publishing deal

with RCA in Nashville.

Outlaw songwriters gravitated to Tennessee

to be a part of that scene.

- It was the counterpart to Los Angeles,

in the way that a music mecca,

or city, could be a community.

- [Susanna] Kris Kristofferson, Mickey Newbury,

and Willie Nelson were just killing it

with their poetic songs.

- People started to see the impact of songs

that weren't little darlin' songs, as they call 'em.

There was a little more thoughtful

kind of songwriting going on.

And I think seeing those kinds of things happen

is inspiring to people that aren't

trying to put on a rhinestone outfit,

and have a career as a singer of country songs.

- [Susanna] Townes followed us to Nashville.

We dragged a used mattress from a grocery store dumpster

for him to sleep on.

Guy and I got married, and Townes was our best man.

He was with us on our wedding night,

and lived with us for the next eight months.

- [Guy] I think we might've gotten

a pint of vodka or somethin',

just 'cause we didn't wanna get too drunk.

- [Susanna] Guy and I were married.

Guy and Townes were best friends,

but Townes and I were soulmates.

Guy and Townes got the flu.

They were such babies. (Susanna chuckles)

So I took care of them 'em.

While they slept,

I started painting the bouncing apple,

but I ran outta white paint.

Townes got some money from his publisher,

and bought paint for me.

We didn't have money for food,

but Townes wanted me to have paint.

(Susanna chuckles)

It's the most important I've ever felt.

- [Guy] And that was one of the reasons

that they were such good friends, you know?

He knew what was most important to Susanna.

- [Susanna] Townes and I live in a mystical world.

One that Guy doesn't understand.

He gets mad at us when we talk over his head.

(Susanna laughs)

- [Guy] Yeah, one day in East Nashville,

in the first little house we moved to,

something had pissed me off

about the way Townes and Susanna

were denigrating my intelligence,

and I was offended.

So I proceeded to just quietly

go get a hammer and some nails.

(objects clattering)

I don't know.

I just nailed myself in that front room.

(knocking)

- [Susanna] So he nailed himself in the room,

and he nailed the window shut too.

(mellow instrumental "Let Him Roll")

♪ So he died ♪

- [Susanna] Guy may have had a hissy fit,

but he wrote "Let Him Roll" while he was in that room.

♪ Just let him roll ♪

♪ Lord, let him roll ♪

- [Townes] Guy and I, one time,

we were living together in Nashville,

and our house was infested by mice.

We got this system down,

where Guy would get a broom,

and I'd hide around the corner with a paper sack,

and Guy would chase the mice down the hall.

As soon as he'd hit the corner,

he'd give 'em a lick with the broom into the sack.

And we had a sack full of like, what?

Eight mice. (Guy laughs)

And we went down to a local pool room in Nashville,

turned 'em loose on the pool table.

Kinda like split through the pockets, right?

(Guy laughs) Pew, pew, pew, pew.

And some guys come, (balls clang)

and started this game of 8-ball,

and every time somebody would sink a ball

in the pockets, you know,

Susanna, Guy's wife, was,

"Oh, no, oh, no!".

She was like imagining all the little mice

running around the tube,

you know, the eight ball was right behind 'em.

We finally had to leave.

We had to take Susanna home.

(Guy laughs) (Townes laughs)

- [Guy] Yep, we know how to have a good time,

don't we? (both laughing)

All right. (acoustic guitar strumming)

- [Susanna] "It was just after we said I do

that I ever knew there was any one but you."

"It was at one of those parties they give us newlyweds

that I ever craved another man's bed."

"He told me he'd rather give his own life

than take the love of his best friend's wife."

"Now we've lived this way for the last thousand years,

measured with tears for my husband and his wife."

"Now he comes to visit, and we all play cards,

and we study the peach trees in the backyard."

"Then 12 o'clock comes, and he must depart."

"One is my soul, and the other my heart."

(acoustic guitar strums "LA Freeway")

We were thrilled when Jerry Jeff Walker came through town,

and picked up a couple of Guy's songs.

- [Jerry Jeff] I go to New York, and I said,

"I'm gonna do the song on that, finishin' this project."

"I'm gonna do 'Old Time Feeling',

but you guys oughta listen to Guy Clark."

"He really writes some good stuff."

I said, "He wrote this other song called 'LA Freeway'",

and I played just that chorus,

and they go, "Do that one",

and I said, "Okay, I'll do 'em both".

So I wound up doing "Old Time Feeling" and "LA Freeway",

and, of course, the hit had the chorus,

and it had everything else.

- [Susanna] Jerry Jeff put Guy on the map.

"LA Freeway" was a hit, and Guy's career took off.

- [Guy] Susanna and I were living in Los Angeles

when I was workin' at the Dobro factory.

I was playing in a little string band at night,

and about 4:30 in the morning,

we're driving back to LA after the gig,

falling asleep in the back of this old Cadillac,

and I sat up, and I looked around to see where we were,

and I said, "If I could just get off of this LA Freeway"

without getting killed or caught",

and started to go back to sleep,

and I went, "Write that down".

And I got Susanna's eyebrow pencil,

and a burger sack, and wrote,

"If I can just get off this LA Freeway

without getting killed or caught",

put it in my pocket, and went back to sleep.

And I carried that in my billfold,

in my wallet, for two years, until we moved to Nashville.

My only tip about writing, or songwriting, is,

if you have an idea, if you have a flash, write it down.

'Cause if you don't, five minutes, you'll forget it.

(acoustic guitar strums "LA Freeway")

- [Susanna] Luckenbach, Texas is a sacred place for Guy.

He loves to go to Luckenbach.

One night, Guy described every detail of Luckenbach

to our songwriter friend, Chips Moman.

- [Guy] And I was telling Bobby and Chips

what a cool place Luckenbach, Texas was,

'cause I was getting ready to go there.

We were going, "And y'all oughta just go with me".

"Come on, let's go."

"Okay, man, I'm with you."

- [Susanna] Chips didn't come to Luckenbach with us.

In fact, Chips never went to Luckenbach,

but that didn't stop him from writing a song about it.

♪ Let's go to Luckenbach, Texas ♪

♪ With Willie, Waylon and the boys ♪

- [Guy] 'Cause it was such a well-rendered story.

♪ This successful life we're livin' ♪

♪ Got us feuding like the Hatfields and McCoys ♪

- "Luckenbach, Texas" might be the song

that defined that whole outlaw movement.

That's one of those that everybody knows.

You sing along.

It's part of our DNA.

♪ Out in Luckenbach, Texas ♪

♪ Ain't nobody feelin' no pain ♪

Its like I heard it and went, oh no man, come on.

I'm not offended by the fact that they did that.

I don't think I am.

- [Susanna] Actually, Guy never got over it.

It was a missed opportunity.

That song made millions.

Songwriters with lofty ideals knew where to find Guy.

He didn't care about mainstream music.

His only desire was to write songs as great literature.

Our house was a hippie poet salon.

- "So that was just a moveable feast", to quote Hemingway.

But Guy was really the center of it.

I've always said, he was the curator of what was good.

- So the salon existed,

because we had no other way to figure out

our audience was ourselves.

- That is where Guy's creativity was at its best,

and at its finest.

He had a jeweler's eye in that moment,

and was a profound influence on me.

- [Steve] So we were just playing songs,

trying to impress each other,

'cause we had no other audience except ourselves,

which makes a very jaded, tough audience,

and I think sometimes it accelerated, you know,

how good we got.

- All right, do it.

- Guy, wasn't in the business of harvesting stardom.

He was in the business of harvesting art,

and harvesting poetry.

- Listen to that song.

- [Rodney] He could identify what was true,

and real, and good,

and really insightful, incisive, true songs.

Most everybody that I knew wanted to be around that.

- All right. - Yay! (hand claps)

- I certainly did,

'cause I wanted to learn about that.

- We weren't trying to impress Guy

as much as we were trying to impress Susanna,

and the reason we felt that way,

is because Guy was trying to impress Susanna.

- You know, Guy was the sun, and it's just all, you know,

there was a lot of planets spinning around there,

and, you know, maybe Susanna was the sun sometimes,

and Guy was the moon,

and then Guy was the sun, and Susanna was the moon,

and the rest of these artists would orbit around that.

- They were both artists.

They both carried themselves as artists.

You know, we learned to write songs from Guy and Townes,

but we learned how to

carry ourselves as artists from Susanna.

- She drank a lot.

I mean she drank heavy, you know?

She was two fisted, you know?

She said, well, I'll show, you know,

I'm hangin' with a Guy and Townes,

that I can drink as much as they do.

You know, I can do as much blow as they do, you know?

And I can be more lucid than they are.

And she was fun, and she was painting,

and she was a poet,

she just, you know, had a, like a magic wand, in a way.

That, tap you on the shoulders a couple of times

with my magic wand,

and you, too, will have the magic,

and you, too, will be an artist,

and you, too, will understand that art is the process.

It's not the end result.

- [Guy] She was a great painter,

but she wouldn't clean a brush.

She'd let it dry, and throw it away,

you know, $100 brush,

and I'm goin', come on.

She wouldn't wash a pan.

She'd go buy a new $50 copper clad frying pan,

use it once, burn it, and throw it away.

"It's about the food, the nourishment."

"It's not about washin' dishes."

And that was it, you know?

It was just like, you can't argue with that, you know?

- She was as no BS as Guy was, you know?

They were the perfect pair, you know?

And they're the kinda couple that

you dream about being,

in that it's not one or the other,

it's always both.

- [Susanna] Guy didn't care about hit songs.

He cared about great songs,

and those great songs landed him a record deal.

- [Guy] I had a stack of songs to draw from,

and RCA was gonna put out the record,

and they brought some producer down from New York.

I mean, he was a nice enough guy,

but he was prissy and in charge.

(Guy chuckles)

Two things I really don't get along with.

Well, it was all brand new for me.

I'd never played with a drummer

before I came to Nashville, you know?

Being in a recording studio was exciting,

you know, to actually go in a studio, and have a full band.

I always thought it sounded like shit

but it was exciting, you know?

But I finally just said, "Man, stop this right now".

"If you put this record out,

I'll change my fuckin' name, and do somethin' else."

- [Susanna] Guy was miserable

making records the Nashville way.

Guy was a folk singer.

He cared about acoustic guitars and meaningful lyrics.

- [Guy] We just kind of scrambled around,

Rodney and some friends,

and kinda scabbed some demos that I had been doing,

and fixed 'em up, and just did it almost for nothin',

'cause we'd already spent all the money

on the first album.

- [Susanna] When Guy sang

"Desperados Waiting For The Train" for Townes,

Townes said, "Gone commercial, huh?".

(Susanna laughs)

Guy could go in, and sing a song in front of an audience,

and he wouldn't give a flying fuck,

but if he sang it in front of Townes,

Guy would be crazy until Townes gave the lordly okay.

Townes was the yardstick.

(guitar strums "Desperados Waiting for a Train")

Old No 1 painted a picture of Guys' childhood,

in the West Texas town of Monahans.

- [Guy] I mean, West Texas is really austere,

and it's really beautiful.

I really love the desert.

I mean, it's like stunningly beautiful at certain times,

and it's also very harsh.

Cold, hot.

But I think it

it shapes your character in a way

that no other place in the world does.

I mean, I saw stuff growing up

that I wouldn't trade for anything.

I've seen oil wells blow out, like gushers.

I could never forget the smell

of just raw crude oil comin' out of the ground,

or way over the derrick,

(Guy laughs)

you know, stuff like that.

Tumbleweeds, sand storms.

- [Susanna] Guy came from tough stock.

He lived like he was in some old Western movie,

badass grandmothers, and an old wildcatter desperado

named Jack Prigg, his best friend.

- [Guy] I just happened to run across this crusty, old guy

who drilled oil wells all over the world.

I mean, the first wells in South America,

and the first wells in Iraq, and Iran in the '20s.

Never married,

but wound up living at my grandmother's hotel.

In World War II, my father was overseas,

and this was who took me everywhere,

and taught me everything, showed me how to whittle,

took me to bars, taught me to drive.

I jokingly say he was like my grandfather.

He was kinda my grandmother's boyfriend,

but he was like part of the family.

(guitar strums "Desperados Waiting for a Train")

Both of my grandmothers were just, like, tough as nails.

My father's mother had her leg amputated

on the kitchen table when she was 12-years-old,

and wound up runnin' this hotel in Monahans, Texas.

Her husband was a drug addict.

"Pharmacist" is what he called himself, (Guy laughs)

and left, when my father was seven, I think.

Never came back.

She was just a little, gray haired, church going lady,

and she bootlegged whiskey out of the back of her hotel.

And the other one came from Kentucky in a covered wagon

to the Indian territory when she was 12-years-old,

and I think they moved to San Antonio,

and dealt horses out of the back of a wagon.

And she wound up back in Oklahoma.

And was a federal judge.

You know, sent guys to the pen.

Just like, wow!

- There is something romantic about Texas, you know,

and all of its glory, and all its debauchery,

and a Guy was the literary genius of it.

His songs were literature.

(guitar strums "Desperados Waiting for a Train")

- [Susanna] Old No 1 had great reviews,

but did not sell.

- [Guy] I just wasn't cut out

to do the Nashville country star thing.

They found that out pretty quick.

- [Susanna] It was a big deal when Dottsy recorded my song,

"I'll be your San Antone Rose".

Suddenly, I was a hit songwriter,

while RCA was still trying to get Guy off the ground.

- She knew how to put a lot of heart into these songs

that were still kinda basically,

kind of basic country songs that were pretty commercial.

So therefore, she was more successful at it than we were.

- [Guy] She just watched Townes and I go through

all of this angst, and artistic whatever,

that we were trying to write songs, and make a difference,

and she could just sit down,

and write anything off the top of her head,

and have a hit number one song, you know?

She'd say,

"Is that what y'all were trying to do?".

You know, we're just like, oh, fuck, you know?

She considered herself a painter

who dabbled in song writing.

She had a guitar, but she never learned to tune it.

This isn't about learning to play the guitar.

It's about writin' hit songs.

(Guy laughs)

- [Susanna] While Guy scrambled

to make Old No 1 into something,

Townes went back and forth between Nashville and Austin.

When we were not together,

Townes still called me every morning at 8:30.

We talked about language, and words, and poetry, and songs.

More often than not,

he'd read me his new poem of the day.

Songs always had to work

as a poem on paper first, Townes' rule.

(male speaks indistinctly) (Susanna laughs)

(all laughing)

On Christmas Eve, 1976, Townes came over.

I got T.R. out to document our conversation.

(Townes picks upbeat guitar tune)

(Townes picks upbeat guitar tune)

(Guy and Susanna laughing)

(bad acoustic guitar buzzer sounds)

(all laughing)

(guitar strums "Texas Cookin'")

- [Guy] Well, I'm 41.

I have blue eyes, and I like fried chicken.

- [Susanna] RCA had high hopes

for Guy's next record, Texas Cookin'.

- [Guy] You know, I wrote it after I moved to Nashville,

'cause I couldn't get any real food.

You know, you can't buy barbecue here.

Only barbecue is pork, you know?

- [Susanna] A few Texas radio stations

got on board with the single,

but RCA wanted a national hit on country radio,

and it was not happening.

♪ Come back home ♪

- [Guy] It's a hard thing to do, you know?

I mean, where do you put a record like that?

I mean, is that country, or is that pop?

You know, they don't really have a record bin

to put that stuff in,

and they don't really know what to do with it.

♪ Oh my, mama, ain't that Texas cookin' somethin' ♪

- "Why didn't Guy Clark become a big star",

you know, quote unquote?

Well, I can tell you a story

that, to me, illustrates it in a way.

Guy had Old No. 1 out,

and was getting booked on Austin City Limits.

So he said, "Come on, go down".

"Let's go do Austin City Limits,

come sing harmony with me, and play guitar".

- [Announcer] Tonight, It's Texas Cookin' with Guy Clark.

- The night before the shoot,

which if somebody were thinking about stardom,

and image projection,

we'd all gone to bed, got some rest,

and got up, and got on with the business of becoming a star.

But Jerry Jeff came around to the hotel,

and a couple of other yahoos,

and we stayed up all night swapping songs.

♪ Run his fingers through ♪

♪ Seventy years ♪ - Guy didn't care about

pleasing the record label.

He was passionate about the songs,

and he was hell bent on doing things his way.

RCA dropped him.

♪ We was friends, me and this old man ♪

♪ Was like desperados waiting for a train ♪

♪ Was like desperados waiting for a train ♪

♪ Well, he's a drifter ♪

♪ And a driller of oil wells ♪

♪ And an old school man of the world ♪

- [Susanna] He signed a deal

with another major label, Warner Brothers,

just down the street on Music Row.

♪ And he'd wink and give me money ♪

- [Guy] And I got real enamored with Warner Brothers,

and that whole scene Emmylou was in.

The guys in LA were throwing money around,

like it was nuts, you know?

I mean, I was spending $125,000 on an album, you know?

It was just absolutely stupid. ♪ Waiting for a train ♪

- [Susanna] Warner Brothers released the album Guy Clark.

It bombed. ♪ Waiting for a train ♪

♪ Like desperados waiting for a train ♪

(audience cheers and applauds)

- [Susanna] I had a great year.

Jerry Jeff Walker recorded my songs.

Willie and Emmy used my paintings for album covers.

Emmylou released Quarter Moon in a Ten Cent Town.

That title came from a line in "Easy From Now On",

which is a song I wrote with Carlene Carter.

♪ It's gonna be easy from now on ♪

- [Susanna] Guy seemed resentful at my success.

Emmy and Rodney were getting a lot of attention

with their records.

Guy wanted some of that.

- When the new wave post-punk-rock-thing hit,

I thought, oh boy, we gotta get some edge.

So I sought out Craig Leon, and we made

But What Will the Neighbors Think.

- [Guy] Rodney's a drummer.

He loves drums.

He loves the sound of drums.

He plays drums.

And he loved the drum sound

that Craig Leon got on his record,

and consequently,

just pushed me in that direction, you know?

And I went, okay.

I don't know, you know, anything about drums,

but if you say so.

So once again, that was that kind of situation,

man, if you put this out, I'll split.

I'll change my name.

I'll do anything, but this is not right,

that I can't in good conscience

live with this kind of production.

- [Susanna] Once again, Guy scrapped an entire record.

He turned to Rodney to produce The South Coast of Texas.

- [Guy] And once again, you know, we just scraped,

and stole studio time,

you know, just anything we could do to get this record made.

Rodney was gonna produce it,

and everything was gonna be different.

- We made South Coast Of Texas, I think, in three days.

And also, sweet Vince Gill came in,

and he and I did the background vocals,

and I thought it was a really fine record.

I think the record company appreciated it to some degree.

I'm not sure they knew,

yet knew how to market a poet of Guy's caliber.

♪ Oh, the south coast of Texas ♪

♪ That's a thin slice of life ♪

♪ It's salty and hard ♪ - In the fifth grade,

Guy moved to Rockport,

that's a little fishing town on the South Coast of Texas.

- [Guy] I think it was always kind of a wonderful.

It was a really small town.

My graduating class was 46,

and, you know, everybody knew everybody,

and it seemed like idyllic.

You know, I played football, and basketball, and ran track,

was on the Student Council, you know,

all of that social stuff that happens in high school.

My father was a lawyer,

and my mother worked as a secretary.

She had such an amazing encyclopedia of stuff she could do.

One of 'em was reading poetry after dinner,

and my mother considered herself a very good interpreter

of that kind of stuff.

I'm sure a lot of it stuck with me.

Ah, I tend to get a little dramatic.

(Guy laughs)

♪ In the cars of my youth ♪

♪ How I tore through those sand dunes ♪

♪ And cut up my tires on them oyster shell roads ♪

♪ Ah, but nothin' is forever ♪

♪ Say the old men in the shipyards ♪

♪ Turnin' trees into shrimp boats ♪

♪ Hell, I guess they oughta know ♪

- [Guy] When I was in high school working at a ship yard,

we were building big 80 foot wooden shrimp boats.

That fascinated me.

I mean, if you look at the lines of a wooden boat,

the way it just curves around, that is just such an art.

I remember telling my parents one time

that I wanted to be a carpenter in the shipyard.

I decided what I was gonna do.

(Guy chuckles)

Yeah, it was very cool.

(guitar pic flamenco tune)

- [Susanna] Lola Bonner was Ellis Clark's law partner.

She taught Guy to play guitar.

- [Guy] She played guitar,

and she was South Texas born and bred,

and all she knew was Mexican songs.

And the first time I saw her

was out at Hondo Crouch's sister's place on the beach.

And I was just taken

with that first time of seeing Hondo, and Lola,

and everybody just passing the guitar around,

playing it, and trading songs.

I was hooked from that day on.

(guitar strums somber "The Randall Knife")

- [Susanna] The South Coast of Texas came out,

and not long after that Guy's father died.

- [Guy] He had a bad heart,

and he smoked and drank all his life, you know?

He slowly started losing his memory.

He just got weaker and weaker.

And we knew he was dying,

and I was driving from Nashville to Rockport,

and I got to Beeville, I think,

just was worried, and I called my mother,

and I talked to him, and he was,

all of a sudden, he was very lucid,

and it was a conversation that kind of healed

any hard feelings that might've been between he and I.

We were back in Nashville,

and I started writing this poem.

I didn't think of it as song.

I mean, it just...

I couldn't make it a song.

I couldn't twist it into a song.

- [Susanna] On his next album,

Guy recorded "Randall Knife" to honor his father.

(guitar strums)

- [Guy] That was one of the few arguments

Rod and I ever got into about music,

was he was producing the record,

and we had a full band in the studio.

I mean, you know, A players.

And we did "The Randall Knife",

and I told Rodney right then,

I said, "Man, this is not a song you play with drums".

"We can't do this."

And Rodney said,

"Well, I want it to sound like the rest of the record".

- That was not my finest hour as a producer, I don't think,

and I think it may have been a turning point for Guy,

in that, kind of the methodology

of recording tracks with musicians,

and then havin' the lead artist come back,

and dub in their vocals.

That's not how you wanna record Guy Clark,

because he's an actor, and a narrator, and a performer.

If anything positive came out,

besides there bein' a record in the world

with those songs on it,

is that I think he decided

what he wanted to do from then on.

♪ My father died when I was forty ♪

♪ And I couldn't find a way to cry ♪

♪ Not because I didn't love him ♪

♪ And not because he didn't try ♪

♪ Oh, I'd cried for every lesser thing ♪

♪ The whiskey, pain and beauty ♪

♪ But he deserved a better tear ♪

♪ And I was not quite ready ♪

♪ So we took his ashes out to sea ♪

♪ And poured `em off the stern ♪

♪ And then threw the roses in the wake ♪

♪ Of everything we'd learned ♪

♪ And when we got back to the house ♪

♪ They asked me what I wanted ♪

♪ Not the law books, not the watch ♪

♪ I need the things he's haunted ♪

♪ Oh, my hand burned for the Randall knife ♪

♪ There in the bottom drawer ♪

♪ And I found a tear for my father's life ♪

♪ And all that it stood for ♪

(somber "Randall Knife" continues playing)

- [Susanna] Warner Brothers dropped Guy from the label.

Guy was okay with the decision.

He'd recorded five albums with two major labels,

and he hadn't been happy with any of 'em.

Guy was finished chasing hits.

He was finished playing with the band,

and he was finished with the music business.

He had no idea of what he was gonna do next,

but he knew it was time to do things his way.

- [Guy] Yeah, I wanted it to be good.

I knew the songs were good, and I knew I could play 'em,

'cause I wrote 'em,

but I hadn't just stood up there

with just me and my guitar in a long, long time.

I quit, and started over.

For once, I was right, I guess.

You know, I figured out that's what I wanted to do.

All you gotta do is just do it.

Nobody says you can't, so

Here I am, a folk singer.

(Guy chuckles)

- Smart choice, Guy choosing the path of a folk singer,

and choosing a method of recording

in the tradition of folk singers,

which is (Rodney chuckles)

elbow the drums out, clear everything out of the way,

so you can hear the words,

because that's, you know,

that was Guy coming to understand his strength.

- He knew what he wanted to be.

He knew how he wanted to sound.

Every word mattered in every song.

So that's clarity, you know?

At its best.

- [Guy] Never did write hit songs for country music radio.

I never was a country singer.

I'm still not a country singer.

I just write songs and play 'em.

I'm Guy Clark.

- [Susanna] Guy and Townes hit the road with their guitars,

and they were playing together

like they did back in the Houston days.

But he didn't record again for five years.

- [City Billy] Visiting this morning

with Townes Van Zandt and Guy Clark.

Do you have any record in the works, also, of your own,

besides... Well-

Kind of in the process

of trying to write some songs for one.

Remember, that's the hard part.

- [City Billy] You have a contract at the moment,

- No. - or you just

peddle it once it's done? - Uh-uh.

No, I'll just do it, and then see what happens.

Maybe just peddle it myself, you know?

(Guy laughs)

- He came to me in the hallway one day, and said,

"Man, I gotta make my comeback record".

And he said, "And I ain't got no money,

and you're just the guy that can help me".

- [Susanna] For the first time since Old No 1,

the songs took the starring role.

Guy was so happy about this album

that he put his self portrait painting on the cover.

He took the album to Barry Poss at Sugar Hill Records.

- So normally, we wouldn't do a one-off.

We like to work with artists over time, developing careers.

But the chance to work with Guy Clark,

even for one album, was different.

His music, I think, went right to the heart

of what I wanted the label to be about to begin with.

- [Susanna] Guy put my song, "Come from the Heart",

on his first Grammy-nominated album.

(acoustic instrumental "Come From The Heart")

♪ When I was a young man ♪

♪ My daddy told me ♪

♪ A lesson he learned ♪ - The identity,

the statement that I wanted,

came from roots-based contemporary music

Now called Americana.

And I think Guy Clark not only fit that aesthetic perfectly,

he helped define it. ♪ Learn to let go ♪

♪ You got to sing ♪

♪ Like you don't need the money ♪

♪ Love ♪

♪ Like you'll never get hurt ♪

♪ You got to dance ♪

♪ Like nobody's watching ♪

♪ It's gotta come from the heart ♪

♪ If you want it to work ♪

♪ Yeah ♪

- [Susanna] "Come from the Heart" had a life of its own,

and several people cut it,

but Kathy Mattea made it a monster hit.

♪ Oh, you got to sing ♪ ♪ Sing ♪

♪ Like you don't need the money ♪

♪ Love ♪ ♪ Love ♪

♪ Like you'll never get hurt ♪

♪ You've got to dance ♪ ♪ Dance ♪

♪ Like nobody's watchin' ♪

♪ It's gotta come from the heart ♪

♪ If you want it to work ♪

(upbeat "Come From the Heart" continues)

- [Susanna] After I got my royalties

from "Come from the Heart", I left Guy.

I still loved him,

but I had stuff to work out,

and I couldn't do it livin' with Guy.

- [Guy] She'd had enough of my bullshit,

and she just rented herself an apartment.

That was it.

I wouldn't have thought

that she had her shit together enough to do that,

and I think she was proving a point,

that she didn't have to depend on me for everything.

- She was reclaiming a part of herself

that she'd lost in her marriage.

But Susanna, during that time period,

she was more healthy than I recall her ever being,

and she was going to therapy,

and doing a lot of self-affirming things,

and was a delight to be around.

And said, "I'm done with marriage".

- [Susanna] I gave Guy a comfortable place to be

so he could be an artist.

I poured love into him.

I spoiled him to the point

where he thought he could get away with anything.

I tended to what he needed,

and I did that until I realized

that it wasn't being returned.

- Rodney had a relationship with Susanna

that was separate from his relationship with Guy.

So I did I.

And Townes certainly did.

The relationship between Townes and Susanna,

it was something that,

nobody really talked about it,

because it was a little,

it was a little too intimate

to be in the same room with sometimes it seemed,

and probably brought up questions

nobody really wanted to know the answer to,

'cause it sort of blew their whole

idea about the whole rest of it,

you know, Guy and Susanna as an entity.

- [Susanna] Townes and his wife split up,

and he spent a lot of time at my place.

Townes served me breakfast in bed, always with flowers.

(Susanna giggles)

Sometimes he'd tell those terrible jokes of his.

Sometimes he'd cry,

and sometimes I'd cry for him.

After supper, we'd drink wine,

and watch reruns on Nick at Nite.

It was a sweet and loving time.

Rodney and his wife, Roseanne, broke up too,

and then Rodney and I got close.

- I loved Susanna, you know?

And she taught me how to be a friend,

but it evolved into a real, true friendship.

What do you think, Ms. Clark?

- Well, they just didn't have any tacos,

and I'm kinda disappointed.

(females laughing)

(Susanna laughs)

That's all I think right now.

(females laughing)

Hello there, Rod. - Hi.

- How are you?

- I'm fine. - Ain't nobody

talkin' to you today?

- [Rodney] No, I don't know why, either.

I guess it's my snorkel.

(all laughing)

- I'm so proud to be here at

Ms. Julia's and Mr. Bee's weddin'.

- Me too. - Yeah, are ya?

- [Rodney] Yes, I am.

- Yeah.

You're doing a good job, Rod.

[Rodney] I'm having fun. Yeah?

I take... Bye.

(all laughing) - Bye, Rod.

- So ah...

This is just about it.

Right...

Now!

(tape recorder clicks)

(acoustic guitar strums a chord)

(Susanna laughs)

(both laughing)

(Rodney laughing)

(all laughing)

(Susanna sighs loudly)

(object clatters)

- Yeah, Susanna was a lot of work for any one person,

and Guy figured out early on

that he was never gonna be able to keep her,

unless somebody else held up some of the,

you know, took up some of the slack.

So he gave her room for those relationships.

(guitar strums "Dublin Blues" )

- [Susanna] While we were apart,

Guy focused on his work,

and Travis joined him on the road.

(guitar strums "Dublin Blues")

- [Guy] Travis is a great bass player.

You know, he reads Count Basie charts.

He's a really well-schooled bass player.

So I thought, well, that'd be cool.

Get Travis to play, be my bass player.

I mean, we played together really good.

We sang together well.

- [Susanna] Asylum Records released

two successful albums.

Guy became a star in the new Americana genre.

(audience cheers and applauds)

- I'm gonna sing you a couple of new songs,

songs you never heard.

And it's called the "Dublin Blues".

(acoustic guitar strums "Dublin Blues")

♪ Well, I wished I was in Austin ♪

♪ Mmmmm ♪

♪ In the Chili Parlor bar ♪

♪ Drinkin' Mad Dog Margaritas ♪

♪ And not carin' where you are ♪

♪ But here I sit in Dublin ♪

♪ Mmmmm ♪

♪ Just rollin' cigarettes ♪

♪ And holdin' back and chokin' back ♪

♪ The shakes with every breath ♪

♪ So forgive me all my anger ♪

♪ Forgive me all my faults ♪

♪ There's no need to forgive me ♪

♪ For thinkin' what I thought ♪

♪ I loved you from the git-go ♪

♪ And I'll love you till I die ♪

♪ I loved you on the Spanish steps ♪

♪ The day you said goodbye ♪

♪ I am just a poor boy ♪

♪ Mmmmm ♪

♪ Work's my middle name ♪

♪ If money was a reason ♪

♪ Well, I would not be the same ♪

- This was a time when Americana music was thriving,

and there was an independent business

to support all that up and down the chain.

I mean, there were labels to record the music.

There were stores to sell it.

There were booking agents

and managers to place the artists in clubs.

And there were festivals to perform at.

All of this, making independent careers

for people, like Guy, very possible.

- [Susanna] In the spring of '95,

Dublin Blues shot to the top of the Americana chart.

It was Guy's first number one album.

He was the coolest songwriter in town.

The label threw a party to celebrate,

and all of Music Row showed up to honor Guy.

(guitar strums mellow "Stuff that Works")

I still loved Guy, and he loved me.

We'd been apart for six years,

but once we got back together,

we promised to stay together forever.

After all those years of struggle,

our dreams had come true.

♪ I got a woman I love ♪

♪ She's crazy ♪

♪ And paints like God ♪

- [Susanna] We were together,

and on top of the world ♪ She's got a playground ♪

♪ Sense of justice ♪

♪ She won't take odds ♪

♪ I got a tattoo with her name right through my soul ♪

♪ I think everything she touches turns to gold ♪

♪ Stuff that works ♪

♪ Stuff that holds up ♪

♪ The kind of stuff you don't hang on the wall ♪

♪ Stuff that's real ♪

♪ Stuff you feel ♪

♪ The kind of stuff you reach for when you fall ♪

(mellow country music continues)

- [Susanna] With all the praise

surrounding Guy as a songwriter,

Rounder Records released a greatest hits album,

and called it Craftsman. Guy hated that title.

(Guy exhales loudly)

- [Guy] I should've put a stop to that Craftsman shit,

because I consider it poetry, and art,

but I just said, "Whatever you wanna do".

"You know, it's your deal."

"You're putting these records out."

I would never use that term applied to my writing.

I'm kind of offended by it.

- [Susanna] In the fall of '96,

Guy recorded his first live album.

He called it Keepers.

- [Guy] I've always wanted to do a live album,

and what I did, was to go back to those early albums,

and do live versions of those songs

that I do every night,

that I never particularly liked

the way they were recorded originally.

- Guy just gathered up his little studio buddies

that worked with him.

It was packed every night.

We sat in the middle of the room,

and Jerry Douglas would sit right here over my shoulder,

and the next night it would be Emmylou,

and the next night it would be somebody else,

but they were right on top of us.

And man, Guy was...

I still like that record

about as much as anything he ever did.

It just...

He was really having fun that night.

- [Alanna] How do you want the general public,

or people listening to this, to think of you?

- [Voice Of Guy] As a good songwriter,

and a good singer of my own songs.

I'd like everybody to think

I'm as good as I think I am, you know?

(Guy chuckles)

(indistinct chattering)

- I may be a lonely schizophrenic,

but at least I got each other.

(audience laughs)

- [Susanna] Guy and Townes went back on the road,

and sold out shows everywhere they went,

but Townes was in bad shape.

- Townes always said he wanted to come to my house to die,

so I sold it to him.

(audience laughs)

- [Guy] That's not water.

(audience laughs)

- But I do remember a few times with Guy and Townes.

Once in Santa Fe, particularly,

they were playing there.

Susanna wasn't there. (audience laughs)

- Hey, Guy, get me one too.

- Yeah, sure. (audience laughs)

- Townes was so, so drunk

that Jo Harvey and I kind of walked him

down these stairs, and back up the stairs, and whatever.

But Townes did a horrible set.

He maybe got through a couple of songs,

and told endless stories,

but barely could stay on the stool.

Then Guy played a really kind of pristine set,

a really beautiful set.

But I remember downstairs,

Townes was sitting down,

and Guy and I were kind of over

in Guy's area of the dressing area,

and there were about 15 people that were around Townes

shovin' dope and shovin' liquor at him.

And it was like vultures, you know?

And I remember, Guy and I both kind of watching it,

and he just said, "It happens everywhere we go", you know?

"Everywhere we go."

And it was like, you know, die for me, you know?

Die for me, you know?

- [Guy] You had to learn to tolerate Townes,

in some ways.

I mean, it all evolved around gettin' drunk, you know?

And just being as big a jerks,

as we could figure out how to do it,

you know? (Guy chuckles)

And I finally just got to the point

where I couldn't do that with him,

because I had Susanna,

and I had responsibilities,

a commitment with the publishing company, you know?

- I knew there was something.

- [Guy] That was just the way he was,

and there was nothing you could do about it.

(Townes speaks faintly)

(tape recorder crackles)

(tape recorder crackles)

(somber slide guitar "Black Haired Boy")

- [Susanna] This morning, 8:30 came and went.

The phone didn't ring.

Townes Van Zandt died on January 1st, 1997.

Part of me died with him.

Last night, Guy called from the studio.

He was crying, and said, "My heart hurts".

I asked if there was anything I could do for him?

Guy said, "Say it ain't so."

Townes' words were always gentle and loving,

but like in his songs, mighty words they were.

♪ He's looking for a home that he's scared to find ♪

♪ Some lady beside him and he's drunk on white wine ♪

♪ Some lady beside him and he's drunk on white wine ♪

- [Susanna] I had the honor and the privilege

of having this noble, wild soul in my life.

He called me his best friend and sister.

I called him my best friend and brother.

- When Townes died, Susanna called me,

so I went over, and we sat at the table,

and Guy had a bottle of

Johnnie Walker Red, I think, a quart,

and he was hurtin'.

You know, he was drinking whiskey, you know?

So when the pain is so deep, it's that moan.

It's that timeless moan pain, you know?

And Susanna was...

You know, that conversation was that, you know, it's over,

and she was just saying, "It's over",

and Guy was just trying to deal with the pain.

So Susanna surrendered something that night.

- [Guy] Oh, it really destroyed her,

and it did me too to a certain extent,

but she was very grievous at Townes's death.

(audience applauds)

- Mr. Rodney Crowell.

(Guy laughs) (audience applauds)

- Thank you.

Then shortly after that,

we did an Austin City Limits performance,

a bunch of us,

and that night, Susanna told me, "I have a pain in my back,"

and from then on,

there was this mythical pain in Susanna's back,

that I, you know, as time went on,

I started to argue with her about the pain in her back,

and I started to not believe

that there was a pain in her back,

and I just started this thing about,

well, you know, a lot of people have had pain in their back,

and they get enough of it.

I know I can give you three or four people

who went and got surgery, and corrected the pain.

But Susanna wanted the pain pills.

- [Susanna] Dear Townes,

it's been 13 days since your soul was released.

And your spirit now flies.

Please visit me.

I taught you of angels, and you taught me of time,

so come to me now in my dreams.

Carry me with you.

Let love guide me, as it did you.

Love, Susanna.

- That back pain set in,

and she went to bed, and didn't get up.

- [Guy] I mean, it was tough.

It was just hard to see her dissolve into that

kind of existence, you know?

'Cause it was not productive.

It was not.

I don't know.

It was sad, very sad.

- You know, I tried everything,

but I was no match

for what she had decided she wanted to do,

which is, she wanted to die slowly, and she did,

and Guy paid a high price for that.

And I was angry at her.

She quit on me.

She quit on Emmy.

She quit on Guy.

She quit on herself,

and I was really angry about it,

and it brought out some of my worst traits.

Then, you know, there would be times when I'd think,

well I gotta go and sit next to her,

and breathe her cigarette smoke, and tell her I love her,

'cause I do.

Yeah, it's like, yeah, well, I wasn't getting anything back.

- [Susanna] I continued to spiral down

as Guy's star kept rising.

Keepers was nominated for a Grammy.

Guy recorded two more albums for Sugar Hill.

ASCAP gave him

a Lifetime Achievement Award for songwriting.

NSAI put him in the Songwriter Hall of Fame,

and then the Americana Music Association

gave him another Lifetime Achievement Award.

(audience applauds)

- Oh, thank you very much.

Thank you so much.

(acoustic mellow "Dublin Blues")

If I could write, if I knew how to

write the next Garth Brooks hit,

I would do it in a second, man.

I mean, really, wouldn't you?

But the whole thing is, which I've come to realize,

I can't do it, man.

But if I could, I would.

You know, I'm just cursed with artistic integrity.

♪ I have been to Fort Worth ♪

♪ Mm-Hmm ♪

♪ And I have been to Spain ♪

♪ And I have been too proud to come in out of the rain ♪

♪ And I have seen the David ♪

♪ Mm-hmm ♪

♪ I've seen the Mona Lisa too ♪

♪ And I have heard Doc Watson ♪

♪ Play Columbus Stockade Blues ♪

♪ So forgive me all my anger ♪

♪ Forgive me all my faults ♪

♪ There's no need to forgive me ♪

♪ For thinkin' what I thought ♪

♪ I loved you from the get-go ♪

♪ And I'll love you till I die ♪

♪ I loved you on the Spanish steps ♪

♪ The day you said goodbye ♪

♪ Well, I wished I was in Austin ♪

♪ Mm-Hmm ♪

♪ In a Chili Parlor bar ♪

♪ Drinkin' Mad Dog Margaritas ♪

♪ And not carin' where you are ♪

(audience cheers and applauds)

- [Susanna] In 2006, Guy was diagnosed with lymphoma.

He started chemotherapy, lost his hair,

and was worried about making money.

But we hung in there, and he continued to work.

Guy signed with Dualtone Records

and recorded Workbench Songs.

Three years later, he released Somedays the Song Writes You.

Both albums were nominated for GRAMMYS.

(guitar strums mellow "My Favorite Picture of You")

Guy wrote a new song for me.

It's the best song he ever wrote for me.

He would bring his guitar into the bedroom every day,

sit on the bed, and play it.

- Yeah,

I always had this little Polaroid.

It was always my favorite picture of Susanna,

and it was just, she was,

we were in front of John Lomax's house over on 21st.

It was cold and wet.

And we'd been in there,

and Townes and I were just drunk, and bein' assholes.

You know, she finally had enough,

and she just got up and left,

put on her coat, and walked outside.

I mean, like I said, she didn't take a bad picture,

but that one,

somehow it captured the essence of her.

That is Susanna.

She had this look on her face

I've seen a million times,

but that day was, she had had enough.

♪ My favorite picture of you ♪

♪ Is the one where your wings are showing ♪

♪ Oh, your arms are crossed ♪

♪ Your fists are clenched ♪

♪ Not gone but going ♪

♪ Oh, a stand-up angel ♪

♪ Who won't back down ♪

♪ Nobody's fool and nobody's clown ♪

♪ You were smarter than that ♪

♪ My favorite picture of you ♪

♪ Is one where it hasn't rained yet ♪

♪ Oh, and as I recall there came a winter squall ♪

♪ And we got soaking wet ♪

♪ A thousand words in the blink of an eye ♪

♪ The camera loves you and so do I ♪

♪ Click ♪

♪ My favorite picture of you ♪

♪ Is one where you're staring straight into the lens ♪

- Life without Susanna started when Townes Van Zandt died.

From that day on, she hid out under cover.

Her Percocets and cigarette along for the ride.

She made her bed, inside her head a shelter.

Each new day, a sliver through the blinds.

I tried tough love, tenderness, and anger,

but nothing pierced the fortress inside her mind.

She won.

She got the last word.

(guitar strums gentle "My Favorite Picture of You")

- [Guy] I miss her sense of humor,

and her intelligence,

just how talented she was.

She could paint.

She could write.

Good lord, what a beautiful woman.

Smart.

But she wouldn't clean her fucking brushes.

(Guy chuckles)

It's true, it was a mythical love story.

I wouldn't disabuse anyone of that.

It's just,

you had to be there to get it, you know?

(lighter flicks)

(guitar strums melancholy "My Favorite Picture of You")

- It was kind of a slow collapse.

Well, he and Verlon came through.

They were so tired,

and Guy was, he could barely walk.

They just slept for three days, and then left,

and it was the first time that I remember it

just being really telling that they were,

it was a difficult run for them.

- You know, I kept wantin' Guy to quit

long before he did.

And now, lookin' back on it,

I realize, that was probably

stupid of me,

because when a man quits, he's done.

And so Guy was stayin' out there

as long as he could possibly stay out there,

and he was havin' a real hard time playing,

and a pretty hard time singing too.

They finally sent us on a 12 day run.

It was all across Texas.

We started at Abilene, Fort Worth, Dallas, San Antonio.

We wound up in Beaumont,

and I knew,

and I believe that he knew too,

that it just, it couldn't go on.

We got in the car the next morning,

and drove back to Nashville.

You know, a pretty quiet ride, nothin' much said.

Got back to the house,

he picked up the phone right then and there,

and he called our booking agent, and he said,

"Keith, don't book me nothing else".

"I'm done."

Click.

And Guy just leaned back,

and he started rolling a cigarette,

and he goes, "Let's recap."

And I said, "What do you mean?"

We just started talking about, from day one,

all the stuff we did, and the places we'd gone.

So I walked out of there feeling okay about it, you know?

(guitar strums melancholy "My Favorite Picture of You")

- [Guy] It means more to me now than I thought it would.

I mean, I thought I would just blow this shit off.

It was kind of ironic, you know?

To do this for 40 years,

finally win, I guess, the best award you can get for it,

and not be able to do it anymore, you know?

(guitar strums gentle "Old Friends")

- He was working on this song about crows.

(crows cawing)

I remember he had a line I loved that was,

"They were so black,

you could only see 'em at night", you know?

He was really, I think,

talking about his own vulnerability at that particular time.

I called Rodney, and Rodney said,

"Well, if you're coming, you better come now".

"You know, now."

- I'd been over there, I guess, a couple of days,

pretty much all day long,

and people were coming by,

and people gathered around his bed, and sang songs.

It was a beautiful thing.

Everything had sort of wound down, and people had gone home,

and I felt like this might be it, you know?

I decided to stay there, too, all night.

I just was gonna sit in the recliner, and just hang out.

And it felt right that I was there, and it was a blessing.

I'm glad I was.

He finally just kinda took a big old, deep breath,

and I knew he was gone.

(guitar strums gentle "Old Friends")

The subject came up about Guy's ashes,

and I had heard about this,

but I didn't know if it was for real,

that there had been some sort of pact between

Guy and our dear old buddy, Terry Allen.

He said, "I want Terry

to put me into one of his sculptures."

And I thought, you know,

I thought maybe that was a joke.

But earlier that morning,

I talked to Terry on the phone after Guy passed,

and he said, "No, it ain't a joke, and it's for real."

- You know, I never took that totally serious.

My response, ultimately, was

"Okay, I'm gonna cast a goat.

I'm gonna do a bronze goat,

and I'm gonna take your ashes,

and I'm gonna shove it up its ass."

And Guy looked at me, and went, "Perfect!"

(Terry laughs) Yeah.

- And then we got a call, just almost instantly,

that everybody was gonna come out to our house.

- I said, "If it's okay, if it's legal,

and if it's okay with everybody,

I'd like to just take Guy out there myself."

I said, "I'll put him in the car,

and it'll be our final road trip."

(guitar strums mellow "Dublin Blues")

The next thing you know,

there's 8 or 10 of us on a tour bus,

and those of us couldn't ride the bus met us there.

- Everybody just stopped their lives,

and headed for Santa Fe.

(indistinct chattering)

- [Steve] You know, we took Guy's ashes there,

and we got there at sunset the next day,

and it was most beautiful land-based sunset I've ever seen.

I give Guy full credit for that.

- We set up a little makeshift altar in our living room,

and put the ashes there with a candle.

People just ended up going into the living room,

and just standing, looking at Guy.

- And nobody said a word for a long time,

and then, just one at a time,

everyone started telling some wonderful story

about their experiences with Guy.

- Steve Earle, he went and got his guitar, and said,

"Let's all do a song that Guy would want us to sing."

People took turns singing songs.

It was just one of those nights, you know?

And then everybody left,

and went back, back into their lives.

And there I was, standing with the soon-to-be goat.

(Terry laughs)

(gentle music "Desperados Waiting for a Train")

- His command of the language is universal.

It just happens to be thematically specific,

most of the time, to Texas.

Texans really love their heroes,

and Guy is a true-blue Texas hero.

♪ Run his fingers through 70 years ♪

- He was a powerful figure

with an enormous presence,

but all that larger than life bigness

actually came wrapped in a man of quiet grace and elegance.

- He had this eye for detail, and this memory for detail.

I mean, I don't think it'll matter

whether it's set to music or whether it's not.

Guy's best songs transcend being songs,

that they could have been novels,

could have been short stories.

- I'm pretty sure they'll say,

he's one, of the greatest

American songwriters that ever lived.

- A legacy is already in stone, even before he left,

and I don't know that it's changed.

To me, it was every bit as much of a legacy

in the mid-'70s, as it was 40 plus years later.

All those stories, all those characters, all those things,

they were powerful to me,

because they felt familiar.

- You still feel like he's with us all the time.

He seems to be present,

and you don't know if he's an angel, or a ghost.

You know, it's just that song of his,

the stuff that's real, stuff you feel,

stuff that you can count on,

you know, when you're down, or when you fall.

♪ One day I looked up and he's pushin' 80 ♪

♪ And there was brown tobacco stains all down his chin ♪

♪ To me he's one of the heroes of this country ♪

♪ So why's he all dressed up like them old men ♪

♪ Drinkin' beer and playin' moon and 42 ♪

♪ Just like a desperado waiting for a train ♪

♪ Like desperados waiting for a train ♪

(crows cawing)

(wind whips)

(chimes tinkle)

(wind continues whipping)

(crows cawing)

(chimes tinkle)

(crows continue cawing)

(one crow caws loudly)

(chimes tinkling)

(wind continues to whip)

(crows cawing)

(upbeat music "Caw Caw Blues")

♪ Heckle and Jeckle built a barbed wire nest ♪

(crows cawing)

♪ In a windmill derrick way out west ♪

♪ Scooping up scraps down the long fence line ♪

♪ It was a work of art, the only one of its kind ♪

♪ Way out around Lubbock as the John Crow flies ♪

♪ Ole Heckle and Jeckle built a sky high rise ♪

♪ Heckle and Jeckle, so cold jet black ♪

♪ You could see 'em at night in the cactus Jack ♪

♪ Murder of crows, murder of crows ♪

♪ Two old birds make a murder of crows ♪

♪ And everyone knows that anything goes ♪

♪ Ol' Heckle and Jeckle make a murder of crows ♪

(upbeat country music continues)

♪ Catching baby rattlesnakes two-by-two ♪

♪ We're gonna make a little pot of that rattlesnake stew ♪

♪ Little baby rattlesnakes better watch out ♪

♪ Ol' Heckle and Jeckle steady out and about ♪

♪ Murder of crows, murder of crows ♪

♪ Two old birds make a murder of crows ♪

♪ Everyone knows that anything goes ♪

♪ Ol' Heckle and Jeckle make a murder of crows ♪

(upbeat country music continues)

♪ Scarecrow standing in a tall corn patch ♪

♪ Heckle and Jeckle got nary a scratch ♪

♪ Eating like kings nearly all day long ♪

♪ Dodging that buckshot, singing that song ♪

♪ Caw Caw Blues, Caw Caw Blues ♪

♪ Ten'll get you twenty if you're counting by twos ♪

♪ Barbed wire palace full of magpie chicks ♪

♪ Old Heckle and Jeckle steady getting their kicks ♪

♪ Murder of crows, murder of crows ♪

♪ Two old birds'll make a murder of crows ♪

♪ Everyone knows that anything goes ♪

♪ Ol' Heckle and Jeckle make a murder of crows ♪

♪ Oh ♪

♪ Oh ♪

♪ Daddy's in the kitchen in his everyday shoes ♪

♪ Sittin' down singing them Caw Caw Blues ♪