Original subtitles

I'll see you in there. Okay.

Oh, Peggy.

Do you know my friends John and Mary Lee Sullivan?

This is my mother -in -law, Peggy Patrick.

How do you do? Pleased to meet you. John and Mary Lee are moving tomorrow to

Brampton, Ontario.

Oh, how interesting.

We're sitting right over here. Are you going to come and join us? Join you in a

minute. All right. See you then.

I keep expecting to see Ross walking, surrounded by people like he always was.

There you go, Bill.

Excuse me, Mrs. Thatcher. I'm with the Moose Judge Himes Herald. Would you mind

if I got a picture?

All right, would you? Okay. Would you mind just moving down here?

Come on, honey.

Stephanie?

Regan? Regan!

Come on. Mom!

Come and see Dad's cleaning up. I will, you know. We have to do his picture.

Come on, Regan. Hurry up.

Is this all right? A little bit closer together.

This has been a great day, just a great day.

This is the best bullshit ever. Go down, go down, go down.

And Mom, you know what?

Dad's thinking about buying more land.

More land?

Structurally, he is one of the best.

He's got a good front, but if you want to know about an animal, you start at

back.

That's right, Don.

He's got strong legs.

Like I always say,

you can't service a cow, and it don't matter what the rest of them looks like.

Forty centimeters.

Good set.

Say, Colin, you measure up?

You want to know if I measure up?

Yeah. He wants to know if I measure up.

Try me.

Gentlemen, the bar is open. I would like to buy you all a drink.

Where have you been all afternoon? You've been hiding from

me.

I just got my best bowler one -way ticket to Tokyo.

Imperial's got you watered down.

Why don't we get together tonight and make some waves?

Mom, Mom!

You've got to see this humongous bull. Where's your dad?

Um, he's at the bar.

Can I get a glass of milk?

What's the matter? Did you eat too much chip today?

How many hot dogs did you have, anyway?

Only four.

Give me a beer.

Dad, maybe I'm going to have to go walk.

Yeah, good night.

Go on, sweetheart. I'll be up in a minute.

Shall I make you a sandwich?

Colin, I've been thinking again about needing to get away.

With the kid.

You'd hardly miss it if you get home so late.

Mean you're home pretty late not tonight. I do not want to talk about

Yeah

Sir, I was just driving by and I thought that your car is parked on the wrong

side of the street.

There have been some complaints.

Sir, you don't know who I am?

I know who you are, Mr. Thatcher. Oh, good. We're making progress.

Sir, your vehicle is... Now, wait a minute. Wait a minute. I don't have to

up with this bullshit from you.

I'll park my vehicles any goddamn way I want.

Now, get your ass off my property.

If this harassment continues, I'm going to get you thrown off the force.

You want to go, do you?

That is what you want?

Be careful, you'll wake the kids.

You think you can take my kids?

You will never take my kids. Never!

You want to go?

You really want to...

I'm sorry, Ellie.

It's okay.

Come anytime.

Even when Colin doesn't kick you out.

Before the kids are awake.

Right.

And make an angel food cake.

And remote paper the living room before I'm even out of bed.

Thank you.

Farmers are unable to purchase trucks in accordance with their coming needs

because of the uncertainty about your load limits.

The time has now come for the minister to make some statement that is

definitive.

Order. Order. I will not permit the member to continue.

Point of order, Mr. Speaker, is that in this house we have a double standard.

We have a set of rules for this side of the house, and we have a set of rules

for that side of the house.

Hallelujah.

Order.

Order. Order is right, Mr. Speaker, and order is what my party, the Conservative

Party of Saskatchewan, intends to bring to this province after we wipe you off

the map of the next election.

Hi,

Mom. Hi.

I'm going to football practice.

See ya.

Will you be home for supper?

I don't know, maybe.

Do you want me to make the lettuce a little?

That's right, Stephanie.

Daddy brought them for Mommy because she is such a special mommy.

Now, Joanne, this thing you're going through is just a midlife crisis.

Okay.

I could stay.

Do you want me to stay?

You ain't wrong to hear.

gonna teach you how to play this game.

You wish.

Tell Greg to start fixing fence north of Mortlack.

Bye, Dad.

Bye, Stephanie.

What's going on? Looks like you're going to feed another cattle sale.

I wanted to make sure he didn't starve.

I decided to take Regan and Stephanie camping for a few days.

I didn't think you'd want to come.

You mean I could stay here alone?

Alone with Blaine Max.

Come on, I'm a babysitter.

What's this?

to the Sullivans in Brampton.

They moved there, remember?

Let's go.

Fingers and toes, watch out.

Okay, the lasagna you reheat at 350 and the same with the shepherd's pie.

And Sandra will be in to check up on you in case there's anything you need, all

right? Oh, and your father said something about mending a fence

More like.

I mean to work on the ranch rather than come with us.

It's what I thought you'd rather do.

Whoa.

Relax. I think I'll survive okay.

Okay, kids.

Do up your seatbelt.

Bring it back, eh?

I better go.

I'm going to miss my plane.

Hey, Ron, wait a sec.

Everything okay?

Yeah.

There's nothing wrong with James.

Where is everybody?

Went by the house on my way here, nobody home?

Yeah, Mom took the kids camping.

She'll be back today.

Oh, yeah?

Oh.

Look at that one over there.

Reminds me of the first calf I ever had.

She was small, but she turned into a hell of a good breeder.

So, got much more to do?

Just this one. We've got to fish it up.

All right.

I'll wait for you.

issues going?

Park. Peninsula Park. Why?

Dad, what's wrong?

Dad?

Good evening, Greg. Is your father home?

So, Jack, what'd you find out?

Did we talk in private?

What's going on?

Colin, I'm here at Joanne's instructions to advise you that she does not wish to

see you.

this time, and that you can communicate with her only through me.

But wait a minute.

You know where she is? Where the hell is she?

Joanne... Joanne says she made clear to you many times that she needed time away

from you for both of you to sort out your feelings.

But that your unwillingness to consider her wishes in the matter left her no

alternative but to act in this manner.

What is this bullshit?

Colin, she's safe. He asked me to tell you that she and the children are safe

and well.

And that when she is able, she will... No, no. You are my lawyer. The Thatcher

lawyer. You are going to tell me where the hell she is. Colin, I'm sorry.

I think if you don't pressure her too much just now, you have a better chance

reestablishing... She can't do this.

Leave me, kidnap my kids. She can't do this to me!

If you want me to play with you, start catching the ball.

Okay?

Don't worry, you won't miss your plane.

Say goodbye to the kids for me.

I warned you they were having an affair.

What?

I warned you six months ago, but you didn't believe me.

You're wrong.

You were taken.

Ron is having an affair with Joanne.

I know it.

I have proof.

He helped her to run away.

He doesn't know I found out.

He's coming home tomorrow and he's acting like nothing happened.

Tell him he owes me a game of golf.

There's my buddy.

Colin, how you doing?

Oh, not too bad, considering.

Yeah.

Heard about Joanne.

Yeah, yeah. At times like this, you really find out who your friends are.

Say, that deal that took you away from Palm Springs, that come out okay? Yeah.

Good.

Nice shot.

No, it's not too bad.

I just want you to know that by the time I sink my putt, you better goddamn well

tell me where my wife and children are.

There's no need for this, Colin.

It's my wife, Ron.

Jesus Christ.

You better tell me where they are, or I'm gonna kill you.

I'll see what I can do.

Operator?

Yes, this is a long -distance call.

I'd like to put it on my credit card.

Yeah.

Joanne, um... Now listen to me.

No, I'm not angry. I'm not.

No, I'm too upset to be angry.

Look, I blame myself for what happened.

And I respect... No,

Joanne. No, please don't take legal action.

All right, I promise you.

I will not apply for custody.

Joanne, darling.

I miss you.

Greg? Greg's heartbroken.

Joe, would you please come home?

Not yet, I can't.

Would you put Greg on, please?

Because she was mailing.

Cartons.

She said it was all my old clothes she was giving away.

To the Sullivans.

Did you see any of this?

Yeah.

Brampton, Ontario.

take you home

that's

where you belong

hello

your

children are safe or you will never find them

The kids are there.

I've seen them.

Jo?

Do you want me to wait for you?

Thanks, I'm fine.

Oh,

do you?

Well, that's entirely at my discretion.

My lawyer obtained interim custody.

Your lawyer?

From now on, you'll only be allowed to see them under my close personal

supervision.

Where are the kids? I want to see them.

You want to see them?

Go ahead.

Probably want to see you.

Don't expect to come back as if nothing had happened

I suggest you go back home, back to Iowa.

What the hell do you think you're doing?

I left my car in Branson. I thought maybe I could borrow the pickup until I

it back.

You're not taking anything.

Can you suggest to His Lordship why you think the children would be better off

with you than with their father?

I think he needs someone who cares for them, who is also a mature individual.

Someone who loves them enough to give them the discipline that they require.

I think that I can offer them a wider, warmer range in terms of family.

I'm concerned about their emotional development. Their father's not...

He's not a people person, and I've always worked as a buffer.

I think you have to have a basic stability in a home.

And if you have to be worried when somebody comes through the door whether

they're going to be in a good mood or a bad mood... You're speaking specifically

of your husband?

Yes, I am.

My husband has a very volatile temper.

In many respects, I think he feels that he's above the law and that the law is

for somebody else.

I left with my children because I was fearful of what would happen to them.

And I just didn't consider the consequences.

You now ask the court, I gather, to believe that you're going to stay in

Jaw. Is that what you want people to believe?

I want people to believe what's true.

One of the reasons I went to Brampton was to get away from my husband.

The other was to terminate a relationship with another individual.

By that you mean Graham?

Yes.

I'd never gotten involved with anyone else before.

And I'm... Well, regrets are in the blast and

they won't do any good now.

My concern now is for the children.

I would like to warn the witness and ask her about her relationship with Ron

Graham. I object to that.

I don't want this witness painted black and her husband painted white.

Mr. Rushwood, it would be almost impossible for me to conclude on the

have so far that the relationship between the witness and Graham was

All right.

Mrs. Batcher, I take it you had sexual relations with Mr. Graham?

Pardon?

Are you hard of hearing?

Did you ever tell your husband you were going to leave him and take the

children? I would have been crazy to do that, Tony.

Don't call me Tony.

It was not uncommon for me to find her crying, and I would try and comfort her.

I knew she was approaching her 40th birthday. I knew this was bothering her.

Merchant, can we shorten this, please? I wrote her on the other side during

this. No, no, I have a reason.

I don't believe there's one chance in 50 that if she had custody of the children

that they would still be in Moose Jaw in 14 months.

And I suggest to you that one of the important considerations is...

Are these children going to be raised as children of some divorcee in Toronto or

Iowa or something where she can find work and be fulfilled?

Or are the children going to be raised as Thatchers in Saskatchewan,

particularly in the case of the boys?

All right.

There is no evidence at all to support that.

My client has already agreed to keep the children in Moostraw.

Still, I think most certainly that it's relevant.

Why do you think the children?

all of the children would be better off with you.

I care very deeply for my children. I believe that my family has very deep

in this province.

I truly believe that they should not be taken out of their Saskatchewan

heritage. I believe that I can give them a taste of both worlds, both urban and

rural.

They get a taste of what it's like to go out among the cattle, and at the same

time, we come back into town, we clean up, and we step right back into an urban

existence.

Thank you, Mr. Thatcher.

My lord, I would like to call Greg Thatcher.

He's a very mature boy. Well, I don't want it to happen.

It's bad enough his parents can't get along without him having to participate

the determination.

I don't think it's worth that much.

Greg.

Judgment's in.

I'll call you right back.

This is an application by the wife for the custody of three children in

marriage.

They're the boys, Gregory, Greg, age 14, Regan, age 10, and the girl, Stephanie,

age 5.

Greg's preference is real.

I cannot order him to live with his mother.

There are several positive reasons for awarding custody of Regan and Stephanie

to the wife.

He is a much warmer, more affectionate, and sympathetic person than the husband.

I venture the thought that his lack of qualities, his failure to appreciate the

wife, caused the marriage breakdown.

Adultery is rarely the cause, it is the result.

I'm going to file a motion to appeal to judgment.

We're going to ask for an automatic stay.

We'll go all the way to the Supreme Court of Canada if necessary.

Paula, this isn't the end.

I'll come for the kids.

Can't have them.

What are you talking about? I won custody.

Talk to your lawyer.

came from the house. What happened? Why can't I have the kids?

Joanne, if I had known on Friday that you were going to leave the children

your father over the weekend, I would have advised against it. It would have

been better to take them when you had the chance.

He's used the weekend to file an appeal.

An appeal? What does that mean?

It means that Stephanie and Regan will stay with Colin until the appeal is

heard.

But that could take months.

What do we do?

Joanne, I'm afraid I have some bad news for you.

This case is bound to drag on for a very long time, and I have other clients.

I'm sorry.

I can no longer represent you.

Do my husband have anything to do with this?

No. Of course not.

That looks to me like somebody's been fooling with your brakes.

When I do manage to see my children, it's clear to me that my husband is

them again to me.

Sometimes when I come for my weekends, the children have been removed from the

house.

For instance, right now they're in Arizona and I won't be seeing them over

holidays.

Mrs. Thatcher, I'm very sorry, but I really can't take you on.

This case is going to drag out for a long time and be strenuously litigated.

There's the man of your husband who seems hard -nosed and very difficult to

reason with.

Then there's his lawyer, Tony Merchant, who has a reputation for keeping it

vitriolic.

Mr. Duran, are you saying that I don't have free choice of legal counsel?

Because you're afraid of Colin Thatcher and Tony Merchant.

for divorce prepare for the custody appeal and get you the house then

the land after all you're entitled to half of that does that mean you're

the case i guess it does

take

a good look

Perfect a half -section as God ever made.

And now it's yours.

$205 ,000 I paid for it.

Made the deal today.

I put this land in trust for you boys, both of you.

That means if nobody can touch it, take it away from you.

Not even your mother.

She doesn't understand the land.

She never cared for it.

She'd have to ask directions on how to find it.

She looks at these lands, Thatcher lands.

All she sees is dollar signs.

Go on, it's yours.

It's your land.

Go on, Regan.

I want you to feel it.

Say to yourself, this is my land.

Thatcher land.

From Ross Thatcher to his son.

hamburger helper.

That was just me.

We lost the custody appeal and the house.

We're going to have to move out of here.

What?

We'll just appeal again, right?

Supreme Court says no.

Is that what you want?

To live with a bitch?

There are no more appeals left, Joanne.

Even Colin has to accept that.

I hope you're right.

Now you've got sole possession of this house in custody of your youngest

children, and I'm confident the property settlement probably went very well.

Thanks for everything, Jerry.

Good luck, Joanne.

God bless.

New job doing office furnishings. Had to have a meeting with him at Ipco.

Ipco? Steel mill.

The vice president of planning and development.

So we had this meeting.

We were both very formal, very businesslike.

Then he called me the next night and asked me did I want to have dinner?

Or did I have something better to do?

What did he say?

I hesitated. No. Two seconds.

Forgotten what it was like to have someone who actually likes me.

That's wonderful, Joe.

Here's Joanne.

I'll be right back.

Daddy!

I'm taking Regan to the ranch.

Can we talk about this inside?

I said I'm taking him. Now!

You have access only on weekends. Those are the rules. Screw the rules!

Is this your new boyfriend?

I'm going to have to ask you to leave now. Leave?

This is my house!

This is my father's house!

And these are my goddamn steaks!

I need you to give me a chance.

And then maybe someday when all this is blown over, everybody can feel...

Well, how is he?

Frightened.

Confused.

Angry.

He's not a good friend.

He was sick for a month after he was born.

And when he got well, he just stayed special to me.

I always wanted to give my children what I'd had.

A happy family.

Tony, I'll understand if you don't want to go and see me.

You visit me.

We've got something better.

Morning. Hi.

Hey. Want some coffee? Sure.

Well, Bill can't believe what happened yesterday.

It's called the bully. Pure and simple.

Yes, I'd like to speak to Mr. Joanne, please.

Joanne Theser?

I'm complying with... court order to return Regan.

Come on, Regan, let's go.

Come on, you have to do this. Come on.

What are you going to leave the poor kid alone?

He said you'd say bad things about him. I saw you. I saw you kissing Mr. Grant.

He said it would make my mind sick if I stayed with you.

Dad says you're a whore.

You will not.

You will not speak to me like that.

I am your mother.

He said we'd be out of here an hour ago. We're doing what we can.

There's still a bunch of bosses upstairs.

It's been taking forever.

I'll miss you.

I'll miss you too, Lily.

But I have to get Regan out of Moose Jaw or I don't have a chance with him.

I know. Okay.

Is everything out of the kitchen?

What do you think you're doing?

Just making sure his light -fingered mother doesn't take what isn't hers.

Check these other boxes out, too, Greg.

You, get off the truck.

You want to get charged with theft? He's got a right to look through any of the

stuff he wants to.

Mr. Thatcher, we don't want to cause any problem.

I have an order from the court allowing me to remove my possessions. I can show

you the document.

I'm not taking this car. This car's mine.

Colin, that's enough.

Leave her alone.

Greg, stop it.

Greg, I've taken nothing that belongs to you.

Shut up. Shut up, you bitch.

You think running away to Regina is going to make any difference?

seasonably warm temperatures.

You keep okay?

The bed's lumpy.

Mine too.

We'll rent a better house when I have a full -time job, okay?

Okay.

It's time to get up.

Regan!

Time to get up.

Colin back in Moose Jaw.

Colin says he hitchhiked back.

Joanne?

I'm afraid I have some bad news.

A new hearing is being ordered regarding Regan's custody.

What?

I want a custody. I want an appeal.

I was supposed to be given a chance with my son.

Tony Marchant.

was able to persuade the court that the circumstances surrounding your custody

have changed greatly because of Regan's constant attempts at running away. But

Colin told him to run away!

Joanne, once we're back in court, I feel confident that we'll be able to

persuade the judge that you deserve custody of Regan, especially in light of

Colin's actions.

The judges decided that Regan should stay with his father in Moose Jaw until

new custody order is issued.

It's the Thatcher judgment.

I'd like your opinion.

This is yet another chapter in the Thatcher matrimonial troubles.

As the evidence developed in this trial, it became apparent to me... Indeed, it

was overwhelming that Mr. Thatcher was determined to win custody of the son

Regan by any means at all.

It is a long and dreadful story of interference, contempt of court, and

downright deception by Mr. Thatcher.

His methods and purposes have been to destroy his wife in the minds of their

children.

In so doing, he has gone a long way to destroying the children themselves.

I possess a consuming fear that Regan will develop into an unsympathetic

inconsiderate, domineering adult like his father, if I award his custody to

father. If the child is to be saved, only his mother can do it.

If he wants to cry, he has had no chance.

That has been denied her by the actions of her husband and Gregory.

I know full well that being with his father is where the boy wants to be, but

concern for his welfare, which is the principal factor in an issue of custody,

must override the child's present desires.

There will therefore be an order awarding the custody of Regan to Mrs.

forthwith with the provision that Mr. Thatcher and Gregory not communicate in

any way with Regan.

If Mrs. Thatcher is to be successful, Regan must be free for a long time from

her husband's and Gregory's interference.

Colin, this is by no means the end.

You still have a number of legal options.

It would do better if we had a few bodyguards.

Maybe a police detachment?

Is Regan ready?

He's not here.

Where is he?

the clock. He was supposed to be ready to leave at six.

He's not here.

Okay, I'd like to speak to your father. He's not here either. Where are they?

I don't know.

Mind if we look in the house?

Go ahead.

Come in.

I'll get back to you. Thank you.

Morning.

This is my son, Regan Erickson.

Hello, Regan.

Welcome to Palm Valley School.

Glad you could take him. We didn't want him to miss his year.

I'll be in and out of Palm Springs, so he'll be living with his grandmother.

Well, I hope you'll enjoy your year with us young man.

When was the last time you saw your son, Regan?

I don't know.

I think I will decline that question.

Do you know if Regan is in school or not?

Wait.

I want the record to show that Mr. Merchant has written something down and

handed it to Mr. Thatcher.

I'll decline that answer and say that I believe I have complied with the

judgment.

I am going to repeat the question, Mr. Thatcher.

Do you know where Regan is?

Give the same answer.

I would have to decline.

Any news?

None.

Moose Jaw Police questioned Thatcher, his mother.

No one seems to have the slightest idea of where the boy is.

Obviously, Thatcher's hiding him.

Thatcher. An elected official defying a court order, showing blatant disrespect

for the law.

Like an arrow directed right at the heart of the court system.

Can't criminal charges be laid to force him to stay where he's hiding, Regan?

We've already requested that, but the Attorney General's office has declined

do so.

Thatcher thinks he's above the law, and no one's stopping him.

Thank you.

It's good to see such a nice turnout here.

Good to see you, Drew, and if you're late.

see you remain.

So, thank you all for coming.

Now, there have been some rumors in the past few weeks about certain

events in my life, and I have prepared a statement to set the record straight.

This has been a difficult time for me and my family, beginning with my wife's

adulterous affair.

Regan's lawyer and three leading child psychologists urge the court

to allow Regan to stay with me.

I will not be threatened into betraying those close to me.

Many aspects of this case have been put up job by the NDP to harass me, and

talk of contempt by Judge McPherson and the continuing vendetta of my wife will

not make me...

Let my family down.

Thank you. That's all I have to say for now.

Colin Thatcher, press conference.

This is Drew Patterson, CBC News. How

much?

In the neighborhood of $800 ,000.

Mr. Justice Hughes has given you four months to pay.

First, we're going to file for an immediate appeal.

That's all I'm going to say, and I'll get these cameras out of my face before

shove them down your throat. Are you in?

You anticipate having to sell off any of your land? I don't anticipate selling

any. What about the ranch? Is it going to have to go, Colin? The ranch isn't

going anywhere.

How do you feel right now, sir?

I have nothing more to say.

Yeah.

Yeah, where you been?

Incarcerated over at the Regina Correctional. What for?

Well, pointing a firearm and causing bodily harm.

Oh, yeah. Caught seven months.

So, uh, it's too bad about your wife, eh?

Yeah, well, uh, a lot of people get divorced, Gary. You know, you just gotta

learn to move on, eh?

Yeah.

So, I guess you met a lot of interesting types in jail there.

Interesting. Yeah, right. That's the word for it.

Interesting.

So, what do you want to see me about?

Job. I got a job for me. I'm looking for a job.

There you go.

Why not?

Yeah, I got a job for you, Gary. You know me.

Like to take care of my constituents.

Hey, how you doing?

Hey, it's my buddy!

How you doing, dear?

It's my buddy, me and him are graduates of Regina Correctional.

So, uh, so listen, you need some bread?

Because there's a friend of mine who needs a job doing it.

What we got here is 15 ,000 down and 10 ,000 on the pieces.

That's what you want.

What the hell happened?

I don't know, Colin. I gave him the money.

Maybe he never intended on doing that. Maybe he just wanted the bread. So what

the hell am I supposed to do? Call the goddamn fraud squad?

Tell them my hitman ripped me off?

Well, it gives me great pleasure, ladies and gentlemen, to ask that you raise

your glasses in a toast to Joanne and Tony.

A long and happy life.

Joanne and Tony!

Congratulations,

man.

Do you like it? Congratulations, Andrew. It's beautiful.

Yeah.

I'm so happy for you. Thank you. You look wonderful.

Thank you. Thanks for that.

Every happiness, Joy. You deserve every happiness.

And we'll get Regan back.

I'm sure of that.

Thanks for everything, Jerry.

We'll see you soon.

Bye -bye. Be careful.

Bye -bye now.

Bye, Stephanie.

I'll put it in.

Stephanie starts the street.

Coming up.

As soon as I finish, please.

On Sunday, May 17th, I was the victim of an attempted murder when I was shot

by a bullet fired from a high -powered rifle.

Needless to say, I am afraid for the well -being of myself and my family.

I dearly love all my children.

I have fought for Regan for close to 24 months.

No custody litigation has been more prolonged or extensive.

But I am now giving up my fight for him.

I believe it is in the best interest of Regan, who has been subjected to an

undercover existence and unhealthy influences.

The fact that I have been personally terrorized during the past eight months

an ingredient of that decision.

Mr. Thatcher has lost all of his court battles regarding Regan because of

damning evidence against him.

Mr. Justice McPherson concluded ten months ago that Mr. Thatcher was trying

win by cheating.

As a result of the events since that judgment,

I must concede that Mr. Thatcher has succeeded.

As

a

result of the events since that judgment,

I must concede that Mr. Thatcher has succeeded.

The reluctance of the media to reproduce the actual court judgments as opposed

to publishing the interpretive utterances of Mr. Thatcher.

God, she looks pathetic.

That is why I felt I should...

Those public

exercises again.

These are the papers giving up custody of Regan.

Joanne, I feel I've been of no use to you, no use at all.

You've won nearly every application in court, and yet... Well, if I were you,

I'd find myself another lawyer.

I'm not that easy to get rid of, Jim.

5 minutes.

With your support, we won in Thunder Creek. We won all over Saskatchewan.

I would like to thank my family

for standing by me over this past year through my personal

difficulties, through the continuing vendetta of my wife, the judges.

And the NDP?

The elections had gone on forever.

Since Colin started campaigning, no strange phone calls and no break -ins.

I'm leading a normal life for a change.

I can't believe it. The Conservatives have just won the biggest majority in

Saskatchewan history.

An extraordinary victory tonight for Grant Devine and the Conservative Party

Saskatchewan. And here at Thatcher headquarters, the mood is, well,

Colin Thatcher, member for Thunder Creek, is one of the party's more

controversial personalities.

And tonight, Thatcher has again come up a winner.

Thatcher's not cabinet material, that's for sure.

But I could never name him after everything that's happened.

Thank you. I want to thank you, each and every one of you, for this great,

great victory.

on TV.

What? I notice the minute Joanne gives up custody, Regan miraculously

resurfaces.

I would be very proud of his son tonight.

Oh,

Peggy,

I just love these people. I mean, they're real people, you know. Not like

California types at all.

I've always found the people in Palm Springs were very nice.

You see, it's important to me that I like it here because...

We'll be here soon. Oh, dear, dear.

Why is that?

Well, Mrs. Patrick Collins told you, hasn't he?

So what's wrong now, sweetheart?

Divine.

It's hassling me about these government contracts I gave the Tony Merchant's law

firm. It's my job, for Christ's sake. I'm the energy minister, aren't I?

You've been eating too much steak again.

All those aggressive proteins running around inside you.

What the hell are you going on about?

I'm talking about breach of promise, darling.

You know, that's courtroom talk for he asked her to marry him and then forgot

all about it.

This is not the time to talk about this. So when's the right time, Mr. Minister?

You know, I felt like a fool in front of your mother.

Back off. Just back off. If you think I'm just another one of your California

bimbos, you've got a lot to learn.

Don't be so down.

You're right. You weren't worth it.

Hey.

I'll be flying all over the world from now on.

Limos.

Hotel suites. You come with me. Drop till you drop. All over Paris.

London.

Aren't you even going to apologize for hitting me?

I've never had a woman in my life.

Hi, sweetheart.

I know I'm not supposed to see you except on weekends, but I was just over

the legislature here where I work. You know, I'm the Minister of Energy now.

And I just remembered there's a new toy store over in the mall.

How would you like to go over there and buy anything you want?

Okay.

Mrs. Wilson did not say I could let Stephanie go out.

That's fine. I'll call her.

Come on, honey, let's go.

Come on.

Okay, all these numbers do not care to me.

I've initialed the bottom of each account.

Radius 2,

Joanne Wilson speaking.

Stephanie and I had a terrific time at the mall today.

away. What's the matter?

You're hungry for a salad, isn't it?

Hi,

Mommy.

Who gave you that?

I found it.

Why are you lying to me?

Your father gave you that, didn't he?

Didn't he?

Where were you?

How could you let him take her?

But Mr.

Thatcher, he said he would call you.

and being in cabinet seems to agree with you. People say you're a tough

negotiator. Somebody's got to do the job, don't they?

At least some of your ideas are popular. Look, guys, he's got to be tough. This

is the best energy minister this province ever had. Hell, he's the best

we ever had, period.

Carl, what do you intend to do about the Great Plains heavy oil upgrade?

I'll tell you one thing, Drew. I do not like the oil companies demanding blanket

risk coverage in the form of government loan guarantees. I simply do not like

it. I mean, you know me. I'm a free enterpriser.

Anyway, the plan was so bad, I didn't even bring it up in cabinet.

Mr. Thatcher, how do you like being compared to J .R. Ewing on Dallas?

I think you better turn off your TV and get back into the kitchen.

I'll see you later, fellas. Thanks a lot.

So, you sticking over the portfolio like a qualifier?

Colin!

You leave her alone!

You've taken everything you wanted. Now you leave her alone!

Not quite everything.

You listen to me.

I will fight you.

I will fight you for the rest of my life for her.

Go ahead. See how far you get.

When Colin applied for extended visiting rights with Stephanie, he finally had

to answer all those questions which he had stonewalled at Regan's hearing.

Amongst other things, the court heard that Colin had taken Regan out of the

country, and they concluded, as they should have, that Colin could not be

trusted with Stephanie any further than two hours, Saturday afternoons, in this

house. And that's not likely to change.

What about the second property settlement payment?

It's due at the birth of the month, $87 ,500.

But if he fails to make the payment, we can demand the balance of $350 ,000 with

interest.

And I have heard, Tony, rumors to the effect that the Moose Jaw Credit Union

starting to foreclose on three parcels of Thatcher land.

Looks like his empire is starting to crumble.

Colin, Mr. Thatcher, what's your truth about you being in hot water with the

Premier? I don't know anything about that. Mr. Thatcher, what do you say

these rumors?

I don't know. Is Mr. Devine talking to you about your behavior, sir?

He'll be talking very soon, I'm sure of that. Colin, Premier Devine has been

heard to say that he thinks you're acting like a maverick, you're not a

player, you don't attend cabinet meetings. Yeah, of course I'm a

shoot my mouth off, my constituents like me for it, and I'm sure it's all not

going to change. Now, this is a...

The new government, a lot of new guys on the block, not used to being in power.

You know, I'm just not interested in playing their naive little games, okay?

I'll leave that to the NDP.

All right.

You

said

there are two letters of resignation on that death, and one of them is yours.

I've been around too long for this.

What are you going to do now, Colin?

Go back to the ranch. I got a farm to run.

Radio 2, Joanne Wilson.

Tony, hi.

Kidding.

Siobhan, will you turn on the radio?

Sure.

Yeah, we'll listen to it now. I'll call you back.

No, no, I'll call you right back.

Colin's been fired. Premier Grant Devine today announced Colin Thatcher's

resignation. The Premier said that Thatcher, the playboy millionaire

resigned from his cabinet position due to family and financial reasons.

This has been a CBC special report from Regina.

We now return you to our... What are you making of that?

Next,

the Radio Noon Market Report with Roy Maxwell. Makes me nervous.

Colin, what's happening?

Been in the news again, eh?

I hear you and old Devine had a real chubby match.

So how does it feel to be one of the unemployed?

Be able to hold on to that ranch of yours, or what?

Thatcher's won't sell land.

That's a good thing you turned up here.

Hmm.

Mr. Adams, it's out there again.

She sits there, louched down like that, day after day.

Should we call the police?

No, no.

I'm sure there's no need for that.

I guess that means no school tomorrow.

Want some more ginger ale?

Okay.

Was it me who gave the food to Tony?

That's what he ate, yeah.

Mommy, sing me a song.

You want to hear our song?

Sunshine, my only sunshine.

You make me happy when skies are gray.

You'll never know, dear, how much I love you.

Please don't take my sunshine away.

Does she have a fever?

Barely a hundred.

Just enough to get out of going to school tomorrow.

It's so quiet out there.

Oh, it's so much of a crowd.

How about we recuperate from all our illnesses and problems?

I can't break it.

Warmed by golden sun.

Cooled by Pacific breezes. A paradise for lovers under southern stars.

Jealousy will get you nowhere.

Anything you can manage for two weeks without me?

Definitely not.

You're too bad. I'm going.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Is your son's home?

Please let me take you back to the hub.

There's nothing more you can do here now.

Airports? Airport, train station, bus depot.

Roblox in Ohio.

Not exactly what you'd call a professional job.

Mr. Dodson here.

Says he saw a man leave the garage shortly after he heard his shot.

I got a constant drop.

Uh, Mrs. Haas, Mr. Adams, this is Inspector Swayze, head of

I knew there was something wrong with that girl.

I'll never be able to forgive myself if this could have been prevented.

She saw a strange man in a car parked outside the house for several days

the murder.

If you come with me, I'll take your statements.

I found this in the snow, I just revealed it.

W .C.

Thatcher.

Call Moose Jaw. Tell him to check on Thatcher.

Police were called to the scene at approximately ten past six tonight, and

say that no suspects have been apprehended.

This vicious slaying is a tragic end for Joanne Wilson, ex -wife of Colin

Thatcher, the flamboyant millionaire rancher.

and the son of a former liberal premier.

Drew Patterson, CBC News, Regina.

She's Stephanie.

He's... He's not here.

Where is she?

I... I think she's somewhere, perhaps in the neighborhood, but I do not know

where.

Mr. Wilson is not here.

He'll be back soon, if you want to speak to him.

Colin's looking for Stephanie.

Is she here?

I'm sorry. I can't let Stephanie go with anyone.

Stephanie!

Stephanie, come here!

Excuse me. This is my house. You'll have to leave, both of you. I've come for my

daughter. I know she's here. Well, I'm going to have to call Tony Wilson.

has nothing to do with this. Stephanie is my daughter. You get out of my way,

damn it! Stephanie!

God, she's in here!

Let's go.

But the souls of the righteous are in the hand of God.

and no torment will ever touch them.

In the eyes of the foolish, they seem to have died, and their departure was

thought to be an affliction, and their going from us to be their destruction.

But they are at peace.

Those who trust in him will understand truth, and the faithful will abide with

him in love, because grace...

and mercy are upon his elect, and he watches over his holy ones.

in an even better mood in a minute.

So, you

finally did it, huh?

Life can be bad, you know.

What do I have to do for another drink around here?

What it is that we're supposed to be looking for?

Here, a little bit.

900 bucks is a tune -up.

Hans, I know it's a Benz.

Yeah.

Yeah. All right, go ahead.

Tune it up.

Of course, a psychic only acts up when I got problems.

So, what do you got?

Well, uh...

Print of the running shoe found near the garage is not connected to the murder.

As for the murder weapon itself, I walked from here to Penn, 30 kilometers,

searched every culvert, every weed, nothing.

Thatcher. She's still our prime suspect.

Go and find me another one.

Does that look like Thatcher to you?

The blue Oldsmobile the housekeeper saw checks out to Thatcher.

It's a government car, but it wasn't moved the day of the murder.

Ah, listen, there's a sergeant with Moose Jaw Police.

He saw Thatcher talking to a Gary Anderson the day before the murder.

This guy's got a record. Small stuff.

Anderson.

Go and talk to him.

is my responsibility now. We're a family.

She's all I have left from Joanne. Tony, Joanne's custody is no longer valid. It

ceased to be with her death.

The law always favors the natural father over the stepfather.

I promised her. I promised Joanne that I'd always take care of Stephanie.

My God, Jerry, you know that she fought with everything she could to save those

children from Thatcher. She gave her life for them.

I know, Tony.

The courts have already decided.

I'm very sorry.

He swore that he'd take the throne from me.

He has it all now.

You remember your mother.

Remember how much she loved you.

Don't you let anyone tell you she didn't, okay?

Okay.

my friend Glenn Crockett after I'd been to the dentist.

That would be 6 o 'clock for, what, 20 minutes or so?

And then after that I went to the Grand Hall.

That's a hotel in Moose Jaw for my pepper.

rolls, but I only ate the filling.

I hate cabbage.

Gives me the old...

The Crown Attorney?

Oh, yeah, he's in the sauna.

Through these doors, the end of the hall.

Sir?

Oh, hiya.

I gotta tell you, we're no further along.

The media's been on my ass already.

Forget about the media.

What about all these stories going around about Joanne Wilson and the whole

city's talking?

You know, I've been hearing rumors myself.

Thatcher had been asking around for a hitman.

In the cabinet, even. Of course, nobody's talking about it, especially

the legislature.

He's still focusing on Thatcher.

Well, he's the only one who fits.

His visa receipt was found right there, right by the body.

Could have been a plant.

Well, it's possible, but not likely. I mean, whoever plants something usually

puts it someplace where they're sure it's going to be found. This was just...

blowing around in the snow.

It's a miracle we spotted it.

What about this Gary Anderson?

Perfect alibi.

It's too perfect.

The kind of alibi you'd want if you knew you were going to need one.

Oh, listen to this.

That's your old Joanne Wilson, a pile of money.

The credit union was starting to foreclose on him. A lot of people have

Serge, have you seen the photographs of Joanne Wilson's corpse?

Whoever did that to her hated her with a passion.

Passion.

Whoever hated her that much.

Here you go. Thank you.

I'm with the China Police. I'm looking for Blaine Matheson. Blaine Matheson?

He's right over there in the green cap.

Nice.

Blaine Matheson?

Yeah. China Police.

He used to be the boyfriend of Sandra Hammond, right?

That's your family babysitter? Yeah.

You mind stepping outside?

I'd like to ask a few questions.

Yeah, okay.

Thanks.

So you stopped seeing her about a year ago?

Yes. Basically, you've had no dealings with the family since then?

No. How about before, when Joanne was shot in the shoulder?

Yeah, about two years ago.

Oh, yeah, there was this one thing.

Sandra told me not to go into the garage, so I did.

And there was this orange Mustang with a high -powered rifle in it.

And a rental agreement.

Did you read it?

Yeah. You remember the name?

Yeah, Anderson.

Uh, Gary Anderson.

Okay, thanks a lot.

Go finish your breakfast. All right. We may need a statement from you later.

Sure.

You should just take him in. We can't take him in. If we take him in, he's

to clam up. We're going to get nothing. We've got to play this by the book. By

the book? The guy can't even read.

Look, I just want to talk to the guy, that's all. I know this kind of

If he takes off, he's not going to take off.

Look, just go have a coffee or something. Here, I'll even bring for the

That's okay.

What do you want, sticky?

Yeah, with that white stuff.

And coffee? Yeah, and stop worrying. You worry too much.

But we're up a week late there.

The Orange Mustang.

They've got nothing. They've got no evidence. No clues, no suspects. I mean,

they are the laughingstock of the country.

I mean, if they want to charge me with something, they can go ahead.

I'm innocent. I've got nothing to hide.

Now, if you'll excuse me, we're on our way to the sun.

How are your children feeling about all this going on? They're not bad, ma 'am.

Keeps them off guard.

Serge, what more do you want?

We've got information from his ex -girlfriend about Thatcher buying a gun.

got bullets the same kind as killed Joanne.

Everything Anderson told us about what he burned in the barrel.

The lab boys have examined the ash, and there's just about proof that the glass

in there came from Thatcher's eyeglasses.

There's just about proof that the button came from that jacket. The

fingerprints, eight -point similarity with Thatcher's. Ed, Ed, Ed, a dozen

likelies don't add up to one.

fact beyond a reasonable doubt.

To convince 12 jurors, we've got to have evidence that's airtight, especially

when we're dealing with someone like Thatcher.

Charge him with a lesser offense?

Okay. First degree or nothing.

I have something in mind.

I went dead. I had to borrow this from the municipality secretary.

Oh, yeah?

It's not really your style there, eh, Colin?

Let's go for a ride.

I'd sort of prefer to stay around here for a couple minutes.

Yeah, well, you have to be awful cautious. You never know.

Well, everything is...

Walk over this way.

The land's getting pretty dry, eh?

Yeah.

It is.

It's really down at this end, where Evan Fowler used to dump his manure.

Oh, yeah?

You been hassled?

Yeah, well, the cops come the once and just asked me about the chef, the car.

And that was about it. Other than that, nothing at all.

How about you?

Oh, just the once, the day after.

But no question, there's been some attempts to put us together.

We should not be seen together.

Okay.

Well, I got rid of the stuff out of the car.

Good.

You kind of scared me there for a while because I didn't know what the hell... I

didn't know what the hell you'd done with that gun, eh? Don't even talk like

that.

I'm sorry.

Look, Colin, it's just when I searched the car, eh, and when I couldn't find

I... Walk back this way.

Yeah, okay, I'm sorry about that. I just, uh... Yeah, well, you know, I have

always had a real fear of the parabolic mics that they have.

It kind of scared me there for a while because I didn't know what the hell... I

didn't know what the hell you'd done with that gun, eh? Don't even talk like

that. I mean, don't even... Walk back this way.

Yeah, okay, I'm sorry about that. Just, uh... You know, I have always had a real

fear of those... It all fits. All of it.

You know, but, uh... You know, there are no loose ends at all.

Make the arrest.

Behind me in the Saskatoon courtroom, the first -degree murder trial of Colin

Thatcher is about to begin.

Despite his appeals, Thatcher has been repeatedly denied bail since his arrest

23 weeks ago.

Okay for you, Judy?

Good for me. All right, we got it.

Order, all rise.

Court is now in session.

Are counsel ready to proceed?

Yes, my lord.

Arraign the accused.

Thank you, my lord.

Mr. Thatcher, will you stand, please?

W. Colin Thatcher, you stand charged as follows.

W. Colin Thatcher of the city of Moose Jaw in the province of Saskatchewan

stands charged.

that he, the said W. Colin Thatcher, on or about the 21st day of January, 1983,

at Regina in the province of Saskatchewan, did unlawfully cause the

Joanne K. Wilson and did thereby commit first -degree murder, contrary to

Section 218 of the Criminal Code.

Do you understand the charge as it has no deal?

I do. How say you? Do you plead guilty or not guilty?

Not guilty.

You may be seated.

As a quick summary, the property settlement was $800 and some thousand

in Joanne Wilson's favor by the cordon.

After the negotiations, it was roughly half?

Yes, roughly.

Now, very quickly about the method of payment. Was there a provision dealing

with the death of Joanne?

A moratorium was put on the payments.

It meant that with Joanne's death, payments could be deferred.

Indeed, they were deferred and have never been paid since her death.

Thank you.

Your witness?

Mr. Wilson, you didn't admit... You didn't have

anything to do with that, did you? That first shooting of Joanne Wilson.

Or the second one. I want to be clear on that.

No, of course not.

Mr. Wilson, I'll ask it as directly as I can, and I know that you'll answer as

directly as you can. Were you and Joanne having some marital problems?

No, definitely not.

So if I were to suggest to you that perhaps the presence of the housekeeper

an ongoing basis was the source of some friction between you and Joanne, what

would your answer to that be?

I would say that that was nonsense, because Joanne hired her. Joanne was

happy to have her.

So what's the purpose then today of having this particular individual remain

your house?

What duties does she perform?

She doesn't perform any duties.

She's a student. We have a large house.

Right.

Mr. Wilson, on the afternoon of the murder, who was at home?

I was at home.

I don't remember whether Mario was home. And you were upstairs with your... You

were laying in bed at the time that you were aroused?

Yes.

And you didn't hear anything at all from the garage?

No.

Mr. Wilson, you don't like Colin Thatcher at all, do you?

No.

Would I be correct in saying that you wouldn't mind seeing him convicted for

this?

I would not mind.

Well, from what he told me, he was going into Regina every night if he could

to find an opportune time.

when Joanne would be available.

Available?

Available for what?

If the circumstances were right for Joanne to be killed.

When did you next talk to Colin about the killing of Joanne?

Well, I was really upset, but...

i think the first thing i said was um so you really did it this time huh

and he uh he just told me not to talk in there you're referring to the

suspicion of microphones which you mentioned earlier yes i am

then when we were outside the condo um the thing that sticks in

my mind is him saying

I have to admit, it's a strange feeling to have blown your wife away.

Is

this

an act?

An act. An act for the jury?

No. You enjoy this process?

Not at all.

Being here, enjoying the notoriety of being a witness in a major murder trial.

Sir, my life has been threatened twice by telephone.

Well, that's very convenient.

I'm getting the very distinct impression, Mrs. Mandel, that you'd like

a picture here today of Satan personified beside me, and you yourself

Yet, in fact, when you knew what you said you knew, that Joanne Thatcher had

been murdered by the accused,

You didn't do anything.

You didn't take steps to tell anybody.

Perhaps this was a mistake on my part.

Perhaps this whole little thing this morning is a flight of fancy on your

witness. A little bit of imagination.

Isn't the reason that you became bitter towards Colin Thatcher is that you,

witness, as you viewed it, you wasted two years of your life on this man.

And when you realized that he wasn't going to marry you, you got bitter, and

mean bitter.

Yes, I was a little bitter at first.

Afterwards, I wasn't.

When I left him, I was just relieved.

I suggest to you, witness, you have taken everything that Colin Thatcher

said, made any reference to, and you've just twisted it a little bit to put a

guilty look to it. I have no reason to do that. And when he came into the

condominium and you said, well, you finally did it this time, huh?

And he said not to talk there, you took that to be an unequivocal, total,

complete admission that he'd done the murder, didn't you?

Yes, we had oblique conversations because of Colin's fear of wiretaps and

microphones.

Can you tell me this witness?

Have you ever given Colin Thatcher the benefit of one doubt?

Have you ever done that?

I sure have.

I sure have.

I have no further questions.

My lord, one brief question in re -examination.

Is it your opinion that the statement, it is a strange feeling to have blown

your wife away, Is that oblique?

I don't think so.

No.

No.

Thank you, my lord.

Mrs. Mendel, you are excused from further attendance until required.

We will adjourn now until 10 o 'clock tomorrow morning.

Order.

Find Anderson.

Can't find him.

Is he in there?

Yes, sir.

You all set?

Anytime.

Let's do it.

Let me talk to him first.

He knows me.

The man is crazy.

He's not much good to his dad, is he?

See? You do anything for anyone, and you just get screwed.

Hey, Gar.

There's a lot of people waiting for you out there.

I know who you are. Nobody.

Nobody knows who is Gary Anderson.

This is Gary Anderson.

My Lord.

Before we proceed, I'd like to ask your permission to allow Mr. Thatcher to join

me at the council table once the present situation makes it difficult to confer.

Any objection, Mr. Kiyafa?

No objection, my Lord.

Very well.

Be sure.

I was to listen to the news.

And if anything had happened to Joanne, I was to go back and pick up the car.

I'd read on the 22nd in the Regina Leader Post that she had been killed.

And I consequently drove the car back out to my mother's farm.

And I...

cleared the stuff up that was on the inside of the car. What was in the car

you picked it up?

Well, there was a black ski -tape jacket, a pair of blue jeans, some

and there was a tuft of hair, what looked to be out of a wig, you know.

I would ask, my lord, that we now hear the tape recording.

Yeah, it is, particularly down at this end. This is where Evan Thalle has

his manure.

Have you been hassled?

Well, the cops come once and talk to me about the shed.

But apart from that, nothing.

How about you?

Just the once, the day after.

No question, there's been some attempts to put us together, and

we should not be seen together.

Yeah, okay.

So I got rid of this stuff out of the car.

Good.

And you... Yeah, you kind of gave me a scare there, eh? I mean, I didn't know

where the hell you... Well, I didn't know what the hell you did with the gun.

Well, don't even talk like that.

Don't even... Let's walk back this way.

Look, I'm sorry about that. I didn't mean to... Yeah, you know, I've always

a great fear about...

parabolic mics that they have.

Now, there are no loose ends. No. At all. I mean, they've all gone every

direction.

You need some breath?

Yeah, well, I could use some for that car, eh? Uh -huh.

Because I had a bitch of a time getting rid of the blood and stuff out of the

car. Well, there's no chance it could ever surface. I mean, is there a chance

could surface?

Oh, no way. No.

Well, I mean, you know, don't worry about it. I mean,

it ain't coming to that.

It ain't coming to that. I mean, there's only two places to put a connection

together, and they got zero else.

They got zero else. I mean, you know what there is to put together.

It ain't possible. It ain't coming from me.

Just always remember that if you were to say I said this or that, it's a crock

of garbage. It's just always deny, deny, deny.

Okay. I was just lucky that night.

I was at home with three people.

Three people, that's pretty solid.

Yeah, but your people, I mean, would they crack?

No, no, no, never.

Okay. I mean, just remember, it's deny, deny, deny.

So I'm glad it went down, eh?

Yeah.

Glad you got her.

Okay.

Just remember, it's deny, deny, deny.

Okay.

So I'm glad it went down, eh?

Yeah.

Glad you got her.

anderson it's very beautiful now at this point

you are starting out with one purpose in mind and it isn't to check out the

karen landscape it is to get a confession from colin thatcher yet

this whole transcript you don't ask one question

which would unequivocally be said to relate directly to Joanne Wilson's

and put that to Thatcher. Why didn't you do that?

Well, I felt that if I'd started with, say, a direct question, he might...

I thought it would spook him.

The reason was that you knew, Gary Anderson, that if you asked a direct

question... You knew you were going to get a direct denial because you knew

nothing had gone on between you and Thatcher. Isn't that the real reason why

never go into detail on the tape? No.

I had no way of knowing what his answer would be.

See, there is two possible explanations to this whole thing, Gary Anderson,

about why someone would do what you said that you did.

One explanation...

is that you were a fool.

And do you agree that that's one explanation?

Well, I certainly felt like a fool.

The other explanation is that with nothing to lose, and perhaps

$50 ,000 of reward money to gain, you might be prepared to say that

you had done something that you really hadn't. I mean, isn't that the other

explanation? No, not to me, it's not.

Gary, you come to us today, before this court, with total immunity,

guaranteed to you by the authorities in the province from ever being prosecuted

in relation to this murder. Isn't that correct? You've got nothing to lose here

today, Gary.

You've got nothing to lose.

Well, if you're saying pertaining to this particular charge, then no, I have

nothing to lose.

Where have you been the last few days, Gary?

Part of the time in hospital.

And in that hospital, you weren't in the pediatrics department, Gary.

You were in the mental health wing.

The psychiatric wing, isn't that right?

I don't remember what wing I was in.

I know a lot of people who voted for you, Mr. Patrick.

Yeah, so?

What's your name?

John.

John Lipsy.

It's good to meet you, John.

John.

Is that a Bible, sir?

Yes, John, it is.

Didn't know you were a religious man.

That's the only thing that sustains me through this nightmare.

an excellent marriage for probably 16 and a half of our 17 years.

Now, I'm not trying to convey the impression that I was the perfect

because I have the same frailties that everybody else does that's married. But

if there was a time when I was an excellent husband, I

believe it was the last eight months of our marriage.

For that time frame, I put more into it.

And I,

you know, I could feel things slipping away.

She was a troubled person.

She was an unhappy person.

Did you care for her?

Oh, very much so.

And for a long time after our separation, I was interested in

her. In fact, we became very close to it on a couple of occasions.

Mr. Thatcher, what is the nature of the relationship between you, and Lynn Daly,

also known as Lynn Mandel.

She had a misconception that there was some remote possibility that we might be

getting married, and I would use Joanne as an excuse for putting Lynn off

about getting married, and I believe she became rather bitter towards Joanne.

Now, there were times when I did care for her, but I never trusted her.

In fact, I never had enough confidence in her to let her drive my car.

Mr. Thatcher, do you remember her telling this court a statement, which

supposed to have said to her, it is a strange feeling to have blown your wife

away?

We were in bed, and she asked me very quietly, did you blow her

away?

And I said, I cannot imagine what a strange feeling that would be.

No, of course not.

Now, we listened to a tape.

Why did you go to that meeting with Gary Anderson, if I can put it that simply?

Two reasons.

The police had come down very heavily on anybody that had known me.

I wanted to know what was happening between Anderson and the Regina police.

Anderson is a very volatile, irrational individual and someone that you don't

want to have any trouble with, including me.

Mr. Anderson says, I got rid of the stuff out of the car.

What did you believe that he was referring to?

In 1982, I had met him at the legislative buildings.

I had sat in his car for a few moments, and I had left my top coat and my scarf

and my gloves, and I believe he was referring to that.

Anderson says, almost out of nowhere, I had a, of a time to

clean the car out, getting blood and stuff off.

What's being discussed in this exchange?

Well, he had a grin on his face as he was saying it.

And I think if there had been a camera there, the expression on my face would

have conveyed everything.

I did not find it funny.

It's just always deny, deny, deny. What are you referring to there, Mr.

Thatcher?

When you've done nothing wrong, I see nothing wrong in denying it.

And with regard to the end...

of the conversation. What did you take Mr. Anderson to mean with his little

comment, I'm glad you got her?

He made a little gesture with his hand, and I thought he was referring to a

short person, and I thought he was referring to my daughter Stephanie, of

had obtained custody some months before, but in fact, I really do not know what

he meant.

Mr. Thatcher, did you have anything, whatever to do

with that shooting on January the 21st, 1983?

No.

Did you do it yourself, Mr. Thatcher? No, I did not.

Did you arrange for anyone in any way to have anything to do with it?

No.

That display?

A lump in his throat when he talked about Joanne.

And people believed him. Mr. Criado, what do you think about the trial? Not

People are

thinking it's inconceivable a fracture that a committed murder. I can feel it

the courtroom.

Serge, you got him.

The tape, for God's sake, just listen to that tape.

What's an innocent man doing talking about blood and guns?

Ed,

the case is closed.

We can't call back witnesses.

Hi, have you got a Dick Culver registered here? Just a moment.

Thank you. You're welcome.

Mr. Thatcher, you gave us a great long story on how happy a

marriage you had for some 16 and a half years, right?

I had many frailties. I obviously failed as a husband. My marriage broke up.

We've pulled a wonderful switch to humility this afternoon. I'm very

with that, sir.

I'm glad you're pleased.

Do you think one of the most important things in a marriage is being faithful?

Yes, I suppose so.

Then why, when you were trying this hard to make the marriage work, were you

also doing one Janice Gardner at the same time?

And you were cheating and laughing and boozing it up and making all kinds of

smart aleck jokes about how you were cheating on the old bag at home.

That is your description.

Be me yours.

The breakdown of a marriage is a two -way street.

Please answer the question.

Did you convey to the jury the impression that you and Graham had taken

couple of babes with you?

I really didn't see the relevancy of it.

You didn't see the relevance of you...

fooling around with these other women?

I'm sorry you're not getting the answers you are looking for.

You're not sorry at all. You're just evasive.

You had an $87 ,000 payment to Joanne Wilson coming due in February of 1983.

Could you make your payments?

Yes.

Then why did three or four banks and financial institutions sue you?

Certainly we were having cash flow problems like everyone else is in

agriculture. All right.

And if Joanne died, everything would be set back a year.

We had a moratorium arrangement both ways.

Your car, a car checked

out to you by the government of Saskatchewan, was seen for several days

apparently stalking Joanne Wilson.

That was not my car.

I did not have the car you suggest was stalking Joanne.

So now the government records are wrong?

You've taken deny, deny, deny to new heights already.

And we haven't even started yet.

All right.

Let's get on to your witnesses.

The ones who provided you with an alibi.

All those witnesses came here, and they testified under the perjury act.

Not with immunity.

If you think they're not telling the truth, Mr. Kiaba, then why don't you

appropriate action instead of asking me about it? Oh, because I've got a much

more interesting case here than a little perjury trial.

If you're accusing them of perjury, then why don't you do something about it?

Why ask me about it?

They testify.

They are vulnerable.

They don't have immunity like your witnesses.

Relax, Mr.

Thatcher. If you're telling the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the

truth, nothing can hurt you. It is very easy to say that my sons have lied.

Why don't you step out on the courtroom steps and say that?

Come to the end of my cross -examination, and I'll ask one final,

question.

Did your hate for Joanne Wilson lead you

to kill her on that night?

I did not kill her.

I do not hate her.

Cover.

Head Swayze.

Head of Regina CRD.

I've been expecting you, Guy.

It was an act of God that brought the man here.

And I now ask to reopen the Crown's case to call this one witness.

Mr. Albright?

My Lord, there's potentially significant prejudice to mean defense.

Mr. Culver's now called.

And that's the only witness you propose to call?

Yes, my Lord.

Very well.

Mr. Thatcher was a sitting member of the Liberal Party.

I was the leader of the Conservative Party.

I had convinced him, cajoled him into crossing the floor to become a

Conservative.

Subsequent to that time, we became friends.

Would you recount your connection with this matter before the court?

My wife and I had decided to go down to Arizona.

I had said to Colin, would you like to join us?

During the course of this entire time, I never heard Colin or the babysitter

refer to Joanne as anything but the bitch.

My wife and I became rather upset about this because the children were present.

Colin asked to speak privately to me.

He opened up by saying,

I have only one solution for the bitch.

I've got to hire somebody to kill her.

Thank you.

Would you answer my learned friend, please?

Someone at occasion wants to refer to you as a cheap drunk.

Do you drink often?

I have been known to drink too much.

Sometimes, but not often, no.

Mr. Culver, I take it that you at no time ingest, after an afternoon of

ever suggested to Mr. Thatcher, look, you've got three alternatives. You can

hire a hitman, which isn't an alternative.

You can settle, or you can let the lawyers and the courts bleed you dry.

I certainly said to him, you can let the lawyers and the courts bleed you dry.

But never at any time did I suggest a hitman.

I take it that what you've been telling us this afternoon isn't a flight of

imagination on your part?

I am a great believer in friendship and loyalty.

I don't have flight of imagination.

I wish I did not have to be sitting in this chair.

defense says, if you accept the evidence of witnesses who testified that Colin

Thatcher was in Moose Jaw on the evening of the murder, Thatcher personally

would not have committed the murder.

Counsel for the defense has also told you that as the Crown has not produced

evidence that anyone other than Colin Thatcher killed Joanne Wilson, it is

duty to find him not guilty.

With respect, I am unable to agree with this argument.

Many years ago, our law abolished the difference between a principal and a

to a crime.

Colin Thatcher is charged with committing the offense of murder.

Therefore, even if you do not find that he did the act of murder himself, he is

equally guilty if you find and are satisfied that he either aided or

another or others in its commission.

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, you will retire now, and we will await your

verdict.

Well, the way I look at it is, the longer the jury stays out, the better it

for Colin.

After all, it's Colin's word against scum like Anderson and Lynn Daly.

of the jury. Have you agreed upon your verdict?

We have.

How say you? Do you find the accused guilty or not guilty on the charge of

-degree murder?

We find the accused guilty.

What did he say?

Guilty?

I propose to proceed to sentencing, Mr. Albright.

Would you stand, Mr. Thatcher?

having found you guilty of murder in the first degree the sentence I must

pronounce is mandatory you will be imprisoned in a federal penitentiary for

without eligibility for parole until you have served 25 years of your sentence

this court now stands adjourned

How do you feel?

How do I look?

Mr.

Thatcher, are you going to appeal?

It doesn't matter now.

I'm innocent.

I did not do it.

But it wasn't in the cards.